IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: August 1st, 2009

schestowitzgnAug 01 00:12
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cubezzzsometimes I think about the end of Tron, you know the part where Flynn says "it's a free system again" and the red lines all turn into blue linesAug 01 00:40
cubezzzbut when I look around today's internet I see the oppositeAug 01 00:41
cubezzzEncom = Microsoft basicallyAug 01 00:41
cubezzzit's more like it _was_ a free system, then it got more and more red, now it's slowly turning blue :)Aug 01 00:44
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Looks like everyones in for a treat?!? Apparently an 80 page review of 7 is coming our way...great joy...can't wait...Aug 01 01:16
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] I'm sure I'll spend the time to evaluate it. I wonder how many sentences will have "Feature rich" in them?Aug 01 01:17
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Just installed the latest build of Chromium... 3.0.197.0 (0) giving it a run....I don't think Firefox has much time left on my rig! #linuxAug 01 01:21
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Running the development release of Wine (1.1.26) on a few demoscene binaries. Very impressive! XPM for 7? Why not Wine for Linux instead?Aug 01 01:34
_goblinand it looks as if nobody is talking.....Aug 01 01:45
Aondo:)Aug 01 01:52
Aondoyou are!Aug 01 01:52
_goblinor were....Aug 01 01:57
oiaohmhttp://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/07/31/microsoft_plans_to_use_windows_7_to_raise_netbook_prices.html  << HmmAug 01 02:12
oiaohmLook like MS is being force to back way from cut price attack.Aug 01 02:13
Aondobut with arm netbooks they wont have anything to say, would they? unless they adapt i guess.Aug 01 02:13
_goblin"ultra thin" didnt ballmer call them...?Aug 01 02:14
_goblinhe seems to forget that the appeal of Netbooks is price...An more expensive laptop with a different name won't appease (IMO) just because its small...Aug 01 02:15
oiaohmIssue here is under cutting is never a long term game if you need income.Aug 01 02:16
_goblinI think the truth is, is that they know the hunger for netbooks and cheap prices is not going to be satisfied with a Windows platform and cheap, low spec hardware.....Aug 01 02:16
oiaohmLinux is basically out lasting.Aug 01 02:16
_goblinmy XP netbook experience was awful....and they are saying they can get Vista 7 on a cheap netbook?  I wouldnt think so....Aug 01 02:17
_goblinit may be netbook in size, but it certainly won't be in price.Aug 01 02:17
oiaohmDos vs OS/2 all over again.Aug 01 02:18
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twitterWhat do I make of this http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/skype_as_we_know_it_may_not_exist_much_longer_ebay.phpAug 01 03:32
twitter?Aug 01 03:32
twitterSoftware patents suck life.Aug 01 03:33
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twitterSkype is not your freedom friend http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/skype_says_no_to_jailbroken_iphones.phpAug 01 03:37
twitterthey can die with an attitude like that.  Good riddanceAug 01 03:38
twitterprobably scared someone will figure out how to use the video camera (with a mirror, duh) and beat Apple to the video phone punch.Aug 01 03:39
Xarver:PAug 01 03:41
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twitterSomething worth sharing http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/freedom-or-copyright.htmlAug 01 03:56
twitterThere's a good slogan.  "Something that's worth sharing is worth having.  If you can't share it, it's worthless."Aug 01 03:58
twitterM$ dude harasses RMS at free software conference.  http://www.globalnerdy.com/2009/01/26/winning-the-gnu/Aug 01 04:17
twitterGotta love the looks he's getting here http://www.globalnerdy.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/stallmandevilla-5.jpgAug 01 04:21
amarsh04Does RMS ever harass others?Aug 01 04:24
twitterI don't think he goes to M$ conferences.Aug 01 04:32
twitterOr trolls the interwebs, seeking and destroying.Aug 01 04:33
twitterThat's what mega corps like M$ do.Aug 01 04:33
twitterthey have to put some TE in every chat room, at every convention, influence all media, spin, spin spin.  If they spent half as much on code, they would not need the advertising.Aug 01 04:40
twitterhere's something nifty http://www.belkin.com/skype/howitworks/Aug 01 04:54
twitterI don't think it has a camera, though.Aug 01 04:55
twitterand the EEE PC is cheaperAug 01 04:56
cubezzzheh. funny storyAug 01 04:59
tessier__schestowitz: /home has reached 99% full. I am compressing your wordpress db dumps for you. Would be a good idea to modify whatever script you have to dump the db to compress them afterwards also. Might want to just keep a week of dumps.Aug 01 05:04
twitterIt's funny how TE's look down on consultants who sell out for the low price of $250/hour.  You know they have sold out for a fraction of that.Aug 01 05:10
oiaohmLinus sometimes goes to MS conferences for sport.Aug 01 05:13
oiaohmYes there are some good funny videos of MS guys getting Linux data wrong then finding out they are being correct by Linus.Aug 01 05:14
twitterSeems like a waste of time, Ohm.Aug 01 05:15
twitterBut it's his time to wasteAug 01 05:15
oiaohmIts not exactly a waste of time.  He goes sometimes to find out what MS is planing.Aug 01 05:16
oiaohmEveryone has to have there form of r&r.Aug 01 05:17
twitterEveryone knows what M$ is planning - it's what free software was doing 10 years ago.Aug 01 05:22
twitterSomehow, it never get's past the planning stages.Aug 01 05:22
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twitterHeh, from above article on Skype doom.  ->  Skype continues to grow very quickly.   Now with 480 million users around the world, it is twice the size of Facebook and adding users almost as fast.Aug 01 06:05
twitterOnly software patents could screw up something twice the size of facebook.Aug 01 06:06
twitterWorks well on GNU/Linux, Steve Smash!Aug 01 06:06
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oiaohmPatent war could happen if software patents are attempted to be used against open source.Aug 01 06:34
oiaohmMAD out come would be bad.Aug 01 06:35
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schestowitztessier: thanks, wil do thatAug 01 07:06
fewaThats why i take an effort to spread open-sourceAug 01 07:09
fewato let people see what it can doAug 01 07:10
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mikeyhey roy, i will be in the gym for 9.30, this morning, you coming?Aug 01 07:49
schestowitzYeah, sure.Aug 01 07:50
twitterHow did you like the announcement that Windows is officially a weapon of mass destruction?Aug 01 07:51
schestowitzWhere?Aug 01 07:51
twitterSandia Lab's study of botnets.Aug 01 07:51
mikeyok setting off out now, see you at the gym at 9.30 for ping pong etcAug 01 07:52
twitterThey are the official US nuclear stockpile stewards.  Them making Windows botnets on their supercomputers (using wine) was very funny.Aug 01 07:52
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twitterhttp://it.slashdot.org/story/09/07/28/1958237/Sandia-Studies-Botnets-In-1M-OS-Digital-Petri-DishAug 01 07:53
schestowitztwitter: oh, *that*Aug 01 07:55
schestowitzA bit dated nowAug 01 07:55
twitteryesAug 01 07:55
twitterstill funnyAug 01 07:55
twitterI commented on it at the time.Aug 01 07:55
twittermust be too much noise in here for you to see my comments ....Aug 01 07:55
twitterOuch.  I see that the RIAA just gave everyone  675000 new reasons to hate them.Aug 01 08:17
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twitterhttp://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/07/tenenbaum-trial-opens-following-last-minute-dismissal-of-fair-use-defense.arsAug 01 08:22
twitter"tortured" jury choiceAug 01 08:22
twitterprior dismissal of all defensesAug 01 08:22
twitterslam dunk for RIAA set up before trial even started.Aug 01 08:23
twitterThat's what $1M of legal muscle will buy you in the US.  Shameful.Aug 01 08:23
twittermore here http://recordingindustryvspeople.blogspot.com/Aug 01 08:25
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Yes its true, theres limited Flash support on Chromium by enabling the option at the command line....Aug 01 08:26
fewahttp://www.govtrack.us/congress/amendment.xpd?session=111&amdt=h187Aug 01 08:27
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schestowitzWFTL Bytes! is back http://wftlbytes.com/content/wftl-bytes-july-29-2009Aug 01 08:40
fewawhat?Aug 01 08:43
fewawhat was wrong with yahoo's search results?Aug 01 08:43
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schestowitzZafargo: =MutexAug 01 09:02
>ChanServ<op #boycottnovell schestowitzAug 01 09:02
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schestowitzHe'll come back with yet another nameAug 01 09:03
schestowitzfewa: someone mailed me this:Aug 01 09:03
schestowitz"It looks like M$ gutted Yahoo and is keeping the outer shell.  If PHPAug 01 09:03
schestowitzand FreeBSD developers were really the target, then this does close toAug 01 09:03
schestowitzmaximum damage because M$ was able to eliminate the employmentAug 01 09:03
schestowitzprotections in case of buyout."Aug 01 09:03
fewauggghAug 01 09:04
fewayahoo results were never horrible IMHOAug 01 09:04
fewaand yahoo has a number of employees that are real evangalistsAug 01 09:04
fewasuch as Douglas Crockford, creator and supporter of JSONAug 01 09:06
oiaohmReally yahoo has very few lines doing well.Aug 01 09:07
fewaJapanAug 01 09:07
fewaYahoo Japan is worth more than Yahoo USAug 01 09:07
fewaGoogle struggles to competeAug 01 09:08
fewaeven had to make their japan homepage differntAug 01 09:08
oiaohmqq.com is also another major competitor in that area.Aug 01 09:09
fewachina != japanAug 01 09:10
oiaohmGoogle search engine seams to have issues with japaniess finding correct results.Aug 01 09:11
oiaohmWhere qq.com and yahoo engine seams to do better.Aug 01 09:12
fewabus yes asian anguages are a completely different computational modelAug 01 09:12
fewaYahoo US's best asset is probably its 50% state in yahoo japanAug 01 09:12
oiaohmYahoo search engine for results is still way ahead of MS engine.Aug 01 09:15
fewaexactlyAug 01 09:16
fewabut that WFTL Bytes! show said they would scrap itAug 01 09:16
fewaand replace it with the Decide for me! engineAug 01 09:16
oiaohmMS insanity.Aug 01 09:16
oiaohmStrikes again.Aug 01 09:16
fewawhich mean i will have to drop using yahooAug 01 09:17
fewawhich i actually likeAug 01 09:17
fewagoogle's advantages seem to be a bigger index, and better guessing at noindex sitesAug 01 09:18
fewabut with sources of information there should always be more than one sourceAug 01 09:18
oiaohmhttp://www.dmoz.org/  << maybe focus will return to this.Aug 01 09:19
fewadmoz is useless, wikipedia is _much_ betterAug 01 09:19
fewaor other socially determined sitesAug 01 09:19
schestowitzdmoz is Wales' old project, I learnedAug 01 09:20
schestowitzIt used to have a different name I can't recallAug 01 09:20
fewacame out of Netscape i thoughtAug 01 09:20
schestowitzAnd Wikipedia used not to be a WikiAug 01 09:20
fewathen through AOL and now Mozilla/WikipediaAug 01 09:20
schestowitzTHey just took some Wiki software later. DMoz failed for WalesAug 01 09:20
fewaprimarilyAug 01 09:20
fewadmoz was the #1 way to get good listingsAug 01 09:21
fewayou could get page 1 of a somewhat minor topic with dmozAug 01 09:21
schestowitzbblAug 01 09:21
fewaon the search enginesAug 01 09:22
oiaohmWikipedia is the birth of place of mediawiki .Aug 01 09:22
fewaof courseAug 01 09:22
fewabut mediawiki isn't actually that greatAug 01 09:22
oiaohmCompared it what existed before it was fewaAug 01 09:22
fewameh what about meatballwiki softwareAug 01 09:23
fewasame syntaxAug 01 09:23
fewaon what part? the monobook style? template system? versioning backend?Aug 01 09:23
fewathis is awesome: http://github.com/bmizerany/git-wiki/networkAug 01 09:25
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oiaohmmediawiki supports images and videos and the like.  Meatball is targeted at per data.Aug 01 09:27
