Join us now at the IRC channel.
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| Quadrescence | schestowitz: you awake? | Nov 16 04:56 |
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| schestowitz | Quadrescence: I am now | Nov 16 06:45 |
| schestowitz | malacoda: http://www.bash.org/?top | Nov 16 06:45 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: QDB: Top 100 Quotes .::. Size~: 102.71 KB | Nov 16 06:46 |
| schestowitz | ^oops. MinceR: too | Nov 16 06:46 |
| MinceR | i'm aware of bash.org, is there any particular quote you want to reference? | Nov 16 06:46 |
| schestowitz | no :-( | Nov 16 06:49 |
| schestowitz | http://stanford.edu/~pgbovine/cde.html | Nov 16 06:50 |
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| oiaohm | schestowitz: cde stuff has been possible for ages. early Linux standard base scripts cover that. | Nov 16 09:14 |
| MinceR | http://punditkitchen.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/bec6aad7-d27f-4ba8-ba1c-f530f74fe416.jpg | Nov 16 09:15 |
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| schestowitz | <_doug> I told you this before but it just don't go in. This IRC channel is a futile waste of time and only attracts COLA trolls. The amount of time you devote to this IRC channel is also a waste. The web site is only marginally usefull, it does provide some usefull links. But is too dense for the average reader to make sense of. The ones who haven't been following the SCO case since forever. You would better serve the cause | Nov 16 09:44 |
| schestowitz | by writing up well tho | Nov 16 09:44 |
| schestowitz | <_doug> "That's all I have to say about that" | Nov 16 09:44 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: heh. not just bankers | Nov 16 09:45 |
| schestowitz | Wealth holders in general | Nov 16 09:45 |
| schestowitz | "banker" is a bit of a scapegoat | Nov 16 09:45 |
| MinceR | yet he joined anyway | Nov 16 09:50 |
| schestowitz | I know | Nov 16 09:53 |
| schestowitz | "http://www.informationweek.com/news/storage/reviews/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=228200850&itc=ref-true&fmid=16181" | Nov 16 09:54 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Exclusive: Microsoft Altered Windows Sales Numbers -- InformationWeek .::. Size~: 75.47 KB | Nov 16 09:54 |
| schestowitz | Thanks for that | Nov 16 09:54 |
| MinceR | np | Nov 16 09:54 |
| schestowitz | The picture made clearer now | Nov 16 09:55 |
| schestowitz | What I've been saying for years | Nov 16 09:55 |
| schestowitz | "If I don't object, no [sheep of those] will." to #TSA agent's "we all submit our dignity for own good" http://ub0.cc/PN/jn {♺ @schestowitz}" | Nov 16 09:55 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: YouTube - TSA Screening, Terminal 2, SAN, Nov. 13, 2010 - part 2 .::. Size~: 121.94 KB | Nov 16 09:55 |
| schestowitz | I have a general question | Nov 16 10:00 |
| schestowitz | Assuming Microsoft falls and burns within a few years, should we track it as much at all to document the demise? | Nov 16 10:01 |
| schestowitz | or shall we assume it's better use of time to promote freedom software? | Nov 16 10:01 |
| schestowitz | My judgment may be biased, I could use a second opinion | Nov 16 10:01 |
| MinceR | imo it would be useful to track (and assist, as much as possible) | Nov 16 10:02 |
| MinceR | also, we don't know how many years it will take | Nov 16 10:03 |
| schestowitz | Yeah, same with Novell | Nov 16 10:03 |
| schestowitz | They're on the block (for sale) since March-ish | Nov 16 10:04 |
| schestowitz | I'll do a Novell post or set of long ones this week, about Microsoft I'll post what people send me... I can't catch up with the 3000 Microsoft headlines I have unread in Thunderbird | Nov 16 10:04 |
| schestowitz | "AllView, a Romanian company from Brașov, announced an Android tablet priced EUR 200 http://is.gd/hcAMa Announce from a MS journalist..." | Nov 16 11:03 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Google Traducere .::. Size~: 1.35 KB | Nov 16 11:03 |
| oiaohm | schestowitz: by the time MS gives up ghost we will have other problems. | Nov 16 11:05 |
| oiaohm | Like media companies wanting DRM. | Nov 16 11:06 |
| MinceR | and perhaps crApple | Nov 16 11:07 |
| MinceR | and SCOracle | Nov 16 11:07 |
| oiaohm | Netflix | Nov 16 11:07 |
| schestowitz | same thing ;) | Nov 16 11:08 |
| schestowitz | Post coming... I think Oracle helps Apple | Nov 16 11:08 |
| schestowitz | On desktop anyway | Nov 16 11:08 |
| schestowitz | To fight the 'freetards' | Nov 16 11:08 |
| oiaohm | Orcale is fairly netural on desktop. | Nov 16 11:08 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: netflix has ex-MSFT staff | Nov 16 11:08 |
| oiaohm | I know. | Nov 16 11:08 |
| oiaohm | But MS sold the idea of DRM to movie companies. | Nov 16 11:09 |
| oiaohm | And netflix came out of that. | Nov 16 11:09 |
| MinceR | also, i wonder what will become of canonical after m$ dies | Nov 16 11:09 |
| MinceR | perhaps a full-time crApple vassal | Nov 16 11:09 |
| oiaohm | Even after MS is gone we will still be fighting that idea. | Nov 16 11:09 |
| oiaohm | Like netflix with andriod at moment. | Nov 16 11:09 |
| oiaohm | They want android to build in a universal drm solution. | Nov 16 11:10 |
| MinceR | also, unless MeeGo succeeds, we still won't have a mobile OS that doesn't suck | Nov 16 11:10 |
| oiaohm | MeeGo already has markets in a form of mobile. | Nov 16 11:10 |
| oiaohm | In car systems. | Nov 16 11:10 |
| MinceR | i meant mobile phone OS | Nov 16 11:11 |
| MinceR | on actual devices | Nov 16 11:11 |
| oiaohm | Some cars take sim cards that are targed for Meego. | Nov 16 11:12 |
| oiaohm | Yes the worlds most oversized mobile phone. | Nov 16 11:12 |
| schestowitz | meego-.intel-genivi (spelling) | Nov 16 11:13 |
| oiaohm | I am like you i would prefer more resonable sized devices. | Nov 16 11:13 |
| schestowitz | [11:10] <oiaohm> They want android to build in a universal drm solution. | Nov 16 11:13 |
| schestowitz | DRM soloooshen | Nov 16 11:13 |
| schestowitz | How about" DRM poison"? | Nov 16 11:13 |
| oiaohm | Only way with open source is do it in hardware. | Nov 16 11:13 |
| oiaohm | And drm done that way is a true ass hole. | Nov 16 11:14 |
| oiaohm | and I wonder if windows mobile 7 issue with storage are drm linked. | Nov 16 11:14 |
| schestowitz | Probably not | Nov 16 11:15 |
| schestowitz | Based on what I read | Nov 16 11:15 |
| schestowitz | They could, however, use proprietary staff/extension like exFAQT | Nov 16 11:15 |
| MinceR | i prefer devices that can at least fit on my camera bag with belt loop | Nov 16 11:15 |
| schestowitz | They could, however, use proprietary staff/extension like exFAT | Nov 16 11:15 |
| MinceR | (i store 2 phones in it normally) | Nov 16 11:15 |
| schestowitz | Woz too.... | Nov 16 11:16 |
| schestowitz | One to show loyalty to a cult | Nov 16 11:16 |
| MinceR | not for the same reason | Nov 16 11:16 |
| MinceR | one of the phones i carry belongs to my employer and is used to keep in touch with the client :> | Nov 16 11:16 |
| oiaohm | Some cars take a sim card for the reason of tracking the car if it nicked. MinceR | Nov 16 11:16 |
| schestowitz | Would be better to have 2 SIMs | Nov 16 11:16 |
