IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: July 5th, 2015-July 11th, 2015

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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines You Can Now Upgrade to Linux Mint 17.2	Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	"Rafaela" http://t.co/Ts3d19S9uz	Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n077m	Jul 05 00:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| You Can Now Upgrade to Linux Mint 17.2 "Rafaela" \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 14.10 (Utopic Unicorn) to Reach End of	Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	Life Soon http://t.co/m7hYT7FWMd	Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n077v	Jul 05 00:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu 14.10 (Utopic Unicorn) to Reach End of Life Soon \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Intel Has More Graphics Code For Testing, Plans	Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	For Linux 4.3 http://t.co/pKcszBMjsj	Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 00:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n077w	Jul 05 00:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Intel Has More Graphics Code For Testing, Plans For Linux 4.3 \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 00:54
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cubexyz	anyone know of a paint program that can extend an image to the left or to the top?	Jul 05 05:51
cubexyz	not stretching but adding new space	Jul 05 05:51
msb__	cubexyz: Can you just insert your image into the middle of a bigger white space?	Jul 05 06:26
cubexyz	no, imagemagick 6 or higher has a better method	Jul 05 06:26
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE Plasma 5.3.2 Lands in Kubuntu 15.10 (Wily	Jul 05 06:26
TweetTuxMachines	Werewolf) http://t.co/Yf4uwM88nn	Jul 05 06:26
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 06:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| KDE Plasma 5.3.2 Lands in Kubuntu 15.10 (Wily Werewolf) \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 06:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n09wf	Jul 05 06:26
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Parsix GNU/Linux 8.0 to Finally Switch to GNOME	Jul 05 06:26
TweetTuxMachines	3.16, Linux Kernel 4.0 http://t.co/octWzZwRZ5	Jul 05 06:26
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 06:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Parsix GNU/Linux 8.0 to Finally Switch to GNOME 3.16, Linux Kernel 4.0 \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 06:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n09wg	Jul 05 06:26
cubexyz	e.g. convert file.jpg -splice 0x100 splice_top.jpg	Jul 05 06:27
cubexyz	splices in 100 pixels worth of white space at the top	Jul 05 06:27
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines YotaPhone drops Android for Sailfish OS	Jul 05 08:26
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/bmgNIwxLJg	Jul 05 08:26
TweetTuxMachines	(www.androidauthority.com)	Jul 05 08:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.androidauthority.com \| YotaPhone drops Android for Sailfish OS - Android Authority		Jul 05 08:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0awz	Jul 05 08:26
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines You Can Now Upgrade to Linux Mint 17.2	Jul 05 08:27
TweetTuxMachines	"Rafaela" http://t.co/qyZES9La4C	Jul 05 08:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| You Can Now Upgrade to Linux Mint 17.2 "Rafaela" - Softpedia		Jul 05 08:27
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 08:27
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0ax0	Jul 05 08:27
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 14.10 (Utopic Unicorn) to Reach End of	Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	Life Soon http://t.co/hisrg8q4O9	Jul 05 08:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu 14.10 (Utopic Unicorn) to Reach End of Life Soon - Softpedia		Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0axy	Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Intel Has More Graphics Code For Testing, Plans	Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	For Linux 4.3 http://t.co/fMEVMuDMIv	Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 08:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Intel Has More Graphics Code For Testing, Plans For Linux 4.3 - Phoronix		Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0axz	Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE Plasma 5.3.2 Lands in Kubuntu 15.10 (Wily	Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	Werewolf) http://t.co/IIAQu38yae	Jul 05 08:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| KDE Plasma 5.3.2 Lands in Kubuntu 15.10 (Wily Werewolf) - Softpedia		Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	(linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0ay0	Jul 05 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Parsix GNU/Linux 8.0 to Finally Switch to GNOME	Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	3.16, Linux Kernel 4.0 http://t.co/lvmQNviBrI	Jul 05 08:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Parsix GNU/Linux 8.0 to Finally Switch to GNOME 3.16, Linux Kernel 4.0 - Softpedia		Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b1j	Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Docker Machine 0.3.0 Deep Dive	Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/1J8hRjTcJ9 (blog.docker.com)	Jul 05 08:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-blog.docker.com \| Docker Machine 0.3.0 Deep Dive \| Docker Blog		Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b1k	Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project	Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	Leader http://t.co/qRJYtkqOox	Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	(www.mylinuxrig.com)	Jul 05 08:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.mylinuxrig.com \| The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project... - My Linux Rig		Jul 05 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b1l	Jul 05 08:41
*TweetTuxMachines @mccourt_360 favourited 'The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project...'		Jul 05 08:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The July 2015 issue of the PCLinuxOS Magazine	Jul 05 08:50
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/kTv1WtaFvU (lxer.com)	Jul 05 08:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lxer.com \| LXer: The July 2015 issue of the PCLinuxOS Magazine		Jul 05 08:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b4n	Jul 05 08:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project	Jul 05 08:53
TweetTuxMachines	Leader http://t.co/pD2hWSOOKl	Jul 05 08:53
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 08:53
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project Leader \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 08:53
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b5h	Jul 05 08:53
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The July 2015 issue of the PCLinuxOS Magazine	Jul 05 08:53
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/f6FKFEmBOP (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 08:53
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b5i	Jul 05 08:53
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| The July 2015 issue of the PCLinuxOS Magazine \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 08:53
*TweetTuxMachines @tlongren favourited 'Docker Machine 0.3.0 Deep Dive http://t.co/1J8hRjTcJ9'		Jul 05 09:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer	Jul 05 09:05
TweetTuxMachines	in Unity 8, Support for Refunds	Jul 05 09:05
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Q3YsAo7Lkz (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 09:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer in Unity 8, Support for Refunds - Softpedia		Jul 05 09:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b9l	Jul 05 09:05
*TweetTuxMachines @Ubuntu_topics favourited 'Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer...'		Jul 05 09:16
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2 Bringing Support For ARCv2, HS38 CPU	Jul 05 09:16
TweetTuxMachines	Cores http://t.co/JXeqFea011 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 09:16
TweetTuxMachines	also http://t.co/k9pyWAqFIS (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 09:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bcv	Jul 05 09:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Linux 4.2 Bringing Support For ARCv2, HS38 CPU Cores - Phoronix		Jul 05 09:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Radeon & AMDGPU DRM Fixes Queue Up For Linux 4.2 - Phoronix		Jul 05 09:16
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Snappy Open House Is Your Chance to Get	Jul 05 09:16
TweetTuxMachines	Familiar with Ubuntu Snappy	Jul 05 09:16
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/hQJkcQaEgh (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 09:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Snappy Open House Is Your Chance to Get Familiar with Ubuntu Snappy - Softpedia		Jul 05 09:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bcw	Jul 05 09:16
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines First Ubuntu Snappy Open House Announced,	Jul 05 09:27
TweetTuxMachines	UbuCon Germany Planning Continues	Jul 05 09:27
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/mSjCbxv8c8 (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 09:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| First Ubuntu Snappy Open House Announced, UbuCon Germany Planning Continues - Softpedia		Jul 05 09:27
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bgg	Jul 05 09:27
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Benchmarks Of 54 Different Intel/AMD Linux	Jul 05 09:27
TweetTuxMachines	Systems http://t.co/4tEVpi246l	Jul 05 09:27
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 09:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Benchmarks Of 54 Different Intel/AMD Linux Systems - Phoronix		Jul 05 09:27
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bgh	Jul 05 09:27
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer	Jul 05 09:28
TweetTuxMachines	in Unity 8, Support for Refunds	Jul 05 09:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/NOHo5ISXkN (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 09:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bgk	Jul 05 09:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer in Unity 8, Support for Refunds \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 09:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2 Bringing Support For ARCv2, HS38 CPU	Jul 05 09:28
TweetTuxMachines	Cores http://t.co/dmwhdkIvCB	Jul 05 09:28
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 09:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux 4.2 Bringing Support For ARCv2, HS38 CPU Cores \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 09:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bgm	Jul 05 09:28
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Snappy Open House Is Your Chance to Get	Jul 05 10:08
TweetTuxMachines	Familiar with Ubuntu Snappy	Jul 05 10:08
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/nhksLI1liG (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 10:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bt5	Jul 05 10:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Snappy Open House Is Your Chance to Get Familiar with Ubuntu Snappy \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 10:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Benchmarks Of 54 Different Intel/AMD Linux	Jul 05 10:08
TweetTuxMachines	Systems http://t.co/fQNxomw5QK	Jul 05 10:08
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 10:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bt6	Jul 05 10:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Benchmarks Of 54 Different Intel/AMD Linux Systems \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 10:08
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r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/DaveGaleUK/status/617656087815319553	Jul 05 15:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@DaveGaleUK: @schestowitz Plenty more where that came from: https://t.co/Rxcztlwwca		Jul 05 15:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> tadag.wordpress.com \| History \| tadag - Trusted Authenticated Domains and Gateways		Jul 05 15:15
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/mellenoweth/status/617683351042957314	Jul 05 15:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mellenoweth: @schestowitz looked it up, very interesting!		Jul 05 15:16
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/spastri/status/617710197369274368	Jul 05 16:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@spastri: @schestowitz and people are fed up with them! #Greece #referendum #NO		Jul 05 16:05
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/spastri/status/617710416492277760	Jul 05 16:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@spastri: "Greece's majority outlets are owned by corporate titans and other oligarchs" and people are fed up with them! https://t.co/KZJ0tET9JA		Jul 05 16:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: "Greece's biggest news outlets are owned by corporate titans and other "oligarchs"" http://t.co/ivZqITiSPH #greece		Jul 05 16:05
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/saitta_chris/status/617710752338542592	Jul 05 16:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@saitta_chris: @schestowitz That will all be eating Chinese food soon		Jul 05 16:06
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*TweetTuxMachines @LukeVizzicks followed @tuxmachines		Jul 05 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2 Offers Performance Improvements For	Jul 05 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	Non-Transparent Bridging http://t.co/waTQcRkVJc	Jul 05 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 16:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux 4.2 Offers Performance Improvements For Non-Transparent Bridging \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0erm	Jul 05 16:26
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/saitta_chris/status/617712899633491968	Jul 05 16:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@saitta_chris: @schestowitz I think Greece, Turkey, Italy, Egypt, Cyprus, Spain, Portugal, Ireland should create their own Union, UK and France are welcome		Jul 05 16:30
r_schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6297117	Jul 05 16:33
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: #snowden did not pass documents electronically to journalists; did it in person in #hk after communicating not so securely with Greenwald		Jul 05 16:33
r_schestowitz	"	Jul 05 16:33
r_schestowitz	You can watch the download using rsync (with Tails) in the film Citizenfour. Snowden typed a passphrase out of sight of everyone in the room to start the second transfer. It was interesting to me that he confidently said he couldn’t be compelled to give up the documents. I suspect he provided a way to make it impossible for him to get to the documents after he had passed them on to Poitras and Greenwald.	Jul 05 16:33
r_schestowitz	I’ve been thinking how I would make something like that happen. I think the best way would be to copy the documents to a virtual machine, and then remotely restart that machine when I was sure the documents were copied to Greenwald’s SD cards. (We see him pull one SD card out and replace it with another. He then says something about marking one of them with a Sharpie to keep the two (with similar directory structure) from being	Jul 05 16:33
r_schestowitz	confused. Greenwald booted Tails from a memory stick. We see that happen too.	Jul 05 16:33
r_schestowitz	Snowden didn’t take the documents to Moscow; he didn’t even take a physical copy to Hong Kong. Schneier speculates that something may have been copied surreptitiously from Greenwald by one or more governments. Greenwald admits his lack of understanding to computer security and encryption in his book. I’d use Tails booted from the DVD when I wanted to read and copy from the documents. I’d keep the whole cache on SD cards or memory	Jul 05 16:33
r_schestowitz	sticks with one, LUKS-encrypted EXT4 partition. I’d decrypt the files only after I’d copied them to Tails home directory. I’d never let the unencrypted stuff touch a storage medium.	Jul 05 16:33
r_schestowitz	For more info, read No Place to Hide, by Greenwald.	Jul 05 16:33
r_schestowitz	"	Jul 05 16:33
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Lava to Launch Google Android One 2.0	Jul 05 16:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/QASgLhGaZ5 (www.ibtimes.co.in)	Jul 05 16:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f0s	Jul 05 16:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.ibtimes.co.in \| Lava to Launch Google Android One 2.0 Series with Mid-Range Specifications in Mid-July: Report		Jul 05 16:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence	Jul 05 16:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Us58fLVmdP (www.fool.com)	Jul 05 16:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f0t	Jul 05 16:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.fool.com \| Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence -- The Motley Fool		Jul 05 16:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Is Android the New Windows?	Jul 05 16:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/wudYVczsmL (recode.net)	Jul 05 16:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-recode.net \| Is Android the New Windows? \| Re/code		Jul 05 16:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f0u	Jul 05 16:56
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Report: Better Android One devices to launch in	Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	India, cost $189 http://t.co/BaG9Sr7dNi	Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	(arstechnica.com)	Jul 05 17:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-arstechnica.com \| Report: Better Android One devices to launch in India, cost $189 \| Ars Technica		Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f7o	Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The Android Version Of The Dolphin Nintendo	Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	Gamecube/Wii Emulator Is Coming Along Nicely -	Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	Here It Is Running http://t.co/RE7E2GEKNT	Jul 05 17:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.androidpolice.com \| The Android Version Of The Dolphin Nintendo Gamecube/Wii Emulator Is Coming Along Nicely - Here It Is Running On A SHIELD TV		Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	(www.androidpolice.com)	Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f7p	Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Is this Blackberry's Android phone? Leaked	Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	image reveals curved 'Venice' handset	Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sGRt8a9ka9 (www.dailymail.co.uk)	Jul 05 17:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.dailymail.co.uk \| Blackberry's curved 'Venice' Android phone in leaked image \| Daily Mail Online		Jul 05 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f7q	Jul 05 17:17
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence	Jul 05 18:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/I9PoQTg1te (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 18:31
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0fxc	Jul 05 18:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 18:31
*TweetTuxMachines @speedytux retweeted @tuxmachines: 'Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence http://t.co/I9PoQTg1te'		Jul 05 18:31
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XRevan86	https://xakep.ru/2011/12/26/58104 Interesting story. In Russian though.	Jul 05 22:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Couldn't resolve host 'xakep.ru' ( status 0 @ https://xakep.ru/2011/12/26/58104 )		Jul 05 22:26
XRevan86	I can't find it in English.	Jul 05 22:26
*XRevan86 (~XRevan86@162.244.25.66) has left #techrights		Jul 05 22:31
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Debian/TeX Live 2015.20150703-1	Jul 05 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/BBtF4mL71A (www.preining.info)	Jul 05 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0iew	Jul 05 22:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.preining.info \| Debian/TeX Live 2015.20150703-1 \| There and back again		Jul 05 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines gnome Donations within the EU are now handled	Jul 05 23:45
TweetTuxMachines	through the Wau Holland Foundation	Jul 05 23:45
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/rexvq212iq (www.gnome.org)	Jul 05 23:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0iui	Jul 05 23:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gnome.org \| Donations within the EU are now handled through the Wau Holland Foundation – GNOME		Jul 05 23:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2 Offers Performance Improvements For	Jul 05 23:46
TweetTuxMachines	Non-Transparent Bridging http://t.co/MOpCnqh7xu	Jul 05 23:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Linux 4.2 Offers Performance Improvements For Non-Transparent Bridging - Phoronix		Jul 05 23:46
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 23:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0iuj	Jul 05 23:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines illume OS 3 Linux Distro Officially Released,	Jul 05 23:46
TweetTuxMachines	Based on Debian 8.1 "Jessie"	Jul 05 23:46
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/f1gBQLI2cv (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 23:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| illume OS 3 Linux Distro Officially Released, Based on Debian 8.1 "Jessie" - Softpedia		Jul 05 23:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0iuk	Jul 05 23:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines LibreOffice 5, a foundation for the future	Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/bvkIy5XWtG (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0j7q	Jul 06 00:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| LibreOffice 5, a foundation for the future \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines illume OS 3 Linux Distro Officially Released,	Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	Based on Debian 8.1 "Jessie"	Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/QpENJjvKOo (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0j7r	Jul 06 00:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| illume OS 3 Linux Distro Officially Released, Based on Debian 8.1 "Jessie" \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Do Your Prefer Modern Or Traditional Linux	Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	Desktop Environments? http://t.co/YGXzhzWUmn	Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 00:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Do Your Prefer Modern Or Traditional Linux Desktop Environments? \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 00:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0j7s	Jul 06 00:28
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2-rc1 http://t.co/YmUqeqNKu7	Jul 06 06:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 06:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0m9u	Jul 06 06:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux 4.2-rc1 \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 06:05
TweetTuxMachines	@jfoxdev @tuxmachines Ugh 4.2 already? I'm still trying	Jul 06 06:05
TweetTuxMachines	to patch fglrx for 4.1!	Jul 06 06:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0m9v	Jul 06 06:05
*XRevan86 (~XRevan86@162.244.25.66) has joined #techrights		Jul 06 07:29
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Brushfire Games On Their Linux Sales For	Jul 06 08:48
TweetTuxMachines	Shipwreck & Their Thoughts On Linux	Jul 06 08:48
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/TKTbUqHMNK (www.gamingonlinux.com)	Jul 06 08:48
TweetTuxMachines	"4.40% Linux"	Jul 06 08:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0ncs	Jul 06 08:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gamingonlinux.com \| Brushfire Games On Their Linux Sales For Shipwreck & Their Thoughts On Linux \| GamingOnLinux		Jul 06 08:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "It's good to see another Daedalic published	Jul 06 08:49
TweetTuxMachines	game made available for Linux."	Jul 06 08:49
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/cbQl0mugXH (www.gamingonlinux.com)	Jul 06 08:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0ncv	Jul 06 08:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gamingonlinux.com \| Point-And-Click Adventure 'Anna's Quest' Released On GOG And Steam For Linux \| GamingOnLinux		Jul 06 08:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Do Your Prefer Modern Or Traditional Linux	Jul 06 09:02
TweetTuxMachines	Desktop Environments? http://t.co/Sw81PZFv5o	Jul 06 09:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.everydaylinuxuser.com \| Do Your Prefer Modern Or Traditional Linux Desktop Environments? « Everyday Linux User		Jul 06 09:02
TweetTuxMachines	(www.everydaylinuxuser.com)	Jul 06 09:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nh0	Jul 06 09:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2-rc1 http://t.co/tckvBY3MPN	Jul 06 09:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lkml.iu.edu \| Linux-Kernel Archive: Linux 4.2-rc1		Jul 06 09:03
TweetTuxMachines	(lkml.iu.edu)	Jul 06 09:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nh1	Jul 06 09:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Systemd 222 Will Do Away With Its Accelerometer	Jul 06 09:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sK0vJzmMRY (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 06 09:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nh3	Jul 06 09:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Systemd 222 Will Do Away With Its Accelerometer - Phoronix		Jul 06 09:03
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The Many New Features Of The Linux 4.2 Kernel	Jul 06 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/HgjlTY1rrc (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 06 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nuk	Jul 06 09:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| New Features Of The Linux 4.2 Kernel - Phoronix		Jul 06 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 6/7/2015: Linux 4.2-rc1, YotaPhone Picks	Jul 06 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	SailfishOS http://t.co/h7383tGHZd	Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	(techrights.org)	Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nul	Jul 06 09:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 6/7/2015: Linux 4.2-rc1, YotaPhone Picks Sailfish OS \| Techrights		Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android Leftovers http://t.co/3HTAhO6yce	Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 09:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Android Leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0num	Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Gaming http://t.co/9peTEEg6Ts	Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 09:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Gaming \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nup	Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's howtos http://t.co/35itRYGi7h	Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 09:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's howtos \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nuq	Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Software http://t.co/3JREhhCmpI	Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 09:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Software \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 09:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nur	Jul 06 09:49
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's leftovers http://t.co/dbG2Y90bAv	Jul 06 13:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 13:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 13:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0pkb	Jul 06 13:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/9oD0eHqa43	Jul 06 13:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 13:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 13:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0pkc	Jul 06 13:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/E99NWP9DBr	Jul 06 13:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 13:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0pkd	Jul 06 13:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 13:05
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**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Jul 6 14:11:40 2015
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Jul 6 14:12:08 2015
*Now talking on #techrights		Jul 06 14:12
*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 06 14:12
*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 06 14:12
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roy__	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618092428390608896	Jul 06 17:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz (price of syccess...?)		Jul 06 17:24
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roy__	https://twitter.com/readergordonbp/status/618095784395935744	Jul 06 17:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@readergordonbp: @schestowitz PC World are learning - they're a lot better than they used to be. Some of the staff have even heard of Linux! :-)		Jul 06 17:35
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gde33	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDMOdaJMruM	Jul 06 18:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com \| The Network of Global Corporate Control June 2 & 23 - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/n0tdm ]		Jul 06 18:42
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roy__	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6297742	Jul 06 19:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Not a Diaspora post?		Jul 06 19:19
roy__	""We just want to ensure that terrorists anyone do not have a safe space in which to communicate. That is the challenge, and it is a challenge that will come in front of the House."	Jul 06 19:19
roy__	"So he’s admtting that he’s making the internet totally unsafe.'	Jul 06 19:19
roy__	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6297552	Jul 06 19:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Greek town of Livadeia switched to #LibreOffice https://joinup.ec.europa.eu/node/144304 #odf #freesw #greece		Jul 06 19:20
roy__	"They should have enabled TLS, while at it."	Jul 06 19:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> joinup.ec.europa.eu \| Greek town of Livadeia switched to LibreOffice \| Joinup		Jul 06 19:20
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software	Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/kT0KbsYVbx (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0uho	Jul 06 20:22
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Firefox 40 to Bring Better Performance,	Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	Scrolling, and Graphics on Linux	Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/wnUI3yUj8e (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0uhr	Jul 06 20:22
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Firefox 40 to Bring Better Performance, Scrolling, and Graphics on Linux \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux Mint 17.2 launches with big Cinnamon and	Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	MATE desktop improvements	Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ypwPIkSDd6 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 20:22
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0uhs	Jul 06 20:22
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux Mint 17.2 launches with big Cinnamon and MATE desktop improvements \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 20:22
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines GNOME's Photos App to Receive Editing, Import,	Jul 06 21:10
TweetTuxMachines	and Sharing Features http://t.co/7wUGIQtmfO	Jul 06 21:10
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 21:10
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| GNOME's Photos App to Receive Editing, Import, and Sharing Features \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 21:10
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0uzp	Jul 06 21:10
*TweetTuxMachines @MarketingCor favourited 'Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software http://t.co/kT0KbsYVbx'		Jul 06 21:10
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 4MLinux 13.0 Operating System Has a Highly	Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	Customized JWM Experience	Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/W6yXzihYNc (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0xih	Jul 06 22:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 4MLinux 13.0 Operating System Has a Highly Customized JWM Experience \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Solus OS Gets UEFI Fixes and Better Power	Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	Consumption for Laptops http://t.co/abrZPUKfUA	Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 22:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Solus OS Gets UEFI Fixes and Better Power Consumption for Laptops \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0xil	Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Python and Raspberry Pi in education	Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/8BB3ZVNLbC (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 22:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0xiq	Jul 06 22:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Python and Raspberry Pi in education \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 22:09
*carlos_ (~carlos@cpc73860-dals21-2-0-cust316.20-2.cable.virginm.net) has joined #techrights		Jul 06 22:27
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*TweetTuxMachines @developrise favourited 'Python and Raspberry Pi in education http://t.co/8BB3ZVNLbC'		Jul 06 22:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines It's Now Easier Managing Systemd In KDE	Jul 06 22:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/gybrWBmObd (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 22:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n12km	Jul 06 22:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| It's Now Easier Managing Systemd In KDE \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 22:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Next Tizen Smartphone, Samsung Z3 SM-Z300H,	Jul 06 22:55
TweetTuxMachines	Imported to india for Testing	Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4LlaofUTKd (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n12lm	Jul 06 22:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Next Tizen Smartphone, Samsung Z3 SM-Z300H, Imported to india for Testing \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines GPS Navigation for Ubuntu Touch Gets More	Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	Features http://t.co/ajS4DNvlIi	Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 22:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| GPS Navigation for Ubuntu Touch Gets More Features \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n12lw	Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for	Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	Unity 8 - Video http://t.co/14ZFYUriIe	Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 22:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for Unity 8 - Video \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 22:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n12m4	Jul 06 22:56
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/ArrowSparrow/status/618203357514051584	Jul 07 00:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@ArrowSparrow: @schestowitz we have no time all these activities. You are Pro.		Jul 07 00:45
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AdmFubar	hi all thought I'd pass this along in case is hasn't been seen	Jul 07 01:58
AdmFubar	http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/privacy-personal	Jul 07 01:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxjournal.com \| Privacy Is Personal \| Linux Journal [ http://ur1.ca/n1az1 ]		Jul 07 01:58
AdmFubar	laters	Jul 07 01:58
*AdmFubar (~AdmFubar@75.33.34.162) has left #techrights ("PING 1436230757")		Jul 07 01:59
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for	Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	Unity 8 - Video http://t.co/S9Cz35Lxva	Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 02:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 403 @ http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/77742?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter )		Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1b26	Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Speech recognition and synthesis shield runs	Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	Linux http://t.co/CcQJJUl916	Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 02:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Speech recognition and synthesis shield runs Linux \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1b27	Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines An Introduction to Linux Containers	Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/vO3e1nCYbS (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 02:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1b2a	Jul 07 02:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| An Introduction to Linux Containers \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 02:08
*oiaohm (~oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #techrights		Jul 07 06:41
oiaohm	http://www.scrye.com/wordpress/nirik/2015/07/06/gnome-on-wayland-testing/ interesting progress	Jul 07 08:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.scrye.com \| Kevin's musings » gnome on wayland testing [ http://ur1.ca/n1dwq ]		Jul 07 08:09
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/reptoidz/status/618282510443659264	Jul 07 08:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@reptoidz: @schestowitz there is no "patent extortion" it's the law. Android doesn't need exfat support to function. That's for SD cards.		Jul 07 08:20
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software	Jul 07 08:33
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4jPL7LFC0q (www.datamation.com)	Jul 07 08:33
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e2g	Jul 07 08:33
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.datamation.com \| Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software - Datamation		Jul 07 08:33
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Firefox 40 to Bring Better Performance,	Jul 07 08:36
TweetTuxMachines	Scrolling, and Graphics on Linux	Jul 07 08:36
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/b3UDrX9GmT (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 08:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Firefox 40 to Bring Better Performance, Scrolling, and Graphics on Linux - Softpedia		Jul 07 08:36
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e3j	Jul 07 08:36
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines GNOME's Photos App to Receive Editing, Import,	Jul 07 08:36
TweetTuxMachines	and Sharing Features http://t.co/OtjeMEk8Oa	Jul 07 08:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| GNOME's Photos App to Receive Editing, Import, and Sharing Features - Softpedia		Jul 07 08:36
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 08:36
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e3k	Jul 07 08:36
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux Mint 17.2 launches with big Cinnamon and	Jul 07 08:37
TweetTuxMachines	MATE desktop improvements	Jul 07 08:37
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/RO4b8DhU5W (www.pcworld.com)	Jul 07 08:37
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e3l	Jul 07 08:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pcworld.com \| Linux Mint 17.2 launches with big Cinnamon and MATE desktop improvements \| PCWorld		Jul 07 08:37
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 4MLinux 13.0 Operating System Has a Highly	Jul 07 08:37
TweetTuxMachines	Customized JWM Experience	Jul 07 08:37
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/MN97GikSrD (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 08:37
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e3m	Jul 07 08:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| 4MLinux 13.0 Operating System Has a Highly Customized JWM Experience - Softpedia		Jul 07 08:37
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Solus OS Gets UEFI Fixes and Better Power	Jul 07 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	Consumption for Laptops http://t.co/YqqJxl2EOH	Jul 07 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 08:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Solus OS Gets UEFI Fixes and Better Power Consumption for Laptops - Softpedia		Jul 07 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e53	Jul 07 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Python and Raspberry Pi in education	Jul 07 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ft78KzkIFl (opensource.com)	Jul 07 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e54	Jul 07 08:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-opensource.com \| Raspberry Pi and Python in education \| Opensource.com		Jul 07 08:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Oxide Vulnerabilities Closed in Ubuntu OSes	Jul 07 08:42
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/kwMjnp1xNi (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 08:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Oxide Vulnerabilities Closed in Ubuntu OSes - Softpedia		Jul 07 08:42
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e55	Jul 07 08:42
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines It's Now Easier Managing Systemd In KDE	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Jz1VRvNel5 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	performance poor since I moved to it (not by	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	choice)	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e62	Jul 07 08:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| It's Now Easier Managing Systemd In KDE - Phoronix		Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Next Tizen Smartphone, Samsung Z3 SM-Z300H,	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	Imported to india for Testing	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/nKi3FUIEER (www.tizenexperts.com)	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e63	Jul 07 08:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tizenexperts.com \| Next Tizen Smartphone, Samsung Z3 SM-Z300H, Imported to india for TestingTizen Experts		Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines GPS Navigation for Ubuntu Touch Gets More	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	Features http://t.co/z2uoLDVBWt	Jul 07 08:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| GPS Navigation for Ubuntu Touch Gets More Features - Softpedia		Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	(linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e64	Jul 07 08:44
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for	Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	Unity 8 - Video http://t.co/W3jK8drYX0	Jul 07 08:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for Unity 8 - Video - Softpedia		Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	(linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e8r	Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Speech recognition and synthesis shield runs	Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	Linux http://t.co/yzuP8eSemw (linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 07 08:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| Speech recognition and synthesis shield runs Linux · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e8s	Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines An Introduction to Linux Containers	Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/CgTowqQ3gk	Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	(www.smallbusinesscomputing.com)	Jul 07 08:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.smallbusinesscomputing.com \| An Introduction to Linux Containers		Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e8t	Jul 07 08:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Containers change the game	Jul 07 09:15
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/miyVZ1FSMm (www.infoworld.com)	Jul 07 09:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.infoworld.com \| Containers create composable applications		Jul 07 09:15
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/CJZ5zqxYB5 (www.dbta.com)	Jul 07 09:15
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1ehg	Jul 07 09:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.dbta.com \| IBM Rolls Out Docker-Based Container Services - Database Trends and Applications		Jul 07 09:15
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Structuring RedHat’s pipeline to deliver	Jul 07 09:15
TweetTuxMachines	consistent results http://t.co/dqtQzqksQV	Jul 07 09:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-siliconangle.com \| Structuring RedHat’s pipeline to deliver consistent results \| #RHSummit \| SiliconANGLE		Jul 07 09:15
TweetTuxMachines	(siliconangle.com)	Jul 07 09:15
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1ehh	Jul 07 09:15
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/mdouka/status/618335399480406017	Jul 07 09:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mdouka: Free and Open-Source Video Editor Shotcut Gets Better 4K Support http://t.co/d5EOgNooXw via @rightrelevance thanks @schestowitz		Jul 07 09:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> news.softpedia.com \| Free and Open-Source Video Editor Shotcut Gets Better 4K Support - Softpedia		Jul 07 09:39
*TweetTuxMachines @mccourt_360 favourited 'Structuring RedHat’s pipeline to deliver consistent results http://t.co/dqtQzqksQV'		Jul 07 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux on the desktop is so hot there's now a	Jul 07 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	fight over it http://t.co/YmXaPOFbbU	Jul 07 09:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theregister.co.uk \| Linux on the desktop is so hot there's now a fight over it • The Register		Jul 07 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	(www.theregister.co.uk)	Jul 07 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1esk	Jul 07 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat http://t.co/XudZE0szqm	Jul 07 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 09:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Red Hat \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1esl	Jul 07 09:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Containers http://t.co/0SfT6A8GVv	Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 10:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Containers \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1exu	Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux on the desktop is so hot there's now a	Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	fight over it http://t.co/TYlwRwfUId	Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 10:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux on the desktop is so hot there's now a fight over it \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1exv	Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines How I Discovered Linux & Changed the World	Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/16HhL4XEjk (fossforce.com)	Jul 07 10:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-fossforce.com \| How I Discovered Linux & Changed the World \| FOSS Force		Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1exy	Jul 07 10:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines New Features Of The Linux 4.2 Kernel	Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/C1nsRZohhP (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1f0n	Jul 07 10:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| New Features Of The Linux 4.2 Kernel - Phoronix		Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Xbox Wireless Controller LEDs Work On Linux 4.2	Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/h7eShlYuO5 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1f0o	Jul 07 10:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Thanks Valve, Xbox Wireless Controller LEDs Work On Linux 4.2 - Phoronix		Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "inconvenient to use port 443 for SSH, because	Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	it meant I couldn't host secure Web sites on	Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	that server." http://t.co/USa3O2NkiA	Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	(www.linuxjournal.com)	Jul 07 10:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxjournal.com \| One Port to Rule Them All! \| Linux Journal		Jul 07 10:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1f0p	Jul 07 10:18
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msb__	A favorite song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TvfBxIkupA	Jul 07 10:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com \| Phil Ochs - Ballad Of The Carpenter - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/n1f7x ]		Jul 07 10:44
msb__	"Come all you working men, farmers and weavers too: If you could only stand as one, this world belongs to you."	Jul 07 10:47
msb__	"Two thousand years have passed and gone, many a hero too, but the dream of this poor carpenter remains in the hands of you."	Jul 07 10:52
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines LliureX 15.05 Screencast and Screenshots	Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/3K2kr170ay (www.linuxquestions.org)	Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flo	Jul 07 11:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxquestions.org \| LliureX 15.05 Screencast and Screenshots		Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines It's Been Five Months Since I Left Ubuntu For	Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	Fedora On My Main Workstation	Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/I9mGnKUh0U (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flp	Jul 07 11:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| It's Been Five Months Since I Left Ubuntu For Fedora On My Main Workstation - Phoronix		Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	@sopadebits RT @tuxmachines Windows Could Receive a Hard	Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	Blow As Linux Is Finally Being Considered for	Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	ATMs http://t.co/gKMzoeMzXf	Jul 07 11:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Windows Could Receive a Hard Blow As Linux Is Finally Being Considered for ATMs - Softpedia		Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flq	Jul 07 11:34
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux provides career transition after military	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	service http://t.co/dkLiubml1g	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fls	Jul 07 11:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux provides career transition after military service \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Kernel http://t.co/a2jfjqCk9B	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flt	Jul 07 11:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Kernel \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines openSUSE Leap 42 Is a New Version That Will	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	Change the openSUSE Project	Jul 07 11:35
cubexyz	wasn't linux already used for ATMs?	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/aksdQe2lcb (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flu	Jul 07 11:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| openSUSE Leap 42 Is a New Version That Will Change the openSUSE Project \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Lenovo ThinkPad L450 comes with Ubuntu	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/tmUYZwRglm (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 11:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flv	Jul 07 11:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Lenovo ThinkPad L450 comes with Ubuntu \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 11:35
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*jgay (~jgay@c-65-96-75-169.hsd1.ct.comcast.net) has joined #techrights		Jul 07 11:48
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cubexyz	Indian banks use linux based ATMs since 2014	Jul 07 11:57
cubexyz	also Brazil, since 2008	Jul 07 11:58
cubexyz	and ATMs existed before Microsoft	Jul 07 11:59
cubexyz	more of a case of people not knowing history	Jul 07 12:00
cubexyz	maybe they think computers didn't exist before Microsoft, lol	Jul 07 12:00
cubexyz	check Banrisul, the largest bank in southern Brazil...	Jul 07 12:03
cubexyz	they actually went from MSDOS to Linux	Jul 07 12:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines EC publishes open source code of legislation	Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	editor http://t.co/AtCpP6b67p	Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 12:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| EC publishes open source code of legislation editor \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fug	Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines LibreOffice 5.0: A Unique Release	Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/WdOC5ekxMm (ostatic.com)	Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fuh	Jul 07 12:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ostatic.com \| LibreOffice 5.0: A Unique Release		Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Kernel Summit 2015: Call for Proposals	Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/D1UuOD4RaJ (lwn.net)	Jul 07 12:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lwn.net \| Kernel Summit 2015: Call for Proposals [LWN.net]		Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fuk	Jul 07 12:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Kernel 3.19.8 CKT2 Has Been Released	Jul 07 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/AZZ8c78i4G (linuxg.net)	Jul 07 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fv8	Jul 07 12:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxg.net \| Kernel 3.19.8 CKT2 Has Been Released \| LinuxG.net		Jul 07 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux provides career transition after military	Jul 07 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	service http://t.co/oemGwSyUeY (opensource.com)	Jul 07 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fv9	Jul 07 12:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-opensource.com \| Chase Crum shares his Linux story \| Opensource.com		Jul 07 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Lenovo ThinkPad L450 comes with Ubuntu	Jul 07 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/a5LPa04VoN (indianexpress.com)	Jul 07 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fva	Jul 07 12:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-indianexpress.com \| Lenovo ThinkPad L450 comes with Ubuntu \| The Indian Express		Jul 07 12:06
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 7/7/2015: Lenovo ThinkPad With GNU/Linux,	Jul 07 12:30
TweetTuxMachines	More Containers Hype http://t.co/YYPwlk84oe	Jul 07 12:30
TweetTuxMachines	(techrights.org)	Jul 07 12:30
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1g26	Jul 07 12:30
*TweetTuxMachines @Miladsob favourited 'Linux provides career transition after military service http://t.co/oemGwSyUeY'		Jul 07 12:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 7/7/2015: Lenovo ThinkPad With GNU/Linux, More Containers Hype \| Techrights		Jul 07 12:30
msb__	Suse Leap42: It will be coded in Esperanto and executed by a midget inside your computer.	Jul 07 12:34
cubexyz	oiaohm, another observation about X...	Jul 07 13:41
cubexyz	under certain conditions the text screen can be transformed into a corrupted X screen	Jul 07 13:42
cubexyz	then /sbin/modprobe radeonfb fixes it	Jul 07 13:43
cubexyz	no idea why it happens, don't even understand why loading radeonfb fixes it	Jul 07 13:43
oiaohm	cubexyz: it called memory miss management.	Jul 07 13:44
cubexyz	any idea why loading radeonfb returns the text console to normal?	Jul 07 13:44
oiaohm	X11 and framebuffer are in fact bothing running at the same time.	Jul 07 13:44
oiaohm	The Linux text based console is in fact done to framebuffer.	Jul 07 13:45
oiaohm	So reloading the radeonfb causes the framebuffer stuff to reset.	Jul 07 13:45
oiaohm	Basically we need to get off framebuffer and dri and on to pure KMS.	Jul 07 13:46
cubexyz	I guess one could look at the radeonfb code and try to puzzle it out	Jul 07 13:46
oiaohm	cubexyz: loading any fb driver that works with the card would trigger the fix.	Jul 07 13:46
cubexyz	also the text is pulled to left	Jul 07 13:46
oiaohm	AMD/ATI cards are known for o my god I leaked data.	Jul 07 13:47
oiaohm	cubexyz: I guess what using closed source amd driver.	Jul 07 13:47
cubexyz	I can jig things over with "fbset -move right"	Jul 07 13:48
oiaohm	cubexyz: I mostly run NVIDIA	Jul 07 13:48
cubexyz	old CRT so who knows :)	Jul 07 13:48
oiaohm	or Intel	Jul 07 13:48
cubexyz	you don't use open source video driver?	Jul 07 13:48
oiaohm	cubexyz: open source intel.	Jul 07 13:49
cubexyz	I got to make my own distro someday	Jul 07 13:49
oiaohm	I am hoping AMDGPU unified driver a lot last fixes the AMD super leak in new cards.	Jul 07 13:50
oiaohm	lot/long	Jul 07 13:50
cubexyz	there must be some default framebuffer for text?	Jul 07 13:51
MinceR	systemd will have one :>	Jul 07 13:51
cubexyz	doesn't seem to be a module (I can't see one)	Jul 07 13:51
oiaohm	cubexyz: Linux writes it text into screen by framebuffer.	Jul 07 13:51
MinceR	it will occasionally require you to reboot, though :>	Jul 07 13:51
oiaohm	cubexyz: planned to be replaced at some point by KMSCON	Jul 07 13:51
cubexyz	radeonfb doesn't show up in process status either	Jul 07 13:54
cubexyz	part of X I guess	Jul 07 13:55
oiaohm	No radeonfb is part of kernel.	Jul 07 13:56
oiaohm	cubexyz: lsmod should show it.	Jul 07 13:57
oiaohm	cubexyz: kernel modules don't exactly appear in process table.	Jul 07 13:57
oiaohm	cubexyz: this is a Linux long term project https://dvdhrm.wordpress.com/2012/08/12/killing-off-config_vt/	Jul 07 13:59
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-dvdhrm.wordpress.com \| Deprecating CONFIG_VT \| Ponyhof [ http://ur1.ca/n1grl ]		Jul 07 13:59
MinceR	if people miss having to reboot so much, why don't they go back to windows?	Jul 07 14:01
MinceR	"This definitely needs to be replaced by a more internationalized console."	Jul 07 14:02
MinceR	somebody needs to be told about windowing systems	Jul 07 14:02
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oiaohm	MinceR: part of moving vt to userspace is so a console death is not kernel panic as well.	Jul 07 14:04
MinceR	apparently they also want to bloat the VT so it couldn't be used for troubleshooting if it didn't die	Jul 07 14:05
*XRevan86 (~XRevan86@162.244.25.66) has joined #techrights		Jul 07 14:06
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oiaohm	MinceR: if the shell is dead a workign VT is not much use.	Jul 07 14:06
MinceR	i can log in again and have another shell start	Jul 07 14:06
oiaohm	Not if the shell is truly dead.	Jul 07 14:08
MinceR	so just because another part of the system can fail, we should make the VT much more fragile?	Jul 07 14:09
oiaohm	MinceR: think X11 death	Jul 07 14:09
MinceR	sounds like typical systemd argumentation	Jul 07 14:09
oiaohm	kmscon is before systemd.	Jul 07 14:09
oiaohm	there is also fblog what is kernel loging massively simplifed.	Jul 07 14:10
MinceR	"but these other pieces of software have these design flaws too, so we _must_ implement those design flaws here as well!"	Jul 07 14:10
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oiaohm	kmscon when you do a SAK will be terminated and cleaned.	Jul 07 14:10
oiaohm	Basically fblog stays in kernel.	Jul 07 14:10
oiaohm	and kmscon moves to userspace	Jul 07 14:10
oiaohm	The old Linux vt system split in 2	Jul 07 14:11
XRevan86	http://businessinsider.com/are-these-monkeys-domesticating-wolves-2015-6	Jul 07 14:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.businessinsider.com \| Are these monkeys domesticating wolves? - Business Insider [ http://ur1.ca/n1gvh ]		Jul 07 14:11
oiaohm	MinceR: exactly how do you think KMScon is more fragile.	Jul 07 14:13
MinceR	according to that article, they want to add all the bells and whistles they can think of	Jul 07 14:14
MinceR	more code means more bugs	Jul 07 14:14
cubexyz	oiaohm, you could still get into a system via the serial port even if X messes up	Jul 07 14:15
cubexyz	at least you can reboot	Jul 07 14:15
MinceR	until they insist on rendering your terminal with opengl	Jul 07 14:15
MinceR	because they forgot that serial consoles don't have opengl	Jul 07 14:15
oiaohm	MinceR: serial consoles are not done by the Linuix kernel VT framework.	Jul 07 14:16
oiaohm	same to cubexyz	Jul 07 14:16
oiaohm	Virtual Terminal under Linux is only graphical terminals.	Jul 07 14:16
cubexyz	didn't it use to run getty via serial port(s)?	Jul 07 14:17
MinceR	so they'll leave the textmode terminal alone or not?	Jul 07 14:17
cubexyz	could be a last-ditch way to get in	Jul 07 14:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: getty via serial port has nothing todo with CONFIG_VT	Jul 07 14:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: or KMScon	Jul 07 14:18
oiaohm	MinceR: what textbased terminal. CONFIG_VT is framebuffer rendered in most cases. How often to you use the pure vesa 1 shell only login.	Jul 07 14:20
oiaohm	MinceR: worse is some devices like android GPU's don't have a vesa mode at all.	Jul 07 14:21
oiaohm	MinceR: so render by opengl or have nothing.	Jul 07 14:21
oiaohm	MinceR: basically CONFIG_VT has seen it day.	Jul 07 14:22
oiaohm	As cubexyz has found you really need in you end up dropping to a pure text mode getty on serial port or something equal.	Jul 07 14:23
oiaohm	why because config_vt on current hardware can be a brick.	Jul 07 14:24
cubexyz	run a real terminal	Jul 07 14:24
cubexyz	as a safety measure	Jul 07 14:24
oiaohm	cubexyz: when you say real you mean a real serial terminal.	Jul 07 14:24
cubexyz	yes	Jul 07 14:24
oiaohm	or parallel port terminal(bois post codes can go there)	Jul 07 14:25
oiaohm	As well as control.	Jul 07 14:25
oiaohm	KMScon will make SAK sane. Currently KMS and FB both allocate what the video card is currently doing.	Jul 07 14:26
cubexyz	I've never heard of parallel port terminal	Jul 07 14:27
cubexyz	we used to have Wyse terminals on Xenix	Jul 07 14:30
oiaohm	http://tarmo.fi/blog/2003/09/configuring-plip-in-linux/	Jul 07 14:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-tarmo.fi \| Configuring PLIP in Linux - tarmo.fi [ http://ur1.ca/n1h1u ]		Jul 07 14:32
oiaohm	cubexyz: you can network over parallel port.	Jul 07 14:32
cubexyz	yes, I remember PLIP :)	Jul 07 14:32
oiaohm	ssh over plip	Jul 07 14:32
cubexyz	that would work even if the video stuff was botched I would think	Jul 07 14:32
oiaohm	There is also forward serial by PLIP	Jul 07 14:33
oiaohm	what is forward serial by network	Jul 07 14:33
oiaohm	basically there are enough ways to skin the cat.	Jul 07 14:34
oiaohm	USB port, printer port, or serial port can all be used for mayday console.	Jul 07 14:34
oiaohm	Modern motherboards will send post to USB.	Jul 07 14:34
oiaohm	So the right kind of device in USB you know if the computer has booted or died.	Jul 07 14:35
oiaohm	It would be such a fun extention to a screen.	Jul 07 14:35
cubexyz	I guess radeonfb is still using a rasterized graphical screen	Jul 07 14:36
cubexyz	or does it just write characters to video memory e.g. MDA?	Jul 07 14:36
oiaohm	fb under Linux the kernel is doing all the font processing and the like into image then that goes to screen.	Jul 07 14:37
cubexyz	seems to default to 1024x768	Jul 07 14:37
cubexyz	right, otherwise you couldn't change the fonts	Jul 07 14:38
oiaohm	Turns out the text mode vesa on most modern day cards does not work properly.	Jul 07 14:38
cubexyz	it would just be text	Jul 07 14:38
oiaohm	cubexyz: you are meant to be able to upload fonts under vesa	Jul 07 14:38
oiaohm	But that mostly does not work.	Jul 07 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: OSS http://t.co/1S3mRwQW1K	Jul 07 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 14:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: OSS \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1h46	Jul 07 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's howtos http://t.co/G96cUjoYZD	Jul 07 14:39
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 14:39
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1h49	Jul 07 14:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's howtos \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 14:39
cubexyz	fbset code looks pretty old	Jul 07 14:39
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's leftovers http://t.co/eJBwz53VCn	Jul 07 14:39
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 14:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 14:39
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1h4d	Jul 07 14:39
oiaohm	Config_VT was good when video cards worked and were not likely to send back random garbage just because they fell like it.	Jul 07 14:40
oiaohm	MinceR: I know the idea kill Config_VT starts well before Systemd. After a huge stack of kernel panics caused by cards gone stupid.	Jul 07 14:41
MinceR	so it's still useful for people who have working video cards	Jul 07 14:41
cubexyz	things do muck up though	Jul 07 14:42
MinceR	now they get to kill two birds with one stone	Jul 07 14:42
MinceR	remove VT from the kernel, stuff it into systemd	Jul 07 14:42
oiaohm	MinceR: define working.	Jul 07 14:42
MinceR	and force systemd on everyone	Jul 07 14:42
oiaohm	Not really KMSCON works with openrc	Jul 07 14:43
oiaohm	MinceR: also what is shocking is openbsd is looking at including it.	Jul 07 14:43
MinceR	lol	Jul 07 14:44
oiaohm	Some of the changes that people want to blame on systemd have not much todo with it.	Jul 07 14:44
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oiaohm	MinceR: openbsd has their own fork of logind	Jul 07 14:44
MinceR	are they tired of simple designs?	Jul 07 14:44
oiaohm	Nop	Jul 07 14:45
oiaohm	openbsd are equally sick of kernel painces due to hardware stupidity.	Jul 07 14:45
oiaohm	kmscon allows 1 block of console code to be used for graphical and terminal modes.	Jul 07 14:46
oiaohm	Instead of maintain 8 as currently.	Jul 07 14:46
oiaohm	MinceR: exactly what is simple about having to maintain vt terminal code for X11, vt terminal code for framebuffer on Linux, vt terminal code on all the BSDs.	Jul 07 14:47
cubexyz	it was simpler when it was all EGA, VGA etc	Jul 07 14:47
cubexyz	now I don't really know how it all works	Jul 07 14:48
oiaohm	cubexyz: yep when you did not have gpu with firmware blobs emulating crap.	Jul 07 14:48
oiaohm	MinceR: then you have to remember application developers has to deal with all the console implementation bugs.	Jul 07 14:50
cubexyz	my Linux console man page is dated 1994 :-/	Jul 07 14:50
cubexyz	and it's woefully incomplete	Jul 07 14:50
*TweetTuxMachines got exception: Unexpected end of ZLIB input stream ; reconnecting to Twitter...		Jul 07 14:50
MinceR	oiaohm: soon, they'll get to deal with implementation bugs put there by code monkeys at redcrap who couldn't care less	Jul 07 14:51
oiaohm	http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/libtsm/ This is out of KMSCON	Jul 07 14:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.freedesktop.org \| libtsm [ http://ur1.ca/n1h95 ]		Jul 07 14:54
oiaohm	MinceR: before KMSCON all termal service libraries depended on X11, GTK, QT.....	Jul 07 14:57
cubexyz	mplayer seems to open fbdev2 sometimes	Jul 07 14:57
oiaohm	Please note KMScon is not in fact part of systemd eitehr MinceR	Jul 07 14:58
MinceR	yet	Jul 07 14:58
oiaohm	The developer behind KMSCon is not redhat.	Jul 07 14:59
cubexyz	it should be in userland	Jul 07 15:00
oiaohm	There has been a long list of data leaks between users caused by Config_VT as well.	Jul 07 15:02
oiaohm	Reality console emulation should be userland.	Jul 07 15:02
oiaohm	Because when user logs out it should be flushed.	Jul 07 15:02
oiaohm	getty for serial is userland and it is flushed when the serial connect terminates.	Jul 07 15:03
oiaohm	A lot of what is happening with systemd is a result of hey we have these bugs we will not bother fixing it instead lets keep on using broken.	Jul 07 15:06
oiaohm	So when 1 init system decides to really attempt to fix the faults a stack of compadiblity issues were going to appear.	Jul 07 15:07
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schestowitz	http://www.linuxtoday.com/it_management/there-is-no-new-microsoft-under-nadella-patent-extortion-against-linuxandroid-carries-on-150706040014.html	Jul 07 17:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxtoday.com \| Linux Today - There is No 'New Microsoft': Under Nadella, Patent Extortion Against Linux/Android Carries on [ http://ur1.ca/n1ice ]		Jul 07 17:05
schestowitz	"Microsoft can't compete with products, so all they have left is Patent Extortion. It's that or fail as a company and whilst US (and UK/EU) politicians remain corrupt and open to any bribery that's on offer, thus enabling the abuse of the law to protect the economically inept, that will not change."	Jul 07 17:05
schestowitz	"Well, this sounds like a big pile of butt hurt in the article. Even if the "Malware" BS were true and didn't get installed (which I have yet to see a single reference other than a conspiracy theory), the Android OS has become so fragmented and vulnerable that it's hard to imagine Microsoft could make it much worse. Granted, they could.. but, it's simply garbage by the time it hits end-users unless it's on a Google flagship device."	Jul 07 17:05
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**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jul 7 22:23:21 2015
*Now talking on #techrights		Jul 07 22:23
*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 07 22:23
*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 07 22:23
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement	Jul 08 00:36
TweetTuxMachines	for Meizu MX4 http://t.co/IwE797tlBV	Jul 08 00:36
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 00:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement for Meizu MX4 \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 00:36
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2bsx	Jul 08 00:36