oiaohmSince mediawiki lot of others have appeared.Aug 01 09:28
fewaI still like mediawiki cause its WYSIWYMAug 01 09:30
fewatoo many WYSIWYG, which is fundamentally flawedAug 01 09:30
fewaand doesn't work well in browserAug 01 09:31
oiaohmRemember items like wordpress follow on from mediawiki.Aug 01 09:32
fewademo http://git-wiki.kicks-ass.org/HomeAug 01 09:33
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oiaohmgit-wiki could have working copy advantage.Aug 01 09:38
fewaisnt that cool?Aug 01 09:38
oiaohmTo a point.  git merge conflits can be fun.Aug 01 09:41
fewaoiaohm, have you seen mediawiki merge conflicts?Aug 01 09:41
fewathere is absolutely no merge resolutionAug 01 09:41
fewaeven if both are working on completely differnt sectionsAug 01 09:41
fewaexcept through a hack, that if only one section was showed it only conflicts if that section was conflictedAug 01 09:42
oiaohmSometimes you are better of with no merge optio.Aug 01 09:42
fewagit-wiki is also horrible insecureAug 01 09:42
oiaohmThat with a merge that goes forward and is incorrect.Aug 01 09:43
fewain that you can upgrade binary files and it will blindly put then to the browserAug 01 09:43
oiaohmIe the double sided sword.Aug 01 09:43
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KrensoHelloAug 01 10:01
Krensointerview with gnome-do author http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxplanet/reports/6797/2/Aug 01 10:01
KrensoGnome-do uses linq and other technologies not covered by ms comunity promise. So ubuntu right now van be sued.Aug 01 10:02
Krensoit does not have patent deal with ms, as i knowAug 01 10:02
Krenso*canAug 01 10:02
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[scientes] Weiner Challenges the Republicans to Put-Up or Shut-Up on Healthcare http://bit.ly/u9KOw #hcr #hr3200 #hr676Aug 01 10:24
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] "You know you have made it when….." New article on Openbytes. Hi Moshe Goldfarb! http://tinyurl.com/nb7a9p #microsoft #linux #windowsAug 01 11:06
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] i joked about a chess player's page with a makeup & leg photo, and got a follow from "a chess grandmaster and model." Seems it IS necessary.Aug 01 11:51
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] FCC finally asks Apple "WTF" over iPhone App Store http://ping.fm/RlIre I'm sure the EU will notice too when the Pre gets hereAug 01 11:55
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] this is not a joke. RT @xlerb SQCK: fsck(8) reimplemented in SQL. Yes, really. http://is.gd/1WLOvAug 01 12:56
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trmancohttp://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnote-list/2009-July/msg00020.htmlAug 01 13:13
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schestowitzMinorAug 01 13:16
trmancoyeah, just a applet crash fixAug 01 13:19
schestowitzGnote does well on its own nowAug 01 13:29
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Alguém me sabe dizer em que é que consiste um "Administração de Sistemas SAP"??Aug 01 14:01
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schestowitzMutex is backAug 01 14:36
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schestowitzThat was Mutex nymshiftAug 01 14:36
oiaohmHmmAug 01 14:37
schestowitzApache ain't serving pages. WeirdAug 01 14:39
schestowitzServer's up, maybe a connectivity issue.Aug 01 14:39
schestowitzThough it would not explain being to SSHAug 01 14:39
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schestowitzOK, apachectl restart did the trickAug 01 14:44
schestowitzHmmmm.... maybe not quiteAug 01 14:46
schestowitzBN is not accessible. tessier is probably asleepAug 01 14:46
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schestowitz 1566 mysql     15   0  405m 115m 4592 S 136.2  5.6   6801:29 mysqldAug 01 14:50
schestowitzSomething weird is going on.Aug 01 14:50
schestowitzVery erraticAug 01 14:50
taconewhat's the problem ?Aug 01 14:51
schestowitzNot sure...Aug 01 14:51
schestowitzFirst it didn't serve pagesAug 01 14:51
schestowitzI restarted Apache and now mysql load is crazyAug 01 14:51
schestowitzI think I can get it under control..Aug 01 14:52
schestowitzANother setback for Novell this week.. post coming soon.Aug 01 14:54
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wallclimberYay!  BN is working againAug 01 15:07
popey19:11:57 < schestowitz> popey: they mention you in the showAug 01 15:09
popeyschestowitz: yeah, misquoting me aren't they?Aug 01 15:09
trmancoschestowitz, Gnote still backports some stuff from tomboyAug 01 15:10
oiaohmGnote is a pure clone operation.Aug 01 15:11
oiaohmIts has kinda scared the crap out of some C# developers how simply cloning of there work can be done.Aug 01 15:11
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schestowitzpopey: I don't know. Let them know in #linuxoutlawsAug 01 15:12
schestowitzYou'll find me there too ;-pAug 01 15:12
taconehubert declared gnote is not going to be a port foreverAug 01 15:13
oiaohmBecause common sence kinda says if mono cannot do something with its memory usage and cpu usage tomboy will die when running in competition to gnote.Aug 01 15:14
schestowitzWhat about plguins?Aug 01 15:14
schestowitzThey may, in due time, add gnote compt.Aug 01 15:15
schestowitzAt least those that are not themselves Mono-reliantAug 01 15:15
schestowitzwallclimber: I'll do the next exhibit later today, I hope. Wasted too much time today on pingpong and sauna, so I feel behind... ^_^Aug 01 15:16
wallclimberI understand.  Pingpong and saunas make me feel behind tooAug 01 15:17
wallclimber:)Aug 01 15:17
schestowitzNext post is about Novell cancellationAug 01 15:18
schestowitzThe press totally misses this one.Aug 01 15:18
schestowitzDid you hear the latest about sy-congara?Aug 01 15:19
schestowitzhttp://www.javaworld.com/community/node/3261Aug 01 15:19
schestowitzhttp://aralbalkan.com/2316Aug 01 15:19
wallclimberNovell cancellation of what?Aug 01 15:19
schestowitzhttp://aralbalkan.com/2315Aug 01 15:19
schestowitzHot water for MOG and her" "Cihad" friends, who did to Aral Balkan what they did to PJ, sort ofAug 01 15:20
schestowitzOh, you know what I learned today:?Aug 01 15:20
wallclimberi'm surprised no one has sued sys-con by nowAug 01 15:20
schestowitzOne of the most senior people here got caught marketing exams and fraudulently claiming some qualificationsAug 01 15:21
schestowitzI'd hate to check out the news later... it has been in the front pagAug 01 15:21
schestowitzwallclimber: Groklaw couldAug 01 15:21
schestowitzThere's evidenceAug 01 15:21
wallclimberdidn't carla write about this too?Aug 01 15:21
schestowitzLet me get that news from Manc..Aug 01 15:22
schestowitzwallclimber: hardlyAug 01 15:22
schestowitzShe just mentions itAug 01 15:22
schestowitzShe knows about the "expose" incidentAug 01 15:22
schestowitzBut Brian was in Linux Today at the timeAug 01 15:22
wallclimberyes, what they tried to do to pj was shamefulAug 01 15:22
wallclimberwasn't Brian one of them that quit over the pj incident?Aug 01 15:23
schestowitzBritish Airways loses £148 million < http://www.mirror.co.uk/advice/money/2009/08/01/british-airways-loses-148-million-115875-21563693/ >Aug 01 15:23
schestowitzScientist got job despite shadow over past  < http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/s/1129165_scientist_got_job_despite_shadow_over_past_ >Aug 01 15:23
schestowitz'Exam cheat' professor probed < http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2009/08/01/exam-cheat-professor-probed-115875-21563049/ >Aug 01 15:23
schestowitzOh, I thought it would be Nancy RothwellAug 01 15:23
schestowitzTurns out it's an American profAug 01 15:24
schestowitzwallclimber: Brian? He was with JupitermediaAug 01 15:24
schestowitzUniversity professor 'marked exam papers without reading them properly'  < http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/5948218/University-professor-marked-exam-papers-without-reading-them-properly.html >Aug 01 15:24
wallclimberI don't think I'd want to fly an airline that's cutting costs -Aug 01 15:26
oiaohmDepends on where wallclimberAug 01 15:26
wallclimberi'd worry the planes would be unsafeAug 01 15:26
oiaohmIf its like reception and food ok annoyance.Aug 01 15:27
schestowitzwallclimber: many of them doAug 01 15:27
oiaohmIf its aircraft care o boy problems.Aug 01 15:27
schestowitzYou'd need to pay for waterAug 01 15:27
schestowitzIn some British airlines you need to pay to use the toiletAug 01 15:27
oiaohmIt does partly come down to how good the regulators are with air safety.Aug 01 15:28
wallclimberwell, they probably don't say much about it if they cut back on mechanics and maintenanceAug 01 15:28
wallclimberpeopleAug 01 15:28
schestowitzwallclimber: and yes, I worry about safety too if they cut replacement budgets and slacken the checks prior to flightsAug 01 15:28
schestowitzThere have been many crashes since Wall Street crashedAug 01 15:28
wallclimberthey just give the remaining workers more workAug 01 15:28
wallclimberto doAug 01 15:28
schestowitzI said this earlier this year when many planes were failing.Aug 01 15:28
oiaohmAustralia a air line caught cutting back on maintenance loses clearance to land.Aug 01 15:28
oiaohmBasically it a out of business effect.Aug 01 15:29
schestowitzEven the fact that shipments of new planes get canceled...Aug 01 15:29
oiaohmSo they will cut anything else first.Aug 01 15:29
schestowitzIt means that plane whch would be decommissioned like Concordes simpy don't Aug 01 15:29
wallclimberi love flying, but i hate airportsAug 01 15:29
schestowitzThe whole cycle of new replaces oldest gets brokenAug 01 15:29
schestowitzBoeing lost a multi-billion-dollar deal in AUAug 01 15:30
wallclimberso if i can't drive myself i just don't goAug 01 15:30
schestowitzCarbon footprintAug 01 15:30
schestowitzFlight from east to est (US) = half a tonne of carbon per passengerAug 01 15:31
schestowitz*westAug 01 15:31
oiaohmBoeing lost of deal is linked to something else.Aug 01 15:31
schestowitzoiaohm: I suppose soAug 01 15:31
wallclimberthe last time i flew they made me take off my shoes - i purposely wore the thinnest, most minimal sandals possible...yet, being barely 5ft tall and obviously over 50, i stillAug 01 15:31
schestowitzI read it 2-3 months agoAug 01 15:31
wallclimberapparently looked like a potential terroristAug 01 15:31
schestowitzWHat's the obsession with travel anyway?Aug 01 15:31
oiaohmA boeing aircraft having a complete computer failure in mid air did not do them good.Aug 01 15:31
schestowitzAre people so bored or have they explored EVERY little corner of their town/country?Aug 01 15:31
oiaohmA almost new aircraft.Aug 01 15:31
schestowitzThere should be standup skits about itAug 01 15:32
schestowitzThe "going abroad" thing is like the "going out"Aug 01 15:32
oiaohmFly by wire aircraft with all comptuers out is not good.Aug 01 15:32
schestowitz"What are you going out?"Aug 01 15:32
schestowitz"To be 'Out'"Aug 01 15:32
schestowitzI'm "out there"Aug 01 15:32
schestowitzI'm "not at home"Aug 01 15:32
wallclimberRoy, yes, exploration is great fun.  I love travel.  I hope to do a lot more before i get too oldAug 01 15:32
schestowitzPeople would go out to watch a film they could watch at homeAug 01 15:33
schestowitz"Where's Phil?"Aug 01 15:33
schestowitz"I don't know.. he went OUT!"Aug 01 15:33
oiaohmBasically boeing is going to have redesign control system with a hardware back up schestowitz.Aug 01 15:33
wallclimberi think it's important to see new places and meet new peopleAug 01 15:33
schestowitzoiaohm: also new models are canceledAug 01 15:33
schestowitzALl these vision of two-floor planes with leisure facilities..Aug 01 15:33
oiaohmThey are the heavy fly by wire schestowitzAug 01 15:33
schestowitzPeople never enjoy air travelAug 01 15:34
schestowitzThere's nothing 'fun' about being confined in a noisy cabin and a safety  strapAug 01 15:34
wallclimberair travel sucks - i think they send airport security people to "Bad-Attitude" schoolAug 01 15:34
schestowitzSo the rich folks take the front seats (most dangerous) and sip wine to pretend it's all funAug 01 15:34
schestowitzwallclimber: they have to be toughAug 01 15:35
