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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: September 13th, 2008

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schestowitzBad news for Microsoft and Novell: http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp...Sep 13 06:29
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schestowitzHa! http://www.dabcc.com/article.aspx?id=8564 Maybe that's the interesting announcement Crosby has promised. And people used to ridicule us for suggesting Xen was a bad route, just like choosing Novell (which too can end up this way).Sep 13 07:11
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kentmalast night of the proms tonight...Sep 13 11:40
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twitterIt would be nice to see fraud cases, but the US Justice system is deeply corrupted by the Bush administration and corporate cronies.Sep 13 13:55
twitterThe DOJ  has consistently fired people for political reasons and nailed people who stand in the way of the rich and powerful.Sep 13 13:56
twitterGreg Palast has an interesting example of this kind of thing here,  http://www.gregpalast.com/elliot-spitz...Sep 13 13:57
twitterOne of the first things the Bush administration did is let M$ off the hook.  I expect these fraud cases to work in M$'s favor, against competitors such as Google and Yahoo, rather than provide justice.Sep 13 13:58
schestowitzkentma: what type?Sep 13 14:01
schestowitztwitter: I assume that almost every company is fraudulent (Apple got dinged quite recently). The question is: to what extent?  Finding it out and showing proof is the challenge and it's something you can help me document. There are many people who use the Web to do research. If evidence is presented, it helps them. Transparency is bliss, which is why I adore Wikileaks.Sep 13 14:03
trmancohttp://www.techoozie.com/grateful-f...Sep 13 14:06
schestowitzI never saw it before (July)Sep 13 14:08
trmancofound it on stumbleuponSep 13 14:09
twitterDon't like it.  Paints GNU/Linux users as an obnoxious minority.  M$ Office users are far worse.Sep 13 14:09
schestowitzIt names "3%" as a figure (which is probably wrong), neglecting to mention that "computer" != "desktop". It's playing right into the hands of the FUD factories.Sep 13 14:09
schestowitztwitter: when a population grow big (or seen as big), then it's not seen as "rebellious"Sep 13 14:10
schestowitz*grows.               BTW,  this is why it's important for Microsoft to lies with Gartner mouth pieces, e.g. in Brazil.  Vendors don't entertain "rebels", but they address niche or market.Sep 13 14:10
twitterOffice users are not rebellious, they are obnoxious conformists.Sep 13 14:11
schestowitzYes, I know the feeling.Sep 13 14:11
schestowitzI insisted on doing my presentations with ODF back in 2005 or 2004Sep 13 14:11
schestowitzI had to pressure them and waste my time merely to facilitate it.Sep 13 14:12
schestowitzAnd they still thought in terms of /applications/, not standards. Ultimately I did a lot of presentation in Web based ways... JS+CSS+HTML mostly.Sep 13 14:12
schestowitzToday we have Google Apps, but it was all about D-I-Y back in the days. Let me find some quote.Sep 13 14:13
schestowitz"everytime you say things like this i just think of that cult of people who send around .doc files. i dont want to communicate with people who talk in .doc format, but they do not wish to use something else, so they discredit those without word." --Ed, c.o.l.a.Sep 13 14:13
twitterThings are finally changing.Sep 13 14:14
twitterIt does not make sense to expect others to spend $450 just to cooperate with you.Sep 13 14:15
twitterStill, I had a conversation with a passive M$ cultist the other day.  A post doc, he was happy student fees purchased the latest and greatest M$ toxins for him.Sep 13 14:16
schestowitzI got a toxic .doc a couple of days ago, which i rarely (months since the last time, I think). It's a job opening, but I rejected iot.Sep 13 14:17
