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IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: Friday, December 13, 2019

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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Why secure web-based applications with Kali Linux? []Dec 13 01:39
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Proteus Device is a secure, Linux-based handheld (not a smartphone) []Dec 13 01:40
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Nvidia Linux/BSD Graphics Driver Adds Support for Quadro T2000 with Max-Q Design []Dec 13 01:42
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Zorin OS 15.1 is Released: A Better Way to Work, Learn and Play []Dec 13 01:44
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers []Dec 13 01:45
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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games: Game Awards, Unity (Mono) and Hive Time []Dec 13 02:00
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos []Dec 13 02:08
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Deepin Linux Review: Stylish Distro or Spyware? []Dec 13 02:10
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Vim 8.2 is available! []Dec 13 02:33
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Audiocasts/Shows: Linux Headlines, Ubuntu Podcast and Bad Voltage []Dec 13 02:43
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Python Programming, Rust and Puppet Enterprise 3 []Dec 13 02:47
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Mesa 19.3.0 Released []Dec 13 02:49
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Devices: Axiomtek, Vecow and Canonical on Robotics []Dec 13 03:00
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Mozilla: Analysis Maturation Plan, Content Security Policy and Firefox Reality []Dec 13 03:02
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Red Hat and Fedora; OpenShift, Satellite, Fedora Women’s Day and More []Dec 13 03:15
oiaohmMinceR: I still remember being on a cattle property and living on killing rabbits and grown vegetables because the property was destocked due to dry.   But that is because I did not mind eating rabbit.   Now if you don't exactly like the taste...of rabbits your choice is basically vegan.Dec 13 04:14
oiaohmSo a lot more farmers are temporary vegan that most people think.Dec 13 04:15
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Security Leftovers []Dec 13 04:23
schestowitz:-(Dec 13 04:30
schestowitzwhy even kill them?Dec 13 04:30
DaemonFC[m]schestowitz They're an invasive species.Dec 13 04:33
oiaohmschestowitz: in Australia rabbits are a environmental pest.Dec 13 04:33
DaemonFC[m]Australia got overrun with them years ago.Dec 13 04:34
schestowitzhumans areDec 13 04:34
oiaohmThat just happen to taste reasonable.Dec 13 04:34
oiaohmRabbit warrens in Australian soils are highly dangerous.Dec 13 04:34
DaemonFC[m]Well, if you're going to kill them as a pest and they are edible.....Dec 13 04:34
DaemonFC[m]Why not make rabbit stew?Dec 13 04:35
DaemonFC[m]Rabbit burrito.Dec 13 04:35
DaemonFC[m]Rabbit burger....Dec 13 04:35
oiaohmYou serve them up and call rabbit 4 legged chicken and most people who don't know better have no problem eating it.Dec 13 04:35
DaemonFC[m]I spent the evening at Dave and Busters.Dec 13 04:36
oiaohmSlightly tougher texture chicken is basically what rabbit meat is.Dec 13 04:36
DaemonFC[m]They have this $20 all you can eat wings and video games.Dec 13 04:36
oiaohmI still remember  having scout camp when I was young with city slickers and we serve up 36 scouts with a meal made in a rough Hāngi (using heated bricks instead of stone) about 18 rabbits.  Of course while they were eating it we were calling it 4 leg chicken.Dec 13 04:39
oiaohmAfter they had their meal we brought out the rabbit skin hats we had made from the skins.Dec 13 04:39
oiaohmThat was one fun camp.Dec 13 04:40
oiaohmThey turns up at the camp site and due to hangi and all the cooking being underground there looked to be no cooking or food being done.Dec 13 04:40
oiaohmAnd their leader had the idea we will go to town and by food only to be told the largest fast food joint in town could not feed them no matter what.Dec 13 04:41
oiaohmThey wanted a rural experience we gave them one.Dec 13 04:41
DaemonFC[m]It would be nice if I knew how to live like that. Just go off the grid and ignore the government.Dec 13 04:47
oiaohmSorry to say attempting to live off grid does not mean you can avoid governmentDec 13 04:53
oiaohmAt times weather conditions here get that bad you need government assistance to get basics like water.Dec 13 04:54
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: China's Kylin forks are about to join up for new 'domestic os' []Dec 13 05:43
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos []Dec 13 05:46
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: AndesCore 27-Series Linux RISC-V SoC Features a Vector Processing Unit []Dec 13 05:51
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: BSD: BGP and OpenBGPD, FreeBSD and OpenBSD []Dec 13 05:56
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Benchmark results on mdds multi_type_vector []Dec 13 06:54
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oiaohm  we really do need to get a functional digital sextantDec 13 07:25
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-GPS inventor: We need to fix GPS's jamming problem | ZDNetDec 13 07:25
MinceR 13 07:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-There's only one man who would DARE give me the raspberry - YouTubeDec 13 07:27
oiaohmOf course a functional digital sextant only need good time value would not have to depend on satellites. Dec 13 07:30
oiaohmFor most navigations things the 250 meter sq of where you are is good enough.Dec 13 07:30
oiaohmAt least enough in most cases to say hey the GPS I am getting is bogus crap.Dec 13 07:31
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Top 5 reasons to switch from Windows to Linux right now []Dec 13 08:04
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Best Linux Distribution for Windows Users in 2019 []Dec 13 08:05
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: AndesCore 27-Series Linux RISC-V SoC Features a Vector Processing Unit []Dec 13 08:08
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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux Foundation Has Outsourced All the Licence Compliance Stuff to Microsoft, a Serial GPL Violator []Dec 13 08:38
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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Today in #Techrights []Dec 13 08:38
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers []Dec 13 08:41
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: What GNOME 2 fans love about the Mate Linux desktop []Dec 13 09:02
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Google Now Bans Some Linux Web Browsers From Their Services []Dec 13 09:07
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Programming Leftovers []Dec 13 09:31
