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IRC: #boycottnovell-social @ FreeNode: January 30th, 2011

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schestowitzhe uses fedoraJan 30 04:34
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oiaohmBack from lca2011 .  Its also time for a new default machine.  This one has just lost 2 ram slots.  Ie they don't work any more.Jan 30 09:36
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schestowitzI am still under the impression that Techrights has been infiltrated by British spies and should currently be preparing a statement to explain the situation.Jan 30 19:38
schestowitzI thought about saying that" Techrights Infiltrated by Undercover Police Spies, Issue Addressed" - British police informants found immersed in Techrights and are politely asked to leaveJan 30 19:39
schestowitzBut the person is harmlessJan 30 19:39
MinceRwhat is to say they won't come back with a different nick/username/host?Jan 30 19:40
MinceRexcept this time we won't knowJan 30 19:40
schestowitzThere is no reason to identify software freedom as some sort of "risk group". According the leaked MOD manual (thanks to Wikileaks), investigative journalists may be no better than "terrorists".Jan 30 19:41
MinceRanti-free software people might try to paint us as terrorists, thoughJan 30 19:41
schestowitzBut this person says there is separation between work and homeJan 30 19:41
MinceRthey might pay a lot of money to help that message alongJan 30 19:41
MinceRm$ could be really, really desperateJan 30 19:42
schestowitz Mark Kennedy: 15 other undercover police infiltrated green movementJan 30 19:42
TechrightsBot-scTitle: Mark Kennedy: 15 other undercover police infiltrated green movement - Telegraph .::. Size~: 80.66 KBJan 30 19:42
schestowitzThose who follow the daily links here in Techrights will know that there is a fiasco in Britain over the extensive use of police spies to infiltrate groups like environmental groups and at the expense of millions (taxpayers' money) spy on these peaceful people to dig some 'dirt' on them, than hand over data to private companies that suffer from non-violent activism.Jan 30 19:43
schestowitzSomeone blew the whistle after being exposed (working undercover with a fake name for the National Public Order Intelligence Unit and the Met). It turns out that green groups alone were infiltrated by at least 15 undercover agents who spied on members. The Guardian alleged that the police had turned into a sort of private forces for corporations, which in turn fund the government in all sorts of ways.Jan 30 19:43
schestowitzI was told that in 2006 I had come under surveillance on campus. The IT administrator who told me there was kind enough to break the rules by privately informing while reluctantly complying. It is insulting -- not rewarding -- to be prosecuted or harassed like this for doing absolutely nothing unethical or wrong. It is not acceptable.Jan 30 19:44
schestowitzI don't know if we have been under surveillance from British cops... but... at least one of whom infiltrated the group and admitted doing undercover work dressing up and acting as assimilated member for the purpose of becoming an inside informant and maybe find incriminating material.Jan 30 19:45
MinceRalso, they might be interested in support for wikileaks, which they fear and hateJan 30 19:46
schestowitzThat's what I thought earlierJan 30 19:46
qu1j0t3"this person says there is separation between work and home"Jan 30 19:46
schestowitzmentioned this the other week and warned to stay away from Wikileaks, specifically in relation to ‘Anonymous’, which we never endorsed at all.Jan 30 19:46
qu1j0t3i don't think that matters.Jan 30 19:47
qu1j0t3this behaviour is unacceptable to TR communityJan 30 19:47
schestowitzThe undercover thing is for sure. This we know for a fact, but whether Techrights too was among the watched group is the past we cannot verify using more than circumstantial evidence. The person in question has been avoiding contact since the issue started to be raised and previously admitted that more cops were watching over.Jan 30 19:47
qu1j0t3it can't be tolerated and remain consistent with TR valuesJan 30 19:47
