Join us now at the IRC channel.
| XRevan86 | MinceR: That's ironic… they had one job… | Jun 17 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| MinceR | the way the chocolate ration was increased? | Jun 17 00:00 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: i know, right? | Jun 17 00:00 |
| MinceR | oh, i forgot that they're also fond of monarchy | Jun 17 00:00 |
| DaemonFC[m] | There's nothing legitimate about this tax law. | Jun 17 00:00 |
| MinceR | apparently the austrian school decided that monarchy was closer to anarchism than democracy is | Jun 17 00:00 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The Republicans played a pea and shell game that raises taxes on the middle class and makes it look like a cut. | Jun 17 00:01 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Then hands the money to the rich. | Jun 17 00:01 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: In a libertarian way it kinda is | Jun 17 00:01 |
| MinceR | actual libertarian or "republican" "libertarian"? | Jun 17 00:01 |
| DaemonFC[m] | People were filing in to prepay their property taxes for the next year in Illinois so they could deduct them one last time at full value. | Jun 17 00:01 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Democracy begets bureaucracy, that stuff is complicated and annoying. | Jun 17 00:01 |
| MinceR | democracy also reduces the power the state wields over the individual | Jun 17 00:02 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Compare it to a simple state of minimal laws with just a dude on the throne. Can't get simpler than that. | Jun 17 00:02 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Yep yep. Even at the local level, the Democrats are nasty here. | Jun 17 00:02 |
| MinceR | if run correctly (which of course never happens), the government serves the people, while in the case of monarchy, the government is not even supposed or pretending to do so | Jun 17 00:02 |
| MinceR | yeah, i know the sort | Jun 17 00:03 |
| MinceR | "small government" that enforces religious rules :> | Jun 17 00:03 |
| MinceR | and polices people's bedrooms | Jun 17 00:03 |
| DaemonFC[m] | They didn't want to face a Libertarian on the ballot for Fox Lake, IL council, so they had the cops go cite him for having a car parked on his lawn and then "forgot" to notify him. | Jun 17 00:03 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Suddenly, he owes $46,000 to the city and can't get on the ballot. | Jun 17 00:03 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The point here is that the people who run the city make sure it stays that way, and they'll do corrupt shit and nobody hears about it because it's a small town. | Jun 17 00:04 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: I'm just toying with the concept. More closer to reality, the issue of simple absolute monarchies is that they do not ensure bourgeois safety. | Jun 17 00:05 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: we should also ban the word "shell", as in wars, tanks fire shells and kill people, causing lots of grief | Jun 17 00:05 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The message is that everyone has a "car parked on the lawn" that the city will become interested in if you oppose anyone on the ballot. | Jun 17 00:05 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: and the cornerstone of anarchism is to not ensure bourgeois safety? | Jun 17 00:05 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: ancap is all about letting them defend their property on their own without any obstruction. | Jun 17 00:06 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The country is flying apart at the hinges and all Trump does is lie about the statistics and duct tape everything with Socialism for the rich. | Jun 17 00:06 |
| DaemonFC[m] | His voters are far too stupid to understand that this is not good for them. | Jun 17 00:07 |
| DaemonFC[m] | So he gets away with it, maybe for another 4 years too. | Jun 17 00:07 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: So good luck with lynching actually. | Jun 17 00:07 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The reason this Tara Reade thing went away is because nobody fucking cares anymore. | Jun 17 00:07 |
| DaemonFC[m] | They have bigger problems than what Biden may or may not have done in 1993 and they're not in the mood to listen to conspiracy theories that have no evidence whatsoever. | Jun 17 00:08 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Biden got the Violence Against Women Act through Congress while Trump was raping 13 year old girls. | Jun 17 00:08 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: that sword cuts both ways | Jun 17 00:08 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Trump will probably always get away with anything though. | Jun 17 00:09 |
| DaemonFC[m] | When that victim sued him, his supporters sent her death threats and she ran to hide. | Jun 17 00:09 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: The nonaggression principle is all about leaving them in peace too. | Jun 17 00:09 |
| MinceR | but not others? | Jun 17 00:09 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: If you don't impose on their property, you should be fine. | Jun 17 00:10 |
| MinceR | i suppose the fake "anarchists" would not interpret the bigotry they promote as "aggression" | Jun 17 00:10 |
| XRevan86 | Property is everything they can take though, so good luck with that too %). | Jun 17 00:10 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Aggression is property infringement. | Jun 17 00:11 |
| MinceR | neither enforcing religious rules against people who asked for none of them | Jun 17 00:11 |
| XRevan86 | Ancap is very property focused. | Jun 17 00:12 |
| MinceR | seems more focused on "i just want to call myself an anarchist because i think it makes me cool and edgy" | Jun 17 00:12 |
| schestowitz | [00:05] <MinceR> schestowitz: we should also ban the word "shell", as in wars, tanks fire shells and kill people, causing lots of grief | Jun 17 00:13 |
| schestowitz | a terminal shell | Jun 17 00:13 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Well, proper ones anyway. How that leads to fascism or monarchy – I don't know. | Jun 17 00:13 |
| schestowitz | = a shell that knocks you over causing a fatality | Jun 17 00:13 |
| schestowitz | I bash you not... | Jun 17 00:13 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: But it does mean that you have no right to obstruct anyone's activities if they did something like fire a person for being gay. You can vote with your wallet or do something else equally worthless. | Jun 17 00:15 |
| XRevan86 | Don't know how wallets would look like in ancap. I owe you one's from capitalists or bitcoins? | Jun 17 00:16 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: i haven't had the time or energy to dive into the relevant literature enough to find the path from property to fascism | Jun 17 00:17 |
| MinceR | it's possible that it was the other way around | Jun 17 00:17 |
| MinceR | as for wallets, they could contain gold, depending on whom you ask | Jun 17 00:18 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Right, gold makes sense. Except heavy and with quality issues. | Jun 17 00:18 |
| XRevan86 | I don't know what's the appeal of ancap, it's like the worst of both worlds. | Jun 17 00:20 |
| XRevan86 | Capitalism needs a medium in which capital can safely interact. Anarchism is literally abolishment of the said medium. | Jun 17 00:23 |
| MinceR | not really | Jun 17 00:23 |
| XRevan86 | Without it they can resort to feudalism at best. | Jun 17 00:23 |
| MinceR | it's the abolishment of powerful forces that distort the market | Jun 17 00:23 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: You're thinking of libertarianism. | Jun 17 00:24 |
| MinceR | no, i'm thinking of capitalism | Jun 17 00:24 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: The state doesn't just influence the market, it provides the market space. | Jun 17 00:25 |
| MinceR | it doesn't just influence the market, it provides a hotbed of corruption which also distorts the market | Jun 17 00:25 |
| MinceR | the universe provides the market space | Jun 17 00:25 |
| MinceR | humans exchanging goods predates the state | Jun 17 00:25 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Basic exchange of goods is not the same thing as capitalism. | Jun 17 00:26 |
| MinceR | basic exchange of goods gives rise to the market | Jun 17 00:26 |
| MinceR | which is what capitalism is supposed to be all about | Jun 17 00:26 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: What capitalism needs is endurance that there will be no use of literal force, no theft, etc. | Jun 17 00:27 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: For that you need police. | Jun 17 00:27 |
| MinceR | no, i don't | Jun 17 00:27 |
| MinceR | for that i need people who wield force | Jun 17 00:27 |
| MinceR | there's no need to pretend that someone has a monopoly on that force | Jun 17 00:27 |
| MinceR | i know that people like to pretend that policemen are saints | Jun 17 00:28 |
| MinceR | unfortunately, they're merely human | Jun 17 00:28 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: The same people who can be used as thugs. | Jun 17 00:28 |