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Security Leftovers []Dec 13 09:34
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos []Dec 13 09:38
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Screencasts and Shows: ArcoLinux 19.12 Run Through, TechSNAP and Python Bytes []Dec 13 09:40
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's leftovers []Dec 13 09:41
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Links 13/12/2019: Zorin OS 15.1, Vim 8.2 []Dec 13 09:56
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Why FOSS is still not on activist agendas []Dec 13 09:57
schestowitzone wonders if Microsoft was a big client of these law firms 13 10:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 999 @ )Dec 13 10:05
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Trying Out The Skia+Vulkan Powered LibreOffice 6.5 Development Build []Dec 13 10:14
oiaohmschestowitz: what about the reverse as well.Dec 13 10:31
XRevan86 this good post is translated to English turns outDec 13 11:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Nginx's office is being searched due to Rambler Group's lawsuit. The complaintant press service confirmed the suit / HabrDec 13 11:09
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linuxgirlHi :-)Dec 13 14:02
XRevan86linuxgirl: hiDec 13 14:03
linuxgirl:-)Dec 13 14:03
linuxgirlSeen Bryan Lunduke's latest video? He's calling out the LF and corporate stuff adversely affecting Linux. Dec 13 14:03
linuxgirl 13 14:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-The 2 Problems Facing Linux (and Open Source) in 2020 | Bryan Lunduke on PatreonDec 13 14:05
linuxgirlIt's free, not paid, linkDec 13 14:05
MinceRinteresting how to him "business" is an excuse for any crimeDec 13 14:07
MinceRChurch of the Almighty Money?Dec 13 14:07
linuxgirlto Lunduke?Dec 13 14:07
MinceRyesDec 13 14:08
MinceR>I don't view Microsoft as evil... simply a company focused (primarily) on Closed Source software and with a track record of attacking those that threaten their core businesses.  They're just doing the business they do.Dec 13 14:08
linuxgirlI didn't read it that way; he's pointing out facts, but the whole article clearly is about concerns to do with MS and others. Dec 13 14:08
MinceRapparently even trying to coexist with microsloth is a threat to their core businesses and so microshit trying to end human technology (and human life) is just businessDec 13 14:09
linuxgirlYes, MS stink. The article's about stopping them/corporate/LF eg by forking, which he sees could happen in 2020 if things keep ramping up. Dec 13 14:09
linuxgirlHe references that. Dec 13 14:10
linuxgirlGood that somebody more public is actually speaking up. Dec 13 14:10
MinceRthe only way to save Linux would be if enough competent kernel developers switched to maintaining a fork of itDec 13 14:10
linuxgirlI'd stopped watching him when he didn't acknowledge about RMS sabotaged, but this video got my attention. Dec 13 14:10
linuxgirlYes, it needs the developers. Dec 13 14:10
MinceRwhich is not likely to happenDec 13 14:10
linuxgirlDon't know. Do we know all the developers?Dec 13 14:11
MinceRi know there's only one sane person in the upper echelons, and he's on a leashDec 13 14:11
linuxgirlTed T'so?Dec 13 14:11
MinceRLinusDec 13 14:11
linuxgirlHe's gone really quiet. Dec 13 14:11
MinceRwhere does Ted T'so stand on the CoC and cancerd issues?Dec 13 14:12
linuxgirlHe needed to keep being Linus, to not knuckle under the CoC. Dec 13 14:12
MinceRi haven't heard of the other people from before the megacorporate takeoverDec 13 14:12
linuxgirlI don't know Ted, but he got attacked within the 1st week, so I doubt he's keen on it. Dec 13 14:12
linuxgirl1st week of the CoC I meanDec 13 14:13
MinceRmicrosuck's minions are probably blackmailing LinusDec 13 14:13
linuxgirlThat's the problem; if he'd not gone along with anything, and kept being Linus, that would have been a powerful thing to do. Maybe he will speak up, as things ramp up worse. Dec 13 14:13
linuxgirlThe last article published here (figosdev?) has bothered me ... saying about dishonesty while at the same time saying about 'we were all scheming a year before', and then wondering why RMS is doing things his way ('fighting quietly'). Dec 13 14:16
linuxgirlDue to RMS 'fighting quietly', unlike possibly the author of the article, so much was achieved. Dec 13 14:17
linuxgirlI don't know why people are thinking that hoping in the FSF is going to work. Even this author says they never listen. Maybe RMS is right to not take them on, instead preferring to get on with his work and do some further good. Who knows, but the 'boycotting most of Europe' was unnecessary in the mix too. I know news is thin on the ground at theDec 13 14:18
linuxgirlmoment, but surely it's better to not just fill the space like this. Dec 13 14:18
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MinceR 13 14:26
XRevan86MinceR: :)Dec 13 14:27
MinceRalso, i don't think Lunduke's solution will work, unfortunatelyDec 13 14:35
MinceRmicrosloth and their cultists have a habit of reframing any criticism to them as "hatred"Dec 13 14:36
MinceR(and they do deserve all the hatred and attacks they get)Dec 13 14:36
psydroidit gets even worse than thatDec 13 14:38
psydroidin one of my conversations on freenode microsloth adapts were even arguing that software developers writing software on and free operating systems take away from software development for microsloth platformsDec 13 14:39
psydroidthat's the moment I realised these people aren't right in their heads and they deserve their platform to be completely annihilated, after which they have the option of going down along with itDec 13 14:39
MinceRindeedDec 13 14:40
MinceR 13 15:15
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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games: Sally Face, Feral Interactive Staff, Crowdfunding and WarriOrb: Prologue []Dec 13 17:00
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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos []Dec 13 17:10
MinceR 13 17:14
XRevan86 13 17:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | NO TITLEDec 13 17:15
*XRevan86 is surprised how big this topic gotDec 13 17:17
XRevan86 %)Dec 13 17:20
XRevan86and another one: 13 17:20
MinceRi'm not surprised by the racketDec 13 17:24
MinceRwhat i'm wondering about is whether putin is involvedDec 13 17:24
oiaohmpsydroid: its true that software development on Linux has taken some software away from Microsoft in the enterprise sector.Dec 13 17:25
MinceRwhat's this i/we business?Dec 13 17:25
oiaohmWSL  was another services for unix attempt to reverse a trend.  Did not work now they have WSL2 it going to be interesting to watch if business are going to take the point of view hey make a Linux package it works everywhere.Dec 13 17:27
psydroidoiaohm, that's exactly the point, if Microsoft and its partners want software written for their technologies they'll have to pay developers to do it for themDec 13 17:27
MinceRthat won't lastDec 13 17:27
MinceRmicrosloth is working on stopping Linux from working anywhereDec 13 17:27