schestowitzqu1j0t3: This is not the sort of attention Techrights needs or welcomes and we have therefore addressed the problem over the past week or so. Core members of Techrights have been informed in line with the suggestions foundJan 30 19:48
qu1j0t3either the person is an infiltrator of [activist groups] or they are not.Jan 30 19:48
schestowitz What to do about Political SpyingJan 30 19:48
TechrightsBot-scTitle: tao : security : general security : bugs, taps and infiltrators .::. Size~: 22.66 KBJan 30 19:48
schestowitzTo clarify, there is no threat posed to anybody (nobody was intimidated in any way and this went on for over a year), but as a matter of principle we are unwilling to have an element among us that is the police. One thing echrights covers a lot these days is the issue of civil liberties and history teaches that any group -- once infiltrated by police -- is bound to suffer from it.Jan 30 19:48
MinceRthen again if we tell them to go away (or ban them), they'll at least lose their identity and will only be able to spy on us as anonymous users (and the channels are public anyway)Jan 30 19:48
MinceRmight be a setback to infiltrationJan 30 19:49
schestowitzI could say that Techrights respectfully declines to accept any sort of such intervention and therefore disengages from those who are hereby encouraged to leave the community (they know who they are).Jan 30 19:49
schestowitzthanks to green activists who helped expose illegitimate use of power and informed the public about it through the watchdog press.Jan 30 19:50
schestowitzI generally know that people say you should always stay away from the police, especially if you have done nothing wrong. Police protects order and power, it does not need to protect the people; it is not obliged to, either, contrary to widely-spread misconceptions.Jan 30 19:50
schestowitz Five UK Men Arrested Over ‘Anonymous’ Wikileaks Attacks    -  -TRIdentica/#techrights-[glynmoody/@glynmoody] Five UK Men Arrested Over ‘Anonymous’ #Wikileaks Attacks - as @calixte asks: And they found them how...?Jan 30 19:51
TechrightsBot-scTitle: Five UK Men Arrested Over ‘Anonymous’ Wikileaks Attacks .::. Size~: 76.53 KBJan 30 19:51
TechrightsBot-scTitle: Five UK Men Arrested Over ‘Anonymous’ Wikileaks Attacks .::. Size~: 76.29 KBJan 30 19:51
schestowitzread the comments Police arrest five over Anonymous attacksJan 30 19:52
TechrightsBot-scTitle: Police arrest five over Anonymous attacks | News | PC Pro .::. Size~: 48.97 KBJan 30 19:52
MinceRcan you expose the spy along with asking him/her to leave?Jan 30 19:53
MinceR(exact nick and whatever)Jan 30 19:53
schestowitzNoJan 30 19:54
schestowitzI check to see if it's benignJan 30 19:54
qu1j0t3can also ask to leave privately.Jan 30 19:55
qu1j0t31st resort.Jan 30 19:55
schestowitzI'm pressuring for disclosureJan 30 19:57
schestowitzBut the "family" card gets pulledJan 30 19:57
MinceR?Jan 30 19:58
schestowitzfear of retaliationJan 30 19:58
MinceRwhose family is in danger? yours or the spy's?Jan 30 19:59
schestowitzNot mineJan 30 19:59
schestowitzBut the thing is thisJan 30 20:00
schestowitzThe person does make a compelling case we're not at all targeted or anythingJan 30 20:00
MinceRwhat does he say why he's here?Jan 30 20:00
schestowitzThe person says the undercover gig is overJan 30 20:04
schestowitzgigsJan 30 20:04
MinceRso he's going native?Jan 30 20:05
schestowitzcommunity serviceJan 30 20:05
gnufreexHm..Jan 30 20:11
gnufreexThat sounds like Canonical... community service...Jan 30 20:12
gnufreexAre you sure spy is not from Canonical?Jan 30 20:13
schestowitzNoJan 30 20:16
schestowitzIf something changes, I'll say so.Jan 30 20:16
schestowitzBut I am trying to push for disclosureJan 30 20:16
gnufreexI was joking.Jan 30 20:20
schestowitzWe can't quite have internal discussions about police infiltrators... they can be public as long as nobody is namedJan 30 20:21
schestowitzI thought about contacting our dear Richard Stallman with a copy of my posts/bit of text, which does not name people so as to not complicate matters any further. They too might have 'buddies'...Jan 30 20:21
schestowitzI'll post a message to someone about it... someone who was in contact with similar peopleJan 30 20:25
