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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Eye on #Apple : Perfect Shiny Products http://ping.fm/P1WJw | Oct 16 00:13 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Gartner Lied About #Vista , So Why Should People Believe it Regarding #Vista 7 ? http://ping.fm/rhXkZ | Oct 16 00:14 | |
phIRCe | Title: Gartner Lied About Vista, So Why Should People Believe it Regarding Vista 7? | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 100.02 KB | Oct 16 00:14 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Photo: Parabéns ao @brunomiguel Tux penguin cake (via litlnemo) http://tumblr.com/xkj3jhsh4 | Oct 16 00:16 | |
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*ThistleWeb is listening to FLOSS with schestowitz | Oct 16 00:24 | |
trmanco | :) | Oct 16 00:24 |
trmanco | "No, it's kidding. | Oct 16 00:38 |
trmanco | I can tell by the pixels." | Oct 16 00:38 |
trmanco | LOL | Oct 16 00:38 |
ThistleWeb | I thought schestowitz woulda had a Macunian accent | Oct 16 00:38 |
trmanco | heh | Oct 16 00:39 |
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trmanco | http://www.maxim.com/humor/stupid-fun/84573/9-reasons-why-google-search-suggest-is-better-than-yahoo.html | Oct 16 00:44 |
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trmanco | http://www.darkreading.com/security/attacks/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=220600886&cid=RSSfeed | Oct 16 00:44 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft Hooks up with the Press and the #Government to Cement Protectionist Measures http://ping.fm/rOETv | Oct 16 00:50 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] A Win .exe seems well named, as a bad one of those can execute your Windows PC | Oct 16 00:53 | |
trmanco | !quit phIRCe | Oct 16 00:54 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Funny tests of search completion http://ping.fm/SJmVp (via @trmanco ) | Oct 16 00:54 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft Sued for Data Loss http://ping.fm/E9e7V #danger #sidekick #fail | Oct 16 01:25 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[tracyrreed] http://bit.ly/1XYOZk China fears the Internet as a threat to their dictatorship so much that they shut down Tor for National day! | Oct 16 01:30 | |
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DaemonFC | http://www.indianasnewscenter.com/news/local/64426252.html | Oct 16 02:32 |
DaemonFC | lmao | Oct 16 02:32 |
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schestowitz | Have you seized control of the lib's site yet? | Oct 16 02:46 |
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yuhong | schestowitz: Did you see my email on OS/2 that was sent to roy@schestowitz.com? | Oct 16 03:03 |
schestowitz | Let me check. | Oct 16 03:04 |
yuhong | It was a reply to Michael Necasek's email. | Oct 16 03:05 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Search is Still Slipping Through Microsoft’s Fingers http://ping.fm/U976P #bing #google | Oct 16 03:05 | |
yuhong | He is an expert on OS/2 | Oct 16 03:05 |
yuhong | My email address is yuhongbao_386@hotmail.com | Oct 16 03:09 |
schestowitz | yuhong: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/10/15/jeremy-allison-on-mono/comment-page-1/#comment-74215 | Oct 16 03:12 |
schestowitz | yuhong: oh, I got that message in the morning | Oct 16 03:12 |
Balrog_ | idk if it's a good idea to post email addresses in publicly logged IRC :\ | Oct 16 03:12 |
Balrog_ | that may be an invitation for spam | Oct 16 03:12 |
schestowitz | Totally forgot about it by now, thought you'd sent something else a moment ago | Oct 16 03:12 |
yuhong | I just noticed it. | Oct 16 03:12 |
schestowitz | Balrog_: agreed | Oct 16 03:12 |
schestowitz | my private mail address is not here though | Oct 16 03:13 |
yuhong | It is about OS/2 | Oct 16 03:13 |
