schestowitz | Except search, although acquisitions help some pieces (E.g. Deja News) | Aug 06 00:00 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Talking of which I don't seem to be able to get the daily build today....maybe its a little late.... | Aug 06 00:00 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] So Microsoft "admits" does it? I don't think it was a secret...we already knew...http://tinyurl.com/m2f9tw #microsoft #windows #linux #xp | Aug 06 00:02 | |
_goblin | Good article that one Roy (Microsoft admits that Linux desktop elephant exists) | Aug 06 00:04 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Unethical Microsoft Front Group Attacks Migration from Microsoft/Novell to Google http://ping.fm/3m5BV | Aug 06 00:08 | |
schestowitz | _goblin: there's another one on this subject coming | Aug 06 00:09 |
schestowitz | I do a burst of posts at the moment. joy.. | Aug 06 00:09 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Vista 7 Could be Delayed Due to Massive Bug — Claim http://ping.fm/w1hyB | Aug 06 00:30 | |
_goblin | lol.... | Aug 06 00:37 |
_goblin | massive bug? consuming massive amounts of memory? Sounds like Windows is working perfectly to me.... | Aug 06 00:38 |
_goblin | dont worry....buy it anyway...."It will be better next time....." | Aug 06 00:38 |
schestowitz | Vista 8 | Aug 06 00:47 |
schestowitz | Or don't use checkdisk.. for now.. more bugs are out there to be identified, sitll | Aug 06 00:47 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] ODF 1.2 Gains Approval, Garners Support, Microsoft Carries on Lying http://ping.fm/CROa1 | Aug 06 01:01 | |
Diablo-D3 | hey schestowitz | Aug 06 01:03 |
Diablo-D3 | http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/08/05/1555219/XML-Library-Flaw-mdash-Sun-Apache-GNOME-Affected?from=rss | Aug 06 01:03 |
Diablo-D3 | did I paste that yet? | Aug 06 01:03 |
Diablo-D3 | because thats OMFGHORRIFYING | Aug 06 01:03 |
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schestowitz | DOS flaw | Aug 06 01:28 |
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Xarver | schestowitz: Problem, recordmydesktop crashes when I stop recording :( | Aug 06 01:31 |
schestowitz | I've never used that program | Aug 06 01:33 |
Xarver | hmm know any recording programs that work well? | Aug 06 01:34 |
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mikankun | Xarver: xvidcap is the best one I know of | Aug 06 01:47 |
Xarver | ok | Aug 06 01:49 |
Diablo-D3 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4Q7xgxDJh4&fmt=22 | Aug 06 01:59 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft Should be Reported to the ASA/Equivalent for “TCO”, Benchmark Frauds http://ping.fm/4MiF2 | Aug 06 02:03 | |
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schestowitz | gn | Aug 06 02:17 |
M$ fail submission http://slashdot.org/submission/1050951/M-Blames-Linux-and-Google-for-Revenue-Fail | Aug 06 02:28 | |
M$ Death Watch is updated http://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/213707 | Aug 06 02:33 | |
cubezzz | redhat stock price is down from 2000 too | Aug 06 02:39 |
cubezzz | of course, doj didn't break up microsoft | Aug 06 02:40 |
cubezzz | activation was the last straw for me, change your motherboard then you have to re-activate... | Aug 06 02:41 |
cubezzz | no more microsoft after that | Aug 06 02:42 |
cubezzz | I was using Unix System V in the 80's and saying windows 2.0 sucked :) | Aug 06 02:44 |
Diablo-D3 | cubezzz: yeah but | Aug 06 02:48 |
Diablo-D3 | redhat is... a meh stock | Aug 06 02:48 |
cubezzz | I bought in at $10 :) | Aug 06 02:49 |
cubezzz | it went as low as $3 per share at one point | Aug 06 02:50 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[d235j] RT @ericasadun: Source found! It is http://despair.com/ and they sell t-shirts of the venn diagram, de-motivators and more. Cool site... | Aug 06 03:22 | |
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M$FT from $58 to $20. Google, from $100 in 2004 to $450 today. IBM $135 to $120. Apple $200 to $165. Red Hat is not the best example, but they have shown solid growth since falling off their IPO euphoria (ie being broken by M$ ten years ago) Novell never enjoyed such euphoria, unless you consider a $40 share price lofty. Now $4.66 It is kind of sad to see how they were crushed in the mid 90s and then again in 2000. Not even t | Aug 06 04:00 | |
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Mark Shuttleworth aligns himself with Mono and M$ -> I enjoyed Linus Torvalds' recent interview where he talked about prejudice against Microsoft in the Linux community, and how poisonous it is. The same is true of prejudice against Ubuntu here in Debian. | Aug 06 04:09 | |
This is an unfortunate abuse of the word "prejudice." A person would have to suspend their memory and capacity to reason to trust M$. | Aug 06 04:11 | |
The kind of judgment people use in dealing with abusers is the opposite of prejudice. | Aug 06 04:11 | |
Debian has worked wonderfully and does not need to get on a Ubuntu release schedule. | Aug 06 04:13 | |
ThistleWeb | "prejudice" means to pre-judge | Aug 06 04:15 |
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ThistleWeb | peeps in the debian community have had their beloved debian shunted aside and the limelight taken by ubuntu, which relies on their work | Aug 06 04:16 |
I'm not sure what upstream projects have been feeding him, but as a user I have no interest in Debian's excellent release schedule. The "it's done when it's done" and easy upgrade path is why I use Debian. | Aug 06 04:16 | |
ThistleWeb | some dont like the modifications ubuntu have made to make it user firendly | Aug 06 04:16 |
I don't like those modifications but don't care. | Aug 06 04:17 | |
ThistleWeb | so they wont even listen to any suggestions made by mark, or ubuntu | Aug 06 04:17 |
ThistleWeb | thats what he means by prejudice | Aug 06 04:17 |
ThistleWeb | they pre-judge his intentions | Aug 06 04:17 |
I surely don't think badly of Ubuntu's commercial success | Aug 06 04:17 | |
ThistleWeb | it's not an abuse of the term | Aug 06 04:17 |
no, a disagreement is not a pre judge | Aug 06 04:17 | |
it's just a disagreement | Aug 06 04:17 | |
ThistleWeb | they judge his intentions without giving him a fair hearing | Aug 06 04:18 |
ThistleWeb | thats what he means | Aug 06 04:18 |
I don't care about his intentions. | Aug 06 04:18 | |
ThistleWeb | you just claimed he misuses the term "prejudice" | Aug 06 04:18 |
If I wanted Ubuntu, I'd use Ubuntu. | Aug 06 04:18 | |
ThistleWeb | I'm explaining that it's not a misuse | Aug 06 04:19 |
"prejudice against Microsoft in the Linux community" is rather clear. | Aug 06 04:19 | |
and clearly a misuse of the term. | Aug 06 04:19 | |
ThistleWeb | I dunno, they did relase under the gpl | Aug 06 04:20 |
I have yet to judge Ubuntu in the same way because Shuttleworth consistently says good things about software freedom. | Aug 06 04:20 | |
ThistleWeb | even if they had to | Aug 06 04:20 |
ThistleWeb | the code speaks for itself | Aug 06 04:20 |
ThistleWeb | even if it was submitted with gritted teeth | Aug 06 04:20 |
So, you trust M$? | Aug 06 04:21 | |
ThistleWeb | to reject it because it was MS, even if it met all other criteria would be wrong | Aug 06 04:21 |
ThistleWeb | of course not | Aug 06 04:21 |
Want to run gnu/linux on top of M$? | Aug 06 04:21 | |
ThistleWeb | not with code under MS terms | Aug 06 04:22 |
so, I see the code speaks for itself, even for you. | Aug 06 04:22 | |
ThistleWeb | the code they submitted was under the same licence as many others, the GPL | Aug 06 04:22 |
and you have no use for it, neither do I. | Aug 06 04:22 | |
ThistleWeb | it waqsn't a MS-modified GPL | Aug 06 04:23 |
ThistleWeb | it was the gpl | Aug 06 04:23 |
ThistleWeb | same as many others | Aug 06 04:23 |
ThistleWeb | what makes theirs different? | Aug 06 04:23 |
version 2 has been replaced. | Aug 06 04:23 | |
ThistleWeb | and? | Aug 06 04:23 |
ThistleWeb | what doe sthat have to do with anything? | Aug 06 04:23 |
ThistleWeb | it's still gpl | Aug 06 04:24 |
if you want to protect your freedom, use gpl3 | Aug 06 04:24 | |
ThistleWeb | hang on, didn't you ignore me? | Aug 06 04:24 |
I generally do and our conversation reminds me why. | Aug 06 04:25 | |
ThistleWeb | the point is that MS submit code to scratch their itch | Aug 06 04:25 |
ThistleWeb | so does everyone else | Aug 06 04:25 |
ThistleWeb | they didn't try to get it in with conditions | Aug 06 04:25 |
ThistleWeb | because they couldn't | Aug 06 04:25 |
so what? where are you going with this? | Aug 06 04:25 | |
ThistleWeb | but they didn't | Aug 06 04:25 |
ThistleWeb | my point is that to reject MS GPL code just because it came from MS is pre-judice | Aug 06 04:26 |
ThistleWeb | it's still gpl | Aug 06 04:26 |
ThistleWeb | like any other gpl code | Aug 06 04:26 |
what you say is true, but I've rejected it because I have no use for their code | Aug 06 04:27 | |
so your point is only to yourself | Aug 06 04:27 | |
ThistleWeb | that's fine, they gpl code they've submitted has a use to to some peeps, not to all, which is the same as all foss code | Aug 06 04:28 |
you too have rejected the code because you have no use for it. | Aug 06 04:28 | |
ThistleWeb | I have no use for evolution either | Aug 06 04:28 |
ThistleWeb | not kde | Aug 06 04:28 |
ThistleWeb | but it;s all good | Aug 06 04:28 |
ThistleWeb | you can't just look at yopur narrow use and accept / reject what you use | Aug 06 04:29 |
ThistleWeb | people have every right to prejudge mono | Aug 06 04:29 |
ThistleWeb | they are right to | Aug 06 04:29 |
ThistleWeb | because of all the uncertainties it entails | Aug 06 04:29 |
I doubt anyone wants to put their gnu/linux in M$'s cage. | Aug 06 04:30 | |
hypervisor or mono | Aug 06 04:30 | |
ThistleWeb | but not their gpl hypervisor code | Aug 06 04:30 |
ThistleWeb | because it'sgpl | Aug 06 04:30 |
ThistleWeb | I dont doubt they hated releasing it under the GPL | Aug 06 04:30 |
ThistleWeb | but they di | Aug 06 04:30 |
ThistleWeb | did | Aug 06 04:30 |
My conditions for acceptance of M$ continue to be the same, complete abandonment of software patents and gpl of all their code. | Aug 06 04:31 | |
That would make M$ an honest company. | Aug 06 04:31 | |
Until then, I have no use for them. | Aug 06 04:31 | |
ThistleWeb | of course they're not an honest company, but they were forced to release the hypervisor code in an honest way, even if they did lie about the why | Aug 06 04:31 |
ThistleWeb | so you're prejudiced against code coming from MS until the company accept your outlook | Aug 06 04:32 |
ThistleWeb | that's a very correct definition of "prejudice" | Aug 06 04:32 |
no, I don't want code that's not free. | Aug 06 04:32 | |
ThistleWeb | it is free | Aug 06 04:32 |
ThistleWeb | it's GPL | Aug 06 04:32 |
you run in circles | Aug 06 04:33 | |
fewa | i.e. The GPL worked | Aug 06 04:33 |
fewa | but that doesn't mean the code is any good | Aug 06 04:33 |
or useful | Aug 06 04:33 | |
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ThistleWeb | MS released the hypervisor code under the GPL | Aug 06 04:33 |
ThistleWeb | whoich make sit gree | Aug 06 04:33 |
ThistleWeb | free* | Aug 06 04:33 |
I think that's the sixth time you have said the same thing. | Aug 06 04:34 | |
fewa | Just because the legal liability of the GPL worked doesn't make the code they were forced to release (not out of good will) any good | Aug 06 04:34 |
ThistleWeb | nothing else they released is, but that is | Aug 06 04:34 |
yuhong | BTW, another use for the word "schmoozing": | Aug 06 04:34 |
ThistleWeb | I know they were forced to, but they still did | Aug 06 04:34 |
yuhong | http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/07/27/1528201/Managers-Schedule-vs-Makers-Schedule | Aug 06 04:34 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, that doesn't make the code good | Aug 06 04:34 |
ThistleWeb | yes, they lied, tried to play the PR game | Aug 06 04:34 |
fewa | as many kernel hackers would say, lets see the code | Aug 06 04:34 |
ThistleWeb | I never said it did make the code good | Aug 06 04:34 |
ThistleWeb | just that it was free | Aug 06 04:35 |
it is what it is | Aug 06 04:35 | |
fewa | as kernel hackers would not admit bad code | Aug 06 04:35 |
you are what you are | Aug 06 04:35 | |
ThistleWeb | it should be treated like any other free software, and judged on merrit | Aug 06 04:35 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, no, its contrib, it dependant on non-free software | Aug 06 04:35 |
I agree | Aug 06 04:35 | |
ThistleWeb | not pre-judged because it came from MS | Aug 06 04:35 |
fewa | agreed | Aug 06 04:35 |
judged because it's stupid | Aug 06 04:35 | |
fewa | On merit, the APIs that are trying to add already exist | Aug 06 04:36 |
ThistleWeb | stupid? how old are you? | Aug 06 04:36 |
how old are you? | Aug 06 04:36 | |
cubezzz | I'm 43 :) | Aug 06 04:36 |
fewa | they were put there for KVM and I do not see why MSFT needs a special API for its software, that is not the way the kernel usually does things | Aug 06 04:36 |
probably because M$'s other software is non free and needs a "stable" api | Aug 06 04:37 | |
ThistleWeb | don't get me wrong, I'm not defending MS here, I'm responding to the claims that there's a misuse of the term prejudice | Aug 06 04:37 |
some dinky little thing that only M$ would bother to change | Aug 06 04:37 | |
ThistleWeb | I get where they're coming from | Aug 06 04:37 |
fewa | But yes, the code they released, under legal liability, it not, it itsself, a bad things | Aug 06 04:38 |
ThistleWeb | I don't defend anything MS have some vague patent claim on | Aug 06 04:38 |
We all know what M$ wants. | Aug 06 04:38 | |
ThistleWeb | but the gpl is the gpl | Aug 06 04:38 |
fewa | and it does not add legal liability to and people who use it | Aug 06 04:38 |
ThistleWeb | they did release the hypervisor stuff under that licence, as much as it must have galled them | Aug 06 04:38 |
ThistleWeb is ThistleWeb | Aug 06 04:38 | |
red is red | Aug 06 04:39 | |
ThistleWeb | so why should they not be treated the same as other gpl code contributers for that code | Aug 06 04:39 |
fewa | However, it actually does add liability to those that use it, liability for viruses and other malware, as the MSAPI only runs on MSFT software | Aug 06 04:39 |
because M$ is a convicted felon, not worthy of trust, that's why. | Aug 06 04:39 | |
that's called judgment | Aug 06 04:40 | |
ThistleWeb | so you're pre-judging them | Aug 06 04:40 |
good judgment | Aug 06 04:40 | |
yuhong | Yep, but it doesn't add liability to those that don't use it. | Aug 06 04:40 |
ThistleWeb | which is the point Linux is making | Aug 06 04:40 |
fewa | yuhong, agreed | Aug 06 04:40 |
ThistleWeb | anythign coming from MS must be bad | Aug 06 04:40 |
ThistleWeb | before you even look at it | Aug 06 04:40 |
Linus liked DRM | Aug 06 04:40 | |
ThistleWeb | it must be bad | Aug 06 04:40 |