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 11 features Apple 'borrowed' from Android in	Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	the last year http://t.co/0pgkft7Yoh	Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2c3j	Jul 08 01:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 11 features Apple 'borrowed' from Android in the last year \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping	Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	Ubuntu-Powered Laptops in India	Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/kuy1Mjodm3 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2c3n	Jul 08 01:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping Ubuntu-Powered Laptops in India \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linus Torvalds Says Valve Is Exploring a	Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	"Second Source" Against Microsoft	Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sWRcVSdBNu (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 01:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2c3o	Jul 08 01:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linus Torvalds Says Valve Is Exploring a "Second Source" Against Microsoft \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 01:16
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/thewtfmagazine/status/618552534483927040 https://twitter.com/stonemirror/status/618573330598227968	Jul 08 02:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@thewtfmagazine: @stonemirror @koretzky You stalked anybody lately Lefty? You are a JOKE, DUDE A JOKE #Gamergate check this out > http://t.co/SkZDkjsB3h >		Jul 08 02:14
schestowitz	he's still trolling new people	Jul 08 02:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| Richard Stallman and Bruce Perens Defamed by Troll \| Techrights		Jul 08 02:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@stonemirror: @thewtfmagazine LOL, "TechRights". @schestowitz, someone BELIEVES you! @koretzky #ItsAMiracle.		Jul 08 02:14
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/_DHMapplethorpe/status/618556008097411074	Jul 08 02:23
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@_DHMapplethorpe: Top comment on this. That's about you right? Stonemirror aka Lefty? http://t.co/V8PcZ8yW0Z @stonemirror @RejZoRSheep @_icze4r @koretzky		Jul 08 02:23
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Chartoc/status/618555077893206016	Jul 08 02:23
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Chartoc: @agelatinouscube @JamesBolton11 and actual harasser of women too. http://t.co/oj5aPBN2kB		Jul 08 02:23
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/_DHMapplethorpe/status/618553159758168064 https://twitter.com/thewtfmagazine/status/618552534483927040	Jul 08 02:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@_DHMapplethorpe: Hey are you the same Stonemirror in this article :0 http://t.co/V8PcZ8yW0Z @stonemirror @MyKeyMoonShine @RejZoRSheep @_icze4r @koretzky		Jul 08 02:24
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/_DHMapplethorpe/status/618528610723348480	Jul 08 02:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@_DHMapplethorpe: Daily Reminder: @stonemirror is projecting HARD http://t.co/T8cngMrehj		Jul 08 02:24
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Azermane/status/618570888473104384	Jul 08 02:25
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Azermane: @TheRalphRetort check this out http://t.co/llAH5zwNW8		Jul 08 02:25
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Jolla cuts hardware biz loose to concentrate on	Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	Sailfish licensing http://t.co/OEXZDYQS9n	Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 02:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Jolla cuts hardware biz loose to concentrate on Sailfish licensing \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cuv	Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung to train India’s Telangana youth in	Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	Tizen Tech http://t.co/88qWKpi8XY	Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 02:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Samsung to train India’s Telangana youth in Tizen Tech \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cuw	Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review: Linux Mint 17.2 Release is Refreshed	Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	and Faster http://t.co/scOiBrV71B	Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cuz	Jul 08 02:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Review: Linux Mint 17.2 Release is Refreshed and Faster \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 02:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement	Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	for Meizu MX4 http://t.co/W0j26eyXBu	Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 02:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement for Meizu MX4 - Softpedia		Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cw5	Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 11 features Apple 'borrowed' from Android in	Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	the last year http://t.co/m5JupPGxc2	Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	(www.businessinsider.com)	Jul 08 02:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-uk.businessinsider.com \| 11 features Apple borrowed from Android in the last year - Business Insider		Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cw6	Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping	Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	Ubuntu-Powered Laptops in India	Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4koPBTEg4H (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cw7	Jul 08 02:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping Ubuntu-Powered Laptops in India - Softpedia		Jul 08 02:32
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linus Torvalds Says Valve Is Exploring a	Jul 08 02:33
TweetTuxMachines	"Second Source" Against Microsoft	Jul 08 02:33
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/NLuswy4O1M (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 02:33
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cwd	Jul 08 02:33
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Linus Torvalds Says Valve Is Exploring a "Second Source" Against Microsoft - Softpedia		Jul 08 02:33
*TweetTuxMachines @RanjibDey retweeted @tuxmachines: 'Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping Ubuntu-Powered Laptops...'		Jul 08 02:33
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618592504556883968	Jul 08 02:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz My old junk, combined with horrid Internet connections (just 60 miles from Silicon Valley!) slows my work by about 50%		Jul 08 02:34
schestowitz	old junk can work well and limited bandwidth too.... it's how you use it.	Jul 08 02:34
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618594370518929408	Jul 08 02:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz (requires too much overhead in planning and organization. I need 10 windows open at once, to keep up with me)		Jul 08 02:39
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Jolla cuts hardware biz loose to concentrate on	Jul 08 02:49
TweetTuxMachines	Sailfish licensing http://t.co/FIwbRtkj08	Jul 08 02:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.theregister.co.uk) makes sense.	Jul 08 02:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theregister.co.uk \| Jolla cuts hardware biz loose to concentrate on Sailfish licensing • The Register		Jul 08 02:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2d2z	Jul 08 02:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung to train India’s Telangana youth in	Jul 08 02:49
TweetTuxMachines	Tizen Tech http://t.co/6L8NABaLN5	Jul 08 02:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tizenexperts.com)	Jul 08 02:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tizenexperts.com \| Samsung to train India’s Telangana youth in Tizen TechTizen Experts		Jul 08 02:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2d30	Jul 08 02:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review: Linux Mint 17.2 Release is Refreshed	Jul 08 02:50
TweetTuxMachines	and Faster http://t.co/up6DvbeZlW	Jul 08 02:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.linux.com)	Jul 08 02:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2d31	Jul 08 02:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| Review: Linux Mint 17.2 Release is Refreshed and Faster \| Linux.com		Jul 08 02:50
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618603967644184576	Jul 08 03:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz (guy you lauded seems to be "suspended" on Twitter...first one i've rune into like that)		Jul 08 03:16
schestowitz	maybe imposter	Jul 08 03:16
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618604586769760256	Jul 08 03:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz o O o		Jul 08 03:18
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/_sinisterBen/status/618611807238799360	Jul 08 03:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@_sinisterBen: @New_Versailles @gameragodzilla @stonemirror He's a serial harasser, who the anti-#GamerGate folks fully support! http://t.co/JAjOKqYFWu		Jul 08 03:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| Richard Stallman and Bruce Perens Defamed by Troll \| Techrights		Jul 08 03:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines OpenPrinting CUPS Filters Vulnerability Fixed	Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	in Ubuntu OSes http://t.co/wIEjiLDVLt	Jul 08 03:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| OpenPrinting CUPS Filters Vulnerability Fixed in Ubuntu OSes - Softpedia		Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	(linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dsy	Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Compact IoT gateway runs Yocto Linux on Quark	Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/EcRhCrey9i (linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 08 03:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| Compact IoT gateway runs Yocto Linux on Quark · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dsz	Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Manjaro 0.8.13 Gets New Plasma, MATE, and	Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	Cinnamon Versions http://t.co/KTYeAwVwSp	Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 03:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Manjaro 0.8.13 Gets New Plasma, MATE, and Cinnamon Versions - Softpedia		Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dt0	Jul 08 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines OpenStack Meiji 明治 Set to Succeed Liberty	Jul 08 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ipDWVIWXQC (www.internetnews.com)	Jul 08 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dwp	Jul 08 04:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.internetnews.com \| OpenStack Meiji ææ²» Set to Succeed Liberty - InternetNews.		Jul 08 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "KDE project is bringing an eventful series of	Jul 08 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	presentations and activities on community	Jul 08 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	driven software" https://t.co/QY6yEA3CI3	Jul 08 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	(dot.kde.org)	Jul 08 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dwr	Jul 08 04:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-dot.kde.org \| KDE and Qt at FISL 2015 \| KDE.news		Jul 08 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "Van De Moere had to give Okul an intensive	Jul 08 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	training session on Linux"	Jul 08 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/RDfR9NA4oT (www.bloomberg.com)	Jul 08 04:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.bloomberg.com \| The Mob's IT Department \| Bloomberg Business		Jul 08 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dwt	Jul 08 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Fedora 22: not obvious excellence	Jul 08 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/XWM11SbWcm (linuxblog.darkduck.com)	Jul 08 04:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxblog.darkduck.com \| Fedora 22: not obvious excellence - Linux notes from DarkDuck		Jul 08 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dwu	Jul 08 04:03
*DaemonFC has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)		Jul 08 04:25
*TweetTuxMachines @Dan_Chetrit favourited '"Van De Moere had to give Okul an...'		Jul 08 04:59
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Compact IoT gateway runs Yocto Linux on Quark	Jul 08 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ILOAwYcXDn (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ef7	Jul 08 05:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Compact IoT gateway runs Yocto Linux on Quark \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines NSA runs its spying activities on Red Hat Linux	Jul 08 05:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/uhKFpCKJAW (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 05:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ef8	Jul 08 05:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| NSA runs its spying activities on Red Hat Linux \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 05:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Manjaro 0.8.13 Gets New Plasma, MATE, and	Jul 08 05:03
TweetTuxMachines	Cinnamon Versions http://t.co/YvsXh4FVwt	Jul 08 05:03
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 05:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Manjaro 0.8.13 Gets New Plasma, MATE, and Cinnamon Versions \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 05:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ef9	Jul 08 05:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Fedora 22: not obvious excellence	Jul 08 05:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/oklbdevKjM (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 05:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2efa	Jul 08 05:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Fedora 22: not obvious excellence \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 05:03
*oiaohm (~oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #techrights		Jul 08 05:27
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*tessier (~treed@kernel-panic/copilotco) has joined #techrights		Jul 08 07:30
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*amarsh04 (~amarsh04@ppp14-2-73-102.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net) has joined #techrights		Jul 08 09:22
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 5 Best Linux Desktop Environments With Pros &	Jul 08 09:23
TweetTuxMachines	Cons http://t.co/dUvnei3OEr	Jul 08 09:23
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxandubuntu.com \| 5 Best Linux Desktop Environments With Pros & Cons - LinuxUbuntu Apps Reviews \| Tutorials \| HowTos \| News		Jul 08 09:23
TweetTuxMachines	(www.linuxandubuntu.com)	Jul 08 09:23
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gaj	Jul 08 09:23
*TweetTuxMachines @voidquest44 retweeted @tuxmachines: '5 Best Linux Desktop Environments With Pros &...'		Jul 08 09:23
*TweetTuxMachines @voidquest44 favourited '5 Best Linux Desktop Environments With Pros &...'		Jul 08 10:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE project activity reports	Jul 08 10:19
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/H75Stv6BGN	Jul 08 10:19
TweetTuxMachines	(ahmedabouelhamayed.wordpress.com)	Jul 08 10:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ahmedabouelhamayed.wordpress.com \| KDE project activity reports \| Ahmed AbouElhamayed's Personal Blog		Jul 08 10:19
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gpl	Jul 08 10:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines If You Give a Kid Linux… http://t.co/cT85etldwG	Jul 08 10:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-fossforce.com \| If You Give a Kid Linux… \| FOSS Force		Jul 08 10:19
TweetTuxMachines	(fossforce.com)	Jul 08 10:19
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gpm	Jul 08 10:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines How To Get Started In Open Source	Jul 08 10:30
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/eghRxAAq1w (www.crn.com)	Jul 08 10:30
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gsh	Jul 08 10:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.crn.com \| How To Get Started In Open Source - Page: 1 \| CRN		Jul 08 10:30
*TweetTuxMachines @LukeVizzicks retweeted @tuxmachines: 'KDE project activity reports https://t.co/H75Stv6BGN'		Jul 08 10:30
*amarsh04 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)		Jul 08 10:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Loading Linux To Make My Netbook Sing Again	Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Yeka1hqfnf (www.lifehacker.com.au)	Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gwx	Jul 08 10:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.lifehacker.com.au \| Loading Linux To Make My Netbook Sing Again \| Lifehacker Australia		Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 Daily Images Haven't Been	Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	Refreshed in a Month http://t.co/H4y2SqNqvu	Jul 08 10:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu 15.10 Daily Images Haven't Been Refreshed in a Month - Softpedia		Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gwy	Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch Should Get a New Major OTA Update	Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	Next Wednesday http://t.co/fYGq1E5YhM	Jul 08 10:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu Touch Should Get a New Major OTA Update Next Wednesday - Softpedia		Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 10:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gwz	Jul 08 10:46
cubexyz	damn those flash ads	Jul 08 10:49
cubexyz	cpu use 100% :-/	Jul 08 10:49
*Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@CAcert/Cirrus-Minor) has joined #techrights		Jul 08 10:53
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "GCC 5 the default compiler in Debian Unstable	Jul 08 10:54
TweetTuxMachines	by month's end." http://t.co/Qdt2JHcQMk	Jul 08 10:54
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 08 10:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Debian Will Soon Make GCC 5 Its Default Compiler - Phoronix		Jul 08 10:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gza	Jul 08 10:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Kali Linux 2.0 to launch at DEFCON 23	Jul 08 10:54
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ySfPcrtYEW (www.theregister.co.uk)	Jul 08 10:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theregister.co.uk \| Kali Linux 2.0 to launch at DEFCON 23 • The Register		Jul 08 10:54
TweetTuxMachines	"first in two years"	Jul 08 10:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gzb	Jul 08 10:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Loading Linux To Make My Netbook Sing Again	Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/h3H3NypgHt (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gzd	Jul 08 10:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Loading Linux To Make My Netbook Sing Again \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Kali Linux 2.0 to launch at DEFCON 23	Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/dNvRxVBZxA (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gzh	Jul 08 10:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Kali Linux 2.0 to launch at DEFCON 23 \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 10:55
*amarsh04 (~amarsh04@ppp14-2-73-102.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net) has joined #techrights		Jul 08 11:20
cubexyz	oiaohm, another interesting point... if I ctrl-alt-backspace and kill X the radeon frame buffer seems completely uneffected	Jul 08 11:27
cubexyz	shouldn't killing X also kill the framebuffer?	Jul 08 11:27
msb__	Kill for the love of killing! Kill for the love of Kali Linux!	Jul 08 11:28
cubexyz	also aewm is using 100% cpu and it just will not die	Jul 08 11:29
cubexyz	I'm never using aewm again	Jul 08 11:30
cubexyz	even init 1 doesn't kill the framebuffer, it's indestructible	Jul 08 11:30
cubexyz	ok, init 1 does actually stop aewm	Jul 08 11:31
cubexyz	a window manager should _exit_	Jul 08 11:31
cubexyz	sheesh	Jul 08 11:31
cubexyz	well, that's what happens when you do experiments	Jul 08 11:32
msb__	Maybe you should use Kali Linux (and wear a yellow scarf).	Jul 08 11:35
msb__	and visit Poettering.	Jul 08 11:36
cubexyz	I'm not part of that clique	Jul 08 11:40
cubexyz	on a more positive note mwm and icewm get the official thumbs up	Jul 08 11:43
cubexyz	they can co-exist without issue	Jul 08 11:43
cubexyz	running two window managers at the same time is a bit unusal I admit	Jul 08 11:46
cubexyz	unusual	Jul 08 11:47
cubexyz	a program should exit when I tell it to	Jul 08 11:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 Daily Images Haven't Been	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	Refreshed in a Month http://t.co/BvHZxwslK8	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfs	Jul 08 11:50
cubexyz	it shouldn't try to endlessly respawn itself like some eldritch horror	Jul 08 11:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu 15.10 Daily Images Haven't Been Refreshed in a Month \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat Used by NSA Spies, SELinux Possibly	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	Bypassed http://t.co/nq3Ik2JZMy	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfw	Jul 08 11:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Red Hat Used by NSA Spies, SELinux Possibly Bypassed \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Debian Will Soon Make GCC 5 Its Default	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	Compiler http://t.co/TqKLMRgXsA	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfx	Jul 08 11:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Debian Will Soon Make GCC 5 Its Default Compiler \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: KDE http://t.co/Sa4qmdA7i6	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfy	Jul 08 11:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: KDE \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Open-Source Databases Pose a Threat to Oracle’s	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	Dominance http://t.co/5zPcCAesbF	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 11:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Open-Source Databases Pose a Threat to Oracle’s Dominance \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfz	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 10 compelling reasons to consider open source	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	for your enterprise storage needs	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/28MgL9pdNQ (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 11:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hg0	Jul 08 11:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 10 compelling reasons to consider open source for your enterprise storage needs \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 11:50
oiaohm	cubexyz: X11 uses DRI framework and framebuffer is in fact a independant framework.	Jul 08 11:52
*nj3ma (~Moshe@105.231.160.49) has joined #techrights		Jul 08 11:52
oiaohm	cubexyz: KMS support in kernel is about slowly but surely removing framebuffer.	Jul 08 11:52
oiaohm	cubexyz: to be correct KMSCON	Jul 08 11:54
*amarsh04 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)		Jul 08 11:55
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/TheRegister/status/618734572902219776 https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618734603587747840	Jul 08 11:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@TheRegister: @schestowitz @Vecchi_Paolo We're an ad-supported business. We don't hide that - the ads are there for all to see, in fact. ^GC		Jul 08 11:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @KatHall42 Putting together data & references, statements from involved parties, publish it in Italian then I will @schestowitz @TheRegister		Jul 08 11:55
oiaohm	cubexyz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_framebuffer	Jul 08 11:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org \| Linux framebuffer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/n2hhg ]		Jul 08 11:55
cubexyz	oiaohm, linux doesn't seem to default to using a framebuffer on startup	Jul 08 11:55
schestowitz	I know, but it places pressure on editors and writers. I saw that myself when I wrote for a living. Removed that with my own sites.	Jul 08 11:55
cubexyz	but what exactly it does I'm not sure	Jul 08 11:56
cubexyz	I assume it's really text mode	Jul 08 11:56
oiaohm	cubexyz: depends on what age kernel.	Jul 08 11:56
cubexyz	this is 2.6.27.29	Jul 08 11:56
oiaohm	No there is no text mode cubexyz	Jul 08 11:56
schestowitz	If you write about tech and advertise cars or holidays, that may be OK. No conflict/fear.	Jul 08 11:56
oiaohm	A text mode is graphic rendered either to fb or kms	Jul 08 11:57
cubexyz	fbset says /dev/fb0 doesn't exist	Jul 08 11:57
cubexyz	it doesn't exist until I modprobe radeonfb	Jul 08 11:57
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618735617409712128	Jul 08 11:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz But IMHO @TheRegister demonstrated, up to now, to be quite well balanced. Otherwise I would be the first flaming against them.		Jul 08 11:58
schestowitz	balance is a subjective thing, based on a consensus sometimes manufactured by hidden forces (or incentives)	Jul 08 11:58
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/KatHall42/status/618735676612345856	Jul 08 11:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KatHall42: @Vecchi_Paolo @schestowitz @TheRegister Cool. Give us a shout if you think it would be relevant to a UK audience when you're ready. :-)		Jul 08 11:58
cubexyz	oiaohm, there must be a text mode...	Jul 08 11:59
cubexyz	what about when you don't run X at all?	Jul 08 11:59
schestowitz	We say that to overlook state terrorism is suitable balance, or to treat proprietary 'addiction'/lock-in as socially acceptable.	Jul 08 11:59
oiaohm	Just because a framebuffer devices is not exported does not mean the kernel is not using one internally cubexyz	Jul 08 11:59
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/KatHall42/status/618735676612345856	Jul 08 12:00
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618736066372194304	Jul 08 12:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @KatHall42 You surely are relevant as these methods are used also in UK to push their products. @schestowitz @TheRegister		Jul 08 12:00
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/KatHall42/status/618735676612345856	Jul 08 12:00
oiaohm	cubexyz: if you screen is 80x25 or 80x50 then you are using a video card textmode.	Jul 08 12:00
oiaohm	cubexyz normally that will not be a linux console.	Jul 08 12:00
oiaohm	cubexyz: also you will see vesa fonts not Linux ones.	Jul 08 12:01
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618736538671824896	Jul 08 12:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz Do you think I get influenced that much by propaganda? https://t.co/nvzTgOqHNz @TheRegister		Jul 08 12:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.linkedin.com \| Who is the most influential person in your life? Edward. \| Paolo Vecchi \| LinkedIn		Jul 08 12:02
schestowitz	Some people are more immune to perceptual manipulation than others. We need to protest the "others" from manipulators.	Jul 08 12:03
cubexyz	ok, I can "setfont drdos8x14"	Jul 08 12:03
cubexyz	been a while since I used that	Jul 08 12:03
schestowitz	That's why there is a strong public movement, for example, against #fox and #newscorp	Jul 08 12:03
cubexyz	I think just "setfont" on it's own reverts to the default font	Jul 08 12:03
schestowitz	*protect	Jul 08 12:04
schestowitz	cubexyz: got a new machine here	Jul 08 12:05
schestowitz	for just 150 quid	Jul 08 12:05
schestowitz	subsidised AFAIK	Jul 08 12:05
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618737386269356032	Jul 08 12:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz Please don't see things in B&W. Embrace the vastity of grey scale views. Je ne suis pas Richard Stallman @TheRegister		Jul 08 12:05
cubexyz	oiaohm, this goes back to my original question of how to reset the text console	Jul 08 12:05
schestowitz	What happens when some views are suppressed or demonised because of conditioning?	Jul 08 12:06
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/readergordonbp/status/618737804059787264	Jul 08 12:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@readergordonbp: @Vecchi_Paolo @schestowitz have either of you ever read The Filter Bubble by Eli Parisser? Very interesting! https://t.co/zoBhIV1ouh		Jul 08 12:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.goodreads.com \| The Filter Bubble: What the Internet is Hiding From You by Eli Pariser — Reviews, Discussion, Bookclubs, Lists		Jul 08 12:06
oiaohm	cubexyz: reset config_vt mode right. By undocumented ways like loading a framebuffer driver or restarting the computer.	Jul 08 12:06
schestowitz	Many views are never being aired because they are viewed, by design, as obscene or subversive	Jul 08 12:07
schestowitz	RMS once told me, we're taught that some things are "laughable" even when they're not	Jul 08 12:07
oiaohm	cubexyz: sysrq magic key can do it as well.	Jul 08 12:08
cubexyz	I think that goes back to conceptual learning verus rote memorization	Jul 08 12:08
cubexyz	mostly people are memorizing facts without any philosophical or organization method	Jul 08 12:08
oiaohm	cubexyz: basically config_vt is a mess	Jul 08 12:09
cubexyz	mother says "use microsoft"	Jul 08 12:09
cubexyz	it's like when a parent says "What I say goes" without any explanation	Jul 08 12:09
cubexyz	that's our society	Jul 08 12:09
cubexyz	oiaohm, I can't really disagree	Jul 08 12:10
oiaohm	cubexyz: then think sysvinit depends on config_vt working.	Jul 08 12:10
cubexyz	I wish I could just write to a memory address like we did on the commodore 64	Jul 08 12:11
cubexyz	then fixing text console would be simple	Jul 08 12:11
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618738798189498368	Jul 08 12:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz It happens every day. I think @TheRegister can be seen as a @PrivateEyeNews for techies & is not pretending to save the world.		Jul 08 12:11
schestowitz	Who ever said it needed to save the world? The point is, diversity of views, unadulterated.	Jul 08 12:12
cubexyz	or failing that, at least have a REAL serial console	Jul 08 12:12
oiaohm	kmscon where the console system can be reset	Jul 08 12:12
oiaohm	Is a good step forwards.	Jul 08 12:12
cubexyz	my solution to computer botch-ups of this nature is to have multiple machines running	Jul 08 12:12
cubexyz	so even if the text console or ssh stops working I have two or three backup machines	Jul 08 12:13
oiaohm	A general computer is over 20 diffenter computers working with each other.	Jul 08 12:13
oiaohm	This is why they can screw up so badly.	Jul 08 12:13
oiaohm	Like a intel/amd cpu cannot in fact start itself. It depends on another cpu to give it the microcode.	Jul 08 12:14
cubexyz	what other cpu?	Jul 08 12:14
cubexyz	the BIOS kickstarts the cpu	Jul 08 12:15
cubexyz	also I do run m68000 sometimes :)	Jul 08 12:16
cubexyz	in my computer museum/work area	Jul 08 12:16
oiaohm	For new intel and amd cpus that is not how it works.	Jul 08 12:16
oiaohm	https://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/ec-development	Jul 08 12:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.chromium.org \| Chromium Embedded Controller (EC) Development - The Chromium Projects [ http://ur1.ca/n2hox ]		Jul 08 12:16
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618739981360758785	Jul 08 12:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz Which is what I think they are doing. There are advertorials every so often but are spotted quite easily @TheRegister		Jul 08 12:17
oiaohm	chromebooks have open source versions of the hidden processor that infact starts the computer cubexyz	Jul 08 12:17
schestowitz	They improved recently and I hope it continues that way :-)	Jul 08 12:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: its all the cpu that wake computer up from being suspended.......	Jul 08 12:17
cubexyz	a microcontroller...	Jul 08 12:19
cubexyz	I wouldn't say another cpu	Jul 08 12:19
cubexyz	just like there's a microcontroller in a computer keyboard	Jul 08 12:20
oiaohm	intel management engine controller is what intel calls that.	Jul 08 12:21
oiaohm	cubexyz: a microcontroller is still a cpu.	Jul 08 12:22
oiaohm	If you remember a 8088/8086-486 the bios was directly connected to the cpu and the cpu could start up without assistance of a Microcontroller.	Jul 08 12:23
oiaohm	cubexyz: pents and latter is where the microcode inload into cpu before bios can process start.	Jul 08 12:24
cubexyz	ok, sorry... I'll say "General Purpose CPU" instead	Jul 08 12:25
cubexyz	technically you're right, a microcontroller is a cpu	Jul 08 12:25
cubexyz	secondary processing unit might be more apt though	Jul 08 12:26
oiaohm	ST-Micro STM32F100 is only 24 mhz but it is a full ARM Cortex M3 that some chromebooks use for the EC	Jul 08 12:30
oiaohm	cubexyz: what is stupid is how we have got to the point a CPU chip cannot start itself.	Jul 08 12:31
*amarsh04 (~amarsh04@ppp14-2-73-102.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net) has joined #techrights		Jul 08 12:31
oiaohm	Results in having to make sure motherboard and cpu match in firmware as well as the socket.	Jul 08 12:31
oiaohm	cubexyz: as the complexity of secondary processing goes up the odds that some bug in seconardary processing will ruin your secuirty happens.	Jul 08 12:33
oiaohm	cubexyz: the old firewire hack to examin memory was not OS but controller of firewire being bugger with direct access to the memory controller.	Jul 08 12:34
cubexyz	I don't think the original pentium had reprogrammable microcode	Jul 08 12:41
cubexyz	Pentium Pro and later it was	Jul 08 12:42
cubexyz	not that I realized it back then	Jul 08 12:42
cubexyz	otherwise Intel could have fixed that FDIV bug with a microcode update	Jul 08 12:43
cubexyz	it does make sense though.... there could be bugs	Jul 08 12:43
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Docker reveals its secret to success	Jul 08 12:44
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/1mf2atdrDu (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 12:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwp	Jul 08 12:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Docker reveals its secret to success \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 12:44
cubexyz	coreboot loads the intel microcode in what they called "ramstage"	Jul 08 12:44
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Tizen 2.3 Rev 3 SDK now released with Native	Jul 08 12:44
TweetTuxMachines	IDE Bug Fixes http://t.co/SlztHUqdvS	Jul 08 12:44
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 12:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwr	Jul 08 12:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Tizen 2.3 Rev 3 SDK now released with Native IDE Bug Fixes \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: OSS http://t.co/PCZQKIoZOg	Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 12:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: OSS \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hws	Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Ubuntu http://t.co/yBdbQDKAeM	Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 12:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Ubuntu \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwt	Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Software http://t.co/AIgPqDkZbX	Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 12:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Software \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwu	Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's howtos http://t.co/1jrYgYdEkn	Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 12:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwv	Jul 08 12:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's howtos \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 12:45
cubexyz	the original IBM PC had the Intel 8259 which was a programmable interrupt controller	Jul 08 12:46
oiaohm	cubexyz: http://www.zdnet.com/article/intel-releases-fix-for-f00f-bug/	Jul 08 12:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.zdnet.com \| Intel releases fix for F00F bug \| ZDNet [ http://ur1.ca/n2hxg ]		Jul 08 12:46
oiaohm	cubexyz: some of the petium 1 bugs could be microcode patched.	Jul 08 12:46
oiaohm	cubexyz: div bug was in the floating point controller.	Jul 08 12:46
oiaohm	Petuim1 had a master microcode inside.	Jul 08 12:47
oiaohm	So no matter what it could start.	Jul 08 12:47
cubexyz	ok Pentium MMX doesn't count :)	Jul 08 12:47
cubexyz	hardly the original Pentium	Jul 08 12:47
oiaohm	cubexyz: read again Pentium and Pentium MMX	Jul 08 12:47
oiaohm	That patch was for both.	Jul 08 12:48
oiaohm	So there were a few issues patched in Pentium 1	Jul 08 12:48
oiaohm	I cannot remember exactly what intel chip become the first that would not start without microcode	Jul 08 12:49
cubexyz	Intel definitely had to swap out the early pentium cpus	Jul 08 12:50
cubexyz	there was probably a ton of different versions	Jul 08 12:50
cubexyz	there was P5, socket 4 and socket 5	Jul 08 12:50
oiaohm	One of the bad reasons for it is overseas production and controlling when the release of the microcode to prevent chip being released to market ahead of intels timeline.	Jul 08 12:50
cubexyz	then socket 7 (skipping socket 6 I guess)	Jul 08 12:50
oiaohm	cubexyz: anything in the floating point buggy in pentuim1 could not be addressed by microcode. The interger processing side was microcode.	Jul 08 12:51
oiaohm	The microcode starts with the risc like designed core inside intel x86 chips	Jul 08 12:52
cubexyz	IBM S/370 had IML	Jul 08 12:56
cubexyz	old CPUs that I know about had PLA	Jul 08 13:00
cubexyz	yup, CPUs have bugs	Jul 08 13:02
oiaohm	cubexyz: CPU bugs mxied with Motherboard chipset bugs you have a nightmare mix	Jul 08 13:02
cubexyz	you can see here that my old P3 system used coreboot to update the microcode:	Jul 08 13:03
cubexyz	http://www.maxhost.org/other/coreboot-serial-output.txt	Jul 08 13:03
cubexyz	I don't think it actually changed anything though	Jul 08 13:03
cubexyz	intel is very secretive about that stuff	Jul 08 13:05
cubexyz	they probably figure... don't make it too good, then no one will stay on the upgrade treadmill	Jul 08 13:07
cubexyz	no one wants to upgrade their dishwasher every couple of years, but somehow with computers it's de rigueur :)	Jul 08 13:08
oiaohm	cubexyz: you have to remember just becuase you can fix bugs by a microcode push there is absolutely no reason why you could not introduce them the same way.	Jul 08 13:09
cubexyz	I'm sure the blackhats have something up their sleeves	Jul 08 13:11
cubexyz	in theory the bad guys could knock out your bios but I've never actually seen that in the wild	Jul 08 13:12
cubexyz	even if they did I have socketed bios and backup images	Jul 08 13:13
cubexyz	the microcode updates aren't persistant either from what I understand	Jul 08 13:13
cubexyz	I think video cards have microcode updates too	Jul 08 13:15
oiaohm	OS applied microcode updates are not persistant	Jul 08 13:15
oiaohm	the microcode updates writting in as part of bios/efi firmware updates are kind of persistant.	Jul 08 13:16
oiaohm	I have seen a few different bios attacks.	Jul 08 13:16
oiaohm	One they guy who did it is still in jail. It was just wrong minorally extend the bios to include a code to cause the computer to fail every 180 days.	Jul 08 13:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: what you call evil way to get repeat customers.	Jul 08 13:17
oiaohm	Also completely stupid	Jul 08 13:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIH_%28computer_virus%29 This is a bios nuking infection.	Jul 08 13:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org \| CIH (computer virus) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/n2i9m ]		Jul 08 13:18
oiaohm	cubexyz: http://www.webroot.com/blog/2011/09/13/mebromi-the-first-bios-rootkit-in-the-wild/ And this was found in 2011	Jul 08 13:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.webroot.com \| Mebromi: the first BIOS rootkit in the wild - Webroot Threat Blog [ http://ur1.ca/n2ia6 ]		Jul 08 13:19
oiaohm	so virus writers are kind getting nasty.	Jul 08 13:20
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/knowhowtohelp/status/618762479796121600	Jul 08 13:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@knowhowtohelp: @schestowitz Happy to hear this, many thanks for the feedback! - Amy		Jul 08 13:45
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/kstallett/status/618763537687703553	Jul 08 13:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@kstallett: @schestowitz Do you know the perpetrators of the attacks?		Jul 08 13:51
schestowitz	No, but even if I knew, i'd need hard evidence to press charges	Jul 08 13:51
*Disconnected ().		Jul 08 13:59
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Jul 8 13:59:54 2015
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jul 8 14:00:10 2015
*Now talking on #techrights		Jul 08 14:00
*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 08 14:00
*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 08 14:00
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's leftovers http://t.co/myuqmL7331	Jul 08 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2itr	Jul 08 14:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 8/7/2015: Kali Linux 2.0, Canonical and	Jul 08 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	Lenovo http://t.co/LeFX0mjozu (techrights.org)	Jul 08 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2its	Jul 08 14:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 8/7/2015: Kali Linux 2.0, Canonical and Lenovo \| Techrights		Jul 08 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat and NSA: This is Not News	Jul 08 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/MMDJ0lqAjY (techrights.org)	Jul 08 14:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2itt	Jul 08 14:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Red Hat and NSA: This is Not News \| Techrights		Jul 08 14:38
r_schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6309874	Jul 08 14:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: "If report is correct, Red Hat's marketing department has a very tricky customer reference" http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/08/evil_nsa_runs_on_saintly_red_hat_enterprise_linux_apache/ #nsa #redhat		Jul 08 14:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.theregister.co.uk \| Evil NSA runs on saintly Linux, Apache, MySQL • The Register [ http://ur1.ca/n2iwg ]		Jul 08 14:49
r_schestowitz	"Love the sin, hate the sinner? Or something like that? ;-)"	Jul 08 14:49
r_schestowitz	In this case, we hate the sin, but love the sinner?	Jul 08 14:49
r_schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6299541	Jul 08 14:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Pirate Bay founders: FBI has #Prenda Law under investigation http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/07/pirate-bay-founders-fbi-has-prenda-law-under-investigation/ as if #fbi upholds the law http://www.h-online.com/security/news/item/Report-DDoS-service-as-a-legitimate-FBI-approved-business-1867566.html		Jul 08 14:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> arstechnica.com \| Pirate Bay founders: FBI has Prenda Law under investigation \| Ars Technica [ http://ur1.ca/n0391 ]		Jul 08 14:50
r_schestowitz	"They might punish Prenda to create a perception of enforcement, and justice in copyright law. All of the big publishers have done the same to promote their works and track users with watermarks. That makes our modern, radical copyright laws essentially a tool for public manipulation. Only privileged people are allowed to share and use all of the cultural resonance of broadcast and big publisher promoted music, music, and images. That is a	Jul 08 14:50
r_schestowitz	very powerful body of work, able to instantly form new memories in people who see them. “Potential troublemakers” who might threaten the revenue of favored companies can be ruined if they are foolish enough to share big publisher garbage."	Jul 08 14:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.h-online.com \| Report: DDoS service as a legitimate, FBI-approved business - The H Security: News and Features [ http://ur1.ca/e02nb ]		Jul 08 14:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/tM8HDZJrNA	Jul 08 15:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 15:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 15:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2j0p	Jul 08 15:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/iYJEQ09eAu	Jul 08 15:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 15:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2j0q	Jul 08 15:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 15:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Play! is a PlayStation 2 emulator for Android	Jul 08 15:05
TweetTuxMachines	(extremely beta) http://t.co/zjZNQmWWl2	Jul 08 15:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-liliputing.com \| Play! is a PlayStation 2 emulator for Android (extremely beta) - Liliputing		Jul 08 15:05
TweetTuxMachines	(liliputing.com)	Jul 08 15:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2j0r	Jul 08 15:05
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 20 best new Android apps and games this week	Jul 08 15:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/0ze2T64JQe (www.theguardian.com)	Jul 08 15:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theguardian.com \| 20 best new Android apps and games this week \| Technology \| The Guardian		Jul 08 15:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/k6AbP5wGTv (www.phonearena.com)	Jul 08 15:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2jf4	Jul 08 15:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phonearena.com \| 7 of the best board games for Android		Jul 08 15:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Best new Android widgets (July 2015)	Jul 08 15:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/GaxOGq4hP8 (www.phonearena.com)	Jul 08 15:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2jf5	Jul 08 15:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phonearena.com \| Best new Android widgets (July 2015)		Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Which Android Wear smartwatch is best for you?	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	Asus vs LG vs Motorola vs Samsung vs Sony	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4o6tsPLVSA (www.pocket-lint.com)	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2jf6	Jul 08 15:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pocket-lint.com \| Which Android Wear smartwatch is best for you? Asus vs LG vs Motorola vs Samsung vs Sony - Pocket-lint		Jul 08 15:56
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r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Nintendo_VX/status/618796962452672512	Jul 08 16:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Nintendo_VX: .@stonemirror @SteamPunkDevil_ @TechyFolks @bobbyo1967 @Gayle36 Did you ever apologize to Kathy Sutphen? http://t.co/Y0goRuU6jb		Jul 08 16:02
r_schestowitz	Lefty	Jul 08 16:02
r_schestowitz	LOL	Jul 08 16:02
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r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/jurasick/status/618800834185400320	Jul 08 16:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@jurasick: @schestowitz I know. Same problem here!		Jul 08 16:18
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r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618805492115091456	Jul 08 16:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz (quality control?)		Jul 08 16:36
r_schestowitz	More like pest control	Jul 08 16:36
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Godzilla_Govt/status/618805863248035840	Jul 08 16:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Godzilla_Govt: Hey, hey.. that's life in the digital ghettos. Get VPN bruh. https://t.co/XnabnN6Ups		Jul 08 16:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: It doesn't inspire confidence when you're told to report #ddos attacks to #fbi which itself is linked to shady DDOS services 'firms'		Jul 08 16:37
r_schestowitz	got it already	Jul 08 16:37
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Godzilla_Govt/status/618806344615723008	Jul 08 16:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Godzilla_Govt: @schestowitz OK. You were just commenting toward the report path for problems w/ DDOS. I see.		Jul 08 16:42
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android M 6.0 Update Features, Releas e Date &	Jul 08 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	Rumors Here! http://t.co/VQuN7oPOhJ	Jul 08 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	(www.latinospost.com)	Jul 08 17:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.latinospost.com \| Android M 6.0 Update Features, Release Date & Rumors Here! : Tech : Latinos Post		Jul 08 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ka0	Jul 08 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Opinion: Can Linux Be A Viable Gaming Platform?	Jul 08 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	Thoughts From A Sympathetic Game Developer	Jul 08 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/eVuLoGCFHJ (www.gamingonlinux.com)	Jul 08 17:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ka1	Jul 08 17:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gamingonlinux.com \| Opinion: Can Linux Be A Viable Gaming Platform? Thoughts From A Sympathetic Game Developer \| GamingOnLinux		Jul 08 17:18
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Tizen 2.3 Rev 3 SDK now released with Native	Jul 08 17:18
TweetTuxMachines	IDE Bug Fixes http://t.co/NunlCv9BSV	Jul 08 17:18
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tizenexperts.com)	Jul 08 17:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tizenexperts.com \| Tizen 2.3 Rev 3 SDK now released with Native IDE Bug FixesTizen Experts		Jul 08 17:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ka3	Jul 08 17:18
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/618817645966688256	Jul 08 17:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: be careful. #owncloud still lacks integrated password throttling, a major hack to be expected sooner or later https://t.co/uCYfqNUO87		Jul 08 17:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: "Users of ownCloud Documents will be happy to hear that we have updated to the latest upstream version of WebODF" https://t.co/ZILwzhpTSn		Jul 08 17:26
schestowitz	Depending on the users' choice of password	Jul 08 17:26
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/618818757998288896	Jul 08 17:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: Yes. But we are talking of the dump user, w/ simple passwords. Unlike Wikipedia, owncloud still lacks pw-throttling https://t.co/Y6TATEzltg		Jul 08 17:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @Wikinaut Depending on the users' choice of password		Jul 08 17:31
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/618819565263429633	Jul 08 17:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: @schestowitz OC team always responds that OC admins have to use fail2ban etc. An insane assumption. OC should ship w/ built-in pw-throttling		Jul 08 17:31
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/SleepyPenguin1/status/618818956963520512	Jul 08 17:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@SleepyPenguin1: New York Stock Exchange suspends trading after technical glitch @ruskin147 @schestowitz http://t.co/WfMkwJdelR		Jul 08 17:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.theguardian.com \| New York Stock Exchange suspends trading after technical glitch \| Business \| The Guardian		Jul 08 17:32
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schestowitz	http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2015/07/08/report-big-job-cuts-expected-microsoft/29853657/	Jul 08 18:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.usatoday.com \| Microsoft cutting up to 7,800 jobs [ http://ur1.ca/n2kvw ]		Jul 08 18:19
schestowitz	Woohoo	Jul 08 18:19
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Debian 9 "Stretch" Moves to FFmpeg from Libav	Jul 08 19:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/lYMFBfPTy4 (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 19:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2lai	Jul 08 19:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Debian 9 "Stretch" Moves to FFmpeg from Libav - Softpedia		Jul 08 19:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Debian 9 "Stretch" Moves to FFmpeg from Libav	Jul 08 19:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ocRtPj5e9s (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 19:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2laj	Jul 08 19:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Debian 9 "Stretch" Moves to FFmpeg from Libav \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 19:09
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DaemonFC	http://gizmodo.com/microsoft-doesnt-want-to-make-smartphones-anymore-1716524766	Jul 08 19:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-gizmodo.com \| Microsoft Doesn't Want to Make Smartphones Anymore [ http://ur1.ca/n2lp5 ]		Jul 08 19:57
DaemonFC	I'd imagine that they'll go ahead and release the two "flagship" phones at the end of the year. Then anyone who buys one will sort of be in "support limbo" for a couple of years like Zune and Kin were.	Jul 08 19:58
DaemonFC	Microsoft has developed a nasty reputation for abandoning their own devices and users. That could explain why some carriers will actually pay you to take a Windows Phone and they still can't sell them.	Jul 08 19:59
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Microsoft cutting up to 7,800 jobs	Jul 08 20:00
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4jwDjqnAIj (error)	Jul 08 20:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2lqk	Jul 08 20:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Microsoft cutting up to 7,800 jobs \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 20:00
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Home Automation with Raspberry Pi	Jul 08 20:00
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/VhYPwZV7cs (error)	Jul 08 20:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2lql	Jul 08 20:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Home Automation with Raspberry Pi \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 20:00
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Ubuntu http://t.co/K0Iim1ukrl	Jul 08 20:00
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 20:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Ubuntu \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 20:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2lqn	Jul 08 20:00
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines This is the tiny computer the BBC is giving to	Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	a million kids http://t.co/m8j0xv5TKm	Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2md1	Jul 08 20:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| This is the tiny computer the BBC is giving to a million kids \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Running ZFS On The Linux 4.1 Kernel	Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/0O8g1Vjsn0 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2md6	Jul 08 20:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Running ZFS On The Linux 4.1 Kernel \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Qt Creator 3.5 Beta 1 Drops BlackBerry,	Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	Improves For Android http://t.co/wRLcQh9S79	Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 20:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Qt Creator 3.5 Beta 1 Drops BlackBerry, Improves For Android \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2md8	Jul 08 20:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Don't touch this! Seven types of open source to	Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	dance away from http://t.co/dDy0vWdXiO	Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 21:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Don't touch this! Seven types of open source to dance away from \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2n57	Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Phoronix on Graphics http://t.co/k9xKJHDOh0	Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 21:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Phoronix on Graphics \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2n59	Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Alpine Linux 3.2.1 released	Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/EbTOphCWi9 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2n5a	Jul 08 21:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Alpine Linux 3.2.1 released \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Multimedia conferencing system runs Android	Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sDQCqTC84I (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2n5b	Jul 08 21:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Multimedia conferencing system runs Android \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 21:50
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Alpine Linux 3.2.1 released	Jul 09 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/u2qL9fSofQ (www.alpinelinux.org)	Jul 09 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2op1	Jul 09 01:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.alpinelinux.org \| Alpine 3.2.1 released \| Alpine Linux		Jul 09 01:26
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DaemonFC	http://undeadly.org/cgi?action=article&sid=20150708134520	Jul 09 01:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-undeadly.org \| Microsoft Now OpenBSD Foundation Gold Contributor [ http://ur1.ca/n2or1 ]		Jul 09 01:35
DaemonFC	Microsoft just gave the OpenBSD foundation somewhere between $25,000 and $50,000.	Jul 09 01:35
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Multimedia conferencing system runs Android	Jul 09 01:38
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/aQzY6oYXXp (linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 09 01:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| Multimedia conferencing system runs Android · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 09 01:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2os1	Jul 09 01:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/iYJEQ09eAu	Jul 09 01:38
TweetTuxMachines	retweeted by (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 01:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 01:38
TweetTuxMachines	@schestowitz	Jul 09 01:39
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2or9	Jul 09 01:39
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Home Automation with Raspberry Pi	Jul 09 01:39
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/B2OHMw9pTG (www.linuxjournal.com)	Jul 09 01:39
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2os2	Jul 09 01:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxjournal.com \| Home Automation with Raspberry Pi \| Linux Journal		Jul 09 01:39
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oiaohm	Something I have never unstood is why Internet compadible IP address have to be used inside private networks. You go through a gateway router and be NATed anyhow	Jul 09 03:34
oiaohm	From my eyes we should be able to use a complete ipv4 address space in our own internal network.	Jul 09 03:35
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Running ZFS On The Linux 4.1 Kernel	Jul 09 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Dektw0g6Kf (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2prt	Jul 09 04:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Running ZFS On The Linux 4.1 Kernel - Phoronix		Jul 09 04:16
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MinceR	oiaohm: that won't work if you're trying to talk to another computer on the same LAN	Jul 09 08:01
oiaohm	MinceR: remember that a netmask of 0.0.0.0 is valid by spec	Jul 09 08:02
oiaohm	MinceR: I have built using proxy internet access using full ipv4 internal before.	Jul 09 08:03
oiaohm	MinceR: basically Ubuntu fan ip tunning mixed with local ipv4 the need to change to ipv6 could be fairly much put off for another 1000+ years.	Jul 09 08:14
oiaohm	MinceR: why each internet ipv4 address could host another ipv4 space of servers.	Jul 09 08:15
MinceR	if you're using 0.0.0.0, you might as well use a private address	Jul 09 08:23
MinceR	and if you're talking to a server, you'll still need a unique address	Jul 09 08:24
oiaohm	MinceR: ps://wiki.ubuntu.com/FanNetworking	Jul 09 08:36
oiaohm	Opps	Jul 09 08:36
oiaohm	https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FanNetworking	Jul 09 08:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-wiki.ubuntu.com \| FanNetworking - Ubuntu Wiki		Jul 09 08:37
oiaohm	MinceR: fan networking is overlaying.	Jul 09 08:37
oiaohm	The theory of a unique IP address comes very different when you allow for ip tunneling.	Jul 09 08:37
oiaohm	So a unique private address in a IPv4 different to the internet using ip tunneling should be accessable by using 1 exposed internet address	Jul 09 08:39
oiaohm	Or could be in fact using multi internet access address points.	Jul 09 08:39
oiaohm	MinceR: only thing a server need really is that a unique route can be formed and the client will support it.	Jul 09 08:40
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux Training Scholarship Deadline this Friday	Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/9O1jJlIcNa (www.linux.com)	Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rnp	Jul 09 08:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| Linux Training Scholarship Deadline this Friday \| Linux.com		Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Nouveau CUDA support is coming	Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/2U3gdww6Ge (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/y1gOtIbTlb (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 08:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| NVIDIA Has Someone Working On Nouveau CUDA Support - Phoronix		Jul 09 08:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| For New Developers There Are A Lot Of Ways To Help Nouveau - Phoronix		Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/VLbd61aY40 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rnq	Jul 09 08:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| CUDA 7.5 Up To RC Status With New 16-bit FP Data Format - Phoronix		Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The linu xfoundation enters further into	Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	training and certification business	Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/8PJcPfSHGu (www.digitaljournal.com)	Jul 09 08:57
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rnr	Jul 09 08:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.digitaljournal.com \| Linux Foundation's Individual Membership Drive to Help IT Professionals Advance Careers - Press Release - Digital Journal		Jul 09 08:57
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/andymckay/status/618956473733746690	Jul 09 08:59
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@andymckay: Got a lot of respect for Nadella, looks like Microsoft is becoming interesting again.		Jul 09 08:59
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/kisielk/status/619012871167410176	Jul 09 08:59
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@kisielk: @andymckay You mean like this? http://t.co/luoUmCCmAj		Jul 09 08:59
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| There is No ‘New Microsoft’: Under Nadella, Patent Extortion Against Linux/Android Carries on \| Techrights		Jul 09 08:59
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/readergordonbp/status/619052624797663232	Jul 09 09:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@readergordonbp: @schestowitz Open Source? With MS?		Jul 09 09:01
schestowitz	MS involved?	Jul 09 09:03
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/PyefinchComms/status/618957288238358528	Jul 09 09:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@PyefinchComms: @schestowitz thanks for sharing Dr. Roy Schestowitz, have a great Thursday :) (insight by http://t.co/Vv2iMRFgYE)		Jul 09 09:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> commun.it \| Twitter Community Management Dashboard \| Twitter Marketing Tool \| Commun.it		Jul 09 09:04
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/fcassia/status/618952126404947968	Jul 09 09:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@fcassia: @Cisco is it safer if we use Cisco kit with built-in backdoors? cc/@schestowitz		Jul 09 09:04
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/AntsiHossie/status/618947016224325633	Jul 09 09:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AntsiHossie: Yes to #TubeStrike. The Media are so quick to portray things for what they are not @schestowitz .. Thank you https://t.co/rNDIw3B5k3		Jul 09 09:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #TubeStrike Justified http://t.co/ucrTL5ZUxD good response, ignore the real ransom: using #wimbledon and tourists to incite against them		Jul 09 09:06
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schestowitz	Guest2866: hey	Jul 09 09:06
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MinceR	oiaohm: your NAT box will still need a public address	Jul 09 09:08
oiaohm	MinceR: depends on how many levels of tunneling you allow.	Jul 09 09:09
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/readergordonbp/status/619055203594182657	Jul 09 09:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@readergordonbp: @schestowitz Yep. Scroll right down to the section Sales Plan: http://t.co/sv6in0zrqw		Jul 09 09:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.bbc.co.uk \| BBC Micro Bit computer's final design revealed - BBC News		Jul 09 09:11
schestowitz	ewww... no lessons learned from OLPC then	Jul 09 09:11
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Peter Hutterer released version 0.19 of	Jul 09 09:13
TweetTuxMachines	Libinput	Jul 09 09:13
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/1cv94avyRe (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 09:13
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rs6	Jul 09 09:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Libinput 0.19 Brings Improved Pointer Acceleration - Phoronix		Jul 09 09:13
*TweetTuxMachines @RamiSilawi favourited 'Linux Training Scholarship Deadline this Friday http://t.co/9O1jJlIcNa'		Jul 09 09:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| Linux Training Scholarship Deadline this Friday \| Linux.com		Jul 09 09:13
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines amd freewsw graphics driver not in bad shape	Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/qMiSxrR26d (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/lrMyRrR49q (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 09:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| A Look At CS:GO & TF2 On AMD GPUs With The Open-Source Driver - Phoronix		Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/jN9FqrO5yW (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 09:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| AMD Radeon 300 Series On Linux - Catalyst: 0 vs. Open-Source: 1 - Phoronix		Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rwn	Jul 09 09:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| What Do You Hope To See Out Of Today's Expected Catalyst Linux Update? - Phoronix		Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 To Follow Debian In Its March To	Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	GCC 5 http://t.co/38HC3BmMsW (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rwo	Jul 09 09:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Ubuntu 15.10 To Follow Debian In Its March To GCC 5 - Phoronix		Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Lots of Linux Kernel Vulnerabilities Closed in	Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	Ubuntu 15.04	Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/hSYb4Bl3Ed (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/YB0cdB6eju (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 09:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Lots of Linux Kernel Vulnerabilities Closed in Ubuntu 15.04 - Softpedia		Jul 09 09:31
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rwq	Jul 09 09:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Canonical Closes Numerous PHP Vulnerabilities in Ubuntu 15.04 - Softpedia		Jul 09 09:31
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*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 09 10:30
*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 09 10:30
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*Now talking on #techrights		Jul 09 10:38
*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 09 10:38
*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 09 10:38
schestowitz	MinceR: anything in channels other than this one over the past hour (had two REIN engineers over for about an hour, couldn't find the source of REIN)?	Jul 09 10:39
MinceR	nothing except the bots	Jul 09 10:41
MinceR	and even that only in #boycottnovell-social	Jul 09 10:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Qt Creator 3.5 Beta 1 Drops BlackBerry,	Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	Improves For Android http://t.co/0vazObcHsj	Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com) qt seeing signs on the wall.	Jul 09 11:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Qt Creator 3.5 Beta 1 Drops BlackBerry, Improves For Android - Phoronix		Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ssy	Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines A Big Set Of Updates Come For KDBUS	Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/9hqbGjfZM6 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2st1	Jul 09 11:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| A Big Set Of Updates Come For KDBUS - Phoronix		Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 6 affordable Android phones you'll actually	Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	enjoy using http://t.co/R7UCVDfrs8	Jul 09 11:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 6 affordable Android phones you'll actually enjoy using \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 11:11
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2st2	Jul 09 11:11
schestowitz	MinceR: thanks a lot	Jul 09 11:13
schestowitz	MinceR: the BT precision test guy was so geeky	Jul 09 11:13
schestowitz	into all that spooks and sci-fi stuff	Jul 09 11:14
MinceR	np	Jul 09 11:14
schestowitz	but couldn't find what messes up the connection	Jul 09 11:14
schestowitz	since march	Jul 09 11:14
schestowitz	very depressing	Jul 09 11:14
cubexyz	I had the idea of multiple ISPs	Jul 09 11:22
cubexyz	expensive but more reliable	Jul 09 11:22
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/tiikeridesign/status/619095741617848320m	Jul 09 11:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@tiikeridesign: @schestowitz wow, the Sherlock #HackingTeam Holmes!		Jul 09 11:50
