Join us now at the IRC channel.
| *Pi-Man (~Cirrus_Mi@unaffiliated/cirrus-minor/x-6868843) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:22 | |
| *jono has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat) | Sep 25 00:24 | |
| *rysiek|pl has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *nj3ma has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *sebsebseb has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *Omega has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *brendyn has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *schestowitz_mob has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *Roderick has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *TRIdentica has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *ohama has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *JimmyCarter has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *flatr0ze has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *gde33 has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *XFaCE has quit (*.net *.split) | Sep 25 00:47 | |
| *XFaCE (XFaCE@unaffiliated/xface) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *gde33 (~gde33@546A1A51.cm-12-3a.dynamic.ziggo.nl) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *flatr0ze (~flatr0ze@108-205-242-13.lightspeed.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *rysiek|pl (~quassel@188.165.233.29) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *nj3ma (~nj3ma@static-41-242-0-196.ips.angani.co) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *sebsebseb (~mageiause@fsf/member/sebsebseb) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *schestowitz_mob (~HP@host31-51-213-45.range31-51.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *Omega (~Omega@started.the.rvlution.net) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *Roderick (~quassel@openculturefoundation.org) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *ohama (ohama@cicolina.org) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *TRIdentica (~twitfolk@mail.copilotco.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *brendyn (brendyn@2400:8900::f03c:91ff:fedf:65b4) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| *JimmyCarter (~far@onegrandcircle.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:54 | |
| DaemonFC | I can't believe how hard it is to find a used car in good shape for a reasonable price. | Sep 25 01:39 |
|---|---|---|
| DaemonFC | Never had this much trouble. | Sep 25 01:39 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, You'd think that a Ford Taurus or Crown Vic would be easy. | Sep 25 01:39 |
| DaemonFC | You used to find them everywhere. | Sep 25 01:40 |
| DaemonFC | Right now there's like almost nothing on the market in the area that I'd want to buy. | Sep 25 01:40 |
| DaemonFC | The closest thing to a deal I've seen all week is a 1999 Chevrolet Malibu LS. | Sep 25 01:40 |
| DaemonFC | '99 was an odd year for that car. They actually had a mid-year production change, so there are two 3.1 liter V6 engines that you could end up with. | Sep 25 01:41 |
| DaemonFC | One is slightly more powerful than the other even though they're the same displacement. | Sep 25 01:42 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Sep 25 01:42 |
| DaemonFC | I'd have to figure out which engine is in that car before I made an offer. | Sep 25 01:44 |
| DaemonFC | I'd be willing to pay a little more if it's the better engine. | Sep 25 01:44 |
| *pookito has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) | Sep 25 01:58 | |
| *tessier has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | Sep 25 02:02 | |
| *tessier (~treed@216.105.40.125) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 02:02 | |
| *tessier has quit (Changing host) | Sep 25 02:02 | |
| *tessier (~treed@kernel-panic/copilotco) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 02:02 | |
| *TakinOver (~quassel@74-84-89-62.client.mchsi.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 02:06 | |
| *Pi-Man has quit (Quit: Left) | Sep 25 03:14 | |
| *TakinOver has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | Sep 25 04:19 | |
| *MinceR has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) | Sep 25 05:27 | |
| *MinceR (~mincer@unaffiliated/mincer) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 05:27 | |
| *ChanServ gives channel operator status to MinceR | Sep 25 05:59 | |
| DaemonFC | http://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/2013/09/11/are-credit-cards-more-expensive-now/ | Sep 25 07:12 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.foxbusiness.com | Are Credit Cards More Expensive Now? | Fox Business [ http://ur1.ca/fp23t ] | Sep 25 07:12 |
| DaemonFC | "It appears to be working. Survey results released in February this year by Consumer Action, a consumer advocacy group in San Francisco, showed that 45% of consumers polled said they paid more each month because of that minimum-payment warning." | Sep 25 07:12 |
| DaemonFC | So they didn't notice that they were paying $30 a month and having their balance go down by $10 before the government made them say that on the bill? :) | Sep 25 07:12 |
| DaemonFC | People are fucking DUMB. | Sep 25 07:12 |
| *iophk (~Adium@unaffiliated/iophk) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 08:04 | |
| *ChanServ gives channel operator status to iophk | Sep 25 08:04 | |
| iophk | http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-09/why-were-shutting-our-comments | Sep 25 08:11 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.popsci.com | Why We're Shutting Off Our Comments | Popular Science [ http://ur1.ca/fp2x1 ] | Sep 25 08:11 |
| *iophk has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Sep 25 08:32 | |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4087493721.html | Sep 25 08:32 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1994 CUTLASS CIERA 77,676 ACTUAL MILES [ http://ur1.ca/fp36a ] | Sep 25 08:32 |
| *amarsh04 has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 08:32 | |
| DaemonFC | Hello... | Sep 25 08:33 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 08:33 |
| DaemonFC | Low mileage creampuff... | Sep 25 08:33 |
| *iophk (~Adium@unaffiliated/iophk) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 09:41 | |
| *ChanServ gives channel operator status to iophk | Sep 25 09:41 | |
| iophk | Muktware doesn't allow comments either. | Sep 25 09:42 |
| iophk | http://torrentfreak.com/how-google-algorithm-changes-hit-torrent-site-traffic-130924/ | Sep 25 09:46 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | torrentfreak.com | How Google Algorithm Changes Hit Torrent Site Traffic | TorrentFreak [ http://ur1.ca/fp45q ] | Sep 25 09:46 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: intresitng tech talks | Sep 25 09:55 |
| sebsebseb | again today as well | Sep 25 09:55 |
| sebsebseb | ,but need Fash or some VLC plugin to see it I Think | Sep 25 09:55 |
| iophk | oh, too bad. | Sep 25 09:55 |
| iophk | It's disturbing that there is so much filtering: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/10332010/Porn-on-most-free-public-WiFi-networks.html | Sep 25 09:57 |
| iophk | http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/sep/25/porn-knives-and-drugs-websites-accessible-on-most-public-wi-fi | Sep 25 09:57 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.telegraph.co.uk | Porn on most free public WiFi networks - Telegraph [ http://ur1.ca/fp4aw ] | Sep 25 09:57 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.theguardian.com | Porn, knives and drugs websites accessible on most public Wi-Fi | Technology | theguardian.com [ http://ur1.ca/fp4ax ] | Sep 25 09:57 |
| iophk | and also disturbing that the articles approach filtering as desireable or normal. | Sep 25 09:57 |
| DaemonFC | http://www.city-data.com/forum/automotive/1246299-market-used-car-how-old-too-2.html | Sep 25 10:01 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.city-data.com | In the Market for Used Car: How Old is Too Old? (vehicles, brakes) - Sports cars, sedans, coupes, SUVs, trucks, motorcycles, tickets, dealers, repairs, gasoline, drivers... - Page 2 - City-Data Forum [ http://ur1.ca/fp4df ] | Sep 25 10:01 |
| DaemonFC | My 1995 has been pretty reliable. | Sep 25 10:02 |
| DaemonFC | I don't see anything wrong with driving an "old" car as long as it's being properly maintained. | Sep 25 10:02 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: maybe shoud put soe MOno on the remaster to win people over to Linux | Sep 25 10:02 |
| sebsebseb | so can have Banshee and F-spot there | Sep 25 10:02 |
| sebsebseb | and maybe even Gbrainy | Sep 25 10:02 |
| iophk | :( | Sep 25 10:02 |
| DaemonFC | You have to remember when you're dealing with a 20 year old car that there's probably some belts and hoses that need swapped out, and it wouldn't hurt to immediately go for a coolant and transmission flush and an oil change just so you know they've been done. | Sep 25 10:03 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I am actsuallly consieirng MOno here since it would put it in anyway in task-gnome etc | Sep 25 10:03 |
| sebsebseb | and Rythomboxi isn't that great | Sep 25 10:03 |
| sebsebseb | Banshee is better really | Sep 25 10:03 |
| iophk | Clementine is better | Sep 25 10:03 |
| iophk | banshess is crashy and slow | Sep 25 10:03 |
| sebsebseb | Clementine is KDE though | Sep 25 10:03 |
| DaemonFC | Old people tend to neglect that stuff. People in general treat their cars like an appliance instead of a machine. | Sep 25 10:03 |
| sebsebseb | I guess can mix in a GNOME remasster though maybe hmm | Sep 25 10:03 |
| sebsebseb | I do like Clementine a lot myself though | Sep 25 10:04 |
| DaemonFC | Of course, there are some kinds of cars that it's just better to never buy them used at all. | Sep 25 10:04 |
| DaemonFC | A Camaro, Corvette, Grand Prix, Mustang, etc. | Sep 25 10:04 |
| DaemonFC | With the odd exception. (Someone that puts thousands of dollars into restoring a classic Mustang is unlikely to have abused it, but people give these cars to their kids and those are the ones you have to watch out for). | Sep 25 10:05 |
| DaemonFC | I had a boss once that spent something in the upper $3x,xxx range on a new Grand Prix GTP for her 16 year old son. | Sep 25 10:05 |
| DaemonFC | Before the thing even got a thousand miles on the clock, he went off the road at about 80 miles per hour and wrapped it around a tree. | Sep 25 10:06 |
| iophk | sebsebseb: xfce is probably a more practical choice for new users than GNOME. GNOME has been going down hill for many many years now. | Sep 25 10:06 |
| iophk | I wouldn't recommend it to anyone at this point. | Sep 25 10:06 |
| roy_ | iophk: muktware? | Sep 25 10:07 |
| roy_ | I think they use disqus | Sep 25 10:07 |
| roy_ | needs JS | Sep 25 10:07 |
| iophk | yes, that's about the same as no comments | Sep 25 10:07 |
| iophk | disqus+js == no comment | Sep 25 10:07 |
| iophk | The system for comments needs to at least appear to be part of the site itself. | Sep 25 10:08 |
| *_Goblin (~goblin@2.217.88.122) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 10:08 | |
| iophk | js is just an unnecessary addon that interferes with privacy and security | Sep 25 10:08 |
| iophk | If a web developer can't code a service without js, then they probably have no business developing. | Sep 25 10:09 |
| iophk | js can be a nice extra, providing flourishes, but it should not ever be a prerequisite for using the service. | Sep 25 10:09 |
| iophk | There's just too much wrong with it. | Sep 25 10:09 |
| DaemonFC | I think the reason I'm having trouble finding a gently used Ford Taurus with low miles from around 2000-2004 is because people commute long distances, and these model years like to rust around the wheel wells and around the gas lid. | Sep 25 10:10 |
| DaemonFC | I will not buy a car that has rust on it, period. | Sep 25 10:10 |
| DaemonFC | At first it's just an eyesore, but eventually the damage is structural, and it's impossible to repair if you don't catch it right away. | Sep 25 10:11 |
| DaemonFC | Most people treat their cars as disposable, so they just let it rust. | Sep 25 10:11 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/_Goblin/status/382787069883346944 | Sep 25 10:11 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @_Goblin: @schestowitz But its proprietary gaming is it not which is making the impact with the users? | Sep 25 10:11 |
| roy_ | _Goblin: yes, better than proprietary on proprietary (Windows) | Sep 25 10:12 |
| DaemonFC | roy_, While I was at the dealership, I hopped into a brand new Ford Taurus SEL that was in the showroom. | Sep 25 10:12 |
| DaemonFC | I about died when I saw the price tag. $41,000 | Sep 25 10:12 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382786104493375488 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382786181261705216 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382792395399892992 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382793268456869888 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382793929600802816 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382794295419621376 | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: GNU/Linux Rapidly Becoming a Gaming Platform of Choice, Offering Better Performance http://t.co/Or0QAvtRF5 #games #gnu #linux | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | GNU/Linux Rapidly Becoming a Gaming Platform of Choice, Offering Better Performance | Techrights | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: Fighting for the #environment https://t.co/OdI5CS5vau | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: LinuxCon 2013 Shows That Linux is Becoming Big and Professional Like GNU http://t.co/s8vBzmug73 #gnu #linux #linuxcon | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | LinuxCon 2013 Shows That Linux is Becoming Big and Professional Like GNU | Techrights | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: PopSci doesn't want to hear back from angry readers http://t.co/cBCzb11bu3 | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> www.popsci.com | Why We're Shutting Off Our Comments | Popular Science | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: British press seemingly upset that in the #uk there is NO #censorship in some networks http://t.co/TkhYFLty6O http://t.co/vDOH1RpNB6 | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> www.theguardian.com | Porn, knives and drugs websites accessible on most public Wi-Fi | Technology | theguardian.com | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> www.telegraph.co.uk | Porn on most free public WiFi networks - Telegraph | Sep 25 10:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: When you 'help' people avoid ('protect' them) from 'bad' stuff you're basically imposing on them your own prejudices. | Sep 25 10:13 |
| DaemonFC | I'm sure that's part of the reason for the recent used vehicle price spike. (What it would cost to get something new these days.) | Sep 25 10:13 |
| DaemonFC | I was checking the going rates for cars like mine. I paid $2,000 in 2005, and I've put about 40,000 miles on it since then. | Sep 25 10:14 |
| DaemonFC | Even with the rust and bumper damage, I could list it for $1,100 and sell it within a few days right now. | Sep 25 10:14 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/alanbell_libsol/status/382794706783973376 | Sep 25 10:15 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @alanbell_libsol: @schestowitz an article that starts with "an investigation by security firm. . ." where the firm in question sells the solution . . . | Sep 25 10:15 |
| DaemonFC | I just never saw the point in agreeing to pay $30k+ for a new vehicle. | Sep 25 10:15 |
| DaemonFC | If you can pay $2,000 and get around from A to B for the next 10 years, why not just do that? | Sep 25 10:16 |
| DaemonFC | Even if you put another $2,000 into repairs, you're still paying less than $50 a month for your car. | Sep 25 10:16 |
| DaemonFC | roy_, One of my bumper stickers says "Honk if anything falls off." | Sep 25 10:17 |
| DaemonFC | Another one says "Laugh all you want. It's paid for." | Sep 25 10:17 |
| DaemonFC | I just don't get people. | Sep 25 10:18 |
| DaemonFC | Who wants to pay for something that loses half its value in the first two years, and then finance it so they end up paying an additional $10,000 to a bank? | Sep 25 10:18 |
| DaemonFC | I might check out that Cutlass if it's still there this afternoon. | Sep 25 10:21 |
| *Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@unaffiliated/cirrus-minor/x-6868843) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 10:21 | |
| DaemonFC | There's a lot of problems with buying a brand new car that nobody ever considers until they're stuck paying for it. | Sep 25 10:22 |
| MinceR | what problems? | Sep 25 10:23 |
| DaemonFC | There's the immediate depreciation, the finance charges, the extra $300 a year it takes to renew your plates, and the additional cost of insurance you have to have on it or else the bank won't agree to finance it. | Sep 25 10:23 |
| MinceR | or you could finance it yourself :> | Sep 25 10:23 |
| DaemonFC | Yeah, if you have $40,000 laying around. | Sep 25 10:23 |
| DaemonFC | You're still going to want to insure it or else you'll be eating it if you wreck. | Sep 25 10:23 |
| MinceR | as for the depreciation, that's the price of not having anyone to screw up and mishandle the car before you :> | Sep 25 10:24 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, That's why there's the two year old off-lease deals. | Sep 25 10:24 |
| MinceR | lease a new car and it eventually becomes yours? | Sep 25 10:24 |
| DaemonFC | The lease contracts that people sign lets them lease the car for two years, and then they're stuck with having to do all the scheduled maintenance and keep the mileage down, or they get fined when they turn it in. | Sep 25 10:25 |
| DaemonFC | So then it goes off lease, the company that made the car usually takes it back, replaces anything that needs replaced, slaps a limited warranty on it, and sells it for about half the original MSRP. | Sep 25 10:26 |
| MinceR | sounds like taking a loan to buy a new car, except with more restrictions | Sep 25 10:26 |
| DaemonFC | Yeah. You're not allowed to put more than 12,000 miles per year on it. | Sep 25 10:26 |
| DaemonFC | If you turn it in after two years with more than 24,000 miles on the odometer, you have to pay $1.50 for each mile you went over. | Sep 25 10:26 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, So the deal usually works out to something like... You pay $3,000 up front, then $175 a month for two years, then you turn it back in and pay the fee for any additional mileage, and then you get fined for any scheduled service you missed. | Sep 25 10:28 |
| DaemonFC | You have to be able to prove you go an oil change every 3,000 miles for example. | Sep 25 10:28 |
| DaemonFC | So you'd have to get stuck paying the dealer to change your oil to get the documentation. | Sep 25 10:28 |
| DaemonFC | That sucks because dealers charge about $35-40 to change the oil and filter. | Sep 25 10:28 |
| DaemonFC | You could go to Walmart and get the same service for about $26, but they won't accept that documentation. | Sep 25 10:29 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 10:29 |
| DaemonFC | Dealers charge more for every service out there, MinceR. | Sep 25 10:29 |
| DaemonFC | Like, I take my car to a shop called Daniels Automotive Repair. | Sep 25 10:30 |
| DaemonFC | They charge $69.99 for a coolant system flush and fill. | Sep 25 10:30 |
| DaemonFC | The local Ford dealer has "specials" where they charge $118 for that service, and it's normally about $150 at the Ford dealer. | Sep 25 10:30 |
| MinceR | they might do a better job and warrant the result, though | Sep 25 10:30 |
| MinceR | at least for a while, anyway | Sep 25 10:31 |
| DaemonFC | The only reason you'd go to the Ford dealer for any service is if your vehicle is under warranty. | Sep 25 10:31 |
| DaemonFC | Then it's Ford that's picking up the bill, so who cares? | Sep 25 10:31 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 10:31 |
| DaemonFC | Daniels gives you a 1 year, 12,000 mile warranty for all work they perform. | Sep 25 10:31 |
| DaemonFC | I had them put a new alternator on my car. | Sep 25 10:32 |
| DaemonFC | The new alternator failed after about 5 months *and* it ruined my battery too, which I didn't even buy from them. | Sep 25 10:32 |
| DaemonFC | I took it back and they replaced the alternator and battery at their expense. | Sep 25 10:32 |
| DaemonFC | I priced out getting an exhaust manifold replaced on a car I was thinking about buying a few weeks ago. | Sep 25 10:33 |
| DaemonFC | The Ford dealer said they'd want about $1,000 to repair that. | Sep 25 10:33 |
| DaemonFC | Daniels said they would do it for $650. | Sep 25 10:34 |
| DaemonFC | Just because it's a dealer does not mean they do better work. | Sep 25 10:34 |
| DaemonFC | It always comes down to what kind of mechanics they employ. | Sep 25 10:34 |
| DaemonFC | I guess you could argue that a Ford dealer specializes in Ford service, so they might be more up to speed about what's going on with Ford cars and trucks, but I've never had a problem with Daniels. | Sep 25 10:35 |
| DaemonFC | A Ford Taurus is a very popular car in the United States. There are tens of millions of them on the road. Almost any shop should have experience with them. | Sep 25 10:35 |
| MinceR | it also comes down to what extra information and tools they have access to | Sep 25 10:35 |
| MinceR | and how much they dare risk on bad mechanics if they have to warrant their work :> | Sep 25 10:36 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, Yeah. There's specialty tools that exist for most cars that only the dealers are supposed to have, but after market tool companies clone them and sell them to other shops. | Sep 25 10:36 |
| DaemonFC | So if your car is more than a couple of years old, the other shops have the necessary tools. | Sep 25 10:36 |
| MinceR | for electronics also? | Sep 25 10:37 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, Remember, the US federal and state governments use these cars as well. | Sep 25 10:37 |
| DaemonFC | Thanks to their sourcing requirements, they almost always demand that anything they use has a secondary market for parts. | Sep 25 10:38 |
| MinceR | :) | Sep 25 10:38 |
| DaemonFC | That's actually why Advanced Micro Devices was initially allowed to sell clones of Intel processors. | Sep 25 10:38 |
