-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Why SUSE Engineers Should Abandon Novell and Start Their Own Company http://bit.ly/gq2QJ | Aug 29 00:14 | |
schestowitz | Eruaran: let's look :-) | Aug 29 00:18 |
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schestowitz | Steven Musil has no history I can recall | Aug 29 00:18 |
schestowitz | MinceR: ping | Aug 29 00:18 |
schestowitz | What's that burning iphone video again? | Aug 29 00:19 |
schestowitz | nm, found it | Aug 29 00:19 |
schestowitz | I'll oggify | Aug 29 00:19 |
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schestowitz | OK, here's the video: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/08/28/microsoft-and-apple-flukes/ | Aug 29 00:31 |
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schestowitz | Can anyone confirm the ogg above works (embedded)? | Aug 29 00:52 |
schestowitz | My cache for this ogg is 'poisoned', so it's broken on my end | Aug 29 00:52 |
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DaemonFC | now I have a "Melissa Mendoza" from Comcast following my blog | Aug 29 01:06 |
DaemonFC | http://izanbardprince.wordpress.com/2009/08/27/comcast-internet-service-down-for-over-nine-hours-last-night/#comment-1073 | Aug 29 01:06 |
DaemonFC | "I could never have imagined a company that could make customers crawl over razor wire and broken glass just to make them pay twice what the service was worth. Bravo!" | Aug 29 01:11 |
DaemonFC | how's that? | Aug 29 01:11 |
schestowitz | Must be torture | Aug 29 01:12 |
schestowitz | :-) | Aug 29 01:12 |
DaemonFC | oh I hate those people | Aug 29 01:12 |
DaemonFC | It was about to make my head explode the other day when I was trying to download a DVD image and my service was going up and down | Aug 29 01:13 |
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DaemonFC | schestowitz: Wine finally did something about SecuROM | Aug 29 01:14 |
DaemonFC | it turns out that one patch fixed the hundreds of games that wouldn't install or needed a no-disc crack even if the SecuROM wasn't in the installer | Aug 29 01:15 |
DaemonFC | for now anyway, I guess, we'll see what the next SecuROM does | Aug 29 01:16 |
DaemonFC | And also, Opera 10 integrates properly into GNOME or KDE and will even find your IcedTea installation by itself | Aug 29 01:18 |
DaemonFC | first release that supports Linux equally to Windows | Aug 29 01:19 |
DaemonFC | I've always liked Opera on Windows or Mac OS, but the Linux version always just seemed like a third rate port. Up til now they were even using gcc 3.2 and QT 3 bindings to build it with | Aug 29 01:20 |
DaemonFC | it got a nice performance boost on Linux just from using a modern compiler | Aug 29 01:21 |
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DaemonFC | http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/3605/30471298.png | Aug 29 01:27 |
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schestowitz | Vista 7 adverts, eh? | Aug 29 01:38 |
DaemonFC | ? | Aug 29 01:39 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] World Wide Web Consortium (W3C) Detoxicated from Microsoft Influence http://bit.ly/a4PAD | Aug 29 01:45 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Novell’s Channel Partner Blasts Novell http://bit.ly/naUn8 | Aug 29 01:46 | |
DaemonFC | I liked how they showed up just as the final touches are being put on HTML 5 and suddenly want to "help" | Aug 29 01:47 |
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schestowitz | Help themselves | Aug 29 01:52 |
schestowitz | Maybe they can recast JPEG 2000 as HD and HTML5 as XAML | Aug 29 01:52 |
DaemonFC | XAML basically went nowhere | Aug 29 01:53 |
DaemonFC | I know they latched it onto Silverlight to try to save it but now it's just dying with Silverlight rather than by itself | Aug 29 01:54 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Microsoft web technologies have generally not been a runaway hit | Aug 29 01:55 |
DaemonFC | they even had Active Channels years before RSS was invented | Aug 29 01:55 |
DaemonFC | that went nowhere | Aug 29 01:55 |
DaemonFC | it easily could have, but nobody wanted to use it | Aug 29 01:56 |
DaemonFC | Netscape also tried to come up with a proprietary RSS-like thing of their own called Netcaster | Aug 29 01:56 |
DaemonFC | Apple and Microsoft might as well be considered the same team as far as their W3C membership goes | Aug 29 01:58 |
DaemonFC | Microsoft: "We'll help you kill Ogg if you help us spread Silverlight" | Aug 29 01:58 |
DaemonFC | Hulu is cozying up to Microsoft some more | Aug 29 02:02 |
DaemonFC | all the Bing commercials and now a Hulu application for Windows that you can control with your Media Center remote | Aug 29 02:03 |
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you need to up the quality on your oggs use ffmpeg2theora -v 6 at least | Aug 29 02:47 | |
the guy with the pistol is a good shot | Aug 29 02:47 | |
DaemonFC | unfortunately, Theora 1.0 is not very useful for things like DVD rips unless you crank the bitrate | Aug 29 02:53 |
DaemonFC | 1.1 is looking a lot better though | Aug 29 02:53 |
DaemonFC | Theora 1.0 is notorious for block artifacts | Aug 29 02:54 |
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DaemonFC | just from my own experimenting, Thusnelda (1.1) is roughly on par with DivX, not quite as good as h.264, but by no means a bad codec | Aug 29 02:56 |
DaemonFC | at least Windows Media Video will be the worst quality again out of the bunch | Aug 29 02:56 |
DaemonFC | I'm just not entirely sure why they would be in such a rush to declare a bad encoder a 1.0 release, GNU-sponsored projects are known for slow development | Aug 29 02:57 |
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schestowitz | gn | Aug 29 02:59 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] ODF Workshop in Brazil Reveals Big New Wins http://bit.ly/14CjIG | Aug 29 02:59 | |
DaemonFC | it's almost like a running gag to see free software get up to 0.99 and stay there for years | Aug 29 02:59 |
DaemonFC | oiaohm__: You'll be horrified to see what Ubuntu has done with Pulseaudio in Karmic development branch | Aug 29 03:01 |
DaemonFC | they've got it so twisted that VLC can't even recognize my microphone anymore | Aug 29 03:01 |
DaemonFC | I was playing around with all the latest alpha/beta stuff, Mandriva 2010 beta was the closest to a working system | Aug 29 03:03 |
DaemonFC | but kernel 2.6.31-rc 7 won't boot on my system | Aug 29 03:03 |
DaemonFC | I'm thinking it's some kind of conflict with Mandriva's init scripts | Aug 29 03:04 |
DaemonFC | they really need to just give up and use Upstart if they're depending on Fedora to maintain their init scripts that anyway | Aug 29 03:04 |
DaemonFC | cause Fedora 9 was the last version they were maintaining them for and it's end of life now | Aug 29 03:05 |
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DaemonFC | in fact I'm certain it's a bug in Mandriva's init scripts | Aug 29 03:09 |
oiaohm | DaemonFC: as long as pulseaudio still can be uninstalled I will not have a problem. | Aug 29 03:09 |
DaemonFC | because it never even initializes my keyboard, then hangs instead of starting X | Aug 29 03:09 |
oiaohm | X11 version. | Aug 29 03:09 |
oiaohm | Yes 2.6.31 has altered the lower down X11 interfaces. | Aug 29 03:10 |
DaemonFC | oiaohm: I'm developing an intense dislike of Pulseaudio | Aug 29 03:10 |
DaemonFC | for a while, it looked like they may have nearly had it under control | Aug 29 03:10 |
oiaohm | I have had intense dislike since it started. | Aug 29 03:10 |
DaemonFC | and now it's exhibiting all kinds of problems again | Aug 29 03:10 |
oiaohm | Pulseaudio is a return to sound servers. | Aug 29 03:10 |
oiaohm | Something we really did not need. | Aug 29 03:10 |
DaemonFC | Esound didn't fix the damned problem | Aug 29 03:10 |
oiaohm | arts did not either. | Aug 29 03:11 |
DaemonFC | what makes them think writing something even more complicated will? | Aug 29 03:11 |
oiaohm | gstreamer is about the only major up sound system being worked on that I agree with. | Aug 29 03:11 |
DaemonFC | I almost prefer the problems that crop up when you're just using ALSA directly | Aug 29 03:12 |
DaemonFC | at least you know what to expect | Aug 29 03:12 |
oiaohm | Alsa problems are predictiable. | Aug 29 03:12 |
DaemonFC | I dunno, I may try Kubuntu | Aug 29 03:12 |
DaemonFC | are they having any funny ideas about putting Pulseaudio in KDE? | Aug 29 03:12 |
DaemonFC | some distros do that | Aug 29 03:13 |
DaemonFC | I think they're smoking crack | Aug 29 03:13 |
DaemonFC | sound system issues vary depending on how your distribution feels like configuring things, so you get programs like VLC, which can autodetect damned near any capture device on Windows or Mac | Aug 29 03:14 |
DaemonFC | and you're left going down the line in Linux trying /dev/dsp, /dev/dsp1. /dev/audio, /dev/audio1...... | Aug 29 03:15 |
DaemonFC | while in Windows it shows up "Logitech Webcam" "Logitech Webcam Microphone", "AverMedia M780 TV Tuner" | Aug 29 03:15 |
DaemonFC | This "every resource as a file" methodology is a disease, and quite dated | Aug 29 03:16 |
DaemonFC | and sometimes you end up with things like Pulseaudio which don't operate within the established system so that no device you try to capture will work | Aug 29 03:17 |
DaemonFC | because Pulseaudio will be having a continuous lock on the device | Aug 29 03:18 |
DaemonFC | and VLC does not support the way Pulseaudio is redirecting the stream | Aug 29 03:18 |
DaemonFC | oiaohm: I'd really like to find whoever designed Pulseaudio and give them a piece of my mind | Aug 29 03:18 |
DaemonFC | it is some crazy shit | Aug 29 03:18 |
DaemonFC | At least the Windows sound mixer can choose sane defaults, supports hotplugging, and if you *do* have to dictate a device to capture from or send to, it's labeled in English and the devices don't conflict | Aug 29 03:21 |
DaemonFC | and the Windows mixer actually properly supports bypassing it should the need arise | Aug 29 03:21 |
DaemonFC | pasuspend does not always work | Aug 29 03:21 |
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I hope Oracle does not sell Sun's hardware to HP, the same idiots that ruined Alpha ten years ago. | Aug 29 04:25 | |
It figures a company like Amway would have a goofy software patent. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amway#Ditto_Delivery | Aug 29 04:28 | |
oiaohm | every resource as a file. Really applies to windows too DaemonFC | Aug 29 04:56 |
oiaohm | Except MS does every resource as a object | Aug 29 04:57 |
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"Singularity School" promotes business method and software patents in the name of charity. Charity is neither exclusive nor greedy. http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/08/27/BUUQ19EJIL.DTL&type=tech | Aug 29 05:12 | |
-> Lest it all seem pie in the sky, he noted the team members are in the process of incorporating a company and applying for patents. | Aug 29 05:12 | |
ummm, yeah, that's got me convinced. convinced that it's bullshit. | Aug 29 05:13 | |
-> Tuition is $25,000 | Aug 29 05:14 | |
DaemonFC | oiaohm: There's some things about almost any OS that I really like and some that really piss me off and never seem to get fixed | Aug 29 05:35 |
DaemonFC | I'm not really a fanboy so much as practical | Aug 29 05:35 |
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DaemonFC | I use my PC for a little bit of everything, so it never takes me long to find out which parts of an OS don't work well | Aug 29 05:36 |
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DaemonFC | people with one or two use cases will swear by Windows or Linux | Aug 29 05:37 |
DaemonFC | in the area of sound servers and sound mixing, the Linux people really screwed the pooch | Aug 29 05:39 |
DaemonFC | VLC on FreeBSD can figure out what devices are in my system, VLC on Windows and Mac can figure it out too, VLC on Linux becomes fill in the blanks | Aug 29 05:40 |
oiaohm | char device in user space will allow some of the sound redesigned | Aug 29 05:41 |
DaemonFC | I think the real problem in Linux is that there are so many approaches to solve a problem that every distribution figures something like this out for itself | Aug 29 05:42 |
DaemonFC | and they all end up with different bugs | Aug 29 05:42 |
DaemonFC | I really am not huge on ALSA | Aug 29 05:42 |
DaemonFC | OSS can emulate ALSA anyway and it's what every other POSIX system is using | Aug 29 05:44 |
oiaohm | all sound devices are char devices. | Aug 29 05:45 |
DaemonFC | I've never ran into conflicts using OSS | Aug 29 05:45 |
oiaohm | Future will get interesting with cuse allowing char devices to be user space. | Aug 29 05:45 |
DaemonFC | the way I see it, Pulseaudio seems to be a userspace service that is covering up a lot of ALSA shortcomings | Aug 29 05:45 |
DaemonFC | I would just totally ditch ALSA and go back to OSS if it were my call | Aug 29 05:46 |
oiaohm | Pulseaudio is a repeat. | Aug 29 05:46 |
oiaohm | Pulseaudio wants to infect every platform including BSD. | Aug 29 05:46 |
DaemonFC | ALSA is like a bad pancake | Aug 29 05:46 |
DaemonFC | Pulseaudio turns that into a short stack of bad pancakes | Aug 29 05:47 |
oiaohm | ALSA could have done the sound mixing Pulseaudio does. | Aug 29 05:47 |
DaemonFC | and you have people that keep wanting to layer more bad pancakes in the form of Pulseaudio plugins | Aug 29 05:47 |
DaemonFC | it's really mind boggling | Aug 29 05:47 |
oiaohm | Basically we have 2 levels doing the same crap. | Aug 29 05:47 |
oiaohm | Ie alsa and Pulseaudio | Aug 29 05:47 |
oiaohm | So you have conflit hell. | Aug 29 05:47 |
DaemonFC | I'm pretty sure OSS does that already | Aug 29 05:47 |
DaemonFC | so why replace OSS when they did it right there the first time? | Aug 29 05:48 |
oiaohm | OSS and ALSA are both direct hardware layers. | Aug 29 05:48 |
oiaohm | ALSA has real-time audio support. | Aug 29 05:48 |
oiaohm | Something OSS lacked when ALSA was designed. | Aug 29 05:48 |
DaemonFC | so isntead of helping to fix OSS, they just built ALSA from scratch independently? | Aug 29 05:49 |
DaemonFC | sounds like a pretty backwards way to solve a problem | Aug 29 05:49 |
oiaohm | OSS still cannot do short window real-time. | Aug 29 05:49 |
oiaohm | Its a api issue. | Aug 29 05:49 |
DaemonFC | cause FreeBSD seems to be humming right along | Aug 29 05:49 |
DaemonFC | while Linux/ALSA gives you a dozen different problems | Aug 29 05:49 |
oiaohm | Lot of ALSA problems have come from stacking. | Aug 29 05:50 |
DaemonFC | ideally I would think that they should put a mixer right into ALSA | Aug 29 05:50 |
oiaohm | Jack and Pulse trying to pretend to be ALSA devices. | Aug 29 05:50 |
oiaohm | There is a mixer in ALSA | Aug 29 05:51 |
DaemonFC | and forget about all this fancy stream redirecting crap | Aug 29 05:51 |
oiaohm | dmix | Aug 29 05:51 |
oiaohm | ALSA can do fancy stream redirecting crap. | Aug 29 05:51 |
oiaohm | Only feature pulse has that alsa does not is per application sound. | Aug 29 05:51 |
oiaohm | Only reason AlSA does not have that is no one has bothered updating alsa mixer. | Aug 29 05:51 |
DaemonFC | that's built right into the Windows Mixer | Aug 29 05:51 |
DaemonFC | I guess I don't see the point in duplicated effort | Aug 29 05:53 |
DaemonFC | Linux developers must go buy a new car every time someone door dings the one they have | Aug 29 05:53 |
DaemonFC | that seems to be the kind of thinking behind their sound system work | Aug 29 05:53 |
DaemonFC | really the only reason I was trying to get VLC to stream is because Flash is pretty much shot on Linux | Aug 29 05:55 |
DaemonFC | it's good enough for Youtube-like sites and that's about it, someone at Justin.tv developed a program that could stream to their service in conjunction with VLC | Aug 29 05:55 |
DaemonFC | tells you what they think about the prospects of Flash improving | Aug 29 05:56 |
oiaohm | pulseaudio is not just targeted at Linux. | Aug 29 05:57 |
oiaohm | Some of the pulseaudio guys were trying to work out how to embed into windows. | Aug 29 05:58 |
DaemonFC | to hell with that | Aug 29 05:58 |
DaemonFC | thank god they can't slap that shit into Windows too | Aug 29 05:59 |
oiaohm | The proto type redirect windows sound into pulseaudio | Aug 29 05:59 |
oiaohm | So stuffing windows the same way as linux. | Aug 29 05:59 |
DaemonFC | and the people over at FreeBSD haven't lost their damned minds either | Aug 29 05:59 |
oiaohm | Sound server guys threw history think sound servers are the cure. | Aug 29 05:59 |
oiaohm | For all sound problems. | Aug 29 05:59 |
DaemonFC | oiaohm: The one in Windows seems to work alright | Aug 29 06:00 |
DaemonFC | I don't get glitching, cut outs, or conflicts | Aug 29 06:00 |
oiaohm | Windows has a kernel level real-time mode that audio uses to avoid glitching. | Aug 29 06:00 |
oiaohm | Real-time branch required to be merged before a sound server stood a chance of working. | Aug 29 06:01 |
DaemonFC | well, Linux has too many problems when you use the full set of real time patches | Aug 29 06:01 |
oiaohm | The full set still has some hacks. | Aug 29 06:02 |
DaemonFC | and Torvalds seems to like to scare away the few people that even bother to work out the mangled spaghetti code that depends on kernel locking | Aug 29 06:02 |
oiaohm | for real-time to merge everythign has to be correctly implemented. | Aug 29 06:02 |
oiaohm | Each Linux kernel has less kernel locking. | Aug 29 06:02 |
oiaohm | Locking issues have to be cured step by step. | Aug 29 06:03 |
oiaohm | If you had been following Linux kernel development you would know the spaghetti of locks is disappearing. | Aug 29 06:04 |
DaemonFC | yeah, a lot of these problems have been caused by code that made sense 10 years ago when it was trying to solve a different set of problems, is how it seems | Aug 29 06:04 |
oiaohm | No | Aug 29 06:04 |
oiaohm | The locking problems was caused by people not understanding what they were using when coding drivers. | Aug 29 06:04 |
oiaohm | Issue is when it wrong is very hard to fix and keep the house of cards standing. | Aug 29 06:05 |
DaemonFC | I laughed my ass off when SCO submitted a few files they accused Torvalds of stealing | Aug 29 06:05 |
DaemonFC | and his rebuttal | Aug 29 06:05 |
oiaohm | The locking issue never really made sence. | Aug 29 06:06 |
oiaohm | 1 lock for everything system wide. | Aug 29 06:06 |
oiaohm | Is kinda insane. | Aug 29 06:06 |
DaemonFC | it was to the effect of " this file is the obvious implementation.....and that file is so bad I'm almost ashamed to have written it way back then" | Aug 29 06:06 |
oiaohm | Yep headaches come for rushed code development at times. | Aug 29 06:07 |
DaemonFC | I ran across an article that says that SCO is going back to court because on appeal, the court found that Novell doesn't own the rights to UNIX | Aug 29 06:08 |
oiaohm | ie that will do for now answer. | Aug 29 06:08 |