XRevan86MinceR: Putin is always involved %)Dec 13 17:28
oiaohmMinceR: And in a lot of ways failing at it.Dec 13 17:28
MinceR:>Dec 13 17:28
danielp3344<MinceR "microsloth is working on stoppin"> ?Dec 13 17:29
MinceRXRevan86: so this is a ploy to get nginx (including proprietary parts) under ownership of a corporation controlled by putin?Dec 13 17:29
MinceRdanielp3344: CoC and the Linux-Destroying FoundationDec 13 17:30
MinceRgkh even announced that he'll break the usb stack nextDec 13 17:30
danielp3344'break' how?Dec 13 17:30
XRevan86MinceR: I wouldn't go that far. Seems to be more petty than that.Dec 13 17:30
MinceRdanielp3344: some reimplementation, i forgotDec 13 17:31
XRevan86I still don't get what their plan was. And because of the backlash probably never will.Dec 13 17:31
oiaohmReally Coppa against youtube and other things show that government regulation of content is coming to the internet.Dec 13 17:31
danielp3344There's always the hurdDec 13 17:31
MinceRoiaohm: iow, the internet is going to be killed by statesDec 13 17:32
MinceRdanielp3344: hurd is deadDec 13 17:32
danielp3344I hear they're getting decent audio supportDec 13 17:32
danielp3344<MinceR "Daniel Peterson: hurd is dead"> actually I know people who actively work on itDec 13 17:32
XRevan86Rambler is already trying to sell a story that it wasn't involved at all, it's all offshore's doing, the one they gave rights to represent them toDec 13 17:32
MinceRremember how hurd used to be a multiserver microkernel system?Dec 13 17:32
MinceR 13 17:32
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | systemdDec 13 17:32
MinceRit's funny how matrix replaces nicks with full namesDec 13 17:33
oiaohmMinceR: its not just the USA pushing these regulations the EU is as well.Dec 13 17:33
MinceRmy point standsDec 13 17:33
MinceRnote that i didn't say "united states"Dec 13 17:34
XRevan86The problem with that being that the offshore's beneficiary is , a co-owner of Rambler.Dec 13 17:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | Alexander Mamut - WikipediaDec 13 17:34
MinceRXRevan86: what offshore?Dec 13 17:34
XRevan86MinceR: Lynwood Investments CY LtdDec 13 17:36
MinceRi seeDec 13 17:38
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: GNU Guile 2.9.7 Released [beta] []Dec 13 17:39
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Benchmarking Mozilla's Firefox Performance Over The Past Two Years []Dec 13 17:40
oiaohmMinceR: some of the parties like Australia also getting in on the regulation game now its not the states of them.   I would say governments are going to kill of the old internet a lot of people new leaving a lot more regulated version.Dec 13 17:43
XRevan86It was almost immediately thought that this trick is to avoid a backfire – if something goes wrong, it's the offshore that's liable.Dec 13 17:43
MinceRwell, humanity gets another chance to learn why they don't want states or authoritarianismDec 13 17:43
MinceRbut maybe they won't survive the lessonDec 13 17:43
XRevan86For this criminal abuse of copyright law.Dec 13 17:43
XRevan86And it seems Rambler does play this card al-flipping-readyDec 13 17:44
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Dual-GPU support follow-up: NVIDIA driver support []Dec 13 17:47
oiaohmMinceR: I still remember hurd early debugging problem of being next to impossible due to not being willing to stay down after something went wrong.Dec 13 17:51
oiaohmSo restart loops.Dec 13 17:51
MinceRyeah, i remember you explaining it :>Dec 13 17:51
oiaohmThere is such thing as too durable of a operating system.Dec 13 17:52
MinceRwell, systemd will definitely make it easier to keep hurd from getting back into operational stateDec 13 17:52
MinceRand users will finally get to wait forever for a very informative error message saying "A stop job is running for user"Dec 13 17:52
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oiaohmA stop job is running for user systemd does not wait forever there is adjustable watchdog timer.Dec 13 17:53
oiaohmIts a lot nicer when that is set to 1 second.Dec 13 17:53
MinceRi'm sure it's easy to adjust on a system that's trying and failing to shut downDec 13 17:53
MinceRi adjust it using the power button or equivalentDec 13 17:53
MinceRafter all, if the machine was running important things, it wouldn't be running cancerd.Dec 13 17:53
MinceRi suppose handling esc or ^C wouldn't have been the "modern" thing to doDec 13 17:54
oiaohmThat stop job thing comes about dealing with orcale database screw ups.Dec 13 17:54
oiaohmunder sysvinit.,Dec 13 17:54
XRevan86I thought systemd does handle Ctrl+Alt+Del pressed multiple times.Dec 13 17:54
oiaohmBeing design for smf and zones it expects that.Dec 13 17:54
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MinceRon the vm that did this yesterday, there's no obstacle databaseDec 13 17:55
MinceRXRevan86: i'll try that next timeDec 13 17:55
oiaohmMinceR: so your idea that systemd would not be running important things is wrong.  Some of the dependencies of important things like some orcale db based medical managment system need that wait behavour so bad things don't happen.Dec 13 17:56
MinceRif you're trusting obstacle and cancerd with medical data, you're doing something wrongDec 13 17:56
MinceRpossibly even criminally wrongDec 13 17:56
MinceRsame thing as running medical imaging and radiotherapy on winblowsDec 13 17:57
oiaohmsysvinit where it kills stuff without noticing that it should wait for data to get to disk?Dec 13 17:57
oiaohmThat my problem you say don't use systemd but what is the option in those cases that current works where you do need to check the status of services and do need to wait.Dec 13 17:58
MinceRyou keep insisting that systemd worksDec 13 17:58
MinceRunfortunately, it just doesn'tDec 13 17:58
oiaohmYou keep on saying it does not work when that not the absolute story either.Dec 13 17:58
MinceRand unfortunately, your words aren't magical, so spamming this channel with praises of cancerd isn't fixing anythingDec 13 17:59
oiaohmsystemd works in particular case very well.Dec 13 17:59
MinceRah yesDec 13 17:59
MinceRthe particular case of wanting to heat a room with a half-booted or half-shutdown PCDec 13 17:59
oiaohmand with the new version with pidfd support no longer has the cgroup race problem on killing services.Dec 13 17:59
MinceRfor those who are tired of heating a room with windows running additional malware scavenged from the internetDec 13 17:59
MinceRniceDec 13 17:59
MinceRsounds like they might get Linux into a state where it will be suitable basis for developing something that has some similarities with systemdDec 13 18:00
oiaohmThe current versions on current kernel of systemd is behaving very well.Dec 13 18:00
MinceRtoo bad it will probably be an unusable windows-like wreck by thenDec 13 18:00
MinceRand too bad they've already killed several GNU/Linux distributions in an attempt to force their pre-proof-of-concept piece of shit on people who didn't ask for itDec 13 18:01
MinceRby the time cgroups will work properly, users will have probably migrated to openbsd alreadyDec 13 18:01
