●● IRC: #boycottnovell @ Techrights IRC Network: Thursday, December 02, 2021 ●● ● Dec 02 [00:18] *altlink_cc9 has quit (connection closed) [00:18] *altlink_c63 (~altlink_c63@2f7u5j6f87p9g.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [00:24] schestowitz https://soylentnews.org/article.pl?sid=21/11/29/1457249 [00:24] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-soylentnews.org | Why We Can't Teach Cybersecurity - SoylentNews [00:24] schestowitz It's not a mystery. Just ask teachers what works. Stop all the top down initiatives and paradigms. For some reason, every bozo in charge seems to want to revolutionize the education system. Go away, you're making it worse. [00:24] schestowitz Reply to This [00:24] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 0, Troll) [00:24] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Monday November 29, @07:02PM (#1200630) [00:24] schestowitz Yeah, lets trust the same people that are trying to teach that women are men and men are women and that every white child is a racist. Trusting teachers? I'm struggling to guess whether you intended a /s tag. [00:24] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:24] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 0, Troll) [00:24] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Monday November 29, @08:06PM (#1200661) [00:24] schestowitz Found the home-schooled one. Let me guess... 8hr bible studies today? [00:24] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:24] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 2, Touch) [00:24] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Monday November 29, @08:15PM (#1200664) [00:24] schestowitz Not every white child. Just the ones like you. [00:24] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:24] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 0) [00:24] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 01, @02:16PM (#1201139) [00:24] schestowitz This one made me smile [00:24] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:24] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: -1, Troll) [00:24] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 30, @12:42AM (#1200750) [00:24] schestowitz Found the incel! Whattup loser? [00:24] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:24] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 4, Insightful) [00:24] schestowitz by MostCynical (2589) on Monday November 29, @08:44PM (#1200685) Journal [00:24] schestowitz this is actually... not going to work [00:24] schestowitz ask Doctors? Simple EMR with no passwords (no time to fill in a user name and password!! just fill in a prescription stat!) [00:25] schestowitz ask Teachers? [00:25] schestowitz If they work in a school with students from wealthy families, technology requests will sound something like "I need a whiteboard I can print and share and ipads that have the same screen display as the white board, plus notes and students can submit work and get feedback..." [00:25] schestowitz If they come from a school with students from poor families, it will be more like "more student meals and free shoes" [00:25] schestowitz Field experts are rarely able to explain their technology needs .. or even think of the 'what ifs'... Tech companies find a product, then look to sell/force it on customers. [00:25] schestowitz Will it be the RIGHT solution? Very unlikely. Is it easy to use (NOTE: this means "no harder than any other [BIGNAME] product", not actually, easy) [00:25] schestowitz Does [LARGECOMPANY] care? No, sales and control of market and monopolization of the 'horizontals' and the 'verticals' is what [LARGECOMPANY] wants. [00:25] schestowitz -- [00:25] schestowitz "I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex [00:25] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:25] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 0) [00:25] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Monday November 29, @09:12PM (#1200696) [00:25] schestowitz Golly, you sound most cynical. [00:25] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:25] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 5, Insightful) [00:25] schestowitz by MostCynical (2589) on Monday November 29, @10:25PM (#1200717) Journal [00:25] schestowitz Cynicism is just what happens when idealism gets some work and life experience. Still an optimist - but I also have ended up with a career interpreting vague 'wants and needs' into buildable requirements (which developers then misinterpret, thereby ensuring I have more work, 'fixing' implementations) [00:25] schestowitz Users may have a fantastic idea of what they need - but they suck at explaining it. [00:25] schestowitz "Tech people" don't listen. They have a way of working, and they know best - if anyone has seen the promotion process in IT, ego and self-promotion get you to the top - completely separate to any contribution or actual success. [00:25] schestowitz These issues are key contributors causing so many projects to fail (completely, or partially) in achieving the original objectives.. (lack of resourcing (people and money) is the other big cause of failures) [00:25] schestowitz I am a cynic - also known as a realist. [00:25] schestowitz -- [00:25] schestowitz "I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex [00:25] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:25] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 2) [00:25] schestowitz by Mojibake Tengu (8598) on Tuesday November 30, @08:48PM (#1200975) Journal [00:25] schestowitz