schestowitzIt's already out practicallyMay 07 00:00
schestowitzMaybe not deployed yetMay 07 00:00
schestowitzBut it has been finalised for a whileMay 07 00:00
schestowitz3.0 crashed (ish) Sun's serversMay 07 00:00
schestowitzNot a good launchMay 07 00:00
schestowitzA shame that when the buzz is up and people come to get it there is no serverresoinseMay 07 00:01
oiaohmOpenoffice mirrors to all its mirrors before offical release notice.May 07 00:01
schestowitzMirrors up, not links to them thoughMay 07 00:01
schestowitzoiaohm: that's why they keep it so quiet stillMay 07 00:01
oiaohmWith the number of users who want to download they need all of them.May 07 00:01
oiaohmIts the openoffice cycle.  You can normally if you know the first mirrors get openoffice 5 days before offical release.May 07 00:02
oiaohmIts also good testing any that sneek in while just in mirroring and complain of a fault they can go opps dud upload.May 07 00:03
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schestowitzI have some mirrors. hold on.May 07 00:19
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/10/13/ooo-use-this-mirror-instead/May 07 00:20
schestowitzIf you browser dirs you'll probably find 3.1May 07 00:21
schestowitzhttp://www.mirrorservice.org/sites/ny1.mirror.openoffice.org/stable/3.1.0/May 07 00:21
schestowitzGot it.May 07 00:21
schestowitzHere is the place to download OpenOffice 3.1 ahead of everyone else: http://www.mirrorservice.org/sites/ny1.mirror.openoffice.org/stable/3.1.0/May 07 00:21
schestowitz"  04-May-2009 "May 07 00:22
schestowitzSee?May 07 00:22
schestowitzIt has been going on for a whileMay 07 00:22
schestowitz50 millionx100mbMay 07 00:22
schestowitzAbout 5 million gigabytesMay 07 00:22
schestowitz5 petabyesMay 07 00:22
schestowitzFunny... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tGxhpQlaIk&feature=channelMay 07 00:31
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seller_liarI was thinkingMay 07 01:01
seller_liarHow to promote ethics for people?May 07 01:01
schestowitzSednt hem books :-)May 07 01:06
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seller_liarWe need to write more criticism in mono appsMay 07 01:08
schestowitzAdds them, pleaseMay 07 01:09
seller_liarokMay 07 01:09
seller_liarI will talk about mooonsonMay 07 01:11
schestowitzhttp://twitter.com/johndrinkwater/statuses/1719916425May 07 01:11
schestowitzDisgusting ^^May 07 01:11
schestowitzHeh. Moon SoonMay 07 01:12
schestowitzMoon byeMay 07 01:12
schestowitzMoon lieMay 07 01:12
seller_liarMoon die!May 07 01:16
Balrogcome on ... even Microsoft's sponsored ODF plugin performs better.May 07 01:19
schestowitzBalrog: I'm doing a postMay 07 01:20
schestowitzIt's very uglyMay 07 01:20
Balrogok.May 07 01:20
Balrogread the commentsMay 07 01:20
Balrogon the technet pageMay 07 01:20
schestowitzHehe.May 07 01:20
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mib_dfhj0slookMay 07 01:30
mib_dfhj0shttp://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php?title=Mono_Applications#Software_developed_with_MonoMay 07 01:30
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Balrogseller_liar: what about it?May 07 01:33
seller_liarI have included criticism about moonsoonMay 07 01:33
Balrogseller_liar: grammar could be better ;)May 07 01:34
seller_liarbalrog: please fix  itMay 07 01:35
Balrog"Mono promoters try to include moosoon to default gnome installation" is ambiguousMay 07 01:36
Balrogseller_liar: what are you trying to mean by that?May 07 01:36
seller_liarMono trolls will try to include moosoon in ubuntuMay 07 01:37
Balrogseller_liar: I wouldn't criticize MIT/X11 over being permissiveMay 07 01:38
Balrogthat's not a problemMay 07 01:38
Balrograther, lack of patent protection isMay 07 01:38
Balrogplus GNU says MIT/X11 is okMay 07 01:39
seller_liaris ok but is not "good"May 07 01:39
Balrogbut ok is not badMay 07 01:39
seller_liargnu linux distros always shoould emphasize gnu gplMay 07 01:40
seller_liarmit x11 has a very old license  , novell uses a lotyMay 07 01:40
Balrogschestowitz: what do you think?May 07 01:41
Balrogshould we criticize MIT/X11?May 07 01:42
BalrogI feel notMay 07 01:42
schestowitzJust a moment....May 07 01:42
seller_liarBut we need emphasizeMay 07 01:42
seller_liarMore mit/x11 software than gnu gpl software is not goodMay 07 01:42
seller_liarMit/x11 promotes what we are trying to destroy in years:May 07 01:43
seller_liarproprietary softwareMay 07 01:43
seller_liarschestowitz: did you see?May 07 01:47
oiaohmMit/X11 has its flaws.May 07 01:49
seller_liarnovell promotes mit licenseMay 07 01:49
oiaohmShould have a update lack ass protecton for user.May 07 01:50
Balrogoiaohm: does that mead we should call is bad and bash it?May 07 01:50
seller_liarnovell de icaza , jeff waugh and other uses mit licenses in blog contentMay 07 01:50
oiaohmThere is worse.May 07 01:50
oiaohmIt could be MS-PL licence.May 07 01:50
seller_liarOk , it ' s not a "bad license" ,May 07 01:50
seller_liarinstead put a "weak license"/May 07 01:50
oiaohmLicense in need of update would be better.May 07 01:51
oiaohmIt was good in its time.May 07 01:51
seller_liarbut not nowMay 07 01:51
seller_liartoday we have microsoft, ibm and all s*ck patents of worldMay 07 01:51
oiaohmSoftware withoutMay 07 01:52
oiaohmrestriction, including without limitation the rights to use,May 07 01:52
oiaohmcopy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sellMay 07 01:52
oiaohmcopies of the Software, and to permit persons to whom theMay 07 01:52
oiaohmSoftware is furnished to do so, subject to the followingMay 07 01:52
oiaohmconditions:May 07 01:52
oiaohmRead that from it.May 07 01:52
oiaohmMit/X11 might still be legally soild.May 07 01:52
seller_liarbut gplv3 is betterMay 07 01:53
oiaohmBecause if the without limitation clause is taken to cover patents as well.May 07 01:53
seller_liarnovell uses mit instead gpl v3 because microsoftMay 07 01:53
oiaohmits still a good licence.May 07 01:53
oiaohmReally Mit/X11 needs a court case to test where patent fit into it.May 07 01:53
Balrog'rights to use' 'without limitation' sounds like a type of patent grantMay 07 01:54
seller_liarplease someone edit my commentMay 07 01:54
oiaohmIts the unknown state around Mit/X11 that is causing its problems.May 07 01:54
seller_liarPut only "lack of protection against patents" and " more mit/x11 and less gpl is bad"May 07 01:55
oiaohmIts that we don't know if it provided patent protection or not seller_liar.May 07 01:55
oiaohmIt wording it could.May 07 01:56
seller_liaroiaohm: gpl is more explicit and offers good termsMay 07 01:56
Balrogschestowitz: Transmission now has a beta Qt version!May 07 01:56
Balrogin addition to the GTK+ oneMay 07 01:56
schestowitzEmbrace, Extend and Expel:  Microsoft Wants to Toss IBM Out of ODF http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/06/embrace-extend-and-expel/May 07 01:56
oiaohmMIT is well worded.May 07 01:56
oiaohmJust it was presoftware patents.May 07 01:56
oiaohmAnd has not been tested with them.May 07 01:57
oiaohmIf Mit/X11 tests find its still a good licence.May 07 01:57
oiaohmfind/fineMay 07 01:57
oiaohmReally if Mit/X11 turns out to protect patents Novell has some major headaches.May 07 01:58
BalrogWe should ask SFLCMay 07 01:58
schestowitzmit is good for MSMay 07 01:59
schestowitzIn case they buy NovellMay 07 01:59
schestowitzThey don;t want gplv3May 07 01:59
oiaohmhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSD_license#Terms   BSD is weaker.May 07 02:00
schestowitzI see seller_liar raised this point alreadyMay 07 02:00
oiaohmMit/X11 is reallly a very strongly worded licence.May 07 02:00
schestowitzI'm just catching  upMay 07 02:00
BalrogBSD only talks about redistributionMay 07 02:00
BalrogMIT talks about use as wellMay 07 02:00
Balrog<The MIT License states more explicitly the rights given to the end-user, including the right to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell the software.>May 07 02:01
oiaohmSoftware without restriction is also in the licence of MITMay 07 02:01
oiaohmAttempting to apply patents may be in direct breach of MIT licence.May 07 02:02
oiaohmSince you are attempting to apply a restriction.May 07 02:02
oiaohmI was always taught the simpler the contract the better.May 07 02:02
oiaohmMIT licence is a really simple contract.May 07 02:03
oiaohmIt could be 100 percent unbreakable.May 07 02:03
BalrogMIT license says "Permission is granted ... to deal in the Software without restriction"May 07 02:03
BalrogWe should ask SFLCMay 07 02:03
oiaohmAlso MS has published blocks of code under MIT as well.May 07 02:04
oiaohmCould be a real nightmare for MS.May 07 02:05
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DaemonFCschestowitz: http://izanbardprince.wordpress.com/2009/05/07/while-im-discussing-vista-why-do-whql-drivers-suffer-from-an-alarming-lack-of-quality/May 07 02:14
DaemonFCyou may get a kick from thisMay 07 02:14
oiaohmApparently windows has the same detection problems as Linux who would guess.May 07 02:19
DaemonFC"the European Union should place sanctions on the United States until such time that ICANN is transferred over to an international body." -MeMay 07 02:21
DaemonFChehMay 07 02:21
DaemonFCit may sound odd hearing an American saying this, but it would protect us from our own government tooMay 07 02:22
oiaohmUsa still techinally owns IP control.May 07 02:22
DaemonFCso it puts that in my interests as wellMay 07 02:22
DaemonFCit would be a nightmare for all these anti-free speech organizations if they had to work over a dozen countries that control the internetMay 07 02:23
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DaemonFCrather than just 1May 07 02:23
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DaemonFCif it was under the control of an international committee, than if a place got an order to remove the listing for say Wikileaks, that would only mean that our representative had to vote to do itMay 07 02:24
DaemonFCit doesn't immediately get them what they wantMay 07 02:24
DaemonFCoiaohm: What's horrific with WHQL drivers is that Microsoft never updates themMay 07 02:27
DaemonFCso the one they signed is likely the first version of that driver, from late 2006May 07 02:27
DaemonFCand that hundreds of bugs could have been fixed by now and they still have version 1.0May 07 02:28
DaemonFCfor that reason, Vista really isn't much easier to set up than XP cause you still need drivers anywayMay 07 02:29
DaemonFCevery time I figure out what is crashing Vista and why, and fix it, it's time to find the next causeMay 07 02:30
DaemonFCthe Error Logging is non-existentMay 07 02:30
DaemonFCso there are precisely a billion things that could have done itMay 07 02:31
DaemonFCI think it was Mr. Green in the Garage, with a power sanderMay 07 02:31
schestowitzDon’t Let Novell (and Microsoft) Control GNU/Linux, Licences, and Open Office < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/06/microsoft-novell-control-dangers/ >May 07 02:32
*schestowitz adds vista7 link for posting laterMay 07 02:32
oiaohmVery few people understand how much work goes into giving Linux hardware support.May 07 02:33
schestowitzUS army has plans to hijack citiczens' computersMay 07 02:33
schestowitzTo attack with botnetsMay 07 02:33
schestowitzThey also have documented plans to bomb botmasters, physically.May 07 02:34
schestowitzsince 2007May 07 02:34
DaemonFCwho said the army is doing that?May 07 02:35
DaemonFCI kind of doubt you'd get dozens of foreign governments to use Windows if it had that kind of a backdoorMay 07 02:36
oiaohmAustralian army is adding a cyber warfare department.May 07 02:36
schestowitzNetworkWorldMay 07 02:36
schestowitzBe careful hecking routersMay 07 02:37
schestowitzThey could send F16s to your houseMay 07 02:37
oiaohmInternet could turn into a mess.May 07 02:37
schestowitzAs Bush once put it (as well as everyone around him), "it could come in the form of a mushroom cloud"May 07 02:38
oiaohmGoing to miss the F18's here.   Particular there anti-cop car with radar gun feature.May 07 02:38
schestowitzThe 'War' on hackersMay 07 02:38
schestowitzThey already got rid of the word 'crackers'May 07 02:38
schestowitz"hackers" will be the new "enemy combatant"May 07 02:39
oiaohmUSA has to do something.May 07 02:39
oiaohmThere networks are leaking so badly you can almost get your hands on anything.May 07 02:39
DaemonFCanyone know any good 9read: CHEAP) TV cards that work out-of-box with most Linux distros?May 07 02:39
DaemonFCthe info I've dug up is sketchyMay 07 02:40
oiaohmFrom the video 4 Linux site DaemonFC?May 07 02:40
DaemonFCI have an AverMedia M780May 07 02:41
DaemonFCnever worked with LinuxMay 07 02:41
DaemonFCprobably never willMay 07 02:41
oiaohmhttp://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page  Basically the best information on that topic I know is is from there DaemonFCMay 07 02:43
DaemonFClooks like Linux doesn't support any PCI-E tunersMay 07 02:44
DaemonFCand therefore, probably most of the ATSC models go out the window tooMay 07 02:45
DaemonFC:(May 07 02:45
DaemonFCthis is like the only thing Vista does wellMay 07 02:46
seller_liarI was thinkingMay 07 02:46
DaemonFCout-of-tree drivers are the devilMay 07 02:46
seller_liarWe cannot only criticise and analyze thingsMay 07 02:46
seller_liarwe need to promote thingsMay 07 02:47
DaemonFCFedora moves way too fast for those to be usefulMay 07 02:47
oiaohmLot of the USB ones are support well.May 07 02:47
oiaohmAnd work supprisingly well.May 07 02:47
DaemonFCLVM still fails on Fedora 11 PreviewMay 07 02:48
seller_liarI don t use LVMMay 07 02:48
seller_liarFedora is crazyMay 07 02:48
seller_liarFerdore put securitylinux, LVM and other stupid things for userMay 07 02:48
seller_liarI like fedore because of ethics ,but I dislike the package selectionMay 07 02:49
seller_liarFedora is a technical distroMay 07 02:49
seller_liarAnd packagekit sucks a lotMay 07 02:50
DaemonFChttp://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/AVerMedia_AVerTV_Combo_PCIe_%28M780%29May 07 02:51
DaemonFCthat's the card I haveMay 07 02:51
oiaohmSo long term it might work.May 07 02:54
oiaohmIts not in the stack if it will never work ever.May 07 02:54
DaemonFChttp://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127988May 07 02:59
DaemonFCaccording to the chatter, it works out of the boxMay 07 02:59
DaemonFCI might grab one when I get paidMay 07 02:59
seller_liarThe real solution for a good gnu linux distro for users is long term supportMay 07 03:02
seller_liarSeparation  app and systemMay 07 03:02
seller_liarAns Throw out the stupid packaging systemMay 07 03:02
seller_liarUse a new software model called application systemMay 07 03:02
oiaohmLong term solution will appear soon enough.May 07 03:04
oiaohmThe tech to allow distributions to merge.May 07 03:04
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seller_liarBut long term is not sufficientMay 07 03:04
seller_liarAll distros must distinct what is application and what is the systemMay 07 03:05
oiaohmBefore windows we had like 20 OS's competing for top place.May 07 03:05
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seller_liarAll distros mix everything ,. application with systemMay 07 03:05
oiaohmNot all.May 07 03:05
seller_liarDistro must support only the system ,not applicationMay 07 03:05
seller_liardebian is crazyMay 07 03:06
seller_liardebian support all system and applicationsMay 07 03:06
seller_liarA good distro must support only:May 07 03:06
seller_liarkernelMay 07 03:06
seller_liarxorgMay 07 03:06
oiaohmThere are some hypervisor role OS's out there.May 07 03:06
seller_liara graphical enviromentMay 07 03:06
seller_liarglibcMay 07 03:06
seller_liargnu apiMay 07 03:06
oiaohmxorg currnetly don't work on them.May 07 03:06
seller_liarand only thisMay 07 03:06
oiaohmeglibc its sainer.May 07 03:06
oiaohmAfter the changes in X11 go threw hypverisor and container based Linux's will be able to come into there own providing a OS that you can run any number of distributions you like.May 07 03:08
DaemonFC`http://www.avermedia.com/avertv/Product/ProductDetail.aspx?Id=431&tab=APDriverMay 07 03:08
DaemonFC`Avermedia has Linux drivers for thatMay 07 03:08
oiaohmInteresting.May 07 03:10
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DaemonFC`wonder if I should get thatMay 07 03:14
schestowitzSCO threatened with Chapter 7 destruction < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/06/us_bankruptcy_trustee_chapter_7_request/ >May 07 03:20
schestowitz27 posts so far today in BNMay 07 03:20
schestowitzmarbux writes: ""Is it time for Rob to step down as chair? I think so.May 07 03:22
schestowitz"I'm not saying Microsoft (or anyone) should be the chair instead, butMay 07 03:22
schestowitzI am saying that Rob is unfit as a leader given his inability toMay 07 03:22
schestowitzseparate his personal venom from his role as a leader in driving theMay 07 03:22
schestowitzstandard forward. It seems like a better approach to empower people onMay 07 03:22