| MinceR | also for checking and resetting error conditions in the onboard computers? | Sep 25 10:38 |
| DaemonFC | The government didn't want to do business with Intel when Intel was the only supplier of x86 processors. | Sep 25 10:38 |
| DaemonFC | So they made Intel agree to let AMD clone their processors. | Sep 25 10:38 |
| DaemonFC | It keeps prices down. | Sep 25 10:38 |
| DaemonFC | Later on, AMD and Intel came to some agreements on their own because they both had essential patents for CPU features that they both wanted to use. | Sep 25 10:39 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, The OBD II standard is vendor-neutral. | Sep 25 10:40 |
| DaemonFC | You can use the same code scanner on any vehicle from any company that is OBD II compliant. | Sep 25 10:41 |
| DaemonFC | I believe they all have to support that because of US laws. | Sep 25 10:41 |
| DaemonFC | My car is actually so old that there is no OBD II port. | Sep 25 10:41 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, Anything older than model year 1996 uses an older version of OBD that is NOT neutral. | Sep 25 10:42 |
| DaemonFC | So you have to have code scanners that are specified to the manufacturer. | Sep 25 10:43 |
| DaemonFC | *specific | Sep 25 10:43 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, I went to a small car lot last week to check out a 1998 Mercury Sable LS station wagon. | Sep 25 10:45 |
| DaemonFC | I noticed that the Check Engine light was on. | Sep 25 10:45 |
| DaemonFC | The guy came out and read off the code. The code was "bad oxygen sensor reading". | Sep 25 10:46 |
| DaemonFC | So he cleared it and was trying to convince me that it "probably wouldn't return". | Sep 25 10:46 |
| DaemonFC | lol | Sep 25 10:46 |
| MinceR | ic | Sep 25 10:46 |
| DaemonFC | I told him "Hitting the clear button doesn't replace the O2 sensor.". | Sep 25 10:46 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Sep 25 10:46 |
| MinceR | :> | Sep 25 10:47 |
| DaemonFC | He said "Well, maybe the last owner had someone fix it that forgot to clear the code..." | Sep 25 10:47 |
| DaemonFC | So I said "And maybe they didn't." | Sep 25 10:47 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 10:47 |
| DaemonFC | A bad O2 sensor can cost you some money. | Sep 25 10:48 |
| DaemonFC | The Sable actually has three of them. | Sep 25 10:48 |
| DaemonFC | The intake sensors have to be replaced as a pair. | Sep 25 10:49 |
| DaemonFC | They're about $100 each and an hour of labor if you go to a shop. | Sep 25 10:49 |
| DaemonFC | You should replace both of them because you pay for an hour of labor either way and if the readings from both sensors are too far apart, the car will just start flashing the check engine light again. | Sep 25 10:50 |
| DaemonFC | Some people have the sensors replaced and the code comes back because the sensors were not actually bad. | Sep 25 10:51 |
| DaemonFC | The function of the sensors is to detect a lean or rich condition, so an intake leak could be causing it. | Sep 25 10:51 |
| DaemonFC | Now you're out $265 from replacing the sensors and that wan't what was wrong. :) | Sep 25 10:51 |
| MinceR | http://www.smosh.com/smosh-pit/photos/awesomely-awkward-iphone-autocorrects | Sep 25 10:53 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.smosh.com | Awesomely Awkward iPhone Autocorrects | SMOSH [ http://ur1.ca/fp50q ] | Sep 25 10:53 |
| DaemonFC | The reason there are two of them on the intake is because if you only have one, then it can be sending bad data to the ECM without throwing a code, because there's nothing to check the sensor's data against. | Sep 25 10:53 |
| DaemonFC | In that case ,your car will either run like shit or guzzle gas. | Sep 25 10:53 |
| DaemonFC | The check engine light might not even come on because it would only be triggered if the sensor is sending out of bounds data to the ECM. | Sep 25 10:54 |
| DaemonFC | So some vehicles only have one sensor and the only sign that the sensor is bad is that your car is running like shit and/or guzzling gas. | Sep 25 10:54 |
| DaemonFC | There's a lot of reasons why that could happen. | Sep 25 10:54 |
| DaemonFC | So a lot of people are running their car and getting bad gas mileage and not paying attention. | Sep 25 10:56 |
| DaemonFC | And the bad sensor is costing them an extra few hundred dollars per year worth of gasoline. | Sep 25 10:56 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 10:56 |
| DaemonFC | That's why you should keep an eye on your gas mileage. If you're getting bad mileage, you want to check for fuel leaks, or a leaking injector, and if that's not the problem, you'll want to swap out the oxygen sensor, because that's probably what's doing it. | Sep 25 10:57 |
| DaemonFC | I think that paying $150 to replace an oxygen sensor is better than having a gas guzzling car. | Sep 25 10:57 |
| DaemonFC | People were less concerned with their car guzzling gas when it was only $1 a gallon. | Sep 25 10:58 |
| DaemonFC | Now that it's $3.50-4 a gallon, more people are keeping an eye on that. | Sep 25 10:58 |
| DaemonFC | Another (sometimes) silent cause of bad gas mileage is worn spark plugs. | Sep 25 10:59 |
| DaemonFC | Those won't cause your car to guzzle, but they could be costing you a few mpg. | Sep 25 10:59 |
| DaemonFC | To keep your fuel costs down, it's better to replace your oxygen sensors and spark plugs every 100,000 miles or so. | Sep 25 11:00 |
| DaemonFC | That means that the average car owner will only have to worry about it once or twice during the lifetime of the car. | Sep 25 11:00 |
| DaemonFC | There's a few people that manage to get to 300,000 miles, but most people aren't that lucky. | Sep 25 11:01 |
| DaemonFC | I'd say that about one in three hundred cars or so is even capable of 300,000 if the owner maintains them properly. | Sep 25 11:01 |
| DaemonFC | My mom's '04 Impala has about 270,000 miles on it, but I'm constantly after her about maintaining it. | Sep 25 11:02 |
| DaemonFC | When her car is having problems, she hands me her debit card and tells me to get it fixed. | Sep 25 11:03 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Sep 25 11:03 |
| DaemonFC | She was noticing some "feedback" in the steering wheel and that her air conditioner would cut out when she went to turn a while back. | Sep 25 11:04 |
| DaemonFC | I asked "You did replace the serpentine belt on schedule?". | Sep 25 11:04 |
| DaemonFC | "The what?" | Sep 25 11:04 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 11:04 |
| DaemonFC | So I took it down to Daniels and had them replace the belt, and the tensioner and idler pulleys. | Sep 25 11:05 |
| DaemonFC | Since they were in there anyway, I also had them replace the water pump. | Sep 25 11:05 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, There's some things that people never replace, ever. | Sep 25 11:06 |
| DaemonFC | Even when the owners manual has it on the service schedule. | Sep 25 11:06 |
| DaemonFC | That's why I will not own a car that has a timing belt. | Sep 25 11:06 |
| DaemonFC | It costs like $400 or so to replace a timing belt. If you buy a car with just over 100,000 on it, do you think the last owner bothered to replace it? | Sep 25 11:07 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 11:07 |
| DaemonFC | Dave recently had to replace his fuel pump. | Sep 25 11:07 |
| DaemonFC | I told him it was his own fault, since he's always letting the gas tank get down to E before he refills the tank. | Sep 25 11:07 |
| DaemonFC | You should never let it get below an eighth of a tank. Not only because you risk running out of fuel, but because the pump has to work harder (it gets hotter) and may fail. | Sep 25 11:08 |
| DaemonFC | It also tends to start sucking in the sediment at the bottom of the tank into the fuel filter. | Sep 25 11:08 |
| DaemonFC | Some people run out of gas, then put more in and find that they can't start the car. | Sep 25 11:09 |
| DaemonFC | That's usually why. | Sep 25 11:09 |
| DaemonFC | At that point, you may have to pay to have the car towed to the shop, where they'll replace the fuel filter. | Sep 25 11:10 |
| DaemonFC | Then the car should start, but you're in for a $100 tow, a $40 filter, and an hour of shop time. | Sep 25 11:10 |
| DaemonFC | All because you had to run it to E. B-) | Sep 25 11:10 |
| DaemonFC | A fuel filter is one of those things that you could do yourself, but nobody actually wants to. | Sep 25 11:11 |
| DaemonFC | Who wants to get soaked in gasoline from the pressure on the fuel line? | Sep 25 11:11 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 11:11 |
| DaemonFC | Most owners manuals recommend fuel filter replacements every 50,000 miles, but I've never replaced one. | Sep 25 11:12 |
| DaemonFC | If you're buying good gasoline, you generally shouldn't have to. | Sep 25 11:12 |
| DaemonFC | I'm pretty picky about where I'll gas up because of that. | Sep 25 11:13 |
| *oiaohm (~oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 11:21 | |
| *_Goblin has quit (Quit: Leaving) | Sep 25 11:31 | |
| *DaemonFC has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) | Sep 25 11:39 | |
| iophk | http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/24/brazil-president-un-speech-nsa-surveillance | Sep 25 11:39 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.theguardian.com | Brazilian president Rousseff: US surveillance a 'breach of international law' | World news | The Guardian [ http://ur1.ca/fp5ri ] | Sep 25 11:39 |
| *sebsebseb has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) | Sep 25 11:44 | |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382810027192766464 | Sep 25 11:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: Free Speech is Dying as Censorship on the Internet Increases, Even in the West http://t.co/gTiXP7KM6r #censorship | Sep 25 11:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | Free Speech is Dying as Censorship on the Internet Increases, Even in the West | Techrights | Sep 25 11:47 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382816217645735936 | Sep 25 11:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: As the World ‘Progresses’ Protest is Being Banned in the United States and Its Allies http://t.co/ltf0xflCz0 #protest | Sep 25 11:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | As the World ‘Progresses’ Protest is Being Banned in the United States and Its Allies | Techrights | Sep 25 11:48 |
| *sebsebseb (~mageiause@fsf/member/sebsebseb) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 11:48 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 11:48 | |
| iophk | Sep 25 11:48 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 11:48 | |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: # | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | heh heh | Sep 25 11:48 |
| sebsebseb | MinceR: | Sep 25 11:49 |
| sebsebseb | MinceR: | Sep 25 11:49 |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 11:49 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 11:49 | |
| iophk | sebsebseb: found a location for your installfest yet? | Sep 25 11:53 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: the realy want these remasters | Sep 25 11:56 |
| sebsebseb | seems that may be difficult to do for MAGIEA | Sep 25 11:56 |
| iophk | why remasters? | Sep 25 11:57 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: i suggested local reops again, but this older guy really doens't seem too get the advantages etc | Sep 25 11:57 |
| sebsebseb | he also came up with a sily saying | Sep 25 11:57 |
| sebsebseb | too do with that last tie | Sep 25 11:57 |
| iophk | has he ever done a network install? | Sep 25 11:57 |
| sebsebseb | that baially translates to him thinking it's uessary | Sep 25 11:57 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: has he ever done a network install nope | Sep 25 11:57 |
| sebsebseb | as far as I know | Sep 25 11:57 |
| sebsebseb | did he even know what a remaster was untill the other two guys started going on about them at the meeting? nope doens't seem like it | Sep 25 11:57 |
| iophk | Do you have time to walk him though one? | Sep 25 11:58 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: if I was set up to show one maybe yeah | Sep 25 11:58 |
| sebsebseb | he wants remasters, because the Open Suse guy suggestd it | Sep 25 11:58 |
| sebsebseb | oh sure easy enough for him | Sep 25 11:58 |
| sebsebseb | use Open Suse studio to make it like he willl be doing | Sep 25 11:58 |
| sebsebseb | then this other guy had done remaster before for Ubuntu/Debian or whatever, but Magiea has loads of install options to | Sep 25 11:59 |
| sebsebseb | a re master isn't really needed muchhere | Sep 25 11:59 |
| sebsebseb | plus the idea of pre instaling apps that joe average and janeaerage may want bydefaut is really just putting junkware on when you think about it | Sep 25 11:59 |
| iophk | Yes, junkware is to be avoided. | Sep 25 11:59 |
| sebsebseb | security updates in the re master by dfault ok nice idea for Open Suse etc, but Maigea 4 will have only been out around a month, so there woud't be much to install from the repo's anyway | Sep 25 12:00 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: you can guess what apps they may want | Sep 25 12:00 |
| sebsebseb | ,but can't know for sure | Sep 25 12:00 |
| iophk | But adding one or two apps for the user is very good. If the user installs those apps himself, then he learns how. | Sep 25 12:00 |
| sebsebseb | and so col acstauly end up pre installing quite a few apps that no they don't actsally want | Sep 25 12:00 |
| iophk | That is part of the teaching / learning process. | Sep 25 12:00 |
| sebsebseb | y3p indeed | Sep 25 12:00 |
| sebsebseb | ,but their idea is just to gie out remasters on USB | Sep 25 12:00 |
| sebsebseb | let them take it home, and play, and come to LUG meeting for an instal maybe | Sep 25 12:01 |
| sebsebseb | and maybe do some installs at the event though | Sep 25 12:01 |
| iophk | However, the basic installation process is slow from optical media. | Sep 25 12:01 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yes we been through that | Sep 25 12:01 |
| sebsebseb | I sent emails trying to expain stuff | Sep 25 12:01 |
| sebsebseb | ,but he doens't seem to get it | Sep 25 12:01 |
| sebsebseb | he thinks my idea sounds complacted or whateer | Sep 25 12:02 |
| iophk | bad idea | Sep 25 12:02 |
| iophk | people will take the USB sticks | Sep 25 12:02 |
| iophk | and reformat them | Sep 25 12:02 |
| iophk | without looking at the linux installer | Sep 25 12:02 |
| iophk | Best to do all the installation at the installfest | Sep 25 12:02 |
| iophk | How long has he been using linux? | Sep 25 12:02 |
| sebsebseb | he wants to do things keep it simple stupid | Sep 25 12:02 |
| iophk | remaster is not simple | Sep 25 12:02 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah that's a point, peope coud just take the usb sticks re format them and use for something else | Sep 25 12:02 |
| iophk | the usb sticks also introduce complicated logistics | Sep 25 12:02 |
| iophk | who pays for them? | Sep 25 12:02 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: he is a ok with these other two guys making re masters and him not doing so | Sep 25 12:03 |
| iophk | how many is too few and how many is too many? | Sep 25 12:03 |
| sebsebseb | ,but it leaves me too do whateer for Mageia, or no Mageia it seems | Sep 25 12:03 |
| iophk | how do you guess the right amount? | Sep 25 12:03 |
| sebsebseb | well gettin some fro a compay at least | Sep 25 12:03 |
| sebsebseb | 3 | Sep 25 12:03 |
| sebsebseb | 30 | Sep 25 12:03 |
| sebsebseb | ,but yeah | Sep 25 12:03 |
| oiaohm | A usb duplicator is cheep. | Sep 25 12:03 |
| *DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@unaffiliated/daemonfc) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 12:03 | |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I am not happy abut stuff | Sep 25 12:03 |
| sebsebseb | these deisions | Sep 25 12:03 |
| iophk | oiaohm: dd | Sep 25 12:03 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: and how he goes and says I am all signging and dancing | Sep 25 12:04 |
| oiaohm | iophk: there are fpga versions that are faster than dd. | Sep 25 12:04 |
| sebsebseb | reffering to the locali repo's idea | Sep 25 12:04 |
| iophk | it would help if you did a test installfest even among yourselves with spare computers | Sep 25 12:04 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: looked that sayng up means he thins the idea is unessarey, beuase he doens't understnad obviosuly it seems | Sep 25 12:04 |
| iophk | that would introduce some realism | Sep 25 12:04 |
| iophk | How long has that fellow been using Linux? | Sep 25 12:04 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah maybe I will try and suggest that at the meeting or LUG or whatever | Sep 25 12:04 |
| sebsebseb | ,but where going to get people from for a test thing? | Sep 25 12:05 |
| iophk | use your spare computers | Sep 25 12:05 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: he's not realy that technical I think, he's getting old and comes to the LUG list for help | Sep 25 12:05 |
| sebsebseb | and got introduced to it a few years or so ago by someone | Sep 25 12:05 |
| iophk | or ask a friend or two to volunteer, but you can still use your spare computer | Sep 25 12:05 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: thing is he's kind of in charge of the whole thing now as well or is pretty muchnow so hmm | Sep 25 12:05 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: maybe I'll just say whatever, do whateer you want for other distors | Sep 25 12:06 |
| sebsebseb | ,but I am going to do things my way for Magiea usng offical Livemedia's and not remasters | Sep 25 12:06 |
| oiaohm | Really at the rate costs are coming down giving out comptuers on stick are becoming afforable. | Sep 25 12:07 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: he even sent us a email the other day, asking to confirm that the software woud come from offical repo's for the remasters | Sep 25 12:07 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I repiedand was like that's the least of our technical worrys, relying on only a remaster is an issue beause.... | Sep 25 12:08 |
| iophk | Maybe he would benefit from trying a netinstall himself | Sep 25 12:08 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yep indeed that's what I am thinking baically to kindof | Sep 25 12:08 |
| sebsebseb | well I am thinking more like maybe he would benefit | Sep 25 12:09 |
| sebsebseb | from actuay installing Magiea himself from say the clasical installer or somethng ike that | Sep 25 12:09 |
| sebsebseb | even if just in a vm | Sep 25 12:09 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I am the one that's mant to know about Magiea, good ways to insttall it etc | Sep 25 12:09 |
| sebsebseb | they haven't een installed it before as far as I know | Sep 25 12:09 |
| sebsebseb | also just, because a remaster works well for one distro or two, doen't mean it's going to work well for all! | Sep 25 12:10 |
| iophk | now is the time to do it before there is a time crunch | Sep 25 12:10 |
| sebsebseb | a time crunch? | Sep 25 12:10 |
| iophk | run out of time | Sep 25 12:10 |
| iophk | the network thing can be thought through | Sep 25 12:10 |
| iophk | even if they use optical media or usb sticks for the installation, there will still be a need to get online and contact a repository | Sep 25 12:11 |
| iophk | that makes the LAN a bottleneck | Sep 25 12:11 |
| iophk | the way around that bottleneck is to have a repository local to the LAN | Sep 25 12:11 |
| iophk | if you have that you may as well do a netinstall because it is faster | Sep 25 12:11 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: QA woan was like, Magia's installer is more flexible | Sep 25 12:11 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: maybe he's just not famiuar with it | Sep 25 12:11 |
| iophk | probably not familiar with it. Got to walk him through an installation | Sep 25 12:12 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yes maybeI shoulddothat ortry to | Sep 25 12:12 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I wonder if he is at hte LUG meeting on Saturday hmm | Sep 25 12:12 |
| sebsebseb | with Magiea got loads of intal options | Sep 25 12:12 |
| sebsebseb | more so than Ubuntu or Mint or OPen Suse | Sep 25 12:12 |
| iophk | Can it do kickstart or preseed? | Sep 25 12:12 |
| sebsebseb | what's that? | Sep 25 12:13 |
| iophk | That is a file on the CD or DVD or USB stick that has several pre-configured options. | Sep 25 12:13 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: not sure what you mean quite, but mayb you do mean the clasical installer | Sep 25 12:13 |
| sebsebseb | that people an pick loads of options | Sep 25 12:14 |
| iophk | If you know that certain menus will always be answered the same way, you can put the answers in the kickstart file. | Sep 25 12:14 |
| sebsebseb | is it a desktop, is it a server, is it a work staiotn, etc | Sep 25 12:14 |
| sebsebseb | what de'sdo you want instaled etc | Sep 25 12:14 |
| sebsebseb | is that what you mean basically? | Sep 25 12:14 |
| iophk | not really | Sep 25 12:14 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: re master is dificut you say | Sep 25 12:14 |
| iophk | if you are doing a lot of desktops with the same partition layout for example | Sep 25 12:14 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: to make | Sep 25 12:14 |
| iophk | you can use kickstart | Sep 25 12:14 |
| iophk | or if you are setting up the same user accounts | Sep 25 12:15 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I hae a feeling it may be for this distro , depending on what that program realy is ike tou se | Sep 25 12:15 |
| iophk | or adding the same applications post-install | Sep 25 12:15 |
| iophk | but really I would stick with the stock image and walk users through manual installation; | Sep 25 12:15 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: they can ue re master for the other distros I don't care | Sep 25 12:15 |
| iophk | If they need handholding for the installation, hand holding for installing the first app or two will be good also | Sep 25 12:15 |
| sebsebseb | it's Magiea what I care about | Sep 25 12:15 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: however now there's more of an idea, that it may not be so much instals | Sep 25 12:16 |
| sebsebseb | ,but rather just people tkaing USB's etc | Sep 25 12:16 |