| MinceR | ic | Nov 16 11:16 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: there's a tiny offer of 2-SIM phones though | Nov 16 11:17 |
| MinceR | i'd have to compromise a lot for that | Nov 16 11:17 |
| MinceR | then again, this too is a compromise, only a different one | Nov 16 11:17 |
| oiaohm | One of my phones have a 2-sim mod in it. | Nov 16 11:17 |
| oiaohm | Do you need both phones on at the same time. | Nov 16 11:17 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: that's what she said :-p | Nov 16 11:17 |
| oiaohm | Ie power phone off power it back up differnet sim loads. | Nov 16 11:18 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: there are times when both needs to be ready to accept calls | Nov 16 11:18 |
| MinceR | s/eds/ed/ | Nov 16 11:18 |
| oiaohm | In that case 2 phones is most likely the best solution for you. | Nov 16 11:19 |
| oiaohm | I have had a crap time with duel sim phones with two calls. | Nov 16 11:19 |
| MinceR | ic | Nov 16 11:19 |
| oiaohm | Ie hanging up on the wrong person. | Nov 16 11:19 |
| MinceR | :> | Nov 16 11:19 |
| oiaohm | 2 phones you don't do that screw up. | Nov 16 11:20 |
| schestowitz | [11:18] <MinceR> oiaohm: there are times when both needs to be ready to accept calls | Nov 16 11:24 |
| schestowitz | that's why Yaweh gave MinceR two ears | Nov 16 11:25 |
| schestowitz | [11:19] <oiaohm> Ie hanging up on the wrong person. | Nov 16 11:25 |
| schestowitz | Easy when you stop using phones | Nov 16 11:26 |
| schestowitz | My bosses are fine with my stance on phones | Nov 16 11:26 |
| schestowitz | I want papertrail I can fwd (mail) | Nov 16 11:26 |
| schestowitz | "Thanks! And another, too: Evolio Ebook, the first Romanian eBook reader with e-ink technology http://tinyurl.com/34dogqn' | Nov 16 11:57 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Google Traducere .::. Size~: 1.17 KB | Nov 16 11:58 |
| oiaohm | Really I prefer text schestowitz | Nov 16 12:08 |
| schestowitz | neat | Nov 16 12:20 |
| Quadrescence | schestowitz: http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download;jsessionid=EFE3F0076281349CA6BE4552753AF3AF?doi=10.1.1.93.2590&rep=rep1&type=pdf | Nov 16 12:33 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: CiteSeerX .::. Size~: 12.61 KB | Nov 16 12:33 |
| Quadrescence | title: | Nov 16 12:33 |
| Quadrescence | Anarchism Triumphant: | Nov 16 12:33 |
| Quadrescence | Free Software and the Death of Copyright | Nov 16 12:33 |
| oiaohm | Open Source depends on Copyright. | Nov 16 12:35 |
| oiaohm | Free Software. Binaries without source that you can never update? | Nov 16 12:35 |
| MinceR | the prerequisites of anarchy make this a non-issue | Nov 16 12:37 |
| schestowitz | Quadrescence: how did that come up? | Nov 16 12:37 |
| schestowitz | Mobbyists? | Nov 16 12:37 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: you can modify them still... | Nov 16 12:38 |
| schestowitz | Like Monsanto does with DNA... guess work, then experimenting on 'brown people' | Nov 16 12:38 |
| MinceR | http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lbz8nrolnw1qzft56o1_400.jpg | Nov 16 12:39 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Nov 16 12:39 |
| Quadrescence | schestowitz: A good acquaintance linked it | Nov 16 12:44 |
| Quadrescence | oiaohm: It is more talking about proprietary software | Nov 16 12:44 |
| Quadrescence | and copyright as in licenses | Nov 16 12:44 |
| oiaohm | copyright and licenses are different things. | Nov 16 12:45 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: fabs linked to this yesterday: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fe9R7jcMPp4 | Nov 16 12:53 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: YouTube - WKUK-Jerkocaust .::. Size~: 119.39 KB | Nov 16 12:53 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: related | Nov 16 12:54 |
| oiaohm | Ideas of copyright go back to the production of books. | Nov 16 12:54 |
| oiaohm | and writen documents. | Nov 16 12:54 |
| oiaohm | licensing production goes back to printing press mass production. | Nov 16 12:55 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: British invention | Nov 16 12:55 |
| schestowitz | King granting monopolies | Nov 16 12:55 |
| oiaohm | Those were early patents. But licensing took many years to develop. | Nov 16 12:56 |
| oiaohm | People forget that at one point libraries the books were chained to the shelves. | Nov 16 12:57 |
| MinceR | and licensing did us so much good | Nov 16 12:57 |
| oiaohm | Licensing become a way to allow production and author get kick backs. | Nov 16 12:58 |
| oiaohm | Before licensing lot of people kept there information secret. | Nov 16 12:59 |
| oiaohm | Now the problem we have with computer programs is they are not like books. | Nov 16 12:59 |
| oiaohm | Books you can basically view the source code of it when you read it. | Nov 16 13:00 |
| oiaohm | A computer program the source is not part of the binary. | Nov 16 13:00 |
| oiaohm | Ie you can rework a book very effectively but you cannot rework a computer program effectively. | Nov 16 13:00 |
| oiaohm | Argueing against copyright or licensing is due to two failures. | Nov 16 13:01 |
| oiaohm | One copyright has been extended longer than it attented. | Nov 16 13:01 |
| oiaohm | two the critical means to rework is missing. | Nov 16 13:01 |
| oiaohm | Also early licensing was not too bad either. There was no execlusive agreements. | Nov 16 13:04 |
| oiaohm | Author would put down a fee of so much per book. And any press wanting to produce it would pay the fee. | Nov 16 13:04 |
| oiaohm | Some of the early books have the production cost information copyright page with the address to send the money to. | Nov 16 13:05 |
| oiaohm | Really a return to early licensing would be good. | Nov 16 13:06 |
| schestowitz | What's a licence legally? mechecks... | Nov 16 13:14 |
| schestowitz | "The verb license or grant licence means to give permission." | Nov 16 13:14 |
| schestowitz | "The requirement may also serve to keep the authorities informed on a type of activity, and to give them the opportunity to set conditions and limitations." | Nov 16 13:15 |
| schestowitz | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Licence | Nov 16 13:15 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: License - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 46.9 KB | Nov 16 13:15 |
| schestowitz | So who imposes this power? | Nov 16 13:15 |
| schestowitz | ANd under what basis? | Nov 16 13:15 |
| schestowitz | I'm trying to see historically how it works because animals other than us don't have licences | Nov 16 13:16 |
| schestowitz | They have non-rigid agreements | Nov 16 13:16 |
| schestowitz | And they enforce these themselves, not with help from bureaucrats | Nov 16 13:16 |
| schestowitz | We're good at brain capacity, but we're also capping its use | Nov 16 13:17 |
| schestowitz | And that's the bad psart | Nov 16 13:17 |
| schestowitz | Physically we're quite inferior | Nov 16 13:17 |
| schestowitz | Bad night vision compared to many animals inc. owl | Nov 16 13:17 |
| schestowitz | Primitive eye with blind spot (octopus does well) | Nov 16 13:18 |
| oiaohm | licenses have taken many forms. | Nov 16 13:18 |
| schestowitz | Not so fast or living long, but good in the mind, yet some of out latest 'innovations' just make life harder for progress | Nov 16 13:18 |