twitterThe poor devil wasted weeks of his time setting up Power Point to do posters for students at a national conference.  You would think such life sucking would teach him to look for the right tool for the job...Sep 13 14:17
schestowitzThere should be more presentation standards.Sep 13 14:18
twitterGoogle does presentations?Sep 13 14:19
schestowitzThat whole pack-and-go thing is a nightmare and collaborating with Microsoft-only people (blame schools) is even worse. When you swap documents back and forth, you know? I look forward to more Web-based collab where you just send a URLSep 13 14:19
schestowitztwitter: yes. I'll fetch an examplew.Sep 13 14:19
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/... (scroll down)Sep 13 14:20
twitterODF has a presentation standard, I think.  It should be an easy thing to tell people to use ODF and submit it if you won't just let them plug their laptop in.Sep 13 14:20
twitterSooner or later, they won't be able to maintain the stacked panel.  There are too many better options.Sep 13 14:22
schestowitzOne conference that the OSI mentioned accepts ODF as a priority.Sep 13 14:22
schestowitzMicrosoft has had its feet dragged, but it had already corrupted the system and abused people to get there.Sep 13 14:23
twitterNow I see.  Iceweasel 3.0.1 does your presentation, my version of konqueror does not.  Is it flash based?Sep 13 14:25
schestowitzGot J enabled?Sep 13 14:28
schestowitzIt needs to allow JS from Google.Sep 13 14:28
schestowitzI used to do them the DIY-ish way with S5: http://schestowitz.com/Research/Progress/Repor...Sep 13 14:29
twitterSame story, but works better than Google in IW.Sep 13 14:31
schestowitzGoogle is not standards-compliant.Sep 13 14:31
schestowitzhttp://radar.oreilly.com/2008/05/g...Sep 13 14:32
schestowitzhttp://www.computerworlduk.com/community...Sep 13 14:32
twitterGoogle wanted me to sign in to get the full page presentation.  That's not something I'd want to force on conference people.Sep 13 14:32
twitterDIY has lots of advantages, thanks for sharing.Sep 13 14:32
schestowitzAlso look at the source code of their search results. It's a bloody mess (they tailor it for speed and test with particular browsers using hacks)Sep 13 14:32
twitterI think I recently read read Stallman saying, "**** speed"Sep 13 14:36
twitter:)Sep 13 14:36
schestowitzthe drug?Sep 13 14:36
twitterNo, as a reason to abandon your freedom.Sep 13 14:36
schestowitz:)Sep 13 14:36
schestowitzI was joking.Sep 13 14:36
schestowitzHe's all about convenience vs compromise.Sep 13 14:37
schestowitzHe must be using his OLPC by now.Sep 13 14:37
twitterAsk your cardiologist about speed ....Sep 13 14:37
schestowitzCardiologists prescribe some more CPU.Sep 13 14:37
schestowitz"Ask your nearest pharmacy for 2mg of RAM and take twice a day before a heavy 'meal'". Keep away from Vista.Sep 13 14:38
twitterI know a cardiologist who's had to tell truckers, usually 30 to 40 years old, that they have only a few months left to live.Sep 13 14:40
schestowitzWhy truckers?Sep 13 14:40
twitterThey use speed to stay awake.Sep 13 14:41
twitterKills them.Sep 13 14:41
schestowitzYikes.Sep 13 14:41
schestowitzProbably similar to those 'athletes' on steroids.Sep 13 14:41
twitterBasically, they end up with a worn out heart.  By the time they notice it's too late.Sep 13 14:41
twitterSteroids, ask Arnie about quad bypass.Sep 13 14:42
schestowitzLOLSep 13 14:42
schestowitzIt's a sick world of sports out there.Sep 13 14:42
twitterit is sick.Sep 13 14:43
schestowitzI'd hate to be a professional athlete because everyone seems to be cheating somehow. And Arnie thrives in a population that think Hollywood heroes make political heroes.Sep 13 14:43
schestowitz*thinksSep 13 14:43
twitterThe more rights you lose, the more the world looks like the Soviet Union or E. Germany did.  Athletes are little more than slaves, pumped up for their owners temporary enjoyment.Sep 13 14:44