Seriously, correct orthodox abbreviation is G.I.T.S., not just GIS. Also, S.A.C. is more common than SAC in this context. [00:25] schestowitz Consider me stickler but once I deeply offended and completely lost an otaku friend because I wrote FF7 instead of (correct form) FFVII. [00:25] schestowitz Cynically yours, [00:25] schestowitz ... [00:25] schestowitz -- [00:25] schestowitz The edge of cannot be defined, for it is beyond every aspect of design [00:25] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:25] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 2) [00:25] schestowitz by MostCynical (2589) on Tuesday November 30, @11:29PM (#1201024) Journal [00:25] schestowitz blame the character limit. [00:25] schestowitz -- [00:25] schestowitz "I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex [00:25] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:25] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 3, Interesting) [00:25] schestowitz by krishnoid (1156) on Monday November 29, @11:15PM (#1200732) [00:26] schestowitz Not to disrespect your cynicism, but they have the cheap shoes [youtu.be] angle covered. [00:26] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:26] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: -1, Flamebait) [00:26] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Monday November 29, @11:51PM (#1200738) [00:26] schestowitz It's not a mystery. Just ask teachers what works. Stop all the top down initiatives and paradigms. For some reason, every bozo in charge seems to want to revolutionize the education system. Go away, you're making it worse. [00:26] schestowitz One of the problems with that idea is that many times teachers don't know what works and what doesn't. If they've been in the field at all, they aren't in it now and have been left behind. I would sooner trust an evening school professor who actually works in the field during the day than an ivory tower professor who's just looking to publish his next paper. [00:26] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:26] schestowitz Re:Ask teachers (Score: 2) [00:26] schestowitz by driverless (4770) on Tuesday November 30, @06:44AM (#1200800) [00:26] schestowitz As a "proof" after a fashion, my students use a combination of Blotto analysis [00:26] schestowitz Yeah, we did a lot of that as students too. Problem is that most of the analysis we did while blotto didn't look so good any more once we'd sobered up again. [00:26] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:26] schestowitz being about power and alliances (Score: 1) [00:26] schestowitz by fustakrakich (6150) on Monday November 29, @07:25PM (#1200640) Journal [00:26] schestowitz So, it's just like every other human endeavor, something quite fundamental, universal even. Are we surprised? [00:26] schestowitz -- [00:26] schestowitz Ok, we paid the ransom. Do I get my dog back? REDUM [00:26] schestowitz Reply to This [00:26] schestowitz There's a balance to strike... (Score: 5, Interesting) [00:26] schestowitz by JoeMerchant (3937) on Monday November 29, @10:16PM (#1200716) [00:26] schestowitz It is left to well educated individuals to opt-out, reject their systems, and insist on secure, interoperable choices. [00:26] schestowitz Well educated how? In technical matters of cybersecurity? Or in business matters of compatibility, mutual benefit - you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours? [00:26] schestowitz Guess which one ends up in charge? [00:26] schestowitz Better to ask forgiveness than permission is a common catch phrase. In this instance, it is better to do a deal with an insecure system and patch it later than to do no deal at all. [00:26] schestowitz It's really going to take the big boys getting burned badly enough for them to insist on security from all their underlings in a meaningful fashion, not just a lipservice policy to enable them to qualify for the next big bid. [00:26] schestowitz -- [00:26] schestowitz John Galt is a selfish crybaby [huffpost.com]. [00:26] schestowitz Reply to This [00:26] schestowitz Re:There's a balance to strike... (Score: 2) [00:26] schestowitz by MostCynical (2589) on Monday November 29, @10:58PM (#1200727) Journal [00:26] schestowitz "educated" people (scientists, engineers, doctors, teachers?) are also busy people. [00:26] schestowitz busy people don't have time to care about this stuff - they just need to get on, doing a job, raising children, doing tax returns, etc etc. [00:26] schestowitz Banks and others use 2FA, so they can show the compliance people they are "taking security seriously" (tick) and "doing something(TM) about security" (tick) [00:26] schestowitz Anything that gets in the way of doing a task is annoying. People will circumvent and shorten any process or procedure, just to get things done - even if it opens their organization to huge risk. [00:26] schestowitz they can be told about the risk - but they don't care, even when it is explained in clear detail, it doesn't effect them, even if it brings down a whole hospital, school district, or whatever [00:26] schestowitz if it gets in the way of doing the job, it will be bypassed or ignored. User names and passwords on sticky notes is just human nature. [00:26] schestowitz Stopping these behaviours is like "teaching" people to breath methane.. perfect systems require perfec [00:26] schestowitz -- [00:26] schestowitz "I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex [00:26] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:27] schestowitz Re:There's a balance to strike... (Score: 