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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: Wednesday, March 18, 2020

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schestowitzhttps://twitter.com/trolltrip/status/1239997889054748673Mar 18 03:03
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@trolltrip: @schestowitz Exactly. Yet why do you even argue they're killing school staff?Mar 18 03:03
schestowitzhttps://twitter.com/Atypicalissue/status/1240030240736337922Mar 18 03:03
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@Atypicalissue: @schestowitz That is murder. How can such people not have problems when they return to normal society whether they… https://t.co/kEgQg82pxVMar 18 03:03
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@Atypicalissue: @schestowitz That is murder. How can such people not have problems when they return to normal society whether they… https://t.co/kEgQg82pxVMar 18 03:03
schestowitz"That is murder. How can such people not have problems when they return to normal society whether they are charged with a war crime or not. Obviously they've gone insane."Mar 18 03:03
schestowitzhttps://twitter.com/er_st0/status/1240087226198798337Mar 18 03:04
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@er_st0: @trolltrip @schestowitz Because they can carry virus yet be asymptomatic for a long period, jester. Absolutely crim… https://t.co/uKsW3FVFr9Mar 18 03:04
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@er_st0: @trolltrip @schestowitz Because they can carry virus yet be asymptomatic for a long period, jester. Absolutely crim… https://t.co/uKsW3FVFr9Mar 18 03:04
schestowitz"Mar 18 03:04
schestowitzBecause they can carry virus yet be asymptomatic for a long period, jester.Mar 18 03:04
schestowitzAbsolutely criminal to not close schools like countries who actually care about citizens other than wealthy.Mar 18 03:04
schestowitz"Mar 18 03:04
roy-on-ted-boxhttp://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2020/03/breaking-epo-and-euipo-extend-all.html?showComment=1584361324890#c8693190228682803810Mar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxWorth noting that the notice is not yet in force. Seems likely that all deadlines falling within 15 March to 17 April *will be* extended. But not set in stone yet.Mar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:34
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-ipkitten.blogspot.com | BREAKING: EPO and EUIPO extend deadlines in response to COVID-19 pandemic - The IPKatMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxKantMonday, 16 March 2020 at 11:21:00 GMTMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxThe EPO provision only applies to particular areas as well.Mar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 11:31:00 GMTMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxI disagree with you there Kant. The EPO has said that post is disrupted in Germany, and hence post is disrupted for the EPO itself. Thus, deadlines will be extended for parties in all areas.Mar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 11:33:00 GMTMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxThe EPO notice is only effective as of its publication in the Official Journal. Unhelpfully, no indication is provided as to when it will be published. Can anyone enlighten us?Mar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxKant - the notice explicitly says that it applies to "all parties and their representatives". It does not say that it only applies to (e.g.) those in Germany or in particular areas thereof. The summary in the IPKat post appears accurate to me. However, it is not as clearly drafted as one might have hoped.Mar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxOJ nerdMonday, 16 March 2020 at 13:25:00 GMTMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxThe OJ is usually published on the last working day of the month, so should be published 31 March 2020.Mar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 11:46:00 GMTMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-box@Anonymous The dislocation provisions apply to periods expiring on or after the date of the publication of the notice. In view of the preamble of the advance notice on the EPO website, it is unclear if the advance notice is a "publication of the notice". For safest practice, the OJ publication of the notice can be taken as the "publication of the notice". As this has not yet occurred, it is questionable whether periods expiring betweenMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxMarch 15th and the publication of the notice in the OJ are, indeed, extended.Mar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:34
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 12:22:00 GMTMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-box@Anonymous 11:46Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxExactly - the notice is "dated" 15 March but it is unclear when it will be published and therefore also unclear what happens to dates falling between 15 March and its official date of publication. The precautionary approach is to assume that all dates run as normal until formal publication of the notice. The EPO should clarify, though.Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxMeldrewMonday, 16 March 2020 at 13:17:00 GMTMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxRule 134(2)EPC does not require publication, just the fact of a general dislocation in the delivery or transmission of mail in the State in which the European Patent Office is located [Germany].Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxAny periods due are extended until the first day following the end of the interval of dislocation.Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxIt is nice to see the notice acknowledges the start of the disruption [Rule 134(4)EPC], but it appears rather presumptuous (although useful) to name an end date in advance.Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 13:32:00 GMTMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxYes, but all we know is that the EPO currently intends to formally ack that the German dislocation started on 15 March. If they change their mind before formal publication, then you would have to provide evidence to prove it yourself... I don't fancy that myself.Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxAnon Y. MouseMonday, 16 March 2020 at 14:28:00 GMTMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxMeldrew - I disagree. The notice explicitly refers to "periods expiring on or after the date of the publication of this notice", and *not* to periods determined according to the start date of the dislocation, which is undefined. I don't see that Rule 134(2) unambiguously clarifies this matter.Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 14:50:00 GMTMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxThe EPO can in theory change their mind anytime up to publishing this in the actual OJ. This seems rather absurd to me, so in my opinion they should get and publish a special mini-edition of the OJ today!Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxAlokinTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 09:51:00 GMTMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxEither someone had the same concerns about the publication date or EPA personel reads the IPKat: The notice has now been updated to read "Periods expiring on or after the date of this Notice are thus extended"...Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxMike SnodinTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 12:11:00 GMTMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxYes, I had spotted this issue too. I agree with Meldrew that Rule 134(2) EPC would, in view of the acknowledgement of a general dislocation in Germany, kick into effect regardless. Nevertheless, out of an abundance of caution, I contacted the EPO to seek clarification. It seems that the amended Notice has answered my query.Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 12:02:00 GMTMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxNo - it always did - the problem is that that sentence itself, like the rest of the Notice, only becomes legal when it appears in the OJ. This is stated at the top in red, and says: "This text is intended for publication in the Official Journal (OJ) of the EPO. It is made available in advance on the EPO website merely as a courtesy to the public. Only the text subsequently published in the officially certified PDF file of the OJ is Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxauthentic. It cannot be guaranteed that this advance version accurately replicates that text."Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxBack to Earth pleaseTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 17:11:00 GMTMar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxEven if the EPO would change its point of view, what I doubt, legitimate expectations have been brought to life, and I do not see any problem.Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxIn some aspects the upper management of the EPO might behave strangely, but here it was not as such a political decision, but a decision which imposes itself.Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 04:35
roy-on-ted-boxhttp://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2020/03/breaking-eqe-and-pre-eqe-postponed.html?showComment=1584372407792#c1112117227617891767Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxFriday, 13 March 2020 at 14:55:00 GMTMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-box"In short, any employer firing people over this is not an employer you want to work for."Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxThat is perhaps true. But personally I would prefer to catch Coronavirus than be sacked, inasmuch that I reckon the detrimental effect on my physical health from Coronvirus would be far less than the detriment to my mental health resulting from being sacked, even by an employer that I 'don't want to work for'. Mar 18 04:37
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-ipkitten.blogspot.com | BREAKING: EQE and pre-EQE postponed until further notice - The IPKatMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxIt seems unlikely that the opposed positions of posters herein will become aligned. But my initial point was that the original poster's smug comment about posts "not ageing well" is not helpful. It doesn't reflect the poster being "the bigger man", it reflects he/she bearing no personal cost from the decision.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxGraver TankSunday, 15 March 2020 at 11:15:00 GMTMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxIt is possible a lot of people in the discussion are either not patent attorneys, or do not realise (or remember) what qualification means or work for a good firm/company - but being qualified (nationally and especially before the EPO) brings the freedom that you can work independently - anywhere, for anybody. Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxBut changing jobs before qualification is a nightmare - there is suspicion about your abilities and motivation. If you are partly-qualified, it is a little easier (I have done this), as you have some independent proof of what you can do.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxAnd someone has to pay for all the courses/books and time you spend studying.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxIf this carries on into May/June, it may mean that school exams are postponed or even cancelled - would these posters be fine if their kids stayed in school an extra year?Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 17:05:00 GMTMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxMe again. Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-box@SP - So the "personal cost" for me would be me or loved ones potentially dying of this disease in an overwhelmed hospital because of the rapid spread of the virus. Once again I think you haven't fully grasped the gravity of the present situation. I mean you no ill will, but please do a bit of reading on this subject. I assume you're a technically minded person so you should be able to get to grips with this.