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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: June 16th, 2010

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*tessier_1 (~treed@mail.copilotco.com) has joined #boycottnovellJun 16 00:00
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Hands-free Control of #Linux -based #Android http://ur1.ca/07suj http://ur1.ca/07sukJun 16 00:02
TechrightsTitle: Touchless Gesture Control Coming to Android Devices - PCWorld .::. Size~: 72.57 KBJun 16 00:02
TechrightsTitle:                     It's time to make gestures at your android smartphone  - The Inquirer          .::. Size~: 58.97 KBJun 16 00:02
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Android Succeeds in the East, Beats #Apple http://ur1.ca/07sv6 http://ur1.ca/07sv7 http://ur1.ca/07sv8Jun 16 00:05
TechrightsTitle: China, Taiwan Agree on Android, Ophone, WiMax, TD-LTE, More - PCWorld .::. Size~: 69.85 KBJun 16 00:05
TechrightsTitle: Google's Android may win backing from China and Taiwan - Android, China, Google, taiwan - Techworld .::. Size~: 52.2 KBJun 16 00:05
TechrightsTitle:   The Apple-Google Mobile Battle Continues As Other Platforms Sit and Watch .::. Size~: 83.8 KBJun 16 00:05
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNOME Comes to #OLPC Devices, Chrome OS for Sub-notebooks Explained http://ur1.ca/07svl http://ur1.ca/07svm http://ur1.ca/07svnJun 16 00:08
TechrightsTitle: Sugar Learning Platform and GNOME Desktop Now Available on One Laptop per Child XO-1.5 - Linux Magazine Online  .::. Size~: 29.84 KBJun 16 00:08
TechrightsTitle: High School XO-1.5 - a New Laptop Build for Teenage Students! - OLPC News .::. Size~: 81.72 KBJun 16 00:08
TechrightsTitle: dd if=/dev/random of=/dev/blog » Chrome OS: Why so much confusion? .::. Size~: 22.6 KBJun 16 00:08
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Thinking of giving Openbytes a facelift....feedback? http://twitpic.com/1x3s36Jun 16 00:13
TechrightsTitle:  Twitpic - Share photos on Twitter  .::. Size~: 8.94 KBJun 16 00:13
sebsebsebschestowitz:  jono DaemonFC  Good idea for Lubuntu I guess http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/06/indicator-applet-supports-comes-to.htmlJun 16 00:14
TechrightsTitle: Indicator applet support comes to Lubuntu | OMG! Ubuntu! .::. Size~: 71.95 KBJun 16 00:14
DaemonFCYay, now it can suck tooJun 16 00:14
DaemonFCin 32-bit only evenJun 16 00:14
sebsebsebLubuntu is 32bit only?Jun 16 00:14
DaemonFCyeahJun 16 00:14
sebsebsebwell its meant to be for computers with not much resourcesJun 16 00:14
sebsebsebuhmmJun 16 00:14
DaemonFCyou can get around that though I thinkJun 16 00:14
sebsebsebI installed Lubuntu on the other computer in 9.10 and upgraded to 10.04Jun 16 00:15
sebsebseband thats running 64bit UbuntuJun 16 00:15
DaemonFCget the 64-bit "Server Edition" and install lubuntu-desktopJun 16 00:15
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] So, which cloud Twitter app is better....Seesmic or Twitterfall?.....mmmJun 16 00:15
DaemonFCWell, GNOME and KDE desktops are getting so bloated that resource-wise you're about as well off to use Windows VistaJun 16 00:16
DaemonFCand this assumption that Ubuntu has that 64-bit users want only the most bloat possible is annoyingJun 16 00:16
DaemonFCThere are plenty of AMD64 capable sub-$300 PCs out there that don't have tons of RAMJun 16 00:17
sebsebsebright so you don't likeJun 16 00:19
sebsebsebGnome or KDEJun 16 00:19
sebsebsebwhat do you run instead then?Jun 16 00:19
DaemonFChttp://freakbits.com/hitlers-dmca-takedown-rant-gets-taken-down-0421Jun 16 00:19
TechrightsTitle:    Hitlers DMCA Takedown Rant Gets Taken Down | FreakBits   .::. Size~: 45.56 KBJun 16 00:19
DaemonFCThey're not appropriate on systems with less than 2 GB of RAMJun 16 00:19
DaemonFCI didn't say that I don't like themJun 16 00:19
sebsebsebnah they work fine on a system with 1GB RAMJun 16 00:19
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] After much soul searching, I think for just day to day tweeting and timelines, Seesmic gets the prize,however for monitoring trends/searchesJun 16 00:20
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Twitterfall wins hands down.....Jun 16 00:20
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] In anycase both are better than any local client Ive seen so far on any distro.Jun 16 00:21
sebsebsebDaemonFC: The support will be optional in LubuntuJun 16 00:21
sebsebsebas the blog entry saysJun 16 00:21
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] My wife took this with a Blackberry, its apparently rare...she's contacting Springwatch with where she saw it. http://twitpic.com/1x3ul1Jun 16 00:22
TechrightsTitle:  Twitpic - Share photos on Twitter  .::. Size~: 9 KBJun 16 00:22
SuborbitalPigeongoblin: my sister is working on that programmeJun 16 00:22
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: hes not in hereJun 16 00:23
SuborbitalPigeonI noticedJun 16 00:23
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Diablo-D3http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-AeHxUbDn0&hd=1Jun 16 00:25
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Portal 2 Teaser Trailer .::. Size~: 85.87 KBJun 16 00:25
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Tonights a little bit of a Twitpic night.....getting some things on here Ive not had time to do before.Jun 16 00:25
*DaemonFC positions an orange portal next to a turret and a blue portal next to Diablo-D3 and shoves him inJun 16 00:26
DaemonFCfun gameJun 16 00:26
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Ah the memories....the very old Goblin avatar......btw my real names Tim. http://twitpic.com/1x3vlkJun 16 00:26
TechrightsTitle:  Twitpic - Share photos on Twitter  .::. Size~: 8.89 KBJun 16 00:26
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWPfcEOr2Yg&feature=player_embeddedJun 16 00:28
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Bender's Anti-Piracy Warning .::. Size~: 91.23 KBJun 16 00:28
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Portal 2 trailer in 720p http://ur1.ca/07sybJun 16 00:29
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Portal 2 Teaser Trailer .::. Size~: 86 KBJun 16 00:29
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRVHUbrbEUA&feature=player_embeddedJun 16 00:34
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- U.K. Anti-Piracy Advert - Parody of this annoying trailer! .::. Size~: 92.29 KBJun 16 00:34
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Reading all the news on measures to combat filesharing, nobody seems to mention (or notice) XDCC. #tpb #piracy #filesharing #torrentJun 16 00:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #FreeSoftware Movements Expand, to #OSI Also http://ur1.ca/07t0k http://ur1.ca/07t0l http://ur1.ca/07t0mJun 16 00:38
TechrightsTitle:   Free software in Africa: Striding ahead : Tectonic - The Source for Open Source News .::. Size~: 43.76 KBJun 16 00:38
TechrightsTitle: A pony for every child  the politics of open source software « commons re:sourceâ„¢ .::. Size~: 39.83 KBJun 16 00:38
TechrightsTitle: Phipps leads change at Open Source Initiative - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 33.71 KBJun 16 00:38
DaemonFCDownloading Creative Commons music is STEALING....from artists too dumb to give us and Apple an 85% cut to "represent" them.Jun 16 00:40
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 00:40
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DaemonFCIf artists self-publish and on average get only 50 cents per album in donations, they already made more than if they sold their music on iTunesJun 16 00:43
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] They say Usenet is old news, but just started reading a very good resource of info... the group "gnu.bash" excellent stuff.. #usenetJun 16 00:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] As is the NG "alt.comp.lang.shell.unix.bourne-bash"....since Ive started taking an interest again in BASH scripting.Jun 16 00:45
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DaemonFChmm, the government says the drinking water is safe hereJun 16 01:05
DaemonFC"acceptable levels" of heavy metals, farming runoff, pesticides, and misc bacteriaJun 16 01:05
DaemonFCyummyJun 16 01:05
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[harishpillay] Looking forward to freemantle & swan river tour. Yay! Good to see tour operator offer senior citizen rates to Mom. That's good business #fbJun 16 01:08
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bethlynnhiJun 16 02:01
sebsebsebbethlynn: hiJun 16 02:03
sebsebsebbethlynn: Are you the one that did a Ubuntu Open Week session?Jun 16 02:04
bethlynnyes I did do a bug one discussion at open week for 9.10Jun 16 02:04
bethlynnthis is me www.whatwillweuse.comJun 16 02:05
sebsebsebyes I rememberJun 16 02:05
sebsebseband I did go to that site before as wellJun 16 02:05
sebsebsebFirst time to this channel or?Jun 16 02:05
bethlynnI've  overhauled it recentlyJun 16 02:05
bethlynnI've been here maybe about 4 times beforeJun 16 02:06
bethlynnI was wondering if anyone here would know what happened to the boycottmicrosoft websiteJun 16 02:06
bethlynnthey stopped posting around 6 years agoJun 16 02:07
bethlynnbut the website is still thereJun 16 02:07
SuborbitalPigeonsebsebseb: revampedJun 16 02:07
sebsebsebprobably a few of them know, but they don't seem activeJun 16 02:07
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: replying in wrong channelJun 16 02:07
SuborbitalPigeonno I wasn'tJun 16 02:07
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: you did, since I asked in otherJun 16 02:07
SuborbitalPigeondid you?Jun 16 02:08
sebsebsebyesJun 16 02:08
SuborbitalPigeonoh wellJun 16 02:08
sebsebsebbethlynn: yeah your bug 1 session was niceJun 16 02:08
sebsebsebthe Lucid one or well something like that, wasn't as goodJun 16 02:09
bethlynnI will keep fighting until June 30, 2011Jun 16 02:09
sebsebsebah yeah, thats when you said Windows would lose most users or something, wasn't it?Jun 16 02:09
bethlynnI did not apply for lucid open week... too busyJun 16 02:09
sebsebsebWhat you been up to then?Jun 16 02:10
bethlynnMicrosoft will no longer hold majority market share come June 30, 2011Jun 16 02:10
sebsebsebbethlynn: yes thats what you saidJun 16 02:10
sebsebseb,but thing isJun 16 02:10
sebsebsebthey still willJun 16 02:10
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sebsebsebbethlynn: maybe in 2014 when XP goes end of lifeJun 16 02:10
sebsebsebother OS's will win a lot more usersJun 16 02:10
SuborbitalPigeonI think it is NOTABUG personallyJun 16 02:10
bethlynnxp is end of life nowJun 16 02:10
sebsebsebno its notJun 16 02:11
sebsebsebit was going to be this AprilJun 16 02:11
sebsebsebthat has just been, but the support got extended by four yearsJun 16 02:11
bethlynnyou can't buy itJun 16 02:11
sebsebsebto  April 2014, and they want business to leave it in 2012 by the latestJun 16 02:11
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bethlynnthe home user lacks supportJun 16 02:12
sebsebsebbethlynn: if we are lucky by 2014,  Wine and ReactOS will be able to run most Windows junkwareJun 16 02:12
bethlynnnobody cares about windows junkwareJun 16 02:12
sebsebsebbethlynn: I meantJun 16 02:12
sebsebsebWindows programsJun 16 02:12
sebsebsebI am calling it all junkware :DJun 16 02:13
sebsebsebWindows only programs to be exactJun 16 02:13
sebsebsebotherwise I would be calling FIrefox and Open Office and such junk as well, which isn't the caseJun 16 02:13
bethlynnsoftware is no longer primarily distributed in shrink wrapped boxes for only one platform Jun 16 02:13
SuborbitalPigeonI don't know what you've been smokingJun 16 02:13
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: who?Jun 16 02:13
*DaemonFC hides his stashJun 16 02:13
DaemonFCneither do IJun 16 02:14
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 02:14
bethlynnby pure volume, more software gets installed by the apple app store and android marketJun 16 02:14
SuborbitalPigeoneither of you TBHJun 16 02:14
sebsebsebbethlynn: uh noJun 16 02:15
sebsebsebmost software gets pre installed with WindowsJun 16 02:15
bethlynnno, it doesn'tJun 16 02:15
sebsebsebsure it doesJun 16 02:15
sebsebsebsince Windows has like 80% market share stillJun 16 02:15
bethlynnwith a typical install, there is no office suiteJun 16 02:16
sebsebsebmore software comes with a Linux distro than with Windows though, useually :)Jun 16 02:16
bethlynnhave  you seen windows 7? the games are web basedJun 16 02:16
DaemonFCwell, unless you get the Black EditionJun 16 02:16
DaemonFCyesJun 16 02:16
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 02:16
SuborbitalPigeonassuming they don't have gwibber installed of courseJun 16 02:16
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sebsebsebbethlynn: uhmm  most of the games that run on XP, as far as I know, will also run on Windows 7Jun 16 02:17
sebsebsebjust like most that run on Vista, as far as I know, will also run on Windows 7Jun 16 02:17
SuborbitalPigeonnopeJun 16 02:17
bethlynnwho's gaming anymore? by pure volume, facebook is the platform, not WindowsJun 16 02:18
sebsebsebbethlynn: uhmm loads of people want to do the commercial gamesJun 16 02:18
sebsebsebincluding a lot of people who try out UbuntuJun 16 02:18
*SuborbitalPigeon coughsJun 16 02:18
bethlynnthe gaming has gone back to the console platform, where by the way, Microsoft lacks majority marketshareJun 16 02:18
sebsebsebbethlynn: some will give up eventaully, and just go back to Windows, since their commercial Windows games,  they coudn't just play and suchJun 16 02:19
sebsebsebThing are starting to go quite a bit more console now sure, but things are still very much so, Windows games as wellJun 16 02:19
cubezzzwell got the coreboot box together nowJun 16 02:19
bethlynnname a game that is Windows-only that millions of people playJun 16 02:20
cubezzzfinallyJun 16 02:20
SuborbitalPigeoncivilization 4Jun 16 02:20
cubezzzeh?Jun 16 02:20
sebsebsebbethlynn: Most games, unless you include WineJun 16 02:20
SuborbitalPigeonoops, that's OS XJun 16 02:20
cubezzzwindows arguments again?Jun 16 02:20
cubezzzI always come in at the worst timesJun 16 02:20
sebsebsebcubezzz: heh in a wayJun 16 02:20
bethlynnI came in here to ask what ever happened to boycottmicrosoft.comJun 16 02:20
cubezzzummm we were never boycottmicrosoftJun 16 02:21
cubezzzas far as I knowJun 16 02:21
sebsebsebcubezzz: indeed, butJun 16 02:21
sebsebsebschestowitz knew the person behind thatJun 16 02:21
sebsebsebor somethingJun 16 02:21
cubezzzhe's probably sleeping thoughJun 16 02:21
bethlynnthats what I was hopingJun 16 02:21
sebsebsebbethlynn: hoping that people here knew?Jun 16 02:22
sebsebsebwhat happended to themJun 16 02:22
bethlynnyesJun 16 02:22
cubezzzyou're not going to find too many pro-microsoft people here thoughJun 16 02:22
sebsebsebanyway maybe  they got bought out by MicrosoftJun 16 02:22
sebsebsebheres a lot of money, to get you to shut upJun 16 02:22
bethlynnthe website is frozen for about 6 yearsJun 16 02:22
bethlynnno explainationJun 16 02:23
sebsebsebcubezzz: oh boycottnovell has been around for less than six years ins't it?Jun 16 02:23
bethlynnif microsoft wants to by me out at whatwillweuse.com, the price is 10millionJun 16 02:23
cubezzzsounds about rightJun 16 02:23
SuborbitalPigeonturkish lira?Jun 16 02:23
bethlynnUSDJun 16 02:23
sebsebsebbethlynn: not at the moment they don't, I mean its not that popular is it?Jun 16 02:23
cubezzzbut really who cares about Microsoft?Jun 16 02:23
cubezzzI mean... we're past that now aren't we?Jun 16 02:24
sebsebsebbethlynn: Linux Today will sometime link to roys bog enteries for exampleJun 16 02:24
WireWulfM$ will dieJun 16 02:24
sebsebsebwhen is the thingJun 16 02:24
sebsebsebthey have loads of computer ignornats locked in big timeJun 16 02:24
sebsebsebmost computer users don't even need Windows,  just they don't know, or scared to try something else, or want to be sheepJun 16 02:24
SuborbitalPigeonThe Thing™?Jun 16 02:24
sebsebsebuse Windows, since like everyone they know, uses itJun 16 02:25
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: I meantJun 16 02:25
sebsebsebwhen will it happenJun 16 02:25
bethlynnthe general public is dumping Microsoft, mostly for apple productsJun 16 02:25
cubezzzyeah don't they know Hurd is the light? :)Jun 16 02:25
sebsebsebthats not really a good thing either bethlynnJun 16 02:25
cubezzzor AROS?Jun 16 02:25
SuborbitalPigeoncubezzz: niceJun 16 02:25
bethlynn1.3 billion pcs and 1 billion smart phonesJun 16 02:25
bethlynnguess which part of that ratio is growing and which is strinkingJun 16 02:26
sebsebsebyesJun 16 02:26
sebsebsebthe mobileJun 16 02:26
bethlynnshrinkingJun 16 02:26
sebsebsebmobile computingJun 16 02:26
sebsebsebis starting to become the thing moreJun 16 02:26
bethlynnthe ubuntu-based linux kernel will be the only folks who are ready for the next big thingJun 16 02:27
cubezzzwell, let's see, I need to use my scanner... hmmm, which PDA does that again? :)Jun 16 02:27
SuborbitalPigeonnow that is a new one, a ubuntu-based kernelJun 16 02:28
bethlynnthere is an app for thatJun 16 02:28
SuborbitalPigeonI always thought it was the other way roundJun 16 02:28
bethlynnyou use the camera to ocr or .pdf the fileJun 16 02:28
sebsebsebno  UbuntuJun 16 02:28
sebsebsebare not forking the Linux kernelJun 16 02:28
sebsebsebthankfuly :)Jun 16 02:29
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: Gnome on the other hand, well you knowJun 16 02:29
cubezzzoh let's see, I need a slide scanner... well you get the idea Jun 16 02:29
cubezzzanyways, I have zaurus for linux pda so I'm covered :)Jun 16 02:30
cubezzzno cell phone for me thoughJun 16 02:30
bethlynnif you need a graphics workstation, linux and apple are still in the leadJun 16 02:30
WireWulfphotoediting on mac i hear is easyJun 16 02:30
cubezzzmehJun 16 02:31
bethlynnso if your graphics needs require a flatbed scanner, well, you are better off not with windowsJun 16 02:31
cubezzzI'm editing pics at the command line :)Jun 16 02:31
cubezzzright nowJun 16 02:31
WireWulfcubezzz old schoolJun 16 02:31
sebsebsebbethlynn: Ubuntu isn't the only distro thoughJun 16 02:31
cubezzzmogrify -modulate 110,110 *.jpegJun 16 02:31
cubezzzftwJun 16 02:31
sebsebsebbethlynn: and if it had as much market share as Windows, that woudn't be a good thingJun 16 02:31
sebsebsebbethlynn: I mean like 60+ %Jun 16 02:32
DaemonFCI noticed Microsoft has started round 2 of IE 8 carpet bombing in TV adsJun 16 02:32
sebsebsebif it had that amoutnJun 16 02:32
bethlynnmoreover, I find modern printers and scanners easier to configure on Linux or Mac anyway. cups is awesomeJun 16 02:32
sebsebsebamountJun 16 02:32
DaemonFCtalking about how much malware it saves you fromJun 16 02:32
cubezzzok, re: scanner, I don't really care as long as the protocol isn't a secretJun 16 02:32
sebsebsebbethlynn: cups is awesome yeah I guess so, for people that know what they are doing with it, or if it just worked for themJun 16 02:32
cubezzzthen I use any OS that is not closedJun 16 02:32
sebsebsebbethlynn: did you get my pm?Jun 16 02:33
cubezzzit's the closed source stuff that's badJun 16 02:33
bethlynnsorry, no pm sebsbsebJun 16 02:33
sebsebsebbethlynn: ohJun 16 02:33
SuborbitalPigeonsebsebseb: that's a snag with your multi-line style, it can be difficult to follow when someone else speaks betweenJun 16 02:34
sebsebsebwas wondering something, could say it here really I guessJun 16 02:34
bethlynnyou confuse me sebsebseb, you attend open week but you do not want ubuntu to have 60+% marketshareJun 16 02:34
sebsebsebindeed since other distrosJun 16 02:34
sebsebsebLinux is meant to be all about choiceJun 16 02:34
SuborbitalPigeonsebsebseb confuses me alsoJun 16 02:34
sebsebsebfrom the distros, to the programs, that are installedJun 16 02:34
SuborbitalPigeonkeeps whining about Ubuntu (as do I), but still keeps banging on about itJun 16 02:35
sebsebsebI would like for a distro to have enough market shareJun 16 02:35
sebsebsebto compete nicely against WIndowsJun 16 02:35
sebsebseb20% is enough though for that I guessJun 16 02:35
cubezzzif tessier was around he'd really challenge your way of thinkingJun 16 02:36
bethlynnok. if Linux is about choice, why do you get upset that people choose one distribution or another?Jun 16 02:36
bethlynnwhy are people jealous of Ubuntu?Jun 16 02:36
bethlynnare they elitist? "I learned on the command line and so must you/"Jun 16 02:36
sebsebsebbethlynn: is your name registered on Freenode?  otherwise someone might pretend to be you,  can do that anyway without nick protection.  Thats what I pm'd asking.  If I remember you from open week, I guess others will as well.  I think you were quite new to IRC really when doing that as well.Jun 16 02:37
SuborbitalPigeonbecause it's horribleJun 16 02:37
cubezzzummJun 16 02:37
DaemonFCbecause you end up using arcane commands and poorly conceived tools to unfuck UbuntuJun 16 02:37
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 02:37
cubezzzusing the command line isn't really that big of a dealJun 16 02:37