| iophk | yes stick with mageia and ubuntu for your choices, have the users choose desktop environment only | Sep 25 12:16 |
| sebsebseb | and comin back to us later | Sep 25 12:16 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: it's not me making all these decisisons | Sep 25 12:16 |
| iophk | how many years later | Sep 25 12:16 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: there's this guy who wants Open Suse etc | Sep 25 12:16 |
| sebsebseb | he's going to make a re master of that | Sep 25 12:16 |
| sebsebseb | and show us on the 10th etc | Sep 25 12:16 |
| sebsebseb | he was one that started off the whole re master idea in fact | Sep 25 12:17 |
| iophk | walk him through mageia on the 10th then too | Sep 25 12:17 |
| sebsebseb | since appparnatly it was so easy to make with Open Suse stuido | Sep 25 12:17 |
| iophk | you don't have to let him run over you guys but it will take a bit of tact | Sep 25 12:17 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: he was going to show us some stuff with remasters or whatever | Sep 25 12:17 |
| iophk | Suse is a bad option | Sep 25 12:17 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: then this old guy who doesn't seem to be that technial actsauy | Sep 25 12:17 |
| iophk | Yes but when he shows you whatever also show him your plan | Sep 25 12:17 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: is the co ordinater or whatever | Sep 25 12:18 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: and he's ok with other peope doing the techset up | Sep 25 12:18 |
| sebsebseb | ,but he thinks we can all just go with a re master, andno loal repo's | Sep 25 12:18 |
| sebsebseb | he thinks we can al just do do remasterd USB sticks | Sep 25 12:18 |
| iophk | I thought he was leaving the tech issues to the others? | Sep 25 12:18 |
| sebsebseb | I think he shuld leavev us alone to do our own thing or whateer distors | Sep 25 12:19 |
| sebsebseb | Open Suse guy does his thing | Sep 25 12:19 |
| iophk | +1 | Sep 25 12:19 |
| sebsebseb | the other guy does Debian/Ubuntu or whatever he's doing | Sep 25 12:19 |
| iophk | except no Suse for the visitors, keep it simple: Mageia or Ubuntu | Sep 25 12:19 |
| sebsebseb | and I do things my way for Mageia | Sep 25 12:19 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I did suggest that no Open Suse bfore or kin of, but once I sot of aid coul do it as well | Sep 25 12:20 |
| sebsebseb | I think Open Suse will be in though | Sep 25 12:20 |
| sebsebseb | ,beause of this guy | Sep 25 12:20 |
| iophk | I'm sure that can be avoided. | Sep 25 12:20 |
| iophk | The choices have to be kept simple | Sep 25 12:20 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: older guy thinks the distros aren't that important | Sep 25 12:20 |
| sebsebseb | he just think it's all Linux really | Sep 25 12:20 |
| iophk | The users should not worry about distros only about choosing between DEs | Sep 25 12:20 |
| sebsebseb | yeah, but looks like it might not end up bein quite so simpel | Sep 25 12:21 |
| sebsebseb | not sure yet | Sep 25 12:21 |
| sebsebseb | haven't deicided stufff like that properly yet | Sep 25 12:21 |
| sebsebseb | meant to do that on the 10th | Sep 25 12:21 |
| sebsebseb | ,but so far peope have been like re mater re master re master! | Sep 25 12:22 |
| sebsebseb | at the last meeting | Sep 25 12:22 |
| iophk | Too many choices will only stress out visitors | Sep 25 12:22 |
| iophk | Show the netinstall on the 10th | Sep 25 12:22 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: sure, but now there's this idea that ight not atsualy do that many installs | Sep 25 12:22 |
| sebsebseb | need a router or whateer for net instal to andethernet cables I Think, I don't know how to do a net install or a re master reay at the moment | Sep 25 12:22 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: more like shw something this Saturdya maybe to, if they turn up at the normal LUG meeting hmm | Sep 25 12:23 |
| iophk | Just need a net connection for the netinstall, but it helps if it is fast | Sep 25 12:24 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: it's at a pub | Sep 25 12:24 |
| sebsebseb | so wel | Sep 25 12:24 |
| sebsebseb | the wifi there is so not good enough | Sep 25 12:24 |
| sebsebseb | the LUG meeting I mean | Sep 25 12:24 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: so you have never done a repository mirror. | Sep 25 12:24 |
| sebsebseb | indeed | Sep 25 12:24 |
| sebsebseb | or a re master | Sep 25 12:25 |
| iophk | Hmm. If you set up one notebook as a tether — it connects to the wifi and then the installation computer connects to it via ethernet | Sep 25 12:25 |
| sebsebseb | a tether, through mobilephone | Sep 25 12:25 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: Yes have done netinstall from fake internet setup. | Sep 25 12:25 |
| sebsebseb | what do you mean? | Sep 25 12:25 |
| sebsebseb | USB sticks is keeping things keep it simple stupid | Sep 25 12:26 |
| sebsebseb | ,but they don't have to be rematers really surely | Sep 25 12:26 |
| sebsebseb | why put junkware on ? | Sep 25 12:26 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: funny enough no USB sticks can drive you more nuts on some of these more moden secure boots. | Sep 25 12:26 |
| sebsebseb | I mean the ida i to put say Jitsi in them instead of Skpe and things lik that | Sep 25 12:26 |
| sebsebseb | stuff average people may want | Sep 25 12:26 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: what was that? | Sep 25 12:26 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: factory installation imaging is done by network. | Sep 25 12:26 |
| sebsebseb | idea is to hopefly get ol d XP comps and such | Sep 25 12:26 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I fee like oh if ony people such as you, were organising this thng as well | Sep 25 12:27 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: some of the windows 8 machines are simpler to overwrite from pxe servered installers. | Sep 25 12:27 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: people who actsauy properly know what they are on about when it comes to thisstuff,but no that doesn't seem to be the case unfortunatlly | Sep 25 12:27 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: some windows 8 machines in fact don't start usb controller until after OS has started. | Sep 25 12:28 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: yeah Windows 8 may be a issue | Sep 25 12:28 |
| sebsebseb | may have to refuse to do anythng with those | Sep 25 12:28 |
| sebsebseb | if we get ay | Sep 25 12:28 |
| sebsebseb | any | Sep 25 12:28 |
| sebsebseb | idea is to do something beore the XP end of life | Sep 25 12:28 |
| iophk | also some vista8 machines will have the bios /uefi set to lock out other OSes | Sep 25 12:28 |
| sebsebseb | target old computers etc | Sep 25 12:28 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah I know | Sep 25 12:28 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I thin I should maybe show him a standad Magiea intal in virtualbox | Sep 25 12:30 |
| sebsebseb | or something | Sep 25 12:30 |
| sebsebseb | I don't know | Sep 25 12:30 |
| iophk | oiaohm: pxe would be a good way to launch netinstall | Sep 25 12:30 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I think everyone shoul be left alone to do it their way | Sep 25 12:30 |
| sebsebseb | main thing is to get some sort of install medai on a USB | Sep 25 12:31 |
| sebsebseb | ,but we can all do that | Sep 25 12:31 |
| sebsebseb | and thenthere are differneces between distros etc | Sep 25 12:31 |
| iophk | load up Mageia in vb with on vb for standard mageia, one for xfce and one for kde | Sep 25 12:31 |
| sebsebseb | MinceR: well I can show de's on my netbook itself | Sep 25 12:31 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: ,but the instal should be shown how easy it is or something | Sep 25 12:31 |
| sebsebseb | or the classical or whateer hmm | Sep 25 12:31 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: or I could take screen shots, and go through a slide show in KDE as the background or something :D | Sep 25 12:32 |
| sebsebseb | showing stuff or uh | Sep 25 12:32 |
| sebsebseb | thisis annoying | Sep 25 12:32 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: keep it simple stupid uh right | Sep 25 12:32 |
| sebsebseb | ,but I have a feeling making a re master will be far from KISS for Mageia | Sep 25 12:32 |
| oiaohm | iophk: the question most people fail to ask is how do OEM install their machines. | Sep 25 12:32 |
| sebsebseb | apparatlly got to use the stanard tool, that the normal ISO's get made in | Sep 25 12:32 |
| sebsebseb | too doit | Sep 25 12:32 |
| oiaohm | iophk: most OEM use PXE with motherboards with onboard networking. | Sep 25 12:33 |
| sebsebseb | or somethng else maybe | Sep 25 12:33 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: I also fear doing install fests. | Sep 25 12:33 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: oh ? | Sep 25 12:33 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: mostly due to the odd ball custom hardware that can turn up that does not work. | Sep 25 12:33 |
| sebsebseb | sure | Sep 25 12:33 |
| sebsebseb | ,but that's why there's this idea | Sep 25 12:33 |
| sebsebseb | to | Sep 25 12:33 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: Yes over here we have a lot of 1 off laptop makes. | Sep 25 12:33 |
| sebsebseb | just try mainy now possbiy | Sep 25 12:34 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: ie companies order laptops with there own company brands on them. | Sep 25 12:34 |
| sebsebseb | here's part of an email someone sent | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | ,but | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | you'll get what I mean by try from this i think | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: iophk | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | We are implying this is an install fest where you bring your Pc we will install it and get then up and running. | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | Nope... not going to happen | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | It should be implied ... | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | 1) bring their PC | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | 2) try out some of the linux variants we have on USB on their PC | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | 3) if they like what we see take a usb with one of the variants to see how they get on... | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | 4) if they wish to peruse it further come to a LUGS meeting and we will help them to install. | Sep 25 12:35 |
| sebsebseb | KISS principal.... | Sep 25 12:35 |
| MinceR | sebsebseb: | Sep 25 12:36 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: iophk yeah that sounds good doesnt it? ^^^^^ | Sep 25 12:36 |
| DaemonFC | Off to go buy that Oldsmobile. | Sep 25 12:36 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 12:36 |
| DaemonFC | bbiab | Sep 25 12:36 |
| sebsebseb | so in other words may not be doing many installs in that case | Sep 25 12:36 |
| sebsebseb | at the event itself, if doing things that way | Sep 25 12:36 |
| iophk | right, but use the live CDs to test whether their hardware can handle it | Sep 25 12:36 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah or the re masered USB's | Sep 25 12:37 |
| sebsebseb | I think that's the idea | Sep 25 12:37 |
| oiaohm | The other problem I have had with livecd and usb is failures. | Sep 25 12:37 |
| sebsebseb | use the remasterd USB's to tet stuff, or possbiyofficcial LIve Media | Sep 25 12:37 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: as for the point of them taking back and then reformatting the USB stick for use for someting else | Sep 25 12:38 |
| sebsebseb | well yeah that may happen, but so be it I guess | Sep 25 12:38 |
| oiaohm | netboot with pxe is fair much dependable on anything Pent II/Pent III | Sep 25 12:38 |
| iophk | +1 for PXE | Sep 25 12:38 |
| iophk | again | Sep 25 12:38 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: iophk I think I won't get any assitance getting a local repos set up etc | Sep 25 12:39 |
| sebsebseb | since they want re masters | Sep 25 12:39 |
| sebsebseb | and I am not a network guy etc | Sep 25 12:39 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: you can run iso images from pxe as well. | Sep 25 12:39 |
| sebsebseb | so unforutnatly even though it's a good idea | Sep 25 12:39 |
| sebsebseb | realistially it lookslike the loal repo's etc is out | Sep 25 12:39 |
| *DaemonFC has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | Sep 25 12:39 | |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: you can run your normall install images from pxe. | Sep 25 12:39 |
| sebsebseb | pxe sounds vaguely failur | Sep 25 12:40 |
| sebsebseb | ,but what's that? | Sep 25 12:40 |
| oiaohm | pxe is the protocol behind network booting. | Sep 25 12:40 |
| iophk | PXE is a nice security hole that allows a boot image to be served over the net | Sep 25 12:40 |
| sebsebseb | oh | Sep 25 12:40 |
| iophk | it uses tftp | Sep 25 12:40 |
| iophk | You can use it to serve up regular ISO images, too | Sep 25 12:41 |
| sebsebseb | I think using USB'sCD's/DVD's is praby the more simpe way of doing thngs | Sep 25 12:41 |
| sebsebseb | however I did suggest having local repo's as well | Sep 25 12:41 |
| sebsebseb | only too get the stupid saying hmm | Sep 25 12:41 |
| sebsebseb | in response | Sep 25 12:41 |
| iophk | Unless you are on a decent network local repos will be important. | Sep 25 12:41 |
| sebsebseb | I suggested havingboth to be more prepard for al install situatons etc | Sep 25 12:41 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: well that guy and the others I guess too then, don't seem to understand that | Sep 25 12:42 |
| iophk | Have to show them | Sep 25 12:42 |
| iophk | With computers, people are really bad at visualising the possibliities | Sep 25 12:42 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: http://ipxe.org/ | Sep 25 12:42 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | ipxe.org | iPXE - open source boot firmware [start] | Sep 25 12:42 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I think there thinking is, use the re master, have the security updates already on the remaster up to the date it was made, and some other apps and give that too people | Sep 25 12:42 |
| iophk | Only when they have hands-on experience do they get it. | Sep 25 12:42 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: in other words no downloadsat the event of stuff | Sep 25 12:43 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: network boot from http servers is particular cool. | Sep 25 12:43 |
| iophk | How will the users install an app of their choosing then? | Sep 25 12:43 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: they won''t | Sep 25 12:43 |
| iophk | You really do have to give them practice with installing their own app. | Sep 25 12:43 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: unless they do so at home | Sep 25 12:43 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: network boot is about your only option if you want to offer more than 1 distrobution. | Sep 25 12:43 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: they don't understand that it seems | Sep 25 12:43 |
| iophk | That's a scary unknown until they have done it the first time. | Sep 25 12:43 |
| iophk | Trust me on that | Sep 25 12:43 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: mass if installation discs is how to get confused. | Sep 25 12:44 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: they think it's ok to just give them a load ofstuff pre installed in a re master | Sep 25 12:44 |
| iophk | That's bad. They'll feel dumped on. | Sep 25 12:44 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I agree it's good for them too larn how to instal somethng, or pratice | Sep 25 12:44 |
| sebsebseb | henc local repo's or intenret i f goo enough at venue | Sep 25 12:44 |
| sebsebseb | ,but these guys don't get that it seems | Sep 25 12:44 |
| iophk | They have to know through experience that they can install an app themselves | Sep 25 12:44 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I guess there is that these are peple who won't really want to learn | Sep 25 12:44 |
| sebsebseb | and just want too be set up by defaut | Sep 25 12:45 |
| sebsebseb | and so a remaster | Sep 25 12:45 |
| iophk | Most of what an installfest is about is the handholding for beginners. | Sep 25 12:45 |
| sebsebseb | there idea above | Sep 25 12:45 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: remaster can be the worst mistake ever. | Sep 25 12:45 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: there is the odd case of the bad driver. | Sep 25 12:45 |
| iophk | If they didn't want the extra help they would have just stayed home and burned their own DVD | Sep 25 12:45 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: sounds ike it may jut be a try thing and giving out USB's fest mainy | Sep 25 12:45 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: even wth a re master, they ma want to download somethng at event realy | Sep 25 12:46 |
| sebsebseb | some other package | Sep 25 12:46 |
| sebsebseb | or look around | Sep 25 12:46 |
| sebsebseb | I know al this stuff | Sep 25 12:46 |
| iophk | AMD64 or i386 images? | Sep 25 12:46 |
| sebsebseb | but these guys dn't seem to get it | Sep 25 12:46 |
| oiaohm | iophk: XP time frame both are required. | Sep 25 12:46 |
| iophk | Again you have to show them | Sep 25 12:46 |
| sebsebseb | I have even thought about that 32bit or 64bit I think most installs woul be 32bit | Sep 25 12:46 |
| oiaohm | This is my problem we are talking lots of images. | Sep 25 12:46 |
| sebsebseb | ,but good to have some 64bit | Sep 25 12:46 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: I think to be prepared I shoud have all the images for Mageia :d | Sep 25 12:47 |
| iophk | Handing out images on USB sticks requires too much logisitcs | Sep 25 12:47 |
| sebsebseb | everything | Sep 25 12:47 |
| sebsebseb | all 7 or hwateve it is | Sep 25 12:47 |
| sebsebseb | 32bit and 64bit and even the dual CD | Sep 25 12:47 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: problem is what will do if you run out of USB sticks | Sep 25 12:47 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: hpopefuly this LInux related company will sponser the event, they are trying to find out | Sep 25 12:47 |
| iophk | PXE can serve up Grub and offer a menu with choices | Sep 25 12:47 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: or end up with a huge stock pile left over. | Sep 25 12:47 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: and hopefuly they wll atay send some guys to help us | Sep 25 12:47 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: now these are peope who know LInux et :) | Sep 25 12:48 |
| sebsebseb | etc | Sep 25 12:48 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: the PXE netboot options are worth looking at. | Sep 25 12:48 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: well will have Live CD's and wat not too I think | Sep 25 12:48 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: ,but yeah I am thinking at the moment, we need more USB stick | Sep 25 12:48 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: a horible 1G 32 bit computer can be the server to network boot 20 machines at once. | Sep 25 12:48 |
| iophk | Do you have a spare machine at home? | Sep 25 12:49 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: yes I know and I Tried to explain to these guys, but they don't get it, it seems | Sep 25 12:49 |
| iophk | Or at work? | Sep 25 12:49 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: including livecd image hosted on the server. | Sep 25 12:49 |
| oiaohm | iophk: I have used a laptop. | Sep 25 12:49 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I was giving some kind of mini desktop PC, needs a harddisk in it | Sep 25 12:49 |
| oiaohm | iophk: a windows laptop. | Sep 25 12:49 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: it's old , but useable | Sep 25 12:49 |
| oiaohm | iophk: yes wrong windows laptop installing Linux machines. | Sep 25 12:49 |
| iophk | Can it do PXE booting? The settings will be in the BIOS | Sep 25 12:50 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: probably not even had that one on yet | Sep 25 12:50 |
| iophk | You turn it on, do the install, then restore the settings to off. | Sep 25 12:50 |
| *sebsebseb needs to ix his normal desktop too, but that's something else | Sep 25 12:50 | |
| iophk | For your PXE/tftp/dhcp server, I would recommend dnsmasq | Sep 25 12:51 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: oiaohm I think with this whole event an issue at times,is that got some older guy in charge,who thinks he knows best at times,when he doesn't | Sep 25 12:51 |
| sebsebseb | to be honest the whole thing is annoing me at the moment | Sep 25 12:51 |
| sebsebseb | since can't even properly havepeoplelooking through the pros and cons | Sep 25 12:51 |
| sebsebseb | of the techoptons | Sep 25 12:51 |
| sebsebseb | other than myself it seems so faruh | Sep 25 12:51 |
| sebsebseb | and then he sends a email too confirm if stuff is from ofial repo's uh, when there is other techstuff, that shou be thought about and consideredproperly, and al that uh | Sep 25 12:52 |
| iophk | is there a white board where you can draw a matrix of the options and their pros and cons? | Sep 25 12:53 |
| sebsebseb | and this channel gets publically logged, maybe I'll regret saying some of the stufff in here today, but freedom of speech I guess | Sep 25 12:53 |
| sebsebseb | in here today, one day, above | Sep 25 12:54 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I just hope we can get some other volunteers on board soon, and ones that are qute technial, and know about htis kind of stuff | Sep 25 12:54 |
| sebsebseb | that could then sove some tech issues nicely and properly :) | Sep 25 12:55 |
| sebsebseb | I think in fact I am not being taken as seriosuy as I shou be by certain people | Sep 25 12:55 |
| sebsebseb | ,beause I am reasoanbly young still andsuch | Sep 25 12:55 |
| iophk | you should actively recruit a person or two to help you | Sep 25 12:55 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah wel it seems might hav lost one vouunteer atsuay | Sep 25 12:56 |