| MinceR | police can be used as thugs as well | Jun 17 00:28 |
| MinceR | and they are | Jun 17 00:28 |
| MinceR | especially when there's no rule of law | Jun 17 00:28 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: In perfect capitalism they're not %). | Jun 17 00:29 |
| MinceR | and afaict there's no rule of law anywhere on earth | Jun 17 00:29 |
| MinceR | yes, because in perfect capitalism there is no state or police :> | Jun 17 00:29 |
| XRevan86 | Capitalism is an economical system in which capital is the primary force. | Jun 17 00:30 |
| MinceR | so, not the violence practiced by the agents of the state | Jun 17 00:31 |
| XRevan86 | Without any outer body to protect capital from the physical world occurrences, some security force is required. | Jun 17 00:31 |
| MinceR | as long as one pretends that the "security force" is an "outer body" | Jun 17 00:31 |
| MinceR | unfortunately, it isn't | Jun 17 00:32 |
| MinceR | it's just a bunch of humans, given power, and corrupted by it | Jun 17 00:32 |
| XRevan86 | And because capital of any size needs protection, it can't be just some private security. | Jun 17 00:32 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: I'm outlining the capitalist theory here. | Jun 17 00:32 |
| XRevan86 | Not how imperfect reality taints it severely. | Jun 17 00:33 |
| XRevan86 | Ancap approaches this with the nonaggression principle and hopes of some bourgeois solidarity. | Jun 17 00:33 |
| XRevan86 | That if someone infringes on some property, the good big capitalist will see it as danger to the market and will eliminate that danger. | Jun 17 00:34 |
| MinceR | it doesn't have to be one big capitalist | Jun 17 00:35 |
| XRevan86 | Or in plural. | Jun 17 00:35 |
| MinceR | it can be a community of people who recognize that such behavior is a threat to their society | Jun 17 00:35 |
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| XRevan86 | A community of like Google, Microsoft, Amazon, Oracle, IBM… | Jun 17 00:36 |
| MinceR | hopefully corporations like those wouldn't be tolerated by a society where individuals aren't disarmed and disenfranchised by the state | Jun 17 00:36 |
| MinceR | certainly, microsloth wouldn't have gotten anywhere without the state enforcing their Imaginary Property | Jun 17 00:37 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: But they have the property, you can't just ignore that. | Jun 17 00:37 |
| XRevan86 | And land is also property, so in ancap no free land is pretty much a given. | Jun 17 00:38 |
| MinceR | those corporations don't really live off having a lot of land | Jun 17 00:39 |
| MinceR | they live off Imaginary Property | Jun 17 00:39 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: You call it imaginary property, hah. But in anarchism they will decide what is and isn't property. | Jun 17 00:39 |
| MinceR | it is indeed not property | Jun 17 00:39 |
| MinceR | making copies of it is nearly cost-free | Jun 17 00:40 |
| XRevan86 | And they will defend what they by consensus consider to be property. | Jun 17 00:40 |
| MinceR | it is generally easier to copy than move | Jun 17 00:40 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Next thing you'll tell me that land is nature and scarce, so belongs to everyone. | Jun 17 00:40 |
| MinceR | i don't think there's an easy way out with land | Jun 17 00:41 |
| MinceR | declare it strictly owned and people will find themselves without a place they could live in | Jun 17 00:41 |
| MinceR | declare it "not property" and you have no privacy | Jun 17 00:41 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: It's a tricky subject. But eternal ownership of land has some interesting consequences. | Jun 17 00:42 |
| MinceR | and you have strangers milling about in the house you're trying to sleep in | Jun 17 00:42 |
| XRevan86 | That ancap will absolutely not touch. | Jun 17 00:42 |
| MinceR | but then, i'm not an "ancap" or an "ancom" | Jun 17 00:42 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Neither am I. | Jun 17 00:42 |
| XRevan86 | > declare it "not property" and you have no privacy | Jun 17 00:43 |
| XRevan86 | That's never the case. Usually the approach is a lease. | Jun 17 00:44 |
| MinceR | from whom? | Jun 17 00:44 |
| MinceR | and what is the basis of leasing land if land is not property? | Jun 17 00:44 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: In anarchy – I don't know. | Jun 17 00:44 |
| XRevan86 | Maybe some mutual agreement that land should not be inherited. | Jun 17 00:45 |
| XRevan86 | Not ancap'ish but in some other form. | Jun 17 00:45 |
| MinceR | or just a general understanding that if someone's trying to hog all the land, they're going to get lynched | Jun 17 00:47 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: What if your business is land-based (plantation)? | Jun 17 00:48 |
| XRevan86 | Or if there's just one good strip of land in the vicinity. | Jun 17 00:48 |
| MinceR | there will probably be others who want to engage in such business as well | Jun 17 00:48 |
| MinceR | and it's in the clients' interest to have competition on the market | Jun 17 00:48 |
| XRevan86 | But it's not hogging if your enterprise needs it. | Jun 17 00:49 |
| MinceR | depends | Jun 17 00:50 |
| MinceR | are others starving because of it? | Jun 17 00:50 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: really it gets fun when you read the finer print of many countries free hold title. Land in a lot of cases is not your property at all its the governments that they allow you to use on a unlimited lease. People normally find this out when govenment sells mining contract under them. | Jun 17 00:50 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: There are always others starving. | Jun 17 00:50 |
| oiaohm | and you techically don't have to be paid a cent. | Jun 17 00:51 |
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| oiaohm | So much of what we call property when you get into fine print arbitrary ideas written on paper. | Jun 17 00:52 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: that doesn't really make it any better | Jun 17 00:52 |
| MinceR | it's just that people like to pretend the government doesn't exist or that it isn't run by people | Jun 17 00:52 |
| oiaohm | Most people don't think how come when a country gets invaided land titles basically go by by as well. | Jun 17 00:53 |
| oiaohm | Because land title depends on your country. | Jun 17 00:53 |
| XRevan86 | Somehow we don't live in an abstract world of ideas. | Jun 17 00:53 |
| XRevan86 | Capitalism doesn't exist, socialism doesn't exist, nothing in reality can fully comply with ideas. | Jun 17 00:54 |
| DaemonFC[m] | <MinceR "it's just that people like to pr"> They aren't people. They're Replicant Lizards. | Jun 17 00:58 |
| XRevan86 | Worst of all, SQL also doesn't exist (: | Jun 17 00:58 |
| DaemonFC[m] | First the Lizard People took over but then they realized they had to pay their Lizard minor officials, so they replaced them with Lizard Replicants. | Jun 17 00:58 |
| MinceR | DaemonFC[m]: lol | Jun 17 00:59 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: good | Jun 17 00:59 |
| MinceR | hopefully neither does COBOL | Jun 17 00:59 |
| MinceR | or Basic | Jun 17 00:59 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: SELECT * FROM [good] | Jun 17 00:59 |
| MinceR | is that m$ access? | Jun 17 00:59 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Skynet and the Lizard Replicants are busy deciding if I get to live or die at this very moment. | Jun 17 01:00 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: yes | Jun 17 01:00 |
| MinceR | ew | Jun 17 01:00 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: That's what does exist in its place. | Jun 17 01:00 |
| MinceR | lol | Jun 17 01:00 |
| XRevan86 | A bit of an exaggerated example, as MS Access is the absolute worst, but still | Jun 17 01:02 |
| psydread | does that abomination still exist? | Jun 17 01:05 |
| XRevan86 | SELECT LAST[basic] FROM [good] WHERE basic LIKE("*absolute.shit*"); | Jun 17 01:06 |
| XRevan86 | I think that would actually execute. | Jun 17 01:07 |
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| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Haiku Release and New Video http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/138842 [https://pleroma.site/objects/a2795c32-8f8f-4d6b-8e4d-a670c6482281] | Jun 17 03:31 | |
| DaemonFC[m] | Not really sure what Haiku offers. | Jun 17 05:03 |
| DaemonFC[m] | It's not *nix, so there's not a lot of software that's compatible with it. | Jun 17 05:04 |
| schestowitz | some people older than us are nostalgic about beos | Jun 17 05:05 |
| schestowitz | I never even used os/2 | Jun 17 05:05 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | I had BeOS on my computer. | Jun 17 05:09 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I was triple booting between Windows 98, BeOS, and Mandrake Linux. | Jun 17 05:09 |
| cubexyz | minix, desqview, tops, CP/M, amigados | Jun 17 05:09 |
| cubexyz | probably others if I think about it more | Jun 17 05:10 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I cut Windows 98 way down with RoM2 and so it wasn't using much space in the end. | Jun 17 05:10 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Then I installed BeOS Personal Edition and Mandrake Linux in files on my FAT32 drive. | Jun 17 05:10 |