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-box@Graver Tank - I do understand how much qualification means, really I do. I also had to pay for my own training. No, I wouldn't be super keen if my kids had to stay in school an extra year, but we are talking about an event the likes of which the world hasn't seen in 100 years.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxThere is every chance that we will all need to be practicing social distancing and so on for most of the rest of this year. If we do not then thousands of vulnerable people will die before their time.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxSeriously, it's that bad.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousThursday, 12 March 2020 at 10:17:00 GMTMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxGiven the situation - I cannot see the exams will be rescheduled in June.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxcassandraThursday, 12 March 2020 at 21:53:00 GMTMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxNo way. Does anybody seriously believe they could? Hopefully in June the worst will be behind us.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxGraver TankSaturday, 14 March 2020 at 23:06:00 GMTMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxThe epi hinted that early 2021 is considered a possibilityMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousFriday, 13 March 2020 at 15:19:00 GMTMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxUniversities and schools are finding alternative ways of assessments. Why can't the EPO do the same.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousFriday, 13 March 2020 at 22:01:00 GMTMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxThere should be no automatic passes so pre-EQE candidates should not get automatic passes. Candidates sitting the main EQEs will not get passes and I don't see why it is fair that pre-EQE candidates get automatic passes. Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxThere should be some discretion applied by the EPO but everyone will need to sit the exams once the corona virus goes away (hopefully soon).Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 15:26:00 GMTMar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxThe pre-EQE is not a qualifying exam, whereas the main EQEs are. Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxClearly no automatic passes will ever be given for main EQEs, as that would result in unsafe professional representation. However, waiving the pre-EQE will not ultimately affect the path the qualification in any way, as pre-EQE candidates will still have to pass the main EQEs.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxIt has no negative affect whatsoever on the main EQE candidates, or the profession as a whole, to skip the pre-EQE for one year. It would be fair because current pre-EQE candidates would not be a more advantageous position to pass the main exams. Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxOf course there may be some bitterness from EQE candidates who were not exempt from the pre-EQE, and understandably so.. but that's different to it actually being unfair.Mar 18 04:37
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 19:01:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxI would strongly disagree with this. If there are no passes for EQEs then there should be no passes for pre-EQEs. Why not let candidates who are doing foundations this June to skip this and do the PEB exams this year. Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxIt must be fair for all candidates so exams.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxGraver TankTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 12:55:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxThe reason for the Pre-Exam was to prevent candidates attempting the Main Exam who were not prepared enough. If it is waived, this will probably happen again, burdening the markers with very poor efforts. I know a lot of people study very hard, but there are also a huge number who do not. If Pre-exam were to be skipped for one year, 2021 is likely to see a large number of poor attempts as many candidates hope for leniency there as wellMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxWaiving would only be possible if the Pre-exam was abolished completely for all current & future candidates, with the necessary changes in the marking procedures. That might be a better discussion :-)Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 15:05:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxI don't believe that that is comparing like-for-like. The Main EQEs are a substantive qualifying exam, whereas the pre-EQE is just a barrier to take a further exam. Nobody would be given a free 'pass' in any case; they would simply be allowed to skip the barrier to take the qualifying exam.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxThe UK foundations do give candidates a part-level qualification, so again that is not comparing like-for-like. I agree, it would be unconscionable to give away a level of qualification for free, but that isn't the case with the pre-EQE.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxTotally agree that a valid argument against waiving it is 'burdening the markers with very poor efforts'. However last year only 107 of the 920 people who took the pre-EQE failed, so I wouldn't say that would represent an unmanageable burden..Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxHaving said all that, it would obviously be best if the pre-EQE were reorganised, I just don't think it would be at all unreasonable if it weren'tMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxGraver TankTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 17:48:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxThe burden on the markers is due to the unprepared people taking the Main Exam papers - there are people who get less than 25 marks, and these have to be marked by two people independently. And by a third if the marks deviate too much. At this level on the C & D papers, these candidates had no chance of passing.