Join us now at the IRC channel.
DaemonFC[m] | I liked Netsurf when I tried it in 2012. Now every site is a web app. Eww. | Jan 29 00:05 |
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DaemonFC[m] | Even the latest Netsurf couldn't render 30% of the sites I threw at it without major problems. | Jan 29 00:06 |
DaemonFC[m] | I managed to use old.reddit.com with it though. | Jan 29 00:06 |
DaemonFC[m] | Wikipedia and a few other sites work okay. | Jan 29 00:06 |
XRevan86 | DaemonFC[m]: Only 30%? Not bad. | Jan 29 00:06 |
DaemonFC[m] | The Javascript being on breaks things worse than leaving it off. | Jan 29 00:07 |
DaemonFC[m] | I liked Opera 12 and I'd probably try to keep using it if they had bumped Linux to support recent enough TLS. | Jan 29 00:08 |
DaemonFC[m] | Just Windows. | Jan 29 00:08 |
DaemonFC[m] | It was compatible enough to probably still work okay mostly. They were always a few years ahead of everyone else on web standards and proud of it. | Jan 29 00:09 |
DaemonFC[m] | I suppose in Wine is an option. | Jan 29 00:13 |
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: GNU Projects and Upcoming LibrePlanet http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133433 [https://pleroma.site/objects/52fbeddf-51d3-42ed-bd19-4ea8d5a049b8] | Jan 29 00:26 | |
DaemonFC[m] | They said they sent 12.18 out to Windows because the browser options for XP were drying up in 2016. | Jan 29 00:26 |
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133434 [https://pleroma.site/objects/dbd0eeec-3f8c-4e7d-b117-fdcec1d13993] | Jan 29 00:37 | |
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cubexyz | I think redhat used to have an rpm for xprint | Jan 29 01:37 |
cubexyz | can't recall using it though | Jan 29 01:37 |
cubexyz | I just use lp mostly, or print from kedit | Jan 29 01:38 |
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: iXsystems' TrueNAS & FreeNAS Hit 11.3 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133435 [https://pleroma.site/objects/c3f74f43-3c0a-48e2-adb0-1de5a54ba159] | Jan 29 02:01 | |
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DaemonFC[m] | Was there any good reason for requiring XP SP3 on some applications near the end? I mean, I suppose it was a good idea to have it, but it didn't make many changes to the OS. | Jan 29 02:15 |
DaemonFC[m] | Xprint was dropped from X years ago. | Jan 29 02:22 |
oiaohm | DaemonFC[m]: https://www.computerworld.com/article/2537429/windows-xp-sp3--the-improvements-are-under-the-hood.html Windows XP sp3 was the start of being able to install windows without a product key. | Jan 29 02:23 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Windows XP SP3: The improvements are under the hood | Computerworld | Jan 29 02:23 | |
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Open Hardware/Modding: Arduino IDE, Raspberry Pi and PocketPCR http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133436 [https://pleroma.site/objects/7a36ba4d-30cd-4771-befa-3e2086fd7d75] | Jan 29 02:23 | |
DaemonFC[m] | The web browser situation on XP actually went downhill way faster than it did on Windows 98 or 2000. | Jan 29 02:29 |
DaemonFC[m] | Windows 98 with Kernelex can actually run Firefox 8, if you didn't mind the bookmarks not working. | Jan 29 02:30 |
DaemonFC[m] | Eveb though I think Mozilla dropped support for XP when Firefox 3 came out. | Jan 29 02:30 |
DaemonFC[m] | No, I was wrong. Firefox 9.0.1 works on Windows 98 with Kernelex. | Jan 29 02:32 |
DaemonFC[m] | Firefox 10 works on Windows 98 but might freeze if you don't disable the updater. | Jan 29 02:40 |
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Latest in GNU/Linux-Chromebook Integration (Crostini) http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133437 [https://pleroma.site/objects/bd0ee87c-125d-4b34-9eb2-9d5770824b1b] | Jan 29 02:41 | |
DaemonFC[m] | Firefox 11 works, but there's rendering glitches. Firefox 12 freezes after a few second. | Jan 29 02:41 |
DaemonFC[m] | Firefox 13 has an error in msvcr100.dll and doesn't start. | Jan 29 02:42 |
oiaohm | https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Sony-HID-Official-But-Clones this one is fun. | Jan 29 02:42 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Sony Now "Officially" Maintaining The Linux PlayStation Input Driver, But Leads To Interesting Problem - Phoronix | Jan 29 02:43 | |
oiaohm | Its not the only time a problem like this comes up in the Linux kernel. | Jan 29 02:43 |
DaemonFC[m] | Firefox 10 was an ESR though. | Jan 29 02:43 |
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux on AMD: Audio Issue Tackled and AMD Zen 3 CPU Support http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133438 [https://pleroma.site/objects/1c9df139-5307-4d48-8f43-b1c3a3dd988b] | Jan 29 02:45 | |
vortigrex | yet another aspect of Linux being captured by hostile corporations | Jan 29 02:45 |
oiaohm | DaemonFC[m]: redhat keeps xprint around as a independant package for horrible legacy applications. Good part was xprint using applications did not demard that xprint was the graphical server part of X11. So you could run two as crash containment. | Jan 29 02:45 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: that problem does turn up on freebsd as well from time to time. | Jan 29 02:45 |