| cubexyz | Venix, many other *nix variants | Jun 17 05:10 |
| cubexyz | RT-11, quasijarus, ultrix, plan 9, etc | Jun 17 05:11 |
| cubexyz | I tried BeOS, I was diverted by it, I'm not really nostalgic about it | Jun 17 05:13 |
| cubexyz | FOSS was the real driver, which made BeOS less interesting, same for amigados although it was leaked/released later | Jun 17 05:16 |
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| superkuh | BeOS 5 was my gateway drug to linux. | Jun 17 05:27 |
| psydread | I never used BeOS, but I remember having a cd set of it | Jun 17 05:31 |
| psydread | and now I have Haiku installed on an Intel Celeron laptop | Jun 17 05:32 |
| psydread | after wiping Kubuntu | Jun 17 05:32 |
| psydread | > Not really sure what Haiku offers. | Jun 17 05:35 |
| psydread | > It's not *nix, so there's not a lot of software that's compatible with it. | Jun 17 05:35 |
| psydread | BeOS was Unix-like and Haiku actually has implemented all of Posix. At least that's what one of the developers recently said. It just doesn't have X11. | Jun 17 05:35 |
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| oiaohm | psydread: https://wiki.winehq.org/Haiku Haiku is posix yes but the undefined sections of posix like what libraries functions have to be in add a extrea mix of hell. | Jun 17 05:45 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-wiki.winehq.org | Haiku - WineHQ Wiki | Jun 17 05:45 | |
| oiaohm | So yes Haiku is Posix compadbile but the library name holding the function could be completely different to every other Unix/BSD/Linux in existance. | Jun 17 05:46 |
| psydread | oiaohm, yes, I know they have some weirdness and I wouldn't put it on my main machines, but I was surprised it worked on real hardware at all. And its hardware support doesn't seem to be that bad either with pretty modern hardware being supported using mostly drivers ported from FreeBSD. | Jun 17 05:51 |
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| *CoderAyn is now known as CrystalMath | Jun 17 06:04 | |
| schestowitz | Ariadne: any good cli/ncurses client for pleroma? | Jun 17 06:05 |
| schestowitz | I still cannot get it to load at all in qupzilla, not mastodon style, not classic style either | Jun 17 06:06 |
| schestowitz | would mastodon clients be compatible? e.g. https://www.linux-magazine.com/Online/Features/Mastodon-Clients-Post-Line/(offset)/3 | Jun 17 06:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux-magazine.com | Tutorial – Mastodon - Page: 1.3 » Linux Magazine | Jun 17 06:08 | |
| schestowitz | https://docs.pleroma.social/clients.html | Jun 17 06:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-docs.pleroma.social | Pleroma Clients — Pleroma v1.1.9-10-g42f76306+dev | Jun 17 06:11 | |
| schestowitz | https://brutaldon.online/ seems to work for me, let's test... | Jun 17 06:13 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-302 redirect with weird Location: about | Jun 17 06:13 | |
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| Ariadne | yes | Jun 17 06:59 |
| Ariadne | mastodon clients are compatible | Jun 17 06:59 |
| schestowitz | I found a way, eventually.. | Jun 17 07:08 |
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| psydread | I think Mastodon should also go p2p like Matrix recently did | Jun 17 10:25 |
| schestowitz | is ti scalable? | Jun 17 10:33 |
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| psydread | I haven't tested it yet | Jun 17 11:07 |
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| schestowitz | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X74TcEZ3_iI | Jun 17 11:17 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-A Message From Vandana Shiva - YouTube | Jun 17 11:17 | |
| schestowitz | YOUTUBE seems to be messing with results a lot | Jun 17 11:17 |
| schestowitz | Google curating to amplify the official narratives | Jun 17 11:18 |
| schestowitz | demoting things that highlight deception | Jun 17 11:18 |
| schestowitz | this is awful, YouTube became like broadcast/TV | Jun 17 11:18 |
| schestowitz | In the name or 'protecting' us from 'bad' ideas | Jun 17 11:18 |
| MinceR | there is no good choice | Jun 17 11:20 |
| MinceR | they can curate or they can become a mouthpiece for nutcases | Jun 17 11:21 |
| MinceR | the problem is with humanity | Jun 17 11:21 |
| schestowitz | <li> | Jun 17 11:42 |
| schestowitz | <h5><a href="https://truthout.org/articles/we-are-witnessing-an-uprising-against-a-world-built-on-anti-blackness/">We Are Witnessing an Uprising Against a World Built on Anti-Blackness</a></h5> | Jun 17 11:42 |
| schestowitz | <blockquote> | Jun 17 11:42 |
| schestowitz | <p>How we understand the current uprising in the wake of multiple police killings is critical. It is not only a protest. If we are fortunate, it stays an uprising — against a whole system built on anti-Blackness. This is not about a few “bad apples,” but an entire institution that has a monopoly on the definition of “justice.” It is about people’s psychic, emotional and economic investments in a heavily resourced | Jun 17 11:42 |
| schestowitz | system that functions to protect white supremacy through anti-Black violence. It is about George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, Tony McDade, Oscar Grant, Sandra Bland, Rekia Boyd and so many others, as well as the hundreds of years’ worth of violence against Black communities. As such, and as the world is witnessing — because of the gravity and depth — every strategy to disturb, let alone upend this world, will be taken.</p></ | Jun 17 11:42 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-truthout.org | We Are Witnessing an Uprising Against a World Built on Anti-Blackness | Jun 17 11:42 | |
| schestowitz | blockquote></li> | Jun 17 11:42 |
| schestowitz | oops | Jun 17 11:42 |
| schestowitz | correct paste: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9gPW77ylGw | Jun 17 11:42 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-What I Learned From Richard Stallman - YouTube | Jun 17 11:42 | |
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| XRevan86 | Why do only white dudes with beer bellies coming to my awesome Pirate-themed party? Is it all the black flags with skulls and bones? I mean, I didn't mean it to be offensive! | Jun 17 12:17 |
| *XRevan86 read https://happyassassin.net/posts/2020/06/17/on-inclusive-language-an-extended-metaphor-involving-parties-because-why-not/ like that when it came to whitelists. | Jun 17 12:17 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-happyassassin.net | On inclusive language: an extended metaphor involving parties because why not | AdamW on Linux and more | Jun 17 12:18 | |
| XRevan86 | I can't wait to move on to the world where colours aren't exclusively reserved for skin. | Jun 17 12:20 |
| XRevan86 | I've been making commie jokes about "red flags", but red is also how skin of indigenous Americans was seen by the European colonisers… | Jun 17 12:22 |
| XRevan86 | Or: better dead than red. | Jun 17 12:23 |
| XRevan86 | Yellow press – untrustworthy. Because Chinese are untrustworthy? Is that the message you want to send? | Jun 17 12:26 |
| MinceR | :> | Jun 17 12:29 |
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| MinceR | they just can't keep their fucking politics out of my technology | Jun 17 12:31 |
| MinceR | they'll be totally surprised and outraged when their ancient enemies get on the bandwagon | Jun 17 12:31 |
| XRevan86 | I'm fine with them taking politics out with "slave". But now it's "race is everything" shoved into every orifice. | Jun 17 12:33 |
| MinceR | slavery is not race anyway | Jun 17 12:36 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Technically not, and it is a very regional thing to always assume otherwise, but it is politics, because slavery is a political issue. | Jun 17 12:37 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: And race-based slavery is the kind of slavery that has pronounced consequences to this day. | Jun 17 12:39 |
| XRevan86 | So in that respect, it's not far-fetched. | Jun 17 12:40 |
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| XRevan86 | No one cares about Slavs having a business of selling other Slavs as slaves anymore. It's even reflected in the name, but today it doesn't creep in the shadows. | Jun 17 12:42 |
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| XRevan86 | And of course if slavery is based on some inherent characteristic of a person (i.e. if social classes are divided by skin tone), then it's _a_lot_ more nasty than when it's mixed. | Jun 17 12:45 |
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| XRevan86 | https://i.chzbgr.com/full/9501782016/hDD17D8BA | Jun 17 12:46 |
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| omac777 | I was reading your article about the Microsoft Github thing. | Jun 17 13:02 |
| omac777 | A few days ago, I was on old.reddit.com/r/rust/ | Jun 17 13:02 |
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| MinceR | XRevan86: yeah, and bible-humpers might actually bring back slavery because in their favorite overrated fable, slavery is portrayed as acceptable | Jun 17 13:04 |