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxPete PollardSaturday, 14 March 2020 at 12:12:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxhttps://patentepi.org/en/epi/news/a4e7106e-0f2c-4d35-af84-6b00f6f89f5cMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-box".... many governments have taken measures to prevent spreading of the COVID19 disease, amongst them prohibition of public events with a certain size up to putting certain regions under total quarantine with an absolute travel ban.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxAdditionally, many companies and employers have also put in place travel restrictions for their employees. It is not possible to carry out a complex pan-European EQE under those circumstances without putting at risk participants and organizers.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxWe all do not know, how the situation will develop within the next months. We support and encourage therefore the Supervisory Board, the EPO EQE secretariat and all other bodies involved to explore all necessary measures to carry out an EQE for the candidates who planned to sit in March 2020 as soon as the situation will allow, either still within 2020 or only in 2021."Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:38
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-patentepi.org | epiMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxGraver TankSaturday, 14 March 2020 at 23:15:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxNot a very strong response. Maybe one day, the epi will take some initiative and set out their vision and plan for the EQE going forward.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 14:05:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxI think it would be wise for CIPA/PEB to postpone the PEB exams this October. We are entering a long period of lock down and many of us will have to start looking out for each other and our older relatives. From the predictions, it is likely that most of us will get the virus. Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxI do not think it is a good idea to proceed with the exams in October. It is clear that this is going to go on for 4-6 months. Many candidates' spring and summer months will be massively affected. It is much better to call this off early rather than risking many candidates going through revision and finding out that they can't do the exams.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxI suggest PEB exams in October to be cancelled.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 14:28:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxAs regrettable as it is, it is the right thing for CIPA/PEB to cancel the exams as it is now clear that this is going to be a long period of time i.e. many months ahead. I totally understand the economic impact it has on candidates but firms and businesses will be hit hard in the next few months. Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxCalling it off early will at least allow candidates not to waste their time revising. I do not see this epidemic slowing down in the next few months.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 14:32:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxAs government policy is to ask over 70s to self-isolate for 16-20 weeks, this would mean that many in our profession will have to go and look after their loved ones. It would put a huge burden on those candidates to also prepare for the PEB exams. Its disappointing but I agree that PEB exams in October should be postponed. Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxWe also do not know when EQEs will be rescheduled but it looks like it will be next year.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 14:25:00 GMTMar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxI would have to agree with this. I think CIPA/PEB should act within the next few weeks. Unfortunately, we need to think about the many months before the exams take place and its not credible/sensible to be allowing candidates to prepare for these exams in this moment. CIPA/PEB has a duty to contribute to the national effort. Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxIt is disappointing but the right thing to do.Mar 18 04:38
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 14:38:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxSome national countries like Italy have postponed their national exams. PEB really needs to consider this. My personal view is that they should cancel October's exams. Its a question of when they should announce this rather than if.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 08:01:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxI'm sorry but where did you read about Italy postponing the national exams?? I'm enrolled for those and I haven't received any such communication.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxI'm not saying it cannot happen, but they haven't made any announcement in this regard as far as I know.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 14:43:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAs a potential candidate, I would appreciate a decision within the next few weeks rather than later nearer to October if PEB/CIPA would cancel these exams. We would all understand the decision if they call it off but don't leave it late. As many have said, it is better for us if we don't have to go through the pain of revising and then find that we can't do the exams. Due to the current situation, it would not be unreasonable to call Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxit off.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxGilman GrundyTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 08:57:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxJuly is plenty of time to make such an announcement.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 18:04:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxThere has been new updates from UK government. I think CIPA/PEB would have no choice but to cancel October's exams. Its a shame but it doesn't seem right in these exceptional times. PEB/CIPA should call this off as early as possible.