vortigrex | yeah, but nobody uses freebsd anyway | Jan 29 02:46 |
oiaohm | the disputes on the Linux side are fairly minor. | Jan 29 02:47 |
oiaohm | compared to https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/10/windows-update-drivers-bricking-usb-serial-chips-beloved-of-hardware-hackers/ | Jan 29 02:47 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-arstechnica.com | Windows Update drivers bricking USB serial chips beloved of hardware hackers | Ars Technica | Jan 29 02:47 | |
vortigrex | for now | Jan 29 02:47 |
oiaohm | Bricking devices is not tollated part of Linux mainline process. | Jan 29 02:47 |
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Red Hat vs. SUSE vs. Canonical Contributions To The Mainline Linux Kernel Over The 2010s http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133439 [https://pleroma.site/objects/b138191d-ac5c-480f-8437-7e02ae65d56d] | Jan 29 02:48 | |
oiaohm | Refusing to support can fly at times. | Jan 29 02:48 |
vortigrex | until some important sponsor of the Microsoft Linux Foundation wants it to be | Jan 29 02:48 |
oiaohm | Does not work that way. | Jan 29 02:48 |
vortigrex | sure, there might be some extra steps | Jan 29 02:48 |
vortigrex | like an alleged CoC violation | Jan 29 02:48 |
oiaohm | Reason why bricking is forbid on Linux side is simple. If you design somethign to brick something are you sure you will not brick your own stuff. | Jan 29 02:49 |
vortigrex | but you know there are many people who aren't nearly that careful | Jan 29 02:49 |
oiaohm | Yes there is a historic example where someone made a patch to attempt to brick something and the result was they bricked their own hardware as well. | Jan 29 02:49 |
oiaohm | Of course the patch never got mainlined. | Jan 29 02:50 |
vortigrex | yeah, but things are changing | Jan 29 02:50 |
oiaohm | Not really. | Jan 29 02:50 |
oiaohm | Lot of this core logic does not change. | Jan 29 02:50 |
oiaohm | Linux kernel has enough issues dealing with quirks without intentionally adding stuff that does bad things. | Jan 29 02:51 |
vortigrex | again, this only matters to reasonable people | Jan 29 02:51 |
oiaohm | It matters to Microsoft. | Jan 29 02:52 |
oiaohm | You think someone add something that bricks something and Microsoft running some custom hardware in Azure and it gets nuked in the process. | Jan 29 02:52 |
vortigrex | microsoft is the last entity you should trust when maintaining a kernel, especially one they want to destroy | Jan 29 02:52 |
oiaohm | Microsoft is to the point they destory the Linux kernel they destory their operations. | Jan 29 02:53 |
vortigrex | they might not care | Jan 29 02:53 |
vortigrex | but even if they do, they're incompetent | Jan 29 02:54 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: https://www.computerworld.com/article/3444499/microsoft-android-phone.html <<Who 10 years ago would think that Microsoft would be attempting to get into the phone market with a android device. | Jan 29 02:54 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-9 critical questions about Microsoft's first Android phone | Computerworld | Jan 29 02:54 | |
oiaohm | with a Linux kernel. | Jan 29 02:54 |
oiaohm | Microsoft is not the threat they use to be. | Jan 29 02:54 |
oiaohm | Because they are coming highly dependant on Linux working. | Jan 29 02:54 |
vortigrex | and even if they were competent, their organization is still set up so that their departments work against each other | Jan 29 02:54 |
vortigrex | they were highly dependent on windows working | Jan 29 02:55 |
vortigrex | did windows ever work? no. | Jan 29 02:55 |
oiaohm | Of course Microsoft is going to fight tooth and nail to prevent Linux getting a desktop footprint in volume. | Jan 29 02:55 |
oiaohm | But breaking the Linux kernel it self would do Microsoft massive harm. | Jan 29 02:55 |
oiaohm | We have a MAD location for Microsoft at the moment. | Jan 29 02:55 |
oiaohm | As in that Microsoft wants to attempt to destory Linux in particular areas yet doing so they can destory themselves in other areas really badly. | Jan 29 02:56 |
DaemonFC[m] | Buy a Nintendo Switch Pro controller. The $20 PowerA one works, unlike the knockoff xbox 360 PowerA controller. | Jan 29 02:56 |
vortigrex | yeah, but MAD only works properly with reasonable people | Jan 29 02:57 |
vortigrex | it doesn't work with an evil corporation of crazy incompetent people | Jan 29 02:57 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: fun fact for the past 20 years when you get windows updates they are in fact hosted on Linux servers. | Jan 29 02:57 |
DaemonFC[m] | "Though I must say with my Sony hat on, I don't really like supporting clone devices (they hijack our device ids.. etcetera) and we support hid-sony in an official capacity now across various devices. Though this change all relates to PS3 generation, which is not that important anymore so it shouldn't matter that much." | Jan 29 02:58 |