schestowitz	cubexyz: a friend of mine from BT does it	Jul 09 11:51
schestowitz	cubexyz: because he lives in the countryside	Jul 09 11:51
schestowitz	but in this case one ISP would not to not use the cables	Jul 09 11:51
schestowitz	which are the culprit in this case, too much electric noise on them	Jul 09 11:51
schestowitz	if the second ISP is wireless (long range) it would not be worth the cancer risk	Jul 09 11:51
*nj3ma (~Moshe@105.53.83.131) has joined #techrights		Jul 09 11:58
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines You May Want To Wait On Trying Out The Linux	Jul 09 12:01
TweetTuxMachines	4.2 Kernel http://t.co/Dj91GyhBDH	Jul 09 12:01
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com) FUSE work in progress:	Jul 09 12:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| You May Want To Wait On Trying Out The Linux 4.2 Kernel - Phoronix		Jul 09 12:01
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/2S6pmu3wz3 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 12:01
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2t52	Jul 09 12:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| FUSE Starts Working On Scalability Improvements With Linux 4.2 - Phoronix		Jul 09 12:01
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines phoronix looks at the latest of mesa	Jul 09 12:01
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/GY33JiDTJk (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 12:01
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/PFrmK7bZLh (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 12:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Understanding More Of The Shader Storage Buffer In Mesa - Phoronix		Jul 09 12:01
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/tETGhBrwjG (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 12:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Mesa Is Working Towards Headless Compute/OpenCL Support - Phoronix		Jul 09 12:01
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2t53	Jul 09 12:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Mesa 10.5.9 Is The Last Of The Series - Phoronix		Jul 09 12:01
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/619098310301904896	Jul 09 12:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: @schestowitz pls not so cryptic. pls plain text		Jul 09 12:02
schestowitz	I don't understand	Jul 09 12:02
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/619099279727161344	Jul 09 12:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: @schestowitz trust UK? Trust BBC?		Jul 09 12:04
schestowitz	With caution	Jul 09 12:04
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/619099660892958720	Jul 09 12:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: @schestowitz pls. elaborate your comparison betw. epo and tubestrike press coverage		Jul 09 12:05
schestowitz	Media characterising workers as well paid, hence greedy, disruptive, management stressed and panicked, extorted by staff	Jul 09 12:06
oiaohm	cubexyz: if you live in Australia you know the right to have your internet connection by multi ISP's still can sux.	Jul 09 12:21
cubexyz	oiaohm, how come?	Jul 09 12:22
oiaohm	cubexyz: why Australian carriers and ISP are different vendors so bad cable in the ground is the carriers problem.	Jul 09 12:22
oiaohm	cubexyz: everyone in Australia has at least 20 different ISP they can choose from.	Jul 09 12:23
oiaohm	cubexyz but number of carriers for cable connection can be exactly 1.	Jul 09 12:23
cubexyz	I assume there's DSL, Cable, Satellite	Jul 09 12:24
cubexyz	but I was thinking just two ISPs :)	Jul 09 12:24
oiaohm	Telstra	Jul 09 12:25
oiaohm	Happens to be cable and 2 of the core satelites above australia.	Jul 09 12:25
oiaohm	To be correct DSL cable and satelite.	Jul 09 12:25
cubexyz	load sharing would be nice too	Jul 09 12:27
cubexyz	exploit the extra bandwidth	Jul 09 12:28
oiaohm	cubexyz: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/satellites-undersea-cables-go-to-telstra/story-e6frg8zx-1226014383346	Jul 09 12:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theaustralian.com.au \| Cookies must be enabled. \| The Australian [ http://ur1.ca/h4kpl ]		Jul 09 12:28
oiaohm	cubexyz: Telstra in the Australian area has been very bussy	Jul 09 12:28
cubexyz	well at least it's not MSN	Jul 09 12:29
oiaohm	Aquirng anything in the area it been able.	Jul 09 12:29
oiaohm	cubexyz: biggest shareholder in Telstra is still the Australian governement.	Jul 09 12:29
oiaohm	cubexyz: I think MSN could in fact be better.	Jul 09 12:30
schestowitz	http://ostatic.com/blog/survey-amazon-is-tops-in-the-public-cloud-but-look-out-for-azure	Jul 09 12:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ostatic.com \| Survey: Amazon is Tops in the Public Cloud, But Look Out for Azure [ http://ur1.ca/n2td6 ]		Jul 09 12:35
schestowitz	Seems like BS to me	Jul 09 12:35
schestowitz	who's this Cowen thing?	Jul 09 12:35
schestowitz	Maybe Microsoft paid	Jul 09 12:35
*Cirrus_Minor has quit (Quit: ◀▬▬ •••They Must've taken my marbles away••◀▬▬)		Jul 09 12:35
schestowitz	oiaohm: I wrote about Aussie ISPs and Microsoft	Jul 09 12:35
schestowitz	Telstra has MS execs in it	Jul 09 12:35
schestowitz	Bigpond has other issues, less serious...	Jul 09 12:36
schestowitz	Some IRC trolls came here from Bigpond...	Jul 09 12:36
cubexyz	oiaohm, I'm looking at Dual WAN routers	Jul 09 12:36
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/619108389029826560	Jul 09 12:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz $250.000 is quite a lot for 6 appliances. Looking at the features it seems like we can do it for about a tenth of that ;-)		Jul 09 12:39
schestowitz	I don't like this company	Jul 09 12:39
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 6 affordable Android phones you'll actually	Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	enjoy using http://t.co/udc7Kwclof	Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	(www.computerworld.com)	Jul 09 12:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.computerworld.com \| 6 affordable Android phones you'll actually enjoy using \| Computerworld		Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tf6	Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro	Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	ProteanOS as fully free http://t.co/gI7Tll704z	Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	(www.fsf.org)	Jul 09 12:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.fsf.org \| FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro ProteanOS as fully free — Free Software Foundation — working together for free software		Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tf7	Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat enables container competition by	Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	setting standards http://t.co/XqeMseP6kI	Jul 09 12:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-siliconangle.com \| Red Hat enables container competition by setting standards \| #RHSummit \| SiliconANGLE		Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	(siliconangle.com)	Jul 09 12:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tf8	Jul 09 12:46
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/619109117748244480	Jul 09 12:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz Why? They try to simplify the deployment of #OpenStack infrastructures but at those prices I can get a team of specialists		Jul 09 12:46
schestowitz	I can't recall what it is they did which I didn't like	Jul 09 12:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat ‘plays well with others’	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Ce5CSoVv65 (siliconangle.com)	Jul 09 12:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-siliconangle.com \| Red Hat ‘plays well with others’ \| #RHSummit \| SiliconANGLE		Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tgw	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung launches SM-G9198 Android clamshell	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	phone in China http://t.co/Bf32xPfgFG	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	(androidcommunity.com)	Jul 09 12:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-androidcommunity.com \| Samsung launches SM-G9198 Android clamshell phone in China - Android Community		Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tgx	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	ProteanOS as fully free http://t.co/Bu7Z4Ktrhn	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 12:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro ProteanOS as fully free \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tgy	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat ‘plays well with others’	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sfjiVJSsDS (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 12:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tgz	Jul 09 12:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Red Hat ‘plays well with others’ \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 12:55
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung launches SM-G9198 Android clamshell	Jul 09 13:29
TweetTuxMachines	phone in China http://t.co/d9H98Ks71o	Jul 09 13:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Samsung launches SM-G9198 Android clamshell phone in China \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 13:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 13:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tv6	Jul 09 13:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines America's Army Considering SteamOS / Linux	Jul 09 13:29
TweetTuxMachines	Support http://t.co/Q2rY9b27YW	Jul 09 13:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com) recruitment propaganda for	Jul 09 13:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| America's Army Considering SteamOS / Linux Support - Phoronix		Jul 09 13:29
TweetTuxMachines	#freesw platform	Jul 09 13:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tv8	Jul 09 13:30
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Catalyst 15.7 Bring Multi-Device Support For	Jul 09 13:30
TweetTuxMachines	OpenCL 2.0, Carrizo Improvements	Jul 09 13:30
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/5oELGqc000 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 13:30
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tv9	Jul 09 13:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Catalyst 15.7 Bring Multi-Device Support For OpenCL 2.0, Carrizo Improvements - Phoronix		Jul 09 13:30
*Cirrus_Minor (~Cirrus_Mi@CAcert/Cirrus-Minor) has joined #techrights		Jul 09 13:31
schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6310647	Jul 09 13:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: "United Airlines had grounded all of its flights after an unspecified computer issue." http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-33450848 phobia, or bad IT (proprietary)		Jul 09 13:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.bbc.co.uk \| NYSE: How Twitter reacted to New York Stock Exchange 'glitch' - BBC News [ http://ur1.ca/n2u1a ]		Jul 09 13:37
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/jurasick/status/619122842584621057	Jul 09 13:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@jurasick: @schestowitz very true.		Jul 09 13:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro	Jul 09 13:47
TweetTuxMachines	retweeted by ProteanOS as fully free http://t.co/Bu7Z4Ktrhn	Jul 09 13:47
TweetTuxMachines	@speedytux (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 13:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2u83	Jul 09 13:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Kernel http://t.co/fdBgfUpfGW	Jul 09 13:47
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 13:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Kernel \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 13:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2u84	Jul 09 13:47
msb__	schestowitz: "<schestowitz> if the second ISP is wireless (long range) it would not be worth the cancer risk"	Jul 09 13:49
*Guest36678 (~ubuntu@ec2-52-28-85-74.eu-central-1.compute.amazonaws.com) has joined #techrights		Jul 09 13:49
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msb__	schestowitz: What if you used a parabolic dish antenna on the roof pointed at the distant source? Fed via a coaxial cable from your router, and with proper design there should be little radiation coming down locally.(minimal "sidelobes"). You could incorporate an amplifier for greater range.	Jul 09 13:52
oiaohm	msb__: there have been issues in Australia with dish design.	Jul 09 13:55
oiaohm	msb__: you know something wrong when it kills a tree.	Jul 09 13:56
msb__	oiaohm: Well, if it's pointed at a tree...	Jul 09 13:56
oiaohm	msb__: no the side lobes killed a tree	Jul 09 13:56
msb__	oiaohm: To begin with, the dish has to be about 10 wavelengths wide to get good focussing	Jul 09 13:57
msb__	Well , then it wasn't designed right. This stuff is not mystical.	Jul 09 13:57
oiaohm	Issue was some dishs has a horible resensence freq.	Jul 09 13:57
msb__	The sidelobes can be measured with a receiver and meter.	Jul 09 13:57
oiaohm	Nice Microwave side beem.	Jul 09 13:58
oiaohm	Tree killing and human killing.	Jul 09 13:58
oiaohm	msb__: I would not say no cancer risk.	Jul 09 13:58
oiaohm	msb__: I would say you do need what ever is deployed well and truly audited.	Jul 09 13:58
msb__	_Measure_ the sidelobe radiation.	Jul 09 13:59
oiaohm	msb__: the issue was the use of offcenter dishes for uplinks.	Jul 09 13:59
oiaohm	msb__: at least here.	Jul 09 13:59
msb__	The feeder horn has to be at the focus of the parabola.	Jul 09 13:59
oiaohm	Offcenter dishs are not perfect parabola that is where problems start.	Jul 09 14:00
msb__	This is 70 year old technology.	Jul 09 14:00
oiaohm	Even with 70 year old technology you can screw it up badly.	Jul 09 14:00
msb__	No doubt covered in an ARRL handbook.	Jul 09 14:00
oiaohm	Not exactly ARRL covers theorictally perfect.	Jul 09 14:01
msb__	Yes, of course. You have to do it right, and measure. The documentation is easy to find.	Jul 09 14:01
oiaohm	Add in a little material impurity and other things.	Jul 09 14:02
oiaohm	Basically a uplink dish is only safe after you have the meter reading confirming it.	Jul 09 14:02
msb__	Correct.	Jul 09 14:02
oiaohm	Correctly deployed and inspected uplink dish should be perfectly safe.	Jul 09 14:03
oiaohm	But of course carriers want to do cheaper than that.	Jul 09 14:03
msb__	This would be home-made, designed and measured.	Jul 09 14:03
msb__	Get a microwave radio expert to help.	Jul 09 14:04
cubexyz	hear about Microsoft donating a chunk of money to OpenBSD?	Jul 09 14:04
cubexyz	wonder what's up with that	Jul 09 14:05
msb__	Maybe they've found a way to poison money.	Jul 09 14:05
oiaohm	msb__: not that.	Jul 09 14:05
oiaohm	cubexyz: the reality is microsoft has only given the money to OpenBSD for work on OpenSSH	Jul 09 14:06
oiaohm	cubexyz: remember Microsoft has the azure cloud services. How are they going to manage all there Linux systems without nice and secure OpenSSH	Jul 09 14:06
cubexyz	ah, it was only $50K	Jul 09 14:07
oiaohm	Really the fact that Microsoft is the largest sponser is down right insulting.	Jul 09 14:07
cubexyz	it is	Jul 09 14:07
oiaohm	cubexyz: Microsoft makes way more than 50K from the Linux servers azure hosts.	Jul 09 14:08
oiaohm	The money being given to OpenSSH is truly peanuts.	Jul 09 14:08
cubexyz	chump change for Microsoft	Jul 09 14:08
cubexyz	yes	Jul 09 14:09
oiaohm	cubexyz: think of amazon, rackspace ...... the other cloud providers	Jul 09 14:09
msb__	Given all the attacks on free software by Microsoft over the years, there should be a clause in the GPL saying that the software can be used by anyone _except_ Microsoft.	Jul 09 14:09
oiaohm	Where is their cash/staff	Jul 09 14:09
cubexyz	msb__, there's the Motif license if you don't want your code on Microsoft Windows	Jul 09 14:10
oiaohm	msb__: of course not that would not be sporting.	Jul 09 14:10
cubexyz	Motif License states the program must be used on an open source operating system	Jul 09 14:10
cubexyz	simple	Jul 09 14:10
oiaohm	msb__: of course we want Microsoft to incorrectly use GPL stuff somewhere core than been forced to release the source code.	Jul 09 14:10
msb__	Very good!	Jul 09 14:10
cubexyz	another scenario... use the Motif License if you don't want your program ported to windows	Jul 09 14:11
msb__	No reason to be sporting with Microsoft; it is not sporting with us.	Jul 09 14:11
oiaohm	msb__: they are sporting.	Jul 09 14:12
cubexyz	oiaohm, I can think of other reasons to use the Motif license	Jul 09 14:12
cubexyz	someone ports your program to windows, and the linux version dies	Jul 09 14:12
oiaohm	Its the funny things like Microsoft iso create tool being fould using a GPL work.	Jul 09 14:12
cubexyz	it's happened before	Jul 09 14:12
oiaohm	So Microsorf had to release the code.	Jul 09 14:12
msb__	oiaohm: http://cosmicpenguin.com/linux/MICROSOFTS_WAR_AGAINST_LINUX.html	Jul 09 14:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-cosmicpenguin.com \| MICROSOFT'S WAR AGAINST LINUX		Jul 09 14:13
cubexyz	but Stallman doesn't like the Motif License of course	Jul 09 14:13
oiaohm	msb__: think about it for all Microsoft anti Linux they end up running Linux in their asure.	Jul 09 14:13
msb__	I wrote that before UEFI.	Jul 09 14:13
msb__	oiaohm: Yes, but they try to get the public not to use Linux.	Jul 09 14:14
cubexyz	I think Microsoft were using BSD for their mail servers at one point?	Jul 09 14:14
oiaohm	Its just funny to watch Microsoft contructions	Jul 09 14:14
cubexyz	I think Microsoft goes where the money goes	Jul 09 14:14
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619130226673631232	Jul 09 14:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz the trams run well after midnight especially at weekends. So yes they do work after midnight for clarification.		Jul 09 14:14
cubexyz	it's there prime directive	Jul 09 14:14
msb__	In order to stop evil it is at least necessary to recognize it and label it publicly as such.	Jul 09 14:14
schestowitz	Just briefly after midnight, 1am at the latest	Jul 09 14:15
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Sulman/status/619130235716521984	Jul 09 14:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Sulman: @schestowitz Proprietary DB's are also over-engineered behemoths with paid training in mind; Oracle I am looking at you.		Jul 09 14:15
msb__	With parabolic dishes radio amateurs have bounced microwave pulses from oven magnetrons off the Moon!	Jul 09 14:17
cubexyz	although I thought openbsd forked OpenSSL	Jul 09 14:18
cubexyz	LibreSSL	Jul 09 14:19
cubexyz	radeonfb (which seems to be unremoveable) automatically sets 1024x768-85	Jul 09 14:33
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines LinuxIT Acquired http://t.co/vWDQrHLLcS	Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2uko	Jul 09 14:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| LinuxIT Acquired \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 5 open source tools for taming text	Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/IT2v1T0aR2 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2uks	Jul 09 14:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 5 open source tools for taming text \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 9/7/2015: LinuxIT Sold, Alpine Linux	Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	3.2.1 Released http://t.co/Oq9dIB0GQx	Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	(techrights.org)	Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2uku	Jul 09 14:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 9/7/2015: LinuxIT Sold, Alpine Linux 3.2.1 Released \| Techrights		Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Gaming http://t.co/CGP3TvnvEU	Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 14:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Gaming \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ukv	Jul 09 14:40
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's leftovers http://t.co/58u9nqShW0	Jul 09 14:41
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 14:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 14:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ukx	Jul 09 14:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android Leftovers http://t.co/eUeU4fyPbj	Jul 09 14:41
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 14:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2uky	Jul 09 14:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Android Leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 14:41
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oiaohm	cubexyz: you cannot unload a driver once it stuck in use. Yes a horible fact about config_vt it a driver trap.	Jul 09 14:42
cubexyz	fbi is kind of neat, viewing pictures on the framebuffer	Jul 09 14:56
cubexyz	could come in handy	Jul 09 14:56
amarsh04	yes, fbi is good, no need to bring up X just to view pictures	Jul 09 14:57
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*amarsh04 (~amarsh04@ppp14-2-73-102.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net) has joined #techrights		Jul 09 15:00
oiaohm	http://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=OpenSSL-9-July-Flaw	Jul 09 15:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-phoronix.com \| OpenSSL's Latest High Severity Issue Exposed - Phoronix [ http://ur1.ca/n2uur ]		Jul 09 15:13
oiaohm	The list of implementation errors keep on showing up.	Jul 09 15:13
oiaohm	Darn I hate when my updates are 1.2G	Jul 09 15:31
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*Po2005 (601c144b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.96.28.20.75) has joined #techrights		Jul 09 15:33
cubexyz	I'm not sure I can stop using radeonfb even if load uvesafb	Jul 09 15:33
Po2005	does anyone know how to get to the #Archive channel?	Jul 09 15:35
oiaohm	Po2005: is your user registered.	Jul 09 15:36
Po2005	well i came from IRC chat. so i am new	Jul 09 15:37
oiaohm	Po2005: I guess you have tried to enter the archive channel.	Jul 09 15:38
oiaohm	Po2005: I know I can enter the channel without issue	Jul 09 15:40
oiaohm	Po2005: but my user is a registered user.	Jul 09 15:40
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MinceR	> Red Hat ‘plays well with others’	Jul 09 15:51
MinceR	no it doesn't	Jul 09 15:51
MinceR	trying to destroy GNU/Linux is not "playing well with others"	Jul 09 15:51
oiaohm	Really that is hash.	Jul 09 15:55
oiaohm	Redhat does not exactly have the objective to destroy GNU/Linux.	Jul 09 15:56
oiaohm	History with the gcc complier and other parts say that.	Jul 09 15:56
oiaohm	At time Redhat objectives and everyone elses does not align for a while.	Jul 09 15:56
oiaohm	MinceR: I guess you forger the egcc mess	Jul 09 15:57
oiaohm	forger/forget	Jul 09 15:57
oiaohm	Redhat not being in alignment is not exactly new.	Jul 09 15:58
MinceR	oiaohm: forcing other distros to become fedora clones or die while turning fedora into a windows clone is not destroying GNU/Linux?	Jul 09 15:58
oiaohm	MinceR: one thing known is if you find the problems redhat is attempting to address and provide a better solution Redhat will change to it.	Jul 09 15:58
oiaohm	MinceR: No they are not forcing that.	Jul 09 15:59
MinceR	seems pretty clear that red hat is trying hard to make everyone depend on code only red hat can maintain	Jul 09 15:59
MinceR	especially in the case of debian	Jul 09 15:59
oiaohm	You miss the egcc history don't you.	Jul 09 15:59
oiaohm	and eglibc	Jul 09 15:59
MinceR	and in the case of their attacks on distros like gentoo and devuan	Jul 09 15:59
oiaohm	Redhat making a varation from the core and having other distrobutions follow is not new.	Jul 09 16:00
MinceR	even abusing their influence on gnome to force other distros to follow?	Jul 09 16:00
oiaohm	Not new	Jul 09 16:00
oiaohm	at a time gnome would not build with standard glibc	Jul 09 16:00
MinceR	also, past wrongdoing does not absolve them now	Jul 09 16:01
MinceR	you can have multiple libc-s installed on the same system	Jul 09 16:01
MinceR	systemd specifically checks whether it got pid1 and complains if it did not.	Jul 09 16:01
oiaohm	Past wrong doing is wrong.	Jul 09 16:01
oiaohm	MinceR: sysvinit checks if it pid1 if it not takes over pid1	Jul 09 16:02
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oiaohm	systemd complaining is in fact being nice.	Jul 09 16:02
MinceR	sysvinit only attempts to do a tiny fraction of what systemd is attempting to do	Jul 09 16:02
MinceR	sysvinit does not come coupled to a logger daemon or dbus	Jul 09 16:03
oiaohm	What about upstart that fedora used before systemd.	Jul 09 16:03
cubexyz	oiaohm, there's tons of people who don't like systemd being shoved down their throats	Jul 09 16:03
cubexyz	it's not just a few	Jul 09 16:03
oiaohm	The reality is most people wanting sysvinit back were not in fact using sysvinit.	Jul 09 16:04
MinceR	even upstart isn't as evil as systemd	Jul 09 16:04
oiaohm	upstart is worse in one hand.	Jul 09 16:04
MinceR	upstart does not try to hijack your userland	Jul 09 16:04
oiaohm	because particular programs hate upstarts ptrace solution instead of using cgroups	Jul 09 16:04
MinceR	it's just a broken init system	Jul 09 16:04
oiaohm	upstart interfered with program debugging MinceR	Jul 09 16:04
MinceR	systemd interferes with logging, reaping zombies and fsck	Jul 09 16:05
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619134663043493888	Jul 09 16:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz for example last tram to Ashton from Picc is 00:52 on a Saturday. So I'd guess we'll after 2am before tram returns to depot.		Jul 09 16:05
oiaohm	upstart interferes in fact with logging and zombies	Jul 09 16:05
oiaohm	MinceR: so 1 the fsck issue.	Jul 09 16:06
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Stubee217/status/619142710541295616	Jul 09 16:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Stubee217: @schestowitz @showbizmcr so get your facts right before "trying" to be clever as you've just changed your whole argument		Jul 09 16:06
MinceR	upstart can be swapped out for a number of init systems	Jul 09 16:06
schestowitz	Most lines have last journey at around 11pm, ending around midnight	Jul 09 16:06
MinceR	systemd tries to hold on to everything with its filthy tentacles	Jul 09 16:06
oiaohm	MinceR: how many of those init systems techically work.	Jul 09 16:06
MinceR	most likely several	Jul 09 16:06
MinceR	as opposed to systemd, which doesn't	Jul 09 16:06
oiaohm	MinceR: I said techically works.	Jul 09 16:07
oiaohm	Ie proper tracking of processors.	Jul 09 16:07
oiaohm	processes	Jul 09 16:07
MinceR	yeah, let's move the goalposts	Jul 09 16:07
amarsh04	our last commuter trains are around midnight here	Jul 09 16:07
MinceR	who cares if systemd tries to continue booting while fsck works	Jul 09 16:07
oiaohm	MinceR: BSD init on bsd system and SMF on solaris has proper process tracking.	Jul 09 16:07
amarsh04	I like to see what fsck is doing	Jul 09 16:07
MinceR	or fails to start services	Jul 09 16:07
oiaohm	MinceR: or the AIX solution has proper process tracking.	Jul 09 16:08
MinceR	or prevents you from interacting with a process that needs input	Jul 09 16:08
amarsh04	and interrupt a forced fsck on the n-th reboot if need be	Jul 09 16:08
amarsh04	exactly	Jul 09 16:08
MinceR	or SIGKILLs your processes before they had a chance to save their stuff	Jul 09 16:08
MinceR	or, together with gnome, makes your screen impossible to unlock until you hibernate and resume, at which point it unlocks without needing a password	Jul 09 16:09
amarsh04	on one machine here (single core) the DHCP process on boot-up is shown, on the other (4-core) it is hidden	Jul 09 16:09
oiaohm	If you want all that you have 1 other choice other than systemd that works openrc	Jul 09 16:09
amarsh04	I like to see such thing on boot-up	Jul 09 16:09
MinceR	openrc is not coupled to everything in an attempt to hijack everything	Jul 09 16:09
MinceR	systemd is	Jul 09 16:09
amarsh04	(using Debian with sysvinit and only libsystemd0)	Jul 09 16:09
amarsh04	plus I find the lack of documentation on debugging udev bad	Jul 09 16:10
MinceR	systemd prevents your system from booting properly if some non-essential fs in fstab is missing	Jul 09 16:10
oiaohm	amarsh04: to be correct the documentation on udev has improved since systemd started.	Jul 09 16:10
cubexyz	it's odd that I never heard about all these sysvinit problems in the Xenix era	Jul 09 16:10
MinceR	yeah	Jul 09 16:10
MinceR	it's almost as if they were made up to support a certain political agenda	Jul 09 16:10
oiaohm	cubexyz: Xenix you cannot break a process way from it starting PID tree.	Jul 09 16:11
oiaohm	Linux is not exactly Unix.	Jul 09 16:11
oiaohm	The minor differences means it cannot work with a Unix style init system correctly.	Jul 09 16:11
amarsh04	good oiaohm, but I was never able to do more than pinpoint which udev version stopped recognising my old Nokia handset in mass storage mode, fortunately it started working again in a later version of udev	Jul 09 16:12
MinceR	red hat "playing nice with others" >> http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2015-June/033170.html	Jul 09 16:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lists.freedesktop.org \| [systemd-devel] [ANNOUNCE] systemd v221 [ http://ur1.ca/n2vc4 ]		Jul 09 16:12
MinceR	see also >> http://lkml.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/1506.2/03764.html	Jul 09 16:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lkml.iu.edu \| Linux-Kernel Archive: careful review of kdbus [ http://ur1.ca/n2vc5 ]		Jul 09 16:12
MinceR	red hat is nothing more than yet another microsoft, playing from the microsoft book of tricks	Jul 09 16:13
MinceR	if gnu/linux users want gnu/linux to survive, they should stop being red hat's clients in any way	Jul 09 16:13
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619162066335715329	Jul 09 16:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz are you are referring to Metrolink in Manchester?		Jul 09 16:14
cubexyz	it will survive	Jul 09 16:14
schestowitz	Yes, lines I take sometimes stop at around 11 (outwards), with journey ending around midnight	Jul 09 16:14
cubexyz	IBM uses Linux, the stock exchanges use Linux	Jul 09 16:14
cubexyz	the US military uses Linux	Jul 09 16:14
MinceR	with some help from crApple, they've even taken aim at other free unixes	Jul 09 16:15
cubexyz	MinceR, I'd run one openbsd box to be safe though	Jul 09 16:15
oiaohm	MinceR: so what did you not notice that even when kdbus was built into systemd by default it was not made fail because it was not there.	Jul 09 16:15
MinceR	oiaohm: doesn't matter, they're still abusing their leverage to pressure linus to make a technical decision he knows to be wrong	Jul 09 16:16
oiaohm	No they are not abusing there leverage at all.	Jul 09 16:17
oiaohm	the rewriting of the dbus library by the systemd group was in fact requested by linus to make a proper assessment.	Jul 09 16:17
amarsh04	a few days of git-bisects and reports lead to a one line of code fix that could cause a kernel lock-up: http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.linux.kernel/1992111	Jul 09 16:18
oiaohm	Linus did in fact request that distrobutions review it.	Jul 09 16:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-permalink.gmane.org \| [PULL] module fix [ http://ur1.ca/n2vdu ]		Jul 09 16:18
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619163236894687232	Jul 09 16:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz so Rochdale (line) then I'm guessing?		Jul 09 16:18
MinceR	dbus should be replaced by an IPC mechanism that wasn't designed by windows kiddies	Jul 09 16:18
MinceR	on the assumption that you'll just reboot if something is wrong	Jul 09 16:18
schestowitz	Ashton and Rochdale	Jul 09 16:18
amarsh04	that could fix a problem that could cause a kernel lock-up rather (-:	Jul 09 16:19
oiaohm	MinceR: too late dbus is already mass deployed.	Jul 09 16:19
cubexyz	rebooting is fine on test systems	Jul 09 16:19
cubexyz	not on your main systems	Jul 09 16:19
MinceR	oiaohm: that's like saying "too late, windows is already mass deployed"	Jul 09 16:19
MinceR	oiaohm: if people could move from windows to gnu/linux, they can also move from lendows to gnu/linux	Jul 09 16:20
oiaohm	MinceR: why did dbus appear in the first place. Existing Unix IPC could not do the job properly.	Jul 09 16:21
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619164300209455104	Jul 09 16:21
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz the farthest part of the system so trams will finish earlier. But to comment the system ends universally at that time is false.		Jul 09 16:21
MinceR	because apparently dcop wasn't sufficiently overcomplicated	Jul 09 16:21
MinceR	and wasn't used in places that don't need it yet	Jul 09 16:22
oiaohm	MinceR: dbus is a simpler protocal than dcop	Jul 09 16:22
MinceR	yeah, specifying an FQDN 3 times in 2 different formats is "simple"	Jul 09 16:22
MinceR	they should have thrown in a UUID or 6 for good measure	Jul 09 16:23
oiaohm	MinceR: that is fact simple. Across dcop it was 14 different formats.	Jul 09 16:23
MinceR	somehow i could use dcop with 0 FQDN-s	Jul 09 16:23
MinceR	somehow it worked	Jul 09 16:23
oiaohm	MinceR: what happen with dcop is it was extended and extended and people lost track of what it was doing.	Jul 09 16:23
MinceR	somehow the tool i used to introspect the interfaces worked reliably, as opposed to crashing all the time	Jul 09 16:23
MinceR	somehow the "init system" didn't depend on dcop	Jul 09 16:24
cubexyz	the dbus-daemon is pretty old isn't it?	Jul 09 16:24
oiaohm	MinceR: I guess you never worked with old qt applications using dcop for stupid things.	Jul 09 16:25
MinceR	i guess so	Jul 09 16:25
MinceR	using dbus for stupid things is more popular now	Jul 09 16:25
MinceR	like broadcasting >512kB messages	Jul 09 16:25
oiaohm	kdbus does not implement exactly the same a the dbus-deamon.	Jul 09 16:25
MinceR	yeah, they'll probably make them incompatible	Jul 09 16:26
oiaohm	In fact it implements a lot differently.	Jul 09 16:26
MinceR	to remove the option of using userspace dbus	Jul 09 16:26
MinceR	and force you to use systemd	Jul 09 16:26
MinceR	next stop: ksystemd	Jul 09 16:26
oiaohm	No you can keep compadiblity with dbus-deamon operations without coping some of the stupidty.	Jul 09 16:26
MinceR	or i can just link all that crap with https://github.com/clbr/nobus	Jul 09 16:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-github.com \| clbr/nobus · GitHub		Jul 09 16:26
oiaohm	The kernel can que up messages from different processes effectively.	Jul 09 16:27
MinceR	userspace can function effectively, if it wasn't implemented in such a shoddy way as dbus is	Jul 09 16:27
MinceR	but "throw it into the kernel" is apparently easier	Jul 09 16:27
MinceR	plus their beloved microsoft did it all the time	Jul 09 16:27
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's howtos http://t.co/WSBNQFK74d	Jul 09 16:27
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 16:27
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vgh	Jul 09 16:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's howtos \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 16:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Software http://t.co/k5RtwQOfd7	Jul 09 16:28
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 16:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Software \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 16:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vgj	Jul 09 16:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines AMD Catalyst 15.7 Stable Linux Driver Released	Jul 09 16:28
TweetTuxMachines	After a Long Absence http://t.co/tSjP2v0ZIC	Jul 09 16:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| AMD Catalyst 15.7 Stable Linux Driver Released After a Long Absence - Softpedia		Jul 09 16:28
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 16:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vgl	Jul 09 16:28
MinceR	i await the OS designed by these ricers that runs everything in ring 0	Jul 09 16:28
oiaohm	MinceR: yes and no there are somethings kdbus can do that userspace code never can.	Jul 09 16:28
MinceR	just because you can doesn't mean you should	Jul 09 16:28
oiaohm	MinceR: like crossing cgroup boundaries without a stack of issues.	Jul 09 16:29
MinceR	just because you can shovel all the garbage you find into the kernel and bloat it beyond all hope of repair doesn't mean you should.	Jul 09 16:29
MinceR	strange, other virtualization solutions somehow managed to communicate with their VMs without needing kernel-mode code	Jul 09 16:29
MinceR	only cgroups are so broken.	Jul 09 16:29
oiaohm	None of the existing Linux IPC are design to cross cgroup boundaries maintin correct secuirty.	Jul 09 16:29
oiaohm	MinceR: really wrong.	Jul 09 16:30
MinceR	good thing they can just throw in a few dozen extra design flaws to work around one design flaw	Jul 09 16:30
cubexyz	when did the dbus stuff appear?	Jul 09 16:30
oiaohm	hyper-v and vmware solution include drivers to extract information.	Jul 09 16:30
oiaohm	So other VM not needing kernel mode code you are so wrong it not funny MinceR	Jul 09 16:31
cubexyz	it's in openbsd also	Jul 09 16:31
cubexyz	so dbus-daemon is trans-linux	Jul 09 16:31
oiaohm	dbus comes from freedesktop	Jul 09 16:31
oiaohm	To make gnome and kde play better with each other	Jul 09 16:32
cubexyz	did Linux version 1.0 have it?	Jul 09 16:32
oiaohm	instead of implementing completley different userspace IPC	Jul 09 16:32
MinceR	mission accomplished	Jul 09 16:32
MinceR	gnome is already dependent on cancerd	Jul 09 16:32
MinceR	kde will become dependent on cancerd in august	Jul 09 16:32
cubexyz	gnome doesn't have to have systemd though	Jul 09 16:33
MinceR	well, funtoo seems to have patched to fix it	Jul 09 16:33
cubexyz	at least not older gnome	Jul 09 16:33
MinceR	i guess it's only a matter of time before they get a message like http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2014-May/019657.html	Jul 09 16:33
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lists.freedesktop.org \| [systemd-devel] [PATCH] Drop the udev firmware loader [ http://ur1.ca/ir0kd ]		Jul 09 16:33
MinceR	and red hat tries to break their fix	Jul 09 16:33
oiaohm	MinceR: please don't be making the mistake that logind means dependancy on systemd.	Jul 09 16:34
cubexyz	and there's that suffix -1 on dbus-daemon	Jul 09 16:34
MinceR	yeah, it's not like systemd-logind is a part of systemd	Jul 09 16:34
oiaohm	BSD systems have implemented their own logind.	Jul 09 16:34
MinceR	oh wait, it is	Jul 09 16:34
MinceR	yeah, bsd is also being turned into lendows	Jul 09 16:34
cubexyz	it looks like 2002 had version 0.13	Jul 09 16:34
MinceR	there's nothing good about that	Jul 09 16:34
oiaohm	MinceR: on Linux logind is part of systemd or consolekit2	Jul 09 16:34
MinceR	red hat won't rest until they've destroyed all unix	Jul 09 16:34
cubexyz	as I mentioned dbus-daemon has been around for a long time	Jul 09 16:34
oiaohm	MinceR: note what I just said.	Jul 09 16:34
MinceR	and then microsoft pulls the plug on their uefi Restricted Boot certificate	Jul 09 16:34
MinceR	and boom, red crap dies too	Jul 09 16:35
oiaohm	To have logind on Linux you dont' have to run systemd at all. MinceR	Jul 09 16:35
MinceR	and everybody will be _extremely_ surprised	Jul 09 16:35
oiaohm	MinceR: do you know what logind is design to get rid of.	Jul 09 16:35
cubexyz	then DOJ puts the beatdown on Microsoft (again)	Jul 09 16:35
MinceR	sanity?	Jul 09 16:35
oiaohm	MinceR: Nop	Jul 09 16:35
MinceR	cubexyz: except they never really punished m$	Jul 09 16:35
oiaohm	MinceR: do you call it sane that gnome and KDE run independant session management that can crash into each other locking up the users interface.	Jul 09 16:36
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/mangel_joe/status/619167609783746565	Jul 09 16:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mangel_joe: @showbizmcr @schestowitz Just look at Mkt St times. They have to get all way out and back from those destinations. http://t.co/6f0HGilc9P		Jul 09 16:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mangel_joe: @showbizmcr @schestowitz Just look at Mkt St times. They have to get all way out and back from those destinations. http://t.co/6f0HGilc9P		Jul 09 16:36
schestowitz	Midnight standard for standard days	Jul 09 16:36
MinceR	afaict that "session management" isn't used for much anyway	Jul 09 16:36
oiaohm	MinceR: what logind is 1 session management no matter the GUI loaded.	Jul 09 16:36
MinceR	usually they just start a bunch of clients	Jul 09 16:36
MinceR	which a simple shell script could do	Jul 09 16:36
oiaohm	MinceR: kde and gnome interaces don't run without the session management.	Jul 09 16:36
MinceR	that is, if poettering hadn't declared shell scripting heresy	Jul 09 16:37
MinceR	oiaohm: i'm doing fine without their interfaces	Jul 09 16:37
oiaohm	MinceR: same with xfce had it own session management.	Jul 09 16:37
oiaohm	MinceR: every single x11 class desktop wm has a session manager.	Jul 09 16:37
MinceR	oiaohm: do you know why shell scripting is heresy?	Jul 09 16:37
MinceR	because a sysadmin could look under the hood and change how they work	Jul 09 16:37
MinceR	and thus they wouldn't be entirely dependant on paying red crap to do their changes for them	Jul 09 16:38
MinceR	(if they feel like doing so)	Jul 09 16:38
oiaohm	MinceR: every single session management in a GUI is not shell script.	Jul 09 16:38
oiaohm	Do you know 3 ways to kill a sysvinit system that a user would not always expect.	Jul 09 16:39
MinceR	yeah, ~/.xsession doesn't exist	Jul 09 16:39
MinceR	i can see a way of killing it that's underway	Jul 09 16:39
oiaohm	MinceR: 1 is change insalled shells	Jul 09 16:39
oiaohm	MinceR: why the /bin/sh changes.	Jul 09 16:39
MinceR	change all applications and DEs so they depend on something that _must_ run as pid1 and isn't init	Jul 09 16:40
MinceR	stuff the kernel with crap that makes it bloated, unstable and insecure	Jul 09 16:40
oiaohm	KDE has only agreed to support logind as a dependancy because it cross platform.	Jul 09 16:40
oiaohm	So allowing cross platform sane service management.	Jul 09 16:40
MinceR	maybe red crap claims it's crossplatform for now	Jul 09 16:40
MinceR	you can bet this will change after kde made their move	Jul 09 16:41
oiaohm	No	Jul 09 16:41
oiaohm	Note there are 2 implementations under Linux	Jul 09 16:41
MinceR	this would not be the first promise they went back on, to lock people into cancerd	Jul 09 16:41
oiaohm	BSD has their own.	Jul 09 16:41
MinceR	http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.hotplug.devel/17392	Jul 09 16:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-article.gmane.org \| Gmane -- The future of the udev source tree [ http://ur1.ca/jn1n9 ]		Jul 09 16:41
MinceR	http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2014-May/019657.html	Jul 09 16:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lists.freedesktop.org \| [systemd-devel] [PATCH] Drop the udev firmware loader [ http://ur1.ca/ir0kd ]		Jul 09 16:41
MinceR	if systemd is so great, why does redcrap need to shove it down people's throats?	Jul 09 16:41
oiaohm	To be correct 3 if you count openrc implementation.	Jul 09 16:41
MinceR	why all the coercion?	Jul 09 16:41
oiaohm	MinceR: some things about systemd are fine to complain about.	Jul 09 16:42
oiaohm	Items like logind not exactly so.	Jul 09 16:42
MinceR	ooh, i'm allowed to complain about some things	Jul 09 16:42
MinceR	that makes me so content	Jul 09 16:42
oiaohm	MinceR: I do have issues with systemd	Jul 09 16:42
MinceR	guess what, other people have more issues with it	Jul 09 16:43
oiaohm	MinceR: just some of the thing you are going on with are in fact not exactly issues. Logind change has to happen. Because before logind it has been insane. With xfce applications starting a xfce session management inside gnome at times	Jul 09 16:43
oiaohm	MinceR: remember the solutions before systemd were not issueless.	Jul 09 16:44
MinceR	at least they were not bloated	Jul 09 16:44
oiaohm	Some of systemd changes have tried out have been replicated by openbsd and the like because they are truly good ideas.	Jul 09 16:44
MinceR	and they were free software	Jul 09 16:44
MinceR	in practice as well as theory	Jul 09 16:44
oiaohm	MinceR: bloated is having more than 1 session manager running.	Jul 09 16:45
MinceR	and they were pretty reliable and secure	Jul 09 16:45
MinceR	oiaohm: actually, even 1 session manager is unnecessary	Jul 09 16:45
oiaohm	MinceR: its eating up good memory without any good reason.	Jul 09 16:45
oiaohm	MinceR: if you kill X11 yes.	Jul 09 16:45
MinceR	guess what else is gobbling memory without any good reason	Jul 09 16:45
MinceR	no, even if i run X11	Jul 09 16:45
MinceR	guess what else is gobbling memory without any good reason >> systemd!	Jul 09 16:45
oiaohm	No X11 design for wm demards you have 1	Jul 09 16:45
MinceR	fvwm ran just fine without xsm or any other session manager	Jul 09 16:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Papyros Linux Distro Uses a New Material Design	Jul 09 16:46
TweetTuxMachines	Shell http://t.co/DWHvQvoEIw	Jul 09 16:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Papyros Linux Distro Uses a New Material Design Shell - Softpedia		Jul 09 16:46
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 16:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vp6	Jul 09 16:46
oiaohm	Its session manager was built into the fvwm binary.	Jul 09 16:46
MinceR	it's funny how many things systemd apologists allege are impossible that i have done often myself	Jul 09 16:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Endless: A computer the rest of the world can	Jul 09 16:46
MinceR	uh huh	Jul 09 16:46
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-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.networkworld.com \| Endless: A complete Linux computer the rest of the world can afford		Jul 09 16:46
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TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vp7	Jul 09 16:46
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TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4YTcoq8Hhk (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 16:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vp8	Jul 09 16:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| French robot company raising money for open source companion robot “BUDDY” \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 16:46
MinceR	and if i have X start xterm first, we start claiming "a session manager was built into xterm"?	Jul 09 16:46
oiaohm	MinceR: X11 for a wm manager to register you must have a session manager.	Jul 09 16:46
oiaohm	MinceR: xterm without a session manager does not have windows.	Jul 09 16:47
MinceR	actually it does	Jul 09 16:47
*carlos_ has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)		Jul 09 16:47
MinceR	it's pretty much all it has	Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The Next Big Thing in Open-Source May Be	Jul 09 16:47
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TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vpd	Jul 09 16:47
oiaohm	MinceR: not x11 windows.	Jul 09 16:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| The Next Big Thing in Open-Source May Be Housing \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines More Meizu MX4 Ubuntu Edition Purchase Invites	Jul 09 16:47
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-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| More Meizu MX4 Ubuntu Edition Purchase Invites Are Now Available \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vpf	Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Canonical Is Back To Doing Feature Development	Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	For Launchpad http://t.co/qr7P5imI0A	Jul 09 16:47
oiaohm	MinceR: ie no proper boarder.	Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vpi	Jul 09 16:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Canonical Is Back To Doing Feature Development For Launchpad \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 5 open source alternatives to Google Docs	Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/zXm455boDj (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 16:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vpj	Jul 09 16:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 5 open source alternatives to Google Docs \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 16:47
MinceR	borders are not what make an x11 window	Jul 09 16:47
MinceR	you should know this if you know x11.	Jul 09 16:47
oiaohm	session manager defines where keyboard input and mouse actions are going.	Jul 09 16:48
MinceR	yet i could somehow type into the xterm that was the only client that was running	Jul 09 16:48
oiaohm	MinceR: that was depend on the X11 default wm	Jul 09 16:48
MinceR	there's no "default wm"	Jul 09 16:48
oiaohm	Once you load your own hello.	Jul 09 16:48
oiaohm	MinceR: there is a default.	Jul 09 16:49
oiaohm	MinceR: X11 server has a noop wm	Jul 09 16:49
oiaohm	MinceR: basically its not a straight forwards as most of use would hope.	Jul 09 16:50
oiaohm	X11 design big mess.	Jul 09 16:51
oiaohm	Stuff to make X11 work equally big mess.	Jul 09 16:51
MinceR	that doesn't stop some people from building a far bigger mess on top of and around it	Jul 09 16:51
MinceR	i wonder when will red hat push mutter into the kernel	Jul 09 16:51
MinceR	after all, windows nt has the windowing system, the window manager and half of the gui toolkit in the kernel	Jul 09 16:52
MinceR	so lendows must do the same	Jul 09 16:52
oiaohm	Not happening.	Jul 09 16:52
oiaohm	Redhat in fact removed the in Linux kernel fb windows manager.	Jul 09 16:52
MinceR	yeah, just like kdbus isn't happening	Jul 09 16:52
oiaohm	Yes gui in kernel was a real thing for early Linux MinceR	Jul 09 16:52
MinceR	they'll have a far bigger one	Jul 09 16:53
MinceR	and shinier	Jul 09 16:53
MinceR	and most important of all, newer!	Jul 09 16:53
oiaohm	MinceR: the idea of WM in kernel space is not going to happen at least not by redhat.	Jul 09 16:53
MinceR	and since it runs in kernel mode, it will be soooooooooo faaaaaaaaaaaaast	Jul 09 16:54
MinceR	just like windows nt	Jul 09 16:54
oiaohm	Not at all.	Jul 09 16:54
oiaohm	Have you not look at KMS and DRI	Jul 09 16:54
MinceR	(which was easily beaten by usermode X, user mode switching and the slowest X11 wm i've ever seen, sawfish)	Jul 09 16:54
oiaohm	Its in fact slower to move a WM into Linux space kernel space.	Jul 09 16:54
MinceR	when did that ever stop anybody?	Jul 09 16:55
MinceR	just because something is a bad idea doesn't mean people won't try it	Jul 09 16:55
oiaohm	MinceR: have you forgot inside the Linux kernel space there is no floating point operations or at least if you want it to perform.	Jul 09 16:55
MinceR	especially the likes of poettering and sievers	Jul 09 16:55
oiaohm	WM for window scaling has to perform floating point at times.	Jul 09 16:55
MinceR	they could put that part into systemd	Jul 09 16:56
oiaohm	MinceR: systemd in userspace maybe.	Jul 09 16:56
MinceR	which is already their landfill for "stuff we don't want to force into the kernel just yet"	Jul 09 16:56
oiaohm	MinceR: but the claim of kernelspace it not happening ever.	Jul 09 16:56
MinceR	sure	Jul 09 16:56
MinceR	would you have guessed 10 years ago that red hat will try to turn gnu/linux into windows?	Jul 09 16:56
oiaohm	Redhat is not going to hurt super computer performance.	Jul 09 16:56
MinceR	yes they are	Jul 09 16:57
oiaohm	MinceR: no they are not.	Jul 09 16:57
oiaohm	kdbus is a loadable module not a embedded one(guess why.	Jul 09 16:57
MinceR	if they didn't want to hurt performance, they wouldn't be forcing garbage like systemd and kdbus	Jul 09 16:57
oiaohm	You just missed something.	Jul 09 16:57
MinceR	i'm sure they'll spread some dependencies on kdbus if they manage to have it merged	Jul 09 16:58
oiaohm	kdbus will always be unloadable.	Jul 09 16:58
MinceR	just like they did with systemd	Jul 09 16:58
MinceR	yeah, and you can set init= to something other than systemd	Jul 09 16:58
MinceR	won't stop redhat from trying to break everything in your system if you do so	Jul 09 16:58
MinceR	(or debian)	Jul 09 16:58
MinceR	iirc they've already managed to break init=/bin/sh	Jul 09 16:58
oiaohm	MinceR: when did you notice that broken.	Jul 09 16:59
oiaohm	I hope you say 2002	Jul 09 16:59
MinceR	it wasn't broken for me since i haven't used cancerd much	Jul 09 17:00
MinceR	and even then only unwittingly	Jul 09 17:00
oiaohm	2002 is pre systemd	Jul 09 17:00
MinceR	apparently i keep doing the impossible	Jul 09 17:01
oiaohm	I was running segmented partitions back in 2002	Jul 09 17:01
MinceR	it's either that or systemd fans are severely delusional.	Jul 09 17:01
oiaohm	There is a issue with initrd and not mounting all required filesystems so /bin being in a different partition guess what happened.	Jul 09 17:01
MinceR	the most separation i ever did was separate /, /boot and /home	Jul 09 17:02
MinceR	(and i regret even that)	Jul 09 17:02
oiaohm	systemd addes the option to fstab to tell extra partitions to be added to the initrd.	Jul 09 17:03
cubexyz	my openbsd box has separate /, /home, /tmp, /usr, /usr/X11R6, /usr/local, /usr/obj, /usr/src, and /var	Jul 09 17:03
oiaohm	cubexyz: but openbsd initrd equal works correctly	Jul 09 17:04
MinceR	maybe red hat will "fix" that too	Jul 09 17:04
oiaohm	There have been a list of issues that would raise there head on Linux MinceR if you started configuing Linux partitions like BSD.	Jul 09 17:04
oiaohm	The reality here is redhat is attempting to fix real faults.	Jul 09 17:05
oiaohm	But they are creating like 20 more at times.	Jul 09 17:05
MinceR	real "faults" like red hat not controlling 100% of the gnu/linux market	Jul 09 17:05
oiaohm	Like early on in systemd where the lead developer goes you will not partition at all.	Jul 09 17:05
oiaohm	OS will all be in 1 partition.	Jul 09 17:06
oiaohm	Current systemd in fact supports split.	Jul 09 17:06
MinceR	didn't they make a mess of /usr recently?	Jul 09 17:06
oiaohm	MinceR: until recently /usr booting was not offically supported.	Jul 09 17:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Launchpad Development Starts Again	Jul 09 17:06
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/p9RvWI4VbT (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 17:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Launchpad Development Starts Again - Softpedia		Jul 09 17:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vux	Jul 09 17:06
oiaohm	and when they made it offically supported they broke the hacks MinceR	Jul 09 17:07
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines ChaletOS 14.04.2 review - Digital white	Jul 09 17:07
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-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.dedoimedo.com \| ChaletOS 14.04.2 review - Digital white chocolate		Jul 09 17:07
TweetTuxMachines	(www.dedoimedo.com)	Jul 09 17:07
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vuz	Jul 09 17:07
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TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Ebe03Jfumv (www.dedoimedo.com)	Jul 09 17:07
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.dedoimedo.com \| SuperX 3.0 Grace review - Saving, ahem, grace		Jul 09 17:07
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vv0	Jul 09 17:07
oiaohm	MinceR: yes people hacking aroudn systemd limitations have been bitten when the limitation has been fixed.	Jul 09 17:07
MinceR	good thing all of this will finally be fixed once redhat moves the entire root filesystem into initrd	Jul 09 17:07
MinceR	(readonly, of course)	Jul 09 17:07
MinceR	(and signed, so that UEFI, TPM and other treacherous tech can ensure you don't get to control anything)	Jul 09 17:08
oiaohm	MinceR: one of the changes of systemd design is that core file systems should be mounted read only by the initrd	Jul 09 17:08
oiaohm	And if there is a issue stop in the initrd with no file system going rw.	Jul 09 17:09
MinceR	maybe that's why it does shit like this >> https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/316	Jul 09 17:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-github.com \| After resuming from standby, systemd is stuck trying to unmount a disk · Issue #316 · systemd/systemd · GitHub [ http://ur1.ca/n2vvm ]		Jul 09 17:09
oiaohm	Theory to reduce data los	Jul 09 17:09
cubexyz	oops, another systemd prob :)	Jul 09 17:09
MinceR	also, http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2015-May/031658.html	Jul 09 17:10
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lists.freedesktop.org \| [systemd-devel] dev-root.device is not active,results in an umount spree [ http://ur1.ca/myk9k ]		Jul 09 17:10
MinceR	one would think that bugs like these 4 years after fedora started forcing systemd on their users is a pretty good sign of systemd going nowhere	Jul 09 17:10
oiaohm	MinceR: yep some of those issues are miss configuration. But the systemd guys have not closed a lot of those bugs as wont fix as they could have	Jul 09 17:11
MinceR	the misconfiguration being allowing cancerd to run	Jul 09 17:11
MinceR	ooh, they haven't closed everything as WONTFIX, only most things	Jul 09 17:11
MinceR	they must be saints.	Jul 09 17:11
oiaohm	MinceR: that is wrong too.	Jul 09 17:11
oiaohm	Very few systemd bug as closed with WONTFIX	Jul 09 17:11
oiaohm	MinceR: the #316 bug you brought in was in fact fixed in newer versions of systemd	Jul 09 17:13
MinceR	who knows, maybe in 3015, systemd will finally be stable enough for production use	Jul 09 17:14
oiaohm	MinceR: the reality that they are fixing a lot of these issues. Even issues they could tag WONTFIX because it against documetnation how systems should be configured.	Jul 09 17:16
oiaohm	MinceR: but its time	Jul 09 17:16
oiaohm	Really I think systemd developers need to stop adding features for a while and just focus on the bug backlog.	Jul 09 17:16
MinceR	i think they just need to find a career they can excel in	Jul 09 17:17
MinceR	software engineering was clearly not meant for them	Jul 09 17:17
MinceR	and neither was QA	Jul 09 17:17
oiaohm	QA I would agree the need a good person on that to take project lead.	Jul 09 17:18
oiaohm	MinceR: remember not everyone doing software engineering should be a release manager or a QA officer.	Jul 09 17:20
MinceR	they should have some idea of good practices, cohesion and coupling, though	Jul 09 17:20
MinceR	also, coding standards and code documentation.	Jul 09 17:20
oiaohm	MinceR: I see systemd as a project with too many indians trying to be chiefs.	Jul 09 17:20
MinceR	i see it as a project of windows fanboys trying to mold gnu/linux into windows.	Jul 09 17:21
MinceR	with a bit of macos, but that's no great difference.	Jul 09 17:21
oiaohm	Really I would not say windows fanboys	Jul 09 17:21
oiaohm	a Lot of what they are doing is impossible for windows.	Jul 09 17:21
oiaohm	the idea of per application /tmp directory and the like this is not windows.	Jul 09 17:22
MinceR	windows seems to be the most notable os with this extreme obsession with bloat, inflexibility, opaqueness, extreme coupling and total lack of cohesion	Jul 09 17:22
oiaohm	MinceR: if they are fanboys of anything is solaris SMF	Jul 09 17:22
MinceR	nope	Jul 09 17:22
MinceR	SMF doesn't run as pid1	Jul 09 17:22
cubexyz	opaqueness certainly	Jul 09 17:22
MinceR	SMF doesn't try to take over the entire userland, afaik it has a clearly defined scope	Jul 09 17:23
oiaohm	MinceR: SMF can run as pid1 if choosen to.	Jul 09 17:23
MinceR	systemd has practically no scope	Jul 09 17:23
oiaohm	MinceR: systemd does not have to run as PID1	Jul 09 17:23
MinceR	oiaohm: see, there's an element of choice. that's completely unheard of in systemd world.	Jul 09 17:23
MinceR	yeah, it can complain and quit	Jul 09 17:23
*nj3ma\|mobile (~Moshe@197.178.32.152) has joined #techrights		Jul 09 17:23
MinceR	which is arguably more useful than what it would otherwise do	Jul 09 17:23
oiaohm	MinceR: note what I said about too many indians attempting to be chief.	Jul 09 17:23
oiaohm	MinceR: systemd no one sat down and defined a scope.	Jul 09 17:23
MinceR	note that i don't want any indian to be my chief.	Jul 09 17:23
oiaohm	So you have a feature creap from hell.	Jul 09 17:24
MinceR	also note that free software is not about making someone your master.	Jul 09 17:24
MinceR	(which is just another way in which you can see that systemd is nonfree)	Jul 09 17:24
oiaohm	MinceR: every project need some form of master.	Jul 09 17:24
MinceR	i'm not a project	Jul 09 17:24
oiaohm	Ether a board or a person.	Jul 09 17:24
oiaohm	MinceR: to make systemd or sysvinit or kernel....	Jul 09 17:24
oiaohm	If that board or person does not manage it correctly expect hell.	Jul 09 17:25
MinceR	no, if that board or person has such leverage as redcrap does, then expect hell	Jul 09 17:25
MinceR	if they don't, expect people to just avoid and ignore that project	Jul 09 17:25
oiaohm	Not exactly true remember 1996 to 1998 we put pu with broken glibc	Jul 09 17:26
oiaohm	because the guy at the top at that at the time had no idea how to do QA	Jul 09 17:26
MinceR	we have other libc-s	Jul 09 17:26
MinceR	and we can even use them at the same time on the same system	Jul 09 17:27
oiaohm	MinceR: now we do	Jul 09 17:27
oiaohm	But back then there was not as much choice.	Jul 09 17:27
MinceR	i'm pretty sure by the time there was a glibc there were others too	Jul 09 17:27
MinceR	redhat's game is about taking all choice away	Jul 09 17:27
oiaohm	the branching of the glibc for Linux starts with redhat makign there own branch away from GNU.	Jul 09 17:27
oiaohm	After redhat puts up with the abuse from GNU for forking a project then the others like dietlibc and the like appear.	Jul 09 17:28
oiaohm	So at times redhat stuborn streak as been good.	Jul 09 17:29
MinceR	there are plenty of libc-s that are not glibc forks, afaik	Jul 09 17:29
oiaohm	At other times redhat stuborn streak brings misseries.	Jul 09 17:29
MinceR	whatever the bsd-s use, musl and bionic come to mind	Jul 09 17:29
oiaohm	musl is newer than the redhat fork.	Jul 09 17:29
oiaohm	The bsd one did not run on Linux kernels.	Jul 09 17:30
oiaohm	So big hissy fit about redhat historically in the end makes competitors that work appear.	Jul 09 17:30
oiaohm	So I am not exactly sure if Long term systemd will be looked back as a bad thing to have happened.	Jul 09 17:31
cubexyz	ok, I found a pre-dbus Linux	Jul 09 17:31
oiaohm	Ok we might be looking back using something completely different from a team than can properly do QA.	Jul 09 17:31
cubexyz	basic linux which is based on old slackware	Jul 09 17:31
oiaohm	cubexyz: dbus is not in KDE3 because KDE 3 was still using dcop	Jul 09 17:32
oiaohm	cubexyz: dbus is not exactly that old.	Jul 09 17:32
cubexyz	dbus-daemon is on my fc1 system	Jul 09 17:32
MinceR	part of why kde3 was reliable	Jul 09 17:32
cubexyz	it seems around 2002 era	Jul 09 17:32
cubexyz	that's what the copyright says	Jul 09 17:33
*balrog has quit (Remote host closed the connection)		Jul 09 17:33
MinceR	also, there was no broken shit like udisks2 or pulseaudio back then	Jul 09 17:33
MinceR	those were the days	Jul 09 17:33
cubexyz	I was referring to basic linux, which is pre-dbus-daemon	Jul 09 17:34
cubexyz	1999 era	Jul 09 17:34
cubexyz	which fits	Jul 09 17:34
oiaohm	MinceR: you are forgeting hald	Jul 09 17:34
MinceR	i don't remember any troubles with hald	Jul 09 17:34
oiaohm	MinceR: yes the userspace device extraction system design to be kernel so called neutral.	Jul 09 17:34
MinceR	then again, that didn't exist back then either, iirc	Jul 09 17:34
oiaohm	hald starts 1988	Jul 09 17:35
cubexyz	bl3 has init, kflushd, kupdate, kswapd, sh, getty, that's it	Jul 09 17:35
MinceR	i do remember udisks2 routinely dying	Jul 09 17:35
MinceR	without any documentation on how you're supposed to restart it	Jul 09 17:35
oiaohm	MinceR: hald is older than Linux.	Jul 09 17:35
oiaohm	And even worse documented than udisks	Jul 09 17:35
MinceR	and with some bullshit about how it will be started when needed	Jul 09 17:35
MinceR	yet i've never seen hald crash	Jul 09 17:35
oiaohm	MinceR: I had tablet input devices.	Jul 09 17:36
oiaohm	hald dieing was kinda a given.	Jul 09 17:36
MinceR	i think i got my thinkpad x-series tablet too late for that	Jul 09 17:37
oiaohm	http://linux.die.net/man/8/hald	Jul 09 17:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.die.net \| hald(8): HAL daemon - Linux man page		Jul 09 17:37
oiaohm	hald is what gets me hating sysvinit MinceR	Jul 09 17:38
cubexyz	ok, so I think dbus-daemon started around the redhat 8 era	Jul 09 17:38
oiaohm	Notice the restart instructions on that man page	Jul 09 17:38
MinceR	hald is not part of sysvinit, though	Jul 09 17:38
MinceR	and sysvinit doesn't depend on hald	Jul 09 17:38
oiaohm	MinceR: sysvinit starts hald but then cannot restart it.	Jul 09 17:38
MinceR	yeah, they managed to document how to restart it	Jul 09 17:39
MinceR	unlike udisks2	Jul 09 17:39
oiaohm	MinceR: hopefullly.	Jul 09 17:39
MinceR	oh, it's so hard to restart	Jul 09 17:39
oiaohm	pkill hald sometimes failed.	Jul 09 17:39
cubexyz	did hald predate Linux?	Jul 09 17:39
MinceR	it's 3 whole commands!	Jul 09 17:39
MinceR	if someone's scared by 3 commands, maybe they shouldn't be using a computer	Jul 09 17:39
oiaohm	MinceR: hald mafuncting is a forkbomb	Jul 09 17:39
oiaohm	pkill hald did not work in every case.	Jul 09 17:40
MinceR	but i totally want to have my entire OS hijacked just so it can be restarted automatically	Jul 09 17:40
MinceR	oh wait, if i wanted that, i could just go back to windows	Jul 09 17:40
oiaohm	MinceR: I really like openrc more than systemd	Jul 09 17:40
MinceR	windows is already broken in every way redhat wants to break linux-based os-es	Jul 09 17:40
MinceR	maybe they should just go back to windows.	Jul 09 17:40
MinceR	oiaohm: guess what, redhat is trying to destroy openrc.	Jul 09 17:41
oiaohm	udisk and the like was attempt to cure hald failures MinceR	Jul 09 17:41
cubexyz	if you want a simple linux to play around with on old old hardware then give bl3 a try	Jul 09 17:41
MinceR	"Gentoo folks, this is your wakeup call." -- as the asshole in the show-window said.	Jul 09 17:41
oiaohm	Mostly udisk and the like have worked.	Jul 09 17:41
MinceR	doesn't seem like that to me	Jul 09 17:41
MinceR	unless you mean "fall over and die" by "work"	Jul 09 17:42
MinceR	because udisks2 does _that_ just fine	Jul 09 17:42
oiaohm	MinceR: did you not notice the typo on the man page.	Jul 09 17:42
oiaohm	Yep /usr/sbin/hald --daemon=no --verbose=yes is the correct command to attempt to make sure hald is dead.	Jul 09 17:43
cubexyz	I'm still learning about KDE 3.5.10 stuff	Jul 09 17:43
MinceR	the -- having extra line breaks?	Jul 09 17:43
MinceR	i assumed that was some processing error	Jul 09 17:43
MinceR	specific to *roff syntax or whatever	Jul 09 17:43
oiaohm	MinceR: that typo is in the offical man page.	Jul 09 17:44
MinceR	(i don't know *roff that well)	Jul 09 17:44
oiaohm	MinceR: source	Jul 09 17:44
oiaohm	MinceR: never been fixed in 12+ years	Jul 09 17:44
MinceR	redhat fixes that by not writing documentation	Jul 09 17:44
oiaohm	In fact 20+ years	Jul 09 17:44
cubexyz	have you guys done any dbus programming?	Jul 09 17:44
MinceR	(or documentation of any worth)	Jul 09 17:44
MinceR	cubexyz: i've attempted to send dbus messages from the command line	Jul 09 17:44
MinceR	it made me miss dcop.	Jul 09 17:44
oiaohm	cubexyz: Yes I have. I hate most of the current dbus libraries.	Jul 09 17:44
MinceR	(it was probably for a shell script)	Jul 09 17:46
oiaohm	MinceR: there is something even more creative about hald that makes you hate it more.	Jul 09 17:46
oiaohm	this /usr/sbin/hald --daemon=no --verbose=yes in fact accept application requests.	Jul 09 17:46
oiaohm	So any application that talks to the hald while you are testing can get massively upset and crash because it has existed.	Jul 09 17:47
cubexyz	and no one writes nroff man pages, may as well mention that :)	Jul 09 17:47
cubexyz	lazy bastards	Jul 09 17:47
MinceR	oiaohm: you mean 'exited'?	Jul 09 17:47
oiaohm	MinceR: since you set no daemon it going to quit.	Jul 09 17:48
MinceR	dbus reimplemented that flaw	Jul 09 17:48
MinceR	i thought daemon=no simply means it remains attached to the terminal you run it from	Jul 09 17:48
MinceR	(or avoids forking if your service manager works better that way)	Jul 09 17:49
oiaohm	MinceR: on most other things you are correct.	Jul 09 17:49
oiaohm	MinceR: hald made it also equal quit	Jul 09 17:49
oiaohm	Just to be super fun.	Jul 09 17:49
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cubexyz	I think my slackware box still has hald	Jul 09 17:50
cubexyz	didn't the other linuxes deprecate hald?	Jul 09 17:50
oiaohm	cubexyz: you use to require hald so X11 server would run.	Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Pisi Linux...Still Alive!	Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/AEynEfPqq5	Jul 09 17:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxmigrante.blogspot.co.uk \| La Esquina de un Migrante a Linux: Pisi Linux...Still Alive!		Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	(linuxmigrante.blogspot.co.uk)	Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2w6f	Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Launchpad Development Starts Again	Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Oo0G0e2uJy (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2w6g	Jul 09 17:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Launchpad Development Starts Again \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Canonical Closes HAProxy Issues in Ubuntu 15.04	Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/i6M4JJCZ9b (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 17:51
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2w6h	Jul 09 17:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Canonical Closes HAProxy Issues in Ubuntu 15.04 \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 17:51
oiaohm	cubexyz: hald is nuked by udev and upower, udisk and so on.	Jul 09 17:52
oiaohm	cubexyz: you can choose to still install hald for backwards compadiblity.	Jul 09 17:52
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 Gets the Latest systemd 222	Jul 09 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/BJMO1uP9Ui (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2wv7	Jul 09 19:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu 15.10 Gets the Latest systemd 222 \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Another day, another OpenSSL patch	Jul 09 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/zM6DHRMaLB (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2wv9	Jul 09 19:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Another day, another OpenSSL patch \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines ChaletOS 14.04.2 review - Digital white	Jul 09 19:29
TweetTuxMachines	chocolate http://t.co/4uqLgf3Wy5	Jul 09 19:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 19:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| ChaletOS 14.04.2 review - Digital white chocolate \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 19:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2wva	Jul 09 19:29
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 Gets the Latest systemd 222	Jul 09 23:47
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/auZPbCZaGu (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 23:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu 15.10 Gets the Latest systemd 222 - Softpedia		Jul 09 23:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2yln	Jul 09 23:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Canonical Closes HAProxy Issues in Ubuntu 15.04	Jul 10 00:06
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/svvdVuNSZJ (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 10 00:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Canonical Closes HAProxy Issues in Ubuntu 15.04 - Softpedia		Jul 10 00:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2yqn	Jul 10 00:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android based videoconferencing system does	Jul 10 00:07
TweetTuxMachines	9-way sessions http://t.co/ZX5y9xtflP	Jul 10 00:07
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 00:07
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2yqp	Jul 10 00:07