DaemonFCjono can tell you all about the delight of using gconf-editor to make the window controls be on the correct sideJun 16 02:38
cubezzzbecause in Linux the gui isn't tied to everything you knowJun 16 02:38
cubezzzit's well compartmentalizedJun 16 02:38
bethlynnI am registered on freenode. I am authenticated. unfortunately empathy doesn't properly handle identificationJun 16 02:38
DaemonFChe's planning to write about just how easy it is to do in the next Ubuntu Book revisionJun 16 02:38
sebsebsebDaemonFC: or just change the theme to another one that isnt' one of the new Canonical themesJun 16 02:38
sebsebsebDaemonFC: jono recently did a blog entry or something about the buttons and suchJun 16 02:38
sebsebsebah yes the one about how Ubuntu isn't a democracyJun 16 02:38
SuborbitalPigeonit's a markocracyJun 16 02:39
sebsebsebyeah I guess empathy sucks for IRCJun 16 02:39
cubezzzyeah I don't care what distro you use :)Jun 16 02:39
*sebsebseb hasn't tried empathy for IRCJun 16 02:39
cubezzzI can't stand closed source, that's my thingJun 16 02:40
bethlynnI am really trying to like empathy but I hate it... I am going back to pidgeonJun 16 02:40
sebsebsebbethlynn: Konversation :) yeah KDE thoughJun 16 02:40
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sebsebsebPidgin isn't that much better for IRC I guessJun 16 02:40
cubezzzno one like xchat any more?Jun 16 02:40
DaemonFCa "community" complicates things too muchJun 16 02:40
sebsebsebcubezzz: yeah most of the Ubuntu newbies like XchatJun 16 02:41
DaemonFCdesign by committee makes for bad softwareJun 16 02:41
sebsebsebhence why I jokeingly call it NoobchatJun 16 02:41
DaemonFCtoo many cooks in the kitchenJun 16 02:41
sebsebsebthat and how Konversation :) even in GnomeJun 16 02:41
DaemonFCit also slows things downJun 16 02:41
bethlynnas far as where are of the panels sit... if Ubuntu made an unpopular choice, people would try something else or not upgradeJun 16 02:41
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DaemonFCyou notice how the one man asskicking band distros manage to maintain a rolling releaseJun 16 02:41
cubezzzVector isn't bad, DSL is nice and fastJun 16 02:41
sebsebsebbethlynn: well quite a lot of expereinced users have left Ubuntu either properly, or very nearly fullyJun 16 02:41
bethlynnquite frankly, the reviews of 10.4 are very happyJun 16 02:41
DaemonFCand only "freeze" in the sense of there's a new Live CD outJun 16 02:41
sebsebsebsince bad changes since 8.10Jun 16 02:42
sebsebsebbethlynn: more  people saying why  they left Ubuntu for another distro, these daysJun 16 02:42
DaemonFCwit hArch you don't have to worry about weather you're using the "Bloated Bastard" or the "Masturbating Monkey"Jun 16 02:42
DaemonFCthere are no huge and complicated upgrade scripts that may hose your in place systemJun 16 02:42
bethlynnwho, besides lottalinuxlinks?Jun 16 02:42
DaemonFCnor in Sidux for that matterJun 16 02:42
sebsebsebbethlynn: uh?Jun 16 02:43
sebsebsebyes on the webJun 16 02:43
sebsebseb,but also on IRCJun 16 02:43
bethlynnwho are these people who are leaving Ubuntu in droves?Jun 16 02:43
DaemonFCpackages just flow in freely as there are new releases upstreamJun 16 02:43
sebsebsebexperienced usersJun 16 02:43
DaemonFCit's surprisingly efficient that way :)Jun 16 02:43
SuborbitalPigeonsebsebseb: I may have led you to the wrong impressionJun 16 02:43
bethlynnnames, come onJun 16 02:43
cubezzzjust ask yourself "What would Stallman use?" :)Jun 16 02:44
SuborbitalPigeonsome perhaps sebsebsebJun 16 02:44
DaemonFCdoing work downstream is a bad thingJun 16 02:44
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: I read quite a bit of it myselfJun 16 02:44
bethlynnStallman uses gnuSense which is ubuntu basedJun 16 02:44
DaemonFCif you don't have anything to commit upstream, don't commit anything at allJun 16 02:44
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 02:44
SuborbitalPigeonso it's not just me then?Jun 16 02:44
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: Linux Today linked to some of these blog enteries and suchJun 16 02:44
sebsebsebbethlynn: Ubuntu is a stepping stoneJun 16 02:45
bethlynnEric S. Raymond uses Ubuntu tooJun 16 02:45
sebsebsebin the last few years most have gone to Ubuntu from WindowsJun 16 02:45
DaemonFCgood for Eric S. RaymondJun 16 02:45
cubezzzLinus uses Fedora, but who's countingJun 16 02:45
DaemonFCUbuntu is a very Windows Vista-ish systemJun 16 02:45
sebsebsebthen some will go back to Windows, orthers will eventaully go onto steping stone two, another  distroJun 16 02:45
DaemonFCmost dual booters use it because of thatJun 16 02:45
bethlynndual booters have wubiJun 16 02:46
sebsebsebbethlynn: they are doing stuff now, starting with 9.04, that is getting at expereinced users, such as myself, who have used the distro since in my case the second release in 2005, but some will have from the first of course as wellJun 16 02:46
sebsebsebWubi is not good in the long runJun 16 02:46
DaemonFCby Windows Vista-ish, I mean lots of bugs, very slow and bloated, not a very good GUI...Jun 16 02:46
DaemonFCit does have the advantage of being DRM-free thoughJun 16 02:46
DaemonFCfor nowJun 16 02:46
DaemonFCthey're already freely promoting stores and such using cartel codecsJun 16 02:47
SuborbitalPigeoncovered in erlang...Jun 16 02:47
DaemonFChow far can DRM be?Jun 16 02:47
cubezzzyou can pretty well roll your own Jun 16 02:47
sebsebsebUbuntu is doing more of their own thing with Gnome for example, thats  what I meant, which is getting at certain experienced users, but also developersJun 16 02:47
cubezzzthat's the bestJun 16 02:47
sebsebsebbethlynn: a partitioned dual boot, is better than Wubi :)Jun 16 02:47
bethlynnagain, put up or shutup, names of people who have left UbuntuJun 16 02:48
SuborbitalPigeonBruce Cowan for oneJun 16 02:48
SuborbitalPigeon(me)Jun 16 02:48
bethlynnfar from the crowd you speakJun 16 02:48
SuborbitalPigeonthanksJun 16 02:49
sebsebsebbethlynn: not quiteJun 16 02:49
sebsebsebbethlynn: he has used it a long time,  he also helps with Gnome a bitJun 16 02:49
SuborbitalPigeonanyway, that is a rather strange argumentJun 16 02:49
sebsebsebbethlynn: the archeives of Linux Today have articles as I was sayingJun 16 02:50
sebsebsebgive a search for UbuntuJun 16 02:50
sebsebseband negative stuff  is likely to come up as wellJun 16 02:50
SuborbitalPigeonin fact, my English teacher once said it is the weakest form there isJun 16 02:50
sebsebsebbethlynn: http://www.linuxtoday.comJun 16 02:50
TechrightsTitle: Linux Today - Linux  News On Internet Time. .::. Size~: 115.92 KBJun 16 02:50
sebsebsebbethlynn: also heres a site for you, which you may know about already, its for Ubuntu fan boys and girls, and people like me, who still want to know what is going on with Ubuntu.  http://www.omgubuntu.co.ukJun 16 02:51
TechrightsTitle: OMG! Ubuntu! .::. Size~: 99.51 KBJun 16 02:51
sebsebsebbethlynn: anyway better people use Ubuntu than WIndows yes :)Jun 16 02:51
sebsebsebhowever it is not always the best distro for them,  also most users don't really choice, they just use it, since most popular at the momentJun 16 02:51
sebsebsebon the desktopJun 16 02:52
sebsebsebbethlynn: which is also a problem when it comes to solving bug 1Jun 16 02:52
sebsebsebsince a lot of people will just go back to WIndows, if they can't get their wireless, sound, or ATI graphcis cards working for example,  instead of trying another distro first where they may have better luckJun 16 02:53
SuborbitalPigeonit turns out that Ubuntu won't ship GNOME 3.0 because they haven't the space on the CD for GTK+ 3.0Jun 16 02:53
bethlynnwhy then are the debian packages growing much faster than rpm. consider the facts in "why linux still sucks" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkgahANeq14Jun 16 02:53
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Why Desktop Linux (Still) Sucks. What We Can Do To Fix It. .::. Size~: 102.37 KBJun 16 02:53
sebsebsebbethlynn: can fit more on a RPM Live CD, than a Deb Live CDJun 16 02:54
SuborbitalPigeonwell, that's not technically trueJun 16 02:54
sebsebsebwell Mandriva seems to come with more stuff on its Live CD than Ubuntu, for exampleJun 16 02:54
SuborbitalPigeonrpms compressed with xz are smaller than debian packages with gzJun 16 02:54
SuborbitalPigeonbut then you can easily compress debian packages with xz tooJun 16 02:54
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: if thats so why doesn't Ubuntu do it? or have they?Jun 16 02:55
SuborbitalPigeonlivecds don't have packages anywayJun 16 02:55
SuborbitalPigeonit's a compressed filesystem of some typeJun 16 02:55
bethlynnthe cdr is a dying media anyhowJun 16 02:55
sebsebsebbethlynn: yes and noJun 16 02:55
sebsebsebalso I would rather download a Live CDJun 16 02:55
sebsebsebthan a big DVDJun 16 02:55
sebsebsebISOJun 16 02:55
SuborbitalPigeonFedora tried to move to DVD, and it didn't go down well in some countriesJun 16 02:56
sebsebsebwhy? simple? since 700MB is much smaller than 4GB, so much less time to downloadJun 16 02:56
bethlynnboth Ubuntu and Fedora support usb imagesJun 16 02:56
sebsebsebbethlynn: and if I was to download a DVD, I would want a lot of good stuff to come with it, well thats what happens with Sabayon a DVD with a lot of good stuff with itJun 16 02:56
SuborbitalPigeonyou have a point there bethlynnJun 16 02:56
SuborbitalPigeonI still wouldn't write off (no pun) CDs yetJun 16 02:57
sebsebsebnot everyone wants to burn a USB stick though, for various reasonsJun 16 02:57
sebsebsebits easier to make a bootable Live CD than a USB stick as well I guessJun 16 02:57
SuborbitalPigeonwhy?Jun 16 02:57
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: I haven't made a bootable USB stick beforeJun 16 02:57
sebsebsebgot plenty of CD's so no need toJun 16 02:57
bethlynnboth Fedora and Ubuntu have a gui tool for doing soJun 16 02:57
sebsebsebbethlynn: yes I know Ubuntu has a GUI toolJun 16 02:58
SuborbitalPigeonit's called ddJun 16 02:58
sebsebsebfor thatJun 16 02:58
SuborbitalPigeonAFAIK the methods of creating the images are identicalJun 16 02:58
SuborbitalPigeonat least, they should be in FedoraJun 16 02:59
sebsebsebbethlynn: monoplgies are not a good thingJun 16 02:59
sebsebsebbethlynn: thats basically what Ubuntu would be when it comes to Linux distros, if it had 80% market shareJun 16 02:59
sebsebsebon the desktopJun 16 02:59
sebsebsebas a wholeJun 16 02:59
SuborbitalPigeonwhich will never happenJun 16 02:59
sebsebsebbethlynn: also XP will still be used in 2004, and probably 2015 quite a bit even, without security updatesJun 16 03:00
sebsebseb2014 not 2004Jun 16 03:00
sebsebsebbethlynn: I would like it as well, for Windows, to lose most of its users before June 2011, but sadly it won't be happeningJun 16 03:01
SuborbitalPigeonwhy?Jun 16 03:01
sebsebsebwell actsauly I woudnt' be so keen on that, if most users went to Mac OS X insteadJun 16 03:01
SuborbitalPigeonI thought you hated consumersJun 16 03:01
sebsebsebbethlynn: sometimes Windows has to be used for some program, its a tool for a job.  and yes Windows shoudn't really be online, because of security reasonsJun 16 03:02
bethlynnreally?!? do you believe that disc platters purchased and deployed in 2007 with XP will continue to spin in 2015?!?Jun 16 03:03
sebsebsebso yeah quite a while before bug 1 gets solved which is for other distros as well,  if it ever gets solvedJun 16 03:03
sebsebsebas far as I know computers that were made in lets say 2000 to 2008Jun 16 03:03
sebsebsebwill probably still work in 2015, most of themJun 16 03:03
bethlynnI do not assert that Ubuntu will have majority market share in 2011Jun 16 03:03
SuborbitalPigeonmy argument is that if bug 1 was truely solved, all you've done is replaced one monopoly with anotherJun 16 03:04
bethlynnI do assert that Microsoft will not have majority market share in 2011Jun 16 03:04
sebsebsebwell there was some article the other dayJun 16 03:04
sebsebsebabout howJun 16 03:04
sebsebsebapparnatly more Macs now than PC's or somethingJun 16 03:04
sebsebsebor thats what people are buying now I meanJun 16 03:04
SuborbitalPigeonbethlynn: so who will then?Jun 16 03:05
sebsebsebbethlynn: which is basically what you said beforeJun 16 03:05
bethlynnyes, exactlyJun 16 03:05
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: Apple possiblyJun 16 03:05
SuborbitalPigeonin one year?Jun 16 03:05
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: probably notJun 16 03:05
sebsebsebbethlynn: anyway haveing most computer users running Mac OS X instead of Windows, isn't really a good thing either.Jun 16 03:06
SuborbitalPigeonthat's an understatementJun 16 03:06
sebsebsebApple are propritaryJun 16 03:06
sebsebsebApple do patentsJun 16 03:06
bethlynnif there is 49.5% market share of windows, 30% market share of mac, 20% market share of Linux and .5% of other, I winJun 16 03:06
sebsebsebthey take open source as well, and put lip stick on it, and sell it to the consumer and thatJun 16 03:06
sebsebsebbethlynn: yes what you just said, sounds niceJun 16 03:07
SuborbitalPigeonI will never understand peoples' obsessions for market shareJun 16 03:07
SuborbitalPigeonI do what little I do because I want to, not because I want people to be forced to use itJun 16 03:08
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: I guess since you don't care about market shareJun 16 03:08
bethlynnwell, you  discussed RMS who demands 100% free software market shareJun 16 03:08
sebsebsebthats why you don't understand, why  many of us careJun 16 03:08
sebsebsebbethlynn: yeah I guess thats true RMS wants 100% free software market share, that won't be happening any time soon, though if everJun 16 03:08
SuborbitalPigeonno, it's because it doesn't matterJun 16 03:08
sebsebsebafter all this is capitalism and consumerism we are on about hereJun 16 03:08
bethlynnI care because we are on a verge of some serious changeJun 16 03:09
bethlynnanyhow, I'd better runJun 16 03:09
sebsebsebbethlynn: ok bye for now I guessJun 16 03:09
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SuborbitalPigeonhalf the time you say you want people to be forced to use something they don't want/care to; and the other half you're saying they're stupidJun 16 03:09
sebsebsebbethlynn: altough serious changeJun 16 03:09
sebsebsebyou mean what exactly?Jun 16 03:09
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: people are stupid to follow Windows, since  like everyone else they know uses itJun 16 03:10
sebsebsebtheres this idea that Windows is the best realy or somethingJun 16 03:10
sebsebsebsince most computer users use itJun 16 03:10
SuborbitalPigeonso instead you'll force them to use Linux and still insult them?Jun 16 03:10
sebsebsebnot forceJun 16 03:10
sebsebsebchoiceJun 16 03:10
SuborbitalPigeonthey've chosenJun 16 03:10
sebsebsebmost computer users don't  reolize they have a choice, and what that choice isJun 16 03:10
bethlynnif anyone can tell me what happened to boycottmicrosoft.com, please email me at bethlynneicher@gmail.com, this is whatwillweuse.com over and outJun 16 03:10
SuborbitalPigeonyou underesimate peopleJun 16 03:10
sebsebsebhence why they will go for WIndows or Mac, since thats what is advertised to themJun 16 03:10
sebsebsebbethlynn: oh that will go in the log of this channel your email addresJun 16 03:11
SuborbitalPigeonwell, this sort of shite doesn't help thatJun 16 03:11
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: anyway Chrome OS will be interestingishJun 16 03:11
sebsebsebthere will be TV adverts from Google for it I guessJun 16 03:11
sebsebsebthat could change stuff :)Jun 16 03:11
SuborbitalPigeonconsidering it can't do anything, I'd be surprisedJun 16 03:11
bethlynnI know... that's why I used the gmail....Jun 16 03:11
bethlynncyaJun 16 03:12
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: I read you can run other apps using some sort of remote connectJun 16 03:12
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sebsebsebon the subject of can't do anythingJun 16 03:12
sebsebsebthats what a lot of people will think in your kind of contextJun 16 03:12
sebsebsebafter trying Ubuntu, or some other distro, hence why tehy don't go mainstreameJun 16 03:12
sebsebsebcan't just use their Windows software, maybe can't just connect to wireless,  or can't just use sound even.  or can't just install a graphics card driver.  We know that can do a lot with Desktop Linux on the correct hardware, they don't.Jun 16 03:13
SuborbitalPigeonit's because I'm not under the impression that everyone is either an idiot, or wrongJun 16 03:13
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: Linux and Mac isn't always a good fit for a userJun 16 03:14
sebsebsebhence WindowsJun 16 03:14
sebsebsebone reasonJun 16 03:14
SuborbitalPigeoncan't just use their camera, maybe can't put the flash off, or just can't use video mode evenJun 16 03:14
sebsebsebthey are OS's they are toolsJun 16 03:14
SuborbitalPigeonwhat idiots that don't even have SLRs!Jun 16 03:14
sebsebsebSLRs ?Jun 16 03:14
SuborbitalPigeon<sarcasm>Jun 16 03:14
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: anyway bug 1 talk is uhmmJun 16 03:14
sebsebsebpretty much over for now I thinkJun 16 03:15
SuborbitalPigeoncrazy?Jun 16 03:15
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: I was doing it since she was here :DJun 16 03:15
SuborbitalPigeondeluded?Jun 16 03:15
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: what she said above though when she gave out percentagesJun 16 03:15
sebsebsebthats the kind of thing I want as wellJun 16 03:15
SuborbitalPigeonoh right, you don't know what an SLR is then?Jun 16 03:15
SuborbitalPigeonyou haven't been given the choice to buy one thenJun 16 03:16
sebsebsebaltough I think for a distro or a few popular distros to have 20% is good enoughJun 16 03:16
sebsebsebforJun 16 03:16
sebsebsebuh yes here it comesJun 16 03:16
sebsebsebcommercial software companies to take Desktop Linux seriouslyJun 16 03:16
sebsebsebwhich will mean more users :)Jun 16 03:16
SuborbitalPigeonI'll believe it when I see itJun 16 03:17
SuborbitalPigeonwhich will be neverJun 16 03:17
sebsebsebwell things could go all mobile insteadJun 16 03:17
sebsebseband then Desktop Linux won't matter much at all anymoreJun 16 03:17
SuborbitalPigeonseriously, you should contribute and mellow yourselfJun 16 03:18
sebsebsebto begin withJun 16 03:18
sebsebsebmost apps for Linux were commercialJun 16 03:18
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: anyway I know Linux distros are really meant to set us free and all that from propritary software, but most users want  software they think is good, be that opensource/freesoftware or propritaryJun 16 03:19
SuborbitalPigeonno, most people don't careJun 16 03:19
sebsebseband most computer users don't know about opensource/freesoftware yeah.Jun 16 03:19
SuborbitalPigeonand it doesn't mean you should mock/belittle themJun 16 03:19
sebsebsebalso quite a few people try out Fedora for example,  or maybe Debian even, and don't like the free software only thingJun 16 03:20
sebsebsebso back to UbuntuJun 16 03:20
SuborbitalPigeongood for themJun 16 03:20
SuborbitalPigeonI don't care what others doJun 16 03:20
sebsebsebFedora and Debian and such, for  people who know about free software, as you basically said beforeJun 16 03:21
sebsebsebUbuntu and Mint, for those that want to replace Windows with something more secureJun 16 03:21
SuborbitalPigeonnoJun 16 03:21
sebsebsebyes most Ubuntu users and I guess Mint as well,  use them, because they want to replace WindowsJun 16 03:21
SuborbitalPigeonhow can you assert that?Jun 16 03:22
SuborbitalPigeonmind you, it can't be for the freedomJun 16 03:22
sebsebsebI have talked to a lot of people from the big Ubuntu channel and that, so I knowJun 16 03:22
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: in fact theres a blog entry from the  other dayJun 16 03:23
sebsebsebon omgubuntuJun 16 03:23
sebsebsebwith many comments,  for why people use UbuntuJun 16 03:23
sebsebsebstill not read most/all of thatJun 16 03:23
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: yes most Ubuntu users  won't be going for it since the freedom, they will be going for it, since what I just saidJun 16 03:23
sebsebsebthey want to get away from viruses and such, thats why they change OSJun 16 03:24
SuborbitalPigeongood for themJun 16 03:24
sebsebsebthats what people care about reallyJun 16 03:24
SuborbitalPigeonevil bastards!Jun 16 03:24
sebsebsebthey just want to use a computer for what they want to do, without security issuesJun 16 03:24
sebsebseband nothing wrong with that reallyJun 16 03:24
SuborbitalPigeonso what is your point exactly?Jun 16 03:24
sebsebsebpeople want to treat a computer as a consumer device that just works,  doesn't have to be maintainedJun 16 03:24
sebsebsebthey don't get that with WIndows,  with a Linux distro  they do if their hardware is ok,  and then just install security updates when availalbeJun 16 03:25
SuborbitalPigeonand?Jun 16 03:25
sebsebseband many  new Ubuntu users won't know about other distros.  and thats how things are.  and yeah I am for choice :)Jun 16 03:26