vortigrex | and it doesn't work with religious fanatics who believe that if everyone dies, they go to Heaven and their enemies go to Hell | Jan 29 02:58 |
DaemonFC[m] | We at Sony want our customers to feel raped without lubrication, but since the PS3 is so old we're not selling those anymore, who cares? | Jan 29 02:58 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: when I say serousally break themselves badly. I mean Microsoft lets the Linux kernel be broken and the result could be their complete operation grinds to a halt. | Jan 29 02:58 |
vortigrex | and who will notice that? | Jan 29 02:58 |
oiaohm | Microsoft investors. | Jan 29 02:59 |
vortigrex | "wow, windows broke again. like that doesn't happen every week!" | Jan 29 02:59 |
vortigrex | microsoft investors are banking on the same thing microsoft itself is | Jan 29 02:59 |
DaemonFC[m] | vortigrex did I translate that from Sony properly? | Jan 29 02:59 |
oiaohm | Think about it failing to send out enterprise billing. | Jan 29 02:59 |
vortigrex | the leverage they have and people being idiots | Jan 29 02:59 |
vortigrex | they're probably used to working around that by now | Jan 29 02:59 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: serousally Linux goes down 80 percent of Microsoft income would go by by due to their current level of dependancy. | Jan 29 03:00 |
vortigrex | DaemonFC[m]: yeah, pretty much | Jan 29 03:00 |
vortigrex | oiaohm: sounds unlikely | Jan 29 03:00 |
DaemonFC[m] | They hate clone controllers because they like selling $80 controllers, and if they support clones, they lose out to a $20 controller that's just as good. | Jan 29 03:00 |
vortigrex | for example, "PC" sales and the microsoft tax would be unaffected | Jan 29 03:00 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: the billing of that goes back though Linux servers from the OEM vendors. | Jan 29 03:01 |
vortigrex | corporations paying microsoft regular fees for unusable bullshit like office365 would be unaffected because IT people who are microsoft cultists are in charge of those | Jan 29 03:01 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: billing office 365 is also Linux servers. | Jan 29 03:01 |
DaemonFC[m] | Actually, you can buy Windows 10 PCs for $200 or $300 and get a decent laptop. Nuke Windows. | Jan 29 03:01 |
vortigrex | billing can still be done on paper | Jan 29 03:01 |
DaemonFC[m] | Subsidized by mass production and a ton of shovelware that gets deleted anyway. | Jan 29 03:01 |
vortigrex | DaemonFC[m]: yes, and by then you've paid for Backdoors10 | Jan 29 03:01 |
vortigrex | and microsoft is laughing to the bank | Jan 29 03:02 |
DaemonFC[m] | No, the shovelware people did. | Jan 29 03:02 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: no they don't have paper processing of that any more they went paperless 15 years ago. | Jan 29 03:02 |
vortigrex | and then using some of that money to buy laws that take away some more of your freedoms | Jan 29 03:02 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: lets just say Microsoft is well and truly over the barrel. | Jan 29 03:02 |
vortigrex | oiaohm: then they'll buy a brand new laptop with whatever on and retry on that | Jan 29 03:03 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: how is your product activation going to work thinking that is Linux servers as well. | Jan 29 03:03 |
vortigrex | people will just get used to not being able to change the wallpaper | Jan 29 03:04 |
vortigrex | or they'll have people do it on the phone | Jan 29 03:04 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: Microsoft is using Linux based phone exchanges. So phone lines dead to Microsoft. | Jan 29 03:04 |
oiaohm | This is a level of screwed of the insane. | Jan 29 03:05 |
oiaohm | Part of the reason why Microsoft started saying they loved Linux was to make it clear to their staff they need to be careful going after Linux usage because they depend on a hell load of Linux to exist. | Jan 29 03:05 |
vortigrex | most of the changes we're talking about aren't going to brick every system running Linux | Jan 29 03:06 |
vortigrex | also, they could replace their PBX system in a hurry if their income depended on it (and it can) | Jan 29 03:07 |
vortigrex | they still have tons of (ill-gotten) money so they can just throw money at such problems | Jan 29 03:08 |
oiaohm | That usb serial one rendered many cheap switches Microsoft was using in Azure at the time useless. | Jan 29 03:08 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: Microsoft with the skype for business server does attempt to make their own PBX but its not reliable enough for their own usage. That really should not surprise most people. | Jan 29 03:12 |
vortigrex | indeed | Jan 29 03:12 |
oiaohm | So its not a problem that throwing money at it fixes. | Jan 29 03:12 |
DaemonFC[m] | I've already exposed a couple of nasty tricks meant to make Linux look broken. | Jan 29 03:12 |
DaemonFC[m] | And fought to give them a PR black eye and some legal troubles if they didn't fix them. | Jan 29 03:12 |
DaemonFC[m] | The Lenovo one was much nastier because you couldn't even install Linux distributions on the laptops. | Jan 29 03:13 |