| MinceR | http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/744199---israelification-high-security-little-bother | Nov 16 13:18 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: The 'Israelification' of airports: High security, little bother - thestar.com .::. Size~: 107.9 KB | Nov 16 13:18 |
| schestowitz | Also... | Nov 16 13:18 |
| schestowitz | Notice how we use the word "race" for humans and for all other animals it's "breed" | Nov 16 13:18 |
| schestowitz | Cause we're allegedly so special | Nov 16 13:19 |
| schestowitz | We say the animal east pig | Nov 16 13:19 |
| schestowitz | But it's called pork/bacon when /we/ eat it | Nov 16 13:19 |
| oiaohm | chicken is a rare exception. | Nov 16 13:19 |
| schestowitz | So removing some of these spinny words aside, why is it that we have a worse power system (separation) than some other animals and how can we correct it? | Nov 16 13:20 |
| oiaohm | same with most birds. | Nov 16 13:20 |
| oiaohm | For some reason eating birds saying what you are eating is fine. | Nov 16 13:20 |
| schestowitz | I know it's a surreal type of debate, but how can we justify having bigger status divide (bar alpha male) than animals? | Nov 16 13:20 |
| schestowitz | Licensing are mechanisms of imposing power | Nov 16 13:20 |
| schestowitz | Patents.. | Nov 16 13:20 |
| schestowitz | Copyright... | Nov 16 13:20 |
| schestowitz | Police... | Nov 16 13:20 |
| schestowitz | For using people to enforce those rules for those in power | Nov 16 13:21 |
| oiaohm | Copyright is more about authorship. | Nov 16 13:21 |
| schestowitz | And we take it for granted rather than being increasingly progressive | Nov 16 13:21 |
| schestowitz | Look what the Internet has done to copyrights | Nov 16 13:21 |
| oiaohm | plagusium is breach of copyright. | Nov 16 13:21 |
| schestowitz | We not have Creative Commons and easy access to public domain | Nov 16 13:21 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: but that's not the key point | Nov 16 13:22 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: we have abundance now | Nov 16 13:22 |
| schestowitz | I don't need to commit an offence by copying and attributing wikipedia | Nov 16 13:22 |
| schestowitz | Or using linux from kernel.org while obeying the gpl | Nov 16 13:22 |
| schestowitz | So harshly (c)ed code become less attractive sometimes | Nov 16 13:23 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: and another thing... plagiarism is something else | Nov 16 13:23 |
| schestowitz | It's not breach of copyright, not in the one-to-one sense | Nov 16 13:23 |
| oiaohm | Really copyright laws allow so much copying and attributing. | Nov 16 13:23 |
| schestowitz | Not interchangeable concepts | Nov 16 13:23 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: you think fair use | Nov 16 13:24 |
| schestowitz | Fair use doctrine is an afterthough | Nov 16 13:24 |
| schestowitz | A quick fix | Nov 16 13:24 |
| schestowitz | *afterthought | Nov 16 13:24 |
| oiaohm | The older laws of copyright you could copy the complete thing if you did state the source. | Nov 16 13:24 |
| schestowitz | A band aid | Nov 16 13:24 |
| schestowitz | One example of fair use for criticism | Nov 16 13:24 |
| oiaohm | Sorry fair use was in the early copyright laws. | Nov 16 13:24 |
| oiaohm | Its as the laws changed it disappeared. | Nov 16 13:24 |
| schestowitz | To criticise you saying junk, for example, I may need to tell what you said | Nov 16 13:24 |
| schestowitz | Thus I need to quote you | Nov 16 13:24 |
| schestowitz | w/o paraphrasing | Nov 16 13:24 |
| oiaohm | Remember the early copyright laws books would state the copy feeing. | Nov 16 13:25 |
| schestowitz | I don't know the history of fiar use | Nov 16 13:25 |
| schestowitz | Let's check | Nov 16 13:25 |
| schestowitz | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use | Nov 16 13:25 |
| oiaohm | The early copyright laws were not as strict. | Nov 16 13:25 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Fair use - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 127.6 KB | Nov 16 13:25 |
| oiaohm | So what was given back by fair use was there. | Nov 16 13:25 |
| schestowitz | "The legal concept of "Test copyright" was first ratified by the Kingdom of Great Britain's Statute of Anne of 1709. As room was not made for the authorized reproduction of copyrighted content within this newly formulated statutory right, the courts created a doctrine of "fair abridgment" in Gyles v Wilcox, which eventually evolved into the modern concept of "fair use," that recognized the utility of such actions. The | Nov 16 13:26 |
| schestowitz | doctrine only existed in the U.S. as common law until it was incorporated into the Copyright Act of 1976, 17 U.S.C. § 107." | Nov 16 13:26 |
| oiaohm | And the fair abridgement is far more open than current day fair use. | Nov 16 13:28 |
| oiaohm | as a person with a printing press under fair abridgement as long as you were prepaird to pay the same fee as the others who had printed the book you could. | Nov 16 13:28 |
| oiaohm | Exclustively and copyright is a fairly new thing schestowitz | Nov 16 13:30 |
| oiaohm | And its that exclusive control right on production that causes some of the largest problems and removes printing press to printing press competetion. | Nov 16 13:30 |
| oiaohm | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Licensing_Act_1662 Note this is older than ann bill. | Nov 16 13:34 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.0 403 Forbidden .::. Size~: 0 KB | Nov 16 13:34 |
| oiaohm | 2 years excuslive after that it open. | Nov 16 13:34 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: Hungary has very fast Internet | Nov 16 13:36 |
| schestowitz | Romania VERY highly ranked too | Nov 16 13:36 |
| oiaohm | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Licensing_Order_of_1643 The start of licensing. schestowitz | Nov 16 13:37 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Licensing Order of 1643 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 37.79 KB | Nov 16 13:37 |
| schestowitz | UK does badly, despite being small and overpopulated | Nov 16 13:37 |
| schestowitz | http://royal.pingdom.com/2010/11/12/real-connection-speeds-for-internet-users-across-the-world | Nov 16 13:37 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Royal Pingdom » The REAL connection speeds for Internet users across the world (charts) .::. Size~: 64.36 KB | Nov 16 13:37 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: thanks for the links | Nov 16 13:37 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: my isp is romanian :> | Nov 16 13:37 |
| schestowitz | my imp is demonic | Nov 16 13:38 |
| MinceR | close enough? :> | Nov 16 13:38 |
| oiaohm | Notice something here licensing predates copyright. schestowitz | Nov 16 13:40 |
| oiaohm | And licensing first use was to prevent items the king did not want printed being printed. | Nov 16 13:40 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: yet people can only think of vampires and gypsies when people mention .ro. Some nice people in identica are Romanian. Very smart chaps, there's also beranger, who went silent. | Nov 16 13:42 |
| MinceR | smart people are nearly equally rare everywhere | Nov 16 13:43 |