schestowitzthe ODF TC who have a long-term view of the need to enableMay 07 03:22
schestowitzinteroperability, and to move those with more short-termMay 07 03:22
schestowitzvendor-oriented agendas to the side."May 07 03:22
schestowitzGray Knowlton, Rethinking ODF Leadership, Gray Matter (6 May 2009),May 07 03:22
schestowitz<http://blogs.technet.com/gray_knowlton/archive/2009/05/06/rethinking-odf-leadership.aspx>May 07 03:22
schestowitzMight be interesting to watch if this is prelude to a political battleMay 07 03:22
schestowitzat OASIS to unseat Weir.May 07 03:22
schestowitzBest regards,May 07 03:22
schestowitzPaul"May 07 03:22
schestowitz"Microsoft calls for Rob Weir's resignation"May 07 03:23
schestowitzgnMay 07 03:29
seller_liargn royMay 07 03:35
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DaemonFChttp://izanbardprince.wordpress.com/2009/05/07/disable-windows-vista-spywareharassment-nag-screen/May 07 04:00
DaemonFCI voted for it, before I voted against it.May 07 04:00
DaemonFC:PMay 07 04:01
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twitterI'm having trouble posting a comment on BNMay 07 05:10
twitterfucking spam filter says I can't addMay 07 05:11
twitter3 + 11 is 14May 07 05:12
twitter"Error: You have entered the wrong sum in the spam protection field. Press the back button and try again."May 07 05:12
twitterughMay 07 05:12
twitterAs the trolls often taunted me on Slashdot, after making a post invisible, "There's 30 minutes of your life you won't get back."May 07 05:17
twitterbroken on two browsers.  Konq and Epiphany.May 07 05:19
twitterIt's nice to know that the wrong sums don't work either.May 07 05:21
twitterOh well, here's my comment.May 07 05:21
twitterI'm afraid you got trolled when linking to the article, "<a href="http://dag.wieers.com/blog/are-there-too-few-people-who-understand-desktop-linux">Are there too few people who understand desktop Linux?</a>"  The author starts from a few general statements that sound good then he makes a bunch of projections from the Windows world onto free software.  He uses this base to conclude in a circular fashion that GNU/Linux is not ready fMay 07 05:22
twitterAfter a long preamble about wanting software that does not suck life, he gets into projections.  He does not make them directly, because people would immediately recognize the lie.  Check it out:May 07 05:22
twitter<blockquote> high-maintenance, bleeding-edge Linux distributions, while very useful to the selected few, are not a nice fit for 99% of the market [like his mom] because they change too often, require work to update them and change often spurs breakage, instability or behavioral change. ... I am not interested in updating/upgrading my mom's computer whenever I pay a visit because the OS demands that from me. I'd rather do other thinMay 07 05:23
twitterIf the author was talking about all the Christmas time he's wasted fixing Windows, he'd have hit the nail on the head.  Unfortunately, he's talking about Ubuntu, Fedora and OpenSuse.May 07 05:23
twitterAs someone who moved his family to free software eight years ago, I can say he's full of beans.  Distributions like Ubuntu and Mepis are easy to use, stable and trivial to upgrade.  My kids play games, my wife does her social browsing, everyone's email works and it is all rather painless.  I go years between upgrades and do precious little upkeep that's not adding new hardware.  My little brother looks after my mom's Windows dissasMay 07 05:23
twitterThe author rounds off his rant with some nonsense about scaling for large companies.  This is something achieved with separate tools that are easily able to manage just about any desktop but Windows.  Apparently, he's never assisted a Fortune 100 "upgrade."  I have, and it was a total pain in the rear where each and every computer needed individual attention for license verification and other nonsense.  Yes, the company in questionMay 07 05:24
twitterNon free software applications each have their individual quirks that change constantly and must be dealt with one at a time.  The process was as automated as it could be with netboots and a good GNU/Linux machine to serve binaries but it was truly painful.  People were able to "upgrade" about 4 computers per hour each.  It took dozens of people weeks to accomplish what is fully automated in the free software world.  Non free softwMay 07 05:24
twitterFree software is here on the desktop both at home and at work.  Cooperation in freedom accomplishes tasks that non free software never will.   Please don't feed the trolls who deny it.May 07 05:24
twitterEnd CommentMay 07 05:25
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**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu May 7 05:40:09 2009
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu May 7 05:40:45 2009
*Now talking on #boycottnovellMay 07 05:40
*Topic for #boycottnovell is: "Exploring the reality behind exclusionary deals with Microsoft and their subtle (yet severe) implications" [publicly logged]May 07 05:40
*Topic for #boycottnovell set by schestowitz at Sun Oct 5 19:20:28 2008May 07 05:40
-ChanServ-[#boycottnovell] Welcome to the #boycottnovell channelMay 07 05:40
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DaemonFCschestowitz: That's the convenient cop out for every hardware maker that doesn't want to either support Linux or open their driversMay 07 05:53
DaemonFC"It changes too much" "Which one would you like us to support?"May 07 05:53
DaemonFCWhat sucks is that a lot of hardware makers can't open source their driver even if they want to, cause they had to license something from someone else to begin withMay 07 05:54
DaemonFCso they might not even own everything you'd needMay 07 05:54
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DaemonFCI'm sure that's got something to do with AverMedia only releasing binary driversMay 07 05:55
DaemonFCthere's probably a ton of stuff they licensed to go into their driverMay 07 05:55
twitterA free driver would not be so hard to make.May 07 05:56
twitterThere are plenty of good examples and hardware companies would do well to quit paying licensing fees for things like that.May 07 05:57
DaemonFCwell, the choice I have is thisMay 07 06:00
DaemonFCbuy a $50 TV tuner widget that has a closed source driver and official supportMay 07 06:00
DaemonFCor spend $90 and get one that is said to work with an open source driver, but that's unofficial and don't ask the company that made it for supportMay 07 06:01
DaemonFCnot exactly a good choiceMay 07 06:01
twitterYou could buy a used analog card for next to nothing and do all the recording you want.May 07 06:02
DaemonFCthen again, if I save the $40, the company could decide that they won't support Linux anymore and the next release of my distribution may not work with their driverMay 07 06:02
DaemonFCthat linuxtv site has no clear list of models supported and by what driversMay 07 06:03
twitterthere are better sites.May 07 06:03
DaemonFCthis seems to be like 3d accelerators in 1999May 07 06:03
twitterthere's a great photo gallery of BT878 hardware someplace.May 07 06:03
DaemonFC"I heard that this model works with that driver if you follow the 300 step installation"May 07 06:04
twitterMy ATI wonder card works just fineMay 07 06:04
DaemonFCI never paid it much attention when I bought the computer because I had never had a TV card beforeMay 07 06:04
twitterIt took a little set up.  I had to figure out that it registered itself as /dev/video0 instead of /dev/videoMay 07 06:05
DaemonFCso it's one of those things where you never thought you needed it til you saw what a cool idea it was :PMay 07 06:05
twitterand /dev/dsp1 instead of /dev/dsp which are VLC defaults with LennyMay 07 06:05
DaemonFCheh, then I have to wonder if VLC for Linux would work right if I tried to use it to watch the streamMay 07 06:06
twitterIt's only cool if you are actually watching TV.May 07 06:06
twitterStreaming and recording work well with VLC.May 07 06:06
DaemonFCon Vista it just makes my TV stream go black and then the card won't work til I rebootMay 07 06:06
twitterNothing works with Vista and newer "HD" capture cards are all DRM encumbered.May 07 06:07
DaemonFCI know it's not any fancy DRM or anythingMay 07 06:07
twitterDRM is baked in.May 07 06:07
DaemonFCAverMedia Center lets you record the streams to anything that DirectShow supportsMay 07 06:07
DaemonFCeven TheoraMay 07 06:07
DaemonFC:PMay 07 06:07
twitterI don't know AverMedia.May 07 06:08
twitterVLC works for me.May 07 06:08
DaemonFCit seems like it would be an awful lot of trouble to intentionally corral someone into using software where they can still do anything they wantMay 07 06:08
DaemonFCthat just smells of a bug to meMay 07 06:08
twitterSomeone seems to have corraled you into Vista.May 07 06:09
twitterGood luck.May 07 06:09
DaemonFCwell, with hardware where manuals are written in EngrishMay 07 06:09
DaemonFConly expect them to make any effort to support WindowsMay 07 06:09
DaemonFCif thatMay 07 06:09
twitterhttp://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/179019May 07 06:09
twitterJust get a used card and any GNU/Linux distribution.May 07 06:10
DaemonFCWindows doesn't degrade any HD movie that isn't encoded with that flagMay 07 06:11
twitterIf you have a digital TV converter box, you can record 640x480 and it's close to DVD quality.May 07 06:11
DaemonFCand not even Blu Ray uses that (yet)May 07 06:11
DaemonFCit's not going to mangle your home movies :PMay 07 06:11
twitterVista will degrade your own home movies.May 07 06:11
twitterYes it does.May 07 06:11
twitterI've got links to at least two articles where people report just that.May 07 06:12
twitterhttp://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/181193May 07 06:12
twitterhttp://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/08/13/0249222May 07 06:12
DaemonFCoh, you're talking about the HDCP handshakeMay 07 06:13
DaemonFCand no, it doesn't degrade your stuffMay 07 06:13
DaemonFCI use a DVI connector and have not had that happenMay 07 06:13
DaemonFCmaybe over VGA, but damnMay 07 06:13
twitterwhy should it label your movie "premium content" and degrade it to over VGA?May 07 06:15
twitterDoes M$ really want my GNU/Linux laptop to do a better home theater, through a VGA projector, than an expensive Vista media PC?May 07 06:15
DaemonFCI didn't say it didMay 07 06:16
DaemonFCI meant I don't use VGA, so Iall I know is it doesn't over DVIMay 07 06:16
twitterWhy would you trust your media to a company that does that?May 07 06:17
twitterWhat if they decide they want to kill DVI the way they seem to want to kill VGA?May 07 06:17
DaemonFCSo far even Windows 7 doesn't do thatMay 07 06:17
DaemonFCthe content protection token is theoretically embedded into commercial HD content like Blu RayMay 07 06:18
DaemonFCbut no titles even use it yetMay 07 06:18
twitterAs you say, it does not make sense to corral people into something they don't have control over, which is why they aim to kill SPDIF, VGA and other DRM free interfaces.May 07 06:18
DaemonFCso I would call BS on anyone claiming to have been affected by itMay 07 06:18
twitterGo argue with Gutmann.May 07 06:19
DaemonFCI still use analog jack for my speakersMay 07 06:19
twitterI'll keep my media free thank you.May 07 06:19
DaemonFCwell, it's not doing anything to meMay 07 06:19
twitteryetMay 07 06:19
twitteryou would be better off with firewire raw capture and editMay 07 06:20
twittersave to the format you wantMay 07 06:20
twitterPart of your TV card problem may be poor driver support.  I don't think industry has recovered from the last minute pull of XP's drivers from Vista.  http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/03/03/2052255May 07 06:22
twitterI'm not sure they want to do M$ that favor either.May 07 06:22
DaemonFCVista supports WDMMay 07 06:23
twitterwhat's that?May 07 06:23
DaemonFCtechnically any WDM driver should work on 98/Me, 2000, XP, Server 2003, Vista, Server 2008, and 7May 07 06:23
DaemonFCyes, any WDM driver should still work in 98May 07 06:23
DaemonFCeven if it's not supportedMay 07 06:23
DaemonFCVista and 7 support WDDM as well, but that's only for display driversMay 07 06:24
DaemonFCThey also support NDIS 6 and 5May 07 06:24
twittertechnically, that's correct.  I have a web cam that did not work with 98 and I doubt it would work with Vista.May 07 06:24
DaemonFCso you can use 2000/XP wifi drivers in a pinchMay 07 06:24
DaemonFCbut not recommendedMay 07 06:24
DaemonFCplaces that made devices for Windows 98 did not usually use WDMMay 07 06:25
DaemonFCthey usually used VxDMay 07 06:25
twitterplease stop.May 07 06:25
DaemonFCwhich died with Windows MeMay 07 06:25
twitterI remember the error messages.May 07 06:25
DaemonFCMicrosoft didn't publicize WDM support all that wellMay 07 06:26
DaemonFCso companies kept making Windows 95 style driversMay 07 06:26
DaemonFC:DMay 07 06:26
twitteryou will give me nightmares of trying to make hardware work with shiny disks and floppies that never really work.May 07 06:26
twitterI'm so much happier with free software.May 07 06:26
DaemonFCwhat was fun.....was VxD drivers BEFORE System File ProtectionMay 07 06:27
DaemonFCoh boy you were in for a treatMay 07 06:27
DaemonFCespecially with no name hardwareMay 07 06:27
DaemonFC:PMay 07 06:27
twitter"no name hardware" has the same chipsets as branded shit.May 07 06:27
DaemonFCmeh, sometimesMay 07 06:28
DaemonFCHint: If the software says "Backuping your BIOS"May 07 06:28
twitterbrand name often means little more than advertising budgetMay 07 06:28
DaemonFCtime to clutch the arms of the chairMay 07 06:28
DaemonFC:DMay 07 06:28
twitteryou can keep itMay 07 06:28
DaemonFCmiraculously it survivedMay 07 06:29
DaemonFCoh, they do a shitty job at AMIMay 07 06:29
DaemonFCI've had to update my BIOS at least 6-7 timesMay 07 06:29
DaemonFCbecause of the dumbest thingsMay 07 06:29
DaemonFCLinux will say "AMI BIOS detected, BIOS may corrupt low memory, working around it"May 07 06:30
DaemonFCin other words "Fuck this, I don't trust that thing"May 07 06:30
DaemonFC:)May 07 06:30
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mib_d2wzmiHey, anyone home?May 07 06:36
DaemonFCtwitter: In most tasks, Vista is 2-3% slower than XPMay 07 06:42
DaemonFCthe dramatic fringe cases of DRM holocaust can't possibly happen til the content degradation token is flipped on for Blu Ray DiscsMay 07 06:43
DaemonFC(Which I don't even have the drive for)May 07 06:43
DaemonFCwhat is just sad is the quality of the driversMay 07 06:44
mib_d2wzmicontent degradation?May 07 06:44
DaemonFCanyway, most of the benchmarks between Vista and XP are from after Vista RTM was just out and the video drivers were not all that greatMay 07 06:45
DaemonFCVista will degrade Blu Ray to about 10% higher resolution than a standard DVD if you don't have an HDCP connection *and* the movie studio has encoded the disc to ask for thatMay 07 06:46
DaemonFC(which no discs do yet and won't for at least another year)May 07 06:46
mib_d2wzmioh... i thought they will eraze the hd-dvd...May 07 06:46
mib_d2wzmithat would really degrade things :)May 07 06:46
DaemonFCHD-DVD is deadMay 07 06:46
mib_d2wzmidetails... you know what i mean :)May 07 06:47
DaemonFCthat was the format Microsoft was backingMay 07 06:47
DaemonFCthe reason the industry disowned it was because it was permanently crackedMay 07 06:47
mib_d2wzmiwell, bd had that virual machine thingy to run custom protection codeMay 07 06:48
DaemonFCI wonder if twitter is aware of AnyDVDHDMay 07 06:48
DaemonFCwhich can strip a Blu Ray of all the DRM and make an unencrypted copyMay 07 06:48
DaemonFCeven on VistaMay 07 06:48
mib_d2wzmiugh, VistaMay 07 06:48
DaemonFCI've ran it on Windows 7, and it still worksMay 07 06:49
mib_d2wzmithey can kill the hack thoughMay 07 06:49
mib_d2wzmiby revoking the key anyDVD is usingMay 07 06:49
DaemonFCit doesn't use a keyMay 07 06:50
mib_d2wzmihmm... i wonderMay 07 06:50
DaemonFCand it has a heuristic mechanismMay 07 06:50
mib_d2wzmiweakness in the encryption?May 07 06:50
DaemonFCyeah, I believe soMay 07 06:50
mib_d2wzminice...May 07 06:50
DaemonFCI mainly use it to remove region coding crapMay 07 06:50
DaemonFCthen you can play the copy on any DVD playerMay 07 06:50
mib_d2wzmihope nobody will have to go to jail for that... unlike dvd crackMay 07 06:50
mib_d2wzmiwhat happened to that kid, the one who cracked dvd?May 07 06:51
DaemonFChttp://www.slysoft.com/en/anydvd.htmlMay 07 06:51
DaemonFCJon Johanson?May 07 06:51
DaemonFCor however you spell that?May 07 06:51
mib_d2wzmiyaMay 07 06:51
mib_d2wzmihimMay 07 06:51
mib_d2wzmibtw... openSuse can't play DVDs well... i had to jump hoops to get it workingMay 07 06:53
mib_d2wzmiubuntu works much better for some reasonMay 07 06:53
DaemonFCPACKMAN repoMay 07 06:53
mib_d2wzmiyeah, packman repo didnt work with suseMay 07 06:53
DaemonFCdon't they have libdvdcss2?May 07 06:53
mib_d2wzmithey do, i got it, but vlc wouldn't play any dvdsMay 07 06:53
mib_d2wzmikmplayer worked, but was a bit buggyMay 07 06:54