ThistleWeb | which is prejudice | Aug 06 04:40 |
***twitter ignores troll who goes in circles | Aug 06 04:41 | |
ThistleWeb | I thought you already did, make sure and do it right this time | Aug 06 04:41 |
cubezzz | no, that isn't true, all the early 8-bit computers used a microsoft basic rom, I can't say _that_ was bad | Aug 06 04:41 |
ThistleWeb | what Linus is saying is that code should be judged on merrit | Aug 06 04:42 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, you are trying to evangalize for nothing | Aug 06 04:42 |
ThistleWeb | regardless of where it comes from | Aug 06 04:42 |
ThistleWeb | by determining that anything coming from MS is bad you are pre-judging them | Aug 06 04:42 |
yuhong | cubezzz: See http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000845.html. | Aug 06 04:42 |
ThistleWeb | even if it's under a licence you agree with | Aug 06 04:42 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, but what is wrong with judging people based on the past actions? | Aug 06 04:43 |
fewa | *people and businesses | Aug 06 04:43 |
ThistleWeb | fewa: nothing if they tried to put stuff in under a non-gpl licnce | Aug 06 04:43 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, isn't that how judgement works? | Aug 06 04:43 |
ThistleWeb | but they didnt | Aug 06 04:43 |
ThistleWeb | they released under the gpl | Aug 06 04:43 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, are we going to start judging people based on their future actions? | Aug 06 04:43 |
ThistleWeb | like many others | Aug 06 04:43 |
ThistleWeb | no, judge on the code itself, not where it came from | Aug 06 04:43 |
ThistleWeb | it's GPL ffs | Aug 06 04:44 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, by defending them so adamentally you are in practice, breaking your own rule of not treating MSFT the same any anyone else | Aug 06 04:44 |
ThistleWeb | fewa: explain please | Aug 06 04:44 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, you would not raise an eyelash is a Free software development firm turned down code from some other company as it was not good enough | Aug 06 04:44 |
fewa | that they might feel it hijacks their work | Aug 06 04:45 |
fewa | this is all hypothetical | Aug 06 04:45 |
ThistleWeb | I'm saying treat the GPL code they submit like any other GPL code from anywhere else | Aug 06 04:45 |
cubezzz | yuhong: interesting article | Aug 06 04:45 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, but by making such a fuss you are treating their code differntly | Aug 06 04:45 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, you are saying that is deserves attention | Aug 06 04:45 |
yuhong | http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/irc-log-25072009.html | Aug 06 04:45 |
ThistleWeb | fewa: this has NOTHING to do with the quality of the code | Aug 06 04:45 |
ThistleWeb | the quality means it;s being judged on merrit | Aug 06 04:45 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, which is based on pre-judgement that MSFT deserves attention | Aug 06 04:45 |
yuhong | "Perhaps we should bring up the issue of how MS got evil again." | Aug 06 04:46 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, but are you the one to judge | Aug 06 04:46 |
ThistleWeb | which is what Linus wants | Aug 06 04:46 |
ThistleWeb | not looking at the submitter being MS and rejecting iwithout even looking at it | Aug 06 04:46 |
cubezzz | I'm totally off the microsoft platform, I don't program on it, I probably would have stuck with Amiga if Commodore survived | Aug 06 04:46 |
ThistleWeb | so accept or reject their code on merrot | Aug 06 04:47 |
ThistleWeb | not on who submitted it | Aug 06 04:47 |
ThistleWeb | that's my point | Aug 06 04:47 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, you don't seem to understand that giving someone/some business attention is a form of pre-judging, and therefore treating for you to pretend you are only treating it like any other code under the GPL is neglecting reality | Aug 06 04:47 |
ThistleWeb | treat their code like any other gpl code | Aug 06 04:47 |
fewa | You have already pre-judged | Aug 06 04:47 |
ThistleWeb | ok, so we should reject all gpl code? | Aug 06 04:48 |
fewa | that is a straw man | Aug 06 04:48 |
ThistleWeb | because even looking at it is pre-judging it? | Aug 06 04:48 |
ThistleWeb | thats what you just said | Aug 06 04:48 |
fewa | state facts, not appeals to "equality" when equality doesn't exist | Aug 06 04:48 |
ThistleWeb | look at the code for the code itslef | Aug 06 04:48 |
ThistleWeb | not who it came from | Aug 06 04:48 |
fewa | Because the matter of the fact is that MSFT deserves no special attention | Aug 06 04:48 |
ThistleWeb | if it's not good enough, fine, reject it | Aug 06 04:48 |
fewa | According to your reasoning of equality | Aug 06 04:49 |
ThistleWeb | but not becuase it came from MS, but because it's not good enough | Aug 06 04:49 |
ThistleWeb | they do deserve special attention | Aug 06 04:49 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, this fight is mis-placed | Aug 06 04:49 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, noone is infringing on MSFTs right | Aug 06 04:49 |
ThistleWeb | so you inspect it even closer | Aug 06 04:49 |
fewa | they have every right to fork the kernel | Aug 06 04:49 |
ThistleWeb | but still judge it for the code itself | Aug 06 04:49 |
ThistleWeb | not who it came from | Aug 06 04:50 |
fewa | but to assume that others will give it attention, and must actively reject it, rather than simply ignore it if it sucks or has no promise | Aug 06 04:50 |
fewa | Is hypocracy | Aug 06 04:50 |
ThistleWeb | eh? | Aug 06 04:50 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, i yield you your straw man | Aug 06 04:51 |
ThistleWeb | I'm starting to see Linus's frustration in this conversation | Aug 06 04:51 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, what do you think I am defending? | Aug 06 04:51 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, are your pre-judging me? | Aug 06 04:51 |
ThistleWeb | I'm guessing we're on crossed wires somewhere | Aug 06 04:52 |
ThistleWeb | my point is simply this | Aug 06 04:52 |
fewa | you have an assumption that I am arguing for something I am not | Aug 06 04:52 |
ThistleWeb | MS do a LOT of harm to FOSS, they seek to destroy it | Aug 06 04:52 |
fewa | until you understand what I am saying you cannot refute me | Aug 06 04:52 |
ThistleWeb | but they did (for whatever reasons) release the hypervisor under the GPL | Aug 06 04:53 |
ThistleWeb | which means the hypervisor stuff should be judged like any other gpl code | Aug 06 04:53 |
ThistleWeb | if it's good, fine, if not, reject it | Aug 06 04:53 |
yuhong | BTW, on the term "Vista 7", here is someone outside of BN using it: | Aug 06 04:53 |
ThistleWeb | don't look at the sender and reject it | Aug 06 04:54 |
yuhong | http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/77909774/m/914001330041 | Aug 06 04:54 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, simply because MSFT exist, doesn't give them a bigger assumption that what they do is productive | Aug 06 04:54 |
ThistleWeb | just because it came from MS | Aug 06 04:54 |
yuhong | ""We don't know what the Beta to Retail will require of Vista 7, so it's not a terrible deal. " | Aug 06 04:54 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, your have fallen into the trap of thinking that MSFT's rights are being infringed, and we need to actively prevent infringement | Aug 06 04:54 |
fewa | which is just a straw man | Aug 06 04:54 |
ThistleWeb | they have the right to be treated like any other GPL contriubter on the GPL code the contribute | Aug 06 04:55 |
ThistleWeb | equality means nothing if you decide some can't play | Aug 06 04:55 |
fewa | The Linux community has no obligation to treat MSFT with more attention and respect than any other newcomer to the community | Aug 06 04:55 |
ThistleWeb | exactly | Aug 06 04:56 |
ThistleWeb | so examine their code closely | Aug 06 04:56 |
ThistleWeb | accept or reject it on merit | Aug 06 04:56 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, thats unwarrented attention | Aug 06 04:56 |
ThistleWeb | not on the fact that it comes from MS | Aug 06 04:56 |
fewa | anyways, your argument is goin in circles | Aug 06 04:56 |
fewa | and you completely, still, miss my point | Aug 06 04:57 |
ThistleWeb | prejudice is deciding that anything from MS is bad, no matter if they do play by our licencing rules | Aug 06 04:57 |
fewa | you have been brainwashed into false ideas of equality | Aug 06 04:57 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, I have not refuted that | Aug 06 04:57 |
fewa | not challenged that | Aug 06 04:57 |
fewa | You just don't know what inequality is | Aug 06 04:58 |
ThistleWeb | whichmeans that treating their GPL code any different is prejudice | Aug 06 04:58 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, do you have some self-interest in Microsoft? | Aug 06 04:58 |
ThistleWeb | yeah actually I do | Aug 06 04:58 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, no, people have the right to treat any code however they want | Aug 06 04:58 |
ThistleWeb | I'll be happy when they declare bankrupcy | Aug 06 04:58 |
fewa | ThistleWeb, and MSFT has all the right to fork the kernel and release their own version | Aug 06 04:58 |
fewa | they also have the right to petition kernel developers | Aug 06 04:59 |
ThistleWeb | of course they do, it's GPL | Aug 06 04:59 |
ThistleWeb | they wont find many takers | Aug 06 04:59 |
fewa | but the kernel developers have no obligation to give a fuck | Aug 06 04:59 |
ThistleWeb | but legally they can | Aug 06 04:59 |
fewa | which is the think you completely miss | Aug 06 04:59 |
fewa | /ignore ThistleWeb all | Aug 06 04:59 |
ThistleWeb | which is the point Linux is making, prejudging MS purely because it comes from MS, regardless of the fact that on this occasion they've released under our licence | Aug 06 05:00 |
M$ casts blame in latest Vista failure http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/05/windows_7_show_stopper_bug/ | Aug 06 05:01 | |
ThistleWeb | Linus* | Aug 06 05:01 |
it's dah drivers! | Aug 06 05:01 | |
fewa | It is largely the drivers | Aug 06 05:01 |
fewa | Windows has a broken binary driver mode that holds back innovation and makes new compiliation incompatible with old hardware | Aug 06 05:02 |
yuhong | twitter: "7 failure" or "Vista 7 failure", not "Vista failure". | Aug 06 05:02 |
fewa | It also make security problems impossible to fix | Aug 06 05:02 |
yuhong | I would not got hat far. | Aug 06 05:02 |
fewa | and makes hardware much slower than it could be | Aug 06 05:02 |
calling it a "show stopper" is "out of place" ha ha | Aug 06 05:02 | |
fewa | *much slower than the drivers from open development | Aug 06 05:03 |
it's Windows. | Aug 06 05:03 | |
fewa | Windows is developed in an inferior manner | Aug 06 05:03 |
yuhong | Well, to be sure this problem will have to be debugged properly, and this is true for any OS. | Aug 06 05:03 |
fewa | that leads to an inferior product | Aug 06 05:04 |
fewa | especially on the topic of drivers | Aug 06 05:04 |
fewa | Linux requires no driver CDs | Aug 06 05:04 |
ThistleWeb | there are no driver cds for linux | Aug 06 05:05 |
ThistleWeb | so it's just as well it requiers none | Aug 06 05:06 |
fewa | Linux works with more hardware out of the box than any other OS | Aug 06 05:06 |
yuhong | Well, driver CDs may be needed for backports, but once the driver is merged into mainline, eventually the need will be eliminated. | Aug 06 05:06 |
fewa | yuhong, noone would use the CD | Aug 06 05:06 |
fewa | they would download the latest git | Aug 06 05:06 |
fewa | from that vendor | Aug 06 05:07 |
ThistleWeb | yeah, normal joe sixpack knows all about git | Aug 06 05:07 |
fewa | and in 2 commands they would have a running kernel, or a running module | Aug 06 05:07 |
yuhong | Yep, that also can be used as well. | Aug 06 05:07 |
yuhong | Or maybe just download a Linux patch from the vendor. | Aug 06 05:08 |
fewa | wget http://driver/source/for/rhel | Aug 06 05:08 |
fewa | install kernel-headers | Aug 06 05:08 |
fewa | make compile | Aug 06 05:08 |
fewa | modprove | Aug 06 05:08 |
yuhong | *Linux tarball | Aug 06 05:08 |
fewa | No restart | Aug 06 05:08 |
fewa | ^^^^^ | Aug 06 05:08 |
ThistleWeb | well, it seems that some users here prefer hardline discrimination to pragmatic equality so I'll say goodbye at this point and take BN off my auto IRC login, keep fighting the good fight, and I;ll still stay on the RSS | Aug 06 05:10 |
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fewa | meh | Aug 06 05:11 |
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damage control over the 3GB memory leak in a critical sub component is in full swing. check disk utility sheesh. | Aug 06 05:19 | |
It's not a show stopper, M$ will shove it out the door ready or not. | Aug 06 05:20 | |
ha ha ha | Aug 06 05:20 | |
it's like Vista all over again. | Aug 06 05:20 | |
fewa | MSFT: releasing known faulty products as good since 1985 | Aug 06 05:21 |
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LMAO. "Mixed results" show that it's still slower than XP, which Ubuntu wipes. http://www.dailytech.com/Windows+7+RTM+Gets+Benchmarked+Results+Are+Mixed/article15892.htm | Aug 06 05:21 | |
http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/02/05/1919259 | Aug 06 05:22 | |
and there's a newer one. | Aug 06 05:22 | |
http://slashdot.org/submission/1037137/Ubuntu-with-Ext3-is-Faster-than-Windows-7-and-XP | Aug 06 05:24 | |
fewa | ext4 is even faster | Aug 06 05:25 |
cubezzz | I have to say windows 2000 was the "best" windows | Aug 06 05:33 |
cubezzz | XP itself is a pig | Aug 06 05:33 |
cubezzz | Vista is just a super-pig | Aug 06 05:34 |
yuhong | It is not a show-stopper since it is not MS's fault, at least according to MS. | Aug 06 05:42 |
yuhong | As I said to be sure this problem will have to be debugged properly, and this is true for any OS. | Aug 06 05:42 |
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yuhong | Anyway, what I want to discuss is another use for the word "schmoozing". | Aug 06 05:44 |
yuhong | http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/07/27/1528201/Managers-Schedule-vs-Makers-Schedule | Aug 06 05:44 |
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I think this sums things up nicely. http://slashdot.org/submission/1051033/Windows-7-Still-Slower-than-XP-and-Ubuntu | Aug 06 05:46 | |
vista failure | Aug 06 05:46 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Got my hands on build 3.0.198.0 of Chromium. Ive been with this since the very early builds, excellent work! #linux #chromium | Aug 06 08:21 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Face on Chromium has gone! Must have been unique to .197....I should really investigate further and find out why. #linux #chromium | Aug 06 08:23 | |