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Android based videoconferencing system does 9-way sessions \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 00:07
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines K12 autonomous Botball contest taps	Jul 10 00:07
TweetTuxMachines	Linux-on-Sitara design http://t.co/sC3vhgwbRl	Jul 10 00:07
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 00:07
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2yqr	Jul 10 00:07
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| K12 autonomous Botball contest taps Linux-on-Sitara design \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 00:07
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Metztli_IT/status/619286877418303488	Jul 10 00:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Metztli_IT: .@ORCL_Linux(#RHEL) 7 #openssl version …1.0.1e-fips 11 Feb 2013 affected from 1.0.1n /1.0.2b https://t.co/f4wYLYz85Z https://t.co/g7i5MaNmPz		Jul 10 00:28
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schestowitz	http://communities-dominate.blogs.com/brands/2015/07/last-lifeline-from-microsoft-to-soon-to-end-lumia-handset-unit-7800-more-jobs-lost-and-76b-written-o.html	Jul 10 00:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-communities-dominate.blogs.com \| Communities Dominate Brands: Last Lifeline from Microsoft to Soon-to-End Lumia Handset Unit - 7,800 more jobs lost and $7.6B written off the books [ http://ur1.ca/n2yya ]		Jul 10 00:42
schestowitz	see also comments	Jul 10 00:42
schestowitz	Lars Noodén wrote on 09/07/15 20:24:	Jul 10 00:44
schestowitz	> https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20150705/18174231556/spain-government-goes-full-police-state-enacts-law-forbidding-dissent-unauthorized-photography-law-enforcement.shtml	Jul 10 00:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.techdirt.com \| Spain Government Goes Full Police State; Enacts Law Forbidding Dissent, 'Unauthorized' Photography Of Law Enforcement \| Techdirt [ http://ur1.ca/n2yyo ]		Jul 10 00:44
schestowitz	>	Jul 10 00:44
schestowitz	> see also the long thread in misc@	Jul 10 00:44
schestowitz	Wrong link?	Jul 10 00:44
schestowitz	https://soylentnews.org/breakingnews/article.pl?sid=15/07/08/1840235	Jul 10 00:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://soylentnews.org/breakingnews/article.pl?sid=15/07/08/1840235 )		Jul 10 00:45
schestowitz	https://2015.eurobsdcon.org/talks/	Jul 10 00:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-2015.eurobsdcon.org \| Talks \| EuroBSDcon 2015		Jul 10 00:46
schestowitz	>	Jul 10 00:53
schestowitz	> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/facebook/11728422/Facebook-Music-Social-network-may-rival-Spotify-and-Apple-with-its-own-streaming-service.html	Jul 10 00:53
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.telegraph.co.uk \| Facebook Music: Social network may rival Spotify and Apple with its own streaming service - Telegraph [ http://ur1.ca/n2z07 ]		Jul 10 00:53
schestowitz	>	Jul 10 00:53
schestowitz	> ==	Jul 10 00:53
schestowitz	>	Jul 10 00:53
schestowitz	> "According to the defense team the court was wrong to	Jul 10 00:53
schestowitz	> label Dotcom and his colleagues as fugitives, a claim	Jul 10 00:53
schestowitz	> which is now supported by several legal expert"	Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	> https://torrentfreak.com/prominent-legal-experts-rally-behind-megaupload-150709/	Jul 10 00:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-torrentfreak.com \| Prominent Legal Experts Rally Behind Megaupload - TorrentFreak [ http://ur1.ca/n2z0b ]		Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	> ==	Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	> http://arstechnica.com/security/2015/07/critical-openssl-bug-allows-attackers-to-impersonate-any-trusted-server/	Jul 10 00:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-arstechnica.com \| Critical OpenSSL bug allows attackers to impersonate any trusted server \| Ars Technica [ http://ur1.ca/n2z0c ]		Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	> ==	Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	> https://2015.eurobsdcon.org/talks/	Jul 10 00:54
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/mangel_joe/status/619292692166656000	Jul 10 00:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mangel_joe: @showbizmcr @schestowitz Also, first tram times are before 6am so I guess those drivers start before 5am. Not really "decent hours" there.		Jul 10 00:55
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Luisja_350/status/619293231491219456	Jul 10 00:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Luisja_350: @schestowitz It's cheaper to keep the mouth shut. #LeyMordaza		Jul 10 00:57
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Five lightweight Linux desktop worlds for	Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	extreme open-sourcers http://t.co/X86ZdFcxce	Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2z3g	Jul 10 01:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Five lightweight Linux desktop worlds for extreme open-sourcers \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The truth is just a download away: Why we need	Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	open source more than ever	Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/mGyPnO0EMY (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2z3h	Jul 10 01:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| The truth is just a download away: Why we need open source more than ever \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines K12 autonomous Botball contest taps	Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	Linux-on-Sitara design http://t.co/C1NjMI6os2	Jul 10 01:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| K12 autonomous Botball contest taps Linux-on-Sitara design · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	(linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 10 01:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2z3i	Jul 10 01:08
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android based videoconferencing system does	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	9-way sessions http://t.co/C1NjMI6os2	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	(linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zcj	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Five lightweight Linux desktop worlds for	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	extreme open-sourcers http://t.co/rFRQdbNXn8	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	(www.theregister.co.uk)	Jul 10 01:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theregister.co.uk \| Five lightweight Linux desktop worlds for extreme open-sourcers • The Register		Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zck	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The People Who Support Linux: SysAdmin Rigs	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	Raspberry Pi for Racing Pigeons	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/dooCPTBvAu (www.linux.com)	Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zcl	Jul 10 01:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| The People Who Support Linux: SysAdmin Rigs Raspberry Pi for Racing Pigeons \| Linux.com		Jul 10 01:58
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Krita 2.9.6 released! https://t.co/cpVEjsEA2b	Jul 10 02:17
TweetTuxMachines	(krita.org)	Jul 10 02:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zg5	Jul 10 02:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-krita.org \| Krita 2.9.6 released! \| Krita		Jul 10 02:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Krita 2.9.6 released! http://t.co/Co2DLFRLSX	Jul 10 02:17
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 02:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zg6	Jul 10 02:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Krita 2.9.6 released! \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 02:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "It is still a WIP and it is also quite early,	Jul 10 02:18
TweetTuxMachines	but if you want to try out Snappy Personal	Jul 10 02:18
TweetTuxMachines	Desktop," http://t.co/teFD5oLzv6	Jul 10 02:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-carla-sella.blogspot.co.uk \| Carla Sella (Letozaf_ ): Snappy Personal Desktop		Jul 10 02:18
TweetTuxMachines	(carla-sella.blogspot.co.uk)	Jul 10 02:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zg7	Jul 10 02:18
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Chartoc/status/619293996981088256	Jul 10 02:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Chartoc: @VCR_Blog @SolidHebime @kishroka months? try years http://t.co/oj5aPBN2kB		Jul 10 02:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| Richard Stallman and Bruce Perens Defamed by Troll \| Techrights		Jul 10 02:24
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oiaohm	http://yro.slashdot.org/story/15/07/09/187204/french-government-it-directorate-supports-odf-rejects-ooxml this is fun	Jul 10 03:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-yro.slashdot.org \| French Government IT Directorate Supports ODF, Rejects OOXML - Slashdot [ http://ur1.ca/n2zon ]		Jul 10 03:03
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Unvanquished Alpha 41 Released, Still Moving	Jul 10 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	Towards NaCl VM Usage http://t.co/FMnFWQ4Syq	Jul 10 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 10 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3094	Jul 10 05:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Unvanquished Alpha 41 Released, Still Moving Towards NaCl VM Usage - Phoronix		Jul 10 05:02
*TweetTuxMachines @mispaginasfavor followed @tuxmachines		Jul 10 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines UC Berkeley, Cal Poly Receive $6 Million for	Jul 10 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	Open Source Project http://t.co/D0tiOyCrwY	Jul 10 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 05:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3095	Jul 10 05:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| UC Berkeley, Cal Poly Receive $6 Million for Open Source Project \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 05:02
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*Now talking on #techrights		Jul 10 06:42
*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 10 06:42
*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 10 06:42
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Metztli_IT/status/619316540052127744	Jul 10 09:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Metztli_IT: .@Virtualbox 5.0 Brings Awesome New Features http://t.co/AmjFDTQH7z via @schestowitz https://t.co/2ReKJyk90w		Jul 10 09:19
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/RegularClaw/status/619396359783776256	Jul 10 09:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@RegularClaw: @schestowitz LO...L?		Jul 10 09:20
schestowitz	https://www.joindiaspora.com/posts/6313809	Jul 10 09:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Not a Diaspora post?		Jul 10 09:24
schestowitz	https://www.joindiaspora.com/posts/6313809	Jul 10 09:24
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*Now talking on #techrights		Jul 10 10:42
*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 10 10:42
*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 10 10:42
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*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 10 12:48
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-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today and Yesterday in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 14:35
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__martin__	MinceR: http://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NSA-KDBUS-Credentials	Jul 10 15:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-phoronix.com \| The NSA Is Looking At Systemd's KDBUS - Phoronix [ http://ur1.ca/n33th ]		Jul 10 15:16
__martin__	anyways, from that ubuntu -> devuan distro hopping; i've ended up at devuan -> steamos for a while and most recently switched to oma aka openmandriva	Jul 10 15:17
MinceR	nsa's dream, a backdoor in the kernel	Jul 10 15:18
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oiaohm	http://newsoffice.mit.edu/2015/computer-program-fixes-old-code-faster-than-expert-engineers-0609 This is becoming no more secrets	Jul 10 15:43
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-newsoffice.mit.edu \| Computer program fixes old code faster than expert engineers \| MIT News [ http://ur1.ca/n340y ]		Jul 10 15:43
MinceR	so does mine	Jul 10 15:45
MinceR	sudo apt-get remove systemd	Jul 10 15:45
oiaohm	MinceR: did you know not being able to use keyboard in boot to control fsck and the like is common in any sysvinit fork to allow parallel booting.	Jul 10 15:49
MinceR	yet another reason to not do parallel booting	Jul 10 15:50
oiaohm	But it double sided.	Jul 10 15:51
oiaohm	parallel booting from performance point of view make sense.	Jul 10 15:52
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MinceR	except if your computer does not run windows and as such you rarely reboot it, it doesn't make any sense	Jul 10 15:52
MinceR	especially if it makes booting less reliable	Jul 10 15:52
MinceR	of course it's still an attractive target to ricers	Jul 10 15:53
oiaohm	There is a catch here.	Jul 10 15:53
oiaohm	Most Linux distrobution default has been a percentage parallel	Jul 10 15:53
oiaohm	Since the year 2000	Jul 10 15:53
oiaohm	This is where the arguement against it comes it bits MinceR	Jul 10 15:53
oiaohm	Question is ammount and how	Jul 10 15:54
oiaohm	Some thing startting parallel with each other is not a issue	Jul 10 15:54
MinceR	yeah, race conditions are not an issue	Jul 10 15:54
MinceR	why would anyone think they are?	Jul 10 15:54
MinceR	also, "most Linux distributions do it" is not a good reason	Jul 10 15:55
oiaohm	Not all parrell boot solutions suffer from race conditions.	Jul 10 15:55
MinceR	especially since the migration to lendows	Jul 10 15:55
oiaohm	MinceR: BSD implements parrell 1996	Jul 10 15:55
oiaohm	Before even NT did it.	Jul 10 15:55
MinceR	openrc lets you turn it off, so if it fails, you can try again	Jul 10 15:55
oiaohm	MinceR: see there is the feature you want.	Jul 10 15:56
oiaohm	Not that systemd has parrell but the option to disable it in case if usse.	Jul 10 15:56
oiaohm	usse/issue	Jul 10 15:56
oiaohm	MinceR: basically parallel booting is not the problem. The controls on parallel booting are the problem.	Jul 10 15:57
__martin__	lel, dat davinci surveillance suite from "the hacking team" leveraged even 0day within selinux... as the news flow	Jul 10 15:57
__martin__	(apart from a dopeee fla$h)	Jul 10 15:58
oiaohm	MinceR: Like I know ways with systemd to make it not start any sevices until the fsck is compete by setting wants on the mounts at particular points.	Jul 10 15:58
MinceR	oiaohm: still, there are use cases where reducing reliability for the sake of saving a few seconds on boot (which rarely happens) is not a good tradeoff	Jul 10 15:59
MinceR	yeah, my favorite way of doing that is replacing systemd with an init system (and userland) that actually works	Jul 10 15:59
oiaohm	MinceR: we have multi core processes these days.	Jul 10 16:00
oiaohm	It not about reducing relaiblity.	Jul 10 16:01
oiaohm	History parrell booting of stuff does not cause that as long as correct locking design is in place.	Jul 10 16:01
MinceR	most of our services don't depend on that	Jul 10 16:01
MinceR	special case solutions belong to special cases	Jul 10 16:01
oiaohm	Most services are single threaded in the start up.	Jul 10 16:02
oiaohm	So starting 3 to 4 at a time that are not overlapping with each other is no problem.	Jul 10 16:02
MinceR	unless one of them depends on another	Jul 10 16:02
oiaohm	Even starting a few 100 at a time.	Jul 10 16:02
__martin__	https://ht.transparencytoolkit.org/KnowledgeBase/Invisibility%20Report%209.6%20-%20%5DHT%5B%20%3a%3a%20KnowledgeBase%20Product.html	Jul 10 16:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 503 @ https://ht.transparencytoolkit.org/KnowledgeBase/Invisibility%20Report%209.6%20-%20%5DHT%5B%20%3a%3a%20KnowledgeBase%20Product.html )		Jul 10 16:02
oiaohm	MinceR: even starting single booting if you start them in the wrong order you have dependancy failure.	Jul 10 16:02
MinceR	yeah, but there's only one order you'll use	Jul 10 16:03
MinceR	so one booting is sufficient to figure out if it works	Jul 10 16:03
MinceR	if you add lots of possibilities for race conditions, suddenly testing takes up more time than you would save.	Jul 10 16:03
oiaohm	Ever wondered why openrc and systemd support full container wrapping of services.	Jul 10 16:04
oiaohm	There is a very pracitcal reason to prevent a lot of possible race condition issues.	Jul 10 16:04
oiaohm	Also you have to remember once the service is started it has to be running parrall to the other services anyhow.	Jul 10 16:05
oiaohm	MinceR: ever head of /tmp directory collisions/exploits.	Jul 10 16:06
oiaohm	head/heard	Jul 10 16:06
MinceR	ever heard of mkstemp?	Jul 10 16:06
MinceR	once the service is successfully started, its prerequisites were already met	Jul 10 16:07
oiaohm	http://man7.org/linux/man-pages/man3/mkstemp.3.html has a bug	Jul 10 16:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-man7.org \| mkstemp(3) - Linux manual page [ http://ur1.ca/n345h ]		Jul 10 16:08
oiaohm	Notice 6 char limit MinceR	Jul 10 16:08
oiaohm	MinceR: service successfully started question how does sysvinit like systems know that.	Jul 10 16:10
MinceR	yeah, that's so easy to exploit	Jul 10 16:10
MinceR	especially if you unlink the file right after opening it	Jul 10 16:10
oiaohm	MinceR: there is a Linux way to create the temp file unlinked	Jul 10 16:11
oiaohm	Its not the mkstemp command.	Jul 10 16:11
oiaohm	MinceR: please also note unlink after opening gives the window for some to to race condition it. If they open the file before you unlink it the file can be blocked from unlinking.	Jul 10 16:15
oiaohm	MinceR: http://lcamtuf.coredump.cx/tmp_paper.txt <<Attacking a system by the /tmp directory is nothing new.	Jul 10 16:19
MinceR	neither is attacking a system by forcing it to use systemd.	Jul 10 16:19
oiaohm	cgroup/jails/zones file system limitations is a very effective method if limiting the attack.	Jul 10 16:19
oiaohm	MinceR: the issue is you are head in sand.	Jul 10 16:20
oiaohm	The problem why systemd is being pushed by redhat so hard is a long list of problems.	Jul 10 16:20
oiaohm	Ok openrc at least can address a good percentage of them.	Jul 10 16:20
oiaohm	But a lot of stuff people says let us keep this is in fact broken crap.	Jul 10 16:21
MinceR	yes, i am	Jul 10 16:21
MinceR	because systemd is flawless	Jul 10 16:21
oiaohm	So of course Redhat will not take anyone serousally who pushes the idea of going back to broken crap.	Jul 10 16:21
MinceR	of course, redcrap is pushing switching to broken crap	Jul 10 16:22
oiaohm	If you argue for the usage of openrc	Jul 10 16:22
MinceR	which is "forward" for you	Jul 10 16:22
oiaohm	and accept that cgroups and other tech has to come.	Jul 10 16:22
MinceR	none of that tech requires a hairball in pid1	Jul 10 16:22
MinceR	none of that tech requires extreme lock-in	Jul 10 16:22
MinceR	none of that tech requires undocumented spaghetti code	Jul 10 16:22
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MinceR	so redcrap can go and stuff their evil crap where the sun doesn't shine.	Jul 10 16:23
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oiaohm	Undocumented spagehetti code is in fact found in sysvinit system.	Jul 10 16:23
oiaohm	Strange breakages of that stuff is what lead to systemd having unit files.	Jul 10 16:23
MinceR	unit files are broken	Jul 10 16:24
MinceR	a typo can make the new version of a unit file be silently ignored by systemd	Jul 10 16:25
MinceR	at least shell parsers are pretty mature by now	Jul 10 16:25
MinceR	systemd will never be mature.	Jul 10 16:25
oiaohm	MinceR: a typo in a sysvinit script can in fact render the computer not bootable at times.	Jul 10 16:25
MinceR	oiaohm: systemd does not need a typo anywhere to render the computer unbootable.	Jul 10 16:26
oiaohm	Sorry scale of bad here.	Jul 10 16:26
oiaohm	Unit files failures being silent is a problem.	Jul 10 16:26
MinceR	it is a problem among thousands.	Jul 10 16:26
MinceR	systemd is a can of worms.	Jul 10 16:27
oiaohm	sysvinit systems are also a can of worms	Jul 10 16:27
MinceR	sysvinit can be replaced. systemd cannot.	Jul 10 16:27
oiaohm	Exactly why do you keep on saying that bogus.	Jul 10 16:27
oiaohm	systemd can be replaced	Jul 10 16:27
MinceR	redcrap made sure to put dependencies on systemd everywhere	Jul 10 16:28
MinceR	specifically to make it as difficult to replace as possible.	Jul 10 16:28
MinceR	redcrap is using microsoftian tactics to take over our computers.	Jul 10 16:28
oiaohm	Not really that difficualt to swap systemd in and out of a system.	Jul 10 16:28
MinceR	and there's a large cult following who also put dependencies wherever they can	Jul 10 16:29
MinceR	like kde	Jul 10 16:29
oiaohm	KDE does not have any solid lock on systemd at this stage.	Jul 10 16:29
MinceR	they've announced to add it in august	Jul 10 16:29
MinceR	parts of that cult are working to destroy the bsd-s as well.	Jul 10 16:29
oiaohm	The only thing out of systemd that kinda haves a solid lock is logind but that has clones.	Jul 10 16:29
MinceR	no, that's not the only thing	Jul 10 16:30
oiaohm	You did not read the announcement fully did you MinceR	Jul 10 16:30
MinceR	i did	Jul 10 16:30
oiaohm	Pull up that KDE annonuncement and re read it.	Jul 10 16:30
oiaohm	It only means logind.	Jul 10 16:30
oiaohm	Other systemd parts are optional and will remain that way.	Jul 10 16:30
MinceR	sure	Jul 10 16:31
MinceR	they'll call them "optional"	Jul 10 16:31
MinceR	and their code will deliberately break (even worse than usual) if those "optional" parts are missing	Jul 10 16:31
oiaohm	fact that consolekit2 has logind this means the new kde will work with sysvinit as long as distrobution has updated there consolekit	Jul 10 16:31
MinceR	also, journald is not "optional"	Jul 10 16:31
MinceR	it takes over your log entries whether you want it or not.	Jul 10 16:31
oiaohm	Funny did you not read the manual that you can point journald conf file to /dev/null then systemd runs old syslog solution.	Jul 10 16:34
oiaohm	MinceR: this is the problem.	Jul 10 16:34
oiaohm	A lot of claims about systemd are bogus.	Jul 10 16:34
MinceR	yeah, poettering claims that the claims are bogus	Jul 10 16:34
MinceR	and while systemd apologists go around claiming that systemd is flawless, it fucks up production systems routinely.	Jul 10 16:35
MinceR	and you know, i'd have no problem with this if they didn't use all the leverage they could get to force their malware on me.	Jul 10 16:35
MinceR	they have the right to write malicious crap code	Jul 10 16:35
MinceR	they don't have the right to force people to run it.	Jul 10 16:36
oiaohm	Really I understand the force.	Jul 10 16:36
MinceR	of course	Jul 10 16:36
MinceR	redcrap thinks this is good business	Jul 10 16:36
oiaohm	We have had 20 years + of a particular set of issues being ingored	Jul 10 16:36
oiaohm	No	Jul 10 16:36
MinceR	kill the competition or make their clients depend on redcrap support contracts	Jul 10 16:36
oiaohm	Its not exactly good for business.	Jul 10 16:36
oiaohm	Redhat attempted to avoid making systemd in the first place.	Jul 10 16:36
MinceR	they don't seem to realize that.	Jul 10 16:36
MinceR	the funny thing will be once redcrap eliminates all competition, m$ will revoke their uefi certificate	Jul 10 16:37
MinceR	and then redcrap will die too.	Jul 10 16:37
oiaohm	The thing you keep on missing is where every redhat wants lockin it closed source.	Jul 10 16:39
oiaohm	Or restricted supply.	Jul 10 16:39
MinceR	you seem to miss the fact that systemd is designed for nonfree replacements.	Jul 10 16:39
MinceR	it's licensed under LGPL 2.1	Jul 10 16:39
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MinceR	and it uses dbus interfaces heavily	Jul 10 16:39
oiaohm	Redhat is basically sick of the support issues sysvinit was.	Jul 10 16:39
MinceR	it's trivial to move dbus services to nonfree blobs.	Jul 10 16:39
MinceR	then they're welcome to close shop.	Jul 10 16:39
oiaohm	MinceR: look up what other init systems were licensed under.	Jul 10 16:40
MinceR	nobody needs them to try and kill unix.	Jul 10 16:40
MinceR	except microsoft	Jul 10 16:40
oiaohm	LGPL is in fact one of the most restrictive llicenses uses on a init system.	Jul 10 16:40
oiaohm	Most are BSD or worse	Jul 10 16:40
MinceR	oiaohm: other "init systems" did not depend on thousands of modules that did things unrelated to init.	Jul 10 16:40
MinceR	other "init systems" have a scope.	Jul 10 16:40
MinceR	systemd has no scope.	Jul 10 16:40
oiaohm	scope complaint is valid.	Jul 10 16:40
MinceR	even poettering is unable to define what systemd is intended to be.	Jul 10 16:40
oiaohm	License complaint really not.	Jul 10 16:41
MinceR	it's just like cancer: it's trying to take over everything	Jul 10 16:41
MinceR	really, the license is unnecessary as they can simply exploit dbus.	Jul 10 16:41
oiaohm	MinceR: remember you cannot be too restrictive in a init system licesing.	Jul 10 16:41
MinceR	why not?	Jul 10 16:41
oiaohm	A pure GPL licensed init system kinda would be a bugger for likes of openssh that are not GPL.	Jul 10 16:42
oiaohm	Really LGPL is about as tight as you can go. Ok GPL with a exception clause.	Jul 10 16:43
MinceR	how is openssh linked to the init system?	Jul 10 16:43
oiaohm	MinceR: its init scripts to register itself.	Jul 10 16:43
oiaohm	Too viral of license becomes a problem.	Jul 10 16:44
MinceR	init scripts are executed, afaik that does not cause any obligations regarding GPL.	Jul 10 16:44
oiaohm	That is wrong under sysvinit if it was GPL.	Jul 10 16:44
MinceR	if they want to do dependency handling, they'll also read comments in init scripts, that also doesn't cause any obligations	Jul 10 16:44
oiaohm	Becuase you have the functions common script.	Jul 10 16:44
oiaohm	That you import and use.	Jul 10 16:44
MinceR	strange, i thought sysvinit on debian was attacked exactly because it didn't use such a script	Jul 10 16:45
MinceR	while at least one bsd did (and as a result, had far shorter init scripts, typically shorter than a unit file)	Jul 10 16:45
MinceR	it's funny how systemd fanboys cherry-pick their "facts" to support their favorite malware	Jul 10 16:45
MinceR	(maybe second favorite, after windows)	Jul 10 16:46
oiaohm	MinceR: debian renamed it but the beast still exists . /lib/lsb/init-functions	Jul 10 16:46
MinceR	even so, they can get away with licensing that file differently	Jul 10 16:47
oiaohm	MinceR: please note that just the most common embedded	Jul 10 16:47
oiaohm	But its not the only case of a fragement of sysvinit base being embeded into a script.	Jul 10 16:48
oiaohm	So if you are sticking to script based the licensing you can go to is kinda restricted to something not to bad viral or solutions will not be able to customise it.	Jul 10 16:49
oiaohm	This is why complaining about LGPL on systemd does not make much sense.	Jul 10 16:50
oiaohm	Anything more than LGPL and it starts becoming unworkable.	Jul 10 16:50
MinceR	it makes sense in the context of how the FSF supports systemd but doesn't support the LLVM debugger in emacs	Jul 10 16:50
MinceR	also, even if a service package was published with an rc script that sources a script that comes with an init/rc system, they can license their init/rc script differently	Jul 10 16:51
oiaohm	Now if you were naming particular parts of systemd that should be broken out to be made independant projects under more restrictive you might have an agurement.	Jul 10 16:52
MinceR	also, you brought up openssh, which is published under a BSD license without advertising clause	Jul 10 16:52
MinceR	therefore it's already compatible with GPL.	Jul 10 16:52
MinceR	there is plenty of functionality in systemd that belongs in independent projects.	Jul 10 16:52
MinceR	unfortunately, they tend to throw in even more unrelated functionality there	Jul 10 16:53
oiaohm	MinceR: but if you bundling a part that contains some GPL code that infects the BSD work. If it was LGPL code the result is not a hazard.	Jul 10 16:53
MinceR	they assimilated udev, then they assimilated gummiboot, and who knows what else.	Jul 10 16:53
oiaohm	the License problem is packaging	Jul 10 16:53
MinceR	oiaohm: how does it "infect" the BSD work?	Jul 10 16:53
oiaohm	MinceR: GPL is infecting to what it shipping with. So a init script with some GPL code in by mistake shipped in BSD project archive we have a problem.	Jul 10 16:54
oiaohm	LGPL is not viral that way.	Jul 10 16:54
MinceR	why would a BSD project ship the code it sources?	Jul 10 16:55
oiaohm	MinceR: init script code the file it needs to regisger into the init. Like they based off the init systems example.	Jul 10 16:55
MinceR	that doesn't explain anything	Jul 10 16:55
oiaohm	for a service to start by a init system MinceR it need to register with the init system right	Jul 10 16:56
MinceR	to do so its rc script will source a file from the init/rc system	Jul 10 16:56
oiaohm	Where you get your template file from to make that registration bit can become toxic if the license is too restrictive.	Jul 10 16:56
MinceR	the rc script of the project is GPL-compatible BSDL	Jul 10 16:57
MinceR	the sourced script is GPL	Jul 10 16:57
MinceR	where's the problem?	Jul 10 16:57
oiaohm	BSD is compadible to be put in GPL.	Jul 10 16:57
MinceR	also, since when does it matter in the case of systemd, which doesn't use shell scripts?	Jul 10 16:57
oiaohm	But GPL is not compadible to be put in BSD	Jul 10 16:57
oiaohm	Its one way compadiblity MinceR	Jul 10 16:57
MinceR	it's not "put in BSD", it's not part of the BSDL-ed project	Jul 10 16:58
MinceR	if it's a problem, anyone can relicense the BSDL-ed init/rc script under GPL	Jul 10 16:58
oiaohm	systemd uses Unit files and it has example unit files right MinceR	Jul 10 16:58
oiaohm	sysvinit has examples as well right.	Jul 10 16:58
oiaohm	remember those examples are under the project main license.	Jul 10 16:58
MinceR	so, writing your own unit/rc file infringes on the examples?	Jul 10 16:59
MinceR	i wonder what court would accept such an argument	Jul 10 16:59
oiaohm	Not exactly writing own. Instead of writing your own you take a template one and modify it.	Jul 10 16:59
oiaohm	Problem is this issue has held up in court in the past for basic copyright infrignement.	Jul 10 17:00
oiaohm	On word templates and the like.	Jul 10 17:00
MinceR	i don't have to take a template and modify it	Jul 10 17:00
MinceR	also, it makes sense to license the templates differently if this is a problem.	Jul 10 17:00
MinceR	also, again, this doesn't apply to the spaghetti code written in c	Jul 10 17:01
MinceR	as that is not incorporated in or linked to unit files	Jul 10 17:01
oiaohm	MinceR: for a safety case template files have to be licensed under LGPL or weaker.	Jul 10 17:01
oiaohm	Ie no viral cause.	Jul 10 17:01
MinceR	c source code is not "template files"	Jul 10 17:01
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MinceR	neither in sysvinit nor in systemd.	Jul 10 17:02
oiaohm	sysvinit is very weak license on it C files.	Jul 10 17:02
MinceR	so redcrap still has no excuse for making extra provisions to allow for nonfree code to be linked to systemd.	Jul 10 17:02
MinceR	sysvinit also doesn't try to force your hand via lock-in, unlike systemd.	Jul 10 17:02
oiaohm	sysvinit you can take it core init source and make a closed binary and never show anyone the source code.	Jul 10 17:03
MinceR	sysvinit is easy to swap out for another init system, which has been done in many cases.	Jul 10 17:03
oiaohm	Nonfree code exactly where.	Jul 10 17:04
oiaohm	most init systems support non free code connections MinceR	Jul 10 17:04
MinceR	you'll find out once redcrap manages to kill its competitors.	Jul 10 17:04
MinceR	you walk right into their trap and invite others to follow.	Jul 10 17:04
oiaohm	Any new init system like upstart openrc..... you could attempt to make the arguement about allowing nonfree code to be linked	Jul 10 17:05
oiaohm	Even the bsd init you could make that arguement MinceR	Jul 10 17:05
MinceR	no other "init system" tries to add as much crap as possible	Jul 10 17:06
oiaohm	Systemd doing too much that is a valid arguement.	Jul 10 17:06
oiaohm	Allowing closed source link in since all open source init systems allow this that is nothing to complain about.	Jul 10 17:07
MinceR	systemd doing too much _and_ being designed to be replaced with nonfree code is even worse.	Jul 10 17:07
MinceR	(not that its current code lends itself particularly well to modification)	Jul 10 17:08
oiaohm	MinceR: but all current init systems are design to allow nonfree code replacment of parts.	Jul 10 17:09
MinceR	oiaohm: most current init systems aren't designed for nonfree extensions, their scope being pretty limited.	Jul 10 17:10
oiaohm	MinceR: I forgot there is 1 exception.	Jul 10 17:10
oiaohm	Only open source init system that is under a license that prevents non free usage is https://www.gnu.org/software/dmd/	Jul 10 17:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gnu.org \| dmd - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation		Jul 10 17:11
oiaohm	And it fairly much a brick.	Jul 10 17:11
MinceR	and the FSF seems to be abandoning it	Jul 10 17:11
MinceR	since they decided that they prefer Gratis Windows to Free Software	Jul 10 17:11
MinceR	maybe they should rename themselves to GWF.	Jul 10 17:12
oiaohm	MinceR: the thing you have missed is like networkmanager and the like you think about how many parts inside sysvinit that have been replaced.	Jul 10 17:13
oiaohm	Ok sysvinit was out a glued up single project.	Jul 10 17:13
oiaohm	If systemd broke up in some ways it would be better.	Jul 10 17:14
oiaohm	Broken up would allow better licensing assignment for it parts.	Jul 10 17:14
MinceR	yeah, networkmanager sucks too	Jul 10 17:14
oiaohm	Ie some parts should be LGPL or lower and some sould be GPL	Jul 10 17:15
MinceR	you can use different licenses even on files hosted in the same repository.	Jul 10 17:15
MinceR	i suspect it was networkmanager on my server that had the brilliant idea of getting an ip address over dhcp on boot and then forgetting completely about dhcp	Jul 10 17:16
oiaohm	The outer license has to be the most restrictive when it comes to viral licenses.	Jul 10 17:16
MinceR	so even unplugging and replugging the cable wouldn't get it to get a new address	Jul 10 17:16
MinceR	so i had to reboot the server to make it accessible on the network.	Jul 10 17:16
MinceR	it's called "copyleft", not "viral"	Jul 10 17:16
MinceR	unless you work for microsoft, of course.	Jul 10 17:16
oiaohm	copyleft covers LGPL	Jul 10 17:18
oiaohm	viral I am refering to the likes of pure AGPL and GPL	Jul 10 17:18
oiaohm	The issue I have inside copyleft there are two types of licenses. One group is safe to embed inside another license without causing major hell like LGPL and the other group GPL that is not safe to embedd.	Jul 10 17:20
MinceR	neither is "safe to embed", at most to link with	Jul 10 17:21
MinceR	and iirc if you link statically, you're still obliged to include .o files	Jul 10 17:21
oiaohm	Weak copyleft you only have to release the parts directly connected to the license file	Jul 10 17:22
oiaohm	Ie LGPL	Jul 10 17:23
oiaohm	Where GPL allows going after the complete lot as Microsoft found out with the iso downloader.	Jul 10 17:23
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oiaohm	MinceR: basically licensing is a pain in ass to get right.	Jul 10 17:26
MinceR	indeed.	Jul 10 17:27
oiaohm	MinceR: networkmanager losing dhcp is normally dhcp client locked up.	Jul 10 17:27
oiaohm	Yes sysvinit lack of means to fully restart something becomes a problem in these cases.	Jul 10 17:27
MinceR	i wonder what restartd is for.	Jul 10 17:28
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oiaohm	MinceR: from memory that as a independant part is gone.	Jul 10 17:29
oiaohm	It was so lower provilaged user using dbus could trigger a restart/reboot from memory.	Jul 10 17:29
oiaohm	Yep fused into logind spec these days under session management	Jul 10 17:31
MinceR	i don't know what you're talking about.	Jul 10 17:33
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oiaohm	MinceR: ok there were two restartd. Yes there was a systemd version.	Jul 10 17:35
MinceR	i wasn't aware of that one	Jul 10 17:35
oiaohm	http://man.cx/restartd%288%29 I don't like to think about the other one.	Jul 10 17:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-man.cx \| Manpage for restartd - man.cx manual pages		Jul 10 17:36
oiaohm	Its truly do you fell lucky punk.	Jul 10 17:36
MinceR	:)	Jul 10 17:36
oiaohm	restartd is one of the hacks to attempt to make sysvinit work that is just even more broken.	Jul 10 17:37
oiaohm	POSIX regexp on the process names. << This is perfect right.	Jul 10 17:38
oiaohm	A service crashes a user starts a process with the same name and restartd thinks everything is perfect.	Jul 10 17:38
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MinceR	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgz8Cn7x3lI	Jul 10 17:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com \| Scary Movie 2 Wheelchair Battle - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/n34oi ]		Jul 10 17:39
oiaohm	MinceR: basically I want service tracking not loto like sysvinit has been.	Jul 10 17:39
MinceR	then you're looking for it in the wrong place.	Jul 10 17:40
oiaohm	MinceR: service tracking has to start when the service starts.	Jul 10 17:40
oiaohm	If it does not your screwed attempting todo it.	Jul 10 17:41
MinceR	if you're using systemd, you're screwed.	Jul 10 17:41
oiaohm	MinceR: remember openrc has service tracking.	Jul 10 17:41
oiaohm	I don't have to go systemd to get it.	Jul 10 17:42
oiaohm	But its a bare min feature I want to see in any future init system.	Jul 10 17:42
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MinceR	besides it's not like poettering's "we don't know therefore we assume yes" approach is going to help you anyway	Jul 10 17:44
oiaohm	systemd service tracking does work. its just the other issues that make it more painful	Jul 10 17:44
oiaohm	Like not giving the right controls for parell booting.	Jul 10 17:45
oiaohm	MinceR: I don't exactly like systemd but I do know I can get the beast after hours and hours of reading and understanding the beast to work in most cases better than sysvinit did.	Jul 10 17:46
oiaohm	Yet I could get the same results with openrc in about 1 hour.	Jul 10 17:46
MinceR	sounds like you didn't understand it as well as you thought you did.	Jul 10 17:46
oiaohm	Not exactly. its the having the init tree and having to put in wants like on local filesystem so that fsck has to complete before starting services.	Jul 10 17:48
oiaohm	MinceR: each Linux distrobution tree with systemd is slightly different.	Jul 10 17:48
MinceR	redcrap will take care of that.	Jul 10 17:49
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MinceR	once they release systemdnf, most distros will just be rebranded fedora.	Jul 10 17:49
oiaohm	Most annoying feature is you put a want in a invalid location it just disregards it without given correct reason why.	Jul 10 17:49
oiaohm	MinceR: http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html did you miss reading this.	Jul 10 17:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-0pointer.net \| Revisiting How We Put Together Linux Systems [ http://ur1.ca/i3miw ]		Jul 10 17:57
MinceR	i've read it	Jul 10 17:58
oiaohm	Can you see the problem.	Jul 10 17:58
MinceR	he has horrible ideas even beyond systemd	Jul 10 17:58
MinceR	i can see the problem	Jul 10 17:58
oiaohm	MinceR: what do you think what the problem is with that idea.	Jul 10 17:58
MinceR	the problem is that poettering is dealing with illusions of adequacy.	Jul 10 17:58
oiaohm	MinceR: forget the person.	Jul 10 17:59
oiaohm	Everything there works except for 1 very key thing.	Jul 10 17:59
MinceR	all the stupid ideas come from one person (or via one person, from places like microsoft)	Jul 10 17:59
oiaohm	Me running debian use to running checkrestart after updating packages	Jul 10 17:59
MinceR	i particularly hate the idea of moving /etc/passwd into subvolume names	Jul 10 18:00
oiaohm	Why running mixed libraries old and new equals more ram consumed.	Jul 10 18:00
oiaohm	MinceR: what one is worse. LDAP or subvolume names.	Jul 10 18:03
oiaohm	/etc/passwd has always been a on going nightmare with chroots.	Jul 10 18:04
MinceR	my systems don't need LDAP for that	Jul 10 18:04
oiaohm	Yes the /etc/passwd file has need splitting in 2 for a long time. 1 containing service required users	Jul 10 18:04
MinceR	but i'm pretty sure one can do LDAP better than the subvolume name kludge.	Jul 10 18:04
oiaohm	One for general users.	Jul 10 18:04
oiaohm	MinceR: the subvolume kludge is faster.	Jul 10 18:05
MinceR	you can do that with PAM, can't you?	Jul 10 18:05
MinceR	oh, again the usual ricer argument	Jul 10 18:05
MinceR	"herp derp, it's fastah!"	Jul 10 18:05
MinceR	doesn't matter if it will work, IT MUST BE FASTER!	Jul 10 18:05
oiaohm	And works better with the case of moving drives.	Jul 10 18:05
MinceR	doesn't matter if it will boot, IT MUST BOOT FASTER!	Jul 10 18:05
oiaohm	LDAP is slower.	Jul 10 18:05
oiaohm	PAM for a long time has not supported loading 2 password files.	Jul 10 18:06
oiaohm	The second one to load completely nukes the first.	Jul 10 18:06
MinceR	android also fakes /etc/passwd entries somehow	Jul 10 18:06
oiaohm	Android does not have /etc/passwd	Jul 10 18:07
MinceR	yup	Jul 10 18:07
MinceR	debian-kit even has some daemon that builds an /etc/passwd out of info from the android host	Jul 10 18:08
MinceR	iirc	Jul 10 18:08
oiaohm	that it really uses	Jul 10 18:08
oiaohm	MinceR: /data/system/user/ is where users are on android as xml files.	Jul 10 18:09
oiaohm	MinceR: yep android makes the subvolume kludge look nice.	Jul 10 18:10
MinceR	i don't think it does	Jul 10 18:10
MinceR	also, you could probably patch PAM to do what you want.	Jul 10 18:10
oiaohm	MinceR: the idea behind the subvolume labels is that you can pull the home drive out put it in another system and end up with some form of sanity.	Jul 10 18:13
MinceR	it's still a bad idea	Jul 10 18:13
oiaohm	Worse idea is the ram issue.	Jul 10 18:13
MinceR	those are not version managed, they're not likely to be backed up	Jul 10 18:13
MinceR	and the whole "make readonly all the things!" makes security updates more cumbersome	Jul 10 18:14
oiaohm	make all readonly really does not make security updates more cumbersome.	Jul 10 18:15
oiaohm	Reality here is majority of services write very little.	Jul 10 18:16
oiaohm	Like how many programs in fact write to /usr/bin	Jul 10 18:16
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MinceR	the idea to replace images with new images to do an update does	Jul 10 18:18
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cubexyz	which programs write to /usr/bin ?	Jul 10 19:03
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Examiner	Dear Dr. Schestowitz, since yesterday the EPO has blacklisted your site.	Jul 10 19:11
Examiner	See the latest comments on http://ipkitten.blogspot.de/2015/06/spy-scandal-epo-hits-news-in-germany.html	Jul 10 19:12
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Firefox 39 Finally Lands in Ubuntu 15.04 After	Jul 10 21:25
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Learn Linux Kernel Device Drivers With Linux	Jul 10 21:26
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TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Ebq9CVLhvs (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 21:26
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today and Yesterday in Techrights	Jul 10 23:00
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TweetTuxMachines	Fixes http://t.co/8yKR1Gi9Z6	Jul 10 23:00
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Firefox 39 Finally Lands in Ubuntu 15.04 After	Jul 10 23:00
TweetTuxMachines	a Long Wait http://t.co/4DjDMIcGI6	Jul 10 23:00
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE Frameworks 5.12.0 Officially Released with	Jul 10 23:41
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE Frameworks 5.12.0 Officially Released with	Jul 10 23:44
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Box computer and Pico-ITX SBC pack i.MX6	Jul 10 23:47
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*TweetTuxMachines @darkday_studios favourited 'Open-Source AMD/NVIDIA GPU Tests On Linux 4.1 +...'		Jul 11 01:42
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines OpenELEC Linux media player includes broadcast	Jul 11 01:42
TweetTuxMachines	TV tuner http://t.co/4uKhFAJMnM	Jul 11 01:42
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 01:42
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n38ev	Jul 11 01:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| OpenELEC Linux media player includes broadcast TV tuner \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 01:42
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	with the NSA using GNU/Linux	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/f1ZrrBFjj0 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n391i	Jul 11 03:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines French Government IT directorate stands its	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	ground : ODF supported, OOXML rejected	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/qVCIObBuN9 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n391j	Jul 11 03:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| French Government IT directorate stands its ground : ODF supported, OOXML rejected \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Open source licensing at GitHub	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/g38sTqkpbn (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n391l	Jul 11 03:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Open source licensing at GitHub \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 03:18
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oiaohm	http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NSA-KDBUS-Credentials It is interesting to see the differnet parties that come out the wood work.	Jul 11 05:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| The NSA Is Looking At Systemd's KDBUS - Phoronix [ http://ur1.ca/n3a35 ]		Jul 11 05:47
TweetTuxMachines	@RamiSilawi RT @tuxmachines: Richard Stallman 'basically'	Jul 11 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux !!!	Jul 11 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/yBl081gzK5 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3adv	Jul 11 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	@RamiSilawi RT @tuxmachines: Richard Stallman 'basically'	Jul 11 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux !!!	Jul 11 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/C3G2otmxgP (linkis.com)	Jul 11 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3adw	Jul 11 06:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linkis.com \| Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux \| Tux Machines - Linkis.com		Jul 11 06:35
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cubexyz	thumbs down once again to the media that can't acknowlegdge the existance of anything beyond Windows and Mac	Jul 11 12:17
cubexyz	society of waste:	Jul 11 12:27
cubexyz	http://upstreampolicy.org/issues/our-throw-away-society/	Jul 11 12:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-upstreampolicy.org \| Our Throw-Away Society \| Upstream [ http://ur1.ca/n3ca7 ]		Jul 11 12:28
oiaohm	cubexyz: Its not that simple	Jul 11 12:41
oiaohm	cubexyz: some of the older computer hardware had lot shorter operational live due to running at clockspeeds higher than the hardware could cope with long term.	Jul 11 12:43
oiaohm	Also more and more is designed as a single part. So single failure that is it.	Jul 11 12:43
cubexyz	the older stuff is more repairable	Jul 11 12:53
cubexyz	also has a lot less integration	Jul 11 12:53
cubexyz	indeed, I'm an "old" computer advocate	Jul 11 12:53
cubexyz	old being P3 area, which really isn't that old	Jul 11 12:54
cubexyz	s/area/era/	Jul 11 12:54
cubexyz	some folks are even fixing very old LCD displays using heat guns	Jul 11 12:54
cubexyz	certainly we can vastly improve the current poor situation	Jul 11 12:55
cubexyz	I would tell people not to overclock	Jul 11 12:56
cubexyz	http://www.maxhost.org/other/computer-longevity.txt	Jul 11 12:57
cubexyz	I admit I only use the amiga once a month	Jul 11 12:57
cubexyz	this is the Dell GX110 I'm typing on now	Jul 11 12:58
cubexyz	so 14 year old computer, just fine for web browsing and IRC	Jul 11 12:58
cubexyz	doesn't get very hot == good longevity	Jul 11 12:59
cubexyz	ok, since the vic-20 is 1981 we know that chips can last over 30 years	Jul 11 13:00
cubexyz	so we'll see how long the P3 stuff can last... I'm guessing it can go another 10 years without a problem	Jul 11 13:01
oiaohm	cubexyz: yep general rule of silcon the cooler it runs the longer it lasts.	Jul 11 13:02
cubexyz	the manufacturers are ridiculous... they suggest replacement every 3 or 4 years	Jul 11 13:03
cubexyz	well, that's great for the manufacturer but crappy for the user	Jul 11 13:03
cubexyz	also wrong -> LCD's last up to 10 years	Jul 11 13:06
cubexyz	the truth is no one really knows	Jul 11 13:06
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cubexyz	one year = 8800 hours	Jul 11 13:09
cubexyz	but it's not on all the time	Jul 11 13:09
oiaohm	LCD do have a mechnical life.	Jul 11 13:15
oiaohm	cubexyz: correct color is a factor most LCD screen lose correct color by about 7 years old.	Jul 11 13:16
oiaohm	cubexyz: basically double the life that people are being told.	Jul 11 13:16
cubexyz	some of those 1970s LCD watches still work	Jul 11 13:18
cubexyz	Microma I think was the first one	Jul 11 13:19
oiaohm	cubexyz: that is black and white.	Jul 11 13:21
cubexyz	sure	Jul 11 13:21
oiaohm	cubexyz: it LCD screens doing shades of grey or shades of color	Jul 11 13:22
oiaohm	That have problems of a mechnical failure to make the differences in color they should with age.	Jul 11 13:22
oiaohm	But that is 7 to 8 years old before that happens.	Jul 11 13:23
cubexyz	I don't suppose they ever made an LCD display for computers that was just on or off	Jul 11 13:23
oiaohm	Yes they did.	Jul 11 13:23
oiaohm	Some of the really early screens were black or while nothing in the middle.	Jul 11 13:24
cubexyz	I remember those laptops with tiny displays	Jul 11 13:24
cubexyz	80x16 text	Jul 11 13:24
cubexyz	TRS-80 Model 100 might be an example actually	Jul 11 13:25
cubexyz	so dot-matrix but no grey shades	Jul 11 13:25
oiaohm	cubexyz: you still buy Monochrome Displays for medical control interfaces.	Jul 11 13:26
gde33	they are very nice to look at	Jul 11 13:27
oiaohm	Yes 15,19 and 21 inch LCD Monochrome is still around cubexyz	Jul 11 13:27
gde33	why are we not printing books with 28 inch pages?	Jul 11 13:27
oiaohm	You do have to be careful not to Mix a LCD Monochrome up with a LCD greyscale in medical devices.	Jul 11 13:28
cubexyz	oiaohm, do you think I could run X on one of those?	Jul 11 13:28
cubexyz	might be an interesting experiment to see if they last a long time	Jul 11 13:28
cubexyz	maybe even run a framebuffer on one	Jul 11 13:29
oiaohm	cubexyz: you can run X on monochrome the question is with your wm choice and application choice like it.	Jul 11 13:29
oiaohm	gde33 human has to carry a book. Its the same reason why a 10inch tablet is not that popular.	Jul 11 13:31
cubexyz	oiaohm, one of those old monochrome LCD displays, I figure it would have used less power then the current colour LCDs?	Jul 11 13:32
cubexyz	those old TRS-80 Model 100's lasted a long time on one battery	Jul 11 13:33
oiaohm	cubexyz: grayscale are simple to get. http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/3Mp-21-inch-2048x1536-LCD-screen_60146345449.html	Jul 11 13:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.alibaba.com \| 3mp 21-inch 2048x1536 Lcd Screen Monochrome Monitor,Ce,Fda Approved,1.5t Mri - Buy Medical Equipment,Led Monitor,Medical Monitor Product on Alibaba.com [ http://ur1.ca/n3crv ]		Jul 11 13:35
gde33	oiaohm: scrolls are awesome tho :D	Jul 11 13:37
oiaohm	cubexyz: pure monochrome are hard to find. Why it such a issue when you mix them up.	Jul 11 13:37
oiaohm	cubexyz: ie a pure monochrome output medical device works with a grayscale monitor.	Jul 11 13:38
oiaohm	cubexyz: but a greyscale output medical device is screwed if you give it a pure monochrome screen.	Jul 11 13:38
cubexyz	oiaohm, I was thinking serial terminal with monochrome LCD	Jul 11 13:38
cubexyz	if such a thing exists	Jul 11 13:38
cubexyz	or even usb terminal	Jul 11 13:40
oiaohm	cubexyz: most are that is DVI-D so in theory add a rasbery pi.	Jul 11 13:40
oiaohm	Colored screens are annoying more often cheaper than monochrome/greyscale screens	Jul 11 13:41
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cubexyz	there's tons of small LCDs	Jul 11 13:52
cubexyz	320x240	Jul 11 13:52
oiaohm	cubexyz: kernel loging is 80 chars.	Jul 11 13:54
oiaohm	cubexyz: or what its optimised for.	Jul 11 13:54
cubexyz	there's USB 2.0 monitors	Jul 11 13:58
cubexyz	1366x768 display	Jul 11 13:59
cubexyz	lightweight and portable	Jul 11 13:59
cubexyz	maybe I can rig up some sort of noveau usb terminal	Jul 11 14:02
MinceR	:)	Jul 11 14:07
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/bigonbe/status/619782977632010240	Jul 11 15:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@bigonbe: @schestowitz The code is open source, anybody can search vulnerabilities in any components. And most will not post in public ML asking Q		Jul 11 15:24
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/ArgosHelpers/status/619813818022129664	Jul 11 15:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@ArgosHelpers: @schestowitz That's fine I'll get the feedback passed onto the store.Again apologies for the wait you had. Ryan		Jul 11 15:24
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines OpenELEC Linux media player includes broadcast	Jul 11 18:56
TweetTuxMachines	TV tuner http://t.co/QPDLNT8FIc	Jul 11 18:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| OpenELEC Linux media player includes broadcast TV tuner · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 11 18:56
TweetTuxMachines	(linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 11 18:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3fd8	Jul 11 18:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines RMS ‘basically’ has no problem with NSA using	Jul 11 18:56
TweetTuxMachines	GNU/Linux http://t.co/OkPUp0gO65	Jul 11 18:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.itworld.com) ‘a program must not restrict	Jul 11 18:56
TweetTuxMachines	what jobs its users do with it’	Jul 11 18:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3fd9	Jul 11 18:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.itworld.com \| Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux \| ITworld		Jul 11 18:56
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/thewtfmagazine/status/619879715189358592 https://twitter.com/LisbethIsAlive/status/619867255581622272	Jul 11 19:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@thewtfmagazine: @stonemirror @grouchosharx You're a stalker, Lefty http://t.co/SkZDkjsB3h		Jul 11 19:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| Richard Stallman and Bruce Perens Defamed by Troll \| Techrights		Jul 11 19:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@LisbethIsAlive: @Cybertario Roy Schestowitz de Techrights y el propio Stallman han criticado duramente a Red Hat por su vinculación con la NSA.		Jul 11 19:27
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/thewtfmagazine/status/619674296286195712	Jul 11 19:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@thewtfmagazine: @stonemirror @Amantisme WELL-STALKED, LEFTY!! XD http://t.co/SkZDkjsB3h		Jul 11 19:28
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition	Jul 11 19:45
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/tfbgF6uFPB (svij.org)	Jul 11 19:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3frz	Jul 11 19:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-svij.org \| Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition		Jul 11 19:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition	Jul 11 19:45
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/NBAmxQEHMj (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 19:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3fs0	Jul 11 19:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 19:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Tin Hats Ready, RMS No Problems Linux Used for	Jul 11 19:46
TweetTuxMachines	Evil http://t.co/3Io54hd39v	Jul 11 19:46
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 19:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Tin Hats Ready, RMS No Problems Linux Used for Evil \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 19:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3fs1	Jul 11 19:46
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/qu1j0t3/status/619941074136645632	Jul 11 19:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@qu1j0t3: Since most of the 12 in this list are white male assholes, let's not hope not too influential https://t.co/tL87NKeqMh		Jul 11 19:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Here are the 12 most influential programmers working today http://t.co/H8ooZIJsaa #rms opening page		Jul 11 19:51
schestowitz	Influence is helped by being white males; different from	Jul 11 19:51
schestowitz	say, 12 most skilled	Jul 11 19:51
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/qu1j0t3/status/619948462243729408 https://twitter.com/qu1j0t3/status/619948564173713409	Jul 11 20:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@qu1j0t3: @schestowitz Also, a number of these are not even programmers.		Jul 11 20:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@qu1j0t3: @schestowitz They might as well have said "12 most famous"... "influential" is usually code for "irrelevant".		Jul 11 20:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition	Jul 11 20:20
TweetTuxMachines	retweeted by http://t.co/NBAmxQEHMj (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 20:20
TweetTuxMachines	@RamiSilawi	Jul 11 20:20
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g3n	Jul 11 20:20
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Point Linux 3.0 Is Out Now. Distro Review	Jul 11 20:20
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/gAs7mFJcIS (linuxpitstop.com)	Jul 11 20:20
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g3o	Jul 11 20:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxpitstop.com \| How to Install Point Linux 3.0 and its prominent Features \| LinuxPitstop		Jul 11 20:20
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines A new crop of stable kernels	Jul 11 20:29
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/o5U9TptO2X (lwn.net)	Jul 11 20:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lwn.net \| A new crop of stable kernels [LWN.net]		Jul 11 20:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g5y	Jul 11 20:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Point Linux 3.0 Is Out Now. Distro Review	Jul 11 20:29
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/1cU6Yt70EW (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 20:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g61	Jul 11 20:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Point Linux 3.0 Is Out Now. Distro Review \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 20:30
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Google Releases Ethernet Adapter for Chromecast	Jul 11 20:30
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/rb1LSkv0pG (www.eweek.com)	Jul 11 20:30
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g63	Jul 11 20:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.eweek.com \| Google Releases Ethernet Adapter for Chromecast		Jul 11 20:30
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/deusexstigma/status/619955158269603840	Jul 11 20:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@deusexstigma: @schestowitz absolute bullshit.		Jul 11 20:46
schestowitz	I saw that a few days ago and needed to puke. Such horrible lies from such horrible media outlets.	Jul 11 20:47
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/deusexstigma/status/619956632298991616	Jul 11 21:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@deusexstigma: @schestowitz unfortunately 'media' outlets who seem to 'soma' -ise the uncritical...		Jul 11 21:15
schestowitz	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMcjoP670so	Jul 11 21:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com \| The Scallies of Manchester - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/n3gkb ]		Jul 11 21:17
schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6317843	Jul 11 21:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: French Government IT directorate stands its ground : #ODF supported, #OOXML rejected https://www.april.org/en/french-government-it-directorate-stands-its-ground-odf-supported-ooxml-rejected Discussion: http://yro.slashdot.org/story/15/07/09/187204/french-government-it-directorate-supports-odf-rejects-ooxml		Jul 11 21:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.april.org \| French Government IT directorate stands its ground : ODF supported, OOXML rejected \| April [ http://ur1.ca/n3gnf ]		Jul 11 21:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> yro.slashdot.org \| French Government IT Directorate Supports ODF, Rejects OOXML - Slashdot [ http://ur1.ca/n2zon ]		Jul 11 21:28
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Google releases second preview of Android M	Jul 11 22:13
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/D2dKPs19Ei (www.zdnet.com)	Jul 11 22:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.zdnet.com \| Google releases second preview of Android M \| ZDNet		Jul 11 22:13
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3gzh	Jul 11 22:13
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Confirmed: America's Army Is Coming Back To	Jul 11 22:13
TweetTuxMachines	Linux http://t.co/kE7HDPoY3N (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 11 22:13
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3gzi	Jul 11 22:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Confirmed: America's Army Is Coming Back To Linux - Phoronix		Jul 11 22:13
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 11/7/2015: Purism Librem 13 Reviewed, KDE	Jul 11 22:13
TweetTuxMachines	Frameworks 5.12.0 is Out http://t.co/QqxqZGlzbd	Jul 11 22:13
TweetTuxMachines	(techrights.org)	Jul 11 22:13
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3gzj	Jul 11 22:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 11/7/2015: Purism Librem 13 Reviewed, KDE Frameworks 5.12.0 is Out \| Techrights		Jul 11 22:13
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schestowitz	> RE: your new page http://techrights.org/2015/07/11/battistelli-blocks-web-sites/	Jul 11 23:26
schestowitz	>	Jul 11 23:26
schestowitz	> "Transmission using Tor and an empty E-mail account can do the trick. We have never let down or betrayed a source (in our decade-old history with many whistleblowers)..."	Jul 11 23:26
schestowitz	>	Jul 11 23:26
schestowitz	> suggestion:	Jul 11 23:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| European Censorship: Tyrants of the EPO Blacklist Techrights, Web Site Not Accessible Office-Wide \| Techrights [ http://ur1.ca/n3hl0 ]		Jul 11 23:26
schestowitz	>	Jul 11 23:26
schestowitz	> Instead of only pointing to Tor, give a hint and link to Tails https://tails.boum.org/ as a secure stand-alone, live system. Much better, much safer to use. Comes with the encryption tools (gpg) which are not present on Windows or Macm, as you certainly know.	Jul 11 23:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-tails.boum.org \| Tails - Privacy for anyone anywhere		Jul 11 23:26
schestowitz	I was going to mention tails, but that requires CD burners and other stuff that some people would feel is too great a task.	Jul 11 23:26
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/crispymint/status/619993478458535937?cn=cmVwbHk%3D&refsrc=email	Jul 11 23:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@crispymint: @schestowitz good post		Jul 11 23:28
BACKUP
*Now talking on #techrights		Jul 07 20:51
*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 07 20:51
*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 07 20:51
*[freenode-info] channel flooding and no channel staff around to help? Please check with freenode support: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#gettinghelp		Jul 07 20:51
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement	Jul 08 00:36
TweetTuxMachines	for Meizu MX4 http://t.co/IwE797tlBV	Jul 08 00:36
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 00:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement for Meizu MX4 \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 00:36
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2bsx	Jul 08 00:36
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jul 8 01:42:20 2015
*Now talking on #techrights		Jul 08 01:42
*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 08 01:42
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**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jul 11 01:56:04 2015
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*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 11 01:56
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	with the NSA using GNU/Linux	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/f1ZrrBFjj0 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n391i	Jul 11 03:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines French Government IT directorate stands its	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	ground : ODF supported, OOXML rejected	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/qVCIObBuN9 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n391j	Jul 11 03:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| French Government IT directorate stands its ground : ODF supported, OOXML rejected \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Open source licensing at GitHub	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/g38sTqkpbn (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 03:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n391l	Jul 11 03:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Open source licensing at GitHub \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 03:18
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oiaohm	http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NSA-KDBUS-Credentials It is interesting to see the differnet parties that come out the wood work.	Jul 11 05:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| The NSA Is Looking At Systemd's KDBUS - Phoronix [ http://ur1.ca/n3a35 ]		Jul 11 05:46
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*Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org \| Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell		Jul 11 08:54
*Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012		Jul 11 08:54
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cubexyz	thumbs down once again to the media that can't acknowlegdge the existance of anything beyond Windows and Mac	Jul 11 12:17
cubexyz	society of waste:	Jul 11 12:27
cubexyz	http://upstreampolicy.org/issues/our-throw-away-society/	Jul 11 12:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-upstreampolicy.org \| Our Throw-Away Society \| Upstream [ http://ur1.ca/n3ca7 ]		Jul 11 12:28
oiaohm	cubexyz: Its not that simple	Jul 11 12:41
oiaohm	cubexyz: some of the older computer hardware had lot shorter operational live due to running at clockspeeds higher than the hardware could cope with long term.	Jul 11 12:43
oiaohm	Also more and more is designed as a single part. So single failure that is it.	Jul 11 12:43
cubexyz	the older stuff is more repairable	Jul 11 12:53
cubexyz	also has a lot less integration	Jul 11 12:53
cubexyz	indeed, I'm an "old" computer advocate	Jul 11 12:53
cubexyz	old being P3 area, which really isn't that old	Jul 11 12:54
cubexyz	s/area/era/	Jul 11 12:54
cubexyz	some folks are even fixing very old LCD displays using heat guns	Jul 11 12:54
cubexyz	certainly we can vastly improve the current poor situation	Jul 11 12:55
cubexyz	I would tell people not to overclock	Jul 11 12:56
cubexyz	http://www.maxhost.org/other/computer-longevity.txt	Jul 11 12:57
cubexyz	I admit I only use the amiga once a month	Jul 11 12:57
cubexyz	this is the Dell GX110 I'm typing on now	Jul 11 12:58
cubexyz	so 14 year old computer, just fine for web browsing and IRC	Jul 11 12:58
cubexyz	doesn't get very hot == good longevity	Jul 11 12:59
cubexyz	ok, since the vic-20 is 1981 we know that chips can last over 30 years	Jul 11 13:00
cubexyz	so we'll see how long the P3 stuff can last... I'm guessing it can go another 10 years without a problem	Jul 11 13:01
oiaohm	cubexyz: yep general rule of silcon the cooler it runs the longer it lasts.	Jul 11 13:02
cubexyz	the manufacturers are ridiculous... they suggest replacement every 3 or 4 years	Jul 11 13:03
cubexyz	well, that's great for the manufacturer but crappy for the user	Jul 11 13:03
cubexyz	also wrong -> LCD's last up to 10 years	Jul 11 13:06
cubexyz	the truth is no one really knows	Jul 11 13:06
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cubexyz	one year = 8800 hours	Jul 11 13:09
cubexyz	but it's not on all the time	Jul 11 13:09
oiaohm	LCD do have a mechnical life.	Jul 11 13:15
oiaohm	cubexyz: correct color is a factor most LCD screen lose correct color by about 7 years old.	Jul 11 13:16
oiaohm	cubexyz: basically double the life that people are being told.	Jul 11 13:16
cubexyz	some of those 1970s LCD watches still work	Jul 11 13:18
cubexyz	Microma I think was the first one	Jul 11 13:19
oiaohm	cubexyz: that is black and white.	Jul 11 13:21
cubexyz	sure	Jul 11 13:21
oiaohm	cubexyz: it LCD screens doing shades of grey or shades of color	Jul 11 13:22
oiaohm	That have problems of a mechnical failure to make the differences in color they should with age.	Jul 11 13:22
oiaohm	But that is 7 to 8 years old before that happens.	Jul 11 13:23
cubexyz	I don't suppose they ever made an LCD display for computers that was just on or off	Jul 11 13:23
oiaohm	Yes they did.	Jul 11 13:23
oiaohm	Some of the really early screens were black or while nothing in the middle.	Jul 11 13:24
cubexyz	I remember those laptops with tiny displays	Jul 11 13:24
cubexyz	80x16 text	Jul 11 13:24
cubexyz	TRS-80 Model 100 might be an example actually	Jul 11 13:25
cubexyz	so dot-matrix but no grey shades	Jul 11 13:25
oiaohm	cubexyz: you still buy Monochrome Displays for medical control interfaces.	Jul 11 13:26
gde33	they are very nice to look at	Jul 11 13:27
oiaohm	Yes 15,19 and 21 inch LCD Monochrome is still around cubexyz	Jul 11 13:27
gde33	why are we not printing books with 28 inch pages?	Jul 11 13:27
oiaohm	You do have to be careful not to Mix a LCD Monochrome up with a LCD greyscale in medical devices.	Jul 11 13:28
cubexyz	oiaohm, do you think I could run X on one of those?	Jul 11 13:28
cubexyz	might be an interesting experiment to see if they last a long time	Jul 11 13:28
cubexyz	maybe even run a framebuffer on one	Jul 11 13:29
oiaohm	cubexyz: you can run X on monochrome the question is with your wm choice and application choice like it.	Jul 11 13:29
oiaohm	gde33 human has to carry a book. Its the same reason why a 10inch tablet is not that popular.	Jul 11 13:31
cubexyz	oiaohm, one of those old monochrome LCD displays, I figure it would have used less power then the current colour LCDs?	Jul 11 13:32
cubexyz	those old TRS-80 Model 100's lasted a long time on one battery	Jul 11 13:33
oiaohm	cubexyz: grayscale are simple to get. http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/3Mp-21-inch-2048x1536-LCD-screen_60146345449.html	Jul 11 13:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.alibaba.com \| 3mp 21-inch 2048x1536 Lcd Screen Monochrome Monitor,Ce,Fda Approved,1.5t Mri - Buy Medical Equipment,Led Monitor,Medical Monitor Product on Alibaba.com [ http://ur1.ca/n3crv ]		Jul 11 13:35
