05.06.09
IRC: #bocottnovell @ FreeNode: May 5th, 2009 – Part 1
To use your own IRC client, join channel #boycottnovell in FreeNode.
| schestowitz | NSW (Australia) Didn’t Choose Free Software Because It Doesn’t Run Non-Free Software??? http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/04/au… | May 05 00:24 |
|---|---|---|
| the_mad_hatter | This is a bit off-topic, but it’s interesting | May 05 00:34 |
| the_mad_hatter | http://www.vanityfair.com/online/politic… | May 05 00:34 |
| the_mad_hatter | Media Darwinism: Which Sites Will Survive? | May 05 00:34 |
| oiaohm | schestowitz: its getting worse. Nsw EC (electrial comission) is moving to .net windows and orcale from java orcale and hp OS. | May 05 00:46 |
| oiaohm | They only have 6 coders total. | May 05 00:46 |
| oiaohm | Anyone else expecting problems. | May 05 00:46 |
| schestowitz | the_mad_hatter: slimmest and fittest | May 05 00:46 |
| schestowitz | I can carry on for quite some time; might have to work a little more for income though | May 05 00:47 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, that older scam | May 05 00:47 |
| schestowitz | See LinuxToday comments | May 05 00:47 |
| schestowitz | Those are the ones I saw anyway | May 05 00:47 |
| *Balrog (n=Balrog@pool-71-255-107-197.phlapa.east.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovell | May 05 00:54 | |
| *_Hicham_ (n=hicham@wana-124-245-12-196.wanamaroc.com) has joined #boycottnovell | May 05 01:01 | |
| _Hicham_ | Hi All! | May 05 01:02 |
| Balrog_ | Hi _Hicham_ | May 05 01:02 |
| _Hicham_ | Balrog_ : any unicode problems again? | May 05 01:03 |
| Balrog_ | not at this point | May 05 01:03 |
| Balrog_ | though I’m annoyed with people using Pagemaker when Scribus is so much better | May 05 01:03 |
| Balrog_ | Adobe doesn’t even support PM anymore | May 05 01:03 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft’s ODF ‘Support’ is a Scam: http://boycottnovell.com/2009… | May 05 01:07 |
| *the_mad_hatter has quit (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) | May 05 01:08 | |
| _Hicham_ | MS never supported and will never support ODF | May 05 01:14 |
| _Hicham_ | I hate doc files | May 05 01:14 |
| Balrog_ | I hate doc files too | May 05 01:17 |
| Balrog_ | though I hate docx a lot more | May 05 01:17 |
| _Hicham_ | fuck docx, fuck doc, fuck microsoft | May 05 01:26 |
| schestowitz | BillG lives you, _Hicham_ | May 05 01:27 |
| Balrog_ | I’m stuck using .doc for interoperability purposes.  |
May 05 01:27 |
| _Hicham_ | fuck interop too | May 05 01:28 |
| Balrog_ | that’s the point of odf | May 05 01:28 |
| Balrog_ | but MS won’t implement it | May 05 01:28 |
| _Hicham_ | MS don’t want Linux, and Linux don’t wan’t it either | May 05 01:28 |
| _Hicham_ | MS pays Novell, to do so | May 05 01:28 |
| _Hicham_ | as always | May 05 01:29 |
| _Hicham_ | Novell, the beloved company of schestowitz | May 05 01:29 |
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| oiaohm | ODF scam is a repeat of the RTF scam | May 05 01:37 |
| oiaohm | Except MS forget something. In the RTF scam they were the cheepest Office suit in the market. | May 05 01:38 |
| *neonfloss has quit (“Leaving”) | May 05 01:39 | |
| Balrog_ | http://ars.userfriendly.org… << funny | May 05 01:40 |
| Balrog_ | oiaohm: RTF scam? URL? | May 05 01:40 |
| RTF was supposed to be an “open” exchange format. It was never fully published, fully featured or really used by M$ Office. It was the OOXML of the 90s. | May 05 01:42 | |
| I remember because I saw people fall for it at the time. | May 05 01:42 | |
| Here’s the wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wi… | May 05 01:43 | |
| oiaohm | RTF was the first attempt at a unified document format. | May 05 01:45 |
| oiaohm | Done so MS gained market. | May 05 01:45 |
| and, Office was not the cheapest Word Processor of note on the market. According to the wiki RTF was made to compete with Tex. It should be obvious which of the two was better. | May 05 01:46 | |
| oiaohm | MS works suit was cheeper. | May 05 01:46 |
| oiaohm | And it was used in the same kinds of way a office suit is used today. | May 05 01:47 |
| oiaohm | Everyone forgets ms precurser to Office. | May 05 01:47 |
| Balrog_ | ms works was always a piece of junk | May 05 01:48 |
| Works was a cheap sucker package meant to draw people into Word and Excel, which were sold as separate products at the time. | May 05 01:49 | |
| M$ dumped it on the market. | May 05 01:49 | |
| oiaohm | Yep. | May 05 01:49 |
| oiaohm | And it worked. | May 05 01:49 |
| I’m shocked that ebook readers use RTF instead of Tex. | May 05 01:49 | |
| oiaohm | MS does not have the cheap sucker package to upsell from. | May 05 01:49 |
| oiaohm | Unless you can the MS trial office that. | May 05 01:50 |
| oiaohm | can/call | May 05 01:50 |
| The dumping did not work so well as bribery and strategic dumping, giving “free” software to business students and other “leaders” | May 05 01:50 | |
| Tex, LaTex and others are still alive and far superior. | May 05 01:51 | |
| RTF is a complete waste of time. | May 05 01:51 | |
| Ha, the bastards also meant to confuse the DCA market http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Re… | May 05 01:52 | |
| That worked well. | May 05 01:52 | |
| _Hicham_ | vive LaTeX | May 05 01:52 |
| Those are parallels to OOXML fraud that I did not notice before. | May 05 01:53 | |
| If you want your writing to look good on paper, you will use LaTex. | May 05 01:53 | |
| KDE has some nifty utilities for it. kbibtex, which works as a reference database, and kile, which is a great editor. | May 05 01:55 | |
| oiaohm | Basically history is repeating and most people don’t even notice. | May 05 01:55 |
| A place where the parallel breaks down, however, is that Open Office is easier to use than M$ Office. | May 05 01:56 | |
| oiaohm | MS Office has become word perfect. | May 05 01:56 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft’s Twitter AstroTurf Continues http://boycottnovell.com/2009/0… | May 05 01:56 |
| oiaohm | from the time of RTF | May 05 01:56 |
| schestowitz | twitter sold out to the Vole :–) | May 05 01:56 |
| oiaohm | The chairs have moved but the game has not. | May 05 01:57 |
| Word Perfect was much better than Word ever will be. | May 05 01:57 | |
| oiaohm | Word Perfect also tried crappy supporting of RTF to save themselves. | May 05 01:57 |
| Has Twitter sold out or is it being abused as all communications methods are by M$? | May 05 01:58 | |
| oiaohm | As I say its a repeat in more ways than 1. | May 05 01:58 |
| RTF “support” was crappy in every word processor by design, just as ISO OOXML will be. | May 05 01:58 | |
| Balrog_ | by MS? explain … | May 05 01:59 |
| Balrog_ | RTF support always was bad | May 05 01:59 |
| schestowitz | Lyx is good too, I hardly used kile | May 05 01:59 |
| Balrog_ | and yes, I used to use WordPerfect for Mac | May 05 01:59 |
| Balrog_ | probably the best word processor ever | May 05 01:59 |
| M$ abuses Slashdot, mail lists, even Boycott Novell’s comments. No communications medium is safe from their malice. | May 05 01:59 | |
| Balrog_ | twitter: url? | May 05 02:00 |
| Roy just did a story on twitter. | May 05 02:00 | |
| oiaohm | I find the insert feature of latex into open office at times handy. | May 05 02:00 |
| the rest is history. | May 05 02:00 | |
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| oiaohm | I know for sure that is not going to open in MS office. | May 05 02:01 |
| mail list abuse http://lists.essential.org/1998/… | May 05 02:01 | |
| Balrog_ | that’s from ’98 | May 05 02:01 |
| http://www.google.com/search?hl=e… | May 05 02:02 | |
| nice how death threats come up at the top of the results, isn’t it? | May 05 02:02 | |
