●● IRC: #boycottnovell @ Techrights IRC Network: Wednesday, September 22, 2021 ●● ● Sep 22 [00:13] *rianne_ (~rianne@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [00:13] *liberty_box (~liberty@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Sep 22 [01:41] *DaemonFC has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) ● Sep 22 [02:10] *DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@pa8wwdszaf3gy.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Sep 22 [05:03] *DaemonFC has quit (Quit: Leaving) ● Sep 22 [08:11] Techrights-sec at about 29 minutes, RMS begins to discuss sw patents [08:11] Techrights-sec at about 56 minutes he gets to the Q&A [08:11] Techrights-sec overall I think it's an improvement that the background information is [08:11] Techrights-sec covered by the 14-minute TED video. Most people are already at least partially [08:11] Techrights-sec familiar with it. [08:11] schestowitz there was a bit of a powwow about it in irc [08:31] Techrights-sec It's equinox already, today. [08:32] schestowitz-TR oh, yeah, I could sense today was a special day but did not recall why ● Sep 22 [10:04] Techrights-sec AFAIK the vaccines reduce the symptoms in the vaccinated but do not prevent [10:04] Techrights-sec them from spreadingit onwards, that is not the most ideal situation [10:05] schestowitz-TR it is tempting to say, that's what happens when you do things in a great hurry [10:09] schestowitz-TR btw, the full RMS talk was requested 3.2k times in the past 20 hours, well worth the effort! extra audience for the angry dude. [10:14] Techrights-sec Excellent. Once he got going, the talk was rather good. He has a [10:14] Techrights-sec newer way of covering the old topics. The Q&A was the better part, though. [10:14] schestowitz-TR unless you are new to him, in which case all the talk is new information. I've scanned for "ukraine"; seems that for the whole lot it's 4.5k views. [10:17] schestowitz-TR to be clear though, I very rarely check traffic like this, but in this case b/w consumption was off the chart, so I got curious [10:21] schestowitz-TR we have attempted to contact meduza by numerous means; they don't reply [10:21] schestowitz-TR absolutely terrible time to be off the (RSS) grid with election and protests [10:22] Techrights-sec I wrote to them at the end of August and have not gotten a response. [10:22] Techrights-sec I think I wrote to them before that, too, and have no response yet. [10:22] schestowitz-TR I have tried birdsite, which is clobbering users at the moment [10:25] schestowitz tl;dr I also checked the tuxmachines accounts. Same thing. Impression suddenly halved, they're basically now showing to "followers" what they subscribed for. Theory needs proving somehow. http://techrights.org/2021/09/14/hiding-tweets/ [10:25] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-techrights.org | Twitter Like Googles YouTube is Hiding Tweets From People Who Follow You | Techrights [10:26] schestowitz-TR *not showing [10:26] schestowitz-TR social control with carrot and stick [10:28] schestowitz-TR "come to us, we are better thsn RSS, we do PUSH NOTIFICATIONS!!!" (until we don't) Same with feedburner, not sure if you paid attention to what happened this year [10:48] Techrights-sec Twitter and the other social control media are all about the [10:48] Techrights-sec mass manipulation of public opinion [10:48] Techrights-sec The tool for that is ranking and filtering. [10:49] *blitzed has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [10:49] schestowitz-TR we may need an overemcompassing term to also include Google Search, YouTube etc. YouTube is just more like FB but video-centric, Google Search is like Bing -- a censorship machine for China, US, EU, France RTbF, maybe one day EPO too ● Sep 22 [11:11] *DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@jqw6a9nnkevmk.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Sep 22 [12:14] Techrights-sec term: WWIII [12:16] schestowitz-TR World Wide 3=W3C? [12:38] *psydroid3 (~psydroid@cqggrmwgu7gji.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [12:44] Techrights-sec WorldWar III. I figure it has already started and been going a while, [12:44] Techrights-sec just not that it has gotten to the 'kinetic' stage yet. [12:44] Techrights-sec e.g. https://www.muckrock.com/foi/united-states-of-america-10/arjen-kamphuis-111695/ [12:44] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-www.muckrock.com | Arjen Kamphuis MuckRock [12:44] schestowitz-TR what do you make of Wuhan? [12:45] Techrights-sec In which context? I have not followed it of late but it is a very populated [12:45] Techrights-sec region. There's a lot of cover up and misdirection about most aspects of [12:45] Techrights-sec anything within the borders. [12:47] schestowitz-TR rianne's father, a manager at a chemical plant, reckons that this coronavirus strain was optimised in the lab [12:50] Techrights-sec Yes, but there is so much noise that it is hard for the authorities to properly [12:50] Techrights-sec investigate. Then there is the traditional obstinacy from the CCP. [12:51] schestowitz-TR like with 9/11, k00ks have poisoned the well. so cpp blames "cia", some blame "market", and people conflate intentional leak with accidential (which at the end does not matter; the outcome is what it is) ● Sep 22 [13:01] Techrights-sec IMO much of that poisoning is semi-intentional. The kooks are kooks, but [13:01] Techrights-sec various interests benefit from firing the up extra hot and winding them [13:01] Techrights-sec up further against specific targets so as to discredit any discussion of [13:01] Techrights-sec the topic. Voting fraud machines is one such example out of many. [13:01] Techrights-sec There was an artice about that specifically in the daily links recently, [13:01] Techrights-sec but cant refind it. [13:06] *activelow has quit (connection closed) [13:06] *activelow (~activelow@c2bkuq6swrs7w.