sebsebsebwe have it when it comes to food and clothing and so on,  OS's we do as well, but most  computer users don't know.   So yeah Ubuntus bug 1,  and that is also why some of us do  Ubuntu support, or well one of the reasons.Jun 16 03:26
SuborbitalPigeonso, people shouldn't use Windows because they are too stupid to realise they have a choice, but then should use Ubuntu because they have no choice?Jun 16 03:26
sebsebsebnoJun 16 03:26
sebsebsebthey should use the OS that works best for what they want to do on the computer,  most of the time that won't be Windows though, but most computer users won't know thatJun 16 03:27
cubezzzdownloaded the wrong aros, silly me :)Jun 16 03:27
SuborbitalPigeonI'm so sorry if anyone is reading this log, this is killing meJun 16 03:27
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: heh in a wayJun 16 03:27
cubezzzeh? what did I miss?Jun 16 03:27
SuborbitalPigeonI'm already in a bad moodJun 16 03:27
sebsebsebcubezzz: uhmmJun 16 03:28
sebsebsebcubezzz: market share talkJun 16 03:28
SuborbitalPigeoncubezzz: literally nothingJun 16 03:28
cubezzzok good Jun 16 03:28
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: whats up?Jun 16 03:28
SuborbitalPigeonyou areJun 16 03:29
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: hehJun 16 03:29
sebsebsebstop talking to me thenJun 16 03:29
sebsebsebconvo over!Jun 16 03:29
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: I have typed what I wanted to say on the subject anyway :DJun 16 03:29
SuborbitalPigeonI would have done if you didn't make such sweeping statementsJun 16 03:29
sebsebsebsweeping statements?Jun 16 03:29
SuborbitalPigeonget a bloody dictionaryJun 16 03:29
sebsebsebanyway I guess if someone else goes through that lot, and reads most of it,  well thats a bit sadJun 16 03:30
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SuborbitalPigeona bit sad?Jun 16 03:30
sebsebsebSuborbitalPigeon: you are thinkingJun 16 03:31
sebsebsebvery sadJun 16 03:31
sebsebsebI guess or something like thatJun 16 03:31
SuborbitalPigeonyou are accusing me of being very sad?Jun 16 03:31
sebsebsebnoJun 16 03:31
SuborbitalPigeonanyway, this endless fruitlessJun 16 03:33
SuborbitalPigeondamn itJun 16 03:33
*WireWulf is now known as Wulf-is-not-hereJun 16 03:34
DaemonFChttp://community.winsupersite.com/blogs/paul/archive/2010/06/04/apple-it-s-not-a-standard-if-it-only-works-in-your-browser-and-on-the-mac.aspxJun 16 03:35
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DaemonFCThurrott finally posts something moderately intelligible Jun 16 03:35
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] Snicker RT @rikkikite: NOOO! Blue screen of death at the Atlanta zoo! http://tweetphoto.com/27347599Jun 16 03:39
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] W00t! RT @engadget: Exclusive: Motorola Droid X preview http://bit.ly/bHYN3vJun 16 03:41
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_the_mad_hatter] New blog post: James Gannon - Is He Responding To His... http://madhatter.ca/2010/06/15/james-gannon-is-he-responding-to-his-masters-voice/Jun 16 03:43
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cubezzzwell processing AROS Lite nowJun 16 03:46
cubezzzjust an experimentJun 16 03:47
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @mkapor: $200,000 paid by eBay to settle employee claim Meg Whitman shoved her http://nyti.ms/adgxXyJun 16 03:49
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DaemonFCOffice 2010 supports ODF 1.1 according to WikipediaJun 16 04:30
sebsebsebDaemonFC:  cubezzz away schestowitz http://www.linuxtoday.com/infrastructure/2010061401139OPCYUBJun 16 04:32
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[harishpillay] Swan River tour http://ur1.ca/07u5aJun 16 04:44
TechrightsTitle: http://file.status.net/identica/harishpillay-20100616T033822-yqr8v8w.jpeg - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 8.17 KBJun 16 04:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[harishpillay] A$56 million house! #fb http://ur1.ca/07u7xJun 16 04:58
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DaemonFChttp://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2010-06-14-lightcigarettes14_ST_N.htm?csp=obinsiteJun 16 05:07
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] Previous http://counter.li.org was expired. Created a new one: 5123040 and counted my workhorses ;-)Jun 16 05:41
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] The new account on http://counter.li.org is 513040. The previous was a typo (Shame on me)Jun 16 05:43
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] The new account on http://counter.li.org is 513040. The previous was a typo (Shame on me)Jun 16 05:43
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] WTF? 503040Jun 16 05:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] yawn :-(Jun 16 05:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #CUBRID Does Clustering, Manatee County Goes With #FreeSoftware http://ur1.ca/07uj4 http://ur1.ca/07uj6Jun 16 06:10
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Python GUI Proposal, Python 2.7 is Coming http://ur1.ca/07uk9 http://ur1.ca/07ukaJun 16 06:15
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[doctorow] Anyone know someone at #Yahoo who can help a friend who's Ymail account has been hijacked?Jun 16 06:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Latest #ACTA Backlash, Escape from “Digital Economy Act” http://ur1.ca/07i4e http://ur1.ca/07ntb http://ur1.ca/07ultJun 16 06:29
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[doctorow] Solved my #Yahoo problem -- thanks @xenijardin!Jun 16 07:07
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MinceRhttp://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/may/16/texas-schools-rewrites-us-historyJun 16 07:50
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DaemonFCsweet zombie Jesus!!!!Jun 16 08:01
DaemonFC:PJun 16 08:01
*DaemonFC is now known as JesusFCJun 16 08:06
JesusFC:)Jun 16 08:06
JesusFCMinceR, Now you can go ahead and guess what the FC stands forJun 16 08:07
JesusFCmuahahahahaaaa!!!Jun 16 08:07
*JesusFC is now known as DaemonFCJun 16 08:07
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @einfeldt RT @mkapor: $200,000 paid by eBay to settle employee claim Meg Whitman shoved her http://nyti.ms/adgxXyJun 16 08:12
TechrightsTitle: Meg Whitman Was Accused of Shoving eBay Employee - NYTimes.com .::. Size~: 69.51 KBJun 16 08:12
MinceRDaemonFC: Future CrewJun 16 08:12
DaemonFCnoJun 16 08:13
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DaemonFCWhy am I making coffee at 3 AM?Jun 16 08:17
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**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jun 16 08:20:39 2010
*Now talking on #boycottnovellJun 16 08:20
*Topic for #boycottnovell is: TechRights.org | Channel #boycottnovell for http://TechRights.org | Free Software Sentry – watching and reporting maneuvers of those who oppose software freedom :: please also join channels #techrights and #boycottnovell-socialJun 16 08:20
*Topic for #boycottnovell set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Fri May 7 00:18:08 2010Jun 16 08:20
-ChanServ-[#boycottnovell] Welcome to the #boycottnovell channelJun 16 08:20
*ChanServ gives channel operator status to schestowitz_logJun 16 08:20
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] Tou? Tou xim? ♺ @JNegocios: PSD propõe possibilidade de acumular salário com parte do subsídio de desemprego http://xl.pt/r/cTFZXmJun 16 08:21
TechrightsTitle: Jornal de Negócios Online .::. Size~: 34.12 KBJun 16 08:21
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] Outro "acidente"? ♺ @JNegocios: Inscritos nos centros de emprego sofreram maior descida em mais de três anos http://xl.pt/r/cOcXqPJun 16 08:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Open Data is necessary but not sufficient - http://bit.ly/9SleTJ interesting comments on open climate science #opendataJun 16 08:22
TechrightsTitle: Jornal de Negócios Online .::. Size~: 33.61 KBJun 16 08:22
TechrightsTitle: Unilever Centre for Molecular Informatics, Cambridge - Open Data is necessary but not sufficient «  petermrs blog .::. Size~: 20.16 KBJun 16 08:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] A Deep Look at #ZaReason Verix Notebook (GNU/Linux), #Raydesk 3.0 http://ur1.ca/07vfr http://ur1.ca/07vfvJun 16 08:31
TechrightsTitle: [Phoronix] ZaReason Verix Notebook Review .::. Size~: 19.05 KBJun 16 08:31
TechrightsTitle: Raydesk: Company > News > Raydesk 3.0: Revolution in Virtual Desktops .::. Size~: 30.67 KBJun 16 08:31
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Coverage of #Linux Against Poverty 2010 (Desktop GNU/Linux) for the Needy http://ur1.ca/07k9lJun 16 08:32
TechrightsTitle: The Blog of Helios: Linux Against Poverty 2010 - Making a Difference .::. Size~: 76.07 KBJun 16 08:32
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] The Californian (and everyones) FOSS elephant in the room. http://www.govtech.com/gt/765252?topic=117671 #FLOSSJun 16 08:34
TechrightsTitle: Open Source Software Gaining Acceptance (Opinion) .::. Size~: 61.01 KBJun 16 08:34
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Free Art License - http://bit.ly/dcEGub interesting: I'd not come across this one before #art #licensingJun 16 08:35
TechrightsTitle: Free Art License | basekamp .::. Size~: 21.07 KBJun 16 08:35
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[yoonkit] The Malaysian Constitution. http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Constitution_of_Malaysia I suggest you read itJun 16 08:37
TechrightsTitle: Constitution of Malaysia - Wikisource .::. Size~: 380.47 KBJun 16 08:37
DaemonFCI always license anything I post as the Creative Commons Share-Alike Non-Commercial with Attribution licenseJun 16 08:37
DaemonFCjust because I don't want some company like Verizon to download it and start using it for freeJun 16 08:37
DaemonFCif I ever see anything like that going on, I will send a DMCA Take-Down notice to themJun 16 08:38
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Gregor MacDonald - Energy, transportation, and transitions - http://bit.ly/bB7A7S great pic, great interview: "This is peak" #peakoilJun 16 08:39
TechrightsTitle: Gregor MacDonald - Energy, transportation, and transitions - Boing Boing .::. Size~: 21.35 KBJun 16 08:39
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] No CIO in healthcare is afraid of FOSS. http://is.gd/cR8Tw #FLOSSJun 16 08:40
DaemonFCa big problem with these free software projects, schestowitz, is that none of them have the balls to use the legal framework bought and paid for by the cartels, against the cartelsJun 16 08:40
DaemonFCif your enemy leaves weapons laying around, why not pick them up and use them against your enemy? :)Jun 16 08:41
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[yoonkit] Interesting that #yorais has his own Facebook page: http://bit.ly/blFtLl Tho everything is in caps!Jun 16 08:44
TechrightsTitle: YB. DATO' SERI UTAMA DR. RAIS YATIM | Facebook .::. Size~: 83.85 KBJun 16 08:44
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] “Ballmer’s Departure Seems to be Imminent” http://techrights.org/2010/06/16/german-magazine-on-leadership/Jun 16 08:53
TechrightsTitle: “Ballmers Departure Seems to be Imminent” | Techrights .::. Size~: 91.94 KBJun 16 08:53
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cubexyzwell had a rather ugly battle with redhat 6 earlierJun 16 08:54
cubexyzno usb mouse on redhat 6 ;)Jun 16 08:54
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Applications for GNU/Linux Reviews, Compared, Listed http://ur1.ca/07vpx http://ur1.ca/07vpz http://ur1.ca/07vq1 http://ur1.ca/07vq2Jun 16 08:58
TechrightsTitle: VirtualBox vs. KVM on the Desktop: A Comparison | WorksWithU .::. Size~: 46.42 KBJun 16 08:58
TechrightsTitle: 7 Dock Applications For Linux Desktops «  LinuxNov .::. Size~: 37.83 KBJun 16 08:58
TechrightsTitle: indicator applets now work with awn | OMG! Ubuntu! .::. Size~: 72.17 KBJun 16 08:58
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux Servers/Appliances Simplified With #TurnKey http://www.readwriteweb.com/cloud/2010/06/turnkey-linux-make-launching-o.phpJun 16 08:59
TechrightsTitle:   TurnKey Linux Make Launching Open Source Appliances in the Cloud Easy - ReadWriteCloud .::. Size~: 52.37 KBJun 16 08:59
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] If we ever needed proof that all crime is a political construct then the aftermath of the #bloodysunday inquiry will provide it.Jun 16 09:04
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] as a follow-up to my last tweet, this looks a seriously good site on the topic of oil and energy: http://bit.ly/cznKJf #oil #energyJun 16 09:30
TechrightsTitle: Gregor.us .::. Size~: 64.85 KBJun 16 09:30
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft gives very expensive gifts to many journalists with the expectation that positive coverage will follow http://ur1.ca/07w09Jun 16 09:32
TechrightsTitle: Bribosoft | Techrights .::. Size~: 96 KBJun 16 09:32
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] RT @wikileaks IMMI has passed! The Icelandic government unanimously supports press freedoms and will put IMMI into law! More soon >>wowJun 16 09:42
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Wireless Oligopoly Is Smother of Invention - http://bit.ly/aqBwup we need open standards, open source and open spectrum #mobileJun 16 09:46
TechrightsTitle: Wireless Oligopoly Is Smother of Invention | Epicenter | Wired.com .::. Size~: 99.16 KBJun 16 09:46
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Exoplanet Hunter’s First Data Withholds the Good Stuff - http://bit.ly/aZ2hEb bad NASA: the public should see what it pays for #opendataJun 16 09:48
TechrightsTitle: Exoplanet Hunters First Data Withholds the Good Stuff | Wired Science | Wired.com .::. Size~: 74.23 KBJun 16 09:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[yoonkit] Ronal-D'oh! RT @sheldongoh: Cristiano Ronaldo fans - look who just joined Twitter :) @cristianoJun 16 09:53
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] A Glimpse at #GIMP Development Ahead of Major New Release http://ur1.ca/07w88 http://ur1.ca/07w8aJun 16 10:05
TechrightsTitle: Martin Nordholts' GIMP Blog: Automatic tab style and removed tab title bar .::. Size~: 27.28 KBJun 16 10:05
TechrightsTitle: How will a fully GEGL powered GIMP look like? - News - gimpusers.com .::. Size~: 20.76 KBJun 16 10:05
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Ubuntu #GNU #Linux follows the footsteps of projects like #Fedora and sweeps Novell’s #Mono aside http://ur1.ca/07w7zJun 16 10:06
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Proprietary Opera Browser Improves #GNU #Linux Support http://ur1.ca/07w89 http://ur1.ca/07w8b http://ur1.ca/07w8cJun 16 10:06
TechrightsTitle: Mono Cleanup | Techrights .::. Size~: 93.32 KBJun 16 10:06
TechrightsTitle: Opera Desktop Team - Saturday Snapshot .::. Size~: 55.73 KBJun 16 10:06
TechrightsTitle: Norwegian browser Opera aims to topple reigning Internet Explorer .::. Size~: 85.81 KBJun 16 10:06
TechrightsTitle: Software Latest Releases  » Blog Archive   » Firefox vs. Opera .::. Size~: 41.7 KBJun 16 10:06
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] New Flock divorces Firefox, snuggles up to Chrome - http://bit.ly/chJhqI chasing the shiny #firefox #chrome #flockJun 16 10:11
TechrightsTitle: New Flock divorces Firefox, snuggles up to Chrome | The Download Blog - Download.com .::. Size~: 70.45 KBJun 16 10:11
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More Rebuttals to Latest #GNU #Linux #Security #FUD http://ur1.ca/07wae ‘ammunition’ for those who come across the latest bit of FUDJun 16 10:14
TechrightsTitle: More Rebuttals to Latest GNU/Linux Security FUD | Techrights .::. Size~: 90.25 KBJun 16 10:14
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[yoonkit] Locals vs Tourists - Singapore: http://www.flickr.com/photos/walkingsf/4671490329/in/set-72157624209158632/Jun 16 10:21
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[doctorow] Sweet Tooth: suspenseful and grim post-apocalyptic graphic novel off to a GREAT start http://tinyurl.com/3xl9ctaJun 16 10:21
TechrightsTitle: Locals and Tourists #38 (GTWA #43): Singapore on Flickr - Photo Sharing! .::. Size~: 62.27 KBJun 16 10:21
TechrightsTitle: Sweet Tooth: gripping, post-apocalyptic graphic novel off to a killer start - Boing Boing .::. Size~: 13.58 KBJun 16 10:21
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Open Correspondence - http://bit.ly/aN0j14 "the cultural graph links items like books, poems and events together" #socialgraph #cultureJun 16 10:30
TechrightsTitle: Open Knowledge Foundation Blog  » Blog Archive   » Open Correspondence .::. Size~: 32.85 KBJun 16 10:30
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] MEPs want an 'Internet of things' - http://bit.ly/b1k55P shouldn't they understand the other Internet first? #meps #internetofthingsJun 16 10:31
TechrightsTitle:                     Meps want an 'internet of things' - The Inquirer          .::. Size~: 55.8 KBJun 16 10:31
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] I have just discovered that there is a #monofree group in identica http://identi.ca/group/monofreeJun 16 10:34
TechrightsTitle: Mono Free (monofree) group - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 50.46 KBJun 16 10:34
schestowitzhttp://identi.ca/conversation/36270804#notice-36475333 "Shotwell gone; when can we hope for Tomboy removal? ♻ @schestowitz: !Ubuntu (...) sweeps Novell’s #Mono aside  http://ur1.ca/07w7z !monofree"Jun 16 10:35
TechrightsTitle: Conversation - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 9.66 KBJun 16 10:35
TechrightsTitle: Mono Cleanup | Techrights .::. Size~: 93.32 KBJun 16 10:35
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @wikileaks IMMI has passed! The Icelandic government unanimously supports press freedoms and will put IMMI into law! More soonJun 16 10:38
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] Ah good, I have notify working with Gwibber again.Jun 16 10:40
MinceRj0Jun 16 10:55
MinceRhttp://www.staringispolite.com/likepython/Jun 16 10:56
TechrightsTitle: Like, Python .::. Size~: 7.24 KBJun 16 10:56
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] TfL Gives Data To Developers, Now National Rail Must Follow Suit - http://bit.ly/bZaEd9 the #opendata train has left the station...Jun 16 10:57
TechrightsTitle: TfL Gives Data To Developers, Now National Rail Must Follow Suit| paidContent:UK .::. Size~: 29.61 KBJun 16 10:57
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] EU Commission for software patents in standards: "There should be no bias in favour or against royalty free standards" http://ur1.ca/07wwaJun 16 11:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] EU Commission using the undefined FRAND term: "IPR to all third parties on fair, reasonable and nondiscriminatory terms" http://ur1.ca/07wwaJun 16 11:16
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] Bill Gates's limp defence of Chinese web censorship http://is.gd/cRglYJun 16 11:17
TechrightsTitle:  Bill Gates's limp defence of Chinese web censorship | Media | guardian.co.uk  .::. Size~: 97.6 KBJun 16 11:17
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[nsisodiya] FOSS software are meant for sharing, but I never shared any foss software with my friends. Everytime I gave DVD or url for download DVD :(Jun 16 11:32
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Another day at work.... :( Getting ready to go.Jun 16 11:33
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[popey] Someone told me I 'popped up' on facebook chat last night, even though I deleted my account weeks ago. Odd. I think he was pissed.Jun 16 11:38
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[popey] RT @rowinggolfer new blogpost - http://bit.ly/cELQ7a 'Making a pyqt4 application which accepts "plugins"' - with ogv video.Jun 16 11:41
TechrightsTitle: rowinggolfer: Making a pyqt4 application which accepts "plugins". .::. Size~: 63.58 KBJun 16 11:41
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Music Biz Set To “3 Strike” Two-Thirds of Irish Broadband - http://bit.ly/aFOrU2 such a waste of time and effort #irelandJun 16 11:43
TechrightsTitle:    Music Biz Set To 3 Strike Two-Thirds of Irish Broadband | TorrentFreak   .::. Size~: 37.03 KBJun 16 11:43
schestowitzMinceR: funnyJun 16 11:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] U.S. State Department beats Cuba with a stick, again. http://is.gd/cRhXrJun 16 11:52
TechrightsTitle: Latin American Herald Tribune - Cuba Rejects U.S. Allegations About Underage Prostitution .::. Size~: 23.96 KBJun 16 11:52
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] Bitcoin P2P Cryptocurrency now in public beta http://is.gd/cRiJi Explanation http://is.gd/cRiOl Technical details http://is.gd/cRiSDJun 16 12:12
TechrightsTitle: P2P Foundation  » Blog Archive   » Bitcoin P2P Cryptocurrency now in public beta .::. Size~: 52.23 KBJun 16 12:12