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*schestowitz gets tired of Firefox memory leaks, but extensions might be to blame | Aug 06 08:37 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] What a Difference a Decade Makes http://ping.fm/W0N3a | Aug 06 08:37 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] "China says no to Bing..." http://tinyurl.com/mgore6 #microsoft #bing #google #linux #windows | Aug 06 08:42 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] #wikimedia video won't play properly in Chrome 3 cos Google can't be bothered using a non-broken decoder http://is.gd/24xoB idjits. #theora | Aug 06 09:00 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft Confirms Existence of Anti-GNU/Linux Teams http://ping.fm/nL1tC | Aug 06 09:16 | |
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fewa | lawl i got the chomium build | Aug 06 09:30 |
Ng | schestowitz: I wish to complain about the anti-gnu/linux teams story... otters are awesome cute critters and your use of that picture is deeply unfair to otters! ;) | Aug 06 09:35 |
schestowitz | Otters are cute | Aug 06 09:36 |
schestowitz | It's supposed to add a gentle side to the story,.. like locats | Aug 06 09:36 |
schestowitz | *lolcatz | Aug 06 09:36 |
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schestowitz | I seem to be having connectivity issues with the BN server today. Other nodes reach it just fine. It's flapping. | Aug 06 09:46 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] When Patents Are Not a Monopoly Strong Enough… http://ping.fm/7zk30 | Aug 06 09:51 | |
schestowitz | Newspaper Websites Pull In 70 Million Visitors In June http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/08/05/newspaper-websites-pull-in-70-million-visitors-in-june | Aug 06 10:02 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft's search as buggy as Windows: "Bing Indexing NoIndex/Nofollow Content" http://ping.fm/7zOo9 | Aug 06 10:02 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Once Again: The Music Industry Does Not Equal The CD Business http://ping.fm/GLT93 | Aug 06 10:07 | |
schestowitz | Amie Street Also Takes Away Features... But At Least Is Honest And Upfront About How They Hate Having To http://techdirt.com/articles/20090731/0311565725.shtml | Aug 06 10:10 |
MinceR | http://punditkitchen.com/2009/08/05/political-pictures-illegally-downloaded/ | Aug 06 10:11 |
schestowitz | Poor ol' rich man... Berkshire Profit on Goldman Sachs Passes $2 Billion < http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aVCQuRSFQf1I > | Aug 06 10:12 |
schestowitz | And who pays for it? | Aug 06 10:12 |
schestowitz | Taxpayers (bailout).. more money from ordinary citizens to a monopolist | Aug 06 10:12 |
schestowitz | MinceR: nice gear | Aug 06 10:14 |
schestowitz | Technology 'priority for Britons' http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/rss/-/1/hi/uk/8186127.stm | Aug 06 10:15 |
schestowitz | "Britons are more willing to cut back on holidays and meals out than on spending on communication technology during the recession, an Ofcom review suggests." | Aug 06 10:15 |
schestowitz | It's not just a recession | Aug 06 10:16 |
Ng | what is it then? :) | Aug 06 10:17 |
schestowitz | Cisco profits (nearly) cut in half < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/05/cisco_q4_2009_financials/ > | Aug 06 10:17 |
schestowitz | Ng: whar the numbers say | Aug 06 10:18 |
schestowitz | This is encouraging news: AMD beta seeks CPU-GPU harmony < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/05/amd_beta_opencl_for_cpus/ > | Aug 06 10:28 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Police learn Tomlinson officer could face manslaughter charge < http://ping.fm/hv7Hf > Maybe a little over the line? | Aug 06 10:42 | |
schestowitz | oiaohm: Australia terror suspects planned barracks suicide attack, say police http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/04/australia-barracks-terrorism-plot-suspects | Aug 06 10:42 |
oiaohm | LOL schestowitz | Aug 06 10:43 |
oiaohm | Basically Australian mil messing with media. | Aug 06 10:44 |
schestowitz | Why? To defend Web monitoring? | Aug 06 10:46 |
oiaohm | Australian media like china found out if they want to get somewhere there is almost no way to stop them. | Aug 06 10:48 |
oiaohm | The report you have in the UK is stuffed up. | Aug 06 10:49 |
oiaohm | 4 media personal entered an australian mil base and were arrested for being terror suspects with items that could be used to plan for a suicide attack ie cameras. | Aug 06 10:50 |
oiaohm | Yes lost in coversion. | Aug 06 10:50 |
schestowitz | Translation.. | Aug 06 10:51 |
schestowitz | Or broken telephone effect | Aug 06 10:52 |
schestowitz | http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2009/08/inspired-by-freedom.html | Aug 06 10:52 |
oiaohm | Both are english | Aug 06 10:52 |
oiaohm | Someone miss read the austalian reports. | Aug 06 10:52 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[scientes] Netbook usability design and case studies - freescale semiconductor http://ur1.ca/8kjh | Aug 06 10:52 | |
oiaohm | Basically the only way to keep australian media out of somewhere they should not is jail them. | Aug 06 10:53 |
oiaohm | Making them terror suspects added the option to hold them for 7 days without charage as a threat so they don't come back as well. | Aug 06 10:54 |
fewa | oiaohm, hmm what is wrong with freedom of the press | Aug 06 10:54 |
fewa | oiaohm, if you neglict them freedoms it will only spill over to everyone | Aug 06 10:55 |
schestowitz | Seigo moving.... http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2009/07/pieces-coming-together.html | Aug 06 10:55 |
fewa | maybe they shouldn't be on a military base, but that doesn't have anything to do when them being part of the media | Aug 06 10:55 |
fewa | If anybody deserves the right to be somewhere and cover something, it is the media | Aug 06 10:56 |
oiaohm | fewa you don't know our media. | Aug 06 10:57 |
fewa | it doesn't matter | Aug 06 10:57 |
fewa | you have to apply rules to everyone | Aug 06 10:57 |
fewa | rules cannot be specific to the media | Aug 06 10:57 |
oiaohm | Keep out signs are basically invite signs to them. | Aug 06 10:57 |
fewa | In the united states the constitution under the first amendment gives rights to take pictures | Aug 06 10:58 |
fewa | oiaohm, then give them tresspass violations | Aug 06 10:58 |
fewa | but it has nothing to do with them being part of the media | Aug 06 10:58 |
oiaohm | Take pictures while not tresspass is legal. | Aug 06 10:58 |
oiaohm | This case they were on the mil base taking photos. | Aug 06 10:59 |
fewa | http://carlosmiller.com/ | Aug 06 10:59 |
oiaohm | Keeping them out with secuirty guards only works so long against determed media here to find a story. | Aug 06 11:00 |
fewa | http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2009/feb/12/photographers-anti-terror-laws | Aug 06 11:00 |
fewa | they could be doing as part of trying to get people to set rules against them in discriminatory manners | Aug 06 11:00 |
fewa | oiaohm, who are they harming? | Aug 06 11:00 |
oiaohm | Place they were trying to get into was classifed coms fewa | Aug 06 11:01 |
fewa | oiaohm, did they harm anyone? | Aug 06 11:01 |
oiaohm | Get hands on classifed coms could. They are classifed to protect people doing operations overseas. | Aug 06 11:02 |
fewa | oiaohm, and what would you have changed to fix it? how would it help? | Aug 06 11:02 |
oiaohm | And with Australian media don't drop on them like a ton of bricks they will. | Aug 06 11:02 |
fewa | oiaohm, does that effect you? | Aug 06 11:02 |
fewa | oiaohm, what would happen if these got information? | Aug 06 11:03 |
oiaohm | Lot of things could. Like having who to kill to stuff up current operations. | Aug 06 11:03 |
oiaohm | As I said classifed for good reason. | Aug 06 11:04 |
fewa | oiaohm, how do you know that? | Aug 06 11:04 |
fewa | do you just trust them? | Aug 06 11:04 |
oiaohm | The information will be declasified in 15 years | Aug 06 11:05 |
oiaohm | Its only operational protection. So it all will be open to auditing one day. | Aug 06 11:05 |
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fewa | I dont know about the UK, but this is what the US military does: http://killinghope.org/bblum6/overthrow.htm | Aug 06 11:06 |
oiaohm | Its not like the USA classifed stuff that never sees the light of day. | Aug 06 11:06 |
fewa | *Australia | Aug 06 11:06 |
oiaohm | Not Australian mils nature to do that. | Aug 06 11:07 |
fewa | doesn't even mention the recent Coup is Honduras | Aug 06 11:07 |
fewa | and the elites call for overthrow of regime in Iran | Aug 06 11:07 |
oiaohm | Australian mil normal works with locals to make peace. | Aug 06 11:07 |
fewa | Thats what most Americans think about Yugoslavia | Aug 06 11:08 |
oiaohm | With the idea of leaving as soon as able. | Aug 06 11:08 |
fewa | but its not what happened | Aug 06 11:08 |
oiaohm | For the simple reason we don't have numbers of mil to be long term stuck. | Aug 06 11:08 |
oiaohm | Iraq and afagainsen have been some of australias longest off mainlane deployments. | Aug 06 11:08 |
fewa | well then pass laws that restrict aaccess to these places, that punish people who infiltriate these places | Aug 06 11:09 |
fewa | but laws cannot be targeted at media | Aug 06 11:09 |
fewa | that is not equality under the law, and its a slippery slope | Aug 06 11:09 |
oiaohm | There is equality under the law here. | Aug 06 11:10 |
fewa | but anyways, you know more | Aug 06 11:10 |
oiaohm | Being media does not give any special protection. | Aug 06 11:10 |
fewa | Right to free speech | Aug 06 11:10 |
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oiaohm | There is no such things as rights under australian laws. | Aug 06 11:11 |
fewa | legally | Aug 06 11:11 |
oiaohm | Even legally. | Aug 06 11:11 |
fewa | exclusive rights to property | Aug 06 11:11 |
oiaohm | No | Aug 06 11:11 |
fewa | its not common law? | Aug 06 11:11 |
oiaohm | exclusive rights to property only exist here to the point of critical need. | Aug 06 11:12 |
fewa | but i do admit those types of rights are quite differnt | Aug 06 11:12 |
oiaohm | So it is possiable for police and others in a case of critical need to take your property and use it for the greater good. | Aug 06 11:13 |
fewa | same thing here | Aug 06 11:13 |
oiaohm | Its not really a right if there is a loop hole that voids the right. | Aug 06 11:13 |
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fewa | yes it is | Aug 06 11:14 |
fewa | all civil rights are only as valid as the government that grants them | Aug 06 11:14 |
fewa | so there is a loop hole that if there is government overthrow you loose your rights | Aug 06 11:14 |
oiaohm | Its like freehold land here. You don't own the minerals under it. So a mining company can take out a claim and push you off it. | Aug 06 11:14 |
fewa | yeah we have that change against common law here too | Aug 06 11:15 |
oiaohm | Here as far as property right goes is far money for what you lost. | Aug 06 11:15 |
oiaohm | You have no real legal grounds to dispute property being taken away from you. | Aug 06 11:16 |
oiaohm | If you get fair payment for it. | Aug 06 11:16 |
fewa | In the US there is this irrational concept of suing peoperty | Aug 06 11:16 |
oiaohm | that also not wise here. | Aug 06 11:17 |
oiaohm | The judges here in case of a non solvable dispute can just take the propertity sell it and split the money. | Aug 06 11:17 |
oiaohm | Dispute over. | Aug 06 11:17 |
oiaohm | Basically we don't have what USA people would refer to as rights. | Aug 06 11:18 |
oiaohm | Closest thing we have to rights is anti descrimination laws. | Aug 06 11:18 |
oiaohm | That everyone must be treated equal no matter how rich or poor they are. | Aug 06 11:18 |
fewa | civil forfeiture http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_v._$124,700 | Aug 06 11:19 |
fewa | oiaohm, thats a very good principal | Aug 06 11:19 |
fewa | egalitarianism | Aug 06 11:19 |
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oiaohm | Its far better than the USA right system fewa | Aug 06 11:21 |
oiaohm | There are not loop holes. | Aug 06 11:21 |
fewa | yeah i am not decided | Aug 06 11:21 |
fewa | still a common law background | Aug 06 11:21 |
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fewa | US system seems more conservative | Aug 06 11:22 |
oiaohm | anti descrimination is basically its own legal body here to see to it. | Aug 06 11:22 |
fewa | but its more neuanced than that | Aug 06 11:22 |
fewa | I see common carrier as one of the halmarks of non descrimination | Aug 06 11:23 |
oiaohm | Complete job is to find cases where descrimination has been applied. | Aug 06 11:23 |
oiaohm | And punish those who took part. | Aug 06 11:23 |
oiaohm | Ie not passive form like normal common law. | Aug 06 11:23 |
fewa | It was a political power move for the FCC to state that telecoms are not common carriers | Aug 06 11:23 |
fewa | allows them to sidestep lots of law, and instead dictate | Aug 06 11:24 |
fewa | oiaohm, you can do that in the US too | Aug 06 11:24 |
fewa | its just the words used to describe it are differnt | Aug 06 11:24 |
fewa | amendment 14 and 15 are about "rigts" to equality | Aug 06 11:25 |
fewa | before the civil war US didnt have such a thing | Aug 06 11:25 |
oiaohm | anti descrimantion is a Ombudsman . Not just a bit of paper somewhere. | Aug 06 11:28 |
fewa | the forced desegregation of schools | Aug 06 11:28 |
fewa | it happened | Aug 06 11:28 |
oiaohm | Ie active 100 percent of the time. | Aug 06 11:28 |
fewa | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown_v._Board_of_Education | Aug 06 11:28 |
oiaohm | Ombudsmans job is to find and punish anyone taking part in descrimination. | Aug 06 11:28 |
fewa | Will here you have to have grounding to sue, so i see your distinction | Aug 06 11:28 |
oiaohm | Normal people don't have to go head to head with goverment or anyone less here with there money if they have a valid case. | Aug 06 11:28 |
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oiaohm | Its one of our biggest protections is that its active and simple. | Aug 06 11:28 |
oiaohm | Compared to doing the same thing in the USA that would require lot of resources from the people being descriminated against. | Aug 06 11:29 |
fewa | oiaohm, so is Australian law ... | Aug 06 11:29 |
fewa | i cant think of qord, two sides of arguments | Aug 06 11:30 |
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fewa | so the judicial system is a large part of sociatal regulation there? | Aug 06 11:31 |
oiaohm | Judicial system is major key stone here. | Aug 06 11:31 |
fewa | I like that | Aug 06 11:31 |
oiaohm | In the form of Ombudsman's. | Aug 06 11:31 |
fewa | strong jury and court system seems rational | Aug 06 11:31 |