DaemonFCyou also need the VLC from PackmanMay 07 06:54
DaemonFCnot the one from SuseMay 07 06:54
mib_d2wzmioh, that's probably oneMay 07 06:54
DaemonFC:)May 07 06:54
mib_d2wzmidoesnt matter anyome, i ditched suseMay 07 06:54
mib_d2wzmii was using tomboy, but then i found it's using monoMay 07 06:54
mib_d2wzmithen i ditched suseMay 07 06:54
DaemonFCtheir quality has really been shot to hell with the 11.x seriesMay 07 06:55
mib_d2wzmiyeah, kde4 integration was badMay 07 06:55
mib_d2wzmii mean it wasnt even stable to release withMay 07 06:55
mib_d2wzmithough that's the reason i went with suse, to try out kde4May 07 06:55
DaemonFCwell, I really don't like Mono, not just the patent kerfluffleMay 07 06:55
DaemonFCbut it's not even directly comaptible with .NetMay 07 06:56
mib_d2wzmiyeah, what's the pointMay 07 06:56
DaemonFCso I'm not even sure why anyone would use itMay 07 06:56
mib_d2wzmii use javaMay 07 06:56
mib_d2wzmiso i dislike .net in generalMay 07 06:56
mib_d2wzmiit's blatant java rip offMay 07 06:56
mib_d2wzmifor no reasonMay 07 06:56
DaemonFCI try not to use eitherMay 07 06:56
DaemonFCI have one JAVA app on this machineMay 07 06:56
DaemonFCthats Azureus/VuzeMay 07 06:57
mib_d2wzmioh, limewire is java as well... that's about it for notable java appsMay 07 06:57
mib_d2wzmifor some reason it never took off as much for desktop appsMay 07 06:57
DaemonFCWell, Peerguardian doesn't work on Vista x64May 07 06:58
DaemonFCand Azureus is the only decent client that can do blocklisting within the client itselfMay 07 06:58
mib_d2wzmiohMay 07 06:58
mib_d2wzminothing works well on vista... due to compatibity issuesMay 07 06:59
mib_d2wzmitoo many changes in the apiMay 07 06:59
DaemonFCwell, Peerguardian has a kernel mode driverMay 07 06:59
mib_d2wzmiohMay 07 06:59
DaemonFCand it can't load it on Vista x64 because it's not signedMay 07 06:59
mib_d2wzmiwhy use vista :)May 07 07:00
mib_d2wzmiit's like a drug... you know it's bad but cant help itMay 07 07:01
DaemonFCI think I'll probably be buying a Mac next timeMay 07 07:04
mib_d2wzmiMacs are nice, if you have the cashMay 07 07:05
mib_d2wzmiSo Vista gives no option to accept unsigned drivers?May 07 07:07
mib_d2wzmiThat would mean MS has the ability to push vendors off the market by not accpting their driversMay 07 07:08
DaemonFCthey used to let you install unsigned drivers if you selected that option from a boot menuMay 07 07:10
DaemonFCthere was an app you could install that hit F8 and selected the No Driver Signaqture Check option every bootMay 07 07:11
DaemonFCbut MS got rid of that in SP1 and laterMay 07 07:11
mib_d2wzmiinterestingMay 07 07:11
DaemonFCMicrosoft claims it's for security purposesMay 07 07:11
DaemonFCto prevent viruses from hijacking the kernelMay 07 07:11
DaemonFC:PMay 07 07:12
mib_d2wzmiyeah... but it's not stopping the virusesMay 07 07:12
DaemonFChttp://blogs.msdn.com/windowsvistasecurity/archive/2006/08/11/695993.aspxMay 07 07:12
DaemonFCAn Introduction to Kernel Patch ProtectionMay 07 07:12
mib_d2wzmii was installing drivers for my wireless, they werent sighned for xpMay 07 07:12
mib_d2wzmiand the box advertised linux compatibilityMay 07 07:12
mib_d2wzmiso i did a little research and the company actually open sourced their driversMay 07 07:13
mib_d2wzmii guess they couldnt get MS to sighn it, so instead they tried to target linux usersMay 07 07:13
DaemonFCbut SP1 also introduced a documented way for antivirus to hook into the kernelMay 07 07:13
DaemonFCso I think the lack of Peerguardian support is just shoddy development on their endMay 07 07:14
DaemonFCthere's no reason they couldn't just use the same kernel hooks as an antivirusMay 07 07:14
mib_d2wzmiim sure drivers require different hooksMay 07 07:14
DaemonFCsome drivers will still install without a signatureMay 07 07:14
DaemonFCif you install a beta Nvidia driver, Windows will bitchMay 07 07:15
DaemonFCbut you can override itMay 07 07:15
mib_d2wzmiim sure big companies have less problems with itMay 07 07:15
mib_d2wzmiits the small fishes that get fried due to budget limitsMay 07 07:15
mib_d2wzmiyou have to write one driver for xp, another one for vista... another one for mac, and somethign for linuxMay 07 07:17
mib_d2wzmiinstead of one driver, you have to write 4May 07 07:17
mib_d2wzmiand keep em up to dateMay 07 07:17
mib_d2wzmiunless you have good sales on your product, taht would cost too muchMay 07 07:18
mib_d2wzmiand im sure ms driver certification is not freeMay 07 07:18
DaemonFC$500 a yearMay 07 07:19
mib_d2wzmithat's not too badMay 07 07:20
DaemonFC"Windows Vista includes the "Windows Filtering Platform", which enables software to perform network oriented activities such as packet inspection and other activities necessary to support firewall products."May 07 07:20
DaemonFCso Peerguardian could be made Vista compatible with no hooking into the kernelMay 07 07:20
mib_d2wzmiwell... maybe they dont like to work with vista :)May 07 07:20
mib_d2wzmiafter all the negative buzz generated around it and anticipation of win 7 many dev simply ignore vistaMay 07 07:21
DaemonFCVista and 7 are pretty compatible with each otherMay 07 07:21
DaemonFCI imagine that most software stamped "Windows 7" will work with VistaMay 07 07:22
mib_d2wzmiso then windows 7 must be as bad as vista...May 07 07:23
DaemonFCit's not really all that differentMay 07 07:23
DaemonFCPeople will develop Vista software one way or the otherMay 07 07:24
mib_d2wzmiprobablyMay 07 07:24
mib_d2wzmii use java, so it will run anywhere anywayMay 07 07:24
mib_d2wzmidon't ahve to deal with all the platform issuesMay 07 07:25
DaemonFCschestowitz: http://www.pcworld.com/article/164485/windows_7_rc_benchmarks.htmlMay 07 07:25
DaemonFCSpeed Test: Windows 7 May Not Be Much Faster Than VistaMay 07 07:25
DaemonFCmarginally faster than VistaMay 07 07:25
DaemonFCwe're talking 1%May 07 07:26
DaemonFCor lessMay 07 07:26
DaemonFCso it's basically a tieMay 07 07:26
mib_d2wzmiwell... the question is... it wont matterMay 07 07:26
mib_d2wzmipeople will buy into the marketing buzz and buy it anywayMay 07 07:27
mib_d2wzmiits all about marketingMay 07 07:27
mib_d2wzmiand bribing the right peopleMay 07 07:27
DaemonFCthey got to the Nero 7 test and noticed Windows 7 is 10-15% fasterMay 07 07:28
DaemonFCthat's not really the caseMay 07 07:28
mib_d2wzmiwhy notMay 07 07:28
DaemonFCif you install proper chipset drivers for your motherboard, then you should have optimized hard disk controller drivers in VistaMay 07 07:29
DaemonFCthe ones that come with Vista work, but they're not optimalMay 07 07:29
DaemonFCthe only difference seems to be is that Vista has better default driversMay 07 07:29
mib_d2wzmiyou mean the other way aroundMay 07 07:30
DaemonFCthe 7-8% boost on Autodesk is also easily explainedMay 07 07:30
DaemonFCDirectX 11May 07 07:30
DaemonFCwhich will be backported to VistaMay 07 07:30
mib_d2wzmiogl > directX :)May 07 07:31
mib_d2wzmiuntil ID software says otherwiseMay 07 07:31
DaemonFCthey use bothMay 07 07:32
mib_d2wzmiyeahMay 07 07:32
mib_d2wzmito port x-boxMay 07 07:32
DaemonFCthey also use DirectX on WindowsMay 07 07:32
DaemonFCthey only use OpenGL on OS X and LinuxMay 07 07:32
mib_d2wzmiQuake 3 was oglMay 07 07:33
DaemonFCOpenGL has become a train wreckMay 07 07:33
mib_d2wzmiso was doom 3May 07 07:33
DaemonFCOpenGL 3 was supposed to be revolutionary and so much infighting broke outMay 07 07:33
mib_d2wzmiogl hasnt changed much, they've added a bit here and thereMay 07 07:33
DaemonFCit became a few piddly extensionsMay 07 07:33
mib_d2wzmiyeah, but the thing isMay 07 07:33
mib_d2wzmiall the changes are api changesMay 07 07:34
mib_d2wzmiit gets the job done either waMay 07 07:34
mib_d2wzmiall the big fuss coming from developers claiming it's hard to useMay 07 07:34
mib_d2wzmithough it aint that hardMay 07 07:35
mib_d2wzmithere is no breakthroughMay 07 07:36
mib_d2wzmiyou have api, you keep adding features as hardware gets more sophisticatedMay 07 07:36
mib_d2wzmiMS always markets things as WOW, BREAKTHROUGH, OMFG, SO COOLMay 07 07:37
mib_d2wzmibut on the back end it's a couple of new features on top of the same old conceptsMay 07 07:37
DaemonFCI'm just not real thrilled with OpenGL 3May 07 07:39
DaemonFCa day late and a dollar short?May 07 07:39
DaemonFC:)May 07 07:39
mib_d2wzmithat's how it goes with standartsMay 07 07:41
mib_d2wzmithey will eventually evolve, just some influential companies don't want to rewrite their stuff for ogl3May 07 07:41
mib_d2wzmibackwards compatibility is importantMay 07 07:42
mib_d2wzmigames with relaxed requirements get consumed more, take World of Warcraft for example... you never needed newest stuff to run itMay 07 07:43
mib_d2wzmithe game market lags a couple of years behind the hardware market, so they have plenty of room to reactMay 07 07:43
DaemonFCmeh, I don't want to sing high praises for DirectX or anything, but it gets developed much fasterMay 07 07:44
DaemonFCthe people behind OpenGL 3 just argued their way into second placeMay 07 07:44
mib_d2wzmiwhen i see directX on all the platforms, i'll consider it :)May 07 07:46
DaemonFCthey either need to throw the CAD people overboard, throw the gaming people overboard, or develop separate dialects for each purposeMay 07 07:46
DaemonFCthe third option is where they're going with thisMay 07 07:46
mib_d2wzmii think people are overreactingMay 07 07:46
mib_d2wzmias far as i'm concerned ogl works just fineMay 07 07:47
mib_d2wzmithe problem is on the side of writing the drivers, not as much on the side of using oglMay 07 07:47
mib_d2wzmithey have big api - harder to write driversMay 07 07:47
mib_d2wzmibut when using it - don't use what you don't want...May 07 07:48
mib_d2wzmithe whole ogl3 was supposed to make it easier to write drivers by dumping some functionalityMay 07 07:48
mib_d2wzmiand make things "prettier" when using the apiMay 07 07:48
mib_d2wzmibut the fact it - it still works either way, provides the same features and equally fastMay 07 07:48
mib_d2wzmithey could do better for sure... but it's not as bad as many people believeMay 07 07:49
DaemonFCsomething that I won't give up though is FLACMay 07 08:22
DaemonFC:PMay 07 08:22
mib_d2wzmino, you must give it up NOWMay 07 08:28
mib_d2wzmior else... :)May 07 08:28
*DaemonFC beats mib_d2wzmi over the head with Intervideo PC FriendlyMay 07 08:28
DaemonFC:PMay 07 08:28
DaemonFCVista doesn't support holding down SHIFT to disable AutoplayMay 07 08:29
DaemonFCyou have to turn it off from the control panelMay 07 08:29
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schestowitzWeird. BN gives many error pagesMay 07 09:20
DaemonFCI'm getting used to bizarre errors that take a ludicrous amount of time to debugMay 07 09:21
DaemonFC:PMay 07 09:21
schestowitzMaybe it's related to server load. I don't know...May 07 09:22
DaemonFCI was not amused by the wifi driver that comes with Vista, kills Vista bugMay 07 09:22
DaemonFCbut googling it shows me that I'm far from alone in experiencing thisMay 07 09:22
DaemonFClooks like the problem lives on into Windows 7 with some cardsMay 07 09:23
DaemonFCI never had that problem on XPMay 07 09:24
DaemonFCI wonder what the hell they didMay 07 09:24
schestowitzWe get loads of traffic so it chokesMay 07 09:29
DaemonFCschestowitz: Looks like Rupert Murdoch's Empire of Lies over at the Fixed Noise Network is collapsingMay 07 09:29
schestowitzAll sorts of things give error messagsMay 07 09:29
schestowitzbrbMay 07 09:29
schestowitzDaemonFC: URL?May 07 09:30
DaemonFCwatching Keith OlbermannMay 07 09:30
schestowitzI'm sure he'll be bailed outMay 07 09:30
schestowitz(Fox)May 07 09:30
DaemonFCapparently Fox News is going brokeMay 07 09:30
schestowitzIt's national propagandaMay 07 09:30
DaemonFCand they just admitted itMay 07 09:30
schestowitzNeeds to be fundedby taxpayersMay 07 09:30
schestowitzRupert has $$May 07 09:30
schestowitzHe won't let it sinkMay 07 09:30
DaemonFCno, Fox news is more or less Republican propagandaMay 07 09:30
schestowitzAnd Keith Olbermann is biased vs themMay 07 09:31
DaemonFCand the Republicans don't have the kind of pull they did :)May 07 09:31
DaemonFCFox News is 97% down on revenue vs first quarter last yearMay 07 09:32
DaemonFCand news Corp over 40% down totalMay 07 09:32
DaemonFCif I heard that rightMay 07 09:32
DaemonFCwell, if they did go under it would certainly be no great lossMay 07 09:33
DaemonFCat least with some news networks, you may get some real news alongside the propagandaMay 07 09:33
DaemonFCFox is 99% propagandaMay 07 09:33
schestowitz brbMay 07 09:34
DaemonFCerrrMay 07 09:36
DaemonFCtotal 47%May 07 09:36
DaemonFCnewspaper down 97%May 07 09:36
DaemonFCFox News is down 99% in profitsMay 07 09:36
DaemonFChe even lost money on "American Idol"May 07 09:37
DaemonFClolMay 07 09:37
DaemonFChttp://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20090506-720083.htmlMay 07 09:38
DaemonFC"The television segment's operating income plummeted by $415 million to $4 million, reflecting declines in ad revenue, the absense of both the Super Bowl and contributions from eight stations sold in July 2008, and higher programming costs because of the year-ago writers strike."May 07 09:39
DaemonFCniceMay 07 09:39
DaemonFCit would be nice to see Fixed Noise get killed off by the recessionMay 07 09:39
DaemonFCthen nobody could say no good came from itMay 07 09:40
schestowitzI'm sure another bad channel will grab the audience lost by FauxMay 07 09:46
schestowitzCertain people are simply attracted to thatMay 07 09:46
schestowitzIt's like saying, it we ban the KKK, racism will stopMay 07 09:46
schestowitz[rather than go underground or find another umrella]May 07 09:46
schestowitzSame with Al QaedaMay 07 09:47
schestowitzBN gives me the s*tsMay 07 09:48
schestowitzError pages and stuff on occasionsMay 07 09:48
schestowitztwitter couldn't leave a commentMay 07 09:48
schestowitzI barelyu could eitherMay 07 09:48
schestowitzAnd I think server load causes thisMay 07 09:48
MinceRgeekingsMay 07 09:52
schestowitzWTF?May 07 09:54
schestowitzhttp://blog.internetnews.com/skerner/2009/05/novell-moonlight-20-previews-s.htmlMay 07 09:54
schestowitz" John Bailo said: It's bigger than that. The Moonlight port clearly proves that Linux can deliver DRM'd media to users. (Hulu has already proven that with its Flash based delivery system, but this should assure customers). I look forward to the day when Real's Rhapsody client can work on Linux and I can download and move audio files to my Sansa View.May 07 09:54
schestowitz"May 07 09:54
schestowitzOh ohMay 07 09:54
schestowitzBailo's back?May 07 09:54
schestowitzFormer MS employeeMay 07 09:54
DaemonFCI'm still waiting for why I should give a flying fuck if I can play DRM crippled filesMay 07 09:55
DaemonFCAre they going to pay ME 99 cents a song to take them?May 07 09:55
schestowitzYeah...May 07 09:55
schestowitzWell, the man used to be in c.o.linux.a. in USENETMay 07 09:56
schestowitzConsidered a troll by someMay 07 09:56
schestowitzIt would be bad if all sorts of MSFTers made demands for stuff like Moonlight and DRMMay 07 09:56
DaemonFCI will never buy any music or movies that I can't watch on my own termsMay 07 09:56
DaemonFCor convert to my format of choiceMay 07 09:56
schestowitzhttp://www.linux-mag.com/id/7324May 07 09:56
schestowitzYou can't BUYMay 07 09:57
schestowitzThat's the thingMay 07 09:57
schestowitzThey RENTMay 07 09:57
schestowitzSo the notions and words must changeMay 07 09:57
DaemonFCwell, they can count me outMay 07 09:57
DaemonFCDRM obviously isn't workingMay 07 09:57
DaemonFCor they wouldn't be removing itMay 07 09:57
schestowitz"Dear Sir,May 07 10:08
schestowitzI was waiting for a paper document, bearing a signature.May 07 10:08
schestowitzMaybe you have noticed that all amicus curiae briefs published are signed and thus made authentic.May 07 10:08
schestowitzNow, if you send me your statement as signed pdf.file or fax it will be online with the next update. "May 07 10:08
schestowitzMeh. I can't be botheredMay 07 10:08
schestowitzI guess it's good that they verify identity, but it would still be easy to fake had someone tried itMay 07 10:08
schestowitzSomeone might help us OWN the linux action show... "I hadn't realized they had a Wikipedia entry. I'll transcribe the whole video and post it. Nothing like original quotes from the originator :0 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_action_show "May 07 10:13
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DaemonFChttp://download.cnet.com/8301-2007_4-10234111-12.html?tag=contentMain;contentBodyMay 07 10:21
DaemonFCWhat to expect in Windows 7 RCMay 07 10:21
DaemonFCthey're really scraping the bottom of the bucket to find things that differentiate it from VistaMay 07 10:22
schestowitzDaemonFC: it's CNETMay 07 10:23
schestowitzIt's not enwsMay 07 10:23
schestowitzit's zdnet's cousinMay 07 10:23
schestowitzOwned by CBS nowMay 07 10:24
schestowitzInvestments for CNET came from Paul Allen, just to give you an idea..May 07 10:24
DaemonFChttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/06/p2p_bill_overreach/May 07 10:24