TechrightsTitle: Bitcoin open source implementation of P2P currency - P2P Foundation .::. Size~: 53.44 KBJun 16 12:12
TechrightsTitle: Not a web page! Aborting application/pdf type .::. Size~: 0 KBJun 16 12:12
schestowitzI got a mpeg scoopJun 16 12:14
schestowitzMüller said he would blog about it because he "wanted the source to feel good about how things progress."Jun 16 12:15
schestowitz> I just meant to say (and it could be misunderstood now) that I wanted toJun 16 12:15
schestowitz> take care of how the story is told. Whether that is achieved through meJun 16 12:15
schestowitz> blogging about it myself or like in this case through an authorizationJun 16 12:15
schestowitz> process actually comes down to the same. So I think that kind of purelyJun 16 12:15
schestowitz> internal consideration is no longer relevant for the public since you willJun 16 12:15
schestowitz> now publish the information and it would therefore be best to leave it out.Jun 16 12:15
nawiwhich blog post are you talking about?Jun 16 12:17
zoobaburl?Jun 16 12:17
schestowitzNot up yet...Jun 16 12:23
schestowitzI'm proofreading...Jun 16 12:23
nawiwhat's the scoop :DJun 16 12:24
schestowitzMPEG taxJun 16 12:24
schestowitzMore than $5 million (cap)Jun 16 12:24
schestowitzOK. Just posted.Jun 16 12:36
schestowitzI needed to just get the go-aheadJun 16 12:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Striding Towards Codec Freedom to Remove 'Linux Tax' from #Dell http://bit.ly/bO9ggw #ubuntu #swpats #patentJun 16 12:37
TechrightsTitle: Striding Towards Codec Freedom to Remove Linux Tax from Dell | Techrights .::. Size~: 99 KBJun 16 12:37
schestowitzhttp://www.streetinsider.com/Rumors/Novell+(NOVL)+Sees+Interest+Into+the+Close+on+Possible+Deal/5727582.htmlJun 16 12:42
nawihmm, you seem to blog a lotJun 16 12:42
TechrightsTitle: StreetInsider.com - Novell (NOVL) Sees Interest Into the Close on Possible Deal .::. Size~: 14.58 KBJun 16 12:43
schestowitzMy record is 28 posts in one dayJun 16 12:46
nawiwhat's your "day job"?Jun 16 12:49
schestowitzI've just finishedJun 16 12:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] @zoobab That's not surprising given that Neelie's speeches are all broadcasted in protocols that require software patentsJun 16 12:51
nawiwhat do you mean by "just finished"Jun 16 12:54
nawilol, first time I see someone quoting a person in IRC with a link to the log. pretty coolJun 16 12:56
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] Re last RT that is just over £7000 per incident half that if you take out the 21 torture cases which leaves £3500 each for dead and woundedJun 16 12:56
nawiin one of your blog posts..Jun 16 12:56
schestowitznawi: 10,294 posts in totalJun 16 12:58
schestowitzIt's a hobby; I might do image science research for pay soon, haven't decided yetJun 16 12:59
schestowitzThe academic model is rustyJun 16 12:59
oiaohmI am normally quoted from IRC.  Main reason I don't post enough in linkable sites.Jun 16 12:59
schestowitzThey still use journals, lectures, peer review etc, which assume scarcity (no video, no Internet, limited # of printer books, library visits, etc.)Jun 16 12:59
nawiwe had some lectures in a video formatJun 16 13:00
schestowitzThe newspaper industry is rarely trying to advance and embrace blogging, microblogging, crowdsourcing, etc.Jun 16 13:00
schestowitznawi: yesJun 16 13:00
nawithe problem is that people are distracted when watching themJun 16 13:00
nawiI myself skipped them too pretty muchJun 16 13:00
schestowitzAt which stage, thing like open university (distant learning) make senseJun 16 13:00
schestowitzAnd MIT's lectures are now 'open' tooJun 16 13:00
schestowitzSo you needn't produce your own courseware, eitherJun 16 13:00
nawiwhen you have to physically go to listen to the lecture, there's no distractionsJun 16 13:00
schestowitzYou can set up examinations based on the material of other pedagoguesJun 16 13:00
nawi(I don't bring my laptop anymore with me)Jun 16 13:00
schestowitzI used to bring my Palm to lectures to take notes withJun 16 13:01
schestowitzAnd I fell asleep too oftenJun 16 13:01
schestowitzThat was ages agoJun 16 13:01
schestowitzI haven't done any exam since 2003Jun 16 13:01
schestowitzExcept oral exams like my Ph.D. viva in 2008Jun 16 13:02
nawiI've just completed about 2 years in a university, but I'm starting to lose motivation to the whole systemJun 16 13:02
nawiI don't really think I'll even graduate..Jun 16 13:02
schestowitzDom graduateJun 16 13:02
schestowitzYou'll regret it later if you don'tJun 16 13:02
schestowitz s/Dom/Do/Jun 16 13:02
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] I am watching the #worldcup. I quite liked the vuvuzela's until I missed all the humour, singing and subtleties of crowd behaviour.Jun 16 13:03
nawiPerhaps I'll get a candidate degree Jun 16 13:03
schestowitzIn 2006 I thought about changing course too, but it's sillyJun 16 13:03
schestowitzI also thought about doing 2 PhDs in 2005Jun 16 13:03
schestowitzBut that's just pointlessJun 16 13:03
schestowitzAcademia is weirdJun 16 13:04
schestowitzIt's outside the remit of 'real world'Jun 16 13:04
nawithe bigger problem is that I'm losing interest in ITJun 16 13:04
schestowitzAnd I have had good jobs here for agesJun 16 13:04
schestowitzLittle work, good payJun 16 13:04
nawibut I don't have any substitute interestsJun 16 13:04
schestowitzI was actually paid to do my Ph.D. cause at work I had so much free time that I was allowed to just do researchJun 16 13:04
nawiwell, politics is one as I'm running as a candidate in the next elections, but I don't like to study that in a uniJun 16 13:05
schestowitznawi: yes, IT is outsourced nowJun 16 13:05
schestowitzNokia is sacking many peopleJun 16 13:05
*nawi would never work for NokiaJun 16 13:05
schestowitzGoogle takes what's left of Europe's phone dominance, Apple tooJun 16 13:05
schestowitzAnd they don't pay for engineersJun 16 13:05
schestowitzThey just employ kids in ChinaJun 16 13:05
nawijob prospects are okay in finland thoughJun 16 13:06
schestowitzBig profits for Jobs & Chums, bad for the restJun 16 13:06
schestowitznawi: in .fi IT?Jun 16 13:07
nawiyesJun 16 13:07
schestowitzServices are always neededJun 16 13:07
schestowitzHow much of Nokia's staff is in .fi?Jun 16 13:07
schestowitzThey had abut 100k in totalJun 16 13:07
schestowitzBut production isn't done in .fiJun 16 13:07
nawiI heard Nokia still employs about 50% of all classesJun 16 13:08
nawiof the IT graduates in my uni that isJun 16 13:08
nawiit used to be like nearly 100% thoughJun 16 13:08
schestowitzhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NokiaJun 16 13:10
TechrightsTitle: Nokia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 393.71 KBJun 16 13:10
schestowitzemployees "125,859 (March 31, 2010"Jun 16 13:10
schestowitz"Nokia Siemens Networks"Jun 16 13:11
schestowitzThat explains better why Nokia loves software patents so muchJun 16 13:11
nawimaybe they hire fresh students, work them till burnout and then get new onesJun 16 13:11
nawihowever, it was pretty disturbing to hear from an Nokia "outsourcing manager" saying that no matter how many hours after the official closing time you would call the Chinese office, someone was there still working overtimeJun 16 13:12
nawias if he expected that to be the norm to followJun 16 13:12
schestowitzHere's how it works, AFAIKJun 16 13:13
schestowitzYou don't need to work overtimeJun 16 13:13
schestowitzReally, you don'tJun 16 13:13
schestowitzBut others mightJun 16 13:13
schestowitzAnd weak employees get replacedJun 16 13:13
schestowitzSo you don't have to work overtimeJun 16 13:13
schestowitzThere's nothing in the contract that requires itJun 16 13:13
schestowitzBut if you choose to work like the contract says, then you're not "exceptional"Jun 16 13:14
schestowitzAnd only "exceptionals" have job securityJun 16 13:14
schestowitzSo it's a system where they can say they obey the lawJun 16 13:14
schestowitzBut only those who bust their arse will keep their jobJun 16 13:14
schestowitzIt's implicit consent to excessive labourJun 16 13:14
schestowitzMicrosoft can exploit this when it comes to workers it imports with visas, to whom losing their job may mean their whole family will be 'deported'Jun 16 13:15
nawiI've heard many scary stories about the finnish IT industry too, people working huge overtimes without extra payJun 16 13:15
nawia lot of depressing shitJun 16 13:15
schestowitzPeople can work 100 times per weekJun 16 13:15
schestowitzPhysically possibleJun 16 13:15
nawipart of the reason I don't look forward to workingJun 16 13:15
nawione funny idea is to be unemployed but work on free softwareJun 16 13:16
schestowitzYou can do sufficiency workJun 16 13:16
nawiand other important political activityJun 16 13:16
schestowitzGoing to Russia like Nils TorvaldsJun 16 13:17
zoobabis it true that the size of netbooks screens is limited my MS licensing,Jun 16 13:21
schestowitzYesJun 16 13:21
schestowitzOr wasJun 16 13:21
zoobabI am looking for a netbook for my mother, but she wants a larger screenJun 16 13:21
schestowitz"You get this discount only if" = coercionJun 16 13:21
zoobablooking at Acer lineJun 16 13:22
zoobabhttp://www.ldlc.be/fiche/PB00096538.htmlJun 16 13:22
TechrightsTitle: Acer Aspire Timeline 3410G-234G32n - Achat / Vente PC Portable sur LDLC.com BELGIQUE .::. Size~: 59.9 KBJun 16 13:22
zoobabjust discovered that some of them have Android preinstalledJun 16 13:22
schestowitzVista 7Jun 16 13:22
zoobabin parralel to Win7Jun 16 13:22
schestowitzAcer does dual, yesJun 16 13:22
schestowitzDell sells Mini with UbuntuJun 16 13:22
schestowitzMaybe not in .beJun 16 13:23
zoobabMini is 10 inches screen, too smallJun 16 13:23
schestowitzVista 7 won't even let you change wallpapersJun 16 13:23
schestowitzUnless you pay extraJun 16 13:23
schestowitzhttp://lxer.com/module/db/index.php?dbn=14Jun 16 13:24
TechrightsTitle: LXer: Pre-installed Linux .::. Size~: 14.13 KBJun 16 13:24
schestowitzhttp://lxer.com/module/db/viewby.php?uid=124&sort=120&option=1&value=on&offset=0&dbn=14Jun 16 13:24
TechrightsTitle: LXer: Pre-installed Linux .::. Size~: 16.32 KBJun 16 13:24
schestowitzhttp://lxer.com/module/db/go/14/6559/vJun 16 13:24
TechrightsTitle: LXer: Pre-installed Linux: Linux Service .::. Size~: 12.92 KBJun 16 13:24
schestowitz.be basedJun 16 13:24
schestowitzhttp://www.linux-service.be/Jun 16 13:25
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] the FSF and our associated organisation FFII asked Google to free the video codec vp8 and use it on YouTube http://ur1.ca/07xy1Jun 16 13:29
TechrightsTitle: FSFE Newsletter - June 2010 .::. Size~: 9.52 KBJun 16 13:29
schestowitzhttp://www.tuxmachines.org/node/45879Jun 16 13:34
TechrightsTitle: Tuxmachines' Fund Raiser | tuxmachines.org .::. Size~: 28.22 KBJun 16 13:34
schestowitzhttp://blog.flameeyes.eu/2010/06/15/why-do-floss-advocates-like-adobe-so-much\Jun 16 13:40
TechrightsTitle: Flameeyes's Weblog : Why do FLOSS advocates like Adobe so much? .::. Size~: 27.72 KBJun 16 13:40
schestowitzDo they?Jun 16 13:40
Diablo-D3we do?Jun 16 13:41
oiaohmOk whatJun 16 13:41
oiaohmMost FLOSS people hate lot of things Adobe do.Jun 16 13:41
nawiofftopic: Nokia is down 9%Jun 16 13:41
Diablo-D3we had flash worse than silverlightJun 16 13:42
Diablo-D3erJun 16 13:42
Diablo-D3we hate flash worse than silverlightJun 16 13:42
Diablo-D3silverlight gets less hate because no site uses it.Jun 16 13:42
nawi*10%Jun 16 13:42
oiaohmOk silverlight is pure item to hate worse than flashJun 16 13:42
Diablo-D3oiaohm: thats the problemJun 16 13:42
Diablo-D3if no site uses silverlightJun 16 13:42
oiaohmWhy do a crappy clone of something.Jun 16 13:42
Diablo-D3then we really dont have to _hate_ itJun 16 13:42
MinceR143649 < Diablo-D3> we hate flash worse than silverlightJun 16 13:42
MinceRyou do?Jun 16 13:43
Diablo-D3MinceR: I doJun 16 13:43
oiaohmI am a little different to you.  Diablo-D3Jun 16 13:43
Diablo-D3I cant hate something nobody usesJun 16 13:43
oiaohmI hate crappy clones.Jun 16 13:43
Diablo-D3I can mildly dislike itJun 16 13:43
MinceRsilverlie sites work on even less systemsJun 16 13:43
Diablo-D3theres no such thing as a silverlight siteJun 16 13:43
oiaohmAnd want to see them cease to exist.Jun 16 13:43
Diablo-D3Ive never naturally came across oneJun 16 13:43
oiaohmNow clones that offer something good.Jun 16 13:43
MinceRi've heard an idiot claim that ie6 users must be supported BUT silverlight is omg-great and must be usedJun 16 13:43
nawihttp://www.kauppalehti.fi/5/i/porssi/porssikurssit/osake/index.jsp?klid=1050&intra=true&graafi=true#graphJun 16 13:43
Diablo-D3the only ones Ive seen are ones microsoft advertise to advertise for silverlightJun 16 13:43
TechrightsTitle: Nokia | Osake | Kauppalehti.fi .::. Size~: 96.97 KBJun 16 13:43
nawilol, Nokia is in freefall, -11%Jun 16 13:43
Diablo-D3now, flash ones?Jun 16 13:43
Diablo-D3out of the 120 tabs I have open in firefox, I bet at least a quarter have flash in themJun 16 13:44
MinceRDiablo-D3: be glad silverlie isn't as widely spread as trashJun 16 13:44
Diablo-D3Im using a firefox build that runs plugins in separate processesJun 16 13:44
oiaohmflash I can kinda live with.Jun 16 13:44
Diablo-D3the flash process was using 4.2gb of memory.Jun 16 13:44
oiaohmFor now.Jun 16 13:44
Diablo-D3or about 5 times more than firefox.Jun 16 13:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] At Hamburg airport. Got my hair in new config so now I officially look good. Next Rome.Jun 16 13:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] Huge amount of data. World Football Elo Ratings / Rankings - Interactive Map http://is.gd/cRoEM #worldcupJun 16 13:50
TechrightsTitle: World Football Elo Ratings / Rankings - Interactive Map | EduTube Educational Videos  .::. Size~: 11.56 KBJun 16 13:50
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] According to Elo formula Chile stand a 70% chance of winning this match, we shall see. #worldcupJun 16 13:53
schestowitznawi: Nokia trades in Helsinki?Jun 16 14:04
schestowitzTeJun 16 14:05
nawiyesJun 16 14:05
schestowitzthey have changed management recentlyJun 16 14:05
nawilowest stock value in ~20 yearsJun 16 14:05
schestowitzSigned deals with Microsoft at Linux's expenseJun 16 14:05
schestowitzAnd with Intel at ARM's expenseJun 16 14:05
schestowitzNokia is cared of Google and Apple (California)Jun 16 14:06
schestowitzNokia's phones are much betterJun 16 14:06
schestowitzMaemo in n900 and MeeGoJun 16 14:06
schestowitzMore openJun 16 14:06
schestowitzGoogledrones just want "apps" and "crapps"Jun 16 14:06
MinceR150003 < schestowitz> Signed deals with Microsoft at Linux's expenseJun 16 14:06
MinceRwhen?Jun 16 14:06
schestowitzApril or MayJun 16 14:07
schestowitzAnd last year tooJun 16 14:07
MinceRdo you have articles about these?Jun 16 14:07
schestowitzAnd in 2008 they signed a Silver Lie dealJun 16 14:07
schestowitzMinceR: yesJun 16 14:07
schestowitzhttp://techrights.org/2008/03/05/moox-and-silverlight-finland/Jun 16 14:08
TechrightsTitle: Nokia and Finland: A Mystery Behind OOXML and Silverlight | Techrights .::. Size~: 111.75 KBJun 16 14:08
schestowitzhttp://techrights.org/2010/05/10/patent-stooges-and-aggressive-cartel/Jun 16 14:08
TechrightsTitle: Software Patents Rumble: Apple, Microsoft, Nokia, and GNU/Linux | Techrights .::. Size~: 128.48 KBJun 16 14:08
oiaohmNokia is has a habit of betting both ways.Jun 16 14:08
schestowitzhttp://www.informationweek.com/news/windows/operatingsystems/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=219501079Jun 16 14:08
TechrightsTitle: Nokia Unveils Windows 7 Netbook -- Netbooks -- InformationWeek .::. Size~: 80.37 KBJun 16 14:08
MinceRand what was this one about? >> 150009 < schestowitz> And with Intel at ARM's expenseJun 16 14:09
oiaohmNokia is going to be forced to compete in the PC market.Jun 16 14:09
oiaohmAs PC makers attack their turf.Jun 16 14:09
MinceRtheir netbook is poulsbo crapJun 16 14:09
schestowitzMinceR: Nokia used not to do AtomJun 16 14:16
schestowitzAnd now it collaborates with Novell/Intel-MoblinJun 16 14:16
schestowitzAtom is rubbishJun 16 14:17
schestowitzThe only thing it's good for is if you pretnd that phone should and /can/ run .EXE legacyJun 16 14:17
*Wulf-is-not-here is now known as WireWulfJun 16 14:18
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] A Look at #PCLinuxOS #Gnome 2010 Replacing #Windows on a Notebook http://ur1.ca/07ybuJun 16 14:20
TechrightsTitle: cidtux's blog: PCLinuxOS Gnome 2010 on ACER ASPIRE 4730ZG .::. Size~: 50.19 KBJun 16 14:20
MinceRor nonfree linux binaries such as Trash for x86Jun 16 14:20
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Comparison of Desktop #GNU #Linux Distributions, Review of #Pardus 2009.2 http://ur1.ca/07ybt http://ur1.ca/07ybvJun 16 14:22
TechrightsTitle: The Linux Experience: Comparison: Best 2010 Linux desktop for begginers .::. Size~: 99.61 KBJun 16 14:22
TechrightsTitle: Pardus 2009.2 review   LinuxBSDos.com .::. Size~: 70.59 KBJun 16 14:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #RedHat Unique Among Free Software Vendors http://ur1.ca/07yf4 http://ur1.ca/07pw7Jun 16 14:32
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Opinions on #FreeSoftware as Billion-dollar Business Opportunity http://ur1.ca/07yf2 http://ur1.ca/07yf5Jun 16 14:32
TechrightsTitle: There may never be another Red Hat but that is OK | ZDNet  .::. Size~: 109.4 KBJun 16 14:32
TechrightsTitle: BBC - dot.Maggie: The open-source entrepreneur .::. Size~: 49.12 KBJun 16 14:32
TechrightsTitle: 451 CAOS Theory » Why there are no billion-dollar open source companies .::. Size~: 43.98 KBJun 16 14:32
TechrightsTitle: On the Other Hand&  » Blog Archive   » Old-fashioned money .::. Size~: 17.3 KBJun 16 14:32
nawischestowitz, you should consider adding flattr buttons to your blog ( http://flattr.com )Jun 16 14:34
TechrightsTitle: Flattr .::. Size~: 8.2 KBJun 16 14:34
nawia large german newspaper just adopted itJun 16 14:34
schestowitzWhoaJun 16 14:37
schestowitz|@schestowitz I think it has been set as the default in UNE, can't find the link atm.  Could change of course."Jun 16 14:37
schestowitzhttp://identi.ca/conversation/36289910#notice-36497191Jun 16 14:37
TechrightsTitle: Conversation - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 9 KBJun 16 14:37
schestowitzIs it true? Banshee in UNE by default?Jun 16 14:38
schestowitznawi: it's a betaJun 16 14:39
nawibut it works well Jun 16 14:39
MinceRand then my eeepc decided the keyboard doesn't workJun 16 14:39
MinceRlife is greatJun 16 14:39
MinceRcould be a linux issue, i have no clueJun 16 14:40
schestowitzI heard of it beforJun 16 14:40
schestowitzWas it from the TPB guy?Jun 16 14:40
nawiyesJun 16 14:40
nawiseems to be gaining tractionJun 16 14:40
schestowitzA friend of mine from Finland asked me to use it in MarchJun 16 14:40
schestowitzBut I haven't yetJun 16 14:41
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] ♺ @wikileaks IMMI has passed! The Icelandic government unanimously supports press freedoms and will put IMMI into law! More soonJun 16 14:41
schestowitznawi: I'll wait on the sideline for nowJun 16 14:41
schestowitzI don't count on blogging to pay anythingJun 16 14:41
nawithe main point is to get publicity for flattrJun 16 14:42
schestowitzIt's a Commons thingJun 16 14:43
schestowitzI write, you write, he writes, we shareJun 16 14:43
schestowitzIf we start paying each other it's cancelled outJun 16 14:43
schestowitzIt's like giving oneself a trophy or giving your wife a cheque for her birthdayJun 16 14:43
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Debian GNU/Linux Project Newsletter Released http://www.debian.org/News/weekly/2010/05/Jun 16 14:45
TechrightsTitle:    Debian Project News - June 14th, 2010  .::. Size~: 21.74 KBJun 16 14:45
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Ubuntu Strives to Improve Its #FreeSoftware http://ur1.ca/07yil http://ur1.ca/07kk6 http://ur1.ca/07469Jun 16 14:47
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] One said generic medicines would not be affected since ACTA does not deal with patents http://ur1.ca/07yjfJun 16 14:47
TechrightsTitle: openSUSE Lizards    » Improve Software Quality .::. Size~: 72.68 KBJun 16 14:47
TechrightsTitle: Proposed Ubuntu 10.10 installer changes will make installation faster, friendly, intelligent | OMG! Ubuntu! .::. Size~: 80.92 KBJun 16 14:47
TechrightsTitle: Cardapio menu applet gets web search and preferences | OMG! Ubuntu! .::. Size~: 73.4 KBJun 16 14:47
nawischestowitz, yet in the real life we need to pay the rent and buy foodJun 16 14:48
nawiwithout money content producing may be an hobby, which limits the creativity of that personJun 16 14:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] A Look at #Motorola 's Latest #Linux Phones, #Android Breaks Record http://ur1.ca/07yk3 http://ur1.ca/07yk5 http://ur1.ca/07yk7Jun 16 14:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Linux is Winning in Tablets, Based on Chinese Testimonial http://ur1.ca/07yk4 http://ur1.ca/07yk9Jun 16 14:51
TechrightsTitle: Motorola's 2GHz Android Phone Means Business - PCWorld Business Center .::. Size~: 60.2 KBJun 16 14:51
