●● IRC: #boycottnovell @ Techrights IRC Network: Tuesday, October 11, 2022 ●● ● Oct 11 [00:49] *Despatche (~desp@u3xy9z2ifjzci.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Oct 11 [02:05] *psydruid has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [02:31] *Noisytoot has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [02:33] *Noisytoot (~noisytoot@tkbibjhmbkvb8.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [02:48] *Noisytoot has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [02:50] *Noisytoot (~noisytoot@tkbibjhmbkvb8.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Oct 11 [04:15] *psydruid (~psydruid@jevhxkzmtrbww.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Oct 11 [08:21] Techrights-sec http://techrights.org/irc-archives/irc-log-techrights-101022.html#tOct%2010%2020:07:57 [08:21] Techrights-sec ^ topic ? [08:21] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | IRC: #techrights @ Techrights IRC Network: Monday, October 10, 2022 [08:41] schestowitz-TR thanks for the topi suggestion [08:42] schestowitz-TR Oil-rich countries seem to be pushing for "MAGA", i.e. destabilising the West https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/maga-wave-midterm-elections/ | Source: The Nation [08:42] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.thenation.com | The Dangers of a MAGA Wave Election | The Nation [08:54] schestowitz-TR i wrote about opensource.com (wanted to write it ysterday, then forgot what I had in mind due to too many things going on at once) [08:54] schestowitz-TR hackaday also deteriorated, but I don't think it coinicided with the change of editor [08:54] schestowitz-TR I think it was months apart [08:54] schestowitz-TR they used to have better stories/projects [08:54] schestowitz-TR couterpunch might not last another 2 years ● Oct 11 [09:08] *DaemonFC has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.14 [SeaMonkey 2.53.14/20221003001100]) [09:17] *DaemonFC (~ambassador@u3k8abp3wtrpn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [09:22] *DaemonFC has quit (Quit: Ambassador 1.3.0 [Pale Moon 31.3.0.1/20220928135025]) [09:22] *DaemonFC (~ambassador@u3k8abp3wtrpn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [09:23] *DaemonFC has quit (connection closed) [09:24] *DaemonFC (~ambassador@u3k8abp3wtrpn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Oct 11 [10:17] *DaemonFC has quit (Quit: Ambassador 1.3.0 [Pale Moon 31.3.0.1/20220928135025]) [10:22] *DaemonFC (~ambassador@u3k8abp3wtrpn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [10:31] *DaemonFC has quit (Quit: Ambassador 1.3.0 [Pale Moon 31.3.0.1/20220928135025]) [10:50] Techrights-sec np ● Oct 11 [11:01] schestowitz-TR the new editor is egoistic, self-promoting, and barely covers linux [11:01] Techrights-sec the effect of a change in editor can take place over time, stories are in [11:01] Techrights-sec the pipeline for up to a few weeks, but also the editor can shift beats and [11:01] Techrights-sec priorities and drive out old staff and bring in flunkies [11:01] Techrights-sec Not a surprise, he was probably selected for all three traits. :( [11:10] Techrights-sec Especially ignoring Linux and FOSS in general [11:17] Techrights-sec What is the age of the new editor? I would posit that few millenials and almost [11:17] Techrights-sec no genZ have actual computer experience. [11:17] Techrights-sec Raspberry Pi Foundation was trying to turn that around but got hit simultaneously from several sides, including infiltration on multiple levels. [11:18] schestowitz-TR not sure of the age, just name [11:18] schestowitz-TR paradoxically, more people than ever have access to computes [11:18] schestowitz-TR in the past, it was few [11:18] schestowitz-TR they were more advanced [11:18] schestowitz-TR I wonder if only the % that is literature went down or also the totals [11:20] schestowitz-TR lol spamnil's spam now goes with generic author name, "news team" [11:20] schestowitz-TR some "team", eh? [11:20] schestowitz-TR the "enderle GROUP" [11:24] psydruid the "news" media are complicit in actively fighting the inevitable victory of free software over closed source software because they know the companies that fund them stand to lose [11:30] Techrights-sec ack [11:31] schestowitz-TR IBM seems to be doing kamikaze on it. it sounds bizarre until you count how microsofters entered management positions there [11:41] *starstreak has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) ● Oct 11 [12:38] schestowitz-TR draft [12:38] Techrights-sec checking [12:38] Techrights-sec still empty [12:39] *psydroid2 (~psydroid@h635kpe3hju7k.