schestowitzNice ones are rareAug 01 15:35
schestowitzThey probably get sacked or don't make selectionAug 01 15:35
oiaohmThe new guys in the air port are nice.Aug 01 15:35
schestowitzBeing smiley and polite make them unfit for the jobAug 01 15:35
schestowitzoiaohm: maybe in AussieAug 01 15:36
schestowitzThe rest are very cold-mindedAug 01 15:36
oiaohmMost people don't understand how rude most of the public are to them.Aug 01 15:36
schestowitzThey also do it so many hours per day, so can you blame them?Aug 01 15:36
schestowitzHow many people do they ask to take their belt off per day?Aug 01 15:36
oiaohmWhen was the last time you spoke nicely to the secuirty personal.Aug 01 15:36
schestowitzAfter a while you'd lose patience... same with till jobsAug 01 15:36
oiaohmAnd just nicely answersed there questions.Aug 01 15:36
oiaohmLot of people don't.Aug 01 15:36
schestowitzThey shoouldn't Aug 01 15:36
schestowitzIt's frowned uponAug 01 15:37
schestowitzIt makes them stand out almost as suspiciousAug 01 15:37
oiaohmNot really.Aug 01 15:37
schestowitzI never see folksiness in the Security Booth (Threatre)Aug 01 15:37
schestowitzOther people are the same..Aug 01 15:37
wallclimberHere, if you aren't polite to security you don't get on the planeAug 01 15:37
schestowitzoiaohm: maybe it depends whereAug 01 15:37
oiaohmI have had times I have got threw the airport faster by being polite and answering there questions.Aug 01 15:38
schestowitzEven checkin people are not so cheerfulAug 01 15:38
oiaohmvirgin here is known for cheerful.Aug 01 15:38
schestowitzIn no airline/airport. Maybe it's different for First Class, but I don't know.Aug 01 15:38
schestowitzFlgiht attendants are the oppositeAug 01 15:38
oiaohmThey don't have a first class.Aug 01 15:38
schestowitzThey are polite and nice all along. You know what they should do?Aug 01 15:38
oiaohmEveryone on virgin gets treated the same.Aug 01 15:38
wallclimberi've been flying for several decades, the rudeness these days is not due to rude customersAug 01 15:38
schestowitzSwap the stewards/sses with the people int he security checkpointsAug 01 15:39
wallclimberthe last time i flew i felt like i was in a pen full of prisoners being herded to the jailhouseAug 01 15:39
schestowitzThen you'll have people patrolling the plane asking for people to take their shoes offAug 01 15:39
oiaohmsecuirty personal have a list of check points to cover.Aug 01 15:39
oiaohmSooner they get done with it the happier they are.Aug 01 15:40
oiaohmJust a lot of people stupidly argue with the secuirty personal.Aug 01 15:40
wallclimberHere, you never, NEVER argue with security...seriouslyAug 01 15:40
schestowitzSome are nebiesAug 01 15:40
schestowitz*newbiesAug 01 15:40
schestowitzAirport newbies don't know to empty pockets before scanner walkthroughAug 01 15:41
wallclimberyou don't joke with them eitherAug 01 15:41
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schestowitzwallclimber: TSA?Aug 01 15:41
XarverhelloAug 01 15:41
schestowitzIn Canada we all needed to pay airport tax. It was weirdAug 01 15:41
schestowitzI had to change currencies for it. Other people were annoyed too...Aug 01 15:42
schestowitzXarver: heyAug 01 15:42
oiaohmMost annoying thing is the rule than cannot tell you what they have found in your bag on the scanner.Aug 01 15:42
oiaohmand that you have to find it and hand it over.Aug 01 15:42
taconewell they told meAug 01 15:42
oiaohmPair of plastic tweasers was funny.Aug 01 15:42
taconethey took it out and asked me what it wasAug 01 15:43
XarverHey this is just me pondering, but for the LGPL license, I have a question. If someone gets your source code, could they compile and sell it?Aug 01 15:43
taconeit was a little laser. the one you use on the blackboards at meetings (i was 18yrs old)Aug 01 15:43
taconethen they asked me very seriously what it was used for..Aug 01 15:43
wallclimberI figure i just won't fly again until i get rich enough to affort my own jetAug 01 15:43
wallclimber:)Aug 01 15:43
oiaohmThey could sell the program using it Xarver as long as the provide the source code.   They could charage for the compile of the LGPL part as well.Aug 01 15:44
oiaohmIe source code to the LGPL bit.Aug 01 15:44
taconegood point wallclimberAug 01 15:44
oiaohmYes  Xarver LGPL is not anti selling things.Aug 01 15:44
schestowitzXarver: yes, they canAug 01 15:44
schestowitzIf they modify it, then they can be requested to give the modifications they makeAug 01 15:45
XarverSo if you sold a program for 50dollars on the LGPL, someone can give it out for free.Aug 01 15:45
schestowitzwallclimber: good thinkingAug 01 15:45
schestowitzGood for the environment tooAug 01 15:45
wallclimberi wouldn't mind having a flying car like Judy JetsonAug 01 15:46
schestowitzbkuhn from the SFLC wrote about this the other dayAug 01 15:46
schestowitzwallclimber: BN's server admin is  a pilotAug 01 15:46
wallclimberdoes he have a flying car?Aug 01 15:46
wallclimber:)Aug 01 15:47
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Xarverhi crunchy135711Aug 01 15:47
XarverYes or no?Aug 01 15:47
schestowitzwallclimber: that existsAug 01 15:48
XarverBecause then there would be no point in selling it, as someone is giving it out for free.Aug 01 15:48
schestowitzBut not commercially, yetAug 01 15:48
schestowitzI saw articles about flying cars a while backAug 01 15:48
schestowitzIt's just a waste of energyAug 01 15:48
oiaohmLGPL libs can be used in different licenced programs XarverAug 01 15:48
schestowitzThey don't gain high speedAug 01 15:48
oiaohmIf you want a GPL program sold to end users you have go no more than old version of kexi.Aug 01 15:49
schestowitzThat vision may never come true. Fossil fuel (in abundance) will have run out by then.Aug 01 15:49
crunchy135711can you distribute LGPL libs with licensed code?Aug 01 15:49
wallclimberwell, high speed is over rated anyway, a slow flying car would be fineAug 01 15:49
XarverI see... What opensource license would use that's selling a product, allowing modifications, but disallowing redistribution?Aug 01 15:49
oiaohmThey even altered it to cripple the windows program unless you had a valid licence key XarverAug 01 15:49
schestowitzMaybe Warren Buffet will get one... just like BillG made that disaster called Surface, which he prevented Microsoft from killing because he wanted oneAug 01 15:49
Xarver:|Aug 01 15:49
oiaohmThe linse engine was even open source XarverAug 01 15:49
oiaohmWindows users are lazy it proved.Aug 01 15:50
XarverDxAug 01 15:50
wallclimberyes "surface" is really catching on, isn't it?  lolAug 01 15:50
schestowitzHeh.Aug 01 15:50
oiaohmBasically the idea that you need to be closed source to sell to end users is wrong.Aug 01 15:50
schestowitzNot even in VegasAug 01 15:50
schestowitzTarget nicheAug 01 15:50
oiaohmYou just need lazy enough end users.Aug 01 15:50
schestowitzAnd with the new depression and hotels being quite empty it may never attain profitabillityAug 01 15:51
schestowitzIt will make a nice museum item as BillG's last hurray Aug 01 15:51
schestowitzTo paraphrase, "it's a good thing we have museums to document that stuff"Aug 01 15:51
wallclimberheh...a Bill Gates Museum...wonder what would be in itAug 01 15:52
wallclimberone big window?Aug 01 15:52
wallclimberwith cracks in it...Aug 01 15:52
oiaohmXarver LGPL allows linking to different licence code including closed source code.Aug 01 15:53
Xarverso if you made an os closed source but made the libs all LGPL no one would hate the os? :PAug 01 15:54
oiaohmI would not go that far.Aug 01 15:54
oiaohmYou would not have lawyers breathing down your neck as long as you followed the LGPL conditions.Aug 01 15:55
oiaohmIe providing the source code of the LGPL licenced bits.Aug 01 15:55
oiaohmThere are some people who would just hate the OS becaue its closed source.Aug 01 15:56
twitterRoy is making one of these online at BN, lots of criminal documentation -> wallclimber: heh...a Bill Gates Museum...wonder what would be in itAug 01 15:56
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oiaohmThere are a lot of programs out there that are part open and part closed XarverAug 01 15:58
schestowitzwallclimber: that existsAug 01 15:58
oiaohmIncluding MS Windows.Aug 01 15:59
schestowitzAnd they also invest in someAug 01 15:59
schestowitzB&M put money also in librariesAug 01 15:59
schestowitzWhich in turn affects their technology orientationAug 01 15:59
schestowitzIt's all part of that nice little swindleAug 01 15:59
Xarveroiaohm, so would people hate the company for making it part closed source?Aug 01 15:59
wallclimberhmmm...everything they do seems to be a swindleAug 01 15:59
Xarveror at least the open source peoplAug 01 15:59
XarverpeopleAug 01 16:00
schestowitzwallclimber: I made a new pageAug 01 16:00
schestowitzhttp://schestowitz.com/Weblog/archives/2007/10/21/gates-foundation-loophole/Aug 01 16:01
oiaohmSome people Xarver   Not the complete open source world.Aug 01 16:01
XarverAh ok. That's fine thenAug 01 16:01
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/Gates_Foundation_CritiqueAug 01 16:01
oiaohmPeople forget companies like redhat do have closed source parts.Aug 01 16:01
Xarver:PAug 01 16:01
oiaohmOpen source world has people from all extreams.Aug 01 16:02
oiaohmHmmAug 01 16:02
twitterthe old "stairwell method" ? -> marked exam papers without reading them properlyAug 01 16:03
oiaohmWindows 7.  I forget about that people talk about 7 deady sins.   It might be fun to see if Windows 7 matches up.Aug 01 16:03
Xarveroiaohm, Nice!Aug 01 16:06
schestowitztwitter: yes, big new over here in ManchesterAug 01 16:06
schestowitzA friend told me about it this morning.Aug 01 16:06
twitterah.  It looks like she at least "skimmed" them.Aug 01 16:07
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Novell Drops Another Event and Loses Major Contract with City of Los Angeles http://ping.fm/322AnAug 01 16:07
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schestowitzfewa: can you do Wiki edits without the Quote Extension?Aug 01 16:07
schestowitzI can'y get it installedAug 01 16:07
schestowitzI get errors when I tryAug 01 16:07
twitterfinal papers, she must have used the "reputation and looks" method.Aug 01 16:07
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schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/List_of_Microsoft_SinsAug 01 16:08
wallclimberlol...List of Microsoft Sins "Illegally shooting antelope"??Aug 01 16:09
wallclimbertooo funnyAug 01 16:09
schestowitzOh wait......Aug 01 16:09
schestowitzIt works finally!Aug 01 16:09
schestowitzAfter 2 weeksAug 01 16:09
schestowitzThey fixed their svnAug 01 16:09
schestowitzwallclimber: too trueAug 01 16:09
oiaohmI was thinking 7 deady sins and Windows 7 design flaws.Aug 01 16:10
oiaohmReally I don't know what MS was doing calling it 7 its so much a open target.Aug 01 16:11
XarverLolAug 01 16:11
XarverfunnyAug 01 16:11
wallclimberoiaohm, maybe they thought 7 would be their lucky number?Aug 01 16:11
schestowitzoiaohm: just VIsta 6.1Aug 01 16:11
schestowitzRegistry calls it Windows v. 6.1Aug 01 16:12
schestowitzMaybe they changed it to "7" in RTMAug 01 16:12
schestowitzVista is Windows 6Aug 01 16:12
wallclimberVista 6.66 would be funnierAug 01 16:12
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oiaohmI will pull out the deady sins at some point I have the sneaking feeling it might have them all covered.Aug 01 16:13
twitterViViViAug 01 16:13
schestowitzwallclimber: that's Trademark of GlodmanSachs666Aug 01 16:15
schestowitzI recommended it to some friends hereAug 01 16:15
wallclimberExtravagance (includes Lust), 7 Deadly sins (according to WP: Gluttony, Greed, Acedia (Despair & Sloth), Wrath, Envy, Pride (Vainglory)Aug 01 16:15
schestowitzTurns out many people already know about it BECAUSE GOldman harassed those guysAug 01 16:15
schestowitzwallclimber: 7 is a special numbers in the biblesAug 01 16:16
schestowitzWhen Vista 7 burns down like it committed a sins the religious groups will hopefully sue MSFT ;-)Aug 01 16:16
schestowitzRemember the Fiji incident?Aug 01 16:16
wallclimberfiji incident?Aug 01 16:16
schestowitzYEah.Aug 01 16:16
schestowitzWait.Aug 01 16:16
