●● IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: Monday, November 30, 2020 ●● ● Nov 30 [00:07] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Accurate Conclusions from Bogus Data: Methodological Issues in Collaboration in the open-source arena: The WebKit case su xn http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144891 [https://pleroma.site/objects/f250b037-eb59-4cb0-a797-799500c12b55] [00:11] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Review: Trisquel GNU/Linux 9.0 su xn http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144892 [https://pleroma.site/objects/dfd075a1-f0bb-477e-ae66-9cd6b32b3264] [00:21] schestowitz zoobab: http://patentblog.kluweriplaw.com/2020/11/26/preparatory-committee-unified-patent-court-an-important-step-closer/ [00:21] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-patentblog.kluweriplaw.com | Preparatory Committee: Unified Patent Court an important step closer - Kluwer Patent Blog [00:21] schestowitz " [00:21] schestowitz Dear lobbyists of all kind: free after Charles de Gaulle, you might have won a battle, but you have not yet won the war! [00:21] schestowitz Whether you like it or not, Art 7(2) UPCA is a ticking time bomb! [00:21] schestowitz " [00:21] schestowitz Game on [00:21] schestowitz zoobab: don't be despaired and all [00:21] schestowitz we'll win this at the end [00:21] schestowitz zoobab: "The problem is not software patents as claimed by the FFII, but the interconnection between a treaty meant to be following EU law and a convention completely outside the reach of EU law. " [00:21] schestowitz both are problems [00:21] schestowitz to different groups [00:23] schestowitz zoobab: I am catching up with about 100 comments at the moment [00:23] schestowitz tl;dr: [00:23] schestowitz the lobbyists' blog posts are pants [00:23] schestowitz pure BS [00:23] schestowitz the comments point this out [00:23] schestowitz with very rare exception [00:23] schestowitz they know they're faking it [00:23] schestowitz I like the comments in https://soylentnews.org/article.pl?sid=20/11/27/1654250 [00:23] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-soylentnews.org | FFII Calls for Donations Against Unitary Software Patent Trolls After a Disastrous Bundestag Vote - SoylentNews [00:56] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux 5.10-rc6 su xn http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144893 [https://pleroma.site/objects/9d7f2266-2164-469e-918f-7a268dc3ab72] [00:56] *smnthermes is now known as Samanto ● Nov 30 [01:04] *Samanto is now known as smnthermes [01:40] *smnthermes is now known as Samanto [01:49] *Samanto is now known as smnthermes ● Nov 30 [02:18] *mmu_man has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [02:23] *birkoff has quit (Changing host) [02:23] *birkoff (birkoff@unaffiliated/birkoff) has joined #techrights [02:23] *birkoff has quit (Changing host) [02:23] *birkoff (birkoff@gateway/shell/ircnow/x-ttzuowdzlafbxkoa) has joined #techrights [02:46] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux 5.10-rc6 Released - This LTS Kernel Now Appearing In Good Shape http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144893#comment-27271 [https://pleroma.site/objects/ca9e073f-5436-4b2f-9126-99b56b7df238] ● Nov 30 [03:09] schestowitz Now everything is in today's bulletin: http://techrights.org/txt/ [03:09] schestowitz even image substitutions [03:57] *rianne_ (~rianne@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [03:57] *asusbox2 (~rianne@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights ● Nov 30 [04:00] *asusbox has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [04:00] *rianne has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [04:03] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: GhostBSD 20.11.28 Release Announcement http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144894 [https://pleroma.site/objects/20a0b470-a421-488c-aaf2-9394c5a08e47] [04:32] schestowitz hmmm.. unix/gnu should have operator for this kind of thing [04:32] schestowitz https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/bash-prepend-text-lines-to-file/ [04:32] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.cyberciti.biz | BASH Prepend A Text / Lines To a File - nixCraft [04:32] schestowitz no simple operator [04:38] MinceR well, it's not a simple operation :> [04:38] MinceR appending to a file is a lot easier [04:44] schestowitz yes, because of how filesystems are [04:44] schestowitz I hoped there would be something with less overhead [04:44] schestowitz for http://techrights.org/txt [04:44] schestowitz let me check what other sites have a text version of them [04:45] schestowitz https://greycoder.com/a-list-of-text-only-new-sites/ [04:45] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-A List Of Text-Only News Sites - GreyCoder [04:45] schestowitz hmmm... that's not really text [04:45] schestowitz it's simplified html [04:47] schestowitz Even the 'geek' ones https://skimfeed.com/ [04:47] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Skimfeed V5.5 - Tech News [04:47] schestowitz still html [04:48] schestowitz "Text-only website are quite useful, especially today." [04:48] schestowitz They're not text only [04:48] schestowitz not even one of them [04:48] schestowitz the CNN one even has malware in it [04:48] schestowitz view-source:https://lite.cnn.com/en [04:48] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lite.cnn.com | CNN - Breaking News, Latest News and Videos [04:48] schestowitz "window.analytics" [04:57] schestowitz these also https://sjmulder.nl/en/textonly.html [04:57] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-sjmulder.nl | Text-only websites [04:57] schestowitz all of them ae html [04:57] schestowitz just a bit watered down [04:57] schestowitz but still html [04:57] schestowitz not text [04:57] schestowitz they do include https://1mb.club/ [04:57] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-1mb.club | 1MB Club ● Nov 30 [05:56] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Zotero: An Open Source App to Help You Collect & Share Research http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144895 [https://pleroma.site/objects/d505ea6d-482f-4e09-9b31-43a3db905cd7] ● Nov 30 [06:38] *oiaohm has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [06:39] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #HowTo use permission command chmod in Linux with various parameters http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144896 [https://pleroma.site/objects/b7626c78-9156-4bcc-98f8-084d25276232] [06:39] *oiaohm (~oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #techrights [06:43] -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Todays #HowTos | #UNIX http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144897 [https://pleroma.site/objects/10b713c2-039c-42e9-aa4f-7c988075f843] ● Nov 30 [07:11] *inky has quit (Quit: Leaving.) [07:21] *Blukunfando (~bkf@62.57.153.77.dyn.user.ono.com) has joined #techrights [07:28] *GNUmoon has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [07:30] *Blukunfando has quit (Excess Flood) [07:33] *Blukunfando (~bkf@62.57.153.77.dyn.user.ono.com) has joined #techrights [07:38] *notanamber (~luca@2001:b07:a16:5bc0:bd01:a12:47e2:5907) has joined #techrights [07:47] *rianne__ has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [07:47] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [07:47] *rianne__ (~rianne@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [07:47] *liberty_box (~liberty@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [07:50] *Blukunfando has quit (Remote host closed the connection) ● Nov 30 [08:11] *CrystalMath has quit (Quit: May we live long and die out | http://vhemt.org/) [08:11] *Blukunfando (~bkf@62.57.153.77.dyn.user.ono.com) has joined #techrights [08:11] *Blukunfando has quit (Excess Flood) [08:32] *GNUmoon (~GNUmoon@gateway/tor-sasl/gnumoon) has joined #techrights ● Nov 30 [10:47] *vZS1 (~vZS1@host-92-20-231-81.as13285.net) has joined #techrights [10:47] *oiaohm has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [10:47] *vZS1 has quit (Client Quit) [10:47] *oiaohm (~oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #techrights [10:50] *mmu_man (~revol@vaf26-2-82-244-111-82.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #techrights ● Nov 30 [11:07] *obarun has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [11:34] *kupi has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) ● Nov 30 [12:04] *notanamber has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) [12:07] *notanamber (~luca@93-41-34-118.ip79.fastwebnet.it) has joined #techrights ● Nov 30 [13:34] schestowitz zoobab: "Combined with a complete dematerialisation of the EPO as it is presently envisaged, it is not a mere dream, but it could become true and all the lawyer firms pushing the UPC would be gloating." http://patentblog.kluweriplaw.com/2020/11/26/german-bundestag-approves-legislation-to-ratify-the-unified-patent-court-agreement/ [13:34] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-patentblog.kluweriplaw.com | German Bundestag approves legislation to ratify the Unified Patent Court Agreement - Kluwer Patent Blog [13:56] zoobab saw it ● Nov 30 [14:01] schestowitz zoobab: thanks, good... [14:01] schestowitz zoobab: read the comments also in SN [14:01] schestowitz we've archives these in IRC [14:01] schestowitz people are on our side [14:02] schestowitz the propaganda you should ignore, focus on what needs doing now [14:11] *kupi (uid212005@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wpncqurqfmhlmlcw) has joined #techrights [14:15] *inky (~inky@141.136.79.29) has joined #techrights [14:47] schestowitz Ariadne: just fyi (I know you don't maintain pleroma.site anymore), pleroma.site has been down entirely for about 7 hours [14:48] schestowitz prior to that it seemed to have performance issues; either way, their uptime is overall not too bad [14:51] *psymin has quit (Quit: Leaving) ● Nov 30 [15:09] *psymin (~psymin@fsf/member/psymin) has joined #techrights [15:26] *inky has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [15:46] *inky (~inky@178.78.141.238) has joined #techrights ● Nov 30 [16:23] MinceR (cat) https://ircz.de/p/2007317 [16:23] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4793348) [16:23] *CrystalMath (~coderain@reactos/developer/theflash) has joined #techrights [16:38] MinceR (audio:important) https://cdn.mastodon.technology/cache/media_attachments/files/008/439/703/original/0ff1cd59389184b6.mp4 [16:40] schestowitz ha [16:41] *inky has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) [16:43] *inky (~inky@141.136.79.29) has joined #techrights [16:45] *MathAmphetamine (~coderain@reactos/developer/theflash) has joined #techrights [16:46] *CrystalMath