TechrightsTitle: Motorola's Milestone XT720: Is This The Next Droid? - PCWorld .::. Size~: 73.56 KBJun 16 14:51
TechrightsTitle: Battleship of an Android phone sets Sprint sales record • The Register .::. Size~: 32.36 KBJun 16 14:51
TechrightsTitle: Q7 Linux MID nice but missing most important feature | Handle With Linux .::. Size~: 30.27 KBJun 16 14:51
schestowitznawi: trueJun 16 14:53
schestowitzIt's a problem musicians, journalists and other people who produce digital stuff are facingJun 16 14:53
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrAfqvIwt9EJun 16 14:53
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Carl Sagan & Ann Druyan talk about Saintly Macaques .::. Size~: 90.79 KBJun 16 14:53
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #OpenVBX is Launched (Free Software) http://techcrunch.com/2010/06/15/twilio-openvbx-google-voice/Jun 16 15:04
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Advice for Building #FreeSoftware Communities http://ur1.ca/07yowJun 16 15:04
TechrightsTitle:   Twilio Releases OpenVBX, An Open Source Google Voice For Businesses  .::. Size~: 72.58 KBJun 16 15:04
TechrightsTitle: How to find a community's cheeseheads when they aren't wearing foam hats | opensource.com .::. Size~: 44.6 KBJun 16 15:04
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] New #FreeSoftware Events With Some Coverage http://ur1.ca/07yqo http://ur1.ca/07yqq http://ur1.ca/07yqrJun 16 15:09
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #OSI and #FSF Ideals Debated http://ur1.ca/07yqn http://ur1.ca/07yqp http://ur1.ca/07gpjJun 16 15:09
TechrightsTitle:  An Open Source Weekend | NetworkWorld.com Community .::. Size~: 74.93 KBJun 16 15:09
TechrightsTitle: Ubuntu Developer Summit: Maverick Meerkat Highlights | Linux User .::. Size~: 31.82 KBJun 16 15:09
TechrightsTitle: Hacking with Open Source .::. Size~: 60.88 KBJun 16 15:09
TechrightsTitle: Your Chance To Change OSI | Open Source Initiative .::. Size~: 16.7 KBJun 16 15:09
TechrightsTitle: Henri Bergius: Weblog: Open Source? Free Software? What we need is Open Projects .::. Size~: 15.48 KBJun 16 15:09
TechrightsTitle: DistroWatch.com: Put the fun back into computing. Use Linux, BSD. .::. Size~: 88.9 KBJun 16 15:09
*WireWulf is now known as Wulf-is-not-hereJun 16 15:14
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] ♺ @bjunior: EU's president talks about the risk of 'democracy collapse' in GR, PT and SP. perfect timing #worldcup http://goo.gl/TBGB #ironyJun 16 15:26
TechrightsTitle: EU chief warns 'democracy could disappear' in Greece, Spain and Portugal  | Mail Online .::. Size~: 77.66 KBJun 16 15:26
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @dsearls: Tweeting now over the new Nexus One Android here in Paris. Liking it.Jun 16 15:29
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] Really good article by @glynmoody RT @gnuchris: Why No Billion-Dollar Open Source Companies? http://ur1.ca/07vf5Jun 16 15:48
TechrightsTitle: Why No Billion-Dollar Open Source Companies? - Community - ComputerworldUK .::. Size~: 108.17 KBJun 16 15:48
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nawiit's a good thingJun 16 15:56
nawilarge corporations get generally very evilJun 16 15:56
nawithere should be some kind of law or mechanism which limits the sizes of corporations. I just don't know whatJun 16 15:57
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Open World Forum 2010 programme - http://bit.ly/cUEieW lots of interesting stuff #owf2010Jun 16 16:00
TechrightsTitle: Open World Forum 2010 - Program .::. Size~: 25.72 KBJun 16 16:00
*Wulf-is-not-here is now known as WireWulfJun 16 16:01
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] ACTA is very bad news for free sw and digital rights; I've written lots about it - see first few links here: http://bit.ly/aKWvJH #actaJun 16 16:03
TechrightsTitle: Google .::. Size~: 14.3 KBJun 16 16:03
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Massive P2P Conglomerate Backs New TV-Series - http://bit.ly/aQnOwE biggest threat not piracy, but not getting noticed: VODO aims to helpJun 16 16:10
TechrightsTitle:    Massive P2P Conglomerate Backs New TV-Series | TorrentFreak   .::. Size~: 42.08 KBJun 16 16:10
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[doctorow] "#Canadian grassroots" pro-#DMCA group is secretly run by US record labels http://tinyurl.com/27ksl5y #astroturfJun 16 16:25
TechrightsTitle: US record labels starts fake "citizen's group" to support Canada's DMCA - Boing Boing .::. Size~: 11.33 KBJun 16 16:25
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] US record labels starts fake "citizen's group" to support Canada's DMCA - http://bit.ly/dwICLv should tell us something #dmca #canadaJun 16 16:26
TechrightsTitle: US record labels starts fake "citizen's group" to support Canada's DMCA - Boing Boing .::. Size~: 11.33 KBJun 16 16:26
schestowitz[15:57] <nawi> there should be some kind of law or mechanism which limits the sizes of corporations. I just don't know whatJun 16 16:39
schestowitzThere's law for monopoliesJun 16 16:39
schestowitz>50%Jun 16 16:39
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @doctorow "#Canadian grassroots" pro-#DMCA group is secretly run by US record labels http://tinyurl.com/27ksl5y #astroturfJun 16 16:43
TechrightsTitle: US record labels starts fake "citizen's group" to support Canada's DMCA - Boing Boing .::. Size~: 11.33 KBJun 16 16:43
nawi40% is too bigJun 16 16:45
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[popey] RT @mdh47 Lessons for Android Tablet Vendors http://j.mp/aLqwaK - I'd add 'battery life is king' to that list.Jun 16 17:02
TechrightsTitle: Lessons for Android Tablet Vendors - SlashGear .::. Size~: 56.81 KBJun 16 17:02
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[rcweir] Uploaded my presentation from #LinuxTag "The Mutual Advantage of Open Source and Open Standards" http://bit.ly/bId7PzJun 16 17:03
TechrightsTitle: Writings .::. Size~: 21.08 KBJun 16 17:03
schestowitznawi: so Nokia need to be regulatedJun 16 17:13
nawiyes, but I didn't claim to have a decent solutionJun 16 17:13
nawidoes Nokia still have a market share higher than 40?Jun 16 17:13
schestowitzDepends on classificationsJun 16 17:16
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @rcweir u/d my presentation from #LinuxTag "The Mutual Advantage of Open Source and Open Standards" http://bit.ly/bId7Pz >simple & goodJun 16 17:16
TechrightsTitle: Writings .::. Size~: 21.08 KBJun 16 17:16
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] What will Iceland’s new media laws mean for journalists? - http://bit.ly/aPI2ou useful first analysis #iceland #journalismJun 16 17:20
TechrightsTitle: What will Icelands new media laws mean for journalists? » Nieman Journalism Lab .::. Size~: 28.41 KBJun 16 17:20
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sebsebsebHiJun 16 17:28
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] 7 Free, Open Source Tomes For Your Edification - http://bit.ly/16qFD4 good choice: covers the basics #opensource #ebooksJun 16 17:30
TechrightsTitle: Google Reader .::. Size~: 12.47 KBJun 16 17:30
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] On my way to Rome via ZRH. Tmrw talking again on #digitalwaste.Jun 16 17:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Novell is a #FogComputing Company Looking for a Buyer http://ur1.ca/07zrq #saas #cloud #microsoftJun 16 17:38
TechrightsTitle: Novell is a Fog Computing Company Looking for a Buyer | Techrights .::. Size~: 91.54 KBJun 16 17:38
schestowitzsebsebseb: wbJun 16 17:56
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] takeoff in Hamburg delayed by at least 25 min. May miss connecting flight to Rome.Jun 16 17:56
sebsebsebschestowitz: tyJun 16 17:56
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] Watched benjamin's talk on "Revealing errors - that reveals how technology shapes and controls our lives" http://bit.ly/cDLltg [flv]Jun 16 17:59
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Deep packet inspection soon to be $1.5 billion business - http://bit.ly/cQ1LVt worrying #dpiJun 16 18:09
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Novell still uses software patents protection as a business proposition to users of #SUSE http://ur1.ca/07zxo #swpatsJun 16 18:12
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] ♺ @glynmoody: What will Iceland’s new media laws mean for journalists? - http://bit.ly/aPI2ou useful first analysis #iceland #journalismJun 16 18:15
schestowitzhttp://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ie2qTB_NLQSdOutaqf-j_ngfsHVAD9GBA6M03Jun 16 18:16
schestowitzChina puts the kibosh on the USJun 16 18:16
schestowitzzoobab: http://www.mediapost.com/publications/?fa=Articles.showArticle&art_aid=130210 "Along with the technology, IBM acquires several of Coremetrics' patents"Jun 16 18:20
schestowitzhttp://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/2010/06/15/business-beseiges-panel-china-complaints/Jun 16 18:20
schestowitzChina no longer takes orders from the White House/WTOJun 16 18:21
nawigoodJun 16 18:21
nawiintellectual monopolists try to stop the growth of chinese corporationsJun 16 18:21
schestowitz"Seven: software patents continue to be a thorn in the side of the industry, with difficulties in securing them and protecting them still common." http://www.ft.com/cms/s/d3955564-774d-11df-ba79-00144feabdc0,Authorised=false.html?_i_location=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ft.com%2Fcms%2Fs%2F0%2Fd3955564-774d-11df-ba79-00144feabdc0.html&_i_referer=Jun 16 18:22
schestowitznawi: why shouldn't they stop them?Jun 16 18:22
nawiwithout patents there would be so much more innovationJun 16 18:22
schestowitzI mean, they are Chinese /sarcasmJun 16 18:22
nawischestowitz, because it's evilJun 16 18:22
schestowitzWhite men was given right to rule by Mr. Jesus Christ and God :-)Jun 16 18:22
schestowitz*wereJun 16 18:22
nawiwhere're you from btw?Jun 16 18:23
schestowitzUKJun 16 18:23
schestowitzI'm sarcastic in the aboveJun 16 18:23
nawiah sorry I forgot you told me earlierJun 16 18:23
schestowitzRemember the Chinese built the US rail systemsJun 16 18:23
schestowitzTexas oughtn't put that in its revisionist new school curriculaJun 16 18:24
nawiwhat's your opinion in the pirate party of UK?Jun 16 18:24
schestowitzThey even redefine slavery with euphemism now, calling it "Trade"Jun 16 18:24
schestowitznawi: I read their blog, I'm subscribed to itJun 16 18:24
nawiit's too bad that they don't have any chance in the parliamentary elections because of the unfair election systemJun 16 18:25
nawiyou're using a better system for the EU elections, however there's not enough seats for small partiesJun 16 18:25
schestowitzMaybe they can bring their own chairs from homeJun 16 18:29
schestowitzSitting at the aisleJun 16 18:29
schestowitzhttp://www.nbcwashington.com/around-town/real-estate/Is_The_White_House_for_Sale_-96258284.htmlJun 16 18:30
schestowitzhttp://developers.slashdot.org/story/10/06/14/2225251/Knuth-Got-It-WrongJun 16 18:36
schestowitzFBI is scanning Facebook: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/10319053.stmJun 16 18:42
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] So now we know that #Facebook is being automatically scanned by the FBI http://ur1.ca/07sdt #1984 #bigbrotherJun 16 18:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] When Medicines Fail: Rachel Nugent on Combating Drug Resistance. http://is.gd/cRI8zJun 16 18:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jonobacon] Folks, join me live at http://bit.ly/wWBiQ for my weekly Ubuntu and community Q+A vidchat! #ubuntuJun 16 18:49
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Google might hurt some video editors for desktop; http://ur1.ca/0805z should Adobe be worried about Photoshop?Jun 16 18:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] @schestowitz I read this earlier it was reported to the police. Still there is far too much spying going on by the authorities.Jun 16 18:54
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] @schestowitz I read that story much earlier today, I am sure it has been changed. Earlier it said people had reported it to police.Jun 16 18:56
MinceRhow was it shown that .net and mono bytecode is not compatible with each other?Jun 16 18:57
schestowitz*LOL* "Troubling evidence surrounding the Deepwater Horizon explosion on April 20th suggests that the incident could have been manufactured." http://sbeckow.wordpress.com/2010/06/14/actions-of-bp-halliburton-and-goldman-sachs-prior-to-the-oil-spill/Jun 16 18:57
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schestowitz"The problem is getting worse. Notional amounts of derivatives held by federally insured banks have risen to more than $200 trillion."Jun 16 19:01
schestowitzhttp://www.fool.com/investing/general/2010/06/15/the-coming-financial-meltdown.aspxJun 16 19:01
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jonobacon] About to start the live video Q+A about #ubuntu and #community - be there and bring questions, and RT this. :-)Jun 16 19:03
schestowitzhttp://www.irc-junkie.org/2010-06-11/researchers-develop-honeybot-social-engineer-irc-users-automatically/Jun 16 19:06
schestowitzhttp://www.theonion.com/interactive/the-onion-sports-introduction-to-world-cup-soccer,17558/Jun 16 19:08
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TechrightsHello World!Jun 16 19:09
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TechrightsTitle: Main Page - Techrights .::. Size~: 37.25 KBJun 16 19:09
TechrightsHello World!Jun 16 19:09
schestowitzTim Bray blogs about football daily... what a waste of space for a tech blog. http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/201x/2010/06/12/World-Cup-Day-2Jun 16 19:11
TechrightsTitle: ongoing by Tim Bray · Day Two .::. Size~: 9.36 KBJun 16 19:11
schestowitzhttp://pogson.6k.ca/2010/06/13/web-stats-i-like/Jun 16 19:17
TechrightsTitle:   Web Stats I Like at  Robert Pogson .::. Size~: 27.33 KBJun 16 19:17
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] $11.7m judgment against Spamhaus slashed to $27,000 - http://bit.ly/dB0IqE a mild outbreak of sanity #spamJun 16 19:20
TechrightsTitle: $11.7m judgment against Spamhaus slashed to $27,000 • The Register .::. Size~: 32.27 KBJun 16 19:20
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] The Advertiser's Doom - http://bit.ly/a8QIIS "Selling audience eyeballs is doomed as a business model." #businessmodelsJun 16 19:34
TechrightsTitle: Digital Productions: The Advertiser's Doom .::. Size~: 25.34 KBJun 16 19:34
schestowitzhttp://www.guardian.co.uk/society/sarah-boseley-global-health/2010/jun/11/abortion-nicaraguaJun 16 19:37
TechrightsTitle:  Nicaragua refuses to lift abortion ban | Society | guardian.co.uk  .::. Size~: 140.81 KBJun 16 19:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Personnel Today goes online only - http://bit.ly/aJltW8 wow, end of an era: I remember seeing the dummies for this before launchJun 16 19:41
TechrightsTitle: Personnel Today goes online only - One Man and His Blog .::. Size~: 45.27 KBJun 16 19:41
schestowitzhttp://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jun/12/darfur-sudan-icc-unJun 16 19:41
TechrightsTitle:  In a bind over Darfur | Louise Roland-Gosselin | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk  .::. Size~: 184.63 KBJun 16 19:41
schestowitz"Perversely, superstitions can help irrational people succeed at a task, even though they are totally false: they provide instruments for people to fool themselves. " http://www.stallman.org/archives/2010-mar-jun.html#14%20June%202010%20%28Keep%20trying%29Jun 16 19:43
schestowitzhttp://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/jun/12/barbara-harris-sterilise-drug-addicts-alcoholicsJun 16 19:45
TechrightsTitle:  Should drug addicts be paid to be sterilised? | Society | The Guardian  .::. Size~: 90.63 KBJun 16 19:45
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] I've just learned that the new name for BP is "Big Polluter" #bpcaresJun 16 19:50
schestowitzHeh: http://news.softpedia.com/news/All-Your-Files-May-Live-in-the-Cloud-Soon-144536.shtmlJun 16 20:00
TechrightsTitle: All Your Files May Live in the Cloud Soon - Dropbox, Ubuntu One, Windows Live Sync and Google Chrome OS are paving the way - Softpedia .::. Size~: 50.3 KBJun 16 20:00
nawilol: http://caustictech.typepad.com/caustictech/2004/06/the_open_source.htmlJun 16 20:00
TechrightsTitle: causticTech: The Open Source Zealot .::. Size~: 62.29 KBJun 16 20:00
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] Broadband providers may have to cap those 'unlimited' broadband claims http://is.gd/cRMf1 #advertisingJun 16 20:03
TechrightsTitle:  Broadband providers may have to cap those 'unlimited' broadband claims | Media | guardian.co.uk  .::. Size~: 92.32 KBJun 16 20:03
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] Ik kon het niet laten, heb me weer geregistreerd op http://websereld.nl onder de handle iGNUciusJun 16 20:04
TechrightsTitle: Error processing the URL:  .::. Size~: 0 KBJun 16 20:04
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] Jemig, vandaag is tikfouten-dag, de juiste link is: http://webwereld.nlJun 16 20:05
TechrightsTitle: Webwereld .::. Size~: 61.74 KBJun 16 20:05
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] All the reports about #Ubuntu For Tablets turn out to be false. It all started in IDG and Mark S. denies it all now. The rumour was false.Jun 16 20:13
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DaemonFChttp://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5g9DpzU7x6mN-SYAHOKaeEc56G5ggD9GCH9E03Jun 16 20:30
TechrightsTitle: The Associated Press: FDA: 'Female Viagra' falls short .::. Size~: 13.18 KBJun 16 20:30
DaemonFCApparently there's ~3.5 billion women out there who can't get an erectionJun 16 20:30
DaemonFCthis looks like a job for the drug companiesJun 16 20:30
DaemonFCDrug company Exec 1: "There's women out there who don't want to have sex." "Exec 2: "You mean like the married ones?" Exec 1: "Yeah. So I've come up with a pill. Exec 2: "But what if they don't want to take it?" Exec 1: "Then we market it to men and suggest they grind it up into their wife's coffee."Jun 16 20:33
DaemonFC:DJun 16 20:33
schestowitzhttp://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/your-business/business-categories/biz-categories-technology/netbooks-find-niche-in-business-world/article1601004/Jun 16 20:40
schestowitz"But he also points out that there is another option for the technically inclined. “A small number of netbooks are available from the factory with Linux pre-installed, and you can always download a free distribution of Linux for an existing netbook,” he says, adding the caveat, “While this may work for the technically adventurous, this is hardly an option for the majority of mainstream businesses that lack the geek cred to Jun 16 20:40
TechrightsTitle: Netbooks find niche in business world - The Globe and Mail .::. Size~: 80.16 KBJun 16 20:40
schestowitzcomfortably integrate Linux-based software and training into their day-to-day operations.” "Jun 16 20:40
schestowitzMyth?Jun 16 20:40
MinceRi'm looking for _technical_ arguments against .net and c#Jun 16 20:41
schestowitzDaemonFC: :-)Jun 16 20:41
schestowitzMinceR: not for incompatibility with MonoJun 16 20:41
schestowitz?Jun 16 20:41
schestowitzhttp://www.sdtimes.com/link/34415Jun 16 20:42
TechrightsTitle: Among Eclipse developers, Windows loses ground - SD Times: Software Development News .::. Size~: 125.3 KBJun 16 20:42
MinceRschestowitz: that's one itemJun 16 20:42
MinceRbut even for that it would be nice to have a linkJun 16 20:42
schestowitzMinceR: google it?Jun 16 20:42
MinceRi'm tryingJun 16 20:43
schestowitzhttp://www.google.com/search?hl=en&c2coff=1&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&q=%22why+.net+sucks%22&aq=f&aqi=m1&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=Jun 16 20:43
TechrightsTitle: "why .net sucks" - Google Search .::. Size~: 37.45 KBJun 16 20:43
DaemonFCMozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; en-US; rv:1.9.3a6pre) Gecko/20100616 Minefield/3.7a6preJun 16 20:44
DaemonFCUser agent creepJun 16 20:44
MinceRno useful results thereJun 16 20:45
schestowitzDo some language insist on spaces before punctuation marks?Jun 16 20:46
DaemonFCMozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 8.0; Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; Trident/4.0; SLCC2; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; .NET CLR 3.5.30729; .NET CLR 3.0.30729; Media Center PC 6.0)Jun 16 20:46
schestowitz*gesJun 16 20:46
DaemonFCIE 8, turning the user agent into a short novelJun 16 20:46
DaemonFCbecause every website I go to needs to be informed that I have Windows Media CenterJun 16 20:47
schestowitzWindows, WINDOWS...... WOW!! 64 Minefield!Jun 16 20:47
schestowitzMaybe Microsoft will start entering random referer [sic] for Bong in HTTP headersJun 16 20:48
DaemonFCshhh, don't give them the ideaJun 16 20:48
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 20:48