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twitterVista 7, taking aim at true fundamentalists and other irrational characters with misplaced faith.Aug 01 16:17
schestowitzhttp://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1026609/fiji-attacks-microsoftAug 01 16:17
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twitter7, it must be blessed.Aug 01 16:17
schestowitz"SOFTWARE GIANT Microsoft has been told not to contaminate the good image of a pacific island by naming its software after it. Fiji's military government has penned a nasty letter to Vole demanding that the company not use its country's nomenclature on any of its products."Aug 01 16:17
schestowitzSmart peopleAug 01 16:17
twittervery funny.Aug 01 16:18
schestowitzThey learned from VIsta that Windows is a dead end. VIstA already has its reputation semi ruined."Aug 01 16:18
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schestowitzMojave too is a laughing stock]Aug 01 16:18
wallclimberyes, Mojave was great comedyAug 01 16:18
schestowitzhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mojave_DesertAug 01 16:18
schestowitzKeyword: desertAug 01 16:18
schestowitzUser count: 9Aug 01 16:18
twitterlike GuantanamoAug 01 16:18
schestowitzWindows GuantanamoAug 01 16:18
schestowitzNot that's a good nameAug 01 16:18
schestowitzLocks you RIGHT inAug 01 16:19
wallclimberlol, i know all about the Mojave desertAug 01 16:19
wallclimber:)Aug 01 16:19
wallclimberit's hot and dryAug 01 16:19
twitterAbu Garu OfficeAug 01 16:19
schestowitzwallclimber: who? Gates?Aug 01 16:19
schestowitzClippy is a copAug 01 16:19
schestowitzWith a whipAug 01 16:19
oiaohmMojave desert was also ment to be USA reactor waste dump.Aug 01 16:20
schestowitz"It SEEMS like you are writing a FREAKIN docuement!!"Aug 01 16:20
schestowitz"Would you like me to SERVE you?"Aug 01 16:20
wallclimberyes, there has been dumping in the deserts for many decadesAug 01 16:20
twitterI'm told that China issued a slightly modified version of Clippy that really was  a cop.Aug 01 16:20
oiaohmBefore las vagas grew.Aug 01 16:20
schestowitztwitter: for censorship?Aug 01 16:20
twitteryesAug 01 16:20
oiaohmNow they have dug a huge waste dump that cannot have anything dumped in it wallclimberAug 01 16:20
wallclimberoiaihm, do you live in the US Southwest?Aug 01 16:21
schestowitzThere was cartoon stuff for babysitting (nanny state)Aug 01 16:21
wallclimberjust curiousAug 01 16:21
oiaohmI live in Australia wallclimberAug 01 16:21
twitterIt would pop up when you looked at unpatriotic sites.Aug 01 16:21
oiaohmUSA tried a lot to get australia to take the waste when they no longer had a dumping location for it.Aug 01 16:21
twittermight have told you to go outsideAug 01 16:21
schestowitztwitter: in CHina, pr0n too is unpatrioticAug 01 16:21
schestowitzNot just political viewsAug 01 16:21
twitterbig brother's love is jealousAug 01 16:22
schestowitzoiaohm: they use Africa nowAug 01 16:22
schestowitzThey rely on ignorance too when they ship their 'gifts' overAug 01 16:22
schestowitzToxic waste like that found in CRTs and old computersAug 01 16:22
wallclimberoiaohm, you should come visit us, we're kind of like a mini-AustraliaAug 01 16:23
schestowitzThe mercury leaks and the rest decomposes in the ground, later to ripple and percolate its way to local lakes used by villagersAug 01 16:23
wallclimberhere in the SouthwestAug 01 16:23
XarverHey guys do you have any open source project ideas? I want to learn wxPython and make something nice. :)Aug 01 16:24
Xarverbrb brushing teethAug 01 16:24
Xarverand going to bathroomAug 01 16:24
wallclimberTMI!Aug 01 16:24
oiaohmNot really wallclimber use some Australian slang and the USA people just don't get it.Aug 01 16:24
oiaohmWe even have problems at times with other australians and local slang.Aug 01 16:24
wallclimberI meant geography, not people - :)Aug 01 16:25
wallclimberif you visit, just be very quiet :)Aug 01 16:25
oiaohmAustralia has majorally different geography.Aug 01 16:25
oiaohmI personally like the rain forest sections.Aug 01 16:26
wallclimberokay, never mind :)Aug 01 16:26
oiaohmIn desert the areas with under ground housing.Aug 01 16:27
oiaohmDo you have any of that over there.Aug 01 16:27
twitterbusted.  chain of email reveals how government lies when caught in uncomfortable situation. so premeditated http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/07/31/air.force.one/Aug 01 16:27
oiaohmIts very nice.  Depth into ground sets room temp.Aug 01 16:27
wallclimberthere's no way we could possibly have anything to compareAug 01 16:27
wallclimber:)Aug 01 16:27
twittercoordinated, and targeting web commentsAug 01 16:27
schestowitzCoool: http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/List_of_Microsoft_SinsAug 01 16:28
schestowitzThe extension works gracefully nowAug 01 16:28
Xarverso any open source ideas that can be done with wxpython?Aug 01 16:28
schestowitzping fewa Aug 01 16:28
twitter->  while the White House, the military and numerous federal and local government agencies coordinated the flight, the federal government demanded secrecy, preparing a news release that was to be distributed only if there were media inquiries. ... "We...need to construct some sort of timeline on when folks became aware of it if that is possible," one Air Force official wrote, responding to the public interest."Aug 01 16:29
twitterthey have a funny way of spelling public outrageAug 01 16:29
schestowitzI got something interesting regarding that this morningAug 01 16:30
schestowitzSOme person who read BN wrote:Aug 01 16:30
twitterHoly crap ->  "No positive spin is possible. Admit mistake," it concludes.Aug 01 16:30
schestowitzI just noticed an interesting article in a French blog called "Les corbeaux de Wikipedia" (The crows of Wikipedia).  It is mainly about how the French government has been involved in sanitising Wikipedia articles which it regards as sensitive.  Of course, this phenomenon extends well beyond the French government:Aug 01 16:30
schestowitzLes corbeaux de WikipediaAug 01 16:30
schestowitzhttp://bugbrother.blog.lemonde.fr/2009/07/31/les-corbeaux-de-wikipedia/Aug 01 16:30
schestowitz--- begin French ---Aug 01 16:30
schestowitzLe FBI, la CIA, l&#8217;église de Scientologie, Al-Jazeera, les gouvernements américains, turcs et israéliens, Exxon, Disney, Fox News&#8230; depuis des années, des centaines d&#8217;organismes publics et entreprises privées ont, discrètement, rectifié ce qui, dans Wikipedia, ne leur convenait pas. Sauf que l&#8217;anonymat, sur l&#8217;Internet, ça n&#8217;existe pas (voir encadré).Aug 01 16:30
schestowitz--- end French ---Aug 01 16:30
twitterIt's like they have a flow chart for lying.Aug 01 16:30
schestowitz"--- begin English ---Aug 01 16:30
schestowitzThe FBI, the CIA, the church of Scientology, Al-Jazeera, Exxon, Disney, Fox News, the governments of the USA, Turkey, and Israel ...  for some years, hundreds of public bodies and private enterprises have, discretely, rectified that which, in Wikipedia, was not suitable for them.  Except that anonymity, on the Internet, does not exist (or rather, it's limited.)Aug 01 16:30
schestowitz--- end English ---"Aug 01 16:30
schestowitz"It also includes some resources in English:Aug 01 16:31
schestowitzwikiscanner : http://wikiscanner.virgil.gr/Aug 01 16:31
schestowitzbest of the WikiWatch : http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/tag/wikiwatch/Aug 01 16:31
schestowitzI briefly tried the Wikiscanner and, while I wasn't able to find some of the most infamous handles, I was readily able to find many edits which came from, for instance, Microsoft. "Aug 01 16:31
schestowitz"On other Wikipedia news, it looks like today the discussion on whether to ban the "hAl" user from any Microsoft-related topics was closed, but not resolved.  Aug 01 16:31
schestowitzhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:OpenDocument#Possible_conflict_of_interestAug 01 16:31
schestowitzhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Conflict_of_interest/Noticeboard/Archive_33#hAl_Microsoft_Topic_BanAug 01 16:31
schestowitzThe Wikipedia person who closed the discussion recommended that, if anyone wanted to carry it further, they should request arbitration."Aug 01 16:31
oiaohmCoober Pedy australia if you even get there wallclimber you have to stay in some of the underground accomodation and visit the grave yard to see the one guys grave stone is a beer keg.Aug 01 16:31
schestowitztwitter: yes, there's a procedureAug 01 16:31
schestowitzWith a fallback that's a good-looking lady coming to do some PR and apologiseAug 01 16:31
schestowitzWHen there's no proper excuse leftAug 01 16:32
schestowitzLike poisonous milkAug 01 16:32
twitterRMS pointed to an Airforce web monitoring flow chart.Aug 01 16:32
schestowitzOr Windows VistaAug 01 16:32
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schestowitzMeh. NewsGator Passes Million-Enterprise-User Milestone and Deepens Relationship With Microsoft < http://www.newsgator.com/companyinfo/press/archive.aspx?post=191 >Aug 01 16:32
schestowitzIs that something worth PR in their eyes?Aug 01 16:33
schestowitzNews+Microsoft=Swne, Nswe or whateverAug 01 16:33
schestowitzNBC=General Electric, Microsoft, Pentagon, other interests..Aug 01 16:34
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schestowitz"Hey, CHuck, we sure make lots of fridges and stuff. How about we start... a NEWS venture...?"Aug 01 16:34
schestowitzThat's how media is run in the US but in other countries tooAug 01 16:34
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twitterugh.  FCC pretends to watch out for wireless consumers -> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/01/AR2009080101074.htmlAug 01 16:35
schestowitzThose with the money get to run the news (= information/misinformation)Aug 01 16:35
schestowitzFCC has Microsoft as MD nowAug 01 16:35
twitteryes, I used the word "consumer" to mock the effortAug 01 16:35
wallclimberI've often wondered how a person "consumes" software...Aug 01 16:36
twitterThey attack iPhone for rejecting Google voice app.  A choice of masters does not equal freedom.Aug 01 16:36
schestowitzThe paranoid in me will say that Microsoft does not like Iphone, so a former Microsofter running the FTC might receive some calls from Redmond.Aug 01 16:36
schestowitz*FCCAug 01 16:36
schestowitz(typo)Aug 01 16:36
twitterthat's not paranoia, it's using your memoryAug 01 16:37
schestowitzI can't help: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/20/microsoft-fcc-steven-vanroekel/Aug 01 16:37
twitterthe triviality of the issue here only highlights how non free the US cell phone market is.Aug 01 16:37
schestowitzFTC was run by Deborah MajorasAug 01 16:37
schestowitzThey took her from indurty..Aug 01 16:37
schestowitzTo ;'watch' industryAug 01 16:37
schestowitzShe's in P&G nowAug 01 16:38
schestowitzThey should stop taking people to government _from industry_Aug 01 16:38
twitterM$ loves it when they can start a messy legal and regulatory battle between M$ competitors.Aug 01 16:38
schestowitzThey make the government just... well,, INDUSTRYAug 01 16:38
schestowitzBarnett from the DOJ used to work for MicrosoftAug 01 16:38
schestowitzNow he's attacking Google from the US DOJAug 01 16:38
twitterThe level of M$ corruption in US DOJ is apparent enough.Aug 01 16:39
twitterThank you for keeping track of people.  That helps make the case.Aug 01 16:39
twitter->  The iPhone needs to be smashed open, and the FCC is swinging the hammer.Aug 01 16:41
twitterbut Windows Mobile and other non free platforms are AOK?Aug 01 16:42
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twitterIt would be a good start to be able to use any device for cell phone service.   OpenMoko comes to mind.Aug 01 16:43
twitterThe real point of freedom, however, has to be Open Spectrum.Aug 01 16:44
twitterThe FCC justifies it's existence with trivialities.Aug 01 16:44
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] RT @anon34bo65f: I want to see a 4chan vs. China heavyweight trolling bout.Aug 01 16:47
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] @davidgerard: I need your help (NeduaWiki). Could you pop into IRC, please?Aug 01 16:55
