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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: February 27th, 2009 – Part 1

Posted in IRC Logs at 11:55 pm by Dr. Roy Schestowitz


Enter the IRC channel now

schestowitz Hey Feb 27 00:00
wispygalaxy hi roy! Feb 27 00:00
schestowitz Long time no see Feb 27 00:00
Balrog hi Feb 27 00:00
wispygalaxy same here hehe :) Feb 27 00:00
wispygalaxy missed ya Feb 27 00:00
*schestowitz reminds channel wispygalaxy is female Feb 27 00:00
wispygalaxy yes lol Feb 27 00:00
schestowitz Anyway.. Feb 27 00:00
schestowitz So TomTom’s in the news now. Feb 27 00:01
wispygalaxy yes i heard Feb 27 00:01
wispygalaxy linux is in court :( Feb 27 00:01
schestowitz No, TomTom. Feb 27 00:01
schestowitz It’s not a Linux case Feb 27 00:01
wispygalaxy oh ok Feb 27 00:01
schestowitz But a portion is put to the test Feb 27 00:01
wispygalaxy on digg, there were posts saying “ms is suing linux” Feb 27 00:01
wispygalaxy did you see them? Feb 27 00:02
Balrog in any case, isn’t there prior art on FAT naming, or is that not applicable here? Feb 27 00:02
wispygalaxy same wording Feb 27 00:02
wispygalaxy did ms wait too long to sue? Feb 27 00:02
schestowitz wispygalaxy: I didn’t see them Feb 27 00:03
schestowitz I hardly read Digg or submit much Feb 27 00:03
wispygalaxy they were in upcoming Feb 27 00:03
Balrog I hope they did …. 13 years is a bit long (that’s the length of time I hear it took them to sue) Feb 27 00:03
schestowitz I’ll be back though. Feb 27 00:03
wispygalaxy you had good stuff on there roy Feb 27 00:03
wispygalaxy cool balrog Feb 27 00:03
wispygalaxy digg is not the same like last year Feb 27 00:04
Balrog The post on digg is “Microsoft suit over FAT patents could open OSS Pandora’s Box” Feb 27 00:04
wispygalaxy i barely read the Front Page anymore Feb 27 00:04
schestowitz Digg used to be a favourite, but mostly in mid-2006 Feb 27 00:04
wispygalaxy upcoming is where i’m at Feb 27 00:04
schestowitz front page of Digg is a mess for news Feb 27 00:04
wispygalaxy yes, i saw your stuff from 2006-2007 Feb 27 00:04
wispygalaxy i blocked all political news from the FP Feb 27 00:04
wispygalaxy it’s more tolerable that way ;) Feb 27 00:05
wispygalaxy i go on reddit more Feb 27 00:05
Balrog I read slashdot Feb 27 00:06
wispygalaxy i do at times Feb 27 00:06
wispygalaxy i saw the poll they had.  it asked how much do you really work Feb 27 00:06
wispygalaxy so roy, have you used kde 4.2 yet? Feb 27 00:07
Balrog I have … it’s great Feb 27 00:07
wispygalaxy yes, it’s really neat Feb 27 00:07
Balrog much better than GNOME for usability Feb 27 00:08
wispygalaxy yes, customization is good Feb 27 00:08
wispygalaxy i’m into eye candy a lot Feb 27 00:08
Balrog (KDE was terrible in 4.0 and bad in 4.1 , and I preferred GNOME over KDE3) Feb 27 00:08
schestowitz wispygalaxy: no yet, not until I move on to the next distro Feb 27 00:08
Balrog I use gentoo Feb 27 00:08
Balrog but KDE4.2 I tested on Fedora 10 Feb 27 00:09
wispygalaxy that’s cool balrog! Feb 27 00:09
wispygalaxy thats ok roy Feb 27 00:09
schestowitz I might use/try BLOG next (Mandriva is perfect, but [H]omer is now developing BLAG) Feb 27 00:09
wispygalaxy 4.0 wasnt 100% ready, i agree Feb 27 00:09
schestowitz *BLAG Feb 27 00:09
Balrog 4.0 wasn’t 55% ready Feb 27 00:09
wispygalaxy i’ve seen homer’s site, very informative Feb 27 00:09
Balrog Fedora is already on one CD Feb 27 00:09
wispygalaxy haha balrog Feb 27 00:10
schestowitz But it’s Enlightenment-based (mostly), maybe some KDE4 packages somewhere too. Will travel,  will compile:-) Feb 27 00:10
wispygalaxy i will always do net installs, never from DVDs Feb 27 00:10
Balrog hm. I get all choice I want with Gentoo. Feb 27 00:10
wispygalaxy haha nice roy Feb 27 00:10
schestowitz Unless it’s mono Feb 27 00:10
Balrog gentoo’s bootstrap system is nic. Feb 27 00:10
schestowitz The choice is DIABLO Feb 27 00:10
Balrog nice * Feb 27 00:10
wispygalaxy ive never tried enlightenment, it looks great Feb 27 00:10
schestowitz It has Compiz now too Feb 27 00:11
schestowitz Novell’s work in part Feb 27 00:11
Balrog Mono … well, once you start trying latest svn, you’re on your own in Gentoo Feb 27 00:11
wispygalaxy gentoo is very powerful, i see :) Feb 27 00:11
wispygalaxy compiz FTW Feb 27 00:11
Balrog the Mono guys say it’s Gentoo’s fault that stuff doesn’t work Feb 27 00:11
wispygalaxy it swayed me to use linux Feb 27 00:11
Balrog compiz is great. But the GPU in my gentoo box is too slow for it Feb 27 00:12
Balrog I use XFCE Feb 27 00:12
wispygalaxy ooo minimal Feb 27 00:12
Balrog yeah, it’s not a very fast system … 1.5GHz / 1.5GB ram Feb 27 00:12
PetoKraus schestowitz: if you wanna try E, use elive Feb 27 00:12
PetoKraus it’s well prepackaged Feb 27 00:12
wispygalaxy i have a 1.73GHz processor for my lappy Feb 27 00:12
wispygalaxy hello, pk! Feb 27 00:12
Balrog heh Feb 27 00:13
PetoKraus hi there Feb 27 00:13
wispygalaxy elive is based on debian, right? Feb 27 00:13
Balrog I know, but I want speed, and GUI isn’t very crucial Feb 27 00:13
PetoKraus yes Feb 27 00:13
wispygalaxy cool, i use debian right now Feb 27 00:13
PetoKraus :) Feb 27 00:13
PetoKraus i started on elive… Feb 27 00:13
wispygalaxy i like gui over speed ;) Feb 27 00:13
PetoKraus used it for 2 months Feb 27 00:14
Balrog cool. I find Fedora 10 nicer than Ubuntu btw Feb 27 00:14
PetoKraus and then moved to debian Feb 27 00:14
wispygalaxy fedora has a great gui Feb 27 00:14
wispygalaxy nice, pk Feb 27 00:14
wispygalaxy when did you start using debian? Feb 27 00:15
PetoKraus i used it since december 2007 till march-april 2008 Feb 27 00:15