schestowitzTo booster its figures like it does not with Yahoo!, cheating with fae reuestsJun 16 20:48
schestowitz*fake requestsJun 16 20:48
DaemonFCschestowitz, Then maybe they can sneak in an extension for Firefox that does the same thingJun 16 20:48
DaemonFCgive it to you in Windows UpdateJun 16 20:48
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 20:48
schestowitzThey could 'pull a plurk'Jun 16 20:49
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jonobacon] A demo of the "Build From Branch" support in Launchpad - wicked cool - http://blip.tv/file/3738068 #ubuntu #launchpadJun 16 20:49
TechrightsTitle: buildfrombranch  .::. Size~: 29.9 KBJun 16 20:49
DaemonFC"Net Applications referrer helper"Jun 16 20:49
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 20:49
schestowitzLet some company in CHina do it, then blame outsidersJun 16 20:49
schestowitzI guess the FF extension that obfuscates Google history boosts Google alreaduJun 16 20:50
schestowitzI can't recall what it was called... haven't heard from it in yearsJun 16 20:50
schestowitzhttp://www.gamershell.com/news_97360.htmlJun 16 20:50
TechrightsTitle: News: Awesome Soccer World 2010 Released and Demo - GamersHell.com .::. Size~: 20.54 KBJun 16 20:50
DaemonFC"The next day, Microsoft confirmed that MSN Juku (which, it stated, had been developed by a Chinese contractor) did contain copied code, and stated that the service would be indefinitely suspended.[6]"Jun 16 20:51
DaemonFC"This service is temporarily suspended while we find someone else's code to steal"Jun 16 20:51
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 20:51
schestowitzhttp://news.cnet.com/8301-30685_3-20007714-264.htmlJun 16 20:52
TechrightsTitle: Twitter whacked by hours-long problems | Deep Tech - CNET News .::. Size~: 87.7 KBJun 16 20:52
DaemonFCschestowitz, The fail whale is suing for overtime payJun 16 20:52
DaemonFC:PJun 16 20:52
schestowitzhttp://twitter.com/#search?q=%23bpcaresJun 16 20:53
TechrightsTitle: Twitter .::. Size~: 43.14 KBJun 16 20:53
DaemonFCThe last thing they want to measure it with is metric unitsJun 16 20:56
DaemonFCthen the numbers are like twice as big, at leastJun 16 20:56
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 20:56
DaemonFCschestowitz, You asked why the US isn't using metric unitsJun 16 20:57
DaemonFCI think it's so oil companies can measure leaks in gallonsJun 16 20:57
schestowitzHeadline not related to content: http://www.booshnews.com/2010/06/15/netbook-operating-system-windows-or-linux/Jun 16 20:59
TechrightsTitle: IT, Hi-Tech, Science, Medicine and Architecture News  » Netbook Operating System  Windows Or Linux? .::. Size~: 29.41 KBJun 16 20:59
schestowitzDaemonFC: they measure in barrelsJun 16 20:59
schestowitzhttp://www.google.com/search?hl=&q=lites+in+barrel&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&ie=UTF-8Jun 16 20:59
DaemonFCsometimesJun 16 20:59
TechrightsTitle: lites in barrel - Google Search .::. Size~: 42.39 KBJun 16 20:59
schestowitz"1 barrel [US, petroleum] = 158.987 295 6 liter"Jun 16 21:00
schestowitzhttp://au.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=1006032512767Jun 16 21:00
TechrightsTitle: Error processing the URL:  .::. Size~: 0 KBJun 16 21:00
schestowitzThis way they stay well under millions per dayJun 16 21:00
DaemonFC1 oil barrel = 42 US gallons, 1 US gallon = 3.78541178 literJun 16 21:00
DaemonFCouchJun 16 21:00
schestowitzThey should count in "ships"Jun 16 21:00
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schestowitzAnd say only 0.1 per dayJun 16 21:00
DaemonFC1 oil barrel = 158.987295 literJun 16 21:01
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 21:01
nawilets all take a moment to laugh at the barbaric imperial systemJun 16 21:01
nawimy country has been using the metric system for over a hundred years (longer than the independence ffs)Jun 16 21:02
schestowitzAnyway, BP is 'old' newsJun 16 21:02
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schestowitzThe oil is going back homeJun 16 21:02
schestowitzAnd has a funeralJun 16 21:02
DaemonFCat least it found a good home after the last empire disbanded and abandoned it, nawi Jun 16 21:02
DaemonFCat least there's thatJun 16 21:02
DaemonFC:DJun 16 21:02
schestowitzThere's a guy in YouTube with a channel just about metric and retardation of US measurement systemJun 16 21:03
schestowitzHe's some teacher in the midwestJun 16 21:03
nawiatleast BP guarantees that any oil hitting the beaches will be free of chargeJun 16 21:03
DaemonFCmaybe the imperial system is just a mummy's curseJun 16 21:03
DaemonFCquick, let's pass it over to China and go metricJun 16 21:03
DaemonFC"You're next! Hehehehehehe!"Jun 16 21:03
schestowitznawi: grab a bucket, mask, and have lots of funJun 16 21:03
schestowitznawi: it's not BP's oil eitherJun 16 21:04
schestowitzThey don't refien itJun 16 21:04
DaemonFCI think the imperial system is like Lord of the Flies, whoever holds it rulesJun 16 21:04
schestowitzThey just punctures a hole somewhereJun 16 21:04
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 21:04
schestowitz*redJun 16 21:04
DaemonFCuntil someone kills the leader and takes itJun 16 21:04
DaemonFC:DJun 16 21:04
schestowitzWe have at least 30k nuclear weapons that can be turned into energyJun 16 21:05
schestowitzAlthough they turn to other chemicals at the endJun 16 21:05
schestowitzThe only other case where atoms change is in the hot cores of planets or supernovasJun 16 21:05
schestowitzMaybe we can throw nuclear waste through a space elevator to the SunJun 16 21:06
schestowitzIntergalactic trash dumpsJun 16 21:06
schestowitzOne-way tripsJun 16 21:07
DaemonFCschestowitz, reminds me of that episode of Rocko's Modern LifeJun 16 21:10
schestowitzWhat's that?Jun 16 21:10
DaemonFCwhere Really Really Really Big Man had a nuclear missile in one hand and a little kid in the otherJun 16 21:11
DaemonFCand threw the kid into the sun by mistake :DJun 16 21:11
schestowitzHow would that work?Jun 16 21:11
schestowitzThe kid would be torn apartJun 16 21:11
schestowitzWhen thrown hard enoughJun 16 21:11
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NtDXWtZWsgo&feature=relatedJun 16 21:12
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Plumber's Assistant .::. Size~: 84.3 KBJun 16 21:12
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHM3uuzBwRg&feature=relatedJun 16 21:13
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Rocko's Modern Life: "I'm a Wild Pig!" .::. Size~: 88.09 KBJun 16 21:13
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2MlMyrcUjY&feature=relatedJun 16 21:13
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Rocko's Modern Life Censored Scene .::. Size~: 88.72 KBJun 16 21:13
schestowitzwth?Jun 16 21:14
schestowitz*LOL* http://www.pcpro.co.uk/blogs/2010/06/16/ubuntu-10-04-a-real-money-saver-for-small-businesses/Jun 16 21:16
schestowitz"It’s not entirely fair to compare boot-up speeds, because my Windows 7 installation is bogged down with lots of installed software, but I’ll do it anyway."Jun 16 21:16
TechrightsTitle: Ubuntu 10.04: a real money saver for small businesses | PC Pro blog .::. Size~: 65.83 KBJun 16 21:16
schestowitzWait...Jun 16 21:16
schestowitzAre they saying that Vista7 comes with more software than Linux?Jun 16 21:17
DaemonFCif he's counting trialware + all the half-functional Windows bundleware....Jun 16 21:17
DaemonFCpossibly :DJun 16 21:17
nawischestowitz, so it's true you've written *10 000* blog posts in the techrights blog?Jun 16 21:18
schestowitzYes, plus pages ouside the blog, such as wiki, static, irc, etc.Jun 16 21:18
schestowitzIt's the biggest project I've ever done and an effective campaignJun 16 21:18
nawihow many years to write those?Jun 16 21:18
schestowitzWe've cost Novell millionsJun 16 21:18
schestowitznawi: 3.5Jun 16 21:18
DaemonFCschestowitz, What's funny is that Microsoft crippled the Windows 7 Ultimate OEM in the same way they crippled the other OEM discsJun 16 21:19
DaemonFCit won't accept a OEM serial for Pro, Home Premium, Basic, or StarterJun 16 21:20
MinceRwhoa, ACCESS pulled out of GNOME?Jun 16 21:20
DaemonFCapparently they want to stop people who pirated a 7 Ultimate disc and want StarterJun 16 21:20
DaemonFC:PJun 16 21:20
DaemonFCyou know, the considerate pirates who don't just want to help themselves to UltimateJun 16 21:21
DaemonFCthey only want to enter the serial that loses Microsoft $20Jun 16 21:21
DaemonFC:DJun 16 21:21
nawischestowitz, so you have a 9-5 job at the moment?Jun 16 21:21
*DaemonFC has never heard of anyone buying UltimateJun 16 21:22
DaemonFCthe only people using Ultimate have MSDN accounts or got it off BittorrentJun 16 21:22
DaemonFCWhy pays $329 for a plastic disc anyway?Jun 16 21:23
nawischestowitz, and how have you cost millions to NovellJun 16 21:24
schestowitzJun 16 21:25
schestowitz[21:20] <MinceR> whoa, ACCESS pulled out of GNOME?Jun 16 21:25
schestowitzThings get rosierJun 16 21:25
schestowitznawi: no, and you might want to review site archivesJun 16 21:26
*DaemonFC knows that schestowitz was among the people gouging eyes out to get Windows 95 on launch dayJun 16 21:26
schestowitzDaemonFC: msdn includes youJun 16 21:27
DaemonFCdirty little secretsJun 16 21:27
schestowitzDaemonFC: were they not 'extras'?Jun 16 21:27
DaemonFCMSDN, Technet, and DreamsparkJun 16 21:27
schestowitzYou sick puppeyJun 16 21:27
schestowitz*pyJun 16 21:27
*DaemonFC has access to stuff from Microsoft he's never even heard of probablyJun 16 21:27
schestowitzWhere do they make it?Jun 16 21:27
schestowitzWhich factory?Jun 16 21:27
schestowitzHow much to make?Jun 16 21:28
DaemonFCOompa Loompa LandJun 16 21:28
schestowitzSo they print out launchn codes?Jun 16 21:28
DaemonFCYou've never heard of Billy Wonka?Jun 16 21:28
schestowitzI haveJun 16 21:28
schestowitzHe makes candyJun 16 21:28
DaemonFCthat's jsut a side gigJun 16 21:28
schestowitzMicrosoft makes binary spewJun 16 21:28
DaemonFCmagical software is another specialtyJun 16 21:28
schestowitzDoesn't apple do "magic"Jun 16 21:28
DaemonFCoh wait...Jun 16 21:28
DaemonFCyeahJun 16 21:29
DaemonFC'it's the Grunka Lunka's that made Windows 7Jun 16 21:29
schestowitzLike making Steve's lungs go titsup\?Jun 16 21:29
schestowitzDaemonFC: no, the ogresJun 16 21:29
schestowitzSanta could fit Vista 7 on his sleigh... for all kidsJun 16 21:29
DaemonFChttp://www.comedycentral.com/videos/index.jhtml?title=slurm-factory-tour&videoId=147496Jun 16 21:29
TechrightsTitle: Slurm Factory Tour | Futurama | Comedy Central .::. Size~: 49.37 KBJun 16 21:29
schestowitzHe gives them launch codesJun 16 21:29
MinceRi don't think it was the lungs, at least not yetJun 16 21:30
schestowitzGoing down people's chimneys with wareZZJun 16 21:30
schestowitzMinceR: he uses finsJun 16 21:30
schestowitzReptile :-pJun 16 21:30
schestowitzDid you know he was a photographer in Ellison's wedding?Jun 16 21:31
MinceRfins can't help with breathingJun 16 21:31
MinceRat least not directlyJun 16 21:31
schestowitzSureJun 16 21:31
schestowitzJobs don't inhaleJun 16 21:31
*DaemonFC starts singing "Grunka Lunka, lunkity Ballmer, if you are nice you'll get Windows 8 next summer"Jun 16 21:31
schestowitzHe doesn't like pr0n, eitherJun 16 21:31
schestowitz"freedom from breathing"Jun 16 21:32
MinceRlolJun 16 21:32
DaemonFChe doesn't like porn while he's giving a family friendly interview watched by people that buy thingsJun 16 21:32
DaemonFCin the back he has a Blackberry and he's fapping to Flash pornJun 16 21:32
DaemonFCand everyone knows it :DJun 16 21:32
schestowitzBoosters: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Microsoft-Open-Source-jQuery-Globalization-Plugin-144481.shtmlJun 16 21:32
TechrightsTitle: Microsoft Open Source jQuery Globalization Plugin - Available - Softpedia .::. Size~: 51.64 KBJun 16 21:32
DaemonFChe doesn't worry about the battery demands of Flash eitherJun 16 21:33
DaemonFCone bar is enough to watch 20 minutesJun 16 21:33
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 21:33
DaemonFCThe Mac Mini is now $700 and can't keep up with my $500 PC from 2006Jun 16 21:34
DaemonFCmarvelousJun 16 21:34
DaemonFCeveryone go rush to buy it nowJun 16 21:34
DaemonFC:DJun 16 21:34
DaemonFCoh, and my $500 PC from 206 already had HDMIJun 16 21:35
schestowitzUselessJun 16 21:35
DaemonFCand these futuristic things called replaceable partsJun 16 21:35
schestowitz="we have flaky hardware"Jun 16 21:36
MinceRand your $500 PC is upgradeable and compatibleJun 16 21:36
MinceRand it wouldn't be easy to match crApple's low hardware quality eitherJun 16 21:37
schestowitzhttp://www.prweb.com/releases/2010/06/prweb4131444.htmJun 16 21:37
TechrightsTitle: Liquidware Brings Modular, Rapid Prototyping to the BeagleBoard Embedded Platform  .::. Size~: 39.71 KBJun 16 21:37
DaemonFCschestowitz, Haven't you ever wished for a $700 PC you can't upgrade that uses laptop components but isn't mobile and requires a separate mouse, keyboard, display, and speakers?Jun 16 21:37
DaemonFCIsn't the Mac Mini jsut the bestest idea ever? :)Jun 16 21:37
MinceRit was, until the release of the next crApple product :>Jun 16 21:37
DaemonFCit's MAGICJun 16 21:37
DaemonFCit's called a Mini-ITX form factor PCJun 16 21:38
DaemonFCand they go for about a third that muchJun 16 21:38
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 21:38
MinceRi have a mini-itx mainboardJun 16 21:38
MinceRthat's crap tooJun 16 21:38
MinceR(via epia)Jun 16 21:38
DaemonFCat least you didn't pay $700 for itJun 16 21:39
DaemonFCand brag to your friends that it's a slow pile of shitJun 16 21:39
DaemonFC:DJun 16 21:39
schestowitzhttp://www.marketwatch.com/story/etisalat-sri-lanka-adopts-red-hat-enterprise-virtualization-2010-06-14?reflink=MW_news_stmpJun 16 21:39
TechrightsTitle: Etisalat Sri Lanka Adopts Red Hat Enterprise Virtualization - MarketWatch .::. Size~: 73.15 KBJun 16 21:39
DaemonFC"It has OS X, but can't use all the features"Jun 16 21:39
DaemonFC"You have to buy the $3,000 Mac Pro for that"Jun 16 21:40
DaemonFC(Which maps to a $1,000 PC)Jun 16 21:40
MinceRyou have to _also_ buy at least one mac proJun 16 21:40
MinceRregardless of what features you wantJun 16 21:40
MinceR:>Jun 16 21:40
MinceRi guess the crApple cult is a lot like the cult of $cientology: the more you spend on it the higher your standing getsJun 16 21:41
DaemonFCOperating Crapple Level 3 biatch!Jun 16 21:41
DaemonFC"Oh yeah? I got an iPad, burn!!!!"Jun 16 21:41
MinceRlolJun 16 21:41
schestowitzyeahJun 16 21:42
DaemonFCat night I bootcamp into Vista and suck my thumbJun 16 21:42
DaemonFCshhhh!Jun 16 21:42
schestowitzi said some years ago, mac mini is affordable ticket to the cultJun 16 21:42
schestowitzhypepod is your first logo in the setJun 16 21:42
DaemonFC$700 is not affordableJun 16 21:42
schestowitzit's like introductory membershipJun 16 21:43
DaemonFCnot for a $200 Mini-ITX PC Jun 16 21:43
MinceRrelatively affordableJun 16 21:43
schestowitzBig spenders get to donate bodyparts to the big kahoonaJun 16 21:43
schestowitzbreeding the "mac experience"Jun 16 21:44
DaemonFCArm, Leg, Eye, Kidney, and Testicle...one more body part gets you the Mac ProJun 16 21:44
schestowitzIf Jobs can get enough followers, he'll be a bionic man :-)Jun 16 21:44
schestowitzHarvesting on his followers like a queen termite :-)Jun 16 21:44
schestowitzhttp://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/First-beta-of-SharpDevelop-4-1021765.htmlJun 16 21:44
TechrightsTitle: First beta of SharpDevelop 4 - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 33.71 KBJun 16 21:44
MinceRbionic liver?Jun 16 21:44
schestowitzbiverJun 16 21:45
DaemonFC"We have the technology, we stole it from various FOSS projects, we can rebuild Next, make it....slightly less of a pile of shit"Jun 16 21:45
DaemonFCchi chi chi chi chaJun 16 21:45
MinceRlolJun 16 21:45
schestowitznot for himJun 16 21:45
schestowitzfor herJun 16 21:45
schestowitzhe has freedom from pr0nJun 16 21:45
MinceRone day he'll have freedom from lifeJun 16 21:45
DaemonFCMinceR, I have to say I like Microsoft better if it comes to a choice between only Microsoft and Apple.Jun 16 21:46
schestowitzwho succeeds him?Jun 16 21:46
DaemonFCAt least Microsoft wrote their own failure-prone softwareJun 16 21:46
schestowitzWho was CEO before he came back?Jun 16 21:46
schestowitzDaemonFC: with BSD codeJun 16 21:46
DaemonFCthey didn't have to steal someone elses to dumb down and fill with bugsJun 16 21:46
schestowitzAnd 'pirated' audioJun 16 21:46
MinceRi have to say that's an immensely bleak choiceJun 16 21:46
MinceRbut i'd go with m$ tooJun 16 21:46
MinceRtheir shit isn't so locked-down as crApple'sJun 16 21:47
MinceRand not so inflexibleJun 16 21:47
schestowitzIt isJun 16 21:47
schestowitzIt's flexibl;e. http://tweetmeme.com/story/855908122/youtube-will-it-blend-ipadJun 16 21:47
TechrightsTitle: YouTube - Will It Blend? - iPad .::. Size~: 37.6 KBJun 16 21:47
DaemonFCbuying Windows Ultimate and still having to extend it is mildly shitty thoughJun 16 21:47
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAl28d6tbkoJun 16 21:47
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Will It Blend? - iPad .::. Size~: 90.9 KBJun 16 21:47
DaemonFCbut at least it isn't OS XJun 16 21:47
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 21:48
MinceRthat didn't flex, it brokeJun 16 21:48
DaemonFCexactlyJun 16 21:48
*jono has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)Jun 16 21:48
schestowitzTechrights just climbed to 1500th in Netcraft ranksJun 16 21:49
DaemonFChmm, looks like this is the last day I can leave the A/C of for a whileJun 16 21:50
schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/06/14/appcelerator_betas_titanium_for_blackberries/Jun 16 21:50
DaemonFC:(Jun 16 21:50
TechrightsTitle: Open source webAndroidiPhoneiPad kit betas for BlackBerry • The Register .::. Size~: 32.49 KBJun 16 21:50
DaemonFCI don't keep well >85Jun 16 21:51
DaemonFCat that point it's like Christmas at Grandma's houseJun 16 21:51
DaemonFC:DJun 16 21:51
schestowitzhttp://www.broadbandgenie.co.uk/news/20100614-free-turnbyturn-satnav-app-now-available-iphonesJun 16 21:52
TechrightsTitle: Free turn-by-turn satnav app now available for iPhones - Broadband Genie .::. Size~: 20.47 KBJun 16 21:52
DaemonFCabout 10 minutes in you excuse yourself to go lay face down in the snow for a whileJun 16 21:52
schestowitzDaemonFC: snow?Jun 16 21:53
schestowitzYou grandma is in FLJun 16 21:53
DaemonFCnopeJun 16 21:53
DaemonFCshe just cranks the heat up to 90 in the WinterJun 16 21:53
DaemonFCthen wonder's why it's still so cold and her gas bill is $400Jun 16 21:53
nawi90... use Celsius Jun 16 21:53
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 21:53
DaemonFC*wondersJun 16 21:53
DaemonFCnawi, neverJun 16 21:54
schestowitzhttp://www.networkworld.com/community/node/62494 "The article looks more like Marketing pitch for the company using fear of compliance through survey."Jun 16 21:54
schestowitzExactlyJun 16 21:54
TechrightsTitle: Distributing Open Source? Survey Says… | NetworkWorld.com Community .::. Size~: 86 KBJun 16 21:54
nawithe weather has been perfect for a while here in FinlandJun 16 21:55
nawinot too cold and not too hotJun 16 21:55
DaemonFChttp://img820.imageshack.us/img820/9182/11287391.pngJun 16 21:57
TechrightsTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/png type .::. Size~: 0 KBJun 16 21:57
nawihttp://www.myconfinedspace.com/wp-content/uploads/tdomf/133278/finland-700x525.jpgJun 16 21:57
TechrightsTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBJun 16 21:57
*jono (~jono@ubuntu/member/jono) has joined #boycottnovellJun 16 21:57
MinceRDaemonFC: what is that in slightly less insane measurements?Jun 16 21:57
nawi90 seems to be around 30 in CJun 16 21:58
DaemonFClooks like the beginning of December nowJun 16 21:59
DaemonFChttp://img248.imageshack.us/img248/554/15700687.pngJun 16 21:59
TechrightsTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/png type .::. Size~: 0 KBJun 16 21:59
DaemonFCnawi, At -40, they're both the same :)Jun 16 22:00
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] HP: The Linux distributor? - http://bit.ly/8Z5tE9 "I suspect HP is going to incorporate webOS on its tablets, printers, and other devices"Jun 16 22:02
TechrightsTitle: HP: The Linux distributor? - Computerworld Blogs .::. Size~: 63.27 KBJun 16 22:02
DaemonFCso when the temperature is -40, I'll use the metric systemJun 16 22:02
DaemonFCjust for youJun 16 22:02
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 22:02
DaemonFCright before dying of exposureJun 16 22:03
DaemonFCin the Antarctic winterJun 16 22:03
schestowitzDaemonFC: your OS is uglyJun 16 22:04
schestowitzNo offence to youJun 16 22:04
nawi-40, that's easyJun 16 22:04
schestowitzIt looks like KDE4 forked for people with terrible eyesightJun 16 22:04
DaemonFCno offenSe takenJun 16 22:04
DaemonFC;)Jun 16 22:04
nawipretty crazy to use windowsJun 16 22:05
schestowitzLook at your deskto;, ryanJun 16 22:05
schestowitzIt's uselessJun 16 22:05
schestowitzIt has a rubbish can in itJun 16 22:05
schestowitzThat's itJun 16 22:05
DaemonFCpretty crazy that most Linux distros handle spell checking so poorlyJun 16 22:05
schestowitzNo folderview plasmoidsJun 16 22:05