| oiaohm | Before the Statute of Anne there is no requirement to pay a author of a book anything. schestowitz | Nov 16 13:43 |
| oiaohm | Yes you do have to note they write it but that is it. | Nov 16 13:43 |
| oiaohm | Statue of Anne as designed to correct a major miss blance of people profiting off other peoples work. | Nov 16 13:44 |
| oiaohm | Lot of what these people are talking about doing with the end of copyright is taking authors back to the days before the Statue of Anne | Nov 16 13:45 |
| schestowitz | @rsandu] ♺ @giulivo: i just moved my stuff from last.fm to libre.fm; if you want to do the same give this a look http://ur1.ca/2cptj | Nov 16 13:48 |
| schestowitz |  | Nov 16 13:48 |
| oiaohm | On the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statute_of_Anne read the Battle of the booksellers. Notice something wrong here. schestowitz | Nov 16 13:48 |
| schestowitz | [13:43] <MinceR> smart people are nearly equally rare everywhere | Nov 16 13:48 |
| schestowitz | No, some are just taken over by companies | Nov 16 13:48 |
| schestowitz | ANd then made silent | Nov 16 13:48 |
| schestowitz | Look what Sun did to Mudock | Nov 16 13:48 |
| schestowitz | *Mudorck | Nov 16 13:48 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Nov 16 13:48 |
| MinceR | companies mostly employ stupid people all the same | Nov 16 13:48 |
| schestowitz | Google makes some 'disappear' as well | Nov 16 13:48 |
| schestowitz | Brain drain | Nov 16 13:48 |
| schestowitz | Tim Bray for example | Nov 16 13:49 |
| oiaohm | Status of Anne made authorship exist as a legal thing. And it was booksellers who disputed for terms to be expanded. | Nov 16 13:49 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: not stupid | Nov 16 13:49 |
| schestowitz | Docile | Nov 16 13:49 |
| schestowitz | They are chosen for obedience | Nov 16 13:49 |
| oiaohm | When you call copyright and licensing the same it misses many critical things of hisotry. schestowitz | Nov 16 13:49 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: Sturgeon's Law applies to humans as well. | Nov 16 13:49 |
| schestowitz | Jobs interviews are partly about ensuring you lack ego and will to explore things for better way, instead taking orders | Nov 16 13:49 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: indeed | Nov 16 13:50 |
| schestowitz | But licensing is a notion of suing third party for imposition | Nov 16 13:50 |
| schestowitz | Or papery things | Nov 16 13:50 |
| oiaohm | We don't want to destroy copyright. | Nov 16 13:50 |
| oiaohm | In particular the right of authorship. | Nov 16 13:50 |
| *schestowitz looks up Sturgeon's Law | Nov 16 13:50 | |
| *schestowitz 's grandpa had a friend called Sturgeon | Nov 16 13:51 | |
| oiaohm | If you created you must always allowed to be the owner. | Nov 16 13:51 |
| oiaohm | Now how licensing is done on top of that needs to be reformed. | Nov 16 13:51 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: "Ninety percent of everything is crud." | Nov 16 13:51 |
| oiaohm | Heck early anna items does not allow authorship rights transfers. | Nov 16 13:51 |
| schestowitz | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodore_Sturgeon | Nov 16 13:51 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Theodore Sturgeon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 59.65 KB | Nov 16 13:51 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: yeah, seen that on top of page | Nov 16 13:52 |
| schestowitz | 90% is just soundbite | Nov 16 13:52 |
| schestowitz | These things are an asymptotic curve | Nov 16 13:52 |
| schestowitz | Not a binary set | Nov 16 13:52 |
| schestowitz | So the curvature tells you something about the Occam's Razor to use | Nov 16 13:52 |
| oiaohm | I still think a lot fighting for the destruction of copyright have no clue what they are attempting to destroy. | Nov 16 13:53 |
| schestowitz | No-one fights for it | Nov 16 13:54 |
| schestowitz | I don't think so | Nov 16 13:54 |
| schestowitz | Those who do are misinformed, or those who exaggerate | Nov 16 13:54 |
| oiaohm | piratebay guys some of them do. | Nov 16 13:54 |
| schestowitz | RMS rclarified his poisition | Nov 16 13:54 |
| schestowitz | He also protested some Pirate Party(ies) policies on copyright | Nov 16 13:54 |
| schestowitz | Suggesting some improvements that keep copyright in tact, just more collab friendly. | Nov 16 13:55 |
| oiaohm | They simple want everything free and stuff the effects on the world. | Nov 16 13:55 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yeah, you beat me to it | Nov 16 13:55 |
| schestowitz | About Pirate Party | Nov 16 13:55 |
| schestowitz | But no, it's not about wanting gratis | Nov 16 13:55 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: Pareto principle :> | Nov 16 13:55 |
| schestowitz | They are misrepresented like this | Nov 16 13:55 |
| schestowitz | Maybe some are | Nov 16 13:55 |
| schestowitz | It's not their idealogy | Nov 16 13:56 |
| schestowitz | *ideology | Nov 16 13:56 |
| oiaohm | Lot of the ideology is wrong. | Nov 16 13:56 |
| oiaohm | Yes we need reform. Its like say I need money so I will rob banks. | Nov 16 13:57 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: I replied to you in http://schestowitz.com/Weblog/archives/2010/11/14/selinux-rant/ | Nov 16 13:57 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: schestowitz.com » Blog Archive » SELinux: Friend or Foe? .::. Size~: 37.67 KB | Nov 16 13:57 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: copying is not robbing | Nov 16 13:57 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: you still don't understand anarchism and aren't even making an effort to understand it. | Nov 16 13:57 |
| schestowitz | and money can be printed, it's just symbolic | Nov 16 13:57 |
| schestowitz | But as long as it's used to gain material things, then it's analogous to theft | Nov 16 13:57 |
| schestowitz | If I steal your money, I steal paper | Nov 16 13:58 |
| schestowitz | If I steal your ebook, I watch your bytes and taking notes for myself | Nov 16 13:58 |
| oiaohm | To rob banks today You just take electronic data. | Nov 16 13:58 |
| schestowitz | Like looking at one's wad of cash and making photocopies of the bills | Nov 16 13:58 |
| oiaohm | You don't need to take paper. | Nov 16 13:58 |
| oiaohm | Or anything solid. | Nov 16 13:58 |
| oiaohm | Just move 1 million into a bank account and go and withdraw it. | Nov 16 13:59 |
| schestowitz | Just make sure the bank uses Windows+Exchange+ShredPoint | Nov 16 13:59 |
| oiaohm | Yep. | Nov 16 13:59 |
| oiaohm | Basically piratebay people don't understand the current day world either. | Nov 16 14:00 |
| oiaohm | That stealing does not require physical action any more. | Nov 16 14:00 |
| oiaohm | You have to be very careful remove the wrong protections you will bring the house of cards that is this world down. | Nov 16 14:01 |
| *MinceR downloads a car | Nov 16 14:01 | |
| schestowitz | You can make a person happy with it | Nov 16 14:02 |
| oiaohm | Without copyright and protections would the piratebay supports mind if there banking details listing everything they paid for with a credit card was published openly. | Nov 16 14:02 |
| schestowitz | If everyone else has them just in bits too | Nov 16 14:02 |
| oiaohm | Its only data | Nov 16 14:02 |