DaemonFC | is this ever going to end? | Aug 29 06:08 |
DaemonFC | SCO stock tripled after the ruling, though it's still only at like 25 cents a share | Aug 29 06:08 |
oiaohm | Issue court ruling still can say neither does SCO. | Aug 29 06:08 |
oiaohm | The owner could be the opengroup. | Aug 29 06:08 |
DaemonFC | back when it was at 6 cents I was telling people that we should all chip in and buy SCO | Aug 29 06:09 |
DaemonFC | release anything they may really have to the public domain and dissolve the company | Aug 29 06:09 |
oiaohm | And who is the opengroup. | Aug 29 06:09 |
oiaohm | The group formed from the case over bsd copyright novel lost. | Aug 29 06:10 |
DaemonFC | this is too funny | Aug 29 06:10 |
DaemonFC | it's like it's been sold to so many people that nobody even knows who really owns it | Aug 29 06:10 |
oiaohm | Issue is bsd court case. | Aug 29 06:11 |
oiaohm | bsd vs novell case. | Aug 29 06:11 |
DaemonFC | it probably is the open group that owns it | Aug 29 06:11 |
DaemonFC | I would hope so, because it's better than SCO or Novell | Aug 29 06:12 |
oiaohm | It was not sold there but the ruling impless opengroup owns it as settlement. | Aug 29 06:12 |
oiaohm | If that is the case SCO will try creating a fraud case against Novell to save self. | Aug 29 06:13 |
oiaohm | End result could be SCO and Novell by by. | Aug 29 06:13 |
DaemonFC | if it was Novell, there wouldn't be anything stopping them from "claiming" the sole right to distribute Linux and filing lawsuits | Aug 29 06:13 |
DaemonFC | I wouldn't put it past them if they thought they could do it | Aug 29 06:13 |
DaemonFC | SCO obviously thought that they could go to court and convince some idiot judge that they owned the rights to Linux | Aug 29 06:14 |
DaemonFC | they were obviously in financial trouble and trying to rough people up for "patent licenses" on something they didn't actually own was probably the only way to get any money coming in | Aug 29 06:17 |
DaemonFC | Unixware and OpenLinux actually weren't bad, for their time | Aug 29 06:18 |
DaemonFC | the releases of Unixware now are just to keep things like Apache and Firefox current | Aug 29 06:18 |
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DaemonFC | oiaohm: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090304032134127 | Aug 29 06:23 |
DaemonFC | I found that interesting | Aug 29 06:23 |
oiaohm | Same thing is found inside solarias and freebsd DaemonFC | Aug 29 06:47 |
DaemonFC | yeah, but they don't use Linux kernel code in the FreeBSD Linuxulator | Aug 29 06:54 |
DaemonFC | Solaris just lets you install a miniature RHEL | Aug 29 06:55 |
DaemonFC | CentOS works too | Aug 29 06:55 |
oiaohm | I have had debian on a Solaris before. | Aug 29 06:55 |
oiaohm | It will be nice once cgroup are complete enough that Linux can copy the solarias way for running solarias and bsd. | Aug 29 06:56 |
oiaohm | vga arbitor for Linux appears to be on line for 2.6.32 | Aug 29 07:07 |
zoobab01 | :win - | Aug 29 08:08 |
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Diablo-D3 | http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/09/08/28/180244/Oracle-To-Sell-Suns-Hardware-Business-To-HP?from=rss | Aug 29 08:39 |
oiaohm | Orcale normally does not hide what they are interested in doing. | Aug 29 08:42 |
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oiaohm | http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=3799 << Another MS profit line bites the dust | Aug 29 09:20 |
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schestowitz | Hey | Aug 29 09:44 |
oiaohm | Hi schestowitz | Aug 29 09:45 |
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schestowitz | Hey, oiaohm | Aug 29 10:45 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Patents Roundup: Tuxera Came to Microsoft, TiVo Misbehaves, Updates on Facebook and Amazon http://ping.fm/HFtQT | Aug 29 10:45 | |
oiaohm | Tax to use file system is annoying. | Aug 29 10:48 |
ziggyfish | testing out Windows 7 (according to the system monitor, it's 100.5 percent idling ) | Aug 29 11:12 |
Diablo-D3 | lol | Aug 29 11:12 |
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ziggyfish | I love how after 20 years of windows, they still have autoexec.bat (has been in Microsoft | Aug 29 11:21 |
ziggyfish | *'s OS's since DOS) | Aug 29 11:21 |
oiaohm | Its not functaion part of boot process ziggyfish | Aug 29 11:22 |
ziggyfish | and config.sys | Aug 29 11:22 |
oiaohm | Left overs for application compad. | Aug 29 11:23 |
ziggyfish | AFAIK DOS applications can't run in Windows XP let alone Windows 7, although can run though thirdparty emulation | Aug 29 11:25 |
oiaohm | Particular windows applications have dos installers. | Aug 29 11:26 |
oiaohm | That do work on XP ziggyfish | Aug 29 11:26 |
ziggyfish | true | Aug 29 11:26 |
oiaohm | Windows 7 I have not tested it for dos compadiblity. Mostly moved to emulated xp. | Aug 29 11:27 |
Diablo-D3 | ziggyfish: dos applications can "run" in xp | Aug 29 11:28 |
Diablo-D3 | just not in the way you're hoping | Aug 29 11:29 |
Diablo-D3 | oiaohm: btw, you may be thinking of cli win32 exes, they're not the same thing | Aug 29 11:29 |
oiaohm | I am not thinking of cli win32 | Aug 29 11:30 |
oiaohm | Some old games have warped installers Diablo-D3 | Aug 29 11:30 |
Diablo-D3 | some old games dont work on XP :< | Aug 29 11:31 |
Diablo-D3 | actually, a lot of old games dont :< | Aug 29 11:31 |
oiaohm | There are some that still do. | Aug 29 11:31 |
oiaohm | and some of them have dos installers. | Aug 29 11:32 |
ziggyfish | just find it interesting that there is still does elements in Windows 20 Years later | Aug 29 11:32 |
oiaohm | I know from doing support with wine and having people complain they would not install under wine due to its dos layer being too poor. | Aug 29 11:32 |
oiaohm | Things don't change fast. | Aug 29 11:33 |
ziggyfish | true. but AFAIK, NT was not meant to be dos based. But their is still elements of dos in the NT kernel. | Aug 29 11:35 |
oiaohm | dos emulation. | Aug 29 11:35 |
oiaohm | Not that great of dos emulation. | Aug 29 11:36 |
Diablo-D3 | oiaohm: wine should just start swiping dosemu code or something | Aug 29 11:48 |
oiaohm | Codebase not compadible Diablo-D3 | Aug 29 11:48 |
oiaohm | windows dos applications have to do windows calls at times to work correctly | Aug 29 11:49 |
Diablo-D3 | fff wtf | Aug 29 11:49 |
oiaohm | lfn dosemu has. | Aug 29 11:49 |
oiaohm | But there are a few other windows only int calls. | Aug 29 11:49 |
oiaohm | http://www.itnews.com.au/News/154129,crime-expert-backs-calls-for-licence-to-compute.aspx << Ok don't know if this is good or bad. | Aug 29 11:50 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft and Its Followers Compare Free Software to Terrorism http://ping.fm/7g5RV | Aug 29 11:50 | |
schestowitz | <oiaohm> Tax to use file system is annoying. | Aug 29 11:51 |
schestowitz | Indeed | Aug 29 11:51 |
schestowitz | Many people don't understand why | Aug 29 11:51 |
schestowitz | Explain to them that when someone give them a USB key, then they can't open the file | Aug 29 11:52 |
schestowitz | They need to go to Microsoft and buy software/software patents | Aug 29 11:52 |
schestowitz | SD card fora shot themselves in the foot | Aug 29 11:52 |
schestowitz | Letting Microsoft collect money from hardware that's sold | Aug 29 11:52 |
schestowitz | Same for many devices that use FAT and maybe NTFS. | Aug 29 11:52 |
schestowitz | Time to bury those FSs | Aug 29 11:52 |
oiaohm | There is not that much patent life left in NTFS. | Aug 29 11:53 |
schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/08/29/comparing-free-software-to-evil/ | Aug 29 11:53 |
schestowitz | Read the above. | Aug 29 11:53 |
schestowitz | I had paid Microsoft employees ("TEs" or in plain terms "AstroTurfers") writing smears about me where they try to make a comparison between me and Unabomber. | Aug 29 11:53 |
oiaohm | exfat the new one MS wants to make money from. | Aug 29 11:53 |
schestowitz | Shame on them | Aug 29 11:53 |
schestowitz | WHo can handle such patent abuse | Aug 29 11:53 |
schestowitz | Microsoft has a lot of propaganda going for RAND | Aug 29 11:53 |
schestowitz | Even in Europe | Aug 29 11:53 |
schestowitz | IDC and BSA helps them with this propaganda | Aug 29 11:54 |
oiaohm | As long as windows is a dominate OS we will have problems. | Aug 29 11:54 |
oiaohm | When windows ceases to be a dominate OS world will change. | Aug 29 11:54 |
schestowitz | How to delete flash tracking cookies on Linux < http://blog.fnmueller.de/2009/08/27/how-to-delete-flash-tracking-cookies-on-linux/ > | Aug 29 12:00 |
schestowitz | oiaohm: sure, help the cause. We need a free market | Aug 29 12:02 |
schestowitz | http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/08/28/bing-commercials-infringe-on-patent | Aug 29 12:04 |
schestowitz | Real-Time Search Engine Attracts $7 Million Funding < http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/08/28/real-time-search-engine-attracts-7-million-funding > | Aug 29 12:05 |
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MinceR | schestowitz: pong :) | Aug 29 12:27 |
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oiaohm | http://antibody.sourceforge.net/ Just when I think i have seen all the open source anti-virus engines out there I find another one. | Aug 29 13:00 |
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schestowitz | Antibiotics for Windows... ask at your pharmacist now.. | Aug 29 13:12 |
MinceR | "I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure." | Aug 29 13:15 |
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Diablo-D3 | schestowitz: the really funny part is we could use UDF for SD cards | Aug 29 13:32 |
schestowitz | brb | Aug 29 13:33 |
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**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Aug 29 13:35:54 2009 | ||
*Now talking on #boycottnovell | Aug 29 13:35 | |
*Topic for #boycottnovell is: Communication about anything, including Microsoft, Novell, and Free software [publicly logged] | Aug 29 13:35 | |
*Topic for #boycottnovell set by schestowitz at Fri Jun 12 18:24:05 2009 | Aug 29 13:35 | |
-ChanServ-[#boycottnovell] Welcome to the #boycottnovell channel | Aug 29 13:35 | |
*#boycottnovell :[freenode-info] why register and identify? your IRC nick is how people know you. http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup | Aug 29 13:35 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] /me is going to get his hair cut | Aug 29 13:36 | |
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oiaohm | http://www.opensourc3.org/ just another site travelled on an channel to silent. | Aug 29 14:14 |
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schestowitz | what do you mean? | Aug 29 14:15 |
oiaohm | 2 hours and nothing was talked about. | Aug 29 14:16 |
oiaohm | Ok I just stuffed my english up bad sorry schestowitz. | Aug 29 14:17 |
oiaohm | Line should have gone : http://www.opensourc3.org/ just another site I found. And this channel is being silent so I felt like making some noise. | Aug 29 14:18 |
schestowitz | I like the music in this video: http://schestowitz.com/Weblog/archives/2009/08/28/true-talent/ | Aug 29 14:24 |
schestowitz | oiaohm: I'm almost done with SUSE news | Aug 29 14:24 |
schestowitz | One last post.. | Aug 29 14:25 |
schestowitz | Novell and Microsoft are dormant | Aug 29 14:25 |
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Xarver | Does anyone like my banner? :P http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/5614/openh.png | Aug 29 14:35 |
MinceR | white on pale yellow? not particularly readable :> | Aug 29 14:35 |
Xarver | that's not yellow o.o | Aug 29 14:36 |
MinceR | what is it, then? | Aug 29 14:36 |
Xarver | that's gray | Aug 29 14:36 |
Xarver | unless your comp is messed up | Aug 29 14:36 |
MinceR | doesn't look gray at all in iceweasel 3.0.6 | Aug 29 14:36 |
Xarver | o.o | Aug 29 14:36 |
MinceR | konqueror thinks it's light gray | Aug 29 14:36 |
MinceR | still not quite readable :) | Aug 29 14:36 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 29 14:36 |
MinceR | oh, wait | Aug 29 14:37 |
MinceR | my display is bad | Aug 29 14:37 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 29 14:37 |
MinceR | iceweasel shows it as gray on the laptop's panel | Aug 29 14:37 |
MinceR | and pale yellow on the external panel | Aug 29 14:37 |
Xarver | well do you at least like the text? | Aug 29 14:37 |
MinceR | it isn't bad | Aug 29 14:37 |
Xarver | I was thinking of the border darker | Aug 29 14:37 |
oiaohm | What are you going for the impossable to read on slightly dirty screens Xarver | Aug 29 14:37 |
MinceR | though i prefer "Free Software" :> | Aug 29 14:37 |
oiaohm | My LCD is over due for a clean. | Aug 29 14:38 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 29 14:38 |
Xarver | Then clean it | Aug 29 14:38 |
Xarver | >.> | Aug 29 14:38 |
MinceR | mine are clean, but they're calibrated slightly differently by default, i guess | Aug 29 14:38 |
oiaohm | Contrast is that close with the dirt is only just readable. | Aug 29 14:38 |
Xarver | I'm going to make the border darker, it'll look better, hold on | Aug 29 14:38 |
MinceR | and color correction can't be setup per display :) | Aug 29 14:39 |
oiaohm | When I say over due for a clean its over due got this screen 3 years ago and it has not been cleaned once. | Aug 29 14:40 |
ThistleWeb | dust won't earn money like regular antiques you know, antique dealers have to handle stuff to evaluate it, which is where your dust investment disappears on the tip of a finger. Although, 3 years is quite impressive if it could be carbon dated | Aug 29 14:41 |
oiaohm | I am kinda seeing what comes first. | Aug 29 14:43 |
ThistleWeb | unless it's proven to have dead hair follicles from some celeb who once looked over your shoulder and shook their head. You could sell it to fans who could use it to clone their lost hero | Aug 29 14:43 |
oiaohm | Screen getting dirty enough that I have to clean it. | Aug 29 14:43 |
oiaohm | Or the screen dies first. | Aug 29 14:43 |
oiaohm | So removing my need to clean it. | Aug 29 14:43 |
Xarver | How about this oiaohm, ThistleWeb, MinceR? http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/8564/openk.png | Aug 29 14:50 |
MinceR | it's readable | Aug 29 14:50 |
MinceR | that's a great improvement ;) | Aug 29 14:50 |
Xarver | Like it? :3 | Aug 29 14:50 |
MinceR | it's difficult to tell on its own | Aug 29 14:51 |
MinceR | is it intended to be part of a webpage? | Aug 29 14:51 |
Xarver | it could be | Aug 29 14:51 |
Xarver | I'm sharpening up my skills with GIMP | Aug 29 14:51 |
ThistleWeb | that's what I was gonna say, on it's own it's non-descript | Aug 29 14:51 |
ThistleWeb | Xarver: you tried the tutorial screencasts? | Aug 29 14:51 |
Xarver | no | Aug 29 14:52 |
Xarver | but I've seen some | Aug 29 14:52 |
ThistleWeb | I get "meet the gimp" and "screencasters" | Aug 29 14:52 |
oiaohm | I would have to see it use to site but as a single item it is nice Xarver | Aug 29 14:52 |
ThistleWeb | meet the gimp is onto like ep 114 now I think | Aug 29 14:52 |
Xarver | I made this with no tutorial guide ^.^ | Aug 29 14:52 |
ThistleWeb | each episode is a tutorial screencast | Aug 29 14:52 |
Xarver | Ah | Aug 29 14:53 |
ThistleWeb | on the gimp | Aug 29 14:53 |
ThistleWeb | screencasters is the same idea, but on inkscape | Aug 29 14:53 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 29 14:53 |
ThistleWeb | it's on like ep 95 now | Aug 29 14:53 |
Xarver | do you know how to create the wavy things in the background | Aug 29 14:53 |
ThistleWeb | all free, with a podcast / rss agregator | Aug 29 14:53 |
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ThistleWeb | meetthegimp.org | Aug 29 14:54 |
ThistleWeb | screencasters.heathenx.org | Aug 29 14:54 |
Xarver | ThistleWeb: http://www.microsoft.com/windows/Framework/images/header_bkg_wol.jpg | Aug 29 14:55 |
ThistleWeb | meet the gimp is done by a german teacher in his spare time who speaks very good english | Aug 29 14:55 |
Xarver | cool | Aug 29 14:55 |
Xarver | that's kind of what I want, but without the microsoft. I was just trying to find an example | Aug 29 14:55 |
ThistleWeb | for creating stuff from scratch, inkscape may be better suited | Aug 29 14:55 |
ThistleWeb | gimp is more for editing photos | Aug 29 14:55 |
Xarver | not really | Aug 29 14:56 |
Xarver | inkscape is vector | Aug 29 14:56 |
ThistleWeb | correct | Aug 29 14:57 |
ThistleWeb | gimp is raster | Aug 29 14:57 |
Xarver | yes. | Aug 29 14:57 |
ThistleWeb | if you're working with existing photos to manipulate and change them, gimp is better suited | Aug 29 14:58 |
ThistleWeb | if your creating something from scratch, specially if it's a logo, inkscape is the better bet | Aug 29 14:58 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 29 14:59 |
ThistleWeb | but the choice is yours, if you prefer one tool over the other, that's cool | Aug 29 14:59 |
ThistleWeb | inkscape can work well with photos' too | Aug 29 15:00 |
ThistleWeb | that's just a sorta "extra" function, rather than a main feature though | Aug 29 15:00 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] back :D | Aug 29 15:00 | |
ThistleWeb | if I was trying to get something like that MS image, I'd explore inkscape | Aug 29 15:01 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 29 15:01 |
ThistleWeb | chances are it'll be much easier, more flexable and get better results than anything else | Aug 29 15:01 |
ThistleWeb | same with the open source logo you showed us | Aug 29 15:02 |
ThistleWeb | vector works wonders for scaling too | Aug 29 15:02 |
ThistleWeb | where you can take it from a tiny few pixels right up to billboard size and it's still cyrstal clear, no pixelation | Aug 29 15:03 |
Xarver | true | Aug 29 15:04 |
ThistleWeb | I've only started playing with inkscape for stuff for my blog | Aug 29 15:05 |
Xarver | ThistleWeb: I actually meant how windows vista for example (BLEH) has those kind of backgrounds | Aug 29 15:06 |
Xarver | the wavy thing | Aug 29 15:06 |
ThistleWeb | there are plenty of pattern sites you could look though | Aug 29 15:06 |
ThistleWeb | get something close, then modify it | Aug 29 15:06 |
Xarver | ok | Aug 29 15:06 |
ThistleWeb | obviously watch for lincencing conditions | Aug 29 15:07 |
ThistleWeb | look for CC stuff | Aug 29 15:07 |
Xarver | Fatal error: Call to undefined function moved_topic() in /home/gimptalk/public_html/forum/viewtopic_seo.php on line 72 | Aug 29 15:08 |
Xarver | :( | Aug 29 15:08 |
ThistleWeb | http://thistleweb.wordpress.com/files/2009/08/novel-vs-movie.jpg <<my only attemtp so far to play with inkscape | Aug 29 15:09 |
ThistleWeb | I just put it up now | Aug 29 15:09 |
Xarver | it's Novell :) | Aug 29 15:09 |
ThistleWeb | theres no blog posts yet, I'm still planning stuff out | Aug 29 15:09 |
ThistleWeb | lol | Aug 29 15:09 |