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oiaohm | A Ombudsman not doing there job and proven so can be personally sued. | Aug 06 11:32 |
oiaohm | For damages. | Aug 06 11:32 |
oiaohm | So they take there job very seriously. | Aug 06 11:32 |
fewa | much better than BS corporate personhood here | Aug 06 11:32 |
oiaohm | What is the point of rights if they are not enforced. | Aug 06 11:33 |
fewa | where noone claims responsibility | Aug 06 11:33 |
fewa | and there is noone to hold responsible | Aug 06 11:33 |
oiaohm | We basically see no need for having written rights while we have enforcement of the basic ideals of the law. | Aug 06 11:33 |
fewa | a system of getter equality is more important than written writes, that is true | Aug 06 11:33 |
oiaohm | The idea of fair treament is written into most countries laws. | Aug 06 11:33 |
fewa | a means to petition the government is a productive manner | Aug 06 11:34 |
fewa | that is super important | Aug 06 11:34 |
fewa | and key to a functioning democracy | Aug 06 11:34 |
oiaohm | Really you miss something. | Aug 06 11:36 |
oiaohm | Ombudsmans also exist here to inspect into goverment kick backs. | Aug 06 11:36 |
oiaohm | From companies. | Aug 06 11:36 |
oiaohm | I really don't know how the USA goverment system would hand that. Were taking money in serect will get people kicked out of being part of goverment. | Aug 06 11:37 |
fewa | Ralph Nader pushed through the Freedom of Information Act here | Aug 06 11:37 |
fewa | it does largely that, and quite successfully | Aug 06 11:38 |
oiaohm | Had that for ages. | Aug 06 11:38 |
fewa | until the Bush regine | Aug 06 11:38 |
fewa | which just ignored it | Aug 06 11:38 |
oiaohm | Freedom of information request is a public request to see information here. | Aug 06 11:38 |
fewa | he needs to be brought to justice for authorizing torture | Aug 06 11:39 |
oiaohm | Ombudsmans are allowed to see documents that never can be released to the public. | Aug 06 11:39 |
oiaohm | Without question. | Aug 06 11:39 |
fewa | all people can see documents here | Aug 06 11:39 |
fewa | except personal information, and classified | Aug 06 11:39 |
fewa | *personal about subjects, not government actors | Aug 06 11:39 |
oiaohm | Ombudsman can see personal and classified if it could be linked to a valid case. | Aug 06 11:40 |
fewa | same here | Aug 06 11:40 |
fewa | called a subpeona | Aug 06 11:40 |
oiaohm | No supeona required. | Aug 06 11:40 |
schestowitz | Black Hat Wi-Fi network hit by 154 DoS attacks < http://blog.internetnews.com/skerner/2009/08/black-hat-wifi-network-hit-by.html > | Aug 06 11:40 |
oiaohm | Ombudsman basically automatically has the supeona to look. | Aug 06 11:40 |
fewa | oiaohm, what do you mean linking to valid case however? | Aug 06 11:40 |
fewa | that is basically a subpoena | Aug 06 11:41 |
oiaohm | Note the could be. | Aug 06 11:41 |
fewa | but i do see the distinction | Aug 06 11:41 |
oiaohm | Ombudsman only has to suspect wrong doing. | Aug 06 11:41 |
fewa | the personal data part is quite limited | Aug 06 11:41 |
oiaohm | To investiage. | Aug 06 11:41 |
fewa | thats why alot of spammers use FOIA | Aug 06 11:41 |
oiaohm | Freedom of information is not fast here. | Aug 06 11:42 |
fewa | It is fast here | Aug 06 11:42 |
oiaohm | Ombudsman can tell you in 24 hours if there is anything is wrong. | Aug 06 11:42 |
oiaohm | Without having to wait a week for Freedom of information to be processed. | Aug 06 11:42 |
fewa | Well, i do admit there needs to be people that can be held responsible for actions | Aug 06 11:43 |
fewa | of every government business deal | Aug 06 11:43 |
oiaohm | Ombudsman job is purely to hold everyone responsible for there actions. | Aug 06 11:43 |
oiaohm | They came part of our system due to large numbers of people we had breaking the law and bribing there way around it at one point. | Aug 06 11:44 |
oiaohm | Its not just goverment deals that need to be held responsible. | Aug 06 11:45 |
fewa | of course | Aug 06 11:45 |
oiaohm | There is nothing in the USA system with the power and responsiablity of our Ombudsans. | Aug 06 11:46 |
oiaohm | There is a lot of power given out in the USA. The responsiablity bit is badly missing. | Aug 06 11:47 |
fewa | it was designed that way from the start | Aug 06 11:47 |
oiaohm | Ours had major responsiablty probems before Ombudsans came into effect. | Aug 06 11:49 |
fewa | But still, have you been to the US? | Aug 06 11:49 |
fewa | Also US government is vey federal | Aug 06 11:49 |
fewa | lots of state control | Aug 06 11:49 |
oiaohm | I still have to get there. | Aug 06 11:49 |
oiaohm | States here almost went rogue due to illegal things going on here. | Aug 06 11:50 |
oiaohm | At one point. | Aug 06 11:50 |
fewa | The way things usually change around here is starting as state referrendums | Aug 06 11:50 |
oiaohm | Also our states are larger than yours. | Aug 06 11:50 |
fewa | and then once over half it becomes federal | Aug 06 11:50 |
fewa | oiaohm, how many states? | Aug 06 11:50 |
fewa | over how many people? | Aug 06 11:51 |
oiaohm | 6 states total. | Aug 06 11:51 |
oiaohm | states total | Aug 06 11:51 |
fewa | oiaohm, yours making a hastly generalization | Aug 06 11:51 |
oiaohm | Land area fewa | Aug 06 11:51 |
fewa | what about california | Aug 06 11:51 |
fewa | texas | Aug 06 11:51 |
fewa | alaska | Aug 06 11:51 |
oiaohm | alaska and western australia are close. | Aug 06 11:51 |
fewa | and what does land area how to do with governance | Aug 06 11:51 |
fewa | population is more important IMHO | Aug 06 11:53 |
oiaohm | We don't have many state referrendums cost of running them due to area makes them very time wasting. | Aug 06 11:53 |
oiaohm | So normally state goverments here agree and go straight to federal referrendums. | Aug 06 11:53 |
fewa | no good/cheap mail system? | Aug 06 11:53 |
fewa | hmm federal referrendums are on same ballot here | Aug 06 11:54 |
fewa | states run federal elections | Aug 06 11:54 |
oiaohm | Not allowed here. | Aug 06 11:54 |
fewa | its caused alot of problems here recently | Aug 06 11:54 |
oiaohm | Since states here still are allowed to do a referrendum to break away from country. | Aug 06 11:54 |
fewa | with diebold fraud | Aug 06 11:54 |
fewa | but also federal doesn't have referrendums here | Aug 06 11:55 |
fewa | only elections | Aug 06 11:55 |
oiaohm | to prevent voiting fraud is costly. | Aug 06 11:55 |
fewa | also votes are state by states | Aug 06 11:55 |
fewa | not by people | Aug 06 11:55 |
fewa | aka, more example of being quite federal | Aug 06 11:55 |
oiaohm | Our votes here directly apply to seats in the federal goverment. | Aug 06 11:55 |
fewa | but there is a move to switch presidential votes to popular vote | Aug 06 11:55 |
oiaohm | Seats are layed out on population numbers. | Aug 06 11:56 |
fewa | this is the difference between party representation and geographical representation | Aug 06 11:56 |
oiaohm | So states don't have equal number of seats. | Aug 06 11:56 |
fewa | I like the partimentary system alot | Aug 06 11:56 |
fewa | seems better | Aug 06 11:56 |
fewa | also your instant runoff ballto system | Aug 06 11:56 |
fewa | like the only place that has that here is San Francisco | Aug 06 11:57 |
oiaohm | and every vote in the seat edges move to keep numbers in seats close to equal. | Aug 06 11:57 |
oiaohm | It gets even funnier at times particular people cannot run in the seat they always did because since the line moved they no longer live in that seat so cannot run for it. | Aug 06 11:58 |
fewa | hmm | Aug 06 11:58 |
fewa | The Democrat and Republican parties do alot of anti-competitive stuff here | Aug 06 11:58 |
fewa | quite descructive to democracy | Aug 06 11:58 |
oiaohm | We only have one major problem here. | Aug 06 11:59 |
oiaohm | Preferinal voting. | Aug 06 11:59 |
fewa | here in Washington they crushed our representative primary voting system | Aug 06 11:59 |
fewa | and replaced it with fake spectator democracy | Aug 06 11:59 |
fewa | where its the parties that have all the power | Aug 06 11:59 |
fewa | not the people, or the canidates | Aug 06 11:59 |
oiaohm | We get independants into goverment a bit. | Aug 06 11:59 |
fewa | (but this only applies to party-based seats) | Aug 06 12:00 |
oiaohm | But its really hard for them. Since they have to win by a large margin. | Aug 06 12:00 |
fewa | The party system here is very corrupting to the democratic system | Aug 06 12:00 |
fewa | for example even if a presidential canidate gets on the ballots on enought states to make it possible to win | Aug 06 12:00 |
oiaohm | Since our major parties agree to give preferenal votes to the other parties over the independants. | Aug 06 12:00 |
fewa | (quite an achievement) | Aug 06 12:00 |
fewa | then they still can't get into the debates | Aug 06 12:00 |
oiaohm | The way it works sux. | Aug 06 12:00 |
fewa | because the dabates are run by the Demo + Rep parties | Aug 06 12:01 |
fewa | and they excluse everyone else | Aug 06 12:01 |
fewa | they even got local police forces to remove Ralph Nader, a third party canidate, from the place of the debates when he had a valid ticket for it | Aug 06 12:01 |
fewa | It makes a mockery of democracy | Aug 06 12:02 |
oiaohm | Lets say we have 3 running. 1 has 45 precent a independant. 1 has 30 percent party 1 and the other has 25 part 2. Since parties 2 gave preference to party 1 And since they are the lowest they get removed and there votes get transfered to party 1 | Aug 06 12:02 |
oiaohm | So the indepenant loses. | Aug 06 12:02 |
fewa | what? | Aug 06 12:02 |
fewa | got a link on the description | Aug 06 12:03 |
fewa | I though the voter sets the instant runoff | Aug 06 12:03 |
oiaohm | That is our voting system. | Aug 06 12:03 |
fewa | not the candidates | Aug 06 12:03 |
fewa | I like a unlimited instant runoff vote | Aug 06 12:03 |
fewa | order as many canidates as you wish in your order of preference | Aug 06 12:03 |
oiaohm | The candidates here get to set simple voting. | Aug 06 12:03 |
fewa | thats wierd | Aug 06 12:03 |
fewa | but i dont really undestand it, so cant really judge it | Aug 06 12:04 |
oiaohm | Ie you place 1 in there box and they get to see your preference for you. | Aug 06 12:04 |
oiaohm | If you number each box you get to set your own preferences. | Aug 06 12:04 |
oiaohm | Yes evil. | Aug 06 12:04 |
fewa | hmm its so alien | Aug 06 12:04 |
oiaohm | Human nature to be lazy. | Aug 06 12:04 |
fewa | cause here everything in same box | Aug 06 12:04 |
fewa | no parliment | Aug 06 12:04 |
fewa | very differn't | Aug 06 12:04 |
oiaohm | And its problem causing. | Aug 06 12:05 |
oiaohm | Its the one major problem our goverment system has. | Aug 06 12:05 |
oiaohm | That the person coming secound can get in just because person coming first did not get over 50 percent is kind bad. | Aug 06 12:05 |
fewa | here there is alot of mail-in-only voting | Aug 06 12:06 |
fewa | in other words, if the US "spreads democracy" it will not really be democracy, but a spectator sport | Aug 06 12:07 |
oiaohm | Also here unlike the USA everyone has to vote. | Aug 06 12:08 |
fewa | felon voter disenfranchisement is wierd | Aug 06 12:08 |
oiaohm | Failure to do so is a fine first year. secound year 2 days in jail. | Aug 06 12:08 |
fewa | oh wut | Aug 06 12:08 |
fewa | i dont support that | Aug 06 12:08 |
fewa | You cant force someone to vote | Aug 06 12:08 |
fewa | just make it easy | Aug 06 12:08 |
fewa | and free | Aug 06 12:08 |
oiaohm | If you turn up and rip up the vote paper you have done what is required. | Aug 06 12:09 |
fewa | how many do that? | Aug 06 12:09 |
oiaohm | Some times a lot. | Aug 06 12:09 |
fewa | thought so :P | Aug 06 12:09 |
fewa | does it count as a none of the above vote? | Aug 06 12:09 |
oiaohm | Without out it there were cases of zero votes for a complete seat. | Aug 06 12:10 |
fewa | holy shit | Aug 06 12:10 |
oiaohm | What caused major problems. | Aug 06 12:10 |
fewa | your turnout is woorse | Aug 06 12:10 |
fewa | i thought US had a problem | Aug 06 12:10 |
oiaohm | Without fines Australians basically would not turn up to vote. | Aug 06 12:10 |
oiaohm | Little bit of nice ness the day you have to vote becomes a public holiday. | Aug 06 12:11 |
fewa | EU vote turnout is so over the place | Aug 06 12:12 |
oiaohm | How far do you have to travel to vote. | Aug 06 12:12 |
fewa | i vote by mail | Aug 06 12:12 |
oiaohm | Some of our seats here have 50 to 100 kms to voting location. | Aug 06 12:12 |
fewa | it costs 41c, which i think should be changed | Aug 06 12:12 |
oiaohm | Mail voting is not prefered here. Simple reason we have had cases of postal vote fraud in past. | Aug 06 12:13 |
fewa | i dont doubt it | Aug 06 12:13 |
fewa | voting is a mess here | Aug 06 12:13 |
fewa | Diablo(tm) voting systems | Aug 06 12:13 |
oiaohm | I know the idea of forced votes sounds bad at first. | Aug 06 12:14 |
fewa | where the CEO announced publically his support of GWB | Aug 06 12:14 |
fewa | in a very suggestive way | Aug 06 12:14 |
oiaohm | It also means our poll stations only have to be open for 1 day. | Aug 06 12:14 |
fewa | COmputerized voting with no paper trail | Aug 06 12:14 |
oiaohm | I think the usa has them open for a week or something stupid. | Aug 06 12:14 |
fewa | and congress forcing out systems that actually work | Aug 06 12:14 |
oiaohm | We have no computeriesed voting. | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | it was horrible | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | oiaohm, no in the US its only one day | Aug 06 12:15 |
oiaohm | Do you have a day off work? | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | tuesday after the first monday | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | no | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | but should be | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | i think some states do | Aug 06 12:15 |
oiaohm | Here is off work. | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | and businesses do | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | tuesday after the first monday in november | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | one day | Aug 06 12:15 |
fewa | alot of fraud here too | Aug 06 12:16 |
oiaohm | Ok this gets more warped. | Aug 06 12:16 |
fewa | understaffing polling stations in porr communities | Aug 06 12:16 |
fewa | so that they have to wait hours | Aug 06 12:16 |
oiaohm | Out going goverment here gets the day here. | Aug 06 12:16 |
fewa | while the rich areas only takes 10 minutes | Aug 06 12:16 |
oiaohm | Of the vote for seats. | Aug 06 12:16 |
fewa | They should change the law where citizens can vote in other areas | Aug 06 12:17 |
fewa | to force these things not to happen | Aug 06 12:17 |
oiaohm | understaffing polling stations would have Ombudsman up you tail here so bad you would not dare do it. | Aug 06 12:17 |
fewa | Its one of the great american disenfranchisements | Aug 06 12:17 |