| MinceR | intellectual monopoly != privacy | Nov 16 14:02 |
| schestowitz | I still can't find anyone who can knock down my arguments about wealth and perception/happiness | Nov 16 14:03 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: There has to be some rules. | Nov 16 14:03 |
| schestowitz | intellectual monopoly = private (monopoly) | Nov 16 14:03 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: not necessarily | Nov 16 14:03 |
| oiaohm | Take out the rules without putting something back we will have a disaster. | Nov 16 14:03 |
| MinceR | rules aren't the only way to behave fairly | Nov 16 14:04 |
| oiaohm | There are too many greedy humans to be without rules. | Nov 16 14:04 |
| *schestowitz hopes to find ways to legally/morally/peer pressure-based penalise/discourage excess greed | Nov 16 14:04 | |
| oiaohm | USA melt down is pure sign of what happens when rules are removed. | Nov 16 14:04 |
| MinceR | rules don't fix greedy humans | Nov 16 14:04 |
| MinceR | we need to get rid of them | Nov 16 14:04 |
| oiaohm | Rules reduce the damage they can do MinceR | Nov 16 14:05 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: they want 'smaller government' | Nov 16 14:05 |
| MinceR | the whole human society is an example how having rules doesn't fix anything | Nov 16 14:05 |
| oiaohm | Before we get rid of them. | Nov 16 14:05 |
| schestowitz | The billionaires started a movement | Nov 16 14:05 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: the rules we have only increase the damage. | Nov 16 14:05 |
| schestowitz | They dubbed it Tea Party | Nov 16 14:05 |
| oiaohm | Then we need to have the rules improved. MinceR | Nov 16 14:05 |
| schestowitz | They used angry devalued people to push for no gov. regulation over corps. | Nov 16 14:05 |
| schestowitz | "corps. give jobs etc. let's abolish the govt. and make corps. the new govt., maybe with their shaddow (puppet) regime" | Nov 16 14:06 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: let them ruins their own economy | Nov 16 14:06 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: idiots hold up governments like that, there's nothing new about that | Nov 16 14:06 |
| schestowitz | The Soviets did that too | Nov 16 14:06 |
| schestowitz | Look where corruption left the former USSR | Nov 16 14:06 |
| schestowitz | "USSA" is not far fetched now | Nov 16 14:07 |
| oiaohm | corruption is human nature. | Nov 16 14:07 |
| schestowitz | I have relatives there who plan an exit in the future | Nov 16 14:07 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: human nature needs to be changed. | Nov 16 14:07 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: not of this kind | Nov 16 14:07 |
| schestowitz | Power is | Nov 16 14:07 |
| schestowitz | You can use power like EFF does | Nov 16 14:07 |
| schestowitz | or Wikileaks, etc. | Nov 16 14:07 |
| oiaohm | Greed/hording. | Nov 16 14:07 |
| oiaohm | Not power. | Nov 16 14:07 |
| oiaohm | most of the time. | Nov 16 14:07 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: all rules do is change the way the ones who have access to most resources wield power. | Nov 16 14:07 |
| schestowitz | I'd like to think that all the little power I have as just a mere person in his 20s is channelled to reduce abuse | Nov 16 14:08 |
| oiaohm | Good rules force fair sharing. | Nov 16 14:08 |
| MinceR | and so the ones in power keep good rules out of the system | Nov 16 14:08 |
| schestowitz | If I wanted a high-paying job, I could get one and be someone's prisoners and part of the problem I hope to decrease | Nov 16 14:08 |
| oiaohm | Its like cutting a cake fairly. As long as the rules are obeyed to do it everyone is treated equal. | Nov 16 14:08 |
| MinceR | as long as human nature is what it is, the current state is stable | Nov 16 14:08 |
| MinceR | "equal treatment" is subject to misinterpretation | Nov 16 14:09 |
| schestowitz | Like NBS~EDISON^Hge | Nov 16 14:09 |
| oiaohm | Biggest problem we have is not the powerful. | Nov 16 14:09 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: NBC, not NBS :> | Nov 16 14:09 |
| oiaohm | But the sheep nature of humans. | Nov 16 14:09 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: I know | Nov 16 14:09 |
| oiaohm | If something is done wrong and it don't effect you. It let slide in most cases. MinceR | Nov 16 14:10 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: I learned they lobby for nukes | Nov 16 14:10 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: GE? | Nov 16 14:10 |
| schestowitz | Using NBC & other channels | Nov 16 14:10 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: yes | Nov 16 14:10 |
| oiaohm | Most good rules come out of when people are prepared to standup and fight for fairness. | Nov 16 14:10 |
| schestowitz | and my sister gets exposed to radiation there, IIRC | Nov 16 14:10 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: whom does GE want to have nukes? | Nov 16 14:10 |
| MinceR | well, some medical equipment also contains radiation sources :> | Nov 16 14:11 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: remember for a long time Whites and Blacks in a lot of countries could not mix. | Nov 16 14:11 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: didn't read on it, I'm no GE expert at all. | Nov 16 14:11 |
| oiaohm | And the blacks got second rate treatment in a lot of cases. | Nov 16 14:11 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: that's because both are racist | Nov 16 14:11 |
| schestowitz | General [ANYTHING] is usually bluechip govt. entity | Nov 16 14:11 |
| oiaohm | Yet people stood up and forced fair access. | Nov 16 14:11 |
| schestowitz | Franchise | Nov 16 14:11 |
| oiaohm | Good rules are in the system MinceR | Nov 16 14:11 |
| schestowitz | Or "standard" or "international" | Nov 16 14:12 |
| oiaohm | Problem is we simple are not prepared to fight to have more of them. MinceR | Nov 16 14:12 |
| schestowitz | peon: what brand is it? | Nov 16 14:12 |
| schestowitz | salesperson: the standard | Nov 16 14:12 |
| schestowitz | the general | Nov 16 14:12 |
| schestowitz | The international [oil/machine/motor] | Nov 16 14:12 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: basically almost everyone who says to me the rules sux when I say will you stand up to change it they say no. | Nov 16 14:13 |
| schestowitz | peon: ah, ok. So I'll have two of the standard | Nov 16 14:13 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: some in really creative ways. | Nov 16 14:13 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: almost everyone has no power to effect real change | Nov 16 14:13 |
| MinceR | or do not know how to do so | Nov 16 14:13 |
| schestowitz | organising | Nov 16 14:13 |
| schestowitz | unions | Nov 16 14:14 |
| schestowitz | Then they have infiltrators | Nov 16 14:14 |
| schestowitz | To break unions | Nov 16 14:14 |
| oiaohm | 1 person alone has no power true. | Nov 16 14:14 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft is small | Nov 16 14:14 |
| schestowitz | Compared to energy companies | Nov 16 14:14 |
| oiaohm | But if they are prepared to talk and try to form up. | Nov 16 14:14 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: i don't even have a union | Nov 16 14:14 |
| schestowitz | They are good at crushing opposition | Nov 16 14:14 |