1) [00:27] schestowitz by crotherm (5427) on Tuesday November 30, @01:22AM (#1200754) [00:27] schestowitz This is why it has to be the responsibility organizations that offer the services to keep things secure. User should not get to decide security policy. Well that's the way it used to be, so long ago, when sysadms were king. :p [00:27] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:27] schestowitz Re:There's a balance to strike... (Score: 4, Insightful) [00:27] schestowitz by JoeMerchant (3937) on Tuesday November 30, @02:24AM (#1200760) [00:27] schestowitz In the end, this is what regulations are all about. [00:27] schestowitz CE mark rolled out design controls in the mid 1990s, FDA followed suit for US medical devices shortly thereafter. They did it because the nature of competitive business is to cut corners, take risks, and if the shit hits the fan: file bankruptcy. Not a great standard for making products that put the consumers at risk of death or serious injury when they fail. [00:27] schestowitz We're getting to the point where insecure networks are literally putting people's lives at risk. I'd like to see industry self-regulate and keep their own house in order without mandatory audits, procedural requirements, etc. but if history is any guide, we can expect those kind of regulations to start affecting large swaths of the internet in a few years. [00:27] schestowitz -- [00:27] schestowitz John Galt is a selfish crybaby [huffpost.com]. [00:27] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:27] schestowitz Re:There's a balance to strike... (Score: 3, Insightful) [00:27] schestowitz by MostCynical (2589) on Tuesday November 30, @04:29AM (#1200781) Journal [00:27] schestowitz one of the fundamental questions that needs to be answered is "why are so many systems accessible on the internet?" [00:27] schestowitz "Convenience"? Not really much of a reason/excuse// [00:27] schestowitz Banks have to provide web pages and apps or lose customers.. [00:27] schestowitz Hospitals? [00:27] schestowitz Medical practices? [00:27] schestowitz Lawyers? [00:27] schestowitz Schools? [00:27] schestowitz A simple web-based client booking system covers most "consumer" interactions for most of these.. [00:27] schestowitz "Cloud" isn't a good enough excuse, either. [00:27] schestowitz -- [00:27] schestowitz "I guess once you start doubting, there's no end to it." -Batou, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex [00:27] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:27] schestowitz Re:There's a balance to strike... (Score: 2) [00:27] schestowitz by JoeMerchant (3937) on Tuesday November 30, @12:54PM (#1200833) [00:27] schestowitz For sure... the first step I take in securing a system is to cut off un-necessary attack surfaces, starting with anything exposed to the open internet. [00:27] schestowitz Thing is, inside a hospital the network is so large and uncontrolled, it's almost as hostile as the open internet. Once you get more than about 5 users on a network, you really need to switch it to zero trust footing because one of them will be bringing in a trojan or virus sooner or later. And hospitals do have legitimate needs to communicate internally among hundreds, sometimes thousands, of users / endpoints. [00:27] schestowitz -- [00:27] schestowitz John Galt is a selfish crybaby [huffpost.com]. [00:27] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:27] schestowitz Re:There's a balance to strike... (Score: 0) [00:27] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 30, @04:20AM (#1200780) [00:27] schestowitz The problem is that there is no accountability. There needs to be accountability. [00:27] schestowitz If a company gives the same password to all of their interns and that company gets hacked and my user data is spread on the Internet the company's negligence is not victimless. They need to be severely fined for being so negligent. The problem is that they don't get fined and the victims don't get adequately compensated. [00:27] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:27] schestowitz money wins. (Score: -1, Offtopic) [00:27] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 30, @01:53PM (#1200846) [00:28] schestowitz good read. [00:28] schestowitz the "computer" is just electronics switching "logic". [00:28] schestowitz humans have nothing to do. a factory that used to employee 100, now employees 10 humans 80 robots and 10 computers. [00:28] schestowitz the way to save this dilemna is to " busy" work the 90 humans with excel, word and ... the internet. [00:28] schestowitz i hope, we can be done with "switching logic" (computing for computing sake) and fight the real war with "switching power and energy" in silly-con ... and evovle to owning and producing our own infinite energy, free from having to be enlisted to fight (and real world die(!) for energy-barons energy wars. [00:28] schestowitz long live the mosfet and h-bridge! [00:28] schestowitz Reply to This [00:28] schestowitz Re:money wins. (Score: 0) [00:28] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 30, @02:17PM (#1200853) [00:28] schestowitz picture like this: [00:28] schestowitz a spherical, huge, gleeming steel reactor with view-ports. [00:28] schestowitz inside you see the wonderous world of "modern computing". rainbow-color flares of twitters and puffy clouds of facebook, with golden rays of emails; complex shapes of theortical models giving rise to other complex, even more complex shapes. [00:28] schestowitz the poetry continues. [00:28] schestowitz you