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| omac777 | Someone posted something about Microsoft acknowledging Rust and wanting to proceed to adopt it for any upcoming software development. I replied along the lines that why should rust developers care about MS thinks because I don't highly regard Microsoft and prefer to warn Rust redditors to remain vigilant about anything Microsoft. The end result | Jun 17 13:09 |
| omac777 | was I got harshly downvoted in terms of point and given a warning of being booted of the forum for rule of "zeolotry". They said don't be "over zealous". They said "do you have a bone to pick with Microsoft?". I'm an older individual so I have read the number of legal suits against Microsoft. I've been admiring techrights.org for a long time | Jun 17 13:09 |
| omac777 | from a distance. I de-activated my account with reddit reason being "too much censorship". I suspect the rust reddit moderator being a Microserf. Thank you for listening. | Jun 17 13:09 |
| schestowitz | hi | Jun 17 13:11 |
| schestowitz | some people in Mozilla are from Microsoft | Jun 17 13:11 |
| schestowitz | that's an issue | Jun 17 13:11 |
| MinceR | i don't even care about rust, it has the same freedom issue as failfox | Jun 17 13:12 |
| omac777 | Have a look at how many messages were deleted in there. https://old.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/h84zwp/microsoft_rust_is_the_industrys_best_chance_at/ | Jun 17 13:12 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-old.reddit.com | Microsoft: Rust Is the Industry’s ‘Best Chance’ at Safe Systems Programming : rust | Jun 17 13:12 | |
| omac777 | my username in old.reddit.com was also omac777 | Jun 17 13:12 |
| MinceR | also, people keep advertising it as a replacement to C++, when it can't even do multiple inheritance | Jun 17 13:12 |
| omac777 | There are no longer messages within that thread posted by omac777(myself)...because they deleted them all over "being over zealous" toward Microsoft. | Jun 17 13:13 |
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| schestowitz | wow | Jun 17 13:14 |
| schestowitz | can you sent screenshot if they're still shown when you are logged in? | Jun 17 13:14 |
| schestowitz | preferably the whole page | Jun 17 13:14 |
| schestowitz | with the missing messages | Jun 17 13:14 |
| schestowitz | we'll reproduce them in techright | Jun 17 13:14 |
| omac777 | No I have none of that history. I'm sorry. | Jun 17 13:14 |
| schestowitz | *techrights even | Jun 17 13:14 |
| schestowitz | maybe Google Cache? | Jun 17 13:14 |
| omac777 | perhaps. hangon. | Jun 17 13:14 |
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| schestowitz | thenewstack is not a news site | Jun 17 13:15 |
| schestowitz | it's sponsored spam site | Jun 17 13:15 |
| schestowitz | can't recall whether Microsoft is one of the sponsors | Jun 17 13:15 |
| schestowitz | but it's a hoax news site, you pay to be covered | Jun 17 13:15 |
| schestowitz | they have media kit | Jun 17 13:16 |
| schestowitz | and they call it something like partner, or some other term I forgot | Jun 17 13:16 |
| omac777 | No, I'm not familiar with the time travel within google cache. | Jun 17 13:16 |
| omac777 | I deactivated my account over this, but I just wanted to let you know something is up with reddit.com and rust moderators. | Jun 17 13:17 |
| schestowitz | if you did not terminate your account fully, you may still be able to recover those messages | Jun 17 13:18 |
| *smnthermes (976c22869c@xmpp.snopyta.org) has left #techrights | Jun 17 13:18 | |
| schestowitz | with context | Jun 17 13:18 |
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| schestowitz | the full page is not of much interest, it's a puff pieces and idiotc nodding | Jun 17 13:18 |
| schestowitz | having eliminated all signs of dissent | Jun 17 13:18 |
| schestowitz | reddit has long been like that | Jun 17 13:18 |
| omac777 | https://www.reddit.com/search/?q=author%3Aomac777 | Jun 17 13:18 |
| schestowitz | it's conde nast-owned, they kicked Linus out for 1.5 months | Jun 17 13:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-reddit.com: search results - author:omac777 | Jun 17 13:18 | |
| omac777 | no posts exist anymore. | Jun 17 13:18 |
| omac777 | I deactivated my account. | Jun 17 13:19 |
| schestowitz | can you reactive still, temporarily? | Jun 17 13:19 |
| schestowitz | I want screenshots of their reply to you | Jun 17 13:19 |
| schestowitz | it's a good topic to cover as we've long argued this rust attitude is really terrible | Jun 17 13:19 |
| schestowitz | they also have github-hosted glean and others, basically mozilla spyware | Jun 17 13:19 |
| schestowitz | hosted by microsoft | Jun 17 13:20 |
| omac777 | nope I can't. It's done. It's permanent. That's ok. | Jun 17 13:20 |
| schestowitz | ok, in that case | Jun 17 13:20 |
| schestowitz | can you expand the above opening message? | Jun 17 13:20 |
| schestowitz | Recalling from memory your argument and their response? | Jun 17 13:20 |
| schestowitz | as best you remember? | Jun 17 13:20 |
| omac777 | I summarized the detail accurately above. | Jun 17 13:21 |
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| schestowitz | ok, I'll see what to do with it, maybe tomorrow after I work | Jun 17 13:22 |
| XRevan86 | It looks like they want adoption and traction no matter from whom, and you were spoiling their groove %) | Jun 17 13:22 |
| schestowitz | also: | Jun 17 13:22 |
| schestowitz | can you confirm is any of the moderators are msft employees? | Jun 17 13:22 |
| schestowitz | or just flairs? | Jun 17 13:22 |
| schestowitz | or mozilla employees | Jun 17 13:22 |
| omac777 | in further posting I was perhaps rude and mentioned "rape" as a word to depict how they treated certain companies that had suits against them which led to the my downvoting points and being labelled as "over-zealous" and they mentioned the rule "zealotry". that's the best I can do. | Jun 17 13:22 |
| schestowitz | that's BS | Jun 17 13:23 |
| schestowitz | corporations that bomb people | Jun 17 13:23 |
| schestowitz | call their opponents zealots | Jun 17 13:23 |
| schestowitz | that's corporate BS | Jun 17 13:23 |
| XRevan86 | Has Microsoft's ICE collaboration been all forgiven? | Jun 17 13:23 |
| omac777 | I have no idea about who moderates old.reddit.com/r/rust but the moderator sounded diplomatic and simply wanted to enforce reddit's rules or make it seem so from my perspective. | Jun 17 13:24 |
| schestowitz | this is what cocs are about | Jun 17 13:24 |
| schestowitz | and why they're so controversial | Jun 17 13:24 |
| schestowitz | corporations love cocs because these help muzzle their critics | Jun 17 13:24 |
| omac777 | None of my words were inciting violence. My words were inciting vigilance. | Jun 17 13:24 |
| XRevan86 | Maybe they paid their moral debts by removing the word "master" from GitHub. | Jun 17 13:24 |
| schestowitz | and they blackmail projects into adpting their drafted cocs | Jun 17 13:24 |
| schestowitz | "or else we won't participate" | Jun 17 13:24 |
| schestowitz | XRevan86: separate issue | Jun 17 13:25 |
| schestowitz | they were not even the first | Jun 17 13:25 |
| schestowitz | kde devs wrote about it days prior... | Jun 17 13:25 |
| XRevan86 | schestowitz: That's tied into "Microsoft is no longer that bad corporation it used to be" | Jun 17 13:25 |
| XRevan86 | Not the first, yes. | Jun 17 13:25 |
| XRevan86 | I think GNOME was the first. | Jun 17 13:26 |
| omac777 | to be clear I was simply telling rust redditors to remain vigilant toward Microsoft and I get downvoted and censored to the point they need to delete my posts. So I decided too much censorship and deactivated my reddit.com account. | Jun 17 13:26 |
| schestowitz | ok, cheers | Jun 17 13:26 |
| schestowitz | better to screenshot evidence if you do this | Jun 17 13:26 |
| schestowitz | i know I would... | Jun 17 13:26 |
| schestowitz | i hate reddit's censorship, it's very corporate-leaning | Jun 17 13:27 |
| omac777 | The data is probably still on reddit databases somewhere. | Jun 17 13:27 |
| omac777 | does the wayback machine cover this? | Jun 17 13:27 |
| schestowitz | and they're infested with these corporations, without disclosure | Jun 17 13:27 |
| schestowitz | no, wayback machine isn't good for caching SHORT term | Jun 17 13:27 |
| omac777 | Very interesting... | Jun 17 13:27 |
| schestowitz | you can try google caching your account | Jun 17 13:28 |
| schestowitz | syntax is webcache: iirc | Jun 17 13:28 |
| omac777 | ok | Jun 17 13:28 |
| schestowitz | it would be interesting to see who talked you down | Jun 17 13:28 |
| schestowitz | if a moderator, maybe a footdsoldiers of mozilla warriors | Jun 17 13:28 |
| schestowitz | who lie constantly about privacy | Jun 17 13:28 |
| omac777 | Well the best way would be to repeat the process on the same topic using a different username | Jun 17 13:32 |
| omac777 | It just can't be me. | Jun 17 13:33 |
| schestowitz | a lot of hassle, too | Jun 17 13:36 |
| psydread | is this a case of MS trying to take over Rust? | Jun 17 13:39 |
| psydread | or rather of MS and Mozilla colluding to nip Rust in the bud? | Jun 17 13:40 |
| MinceR | rust is mozilla's project | Jun 17 13:40 |
| psydread | I know | Jun 17 13:40 |
| psydread | but why would Mozilla allow MS to infiltrate it? | Jun 17 13:40 |