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [13:16] *DaemonFC has quit (connection closed) ● Sep 22 [16:10] *blitzed (~blitzed@5rxnu2dcfq6ba.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [16:13] schestowitz http://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2021/09/the-unified-patent-court-do-we-finally.html?showComment=1632306963642#c671375393792610648 [16:13] -TechrightsBN/#boycottnovell-ipkitten.blogspot.com | The Unified Patent Court. Do we finally have a predictable timeline? - The IPKat [16:13] schestowitz " [16:13] schestowitz In the last para of #8, Attentive nails it. If the goal is to harmonise within the EU the jurisprudence on patent validity (and infringement) there are better ways to do it than the UPC as presently set up. Better because they build on the world's best body of jurisprudence on patent validity, namely the established case law of the Boards of Appeal of the EPO. Industry is always reminding us of its need for "certainty" when contemplating further [16:13] schestowitz rounds of investment in technological innovation. For industry, litigation is therefore to be deprecated, to be seen as a last resort, a damper on investment in new technology. The litigators would like to see more uncertainty, thereby to generate more litigation, earlier, a first rather than a last resort. Now ask: which group of people is driving hardest for the UPC? Could it be those who make money out of patent litigation? [16:13] schestowitz Of course, lawyers in Paris and London consider themselves to be unfairly treated, when all the business of the EPO Boards of Appeal is conducted in Munich. One has to ask to what extent the efforts to hobble and neuter the Boards are made by persons with greater loyalty to Paris and London than to the industries who crave certainty in matters of patent validity. London is the world's epicentee for rent-seeking, for something called Rentier [16:13] schestowitz Capitalism. Who remembers what Prime Minister Johnson's rallying cry in his last election campaign "F*ck Business"? [16:13] schestowitz Come on, all you readers who want to see more technological innovation in Europe. Let's take the opportunity given by BREXIT to build something better than the flawed UPC. Give the job to ta committee of three EU Member States other than France and Germany. I suggest the Republic of Ireland (English law, computer-implemented inventions, medical technology), The Netherlands (pre-eminent in patent litigation, technologically vibrant) and a country [16:13] schestowitz south of the Alps, perhaps Italy. [16:13] schestowitz " [16:15] schestowitz " [16:15] schestowitz For EPLA, its promoters asked the opinion of CJEU. We all know the result: not conform to Union law, cf. C 1/09. And EPLA was dead. [16:15] schestowitz EPLA's promoters became UPCA's promoters. It has been claimed all along that the UPCA is in conformity with Union law, but this has never been tested. [16:15] schestowitz If the UPCA was so clearly conform to Union law, why was the CJEU never asked its opinion about it? The question thus remains: were the UPC/UPCA promoters frighten that the CJEU would not give a positive answer? [16:15] schestowitz In the UPCA as it stands, the problem of Art 7(2) UPCA has not been solved, as London is still mentioned as seat of one of the sections of the central division. In the annex to the UPC IPC classes A and C are meant to be dealt with in London. [16:15] schestowitz Looking at it objectively: a treaty relating to a Court accepting primacy of Union law, mentions a section located in a country which is not any longer member of the EU. How can such a treaty be in conformity to Union law? [16:15] schestowitz Up to now the solutions offered by the UPCs promoters were characterised by a quite wild legal fantasy as the duties allocated to London should be provisionally distributed between Paris and Munich, in order to be later be allocated to another country. [16:15] schestowitz It is difficult to see any legal basis in such a bizarre arrangement. Neither Art 31 and 32 VCLT nor Art 87(2) can really be taken seriously as legal basis. To me this resemble more to Carpetbagger's discussions than a sound legal reasoning. Which IPC class should provisionally go to Paris: A or C or vice-versa? [16:15] schestowitz If anybody tells me this is in conformity with Union law, I will have to burst out in laughter. If the notion of the rightful judge does have any value, and I believe in Europe it has a value, it is not possible that the hodgepodge thus created can be in conformity with Union law. [16:15] schestowitz There is another aspect in the UPCA which seems difficult to reconcile the UPCA with Union law. A judge who is dismissed by its peers according to Art 10 of the Statute of the court, which is part of the UPCA has no means of redress, not even to the CJEU. How can this be in accordance with Union law? [16:15] schestowitz I can only but agree with Max Drei: what