look away at the factory floor you're standing on and see a old, stained cord coming from the reactor that plugs into a rusty 'ol oil drum with a mechanical level gauge. [00:28] schestowitz in the background, people who, once in a while, open the reactor and pluck out people to "go behind the shed" to fetch a new oil drum. [00:28] schestowitz all the while, in orbit, aliens in their sun-glared cockpit are frantically discussing why the tech inside the reactor isn't used to power the reactor itself and why some don't return from behind the shed ... [00:28] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:28] schestowitz Bullshit jobs (Score: 2) [00:28] schestowitz by canopic jug (3949) Subscriber Badge on Tuesday November 30, @02:51PM (#1200862) Journal [00:28] schestowitz the way to save this dilemna is to " busy" work the 90 humans with excel, word and ... the internet. [00:28] schestowitz That was mentioned a little where the article makes reference to "bullshit jobs" [tuxmachines.org] as defined by the late David Graeber. He did some research into the nature and volume of jobs that add no positive worth to society [vox.com], with many actually having a negative net value to society. Things would simply get better if those jobs vanished, with the improvement being substantial for the removal of a subset. [00:28] schestowitz The movement which has replaced ICT with IT is a far cry from creating a bicycle for the mind [youtu.be] as envisioned by the early leaders. The idea was that ICT was a tool to amplify abilities, especially in the realm of intellect. Furthermore, in the early days, computer science was supposed to be for everyone and not about just getting a job [wordpress.com]. Think of the great heights society could reach if all the bullshitters were somehow [00:28] schestowitz converted to activities which provided at least some positive value. For microsofters, though, that contribution might only be through marrow donation followed by rendering for agriculture. [00:28] schestowitz Busywork is only useful for empire builders, and harms society at large. For the same money, those same people could be reassigned to work productively. [00:28] schestowitz -- [00:28] schestowitz Money is not free speech. Elections should not be auctions. [00:28] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:28] schestowitz The Cuckoo's Egg (Score: 0) [00:28] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 30, @03:07PM (#1200866) [00:28] schestowitz This is where I started. Great introduction to Cyber Security. [00:28] schestowitz Reply to This [00:28] schestowitz Re:The Cuckoo's Egg (Score: 0) [00:28] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday November 30, @03:10PM (#1200869) [00:28] schestowitz https://www.crime-research.org/library/grcdos.pdf [crime-research.org] [00:28] -altlink_c63/#boycottnovell- Cloudflare: crime-research.org | Alternative: https://web.archive.org/web/https://www.crime-research.org/library/grcdos.pdf [00:28] schestowitz All the oldies are goldies. [00:28] schestowitz Reply to This Parent [00:28] schestowitz Real world (Score: 0) [00:28] schestowitz by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday December 01, @06:04PM (#1201203) [00:28] schestowitz Let me tell you about the real world. In the real world for most people it doesn't really matter as much as the cybersecurity scaremongers make out. [00:28] schestowitz 1) Keep backups [00:29] schestowitz 2) Keep more backups elsewhere [00:29] schestowitz 3) Nobody gives a damn about most people's secrets especially the secrets of people who can't learn cybersecurity. [00:29] schestowitz If cybersecurity matters to you, you learn it. [00:29] schestowitz On a related note - for decades credit card payments have worked just by knowing the number. Yeah there was some fraud but in the real world big picture it didn't matter. [00:29] schestowitz ----------- [00:29] schestowitz backup ends [00:29] schestowitz -------- Forwarded Message -------- [00:29] schestowitz Subject: Re: Fwd: Tux machines [00:29] schestowitz Date: xxxxxxxx [00:29] schestowitz From: xxxxxxx [00:29] schestowitz Sorry for the delay, and the overly long response. xxxxxxx, except for nudging the one script. [00:29] schestowitz Very well written. On the assertion that M$ has held back computing 20 [00:29] schestowitz years, I'd say it's important to prepend the phrase "at least" to that. [00:29] schestowitz I usually say 40 or so nowadays. I has not only been held back or [00:29] schestowitz stagnated since M$ became increased its interference in the 1990s, but [00:29] schestowitz also computing in general has actually been set back in many areas. [1] [00:29] schestowitz It's hard to convince people of that though since they been told for [00:29] schestowitz years, for some since they started with computers, that the sun shines [00:29] schestowitz out of Bill's every orifice. So good footnotes or endnotes on that are [00:29] schestowitz important. [00:29] schestowitz As M$, and Google, insinuate their proprietary products and services [00:29] schestowitz into education and health care, the case for not just open standards but [00:29] schestowitz also Open Source (or even FOSS) becomes stronger. RMS and David A [00:29] schestowitz Wheeler, among others, have written why FOSS and Open Standards are [00:29] schestowitz essential components of education. Around here, sadly, M$ resellers [00:29] schestowitz have replaced the IT departments and maneuvered into a position where [00:29] schestowitz they determine to a certain extent