schestowitzThe UK is basically f*ed as a democracyMay 07 10:25
schestowitzWe have surveillance here like you wouldn't believeMay 07 10:25
schestowitzEven the US military gets copies of our E-mails here because the govt. gives it to them AFAIMay 07 10:25
schestowitz*KMay 07 10:25
DaemonFCmight as wellMay 07 10:26
DaemonFCwe'll get it anyway, they're jsut saving us the troubleMay 07 10:26
DaemonFC:DMay 07 10:26
schestowitzThe UK goes back to medieval ages faster than the US in some aspectsMay 07 10:26
schestowitzIt's easier because the UK is well wired and smallMay 07 10:26
schestowitzSo you can easily put CCTV at every street cornerMay 07 10:26
schestowitzHA! OpenText Buying Vignette and the Impact of Open Source Content Management < http://ostatic.com/blog/opentext-buying-vignette-and-the-impact-of-open-source-content-management >May 07 10:28
schestowitzMotorola's new Linux phones are based on Android (they gave up on WinMo): http://ostatic.com/blog/motorolas-android-smartphones-are-for-real-news-and-photos-arrivingMay 07 10:28
iwmwhehe, winmo is dying slowly :)May 07 10:30
schestowitzIt isMay 07 10:30
schestowitzNot because I dislike MicrosoftMay 07 10:30
schestowitzbecause it is.May 07 10:30
schestowitzIt's too expensive to maintain/develop and revenue from it is too mere. Microsoft loses TONS of money there and Microsoft fans too (market watchers) say it'll die, so...May 07 10:31
schestowitzMS bought Danger. Anything came out of that yet?May 07 10:31
schestowitzMS hired some BSD devs. I think they are totally lost and don't know what to do now.May 07 10:32
schestowitzEarlier today I also read that they'll use PowerSet in the next SEMay 07 10:33
schestowitzLike Hotmail at the time, it's FOSSMay 07 10:33
schestowitzBut all those buyouts weighing at 100s of millions will get them nowhere. it's DUPLICATION of effort.. trying to replace what they already have.May 07 10:33
schestowitzPentagon Rejects Its Own Pundit Program Whitewash < http://www.prwatch.org/node/8367 >May 07 10:35
schestowitzThis site continues to be excellent for a dose of realityMay 07 10:36
schestowitzhttp://www.prwatch.org/node/8362 "In Scotland, police have been offering environmentalists money in return for information about activist groups."May 07 10:37
schestowitzCyberbullying Law Makes Being Mean Online A Felony < http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/05/04/cyberbullying-law-makes-being-mean-online-a-felony >. This is a tool for net censorshipMay 07 10:38
schestowitzGoogle stung again:  Google Results Polluted By Cybercrooks < http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/04/17/google-results-polluted-by-cybercrooks >May 07 10:39
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schestowitzWhy did this get buried after it was promoted? http://digg.com/microsoft/The_fall_of_Microsoft?t=25158343#c25158343May 07 10:42
schestowitzIntel discontinuing Core i7 940  < http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1136852/intel-discontinuing-core-i7-940 >. EU Commission should discontinue IntelMay 07 10:43
schestowitzAnother Softie waves goodbye: http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=2704May 07 10:45
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oiaohmOpenoffice 3.1.0 is offically released.May 07 10:51
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DaemonFChmmmMay 07 10:57
DaemonFClooks like some guy posted a crack that let Windows Dreamscene work on cheaper versions of VistaMay 07 10:58
DaemonFCand got a harassment letter from MicrosofMay 07 10:58
DaemonFC*MicrosoftMay 07 10:58
DaemonFCbut that was likelyMay 07 10:58
schestowitzThe Curious Case of Android v. Android http://www.linuxinsider.com/story/The-Curious-Case-of-Android-v-Android-66993.htmlMay 07 11:02
schestowitzharassment letter?May 07 11:03
schestowitzproof?May 07 11:03
DaemonFChttp://www.mydigitallife.info/2007/05/10/hack-to-run-dreamscene-in-vista-home-premium-basic-starter-business-and-enterprise/comment-page-2/#comment-231042May 07 11:03
schestowitzhttp://www.linuxjournal.com/content/google-and-giant-robotic-flyswatter (Google and the Giant Robotic FlyswatterMay 07 11:06
schestowitzIt's sick. People own words from the DICTIONARYMay 07 11:06
schestowitzI guess I could call my product "Mug" and then be sued for $1000May 07 11:06
DaemonFCschestowitz: You ever think about maybe running a toxic.html?May 07 11:06
DaemonFCthere was a program that buried hidden links in your site to confuse spambots at one pointMay 07 11:07
DaemonFCI wonder is something could be cooked up to lead Microsoft on a wile goose chaseMay 07 11:07
DaemonFC*wildMay 07 11:07
schestowitzHehe.May 07 11:08
schestowitzGood fit for a post I haveMay 07 11:08
DaemonFCit would be mildly hilarious to have them paying people to chase their own tailMay 07 11:08
schestowitzI mean, the takedownMay 07 11:08
DaemonFCI can't believe they care that much about DreamsceneMay 07 11:08
DaemonFCit's not even in Windows 7May 07 11:09
DaemonFCand they said it was cause of its unpopularityMay 07 11:09
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schestowitz::>May 07 11:11
schestowitzDaemonFC: in the past people didn't mind infringementMay 07 11:11
schestowitzNeither copying of WIndows nor patentsMay 07 11:12
schestowitzNow it's using TomTomMay 07 11:12
schestowitzIt's suing shops that sell WIndowsMay 07 11:12
schestowitzfor 'counterfeiting'May 07 11:12
schestowitzIt chases bloggers around with DMCA takedownsMay 07 11:12
schestowitzIt sues IBM... OH WAIT!! Microsoft didn't actually do that. t just paid SCO for thisMay 07 11:12
DaemonFCnoMay 07 11:13
ushimitsudoki1MS suing TomTom is one of the best things to happen for FLOSS, I think. It removes the whole "MS never used patents aggressively" line that MS apologists so loved to throw aroundMay 07 11:13
DaemonFCit just bought the most expensive SCO UNIX license EVERMay 07 11:13
DaemonFC;)May 07 11:13
DaemonFCAdam Williamson took that line with meMay 07 11:13
DaemonFCon his blogMay 07 11:13
schestowitzushimitsudoki1: it wasn't just TomTOMMay 07 11:14
schestowitzThat was the first patent suit against OFSSMay 07 11:14
schestowitzAnd also against softwareMay 07 11:14
DaemonFCso I wonder why Fedora still has FAT supportMay 07 11:14
schestowitzIt sued over hardware (Primax)May 07 11:14
schestowitzBut......May 07 11:14
schestowitzBear in mind that extortion and lawsuits are the sameMay 07 11:14
schestowitzMicrosoft sued TomTom after failed extortionMay 07 11:14
schestowitzSo it could potentially sue all those that it threatens behind the sceneMay 07 11:15
schestowitz*nesMay 07 11:15
ushimitsudoki1Fedora has it because (perhaps) they don't feel the patents are valid and aren't planning on caving in - whereas TomTom didn't think it was worth it to take a standMay 07 11:15
ushimitsudoki1It was a settlement, not a court decisionMay 07 11:15
schestowitzThere's a workaroundMay 07 11:15
schestowitzTridge threadMay 07 11:15
schestowitzThey also work on killing or trashing the patents at a perceptual levelMay 07 11:15
schestowitzSo that those going to corut will have a day in the fieldMay 07 11:16
schestowitzThis caused a lot of damage to MSMay 07 11:16
schestowitzLots of lost trust in FOSSMay 07 11:16
schestowitzMany people raise the TomTom example nowMay 07 11:16
schestowitzSo it wasn't worth the half a million (or less) they got paidMay 07 11:16
schestowitzThe FUD they earned comes with resentment tooMay 07 11:17
ushimitsudoki1I sure would love to hear some mono-pusher comments on the TomTom caseMay 07 11:18
DaemonFCI think it's gonna be funny when people try to "upgrade" from XP to 7May 07 11:20
DaemonFCand find out that's a no noMay 07 11:20
DaemonFCschestowitz: I found a Microsoft article earlier talking about Kernel Patch ProtectionMay 07 11:22
DaemonFCbasically they could have implemented it on x86, but they basically admitted that they didn't because it breaks a lot of shitMay 07 11:22
DaemonFCso it goes on x64 first and people who want to support x64 will have to live with it from day 1 :PMay 07 11:22
DaemonFCand apparently it was not my imagination, Vista x64 scored about 10% higher on GeekBench than Vista x86 :|May 07 11:24
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schestowitzMS takedowner: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Emma+Rutherford&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&ie=UTF-8May 07 11:26
schestowitzDaemonFC: vista can't run 64 bitMay 07 11:27
schestowitzISVsMay 07 11:27
schestowitzNo-go areaMay 07 11:27
DaemonFC?May 07 11:27
schestowitzMaybe servers being a possibilityMay 07 11:27
schestowitzNot many apps for 64-bitMay 07 11:27
schestowitzNo source code eitherMay 07 11:27
DaemonFCI have Vista X86-64May 07 11:27
schestowitzDoes Adobe finally support 64-bit WinderMay 07 11:28
schestowitzIt supported Linux 64-bit before WinderMay 07 11:28
DaemonFCthey don't really have toMay 07 11:28
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DaemonFCwow64 can run 32-bit applications side by sideMay 07 11:29
DaemonFCthere's not really much point in having a 64-bit web browserMay 07 11:29
DaemonFCso flash runs all the sameMay 07 11:29
DaemonFCthere are 32-bit and 64-bit versions of both IE and Windows Media Player thoughMay 07 11:29
DaemonFCschestowitz: GCC or MSVC can both compile for Win64May 07 11:30
DaemonFCit's not difficultMay 07 11:30
DaemonFCit's just that most outfits know that since Windows can run either/or, then they may as well just put out the Win32 versionMay 07 11:31
DaemonFCmost of the benefits of X86-64 have very little to do with performanceMay 07 11:32
DaemonFCsometimes the 2 GB per process limit of x86 even helpsMay 07 11:32
DaemonFCif a process goes out of control and starts leaking memory for exampleMay 07 11:32
DaemonFCfor anything running in .Net it's whatever architecture Windows isMay 07 11:33
DaemonFCand for JAVA programs, it's whatever version of the JVM you haveMay 07 11:34
DaemonFCschestowitz: X86-64 really stops being interesting past the point of "You can use more RAM"May 07 11:35
schestowitzApple and Microsoft Attack Their Developers and Users (Again) < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/07/apple-and-microsoft-attack/ >May 07 11:35
DaemonFCDEODORANT DEODORANT DEODORANT DEODORANT!!!!!!!!May 07 11:36
DaemonFC:PMay 07 11:36
DaemonFCschestowitz: Apple won't let you run Flash on the iphoneMay 07 11:37
DaemonFCso it's basically uselessMay 07 11:37
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schestowitzDEODORANT won't run on iphone :-pMay 07 11:38
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DaemonFCschestowitz: Microsoft and Apple are dinosaurs that still think push content worksMay 07 11:40
DaemonFCeven though every product using it in the last 10 years has bombedMay 07 11:40
DaemonFCKevin Carmony was even asking Apple to create a system where if you paid them more, they'd review your app faster and give it a better listingMay 07 11:41
DaemonFChe was wanting to use that to push his Dating DNA appMay 07 11:41
DaemonFCschestowitz: I actually found something interesting in Microsoft's "sponsored" Vista Sidebar gadgetsMay 07 11:43
DaemonFCXM Radio has a gadget that lets you sign up for a 2 week trialMay 07 11:43
DaemonFCbut when that runs out you just have to give them another disposable emailMay 07 11:43
DaemonFCand sign up for another 2 free weeksMay 07 11:43
DaemonFCand so onMay 07 11:43
DaemonFCSpeaking of default browser, search, etc.May 07 11:44
DaemonFCThey've had to heavily modify IE and Windows over the years because of antitrust suitsMay 07 11:44
DaemonFCwhat makes Windows Mobile special?May 07 11:44
iwmwm$ as prefixMay 07 11:45
DaemonFCThey seem to change just enough to comply with the judgment or the settlementMay 07 11:45
DaemonFCcause there's still plenty of shit that you can click on that will only open in IEMay 07 11:46
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DaemonFCIE has never been my favorite anythingMay 07 11:47
DaemonFCwhen they welded it onto Windows 98 I was horrifiedMay 07 11:47
anivarwhile looking for dependency maps I came across this patent filed by sun in 1997.  Don't you think this patent overlaps or talks essentialy what debian dependencies already do. Can anyone check this and alert if this is serious? http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20080201705May 07 11:49
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DaemonFCdoubt it mattersMay 07 12:04
DaemonFCDebian is older than the patentMay 07 12:04
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oiaohmDebian might be prior art anivar problem is BSD based OS's were doing it first even older again.May 07 12:18
schestowitzMonoDevelop Moves to Windows, Gnote Comes to GNU/Linux (as Default) < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/07/gnote-comes-to-gnu-as-default/ >May 07 12:21
schestowitzSunracle isn't going to attack Debian usersMay 07 12:22
schestowitzThat would be insaneMay 07 12:22
schestowitzhttp://www.stallman.org/archives/2009-mar-jun.html#07%20May%202009%20%28Nigel%20Inkster%29 "igel Inkster, who was MI6 deputy director when MI6 gave the bogus intelligence report that was used to justify conquering Iraq, says that there  were doubts about it at the time, and that the UK was "dragged into war". It was dragged by Tony B'liar, who would do anything at all for Bush, even kill. "May 07 12:24
oiaohmLol mono guys are going nuts.May 07 12:24
oiaohmVisual studio on windows basic form is free.May 07 12:24
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oiaohmhttp://www.icsharpcode.net/OpenSource/SD/  And you missed schestowitzMay 07 12:25
oiaohmmonodevelop is mostly an attack on sharpdevelop were a large section of monodevelop source came from.May 07 12:25
schestowitzFormer MI6 chief says Britain was 'dragged' into Iraq war  < http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/5267555/Former-MI6-chief-says-Britain-was-dragged-into-Iraq-war.html >May 07 12:26
DaemonFCWhy the hell would you want to use Mono on Windows?May 07 12:28
schestowitzNOVL just needs to disseminate its spermcode/DNA inside GNU/Linux and then come with MS to claim ownership of itMay 07 12:29
schestowitzDaemonFC: cross platformMay 07 12:29
DaemonFChttp://www.voanews.com/english/2009-05-07-voa6.cfmMay 07 12:31
DaemonFCLooks like Pakistan is finally having to deal with the TalibanMay 07 12:31
DaemonFCMaybe they'll be a little bit more agreeable now that they're in danger of being overthrownMay 07 12:32
DaemonFC:)May 07 12:32
schestowitzCould this be croniesMay 07 12:33
DaemonFC?May 07 12:33
schestowitzMaybe a regime working for the USMay 07 12:33
schestowitzIt would look better coming from localsMay 07 12:33
DaemonFCnah, the Taliban are some really bad guysMay 07 12:34
DaemonFCthey want to kill or convert anyone that's even slightly less radicalMay 07 12:34
schestowitzThe US almost supported themMay 07 12:34
schestowitzDepends who they need as cannon fodderMay 07 12:34
DaemonFCit's not a win for anyone but them if they get in power thereMay 07 12:34
schestowitzDaemonFC: yes, but the US had not much problem as long as they launched rocket at Russian tanksMay 07 12:35
DaemonFCI don't think Pakistan wanted to have an all out fight with the TalibanMay 07 12:35
DaemonFCmilitaries like big scary enemies that they never have to fightMay 07 12:35
DaemonFCbut which justify bottomless budgetsMay 07 12:35
schestowitzSome of them still use weapons that the US gave them to actually shoot and kill AmericansMay 07 12:36
DaemonFCschestowitz: The Soviets would have captured that area and pressed onMay 07 12:36
schestowitzTo this date, civilian aeroplane face danger from Stinger missiles made in Columbine or wherever.May 07 12:36
DaemonFCcontrolled most of the oilMay 07 12:36
DaemonFCwhich would have prevented their economy from collapsingMay 07 12:37
DaemonFCand we would still be dealing with a bigger, badder version of them todayMay 07 12:37
DaemonFCand I doubt their ambitions would have stopped thereMay 07 12:37
schestowitzBut that's not the pointMay 07 12:37
DaemonFCthe problem is that they're a bunch of MacgyversMay 07 12:38
DaemonFCthey can turn any bit of crap that they got from anywhere into a bombMay 07 12:38
DaemonFCif Pakistan is killing them I say "Yay Pakistan!" and urge them to not accept any "peace talks"May 07 12:39
DaemonFCbecause that's a code word for "time to reload"May 07 12:39
DaemonFCjust like the PalestiniansMay 07 12:39
DaemonFCthey can't be bargained with, if they say they want to talk about peace, it's merely a stall tacticMay 07 12:40
schestowitzWhat is this site? http://meneame.net/May 07 12:40
schestowitzSeems big, we made FP there just nowMay 07 12:40
DaemonFChttp://72.14.205.132/translate_c?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://meneame.net/&prev=hp&usg=ALkJrhgMOQrHLfsBZ2r5HCBr5WF-Ry5lUgMay 07 12:41
DaemonFCtry thatMay 07 12:41
schestowitzI miss GogolebarMay 07 12:42
schestowitzIt made translation fastMay 07 12:42
schestowitzThe Google Toolbar annoys meMay 07 12:42