schestowitz PetoKraus: If I can run KDE apps, then I might give it a go. I change distros each time I do an install (because it’s more fun). Feb 27 00:15
PetoKraus then it was gentoo for 5-6 months Feb 27 00:16
PetoKraus schestowitz: it uses debian repos, so you should Feb 27 00:16
wispygalaxy im the only one who hasn’t experienced the power of gentoo in this irc room lol :( Feb 27 00:16
wispygalaxy i only have tried ubuntu and debian Feb 27 00:16
wispygalaxy yes, distro switching sounds fun roy Feb 27 00:17
wispygalaxy something new Feb 27 00:17
Balrog what uses debian repos? Gentoo downloads directly from the source, and applies patches from Gentoo if needed Feb 27 00:17
schestowitz PetoKraus: oh, that’s right…. I didn’t know it was still binary compatible. Feb 27 00:17
schestowitz Was someone called Rayman doing it? Feb 27 00:17
PetoKraus yes, it was at the time i used it Feb 27 00:17
Balrog Gento is tricky to set up though … but once it’s up and running it’s rock-solid Feb 27 00:17
PetoKraus you better ask in #elive Feb 27 00:17
wispygalaxy i had XP for 3 years at home along with IE6, i cant imagine doing that again XD Feb 27 00:17
schestowitz A Begian guy, IIRC Feb 27 00:17
PetoKraus Balrog: no it isn’t Feb 27 00:17
schestowitz *Belg Feb 27 00:17
PetoKraus schestowitz: he’s called thanatermesis Feb 27 00:17
Balrog PetoKraus: you mean use the Live CD? Feb 27 00:18
Balrog I don’t do that :P Feb 27 00:18
wispygalaxy i hope to try out gentoo one day ;) Feb 27 00:18
schestowitz wispygalaxy: it’s like a restaurant or a vacation. It’s all similar, but changing fulfills human curiosity. Feb 27 00:18
PetoKraus Balrog: no, gentoo is not rock-solid Feb 27 00:18
PetoKraus well Feb 27 00:18
PetoKraus depends how you set it up Feb 27 00:19
Balrog it’s as rock solid as any linux Feb 27 00:19
PetoKraus in theory, it’s quite solid, not as debian, but it is solid Feb 27 00:19
wispygalaxy nice to see you have a open mind, roy :D Feb 27 00:19
PetoKraus but package managers tend to screw up quite a lot Feb 27 00:19
wispygalaxy i like trying out new foods and clothes Feb 27 00:19
Balrog yeah, so you have to (a) make a local portage tree and (b) make some modifications Feb 27 00:19
Balrog at least in some cases Feb 27 00:20
Balrog I’m running unstable btw Feb 27 00:20
Balrog ( ~x86 ) Feb 27 00:20
*balzac_ has quit (Connection timed out) Feb 27 00:20
PetoKraus i was as well Feb 27 00:20
PetoKraus it was stable branches which have been borked Feb 27 00:20
Balrog heh. Feb 27 00:20
wispygalaxy there’s a big speed difference between debian and ubuntu Feb 27 00:20
Balrog which is faster, and why? Feb 27 00:20
wispygalaxy i had both on my laptop; debian is lightning fast Feb 27 00:20
PetoKraus kernel Feb 27 00:21
wispygalaxy ubuntu lagged at the startup Feb 27 00:21
PetoKraus ubuntu has 300Hz i’d guess Feb 27 00:21
PetoKraus debian has 250 or 100Hz, i’m not quite sure Feb 27 00:21
Balrog look in /proc/config.gz Feb 27 00:21
wispygalaxy so debian can use resources more efficiently, you mean? Feb 27 00:21
PetoKraus i don’t have any of them installed, i cant ;) Feb 27 00:21
Balrog it’s more about kernel interrupts I think Feb 27 00:22
Balrog PetoKraus: why? Feb 27 00:22
wispygalaxy ohhh ok, cool Feb 27 00:22
PetoKraus Balrog: why what? :) Feb 27 00:22
Balrog you can’t run any? Feb 27 00:22
wispygalaxy have you guys ever triple booted Feb 27 00:22
Balrog and what are you running? Feb 27 00:22
Balrog I use VM’s Feb 27 00:22
PetoKraus arch. Feb 27 00:22
Balrog I have multi-booted Feb 27 00:22
wispygalaxy vm is cool, i would like to try it out Feb 27 00:23
PetoKraus i’ve been told to try it when I was pissed off at gentoo Feb 27 00:23
PetoKraus and it stuck. Feb 27 00:23
Balrog hm. Feb 27 00:23
wispygalaxy arch is really fast i heard Feb 27 00:23
PetoKraus it’s not about being fast Feb 27 00:23
Balrog what about this talk about Opensolaris and nexenta? anyone tried it? Feb 27 00:24
wispygalaxy when using vm, what did you swtich between? Feb 27 00:24
PetoKraus it’s more about better organisation of the distribution… while Gentoo offers you slightly more flexibility (well, more flexibility easily compared to arch), this causes headaches for the devs. On arch, you have to be experienced to make it really really gentoo-ish flexible (PKGBUILD editing), but the package managers have it easy Feb 27 00:25
tessier_ Balrog: It looks interesting but I don’t trust Sun or their license so I would never depend on it. Therefore it’s a toy. Feb 27 00:25
Balrog me? I have OS X as the host (at home) and Windows, Fedora, and Ubuntu. At school/work, I have a Gentoo system Feb 27 00:25
Balrog (the one I’m talking about) Feb 27 00:25
PetoKraus it’s dead easy to install a package from outside of your repository tree in arch, in gentoo you need overlays etc Feb 27 00:25
wispygalaxy thats very interesting, pk.  one of my friends at school used arch in the past, and he liked pacman Feb 27 00:25
PetoKraus the only thing i miss from gentoo is proper package block Feb 27 00:26
Balrog Gentoo is also good because *everything* is built from source. So you know what’s going on with the code. (no one sneaked bad code into a binary build.) Feb 27 00:26
wispygalaxy that’s cool balrog, thats a nice variety Feb 27 00:26
Balrog I do have to deal with Solaris though (on SPARC) Feb 27 00:26
schestowitz http://www.kev009.com/wp/2009/02/i-hate-ubuntu/ “I hate Ubuntu.  I immediately lose respect for anyone who runs it, and especially those who advocate it. “ Feb 27 00:27
wispygalaxy i love synaptic, btw Feb 27 00:27