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [12:51] *psydroid2 has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [12:54] *psydroid2 (~psydroid@h635kpe3hju7k.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [12:57] Techrights-sec checking [12:57] Techrights-sec Acronyms CI, SPI, and GSoC should be expanded when they first occur. [12:57] Techrights-sec s/with neither/without either/ [12:57] Techrights-sec It might be more clear to add an additional sentence clarifying that at least [12:57] Techrights-sec one of thsoe two browsers must now be present in Debian. If they are hard [12:57] Techrights-sec dependencies for base packages then that should be mentioned too [12:57] Techrights-sec Does that apply to just the desktop or does it affect Debian in other forms, [12:57] Techrights-sec server and embedded etc [12:57] schestowitz-TR that's the thing I don't know [12:57] Techrights-sec ? [12:57] schestowitz-TR need to ask dfc [12:57] Techrights-sec It'd be an important fact to have covered in the article. ● Oct 11 [13:18] Techrights-sec ^ none of the above is worth quoting and doing so distracts from the message [13:18] Techrights-sec and detracts from the article :/ [13:33] schestowitz-TR Microsoft TCO; the company is not compatible with the notion of security, but it's a "market leader" in NSA back doors. https://www.pentestpartners.com/security-blog/living-off-the-cloud-cloudy-with-a-chance-of-exfiltration/ [13:33] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.pentestpartners.com | Living off the Cloud. Cloudy with a Chance of Exfiltration | Pen Test Partners [13:33] schestowitz-TR ipwatchdog seems like it's dying. Just 2 or 3 comments this week. We remember it being a hub for many people. The editor left years ago, seeing the demise alrea [13:39] Techrights-sec The problem with m$ goes beyond software. If m$ products are present at all [13:39] Techrights-sec on the network, you do not have a technical problem but a staffing problem which [13:39] Techrights-sec in all likelihood extends up into the management levels. [13:39] Techrights-sec m$ is completely incompatible with common notions of security. [13:41] schestowitz-TR i have a general, board question [13:41] schestowitz-TR assuming people are still on the Net, no less than before [13:41] schestowitz-TR where does your intuition tell you they are at? [13:41] schestowitz-TR I'm doing a quick post about this [13:41] schestowitz-TR sandvine gave some stats [13:41] schestowitz-TR froom observation (just one person, rianne, during lockdown), it's lots of "videos" [13:41] schestowitz-TR and scrolling down infinite scroll pages like BBC [13:41] schestowitz-TR without really opening pages [13:42] Techrights-sec I'm not sure where they are. I get a lot of people assuming that other [13:42] Techrights-sec people are in social control media, but there is no way to sort that from [13:42] Techrights-sec disinformation and hype at the moment. [13:42] Techrights-sec Videos are a big problem. You can watch in a 45 minute video what you could [13:42] Techrights-sec once read in 5 minutes or less. So if people are watching instead of reading [13:42] Techrights-sec that would make a huge time difference. [13:44] schestowitz-TR ok, I will stick to observaable facts [13:44] schestowitz-TR without hypothesising too much [13:44] schestowitz-TR tiktok looks like 90s shit on steroids [13:45] schestowitz-TR is it even profitable? [13:45] schestowitz-TR we discussed this months ago and I cannot recall the conclusion [13:45] schestowitz-TR who pays for all this bandwidth and what for? [13:45] Techrights-sec Never seen TikTok, just read about the damage and addictiveness and disinformation surrounding it. [13:45] Techrights-sec Yes, the cost of not just