schestowitzIIRC, CA has a hugely considerable debt. As for RAM, side effects might include appetite for 64-bit. Else you die!Sep 13 14:44
schestowitzhttp://digg.com/linux_unix/Novell_Keeps... "I wonder, will we soon be seeing the same thing happen to Novell as happened to VMware? Like one morning the CEO (Hovsepian?) will be informed by the BOD that he's been voted out and replaced by a 'former' Microsoft employee?"Sep 13 15:09
schestowitz"To be honest, the Novell/MS deal is the strangest thing. It makes no sense on many levels, and stinks (or should that be Smells Beastly?) all the way around...there's got to be more going on."Sep 13 15:09
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kentmaproms last night tonight...Sep 13 17:41
schestowitzhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proms ?Sep 13 17:44
neighborlee interesting: http://live.gnome.org/Tomboy/Win32 : sandyarmsrtrong ( liink on some lines or at bottom of the page )..mono app to run on windows...sandy works for novel..hm what a surprise ;)Sep 13 17:46
schestowitzWhen Microsoft buys Novell, it wants to ensure it gets some useful wares for its money. /sarcasmSep 13 17:47
neighborleeLOL yeahSep 13 17:50
neighborleeI learned that zim is a good replacement for tomboy..Sep 13 17:50
neighborleeso thats one less problemSep 13 17:51
neighborleefspot,,most seem to feel gthumb is fineSep 13 17:51
neighborleebeyond that,,,there are suggetions im seeing, that install phase could 'ask' : no mono as I dont trust anything coming from M$ atm, or : sure fine install mono Im a risk taker LOL ( something along those lines, you get the idea)Sep 13 17:53
schestowitzBut that's you. What happens to people who get Ubuntu Remix for instance?Sep 13 17:54
schestowitzIt's taited with Mono, you know, and it's not trivial to remove. People will get dependent on it and Microsoft will later roar over Mono.Sep 13 17:54
neighborleewell if ubuntu devs can't be convinced to remove mono entirely, this install question might be all we have atm.Sep 13 17:55
neighborleewell mark shuttleworth too, he's fine with mono as I recallSep 13 17:56
schestowitzIt's the same with Novell. Right now it's harvesting/feeding the pig. It makes .NET more widespread and it's trying to ruin Red Hat. Later it'll get around to slaughtering the pig for dinner (bye Novell/SUSE Linux and pay up for Mono).Sep 13 17:56
schestowitzneighborlee: based on the wrong assumption. As PJ stressed as well, Mark S doesn't understand how companies and trolls coopertae.Sep 13 17:57
neighborleenothing woiuld surprise meSep 13 17:57
schestowitz*cooperateSep 13 17:57
neighborleeyup I knowSep 13 17:57
neighborlee:(Sep 13 17:57
schestowitzHe thinks that trolls are an issue, so Microsoft is not. Well, Microsoft has trolls lying around out there with Microsoft employees. Gates even invests in them!Sep 13 17:57
neighborleeyupSep 13 17:58
schestowitzkentma: forget about the Proms. Hard-beat pop and 'soft pr0n' music videos for teenagers take over. Case of point:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qpz0VcDuR4g . Get used to it. Even Charlotte Church ran back to cigarettes and drags, swearing and shouting instead of producing music. CC can hopefully save us from the moguls' 'meat market' productions and ISP police state.Sep 13 18:00
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neighborleeLOL, someone referred to 'estoppel' as evidence that the 'promise' not to sue in Ecma IS ENOUGH to trust mono..ROFL :)))Sep 13 18:07
neighborleeim laughing so hard ;)Sep 13 18:07
schestowitzWhere's that?Sep 13 18:08
neighborleethe wording on the estoppel wiki used a example of creditor/debtor, and if creditor let debtor off hook of a loan, then : ' the creditor may be estopped from collecting the debt" <LOLSep 13 18:09
neighborleepastingSep 13 18:09
neighborleehttp://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/110/Sep 13 18:09