| omac777 | At least you can understand my perspective though. Simply wanting to warn other rust users should be vigilant toward Microsoft. Their opinion shouldn't be deemed in high regard since they have a history with suits against them I stated 3 particular ones. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_litigation The stac electronic, the java j++ Sun VS | Jun 17 13:41 |
| omac777 | MS, Znix... your own link but I used another coming from a book anti trust again microsoft http://techrights.org/2010/05/25/microsoft-sco-and-then-acacia/ https://mitpress.mit.edu/books/microsoft-antitrust-cases | Jun 17 13:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | Microsoft litigation - Wikipedia | Jun 17 13:41 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Microsoft Attacks Linux Competition Using Lawsuits and Threats (With Software Patents), Pays Acacia/IP Innovation After Anti-Linux Lawsuit | Techrights | Jun 17 13:41 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-mitpress.mit.edu | The Microsoft Antitrust Cases | The MIT Press | Jun 17 13:41 | |
| MinceR | maybe they get paid for it | Jun 17 13:41 |
| schestowitz | afaik, microsoft already eee'd rust months ago | Jun 17 13:41 |
| schestowitz | mozilla does not seem to mind | Jun 17 13:42 |
| psydread | that must be a really desperate move | Jun 17 13:42 |
| MinceR | or they're just as naive as the lusers who bought the "Microsoft <3 Linux" bullshit campaign | Jun 17 13:42 |
| schestowitz | it even does all the coding on Microsoft's servers | Jun 17 13:42 |
| schestowitz | mozilla is a basket case | Jun 17 13:42 |
| psydread | and if they allow it, it means we'll have to find another nextgen programming language that isn't infected with the MS virus | Jun 17 13:42 |
| schestowitz | they'll infect it too | Jun 17 13:43 |
| schestowitz | they always try to | Jun 17 13:43 |
| schestowitz | this is what cults do | Jun 17 13:43 |
| MinceR | or forget the nextgen hype and learn lisp | Jun 17 13:43 |
| schestowitz | and look at where Microsoft came from | Jun 17 13:43 |
| omac777 | As I stated before, I'm not inciting violence. I'm giving advice to be vigilant...and some moderator seeing my post stated I am over-zealous dinged me with -89 points and deleted my post mentioning the above links. WOW. I couldn't believe it. This isn't inciting violence. Why on earth is reddit and their rust moderator doing this? | Jun 17 13:43 |
| schestowitz | maybe a Microsoft employee | Jun 17 13:43 |
| schestowitz | but unless we have screenshot | Jun 17 13:44 |
| psydread | my Reddit karma is -99 and will stay like that forever | Jun 17 13:44 |
| schestowitz | all we have is a page full of praise | Jun 17 13:44 |
| schestowitz | and we cannot check who did what, like deleting a comment | Jun 17 13:44 |
| XRevan86 | omac777: New feature-rich native languages without a heavy runtime? | Jun 17 13:45 |
| psydread | a page full of praise is a page that is entirely fake | Jun 17 13:45 |
| *XRevan86 doesn't know any. | Jun 17 13:45 | |
| XRevan86 | If heavy runtime is not a factor, then Crystal and Google's Go. | Jun 17 13:45 |
| omac777 | I'm a rust fan. It's indeed full of merit. It's fully capable now in Linux. | Jun 17 13:46 |
| psydread | maybe that is the reason why MS had to eee it | Jun 17 13:46 |
| omac777 | Rust got the macro capability right. Zig might be safer to use than Rust "unsafe" which makes Zig very interesting too. | Jun 17 13:46 |
| XRevan86 | psydread: MS stated it themselves, that they're interested in a language that can produce efficient code but isn't, well, C or C++. | Jun 17 13:47 |
| psydread | I just started reading a book on Rust a few weeks ago, I will resume that shortly | Jun 17 13:47 |
| omac777 | Zig doesn't have all the written libraries giving practical capabilities though. Rust has grpc, rocket/actix, latest tls, rust-qt(GUI). The only thing truly not documented yet is how to write device drivers in rust for linux, but it's being worked on though. | Jun 17 13:48 |
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| XRevan86 | omac777: Have you looked at Haskell? Just asking :) | Jun 17 13:49 |
| omac777 | Rust could be see as a threat to Microsoft since it's better than Microsoft tooling to be honest. | Jun 17 13:49 |
| schestowitz | they want to control everything | Jun 17 13:50 |
| schestowitz | even linux | Jun 17 13:50 |
| omac777 | THAT is why Microsoft is embracing it as it did web. | Jun 17 13:50 |
| schestowitz | even gnu, in github | Jun 17 13:50 |
| schestowitz | and the kernel | Jun 17 13:50 |
| schestowitz | the tech version of "full spectrum dominance" | Jun 17 13:50 |
| XRevan86 | omac777: I don't think that they'd try to destroy Rust, but they will try to own it. | Jun 17 13:50 |
| schestowitz | they already do it | Jun 17 13:50 |
| MinceR | everything is better than microsloth tooling | Jun 17 13:50 |
| schestowitz | I mentioned it months ago | Jun 17 13:50 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft 'extends' Rust | Jun 17 13:50 |
| schestowitz | whicb is easier for them because they control rust, it is on github | Jun 17 13:51 |
| schestowitz | they can ban 'toxic' devs | Jun 17 13:51 |
| schestowitz | or people who voice scepticism | Jun 17 13:51 |
| schestowitz | they control the communications there too | Jun 17 13:51 |
| psydread | is there a way to fork Rust (retroactively)? | Jun 17 13:51 |
| MinceR | yes | Jun 17 13:51 |
| MinceR | you can clone their repo from shithub | Jun 17 13:51 |
| schestowitz | rusky fork | Jun 17 13:51 |
| schestowitz | don't go there | Jun 17 13:51 |
| schestowitz | don't bite | Jun 17 13:51 |
| MinceR | rename it and strip it of the trademark policy and you have a free language | Jun 17 13:51 |
| MinceR | still no multiple inheritance though | Jun 17 13:51 |
| schestowitz | and then microsoft will ban the fork for 'zealotry' | Jun 17 13:51 |
| psydread | that's what I was thinking | Jun 17 13:52 |
| MinceR | they can't, if it's not on shithub | Jun 17 13:52 |
| schestowitz | they already censor Microsoft critics now | Jun 17 13:52 |
| schestowitz | i saw some examples | Jun 17 13:52 |
| XRevan86 | polish, because without rust | Jun 17 13:52 |
| MinceR | :) | Jun 17 13:52 |
| MinceR | "do you speak polish?" | Jun 17 13:52 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: kurwa | Jun 17 13:52 |
| schestowitz | maybe it's time to call it a day in Rust, if it's really that bad and too late. I just tell them to delete github every week | Jun 17 13:52 |
| omac777 | The rust + microsoft stuff isn't an issue. You can choose not to use it. You can choose to just use Linux and Rust and that's what I do. At work there are cases for using rust on windows for interoperability with all the mgmt types that use microsoft office stuff in the workflow...I co-exist/interoperate with it, but try my best to keep it to a | Jun 17 13:52 |
| omac777 | minimum. | Jun 17 13:52 |
| MinceR | :) | Jun 17 13:52 |
| XRevan86 | I know Slavic languages yet I still replied "kurwa" | Jun 17 13:53 |
| XRevan86 | that's the power of Polish | Jun 17 13:53 |
| schestowitz | polskurwa | Jun 17 13:53 |
| XRevan86 | omac777: Do you know the status of Rust adoption by GNOME? | Jun 17 13:53 |
| XRevan86 | I know a lot of people at GNOME have found Rust to be exactly what they wanted. | Jun 17 13:54 |
| omac777 | I love gtk-rs. Beautiful ! I should have mentioned it alongside rust-qt with vgtk too. | Jun 17 13:54 |
| omac777 | yes there are rust bindings for gui stuff. | Jun 17 13:55 |
| omac777 | yes there are rust bindings for gpu stuff too. | Jun 17 13:55 |
| XRevan86 | Maybe C++ wouldn't've been this much frowned upon in GNOME if gtkmm weren't such an obsolete piece of… | Jun 17 13:56 |
| omac777 | grpc/go are awesome too, but the gui story in golang is weaker imho. | Jun 17 13:56 |
| XRevan86 | omac777: It indeed is. | Jun 17 13:56 |
| schestowitz | https://this-week-in-rust.org/blog/2020/06/16/this-week-in-rust-343/ | Jun 17 13:58 |
| schestowitz | latest | Jun 17 13:58 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-this-week-in-rust.org | This Week in Rust 343 · This Week in Rust | Jun 17 13:58 | |
| schestowitz | for today's next batch of Daily Linls | Jun 17 13:58 |
| schestowitz | github mentioned so many times | Jun 17 13:59 |
| schestowitz | "openly develpers" | Jun 17 13:59 |
| schestowitz | yeah... in proprietary platform with Microsoft spying | Jun 17 13:59 |
| schestowitz | openly... developed | Jun 17 13:59 |
| schestowitz | in a prison | Jun 17 13:59 |
| schestowitz | some people already complained about the rust coc excluding | Jun 17 14:00 |
| schestowitz | and guess what they got for it... | Jun 17 14:00 |
| omac777 | My brain appreciates all the work done in gnu/gcc/g++/clang/clang++/llvm/lld/ll debugger. BUT Rust really is a joy even without multi-inheritance. I love duck-typing(golang concept) within rust. | Jun 17 14:00 |
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| psydread | my concern is what is going to happen to things like Redox now. They moved away to their own Gitlab instances a year or two ago and now MS is embracing the very programming language the entire operating system is written in | Jun 17 14:01 |
| psydread | instance* | Jun 17 14:01 |
| XRevan86 | psydread: (why do I keep mentioning C++?) C++ has "auto", uses of which were extended a lot starting with C++14 | Jun 17 14:03 |
| XRevan86 | pretty ducky to me | Jun 17 14:03 |
