IRC: #boycottnovell @ Techrights IRC Network: Saturday, September 18, 2021

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When the articles are mostly text, they are almost always easier to read

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as Gemini rather than WWW.

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The navigation is easier and there are fewer distractions surrounding the

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body of the post.

x https://cio.economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/corporate-news/microsoft-and-honor-sign-partnership-to-develop-new-ai-devices/86311817

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Sep 18 11:15

schestowitz

-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-cio.economictimes.indiatimes.com | microsoft: Microsoft and Honor sign partnership to develop new AI, devices, IT News, ET CIO

schestowitz

x https://www.computerworld.com/article/3633872/the-rise-of-tablets-why-we-dont-need-laptops-or-phones-anymore.html

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-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.computerworld.com | The rise of tablets: Why we don't need laptops or phones anymore | Computerworld

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# passive "consumption" only

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x https://www.clarepeople.com/3000-new-attacks-continue-using-linux-to-attack-windows-systems/

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-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.clarepeople.com | New attacks continue using Linux to attack Windows systems – The Clare People

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Techrights-sec

untested:

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diff --git a/IPFS/complete-index-split.sh b/IPFS/complete-index-split.sh

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index be19a03..f91b480 100755

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--- a/IPFS/complete-index-split.sh

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+++ b/IPFS/complete-index-split.sh

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@@ -21,7 +21,7 @@ awk '{print "* " $0}' txt | grep ' techrights-' | sed 's/ techrights-/ TR /' |

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echo '' >> /home/gemini/gemini/ipfs/index.gmi

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echo '## IRC Logs' >> /home/gemini/gemini/ipfs/index.gmi

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echo '' >> /home/gemini/gemini/ipfs/index.gmi

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-awk '{print "* " $0}' txt | grep -v ' techrights-' | sed 's/[(].*$//' | sed 's/ irc-log-/ /' >> /hom

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e/gemini/gemini/ipfs/index.gmi

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+awk '!/ techrights-/ {sub(/(.*$/,""); sub(/ irc-log-/," "); print "* " $0}' txt >> /home/gemini/gemini

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/ipfs/index.gmi

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echo '' >> /home/gemini/gemini/ipfs/index.gmi

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echo '=> / back to Techrights (Main Index)' >> /home/gemini/gemini/ipfs/index.gmi

http://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2021/09/dabus-ai-inventor-or-emperors-new.html?showComment=1631711393151#c6661506758750993219

schestowitz

git pull && git show | grep Dae

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Sep 18 20:35

Techrights-sec

I have just seen your push and I got the changes for ipfs, will deploy that soon and test

Sep 18 20:46

schestowitz

I've just pushed view_irc.sh again. Together with the monitor script, it can take http://techrights.org/irc-archives/irc-status.txt (using curl or wget ) and then process them for concise overview. I run it locally on the file, from a lesser PC over ssh with refresh every 20 secs

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Sep 18 22:41

schestowitz

-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-ipkitten.blogspot.com | DABUS: An AI inventor or the Emperor's New Clothes? - The IPKat

schestowitz

schestowitz

Is your title a reference to the 1989 600-page brick "The Emperor's new mind" by Roger Penrose, or is it just a coincidence?

schestowitz

The book seeks to provide an answer to the question "can computers have a mind?", by taking the reader on a breathtaking tour of modern mathematics and physics. The author's view, if I can summarize it, is that there is still something fundamental missing in understanding the nature of "strong AI".

schestowitz

I find this topic rather irksome, and I'm at a loss to understand what the petitioners are really after, or what harm they are actually suffering. In my view, at best they are some pedants tediously trying to make their point, and at worst they are hiding some sinister unavowable motives. The proper forum to settle these questions would be to petition democratically elected governments, rather than pushing their agenda, whatever it is, through

schestowitz

courts, who would in the end make new law rather than "interpreting" existing statutes.

schestowitz

This debate also ignores the historical origins of the right of the inventor to be named, which was a fight that lasted roughly six decades centered around 1900. In turn this raises questions about theories for justifying patents, which are rarely explicitly invoked. The classical bargain theory is already unsatisfactory, and would fail if the source of "innovation" is a non-sentient bucket of chips. (Advocates often hopscotch between theories

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without even realising it.)

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In any case, one should be careful about what one wishes for: what is good for the goose should also apply to the gander. If the skilled person of Art. 56 EPC could be under some circumstances a multidisciplinary team, then why couldn't it be an AI system?

schestowitz

Back in the USSR, one Genrich Altshuller looked at countless patents to try to understand how inventors think, and came up with a systematic set of rules for solving technical problems. This came to be codified in a method called "TRIZ", which has a minor cult-like following. It is actually rather seductive, and is in my view a kind of generalised problem-solution approach. Very roughly, the analysis involves the identification of constraints

schestowitz

and contradictions in the problem statement, and lists rules suggesting which approach could be tried, such as "Do it inversely", "Change the state of the physical property.", or "Do it in advance." (from "Suddenly the inventor appeared", by Altshuller, 1994; other books, such as "Grundlagen der klassischen TRIZ" provide more elaborate tabulations)

schestowitz

http://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2021/09/dabus-ai-inventor-or-emperors-new.html?showComment=1631962981581#c8220496132033312926

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-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-ipkitten.blogspot.com | DABUS: An AI inventor or the Emperor's New Clothes? - The IPKat

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schestowitz

In my humble opinion you start from a wrong premise. You consider that AI “does create inventions, in the sense that its outputs would not have been obvious to a skilled person without the use of such a machine”.