| Balrog_ | heh | May 05 02:03 |
| oiaohm | MS shills are not a new thing. | May 05 02:04 |
| oiaohm | Difference is now they have moved them into PR companies so it cannot be traced extactly back to them. | May 05 02:04 |
| here’s a personal collection of Slashdot trolls http://slashdot.org/~twitte… | May 05 02:04 | |
| oiaohm | First MS shill I hit was in 1995 | May 05 02:04 |
| oiaohm | When I stated about a Microsoft crash flaw in Internet explorer. | May 05 02:05 |
| You can see what G. Michaels does here and in his smear blog. | May 05 02:05 | |
| In his latest dribble he congratulates me on getting a job and tells me that I’m silly for thinking M$ would try to keep me from one. | May 05 02:06 | |
| yes, he cites M$’s inability to blacklist me as evidence of them not trying, as if his persistent harassment did not exist. | May 05 02:07 | |
| *oiaohm has quit (Remote closed the connection) | May 05 02:08 | |
| Roy has posted the story of Boycott Microsoft, where a M$ rep called to get the blogger fired. So you can add phone calls to their list of abuse. | May 05 02:09 | |
| Almost all communications methods were used to attack Peter Gutmann, who wrote an early report on Vista problems. | May 05 02:10 | |
| George Ou and Ed Bott wrote several pieces for their respective Wintel rags. They wrote and called his boss in an effort to get him fired, and so on and so forth. | May 05 02:11 | |
| You can imagine that astroturfers took up the talking points all over the web. | May 05 02:11 | |
| The end result of all of this bullshit is that M$ has zero credibility. | May 05 02:12 | |
| Balrog_ | yes. except that there are still people that are convinced that MS is okay | May 05 02:12 |
| When people say good things about anything M$, you know they are either ignorant or lying. | May 05 02:12 | |
| There are almost no ignorant fans left. | May 05 02:13 | |
| Vista’s failure has demoralized them all. | May 05 02:13 | |
| Balrog_ | I know some ignorant people who don’t really card | May 05 02:13 |
| Balrog_ | care * | May 05 02:13 |
| Balrog_ | they say things about OOo that were true maybe in 2.x | May 05 02:13 |
| right, so they will never go online and express themselves. | May 05 02:13 | |
| if they don’t care, they won’t speak up. | May 05 02:14 | |
| so those who speak up are generally lying. | May 05 02:14 | |
| Balrog_ | twitter: who’s this ‘sockdisclosure’ person? | May 05 02:16 |
| Balrog_ | oh … they dont speak up unless you pull them in. | May 05 02:16 |
| sockdisclosure is just another nym the astroturfers use. | May 05 02:17 | |
| Balrog_ | oh. | May 05 02:17 |
| they decided to target me specifically. it is impossible for me to say who they really are. probably a subgroup of WE | May 05 02:17 | |
| they are not very bright, as usual. | May 05 02:18 | |
| Balrog | obviously | May 05 02:19 |
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| schestowitz | Slashdot told me MS marketing people roam Slashdot | May 05 02:22 |
| Balrog | schestowitz: how? | May 05 02:23 |
| you don’t need Slashdot to tell you that, but it’s nice that they know. Once again, I have to scold Slashdot for not publishing what they know. | May 05 02:23 | |
| schestowitz | Anyway, I’m tired | May 05 02:24 |
| schestowitz | I’ll do more posts when I get up | May 05 02:24 |
| Good night! | May 05 02:24 | |
| Balrog | night! | May 05 02:26 |
| Balrog | I’m going too | May 05 02:27 |
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| the_mad_hatter | You have to wonder who was behind this: | May 05 02:35 |
| the_mad_hatter | http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/05/tech… | May 05 02:35 |
| the_mad_hatter | Apple and Google Ties Investigated vy FTC | May 05 02:35 |
| the_mad_hatter | sorry meant “by FTC” | May 05 02:35 |
| no need to wonder. Wired did the big write up months ago | May 05 02:35 | |
| it will take a while to clean the Bush out of Washington’s offices. | May 05 02:36 | |
| M$ execs go everywhere and not a peep from the FTC. Now they look into Apple? | May 05 02:37 | |
| Oh yeah, big bad monopoly Apple. | May 05 02:37 | |
| Here you go, the ongoing M$ plot to kill Google. http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl… | May 05 02:40 | |
| the_mad_hatter | Thanks for the link. Keeping track of these bastards means a lot of reading. | May 05 02:42 |
| Roy is doing a better job of it than I am at the moment. | May 05 02:43 | |
| he has taken the time to dive deep into board members and other good information. | May 05 02:43 | |
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| the_mad_hatter | Agreed. He does a damned good job of it. | May 05 02:43 |
| tracking people helps to understand why companies do such stupid things | May 05 02:44 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | getting a job in this economy sucks | May 05 02:44 |
| oh yes it does. | May 05 02:44 | |
| it’s been difficult for about 15 years. | May 05 02:44 | |
| the_mad_hatter | Well, technically they aren’t stupid. After all, it’s a way to make money. What they are is immoral. | May 05 02:44 |
| no, it’s stupid. they have helped ruin the economy that makes their money worth anything. | May 05 02:45 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | friend told me I should look at getting a job at canonical because they let you work remotely | May 05 02:45 |
| get a job at any ethical company that will hire you. good luck! | May 05 02:46 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | (since I’m not in the uk, hadn’t thought to apply before) | May 05 02:46 |
| mib_nyvk49 | guess what I saw? | May 05 02:46 |
| _Hicham_ | what did u saw? | May 05 02:46 |
| mib_nyvk49 | their jobs page lists Mono developers | May 05 02:46 |
| ugh | May 05 02:46 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | they are looking for devs experienced with GNOME and Mono | May 05 02:46 |
| well, they do make extensive use of Gnome | May 05 02:47 | |
| got link? | May 05 02:47 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | yea, not surprised at all by gnome | May 05 02:47 |
| _Hicham_ | Mono developers for Canonical? | May 05 02:47 |
| mib_nyvk49 | yea | May 05 02:47 |
| mib_nyvk49 | hold on, lemme find a link | May 05 02:47 |
| mib_nyvk49 | gotta search for it again | May 05 02:48 |
| _Hicham_ | I am not surprised | May 05 02:48 |
| _Hicham_ | Canonical loves Mono | May 05 02:48 |
| I’m surprised. This mono lover says, ” The two biggest Gnome based distros (Redhat and Canonical) don’t do Mono development The biggest Mono adopters are …. Novell! Surprise surprise! Sort of ironic since SuSE was traditionally the biggest KDE desktop…” | May 05 02:49 | |
| http://panela.blog-city.com/mo… | May 05 02:50 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employme… | May 05 02:50 |
| _Hicham_ | Ubuntu started to drift away from its philosophy | May 05 02:51 |
| It’s not damning. You might want to hire someone who’s worked with Mono, if only to eliminate it. | May 05 02:52 | |
| basically, they are hiring up for their mobile push | May 05 02:52 | |
| and they are going with Gnome because it’s what they know. | May 05 02:53 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | yea,although not sure that fits with Online Service | May 05 02:53 |
| mib_nyvk49 | unless it’s some sort of cloud service I guess | May 05 02:53 |
| GPE was not bad five years ago and might still be nice. | May 05 02:53 | |
| _Hicham_ | Canonical still doesn’t contribute much to Linux ecosystem | May 05 02:55 |
| mib_nyvk49 | seems like they are actively trying to change that though | May 05 02:55 |
| mib_nyvk49 | and to be fair, mark funds it out of pocket | May 05 02:55 |
| _Hicham_ | normal | May 05 02:55 |