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| omac777 | the ducky doesn't imply auto typing. In fact I abhor auto-typing within rust. I prefer explicit types not variants. auto is like a variant, but it leaves room for stuff being auto-converted when returning stuff to other caller functions using different types. It wastes lots of cpu time converting between types everywhere. It also leaves room | Jun 17 14:06 |
| omac777 | for a lot of incorrect values being returned too. | Jun 17 14:06 |
| psydread | XRevan86, I know, I've also reading Stroustrup's book from 2018 to catch up with modern C++ syntax, as I needed some of it to write some threading code | Jun 17 14:06 |
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| omac777 | the duck-typing for me simply makes functions available for structures without having to exist within the structure itself. it feels like interfaces....in fact in golang everything is an interface and this is how they manage to make all this magic work. In Rust it actually can be made to work in the very same way which is awesome. | Jun 17 14:10 |
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| XRevan86 | psydread: C++20 introduced a lot more stuff %) | Jun 17 14:13 |
| psydread | XRevant86, I'll catch up with that later, C++17 is ok for now 🙂 | Jun 17 14:13 |
| omac777 | Redox is amazing as a concept. Redox is coming to fruition. they have the gui, they have the network. It runs in a vm. REDOX needs more devs that know what they're doing though. It also need more documentation for regular users to build it and adopt it. | Jun 17 14:14 |
| XRevan86 | omac777: Can you give an example in Rust? | Jun 17 14:14 |
| omac777 | https://www.ultrasaurus.com/2020/01/duck-typing-in-rust-trait-vs-type/ in this case the to_string() could have been quack() and walk() | Jun 17 14:17 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-duck typing in rust: trait vs type « the evolving ultrasaurus | Jun 17 14:17 | |
| schestowitz | mind js and typescript | Jun 17 14:18 |
| schestowitz | microsoft is still doing its java operandi | Jun 17 14:18 |
| schestowitz | and it leverages github to fake popularity of its stuff | Jun 17 14:18 |
| schestowitz | fake 'studied' and 'surveys' | Jun 17 14:18 |
| schestowitz | *studies | Jun 17 14:18 |
| schestowitz | to entice devs to join based on fiction | Jun 17 14:18 |
| omac777 | It's not the best example but essential of a typed struct with a member value is there. Then the function is made available for that type structure later on. let's quack() the first day. then walk() is added the next day(). It's beautiful just like go. C/C++ have these implicitly, but they usually imply that it needs to be embedded within the | Jun 17 14:19 |
| omac777 | class/struct. In golang/rust they are not within the struct. | Jun 17 14:19 |
| omac777 | quack()/walk() are not within the struct in rust/golang. They sit outside of the struct. For long-term maintenance, this is better. | Jun 17 14:19 |
| omac777 | gotta go. | Jun 17 14:20 |
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| liberty_box | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVtTCBH_Jug | Jun 17 16:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Olare's Story | Sheldrick Trust - YouTube | Jun 17 16:52 | |
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| XRevan86 | It's strange to see this many Russians taking a racist stance regarding protests in the US. Ate up all the coverage from Russian television. I didn't see it, but from what I hear, it's pretty close to what Fox News sells. | Jun 17 17:30 |
| XRevan86 | Nothing personal, just that Putin needs another example of why protesting is the worst thing ever. | Jun 17 17:30 |
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| XRevan86 | So https://youtu.be/u2Ntz-JdH5Q?t=1m39s ("we do not want events similiar to what happened in Paris") | Jun 17 17:34 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-YouTube | Jun 17 17:34 | |
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| XRevan86 | https://xkcd.com/2321 | Jun 17 17:47 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-xkcd: Low-Background Metal | Jun 17 17:47 | |
| schestowitz | [17:30] <XRevan86> Nothing personal, just that Putin needs another example of why protesting is the worst thing ever. | Jun 17 17:50 |
| schestowitz | yes, dictators don't like successful revolts | Jun 17 17:50 |
| schestowitz | they can - gasp - inspire people everywhere | Jun 17 17:50 |
| schestowitz | they're 'contagious' | Jun 17 17:50 |
| XRevan86 | schestowitz: Indeed. | Jun 17 17:51 |
| schestowitz | so you infiltrate them | Jun 17 17:51 |
| schestowitz | you misframe them | Jun 17 17:51 |
| schestowitz | no people with grievances | Jun 17 17:51 |
| XRevan86 | Even peaceful protests are outlawed, and this can serve as justification. Just frame it as horrid. | Jun 17 17:52 |
| schestowitz | just lootings, looters looking to burn stuff and get 'free stuff' | Jun 17 17:52 |
| schestowitz | but when US wants revolt for resgime change | Jun 17 17:52 |
| schestowitz | then the most abhorrent provocations are "for democracy" | Jun 17 17:52 |
| schestowitz | even Cubans who take down planes | Jun 17 17:52 |
| schestowitz | (venezuela was the same, Iran last year...) | Jun 17 17:53 |
| schestowitz | not Saudi | Jun 17 17:53 |
| schestowitz | beheaded atheists are OK | Jun 17 17:53 |
| schestowitz | because back thwn US needed cheap oil | Jun 17 17:54 |
| schestowitz | not anymore | Jun 17 17:54 |
| schestowitz | so they bail out n KSA now | Jun 17 17:54 |
| XRevan86 | schestowitz: God bless America | Jun 17 17:54 |
| XRevan86 | They did those atheists a favour, they will sin no more, will make their case less heavy in Hell. | Jun 17 17:55 |
| *XRevan86 wonders if some people still hold the aforementioned views… | Jun 17 17:55 | |
| XRevan86 | Maybe Saudis actually do. | Jun 17 17:57 |
| zoobab | we will launch a crowdfunding campaign to sack the UPC in Germany | Jun 17 18:05 |
| zoobab | I am looking at which "platform" to use | Jun 17 18:05 |
| zoobab | we need something basic, with a meter or something | Jun 17 18:05 |
| zoobab | and no 'fees' | Jun 17 18:05 |
| zoobab | gofundme seems to be require some credit card fees | Jun 17 18:06 |
| zoobab | any recommendation? | Jun 17 18:06 |
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| XRevan86 | https://github.com/openssl/openssl/issues/7482#issuecomment-645355341 renamed for some reason | Jun 17 19:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Support ESNI · Issue #7482 · openssl/openssl · GitHub | Jun 17 19:30 | |
| XRevan86 | I will say "where's my eSNI?" no more. | Jun 17 19:30 |
| XRevan86 | Where's my ECH? | Jun 17 19:30 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Anyway, back to sex toys. I really think the government should subsidize these instead of children. | Jun 17 19:46 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Think about it. They can pay a million dollars over 18 years in welfare and public schools or $1,500 one time to buy every man out there a real doll. | Jun 17 19:47 |
| DaemonFC[m] | As a carbon offset and population control strategy, you really can't knock it. | Jun 17 19:47 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I think it's kind of ridiculous that women have all of these birth control options and it's all bought and paid for by Uncle Sugar, including tubes tied. | Jun 17 19:48 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Women are rate limited as to how much they can get pregnant, but there are some men who go around and have kids with 5-6 different women. | Jun 17 19:48 |
| DaemonFC[m] | We're not really solving the problem by only giving women options and telling men that the condom is all they get and it has an 86% success rate if you use them right. | Jun 17 19:49 |
| DaemonFC[m] | 86% is obviously better than 0%, but it's not something that entirely eliminates the risk. | Jun 17 19:50 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Men should be able to get a vasectomy and their insurance should have to pay for it 100%. | Jun 17 19:50 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Deciding that you'll never have kids is not a bad decision. | Jun 17 19:50 |
| DaemonFC[m] | In fact, in light of the United States turning into Soylent Green levels of unemployed people overnight due to the criminal overreaction by state governments to tge virus, I think we really need two things now. | Jun 17 19:52 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Expand Social Security to Universal Basic Income and enact sweeping measures that remove all barriers to contraception. | Jun 17 19:53 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The virus is out there anyway and it'll kill about the same number of people, just over a longer timeframe. | Jun 17 19:53 |
| CrystalMath | <DaemonFC[m]> Men should be able to get a vasectomy and their insurance should have to pay for it 100%. <- amen to that! | Jun 17 19:54 |
| CrystalMath | err | Jun 17 19:54 |
| CrystalMath | wrong one | Jun 17 19:54 |
| CrystalMath | <DaemonFC[m]> Deciding that you'll never have kids is not a bad decision. | Jun 17 19:54 |
| CrystalMath | <DaemonFC[m]> Deciding that you'll never have kids is not a bad decision. <- amen to that | Jun 17 19:54 |