MinceRhopefully people will learn from this and avoid corporate influence in free software projects like the plague.Dec 13 18:01
oiaohmProblem was cgroups v2 has cgroups fixed.Dec 13 18:02
oiaohmBut cgroups really does not fix the PID is a number that can get replaced by another process at any random time.Dec 13 18:03
oiaohmpidfd is the fix to the PID number problem.Dec 13 18:03
oiaohmThe reality is systemd started with cgroup v1 and no pidfd stuff and pushed in the direction of a fully working service management solution with the level of broken crap the Linux kernel was a the time.Dec 13 18:04
oiaohmopenbsd has the pidfd problem.  Only one of the BSD kernels without the pidfd problem is freebsd.Dec 13 18:05
oiaohmIe the problem pidfd fixes.Dec 13 18:05
oiaohmMinceR: so migrating to openbsd is techically migrating to broken.Dec 13 18:06
MinceR"everything is broken but systemd is special and sacred"Dec 13 18:06
*MinceR yawnsDec 13 18:07
oiaohmAlso really funny OS X who kernel is based off of freebsd managed to have the PID recycling problem. that pidfd fixed for Linux and freebsd kernel has a fix for because they removed it.Dec 13 18:07
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers []Dec 13 18:07
MinceRit's also great that a brand new ubuntu install boots to an emergency prompt to press ctrl+d to continue bootingDec 13 18:07
MinceRhidden on a different virtual console from the one that's actually displayedDec 13 18:07
MinceR"german engineering!"Dec 13 18:08
*psydroid finally states that his contingency plan is to move to Redox OS and Helenos and he will have a look at AROS, AtheOS and Haiku for old computersDec 13 18:08
oiaohmMinceR: not everything outside systemd is broken.  There have been things broken in the Posix/unix world of decades.Dec 13 18:08
MinceRthe os x kernel is a horrible abomination which is driven by marketing liesDec 13 18:08
psydroidwe all want a piece of that German engineering!Dec 13 18:08
MinceRoiaohm: then you should probably move to windowsDec 13 18:08
MinceRit's built on principles you loveDec 13 18:09
MinceRand take the whole cult with youDec 13 18:09
oiaohmI hate windows.Dec 13 18:09
MinceRthey've done so much work for nothingDec 13 18:09
oiaohmWhere is my cpu management around services.Dec 13 18:09
MinceRas an added bonus, they could finally stop pretending that processes are expensiveDec 13 18:09
oiaohmMinceR: come on with windows how do I control how much cpu a service will use.Dec 13 18:09
MinceRbecause they'd have a kernel where processes really are expensive!Dec 13 18:09
MinceRoiaohm: you don'tDec 13 18:09
oiaohmExactly.Dec 13 18:09
oiaohmThat is what I want.Dec 13 18:09
MinceRif you cared about how much cpu things used, you'd run unix, not some bloated piece of shitDec 13 18:09
oiaohmWindows does not suite me at allDec 13 18:10
MinceRneither does cancerdDec 13 18:10
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux Mint 19.3 disc images are being tested ready for Christmas release []Dec 13 18:10
oiaohmwith systemd I can limit a service to a paricular cpu and to particular level of cpu usage.Dec 13 18:10
oiaohmso avoiding problems.Dec 13 18:10
MinceRwhere cancerd (and packagekitd and dbus) uses more cpu than the application the user is using all the timeDec 13 18:10
oiaohmLike I use to do with SMF and zones.Dec 13 18:10
oiaohmWhat had you not worked out I am a old school solaris user.Dec 13 18:11
MinceRthen why don't you use slowlarisDec 13 18:11
MinceRand get the cancerd cult to switch to slowlarisDec 13 18:11
MinceRmaybe Linux could be saved thenDec 13 18:11
oiaohmSolaris has crappy hardware support.Dec 13 18:11
MinceRjust get crappy hardware thenDec 13 18:12
MinceRit fits well with crappy softwareDec 13 18:12
MinceRi wonder if slowlaris runs on crApple hardwareDec 13 18:12
oiaohmThe answer is no.Dec 13 18:12
MinceRpityDec 13 18:12
MinceRit would be a match made in hellDec 13 18:12
oiaohmEven in OS X virtual machines options it managed to totally fail.Dec 13 18:13
oiaohmas I said crappy hardware support.Dec 13 18:13
oiaohmIt makes OS X hardware support look good.Dec 13 18:13
MinceRnah, as long as the crApple logo lights up, they consider it a successDec 13 18:13
oiaohmI have seen a solaris screw up on a x86 motherboard and manage to overvolt the cpu from 1 volt to 3volts.Dec 13 18:14
MinceRniceDec 13 18:14
oiaohmOf course the poor cpu did not live.Dec 13 18:14
MinceRlucky cpuDec 13 18:14
oiaohmSun hardware with solaris was about all that worked safely.Dec 13 18:14
oiaohmMinceR: when it comes to cpu usage on my systemd does not show up top 4000 processes neither does packagekitd.    dbus managed to be in the top 100.Dec 13 18:19
oiaohmBut that not doing things linked to systemd Dec 13 18:19
MinceR 13 18:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | I am sorry, but this looks insaneDec 13 18:20
MinceRi guess the high priests get a different version of systemd from us plebsDec 13 18:20
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oiaohmMinceR: no the old versions of systemd were like that.Dec 13 18:23
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oiaohmThey changed the way watchdog was implemented and systemd cpu usage dropped massively.Dec 13 18:24
MinceRtoo bad they did this years after announcing it was "stable" and killing debian from inside to force it on users who didn't ask for itDec 13 18:25
MinceRi wonder if you can see how this undermines my ability to trust those people everDec 13 18:25
oiaohmTo change the watchdog to cpu effective required getting upstream kernel change in.Dec 13 18:28
<--balrog has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)Dec 13 18:28
oiaohmMinceR: I can understand your issue.  But I also understand that a lot of systemd problems where not systemd alone.  Some was in fact Linux kernel having stuff implemented broken and them deciding to use it.Dec 13 18:29
oiaohmResult finally has been a lot of those kernel level issues fixed.Dec 13 18:30
MinceRsome systemd problems were actually in sysvinit but they magically only manifested when using systemd!Dec 13 18:30
MinceRand yes, some of it was systemd relying (in a non-optional way!) on kernel features that weren't complete and didn't work properlyDec 13 18:31
oiaohmSystemd made it clear the fault was happening.   When it was happening under sysvint without you knowing and you were rolling a dice every time it happen if it would be a good or bad outcome.Dec 13 18:32
MinceRthat's great, doing testing is a good thing to doDec 13 18:32
MinceRbut it is not to be done in productionDec 13 18:32
-->balrog (~balrog@unaffiliated/balrog) has joined #techrightsDec 13 18:32
MinceRlike i've told you 9001 timesDec 13 18:33
MinceRif some alleged "software engineer" doesn't understand this, then i'm not interested in running the "init system" they've "engineered"Dec 13 18:33
oiaohmAs I said with the Linux kernel development process back then to get it fixed it had to be in production.Dec 13 18:33
oiaohmRemember the kernel only got any form of proper testing in mainline kernel in 2017.Dec 13 18:33
MinceRthen it's for the best that Linux dies and i switch to OpenBSDDec 13 18:33