MinceRsearch for "Finnish weather explained" on  http://www.expat-finland.com/living_in_finland/finnish_jokes.htmlJun 16 22:05
TechrightsTitle: Finnish Jokes .::. Size~: 49.06 KBJun 16 22:05
DaemonFChalf the time it's en-US and the other half it's en-GB with UbuntuJun 16 22:05
DaemonFCand you have to go fucking around with it program to programJun 16 22:06
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Mendeley, the-Last.fm-of-research, rolls out premium packages to steady customer nerves - http://bit.ly/bYp1yP interesting service #researchJun 16 22:06
TechrightsTitle:   Mendeley, the-Last.fm-of-research, rolls out premium packages to steady customer nerves  .::. Size~: 34.14 KBJun 16 22:06
schestowitzMinceR: lol, great pageJun 16 22:06
DaemonFCwhat's the most aggravating is that Firefox is usually stuck on en-GB somehow and I end up ignoring the spell checker anyway because it's striking things out that I got rightJun 16 22:07
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 22:07
schestowitzDaemonFC: what's the 'alien' icon?Jun 16 22:08
DaemonFCthen you have to go around removing things like "ubufox" to make it respect your global spell check preferencesJun 16 22:08
schestowitzI put that in scare quotes cause it's just some hollywood notion of 'alien'Jun 16 22:08
DaemonFCjono, What the hell is this crap?Jun 16 22:08
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 22:08
DaemonFChttp://www.xmfan.com/files/cookie-monster-diet_818.jpgJun 16 22:08
TechrightsTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBJun 16 22:08
schestowitzWe humans should be ashamed of ourselves for making an image of "alien" without ever seeing any such thing, let alone good evidence of life outside EarthJun 16 22:08
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schestowitzJoe: "i saw an alien"Jun 16 22:09
DaemonFCit 's a demonJun 16 22:09
DaemonFCpeople have seen those as wellJun 16 22:09
sebsebseboh that South African game was greatJun 16 22:09
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 22:09
schestowitzJane:"what did it look like?"Jun 16 22:09
sebsebsebgoalie being sent offJun 16 22:09
sebsebseband suchJun 16 22:09
schestowitzJohn: "small grey man with 2 big eyes"Jun 16 22:09
DaemonFCIt was horrible, the aliens and demons took turns gang banging me!Jun 16 22:09
schestowitzThey allwys look so vulnerable tooJun 16 22:09
sebsebsebwhen Spain were playing earlier,  some guy who was watching did his middle finger as  well :DJun 16 22:09
schestowitzThey don't speakJun 16 22:09
DaemonFCand about that time, you switch the channel to get it off the Discovery ChannelJun 16 22:09
schestowitzWe primitive humans are loudJun 16 22:09
schestowitzAnd they need to get us cuffed for anal probesJun 16 22:10
schestowitzAllegedlyJun 16 22:10
*sebsebseb wonders if anyone cares hereJun 16 22:10
schestowitzCuddly alientJun 16 22:10
schestowitz*nsJun 16 22:10
DaemonFCthen you wind up on the Science Channel doing a documentary on the life and times of JesusJun 16 22:10
DaemonFCthen you give up and block both channelsJun 16 22:11
schestowitzPeople also claim they know what Jesus looked likeJun 16 22:11
nawi"Science"Jun 16 22:11
schestowitzI have this friend at the gym, and he converted to ChristianityJun 16 22:11
DaemonFCforensic scienceJun 16 22:11
nawiI don't think Jesus existed in any real senseJun 16 22:11
schestowitzThen he explained whyJun 16 22:11
DaemonFCon the shroud of turinJun 16 22:11
schestowitzhe said, when he closed his eyes he saw "jesus"Jun 16 22:11
DaemonFCit's inconclusiveJun 16 22:11
DaemonFCthat way we piss nobody off and still have an hour of programmingJun 16 22:11
schestowitzAnd I went line, "have you ever seen him?"Jun 16 22:11
DaemonFCwhere everyone watched the commercialsJun 16 22:11
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 22:12
schestowitzANd also, "you don't see anything with your eyes shut"Jun 16 22:12
schestowitzIOW, hallucinationsJun 16 22:12
schestowitzI come to the concluision that many theists are just, well... mentally defiecientJun 16 22:12
schestowitz*ficientJun 16 22:12
DaemonFCThe truth is elusive to those who do not seek it with both eyes. "The Book of Origin"Jun 16 22:12
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 22:12
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYxIlzqlXAcJun 16 22:13
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Book Of Origin .::. Size~: 103.36 KBJun 16 22:13
schestowitzDaemonFC: :-)Jun 16 22:14
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] How To Phish, Protect Your Email, and Defeat Copy-And-Paste with CSS - http://bit.ly/bofP2g fascinating, frightening #phishing #cssJun 16 22:14
TechrightsTitle: How To Phish, Protect Your Email, and Defeat Copy-And-Paste with CSS «  Aza on Design .::. Size~: 66.25 KBJun 16 22:14
schestowitzWhen people's Eureka moment is one where they shut their eyes and "see" something, you lose hopeJun 16 22:14
MinceRDaemonFC: dead are the Ori.Jun 16 22:14
DaemonFCHallowed is our new master, Adria!Jun 16 22:14
DaemonFCmeet the new bossJun 16 22:15
DaemonFCsame as the old bossJun 16 22:15
schestowitz/me tired of hypePhone stuff entering "open source" feeds, latest example being http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/Skobbler-brings-open-source-maps-to-UK-iPhones-1022113.htmlJun 16 22:15
TechrightsTitle: Skobbler brings open source maps to UK iPhones - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 35.88 KBJun 16 22:15
DaemonFCOnly a Prior can fly an Ori ship. How convenient they turned Daniel into a Prior.Jun 16 22:16
schestowitzDaemonFC: Yahweh will send you downstairs, unless you repent yo' sinsJun 16 22:16
DaemonFCBut Merlin is keeping the programming from taking him overJun 16 22:17
DaemonFC:DJun 16 22:17
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TuFwplxasXw&feature=relatedJun 16 22:19
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- First Ori Battle .::. Size~: 86.56 KBJun 16 22:19
DaemonFCnyahahahaaaaa!!!Jun 16 22:19
DaemonFCdefinitely the most expensive SG-1 scene everJun 16 22:19
*schestowitz never seen it, bookmarks for laterJun 16 22:20
MinceRAdria can't boss anyone around anymore :>Jun 16 22:20
schestowitznawi: http://www.24worldnews.com/nokia-wont-use-android/20502/ http://www.sellmymobile.com/news/nokia-announces-x5-music-device-1079/Jun 16 22:20
TechrightsTitle: Nokia Wont Use Android .::. Size~: 26.53 KBJun 16 22:20
TechrightsTitle:   Nokia Announces X5 Music Device .::. Size~: 18.2 KBJun 16 22:20
DaemonFCMinceR, I did make the SSID of my router "Korolev"Jun 16 22:21
DaemonFC:DJun 16 22:21
nawischestowitz, ?Jun 16 22:21
MinceR:)Jun 16 22:21
schestowitznawi: just inJun 16 22:21
schestowitzNokia confusedJun 16 22:21
nawiI think Meego is better than AndroidJun 16 22:21
MinceRit isJun 16 22:21
MinceRMeeGo is GNU/Linux, Android isn'tJun 16 22:21
MinceRstrange how Nokia doesn't mention Maemo/MeeGo at all in the declaration of not using AndroidJun 16 22:22
nawias far as I know, Androidu uses Linux and some gnu softwareJun 16 22:22
nawi-uJun 16 22:22
DaemonFCschestowitz, Seek wickedness not amongst your neighbors, lest it find purchase in your own house. :)Jun 16 22:23
nawiMinceR, err, they doJun 16 22:23
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] What Do I Want from the Scientific Publisher of the Future? - http://bit.ly/cpxnbh to be the "guardian of workflows"; important postJun 16 22:23
TechrightsTitle: PLoS Computational Biology: What Do I Want from the Publisher of the Future? .::. Size~: 68.59 KBJun 16 22:23
MinceRoh, missed thatJun 16 22:25
MinceRit's not in the quote thoughJun 16 22:25
DaemonFChttp://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/us_and_canada/10335114.stmJun 16 22:26
TechrightsTitle: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 89.75 KBJun 16 22:26
DaemonFC"Oil giant BP is to put $20bn (£13.5bn) in a compensation fund for victims of the Gulf oil spill and will not pay shareholders a dividend this year."Jun 16 22:27
*DaemonFC takes a peak at what that is doing to their stockJun 16 22:27
DaemonFCit's gone up a little, hmmmJun 16 22:27
DaemonFCthere's no accounting for taste I guessJun 16 22:27
DaemonFCmaybe the investors figure this will appease the GodsJun 16 22:28
DaemonFC(politicians"Jun 16 22:28
DaemonFC*)Jun 16 22:28
DaemonFClook, they paid for roughly 1/5th of the disaster they causedJun 16 22:28
DaemonFCwe're only asking American tax payers for the restJun 16 22:28
DaemonFCthat's totally reasonable :)Jun 16 22:29
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DaemonFCWhen you fuck up,the best thing you can do is own it.Jun 16 22:30
DaemonFCIt only gets worse as the coverups proced.Jun 16 22:31
DaemonFC:PJun 16 22:31
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQNCz9KzT08Jun 16 22:31
TechrightsTitle: YouTube- Full radio interview with Carl Sagan & Ann Druyan, part 3 of 10 .::. Size~: 80.1 KBJun 16 22:31
schestowitzInterestingJun 16 22:32
DaemonFCschestowitz, I guess Indiana can be glad we got the BP investment in wind turbine construction before the oil rig disasterJun 16 22:32
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 22:32
DaemonFCno take-backs :DJun 16 22:32
DaemonFCkwitcher mittengrabben!Jun 16 22:33
schestowitz[22:21] <nawi> I think Meego is better than AndroidJun 16 22:33
schestowitzis isJun 16 22:33
schestowitz*it isJun 16 22:33
*yuhong (~chatzilla@pool-96-253-143-208.sttlwa.dsl-w.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovellJun 16 22:33
yuhongSlightly OT, but on the matter of Apple security:Jun 16 22:34
yuhonghttp://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1113711&p=20520760Jun 16 22:34
TechrightsTitle: Would Copland have been more secure than Mac OS X? - Ars Technica OpenForum .::. Size~: 21.18 KBJun 16 22:34
DaemonFCthe cosntruction is complete, about the only thing BP can do is sell them to someone else to raise their "Oh shit!" fund for the oil leakJun 16 22:34
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 22:34
DaemonFC"But the wind doesn't always blow!!! nyaaaaah!!!!"Jun 16 22:35
DaemonFCCorrect me if I'm wrong, but once you reach altitude, yeah it does. :)Jun 16 22:36
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] On train home.....having to change at st albans.Jun 16 22:36
DaemonFCor build them out at sea where there's no wind brakesJun 16 22:36
DaemonFC(buildings and odd terrain)Jun 16 22:36
DaemonFCnobody would be investing millions of dollars into putting up something that generates power whenever it feels like itJun 16 22:37
DaemonFCthey act like the wind has an on/off switchJun 16 22:37
MinceRyuhong: vaporware is _always_ more secure than actual products :>Jun 16 22:46
MinceRnonexistence is the best defense against attacks -- even better than being disconnected from everything, including electricityJun 16 22:46
yuhongNot what I am talking about.Jun 16 22:47
yuhongI am talking about if it did exist.Jun 16 22:47
MinceRcopland is vaporware.Jun 16 22:47
yuhongYes.Jun 16 22:47
yuhongBut I am talking about it as if it did exist.Jun 16 22:47
MinceRif it did exist it would be more vulnerable than osxJun 16 22:47
yuhongThat is what I am arguing.Jun 16 22:48
yuhongThat is what I am arguing in this thread.Jun 16 22:48
MinceRbecause (as mac os <= 9 proves) crApple suck at developing OSesJun 16 22:48
MinceRwhen they realized that they began ripping off free software projects.Jun 16 22:48
yuhongYes, Mac OS 9 did suck.Jun 16 22:48
DaemonFCMinceR, I really have to ROFL whenever someone brags about buying a full retail copy of Windows to run on their MacJun 16 22:48
yuhongAnd Copland was vaporware.Jun 16 22:48
MinceRDaemonFC: i only feel pity.Jun 16 22:48
DaemonFCFail Cordon Bleu Jun 16 22:48
yuhongBut security was not one of it's major problems.Jun 16 22:48
MinceRyuhong: it must have been if you also take DoS into accountJun 16 22:49
MinceRcrApple fails at basic OS functions such as multitaskingJun 16 22:49
yuhongYes.Jun 16 22:49
MinceRalso look at their track record at patching osxJun 16 22:49
MinceRthat practice would have been the same.Jun 16 22:49
yuhongBut I am talking about remote DoS, not local DoS.Jun 16 22:49
DaemonFCthe only way you'll see me running Windows on a Mac is if Apple gives me a free Mac and I use my  MSDN account to generate a Windows license for itJun 16 22:49
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 22:49
MinceRyuhong: i doubt that the distinction mattersJun 16 22:50
DaemonFCand OS X will be formatted off the drive completelyJun 16 22:50
yuhongAnd Copland would have fixed that.Jun 16 22:50
MinceRhow?Jun 16 22:50
yuhongBy introducing preemptive multitasking.Jun 16 22:50
MinceRalso, the linked post is patently clueless (as is the norm for /. today)Jun 16 22:50
yuhongPatching would be indeed still be the same.Jun 16 22:50
MinceRthey would have most likely failed at implementing it properlyJun 16 22:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Analysis: What Went Wrong With Linden Lab? - http://bit.ly/95GZbl indeed #sl #virtualworldsJun 16 22:51
TechrightsTitle: New World Notes: Analysis: What Went Wrong With Linden Lab? .::. Size~: 58.07 KBJun 16 22:51
MinceRremember that crApple lagged massively with preemptive multitaskingJun 16 22:51
yuhongThat would not be a security problem.Jun 16 22:51
MinceRit's one of the many things they couldn't figure outJun 16 22:51
yuhongFor one thing, classic Mac OS used Pascal strings.Jun 16 22:52
MinceRthe Sinclair QL did preemptive multitasking when crApple hadn't even heard of the idea.Jun 16 22:52
MinceRof multitasking, that is.Jun 16 22:52
yuhongI know.Jun 16 22:52
yuhongNot to mention Amiga.Jun 16 22:52
yuhongBut for a dedicated web server, it would not have been much of a problem.Jun 16 22:53
DaemonFCby introducing preemptive multitasking, the Mac crashed moreJun 16 22:53
MinceRi think the only way copland could have been secure is by crashing right at bootJun 16 22:53
DaemonFCditto for Windows 9xJun 16 22:53
yuhongMinceR: Why?Jun 16 22:53
MinceRDaemonFC: without preemptive multitasking, any buggy app could crash your winblows trivially.Jun 16 22:53
MinceRyuhong: because they can't code their way out of a wet paper bag.Jun 16 22:54
cubezzzno MMU on early AmigasJun 16 22:54
yuhongYes, I know that Copland failed.Jun 16 22:54
MinceRyuhong: no list of buzzwords will make a system secure with clueless developers.Jun 16 22:54
DaemonFCyes MinceR I knowJun 16 22:54
MinceRsecurity is not a feature, it's a process. :>Jun 16 22:54
DaemonFCbecause any program could get a lock on the CPU's undivided attention and then quit respondingJun 16 22:54
DaemonFCfun timesJun 16 22:54
cubezzzMinceR, I had a solution for security probs: make your own CPU :)Jun 16 22:55
DaemonFC:DJun 16 22:55
MinceRyuhong: so if crApple shows me a list of buzzwords, saying "we'll implement all of this and the system will be zomg-secure!" i'll say "prove it. show me you can actually implement all that properly."Jun 16 22:55
MinceRcubezzz: that's an important part of a full solution.Jun 16 22:55
yuhongYes, I know that Copland failed, and I know that Apple had to buy NeXT.Jun 16 22:55
MinceRcubezzz: at least a trustable open CPU.Jun 16 22:55
cubezzzFPGAsJun 16 22:56
yuhongAnd indeed no list of buzzwords would have changed that.Jun 16 22:56
cubezzzno reason why you can't do itJun 16 22:56
DaemonFCMinceR, No cause for alarm, the water is quite safe as far as the 92 substances the EPA actually monitorsJun 16 22:56
DaemonFCyayJun 16 22:56
MinceR:>Jun 16 22:56
DaemonFC(now forget the other billion and go back to drinking it)Jun 16 22:56
cubezzz20 years ago they were always talking about acid rainJun 16 22:57
yuhongMinceR: Yes, I know that Copland failed, and I know that Apple had to buy NeXT.Jun 16 22:57
cubezzznot sure if that's still a problemJun 16 22:57
yuhongMinceR: And indeed no list of buzzwords would have changed that.Jun 16 22:57
DaemonFCalso, they take measurements BEFORE it goes through 20 miles of pipes to get to youJun 16 22:57
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 22:57
MinceRand not too long ago they were talking about chocolate rain!Jun 16 22:57
DaemonFCthat's always good to knowJun 16 22:57
cubezzzblah :)Jun 16 22:57
yuhongApple did open source even before buying NeXT, BTW.Jun 16 22:57
yuhongHave you heard of mkLinux?Jun 16 22:57
MinceRi haveJun 16 22:57
cubezzzI just realized I encountered basic linux years agoJun 16 22:58
cubezzzon one of those "ultimate boot cds"Jun 16 22:58
MinceRyuhong: i also know which sense of "do" it is ;)Jun 16 22:58
DaemonFCI also happen to know that Apple doesn't use Linux in any capacityJun 16 22:58
cubezzzyou know I tried Redhat 6 last night... not viable thoughJun 16 22:58
DaemonFCand I also happen to know they don't use PowerPCJun 16 22:58
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 22:58
cubezzzdidn't understand LCD displays or USB miceJun 16 22:59
yuhongAnd indeed NeXT was based on BSD and Mach, both of which are open source.Jun 16 22:59
DaemonFCof all the crack induced ideas from Crapple from 1990-2005, I'm not surprised porting Linux to Mach to PPC was one of themJun 16 22:59
DaemonFC:PJun 16 22:59
MinceRyuhong: and all the stuff that actually works and is useful in next and osx is the part they took from free software projectsJun 16 22:59
MinceRyuhong: all the stuff crApple added to that sucks heavilyJun 16 22:59
cubezzzAROS is just not ready either unfortunatelyJun 16 23:00
MinceRespecially the fisher price GUIJun 16 23:00
yuhongMinceR: Why?Jun 16 23:00
DaemonFCApple will never send out anything they don't totally controlJun 16 23:00
cubezzzjust couldn't get the network stuff workingJun 16 23:00
MinceRyuhong: because they're marketroids, not engineersJun 16 23:00
MinceRyuhong: they "design" bling, not useful productsJun 16 23:00
DaemonFCif they don't have veto power over what you can do on your device, they won't sell it to youJun 16 23:00
yuhongMinceR: WHy?Jun 16 23:00
MinceRyuhong: their entire set of goals is bogusJun 16 23:00
cubezzzmeh, avoid microsoft is my adviceJun 16 23:00
yuhongMinceR: Why does it suck?Jun 16 23:00
cubezzzseriously they are no goodJun 16 23:00
MinceRyuhong: because all they ever added to that free software was always heavily limited by designJun 16 23:01
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Just helped a drunk male home....... I hope that man wakes up tomorrow and remembers the person who looked after him.Jun 16 23:01
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Support a firm, simple declaration against ACTA - http://bit.ly/bToG1T FSF declaration - you, too, can sign #fsf #actaJun 16 23:01
TechrightsTitle: Support a firm, simple declaration against ACTA &mdash; Free Software Foundation &mdash; free as in freedom .::. Size~: 33.67 KBJun 16 23:01
yuhongWhy do you think "they're marketroids, not engineers"?Jun 16 23:01
MinceRthey never had any respect for the userJun 16 23:01
MinceRbecause all the "design" reasons you can see about crApple (mostly from jobs, of course) are idiotic marketing reasonsJun 16 23:01
MinceR"i don't like fan noise", "i think this feature would confuse users"Jun 16 23:01
MinceRoh, and the reasons of thinking that the users have less intelligence than most unicellular organismsJun 16 23:02
MinceR"they can't tell two mouse buttons apart!"Jun 16 23:02
MinceRdo people like that even _need_ electronic devices?Jun 16 23:02
yuhongWhy do you think that sucks?Jun 16 23:02
yuhongWhy do you think that sucks by themselves?Jun 16 23:02
yuhongI know it causes problems sometimes.Jun 16 23:02
MinceRbecause you can't design a computer if you ignore what a computer is for and what mental capabilities it can augment from the startJun 16 23:03
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Peace of advice, if you are going to drink yourself silly, stay away from trainlines, the two do not mix.Jun 16 23:03
cubezzzactually passive cooling was fine up to p2 400 mhzJun 16 23:03
MinceRalso, prioritizing useless bling over actual functionality is just plain stupidJun 16 23:03
cubezzzand there's a good reason for it, less mechancial partsJun 16 23:03
MinceRcubezzz: the crApple III melted just fine.Jun 16 23:03
yuhongYes, I know.Jun 16 23:04
cubezzzI just build a coreboot system that uses passive coolingJun 16 23:04
MinceRcubezzz: that only shows that you have more clue about building computers than jobs ever didJun 16 23:04
yuhongcubezzz: Not to mention Apple at that time did not x86Jun 16 23:04
MinceR(but that isn't saying much)Jun 16 23:04
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] When I finally get home going to relax with a little irc and maybe publish a few things I have pendingJun 16 23:05
cubezzzespecially since now we have huge fans on power suppliesJun 16 23:05
MinceRnot on all of themJun 16 23:05
MinceRthe power supply of my ThinkPad W700 might be an enormous brick, but it has no fans :)Jun 16 23:05
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Oh and also check out pioneer oneJun 16 23:06
cubezzzI'm really impressed with some older computer designsJun 16 23:06
cubezzzI used to think 486, bah, useles right?Jun 16 23:06
cubezzzbut now I've changed my mindJun 16 23:06