| mib_nyvk49 | that’s pretty damn cool | May 05 02:55 |
| _Hicham_ | Mark has got lots of money | May 05 02:55 |
| mib_nyvk49 | so? | May 05 02:55 |
| mib_nyvk49 | he’s using it to help push freedom software | May 05 02:56 |
| mib_nyvk49 | that earns my respect | May 05 02:56 |
| _Hicham_ | its company is not very profitable yet | May 05 02:56 |
| mib_nyvk49 | give it time  |
May 05 02:56 |
| _Hicham_ | he started Ubuntu foundation, but no one contributed | May 05 02:57 |
| he’s not doing badly for someone who will mail CDs free of charge anywhere in the world | May 05 02:57 | |
| _Hicham_ | sthg like SPI | May 05 02:57 |
| making that profitable is amazing. | May 05 02:57 | |
| _Hicham_ | I just see that he is doing things the old redhat way | May 05 02:58 |
| _Hicham_ | and keeping some apps closed source | May 05 02:58 |
| like what? | May 05 02:58 | |
| _Hicham_ | malone | May 05 02:59 |
| mib_nyvk49 | they do closed source? | May 05 03:00 |
| _Hicham_ | yes | May 05 03:00 |
| _Hicham_ | the only noticeable thing they did is upstart | May 05 03:00 |
| _Hicham_ | but arjan work ( the linux 5 seconds boot ) was based on original sysV init | May 05 03:01 |
| mib_nyvk49 | that’s disappointing | May 05 03:03 |
| _Hicham_ | they said that clearly | May 05 03:04 |
| _Hicham_ | they are a packaging company | May 05 03:04 |
| _Hicham_ | not a contributing company | May 05 03:04 |
| _Hicham_ | and Mr Mark steels debian devs | May 05 03:04 |
| mib_nyvk49 | who doyou work for? | May 05 03:08 |
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| mib_nyvk49 | need more places to apply for a job | May 05 03:10 |
| _Hicham_ | where do u live? | May 05 03:10 |
| mib_nyvk49 | I’d be willing to move, but currently virginia | May 05 03:11 |
| mib_nyvk49 | (USA) | May 05 03:12 |
| _Hicham_ | did u apply for old redhat? | May 05 03:12 |
| mib_nyvk49 | yea | May 05 03:12 |
| _Hicham_ | and? | May 05 03:12 |
| mib_nyvk49 | no luck yet | May 05 03:13 |
| _Hicham_ | what are ur main skills? | May 05 03:13 |
| mib_nyvk49 | I’ve tinkered with gtk | May 05 03:13 |
| mib_nyvk49 | desktop hacking is what I want to do | May 05 03:14 |
| _Hicham_ | did u do anything useful with GTK? | May 05 03:14 |
| mib_nyvk49 | not really | May 05 03:15 |
| do you know C? | May 05 03:15 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | yea | May 05 03:15 |
| _Hicham_ | u should at least do sthg with it | May 05 03:16 |
| _Hicham_ | they r not gonna hire just like that | May 05 03:16 |
| mib_nyvk49 | what do you guys hack on? | May 05 03:18 |
| I don’t right now | May 05 03:20 | |
| I’ve done research and device development, imaging and a little transport. | May 05 03:21 | |
| C and FORTRAN. | May 05 03:21 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | you mean like gimp? | May 05 03:21 |
| no, I used imaging libraries | May 05 03:21 | |
| for devices I was making. | May 05 03:22 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | lucky enough to be able to write the code as free software? or no? | May 05 03:22 |
| Yes, and as public domain. If you work for the government, your code is always public domain. | May 05 03:24 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | ah cool | May 05 03:24 |
| or should be, thieves like to “own” it | May 05 03:24 | |
| they make BS business cases and split up what taxpayers paid for. | May 05 03:24 | |
| then they try to sell it back. most fail | May 05 03:25 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | you looking for a job too? that’s why not hacking on anything anymore? or just not busy at work? | May 05 03:30 |
| I’m busy at work but it’s not research. | May 05 03:31 | |
| mib_nyvk49 | ah | May 05 03:32 |
| mib_nyvk49 | what kind of government job do you have? military type stuff? or? | May 05 03:38 |
| mib_nyvk49 | if you could work for anyone you wanted, which company would you work for? | May 05 03:41 |
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| the_mad_hatter | I’ve been thinking of getting back into programming. Haven’t done much in the last ten years, been too busy. | May 05 03:54 |
| the_mad_hatter | Anyone got a preference for a C IDE? | May 05 04:03 |
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| the_mad_hatter | Hum, here’s an interesting article in Huffington Post by Larry Lessig: | May 05 04:11 |
| the_mad_hatter | http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lawrence-le… | May 05 04:11 |
| the_mad_hatter | Banks Think They “Own” Congress? Wrong — We’re Taking Congress Back | May 05 04:11 |
| the_mad_hatter | That could really scare Microsoft, because they think they own congress as well. | May 05 04:11 |
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| for C, I like kate | May 05 04:51 | |
| the_mad_hatter | Kate? Never heard of it. Why do you like it? | May 05 04:51 |
| kate and kdbg | May 05 04:52 | |
| Kate is KDE’s text editor for code. It has tabs, split screens, color coding and pretty good project management. | May 05 04:52 | |
| You pick up where you left off. | May 05 04:52 | |
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| the_mad_hatter | How does it run under Gnome? | May 05 05:29 |
| the_mad_hatter | Roy, you around? | May 05 05:38 |
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| I don’t run gnome, so I can’t tell you. It should run just fine. I mostly use E16. | May 05 06:08 | |
| oh, he’s gone | May 05 06:08 | |
| ha ha. The US stock market rallied but M$ could barely keep above $20. They should sink right down on news of more layoffs. | May 05 06:10 | |
| http://www.google.com/finance… | May 05 06:10 | |
| How do they expect to get Windows 7 out the door without people to finish it up and sell it? | May 05 06:10 | |
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| schestowitz | http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employm… “Desirable skills and experience * Python, Mono “ <<-It’s a bit of a stretch to call it Ubuntu promoting Mono because it’s mentioned once | May 05 08:13 |
| schestowitz | Canonical’s revenue is 20mil | May 05 08:14 |
| schestowitz | twitter: they may actually RISE on layoiff news | May 05 08:16 |
| schestowitz | Maybe | May 05 08:16 |
| schestowitz | Remember that layoffs are sometimes good news to INVESTORS | May 05 08:16 |
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| kentma | hi all | May 05 08:40 |
| schestowitz | Hi, kentma | May 05 08:59 |
| schestowitz | trmanco says COLA has been trolled a lot less recently | May 05 08:59 |
| schestowitz | I hope it’s true | May 05 08:59 |
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| MinceR | geekings | May 05 09:37 |
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| schestowitz | The Reg has made a story from the whole Firefox controversy: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05… | May 05 09:52 |
| schestowitz | ushimitsudoki1 saw it coming. | May 05 09:52 |
| schestowitz | Asempra is dead. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009… | May 05 09:52 |
| oiaohm | Firefox extension conflits had to happen at some point. | May 05 09:54 |
| schestowitz | Researchers demonstrate the dangers of using Windows by building a botnet: http://arstechnica.com/security/news/200… | May 05 09:55 |
| schestowitz | EU urges US to drop ICANN < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05… > | May 05 09:56 |
| schestowitz | I keep seeing reports about Googlapple | May 05 09:56 |
| schestowitz | What is the Mac loyals’ rebuttal/defense? | May 05 09:56 |
| schestowitz | Balrog_ ought to know. | May 05 09:56 |
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| MinceR | they’ll start loving google, obviously | May 05 09:57 |
| MinceR | they’ve already sacrificed a lot of their freedom, so why stop there? | May 05 09:57 |