| sebsebseb | not suire qite | Sep 25 12:56 |
| sebsebseb | but yeah shoud try and get some more from the LUG meeting this Saturday I Think :) | Sep 25 12:56 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: maybe evenif it's just a new person to the LUG meeting, there's one coming appanratly, no idea who that is yet, but yeah | Sep 25 12:56 |
| sebsebseb | he may want to help out for examle | Sep 25 12:56 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I think need a few peole mor eto hep idealy yeah, 4 isn't reall much, inluding myself uh | Sep 25 12:57 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: good to have more coing to the organisers meetings | Sep 25 12:57 |
| iophk | find someone to set up PXE booting and grub with a selection of ISO images | Sep 25 12:59 |
| oiaohm | iophk: http://tftpd32.jounin.net/ On windows. | Sep 25 12:59 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | tftpd32.jounin.net | TFTPD32 : an opensource IPv6 ready TFTP server/service for windows : TFTP server | Sep 25 12:59 |
| oiaohm | iophk: yep that is dhcp and tftp in one roll in appache something for windows and you are rocking. | Sep 25 12:59 |
| iophk | It would be easier and safer to set up on Linux or BSD | Sep 25 13:00 |
| iophk | also trying to use Windows would look bad, in addition to being difficult | Sep 25 13:00 |
| oiaohm | iophk: at the time the windows computer was the only one that was not broken. | Sep 25 13:00 |
| oiaohm | Yes the last resort option. | Sep 25 13:01 |
| iophk | windows == broken :P | Sep 25 13:01 |
| oiaohm | iophk: Ok it booted. | Sep 25 13:01 |
| oiaohm | iophk: I had the fun of a broken kernel package somehow evilly installing. | Sep 25 13:01 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: any computer will do to run a PXE setup. | Sep 25 13:02 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: Linux/bsd will be better don't run into windows stupid conneciton limits. | Sep 25 13:02 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: the major advantage of the PXE solution is you don't risk it being nicked bit by bit as the day goes on. | Sep 25 13:07 |
| iophk | or scratched and scuffed | Sep 25 13:11 |
| oiaohm | worst I have done is gone threw a few network cables. | Sep 25 13:13 |
| oiaohm | using PXE solutions. | Sep 25 13:13 |
| oiaohm | Ok I am a cabler I have the tools to re do the ends in my car. | Sep 25 13:13 |
| iophk | I guess it to be careful you need extra cables and to lock up all the spare parts not in use. | Sep 25 13:13 |
| iophk | cable smith | Sep 25 13:14 |
| iophk | I bet if you tape the cables down to the table they will be less likely to wander off. | Sep 25 13:14 |
| oiaohm | iophk: if you really sus hot glued to switch. | Sep 25 13:15 |
| oiaohm | Yes it possible to do PXE systems that are really hard to walk off with without tools. | Sep 25 13:16 |
| oiaohm | Best I have seen is lockable tool box with g clamp hole out bottom grommits around the cables with switch and server inside. | Sep 25 13:18 |
| oiaohm | iophk: Yes thief has to walk off with complete table. | Sep 25 13:18 |
| *cubezzz has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) | Sep 25 13:20 | |
| *sebsebseb has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 13:33 | |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382845839674466304 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382821074737844224 | Sep 25 13:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: Linux Back Door Question Revisited in the Age of Government #Surveillance Crimes http://t.co/yjUUISoUXA #nvidia #amd #linux #nsa | Sep 25 13:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | Linux Back Door Question Revisited in the Age of Government Surveillance Crimes | Techrights | Sep 25 13:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: Public Services and Government Branches Compelled to Adopt Free/Libre Software http://t.co/L1iMxI8vfF #egov #freedom | Sep 25 13:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | Public Services and Government Branches Compelled to Adopt Free/Libre Software | Techrights | Sep 25 13:37 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/_Goblin/status/382797844769292288 https://twitter.com/_Goblin/status/382798058469085184 | Sep 25 13:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @_Goblin: @schestowitz Agreed, although by some (not you) my views on proprietary gaming were dismissed all those years ago...Seems I was right. | Sep 25 13:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @_Goblin: @schestowitz For the mainstream,Opensrc is just not the ticket for gaming...sure there's some great titles, but proprietary is where its at. | Sep 25 13:37 |
| *sebsebseb (~mageiause@fsf/member/sebsebseb) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 13:48 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 13:48 | |
| *oiaohm has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 14:13 | |
| *Cirrus_Minor has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) | Sep 25 14:20 | |
| *abeNd-org (~Keith@216.201.219.82) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 14:25 | |
| *DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@unaffiliated/daemonfc) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 14:42 | |
| DaemonFC | Didn't buy the Olds. | Sep 25 14:43 |
| DaemonFC | The car had numerous problems. | Sep 25 14:43 |
| DaemonFC | The engine was ticking. | Sep 25 14:43 |
| DaemonFC | Could have been an exhaust leak or a sticky lifter. | Sep 25 14:43 |
| DaemonFC | Either way, I don't want to find out. | Sep 25 14:43 |
| DaemonFC | If you're not supposed to take gifts that are ticking, why should you pay for something that's ticking? | Sep 25 14:44 |
| DaemonFC | Am I right, MinceR? Of course I'm right. | Sep 25 14:44 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4089796951.html | Sep 25 14:45 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1993 Toyota Camry LE 143.000 MILES [ http://ur1.ca/fp8ey ] | Sep 25 14:45 |
| DaemonFC | That may be worth looking into. | Sep 25 14:45 |
| MinceR | you don't buy clocks? :> | Sep 25 14:45 |
| DaemonFC | It's got 143,000 miles, but it's a Toyota. | Sep 25 14:45 |
| DaemonFC | I've seen those things going to 400,000 and over. | Sep 25 14:45 |
| DaemonFC | You almost never see a Ford or Chevy do that. | Sep 25 14:46 |
| MinceR | :> | Sep 25 14:46 |
| DaemonFC | Anything other than a Japanese car that has over 120, you don't really want to look much further unless it's dirt cheap. | Sep 25 14:46 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, "I'm in a union, I can scratch my butt and put engines together backwards all day long and you can't fire me!" | Sep 25 14:46 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 14:47 |
| DaemonFC | "Recall? Why would we recall it for an engine compartment fire? It's a Chevy, the engine is supposed to catch fire. In fact, you should really pay us $500 more for the engine that catches fire option package!" | Sep 25 14:48 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4088743874.html | Sep 25 14:51 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1989 honda rebel [ http://ur1.ca/fp8i6 ] | Sep 25 14:51 |
| DaemonFC | That's a nice bike. | Sep 25 14:51 |
| DaemonFC | Unfortunately, Indiana has some harsh winters. | Sep 25 14:51 |
| DaemonFC | So you can't drive it for a few months out of the year. | Sep 25 14:52 |
| DaemonFC | That's why I never looked in to getting a motorcycle license. | Sep 25 14:52 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4088628794.html | Sep 25 14:52 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | S10 [ http://ur1.ca/fp8io ] | Sep 25 14:52 |
| DaemonFC | I'd be tired of having a truck in my front yard that didn't run. | Sep 25 14:52 |
| DaemonFC | At that point, it's just a really expensive lawn ornament. | Sep 25 14:53 |
| DaemonFC | I might call down to that Gary's auto sales. | Sep 25 14:55 |
| DaemonFC | He had a Taurus that looked like it was an 00-03 maybe. | Sep 25 14:55 |
| DaemonFC | Sticker said $1900. | Sep 25 14:55 |
| DaemonFC | I'm pretty sure it's a pile of crap at that price, but what the hell? | Sep 25 14:55 |
| DaemonFC | It's right down the street from me. | Sep 25 14:55 |
| MinceR | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMGIbOGu8q0&feature=youtu.be | Sep 25 14:56 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | That Mitchell and Webb Look: Homeopathic A&E - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fp8ki ] | Sep 25 14:56 |
| DaemonFC | Nobody maintains their vehicles as well as I do. | Sep 25 14:56 |
| DaemonFC | That idiot with the Oldsmobile fucking put like 6-7 quarts of oil in it. | Sep 25 14:56 |
| DaemonFC | A 3.1 liter GM 60 degree V6 should have 4.5 quarts in it. | Sep 25 14:56 |
| DaemonFC | With it being that overfilled, it's a wonder it hasn't blown a head gasket or something yet. | Sep 25 14:57 |
| DaemonFC | Surprisingly, the coolant and transmission fluid checked out OK. | Sep 25 14:57 |
| DaemonFC | It's always nice to see someone maintaining their transmission. | Sep 25 14:57 |
| DaemonFC | Most used cars, you pull the dipstick and there's this black shit all over it. | Sep 25 14:58 |
| DaemonFC | At that point, you have to wonder when the transmission will fail. | Sep 25 14:58 |
| DaemonFC | Probably soon. | Sep 25 14:58 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4082105817.html | Sep 25 15:00 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 92' Chevy Lumina [ http://ur1.ca/fp8mz ] | Sep 25 15:00 |
| DaemonFC | Cracked windshield. | Sep 25 15:00 |
| *jono (~jono@ubuntu/member/jono) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 15:00 | |
| DaemonFC | Like anyone in their right mind is going to put a new $600 windshield in an $800 car. | Sep 25 15:00 |
| DaemonFC | I asked that sales guy at City Ford if he'd look into a Chevy Malibu for me. | Sep 25 15:08 |
| DaemonFC | He just called back and said it's a giant pile of crap. | Sep 25 15:08 |
| DaemonFC | So I asked him to look into that Ford Freestar van. | Sep 25 15:08 |
| DaemonFC | Told him "Hey, I noticed it's been on your lot since August. If you can make me a deal on it, I might be able to take it off your hands." | Sep 25 15:09 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 15:09 |
| DaemonFC | He said the Carfax says it hit a deer. | Sep 25 15:09 |
| DaemonFC | Must have been repaired well because I couldn't see any damage. | Sep 25 15:09 |
| DaemonFC | I told him it's like Ron White said "If you ever have problems deer hunting, just slow the bullet down to 55 and put a little horn and some headlights on it. They'll jump out in front of it." | Sep 25 15:10 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4031728948.html | Sep 25 15:12 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1996 Oldsmobile Ciera - ONLY 74K Miles!!! White [ http://ur1.ca/fp8su ] | Sep 25 15:12 |
| DaemonFC | I just texted this dude. | Sep 25 15:12 |
| DaemonFC | It says August, so I bet he's sold it. | Sep 25 15:12 |
| DaemonFC | If he hasn't, there's probably issues with it. | Sep 25 15:12 |
| DaemonFC | Can't hurt to ask/look. | Sep 25 15:13 |
| DaemonFC | If he says yes, my mom works in Fort Wayne anyway, and so does Dave. | Sep 25 15:13 |
| DaemonFC | I could ask them to check it out on their way home. | Sep 25 15:13 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4046958531.html | Sep 25 15:14 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | s10 98" 4 SALE $$ !! [ http://ur1.ca/fp8tz ] | Sep 25 15:14 |
| DaemonFC | I can't believe anyone would buy a pickup truck with a 2.2 liter 4 cylinder engine in it. | Sep 25 15:14 |
| DaemonFC | What the hell are you going to haul with that? It probably barely moves the truck. | Sep 25 15:14 |
| DaemonFC | 4 cylinder engines are for clown cars. | Sep 25 15:15 |
| *cubezzz (~cubeman@maxhost.org) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 15:16 | |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4054983654.html | Sep 25 15:16 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1996 Honda Civic Lx [ http://ur1.ca/fp8v4 ] | Sep 25 15:16 |
| DaemonFC | A Honda that someone spray painted black that appears to be missing its hubcaps. | Sep 25 15:16 |
| DaemonFC | Yikes. | Sep 25 15:17 |
| DaemonFC | http://www.cityautomall.com/VehicleDetails/used-2004-Ford-Freestar_Wagon-4dr_SEL-Columbia_City-IN/2065800953 | Sep 25 15:25 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.cityautomall.com | 2004 Ford Freestar Wagon for sale in Columbia City - 2FMZA52244BB20397 - City Automall [ http://ur1.ca/fp8zy ] | Sep 25 15:25 |
| DaemonFC | There's the van I asked him to look at for me. | Sep 25 15:25 |
| DaemonFC | What do you think, MinceR? | Sep 25 15:25 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 15:25 |
| *MinceR shrugs | Sep 25 15:26 | |
| DaemonFC | http://www.mikeanderson.com/used/Pontiac/2002-Pontiac-Montana-33075d6b0a0a00de00a16748b12eb201.htm | Sep 25 15:26 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.mikeanderson.com | Used 2002 Pontiac Montana For Sale | www.MikeAnderson.com [ http://ur1.ca/fp910 ] | Sep 25 15:26 |
| DaemonFC | Asked them to look into that one for me. | Sep 25 15:26 |
| *iophk has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Sep 25 15:57 | |
| *iophk (~Adium@unaffiliated/iophk) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 17:07 | |
| *ChanServ gives channel operator status to iophk | Sep 25 17:07 | |
| *iophk has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) | Sep 25 17:11 | |
| *iophk1 (~Adium@unaffiliated/iophk) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 17:11 | |
| *ChanServ gives channel operator status to iophk1 | Sep 25 17:11 | |
| *iophk1 is now known as iophk | Sep 25 17:16 | |
| *Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@unaffiliated/cirrus-minor/x-6868843) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 17:25 | |
| *sebsebseb has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 17:52 | |
| DaemonFC | That RoadLoans is a joke. | Sep 25 18:09 |
| DaemonFC | They wanted to give me a car loan at 16.5% APR. | Sep 25 18:09 |
| DaemonFC | My credit card is 12.9. | Sep 25 18:09 |
| DaemonFC | I'd actually be better off buying a car with my credit card. | Sep 25 18:09 |
| DaemonFC | I have old medical bills that are haunting me, so if I want a car, I just have to save up and pay in cash. | Sep 25 18:14 |
| DaemonFC | Which kind of limits me to the crap that other people don't want. | Sep 25 18:14 |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=towwx7KOWDE | Sep 25 18:15 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | : Cell Phones & Car Ads : Foamy The Squirrel - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpbem ] | Sep 25 18:15 |
| DaemonFC | Certified Pre-Fucked automobile. | Sep 25 18:15 |
| DaemonFC | That cash for clunkers bullshit basically removed 16 million mostly perfectly driveable vehicles from the market. | Sep 25 18:16 |
| DaemonFC | Cars that worked had shit poured into the crankcase to seize up the engine so that rich people could get $4,500 of MY money to buy a new car with. | Sep 25 18:17 |
| DaemonFC | And the program brought up the average fuel economy of the entire United States car "fleet" by a whopping......0.4%. | Sep 25 18:17 |
| DaemonFC | The CO2 emissions of the United States has actually been reduced more by people who can no longer actually afford to drive anything at all than cash for clunkers. | Sep 25 18:18 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, I have a better suggestion for being kind to the environment. | Sep 25 18:19 |
| DaemonFC | You know how they take old ships out to sea and sink them to make artificial reefs? | Sep 25 18:19 |
| DaemonFC | They should put these fucking politicians that passed cash for clunkers on one of those ships. | Sep 25 18:20 |
| DaemonFC | Give the marine life something to eat so it can get a big head start to grow. | Sep 25 18:20 |
| DaemonFC | Even worse than cash for clunkers is the fact that alot of the people who were buying cars and getting rid of them when they still had more than half their usable service life left can't afford to do that anymore. | Sep 25 18:23 |
| DaemonFC | They've been driven into the used car market themselves. | Sep 25 18:23 |
| DaemonFC | So you have more people fighting over fewer used vehicles. | Sep 25 18:24 |
| DaemonFC | So the price of a usable used car has basically doubled. | Sep 25 18:24 |
| DaemonFC | Anything that runs is now going for $1,500 or more. | Sep 25 18:24 |
| DaemonFC | Used to be that you could get a 10 year old car with about 100,000 miles on it for $2,000. | Sep 25 18:25 |
| DaemonFC | That seems to be more like $4,000 now. | Sep 25 18:25 |
| DaemonFC | People are hanging on to what they've got and only putting it on the market when it's so far gone that it needs major repairs every month. | Sep 25 18:26 |
| DaemonFC | So the stuff floating around on Craigslist is basically crap and the things people are trading in at dealers is even worse. | Sep 25 18:26 |
| DaemonFC | This means that there's more demand for car repair, so hourly rates for shop time is going up as well. | Sep 25 18:27 |
| DaemonFC | It's probably going to take a few more years for the used car market to sort itself out, and I'm just afraid that I can't keep what I have running long enough to watch prices return to normal. | Sep 25 18:29 |
| MinceR | those politicians might have too much poison and pollutants in them though :> | Sep 25 18:35 |
| iophk | http://www.forbes.com/sites/terokuittinen/2013/09/24/nokia-admits-giving-misleading-information-about-elops-compensation/ | Sep 25 18:49 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.forbes.com | Nokia Admits Giving Misleading Information About Elop's Compensation - Forbes [ http://ur1.ca/fpbum ] | Sep 25 18:49 |
| iophk | 'According to “Helsingin Sanomat”, when chairman Siilasmaa was questioned about Elop’s contract last Friday, he made the false claim of there being “no essential changes”' | Sep 25 18:53 |
| iophk | So the board not only looked complicit, they actually were complicit. | Sep 25 18:53 |
| *Faither (~Muh@krlh-d9be796e.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 19:50 | |
| puppywatch | -- | Sep 25 19:54 |
| *DaemonFC has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | Sep 25 20:10 | |
| *Faither has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 20:46 | |
| iophk | http://www.fastcompany.com/3018385/fast-feed/a-not-my-email-button-because-yahoo-users-are-getting-other-peoples-emails | Sep 25 20:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.fastcompany.com | A "Not My Email" Button, Because Yahoo Users Are Getting Other People's Emails | Fast Company | Business + Innovation [ http://ur1.ca/fpdio ] | Sep 25 20:47 |
| *DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@unaffiliated/daemonfc) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 20:48 | |
| *Cirrus_Minor has quit (Quit: Status Code 410 ▁ ▂ ▃ ▄┉ħţţρş╱╱:αяcħℓίηυχ.σŕ❡ฺ ฺ┉▄ ▃ ▂ ▁) | Sep 25 20:48 | |
| *Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@unaffiliated/cirrus-minor/x-6868843) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 20:49 | |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4090876023.html | Sep 25 21:01 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | HEADS UP about "1994 CUTLASS CIERA 77,676 ACTUAL MILES" [ http://ur1.ca/fpdp7 ] | Sep 25 21:01 |
| iophk | They might not be fast enough to grab Elop and put him in jail. But Siilasmaa is another matter. Maybe some of the other board members that had helped play along. | Sep 25 21:02 |
| *roy_ is now known as schestowitz | Sep 25 21:04 | |
| *ThistleWeb (~gordon@unaffiliated/thistleweb) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:07 | |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4090517168.html | Sep 25 21:08 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1999 Ford Taurus SE [ http://ur1.ca/fpdrz ] | Sep 25 21:08 |
| DaemonFC | Holy shit.... | Sep 25 21:08 |
| DaemonFC | A Ford Taurus with 352,593 miles on the odometer! | Sep 25 21:09 |
| DaemonFC | This is like Al Bundy's Dodge. | Sep 25 21:09 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 21:09 |
| *MinceR dodges it | Sep 25 21:09 | |
| DaemonFC | "And on that day son, you're going to have to outrun the Dodge!" | Sep 25 21:10 |
| DaemonFC | "Dad....Rush Limbaugh could outrun the Dodge." | Sep 25 21:10 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 21:10 |
| *ThistleWeb has quit (Client Quit) | Sep 25 21:11 | |
| DaemonFC | http://www.albundy.net/lyrics_pdad.php | Sep 25 21:12 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.albundy.net | Als Biography | Sep 25 21:12 |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GFq6usPg6U | Sep 25 21:12 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | al bundy - psycho dad - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpduc ] | Sep 25 21:12 |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZs5ROkC0G8 | Sep 25 21:14 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | Al Bundy Bad to the bone - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpdvd ] | Sep 25 21:14 |
| MinceR | :) | Sep 25 21:15 |
| *iophk has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) | Sep 25 21:15 | |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inubkn_TmUs | Sep 25 21:21 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | Bundy Family Barbecue - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpdy3 ] | Sep 25 21:21 |
| DaemonFC | Best. Show. EVER. | Sep 25 21:21 |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVklEwDhUaA | Sep 25 21:29 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | Married With Children - Al Bundy vs Ms Blaub - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpe21 ] | Sep 25 21:29 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4090684052.html | Sep 25 21:31 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 2000 Chrysler Town and Country Van [ http://ur1.ca/fpe3a ] | Sep 25 21:31 |
| DaemonFC | I wonder what's going on lately. | Sep 25 21:31 |
| DaemonFC | $2,000 for a van with 218,000 miles on it. | Sep 25 21:32 |
| DaemonFC | After 200,000, it's really anyone's guess how long it will run. | Sep 25 21:32 |
| DaemonFC | Could go out tomorrow, could make it into the 260s or 270s. | Sep 25 21:32 |
| *pookito (~quassel@pool-108-20-34-111.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:45 | |
| *DaemonFC has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | Sep 25 22:01 | |
| MinceR | gn | Sep 25 22:03 |