PetoKraus Balrog: yeah, on the other hand, gentoo tends to patch a lot. Arch gives you all the “ebuilds” (PKGBUILDs) in an app called Arch Build System. Most packages are vanilla in arch. Feb 27 00:27
PetoKraus therefore you can rebuild the package using ABS, or just do a version bump if new one is released Feb 27 00:27
wispygalaxy balrog, it’s nice how gentoo gives you control.  i wish i knew how to do it Feb 27 00:27
PetoKraus wispygalaxy: gentoo is very good learning tool Feb 27 00:28
wispygalaxy thanks for the link. roy Feb 27 00:28
PetoKraus you should try it Feb 27 00:28
schestowitz wispygalaxy: yes, but I dual boot (Linux and… Linux) Feb 27 00:28
Balrog does Arch have the USE flag system? Feb 27 00:28
wispygalaxy ok i will, it will be one of my goals Feb 27 00:28
Balrog (which is one of the best features of Gentoo) Feb 27 00:28
wispygalaxy haha nice roy Feb 27 00:28
wispygalaxy both using kde, roy? Feb 27 00:28
Balrog schestowitz: I don’t dual boot in Windows anymore. I have a second partition, but that changes frequently Feb 27 00:29
PetoKraus Balrog: no it doesn’t, but you don’t really need it unless you are ricer Feb 27 00:29
Balrog I have a windows VM just-in-case though Feb 27 00:29
schestowitz wispygalaxy: yes. Feb 27 00:29
wispygalaxy :) Feb 27 00:29
PetoKraus and if you want to say, build gnash againist agg instead of opengl Feb 27 00:29
PetoKraus you just change the pkgbuild ;) Feb 27 00:29
PetoKraus there’s optional dependency handling Feb 27 00:30
Balrog erm that’s messy, IMO Feb 27 00:30
wispygalaxy do you use windows for games, balrog? Feb 27 00:30
Balrog us flags are much cleaner Feb 27 00:30
Balrog not games, certain pro software that requires it Feb 27 00:30
PetoKraus theoretically they are cleaner Feb 27 00:30
schestowitz Windows to a computer is like the paper stuffing that comes inside shoes Feb 27 00:30
PetoKraus when it comes to what they can cause, no thanks :D Feb 27 00:30
schestowitz It’s there even if you don’t need it, but you remove it Feb 27 00:30
Balrog I only use it if I have no other choice Feb 27 00:30
wispygalaxy XD roy Feb 27 00:30
PetoKraus there was this very nice bug in gentoo last year Feb 27 00:30
Balrog PetoKraus: what USE-flags cause? Feb 27 00:31
wispygalaxy haha a schestowizm Feb 27 00:31
PetoKraus basically some people have been locked out of their system….. Feb 27 00:31
Balrog schestowitz: I have a Mac, so that doesn’t apply Feb 27 00:31
Balrog yeah, I have Mac OS, but it’s certainly better than Windows Feb 27 00:31
schestowitz Balrog: Macs run Linux too Feb 27 00:31
Balrog And I don’t pay for Windows (get it through school as they have MSDN) Feb 27 00:31
PetoKraus folks, which were using stable and had enabled kerberos useflag systemwide and upgraded their system, and had openssl systemwide were borked…. Feb 27 00:31
schestowitz Linus uses a Mac Feb 27 00:31
Balrog yes, I have Linux VMs Feb 27 00:31
PetoKraus because there was some conflicts – all in all, your wget wouldn’t work because of some dependency ripple Feb 27 00:32
wispygalaxy didnt linus diss the mac os filesystem lol Feb 27 00:32
PetoKraus (triggered by system wide kerberos and openssl) Feb 27 00:32
Balrog Dual-booting is annoying though so I don’t like to do it Feb 27 00:32
Balrog the mac os file system is an interesting beast. Feb 27 00:32
wispygalaxy yes grub can be annoying at times Feb 27 00:32
Balrog see http://osxbook.com/software/hfsdebug/ and the related chapter in Singh’s book if you want to know all about it :P Feb 27 00:33
wispygalaxy macs outnumber windows pcs at my school Feb 27 00:33
Balrog it does need to be replaced eventually Feb 27 00:33
Balrog (it’s somewhat archaic) Feb 27 00:33
Balrog I hear they’re working with Sun on ZFS for Mac Feb 27 00:33
wispygalaxy when you walk past the couches in the study area, you can see netbooks too Feb 27 00:33
Balrog Linux netbooks? Feb 27 00:33
Balrog I’ve seen some with XP Feb 27 00:33
wispygalaxy thanks balrog! Feb 27 00:33
wispygalaxy for the link Feb 27 00:33
Balrog np Feb 27 00:34
Balrog also http://zfs.macosforge.org/trac/wiki/ Feb 27 00:34
wispygalaxy i think some linux Feb 27 00:34
Balrog for the ZFS driver (it’s not too stable yet) Feb 27 00:34
Balrog good. windows on a netbook sucks Feb 27 00:34
Balrog btw, the OS X Internals book by Singh is really good if you want to know how it works inside Feb 27 00:34
wispygalaxy my mom really liked the dell mini with ubuntu, she thought it looked easier to use than windows. Feb 27 00:35
wispygalaxy i still help her with using a computer Feb 27 00:35
PetoKraus my mom really liked my E desktop with dock… Feb 27 00:35
PetoKraus though my colour scheme is a bit intimidating at first Feb 27 00:35
Balrog also he wrote about the encryption they use … see http://osxbook.com/book/bonu… and http://osxbook.com/book/bonus/chapt… Feb 27 00:35
wispygalaxy yes its interesting to know how it all works, balrog Feb 27 00:35
Balrog cool Feb 27 00:35
Balrog btw, the key they use is rather funny, but I won’t say it here Feb 27 00:36
wispygalaxy i dont think i saw any netbooks with XP here Feb 27 00:36
PetoKraus (http://pk.gjhak.sk/old/.storage/2009-…) Feb 27 00:36
wispygalaxy haha balrog Feb 27 00:36
schestowitz News: You Want A Beautiful OS? Try Elive < http://maketecheasier.com/you-want-a-bea… > Feb 27 00:36
wispygalaxy thanks for teaching me all that balrog, with the links Feb 27 00:36
wispygalaxy it looks fantastic, roy Feb 27 00:37
Balrog np Feb 27 00:37
Balrog I have more info, but it’s a lot Feb 27 00:37
wispygalaxy nice screenshot pk Feb 27 00:37
wispygalaxy you should write a blog Feb 27 00:37
wispygalaxy balrog Feb 27 00:37