ThistleWeb | I have a whole series about storytelling, and a whole subseries planned for the difference in the mediums | Aug 29 15:10 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 29 15:10 |
ThistleWeb | that was inkscape with one wallpaper image | Aug 29 15:10 |
ThistleWeb | a few layers | Aug 29 15:11 |
ThistleWeb | and a few gradients | Aug 29 15:12 |
MinceR | if the kind of pattern you're looking for is popular enough, you might even find a tutorial that explains how to do it :) | Aug 29 15:12 |
ThistleWeb | yeah, there are plenty of tutorials on gimp, inkscape etc and millions on photoshop which can easily be adapted | Aug 29 15:13 |
ThistleWeb | those types of waves are a dime-a-dozen on default wallpapers in some distros | Aug 29 15:13 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 29 15:15 |
ThistleWeb | I've gotten to the point where I hardly notice the default wallpapers these days, it's always the first thing to be changed to an image of my own | Aug 29 15:16 |
ThistleWeb | Xarver: have you installed grokingthegimp? | Aug 29 15:16 |
Xarver | no | Aug 29 15:16 |
ThistleWeb | it's a full gimp guide available in most repos | Aug 29 15:16 |
ThistleWeb | an html manual | Aug 29 15:17 |
Xarver | oh | Aug 29 15:17 |
ThistleWeb | it's also free online in either html and pdf form (I think) | Aug 29 15:17 |
schestowitz | TSMC lands Fujitsu deal < http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1531844/tsmc-lands-fujitsu-deal > | Aug 29 15:19 |
Xarver | I want to make this :3 http://s3.envato.com/files/154032.jpg | Aug 29 15:19 |
Xarver | http://www.inspiredm.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/lighteffect.jpg | Aug 29 15:20 |
MinceR | random noise+a layer with a lightness transition+motion blur+a brush that puts random discs and at the end +a layer with a color transition? :) | Aug 29 15:22 |
schestowitz | Disproportional punishment IMHO. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/28/accused_tjx_hacker_accepts_plea/ (Accused TJX hacker faces 15 to 20) | Aug 29 15:22 |
MinceR | perhaps even some non-motion blur to the noise before motion blur | Aug 29 15:22 |
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MinceR | oh, and also the noise would need to be magnified first, i guess | Aug 29 15:23 |
sinograms, perhaps http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&safe=off&q=sinogram&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=lTuZSvPtFImmsgOp1bG4Ag&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=4 | Aug 29 15:24 | |
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MinceR | there are some interesting sinograms there | Aug 29 15:26 |
MinceR | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radon_transform | Aug 29 15:26 |
except for 2nd hand promotion, apple and google bashing and slimy government and oem manipulation, there's not much out of them -> schestowitz: Novell and Microsoft are dormant | Aug 29 15:27 | |
schestowitz | There's anti-Google now | Aug 29 15:27 |
schestowitz | Needs a post soon | Aug 29 15:27 |
schestowitz | But other sites beat many to it... though it's the same thing BN has been showing for months.. | Aug 29 15:28 |
schestowitz | LawMedia scum | Aug 29 15:28 |
schestowitz | HTML defeatism: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/28/html_5_dream/ | Aug 29 15:29 |
one vet says "wipe and reload" the other says "buy a new computer" what should I do? -> schestowitz: Antibiotics for Windows... ask at your pharmacist now. | Aug 29 15:30 | |
You have been way out in front of "traditional" media, Roy. | Aug 29 15:31 | |
the doctor says, "get gnu/linux" | Aug 29 15:31 | |
schestowitz | Venezuela to ban violent videogames? < http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/08/28/venezuela_videogames/ > | Aug 29 15:35 |
You say, "many Free software supporters are atheists," but this is a bad idea. Faith and freedom are complementary and people have been made to fear for both. | Aug 29 15:47 | |
Cold war rhetoric has Communists as godless idolaters who misplaced their faith in the state's and it's dishonest promises of equality and material wealth. People were taught that Communists would take away their religious freedom, and generally they did. | Aug 29 15:47 | |
The pattern of thought is still strong enough that people are afraid of atheists, without understanding they hypocritically infringe on the atheists right to believe what they wish. | Aug 29 15:48 | |
When M$ smears free software as "Communism," they pull all of that cold war propaganda in with them. | Aug 29 15:50 | |
Of course, it's silly. Non free software is the centrally controlled, privacy and freedom violating monstrosity that Soviet planners may have dreamed of. | Aug 29 15:51 | |
Free Software represents free press, individual self help and a real free market. | Aug 29 15:52 | |
schestowitz | I was mostly responding to the use of the word "religious" | Aug 29 15:53 |
schestowitz | Microsoft compares FOSS to a religious cult, esp. extreme ones | Aug 29 15:53 |
Your previous articles that shows how cult like M$ is are better responses. | Aug 29 15:54 | |
M$ employees are immoral and blindly dedicated to their company. | Aug 29 15:55 | |
religious terms, like "jihad" and "evangelism" are regularly used in their emails and literature | Aug 29 15:55 | |
schestowitz | Atheism BTW is only frowned upon in the US (among the western world) | Aug 29 15:55 |
schestowitz | About 44% in the UK are atheists/gnostic | Aug 29 15:56 |
schestowitz | And the UK is still one of the /most/ religious | Aug 29 15:56 |
schestowitz | COmpre that to Sweden where it's like 88% | Aug 29 15:56 |
schestowitz | In the US more like 10% | Aug 29 15:56 |
Well, the US and the UK represent a tiny minority of the world's population. | Aug 29 15:56 | |
schestowitz | So it depends on whose propaganda is chosen | Aug 29 15:56 |
You don't need to go there. | Aug 29 15:57 | |
schestowitz | OK, but I should not avoid it, either | Aug 29 15:57 |
If it's counter productive anywhere and you can get better results directly, as you have in the past, it's better to be direct. | Aug 29 15:57 | |
schestowitz | Linux and GNU are science | Aug 29 15:57 |
schestowitz | It's truth versus delusion | Aug 29 15:58 |
schestowitz | So I'd rather promote the idea of engineering versus superstition, such as thew evangelical company, Microsoft | Aug 29 15:58 |
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M$ will pretend to represent science too. | Aug 29 15:58 | |
schestowitz | "Vendor recommends Windows" = "God created the Earth in seven days" | Aug 29 15:59 |
but they will also pretend to give people freedom of faith | Aug 29 15:59 | |
it is foolish to insult people when you don't have to. | Aug 29 15:59 | |
"Vendor recommends Windows" is a dishonest thing. You have shown directly how it's a lie and the reasons vendors do it. | Aug 29 16:00 | |
schestowitz | twitter: no, s/science/Scientology/ | Aug 29 16:01 |
Xarver | schestowitz: no need to put religion in this. | Aug 29 16:01 |
Xarver | Saying science is linux and windows is religion shouldn't be nessicary. | Aug 29 16:02 |
right and it's evil of M$ to use religion in their promotion. | Aug 29 16:02 | |
Xarver | It doesn't mean Linux is science. >.> | Aug 29 16:03 |
cubezzz | if Microsoft represents religion then it's satanism :) | Aug 29 16:03 |
GNU/Linux is science. It is repeatable and provable. | Aug 29 16:03 | |
Xarver | cubezzz: Agreed. | Aug 29 16:03 |
Xarver | twitter: No need to put religion in this. People don't only believe in science here. | Aug 29 16:03 |
schestowitz | But it represent attitude to applied ideas | Aug 29 16:04 |
neighborlee | cubezzz, no id say its more a right wing conservative agenda, instead of compassionate liberalism ;) | Aug 29 16:04 |
schestowitz | Microsoft's approach goes somehting like this: | Aug 29 16:04 |
Keeping religion out is precisely my purpose. | Aug 29 16:04 | |
schestowitz | Build up followers (ecosystem) | Aug 29 16:04 |
schestowitz | Buy some products | Aug 29 16:04 |
schestowitz | SPread "evangelists" to market it | Aug 29 16:04 |
schestowitz | If it breaks, increase evangelism | Aug 29 16:04 |
schestowitz | Attack critics | Aug 29 16:05 |
Xarver | Yes, but it's annoying how you are relating it to it, as I am you know, religious. | Aug 29 16:05 |
schestowitz | That's not science | Aug 29 16:05 |
Eruaran | GNU/Linux did not start with 'science', it started with a conviction that software should be free just as mathematics is free. | Aug 29 16:05 |
schestowitz | In science there's peer review and respect for idea based on EVIDENCE | Aug 29 16:05 |
schestowitz | Microsoft hates evidence | Aug 29 16:05 |
Xarver | *sigh* | Aug 29 16:05 |
schestowitz | See their EULA | Aug 29 16:05 |
schestowitz | They forbif benchmarks!! | Aug 29 16:05 |
schestowitz | *forbid | Aug 29 16:05 |
schestowitz | That's not a company that's interested in engineering. | Aug 29 16:05 |
Windows and non free software is a centrally controlled mess. | Aug 29 16:05 | |
schestowitz | Just fancy shmancy bribes of Vista 7 to part of their cult | Aug 29 16:06 |
Xarver | Still, religion is a heavy topic and relating to it will start an argument. ._. | Aug 29 16:06 |
schestowitz | People like Fried and McRacken | Aug 29 16:06 |
Eruaran | And when they spout on about how secure Windows is, I shall reply, "and I believe nicotine is not addictive". | Aug 29 16:06 |
Oh yeah, that's slide #2 or so. "It's not about the technology" the customer, etc, "It's about Microsoft" | Aug 29 16:06 | |
schestowitz | Xarver: agreed | Aug 29 16:06 |
schestowitz | But here's the thing | Aug 29 16:06 |
schestowitz | It's not us who say Microsoft is a religion | Aug 29 16:07 |
schestowitz | It's Microsoft that calls FOSS a "cult" | Aug 29 16:07 |
Xarver | ? | Aug 29 16:07 |
schestowitz | So we dismiss the allegations by showing hypocrisy | Aug 29 16:07 |
ThistleWeb | schestowitz: I'm sure that's a typo, I don't think they meant "cuLt" | Aug 29 16:07 |
ThistleWeb | methinks there maybe an "n" in there somewhere | Aug 29 16:08 |
Xarver | :P | Aug 29 16:08 |
*Xarver was just thinking that... | Aug 29 16:08 | |
M$ routinely calls free software advocates, "zealots" "fundamentalists" and other things. | Aug 29 16:08 | |
Xarver | :O | Aug 29 16:08 |
*Omar87 has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) | Aug 29 16:08 | |
schestowitz | ThistleWeb: yes, culn | Aug 29 16:08 |
This shows their hatred of faith. | Aug 29 16:08 | |
ThistleWeb | lol | Aug 29 16:08 |
cubezzz | Microsoft are the biggest zealots by far | Aug 29 16:09 |
cubezzz | ever see Ballmer on stage? | Aug 29 16:09 |
Eruaran | I wonder what will happen to Zimbra now | Aug 29 16:09 |
M$ employees compromise their morals. | Aug 29 16:09 | |
cubezzz | it's scary :) | Aug 29 16:09 |
They harm their neighbors for the benefit of their company. | Aug 29 16:09 | |
ThistleWeb | Eruaran: that occurred to me too with MS cosying up to Yahoo | Aug 29 16:10 |
schestowitz | 12 Words You Can Never Say in the Office < http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=8408354 > | Aug 29 16:10 |
Cunt on the list? | Aug 29 16:10 | |
ThistleWeb | MS won't like the idea of competition to Exchange, one of their key lockin products | Aug 29 16:10 |
ThistleWeb | cunt is one of the stronger swear words which usually causes offense | Aug 29 16:11 |
ThistleWeb | even in a liberal workplace, it's one of the no-no words | Aug 29 16:11 |
cubezzz | some of my friends use Microsoft and I'm quoting here "...so I can have a job" | Aug 29 16:11 |
schestowitz | twitter: don't know. Saw it in the news a minute ago | Aug 29 16:11 |
schestowitz | Yahoo was supposed to be with Google | Aug 29 16:11 |
Eruaran | They may destroy Zimbra and they may destroy VMware, but their focus on companies betrays their weakness. They can take out a few companies, but they cannot stem the rising tide. | Aug 29 16:11 |
schestowitz | People forgot that | Aug 29 16:11 |
schestowitz | But Microsoft and LawMedia (and other corrupt people) shot it down | Aug 29 16:11 |
schestowitz | It's not federal crime to do this | Aug 29 16:12 |
schestowitz | Apparently that's just how DC is run | Aug 29 16:12 |
schestowitz | Microsoft's secret 'screw Google' meetings in D.C. http://www.dailyfinance.com/2009/08/28/microsofts-secret-screw-google-meetings-in-d-c/ | Aug 29 16:12 |
ThistleWeb | I dunno what the yahoo licence allows or does not allow, so I don't know how easily Zimbra could fork if it was knifed by the yahoo / MS deal | Aug 29 16:12 |
schestowitz | Goog The Underdog? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/stanley-bing/goog-the-underdog_b_271379.html | Aug 29 16:12 |
Eruaran | As their power wanes, so the vultures will gather. | Aug 29 16:12 |
schestowitz | Bing Double Cashback Promotion Discontinued http://news.softpedia.com/news/Bing-Double-Cashback-Promotion-Discontinued-120416.shtml | Aug 29 16:13 |
Eruaran | Microsoft will eventually find themselves in court facing charges over their campaign of extortion against companies that use Linux. | Aug 29 16:13 |
schestowitz | ThistleWeb: the issue is different | Aug 29 16:13 |
schestowitz | How people people will /chose/ Zimbra/ now? | Aug 29 16:13 |
schestowitz | It's seen as risky | Aug 29 16:13 |
Eruaran | And when they do, their "partners" wont be there to help them. | Aug 29 16:13 |
schestowitz | Zombira (Yahoo) owna Zimbra | Aug 29 16:13 |
Eruaran | yes | Aug 29 16:14 |
ThistleWeb | are people aware that yahoo own zimbra though? | Aug 29 16:14 |
Eruaran | I certainly wouldn't advise anyone to move to Zimbra now. Its future is uncertain. | Aug 29 16:14 |
ThistleWeb | or will most assume it;s an independant FOSS project | Aug 29 16:14 |
ThistleWeb | uncertanty does play into MS hands though, I agree on that score, which is part of what they planned for | Aug 29 16:16 |
schestowitz | What does Yahoo do these days anyway (other than close parts of the business)? | Aug 29 16:16 |
schestowitz | They have just bought some Arabic portal that will be bonging on | Aug 29 16:16 |
ThistleWeb | I wonder if the time of the portal homepage is past | Aug 29 16:17 |
ThistleWeb | who uses a portal site like MSN, AOL or Yahoo | Aug 29 16:17 |
schestowitz | The tactics of these rogue climate elements must not succeed < http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/aug/27/climate-camp-takes-on-lobbyists > | Aug 29 16:17 |
ThistleWeb | many peeps (not me) have a simple google search page as their home page and jump from there | Aug 29 16:17 |
ThistleWeb | yahoo seem to be like the other 2, MSN and AOL as "the past" | Aug 29 16:18 |
schestowitz | Model arrested for posing nude at New York museum < http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesign/2009/aug/27/metropolitan-museum-nude-model-arrest > | Aug 29 16:18 |
ThistleWeb | I'm loving the middle click in firefox | Aug 29 16:19 |
schestowitz | Portals like Yahoo must be losing to social networking | Aug 29 16:19 |
schestowitz | And then there's blogging, microblogging, facebook, etc. | Aug 29 16:19 |
ThistleWeb | I used to miss PTTL since it's not updated to ff3.5 yet, only to be told about copying a link, opening a new tab and middle clicking, which pastes it into the URL bar and goes to the site | Aug 29 16:20 |
schestowitz | "Madonna was booed by thousands of fans at a concert in Romania after condemning discrimination against Gypsies." http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009/aug/28/madonna-booed-at-romania-concert Watch the photo | Aug 29 16:20 |
ThistleWeb | yeah, exactly, other sites have specialised and taken their crown | Aug 29 16:20 |
ThistleWeb | the impression I got of most portal sites was that they wanted it as a walled garden, where you did everything with them, and the screen was just full of clutter | Aug 29 16:21 |
ThistleWeb | links, icons, blinky, flashy things, thats not even mentioning the adverts all trying to vie for attention | Aug 29 16:22 |
cubezzz | I don't really like the yahoo stuff | Aug 29 16:22 |
schestowitz | I dropped Yahoo! | Aug 29 16:22 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] The last "Downfall" captioning http://bit.ly/qEoUr | Aug 29 16:22 | |
ThistleWeb | that's where Google really nailed it as far as I'm concerned, a simple search page | Aug 29 16:22 |
schestowitz | I view it as the next Corel | Aug 29 16:22 |
cubezzz | I'll run what I like on my own server | Aug 29 16:22 |
schestowitz | They already promote Microsoft software | Aug 29 16:23 |
schestowitz | They got captured from the inside | Aug 29 16:23 |
schestowitz | What was the inner shell (FOSS people) got out or was pushed out | Aug 29 16:23 |
schestowitz | Microsoft is a dangerous political movement and should be treated as such | Aug 29 16:23 |
schestowitz | The change will not come from the US become being a _ political movement_ means that they are in change there | Aug 29 16:24 |
schestowitz | They also took over some other countries, but not to the same degree | Aug 29 16:24 |
schestowitz | Watch the BBC and how Microsoft took over, partly/ | Aug 29 16:24 |
schestowitz | Mary Jo Foley's blog got useless. She has nothing to say because she doesn't want to criticise Microsoft and there are no new products, either. Maybe worth deleting from the feeds soon.. same with the Bong-sponsored Tech Flash.... too much fluff, no signal anymore. | Aug 29 16:26 |
cubezzz | I'd rather here the Linux/FOSS news really :) | Aug 29 16:29 |
cubezzz | hear even | Aug 29 16:29 |
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schestowitz | http://www.nokia.com/press/press-releases/showpressrelease?newsid=1337594 | Aug 29 16:43 |
schestowitz | cubezzz: I read those other blog to keep track of the manipulation from Microsoft. Most of this is skipworthy, but sometimes the Microsoftfolk picks up something about an employee moving to a FOSS company | Aug 29 16:43 |
schestowitz | AdMob Announces Agreement to Acquire AdWhirl < http://www.businesswire.com/portal/site/home/permalink/?ndmViewId=news_view&newsId=20090827006007&newsLang=en >. Why?? | Aug 29 16:44 |
schestowitz | Who? | Aug 29 16:44 |
DaemonFC | I think the post office lost my shipment from Newegg | Aug 29 16:46 |
schestowitz | SOme people put business before ethics. http://carlodaffara.conecta.it/?p=322 it doesn't have to be that way | Aug 29 16:46 |
DaemonFC | hmmm, the rep told me they accidentally sent it to Decatur, Indiana because someone put it in the wrong route :P | Aug 29 16:49 |
schestowitz | Report: Steve Jobs concentrating on tablet < http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-10316970-37.html > | Aug 29 16:49 |
DaemonFC | how the hell do you get Decatur, Indiana 46733 when the package says "Huntington, Indiana 46750"? | Aug 29 16:50 |
DaemonFC | so much for efficiency | Aug 29 16:50 |
schestowitz | OCR | Aug 29 16:50 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Will it cost $3,000 and fit into an envelope? | Aug 29 16:50 |
DaemonFC | the world has to know | Aug 29 16:50 |