| oiaohm | Many cases they will get numbers. | Nov 16 14:14 |
| MinceR | my industry sucks that much | Nov 16 14:14 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: that's good | Nov 16 14:14 |
| schestowitz | It means your system works | Nov 16 14:14 |
| MinceR | why is it good? | Nov 16 14:14 |
| schestowitz | chaos theory | Nov 16 14:14 |
| MinceR | what works? | Nov 16 14:14 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: good for those who own the country | Nov 16 14:14 |
| oiaohm | Once you have enough numbers who agree there is enough force to beet the powerful MinceR | Nov 16 14:15 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: oh. | Nov 16 14:15 |
| schestowitz | stay islalated | Nov 16 14:15 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: numbers aren't enough, i'm afraid | Nov 16 14:15 |
| schestowitz | Watch TV and die | Nov 16 14:15 |
| oiaohm | It is infact MinceR | Nov 16 14:15 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: when your enemy has nukes, the Horrifying Human Wave Attack just doesn't work | Nov 16 14:15 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: as they say to demoralise, resistance is futile | Nov 16 14:16 |
| oiaohm | It depends on where your numbers are. | Nov 16 14:16 |
| schestowitz | People in power historically never just give away power | Nov 16 14:16 |
| oiaohm | If you numbers are the people who have the triggers to the nukes. | Nov 16 14:16 |
| schestowitz | Sadly, all revolutions are aggressive or armed | Nov 16 14:16 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: but they're not. | Nov 16 14:16 |
| oiaohm | Do those people need to eat. | Nov 16 14:16 |
| schestowitz | But with Internet we can get shrewd by inforimaing the public before they use blacklists like in oiaohm's country | Nov 16 14:16 |
| schestowitz | And then passing ACTA for all sorts of power leverge to corps | Nov 16 14:17 |
| schestowitz | *leverage | Nov 16 14:17 |
| schestowitz | sorry for the many typos | Nov 16 14:17 |
| oiaohm | Lot of people think a protest has to be a head on fight. | Nov 16 14:17 |
| oiaohm | Some times it can be simple things that can cause the most problems. | Nov 16 14:18 |
| oiaohm | If you wanted to destroy a city the most effective way is destroy water treatment. | Nov 16 14:18 |
| oiaohm | No nukes required. | Nov 16 14:19 |
| oiaohm | Attempting to police the internet is partly to stop people forming up into groups. | Nov 16 14:20 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: simple question here what power do the powerful have if no one will work for them. | Nov 16 14:21 |
| oiaohm | At this stage not much. | Nov 16 14:21 |
| oiaohm | Problem here we are running out of time to get this stuff sorted out correct MinceR | Nov 16 14:21 |
| oiaohm | Once we have robots that can fight powerfull will no longer need human to make them such. | Nov 16 14:22 |
| schestowitz | [14:18] <oiaohm> If you wanted to destroy a city the most effective way is destroy water treatment. | Nov 16 14:22 |
| schestowitz | For drinking you can import water using trucks | Nov 16 14:23 |
| schestowitz | Even firefighter's trucks | Nov 16 14:23 |
| oiaohm | That is if you know the water treatment was destroyed. | Nov 16 14:23 |
| schestowitz | Moving water around is not so hard | Nov 16 14:23 |
| schestowitz | Electricity is better target | Nov 16 14:23 |
| schestowitz | In some countries you only have few plants | Nov 16 14:24 |
| oiaohm | Also even if you get get freshwater in what are you going todo with the waste. | Nov 16 14:24 |
| schestowitz | So conventional weapons on each can make attacks at night easier | Nov 16 14:24 |
| schestowitz | But such wars have not been fought for decades | Nov 16 14:24 |
| schestowitz | The US army, for example, one of the most aggressive armies, just takes on weak countries | Nov 16 14:24 |
| schestowitz | like korea of the 50s or Vietnam | Nov 16 14:25 |
| schestowitz | [OR Iraq] | Nov 16 14:25 |
| oiaohm | Water has the advantage that if you attack water you can protect self against it quite well. | Nov 16 14:25 |
| oiaohm | Now take out power not so lucky. | Nov 16 14:25 |
| schestowitz | That's what Google Earth is far /sarcasm | Nov 16 14:26 |
| oiaohm | Also I have lived in australia when we had rolling blackouts by the power workers. | Nov 16 14:27 |
| schestowitz | And you never know where nuclear weapons aim by default on the system | Nov 16 14:27 |
| oiaohm | No war. Lot of distruption. | Nov 16 14:27 |
| schestowitz | They can always optimise based on new satellite demos and simulations | Nov 16 14:27 |
| oiaohm | Yes if you can get control of the electrical you can win. | Nov 16 14:27 |
| oiaohm | Since you can hold the power station to ransom. | Nov 16 14:27 |
| oiaohm | Ie attack it we will destory it anyhow. | Nov 16 14:28 |
| oiaohm | Yet to raasom the power system you don't need the power plants either. | Nov 16 14:28 |
| oiaohm | You just need to know what section of the grid to hit. | Nov 16 14:29 |
| oiaohm | This is the problem knowledge is power. | Nov 16 14:29 |
| oiaohm | If the population in a country decided to fight there are too many weak points the army could not cover the ground. | Nov 16 14:29 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, I thought of that | Nov 16 14:29 |
| schestowitz | But it's repairable | Nov 16 14:29 |
| oiaohm | Even when it repaired another section could be attacked. | Nov 16 14:30 |
| schestowitz | Most plants would need to order parts of replacement from abroad | Nov 16 14:30 |
| oiaohm | In a never ending resource suckying style. | Nov 16 14:30 |
| oiaohm | People in power depend on the public not decided to fight. | Nov 16 14:30 |
| schestowitz | Better to have missile defence near strategic iunfrastrtcure | Nov 16 14:30 |
| schestowitz | But it's easy to defeat | Nov 16 14:31 |
| schestowitz | You overwhelm it with blank missiles | Nov 16 14:31 |
| oiaohm | Remember the big usa black out. | Nov 16 14:31 |
| oiaohm | a tree fell over and dropped a power line. | Nov 16 14:31 |
| oiaohm | In the right place. | Nov 16 14:31 |
| oiaohm | No where near any strategic infrastructure. | Nov 16 14:31 |
| schestowitz | The issue is different | Nov 16 14:32 |
| oiaohm | No its not. | Nov 16 14:32 |
| oiaohm | You might defend the plant. | Nov 16 14:32 |
| schestowitz | As I understood it froma friend who served the British army | Nov 16 14:32 |
| schestowitz | It's dependence we have | Nov 16 14:32 |
| schestowitz | We'd die easily | Nov 16 14:32 |
| oiaohm | How would you defend all the power feeds. | Nov 16 14:32 |
| schestowitz | Like domesticated cats in the wild | Nov 16 14:32 |
| oiaohm | Simply you cannot. | Nov 16 14:32 |
| oiaohm | Its just like water. | Nov 16 14:32 |
| schestowitz | The villages in CHina know better how to survive without infrastructure | Nov 16 14:33 |
| schestowitz | Less pampers | Nov 16 14:33 |
| schestowitz | Less pampered | Nov 16 14:33 |
| oiaohm | Right contaimintates and pipes have to replaced. | Nov 16 14:33 |
| schestowitz | So in China-US total war China can win | Nov 16 14:33 |
| schestowitz | The US is too dependent within | Nov 16 14:33 |
| oiaohm | No both lose. | Nov 16 14:33 |
| schestowitz | Sure | Nov 16 14:33 |
| schestowitz | Not just them | Nov 16 14:33 |