*DavidGerard (i=5247016d@gateway/web/freenode/x-obfaihpayinrfayn) has joined #boycottnovellAug 01 17:00
schestowitzDebian Lenny tip: If you absolutely, positively need to make Iceweasel appear as Firefox <  http://www.insidesocal.com/click/2009/07/debian-lenny-tip-if-you-absolu.html >Aug 01 17:01
DavidGerardschestowitz: you pinged?Aug 01 17:01
schestowitzHey, David!Aug 01 17:01
DavidGerardi am sorta busy but sorta here :-)Aug 01 17:01
schestowitzDavidGerard: BTW, all your twits end up in IRCAug 01 17:01
schestowitzYou've not been here recentlyAug 01 17:01
DavidGerard(kid had flu, now her mum has flu)Aug 01 17:01
DavidGerardnopeAug 01 17:01
DavidGerardlife is BUSYAug 01 17:02
schestowitzI know, sorry.Aug 01 17:02
DavidGerardand i'm not even employed yetAug 01 17:02
DavidGerardbrb!Aug 01 17:02
schestowitzOK.. Aug 01 17:02
schestowitzDavidGerard: here's the short story (should be simple). WikiMedia SVN had issues for week, and that's finally resolved. So I got the Cite Extension (the one which does references) and it worked perfectly. The following page worked nicely:  http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/List_of_Microsoft_SinsAug 01 17:04
DavidGerardmmmAug 01 17:05
schestowitzThe all the references were displayed correctly after I had installed the extension. Then, when I tried the first edit after it had been installed it gave a blank page when trying to submit pages. Turns out it hates "{{reflist|2}}" at the bottom. If I remove it, then it accepts the change, but otherwise it won't accept it. Worked fine before...Aug 01 17:05
schestowitzDavidGerard: Sorry to bother you about this, thought yuo maybe came accros this and had pointers to offerAug 01 17:06
schestowitz*AcrossAug 01 17:06
DavidGerardhmmAug 01 17:06
schestowitzIn retrospect I should have just left it alone without edits. If I try to trackback to the initial version it won't work, either. Maybe too much candy?? :-DAug 01 17:06
DavidGerarddo you have ParserFunctions installed and enabled? template:reflist uses themAug 01 17:07
DavidGerardalternately, just put <references /> in the ==References== section for a fairly plain list of themAug 01 17:07
schestowitzDavidGerard: yesAug 01 17:07
schestowitz"require_once( "$IP/extensions/ParserFunctions/ParserFunctions.php" );"Aug 01 17:07
schestowitzFrom my settings fileAug 01 17:07
schestowitzI see...Aug 01 17:08
schestowitzLet's try itAug 01 17:08
DavidGerardi just added it :-)Aug 01 17:08
DavidGerardand now the refs showAug 01 17:08
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DavidGerard{{reflist}} is a way to make them show up in columns of small printAug 01 17:08
schestowitz<references>{{reflist|2}}</references > ?Aug 01 17:08
DavidGerardit's eye candyAug 01 17:08
DavidGerardno, look at the wikitextAug 01 17:08
DavidGerard<cite> is the tag for a citation, <references /> makes all the references in <cite>s show upAug 01 17:09
schestowitzAhhh...Aug 01 17:09
schestowitzLet me tryAug 01 17:09
DavidGerardit's not quite html as we know it. actually, it's weirdly horrible and complicated.Aug 01 17:09
DavidGerardi.e. it's mediawiki wikitextAug 01 17:09
schestowitzJust tried it and it gave the same blank pageAug 01 17:10
schestowitzI inserted <references /> Aug 01 17:10
schestowitzDavidGerard: yeah, Wiki syntax in this is confusing. Mishmash of them... :-)Aug 01 17:10
schestowitzWhat baffles me is that it worked OK before any edits were madeAug 01 17:10
DavidGerardi just tried it and it gave me the blank page, then I tried again and the page worked on reloadAug 01 17:10
DavidGerardthere's something weird wrong there and i don't know whatAug 01 17:11
schestowitzIt's as though editing the page with the calls for refs to be generated that causes the issueAug 01 17:11
DavidGerardi suggest emailing wikimedia-l :-)Aug 01 17:11
DavidGerardusually you get a blank page when php is upsetAug 01 17:11
schestowitzSorry for bothering you, DavidGerard :-)Aug 01 17:11
DavidGerardthat's fine :-)Aug 01 17:11
DavidGerardi do suggest you write it up and email mediawiki-l ... where's the page for itAug 01 17:12
schestowitzAh!Aug 01 17:12
schestowitzIt works if I just reload! :-)Aug 01 17:12
schestowitzI think you've cracked it, Sir!Aug 01 17:12
DavidGerardhttps://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-lAug 01 17:12
DavidGerardit's still not ideal, it shouldn't do thatAug 01 17:12
DavidGerardmediawiki-l is the list for third-party users of mediawikiAug 01 17:12
DavidGerardthere's also mwusers.org, a forumAug 01 17:12
DavidGerardi favour mediawiki-l because i know the devs read it :-)Aug 01 17:13
schestowitzSee it now: http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php?title=List_of_Microsoft_SinsAug 01 17:13
DavidGerardParserFunctions is a separate extension that enables a whole complicated template language - look at the source of {{reflist}}Aug 01 17:13
schestowitzDavidGerard: yes, that's why I installed itAug 01 17:14
DavidGerardit's at the confluence of domain-specific programming languages and turing tarpits ;-)Aug 01 17:14
schestowitzSomeone asked me to put it there.Aug 01 17:14
DavidGerarddid you? hmmAug 01 17:14
schestowitzDavidGerard: must be conflict in parsersAug 01 17:14
DavidGerardit lets you do cool things and that's the only reason people put up with itAug 01 17:14
DavidGerardthen it's def time to ask mediawiki-l :-)Aug 01 17:14
DavidGerardparserfunctions language is ... amazingly horribleAug 01 17:15
DavidGerardit's like brainf*ck with bracesAug 01 17:15
schestowitzYou warned me abouit candyAug 01 17:15
DavidGerardthe devs are in serious discussion about replacing it with something that isn't horribleAug 01 17:15
DavidGerard:-DAug 01 17:15
DavidGerardlolAug 01 17:15
DavidGerardysAug 01 17:15
schestowitzSo every time I installed extensions now I fretAug 01 17:15
DavidGerardyesAug 01 17:15
DavidGerardGOOD!Aug 01 17:15
schestowitzUpgrades of MediaWiki must make it worseAug 01 17:15
DavidGerardtake care with them ;-)Aug 01 17:15
schestowitzThen it's not backward compatibleAug 01 17:15
DavidGerarddependsAug 01 17:15
schestowitzAnd neither are the pages, obviouslyAug 01 17:16
DavidGerardpopular extensions get upgradedAug 01 17:16
DavidGerardless popular ones may notAug 01 17:16
schestowitzYeah.Aug 01 17:16
DavidGerardsometimes stuff will break, sometimes it won'tAug 01 17:16
schestowitzI use a cross-cite one in WordPressAug 01 17:16
DavidGerardmmAug 01 17:16
schestowitzIf it ceased working the site would be a messAug 01 17:16
DavidGerardthe most popular extensions tend to get hosting on wikimedia's svnAug 01 17:16
schestowitzYeah, when it worksAug 01 17:16
DavidGerardi.e. an author can basically ask for commit bit for extensionsAug 01 17:16
schestowitzSVN was down for me for over 2 weeksAug 01 17:16
DavidGerardthere is that!Aug 01 17:17
schestowitz:-)Aug 01 17:17
schestowitzWell, I'm happy that it works nowAug 01 17:17
DavidGerardgood :-)Aug 01 17:17
schestowitzI think you know BTW that everything you Twit comes here to IRCAug 01 17:17
schestowitzTry itAug 01 17:17
schestowitzTwit somethingAug 01 17:17
DavidGerardit still shouldn't do that blank page, that means something is in fact wrongAug 01 17:17
DavidGerardhmAug 01 17:17
schestowitzIt pols every 60 secsAug 01 17:17
schestowitz*pollsAug 01 17:17
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] test tweet for @schestowitzAug 01 17:18
DavidGerard:-O oh good lord!Aug 01 17:19
DavidGerardheeeAug 01 17:19
DavidGerardwho else is on the tweet auto-irc list?Aug 01 17:19
DavidGerardhow was that set up?Aug 01 17:19
schestowitzYeahAug 01 17:19
schestowitzBeen like this for monthsAug 01 17:19
DavidGerard(I have no problem with my tweets going everywhere, just surprised)Aug 01 17:19
schestowitzIt uses twitfolk, which is a very experimental perl scriptAug 01 17:19
schestowitzDavidGerard: most people know about it. There's about 15 of us who attend IRC and also use identica/twitterAug 01 17:20
DavidGerardfine by me :-)Aug 01 17:20
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] @davidgerard waves at test messageAug 01 17:20
DavidGerardi just don't use irc much any more cos it's such a time suckAug 01 17:20
schestowitzYeah, well... it's a good old protocolAug 01 17:20
schestowitzSkype may be on its deathbedAug 01 17:20
DavidGerardmmmAug 01 17:21
schestowitzhttp://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/skype_shutdown_where_are_free_software_and_free_protocolsAug 01 17:21
schestowitzSIP time :-)Aug 01 17:21
DavidGerardi always wondered at the idea of skypeAug 01 17:21
schestowitzThey could charge for itAug 01 17:21
DavidGerardit sounded like someone drunkenly took buzzword bingo seriouslyAug 01 17:21
schestowitzPeople would payAug 01 17:21
DavidGerard"let's synergise our p2p wth VoIP!"Aug 01 17:21
DavidGerardnah, they'd go to talk over yahoo or msn or gtalkAug 01 17:22
schestowitzDavidGerard: how's that Polish news?Aug 01 17:22
DavidGerardwhich are different in that they don't have this weird p2p structureAug 01 17:22
schestowitzIt's a bad time for everyone, I betAug 01 17:22
DavidGerardpolish news?Aug 01 17:22
schestowitzSirius is hiringAug 01 17:22
schestowitzThey do FSAug 01 17:22
schestowitzThey deploy a lot of stuff you're familiar with and expandingAug 01 17:23
DavidGerardi will work in poland if they pay me in pounds and i can work from home in london!Aug 01 17:23
schestowitzYeah, well.. it's usuallty the oppositeAug 01 17:23
DavidGerardi've been interviewing at a lot of media companies (that i won't name on a public channel)Aug 01 17:23
schestowitzI have some friends who are Polish and they work here... not the other way aroundAug 01 17:23
DavidGerardbasically, having worked in broadcast, just keeping a website up 24/7 is so much less demandingAug 01 17:24
schestowitzI see.....Aug 01 17:24
schestowitzWikipedia was a good gig... also contributing to society, not just someone's pocketAug 01 17:25
schestowitzMaybe Freda could get a job as an oracleAug 01 17:25
DavidGerardheeAug 01 17:25
schestowitz"His name is... Linux"Aug 01 17:25
DavidGerardi would loooove to work for wikimedia, but they really can't afford to pay me what i need!Aug 01 17:26
schestowitz(*her)Aug 01 17:26
DavidGerardso i work for them free insteadAug 01 17:26
DavidGerard(i'm sure that makes sense)Aug 01 17:26
schestowitzYeah, well.. compromises, I guess.Aug 01 17:26
DavidGerardit's all volunteers, the paid staff are very few indeed - ~30 paid staff, >100k volunteersAug 01 17:26
schestowitzSome people make big money harming societyAug 01 17:26
schestowitzSome live more humbly actually helping societyAug 01 17:27
schestowitzDavidGerard: I still manage to work voluntarily a lotAug 01 17:27
schestowitzI've had regular jobs for over 10 yearsAug 01 17:27
schestowitzLike Wikipedia, it's a case of doing a hobby.. that's what life's aboutAug 01 17:28
schestowitzRMS still does his 'hobby' since he worked at MIT... and he gets enough to pay the bills and fly coach to give talks.Aug 01 17:29
schestowitzSOme people whom I know that work in charity are the sameAug 01 17:29
*Omar87 (n=omar@79.173.236.168.go.com.jo) has joined #boycottnovellAug 01 17:29
Omar87Hey guys! :DAug 01 17:29
schestowitzNew flamebait: Linux is fat: http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxplanet/reports/6811/1/Aug 01 17:30
schestowitzPosted in like 3 sites som far, under different headlines.Aug 01 17:30
schestowitzHi, Omar87 Aug 01 17:30
Omar87I just came back from the Petra-Aqaba Firefox trip! I'll show you the images and vidz once they become available! :)Aug 01 17:30
Omar87Actually, it's been a few hours since I go home, but it doesn't matter, does it? :pAug 01 17:31
Omar87got*Aug 01 17:32
schestowitzOmar87: Firefox trip???Aug 01 17:32
Omar87Yup!Aug 01 17:32
schestowitzBillion-d/w party?Aug 01 17:32
schestowitzCool. There are no events for it here, AFAIKAug 01 17:32
Omar87schestowitz: We, the Firefox and Open Source groups in Jordan (specifically Jordan University for Science and Technology) have planned a trip to Petra under the name of Firefox.Aug 01 17:34
schestowitzNice!Aug 01 17:34
schestowitzBTW, I've just read this: Iraq in throes of environmental catastrophe, experts say < http://uruknet.de/?p=m56515&hd=&size=1&l=e >Aug 01 17:34