| *pookito (~quassel@pool-108-20-34-111.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) has left #techrights ("http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.") | Sep 25 22:27 | |
| *abeNd-org has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Sep 25 22:32 | |
| *Sosumi has quit (Quit: Leaving) | Sep 25 22:57 | |
| *sebsebseb (~mageiause@fsf/member/sebsebseb) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 23:02 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 23:02 | |
| *flatr0ze has quit (Quit: Communi 2.2.0) | Sep 25 23:42 | |
| *sebsebseb has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 23:48 | |
| ANOTHER SOURCE: | ||
| <--MinceR has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) | Sep 25 00:27 | |
| -->MinceR (~mincer@unaffiliated/mincer) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 00:27 | |
| ---ChanServ gives channel operator status to MinceR | Sep 25 00:59 | |
| DaemonFC | http://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/2013/09/11/are-credit-cards-more-expensive-now/ | Sep 25 02:12 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.foxbusiness.com | Are Credit Cards More Expensive Now? | Fox Business [ http://ur1.ca/fp23t ] | Sep 25 02:12 |
| DaemonFC | "It appears to be working. Survey results released in February this year by Consumer Action, a consumer advocacy group in San Francisco, showed that 45% of consumers polled said they paid more each month because of that minimum-payment warning." | Sep 25 02:12 |
| DaemonFC | So they didn't notice that they were paying $30 a month and having their balance go down by $10 before the government made them say that on the bill? :) | Sep 25 02:12 |
| DaemonFC | People are fucking DUMB. | Sep 25 02:12 |
| -->iophk (~Adium@unaffiliated/iophk) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 03:04 | |
| ---ChanServ gives channel operator status to iophk | Sep 25 03:04 | |
| iophk | http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-09/why-were-shutting-our-comments | Sep 25 03:11 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.popsci.com | Why We're Shutting Off Our Comments | Popular Science [ http://ur1.ca/fp2x1 ] | Sep 25 03:11 |
| <--iophk has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Sep 25 03:32 | |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4087493721.html | Sep 25 03:32 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1994 CUTLASS CIERA 77,676 ACTUAL MILES [ http://ur1.ca/fp36a ] | Sep 25 03:32 |
| <--amarsh04 has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 03:32 | |
| DaemonFC | Hello... | Sep 25 03:33 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 03:33 |
| DaemonFC | Low mileage creampuff... | Sep 25 03:33 |
| -->iophk (~Adium@unaffiliated/iophk) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 04:41 | |
| ---ChanServ gives channel operator status to iophk | Sep 25 04:41 | |
| iophk | Muktware doesn't allow comments either. | Sep 25 04:42 |
| iophk | http://torrentfreak.com/how-google-algorithm-changes-hit-torrent-site-traffic-130924/ | Sep 25 04:46 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | torrentfreak.com | How Google Algorithm Changes Hit Torrent Site Traffic | TorrentFreak [ http://ur1.ca/fp45q ] | Sep 25 04:46 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: intresitng tech talks | Sep 25 04:55 |
| sebsebseb | again today as well | Sep 25 04:55 |
| sebsebseb | ,but need Fash or some VLC plugin to see it I Think | Sep 25 04:55 |
| iophk | oh, too bad. | Sep 25 04:55 |
| iophk | It's disturbing that there is so much filtering: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/10332010/Porn-on-most-free-public-WiFi-networks.html | Sep 25 04:57 |
| iophk | http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/sep/25/porn-knives-and-drugs-websites-accessible-on-most-public-wi-fi | Sep 25 04:57 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.telegraph.co.uk | Porn on most free public WiFi networks - Telegraph [ http://ur1.ca/fp4aw ] | Sep 25 04:57 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.theguardian.com | Porn, knives and drugs websites accessible on most public Wi-Fi | Technology | theguardian.com [ http://ur1.ca/fp4ax ] | Sep 25 04:57 |
| iophk | and also disturbing that the articles approach filtering as desireable or normal. | Sep 25 04:57 |
| DaemonFC | http://www.city-data.com/forum/automotive/1246299-market-used-car-how-old-too-2.html | Sep 25 05:01 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.city-data.com | In the Market for Used Car: How Old is Too Old? (vehicles, brakes) - Sports cars, sedans, coupes, SUVs, trucks, motorcycles, tickets, dealers, repairs, gasoline, drivers... - Page 2 - City-Data Forum [ http://ur1.ca/fp4df ] | Sep 25 05:01 |
| DaemonFC | My 1995 has been pretty reliable. | Sep 25 05:02 |
| DaemonFC | I don't see anything wrong with driving an "old" car as long as it's being properly maintained. | Sep 25 05:02 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: maybe shoud put soe MOno on the remaster to win people over to Linux | Sep 25 05:02 |
| sebsebseb | so can have Banshee and F-spot there | Sep 25 05:02 |
| sebsebseb | and maybe even Gbrainy | Sep 25 05:02 |
| iophk | :( | Sep 25 05:02 |
| DaemonFC | You have to remember when you're dealing with a 20 year old car that there's probably some belts and hoses that need swapped out, and it wouldn't hurt to immediately go for a coolant and transmission flush and an oil change just so you know they've been done. | Sep 25 05:03 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I am actsuallly consieirng MOno here since it would put it in anyway in task-gnome etc | Sep 25 05:03 |
| sebsebseb | and Rythomboxi isn't that great | Sep 25 05:03 |
| sebsebseb | Banshee is better really | Sep 25 05:03 |
| iophk | Clementine is better | Sep 25 05:03 |
| iophk | banshess is crashy and slow | Sep 25 05:03 |
| sebsebseb | Clementine is KDE though | Sep 25 05:03 |
| DaemonFC | Old people tend to neglect that stuff. People in general treat their cars like an appliance instead of a machine. | Sep 25 05:03 |
| sebsebseb | I guess can mix in a GNOME remasster though maybe hmm | Sep 25 05:03 |
| sebsebseb | I do like Clementine a lot myself though | Sep 25 05:04 |
| DaemonFC | Of course, there are some kinds of cars that it's just better to never buy them used at all. | Sep 25 05:04 |
| DaemonFC | A Camaro, Corvette, Grand Prix, Mustang, etc. | Sep 25 05:04 |
| DaemonFC | With the odd exception. (Someone that puts thousands of dollars into restoring a classic Mustang is unlikely to have abused it, but people give these cars to their kids and those are the ones you have to watch out for). | Sep 25 05:05 |
| DaemonFC | I had a boss once that spent something in the upper $3x,xxx range on a new Grand Prix GTP for her 16 year old son. | Sep 25 05:05 |
| DaemonFC | Before the thing even got a thousand miles on the clock, he went off the road at about 80 miles per hour and wrapped it around a tree. | Sep 25 05:06 |
| iophk | sebsebseb: xfce is probably a more practical choice for new users than GNOME. GNOME has been going down hill for many many years now. | Sep 25 05:06 |
| iophk | I wouldn't recommend it to anyone at this point. | Sep 25 05:06 |
| roy_ | iophk: muktware? | Sep 25 05:07 |
| roy_ | I think they use disqus | Sep 25 05:07 |
| roy_ | needs JS | Sep 25 05:07 |
| iophk | yes, that's about the same as no comments | Sep 25 05:07 |
| iophk | disqus+js == no comment | Sep 25 05:07 |
| iophk | The system for comments needs to at least appear to be part of the site itself. | Sep 25 05:08 |
| -->_Goblin (~goblin@2.217.88.122) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 05:08 | |
| iophk | js is just an unnecessary addon that interferes with privacy and security | Sep 25 05:08 |
| iophk | If a web developer can't code a service without js, then they probably have no business developing. | Sep 25 05:09 |
| iophk | js can be a nice extra, providing flourishes, but it should not ever be a prerequisite for using the service. | Sep 25 05:09 |
| iophk | There's just too much wrong with it. | Sep 25 05:09 |
| DaemonFC | I think the reason I'm having trouble finding a gently used Ford Taurus with low miles from around 2000-2004 is because people commute long distances, and these model years like to rust around the wheel wells and around the gas lid. | Sep 25 05:10 |
| DaemonFC | I will not buy a car that has rust on it, period. | Sep 25 05:10 |
| DaemonFC | At first it's just an eyesore, but eventually the damage is structural, and it's impossible to repair if you don't catch it right away. | Sep 25 05:11 |
| DaemonFC | Most people treat their cars as disposable, so they just let it rust. | Sep 25 05:11 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/_Goblin/status/382787069883346944 | Sep 25 05:11 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @_Goblin: @schestowitz But its proprietary gaming is it not which is making the impact with the users? | Sep 25 05:11 |
| roy_ | _Goblin: yes, better than proprietary on proprietary (Windows) | Sep 25 05:12 |
| DaemonFC | roy_, While I was at the dealership, I hopped into a brand new Ford Taurus SEL that was in the showroom. | Sep 25 05:12 |
| DaemonFC | I about died when I saw the price tag. $41,000 | Sep 25 05:12 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382786104493375488 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382786181261705216 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382792395399892992 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382793268456869888 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382793929600802816 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382794295419621376 | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: GNU/Linux Rapidly Becoming a Gaming Platform of Choice, Offering Better Performance http://t.co/Or0QAvtRF5 #games #gnu #linux | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | GNU/Linux Rapidly Becoming a Gaming Platform of Choice, Offering Better Performance | Techrights | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: Fighting for the #environment https://t.co/OdI5CS5vau | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: LinuxCon 2013 Shows That Linux is Becoming Big and Professional Like GNU http://t.co/s8vBzmug73 #gnu #linux #linuxcon | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | LinuxCon 2013 Shows That Linux is Becoming Big and Professional Like GNU | Techrights | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: PopSci doesn't want to hear back from angry readers http://t.co/cBCzb11bu3 | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> www.popsci.com | Why We're Shutting Off Our Comments | Popular Science | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: British press seemingly upset that in the #uk there is NO #censorship in some networks http://t.co/TkhYFLty6O http://t.co/vDOH1RpNB6 | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> www.theguardian.com | Porn, knives and drugs websites accessible on most public Wi-Fi | Technology | theguardian.com | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> www.telegraph.co.uk | Porn on most free public WiFi networks - Telegraph | Sep 25 05:13 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: When you 'help' people avoid ('protect' them) from 'bad' stuff you're basically imposing on them your own prejudices. | Sep 25 05:13 |
| DaemonFC | I'm sure that's part of the reason for the recent used vehicle price spike. (What it would cost to get something new these days.) | Sep 25 05:13 |
| DaemonFC | I was checking the going rates for cars like mine. I paid $2,000 in 2005, and I've put about 40,000 miles on it since then. | Sep 25 05:14 |
| DaemonFC | Even with the rust and bumper damage, I could list it for $1,100 and sell it within a few days right now. | Sep 25 05:14 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/alanbell_libsol/status/382794706783973376 | Sep 25 05:15 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @alanbell_libsol: @schestowitz an article that starts with "an investigation by security firm. . ." where the firm in question sells the solution . . . | Sep 25 05:15 |
| DaemonFC | I just never saw the point in agreeing to pay $30k+ for a new vehicle. | Sep 25 05:15 |
| DaemonFC | If you can pay $2,000 and get around from A to B for the next 10 years, why not just do that? | Sep 25 05:16 |
| DaemonFC | Even if you put another $2,000 into repairs, you're still paying less than $50 a month for your car. | Sep 25 05:16 |
| DaemonFC | roy_, One of my bumper stickers says "Honk if anything falls off." | Sep 25 05:17 |
| DaemonFC | Another one says "Laugh all you want. It's paid for." | Sep 25 05:17 |
| DaemonFC | I just don't get people. | Sep 25 05:18 |
| DaemonFC | Who wants to pay for something that loses half its value in the first two years, and then finance it so they end up paying an additional $10,000 to a bank? | Sep 25 05:18 |
| DaemonFC | I might check out that Cutlass if it's still there this afternoon. | Sep 25 05:21 |
| -->Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@unaffiliated/cirrus-minor/x-6868843) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 05:21 | |
| DaemonFC | There's a lot of problems with buying a brand new car that nobody ever considers until they're stuck paying for it. | Sep 25 05:22 |
| MinceR | what problems? | Sep 25 05:23 |
| DaemonFC | There's the immediate depreciation, the finance charges, the extra $300 a year it takes to renew your plates, and the additional cost of insurance you have to have on it or else the bank won't agree to finance it. | Sep 25 05:23 |
| MinceR | or you could finance it yourself :> | Sep 25 05:23 |
| DaemonFC | Yeah, if you have $40,000 laying around. | Sep 25 05:23 |
| DaemonFC | You're still going to want to insure it or else you'll be eating it if you wreck. | Sep 25 05:23 |
| MinceR | as for the depreciation, that's the price of not having anyone to screw up and mishandle the car before you :> | Sep 25 05:24 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, That's why there's the two year old off-lease deals. | Sep 25 05:24 |
| MinceR | lease a new car and it eventually becomes yours? | Sep 25 05:24 |
| DaemonFC | The lease contracts that people sign lets them lease the car for two years, and then they're stuck with having to do all the scheduled maintenance and keep the mileage down, or they get fined when they turn it in. | Sep 25 05:25 |
| DaemonFC | So then it goes off lease, the company that made the car usually takes it back, replaces anything that needs replaced, slaps a limited warranty on it, and sells it for about half the original MSRP. | Sep 25 05:26 |
| MinceR | sounds like taking a loan to buy a new car, except with more restrictions | Sep 25 05:26 |
| DaemonFC | Yeah. You're not allowed to put more than 12,000 miles per year on it. | Sep 25 05:26 |
| DaemonFC | If you turn it in after two years with more than 24,000 miles on the odometer, you have to pay $1.50 for each mile you went over. | Sep 25 05:26 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, So the deal usually works out to something like... You pay $3,000 up front, then $175 a month for two years, then you turn it back in and pay the fee for any additional mileage, and then you get fined for any scheduled service you missed. | Sep 25 05:28 |
| DaemonFC | You have to be able to prove you go an oil change every 3,000 miles for example. | Sep 25 05:28 |
| DaemonFC | So you'd have to get stuck paying the dealer to change your oil to get the documentation. | Sep 25 05:28 |
| DaemonFC | That sucks because dealers charge about $35-40 to change the oil and filter. | Sep 25 05:28 |
| DaemonFC | You could go to Walmart and get the same service for about $26, but they won't accept that documentation. | Sep 25 05:29 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 05:29 |
| DaemonFC | Dealers charge more for every service out there, MinceR. | Sep 25 05:29 |
| DaemonFC | Like, I take my car to a shop called Daniels Automotive Repair. | Sep 25 05:30 |
| DaemonFC | They charge $69.99 for a coolant system flush and fill. | Sep 25 05:30 |
| DaemonFC | The local Ford dealer has "specials" where they charge $118 for that service, and it's normally about $150 at the Ford dealer. | Sep 25 05:30 |
| MinceR | they might do a better job and warrant the result, though | Sep 25 05:30 |
| MinceR | at least for a while, anyway | Sep 25 05:31 |
| DaemonFC | The only reason you'd go to the Ford dealer for any service is if your vehicle is under warranty. | Sep 25 05:31 |
| DaemonFC | Then it's Ford that's picking up the bill, so who cares? | Sep 25 05:31 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 05:31 |
| DaemonFC | Daniels gives you a 1 year, 12,000 mile warranty for all work they perform. | Sep 25 05:31 |
| DaemonFC | I had them put a new alternator on my car. | Sep 25 05:32 |
| DaemonFC | The new alternator failed after about 5 months *and* it ruined my battery too, which I didn't even buy from them. | Sep 25 05:32 |
| DaemonFC | I took it back and they replaced the alternator and battery at their expense. | Sep 25 05:32 |
| DaemonFC | I priced out getting an exhaust manifold replaced on a car I was thinking about buying a few weeks ago. | Sep 25 05:33 |
| DaemonFC | The Ford dealer said they'd want about $1,000 to repair that. | Sep 25 05:33 |
| DaemonFC | Daniels said they would do it for $650. | Sep 25 05:34 |
| DaemonFC | Just because it's a dealer does not mean they do better work. | Sep 25 05:34 |
| DaemonFC | It always comes down to what kind of mechanics they employ. | Sep 25 05:34 |
| DaemonFC | I guess you could argue that a Ford dealer specializes in Ford service, so they might be more up to speed about what's going on with Ford cars and trucks, but I've never had a problem with Daniels. | Sep 25 05:35 |
| DaemonFC | A Ford Taurus is a very popular car in the United States. There are tens of millions of them on the road. Almost any shop should have experience with them. | Sep 25 05:35 |
| MinceR | it also comes down to what extra information and tools they have access to | Sep 25 05:35 |
| MinceR | and how much they dare risk on bad mechanics if they have to warrant their work :> | Sep 25 05:36 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, Yeah. There's specialty tools that exist for most cars that only the dealers are supposed to have, but after market tool companies clone them and sell them to other shops. | Sep 25 05:36 |
| DaemonFC | So if your car is more than a couple of years old, the other shops have the necessary tools. | Sep 25 05:36 |
| MinceR | for electronics also? | Sep 25 05:37 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, Remember, the US federal and state governments use these cars as well. | Sep 25 05:37 |
| DaemonFC | Thanks to their sourcing requirements, they almost always demand that anything they use has a secondary market for parts. | Sep 25 05:38 |
| MinceR | :) | Sep 25 05:38 |
| DaemonFC | That's actually why Advanced Micro Devices was initially allowed to sell clones of Intel processors. | Sep 25 05:38 |
| MinceR | also for checking and resetting error conditions in the onboard computers? | Sep 25 05:38 |
| DaemonFC | The government didn't want to do business with Intel when Intel was the only supplier of x86 processors. | Sep 25 05:38 |
| DaemonFC | So they made Intel agree to let AMD clone their processors. | Sep 25 05:38 |
| DaemonFC | It keeps prices down. | Sep 25 05:38 |
| DaemonFC | Later on, AMD and Intel came to some agreements on their own because they both had essential patents for CPU features that they both wanted to use. | Sep 25 05:39 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, The OBD II standard is vendor-neutral. | Sep 25 05:40 |
| DaemonFC | You can use the same code scanner on any vehicle from any company that is OBD II compliant. | Sep 25 05:41 |
| DaemonFC | I believe they all have to support that because of US laws. | Sep 25 05:41 |
| DaemonFC | My car is actually so old that there is no OBD II port. | Sep 25 05:41 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, Anything older than model year 1996 uses an older version of OBD that is NOT neutral. | Sep 25 05:42 |
| DaemonFC | So you have to have code scanners that are specified to the manufacturer. | Sep 25 05:43 |
| DaemonFC | *specific | Sep 25 05:43 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, I went to a small car lot last week to check out a 1998 Mercury Sable LS station wagon. | Sep 25 05:45 |
| DaemonFC | I noticed that the Check Engine light was on. | Sep 25 05:45 |
| DaemonFC | The guy came out and read off the code. The code was "bad oxygen sensor reading". | Sep 25 05:46 |
| DaemonFC | So he cleared it and was trying to convince me that it "probably wouldn't return". | Sep 25 05:46 |
| DaemonFC | lol | Sep 25 05:46 |
| MinceR | ic | Sep 25 05:46 |
| DaemonFC | I told him "Hitting the clear button doesn't replace the O2 sensor.". | Sep 25 05:46 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Sep 25 05:46 |
| MinceR | :> | Sep 25 05:47 |
| DaemonFC | He said "Well, maybe the last owner had someone fix it that forgot to clear the code..." | Sep 25 05:47 |
| DaemonFC | So I said "And maybe they didn't." | Sep 25 05:47 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 05:47 |
| DaemonFC | A bad O2 sensor can cost you some money. | Sep 25 05:48 |
| DaemonFC | The Sable actually has three of them. | Sep 25 05:48 |
| DaemonFC | The intake sensors have to be replaced as a pair. | Sep 25 05:49 |
| DaemonFC | They're about $100 each and an hour of labor if you go to a shop. | Sep 25 05:49 |
| DaemonFC | You should replace both of them because you pay for an hour of labor either way and if the readings from both sensors are too far apart, the car will just start flashing the check engine light again. | Sep 25 05:50 |
| DaemonFC | Some people have the sensors replaced and the code comes back because the sensors were not actually bad. | Sep 25 05:51 |
| DaemonFC | The function of the sensors is to detect a lean or rich condition, so an intake leak could be causing it. | Sep 25 05:51 |
| DaemonFC | Now you're out $265 from replacing the sensors and that wan't what was wrong. :) | Sep 25 05:51 |
| MinceR | http://www.smosh.com/smosh-pit/photos/awesomely-awkward-iphone-autocorrects | Sep 25 05:53 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.smosh.com | Awesomely Awkward iPhone Autocorrects | SMOSH [ http://ur1.ca/fp50q ] | Sep 25 05:53 |