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 18:08:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxThe peak is calculated to be around June. 16-20 weeks of isolation is a long time. Its a horrible situation but PEB exams need to be cancelled. It would significantly ease worries of candidates if they announce it soon. Everybody will understand.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 18:55:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxYep - I would agree with the above thoughts although disappointing as it is, the best thing is to cancel PEB exams now and notify everyone in advance. Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxI would be surprise if CIPA/PEB haven't been discussing this already.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 18:59:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxDoes anyone know CIPA/PEB are actively reviewing this thread. Could someone pass this onto CIPA. Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxThere are now genuine concerns about the spread of this virus and I don't think we should press ahead with examinations this year (also taking into the many months of preparation before October).Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 20:57:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxmaybe IPKAT can help with this.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousMonday, 16 March 2020 at 20:55:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxThus could last till August/September. No way PEB exams can go ahead this year.Mar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxGilman GrundyTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 08:56:00 GMTMar 18 04:39
roy-on-ted-boxThe exams are due in October, July is quite enough time to announce their delay/cancellation.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxThere may not actually be any "end" to this crisis. There is the next ~6 months when the health service needs to build up capacity to deal with it, and giving the health services time to do it is the reason for all the measures that have been announced. What happens when they do have enough capacity?Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 11:31:00 GMTMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxThey should probably make a decision before registration is opened. My view is that it should be called off this year.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 11:37:00 GMTMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxEnd of June/early July should be the right time although personally, I don't see why they need to wait till July to cancel.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxIts clear that this is going to hit us through the whole of summer/early autumn and possibly until next year.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxReplyMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxRepliesMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxGraver TankTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 13:22:00 GMTMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxThis will end eventually and we have to get back to normal - it seems early to cancel activities for October. Besides, actually taking exams should be manageable. For some school state exams, they are talking about having desks spaced further apart, fewer people per room etc. It may mean that you have to be flexible in your preparation and use whatever time you have available to study.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 14:20:00 GMTMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxI think we need to have wider considerations as exams are not just on the day but has many months of preparation. Some will catch it, others will have more caring responsibilities during this crisis and unfortunately some will lose their loves one. Preparation will be disrupted so I think its not bad to cancel PEB exams during these testing times.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 14:22:00 GMTMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxMy workplace is also closing down - we are expected to work from home so training will be affected in some way. Work is gearing up to cope with potentially half of their work force. Trainees are now expected to fulfil other roles and not to concentrate on training. These things need to be considered so I think it is only appropriate to cancel PEB exams this year. Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxBy the End of June - if situation is not improving, it should be cancelled.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 16:52:00 GMTMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxYeah this isn't going away by June. Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxI'm not even sure it would be sensible to hold an in-person EQE in March 2021. Solutions for doing the exams remotely need to be found.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxGraver TankTuesday, 17 March 2020 at 17:57:00 GMTMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxSome people will have their preparation disrupted, and others will now have extra time to study (you are now being forced to make the social sacrifices that you would normally have to make when you study). Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxObviously if someone around you gets sick, or you get sick, then it is completely different. But I don't understand why you cannot start your preparation now? - surely, many of the things you learn will also be useful in your job. You can take it easy closer to the exam.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxWell, yeah, but most years there's a functioning vaccine for the seasonal flu that is given to vulnerable groups.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxSeriously folks: this is far, far worse than your usual cold. Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxAnd, actually, isn't it better that the exam is cancelled so trainees aren't forced to take unnecessary risks for the sake of their future careers (see also Anon @ 2020-03-12 16:21:00)? Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxAnd, what if you do live with someone vulnerable? What about then? Sorry we fired you because you wouldn't go to do the EQE to protect your elderly grandfather who lives with you because that's the nature of your family set up? I'd suggest that employment tribunals across the EU would look upon that very unfavourably. Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxIn short, any employer firing people over this is not an employer you want to work for.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxI know it's rough. Trust me, I know. But there is more to life than exams, promotions, salaries, and patents.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxAnonymousFriday, 13 March 2020 at 13:23:00 GMTMar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-box"I know it's rough. Trust me, I know. But there is more to life than exams, promotions, salaries, and patents"Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxThe finals were cancelled for me, and the main thing I am annoyed about is the amount of time with family and friends I sacrificed to revise, for which a big chunk of that time will be wasted. It's the impact on my personal life in having to keep up to date on D just in case the exams are rescheduled, and then spending 6 weeks intensely revising when they announce when the exams will be. Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxThe point I'm trying to make is that the cancellation has meant that 'exams, promotions, salaries, and patents' are taking up even more of my life when I want to focus on other things. We all expected to be rid of the exams by the end of next week, now we don't know when that will be.Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxThat risk of infecting someone else exists every year at this time of year - everyone is now acutely aware of it. This year, for one disease, you are likely to find out that you have been involved in the transmission - that normally never happens. Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxUnless you live with someone vulnerable, it is perfectly fine to continue with activities that you think are important and should go ahead. This will end at some point, and life will have to go back to normal. Mar 18 04:40
roy-on-ted-boxIf you follow the WHO advice and abide by the official travel advice, what is wrong with that? In some countries, they are still having football matches and there are still a lot of people travelling. The WHO advises to use countries to use resources wisely where they will have the biggest impact. Follow the situation daily, and when necessary, take drastic measures, like self-isolation. That is individual responsibility. Mar 18 04:41
roy-on-ted-boxIt is just as likely to catch it (you may even have already had it) from someone in your neighbourhood as someone in Munich. Mar 18 04:41
roy-on-ted-boxAnd if you believe that it is better for everybody that you stay home yourself, you can cancel your own activities/exams voluntarily. But please don't demand that everybody else does the same. A lot of firms give you a short-term contract, and if you don't qualify, you can look for another job. Trainees are often in competition with other trainees, and only so many can stay.Mar 18 04:41
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 04:41
schestowitz>>>> Watch what happened days ago:Mar 18 05:05
schestowitz>>>>Mar 18 05:05
schestowitz>>>> http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/135233Mar 18 05:05
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.tuxmachines.org | Moodle Based Business (LMS) Sold | Tux MachinesMar 18 05:05
schestowitz>>> Wasn't that a competitor to Moodle itself?  I can't remember the detailsMar 18 05:05
schestowitz>>> of that story.Mar 18 05:05
schestowitz>> Maybe that it an angle I am not even aware of.Mar 18 05:05
schestowitz>> http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/BlackboardMar 18 05:05
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | Blackboard - TechrightsMar 18 05:05
schestowitz> I'm not finding it in the top ten but it's a cutthroat market this lastMar 18 05:05
schestowitz> decade or so:Mar 18 05:05
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:05
schestowitz> https://www.owler.com/company/moodleMar 18 05:05
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell- ( status 403 @ https://www.owler.com/company/moodle )Mar 18 05:05
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:05
schestowitz> Blackboard definitely is.  As to where Learning Technologies Group PLCMar 18 05:05
schestowitz> fits in, I don't know.Mar 18 05:05
schestowitzI hardly hear about Sakai anymore:Mar 18 05:05
schestowitzhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakai_(software)Mar 18 05:05
schestowitzAlso see http://techrights.org/2020/03/05/lf-incompatible-with-linux/Mar 18 05:05
schestowitzFrom LF to proprietary VLEMar 18 05:05
schestowitzAlso: http://techrights.org/2020/01/01/latitude-learning-openwash/Mar 18 05:05
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-en.wikipedia.org | Sakai (software) - WikipediaMar 18 05:05
schestowitzShould we do an article about itMar 18 05:05
schestowitzI installed Moodle several times, but this is outside my ballpark as I never used anything else.Mar 18 05:05
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | Chief Marketing Officer of Linux Foundation Left Earlier This Year to Become Chief Communications Officer for Proprietary Software Vanguard That Exposes Kids’ Data to Crackers | TechrightsMar 18 05:05
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | Great Example of Openwashing: Latitude Learning (to Fake Its ‘Openness’) | TechrightsMar 18 05:05
schestowitzRoy Schestowitz wrote on 17/03/2020 06:10:Mar 18 05:08
schestowitz> s@schestowitz.com via RT wrote on 15/03/2020 02:37:Mar 18 05:08
schestowitz>> John Sullivan via RT wrote on 14/03/2020 01:05:Mar 18 05:08
schestowitz>>> Roy, Mar 18 05:08
schestowitz>>>Mar 18 05:08