the curriculum and syllabi, not just [00:29] schestowitz the teaching methods. Some tried to push back 10 years ago, but ended [00:29] schestowitz up in Google's mire, instead of breaking free of proprietary. On the [00:29] schestowitz other side of the pond, several higher institutions had fallen during [00:29] schestowitz the same time period from self-hosting to Google. That was a [00:29] schestowitz compromise, since they had been infiltrated by microsofters and they [00:29] schestowitz were presented with the sole choice of Google or M$. [00:29] schestowitz As for the suitcase data centers, yes! xxxxxxxxxxxx was before the Raspberry [00:29] schestowitz Pi so xxxxxxx usually had to carry not just a brief case but a large back pack [00:29] schestowitz with 20+ kg of equipment and cabling and a 3G modem. xxxxxxx could, and did [00:29] schestowitz many times, set up a lab Archibald Tuttle style anywhere within 5 to 10 [00:29] schestowitz minutes. Sometimes set up a subset during train commutes. [00:30] schestowitz Don't let M$ steal or disparage a nationality. M$ is not a US [00:30] schestowitz corporation, or it is not in any sense of the phrase as used when I was [00:30] schestowitz younger: If I understand correctly, the HQ and money are overseas. [00:30] schestowitz Check with EDGAR to be sure: [00:30] schestowitz https://www.sec.gov/edgar/browse/?CIK=789019&owner=exclude [00:30] -altlink_c63/#boycottnovell- Cloudflare: sec.gov | Alternative: https://web.archive.org/web/https://www.sec.gov/edgar/browse/?CIK=789019&owner=exclude [00:30] schestowitz And it sure works against US interests to advance its own. However, be [00:30] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.sec.gov | EDGAR Entity Landing Page [00:30] schestowitz that as it may, the US government has become beholden to M$ politics. [00:30] schestowitz Backdoors for everyone! [00:30] schestowitz I think it is important to define "security" early on in any article to [00:30] schestowitz avoid confusion. If one defines "security" to be the combination of [00:30] schestowitz confidentiality, integrity, and availability, then M$ fails at all [00:30] schestowitz three. By using vague and varying language, M$ avoids defining it and [00:30] schestowitz usually means it as job security, as in iron rice bowl, rather than any [00:30] schestowitz of the three aspects they fail at completely. [00:30] schestowitz Another aspect of "security" is safety and fitness for purpose [3], both [00:30] schestowitz of which are where M$ fails yet again. [00:30] schestowitz Again, it was refreshing to read. I look forward to the posts. [00:30] schestowitz /xxxxxxx [00:30] schestowitz [1] There are *many* examples, but one is in the desktop as they use [00:30] schestowitz bitmaps instead of client-server for rendering. [00:30] schestowitz [2] Product liability [00:30] schestowitz Transcript, "Cybersecurity as Realpolitik", Dan Geer, 2014: [00:30] schestowitz http://geer.tinho.net/geer.blackhat.6viii14.txt [00:30] schestowitz Video, "Cybersecurity as Realpolitik", Dan Geer, 2014: [00:30] schestowitz https://youtu.be/nT-TGvYOBpI?t=1530s [00:30] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.youtube.com | Cybersecurity as Realpolitik by Dan Geer presented at Black Hat USA 2014 - YouTube [00:30] schestowitz Article, "The Software Industry IS STILL the Problem: [00:30] schestowitz The time is (also) way overdue for IT professional [00:30] schestowitz liability", Poul-Henning Kamp, 2021: [00:30] schestowitz https://dl.acm.org/doi/10.1145/3487019.3489045 [00:30] -altlink_c63/#boycottnovell- Cloudflare: acm.org | Alternative: https://web.archive.org/web/https://dl.acm.org/doi/10.1145/3487019.3489045 [00:30] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-dl.acm.org | [00:30] schestowitz Article, "The Software Industry IS the Problem: [00:30] schestowitz The time has come for software liability laws.", [00:30] schestowitz Poul-Henning Kamp, 2011 [00:30] schestowitz https://queue.acm.org/detail.cfm?id=2030258 [00:30] -altlink_c63/#boycottnovell- Cloudflare: acm.org | Alternative: https://web.archive.org/web/https://queue.acm.org/detail.cfm?id=2030258 [00:30] schestowitz --- [00:30] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-queue.acm.org | The Software Industry IS the Problem - ACM Queue [00:30] schestowitz PS. Instead of a movie to set the tone, xxxxxxxx used /hnefatafl/ to attempt [00:30] schestowitz the students to think asymmetrically: [00:30] schestowitz https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tafl_games [00:30] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-en.wikipedia.org | Tafl games - Wikipedia [00:30] schestowitz Printed the grid on sheets of A3 and used bags of colored, melted [00:30] schestowitz marbles from a gardens shop for the pieces. xxxxxxxx had intended to use [00:30] schestowitz "Illuminati" for the asymmetry part as it is much more so and [00:31] schestowitz multiplayer to boot: [00:31] schestowitz https://www.sjgames.com/illuminati/ [00:31] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.sjgames.com | Illuminati: The Game of Conspiracy [00:31] schestowitz https://www.news.com.au/technology/home-entertainment/gaming/outofprint-conspiracy-card-game-from-1994-that-predicted-911-sees-renewed-popularity-amid-covid19/news-story/aa7a7e43202fbd12de70f39af14269b9 [00:31] schestowitz It was available in the stores in the US but xxxxxx every move to import it [00:31] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.news.com.au | Illuminati: New World Order card game