Re: Debian needs you

["Jaldhar H. Vyas" <jaldhar@braincells.com>]

On Sat, 1 Nov 1997, Bdale Garbee wrote:

> Can you help me understand what you mean by "moderate view" in this context?
> 

Certainly.  It is the notion that free software is only really free if it
is also useable.  In addition to things like source code availability and
the right to reuse the code in commercial apps, it means thinking about
things like distribution and user-friendliness too.

The KDE CD is good because it is useful.  Although it isn't perfectly free
(though it's not as bad as it could be) it is hoped it will introduce a
lot of people to free software who might not otherwise have been and make
it easier for them to be as productive as they would be on totally
non-free systems.  Once they start seeing the benefits they'll come around
to the right way of thinking.  I offer myself as an example.  I started
off being extremely dubious of the whole idea of free software.  Debian
demonstrated to me that this is a powerful and viable and it did it by
_working_.  This was more convincing than a thousand manifestos could have
been.

Moderation means realizing that sometimes pragmatic decisions have to be
made. If you remember Dave Cinege's original gripe was that changing the
version numbering scheme was unneccessary kowtowing to non-free interests. 
I supported that decision because there are many more people that can use
Debian if inexpensive CDs are available.  Therefore it was worth making a
small change to the way we do things to accommodate CD vendors.  In the
KDE case we don't even have to do that much.

One last thing to consider is that less-than-free software often does
innovate and can serve as a source of ideas for free software.  By
completely seperating the two worlds, _both_ will be impoverished.  Rather
we should look to how much we can take rather than how much we can reject.

> Is it your belief that the policy of having the main distribution contain
> only software that meets the DFSG should change?  
> 

No.  I don't see the views I'm expressing needing any major change in
policy.  It's more about how to carry out that policy in the best way.

> If not, I completely agree with the notion that we can and should be 
> essentially neutral as an organization on things like the KDE/Debian disk...
> while tolerating/supporting the rights of everyone involved, *including* our
> leader, to publicly express their personal opinions on such things.
> 

Every leader from the priest at my local temple to the president has to
give up some of their rights to an opinion because there will inevitably
be people who confuse there "personal" voice with their "orgonizational" 
one.  As Debian grows ever larger Bruce or his possible successor will
have to do the same.  it stinks but that's life.

In this case the most I can imagine saying is "Make sure your customers
understand this isn't an official Debian CD and the Debian project doesn't
condone non-free software" if even that much.
  
> I believe that it would be disasterous for us to relax the requirement that 
> the main distribution comply with the DFSG, and equally disasterous to elect 
> as leader someone who could even contemplate suggesting we do so.
> 
> When I signed on as a package maintainer for Debian (it sure seems like it was
> a *long* time ago), the "gang of three" who were central to making Debian 
> happen were Ian Murdock, Ian Jackson, and Bruce Perens (in no particular 
> order).  If I didn't think they were reasonable people with whom I shared much 
> commonality of opinion about software, I wouldn't have signed on.  I may 
> embarrass them by saying so, but in my opinion, anyone who finds themselves 
> *fundamentally at odds* with the philosophies and actions of Bruce and/or 
> IanJ should question why they're participating in Debian.

The reason I asked for someone else to run is because it would be
interesting to know how much support there is for different (potentially
better) strategies in promoting Debian and its ideals.  I'm not unhappy
with Bruce in any way and I don't intend to make a big fuss about this. 
I'll go along with the consensus.  But this is what I feel about the
situation for whatever it's worth. 

-- 
Jaldhar H. Vyas <jaldhar@braincells.com>


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