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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: August 21st, 2008 – Part II

Posted in IRC Logs at 10:21 am by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

Enter the IRC channel now

schestowitz Linus had some rude remarks about it. Aug 21 13:54
MinceR well, all the rabid BSD fans i’ve met were difficult to tolerate Aug 21 13:54
trmanco http://beranger.org/index.php?… Aug 21 13:55
schestowitz ^^ former BSD fan. Aug 21 13:56
MinceR in fact, the BSD and GNU/Linux communities could work together for a better future if the BSD fans wouldn’t be so preoccupied with being frustrated by the low mindshare of BSD. Aug 21 13:56
schestowitz Good find. He analyses Novell (it’s in my feeds, but I haven’t gotten around to it yet). Aug 21 13:57
Tallken Well Aug 21 14:10
Tallken Macs are rock solid Aug 21 14:11
Tallken it’s easier to find a rock solid Mac, in which all are Aug 21 14:11
Tallken than a rock solid PC Aug 21 14:11
Tallken you’ve to know what to look Aug 21 14:11
MinceR lol Aug 21 14:11
MinceR please define this working definition of “rock solid” Aug 21 14:11
schestowitz If you throw a chair at it… Aug 21 14:12
Tallken I’ve seen a PowerBook fall to the floor from 1,5 meters, more or less Aug 21 14:12
Tallken got a little, how do you say when metal gets, like, molded? Aug 21 14:12
Tallken try that with an all plastic PC Aug 21 14:13
MinceR oh, you’re looking for a paperweight, not a computer Aug 21 14:13
MinceR i’m sorry, didn’t realize Aug 21 14:13
Tallken ROFL? Aug 21 14:13
Tallken MinceR: that PowerBook worked fine afterwards Aug 21 14:13
MinceR i tend to just not drop my computers, it somehows keeps them working Aug 21 14:14
Tallken and with disk sensors, which we must say, were an idea from IBM, no harddisk could’ve ocurred… well, would be harder at least Aug 21 14:14
MinceR if i wanted to throw them around, i’d buy a rugged pc, not a mac Aug 21 14:14
Tallken it wasn’t *my* computer lol Aug 21 14:14
Tallken I’ve a whole plastic computer Aug 21 14:14
Tallken HP Pavillion 6530EP Aug 21 14:15
MinceR but leave it to iDiots to throw their stuff around and whine if it breaks Aug 21 14:15
Tallken *perfect* Linux support Aug 21 14:15
Tallken not official of course Aug 21 14:15
Tallken but HAL-info states it doesn’t need any workaround Aug 21 14:15
Tallken BTW, when does someone start a proper Linux HW Compatibility List? Aug 21 14:16
schestowitz MinceR:  did you mean DiDiots? Aug 21 14:16
Tallken All I’ve seen have been poorly maintained Aug 21 14:16
MinceR i don’t know what that would be Aug 21 14:16
schestowitz Laura DiSiot? Aug 21 14:16
MinceR iDiot is the typical crapple fanboy ;) Aug 21 14:16
Tallken DiDiots? Is that someone who used dd on the harddisk? xD Aug 21 14:16
kentma hi Aug 21 14:17
MinceR oh, i faintly recognize that name Aug 21 14:17
MinceR Tallken: hardly… i’ve used dd on it a few times Aug 21 14:17
MinceR for example when i arranged partitions wrong and noticed it in the middle of a gentoo install :> Aug 21 14:17
schestowitz http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laura_DiDio “DiDio is often viewed as being very critical of the free software movement and community due to her early and continuing support of SCO and frequent referencing of those studies comparing the TCO of Microsoft and Linux where Microsoft appears to have performed well.” Aug 21 14:17
Tallken ROFL Aug 21 14:17
MinceR oh. Aug 21 14:17
Tallken MinceR: never used it Aug 21 14:17
schestowitz “been nicknamed “Didiot” and “Dildo” (particularly on Yahoo’s SCOX board), claiming “There’s an extremist fringe of Linux loonies who hang out on forums and are disrespectful and threatening because you disagree with them” and “I’ve had these nut jobs calling me at 11 o’clock at night”[5] – comments which have only served to increase the antagonism.” Aug 21 14:18
Tallken MinceR: on the disk Aug 21 14:18
Tallken MinceR: deleted /dev once, though Aug 21 14:18
Tallken MinceR: in the middle Aug 21 14:18
MinceR :) Aug 21 14:18
MinceR also, i’ve used dd to make qemu disk images Aug 21 14:18
PetoKraus thinkpads are more rugged than anything else Aug 21 14:18
Tallken MinceR: of a Gentoo install on /gentoo ; mount -o bind /dev /gentoo/dev ; chroot /gentoo ; got fed up and aborted installation and deleted /gentoo without unmount /gentoo/dev :D Aug 21 14:18
MinceR lol Aug 21 14:19
schestowitz PetoKraus: but ThinkPads are not pretty. Aug 21 14:19
PetoKraus :D Aug 21 14:19