oiaohmThat is the Linux kernel.Dec 13 18:34
oiaohmAnd we only got unit testing in the Linux kernel this year.Dec 13 18:34
oiaohmLinux kernel development has not been any form of good engineering.  Its been fly by seat of pants and be lucky. Dec 13 18:34
oiaohmYes systemd was working on top of that horrible foundation and decide to push the limits.Dec 13 18:35
oiaohmI see systemd as the evil we had to have to get the development processes of Linux kernel to start heading in a more sane direction.Dec 13 18:35
MinceRtoo bad we had to sacrifice GNU, the FSF and Linux to get to that sane directionDec 13 18:36
MinceRapparently the sane direction is "don't let corporations influence free software in any way, ever"Dec 13 18:37
MinceRoh, and we also had to sacrifice Debian, but who's counting?Dec 13 18:37
oiaohmwine background I remember when wine introduced test driven development as well.Dec 13 18:38
oiaohmIt was another painful time.Dec 13 18:38
oiaohmI really wish it did not take using insanely big sticks to get software development to use quality control and confirm features implemented in fact work.Dec 13 18:38
oiaohmMinceR: I do agree that we should not have required the systemd developers basically to torch the place to get correct development processes.Dec 13 18:40
oiaohmBut with open source projects it been required many times.Dec 13 18:40
oiaohmOne of the great outcomes of the libreoffice vs openoffice blow up was proper testing on libreoffice leading to higher quality product.Dec 13 18:41
MinceRespecially since they still don't have correct development processesDec 13 18:41
MinceRand not only that, but they don't even have correct development principlesDec 13 18:41
MinceRpoettering still doesn't understand cohesionDec 13 18:41
oiaohmIt closer now than where they started.Dec 13 18:41
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: More demo contents about /e/ OS! []Dec 13 18:41
oiaohmMost likely we will need another fire of some form in the init system area to clean that up properly.Dec 13 18:42
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: An Epiphany regarding Purebrowser []Dec 13 18:44
oiaohmMinceR: the complete linux kernel development is defined as hurding cats because it has almost a total lack of cohesionDec 13 18:44
oiaohmBut kind of works some how.Dec 13 18:44
oiaohmFailure to understand cohesion is a common FOSS and closed source development problem.Dec 13 18:45
MinceRtoo bad they put the only person capable of herding them on a leashDec 13 18:45
MinceRusually not being overly ambitious helps with the cohesion problemDec 13 18:45
oiaohmThere is a problem here as well.  Being under ambitious and not testing stuff with lack of cohesion end up with increasing growth of useless bloat code.Dec 13 18:46
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: QEMU 4.2.0 []Dec 13 18:46
oiaohmMinceR: overly ambitious and under ambitious both display problems in different ways with lack of cohesion.Dec 13 18:47
oiaohmsysvinit pid problem is example of lack of ambitious not testing that the stuff in fact worked.Dec 13 18:47
oiaohmLack of cohesion with good quality control that everything works.Dec 13 18:50
oiaohmMinceR: to be correct Linus was starting to not explain and just basically be yelling resulting in getting slowly less effective at hurding.   So in some ways putting a leash on Linus and saying you are not to use bad language/personal attacks.  You are fine to attack the code means Linus is hurding better now.Dec 13 18:51
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Security Leftovers []Dec 13 18:52
oiaohmNow if we can get some unified process for maintainers of the Linux kernel to use instead of the unique process per subsystem.Dec 13 18:52
oiaohmLack of cohesion in the Linux kernel.  Make the lack of conhesion in systemd look like a minor headache.Dec 13 18:53
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux Foundation: Microsoft Buying Seats and Another Branch Started for Edge Openwash []Dec 13 18:54
MinceRoiaohm: no, having the microsloth-driven Linux-Destroying Foundation ban people from conferences and from developing Linux because they made unrelated statements they don't like will not, in fact, make Linux better.Dec 13 18:57
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: The LibreOffice Documentation Team Announces the LibreOffice Online Guide []Dec 13 19:02
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Plenty of Linux Power Is Built Into Linux Lite 4.6 []Dec 13 19:13
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: KDE Meetings and Conferences []Dec 13 19:20
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games: Proton Release and Railway Empire []Dec 13 19:27
oiaohmMinceR: That the wrong point of view.   If you look at the countries where those conference were being held those people statements were illegal in those countries.Dec 13 19:36
oiaohmMinceR: what are they meant to let those people attend and get arrested?  Dec 13 19:36
oiaohmThis war on terror stuff is meaning government regulation is coming a serous pain in ass.Dec 13 19:37
oiaohmMinceR: basically sometimes this problems have nothing todo with Microsoft.   But the rock and hard place government regulation is leaving people running conferences.Dec 13 19:38
MinceRthey could have told those people that they believe those people would be arrested if they visitedDec 13 19:39
MinceRthey're not authoritiesDec 13 19:39
MinceRas for microshit's involvement, see 13 19:40
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | TwitterDec 13 19:40
oiaohmYou have not read the regulations.   Informing them that they might be arrested as reason for blocking can be classed as given them aid so getting your conference management into trouble.Dec 13 19:40
oiaohmGovernement regulation around this stuff is pure ass hole.Dec 13 19:41
MinceRthen they could have stayed out of the whole thing instead of playing policemanDec 13 19:41
MinceRwe have too many of those already, there's no need for volunteersDec 13 19:41
oiaohmSorry no they cannot.Dec 13 19:43
oiaohmThere are some bands in Australia who will not filter those who can attend who is having the government cancel their complete venues.Dec 13 19:43
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Debian: Olivier Berger at Paris Open Source Summit 2019, Molly de Blanc on Autonomy and First Outreachy Post by Anisa Kuci []Dec 13 19:43
oiaohmMinceR: basically don't play policeman in a lot countries now.  No conference.Dec 13 19:44
oiaohmMinceR: Microsoft code of conduct really is nothing like the Linux conference code of conducts.  You can get Microsoft one here.Dec 13 19:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Microsoft Supplier Code of Conduct | Microsoft ProcurementDec 13 19:46
schestowitzyes, sir microsoftDec 13 19:47
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Videos/Audiocasts/Shows: SkateBIRD, Carrion, Kubuntu 19.10 and More []Dec 13 19:47
oiaohm  << The term code of conduct well and truly predates Microsoft usage of it.Dec 13 19:48
