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	<title>Comments on: Microsoft Invited Over to Enter the Gates and Serve the Bill</title>
	<atom:link href="http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/</link>
	<description>Free Software Sentry – watching and reporting maneuvers of those threatened by software freedom</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 14:00:35 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Roy Schestowitz</title>
		<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/comment-page-2/#comment-7263</link>
		<dc:creator>Roy Schestowitz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 00:18:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/#comment-7263</guid>
		<description>The &#039;inventor&#039; of the browser cookie cynically spoke about the fact that it took him just an hour to implement (&#039;invent&#039;) and patenting the damn thing would have taken ages.

Microsoft keeps looking for others to blame for the fact that software is becoming a commodity.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The &#8216;inventor&#8217; of the browser cookie cynically spoke about the fact that it took him just an hour to implement (&#8216;invent&#8217;) and patenting the damn thing would have taken ages.</p>
<p>Microsoft keeps looking for others to blame for the fact that software is becoming a commodity.</p>
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		<title>By: Roy Bixler</title>
		<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/comment-page-2/#comment-7258</link>
		<dc:creator>Roy Bixler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 22:41:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/#comment-7258</guid>
		<description>Those &quot;softies&quot; must have drank a lot of Koolaid to come to a view of patents like this.  They seem to believe that patents are only there to enforce private monopolies on ideas and anyone who uses those ideas without a &quot;licence&quot; from the patent holder is &quot;stealing&quot;.

Reality check: patents are there to encourage the publication of good ideas for the public good.  The &quot;carrot&quot; for the &quot;inventor&quot; of the idea is a temporary monopoly on its use.  When patents were originally conceived, the world ran much more slowly and mathematical concepts were not supposed to be patentable, so a 17-20 year temporary monopoly on an idea may have been more reasonable at the time.

What these &quot;softies&quot; are now saying is that mathematical concepts (i.e. software, algorithms) are patentable, they deserve a 17-20 year duration on that already questionable patent and that their patent application doesn&#039;t even have to describe the idea they implement in their software well enough for anyone else to use the patent for its intended purpose.  To top it off, everyone knows that software development moves quickly and a patent which lasts 17-20 years is a ridiculously long time in that field.  Anyone who is using software patents as a basis of a monopoly is essentially making windfall profits from a bad court decision that allowed software patents in the first place.

Software patents are not serving the public good.   Instead of resulting in the publication of ideas that otherwise would not have been published, they prevent or restrict the use of ideas that are already well known.  Software patents need to be abolished.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Those &#8220;softies&#8221; must have drank a lot of Koolaid to come to a view of patents like this.  They seem to believe that patents are only there to enforce private monopolies on ideas and anyone who uses those ideas without a &#8220;licence&#8221; from the patent holder is &#8220;stealing&#8221;.</p>
<p>Reality check: patents are there to encourage the publication of good ideas for the public good.  The &#8220;carrot&#8221; for the &#8220;inventor&#8221; of the idea is a temporary monopoly on its use.  When patents were originally conceived, the world ran much more slowly and mathematical concepts were not supposed to be patentable, so a 17-20 year temporary monopoly on an idea may have been more reasonable at the time.</p>
<p>What these &#8220;softies&#8221; are now saying is that mathematical concepts (i.e. software, algorithms) are patentable, they deserve a 17-20 year duration on that already questionable patent and that their patent application doesn&#8217;t even have to describe the idea they implement in their software well enough for anyone else to use the patent for its intended purpose.  To top it off, everyone knows that software development moves quickly and a patent which lasts 17-20 years is a ridiculously long time in that field.  Anyone who is using software patents as a basis of a monopoly is essentially making windfall profits from a bad court decision that allowed software patents in the first place.</p>
<p>Software patents are not serving the public good.   Instead of resulting in the publication of ideas that otherwise would not have been published, they prevent or restrict the use of ideas that are already well known.  Software patents need to be abolished.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Roy Schestowitz</title>
		<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/comment-page-2/#comment-7251</link>
		<dc:creator>Roy Schestowitz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 17:28:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/#comment-7251</guid>
		<description>It was about a year ago that I browsed that site. I tried again to find a copy. Burned 5 minutes doing so without success. :-(</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It was about a year ago that I browsed that site. I tried again to find a copy. Burned 5 minutes doing so without success. <img src='http://techrights.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':-(' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: CoolGuy</title>
		<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/comment-page-2/#comment-7240</link>
		<dc:creator>CoolGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:26:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/#comment-7240</guid>
		<description>@roy

you can get the image from the browser cache</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@roy</p>
<p>you can get the image from the browser cache</p>
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		<title>By: CoolGuy</title>
		<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/comment-page-1/#comment-7239</link>
		<dc:creator>CoolGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:22:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/#comment-7239</guid>
		<description>why are my post not visible ???</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>why are my post not visible ???</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: CoolGuy</title>
		<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/comment-page-1/#comment-7238</link>
		<dc:creator>CoolGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:21:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/#comment-7238</guid>
		<description>Let microsoft implement GPL in their sql server/.net and then the OSI will talk with them.

Why does FOSS have to build bridges, when its M$ that has to row the boat to us in the frist place.

Look at their bad behaviour with the OOXML and some dumbass still thinks that M$ wants to interoperate with FOSS.

M$ got invited because the decisions are made by the wrong kind of people that crept inside the OSI board and now they are bullying the OSI board into having their own way - just like M$ likes to do...