schestowitz>>> Could you provide a few samples of the kinds of messages you've received (with headers) so we can get to the bottom of this? I'm sorry to ask you to spend any time on that, but it'll help a lot.Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>> -johnMar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> Hi John,Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> The spam mails have stopped.Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> Thanks a lot for that, muchly appreciated!Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> I assume something was done at your end.Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> I would like to ask, can you investigate further how many e-mailMar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> addresses were targeted and why TWO of mine, inc. private one?Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> Given various recent events, it's rather clear that some people tryMar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> driving a wedge and  strive harm Free software groups. There's ampleMar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> evidence of it.Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> Who would have the persistence to get 20,000 spam mails sent to myMar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> account from FSF servers?Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> BTW, I like your choices of award winners (announced hours ago)Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz>> Keep up the good work,Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz> Hi, have you made any progress investigating this? I know this was aMar 18 05:09
schestowitz> busy week. What was the underlying cause, how many people were affected,Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz> and what is known about the perpetrator? I still receive about 4Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz> fraudulent attempts per day, so this isn't a closed case.Mar 18 05:09
schestowitzAny updates? I still get messages every day, it's only the volume that decreased and we ought to get to the bottom of this.  Mar 18 05:09
schestowitz> Hi,Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz> Is the chair ready to pick up?Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz>> To confirm we have received payment for 1 x Libby Chair in Seat PadMar 18 05:15
schestowitz>> Citadel Manor FL823.Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz>>  Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz>> Collection can be next week – I will email when ready.Mar 18 05:15
schestowitzHi,Mar 18 05:15
schestowitzIt has now been more than a month.Mar 18 05:15
schestowitzYou said you'd contact me Monday. That was 9 days ago. You did not contact me.Mar 18 05:15
schestowitzWhat is going on?Mar 18 05:15
schestowitzPlease explain and rectify.Mar 18 05:15
schestowitzRegards,Mar 18 05:15
schestowitz> Hi, Roy,Mar 18 05:24
schestowitz> I have translated into Spanish the Cancel Culture and Handbook post forMar 18 05:24
schestowitz> maslinux.esMar 18 05:24
schestowitz> I hope you don't mind.Mar 18 05:24
schestowitz> I respected the author, obviously.Mar 18 05:24
schestowitz> Hugs (but not much..)Mar 18 05:24
schestowitzWould it be OK if we reprinted this translation in techrights as well?Mar 18 05:24
schestowitz>       Mar 18 05:29
schestowitz>> IMO, RMS resigned to protect FSF’s reputation and articles like this don’t helpMar 18 05:29
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:29
schestowitz> self-serving pap. rms resigned over a false narrative, to protect the fsf from exactly the sort of bullshit that fossfarce perpetrated to make a buck. and who does fossfarce help?Mar 18 05:29
schestowitz>>>>>> Watch what happened days ago:Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>>>>>Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>>>>> http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/135233Mar 18 05:38
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.tuxmachines.org | Moodle Based Business (LMS) Sold | Tux MachinesMar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>>>> Wasn't that a competitor to Moodle itself?  I can't remember the detailsMar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>>>> of that story.Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>>> Maybe that it an angle I am not even aware of.Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>>> http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/BlackboardMar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>> I'm not finding it in the top ten but it's a cutthroat market this lastMar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>> decade or so:Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>>Mar 18 05:38
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | Blackboard - TechrightsMar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>> https://www.owler.com/company/moodleMar 18 05:38
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell- ( status 403 @ https://www.owler.com/company/moodle )Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>>Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>> Blackboard definitely is.  As to where Learning Technologies Group PLCMar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>> fits in, I don't know.Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>> I hardly hear about Sakai anymore:Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakai_(software)Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz> As far as I can tell, looking in from the outside, there seems to haveMar 18 05:38
schestowitz> been a universal abandonment of all consortia based activities atMar 18 05:38
schestowitz> universities.  They have jumped into proprietary, outsourced productsMar 18 05:38
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-en.wikipedia.org | Sakai (software) - WikipediaMar 18 05:38
schestowitz> and services like Google Docs and Google Classroom.Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz> :(Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz> The abandonment has been planned in some cases, but I suspect that inMar 18 05:38