schestowitz Good comment from Jeff Waugh here: http://www.workswithu.com/2009/02/25/r… He has been quiet for a while. Feb 27 00:37
wispygalaxy spread your knowledge Feb 27 00:38
wispygalaxy i remember the podcast with you and waugh, roy Feb 27 00:38
wispygalaxy late 2007, i think Feb 27 00:38
Balrog MS says there are more Linux desktops than Macs Feb 27 00:39
schestowitz PetoKraus: word up re: colour scheme Feb 27 00:39
Balrog *desktops* Feb 27 00:39
schestowitz Some people think that GUI is grey with teletubby XP theme Feb 27 00:39
wispygalaxy ewwwww Feb 27 00:39
PetoKraus haha Feb 27 00:39
PetoKraus it’s GTK theme from xfce Feb 27 00:39
PetoKraus xfce-dusk i think Feb 27 00:40
wispygalaxy haha reminds me of how ballmer thinks linux is more of a threat than apple Feb 27 00:40
wispygalaxy i want to try out xfce too Feb 27 00:40
Balrog yeah and in the long run, it is a greater threat Feb 27 00:40
PetoKraus and i’ve hand-edited one theme done by a designer of E Feb 27 00:40
PetoKraus to fit with it Feb 27 00:40
schestowitz wispygalaxy: he doesn’t /think/, he /knows/ Feb 27 00:40
wispygalaxy lol yes Feb 27 00:40
schestowitz They have “Linux Heat Map” at MS Feb 27 00:40
Balrog Apple gets the higher end of the market (probably less than 25% at most), Linux gets the majority of the rest Feb 27 00:40
wispygalaxy remember that open source job opening? :P Feb 27 00:41
Balrog that’s what I think MS is afraid of Feb 27 00:41
Balrog yeah I do… Feb 27 00:41
schestowitz “open source strategist..” Feb 27 00:41
schestowitz More like “open source vandal” Feb 27 00:41
wispygalaxy macs are hot with the hipsters at my sister’s college Feb 27 00:41
schestowitz Take freedom away, replace with DRM, rise and repeat Feb 27 00:41
PetoKraus obviously hardest to target are mac users Feb 27 00:41
schestowitz *rinse Feb 27 00:41
wispygalaxy the stereotypes are true Feb 27 00:41
wispygalaxy how can you fight with free? Feb 27 00:42
Balrog and they’re hot with the pros. The stereotypes aren’t 100% true … maybe like 30% (most Mac users I know aren’t hipsters btw) Feb 27 00:42
Balrog and so far the DRM has been low compared to Windows$ Feb 27 00:42
wispygalaxy everytime i see someone with a mac at my school, it’s either a girl with designer clothes, preppy kids, or artists Feb 27 00:43
schestowitz A Third of Dell Inspiron Mini 9 Netbooks Comes with Ubuntu < http://www.itproportal.com/portal/news/article/200… > Feb 27 00:43
wispygalaxy yes the djs i like use macs Feb 27 00:43
[H]omer roy, ref: the red hat vs ubuntu link “But despite all the traits that would seem to make thin clients great – they have cheaper hardware requirements and allow for greater centralization and standardization of software – they’ve rarely failed to gain traction outside of niche markets.” Spot the Freudian slip (double negative) Feb 27 00:43
schestowitz Kudos to Dell for that one. wispygalaxy says that her mom like her Ubuntu Dell. Feb 27 00:43
wispygalaxy she was visibly impressed Feb 27 00:43
Balrog heh. Not true at my school (college). Well my college is large (25000 students) Feb 27 00:43
[H]omer “rarely failed” Feb 27 00:43
wispygalaxy hi [h]omer Feb 27 00:44
wispygalaxy nice to meet you here Feb 27 00:44
[H]omer hi Feb 27 00:44
wispygalaxy i know roy from digg Feb 27 00:44
Balrog ahh … dj’s use them because it’s smoother than Windows. I know a DJ who switched (from Windows) recently Feb 27 00:44
Balrog there’s a lack of good Linux software in some of those fields. :( Feb 27 00:44
schestowitz [H]omer: yeah, nicely concealed there in logical negations Feb 27 00:44
wispygalaxy yes they all like the mac music software Feb 27 00:44
wispygalaxy but you can be a linux user and a dj, its possible ;) Feb 27 00:45
[H]omer Roy, they think people won’t notice Feb 27 00:45
schestowitz [H]omer: “niche market” Feb 27 00:45
schestowitz “marginal” Feb 27 00:45
[H]omer I notice Feb 27 00:45
schestowitz “frantic Feb 27 00:45
schestowitz “lunatic” Feb 27 00:45
*jose__ has quit (“Leaving”) Feb 27 00:45
[H]omer Yes, it’s obvious MS propaganda Feb 27 00:45
[H]omer We were just talking about that in BLAG Feb 27 00:45
*PetoKraus np: Genesis – Dancing With The Moonlit Knight (Selling England By The Pound) Feb 27 00:45
schestowitz There are those Linux ‘fans’ who say they are “happy” with 1% market share Feb 27 00:45
schestowitz Which is a nod to a big lie Feb 27 00:46
Balrog yeah I saw one of them on slashdot Feb 27 00:46
wispygalaxy why settle for less Feb 27 00:46
Balrog got modded troll right away Feb 27 00:46
schestowitz Even Microsoft knows it’s probably over 5% where the Gartner and IDCs don’t travel (Russia, Brazil China..) Feb 27 00:46
wispygalaxy unfair Feb 27 00:46
PetoKraus nah Feb 27 00:46
schestowitz PetoKraus: remove Moonlit Feb 27 00:46
PetoKraus i mean, for people who need, there’s enough software in linux to do multimedia Feb 27 00:47
PetoKraus schestowitz: call Phil or Peter Feb 27 00:47
[H]omer “First, it could be argued that Red Hat anticipates desktop Linux becoming a profitable product for the first time in history, and wants to ensure itself a piece of the pie.  This seems unlikely, however, since Red Hat already participates indirectly in the desktop market through its sponsorship of the Fedora Project.” Feb 27 00:47
schestowitz http://www.groklaw.net/article.php… Feb 27 00:47
[H]omer There’s so much wrong with that, I don’t know where to begin Feb 27 00:47
[H]omer “first time in history” Feb 27 00:47
Balrog PetoKraus: well, it’s only starting to get good. DJ’s rely on specialty software that isn’t yet available for Linux Feb 27 00:47
[H]omer bollocks Feb 27 00:47
PetoKraus Balrog: well, yeah, sound is quite bad Feb 27 00:48