| CrystalMath | i think vasectomies are good but not forcing people to do something | Jun 17 19:54 |
| DaemonFC[m] | If I was straight and had kids when I was 16, they would be 20 years old now, if I did it at 18, they'd be 18, if I did it at 20, they'd be 16. | Jun 17 19:55 |
| DaemonFC[m] | In any event, they'd be aging into this fucking horseshit mess. | Jun 17 19:55 |
| DaemonFC[m] | They'd be inheriting a world that is the most fucked up it has ever been. | Jun 17 19:56 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Although in 2000-2006, it wouldn't have been as obvious because things seemed to be going well on the surface. | Jun 17 19:56 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I did them a giant favor by not having kids. They'll never exist so they wouldn't know that, but I did them a favor. | Jun 17 19:57 |
| kingoffrance | 9/11 was pretty insane, i dont think bush even his supported ran around like they do with trump saying he is really a genius with some mastermind plan...everyone just accepted bush II was an idiot | Jun 17 19:58 |
| kingoffrance | there was no "hes our last hope" etc. | Jun 17 19:58 |
| kingoffrance | so i agree somewhat, it was crazy, but not like now | Jun 17 19:58 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Bush had a 90% approval rating for a few months, and it faded when some people started realizing what Iraq would turn into. | Jun 17 19:59 |
| DaemonFC[m] | It was too late. | Jun 17 19:59 |
| kingoffrance | its just been lurching from crisis to crisis for a long time | Jun 17 20:00 |
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| kingoffrance | theres a red/orange/yellow/green meters for: air, covid, terror, ..... | Jun 17 20:00 |
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| kingoffrance | i predict whatever happens, they will do more of these color-coded crisis measurements | Jun 17 20:00 |
| kingoffrance | that does seem to be a constant | Jun 17 20:01 |
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| MinceR | https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/atm | Jun 17 20:43 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.smbc-comics.com | Saturday Morning Breakfast Cereal - ATM | Jun 17 20:43 | |
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| MinceR | https://ircz.de/p/2002283 | Jun 17 21:22 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4390849) | Jun 17 21:22 | |
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| DaemonFC[m] | <kingoffrance "theres a red/orange/yellow/green"> Lewis Black was talking about how nobody even knows what to do when they say orange alert or whatever. | Jun 17 22:36 |
| DaemonFC[m] | We've been on threat level Orange for the last few years now. | Jun 17 22:36 |
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| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Lenovo’s New ThinkPad P1 Gen3 for Professionals: OLED, 8-core Xeon, Quadro http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/138875 [https://pleroma.site/objects/97cb010a-3042-4e93-8f0e-e82027966ff4] | Jun 17 22:42 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/138876 [https://pleroma.site/objects/f8d26d8b-160e-4836-aeaf-36e9bca038ea] | Jun 17 22:43 | |
| MinceR | https://ircz.de/p/20022751 | Jun 17 22:43 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4390447) | Jun 17 22:43 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Stable Kernels: 5.7.3, 5.6.19, and 5.4.47 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/138877 [https://pleroma.site/objects/4d5b017a-9951-4c5f-b414-54bd21003bd7] | Jun 17 22:45 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Qualcomm’s Linux-driven robotics kit taps Snapdragon 865 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/138878 [https://pleroma.site/objects/55dea8a8-7c3c-4ebe-879f-f08f185b0566] | Jun 17 22:48 | |
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| psydroid | https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Windows-10-Intel-NVIDIA-WSL2 | Jun 17 22:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-NVIDIA, Intel Post New Windows 10 Graphics Drivers For WSL2 Linux App Support - Phoronix | Jun 17 22:52 | |
| schestowitz | see comments | Jun 17 22:52 |
| schestowitz | I did... | Jun 17 22:52 |
| psydroid | MS, Intel and Nvidia trying to put the genie back into the bottle | Jun 17 22:52 |
| schestowitz | zoobab: they all suck | Jun 17 22:54 |
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| schestowitz | psydroid: not many people use this anyway | Jun 17 22:55 |
| schestowitz | so I think phoronix may be helping Microsoft | Jun 17 22:55 |
| schestowitz | he also did an WSL-only benchmark yesterday | Jun 17 22:55 |
| schestowitz | which I think was pointless | Jun 17 22:55 |
| schestowitz | anything for traffic/hits | Jun 17 22:55 |
| psydroid | yes | Jun 17 22:55 |
| schestowitz | I confronted Michael about it | Jun 17 22:55 |
| schestowitz | he told me it's for "entertainment" | Jun 17 22:56 |
| DaemonFC[m] | So is pornhub and psychic hotlines. | Jun 17 22:56 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Gambling too, because the state doesn't want to admit it's encouraging a nasty addiction that leads to suffering. | Jun 17 22:57 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I knew marijuana would happen when the state was having a severe budget crisis. | Jun 17 22:57 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Double whammy. Tax money and dump out the prisons. | Jun 17 22:57 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Frame it as a social justice issue instead of "Illinois is too broke to keep maliciously prosecuting minorities in this particular way.". | Jun 17 22:58 |
| DaemonFC[m] | :) | Jun 17 22:58 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Trump had been desperately looking for a way to put the pin back in the COVID-19 grenade then decided to lob it at the governors and switch to "law and order" after the mass unemployment and police brutality sparked riots. | Jun 17 23:00 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | The worst of the AIDS epidemic didn't start to subside until people started wearing condoms because they saw what it was doing to people. | Jun 17 23:08 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The federal government was no help at all and most of the US contribution to the AIDS research of the 1980s was a fraud named Robert Gallo who claimed he isolated a virus that some French researchers sent him to study and then named it, incorrectly, HTLV III. | Jun 17 23:09 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Anyway, you'd think that people would wear a simple surgical mask if it was any sort of protection at all. | Jun 17 23:11 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I mean, the effort to get at least partial protection from the Coronavirus is minimal. | Jun 17 23:12 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | The Republicans are cheering on the prospect of a mass culling that will mostly affect them. | Jun 17 23:13 |
| DaemonFC[m] | By the time a vaccine gets a lid on this, upwards of 300,000 Americans will be dead. Maybe 400,000. | Jun 17 23:14 |
| MinceR | "hey grim reaper, lend me your sickle / the world needs some culling, blood needs to trickle!" | Jun 17 23:15 |
| DaemonFC[m] | That's almost as good as "Here I sit all brokenhearted. Came to shit, but only farted.". | Jun 17 23:17 |
| MinceR | :> | Jun 17 23:18 |
| MinceR | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGBHfXPqbgI | Jun 17 23:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Zlad - I Am The Anti-Pope - YouTube | Jun 17 23:18 | |
| XRevan86 | If pope means father… | Jun 17 23:19 |
| XRevan86 | anti-father… I got nothing | Jun 17 23:19 |
| psydroid | MS going after Rust, Gemini, ML etc. etc. | Jun 17 23:22 |
| MinceR | they also went after python, didn't they? | Jun 17 23:22 |
| psydroid | Github makes it much easier for them to figure out what to target | Jun 17 23:23 |
| psydroid | yes | Jun 17 23:23 |
| psydroid | offering courses to learn Python using Azure on EdX | Jun 17 23:23 |
| psydroid | I must say they do their infiltration job very well | Jun 17 23:24 |
| schestowitz | https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=AMD-Radeon-Software-For-WSL2 | Jun 17 23:24 |
| schestowitz | now amd also | Jun 17 23:24 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Radeon Software Adrenalin 2020 Edition Updated With WSL Support - Phoronix | Jun 17 23:24 | |
| psydroid | but once you see through it, you know to avoid it all like the plague | Jun 17 23:24 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/138871#comment-25538 | Jun 17 23:25 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Kernel and Graphics: IWD, Vulkan and Microsoft EEE | Tux Machines | Jun 17 23:25 | |
| psydroid | so Phoronix is becoming another Windows site | Jun 17 23:26 |
| psydroid | that's good to know | Jun 17 23:26 |
| MinceR | "is becoming"? | Jun 17 23:27 |
| MinceR | they've been attacking free OSes with their headlines for years | Jun 17 23:27 |
| psydroid | I've never see so many Windows headlines, though | Jun 17 23:28 |
| psydroid | or maybe I haven't been paying attention | Jun 17 23:28 |