| schestowitz | oh cool. BN’s Netcraft ranking is under 2000 now | May 05 09:57 |
| schestowitz | 1997th on the Web. | May 05 09:57 |
| schestowitz | Phoronix is 3123th | May 05 09:58 |
| schestowitz | roughlydrafted 43,000th | May 05 09:59 |
| tacone | schestowitz: so you made the switch to the wiki ? | May 05 10:02 |
| tacone | how to check the rank ? | May 05 10:04 |
| schestowitz | tacone: the toolbar or site checker | May 05 10:13 |
| schestowitz | OIN Explains TomTom’s Settlement with Microsoft (and Other Patent News) < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05… > | May 05 10:13 |
| schestowitz | Is Jupiter Broadcasting’s Linux Action Show Anti-GNU/Linux? < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/0… > | May 05 10:13 |
| schestowitz | tacone: we need to do more work on the Wiki. I’ll make lots of time to redo it next month, hopefully. | May 05 10:13 |
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| schestowitz | http://www.youtube.com/watch?… | May 05 10:40 |
| schestowitz | Peter Dinham spreads BSA propaganda: http://www.itwire.com/content/… | May 05 10:52 |
| schestowitz | Sarah Palin?!?! < http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=… > | May 05 10:54 |
| schestowitz | BlackBerry Outsells iPhone < http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2… > | May 05 10:56 |
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| schestowitz | Redding does something sensible for a change: http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009… (EU Commissioner Pushes For Independent ICANN) | May 05 11:00 |
| zoobab01 | http://media.ffii.org/EbaReferral090430/… | May 05 11:01 |
| schestowitz | Geoengineering and the New Climate Denialism < http://www.worldchanging.com/archiv… > | May 05 11:01 |
| schestowitz | “Microsoft and GE appreciate the leading role the EPO and the Boards of Appeal have played in establishing a reliable framework for patent protection of computer-implemented inven-tions. “ | May 05 11:03 |
| schestowitz | You know about the GE-MS collaboation from last month, right? | May 05 11:03 |
| schestowitz | Does the FFII have a page about GE? | May 05 11:03 |
| schestowitz | http://finance.yahoo.com/echa… | May 05 11:04 |
| schestowitz | Down from $40 to about $5 | May 05 11:05 |
| schestowitz | Then OBAMAABUSH robbed the American public to temporarily elevate the stocks | May 05 11:05 |
| zoobab01 | IBM will soon be president of the USPTO | May 05 11:06 |
| schestowitz | I wrote about it | May 05 11:07 |
| schestowitz | bad news? | May 05 11:07 |
| schestowitz | Well, they were bound to pick one of the monopolists (i.e. “IP” lovers) | May 05 11:07 |
| schestowitz | Marshall Phelps is from IBM too | May 05 11:07 |
| zoobab01 | IBM = swpat | May 05 11:08 |
| zoobab01 | they want swpat to have a competitive advantage over linux | May 05 11:08 |
| zoobab01 | come to us, we will protect you | May 05 11:09 |
| schestowitz | RMS: “Arlen Spector has become a Democrat, illustrating how both the Democratic and Republican parties are becoming more right-wing.” | May 05 11:09 |
| zoobab01 | “All computer programs have technical character in so far as they cause physical changes in the hardware.” —IBM TBA EPO Decision T 1173/97 | May 05 11:09 |
| zoobab01 | http://stopsoftwarepatents.org/quotes | May 05 11:09 |
| schestowitz | zoobab01: or “pay to join OINBM” | May 05 11:09 |
| zoobab01 | |
May 05 11:09 |
| zoobab01 | FFII should kick the FAT patent in court to test Bilski | May 05 11:09 |
| schestowitz | They can come up with more | May 05 11:10 |
| zoobab01 | because the OIN hates subject matter | May 05 11:10 |
| schestowitz | Just change the system | May 05 11:10 |
| zoobab01 | OIN is IBM | May 05 11:10 |
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| zoobab01 | Linux Foundation is IBM | May 05 11:10 |
| schestowitz | “Fighting patents one by one will never eliminate the danger of software patents, any more than swatting mosquitoes will eliminate malaria.” –RMS | May 05 11:10 |
| zoobab01 | sure | May 05 11:10 |
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| schestowitz | Elsevier conspires with company to mislead the public: Merck Makes Phony Peer-Review Journal < http://blog.bioethics.net/2009/05/m… > | May 05 11:24 |
| schestowitz | I’ve just mailed RMS about Mono | May 05 11:25 |
| schestowitz | The FDA’s corruption makes its appearance again: http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_ch… | May 05 11:26 |
| schestowitz | BN did 12805 pages in the past 6 hours. I think it’s a record | May 05 11:27 |
| oiaohm | Linux Foundation and OIN are not just IBM zoobab01. | May 05 11:30 |
| oiaohm | IBM is stuck on patents. They make good money from patents on hardware design. Yes they want to regulate not risk nuking the complete patent system. | May 05 11:31 |
| schestowitz | Monopoly loves monopoly keeper. There’s a surprise… | May 05 11:35 |
| oiaohm | Mind you IBM don’t not make the money exactly the way most expect. If you want to build something that breaches a IBM patent as long as you allow IBM to stick there brand and be a retailer you are fine. | May 05 11:44 |
| oiaohm | Its still making IBM good money. | May 05 11:45 |
| schestowitz | Fedora 10 on HP Mini 1000 < http://s206905281.onlinehome… > | May 05 11:46 |
| zoobab01 | oiaohm: look at the Linux Foundation patent pool, it is all IBM | May 05 11:47 |
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| zoobab01 | I have also evidence that IBM is heavily involved in the Linux Foundation patent policy | May 05 11:47 |
| oiaohm | There is some orcale in there zoobab01. Remember IBM is the largest patent holder out there. | May 05 11:48 |
| zoobab01 | oiaohm: so what? their patents create liabilities for small companies like mine | May 05 11:48 |
| oiaohm | IBM also has the policy that open source can use there patents since its inside there usage policy. | May 05 11:48 |
| oiaohm | Since open source can have IBM brand put on it. | May 05 11:49 |
| zoobab01 | oiaohm: it means that scritly speaking I have to waste my time complying with their stupid claims | May 05 11:49 |
| zoobab01 | FUC | May 05 11:49 |
| zoobab01 | I don’t produce open source | May 05 11:49 |
| zoobab01 | so it does not concern me | May 05 11:49 |
| schestowitz | IBM has good PR | May 05 11:49 |
| zoobab01 | boycottibm.com is free | May 05 11:50 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft is a VERY noisy company | May 05 11:50 |
| schestowitz | Some trackers of news show this too | May 05 11:50 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft is all PR and marketing | May 05 11:50 |
| schestowitz | zoobab01: who would run such a site? It’s also the wrong fish | May 05 11:50 |
| schestowitz | IBM has monopolies like mainframe | May 05 11:51 |
| schestowitz | and HPC | May 05 11:51 |
| schestowitz | Good luck getting their proprietary management tools for that | May 05 11:51 |
| oiaohm | There are other ways out with IBM. Being a sub provider of products is another. Basically IBM can distribute it under IBM brand no problems. | May 05 11:52 |
| oiaohm | Out of the patent holders out there IBM is one of the nicest to small companies. | May 05 11:53 |
| oiaohm | IBM and Cisco systems both use there patents the same way. To hold the right to distribute product. | May 05 11:54 |
| oiaohm | If there did not no one could basically do business. | May 05 11:55 |
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| schestowitz | But it’s still unfair fus | May 05 11:56 |
| schestowitz | *fud | May 05 11:56 |
| schestowitz | to market’s one product basd on perceived protectionism | May 05 11:56 |
| zoobab01 | oiaohm: does not matter if they are nice, they participate to the software patent pollution | May 05 11:57 |