has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [16:53] *MathAmphetamine is now known as CrystalMath ● Nov 30 [17:00] MinceR https://www.deviantart.com/redig76/art/Cthulhu-Awakening-Front-I-Want-YOU-for-breakfast-d-810585419 [17:00] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Cthulhu Awakening Front I Want YOU for breakfast d by redig76 on DeviantArt [17:14] schestowitz pleroma down, pastint diffs [17:14] schestowitz *pasting [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz Links 30/11/2020: GhostBSD 20.11.28, Nitrux 1.3.5, Linux 5.10 RC6, GNOME Circle, Microsoft Collapses Again in Web Server Share http://techrights.org/2020/11/30/microsoft-iis-collapses/ [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz Todays Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144916 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Links 30/11/2020: GhostBSD 20.11.28, Nitrux 1.3.5, Linux 5.10 RC6, GNOME Circle, Microsoft Collapses Again in Web Server Share | Techrights [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | today's leftovers | Tux Machines [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz Programming/Development Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144915 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Programming/Development Leftovers | Tux Machines [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144914 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Android Leftovers | Tux Machines [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz vQt 6.0's 3D Renderer Is Much Improved But More Work Remains http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144899#comment-27275 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Qt 3D Renderer changes and improvements in Qt 6 | Tux Machines [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz Devices/Embedded: MiTAC, #RaspberryPi and #ESP32 / #Arduino http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144913 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Devices/Embedded: MiTAC, Raspberry Pi and ESP32/Arduino | Tux Machines [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz Todays #HowTos | #UNIX http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144912 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | today's howtos | Tux Machines [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz Linux Kernel: Greg Kroah-Hartmans Talk and Panics http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144911 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Linux Kernel: Greg Kroah-Hartman's Talk and Panics | Tux Machines [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz Audiocasts/Shows: Apple Hype From the Viewpoint of GNU/Linux http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144910 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Audiocasts/Shows: Apple Hype From the Viewpoint of GNU/Linux | Tux Machines [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz RADV Vulkan Drive and Vulkan Improvements http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144908 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | RADV Vulkan Drive and Vulkan Improvements | Tux Machines [17:14] schestowitz [17:14] schestowitz Minder mind-mapping tool http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144907 [17:14] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Minder mind-mapping tool | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz Games: Godot Engine, Rail Route, MangoHud, Cube 2: Sauerbraten and Minigalaxy http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144906 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Games: Godot Engine, Rail Route, MangoHud, Cube 2: Sauerbraten and Minigalaxy | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz TUXEDO launch their Linux powered XMG FUSION 15 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144808#comment-27274 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | TUXEDO Computers Enables Full Linux Support on the Intel-TongFang QC7 Gaming Laptop | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz GNOMEs Developer Outreach http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144905 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | GNOME's Developer Outreach | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz The Raspberry Pi 400 isn't the only keyboard computer with a Raspberry Pi inside [17:15] schestowitz http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144898#comment-27273 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Unboxing the Raspberry Pi 400 | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz Changelog: Nitrux 1.3.5 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144900 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Changelog: Nitrux 1.3.5 | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz Qt 3D Renderer changes and improvements in Qt 6 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144899 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Qt 3D Renderer changes and improvements in Qt 6 | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz GhostBSD 20.11.28 Released With Improved Steam On Linux Performance http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144894#comment-27272 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | GhostBSD 20.11.28 Release Announcement | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144902 