vortigrex | they might not know that though -- they're used to "fixing" problems by throwing money at them successfully | Jan 29 03:14 |
vortigrex | they throwed money at the Linux Foundation, and now it's theirs | Jan 29 03:14 |
vortigrex | and it can fire people from the project | Jan 29 03:14 |
vortigrex | and Linus is doing what they want him to do | Jan 29 03:15 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: what gives you that idea. IBM, HP and many others would also love to aquire Linus | Jan 29 03:15 |
oiaohm | The Linux foundation is quite a hostile place of greed. | Jan 29 03:16 |
oiaohm | Microsoft might seam powerful but compared to all the parties in their Microsoft is quite weak. | Jan 29 03:16 |
DaemonFC[m] | The Foxconn BIOS bug was strangely patched in Windows 3 years before they started shipping the affected hardware. | Jan 29 03:16 |
oiaohm | DaemonFC[m]: because the BUG came from the Microsoft ACPI testsuite. | Jan 29 03:17 |
vortigrex | well, for example, there's 1 party in there that decides what boots on your UEFI "PC" | Jan 29 03:17 |
vortigrex | it's microsoft. | Jan 29 03:17 |
vortigrex | and there's 1 party in there that bragged about being the one who forced the CoC on them | Jan 29 03:17 |
vortigrex | that one is microsoft too! | Jan 29 03:18 |
vortigrex | IBM loves microsoft, HP loves microsoft | Jan 29 03:18 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: where do you get that one Microsoft braged about CoC. | Jan 29 03:18 |
vortigrex | https://mobile.twitter.com/geo_walters/status/1041493985171316737 | Jan 29 03:18 |
oiaohm | IBM hates Microsoft at core because Microsoft will not support IBM power platform. | Jan 29 03:18 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-mobile.twitter.com | Twitter | Jan 29 03:18 | |
vortigrex | so why did they buy the company that paid microsoft to sign their bootloader stub and replicated a lot of design flaws in windows because it "modern" and proceeded to force it on a lot of people who didn't want it, and then just let them keep doing everything they've been doing before? | Jan 29 03:19 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: Microsoft code of conduct is nothing like the Linux kernel code of conduct. | Jan 29 03:20 |
vortigrex | and why are they assisting to microsoft's schemes against Linux users via the OIN? | Jan 29 03:20 |
oiaohm | IBM made OIN | Jan 29 03:21 |
vortigrex | yes they did | Jan 29 03:21 |
oiaohm | IBM still basically control OIN and I have not seen Microsoft be able to use the OIN. | Jan 29 03:21 |
oiaohm | against Linux users. | Jan 29 03:21 |
oiaohm | IBM make OIN restricted so IBM could still use their patents. | Jan 29 03:22 |
oiaohm | Basically don't underestament IBM own means to be Evil alone. | Jan 29 03:22 |
vortigrex | i don't | Jan 29 03:23 |
vortigrex | i'm pointing out that they're cronies with microsoft, possibly more than ever | Jan 29 03:23 |
oiaohm | Really no IBM and Microsoft basically don't get along. At times their indvidual objectives aline. | Jan 29 03:25 |
vortigrex | well sure, ibm did some actual things sometime in the past | Jan 29 03:25 |
vortigrex | before they sold off most of the company :> | Jan 29 03:25 |
oiaohm | So IBM is never a cronies with Microsoft. That goes back to when Microsoft backstab IBM and IBM has a standing policy don't trust Microsoft. | Jan 29 03:25 |
DaemonFC[m] | I would think IBM would still be bitter over all that money they wasted on OS/2 after Microsoft fucked them good on that. | Jan 29 03:25 |
DaemonFC[m] | Maybe 20 years is long enough to forget. | Jan 29 03:25 |
oiaohm | Not even close DaemonFC[m] | Jan 29 03:26 |
vortigrex | then they became official card-carrying apple shills | Jan 29 03:26 |
vortigrex | then they bought red hat and had it function the same as before | Jan 29 03:26 |
oiaohm | Apple also doubled crossed IBM> | Jan 29 03:26 |
vortigrex | DaemonFC[m]: i suspect the people responsible don't work there anymore | Jan 29 03:26 |
oiaohm | IBM is one company you can bet is doing their actions by their own choices. | Jan 29 03:26 |
vortigrex | and they probably don't even know what they're doing | Jan 29 03:27 |
oiaohm | Those choices may not be what we want with IBM. | Jan 29 03:27 |
vortigrex | they certainly aren't | Jan 29 03:27 |
oiaohm | This is the problem a lot of people want to see Microsoft as the leader with a lot of cronies following them. In the Linux foundation this is basically not the case. | Jan 29 03:28 |
oiaohm | Linux foundation stack of different evil companies working with each other. | Jan 29 03:29 |
oiaohm | who at times evil ideas aline. | Jan 29 03:29 |
vortigrex | and microsoft probably still threatens HP with hiking license prices if they do something microsoft doesn't like | Jan 29 03:29 |
vortigrex | and HP loves it | Jan 29 03:30 |
oiaohm | Microsoft did once. HP responded by saying hey we don't need to make any windows server supporting hardware. | Jan 29 03:31 |
oiaohm | That is how Microsoft really kicked their windows server market in the nuts. | Jan 29 03:31 |
DaemonFC[m] | Lol | Jan 29 03:31 |
vortigrex | well, apparently HP also didn't need to make any laptops that support anything other than windows | Jan 29 03:31 |