| oiaohm | Neither IBM and Cisco forbid the item from being sold under its own brand either. Also neither IBM or Cisco set the price of the item. | May 05 11:57 |
| schestowitz | Doesn’t matter | May 05 11:58 |
| zoobab01 | like any company wasting my time reading their claims | May 05 11:58 |
| schestowitz | Economics and markets change | May 05 11:58 |
| schestowitz | They could turn aggressive, oiaohm | May 05 11:58 |
| schestowitz | Like Microsoft’s “promise not to sue” | May 05 11:58 |
| schestowitz | Wait until MS announced layoff later today (yes, I hope it’s true) | May 05 11:58 |
| schestowitz | Then it’ll not be Mister Responsible Big Microsoft playing nice with $small_company | May 05 11:59 |
| oiaohm | What would be worse Cisco and IBM making produces that competed with the smaller company and dumping them cheep into the mark so destroying the smaller company. | May 05 11:59 |
| schestowitz | Then they’ll turn into a SCO | May 05 11:59 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: like with Sun? | May 05 11:59 |
| schestowitz | See last night’s link | May 05 11:59 |
| schestowitz | About IBM vs Solaris | May 05 11:59 |
| schestowitz | They dump on the market to ruin Solaris and SPARC | May 05 11:59 |
| oiaohm | Exactly. | May 05 12:00 |
| schestowitz | If it’s wrong for MS, then it’s also wrong for IBM | May 05 12:00 |
| oiaohm | Remove patents does not prevent small guy from attack. | May 05 12:00 |
| schestowitz | But IBM spreads its “Linux” | May 05 12:00 |
| schestowitz | Don’t get me started on IBM’s stub on anything but the kernel | May 05 12:00 |
| schestowitz | This is deliberate | May 05 12:00 |
| schestowitz | They don’t like the philosophy | May 05 12:00 |
| schestowitz | IBM doesn’t even like the GPL much | May 05 12:00 |
| schestowitz | It likes Eclipse for example | May 05 12:00 |
| schestowitz | Fee software | May 05 12:01 |
| schestowitz | “Berlusconi: Wife must apologize for divorce threat” http://www.topix.net/content/ap/2009/0… | May 05 12:01 |
| oiaohm | Patent pollution is only a small part of what a start up company has to put up with. | May 05 12:02 |
| tacone | he also told she was bad advised from his political oppositors | May 05 12:02 |
| schestowitz | Holy cow. | May 05 12:02 |
| schestowitz | Mary Jo Foley is like a Vista7 marketing machine this hyear | May 05 12:02 |
| schestowitz | Every second blog item from her is Vista7 this and Vista7 that. | May 05 12:02 |
| oiaohm | It goes on market the end of this year. | May 05 12:02 |
| schestowitz | She feels the heat, I guess. | May 05 12:02 |
| schestowitz | She’s one of the last Microsoft watchers remaining | May 05 12:02 |
| schestowitz | Joe and Joe are down | May 05 12:03 |
| schestowitz | Todd is moved | May 05 12:03 |
| tacone | vista7 has been suggested from one the main (generic) newspapers of italy to linux users | May 05 12:03 |
| schestowitz | And Microsoft may announce layoffs, but Mary Jo is still ignoring it | May 05 12:03 |
| MinceR | 131310 < _folti_> waa: “i need an iphone because i need a place to stick my ‘defective by design’ sticker.”  |
May 05 12:03 |
| tacone | to linux users !… | May 05 12:03 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: or CDs at the shop | May 05 12:04 |
| schestowitz | Let me find a video of RMS protests in France | May 05 12:04 |
| oiaohm | tacone: windows 7 is though to be magical to convert Linux users back. | May 05 12:04 |
| tacone | though or thought ? | May 05 12:05 |
| schestowitz | What’s wrong with my iPod? < http://www.youtube.com/watch?… > | May 05 12:05 |
| tacone | schestowitz: the iPod itself | May 05 12:05 |
| schestowitz | I’ve grown tired of explaining this to friends | May 05 12:07 |
| schestowitz | They learn when they lose all their music |
May 05 12:07 |
| tacone | right | May 05 12:08 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft to defend its IE policies in closed-door antitrust hearing < http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=2654 > | May 05 12:09 |
| schestowitz | From the same post: http://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-12558-0… “You think the US has a capitalist economy? In what sense?” | May 05 12:09 |
| schestowitz | tacone: it’s like explaining to people that eating just hotdogs will give them a heart attack | May 05 12:09 |
| schestowitz | If you’re lucky you get to tell them this after they get one (if they are still alive) | May 05 12:10 |
| schestowitz | I stopped eating tuna myself. Mercury debate…… | May 05 12:10 |
| schestowitz | I wonder to what extent this can be a corporate lie like “Dolphin Safe”. Here’s what I don’t get: why does tuna present mercury issue whereas other fish don’t? | May 05 12:11 |
| oiaohm | Any large fish presents a Mercury risk. | May 05 12:12 |
| oiaohm | Tuna are not particularly good at getting rid of mercury. | May 05 12:12 |
| oiaohm | Just like we are not particularly good at getting rid of mercury. | May 05 12:12 |
| schestowitz | “You gotta see this in context, Miguel de Icaza recommends Linux Hater, Linux Hater points to a Novell blog that point to the video and the Novell blog mentions the Linux Hater blog. This kind of ‘constructive’ criticism is lethal, as it comes from a Linux proponent. See where that ‘E-Commerce Times’ article gets a ‘Does Linux Suck?’ headline out of it.” | May 05 12:13 |
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| schestowitz | “Just who ‘writes’ the Novell blog http://www.novell.com/communities/no… Just who writes ‘Linux sucks’ blog ?” | May 05 12:13 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: I guess I’ll keep off tuna for a while longer then. The sea’s population is growing smaller too. About 10 years ago I was told that it would almost run out in th e future (or price of seafood elevated) | May 05 12:14 |
| oiaohm | http://www.fda.gov/fdac/reprints/mercury.html | May 05 12:16 |
| MinceR | where’s the Linux proponent? | May 05 12:17 |
| MinceR | de icaza certainly isn’t one | May 05 12:17 |
| oiaohm | Shark is one of the most risky one its normally sold to people as flake. | May 05 12:17 |
| oiaohm | Tuna is not the worse it just the most common consumed. | May 05 12:18 |
| schestowitz | sjvn likes KDE again after bashing it and huring many people’s feelings. http://blogs.computerworld.com/kd… | May 05 12:22 |
| schestowitz | Mandriva 2009.1 got very good reviews for its implementation (deployment, whatever) of KDE4 | May 05 12:23 |
| schestowitz | Wikipedians: Please vote (by May 3) < http://www.lessig.org/blog/2009/0… >. No known outcome yet? | May 05 12:24 |
| oiaohm | I guess you have not been eating flake with chips schestowitz | May 05 12:25 |
| schestowitz | “New KDE rocks [...] I was waiting a long time for upgrading from KDE 3.5 and sort of took a leap of faith when I installed Kubuntu 9.04 with the new KDE release. I really like it, last time I tired, somewhere at 4.0.1 (?) my system hang so many times, not to mention problems with the display.” | May 05 12:25 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: no, tuna flakes are goss too | May 05 12:26 |
| oiaohm | Not tuna flakes. | May 05 12:26 |
| schestowitz | The cheaper type is darker and contains all sorts of argans you can’t recognise in flake form. | May 05 12:26 |
| schestowitz | It’s worst when the product is not even consistent or homogenous. | May 05 12:26 |
| oiaohm | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fla… Ok opps | May 05 12:27 |
| oiaohm | It an Australian only term. | May 05 12:27 |
| schestowitz | Anti-Linux Turfers raid SJVN’s blog as well | May 05 12:27 |
| schestowitz | Oh | May 05 12:27 |
| oiaohm | People will not normally eat shark here rename it flake and they eat it by the ton. | May 05 12:27 |