schestowitzI think I'll do a cartoon about this. :-)Sep 13 18:09
neighborleeeropple  's commentSep 13 18:09
neighborleeROFLSep 13 18:09
neighborleeits just laughableSep 13 18:09
neighborleethe diisclousre was just hilllarious tooSep 13 18:10
neighborlee(Disclosure: I'm a GSoC developer for Mono. The above pointer to the practice of estoppel, however, was pointed to me by a lawyer friend of mine whose judgement I trust unblinkingly.)Sep 13 18:10
schestowitzI see "Lars Noodén" there.Sep 13 18:10
neighborleehmmSep 13 18:10
schestowitzHe knows that stuff!Sep 13 18:10
neighborleehehSep 13 18:10
schestowitzVexorian read BNSep 13 18:10
schestowitzThe problem is that if they can get mental acceptance, there are more developers doing the denial in publicSep 13 18:11
neighborleeof courseSep 13 18:12
schestowitzLet me do a cartoon (ish)Sep 13 18:12
neighborleewhen it gets a bit hot, you typically see mono supporters getting nastySep 13 18:12
neighborleethats what ive seen over time anywaySep 13 18:12
neighborleeboth here, and boycottnovell and other placesSep 13 18:12
neighborleeI guess it threatens the cushy programmer .net jobs or something o_0Sep 13 18:13
neighborleeor something ;)Sep 13 18:13
neighborleemaybe they all get free xbox360 coupons ;0-Sep 13 18:13
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schestowitzWell, that too.Sep 13 18:15
schestowitzIt's generally defense of what they were brought to by Novell  and its boosters.Sep 13 18:16
neighborleeyeahSep 13 18:16
neighborleeso who is lars anywaySep 13 18:16
neighborleeclearly not a mono supporter <yayyy>Sep 13 18:17
PetoKrausso i've got this amazing piece of hardware.... Intel Celeron 2600, 512MB RAM, 40 + 500 GB HDD, wireless PCI card etc... for under €£100Sep 13 18:18
PetoKrausfun what you can find on ebaySep 13 18:18
neighborleethe harddrive is prob. the most expensive part ;) ( though I dont know much about celeron models)Sep 13 18:19
PetoKrausyeah, that's half :)Sep 13 18:19
neighborleeram is very cheap these days,,Sep 13 18:19
PetoKraushome server.Sep 13 18:19
neighborleeah yesSep 13 18:19
PetoKrausi'll underclock a bit, though.Sep 13 18:19
neighborlee:)Sep 13 18:20
schestowitzI have somehing similar.Sep 13 18:21
schestowitzHaven't booted it up in about a month.Sep 13 18:21
schestowitz*LOL* Two hits on BN in search for Novell: http://images.google.com/images?sourceid=mozcli...Sep 13 18:22
schestowitzOkay, check out the front page now. I made a post.Sep 13 18:45
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kentmaschestowitz: ah, you're probably right - e'en so, the last prom has started now, and I'm going to enjoy it :-)Sep 13 19:30
schestowitzI C... http://www.bbc.co.uk/proms/2008/w... "Time 8.00pm - c10.35pm"Sep 13 19:32
twitterick, Yahoo Finance now requires flash.Sep 13 19:40
twitterGoogle will still server a static imageSep 13 19:41
schestowitzBetter than Yahoo doing Silverfish. http://itmanagement.earthweb.com...Sep 13 19:42
neighborleetwitter, does it work with gnashSep 13 19:43
neighborleeschestowitz, egads yes indeed ;)Sep 13 19:43
twitterGnash and Knash sort of work with Google but not at all with Yahoo.  Google's static images are easier on my install.  I can test it with a more up to date version of Lenny but that's the story with this machine.Sep 13 19:45
schestowitzGoogle could have done it all with Ajax.Sep 13 19:46
schestowitzIt could also lobby for Ogg in HTML5, helping against Microsoft and its Ilk (former Softie in Nokia) and friends from Apple.Sep 13 19:46
twitterYes, that would be nice.Sep 13 19:47
schestowitzI posted this < http://schestowitz.com/Weblog/ar... > in my blog some days ago.Sep 13 19:47
schestowitzMono strings OOo: http://beranger.org/index.php?page=dia...Sep 13 19:52
schestowitzThis is said to have happened in PCLOS before  (someone in Groklaw complained), but it was contradicted later.Sep 13 19:52
neighborleeOMGosh...nasty nastySep 13 19:54