bandwidth but the ever-increasing storage is a big [13:45] Techrights-sec question. TikTok seems to try to take on the latter by focusing on "shorts". [13:49] schestowitz-TR theory: many "tech" or "web" companies gambled on a future that never came [13:49] schestowitz-TR mnanyh folded in the dot com boom [13:49] schestowitz-TR but some had a second go or second life [13:49] schestowitz-TR those that the regime (debt, "defencE") subsidise are there to spy, manipulate, censors [13:49] schestowitz-TR like youtube does... ramping it up very rapidly [13:49] schestowitz-TR and tiktok is the same ezxcept one of the tentaclkes from the CCP [13:49] schestowitz-TR CPP [13:49] schestowitz-TR CPC [13:49] Techrights-sec I guess it is now capped at 10min, up from 3 min: [13:49] Techrights-sec https://techcrunch.com/2022/02/28/tiktok-expands-max-video-length-to-10-minutes-up-from-3-minutes/ [13:49] Techrights-sec ByteDance is beholden to and operates only under the permission of the CCP [13:49] Techrights-sec ByteDance is a surveillance and propaganda engine by design. [13:49] Techrights-sec It'd not be that different for another country to start up a youth-targeting [13:49] Techrights-sec video site using Palantir or Team Cymru or one of the others. :( [13:49] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-TikTok expands max video length to 10 minutes, up from 3 minutes TechCrunch [13:50] schestowitz-TR iirc, palantor and bytedance don't make a profit [13:50] schestowitz-TR something shores them up [13:50] Techrights-sec Probably not, that's not what they are about anyway. They are both about [13:50] Techrights-sec surveillance. The former is done as a company in order to evade the constraints [13:50] Techrights-sec and oversight required of the public sector. [13:56] schestowitz-TR this is not fair competition [13:56] schestowitz-TR and it's worse than graft asthe activity is illegal [13:56] schestowitz-TR I was told that also by a whistleblower [13:56] schestowitz-TR by companies that do this [13:56] schestowitz-TR they also do election meddling [13:56] schestowitz-TR I read somewhere byt cannot find the ref atm that BoA expects 175k layoffs a month or a week [13:56] schestowitz-TR just in time for US election [13:56] schestowitz-TR sleepy needs to wake up and not pretend there's a recovery and "pandemic is over" [13:57] Techrights-sec Probably. [13:57] Techrights-sec Recall that both Snowden and Winner were excempt from whistleblowers' protection [13:57] Techrights-sec due to the hard fact that they were working in the private sector. ● Oct 11 [14:10] Techrights-sec https://www.efinancialcareers.fi/news/2022/09/goldman-sachs-hiring-and-firing [14:10] Techrights-sec ? [14:10] Techrights-sec Those aren't real jobs though but could be an indirect indicator of more [14:10] Techrights-sec substantial parts of the economy [14:10] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.efinancialcareers.fi | Goldman Sachs is firing in places it was hiring only last year [14:12] schestowitz-TR people who sit on some savings are far better off [14:12] schestowitz-TR because stress and uncertainty harrm helath [14:12] schestowitz-TR and health too became "expensive" [14:12] schestowitz-TR mortgage vs savinbgs vs kids [14:12] schestowitz-TR imho, ime, many chose the first and last [14:12] schestowitz-TR and not anything else [14:12] schestowitz-TR iow, gambling on a future we will never have [14:12] schestowitz-TR kids used to be a way for parents to insure their future (old age), not they're mostly a burden [14:13] schestowitz-TR *now [14:16] schestowitz-TR --- [14:16] schestowitz-TR if you want to se a specialist fast, and a good one, you must pay [14:16] schestowitz-TR "infortmally" [14:16] schestowitz-TR the formal policy is that everyone has access [14:16] schestowitz-TR removing national health care may mean short term "savings" in one's salary [14:16] schestowitz-TR but russian roulette with one's health [14:16] schestowitz-TR as costs of care rapidly grow like in USA [14:16] schestowitz-TR more like price-fixing cartels [14:16] schestowitz-TR see insulin [14:16] schestowitz-TR sleepy did not solve the problem [14:16] schestowitz-TR nor did he tackle