| schestowitz | Flake here would be Cornflakes{Tm} | May 05 12:27 |
| schestowitz | Made nearby in Trafford | May 05 12:27 |
| oiaohm | So when you buy fish and chips over there what is shark called? | May 05 12:28 |
| schestowitz | SpringSource Acquires Hyperic. The newest open source powerhouse? < http://www.internetnews.com/dev-news/a… > Seems benign. | May 05 12:29 |
| schestowitz | The fish is usually kipper AFAIK | May 05 12:29 |
| schestowitz | Can be cod too | May 05 12:29 |
| schestowitz | I have like 20 tins of pilchards at my house ATM | May 05 12:30 |
| schestowitz | Fish and chips are probably at risk due to multinationals like Burger Kind and Subway | May 05 12:31 |
| schestowitz | *King | May 05 12:31 |
| schestowitz | More ways to gain access to systems you have physical access to < http://www.handlewithlinux.com/More-ways-to-… > | May 05 12:31 |
| oiaohm | Fish and chips and conner store made works buggers are still popular here. | May 05 12:31 |
| schestowitz | http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story… “Linux taking over the world ( May 5, 2009, 04:19:51 ) I think it will happen with Linux users competing against other Linux users: Everyone wants their distro to win out — and you can do something about it! “ | May 05 12:32 |
| schestowitz | AU must be more fishing-oriented than most countries | May 05 12:32 |
| schestowitz | I reckon the seas north of AU are filled with Asian fishermen | May 05 12:32 |
| *mib_ja3cq6 is now known as Ap0G33 | May 05 12:33 | |
| *Ap0G33 (i=c910e07d@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-1cf2ca3a079007e5) has left #boycottnovell | May 05 12:33 | |
| schestowitz | “I now have an excellent reason for wanting to move to KDE4 and I am sure it will happen. Honey catches more flies than vinegar. ” http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story… | May 05 12:34 |
| oiaohm | Hmm I cannot find a true australian works burger instructions on line yet. So far they are all missing beetroot. | May 05 12:36 |
| schestowitz | “Joe Wilcox, formerly of Microsoft Watch, is back to blogging at joewilcox.com, with posts on his daughter’s switch from Mac to PC, and Microsoft’s latest Laptop Hunter ad. See his introductory post here.” | May 05 12:37 |
| schestowitz | I suppose you know who he is | May 05 12:37 |
| schestowitz | Advertisement for the Vole? | May 05 12:37 |
| schestowitz | http://www.joewilcox.com/2009/05… | May 05 12:37 |
| oiaohm | http://www.grouprecipes.com/131/… That is basically a Aus works bugger stupid enough you buy them cheaper than big macs yet they are bigger. | May 05 12:38 |
| oiaohm | This is the problem our corner stores steped up to the competition. | May 05 12:38 |
| schestowitz | Linux is DOOMED. Vista 7 has this new ‘feature’: http://www.techflash.com/microsoft/Windo… | May 05 12:38 |
| MinceR | oh noes | May 05 12:40 |
| MinceR | i just hope the EULA allows us to use those new wallpapers in other OS-es! | May 05 12:40 |
| *MinceR runs to get a license | May 05 12:40 | |
| oiaohm | High grade works buggers use stakes instead of mince. Some strange works buggers use kangaroo. So yes when ordering a work bugger pays to check what you are getting first. | May 05 12:40 |
| oiaohm | New wallpapers so what. | May 05 12:41 |
| *MinceR was being sarcastic | May 05 12:41 | |
| oiaohm | KDE and Gnome are both planing some new ones before end of year. | May 05 12:42 |
| MinceR | kde-look.org, gnome-look.org, deviantart, digitalblasphemy and dozens of other sites have more than one could choose from. :> | May 05 12:43 |
| oiaohm | Wonder if KDE will get the intergrated social desktop out before windows 7 gets released. | May 05 12:44 |
| MinceR | mincer@stormwind(pts/4) % du -sh m/pix/wallpaper.scale | May 05 12:44 |
| MinceR | 449Mm/pix/wallpaper.scale | May 05 12:44 |
| schestowitz | http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_stor… “I firmly believe those numbers of “finally reaching 1% desktop market share” is a vast under reporting of the true Linux desktop market share. As other have pointed out the place reporting these numbers is a company firmly entrenched in Microsoft’s back pocket.” | May 05 12:45 |
| schestowitz | └─(12:46 $)─> du -sh ~/Main/Graphics/Wallpapers/ | May 05 12:46 |
| schestowitz | 549M /home/roy/Main/Graphics/Wallpapers/ | May 05 12:46 |
| oiaohm | After what that windows guy calls the best somehow I don’t want to see the worst in the new Windows backgrounds. | May 05 12:46 |
| schestowitz | On shuffle in KDE BTW | May 05 12:47 |
| oiaohm | schestowitz: what is the most popular fast food over there. | May 05 12:47 |
| schestowitz | In KDE 3.1 I kept different wallpapers in each desktop (quad-head wallpapers) | May 05 12:47 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: I think curry | May 05 12:47 |
| oiaohm | Here its a pie. | May 05 12:48 |
| schestowitz | If that can count as fast food | May 05 12:48 |
| schestowitz | More of a restaurant dish that beats all | May 05 12:48 |
| schestowitz | Does chewing gum count as fast ‘food’? | May 05 12:48 |
| oiaohm | I have no a single curry place inside 200 kms of where I am. | May 05 12:48 |
| oiaohm | No chewing cum does not count. | May 05 12:48 |
| schestowitz | Chewing gum is culinary masturbation. | May 05 12:49 |
| schestowitz | Can a person live just on chewing gums? For how long? | May 05 12:49 |
| oiaohm | Not too long. | May 05 12:49 |
| schestowitz | That right there is an interesting experiment. | May 05 12:49 |
| oiaohm | there is almost no food value to it. | May 05 12:49 |
| schestowitz | Sugar | May 05 12:49 |
| schestowitz | Not enough to build cell thoug | May 05 12:50 |
| oiaohm | Sugar you burn off more doing the chewing to get it. | May 05 12:50 |
| oiaohm | Thinking about it there is most likely no food value at all. | May 05 12:51 |
| oiaohm | its most likely a negitive food. | May 05 12:51 |
| schestowitz | Sauerbraten 2009 is released (free download, GNU/Linux included of course): http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?p… | May 05 12:51 |
| oiaohm | Unless you eat it whole and risk screwing up the works. | May 05 12:51 |
| schestowitz | Does it contain real sugars? | May 05 12:52 |
| schestowitz | Other than acids and stuff that’s probably poisonous at moderate levels? | May 05 12:52 |
| schestowitz | http://en.wikipedia.org/… | May 05 12:53 |
| schestowitz | “Chewing gum is a type of confection traditionally made of chicle, a natural latex product, or synthetic rubber known as polyisobutylene, which is a non-vulcanisable form of the butyl rubber (isoprene-isobutylene) used for inner tubes or to line tubeless tyres.” | May 05 12:53 |
| schestowitz | HHHHHHHHHHHHHmmmmmmm………. sounds juicy, donnit? | May 05 12:53 |
| schestowitz | Rubber… latex…. tyres | May 05 12:53 |
| *schestowitz drools | May 05 12:54 | |
| schestowitz | Snake oilware: AVG Ventures Into Linux Malware Protection < http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?p… > | May 05 12:55 |
| oiaohm | Yep schestowitz and people chew gum say for some reason they will not chew inner tubes. | May 05 12:56 |
| schestowitz | LOL -> New in YouTube: “I novell i made to the song moonlight shadow” http://www.youtube.com/wat… | May 05 12:58 |
| oiaohm | schestowitz: it shows that Linux has a enough market share that anti-virus companies are getting worried. | May 05 12:58 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, but who knows how much… | May 05 12:58 |
| schestowitz | The press is dying. | May 05 12:59 |
| schestowitz | You know what this means? | May 05 12:59 |
| schestowitz | Many Linux migrations we’ll never hear about | May 05 12:59 |
| schestowitz | No reporting | May 05 12:59 |