DaemonFC | they make some notoriously pointless crap | Aug 29 16:51 |
you should not do business with unethical people, they will screw you when they can. | Aug 29 16:51 | |
DaemonFC | who the hell buys an expensive tablet just for the banal day to day crap of sending email and opening documents? | Aug 29 16:52 |
DaemonFC | I can at least kind of understand the kind of person that would spend on a Mac Pro or something | Aug 29 16:53 |
ThistleWeb | schestowitz: I assume you've seen this >> http://rss.slashdot.org/~r/Slashdot/slashdot/~3/sJD-rj7n_-w/Microsoft-Holding-Screw-Google-Meetings-In-DC | Aug 29 16:54 |
ThistleWeb | http://news.slashdot.org/story/09/08/29/030223/Microsoft-Holding-Screw-Google-Meetings-In-DC <<cleaner link | Aug 29 16:54 |
schestowitz | ThistleWeb: yes | Aug 29 16:54 |
*amarsh04 has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Aug 29 16:55 | |
schestowitz | http://www.technewsworld.com/story/67966.html | Aug 29 17:01 |
schestowitz | 'The closest approximation in the Linux world is Xandros server, hairyfeet added, and "while it gets a lot of the way towards the Server+Exchange functionality, it isn't nearly as good at GPO as a Winserver is. And I haven't seen a 'Sharepoint killer' or an 'Outlook killer' yet come from the Linux world."" | Aug 29 17:01 |
schestowitz | This Turfer again | Aug 29 17:01 |
schestowitz | The usual Microsoft promotion/Linux bashing from mr. 'hairyfeet" | Aug 29 17:02 |
schestowitz | bbl | Aug 29 17:03 |
DaemonFC | Xandros? Oh please | Aug 29 17:04 |
DaemonFC | they are a bad joke | Aug 29 17:04 |
schestowitz | They pay MS tax | Aug 29 17:05 |
schestowitz | Thus the recommendation maybe | Aug 29 17:05 |
schestowitz | bbl | Aug 29 17:05 |
DaemonFC | I also noticed those iMagicOS spammers* have reduced the price of their Linux-based Vista clone from $89 to $19.95 *I call them spammers because their "CEO" spams other distributions forums under false names | Aug 29 17:05 |
ThistleWeb | thankfully the respectable distros haven't given in to the MS tax yet | Aug 29 17:07 |
DaemonFC | it's because they know it's bogus | Aug 29 17:07 |
ThistleWeb | no serious linux user would use linspire, xandros or suse | Aug 29 17:07 |
DaemonFC | and the few cases where MS actually showed that they held a patent, the next Linux kernel was patched to avoid it | Aug 29 17:08 |
DaemonFC | so MS probably won't be doing that again soon | Aug 29 17:08 |
ThistleWeb | aside from the MS tax part, they're just not very good distros | Aug 29 17:08 |
ThistleWeb | it's not as if MS bullied the cream of the crop is it? | Aug 29 17:08 |
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DaemonFC | ThistleWeb: Xandros still uses some software based on stuff they bought from Caldera | Aug 29 17:08 |
DaemonFC | before the SCO merger | Aug 29 17:08 |
ThistleWeb | they bullied the lil distros that peeps don't want | Aug 29 17:09 |
DaemonFC | I don't know why they would though, Dolphin or Konqueror are both better file managers than Caldera Explorer | Aug 29 17:09 |
ThistleWeb | my impression of Xandros, even before signing with MS, is that they were always just using Linux for their own aims, with no intention of being FOSS friendly except where they had to, to be GPL compliant | Aug 29 17:10 |
ThistleWeb | linspire were aiming to be a linux for windows users | Aug 29 17:11 |
ThistleWeb | with some dubious ideas | Aug 29 17:11 |
ThistleWeb | and suse, you have to feel for opensuse | Aug 29 17:11 |
ThistleWeb | a kde distro bought, and told to switch to gnome by the new owners, who go and sign the kiss of death pact with MS | Aug 29 17:12 |
ThistleWeb | I'm glad to hear they're moving back to kde | Aug 29 17:12 |
ThistleWeb | distancing themselves from novell could be a good idea too | Aug 29 17:13 |
ThistleWeb | when you rely on a large community, being a pariah does not help your project | Aug 29 17:13 |
DaemonFC | ThistleWeb: Linus Torvalds addressed the complaints of that nature | Aug 29 17:16 |
DaemonFC | he said that open source software is all about one's own greedy ambitions and everything that anyone contributes is to "scratch their own itch" | Aug 29 17:17 |
ThistleWeb | I've had another thought on the whole novell / MS deal | Aug 29 17:17 |
DaemonFC | he's right, it would be stupid to get political and turn down perfectly good contributions jsut because you personally dislike the company they came from | Aug 29 17:17 |
ThistleWeb | it was only a 5yr deal I think, which may or may not be renewed | Aug 29 17:18 |
DaemonFC | it was renewed already wasn't it? Last year | Aug 29 17:18 |
MinceR | "perfectly good" contributions? | Aug 29 17:18 |
ThistleWeb | what happens when the deal runs out, and MS decide to hike the price too high? | Aug 29 17:18 |
DaemonFC | when Microsoft went back and bought more Suse licenses | Aug 29 17:18 |
ThistleWeb | intentionally so that Novell cant pay | Aug 29 17:18 |
ThistleWeb | knowing they're uisng MS patented "IP" | Aug 29 17:19 |
ThistleWeb | because they helped get it in there | Aug 29 17:19 |
MinceR | also, what happened to thinking about one's own future? | Aug 29 17:19 |
DaemonFC | MinceR: A lot of the Intel HDA audio work is being done by Suse employees | Aug 29 17:19 |
DaemonFC | about half the work on ALSA too | Aug 29 17:19 |
DaemonFC | why don't you jsut go uninstall the sound system cause of that? | Aug 29 17:19 |
ThistleWeb | now even novell tech is no longer covered by a covenant not to sue | Aug 29 17:19 |
MinceR | DaemonFC: a lot of the messages posted here come from people who disagree with you | Aug 29 17:19 |
ThistleWeb | along with everything novell are trying to push into other distros like mono | Aug 29 17:19 |
DaemonFC | you'll only have about 90% of the system left that they've touched in some significant way | Aug 29 17:19 |
MinceR | DaemonFC: why don't you just leave because of that? | Aug 29 17:19 |
Diablo-D3 | DaemonFC: explains why alsa is a fucking piece of shit, btw | Aug 29 17:20 |
MinceR | it would be better if they didn't touch the system :> | Aug 29 17:20 |
DaemonFC | no it doesn't | Aug 29 17:20 |
DaemonFC | it explains why some of it works | Aug 29 17:20 |
Diablo-D3 | not really | Aug 29 17:20 |
DaemonFC | Red Hat and Novell are paying people to fix it | Aug 29 17:20 |
Diablo-D3 | the only way to fix it is ditch it | Aug 29 17:20 |
MinceR | and use what? | Aug 29 17:21 |
DaemonFC | between Red Hat and Novell,. you have almsot 95% of the work being done on ALSA and sound drivers | Aug 29 17:21 |
ThistleWeb | they could either set the renewal price so high that it's not worth it, or leave novell with a hellava patent lawsuit to face, which may push them under, killing their part in FOSS | Aug 29 17:21 |
Diablo-D3 | DaemonFC: anyhow, you've been asked to leave | Aug 29 17:21 |
Diablo-D3 | get the fuck out | Aug 29 17:21 |
MinceR | DaemonFC: Red Hat is no m$ supplicant | Aug 29 17:21 |
DaemonFC | and almost a 25% of the total kernel contributions | Aug 29 17:21 |
ThistleWeb | let's face it, MS were doing a LOT better financially when the deal first appeared | Aug 29 17:21 |
Diablo-D3 | ThistleWeb: so is DaemonFC's mom | Aug 29 17:21 |
ThistleWeb | the ecconomy has went to hell since then | Aug 29 17:21 |
Diablo-D3 | ThistleWeb: she learned to quit giving it away | Aug 29 17:21 |
DaemonFC | Linus Torvalds isn't going to scare away the provider of 12% of Linux code just because of some political terrorists at the FSF | Aug 29 17:22 |
Diablo-D3 | "political terrorists" | Aug 29 17:22 |
Diablo-D3 | bwahahahahahah | Aug 29 17:22 |
Diablo-D3 | oh wow | Aug 29 17:22 |
DaemonFC | why don't they go back to bothering salespersons at Apple Stores? | Aug 29 17:22 |
Diablo-D3 | you can't pay for troll material this good | Aug 29 17:22 |
Diablo-D3 | oh wait, nm, Microsoft is | Aug 29 17:22 |
ThistleWeb | the more MS heamorages money, the more they'll seek to make the difference up in other ways, like screwing more out of patent deals | Aug 29 17:22 |
Diablo-D3 | I guess Bill Gates _can_ buy everything | Aug 29 17:23 |
DaemonFC | Where did that campaign go off to anyway? | Aug 29 17:23 |
MinceR | Diablo-D3: this troll material isn't even good | Aug 29 17:23 |
MinceR | Diablo-D3: it's tired and transparent | Aug 29 17:23 |
DaemonFC | they were going to chain themselves to Mac Pro workstations til the store manager threatened to call mall security? | Aug 29 17:23 |
MinceR | DaemonFC: why don't you take some rest until the urge to troll goes away? | Aug 29 17:24 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: I know | Aug 29 17:24 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: its actually kind of sad, I troll more in the morning than DaemonFC does all week | Aug 29 17:24 |
ThistleWeb | yeah you have to wonder why DaemonFC has no permanant ban here | Aug 29 17:24 |
Diablo-D3 | and I've officially retired from it too | Aug 29 17:24 |
Diablo-D3 | his troll-fu is week | Aug 29 17:24 |
Diablo-D3 | er, weak | Aug 29 17:24 |
Diablo-D3 | my typing is weak :< | Aug 29 17:24 |
DaemonFC | every once in a while MinceR gets an op and kicks me for not being sufficiently hateful of all his political enemies | Aug 29 17:25 |
DaemonFC | :P | Aug 29 17:25 |
ThistleWeb | anyone can have a bad mood, or get into an argument without meaning to, but his is pretty constant | Aug 29 17:25 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: you know wants amazing? | Aug 29 17:25 |
Diablo-D3 | glassfish can run ruby apps | Aug 29 17:25 |
Diablo-D3 | er, RoR apps | Aug 29 17:25 |
MinceR | DaemonFC: every once in a while schestowitz gets tired of your trolling and has me kickban you | Aug 29 17:25 |
Diablo-D3 | and it doesnt include ruby | Aug 29 17:26 |
Diablo-D3 | it uses that jruby shit | Aug 29 17:26 |
ThistleWeb | runny shit? | Aug 29 17:26 |
MinceR | Diablo-D3: well, glassfish is some java-based stuff, i'd expect it to do that if at all | Aug 29 17:26 |
ThistleWeb | oh ruby shit | Aug 29 17:26 |
ThistleWeb | my bad, read that wrong | Aug 29 17:26 |
MinceR | ThistleWeb: you know, that language that wanted to be python but couldn't | Aug 29 17:26 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: glassfish is the new java ee server from sun | Aug 29 17:26 |
Diablo-D3 | its just amazing that Sun can out .NET .NET and probably didnt even realize .NET even exists | Aug 29 17:27 |
ThistleWeb | never heard of glassfish, but RoR did intrigue me after hearing the floss weekly interview | Aug 29 17:27 |
Diablo-D3 | ThistleWeb: RoR is largely fucking shit | Aug 29 17:27 |
Diablo-D3 | it takes a shitty functional language and combines it with good ideas, but tries to claim it invented said ideas | Aug 29 17:27 |
ThistleWeb | sit on the fence why don't you | Aug 29 17:28 |
Diablo-D3 | protip: RoR didn't invent IoC or even make it popular | Aug 29 17:28 |
ThistleWeb | I'm not interested in what it claims, but what it does | Aug 29 17:28 |
Diablo-D3 | what it does is the same as any other language, but tries to make it "hip" and "cool" by using a language inferior to lisp | Aug 29 17:28 |
DaemonFC | OSX86 is going to be in a world of hurt pretty soon | Aug 29 17:29 |
Diablo-D3 | I can honestly say there are lisp dialects out there easier to learn and program in than ruby | Aug 29 17:29 |
DaemonFC | Apple is including a malware scanner (quietly) in Snow Leopard | Aug 29 17:29 |
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Diablo-D3 | DaemonFC: and it is aware of all three malwares | Aug 29 17:29 |
MinceR | not quietly enough | Aug 29 17:29 |
Diablo-D3 | the best part is, the malware scanner isnt even for snow leopard | Aug 29 17:30 |
MinceR | only the crApple fanboys don't realize that osx is vulnerable to malware | Aug 29 17:30 |
DaemonFC | it got me thinking that eventually this Snow Leopard scanner will become hundreds of signatures, and possibly remove OSX86 bootloaders too | Aug 29 17:30 |
ThistleWeb | my impression is that it defines a lot of defaults so you dont have to, which also helps syncronise stuff. All I'm going on is that interview though. This seems great for most peeps and most uses, but I can imagine the limits would be frustrating when you need to step beyond them | Aug 29 17:30 |
Diablo-D3 | its so you dont spread the malware to older macs that dont have the newest security updates | Aug 29 17:30 |
DaemonFC | kind of like Windows Defender removes modified GRUB bootloaders that have the activation cracks in them | Aug 29 17:30 |
Diablo-D3 | you know, like G3s still running 10.2 | Aug 29 17:30 |
MinceR | even G3s could use an upgrade to gnu/linux | Aug 29 17:30 |
Diablo-D3 | DaemonFC: but who the fuck runs windows on real hardware? | Aug 29 17:30 |
Diablo-D3 | thats asking for trouble | Aug 29 17:31 |
MinceR | Diablo-D3: gamers | Aug 29 17:31 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: not really, no | Aug 29 17:31 |
DaemonFC | putting something in the Master Boot Record designed to crack the OS is asking for it | Aug 29 17:31 |
DaemonFC | doesn't stop anyone from doing it I suppose | Aug 29 17:31 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: I'd use xen desktop or virtualbox for that | Aug 29 17:31 |
MinceR | though 3d-enabled virtualization exists | Aug 29 17:31 |
ThistleWeb | Diablo-D3: I'd imagine the percentage would be higher than those running windows on imaginary hardware | Aug 29 17:31 |
MinceR | i don't know how well it works now | Aug 29 17:31 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: surprisingly well | Aug 29 17:31 |
MinceR | Diablo-D3: has anyone benchmarked them? | Aug 29 17:31 |
Diablo-D3 | I have | Aug 29 17:31 |
MinceR | what are the results? | Aug 29 17:31 |
Diablo-D3 | its a tad slow in some places | Aug 29 17:31 |
Diablo-D3 | though the real problem is hl2 still doesnt work entirely right in virtualbox | Aug 29 17:32 |
Diablo-D3 | how the fuck am I supposed to get my team fortress on! | Aug 29 17:32 |
DaemonFC | so far I've only ran into one DRM system in Windows 7, that was easily avoided by using other media center software | Aug 29 17:32 |
Diablo-D3 | DaemonFC: except for the DRM that allows you to boot w7 | Aug 29 17:32 |
MinceR | Diablo-D3: with quake, of course | Aug 29 17:32 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: tf2, dork | Aug 29 17:33 |
DaemonFC | I suppose it'll be like their browser and their media player, it hasn't exactly stopped their competitors from making other software | Aug 29 17:33 |
MinceR | Diablo-D3: you said team fortress, not tf2. dork. | Aug 29 17:33 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: no one says "get your tf2 on" | Aug 29 17:33 |
MinceR | Diablo-D3: everyone just runs tf on quake instead? :> | Aug 29 17:33 |
ThistleWeb | at one point ages ago I thought about buying an old Mac because I loved the asthetics of it, but I wouldn't want to run OSX, and know getting Linux on it can be tricky, and imperfect, with limited choices depending on the Mac in question | Aug 29 17:33 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: I used to | Aug 29 17:33 |
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Diablo-D3 | MinceR: it was fun | Aug 29 17:33 |
MinceR | i used to, too | Aug 29 17:33 |
Diablo-D3 | 2fort4 <3 | Aug 29 17:33 |
MinceR | i've stolen some ideas for my closed-distribution quake mod, too | Aug 29 17:34 |
ThistleWeb | it was also VERY expensive for an old second hand pc | Aug 29 17:34 |
MinceR | (it would have been some massive copyright infringement to distribute it, but it was fun on lan parties :> ) | Aug 29 17:34 |
Diablo-D3 | ThistleWeb: you're kidding right? | Aug 29 17:34 |
Diablo-D3 | I have debian sid running on my powerbook fine | Aug 29 17:34 |
MinceR | pk13 ftw | Aug 29 17:34 |
MinceR | (one of my favorite quake maps, from painkeep) | Aug 29 17:35 |
ThistleWeb | never tried it, it's just what I've picked up from peeps | Aug 29 17:35 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: btw, you know what pisses me off? | Aug 29 17:35 |
Diablo-D3 | quakelive is still crap | Aug 29 17:35 |
MinceR | well, the concept is retarded | Aug 29 17:35 |
ThistleWeb | debian would probs be the only option I'd want though | Aug 29 17:35 |
Diablo-D3 | all they did was shove quake3 into a plugin | Aug 29 17:35 |
ThistleWeb | not keen on rpm distros | Aug 29 17:35 |
MinceR | if players have to install a quakelive-specific plugin anyway, why bother with a browser at all? | Aug 29 17:35 |
MinceR | just re-release q3a with ads and be done with it | Aug 29 17:35 |
Diablo-D3 | MinceR: the problem is, if quake3 crashes, it eats your browser | Aug 29 17:36 |
Diablo-D3 | it takes firefox 5 minutes to startup goddamnit | Aug 29 17:36 |
Diablo-D3 | I have like 500 tabs | Aug 29 17:36 |
MinceR | lol | Aug 29 17:36 |
ThistleWeb | maybe it's one of these things that have gotten better and better and I haven't been paying attention | Aug 29 17:36 |
MinceR | i tend to move tabs to bookmarks if there are too many of them | Aug 29 17:36 |
Diablo-D3 | it was worse back in the 2.0 days | Aug 29 17:36 |
Diablo-D3 | it took like 10 | Aug 29 17:36 |
Diablo-D3 | and used 4 gigs of memory | Aug 29 17:36 |
Diablo-D3 | <daemonfc> but internet explorer would only use 4 megs! and it sucks dicks too! | Aug 29 17:37 |
MinceR | lol | Aug 29 17:37 |
Diablo-D3 | <daemonfc> but dont tell anyone it can suck dicks! if word got out it could suck dicks, people would be lined up around the block to get their dicks sucked | Aug 29 17:37 |
MinceR | :D | Aug 29 17:37 |
MinceR | well, sure, IE is like the only way to browse the m$-web | Aug 29 17:38 |
Diablo-D3 | sadly, my version of DaemonFC is a better troll | Aug 29 17:38 |
MinceR | too bad i prefer the real web | Aug 29 17:38 |
MinceR | built on standard html instead of m$-html, etc. | Aug 29 17:38 |
Diablo-D3 | I dont even use the web anymore | Aug 29 17:38 |
DaemonFC | Opera then? | Aug 29 17:38 |
DaemonFC | it's the only one with a proper rendering engine | Aug 29 17:38 |
Diablo-D3 | I just use amule and download my porn that way | Aug 29 17:38 |
MinceR | probably one browser won't suffice anyway | Aug 29 17:39 |
Diablo-D3 | DaemonFC: you're kidding me, right? | Aug 29 17:39 |
Diablo-D3 | Ive seen opera's source code | Aug 29 17:39 |
Diablo-D3 | its lulzy | Aug 29 17:39 |
MinceR | ff is a must-have for all the extensions and for full flash support | Aug 29 17:39 |
DaemonFC | Opera is not open source | Aug 29 17:39 |
Diablo-D3 | DaemonFC: you say that like it means something | Aug 29 17:39 |
DaemonFC | extensions are overrated | Aug 29 17:39 |
this is a tiny and mostly worthless space now -> MinceR: well, sure, IE is like the only way to browse the m$-web | Aug 29 17:39 | |
Diablo-D3 | why does opera have to be open source for me to see the code? | Aug 29 17:39 |
the world has moved on, M$ is history. | Aug 29 17:39 | |
Diablo-D3 | shit dude, Ive seen microsoft source code | Aug 29 17:39 |
ThistleWeb | yeah extentions like the chuck norris thingy are just what web users need | Aug 29 17:40 |
Diablo-D3 | naw man | Aug 29 17:40 |