MinceR yes they are Aug 21 14:19
PetoKraus they are, man, they are pretty. Aug 21 14:19
PetoKraus IN YOUR FACE! Aug 21 14:19
MinceR just not in the crapple cheap-white-plastic way. Aug 21 14:19
MinceR but in the this-is-what-a-computer-looks-like way. Aug 21 14:19
schestowitz A matter of taste, meguesses Aug 21 14:20
PetoKraus nah. in the “i can smack you with it and then blog about it with it” Aug 21 14:20
MinceR yes Aug 21 14:20
MinceR iDiots have no taste ;) Aug 21 14:20
twitter Good morning.  Catching up…. Aug 21 14:21
MinceR hay Aug 21 14:21
Tallken Maybe she learnt something Aug 21 14:21
Tallken (yes I’ve too much faith in people lol) Aug 21 14:22
Tallken Microsoft IP in Linux Aug 21 14:22
Tallken Ms. Didio was more cautious in relation to Steve Ballmer’s 2006 comments about possible Microsoft IP in Linux “At this point I think it is more of an intimidation tactic. To tell you the truth, if I am Joe IT, I don’t know if this is much of a deterrent to me. Quite frankly, you have to prove [IP infringement].” Aug 21 14:22
MinceR time to teach her what the word “FUD” means Aug 21 14:22
schestowitz Yankee Group is a scam. Let me find something. Aug 21 14:22
twitter Yes, in the US Universities first and now ordinary businesses claim copyright on ALL images of their buildings.  Guards will waste their time running people with cameras off …. so now the bad guys have an easy distraction. Aug 21 14:22
schestowitz http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/01/yan… Aug 21 14:22
schestowitz The quote at the top says it all really. Aug 21 14:23
schestowitz twitter: I saw McCain’s page on IP earlier. Not good… Aug 21 14:23
blackrabbit http://www.computerworld.com/acti… Aug 21 14:26
blackrabbit WSJ: Microsoft hires Seinfeld to bite Apple Aug 21 14:26
blackrabbit Seinfeld will take home $10 million for his role in the spots Aug 21 14:26
blackrabbit but I thought vista was doing so well? LOL Aug 21 14:26
blackrabbit The software giant’s new $300 million advertising campaign, devised by a newly hired ad agency, has been closely guarded. But Mr. Seinfeld will be one of the key celebrity pitchmen, say people close to the situation. He will appear with Microsoft Chairman Bill Gates in ads and receive about $10 million for the work, they say. Aug 21 14:27
blackrabbit 300 million dollars !!! Aug 21 14:27
blackrabbit that is pathetic! Aug 21 14:27
blackrabbit and look, Mr. Bill “philanthropic” Gates will appear in the ads Aug 21 14:27
blackrabbit what a whore Aug 21 14:28
blackrabbit The new ad effort is expected to use some variation of the slogan “Windows, Not Walls Aug 21 14:28
blackrabbit Windows, not walls? Aug 21 14:29
twitter McCain is worse than Obama, who’s not very good. Aug 21 14:29
Tallken Seinfeld? Aug 21 14:29
Tallken wo-hoo! Aug 21 14:29
Tallken This is gonna be good :D Aug 21 14:29
Tallken I don’t mind how much money they throw at it Aug 21 14:29
blackrabbit I wouldn’t do commercials for MS if they offered me $100 million Aug 21 14:30
Tallken as long as their actions are proxied Aug 21 14:30
Tallken and masked as independent Aug 21 14:30
Tallken blackrabbit: but you’re probably a knowledgeagle person in the IT field Aug 21 14:30
blackrabbit meaning? Aug 21 14:30
Tallken meaning if you weren’t you wouldn’t have reason not to make a commercial for MS Aug 21 14:31
blackrabbit I have standards Aug 21 14:31
blackrabbit some people don’t Aug 21 14:31
Tallken standards is a bad word to use nowadays xD Aug 21 14:31
Tallken (OOXML) Aug 21 14:32
Tallken :D Aug 21 14:32
blackrabbit so is “free” perception is everything Aug 21 14:32
Tallken it’s a matter of knowledge and standards Aug 21 14:32
Tallken you can have standards Aug 21 14:32
Tallken but you may not have the knowledge to know what you’re doing is against your standards Aug 21 14:33
blackrabbit standards imply knowledge Aug 21 14:33
blackrabbit various degrees of standards Aug 21 14:33
blackrabbit and a thousand ways to define them all Aug 21 14:33
blackrabbit and the people who have them Aug 21 14:33
blackrabbit and the people who misunderstand them Aug 21 14:33
blackrabbit etc Aug 21 14:33
Tallken and a standard to bind them all Aug 21 14:33
Tallken ups sorry ring Aug 21 14:33
Tallken well Aug 21 14:34
Tallken I see where you getting at Aug 21 14:34
Tallken but Aug 21 14:34
twitter Seinfeld on M$ computers.  One early 90s thing meets another, that’s going to look fresh. Aug 21 14:34
Tallken I see also where *I’m* getting at Aug 21 14:34
Tallken standards are IMO a general thing Aug 21 14:35