fewa | only second to poll taxes | Aug 06 12:18 |
oiaohm | Default we can vote at any polling station. | Aug 06 12:18 |
fewa | used to prevent the blacks in the south from voting | Aug 06 12:18 |
oiaohm | What are poll taxes. | Aug 06 12:18 |
fewa | after the civil war | Aug 06 12:18 |
oiaohm | You don't mean you have to pay to vote. | Aug 06 12:18 |
fewa | forcing people to pay to vote | Aug 06 12:18 |
oiaohm | If that was done here no one would vote. | Aug 06 12:18 |
fewa | and discriminatorally | Aug 06 12:18 |
fewa | only to black people | Aug 06 12:19 |
oiaohm | Its kind our nature. | Aug 06 12:19 |
fewa | it was a sad day | Aug 06 12:19 |
oiaohm | You guys have major problomes. | Aug 06 12:19 |
fewa | the US had to pass a constitutional amendment and bring in the military to abolish it | Aug 06 12:19 |
fewa | Slavery was a big problem | Aug 06 12:19 |
fewa | but ive only heard about this | Aug 06 12:19 |
oiaohm | We had slavery here for a while too. | Aug 06 12:20 |
fewa | as i live in the west | Aug 06 12:20 |
fewa | The forced desegregation | Aug 06 12:20 |
oiaohm | Before our system got Ombudsman's and slavery forbin. | Aug 06 12:20 |
fewa | they had to have guards for each black student | Aug 06 12:20 |
fewa | to prevent them from being killed and beat up | Aug 06 12:20 |
oiaohm | I guess you heard of the rum rebionion in australia. | Aug 06 12:20 |
fewa | no, but there was prohibition is the US | Aug 06 12:21 |
oiaohm | The problem was people were being paid in rum instead of cash. | Aug 06 12:21 |
fewa | a nation wide ban on alcohol | Aug 06 12:21 |
oiaohm | You require cash to buy land. | Aug 06 12:21 |
fewa | oiaohm, the United States is very diverse | Aug 06 12:21 |
oiaohm | Australia is fairly diverse. | Aug 06 12:22 |
oiaohm | Just with lots of spaces. | Aug 06 12:22 |
fewa | we got that too | Aug 06 12:22 |
fewa | ive seen it in the US | Aug 06 12:22 |
fewa | they call it the great plains | Aug 06 12:22 |
fewa | use to be heards of buffalo | Aug 06 12:22 |
oiaohm | Yours are normally living great spaces. | Aug 06 12:23 |
fewa | now its cows | Aug 06 12:23 |
oiaohm | Not like our deserts. | Aug 06 12:23 |
oiaohm | Get stuck out there you are basically stuffed | Aug 06 12:23 |
fewa | and antelope | Aug 06 12:23 |
fewa | oiaohm, we got that too | Aug 06 12:23 |
fewa | the whole state of Navada is like that | Aug 06 12:23 |
oiaohm | Most of our population is also conserated on the east sea board. | Aug 06 12:24 |
oiaohm | Like over 70 percent of it. | Aug 06 12:24 |
fewa | we have two seaboards | Aug 06 12:24 |
fewa | and the easy is very wide | Aug 06 12:24 |
oiaohm | Other seaboard boards basically have no one on them. | Aug 06 12:25 |
fewa | but ive not really been there | Aug 06 12:25 |
oiaohm | Basically most of australia has no one in it. | Aug 06 12:25 |
fewa | big culture difference between west and east | Aug 06 12:25 |
oiaohm | same here. | Aug 06 12:25 |
fewa | and of course culture in central, + alaska, + hawaii | Aug 06 12:25 |
oiaohm | perth is about the only highlight on the west. | Aug 06 12:25 |
oiaohm | There are no other major citys on the west sea board. | Aug 06 12:26 |
oiaohm | Note the west sea board also has the largest state. | Aug 06 12:26 |
oiaohm | Ie 1 state for the complete thing. | Aug 06 12:27 |
oiaohm | where the east is 3 states. | Aug 06 12:27 |
fewa | ie alaska | Aug 06 12:27 |
oiaohm | Reason why I said alaska and our west are basically the same. | Aug 06 12:27 |
fewa | what about your aborigines there? | Aug 06 12:27 |
oiaohm | Except alaska is cold and west is god darn hot. | Aug 06 12:28 |
fewa | yeah | Aug 06 12:28 |
fewa | :P | Aug 06 12:28 |
fewa | climate of west prob more like navada | Aug 06 12:28 |
fewa | and southern california | Aug 06 12:28 |
oiaohm | What would be your windest. | Aug 06 12:28 |
fewa | in the plains | Aug 06 12:29 |
oiaohm | It has the rorring 40's wind hitting it too. | Aug 06 12:29 |
fewa | oklahoma | Aug 06 12:29 |
oiaohm | Basically put all three together and you have the west here. | Aug 06 12:29 |
fewa | Nevada dessert wasnt too windy when i was there | Aug 06 12:29 |
oiaohm | aborigines here we are still having problems getting there communities working. | Aug 06 12:30 |
oiaohm | They so like living out in the middle of no where. | Aug 06 12:30 |
fewa | what is their legal situation | Aug 06 12:30 |
oiaohm | Equals | Aug 06 12:30 |
fewa | legal situation here is a mess | Aug 06 12:31 |
fewa | same in Canada | Aug 06 12:31 |
oiaohm | They do have land rights as well where they can claim particular sites of importance. | Aug 06 12:31 |
fewa | they are all US, (or canadian) citizens, but there is alot of additonal politics | Aug 06 12:31 |
fewa | For example they have their own national health system | Aug 06 12:32 |
oiaohm | Currently our biggest problem is getting medical and education to them. | Aug 06 12:32 |
fewa | single-payer | Aug 06 12:32 |
oiaohm | And I do mean getting medical and education to them. | Aug 06 12:32 |
fewa | They probably get better health care coverage than non-indians here, if they want it | Aug 06 12:32 |
oiaohm | Not really. | Aug 06 12:32 |
fewa | as US healthcare is such a mess | Aug 06 12:32 |
fewa | the elites here have tried to defraud all the veterns from their entitlement to healthcare | Aug 06 12:33 |
oiaohm | Ok here due to how far they live away from normal here they have 10 to 20 years less live span than the adverage for our aborigines. | Aug 06 12:33 |
oiaohm | Then take for thousands of years they had nothing like beer. So when they get drunk they get badly drunk. | Aug 06 12:34 |
fewa | Differnt cultures too | Aug 06 12:34 |
fewa | here the natives have huge problems with alcoholism | Aug 06 12:34 |
fewa | well ok, same thing | Aug 06 12:35 |
oiaohm | Its not exacly the same thing. | Aug 06 12:35 |
oiaohm | Problem with getting drunk here for them is the suger. | Aug 06 12:35 |
oiaohm | They are not genically use to that as well. | Aug 06 12:35 |
fewa | but alcohol isn't that good | Aug 06 12:36 |
oiaohm | When I say badly drunk I mean almost dead. | Aug 06 12:36 |
fewa | thats dessert society | Aug 06 12:36 |
fewa | makes a differnt composition | Aug 06 12:36 |
oiaohm | Basically you don't help them drown there sorrows if you want them alive the next day. | Aug 06 12:37 |
fewa | in addition to lack of metobolism of alcohol like we have here | Aug 06 12:37 |
oiaohm | 1 or 2 bottles and some of them here turn volient as well. | Aug 06 12:38 |
fewa | alcohol is poison | Aug 06 12:38 |
oiaohm | Due to slow metobolism and very little resistance to alcohol. | Aug 06 12:38 |
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fewa | its just that many westerners have some immunity | Aug 06 12:38 |
oiaohm | New zealanders have way more than westerners | Aug 06 12:39 |
Ng | alcohol dehydrogenase \o/ | Aug 06 12:40 |
fewa | all those debtors :P | Aug 06 12:40 |
schestowitz | Red Bull give ya wings! | Aug 06 12:41 |
schestowitz | banned in Europe now | Aug 06 12:42 |
schestowitz | Those kids partying all night tillt he heart attack | Aug 06 12:42 |
fewa | caffeine drinks do need some sort of regulation | Aug 06 12:42 |
Ng | it's only banned in france right now afair? | Aug 06 12:42 |
Ng | oh some of germany too | Aug 06 12:42 |
Ng | woah and denmark. epic nannyism | Aug 06 12:43 |
fewa | banning is a bit extreme | Aug 06 12:44 |
fewa | and doesnt make much sense | Aug 06 12:44 |
Ng | indeed | Aug 06 12:44 |
Ng | we have a growing market for "energy" drinks in the UK atm, there are a variety of brands that sell them in all shapes and sizes and strengths | Aug 06 12:45 |
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fewa | that originated in the US | Aug 06 12:53 |
fewa | YOu havnt seen how big they get here | Aug 06 12:54 |
schestowitz | Gartner spread FOSS FUD, as usual, Asay feeds them along with other FOSS-hostile ones like Forrester that Microsoft paid to attack Linux: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10303566-16.html | Aug 06 12:54 |
schestowitz | I've just made Firefox nearly redundant for browsing. I'll brose with gekco in Thunderbird instead | Aug 06 12:55 |
schestowitz | http://www.h-online.com/open/Microsoft-acknowledges-competition-from-Canonical-and-Red-Hat--/news/113935 (Microsoft acknowledges competition from Canonical and Red Hat) | Aug 06 12:55 |
schestowitz | A Late X Server 1.7 Means No Update For Ubuntu 9.10 < http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NzQzNA > | Aug 06 13:03 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Thanks to a tip from @kabatology , I have just moved to ThunderBrowse as my primary Web browser (Konq and FF are secondary). | Aug 06 13:05 | |
*amarsh04_ is now known as amarsh04 | Aug 06 13:08 | |
schestowitz | Google Launches A Major Offensive Against Microsoft With “Going Google” http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/08/02/google-launches-a-major-offensive-against-microsoft-with-going-google/ | Aug 06 13:38 |
schestowitz | Shanghai bans heavy polluting vehicles from downtown http://mobile.shanghaiist.com/2009/08/03/shanghai_bans_heavy_polluting_vehic.php | Aug 06 13:40 |
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schestowitz | EC Survey: Third Of Young People Won’t Pay For Online Content < http://paidcontent.co.uk/article/419-ec-survey-third-of-young-people-wont-pay-for-online-content/ > That's fine! | Aug 06 13:50 |
schestowitz | Twitter's down | Aug 06 13:55 |
schestowitz | http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?title=linux_s_user_interface_puts_ms_windows_t&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1 "|[ctrl][alt][numlock] doesn't seem to work on my KDE 4.3 / Debian Sid setup. Is it an XOrg thing? A DE thing (which DE)?Yes the Windows desktop is not a fun place to be." | Aug 06 13:57 |
MinceR | isn't there an xorg.conf (or *.fdi) setting to enable that? | Aug 06 13:58 |
schestowitz | MinceR: doesn't work in KDE 3.5.10 here | Aug 06 14:00 |
schestowitz | kde 4.3 is here :) quick gentoo (upgrade) guide < http://www.linuxized.com/2009/08/kde-4-3-is-here-quick-gentoo-upgrade-guide/ > | Aug 06 14:00 |
schestowitz | LGP is looking for C/C++ developers for porting games to Linux < http://www.linux-gamers.net/modules/news/article.php?storyid=2586 > | Aug 06 14:02 |
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schestowitz | bbl | Aug 06 14:07 |
fewa | British Lawmaker David Davis Challenges US Threats to Suppress Evidence of CIA Torture http://www.democracynow.org/2009/8/5/british_lawmaker_david_davis_challenges_us | Aug 06 14:11 |
oiaohm | My current kde is part way between kde 3.5 and 4.2 | Aug 06 14:37 |
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fewa | what do you mean? | Aug 06 15:03 |
fewa | the core system is completely rewritten | Aug 06 15:03 |
MinceR | you can probably mix and match apps though | Aug 06 15:07 |
oiaohm | ITs heavy mixed and matched. | Aug 06 15:08 |
oiaohm | I still have kde 3.5 doing lot of wm work. But support things like clock and network controls are from 4.2 | Aug 06 15:09 |
oiaohm | Basically there is not enough left of kde 3.5 to be just 3.5 any more and there is not enough kde 4.2 to be 4.2 | Aug 06 15:10 |
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Balrog | http://advice.cio.com/shane_oneill/bing_search_tainted_by_pro_microsoft_results | Aug 06 15:16 |
Balrog | http://search.slashdot.org/story/09/08/06/1334225/Bing-Search-Tainted-By-Pro-Microsoft-Results | Aug 06 15:16 |
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thenixedreport | http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2009/08/walking-kid-home.html | Aug 06 15:36 |
ha ha, look how safe RFID tagged passports make you http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/08/fed-rfid/ | Aug 06 15:41 | |
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Balrog_ | twitter is being ddos'ed | Aug 06 15:53 |
all is clear in Tacoma | Aug 06 15:53 | |
people seem to like benchmarks showing that Vista 7 is slower than XP and that Ubuntu slaps them both http://slashdot.org/submission/1051033/Windows-7-Still-Slower-than-XP-and-Ubuntu | Aug 06 15:56 | |
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Omar87 | Hi | Aug 06 15:57 |
With benchmarks like that, M$ is stuck talking about "look and feel" | Aug 06 15:57 | |
but it's hard to see what kind of good feeling a slow, buggy system will yeild. | Aug 06 15:57 | |
MinceR | the feeling of desire of something that sucks less. | Aug 06 15:57 |
Omar87 | I was chatting in Chris Pirillo's channel at the Wyldryde network. | Aug 06 15:57 |
fewa | thats what happens you insert huge DRM scemes into your products, making them less usefull and performing | Aug 06 15:58 |
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MinceR | and "look and feel" is not something m$ should be proud of anyway :> | Aug 06 15:58 |
Omar87 | Tried to start a polite argument about M$ begging iPhone devs to save her child. | Aug 06 15:58 |
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digital restrictions are designed to impede | Aug 06 15:58 | |
Omar87 | But I was kicked immediately by the bots. :) | Aug 06 15:58 |
they must hate "M$" characters | Aug 06 15:59 | |
I like watching Chris Pirillo explode over Vista | Aug 06 15:59 | |
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M$ people like to call free software advocates, "zealots," but only windows is annoying enough to raise passions like that. | Aug 06 16:00 | |
fewa | if you have passions about Linux, you cn use them to change it | Aug 06 16:01 |
fewa | or any free software for that manner | Aug 06 16:01 |
http://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/215115 | Aug 06 16:01 | |
Omar87 | twitter: I didn't really write it "M$", I actually wrote the full name. | Aug 06 16:02 |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqalHbrttV0&feature=related | Aug 06 16:02 | |
then your kick must have been manual | Aug 06 16:02 | |
oh yes, here it is. The big Chris Vista rant http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2JJZMhFaG0 | Aug 06 16:03 | |
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Omar87 | twitter: But then take a look at this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYIfyDENTIY&feature=channel | Aug 06 16:07 |
Omar87 | twitter: This guy's totall retard.. :) | Aug 06 16:07 |
Omar87 | twitter: correction--> This guy's a total retard.. :) | Aug 06 16:08 |
Omar87 | twitter: a month after a BSOD came and kicked him in the ***, he came back yapping: "It's not Vista's problem. It's your 'junky hardware' that is the problem." | Aug 06 16:11 |
Omar87 | twitter: I'm just wondering how much did Ballmer pay him for these words. | Aug 06 16:12 |
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schestowitz | Balrog: any link about the twitter status? | Aug 06 16:18 |
schestowitz | > * BNc has quit ("malformed JSON string, neither array, object, number, string or atom, at character offset 0 (before "<!DOCTYPE html PUBLI...") | Aug 06 16:19 |