ThistleWeb | I'd give up adblocking for chuck norris facts | Aug 29 17:40 |
Diablo-D3 | the "stop hammer time" stop button extension is awesome | Aug 29 17:40 |
MinceR | ThistleWeb: i was thinking more along the lines of the Web Developer Toolbar and flash video downloaders | Aug 29 17:40 |
MinceR | perhaps also greasemonkey | Aug 29 17:40 |
ThistleWeb | lol, yeah | Aug 29 17:40 |
Diablo-D3 | greasemonkey is fucking awesome | Aug 29 17:40 |
ThistleWeb | opera is nce, but it needs proper extentions | Aug 29 17:40 |
ThistleWeb | not the toys it has now | Aug 29 17:41 |
MinceR | noscript is probably a good idea to have too | Aug 29 17:41 |
DaemonFC | Opera only restricts the parts that could be security problems | Aug 29 17:41 |
Diablo-D3 | thats what she said | Aug 29 17:41 |
DaemonFC | Firefox extensions are like running a full blown program | Aug 29 17:41 |
DaemonFC | most people don't truly appreciate how dangerous Firefox extensions could be | Aug 29 17:41 |
DaemonFC | just as bad as a malicious ActiveX control, maybe even worse | Aug 29 17:42 |
MinceR | except i choose what extensions i run | Aug 29 17:42 |
ThistleWeb | my main beef with opera is that it seems unable to consistently display font sizes | Aug 29 17:42 |
MinceR | and they can apply to any page | Aug 29 17:42 |
DaemonFC | IE at least sandboxes ActiveX now | Aug 29 17:42 |
MinceR | while RadioActiveX is embedded into pages that don't need it | Aug 29 17:42 |
DaemonFC | Firefox doesn't sandbox extensions | Aug 29 17:42 |
Diablo-D3 | fuck yeah, new version of jersey is out | Aug 29 17:42 |
MinceR | DaemonFC: you're confusing plugins with extensions | Aug 29 17:42 |
MinceR | they serve different purposes | Aug 29 17:43 |
ThistleWeb | even trying to lock it down, I can go from one site where the text is a nice readable size, to another and it's either Mr Magoo HUGE, or tiny | Aug 29 17:43 |
DaemonFC | they *can* | Aug 29 17:44 |
DaemonFC | but that's not saying they always do | Aug 29 17:44 |
MinceR | they almost always do | Aug 29 17:44 |
MinceR | in fact, i don't know of any case when they don't | Aug 29 17:44 |
DaemonFC | the Moonlight "extension" is actually a plugin | Aug 29 17:44 |
ThistleWeb | and the fact that in opera, flash videos seem to autoplay, which I don't like | Aug 29 17:44 |
MinceR | who the hell uses moonlight anyway? | Aug 29 17:44 |
DaemonFC | there's a flash blocking user script for Opera | Aug 29 17:45 |
DaemonFC | I use it | Aug 29 17:45 |
MinceR | it's only legal for suse customers, afaik | Aug 29 17:45 |
ThistleWeb | I'd expect these 2 issues can be resolved easily with the right settings | Aug 29 17:45 |
MinceR | so fuck that | Aug 29 17:45 |
DaemonFC | it works jsut like Flashblock | Aug 29 17:45 |
ThistleWeb | I've just not found them | Aug 29 17:45 |
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MinceR | i'd like some non-JS flash blocker | Aug 29 17:45 |
MinceR | but sadly neither opera nor ff have that | Aug 29 17:45 |
DaemonFC | a good ad blocking filter blocks most flash annoyances anyway | Aug 29 17:45 |
MinceR | swfdec can do a bit of it, but there's lots of flash that doesn't work with swfdec | Aug 29 17:45 |
ThistleWeb | I do like the real time preview / "keep or remove" way opera works | Aug 29 17:46 |
DaemonFC | and Swfdec runs the video using only the CPU | Aug 29 17:46 |
DaemonFC | watch what it does to your CPU usage | Aug 29 17:46 |
MinceR | watch what adobe trash does to your cpu usage | Aug 29 17:46 |
DaemonFC | almost nothing | Aug 29 17:46 |
DaemonFC | it hooks into DirectX or OpenGL and renders on the GPU | Aug 29 17:46 |
MinceR | you must be living in some strange alternate reality then | Aug 29 17:47 |
DaemonFC | if you have any kind of reasonable video card, Flash won't do anything to your CPU | Aug 29 17:47 |
DaemonFC | if you're trying to run it on some 10 year old integrated Intel something or other, you'll be in trouble | Aug 29 17:47 |
MinceR | i'm trying to run it on a pretty new nvidia :> | Aug 29 17:48 |
MinceR | and it's about as crap as it ever was | Aug 29 17:48 |
DaemonFC | well you're doing something wrong then | Aug 29 17:48 |
MinceR | i've seen moonblight on a cow orker's machine | Aug 29 17:49 |
MinceR | it wasn't any better either | Aug 29 17:49 |
DaemonFC | are you using a native version or trying to use a plugin "wrapper"? | Aug 29 17:49 |
MinceR | DaemonFC: yes, i've chosen the reality to live in wrong, apparently | Aug 29 17:49 |
MinceR | or i'm not using a supercomputer to render a single webpage | Aug 29 17:49 |
MinceR | it must be one of those things | Aug 29 17:49 |
DaemonFC | mine is hardly a supercomputer | Aug 29 17:49 |
MinceR | i'm using what debian uses :> | Aug 29 17:49 |
DaemonFC | it runs fine | Aug 29 17:49 |
MinceR | before that, i used what ubuntu used | Aug 29 17:49 |
MinceR | which is probably the same thing | Aug 29 17:49 |
MinceR | and actually i've used several distros and flash invariably sucked in the exact same way | Aug 29 17:50 |
MinceR | while non-flash apps did all those things (vector graphics, video playback, whatever) properly | Aug 29 17:50 |
DaemonFC | Ubuntu still uses the wrapped 32-bit plugin | Aug 29 17:50 |
DaemonFC | and good luck trying to get rid of that | Aug 29 17:50 |
MinceR | and that's beside the fact that none of this crap belongs on webpages anyway | Aug 29 17:51 |
DaemonFC | it dumps symbolic links to the plugin in all the places any browser could look | Aug 29 17:51 |
MinceR | oh noes, symbolic links! | Aug 29 17:51 |
DaemonFC | you need to delete those, the plugin, and the package | Aug 29 17:51 |
DaemonFC | it's a pain in the ass | Aug 29 17:51 |
DaemonFC | locate command helps | Aug 29 17:51 |
MinceR | it sucked the same way in gentoo | Aug 29 17:51 |
DaemonFC | best off to just not install theirs and use the 64-bit plugin from Adobe Labs | Aug 29 17:52 |
MinceR | also, it sucked the same way on 32bit cpus | Aug 29 17:52 |
DaemonFC | copy it into /usr/lib64/mozilla/plugins and restart your browser | Aug 29 17:52 |
DaemonFC | Flash 10 was an incredible performance improvement | Aug 29 17:53 |
MinceR | as in, it sucked a little less? | Aug 29 17:53 |
DaemonFC | nspluginwrapper has always been pretty ugly | Aug 29 17:53 |
DaemonFC | Opera's wrapper works better | Aug 29 17:53 |
DaemonFC | there's still a few bugs in the 64-bit Flash plugin that seem to crash under certain circumstances, it interferes with Opera more than Firefox | Aug 29 17:54 |
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DaemonFC | if you use Opera, you should use 32-bit Flash with Operawrapper | Aug 29 17:54 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] right, I am going to Vagabonds tonight. Still v poor. Buy me a drink? I put out! By me two drinks and I'll refrain from putting out! | Aug 29 17:54 | |
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DaemonFC | Firefox has always just seemed to be too slow and too memory hungry for no more than it does | Aug 29 17:57 |
DaemonFC | Opera has all the stuff I needed Firefox extensions for built in | Aug 29 17:57 |
ThistleWeb | glad opera suits you | Aug 29 17:57 |
DaemonFC | the licensing affects what most distributions ship instead of the quality of the product | Aug 29 17:57 |
ThistleWeb | choice is a good thing | Aug 29 17:57 |
DaemonFC | If Opera was to go open source, it would run them out of business | Aug 29 17:59 |
ThistleWeb | bollocks | Aug 29 17:59 |
DaemonFC | anyone could just recompile it, not pay them, and slap it on their device | Aug 29 17:59 |
DaemonFC | Opera would go bankrupt | Aug 29 17:59 |
ThistleWeb | I'm guessing the urge not to troll has worn off eh? | Aug 29 17:59 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] DW/LJ: Party party party. http://reddragdiva.dreamwidth.org/13468.html http://reddragdiva.livejournal.com/527134.html | Aug 29 17:59 | |
ThistleWeb | didn't take long | Aug 29 17:59 |
ThistleWeb | again | Aug 29 18:00 |
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DaemonFC | http://computerworld.co.nz/news.nsf/tech/982280C3DA7766DFCC257213007BC166 | Aug 29 18:02 |
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DaemonFC | an interview with their CEO about why they won't go open source | Aug 29 18:02 |
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DaemonFC | Google seems to fund any browser that will use them in the search box | Aug 29 18:10 |
ThistleWeb | yeah imagine that, funding a number of browsers | Aug 29 18:10 |
DaemonFC | they even fund Internet Explorer-based browsers | Aug 29 18:11 |
ThistleWeb | not as focussed at denying choice as MS, they only fund their own | Aug 29 18:11 |
DaemonFC | they gave a million dollars to Maxthon alone | Aug 29 18:11 |
ThistleWeb | they're just doing the whole anti-competitive thingy all wrong. Perhaps they should get a proxy into Redmond to learn from the masters how it's done | Aug 29 18:12 |
DaemonFC | Google pays an obscene amount of money to make sure its search monopoly remains | Aug 29 18:12 |
DaemonFC | they pay like hundreds of millions a year to Firefox just to keep smaller search engines who can't afford it out | Aug 29 18:13 |
DaemonFC | it's pretty much exactly like Microsoft | Aug 29 18:13 |
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ThistleWeb | I'm guessing that I'm the only person who hasn't ignored you judging by the conversation, time to join the crowd methinks | Aug 29 18:16 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] A fazer o jantar!! | Aug 29 18:22 | |
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DaemonFC | hmm | Aug 29 18:34 |
DaemonFC | http://distrowatch.com/?newsid=05644 | Aug 29 18:34 |
DaemonFC | "Also, this is the first release of Slackware with native support for the 64-bit x86_64 architecture!" | Aug 29 18:35 |
DaemonFC | took them about long enough | Aug 29 18:35 |
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Omar87 | Hi all | Aug 29 18:52 |
Omar87 | Any new updates on the i4i lawsuit against MS? | Aug 29 18:53 |
amarsh04 | only hp and dell's amicus briefs posted on www.groklaw.net | Aug 29 18:54 |
DaemonFC | Dell and HP files friend of the court petitions | Aug 29 18:56 |
DaemonFC | in Microsoft's favor | Aug 29 18:56 |
DaemonFC | *filed | Aug 29 18:56 |
DaemonFC | yeah, that | Aug 29 18:56 |
DaemonFC | what systems do they ship Word on? | Aug 29 18:56 |
DaemonFC | trialware maybe | Aug 29 18:56 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NotN: Designers prefer websites designed by designers http://notnews.today.com/?p=626 | Aug 29 19:01 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] /me is going to VACUUM Firefox's .sqlite's | Aug 29 19:31 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] /me is done... | Aug 29 19:33 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] ♺ @photomatt: Is this the best WordPress Cake? http://twitpic.com/gan1 | Aug 29 19:34 | |
trmanco | http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/drupal/node/90 | Aug 29 19:45 |
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*schestowitz listens to http://www.twit.tv/floss83 | Aug 29 20:03 | |
schestowitz | I messed up the rowing contest | Aug 29 20:03 |
schestowitz | THe ergo froze half way through | Aug 29 20:04 |
schestowitz | First thing it ever happens this decade !! | Aug 29 20:04 |
schestowitz | ANd in a contest | Aug 29 20:04 |
schestowitz | Then the straps came loose | Aug 29 20:04 |
schestowitz | Omar87: they got an appeal | Aug 29 20:11 |
schestowitz | With help from DOJ and other b*ches like HP and Dell filing amici | Aug 29 20:11 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] ♺ @trmanco] ♺ @photomatt: Is this the best WordPress Cake? http://twitpic.com/gan1 | Aug 29 20:13 | |
schestowitz | via mail: "Motorola confirms upcoming linux handset [..] Here's another: Motorola will use Android (linux) next: | Aug 29 20:13 |
schestowitz | http://gigaom.com/2009/08/26/exclusive-motorola-confirms-it-will-launch-android-devices-at-moblize/" | Aug 29 20:13 |
schestowitz | "> i have seen figures that say that 60% of all smart phones use FOSS OSes. | Aug 29 20:15 |
schestowitz | Very doubtful. But... Symbian now counts as FOSS, so..." | Aug 29 20:15 |
DaemonFC | mine doesn't :P | Aug 29 20:21 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] This is a very creative sign: http://ping.fm/7BvGC | Aug 29 20:22 | |
DaemonFC | It doesn't look like Gecko will ever be on mobile phones in any serious way now | Aug 29 20:24 |
DaemonFC | if you want to see just how bad Fennec is, they have compiled versions for Windows, Linux, and Mac | Aug 29 20:25 |
MinceR | it already is on N900 | Aug 29 20:26 |
DaemonFC | yeah, Nokia is being cheap | Aug 29 20:26 |
DaemonFC | and if they wanted a decent browser without paying anyone they would have used Webkit | Aug 29 20:26 |
trmanco | just a rendering engine won't be enough | Aug 29 20:27 |
MinceR | Webkit is not a browser, it's just a rendering engine | Aug 29 20:27 |
trmanco | :> | Aug 29 20:27 |
DaemonFC | for all the money they spent porting Firefox | Aug 29 20:27 |
DaemonFC | they could have done something useful | Aug 29 20:27 |
schestowitz | http://tech.yahoo.com/news/pcworld/20090827/tc_pcworld/bluraydrivesinpcsfuggetaboutit (Blu-ray Drives in PCs? Fuggetaboutit ) | Aug 29 20:28 |
DaemonFC | if one guy got bored and wrote Midori, then you can't tell me that with all the employees Nokia has, they couldn't have built a browser with Webkit for their phones | Aug 29 20:28 |
trmanco | well, the point is using free software | Aug 29 20:29 |
DaemonFC | Webkit is free software | Aug 29 20:29 |
MinceR | perhaps they don't like Webkit as much as you do :> | Aug 29 20:29 |
trmanco | webkit isn't a browser | Aug 29 20:29 |
MinceR | then again, i've heard Qt includes WebKit now... | Aug 29 20:29 |
DaemonFC | I don't even use Firefox on my desktop, I sure as hell am not going to use a brain damaged half functional version on my phone | Aug 29 20:30 |
trmanco | they could have built a web browser which wasn't going to be free software with webkit | Aug 29 20:30 |
trmanco | I can see you prefer your American style iphone y | Aug 29 20:30 |
DaemonFC | Opera runs on the Blackberry, and it can even play Flash videos | Aug 29 20:30 |
trmanco | so can fennec (flash videos) | Aug 29 20:31 |
trmanco | isn't opera a paid app on cell phones? | Aug 29 20:31 |
DaemonFC | no | Aug 29 20:31 |
trmanco | opera full | Aug 29 20:31 |
DaemonFC | it's freeware | Aug 29 20:31 |
trmanco | not mini | Aug 29 20:31 |
MinceR | probably it's only paid if the phone maker preinstalls it | Aug 29 20:32 |
DaemonFC | and sometimes it's included on the phone | Aug 29 20:32 |
DaemonFC | doesn't *have* to be | Aug 29 20:32 |
trmanco | heh, not so long ago the full opera was a paid app on nokia 6600 | Aug 29 20:32 |
trmanco | I had 1- pirate it or 2- get mini | Aug 29 20:32 |
DaemonFC | I downloaded Opera onto my old Nokia phone | Aug 29 20:32 |
DaemonFC | it was free | Aug 29 20:32 |
trmanco | I would usually go with 2 | Aug 29 20:32 |
trmanco | of use the trial | Aug 29 20:32 |
schestowitz | Neat: http://info.abril.com.br/blog/zonalivre/20090813_listar.shtml?188467 | Aug 29 20:33 |
DaemonFC | the data transfer to download it was the only thing you could say I "paid for" | Aug 29 20:33 |
schestowitz | trmanco: can read it | Aug 29 20:33 |
DaemonFC | but that's downloading anything | Aug 29 20:33 |
schestowitz | Let's not say "pirate" | Aug 29 20:34 |
schestowitz | Unless it's something criminal near Somalia | Aug 29 20:34 |
trmanco | yeah | Aug 29 20:34 |
schestowitz | By allowing them to change the language we already lose the debate | Aug 29 20:34 |
DaemonFC | I used to register Opera btw | Aug 29 20:34 |
schestowitz | If the MPAA started calling itself MAFIAA in public it would not be respected | Aug 29 20:34 |
trmanco | the download costs here are 1¢ each KB | Aug 29 20:35 |
trmanco | with a download speed of 4 KM/s | Aug 29 20:35 |
trmanco | KB* | Aug 29 20:35 |
DaemonFC | I have unlimited downloading now | Aug 29 20:35 |
trmanco | this is gprs | Aug 29 20:35 |
DaemonFC | $10 a month flat rate | Aug 29 20:35 |
trmanco | 2.5g | Aug 29 20:35 |
schestowitz | COMCAST | Aug 29 20:35 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: I'm talking about my phone | Aug 29 20:35 |
DaemonFC | Comcast cap is 250 gigs a month | Aug 29 20:36 |
DaemonFC | if I haven't hit the cap I'd really hate to see who would | Aug 29 20:36 |
trmanco | I have no cap | Aug 29 20:36 |
trmanco | :-P | Aug 29 20:36 |
schestowitz | http://izanbardprince.wordpress.com/2009/08/07/comcast-is-now-using-dns-hijacking-to-serve-up-error-pages-full-of-advertising/ | Aug 29 20:36 |
trmanco | take that comcast | Aug 29 20:36 |
trmanco | :-P | Aug 29 20:36 |
DaemonFC | you probably have one of the ISPs that has an invisicap | Aug 29 20:36 |
schestowitz | Virgin does tha same | Aug 29 20:36 |
schestowitz | There should be laws against it | Aug 29 20:37 |
trmanco | DaemonFC, what that? | Aug 29 20:37 |
schestowitz | And the FCC should come cracking down | Aug 29 20:37 |
schestowitz | Same for the whole phorm thing | Aug 29 20:37 |
DaemonFC | like "unreasonable usage gives us the right to cut you off" then they never define what unreasonable means | Aug 29 20:37 |
DaemonFC | Comcast use to have that policy | Aug 29 20:37 |
schestowitz | They prostitute themselves or pimp out their clients | Aug 29 20:37 |
trmanco | I need all that bandwidth to update my 500 home servers :-P | Aug 29 20:37 |
trmanco | DaemonFC, never heard of that | Aug 29 20:37 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Yes, I wrote that, and I was pissed | Aug 29 20:37 |
trmanco | or of anyone with that problem | Aug 29 20:38 |
DaemonFC | I'm not a hige fan of Comcast they're just the least shitty deal here | Aug 29 20:38 |
DaemonFC | the only other guys are AT&T | Aug 29 20:38 |
trmanco | I know people who break 100GB mark with a 4Mbit connection | Aug 29 20:38 |
DaemonFC | *huge | Aug 29 20:38 |
trmanco | per month | Aug 29 20:38 |
DaemonFC | AT&T's only plan under $35 a month that doesn't include a phone line is $20 a month for 768 kbps ADSL | Aug 29 20:39 |
DaemonFC | and you have to sign up for a whole year to get that | Aug 29 20:39 |
DaemonFC | their next bump up is $35 for 1.5 Mbps, and that goes month to month | Aug 29 20:40 |
trmanco | I prefer a phone line | Aug 29 20:40 |
DaemonFC | but then the phone company hits you with $70 for the router modem | Aug 29 20:41 |
trmanco | :O | Aug 29 20:41 |
DaemonFC | *and* a whole bunch of fees and telecom taxes they never mentioned | Aug 29 20:41 |
DaemonFC | $200 to "install it" (install meaning running 20 feet of cord from the phone pole to your house | Aug 29 20:41 |
DaemonFC | and another $175 if you break their contract | Aug 29 20:42 |
trmanco | ... | Aug 29 20:42 |
DaemonFC | yeah... | Aug 29 20:42 |
DaemonFC | and then they obfuscate the modem setup | Aug 29 20:42 |
DaemonFC | so you NEED the Windows or Mac software to set the modem up | Aug 29 20:43 |