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Android Leftovers | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz Collabora Office 6.4 Arrives on Mobile and Chromebooks with New Look and Dark Mode http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144903 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Collabora Office 6.4 Arrives on Mobile and Chromebooks with New Look and Dark Mode | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz Nitrux 1.3.5 Brings More Portable Apps, Latest KDE Plasma Desktop http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144901 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Nitrux 1.3.5 Brings More Portable Apps, Latest KDE Plasma Desktop | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz Today in #Techrights http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144904 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Today in Techrights | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz Unboxing the Raspberry Pi 400 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144898 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Unboxing the Raspberry Pi 400 | Tux Machines [17:15] schestowitz [17:15] schestowitz Todays #HowTos | #UNIX http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/144897 [17:15] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | today's howtos | Tux Machines [17:17] *notanamber has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) [17:38] XRevan86 https://existentialcomics.com/comic/370 thought it's a big preachy, not realising it's just because this is based on a true story [17:38] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-existentialcomics.com | Herbert Spencer Visits Pittsburgh - Existential Comics [17:43] MinceR https://ircz.de/p/20081829 [17:43] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4831399) [17:53] MinceR https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EnstKZ_VEAMZ34y?format=jpg&name=orig [17:56] XRevan86 MinceR: I can't decide whether I should mock him for bying an IoT doorbell or to laugh with him at the state of affairs. [17:58] MinceR you should mock him and laugh at him [17:58] MinceR he bought the stupidest doorbell ever made (one that doesn't even work without someone else's computer helping out) advertised as "smart" [17:59] XRevan86 MinceR: But also he recognises the issue, at least partially. [17:59] psydroid and enjoy it ● Nov 30 [18:18] MinceR (cat) https://ircz.de/p/20072756 [18:18] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4786685) [18:35] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds) [18:35] *rianne__ has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [18:37] *rianne__ (~rianne@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [18:42] *rianne__ has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) [18:44] oiaohm Problem with the IoT door bells is the security risks. [18:46] oiaohm Really its fun using a targeted wifi jammer against them so they ring but have no picture. [18:46] *rianne__ (~rianne@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [18:46] *liberty_box (~liberty@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [18:49] oiaohm Being a cabler I do have a wired in security system in my house I did for prac. ● Nov 30 [19:02] *obarun (~obarun@host-115-126-165-174.fibre.nautile.nc) has joined #techrights [19:04] *oiaohm has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [19:04] *oiaohm (~oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #techrights [19:29] *rianne__ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [19:30] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) [19:33] *rianne__ (~rianne@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [19:35] *liberty_box (~liberty@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [19:35] *schestowitz has quit (Quit: Konversation term) [19:35] *schestowitz (~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz) has joined #techrights [19:42] schestowitz alarm bells are simple [19:42] schestowitz they used to be just physical bells [19:42] schestowitz those are cheap [19:43] *rianne__ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [19:44] *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [19:49] MinceR https://ircz.de/p/20081632 [19:49] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object (4827363) [19:56] oiaohm schestowitz: https://www.bunnings.com.au/swing-slide-climb-ship-bell_p3321047 this is my house door bell. [19:56] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.bunnings.com.au | Swing Slide Climb Ship Bell | Bunnings Warehouse [19:56] MinceR :) [19:57] oiaohm They turn out not that hard to make tone trigger for remote either. [19:57] oiaohm So wireless to computer by sound. [19:57] schestowitz does the job [19:58] MinceR https://i.pinimg.com/originals/67/28/c3/6728c388a95cfea916cb1060f51f9e52.jpg [19:58] oiaohm Basically I have something equal to a ring door bell with nothing electrical outside the walls of the building. [19:58] MinceR https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/2372/3021/products/image1_530x@2x.jpeg?v=1566125600 [19:58] oiaohm and without the IOT security risks. [19:59] oiaohm The house I am in has high iron bricks that make a natural fardays cage. ● Nov 30 [20:00] schestowitz not good for "smart" things [20:00] schestowitz only smart humans [20:01] CrystalMath i have an old buzz bell