predicted 9/11, Trump presidency and COVID | news.com.au Australias leading news site [00:31] schestowitz was blocked for about a year until xxxxxxxx was no longer xxxxx. [00:31] schestowitz PPS. xxxxxx got some /business/ students to master the quick sort algorithm [00:31] schestowitz by showing them how to apply it to regular playing cards. No bubble [00:31] schestowitz sort for them, not even once. [00:31] schestowitz Addendum: Please also consider https://publiccode.eu/ in the context of [00:31] schestowitz the mention of RMS and David A Wheeler. [00:31] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-publiccode.eu | Public Money, Public Code [00:31] schestowitz [00:31] schestowitz [00:31] schestowitz The link to publiccode.eu can be moved in the text a little. It covers [00:31] schestowitz topics brought up by DAW and RMS but is itself not their specific words. [00:31] schestowitz https://www.gnu.org/education/edu-schools.en.html [00:31] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.gnu.org | Why Schools Should Exclusively Use Free Software - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation [00:31] schestowitz http://dwheeler.com/oss_fs_why.html [00:31] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-dwheeler.com | Why Open Source Software / Free Software (OSS/FS, FOSS, or FLOSS)? Look at the Numbers! [00:51] *DaemonFC has quit (Quit: Leaving) [00:53] *DaemonFC (~daemonfc@pv67xjyd8dra8.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Dec 02 [01:07] *u-amarsh04 (~amarsh04@t25x9hgy9xhrc.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [01:37] *psydroid2 has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [01:44] *hyperreal has quit (Quit: the lounge - https://webirc.envs.net) [01:55] *hyperreal (~hyperreal@uwig9nz6889zi.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Dec 02 [05:06] *DaemonFC has quit (Quit: Leaving) [05:40] *Despatche has quit (Quit: Read error: Connection reset by deer) ● Dec 02 [08:09] schestowitz-TR The drop-caps need to be in the same paragraph as the rest of the text [08:09] schestowitz-TR they are connected to: [08:09] schestowitz-TR

“T

[08:09] schestowitz-TR

he EPO is wasting money on stock market gambling,” we noted the other day. ... [08:09] schestowitz-TR from http://techrights.org/2021/12/01/self-regulation-epo/ [08:09] schestowitz-TR Having the first letter in a separate paragraph can't really be worked around [08:09] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | EPO Cannot and Will Not Self-Regulate | Techrights [08:09] schestowitz-TR and ends up like this: [08:09] schestowitz-TR gemini://gemini.techrights.org/2021/12/01/self-regulation-epo/ [08:09] schestowitz-TR That throws off screen readers a bit. [08:09] schestowitz-TR (I've since edited the HTML) [08:09] schestowitz-TR https://meduza.io/rss/en/all not available ... [08:09] -altlink_c63/#boycottnovell- Cloudflare: meduza.io | Alternative: https://web.archive.org/web/https://meduza.io/rss/en/all [08:09] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell- ( status 502 @ https://meduza.io/rss/en/all ) [08:09] schestowitz-TR are purge_logs.sh and gemini-main-index-template.sh uptodate in Git? [08:11] schestowitz-TR With the drop cap, I noticed my error when I saw the article later in RSS feeds. Thanks for letting me know you edited it, I assume a very minor edit (wordpress does version control) [08:17] *altlink_c63 has quit (connection closed) [08:17] *altlink_4af (~altlink_4af@2f7u5j6f87p9g.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [08:19] schestowitz-TR those two files are not up to date in git, thanks for reminding me of it. For some files it is typical for the server to be "ahead"... I typically check or diff before changing them [08:22] Techrights-sec2 Yes, it was just to merge the two paragraphs [08:22] Techrights-sec2 I usually go from the basis that Git has the authoritative version, regardless [08:22] Techrights-sec2 of what might be elsewhere. [08:22] schestowitz-TR another factor is, the changes I made were really negligible and would take moments to reproduce [08:23] Techrights-sec2 No need to do them twice though. [08:32] schestowitz added last line: [08:32] schestowitz ====================== [08:32] schestowitz to do when there's a new/next month: [08:32] schestowitz [08:32] schestowitz schestowitz microblog index - create more months (changes to open file inc. top of current open file, namely change month NUMBER and NAME OF MONTH, sometimes YEAR.. at end of December) [08:32] schestowitz template.txt one number/month up! [08:32] schestowitz raspi/gemini: 1) delete old logs (change script purge_logs), 2) change index for bulletins front page (gemini-main-index-template.sh add TWO LINES) and [08:32] schestowitz DEPRECATED (automatic) 3) add older month in '~/gemini/archives' [08:32] schestowitz videos in techrights [08:32] schestowitz change ~/daily-links.sh script (just the month number/year in end of December) [08:32] schestowitz push to git purge_logs, gemini-main-index-template.sh [08:32] schestowitz [08:32] schestowitz ====================== ● Dec 02 [10:35] *psydroid2 (~psydroid@cqggrmwgu7gji.