| psydroid | I've always maintained that true solutions for Linux will come from companies that aren't tied to the Wintel ecosystem, but I have yet to see if and what a company such as Esperanto Technologies will come up with | Jun 17 23:31 |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today’s howtos http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/138880 [https://pleroma.site/objects/4e5579f3-5ff3-4e98-9dd1-fd12f74237c0] | Jun 17 23:35 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Best linux laptops for 2020 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/138881 [https://pleroma.site/objects/828c0fc8-daf3-49dc-b65f-895c0c305717] | Jun 17 23:44 | |
| schestowitz | wow, for wsl1 no user number change in over a year https://mspoweruser.com/3-5-million-windows-subsystem-for-linux-users-can-now-use-gpu-compute-from-linux-on-windows/ | Jun 17 23:46 |
| schestowitz | wsl2 is like 150k | Jun 17 23:46 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-3.5 million Windows Subsystem for Linux users can now use GPU Compute from Linux on Windows - MSPoweruser | Jun 17 23:46 | |
| schestowitz | this one is the same as ages ago | Jun 17 23:46 |
| schestowitz | so it is not growing | Jun 17 23:46 |
| schestowitz | psydroid: I agree with mincer | Jun 17 23:46 |
| schestowitz | it's a longstanding issue with Larabel | Jun 17 23:46 |
| schestowitz | I cannot convince him otherwise | Jun 17 23:47 |
| schestowitz | let me just dump these thoughts in IRC | Jun 17 23:47 |
| schestowitz | I have just checked news about "Linux", "ubuntu" etc. | Jun 17 23:47 |
| schestowitz | the usual culprits emplify wsl | Jun 17 23:47 |
| schestowitz | omgubuntu, phoronix | Jun 17 23:47 |
| schestowitz | even multiple times each | Jun 17 23:47 |
| DaemonFC[m] | schestowitz: At least I can do my psychiatrist appointments over the phone now. | Jun 17 23:47 |
| schestowitz | and it's over nothing of substance, it's hype campaign | Jun 17 23:47 |
| schestowitz | all in all about a dozen headline today | Jun 17 23:48 |
| schestowitz | so they are googlebombing again | Jun 17 23:48 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Instead of burning 4-5 gallons of gas and getting to go to lovely Chicago. | Jun 17 23:48 |
| schestowitz | writing about this would only give it more free publicity | Jun 17 23:48 |
| schestowitz | so maybe, at most, I'd make jokes/memes about it, without too much context as that would mean links and name recognition for this *SL crap | Jun 17 23:48 |
| schestowitz | even just naming it can help them | Jun 17 23:48 |
| schestowitz | brings their "mindshare" as they call it... | Jun 17 23:49 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC[m]: let's talk tech | Jun 17 23:49 |
| schestowitz | not your medical records | Jun 17 23:49 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Well, nobody can really stop Microsoft from doing WSL as long as they comply with the license. | Jun 17 23:49 |
| schestowitz | yes, but the media helps them | Jun 17 23:49 |
| schestowitz | like it helped "Open Source" | Jun 17 23:49 |
| schestowitz | it got people to stop speaking about free software for a while | Jun 17 23:49 |
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| schestowitz | now the MS-funded site amplify*WL | Jun 17 23:50 |
| MinceR | well, technically they're abusing the Linux brand | Jun 17 23:50 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Well, they gave me a choice between Zoom or a phone call. After everything I've heard of Zoom, I selected the phone call. | Jun 17 23:50 |
| MinceR | but they own the Microsoft Linux Foundation, so they aren't going to be sued for that | Jun 17 23:50 |
| schestowitz | like it's sooooo much better than this hippie Linux thing... more "professional" | Jun 17 23:50 |
| schestowitz | "the boss will love it!" | Jun 17 23:50 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: they are | Jun 17 23:50 |
| schestowitz | I have been saying it for ages, yet nobody else is willing to say the same | Jun 17 23:50 |
| schestowitz | they associate Vista10 with "LINUX" | Jun 17 23:50 |
| schestowitz | it causes blur and confusion | Jun 17 23:51 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I wonder how much code Microsoft "contributes" to Linux that actually furthers anything I want to do with it. | Jun 17 23:51 |
| schestowitz | for a while many thought MacOS was "like linux" | Jun 17 23:51 |
| MinceR | from what i've seen, the code they "contribute" is absolute garbage | Jun 17 23:51 |
| schestowitz | hyper-V, related stuff.... Phoronix says they want to merge WSL crap ... into the kernel! | Jun 17 23:51 |
| schestowitz | Where's Linus? | Jun 17 23:51 |
| schestowitz | Silenced to death? | Jun 17 23:51 |
| schestowitz | It would be "hate" to reject the PR | Jun 17 23:52 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Obviously, hyper-v has nothing to do with Linux. It doesn't affect you though because the module isn't used outside of Linux as a Windows guest, but the media played that up. Then brushed off the fact that the code was crap and that Novell paid Greg KH to fix it. | Jun 17 23:52 |
| schestowitz | (pull req, not public rel) | Jun 17 23:52 |
| MinceR | they did compromise the quality control of Linux to get it in, though | Jun 17 23:52 |
| schestowitz | it was a gpl violation too | Jun 17 23:52 |
| DaemonFC[m] | If anything, paying someone to fix hyper-v when they could be working on something else was a net negative for people who want to use Linux. | Jun 17 23:52 |
| MinceR | they used to not merge drivers that did something another driver was already doing | Jun 17 23:53 |
| schestowitz | about 18k lines of code, pushed by some microsofter with a danish name | Jun 17 23:53 |
| schestowitz | the whole thing is a mess | Jun 17 23:53 |
| MinceR | and i doubt that Linux would have accepted a patch that has /etc/init.d/network restart hardcoded into it back when it was independent | Jun 17 23:53 |
| schestowitz | but nobody talks about it | Jun 17 23:53 |
| schestowitz | I thought about pasting some links here | Jun 17 23:53 |
| schestowitz | but bot and people would give it more hits | Jun 17 23:53 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Srinivasan I think? | Jun 17 23:53 |
| MinceR | sounds indian | Jun 17 23:53 |
| schestowitz | we need to send the message people have no interest in this EEE plot, and won't participate | Jun 17 23:54 |
| schestowitz | I don't want to start fighting with sites over it, like I did back in the mono days any time a journo boosted it in linux | Jun 17 23:54 |
| schestowitz | *inside | Jun 17 23:54 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC[m]: that's different work | Jun 17 23:54 |
| schestowitz | I have not even come across his name for years | Jun 17 23:54 |
| schestowitz | maybe he made himself obsolete, having become associated with MSFT entryism | Jun 17 23:55 |
| schestowitz | and iirc he may have worked for novell prior to that | Jun 17 23:55 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Microsoft is clearly on the way out. They tried to mimic Apple's business model of consumer stuff and that went nowhere because Windows and the Zune and Windows Phone were horrid and nobody was going to pay premiums for junk that doesn't work right. | Jun 17 23:55 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The servicing stack in Windows has deteriorated to its worst state ever. At least you could make Windows 7 updates install usually. | Jun 17 23:56 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Now they have this idea that they'll be an alternative to IBM or AWS. | Jun 17 23:56 |
| MinceR | we'll need more non-x86 non-uefi computers to be able to get rid of microsloth | Jun 17 23:56 |
| MinceR | maybe just non-uefi if some x86 licensee is willing to make non-hostile CPUs | Jun 17 23:56 |
| DaemonFC[m] | schestowitz: The idea that there are pro-Microsoft trolls that aren't being paid is hilarious considering that their stuff barely even works at all if you're lucky. | Jun 17 23:57 |
| MinceR | they get paid in gratis licenses | Jun 17 23:57 |
| DaemonFC[m] | People love things that work, not things that make their lives more frustrating. | Jun 17 23:57 |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games: GOG, Star Renegades, Steam and Across The Grooves http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/138882 [https://pleroma.site/objects/706b279a-2014-4c30-9999-9d1ff3c04fb8] | Jun 17 23:57 | |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC[m]: reverse bribes | Jun 17 23:58 |
| schestowitz | they might get hired for something later | Jun 17 23:58 |
| schestowitz | rewarded AFTER the act | Jun 17 23:58 |
| DaemonFC[m] | If WavPack was still proprietary, I would have steered clear of it for the same reason I've stayed clear of other formats that depend on non-Free software. | Jun 17 23:58 |
| schestowitz | people learn to breathe in rich people's farts | Jun 17 23:58 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I don't want a program that litters my hard drive with files I may never be able to get the data back out of. People say such concerns are crazy. | Jun 17 23:59 |
| schestowitz | assuming it might spread some money their way | Jun 17 23:59 |
| schestowitz | and those aren't the people you want to associate with... there's an ethnic correlation too ime | Jun 17 23:59 |
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