neighborleeyeah , im sadened to see them going the mono way too...at least fedora reversed course.Sep 13 19:55
neighborleeworking on ubuntu ;)Sep 13 19:55
schestowitzI could try to reproduce because I use the same distro as him ATM. Actually, I recommended it to him before he tried it again.Sep 13 19:55
schestowitzFedora? Not exactly. Just the live CD.Sep 13 19:55
neighborleeyes but its the recommended installSep 13 19:56
neighborleedvd is less so as its a miuch bigger downloadSep 13 19:56
schestowitzI bet it's Novell with go-oo that makes it virtually impossible to steer away from it.Sep 13 19:56
neighborleeI'm aware of this, and I'm waiting to see if they get rid of this before the 2009.0 edition is out, before I choose to renew my powerpack subscription. <ohhhh ;)Sep 13 19:56
schestowitzWe saw whis coming in 2006: http://boycottnovell.com/2006/11/20...Sep 13 19:57
schestowitzAlso http://boycottnovell.com/?p=20Sep 13 19:57
neighborleeBéranger comment was priceless LOLSep 13 19:58
schestowitzRead the second one well.Sep 13 19:58
neighborleePatkos Csaba  either a mole, or someone in cave  o_0Sep 13 19:58
neighborleehm maybe both ;0-Sep 13 19:59
schestowitzVery well, very closely. Share it in forums if needed. That's Microsoft's chief admitting that Mono is only for Novell and a trapSep 13 19:59
neighborleegrinsSep 13 19:59
neighborleei missed a url, one secSep 13 19:59
neighborleethe last one you posted in here you mean ?Sep 13 19:59
schestowitzYesSep 13 20:00
schestowitzRead it.Sep 13 20:00
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neighborleeic yesSep 13 20:01
neighborleeoh boy ;)Sep 13 20:01
neighborleeyeah I dont think I ever saw thatSep 13 20:02
neighborleeo_0Sep 13 20:02
schestowitzShare it, please. Right from the horse's mouth. Goldfarb admitted this in 2008, but he's no Bob MSep 13 20:03
neighborleeI can do that.Sep 13 20:03
schestowitzTnxSep 13 20:07
PetoKrausberanger owned the thread.Sep 13 20:09
PetoKrausif ooo 3.0 doesn't build without monoSep 13 20:09
PetoKrauswell, that'd be sad. flagship of opensource hijacked.Sep 13 20:09
schestowitzLet me fint the GL threat Groklaw)Sep 13 20:09
schestowitz*thread (Groklaw)Sep 13 20:09
schestowitzhttp://www.groklaw.net/comme...) +from+Ubuntu+Hardy+Heron&type=article&a mp;order=&hideanonymous=0&am p;pid=716633#c716651Sep 13 20:10
schestowitzVictor brought it up in: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/15...Sep 13 20:10
schestowitzhttp://tinyurl.com/5k3zjxSep 13 20:11
schestowitz"Makes sense to me and I want to purge mono-related packages - if any - from distributions I use [which are - on hard drive - PCLinuxOS, Fedora, Mandriva, Mint, and Kubuntu]."Sep 13 20:11
schestowitzO wait!! It's bbaston. I think I know himSep 13 20:12
schestowitzPCLinuxOS is definitely a Mandriva derivative, right?Sep 13 20:13
neighborleeindividual developers wouldn’t be permitted to distribute these improvements and the “community” would not benefit. <  thats huge ;0- and of couse underlines the whole  m$/novel pact itself...why anyone but moles think this is just fine , I would be very surprised ;))Sep 13 20:13
schestowitzYou now have an image to explain to Mono boosters the "ECMA promise": http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content...Sep 13 20:14
trmancohttp://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/grub.htmlSep 13 20:16
schestowitzWhatzit for?Sep 13 20:17
neighborleeI agree with Mr. Remnant: F-Spot is beautiful and simple like, forSep 13 20:19
neighborleeexample, Microsoft Vista. < ROFL...thats too funny ;) ,from here: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-d...Sep 13 20:19
schestowitzI'm sure that enough /Mono shill' were there to refuse Microsoft executives who say it's a trap.Sep 13 20:22
trmancoschestowitz, great grub tutorialSep 13 20:22
schestowitzIt's a Big Lie. The Novell Lie. Keep everyone asleep while poisoning all the distros with a cryptonyte (spelling?) that only Novell bought 'protection' for.Sep 13 20:23
neighborleehttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu... < see hereSep 13 20:23
neighborleeand here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p... < and hereSep 13 20:23
neighborleethey kinda seem to be saying the same thing, dont they ;)))Sep 13 20:23
neighborleemole alert**Sep 13 20:23
neighborleegotchaSep 13 20:23
schestowitzProbably Mono developers or Novell employees (or people who got brainwashed by them).Sep 13 20:24
neighborleeexactlySep 13 20:24
schestowitzThis one < https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ub... > sounds like the BS Novell people yell back at me for BN.Sep 13 20:25
neighborleeyesSep 13 20:26
trmancoI wonder how many patents Windows' kernel infringesSep 13 20:26
trmancoand that saying that the Linux kernel infringes patents from MS that's BSSep 13 20:26
neighborleeeven IF it is true ...which is easier to remove fspot/tomboy/yadda, or the kernel..LOL...rome wasn't built in a day,but I suspect they didnt start with the top of the buildings hahahahaSep 13 20:27
trmancoLinus responded to that I thinkSep 13 20:27
neighborleetrmanco, it would be great if I had a url to show that makes this point.Sep 13 20:27
neighborleebrbSep 13 20:28
trmancookSep 13 20:28
schestowitzJust found: http://news.cnet.com/2100-7344_3-5296787.html (IBM pledges no patent attacks against Linux)Sep 13 20:28
schestowitzhttp://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07... (  Linus Responds To Microsoft Patent Claims )Sep 13 20:29
trmancogreatSep 13 20:30
trmancoyou found it :PSep 13 20:30
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neighborleeschestowitz, sweet ;))thx indeed!!Sep 13 20:30
trmancostupid patentsSep 13 20:31
schestowitzThere's this in the news: http://blogs.zdnet.com/green/?p=1341Sep 13 20:31
trmancogood thing Europe (I think) doesn't have patentsSep 13 20:31
schestowitz4 down, 7 million to go.Sep 13 20:31
schestowitz"Fighting patents one by one will never eliminate the danger of software patents, any more than swatting mosquitoes will eliminate malaria." --Richard StallmanSep 13 20:32
trmancomehSep 13 20:32
trmancothos microshaft ads suckSep 13 20:32
trmancothose*Sep 13 20:32
schestowitzBy designSep 13 20:32
schestowitzTo suit VistaSep 13 20:32
trmancoa lot of sites where I see the keywords "linux" and "open source" always contain a stupid microshaft adSep 13 20:33
schestowitzThey live in Linux' shadow in many areas other than the desktop (embedded, servers, HPC, etc.)Sep 13 20:34
trmancobrbSep 13 20:37
trmancobackSep 13 20:44
trmancoschestowitz, http://groups.google.com/group/co...Sep 13 20:47
schestowitzIt's a troll. killfiled on my reader.Sep 13 20:49
trmancoyesSep 13 20:49
trmancoHe said that the LHC got hacked and it was because of LinuxSep 13 20:49
trmancoI don't see no Linux on that articleSep 13 20:51
schestowitzThey use Linux on some desktops/laptops. That's separate.Sep 13 20:51
schestowitztrmanco: it doesn't matter They fabricate 'evidence', manufacturing misconception.Sep 13 20:52
trmancookSep 13 20:52
schestowitzI'll do some more posts now (USENET)Sep 13 20:55
trmancookSep 13 20:55
*trmanco Waiting ...Sep 13 20:55
schestowitzThe guy who posted the LHC FUD could be a Microsoft agentSep 13 20:57
trmancoproxy?Sep 13 20:57
schestowitzHe intimidates people by posting their personal details and he must have some special access to ISPs to obtain that. He posts via zombies or remailers (go figure why the secrecy)Sep 13 20:57
trmanco:|Sep 13 20:58
schestowitzIt was agreed some time in 2006 that the way to beat the shill is to flood them out with good news for Free software and here I am 2 years later.Sep 13 20:58
trmancoyou get all the newsSep 13 20:58
trmancoyou nearly leave a chance for others to post linux related news :PSep 13 20:59
schestowitzI go through lots. Good software makes it possible.Sep 13 20:59