gde33	oiaohm: scrolls are awesome tho :D	Jul 11 13:36
oiaohm	cubexyz: pure monochrome are hard to find. Why it such a issue when you mix them up.	Jul 11 13:37
oiaohm	cubexyz: ie a pure monochrome output medical device works with a grayscale monitor.	Jul 11 13:38
oiaohm	cubexyz: but a greyscale output medical device is screwed if you give it a pure monochrome screen.	Jul 11 13:38
cubexyz	oiaohm, I was thinking serial terminal with monochrome LCD	Jul 11 13:38
cubexyz	if such a thing exists	Jul 11 13:38
cubexyz	or even usb terminal	Jul 11 13:40
oiaohm	cubexyz: most are that is DVI-D so in theory add a rasbery pi.	Jul 11 13:40
oiaohm	Colored screens are annoying more often cheaper than monochrome/greyscale screens	Jul 11 13:41
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cubexyz	there's tons of small LCDs	Jul 11 13:52
cubexyz	320x240	Jul 11 13:52
oiaohm	cubexyz: kernel loging is 80 chars.	Jul 11 13:54
oiaohm	cubexyz: or what its optimised for.	Jul 11 13:54
cubexyz	there's USB 2.0 monitors	Jul 11 13:58
cubexyz	1366x768 display	Jul 11 13:59
cubexyz	lightweight and portable	Jul 11 13:59
cubexyz	maybe I can rig up some sort of noveau usb terminal	Jul 11 14:02
MinceR	:)	Jul 11 14:07
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/bigonbe/status/619782977632010240	Jul 11 15:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@bigonbe: @schestowitz The code is open source, anybody can search vulnerabilities in any components. And most will not post in public ML asking Q		Jul 11 15:24
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/ArgosHelpers/status/619813818022129664	Jul 11 15:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@ArgosHelpers: @schestowitz That's fine I'll get the feedback passed onto the store.Again apologies for the wait you had. Ryan		Jul 11 15:24
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BACKUP
cubexyz	anyone know of a paint program that can extend an image to the left or to the top?	Jul 05 00:51
cubexyz	not stretching but adding new space	Jul 05 00:51
msb__	cubexyz: Can you just insert your image into the middle of a bigger white space?	Jul 05 01:26
cubexyz	no, imagemagick 6 or higher has a better method	Jul 05 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE Plasma 5.3.2 Lands in Kubuntu 15.10 (Wily	Jul 05 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	Werewolf) http://t.co/Yf4uwM88nn	Jul 05 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n09wf	Jul 05 01:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| KDE Plasma 5.3.2 Lands in Kubuntu 15.10 (Wily Werewolf) \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Parsix GNU/Linux 8.0 to Finally Switch to GNOME	Jul 05 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	3.16, Linux Kernel 4.0 http://t.co/octWzZwRZ5	Jul 05 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 01:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Parsix GNU/Linux 8.0 to Finally Switch to GNOME 3.16, Linux Kernel 4.0 \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 01:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n09wg	Jul 05 01:26
cubexyz	e.g. convert file.jpg -splice 0x100 splice_top.jpg	Jul 05 01:27
cubexyz	splices in 100 pixels worth of white space at the top	Jul 05 01:27
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines YotaPhone drops Android for Sailfish OS	Jul 05 03:26
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/bmgNIwxLJg	Jul 05 03:26
TweetTuxMachines	(www.androidauthority.com)	Jul 05 03:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.androidauthority.com \| YotaPhone drops Android for Sailfish OS - Android Authority		Jul 05 03:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0awz	Jul 05 03:26
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines You Can Now Upgrade to Linux Mint 17.2	Jul 05 03:27
TweetTuxMachines	"Rafaela" http://t.co/qyZES9La4C	Jul 05 03:27
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 03:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| You Can Now Upgrade to Linux Mint 17.2 "Rafaela" - Softpedia		Jul 05 03:27
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0ax0	Jul 05 03:27
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 14.10 (Utopic Unicorn) to Reach End of	Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	Life Soon http://t.co/hisrg8q4O9	Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 03:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu 14.10 (Utopic Unicorn) to Reach End of Life Soon - Softpedia		Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0axy	Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Intel Has More Graphics Code For Testing, Plans	Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	For Linux 4.3 http://t.co/fMEVMuDMIv	Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 03:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Intel Has More Graphics Code For Testing, Plans For Linux 4.3 - Phoronix		Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0axz	Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE Plasma 5.3.2 Lands in Kubuntu 15.10 (Wily	Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	Werewolf) http://t.co/IIAQu38yae	Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	(linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 03:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| KDE Plasma 5.3.2 Lands in Kubuntu 15.10 (Wily Werewolf) - Softpedia		Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0ay0	Jul 05 03:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Parsix GNU/Linux 8.0 to Finally Switch to GNOME	Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	3.16, Linux Kernel 4.0 http://t.co/lvmQNviBrI	Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 03:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Parsix GNU/Linux 8.0 to Finally Switch to GNOME 3.16, Linux Kernel 4.0 - Softpedia		Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b1j	Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Docker Machine 0.3.0 Deep Dive	Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/1J8hRjTcJ9 (blog.docker.com)	Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b1k	Jul 05 03:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-blog.docker.com \| Docker Machine 0.3.0 Deep Dive \| Docker Blog		Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project	Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	Leader http://t.co/qRJYtkqOox	Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	(www.mylinuxrig.com)	Jul 05 03:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.mylinuxrig.com \| The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project... - My Linux Rig		Jul 05 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b1l	Jul 05 03:41
*TweetTuxMachines @mccourt_360 favourited 'The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project...'		Jul 05 03:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The July 2015 issue of the PCLinuxOS Magazine	Jul 05 03:50
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/kTv1WtaFvU (lxer.com)	Jul 05 03:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b4n	Jul 05 03:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lxer.com \| LXer: The July 2015 issue of the PCLinuxOS Magazine		Jul 05 03:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project	Jul 05 03:53
TweetTuxMachines	Leader http://t.co/pD2hWSOOKl	Jul 05 03:53
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 03:53
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| The Linux Setup - Neil McGovern, Debian Project Leader \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 03:53
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b5h	Jul 05 03:53
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The July 2015 issue of the PCLinuxOS Magazine	Jul 05 03:53
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/f6FKFEmBOP (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 03:53
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b5i	Jul 05 03:53
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| The July 2015 issue of the PCLinuxOS Magazine \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 03:53
*TweetTuxMachines @tlongren favourited 'Docker Machine 0.3.0 Deep Dive http://t.co/1J8hRjTcJ9'		Jul 05 04:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer	Jul 05 04:05
TweetTuxMachines	in Unity 8, Support for Refunds	Jul 05 04:05
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Q3YsAo7Lkz (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 04:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0b9l	Jul 05 04:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer in Unity 8, Support for Refunds - Softpedia		Jul 05 04:05
*TweetTuxMachines @Ubuntu_topics favourited 'Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer...'		Jul 05 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2 Bringing Support For ARCv2, HS38 CPU	Jul 05 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	Cores http://t.co/JXeqFea011 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	also http://t.co/k9pyWAqFIS (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bcv	Jul 05 04:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Linux 4.2 Bringing Support For ARCv2, HS38 CPU Cores - Phoronix		Jul 05 04:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Radeon & AMDGPU DRM Fixes Queue Up For Linux 4.2 - Phoronix		Jul 05 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Snappy Open House Is Your Chance to Get	Jul 05 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	Familiar with Ubuntu Snappy	Jul 05 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/hQJkcQaEgh (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 04:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bcw	Jul 05 04:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Snappy Open House Is Your Chance to Get Familiar with Ubuntu Snappy - Softpedia		Jul 05 04:16
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines First Ubuntu Snappy Open House Announced,	Jul 05 04:27
TweetTuxMachines	UbuCon Germany Planning Continues	Jul 05 04:27
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/mSjCbxv8c8 (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 04:27
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bgg	Jul 05 04:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| First Ubuntu Snappy Open House Announced, UbuCon Germany Planning Continues - Softpedia		Jul 05 04:27
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Benchmarks Of 54 Different Intel/AMD Linux	Jul 05 04:27
TweetTuxMachines	Systems http://t.co/4tEVpi246l	Jul 05 04:27
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 04:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Benchmarks Of 54 Different Intel/AMD Linux Systems - Phoronix		Jul 05 04:27
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bgh	Jul 05 04:27
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer	Jul 05 04:28
TweetTuxMachines	in Unity 8, Support for Refunds	Jul 05 04:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/NOHo5ISXkN (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 04:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bgk	Jul 05 04:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu Touch OTA-5 Will Bring a New Thumbnailer in Unity 8, Support for Refunds \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 04:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2 Bringing Support For ARCv2, HS38 CPU	Jul 05 04:28
TweetTuxMachines	Cores http://t.co/dmwhdkIvCB	Jul 05 04:28
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 04:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux 4.2 Bringing Support For ARCv2, HS38 CPU Cores \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 04:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bgm	Jul 05 04:28
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Snappy Open House Is Your Chance to Get	Jul 05 05:08
TweetTuxMachines	Familiar with Ubuntu Snappy	Jul 05 05:08
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/nhksLI1liG (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 05:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bt5	Jul 05 05:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Snappy Open House Is Your Chance to Get Familiar with Ubuntu Snappy \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 05:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Benchmarks Of 54 Different Intel/AMD Linux	Jul 05 05:08
TweetTuxMachines	Systems http://t.co/fQNxomw5QK	Jul 05 05:08
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 05:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0bt6	Jul 05 05:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Benchmarks Of 54 Different Intel/AMD Linux Systems \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 05:08
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r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/DaveGaleUK/status/617656087815319553	Jul 05 10:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@DaveGaleUK: @schestowitz Plenty more where that came from: https://t.co/Rxcztlwwca		Jul 05 10:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> tadag.wordpress.com \| History \| tadag - Trusted Authenticated Domains and Gateways		Jul 05 10:15
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/mellenoweth/status/617683351042957314	Jul 05 10:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mellenoweth: @schestowitz looked it up, very interesting!		Jul 05 10:16
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/spastri/status/617710197369274368	Jul 05 11:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@spastri: @schestowitz and people are fed up with them! #Greece #referendum #NO		Jul 05 11:05
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/spastri/status/617710416492277760	Jul 05 11:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@spastri: "Greece's majority outlets are owned by corporate titans and other oligarchs" and people are fed up with them! https://t.co/KZJ0tET9JA		Jul 05 11:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: "Greece's biggest news outlets are owned by corporate titans and other "oligarchs"" http://t.co/ivZqITiSPH #greece		Jul 05 11:05
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/saitta_chris/status/617710752338542592	Jul 05 11:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@saitta_chris: @schestowitz That will all be eating Chinese food soon		Jul 05 11:06
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*TweetTuxMachines @LukeVizzicks followed @tuxmachines		Jul 05 11:26
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2 Offers Performance Improvements For	Jul 05 11:26
TweetTuxMachines	Non-Transparent Bridging http://t.co/waTQcRkVJc	Jul 05 11:26
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 11:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0erm	Jul 05 11:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux 4.2 Offers Performance Improvements For Non-Transparent Bridging \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 11:26
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/saitta_chris/status/617712899633491968	Jul 05 11:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@saitta_chris: @schestowitz I think Greece, Turkey, Italy, Egypt, Cyprus, Spain, Portugal, Ireland should create their own Union, UK and France are welcome		Jul 05 11:30
r_schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6297117	Jul 05 11:33
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: #snowden did not pass documents electronically to journalists; did it in person in #hk after communicating not so securely with Greenwald		Jul 05 11:33
r_schestowitz	"	Jul 05 11:33
r_schestowitz	You can watch the download using rsync (with Tails) in the film Citizenfour. Snowden typed a passphrase out of sight of everyone in the room to start the second transfer. It was interesting to me that he confidently said he couldn’t be compelled to give up the documents. I suspect he provided a way to make it impossible for him to get to the documents after he had passed them on to Poitras and Greenwald.	Jul 05 11:33
r_schestowitz	I’ve been thinking how I would make something like that happen. I think the best way would be to copy the documents to a virtual machine, and then remotely restart that machine when I was sure the documents were copied to Greenwald’s SD cards. (We see him pull one SD card out and replace it with another. He then says something about marking one of them with a Sharpie to keep the two (with similar directory structure) from being	Jul 05 11:33
r_schestowitz	confused. Greenwald booted Tails from a memory stick. We see that happen too.	Jul 05 11:33
r_schestowitz	Snowden didn’t take the documents to Moscow; he didn’t even take a physical copy to Hong Kong. Schneier speculates that something may have been copied surreptitiously from Greenwald by one or more governments. Greenwald admits his lack of understanding to computer security and encryption in his book. I’d use Tails booted from the DVD when I wanted to read and copy from the documents. I’d keep the whole cache on SD cards or memory	Jul 05 11:33
r_schestowitz	sticks with one, LUKS-encrypted EXT4 partition. I’d decrypt the files only after I’d copied them to Tails home directory. I’d never let the unencrypted stuff touch a storage medium.	Jul 05 11:33
r_schestowitz	For more info, read No Place to Hide, by Greenwald.	Jul 05 11:33
r_schestowitz	"	Jul 05 11:33
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Lava to Launch Google Android One 2.0	Jul 05 11:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/QASgLhGaZ5 (www.ibtimes.co.in)	Jul 05 11:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f0s	Jul 05 11:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.ibtimes.co.in \| Lava to Launch Google Android One 2.0 Series with Mid-Range Specifications in Mid-July: Report		Jul 05 11:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence	Jul 05 11:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Us58fLVmdP (www.fool.com)	Jul 05 11:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f0t	Jul 05 11:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.fool.com \| Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence -- The Motley Fool		Jul 05 11:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Is Android the New Windows?	Jul 05 11:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/wudYVczsmL (recode.net)	Jul 05 11:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f0u	Jul 05 11:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-recode.net \| Is Android the New Windows? \| Re/code		Jul 05 11:56
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Report: Better Android One devices to launch in	Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	India, cost $189 http://t.co/BaG9Sr7dNi	Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	(arstechnica.com)	Jul 05 12:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-arstechnica.com \| Report: Better Android One devices to launch in India, cost $189 \| Ars Technica		Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f7o	Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The Android Version Of The Dolphin Nintendo	Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	Gamecube/Wii Emulator Is Coming Along Nicely -	Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	Here It Is Running http://t.co/RE7E2GEKNT	Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	(www.androidpolice.com)	Jul 05 12:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.androidpolice.com \| The Android Version Of The Dolphin Nintendo Gamecube/Wii Emulator Is Coming Along Nicely - Here It Is Running On A SHIELD TV		Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f7p	Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Is this Blackberry's Android phone? Leaked	Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	image reveals curved 'Venice' handset	Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sGRt8a9ka9 (www.dailymail.co.uk)	Jul 05 12:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.dailymail.co.uk \| Blackberry's curved 'Venice' Android phone in leaked image \| Daily Mail Online		Jul 05 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0f7q	Jul 05 12:17
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence	Jul 05 13:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/I9PoQTg1te (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 13:31
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0fxc	Jul 05 13:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 13:31
*TweetTuxMachines @speedytux retweeted @tuxmachines: 'Samsung Continues to Lessen Android Dependence http://t.co/I9PoQTg1te'		Jul 05 13:31
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XRevan86	https://xakep.ru/2011/12/26/58104 Interesting story. In Russian though.	Jul 05 17:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Couldn't resolve host 'xakep.ru' ( status 0 @ https://xakep.ru/2011/12/26/58104 )		Jul 05 17:26
XRevan86	I can't find it in English.	Jul 05 17:26
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Debian/TeX Live 2015.20150703-1	Jul 05 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/BBtF4mL71A (www.preining.info)	Jul 05 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0iew	Jul 05 17:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.preining.info \| Debian/TeX Live 2015.20150703-1 \| There and back again		Jul 05 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines gnome Donations within the EU are now handled	Jul 05 18:45
TweetTuxMachines	through the Wau Holland Foundation	Jul 05 18:45
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/rexvq212iq (www.gnome.org)	Jul 05 18:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0iui	Jul 05 18:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gnome.org \| Donations within the EU are now handled through the Wau Holland Foundation – GNOME		Jul 05 18:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2 Offers Performance Improvements For	Jul 05 18:46
TweetTuxMachines	Non-Transparent Bridging http://t.co/MOpCnqh7xu	Jul 05 18:46
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 05 18:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Linux 4.2 Offers Performance Improvements For Non-Transparent Bridging - Phoronix		Jul 05 18:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0iuj	Jul 05 18:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines illume OS 3 Linux Distro Officially Released,	Jul 05 18:46
TweetTuxMachines	Based on Debian 8.1 "Jessie"	Jul 05 18:46
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/f1gBQLI2cv (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 05 18:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0iuk	Jul 05 18:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| illume OS 3 Linux Distro Officially Released, Based on Debian 8.1 "Jessie" - Softpedia		Jul 05 18:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines LibreOffice 5, a foundation for the future	Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/bvkIy5XWtG (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0j7q	Jul 05 19:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| LibreOffice 5, a foundation for the future \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines illume OS 3 Linux Distro Officially Released,	Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	Based on Debian 8.1 "Jessie"	Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/QpENJjvKOo (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0j7r	Jul 05 19:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| illume OS 3 Linux Distro Officially Released, Based on Debian 8.1 "Jessie" \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Do Your Prefer Modern Or Traditional Linux	Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	Desktop Environments? http://t.co/YGXzhzWUmn	Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 05 19:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Do Your Prefer Modern Or Traditional Linux Desktop Environments? \| Tux Machines		Jul 05 19:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0j7s	Jul 05 19:28
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2-rc1 http://t.co/YmUqeqNKu7	Jul 06 01:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 01:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0m9u	Jul 06 01:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux 4.2-rc1 \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 01:05
TweetTuxMachines	@jfoxdev @tuxmachines Ugh 4.2 already? I'm still trying	Jul 06 01:05
TweetTuxMachines	to patch fglrx for 4.1!	Jul 06 01:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0m9v	Jul 06 01:05
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Brushfire Games On Their Linux Sales For	Jul 06 03:48
TweetTuxMachines	Shipwreck & Their Thoughts On Linux	Jul 06 03:48
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/TKTbUqHMNK (www.gamingonlinux.com)	Jul 06 03:48
TweetTuxMachines	"4.40% Linux"	Jul 06 03:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0ncs	Jul 06 03:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gamingonlinux.com \| Brushfire Games On Their Linux Sales For Shipwreck & Their Thoughts On Linux \| GamingOnLinux		Jul 06 03:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "It's good to see another Daedalic published	Jul 06 03:49
TweetTuxMachines	game made available for Linux."	Jul 06 03:49
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/cbQl0mugXH (www.gamingonlinux.com)	Jul 06 03:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0ncv	Jul 06 03:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gamingonlinux.com \| Point-And-Click Adventure 'Anna's Quest' Released On GOG And Steam For Linux \| GamingOnLinux		Jul 06 03:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Do Your Prefer Modern Or Traditional Linux	Jul 06 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	Desktop Environments? http://t.co/Sw81PZFv5o	Jul 06 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	(www.everydaylinuxuser.com)	Jul 06 04:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.everydaylinuxuser.com \| Do Your Prefer Modern Or Traditional Linux Desktop Environments? « Everyday Linux User		Jul 06 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nh0	Jul 06 04:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux 4.2-rc1 http://t.co/tckvBY3MPN	Jul 06 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	(lkml.iu.edu)	Jul 06 04:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lkml.iu.edu \| Linux-Kernel Archive: Linux 4.2-rc1		Jul 06 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nh1	Jul 06 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Systemd 222 Will Do Away With Its Accelerometer	Jul 06 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sK0vJzmMRY (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 06 04:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nh3	Jul 06 04:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Systemd 222 Will Do Away With Its Accelerometer - Phoronix		Jul 06 04:03
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The Many New Features Of The Linux 4.2 Kernel	Jul 06 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/HgjlTY1rrc (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 06 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nuk	Jul 06 04:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| New Features Of The Linux 4.2 Kernel - Phoronix		Jul 06 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 6/7/2015: Linux 4.2-rc1, YotaPhone Picks	Jul 06 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	SailfishOS http://t.co/h7383tGHZd	Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	(techrights.org)	Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nul	Jul 06 04:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 6/7/2015: Linux 4.2-rc1, YotaPhone Picks Sailfish OS \| Techrights		Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android Leftovers http://t.co/3HTAhO6yce	Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 04:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Android Leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0num	Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Gaming http://t.co/9peTEEg6Ts	Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 04:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Gaming \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nup	Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's howtos http://t.co/35itRYGi7h	Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nuq	Jul 06 04:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's howtos \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Software http://t.co/3JREhhCmpI	Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 04:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Software \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 04:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0nur	Jul 06 04:49
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's leftovers http://t.co/dbG2Y90bAv	Jul 06 08:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 08:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 08:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0pkb	Jul 06 08:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/9oD0eHqa43	Jul 06 08:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 08:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 08:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0pkc	Jul 06 08:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/E99NWP9DBr	Jul 06 08:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 08:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0pkd	Jul 06 08:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 08:05
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roy__	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618092428390608896	Jul 06 12:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz (price of syccess...?)		Jul 06 12:24
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roy__	https://twitter.com/readergordonbp/status/618095784395935744	Jul 06 12:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@readergordonbp: @schestowitz PC World are learning - they're a lot better than they used to be. Some of the staff have even heard of Linux! :-)		Jul 06 12:35
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gde33	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDMOdaJMruM	Jul 06 13:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com \| The Network of Global Corporate Control June 2 & 23 - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/n0tdm ]		Jul 06 13:42
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roy__	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6297742	Jul 06 14:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Not a Diaspora post?		Jul 06 14:19
roy__	""We just want to ensure that terrorists anyone do not have a safe space in which to communicate. That is the challenge, and it is a challenge that will come in front of the House."	Jul 06 14:19
roy__	"So he’s admtting that he’s making the internet totally unsafe.'	Jul 06 14:19
roy__	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6297552	Jul 06 14:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Greek town of Livadeia switched to #LibreOffice https://joinup.ec.europa.eu/node/144304 #odf #freesw #greece		Jul 06 14:20
roy__	"They should have enabled TLS, while at it."	Jul 06 14:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> joinup.ec.europa.eu \| Greek town of Livadeia switched to LibreOffice \| Joinup		Jul 06 14:20
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software	Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/kT0KbsYVbx (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0uho	Jul 06 15:22
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Firefox 40 to Bring Better Performance,	Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	Scrolling, and Graphics on Linux	Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/wnUI3yUj8e (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0uhr	Jul 06 15:22
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Firefox 40 to Bring Better Performance, Scrolling, and Graphics on Linux \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux Mint 17.2 launches with big Cinnamon and	Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	MATE desktop improvements	Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ypwPIkSDd6 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 15:22
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0uhs	Jul 06 15:22
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux Mint 17.2 launches with big Cinnamon and MATE desktop improvements \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 15:22
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines GNOME's Photos App to Receive Editing, Import,	Jul 06 16:10
TweetTuxMachines	and Sharing Features http://t.co/7wUGIQtmfO	Jul 06 16:10
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 16:10
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| GNOME's Photos App to Receive Editing, Import, and Sharing Features \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 16:10
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0uzp	Jul 06 16:10
*TweetTuxMachines @MarketingCor favourited 'Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software http://t.co/kT0KbsYVbx'		Jul 06 16:10
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 4MLinux 13.0 Operating System Has a Highly	Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	Customized JWM Experience	Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/W6yXzihYNc (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0xih	Jul 06 17:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 4MLinux 13.0 Operating System Has a Highly Customized JWM Experience \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Solus OS Gets UEFI Fixes and Better Power	Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	Consumption for Laptops http://t.co/abrZPUKfUA	Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 17:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Solus OS Gets UEFI Fixes and Better Power Consumption for Laptops \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0xil	Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Python and Raspberry Pi in education	Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/8BB3ZVNLbC (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 17:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n0xiq	Jul 06 17:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Python and Raspberry Pi in education \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 17:09
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*TweetTuxMachines @developrise favourited 'Python and Raspberry Pi in education http://t.co/8BB3ZVNLbC'		Jul 06 17:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines It's Now Easier Managing Systemd In KDE	Jul 06 17:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/gybrWBmObd (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 17:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n12km	Jul 06 17:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| It's Now Easier Managing Systemd In KDE \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 17:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Next Tizen Smartphone, Samsung Z3 SM-Z300H,	Jul 06 17:55
TweetTuxMachines	Imported to india for Testing	Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4LlaofUTKd (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n12lm	Jul 06 17:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Next Tizen Smartphone, Samsung Z3 SM-Z300H, Imported to india for Testing \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines GPS Navigation for Ubuntu Touch Gets More	Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	Features http://t.co/ajS4DNvlIi	Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n12lw	Jul 06 17:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| GPS Navigation for Ubuntu Touch Gets More Features \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for	Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	Unity 8 - Video http://t.co/14ZFYUriIe	Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 17:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for Unity 8 - Video \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 17:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n12m4	Jul 06 17:56
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/ArrowSparrow/status/618203357514051584	Jul 06 19:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@ArrowSparrow: @schestowitz we have no time all these activities. You are Pro.		Jul 06 19:45
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AdmFubar	hi all thought I'd pass this along in case is hasn't been seen	Jul 06 20:58
AdmFubar	http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/privacy-personal	Jul 06 20:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxjournal.com \| Privacy Is Personal \| Linux Journal [ http://ur1.ca/n1az1 ]		Jul 06 20:58
AdmFubar	laters	Jul 06 20:58
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for	Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	Unity 8 - Video http://t.co/S9Cz35Lxva	Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 21:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 403 @ http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/77742?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter )		Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1b26	Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Speech recognition and synthesis shield runs	Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	Linux http://t.co/CcQJJUl916	Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 21:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Speech recognition and synthesis shield runs Linux \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1b27	Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines An Introduction to Linux Containers	Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/vO3e1nCYbS (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 06 21:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1b2a	Jul 06 21:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| An Introduction to Linux Containers \| Tux Machines		Jul 06 21:08
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oiaohm	http://www.scrye.com/wordpress/nirik/2015/07/06/gnome-on-wayland-testing/ interesting progress	Jul 07 03:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.scrye.com \| Kevin's musings » gnome on wayland testing [ http://ur1.ca/n1dwq ]		Jul 07 03:09
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/reptoidz/status/618282510443659264	Jul 07 03:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@reptoidz: @schestowitz there is no "patent extortion" it's the law. Android doesn't need exfat support to function. That's for SD cards.		Jul 07 03:20
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software	Jul 07 03:33
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4jPL7LFC0q (www.datamation.com)	Jul 07 03:33
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e2g	Jul 07 03:33
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.datamation.com \| Audio-Video Production On Linux: Best Software - Datamation		Jul 07 03:33
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Firefox 40 to Bring Better Performance,	Jul 07 03:36
TweetTuxMachines	Scrolling, and Graphics on Linux	Jul 07 03:36
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/b3UDrX9GmT (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 03:36
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e3j	Jul 07 03:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Firefox 40 to Bring Better Performance, Scrolling, and Graphics on Linux - Softpedia		Jul 07 03:36
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines GNOME's Photos App to Receive Editing, Import,	Jul 07 03:36
TweetTuxMachines	and Sharing Features http://t.co/OtjeMEk8Oa	Jul 07 03:36
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 03:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| GNOME's Photos App to Receive Editing, Import, and Sharing Features - Softpedia		Jul 07 03:36
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e3k	Jul 07 03:36
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux Mint 17.2 launches with big Cinnamon and	Jul 07 03:37
TweetTuxMachines	MATE desktop improvements	Jul 07 03:37
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/RO4b8DhU5W (www.pcworld.com)	Jul 07 03:37
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e3l	Jul 07 03:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pcworld.com \| Linux Mint 17.2 launches with big Cinnamon and MATE desktop improvements \| PCWorld		Jul 07 03:37
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 4MLinux 13.0 Operating System Has a Highly	Jul 07 03:37
TweetTuxMachines	Customized JWM Experience	Jul 07 03:37
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/MN97GikSrD (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 03:37
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e3m	Jul 07 03:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| 4MLinux 13.0 Operating System Has a Highly Customized JWM Experience - Softpedia		Jul 07 03:37
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Solus OS Gets UEFI Fixes and Better Power	Jul 07 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	Consumption for Laptops http://t.co/YqqJxl2EOH	Jul 07 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 03:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Solus OS Gets UEFI Fixes and Better Power Consumption for Laptops - Softpedia		Jul 07 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e53	Jul 07 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Python and Raspberry Pi in education	Jul 07 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ft78KzkIFl (opensource.com)	Jul 07 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e54	Jul 07 03:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-opensource.com \| Raspberry Pi and Python in education \| Opensource.com		Jul 07 03:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Oxide Vulnerabilities Closed in Ubuntu OSes	Jul 07 03:42
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/kwMjnp1xNi (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 03:42
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e55	Jul 07 03:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Oxide Vulnerabilities Closed in Ubuntu OSes - Softpedia		Jul 07 03:42
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines It's Now Easier Managing Systemd In KDE	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Jz1VRvNel5 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	performance poor since I moved to it (not by	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	choice)	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e62	Jul 07 03:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| It's Now Easier Managing Systemd In KDE - Phoronix		Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Next Tizen Smartphone, Samsung Z3 SM-Z300H,	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	Imported to india for Testing	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/nKi3FUIEER (www.tizenexperts.com)	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e63	Jul 07 03:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tizenexperts.com \| Next Tizen Smartphone, Samsung Z3 SM-Z300H, Imported to india for TestingTizen Experts		Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines GPS Navigation for Ubuntu Touch Gets More	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	Features http://t.co/z2uoLDVBWt	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	(linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 03:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| GPS Navigation for Ubuntu Touch Gets More Features - Softpedia		Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e64	Jul 07 03:44
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for	Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	Unity 8 - Video http://t.co/W3jK8drYX0	Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	(linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 03:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu Developers Working on Feature Parity for Unity 8 - Video - Softpedia		Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e8r	Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Speech recognition and synthesis shield runs	Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	Linux http://t.co/yzuP8eSemw (linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 07 03:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| Speech recognition and synthesis shield runs Linux · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e8s	Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines An Introduction to Linux Containers	Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/CgTowqQ3gk	Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	(www.smallbusinesscomputing.com)	Jul 07 03:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.smallbusinesscomputing.com \| An Introduction to Linux Containers		Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1e8t	Jul 07 03:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Containers change the game	Jul 07 04:15
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/miyVZ1FSMm (www.infoworld.com)	Jul 07 04:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.infoworld.com \| Containers create composable applications		Jul 07 04:15
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/CJZ5zqxYB5 (www.dbta.com)	Jul 07 04:15
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1ehg	Jul 07 04:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.dbta.com \| IBM Rolls Out Docker-Based Container Services - Database Trends and Applications		Jul 07 04:15
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Structuring RedHat’s pipeline to deliver	Jul 07 04:15
TweetTuxMachines	consistent results http://t.co/dqtQzqksQV	Jul 07 04:15
TweetTuxMachines	(siliconangle.com)	Jul 07 04:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-siliconangle.com \| Structuring RedHat’s pipeline to deliver consistent results \| #RHSummit \| SiliconANGLE		Jul 07 04:15
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1ehh	Jul 07 04:15
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/mdouka/status/618335399480406017	Jul 07 04:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mdouka: Free and Open-Source Video Editor Shotcut Gets Better 4K Support http://t.co/d5EOgNooXw via @rightrelevance thanks @schestowitz		Jul 07 04:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> news.softpedia.com \| Free and Open-Source Video Editor Shotcut Gets Better 4K Support - Softpedia		Jul 07 04:39
*TweetTuxMachines @mccourt_360 favourited 'Structuring RedHat’s pipeline to deliver consistent results http://t.co/dqtQzqksQV'		Jul 07 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux on the desktop is so hot there's now a	Jul 07 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	fight over it http://t.co/YmXaPOFbbU	Jul 07 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	(www.theregister.co.uk)	Jul 07 04:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theregister.co.uk \| Linux on the desktop is so hot there's now a fight over it • The Register		Jul 07 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1esk	Jul 07 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat http://t.co/XudZE0szqm	Jul 07 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 04:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Red Hat \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1esl	Jul 07 04:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Containers http://t.co/0SfT6A8GVv	Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1exu	Jul 07 05:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Containers \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux on the desktop is so hot there's now a	Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	fight over it http://t.co/TYlwRwfUId	Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 05:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux on the desktop is so hot there's now a fight over it \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1exv	Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines How I Discovered Linux & Changed the World	Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/16HhL4XEjk (fossforce.com)	Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1exy	Jul 07 05:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-fossforce.com \| How I Discovered Linux & Changed the World \| FOSS Force		Jul 07 05:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines New Features Of The Linux 4.2 Kernel	Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/C1nsRZohhP (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1f0n	Jul 07 05:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| New Features Of The Linux 4.2 Kernel - Phoronix		Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Xbox Wireless Controller LEDs Work On Linux 4.2	Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/h7eShlYuO5 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1f0o	Jul 07 05:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Thanks Valve, Xbox Wireless Controller LEDs Work On Linux 4.2 - Phoronix		Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "inconvenient to use port 443 for SSH, because	Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	it meant I couldn't host secure Web sites on	Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	that server." http://t.co/USa3O2NkiA	Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	(www.linuxjournal.com)	Jul 07 05:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxjournal.com \| One Port to Rule Them All! \| Linux Journal		Jul 07 05:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1f0p	Jul 07 05:17
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msb__	A favorite song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TvfBxIkupA	Jul 07 05:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com \| Phil Ochs - Ballad Of The Carpenter - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/n1f7x ]		Jul 07 05:44
msb__	"Come all you working men, farmers and weavers too: If you could only stand as one, this world belongs to you."	Jul 07 05:47
msb__	"Two thousand years have passed and gone, many a hero too, but the dream of this poor carpenter remains in the hands of you."	Jul 07 05:52
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines LliureX 15.05 Screencast and Screenshots	Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/3K2kr170ay (www.linuxquestions.org)	Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flo	Jul 07 06:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxquestions.org \| LliureX 15.05 Screencast and Screenshots		Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines It's Been Five Months Since I Left Ubuntu For	Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	Fedora On My Main Workstation	Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/I9mGnKUh0U (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flp	Jul 07 06:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| It's Been Five Months Since I Left Ubuntu For Fedora On My Main Workstation - Phoronix		Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	@sopadebits RT @tuxmachines Windows Could Receive a Hard	Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	Blow As Linux Is Finally Being Considered for	Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	ATMs http://t.co/gKMzoeMzXf	Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 06:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Windows Could Receive a Hard Blow As Linux Is Finally Being Considered for ATMs - Softpedia		Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flq	Jul 07 06:34
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux provides career transition after military	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	service http://t.co/dkLiubml1g	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fls	Jul 07 06:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linux provides career transition after military service \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Kernel http://t.co/a2jfjqCk9B	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flt	Jul 07 06:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Kernel \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines openSUSE Leap 42 Is a New Version That Will	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	Change the openSUSE Project	Jul 07 06:35
cubexyz	wasn't linux already used for ATMs?	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/aksdQe2lcb (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flu	Jul 07 06:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| openSUSE Leap 42 Is a New Version That Will Change the openSUSE Project \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Lenovo ThinkPad L450 comes with Ubuntu	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/tmUYZwRglm (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 06:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1flv	Jul 07 06:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Lenovo ThinkPad L450 comes with Ubuntu \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 06:35
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cubexyz	Indian banks use linux based ATMs since 2014	Jul 07 06:57
cubexyz	also Brazil, since 2008	Jul 07 06:58
cubexyz	and ATMs existed before Microsoft	Jul 07 06:59
cubexyz	more of a case of people not knowing history	Jul 07 07:00
cubexyz	maybe they think computers didn't exist before Microsoft, lol	Jul 07 07:00
cubexyz	check Banrisul, the largest bank in southern Brazil...	Jul 07 07:03
cubexyz	they actually went from MSDOS to Linux	Jul 07 07:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines EC publishes open source code of legislation	Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	editor http://t.co/AtCpP6b67p	Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 07:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| EC publishes open source code of legislation editor \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fug	Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines LibreOffice 5.0: A Unique Release	Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/WdOC5ekxMm (ostatic.com)	Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fuh	Jul 07 07:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ostatic.com \| LibreOffice 5.0: A Unique Release		Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Kernel Summit 2015: Call for Proposals	Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/D1UuOD4RaJ (lwn.net)	Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fuk	Jul 07 07:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lwn.net \| Kernel Summit 2015: Call for Proposals [LWN.net]		Jul 07 07:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Kernel 3.19.8 CKT2 Has Been Released	Jul 07 07:06
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/AZZ8c78i4G (linuxg.net)	Jul 07 07:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fv8	Jul 07 07:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxg.net \| Kernel 3.19.8 CKT2 Has Been Released \| LinuxG.net		Jul 07 07:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux provides career transition after military	Jul 07 07:06
TweetTuxMachines	service http://t.co/oemGwSyUeY (opensource.com)	Jul 07 07:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fv9	Jul 07 07:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-opensource.com \| Chase Crum shares his Linux story \| Opensource.com		Jul 07 07:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Lenovo ThinkPad L450 comes with Ubuntu	Jul 07 07:06
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/a5LPa04VoN (indianexpress.com)	Jul 07 07:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1fva	Jul 07 07:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-indianexpress.com \| Lenovo ThinkPad L450 comes with Ubuntu \| The Indian Express		Jul 07 07:06
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 7/7/2015: Lenovo ThinkPad With GNU/Linux,	Jul 07 07:30
TweetTuxMachines	More Containers Hype http://t.co/YYPwlk84oe	Jul 07 07:30
TweetTuxMachines	(techrights.org)	Jul 07 07:30
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1g26	Jul 07 07:30
*TweetTuxMachines @Miladsob favourited 'Linux provides career transition after military service http://t.co/oemGwSyUeY'		Jul 07 07:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 7/7/2015: Lenovo ThinkPad With GNU/Linux, More Containers Hype \| Techrights		Jul 07 07:30
msb__	Suse Leap42: It will be coded in Esperanto and executed by a midget inside your computer.	Jul 07 07:34
cubexyz	oiaohm, another observation about X...	Jul 07 08:41
cubexyz	under certain conditions the text screen can be transformed into a corrupted X screen	Jul 07 08:42
cubexyz	then /sbin/modprobe radeonfb fixes it	Jul 07 08:43
cubexyz	no idea why it happens, don't even understand why loading radeonfb fixes it	Jul 07 08:43
oiaohm	cubexyz: it called memory miss management.	Jul 07 08:44
cubexyz	any idea why loading radeonfb returns the text console to normal?	Jul 07 08:44
oiaohm	X11 and framebuffer are in fact bothing running at the same time.	Jul 07 08:44
oiaohm	The Linux text based console is in fact done to framebuffer.	Jul 07 08:45
oiaohm	So reloading the radeonfb causes the framebuffer stuff to reset.	Jul 07 08:45
oiaohm	Basically we need to get off framebuffer and dri and on to pure KMS.	Jul 07 08:46
cubexyz	I guess one could look at the radeonfb code and try to puzzle it out	Jul 07 08:46
oiaohm	cubexyz: loading any fb driver that works with the card would trigger the fix.	Jul 07 08:46
cubexyz	also the text is pulled to left	Jul 07 08:46
oiaohm	AMD/ATI cards are known for o my god I leaked data.	Jul 07 08:47
oiaohm	cubexyz: I guess what using closed source amd driver.	Jul 07 08:47
cubexyz	I can jig things over with "fbset -move right"	Jul 07 08:48
oiaohm	cubexyz: I mostly run NVIDIA	Jul 07 08:48
cubexyz	old CRT so who knows :)	Jul 07 08:48
oiaohm	or Intel	Jul 07 08:48
cubexyz	you don't use open source video driver?	Jul 07 08:49
oiaohm	cubexyz: open source intel.	Jul 07 08:49
cubexyz	I got to make my own distro someday	Jul 07 08:49
oiaohm	I am hoping AMDGPU unified driver a lot last fixes the AMD super leak in new cards.	Jul 07 08:50
oiaohm	lot/long	Jul 07 08:50
cubexyz	there must be some default framebuffer for text?	Jul 07 08:51
MinceR	systemd will have one :>	Jul 07 08:51
cubexyz	doesn't seem to be a module (I can't see one)	Jul 07 08:51
oiaohm	cubexyz: Linux writes it text into screen by framebuffer.	Jul 07 08:51
MinceR	it will occasionally require you to reboot, though :>	Jul 07 08:51
oiaohm	cubexyz: planned to be replaced at some point by KMSCON	Jul 07 08:51
cubexyz	radeonfb doesn't show up in process status either	Jul 07 08:54
cubexyz	part of X I guess	Jul 07 08:55
oiaohm	No radeonfb is part of kernel.	Jul 07 08:56
oiaohm	cubexyz: lsmod should show it.	Jul 07 08:57
oiaohm	cubexyz: kernel modules don't exactly appear in process table.	Jul 07 08:57
oiaohm	cubexyz: this is a Linux long term project https://dvdhrm.wordpress.com/2012/08/12/killing-off-config_vt/	Jul 07 08:59
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-dvdhrm.wordpress.com \| Deprecating CONFIG_VT \| Ponyhof [ http://ur1.ca/n1grl ]		Jul 07 08:59
MinceR	if people miss having to reboot so much, why don't they go back to windows?	Jul 07 09:01
MinceR	"This definitely needs to be replaced by a more internationalized console."	Jul 07 09:02
MinceR	somebody needs to be told about windowing systems	Jul 07 09:02
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oiaohm	MinceR: part of moving vt to userspace is so a console death is not kernel panic as well.	Jul 07 09:04
MinceR	apparently they also want to bloat the VT so it couldn't be used for troubleshooting if it didn't die	Jul 07 09:05
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oiaohm	MinceR: if the shell is dead a workign VT is not much use.	Jul 07 09:06
MinceR	i can log in again and have another shell start	Jul 07 09:06
oiaohm	Not if the shell is truly dead.	Jul 07 09:08
MinceR	so just because another part of the system can fail, we should make the VT much more fragile?	Jul 07 09:09
oiaohm	MinceR: think X11 death	Jul 07 09:09
MinceR	sounds like typical systemd argumentation	Jul 07 09:09
oiaohm	kmscon is before systemd.	Jul 07 09:09
oiaohm	there is also fblog what is kernel loging massively simplifed.	Jul 07 09:10
MinceR	"but these other pieces of software have these design flaws too, so we _must_ implement those design flaws here as well!"	Jul 07 09:10
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oiaohm	kmscon when you do a SAK will be terminated and cleaned.	Jul 07 09:10
oiaohm	Basically fblog stays in kernel.	Jul 07 09:10
oiaohm	and kmscon moves to userspace	Jul 07 09:10
oiaohm	The old Linux vt system split in 2	Jul 07 09:11
XRevan86	http://businessinsider.com/are-these-monkeys-domesticating-wolves-2015-6	Jul 07 09:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.businessinsider.com \| Are these monkeys domesticating wolves? - Business Insider [ http://ur1.ca/n1gvh ]		Jul 07 09:11
oiaohm	MinceR: exactly how do you think KMScon is more fragile.	Jul 07 09:13
MinceR	according to that article, they want to add all the bells and whistles they can think of	Jul 07 09:14
MinceR	more code means more bugs	Jul 07 09:14
cubexyz	oiaohm, you could still get into a system via the serial port even if X messes up	Jul 07 09:15
cubexyz	at least you can reboot	Jul 07 09:15
MinceR	until they insist on rendering your terminal with opengl	Jul 07 09:15
MinceR	because they forgot that serial consoles don't have opengl	Jul 07 09:15
oiaohm	MinceR: serial consoles are not done by the Linuix kernel VT framework.	Jul 07 09:16
oiaohm	same to cubexyz	Jul 07 09:16
oiaohm	Virtual Terminal under Linux is only graphical terminals.	Jul 07 09:16
cubexyz	didn't it use to run getty via serial port(s)?	Jul 07 09:17
MinceR	so they'll leave the textmode terminal alone or not?	Jul 07 09:17
cubexyz	could be a last-ditch way to get in	Jul 07 09:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: getty via serial port has nothing todo with CONFIG_VT	Jul 07 09:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: or KMScon	Jul 07 09:18
oiaohm	MinceR: what textbased terminal. CONFIG_VT is framebuffer rendered in most cases. How often to you use the pure vesa 1 shell only login.	Jul 07 09:20
oiaohm	MinceR: worse is some devices like android GPU's don't have a vesa mode at all.	Jul 07 09:21
oiaohm	MinceR: so render by opengl or have nothing.	Jul 07 09:21
oiaohm	MinceR: basically CONFIG_VT has seen it day.	Jul 07 09:22
oiaohm	As cubexyz has found you really need in you end up dropping to a pure text mode getty on serial port or something equal.	Jul 07 09:23
oiaohm	why because config_vt on current hardware can be a brick.	Jul 07 09:24
cubexyz	run a real terminal	Jul 07 09:24
cubexyz	as a safety measure	Jul 07 09:24
oiaohm	cubexyz: when you say real you mean a real serial terminal.	Jul 07 09:24
cubexyz	yes	Jul 07 09:24
oiaohm	or parallel port terminal(bois post codes can go there)	Jul 07 09:25
oiaohm	As well as control.	Jul 07 09:25
oiaohm	KMScon will make SAK sane. Currently KMS and FB both allocate what the video card is currently doing.	Jul 07 09:26
cubexyz	I've never heard of parallel port terminal	Jul 07 09:27
cubexyz	we used to have Wyse terminals on Xenix	Jul 07 09:30
oiaohm	http://tarmo.fi/blog/2003/09/configuring-plip-in-linux/	Jul 07 09:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-tarmo.fi \| Configuring PLIP in Linux - tarmo.fi [ http://ur1.ca/n1h1u ]		Jul 07 09:32
oiaohm	cubexyz: you can network over parallel port.	Jul 07 09:32
cubexyz	yes, I remember PLIP :)	Jul 07 09:32
oiaohm	ssh over plip	Jul 07 09:32
cubexyz	that would work even if the video stuff was botched I would think	Jul 07 09:32
oiaohm	There is also forward serial by PLIP	Jul 07 09:33
oiaohm	what is forward serial by network	Jul 07 09:33
oiaohm	basically there are enough ways to skin the cat.	Jul 07 09:34
oiaohm	USB port, printer port, or serial port can all be used for mayday console.	Jul 07 09:34
oiaohm	Modern motherboards will send post to USB.	Jul 07 09:34
oiaohm	So the right kind of device in USB you know if the computer has booted or died.	Jul 07 09:35
oiaohm	It would be such a fun extention to a screen.	Jul 07 09:35
cubexyz	I guess radeonfb is still using a rasterized graphical screen	Jul 07 09:36
cubexyz	or does it just write characters to video memory e.g. MDA?	Jul 07 09:36
oiaohm	fb under Linux the kernel is doing all the font processing and the like into image then that goes to screen.	Jul 07 09:37
cubexyz	seems to default to 1024x768	Jul 07 09:37
cubexyz	right, otherwise you couldn't change the fonts	Jul 07 09:38
oiaohm	Turns out the text mode vesa on most modern day cards does not work properly.	Jul 07 09:38
cubexyz	it would just be text	Jul 07 09:38
oiaohm	cubexyz: you are meant to be able to upload fonts under vesa	Jul 07 09:38
oiaohm	But that mostly does not work.	Jul 07 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: OSS http://t.co/1S3mRwQW1K	Jul 07 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 09:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: OSS \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1h46	Jul 07 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's howtos http://t.co/G96cUjoYZD	Jul 07 09:39
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 09:39
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1h49	Jul 07 09:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's howtos \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 09:39
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's leftovers http://t.co/eJBwz53VCn	Jul 07 09:39
cubexyz	fbset code looks pretty old	Jul 07 09:39
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 09:39
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n1h4d	Jul 07 09:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 09:39
oiaohm	Config_VT was good when video cards worked and were not likely to send back random garbage just because they fell like it.	Jul 07 09:40
oiaohm	MinceR: I know the idea kill Config_VT starts well before Systemd. After a huge stack of kernel panics caused by cards gone stupid.	Jul 07 09:41
MinceR	so it's still useful for people who have working video cards	Jul 07 09:41
cubexyz	things do muck up though	Jul 07 09:42
MinceR	now they get to kill two birds with one stone	Jul 07 09:42
MinceR	remove VT from the kernel, stuff it into systemd	Jul 07 09:42
oiaohm	MinceR: define working.	Jul 07 09:42
MinceR	and force systemd on everyone	Jul 07 09:42
oiaohm	Not really KMSCON works with openrc	Jul 07 09:43
oiaohm	MinceR: also what is shocking is openbsd is looking at including it.	Jul 07 09:43
MinceR	lol	Jul 07 09:44
oiaohm	Some of the changes that people want to blame on systemd have not much todo with it.	Jul 07 09:44
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oiaohm	MinceR: openbsd has their own fork of logind	Jul 07 09:44
MinceR	are they tired of simple designs?	Jul 07 09:44
oiaohm	Nop	Jul 07 09:45
oiaohm	openbsd are equally sick of kernel painces due to hardware stupidity.	Jul 07 09:45
oiaohm	kmscon allows 1 block of console code to be used for graphical and terminal modes.	Jul 07 09:46
oiaohm	Instead of maintain 8 as currently.	Jul 07 09:46
oiaohm	MinceR: exactly what is simple about having to maintain vt terminal code for X11, vt terminal code for framebuffer on Linux, vt terminal code on all the BSDs.	Jul 07 09:47
cubexyz	it was simpler when it was all EGA, VGA etc	Jul 07 09:47
cubexyz	now I don't really know how it all works	Jul 07 09:48
oiaohm	cubexyz: yep when you did not have gpu with firmware blobs emulating crap.	Jul 07 09:48
oiaohm	MinceR: then you have to remember application developers has to deal with all the console implementation bugs.	Jul 07 09:50
cubexyz	my Linux console man page is dated 1994 :-/	Jul 07 09:50
cubexyz	and it's woefully incomplete	Jul 07 09:50
*TweetTuxMachines got exception: Unexpected end of ZLIB input stream ; reconnecting to Twitter...		Jul 07 09:50
MinceR	oiaohm: soon, they'll get to deal with implementation bugs put there by code monkeys at redcrap who couldn't care less	Jul 07 09:51
oiaohm	http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/libtsm/ This is out of KMSCON	Jul 07 09:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.freedesktop.org \| libtsm [ http://ur1.ca/n1h95 ]		Jul 07 09:54
oiaohm	MinceR: before KMSCON all termal service libraries depended on X11, GTK, QT.....	Jul 07 09:57
cubexyz	mplayer seems to open fbdev2 sometimes	Jul 07 09:57
oiaohm	Please note KMScon is not in fact part of systemd eitehr MinceR	Jul 07 09:58
MinceR	yet	Jul 07 09:58
oiaohm	The developer behind KMSCon is not redhat.	Jul 07 09:59
cubexyz	it should be in userland	Jul 07 10:00
oiaohm	There has been a long list of data leaks between users caused by Config_VT as well.	Jul 07 10:02
oiaohm	Reality console emulation should be userland.	Jul 07 10:02
oiaohm	Because when user logs out it should be flushed.	Jul 07 10:02
oiaohm	getty for serial is userland and it is flushed when the serial connect terminates.	Jul 07 10:03
oiaohm	A lot of what is happening with systemd is a result of hey we have these bugs we will not bother fixing it instead lets keep on using broken.	Jul 07 10:06
oiaohm	So when 1 init system decides to really attempt to fix the faults a stack of compadiblity issues were going to appear.	Jul 07 10:07
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schestowitz	http://www.linuxtoday.com/it_management/there-is-no-new-microsoft-under-nadella-patent-extortion-against-linuxandroid-carries-on-150706040014.html	Jul 07 12:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxtoday.com \| Linux Today - There is No 'New Microsoft': Under Nadella, Patent Extortion Against Linux/Android Carries on [ http://ur1.ca/n1ice ]		Jul 07 12:05
schestowitz	"Microsoft can't compete with products, so all they have left is Patent Extortion. It's that or fail as a company and whilst US (and UK/EU) politicians remain corrupt and open to any bribery that's on offer, thus enabling the abuse of the law to protect the economically inept, that will not change."	Jul 07 12:05
schestowitz	"Well, this sounds like a big pile of butt hurt in the article. Even if the "Malware" BS were true and didn't get installed (which I have yet to see a single reference other than a conspiracy theory), the Android OS has become so fragmented and vulnerable that it's hard to imagine Microsoft could make it much worse. Granted, they could.. but, it's simply garbage by the time it hits end-users unless it's on a Google flagship device."	Jul 07 12:05
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement	Jul 07 19:36
TweetTuxMachines	for Meizu MX4 http://t.co/IwE797tlBV	Jul 07 19:36
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 19:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement for Meizu MX4 \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 19:36
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2bsx	Jul 07 19:36
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 11 features Apple 'borrowed' from Android in	Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	the last year http://t.co/0pgkft7Yoh	Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2c3j	Jul 07 20:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 11 features Apple 'borrowed' from Android in the last year \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping	Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	Ubuntu-Powered Laptops in India	Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/kuy1Mjodm3 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2c3n	Jul 07 20:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping Ubuntu-Powered Laptops in India \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linus Torvalds Says Valve Is Exploring a	Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	"Second Source" Against Microsoft	Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sWRcVSdBNu (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 20:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2c3o	Jul 07 20:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Linus Torvalds Says Valve Is Exploring a "Second Source" Against Microsoft \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 20:16