schestowitz"As part of our obligation to freedom and liberty, we have warned other people who are believed (based on discreet information) to be watched/targeted by the police agents for non-violent dissent. I have reasons to believe that your friend Danny -- if not you too -- is under police surveillance because his name came up by a person whom we know as a semi-friend of 'Mark Kennedy' (National Public Order Intelligence Unit and theJan 30 20:25
schestowitzMet on the face of it). Please do not hesitate to contact me for further information."Jan 30 20:25
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schestowitz0/ oiaohmJan 30 20:34
schestowitzWelcome back from LCAJan 30 20:34
oiaohmThe censored video when it gets up is a good one.Jan 30 20:36
oiaohmYes he went a little far in a few places but the points were highly valid.Jan 30 20:37
qu1j0t3"fear of retaliation" -- that's not a problem if it's private requesst to leave.Jan 30 20:38
qu1j0t3if they won't leave: then they are taking the risk.Jan 30 20:38
qu1j0t3"The person does make a compelling case we're not at all targeted or anything" -- not relevant. the group's principles are violated.Jan 30 20:39
qu1j0t3"The person says the undercover gig is over" -- then it's time to fess up.Jan 30 20:39
qu1j0t3(or leave)Jan 30 20:39
schestowitzI keep pressuring for disclosureJan 30 20:39
qu1j0t3i think the options are simple.Jan 30 20:39
schestowitzqu1j0t3: yesJan 30 20:39
qu1j0t3they can choose to leave voluntarily if they really beleive these "risk" arguments.Jan 30 20:40
oiaohmAlso all the other keynotes are really good.Jan 30 20:40
qu1j0t3if not, then they have to take the consequences.Jan 30 20:40
oiaohmLike the one guy talking about ipv4 and basically saying to Linux guys fix it.Jan 30 20:40
oiaohmReally this LCA is having some of the most video releases.Jan 30 20:40
oiaohmschestowitz: I guess you are aware we are basically out of ipv4 and will start running on the reserve number to issue next month.Jan 30 20:41
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sebsebsebHiJan 30 21:30
schestowitzHello!Jan 30 22:26
oiaohmHi sebsebsebJan 30 22:28
sebsebseboiaohm: hiJan 30 22:28
oiaohmI got to the LCA now I have tiding everything up.Jan 30 22:30
oiaohmYes being away for a week does cause some havoicJan 30 22:30
sebsebsebyeah I saw something this morningJan 30 22:30
sebsebsebabout thatJan 30 22:30
sebsebsebdid you get to meet Linus?Jan 30 22:30
oiaohmSaw him did not get to meet him.Jan 30 22:32
oiaohmHe was busy when I saw him.Jan 30 22:32
oiaohmWith who turns out to be the OMG ubuntu guy.Jan 30 22:32
oiaohmBugger I did not know who the OMG ubuntu guy was.Jan 30 22:32
oiaohmMind you I got to talk 1 on one with a few redhat guys they were nice.Jan 30 22:34
oiaohmAlso meet a few guys talking about building an accountancy package for AustraliaJan 30 22:35
oiaohmSimple one at that.Jan 30 22:35
schestowitzoiaohm: that dude (neckbeard basher) made Linus look like a short viking with belly :)Jan 30 22:49
oiaohmThinking where Linus is from short viking with a belly is right.Jan 30 22:51
schestowitz 30 22:54
TechrightsBot-scTitle: Sony Gets Restraining Order Against Guy Who Restored PS3 Feature Sony Deleted | Techdirt .::. Size~: 134.3 KBJan 30 22:54
schestowitzSCOnyJan 30 22:54
schestowitzoiaohm: but not FinlandJan 30 22:54
schestowitzAlthough it's ScandinavianJan 30 22:54
oiaohmVikings is a over wrapper term.  Vikings are often equated with Varangians, who came to consist of both Finns and Swedes as the latter turned Eastward.Jan 30 22:56
oiaohmSo yes Linus could be a direct link to a Viking blood line.Jan 30 22:57
oiaohmSo looking like a Viking with age would not be strange.Jan 30 22:57
schestowitzThere's Swedish roots to LinusJan 30 23:02
qu1j0t3aren't there norwegian vikings?Jan 30 23:06
oiaohmThe Varangians spreed out.  qu1j0t3 remember they got all the way to the USA.Jan 30 23:07
oiaohmYes norwedian was basically colonistaion.Jan 30 23:07
*qu1j0t3 's surname reputedly has viking origin, maybe back to finlandJan 30 23:07
qu1j0t3then later, many generations in ScotlandJan 30 23:08
gnufreexThose antiNecbeard trolls again turned OMG comments! into anti-GNU flamewar.Jan 30 23:08
qu1j0t3well, i can't believe we're still discussing that sophomoric, moronic post.Jan 30 23:08
gnufreexI just read the backlogJan 30 23:09
gnufreex:-)Jan 30 23:09
qu1j0t3brave manJan 30 23:09
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