schestowitz | "Oh my God. They killed twitfolk. You b*stards" | Aug 06 16:19 |
schestowitz | > <twitter> M$ people like to call free software advocates, "zealots" | Aug 06 16:22 |
schestowitz | You could call people who push you to using Windows "Zealots" | Aug 06 16:22 |
schestowitz | Zealots should have nothing to do with what's done more commonly | Aug 06 16:23 |
schestowitz | w.youtube.com/watch?v=yX8yrOAjfKM&NR=1 | Aug 06 16:24 |
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schestowitz | http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8186822.stm ( Lenovo makes third straight loss ) Lenovo is close to Microsoft, so this if good news | Aug 06 16:41 |
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schestowitz | Global banking collapse fails to dent broadband < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/06/ofcom_market/ > | Aug 06 16:43 |
schestowitz | Hi, _Hicham_ | Aug 06 16:43 |
_Hicham_ | hi schestowitz | Aug 06 16:43 |
schestowitz | Twitter is up and down today (I hear it's DDOS) and also been sued http://ping.fm/43m5X | Aug 06 16:43 |
schestowitz | Brit diplomats' mission to expose Scientology's 'diploma mill' http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/06/scientology_diplomat_probe/ | Aug 06 16:47 |
Xarver | Guys I want to make a screencast on programming probably what should it be about | Aug 06 16:48 |
_Hicham_ | Xarver : about Aspect Oriented Programming | Aug 06 16:48 |
Xarver | Aspect? | Aug 06 16:48 |
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schestowitz | Object? | Aug 06 16:49 |
schestowitz | AOP? | Aug 06 16:49 |
Xarver | I only know of functional and object | Aug 06 16:50 |
schestowitz | CVS vs Git vs SVN | Aug 06 16:50 |
Xarver | Hehe | Aug 06 16:50 |
Xarver | I know nothing about them though :P | Aug 06 16:50 |
schestowitz | ECT is troilling Wals? http://www.linuxinsider.com/rsstory/67776.html | Aug 06 16:52 |
schestowitz | *trolling Wales | Aug 06 16:52 |
Xarver | So any screencast ideas | Aug 06 16:59 |
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thenixedreport | Hey Roy. | Aug 06 17:03 |
thenixedreport | Did you get my e-mail? | Aug 06 17:03 |
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Balrog | schestowitz: it's slowly coming back up | Aug 06 17:09 |
Balrog | Facebook is also acting up, btw | Aug 06 17:09 |
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schestowitz | thenixedreport: let me chrck | Aug 06 17:14 |
schestowitz | http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Palm-Pre-and-My-Tether/?kc=rss (Palm fires back at Apple as Pre debuts on Amazon) | Aug 06 17:14 |
schestowitz | Balrog: makes me feel better to find other victims of DDoS. It's a real nightmare | Aug 06 17:15 |
schestowitz | thenixedreport: yes, sounds good | Aug 06 17:15 |
schestowitz | Can you say more about it? | Aug 06 17:15 |
schestowitz | I wouldn't ever try to fork the FS or use another name | Aug 06 17:16 |
schestowitz | Look what the OSS people did... RMS was right.. they just confused | Aug 06 17:16 |
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Omar87 | Hi | Aug 06 17:20 |
Omar87 | So what about that Bloatnux thing? | Aug 06 17:20 |
schestowitz | Have you installed it? | Aug 06 17:20 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] @davidgerard: what's with all the WP FUD? http://bit.ly/fKEgd | Aug 06 17:20 | |
Omar87 | Nope | Aug 06 17:20 |
Omar87 | Haven't even downloaded it yet. | Aug 06 17:21 |
schestowitz | thenixedreport: yes, that's RMS... | Aug 06 17:21 |
schestowitz | It might be worth airing | Aug 06 17:21 |
Omar87 | So what about it? | Aug 06 17:21 |
schestowitz | If the idea is to establish another name and spread it by all sorts of mean, it would probably be damaging like a fork | Aug 06 17:22 |
schestowitz | Omar87: like it says in the post, it's filled with mono | Aug 06 17:22 |
Omar87 | It's real? | Aug 06 17:22 |
schestowitz | Yes, go get it | Aug 06 17:23 |
schestowitz | You can run it as a live CD too | Aug 06 17:23 |
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Omar87 | And why would I wanna use something filled with Mono? :) | Aug 06 17:23 |
schestowitz | http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1496436/internet-advertising-continues-fall (Internet advertising continues to fall ) | Aug 06 17:24 |
schestowitz | Omar87: it's a statement against Mono advocates | Aug 06 17:25 |
schestowitz | Implying mono opposers are ill paranoid | Aug 06 17:25 |
schestowitz | This one shows Mono is bloat and risky (SueMe Linux) | Aug 06 17:25 |
Balrog | schestowitz: we don't know much about what's going on | Aug 06 17:25 |
Balrog | other then some people are trying to bring those sites down (twitter appears to be down again) | Aug 06 17:25 |
schestowitz | Did Twitter do something? | Aug 06 17:26 |
schestowitz | Like allow people to annoy China? | Aug 06 17:26 |
Balrog | Twitter doesn't actively prevent people from annoying China | Aug 06 17:27 |
schestowitz | Was there a controversy? | Aug 06 17:27 |
schestowitz | The one I can think of is Iran | Aug 06 17:27 |
Balrog | apparently not | Aug 06 17:28 |
schestowitz | There was an article this morning in the MSBBC | Aug 06 17:28 |
Balrog | as I said, facebook is acting up too | Aug 06 17:28 |
schestowitz | The founder of Twitter said that the downtime or whatever was not caused by orders from the US government | Aug 06 17:28 |
schestowitz | He dismissed some rumours | Aug 06 17:28 |
Balrog | //that/ downtime | Aug 06 17:28 |
schestowitz | Facebook acting up? Good! | Aug 06 17:28 |
schestowitz | is.gd! | Aug 06 17:28 |
Balrog | this downtime is by ddos | Aug 06 17:28 |
Balrog | this downtime is by ddos | Aug 06 17:28 |
Balrog | err sorry | Aug 06 17:29 |
Balrog | ...why good? | Aug 06 17:29 |
schestowitz | I know, I'm semi-joking, BUT | Aug 06 17:29 |
schestowitz | In a way, more DDOS will raise awareness of WIndows botnets | Aug 06 17:29 |
Balrog | true. | Aug 06 17:29 |
schestowitz | People will say enough and kick more Wintendo boxes off networks | Aug 06 17:29 |
schestowitz | Our DNS servers are messed up by them | Aug 06 17:29 |
schestowitz | I'm using opendns at the moment cause of that | Aug 06 17:29 |
Balrog | I hear. | Aug 06 17:30 |
Balrog | :\ | Aug 06 17:30 |
schestowitz | thenixedreport: if we were to set up a pro-ethics movement, then what...? | Aug 06 17:32 |
schestowitz | I find that many issues won't dabble in FS unless they have a good understanding of /why/ | Aug 06 17:32 |
schestowitz | They think of power (Firefox), not ethics | Aug 06 17:32 |
schestowitz | I learned that people are educated to misunderstand freedom and associate it with fake choice and other things, and not by accident. | Aug 06 17:33 |
schestowitz | EFF deals with rights, not freedom | Aug 06 17:34 |
schestowitz | But then there's FSF, which revolves around GNU system and GPL for developers | Aug 06 17:34 |
schestowitz | RMS is also increasingly interested in broader political issues | Aug 06 17:34 |
schestowitz | Patent systems are among them. | Aug 06 17:34 |
Omar87 | ~"It will have to be 2010 before the economic news starts to get better, just in time for the world to end in 2012. µ "~ Huh? | Aug 06 17:36 |
schestowitz | Omar87: where from? | Aug 06 17:37 |
Omar87 | I personally don't believe that 2012 will be the end of the world. | Aug 06 17:37 |
schestowitz | Omar87: there's that 2012 stupidity | Aug 06 17:37 |
Omar87 | http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1496436/internet-advertising-continues-fall | Aug 06 17:37 |
schestowitz | http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=2012+apocalypse&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&ie=UTF-8 | Aug 06 17:37 |
schestowitz | Omar87: INQ is humourous, so maybe it was intended as a joke about the apocalypse nuttery | Aug 06 17:38 |
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thenixedreport | Guess which distro I'm going to try next? | Aug 06 17:44 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 17:44 |
thenixedreport | CentOS? | Aug 06 17:45 |
thenixedreport | Again. | Aug 06 17:45 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 17:45 |
thenixedreport | I bought an extra machine. | Aug 06 17:45 |
Xarver | Have you tried Mandriva? | Aug 06 17:49 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Microsoft blames open source for revenue fall: http://u.nu/5trr | Aug 06 17:52 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Microsoft slammed over Bing's sponsored online drug ads: http://u.nu/2urr | Aug 06 17:52 | |
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schestowitz | centos on a desktop? | Aug 06 17:53 |
schestowitz | Caitlyn tried. | Aug 06 17:53 |
thenixedreport | On a netbook, yes... | Aug 06 17:53 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 17:53 |
thenixedreport | I think I'll try it on the netbook I just purchased (when it arrives sometime next week). | Aug 06 17:54 |
thenixedreport | I read her column. | Aug 06 17:54 |
thenixedreport | There is a problem. | Aug 06 17:54 |
schestowitz | Why don't you try bloatnux? | Aug 06 17:54 |
thenixedreport | Her recommendation against the distribution is based on a very small issue. | Aug 06 17:54 |
schestowitz | It's the latest BN distro | Aug 06 17:54 |
schestowitz | SueMe was Slax based and Shane doesn't maintain it anymore | Aug 06 17:54 |
Xarver | So any screencast ideas? | Aug 06 17:54 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 17:54 |
schestowitz | Xarver: kde 4.3, definitely | Aug 06 17:55 |
schestowitz | We ought to have promotional videos of it. You could manually install it from repos/source | Aug 06 17:55 |
Xarver | Mandriva 2009.1 doesn't have kde 4.3 :( | Aug 06 17:55 |
thenixedreport | Any enterprise environment worth anything would test any security updates before applying them anyway. | Aug 06 17:55 |
Xarver | Nah I'd rather wait 'till November for 2010 | Aug 06 17:56 |
schestowitz | Xarver: you can build it for Mandruva | Aug 06 17:56 |
thenixedreport | Besides which, even workstations have (or should anyway) limited access to the Internet to protect from vulnerabilities. | Aug 06 17:56 |
schestowitz | Or check the cooker people. | Aug 06 17:56 |
thenixedreport | At least, that's what a smart IT crew would do. | Aug 06 17:56 |
Xarver | schestowitz: did you do it? | Aug 06 17:56 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] 'Kill IE6' campaign gains force; 30M Web users get switch pitch: http://is.gd/25cjx | Aug 06 17:56 | |
thenixedreport | So the whole thing over a Firefox update not being applied asap is really a red herring as far as I'm concerned. | Aug 06 17:56 |
Xarver | >.> | Aug 06 18:00 |
schestowitz | thenixedreport: I'm sort of trying to avoid Firefox now for most things | Aug 06 18:00 |
schestowitz | I use ThunderBrowse | Aug 06 18:00 |
thenixedreport | ? | Aug 06 18:01 |
schestowitz | Firefox is needed for sites with cookies and Flash | Aug 06 18:01 |
thenixedreport | ThunderBrowse? | Aug 06 18:01 |
schestowitz | Yeah | Aug 06 18:01 |
schestowitz | FOund out about it in the afternoon | Aug 06 18:01 |
schestowitz | I do everything in my mail client and kate now | Aug 06 18:01 |
thenixedreport | Wow. | Aug 06 18:01 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 18:01 |
thenixedreport | And an irc client... | Aug 06 18:02 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 18:02 |
schestowitz | Not really | Aug 06 18:04 |
schestowitz | xchat | Aug 06 18:04 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] A Late X Server 1.7 Means No Update For Ubuntu 9.10: http://is.gd/25cBh | Aug 06 18:04 | |
schestowitz | I also use Konqueror for stuff | Aug 06 18:04 |
schestowitz | My relationship with Firefox went bad because extensions seem to cause conflicts, so it can mess up and take over 1GB of RAM (and slow down before I notice) | Aug 06 18:04 |
thenixedreport | Understood. | Aug 06 18:05 |
schestowitz | trmanco: as we all know, all that Linux is.. is Ubuntu /sarcasm | Aug 06 18:05 |
thenixedreport | I'm waiting for a webkit-based browser to rise up. | Aug 06 18:05 |
schestowitz | Chrome | Aug 06 18:05 |
thenixedreport | Not necessarily. | Aug 06 18:05 |
thenixedreport | There are other projects. | Aug 06 18:05 |
thenixedreport | I would rather they succeed before Chrome does. | Aug 06 18:05 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 18:06 |
schestowitz | thenixedreport: http://news.cnet.com/8301-1001_3-10303762-92.html | Aug 06 18:06 |
schestowitz | Watch it | Aug 06 18:06 |
schestowitz | There's another one | Aug 06 18:06 |
thenixedreport | Yeah, and? | Aug 06 18:06 |
schestowitz | http://blog.lynxworks.eu/20090802/replacing-firefox/ | Aug 06 18:06 |
schestowitz | AArora | Aug 06 18:06 |
schestowitz | Give it a shot | Aug 06 18:06 |
schestowitz | Arora | Aug 06 18:07 |
thenixedreport | I've used it. | Aug 06 18:07 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 18:07 |
thenixedreport | It's fast! | Aug 06 18:07 |
thenixedreport | Very fast. | Aug 06 18:07 |
schestowitz | There's the one with a long name | Aug 06 18:07 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 18:07 |
schestowitz | Not sure it's maintained | Aug 06 18:07 |
schestowitz | Something like kanbaulatrsddk3@# | Aug 06 18:07 |
thenixedreport | There's also Midori. | Aug 06 18:07 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 18:07 |
thenixedreport | Though they need to speed it up a little bit. | Aug 06 18:07 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 18:07 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Twitter hit by denial of service attack (CNN): http://is.gd/25cZY #ddos #dos | Aug 06 18:07 | |
thenixedreport | I don't care about skinning a web browser. | Aug 06 18:07 |
schestowitz | I'm trying to escape some plugin bloat | Aug 06 18:08 |
schestowitz | More is not always better | Aug 06 18:08 |
schestowitz | Clutter... | Aug 06 18:08 |
schestowitz | Weight... | Aug 06 18:08 |
schestowitz | Spyware | Aug 06 18:08 |
thenixedreport | Could that be anti-sec that's trying to take down Twitter? | Aug 06 18:08 |
schestowitz | Like Alexa, Netcraft, Compete... | Aug 06 18:08 |
schestowitz | OT Yikes,. No wonder it smells like plastic here. My stove burned a cereal box :-o | Aug 06 18:10 |
thenixedreport | lol | Aug 06 18:11 |
thenixedreport | CentOS is installing rather quickly. | Aug 06 18:11 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 18:11 |
thenixedreport | Woot! | Aug 06 18:11 |
fewa | 5? | Aug 06 18:12 |
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MinceR | 192813 < schestowitz> There's the one with a long name | Aug 06 18:12 |
MinceR | Kazehakase? | Aug 06 18:12 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[d235j] RT @stroughtonsmith: "Apple Rejecting All e-Book App Store Submissions?" http://tinyurl.com/noc8ph (truncated) | Aug 06 18:13 | |
trmanco | http://news.cnet.com/8301-27076_3-10302768-248.html?part=rss&tag=feed&subj=Webware | Aug 06 18:13 |