schestowitz"Norway denounces corruption in Spain"May 07 12:42
schestowitzProbably not the Microsoft caseMay 07 12:42
schestowitzAnyway, I'vce gotta go nowMay 07 12:42
schestowitzbblMay 07 12:42
DaemonFCI'm hoping that Spain does prosecute the Bush AdministrationMay 07 12:44
DaemonFCand while they're at it, they can uncover the network of willing accomplices in the UKMay 07 12:44
*ChanServ gives channel operator status to schestowitzMay 07 12:44
DaemonFCthis could become the next Nuremberg trial if they really wanted to push it that farMay 07 12:45
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DaemonFChttp://www.pcworld.com/article/164487/duke_nukem_fornever_3d_realms_shutting_down.html/May 07 12:47
DaemonFCDuke Nukem For-Never? 3D Realms Shutting DownMay 07 12:47
*DaemonFC groansMay 07 12:47
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trmancohello everyoneMay 07 13:16
DaemonFCso Logitech releases an update that works on Windows 7May 07 13:29
DaemonFCbut it's only a web update releaseMay 07 13:29
DaemonFCand requires the Vista software you can't installMay 07 13:29
DaemonFCcan someone tell me how they come up with this shit?May 07 13:29
iwmwlolMay 07 13:34
trmancoanybody here use geany?May 07 13:38
oiaohmMaybe they don't like Windows 7 DaemonFCMay 07 13:39
DaemonFCSounds reasonable til you figure out that 11.9 is only downloadable once you have installed 11.8 and check for updates, but as I pointed out in an earlier post, 11.8 kills Windows 7 dead about halfway through installation.May 07 13:40
DaemonFCSo I updated a Vista system and kidnapped the 11.9 installer from a temp folder:May 07 13:40
DaemonFCMerry ChristmasMay 07 13:40
DaemonFC-MeMay 07 13:40
DaemonFCheheMay 07 13:40
oiaohmThat sounds like logitech wants windows 7 dead.May 07 13:41
iwmwmanufacturers don't like systems that are always changing the ddk for no reason, obviouslyMay 07 13:45
iwmwas well as userspace apiMay 07 13:45
iwmwso they could just vote by producing crappy drivers and by this system goes bbMay 07 13:46
iwmwthey could as well bury vista already, did they really need vista?May 07 13:48
DaemonFCoh sweet!May 07 13:48
DaemonFCVLC can record to Theora+Vorbis from my camMay 07 13:48
DaemonFCI don't need Logitech's crapwareMay 07 13:49
iwmwyeah, vlc likes to access camerasMay 07 13:49
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iwmwit even recorded from some crappy fake chinese copy of nokia cell of guy that came to me to test itMay 07 13:51
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DaemonFChmmmMay 07 13:58
DaemonFCalways happy when I can kill off a piece of crapwareMay 07 13:59
DaemonFC:)May 07 13:59
iwmwyeah, i even replaced almost all payware mostly bloatware apps with free onesMay 07 14:00
DaemonFCLogitech's software is worthlessMay 07 14:00
DaemonFCit will only encode to WMVMay 07 14:00
DaemonFCthat's itMay 07 14:00
iwmwwmv... not bad... but w in the name of that format makes me avoid itMay 07 14:01
iwmwthey better produced x264May 07 14:02
iwmwbetter quality and less shitMay 07 14:02
DaemonFCVLC lets you do WMV+WMA, x.264+AAC, Theora+Vorbis, Theora+FlacMay 07 14:03
DaemonFCseveral othersMay 07 14:03
DaemonFCbut you have choicesMay 07 14:03
DaemonFCbasically any combination of audio and video that VLC supports is possibleMay 07 14:03
oiaohmI though I said VLC when you where having trouble with logitech before DaemonFC?May 07 14:04
DaemonFCVLC is a swiss army knife, Windows Media Player is old swiss cheese, stinky and full of holesMay 07 14:04
DaemonFCB-)May 07 14:04
DaemonFCoiahm: VLC has a lot of functionalityMay 07 14:05
oiaohmI know.May 07 14:05
DaemonFCshame that it's not all readily obviousMay 07 14:05
oiaohmRerecording dvd's into a smaller format is another one I use.May 07 14:05
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DaemonFCI also noticed that it can rip CDs to FLAC :)May 07 14:07
DaemonFCthereby replacing my Exact Audio CopyMay 07 14:08
DaemonFC:PMay 07 14:08
oiaohmVLC is not a player.May 07 14:08
oiaohmIts a player/universal ripping tool.May 07 14:08
trmancocouldn't help it -> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/browse_frm/thread/a58c27dc88751c26#May 07 14:08
oiaohmIts just knowing how to make it play ball.May 07 14:08
trmancoI had to say somethingMay 07 14:08
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oiaohmtomboy eats memory badly.May 07 14:10
DaemonFCit also churns the hard diskMay 07 14:11
oiaohmIts hard for mono developers to except that in under a month a clone of a .net program in C++ can basically beat them dead.May 07 14:12
oiaohmIts also excepting that it took less than 1 month to port most of it.May 07 14:13
trmancothere is still some addons missing and some don't even work yetMay 07 14:14
trmancothe timestamp addin doesn't workMay 07 14:14
trmancoand you can't disable any addons yet...May 07 14:15
iwmwin either case... once it's stable people can develop their own addonsMay 07 14:15
oiaohmThinking only 1 month since the start of the gnote project has started how far comlete is it trmancoMay 07 14:15
trmancojust have these two thing bugging me, but overall, it's a nice piece of softwareMay 07 14:15
oiaohmIts doing extreamly well.May 07 14:15
trmancoyeah, it sure isMay 07 14:15
DaemonFChttp://img4.imageshack.us/img4/5841/vlcn.pngMay 07 14:15
trmancothings*May 07 14:15
oiaohm6 months time it will be basically why tomboy.May 07 14:16
oiaohmNot something the mono camp was expecting.May 07 14:16
iwmwso you like doorsMay 07 14:17
trmancoI hope it gets better than tomboy (new functionality for example)May 07 14:17
oiaohmhttp://gcc.gnu.org/wiki/plugins  Nice gcc going moduler.May 07 14:17
DaemonFCheheMay 07 14:18
DaemonFCyeahMay 07 14:18
DaemonFCI am going to kill Kevin Carmony for what he did though :PMay 07 14:18
DaemonFChttp://kevincarmony.com/linspire_videos/RunLinspire.swfMay 07 14:18
oiaohmThat is the other thing gnote can port in tomboy but tomboy cannot port in gnote.May 07 14:19
oiaohmLicence issue.May 07 14:19
iwmwwhat's tomboy license?May 07 14:19
oiaohmgplv2 tomboy  gplv3 gnoteMay 07 14:19
iwmwlolMay 07 14:19
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iwmwwhy isn't tomboy gplv3?May 07 14:20
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oiaohmThere are still a lot of things that are not iwmwMay 07 14:20
iwmwyeah, but why they started it with gplv2 not 3?May 07 14:21
trmancoit's not only gplv2May 07 14:22
iwmwso gplv3 denies other licenses under which tomboy is licensed?May 07 14:23
oiaohmgplv3 can have gplv2 licence code inside.May 07 14:25
oiaohmMirror don't work.May 07 14:26
iwmwi just read that tomboy is lgplMay 07 14:26
oiaohmIts the version.May 07 14:26
trmancoI was referring to this post a while back, copied the wrong link...-> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/msg/d5cf14290de2a1e3May 07 14:29
iwmwyou posted link to post of some ignorant userMay 07 14:30
iwmwbeforeMay 07 14:30
trmancohttp://kde.org/announcements/announce-4.2.3.phpMay 07 14:32
trmancohe is an idiotMay 07 14:32
trmancoI see he already replied back, I'll give him another reply and then back he goes to my killfile again, it's not worth it, reading post from a peanut sized brain trollMay 07 14:33
trmancoposts*May 07 14:33
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Omar87Guys, what do you think of the upcoming Walfram Alpha search engine?May 07 14:41
Omar87Will it really be so revolutionary that it might even wipe Google out?May 07 14:42
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iwmwnot too much was said about that so you can't make prognosisMay 07 14:45
iwmwin either case.... it's launching this month so you will try and seeMay 07 14:46
iwmwfrom what i read about wolframalpha it would rather be a good complement to usual search engines not a replacer of popular onesMay 07 14:56
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DaemonFCCan anyone explain why Vista feels faster and more stable than KDE?May 07 15:00
DaemonFCI'm still waiting on that oneMay 07 15:00
trmancohow can it feal faster if it's core components suck?May 07 15:00
DaemonFCI'm not jokingMay 07 15:00
DaemonFCVista's GUI is much more responsive than KDEMay 07 15:01
trmancoI haven't tried kde 4 yetMay 07 15:01
DaemonFCthey botched KDE 4.x big timeMay 07 15:01
trmancobut I have tried vista a couple of timesMay 07 15:01
trmancojust wait until kde 4.5 comes out :-PMay 07 15:01
DaemonFClast version I tried was 4.2.2May 07 15:01
DaemonFCI wasn't thrilledMay 07 15:02
DaemonFCGNOME still runs betterMay 07 15:02
trmancowhat about kde 3.5May 07 15:02
trmanco?May 07 15:02
DaemonFCKDE 3.5.10 is alrightMay 07 15:02
DaemonFCif you strap Compiz Fusion onto itMay 07 15:03
MinceR4.2.2 should still be called some sort of 4.0 beta or prebetaMay 07 15:03
DaemonFCthat's what a few distros are still doingMay 07 15:03
trmancoyeahMay 07 15:03
MinceRkicker still works badly with compiz, doesn't it?May 07 15:03
DaemonFCwell, the korrekt thing to do in KDE is KwinMay 07 15:03
DaemonFCof kourseMay 07 15:03
MinceRkwin's compositing is buggyMay 07 15:04
MinceRit leaves droppingsMay 07 15:04
MinceRkde3 kwin, that isMay 07 15:04
MinceRor that separate program that does it thereMay 07 15:04
DaemonFCyeah, I'm beginning to think that sorting KDE 4 out will take a long long timeMay 07 15:04
DaemonFCat least another yearMay 07 15:04
MinceRonce i did a calculation based on 3.0->3.5 but i forgot the resultMay 07 15:05
twitterI'm aware of HDDVD ripping tools.  Like DeCSS before them, they prove that GNU/Linux can be used to deliver restricted media they way media should be delivered - without restrictions.  ha ha.May 07 15:05
DaemonFCfrom KDE 4.0 to 4.2.0, they had over 67,000 commitsMay 07 15:05
DaemonFCand the thing still doesn't work rightMay 07 15:05
twitterStill, DRM'd media should never be protected by copyright because it can never enter the public domain.May 07 15:05
DaemonFCmajor parts of GNOME can change and the user won't even notice, because they wait til the new system is in place to deprecate the old oneMay 07 15:06
twitterLike RMS says, you can't depend on being able to break copy protection, it should just be against the law to restrict media that way.May 07 15:06
DaemonFCso it's not like they're ripping the rug out from under youMay 07 15:06
DaemonFCcopy protection will always be breakableMay 07 15:07
DaemonFCespecially when they have to leave implementation gaps for their "partners"May 07 15:07
twitteryes, but they will always be a pain.May 07 15:07
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twitterand the pursuit always violates your rights and encourages stupid lawsMay 07 15:08
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twitterWith broadcasters like Fox dying, these idiot laws will start to fade.May 07 15:08
twitterWithout money, they can't fund corruption.May 07 15:08
twittertheir position still gives them power, but advertisers have realized how little power they have left.May 07 15:09
SubsonicBhttp://www.boingboing.net/2009/05/06/eff-sues-obama-admin.htmlMay 07 15:09
twitterbroadcast is a form of censorship that has been routed around.May 07 15:09
SubsonicBpublicly available information shows that the treaty could establish far-reaching customs regulations over Internet traffic in the guise of anti-counterfeiting measures. Additionally, multi-national IP industry companies have publicly requested that ISPs be required to engage in filtering of their customers’ Internet communications for potentially copyright-infringing material, force...May 07 15:09
SubsonicB...mandatory disclosure of personal information about alleged copyright infringers, and adopt “Three Strikes” policies requiring ISPs to automatically terminate customers’ Internet access upon a repeat allegation of copyright infringement.May 07 15:09
DaemonFCwell, the advertising is worthless when people are unemployed or underemployed and jsut looking to pay bills and eatMay 07 15:09
twittercool.  EFF goes after ACTA.May 07 15:10
DaemonFCthey asked me what I was going to spend my stimulus check on this year and I wrote "RENT"May 07 15:10
DaemonFC:PMay 07 15:10
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twitterno, advertising works as long as people eatMay 07 15:10
DaemonFChow is that?May 07 15:10
SubsonicBAnd look at just what happened at the European ParliamentMay 07 15:11
twitterit can guide where and what they eat, that's valuableMay 07 15:11
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DaemonFCI go to ALDI, nothing in there gets advertisedMay 07 15:11
DaemonFCexcept that it's cheapMay 07 15:11
twitteryeah, the days you could synchronize a whole country with broadcast are over.May 07 15:12
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DaemonFCWalmart is in trouble now because they've outsourced so many manufacturing jobsMay 07 15:12
twitterreally?May 07 15:12
DaemonFCnow they're looking to flee the US to go rough up other countries for moneyMay 07 15:12
DaemonFCyeah, they're opening up more stores in foreign countries than they are hereMay 07 15:13
DaemonFCyou never saw them prioritize that even ten years agoMay 07 15:13
DaemonFCthey know how much they've soured this place with their smash and grab operationMay 07 15:14
twittertheir business model squeezes contractors, such as my next door neighbor.  he moved to overseas manufacturing and they squeeze him harder.May 07 15:14
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twittereither way, they make money.May 07 15:14
DaemonFCno, what they'll do now is ditch himMay 07 15:14
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DaemonFCand buy straight from his supplierMay 07 15:14
twitterI don't think soMay 07 15:14
DaemonFCthey used him to put himself out of businessMay 07 15:14
twittertoo much workMay 07 15:14
DaemonFCno, I've seen them do itMay 07 15:14
twitterand you've seen their product line go to pure shit you would never buy, haven't you?May 07 15:15
DaemonFCthey convinced him he'd make all this money if he just fired all of his employees and ordered from ChinaMay 07 15:15
twitternah, he's always been a middle man.May 07 15:15
DaemonFCnow they have him shut down his capacity, do the legwork of gearing up the suppliers to make shit to his specsMay 07 15:15
DaemonFCthen they cut him out, rebrand it allMay 07 15:15
DaemonFCand sell his stuff without him selling it to themMay 07 15:15
twitterhe knows people who had actual employees but I don't think he ever didMay 07 15:16
trmancowowMay 07 15:16
DaemonFCthey tricked the CEO of the company I used to work for like thatMay 07 15:16
trmancotransmission is getting powerfulMay 07 15:16
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DaemonFCnow even he's out of a jobMay 07 15:16
DaemonFCyeah he was making great money between the day he fired everyone and about a year laterMay 07 15:17
DaemonFC:)May 07 15:17
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_Hicham_Hi All!May 07 15:30
trmanco10 reasons why Linux will oust Windows: http://www.zdnetasia.com/insight/software/0,39044822,62052873,00.htmMay 07 15:31
trmancohi _Hicham_May 07 15:31
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Omar87Guys, what do you think of the new Walfram Alpha thing? Some people say that it might be a replacement for Google...May 07 15:37
MinceRi don't know it. url?May 07 15:55
_Hicham_مرحبا بالسيد عمرMay 07 15:57
MinceRniceMay 07 16:00
MinceRopera doesn't recognize that as a url, though :>May 07 16:00
_Hicham_where is the URL MinceR?May 07 16:03
MinceRoh, you're _Hicham_, not Omar87May 07 16:03
trmancololMay 07 16:04
*MinceR forgot to read the nicks againMay 07 16:04
MinceRmaybe i should get a nick-coloring script, however ugly it looks.May 07 16:04
trmancomy nick are coloredMay 07 16:04
_Hicham_what client do u use MinceR?May 07 16:04
trmanconicks*May 07 16:04
MinceRirssiMay 07 16:04
trmancoprobobly irssiMay 07 16:04
trmancoyeahMay 07 16:04
trmancoI thought soMay 07 16:04
_Hicham_why not just plain Pidgin?May 07 16:06
_Hicham_Pidgin just rocksMay 07 16:06
MinceRpidgin just failsMay 07 16:08
MinceRafter having pidgin crash twice because i received a jabber message, i replaced it with gajimMay 07 16:09
MinceRbut for personal use i stick with irssi+bitlbeeMay 07 16:09
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trmancopidgin rarely crashesMay 07 16:22
trmancoon my machineMay 07 16:22
trmancotext based applications tend to be a lot more stable than gui based apps, for obviousMay 07 16:23
MinceRi've heard of the same kind of pidgin crashes around hereMay 07 16:27
trmancoit does crash, but no really oftenMay 07 16:29
trmancoI do have 2 jabber accounts and it works fine, for nowMay 07 16:30
trmancolatest version thoughMay 07 16:30
_Hicham_MinceR : don't be negative, if it crashes, try to find out whyMay 07 16:33
_Hicham_contributeMay 07 16:33
_Hicham_at least with bug reportingMay 07 16:33
_Hicham_that is open sourceMay 07 16:33
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MinceRi know why: because it's pidginMay 07 16:40