schestowitz> most cases it has just been neglect as fools rush to hand money,Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz> control, and access over to hostile third parties rather than buildingMar 18 05:38
schestowitz> and keeping competency in-house.Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>> Also see http://techrights.org/2020/03/05/lf-incompatible-with-linux/Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>> From LF to proprietary VLEMar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>> Also: http://techrights.org/2020/01/01/latitude-learning-openwash/Mar 18 05:38
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | Chief Marketing Officer of Linux Foundation Left Earlier This Year to Become Chief Communications Officer for Proprietary Software Vanguard That Exposes Kids’ Data to Crackers | TechrightsMar 18 05:38
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:38
schestowitz>> Should we do an article about itMar 18 05:38
schestowitz> It'd be worth collecting info about it but it will be a few days beforeMar 18 05:39
schestowitz> I hear anything myself.Mar 18 05:39
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:39
schestowitz>> I installed Moodle several times, but this is outside my ballpark as IMar 18 05:39
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | Great Example of Openwashing: Latitude Learning (to Fake Its ‘Openness’) | TechrightsMar 18 05:39
schestowitz>> never used anything else.Mar 18 05:39
schestowitz> Moodle really shines when you compare it to the other products outMar 18 05:39
schestowitz> there.  Some are really quite bad, such that Moodle's rough spots lookMar 18 05:39
schestowitz> absolutely grand in comparison.Mar 18 05:39
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:39
schestowitz> By the way, in today's batch there will be:Mar 18 05:39
schestowitz> Mar 18 05:39
schestowitz> https://www.thenation.com/article/society/bill-gates-foundation-philanthropy/Mar 18 05:39
schestowitzI hope much bigger scandals than this led to his escape from Microsoft. Time will tellMar 18 05:39
schestowitzSeattle is a mess right now, so I doubt the record will be sent.Mar 18 05:39
schestowitzhttp://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/Gates_Foundation_Critique#2020Mar 18 05:39
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.thenation.com | Bill Gates Gives to the Rich (Including Himself) | The NationMar 18 05:39
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | Gates Foundation Critique - TechrightsMar 18 05:39
schestowitz>>>> I will try to write a lot today. Mar 18 05:39
schestowitz>>> Excellent.  The topics and detail are very important as too few or, inMar 18 05:40
schestowitz>>> some cases, no others cover the topics.Mar 18 05:40
schestowitz>>>Mar 18 05:40
schestowitz>>>> Covid curiousity takes up a lot of time.Mar 18 05:40
schestowitz>>> SARS-CoV-2 is a big disturbance and a lot of problematic actions willMar 18 05:40
schestowitz>>> take place using it as cover and distraction.  Some stuff won't show upMar 18 05:40
schestowitz>>> at all, others stuff will just be blip and then forgotten immediately.Mar 18 05:40
schestowitz>> Like the npm and bill gates news.Mar 18 05:40
schestowitz>>Mar 18 05:40
schestowitz>> No analysis of it (proper) I was able to find...Mar 18 05:40
schestowitz> None that I see, yet.  That's even after NPN was just subsumed by M$Mar 18 05:40
schestowitz> GitHub.  :(Mar 18 05:40
schestowitzI'm not even sure what to say yet.Mar 18 05:40
schestowitzI will read into it this weekend.Mar 18 05:40
roy-on-ted-boxhttps://joindiaspora.com/posts/15236720#aa99487075f301377d857a163eb51328Mar 18 05:46
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Imagine how @fsf would feel had #facebook called its fake 'money' "libre"....Mar 18 05:46
roy-on-ted-box"our communities would then have to launch librelibre ;-)"Mar 18 05:46
roy-on-ted-boxhttps://joindiaspora.com/posts/17444492#b4e5d6d0489e0138ee2a2a0000053625Mar 18 05:47
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: #LetsEncrypt , Jim Meyering, and Clarissa Lima Borges receive FSF's 2019 Free Software Awards http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/135199 #gnu #fsf #freesw Mar 18 05:47
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell--> www.tuxmachines.org | Let's Encrypt, Jim Meyering, and Clarissa Lima Borges receive FSF's 2019 Free Software Awards | Tux MachinesMar 18 05:47
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 05:47
roy-on-ted-boxrofl.Mar 18 05:47
roy-on-ted-boxwhat a relief. i was afraid they were going to give it to rms. YES id nominate him, though only if i was sure he wouldnt receive it. condolances to meyering and borges, theyre probably going to go work for apple or google now.Mar 18 05:47
roy-on-ted-box"Mar 18 05:47
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schestowitz__                <li>Mar 18 10:35
schestowitz__                  <h5><a href="https://www.networkworld.com/article/3532815/viewing-and-configuring-password-aging-on-linux.html">Viewing and configuring password aging on Linux</a></h5>Mar 18 10:35
-TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell- ( status 404 @ https://www.networkworld.com/article/3532815/viewing-and-configuring-password-aging-on-linux.html">Viewing )Mar 18 10:35
schestowitz__                  <blockquote>Mar 18 10:35
schestowitz__                    <p>User passwords on Linux systems can be configured to be permanent or can be set to expire so that individuals must reset them periodically. Periodic password changing is generally considered good practice for security reasons, but is not configured by default. </p>Mar 18 10:35
schestowitz__                    <p> To view and modify password-aging settings, you need to be familiar with a couple important commands – the chage command along with its -l option and the passwd command with its -S. These commands, along with a few other chage commands that are used to configure password aging are described in this post. </p></blockquote></li>Mar 18 10:35
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