Omar87schestowitz: We thought it would be a great celebration of the new release. :)Aug 01 17:34
schestowitzI hadn't realise there are weather conditions like that in summerAug 01 17:35
schestowitzOmar87: yes, but it's merely a milestone and reason for celebration (Firefox downloads)Aug 01 17:35
schestowitzFirefox changed the Web by enforcing standardsAug 01 17:35
schestowitzBack in 2003 I struggled with Linux on the Web because some sites didn't properly support KonquerorAug 01 17:35
schestowitzYears later it was a totally different story.. I moved from Mozilla to Firefox around 2004 IIRCAug 01 17:36
schestowitzMozilla 1.6 it wasAug 01 17:36
Omar87schestowitz: Exactly, it was just a nice and humble contribution from the Firefox fans in Jordan.Aug 01 17:36
schestowitzOr 1.7... on SuSE 8.1Aug 01 17:36
schestowitzOmar87: do government sites support all browsers?Aug 01 17:36
schestowitzIn SA and Portugal there's some ActiveX poison in citizens' sitesAug 01 17:36
schestowitzHere in the UK it's mostly sorted out by now. No access/browsing issues. So I've not needed Windows for yearsAug 01 17:37
Omar87schestowitz: Unfortunately, most of the Government's websites are built in .NET.. and.. you know the rest. :)Aug 01 17:37
schestowitzOmar87: well, that may changeAug 01 17:38
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schestowitzEurope and South America make the moveAug 01 17:38
Omar87schestowitz: I hope so.Aug 01 17:38
schestowitzEast Asia is willing but slow. Russia is also moving.Aug 01 17:38
twitterPeople accuse me of being a tool.  It's all lies! LOL -> schestowitz: DavidGerard: most people know about it. There's about 15 of us who attend IRC and also use identica/twitterAug 01 17:38
schestowitzJordan is like UK... a lover of MicrosoftAug 01 17:39
twitterThere is a lot of FUD about Skype out there.Aug 01 17:39
twitterI pointed to some of it last night.Aug 01 17:39
schestowitzYes, but either way I want to leave itAug 01 17:39
schestowitzAND...Aug 01 17:39
twittera relative tells me it was plastered in Drudge ReportAug 01 17:39
schestowitzI want to have a reasont o get people off itAug 01 17:39
schestowitzSo that I canAug 01 17:39
schestowitzIf I can say to family, here... move to SIP now, then I can drop SkypeAug 01 17:40
schestowitzIt's a resource hog... preallocates about 100MB of RAMAug 01 17:40
twitterDo you have a SIP client that works from end to end?Aug 01 17:40
schestowitzThere are manyAug 01 17:40
twitterI've had problems with Ekiga.Aug 01 17:40
schestowitzI don't care for video anywayAug 01 17:40
schestowitzVIdeo is stupidAug 01 17:40
schestowitzFor communication anywayAug 01 17:40
twitterVideo is NOT stupid.Aug 01 17:40
schestowitzI usually read or type while talking anywayAug 01 17:41
schestowitztwitter: to some people it ain'tAug 01 17:41
twitterI'm half way across the country from my 3 year old girl.Aug 01 17:41
schestowitzI also need a newer kernel for my old Webcam to workAug 01 17:41
twitterI can tell you how important video is to her.Aug 01 17:41
schestowitztwitter: Ah, that's rightAug 01 17:41
schestowitzI thought you had brought the family Aug 01 17:41
twitternope, not yetAug 01 17:41
twitterthis gig might only last six months.Aug 01 17:42
schestowitzThe usualAug 01 17:42
schestowitzThese days worker rights are gutterAug 01 17:42
schestowitzSo obligations to people are nullifiedAug 01 17:42
schestowitzAnd they can use offshoring to extort and negotiateAug 01 17:42
twitterIf you have a good SIP client that works end to end, I'd love to know about it.Aug 01 17:42
schestowitzStagnation in salaries, visas, and all that stuff known and marketed as globalisationAug 01 17:43
schestowitzI know some very good videos that explain this in contextAug 01 17:43
twitterNone of the clients in Lenny have worked for me so far, or at least with Astrisks out of the box.Aug 01 17:43
schestowitzTyrannical entities using the system to suit themselves while as a technowaffle/afterthought marketing this as the public's intrestsAug 01 17:43
twitterFooling around with asterisks config files did not help.Aug 01 17:44
schestowitzIf SIP clients are inferior I'm willing to cope with itAug 01 17:44
twitterI can get Ekiga to see and connect, but I can't get video.Aug 01 17:44
schestowitzSkype needs to be reformed or replaced in some ways. They let in the Chinese govt. (For text0Aug 01 17:44
schestowitzBTW: did you see http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/yes_linus_microsoft_hating_disease_and_its_pandemic /Aug 01 17:45
twitterEEE PC 701SD  is hostile to Ekiga, so I don't have two computers to work things out with.Aug 01 17:45
schestowitzI used to be using Wikis a lot more to communicateAug 01 17:46
schestowitzNow I just do audio.... choose another medium maybeAug 01 17:46
twitterThere are barriers to free video phones at every level.  The devices are hostile, software patents stand in the way, Cisco mangles packet headers, ISPs block competitors.Aug 01 17:46
twitterand free video phones are a killer feature that GNU/Linux should be rocking with.Aug 01 17:46
schestowitzit doesAug 01 17:47
twitterSkype is a software patent offender, but their client works with GNU/Linux out of the box.Aug 01 17:47
schestowitzJust not the FS sideAug 01 17:47
twitterWell, that's a crime.Aug 01 17:47
schestowitzAlthough it;'s possible to get up and running with the right h/wAug 01 17:47
schestowitzIt can be preinstalled, tooAug 01 17:47
twitterDid you konw that Skype has more than twice as many users as Facebook does?Aug 01 17:47
schestowitzFacebooks is junkAug 01 17:48
schestowitzThe kids love itAug 01 17:48
schestowitzI see how my sister uses it... far too much time spentAug 01 17:48
trmancoit's not junkAug 01 17:48
schestowitzThey do what they call "games'Aug 01 17:48
schestowitzANd "socialising"Aug 01 17:48
schestowitzAnd listen to this thing called "musicAug 01 17:48
twitterFacebook is junk.  Something tells me that threatening Facebook would make more trouble than killing Skype.Aug 01 17:48
trmancoI actually focus with experiments on it's interfaceAug 01 17:49
schestowitzAnd spend time doing that thing called "homework" (part indoctrination and training)Aug 01 17:49
trmancoit's a great piece of designAug 01 17:49
schestowitzI saw how it goesAug 01 17:49
schestowitzIt's not a Facebook problemAug 01 17:49
schestowitzIt's another problemAug 01 17:49
schestowitzLike SMS cultureAug 01 17:49
schestowitzIt doesn't harm language, unlike FUD that indicates soAug 01 17:49
twitterSocial networks should not have owners.Aug 01 17:49
schestowitzBut it mobilises kidsAug 01 17:50
trmanco"Hi how r u?"Aug 01 17:50
schestowitzAnd it makes them socially inaptAug 01 17:50
schestowitzThey exchange small sequences of thumb-driven chars with banal messagesAug 01 17:50
twitterMore communications are better than less.Aug 01 17:50
twitterbanal or not, this is how we learnAug 01 17:50
schestowitztrmanco: "me OK, & u?"Aug 01 17:50
twitterOK & uAug 01 17:51
twitterme was waste of typeAug 01 17:51
twitterK & uAug 01 17:51
*schestowitz gtg 2 fb 2 find gf lolzAug 01 17:51
twitterthe form is less important than the meaning.Aug 01 17:51
twittercommunications build tolerance for others.Aug 01 17:51
schestowitzYeah, I knowAug 01 17:51
schestowitzIt's interesting to see how people perceive the WebAug 01 17:52
schestowitzTo some, FB is like the gateway, not GOogleAug 01 17:52
twittermedia giants hate the webAug 01 17:52
schestowitzTo others it's a portal like that one I made in 2002 and I saw others following a similar pathAug 01 17:52
schestowitztwitter: they adaptAug 01 17:52
schestowitzMurdoch got 'hip'Aug 01 17:52
schestowitzHe bought MYSpace *LOLZ*Aug 01 17:52
twittermost negative perceptions come from media defending their gatekeeper statusAug 01 17:53
schestowitzMurduch uber-social-istAug 01 17:53
twitterthey seek to control by ownershipAug 01 17:53
schestowitzAfter Murdoch bought them they collapsedAug 01 17:53
schestowitzThe kids move to FBAug 01 17:53
twitterfreedom terrifies themAug 01 17:53
schestowitzAnd MySpace has wave after wave of layoffs nowAug 01 17:53
schestowitzWSJ is the sameAug 01 17:53
twitterFB is owned by M$ in partAug 01 17:53
schestowitzThe paygates don't helpAug 01 17:53
twitterAlso monitored by big dumb companies.Aug 01 17:54
twittersocial networks should be distributed so that people can maintain their privacy and dignityAug 01 17:54
twitterFB collects too much power.Aug 01 17:55
schestowitzU.S. back-to-school; Wal-Mart woos laptop shoppers < http://www.reuters.com/article/ousiv/idUSTRE56M10X20090723 >Aug 01 17:55
schestowitzHave Red-Mart taken over the Republic yet?Aug 01 17:56
twitterThere's no reason for free software SIP phones to suck.  ogg and theora are just as good or better than non free codecsAug 01 17:57
schestowitzFor a change, Paul Meller wrote about Microsoft antitrust without quoting Microsoft front groups: http://www.pcworld.com/article/169041/microsofts_eu_offer_gets_cautious_welcome_from_rivals.htmlAug 01 17:58
twitterI'm stunned that Ekiga did not work out of the box for me.Aug 01 17:58
schestowitztwitter: they need usersAug 01 17:58
twitterI don't need users.Aug 01 17:59
schestowitzThat's why Skype problems may be OK news (from my selfish view as a FS advocate)Aug 01 17:59
twitterby running my own Astricks server, I can add anyone that I want.Aug 01 17:59
schestowitzSkype needing replacement is good for SIP and FSAug 01 17:59
twitterThat part is really easy.Aug 01 17:59
twitterIt's not good for free software if software patents stand in the way.Aug 01 18:00
schestowitztwitter: tessier runs Asterisk on his server and sets that up for clientsAug 01 18:00
schestowitzNo s/w patents here.Aug 01 18:00
schestowitzBar NokiaAug 01 18:00
twitterWell, I'd love to have some advice from him.Aug 01 18:00
twitterThere are lots of software patents on video and voice codecsAug 01 18:00
twitterand the whole problem with Skype is one of software patents.  The owner is messing with EBay over it.Aug 01 18:01
Omar87schestowitz: http://www.flickr.com/photos/10123666@N07/3777770211/Aug 01 18:01
schestowitzSpinvox Tries To Patent Dictation?  http://techdirt.com/articles/20090731/0301435724.shtmlAug 01 18:01
twitterThe death of Skype has only one winner, M$Aug 01 18:01
schestowitzMethod of providing voicemails to a wireless information device http://appft1.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PG01&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1="20060223502".PGNR.&OS=DN/20060223502&RS=DN/20060223502Aug 01 18:01
schestowitztwitter: they do SIP?Aug 01 18:01
twitterThey get to deny GNU/Linux users of a killer feature and parade patent FUD around.Aug 01 18:01
schestowitzTheir Comms Server is lostAug 01 18:01
twitterM$ invented SIP, from what I recall.Aug 01 18:01
schestowitzAnd they killed Response Unit or whatever it's calledAug 01 18:02
twitterEkiga is Gnome Meeting which was an imitation of Net Meeting.Aug 01 18:02
schestowitzOmar87: nice!Aug 01 18:02
Omar87schestowitz: ;)Aug 01 18:02
schestowitzSql Alchemist... good nymAug 01 18:03
twitterThe real M$ victory, though, is to deny GNU/Linux users of something that they claim is easy on Winblows.Aug 01 18:03
Omar87lolAug 01 18:03
schestowitzGroklaw RSS feeds are still brokenAug 01 18:03
twitterPeople have been chatting with web cams for more than a decade.  It's always been a huge pain in the ass on Winblows.Aug 01 18:03
schestowitzNot reallyAug 01 18:04
schestowitzMSN Messenger is used by someAug 01 18:04
schestowitzThere are Flash-based clientsAug 01 18:04
schestowitzWith WebcamsAug 01 18:04
twitterIt always sucked, like all things Winblows.Aug 01 18:04
twitterThe flash based clients, like those used by Yahoo and Google are very recent next to SIP.Aug 01 18:04
schestowitzMicrosoft innovates Apple... http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/07/24/microsoft_stores_to_mimic_apples_with_guru_bars.htmlAug 01 18:05
twitterbut it's all hugely stupid and redundant.Aug 01 18:05
twitterClients should just work.  It should not be hard.Aug 01 18:05
schestowitzNo, Flash based ones I used as early as 2003Aug 01 18:05
schestowitzDrop-in for sites... with WebcamsAug 01 18:05
Omar87schestowitz: lol, And there's still more photos (and vidz) to come. ;)Aug 01 18:05