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The problem is that any AI system cannot by essence do more than it has been told to do. And all the ambiguity results from this wrong premise.

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In that respect, I cannot imagine that “AI becomes better than humans at generating unforeseen results”.

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There is therefore no need to adapt the level of inventive step to match what would be obvious for an AI (or for a skilled person with the assistance of AI).

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I cannot follow you when you express the fear that it “may become very much harder for a mere human to make a patentable invention”.

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To me the discussion on AI is highly academic and should remain in this field.

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http://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2021/09/no-german-injunction-gap-expedition-in.html?showComment=1631882668622#c3425297260496883847

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-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-ipkitten.blogspot.com | No "German injunction gap" expedition in Abbott v Dexcom global diabetes battle, as Mr Justice Mellor expresses "some regret" - The IPKat

schestowitz

"My understanding is that the German system when it requires a "security" it is not a promise to pay but the actual amount has to be deposited at the court. This is of itself a significant issue as you lose all power in getting it back. This was some 10+ years ago so it may have changed. "

http://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2021/09/book-review-intellectual-property-law.html?showComment=1631843907177#c7739649820655563306

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-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-ipkitten.blogspot.com | Book Review: Intellectual Property Law in China, 2nd Edition - The IPKat

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"Tian Lu wrote: "Those who are innovating and exploring modalities in the justice system do not shake China’s tradition of statutory law. The discourse in this book would have been more rigorous if the additional explanations above had been provided." But on the same page 9 the authors write "Chinese law is different from the Common Law tradition in that the decision of a higher court or even of the SPC does not bind the lower court (unlike

schestowitz

the above-mentioned Interpretations), so that they may decide differently in a similar case." And then the reference is made to my editorial IP in China: Moving closer to the common law system for the sake of uniformity: https://academic-oup-com.eres.qnl.qa/jiplp/article/12/8/621/3978698?searchresult=1|

-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-Connection timed out after 10000 milliseconds ( status 0 @ https://academic-oup-com.eres.qnl.qa/jiplp/article/12/8/621/3978698?searchresult=1| )

activelow

"AI" isn't an academic term; it is unspecific, and unscientific, quackery

Sep 18 23:06

activelow

lacking a definition instead Turing proposed some shallow test a chatbot reproducing indistinguishable phrases from social media blather defined this term, which it doesn't

Sep 18 23:09

activelow

schestowitz: "Turing test" with the argument to verify what wasn't specified to begin with. it is tautological circular, usncientific and deceptive argument.

Sep 18 23:10

schestowitz-TR2

activelow: I agree HEY HI is vague

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they don't say SVMs

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or Neural networks

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they want to keep it broad and generic

activelow

For example, "AI" was evident when some script scraped of phrases from british yellow press, and then claiming "see this is innovative AI reproducing the intellect of british yellow press"

schestowitz-TR2

"hey hi" can be computer or just program

activelow

of cause, it is indistinguishable, if some yellow press gossip was written realtime by an author or if it was scraped from some database of archived text samples

Sep 18 23:13

activelow

"Turing test", doesn't verify anything

Sep 18 23:15

activelow

in any case, a chatbot scrapes text samples, written by humans, and the algorithms to select phrases too

Sep 18 23:16

activelow

"AI" doesn't invent nor innovate, AI isn't at least identifiable, it isn't an objective term, it is a highly unspecific and abstract *concept*

Sep 18 23:17

activelow

which cannot be either proven or disproven to exist or not

Sep 18 23:17

activelow

since *concepts* do NOT qualify with existence, only objects do

Sep 18 23:17

activelow

such as *time* as an abstract concept does not neither exist or not, it is only a watch to measure time which can either exist or not

Sep 18 23:18

activelow

then next, "AI" as an *abstract* and unspecific concept had to be verified for it's utility, if this concept could predict or model anything at all: no it cannot.

Sep 18 23:19

activelow

if algorithms (differential equation systems) are modeled according to natural brain function then this is objective, it can be qualified and quantified, such as layers of a (algorithmic) neural perceptron

Sep 18 23:20

activelow

"AI" cannot be qualified or quantified, it is deceptive, harmful quackery

schestowitz-TR2

it's all outlandish and infantile... hey hi

schestowitz-TR2

we need to mock people who use the term

activelow

schestowitz-TR2: are there any chatbots present on techrights IRC?

schestowitz-TR2

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not "hey hi"

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the logic is very simple

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like output of title of given url

https://twitter.com/mikenov/status/1439182114356961285

activelow

ordinary text processing, not implying some text parser is trivial (given the power of Perl regex for example)

Sep 18 23:22

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Sep 18 23:28

schestowitz

-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@mikenov: BA-LO-NEY! Phony Baloney! #NewAbwehr - #KGB #PoliticalWeapon in action! https://t.co/rpLyu9HjEW

-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@schestowitz: ● NEWS ● #TheNation ☞ There’s No Good Reason #FBI Director #ChrisWray Still Has a Job https://t.co/WE2f3dXbqS

https://twitter.com/glynmoody/status/1439179096538419201

schestowitz

-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@glynmoody: "Truss scored particularly badly in a 2019 analysis by DeSmog and the Guardian of MPs’ votes on climate change, bei… https://t.co/qSm44sLO8F

-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@glynmoody: "Truss scored particularly badly in a 2019 analysis by DeSmog and the Guardian of MPs’ votes on climate change, bei… https://t.co/qSm44sLO8F

schestowitz

|""Truss scored particularly badly in a 2019 analysis by DeSmog and the Guardian of MPs’ votes on climate change, being present for 10 votes and voting positively in two."|