MinceRyuhong: another interesting aspect of crApple's cluelessness is the crApple HIG (Human Interface Guidelines)Jun 16 23:06
cubezzz486 + freedos = vey usefulJun 16 23:07
MinceRgems like the idiotic dialog button order which GNOME also copiedJun 16 23:07
yuhongWhy is it bad?Jun 16 23:07
yuhongMinceR: Why is it bad?Jun 16 23:07
MinceRignoring facts like 1) the user tends to confirm actions he initiates and 2) english is written left-to-rightJun 16 23:07
cubezzzand you know how I still use fc1? fc1 is better than newer fedora in some ways: uses less memoryJun 16 23:07
MinceRyuhong: the crApple button order forces you to read through the maximal amount of buttons in typical cases, wasting your time and increasing the chance of errorJun 16 23:08
cubezzzand old mozilla runs faster on many web pagesJun 16 23:08
DaemonFCMinceR, Does the Mac make you write English right-to-left?Jun 16 23:08
MinceRDaemonFC: nopeJun 16 23:08
DaemonFC:DJun 16 23:08
MinceRDaemonFC: but left-to-right makes scanning buttons left-to-right naturalJun 16 23:08
MinceRyet crApple puts the rarely used buttons on the leftJun 16 23:09
MinceR(usually. there is some inconsistency to it.)Jun 16 23:09
cubezzzthere's no perfect systemJun 16 23:09
cubezzzexcept for fc1 Jun 16 23:09
MinceRit's the pessimal mix of reverse ordering and random orderingJun 16 23:09
cubezzzj/kJun 16 23:09
yuhongYes, I know about the button ordering.Jun 16 23:09
MinceRthen there's the menu bar position, which is based on a misinterpretation of Fitts' LawJun 16 23:10
MinceR(and also screws with MouseFocus and SloppyFocus)Jun 16 23:10
yuhongI know, dates all the back to when the Mac was a single-app system.Jun 16 23:10
DaemonFCMinceR, I notice lots of Windows programs doing the same thingJun 16 23:10
DaemonFCyou mean to hit OK and you hit CancelJun 16 23:10
DaemonFCbut the next dialog is the other way aroundJun 16 23:10
MinceRDaemonFC: winblows apps like to be inconsistent in every way ever since m$ introduced the policy of putting a custom widget set in every release of m$ office everJun 16 23:11
yuhongI know.Jun 16 23:11
MinceR(instead of using the one they built into the current winblows release)Jun 16 23:11
DaemonFCMinceR, rightJun 16 23:11
DaemonFCI noticed thatJun 16 23:11
yuhongAnd in OS X the window buttons is on the left and in reverse order too.Jun 16 23:12
DaemonFCif you ran Office XP on Windows 7, you get an XP-ish widget set anywayJun 16 23:12
yuhongWhich Ubuntu 10.04 copied.Jun 16 23:12
DaemonFCI have a feeling it's to make you feel uncomfortableJun 16 23:12
cubezzzmost OSes are oink oink memory pigsJun 16 23:12
DaemonFCunless you have the latest Windows and OfficeJun 16 23:12
yuhongI would not go that far though.Jun 16 23:12
cubezzzthe perfect OS could adjust itself to any memory size (within reason)Jun 16 23:12
yuhonghttp://toastytech.com/guis/nt351word.gifJun 16 23:13
TechrightsTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/gif type .::. Size~: 0 KBJun 16 23:13
DaemonFCand Office 2010 won't run on XP x64 Edition at allJun 16 23:13
DaemonFChow long until someone patches that? :)Jun 16 23:13
cubezzzsomething that could act like basic linux or Fedora depending on the systemJun 16 23:13
MinceRyuhong: what's that thin menu item that's selected in the submenu?Jun 16 23:13
*MinceR doubts it's a tearoff menu :)Jun 16 23:13
MinceR(m$ has yet to "invent" that)Jun 16 23:14
yuhongDaemonFC: I always prefer Vista/7 to XP x64 partly to the latter's lack of support.Jun 16 23:14
yuhongMinceR: Yes, it is a tearoff into a toolbar.Jun 16 23:14
DaemonFCXP is preventing lots of Windows apps from improving, because if they do, then half of Windows users couldn't buy themJun 16 23:14
yuhongYes, I know.Jun 16 23:14
DaemonFCmost software at least tells you to grab XP SP3 nowJun 16 23:14
cubezzzjust switch to ReactOS :)Jun 16 23:14
MinceRfunny, i never noticed thatJun 16 23:14
sebsebsebcubezzz: ReactOS isn't  ready yetJun 16 23:15
DaemonFCthe Paint.Net guy is making XP SP3 the mandatory minimum nowJun 16 23:15
cubezzzno activiation at leastJun 16 23:15
MinceRDaemonFC: porting to GNU/Linux would be an instant improvementJun 16 23:15
nawireactOS seems stupidJun 16 23:15
MinceRit isJun 16 23:15
MinceRit's a reimplementation of a broken design :>Jun 16 23:15
cubezzzyeah I was kind of kidding thereJun 16 23:15
yuhongMinceR: And I say that as one who once used Office 97 and even now use 2000.Jun 16 23:15
yuhongNot on this computer, but on other computers.Jun 16 23:15
DaemonFCI'm unaware of any new features SP3 bringsJun 16 23:15
DaemonFChe's probably just sick of testing it out on a different set of XP bugsJun 16 23:15
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 23:15
yuhongDaemonFC: Indeed, it is not intended to bring much new features, unlike SP2.Jun 16 23:16
yuhongMinceR: NT is a broken design? I already rebut this many times.Jun 16 23:16
DaemonFCMinceR, I counted it up sometime last year, if you count every single bug fixed on XP in total, between SPs and hotfixesJun 16 23:16
DaemonFCand it was nearing 4,000 back thenJun 16 23:17
DaemonFCand this is just the ones they fixed over the 8 year spanJun 16 23:17
DaemonFCthere's lots more they'll never fixJun 16 23:18
cubezzzReactOS might be in the same boat as AROSJun 16 23:18
MinceRyuhong: yes it isJun 16 23:18
MinceRyuhong: they started off with a relatively good design (VMS) and corrupted it in every way imaginable.Jun 16 23:18
DaemonFCso it's obvious that MS has no trouble with shipping an OS with about 5,000 security issues, memory leaks, crashers, graphical glitch situations, etc.Jun 16 23:19
MinceRyuhong: also note that "i would not go that far" is not a "rebuttal" and never was.Jun 16 23:19
DaemonFCand 5,000 is just a conservative guessJun 16 23:19
yuhongMinceR: Corrupted the DESIGN?Jun 16 23:20
MinceRyuhong: yesJun 16 23:20
yuhongMinceR: In what ways?Jun 16 23:20
DaemonFCpeople talk about how "good and stable" XP wasJun 16 23:20
MinceRyuhong: turning a microkernel into that mess would be a design issueJun 16 23:20
DaemonFCthey obviously never had the RTM releaseJun 16 23:20
DaemonFCwith 9years of bug patches behind it, it's tolerableJun 16 23:20
MinceRyuhong: same thing about things related to the posix subsystemJun 16 23:20
yuhongDaemonFC: and they bitch about how buggy Vista RTM was.Jun 16 23:21
MinceRwell, it was buggyJun 16 23:21
DaemonFCMinceR, I'll tell you one stupid Windows 7 bug I managed to trip constantlyJun 16 23:21
MinceReverything they've ever released was buggy enough to bitch about.Jun 16 23:21
DaemonFCit would forget what icon to use for shortcutsJun 16 23:21
DaemonFCand leave you with a desktop and start menu full of generic iconsJun 16 23:21
MinceR:)Jun 16 23:21
yuhongMinceR: But how is the design broken?Jun 16 23:21
MinceRyuhong: look it up. :)Jun 16 23:22
*Will (4c724679@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.114.70.121) has joined #boycottnovellJun 16 23:22
Willhttp://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/security/358714/so-dell-is-ubuntu-safer-than-windows-or-notJun 16 23:22
TechrightsTitle: So Dell, is Ubuntu safer than Windows or not? | Security | News | PC Pro .::. Size~: 41.14 KBJun 16 23:22
MinceRwhile you're at it, look at the registry, too.Jun 16 23:22
yuhongMinceR: Yes, I know about the registry,Jun 16 23:22
yuhongMinceR: Yes, I know about the registry and it's issues.Jun 16 23:22
DaemonFCMinceR, so after freezing the RTM in July....Jun 16 23:22
DaemonFCI got to put up with that until the hotfix, in the middle of JanuaryJun 16 23:23
MinceRyuhong: i suspect you already know a lot about how broken winnt is, but you don't realize it yet. :>Jun 16 23:23
cubezzzwithout even looking, I would say yesJun 16 23:23
*Will has quit (Client Quit)Jun 16 23:23
yuhongMinceR: None I can say that really relate to the design.Jun 16 23:23
MinceRDaemonFC: i had winxp decide that only two columns of icons fit on the QuickLaunch Bar when there was clearly room for threeJun 16 23:23
cubezzzbut I'm off of Dell anywayJun 16 23:23
MinceRthen accidentally dropping a folder on it made it realize the error. :>Jun 16 23:23
yuhongAnd the Registry cannot be eliminated without breaking Win32, only reimplemented.Jun 16 23:24
yuhongEven Wine has to implement it.Jun 16 23:24
MinceRyuhong: if by "design" you mean a document they've burnt before writing the first line of code, i guess. :>Jun 16 23:24
yuhongMinceR: None I can think of that really relate to the design.Jun 16 23:24
yuhongMinceR: What do you mean?Jun 16 23:24
MinceRwell, if you argue that winblows wasn't really designed, i'd agree with you. :>Jun 16 23:24
yuhongMinceR: But it was.Jun 16 23:25
yuhongMinceR: But it was designed.Jun 16 23:25
DaemonFCMinceR, YOu could drag the Windows XP taskbar out to roughly half your screenJun 16 23:25
yuhongMinceR: MS has NT design documents.Jun 16 23:25
DaemonFCand there was still only two colums of quicklaunchJun 16 23:25
DaemonFC:)Jun 16 23:25
MinceRDaemonFC: now it has 3.Jun 16 23:25
MinceRDaemonFC: it also realized it could display more info on the clock.Jun 16 23:25
yuhongMinceR: MS has NT design documents internally.Jun 16 23:25
yuhonghttp://www.virtualdub.org/blog/pivot/entry.php?id=24Jun 16 23:26
TechrightsTitle: I hate Windows - virtualdub.org .::. Size~: 27.03 KBJun 16 23:26
cubezzzDell is seriously messed up:Jun 16 23:26
MinceRyuhong: the documents they've ignored or the ones that actually reflect their system?Jun 16 23:26
cubezzz""...it is not Dell’s intention to recommend one OS over another".Jun 16 23:26
cubezzzOh yea? The Dell website is always stating "Dell recommends Windows 7".Jun 16 23:26
cubezzzpfffffftJun 16 23:26
MinceRdell is hell.Jun 16 23:26
yuhongThey do reflect the system.Jun 16 23:26
MinceRyuhong: then they must be just as braindead as the system is.Jun 16 23:26
yuhongThey do reflect the core system design.Jun 16 23:26
yuhongWhy is it braindead?Jun 16 23:26
yuhongProof, please?Jun 16 23:26
MinceRdown to the putting part of the GUI into the kernel "because it will be fast", even though it's still slow.Jun 16 23:27
MinceRbut at least this way it crashes the system easily.Jun 16 23:27
yuhongStill slow?Jun 16 23:27
yuhongIn what ways?Jun 16 23:27
MinceRand the entire registry by itself is a design flaw.Jun 16 23:27
cubezzzwindows is an enormous memory pig, worse than any other OSJun 16 23:27
MinceRyuhong: in what ways do you think a GUI can be slow?Jun 16 23:27
yuhongIn what ways it actually is slow?Jun 16 23:28
MinceRin the way that it takes longer to do its jobJun 16 23:28
cubezzzit wastes a lot of cpu on pointless eye candyJun 16 23:28
yuhongIt may not be related to the core Win32 subsystem at all.Jun 16 23:28
cubezzzKDE 4 has a similar problemJun 16 23:28
MinceRi wonder what they did to the system/user resource(?) memory issue that crippled win3.1 so muchJun 16 23:28
yuhongcubezzz: I know about the DWM.Jun 16 23:28
DaemonFCthink it's time to clean the coffee makerJun 16 23:29
yuhongMinceR: They redesigned it in NT.Jun 16 23:29
DaemonFCI went to pour 8 cups of water in and had about 12 cups try to spill out of the reservoirJun 16 23:29
MinceRyuhong: so you're basically claiming that the kernel is not the core of winblows after all?Jun 16 23:29
DaemonFCcalcium deposits more than likelyJun 16 23:29
yuhongMinceR: Nope.Jun 16 23:29
DaemonFCkeeps all the water from getting through the systemJun 16 23:29
MinceRyuhong: i've made my comparisons after NT.Jun 16 23:29
DaemonFCI was wondering why I've been a cup short latelyJun 16 23:29
yuhongMinceR: Not to mention even 9x have 32-bit heaps.Jun 16 23:29
MinceRbetween a supposedly mature NT-based system (dunno which) and my first GNU/Linux install (Red Hat 7)Jun 16 23:30
MinceRthe latter looked better, and its GUI running entirely in userspace was noticeably faster and more responsive.Jun 16 23:30
MinceRthis proves that putting the GUI into the winblows kernel did not bring the supposed advantageJun 16 23:30
MinceRsJun 16 23:30
MinceRthe disadvantages are, of course, apparent.Jun 16 23:30
MinceRand this is indeed a design issue.Jun 16 23:31
yuhongMinceR: And desktop heap sizes are easy to increase.Jun 16 23:31
yuhongMinceR: And that doesn't say much about why it happened.Jun 16 23:31
MinceRprobably most people are aware of how much memory winblows wastes compared to other OS-esJun 16 23:31
MinceRand the constand disk thrashing resulting from thisJun 16 23:32
MinceRs/and/ant/Jun 16 23:32
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] ♺ @Kletskous: Support a firm, simple declaration against ACTA - http://bit.ly/bToG1T FSF declaration - you, too, can sign #fsf #actaJun 16 23:32
TechrightsTitle: Support a firm, simple declaration against ACTA &mdash; Free Software Foundation &mdash; free as in freedom .::. Size~: 33.67 KBJun 16 23:32
yuhongIt may be related to something else, and that doesn't mean putting Win32 subsystem into the kernel did not have an davantage.Jun 16 23:32
MinceRyuhong: go ask someone who "develops" winblows. most likely nobody has any clue why winblows does things the way it does.Jun 16 23:32
DaemonFCMinceR, Wanna take a shot at what's in that CleanCaf powder?Jun 16 23:32
cubezzzLinux can run good on a 486Jun 16 23:32
cubezzzwith 16 megs of ramJun 16 23:32
DaemonFCsee if I can come up with a homemade alternative?Jun 16 23:32
MinceRyuhong: maybe it has some vague theoretical advantage that was never realized.Jun 16 23:32
MinceRDaemonFC: i have no idea what that is.Jun 16 23:33
yuhongBTW, even NT 3.x BSoDd when CSRSS crashed.Jun 16 23:33
DaemonFCMinceR, Coffee maker cleaning solutionJun 16 23:33
DaemonFCmix it with 4 cups warm water and run it through the brew cycleJun 16 23:33
DaemonFCit turns blue/greenJun 16 23:33
DaemonFCand foams a littleJun 16 23:33
MinceRyuhong: it must be fun having the system crash because random things named after 5 random consonants crash.Jun 16 23:33
yuhongMinceR: I am talking about why "Its GUI running entirely in userspace was noticeably faster and more responsive"Jun 16 23:34
MinceRit's great knowing what goes on inside, isn't it?Jun 16 23:34
DaemonFCI'm guessing what it could be made of so I might try something a bit cheaperJun 16 23:34
MinceRyuhong: that's basically about how m$ missed the entire stated goal of that design decision.Jun 16 23:34
yuhongCSRSS was where the Win32 subsystem was back in NT 3.x.Jun 16 23:34
DaemonFCit says it clears hard water deposits that gum up your coffee makerJun 16 23:34
yuhongMinceR: I am talking about why "Its GUI running entirely in userspace was noticeably faster and more responsive".Jun 16 23:34
MinceRplease repeat that quote some more times.Jun 16 23:34
*DaemonFC slap yuhong with win32s, wing, and IE 5 for Windows 3.1Jun 16 23:35
yuhongMinceR: And saying that there can be more than one cause for this.Jun 16 23:35
MinceRyuhong: it doesn't really matterJun 16 23:35
DaemonFCMinceR, You want to know something totally perverse?Jun 16 23:35
DaemonFCWindows 3.1 users had support options in some use cases up until mid-2008Jun 16 23:35
DaemonFCB-)Jun 16 23:35
MinceRyuhong: if m$ says "we'll make a tradeoff that improves performance at the cost of stability", it's reasonable to expect some performance.Jun 16 23:36
MinceRyuhong: if the performance isn't there then the tradeoff was a complete waste.Jun 16 23:36
MinceRand since the tradeoff happened in the core design, it's a core design flaw.Jun 16 23:36
yuhongMinceR: Unless you can prove that the user-mode inter-process communication between X and programs was lighter-weight than communications between the Win32 subsystems and Win32 programs.Jun 16 23:37
MinceRand if you think the registry isn't a core part of winblows, try running your apps without it.Jun 16 23:37
yuhongYes, even Wine have to emulate it, and changing it would break all Win32 programs.Jun 16 23:37
MinceRyuhong: it doesn't matter whether it was lightweight or not, it was FASTER. and it was also MORE ROBUST.Jun 16 23:37
yuhongYes, I mean faster.Jun 16 23:38
MinceRyuhong: no amount of m$ apologist bullshit is going to change those FACTS.Jun 16 23:38
yuhongOf course not.Jun 16 23:38
yuhongBut what interface does X use to communicate with programs? I know that NT 3.x used lightweight LPC.Jun 16 23:38
MinceRiirc it used Unix domain sockets and some form of shared memory.Jun 16 23:39
yuhongYes, I was thinking of this.Jun 16 23:39
MinceR(of course it could also use TCP when the server is not on the same box as the clients)Jun 16 23:39
yuhongBut NT 4 and later use direct syscalls, which are faster.Jun 16 23:39
yuhongBut NT 4 and later use direct syscalls, which are even faster.Jun 16 23:39
cubezzzthere's qtopiaJun 16 23:40
MinceRsadly, i've never used NT before version 4 on any of my machines. :>Jun 16 23:40
yuhongYes, indeed Unix domain sockets were faster than LPC.Jun 16 23:40
cubezzzand other X alternativesJun 16 23:40
MinceRso it was those direct syscalls failing.Jun 16 23:40
yuhongYes, indeed Unix domain sockets were lighter-weight than LPC. Faster is actually another matter.Jun 16 23:40
MinceRit doesn't matter if you're directly twiddling bits in kernel memory from your app if your GUI drawing rountines spend thousands of superfluous cycles twiddling their thumbs. :>Jun 16 23:41
MinceRbut you will crash your kernel easier.Jun 16 23:41
DaemonFCI think I need to clean my coffee maker more oftenJun 16 23:41
MinceRs/roun/rou/Jun 16 23:41
DaemonFCI have to slap it to keep the cleaning solution coming throughJun 16 23:41
DaemonFC:PJun 16 23:41
yuhongYes, that is what I mean by mentioning that it may not be caused by this at all.Jun 16 23:41
yuhongYes, that is what I mean by mentioning that it may not be caused by "this" at all.Jun 16 23:42
MinceRand yes, i'm aware that _in theory_ a GUI can be faster if it's running in kernel mode.Jun 16 23:42
MinceRbut it's not worth it. and m$ has wasted stability while trying to reach that goal, and then they failed to reach the goal.Jun 16 23:42
MinceRand while you try to find a way to defend the indefensible mess that is the NT design, i'll have some sleep.Jun 16 23:43
MinceRgnJun 16 23:43
yuhongOne last thing, I actually asked larry osterman from ms if CSRSS could be restarted instead.Jun 16 23:44
DaemonFCActually, I may just go buy some distilled waterJun 16 23:44
DaemonFCthat coffee maker is in there sounding like it's dyingJun 16 23:44
DaemonFCshuts off after every 2 cups now and I have to hit the Brew button again :(Jun 16 23:45
DaemonFCso much for deluxe coffee makerJun 16 23:45
yuhongHe said it would require all Win32 apps to be restarted.Jun 16 23:45
DaemonFCcan't handle a month's worth of Indiana tap waterJun 16 23:45
yuhong"and while you try to find a way to defend the indefensible mess that is the NT design, i'll have some sleep." It is really off-topic.Jun 16 23:45
yuhong"and while you try to find a way to defend the indefensible mess that is the NT design, i'll have some sleep." It is really off-topic anyway.Jun 16 23:45
yuhongI was going to talk about Copland.Jun 16 23:45
DaemonFCMinceR, I can hear it in thereJun 16 23:46
DaemonFC"Rosebud!!!" "Rosebuddddddd!!!!"Jun 16 23:46
DaemonFCor maybe that's jsut the pump :PJun 16 23:46
yuhongMinceR: Note that the Win32 subsystem is only one part of NT design.Jun 16 23:48
*yuhong has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.3/20100401080539])Jun 16 23:49
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] The Sun drops World Cup sweepstake as bloggers cry foul | Media | guardian.co.uk http://tinyurl.com/3x69fxjJun 16 23:52
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] WikiLeaks to release video of deadly US Afghan attack | Media | The Guardian http://tinyurl.com/289t2x2Jun 16 23:52
MinceRit must be really a lot more productive to talk about a mess that wasn't even turned into a product, ever.Jun 16 23:52
TechrightsTitle:  The Sun drops World Cup sweepstake as bloggers cry foul | Media | guardian.co.uk  .::. Size~: 111.46 KBJun 16 23:52
TechrightsTitle:  WikiLeaks to release video of deadly US Afghan attack | Media | The Guardian  .::. Size~: 76.11 KBJun 16 23:52
MinceRhow shiny this vapor is.Jun 16 23:52
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] ♺ @dmaphy: ♺ @robmyers: RT @mattl Sign the FSF petition against ACTA -- Freedom, not compromise -- http://ur1.ca/0819e #fsf #gnu #lp #dbdJun 16 23:53
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] Damn, sorry for the group spam, even if for a good cause...Jun 16 23:53
TechrightsTitle: FSF says: Take a stand with us for freedom, against ACTA &mdash; Free Software Foundation &mdash; free as in freedom .::. Size~: 26.32 KBJun 16 23:53
DaemonFCMinceR, http://www.essentialwonders.com/servlet/the-101/Urnex-Cleancaf,-Coffee-descaler,/DetailJun 16 23:53
DaemonFCI think using distilled water from the supermarket would be cheaperJun 16 23:53
DaemonFCthis is the best deal I found on this stuffJun 16 23:54
MinceRno acetic acid, citric acid, hydrochloric acid or anything like that?Jun 16 23:55
MinceR(for descaling)Jun 16 23:56
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] @_goblin that's kind of youJun 16 23:56
DaemonFCowners manual says not to do thatJun 16 23:58
DaemonFC(vinegar)Jun 16 23:58
*sebsebseb Has bad news!Jun 16 23:58

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