wispygalaxy thats the thing about apple, they cater to specialized groups Feb 27 00:48
PetoKraus gimp + inkscape + qtpfsgui + hugin +krita are okay for graphics Feb 27 00:48
wispygalaxy so it’s very convenient for djs to get everything in one package Feb 27 00:48
Balrog wispygalaxy: They cater to whoever wants to pay at least $1000 Feb 27 00:48
schestowitz [H]omer: Red Hat sells RHEL for desktops to many clients Feb 27 00:48
PetoKraus and cinelerra + kino + blender is The Ultimate Movie Factory combo Feb 27 00:48
[H]omer And … they won’t because of Fedora … again, bollocks. What about Ubuntu v Ubuntu LTS, or SUSE v OpenSUSE, or … etc Feb 27 00:48
schestowitz Intel, DreamWorks, etc. Feb 27 00:48
PetoKraus (obviously, with fully equipped mencoder) Feb 27 00:49
PetoKraus but sound, umm :/ Feb 27 00:49
Balrog and Photoshop has stuff that pros need. Unfortunately, Adobe doesn’t know how to write good code. Feb 27 00:49
wispygalaxy haha true balrog Feb 27 00:49
PetoKraus well Feb 27 00:49
PetoKraus it’s what I am talking about Feb 27 00:49
PetoKraus i am sure if people tried they could do everything using FOSS Feb 27 00:49
Balrog Maya is available for Linux … most of the plugins don’t work (Windows-only binaries), but yes it’s available Feb 27 00:49
wispygalaxy i dont know anyone personally who uses photoshop Feb 27 00:49
[H]omer +1 Feb 27 00:49
Balrog I know several people Feb 27 00:49
PetoKraus the proof is being Big Buck Bunny, for example Feb 27 00:49
PetoKraus -being Feb 27 00:50
Balrog I took a digital effects class last summer. Feb 27 00:50
[H]omer Photoshop is a scam to cream money from sheep Feb 27 00:50
PetoKraus well Feb 27 00:50
Balrog they all use Macs … and Windows for a few specific apps. Feb 27 00:50
PetoKraus i don’t know a single person who has legal photoshop Feb 27 00:50
schestowitz Buzz advertising. Feb 27 00:50
PetoKraus at work we don’t have Feb 27 00:50
schestowitz Bernays et al. Feb 27 00:50
Balrog and Photoshop and all. In any case, Photoshop is the standard there Feb 27 00:50
wispygalaxy my sister loves photography, and she uses picassa mostly Feb 27 00:50
schestowitz Get some hipster to bless it… Feb 27 00:50
Balrog The school has legal photoshop and so do the pros. Feb 27 00:50
PetoKraus wispygalaxy: i love photography, yet 3/4 of my pictures are unedited Feb 27 00:51
schestowitz PetoKraus: they get it for free Feb 27 00:51
PetoKraus the 1/4 is done with qtpfsgui HDR software Feb 27 00:51
PetoKraus yeah Feb 27 00:51
PetoKraus :/ Feb 27 00:51
wispygalaxy roy, im having a test on buzz advertising (advertising) this monday lol Feb 27 00:51
schestowitz Then when they go to work they order Photoshop like they order “Coke” please Feb 27 00:51
Balrog it’s more for digital effects than editing Feb 27 00:51
schestowitz But business must pay for it Feb 27 00:51
PetoKraus 699 for retail Feb 27 00:51
schestowitz Adobe uses the same tactics as MS Feb 27 00:51
PetoKraus $ Feb 27 00:51
wispygalaxy my sister has to edit EVERY photo Feb 27 00:51
schestowitz The Inquirer wrote about it in 2007 Feb 27 00:51
Balrog most businesses buy creative suite Feb 27 00:51
wispygalaxy she puts them through so many effects Feb 27 00:52
Balrog and yes it’s overpriced Feb 27 00:52
schestowitz They put their wares at schools to get kids addicted Feb 27 00:52
Balrog I was doing stuff like masks and other stuff Feb 27 00:52
schestowitz If they could put caffeine or coke in Photoshop, rest assured they would. Feb 27 00:52
Balrog Adobe doesn’t know how to write good code. Feb 27 00:52
wispygalaxy cool glad to see you are into art Feb 27 00:52
Balrog It doesn’t even handle a case sensitive FS properly  :( Feb 27 00:53
wispygalaxy what software would you say is a gateway drug? Feb 27 00:53
PetoKraus yeah Feb 27 00:53
[H]omer IME Photoshop is bloated, vastly overrated, fluff Feb 27 00:53
PetoKraus this reminds me that i need to edit my failed suicide attempt AKA skiing in scotland 2009 Feb 27 00:53
wispygalaxy haha what happened lol Feb 27 00:53
PetoKraus i wanted to do a vista7 videoreview Feb 27 00:53
Balrog it’s bloated, it’s overrated, but not totally fluff. It has tools that do the job, and plugins that help Feb 27 00:53
PetoKraus but the thing was so crappy Feb 27 00:53
wispygalaxy i always wanted to go snowboarding lol Feb 27 00:54
schestowitz [H]omer: it has some better functions. If you work on it 30 hours a week, it’s worth the price Feb 27 00:54
Balrog Until gimp gets to the same point, it will always stay on top Feb 27 00:54
schestowitz Few people need that Feb 27 00:54
PetoKraus that one hour of footage was full of 3 minutes of funny lines Feb 27 00:54
PetoKraus all around the place Feb 27 00:54
wispygalaxy you have used 7, pk? Feb 27 00:54
PetoKraus “used” Feb 27 00:54
PetoKraus it was unusable Feb 27 00:54
wispygalaxy lol Feb 27 00:54
Balrog yes, I agree … more lik 15-20 hours a week, or do specialty stuff like digital effects that requires a variety of special software Feb 27 00:54
PetoKraus no sound, barely any graphics, no network out of the box Feb 27 00:54
wispygalaxy yuck Feb 27 00:54
PetoKraus even the scrollwheel had problems working Feb 27 00:54
[H]omer Need a plugin for the Gimp … just write one, after all it’s Free Software (unlike Photoshop) Feb 27 00:54
[H]omer How much is the SDK Feb 27 00:55
[H]omer ? Feb 27 00:55
[H]omer Can you even buy the SDK Feb 27 00:55
[H]omer ? Feb 27 00:55
[H]omer I suppose you must Feb 27 00:55
[H]omer SOmehow Feb 27 00:55
Balrog the Photoshop SDK? Feb 27 00:55
PetoKraus you just guess-code :D Feb 27 00:55
[H]omer Do you have to sign an NDA in blood too Feb 27 00:55