Tallken and you can apply them to several areas Aug 21 14:35
Tallken to allow you to apply them to several areas Aug 21 14:35
Tallken you have to have the knowledge related to those areas Aug 21 14:35
Tallken so you can convert an abstract standard Aug 21 14:35
Tallken in something concrete Aug 21 14:35
Tallken twitter: lol :D Aug 21 14:35
Tallken twitter: I like Seinfeld Aug 21 14:36
blackrabbit this implies I don’t understand where you’re coming from, I do Aug 21 14:36
Tallken twitter: and Elaine :D Aug 21 14:36
Tallken blackrabbit: didn’t understand, care to rephrase please? Aug 21 14:36
MinceR i didn’t think seinfeld could sink so low Aug 21 14:36
blackrabbit O_o Aug 21 14:36
Tallken ? Aug 21 14:37
blackrabbit ..moving on Aug 21 14:37
MinceR re the powerbook: an anecdote showing that powerbooks are tough doesn’t mean all crapple computers are. Aug 21 14:37
schestowitz Ballmer gets the attention he craves in the front page: http://boycottnovell.com/   (lots of quotes and some photos) Aug 21 14:38
twitter He lent his name to a lame HP advert.  http://www.youtube.com/watc… Aug 21 14:38
schestowitz Oh no, Jerry SOLD OUT!! Aug 21 14:38
Tallken twitter: ok, crappy as hell Aug 21 14:39
PetoKraus jerry who? Aug 21 14:39
Tallken twitter: but it’s my computer in the ad ;) Aug 21 14:39
PetoKraus the mouse, you mean? Aug 21 14:39
twitter There were not many computers in the actual show.  Run 1989 to 1998. Aug 21 14:40
schestowitz Blech. Microsoft to use comedy to sell Windows. It figures. It’s a joke. Aug 21 14:40
twitter Investors won’t be laughing. Aug 21 14:40
twitter ha ha. Aug 21 14:40
MinceR PetoKraus: seinfeld. Aug 21 14:40
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schestowitz That’s it. I can’t watch Seinfeld anymore. Watched it over 1000 times (I think), but this is it. It’s a moral issue. :-) Aug 21 14:41
*blackrabbit registers BoycottSeinfeld Aug 21 14:41
MinceR :) Aug 21 14:42
blackrabbit not :D Aug 21 14:42
MinceR it would be nice Aug 21 14:42
schestowitz This isn’t the first time they use celebs to sell Windows. See my earlier post about Bollywood. It also mentioned Jackass and NASCAR. Aug 21 14:43
twitter A M$ person will feel right at home selling torture devices to local governments to inflict on citizens.  … M$ Jackass?!! Very funny and fitting. Aug 21 14:44
MinceR they’re already doing that Aug 21 14:44
MinceR winblows is a torture device, for example Aug 21 14:45
twitter Yes but Windows only kills people indirectly. Aug 21 14:45
twitter so far. Aug 21 14:45
MinceR well, some hospital equipment is said to run windows Aug 21 14:45
MinceR so we can’t really know Aug 21 14:45
schestowitz Bill Gates: “Windows 2000 already contains features such as the human discipline component, where the PC can send an electric shock through the keyboard if the human does something that does not please Windows.” Aug 21 14:46
MinceR :) Aug 21 14:46
twitter I wonder if they get royalties from Taser. Aug 21 14:47
twitter It’s funny that blogger thinks the Novel deal is making M$ money.  I thought they paid something silly like $3,000 per license the first time. Aug 21 14:49
schestowitz twitter: which blogger? Aug 21 14:49
schestowitz Sean Kerner? Well, they *do* get paid. Aug 21 14:50
twitter I’ll go look again, it was your link… Aug 21 14:50
schestowitz Microsoft turns SUSE into a cash cow. It needn’t even wrote code for it. Aug 21 14:50
twitter I don’t think they have made $350 million bucks from it. Aug 21 14:51
twitter How much did Novell make last year? Aug 21 14:51
twitter It’s repulsive M$ makes a single cent from code they hate. Aug 21 14:52
MinceR it isn’t just code they hate Aug 21 14:53
twitter I still think the Novell deal is a loser for them. Aug 21 14:53
MinceR it’s code they’ve publicly said all kinds of vile things about Aug 21 14:53
schestowitz twitter: being “repulsive” does not make something untrue. I’ve stressed this for ages. Aug 21 14:53
twitter http://boycottnovell.com/2006/12… Aug 21 14:56
blackrabbit always a pleasure, schestowitz, duty calls Aug 21 14:57
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twitter If your figures were right back then, the only way they are making money from Novell is by taking it from others.  I don’t see them making a profit even on $600/seat/year. Aug 21 14:59
schestowitz That brings back memories. Aug 21 15:00
schestowitz http://boycottnovell.com/2007/12… Aug 21 15:01
schestowitz I show you the bits about royalty payments. Aug 21 15:02