DaemonFC[m] | HP barely survived Carly Fiorina. | Jan 29 03:31 |
vortigrex | judging by the one i used at the last place | Jan 29 03:31 |
DaemonFC[m] | I was shocked that she ran for president, and that we ended up getting someone far less qualified. | Jan 29 03:32 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: I have been at a Linux conference sitting next to the head of HP research and development. I asked him the direct question why do you desktops and laptops have windows on them. His answer was it cheaper that way we are not paying for windows in fact malware we put on there is paying for windows and about 50 to 100USD more. | Jan 29 03:33 |
vortigrex | and the users are paying for it in time, stress and lost neurons | Jan 29 03:34 |
DaemonFC[m] | My last HP laptop, actually a post merger Compaq, was so horrible. | Jan 29 03:34 |
vortigrex | but who cares? they were stupid enough to buy from HP | Jan 29 03:34 |
vortigrex | they deserve it. | Jan 29 03:34 |
DaemonFC[m] | It was like tla Yugo that wouldn't die. | Jan 29 03:34 |
DaemonFC[m] | Like a | Jan 29 03:34 |
oiaohm | So to sell a Linux laptop HP has to sell it at a higher price that they don't think people would buy. | Jan 29 03:34 |
vortigrex | there's such a Yugo? | Jan 29 03:34 |
vortigrex | also, wouldn't the malware people pay for all that even if the laptop did have working Legacy Boot for example? | Jan 29 03:35 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: that was the problem when Microsoft suggested lifting price they were cutting into HP profit margin from the malware. | Jan 29 03:35 |
*danielp3344 still wants a yugo | Jan 29 03:35 | |
DaemonFC[m] | Yeah, it was underpowered, it heated up like a furnace, they said it was Vista compatible and then didn't release any Vista drivers, but sent me a Vista disc for it. | Jan 29 03:35 |
vortigrex | ah, those lucky people who didn't have to deal with eastern bloc excuses for cars in their lives... | Jan 29 03:36 |
DaemonFC[m] | The touchpad malfunctioned and they fixed it, but their courier told me to meet him at Wendy's. | Jan 29 03:36 |
danielp3344 | vortigrex: I really want one | Jan 29 03:36 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: remember when Microsoft wanted todo the signature line of laptops from vendors and all the vendors were like if you want that the price of laptop has to go up by at least 100 USD even if the licenses on those machines from you are free Microsoft. | Jan 29 03:36 |
danielp3344 | Just so I can cram 800hp into it and make fun of muscle cars | Jan 29 03:36 |
DaemonFC[m] | Yeah, my Yoga 900 was a Signature laptop. | Jan 29 03:37 |
vortigrex | yeah, i remember that one | Jan 29 03:37 |
vortigrex | extra cost, extra special shitty hardware | Jan 29 03:37 |
vortigrex | what a deal! | Jan 29 03:37 |
DaemonFC[m] | It was on a back to school sale so they knocked $150 off what everyone else was charging. Then I founf out they did a mid year refresh with a hardware upgrade and the new one didn't run Linux like the one in the blog I was reading did. | Jan 29 03:38 |
oiaohm | Cut conners on the Signature laptop due to not being malware funded. | Jan 29 03:38 |
oiaohm | The sick world we live in. | Jan 29 03:38 |
oiaohm | Where you cannot by a malware free laptop simply because it not cost effective. | Jan 29 03:39 |
vortigrex | well, there's also that little issue that windows itself is malware | Jan 29 03:40 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: remember what I said the Linux foundation is made of companies with different of evil/greed. HP form of greed is different to the Microsoft one. | Jan 29 03:40 |
vortigrex | spyware, built-in keylogger, mandatory "updates" and reboots... | Jan 29 03:40 |
oiaohm | vortigrex: except windows is malware where the party providing it expect you to pay them instead of them paying you as a hardware vendor. | Jan 29 03:40 |
vortigrex | sweet deal for them | Jan 29 03:41 |
oiaohm | Windows only flys with hardware vendors as much as it does because third parties malware who pay them money depend on Windows to work. | Jan 29 03:41 |
oiaohm | I have said this one and it caused outrage. One way for Linux to take over the desktop is come malware compadible so vendors can make more money installing Linux than Installing windows. | Jan 29 03:42 |
oiaohm | Yes the greed of hardware vendors is horrible. | Jan 29 03:42 |
oiaohm | Please note form of greed for malware paying them extends to like android phone makers... Lots and lots of hardware vendors. | Jan 29 03:43 |
vortigrex | that one's already done | Jan 29 03:43 |
vortigrex | most distros already ship with malware, it's called "systemd" | Jan 29 03:43 |
oiaohm | systemd does not meet the define of malware | Jan 29 03:53 |
oiaohm | Also its not selling you to make a profit to pay for it presence. | Jan 29 03:53 |
vortigrex | it's apparently profitable enough for ibm somehow | Jan 29 03:54 |
vortigrex | you know, i'd probably buy the "not malware" part if it was just atrociously designed and full of bugs | Jan 29 03:54 |
vortigrex | but the thing is, they've compromised organizations to try and force it on my equipment | Jan 29 03:55 |