wispygalaxy the beta download is huge for windows 7 Feb 27 00:55
wispygalaxy 2 GB i think Feb 27 00:55
PetoKraus wispygalaxy: yeah Feb 27 00:55
PetoKraus more Feb 27 00:55
Balrog ?? Feb 27 00:55
wispygalaxy haha Feb 27 00:55
schestowitz wispygalaxy: it’s delayed Feb 27 00:55
Balrog or the vista7 sdk? Feb 27 00:56
wispygalaxy bigger than DSL huh Feb 27 00:56
schestowitz Vista7 is delayed until 2010 at the earliest Feb 27 00:56
wispygalaxy really, roy? Feb 27 00:56
schestowitz It’s too messy even for testers Feb 27 00:56
wispygalaxy they said sept 09 Feb 27 00:56
schestowitz wispygalaxy: CNN wrote this Feb 27 00:56
PetoKraus 2.5G Feb 27 00:56
wispygalaxy thats a biggie Feb 27 00:56
schestowitz So they must have delayed it just like Office 14 (which is obsolete because of ODF and the Web anyway) Feb 27 00:56
wispygalaxy cool, thx for info roy Feb 27 00:56
PetoKraus hmm Feb 27 00:56
schestowitz wispygalaxy: they also said Vista would be out in October 2003 Feb 27 00:56
PetoKraus that’s a new one Feb 27 00:56
PetoKraus i thought, and hoped, they’re gonna rush it out Feb 27 00:57
wispygalaxy my teacher refuses to get office 07, he was so adamant Feb 27 00:57
schestowitz And have WinFS and all kinds of other stuff that even in 2010 we’re not seeing. Feb 27 00:57
schestowitz 9 years later Feb 27 00:57
schestowitz No WinFS Feb 27 00:57
schestowitz They even spoke about it in the 90s, I think Feb 27 00:57
wispygalaxy fail lol Feb 27 00:57
PetoKraus well Feb 27 00:57
wispygalaxy yes and make a fool of themselves lol pk Feb 27 00:57
PetoKraus i’m not gonna say anything about the state of Linux filesystems Feb 27 00:57
PetoKraus or at least Feb 27 00:57
PetoKraus the marketing Feb 27 00:57
PetoKraus Feb 27 00:57
*PetoKraus np: Genesis – Firth Of Fifth (Selling England By The Pound) Feb 27 00:57
PetoKraus i like puns. Genesis did as well. Feb 27 00:58
wispygalaxy the 90s will never come back for ms Feb 27 00:58
[H]omer Microsoft made an announcement today, that in 2010 they will make an announcement that they will make an announcement in 2011 declaring their intention to make an announcement in 2012, announcing the release of Vista7 in 2013. Feb 27 00:58
[H]omer Maybe Feb 27 00:58
schestowitz Heh. Feb 27 00:58
schestowitz Like Loooooooooooooonghorn Feb 27 00:58
[H]omer [joking] Feb 27 00:58
Balrog yeah where is all this? OS X has a filesystem with an index (of names, has been like this since the 80s) … they can’t do anything as good as Apple, and even Linux for that matter Feb 27 00:58
wispygalaxy i tend to make puns lol Feb 27 00:58
schestowitz Taking a lllllllllllllllllllllllllllong time. Feb 27 00:58
wispygalaxy lol homer Feb 27 00:58
PetoKraus schestowitz: let the dead bury the dead Feb 27 00:58
schestowitz It out “real soon now” Feb 27 00:58
PetoKraus anyway Feb 27 00:58
PetoKraus who uses ext4? :/ Feb 27 00:59
schestowitz Gates: “Any day now! Just don’t try anything else” Feb 27 00:59
schestowitz “Vista will have WinFS… will make your coffee” Feb 27 00:59
Balrog MS is always behind the competition Feb 27 00:59
wispygalaxy ms was inspired by apple’s fs? interesting Feb 27 00:59
PetoKraus i’m wondering what’ll happen when btrfs and tux3 are “finished” Feb 27 00:59
[H]omer PetoKraus, I will be using ext4 from Sunday onwards, on Fedora 11 alpha Feb 27 00:59
PetoKraus some real-world numbers, how well does it compare with other filesystems, and whether they’re reliable Feb 27 00:59
wispygalaxy coffee makes me a wee bit jumpy, i like tea better Feb 27 01:00
PetoKraus [H]omer: to be honest, i don’t find it worthy upgrade Feb 27 01:00
[H]omer ext4 consistently beats other filesystems in benchmarks Feb 27 01:00
Balrog Apple’s FS always had metadata…type codes, creator codes, labels, finder flags, and an index of filenames for rapid searching Feb 27 01:00
schestowitz tux3 is not for regular desktops Feb 27 01:00
PetoKraus i know Feb 27 01:00
PetoKraus [H]omer: well… reiser2 beats them as well Feb 27 01:00
PetoKraus :D Feb 27 01:00
schestowitz btrfs is for oracle mostly. Feb 27 01:00
wispygalaxy i like how they used tux’s name Feb 27 01:01
schestowitz maybe servers and desktops too, in due time. Feb 27 01:01
Balrog Permissions and UNIX stuff was shoehorned in … that’s what Linus was presumably complaining about Feb 27 01:01
PetoKraus btrfs is supposed to be THE filesystem Feb 27 01:01
wispygalaxy haha pk Feb 27 01:01
[H]omer http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=arti… Feb 27 01:01
Balrog btrfs is 2 years down the road Feb 27 01:01
schestowitz PetoKraus: reiser doesn’t just beat them.. it kill em Feb 27 01:01
PetoKraus :) Feb 27 01:01
Balrog reiser kills your data Feb 27 01:01
Balrog I’ve seen it Feb 27 01:01
Balrog :P Feb 27 01:01
[H]omer Roy, that’s sick :) Feb 27 01:01
wispygalaxy can you uncover it? Feb 27 01:01
schestowitz rm -rf /home/nina Feb 27 01:02
PetoKraus well Feb 27 01:02
wispygalaxy and find it again Feb 27 01:02
PetoKraus everything i tried killed my data Feb 27 01:02
PetoKraus ext3, ext2, reiserfs Feb 27 01:02
[H]omer Does Hans Reiser make “killa appz”? Feb 27 01:02
Balrog ext3 seems to work well Feb 27 01:02
PetoKraus the only thing which i found reliable was JFS Feb 27 01:02
schestowitz No, Apples does ! Feb 27 01:02
Balrog I use ext3 and HFS+ and occasionally XFS Feb 27 01:02
schestowitz It has Dashboard Feb 27 01:02
Balrog heh dashboard Feb 27 01:03
Balrog I never use it Feb 27 01:03
schestowitz You click stuff Feb 27 01:03
schestowitz And it launches it Feb 27 01:03
schestowitz But…. it focuses on stuff Feb 27 01:03
schestowitz Genius mighty Jobs has a patent on it Feb 27 01:03