F*** their interoperability shit. Let them die a slow and painful death.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let microsoft implement GPL in their sql server/.net and then the OSI will talk with them.</p>
<p>Why does FOSS have to build bridges, when its M$ that has to row the boat to us in the frist place.</p>
<p>Look at their bad behaviour with the OOXML and some dumbass still thinks that M$ wants to interoperate with FOSS.</p>
<p>M$ got invited because the decisions are made by the wrong kind of people that crept inside the OSI board and now they are bullying the OSI board into having their own way &#8211; just like M$ likes to do&#8230;</p>
<p>F*** their interoperability shit. Let them die a slow and painful death.</p>
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		<title>By: Roy Schestowitz</title>
		<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/comment-page-1/#comment-7236</link>
		<dc:creator>Roy Schestowitz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:16:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/#comment-7236</guid>
		<description>Watch &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.gridter.com/articles/software_cycle.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this image&lt;/a&gt; (some &lt;a href=&quot;http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/browse_thread/thread/8dbd89da8554f84/8324dca0260dadb5?lnk=st&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;context here&lt;/a&gt;)

&lt;b&gt;Edit:&lt;/b&gt;

Hmm... I realise now that the image is no longer there and I can&#039;t find a copy. The description hopefully explains what was shown there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Watch <a href="http://www.gridter.com/articles/software_cycle.html" rel="nofollow">this image</a> (some <a href="http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/browse_thread/thread/8dbd89da8554f84/8324dca0260dadb5?lnk=st" rel="nofollow">context here</a>)</p>
<p><b>Edit:</b></p>
<p>Hmm&#8230; I realise now that the image is no longer there and I can&#8217;t find a copy. The description hopefully explains what was shown there.</p>
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		<title>By: Victor Soliz</title>
		<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/comment-page-1/#comment-7234</link>
		<dc:creator>Victor Soliz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 16:03:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/#comment-7234</guid>
		<description>Wow, FLOSS copies from proprietary software, therefore it must suck...

Reminds me of internet explorer 7 implementing tabs, or OS/X Leopard implementing workspaces, but hey, who cares about those fine examples? It is better to blindly follow crazy MS accusations...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, FLOSS copies from proprietary software, therefore it must suck&#8230;</p>
<p>Reminds me of internet explorer 7 implementing tabs, or OS/X Leopard implementing workspaces, but hey, who cares about those fine examples? It is better to blindly follow crazy MS accusations&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Victor Soliz</title>
		<link>http://techrights.org/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/comment-page-1/#comment-7232</link>
		<dc:creator>Victor Soliz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2008 15:51:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/27/microsoft-wants-money-at-osbc/#comment-7232</guid>
		<description>Yeah thanks for that Groklaw, like I said before I think OOXML actually stands for optionally-open, this is due to prior experience on how .net works.

.net has been released to ECMA and MS offers it as open stuff , EXCEPT for system.windows.forms. 

So, what happens is that all the MS IDES (And SharpDevelop) will almost make it explicit to the user that he must use system.windows.forms, you decide to make an application and it will use windows.forms by default, you got to opt-out and there is no other easy way to have GUI in a .net app without that. And that&#039;s not the only case, MS enforces extensions, like SQL server and other issues.

This is the reason MONO fails to do the only job you would have considered as useful to Linux, let people use important .net apps outside the framework, let me talk from experience that this happens specifically to &quot;Da Vinci&quot; the Bolivian tax client software which was implemented on vb.net and among other things requires you to run a SQLserver client and comes with activeX components... Thus it is impossible to run it on MONO in Linux anyways.

So, that&#039;s how I think it would work in Office, MS will forever advertize OOXML as the ultimate open document standard, let&#039;s just assume you actually were able to implement such 6000 pages long format, and that you give enough confidence on the OSP to implement it, you will still be screwed up since MS is most likely to make office in a way that users will be (unsuspectingly) forced into using the non-covered extensions, since it will be VERY easy to add them to your OOXML document, and VERY hard not to add them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah thanks for that Groklaw, like I said before I think OOXML actually stands for optionally-open, this is due to prior experience on how .net works.</p>
<p>.net has been released to ECMA and MS offers it as open stuff , EXCEPT for system.windows.forms. </p>
<p>So, what happens is that all the MS IDES (And SharpDevelop) will almost make it explicit to the user that he must use system.windows.forms, you decide to make an application and it will use windows.forms by default, you got to opt-out and there is no other easy way to have GUI in a .net app without that. And that&#8217;s not the only case, MS enforces extensions, like SQL server and other issues.</p>
<p>This is the reason MONO fails to do the only job you would have considered as useful to Linux, let people use important .net apps outside the framework, let me talk from experience that this happens specifically to &#8220;Da Vinci&#8221; the Bolivian tax client software which was implemented on vb.net and among other things requires you to run a SQLserver client and comes with activeX components&#8230; Thus it is impossible to run it on MONO in Linux anyways.</p>
<p>So, that&#8217;s how I think it would work in Office, MS will forever advertize OOXML as the ultimate open document standard, let&#8217;s just assume you actually were able to implement such 6000 pages long format, and that you give enough confidence on the OSP to implement it, you will still be screwed up since MS is most likely to make office in a way that users will be (unsuspectingly) forced into using the non-covered extensions, since it will be VERY easy to add them to your OOXML document, and VERY hard not to add them.</p>
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