trmanco | is this actually new? | Aug 06 18:13 |
trmanco | I can't remember what service they were going to shut down a few days ago | Aug 06 18:14 |
fewa | MSFT has been shutting down failed projects forever | Aug 06 18:14 |
fewa | Its had so many lately | Aug 06 18:14 |
trmanco | to many | Aug 06 18:14 |
trmanco | that I can't even keep track of | Aug 06 18:14 |
fewa | and they all look the same | Aug 06 18:14 |
fewa | thats why it doesn't matter, and don't care if that individual one is new | Aug 06 18:14 |
trmanco | hopefully they will shut down their IM service | Aug 06 18:14 |
trmanco | and then hotmail | Aug 06 18:15 |
fewa | they wont do that | Aug 06 18:15 |
trmanco | or live mail or msn mais or whatever | Aug 06 18:15 |
fewa | they may start taxing it | Aug 06 18:15 |
trmanco | mail* | Aug 06 18:15 |
schestowitz | MinceR: that's the one | Aug 06 18:15 |
fewa | trying to squeeze money out of users | Aug 06 18:15 |
schestowitz | I think it was longer | Aug 06 18:15 |
schestowitz | Gecko based | Aug 06 18:15 |
trmanco | omg | Aug 06 18:15 |
fewa | *wringing it | Aug 06 18:16 |
trmanco | look at this | Aug 06 18:16 |
MinceR | iirc it could be compiled with WebKit too | Aug 06 18:16 |
MinceR | i never managed to do so though | Aug 06 18:16 |
trmanco | Hi, Tony Manco. | Aug 06 18:16 |
trmanco | Microsoft News (MicrosoftFix) is now following your tweets on Twitter. | Aug 06 18:16 |
fewa | Thats why people should have their own names, names they own | Aug 06 18:16 |
trmanco | "# Bio News about Microsoft. (Not Affiliated with Microsoft Corp)" | Aug 06 18:16 |
trmanco | ah, I feel more comfortable now | Aug 06 18:17 |
schestowitz | trmanco: he did this with another FOSS company | Aug 06 18:17 |
trmanco | it's probably a bot that searches for certain keywords and then follows the poster | Aug 06 18:17 |
tacone | yum. linuxoutlaws compares samsung with the first iphone | Aug 06 18:17 |
schestowitz | See BN on "MicrosoftFix" | Aug 06 18:17 |
schestowitz | Goblin and others wrote about it | Aug 06 18:18 |
tacone | with nice results | Aug 06 18:18 |
fewa | trmanco, it looks fairly sane http://twitter.com/MicrosoftFix | Aug 06 18:18 |
schestowitz | tacone: Samsung = ms patent racket | Aug 06 18:18 |
fewa | aka Microsoft Admits Fear of Linux - PC World http://tinyurl.com/nrpx8q #Microsoft | Aug 06 18:18 |
fewa | Microsoft Admits That Linux Desktop Elephant Exists - ChannelWeb http://tinyurl.com/n3kkxb #Microsoft | Aug 06 18:18 |
tacone | the android samsung | Aug 06 18:19 |
schestowitz | Still | Aug 06 18:19 |
tacone | ms patent racket = pretty much anyone | Aug 06 18:19 |
zoobab01 | http://www.itscj.ipsj.or.jp/sc34/ | Aug 06 18:19 |
zoobab01 | Microsoft organising the SC34 meeting of ISO for OOXML maintenance | Aug 06 18:20 |
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schestowitz | zoobab01: who pays for dinner? | Aug 06 18:21 |
schestowitz | Georg Greve: http://identi.ca/notice/7301023 "Microsoft planning to freeze ODF at "broken useless" level by blocking updates at ISO? Seems quite possible..." | Aug 06 18:22 |
fewa | schestowitz, see how it archives the target link | Aug 06 18:24 |
fewa | thats something done with foresight | Aug 06 18:24 |
schestowitz | US CTO | Aug 06 18:25 |
schestowitz | http://www.pcworld.com/article/169637/obamas_cto_gets_warm_welcome_in_silicon_valley.html | Aug 06 18:25 |
schestowitz | ""I'm a big fan of open collaboration, not specifically open source," he said. "I have no problem with people buying Microsoft and Oracle, but the challenge is the dollars spent on top of that afterwards, the custom development." Various departments create custom software modules and don't share them with other departments, he said. "So we're trying to create a way of sharing intellectual property."" | Aug 06 18:25 |
schestowitz | intellectual what:? | Aug 06 18:25 |
fewa | junk | Aug 06 18:26 |
schestowitz | fewa: the ISO one? | Aug 06 18:26 |
fewa | its political staging | Aug 06 18:26 |
fewa | that quote | Aug 06 18:26 |
fewa | you erect the straw man of describing a non-rival good as property, and then you professing about sharing it | Aug 06 18:27 |
fewa | when sharing is the whole point | Aug 06 18:27 |
fewa | it the classic opressive game | Aug 06 18:27 |
fewa | take away someones rights, and then sell them back piecemeal | Aug 06 18:27 |
schestowitz | "Open"... | Aug 06 18:28 |
schestowitz | Well, Microsoft JasonM has just redefined it again | Aug 06 18:28 |
schestowitz | To be symbiotic with RAND | Aug 06 18:28 |
schestowitz | Glyn wrote about i | Aug 06 18:28 |
schestowitz | *it | Aug 06 18:28 |
*desu has quit ("Leaving") | Aug 06 18:28 | |
Xarver | Any screencast ideas? :P | Aug 06 18:38 |
schestowitz | What is this junk...? http://www.itbusiness.ca/it/client/en/home/News.asp?id=54074 | Aug 06 18:40 |
schestowitz | Xarver: screencast about screencasts about screencasts..... | Aug 06 18:41 |
Xarver | O.o | Aug 06 18:41 |
schestowitz | https://twitter.com/jlundstocholm/status/3166988159 | Aug 06 18:44 |
trmanco | http://news.cnet.com/8301-19518_3-10304823-238.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-20 | Aug 06 18:44 |
trmanco | :o | Aug 06 18:44 |
schestowitz | Lund is a Microsoft shill | Aug 06 18:45 |
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schestowitz | Supported Features http://xkcd.com/619/ | Aug 06 18:59 |
MinceR | that comic fails | Aug 06 19:00 |
Xarver | I love xkcd | Aug 06 19:00 |
MinceR | ask adobe about fixing trash, don't expect random kernel patches to do so. | Aug 06 19:00 |
MinceR | generally i love it too | Aug 06 19:00 |
MinceR | but this strip fails hard. | Aug 06 19:00 |
MinceR | if he were to argue that the linux kernel is incapable of supporting smooth full-screen video playback, he should take a look at mplayer, vlc and xine. | Aug 06 19:01 |
MinceR | (also, with compiz i can zoom on a flash video arbitrarily in real-time and it remains as "smooth" as it was in its original size.) | Aug 06 19:01 |
Xarver | My favorite:http://xkcd.com/303/ | Aug 06 19:01 |
Xarver | http://xkcd.com/303/ | Aug 06 19:01 |
MinceR | :) | Aug 06 19:01 |
MinceR | also, i'd check if swfdec can do what the whine is about. | Aug 06 19:02 |
Xarver | mandriva one comes with all the stuff I need | Aug 06 19:03 |
schestowitz | Almost | Aug 06 19:04 |
schestowitz | PCLOS has more | Aug 06 19:04 |
schestowitz | If you get Kaffine in Mandriva, then you have codecs too | Aug 06 19:04 |
schestowitz | Xarver: yes, 303 is funny | Aug 06 19:04 |
Xarver | :D | Aug 06 19:04 |
Xarver | twitter is SLOW today | Aug 06 19:05 |
schestowitz | Xarver: it's under DDoS | Aug 06 19:05 |
schestowitz | <trmanco> http://news.cnet.com/8301-19518_3-10304823-238.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-20 | Aug 06 19:05 |
schestowitz | Blame Windows zombies | Aug 06 19:05 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 06 19:06 |
trmanco | yeah | Aug 06 19:07 |
schestowitz | Complaint mode: http://www.workswithu.com/2009/08/05/rethinking-ubuntus-update-policyor-not/ | Aug 06 19:07 |
schestowitz | Nice pic: http://arstechnica.com/open-source/reviews/2009/08/hands-on-kde-43-delivers-a-social-desktop.ars | Aug 06 19:07 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] On the Ethical and Education Value of GNU/Linux http://ping.fm/Cmq11 | Aug 06 19:20 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Instability to Learn as a Windows Trap and Perceived 'Problem' in GNU/Linux http://ping.fm/B3I7x | Aug 06 19:23 | |
no zombies here! | Aug 06 19:27 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Air Navigation Now Done with GNU/Linux http://ping.fm/73THw | Aug 06 19:28 | |
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he he, "this has fail written all over it" http://business.theatlantic.com/2009/08/is_murdochs_plan_to_charge_for_online_news_doomed.php | Aug 06 19:32 | |
schestowitz | It is | Aug 06 19:36 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More Children Receive GNU/Linux Desktops in Large Numbers http://ping.fm/d6s9s | Aug 06 19:36 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] K Desktop Environment 4.3 Review http://ping.fm/ZeuDg | Aug 06 19:54 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NotN: Twitter crashes for ninety minutes, nerds traumatised http://is.gd/2590J | Aug 06 19:57 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] @schestowitz more space-filling than malice. Study didn't say what NewScientist claimed, news sites don't care. SNAFU. #wikipedia | Aug 06 19:59 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] RT @wikileaks New Zealand censors force business paper to remove Vodafone story http://bit.ly/2ZneI - please forward | Aug 06 20:00 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Future Motorola Phones Are Running Linux, Coming Soon http://ping.fm/WYRt2 | Aug 06 20:14 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] SCO is Dying, Sale Blocked http://ping.fm/ztG2u | Aug 06 20:53 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft's Bribed-for Vista 7 'Coverage', as Explained by John C. Dvorak http://ping.fm/JOdfu | Aug 06 20:57 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft is Escaping Tax Again http://ping.fm/PoWg6 | Aug 06 21:04 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] I have done tech support to normal people. This is gold: The Over-The-Phone Interface Test http://bit.ly/w9FVn | Aug 06 21:08 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Love real ale, hate this sort of thing... RT @scissorkicks CAMRA need to end this shit NOW. http://twitgoo.com/230jo | Aug 06 21:11 | |
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schestowitz | thenixedreport: I'm listening to http://tllts.org/dl.php , but in the latest episode they are all over the place | Aug 06 21:23 |
schestowitz | No signal (valuable info) so far.. | Aug 06 21:23 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] DW/LJ: Collapse board. http://reddragdiva.dreamwidth.org/12621.html http://reddragdiva.livejournal.com/526395.html | Aug 06 21:40 | |
schestowitz | popey: you're mentioned in min3: http://linuxoutlaws.com/podcast/ogg/105 | Aug 06 21:42 |
popey | thanks schestowitz | Aug 06 21:42 |
thenixedreport | Listen for their guests. | Aug 06 21:43 |
thenixedreport | It's more like having a conversation than a show. | Aug 06 21:43 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 21:43 |
schestowitz | thenixedreport: yeah | Aug 06 21:44 |
schestowitz | Well, I got a little bored | Aug 06 21:44 |
thenixedreport | :) | Aug 06 21:45 |
schestowitz | I do like the show, but it's 2.5 hours long | Aug 06 21:50 |
schestowitz | Not compressed enough, so more dross | Aug 06 21:50 |
trmanco | http://www.zerodayinitiative.com/advisories/ZDI-09-047/ | Aug 06 22:02 |
trmanco | http://www.zerodayinitiative.com/advisories/ZDI-09-048/ | Aug 06 22:02 |
schestowitz | http://img40.yfrog.com/i/jkp.png/ | Aug 06 22:08 |
schestowitz | The OOXML trolls keep chatting about BN | Aug 06 22:08 |
schestowitz | Including Microsoft employees... | Aug 06 22:08 |
schestowitz | I'll carry on ignoring them, BUT... I have a post about them | Aug 06 22:08 |
trmanco | iBone? | Aug 06 22:09 |
MinceR | jesusPhone? | Aug 06 22:10 |
schestowitz | Stone | Aug 06 22:10 |
trmanco | iTroll | Aug 06 22:11 |
MinceR | nah, Stone is proven technology | Aug 06 22:11 |
MinceR | and it does everything the jesusPhone does, except for the touchscreen. | Aug 06 22:11 |
trmanco | it's damaging technology | Aug 06 22:11 |
schestowitz | Stone+touchscreen: http://www.modmyi.com/forums/attachments/native-iphone-ipod-touch-app-discussion/108771d1224045646-feature-comparison-between-stone-iphone-stone.jpg | Aug 06 22:11 |
schestowitz | OK, I'll do some new posts. Lots today... | Aug 06 22:12 |
thenixedreport | http://www.centos.org/modules/tinycontent/index.php?id=23 | Aug 06 22:14 |
thenixedreport | So after August 15, the CentOS team may accept donations again. | Aug 06 22:14 |
Xarver | why not accept donations | Aug 06 22:14 |
thenixedreport | They want an accounting of the money donated. | Aug 06 22:15 |
thenixedreport | Remember, the domain name and the funds was controlled by one person who almost dropped off the face of the earth. | Aug 06 22:15 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 06 22:15 |
Xarver | accounting? | Aug 06 22:15 |
thenixedreport | In other words, they probably want to be able to tell everyone where the donated money went. | Aug 06 22:16 |
thenixedreport | Whether it be hosting costs, purchased hardware, etc........ | Aug 06 22:16 |
thenixedreport | Obviously if it turns out the thing was building and building and was left there, it won't take long. | Aug 06 22:17 |
thenixedreport | brb | Aug 06 22:17 |
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_goblin | hello all... | Aug 06 22:36 |
Xarver | hi | Aug 06 22:36 |
_goblin | rains really heavy here..... | Aug 06 22:36 |
Xarver | sunny here | Aug 06 22:37 |
schestowitz | Hey, _goblin | Aug 06 22:38 |
schestowitz | I've just listened to the Outlaws | Aug 06 22:38 |
schestowitz | Your Linux Inlaws | Aug 06 22:39 |
schestowitz | Were you one among the 40 who listened live? | Aug 06 22:39 |
schestowitz | Bad Day for Twitter: Attack from Microsoft Windows Zombies, Texas Lawsuit Over Software Patents http://boycottnovell.com/2009/08/06/techradium-and-ddos-vs-twitter/ | Aug 06 22:39 |
_goblin | yep | Aug 06 22:39 |
_goblin | I think it was ep 104... | Aug 06 22:40 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Darryl (who comments on my blog) suggests that "kids giving away Linux" is anti-competitive! here: http://tinyurl.com/kvkufp #microsoft | Aug 06 22:40 | |
_goblin | Ive got a cracking comment posted on my blog, check this: | Aug 06 22:40 |
_goblin | Qoute Darryl "And its not like the FOSS kids dont also give away product for free to gain market share. Their whole model is based on anti-competative tactics, like bait and switch, and price fixing. If FOSS linux were ever to create a product of value and gain some market share, it would stand a strong risk of coming under the FTC’s eyes itself for it’s questionable buiness methods." | Aug 06 22:41 |
_goblin | l "And its not like the FOSS kids dont also give away product for free to gain market share. Their whole model is based on anti-competative tactics, like bait and switch, and price fixing. If FOSS linux were ever to create a product of value and gain some market share, it would stand a strong risk of coming under the FTC’s eyes itself for it’s questionable buiness methods." | Aug 06 22:41 |
_goblin | sorry.... | Aug 06 22:41 |
_goblin | mis paste... | Aug 06 22:41 |
_goblin | So kids giving away disks is bad (according to Darryl)...I suppose it is for those working in Redmond. | Aug 06 22:42 |
_goblin | I am sure the FTC will come down hard on those pesky kids advocating Linux. | Aug 06 22:43 |