twitterI watched people doing things like that in 1998.Aug 01 18:05
schestowitzOmar87: if you have Ogg videos, tell me the URL and I'll put it at the bottom of DaIly Links as <video>Aug 01 18:06
twitterMy oldest webcam is from that time period and it required net meeting, which never worked for me.Aug 01 18:06
schestowitz Wall Street Goes to War  < http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2009/0803/iraq-afghanistan-obama-wall-street-goes-to-war.html?partner=contextstory >Aug 01 18:07
twitternet meeting failed, even though I had both cable modem and DSL, both wide open at the time.Aug 01 18:07
twitterVideo is a long running failure for M$.Aug 01 18:07
schestowitz"The battle for wartime profits is waged in the boardroom. Inside the most lucrative--and the ugliest--deal of the Iraq and Afghan wars."Aug 01 18:07
twitterSkype dominates based on the failure of others.Aug 01 18:07
schestowitzA friend told em his hypothesis today that London still controls a lot of the world's financesAug 01 18:07
schestowitzWhich I doubtAug 01 18:07
twittermust be on the secret gold standardAug 01 18:08
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schestowitzHe hypothesises that wars involve use of nationality (patriotism) or religion to engage a mass/public in wars that add to the pockets of the elite classAug 01 18:08
schestowitzThat is more or less established fact for _SOME_ wars, but not allAug 01 18:08
schestowitzWall Street loves wars, I guess.Aug 01 18:08
schestowitzIt 'drives the market'... like a tank]Aug 01 18:08
schestowitzProduction and destruction = cycle of tradeAug 01 18:09
twitterMy hunch is that software patents stand in the way of decent, easy to use free software video phones.Aug 01 18:09
schestowitzBogus Textron, Harmon Bids Fueled ‘Suspicious’ Trades  < http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=ayQQjjPCwUXU >Aug 01 18:09
twitterStupid stuff like "one click shopping"Aug 01 18:10
schestowitz"Bogus takeover bids for Textron Inc. and Harman International Industries Inc. reaped more than $5 million for a Kuwait-based financier and firms who placed “highly profitable and suspicious” bets beforehand, U.S. regulators said in a lawsuit targeting the traders....The SEC can sue people for making bogus bids to manipulate stock prices."Aug 01 18:10
schestowitztwitter: maybe it's only 'defensive"Aug 01 18:10
schestowitzLike h-bomb warheads areAug 01 18:10
schestowitzAmazon wants to scare rivalsAug 01 18:10
schestowitzWith junk patentsAug 01 18:10
schestowitzAmazon: where eShopping ws invented, supposedly.Aug 01 18:11
schestowitzIBM sticks to the same spiel with Internet patentsAug 01 18:11
twitterThis kind of scare stops distros like Debian cold.Aug 01 18:11
twitterthe scare is based on a real legal threatAug 01 18:11
schestowitzhttp://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1202432536214&Wachovia_BofA_Citibank_Sued_Over_BadFaith_Overdraft_Fees 'So far, Wachovia, Bank of America and Citibank have been named as defendants in the lawsuits, and plaintiffs attorneys expect other financial institutions to be brought in."I think what you will see is all of the major banks may be using the same computer program to reorder charges, which is costing consumers around the couAug 01 18:12
schestowitzntry billions of billions," Alters said. 'Aug 01 18:12
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] Skype doing some copyright infringement by citing source code it does not own in US patent trials: http://bit.ly/Jo0NXAug 01 18:13
schestowitzhttp://www.law.com/jsp/legaltechnology/pubArticleLT.jsp?id=1202432521686 (Pictures From Public Places Not Private)Aug 01 18:13
schestowitzhttp://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idUSLQ34711920090726 "Despite its enormous wealth, Kuwait, which sits on a tenth of global oil reserves, lacks any sort of financial regulator to effectively clamp down on insider trading. It is the only Gulf Arab state where the market -- the second largest Arab bourse -- quasi supervises itself, with plans to set up a financial authority stalled for several years."Aug 01 18:15
schestowitzSEC Seeks Return of $4 Million in Bonuses, Stock Sale Profits From Former CEO of CSK Auto  < http://www.sec.gov/news/press/2009/2009-167.htm >Aug 01 18:16
schestowitzKuwait financier facing U.S. fraud suit found dead < http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idUSTRE56P0YD20090726 >Aug 01 18:16
twitterGod, what a flood of FUD.  http://news.google.com/news?um=1&ned=us&hl=en&q=skypeAug 01 18:16
schestowitz"Algosaibi has sued the head of Saad Group in a New York court for fraud in a case involving allegations of $10 billion in loan irregularities."Aug 01 18:16
twitterheh, I sent you the reordered bank draft story days ago.Aug 01 18:17
twitterI think it was a Groklaw news pick.Aug 01 18:17
zoobab01http://www.iptegrity.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=378&Itemid=9Aug 01 18:19
twitterhi zoobab, thanks for the link to the Skype docAug 01 18:22
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schestowitzI didn't even notice this one: IBM to Acquire SPSS, Adding to Acquisitions  < http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124878176796786611.html >Aug 01 18:23
schestowitzIBM... just swallows everything when there's a depressionAug 01 18:23
schestowitzINNOVA~1Aug 01 18:23
schestowitzBye, SPSSAug 01 18:23
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twitterWho is Net2Phone?Aug 01 18:24
twitterding, ding, ding, it's all about F***ing patents ->  Joltid has alleged that Skype should not possess, use or modify certain software source code and that, by doing so, and by disclosing such code in certain U.S. patent cases pursuant to orders from U.S. courts, Skype has breached the license agreement.Aug 01 18:25
twitter!Aug 01 18:26
twitter->  Other third parties have from time to time claimed, and others may claim in the future, that we have infringed their intellectual property rights. We are subject to additional patent disputesAug 01 18:26
twitterThis is the mess that free software climbs into.Aug 01 18:26
twitterSoftware patents must go.Aug 01 18:27
schestowitzRadio host denies threatening federal judges < http://www.chicagobreakingnews.com/2009/07/radio-host-denies-threatening-federal-judges.html >Aug 01 18:27
schestowitzWant to use phone? Buy inetlelectual monopoliesAug 01 18:28
schestowitzThe new 'gold'Aug 01 18:28
twittermore like desert propertyAug 01 18:28
twittera massive fraud.Aug 01 18:28
twitterDMCA and other nonsense also feared by Ebay ->   We may also become more vulnerable to third-party claims as laws such as the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, the Lanham Act and the Communications Decency Act are interpreted by the courts, and as we become subject to laws in jurisdictions where the underlying laws with respect to the potential liability of online intermediaries like ourselves are either unclear or less favorable. Aug 01 18:29
zoobab01EUCD is under consideration for violatuion of free speech: http://www.edri.org/edri-gram/number7.15/finnish-css-echrAug 01 18:31
twitter Net2Phone Jumps Into The VoIP Patent Lawsuit Business: Sues Skype -> http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20080131/001435132.shtmlAug 01 18:32
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Will_Looks like CentOS may be back on track now:Aug 01 18:38
Will_http://www.centos.org/Aug 01 18:38
Will_http://linux.slashdot.org/story/09/08/01/1443221/CentOS-Administrator-ReappearsAug 01 18:38
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schestowitzPJ on Skype: http://www.theage.com.au/technology/biz-tech/shock-threat-to-shut-skype-20090731-e3qe.html "[PJ: I wonder why this threatens to shut it down? It threatens to separate eBay from Skype, but why wouldn't the licensors retain the right to continue with another partner or on their own? eBay didn't build it, after all. They just bought it.] -"Aug 01 18:40
schestowitzCentOS got a lot of free publicity, in a wayAug 01 18:40
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] Erik Josefsson becomes advisor assistant in the European Parliament about the Pirate Party, more time spend on UPLS?: http://bit.ly/dlVrwAug 01 18:42
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] Erik Josefsson becomes advisor assistant in the European Parliament for the Pirate Party, more time to be spent on UPLS? http://bit.ly/dlVrwAug 01 18:42
schestowitzzoobab01: yes, seen that one about CSSAug 01 18:42
zoobab01CSS?Aug 01 18:42
schestowitzCSS caseAug 01 18:43
schestowitzhttp://www.edri.org/edri-gram/number7.15/finnish-css-echrAug 01 18:43
schestowitzJudge gleeful as Nortel broken up < http://www.thestar.com/world/columnist/article/673200 >Aug 01 18:46
schestowitzzoobab01: I have a link for youAug 01 18:46
schestowitzSenators See Patent Office Nominee as Possible Ally < http://legaltimes.typepad.com/blt/2009/07/senators-see-patent-office-nominee-as-possible-ally.html >Aug 01 18:46
tacone"why the Swedish Pirate Party might endanger the GPL and much more" -- linux outlaws 104Aug 01 18:47
schestowitzI have a large post on patents coming. I'm mostly relying on DM for links to be used as input, so...Aug 01 18:47
schestowitztacone: yes, I listened to itAug 01 18:47
taconei'm afraid of even downloadingAug 01 18:47
schestowitzThey explained the issue wellAug 01 18:47
taconeoh no, just a link to rmsAug 01 18:47
schestowitztacone: downloading is the new "smoking pot"Aug 01 18:47
taconeok, niceAug 01 18:47
schestowitzor "Downloading cocaine"Aug 01 18:48
schestowitzhttp://blogs.zdnet.com/security/?p=3828 (Researchers find insecure BIOS 'rootkit' pre-loaded in laptops 0Aug 01 18:49
taconeschestowitz: http://mono-nono.com/2009/07/28/chicken-little-remix-up/comment-page-1/#comment-865Aug 01 18:51
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schestowitzMy thoughts exactlyAug 01 18:57
schestowitzIt's supposed to serve Mono proponentsAug 01 18:57
schestowitzSo that they can make the point you have 'choice'Aug 01 18:57
schestowitz"Chicken Little"Aug 01 18:57
schestowitzYeah... I see a mass exodus from businesses to "Chicken Little" enterprise editionAug 01 18:58
schestowitzLike Kiwi Linux (Ubuntu derivative) took offAug 01 18:58
schestowitzThey know how much "included by default" meansAug 01 18:58
taconeright. at the same time having a regular mantained non mono remix is better than nothing.Aug 01 19:01
taconedunno.Aug 01 19:01
taconepointing out its existance in a small post without further comments may be a nice thing.Aug 01 19:02
schestowitzI didAug 01 19:03
schestowitzSee the comments about itAug 01 19:03
taconeurl ?Aug 01 19:04
schestowitzLatest in BNAug 01 19:06
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Omar87Hi schestowitzAug 01 19:08
Omar87Hi allAug 01 19:08
taconei can't see itAug 01 19:09
schestowitzHeyAug 01 19:11
schestowitztacone: It's in the digest about SUSE StudioAug 01 19:11
schestowitzI'm waiitng for better stories about it that I can linkt oAug 01 19:12
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schestowitzI'll post some Links news, I guess.Aug 01 19:40
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] New Magazine About GNU/Linux and Free Software Debuts http://ping.fm/0xNVmAug 01 19:52
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] First the Anti-Linux Propagandists Mock GNU/Linux, Later They Use It http://ping.fm/5TST9Aug 01 19:54
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Another Linux Kernel Event Coming to Portland http://ping.fm/YwvfHAug 01 19:56
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KrensoHelloAug 01 19:58
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] A Detailed Look at Stellarium http://ping.fm/JnTp6Aug 01 19:58
KrensoI was talking about mono on #monoAug 01 19:59
Krensoand some guy said: ecma335 is defining things on a per-object basis and thus not extendable, and thus splitting mono will make it unusable for many people.Aug 01 20:00
Krensobut he didn't want to talk broader about it nowAug 01 20:01
wallclimberStellarium is great!  My grandkids love itAug 01 20:01
schestowitzwallclimber: I have the memo laid out nowAug 01 20:01