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/thewtfmagazine/status/618552534483927040 https://twitter.com/stonemirror/status/618573330598227968	Jul 07 21:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@thewtfmagazine: @stonemirror @koretzky You stalked anybody lately Lefty? You are a JOKE, DUDE A JOKE #Gamergate check this out > http://t.co/SkZDkjsB3h >		Jul 07 21:14
schestowitz	he's still trolling new people	Jul 07 21:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| Richard Stallman and Bruce Perens Defamed by Troll \| Techrights		Jul 07 21:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@stonemirror: @thewtfmagazine LOL, "TechRights". @schestowitz, someone BELIEVES you! @koretzky #ItsAMiracle.		Jul 07 21:14
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/_DHMapplethorpe/status/618556008097411074	Jul 07 21:23
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@_DHMapplethorpe: Top comment on this. That's about you right? Stonemirror aka Lefty? http://t.co/V8PcZ8yW0Z @stonemirror @RejZoRSheep @_icze4r @koretzky		Jul 07 21:23
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Chartoc/status/618555077893206016	Jul 07 21:23
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Chartoc: @agelatinouscube @JamesBolton11 and actual harasser of women too. http://t.co/oj5aPBN2kB		Jul 07 21:23
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/_DHMapplethorpe/status/618553159758168064 https://twitter.com/thewtfmagazine/status/618552534483927040	Jul 07 21:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@_DHMapplethorpe: Hey are you the same Stonemirror in this article :0 http://t.co/V8PcZ8yW0Z @stonemirror @MyKeyMoonShine @RejZoRSheep @_icze4r @koretzky		Jul 07 21:24
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/_DHMapplethorpe/status/618528610723348480	Jul 07 21:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@_DHMapplethorpe: Daily Reminder: @stonemirror is projecting HARD http://t.co/T8cngMrehj		Jul 07 21:24
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Azermane/status/618570888473104384	Jul 07 21:25
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Azermane: @TheRalphRetort check this out http://t.co/llAH5zwNW8		Jul 07 21:25
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Jolla cuts hardware biz loose to concentrate on	Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	Sailfish licensing http://t.co/OEXZDYQS9n	Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 21:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Jolla cuts hardware biz loose to concentrate on Sailfish licensing \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cuv	Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung to train India’s Telangana youth in	Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	Tizen Tech http://t.co/88qWKpi8XY	Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 21:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Samsung to train India’s Telangana youth in Tizen Tech \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cuw	Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review: Linux Mint 17.2 Release is Refreshed	Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	and Faster http://t.co/scOiBrV71B	Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cuz	Jul 07 21:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Review: Linux Mint 17.2 Release is Refreshed and Faster \| Tux Machines		Jul 07 21:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement	Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	for Meizu MX4 http://t.co/W0j26eyXBu	Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 21:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu Touch to Get Major Battery Improvement for Meizu MX4 - Softpedia		Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cw5	Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 11 features Apple 'borrowed' from Android in	Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	the last year http://t.co/m5JupPGxc2	Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	(www.businessinsider.com)	Jul 07 21:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-uk.businessinsider.com \| 11 features Apple borrowed from Android in the last year - Business Insider		Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cw6	Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping	Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	Ubuntu-Powered Laptops in India	Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4koPBTEg4H (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cw7	Jul 07 21:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping Ubuntu-Powered Laptops in India - Softpedia		Jul 07 21:32
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linus Torvalds Says Valve Is Exploring a	Jul 07 21:33
TweetTuxMachines	"Second Source" Against Microsoft	Jul 07 21:33
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/NLuswy4O1M (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 21:33
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2cwd	Jul 07 21:33
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Linus Torvalds Says Valve Is Exploring a "Second Source" Against Microsoft - Softpedia		Jul 07 21:33
*TweetTuxMachines @RanjibDey retweeted @tuxmachines: 'Canonical and Lenovo to Start Shipping Ubuntu-Powered Laptops...'		Jul 07 21:33
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618592504556883968	Jul 07 21:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz My old junk, combined with horrid Internet connections (just 60 miles from Silicon Valley!) slows my work by about 50%		Jul 07 21:34
schestowitz	old junk can work well and limited bandwidth too.... it's how you use it.	Jul 07 21:34
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618594370518929408	Jul 07 21:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz (requires too much overhead in planning and organization. I need 10 windows open at once, to keep up with me)		Jul 07 21:39
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Jolla cuts hardware biz loose to concentrate on	Jul 07 21:49
TweetTuxMachines	Sailfish licensing http://t.co/FIwbRtkj08	Jul 07 21:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.theregister.co.uk) makes sense.	Jul 07 21:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theregister.co.uk \| Jolla cuts hardware biz loose to concentrate on Sailfish licensing • The Register		Jul 07 21:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2d2z	Jul 07 21:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung to train India’s Telangana youth in	Jul 07 21:49
TweetTuxMachines	Tizen Tech http://t.co/6L8NABaLN5	Jul 07 21:49
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tizenexperts.com)	Jul 07 21:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tizenexperts.com \| Samsung to train India’s Telangana youth in Tizen TechTizen Experts		Jul 07 21:49
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2d30	Jul 07 21:49
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review: Linux Mint 17.2 Release is Refreshed	Jul 07 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	and Faster http://t.co/up6DvbeZlW	Jul 07 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.linux.com)	Jul 07 21:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2d31	Jul 07 21:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| Review: Linux Mint 17.2 Release is Refreshed and Faster \| Linux.com		Jul 07 21:50
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618603967644184576	Jul 07 22:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz (guy you lauded seems to be "suspended" on Twitter...first one i've rune into like that)		Jul 07 22:16
schestowitz	maybe imposter	Jul 07 22:16
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618604586769760256	Jul 07 22:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz o O o		Jul 07 22:18
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/_sinisterBen/status/618611807238799360	Jul 07 22:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@_sinisterBen: @New_Versailles @gameragodzilla @stonemirror He's a serial harasser, who the anti-#GamerGate folks fully support! http://t.co/JAjOKqYFWu		Jul 07 22:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| Richard Stallman and Bruce Perens Defamed by Troll \| Techrights		Jul 07 22:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines OpenPrinting CUPS Filters Vulnerability Fixed	Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	in Ubuntu OSes http://t.co/wIEjiLDVLt	Jul 07 22:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| OpenPrinting CUPS Filters Vulnerability Fixed in Ubuntu OSes - Softpedia		Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	(linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dsy	Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Compact IoT gateway runs Yocto Linux on Quark	Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/EcRhCrey9i (linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 07 22:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| Compact IoT gateway runs Yocto Linux on Quark · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dsz	Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Manjaro 0.8.13 Gets New Plasma, MATE, and	Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	Cinnamon Versions http://t.co/KTYeAwVwSp	Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 07 22:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Manjaro 0.8.13 Gets New Plasma, MATE, and Cinnamon Versions - Softpedia		Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dt0	Jul 07 22:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines OpenStack Meiji 明治 Set to Succeed Liberty	Jul 07 23:02
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ipDWVIWXQC (www.internetnews.com)	Jul 07 23:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dwp	Jul 07 23:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.internetnews.com \| OpenStack Meiji ææ²» Set to Succeed Liberty - InternetNews.		Jul 07 23:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "KDE project is bringing an eventful series of	Jul 07 23:02
TweetTuxMachines	presentations and activities on community	Jul 07 23:02
TweetTuxMachines	driven software" https://t.co/QY6yEA3CI3	Jul 07 23:02
TweetTuxMachines	(dot.kde.org)	Jul 07 23:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dwr	Jul 07 23:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-dot.kde.org \| KDE and Qt at FISL 2015 \| KDE.news		Jul 07 23:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "Van De Moere had to give Okul an intensive	Jul 07 23:03
TweetTuxMachines	training session on Linux"	Jul 07 23:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/RDfR9NA4oT (www.bloomberg.com)	Jul 07 23:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.bloomberg.com \| The Mob's IT Department \| Bloomberg Business		Jul 07 23:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dwt	Jul 07 23:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Fedora 22: not obvious excellence	Jul 07 23:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/XWM11SbWcm (linuxblog.darkduck.com)	Jul 07 23:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxblog.darkduck.com \| Fedora 22: not obvious excellence - Linux notes from DarkDuck		Jul 07 23:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2dwu	Jul 07 23:03
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*TweetTuxMachines @Dan_Chetrit favourited '"Van De Moere had to give Okul an...'		Jul 07 23:59
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Compact IoT gateway runs Yocto Linux on Quark	Jul 08 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ILOAwYcXDn (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ef7	Jul 08 00:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Compact IoT gateway runs Yocto Linux on Quark \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines NSA runs its spying activities on Red Hat Linux	Jul 08 00:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/uhKFpCKJAW (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 00:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ef8	Jul 08 00:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| NSA runs its spying activities on Red Hat Linux \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 00:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Manjaro 0.8.13 Gets New Plasma, MATE, and	Jul 08 00:03
TweetTuxMachines	Cinnamon Versions http://t.co/YvsXh4FVwt	Jul 08 00:03
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 00:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Manjaro 0.8.13 Gets New Plasma, MATE, and Cinnamon Versions \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 00:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ef9	Jul 08 00:03
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Fedora 22: not obvious excellence	Jul 08 00:03
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/oklbdevKjM (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 00:03
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2efa	Jul 08 00:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Fedora 22: not obvious excellence \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 00:03
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 5 Best Linux Desktop Environments With Pros &	Jul 08 04:23
TweetTuxMachines	Cons http://t.co/dUvnei3OEr	Jul 08 04:23
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxandubuntu.com \| 5 Best Linux Desktop Environments With Pros & Cons - LinuxUbuntu Apps Reviews \| Tutorials \| HowTos \| News		Jul 08 04:23
TweetTuxMachines	(www.linuxandubuntu.com)	Jul 08 04:23
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gaj	Jul 08 04:23
*TweetTuxMachines @voidquest44 retweeted @tuxmachines: '5 Best Linux Desktop Environments With Pros &...'		Jul 08 04:23
*TweetTuxMachines @voidquest44 favourited '5 Best Linux Desktop Environments With Pros &...'		Jul 08 05:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE project activity reports	Jul 08 05:19
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/H75Stv6BGN	Jul 08 05:19
TweetTuxMachines	(ahmedabouelhamayed.wordpress.com)	Jul 08 05:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ahmedabouelhamayed.wordpress.com \| KDE project activity reports \| Ahmed AbouElhamayed's Personal Blog		Jul 08 05:19
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gpl	Jul 08 05:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines If You Give a Kid Linux… http://t.co/cT85etldwG	Jul 08 05:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-fossforce.com \| If You Give a Kid Linux… \| FOSS Force		Jul 08 05:19
TweetTuxMachines	(fossforce.com)	Jul 08 05:19
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gpm	Jul 08 05:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines How To Get Started In Open Source	Jul 08 05:30
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/eghRxAAq1w (www.crn.com)	Jul 08 05:30
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gsh	Jul 08 05:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.crn.com \| How To Get Started In Open Source - Page: 1 \| CRN		Jul 08 05:30
*TweetTuxMachines @LukeVizzicks retweeted @tuxmachines: 'KDE project activity reports https://t.co/H75Stv6BGN'		Jul 08 05:30
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Loading Linux To Make My Netbook Sing Again	Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Yeka1hqfnf (www.lifehacker.com.au)	Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gwx	Jul 08 05:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.lifehacker.com.au \| Loading Linux To Make My Netbook Sing Again \| Lifehacker Australia		Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 Daily Images Haven't Been	Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	Refreshed in a Month http://t.co/H4y2SqNqvu	Jul 08 05:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu 15.10 Daily Images Haven't Been Refreshed in a Month - Softpedia		Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gwy	Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu Touch Should Get a New Major OTA Update	Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	Next Wednesday http://t.co/fYGq1E5YhM	Jul 08 05:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu Touch Should Get a New Major OTA Update Next Wednesday - Softpedia		Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 05:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gwz	Jul 08 05:46
cubexyz	damn those flash ads	Jul 08 05:49
cubexyz	cpu use 100% :-/	Jul 08 05:49
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "GCC 5 the default compiler in Debian Unstable	Jul 08 05:54
TweetTuxMachines	by month's end." http://t.co/Qdt2JHcQMk	Jul 08 05:54
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 08 05:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Debian Will Soon Make GCC 5 Its Default Compiler - Phoronix		Jul 08 05:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gza	Jul 08 05:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Kali Linux 2.0 to launch at DEFCON 23	Jul 08 05:54
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ySfPcrtYEW (www.theregister.co.uk)	Jul 08 05:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theregister.co.uk \| Kali Linux 2.0 to launch at DEFCON 23 • The Register		Jul 08 05:54
TweetTuxMachines	"first in two years"	Jul 08 05:54
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gzb	Jul 08 05:54
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Loading Linux To Make My Netbook Sing Again	Jul 08 05:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/h3H3NypgHt (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 05:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gzd	Jul 08 05:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Loading Linux To Make My Netbook Sing Again \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 05:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Kali Linux 2.0 to launch at DEFCON 23	Jul 08 05:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/dNvRxVBZxA (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 05:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2gzh	Jul 08 05:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Kali Linux 2.0 to launch at DEFCON 23 \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 05:55
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cubexyz	oiaohm, another interesting point... if I ctrl-alt-backspace and kill X the radeon frame buffer seems completely uneffected	Jul 08 06:27
cubexyz	shouldn't killing X also kill the framebuffer?	Jul 08 06:27
msb__	Kill for the love of killing! Kill for the love of Kali Linux!	Jul 08 06:28
cubexyz	also aewm is using 100% cpu and it just will not die	Jul 08 06:29
cubexyz	I'm never using aewm again	Jul 08 06:30
cubexyz	even init 1 doesn't kill the framebuffer, it's indestructible	Jul 08 06:30
cubexyz	ok, init 1 does actually stop aewm	Jul 08 06:31
cubexyz	a window manager should _exit_	Jul 08 06:31
cubexyz	sheesh	Jul 08 06:31
cubexyz	well, that's what happens when you do experiments	Jul 08 06:32
msb__	Maybe you should use Kali Linux (and wear a yellow scarf).	Jul 08 06:35
msb__	and visit Poettering.	Jul 08 06:36
cubexyz	I'm not part of that clique	Jul 08 06:40
cubexyz	on a more positive note mwm and icewm get the official thumbs up	Jul 08 06:43
cubexyz	they can co-exist without issue	Jul 08 06:43
cubexyz	running two window managers at the same time is a bit unusal I admit	Jul 08 06:46
cubexyz	unusual	Jul 08 06:47
cubexyz	a program should exit when I tell it to	Jul 08 06:48
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 Daily Images Haven't Been	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	Refreshed in a Month http://t.co/BvHZxwslK8	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfs	Jul 08 06:50
cubexyz	it shouldn't try to endlessly respawn itself like some eldritch horror	Jul 08 06:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu 15.10 Daily Images Haven't Been Refreshed in a Month \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat Used by NSA Spies, SELinux Possibly	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	Bypassed http://t.co/nq3Ik2JZMy	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfw	Jul 08 06:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Red Hat Used by NSA Spies, SELinux Possibly Bypassed \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Debian Will Soon Make GCC 5 Its Default	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	Compiler http://t.co/TqKLMRgXsA	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfx	Jul 08 06:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Debian Will Soon Make GCC 5 Its Default Compiler \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: KDE http://t.co/Sa4qmdA7i6	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfy	Jul 08 06:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: KDE \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Open-Source Databases Pose a Threat to Oracle’s	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	Dominance http://t.co/5zPcCAesbF	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 06:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Open-Source Databases Pose a Threat to Oracle’s Dominance \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hfz	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 10 compelling reasons to consider open source	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	for your enterprise storage needs	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/28MgL9pdNQ (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 06:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hg0	Jul 08 06:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 10 compelling reasons to consider open source for your enterprise storage needs \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 06:50
oiaohm	cubexyz: X11 uses DRI framework and framebuffer is in fact a independant framework.	Jul 08 06:52
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oiaohm	cubexyz: KMS support in kernel is about slowly but surely removing framebuffer.	Jul 08 06:52
oiaohm	cubexyz: to be correct KMSCON	Jul 08 06:54
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/TheRegister/status/618734572902219776 https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618734603587747840	Jul 08 06:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@TheRegister: @schestowitz @Vecchi_Paolo We're an ad-supported business. We don't hide that - the ads are there for all to see, in fact. ^GC		Jul 08 06:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @KatHall42 Putting together data & references, statements from involved parties, publish it in Italian then I will @schestowitz @TheRegister		Jul 08 06:55
oiaohm	cubexyz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_framebuffer	Jul 08 06:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org \| Linux framebuffer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/n2hhg ]		Jul 08 06:55
cubexyz	oiaohm, linux doesn't seem to default to using a framebuffer on startup	Jul 08 06:55
schestowitz	I know, but it places pressure on editors and writers. I saw that myself when I wrote for a living. Removed that with my own sites.	Jul 08 06:55
cubexyz	but what exactly it does I'm not sure	Jul 08 06:56
cubexyz	I assume it's really text mode	Jul 08 06:56
oiaohm	cubexyz: depends on what age kernel.	Jul 08 06:56
cubexyz	this is 2.6.27.29	Jul 08 06:56
oiaohm	No there is no text mode cubexyz	Jul 08 06:56
schestowitz	If you write about tech and advertise cars or holidays, that may be OK. No conflict/fear.	Jul 08 06:56
oiaohm	A text mode is graphic rendered either to fb or kms	Jul 08 06:57
cubexyz	fbset says /dev/fb0 doesn't exist	Jul 08 06:57
cubexyz	it doesn't exist until I modprobe radeonfb	Jul 08 06:57
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618735617409712128	Jul 08 06:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz But IMHO @TheRegister demonstrated, up to now, to be quite well balanced. Otherwise I would be the first flaming against them.		Jul 08 06:58
schestowitz	balance is a subjective thing, based on a consensus sometimes manufactured by hidden forces (or incentives)	Jul 08 06:58
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/KatHall42/status/618735676612345856	Jul 08 06:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KatHall42: @Vecchi_Paolo @schestowitz @TheRegister Cool. Give us a shout if you think it would be relevant to a UK audience when you're ready. :-)		Jul 08 06:58
cubexyz	oiaohm, there must be a text mode...	Jul 08 06:59
cubexyz	what about when you don't run X at all?	Jul 08 06:59
schestowitz	We say that to overlook state terrorism is suitable balance, or to treat proprietary 'addiction'/lock-in as socially acceptable.	Jul 08 06:59
oiaohm	Just because a framebuffer devices is not exported does not mean the kernel is not using one internally cubexyz	Jul 08 06:59
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/KatHall42/status/618735676612345856	Jul 08 07:00
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618736066372194304	Jul 08 07:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @KatHall42 You surely are relevant as these methods are used also in UK to push their products. @schestowitz @TheRegister		Jul 08 07:00
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/KatHall42/status/618735676612345856	Jul 08 07:00
oiaohm	cubexyz: if you screen is 80x25 or 80x50 then you are using a video card textmode.	Jul 08 07:00
oiaohm	cubexyz normally that will not be a linux console.	Jul 08 07:00
oiaohm	cubexyz: also you will see vesa fonts not Linux ones.	Jul 08 07:01
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618736538671824896	Jul 08 07:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz Do you think I get influenced that much by propaganda? https://t.co/nvzTgOqHNz @TheRegister		Jul 08 07:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.linkedin.com \| Who is the most influential person in your life? Edward. \| Paolo Vecchi \| LinkedIn		Jul 08 07:02
schestowitz	Some people are more immune to perceptual manipulation than others. We need to protest the "others" from manipulators.	Jul 08 07:03
cubexyz	ok, I can "setfont drdos8x14"	Jul 08 07:03
cubexyz	been a while since I used that	Jul 08 07:03
schestowitz	That's why there is a strong public movement, for example, against #fox and #newscorp	Jul 08 07:03
cubexyz	I think just "setfont" on it's own reverts to the default font	Jul 08 07:03
schestowitz	*protect	Jul 08 07:04
schestowitz	cubexyz: got a new machine here	Jul 08 07:05
schestowitz	for just 150 quid	Jul 08 07:05
schestowitz	subsidised AFAIK	Jul 08 07:05
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618737386269356032	Jul 08 07:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz Please don't see things in B&W. Embrace the vastity of grey scale views. Je ne suis pas Richard Stallman @TheRegister		Jul 08 07:05
cubexyz	oiaohm, this goes back to my original question of how to reset the text console	Jul 08 07:05
schestowitz	What happens when some views are suppressed or demonised because of conditioning?	Jul 08 07:06
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/readergordonbp/status/618737804059787264	Jul 08 07:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@readergordonbp: @Vecchi_Paolo @schestowitz have either of you ever read The Filter Bubble by Eli Parisser? Very interesting! https://t.co/zoBhIV1ouh		Jul 08 07:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.goodreads.com \| The Filter Bubble: What the Internet is Hiding From You by Eli Pariser — Reviews, Discussion, Bookclubs, Lists		Jul 08 07:06
oiaohm	cubexyz: reset config_vt mode right. By undocumented ways like loading a framebuffer driver or restarting the computer.	Jul 08 07:06
schestowitz	Many views are never being aired because they are viewed, by design, as obscene or subversive	Jul 08 07:07
schestowitz	RMS once told me, we're taught that some things are "laughable" even when they're not	Jul 08 07:07
oiaohm	cubexyz: sysrq magic key can do it as well.	Jul 08 07:08
cubexyz	I think that goes back to conceptual learning verus rote memorization	Jul 08 07:08
cubexyz	mostly people are memorizing facts without any philosophical or organization method	Jul 08 07:08
oiaohm	cubexyz: basically config_vt is a mess	Jul 08 07:09
cubexyz	mother says "use microsoft"	Jul 08 07:09
cubexyz	it's like when a parent says "What I say goes" without any explanation	Jul 08 07:09
cubexyz	that's our society	Jul 08 07:09
cubexyz	oiaohm, I can't really disagree	Jul 08 07:10
oiaohm	cubexyz: then think sysvinit depends on config_vt working.	Jul 08 07:10
cubexyz	I wish I could just write to a memory address like we did on the commodore 64	Jul 08 07:11
cubexyz	then fixing text console would be simple	Jul 08 07:11
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618738798189498368	Jul 08 07:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz It happens every day. I think @TheRegister can be seen as a @PrivateEyeNews for techies & is not pretending to save the world.		Jul 08 07:11
schestowitz	Who ever said it needed to save the world? The point is, diversity of views, unadulterated.	Jul 08 07:12
cubexyz	or failing that, at least have a REAL serial console	Jul 08 07:12
oiaohm	kmscon where the console system can be reset	Jul 08 07:12
oiaohm	Is a good step forwards.	Jul 08 07:12
cubexyz	my solution to computer botch-ups of this nature is to have multiple machines running	Jul 08 07:12
cubexyz	so even if the text console or ssh stops working I have two or three backup machines	Jul 08 07:13
oiaohm	A general computer is over 20 diffenter computers working with each other.	Jul 08 07:13
oiaohm	This is why they can screw up so badly.	Jul 08 07:13
oiaohm	Like a intel/amd cpu cannot in fact start itself. It depends on another cpu to give it the microcode.	Jul 08 07:14
cubexyz	what other cpu?	Jul 08 07:14
cubexyz	the BIOS kickstarts the cpu	Jul 08 07:15
cubexyz	also I do run m68000 sometimes :)	Jul 08 07:16
cubexyz	in my computer museum/work area	Jul 08 07:16
oiaohm	For new intel and amd cpus that is not how it works.	Jul 08 07:16
oiaohm	https://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/ec-development	Jul 08 07:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.chromium.org \| Chromium Embedded Controller (EC) Development - The Chromium Projects [ http://ur1.ca/n2hox ]		Jul 08 07:16
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/618739981360758785	Jul 08 07:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz Which is what I think they are doing. There are advertorials every so often but are spotted quite easily @TheRegister		Jul 08 07:17
oiaohm	chromebooks have open source versions of the hidden processor that infact starts the computer cubexyz	Jul 08 07:17
schestowitz	They improved recently and I hope it continues that way :-)	Jul 08 07:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: its all the cpu that wake computer up from being suspended.......	Jul 08 07:17
cubexyz	a microcontroller...	Jul 08 07:19
cubexyz	I wouldn't say another cpu	Jul 08 07:19
cubexyz	just like there's a microcontroller in a computer keyboard	Jul 08 07:20
oiaohm	intel management engine controller is what intel calls that.	Jul 08 07:21
oiaohm	cubexyz: a microcontroller is still a cpu.	Jul 08 07:22
oiaohm	If you remember a 8088/8086-486 the bios was directly connected to the cpu and the cpu could start up without assistance of a Microcontroller.	Jul 08 07:23
oiaohm	cubexyz: pents and latter is where the microcode inload into cpu before bios can process start.	Jul 08 07:24
cubexyz	ok, sorry... I'll say "General Purpose CPU" instead	Jul 08 07:25
cubexyz	technically you're right, a microcontroller is a cpu	Jul 08 07:25
cubexyz	secondary processing unit might be more apt though	Jul 08 07:26
oiaohm	ST-Micro STM32F100 is only 24 mhz but it is a full ARM Cortex M3 that some chromebooks use for the EC	Jul 08 07:30
oiaohm	cubexyz: what is stupid is how we have got to the point a CPU chip cannot start itself.	Jul 08 07:31
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oiaohm	Results in having to make sure motherboard and cpu match in firmware as well as the socket.	Jul 08 07:31
oiaohm	cubexyz: as the complexity of secondary processing goes up the odds that some bug in seconardary processing will ruin your secuirty happens.	Jul 08 07:33
oiaohm	cubexyz: the old firewire hack to examin memory was not OS but controller of firewire being bugger with direct access to the memory controller.	Jul 08 07:34
cubexyz	I don't think the original pentium had reprogrammable microcode	Jul 08 07:41
cubexyz	Pentium Pro and later it was	Jul 08 07:42
cubexyz	not that I realized it back then	Jul 08 07:42
cubexyz	otherwise Intel could have fixed that FDIV bug with a microcode update	Jul 08 07:42
cubexyz	it does make sense though.... there could be bugs	Jul 08 07:43
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Docker reveals its secret to success	Jul 08 07:44
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/1mf2atdrDu (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 07:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwp	Jul 08 07:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Docker reveals its secret to success \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 07:44
cubexyz	coreboot loads the intel microcode in what they called "ramstage"	Jul 08 07:44
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Tizen 2.3 Rev 3 SDK now released with Native	Jul 08 07:44
TweetTuxMachines	IDE Bug Fixes http://t.co/SlztHUqdvS	Jul 08 07:44
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 07:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwr	Jul 08 07:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Tizen 2.3 Rev 3 SDK now released with Native IDE Bug Fixes \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: OSS http://t.co/PCZQKIoZOg	Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 07:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: OSS \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hws	Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Ubuntu http://t.co/yBdbQDKAeM	Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 07:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Ubuntu \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwt	Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Software http://t.co/AIgPqDkZbX	Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 07:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Software \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwu	Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's howtos http://t.co/1jrYgYdEkn	Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 07:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2hwv	Jul 08 07:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's howtos \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 07:45
cubexyz	the original IBM PC had the Intel 8259 which was a programmable interrupt controller	Jul 08 07:46
oiaohm	cubexyz: http://www.zdnet.com/article/intel-releases-fix-for-f00f-bug/	Jul 08 07:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.zdnet.com \| Intel releases fix for F00F bug \| ZDNet [ http://ur1.ca/n2hxg ]		Jul 08 07:46
oiaohm	cubexyz: some of the petium 1 bugs could be microcode patched.	Jul 08 07:46
oiaohm	cubexyz: div bug was in the floating point controller.	Jul 08 07:46
oiaohm	Petuim1 had a master microcode inside.	Jul 08 07:47
oiaohm	So no matter what it could start.	Jul 08 07:47
cubexyz	ok Pentium MMX doesn't count :)	Jul 08 07:47
cubexyz	hardly the original Pentium	Jul 08 07:47
oiaohm	cubexyz: read again Pentium and Pentium MMX	Jul 08 07:47
oiaohm	That patch was for both.	Jul 08 07:48
oiaohm	So there were a few issues patched in Pentium 1	Jul 08 07:48
oiaohm	I cannot remember exactly what intel chip become the first that would not start without microcode	Jul 08 07:49
cubexyz	Intel definitely had to swap out the early pentium cpus	Jul 08 07:50
cubexyz	there was probably a ton of different versions	Jul 08 07:50
cubexyz	there was P5, socket 4 and socket 5	Jul 08 07:50
oiaohm	One of the bad reasons for it is overseas production and controlling when the release of the microcode to prevent chip being released to market ahead of intels timeline.	Jul 08 07:50
cubexyz	then socket 7 (skipping socket 6 I guess)	Jul 08 07:50
oiaohm	cubexyz: anything in the floating point buggy in pentuim1 could not be addressed by microcode. The interger processing side was microcode.	Jul 08 07:51
oiaohm	The microcode starts with the risc like designed core inside intel x86 chips	Jul 08 07:52
cubexyz	IBM S/370 had IML	Jul 08 07:56
cubexyz	old CPUs that I know about had PLA	Jul 08 08:00
cubexyz	yup, CPUs have bugs	Jul 08 08:02
oiaohm	cubexyz: CPU bugs mxied with Motherboard chipset bugs you have a nightmare mix	Jul 08 08:02
cubexyz	you can see here that my old P3 system used coreboot to update the microcode:	Jul 08 08:03
cubexyz	http://www.maxhost.org/other/coreboot-serial-output.txt	Jul 08 08:03
cubexyz	I don't think it actually changed anything though	Jul 08 08:03
cubexyz	intel is very secretive about that stuff	Jul 08 08:05
cubexyz	they probably figure... don't make it too good, then no one will stay on the upgrade treadmill	Jul 08 08:07
cubexyz	no one wants to upgrade their dishwasher every couple of years, but somehow with computers it's de rigueur :)	Jul 08 08:08
oiaohm	cubexyz: you have to remember just becuase you can fix bugs by a microcode push there is absolutely no reason why you could not introduce them the same way.	Jul 08 08:09
cubexyz	I'm sure the blackhats have something up their sleeves	Jul 08 08:11
cubexyz	in theory the bad guys could knock out your bios but I've never actually seen that in the wild	Jul 08 08:12
cubexyz	even if they did I have socketed bios and backup images	Jul 08 08:13
cubexyz	the microcode updates aren't persistant either from what I understand	Jul 08 08:13
cubexyz	I think video cards have microcode updates too	Jul 08 08:15
oiaohm	OS applied microcode updates are not persistant	Jul 08 08:15
oiaohm	the microcode updates writting in as part of bios/efi firmware updates are kind of persistant.	Jul 08 08:16
oiaohm	I have seen a few different bios attacks.	Jul 08 08:16
oiaohm	One they guy who did it is still in jail. It was just wrong minorally extend the bios to include a code to cause the computer to fail every 180 days.	Jul 08 08:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: what you call evil way to get repeat customers.	Jul 08 08:17
oiaohm	Also completely stupid	Jul 08 08:17
oiaohm	cubexyz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIH_%28computer_virus%29 This is a bios nuking infection.	Jul 08 08:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org \| CIH (computer virus) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/n2i9m ]		Jul 08 08:18
oiaohm	cubexyz: http://www.webroot.com/blog/2011/09/13/mebromi-the-first-bios-rootkit-in-the-wild/ And this was found in 2011	Jul 08 08:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.webroot.com \| Mebromi: the first BIOS rootkit in the wild - Webroot Threat Blog [ http://ur1.ca/n2ia6 ]		Jul 08 08:19
oiaohm	so virus writers are kind getting nasty.	Jul 08 08:20
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/knowhowtohelp/status/618762479796121600	Jul 08 08:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@knowhowtohelp: @schestowitz Happy to hear this, many thanks for the feedback! - Amy		Jul 08 08:45
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/kstallett/status/618763537687703553	Jul 08 08:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@kstallett: @schestowitz Do you know the perpetrators of the attacks?		Jul 08 08:51
schestowitz	No, but even if I knew, i'd need hard evidence to press charges	Jul 08 08:51
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's leftovers http://t.co/myuqmL7331	Jul 08 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2itr	Jul 08 09:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 8/7/2015: Kali Linux 2.0, Canonical and	Jul 08 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	Lenovo http://t.co/LeFX0mjozu (techrights.org)	Jul 08 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2its	Jul 08 09:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 8/7/2015: Kali Linux 2.0, Canonical and Lenovo \| Techrights		Jul 08 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat and NSA: This is Not News	Jul 08 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/MMDJ0lqAjY (techrights.org)	Jul 08 09:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2itt	Jul 08 09:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Red Hat and NSA: This is Not News \| Techrights		Jul 08 09:38
r_schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6309874	Jul 08 09:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: "If report is correct, Red Hat's marketing department has a very tricky customer reference" http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/08/evil_nsa_runs_on_saintly_red_hat_enterprise_linux_apache/ #nsa #redhat		Jul 08 09:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.theregister.co.uk \| Evil NSA runs on saintly Linux, Apache, MySQL • The Register [ http://ur1.ca/n2iwg ]		Jul 08 09:49
r_schestowitz	"Love the sin, hate the sinner? Or something like that? ;-)"	Jul 08 09:49
r_schestowitz	In this case, we hate the sin, but love the sinner?	Jul 08 09:49
r_schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6299541	Jul 08 09:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Pirate Bay founders: FBI has #Prenda Law under investigation http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/07/pirate-bay-founders-fbi-has-prenda-law-under-investigation/ as if #fbi upholds the law http://www.h-online.com/security/news/item/Report-DDoS-service-as-a-legitimate-FBI-approved-business-1867566.html		Jul 08 09:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> arstechnica.com \| Pirate Bay founders: FBI has Prenda Law under investigation \| Ars Technica [ http://ur1.ca/n0391 ]		Jul 08 09:50
r_schestowitz	"They might punish Prenda to create a perception of enforcement, and justice in copyright law. All of the big publishers have done the same to promote their works and track users with watermarks. That makes our modern, radical copyright laws essentially a tool for public manipulation. Only privileged people are allowed to share and use all of the cultural resonance of broadcast and big publisher promoted music, music, and images. That is a	Jul 08 09:50
r_schestowitz	very powerful body of work, able to instantly form new memories in people who see them. “Potential troublemakers” who might threaten the revenue of favored companies can be ruined if they are foolish enough to share big publisher garbage."	Jul 08 09:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.h-online.com \| Report: DDoS service as a legitimate, FBI-approved business - The H Security: News and Features [ http://ur1.ca/e02nb ]		Jul 08 09:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/tM8HDZJrNA	Jul 08 10:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 10:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 10:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2j0p	Jul 08 10:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/iYJEQ09eAu	Jul 08 10:05
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 10:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2j0q	Jul 08 10:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 10:05
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Play! is a PlayStation 2 emulator for Android	Jul 08 10:05
TweetTuxMachines	(extremely beta) http://t.co/zjZNQmWWl2	Jul 08 10:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-liliputing.com \| Play! is a PlayStation 2 emulator for Android (extremely beta) - Liliputing		Jul 08 10:05
TweetTuxMachines	(liliputing.com)	Jul 08 10:05
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2j0r	Jul 08 10:05
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 20 best new Android apps and games this week	Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/0ze2T64JQe (www.theguardian.com)	Jul 08 10:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theguardian.com \| 20 best new Android apps and games this week \| Technology \| The Guardian		Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/k6AbP5wGTv (www.phonearena.com)	Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2jf4	Jul 08 10:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phonearena.com \| 7 of the best board games for Android		Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Best new Android widgets (July 2015)	Jul 08 10:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/GaxOGq4hP8 (www.phonearena.com)	Jul 08 10:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2jf5	Jul 08 10:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phonearena.com \| Best new Android widgets (July 2015)		Jul 08 10:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Which Android Wear smartwatch is best for you?	Jul 08 10:56
TweetTuxMachines	Asus vs LG vs Motorola vs Samsung vs Sony	Jul 08 10:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4o6tsPLVSA (www.pocket-lint.com)	Jul 08 10:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2jf6	Jul 08 10:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pocket-lint.com \| Which Android Wear smartwatch is best for you? Asus vs LG vs Motorola vs Samsung vs Sony - Pocket-lint		Jul 08 10:56
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r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Nintendo_VX/status/618796962452672512	Jul 08 11:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Nintendo_VX: .@stonemirror @SteamPunkDevil_ @TechyFolks @bobbyo1967 @Gayle36 Did you ever apologize to Kathy Sutphen? http://t.co/Y0goRuU6jb		Jul 08 11:02
r_schestowitz	Lefty	Jul 08 11:02
r_schestowitz	LOL	Jul 08 11:02
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r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/jurasick/status/618800834185400320	Jul 08 11:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@jurasick: @schestowitz I know. Same problem here!		Jul 08 11:18
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r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/618805492115091456	Jul 08 11:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @schestowitz (quality control?)		Jul 08 11:36
r_schestowitz	More like pest control	Jul 08 11:36
r_schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Godzilla_Govt/status/618805863248035840	Jul 08 11:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Godzilla_Govt: Hey, hey.. that's life in the digital ghettos. Get VPN bruh. https://t.co/XnabnN6Ups		Jul 08 11:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: It doesn't inspire confidence when you're told to report #ddos attacks to #fbi which itself is linked to shady DDOS services 'firms'		Jul 08 11:37
r_schestowitz	got it already	Jul 08 11:37
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Godzilla_Govt/status/618806344615723008	Jul 08 11:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Godzilla_Govt: @schestowitz OK. You were just commenting toward the report path for problems w/ DDOS. I see.		Jul 08 11:42
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android M 6.0 Update Features, Releas e Date &	Jul 08 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	Rumors Here! http://t.co/VQuN7oPOhJ	Jul 08 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	(www.latinospost.com)	Jul 08 12:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.latinospost.com \| Android M 6.0 Update Features, Release Date & Rumors Here! : Tech : Latinos Post		Jul 08 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ka0	Jul 08 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Opinion: Can Linux Be A Viable Gaming Platform?	Jul 08 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	Thoughts From A Sympathetic Game Developer	Jul 08 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/eVuLoGCFHJ (www.gamingonlinux.com)	Jul 08 12:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ka1	Jul 08 12:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gamingonlinux.com \| Opinion: Can Linux Be A Viable Gaming Platform? Thoughts From A Sympathetic Game Developer \| GamingOnLinux		Jul 08 12:18
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Tizen 2.3 Rev 3 SDK now released with Native	Jul 08 12:18
TweetTuxMachines	IDE Bug Fixes http://t.co/NunlCv9BSV	Jul 08 12:18
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tizenexperts.com)	Jul 08 12:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tizenexperts.com \| Tizen 2.3 Rev 3 SDK now released with Native IDE Bug FixesTizen Experts		Jul 08 12:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ka3	Jul 08 12:18
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/618817645966688256	Jul 08 12:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: be careful. #owncloud still lacks integrated password throttling, a major hack to be expected sooner or later https://t.co/uCYfqNUO87		Jul 08 12:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: "Users of ownCloud Documents will be happy to hear that we have updated to the latest upstream version of WebODF" https://t.co/ZILwzhpTSn		Jul 08 12:26
schestowitz	Depending on the users' choice of password	Jul 08 12:26
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/618818757998288896	Jul 08 12:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: Yes. But we are talking of the dump user, w/ simple passwords. Unlike Wikipedia, owncloud still lacks pw-throttling https://t.co/Y6TATEzltg		Jul 08 12:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @Wikinaut Depending on the users' choice of password		Jul 08 12:31
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/618819565263429633	Jul 08 12:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: @schestowitz OC team always responds that OC admins have to use fail2ban etc. An insane assumption. OC should ship w/ built-in pw-throttling		Jul 08 12:31
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/SleepyPenguin1/status/618818956963520512	Jul 08 12:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@SleepyPenguin1: New York Stock Exchange suspends trading after technical glitch @ruskin147 @schestowitz http://t.co/WfMkwJdelR		Jul 08 12:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.theguardian.com \| New York Stock Exchange suspends trading after technical glitch \| Business \| The Guardian		Jul 08 12:32
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schestowitz	http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2015/07/08/report-big-job-cuts-expected-microsoft/29853657/	Jul 08 13:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.usatoday.com \| Microsoft cutting up to 7,800 jobs [ http://ur1.ca/n2kvw ]		Jul 08 13:19
schestowitz	Woohoo	Jul 08 13:19
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Debian 9 "Stretch" Moves to FFmpeg from Libav	Jul 08 14:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/lYMFBfPTy4 (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 08 14:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2lai	Jul 08 14:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Debian 9 "Stretch" Moves to FFmpeg from Libav - Softpedia		Jul 08 14:09
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Debian 9 "Stretch" Moves to FFmpeg from Libav	Jul 08 14:09
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/ocRtPj5e9s (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 14:09
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2laj	Jul 08 14:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Debian 9 "Stretch" Moves to FFmpeg from Libav \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 14:09
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DaemonFC	http://gizmodo.com/microsoft-doesnt-want-to-make-smartphones-anymore-1716524766	Jul 08 14:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-gizmodo.com \| Microsoft Doesn't Want to Make Smartphones Anymore [ http://ur1.ca/n2lp5 ]		Jul 08 14:57
DaemonFC	I'd imagine that they'll go ahead and release the two "flagship" phones at the end of the year. Then anyone who buys one will sort of be in "support limbo" for a couple of years like Zune and Kin were.	Jul 08 14:58
DaemonFC	Microsoft has developed a nasty reputation for abandoning their own devices and users. That could explain why some carriers will actually pay you to take a Windows Phone and they still can't sell them.	Jul 08 14:59
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Microsoft cutting up to 7,800 jobs	Jul 08 15:00
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/4jwDjqnAIj (error)	Jul 08 15:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2lqk	Jul 08 15:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Microsoft cutting up to 7,800 jobs \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 15:00
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Home Automation with Raspberry Pi	Jul 08 15:00
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/VhYPwZV7cs (error)	Jul 08 15:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2lql	Jul 08 15:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Home Automation with Raspberry Pi \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 15:00
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Ubuntu http://t.co/K0Iim1ukrl	Jul 08 15:00
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 15:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Ubuntu \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 15:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2lqn	Jul 08 15:00
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines This is the tiny computer the BBC is giving to	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	a million kids http://t.co/m8j0xv5TKm	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2md1	Jul 08 15:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| This is the tiny computer the BBC is giving to a million kids \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Running ZFS On The Linux 4.1 Kernel	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/0O8g1Vjsn0 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2md6	Jul 08 15:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Running ZFS On The Linux 4.1 Kernel \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Qt Creator 3.5 Beta 1 Drops BlackBerry,	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	Improves For Android http://t.co/wRLcQh9S79	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 15:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Qt Creator 3.5 Beta 1 Drops BlackBerry, Improves For Android \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2md8	Jul 08 15:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Don't touch this! Seven types of open source to	Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	dance away from http://t.co/dDy0vWdXiO	Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 16:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Don't touch this! Seven types of open source to dance away from \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2n57	Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Phoronix on Graphics http://t.co/k9xKJHDOh0	Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 16:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Phoronix on Graphics \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2n59	Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Alpine Linux 3.2.1 released	Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/EbTOphCWi9 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2n5a	Jul 08 16:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Alpine Linux 3.2.1 released \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Multimedia conferencing system runs Android	Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sDQCqTC84I (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 16:50
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2n5b	Jul 08 16:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Multimedia conferencing system runs Android \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 16:50
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Alpine Linux 3.2.1 released	Jul 08 20:26
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/u2qL9fSofQ (www.alpinelinux.org)	Jul 08 20:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2op1	Jul 08 20:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.alpinelinux.org \| Alpine 3.2.1 released \| Alpine Linux		Jul 08 20:26
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DaemonFC	http://undeadly.org/cgi?action=article&sid=20150708134520	Jul 08 20:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-undeadly.org \| Microsoft Now OpenBSD Foundation Gold Contributor [ http://ur1.ca/n2or1 ]		Jul 08 20:35
DaemonFC	Microsoft just gave the OpenBSD foundation somewhere between $25,000 and $50,000.	Jul 08 20:35
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Multimedia conferencing system runs Android	Jul 08 20:38
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/aQzY6oYXXp (linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 08 20:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| Multimedia conferencing system runs Android · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 08 20:38
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2os1	Jul 08 20:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/iYJEQ09eAu	Jul 08 20:38
TweetTuxMachines	retweeted by (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 08 20:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 08 20:38
TweetTuxMachines	@schestowitz	Jul 08 20:39
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2or9	Jul 08 20:39
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Home Automation with Raspberry Pi	Jul 08 20:39
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/B2OHMw9pTG (www.linuxjournal.com)	Jul 08 20:39
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2os2	Jul 08 20:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxjournal.com \| Home Automation with Raspberry Pi \| Linux Journal		Jul 08 20:39
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oiaohm	Something I have never unstood is why Internet compadible IP address have to be used inside private networks. You go through a gateway router and be NATed anyhow	Jul 08 22:34
oiaohm	From my eyes we should be able to use a complete ipv4 address space in our own internal network.	Jul 08 22:35
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Running ZFS On The Linux 4.1 Kernel	Jul 08 23:16
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Dektw0g6Kf (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 08 23:16
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2prt	Jul 08 23:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Running ZFS On The Linux 4.1 Kernel - Phoronix		Jul 08 23:16
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MinceR	oiaohm: that won't work if you're trying to talk to another computer on the same LAN	Jul 09 03:01
oiaohm	MinceR: remember that a netmask of 0.0.0.0 is valid by spec	Jul 09 03:02
oiaohm	MinceR: I have built using proxy internet access using full ipv4 internal before.	Jul 09 03:03
oiaohm	MinceR: basically Ubuntu fan ip tunning mixed with local ipv4 the need to change to ipv6 could be fairly much put off for another 1000+ years.	Jul 09 03:14
oiaohm	MinceR: why each internet ipv4 address could host another ipv4 space of servers.	Jul 09 03:15
MinceR	if you're using 0.0.0.0, you might as well use a private address	Jul 09 03:23
MinceR	and if you're talking to a server, you'll still need a unique address	Jul 09 03:24
oiaohm	MinceR: ps://wiki.ubuntu.com/FanNetworking	Jul 09 03:36
oiaohm	Opps	Jul 09 03:36
oiaohm	https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FanNetworking	Jul 09 03:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-wiki.ubuntu.com \| FanNetworking - Ubuntu Wiki		Jul 09 03:37
oiaohm	MinceR: fan networking is overlaying.	Jul 09 03:37
oiaohm	The theory of a unique IP address comes very different when you allow for ip tunneling.	Jul 09 03:37
oiaohm	So a unique private address in a IPv4 different to the internet using ip tunneling should be accessable by using 1 exposed internet address	Jul 09 03:39
oiaohm	Or could be in fact using multi internet access address points.	Jul 09 03:39
oiaohm	MinceR: only thing a server need really is that a unique route can be formed and the client will support it.	Jul 09 03:40
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Linux Training Scholarship Deadline this Friday	Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/9O1jJlIcNa (www.linux.com)	Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rnp	Jul 09 03:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| Linux Training Scholarship Deadline this Friday \| Linux.com		Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Nouveau CUDA support is coming	Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/2U3gdww6Ge (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/y1gOtIbTlb (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 03:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| NVIDIA Has Someone Working On Nouveau CUDA Support - Phoronix		Jul 09 03:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| For New Developers There Are A Lot Of Ways To Help Nouveau - Phoronix		Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/VLbd61aY40 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rnq	Jul 09 03:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| CUDA 7.5 Up To RC Status With New 16-bit FP Data Format - Phoronix		Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The linu xfoundation enters further into	Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	training and certification business	Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/8PJcPfSHGu (www.digitaljournal.com)	Jul 09 03:57
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rnr	Jul 09 03:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.digitaljournal.com \| Linux Foundation's Individual Membership Drive to Help IT Professionals Advance Careers - Press Release - Digital Journal		Jul 09 03:57
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/andymckay/status/618956473733746690	Jul 09 03:59
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@andymckay: Got a lot of respect for Nadella, looks like Microsoft is becoming interesting again.		Jul 09 03:59
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/kisielk/status/619012871167410176	Jul 09 03:59
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@kisielk: @andymckay You mean like this? http://t.co/luoUmCCmAj		Jul 09 03:59
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| There is No ‘New Microsoft’: Under Nadella, Patent Extortion Against Linux/Android Carries on \| Techrights		Jul 09 03:59
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/readergordonbp/status/619052624797663232	Jul 09 04:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@readergordonbp: @schestowitz Open Source? With MS?		Jul 09 04:01
schestowitz	MS involved?	Jul 09 04:03
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/PyefinchComms/status/618957288238358528	Jul 09 04:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@PyefinchComms: @schestowitz thanks for sharing Dr. Roy Schestowitz, have a great Thursday :) (insight by http://t.co/Vv2iMRFgYE)		Jul 09 04:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> commun.it \| Twitter Community Management Dashboard \| Twitter Marketing Tool \| Commun.it		Jul 09 04:04
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/fcassia/status/618952126404947968	Jul 09 04:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@fcassia: @Cisco is it safer if we use Cisco kit with built-in backdoors? cc/@schestowitz		Jul 09 04:04
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/AntsiHossie/status/618947016224325633	Jul 09 04:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AntsiHossie: Yes to #TubeStrike. The Media are so quick to portray things for what they are not @schestowitz .. Thank you https://t.co/rNDIw3B5k3		Jul 09 04:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #TubeStrike Justified http://t.co/ucrTL5ZUxD good response, ignore the real ransom: using #wimbledon and tourists to incite against them		Jul 09 04:06
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schestowitz	Guest2866: hey	Jul 09 04:06
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MinceR	oiaohm: your NAT box will still need a public address	Jul 09 04:08
oiaohm	MinceR: depends on how many levels of tunneling you allow.	Jul 09 04:09
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/readergordonbp/status/619055203594182657	Jul 09 04:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@readergordonbp: @schestowitz Yep. Scroll right down to the section Sales Plan: http://t.co/sv6in0zrqw		Jul 09 04:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.bbc.co.uk \| BBC Micro Bit computer's final design revealed - BBC News		Jul 09 04:11
schestowitz	ewww... no lessons learned from OLPC then	Jul 09 04:11
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Peter Hutterer released version 0.19 of	Jul 09 04:13
TweetTuxMachines	Libinput	Jul 09 04:13
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/1cv94avyRe (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 04:13
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rs6	Jul 09 04:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Libinput 0.19 Brings Improved Pointer Acceleration - Phoronix		Jul 09 04:13
*TweetTuxMachines @RamiSilawi favourited 'Linux Training Scholarship Deadline this Friday http://t.co/9O1jJlIcNa'		Jul 09 04:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| Linux Training Scholarship Deadline this Friday \| Linux.com		Jul 09 04:13
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines amd freewsw graphics driver not in bad shape	Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/qMiSxrR26d (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/lrMyRrR49q (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 04:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| A Look At CS:GO & TF2 On AMD GPUs With The Open-Source Driver - Phoronix		Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/jN9FqrO5yW (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 04:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| AMD Radeon 300 Series On Linux - Catalyst: 0 vs. Open-Source: 1 - Phoronix		Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rwn	Jul 09 04:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| What Do You Hope To See Out Of Today's Expected Catalyst Linux Update? - Phoronix		Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 To Follow Debian In Its March To	Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	GCC 5 http://t.co/38HC3BmMsW (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rwo	Jul 09 04:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Ubuntu 15.10 To Follow Debian In Its March To GCC 5 - Phoronix		Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Lots of Linux Kernel Vulnerabilities Closed in	Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	Ubuntu 15.04	Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/hSYb4Bl3Ed (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/YB0cdB6eju (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 04:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Lots of Linux Kernel Vulnerabilities Closed in Ubuntu 15.04 - Softpedia		Jul 09 04:31
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2rwq	Jul 09 04:31
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Canonical Closes Numerous PHP Vulnerabilities in Ubuntu 15.04 - Softpedia		Jul 09 04:31
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schestowitz	MinceR: anything in channels other than this one over the past hour (had two REIN engineers over for about an hour, couldn't find the source of REIN)?	Jul 09 05:39
MinceR	nothing except the bots	Jul 09 05:41
MinceR	and even that only in #boycottnovell-social	Jul 09 05:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Qt Creator 3.5 Beta 1 Drops BlackBerry,	Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	Improves For Android http://t.co/0vazObcHsj	Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com) qt seeing signs on the wall.	Jul 09 06:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Qt Creator 3.5 Beta 1 Drops BlackBerry, Improves For Android - Phoronix		Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ssy	Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines A Big Set Of Updates Come For KDBUS	Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/9hqbGjfZM6 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2st1	Jul 09 06:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| A Big Set Of Updates Come For KDBUS - Phoronix		Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 6 affordable Android phones you'll actually	Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	enjoy using http://t.co/R7UCVDfrs8	Jul 09 06:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 6 affordable Android phones you'll actually enjoy using \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 06:11
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2st2	Jul 09 06:11
schestowitz	MinceR: thanks a lot	Jul 09 06:13
schestowitz	MinceR: the BT precision test guy was so geeky	Jul 09 06:13
schestowitz	into all that spooks and sci-fi stuff	Jul 09 06:14
MinceR	np	Jul 09 06:14
schestowitz	but couldn't find what messes up the connection	Jul 09 06:14
schestowitz	since march	Jul 09 06:14
schestowitz	very depressing	Jul 09 06:14
cubexyz	I had the idea of multiple ISPs	Jul 09 06:22
cubexyz	expensive but more reliable	Jul 09 06:22
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/tiikeridesign/status/619095741617848320m	Jul 09 06:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@tiikeridesign: @schestowitz wow, the Sherlock #HackingTeam Holmes!		Jul 09 06:50
schestowitz	cubexyz: a friend of mine from BT does it	Jul 09 06:51
schestowitz	cubexyz: because he lives in the countryside	Jul 09 06:51
schestowitz	but in this case one ISP would not to not use the cables	Jul 09 06:51
schestowitz	which are the culprit in this case, too much electric noise on them	Jul 09 06:51
schestowitz	if the second ISP is wireless (long range) it would not be worth the cancer risk	Jul 09 06:51
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines You May Want To Wait On Trying Out The Linux	Jul 09 07:01
TweetTuxMachines	4.2 Kernel http://t.co/Dj91GyhBDH	Jul 09 07:01
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com) FUSE work in progress:	Jul 09 07:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| You May Want To Wait On Trying Out The Linux 4.2 Kernel - Phoronix		Jul 09 07:01
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/2S6pmu3wz3 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 07:01
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2t52	Jul 09 07:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| FUSE Starts Working On Scalability Improvements With Linux 4.2 - Phoronix		Jul 09 07:01
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines phoronix looks at the latest of mesa	Jul 09 07:01
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/GY33JiDTJk (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 07:01
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/PFrmK7bZLh (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 07:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Understanding More Of The Shader Storage Buffer In Mesa - Phoronix		Jul 09 07:01
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/tETGhBrwjG (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 07:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Mesa Is Working Towards Headless Compute/OpenCL Support - Phoronix		Jul 09 07:01