trmanco | I hate modems | Aug 29 20:43 |
trmanco | especially usb modems | Aug 29 20:43 |
DaemonFC | the software fails to install under Wine of course | Aug 29 20:43 |
DaemonFC | this Motorola cable modem I have has been decent | Aug 29 20:43 |
DaemonFC | the RCA ones are junk | Aug 29 20:43 |
DaemonFC | RCA ones last about 6-8 months then they'll overheat and become unstable | Aug 29 20:44 |
DaemonFC | eventually they won't even power on | Aug 29 20:44 |
schestowitz | RCA still exists?!?! | Aug 29 20:44 |
schestowitz | I bought an RCA radio in FL like a decade or more ago | Aug 29 20:44 |
DaemonFC | as a brand, yes | Aug 29 20:44 |
schestowitz | There still struggled to survive | Aug 29 20:44 |
schestowitz | As a brand? | Aug 29 20:44 |
schestowitz | Meaning...? | Aug 29 20:45 |
schestowitz | They sent it to China? | Aug 29 20:45 |
schestowitz | And put the American brand name on it? | Aug 29 20:45 |
DaemonFC | RCA/GE/Proscan are all brands owned by Thomson Consumer Electronics | Aug 29 20:45 |
DaemonFC | they make the stuff in Mexico and China | Aug 29 20:45 |
schestowitz | GE? | Aug 29 20:45 |
DaemonFC | and Thomson is a French company | Aug 29 20:45 |
schestowitz | Thomson is a nasty company | Aug 29 20:45 |
schestowitz | Isn't it with Reuters too? | Aug 29 20:45 |
DaemonFC | yeah, my dad worked for RCA starting in 1976 I believe | Aug 29 20:45 |
schestowitz | And researcn field... | Aug 29 20:46 |
DaemonFC | Thomson kept him after they bought RCA in the early 90s, laid him off in 2001 | Aug 29 20:46 |
schestowitz | GE as in General Electric?? | Aug 29 20:46 |
DaemonFC | yeah, GE consumer electronics division, yeah | Aug 29 20:46 |
schestowitz | RCA is still in some old USian tunes | Aug 29 20:46 |
DaemonFC | the military contracts of RCA and GE went mainly to Raytheon | Aug 29 20:46 |
schestowitz | Like McDougal Dougalas | Aug 29 20:46 |
DaemonFC | my dad has also worked for Raytheon | Aug 29 20:46 |
schestowitz | *McDonald | Aug 29 20:46 |
schestowitz | Raytheon use Linux | Aug 29 20:47 |
DaemonFC | he can't even tell me what he did at Raytheon because he signed an NDA | Aug 29 20:47 |
schestowitz | I know that much, but their defense work it probably more on the confidential side..? | Aug 29 20:47 |
schestowitz | Yeah | Aug 29 20:47 |
schestowitz | I figured that. | Aug 29 20:47 |
DaemonFC | they work on classified government weapons systems | Aug 29 20:47 |
schestowitz | Yeah. | Aug 29 20:47 |
DaemonFC | that's all he can tell me | Aug 29 20:47 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] chatting at http://tinychat.com/manuellatta #tinychat | Aug 29 20:47 | |
schestowitz | Simulations done on Linux | Aug 29 20:47 |
DaemonFC | he could also tell me that he worked on radar systems and other components for the F-22 and F-35 | Aug 29 20:48 |
trmanco | ah | Aug 29 20:48 |
schestowitz | NDAs are dehumanising | Aug 29 20:48 |
schestowitz | Thought becomes crime.. like patents and all | Aug 29 20:48 |
DaemonFC | he has patents | Aug 29 20:48 |
DaemonFC | but he can't enforce them or charge royalties | Aug 29 20:49 |
DaemonFC | he developed components on company time when he was working at RCA/Thomson | Aug 29 20:49 |
DaemonFC | and so even though the patents are in his name, they own the exclusive rights | Aug 29 20:49 |
schestowitz | TechFLash has really slown down | Aug 29 20:49 |
schestowitz | I'm pleased to see it cause it's MS PR more or less | Aug 29 20:50 |
schestowitz | Same goes for other MS 'PR' blog | Aug 29 20:50 |
schestowitz | *blogs | Aug 29 20:50 |
schestowitz | Also means less work for me tracking the Vole | Aug 29 20:50 |
DaemonFC | he hold 9 patents if I remember correctly | Aug 29 20:50 |
DaemonFC | mainly on television components | Aug 29 20:50 |
schestowitz | I ought to organise the Wiki some more this weekend | Aug 29 20:50 |
schestowitz | This girl that I like from the gym is gonna watch it this weekend... gave her the address :-) | Aug 29 20:50 |
schestowitz | Patents are usually owned by the company | Aug 29 20:51 |
schestowitz | The names on it are the least credit they get | Aug 29 20:51 |
schestowitz | Academic work can be similar wrt patents | Aug 29 20:51 |
schestowitz | "> Yes, Symbian was about 30% of the market, as I recall. | Aug 29 20:52 |
schestowitz | More like 60%, depending on form factor. " | Aug 29 20:52 |
schestowitz | How much does Synbian account for in_smart_phones? | Aug 29 20:52 |
DaemonFC | he's doing all kinds of work now, some of it is really below him | Aug 29 20:52 |
DaemonFC | but it's what is hiring | Aug 29 20:52 |
DaemonFC | Symbian is mostly Nokia, right? | Aug 29 20:53 |
schestowitz | http://www.ghacks.net/2009/08/28/connect-to-a-remote-virtual-machine-with-rdesktop/ | Aug 29 20:54 |
schestowitz | All Nokia | Aug 29 20:54 |
schestowitz | 100% | Aug 29 20:54 |
DaemonFC | open source is used by companies to grandstand | Aug 29 20:54 |
schestowitz | EPL | Aug 29 20:54 |
schestowitz | Hardly 'open' | Aug 29 20:54 |
schestowitz | PR purposes | Aug 29 20:54 |
DaemonFC | they can release things that are only really suited to their needs because they still control it anyway | Aug 29 20:54 |
schestowitz | Liike the new BONG SDK | Aug 29 20:54 |
schestowitz | MsPL | Aug 29 20:55 |
DaemonFC | also a lot of closed source companies release their SDKs under BSD-like licenses | Aug 29 20:55 |
DaemonFC | so you can make plugins for their software but you really have no idea how the software works | Aug 29 20:55 |
DaemonFC | Foobar2000 is like that, so is Winamp, and Opera | Aug 29 20:55 |
DaemonFC | all good programs though | Aug 29 20:55 |
schestowitz | "With that being the case, and there being no chance whatsoever of SCO successfully pursuing a Linux lawsuit, I strongly suspect that the Trustee will drop all of SCO's lawsuits and spend his time on rendering down SCO's remains into pennies on dollars. Rationally, there's nothing left to do, and with a reasonable person now in charge of SCO's remains, that's what I expect to happen." | Aug 29 20:56 |
schestowitz | http://blogs.computerworld.com/14625/what_happens_next_in_sco_vs_novell | Aug 29 20:56 |
DaemonFC | Winamp has stated that they couldn't open source even if they wanted to | Aug 29 20:56 |
DaemonFC | because they've licensed so many things for it that even they don't own all the parts to make it work | Aug 29 20:56 |
schestowitz | llama will kick winamp in the arse if it doesn't liberate the code | Aug 29 20:57 |
DaemonFC | Nvidia likes to use that one too | Aug 29 20:57 |
schestowitz | Blame-paasing | Aug 29 20:57 |
schestowitz | How convenient | Aug 29 20:57 |
DaemonFC | AOL/Nullsoft ported Winamp to Linux back in 2003 | Aug 29 20:57 |
schestowitz | Eventually they open-source | Aug 29 20:57 |
DaemonFC | didn't last long | Aug 29 20:57 |
schestowitz | Nobody then asks questions about the faux excusez | Aug 29 20:57 |
DaemonFC | the only thing it could do was play MP3s | Aug 29 20:57 |
schestowitz | xmms is better | Aug 29 20:58 |
schestowitz | Uses less RAM | Aug 29 20:58 |
DaemonFC | Winamp's core and to a greater extent, plugins, are all very dependent on Windows | Aug 29 20:58 |
schestowitz | In Windows 98 I had to use older versions of winamp to cope with a 32mb of ram laptop | Aug 29 20:58 |
DaemonFC | it's why it has never worked well in Wine | Aug 29 20:58 |
DaemonFC | they would have to rewrite almost all of it to do a proper port | Aug 29 20:59 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Winamp doesn't use an unreasonable amount of RAM | Aug 29 20:59 |
schestowitz | http://www.geeksaresexy.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/onegigabyte1.jpg | Aug 29 20:59 |
DaemonFC | if it does, you can always use the classic skin and it won't take much more than 2.x | Aug 29 20:59 |
schestowitz | http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2009-08-28-019-35-NW-HW-0000 "The SD card in the hand should have been a 15x11 mm micro SD card instead of a 32x24 standard SD card " | Aug 29 21:00 |
schestowitz | "At any rate, it seems as if FOSS has a dominant share in the smart phone market, and as smart phones proceed toward convergence with small form factor netbooks, it seems to be fertile ground for converting lots of Microsoft Windows users to FOSS users, even if they don't know it." | Aug 29 21:01 |
schestowitz | " Once the low end netbook market is lost, FOSS can start to creep up the market into more expensive notebooks and then hopefully also converge with corporate FOSS desktop installs in corporate environments like Hollywood, which I have heard is top to bottom Linux everywhere except maybe a few CEO offices. " | Aug 29 21:01 |
trmanco | http://www.anandtech.com/systems/showdoc.aspx?i=3616&p=24 | Aug 29 21:02 |
DaemonFC | hmmm, seems like Opera Mobile is still $24 if you use Windows Mobile | Aug 29 21:02 |
DaemonFC | but there's a beta of 9.7 that's now freeware | Aug 29 21:02 |
schestowitz | http://robertmh.wordpress.com/2009/08/27/the-economics-of-smoke/ "I heard a reputable economist speak on TV. He came to say US economic recovery is fundamentally based on “innovation”. He sounded pretty convinced that this is going to restore it in a few years." | Aug 29 21:03 |
DaemonFC | Holly wood using Linux? | Aug 29 21:03 |
DaemonFC | *Hollywood | Aug 29 21:03 |
DaemonFC | they're mostly Mac I though | Aug 29 21:04 |
MinceR | well, you thought wrong | Aug 29 21:04 |
DaemonFC | what professional video editing stuff runs on Linux? | Aug 29 21:04 |
MinceR | ever heard of cinepaint? | Aug 29 21:04 |
DaemonFC | I haven't seen any | Aug 29 21:04 |
DaemonFC | are they using their own applications? | Aug 29 21:04 |
MinceR | or rendering farms? | Aug 29 21:04 |
DaemonFC | yeah, it looks like they use their own software | Aug 29 21:05 |
DaemonFC | http://news.softpedia.com/news/Hollywood-Loves-Linux-45571.shtml | Aug 29 21:06 |
schestowitz | Slackware is still kde-based, right? | Aug 29 21:06 |
schestowitz | I think there was some backlash a while ago | Aug 29 21:06 |
schestowitz | "I remember with great fondness the KDE 4.0 release event, including how Volkerding joined us in Palo Alto not only for the technical side of the event but also to get down with some post-event karaoke at a local bar. Awesome fun." | Aug 29 21:06 |
schestowitz | http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2009/08/slackware-13.html | Aug 29 21:06 |
DaemonFC | "the whole movie was rendered and touched up with the help of custom made software which ran on Linux systems." | Aug 29 21:06 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: no, Linux | Aug 29 21:06 |
schestowitz | Used to be Solaris | Aug 29 21:06 |
DaemonFC | They're using RHEL as a cheap platform for software they would have to develop anyway" | Aug 29 21:06 |
schestowitz | Hollywood isn't PR agencies | Aug 29 21:06 |
schestowitz | They don't need Macs | Aug 29 21:06 |
schestowitz | They have proprietary s/w for Linux | Aug 29 21:07 |
schestowitz | RHEL | Aug 29 21:07 |
schestowitz | Oh | Aug 29 21:07 |
schestowitz | Beat me to it, I see... | Aug 29 21:07 |
schestowitz | Yes, they use long-term supported plats | Aug 29 21:07 |
DaemonFC | that's what I was saying, I haven't seen any good video editing software on Linux, maybe good for editing home movies or low budget projects | Aug 29 21:07 |
schestowitz | RHEL can offer patches for like 8 years | Aug 29 21:08 |
DaemonFC | but nothing like the kind of effects you see in a $100 million blockbuster | Aug 29 21:08 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: well, that's expensive s/w | Aug 29 21:08 |
schestowitz | And Linux is reliable | Aug 29 21:08 |
schestowitz | RealNetworks use Linux | Aug 29 21:08 |
DaemonFC | yeah, Helix | Aug 29 21:08 |
schestowitz | They use to use Windows, but it crashes a lot | Aug 29 21:08 |
schestowitz | http://www.archive.org/download/e-dv037_dls_4_foreman_00-00_005.ogg/e-dv037_dls_4_foreman_00-00_005.ogv | Aug 29 21:08 |
schestowitz | http://www.archive.org/download/e-dv037_dls_4_foreman_00-00_004.ogg/e-dv037_dls_4_foreman_00-00_004.ogv | Aug 29 21:08 |
schestowitz | I\m gonna post these videos soon | Aug 29 21:08 |
schestowitz | Real GM says they use Linux cause it's better | Aug 29 21:09 |
schestowitz | Lesser known stories | Aug 29 21:09 |
schestowitz | No PR for GNU | Aug 29 21:09 |
DaemonFC | I haven't had the RTM version of Windows 7 collapse on me yet | Aug 29 21:09 |
DaemonFC | the betas and the RC were flaky at times | Aug 29 21:09 |
schestowitz | blockbuster films use s/w few would buy | Aug 29 21:09 |
schestowitz | Maybe the price tags would be 6-figure costs | Aug 29 21:09 |
DaemonFC | well, nobody would buy it because it's really overkill for what most people would do with it anyway | Aug 29 21:10 |
schestowitz | Trading platforms too, I reckon | Aug 29 21:10 |
schestowitz | If you make huge bloated s/w for just 50 clients worldwide, then it ought to cost a lot | Aug 29 21:10 |
schestowitz | Not the MS-type s/w | Aug 29 21:10 |
schestowitz | $100k, not $100 | Aug 29 21:10 |
DaemonFC | right, Windows isn't used by 50 people | Aug 29 21:11 |
schestowitz | Microsoft's OS is now worth like $1 | Aug 29 21:11 |
DaemonFC | more like hundreds of millions | Aug 29 21:11 |
schestowitz | And they give Vista 7 for free trial | Aug 29 21:11 |
DaemonFC | but it still costs hundreds of dollars each | Aug 29 21:11 |
schestowitz | Like 4 months IIRC | Aug 29 21:11 |
schestowitz | Getting people stuck and 'addicted' | Aug 29 21:11 |
schestowitz | But wait | Aug 29 21:11 |
schestowitz | Can't people just reinstall every 4 months and use trial version? | Aug 29 21:11 |
schestowitz | As in time limited? | Aug 29 21:11 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Lord Mandelson: “Taking something for nothing is wrong” --– No, not expenses, data. http://tinyurl.com/nn7v6h #piracy #tpb #torrents #fact | Aug 29 21:11 | |
schestowitz | Does it register people's h/w specs to prevent this? | Aug 29 21:11 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Yeah, you could | Aug 29 21:11 |
DaemonFC | no, it doesn't | Aug 29 21:12 |
schestowitz | Heh | Aug 29 21:12 |
schestowitz | Trouible ahead | Aug 29 21:12 |
schestowitz | Office too | Aug 29 21:12 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: If you're going to just use the grace period, download Windows Server | Aug 29 21:12 |
schestowitz | Apps loses them HUGE customers | Aug 29 21:12 |
DaemonFC | and you get 6 months | Aug 29 21:12 |
schestowitz | DC, Motorola, NZ national post.. | Aug 29 21:12 |
schestowitz | Now they just smear Google and have a plot to assassinate the company | Aug 29 21:12 |
schestowitz | Time to send Microsoft execs to a prison sentence | Aug 29 21:12 |
DaemonFC | Microsoft is using the same keys for every Windows Server trial now | Aug 29 21:13 |
schestowitz | Organised crime is still a crime | Aug 29 21:13 |
DaemonFC | they'll activate Windows for 180 days | Aug 29 21:13 |
schestowitz | I haven't activates Mandriva yet | Aug 29 21:13 |
DaemonFC | so I suppose you could use your 30 day grace period, your 3 rearms, and then slap in a trial key on the last day | Aug 29 21:13 |
schestowitz | I must be doing something wrong | Aug 29 21:13 |
schestowitz | "Mr Data, Activate!" | Aug 29 21:13 |
DaemonFC | you'd get 300 days before you have to reinstall | Aug 29 21:13 |
DaemonFC | and you haven't actually done anything illegal | Aug 29 21:14 |
DaemonFC | so that gives you about 10 months | Aug 29 21:14 |
schestowitz | Here he is activating Windows 7: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urcO5OzKwPo | Aug 29 21:14 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: http://databsod.ytmnd.com/ | Aug 29 21:15 |
DaemonFC | http://www.abclinuxu.cz/clanky/rozhovory/opera-jon-s.-von-tetzchner?page=1 | Aug 29 21:18 |
DaemonFC | there's a newer interview with Opera's CEO | Aug 29 21:18 |
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schestowitz | Eek. | Aug 29 21:20 |
schestowitz | load average: 14.51, 4.25, 1.90 | Aug 29 21:20 |
DaemonFC | "My impression is that if we were to open source Opera, some people would be able to look at our source code and they could potentially help us. I think still most of the work would be done by us. Just like it actually is with the other major open source projects. If you want to contribute to one of the open source projects it's not all that easy in practice. Because there's someone as a gatekeeper who controls it." | Aug 29 21:20 |
DaemonFC | and that brings about forks too, like FunPidgin/Carrier, which didn't go anywhere unfortunately | Aug 29 21:21 |
DaemonFC | or when Pidgin decided to stop working on voice and video because they didn't have those kinds of resources | Aug 29 21:22 |
DaemonFC | the problem is that not everyone is a programmer, I can use Pidgin, it's obvious to any user that it's not complete, but yet I can't fix it because I am not a programmer | Aug 29 21:23 |
DaemonFC | so having the source code or having a binary is the same thing to me | Aug 29 21:23 |
MinceR | so stop whining and start using live messenger already. | Aug 29 21:23 |
MinceR | and leave us alone. | Aug 29 21:23 |
schestowitz | QUOTE: If you had 30 seconds to tell someone why it matters that FOSS succeed in taking dominant market share over Microsoft, what would you tell them? | Aug 29 21:24 |
schestowitz | If you had to 2 minutes to tell a story as to the same thing, what story would you tell? If forgot to stipulate that you can't use any industry terms or abbreviations or acronyms or jargon in telling the two items below. It must be all in layperson's terms. | Aug 29 21:24 |
MinceR | it's not like anyone is forcing you to use FLOSS. | Aug 29 21:24 |
schestowitz | /UNQUOTE | Aug 29 21:24 |
schestowitz | MinceR: the opposite is true | Aug 29 21:24 |
schestowitz | People are forced to buy Windows with a... well, HARDWARE | Aug 29 21:24 |
MinceR | i know, but DaemonFC doesn't know. | Aug 29 21:24 |
amarsh04 | slight difference... I'm not a C programmer, but I can rebuild code that others have provided - otherwise I couldn't run xmms 1.2 any more | Aug 29 21:24 |
DaemonFC | competition is important from the standpoint that it gives your customers a nuclear option | Aug 29 21:24 |
DaemonFC | it keeps you honest where you *have* to be | Aug 29 21:25 |
schestowitz | xmms crashed for me | Aug 29 21:25 |
schestowitz | I emptied ..xmms for a new settings profile to be built, but no happiness | Aug 29 21:25 |
schestowitz | Other than those random crashes it works well | Aug 29 21:25 |
schestowitz | Weird... cause on Ubuntu it would run for months not crashing | Aug 29 21:25 |
DaemonFC | when Microsoft does improve bits of Windows or doesn't clamp down on you with DRM where they otherwise could have, I think it's because they don't want to back you into a corner | Aug 29 21:26 |
DaemonFC | and that's why you haven't seen DRM really get in your face as much as they wanted to with "Palladium" | Aug 29 21:27 |
MinceR | lol | Aug 29 21:27 |
amarsh04 | I've rebuilt xmms 1:1.2.10+20061101 on Debian unstable i386 and it's fairly well behaved | Aug 29 21:27 |