twitter All very interesting, but I don’t see how M$ can make a profit selling a Suse seat that cost them at least $600. Aug 21 15:10
twitter The money is going to have to come from royalties they will charge everyone in the future if they can pass that trash through US courts. Aug 21 15:11
twitter Canonical and Red Hat are still laughing out loud at M$ Patents. Aug 21 15:12
schestowitz Whose court is it anyway? http://boycottnovell.com/2007/10… Aug 21 15:13
schestowitz twitter: Microsoft leaves them out in the cold to screw them. http://boycottnovell.com/2008/06/11/mi… Aug 21 15:14
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neighborlee omg, will the FUD never end..these guys went to some school I think for this stuff, and they call US hilarious:: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php… < last post, just before mine..EEK gadzooks Aug 21 15:57
neighborlee even facing facts from a M$ employee they call it fud from that source…OOOOOOK ;) Aug 21 15:57
schestowitz Let me see.. Aug 21 15:57
schestowitz The ending says it’s a Mono fan. Aug 21 15:58
neighborlee interestingly enough,,this person has posted to forums 4 whole times…I smell a rat. Aug 21 15:58
neighborlee of course Aug 21 15:58
schestowitz He also seems to know the background to this, suggesting that he defended Mono before. Aug 21 15:58
schestowitz What are the other posts. Aug 21 15:58
schestowitz ? Aug 21 15:59
neighborlee atm , thats it Aug 21 15:59
neighborlee I was just a bit surprised he is caling FUD on a M$ employee’s own words LOL Aug 21 16:00
neighborlee oh,,I was just referring to the post prior to that, being mine, which he  r esponded to LOL Aug 21 16:00
neighborlee http://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-1… < he called this M$ FUD ..talk about  wanting cake and eat it too;0 Aug 21 16:01
schestowitz What other messages did he post? Aug 21 16:01
neighborlee oh that Aug 21 16:01
schestowitz You can search by username on that site. Aug 21 16:01
neighborlee well Aug 21 16:01
neighborlee yes Aug 21 16:01
schestowitz If all he ever does is defend Mono, then it could be a ‘mole’. Aug 21 16:01
neighborlee I just noted, that he only posted 3 other times other than this one, so to me I suspect a mono rat … Aug 21 16:01
neighborlee yes thats what I meant Aug 21 16:01
schestowitz Can you see these 3 posts? Aug 21 16:02
neighborlee yes ill check Aug 21 16:02
neighborlee http://ubuntuforums.org/search.php?s… Aug 21 16:02
Tallken lol Aug 21 16:03
neighborlee ROFL Aug 21 16:03
neighborlee yup I was right Aug 21 16:03
Tallken just Mono related threads Aug 21 16:03
neighborlee MOLE CITY Aug 21 16:03
neighborlee hhahah Aug 21 16:03
neighborlee ohhh boycottnovell got a noteworthy mention from our dear mole ;) Aug 21 16:03
neighborlee bravo schestowitz  hehe Aug 21 16:03
schestowitz Where? Aug 21 16:06
schestowitz I need to URLs to show this. Aug 21 16:07
schestowitz One posts per 2 months, all about Mono. In-tres-ting Aug 21 16:07
neighborlee http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread…. Aug 21 16:08
neighborlee It’s mostly all mole posts,,but there was one guy/gal ? who posted a sane rebuttle, userid I think it is Aug 21 16:09
neighborlee 2nd page I thik Aug 21 16:09
neighborlee ..think Aug 21 16:09
neighborlee yup Aug 21 16:10
schestowitz Can you give me the URLs please. I want to point this out in BN.com Aug 21 16:11
Tallken there is one thread where he posted several times Aug 21 16:11
neighborlee which  url do you wish Aug 21 16:11
Tallken 1st Aug 21 16:12
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=563526… Aug 21 16:12
neighborlee the one I gave , is the thread about boycottnovell Aug 21 16:12
Tallken 2nd Aug 21 16:12
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=51… Aug 21 16:12
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5… Aug 21 16:12
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.ph… Aug 21 16:13
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p… Aug 21 16:13
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.ph… Aug 21 16:13
Tallken 3rd Aug 21 16:13
neighborlee I saw that one yes, but I xeroed in on the boycottnvell thread is all Aug 21 16:13
neighborlee zeroed lol Aug 21 16:13
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5136257… Aug 21 16:14
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=51… Aug 21 16:14
Tallken 4th Aug 21 16:14
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=4683… Aug 21 16:14
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=4684425… Aug 21 16:14