| schestowitz | Nuclear winter | Nov 16 14:33 |
| oiaohm | China might be less pampered but they are also less trained how to cope with bioweapoms. | Nov 16 14:34 |
| oiaohm | Even natural ones. | Nov 16 14:34 |
| schestowitz | How is the US better prepared for disease | Nov 16 14:34 |
| schestowitz | Heck, they don't even have nationalised health service | Nov 16 14:34 |
| schestowitz | They can't take care of their own sick people when there's no war at all | Nov 16 14:34 |
| schestowitz | Because of the insurance cartel, not lack of siill | Nov 16 14:34 |
| schestowitz | Because of the insurance cartel, not lack of skill | Nov 16 14:34 |
| oiaohm | In a war you can afford to lose 80 percent of you population. | Nov 16 14:35 |
| oiaohm | Yes USA has enough resources to protect the 20 percent core. | Nov 16 14:35 |
| schestowitz | Where does this number come from? | Nov 16 14:35 |
| oiaohm | Its with the types of weapon systems coming into use. | Nov 16 14:36 |
| oiaohm | Sorry those numbers are where it will be in about 5 to 6 years. | Nov 16 14:36 |
| oiaohm | With the ideals of force multiplied by robots. | Nov 16 14:36 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: the masses of the zombies gladly work for the powerful ones, though | Nov 16 14:36 |
| MinceR | i doubt any of us can change that | Nov 16 14:36 |
| oiaohm | The simple fact if we don't at some point we will become disposable. MinceR | Nov 16 14:37 |
| MinceR | how do you know we aren't already? | Nov 16 14:37 |
| oiaohm | Not yet. | Nov 16 14:37 |
| oiaohm | Do we have fully function robot armies. MinceR? | Nov 16 14:38 |
| oiaohm | Ansnwer no. | Nov 16 14:38 |
| oiaohm | At current rate of development 5 to 6 years they will exist. | Nov 16 14:38 |
| oiaohm | At that point we are no longer required to breed to make possible soliders. | Nov 16 14:39 |
| oiaohm | So our only use past that point is food production. Then the same question how long until we are not require for that. | Nov 16 14:39 |
| schestowitz | [14:38] <oiaohm> Do we have fully function robot armies. MinceR? | Nov 16 14:39 |
| oiaohm | At that point we are then 100 percent desposable. | Nov 16 14:39 |
| schestowitz | Robot armies are stupid | Nov 16 14:40 |
| schestowitz | Except for targetted killings | Nov 16 14:40 |
| MinceR | i'd like to have a robot army | Nov 16 14:40 |
| schestowitz | Which in total wars you need not have | Nov 16 14:40 |
| MinceR | with optional direct control | Nov 16 14:40 |
| schestowitz | See London or Dresden bombing | Nov 16 14:40 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: UAVs can deliver bombs too | Nov 16 14:40 |
| MinceR | :> | Nov 16 14:40 |
| schestowitz | Ground troops are obsolete | Nov 16 14:40 |
| MinceR | not yet | Nov 16 14:40 |
| oiaohm | Robots still have limited movement in battle field compared to normal ground troops. | Nov 16 14:41 |
| schestowitz | The US has been carpt-bombing, then using parachuters ("troops") to hike | Nov 16 14:41 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: that can be fixed, eventually | Nov 16 14:41 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: yes | Nov 16 14:41 |
| oiaohm | But yes inside 5 to 6 years ground troups will have no advange. | Nov 16 14:41 |
| schestowitz | They use drones in Yemen now | Nov 16 14:41 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: you still need ground forces to hold ground and to take over facilities | Nov 16 14:41 |
| schestowitz | And kill many innocent | Nov 16 14:41 |
| oiaohm | Also why parachute troops in. | Nov 16 14:41 |
| MinceR | and to take ground | Nov 16 14:41 |
| schestowitz | They should hand the drone | Nov 16 14:42 |
| schestowitz | They should hang the drone | Nov 16 14:42 |
| oiaohm | When you can just drop robots | Nov 16 14:42 |
| oiaohm | From 10000 feet | Nov 16 14:42 |
| schestowitz | DIsmantle its head... for replacement with a new one | Nov 16 14:42 |
| oiaohm | As like bombs without parshotes | Nov 16 14:42 |
| oiaohm | And they still operate. | Nov 16 14:42 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: you can probably also manufacture robots near the front line | Nov 16 14:42 |
| oiaohm | Self reproducing robots already exist. Self assembing don't. | Nov 16 14:43 |
| schestowitz | RepRap? | Nov 16 14:43 |
| schestowitz | RepRap Rambo Edition(R)? | Nov 16 14:43 |
| oiaohm | The first was a milling robot in japan. schestowitz | Nov 16 14:43 |
| MinceR | :D | Nov 16 14:43 |
| oiaohm | It can remake every part. | Nov 16 14:43 |
| oiaohm | Including its chips. | Nov 16 14:43 |
| oiaohm | Only thing it cannot do is solder | Nov 16 14:43 |
| oiaohm | to gue its ciruit board up. | Nov 16 14:43 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, sheep are hard toi manufacture | Nov 16 14:44 |
| schestowitz | Cell-level complexity | Nov 16 14:44 |
| MinceR | nah, sheep are self-replicating :> | Nov 16 14:44 |
| schestowitz | And they might accidentally get a mind to think on their own | Nov 16 14:44 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: Dolly Schwartzkopf | Nov 16 14:44 |
| oiaohm | It is possible to produce a living sheep without a brain. | Nov 16 14:45 |
| oiaohm | with dna tampering. | Nov 16 14:45 |
| schestowitz | oh, I thought oiaohm said soldier, not solder | Nov 16 14:45 |
| MinceR | :> | Nov 16 14:45 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: but you start with a model | Nov 16 14:45 |
| schestowitz | Create a cell from scratch, I think something similar was achieved around march | Nov 16 14:46 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: people like us make many of these types of cells all day long | Nov 16 14:46 |
| oiaohm | We know how dna and rna proper work these days. | Nov 16 14:46 |
| schestowitz | Some make us what we are but due to lossy duplication we get wrinkles and age | Nov 16 14:46 |
| oiaohm | We also know how to fix the duplication issue. | Nov 16 14:47 |
| schestowitz | Males and females also make self-replicating models of entire bodies | Nov 16 14:47 |
| schestowitz | of a billion billion billion atoms | Nov 16 14:47 |
| oiaohm | and make new forms that are nuke proff. | Nov 16 14:47 |
| schestowitz | radiation or impact? | Nov 16 14:47 |
| oiaohm | Problem is making something with arms legs and can walk is a little tricky at this time. | Nov 16 14:47 |
| oiaohm | radiation and impact | Nov 16 14:47 |
| schestowitz | "if you see a flash, duck" | Nov 16 14:48 |
| oiaohm | No see flash party. | Nov 16 14:48 |
| oiaohm | There are creatures who eat that power. | Nov 16 14:48 |
| schestowitz | but the velocity can break tissue connections | Nov 16 14:48 |
| schestowitz | So it's silly to suggest "nuclear-proof" | Nov 16 14:49 |
| oiaohm | mold based slugs. | Nov 16 14:49 |
| oiaohm | Ie velocity blows them to bits. | Nov 16 14:49 |
| oiaohm | but there indvidual cells live | Nov 16 14:49 |
| oiaohm | And are able to replicate back up to another slug. | Nov 16 14:49 |
| oiaohm | So all you did with the nuke was make more. | Nov 16 14:49 |
| oiaohm | I am deadly serous about being able to build a creature that unless you get a direct hit above it forget it. | Nov 16 14:51 |
| oiaohm | it going to do nothing. | Nov 16 14:51 |