trmancobut thats goodSep 13 20:59
schestowitzBesides, I E-mail PJ twice a day with links, so some of it helps Groklaw too.Sep 13 20:59
trmancowhy won't these trolls just go away :|Sep 13 21:01
trmancoits so easy to stop postingSep 13 21:01
schestowitzSome of them were former Microsoft employees, others are Microsoft partners, trolls and AstroTurfers, some of whom were exposed before. I thin there's a SccriptMonkey plugin for Firefox to filter Google Groups.Sep 13 21:02
trmancoI don't use google groups :|Sep 13 21:03
trmancoI have to start creating filters in thunderbird :)Sep 13 21:04
schestowitzUse ColaTrolls to built a filter to catch all.Sep 13 21:04
trmancoyesSep 13 21:05
trmancosounds like a nice name for a filter for that purposeSep 13 21:05
schestowitzhttp://colatrolls.blogspot.com/Sep 13 21:05
trmancoso manySep 13 21:06
trmancobut not all of them are thereSep 13 21:06
trmancoit hasn't been updated in a whileSep 13 21:06
schestowitzYes, it's an old list.Sep 13 21:07
neighborleeI think that link I posted about showing that ubuntu devs dont know much about gthumb was a great choice..others are saying hey wait a minute..:: "  That makes me wonder if any of the devs in question have ever actually used gThumb. Nautilus and EOG do not "handle 95% of gthumb'sSep 13 21:15
neighborleefunctionality". Oh, but F-Spot has a "better user experience". Who needs functionality when you have such a great "user experience"? ""Sep 13 21:15
neighborleelolSep 13 21:15
trmancololSep 13 21:16
schestowitzUser experience. *LOL*Sep 13 21:16
schestowitzSound bites like "innovation" and "ease of use"... "usability"Sep 13 21:17
trmancoI've heard the Fspot it slowSep 13 21:17
trmancothat*Sep 13 21:17
trmancois*Sep 13 21:17
trmancoman so many typosSep 13 21:17
schestowitzLinus Torvalds:  “I think that “innovation” is a four-letter word in the industry. It should never be used in polite company. It’s become a PR thing to sell new versions with.”Sep 13 21:18
schestowitz“It was Edison who said “1% inspiration, 99% perspiration”. That may have been true a hundred years ago. These days it’s “0.01% inspiration, 99.99% perspiration”, and the inspiration is the easy part. As a project manager, I have never had trouble finding people with crazy ideas. I have trouble finding people who can execute. IOW, “innovation” is way oversold. And it sure as hell shouldn’t be applied to products lSep 13 21:18
schestowitzike MS Word or Open office.”Sep 13 21:18
PetoKrausyou mean INNOVA~1Sep 13 21:21
schestowitzNo, no... Ballmer pronounces it with "vation" and everything. The whole deal!! :-)Sep 13 21:21
PetoKrausthat's incorrectSep 13 21:22
PetoKraushe accidently the whole thingSep 13 21:22
schestowitz"it's not Eneterprise ready".... "We have lots of reserach and development"... "we spent $5 million developing ME 3, AKA XP Vista Endition"Sep 13 21:22
schestowitz*Many typos.             There are many examples of the Microsoft 'chorus'. All sorts of catchy phrases like "you get what you pay for"Sep 13 21:23
PetoKrausheheSep 13 21:24
PetoKrausi had such a funny time explaining todaySep 13 21:24
PetoKrauswhat's the benefits of linux based PCSep 13 21:24
schestowitzClass?Sep 13 21:24
PetoKrausno, shopSep 13 21:24
PetoKrausthere was this EEE with XP, but with Staroffice installedSep 13 21:24
schestowitzDemoing tuxpaint? ;-pSep 13 21:24
PetoKrausso i was like - alright, you get the same thing on that linux one, and it's 40 quid cheaperSep 13 21:25
schestowitzNo forced upgrades, lock-in, etc.Sep 13 21:25
schestowitzNo spyware.Sep 13 21:25
PetoKrausanyway, what pissed me offSep 13 21:25
PetoKrausroyally pissed me offSep 13 21:25
PetoKrausis the "possibility" to get Inspiron Mini 9 with Ubuntu in the ukSep 13 21:25
schestowitzPeople are taught to think in superficial ways. As RMS says, "how powerful is this program?"Sep 13 21:26
schestowitzNot "what does it do to my freedom?"Sep 13 21:26
PetoKrausi mean both are importantSep 13 21:26