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [10:49] schestowitz-TR nback ~2 hours [10:49] schestowitz-TR back, all good [10:49] Techrights-sec2 wb [10:49] Techrights-sec2 excellent news [10:49] Techrights-sec2 I'm wondering if the Gemini IRC logs can be made to serve as Gemini instead [10:49] Techrights-sec2 of text/plain e.g. [10:49] Techrights-sec2 gemini://gemini.techrights.org/tr_text_version/irc-log-techrights-011221.txt [10:49] Techrights-sec2 to gemini://gemini.techrights.org/tr_text_version/irc-log-techrights-011221.gmi [10:49] Techrights-sec2 instead. It would probably eliminate the need for an external viewer, at least [10:49] Techrights-sec2 in some Gemini clients. [10:51] schestowitz-TR good point [10:51] schestowitz-TR considerations [10:51] schestowitz-TR creating a new set of files can be costly [10:51] schestowitz-TR generating gem on the fly can be hard with agate [10:51] schestowitz-TR there are existing links which go to .txt [10:51] schestowitz-TR I do not know if you can serve a .txt file as gmi but maybe that depends on the client softweare [10:52] Techrights-sec2 same files, perhaps even same inodes (hardlink) but different names there [10:52] Techrights-sec2 I would think it depends more on Agate's abilities [10:52] Techrights-sec2 (Agate needs updating btw) [10:54] schestowitz-TR I am going to test with moonlander, lagrange, and amfora [10:55] Techrights-sec2 Excellent [10:57] *DaemonFC (~daemonfc@7mk5api2hc5bi.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Dec 02 [11:01] schestowitz-TR ok, so it looks like the .txt extension is a problem. both lagrange and amfora don't give a damn about gemtext and interpret it as just normal text [11:04] Techrights-sec2 Which script and which account calls xhtml-log-to-text.pl ? It is [11:04] Techrights-sec2 not used by Gemini, but that's where the workflow can be changed. [11:04] Techrights-sec2 Can Agate be made to provide the rightr MIME type for those directories instead? [11:06] schestowitz-TR th e script runs on my laptop at 2:30am [11:06] schestowitz-TR I know little about agate [11:08] schestowitz-TR I assume you want to convert links in the logs into clickable ones, or use headlines for times, e.g. 11pm [11:17] schestowitz Also available via the Gemini protocol at: [11:17] schestowitz gemini://gemini.techrights.org/tr_text_version/irc-log-techrights-011221.txt [11:17] schestowitz gemini://gemini.techrights.org/tr_text_version/irc-log-011221.txt [11:17] schestowitz gemini://gemini.techrights.org/tr_text_version/irc-log-social-011221.txt [11:17] schestowitz gemini://gemini.techrights.org/tr_text_version/irc-log-techbytes-011221.txt [11:17] schestowitz This could become a second portion, follow up on [11:18] schestowitz same as above, 4 links, with gmi or dir with index.gmi in it [11:18] Techrights-sec2 since they are links, maybe just leave them as is and add a third link [11:18] Techrights-sec2 with the .gmi extension. But which script? [11:18] Techrights-sec2 $ find /home -type f -samefile /home/gemini/gemini/tr_text_version/irc-log-010321.txt -print 2>/dev/null [11:18] Techrights-sec2 /home/gemini/gemini/tr_text_version/irc-log-010321.txt [11:18] Techrights-sec2 /home/glr/tr_text_version/irc-log-010321.txt [11:18] Techrights-sec2 Ok it looks like the script that populates tr_text_version is not on the RPi, [11:18] Techrights-sec2 is that the one you mentioned runs at 02:30 UTC from your machine? [11:20] schestowitz the file which populates this dir is yesterday_irc_log shell script, I think, and is in git [11:21] schestowitz 30 02 * * * /home/roy/yesterday-irc.log.sh > /home/roy/output.txt [11:22] Techrights-sec2 Can you post the 2:30 UTC script? [11:22] Techrights-sec2 Hmm. Not in Git. [11:26] Techrights-sec2 $ find . -type f -name yesterday-irc.log.sh -print | wc -l [11:26] Techrights-sec2 0 [11:26] schestowitz-TR I thought I had added it, but I was wrong [11:30] Techrights-sec2 It could go in the IRC directory within the repository. [11:30] schestowitz-TR I probably added this and others to git before we reset it, let me redact and readd [11:34] Techrights-sec2 thanks [11:36] schestowitz-TR pushed to git, please do not edit as it would risk my nightly workflow breaking or reintegrated into my files wi [11:36] schestowitz-TR thout the redacted bits [11:36] schestowitz-TR I will add the bullein files too, as before, I assume I did it on the old repo [11:41] schestowitz-TR just added text_upload.sh as well. no need to improve it as we would have to test any changes carefully [11:49] Techrights-sec2 If possible it would be useful to add two lines to yesterday-irc.log.sh [11:49] Techrights-sec2 so that it makes the hardlinks, but if that is undesireable, they [11:49] Techrights-sec2 can be made separately as well [11:49] Techrights-sec2 Nevermind. I can guess the redacvted part uploads, links don't upload well [11:49] Techrights-sec2 except with Rsync. [11:49] Techrights-sec2 I'll ift it in under the Gemini script directory [11:57] *DaemonFC has quit (Quit: Leaving) ● Dec 02 [12:13] *tech_exorcist (~tech_exorcist@5c84rj45gkqvi.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [12:36] Techrights-sec2 for some reason the files in ~gemini/gemini/tr_text_version/ are owned by [12:36] Techrights-sec2 glr (1002) [12:36] Techrights-sec2 That blocks creation of hard links by the gemini account. [12:36] Techrights-sec2 Agate does not like soft links [12:37] schestowitz-TR we can alter the nightly job [12:48] Techrights-sec2 s/text/gmi/ [12:48] Techrights-sec2 find/home/gemini/gemini/tr_text_version \ [12:48] Techrights-sec2 -maxdepth 1 -type f -name '*.txt' -printf '%P\n' \ [12:48] Techrights-sec2 | xargs -I {} sh -c 'f={}; test -f ${f%%.txt}.gmi || ln ${f} ${f%%.txt}.gmi' [12:48] schestowitz-TR do you want me to run that? ● Dec 02 [13:04] Techrights-sec2 It would need to be run after / as part of each upload to the tr_text_version [13:04] Techrights-sec2 directory. It has to run from within /home/gemini/gemini/tr_text_version [13:04] schestowitz-TR so you found a way to accomplish it, well done [13:09] Techrights-sec2 np; thought it might not be the most efficient and scalable of all time, [13:09] Techrights-sec2 it shoud do for the foreeable future [13:10] schestowitz-TR yesterday a regular reader over gemini joined IRC, so we know some people frequent the capsule. 