MinceRfixed by switching to gajim. :>May 07 16:40
trmancoit looks pretty much the sameMay 07 16:41
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schestowitzClassic UK... London Olympics Says No To Free Software < http://www.fsdaily.com/Opposition/London_Olympics_Says_No_To_Free_Software >May 07 16:49
schestowitz"Too much risk..." to Microsoft's reveneMay 07 16:49
schestowitzSounds like the usual collusionMay 07 16:49
schestowitzJust like in ChinaMay 07 16:49
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Omar87MinceR: www.walframalpha.com, however, it's not launched yet. It will be launched anytime this month though.May 07 17:06
Omar87MinceR: Sorry, I meant http://www.wolframalpha.com/May 07 17:07
schestowitzSounds like another Cuil or WikiaMay 07 17:09
schestowitzYawn-worthyMay 07 17:09
schestowitzThey are already well placed in Google for maths stuffMay 07 17:09
schestowitzThey are Wikipedia for maths to some peopleMay 07 17:09
schestowitzbrbMay 07 17:09
schestowitzUpdated: Microsoft Lays Off 28 Percent Of In-Game Advertising Unit Staff < http://www.paidcontent.org/entry/419-report-microsoft-guts-in-game-advertising-unit-in-layoffs/ ? So it's not 75% after all.May 07 17:11
schestowitz OpenOffice.org 3.1.0 is available < http://blogs.sun.com/GullFOSS/entry/openoffice_org_3_1_0 >May 07 17:12
schestowitzGet OpenOffice.org 3.1.0 now if you want the nice new features: http://download.openoffice.org/May 07 17:12
trmancoI'll write about it laterMay 07 17:12
schestowitzI'm gonna change the format of IRC logsMay 07 17:13
schestowitzStarting tomorrowMay 07 17:13
trmancowhat will it look likeMay 07 17:14
schestowitzNotice how the Microsoft-inclined pres, which is rubbish, poses the Microsoft vs ODF situation as an IBM thing. The lies...May 07 17:15
Omar87Alright, now that's wierd..May 07 17:15
schestowitzIBM is mostly the messenger hereMay 07 17:16
schestowitzOmar87: what's ypMay 07 17:16
Omar87I tried to check for updates in OO.o, but it failed.May 07 17:16
schestowitzDid you see the CNET link I gave you days ago?May 07 17:16
Omar87schestowitz: What was it about?May 07 17:16
schestowitzOmar87: probably not there, yetMay 07 17:16
schestowitzOmar87: let me find itMay 07 17:16
schestowitzhttp://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-10232069-38.htmlMay 07 17:16
schestowitzSounds like he drank from Microsoft's Kool-Aid far too much. See what he says about OSSMay 07 17:17
Omar87schestowitz: Yeah, but it didn't even try, it failed immediately.May 07 17:17
schestowitz  Oh.. that free software thing... it's so EXPENSIVE!! *rolls eyes*May 07 17:17
schestowitzMSDN Magazine gets slashed... http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2009/05/07/microsoft_products_scaled_back/May 07 17:19
schestowitzMicrosoft hasn't enough money to run its unitsMay 07 17:19
schestowitz3D Realms is kaput < http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/rss/-/1/hi/technology/8037688.stm >, but hopefully they'll give the engine and models to the community; it's dead either way.May 07 17:21
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schestowitzVictoria's article/headline about ODF was changed a little to show that ODF!=IBM: Microsoft under fire for ODF glitch in Excel  < http://news.zdnet.co.uk/software/0,1000000121,39649168,00.htm >May 07 17:22
trmancoEngage, embrace, extinguish: http://harishpillay.livejournal.com/157565.htmlMay 07 17:22
trmancoYahoo has been invaded by Microsoft from the very inside ->http://lonelyspooky.com/2009/05/06/ate-tu-yahoo/May 07 17:23
schestowitzIn June I'm gonna make super-progress on Wiki+Comes exhibits. I have thousands of crimes I want to expose.May 07 17:23
schestowitzYes, Yahoo is poisonedMay 07 17:24
schestowitz"Today we have OpenOffice.org 3.1 gets released. In the meantime, the proprietary product from Redmond claims to be able to wirte ODF format, but fails. Pity. Money corrupts, but MS Tax Dollars corrupts absolutely." http://harishpillay.livejournal.com/157565.htmlMay 07 17:24
schestowitztrmanco: he just retwitted my [ANN] re OOoMay 07 17:26
trmancoANN?May 07 17:26
schestowitzDuke Nukem Forever developer defunct, says staffer < http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/05/07/duke_down_as_3d_realms_closes/ >May 07 17:26
schestowitzUSENET: ANNouncementMay 07 17:26
schestowitzYahoo used to recommend Firefox 3.09May 07 17:27
schestowitzThat is, when Jerry was in chargeMay 07 17:27
schestowitzNow it's just ctotally corruptedMay 07 17:28
trmancoahMay 07 17:28
schestowitzBartz is a partner of BallmerMay 07 17:28
schestowitzSince years agoMay 07 17:28
schestowitzIcahn must be happy about her appointmentMay 07 17:28
trmancoyeah, I remember yahoo recommending Firefox with Yahoo toolbarMay 07 17:28
schestowitzIcahn should be sent to prison along with Wall Street bankers and Nathan MhyrvoldMay 07 17:28
schestowitzThe software patents cartel, including hired Microsoft shills like ACT, get their way in the UK. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/07/ipo_approve_software_patent/May 07 17:30
schestowitzMicrosoft now attempt to fragment ODF < http://homembit.com/2009/05/microsoft-now-attempt-to-fragment-odf.html > Remember Java?May 07 17:33
schestowitzBen Slivka, Microsoft: "great Win 32 implementations written/deployed. [...] Do encourage fragmentation of the Java classlib space."" Think ODF.May 07 17:33
schestowitzGavin Clarke is boosting Silver Lie againMay 07 17:35
schestowitzHe pretends Silver Lie if the leader or somwthintMay 07 17:36
schestowitzKnown MS strategyMay 07 17:36
schestowitzTreat the Web as through Adobe doesn't exist in RIAMay 07 17:36
schestowitzDisgusting and dishonestMay 07 17:36
trmancowho wrote this -> http://news.cnet.com/2100-1001-252681.html?May 07 17:39
schestowitzhttp://www.examiner.com/x-6683-Apple-Products-Examiner~y2009m4d27-My-top-5-Mac-apps-5-Nvu "Nvu by Linspire/Mozilla is an HTML editor, but one with a GUI, and interface"May 07 17:43
schestowitzWhat?May 07 17:43
schestowitzNvu by Linspire/Mozilla?May 07 17:43
schestowitzCan anyone confirm this is erroneous?May 07 17:43
Omar87schestowitz: I just finished reading it.May 07 17:43
Omar87schestowitz: It does feel a bit sad..May 07 17:44
schestowitztrmanco: I care more about who DELETED itMay 07 17:44
trmancoI would love to get my eyes on the articleMay 07 17:44
schestowitztrmanco: there are parellel onesMay 07 17:46
schestowitzI think it's the Allchin statmentsMay 07 17:46
trmancoI can't find it in the archive :(May 07 17:46
trmancodamnMay 07 17:46
schestowitzThey go to the government and describe FOSS as though it's communism that will rape your babyMay 07 17:46
schestowitzJm Allchin is one heck of a felonMay 07 17:46
schestowitzYou can find lots about him in BNMay 07 17:47
schestowitzHe should not be in retirement; he should be in a prison cell.May 07 17:47
Omar87schestowitz: I don't know why, but I feel like none of what the Jordanian Minister said about FOSS doesn't make any sense.May 07 17:48
schestowitzIt doesn'tMay 07 17:49
schestowitzhe's like Steel in the UKMay 07 17:49
schestowitzit's a bunch of people who drink the MS Koo-AidMay 07 17:49
schestowitzTo them, FOSS id made by kids in mom's basementMay 07 17:49
schestowitzThat's what Microsoft tells themMay 07 17:49
Omar87Damn it man.May 07 17:50
schestowitztrmanco: help me find a quoteMay 07 17:50
schestowitzSomehting about GNOME devs saying "it's almost like Windows"May 07 17:50
schestowitzSaid in reference to GNOME and MonoMay 07 17:50
trmancoahMay 07 17:50
trmancothat would be nice now wouldn't it?May 07 17:50
schestowitzRussell quoted it a while back, but it's not easy to findMay 07 17:50
schestowitz"Windows toys" or somethingMay 07 17:51
schestowitztrmanco: I just replied to you in BNMay 07 17:51
schestowitzBut I quote just Novell de IcazaMay 07 17:51
schestowitzIt would be nice to quote non-NovellersMay 07 17:51
trmancolet me finish reading the news, then I will try and find somethingMay 07 17:51
schestowitzLike the FriendmanitesMay 07 17:51
Omar87He claims that Jordan needs to wait for companies out side to come invest here because it has no natural resources. Well, what do natural resources have to do with software???May 07 17:51
schestowitzNot the economist, the Nat (Microsoft employee)May 07 17:52
schestowitz*FriedmanitesMay 07 17:52
schestowitzOmar87: so he promotes colonialismMay 07 17:52
Omar87It's not like you're gonna need 10000 tons of gold and diamond to build a Linux distro, right?May 07 17:52
schestowitzThat's rubbishMay 07 17:52
schestowitzJordan has Petra and tourrismMay 07 17:53
schestowitzMaybe oil too, but I think it's further eastMay 07 17:53
schestowitzTo say, "let the foreigners save us" is like saying let them take out labour and offer us somethingMay 07 17:53
schestowitzLike Britain in India.May 07 17:53
Omar87It not only doesn't make sense, it's also hilariously stupid! :DMay 07 17:53
schestowitzOmar87: that's why I showed you this articleMay 07 17:54
Omar87schestowitz: Thanks man. :)May 07 17:54
schestowitzThe US has no natural resources, eitherMay 07 17:54
schestowitzNothing like Iraq'sMay 07 17:54
schestowitzBut it has invaded other people's countries with trade rules sicne the 19th centuryMay 07 17:54
schestowitzKind of like the British, just biggerMay 07 17:55
schestowitzThey actually took some nations from the British and even Cuba from the SpanishMay 07 17:55
schestowitzSo that they can oppress the population rather than the SpanishMay 07 17:55
schestowitzOr look at SaddamMay 07 17:55
schestowitzThey promised to end abuse of citizensMay 07 17:55
schestowitzBut their prisons there are torture devicesMay 07 17:55
schestowitzThere was an atritcle about it in the British papers todayMay 07 17:56
Omar87Even Japan has not natural resources.May 07 17:56
schestowitzOmar87: nopeMay 07 17:56
schestowitzFisheryMay 07 17:56
schestowitzushimitsudoki would knowMay 07 17:56
schestowitzJapan oppressed ChinaMay 07 17:56
Omar87I'll brb.May 07 17:56
schestowitzAFAIK from a friend who's Chinese they also slaughtered manyMay 07 17:56
schestowitzSame with the British BTWMay 07 17:56
schestowitzFights over slavery pretty muchMay 07 17:56
schestowitzThe British had signs on property in China.May 07 17:57
schestowitz"No dogs and Chinese allowed" (maybe not exact quotes)May 07 17:57
schestowitzThe Germans used similar banners before WW2May 07 17:57
schestowitz"I don't really see any major improvements. It looks the same. It feels the same. Same applications. Same everything." http://www.daniweb.com/blogs/entry4326.htmlMay 07 17:58
schestowitzbrbMay 07 18:00
schestowitzOld new re-reported: French National Police Dump Windows for Linux < http://www.infopackets.com/news/business/microsoft/2009/20090506_french_national_police_dump_windows_for_linux.htm >. BillG visited Paris at exactly that time. Why?May 07 18:17
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Omar87schestowitz: By the way, regarding the line: "You have to develop software to interface with the open source, which will cost you more. A country like Jordan cannot afford such things. ", I know a guy who's not even an IT graduate (Math) but have successfully established a Fedora-based distro called Ojouba-أعجوبة (meaning: Miracle, or something extraordinary).May 07 18:24
schestowitzYes, it's affordableMay 07 18:24
schestowitzSome 'kiddie' companies like IBM and GOogle use that. Oracle too.May 07 18:24
schestowitzNetcraft Lists April's Most Reliable Sites < http://www.thewhir.com/web-hosting-news/050609_Netcraft_Lists_Aprils_Most_Reliable_Sites > I'm not sure Netcraft can be trusted at all.May 07 18:25
Omar87So "it's gonna cost you a lot" is just plain non-sense.May 07 18:25
schestowitzMicrosoft manufactures (read: bribes analysts) to produce papers that say thisMay 07 18:33
schestowitzDell is said to be preparing to ship Android.. http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=44900&id=e9381817-0593-417a-8639-c4c53e2a2a10&view=newsMay 07 18:34
schestowitzEnergy of the Future: Igniting a Star With Laser Light http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2009/05/gallery_nifMay 07 18:44
schestowitzhttp://torvalds-family.blogspot.com/2009/05/peeve-of-day.html "I was at the optometrist with Patricia, who is near-sighted like me. Or rather - not like me, since I've had lasik, and since she's more nearsighted than I ever was. She's blind as a bat without glasses or contacts, in other words."May 07 18:45
schestowitzLinus wears no glasses anymoreMay 07 18:46
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schestowitzMicrosoft still loses money in XBox and Nintendo.. well... Nintendo financials reveal impressive Wii, DS sales < http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/05/07/nintendo_2009_financials/ >May 07 18:56
MinceROmar87: well, Wolfram Alpha doesn't seem like a general-purpose web searchMay 07 19:08
schestowitzVista7 Draws Complaints from Mozilla < http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/osrc/article.php/3819176/Windows-7-Draws-Complaints-from-Mozilla.htm >May 07 19:09
schestowitzVenezuelan government’s Canaima GNU/Linux 2.0.1 stable is released < http://news.northxsouth.com/2009/05/06/venezuelan-governments-canaima-gnulinux-201-stable-is-released/ > And their national migration continues.May 07 19:14
schestowitzhttp://www.blogicalthoughts.com/images/signs/945_signs.jpgMay 07 19:15
MinceR"you are what you eat"?May 07 19:16
Balrog_anyone here knows wget?May 07 19:17
schestowitzMinceR: maybe. But it gets processedMay 07 19:17
schestowitzBalrog_: yes, waddup?May 07 19:17
MinceRBalrog_: i doMay 07 19:17
schestowitzCat Stevens Claims Coldplay's 'Viva La Vida' Was Copied From His Song, Not Satriani's < http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20090504/1649054744.shtml >May 07 19:17
MinceR"i can wget" "show me"May 07 19:18
schestowitzEarly Results: Labels Losing Money on iTunes Variable Pricing...  < http://www.digitalmusicnews.com/stories/050309itunes >May 07 19:18
Balrog_MinceR: you know what to do when wget is pulling http://somesite.com/* then http://somesite.com/%2F%2F/* which leads to infinite recursion?May 07 19:18
Balrog_I added '%2F%2F' to exclude dirs, and it didn't helpMay 07 19:18
schestowitzExclude dirs?May 07 19:19
schestowitz-r?May 07 19:19
Balrog_one sec.May 07 19:19
schestowitz#wget -q -r -l1 -H -t1 -nd -N -np  -erobots=off -i SITEMay 07 19:20
schestowitzWhere SITE is a fileMay 07 19:20
schestowitzwith a list of URLsMay 07 19:20
schestowitzPrison Awaiting Hostile Bloggers < http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/05/prison-awaiting-hostile-bloggers/ >May 07 19:21
schestowitzBe nice to the people around you.May 07 19:21
Balrog_'wget -m -np -E -k -K -p --user-agent=$random "-e robots=off --timeout=40 --tries=3 --exclude-directories=$exclude_directories $urls'May 07 19:22
Balrog_that's what my line looks likeMay 07 19:22
Balrog_though the quotes are a bit messed up there...so don't pay attention to that partMay 07 19:22
schestowitzCongressional computers continue to be used to vandalize Wikipedia < http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Congressional_computers_continue_to_be_used_to_vandalize_Wikipedia >May 07 19:23
schestowitzWhat's it for?May 07 19:23
schestowitzThe Pirate Google?May 07 19:23
schestowitzhttp://www.thepirategoogle.com/May 07 19:23
Balrog_you're asking me?May 07 19:23
Balrog_Archiving old sites that may disappearMay 07 19:24
Balrog_it's part of a script that takes the site and then rar's it up (I don't like rar but it allows for already compressed files to be excluded).May 07 19:24
schestowitzYes, Democracy!!111 Chief Army Chaplain in Afghanistan distributes local-language Bibles, orders congregation to convert locals < http://www.boingboing.net/2009/05/06/chief-army-chaplain.html >>May 07 19:24
schestowitzSome sites don't like thatMay 07 19:26
schestowitzIt hammers themMay 07 19:26
schestowitzAlso, there's the issue of copyrightsMay 07 19:26
Balrog_I know about that stuffMay 07 19:26
schestowitzSome would say even browser cache or whatever is 'violation'May 07 19:26
Balrog_about hammering, I use --wait-random and other wait commandsMay 07 19:26
schestowitzThe Chrysler deal confirms President Obama's disregard for the law. < http://reason.com/news/show/133325.html >. The Business Party still in power.May 07 19:27
schestowitzSupreme Court: Feds Abusing Identity Theft Law < http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/05/supreme-court-feds-abusing-identity-theft-law/ >May 07 19:28
schestowitzWe have a lot of terrorists in the UK. :) London cops catch and search a potential terrorist every three minutes < http://www.boingboing.net/2009/05/05/london-cops-catch-an.html >May 07 19:29
schestowitzThe press describes Microsoft's ODF snub as a "glitch". As court exhibits show, such things are not glitches but sabotage.May 07 19:44
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schestowitzBe careful of what the Burton Group  says about ODF right now, Microsoft paid them a lot to attack ODF.May 07 19:45