vortigrex | i think we can rule out negligence here | Jan 29 03:55 |
oiaohm | Really what was being used before systemd was also full of bugs. | Jan 29 03:55 |
*vortigrex yawns | Jan 29 03:55 | |
vortigrex | you can skip the infomercial, i'm not buying systemd | Jan 29 03:55 |
oiaohm | Thing is for redhat now IBM. Systemd has in fact reduced deployed system issues. | Jan 29 03:55 |
vortigrex | in your dreams maybe | Jan 29 03:56 |
oiaohm | Redhat/IBM support contracts they make more money that way. | Jan 29 03:56 |
vortigrex | of course | Jan 29 03:56 |
oiaohm | Redhat and IBM have the stats on it. | Jan 29 03:56 |
vortigrex | it's easier to make more money with support contracts when nobody else can understand the code your clients are running | Jan 29 03:56 |
oiaohm | There were a list of common issues that were coming from badly made scripts in the init system. | Jan 29 03:57 |
oiaohm | So its not exactly what you are saying. | Jan 29 03:57 |
oiaohm | I am not saying that systemd is perfect. | Jan 29 03:58 |
oiaohm | But what was before systemd was no where near perfect either. | Jan 29 03:58 |
vortigrex | you're merely pretending that a few edge cases almost nobody encountered with sysvinit outweigh massive bugs in systemd that regularly break systems | Jan 29 03:58 |
oiaohm | There rare edge cases in your big data centers were daily/hourly problems. | Jan 29 03:59 |
oiaohm | Systemd managed to cure those. | Jan 29 03:59 |
vortigrex | things like "oh no, PIDs can be reused!" vs the systemd developers themselves admitting that the sacred cgroups technology can not reliably do what they were selling it as doing | Jan 29 03:59 |
oiaohm | PID reuse time in highly loaded data centers is less than a second. | Jan 29 04:00 |
vortigrex | then what sort of problem is ubuntu booting into emergency mode on a hidden vc _every_ _single_ _time_? a millisecondly problem? | Jan 29 04:00 |
oiaohm | The lag between getting the PID and sending kill command at least once per day is over 5 seconds. | Jan 29 04:00 |
vortigrex | what sort of problem is systemd failing to shutdown if the NFS server isn't reachable? an every second problem? | Jan 29 04:00 |
vortigrex | yeah, maybe if you're running systemd and gnome | Jan 29 04:00 |
oiaohm | NFS is normally clustered in the data center. So they did not test for that failing early on because in the data centre that did not happen. | Jan 29 04:01 |
oiaohm | systemd was designed first to fix the datacentre problems. | Jan 29 04:02 |
vortigrex | what sort of problem is a laptop failing to boot without a network connection? | Jan 29 04:02 |
vortigrex | and who the hell uses multiseat in a datacenter? | Jan 29 04:02 |
oiaohm | multiseat is in fact used in the datacenter for multi people working on a problem at once. | Jan 29 04:03 |
vortigrex | lol | Jan 29 04:03 |
vortigrex | they haven't heard of SSH and serial console yet? | Jan 29 04:03 |
oiaohm | You have to remember there have been SSH exploiting malware. | Jan 29 04:04 |
vortigrex | and let me guess, they also need to use audio and webcams while they're at it | Jan 29 04:04 |
vortigrex | because nobody told them it was a server they were supposed to fix | Jan 29 04:04 |
vortigrex | or maybe this is some sort of mythical datacenter that consists of multimedia desktop machines? | Jan 29 04:04 |
oiaohm | audio is a funny one. https://www.ontrack.com/blog/2017/01/10/loud-noise-data-loss/ | Jan 29 04:05 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.ontrack.com | Beware: Loud Noise Can Cause Data Loss on Hard Drives | Jan 29 04:05 | |
oiaohm | So yes you do find mics at times in data centres monitoring background noise levels. | Jan 29 04:06 |
vortigrex | but not plugged into the servers doing other things | Jan 29 04:06 |
vortigrex | and not used by whichever user happens to be logged into a GUI | Jan 29 04:06 |
oiaohm | It still can be a server in rack. | Jan 29 04:06 |
vortigrex | (and what are they doing with GUIs on a server anyway?) | Jan 29 04:06 |
oiaohm | Normally GUI would be hooked up to a rack that had been pulled out and isolated due to infection. | Jan 29 04:07 |
vortigrex | what for? | Jan 29 04:07 |
oiaohm | Forensics. | Jan 29 04:07 |
vortigrex | what are these people who can't work with serial terminals doing in a data center? | Jan 29 04:07 |
oiaohm | So you can id the infection and hopefully prevent more. | Jan 29 04:08 |
oiaohm | serial terminals are slow compared to direct terminals. | Jan 29 04:08 |
vortigrex | oh yeah, they create GUIs in Visual Basic to id the infection! | Jan 29 04:08 |
oiaohm | Remember infection you can be racing the clock. | Jan 29 04:08 |
vortigrex | it looks just like in the movies. | Jan 29 04:08 |
oiaohm | Not visual basic its normally python. | Jan 29 04:08 |
oiaohm | historically perl. | Jan 29 04:08 |
oiaohm | That a horrible conecpt making a X11 application using perl. | Jan 29 04:09 |
vortigrex | i've seen worse | Jan 29 04:09 |
vortigrex | much worse | Jan 29 04:09 |
vortigrex | like building a GUI where you have to specify with coordinates where each widget goes and how wide and tall it must be | Jan 29 04:09 |