patents on covid-19 stuff [14:16] schestowitz-TR useless waste of time [14:16] schestowitz-TR interlufe between two fascists or the same fascist [14:17] Techrights-sec The US does not have health care, it has a medicine industry. Any treatment [14:17] Techrights-sec is a mere side effect and almost an afterthought. The details of what and how [14:17] Techrights-sec to treat "patients" are left up to MBAs and MDs are excluded from that for the [14:17] Techrights-sec most part. [14:33] schestowitz-TR I've tossed in a draft [14:33] schestowitz-TR still getting some graphis and stuff [14:33] schestowitz-TR to shown the "knowns" [14:33] schestowitz-TR *show [14:33] schestowitz-TR damning for the www imho [14:33] schestowitz-TR and serves to show the death of www as info medium [14:34] schestowitz-TR maybe "apps" are all the rage [14:34] Techrights-sec checking [14:34] Techrights-sec The last chart, the one with the blue peak in sites, could be analyzed more [14:34] Techrights-sec because it is showing a rather important phenomenon [14:35] schestowitz-TR yes, hence I share incomplete draft [14:35] schestowitz-TR I've just added speculations to the text and fioxed loads of typos [14:35] Techrights-sec "apps" are outdated, insecure, bug-ridden single-site browsers running [14:35] Techrights-sec insecure, bug-ridden javascript over HTTPS and not even a stateful protocol [14:40] schestowitz-TR random thought: maybe 20 years from now the skills associated with operating a web site will be similar to running bbs today [14:40] schestowitz-TR but we don't know yet [14:48] schestowitz-TR eff, fsf, and wikileaks very quiet and little impact [14:48] schestowitz-TR cc bounced back for a month, went silent again [14:48] schestowitz-TR maybe too busy in social control cages [14:49] Techrights-sec https://thephantomtollbooth.fandom.com/wiki/The_Official_Senses-Taker [14:49] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-thephantomtollbooth.fandom.com | The Official Senses-Taker | The Phantom Tollbooth Wiki | Fandom [14:58] schestowitz-TR solid (ms github, JS) was a solid failure [14:58] schestowitz-TR timbl is a one-trick pony [14:58] schestowitz-TR right place, right time imho [14:58] schestowitz-TR github will also be small 5 years from now [14:58] schestowitz-TR they can't make money off it [14:59] Techrights-sec Anyway social control media in a nutshell: [14:59] Techrights-sec https://thephantomtollbooth.fandom.com/wiki/The_Official_Senses-Taker [14:59] Techrights-sec timbl was great up until, for whatever reason, he bailed on the vision and [14:59] Techrights-sec sold out to DRM ● Oct 11 [15:01] schestowitz-TR no, drm came much later than his sellout [15:01] schestowitz-TR a continuation of a negative trend [15:01] schestowitz-TR sometimes I wonder if it's the same pattern as eff (founders), lt, rms... [15:01] schestowitz-TR how people are sucked out of their own orgs [15:01] schestowitz-TR seemingly with their consent [15:01] schestowitz-TR having been emotionally drained [15:01] schestowitz-TR assange was an extremely case (torture/assassination) [15:01] schestowitz-TR *extreme [15:05] schestowitz-TR btw, opensource.org and .com are not coming back [15:05] schestowitz-TR as microsoft outposts [15:05] schestowitz-TR they alienate the original audience [15:05] schestowitz-TR like linux.com [15:05] schestowitz-TR brands coming under attack [15:05] schestowitz-TR persistent and vicious [15:05] schestowitz-TR to the point oof surrendering and... "you own us now" [15:05] schestowitz-TR remember wikileaksforums (anti-WL) and trolls (MAGA< Russia) who spoiled the wikileaks brand [15:05] schestowitz-TR making it seem like some edgy alt-reich/putin thing [15:05] schestowitz-TR which is strange as upon examination of who runs it those are mostly leftists [15:07] schestowitz-TR similarly, in the medical profession, many who ask for no patents or better vaccines or anothe rtreatment/plicy would be painted as nationalists and [15:07] schestowitz-TR k00ky radicals who block roads with trucks and whatnot. bill gates has roped in this straw man. [15:15] Techrights-sec ack [15:21] schestowitz "[LSCTH] Slides info session rewards 2022 - Guidance document on