Tallken http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=… Aug 21 16:14
Tallken Aug 21 16:15
Tallken the end Aug 21 16:15
schestowitz Thanks! Aug 21 16:15
Tallken «I do C# programming on Linux for a living using Mono, so there are definitely jobs out there – and more companies seem to be moving to Mono every week if you pay attention to the Mono mailing lists.» Aug 21 16:15
schestowitz *LOL* Aug 21 16:15
Tallken – by alternatealias Aug 21 16:15
schestowitz So he’s defending his pocket. Aug 21 16:15
neighborlee gotta love the nick LOL!! Aug 21 16:15
schestowitz It’s like asking Microsoft if Windows has problems. Aug 21 16:16
neighborlee yup,,I suspect they ALL are. Aug 21 16:16
neighborlee LOL Aug 21 16:16
schestowitz I’ll copy this and post about this later. I’ve got to run to the gym now. Aug 21 16:17
neighborlee ok have a great WO Aug 21 16:17
schestowitz Ta. Aug 21 16:18
*neighborlee considers wiifit WO <grins> Aug 21 16:18
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twitter Moles often do more than talk about their one topic.  They are bright enough to know they need to “round out” their pen names.  What you have to look for is a pattern of posting behavior and ignore the fluff. Aug 21 16:29
neighborlee also when someone posts but a few times since joining ( in 2004) its a clear sign he/she is doing so on a emotinal level…my assumption :L) Aug 21 16:30
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lucian hello Aug 21 16:44
neighborlee hi there Aug 21 16:45
lucian oh Aug 21 16:45
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neighborlee o_0 Aug 21 16:45
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self_liar hello Aug 21 16:47
neighborlee hi there liar ;) Aug 21 16:47
self_liar hello neigh Aug 21 16:47
neighborlee lol Aug 21 16:47
self_liar neighborlee: I was thinking Aug 21 16:47
self_liar neighborlee: have dot gnu  patent problems? Aug 21 16:47
neighborlee I have no idea Aug 21 16:48
self_liar neighborlee: maybe roy know about this Aug 21 16:49
neighborlee he isn’t here atm. Aug 21 16:49
self_liar neighborlee: i know Aug 21 16:49
neighborlee ah Aug 21 16:49
self_liar neighborlee: so ,the big problem Aug 21 16:51
self_liar neighborlee: is about people loving novell because the good will in help the linux foundation Aug 21 16:51
neighborlee I think part of it is people not taking time to look into problems facing foss Aug 21 16:52
neighborlee they just assume its ‘safe’ if a given distro adopts it. Aug 21 16:52
neighborlee which illistrates the importance of good leadership p)( Aug 21 16:53
neighborlee illustrates Aug 21 16:53
neighborlee however, it all might hopefully backware on M$, due to fedora livecd’s removal of mono ;) Aug 21 16:53
neighborlee I haven’t tried livedvd so I dont know,,at least on some front fedora is  answering the call . Aug 21 16:54
neighborlee considering redhat themselves, never adopted mono, I guess it was just a matter of time ;) Aug 21 16:54
self_liar neighborlee: yes Aug 21 16:56
self_liar neighborlee: People assumes which novell and other companies are necessary for GNU linux Aug 21 16:57
self_liar neighborlee: People think that without these companies, Linux would not be good enough. Aug 21 16:59
self_liar neighborlee:I do not believe it Aug 21 16:59
neighborlee I think linux would be just fine,,I dont know enough history of NOVEL, to really make a educated comment, but overall yeah I think your prob. right Aug 21 17:00
neighborlee a really , odd thing I just thought about Aug 21 17:00
self_liar neighborlee:Many things done in linux not serve get nothing in the area of desktop. Many things are not necessary for the desktop Aug 21 17:01
neighborlee novel bought out suse, and next the M$/novel deal came..( was that the order ?),,,isnt that what M$ does , buy out to remove competition ? Hmmmmmmmm Aug 21 17:01
self_liar neighborlee: Aug 21 17:02
self_liar “Oh not speak badly of their novell idiot! They help that most everyone! Shut up” Aug 21 17:02
self_liar português Aug 21 17:02
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self_liar Aug 21 17:02
self_liar » Aug 21 17:02
self_liar inglês Aug 21 17:02
self_liar Aug 21 17:02
self_liar Traduzir Aug 21 17:02
self_liar Aug 21 17:02
neighborlee are you ok thre self liar ?? Aug 21 17:02
neighborlee having keyboard issues ? Aug 21 17:02
self_liar neighborlee: oops ,sorry ,google translation error! Aug 21 17:02
neighborlee ahhhh ic ;) Aug 21 17:03