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2t53	Jul 09 07:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Mesa 10.5.9 Is The Last Of The Series - Phoronix		Jul 09 07:01
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/619098310301904896	Jul 09 07:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: @schestowitz pls not so cryptic. pls plain text		Jul 09 07:02
schestowitz	I don't understand	Jul 09 07:02
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/619099279727161344	Jul 09 07:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: @schestowitz trust UK? Trust BBC?		Jul 09 07:04
schestowitz	With caution	Jul 09 07:04
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Wikinaut/status/619099660892958720	Jul 09 07:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Wikinaut: @schestowitz pls. elaborate your comparison betw. epo and tubestrike press coverage		Jul 09 07:05
schestowitz	Media characterising workers as well paid, hence greedy, disruptive, management stressed and panicked, extorted by staff	Jul 09 07:06
oiaohm	cubexyz: if you live in Australia you know the right to have your internet connection by multi ISP's still can sux.	Jul 09 07:21
cubexyz	oiaohm, how come?	Jul 09 07:22
oiaohm	cubexyz: why Australian carriers and ISP are different vendors so bad cable in the ground is the carriers problem.	Jul 09 07:22
oiaohm	cubexyz: everyone in Australia has at least 20 different ISP they can choose from.	Jul 09 07:23
oiaohm	cubexyz but number of carriers for cable connection can be exactly 1.	Jul 09 07:23
cubexyz	I assume there's DSL, Cable, Satellite	Jul 09 07:24
cubexyz	but I was thinking just two ISPs :)	Jul 09 07:24
oiaohm	Telstra	Jul 09 07:25
oiaohm	Happens to be cable and 2 of the core satelites above australia.	Jul 09 07:25
oiaohm	To be correct DSL cable and satelite.	Jul 09 07:25
cubexyz	load sharing would be nice too	Jul 09 07:27
cubexyz	exploit the extra bandwidth	Jul 09 07:28
oiaohm	cubexyz: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/satellites-undersea-cables-go-to-telstra/story-e6frg8zx-1226014383346	Jul 09 07:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theaustralian.com.au \| Cookies must be enabled. \| The Australian [ http://ur1.ca/h4kpl ]		Jul 09 07:28
oiaohm	cubexyz: Telstra in the Australian area has been very bussy	Jul 09 07:28
cubexyz	well at least it's not MSN	Jul 09 07:29
oiaohm	Aquirng anything in the area it been able.	Jul 09 07:29
oiaohm	cubexyz: biggest shareholder in Telstra is still the Australian governement.	Jul 09 07:29
oiaohm	cubexyz: I think MSN could in fact be better.	Jul 09 07:30
schestowitz	http://ostatic.com/blog/survey-amazon-is-tops-in-the-public-cloud-but-look-out-for-azure	Jul 09 07:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ostatic.com \| Survey: Amazon is Tops in the Public Cloud, But Look Out for Azure [ http://ur1.ca/n2td6 ]		Jul 09 07:35
schestowitz	Seems like BS to me	Jul 09 07:35
schestowitz	who's this Cowen thing?	Jul 09 07:35
schestowitz	Maybe Microsoft paid	Jul 09 07:35
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schestowitz	oiaohm: I wrote about Aussie ISPs and Microsoft	Jul 09 07:35
schestowitz	Telstra has MS execs in it	Jul 09 07:35
schestowitz	Bigpond has other issues, less serious...	Jul 09 07:36
schestowitz	Some IRC trolls came here from Bigpond...	Jul 09 07:36
cubexyz	oiaohm, I'm looking at Dual WAN routers	Jul 09 07:36
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/619108389029826560	Jul 09 07:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz $250.000 is quite a lot for 6 appliances. Looking at the features it seems like we can do it for about a tenth of that ;-)		Jul 09 07:39
schestowitz	I don't like this company	Jul 09 07:39
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 6 affordable Android phones you'll actually	Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	enjoy using http://t.co/udc7Kwclof	Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	(www.computerworld.com)	Jul 09 07:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.computerworld.com \| 6 affordable Android phones you'll actually enjoy using \| Computerworld		Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tf6	Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro	Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	ProteanOS as fully free http://t.co/gI7Tll704z	Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	(www.fsf.org)	Jul 09 07:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.fsf.org \| FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro ProteanOS as fully free — Free Software Foundation — working together for free software		Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tf7	Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat enables container competition by	Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	setting standards http://t.co/XqeMseP6kI	Jul 09 07:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-siliconangle.com \| Red Hat enables container competition by setting standards \| #RHSummit \| SiliconANGLE		Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	(siliconangle.com)	Jul 09 07:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tf8	Jul 09 07:46
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Vecchi_Paolo/status/619109117748244480	Jul 09 07:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Vecchi_Paolo: @schestowitz Why? They try to simplify the deployment of #OpenStack infrastructures but at those prices I can get a team of specialists		Jul 09 07:46
schestowitz	I can't recall what it is they did which I didn't like	Jul 09 07:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat ‘plays well with others’	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Ce5CSoVv65 (siliconangle.com)	Jul 09 07:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-siliconangle.com \| Red Hat ‘plays well with others’ \| #RHSummit \| SiliconANGLE		Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tgw	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung launches SM-G9198 Android clamshell	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	phone in China http://t.co/Bf32xPfgFG	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	(androidcommunity.com)	Jul 09 07:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-androidcommunity.com \| Samsung launches SM-G9198 Android clamshell phone in China - Android Community		Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tgx	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	ProteanOS as fully free http://t.co/Bu7Z4Ktrhn	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 07:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro ProteanOS as fully free \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tgy	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Red Hat ‘plays well with others’	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/sfjiVJSsDS (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 07:55
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tgz	Jul 09 07:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Red Hat ‘plays well with others’ \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 07:55
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Samsung launches SM-G9198 Android clamshell	Jul 09 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	phone in China http://t.co/d9H98Ks71o	Jul 09 08:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Samsung launches SM-G9198 Android clamshell phone in China \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tv6	Jul 09 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines America's Army Considering SteamOS / Linux	Jul 09 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	Support http://t.co/Q2rY9b27YW	Jul 09 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com) recruitment propaganda for	Jul 09 08:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| America's Army Considering SteamOS / Linux Support - Phoronix		Jul 09 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	#freesw platform	Jul 09 08:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tv8	Jul 09 08:30
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Catalyst 15.7 Bring Multi-Device Support For	Jul 09 08:30
TweetTuxMachines	OpenCL 2.0, Carrizo Improvements	Jul 09 08:30
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/5oELGqc000 (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 09 08:30
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2tv9	Jul 09 08:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Catalyst 15.7 Bring Multi-Device Support For OpenCL 2.0, Carrizo Improvements - Phoronix		Jul 09 08:30
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schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6310647	Jul 09 08:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: "United Airlines had grounded all of its flights after an unspecified computer issue." http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-33450848 phobia, or bad IT (proprietary)		Jul 09 08:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.bbc.co.uk \| NYSE: How Twitter reacted to New York Stock Exchange 'glitch' - BBC News [ http://ur1.ca/n2u1a ]		Jul 09 08:37
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/jurasick/status/619122842584621057	Jul 09 08:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@jurasick: @schestowitz very true.		Jul 09 08:38
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines FSF endorses embedded GNU/Linux distro	Jul 09 08:47
TweetTuxMachines	retweeted by ProteanOS as fully free http://t.co/Bu7Z4Ktrhn	Jul 09 08:47
TweetTuxMachines	@speedytux (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 08:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2u83	Jul 09 08:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Kernel http://t.co/fdBgfUpfGW	Jul 09 08:47
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 08:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Kernel \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 08:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2u84	Jul 09 08:47
msb__	schestowitz: "<schestowitz> if the second ISP is wireless (long range) it would not be worth the cancer risk"	Jul 09 08:49
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msb__	schestowitz: What if you used a parabolic dish antenna on the roof pointed at the distant source? Fed via a coaxial cable from your router, and with proper design there should be little radiation coming down locally.(minimal "sidelobes"). You could incorporate an amplifier for greater range.	Jul 09 08:52
oiaohm	msb__: there have been issues in Australia with dish design.	Jul 09 08:55
oiaohm	msb__: you know something wrong when it kills a tree.	Jul 09 08:56
msb__	oiaohm: Well, if it's pointed at a tree...	Jul 09 08:56
oiaohm	msb__: no the side lobes killed a tree	Jul 09 08:56
msb__	oiaohm: To begin with, the dish has to be about 10 wavelengths wide to get good focussing	Jul 09 08:57
msb__	Well , then it wasn't designed right. This stuff is not mystical.	Jul 09 08:57
oiaohm	Issue was some dishs has a horible resensence freq.	Jul 09 08:57
msb__	The sidelobes can be measured with a receiver and meter.	Jul 09 08:57
oiaohm	Nice Microwave side beem.	Jul 09 08:58
oiaohm	Tree killing and human killing.	Jul 09 08:58
oiaohm	msb__: I would not say no cancer risk.	Jul 09 08:58
oiaohm	msb__: I would say you do need what ever is deployed well and truly audited.	Jul 09 08:58
msb__	_Measure_ the sidelobe radiation.	Jul 09 08:59
oiaohm	msb__: the issue was the use of offcenter dishes for uplinks.	Jul 09 08:59
oiaohm	msb__: at least here.	Jul 09 08:59
msb__	The feeder horn has to be at the focus of the parabola.	Jul 09 08:59
oiaohm	Offcenter dishs are not perfect parabola that is where problems start.	Jul 09 09:00
msb__	This is 70 year old technology.	Jul 09 09:00
oiaohm	Even with 70 year old technology you can screw it up badly.	Jul 09 09:00
msb__	No doubt covered in an ARRL handbook.	Jul 09 09:00
oiaohm	Not exactly ARRL covers theorictally perfect.	Jul 09 09:01
msb__	Yes, of course. You have to do it right, and measure. The documentation is easy to find.	Jul 09 09:01
oiaohm	Add in a little material impurity and other things.	Jul 09 09:02
oiaohm	Basically a uplink dish is only safe after you have the meter reading confirming it.	Jul 09 09:02
msb__	Correct.	Jul 09 09:02
oiaohm	Correctly deployed and inspected uplink dish should be perfectly safe.	Jul 09 09:03
oiaohm	But of course carriers want to do cheaper than that.	Jul 09 09:03
msb__	This would be home-made, designed and measured.	Jul 09 09:03
msb__	Get a microwave radio expert to help.	Jul 09 09:04
cubexyz	hear about Microsoft donating a chunk of money to OpenBSD?	Jul 09 09:04
cubexyz	wonder what's up with that	Jul 09 09:05
msb__	Maybe they've found a way to poison money.	Jul 09 09:05
oiaohm	msb__: not that.	Jul 09 09:05
oiaohm	cubexyz: the reality is microsoft has only given the money to OpenBSD for work on OpenSSH	Jul 09 09:06
oiaohm	cubexyz: remember Microsoft has the azure cloud services. How are they going to manage all there Linux systems without nice and secure OpenSSH	Jul 09 09:06
cubexyz	ah, it was only $50K	Jul 09 09:07
oiaohm	Really the fact that Microsoft is the largest sponser is down right insulting.	Jul 09 09:07
cubexyz	it is	Jul 09 09:07
oiaohm	cubexyz: Microsoft makes way more than 50K from the Linux servers azure hosts.	Jul 09 09:08
oiaohm	The money being given to OpenSSH is truly peanuts.	Jul 09 09:08
cubexyz	chump change for Microsoft	Jul 09 09:08
cubexyz	yes	Jul 09 09:09
oiaohm	cubexyz: think of amazon, rackspace ...... the other cloud providers	Jul 09 09:09
msb__	Given all the attacks on free software by Microsoft over the years, there should be a clause in the GPL saying that the software can be used by anyone _except_ Microsoft.	Jul 09 09:09
oiaohm	Where is their cash/staff	Jul 09 09:09
cubexyz	msb__, there's the Motif license if you don't want your code on Microsoft Windows	Jul 09 09:10
oiaohm	msb__: of course not that would not be sporting.	Jul 09 09:10
cubexyz	Motif License states the program must be used on an open source operating system	Jul 09 09:10
cubexyz	simple	Jul 09 09:10
oiaohm	msb__: of course we want Microsoft to incorrectly use GPL stuff somewhere core than been forced to release the source code.	Jul 09 09:10
msb__	Very good!	Jul 09 09:10
cubexyz	another scenario... use the Motif License if you don't want your program ported to windows	Jul 09 09:11
msb__	No reason to be sporting with Microsoft; it is not sporting with us.	Jul 09 09:11
oiaohm	msb__: they are sporting.	Jul 09 09:12
cubexyz	oiaohm, I can think of other reasons to use the Motif license	Jul 09 09:12
cubexyz	someone ports your program to windows, and the linux version dies	Jul 09 09:12
oiaohm	Its the funny things like Microsoft iso create tool being fould using a GPL work.	Jul 09 09:12
cubexyz	it's happened before	Jul 09 09:12
oiaohm	So Microsorf had to release the code.	Jul 09 09:12
msb__	oiaohm: http://cosmicpenguin.com/linux/MICROSOFTS_WAR_AGAINST_LINUX.html	Jul 09 09:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-cosmicpenguin.com \| MICROSOFT'S WAR AGAINST LINUX		Jul 09 09:13
cubexyz	but Stallman doesn't like the Motif License of course	Jul 09 09:13
oiaohm	msb__: think about it for all Microsoft anti Linux they end up running Linux in their asure.	Jul 09 09:13
msb__	I wrote that before UEFI.	Jul 09 09:13
msb__	oiaohm: Yes, but they try to get the public not to use Linux.	Jul 09 09:14
cubexyz	I think Microsoft were using BSD for their mail servers at one point?	Jul 09 09:14
oiaohm	Its just funny to watch Microsoft contructions	Jul 09 09:14
cubexyz	I think Microsoft goes where the money goes	Jul 09 09:14
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619130226673631232	Jul 09 09:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz the trams run well after midnight especially at weekends. So yes they do work after midnight for clarification.		Jul 09 09:14
cubexyz	it's there prime directive	Jul 09 09:14
msb__	In order to stop evil it is at least necessary to recognize it and label it publicly as such.	Jul 09 09:14
schestowitz	Just briefly after midnight, 1am at the latest	Jul 09 09:15
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Sulman/status/619130235716521984	Jul 09 09:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Sulman: @schestowitz Proprietary DB's are also over-engineered behemoths with paid training in mind; Oracle I am looking at you.		Jul 09 09:15
msb__	With parabolic dishes radio amateurs have bounced microwave pulses from oven magnetrons off the Moon!	Jul 09 09:17
cubexyz	although I thought openbsd forked OpenSSL	Jul 09 09:18
cubexyz	LibreSSL	Jul 09 09:19
cubexyz	radeonfb (which seems to be unremoveable) automatically sets 1024x768-85	Jul 09 09:33
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines LinuxIT Acquired http://t.co/vWDQrHLLcS	Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2uko	Jul 09 09:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| LinuxIT Acquired \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines 5 open source tools for taming text	Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/IT2v1T0aR2 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2uks	Jul 09 09:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| 5 open source tools for taming text \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 9/7/2015: LinuxIT Sold, Alpine Linux	Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	3.2.1 Released http://t.co/Oq9dIB0GQx	Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	(techrights.org)	Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2uku	Jul 09 09:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 9/7/2015: LinuxIT Sold, Alpine Linux 3.2.1 Released \| Techrights		Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Gaming http://t.co/CGP3TvnvEU	Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 09:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Gaming \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ukv	Jul 09 09:40
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's leftovers http://t.co/58u9nqShW0	Jul 09 09:41
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 09:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 09:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2ukx	Jul 09 09:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android Leftovers http://t.co/eUeU4fyPbj	Jul 09 09:41
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 09:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2uky	Jul 09 09:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Android Leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 09:41
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oiaohm	cubexyz: you cannot unload a driver once it stuck in use. Yes a horible fact about config_vt it a driver trap.	Jul 09 09:42
cubexyz	fbi is kind of neat, viewing pictures on the framebuffer	Jul 09 09:56
cubexyz	could come in handy	Jul 09 09:56
amarsh04	yes, fbi is good, no need to bring up X just to view pictures	Jul 09 09:57
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oiaohm	http://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=OpenSSL-9-July-Flaw	Jul 09 10:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-phoronix.com \| OpenSSL's Latest High Severity Issue Exposed - Phoronix [ http://ur1.ca/n2uur ]		Jul 09 10:13
oiaohm	The list of implementation errors keep on showing up.	Jul 09 10:13
oiaohm	Darn I hate when my updates are 1.2G	Jul 09 10:31
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cubexyz	I'm not sure I can stop using radeonfb even if load uvesafb	Jul 09 10:33
Po2005	does anyone know how to get to the #Archive channel?	Jul 09 10:35
oiaohm	Po2005: is your user registered.	Jul 09 10:36
Po2005	well i came from IRC chat. so i am new	Jul 09 10:37
oiaohm	Po2005: I guess you have tried to enter the archive channel.	Jul 09 10:38
oiaohm	Po2005: I know I can enter the channel without issue	Jul 09 10:40
oiaohm	Po2005: but my user is a registered user.	Jul 09 10:40
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MinceR	> Red Hat ‘plays well with others’	Jul 09 10:51
MinceR	no it doesn't	Jul 09 10:51
MinceR	trying to destroy GNU/Linux is not "playing well with others"	Jul 09 10:51
oiaohm	Really that is hash.	Jul 09 10:55
oiaohm	Redhat does not exactly have the objective to destroy GNU/Linux.	Jul 09 10:56
oiaohm	History with the gcc complier and other parts say that.	Jul 09 10:56
oiaohm	At time Redhat objectives and everyone elses does not align for a while.	Jul 09 10:56
oiaohm	MinceR: I guess you forger the egcc mess	Jul 09 10:57
oiaohm	forger/forget	Jul 09 10:57
oiaohm	Redhat not being in alignment is not exactly new.	Jul 09 10:58
MinceR	oiaohm: forcing other distros to become fedora clones or die while turning fedora into a windows clone is not destroying GNU/Linux?	Jul 09 10:58
oiaohm	MinceR: one thing known is if you find the problems redhat is attempting to address and provide a better solution Redhat will change to it.	Jul 09 10:58
oiaohm	MinceR: No they are not forcing that.	Jul 09 10:59
MinceR	seems pretty clear that red hat is trying hard to make everyone depend on code only red hat can maintain	Jul 09 10:59
MinceR	especially in the case of debian	Jul 09 10:59
oiaohm	You miss the egcc history don't you.	Jul 09 10:59
oiaohm	and eglibc	Jul 09 10:59
MinceR	and in the case of their attacks on distros like gentoo and devuan	Jul 09 10:59
oiaohm	Redhat making a varation from the core and having other distrobutions follow is not new.	Jul 09 11:00
MinceR	even abusing their influence on gnome to force other distros to follow?	Jul 09 11:00
oiaohm	Not new	Jul 09 11:00
oiaohm	at a time gnome would not build with standard glibc	Jul 09 11:00
MinceR	also, past wrongdoing does not absolve them now	Jul 09 11:01
MinceR	you can have multiple libc-s installed on the same system	Jul 09 11:01
MinceR	systemd specifically checks whether it got pid1 and complains if it did not.	Jul 09 11:01
oiaohm	Past wrong doing is wrong.	Jul 09 11:01
oiaohm	MinceR: sysvinit checks if it pid1 if it not takes over pid1	Jul 09 11:02
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oiaohm	systemd complaining is in fact being nice.	Jul 09 11:02
MinceR	sysvinit only attempts to do a tiny fraction of what systemd is attempting to do	Jul 09 11:02
MinceR	sysvinit does not come coupled to a logger daemon or dbus	Jul 09 11:03
oiaohm	What about upstart that fedora used before systemd.	Jul 09 11:03
cubexyz	oiaohm, there's tons of people who don't like systemd being shoved down their throats	Jul 09 11:03
cubexyz	it's not just a few	Jul 09 11:03
oiaohm	The reality is most people wanting sysvinit back were not in fact using sysvinit.	Jul 09 11:04
MinceR	even upstart isn't as evil as systemd	Jul 09 11:04
oiaohm	upstart is worse in one hand.	Jul 09 11:04
MinceR	upstart does not try to hijack your userland	Jul 09 11:04
oiaohm	because particular programs hate upstarts ptrace solution instead of using cgroups	Jul 09 11:04
MinceR	it's just a broken init system	Jul 09 11:04
oiaohm	upstart interfered with program debugging MinceR	Jul 09 11:04
MinceR	systemd interferes with logging, reaping zombies and fsck	Jul 09 11:05
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619134663043493888	Jul 09 11:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz for example last tram to Ashton from Picc is 00:52 on a Saturday. So I'd guess we'll after 2am before tram returns to depot.		Jul 09 11:05
oiaohm	upstart interferes in fact with logging and zombies	Jul 09 11:05
oiaohm	MinceR: so 1 the fsck issue.	Jul 09 11:06
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Stubee217/status/619142710541295616	Jul 09 11:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Stubee217: @schestowitz @showbizmcr so get your facts right before "trying" to be clever as you've just changed your whole argument		Jul 09 11:06
MinceR	upstart can be swapped out for a number of init systems	Jul 09 11:06
schestowitz	Most lines have last journey at around 11pm, ending around midnight	Jul 09 11:06
MinceR	systemd tries to hold on to everything with its filthy tentacles	Jul 09 11:06
oiaohm	MinceR: how many of those init systems techically work.	Jul 09 11:06
MinceR	most likely several	Jul 09 11:06
MinceR	as opposed to systemd, which doesn't	Jul 09 11:06
oiaohm	MinceR: I said techically works.	Jul 09 11:07
oiaohm	Ie proper tracking of processors.	Jul 09 11:07
oiaohm	processes	Jul 09 11:07
MinceR	yeah, let's move the goalposts	Jul 09 11:07
amarsh04	our last commuter trains are around midnight here	Jul 09 11:07
MinceR	who cares if systemd tries to continue booting while fsck works	Jul 09 11:07
oiaohm	MinceR: BSD init on bsd system and SMF on solaris has proper process tracking.	Jul 09 11:07
amarsh04	I like to see what fsck is doing	Jul 09 11:07
MinceR	or fails to start services	Jul 09 11:07
oiaohm	MinceR: or the AIX solution has proper process tracking.	Jul 09 11:08
MinceR	or prevents you from interacting with a process that needs input	Jul 09 11:08
amarsh04	and interrupt a forced fsck on the n-th reboot if need be	Jul 09 11:08
amarsh04	exactly	Jul 09 11:08
MinceR	or SIGKILLs your processes before they had a chance to save their stuff	Jul 09 11:08
MinceR	or, together with gnome, makes your screen impossible to unlock until you hibernate and resume, at which point it unlocks without needing a password	Jul 09 11:09
amarsh04	on one machine here (single core) the DHCP process on boot-up is shown, on the other (4-core) it is hidden	Jul 09 11:09
oiaohm	If you want all that you have 1 other choice other than systemd that works openrc	Jul 09 11:09
amarsh04	I like to see such thing on boot-up	Jul 09 11:09
MinceR	openrc is not coupled to everything in an attempt to hijack everything	Jul 09 11:09
MinceR	systemd is	Jul 09 11:09
amarsh04	(using Debian with sysvinit and only libsystemd0)	Jul 09 11:09
amarsh04	plus I find the lack of documentation on debugging udev bad	Jul 09 11:10
MinceR	systemd prevents your system from booting properly if some non-essential fs in fstab is missing	Jul 09 11:10
oiaohm	amarsh04: to be correct the documentation on udev has improved since systemd started.	Jul 09 11:10
cubexyz	it's odd that I never heard about all these sysvinit problems in the Xenix era	Jul 09 11:10
MinceR	yeah	Jul 09 11:10
MinceR	it's almost as if they were made up to support a certain political agenda	Jul 09 11:10
oiaohm	cubexyz: Xenix you cannot break a process way from it starting PID tree.	Jul 09 11:11
oiaohm	Linux is not exactly Unix.	Jul 09 11:11
oiaohm	The minor differences means it cannot work with a Unix style init system correctly.	Jul 09 11:11
amarsh04	good oiaohm, but I was never able to do more than pinpoint which udev version stopped recognising my old Nokia handset in mass storage mode, fortunately it started working again in a later version of udev	Jul 09 11:12
MinceR	red hat "playing nice with others" >> http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2015-June/033170.html	Jul 09 11:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lists.freedesktop.org \| [systemd-devel] [ANNOUNCE] systemd v221 [ http://ur1.ca/n2vc4 ]		Jul 09 11:12
MinceR	see also >> http://lkml.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/1506.2/03764.html	Jul 09 11:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lkml.iu.edu \| Linux-Kernel Archive: careful review of kdbus [ http://ur1.ca/n2vc5 ]		Jul 09 11:12
MinceR	red hat is nothing more than yet another microsoft, playing from the microsoft book of tricks	Jul 09 11:13
MinceR	if gnu/linux users want gnu/linux to survive, they should stop being red hat's clients in any way	Jul 09 11:13
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619162066335715329	Jul 09 11:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz are you are referring to Metrolink in Manchester?		Jul 09 11:14
cubexyz	it will survive	Jul 09 11:14
schestowitz	Yes, lines I take sometimes stop at around 11 (outwards), with journey ending around midnight	Jul 09 11:14
cubexyz	IBM uses Linux, the stock exchanges use Linux	Jul 09 11:14
cubexyz	the US military uses Linux	Jul 09 11:14
MinceR	with some help from crApple, they've even taken aim at other free unixes	Jul 09 11:15
cubexyz	MinceR, I'd run one openbsd box to be safe though	Jul 09 11:15
oiaohm	MinceR: so what did you not notice that even when kdbus was built into systemd by default it was not made fail because it was not there.	Jul 09 11:15
MinceR	oiaohm: doesn't matter, they're still abusing their leverage to pressure linus to make a technical decision he knows to be wrong	Jul 09 11:16
oiaohm	No they are not abusing there leverage at all.	Jul 09 11:17
oiaohm	the rewriting of the dbus library by the systemd group was in fact requested by linus to make a proper assessment.	Jul 09 11:17
amarsh04	a few days of git-bisects and reports lead to a one line of code fix that could cause a kernel lock-up: http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.linux.kernel/1992111	Jul 09 11:18
oiaohm	Linus did in fact request that distrobutions review it.	Jul 09 11:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-permalink.gmane.org \| [PULL] module fix [ http://ur1.ca/n2vdu ]		Jul 09 11:18
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619163236894687232	Jul 09 11:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz so Rochdale (line) then I'm guessing?		Jul 09 11:18
MinceR	dbus should be replaced by an IPC mechanism that wasn't designed by windows kiddies	Jul 09 11:18
MinceR	on the assumption that you'll just reboot if something is wrong	Jul 09 11:18
schestowitz	Ashton and Rochdale	Jul 09 11:18
amarsh04	that could fix a problem that could cause a kernel lock-up rather (-:	Jul 09 11:19
oiaohm	MinceR: too late dbus is already mass deployed.	Jul 09 11:19
cubexyz	rebooting is fine on test systems	Jul 09 11:19
cubexyz	not on your main systems	Jul 09 11:19
MinceR	oiaohm: that's like saying "too late, windows is already mass deployed"	Jul 09 11:19
MinceR	oiaohm: if people could move from windows to gnu/linux, they can also move from lendows to gnu/linux	Jul 09 11:20
oiaohm	MinceR: why did dbus appear in the first place. Existing Unix IPC could not do the job properly.	Jul 09 11:21
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/showbizmcr/status/619164300209455104	Jul 09 11:21
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@showbizmcr: @schestowitz the farthest part of the system so trams will finish earlier. But to comment the system ends universally at that time is false.		Jul 09 11:21
MinceR	because apparently dcop wasn't sufficiently overcomplicated	Jul 09 11:21
MinceR	and wasn't used in places that don't need it yet	Jul 09 11:22
oiaohm	MinceR: dbus is a simpler protocal than dcop	Jul 09 11:22
MinceR	yeah, specifying an FQDN 3 times in 2 different formats is "simple"	Jul 09 11:22
MinceR	they should have thrown in a UUID or 6 for good measure	Jul 09 11:23
oiaohm	MinceR: that is fact simple. Across dcop it was 14 different formats.	Jul 09 11:23
MinceR	somehow i could use dcop with 0 FQDN-s	Jul 09 11:23
MinceR	somehow it worked	Jul 09 11:23
oiaohm	MinceR: what happen with dcop is it was extended and extended and people lost track of what it was doing.	Jul 09 11:23
MinceR	somehow the tool i used to introspect the interfaces worked reliably, as opposed to crashing all the time	Jul 09 11:23
MinceR	somehow the "init system" didn't depend on dcop	Jul 09 11:24
cubexyz	the dbus-daemon is pretty old isn't it?	Jul 09 11:24
oiaohm	MinceR: I guess you never worked with old qt applications using dcop for stupid things.	Jul 09 11:25
MinceR	i guess so	Jul 09 11:25
MinceR	using dbus for stupid things is more popular now	Jul 09 11:25
MinceR	like broadcasting >512kB messages	Jul 09 11:25
oiaohm	kdbus does not implement exactly the same a the dbus-deamon.	Jul 09 11:25
MinceR	yeah, they'll probably make them incompatible	Jul 09 11:26
oiaohm	In fact it implements a lot differently.	Jul 09 11:26
MinceR	to remove the option of using userspace dbus	Jul 09 11:26
MinceR	and force you to use systemd	Jul 09 11:26
MinceR	next stop: ksystemd	Jul 09 11:26
oiaohm	No you can keep compadiblity with dbus-deamon operations without coping some of the stupidty.	Jul 09 11:26
MinceR	or i can just link all that crap with https://github.com/clbr/nobus	Jul 09 11:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-github.com \| clbr/nobus · GitHub		Jul 09 11:26
oiaohm	The kernel can que up messages from different processes effectively.	Jul 09 11:27
MinceR	userspace can function effectively, if it wasn't implemented in such a shoddy way as dbus is	Jul 09 11:27
MinceR	but "throw it into the kernel" is apparently easier	Jul 09 11:27
MinceR	plus their beloved microsoft did it all the time	Jul 09 11:27
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's howtos http://t.co/WSBNQFK74d	Jul 09 11:27
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 11:27
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vgh	Jul 09 11:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's howtos \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 11:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Software http://t.co/k5RtwQOfd7	Jul 09 11:28
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 11:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Software \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 11:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vgj	Jul 09 11:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines AMD Catalyst 15.7 Stable Linux Driver Released	Jul 09 11:28
TweetTuxMachines	After a Long Absence http://t.co/tSjP2v0ZIC	Jul 09 11:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| AMD Catalyst 15.7 Stable Linux Driver Released After a Long Absence - Softpedia		Jul 09 11:28
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 11:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vgl	Jul 09 11:28
MinceR	i await the OS designed by these ricers that runs everything in ring 0	Jul 09 11:28
oiaohm	MinceR: yes and no there are somethings kdbus can do that userspace code never can.	Jul 09 11:28
MinceR	just because you can doesn't mean you should	Jul 09 11:28
oiaohm	MinceR: like crossing cgroup boundaries without a stack of issues.	Jul 09 11:29
MinceR	just because you can shovel all the garbage you find into the kernel and bloat it beyond all hope of repair doesn't mean you should.	Jul 09 11:29
MinceR	strange, other virtualization solutions somehow managed to communicate with their VMs without needing kernel-mode code	Jul 09 11:29
MinceR	only cgroups are so broken.	Jul 09 11:29
oiaohm	None of the existing Linux IPC are design to cross cgroup boundaries maintin correct secuirty.	Jul 09 11:29
oiaohm	MinceR: really wrong.	Jul 09 11:30
MinceR	good thing they can just throw in a few dozen extra design flaws to work around one design flaw	Jul 09 11:30
cubexyz	when did the dbus stuff appear?	Jul 09 11:30
oiaohm	hyper-v and vmware solution include drivers to extract information.	Jul 09 11:30
oiaohm	So other VM not needing kernel mode code you are so wrong it not funny MinceR	Jul 09 11:31
cubexyz	it's in openbsd also	Jul 09 11:31
cubexyz	so dbus-daemon is trans-linux	Jul 09 11:31
oiaohm	dbus comes from freedesktop	Jul 09 11:31
oiaohm	To make gnome and kde play better with each other	Jul 09 11:32
cubexyz	did Linux version 1.0 have it?	Jul 09 11:32
oiaohm	instead of implementing completley different userspace IPC	Jul 09 11:32
MinceR	mission accomplished	Jul 09 11:32
MinceR	gnome is already dependent on cancerd	Jul 09 11:32
MinceR	kde will become dependent on cancerd in august	Jul 09 11:32
cubexyz	gnome doesn't have to have systemd though	Jul 09 11:33
MinceR	well, funtoo seems to have patched to fix it	Jul 09 11:33
cubexyz	at least not older gnome	Jul 09 11:33
MinceR	i guess it's only a matter of time before they get a message like http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2014-May/019657.html	Jul 09 11:33
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lists.freedesktop.org \| [systemd-devel] [PATCH] Drop the udev firmware loader [ http://ur1.ca/ir0kd ]		Jul 09 11:33
MinceR	and red hat tries to break their fix	Jul 09 11:33
oiaohm	MinceR: please don't be making the mistake that logind means dependancy on systemd.	Jul 09 11:34
cubexyz	and there's that suffix -1 on dbus-daemon	Jul 09 11:34
MinceR	yeah, it's not like systemd-logind is a part of systemd	Jul 09 11:34
oiaohm	BSD systems have implemented their own logind.	Jul 09 11:34
MinceR	oh wait, it is	Jul 09 11:34
MinceR	yeah, bsd is also being turned into lendows	Jul 09 11:34
cubexyz	it looks like 2002 had version 0.13	Jul 09 11:34
MinceR	there's nothing good about that	Jul 09 11:34
oiaohm	MinceR: on Linux logind is part of systemd or consolekit2	Jul 09 11:34
MinceR	red hat won't rest until they've destroyed all unix	Jul 09 11:34
cubexyz	as I mentioned dbus-daemon has been around for a long time	Jul 09 11:34
oiaohm	MinceR: note what I just said.	Jul 09 11:34
MinceR	and then microsoft pulls the plug on their uefi Restricted Boot certificate	Jul 09 11:34
MinceR	and boom, red crap dies too	Jul 09 11:35
oiaohm	To have logind on Linux you dont' have to run systemd at all. MinceR	Jul 09 11:35
MinceR	and everybody will be _extremely_ surprised	Jul 09 11:35
oiaohm	MinceR: do you know what logind is design to get rid of.	Jul 09 11:35
cubexyz	then DOJ puts the beatdown on Microsoft (again)	Jul 09 11:35
MinceR	sanity?	Jul 09 11:35
oiaohm	MinceR: Nop	Jul 09 11:35
MinceR	cubexyz: except they never really punished m$	Jul 09 11:35
oiaohm	MinceR: do you call it sane that gnome and KDE run independant session management that can crash into each other locking up the users interface.	Jul 09 11:36
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/mangel_joe/status/619167609783746565	Jul 09 11:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mangel_joe: @showbizmcr @schestowitz Just look at Mkt St times. They have to get all way out and back from those destinations. http://t.co/6f0HGilc9P		Jul 09 11:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mangel_joe: @showbizmcr @schestowitz Just look at Mkt St times. They have to get all way out and back from those destinations. http://t.co/6f0HGilc9P		Jul 09 11:36
schestowitz	Midnight standard for standard days	Jul 09 11:36
MinceR	afaict that "session management" isn't used for much anyway	Jul 09 11:36
oiaohm	MinceR: what logind is 1 session management no matter the GUI loaded.	Jul 09 11:36
MinceR	usually they just start a bunch of clients	Jul 09 11:36
MinceR	which a simple shell script could do	Jul 09 11:36
oiaohm	MinceR: kde and gnome interaces don't run without the session management.	Jul 09 11:36
MinceR	that is, if poettering hadn't declared shell scripting heresy	Jul 09 11:37
MinceR	oiaohm: i'm doing fine without their interfaces	Jul 09 11:37
oiaohm	MinceR: same with xfce had it own session management.	Jul 09 11:37
oiaohm	MinceR: every single x11 class desktop wm has a session manager.	Jul 09 11:37
MinceR	oiaohm: do you know why shell scripting is heresy?	Jul 09 11:37
MinceR	because a sysadmin could look under the hood and change how they work	Jul 09 11:37
MinceR	and thus they wouldn't be entirely dependant on paying red crap to do their changes for them	Jul 09 11:38
MinceR	(if they feel like doing so)	Jul 09 11:38
oiaohm	MinceR: every single session management in a GUI is not shell script.	Jul 09 11:38
oiaohm	Do you know 3 ways to kill a sysvinit system that a user would not always expect.	Jul 09 11:39
MinceR	yeah, ~/.xsession doesn't exist	Jul 09 11:39
MinceR	i can see a way of killing it that's underway	Jul 09 11:39
oiaohm	MinceR: 1 is change insalled shells	Jul 09 11:39
oiaohm	MinceR: why the /bin/sh changes.	Jul 09 11:39
MinceR	change all applications and DEs so they depend on something that _must_ run as pid1 and isn't init	Jul 09 11:40
MinceR	stuff the kernel with crap that makes it bloated, unstable and insecure	Jul 09 11:40
oiaohm	KDE has only agreed to support logind as a dependancy because it cross platform.	Jul 09 11:40
oiaohm	So allowing cross platform sane service management.	Jul 09 11:40
MinceR	maybe red crap claims it's crossplatform for now	Jul 09 11:40
MinceR	you can bet this will change after kde made their move	Jul 09 11:41
oiaohm	No	Jul 09 11:41
oiaohm	Note there are 2 implementations under Linux	Jul 09 11:41
MinceR	this would not be the first promise they went back on, to lock people into cancerd	Jul 09 11:41
oiaohm	BSD has their own.	Jul 09 11:41
MinceR	http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.hotplug.devel/17392	Jul 09 11:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-article.gmane.org \| Gmane -- The future of the udev source tree [ http://ur1.ca/jn1n9 ]		Jul 09 11:41
MinceR	http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2014-May/019657.html	Jul 09 11:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lists.freedesktop.org \| [systemd-devel] [PATCH] Drop the udev firmware loader [ http://ur1.ca/ir0kd ]		Jul 09 11:41
MinceR	if systemd is so great, why does redcrap need to shove it down people's throats?	Jul 09 11:41
oiaohm	To be correct 3 if you count openrc implementation.	Jul 09 11:41
MinceR	why all the coercion?	Jul 09 11:41
oiaohm	MinceR: some things about systemd are fine to complain about.	Jul 09 11:42
oiaohm	Items like logind not exactly so.	Jul 09 11:42
MinceR	ooh, i'm allowed to complain about some things	Jul 09 11:42
MinceR	that makes me so content	Jul 09 11:42
oiaohm	MinceR: I do have issues with systemd	Jul 09 11:42
MinceR	guess what, other people have more issues with it	Jul 09 11:43
oiaohm	MinceR: just some of the thing you are going on with are in fact not exactly issues. Logind change has to happen. Because before logind it has been insane. With xfce applications starting a xfce session management inside gnome at times	Jul 09 11:43
oiaohm	MinceR: remember the solutions before systemd were not issueless.	Jul 09 11:44
MinceR	at least they were not bloated	Jul 09 11:44
oiaohm	Some of systemd changes have tried out have been replicated by openbsd and the like because they are truly good ideas.	Jul 09 11:44
MinceR	and they were free software	Jul 09 11:44
MinceR	in practice as well as theory	Jul 09 11:44
oiaohm	MinceR: bloated is having more than 1 session manager running.	Jul 09 11:45
MinceR	and they were pretty reliable and secure	Jul 09 11:45
MinceR	oiaohm: actually, even 1 session manager is unnecessary	Jul 09 11:45
oiaohm	MinceR: its eating up good memory without any good reason.	Jul 09 11:45
oiaohm	MinceR: if you kill X11 yes.	Jul 09 11:45
MinceR	guess what else is gobbling memory without any good reason	Jul 09 11:45
MinceR	no, even if i run X11	Jul 09 11:45
MinceR	guess what else is gobbling memory without any good reason >> systemd!	Jul 09 11:45
oiaohm	No X11 design for wm demards you have 1	Jul 09 11:45
MinceR	fvwm ran just fine without xsm or any other session manager	Jul 09 11:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Papyros Linux Distro Uses a New Material Design	Jul 09 11:46
TweetTuxMachines	Shell http://t.co/DWHvQvoEIw	Jul 09 11:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Papyros Linux Distro Uses a New Material Design Shell - Softpedia		Jul 09 11:46
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 11:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vp6	Jul 09 11:46
oiaohm	Its session manager was built into the fvwm binary.	Jul 09 11:46
MinceR	it's funny how many things systemd apologists allege are impossible that i have done often myself	Jul 09 11:46
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MinceR	uh huh	Jul 09 11:46
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-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| French robot company raising money for open source companion robot “BUDDY” \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 11:46
MinceR	and if i have X start xterm first, we start claiming "a session manager was built into xterm"?	Jul 09 11:46
oiaohm	MinceR: X11 for a wm manager to register you must have a session manager.	Jul 09 11:46
oiaohm	MinceR: xterm without a session manager does not have windows.	Jul 09 11:47
MinceR	actually it does	Jul 09 11:47
<--carlos_ has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)		Jul 09 11:47
MinceR	it's pretty much all it has	Jul 09 11:47
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oiaohm	MinceR: not x11 windows.	Jul 09 11:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| The Next Big Thing in Open-Source May Be Housing \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 11:47
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oiaohm	MinceR: ie no proper boarder.	Jul 09 11:47
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MinceR	borders are not what make an x11 window	Jul 09 11:47
MinceR	you should know this if you know x11.	Jul 09 11:47
oiaohm	session manager defines where keyboard input and mouse actions are going.	Jul 09 11:48
MinceR	yet i could somehow type into the xterm that was the only client that was running	Jul 09 11:48
oiaohm	MinceR: that was depend on the X11 default wm	Jul 09 11:48
MinceR	there's no "default wm"	Jul 09 11:48
oiaohm	Once you load your own hello.	Jul 09 11:48
oiaohm	MinceR: there is a default.	Jul 09 11:49
oiaohm	MinceR: X11 server has a noop wm	Jul 09 11:49
oiaohm	MinceR: basically its not a straight forwards as most of use would hope.	Jul 09 11:50
oiaohm	X11 design big mess.	Jul 09 11:51
oiaohm	Stuff to make X11 work equally big mess.	Jul 09 11:51
MinceR	that doesn't stop some people from building a far bigger mess on top of and around it	Jul 09 11:51
MinceR	i wonder when will red hat push mutter into the kernel	Jul 09 11:51
MinceR	after all, windows nt has the windowing system, the window manager and half of the gui toolkit in the kernel	Jul 09 11:52
MinceR	so lendows must do the same	Jul 09 11:52
oiaohm	Not happening.	Jul 09 11:52
oiaohm	Redhat in fact removed the in Linux kernel fb windows manager.	Jul 09 11:52
MinceR	yeah, just like kdbus isn't happening	Jul 09 11:52
oiaohm	Yes gui in kernel was a real thing for early Linux MinceR	Jul 09 11:52
MinceR	they'll have a far bigger one	Jul 09 11:53
MinceR	and shinier	Jul 09 11:53
MinceR	and most important of all, newer!	Jul 09 11:53
oiaohm	MinceR: the idea of WM in kernel space is not going to happen at least not by redhat.	Jul 09 11:53
MinceR	and since it runs in kernel mode, it will be soooooooooo faaaaaaaaaaaaast	Jul 09 11:54
MinceR	just like windows nt	Jul 09 11:54
oiaohm	Not at all.	Jul 09 11:54
oiaohm	Have you not look at KMS and DRI	Jul 09 11:54
MinceR	(which was easily beaten by usermode X, user mode switching and the slowest X11 wm i've ever seen, sawfish)	Jul 09 11:54
oiaohm	Its in fact slower to move a WM into Linux space kernel space.	Jul 09 11:54
MinceR	when did that ever stop anybody?	Jul 09 11:55
MinceR	just because something is a bad idea doesn't mean people won't try it	Jul 09 11:55
oiaohm	MinceR: have you forgot inside the Linux kernel space there is no floating point operations or at least if you want it to perform.	Jul 09 11:55
MinceR	especially the likes of poettering and sievers	Jul 09 11:55
oiaohm	WM for window scaling has to perform floating point at times.	Jul 09 11:55
MinceR	they could put that part into systemd	Jul 09 11:56
oiaohm	MinceR: systemd in userspace maybe.	Jul 09 11:56
MinceR	which is already their landfill for "stuff we don't want to force into the kernel just yet"	Jul 09 11:56
oiaohm	MinceR: but the claim of kernelspace it not happening ever.	Jul 09 11:56
MinceR	sure	Jul 09 11:56
MinceR	would you have guessed 10 years ago that red hat will try to turn gnu/linux into windows?	Jul 09 11:56
oiaohm	Redhat is not going to hurt super computer performance.	Jul 09 11:56
MinceR	yes they are	Jul 09 11:57
oiaohm	MinceR: no they are not.	Jul 09 11:57
oiaohm	kdbus is a loadable module not a embedded one(guess why.	Jul 09 11:57
MinceR	if they didn't want to hurt performance, they wouldn't be forcing garbage like systemd and kdbus	Jul 09 11:57
oiaohm	You just missed something.	Jul 09 11:57
MinceR	i'm sure they'll spread some dependencies on kdbus if they manage to have it merged	Jul 09 11:58
oiaohm	kdbus will always be unloadable.	Jul 09 11:58
MinceR	just like they did with systemd	Jul 09 11:58
MinceR	yeah, and you can set init= to something other than systemd	Jul 09 11:58
MinceR	won't stop redhat from trying to break everything in your system if you do so	Jul 09 11:58
MinceR	(or debian)	Jul 09 11:58
MinceR	iirc they've already managed to break init=/bin/sh	Jul 09 11:58
oiaohm	MinceR: when did you notice that broken.	Jul 09 11:59
oiaohm	I hope you say 2002	Jul 09 11:59
MinceR	it wasn't broken for me since i haven't used cancerd much	Jul 09 12:00
MinceR	and even then only unwittingly	Jul 09 12:00
oiaohm	2002 is pre systemd	Jul 09 12:00
MinceR	apparently i keep doing the impossible	Jul 09 12:01
oiaohm	I was running segmented partitions back in 2002	Jul 09 12:01
MinceR	it's either that or systemd fans are severely delusional.	Jul 09 12:01
oiaohm	There is a issue with initrd and not mounting all required filesystems so /bin being in a different partition guess what happened.	Jul 09 12:01
MinceR	the most separation i ever did was separate /, /boot and /home	Jul 09 12:02
MinceR	(and i regret even that)	Jul 09 12:02
oiaohm	systemd addes the option to fstab to tell extra partitions to be added to the initrd.	Jul 09 12:03
cubexyz	my openbsd box has separate /, /home, /tmp, /usr, /usr/X11R6, /usr/local, /usr/obj, /usr/src, and /var	Jul 09 12:03
oiaohm	cubexyz: but openbsd initrd equal works correctly	Jul 09 12:04
MinceR	maybe red hat will "fix" that too	Jul 09 12:04
oiaohm	There have been a list of issues that would raise there head on Linux MinceR if you started configuing Linux partitions like BSD.	Jul 09 12:04
oiaohm	The reality here is redhat is attempting to fix real faults.	Jul 09 12:05
oiaohm	But they are creating like 20 more at times.	Jul 09 12:05
MinceR	real "faults" like red hat not controlling 100% of the gnu/linux market	Jul 09 12:05
oiaohm	Like early on in systemd where the lead developer goes you will not partition at all.	Jul 09 12:05
oiaohm	OS will all be in 1 partition.	Jul 09 12:06
oiaohm	Current systemd in fact supports split.	Jul 09 12:06
MinceR	didn't they make a mess of /usr recently?	Jul 09 12:06
oiaohm	MinceR: until recently /usr booting was not offically supported.	Jul 09 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Launchpad Development Starts Again	Jul 09 12:06
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/p9RvWI4VbT (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 12:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Launchpad Development Starts Again - Softpedia		Jul 09 12:06
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oiaohm	and when they made it offically supported they broke the hacks MinceR	Jul 09 12:07
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines ChaletOS 14.04.2 review - Digital white	Jul 09 12:07
TweetTuxMachines	chocolate http://t.co/Bhu8h2fflN	Jul 09 12:07
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines SuperX 3.0 Grace review - Saving, ahem, grace	Jul 09 12:07
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Ebe03Jfumv (www.dedoimedo.com)	Jul 09 12:07
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.dedoimedo.com \| SuperX 3.0 Grace review - Saving, ahem, grace		Jul 09 12:07
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2vv0	Jul 09 12:07
oiaohm	MinceR: yes people hacking aroudn systemd limitations have been bitten when the limitation has been fixed.	Jul 09 12:07
MinceR	good thing all of this will finally be fixed once redhat moves the entire root filesystem into initrd	Jul 09 12:07
MinceR	(readonly, of course)	Jul 09 12:07
MinceR	(and signed, so that UEFI, TPM and other treacherous tech can ensure you don't get to control anything)	Jul 09 12:08
oiaohm	MinceR: one of the changes of systemd design is that core file systems should be mounted read only by the initrd	Jul 09 12:08
oiaohm	And if there is a issue stop in the initrd with no file system going rw.	Jul 09 12:09
MinceR	maybe that's why it does shit like this >> https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/316	Jul 09 12:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-github.com \| After resuming from standby, systemd is stuck trying to unmount a disk · Issue #316 · systemd/systemd · GitHub [ http://ur1.ca/n2vvm ]		Jul 09 12:09
oiaohm	Theory to reduce data los	Jul 09 12:09
cubexyz	oops, another systemd prob :)	Jul 09 12:09
MinceR	also, http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2015-May/031658.html	Jul 09 12:10
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lists.freedesktop.org \| [systemd-devel] dev-root.device is not active,results in an umount spree [ http://ur1.ca/myk9k ]		Jul 09 12:10
MinceR	one would think that bugs like these 4 years after fedora started forcing systemd on their users is a pretty good sign of systemd going nowhere	Jul 09 12:10
oiaohm	MinceR: yep some of those issues are miss configuration. But the systemd guys have not closed a lot of those bugs as wont fix as they could have	Jul 09 12:11
MinceR	the misconfiguration being allowing cancerd to run	Jul 09 12:11
MinceR	ooh, they haven't closed everything as WONTFIX, only most things	Jul 09 12:11
MinceR	they must be saints.	Jul 09 12:11
oiaohm	MinceR: that is wrong too.	Jul 09 12:11
oiaohm	Very few systemd bug as closed with WONTFIX	Jul 09 12:11
oiaohm	MinceR: the #316 bug you brought in was in fact fixed in newer versions of systemd	Jul 09 12:13
MinceR	who knows, maybe in 3015, systemd will finally be stable enough for production use	Jul 09 12:14
oiaohm	MinceR: the reality that they are fixing a lot of these issues. Even issues they could tag WONTFIX because it against documetnation how systems should be configured.	Jul 09 12:16
oiaohm	MinceR: but its time	Jul 09 12:16
oiaohm	Really I think systemd developers need to stop adding features for a while and just focus on the bug backlog.	Jul 09 12:16
MinceR	i think they just need to find a career they can excel in	Jul 09 12:17
MinceR	software engineering was clearly not meant for them	Jul 09 12:17
MinceR	and neither was QA	Jul 09 12:17
oiaohm	QA I would agree the need a good person on that to take project lead.	Jul 09 12:18
oiaohm	MinceR: remember not everyone doing software engineering should be a release manager or a QA officer.	Jul 09 12:20
MinceR	they should have some idea of good practices, cohesion and coupling, though	Jul 09 12:20
MinceR	also, coding standards and code documentation.	Jul 09 12:20
oiaohm	MinceR: I see systemd as a project with too many indians trying to be chiefs.	Jul 09 12:21
MinceR	i see it as a project of windows fanboys trying to mold gnu/linux into windows.	Jul 09 12:21
MinceR	with a bit of macos, but that's no great difference.	Jul 09 12:21
oiaohm	Really I would not say windows fanboys	Jul 09 12:21
oiaohm	a Lot of what they are doing is impossible for windows.	Jul 09 12:21
oiaohm	the idea of per application /tmp directory and the like this is not windows.	Jul 09 12:22
MinceR	windows seems to be the most notable os with this extreme obsession with bloat, inflexibility, opaqueness, extreme coupling and total lack of cohesion	Jul 09 12:22
oiaohm	MinceR: if they are fanboys of anything is solaris SMF	Jul 09 12:22
MinceR	nope	Jul 09 12:22
MinceR	SMF doesn't run as pid1	Jul 09 12:22
cubexyz	opaqueness certainly	Jul 09 12:22
MinceR	SMF doesn't try to take over the entire userland, afaik it has a clearly defined scope	Jul 09 12:23
oiaohm	MinceR: SMF can run as pid1 if choosen to.	Jul 09 12:23
MinceR	systemd has practically no scope	Jul 09 12:23
oiaohm	MinceR: systemd does not have to run as PID1	Jul 09 12:23
MinceR	oiaohm: see, there's an element of choice. that's completely unheard of in systemd world.	Jul 09 12:23
MinceR	yeah, it can complain and quit	Jul 09 12:23
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MinceR	which is arguably more useful than what it would otherwise do	Jul 09 12:23
oiaohm	MinceR: note what I said about too many indians attempting to be chief.	Jul 09 12:23
oiaohm	MinceR: systemd no one sat down and defined a scope.	Jul 09 12:23
MinceR	note that i don't want any indian to be my chief.	Jul 09 12:23
oiaohm	So you have a feature creap from hell.	Jul 09 12:24
MinceR	also note that free software is not about making someone your master.	Jul 09 12:24
MinceR	(which is just another way in which you can see that systemd is nonfree)	Jul 09 12:24
oiaohm	MinceR: every project need some form of master.	Jul 09 12:24
MinceR	i'm not a project	Jul 09 12:24
oiaohm	Ether a board or a person.	Jul 09 12:24
oiaohm	MinceR: to make systemd or sysvinit or kernel....	Jul 09 12:24
oiaohm	If that board or person does not manage it correctly expect hell.	Jul 09 12:25
MinceR	no, if that board or person has such leverage as redcrap does, then expect hell	Jul 09 12:25
MinceR	if they don't, expect people to just avoid and ignore that project	Jul 09 12:25
oiaohm	Not exactly true remember 1996 to 1998 we put pu with broken glibc	Jul 09 12:26
oiaohm	because the guy at the top at that at the time had no idea how to do QA	Jul 09 12:26
MinceR	we have other libc-s	Jul 09 12:26
MinceR	and we can even use them at the same time on the same system	Jul 09 12:27
oiaohm	MinceR: now we do	Jul 09 12:27
oiaohm	But back then there was not as much choice.	Jul 09 12:27
MinceR	i'm pretty sure by the time there was a glibc there were others too	Jul 09 12:27
MinceR	redhat's game is about taking all choice away	Jul 09 12:27
oiaohm	the branching of the glibc for Linux starts with redhat makign there own branch away from GNU.	Jul 09 12:28
oiaohm	After redhat puts up with the abuse from GNU for forking a project then the others like dietlibc and the like appear.	Jul 09 12:28
oiaohm	So at times redhat stuborn streak as been good.	Jul 09 12:29
MinceR	there are plenty of libc-s that are not glibc forks, afaik	Jul 09 12:29
oiaohm	At other times redhat stuborn streak brings misseries.	Jul 09 12:29
MinceR	whatever the bsd-s use, musl and bionic come to mind	Jul 09 12:29
oiaohm	musl is newer than the redhat fork.	Jul 09 12:29
oiaohm	The bsd one did not run on Linux kernels.	Jul 09 12:30
oiaohm	So big hissy fit about redhat historically in the end makes competitors that work appear.	Jul 09 12:30
oiaohm	So I am not exactly sure if Long term systemd will be looked back as a bad thing to have happened.	Jul 09 12:31
cubexyz	ok, I found a pre-dbus Linux	Jul 09 12:31
oiaohm	Ok we might be looking back using something completely different from a team than can properly do QA.	Jul 09 12:31
cubexyz	basic linux which is based on old slackware	Jul 09 12:31
oiaohm	cubexyz: dbus is not in KDE3 because KDE 3 was still using dcop	Jul 09 12:32
oiaohm	cubexyz: dbus is not exactly that old.	Jul 09 12:32
cubexyz	dbus-daemon is on my fc1 system	Jul 09 12:32
MinceR	part of why kde3 was reliable	Jul 09 12:32
cubexyz	it seems around 2002 era	Jul 09 12:32
cubexyz	that's what the copyright says	Jul 09 12:33
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MinceR	also, there was no broken shit like udisks2 or pulseaudio back then	Jul 09 12:33
MinceR	those were the days	Jul 09 12:33
cubexyz	I was referring to basic linux, which is pre-dbus-daemon	Jul 09 12:34
cubexyz	1999 era	Jul 09 12:34
cubexyz	which fits	Jul 09 12:34
oiaohm	MinceR: you are forgeting hald	Jul 09 12:34
MinceR	i don't remember any troubles with hald	Jul 09 12:34
oiaohm	MinceR: yes the userspace device extraction system design to be kernel so called neutral.	Jul 09 12:34
MinceR	then again, that didn't exist back then either, iirc	Jul 09 12:34
oiaohm	hald starts 1988	Jul 09 12:35
cubexyz	bl3 has init, kflushd, kupdate, kswapd, sh, getty, that's it	Jul 09 12:35
MinceR	i do remember udisks2 routinely dying	Jul 09 12:35
MinceR	without any documentation on how you're supposed to restart it	Jul 09 12:35
oiaohm	MinceR: hald is older than Linux.	Jul 09 12:35
oiaohm	And even worse documented than udisks	Jul 09 12:35
MinceR	and with some bullshit about how it will be started when needed	Jul 09 12:35
MinceR	yet i've never seen hald crash	Jul 09 12:35
oiaohm	MinceR: I had tablet input devices.	Jul 09 12:36
oiaohm	hald dieing was kinda a given.	Jul 09 12:36
MinceR	i think i got my thinkpad x-series tablet too late for that	Jul 09 12:37
oiaohm	http://linux.die.net/man/8/hald	Jul 09 12:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.die.net \| hald(8): HAL daemon - Linux man page		Jul 09 12:37
oiaohm	hald is what gets me hating sysvinit MinceR	Jul 09 12:38
cubexyz	ok, so I think dbus-daemon started around the redhat 8 era	Jul 09 12:38
oiaohm	Notice the restart instructions on that man page	Jul 09 12:38
MinceR	hald is not part of sysvinit, though	Jul 09 12:38
MinceR	and sysvinit doesn't depend on hald	Jul 09 12:38
oiaohm	MinceR: sysvinit starts hald but then cannot restart it.	Jul 09 12:38
MinceR	yeah, they managed to document how to restart it	Jul 09 12:39
MinceR	unlike udisks2	Jul 09 12:39
oiaohm	MinceR: hopefullly.	Jul 09 12:39
MinceR	oh, it's so hard to restart	Jul 09 12:39
oiaohm	pkill hald sometimes failed.	Jul 09 12:39
cubexyz	did hald predate Linux?	Jul 09 12:39
MinceR	it's 3 whole commands!	Jul 09 12:39
MinceR	if someone's scared by 3 commands, maybe they shouldn't be using a computer	Jul 09 12:39
oiaohm	MinceR: hald mafuncting is a forkbomb	Jul 09 12:39
oiaohm	pkill hald did not work in every case.	Jul 09 12:40
MinceR	but i totally want to have my entire OS hijacked just so it can be restarted automatically	Jul 09 12:40
MinceR	oh wait, if i wanted that, i could just go back to windows	Jul 09 12:40
oiaohm	MinceR: I really like openrc more than systemd	Jul 09 12:40
MinceR	windows is already broken in every way redhat wants to break linux-based os-es	Jul 09 12:40
MinceR	maybe they should just go back to windows.	Jul 09 12:40
MinceR	oiaohm: guess what, redhat is trying to destroy openrc.	Jul 09 12:41
oiaohm	udisk and the like was attempt to cure hald failures MinceR	Jul 09 12:41
cubexyz	if you want a simple linux to play around with on old old hardware then give bl3 a try	Jul 09 12:41
MinceR	"Gentoo folks, this is your wakeup call." -- as the asshole in the show-window said.	Jul 09 12:41
oiaohm	Mostly udisk and the like have worked.	Jul 09 12:41
MinceR	doesn't seem like that to me	Jul 09 12:41
MinceR	unless you mean "fall over and die" by "work"	Jul 09 12:42
MinceR	because udisks2 does _that_ just fine	Jul 09 12:42
oiaohm	MinceR: did you not notice the typo on the man page.	Jul 09 12:42
oiaohm	Yep /usr/sbin/hald --daemon=no --verbose=yes is the correct command to attempt to make sure hald is dead.	Jul 09 12:43
cubexyz	I'm still learning about KDE 3.5.10 stuff	Jul 09 12:43
MinceR	the -- having extra line breaks?	Jul 09 12:43
MinceR	i assumed that was some processing error	Jul 09 12:43
MinceR	specific to *roff syntax or whatever	Jul 09 12:43
oiaohm	MinceR: that typo is in the offical man page.	Jul 09 12:44
MinceR	(i don't know *roff that well)	Jul 09 12:44
oiaohm	MinceR: source	Jul 09 12:44
oiaohm	MinceR: never been fixed in 12+ years	Jul 09 12:44
MinceR	redhat fixes that by not writing documentation	Jul 09 12:44
oiaohm	In fact 20+ years	Jul 09 12:44
cubexyz	have you guys done any dbus programming?	Jul 09 12:44
MinceR	(or documentation of any worth)	Jul 09 12:44
MinceR	cubexyz: i've attempted to send dbus messages from the command line	Jul 09 12:44
MinceR	it made me miss dcop.	Jul 09 12:44
oiaohm	cubexyz: Yes I have. I hate most of the current dbus libraries.	Jul 09 12:45
MinceR	(it was probably for a shell script)	Jul 09 12:46
oiaohm	MinceR: there is something even more creative about hald that makes you hate it more.	Jul 09 12:46
oiaohm	this /usr/sbin/hald --daemon=no --verbose=yes in fact accept application requests.	Jul 09 12:46
oiaohm	So any application that talks to the hald while you are testing can get massively upset and crash because it has existed.	Jul 09 12:47
cubexyz	and no one writes nroff man pages, may as well mention that :)	Jul 09 12:47
cubexyz	lazy bastards	Jul 09 12:47
MinceR	oiaohm: you mean 'exited'?	Jul 09 12:47
oiaohm	MinceR: since you set no daemon it going to quit.	Jul 09 12:48
MinceR	dbus reimplemented that flaw	Jul 09 12:48
MinceR	i thought daemon=no simply means it remains attached to the terminal you run it from	Jul 09 12:48
MinceR	(or avoids forking if your service manager works better that way)	Jul 09 12:49
oiaohm	MinceR: on most other things you are correct.	Jul 09 12:49
oiaohm	MinceR: hald made it also equal quit	Jul 09 12:49
oiaohm	Just to be super fun.	Jul 09 12:49
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cubexyz	I think my slackware box still has hald	Jul 09 12:50
cubexyz	didn't the other linuxes deprecate hald?	Jul 09 12:50
oiaohm	cubexyz: you use to require hald so X11 server would run.	Jul 09 12:51
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Pisi Linux...Still Alive!	Jul 09 12:51
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/AEynEfPqq5	Jul 09 12:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxmigrante.blogspot.co.uk \| La Esquina de un Migrante a Linux: Pisi Linux...Still Alive!		Jul 09 12:51
TweetTuxMachines	(linuxmigrante.blogspot.co.uk)	Jul 09 12:51
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2w6f	Jul 09 12:51
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Launchpad Development Starts Again	Jul 09 12:51
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Oo0G0e2uJy (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 12:51
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2w6g	Jul 09 12:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Launchpad Development Starts Again \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 12:51
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Canonical Closes HAProxy Issues in Ubuntu 15.04	Jul 09 12:51
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/i6M4JJCZ9b (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 12:51
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-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Canonical Closes HAProxy Issues in Ubuntu 15.04 \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 12:51
oiaohm	cubexyz: hald is nuked by udev and upower, udisk and so on.	Jul 09 12:52
oiaohm	cubexyz: you can choose to still install hald for backwards compadiblity.	Jul 09 12:52
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 Gets the Latest systemd 222	Jul 09 14:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/BJMO1uP9Ui (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 14:28
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-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Ubuntu 15.10 Gets the Latest systemd 222 \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 14:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Another day, another OpenSSL patch	Jul 09 14:28
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/zM6DHRMaLB (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 14:28
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2wv9	Jul 09 14:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Another day, another OpenSSL patch \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 14:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines ChaletOS 14.04.2 review - Digital white	Jul 09 14:29
TweetTuxMachines	chocolate http://t.co/4uqLgf3Wy5	Jul 09 14:29
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 14:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| ChaletOS 14.04.2 review - Digital white chocolate \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 14:29
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Ubuntu 15.10 Gets the Latest systemd 222	Jul 09 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/auZPbCZaGu (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 18:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Ubuntu 15.10 Gets the Latest systemd 222 - Softpedia		Jul 09 18:47
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Canonical Closes HAProxy Issues in Ubuntu 15.04	Jul 09 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/svvdVuNSZJ (linux.softpedia.com)	Jul 09 19:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linux.softpedia.com \| Canonical Closes HAProxy Issues in Ubuntu 15.04 - Softpedia		Jul 09 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2yqn	Jul 09 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android based videoconferencing system does	Jul 09 19:07
TweetTuxMachines	9-way sessions http://t.co/ZX5y9xtflP	Jul 09 19:07
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 19:07
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2yqp	Jul 09 19:07
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Android based videoconferencing system does 9-way sessions \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 19:07
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines K12 autonomous Botball contest taps	Jul 09 19:07
TweetTuxMachines	Linux-on-Sitara design http://t.co/sC3vhgwbRl	Jul 09 19:07
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 19:07
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2yqr	Jul 09 19:07
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| K12 autonomous Botball contest taps Linux-on-Sitara design \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 19:07
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Metztli_IT/status/619286877418303488	Jul 09 19:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Metztli_IT: .@ORCL_Linux(#RHEL) 7 #openssl version …1.0.1e-fips 11 Feb 2013 affected from 1.0.1n /1.0.2b https://t.co/f4wYLYz85Z https://t.co/g7i5MaNmPz		Jul 09 19:28
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schestowitz	http://communities-dominate.blogs.com/brands/2015/07/last-lifeline-from-microsoft-to-soon-to-end-lumia-handset-unit-7800-more-jobs-lost-and-76b-written-o.html	Jul 09 19:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-communities-dominate.blogs.com \| Communities Dominate Brands: Last Lifeline from Microsoft to Soon-to-End Lumia Handset Unit - 7,800 more jobs lost and $7.6B written off the books [ http://ur1.ca/n2yya ]		Jul 09 19:42
schestowitz	see also comments	Jul 09 19:42
schestowitz	Lars Noodén wrote on 09/07/15 20:24:	Jul 09 19:44
schestowitz	> https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20150705/18174231556/spain-government-goes-full-police-state-enacts-law-forbidding-dissent-unauthorized-photography-law-enforcement.shtml	Jul 09 19:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.techdirt.com \| Spain Government Goes Full Police State; Enacts Law Forbidding Dissent, 'Unauthorized' Photography Of Law Enforcement \| Techdirt [ http://ur1.ca/n2yyo ]		Jul 09 19:44
schestowitz	>	Jul 09 19:44
schestowitz	> see also the long thread in misc@	Jul 09 19:44
schestowitz	Wrong link?	Jul 09 19:44
schestowitz	https://soylentnews.org/breakingnews/article.pl?sid=15/07/08/1840235	Jul 09 19:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://soylentnews.org/breakingnews/article.pl?sid=15/07/08/1840235 )		Jul 09 19:45
schestowitz	https://2015.eurobsdcon.org/talks/	Jul 09 19:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-2015.eurobsdcon.org \| Talks \| EuroBSDcon 2015		Jul 09 19:46
schestowitz	>	Jul 09 19:53
schestowitz	> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/facebook/11728422/Facebook-Music-Social-network-may-rival-Spotify-and-Apple-with-its-own-streaming-service.html	Jul 09 19:53
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.telegraph.co.uk \| Facebook Music: Social network may rival Spotify and Apple with its own streaming service - Telegraph [ http://ur1.ca/n2z07 ]		Jul 09 19:53
schestowitz	>	Jul 09 19:53
schestowitz	> ==	Jul 09 19:53
schestowitz	>	Jul 09 19:53
schestowitz	> "According to the defense team the court was wrong to	Jul 09 19:53
schestowitz	> label Dotcom and his colleagues as fugitives, a claim	Jul 09 19:53
schestowitz	> which is now supported by several legal expert"	Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	> https://torrentfreak.com/prominent-legal-experts-rally-behind-megaupload-150709/	Jul 09 19:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-torrentfreak.com \| Prominent Legal Experts Rally Behind Megaupload - TorrentFreak [ http://ur1.ca/n2z0b ]		Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	> ==	Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	> http://arstechnica.com/security/2015/07/critical-openssl-bug-allows-attackers-to-impersonate-any-trusted-server/	Jul 09 19:54