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schestowitzMicrosoft, Yahoo Deal Still Possible < http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/05/07/microsoft-yahoo-deal-still-possible >. Microsoft has already stolen Yahoo's soul.  http://lonelyspooky.com/2009/05/06/ate-tu-yahoo/May 07 19:55
bgtr4lolMay 07 19:57
schestowitzStudent's Wikipedia hoax quote used worldwide in newspaper obituaries < http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/0506/1224245992919.html >. May 07 19:57
schestowitzHere is the URL for army bibles (now you know why it's called crusade) again:  < http://www.boingboing.net/2009/05/06/chief-army-chaplain.html >May 07 19:58
trmancoanybody here have an ooo 3.1 spalsh screen shot around?May 07 19:59
trmancosplash*May 07 20:00
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schestowitzSplashTOP!May 07 20:05
schestowitzDmitri regularly writes for these chaps now: http://www.linux-magazine.com/online/blogs/productivity_sauce_dmitri_s_open_source_blend_of_productive_computing/access_your_apps_and_docs_remotely_with_freenx < Access Your Apps and Docs Remotely with FreeNX >May 07 20:06
bgtr4aww. i wanted to test ff3.5b4May 07 20:07
schestowitzIt's funny how publications that are active change over timeMay 07 20:07
schestowitzLinux.com down, Groklaw quiet, Technocrat shuts down, /. loses momentum, Linux Pro Magazine rises, SJVN comes to IDG...May 07 20:07
bgtr4You may have heard the news . . .May 07 20:09
bgtr4The Linux Foundation is taking over Linux.com.May 07 20:09
bgtr4what does it mean?May 07 20:09
bgtr4(linux.com)May 07 20:09
schestowitzIt must be true. There are many TERROR~1 out there. 400,000 still on terror watchlist, including author of book on Rove <http://rawstory.com/08/news/2009/05/06/terrorist-watchlist-exceeds-400000/ >May 07 20:11
schestowitzbgtr4: not muchMay 07 20:12
schestowitzJust that it's kaputMay 07 20:12
*bgtr4 should definitely read about prev owners of linux.com and linux foundation ownersMay 07 20:14
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schestowitzCriminalisation: US teacher broke law by describing creationism as 'superstitious nonsense' < http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/may/06/us-creationism-teacher-first-amendment >May 07 20:15
bgtr4linux foundation is smth beurocratic i thinkMay 07 20:16
schestowitzIBMMay 07 20:16
bgtr470 membersMay 07 20:16
schestowitzet alMay 07 20:16
bgtr4ibm wasn't listed the first there... but from my experience it means nothingMay 07 20:16
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bgtr4sourceforge is the owner of linux.com?May 07 20:18
bgtr4and who's the owner of sourceforge?May 07 20:18
schestowitzUS spy boss pushes for unified cyber-command center < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/06/cyber_command_center_proposal/ >May 07 20:18
schestowitzbgtr4: LNUXMay 07 20:19
schestowitz@#2357235273 UK Home Secretary announces ID card pilot launch < http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/UK_Home_Secretary_announces_ID_card_pilot_launch > the Tories will love this May 07 20:21
schestowitzIt's like in the futuristic films May 07 20:21
schestowitzMaybe they can brand us like cows, tooMay 07 20:21
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schestowitzCan a person really own simple facts and place on embargo on readers? http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/05/who-owns-the-facts-the-ap-and-the-hot-news-controversy.arsMay 07 20:25
schestowitz*impose anMay 07 20:25
bgtr4who's lnux?May 07 20:25
bgtr4i can't find a proper answer via search enginesMay 07 20:25
bgtr4didn't search for an hour yet to be sure that it's not describedMay 07 20:27
schestowitzHulo, Goodbye. http://techdirt.com/articles/20090506/1650154773.shtml (Hulu Continues Its War On Users)May 07 20:27
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schestowitzbgtr4: Some company in the east coastMay 07 20:28
schestowitzNothing fancyMay 07 20:28
schestowitzStock crashed years agoMay 07 20:28
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schestowitzGuy Convicted Of Hacking For Uploading Naked Picture Of Himself < http://techdirt.com/articles/20090506/0219504764.shtml >May 07 20:29
Balrog_schestowitz: that Infoworld article is still missingMay 07 20:30
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schestowitzIs it...?May 07 20:33
schestowitzWell, how convenientMay 07 20:33
Balrog_http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/xml/02/09/05/020905hnmssecure.htmlMay 07 20:35
Balrog_searching doesn't helpMay 07 20:35
schestowitzushimitsudoki: LXer has just reposted your thing: http://www.olpcnews.com/sales_talk/microsoft/how_microsoft_got_xp_on_the_xo.htmlMay 07 20:42
schestowitzBalrog_: to Microsoft, this is the happy endingMay 07 20:43
Balrog_:/May 07 20:44
schestowitzMake a local copy from Web ArchiveMay 07 20:47
bgtr4oh... i was just ignoring nasdaq links... http://www.marketwatch.com/quotes/lnuxMay 07 20:50
bgtr4so it's risingMay 07 20:51
schestowitzLNUX up above 1% ? ;-)May 07 20:56
bgtr4nooMay 07 20:57
bgtr4omg... i don't understand nasdaqMay 07 20:57
schestowitzZimbra is not open source. http://download.cnet.com/8301-2007_4-10233908-12.htmlMay 07 21:00
schestowitzNovell's results are due by the 28th. It will be ugly because the company got not a single big MSLinux contract.May 07 21:01
schestowitzHeh. I only made 2 posts today in BoycottNovell today and got 202701 hits in 16 hours.May 07 21:03
schestowitzThe site has unfulfilled potential. Some people send me tips now, which helps. Fewer are willing to contribute articles..May 07 21:04
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schestowitzLinux: The Operating System of the Cloud < http://www.linuxfoundation.org/publications/linuxincloud.html >May 07 21:11
schestowitz10 reasons why Linux will oust Windows < http://www.zdnetasia.com/insight/software/0,39044822,62052873,00.htm >May 07 21:12
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schestowitzKDE 4.2.3 released http://www.itrunsonlinux.com/news/65-kde-423-released http://kde.org/announcements/announce-4.2.3.phpMay 07 21:12
schestowitzPetoKraus: are you still coming to M.E.N.?May 07 21:12
bgtr4waht the f, why novell nasdaq rised 10 day ago and then fell?May 07 21:13
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schestowitzSCO fights back  for survival. http://arstechnica.com/open-source/news/2009/05/sco-to-fight-us-bankruptcy-trustees-motion-to-liquidate-it.ars  SCO to fight US bankruptcy trustee's motion to liquidate itMay 07 21:14
bgtr4novell chose too stuped animalMay 07 21:15
*schestowitz wonders if NOVL is still on buyback-steroidsMay 07 21:15
taconecanonical sees mono as a 'desiderable skill' http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/canonical_GDOS/May 07 21:15
schestowitztacone: I knowMay 07 21:15
schestowitzPython too?May 07 21:15
schestowitzI saw some position like that the other dayMay 07 21:15
taconei don't think the job is about mono.May 07 21:15
taconeor python.May 07 21:15
schestowitzYeahMay 07 21:16
taconeis more about gnome online desktop or stuff like that.May 07 21:16
schestowitzThat's the one I sawMay 07 21:16
schestowitzSomeone brought it up in IRCMay 07 21:16
schestowitz_Hitcham_ IIRCMay 07 21:16
taconeby the way, they hired a novell laiden off for this position.May 07 21:16
taconehttp://blogs.gnome.org/rodrigo/2009/05/04/new-job/May 07 21:16
schestowitzI sent MarkS some info on monoMay 07 21:16
taconedid he reply ?May 07 21:16
schestowitzHe thanked me and smiled, but Ubuntu is too deep in this s*itMay 07 21:16
schestowitzHe goes by his engineers tooMay 07 21:17
taconeJorge, the upstream relation manager, is a strong mono proponent.May 07 21:17
schestowitzJeff Waugh used to work for himMay 07 21:17
schestowitzWaugh is a buddy of Novell de IcazzzzzzzzMay 07 21:17
taconehe started a meme once, 'say your hero' and elected the ubuntu mono team as his heroesMay 07 21:18
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schestowitzreally?May 07 21:20
schestowitzAny link to that?May 07 21:20
schestowitzIt would be a shame if GNU/Linux became a Microsoft-infected Ubuntu-branded coaster. I am sure Microsoft will raise its voice at one stage. It's precious 'IP'May 07 21:22
taconeschestowitz: i sent you the link to his blog in prvMay 07 21:24
taconebyeMay 07 21:24
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schestowitzAll your queries are [sic] belong to teh Google: "Google captured 72.74 percent of all U.S. searches in April" http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/05/07/google-search-share-up-7May 07 21:24
Balrog_schestowitz: do we know if moonlight 2 uses its own mono or does it use the system mono?May 07 21:24
schestowitzIt needs MonoMay 07 21:24
schestowitzbased on what people sayMay 07 21:25
schestowitzI didn't try itMay 07 21:25
Balrog_okMay 07 21:25
Balrog_I unzipped the XPI and it looks like it installs its own local copy of monoMay 07 21:25
Balrog_the structure of the directory is similar to Silverlight for MAcMay 07 21:25
Balrog_Mac *May 07 21:25
Balrog_http://pastebin.ca/1415687May 07 21:26
schestowitzYahoo Testing Favicons in Sponsored Ads < http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/05/07/yahoo-testing-favicons-in-sponsored-ads > Yeah, that'll save em..May 07 21:26
Balrog_taqke a look ... won't hurtMay 07 21:26
Balrog_I don't like mono though, in any case.May 07 21:26
schestowitz"#May 07 21:27
schestowitz184K    ./plugins/moonlight/System.ServiceModel.dllMay 07 21:27
schestowitz#May 07 21:27
schestowitz 40K    ./plugins/moonlight/System.ServiceModel.Web.dllMay 07 21:27
schestowitz#May 07 21:27
schestowitz 64K    ./plugins/moonlight/System.Windows.Browser.dllMay 07 21:27
schestowitz#May 07 21:27
schestowitz660K    ./plugins/moonlight/System.Windows.dllMay 07 21:27
schestowitz#May 07 21:27
schestowitz172K    ./plugins/moonlight/System.Xml.dllMay 07 21:27
schestowitz#May 07 21:27
schestowitz 88K    ./plugins/moonlight/System.Xml.Linq.dll"May 07 21:27
schestowitzHa...May 07 21:27
schestowitzBreath of fresh airMay 07 21:27
schestowitzFeels like home for NOVELL~1May 07 21:27
Balrog_that's obviously monoMay 07 21:27
Balrog_but it's locally installed .... which is easier to removeMay 07 21:27
schestowitzSo tel me...May 07 21:27
schestowitzWhen will mono be assigned to /progra~1/May 07 21:28
schestowitz<<< you are about to install Mono >>>May 07 21:28
Balrog_well there's no /progra~1/ in linux .......May 07 21:28
schestowitz<<<[ACCEPT] | [DENY] >>>May 07 21:28
schestowitzor allow/cencelMay 07 21:29
schestowitz*caMay 07 21:29
trmancouh ohMay 07 21:30
schestowitz"Read the Tuxradar review for details. From a KDE 4 desktop user perspective, this is one the best Mandriva releases in years. Far better than Kubuntu's Jaunty for Linux newbies and experienced Linux users alike." :-)May 07 21:31
schestowitzping MinceR: check out Mand 2009.1May 07 21:31
schestowitzMaybe MinceR is at work again (sleep)May 07 21:31
MinceRpongMay 07 21:31
bgtr4lawlMay 07 21:31
bgtr4novell~1May 07 21:32
MinceRnot at work, just being productive ;)May 07 21:32
bgtr4XDMay 07 21:32
Balrog_schestowitz: looks like they're making it so that moon/mono gets installed in ~/.mozilla/May 07 21:32
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schestowitzHarder to deleteMay 07 21:32
schestowitzCan't find it easilyMay 07 21:32
schestowitzDo they support Opera?May 07 21:32
schestowitzThe binary WebovellMay 07 21:32
schestowitzTower of babelMay 07 21:32
Balrog_nope, firefox only, unless you build yourself as an nspluginMay 07 21:33
schestowitzWondeerfulMay 07 21:33
schestowitzThank,s NovellMay 07 21:33
bgtr4i still can't stop laughingMay 07 21:33
bgtr4novell~1 XDMay 07 21:33
schestowitzbgtr4: it's patentedMay 07 21:33
schestowitzFAT shortenerMay 07 21:33
schestowitzpatents are no joke. May 07 21:33
bgtr4XDMay 07 21:33
schestowitz"2009.1 simply rocks :) ." http://dodonov.net/blog/2009/05/06/mandriva-only-mode/May 07 21:35
bgtr4does mdv include mono by default?May 07 21:36
schestowitzMore positive new reviews/appraisals of Mandriva 2009.1 (my favourite): http://pbs01.wordpress.com/2009/05/06/mandriva-linux-2009-spring-first-impressions/ http://beginlinux.wordpress.com/2009/05/06/mandriva-20091-install/May 07 21:36
schestowitzbgtr4: maybe the GNOME versionMay 07 21:36
bgtr4at least mdv 2009.1 kde one had no monoMay 07 21:37
bgtr4rc2 or smthMay 07 21:37
bgtr4and they had 2gb worth of installation with datMay 07 21:37
MinceRwhat kde does mandriva 2009.1 have?May 07 21:37
bgtr44.2.2May 07 21:37
bgtr4for rc2May 07 21:37
MinceRand how much emphasis does mandriva put on reliability?May 07 21:38
schestowitzTuxRadar also loved Mandriva 2009.1 Spring http://www.tuxradar.com/content/mandriva-20091-springMay 07 21:38
bgtr4not much, MinceRMay 07 21:38
schestowitzMinceR: 4.2.1/2May 07 21:38
schestowitz4.2.3 is out todayMay 07 21:38
schestowitz4.3 is nearMay 07 21:38
schestowitzfeature freezesMay 07 21:38
schestowitzMinceR: based on my experience, very highMay 07 21:38
schestowitzNever had any issued on this boxMay 07 21:39
schestowitzRunning 2008.1. They say 2009.1 is the best in years.May 07 21:39
MinceRand compared to ubuntu or ubuntu LTS?May 07 21:39
schestowitzBut I haven't tried it yetMay 07 21:39
bgtr4.1 is always better than .0May 07 21:39
schestowitzMinceR: dunno. Depends on whether it's GNOME or kde4May 07 21:39
schestowitzbgtr4: yesMay 07 21:39
schestowitzBeranger told me thisMay 07 21:39
bgtr4mandriva never had good gnomeMay 07 21:39
schestowitzbgtr4: it's not a gnome distroMay 07 21:40
bgtr4at least last 17 monthsMay 07 21:40
bgtr4while i was actually using linuxMay 07 21:40
bgtr4starting from mandrivaMay 07 21:40
schestowitzI used mandrake 8. somethingMay 07 21:40
bgtr4they have good manager for installationMay 07 21:41
schestowitzUbuntu: Two Ways to Keep A Clean Desktop Without Affecting Your Efficiency < http://maketecheasier.com/ubuntu-two-ways-to-keep-a-clean-desktop-without-affecting-your-efficiency/2009/05/06 >May 07 21:41
bgtr4some good toolsMay 07 21:41
bgtr4but only in debian i felt so good even though package manager just sucks and updates are rareMay 07 21:42
bgtr4idk whyMay 07 21:42
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schestowitzVideo Drivers Are All that Is Holding Linux Back (Maybe Windows 7, Too) < http://www.lockergnome.com/theoracle/2009/05/06/video-drivers-are-all-that-is-holding-linux-back-maybe-windows-7-too/ >May 07 21:45
mib_6vah9ubunch of poo poo headsMay 07 21:45
schestowitzThanks.May 07 21:45
schestowitzMispelled Pooh :-)May 07 21:45
schestowitz*misspelledMay 07 21:45
bgtr4gconf-editor didn't help me to get rid of lame minimizing animationMay 07 21:45
schestowitzwhy minimise?May 07 21:46
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schestowitzvitrual desktops do more quickerMay 07 21:46
bgtr4i use themMay 07 21:46
bgtr4especially at workMay 07 21:46
schestowitzBased on the insult, mib_6vah9u was one of the Linux Action Show fansMay 07 21:46
MinceRbgtr4: compiz?May 07 21:46
bgtr4idk, usual debian instllationMay 07 21:47
bgtr4barely it's compizMay 07 21:47
bgtr4or i would've knownMay 07 21:47
schestowitzWill Oracle resurrect Looking Glass? :-)May 07 21:47
bgtr4oh, you advice to use compiz to solve datMay 07 21:47
MinceRbgtr4: if it is, then you can change or disable the minimizing animation via CompizConfig Settings ManagerMay 07 21:47
schestowitzMine's lava lampMay 07 21:48
schestowitzTo anger AppleMay 07 21:48
schestowitzIt holds a patent on thisMay 07 21:48
bgtr4lolMay 07 21:48
schestowitzPissed the Compiz people offMay 07 21:48
schestowitzMaybe Aaron Seigo tooMay 07 21:48
bgtr4patents are so immatureMay 07 21:48
schestowitzApple predates hollywoodMay 07 21:48
schestowitzAnd alladinMay 07 21:48
bgtr4they will learn once they are quite restrictedMay 07 21:48
schestowitzIt saw him sneaking out of the bottleMay 07 21:48
schestowitzINNOVA~1 YEAH YEAH BURN BBAYMay 07 21:49
bgtr4i want to believe red hat arose that patent deal not in vainMay 07 21:51
schestowitzwhich one?May 07 21:52
schestowitzWindows gains market share in BN (more trolls).May 07 21:52
bgtr4to complain about m$ abusesMay 07 21:52
bgtr4mostlyMay 07 21:52
schestowitz44.2 % Windows - 44.8 % Linux (this month)May 07 21:52
bgtr4and european union should change lawsMay 07 21:52
schestowitzRed Hat is weirdMay 07 21:52
schestowitzUK approves software patent todayMay 07 21:52
bgtr4so patents are no that shit as m$ wants them to beMay 07 21:52
schestowitzishMay 07 21:52
bgtr4i did post the linkMay 07 21:53
schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/07/ipo_approve_software_patent/May 07 21:53
schestowitzI'll protest along with othersMay 07 21:53
bgtr4about 2 days agoMay 07 21:53
schestowitzAllsion Brimelow and her goonsMay 07 21:53
schestowitzThey just want to make more monetMay 07 21:53
schestowitzMore patents, more moneyMay 07 21:53
bgtr4they made a 11 pages complaintMay 07 21:53
schestowitzThat's why there should be parliamentary regulationMay 07 21:53