contesting lack of promotion, steps, bonus" [15:21] schestowitz " [15:21] schestowitz Dear colleagues, [15:21] schestowitz Please find the complete slides accompanying the information session on the 2022 rewards exercise which took place on September 13th. The slides can serve as a guide for future reference. [15:21] schestowitz Related publications: [15:21] schestowitz " [15:51] schestowitz-TR draft [15:51] Techrights-sec ack [15:51] Techrights-sec s/mhe/the/ [15:51] Techrights-sec EPO? or EPO? Please expand the acronym [15:51] Techrights-sec s/worki/work/ [15:52] Techrights-sec Please expand the acronnym EPC too ● Oct 11 [16:03] schestowitz-TR thought: apps are lile tabs that follow you around on a phone even when the tabs are not open ("apps" leak data all the time) [16:03] schestowitz-TR china is the incubator of a lot of spy and social control INNOVA~1 fore western nations to imitat^H^Hpirate [16:04] schestowitz-TR wrt law, cops and regimes become less predictable [16:04] schestowitz-TR it's a form of deterrance [16:05] schestowitz-TR the irrational dictator [16:05] schestowitz-TR don't mess with him, he always gets his way, he's in power [16:05] schestowitz-TR lots of prior art for today's GAFAM patents would have to be in china [16:05] schestowitz-TR in mandarin [16:11] Techrights-sec https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/covid-cases-rise-shanghai-other-chinese-cities-preventive-steps-strengthened-2022-10-11/ [16:11] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-China steps up anti-COVID measures in megacities as infections mount | Reuters [16:12] schestowitz-TR usuaually, you would say, haha, f* china [16:12] schestowitz-TR but this will mostly penalise the west [16:12] schestowitz-TR that's our "warehouse" and cheap labour pool [16:12] schestowitz-TR so it further harms OUT economies [16:12] schestowitz-TR *OUR [16:12] schestowitz-TR unless you can get a factory down the road to make plastic items for one euro a pair and find a river stream onto which to dump the toxins [16:32] *u-amarsh04 has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) 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[16:37] *u-amarsh04 (~amarsh04@freenode-rmogvn.g0d7.dtdf.mc4289.IP) has joined #boycottnovell [16:37] *u-amarsh04 (~amarsh04@22agg6qj8dxhg.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Oct 11 [17:05] *starstreak (~starstreak@muarsy2vret2q.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [17:42] *rianne_ has quit (*.net *.split) [17:42] *Techrights-sec has quit (*.net *.split) [17:42] *schestowitz has quit (*.net *.split) [17:42] *rianne_ (~rianne@freenode-vjf.peq.k31cok.IP) has joined #boycottnovell [17:42] *schestowitz (~schestowi@freenode/user/schestowitz) has joined #boycottnovell [17:42] *Techrights-sec (~quassel@freenode-j7a7ih.am6e.nqgd.t29qgt.IP) has joined #boycottnovell [17:44] *schestowitz has quit (*.net *.split) [17:44] *Techrights-sec has quit (*.net *.split) [17:44] *rianne_ has quit (*.net *.split) [17:46] *rianne_ (~rianne@freenode-vjf.peq.k31cok.IP) has joined #boycottnovell [17:46] *schestowitz (~schestowi@freenode/user/schestowitz) has joined #boycottnovell [17:46] *Techrights-sec (~quassel@freenode-j7a7ih.am6e.nqgd.t29qgt.IP) has joined #boycottnovell [17:48] *schestowitz has quit (*.net *.split) [17:48] *Techrights-sec has quit (*.net *.split) [17:48] *rianne_ has quit (*.net *.split) [17:49] *rianne_ (~rianne@freenode-vjf.peq.k31cok.IP) has joined #boycottnovell [17:49] *schestowitz (~schestowi@freenode/user/schestowitz) has joined #boycottnovell [17:49] *Techrights-sec (~quassel@freenode-j7a7ih.am6e.nqgd.t29qgt.IP) has joined #boycottnovell [17:59] schestowitz-TR some idiot in $company wants to distribute "mobile phones" to staff for "security" [17:59] schestowitz-TR what a circus [17:59] schestowitz-TR passwords outsourced to firm in another continent, with trrack record of security breaches [17:59] schestowitz-TR and many other laughable steps back [17:59] schestowitz-TR from secure infra to GLFAM crap [17:59] schestowitz-TR and now this... [17:59] Techrights-sec ack ● Oct 11 [19:15] *starstreak has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:18] *starstreak (~starstreak@muarsy2vret2q.