MinceR | no, palladium didn't go that far because the hw companies didn't like the idea that much | Aug 29 21:27 |
DaemonFC | You keep hearing the FSF shout that the sky is falling, but I've never encoded any media with DRM | Aug 29 21:27 |
DaemonFC | I've never purchased any DRM'd files | Aug 29 21:27 |
MinceR | not everybody liked the idea of "hey, let's put a backdoor that m$ can use into every PC from now on!" | Aug 29 21:28 |
DaemonFC | if you pop in a CD and rip it into Windows Media out of ignorance, that's your problem | Aug 29 21:28 |
schestowitz | I need to run "soundwrapper xmms %U" | Aug 29 21:28 |
DaemonFC | it's not cause there are no choices | Aug 29 21:28 |
amarsh04 | are you on a machine running pulseaudio, schestowitz? | Aug 29 21:29 |
DaemonFC | Ogg files play on Windows with a 2 MB plugin or just about any other player | Aug 29 21:29 |
schestowitz | amarsh04: yes | Aug 29 21:29 |
amarsh04 | I'm glad I haven't had to deal with pulseaudio yet | Aug 29 21:29 |
DaemonFC | and there's Blu Ray ripping software for Windows that Microsoft can't stop you from using | Aug 29 21:30 |
schestowitz | I had to change my xbindkeys file to reflect on it | Aug 29 21:30 |
DaemonFC | and SecuROM removers for games | Aug 29 21:30 |
MinceR | pulseaudio sucks | Aug 29 21:31 |
schestowitz | Swedish Regulators Say The Word 'bank' Not Allowed In Any Domain Names... Except If You're A Bank < http://techdirt.com/articles/20090827/1929016027.shtml >. Yeah, that'll stop the fraud... | Aug 29 21:31 |
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trmanco | pulseaudio works great | Aug 29 21:31 |
DaemonFC | icck | Aug 29 21:31 |
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trmanco | it does | Aug 29 21:31 |
DaemonFC | bullshit | Aug 29 21:31 |
trmanco | wtf | Aug 29 21:32 |
DaemonFC | everytime they get something to work with it, it breaks something else | Aug 29 21:32 |
trmanco | opserv kick me if I'm lying :-P | Aug 29 21:32 |
trmanco | nah | Aug 29 21:32 |
trmanco | that's not my case | Aug 29 21:32 |
schestowitz | A Hunger Strike Isn't A New Business Model And It Won't Stop File Sharing < http://techdirt.com/articles/20090827/0302056018.shtml > | Aug 29 21:33 |
schestowitz | Good headlien | Aug 29 21:33 |
trmanco | it's been working great on my machine since 8.10 | Aug 29 21:33 |
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trmanco | I actually disabled it on 8.04 because it had some strange problems | Aug 29 21:33 |
DaemonFC | yeah, well, you aren't trying to stream with VLC | Aug 29 21:33 |
trmanco | then enabled it again | Aug 29 21:33 |
schestowitz | pulseaudio -- what is it that breaks for people? | Aug 29 21:33 |
DaemonFC | Pulseaudio effectively makes that impossible unless you uninstall it | Aug 29 21:33 |
schestowitz | I still try to figure it out | Aug 29 21:33 |
trmanco | VLC is a a QT app | Aug 29 21:33 |
trmanco | I don't mix sorry | Aug 29 21:33 |
DaemonFC | so? | Aug 29 21:33 |
schestowitz | No worse than alsa in ubuntu 7.094 | Aug 29 21:33 |
schestowitz | *7.04 | Aug 29 21:33 |
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trmanco | alsa had sound crackling problems on 7.04 | Aug 29 21:34 |
trmanco | and it still does | Aug 29 21:34 |
DaemonFC | and it has them even worse now | Aug 29 21:34 |
DaemonFC | :D | Aug 29 21:34 |
trmanco | if you play doom, you can see that stuff happen | Aug 29 21:34 |
schestowitz | I guess people forgot about Windows | Aug 29 21:34 |
DaemonFC | some of the more cutting edge distributions are getting over that just because Pulseaudio made it intolerable | Aug 29 21:34 |
schestowitz | The audio there locks uop | Aug 29 21:34 |
MinceR | schestowitz: it breaks the high-level api of alsa, with doing so it also breaks dmix | Aug 29 21:35 |
DaemonFC | and the Linux developers are fixing ALSA | Aug 29 21:35 |
trmanco | it's recommended to disable pcm | Aug 29 21:35 |
schestowitz | In Windows 98 it occasionally requird a reboot | Aug 29 21:35 |
schestowitz | Not re-login | Aug 29 21:35 |
MinceR | schestowitz: and if the system load is high, it makes sound skip like it isn't funny | Aug 29 21:35 |
schestowitz | Reboot | Aug 29 21:35 |
schestowitz | For stupid sound issues | Aug 29 21:35 |
schestowitz | Maybe it's still there in Windows, who knows? | Aug 29 21:35 |
MinceR | so basically it reimplements dmix in a screwed-up way | Aug 29 21:35 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Windows has had user mode audio since Vista | Aug 29 21:35 |
schestowitz | Vista got worse than XP, sound-wise | Aug 29 21:35 |
DaemonFC | it hardly ever glitches in Windows 7 now, but even Vista was better about it than XP | Aug 29 21:35 |
trmanco | I'ts hard to admit, but I think it actually improved sound-wise | Aug 29 21:36 |
trmanco | vista | Aug 29 21:36 |
DaemonFC | it did | Aug 29 21:36 |
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DaemonFC | XP's sound mixer was terrible | Aug 29 21:36 |
schestowitz | bash-3.2$ soundwrapper xmms %U | Aug 29 21:36 |
schestowitz | E: shm.c: Invalid shared memory segment size | Aug 29 21:36 |
trmanco | that was actually one thing they did right | Aug 29 21:36 |
schestowitz | It's still running | Aug 29 21:36 |
trmanco | :| | Aug 29 21:36 |
trmanco | use muc | Aug 29 21:36 |
schestowitz | But not perfectly operational | Aug 29 21:36 |
trmanco | :-p | Aug 29 21:37 |
DaemonFC | Windows 2003/XP x64 had some improvements | Aug 29 21:37 |
trmanco | why the soundwrapper thingy? | Aug 29 21:37 |
schestowitz | pulse | Aug 29 21:37 |
DaemonFC | fixed the glitching but still no per application volume controls | Aug 29 21:37 |
trmanco | DaemonFC, no it didn't | Aug 29 21:37 |
trmanco | in the xp land 32 bit has the best sound | Aug 29 21:37 |
DaemonFC | not in my experience | Aug 29 21:37 |
trmanco | ok | Aug 29 21:38 |
DaemonFC | probably all depends on the drivers you have | Aug 29 21:38 |
DaemonFC | Intel's HDA audio drivers are pretty straightforward | Aug 29 21:38 |
schestowitz | xmms: pulsecore/mutex-posix.c:92: pa_mutex_lock: Assertion `pthread_mutex_lock(&m->mutex) == 0' failed. | Aug 29 21:38 |
trmanco | let me check hardware | Aug 29 21:38 |
trmanco | schestowitz, what version? | Aug 29 21:38 |
DaemonFC | I could see where you might run into problems with more complicated sound cards | Aug 29 21:39 |
trmanco | I don't think xmms is compatible with it | Aug 29 21:39 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: XMMS is basically abandonware at this point | Aug 29 21:39 |
schestowitz | trmanco: 1.2 | Aug 29 21:39 |
DaemonFC | Audacious is the only semi-current fork | Aug 29 21:39 |
trmanco | Intel Corporation 82801G (ICH7 Family) High Definition Audio Controller | Aug 29 21:39 |
DaemonFC | I have a Intel G33 board | Aug 29 21:40 |
DaemonFC | ICH9 | Aug 29 21:40 |
DaemonFC | so it's quite a bit newer | Aug 29 21:40 |
trmanco | yeah, my hardware is old | Aug 29 21:40 |
trmanco | from 2005 | Aug 29 21:40 |
trmanco | damn machine hasn't given my a problem | Aug 29 21:40 |
trmanco | :D | Aug 29 21:40 |
trmanco | and it has been though a lot | Aug 29 21:40 |
*amarsh04 is on a 1998 era machine | Aug 29 21:40 | |
trmanco | back when I was a "heavy windows gamer" | Aug 29 21:41 |
DaemonFC | it also has S/PDIF and 7.1 channel support | Aug 29 21:41 |
DaemonFC | it's pretty decent for an integrated chipset | Aug 29 21:41 |
trmanco | mine has s/pdif with 5.1 | Aug 29 21:41 |
amarsh04 | old computer to me means PDP-11 | Aug 29 21:41 |
amarsh04 | or older | Aug 29 21:41 |
DaemonFC | I still have Windows 98 | Aug 29 21:41 |
trmanco | that junk? | Aug 29 21:42 |
DaemonFC | as a gag I ran it on a 3.8 Ghz Pentium 4 Extreme Edition CPU | Aug 29 21:42 |
DaemonFC | with 4 gigs of RAM | Aug 29 21:42 |
DaemonFC | :D | Aug 29 21:42 |
trmanco | and the os just exploded | Aug 29 21:42 |
DaemonFC | nope, it still worked | Aug 29 21:42 |
trmanco | it's too fast :-P | Aug 29 21:42 |
DaemonFC | it doesn't have any SMP support | Aug 29 21:42 |
DaemonFC | so multicore processors would only be seen as a uniprocessor system by Windows 98 | Aug 29 21:43 |
DaemonFC | it'll still boot up on a Core 2 Duo though | Aug 29 21:43 |
trmanco | http://www.linux-gamers.net/modules/news/article.php?storyid=2602 | Aug 29 21:43 |
DaemonFC | Windows 2000 supports dual core CPUs | Aug 29 21:43 |
DaemonFC | through the same mechanism that was intended for dual socket motherboards | Aug 29 21:44 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Warsow 0.5 released: http://is.gd/2Gsbf | Aug 29 21:44 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] /me pensa seriamente em *mudar* para KDE #kde | Aug 29 21:44 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] found oyster card. leaving at last! | Aug 29 21:48 | |
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schestowitz | I think I got xmms under control | Aug 29 21:53 |
schestowitz | It has some nice kde panel app that I love cause it's light, fast, has global accelerators, and quick db lookup | Aug 29 21:53 |
schestowitz | All in just a few megs of ram | Aug 29 21:53 |
schestowitz | http://identi.ca/notice/9048076 "FSF did some anti-Apple campaigns too. Personally I worry more about Apple becase they have user loyalty; Microsoft doesn't" | Aug 29 21:56 |
ziggyfish | http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090829110124793 | Aug 29 21:58 |
_goblin | Microsoft loyalty does exist - they just have to pay for it, thats all. | Aug 29 21:58 |
trmanco | yes | Aug 29 21:58 |
schestowitz | Many headlines out there about Nokia's Linux http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2009/08/28/tech-today-data-deluge-swamps-scientists-nokia-phones-to-use-linux-more/ http://www.techtree.com/India/News/Samsung_To_Make_Own_Smartphone_OS/551-105874-580.html | Aug 29 22:00 |
schestowitz | _goblin: pay for the loyalty, not the product :-) | Aug 29 22:00 |
schestowitz | They say Apple has fans and Microsoft has shils | Aug 29 22:00 |
schestowitz | The reality is that Apple too engages in the whole "evangelism" nonesense | Aug 29 22:00 |
schestowitz | Apple also use the anti-Microsoft sentiment | Aug 29 22:01 |
schestowitz | And those who want to be different | Aug 29 22:01 |
schestowitz | Just watch those Mac ads | Aug 29 22:01 |
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twitter1 | this network sucks. ssh seems to be blocked. | Aug 29 22:06 |
schestowitz | The apache incident had ssh to blame... looke like negligence | Aug 29 22:06 |
DaemonFC | hmmmm | Aug 29 22:06 |
schestowitz | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/08/28/apache_hack/ | Aug 29 22:06 |
DaemonFC | Foobar2000 takes less RAM to play Vorbis than MP3 actually | Aug 29 22:06 |
DaemonFC | 30 megs | Aug 29 22:07 |
twitter1 | I never use keys, always password authorization. | Aug 29 22:07 |
twitter1 | interesting that should happen one day before I complain about ssh blockage. | Aug 29 22:07 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: Linux version = ??? | Aug 29 22:07 |
DaemonFC | nope | Aug 29 22:07 |
DaemonFC | it mostly runs in Wine | Aug 29 22:08 |
twitter1 | I'll have to see about listening on a non standard port. | Aug 29 22:08 |
DaemonFC | the parts that don't are because of limitations in Wine | Aug 29 22:08 |
twitter1 | When I signed onto this network, it mentioned something about the owner's "right" to monitor my traffic in any way. That's fine, so long as I can encrypt my traffic. | Aug 29 22:08 |
twitter1 | "Let them eat static." | Aug 29 22:09 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: it's useless to me then :P | Aug 29 22:09 |
DaemonFC | meh | Aug 29 22:09 |
DaemonFC | it's one of the better music players/encoders out there | Aug 29 22:09 |
MinceR | twitter1: make sure you check the ssh key fingerprint then. :> | Aug 29 22:10 |
DaemonFC | the only thing that just flat out doesn't work on Linux at all is MP3 encoding with LAME | Aug 29 22:10 |
twitter1 | What do you mean MinceR? | Aug 29 22:10 |
MinceR | ssh checks the public key if it knows it already; but if none of these checks happen, then you could be the subject of an MITM attack | Aug 29 22:10 |
twitter1 | ah yes, that's right | Aug 29 22:10 |
DaemonFC | AAC encoding with Nero and Ogg Vorbis encoding with AoTuv both work | Aug 29 22:10 |
twitter1 | OpenSSH does that. | Aug 29 22:10 |
DaemonFC | it can also use the Windows Flac encoder just fine | Aug 29 22:11 |
twitter1 | gives me a big fat warning and dumps the session when something changes. | Aug 29 22:11 |
DaemonFC | that particular issue is likely a bug in LAME | Aug 29 22:11 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: not saying it isn't good, | Aug 29 22:12 |
twitter1 | ziggyfish, you would be better off not listening to devils and demons | Aug 29 22:12 |
ziggyfish | twitter1: lol | Aug 29 22:12 |
DaemonFC | it can encode to just about any format that has a command line encoder | Aug 29 22:12 |
DaemonFC | and it has tons of extensions | Aug 29 22:13 |
_Goblin_ | DaemonFC why do you come here when you are the only one loving Windows? | Aug 29 22:13 |
_Goblin_ | wouldnt Microsoft.com be a better place to hang out. | Aug 29 22:13 |
DaemonFC | I even worked out a set of commands to let it hook into the Windows Media encoder through a VBS script | Aug 29 22:13 |
_Goblin_ | lol | Aug 29 22:14 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: I'm just saying I use Linux exclusively, so for me to use that I would have to buy Windows and I don't want to do that | Aug 29 22:14 |
_Goblin_ | nobody does | Aug 29 22:14 |
DaemonFC | I don't buy it | Aug 29 22:14 |
_Goblin_ | thats going to be 7s problem...nobody wants to pay for it. | Aug 29 22:14 |
DaemonFC | they dump license keys on me for more products of theirs than I even care about | Aug 29 22:14 |
DaemonFC | I give away license keys I don't have a use for | Aug 29 22:15 |
_Goblin_ | wow.....and no thanks. | Aug 29 22:15 |
twitter1 | Hi, DeamonFC. I thought the M$ people were busy harassing you with homophobic comments on your blogs. | Aug 29 22:15 |
twitter1 | I can believe they were. | Aug 29 22:15 |
_Goblin_ | whats Daemons blog url? | Aug 29 22:16 |
DaemonFC | I strongly suspect that was either them or Comcast | Aug 29 22:16 |
twitter1 | I'm not sure anymore, but I saved the youtube clip. | Aug 29 22:16 |
DaemonFC | I haven't actually given either of them a reason to like me | Aug 29 22:16 |
twitter1 | Other than promoting windows here? | Aug 29 22:16 |
DaemonFC | promoting? | Aug 29 22:17 |
_Goblin_ | yep | Aug 29 22:17 |
_Goblin_ | badly | Aug 29 22:17 |
twitter1 | Tirelessly mentioning how great it is. Posting screenshots of Vista. That kind of promoting. | Aug 29 22:17 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: what's your blogs URL | Aug 29 22:17 |
_Goblin_ | he'll ignore that one | Aug 29 22:17 |
_Goblin_ | or change the subject | Aug 29 22:18 |
_Goblin_ | lets see..... | Aug 29 22:18 |
_Goblin_ | hello? Daemon???? URL please? | Aug 29 22:18 |
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_Goblin_ | at last | Aug 29 22:19 |
*_Goblin_ is now known as _Goblin | Aug 29 22:19 | |
_Goblin | DaemonFC: You still here? | Aug 29 22:19 |
_Goblin | lol | Aug 29 22:19 |
DaemonFC | I don't even have Vista installed on anything currently, actually | Aug 29 22:20 |
ziggyfish | is that how we get rid of DaemonFC when we want to, just ask for his blog URL | Aug 29 22:20 |
DaemonFC | and yes I am still here | Aug 29 22:20 |
_Goblin | there you go ziggyfish...... | Aug 29 22:20 |
_Goblin | he changes the subject | Aug 29 22:20 |
_Goblin | or ignores | Aug 29 22:20 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: URL for blog = ??? | Aug 29 22:20 |
_Goblin | or both | Aug 29 22:20 |
_Goblin | DaemonFC whats your URL? | Aug 29 22:20 |
DaemonFC | http://izanbardprince.wordpress.com/ | Aug 29 22:20 |
DaemonFC | :D | Aug 29 22:20 |
ziggyfish | thank you | Aug 29 22:20 |
_Goblin | steady....we don't know yet if its his. | Aug 29 22:21 |
_Goblin | quick email to the author... | Aug 29 22:21 |
twitter1 | that's what he's claimed before .... never thought to check, ha ha. | Aug 29 22:21 |
ziggyfish | it could be, he's got the same real name as the blog | Aug 29 22:22 |
_Goblin | just posted a comment on the latest article.... | Aug 29 22:22 |
_Goblin | go on daemon....respond to it. | Aug 29 22:23 |
twitter1 | I forgot to wish DaemonFC a happy Zazibar War day. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Zanzibar_War | Aug 29 22:23 |
schestowitz | Neutron Bomb < http://www.cringely.com/2009/08/neutron-bomb/ > | Aug 29 22:24 |
_Goblin | DaemonFC: Ive just posted a comment on your blog.....why not respond and prove its yours? | Aug 29 22:24 |
schestowitz | _Goblin: it's his | Aug 29 22:26 |
schestowitz | For sure | Aug 29 22:26 |
schestowitz | He promotes Windows here | Aug 29 22:26 |
schestowitz | Whether for pay or not | Aug 29 22:26 |
schestowitz | He hardly touches Linux | Aug 29 22:26 |
schestowitz | Just MSDN membership, Microsoft freebies, alphas and stuff | Aug 29 22:26 |
_Goblin | lol... | Aug 29 22:27 |
_Goblin | I'll keep that URL I think then... | Aug 29 22:27 |
schestowitz | He likes talking about Linux... how it "doesn't work" and stiff | Aug 29 22:27 |
schestowitz | The reassurance and self-defense of one's preference | Aug 29 22:27 |
schestowitz | Reinforcing his own choices | Aug 29 22:27 |
_Goblin | lol.....no wonder he gets so many product keys | Aug 29 22:28 |
schestowitz | He's not a shill, I doubt it, but sometimes he gets annoyingly provocative (i.e. trolling) | Aug 29 22:28 |
twitter1 | It's interesting that he does not back up his ownership of his blog. | Aug 29 22:28 |
schestowitz | He must remember it's a pro-Linus site | Aug 29 22:28 |
DaemonFC | http://izanbardprince.wordpress.com/2009/08/28/wine-1-1-28-finally-supports-installing-securom-infected-games-without-crashing/#comments | Aug 29 22:28 |
schestowitz | Stop treating Linux like cheap WIndows | Aug 29 22:28 |
schestowitz | Then things will never crash | Aug 29 22:28 |
MinceR | do we really need to keep a troll around? | Aug 29 22:28 |
*schestowitz gives channel operator status to _Goblin | Aug 29 22:29 | |
ziggyfish | true | Aug 29 22:29 |
_Goblin | lol - thank you....nice blog you have there....Ill be visiting shortly to quote you on my articles... | Aug 29 22:29 |
schestowitz | I'll give Gob' op just in case | Aug 29 22:29 |
_Goblin | lol | Aug 29 22:29 |
_Goblin | thanks but I think Mincer is the better choice.... | Aug 29 22:29 |
twitter1 | bbl | Aug 29 22:29 |
DaemonFC | I did use Linux pretty exclusively before I got a new computer | Aug 29 22:29 |
schestowitz | No, he's MAD | Aug 29 22:29 |
DaemonFC | there was about 3 years where it's all I used | Aug 29 22:29 |
MinceR | nah, i'd kickban the troll calmly ;) | Aug 29 22:30 |
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schestowitz | It's like giving a rifle to an 18-yo... kinda like the US military when I come to think of it | Aug 29 22:30 |