schestowitzIt's posted to the Web, but I need lots of work for context.Aug 01 20:02
KrensoIt's the first time i hear about this case with ecma and per-object basisAug 01 20:02
schestowitzESR's pages helpAug 01 20:02
wallclimberi'm looking for it...Aug 01 20:02
schestowitzIt's the core of HalloweenAug 01 20:02
schestowitzwallclimber: don't worry about itAug 01 20:02
schestowitzBut BN will have an exclusive copy of an important document that's spread out there for people to useAug 01 20:02
wallclimber:)Aug 01 20:03
schestowitzwallclimber: Stellarium looks good, but I never tried itAug 01 20:03
schestowitzI tried kstar some years agoAug 01 20:03
schestowitzI watched many astrological vids on YouTube recentlyAug 01 20:03
schestowitzOne of the enthusiasts loved StellariumAug 01 20:03
schestowitzHe did a little demo I could findAug 01 20:04
schestowitzMany observers of stars seem to be in the mid-westAug 01 20:04
schestowitzFacilities tooAug 01 20:04
wallclimberi muddled around with stellarium then showed it to my grandson and he had it doing all kinds of things...very funAug 01 20:04
schestowitzEducational tooAug 01 20:04
KrensoWhat's intresting, they tell me no to bother about patents. Just focus on applicationsAug 01 20:04
schestowitzhttp://ostatic.com/blog/go-back-to-school-with-linux-part-threeAug 01 20:04
wallclimbermy youngest son lives in Kansas and the stars are extremely gorgeous on the prairiesAug 01 20:05
Krensothat ms has patents on opengl and doesn't sue anybody on itAug 01 20:05
schestowitzKrenso: the applications are not amazingAug 01 20:05
schestowitzSOme are resource hogsAug 01 20:05
schestowitzgnome-do is considered necessaryAug 01 20:05
schestowitzBut another issue is API dominationAug 01 20:05
schestowitzTHey don't seem to mind helping Microsoft pollute Linux with Windows APIsAug 01 20:05
schestowitzIt's alll in the doc I'll post tomorrowAug 01 20:05
schestowitzUse of APIs against LinuxAug 01 20:06
KrensoGnome-do is definitelly based on non-ecmaAug 01 20:06
schestowitzYesAug 01 20:06
schestowitzBanshee tooAug 01 20:06
schestowitzI doubt they careAug 01 20:06
Krensothere is also joel spolsky article about api war from 2004Aug 01 20:06
KrensoMs wants to be gatekeeper: all virtualization through them, all aplications through them and so onAug 01 20:07
Krensofirst xen, now vmwareAug 01 20:08
Krensothen red hat bought qumranAug 01 20:08
KrensoWhen discovered what's going onAug 01 20:09
Krensowith xenAug 01 20:09
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Motorola Enlists Developers for Linux Phones http://ping.fm/yxSp4Aug 01 20:09
schestowitzMicrosoft now puts its APIs inside LinuxAug 01 20:09
schestowitzHypercalls in hyper0-vAug 01 20:09
schestowitzIt's polluting Linux IMHOAug 01 20:09
schestowitzI will write about it romorrowAug 01 20:10
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KrensoCan you tell me more about this hypercalls?Aug 01 20:10
schestowitzTo get an idea, I suggest you search BN for itAug 01 20:11
schestowitzI link to many good articles on itAug 01 20:11
schestowitzAnd put it in context (the part which is hostile to Linux and FS... patents and all)Aug 01 20:11
schestowitzIt's old newsAug 01 20:11
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Red Hat Rallies More GNU/Linux Developers in Asia http://ping.fm/0k1AsAug 01 20:11
KrensookAug 01 20:11
schestowitzhttp://www.google.com/search?q=site:boycottnovell.com+hypercalls&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&ie=UTF-8&hl=enAug 01 20:12
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] CentOS Team: Majority of Issues Resolved Immediately http://www.centos.org/Aug 01 20:14
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] @schestowitz I wonder if Microsoft tried to get Akamai to use NT/IIS frontends for their own stuff ;-pAug 01 20:18
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Skype an Excellent Lesson in Dangers of Proprietary Software and Ugliness of Software Patents http://ping.fm/DkMi0Aug 01 20:19
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Mozilla Sunbird 1.0 is Near http://ping.fm/zne2Y , Chrome Gets Themes http://ping.fm/bOiCiAug 01 20:21
ThistleWebthe Skype thing won't be noticed by most people, it's a shakedown for cash. eBay are trying to sell it AFAIK but it they can't without that licence, so they have no choice but to pay up to keep Skype as a saleable thingAug 01 20:22
schestowitzYeahAug 01 20:22
schestowitzThey tried beforeAug 01 20:22
ThistleWebthey don't want Skype closed because the licence aint paidAug 01 20:22
schestowitzWho would buy?Aug 01 20:22
schestowitzAnd.. would they charge?Aug 01 20:22
ThistleWebthey want a cut of the moneyAug 01 20:22
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] New Opportunity to Convince White House to Embrace Free Software http://ping.fm/2hhrbAug 01 20:22
ThistleWeblike most patent shakedowns / agreements, most people won't notice as the companies involved will do their deal under an NDA, announce some PR statement about "closer ties" and the price will shift up to pay the costs of the agreementAug 01 20:24
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Code Rush in the Creative Commons http://ping.fm/LrFBeAug 01 20:24
ThistleWebthe price rise will just be put down to regular buisnessAug 01 20:24
ThistleWebeveryone goes on as if nothing has happenedAug 01 20:25
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Heise Takes a Look at Latest Eclipse http://ping.fm/6zAMjAug 01 20:27
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] EFF Publishes Advice on Privacy and Anti-Surveillance http://ping.fm/zTLBBAug 01 20:28
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Intellectual Insanity Goes More Insane - Latest Examples http://ping.fm/zyhor http://ping.fm/PMjmNAug 01 20:35
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Amanda Palmer Slams MAFIAA Philosophy http://ping.fm/m1K4hAug 01 20:35
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Wolfram|Alpha Claims Ownership of Algorithm Output http://ping.fm/SQF7aAug 01 20:36
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Software Patents-hostile People Gain Influence http://ping.fm/yHigH http://ping.fm/6Yg8HAug 01 20:38
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Apparent Microsoft Drones Go More Revisionism Against ODF in Wikipedia http://ping.fm/kMIs7 http://ping.fm/93cXNAug 01 20:47
ThistleWebwouldn't it be funny if the Skype thing crumbled, and ebay refused to pay up on something which has little value, so Skype disappeared to be replaced by regular sip clients like gizmo, leaving the owners of that one part with nothingAug 01 20:48
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] PSPP Adds Support of OpenDocument Format - ODF http://ping.fm/CbdmzAug 01 20:49
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Flash Bugs Also Microsoft's Fault http://ping.fm/Gs2llAug 01 20:55
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sebsebsebhiAug 01 20:56
schestowitzACKAug 01 20:56
sebsebsebschestowitz: why?Aug 01 20:57
ThistleWebam I right in thinking it's the codecs the skype thing is over?Aug 01 20:57
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft Back to "Price Fixing" Mode After Attacking GNU/Linux http://ping.fm/AZvCBAug 01 20:57
ThistleWebif so, surely ebay could modify skype and use different codecs, nulifying their claimsAug 01 20:57
schestowitzsebsebseb: ACK just means I received the messageAug 01 20:59
sebsebsebokAug 01 20:59
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft-Led FCC Attacks Apple Just Month After Microsoft Appointment http://ping.fm/z8gX1 http://ping.fm/BLSDZAug 01 20:59
ThistleWebApple ain't exactly an innocent target thoughAug 01 21:03
ThistleWebthey deserve a good probingAug 01 21:03
ThistleWebeven if the timing is suspiciousAug 01 21:03
ThistleWebthe FCC would have more credibility if they dealt with MS properly thoughAug 01 21:04
schestowitzI knowAug 01 21:16
schestowitzI'm not defending AppleAug 01 21:16
schestowitzI don't think the MSFT person played much of a role eitherAug 01 21:17
schestowitzBut it is important to bear that in mind, IMHO.Aug 01 21:17
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schestowitzSome E-mails I received about it saw it coming.Aug 01 21:17
ThistleWebunfortunately plenty of companies really need to be probed by the FCC and their EU counterparts, including MSAug 01 21:19
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] @davidgerard I have a good memo about it: http://bit.ly/maf7YAug 01 21:19
ThistleWebonly so many hours in the day and so many companies to investigate, who will all kick, scream and misleadAug 01 21:20
trmancohttp://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/96ops/google_says_c_is_going_to_kill_us_all_pic/Aug 01 21:22
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lz5hG8LqxTI&NR=1Aug 01 21:27
schestowitzRegulation against health villainsAug 01 21:27
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] @schestowitz your Flash bugs link is badAug 01 21:49
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trmancoughAug 01 22:06
trmancophp has namepaces nowAug 01 22:07
trmanconamespaces*Aug 01 22:07
sebsebsebtrmanco: oh?Aug 01 22:07
trmancophp 5.3 introduced support for namespacesAug 01 22:07
trmancohttp://pt.php.net/manual/pl/language.namespaces.phpAug 01 22:10
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Sys-Con Media Site Delisted, Spam Pattern Explained http://ping.fm/rSX0uAug 01 22:10
schestowitzfewa: I sorted out MediaWikiAug 01 22:10
schestowitz http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/List_of_Microsoft_SinsAug 01 22:11
schestowitzCite Extension is installed nowAug 01 22:11
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Here is the correct link: "Adobe patches 12 Flash bugs, 3 caused by Microsoft" http://ping.fm/eB6Gt (kudos @davidgerard )Aug 01 22:12
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NotN: Ministry of Health welcomes suicide ruling http://notnews.today.com/?p=578Aug 01 22:18
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] @schestowitz and even tho it's cross-platform on Acrobat ... only Windows users use Acrobat. Linux uses Ghostscript, Mac uses Preview.Aug 01 22:20
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Cleaning my feed listAug 01 22:21
trmancohttp://marketshare.hitslink.com/search-engine-market-share.aspx?qprid=4&qpmr=100&qpdt=1&qpct=3&qpaf=-000%09101%09CN%0D&qptimeframe=M&qpsp=126&sample=1Aug 01 22:21
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] July 2009 Web Server Survey: http://is.gd/1Y95uAug 01 22:23
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trmancoWordpress will be moving to php5 only soonAug 01 22:28
trmancohttp://codex.wordpress.org/Switching_to_PHP5Aug 01 22:28
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Jim Allchin’s Lies and Patent FUD Against Free Software http://ping.fm/jIxTGAug 01 22:37
schestowitztrmanco: don't feed Hopkins et al (Microsoft)Aug 01 22:37
trmancowhat, netcraft?Aug 01 22:38
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Xarver_hiAug 01 22:45
schestowitztrmanco: no, netappsAug 01 22:56
schestowitzXarver_: what's up?Aug 01 22:56
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trmancoahAug 01 22:56
Xarvernothing much schestowitzAug 01 22:57
Xarverjust boredAug 01 22:57
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Switzer Performance P800 997 Twin-Turbo: The world is never enough [w/VIDEO] — Autoblog: http://bit.ly/18rpm0 (via @therealautoblog)Aug 01 23:09
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] DW/LJ: Fighting in built-up areas. http://reddragdiva.dreamwidth.org/12374.html http://reddragdiva.livejournal.com/526188.htmlAug 01 23:20
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Groklaw on Microsoft’s GPL Violation and Microsoft on the GPL http://ping.fm/rI7vZAug 01 23:27
*tacone (n=Adium@151.80.136.98) has joined #boycottnovellAug 01 23:27
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*Xarver has quit ("Leaving")Aug 01 23:41
*Balrog (n=Balrog@pool-173-59-72-234.phlapa.east.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovellAug 01 23:43

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