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [19:21] *starstreak has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:21] *starstreak (~starstreak@muarsy2vret2q.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [19:24] *starstreak has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:25] *starstreak (~starstreak@muarsy2vret2q.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [19:29] *starstreak has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:36] *starstreak (~starstreak@muarsy2vret2q.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [19:39] *starstreak has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:40] *starstreak (~starstreak@muarsy2vret2q.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Oct 11 [20:12] *DaemonFC (~daemonfc@pupsf4x2uvcgu.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Oct 11 [21:57] psydruid https://web.archive.org/web/20221006113141/https://sei.cade.gov.br/sei/modulos/pesquisa/md_pesq_documento_consulta_externa.php?HJ7F4wnIPj2Y8B7Bj80h1lskjh7ohC8yMfhLoDBLddZou1UxFwR2xny_H8WpNqBA9LEUmxpnNJZhTSHmSvXvpffRtONbaxBeOzHPgm0V3c1aCdhWaTZo9OtUDTJX_L_7 [21:57] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-web.archive.org | SEI/CADE - 1128655 - Parecer [21:58] psydruid Microsoft the gaming company is said to be earning $3 billion a year on Xbox console games ● Oct 11 [22:00] schestowitz-TR revenue or profit? [22:01] schestowitz-TR xbox was losses [22:01] schestowitz-TR maybe they game the numbersa [22:01] schestowitz-TR and count the share of other companies [22:01] schestowitz-TR like those actually making the games [22:14] *DaemonFC has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.14 [SeaMonkey 2.53.14/20221003001100]) [22:15] *DaemonFC (~ambassador@pupsf4x2uvcgu.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [22:18] psydruid it's not clear [22:18] schestowitz-TR probably by intention [22:18] schestowitz-TR xbox has been an experiment and failure [22:18] psydruid and I'm not going to read that entire filing [22:19] schestowitz-TR I used to write about it regularly [22:19] *DaemonFC has quit (connection closed) [22:19] schestowitz-TR they kept lying about market performance [22:19] schestowitz-TR profits went to the japanese companies [22:19] schestowitz-TR for instance [22:19] schestowitz-TR it can go like [22:19] schestowitz-TR xbox network made 3 billion in revenue [22:20] schestowitz-TR and then the money got distributed [22:20] schestowitz-TR 60% to developers of the games [22:20] schestowitz-TR 60% to salaries [22:20] schestowitz-TR i.e. net loss [22:20] *DaemonFC (~daemonfc@pupsf4x2uvcgu.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [22:20] schestowitz-TR they will try to tell you what THEY want you to think [22:25] *psydroid2 has quit (connection closed) [22:27] psydruid there was some other "news" about a collaboration with Suckermeta [22:27] psydruid they are like a parasite that moves from host to host doing whatever to stay in business [22:28] psydruid if the software business fails they move to new hypes [22:28] schestowitz-TR failing that, liaise with NSA, ask for bailouts etc. [22:28] schestowitz-TR basically try to become part of the government [22:28] schestowitz-TR so they keep you afloat like Big Banks [22:28] schestowitz-TR with medical data [22:28] schestowitz-TR military stuff [22:28] schestowitz-TR (that's IBM, too) [22:28] schestowitz-TR Windows sales collapsed [22:28] psydruid I don't know if such a chameleon has existed in the computer business before other than their big example IBM [22:28] schestowitz-TR as the sales are like 90% "new" PCs [22:28] schestowitz-TR and now many people buy such PCs [22:31] *Despatche has quit (Quit: Read error: Connection reset by deer) [22:44] psydruid Vista 12 is coming while Vista 11 is barely seeing any use [22:45] psydruid they see the writing on the wall and struggle for survival [22:46] psydruid so get entangled and try to become "mission-critical" ● Oct 11 [23:09] schestowitz-TR yeah [23:09] schestowitz-TR "Too big to fail" [23:11] schestowitz-TR just checked taiwan and india [23:11] schestowitz-TR in india android is now 75% [23:12] schestowitz-TR windows 17%