_Goblin | and don't tell me....you found MS and saw the light.... | Aug 29 22:30 |
_Goblin | "I Love Linux but................." | Aug 29 22:30 |
_Goblin | "M$ is awfull but I love its products" | Aug 29 22:30 |
schestowitz | "I kow Linux" | Aug 29 22:30 |
_Goblin | common disclaimers when telling lies. | Aug 29 22:30 |
schestowitz | "Look at my Linuxxxx skillzzz" | Aug 29 22:30 |
schestowitz | But... | Aug 29 22:30 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: nice blog, but it's a bit depressing, are you trying to get people to commit suicide ? | Aug 29 22:30 |
DaemonFC | not really, it's just that Wine doesn't run all the Windows software I use | Aug 29 22:30 |
schestowitz | "Watch my screenshots.." | Aug 29 22:31 |
_Goblin | it runs more than XPM | Aug 29 22:31 |
schestowitz | [shows Vista, Vista 7, offers MSDN keys...] | Aug 29 22:31 |
ziggyfish | the colours are to grey | Aug 29 22:31 |
_Goblin | especially when DX is concerned. | Aug 29 22:31 |
DaemonFC | that's slowly getting better | Aug 29 22:31 |
_Goblin | what XPM and DX? Dont think so.....no DX support at all. | Aug 29 22:31 |
DaemonFC | I have my fingers crossed for Wine 1.2, which will be along presently | Aug 29 22:32 |
_Goblin | I have my fingers crossed that Microsoft will be departing presently. | Aug 29 22:32 |
DaemonFC | unfortunately, distributions tend to use old versions and official versions and mangled versions of things that I use pretty heavily | Aug 29 22:33 |
ziggyfish | "Wine 1.1.28 finally supports installing SecuROM-infected games without crashing" even though the title is negative, I find this a good thing. Wine is getting better | Aug 29 22:33 |
DaemonFC | and to get it to do what you want almost always involves compiling it yourself and building your own package | Aug 29 22:33 |
DaemonFC | media encoders mostly | Aug 29 22:33 |
DaemonFC | the reference libvorbis hasn't seen any significant inprovements since 1.1 was out | Aug 29 22:34 |
DaemonFC | they still use it though | Aug 29 22:34 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: 9/10 websites offer packages for nightly builds | Aug 29 22:34 |
DaemonFC | there's forks out there which are 10 times better | Aug 29 22:34 |
DaemonFC | (AoTuv) | Aug 29 22:34 |
DaemonFC | AoTuv gives source patches you can apply to the reference encoder | Aug 29 22:35 |
DaemonFC | the only binaries he posts are for Windows | Aug 29 22:35 |
DaemonFC | and Gstreamer uses its own plugins anyway | Aug 29 22:35 |
DaemonFC | so you're going to have to come up with a shell script after you apply the diffs and compile the encoder yourself | Aug 29 22:36 |
_Goblin | just thought Id check my version of Wine...... | Aug 29 22:36 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: url for AoTuv | Aug 29 22:36 |
_Goblin | yep...its .28 | Aug 29 22:36 |
DaemonFC | and you can't use any of the nice GUI tools that come with your distribution | Aug 29 22:36 |
DaemonFC | http://www.geocities.jp/aoyoume/aotuv/ | Aug 29 22:36 |
_Goblin | ahhhh geocities... | Aug 29 22:37 |
DaemonFC | that one guy is probably the only reason Vorbis is useful | Aug 29 22:37 |
DaemonFC | especially at mid or low bitrates | Aug 29 22:37 |
schestowitz | DOes MS have any major releases before Oct? | Aug 29 22:37 |
schestowitz | If not, expect revenue to drop shrply again | Aug 29 22:37 |
schestowitz | Double digit | Aug 29 22:37 |
DaemonFC | Xiph.org pretty much jsut rebranded AoTuv Beta 2 as libvorbis 1.1 | Aug 29 22:37 |
schestowitz | And profit to sink bya third again | Aug 29 22:38 |
DaemonFC | but that was years ago | Aug 29 22:38 |
schestowitz | *by a | Aug 29 22:38 |
schestowitz | Vista 7 won't change it | Aug 29 22:38 |
DaemonFC | and the reference encoder hasn't improved, quality wise, at all | Aug 29 22:38 |
_Goblin | thats why that cut some fat......should impact on the next set of figures... | Aug 29 22:38 |
DaemonFC | even though there are some pretty serious bugs | Aug 29 22:38 |
schestowitz | Too cheap, too little, too late, people don't buy new PCs | Aug 29 22:38 |
schestowitz | Software hardly wears out | Aug 29 22:38 |
schestowitz | People use XP and Linux | Aug 29 22:38 |
_Goblin | Roy: Have you seen Lord Mandelsons article on p2P? | Aug 29 22:38 |
ziggyfish | DaemonFC: AoTuv has no Linux support (official support) | Aug 29 22:38 |
DaemonFC | right, but you can compile it | Aug 29 22:39 |
schestowitz | _Goblin: I saw many | Aug 29 22:39 |
schestowitz | He met that Geffen scum | Aug 29 22:39 |
DaemonFC | so why don't distributions just do that? | Aug 29 22:39 |
_Goblin | its his Times article | Aug 29 22:39 |
schestowitz | The ;'rich club' conspires against the people | Aug 29 22:39 |
_Goblin | I think its today... | Aug 29 22:39 |
_Goblin | Ive done a followup one.... | Aug 29 22:39 |
schestowitz | "Lord" as in "oh lord, he's a sellout" | Aug 29 22:39 |
schestowitz | _Goblin: haven't gotten around to it yet | Aug 29 22:40 |
_Goblin | Lord Mandlebrot has some crackers......its a hoot. | Aug 29 22:40 |
schestowitz | BTW, don't let he demos derail the discussion | Aug 29 22:40 |
schestowitz | This is not about WIndows here | Aug 29 22:40 |
_Goblin | yep | Aug 29 22:40 |
DaemonFC | the RIAA and "partners" probably paid him for that | Aug 29 22:40 |
schestowitz | Deferred payment | Aug 29 22:41 |
schestowitz | Post-term | Aug 29 22:41 |
_Goblin | more likely F.A.C.T | Aug 29 22:41 |
schestowitz | or favours | Aug 29 22:41 |
schestowitz | Protections and he | Aug 29 22:41 |
schestowitz | Protections and help | Aug 29 22:41 |
DaemonFC | if Douglas Hogg had just used RIAA bribe money to clean his moat instead of taking it directly from public funds | Aug 29 22:41 |
schestowitz | "You give us x, we help you get elected in 2 years" | Aug 29 22:41 |
DaemonFC | there never would have been a scandal on the news | Aug 29 22:41 |
schestowitz | Bribery. FACT. | Aug 29 22:41 |
schestowitz | The word FACT does give them some validity | Aug 29 22:42 |
schestowitz | Unlike MAFIAA | Aug 29 22:42 |
DaemonFC | why, you ask? Because the same kind of people who bribe on behalf of RIAA and MPAA control the cable news networks too | Aug 29 22:42 |
DaemonFC | so taking bribes from them is safe | Aug 29 22:42 |
schestowitz | RIAA sounds like some Rifle association | Aug 29 22:42 |
schestowitz | NRA | Aug 29 22:42 |
schestowitz | Or the Irish 'militias' | Aug 29 22:42 |
_Goblin | Its funny though....FACT claim that the DVD sellers are involved in human trafficking, whilst Lord Mandelbrot wants to remove online filesharers....surely he is simply driving the average file sharer into the hands of the criminal??? | Aug 29 22:42 |
schestowitz | IRA | Aug 29 22:43 |
schestowitz | _Goblin: yes, people swap 1s and 0s in many ways | Aug 29 22:43 |
schestowitz | They'll always find ways to share... well, info | Aug 29 22:43 |
_Goblin | if FACT are to believed, all of lifes ills are to be blamed on piracy... | Aug 29 22:43 |
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schestowitz | _Goblin: terrorism too | Aug 29 22:44 |
_Goblin | yep...all the hot potato's of crime.... | Aug 29 22:44 |
schestowitz | Bin Laden must be setting up his P2p international chain | Aug 29 22:44 |
schestowitz | You know, to fund bombs and planes through Madonna d/ls :-) | Aug 29 22:44 |
ziggyfish | lol | Aug 29 22:44 |
DaemonFC | RIAA was saying law enforcement should get search warrants to investigate file sharers because they were likely running crack houses and prostitution rings too | Aug 29 22:44 |
DaemonFC | :D | Aug 29 22:44 |
DaemonFC | I am serious | Aug 29 22:44 |
schestowitz | BT said VoIP promotes terror~1 | Aug 29 22:45 |
schestowitz | The only terrorists are FACT | Aug 29 22:45 |
schestowitz | They do so bydefintion | Aug 29 22:45 |
schestowitz | The use of intimidation for political goals | Aug 29 22:45 |
schestowitz | That's FACT | Aug 29 22:45 |
schestowitz | That'\s MPAA | Aug 29 22:45 |
schestowitz | RIAA | Aug 29 22:45 |
schestowitz | Terrorists | Aug 29 22:45 |
_Goblin | I think you give them too much credit......I would say ignorant trouble makers is more like it. | Aug 29 22:45 |
schestowitz | They terrorise the government to change politics | Aug 29 22:45 |
ziggyfish | Someone one said that Linux funds terrorists, but the same has also been said for WIndows | Aug 29 22:46 |
_Goblin | I also want to know how a comercially funded organization can have the ear of the government and the Police. | Aug 29 22:46 |
schestowitz | _Goblin: just turn the table on them | Aug 29 22:46 |
schestowitz | Hypocrisy | Aug 29 22:46 |
schestowitz | They want to control the Web | Aug 29 22:46 |
schestowitz | And to maximise profit | Aug 29 22:46 |
schestowitz | As though it's all taken for granted | Aug 29 22:46 |
schestowitz | Remember laws exist to serve people | Aug 29 22:46 |
schestowitz | Not billionaires from Beverly Hills | Aug 29 22:46 |
schestowitz | People forgot this | Aug 29 22:46 |
_Goblin | Still, as I maintain, in UK law the act of downloading is not illegal, its simply the sharing of....people can alter their habbits accordingly. | Aug 29 22:46 |
schestowitz | Or miscomprehdn because of immense and overwhelming propaganda | Aug 29 22:47 |
_Goblin | NG's, IRC are two where its the sharer not the downloader who comits the offence. | Aug 29 22:47 |
schestowitz | ziggyfish: Windowsm fund racketeering | Aug 29 22:47 |
schestowitz | Just watch what Microsoft does to Linux | Aug 29 22:47 |
schestowitz | RICO Act applies here | Aug 29 22:47 |
schestowitz | People can 'smuggle' 1s and 0s. | Aug 29 22:48 |
schestowitz | Scary, innit? | Aug 29 22:48 |
schestowitz | FOrget about plutonium. | Aug 29 22:48 |
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*Balrog_ is now known as Balrog | Aug 29 22:54 | |
_Goblin | I'm going to going soon....work tomorrow & monday.... | Aug 29 22:59 |
_Goblin | :( | Aug 29 22:59 |
_Goblin | everyone think of me as you enjoy your bank holiday weekend.... | Aug 29 23:00 |
_Goblin | won't be back until tuesday.... | Aug 29 23:00 |
_Goblin | although I may get a little time sunday night.... | Aug 29 23:00 |
schestowitz | Microsoft tosses abandonware into pseudo-OSS: http://ostatic.com/blog/microsoft-opens-popfly-source-code | Aug 29 23:04 |
schestowitz | I forgot all about Bank Holiday | Aug 29 23:04 |
schestowitz | They need more holidays now too? :-) Are those bailouts (public looting) and bonuses not enough for them? | Aug 29 23:05 |
_Goblin | everyones on holiday but me :( | Aug 29 23:06 |
ziggyfish | schestowitz: it's the modern war | Aug 29 23:06 |
schestowitz | Many wars are caused by financial interests at the top | Aug 29 23:10 |
schestowitz | They are just dressed up and marketed a little differently | Aug 29 23:11 |
schestowitz | Domination of oil and power for example has little to do with ordinary people, who are mere clients of those who run the country | Aug 29 23:11 |
schestowitz | They give you a rifle and a casket to go fight the "war for consumption" | Aug 29 23:11 |
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seller_liar | I was thinking | Aug 29 23:13 |
seller_liar | the last strategy of trolls is to say " prove it" | Aug 29 23:13 |
schestowitz | Example? | Aug 29 23:14 |
seller_liar | of course , It's very hard to prove everything , but we can say | Aug 29 23:14 |
seller_liar | there's a lot of evidence | Aug 29 23:14 |
seller_liar | "there's a lot of evidence " | Aug 29 23:14 |
schestowitz | Evidence can be proof | Aug 29 23:14 |
schestowitz | Tautological soemtimes | Aug 29 23:15 |
schestowitz | It's proven the world is round | Aug 29 23:15 |
schestowitz | Based on observations | Aug 29 23:15 |
schestowitz | I.e. evidence | Aug 29 23:15 |
seller_liar | yes ,exactly | Aug 29 23:15 |
schestowitz | Less so with maths although there are explanations that relate the law of physics | Aug 29 23:15 |
schestowitz | Like circulating of planet... they revolve. | Aug 29 23:16 |
schestowitz | And gravity makes objects round | Aug 29 23:16 |
schestowitz | Like atoms and their neurons surrounding the nucleus like a satellite | Aug 29 23:16 |
schestowitz | As for Linux: | Aug 29 23:16 |
schestowitz | People may say, prove it fastr | Aug 29 23:16 |
schestowitz | Well, we have benchmarks | Aug 29 23:16 |
schestowitz | So you can show | Aug 29 23:16 |
schestowitz | There's evidence for many things | Aug 29 23:17 |
schestowitz | BN accumulates lots of evidence | Aug 29 23:17 |
seller_liar | Yes , I know | Aug 29 23:17 |
schestowitz | BN has very little of those posts that just go, "I like Linux, Linux is cool, WIndows is kinds slow...etc. | Aug 29 23:17 |
seller_liar | trolls sometimes don t have more defenses and say " prove it" | Aug 29 23:17 |
schestowitz | That's the type of crap that comes from ZDnet and CNET | Aug 29 23:17 |
schestowitz | "Columnists" | Aug 29 23:17 |
schestowitz | aka Shills for sale | Aug 29 23:17 |
schestowitz | You can hire them for opinions | Aug 29 23:17 |
schestowitz | Like PR people | Aug 29 23:18 |
schestowitz | Not evidence based. Marketing is never evidence based | Aug 29 23:18 |
schestowitz | That's what makes it marketing | Aug 29 23:18 |
schestowitz | There are marketing companies like IDC|IDC that are good at PRETENDING to give proof | Aug 29 23:19 |
schestowitz | But they are mouths for hire | Aug 29 23:19 |
schestowitz | It's marketing | Aug 29 23:19 |
MinceR | one of those Cs should be a G, i guess | Aug 29 23:19 |
schestowitz | -Gartner- Gangster Group too | Aug 29 23:19 |
schestowitz | Even academia gets increasingly corrupted | Aug 29 23:19 |
schestowitz | MinceR: aye | Aug 29 23:19 |
seller_liar | Yes , I know | Aug 29 23:19 |
seller_liar | I São Paulo ( the city) | Aug 29 23:19 |
schestowitz | Nice place | Aug 29 23:20 |
schestowitz | Culture didn't die there, yet | Aug 29 23:20 |
seller_liar | there are a company called PRODAM | Aug 29 23:20 |
schestowitz | Are the multinationals trying to turn you over to USian lifestyle? | Aug 29 23:20 |
seller_liar | PRODAM install windows in everything in são paulo prefecture | Aug 29 23:20 |
schestowitz | Coke and xbox? | Aug 29 23:20 |
seller_liar | PRODAM is a government company | Aug 29 23:20 |
schestowitz | Like Cosco? | Aug 29 23:21 |
seller_liar | but probably have a lot of "insiders" | Aug 29 23:21 |
schestowitz | Or what was its name? | Aug 29 23:21 |
seller_liar | Cosco ? I don t know | Aug 29 23:21 |
schestowitz | Contractors are a dodgy thing | Aug 29 23:21 |
schestowitz | GOvrnment companies still run like a business | Aug 29 23:21 |
seller_liar | but prodam is responsible for all IT in sao paulo prefecture | Aug 29 23:21 |
schestowitz | Case of point here: NHS, BBC.. | Aug 29 23:21 |
schestowitz | IT... | Aug 29 23:22 |
schestowitz | Where did the execs come from/ | Aug 29 23:22 |
schestowitz | Obvious some IT companies | Aug 29 23:22 |
schestowitz | Find out the names | Aug 29 23:22 |
schestowitz | Align them | Aug 29 23:22 |
schestowitz | Google each one | Aug 29 23:22 |
seller_liar | PRODAm have lot of microsoft "foxies and insiders" | Aug 29 23:22 |
schestowitz | Then put a label of career history | Aug 29 23:22 |
schestowitz | Ah | Aug 29 23:22 |
schestowitz | the "MSInsider|/"Fox" | Aug 29 23:22 |
seller_liar | yes | Aug 29 23:22 |
schestowitz | Microsoft Delta Team loves em | Aug 29 23:23 |
seller_liar | Everything prodam install on prefecture is windows based | Aug 29 23:23 |
schestowitz | They get free dinner | Aug 29 23:23 |
schestowitz | Who knows, maybe free prostitutes too | Aug 29 23:23 |
seller_liar | Sao paulo city is doomed because prodam | Aug 29 23:23 |
schestowitz | Find out names of insiders | Aug 29 23:23 |
schestowitz | Conflict of interetss | Aug 29 23:23 |
schestowitz | They can use chairs to buy from former employer | Aug 29 23:23 |
schestowitz | ANd thus be removed | Aug 29 23:23 |
_Goblin | right I'm off....may see you all Sunday but most likely it won't be until tuesday....depends on how busy I am..... | Aug 29 23:24 |
_Goblin | take care all. | Aug 29 23:24 |
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schestowitz | If you pass us the names of Microsoft insiders there, posts can be made just to explain who they are and what they do | Aug 29 23:24 |
schestowitz | We have those in the UK too | Aug 29 23:24 |
seller_liar | It's not easy to remove a goverment employer | Aug 29 23:24 |
seller_liar | but | Aug 29 23:24 |
schestowitz | Showing who they are just limits their ability to maneuver | Aug 29 23:24 |
schestowitz | They klnow they are being watched | Aug 29 23:25 |
schestowitz | seller_liar: not to remove | Aug 29 23:25 |
schestowitz | To explain to people who they are | Aug 29 23:25 |
schestowitz | Like Zuck | Aug 29 23:25 |
schestowitz | He hates me | Aug 29 23:25 |
seller_liar | who is zuck ? | Aug 29 23:25 |
schestowitz | Cause people find out easily who he serves | Aug 29 23:25 |
schestowitz | Zuck=top Microsoft lobbyist | Aug 29 23:25 |
schestowitz | Anti-ODF, pro-sw pats in Europe | Aug 29 23:25 |
schestowitz | Very grotesque man | Aug 29 23:25 |
seller_liar | are there some site about zuck? | Aug 29 23:26 |
schestowitz | Balmer's little helper | Aug 29 23:26 |
schestowitz | seller_liar: sort of | Aug 29 23:26 |
seller_liar | fuck zuck heheh | Aug 29 23:26 |
schestowitz | http://www.google.com/search?q=site:boycottnovell.com+zuck&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&ie=UTF-8&hl=en | Aug 29 23:26 |
seller_liar | thanks | Aug 29 23:26 |
schestowitz | http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&c2coff=1&q=Jonathan+Zuck&aq=f&oq=&aqi= | Aug 29 23:27 |
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schestowitz | So people see who he is very easily | Aug 29 23:27 |
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seller_liar | someone know about the last ubuntu alpha? | Aug 29 23:39 |
seller_liar | he contain more mono? or not? | Aug 29 23:39 |
schestowitz | Six months without X http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2009/08/28/six-months-without-x/ | Aug 29 23:43 |
schestowitz | seller_liar: no | Aug 29 23:43 |
schestowitz | SSH Key compromise takes Apache.org offline - Update 2 < http://www.h-online.com/open/SSH-Key-compromise-takes-Apache-org-offline-Update-2--/news/114115 > | Aug 29 23:44 |
schestowitz | what's your take on GOOG, seller_liar ? | Aug 29 23:44 |
seller_liar | what? | Aug 29 23:44 |
seller_liar | Ah, ok , I will search in google about this | Aug 29 23:45 |
schestowitz | Ubuntu 9.10 are we ready? < http://shanefagan.com/2009/08/29/ubuntu-910/ > | Aug 29 23:49 |
schestowitz | seller_liar: no, I meant, "what do you make of Google's dominance?" | Aug 29 23:50 |
schestowitz | I bet Google.br is the main route for many down south | Aug 29 23:50 |
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schestowitz | A year later, CodeWeavers urges free CrossOver users to pay up http://www.downloadsquad.com/2009/08/28/a-year-later-codeweavers-urges-free-crossover-users-to-pay-up/ | Aug 29 23:51 |
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