vortigrex | because the GUI toolkit can't figure it out by itself | Jan 29 04:09 |
vortigrex | and can't arrange the widgets | Jan 29 04:09 |
vortigrex | it's called "microsoft windows" | Jan 29 04:09 |
oiaohm | Windows Script Host gives you the option to use HTML. | Jan 29 04:12 |
oiaohm | Bad HTML but still better than raw X11. | Jan 29 04:12 |
vortigrex | or you could use just about any toolkit that was not made by microsoft | Jan 29 04:13 |
vortigrex | (dunno how broken macos is in this regard though) | Jan 29 04:13 |
oiaohm | Worse | Jan 29 04:13 |
vortigrex | still, GTK+, Qt, Tk, Swing do this properly | Jan 29 04:14 |
vortigrex | iirc so do AWT and SWT | Jan 29 04:14 |
vortigrex | haven't really looked into others | Jan 29 04:14 |
oiaohm | macos will at times straight up say I will auto align stuff. then you do that and it decides 1 in 20 load of the program to just stack everything straight on top of each other. | Jan 29 04:14 |
vortigrex | :) | Jan 29 04:14 |
oiaohm | So you click and you it ok and cancel at the same time and it runs both code paths. | Jan 29 04:14 |
oiaohm | How can you say well and truly upset results. | Jan 29 04:15 |
oiaohm | You would expect to choose either the ok or cancel buttons not run both buttons with no locking. | Jan 29 04:15 |
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DaemonFC[m] | I'm surprised to see the commit count from Canonical to the kernel going way up. | Jan 29 04:54 |
DaemonFC[m] | About 10 years ago, they weren't doing a hell of a lot. They said they were attracting users to open source. | Jan 29 04:55 |
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schestowitz | Klem_von_Met: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/microsofts-mixed-reality-goggles-take-marina-abramovi%C4%87-on-a-world-tour/ar-BBZnLmo | Jan 29 07:04 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.msn.com | Microsoft’s ‘Mixed Reality’ Goggles Take Marina Abramović on a World Tour | Jan 29 07:04 | |
schestowitz | someone sent this to me | Jan 29 07:04 |
schestowitz | fine marketing by Microsoft | Jan 29 07:04 |
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DaemonFC[m] | Samsung Chromebook 3 -Yes or no? | Jan 29 07:23 |
DaemonFC[m] | Mandy needs something to replace that Macbook that time forgot. | Jan 29 07:23 |
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scientes | https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc4042 | Jan 29 12:25 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-tools.ietf.org | RFC 4042 - UTF-9 and UTF-18 Efficient Transformation Formats of Unicode | Jan 29 12:25 | |
oiaohm | scientes: I guess you noted the date on that one. | Jan 29 12:51 |
oiaohm | scientes: https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2549 the start of that tradition on RFC. | Jan 29 12:52 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-tools.ietf.org | RFC 2549 - IP over Avian Carriers with Quality of Service | Jan 29 12:52 | |
oiaohm | scientes: sorry I was off by 2 https://www.rfc-archive.org/1+april+rfc | Jan 29 12:54 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.rfc-archive.org | The RFC Archive - All IETF RFCs, Internet Protocol Standards, Draft Standards, and Best Current Practices | Jan 29 12:54 | |
oiaohm | scientes: https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2324 One of the best out the 1 of april rfcs | Jan 29 12:58 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-tools.ietf.org | RFC 2324 - Hyper Text Coffee Pot Control Protocol (HTCPCP/1.0) | Jan 29 12:58 | |
scientes | > | Jan 29 12:59 |
scientes | 2.3.2 418 I'm a teapot | Jan 29 12:59 |
scientes | > The resulting entity body MAY be short and | Jan 29 12:59 |
scientes | stout. | Jan 29 12:59 |
scientes | https://www.rfc-archive.org/getrfc?rfc=5242&tag=A-Generalized-Unified-Character-Code--Western-European-and-CJK-Sections | Jan 29 13:03 |
scientes | oh god, this is painful | Jan 29 13:03 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.rfc-archive.org | RFC 5242: A Generalized Unified Character Code: Western European and CJK Sections - The RFC Archive | Jan 29 13:03 | |
scientes | o Symbols consisting of multiple marks are always constructed from | Jan 29 13:04 |
scientes | combining characters and positional modifiers; thus, the "i" | Jan 29 13:04 |
scientes | character is constructed from the vertical line symbol followed by | Jan 29 13:04 |
scientes | a combining dot above. Similarly "f" is composed of a centered | Jan 29 13:04 |
scientes | vertical line, a right hook in the top position, and an | Jan 29 13:04 |
scientes | appropriately-positioned composing hyphen. | Jan 29 13:04 |
scientes | Questions to, and contributions for, this coding system should be | Jan 29 13:04 |
scientes | addressed to the mailing list | Jan 29 13:04 |
scientes | unified-ccs@xn--iwem3b1f.xn--90ase1a.bogus.domain.name. | Jan 29 13:04 |
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XRevan86 | https://openwall.com/lists/oss-security/2020/01/28/3 | Jan 29 13:24 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.openwall.com | oss-security - LPE and RCE in OpenSMTPD (CVE-2020-7247) | Jan 29 13:24 | |