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MinceR | only if it's paid enough. | Aug 06 22:45 |
_goblin | Darryl has to be a joke poster surely? | Aug 06 22:45 |
trmanco | real "hackers" don't use shit systems -> http://news.cnet.com/8301-27080_3-10302236-245.html | Aug 06 22:47 |
trmanco | and they usually like to keep off the radar too... | Aug 06 22:47 |
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_goblin | good article.... | Aug 06 22:48 |
_goblin | It reminds me of the "scene" parties of the early 90's..... | Aug 06 22:49 |
_goblin | you never gave the location of the real ones. | Aug 06 22:49 |
schestowitz | _goblin: 105 | Aug 06 22:50 |
_goblin | no havent caught it yet... | Aug 06 22:50 |
_goblin | I dont think... | Aug 06 22:51 |
_goblin | I think it was 104 I listened to live. | Aug 06 22:51 |
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trmanco | ... | Aug 06 22:57 |
oiaohm | http://www.osnews.com/story/21962/Office_2010_To_Get_File_Format_Ballot << Great even worse. | Aug 06 22:58 |
oiaohm | MS seams to be out to avoid the EU regulators. | Aug 06 23:00 |
ThistleWeb | oiaohm: so you can pick from a working MS format, or a (supposedly working) broken odf | Aug 06 23:00 |
oiaohm | MS is being forced to come into line with odf 1.2 as well. | Aug 06 23:02 |
oiaohm | But the issue is that is mandoray if its done the wrong way you could have produced document hell in a business. | Aug 06 23:02 |
ThistleWeb | maybe they've finally, reluctantly seen the writing on the wall, that the EU are gonna keep hammering them on case after case, with fine after fine | Aug 06 23:03 |
oiaohm | Or maybe they are running out of money to resist. | Aug 06 23:03 |
ThistleWeb | that they're now reluctantly trying to placate the EU | Aug 06 23:04 |
ThistleWeb | indeedy | Aug 06 23:04 |
ThistleWeb | each new fine, is anther chunk of cash | Aug 06 23:04 |
ThistleWeb | they know they've only had to deal with the EU wrath on a tiny fraction of their practises / crimes, that there's a whole book load of charges they could face yet | Aug 06 23:05 |
oiaohm | Yep the EU system has only really been testing the waters again MS. | Aug 06 23:06 |
_goblin | maybe the fines could pay for our hosting the Olympics? | Aug 06 23:08 |
oiaohm | Most likely could but would also basically kill MS _goblin | Aug 06 23:08 |
ThistleWeb | yeah, I wish the UK had left the bids for that to other countries who want to waste tax payers money | Aug 06 23:08 |
_goblin | I bet the other countries our laughing their heads off now.... | Aug 06 23:09 |
_goblin | middle of recession and we have to foot the bill. | Aug 06 23:09 |
ThistleWeb | the UK has NEVER been able to turn an event into a legacy | Aug 06 23:09 |
ThistleWeb | yet it's used as a reason to bid EVERY time | Aug 06 23:09 |
_goblin | and turn it into a farse. | Aug 06 23:09 |
oiaohm | Really Australia had the most spreed out Olympics ever. | Aug 06 23:09 |
ThistleWeb | we'll buuild new infrastructure, new stadia, new roads etc that will let us help generations of atheletes etc | Aug 06 23:10 |
oiaohm | Different sports were in different capitial citys. | Aug 06 23:10 |
ThistleWeb | it's all PR bullshit | Aug 06 23:10 |
_goblin | thistleweb: yep just like the dome. | Aug 06 23:10 |
oiaohm | So lot of infrastructure updates that were needed were done when we did our Olympics | Aug 06 23:10 |
ThistleWeb | Oz has a good sporting base though | Aug 06 23:10 |
oiaohm | Most were over due updates. | Aug 06 23:10 |
_goblin | and if theres any benefits to the UK, it will only be London that gets them...to hell with the rest of the country | Aug 06 23:10 |
oiaohm | With the size of UK you could have done what australa did more simply. | Aug 06 23:11 |
ThistleWeb | so any world sports event held in Austrailia can only be good, they already have a legacy in place, and new investment will add richness to that | Aug 06 23:11 |
oiaohm | Distace between venues here was bigger than the lenth of the UK. | Aug 06 23:12 |
ThistleWeb | the Aussies know how to turn that investment into a long term gain | Aug 06 23:12 |
oiaohm | And it worked. | Aug 06 23:12 |
ThistleWeb | the Brits have NEVER managed that | Aug 06 23:12 |
ThistleWeb | not once | Aug 06 23:12 |
schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/08/06/msft-avoidance-of-a-gpl-lawsuit/ Sun’s Chief Open Source Officer: Microsoft’s Linux Code Apparently About Avoidance of a GPL Lawsuit | Aug 06 23:12 |
_goblin | Thistleweb: true......very true. | Aug 06 23:12 |
oiaohm | Air companies did great in the Olympics | Aug 06 23:12 |
ThistleWeb | yet we still throws billions away for that 2 weeks int he world spotlight | Aug 06 23:12 |
schestowitz | Twitter is in the s*itter today | Aug 06 23:12 |
oiaohm | With the australian setup. | Aug 06 23:12 |
oiaohm | It coverd some of the costs. | Aug 06 23:13 |
_goblin | lol | Aug 06 23:13 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Currently reading “Getting past first base…” @forakerdesign - http://bit.ly/x9TLE | Aug 06 23:13 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Sun’s Chief Open Source Officer: Microsoft’s Linux Code Apparently About Avoidance of a GPL Lawsuit http://ping.fm/22CYi | Aug 06 23:13 | |
ThistleWeb | if we had all the bases covered, with NHS funding, school funding etc and had money left over.....fine, give tax rebates | Aug 06 23:13 |
ThistleWeb | we have plenty of REAL needs for that money, all screaming for cash | Aug 06 23:13 |
_goblin | Thistleweb: Could not agree more....so many places need investment. | Aug 06 23:13 |
_goblin | Especially in the north. | Aug 06 23:14 |
ThistleWeb | yet a prestige event is the chosen way to spend / waste that money | Aug 06 23:14 |
oiaohm | How are your sporting locations _goblin | Aug 06 23:14 |
ThistleWeb | all over the country | Aug 06 23:14 |
ThistleWeb | every area has it's own priorities for spending | Aug 06 23:14 |
oiaohm | I guess like it was here in need of replacements almost everywhere. | Aug 06 23:14 |
_goblin | oiaohm: I don't really know....the real cost of this though is the policing. | Aug 06 23:15 |
ThistleWeb | when so little investment is done over too long, it comes down to EVERYTHING needs cash NOW | Aug 06 23:15 |
ThistleWeb | our rail network is a joke | Aug 06 23:15 |
ThistleWeb | it's largely Victorian | Aug 06 23:15 |
oiaohm | We have it simpler there too there are very few ways into Australia | Aug 06 23:15 |
_goblin | but as long as certain UK locations look good for a few weeks, to hell with everyone else in the UK. | Aug 06 23:15 |
ThistleWeb | we have high speed trains but they can't get those speeds because the tracks can't cope | Aug 06 23:15 |
oiaohm | Major cost for ours in policing was getting our SAS upto speed with in modern city combat if it was required. | Aug 06 23:16 |
oiaohm | That include runs threw the cities. | Aug 06 23:17 |
oiaohm | To locate good placement locations. | Aug 06 23:17 |
_goblin | theres also the issue of cleaning...........Nottinghill is two days at a fraction of the attendance expected for the Olympics.... | Aug 06 23:17 |
ThistleWeb | thats what happens when you allow trians to run for profit, they only spend the absolute minimum to help boost profits, so the infrastructure gets minimal repairs, not overhauling | Aug 06 23:17 |
oiaohm | Cleaning here was sold to a recycling firm. | Aug 06 23:17 |
ThistleWeb | major events do create temp jobs | Aug 06 23:17 |
_goblin | We can't even get people out of London quickly on new years eve. | Aug 06 23:17 |
ThistleWeb | they bring in tourists | Aug 06 23:18 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] RT @tweetmeme 20 Tips on How to Write for the Web | Webdesigner Depot http://bit.ly/VJVyA | Aug 06 23:18 | |
_goblin | and it will be London that reaps those rewards..... | Aug 06 23:18 |
ThistleWeb | but the lavish spending on the bidding, then preparing for it with private contractors creaming most of the money is a joke | Aug 06 23:18 |
oiaohm | Lot of the roads in sidney were restricted to bus only for the and more buses put on. | Aug 06 23:18 |
ThistleWeb | apparently that area of London is badly in need of upgrades | Aug 06 23:18 |
_goblin | whilst places in the north go to rack and ruin, hidden from the eyes of the camera in favor of the image of a prosperous UK. | Aug 06 23:19 |
oiaohm | For the ollipmics. | Aug 06 23:19 |
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_goblin | I sound like George. | Aug 06 23:19 |
oiaohm | The effect did increase the speed people could be moved by about 400 percent. | Aug 06 23:19 |
ThistleWeb | the footie world cup is a prefect example | Aug 06 23:19 |
oiaohm | Cars are highly ineffective. | Aug 06 23:19 |
_goblin | ah...footie...different matter... | Aug 06 23:19 |
_goblin | yep World Cup, all for it! | Aug 06 23:19 |
ThistleWeb | if the UK (not england) hosted it, we already have LOTS of stadia already in place capable og hosting the biggest games | Aug 06 23:20 |
ThistleWeb | they're in use every week for permier league games | Aug 06 23:20 |
_goblin | Agreed Thistleweb: but then its all about making the bigger show than the last country.... | Aug 06 23:20 |
ThistleWeb | yeah, always gotta be "the best yet" | Aug 06 23:20 |
ThistleWeb | bankrupt a small country paying for the opening ceremony | Aug 06 23:20 |
_goblin | and what about the Olympic logo.... | Aug 06 23:21 |
_goblin | look how much that rubbish cost. | Aug 06 23:21 |
ThistleWeb | these events are an excuse to milk the taxpayer for contracts | Aug 06 23:21 |
oiaohm | Our opening ceremony cost less than the one before it. | Aug 06 23:22 |
ThistleWeb | oiaohm: like I stated, the Aussies are smart bastards when it comes to hosting major events | Aug 06 23:22 |
oiaohm | Does help that lots of the fancy fireworks are made in Australia. | Aug 06 23:22 |
oiaohm | So every Olympics is basically australian income. | Aug 06 23:22 |
ThistleWeb | something we Brits seem incapable of doing | Aug 06 23:22 |
oiaohm | The on stage items were designed to be recycled. | Aug 06 23:23 |
oiaohm | If you look closely all the tin sheds were using full un cut sheets where able. | Aug 06 23:23 |
oiaohm | Large ammount of cost comes from left overs. | Aug 06 23:24 |
oiaohm | Good planing can keep the open show costs down. You are not going to be able to match chinas with there army of people. | Aug 06 23:24 |
oiaohm | You are going to have to do a good show by being smarter not costing more. | Aug 06 23:25 |
ThistleWeb | shameless plug alert - my screencast on mozilla usability is finally out hackerpublicradio.org | Aug 06 23:27 |
ThistleWeb | I recorded it a couple of months ago, it's been sitting on the FTP since | Aug 06 23:28 |
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oiaohm | We also recycle event sites. | Aug 06 23:28 |
ThistleWeb | China is a low wage country too | Aug 06 23:29 |
_goblin | Ill check it out and link it Thistleweb! | Aug 06 23:29 |
oiaohm | We got the Olypincs and the next year the same locatiosn built for Olypincs to host other events. | Aug 06 23:29 |
oiaohm | So recovering and making profts on them. | Aug 06 23:29 |
ThistleWeb | _goblin: ty, the file on the hpr feed is the audio only mp3, the avi is optional, thats the way HPR do things. I really want peeps to watch it to see what I'm getting it | Aug 06 23:30 |
oiaohm | If UK gets there planing good it will be fine. | Aug 06 23:30 |
oiaohm | Even china did the same. | Aug 06 23:31 |
ThistleWeb | oiaohm: lol, you have more faith in the UK than it deserves | Aug 06 23:31 |
oiaohm | If you go to china now every single location for the games has been recycled into something. | Aug 06 23:31 |
ThistleWeb | it will go just as smooth as the Dome, or the Scottish Parliment building | Aug 06 23:31 |
ThistleWeb | many times over budget | Aug 06 23:31 |
ThistleWeb | only just done in time | Aug 06 23:31 |
ThistleWeb | with lots of corners cut | Aug 06 23:32 |
oiaohm | Our parlement house was over budget too. | Aug 06 23:32 |
ThistleWeb | and the contractors waltzing all the way to the bank | Aug 06 23:32 |
oiaohm | Building into a hill has its problems. | Aug 06 23:32 |
ThistleWeb | in the Scottish Parliment case, it was MSP's always wanting new stuff added AFTER the plans had been finalised and accepted | Aug 06 23:32 |
oiaohm | Only thing in our Parliment house that is above the past ground level is the flag pole sticking out the top. | Aug 06 23:33 |
ThistleWeb | building into a hill will provide natural insulation | Aug 06 23:34 |
oiaohm | As you can guess our Parliment house has a limited number of windows. | Aug 06 23:34 |
ThistleWeb | which will help cut running costs I'd assume | Aug 06 23:34 |
ThistleWeb | that too | Aug 06 23:34 |
_goblin | The Shires! | Aug 06 23:34 |
_goblin | Call me Bilbo! | Aug 06 23:34 |
ThistleWeb | lol | Aug 06 23:34 |
ThistleWeb | grass roof | Aug 06 23:35 |
_goblin | Ill let you be Gandalf | Aug 06 23:35 |
ThistleWeb | I gave up the pipe weed | Aug 06 23:35 |
_goblin | and Ballmer can be Golum | Aug 06 23:35 |
oiaohm | Ok we do have some complete citys that are mines turned into houses. | Aug 06 23:35 |
_goblin | actually....... | Aug 06 23:35 |
_goblin | there is a similarity come to think of it.... | Aug 06 23:35 |
oiaohm | Yes the roof of the Australian Parliment house has to be mowed. | Aug 06 23:36 |
oiaohm | Real nice fun job there. | Aug 06 23:36 |
oiaohm | Gets even funnier it took almost 100 years to decide on what the Australian Parliment house should look like so they could move out of the temporary one. | Aug 06 23:39 |
oiaohm | You talk about your goverment having problems making up there minds on the plans. | Aug 06 23:40 |
oiaohm | Our capitial city was build to be one. | Aug 06 23:40 |
ThistleWeb | stuff like that comes down to who's gonna be the one in front of the cameras taking the plaudits when it opens | Aug 06 23:40 |
ThistleWeb | iff they'e likely to be booted out before that happens, a party will block it | Aug 06 23:41 |
ThistleWeb | they dont want to start a project only to have the opposition at the finish line taking the applause | Aug 06 23:41 |
ThistleWeb | that can happen in reverse too, with a major disaster like the dome, where the new govt will take the blame | Aug 06 23:43 |
oiaohm | Its the size of the block of land they were playing with. | Aug 06 23:43 |
ThistleWeb | in that case, the govt didnt change | Aug 06 23:43 |
oiaohm | The Parliment house makes up about 15 percent of the cities land area. | Aug 06 23:43 |
oiaohm | 300 x 300 metter building. | Aug 06 23:43 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] RT @tweetmeme Sticky (Fixed) SideNav Layout with CSS http://bit.ly/VF2md | Aug 06 23:45 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] How GNU/Linux Devoured Microsoft’s Business Model http://ping.fm/yQd34 | Aug 06 23:51 | |
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ThistleWeb | bbl | Aug 06 23:56 |
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