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | Code of Conduct for the International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement and NGOs in Disaster Relief - WikipediaDec 13 19:48
oiaohmYes the red cross code of conduct is closer to the Linux kernel one than the Microsoft code of conduct.Dec 13 19:48
schestowitzmaybe they had pedophile priest issuesDec 13 19:49
oiaohmThe red cross was one of the first to start directly dealing with that problem.Dec 13 19:49
schestowitzdon't think that applies to bill gates and his bff epsteinDec 13 19:49
oiaohmNote Microsoft code of conduct applies to third party employees and suppliers not to themselves.Dec 13 19:50
schestowitzanyway... if your point is, msft has it, so we should tooDec 13 19:50
schestowitzthen I'd see no pointing even debating the subjectDec 13 19:50
oiaohmMy point is Microsoft code of conduct is nothing like the Linux one other than the three words code of conduct.Dec 13 19:51
schestowitzGNU/Linux needs to replace MiceosoftDec 13 19:51
schestowitznot apart to Microsoft cultureDec 13 19:51
schestowitz*adaptDec 13 19:51
oiaohmNow if Linux kernel code of conduct and conference code of conduct was being compared to the red cross one there would be some matches.Dec 13 19:51
MinceRwhen can we expect international red cross to deal with their problem of being massive bigots toward gamers?Dec 13 19:51
schestowitzthere are already laws in placeDec 13 19:52
schestowitze.g. for workplace harassmentDec 13 19:52
MinceR13 205108 < schestowitz> GNU/Linux needs to replace MiceosoftDec 13 19:52
schestowitzthe corporations want to shield more excuses to control everythingDec 13 19:52
MinceRi think that boat has sailedDec 13 19:52
schestowitznot just at state levelDec 13 19:52
schestowitzEEEDec 13 19:52
schestowitzbut not at gnuDec 13 19:52
schestowitzat lf-- yesDec 13 19:52
oiaohmThe laws against workplace harassement also require management to take actions to prevent it.Dec 13 19:53
MinceRibm and microsuck will simply make gnu impossible to run on linuxDec 13 19:53
schestowitzzemlin opened his cheeks too wideDec 13 19:53
oiaohmThis normally comes a code of conduct/ code of ethics.Dec 13 19:53
schestowitzand I don't mean his mouthDec 13 19:53
oiaohmMicrosoft internal is code of ethics.Dec 13 19:53
MinceRzemlin shouldn't have been allowed near the kernelDec 13 19:53
MinceRor near any free software projectDec 13 19:53
schestowitzyupDec 13 19:53
MinceRlol @ the concept of microsloth having anything to do with ethicsDec 13 19:53
schestowitzhe was new to itDec 13 19:53
oiaohmNot like Microsoft code of ethics really restricts that much.Dec 13 19:53
MinceRthey're the anti-ethicsDec 13 19:53
schestowitzhe found out about LUNIX thing around 2000Dec 13 19:54
MinceRIBM stands for I'm Buying MicrosoftDec 13 19:54
danielp3344XDDec 13 19:54
danielp3344MinceR: what about POWER?Dec 13 19:55
MinceRi don't have one and i'm less and less interested in itDec 13 19:55
danielp3344why is that?Dec 13 19:55
MinceRis it any better than systemd, clearcase or clearquest?Dec 13 19:56
danielp3344They're the most powerful cpus available that don't require nonfree software of any sortDec 13 19:56
MinceRbecause ibm has made it clear that they'll do anything they can to harm the IT industry and the free software communityDec 13 19:56
danielp3344They're in like the top 3 most libre machines on the marketDec 13 19:56
MinceRi think i'll use RISC-V or OpenRISC insteadDec 13 19:56
danielp3344MinceR: they're coolDec 13 19:56
danielp3344but POWER is really fastDec 13 19:56
MinceRi'd need an open core to have a chance against hardware backdoors anywayDec 13 19:56
MinceRyeah, so's x86_64Dec 13 19:57
danielp3344MinceR: POWER is much fasterDec 13 19:57
danielp3344even when gnu MP ans glibc had zero optimizations the cpus were beating the i9s and threadrippersDec 13 19:57
danielp3344and*Dec 13 19:57
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Fedora, Red Hat and IBM: Flatpak 1.5.2, Cockpit 209, OpenShift, Java and More []Dec 13 19:59
oiaohmMinceR:  Ok they have renamed it again at Microsoft.  Its not code of ethics any more it standards of business   When you read through that stack of policies all staff is meant to follow and basically nothing about good code of conduct.Dec 13 20:00
MinceRfunny, i guess someone reminded them that they don't do ethicsDec 13 20:01
MinceR"business", on the other hand, simply means "crimes we can get away with"Dec 13 20:01
oiaohmThat document says they should not pay bribes to get contracts.Dec 13 20:02
oiaohmBut that does not stop them.Dec 13 20:02
MinceRduhDec 13 20:02
MinceRinteresting how the law applies to kernel developers the SJWs don't like but it doesn't apply to microshit or ibm or crAppleDec 13 20:03
MinceRand how the law punishes slightly inconveniencing rich and powerful people much more harshly than murdering innocent poor peopleDec 13 20:03
MinceRwhat a sweet fucking deal for most people this whole state business is.Dec 13 20:04
oiaohmIBM had something like the Linux kernel SoC before world war II.Dec 13 20:04
oiaohmSoC/CoCDec 13 20:04
MinceRis that why they helped the nazis keep track of alleged jews?Dec 13 20:04
oiaohmYes because they could not do discrimination in business dealings Dec 13 20:05
oiaohmNot supplying the nazis tech would have been discrimination right?Dec 13 20:05
oiaohmIBM has refined their policy since then.Dec 13 20:06
oiaohmApple dealing with china is basically in the same way.Dec 13 20:06
oiaohmThe law does apply to Microsoft, apple and IBM.Dec 13 20:06
oiaohmProblem is what it results in sometimes is quite horrible.Dec 13 20:06
MinceRwatson was way too proud of the medal he got from his nazi pals for this to be simply an issue of "unfortunately having to sell to them"Dec 13 20:08
oiaohmIts something the so call social Justice warriors normally don't consider.   That humans are humans who will bend the rules to suit their objectives.Dec 13 20:09
oiaohmMinceR: remember by the IBM policy at the time watson was doing nothing wrong.   Like the current Linux CoC  where does it say here you cannot aid in mass murder.Dec 13 20:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | Contributor Covenant Code of Conduct — The Linux Kernel documentationDec 13 20:12
MinceRriiiiightDec 13 20:13
MinceRthere's nothing wrong with rounding up people based on who their ancestors were and killing themDec 13 20:13
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos []Dec 13 20:14
oiaohmMinceR: it was not against german law at the time and was not against company policy at the time.   Of course IBM current day code of conduct is against the rules to knowing assist.Dec 13 20:15
oiaohmWe class is as wrong but hey that not the way it is.Dec 13 20:16
MinceRand according to your theory of "the law is always right", that makes it all rightDec 13 20:17
MinceRwhy do any pretense of ethics or morality at this point?Dec 13 20:17
oiaohmI did not say the law is always right.Dec 13 20:17
MinceRonly implied it every chance you got?Dec 13 20:18
oiaohmIBM code of conduct these days go well past what countries laws require.   So does Microsoft code of conduct on suppliers and so does apple code of conduct on suppliers.Dec 13 20:18