| DaemonFC | The reason there are two of them on the intake is because if you only have one, then it can be sending bad data to the ECM without throwing a code, because there's nothing to check the sensor's data against. | Sep 25 05:53 |
| DaemonFC | In that case ,your car will either run like shit or guzzle gas. | Sep 25 05:53 |
| DaemonFC | The check engine light might not even come on because it would only be triggered if the sensor is sending out of bounds data to the ECM. | Sep 25 05:54 |
| DaemonFC | So some vehicles only have one sensor and the only sign that the sensor is bad is that your car is running like shit and/or guzzling gas. | Sep 25 05:54 |
| DaemonFC | There's a lot of reasons why that could happen. | Sep 25 05:54 |
| DaemonFC | So a lot of people are running their car and getting bad gas mileage and not paying attention. | Sep 25 05:56 |
| DaemonFC | And the bad sensor is costing them an extra few hundred dollars per year worth of gasoline. | Sep 25 05:56 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 05:56 |
| DaemonFC | That's why you should keep an eye on your gas mileage. If you're getting bad mileage, you want to check for fuel leaks, or a leaking injector, and if that's not the problem, you'll want to swap out the oxygen sensor, because that's probably what's doing it. | Sep 25 05:57 |
| DaemonFC | I think that paying $150 to replace an oxygen sensor is better than having a gas guzzling car. | Sep 25 05:57 |
| DaemonFC | People were less concerned with their car guzzling gas when it was only $1 a gallon. | Sep 25 05:58 |
| DaemonFC | Now that it's $3.50-4 a gallon, more people are keeping an eye on that. | Sep 25 05:58 |
| DaemonFC | Another (sometimes) silent cause of bad gas mileage is worn spark plugs. | Sep 25 05:59 |
| DaemonFC | Those won't cause your car to guzzle, but they could be costing you a few mpg. | Sep 25 05:59 |
| DaemonFC | To keep your fuel costs down, it's better to replace your oxygen sensors and spark plugs every 100,000 miles or so. | Sep 25 06:00 |
| DaemonFC | That means that the average car owner will only have to worry about it once or twice during the lifetime of the car. | Sep 25 06:00 |
| DaemonFC | There's a few people that manage to get to 300,000 miles, but most people aren't that lucky. | Sep 25 06:01 |
| DaemonFC | I'd say that about one in three hundred cars or so is even capable of 300,000 if the owner maintains them properly. | Sep 25 06:01 |
| DaemonFC | My mom's '04 Impala has about 270,000 miles on it, but I'm constantly after her about maintaining it. | Sep 25 06:02 |
| DaemonFC | When her car is having problems, she hands me her debit card and tells me to get it fixed. | Sep 25 06:03 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Sep 25 06:03 |
| DaemonFC | She was noticing some "feedback" in the steering wheel and that her air conditioner would cut out when she went to turn a while back. | Sep 25 06:04 |
| DaemonFC | I asked "You did replace the serpentine belt on schedule?". | Sep 25 06:04 |
| DaemonFC | "The what?" | Sep 25 06:04 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 06:04 |
| DaemonFC | So I took it down to Daniels and had them replace the belt, and the tensioner and idler pulleys. | Sep 25 06:05 |
| DaemonFC | Since they were in there anyway, I also had them replace the water pump. | Sep 25 06:05 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, There's some things that people never replace, ever. | Sep 25 06:06 |
| DaemonFC | Even when the owners manual has it on the service schedule. | Sep 25 06:06 |
| DaemonFC | That's why I will not own a car that has a timing belt. | Sep 25 06:06 |
| DaemonFC | It costs like $400 or so to replace a timing belt. If you buy a car with just over 100,000 on it, do you think the last owner bothered to replace it? | Sep 25 06:07 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 06:07 |
| DaemonFC | Dave recently had to replace his fuel pump. | Sep 25 06:07 |
| DaemonFC | I told him it was his own fault, since he's always letting the gas tank get down to E before he refills the tank. | Sep 25 06:07 |
| DaemonFC | You should never let it get below an eighth of a tank. Not only because you risk running out of fuel, but because the pump has to work harder (it gets hotter) and may fail. | Sep 25 06:08 |
| DaemonFC | It also tends to start sucking in the sediment at the bottom of the tank into the fuel filter. | Sep 25 06:08 |
| DaemonFC | Some people run out of gas, then put more in and find that they can't start the car. | Sep 25 06:09 |
| DaemonFC | That's usually why. | Sep 25 06:09 |
| DaemonFC | At that point, you may have to pay to have the car towed to the shop, where they'll replace the fuel filter. | Sep 25 06:10 |
| DaemonFC | Then the car should start, but you're in for a $100 tow, a $40 filter, and an hour of shop time. | Sep 25 06:10 |
| DaemonFC | All because you had to run it to E. B-) | Sep 25 06:10 |
| DaemonFC | A fuel filter is one of those things that you could do yourself, but nobody actually wants to. | Sep 25 06:11 |
| DaemonFC | Who wants to get soaked in gasoline from the pressure on the fuel line? | Sep 25 06:11 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 06:11 |
| DaemonFC | Most owners manuals recommend fuel filter replacements every 50,000 miles, but I've never replaced one. | Sep 25 06:12 |
| DaemonFC | If you're buying good gasoline, you generally shouldn't have to. | Sep 25 06:12 |
| DaemonFC | I'm pretty picky about where I'll gas up because of that. | Sep 25 06:13 |
| -->oiaohm (~oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 06:21 | |
| <--_Goblin has quit (Quit: Leaving) | Sep 25 06:31 | |
| <--DaemonFC has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) | Sep 25 06:39 | |
| iophk | http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/24/brazil-president-un-speech-nsa-surveillance | Sep 25 06:39 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.theguardian.com | Brazilian president Rousseff: US surveillance a 'breach of international law' | World news | The Guardian [ http://ur1.ca/fp5ri ] | Sep 25 06:39 |
| <--sebsebseb has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) | Sep 25 06:44 | |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382810027192766464 | Sep 25 06:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: Free Speech is Dying as Censorship on the Internet Increases, Even in the West http://t.co/gTiXP7KM6r #censorship | Sep 25 06:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | Free Speech is Dying as Censorship on the Internet Increases, Even in the West | Techrights | Sep 25 06:47 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382816217645735936 | Sep 25 06:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: As the World Progresses Protest is Being Banned in the United States and Its Allies http://t.co/ltf0xflCz0 #protest | Sep 25 06:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | As the World Progresses Protest is Being Banned in the United States and Its Allies | Techrights | Sep 25 06:48 |
| -->sebsebseb (~mageiause@fsf/member/sebsebseb) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 06:48 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 06:48 | |
| iophk | Sep 25 06:48 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 06:48 | |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: # | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | iophk | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | heh heh | Sep 25 06:48 |
| sebsebseb | MinceR: | Sep 25 06:49 |
| sebsebseb | MinceR: | Sep 25 06:49 |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 06:49 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 06:49 | |
| iophk | sebsebseb: found a location for your installfest yet? | Sep 25 06:53 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: the realy want these remasters | Sep 25 06:56 |
| sebsebseb | seems that may be difficult to do for MAGIEA | Sep 25 06:56 |
| iophk | why remasters? | Sep 25 06:57 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: i suggested local reops again, but this older guy really doens't seem too get the advantages etc | Sep 25 06:57 |
| sebsebseb | he also came up with a sily saying | Sep 25 06:57 |
| sebsebseb | too do with that last tie | Sep 25 06:57 |
| iophk | has he ever done a network install? | Sep 25 06:57 |
| sebsebseb | that baially translates to him thinking it's uessary | Sep 25 06:57 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: has he ever done a network install nope | Sep 25 06:57 |
| sebsebseb | as far as I know | Sep 25 06:57 |
| sebsebseb | did he even know what a remaster was untill the other two guys started going on about them at the meeting? nope doens't seem like it | Sep 25 06:57 |
| iophk | Do you have time to walk him though one? | Sep 25 06:58 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: if I was set up to show one maybe yeah | Sep 25 06:58 |
| sebsebseb | he wants remasters, because the Open Suse guy suggestd it | Sep 25 06:58 |
| sebsebseb | oh sure easy enough for him | Sep 25 06:58 |
| sebsebseb | use Open Suse studio to make it like he willl be doing | Sep 25 06:58 |
| sebsebseb | then this other guy had done remaster before for Ubuntu/Debian or whatever, but Magiea has loads of install options to | Sep 25 06:59 |
| sebsebseb | a re master isn't really needed muchhere | Sep 25 06:59 |
| sebsebseb | plus the idea of pre instaling apps that joe average and janeaerage may want bydefaut is really just putting junkware on when you think about it | Sep 25 06:59 |
| iophk | Yes, junkware is to be avoided. | Sep 25 06:59 |
| sebsebseb | security updates in the re master by dfault ok nice idea for Open Suse etc, but Maigea 4 will have only been out around a month, so there woud't be much to install from the repo's anyway | Sep 25 07:00 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: you can guess what apps they may want | Sep 25 07:00 |
| sebsebseb | ,but can't know for sure | Sep 25 07:00 |
| iophk | But adding one or two apps for the user is very good. If the user installs those apps himself, then he learns how. | Sep 25 07:00 |
| sebsebseb | and so col acstauly end up pre installing quite a few apps that no they don't actsally want | Sep 25 07:00 |
| iophk | That is part of the teaching / learning process. | Sep 25 07:00 |
| sebsebseb | y3p indeed | Sep 25 07:00 |
| sebsebseb | ,but their idea is just to gie out remasters on USB | Sep 25 07:00 |
| sebsebseb | let them take it home, and play, and come to LUG meeting for an instal maybe | Sep 25 07:01 |
| sebsebseb | and maybe do some installs at the event though | Sep 25 07:01 |
| iophk | However, the basic installation process is slow from optical media. | Sep 25 07:01 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yes we been through that | Sep 25 07:01 |
| sebsebseb | I sent emails trying to expain stuff | Sep 25 07:01 |
| sebsebseb | ,but he doens't seem to get it | Sep 25 07:01 |
| sebsebseb | he thinks my idea sounds complacted or whateer | Sep 25 07:02 |
| iophk | bad idea | Sep 25 07:02 |
| iophk | people will take the USB sticks | Sep 25 07:02 |
| iophk | and reformat them | Sep 25 07:02 |
| iophk | without looking at the linux installer | Sep 25 07:02 |
| iophk | Best to do all the installation at the installfest | Sep 25 07:02 |
| iophk | How long has he been using linux? | Sep 25 07:02 |
| sebsebseb | he wants to do things keep it simple stupid | Sep 25 07:02 |
| iophk | remaster is not simple | Sep 25 07:02 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah that's a point, peope coud just take the usb sticks re format them and use for something else | Sep 25 07:02 |
| iophk | the usb sticks also introduce complicated logistics | Sep 25 07:02 |
| iophk | who pays for them? | Sep 25 07:02 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: he is a ok with these other two guys making re masters and him not doing so | Sep 25 07:03 |
| iophk | how many is too few and how many is too many? | Sep 25 07:03 |
| sebsebseb | ,but it leaves me too do whateer for Mageia, or no Mageia it seems | Sep 25 07:03 |
| iophk | how do you guess the right amount? | Sep 25 07:03 |
| sebsebseb | well gettin some fro a compay at least | Sep 25 07:03 |
| sebsebseb | 3 | Sep 25 07:03 |
| sebsebseb | 30 | Sep 25 07:03 |
| sebsebseb | ,but yeah | Sep 25 07:03 |
| oiaohm | A usb duplicator is cheep. | Sep 25 07:03 |
| -->DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@unaffiliated/daemonfc) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 07:03 | |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I am not happy abut stuff | Sep 25 07:03 |
| sebsebseb | these deisions | Sep 25 07:03 |
| iophk | oiaohm: dd | Sep 25 07:03 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: and how he goes and says I am all signging and dancing | Sep 25 07:04 |
| oiaohm | iophk: there are fpga versions that are faster than dd. | Sep 25 07:04 |
| sebsebseb | reffering to the locali repo's idea | Sep 25 07:04 |
| iophk | it would help if you did a test installfest even among yourselves with spare computers | Sep 25 07:04 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: looked that sayng up means he thins the idea is unessarey, beuase he doens't understnad obviosuly it seems | Sep 25 07:04 |
| iophk | that would introduce some realism | Sep 25 07:04 |
| iophk | How long has that fellow been using Linux? | Sep 25 07:04 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah maybe I will try and suggest that at the meeting or LUG or whatever | Sep 25 07:04 |
| sebsebseb | ,but where going to get people from for a test thing? | Sep 25 07:05 |
| iophk | use your spare computers | Sep 25 07:05 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: he's not realy that technical I think, he's getting old and comes to the LUG list for help | Sep 25 07:05 |
| sebsebseb | and got introduced to it a few years or so ago by someone | Sep 25 07:05 |
| iophk | or ask a friend or two to volunteer, but you can still use your spare computer | Sep 25 07:05 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: thing is he's kind of in charge of the whole thing now as well or is pretty muchnow so hmm | Sep 25 07:05 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: maybe I'll just say whatever, do whateer you want for other distors | Sep 25 07:06 |
| sebsebseb | ,but I am going to do things my way for Magiea usng offical Livemedia's and not remasters | Sep 25 07:06 |
| oiaohm | Really at the rate costs are coming down giving out comptuers on stick are becoming afforable. | Sep 25 07:07 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: he even sent us a email the other day, asking to confirm that the software woud come from offical repo's for the remasters | Sep 25 07:07 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I repiedand was like that's the least of our technical worrys, relying on only a remaster is an issue beause.... | Sep 25 07:08 |
| iophk | Maybe he would benefit from trying a netinstall himself | Sep 25 07:08 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yep indeed that's what I am thinking baically to kindof | Sep 25 07:08 |
| sebsebseb | well I am thinking more like maybe he would benefit | Sep 25 07:09 |
| sebsebseb | from actuay installing Magiea himself from say the clasical installer or somethng ike that | Sep 25 07:09 |
| sebsebseb | even if just in a vm | Sep 25 07:09 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I am the one that's mant to know about Magiea, good ways to insttall it etc | Sep 25 07:09 |
| sebsebseb | they haven't een installed it before as far as I know | Sep 25 07:09 |
| sebsebseb | also just, because a remaster works well for one distro or two, doen't mean it's going to work well for all! | Sep 25 07:10 |
| iophk | now is the time to do it before there is a time crunch | Sep 25 07:10 |
| sebsebseb | a time crunch? | Sep 25 07:10 |
| iophk | run out of time | Sep 25 07:10 |
| iophk | the network thing can be thought through | Sep 25 07:10 |
| iophk | even if they use optical media or usb sticks for the installation, there will still be a need to get online and contact a repository | Sep 25 07:11 |
| iophk | that makes the LAN a bottleneck | Sep 25 07:11 |
| iophk | the way around that bottleneck is to have a repository local to the LAN | Sep 25 07:11 |
| iophk | if you have that you may as well do a netinstall because it is faster | Sep 25 07:11 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: QA woan was like, Magia's installer is more flexible | Sep 25 07:11 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: maybe he's just not famiuar with it | Sep 25 07:11 |
| iophk | probably not familiar with it. Got to walk him through an installation | Sep 25 07:12 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yes maybeI shoulddothat ortry to | Sep 25 07:12 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I wonder if he is at hte LUG meeting on Saturday hmm | Sep 25 07:12 |
| sebsebseb | with Magiea got loads of intal options | Sep 25 07:12 |
| sebsebseb | more so than Ubuntu or Mint or OPen Suse | Sep 25 07:12 |
| iophk | Can it do kickstart or preseed? | Sep 25 07:12 |
| sebsebseb | what's that? | Sep 25 07:13 |
| iophk | That is a file on the CD or DVD or USB stick that has several pre-configured options. | Sep 25 07:13 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: not sure what you mean quite, but mayb you do mean the clasical installer | Sep 25 07:13 |
| sebsebseb | that people an pick loads of options | Sep 25 07:14 |
| iophk | If you know that certain menus will always be answered the same way, you can put the answers in the kickstart file. | Sep 25 07:14 |
| sebsebseb | is it a desktop, is it a server, is it a work staiotn, etc | Sep 25 07:14 |
| sebsebseb | what de'sdo you want instaled etc | Sep 25 07:14 |
| sebsebseb | is that what you mean basically? | Sep 25 07:14 |
| iophk | not really | Sep 25 07:14 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: re master is dificut you say | Sep 25 07:14 |
| iophk | if you are doing a lot of desktops with the same partition layout for example | Sep 25 07:14 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: to make | Sep 25 07:14 |
| iophk | you can use kickstart | Sep 25 07:14 |
| iophk | or if you are setting up the same user accounts | Sep 25 07:15 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I hae a feeling it may be for this distro , depending on what that program realy is ike tou se | Sep 25 07:15 |
| iophk | or adding the same applications post-install | Sep 25 07:15 |
| iophk | but really I would stick with the stock image and walk users through manual installation; | Sep 25 07:15 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: they can ue re master for the other distros I don't care | Sep 25 07:15 |
| iophk | If they need handholding for the installation, hand holding for installing the first app or two will be good also | Sep 25 07:15 |
| sebsebseb | it's Magiea what I care about | Sep 25 07:15 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: however now there's more of an idea, that it may not be so much instals | Sep 25 07:16 |
| sebsebseb | ,but rather just people tkaing USB's etc | Sep 25 07:16 |
| iophk | yes stick with mageia and ubuntu for your choices, have the users choose desktop environment only | Sep 25 07:16 |
| sebsebseb | and comin back to us later | Sep 25 07:16 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: it's not me making all these decisisons | Sep 25 07:16 |
| iophk | how many years later | Sep 25 07:16 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: there's this guy who wants Open Suse etc | Sep 25 07:16 |
| sebsebseb | he's going to make a re master of that | Sep 25 07:16 |
| sebsebseb | and show us on the 10th etc | Sep 25 07:16 |
| sebsebseb | he was one that started off the whole re master idea in fact | Sep 25 07:17 |
| iophk | walk him through mageia on the 10th then too | Sep 25 07:17 |
| sebsebseb | since appparnatly it was so easy to make with Open Suse stuido | Sep 25 07:17 |
| iophk | you don't have to let him run over you guys but it will take a bit of tact | Sep 25 07:17 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: he was going to show us some stuff with remasters or whatever | Sep 25 07:17 |
| iophk | Suse is a bad option | Sep 25 07:17 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: then this old guy who doesn't seem to be that technial actsauy | Sep 25 07:17 |
| iophk | Yes but when he shows you whatever also show him your plan | Sep 25 07:17 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: is the co ordinater or whatever | Sep 25 07:18 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: and he's ok with other peope doing the techset up | Sep 25 07:18 |
| sebsebseb | ,but he thinks we can all just go with a re master, andno loal repo's | Sep 25 07:18 |
| sebsebseb | he thinks we can al just do do remasterd USB sticks | Sep 25 07:18 |
| iophk | I thought he was leaving the tech issues to the others? | Sep 25 07:18 |
| sebsebseb | I think he shuld leavev us alone to do our own thing or whateer distors | Sep 25 07:19 |
| sebsebseb | Open Suse guy does his thing | Sep 25 07:19 |
| iophk | +1 | Sep 25 07:19 |
| sebsebseb | the other guy does Debian/Ubuntu or whatever he's doing | Sep 25 07:19 |
| iophk | except no Suse for the visitors, keep it simple: Mageia or Ubuntu | Sep 25 07:19 |
| sebsebseb | and I do things my way for Mageia | Sep 25 07:19 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I did suggest that no Open Suse bfore or kin of, but once I sot of aid coul do it as well | Sep 25 07:20 |
| sebsebseb | I think Open Suse will be in though | Sep 25 07:20 |
| sebsebseb | ,beause of this guy | Sep 25 07:20 |
| iophk | I'm sure that can be avoided. | Sep 25 07:20 |
| iophk | The choices have to be kept simple | Sep 25 07:20 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: older guy thinks the distros aren't that important | Sep 25 07:20 |
| sebsebseb | he just think it's all Linux really | Sep 25 07:20 |
| iophk | The users should not worry about distros only about choosing between DEs | Sep 25 07:20 |
| sebsebseb | yeah, but looks like it might not end up bein quite so simpel | Sep 25 07:21 |
| sebsebseb | not sure yet | Sep 25 07:21 |
| sebsebseb | haven't deicided stufff like that properly yet | Sep 25 07:21 |
| sebsebseb | meant to do that on the 10th | Sep 25 07:21 |
| sebsebseb | ,but so far peope have been like re mater re master re master! | Sep 25 07:22 |
| sebsebseb | at the last meeting | Sep 25 07:22 |