yuhong | Did you read it? | Oct 16 03:14 |
yuhong | And what did you think? | Oct 16 03:17 |
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yuhong | Are you writing up a reply? | Oct 16 03:22 |
yuhong | OS/2 was not always MS's enemy. | Oct 16 03:22 |
Balrog_ | yuhong: OS/2 ? | Oct 16 03:22 |
Balrog_ | sounds interesting | Oct 16 03:22 |
yuhong | Yep. | Oct 16 03:22 |
cubezzz | wasn't OS/2 from Microsoft originally? | Oct 16 03:22 |
yuhong | Yep, exactly. | Oct 16 03:23 |
cubezzz | and Xenix, they seem to like to experiment with OSes | Oct 16 03:23 |
yuhong | To be more precise, it was developed jointly with IBM too under the JDA. | Oct 16 03:23 |
cubezzz | I'm sure that's still the case | Oct 16 03:23 |
cubezzz | I know that some Microsoft guys use FOSS | Oct 16 03:25 |
yuhong | http://pages.prodigy.net/michaln/history/index.html | Oct 16 03:25 |
yuhong | Has a good history of OS/ | Oct 16 03:25 |
yuhong | Has a good history of OS/2. | Oct 16 03:25 |
yuhong | Is also where i got the email address for Michael Necasek. | Oct 16 03:27 |
yuhong | Which I sent emails to. | Oct 16 03:27 |
yuhong | I wanted to forward this one also to schestowitz. | Oct 16 03:27 |
cubezzz | so anyone still doing OS/2 work? :) | Oct 16 03:28 |
yuhong | I forwarded one of my replies to him also to schestowitz, which I was asking schestowitz to check.. | Oct 16 03:28 |
cubezzz | Stallman was really thinking ahead | Oct 16 03:30 |
cubezzz | portable, 32-bit free operating system | Oct 16 03:31 |
cubezzz | except the HURD part ;-) | Oct 16 03:31 |
DaemonFC | cubezzz, He was just thinking beyond our lifetimes with HURD | Oct 16 03:31 |
DaemonFC | right? | Oct 16 03:31 |
DaemonFC | I mean what a visionary :D | Oct 16 03:31 |
cubezzz | I guess so | Oct 16 03:32 |
schestowitz | Mach was later adopted by Apple | Oct 16 03:33 |
schestowitz | Like over a decade later | Oct 16 03:33 |
cubezzz | Tanenbaum was going on about microkernels and how Linus wouldn't have done well in his operating system class | Oct 16 03:34 |
cubezzz | this is old, but still interesting: | Oct 16 03:37 |
cubezzz | http://blogs.pcworld.com/communityvoices/archives/2008/08/interview_with.html | Oct 16 03:37 |
cubezzz | X11 isn't the only windows system though | Oct 16 03:39 |
cubezzz | there's qtopia (old, probably morphed into something else) | Oct 16 03:39 |
schestowitz | I've always wondered about that | Oct 16 03:40 |
schestowitz | X has its problems but also its advantages | Oct 16 03:40 |
schestowitz | It's detachable and portable (ssh -X) | Oct 16 03:40 |
cubezzz | it's biggie piggie :) | Oct 16 03:40 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft #Patents at Risk Due to #FreeSoftware Prior Art; Opposition to Patents Grows http://ping.fm/Athg6 | Oct 16 03:40 | |
schestowitz | WIndows can only dream of some of these features | Oct 16 03:40 |
yuhong | I know. | Oct 16 03:41 |
schestowitz | But at the same time, some rendering can be slow in X like some JS stuff/Ajax, which might have something to do with browsers actually | Oct 16 03:41 |
cubezzz | there's even some PDA's that run X | Oct 16 03:41 |
cubezzz | I thought X systems was way ahead a long time ago | Oct 16 03:42 |
cubezzz | like when Waterloo had Sun4's | Oct 16 03:42 |
yuhong | And on MS/TomTom, here is a link on TechDirt. | Oct 16 03:43 |
yuhong | http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20090314/1226424116.shtml | Oct 16 03:43 |
yuhong | "TomTom Caught Between Microsoft Rock And GPL Hard Place" | Oct 16 03:43 |
yuhong | What do you think about this problem? | Oct 16 03:44 |
yuhong | http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2009/02/microsoft-sues-tomtom-over-fat-patents-in-linux-based-device.ars?comments=1&comment_id=711004537931 | Oct 16 03:45 |