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Mozilla and Curl Leftovers []Dec 13 20:19
oiaohmCoC of the Linux kernel is only barely to what the Laws require.Dec 13 20:19
MinceRwhich is not necessarily a good thingDec 13 20:19
oiaohmExactly IBM historic example says it can be really a bad thing.Dec 13 20:20
MinceRalso, afaik in most jurisdictions the law does not require most or any of what the Linux CoC requiresDec 13 20:20
oiaohmNo 90% of the global jurisdictions require what is in the Linux kernel CoC.Dec 13 20:20
MinceRthis planet would be a lot less shitty place to live on if humans finally got over their perverse law fetishism and obsession.Dec 13 20:20
oiaohmMostly has been spread around the world by trade agreements.Dec 13 20:21
oiaohmLinux kernel coc is fairly close to bare bones for doing business internationallyDec 13 20:22
oiaohmthat is most likely not a good thing.Dec 13 20:22
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Programming: GAction, Research on Developers, JavaBeans and Python []Dec 13 20:22
oiaohmas it really does not have the extra stuff to prevent abuse and miss use.Dec 13 20:22
schestowitz[20:22] <oiaohm> that is most likely not a good thing.Dec 13 20:23
schestowitzmaybe Linux should also buy weaponsDec 13 20:23
schestowitzas most countries do thatDec 13 20:23
MinceR?coorva :>Dec 13 20:23
MinceRoopsDec 13 20:23
MinceR:>Dec 13 20:23
schestowitzda. da.Dec 13 20:23
*schestowitz does not know a word in Hungarian except goulashDec 13 20:24
MinceRthat's not in hungarian though :>Dec 13 20:24
MinceRthe hungarian word would be "gulyás"Dec 13 20:25
XRevan86kurwa is PolishDec 13 20:25
schestowitzif I knew how to say face, I'd know what to call Viktor OrbanDec 13 20:25
XRevan86and the yes-word in Polish is takDec 13 20:26
MinceRyeah, that line was a search command i wanted to edit and then forgot aboutDec 13 20:26
MinceR(it was from another channel)Dec 13 20:26
oiaohmMinceR:    This map.  The red and yellow on here is where you don't need the Linux kernel CoC by law.   All the area in green technically need everything written in the Linux kernel CoC its only a question if the country will enforce their laws or not.Dec 13 20:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination - WikipediaDec 13 20:27
oiaohmMinceR: when you look at that map its over 90 percent of the earths land area.Dec 13 20:27
MinceRah, only racialDec 13 20:27
XRevan86 it appears no West Slavic language retained "da"Dec 13 20:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | Reconstruction:Proto-Slavic/da - WiktionaryDec 13 20:27
MinceRso when an SJW says "kill all males", that's totally acceptableDec 13 20:28
oiaohmMinceR: the convention class sexes as races.Dec 13 20:28
oiaohmMinceR: so "kill all males" is breach of that convention.Dec 13 20:29
MinceRmaybe the convention should learn a few things about biology, thenDec 13 20:29
MinceRalso, even if it's in violation of the law, they somehow don't get punished for itDec 13 20:30
oiaohmThat darkgreen on that map its in there laws but they are currently not enforcing it.Dec 13 20:31
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's leftovers []Dec 13 20:32
oiaohmOf course USA would be one of those places that has not been enforcing it and is now starting to change.Dec 13 20:32
MinceRbut only in ways that are convenient for SJWs and their rich, powerful corporate sponsorsDec 13 20:33
oiaohmThe area of earth you techically need something like the linux CoC to run conventions is a lot larger than most suspect.Dec 13 20:34
MinceRthere isn't much of a point to those conventions anywayDec 13 20:34
MinceRSJWs have made sure of thatDec 13 20:35
MinceRand microshit did tooDec 13 20:35
oiaohmRemember when you sign on visa to enter a country you will obey this stuff even if it not enforced.  If you get a prick of a boarder officer sees you been doing stuff in breach of that convetion they can send you home without trial.Dec 13 20:36
oiaohmIf you are a party running a conference the last thing you want todo is pay for air tickets for people who don't get in.Dec 13 20:37
DaemonFC[m]I entered to win a Mercedes.Dec 13 20:38
oiaohmMinceR: its not just SJW.    Lot of people have no clue how big the legal requirement is and how much of the earth is covered.   Because they don't see the laws being enforced.Dec 13 20:38
oiaohmHaving visa rejected really suxs.Dec 13 20:38
DaemonFC[m]I'd drive a free Mercedes until it was out of warranty and then sell it when it starts acting possessed 5 years later like any other German car.Dec 13 20:38
oiaohmParticularly after person has used flight.Dec 13 20:38
MinceRlolDec 13 20:38
oiaohmBoarder enforcement means no trials.Dec 13 20:39
MinceRdon't fly to shitholes?Dec 13 20:39
oiaohmAnd in most cases no media coverage.Dec 13 20:39
oiaohmMinceR: so 90 percent+ of the earth.Dec 13 20:39
oiaohmYou cannot fly to.Dec 13 20:39
MinceRwell yeah, there's this horrible human infestationDec 13 20:39
DaemonFC[m]Well, Trump is pushing judges to get people through in about 2 minutes.Dec 13 20:39
oiaohmMinceR: then look at the red and yellow areas.Dec 13 20:40
DaemonFC[m]So unless you can make your case in 120 seconds without a lawyer, good luck back in Mexico.Dec 13 20:40
oiaohmMinceR: those areas are horrible.Dec 13 20:40
MinceRDaemonFC[m]: on the bright side, dump is making mexico a nicer place to live in than usoniaDec 13 20:40
MinceRthe only way he knows how!Dec 13 20:40
DaemonFC[m]MinceR The new NAFTA actually does look a lot better for the US.Dec 13 20:41
oiaohmDaemonFC[m]: Australia visa rejection 15 min no judge.Dec 13 20:41
DaemonFC[m]Not that this was hard.Dec 13 20:41
oiaohmDaemonFC[m]: and possible not even allowed to say a single word in defense.Dec 13 20:41
DaemonFC[m]We didn't really make many concessions. The deal made Mexico and Canada give up way more than they gotDec 13 20:41
oiaohmSo 2 mins with a judge is being quite nice.Dec 13 20:41
DaemonFC[m]Trump did threaten to rip NAFTA up and walk away.Dec 13 20:42
DaemonFC[m]Which is exactly what I've always wanted.Dec 13 20:42
DaemonFC[m]Overall I don't approve of him, but he did make NAFTA a little better.Dec 13 20:42
DaemonFC[m]It was a terrible deal that was intended to screw American workers hard.Dec 13 20:43
DaemonFC[m]I saw an estimate that the new NAFTA will create 175,000 jobs in the US. The old one got rid of 3 million, so it's more correct to say the new one is less bad.Dec 13 20:43
DaemonFC[m]The impeachment isn't to get Trump out of office.Dec 13 20:44
DaemonFC[m]It's to tie up the Senate so they spend a whole month next yesr not getting anything done.Dec 13 20:45
DaemonFC[m]And then the Democrats can run against a president who was impeached.Dec 13 20:45
DaemonFC[m]Aftwr impeachment, the House Democrats can pass USMCA and force the Senate to deliberate and vote on that. Which will eat up a few weeks even under fast track.Dec 13 20:46
DaemonFC[m]So they won't get a lot else done until March.Dec 13 20:47
oiaohmSo the usa impeachment is not like the Australian one that is basically instant out.Dec 13 20:47