| iophk | Too many choices will only stress out visitors | Sep 25 07:22 |
| iophk | Show the netinstall on the 10th | Sep 25 07:22 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: sure, but now there's this idea that ight not atsualy do that many installs | Sep 25 07:22 |
| sebsebseb | need a router or whateer for net instal to andethernet cables I Think, I don't know how to do a net install or a re master reay at the moment | Sep 25 07:22 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: more like shw something this Saturdya maybe to, if they turn up at the normal LUG meeting hmm | Sep 25 07:23 |
| iophk | Just need a net connection for the netinstall, but it helps if it is fast | Sep 25 07:24 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: it's at a pub | Sep 25 07:24 |
| sebsebseb | so wel | Sep 25 07:24 |
| sebsebseb | the wifi there is so not good enough | Sep 25 07:24 |
| sebsebseb | the LUG meeting I mean | Sep 25 07:24 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: so you have never done a repository mirror. | Sep 25 07:24 |
| sebsebseb | indeed | Sep 25 07:24 |
| sebsebseb | or a re master | Sep 25 07:25 |
| iophk | Hmm. If you set up one notebook as a tether it connects to the wifi and then the installation computer connects to it via ethernet | Sep 25 07:25 |
| sebsebseb | a tether, through mobilephone | Sep 25 07:25 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: Yes have done netinstall from fake internet setup. | Sep 25 07:25 |
| sebsebseb | what do you mean? | Sep 25 07:25 |
| sebsebseb | USB sticks is keeping things keep it simple stupid | Sep 25 07:26 |
| sebsebseb | ,but they don't have to be rematers really surely | Sep 25 07:26 |
| sebsebseb | why put junkware on ? | Sep 25 07:26 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: funny enough no USB sticks can drive you more nuts on some of these more moden secure boots. | Sep 25 07:26 |
| sebsebseb | I mean the ida i to put say Jitsi in them instead of Skpe and things lik that | Sep 25 07:26 |
| sebsebseb | stuff average people may want | Sep 25 07:26 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: what was that? | Sep 25 07:26 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: factory installation imaging is done by network. | Sep 25 07:26 |
| sebsebseb | idea is to hopefly get ol d XP comps and such | Sep 25 07:26 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I fee like oh if ony people such as you, were organising this thng as well | Sep 25 07:27 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: some of the windows 8 machines are simpler to overwrite from pxe servered installers. | Sep 25 07:27 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: people who actsauy properly know what they are on about when it comes to thisstuff,but no that doesn't seem to be the case unfortunatlly | Sep 25 07:27 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: some windows 8 machines in fact don't start usb controller until after OS has started. | Sep 25 07:28 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: yeah Windows 8 may be a issue | Sep 25 07:28 |
| sebsebseb | may have to refuse to do anythng with those | Sep 25 07:28 |
| sebsebseb | if we get ay | Sep 25 07:28 |
| sebsebseb | any | Sep 25 07:28 |
| sebsebseb | idea is to do something beore the XP end of life | Sep 25 07:28 |
| iophk | also some vista8 machines will have the bios /uefi set to lock out other OSes | Sep 25 07:28 |
| sebsebseb | target old computers etc | Sep 25 07:28 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah I know | Sep 25 07:28 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I thin I should maybe show him a standad Magiea intal in virtualbox | Sep 25 07:30 |
| sebsebseb | or something | Sep 25 07:30 |
| sebsebseb | I don't know | Sep 25 07:30 |
| iophk | oiaohm: pxe would be a good way to launch netinstall | Sep 25 07:30 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I think everyone shoul be left alone to do it their way | Sep 25 07:30 |
| sebsebseb | main thing is to get some sort of install medai on a USB | Sep 25 07:31 |
| sebsebseb | ,but we can all do that | Sep 25 07:31 |
| sebsebseb | and thenthere are differneces between distros etc | Sep 25 07:31 |
| iophk | load up Mageia in vb with on vb for standard mageia, one for xfce and one for kde | Sep 25 07:31 |
| sebsebseb | MinceR: well I can show de's on my netbook itself | Sep 25 07:31 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: ,but the instal should be shown how easy it is or something | Sep 25 07:31 |
| sebsebseb | or the classical or whateer hmm | Sep 25 07:31 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: or I could take screen shots, and go through a slide show in KDE as the background or something :D | Sep 25 07:32 |
| sebsebseb | showing stuff or uh | Sep 25 07:32 |
| sebsebseb | thisis annoying | Sep 25 07:32 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: keep it simple stupid uh right | Sep 25 07:32 |
| sebsebseb | ,but I have a feeling making a re master will be far from KISS for Mageia | Sep 25 07:32 |
| oiaohm | iophk: the question most people fail to ask is how do OEM install their machines. | Sep 25 07:32 |
| sebsebseb | apparatlly got to use the stanard tool, that the normal ISO's get made in | Sep 25 07:32 |
| sebsebseb | too doit | Sep 25 07:32 |
| oiaohm | iophk: most OEM use PXE with motherboards with onboard networking. | Sep 25 07:33 |
| sebsebseb | or somethng else maybe | Sep 25 07:33 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: I also fear doing install fests. | Sep 25 07:33 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: oh ? | Sep 25 07:33 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: mostly due to the odd ball custom hardware that can turn up that does not work. | Sep 25 07:33 |
| sebsebseb | sure | Sep 25 07:33 |
| sebsebseb | ,but that's why there's this idea | Sep 25 07:33 |
| sebsebseb | to | Sep 25 07:33 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: Yes over here we have a lot of 1 off laptop makes. | Sep 25 07:33 |
| sebsebseb | just try mainy now possbiy | Sep 25 07:34 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: ie companies order laptops with there own company brands on them. | Sep 25 07:34 |
| sebsebseb | here's part of an email someone sent | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | ,but | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | you'll get what I mean by try from this i think | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: iophk | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | We are implying this is an install fest where you bring your Pc we will install it and get then up and running. | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | Nope... not going to happen | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | It should be implied ... | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | 1) bring their PC | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | 2) try out some of the linux variants we have on USB on their PC | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | 3) if they like what we see take a usb with one of the variants to see how they get on... | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | 4) if they wish to peruse it further come to a LUGS meeting and we will help them to install. | Sep 25 07:35 |
| sebsebseb | KISS principal.... | Sep 25 07:35 |
| MinceR | sebsebseb: | Sep 25 07:36 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: iophk yeah that sounds good doesnt it? ^^^^^ | Sep 25 07:36 |
| DaemonFC | Off to go buy that Oldsmobile. | Sep 25 07:36 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 07:36 |
| DaemonFC | bbiab | Sep 25 07:36 |
| sebsebseb | so in other words may not be doing many installs in that case | Sep 25 07:36 |
| sebsebseb | at the event itself, if doing things that way | Sep 25 07:36 |
| iophk | right, but use the live CDs to test whether their hardware can handle it | Sep 25 07:36 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah or the re masered USB's | Sep 25 07:37 |
| sebsebseb | I think that's the idea | Sep 25 07:37 |
| oiaohm | The other problem I have had with livecd and usb is failures. | Sep 25 07:37 |
| sebsebseb | use the remasterd USB's to tet stuff, or possbiyofficcial LIve Media | Sep 25 07:37 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: as for the point of them taking back and then reformatting the USB stick for use for someting else | Sep 25 07:38 |
| sebsebseb | well yeah that may happen, but so be it I guess | Sep 25 07:38 |
| oiaohm | netboot with pxe is fair much dependable on anything Pent II/Pent III | Sep 25 07:38 |
| iophk | +1 for PXE | Sep 25 07:38 |
| iophk | again | Sep 25 07:38 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: iophk I think I won't get any assitance getting a local repos set up etc | Sep 25 07:39 |
| sebsebseb | since they want re masters | Sep 25 07:39 |
| sebsebseb | and I am not a network guy etc | Sep 25 07:39 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: you can run iso images from pxe as well. | Sep 25 07:39 |
| sebsebseb | so unforutnatly even though it's a good idea | Sep 25 07:39 |
| sebsebseb | realistially it lookslike the loal repo's etc is out | Sep 25 07:39 |
| <--DaemonFC has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | Sep 25 07:39 | |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: you can run your normall install images from pxe. | Sep 25 07:39 |
| sebsebseb | pxe sounds vaguely failur | Sep 25 07:40 |
| sebsebseb | ,but what's that? | Sep 25 07:40 |
| oiaohm | pxe is the protocol behind network booting. | Sep 25 07:40 |
| iophk | PXE is a nice security hole that allows a boot image to be served over the net | Sep 25 07:40 |
| sebsebseb | oh | Sep 25 07:40 |
| iophk | it uses tftp | Sep 25 07:40 |
| iophk | You can use it to serve up regular ISO images, too | Sep 25 07:41 |
| sebsebseb | I think using USB'sCD's/DVD's is praby the more simpe way of doing thngs | Sep 25 07:41 |
| sebsebseb | however I did suggest having local repo's as well | Sep 25 07:41 |
| sebsebseb | only too get the stupid saying hmm | Sep 25 07:41 |
| sebsebseb | in response | Sep 25 07:41 |
| iophk | Unless you are on a decent network local repos will be important. | Sep 25 07:41 |
| sebsebseb | I suggested havingboth to be more prepard for al install situatons etc | Sep 25 07:41 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: well that guy and the others I guess too then, don't seem to understand that | Sep 25 07:42 |
| iophk | Have to show them | Sep 25 07:42 |
| iophk | With computers, people are really bad at visualising the possibliities | Sep 25 07:42 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: http://ipxe.org/ | Sep 25 07:42 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | ipxe.org | iPXE - open source boot firmware [start] | Sep 25 07:42 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I think there thinking is, use the re master, have the security updates already on the remaster up to the date it was made, and some other apps and give that too people | Sep 25 07:42 |
| iophk | Only when they have hands-on experience do they get it. | Sep 25 07:42 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: in other words no downloadsat the event of stuff | Sep 25 07:43 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: network boot from http servers is particular cool. | Sep 25 07:43 |
| iophk | How will the users install an app of their choosing then? | Sep 25 07:43 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: they won''t | Sep 25 07:43 |
| iophk | You really do have to give them practice with installing their own app. | Sep 25 07:43 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: unless they do so at home | Sep 25 07:43 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: network boot is about your only option if you want to offer more than 1 distrobution. | Sep 25 07:43 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: they don't understand that it seems | Sep 25 07:43 |
| iophk | That's a scary unknown until they have done it the first time. | Sep 25 07:43 |
| iophk | Trust me on that | Sep 25 07:43 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: mass if installation discs is how to get confused. | Sep 25 07:44 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: they think it's ok to just give them a load ofstuff pre installed in a re master | Sep 25 07:44 |
| iophk | That's bad. They'll feel dumped on. | Sep 25 07:44 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I agree it's good for them too larn how to instal somethng, or pratice | Sep 25 07:44 |
| sebsebseb | henc local repo's or intenret i f goo enough at venue | Sep 25 07:44 |
| sebsebseb | ,but these guys don't get that it seems | Sep 25 07:44 |
| iophk | They have to know through experience that they can install an app themselves | Sep 25 07:44 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I guess there is that these are peple who won't really want to learn | Sep 25 07:44 |
| sebsebseb | and just want too be set up by defaut | Sep 25 07:45 |
| sebsebseb | and so a remaster | Sep 25 07:45 |
| iophk | Most of what an installfest is about is the handholding for beginners. | Sep 25 07:45 |
| sebsebseb | there idea above | Sep 25 07:45 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: remaster can be the worst mistake ever. | Sep 25 07:45 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: there is the odd case of the bad driver. | Sep 25 07:45 |
| iophk | If they didn't want the extra help they would have just stayed home and burned their own DVD | Sep 25 07:45 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: sounds ike it may jut be a try thing and giving out USB's fest mainy | Sep 25 07:45 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: even wth a re master, they ma want to download somethng at event realy | Sep 25 07:46 |
| sebsebseb | some other package | Sep 25 07:46 |
| sebsebseb | or look around | Sep 25 07:46 |
| sebsebseb | I know al this stuff | Sep 25 07:46 |
| iophk | AMD64 or i386 images? | Sep 25 07:46 |
| sebsebseb | but these guys dn't seem to get it | Sep 25 07:46 |
| oiaohm | iophk: XP time frame both are required. | Sep 25 07:46 |
| iophk | Again you have to show them | Sep 25 07:46 |
| sebsebseb | I have even thought about that 32bit or 64bit I think most installs woul be 32bit | Sep 25 07:46 |
| oiaohm | This is my problem we are talking lots of images. | Sep 25 07:46 |
| sebsebseb | ,but good to have some 64bit | Sep 25 07:46 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: I think to be prepared I shoud have all the images for Mageia :d | Sep 25 07:47 |
| iophk | Handing out images on USB sticks requires too much logisitcs | Sep 25 07:47 |
| sebsebseb | everything | Sep 25 07:47 |
| sebsebseb | all 7 or hwateve it is | Sep 25 07:47 |
| sebsebseb | 32bit and 64bit and even the dual CD | Sep 25 07:47 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: problem is what will do if you run out of USB sticks | Sep 25 07:47 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: hpopefuly this LInux related company will sponser the event, they are trying to find out | Sep 25 07:47 |
| iophk | PXE can serve up Grub and offer a menu with choices | Sep 25 07:47 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: or end up with a huge stock pile left over. | Sep 25 07:47 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: and hopefuly they wll atay send some guys to help us | Sep 25 07:47 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: now these are peope who know LInux et :) | Sep 25 07:48 |
| sebsebseb | etc | Sep 25 07:48 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: the PXE netboot options are worth looking at. | Sep 25 07:48 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: well will have Live CD's and wat not too I think | Sep 25 07:48 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: ,but yeah I am thinking at the moment, we need more USB stick | Sep 25 07:48 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: a horible 1G 32 bit computer can be the server to network boot 20 machines at once. | Sep 25 07:48 |
| iophk | Do you have a spare machine at home? | Sep 25 07:49 |
| sebsebseb | oiaohm: yes I know and I Tried to explain to these guys, but they don't get it, it seems | Sep 25 07:49 |
| iophk | Or at work? | Sep 25 07:49 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: including livecd image hosted on the server. | Sep 25 07:49 |
| oiaohm | iophk: I have used a laptop. | Sep 25 07:49 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I was giving some kind of mini desktop PC, needs a harddisk in it | Sep 25 07:49 |
| oiaohm | iophk: a windows laptop. | Sep 25 07:49 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: it's old , but useable | Sep 25 07:49 |
| oiaohm | iophk: yes wrong windows laptop installing Linux machines. | Sep 25 07:49 |
| iophk | Can it do PXE booting? The settings will be in the BIOS | Sep 25 07:50 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: probably not even had that one on yet | Sep 25 07:50 |
| iophk | You turn it on, do the install, then restore the settings to off. | Sep 25 07:50 |
| *sebsebseb needs to ix his normal desktop too, but that's something else | Sep 25 07:50 | |
| iophk | For your PXE/tftp/dhcp server, I would recommend dnsmasq | Sep 25 07:51 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: oiaohm I think with this whole event an issue at times,is that got some older guy in charge,who thinks he knows best at times,when he doesn't | Sep 25 07:51 |
| sebsebseb | to be honest the whole thing is annoing me at the moment | Sep 25 07:51 |
| sebsebseb | since can't even properly havepeoplelooking through the pros and cons | Sep 25 07:51 |
| sebsebseb | of the techoptons | Sep 25 07:51 |
| sebsebseb | other than myself it seems so faruh | Sep 25 07:51 |
| sebsebseb | and then he sends a email too confirm if stuff is from ofial repo's uh, when there is other techstuff, that shou be thought about and consideredproperly, and al that uh | Sep 25 07:52 |
| iophk | is there a white board where you can draw a matrix of the options and their pros and cons? | Sep 25 07:53 |
| sebsebseb | and this channel gets publically logged, maybe I'll regret saying some of the stufff in here today, but freedom of speech I guess | Sep 25 07:53 |
| sebsebseb | in here today, one day, above | Sep 25 07:54 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I just hope we can get some other volunteers on board soon, and ones that are qute technial, and know about htis kind of stuff | Sep 25 07:54 |
| sebsebseb | that could then sove some tech issues nicely and properly :) | Sep 25 07:55 |
| sebsebseb | I think in fact I am not being taken as seriosuy as I shou be by certain people | Sep 25 07:55 |
| sebsebseb | ,beause I am reasoanbly young still andsuch | Sep 25 07:55 |
| iophk | you should actively recruit a person or two to help you | Sep 25 07:55 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: yeah wel it seems might hav lost one vouunteer atsuay | Sep 25 07:56 |
| sebsebseb | not suire qite | Sep 25 07:56 |
| sebsebseb | but yeah shoud try and get some more from the LUG meeting this Saturday I Think :) | Sep 25 07:56 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: maybe evenif it's just a new person to the LUG meeting, there's one coming appanratly, no idea who that is yet, but yeah | Sep 25 07:56 |
| sebsebseb | he may want to help out for examle | Sep 25 07:56 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: I think need a few peole mor eto hep idealy yeah, 4 isn't reall much, inluding myself uh | Sep 25 07:57 |
| sebsebseb | iophk: good to have more coing to the organisers meetings | Sep 25 07:57 |
| iophk | find someone to set up PXE booting and grub with a selection of ISO images | Sep 25 07:59 |
| oiaohm | iophk: http://tftpd32.jounin.net/ On windows. | Sep 25 07:59 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | tftpd32.jounin.net | TFTPD32 : an opensource IPv6 ready TFTP server/service for windows : TFTP server | Sep 25 07:59 |
| oiaohm | iophk: yep that is dhcp and tftp in one roll in appache something for windows and you are rocking. | Sep 25 07:59 |
| iophk | It would be easier and safer to set up on Linux or BSD | Sep 25 08:00 |
| iophk | also trying to use Windows would look bad, in addition to being difficult | Sep 25 08:00 |
| oiaohm | iophk: at the time the windows computer was the only one that was not broken. | Sep 25 08:00 |
| oiaohm | Yes the last resort option. | Sep 25 08:01 |
| iophk | windows == broken :P | Sep 25 08:01 |
| oiaohm | iophk: Ok it booted. | Sep 25 08:01 |
| oiaohm | iophk: I had the fun of a broken kernel package somehow evilly installing. | Sep 25 08:01 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: any computer will do to run a PXE setup. | Sep 25 08:02 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: Linux/bsd will be better don't run into windows stupid conneciton limits. | Sep 25 08:02 |
| oiaohm | sebsebseb: the major advantage of the PXE solution is you don't risk it being nicked bit by bit as the day goes on. | Sep 25 08:07 |
| iophk | or scratched and scuffed | Sep 25 08:11 |
| oiaohm | worst I have done is gone threw a few network cables. | Sep 25 08:13 |
| oiaohm | using PXE solutions. | Sep 25 08:13 |
| oiaohm | Ok I am a cabler I have the tools to re do the ends in my car. | Sep 25 08:13 |
| iophk | I guess it to be careful you need extra cables and to lock up all the spare parts not in use. | Sep 25 08:13 |
| iophk | cable smith | Sep 25 08:14 |
| iophk | I bet if you tape the cables down to the table they will be less likely to wander off. | Sep 25 08:14 |
| oiaohm | iophk: if you really sus hot glued to switch. | Sep 25 08:15 |
| oiaohm | Yes it possible to do PXE systems that are really hard to walk off with without tools. | Sep 25 08:16 |
| oiaohm | Best I have seen is lockable tool box with g clamp hole out bottom grommits around the cables with switch and server inside. | Sep 25 08:18 |
| oiaohm | iophk: Yes thief has to walk off with complete table. | Sep 25 08:18 |
| <--cubezzz has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) | Sep 25 08:20 | |