| schestowitz | Well, at least a year late we found out in the English press about 100,000+ cops in France running Linux | May 05 12:59 |
| oiaohm | Look at the loss of blood. | May 05 12:59 |
| schestowitz | It came from OSOR (open source observatory) research | May 05 13:00 |
| oiaohm | In computer world its heavly focused around MS supporters. | May 05 13:00 |
| schestowitz | Let’s see if layoffs are announced today | May 05 13:00 |
| oiaohm | Most Linux media is business as normal. | May 05 13:00 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: it’s focused like this because it’s MANNED like this | May 05 13:00 |
| schestowitz | Your staff is your bias | May 05 13:00 |
| oiaohm | lwn is not going anywhere. There subscriptions are up of all things. | May 05 13:01 |
| oiaohm | This down turn is being strange. Linux stuff is mostly going the other way to the trend. | May 05 13:02 |
| oiaohm | Its more like a model failing. | May 05 13:02 |
| schestowitz | Yes | May 05 13:04 |
| schestowitz | See the Linux Foundation | May 05 13:04 |
| schestowitz | ..Post about it | May 05 13:04 |
| schestowitz | Let me find it | May 05 13:05 |
| schestowitz | http://linux-foundation.org/weblogs/ang… | May 05 13:05 |
| schestowitz | “The 3rd Annual Linux Foundation Collaboration Summit, held this April 8-10 in San Francisco, left me surprised and in high spirits. Why you ask?” | May 05 13:05 |
| schestowitz | “Because although I am fully aware that the downturn the economy has taken is affecting both individuals and businesses alike across the board, it didn’t seem to have this effect on the summit this year – not in a lack of attendees, enthusiasm among the participants or spirit of the collaboration.” | May 05 13:05 |
| oiaohm | Media firms have to make a profit. Its like pc mags here found if a cover cd don’t have a copy of Linux you can basically cut you sales in half. | May 05 13:07 |
| *kentma1 (n=user@host86-154-251-35.range86-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #boycottnovell | May 05 13:07 | |
| schestowitz | UK Gov’t Considers Google Tax? http://techdirt.com/articles/2… See my argument with a PAID anti-Google shill: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/04/… | May 05 13:08 |
| *mib_fobnbl (i=c0a314e8@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-702723b3548cc25a) has joined #boycottnovell | May 05 13:09 | |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, Linux ISOs are cheap | May 05 13:09 |
| schestowitz | In Germany they attach a copy of Ubuntu of OpenSUSE | May 05 13:09 |
| schestowitz | Buy some paper, get some more plastic | May 05 13:09 |
| schestowitz | Holy FUD! The Mother Of All Anti-Google Rants: Comparing Google To The Taliban < http://techdirt.com/articles/2009… > | May 05 13:11 |
| oiaohm | You will find its a web in the PR world to hide exactly where the money came from. | May 05 13:13 |
| schestowitz | zoobab01: you have GOT to read this: http://techdirt.com/articles/20… ACK? | May 05 13:13 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, there’s a limit to how much you can follow | May 05 13:13 |
| schestowitz | It becomes challenging at some stage | May 05 13:14 |
| schestowitz | See SCO->BayStar->MS | May 05 13:14 |
| schestowitz | “On the same day that CA blasted SCO, Open Source evangelist Eric Raymond revealed a leaked email from SCO’s strategic consultant Mike Anderer to their management. The email details how, surprise surprise, Microsoft has arranged virtually all of SCO’s financing, hiding behind intermediaries like Baystar Capital.” –Perens | May 05 13:14 |
| schestowitz | “…Microsoft wished to promote SCO and its pending lawsuit against IBM and the Linux operating system. But Microsoft did not want to be seen as attacking IBM or Linux.” –Larry Goldfarb, Baystar, key investor in SCO | May 05 13:14 |
| schestowitz | “[Microsoft's] Mr. Emerson and I discussed a variety of investment structures wherein Microsoft would ‘backstop,’ or guarantee in some way, BayStar’s investment…. Microsoft assured me that it would in some way guarantee BayStar’s investment in SCO.” –Larry Goldfarb | May 05 13:14 |
| oiaohm | Hmm that template looks strangely linked at www.rosefdn.org going to check out domian would not be supprised if it not another grassroots site. | May 05 13:15 |
| schestowitz | http://techdirt.com/articles/20… — Intel’s co-founder says patents are like a bubble waiting to burst. | May 05 13:16 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: which one? | May 05 13:17 |
| schestowitz | I mean, which is like the rosenfdn? | May 05 13:17 |
| schestowitz | SourceWatch has some good research that show who created what umbrella/shells and why | May 05 13:17 |
| schestowitz | More details on Elsevier’s corruption. http://techdirt.com/articles/2… Another reason for me never to publish in Elsevier (other than the MS connection) | May 05 13:18 |
| zoobab01 | schestowitz: read the Digimaj feed | May 05 13:20 |
| oiaohm | http://electricembers.net/aboutus.php I wonder if we should contact www.rosefdn.org host. | May 05 13:20 |
| schestowitz | zoobab01: I don’t read it fast enough | May 05 13:20 |
| oiaohm | They have a strict rule against advertisement of any form. | May 05 13:20 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: what about? | May 05 13:21 |
| schestowitz | I don’t quite follow. What to look at..? | May 05 13:21 |
| oiaohm | electricembers.net is www.rosefdn.org web host. | May 05 13:22 |
| *kentma has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) | May 05 13:22 | |
| schestowitz | it took the Bulldogs (Watchdog) just HOURS to mail me after I posted in BN | May 05 13:23 |
| schestowitz | So they stalk their own image | May 05 13:23 |
| schestowitz | And then they try to police it… | May 05 13:23 |
| oiaohm | Opp I left out a them and about. | May 05 13:23 |
| schestowitz | It’s not easy to find me E-mail addy, either. | May 05 13:23 |
| schestowitz | is rosenfdn rotten? | May 05 13:23 |
| schestowitz | All we know is that they make donations to attack Google | May 05 13:23 |
| schestowitz | But the question is, on whose behalf, if anyone? | May 05 13:24 |
| schestowitz | People don’t just attack Google as a hobyy | May 05 13:24 |
| schestowitz | That’s just how people portray themselves in foundationa | May 05 13:24 |
| oiaohm | http://techdirt.com/articles/… Its simple to find the hosts email address. | May 05 13:24 |
| schestowitz | Like the Gates Foundry | May 05 13:24 |
| schestowitz | Or Baystar | May 05 13:24 |
| oiaohm | Opps wrong link. | May 05 13:24 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft’s funnel for lawsuits against Linux | May 05 13:24 |
| schestowitz | Oh wait | May 05 13:24 |
| oiaohm | http://toolbar.netcraft.com/s… | May 05 13:24 |
| schestowitz | http://blogs.ft.com/maverecon/2… | May 05 13:25 |
| schestowitz | Google=Taliban | May 05 13:25 |
| schestowitz | Says the FT, which is praiising Microsoft a lot | May 05 13:26 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: is there anything to say what rosenfdn attacks Google? | May 05 13:26 |
| schestowitz | I look at their pages | May 05 13:26 |
| schestowitz | NOTHING about privacy | May 05 13:26 |
| schestowitz | So the idea that they promote privacy seems moot | May 05 13:26 |
| oiaohm | rosenfdn is all ment to be about the envorment. | May 05 13:27 |
| oiaohm | I think contacting them is required to find out if this is a fake link. | May 05 13:27 |
| oiaohm | It would not be the first time I have see a PR try that. | May 05 13:28 |
| oiaohm | http://www.rosefdn.org/contactus.php If they are not in it they will be highly offended. | May 05 13:28 |
| schestowitz | tacone: http://techdirt.com/articles… (Italy’s Troubling View Of The Internet) | May 05 13:29 |