oiaohmMind you Australian equal to impeachment against the government general is a double way splat.Dec 13 20:47
DaemonFC[m]No, majority vote in the House impeaches the official.Dec 13 20:48
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Links 13/12/2019: QEMU 4.2.0, GNU Guile 2.9.7 []Dec 13 20:48
DaemonFC[m]Then they go to trial in the Senate, where it takes a super majority 67/100 voting to convict.Dec 13 20:48
oiaohmAs in you get rid of the governer general and you also go straight to election because senate and house are also booted.Dec 13 20:48
DaemonFC[m]So Trump will be the third president impeached but not removed.Dec 13 20:48
oiaohmOk your system lacks serous teeth.Dec 13 20:49
DaemonFC[m]Other federal officials have been removed before.Dec 13 20:49
DaemonFC[m]Mostly judges. And each chamber of Congress can remove their own members as they see fit in their rules.Dec 13 20:49
MinceRthe less the state can do the better off everybody else isDec 13 20:50
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Fedora Deciding Whether CD/DVD Installation Issues Should Still Hold Up Releases []Dec 13 20:50
oiaohmFun part in the Australian system is the governer general can nuke the house and senate on own as well at cost of his position.Dec 13 20:50
oiaohmBasically things have to be bad for it to be used here.Dec 13 20:51
schestowitzkaniini: pleroma srrves blank pages to older version of chromium, at least pleroma.siteDec 13 20:54
*schestowitz first noticed this 1-2 months agoDec 13 20:55
DaemonFC[m]I need to stop hitting the scroll up button in Riot.Dec 13 20:55
XRevan86schestowitz: Check it for JS errors in devtools then. I think that would be a lot more concrete.Dec 13 20:56
DaemonFC[m]Anyway, yeah, systemd is managing so many things now that it's impossible to figure out why odd behavior is going on in the operating system or what's even doing it.Dec 13 20:56
DaemonFC[m]It's got hundreds (I think) of binaries involved with it.Dec 13 20:56
MinceRit's actually easy to figure it outDec 13 20:56
DaemonFC[m]And even the non-systemd distributions end up using parts of it anyway to get other programs to work.Dec 13 20:57
MinceR1. get rid of systemdDec 13 20:57
MinceR2. try to reproduce issueDec 13 20:57
MinceR3. if it's no longer there, systemd was the causeDec 13 20:57
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: These Linux browsers are being banned from Google services []Dec 13 20:58
schestowitzMinceR: no, you use it wrong!!Dec 13 20:59
schestowitzI remember when LP blamed pulseaudio causing issues.... on packagersDec 13 20:59
XRevan864. ignore the possibility that the issue could indeed be between the display and the chair %)Dec 13 21:00
schestowitzI remember having to reboot maybe dozens of times per year due to pulseaudio stack getting ;jammed' a decade backDec 13 21:00
XRevan86(or in a faulty .service file)Dec 13 21:00
MinceRschestowitz: "You're holding it wrong"Dec 13 21:00
schestowitzon one machine, unless last year, I had to kill pulseaudio occasionally and let it  start itself again because it took 100% of the CPU nonstopDec 13 21:01
MinceRXRevan86: well, usually the cause of having systemd on the computer is between the display and the chairDec 13 21:01
schestowitzMinceR: I tried system with a bumperDec 13 21:01
MinceR:>Dec 13 21:01
MinceRyou should have used systemd-bumperdDec 13 21:01
XRevan86MinceR: All I can say to that is touchéDec 13 21:01
schestowitzin diapora alejandro calls it systemdickDec 13 21:01
MinceR:>Dec 13 21:01
MinceRdicks are actually usable and have a well defined range of functionalityDec 13 21:02
schestowitzbut if gnu/linux will improve they'll credit systemdDec 13 21:02
schestowitzeven for things that have nothing to do with it, like drivers elsewhere in the stackDec 13 21:02
XRevan86MinceR: Even Dick Nixon?Dec 13 21:02
MinceRwell no, but he's dead alreadyDec 13 21:03
MinceRand i suspect he was still more decent than his successorsDec 13 21:03
XRevan86ironic thatDec 13 21:03
schestowitz 13 21:03
-TechrightsBot-tr/ | Thousands of 'penis fish' wash onto California beach, shocking localsDec 13 21:03
XRevan86"shocking locals" – what did they say? "well, I'd never!" ?Dec 13 21:04
MinceR"don't tase me bro"Dec 13 21:05
schestowitzdon't taste, eitherDec 13 21:05
schestowitzanyway, that's today's newsDec 13 21:06
schestowitzRianne saw that earlier in the paperDec 13 21:06
schestowitzseems the reports about it are manyDec 13 21:06
DaemonFC[m]oiaohm: Impeachment is more political than a criminal proceeding.Dec 13 21:07
DaemonFC[m]In a criminal proceeding, the prosecutor will use anything you've ever done that they know about against you.Dec 13 21:07
MinceRbecause the laws don't apply to the presidentDec 13 21:07
DaemonFC[m]They're trying to chip away at your credibility, so the first time you go into court they don't really have anything to tell the judge except why you're there that day.Dec 13 21:08
MinceRwhich should tip people off that something heavily fucked up is going on, that they've been lied to about the functionality of the stateDec 13 21:08
MinceRbut people mostly don't careDec 13 21:08
DaemonFC[m]But as the list grows longer, yeah, they'll use all of it to make their case that you're just a no good pile of shit who has been there before and will probably be back.Dec 13 21:08
MinceRand they get ruled over by an institution that should be serving themDec 13 21:08
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Pi for Everyone and Everything []Dec 13 21:12
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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Wine 5.0's first release candidate []Dec 13 21:55
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux-on-Jetson SDR board gets major software upgrade []Dec 13 21:58
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DaemonFC[m]MinceR What? Charging people with what actually might have happened, giving them a day in court, and only being allowed to tall about why we're in court now?Dec 13 22:45
DaemonFC[m]Next you'll want a representative democracy!Dec 13 22:45
DaemonFC[m]Where does it stop?Dec 13 22:45
MinceR:>Dec 13 22:46
XRevan86 that explains itDec 13 22:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-xkcd: Brussels Sprouts Mandela EffectDec 13 22:47
MinceR:)Dec 13 22:50
XRevan86 and a third oneDec 13 23:16
DaemonFC[m]MinceR: By letting the state use character assassination instead of proving their case, it encourages weak cases based on "Look what happened 20 years ago." instead of why we're in court today.Dec 13 23:23
DaemonFC[m]In 2012, when my cousin's husband was in court in Indiana, the prosecutor was allowed to bring up a marijuana possession charge from 1989.Dec 13 23:23
DaemonFC[m]This is egregious. Dec 13 23:23
DaemonFC[m]I haven't seen a judge _ever_ go "Hey, wait a minute...".Dec 13 23:24
DaemonFC[m]If he had just gotten out of prison for a similar offense or something, maybe. Goes to behavior.Dec 13 23:24
XRevan86"and a third one" – from ReactOS this timeDec 13 23:26

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