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-arstechnica.com \| Critical OpenSSL bug allows attackers to impersonate any trusted server \| Ars Technica [ http://ur1.ca/n2z0c ]		Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	> ==	Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	>	Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	> https://2015.eurobsdcon.org/talks/	Jul 09 19:54
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/mangel_joe/status/619292692166656000	Jul 09 19:55
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mangel_joe: @showbizmcr @schestowitz Also, first tram times are before 6am so I guess those drivers start before 5am. Not really "decent hours" there.		Jul 09 19:55
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Luisja_350/status/619293231491219456	Jul 09 19:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Luisja_350: @schestowitz It's cheaper to keep the mouth shut. #LeyMordaza		Jul 09 19:57
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Five lightweight Linux desktop worlds for	Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	extreme open-sourcers http://t.co/X86ZdFcxce	Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2z3g	Jul 09 20:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Five lightweight Linux desktop worlds for extreme open-sourcers \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The truth is just a download away: Why we need	Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	open source more than ever	Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/mGyPnO0EMY (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2z3h	Jul 09 20:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| The truth is just a download away: Why we need open source more than ever \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines K12 autonomous Botball contest taps	Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	Linux-on-Sitara design http://t.co/C1NjMI6os2	Jul 09 20:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| K12 autonomous Botball contest taps Linux-on-Sitara design · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	(linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 09 20:08
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2z3i	Jul 09 20:08
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Android based videoconferencing system does	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	9-way sessions http://t.co/C1NjMI6os2	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	(linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zcj	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Five lightweight Linux desktop worlds for	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	extreme open-sourcers http://t.co/rFRQdbNXn8	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	(www.theregister.co.uk)	Jul 09 20:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theregister.co.uk \| Five lightweight Linux desktop worlds for extreme open-sourcers • The Register		Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zck	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The People Who Support Linux: SysAdmin Rigs	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	Raspberry Pi for Racing Pigeons	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/dooCPTBvAu (www.linux.com)	Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zcl	Jul 09 20:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| The People Who Support Linux: SysAdmin Rigs Raspberry Pi for Racing Pigeons \| Linux.com		Jul 09 20:58
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Krita 2.9.6 released! https://t.co/cpVEjsEA2b	Jul 09 21:17
TweetTuxMachines	(krita.org)	Jul 09 21:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zg5	Jul 09 21:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-krita.org \| Krita 2.9.6 released! \| Krita		Jul 09 21:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Krita 2.9.6 released! http://t.co/Co2DLFRLSX	Jul 09 21:17
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 09 21:17
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zg6	Jul 09 21:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Krita 2.9.6 released! \| Tux Machines		Jul 09 21:17
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines "It is still a WIP and it is also quite early,	Jul 09 21:18
TweetTuxMachines	but if you want to try out Snappy Personal	Jul 09 21:18
TweetTuxMachines	Desktop," http://t.co/teFD5oLzv6	Jul 09 21:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-carla-sella.blogspot.co.uk \| Carla Sella (Letozaf_ ): Snappy Personal Desktop		Jul 09 21:18
TweetTuxMachines	(carla-sella.blogspot.co.uk)	Jul 09 21:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n2zg7	Jul 09 21:18
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Chartoc/status/619293996981088256	Jul 09 21:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Chartoc: @VCR_Blog @SolidHebime @kishroka months? try years http://t.co/oj5aPBN2kB		Jul 09 21:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| Richard Stallman and Bruce Perens Defamed by Troll \| Techrights		Jul 09 21:24
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oiaohm	http://yro.slashdot.org/story/15/07/09/187204/french-government-it-directorate-supports-odf-rejects-ooxml this is fun	Jul 09 22:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-yro.slashdot.org \| French Government IT Directorate Supports ODF, Rejects OOXML - Slashdot [ http://ur1.ca/n2zon ]		Jul 09 22:03
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Unvanquished Alpha 41 Released, Still Moving	Jul 10 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	Towards NaCl VM Usage http://t.co/FMnFWQ4Syq	Jul 10 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 10 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3094	Jul 10 00:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Unvanquished Alpha 41 Released, Still Moving Towards NaCl VM Usage - Phoronix		Jul 10 00:02
*TweetTuxMachines @mispaginasfavor followed @tuxmachines		Jul 10 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines UC Berkeley, Cal Poly Receive $6 Million for	Jul 10 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	Open Source Project http://t.co/D0tiOyCrwY	Jul 10 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 00:02
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3095	Jul 10 00:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| UC Berkeley, Cal Poly Receive $6 Million for Open Source Project \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 00:02
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/Metztli_IT/status/619316540052127744	Jul 10 04:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Metztli_IT: .@Virtualbox 5.0 Brings Awesome New Features http://t.co/AmjFDTQH7z via @schestowitz https://t.co/2ReKJyk90w		Jul 10 04:19
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/RegularClaw/status/619396359783776256	Jul 10 04:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@RegularClaw: @schestowitz LO...L?		Jul 10 04:20
schestowitz	https://www.joindiaspora.com/posts/6313809	Jul 10 04:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Not a Diaspora post?		Jul 10 04:24
schestowitz	https://www.joindiaspora.com/posts/6313809	Jul 10 04:24
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines VirtualBox 5.0 http://t.co/Y8y8fEVeI6	Jul 10 05:40
TweetTuxMachines	retweeted by (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 05:40
TweetTuxMachines	@LukeVizzicks	Jul 10 05:40
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n31qk	Jul 10 05:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| VirtualBox 5.0 \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 05:40
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today and Yesterday in Techrights	Jul 10 09:35
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/uvwTMkdVMZ (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 09:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n33cb	Jul 10 09:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today and Yesterday in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 09:35
*TweetTuxMachines got exception: Unexpected end of ZLIB input stream ; reconnecting to Twitter...		Jul 10 09:35
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__martin__	MinceR: http://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NSA-KDBUS-Credentials	Jul 10 10:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-phoronix.com \| The NSA Is Looking At Systemd's KDBUS - Phoronix [ http://ur1.ca/n33th ]		Jul 10 10:16
__martin__	anyways, from that ubuntu -> devuan distro hopping; i've ended up at devuan -> steamos for a while and most recently switched to oma aka openmandriva	Jul 10 10:17
MinceR	nsa's dream, a backdoor in the kernel	Jul 10 10:18
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oiaohm	http://newsoffice.mit.edu/2015/computer-program-fixes-old-code-faster-than-expert-engineers-0609 This is becoming no more secrets	Jul 10 10:43
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-newsoffice.mit.edu \| Computer program fixes old code faster than expert engineers \| MIT News [ http://ur1.ca/n340y ]		Jul 10 10:43
MinceR	so does mine	Jul 10 10:45
MinceR	sudo apt-get remove systemd	Jul 10 10:45
oiaohm	MinceR: did you know not being able to use keyboard in boot to control fsck and the like is common in any sysvinit fork to allow parallel booting.	Jul 10 10:49
MinceR	yet another reason to not do parallel booting	Jul 10 10:50
oiaohm	But it double sided.	Jul 10 10:51
oiaohm	parallel booting from performance point of view make sense.	Jul 10 10:52
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MinceR	except if your computer does not run windows and as such you rarely reboot it, it doesn't make any sense	Jul 10 10:52
MinceR	especially if it makes booting less reliable	Jul 10 10:52
MinceR	of course it's still an attractive target to ricers	Jul 10 10:53
oiaohm	There is a catch here.	Jul 10 10:53
oiaohm	Most Linux distrobution default has been a percentage parallel	Jul 10 10:53
oiaohm	Since the year 2000	Jul 10 10:53
oiaohm	This is where the arguement against it comes it bits MinceR	Jul 10 10:53
oiaohm	Question is ammount and how	Jul 10 10:54
oiaohm	Some thing startting parallel with each other is not a issue	Jul 10 10:54
MinceR	yeah, race conditions are not an issue	Jul 10 10:54
MinceR	why would anyone think they are?	Jul 10 10:54
MinceR	also, "most Linux distributions do it" is not a good reason	Jul 10 10:55
oiaohm	Not all parrell boot solutions suffer from race conditions.	Jul 10 10:55
MinceR	especially since the migration to lendows	Jul 10 10:55
oiaohm	MinceR: BSD implements parrell 1996	Jul 10 10:55
oiaohm	Before even NT did it.	Jul 10 10:55
MinceR	openrc lets you turn it off, so if it fails, you can try again	Jul 10 10:55
oiaohm	MinceR: see there is the feature you want.	Jul 10 10:56
oiaohm	Not that systemd has parrell but the option to disable it in case if usse.	Jul 10 10:56
oiaohm	usse/issue	Jul 10 10:56
oiaohm	MinceR: basically parallel booting is not the problem. The controls on parallel booting are the problem.	Jul 10 10:57
__martin__	lel, dat davinci surveillance suite from "the hacking team" leveraged even 0day within selinux... as the news flow	Jul 10 10:57
__martin__	(apart from a dopeee fla$h)	Jul 10 10:58
oiaohm	MinceR: Like I know ways with systemd to make it not start any sevices until the fsck is compete by setting wants on the mounts at particular points.	Jul 10 10:58
MinceR	oiaohm: still, there are use cases where reducing reliability for the sake of saving a few seconds on boot (which rarely happens) is not a good tradeoff	Jul 10 10:59
MinceR	yeah, my favorite way of doing that is replacing systemd with an init system (and userland) that actually works	Jul 10 10:59
oiaohm	MinceR: we have multi core processes these days.	Jul 10 11:00
oiaohm	It not about reducing relaiblity.	Jul 10 11:01
oiaohm	History parrell booting of stuff does not cause that as long as correct locking design is in place.	Jul 10 11:01
MinceR	most of our services don't depend on that	Jul 10 11:01
MinceR	special case solutions belong to special cases	Jul 10 11:01
oiaohm	Most services are single threaded in the start up.	Jul 10 11:02
oiaohm	So starting 3 to 4 at a time that are not overlapping with each other is no problem.	Jul 10 11:02
MinceR	unless one of them depends on another	Jul 10 11:02
oiaohm	Even starting a few 100 at a time.	Jul 10 11:02
__martin__	https://ht.transparencytoolkit.org/KnowledgeBase/Invisibility%20Report%209.6%20-%20%5DHT%5B%20%3a%3a%20KnowledgeBase%20Product.html	Jul 10 11:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 503 @ https://ht.transparencytoolkit.org/KnowledgeBase/Invisibility%20Report%209.6%20-%20%5DHT%5B%20%3a%3a%20KnowledgeBase%20Product.html )		Jul 10 11:02
oiaohm	MinceR: even starting single booting if you start them in the wrong order you have dependancy failure.	Jul 10 11:02
MinceR	yeah, but there's only one order you'll use	Jul 10 11:03
MinceR	so one booting is sufficient to figure out if it works	Jul 10 11:03
MinceR	if you add lots of possibilities for race conditions, suddenly testing takes up more time than you would save.	Jul 10 11:03
oiaohm	Ever wondered why openrc and systemd support full container wrapping of services.	Jul 10 11:04
oiaohm	There is a very pracitcal reason to prevent a lot of possible race condition issues.	Jul 10 11:04
oiaohm	Also you have to remember once the service is started it has to be running parrall to the other services anyhow.	Jul 10 11:05
oiaohm	MinceR: ever head of /tmp directory collisions/exploits.	Jul 10 11:06
oiaohm	head/heard	Jul 10 11:06
MinceR	ever heard of mkstemp?	Jul 10 11:06
MinceR	once the service is successfully started, its prerequisites were already met	Jul 10 11:07
oiaohm	http://man7.org/linux/man-pages/man3/mkstemp.3.html has a bug	Jul 10 11:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-man7.org \| mkstemp(3) - Linux manual page [ http://ur1.ca/n345h ]		Jul 10 11:08
oiaohm	Notice 6 char limit MinceR	Jul 10 11:08
oiaohm	MinceR: service successfully started question how does sysvinit like systems know that.	Jul 10 11:10
MinceR	yeah, that's so easy to exploit	Jul 10 11:10
MinceR	especially if you unlink the file right after opening it	Jul 10 11:10
oiaohm	MinceR: there is a Linux way to create the temp file unlinked	Jul 10 11:11
oiaohm	Its not the mkstemp command.	Jul 10 11:11
oiaohm	MinceR: please also note unlink after opening gives the window for some to to race condition it. If they open the file before you unlink it the file can be blocked from unlinking.	Jul 10 11:15
oiaohm	MinceR: http://lcamtuf.coredump.cx/tmp_paper.txt <<Attacking a system by the /tmp directory is nothing new.	Jul 10 11:19
MinceR	neither is attacking a system by forcing it to use systemd.	Jul 10 11:19
oiaohm	cgroup/jails/zones file system limitations is a very effective method if limiting the attack.	Jul 10 11:19
oiaohm	MinceR: the issue is you are head in sand.	Jul 10 11:20
oiaohm	The problem why systemd is being pushed by redhat so hard is a long list of problems.	Jul 10 11:20
oiaohm	Ok openrc at least can address a good percentage of them.	Jul 10 11:20
oiaohm	But a lot of stuff people says let us keep this is in fact broken crap.	Jul 10 11:21
MinceR	yes, i am	Jul 10 11:21
MinceR	because systemd is flawless	Jul 10 11:21
oiaohm	So of course Redhat will not take anyone serousally who pushes the idea of going back to broken crap.	Jul 10 11:21
MinceR	of course, redcrap is pushing switching to broken crap	Jul 10 11:22
oiaohm	If you argue for the usage of openrc	Jul 10 11:22
MinceR	which is "forward" for you	Jul 10 11:22
oiaohm	and accept that cgroups and other tech has to come.	Jul 10 11:22
MinceR	none of that tech requires a hairball in pid1	Jul 10 11:22
MinceR	none of that tech requires extreme lock-in	Jul 10 11:22
MinceR	none of that tech requires undocumented spaghetti code	Jul 10 11:22
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MinceR	so redcrap can go and stuff their evil crap where the sun doesn't shine.	Jul 10 11:23
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oiaohm	Undocumented spagehetti code is in fact found in sysvinit system.	Jul 10 11:23
oiaohm	Strange breakages of that stuff is what lead to systemd having unit files.	Jul 10 11:23
MinceR	unit files are broken	Jul 10 11:24
MinceR	a typo can make the new version of a unit file be silently ignored by systemd	Jul 10 11:25
MinceR	at least shell parsers are pretty mature by now	Jul 10 11:25
MinceR	systemd will never be mature.	Jul 10 11:25
oiaohm	MinceR: a typo in a sysvinit script can in fact render the computer not bootable at times.	Jul 10 11:25
MinceR	oiaohm: systemd does not need a typo anywhere to render the computer unbootable.	Jul 10 11:26
oiaohm	Sorry scale of bad here.	Jul 10 11:26
oiaohm	Unit files failures being silent is a problem.	Jul 10 11:26
MinceR	it is a problem among thousands.	Jul 10 11:26
MinceR	systemd is a can of worms.	Jul 10 11:27
oiaohm	sysvinit systems are also a can of worms	Jul 10 11:27
MinceR	sysvinit can be replaced. systemd cannot.	Jul 10 11:27
oiaohm	Exactly why do you keep on saying that bogus.	Jul 10 11:27
oiaohm	systemd can be replaced	Jul 10 11:27
MinceR	redcrap made sure to put dependencies on systemd everywhere	Jul 10 11:28
MinceR	specifically to make it as difficult to replace as possible.	Jul 10 11:28
MinceR	redcrap is using microsoftian tactics to take over our computers.	Jul 10 11:28
oiaohm	Not really that difficualt to swap systemd in and out of a system.	Jul 10 11:28
MinceR	and there's a large cult following who also put dependencies wherever they can	Jul 10 11:29
MinceR	like kde	Jul 10 11:29
oiaohm	KDE does not have any solid lock on systemd at this stage.	Jul 10 11:29
MinceR	they've announced to add it in august	Jul 10 11:29
MinceR	parts of that cult are working to destroy the bsd-s as well.	Jul 10 11:29
oiaohm	The only thing out of systemd that kinda haves a solid lock is logind but that has clones.	Jul 10 11:29
MinceR	no, that's not the only thing	Jul 10 11:30
oiaohm	You did not read the announcement fully did you MinceR	Jul 10 11:30
MinceR	i did	Jul 10 11:30
oiaohm	Pull up that KDE annonuncement and re read it.	Jul 10 11:30
oiaohm	It only means logind.	Jul 10 11:30
oiaohm	Other systemd parts are optional and will remain that way.	Jul 10 11:30
MinceR	sure	Jul 10 11:31
MinceR	they'll call them "optional"	Jul 10 11:31
MinceR	and their code will deliberately break (even worse than usual) if those "optional" parts are missing	Jul 10 11:31
oiaohm	fact that consolekit2 has logind this means the new kde will work with sysvinit as long as distrobution has updated there consolekit	Jul 10 11:31
MinceR	also, journald is not "optional"	Jul 10 11:31
MinceR	it takes over your log entries whether you want it or not.	Jul 10 11:31
oiaohm	Funny did you not read the manual that you can point journald conf file to /dev/null then systemd runs old syslog solution.	Jul 10 11:34
oiaohm	MinceR: this is the problem.	Jul 10 11:34
oiaohm	A lot of claims about systemd are bogus.	Jul 10 11:34
MinceR	yeah, poettering claims that the claims are bogus	Jul 10 11:34
MinceR	and while systemd apologists go around claiming that systemd is flawless, it fucks up production systems routinely.	Jul 10 11:35
MinceR	and you know, i'd have no problem with this if they didn't use all the leverage they could get to force their malware on me.	Jul 10 11:35
MinceR	they have the right to write malicious crap code	Jul 10 11:35
MinceR	they don't have the right to force people to run it.	Jul 10 11:36
oiaohm	Really I understand the force.	Jul 10 11:36
MinceR	of course	Jul 10 11:36
MinceR	redcrap thinks this is good business	Jul 10 11:36
oiaohm	We have had 20 years + of a particular set of issues being ingored	Jul 10 11:36
oiaohm	No	Jul 10 11:36
MinceR	kill the competition or make their clients depend on redcrap support contracts	Jul 10 11:36
oiaohm	Its not exactly good for business.	Jul 10 11:36
oiaohm	Redhat attempted to avoid making systemd in the first place.	Jul 10 11:36
MinceR	they don't seem to realize that.	Jul 10 11:36
MinceR	the funny thing will be once redcrap eliminates all competition, m$ will revoke their uefi certificate	Jul 10 11:37
MinceR	and then redcrap will die too.	Jul 10 11:37
oiaohm	The thing you keep on missing is where every redhat wants lockin it closed source.	Jul 10 11:39
oiaohm	Or restricted supply.	Jul 10 11:39
MinceR	you seem to miss the fact that systemd is designed for nonfree replacements.	Jul 10 11:39
MinceR	it's licensed under LGPL 2.1	Jul 10 11:39
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MinceR	and it uses dbus interfaces heavily	Jul 10 11:39
oiaohm	Redhat is basically sick of the support issues sysvinit was.	Jul 10 11:39
MinceR	it's trivial to move dbus services to nonfree blobs.	Jul 10 11:39
MinceR	then they're welcome to close shop.	Jul 10 11:39
oiaohm	MinceR: look up what other init systems were licensed under.	Jul 10 11:40
MinceR	nobody needs them to try and kill unix.	Jul 10 11:40
MinceR	except microsoft	Jul 10 11:40
oiaohm	LGPL is in fact one of the most restrictive llicenses uses on a init system.	Jul 10 11:40
oiaohm	Most are BSD or worse	Jul 10 11:40
MinceR	oiaohm: other "init systems" did not depend on thousands of modules that did things unrelated to init.	Jul 10 11:40
MinceR	other "init systems" have a scope.	Jul 10 11:40
MinceR	systemd has no scope.	Jul 10 11:40
oiaohm	scope complaint is valid.	Jul 10 11:40
MinceR	even poettering is unable to define what systemd is intended to be.	Jul 10 11:40
oiaohm	License complaint really not.	Jul 10 11:41
MinceR	it's just like cancer: it's trying to take over everything	Jul 10 11:41
MinceR	really, the license is unnecessary as they can simply exploit dbus.	Jul 10 11:41
oiaohm	MinceR: remember you cannot be too restrictive in a init system licesing.	Jul 10 11:41
MinceR	why not?	Jul 10 11:41
oiaohm	A pure GPL licensed init system kinda would be a bugger for likes of openssh that are not GPL.	Jul 10 11:42
oiaohm	Really LGPL is about as tight as you can go. Ok GPL with a exception clause.	Jul 10 11:43
MinceR	how is openssh linked to the init system?	Jul 10 11:43
oiaohm	MinceR: its init scripts to register itself.	Jul 10 11:43
oiaohm	Too viral of license becomes a problem.	Jul 10 11:44
MinceR	init scripts are executed, afaik that does not cause any obligations regarding GPL.	Jul 10 11:44
oiaohm	That is wrong under sysvinit if it was GPL.	Jul 10 11:44
MinceR	if they want to do dependency handling, they'll also read comments in init scripts, that also doesn't cause any obligations	Jul 10 11:44
oiaohm	Becuase you have the functions common script.	Jul 10 11:44
oiaohm	That you import and use.	Jul 10 11:44
MinceR	strange, i thought sysvinit on debian was attacked exactly because it didn't use such a script	Jul 10 11:45
MinceR	while at least one bsd did (and as a result, had far shorter init scripts, typically shorter than a unit file)	Jul 10 11:45
MinceR	it's funny how systemd fanboys cherry-pick their "facts" to support their favorite malware	Jul 10 11:45
MinceR	(maybe second favorite, after windows)	Jul 10 11:46
oiaohm	MinceR: debian renamed it but the beast still exists . /lib/lsb/init-functions	Jul 10 11:46
MinceR	even so, they can get away with licensing that file differently	Jul 10 11:47
oiaohm	MinceR: please note that just the most common embedded	Jul 10 11:47
oiaohm	But its not the only case of a fragement of sysvinit base being embeded into a script.	Jul 10 11:48
oiaohm	So if you are sticking to script based the licensing you can go to is kinda restricted to something not to bad viral or solutions will not be able to customise it.	Jul 10 11:49
oiaohm	This is why complaining about LGPL on systemd does not make much sense.	Jul 10 11:50
oiaohm	Anything more than LGPL and it starts becoming unworkable.	Jul 10 11:50
MinceR	it makes sense in the context of how the FSF supports systemd but doesn't support the LLVM debugger in emacs	Jul 10 11:50
MinceR	also, even if a service package was published with an rc script that sources a script that comes with an init/rc system, they can license their init/rc script differently	Jul 10 11:51
oiaohm	Now if you were naming particular parts of systemd that should be broken out to be made independant projects under more restrictive you might have an agurement.	Jul 10 11:52
MinceR	also, you brought up openssh, which is published under a BSD license without advertising clause	Jul 10 11:52
MinceR	therefore it's already compatible with GPL.	Jul 10 11:52
MinceR	there is plenty of functionality in systemd that belongs in independent projects.	Jul 10 11:52
MinceR	unfortunately, they tend to throw in even more unrelated functionality there	Jul 10 11:53
oiaohm	MinceR: but if you bundling a part that contains some GPL code that infects the BSD work. If it was LGPL code the result is not a hazard.	Jul 10 11:53
MinceR	they assimilated udev, then they assimilated gummiboot, and who knows what else.	Jul 10 11:53
oiaohm	the License problem is packaging	Jul 10 11:53
MinceR	oiaohm: how does it "infect" the BSD work?	Jul 10 11:53
oiaohm	MinceR: GPL is infecting to what it shipping with. So a init script with some GPL code in by mistake shipped in BSD project archive we have a problem.	Jul 10 11:54
oiaohm	LGPL is not viral that way.	Jul 10 11:54
MinceR	why would a BSD project ship the code it sources?	Jul 10 11:55
oiaohm	MinceR: init script code the file it needs to regisger into the init. Like they based off the init systems example.	Jul 10 11:55
MinceR	that doesn't explain anything	Jul 10 11:55
oiaohm	for a service to start by a init system MinceR it need to register with the init system right	Jul 10 11:56
MinceR	to do so its rc script will source a file from the init/rc system	Jul 10 11:56
oiaohm	Where you get your template file from to make that registration bit can become toxic if the license is too restrictive.	Jul 10 11:56
MinceR	the rc script of the project is GPL-compatible BSDL	Jul 10 11:57
MinceR	the sourced script is GPL	Jul 10 11:57
MinceR	where's the problem?	Jul 10 11:57
oiaohm	BSD is compadible to be put in GPL.	Jul 10 11:57
MinceR	also, since when does it matter in the case of systemd, which doesn't use shell scripts?	Jul 10 11:57
oiaohm	But GPL is not compadible to be put in BSD	Jul 10 11:57
oiaohm	Its one way compadiblity MinceR	Jul 10 11:57
MinceR	it's not "put in BSD", it's not part of the BSDL-ed project	Jul 10 11:58
MinceR	if it's a problem, anyone can relicense the BSDL-ed init/rc script under GPL	Jul 10 11:58
oiaohm	systemd uses Unit files and it has example unit files right MinceR	Jul 10 11:58
oiaohm	sysvinit has examples as well right.	Jul 10 11:58
oiaohm	remember those examples are under the project main license.	Jul 10 11:58
MinceR	so, writing your own unit/rc file infringes on the examples?	Jul 10 11:59
MinceR	i wonder what court would accept such an argument	Jul 10 11:59
oiaohm	Not exactly writing own. Instead of writing your own you take a template one and modify it.	Jul 10 11:59
oiaohm	Problem is this issue has held up in court in the past for basic copyright infrignement.	Jul 10 12:00
oiaohm	On word templates and the like.	Jul 10 12:00
MinceR	i don't have to take a template and modify it	Jul 10 12:00
MinceR	also, it makes sense to license the templates differently if this is a problem.	Jul 10 12:00
MinceR	also, again, this doesn't apply to the spaghetti code written in c	Jul 10 12:01
MinceR	as that is not incorporated in or linked to unit files	Jul 10 12:01
oiaohm	MinceR: for a safety case template files have to be licensed under LGPL or weaker.	Jul 10 12:01
oiaohm	Ie no viral cause.	Jul 10 12:01
MinceR	c source code is not "template files"	Jul 10 12:01
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MinceR	neither in sysvinit nor in systemd.	Jul 10 12:02
oiaohm	sysvinit is very weak license on it C files.	Jul 10 12:02
MinceR	so redcrap still has no excuse for making extra provisions to allow for nonfree code to be linked to systemd.	Jul 10 12:02
MinceR	sysvinit also doesn't try to force your hand via lock-in, unlike systemd.	Jul 10 12:02
oiaohm	sysvinit you can take it core init source and make a closed binary and never show anyone the source code.	Jul 10 12:03
MinceR	sysvinit is easy to swap out for another init system, which has been done in many cases.	Jul 10 12:03
oiaohm	Nonfree code exactly where.	Jul 10 12:04
oiaohm	most init systems support non free code connections MinceR	Jul 10 12:04
MinceR	you'll find out once redcrap manages to kill its competitors.	Jul 10 12:04
MinceR	you walk right into their trap and invite others to follow.	Jul 10 12:04
oiaohm	Any new init system like upstart openrc..... you could attempt to make the arguement about allowing nonfree code to be linked	Jul 10 12:05
oiaohm	Even the bsd init you could make that arguement MinceR	Jul 10 12:05
MinceR	no other "init system" tries to add as much crap as possible	Jul 10 12:06
oiaohm	Systemd doing too much that is a valid arguement.	Jul 10 12:06
oiaohm	Allowing closed source link in since all open source init systems allow this that is nothing to complain about.	Jul 10 12:07
MinceR	systemd doing too much _and_ being designed to be replaced with nonfree code is even worse.	Jul 10 12:07
MinceR	(not that its current code lends itself particularly well to modification)	Jul 10 12:08
oiaohm	MinceR: but all current init systems are design to allow nonfree code replacment of parts.	Jul 10 12:09
MinceR	oiaohm: most current init systems aren't designed for nonfree extensions, their scope being pretty limited.	Jul 10 12:10
oiaohm	MinceR: I forgot there is 1 exception.	Jul 10 12:10
oiaohm	Only open source init system that is under a license that prevents non free usage is https://www.gnu.org/software/dmd/	Jul 10 12:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gnu.org \| dmd - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation		Jul 10 12:11
oiaohm	And it fairly much a brick.	Jul 10 12:11
MinceR	and the FSF seems to be abandoning it	Jul 10 12:11
MinceR	since they decided that they prefer Gratis Windows to Free Software	Jul 10 12:11
MinceR	maybe they should rename themselves to GWF.	Jul 10 12:12
oiaohm	MinceR: the thing you have missed is like networkmanager and the like you think about how many parts inside sysvinit that have been replaced.	Jul 10 12:13
oiaohm	Ok sysvinit was out a glued up single project.	Jul 10 12:13
oiaohm	If systemd broke up in some ways it would be better.	Jul 10 12:14
oiaohm	Broken up would allow better licensing assignment for it parts.	Jul 10 12:14
MinceR	yeah, networkmanager sucks too	Jul 10 12:14
oiaohm	Ie some parts should be LGPL or lower and some sould be GPL	Jul 10 12:15
MinceR	you can use different licenses even on files hosted in the same repository.	Jul 10 12:15
MinceR	i suspect it was networkmanager on my server that had the brilliant idea of getting an ip address over dhcp on boot and then forgetting completely about dhcp	Jul 10 12:16
oiaohm	The outer license has to be the most restrictive when it comes to viral licenses.	Jul 10 12:16
MinceR	so even unplugging and replugging the cable wouldn't get it to get a new address	Jul 10 12:16
MinceR	so i had to reboot the server to make it accessible on the network.	Jul 10 12:16
MinceR	it's called "copyleft", not "viral"	Jul 10 12:16
MinceR	unless you work for microsoft, of course.	Jul 10 12:16
oiaohm	copyleft covers LGPL	Jul 10 12:18
oiaohm	viral I am refering to the likes of pure AGPL and GPL	Jul 10 12:18
oiaohm	The issue I have inside copyleft there are two types of licenses. One group is safe to embed inside another license without causing major hell like LGPL and the other group GPL that is not safe to embedd.	Jul 10 12:20
MinceR	neither is "safe to embed", at most to link with	Jul 10 12:21
MinceR	and iirc if you link statically, you're still obliged to include .o files	Jul 10 12:21
oiaohm	Weak copyleft you only have to release the parts directly connected to the license file	Jul 10 12:22
oiaohm	Ie LGPL	Jul 10 12:23
oiaohm	Where GPL allows going after the complete lot as Microsoft found out with the iso downloader.	Jul 10 12:23
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oiaohm	MinceR: basically licensing is a pain in ass to get right.	Jul 10 12:26
MinceR	indeed.	Jul 10 12:27
oiaohm	MinceR: networkmanager losing dhcp is normally dhcp client locked up.	Jul 10 12:27
oiaohm	Yes sysvinit lack of means to fully restart something becomes a problem in these cases.	Jul 10 12:27
MinceR	i wonder what restartd is for.	Jul 10 12:28
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oiaohm	MinceR: from memory that as a independant part is gone.	Jul 10 12:29
oiaohm	It was so lower provilaged user using dbus could trigger a restart/reboot from memory.	Jul 10 12:29
oiaohm	Yep fused into logind spec these days under session management	Jul 10 12:31
MinceR	i don't know what you're talking about.	Jul 10 12:33
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oiaohm	MinceR: ok there were two restartd. Yes there was a systemd version.	Jul 10 12:35
MinceR	i wasn't aware of that one	Jul 10 12:35
oiaohm	http://man.cx/restartd%288%29 I don't like to think about the other one.	Jul 10 12:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-man.cx \| Manpage for restartd - man.cx manual pages		Jul 10 12:36
oiaohm	Its truly do you fell lucky punk.	Jul 10 12:36
MinceR	:)	Jul 10 12:36
oiaohm	restartd is one of the hacks to attempt to make sysvinit work that is just even more broken.	Jul 10 12:37
oiaohm	POSIX regexp on the process names. << This is perfect right.	Jul 10 12:38
oiaohm	A service crashes a user starts a process with the same name and restartd thinks everything is perfect.	Jul 10 12:38
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MinceR	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgz8Cn7x3lI	Jul 10 12:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com \| Scary Movie 2 Wheelchair Battle - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/n34oi ]		Jul 10 12:39
oiaohm	MinceR: basically I want service tracking not loto like sysvinit has been.	Jul 10 12:39
MinceR	then you're looking for it in the wrong place.	Jul 10 12:40
oiaohm	MinceR: service tracking has to start when the service starts.	Jul 10 12:40
oiaohm	If it does not your screwed attempting todo it.	Jul 10 12:41
MinceR	if you're using systemd, you're screwed.	Jul 10 12:41
oiaohm	MinceR: remember openrc has service tracking.	Jul 10 12:41
oiaohm	I don't have to go systemd to get it.	Jul 10 12:42
oiaohm	But its a bare min feature I want to see in any future init system.	Jul 10 12:42
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MinceR	besides it's not like poettering's "we don't know therefore we assume yes" approach is going to help you anyway	Jul 10 12:44
oiaohm	systemd service tracking does work. its just the other issues that make it more painful	Jul 10 12:44
oiaohm	Like not giving the right controls for parell booting.	Jul 10 12:45
oiaohm	MinceR: I don't exactly like systemd but I do know I can get the beast after hours and hours of reading and understanding the beast to work in most cases better than sysvinit did.	Jul 10 12:46
oiaohm	Yet I could get the same results with openrc in about 1 hour.	Jul 10 12:46
MinceR	sounds like you didn't understand it as well as you thought you did.	Jul 10 12:46
oiaohm	Not exactly. its the having the init tree and having to put in wants like on local filesystem so that fsck has to complete before starting services.	Jul 10 12:48
oiaohm	MinceR: each Linux distrobution tree with systemd is slightly different.	Jul 10 12:48
MinceR	redcrap will take care of that.	Jul 10 12:49
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MinceR	once they release systemdnf, most distros will just be rebranded fedora.	Jul 10 12:49
oiaohm	Most annoying feature is you put a want in a invalid location it just disregards it without given correct reason why.	Jul 10 12:49
oiaohm	MinceR: http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html did you miss reading this.	Jul 10 12:57
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-0pointer.net \| Revisiting How We Put Together Linux Systems [ http://ur1.ca/i3miw ]		Jul 10 12:57
MinceR	i've read it	Jul 10 12:58
oiaohm	Can you see the problem.	Jul 10 12:58
MinceR	he has horrible ideas even beyond systemd	Jul 10 12:58
MinceR	i can see the problem	Jul 10 12:58
oiaohm	MinceR: what do you think what the problem is with that idea.	Jul 10 12:58
MinceR	the problem is that poettering is dealing with illusions of adequacy.	Jul 10 12:58
oiaohm	MinceR: forget the person.	Jul 10 12:59
oiaohm	Everything there works except for 1 very key thing.	Jul 10 12:59
MinceR	all the stupid ideas come from one person (or via one person, from places like microsoft)	Jul 10 12:59
oiaohm	Me running debian use to running checkrestart after updating packages	Jul 10 12:59
MinceR	i particularly hate the idea of moving /etc/passwd into subvolume names	Jul 10 13:00
oiaohm	Why running mixed libraries old and new equals more ram consumed.	Jul 10 13:00
oiaohm	MinceR: what one is worse. LDAP or subvolume names.	Jul 10 13:03
oiaohm	/etc/passwd has always been a on going nightmare with chroots.	Jul 10 13:04
MinceR	my systems don't need LDAP for that	Jul 10 13:04
oiaohm	Yes the /etc/passwd file has need splitting in 2 for a long time. 1 containing service required users	Jul 10 13:04
MinceR	but i'm pretty sure one can do LDAP better than the subvolume name kludge.	Jul 10 13:04
oiaohm	One for general users.	Jul 10 13:04
oiaohm	MinceR: the subvolume kludge is faster.	Jul 10 13:05
MinceR	you can do that with PAM, can't you?	Jul 10 13:05
MinceR	oh, again the usual ricer argument	Jul 10 13:05
MinceR	"herp derp, it's fastah!"	Jul 10 13:05
MinceR	doesn't matter if it will work, IT MUST BE FASTER!	Jul 10 13:05
oiaohm	And works better with the case of moving drives.	Jul 10 13:05
MinceR	doesn't matter if it will boot, IT MUST BOOT FASTER!	Jul 10 13:05
oiaohm	LDAP is slower.	Jul 10 13:05
oiaohm	PAM for a long time has not supported loading 2 password files.	Jul 10 13:06
oiaohm	The second one to load completely nukes the first.	Jul 10 13:06
MinceR	android also fakes /etc/passwd entries somehow	Jul 10 13:06
oiaohm	Android does not have /etc/passwd	Jul 10 13:07
MinceR	yup	Jul 10 13:07
MinceR	debian-kit even has some daemon that builds an /etc/passwd out of info from the android host	Jul 10 13:08
MinceR	iirc	Jul 10 13:08
oiaohm	that it really uses	Jul 10 13:08
oiaohm	MinceR: /data/system/user/ is where users are on android as xml files.	Jul 10 13:09
oiaohm	MinceR: yep android makes the subvolume kludge look nice.	Jul 10 13:10
MinceR	i don't think it does	Jul 10 13:10
MinceR	also, you could probably patch PAM to do what you want.	Jul 10 13:10
oiaohm	MinceR: the idea behind the subvolume labels is that you can pull the home drive out put it in another system and end up with some form of sanity.	Jul 10 13:13
MinceR	it's still a bad idea	Jul 10 13:13
oiaohm	Worse idea is the ram issue.	Jul 10 13:13
MinceR	those are not version managed, they're not likely to be backed up	Jul 10 13:13
MinceR	and the whole "make readonly all the things!" makes security updates more cumbersome	Jul 10 13:14
oiaohm	make all readonly really does not make security updates more cumbersome.	Jul 10 13:15
oiaohm	Reality here is majority of services write very little.	Jul 10 13:16
oiaohm	Like how many programs in fact write to /usr/bin	Jul 10 13:16
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MinceR	the idea to replace images with new images to do an update does	Jul 10 13:18
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cubexyz	which programs write to /usr/bin ?	Jul 10 14:03
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Examiner	Dear Dr. Schestowitz, since yesterday the EPO has blacklisted your site.	Jul 10 14:11
Examiner	See the latest comments on http://ipkitten.blogspot.de/2015/06/spy-scandal-epo-hits-news-in-germany.html	Jul 10 14:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ipkitten.blogspot.de \| The IPKat: "Spy scandal" - EPO hits the news in Germany [ http://ur1.ca/n3597 ]		Jul 10 14:12
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Q4OS Live CD, stable http://t.co/4AZGQUVW6r	Jul 10 16:12
TweetTuxMachines	(q4os.org)	Jul 10 16:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-q4os.org \| Q4OS - desktop operating system		Jul 10 16:12
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3643	Jul 10 16:12
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Learn Linux Kernel Device Drivers With Linux	Jul 10 16:12
TweetTuxMachines	Foundation Instructor Bill Kerr	Jul 10 16:12
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/qYqOlMf20P (www.linux.com)	Jul 10 16:12
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3644	Jul 10 16:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| Learn Linux Kernel Device Drivers With Linux Foundation Instructor Bill Kerr \| Linux.com		Jul 10 16:12
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Firefox 39 Finally Lands in Ubuntu 15.04 After	Jul 10 16:25
TweetTuxMachines	a Long Wait http://t.co/pUTBFAz5mn	Jul 10 16:25
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Firefox 39 Finally Lands in Ubuntu 15.04 After a Long Wait - Softpedia		Jul 10 16:25
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 10 16:25
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n367w	Jul 10 16:25
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Q4OS Live CD, stable http://t.co/J5yPJbZq5p	Jul 10 16:25
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 16:25
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Q4OS Live CD, stable \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 16:25
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n367y	Jul 10 16:25
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Learn Linux Kernel Device Drivers With Linux	Jul 10 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	Foundation Instructor Bill Kerr	Jul 10 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/Ebq9CVLhvs (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n367z	Jul 10 16:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Learn Linux Kernel Device Drivers With Linux Foundation Instructor Bill Kerr \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Why I code and don't get paid for it	Jul 10 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/rrDKonmMdg (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 16:26
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3680	Jul 10 16:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Why I code and don't get paid for it \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 16:26
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today and Yesterday in Techrights	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	retweeted by http://t.co/WTwvKq7I0z (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	@schestowitz	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n36f1	Jul 10 18:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today and Yesterday in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines LibreOffice 4.4.5 RC1 Arrives with More than 70	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	Fixes http://t.co/8yKR1Gi9Z6	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3790	Jul 10 18:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| LibreOffice 4.4.5 RC1 Arrives with More than 70 Fixes \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Firefox 39 Finally Lands in Ubuntu 15.04 After	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	a Long Wait http://t.co/4DjDMIcGI6	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3792	Jul 10 18:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Firefox 39 Finally Lands in Ubuntu 15.04 After a Long Wait \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Wine 1.7.47 Release with Direct2D Improvements	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	and More Gaming Fixes http://t.co/Ud7q3eDCwT	Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 18:00
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Wine 1.7.47 Release with Direct2D Improvements and More Gaming Fixes \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 18:00
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3793	Jul 10 18:01
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Which Linux Web Browser is Right for You?	Jul 10 18:01
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/L7oaENuTv8 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 18:01
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3799	Jul 10 18:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Which Linux Web Browser is Right for You? \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 18:01
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE Frameworks 5.12.0 Officially Released with	Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	Lots of Fixes and New Features	Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/WEI3BWDqlC (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37io	Jul 10 18:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| KDE Frameworks 5.12.0 Officially Released with Lots of Fixes and New Features \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The NSA Is Looking At Systemd KDBUS	Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/YjMhonqssb (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 10 18:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| The NSA Is Looking At Systemd's KDBUS - Phoronix		Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37ip	Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Open-Source AMD/NVIDIA GPU Tests On Linux 4.1 +	Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	Mesa 10.7-dev http://t.co/KzsXXWc023	Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	(www.phoronix.com)	Jul 10 18:41
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Open-Source AMD/NVIDIA GPU Tests On Linux 4.1 + Mesa 10.7-dev - Phoronix		Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37iq	Jul 10 18:41
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Purism Librem 13 Review http://t.co/qLaze7OLC6	Jul 10 18:43
TweetTuxMachines	(www.linuxjournal.com)	Jul 10 18:43
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linuxjournal.com \| Purism Librem 13 Review \| Linux Journal		Jul 10 18:43
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37jb	Jul 10 18:43
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Wine 1.7.47 Release with Direct2D Improvements	Jul 10 18:43
TweetTuxMachines	and More Gaming Fixes http://t.co/HGUJGnwQIk	Jul 10 18:43
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| Wine 1.7.47 Release with Direct2D Improvements and More Gaming Fixes - Softpedia		Jul 10 18:43
TweetTuxMachines	(news.softpedia.com)	Jul 10 18:43
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37je	Jul 10 18:43
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines KDE Frameworks 5.12.0 Officially Released with	Jul 10 18:44
TweetTuxMachines	Lots of Fixes and New Features	Jul 10 18:44
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/RCA9idtBdO (news.softpedia.com)	Jul 10 18:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.softpedia.com \| KDE Frameworks 5.12.0 Officially Released with Lots of Fixes and New Features - Softpedia		Jul 10 18:44
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37jf	Jul 10 18:44
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Which Linux Web Browser is Right for You?	Jul 10 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/fS6KgFCkow (www.linux.com)	Jul 10 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37ku	Jul 10 18:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.linux.com \| Which Linux Web Browser is Right for You? \| Linux.com		Jul 10 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Core Linux tools top list of most at-risk	Jul 10 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	software http://t.co/o7uWxlkblA	Jul 10 18:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.infoworld.com \| Core Linux tools top list of most at-risk software \| InfoWorld		Jul 10 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	(www.infoworld.com)	Jul 10 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37kv	Jul 10 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Box computer and Pico-ITX SBC pack i.MX6	Jul 10 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/NfGFZwJidR (linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 10 18:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| Box computer and Pico-ITX SBC pack i.MX6 · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 10 18:47
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37kw	Jul 10 18:47
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Purism Librem 13 Review http://t.co/NpT0ySrYG6	Jul 10 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 19:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Purism Librem 13 Review \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37pn	Jul 10 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Open-Source AMD/NVIDIA GPU Tests On Linux 4.1 +	Jul 10 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	Mesa 10.7-dev http://t.co/vahpZI05Rm	Jul 10 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 19:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Open-Source AMD/NVIDIA GPU Tests On Linux 4.1 + Mesa 10.7-dev \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37pp	Jul 10 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines The NSA Is Looking At Systemd's KDBUS	Jul 10 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/p3XxRT37Hc (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 19:06
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n37pr	Jul 10 19:06
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| The NSA Is Looking At Systemd's KDBUS \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 19:06
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/georgebaily/status/619646366151745536	Jul 10 19:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@georgebaily: @schestowitz Hollywood trailer voice: "one man..."		Jul 10 19:18
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*TweetTuxMachines @darkday_studios favourited 'Open-Source AMD/NVIDIA GPU Tests On Linux 4.1 +...'		Jul 10 20:42
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines OpenELEC Linux media player includes broadcast	Jul 10 20:42
TweetTuxMachines	TV tuner http://t.co/4uKhFAJMnM	Jul 10 20:42
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 20:42
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n38ev	Jul 10 20:42
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| OpenELEC Linux media player includes broadcast TV tuner \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 20:42
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem	Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	with the NSA using GNU/Linux	Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/f1ZrrBFjj0 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n391i	Jul 10 22:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines French Government IT directorate stands its	Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	ground : ODF supported, OOXML rejected	Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/qVCIObBuN9 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n391j	Jul 10 22:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| French Government IT directorate stands its ground : ODF supported, OOXML rejected \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Open source licensing at GitHub	Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/g38sTqkpbn (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 10 22:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n391l	Jul 10 22:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Open source licensing at GitHub \| Tux Machines		Jul 10 22:18
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oiaohm	http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NSA-KDBUS-Credentials It is interesting to see the differnet parties that come out the wood work.	Jul 11 00:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| The NSA Is Looking At Systemd's KDBUS - Phoronix [ http://ur1.ca/n3a35 ]		Jul 11 00:47
TweetTuxMachines	@RamiSilawi RT @tuxmachines: Richard Stallman 'basically'	Jul 11 01:35
TweetTuxMachines	has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux !!!	Jul 11 01:35
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/yBl081gzK5 (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 01:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3adv	Jul 11 01:35
TweetTuxMachines	@RamiSilawi RT @tuxmachines: Richard Stallman 'basically'	Jul 11 01:35
TweetTuxMachines	has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux !!!	Jul 11 01:35
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/C3G2otmxgP (linkis.com)	Jul 11 01:35
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3adw	Jul 11 01:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linkis.com \| Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux \| Tux Machines - Linkis.com		Jul 11 01:35
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cubexyz	thumbs down once again to the media that can't acknowlegdge the existance of anything beyond Windows and Mac	Jul 11 07:17
cubexyz	society of waste:	Jul 11 07:27
cubexyz	http://upstreampolicy.org/issues/our-throw-away-society/	Jul 11 07:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-upstreampolicy.org \| Our Throw-Away Society \| Upstream [ http://ur1.ca/n3ca7 ]		Jul 11 07:28
oiaohm	cubexyz: Its not that simple	Jul 11 07:41
oiaohm	cubexyz: some of the older computer hardware had lot shorter operational live due to running at clockspeeds higher than the hardware could cope with long term.	Jul 11 07:43
oiaohm	Also more and more is designed as a single part. So single failure that is it.	Jul 11 07:43
cubexyz	the older stuff is more repairable	Jul 11 07:53
cubexyz	also has a lot less integration	Jul 11 07:53
cubexyz	indeed, I'm an "old" computer advocate	Jul 11 07:53
cubexyz	old being P3 area, which really isn't that old	Jul 11 07:54
cubexyz	s/area/era/	Jul 11 07:54
cubexyz	some folks are even fixing very old LCD displays using heat guns	Jul 11 07:54
cubexyz	certainly we can vastly improve the current poor situation	Jul 11 07:55
cubexyz	I would tell people not to overclock	Jul 11 07:56
cubexyz	http://www.maxhost.org/other/computer-longevity.txt	Jul 11 07:57
cubexyz	I admit I only use the amiga once a month	Jul 11 07:57
cubexyz	this is the Dell GX110 I'm typing on now	Jul 11 07:58
cubexyz	so 14 year old computer, just fine for web browsing and IRC	Jul 11 07:58
cubexyz	doesn't get very hot == good longevity	Jul 11 07:59
cubexyz	ok, since the vic-20 is 1981 we know that chips can last over 30 years	Jul 11 08:00
cubexyz	so we'll see how long the P3 stuff can last... I'm guessing it can go another 10 years without a problem	Jul 11 08:01
oiaohm	cubexyz: yep general rule of silcon the cooler it runs the longer it lasts.	Jul 11 08:02
cubexyz	the manufacturers are ridiculous... they suggest replacement every 3 or 4 years	Jul 11 08:03
cubexyz	well, that's great for the manufacturer but crappy for the user	Jul 11 08:03
cubexyz	also wrong -> LCD's last up to 10 years	Jul 11 08:06
cubexyz	the truth is no one really knows	Jul 11 08:06
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cubexyz	one year = 8800 hours	Jul 11 08:09
cubexyz	but it's not on all the time	Jul 11 08:09
oiaohm	LCD do have a mechnical life.	Jul 11 08:15
oiaohm	cubexyz: correct color is a factor most LCD screen lose correct color by about 7 years old.	Jul 11 08:16
oiaohm	cubexyz: basically double the life that people are being told.	Jul 11 08:16
cubexyz	some of those 1970s LCD watches still work	Jul 11 08:18
cubexyz	Microma I think was the first one	Jul 11 08:19
oiaohm	cubexyz: that is black and white.	Jul 11 08:21
cubexyz	sure	Jul 11 08:21
oiaohm	cubexyz: it LCD screens doing shades of grey or shades of color	Jul 11 08:22
oiaohm	That have problems of a mechnical failure to make the differences in color they should with age.	Jul 11 08:22
oiaohm	But that is 7 to 8 years old before that happens.	Jul 11 08:23
cubexyz	I don't suppose they ever made an LCD display for computers that was just on or off	Jul 11 08:23
oiaohm	Yes they did.	Jul 11 08:23
oiaohm	Some of the really early screens were black or while nothing in the middle.	Jul 11 08:24
cubexyz	I remember those laptops with tiny displays	Jul 11 08:24
cubexyz	80x16 text	Jul 11 08:24
cubexyz	TRS-80 Model 100 might be an example actually	Jul 11 08:25
cubexyz	so dot-matrix but no grey shades	Jul 11 08:25
oiaohm	cubexyz: you still buy Monochrome Displays for medical control interfaces.	Jul 11 08:26
gde33	they are very nice to look at	Jul 11 08:27
oiaohm	Yes 15,19 and 21 inch LCD Monochrome is still around cubexyz	Jul 11 08:27
gde33	why are we not printing books with 28 inch pages?	Jul 11 08:27
oiaohm	You do have to be careful not to Mix a LCD Monochrome up with a LCD greyscale in medical devices.	Jul 11 08:28
cubexyz	oiaohm, do you think I could run X on one of those?	Jul 11 08:28
cubexyz	might be an interesting experiment to see if they last a long time	Jul 11 08:28
cubexyz	maybe even run a framebuffer on one	Jul 11 08:29
oiaohm	cubexyz: you can run X on monochrome the question is with your wm choice and application choice like it.	Jul 11 08:29
oiaohm	gde33 human has to carry a book. Its the same reason why a 10inch tablet is not that popular.	Jul 11 08:31
cubexyz	oiaohm, one of those old monochrome LCD displays, I figure it would have used less power then the current colour LCDs?	Jul 11 08:32
cubexyz	those old TRS-80 Model 100's lasted a long time on one battery	Jul 11 08:33
oiaohm	cubexyz: grayscale are simple to get. http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/3Mp-21-inch-2048x1536-LCD-screen_60146345449.html	Jul 11 08:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.alibaba.com \| 3mp 21-inch 2048x1536 Lcd Screen Monochrome Monitor,Ce,Fda Approved,1.5t Mri - Buy Medical Equipment,Led Monitor,Medical Monitor Product on Alibaba.com [ http://ur1.ca/n3crv ]		Jul 11 08:35
gde33	oiaohm: scrolls are awesome tho :D	Jul 11 08:37
oiaohm	cubexyz: pure monochrome are hard to find. Why it such a issue when you mix them up.	Jul 11 08:37
oiaohm	cubexyz: ie a pure monochrome output medical device works with a grayscale monitor.	Jul 11 08:38
oiaohm	cubexyz: but a greyscale output medical device is screwed if you give it a pure monochrome screen.	Jul 11 08:38
cubexyz	oiaohm, I was thinking serial terminal with monochrome LCD	Jul 11 08:38
cubexyz	if such a thing exists	Jul 11 08:38
cubexyz	or even usb terminal	Jul 11 08:40
oiaohm	cubexyz: most are that is DVI-D so in theory add a rasbery pi.	Jul 11 08:40
oiaohm	Colored screens are annoying more often cheaper than monochrome/greyscale screens	Jul 11 08:41
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cubexyz	there's tons of small LCDs	Jul 11 08:52
cubexyz	320x240	Jul 11 08:52
oiaohm	cubexyz: kernel loging is 80 chars.	Jul 11 08:54
oiaohm	cubexyz: or what its optimised for.	Jul 11 08:54
cubexyz	there's USB 2.0 monitors	Jul 11 08:58
cubexyz	1366x768 display	Jul 11 08:59
cubexyz	lightweight and portable	Jul 11 08:59
cubexyz	maybe I can rig up some sort of noveau usb terminal	Jul 11 09:02
MinceR	:)	Jul 11 09:07
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/bigonbe/status/619782977632010240	Jul 11 10:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@bigonbe: @schestowitz The code is open source, anybody can search vulnerabilities in any components. And most will not post in public ML asking Q		Jul 11 10:24
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/ArgosHelpers/status/619813818022129664	Jul 11 10:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@ArgosHelpers: @schestowitz That's fine I'll get the feedback passed onto the store.Again apologies for the wait you had. Ryan		Jul 11 10:24
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines OpenELEC Linux media player includes broadcast	Jul 11 13:56
TweetTuxMachines	TV tuner http://t.co/QPDLNT8FIc	Jul 11 13:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxgizmos.com \| OpenELEC Linux media player includes broadcast TV tuner · LinuxGizmos.com		Jul 11 13:56
TweetTuxMachines	(linuxgizmos.com)	Jul 11 13:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3fd8	Jul 11 13:56
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines RMS ‘basically’ has no problem with NSA using	Jul 11 13:56
TweetTuxMachines	GNU/Linux http://t.co/OkPUp0gO65	Jul 11 13:56
TweetTuxMachines	(www.itworld.com) ‘a program must not restrict	Jul 11 13:56
TweetTuxMachines	what jobs its users do with it’	Jul 11 13:56
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3fd9	Jul 11 13:56
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.itworld.com \| Richard Stallman 'basically' has no problem with the NSA using GNU/Linux \| ITworld		Jul 11 13:56
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/thewtfmagazine/status/619879715189358592 https://twitter.com/LisbethIsAlive/status/619867255581622272	Jul 11 14:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@thewtfmagazine: @stonemirror @grouchosharx You're a stalker, Lefty http://t.co/SkZDkjsB3h		Jul 11 14:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org \| Richard Stallman and Bruce Perens Defamed by Troll \| Techrights		Jul 11 14:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@LisbethIsAlive: @Cybertario Roy Schestowitz de Techrights y el propio Stallman han criticado duramente a Red Hat por su vinculación con la NSA.		Jul 11 14:27
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/thewtfmagazine/status/619674296286195712	Jul 11 14:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@thewtfmagazine: @stonemirror @Amantisme WELL-STALKED, LEFTY!! XD http://t.co/SkZDkjsB3h		Jul 11 14:28
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition	Jul 11 14:45
TweetTuxMachines	https://t.co/tfbgF6uFPB (svij.org)	Jul 11 14:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3frz	Jul 11 14:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-svij.org \| Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition		Jul 11 14:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition	Jul 11 14:45
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/NBAmxQEHMj (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 14:45
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3fs0	Jul 11 14:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 14:45
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Tin Hats Ready, RMS No Problems Linux Used for	Jul 11 14:46
TweetTuxMachines	Evil http://t.co/3Io54hd39v	Jul 11 14:46
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 14:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Tin Hats Ready, RMS No Problems Linux Used for Evil \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 14:46
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3fs1	Jul 11 14:46
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schestowitz	https://twitter.com/qu1j0t3/status/619941074136645632	Jul 11 14:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@qu1j0t3: Since most of the 12 in this list are white male assholes, let's not hope not too influential https://t.co/tL87NKeqMh		Jul 11 14:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Here are the 12 most influential programmers working today http://t.co/H8ooZIJsaa #rms opening page		Jul 11 14:51
schestowitz	Influence is helped by being white males; different from	Jul 11 14:51
schestowitz	say, 12 most skilled	Jul 11 14:51
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/qu1j0t3/status/619948462243729408 https://twitter.com/qu1j0t3/status/619948564173713409	Jul 11 15:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@qu1j0t3: @schestowitz Also, a number of these are not even programmers.		Jul 11 15:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@qu1j0t3: @schestowitz They might as well have said "12 most famous"... "influential" is usually code for "irrelevant".		Jul 11 15:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Review bq Aquaris E5 - Ubuntu Edition	Jul 11 15:20
TweetTuxMachines	retweeted by http://t.co/NBAmxQEHMj (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 15:20
TweetTuxMachines	@RamiSilawi	Jul 11 15:20
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g3n	Jul 11 15:20
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Point Linux 3.0 Is Out Now. Distro Review	Jul 11 15:20
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/gAs7mFJcIS (linuxpitstop.com)	Jul 11 15:20
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g3o	Jul 11 15:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-linuxpitstop.com \| How to Install Point Linux 3.0 and its prominent Features \| LinuxPitstop		Jul 11 15:20
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines A new crop of stable kernels	Jul 11 15:29
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/o5U9TptO2X (lwn.net)	Jul 11 15:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lwn.net \| A new crop of stable kernels [LWN.net]		Jul 11 15:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g5y	Jul 11 15:29
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Point Linux 3.0 Is Out Now. Distro Review	Jul 11 15:29
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/1cU6Yt70EW (www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 15:29
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g61	Jul 11 15:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Point Linux 3.0 Is Out Now. Distro Review \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 15:30
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Google Releases Ethernet Adapter for Chromecast	Jul 11 15:30
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/rb1LSkv0pG (www.eweek.com)	Jul 11 15:30
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3g63	Jul 11 15:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.eweek.com \| Google Releases Ethernet Adapter for Chromecast		Jul 11 15:30
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/deusexstigma/status/619955158269603840	Jul 11 15:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@deusexstigma: @schestowitz absolute bullshit.		Jul 11 15:46
schestowitz	I saw that a few days ago and needed to puke. Such horrible lies from such horrible media outlets.	Jul 11 15:47
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/deusexstigma/status/619956632298991616	Jul 11 16:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@deusexstigma: @schestowitz unfortunately 'media' outlets who seem to 'soma' -ise the uncritical...		Jul 11 16:15
schestowitz	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMcjoP670so	Jul 11 16:17
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com \| The Scallies of Manchester - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/n3gkb ]		Jul 11 16:17
schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6317843	Jul 11 16:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: French Government IT directorate stands its ground : #ODF supported, #OOXML rejected https://www.april.org/en/french-government-it-directorate-stands-its-ground-odf-supported-ooxml-rejected Discussion: http://yro.slashdot.org/story/15/07/09/187204/french-government-it-directorate-supports-odf-rejects-ooxml		Jul 11 16:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.april.org \| French Government IT directorate stands its ground : ODF supported, OOXML rejected \| April [ http://ur1.ca/n3gnf ]		Jul 11 16:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> yro.slashdot.org \| French Government IT Directorate Supports ODF, Rejects OOXML - Slashdot [ http://ur1.ca/n2zon ]		Jul 11 16:28
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TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Google releases second preview of Android M	Jul 11 17:13
TweetTuxMachines	http://t.co/D2dKPs19Ei (www.zdnet.com)	Jul 11 17:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.zdnet.com \| Google releases second preview of Android M \| ZDNet		Jul 11 17:13
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3gzh	Jul 11 17:13
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Confirmed: America's Army Is Coming Back To	Jul 11 17:13
TweetTuxMachines	Linux http://t.co/kE7HDPoY3N (www.phoronix.com)	Jul 11 17:13
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3gzi	Jul 11 17:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.phoronix.com \| Confirmed: America's Army Is Coming Back To Linux - Phoronix		Jul 11 17:13
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Links 11/7/2015: Purism Librem 13 Reviewed, KDE	Jul 11 17:13
TweetTuxMachines	Frameworks 5.12.0 is Out http://t.co/QqxqZGlzbd	Jul 11 17:13
TweetTuxMachines	(techrights.org)	Jul 11 17:13
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3gzj	Jul 11 17:13
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Links 11/7/2015: Purism Librem 13 Reviewed, KDE Frameworks 5.12.0 is Out \| Techrights		Jul 11 17:13
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schestowitz	> RE: your new page http://techrights.org/2015/07/11/battistelli-blocks-web-sites/	Jul 11 18:26
schestowitz	>	Jul 11 18:26
schestowitz	> "Transmission using Tor and an empty E-mail account can do the trick. We have never let down or betrayed a source (in our decade-old history with many whistleblowers)..."	Jul 11 18:26
schestowitz	>	Jul 11 18:26
schestowitz	> suggestion:	Jul 11 18:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| European Censorship: Tyrants of the EPO Blacklist Techrights, Web Site Not Accessible Office-Wide \| Techrights [ http://ur1.ca/n3hl0 ]		Jul 11 18:26
schestowitz	>	Jul 11 18:26
schestowitz	> Instead of only pointing to Tor, give a hint and link to Tails https://tails.boum.org/ as a secure stand-alone, live system. Much better, much safer to use. Comes with the encryption tools (gpg) which are not present on Windows or Macm, as you certainly know.	Jul 11 18:26
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-tails.boum.org \| Tails - Privacy for anyone anywhere		Jul 11 18:26
schestowitz	I was going to mention tails, but that requires CD burners and other stuff that some people would feel is too great a task.	Jul 11 18:26
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/crispymint/status/619993478458535937?cn=cmVwbHk%3D&refsrc=email	Jul 11 18:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@crispymint: @schestowitz good post		Jul 11 18:28
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/SwR10nE7j9	Jul 11 19:11
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 19:11
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3hvi	Jul 11 19:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 19:11
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: KDE/Qt http://t.co/A6d52dyTCo	Jul 11 19:11
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 19:11
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: KDE/Qt \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 19:11
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3hvk	Jul 11 19:11
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Leftovers: Gaming http://t.co/e9uHdFvUsx	Jul 11 19:18
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 19:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Leftovers: Gaming \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 19:18
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3hxg	Jul 11 19:18
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's howtos http://t.co/wdr7US1esu	Jul 11 19:19
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 19:19
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3hxh	Jul 11 19:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's howtos \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 19:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines today's leftovers http://t.co/LuklVonGRv	Jul 11 19:19
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 19:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| today's leftovers \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 19:19
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3hxi	Jul 11 19:19
TweetTuxMachines	@tuxmachines Today in Techrights http://t.co/d81Vsdq3YV	Jul 11 19:19
TweetTuxMachines	(www.tuxmachines.org)	Jul 11 19:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Today in Techrights \| Tux Machines		Jul 11 19:19
TweetTuxMachines	........................................ http://ur1.ca/n3hxj	Jul 11 19:19
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