XRevan86 | root RCE in OpenSMTPD | Jan 29 13:25 |
scientes | XRevan86, nice | Jan 29 13:25 |
scientes | kinda blows a hole in OpenSSH's security bullclaims | Jan 29 13:25 |
oiaohm | scientes: ?? that not about openssh. I think someone need to read a little closer. | Jan 29 13:26 |
scientes | I meant OpenBSD | Jan 29 13:26 |
scientes | they will have to update their web site | Jan 29 13:27 |
oiaohm | Its been bull like for ever. | Jan 29 13:27 |
scientes | I mean like that e-mail shows they getting root terminal over nc | Jan 29 13:27 |
scientes | its...like...super easy | Jan 29 13:27 |
oiaohm | sel4 is really one the the rare ones that can claim proper security. | Jan 29 13:28 |
XRevan86 | They've reinvented postfix for minor licensing issues, and that's what they got | Jan 29 13:28 |
scientes | postfix is great | Jan 29 13:28 |
oiaohm | postfix have had it security disasters. | Jan 29 13:28 |
scientes | MAIL FROM:<;sleep 66;> | Jan 29 13:28 |
scientes | RCPT TO:<root> | Jan 29 13:28 |
XRevan86 | oiaohm: I'm only using it since 2013, not on my memory | Jan 29 13:29 |
oiaohm | XRevan86: the remote disaster with postfix was 2012 full remote exploit. | Jan 29 13:30 |
oiaohm | Still I would love to see more items be proper audited code. | Jan 29 13:31 |
scientes | oiaohm, or proven code? | Jan 29 13:31 |
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XRevan86 | oiaohm: Can't find it | Jan 29 13:32 |
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XRevan86 | https://cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list.php?vendor_id=8450 looking here | Jan 29 13:32 |
oiaohm | scientes: sel4 mathematical proof validation like stuff level for proper audit I mean. | Jan 29 13:32 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.cvedetails.com | Postfix : Security vulnerabilities | Jan 29 13:32 | |
oiaohm | XRevan86: Sorry I was thinking year of cleaning up not year of CVE. https://www.cvedetails.com/cve/CVE-2011-1720/ | Jan 29 13:35 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.cvedetails.com | CVE-2011-1720 : The SMTP server in Postfix before 2.5.13, 2.6.x before 2.6.10, 2.7.x before 2.7.4, and 2.8.x before 2.8.3, when certain | Jan 29 13:35 | |
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XRevan86 | > does not affect Postfix SMTP servers that use Dovecot SASL authentication | Jan 29 13:36 |
XRevan86 | oiaohm: I wouldn't call that a disaster. | Jan 29 13:37 |
oiaohm | XRevan86: the possible claim of allowing remote code to execute is turns out not just to be possbile but a handful of infections in fact used it. | Jan 29 13:37 |
oiaohm | Lets just say those with a wrong server configs and that bastard was a worm had kind of a messy. | Jan 29 13:38 |
oiaohm | Please note the infection turned up about 12 months after the CVE. | Jan 29 13:39 |
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XRevan86 | oy, compared to this opensmtpd bug this is nothing | Jan 29 13:40 |
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XRevan86 | https://smbc-comics.com/comic/transporter | Jan 29 15:12 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.smbc-comics.com | Saturday Morning Breakfast Cereal - Transporter | Jan 29 15:12 | |
danielp3344 | https://libresilicon.com/ | Jan 29 15:14 |
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-libresilicon.com | Libre Silicon | Jan 29 15:14 | |
danielp3344 | hey this is neat | Jan 29 15:14 |
superkuh | Ah good. Just checked my postfix server and I don't support any of the vulnerable cyrus SASL login methods. | Jan 29 15:18 |
XRevan86 | Disaster averted :) | Jan 29 15:18 |
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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Data transfer in GTK4 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133462 [https://pleroma.site/objects/9d3894d5-9973-4729-850b-e41ad4fe0a37] | Jan 29 18:15 | |
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Security Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133463 [https://pleroma.site/objects/a8bca61c-eeb8-443b-8d01-5915a33c90a4] | Jan 29 18:19 | |
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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Ditch Windows 7 For Ubuntu Linux With This Great Guide http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133461 [https://pleroma.site/objects/9c955cd2-0631-4287-9dd5-501f2fc4a04e] | Jan 29 18:27 | |
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-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Python Programming Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133465 [https://pleroma.site/objects/65657881-7a5e-4a29-8710-73335e5dd5ce] | Jan 29 18:57 | |
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Libvirt, PHP, FFmpeg Updates Roll Out on Tumbleweed http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/133466 [https://pleroma.site/objects/65dfd886-2339-4e57-ac2e-dcf4c9b9cf69] | Jan 29 19:00 | |
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*XRevan86 gaved drwho another chance: E3, E4 – ugh, E5 – okay, that got my attention back. | Jan 29 21:50 | |
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