1pm, 16.5k reqs so far today [13:11] Techrights-sec2 Awesome. Gemini is really an easier way to read the articles even if the WWW [13:11] Techrights-sec2 interface is more familiar for the time being. [13:11] schestowitz-TR kate is also good for reading news ;-) ● Dec 02 [14:09] schestowitz "There are 1840 capsules. We successfully connected recently to 1495 of them." [14:09] schestowitz we're still at the top of the list [14:09] schestowitz gemini://gemini.techrights.org/tester.txt is where I tested to see how clients handle gemtext with txt extension [14:21] *activelow has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [14:25] schestowitz-TR GFAMA has escalated to "I know where you live!!" [14:25] schestowitz-TR Sending by post the exact same thing as by email [14:25] schestowitz-TR Of course I have no plan of borthing [14:25] schestowitz-TR as I can sue also [14:26] Techrights-sec2 maybe a good plan B [14:26] Techrights-sec2 to have in reserve. [14:26] Techrights-sec2 It does mean that the posts are quite effective. [14:26] schestowitz-TR yes, which condemn the technial work, harming employment chance, based on the text of the letter [14:28] schestowitz-TR stalking someone in IRC 24/7 is unhealthy obsession. legal people 'get' that. [14:28] *activelow (~activelow@75hswn6tnmuxs.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [14:30] Techrights-sec2 yes, there are many approaches to a counter [14:30] Techrights-sec2 btw v2 seems to make Gemini sluggish, can you test the current incarnation of v6 [14:30] Techrights-sec2 ? [14:31] schestowitz-TR it has been running v6 since you last changed it ;-) network maxed up here sometimes. gemini slow also partly due to 60k reqs in past 1.5 days [14:32] Techrights-sec2 Ah. But which version of v6? tc is difficult [14:33] schestowitz-TR I ran ir directly from your homedir after you had changed it last night [14:33] Techrights-sec2 then it still needs work, [14:34] schestowitz-TR the current one feels very close, compared to prior "6" and 5. maybe try a 7 to avoid confusion over which version of "6" runs. [14:35] Techrights-sec2 I must read some more first though. [14:58] Techrights-sec2 tc -g -s class show dev wlan0 ? ● Dec 02 [15:49] *techrights_guest|86 (~5b263abd@54n9xgft8g6u2.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [15:55] *techrights_guest|86 has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [15:56] *Despatche (~desp@u3xy9z2ifjzci.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Dec 02 [16:16] *altlink_4af has quit (connection closed) [16:16] *altlink_fbf (~altlink_fbf@2f7u5j6f87p9g.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [16:23] *tech_exorcist has quit (Quit: see you later) ● Dec 02 [17:39] Techrights-sec2 ok, some tweaks in tc-shaper-07.sh; seems to work ok on the test device, but... [17:39] schestowitz-TR running now [17:45] schestowitz-TR gemini is slow now [17:45] Techrights-sec2 :( one more change then. just a sec [17:51] Techrights-sec2 tc-shaper-07.sh should handle Gemini a little faster now, please reload it [17:51] schestowitz-TR i've rerun it now [17:52] Techrights-sec2 seems slightly slow but ok now [17:52] Techrights-sec2 it could be the disk too if IPFS is runnning [17:57] Techrights-sec2 tc -g -s class show dev eth0 [17:57] Techrights-sec2 should show the layout ● Dec 02 [18:21] *liberty_box_ has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [18:21] *rianne has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [18:21] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [18:26] *rianne (~rianne@62vhapicsw4ds.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [18:26] *liberty_box (~liberty@62vhapicsw4ds.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [18:27] *liberty_box_ (~liberty@62vhapicsw4ds.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [18:31] *DaemonFC (~daemonfc@34u2usvgn4b7g.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [18:55] *rianne has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [18:56] *liberty_box_ has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [18:56] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [18:58] *rianne (~rianne@62vhapicsw4ds.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [18:59] *liberty_box_ (~liberty@62vhapicsw4ds.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Dec 02 [19:00] *liberty_box (~liberty@62vhapicsw4ds.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [19:43] *tech_exorcist (~tech_exorcist@r7zq4q2ys63yk.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [19:44] *DaemonFC has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:53] *liberty_box_ has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:53] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:53] *rianne has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) ● Dec 02 [20:04] *rianne (~rianne@62vhapicsw4ds.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [20:04] *liberty_box_ (~liberty@62vhapicsw4ds.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [20:04] *liberty_box (~liberty@62vhapicsw4ds.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [20:19] *Disconnected (Connection reset by peer). 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