schestowitz He ‘invented’ it Feb 27 01:03
Balrog on Dashboard? I don’t think so Feb 27 01:03
wispygalaxy i still dont like the 1 click mouse idea Feb 27 01:03
schestowitz It cam as an epiphany from God when he was at the hospital Feb 27 01:03
*Balrog thinks about Konfabulator Feb 27 01:04
wispygalaxy lol Feb 27 01:04
schestowitz The geniusness dawned upon him Feb 27 01:04
Balrog wispygalaxy: 1-click mouse? Feb 27 01:04
wispygalaxy you cant click right Feb 27 01:04
PetoKraus i like how phoronix completely missed out JFS Feb 27 01:04
schestowitz yes Feb 27 01:04
PetoKraus off that benchmark Feb 27 01:04
PetoKraus oh well Feb 27 01:04
schestowitz off many of them Feb 27 01:04
Balrog wispygalaxy: do you have those scroll-ball mice? Feb 27 01:05
PetoKraus i don’t get it. It’s really underrated filesystem Feb 27 01:05
schestowitz What you should do before, during & after an Ubuntu install < http://onthewatercloset.blogspot.com/2009… > Feb 27 01:05
wispygalaxy i have a fellowes mouse Feb 27 01:05
PetoKraus schestowitz: remove mono Feb 27 01:05
wispygalaxy i like the shape of the apple mouse Feb 27 01:05
PetoKraus :) Feb 27 01:05
schestowitz PetoKraus: yes Feb 27 01:05
Balrog ah. Well apple’s current mice have 4 buttons Feb 27 01:05
schestowitz Conspicuously missing Feb 27 01:05
Balrog right, left, scroll, and side Feb 27 01:05
schestowitz “Cool Windows toys” Feb 27 01:05
PetoKraus “Also if you are in Pakistan and experience frequent power failures – you dont need to worry.” Feb 27 01:05
schestowitz “almost like Windows” I think was the exact quote Feb 27 01:06
PetoKraus why the hell would you be in pakistan? Feb 27 01:06
wispygalaxy i have 5 buttons ;P Feb 27 01:06
PetoKraus all of them are in britain! Feb 27 01:06
Balrog yeah heh…at least it works. The touch pad on the laptops are more useful Feb 27 01:06
tessier_ They have electricity in Pakistan? Feb 27 01:06
PetoKraus maybe Feb 27 01:06
schestowitz Why not? Feb 27 01:06
wispygalaxy yes, the touchpads are nifty Feb 27 01:06
schestowitz They have nuclear operations Feb 27 01:06
wispygalaxy i forget my mouse at home sometimes, so it helps Feb 27 01:06
Balrog wispygalaxy: the touchpad? Feb 27 01:07
PetoKraus hmm Feb 27 01:07
Balrog I stopped using the mouse I have :P Feb 27 01:07
PetoKraus payday! Feb 27 01:07
*Balrog_ (n=Balrog@pool-71-255-101-57.phlapa.east.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovell Feb 27 01:07
schestowitz This is not Gnome < http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2009/02/25… > Feb 27 01:07
wispygalaxy yep, balrog Feb 27 01:07
Balrog that is me Feb 27 01:08
PetoKraus Balrog: i’m using the only good microsoft product Feb 27 01:08
PetoKraus laser mouse Feb 27 01:08
PetoKraus :) Feb 27 01:08
PetoKraus manufactured by logitech Feb 27 01:08
PetoKraus but hey! Feb 27 01:08
schestowitz Is it not just rebranded MS? Feb 27 01:08
schestowitz Realy? Feb 27 01:08
wispygalaxy i used to have a logitech mouse with a scroll whell Feb 27 01:08
wispygalaxy wheel* Feb 27 01:08
schestowitz They manufacture these? Feb 27 01:08
Balrog_ I quit using mice. I use the trackpad. (any large trackpad with a rather-high sensitivity works for me) Feb 27 01:08
PetoKraus i’m pretty confident they do Feb 27 01:08
schestowitz Microsoft was rumoured once to be interested in buying the company Feb 27 01:08
Balrog_ gestures make it more useful Feb 27 01:08
Balrog_ but aren’t mandatory Feb 27 01:08
PetoKraus i know they do for dell Feb 27 01:08
schestowitz Logitech fired many people recently.. maybe 20% of wordforce Feb 27 01:08
wispygalaxy mouse gestures startle me all the time, i always jiggle my mouse a lot Feb 27 01:09
PetoKraus yeah Feb 27 01:09
Balrog_ trackpad gestures Feb 27 01:09
wispygalaxy i should turn them off lol Feb 27 01:09
PetoKraus keyboard shortcuts FTW:) Feb 27 01:09
Balrog_ scroll, zoom Feb 27 01:09
wispygalaxy yes haha Feb 27 01:09
PetoKraus i mean Feb 27 01:09
Balrog_ btw, the eeepc has trackpad scroll Feb 27 01:09
PetoKraus i am gradually adding more and more shortcuts Feb 27 01:10
schestowitz “The only BECTA recommended operating system for schools is Microsoft Windows” http://thelinuxsociety.org.uk/content/h… Feb 27 01:10
wispygalaxy have you tried the eee pc, balrog? Feb 27 01:10
wispygalaxy its not small at all for me Feb 27 01:10
Balrog_ yes, I have used a 901 Feb 27 01:10
PetoKraus i started with enlightenment default ALT+Fx for desktop switch and ALT+Mouse click for dragging windows/resizing windows Feb 27 01:10
Balrog_ the keyboard sucks, but otherwise it’s great Feb 27 01:10
PetoKraus and now it’s plenty of other apps bound to Alt, Ctrl and Win key Feb 27 01:11
schestowitz Win key? Feb 27 01:11
wispygalaxy my keyboard is not the best, the keys are way too slippery Feb 27 01:11
schestowitz Superkey :-) Feb 27 01:11
wispygalaxy i make typos a lot :( Feb 27 01:11
Balrog_ why doesn’t the win key do anything on Windows? Feb 27 01:11
PetoKraus schestowitz: :) Feb 27 01:11
Balrog_ unlike the Command key, which does a lot on Macs Feb 27 01:11
PetoKraus Balrog_: cause it’s windows Feb 27 01:11
Balrog_ heh. Feb 27 01:11
PetoKraus anyway Feb 27 01:11
wispygalaxy i want a tux key Feb 27 01:11
PetoKraus i consider “Win+C” a nice acronym for window close Feb 27 01:11
Balrog_ you know why they dropped the ‘apple key’ designation? Feb 27 01:11
PetoKraus they didn’t wanted to look like fags? Feb 27 01:12
Balrog_ (the command key used to be the apple key) Feb 27 01:12
wispygalaxy my laptop has the vista key, i want it off of there lol Feb 27 01:12
*PetoKraus np: Genesis – The Battle Of Epping Forest (Selling England By The Pound) Feb 27 01:12