self_liar neighborlee: “Oh not speak badly of  novell ,your idiot! They help that most everyone! Aug 21 17:03
twitter Free software does not need companies, but there’s no reason companies can’t use free software. Aug 21 17:04
self_liar twitter: yes ,but people think this way Aug 21 17:04
twitter Free software works best when everyone can participate without harming the freedom of others. Aug 21 17:04
twitter people learn sooner or later Aug 21 17:05
neighborlee twitter, exactly Aug 21 17:05
neighborlee twitter, thats why I love gtk vs qt..not a flame over the two, just adding voice to your comment as it applies to use of foss. Aug 21 17:05
neighborlee one offers total freedom while the other almost ;) Aug 21 17:06
neighborlee foss an companies…most prefer gtk/gnome ( as I’ve read anyway) because of fact its not a financial burden..im not entirely sure of  how many do, but I suspect its high. Aug 21 17:07
twitter M$ is fighting the truth itself, that’s not a war they can win by perception management.  I have not kept up with gtk and qt.  Gnome’s move into mono is disturbing. Aug 21 17:07
twitter Free software is a winner because the cost of entry is low and the rewards are large. Aug 21 17:07
neighborlee I totally agree about your ending commenrt twitter Aug 21 17:07
neighborlee it worries me mu ch as well. Aug 21 17:07
neighborlee alot. Aug 21 17:07
neighborlee I even thought about forking gnome because of it Aug 21 17:08
neighborlee if they dont stop, I willl. Aug 21 17:08
neighborlee that or someone will,,if its not be done already. Aug 21 17:08
self_liar twitter: I believe that the LF chose make money from Linux, but this involves a  moral and ethical cost Aug 21 17:08
twitter Not if they respect user freedom. Aug 21 17:08
self_liar twitter: Yes ,according with license,they do this Aug 21 17:09
twitter Companies don’t have to make money through highway robbery. Aug 21 17:09
self_liar twitter: but for them all is technical decisions and who gives more power over linux Aug 21 17:09
self_liar twitter: the license does not change, but the etic and moral do Aug 21 17:10
twitter Sooner or later, companies with bad reputations lose their customers. Aug 21 17:10
MinceR i think both qt and gtk are in danger now Aug 21 17:10
twitter With free software, it can happen sooner. Aug 21 17:10
MinceR though gtk less so Aug 21 17:10
twitter Someone will fork it if there are real problems. Aug 21 17:10
MinceR they can do that with gtk but not with qt Aug 21 17:11
twitter Why not? Aug 21 17:11
MinceR (the qt fork will not be usable for non-gpl projects and i think that’s a problem with such a basic library) Aug 21 17:11
MinceR (unless of course it happens because nokia officially discontinues qt) Aug 21 17:12
twitter the problem is with non-gpl projects :) Aug 21 17:12
neighborlee I had no idea qt fork was  on horizon..is that even legal o_0 Aug 21 17:12
neighborlee err fork I guess of ‘free’ side but still..odd but interesting ;0- Aug 21 17:13
twitter Any free software project can be forked, but there has to be a good reason.  I’m not aware of any good reasons to fork qt. Aug 21 17:13
MinceR a desktop that can’t run non-gpl apps legally wouldn’t be practical Aug 21 17:13
neighborlee yes Aug 21 17:13
MinceR i’m afraid nokia will provide a reason eventually Aug 21 17:13
MinceR if for no other reason then because they get a nice sum of money from microsoft Aug 21 17:13
twitter What’s missing from gpl land? Aug 21 17:14
MinceR AAA-category games, for example Aug 21 17:14
twitter So? Aug 21 17:14
neighborlee indeed..huge gap Aug 21 17:14
neighborlee way huge Aug 21 17:14
MinceR and highly specialized apps that don’t have a great developer community Aug 21 17:14
neighborlee well..its clear,,,wine Aug 21 17:14
MinceR and non-gpl opensource apps Aug 21 17:14
neighborlee will be highly used for sometime ;) Aug 21 17:14
neighborlee for  things in which it works anyway ;)) Aug 21 17:15
twitter Free software does everything I need. Aug 21 17:15
neighborlee your lucky then Aug 21 17:15
MinceR gpl != free software Aug 21 17:15
neighborlee Im working on it, but I have a ways to go Aug 21 17:15
MinceR there’s gpl-incompatible free software, you know Aug 21 17:15
neighborlee MinceR, no, but its that very thing that allows freedom from opression sometimes ;) Aug 21 17:15
MinceR i know Aug 21 17:16
MinceR but that doesn’t mean that basic libraries should be legally barred from use Aug 21 17:16
self_liar Why intel blocks the installation of an alternative BIOS? Aug 21 17:16