schestowitzBut the EPO almost breaks the lawMay 07 21:54
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schestowitzhi, mike May 07 21:54
mikeu have to be kidding meMay 07 21:54
mikewith that post...May 07 21:54
schestowitzhow come?May 07 21:54
schestowitzWhich one?May 07 21:54
*mike is now known as Guest40817May 07 21:54
Guest40817Is Jupiter Broadcasting’s Linux Action Show Anti-GNU/Linux?May 07 21:54
schestowitzNo, it's no jokeMay 07 21:55
schestowitzThey disregard many valuesMay 07 21:55
Guest40817well guess whatMay 07 21:55
schestowitzHmmm...May 07 21:55
Guest40817i am an op on Jupiter BroadcastingMay 07 21:55
schestowitzI need to change toothbrush :-)May 07 21:55
schestowitzOKMay 07 21:55
schestowitzi an an op on BN :-DMay 07 21:56
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schestowitzOpenOffice.org 3.1 is born < http://www.openoffice.org/news/ >May 07 21:58
schestowitzvery long.May 07 21:58
MinceRi'm an op on ~15 channels.May 07 21:58
MinceRand i'm an ircop on 1 network. :>May 07 21:58
schestowitzMulti-processor support coming for Firefox < http://mozillalinks.org/wp/2009/05/multi-processor-support-coming-for-firefox/ > Chrome, we hardly knew thy.May 07 21:59
MinceRchromium isn't dead yet, is it?May 07 21:59
schestowitzPracticially?May 07 22:00
schestowitzClinically?May 07 22:00
bgtr4that was that article: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/04/30/red_hat_europe_patents/May 07 22:00
schestowitzFunny Firefox < http://linuxsysconfig.com/2009/05/funny-firefox/ >May 07 22:00
bgtr4did you guys read it?May 07 22:00
MinceRwow, RH changed their mind about sw patents?May 07 22:01
MinceR(also known as "computer-implemented inventions")May 07 22:01
bgtr4The board is expected to receive a similar report from patents hit factory IBM, while it has already received reports from consumer electronics giant Philips and a number of academicsMay 07 22:02
schestowitzMinceR sleeps around with 51 chansMay 07 22:03
MinceR:)May 07 22:03
schestowitzMinceR: they changed no mindMay 07 22:03
bgtr4seems like they all are tired of m$ abuse of patentsMay 07 22:03
schestowitzThey resist sw patentsMay 07 22:03
schestowitzWhile filing for someMay 07 22:03
MinceRso they're lying?May 07 22:03
schestowitzBut But BUT! It's only defensiveMay 07 22:03
schestowitzThe classic excuseMay 07 22:04
MinceRwe all know what the best defense isMay 07 22:04
schestowitzMinceR: they have engineers, but they also have IP peopleMay 07 22:04
schestowitzI.e. useless staffMay 07 22:04
schestowitzPeople who were trained not to developMay 07 22:04
bgtr4so rh is just playing?May 07 22:04
schestowitzBut to work around developers and walk where work is doneMay 07 22:04
schestowitzAnd offer some bubble-like prootectionMay 07 22:04
MinceRmaybe it's a schizophrenic companyMay 07 22:04
schestowitzBy asking engineers WHAT patents they  can type upMay 07 22:05
MinceRdo they own those "defensive" sw patents or does some sort of patent pool own them?May 07 22:05
schestowitz"Hitting a person nostril using rigid apparatus.."May 07 22:05
bgtr4not defeinsive patentsMay 07 22:05
schestowitzPatents are not defensivesMay 07 22:06
schestowitz*siveMay 07 22:06
schestowitzNot more than guns areMay 07 22:06
bgtr4guns are not defensiveMay 07 22:06
bgtr4especially against knifeMay 07 22:06
schestowitzIt's one among a set of lie_s{i}May 07 22:06
schestowitz"more patents=more innovation"May 07 22:06
schestowitz"Patents protect small investors"May 07 22:06
bgtr4gun just makes you feel like protectedMay 07 22:06
schestowitz"Patents help the economy.."May 07 22:06
schestowitz*inventorsMay 07 22:07
schestowitzI can never type "inventor"May 07 22:07
bgtr4but some big companies abuse patentsMay 07 22:07
schestowitzAlways comes out with an SMay 07 22:07
schestowitzI also can't type RussiaMay 07 22:07
schestowitzbgtr4: just holding them is abusing themMay 07 22:07
bgtr4what do you type instead?May 07 22:07
schestowitzLike MicrosoftMay 07 22:07
schestowitz"we know Linux infringes"May 07 22:07
schestowitz"We have portfolio"May 07 22:08
schestowitz"Cherish our IP"May 07 22:08
bgtr4patents are themselves abuseMay 07 22:08
schestowitzImagine living in a neighbourhood  where there is little crime because everyone is terrified from one anotherMay 07 22:08
bgtr4in the way they areMay 07 22:08
schestowitzA  gun on every deak --billG :-)May 07 22:08
schestowitz*deskMay 07 22:08
MinceRhappiness is a warm gun.May 07 22:09
bgtr4i gotta buy another beer to understand thatMay 07 22:09
bgtr4"happiness is a warm gun:"May 07 22:09
schestowitzPalm WebOS to breathe new life into Foleo? < http://apcmag.com/palm-looks-to-breathe-new-life-into-failed-foleo.htm > More rumours, interesting nonetheless.May 07 22:09
bgtr4i kinda already know what it meansMay 07 22:09
bgtr4but i gotta understand how you came to thisMay 07 22:10
schestowitzwarm gunMay 07 22:10
schestowitzSounds like something from a Blue movieMay 07 22:10
schestowitzNot a good phrase, MinceR May 07 22:10
bgtr4there are plenty of meaning of this sentence, schestowitzMay 07 22:10
bgtr4meaningsMay 07 22:10
schestowitzMaybe smoking gunMay 07 22:10
bgtr4noMay 07 22:10
bgtr4quite differentMay 07 22:10
bgtr4but it's outside of this channelMay 07 22:11
bgtr4and i'm gone for beerMay 07 22:11
MinceR225314 <@NiTessine> I think it should be tested. Suspend the Pope from a great height in midair, see if he's really infallible.May 07 22:15
MinceRoops, wrong paste.May 07 22:15
MinceRhttp://slated.org/mono_is_dangerous_and_redundantMay 07 22:16
schestowitzLinux Action Show mob is aboard :0( XBMCMay 07 22:16
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/05/linux-sucks-fud/comment-page-1/#comment-63154May 07 22:16
schestowitzSlated seems to have taken a long break from teh Internets May 07 22:17
schestowitz"That led into his reason why he doesn't use the GPL any more. In his eyes, the GPL comes with implicit philosophical baggage -- in this case, putting freedom to hack above other software freedoms. He opted for the BSD license or a variant thereof, which is unambiguous and carries little baggage."May 07 22:22
schestowitzOh, yeah... the philosophy of SCIENCE.May 07 22:22
schestowitzhttp://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/archives/2009/05/no_gpl_for_me_t.html;jsessionid=OJORLGLPICDBOQSNDLRSKH0CJUNN2JVNMay 07 22:22
bgtr4these guys just don't understand, that you can do almost everything with linux as with any other platform. they want to have windows for free and yet it's not even the best solutionMay 07 22:25
MinceRhis friend misunderstands sw freedomMay 07 22:25
MinceRit's not just the freedom to hackMay 07 22:25
bgtr4they don't even understand what's to hackMay 07 22:26
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MinceRif John Smith hires a sw developer to modify a program he used so that he can get his data out of it in a portable format, then John Smith certainly isn't exercising his freedom to hackMay 07 22:28
schestowitzDuke Nukem dies again: Now I know what SCO and Duke have in commonMay 07 22:28
schestowitzDuke McBrideMay 07 22:28
MinceRDuke isn't deadMay 07 22:28
schestowitzHe isMay 07 22:28
MinceRDuke Nukem Whenever might beMay 07 22:28
schestowitzFell off his jetpackMay 07 22:28
MinceRApogee is still working on Duke Nukem TrilogyMay 07 22:28
schestowitzNot the bazookas May 07 22:29
MinceRand Take2 still owns Duke Nukem WheneverMay 07 22:29
MinceRwhatever is completed of it so farMay 07 22:29
schestowitzAh..May 07 22:29
schestowitzSelling data, model and engineMay 07 22:29
schestowitzThe Duke "IP"May 07 22:29
MinceRwell, the engine is from EpicMay 07 22:29
schestowitzEpic FAIL :-DMay 07 22:30
MinceRnot reallyMay 07 22:30
schestowitzI knowMay 07 22:30
MinceRthe Unreal Engine is one of the most advanced game engines aroundMay 07 22:30
schestowitzI just had a train of thoughtMay 07 22:30
MinceRalso, i'm not quite sure who owns the Duke Nukem characterMay 07 22:30
schestowitzThe USian armyMay 07 22:30
MinceRunlikelyMay 07 22:30
schestowitzHe's the sort of character that is intended to increase recruitingMay 07 22:31
schestowitzGI Joe typweMay 07 22:31
MinceRi doubt itMay 07 22:31
schestowitzJohn Ramb0May 07 22:31
MinceRhe is no soldierMay 07 22:31
schestowitzNo?May 07 22:31
schestowitzLooks like itMay 07 22:31
MinceRand no member of any armed forceMay 07 22:31
MinceRhe's a lone hero :)May 07 22:31
schestowitzI haven't played it in agesMay 07 22:31
schestowitzI remember level one very, very wellMay 07 22:31
schestowitznoookilar warrior?May 07 22:32
MinceR:)May 07 22:32
schestowitzze type of person Bush would call, "my kinda of guy"May 07 22:33
bgtr4i won't miss duke nukemMay 07 22:35
bgtr4if it doesn't releaseMay 07 22:35
bgtr4i played wolf3d and then i came to "old" games like q1 megatf, oni, evolva, ...May 07 22:37
MinceRi will, i liked that characterMay 07 22:38
bgtr4if they get reimplement for current middlewareMay 07 22:38
bgtr4they are absolute hitsMay 07 22:38
bgtr4middleware here is opengl and dxMay 07 22:39
MinceRcursed zdnetasia makes the page reload itself regularlyMay 07 22:39
MinceRpretty rotten way to get hitsMay 07 22:39
bgtr4piratic sites can't be reliable on notrotten waysMay 07 22:42
bgtr4remember, it's piratic foundations that gave people free windowsMay 07 22:44
bgtr4they are good to have it free but they make it free and yet they do right thingMay 07 22:44
bgtr4'cause law should be adjustedMay 07 22:45
bgtr4internet should be free for allMay 07 22:45
bgtr4not just with enforced usa lawsMay 07 22:45
bgtr4it should have no lawsMay 07 22:45
bgtr4--> no patents abuse... no drm... no insanely restricting copyrightsMay 07 22:46
bgtr4but yet more sane software to restrict access on users' choice, more avs and other appsMay 07 22:48
MinceRgnMay 07 22:49
schestowitz"Microsoft Incentives (msincentives) is now following your updates on Twitter."May 07 22:51
schestowitzWTF?May 07 22:51
bgtr4lolMay 07 22:53
bgtr4that's just lol and nothing to worry aboutMay 07 22:53
schestowitzThey have other accountsMay 07 22:53
schestowitzit's the MS bribe-U accountsMay 07 22:53
schestowitzThey have agencies working on TwitterMay 07 22:53
bgtr4they all act in the same wayMay 07 22:53
schestowitzMicrosoft still works like a mafia thereMay 07 22:54
schestowitzWaggener Enstrom is spying on usersMay 07 22:54
schestowitzFederated Media is policing twitter for MicrosoftMay 07 22:54
bgtr4it's just funny to watch at m$ guysMay 07 22:54
bgtr4they piss offMay 07 22:54
bgtr4they piss off at anything that's against m$ and if you mention linux they are twice berserkMay 07 22:54
bgtr4and m$ isn't something you can go with but rather be a slave of whatMay 07 22:55
bgtr4the good strategy is to let them run into wallMay 07 22:59
bgtr4like let them understand where they are dumb atMay 07 23:00
bgtr4or let them understand how weak they areMay 07 23:01
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bgtr4like spending plenty of $$ to make shitMay 07 23:02
bgtr4because m$ said soMay 07 23:02
schestowitzThey're doneMay 07 23:03
bgtr4or that they just make no senseMay 07 23:03
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bgtr4(links involved for EVERY case and they are far from reality) orMay 07 23:05
bgtr4...May 07 23:06
bgtr4i'm not eager to make a howto for dat, it's just obvious once you read that m$-addicted non-believing in themselves slavesMay 07 23:07
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bgtr4even though i use windows (pirated, for games), but i never bought m$ products and never willMay 07 23:08
bgtr4in fact... i never bought anyones' productsMay 07 23:09
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bgtr4even though i'm capable ofMay 07 23:10
schestowitzI never bought s/wMay 07 23:14
schestowitzlibervisco: thanks for the site.  I use it nowMay 07 23:14
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liberviscoschestowitz, glad to hear, np :)May 07 23:16
schestowitzit's good to have input that is inspirational for conversations and writingsMay 07 23:17
liberviscoyeahMay 07 23:18
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_Hicham_has anyone of u worked with THC Hydra?May 07 23:20
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taconemicrosoft imposes limits on netbooks hardware when it comes to ship windows on themMay 07 23:24
taconehttp://www.itexaminer.com/microsoft-adds-to-atoms-restrictions.aspxMay 07 23:24
bgtr4lolMay 07 23:24
bgtr4if people subdueMay 07 23:24
schestowitzIs this news?May 07 23:25
bgtr4i'd better not tell what's pendingMay 07 23:25
schestowitzIt just comes to show that Microsoft is a curse to consumers. The EU Commission should be informed and ask to reactMay 07 23:26
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schestowitz*akedMay 07 23:26
schestowitz*askedMay 07 23:26
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_Hicham_wb oiaohmMay 07 23:45
oiaohmHi _Hicham_May 07 23:46
_Hicham_just woke up?May 07 23:47
oiaohmThe ODF thing attacking MS for not supporting it will not get anywhere.   Attacking them on the lines the must lack the staff to built it correctly is more the correct line.   _Hicham_ yep.May 07 23:47
_Hicham_good morning thenMay 07 23:48
_Hicham_the ODF shouldn't be supported by MicrosoftMay 07 23:48
_Hicham_XML is maintained by Novell, which is enough for MicrosoftMay 07 23:48
oiaohmProper support breaks down there hold on market _Hicham_May 07 23:48
_Hicham_that is why I am saying thatMay 07 23:49
_Hicham_they pay Novell to develop an openoffice plugin that can handle docx filesMay 07 23:49
oiaohmODF should be supported by MS.May 07 23:49
_Hicham_MS should be isolatedMay 07 23:49
_Hicham_to ease its deathMay 07 23:50
_Hicham_quarantinedMay 07 23:50
oiaohmBasically the should be forced to or publically discredited and made look suspect.May 07 23:50
_Hicham_it is a plagueMay 07 23:50
oiaohmisolated does not kill MS.May 07 23:50
oiaohmMS got it right a long time ago.May 07 23:50
_Hicham_why?May 07 23:50
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_Hicham_how?May 07 23:50
oiaohmEmbrace Extend Extingish   Ok last word is spelt wrong.May 07 23:50
_Hicham_extinguishMay 07 23:51
_Hicham_no problemMay 07 23:51
oiaohmYou embrace them so there users can move to your platform without issues.May 07 23:51
_Hicham_time has changedMay 07 23:51
oiaohmYou extend so you add more features.May 07 23:51
oiaohmSo you Extingish.May 07 23:51
_Hicham_that was old strategyMay 07 23:52
oiaohmWhat can add features faster Open Source or Microsoft.May 07 23:52
_Hicham_when Linux was still a babyMay 07 23:52
_Hicham_Linux now has a terrific supportMay 07 23:52
_Hicham_everyone is participatingMay 07 23:52
oiaohmLinux is Extending faster than MS could dream.May 07 23:52
oiaohmMost major open source programs are.May 07 23:52
_Hicham_all software vendors are porting their s/w to LinuxMay 07 23:52
_Hicham_Linux is embracing WindowsMay 07 23:53
oiaohmExactly.May 07 23:53
_Hicham_Windows can't embrace LinuxMay 07 23:53
_Hicham_Linux is too big nowMay 07 23:53
oiaohmODF needs to embrace Microsoft.May 07 23:53
oiaohmIe Microsoft produces a ODF standard document that works.May 07 23:53
_Hicham_Microsoft is embraced through Novell extension to OpenOfficeMay 07 23:54
oiaohmThen ODF can extend it leaving MS in the dust so Extingish them.May 07 23:54
oiaohmOOXML is really not getting very far.May 07 23:54
_Hicham_docx wasn't  well receivedMay 07 23:54
oiaohmJust embracing OpenOffice is not enough.May 07 23:54
oiaohmThey failed to embrace abiword and koffice.May 07 23:55
_Hicham_almost all users are using doc formatMay 07 23:55
_Hicham_abiword is greatMay 07 23:55
_Hicham_koffice alsoMay 07 23:55
oiaohmdoc format was MS embrace and extend of the past.May 07 23:55
_Hicham_they should surviveMay 07 23:55
_Hicham_abiword is well for low end machinesMay 07 23:55
_Hicham_say old machinesMay 07 23:55
oiaohmSo you want them to survive to get that you need MS supporting ODF.May 07 23:55
_Hicham_noMay 07 23:56
_Hicham_MS do not have to support ODFMay 07 23:56
_Hicham_their document format is not getting anywhereMay 07 23:56
DaemonFCif people send me docx, I convert it to odt before sending it back with a link to the covnersion filterMay 07 23:56
_Hicham_doc is fully supported by OpenOfficeMay 07 23:56
oiaohmSo if Microsoft don't  support ODF you turn it into a public embasement the worse you can think up.   And the worst I can think up is that MS lacks the developers to do it.May 07 23:57
oiaohmIf that is the case MS Office is now a major secuirty risk.May 07 23:57
_Hicham_MS Office have been always a security risk to everyoneMay 07 23:58
oiaohmOld rule of FUD.May 07 23:58
oiaohmfear uncertainty & doubtMay 07 23:58
_Hicham_personally, I don't use doc files too muchMay 07 23:58
_Hicham_I request pdf filesMay 07 23:59
oiaohmWhen it comes to PR games most of the rules are set in stone.May 07 23:59
_Hicham_sending a document is doc format is a real shameMay 07 23:59
oiaohmMS Office suxs at producing printable PDF's as well.May 07 23:59
_Hicham_Microsoft Office is very buggy and sluggishMay 07 23:59