| oiaohm | Fake linking basically says astroturfer. | May 05 13:29 |
| schestowitz | I’ll check | May 05 13:29 |
| oiaohm | http://www.rosefdn.org/downloads… They are the funding source. | May 05 13:32 |
| schestowitz | My name is Roy Schestowitz and I am a reporter investigating an entity called Consumer Watchdog. They claim that you funded a campaign of theirs against Google and I just wanted to confirm this because I realise that you focus on benefits to the environment and communities. | May 05 13:32 |
| schestowitz | Looking forward to your response. | May 05 13:32 |
| oiaohm | Its down right huge $100 000 USD> | May 05 13:32 |
| schestowitz | That’s the E-mail I just sent them | May 05 13:32 |
| oiaohm | I googled. | May 05 13:32 |
| oiaohm | And found there list of 2008 grants. | May 05 13:32 |
| schestowitz | Useful | May 05 13:33 |
| tacone | normal stuff | May 05 13:33 |
| schestowitz | Ha | May 05 13:33 |
| schestowitz | Google is there | May 05 13:33 |
| schestowitz | $100,000 | May 05 13:33 |
| tacone | we’re getting used to them trying all the time and never obtaining anything. | May 05 13:33 |
| schestowitz | “watchdogged | May 05 13:34 |
| tacone | german raises many more concerns to me | May 05 13:34 |
| schestowitz | This is sick | May 05 13:35 |
| schestowitz | They are basically funding lots of lobbyists | May 05 13:35 |
| schestowitz | Why? | May 05 13:35 |
| schestowitz | Who gains? | May 05 13:35 |
| oiaohm | So you are right the first one is just a highered gun. | May 05 13:36 |
| schestowitz | tacone: begs for civil disobedience | May 05 13:36 |
| oiaohm | Why are lobbyist funding lobbyist. | May 05 13:36 |
| tacone | what ? | May 05 13:36 |
| schestowitz | The government is all cool with Freedom, as long as people below it are powerless | May 05 13:36 |
| tacone | governments never push far enough to trigger civil disobbedience | May 05 13:37 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: money chain | May 05 13:37 |
| tacone | they let everyone to be out-law | May 05 13:37 |
| tacone | so from time to time they can pick and jail the people they want in jail. | May 05 13:37 |
| schestowitz | Yes | May 05 13:37 |
| schestowitz | Same in Russia with s/w | May 05 13:38 |
| tacone | it already happens here. | May 05 13:38 |
| schestowitz | They jail the troublemaking journalists | May 05 13:38 |
| tacone | right. | May 05 13:38 |
| schestowitz | For ‘pirating’ something (everyone does) | May 05 13:38 |
| tacone | gonna go now. later. | May 05 13:38 |
| schestowitz | Copyurights are anothe goodie | May 05 13:38 |
| schestowitz | Even Sarko was cauhtt and fined | May 05 13:38 |
| schestowitz | I guess you should also jail those babysitting kids who don’t pay tax for watching the neighbours’s baby | May 05 13:38 |
| iwmw | everybody should be put to jail and work for free there | May 05 13:39 |
| oiaohm | http://www.rosefdn.org/article.php?… Found more of the monay chain. | May 05 13:40 |
| schestowitz | Ha. | May 05 13:41 |
| schestowitz | Well, yesterday I tried to find an MS funnel without much success | May 05 13:41 |
| schestowitz | “San Francisco Bay-Delta Fund: Originally seeded with a $900,000 restitution award from Exxon and supplemented by payments from many additional settlements involving San Francisco Baykeeper, California Sportfishing Protection Alliance,” | May 05 13:42 |
| schestowitz | Wha wha? | May 05 13:42 |
| schestowitz | Exxon? | May 05 13:42 |
| schestowitz | “…Union Bank and Cal Fed Bank…” | May 05 13:43 |
| schestowitz | So it’s not some God-like rich dude giving this money | May 05 13:43 |
| schestowitz | It’s corporations | May 05 13:43 |
| schestowitz | Instead of Exxon funding Grassroots.com (AstroTurf) it’s just some <X> foundation | May 05 13:43 |
| oiaohm | And the banks were most likely given the money to give to the PR group. | May 05 13:44 |
| schestowitz | http://www.rosefdn.org/article… | May 05 13:44 |
| oiaohm | So effectively the money has been well and truly washed. | May 05 13:45 |
| schestowitz | Banks given by whom? | May 05 13:45 |
| schestowitz | Companies that have vested interests? | May 05 13:45 |
| oiaohm | Yep. | May 05 13:45 |
| oiaohm | That would be normal. | May 05 13:45 |
| schestowitz | Some funds come from settlements though | May 05 13:46 |
| schestowitz | I.e. from penalised companies | May 05 13:46 |
| oiaohm | This money laundering on a grand scale. | May 05 13:47 |
| oiaohm | You get ordered to pay money so you pay it to a PR group who will attack your competition. | May 05 13:47 |
| oiaohm | If you can of course. | May 05 13:48 |
| oiaohm | So unless they come clean about the complete source of this money we cannot even tell if what they are doing is legal or not. | May 05 13:48 |
| oiaohm | Remember I said the USA system was rotten to the core this is what I was talking about schestowitz. | May 05 13:49 |
| schestowitz | I know about the PR riddle | May 05 13:49 |
| schestowitz | I mean, look at SourceWatch | May 05 13:49 |
| schestowitz | it has extensive documentation of just the edge of the machinations of this system | May 05 13:49 |
| oiaohm | Dig deep enough and there is illegally used money. | May 05 13:49 |
| schestowitz | It had no page that I could find about the Rosefdn | May 05 13:50 |
| schestowitz | Sue | May 05 13:50 |
| schestowitz | Sure | May 05 13:50 |
| schestowitz | Let’s stop it there | May 05 13:50 |
| oiaohm | SourceWatch does not track funders. | May 05 13:50 |
| schestowitz | I’ll post this bit of of the log separately | May 05 13:50 |
| oiaohm | Only the PR doers. | May 05 13:50 |
| schestowitz | I don’t have much time today to organise the facts | May 05 13:50 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes | May 05 13:50 |
| *schestowitz processes the log | May 05 13:52 | |
| oiaohm | SourceWatch was more created by press people who did not want to be tricked by PR with no interest in finding the source of the fake PR. | May 05 13:52 |
| kentma1 | oiaohm: it’s a good idea. It’s a shame the BBC don’t check this before publishing industry-funded “opinion pieces” on global warming… | May 05 13:54 |
| oiaohm | Without tracing to source you cannot shame companies into not putting up PR that can trick you kentma1. | May 05 13:55 |
| oiaohm | SourceWatch is more a bandaid over a massively deep and bleeding cut. | May 05 13:56 |
| kentma1 | indeed. Interestingly, I don’t think I really understood just how manipulated the news is until we got global television and the net. | May 05 13:57 |
| kentma1 | Shortwave radio was quite good, but in the end, it was mostly controlled by governments, so the “positions” were very overt. | May 05 13:58 |
| kentma1 | being able to watch television news from around the world is amazing, though – just to see the different spin. | May 05 13:58 |
| kentma1 | The internet, though, has created a situation where anyone and everyone can publish. | May 05 13:59 |
| kentma1 | Just like the GPL has borne a software mountain that no proprietary company can manipulate in any significant way, so, I think, the internet might do the same with “information”. | May 05 14:00 |
Victor Soliz said,
May 7, 2009 at 9:19 am
Really Roy, I would love to see these logs posted in links that point outside the home page. It is VERY hard to read the articles from a RSS reader with these huge chat logs taking the space, and the home page suffers the same issue. You don’t really expect us to read them, right? They are just a record for later reference…
Roy Schestowitz Reply:
May 7th, 2009 at 11:00 am
I thought of ways to work it out several times and couldn’t think of a flawless way, but I think I have an idea. I’ll try something different tomorrow. Let me know what you think of it.