neighborlee its not intel Aug 21 17:16
twitter Copy left and free software are both free software.  Copy left is best for the community but free software is usable. Aug 21 17:16
MinceR not even all copyleft is gpl Aug 21 17:16
self_liar neighborlee: Who? Aug 21 17:17
twitter So? Aug 21 17:17
neighborlee self_liar, unless this is something new ive not heard of Aug 21 17:17
MinceR so what you’re advocating would make it illegal to run some copyleft, opensourced apps and some non-copyleft opensourced apps Aug 21 17:17
self_liar neighborlee: FSF does not use intel chipsets Aug 21 17:17
MinceR (i’m not sure about the latter category actually) Aug 21 17:17
neighborlee self_liar, I find that slightly hypocritical Aug 21 17:18
self_liar neighborlee: why? Aug 21 17:18
neighborlee self_liar, I mean at least they do offer mostly oss gpu’s…we can’t get it all immediately ;) Aug 21 17:18
self_liar neighborlee: intel is very smart Aug 21 17:19
neighborlee personally I use amd, but hey lol Aug 21 17:21
neighborlee I almost considered ati though,,but I caved and stuck with my new 8800 GTX <G> Aug 21 17:21
neighborlee when I learned I could force 8800 to do hdr + AA, I stuck tight – Aug 21 17:22
self_liar neighborlee: Intel is very agressive sometimes, a long time intel join forces with microsoft Aug 21 17:22
self_liar neighborlee: but in gnu linux it does not matter Aug 21 17:22
neighborlee hmm I missed something then yes Aug 21 17:23
neighborlee how did they join Aug 21 17:23
neighborlee when] Aug 21 17:23
self_liar neighborlee: roy did some articles, intel -m$ forces negroponte Aug 21 17:23
neighborlee ah Aug 21 17:24
neighborlee I search it Aug 21 17:24
neighborlee I’ll Aug 21 17:24
neighborlee thx Aug 21 17:24
self_liar neighborlee: A playstation 2 emulator is very slow ,even in most actual machines Aug 21 17:24
self_liar self_liar: AA  is not so important in GNU Linux Aug 21 17:26
self_liar neighborlee:  AA  is not so important in GNU Linux Aug 21 17:26
*kentma (n=user@host86-152-100-228.range86-152.btcentralplus.com) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 21 17:28
self_liar kentma: hello kentma Aug 21 17:31
self_liar kentma: do you know about dot gnu has envolved in patents? Aug 21 17:31
neighborlee Now I totally understand why gpl3 was invented, if I didn’t quite earlier.. Aug 21 17:55
neighborlee The Microsoft/Novell Patent Covenant circumvented this GPLv2 restriction in a manner which most people consider to violate the spirit of the GPL, if not the precise wording. Novell did not negotiate a license for themselves and therefore was not required by the GPL to pass that license on to everyone. What they did was negotiate a license that was valid only for Novell customers. Aug 21 17:55
*libervisco (n=daniel@tuxhacker/libervisco) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 21 17:56
neighborlee libervisco, hi there ;0 Aug 21 17:56
self_liar neighborlee: please ,if you understand everything ,explain me Aug 21 17:57
neighborlee well its just the reason to be for gpl3..hey LOL that rhymed, im so hip Aug 21 17:58
neighborlee basicallly , simply that gpl3 will protect from abuse of gpl2 Aug 21 17:58
neighborlee ala make such pacts of novel and M$ as example, impossible Aug 21 17:58
self_liar neighborlee: oh ,of course,but the detail I don understand Aug 21 17:59
self_liar neighborlee: why gpl blocks this contracts? Aug 21 18:00
neighborlee gpl3 will Aug 21 18:00
neighborlee it willl block allowed use of gpl if patent is intended Aug 21 18:00
self_liar neighborlee: sorry , wrong question Aug 21 18:00
neighborlee np Aug 21 18:00
self_liar neighborlee: HOW GPL blocks this contracts Aug 21 18:01
neighborlee http://gplv3.fsf.org/ Aug 21 18:01
self_liar neighborlee: ah , ok, I will read, thanks Aug 21 18:02
neighborlee yw Aug 21 18:02
self_liar neighborlee: did you find some article about intel-m$? Aug 21 18:02
neighborlee nope Aug 21 18:02
neighborlee was busy reading, and checking for moles Aug 21 18:02
neighborlee haha Aug 21 18:02
self_liar neighborlee: heh ok Aug 21 18:02
neighborlee dain things are pesky Aug 21 18:03
benJIman I see boycottnovell is linked here http://opensource.org/node/363 Aug 21 18:06
self_liar damn Aug 21 18:09
self_liar seems the cursed OOXML has been approved Aug 21 18:09
twitter what ? Aug 21 18:11
self_liar http://www.iso.org/iso/press… Aug 21 18:12
neighborlee laughable Aug 21 18:17
neighborlee can anyone say, stacked deck LOL ;)) Aug 21 18:17
twitter oh, that.  it was a scandal and there’s time for appeals. Aug 21 18:17