from 1970 [20:01] schestowitz one day they will make alarms that work without power and connection. That would be... innovative? [20:01] CrystalMath still requires power though [20:01] CrystalMath i made an electric bell myself as a kid [20:02] CrystalMath using an electromagnet [20:02] schestowitz common exercise [20:02] CrystalMath it wasn't very loud though [20:02] oiaohm I remember one place that had a crank bell. [20:02] oiaohm As in hand crank so the door bell would ring. [20:02] *obarun has quit (Remote host closed the connection) [20:02] schestowitz not good in covid times [20:04] CrystalMath so disinfect it [20:04] CrystalMath there's no sane bell that doesn't require touch [20:05] oiaohm The crank door bell was not that bad in covid-19 time as it was a solid brass handle. [20:05] CrystalMath oh [20:05] oiaohm Material is a factor. [20:07] oiaohm Brass most viruses are rendered dead inside 40 mins. [20:08] oiaohm So as long as you are only getting a few people per day spread over the day brass items are not a contact spread item. [20:12] schestowitz >> Intel: buy us... because we're good at solving problems we create [20:12] schestowitz > [20:12] schestowitz > I'm pretty sure Moore's law is now about the number of serious microcode [20:12] schestowitz > vulnerabilities. [20:15] schestowitz oiaohm: [20:15] schestowitz >> Some of Linus rants against developers crossed into the Australian [20:15] schestowitz > laws define of verbal Assault. [20:15] schestowitz > [20:15] schestowitz > Australians are all fucking idiots anyway. [20:15] schestowitz >> No verbal Assualt under Australian law in written form is offence [20:15] schestowitz > alone with a max of 10 years jail. [20:15] schestowitz > [20:15] schestowitz > My advice is that nobody visit or do business with Australia, unless of [20:15] schestowitz > course they're going to start extraditing people for "verbal assault" in [20:15] schestowitz > which case-- nuke them from orbit until all the dingoes and 'roos glow [20:15] schestowitz > green. [20:16] *liberty_box (~liberty@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [20:16] *rianne__ (~rianne@host81-154-173-112.range81-154.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights [20:16] oiaohm Austalian define of verbal assault is imported from the UK. [20:19] oiaohm schestowitz: the reality here is there are quite a few countries with laws against it. Lot of countries have not applied it to online text conversations yet. Lot of things Linus wrote in emails if he has said verbally in a normal office in may countries would have been criminal offences. [20:20] oiaohm Australia is just a little ahead due to rulings saying verbal assult for spoken actions apply to text based actions online as well. [20:26] schestowitz ok [20:26] oiaohm schestowitz: Malicious Communications Act in the UK what is 6 months with a fine would have covered Linus actions when he was pulled up as well. [20:26] schestowitz what words/incident specifically? [20:26] schestowitz I presume that would be used in menacing scenario [20:26] schestowitz like someone shouting curse words at someone's home [20:27] schestowitz and that would be a way to hold them accountable for "antisocial behaviour" [20:27] oiaohm Malicious Communications Act covers in the UK online actions like personally attacking emails. [20:28] oiaohm Basically antisocial behaviour. [20:28] schestowitz depends on the context [20:28] schestowitz and the actual sense of threat [20:28] oiaohm I am trying to remember the event that Linus was caught on. It was covered in Linux Australia conference. Its where Linus got personally abusive because a person submitting code did something that was not documented. [20:29] oiaohm Problem that person was Australia citizen. [20:29] schestowitz some strongly worded emails can cause panic, if for instance physical action was to follow [20:29] oiaohm So Linus had to be pulled up. [20:29] schestowitz he said something to the effect of not being born [20:29] schestowitz but maybe jokingly [20:29] schestowitz and either way, the law should not protect feelings [20:29] schestowitz but physical safety [20:30] oiaohm Mental safety does have to be considered. [20:30] schestowitz the US has a case on that [20:30] oiaohm There is such thing of just being too far out of line. [20:30] schestowitz Dorey or something [20:30] schestowitz where a girl killed herself after getting some communications from an older lady [20:31] schestowitz iirc, the cause concluded that if someone kills oneself due to being offended, you cannot hold the offender accountable for it [20:31] schestowitz people who kill themselves over an email were suicidal (likely) to begin with [20:31] schestowitz irrespective of these emails [20:32] schestowitz and they can use suicide as just a weapon or revenge [20:32] schestowitz I am guessing that's partly the reason such law exist in the first place [20:32] schestowitz *laws [20:32] schestowitz bbl [20:32] schestowitz I need to write some stuff [20:32] oiaohm Or go on a mass murder killing spree [20:33] oiaohm Either way harm a person personality too much bad things can happen. [20:34] oiaohm So laws exist to prevent take it too far. [20:36] oiaohm Lot of usa states have passed their own unique laws to deal with the problem. Australia just extend our existing assault laws to cover the online problem that is a fairly sane thing todo. [20:37] oiaohm