| <--sebsebseb has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 08:33 | |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382845839674466304 https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/382821074737844224 | Sep 25 08:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: Linux Back Door Question Revisited in the Age of Government #Surveillance Crimes http://t.co/yjUUISoUXA #nvidia #amd #linux #nsa | Sep 25 08:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | Linux Back Door Question Revisited in the Age of Government Surveillance Crimes | Techrights | Sep 25 08:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @schestowitz: Public Services and Government Branches Compelled to Adopt Free/Libre Software http://t.co/L1iMxI8vfF #egov #freedom | Sep 25 08:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | -> techrights.org | Public Services and Government Branches Compelled to Adopt Free/Libre Software | Techrights | Sep 25 08:37 |
| roy_ | https://twitter.com/_Goblin/status/382797844769292288 https://twitter.com/_Goblin/status/382798058469085184 | Sep 25 08:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @_Goblin: @schestowitz Agreed, although by some (not you) my views on proprietary gaming were dismissed all those years ago...Seems I was right. | Sep 25 08:37 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | @_Goblin: @schestowitz For the mainstream,Opensrc is just not the ticket for gaming...sure there's some great titles, but proprietary is where its at. | Sep 25 08:37 |
| -->sebsebseb (~mageiause@fsf/member/sebsebseb) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 08:48 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 08:48 | |
| <--oiaohm has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 09:13 | |
| <--Cirrus_Minor has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) | Sep 25 09:20 | |
| -->abeNd-org (~Keith@216.201.219.82) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 09:25 | |
| -->DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@unaffiliated/daemonfc) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 09:42 | |
| DaemonFC | Didn't buy the Olds. | Sep 25 09:43 |
| DaemonFC | The car had numerous problems. | Sep 25 09:43 |
| DaemonFC | The engine was ticking. | Sep 25 09:43 |
| DaemonFC | Could have been an exhaust leak or a sticky lifter. | Sep 25 09:43 |
| DaemonFC | Either way, I don't want to find out. | Sep 25 09:43 |
| DaemonFC | If you're not supposed to take gifts that are ticking, why should you pay for something that's ticking? | Sep 25 09:43 |
| DaemonFC | Am I right, MinceR? Of course I'm right. | Sep 25 09:44 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4089796951.html | Sep 25 09:45 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1993 Toyota Camry LE 143.000 MILES [ http://ur1.ca/fp8ey ] | Sep 25 09:45 |
| DaemonFC | That may be worth looking into. | Sep 25 09:45 |
| MinceR | you don't buy clocks? :> | Sep 25 09:45 |
| DaemonFC | It's got 143,000 miles, but it's a Toyota. | Sep 25 09:45 |
| DaemonFC | I've seen those things going to 400,000 and over. | Sep 25 09:45 |
| DaemonFC | You almost never see a Ford or Chevy do that. | Sep 25 09:46 |
| MinceR | :> | Sep 25 09:46 |
| DaemonFC | Anything other than a Japanese car that has over 120, you don't really want to look much further unless it's dirt cheap. | Sep 25 09:46 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, "I'm in a union, I can scratch my butt and put engines together backwards all day long and you can't fire me!" | Sep 25 09:46 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 09:47 |
| DaemonFC | "Recall? Why would we recall it for an engine compartment fire? It's a Chevy, the engine is supposed to catch fire. In fact, you should really pay us $500 more for the engine that catches fire option package!" | Sep 25 09:48 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4088743874.html | Sep 25 09:51 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1989 honda rebel [ http://ur1.ca/fp8i6 ] | Sep 25 09:51 |
| DaemonFC | That's a nice bike. | Sep 25 09:51 |
| DaemonFC | Unfortunately, Indiana has some harsh winters. | Sep 25 09:51 |
| DaemonFC | So you can't drive it for a few months out of the year. | Sep 25 09:52 |
| DaemonFC | That's why I never looked in to getting a motorcycle license. | Sep 25 09:52 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4088628794.html | Sep 25 09:52 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | S10 [ http://ur1.ca/fp8io ] | Sep 25 09:52 |
| DaemonFC | I'd be tired of having a truck in my front yard that didn't run. | Sep 25 09:52 |
| DaemonFC | At that point, it's just a really expensive lawn ornament. | Sep 25 09:53 |
| DaemonFC | I might call down to that Gary's auto sales. | Sep 25 09:55 |
| DaemonFC | He had a Taurus that looked like it was an 00-03 maybe. | Sep 25 09:55 |
| DaemonFC | Sticker said $1900. | Sep 25 09:55 |
| DaemonFC | I'm pretty sure it's a pile of crap at that price, but what the hell? | Sep 25 09:55 |
| DaemonFC | It's right down the street from me. | Sep 25 09:55 |
| MinceR | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMGIbOGu8q0&feature=youtu.be | Sep 25 09:56 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | That Mitchell and Webb Look: Homeopathic A&E - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fp8ki ] | Sep 25 09:56 |
| DaemonFC | Nobody maintains their vehicles as well as I do. | Sep 25 09:56 |
| DaemonFC | That idiot with the Oldsmobile fucking put like 6-7 quarts of oil in it. | Sep 25 09:56 |
| DaemonFC | A 3.1 liter GM 60 degree V6 should have 4.5 quarts in it. | Sep 25 09:56 |
| DaemonFC | With it being that overfilled, it's a wonder it hasn't blown a head gasket or something yet. | Sep 25 09:57 |
| DaemonFC | Surprisingly, the coolant and transmission fluid checked out OK. | Sep 25 09:57 |
| DaemonFC | It's always nice to see someone maintaining their transmission. | Sep 25 09:57 |
| DaemonFC | Most used cars, you pull the dipstick and there's this black shit all over it. | Sep 25 09:58 |
| DaemonFC | At that point, you have to wonder when the transmission will fail. | Sep 25 09:58 |
| DaemonFC | Probably soon. | Sep 25 09:58 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4082105817.html | Sep 25 10:00 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 92' Chevy Lumina [ http://ur1.ca/fp8mz ] | Sep 25 10:00 |
| DaemonFC | Cracked windshield. | Sep 25 10:00 |
| -->jono (~jono@ubuntu/member/jono) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 10:00 | |
| DaemonFC | Like anyone in their right mind is going to put a new $600 windshield in an $800 car. | Sep 25 10:00 |
| DaemonFC | I asked that sales guy at City Ford if he'd look into a Chevy Malibu for me. | Sep 25 10:08 |
| DaemonFC | He just called back and said it's a giant pile of crap. | Sep 25 10:08 |
| DaemonFC | So I asked him to look into that Ford Freestar van. | Sep 25 10:08 |
| DaemonFC | Told him "Hey, I noticed it's been on your lot since August. If you can make me a deal on it, I might be able to take it off your hands." | Sep 25 10:09 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 10:09 |
| DaemonFC | He said the Carfax says it hit a deer. | Sep 25 10:09 |
| DaemonFC | Must have been repaired well because I couldn't see any damage. | Sep 25 10:09 |
| DaemonFC | I told him it's like Ron White said "If you ever have problems deer hunting, just slow the bullet down to 55 and put a little horn and some headlights on it. They'll jump out in front of it." | Sep 25 10:10 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4031728948.html | Sep 25 10:12 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1996 Oldsmobile Ciera - ONLY 74K Miles!!! White [ http://ur1.ca/fp8su ] | Sep 25 10:12 |
| DaemonFC | I just texted this dude. | Sep 25 10:12 |
| DaemonFC | It says August, so I bet he's sold it. | Sep 25 10:12 |
| DaemonFC | If he hasn't, there's probably issues with it. | Sep 25 10:12 |
| DaemonFC | Can't hurt to ask/look. | Sep 25 10:13 |
| DaemonFC | If he says yes, my mom works in Fort Wayne anyway, and so does Dave. | Sep 25 10:13 |
| DaemonFC | I could ask them to check it out on their way home. | Sep 25 10:13 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4046958531.html | Sep 25 10:14 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | s10 98" 4 SALE $$ !! [ http://ur1.ca/fp8tz ] | Sep 25 10:14 |
| DaemonFC | I can't believe anyone would buy a pickup truck with a 2.2 liter 4 cylinder engine in it. | Sep 25 10:14 |
| DaemonFC | What the hell are you going to haul with that? It probably barely moves the truck. | Sep 25 10:14 |
| DaemonFC | 4 cylinder engines are for clown cars. | Sep 25 10:15 |
| -->cubezzz (~cubeman@maxhost.org) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 10:16 | |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4054983654.html | Sep 25 10:16 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1996 Honda Civic Lx [ http://ur1.ca/fp8v4 ] | Sep 25 10:16 |
| DaemonFC | A Honda that someone spray painted black that appears to be missing its hubcaps. | Sep 25 10:16 |
| DaemonFC | Yikes. | Sep 25 10:17 |
| DaemonFC | http://www.cityautomall.com/VehicleDetails/used-2004-Ford-Freestar_Wagon-4dr_SEL-Columbia_City-IN/2065800953 | Sep 25 10:25 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.cityautomall.com | 2004 Ford Freestar Wagon for sale in Columbia City - 2FMZA52244BB20397 - City Automall [ http://ur1.ca/fp8zy ] | Sep 25 10:25 |
| DaemonFC | There's the van I asked him to look at for me. | Sep 25 10:25 |
| DaemonFC | What do you think, MinceR? | Sep 25 10:25 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 10:25 |
| *MinceR shrugs | Sep 25 10:26 | |
| DaemonFC | http://www.mikeanderson.com/used/Pontiac/2002-Pontiac-Montana-33075d6b0a0a00de00a16748b12eb201.htm | Sep 25 10:26 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.mikeanderson.com | Used 2002 Pontiac Montana For Sale | www.MikeAnderson.com [ http://ur1.ca/fp910 ] | Sep 25 10:26 |
| DaemonFC | Asked them to look into that one for me. | Sep 25 10:26 |
| <--iophk has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Sep 25 10:57 | |
| -->iophk (~Adium@unaffiliated/iophk) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 12:07 | |
| ---ChanServ gives channel operator status to iophk | Sep 25 12:07 | |
| <--iophk has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) | Sep 25 12:11 | |
| -->iophk1 (~Adium@unaffiliated/iophk) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 12:11 | |
| ---ChanServ gives channel operator status to iophk1 | Sep 25 12:11 | |
| ---iophk1 is now known as iophk | Sep 25 12:16 | |
| -->Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@unaffiliated/cirrus-minor/x-6868843) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 12:25 | |
| <--sebsebseb has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 12:52 | |
| DaemonFC | That RoadLoans is a joke. | Sep 25 13:09 |
| DaemonFC | They wanted to give me a car loan at 16.5% APR. | Sep 25 13:09 |
| DaemonFC | My credit card is 12.9. | Sep 25 13:09 |
| DaemonFC | I'd actually be better off buying a car with my credit card. | Sep 25 13:09 |
| DaemonFC | I have old medical bills that are haunting me, so if I want a car, I just have to save up and pay in cash. | Sep 25 13:14 |
| DaemonFC | Which kind of limits me to the crap that other people don't want. | Sep 25 13:14 |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=towwx7KOWDE | Sep 25 13:15 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | : Cell Phones & Car Ads : Foamy The Squirrel - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpbem ] | Sep 25 13:15 |
| DaemonFC | Certified Pre-Fucked automobile. | Sep 25 13:15 |
| DaemonFC | That cash for clunkers bullshit basically removed 16 million mostly perfectly driveable vehicles from the market. | Sep 25 13:16 |
| DaemonFC | Cars that worked had shit poured into the crankcase to seize up the engine so that rich people could get $4,500 of MY money to buy a new car with. | Sep 25 13:17 |
| DaemonFC | And the program brought up the average fuel economy of the entire United States car "fleet" by a whopping......0.4%. | Sep 25 13:17 |
| DaemonFC | The CO2 emissions of the United States has actually been reduced more by people who can no longer actually afford to drive anything at all than cash for clunkers. | Sep 25 13:18 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR, I have a better suggestion for being kind to the environment. | Sep 25 13:19 |
| DaemonFC | You know how they take old ships out to sea and sink them to make artificial reefs? | Sep 25 13:19 |
| DaemonFC | They should put these fucking politicians that passed cash for clunkers on one of those ships. | Sep 25 13:20 |
| DaemonFC | Give the marine life something to eat so it can get a big head start to grow. | Sep 25 13:20 |
| DaemonFC | Even worse than cash for clunkers is the fact that alot of the people who were buying cars and getting rid of them when they still had more than half their usable service life left can't afford to do that anymore. | Sep 25 13:23 |
| DaemonFC | They've been driven into the used car market themselves. | Sep 25 13:23 |
| DaemonFC | So you have more people fighting over fewer used vehicles. | Sep 25 13:24 |
| DaemonFC | So the price of a usable used car has basically doubled. | Sep 25 13:24 |
| DaemonFC | Anything that runs is now going for $1,500 or more. | Sep 25 13:24 |
| DaemonFC | Used to be that you could get a 10 year old car with about 100,000 miles on it for $2,000. | Sep 25 13:25 |
| DaemonFC | That seems to be more like $4,000 now. | Sep 25 13:25 |
| DaemonFC | People are hanging on to what they've got and only putting it on the market when it's so far gone that it needs major repairs every month. | Sep 25 13:26 |
| DaemonFC | So the stuff floating around on Craigslist is basically crap and the things people are trading in at dealers is even worse. | Sep 25 13:26 |
| DaemonFC | This means that there's more demand for car repair, so hourly rates for shop time is going up as well. | Sep 25 13:27 |
| DaemonFC | It's probably going to take a few more years for the used car market to sort itself out, and I'm just afraid that I can't keep what I have running long enough to watch prices return to normal. | Sep 25 13:29 |
| MinceR | those politicians might have too much poison and pollutants in them though :> | Sep 25 13:35 |
| iophk | http://www.forbes.com/sites/terokuittinen/2013/09/24/nokia-admits-giving-misleading-information-about-elops-compensation/ | Sep 25 13:49 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.forbes.com | Nokia Admits Giving Misleading Information About Elop's Compensation - Forbes [ http://ur1.ca/fpbum ] | Sep 25 13:49 |
| iophk | 'According to Helsingin Sanomat, when chairman Siilasmaa was questioned about Elops contract last Friday, he made the false claim of there being no essential changes' | Sep 25 13:53 |
| iophk | So the board not only looked complicit, they actually were complicit. | Sep 25 13:53 |
| -->Faither (~Muh@krlh-d9be796e.pool.mediaWays.net) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 14:50 | |
| puppywatch | -- | Sep 25 14:54 |
| <--DaemonFC has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | Sep 25 15:10 | |
| <--Faither has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 15:46 | |
| iophk | http://www.fastcompany.com/3018385/fast-feed/a-not-my-email-button-because-yahoo-users-are-getting-other-peoples-emails | Sep 25 15:47 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.fastcompany.com | A "Not My Email" Button, Because Yahoo Users Are Getting Other People's Emails | Fast Company | Business + Innovation [ http://ur1.ca/fpdio ] | Sep 25 15:47 |
| -->DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@unaffiliated/daemonfc) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 15:48 | |
| <--Cirrus_Minor has quit (Quit: Status Code 410 :c. ) | Sep 25 15:48 | |
| -->Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@unaffiliated/cirrus-minor/x-6868843) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 15:49 | |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4090876023.html | Sep 25 16:01 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | HEADS UP about "1994 CUTLASS CIERA 77,676 ACTUAL MILES" [ http://ur1.ca/fpdp7 ] | Sep 25 16:01 |
| iophk | They might not be fast enough to grab Elop and put him in jail. But Siilasmaa is another matter. Maybe some of the other board members that had helped play along. | Sep 25 16:02 |
| ---roy_ is now known as schestowitz | Sep 25 16:04 | |
| -->ThistleWeb (~gordon@unaffiliated/thistleweb) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 16:07 | |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4090517168.html | Sep 25 16:08 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 1999 Ford Taurus SE [ http://ur1.ca/fpdrz ] | Sep 25 16:08 |
| DaemonFC | Holy shit.... | Sep 25 16:08 |
| DaemonFC | A Ford Taurus with 352,593 miles on the odometer! | Sep 25 16:09 |
| DaemonFC | This is like Al Bundy's Dodge. | Sep 25 16:09 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Sep 25 16:09 |
| *MinceR dodges it | Sep 25 16:09 | |
| DaemonFC | "And on that day son, you're going to have to outrun the Dodge!" | Sep 25 16:10 |
| DaemonFC | "Dad....Rush Limbaugh could outrun the Dodge." | Sep 25 16:10 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Sep 25 16:10 |
| <--ThistleWeb has quit (Client Quit) | Sep 25 16:11 | |
| DaemonFC | http://www.albundy.net/lyrics_pdad.php | Sep 25 16:12 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.albundy.net | Als Biography | Sep 25 16:12 |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GFq6usPg6U | Sep 25 16:12 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | al bundy - psycho dad - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpduc ] | Sep 25 16:12 |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZs5ROkC0G8 | Sep 25 16:14 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | Al Bundy Bad to the bone - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpdvd ] | Sep 25 16:14 |
| MinceR | :) | Sep 25 16:15 |
| <--iophk has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) | Sep 25 16:15 | |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inubkn_TmUs | Sep 25 16:21 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | Bundy Family Barbecue - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpdy3 ] | Sep 25 16:21 |
| DaemonFC | Best. Show. EVER. | Sep 25 16:21 |
| DaemonFC | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVklEwDhUaA | Sep 25 16:29 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | www.youtube.com | Married With Children - Al Bundy vs Ms Blaub - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/fpe21 ] | Sep 25 16:29 |
| DaemonFC | https://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/4090684052.html | Sep 25 16:31 |
| TechrightsBot-tr | fortwayne.craigslist.org | 2000 Chrysler Town and Country Van [ http://ur1.ca/fpe3a ] | Sep 25 16:31 |
| DaemonFC | I wonder what's going on lately. | Sep 25 16:31 |
| DaemonFC | $2,000 for a van with 218,000 miles on it. | Sep 25 16:32 |
| DaemonFC | After 200,000, it's really anyone's guess how long it will run. | Sep 25 16:32 |
| DaemonFC | Could go out tomorrow, could make it into the 260s or 270s. | Sep 25 16:32 |
| -->pookito (~quassel@pool-108-20-34-111.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 16:45 | |
| <--DaemonFC has quit (Remote host closed the connection) | Sep 25 17:01 | |
| MinceR | gn | Sep 25 17:03 |
| <--pookito (~quassel@pool-108-20-34-111.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) has left #techrights ("http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.") | Sep 25 17:27 | |
| <--abeNd-org has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Sep 25 17:32 | |
| <--Sosumi has quit (Quit: Leaving) | Sep 25 17:57 | |
| -->sebsebseb (~mageiause@fsf/member/sebsebseb) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 18:02 | |
| sebsebseb | Sep 25 18:02 | |
| <--flatr0ze has quit (Quit: Communi 2.2.0) | Sep 25 18:42 | |
| <--sebsebseb has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 18:48 | |
| <--Cirrus_Minor has quit (Quit: Status Code 410 :c. ) | Sep 25 20:22 | |
| -->amarsh04 (~amarsh04@2001:44b8:61::d) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 20:54 | |
| <--amarsh04 has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 21:02 | |
| -->amarsh04 (~amarsh04@2001:44b8:61::d) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:02 | |
| <--schestowitz has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) | Sep 25 21:03 | |
| <--pidgin_log1 has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) | Sep 25 21:05 | |
| <--libertybox_ has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) | Sep 25 21:05 | |
| <--puppywatch has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) | Sep 25 21:05 | |
| <--schestowitz_mob has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) | Sep 25 21:05 | |
| <--schestowitz_log has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) | Sep 25 21:06 | |
| <--jono has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat) | Sep 25 21:07 | |
| -->schestowitz_log (~schestowi@host31-51-213-45.range31-51.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:15 | |
| <--schestowitz_log has quit (Changing host) | Sep 25 21:15 | |
| -->schestowitz_log (~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:15 | |
| -->schestowitz (~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:15 | |
| -->libertybox_ (~liberty@host31-51-213-45.range31-51.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:15 | |
| -->schestowitz_mob (~HP@host31-51-213-45.range31-51.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:15 | |
| -->puppywatch (~PuppyWatc@host31-51-213-45.range31-51.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:18 | |
| -->pidgin_log (~roy@host31-51-213-45.range31-51.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:20 | |
| -->roy_ (~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:30 | |
| <--schestowitz has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) | Sep 25 21:31 | |
| -->TakinOver (~quassel@74-84-89-62.client.mchsi.com) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 21:54 | |
| <--amarsh04 has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Sep 25 22:35 | |
| -->amarsh04 (~amarsh04@2001:44b8:61::d) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 22:38 | |
| <--prurigro has quit (K-Lined) | Sep 25 22:42 | |
| <--XFaCE has quit (K-Lined) | Sep 25 22:42 | |
| -->prurigro (prurigro@2600:3c03::f03c:91ff:fedf:bb8a) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 22:43 | |
| -->XFaCE (XFaCE@unaffiliated/xface) has joined #techrights | Sep 25 22:43 | |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.6 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!