| schestowitz | "Romanian Defense Ministry's website, www.mapn.ro, hacked http://tinyurl.com/38bu4mf " | Nov 16 14:52 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Google Traducere .::. Size~: 1.22 KB | Nov 16 14:52 |
| schestowitz | Sent to me by mail | Nov 16 14:52 |
| oiaohm | Nukes are only some use while you are still fighting creatures with our weaknesses. | Nov 16 14:52 |
| oiaohm | Now a nuclear-proof flesh eating mold would major head ache. | Nov 16 14:54 |
| oiaohm | But it is destoryable. Micro fine mist | Nov 16 14:55 |
| oiaohm | Ie forget the idea that a Nuke is a war winner. It could be a war loser. | Nov 16 14:55 |
| *oiaohm has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | Nov 16 14:56 | |
| schestowitz | Hmmm.... my middle name (Samuel, my grandpa) turns out to be confusing to Google, wrongly associating me with "S", the late Sigmund Kurt Schestowitz | Nov 16 15:34 |
| schestowitz | " No, THAT'S what I call a real morron ! http://is.gd/hdzQR " | Nov 16 15:38 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: The lesson of Google Android fail | ZDNet .::. Size~: 127.66 KB | Nov 16 15:38 |
| schestowitz | This guy keeps sending me PMs. | Nov 16 15:49 |
| schestowitz | I don't like those | Nov 16 15:49 |
| schestowitz | It gives impression of no transparen cy | Nov 16 15:49 |
| schestowitz | It gives impression of no transparency | Nov 16 15:49 |
| schestowitz | "I've used them only for messages that are not good to the commo cause " | Nov 16 15:49 |
| schestowitz | :-/ | Nov 16 15:49 |
| schestowitz | "Dan Iancu (uhitto) and Adrian Seceleanu (adrianseceleanu) do exactly the same on Romanian Twitter - trolls" | Nov 16 15:53 |
| *abeNd-org (~KKlenke@66.212.115.49) has joined #boycottnovell-social | Nov 16 15:54 | |
| schestowitz | "Advocate !gnu ☛ !linux ☛ based on value, not based on price. The zero cost can be mentioned later as added value, in my experience..." | Nov 16 16:07 |
| *abeNd-org has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Nov 16 16:14 | |
| *abeNd-org (~KKlenke@66.212.115.49) has joined #boycottnovell-social | Nov 16 16:22 | |
| schestowitz | "Advocate #gnu #linux based on value, not based on price. The 0 cost can be mentioned later +value| ~ #RedHat CEO advice #OSBC" | Nov 16 16:24 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/#!/Metztli_IT/status/4569624746135552 | Nov 16 16:27 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Twitter .::. Size~: 41.59 KB | Nov 16 16:27 |
| Quadrescence | schestowitz: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/11/15/amd_secret_debugger/ | Nov 16 16:57 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: 'Super-secret' debugger discovered in AMD CPUs • The Register .::. Size~: 21.77 KB | Nov 16 16:57 |
| schestowitz | Quadrescence: added to daily links | Nov 16 17:26 |
| schestowitz | "what exactly is meant by "officialness"?" https://identi.ca/notice/58734560 | Nov 16 19:50 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Brendan Foley (pmctechblog)'s status on Tuesday, 16-Nov-10 19:23:39 UTC - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 8.23 KB | Nov 16 19:50 |
| schestowitz | me: "that's my point. This notion is silly and artificial." | Nov 16 19:50 |
| schestowitz | "I judge it by whether they use those terrible TV screens behind Wolf Blitzer instead of just showing footage in the whole frame" https://identi.ca/notice/58735416 | Nov 16 19:51 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Joel Adamson (trashbird1240)'s status on Tuesday, 16-Nov-10 19:46:04 UTC - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 8.74 KB | Nov 16 19:51 |
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| schestowitz | Hm.... MinceR http://slated.org/jono_bacon_prefers_windows | Nov 16 21:54 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Jono Bacon prefers Windows | Slated .::. Size~: 13.61 KB | Nov 16 21:54 |
| schestowitz | I don't know where it all got started | Nov 16 21:55 |
| MinceR | whoa | Nov 16 21:55 |
| schestowitz | Maybe it was you feeding in IRC | Nov 16 21:55 |
| schestowitz | And then COLA picked it up | Nov 16 21:55 |
| schestowitz | 70+ posts about it | Nov 16 21:55 |
| schestowitz | And I think Homer hangs around there | Nov 16 21:55 |
| MinceR | this is a new quote, though | Nov 16 21:55 |
| MinceR | from http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/msg/4f50d975f50c23cd?dmode=source | Nov 16 21:55 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Jono Bacon's Windows 7 Home Studio. - comp.os.linux.advocacy | Google Groups .::. Size~: 25.51 KB | Nov 16 21:55 |
| schestowitz | Oh, I see now.. | Nov 16 21:55 |
| schestowitz | http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/msg/4f50d975f50c23cd?dmode=source | Nov 16 21:55 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Jono Bacon's Windows 7 Home Studio. - comp.os.linux.advocacy | Google Groups .::. Size~: 25.51 KB | Nov 16 21:55 |
| schestowitz | He responded | Nov 16 21:55 |
| schestowitz | He ought to have stayed out | Nov 16 21:56 |
| MinceR | this is how novell2.0 helps m$ advertise vista7 | Nov 16 21:56 |
| MinceR | i don't see any good way to handle this new ad campaign | Nov 16 21:57 |
| MinceR | ignore it and novell2.0 retains its undeserved prestige | Nov 16 21:58 |
| MinceR | talk about it and the advertisement is propagated | Nov 16 21:58 |
| schestowitz | This might also explain why Homer came back to IRC after years away | Nov 16 21:58 |
| *abeNd-org (~KKlenke@66.212.115.49) has joined #boycottnovell-social | Nov 16 22:05 | |
| schestowitz | "#Fedora ☛ 14: Strong follow-up to 13 still suffers from same niche appeal http://is.gd/hf2yP http://is.gd/hf2Bd #redhat ☛ !gnu ☛ !linux ☛" | Nov 16 22:22 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Fedora 14: Strong follow-up to 13 still suffers from same niche appeal | Linux and Open Source | TechRepublic.com .::. Size~: 74.03 KB | Nov 16 22:22 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Its A Binary World 2.0 » Upgraded to Fedora 14 .::. Size~: 94.78 KB | Nov 16 22:22 |
| schestowitz | "What do you call a group of #Microsoft ☛ boosters inside a !Linux ☛ event? http://is.gd/hf27o" | Nov 16 22:22 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Mono Developer Room at FOSDEM - Miguel de Icaza .::. Size~: 14.01 KB | Nov 16 22:23 |
| MinceR | :) | Nov 16 22:23 |
| *oiaohm (~oiaohm@80.135.dsl.brs.iprimus.net.au) has joined #boycottnovell-social | Nov 16 22:40 | |
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| *oiaohm (~oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #boycottnovell-social | Nov 16 22:40 | |
| oiaohm | schestowitz: http://ars.samsung.com/customer/usa/jsp/faqs/faqs_view_us.jsp?SITE_ID=22&PG_ID=2&PROD_SUB_ID=557&PROD_ID=558&AT_ID=344529 Just had a good read | Nov 16 22:41 |
| TechrightsBot-sc | Title: Does Windows Phone support microSD card for Memory Expansion? .::. Size~: 17.84 KB | Nov 16 22:41 |
| oiaohm | From the way it reads I am very suspect that MS is using ATA password on the flash media. | Nov 16 22:42 |
| oiaohm | That to remove the device having to format is very much like its DRM. | Nov 16 22:42 |
| oiaohm | Question we need answered. This would be pure evil if it the case. Can memery cards be swaped between windows mobile devices. | Nov 16 22:44 |
| oiaohm | If no we have true DRM on our hands. | Nov 16 22:44 |
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