USA is a checkboard mess of what is legal and what is not. ● Nov 30 [21:00] *GNUmoon has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [21:05] DaemonFC[m] I'm using a hand cranked washing machine and an electric laundry spinner. [21:05] DaemonFC[m] Over time, cheaper than using the laundromat. [21:29] MinceR 30 212903 < oiaohm> Problem that person was Australia citizen. [21:29] MinceR yes, that definitely was the problem [21:29] MinceR not that their code sucked :> [21:36] oiaohm MinceR: in this case code was not fact bad. [21:41] oiaohm I wish I could find the video again going over it MinceR. There was a rule that had been agreed at a Linux Plumbers conference that had not be documented that you were not raise a kernel panic under particular conditions. That what Linus got abusive over against the Australian developer. [21:42] oiaohm So it was not that the submitted code suxed as such it was that particular code already included in the Linux kernel suxed so don't do X or you would trigger it. [21:42] oiaohm Yet that was not documented. [21:43] oiaohm MinceR: its one thing to rip into a person for doing something wrong when they really have. Its another to have a case like that where person themselves has done really nothing wrong and other parties have not done their job. [21:51] search_social obviously linux should fork into two OS's, one for the free world and one for politically repressive 3rd world dictatorships [21:56] MinceR i guess microshit would manage the latter, then :> [21:59] *GNUmoon (~GNUmoon@gateway/tor-sasl/gnumoon) has joined #techrights ● Nov 30 [22:08] search_social well no i mean people in 3rd world dictatorships deserve rights too [22:08] search_social it's just you have to be a little more subtle about it [22:16] oiaohm search_social: where do you define the freeworld is. [22:16] MinceR maybe 3 kernels then [22:16] oiaohm Particular things Linus did was on the wrong side of different USA states laws. [22:16] *Blukunfando (~bkf@62.57.153.77.dyn.user.ono.com) has joined #techrights [22:17] oiaohm Freeworld is fairly much a myth. [22:17] MinceR free from humans [22:19] schestowitz wow. pleroma.site is still down [22:20] search_social i've learned rhetoric is more effective if you don't define your terms [22:20] schestowitz (since around 7am here) [22:20] oiaohm search_social: to be correct rhetoric is more deceptive if you don't define your terms. [22:21] schestowitz Depends how you value your time ---> [21:05] I'm using a hand cranked washing machine and an electric laundry spinner. [22:21] search_social well, if you are facing someone that doesn't define their terms and you try to define your terms the net result seems to be quite deceptive as well [22:22] search_social you'll be about 5 words into your definition before you get stoned to death by the mob [22:23] oiaohm search_social: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_World the normal define of Free World from the Cold war is this one. But it includes many countries without free speech. [22:23] -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | Free World - Wikipedia [22:23] oiaohm Stupid as it sounds your country could be a dictatorship and part of the cold war free world. [22:24] oiaohm Just as long as it was not a communist dictatorship. [22:24] search_social i would use something more granular than country, say individuals [22:26] oiaohm Even invdividuals these days have to live by socal norms. Its not like we have nude Philosophers walking around in barrels being classed as acceptable. [22:27] oiaohm Yes greek history there were true people doing that. [22:27] oiaohm and other wacky things in other countries. [22:27] *kingoffrance sheepishly takes down poster of Diogenes [22:27] kingoffrance IIRC alexander the great supposedly asked him what he could do for him, and he told alexander the great to get out of his sun :) [22:29] oiaohm kingoffrance: Diogenes lived in a large wine barrel from memory. There was another who wore a smaller barrel as clothing. [22:29] kingoffrance i just heard "tub" but thats even better [22:30] oiaohm Wine crushing tub That like 2 meters across. Over on it side makes a lot better home than alot of current day homeless have. [22:31] kingoffrance and i learned cooper is another one of those names that was occupation (made barrels and similar) [22:32] oiaohm We still have coopers here making barrels. [22:33] oiaohm For the bunderberg rum and the like. [22:34] oiaohm kingoffrance: Gymnosophist Philosophers I was thinking about. They could be completely nude or if you were lucky they were wearing a barrel but that is basically as far as clothing went for them. [22:34] kingoffrance yeah, i have heard that [22:34] oiaohm Today that would be in most countries instant arrested. [22:34] kingoffrance or i have heard that is what the gymnasium was, makes sense [22:35] oiaohm Yes the old idea of competition in the nude. [22:36] oiaohm Of course this also had the rule that women were not allows to take part in male sports or even watch them. [22:36] oiaohm Social norms end up with a stack of different trade offs. [22:54] *kupi has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) ● Nov 30 [23:10] DaemonFC[m] Okay, I finally got all the laundry caught up. [23:10] DaemonFC[m] Took me a few hours with that setup, but I'll just wash it each day now. [23:11] *GNUmoon has quit (Remote host closed the connection)