PetoKraus cause they disagree on the gangland boundary! Feb 27 01:12
wispygalaxy i bought my lappy before getting linux Feb 27 01:12
Balrog_ nope, Jobs felt that the Apple logo was already in too many places Feb 27 01:12
PetoKraus :) Feb 27 01:12
PetoKraus it is. Feb 27 01:12
wispygalaxy i was so naive back then Feb 27 01:12
Balrog_ http://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?story=… Feb 27 01:12
Balrog_ I believe that’s the one Feb 27 01:12
PetoKraus i’d like to plant a bit of C4 in every iphone logo Feb 27 01:13
PetoKraus and detonate them all at once Feb 27 01:13
PetoKraus that’d be nice Feb 27 01:13
Balrog_ heh. iphone isn’t bad Feb 27 01:13
PetoKraus you know, not huge bit Feb 27 01:13
PetoKraus just enough to make you deaf for half an hour Feb 27 01:13
wispygalaxy one girl in my class got an iphone last night, she was bragging about it today Feb 27 01:13
PetoKraus that’d make the news Feb 27 01:13
PetoKraus bah Feb 27 01:13
Balrog_ I see it a lot Feb 27 01:13
Balrog_ you must be at a smaller school Feb 27 01:14
PetoKraus i am thinking of getting one of the older HTC modules Feb 27 01:14
PetoKraus *cellphones Feb 27 01:14
Balrog_ keep away from Windows Mobile Feb 27 01:14
wispygalaxy yes i wil Feb 27 01:14
PetoKraus they run linux pretty well Feb 27 01:14
wispygalaxy i want an android Feb 27 01:14
Balrog_ get an unlocked iphone or a dev android if you want to do anything interesting Feb 27 01:14
PetoKraus nah Feb 27 01:14
wispygalaxy what’s up with open moko? Feb 27 01:14
PetoKraus dev android is too expensive Feb 27 01:14
PetoKraus so is freerunner Feb 27 01:14
schestowitz The Losing Battle Against Technology Freedom < http://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?title=… >  “So now we have Microsoft’s thrown gauntlet against Linux, in the suit against Tom-Tom. As Slashdot commenters are quick to point out, the nature of the lawsuit, revolving around use of the FAT file-system, is anti-competitive on the part of Microsoft, the convicted monopolist Feb 27 01:15
schestowitz .” Feb 27 01:15
wispygalaxy balrog have you hacked a phone before? Feb 27 01:15
PetoKraus you can get older HTC for half the price Feb 27 01:15
Balrog_ I have both an iphone (2G) and ipod touch…both jailbroken … heh Feb 27 01:15
Balrog_ yeah hacked iphone 2G Feb 27 01:15
Balrog_ and touch Feb 27 01:15
PetoKraus and you get basically the same hardware Feb 27 01:15
Balrog_ ;) Feb 27 01:15
wispygalaxy cool! Feb 27 01:15
PetoKraus what I need from a “better phone” is: wifi, keyboard, phone, make it run linux Feb 27 01:15
wispygalaxy you know how to get things to the way you want them Feb 27 01:15
schestowitz wispygalaxy: iphone is a fashion statement/accessory too Feb 27 01:16
Balrog_ keyboard is messy Feb 27 01:16
Balrog_ a lot of parts Feb 27 01:16
schestowitz Apple brand is very powerful Feb 27 01:16
PetoKraus Balrog_: bah, it’s useful Feb 27 01:16
schestowitz People express themselves using gadgets Feb 27 01:16
Balrog_ schestowitz: well I don’t care for that part Feb 27 01:16
schestowitz Apple spend a fortune marketing this thing Feb 27 01:16
Balrog_ more about usefulness for me Feb 27 01:16
wispygalaxy keyboards are usually a miss, not hit for me Feb 27 01:16
PetoKraus well Feb 27 01:16
PetoKraus i don’t like touchscreens Feb 27 01:16
Balrog_ keyboards have too many moving parts Feb 27 01:16
schestowitz Also using unethical methods like paying celebs to fake queuing up for one. Feb 27 01:17
wispygalaxy yes roy, my sis wanted the ipod shuffle when it came out b/c her friends all had it Feb 27 01:17
PetoKraus http://i20.ebayimg.com/04/i/001/33… Feb 27 01:17
wispygalaxy reminds me of lindsay lohan and how she bragged about her phone Feb 27 01:17
PetoKraus this would be okay Feb 27 01:17
PetoKraus £80 on ebay Feb 27 01:17
Balrog_ heh. I haven’t seen / paid attention to those things lately. But not like the Mojave project and ‘I’m a PC’ (really unethical stuff in comparison) Feb 27 01:17
Balrog_ I got my iphone 2G for $120 Feb 27 01:17
PetoKraus though the wifi support is dodgy so far Feb 27 01:18
wispygalaxy we had to analyze those ads in my marketing class Feb 27 01:18
Balrog_ heh Feb 27 01:18
Balrog_ everyone advertises like that today :( Feb 27 01:18
wispygalaxy we overall said that the ads failed XD Feb 27 01:18
schestowitz Those who pay for advertising and prurious marketing are always the customer Feb 27 01:18
schestowitz *mers Feb 27 01:18
wispygalaxy cool pk Feb 27 01:18
schestowitz 20% or so of any product — on average — is spend on /US/ being brainwahed Feb 27 01:18
wispygalaxy im getting a new phone in a couple of monthys Feb 27 01:18
wispygalaxy months* Feb 27 01:18
schestowitz Shown images to impact our subconscious feelings, not technical details. Feb 27 01:19
schestowitz It’s a form of hypnosis that stu[ifies us Feb 27 01:19
PetoKraus well my current phone is:… Feb 27 01:19
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    Links for the day

  29. Sirius Finished

    Yesterday I was sent a letter approving my resignation from Sirius ‘Open Source’, two months after I had already announced that I was resigning with immediate effect; they sent an identical letter to my wife (this time, unlike before, they remembered to also change the names!!)

  30. The Collapse of Sirius in a Nutshell: How to Identify the Symptoms and Decide When to Leave

    Sirius is finished, but it's important to share the lessons learned with other people; there might be other "pretenders" out there and they need to be abandoned

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