neighborlee its like our system for appointing  supreme court justices Aug 21 18:18
neighborlee talk about stacked ;) Aug 21 18:18
neighborlee Sam’s message to the audience, which included leading open source companies, open source project leaders, board members, venture capitalists, etc., is that Microsoft is truly, truly interested in playing nice with the open source community. < OMGosh thast funny ;) Aug 21 18:19
neighborlee man, who did he think he was kidding ?? ;) Aug 21 18:19
neighborlee id love to have been a mouse, looking straight out at audience watching reactions ;) Aug 21 18:19
self_liar twitter: but after the rejection of india and other countries, I don t believe anymore Aug 21 18:20
neighborlee benJIman, ah yes Ic that…sweet ;) Aug 21 18:24
neighborlee yes, the ballmer comment is insurance that clearly signals the mess mono is..we should  continually remind everyone of that . Aug 21 18:26
*lucian (n=lucian@201-68-205-24.dsl.telesp.net.br) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 21 18:37
twitter Yes, it was really outrageous of them to reject all of the appeals at once, without considering the individual merits of each.  The 2/3rds vote to continue and language problems were also great corruptions. Aug 21 18:37
twitter Still, they can’t publish that trash as long as there are appeals. Aug 21 18:37
*lucian (n=lucian@201-68-205-24.dsl.telesp.net.br) has left #boycottnovell (“Konversation terminated!”) Aug 21 18:38
*lucian (n=lucian@201-68-205-24.dsl.telesp.net.br) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 21 18:38
*lucian has quit (Remote closed the connection) Aug 21 18:39
*seller_liar (n=lucian@201-68-205-24.dsl.telesp.net.br) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 21 18:40
seller_liar hey Aug 21 18:40
seller_liar my identity has been stolen Aug 21 18:40
kentma ah, more trolls? Aug 21 18:45
*seller_liar has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) Aug 21 18:49
*self_liar has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) Aug 21 18:51
*schestowitz catching up Aug 21 18:52
*seller_liar (n=seller@201-68-113-10.dsl.telesp.net.br) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 21 18:55
schestowitz So OSI endorses Boycott Novell now, or at least begins to. It’s about time. 2 years late. Aug 21 18:56
seller_liar schestowitz: hey roy ,if you self_liar , don trust Aug 21 18:56
schestowitz Intel/Microsoft collusion at http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/0… (answering a question) Aug 21 18:56
seller_liar schestowitz: oh ,thanks Aug 21 18:57
seller_liar schestowitz: *if you see self_liar , maybe a troll Aug 21 18:57
schestowitz I have lots of stuff stacked for posting and more news to catch up with. The Mono thing is importany. Aug 21 18:57
seller_liar schestowitz: yes Aug 21 18:58
schestowitz Re:  ISO and IEC members give go ahead on ISO/IEC DIS 29500 ( http://www.iso.org/iso/… ) : it’s not over yet and it’s not news. It’s from last week. Aug 21 18:58
schestowitz seller_liar: thanks, I’ll do a whois. Aug 21 18:59
seller_liar schestowitz: ah ,ok, I’m bit outdated, but I cannot see hope in this case Aug 21 18:59
schestowitz OpenSUSE has just reaches alpha 2 (11.1) Aug 21 19:00
seller_liar schestowitz: I don like suse, Mandriva is a lot better , suse is bad Aug 21 19:02
schestowitz It has been a very quiet week for OpenSUSE so far. Aug 21 19:03
PetoKraus :) Aug 21 19:03
*schestowitz uses Mandriva at the moment. Other two PCs don’t have Mandriva.. Aug 21 19:03
seller_liar schestowitz: mandriva gnome includes mono? Aug 21 19:03
PetoKraus hehe. i’ve been just solving a problem for a friend Aug 21 19:04
seller_liar schestowitz: I’m using mandriva kde Aug 21 19:04
schestowitz This one made me smile (IMG): http://beranger.org/index.php?p… Aug 21 19:04
*schestowitz on Mandriva 2008.1 KDE Aug 21 19:04
PetoKraus he’s got ubuntu, with WindowsXP vmware folder on the desktop, he had moved the folder to trash and couldn’t move it back (too big) Aug 21 19:04
PetoKraus ssh & mv save the day Aug 21 19:04
PetoKraus he was like “so, would you come over, or…” “nono, i’ll fix it from here” :) Aug 21 19:04
schestowitz Just got mail (SPAM?) from  “Microsoft International Promotions” Aug 21 19:05
seller_liar schestowitz: heheh,funny , very sad,but true Aug 21 19:05
seller_liar schestowitz: a lot of people does not give credit for rms Aug 21 19:05
PetoKraus well… Aug 21 19:06
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