PetoKrausbut honestly, if you are a 18yo student of liberal artsSep 13 21:26
PetoKrausyou don't need freaking economical macros in your word processorSep 13 21:26
schestowitzYes, it's due to education though.Sep 13 21:26
schestowitzMoney, money, mon^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^HSep 13 21:27
PetoKrausi am gonna write a letter to dellSep 13 21:27
schestowitzThat's like sending a gifft to /de/null/, no?Sep 13 21:28
schestowitz*typosSep 13 21:28
MinceRnopeSep 13 21:28
MinceRit doesn't cost as muchSep 13 21:28
MinceRand if enough people do it, there's a tiny chance dell realises the error of their waysSep 13 21:29
schestowitzReuse someone's letterSep 13 21:29
schestowitzWait.Sep 13 21:29
schestowitzhttp://www.openmalaysiablog.com/2008/09/...Sep 13 21:29
PetoKrausnahSep 13 21:30
PetoKrausi am just gonna fucking kill (tm) ^W^W ask dell.uk why don't they include the ubuntu version, as dell USA doesSep 13 21:31
schestowitzTell his you'll "whack" them. It worked for Microsoft.Sep 13 21:31
schestowitzhttp://www.nypost.com/seven/0...Sep 13 21:31
MinceRhttp://imma-chargin-malaysia.istheshit.net/Sep 13 21:34
PetoKrausd'ohSep 13 21:34
PetoKraustheir page is likeSep 13 21:34
schestowitzMonkSep 13 21:36
PetoKrausoh come onSep 13 21:37
schestowitzThis man < http://www.campfire.net.au/files/im... > just found out that Dell only sells Vista.Sep 13 21:37
PetoKrausif they piss me offSep 13 21:37
PetoKrausi'll call'emSep 13 21:37
PetoKrausokSep 13 21:38
PetoKrausi'll try dell forumsSep 13 21:38
schestowitzSend them the picture of this gentleman to show them how angry you are.Sep 13 21:39
PetoKrausoh FUCK!Sep 13 21:40
PetoKrausdell sales - no EMAIL??!?!Sep 13 21:41
schestowitzOf course not.Sep 13 21:41
PetoKrausyou have to be fucking kidding meSep 13 21:41
schestowitzSame with the travel agent I booked a ticket with.Sep 13 21:41
schestowitzI had to use their emergency E-mail.Sep 13 21:41
PetoKrausTHIS IS A FUCKING EMERGENCY!Sep 13 21:42
schestowitzAnd then get some phone number to be thrown from one exchange to another.Sep 13 21:42
schestowitzIt is. LMOASep 13 21:42
PetoKraus"Thank you for your feedback. Your opinion is important to us."Sep 13 21:48
PetoKrausthey are going to be buggered till i get answerSep 13 21:48
schestowitzIt probably reaches someone who never heard of Lunix.Sep 13 21:49
schestowitzUbuntu? Maybe.Sep 13 21:50
PetoKrausi don't careSep 13 21:50
PetoKrausi went on a rant about the webpage as wellSep 13 21:50
schestowitzThere's no reason to live in a world where computer is synonymous with Windows. Dell helps it.Sep 13 21:50
PetoKrausheheSep 13 21:52
PetoKrausthere were two turks buying a machine todaySep 13 21:52
PetoKrausand there's a surcharge on Credit CardsSep 13 21:52
PetoKrausso when i told them, they said, no, there isn't and it never happened before, and they leftSep 13 21:52
schestowitzPharmacySep 13 21:53
schestowitz?Sep 13 21:53
PetoKrauspharmacy? sorry?Sep 13 21:53
schestowitzOh, sorry. Where was that?Sep 13 21:54
PetoKrauslaptopsdirect.netSep 13 21:54
PetoKraus(do not interchange with *.co.uk)Sep 13 21:55
schestowitzDid you see what MicrosASUS is doing in AU?Sep 13 21:57
schestowitzIt's in the front page of Free Software Daily now.Sep 13 21:57
PetoKrausnoSep 13 22:04
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/09/11/a... and http://boycottnovell.com/2008/09/1...Sep 13 22:06
tessierThat's Acer not Asus right?Sep 13 22:10
PetoKrausseems soSep 13 22:10
schestowitzWhich one?Sep 13 22:10
tessierYou said "MicrosASUS"Sep 13 22:15
tessierShould be "MicrosAcer"Sep 13 22:16
schestowitzASUS is in the first link.Sep 13 22:18
schestowitzI've just posted about what I hope is not Monodriva in he making: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/09/13/micro...Sep 13 22:46
*mib_gxbt6y has quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")Sep 13 23:42

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