is going on with the UPCA is in a sense criminal as only private interests are behind the fig leaf of an imperious necessity for Europes industry in general and SMEs in particular. [16:15] schestowitz I also agree with IPMouse, the only way to challenge the mess is to bring it in front of the CJEU one way or another. [16:15] schestowitz FOARP is right. The original idea of the UPC promoters was to bring it into force as quickly as possible and before everybody could have a careful look at it and realise what was going on. I see one positive effect to the Brexit: it stalled the entry into force of the UPC and might through Art 7(2) UPCA bring it to fail. [16:15] schestowitz The only correct way to deal with the problem posed by Brexit is to clarify the problem created by Art 7(2) before the UPC enters into force. [16:15] schestowitz But this means further delays, and by then the interest for the UPC will have gone. After all, the EU lived perfectly well for 50+ years without something like the UPC and creating such an institution in view of the very few transnational litigations a year is not worth it. [16:15] schestowitz There are other ways, much cheaper, to harmonise litigation within Europe and those ways can apply not only to the whole of the EU, but also to all member states of the EPC. [16:15] schestowitz " [16:30] *blitzed has quit (connection closed) [16:31] *blitzed (~blitzed@5rxnu2dcfq6ba.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [16:44] Techrights-sec With 2001-09-11, the PATRIOT-act was ready and waiting on the shelf for [16:44] Techrights-sec an opportunity, any opportunity, to get deployed. If there had not been that [16:44] Techrights-sec passively allowed disaster there would have been another disaster along shortly [16:44] Techrights-sec either actively or passively enabled. The PATRIOT act was not written quickly, [16:44] Techrights-sec given the convoluted nature of its references to what got changed and how. [16:45] schestowitz-TR in latest 2 techbytes eps tim mentioned how covid19 was used to pass some really malicious laws over here too... ● Sep 22 [17:18] Techrights-sec I'd not be surprised if those laws were ready and waiting to be pulled off the [17:18] Techrights-sec shelf in just such an opportunity. [17:27] *activelow has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [17:34] *activelow (~activelow@3epy783jsvpvq.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [17:44] *rianne_ has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [17:44] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [17:45] *activelow has quit (Quit: rebooting) [17:48] schestowitz >>> Your login script is broken and logs out the same second it logs in so [17:48] schestowitz >>> there is not time for a connection. [17:48] schestowitz >> Should I increase the delay in the loop? [17:48] schestowitz >> [17:48] schestowitz > The delay between the connection and disconnection needs to be increased [17:48] schestowitz > quite a bit. [17:48] schestowitz I've increased to 20 secs. [17:51] *activelow (~activelow@b3rs3wwrk3aiu.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [17:56] *rianne_ (~rianne@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [17:56] *liberty_box (~liberty@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Sep 22 [18:01] schestowitz > Can you upload it somewhere? I'd like to see it to either find if it [18:01] schestowitz > can be improved or optimize my script to deal with it best. [18:02] Techrights-sec thanks [18:03] schestowitz-TR nap time for me....... ● Sep 22 [19:01] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:01] *rianne_ has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:08] *DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@e5ifhyuxg6s7y.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [19:28] *DaemonFC has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [19:32] Techrights-sec ytalk 'sleep 1; ytalk [19:35] schestowitz " [19:35] schestowitz [19:35] schestowitz without the username after the ytalk command, the script would only be able [19:35] schestowitz to respond to an incoming ytalk not initiate one. However, the window for [19:35] schestowitz that is very, very short since the other end will timeout quickly. So the [19:35] schestowitz above modification should greatly increase the ability to reconnect. [19:35] schestowitz " ● Sep 22 [20:00] *liberty_box (~liberty@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [20:00] *rianne_ (~rianne@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [20:46] *psydroid2 has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [20:48] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [20:49] *rianne_ has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [20:52] *DaemonFC (~DaemonFC@e5ifhyuxg6s7y.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [20:53] *psydroid2 (~psydroid@cqggrmwgu7gji.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Sep 22 [21:07] *rianne_ (~rianne@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [21:07] *liberty_box (~liberty@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell ● Sep 22 [22:03] *psydroid3 has quit (connection closed) [22:11] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) [22:11] *rianne_ has quit (Ping timeout: 2m30s) ● Sep 22 [23:51] *rianne_ (~rianne@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell [23:51] *liberty_box (~liberty@qhduu73fcjmdn.irc) has joined #boycottnovell