yuhong | "Around 5 years ago he mentioned to me that Microsoft had knocked on their door, because the drives were shipped pre-formatted with FAT32. So this manufacturer used a setup where a "genuine" Windows box would format a drive of the required capacity, and this master would then be imaged onto every drive. Obviously this is a technicality in the extreme, but that's what was required to comply... | Oct 16 03:46 |
yuhong | ...with the patents. | Oct 16 03:46 |
yuhong | I'm sure it wasn't their ideal solution, of course, they'd probably have rather used a Linux box, or just generated the image algorithmically. There's been a few cases of pre-formatted drives shipping with viruses, malware, porn, whatever... likely because it's a Windows box generating that master image." | Oct 16 03:46 |
cubezzz | why even both with FAT? | Oct 16 03:46 |
yuhong | And that just for FORMATTING the drive, which technically should not infridge on the FAT LFN patents, because formatting do not write any FAT LFN entries. | Oct 16 03:46 |
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yuhong | cubezzz: Indeed, read the link I just posted above for a solution using ext4. | Oct 16 03:47 |
cubezzz | ok, is it possible to make windows boxes to read ext2 or ext3 partitions? | Oct 16 03:47 |
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yuhong | Yep, that is exactly what the comment advocates. | Oct 16 03:47 |
cubezzz | or just don't use windows at all, no biggie there | Oct 16 03:47 |
yuhong | Read the entire comment. | Oct 16 03:47 |
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cubezzz | yeah, I agree with what he says | Oct 16 03:51 |
cubezzz | too many companies are too wimpy to break away from the big M | Oct 16 03:51 |
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DaemonFC | Windows can read ext2 or ext3 with a third party driver | Oct 16 03:52 |
DaemonFC | but it's dangerous | Oct 16 03:52 |
DaemonFC | it doesn't recognize file permissions so you can modify any file on the partition in Windows | Oct 16 03:52 |
yuhong | Yep, the problem is that Windows and Unix file permissions are different. | Oct 16 03:53 |
cubezzz | actually microkernels do make sense | Oct 16 03:55 |
cubezzz | there's a lot less code that could bring down the entire OS | Oct 16 03:55 |
yuhong | I know. | Oct 16 03:55 |
*schestowitz FATAL ERROR. Sleep(99) && reb^H^H^H^H^H | Oct 16 03:55 | |
yuhong | And Intel and MS were not always friends. | Oct 16 03:57 |
yuhong | From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Architecture_Labs: | Oct 16 03:57 |
yuhong | "IAL pursued both hardware and software initiatives, but the latter became de-emphasized after the efforts collided with similar activities by Microsoft. For example, Native Signal Processing (NSP) was a software initiative to allow Intel-based PCs to run time-sensitive code independently of the operating system, allowing real-time audio and video processing on the microprocessors of the... | Oct 16 03:57 |
yuhong | ...mid-1990s. Microsoft refused to support NSP in its operating systems and convinced PC makers that the NSP drivers would render their systems unsupported, and Intel pulled back from promoting the software, leaving NSP as an orphan. IAL also tangled with Microsoft by supporting Netscape and their early browser, and by producing a fast native x86 port of the Java system. Most of these... | Oct 16 03:57 |
yuhong | ...projects were later shelved, and after 1997 IAL tended not to risk competing with Microsoft. The details of IAL's conflicts with Microsoft over software were revealed in Steven McGeady's testimony in the Microsoft anti-trust trial." | Oct 16 03:57 |
yuhong | http://partners.nytimes.com/library/tech/98/11/biztech/articles/16soft.html | Oct 16 03:58 |
cubezzz | who is MIcrosoft really "friends" with? | Oct 16 03:58 |
cubezzz | Adobe? SUN? Google? | Oct 16 03:59 |
cubezzz | not really eh? :) | Oct 16 03:59 |
cubezzz | I don't even think Ballmer and Gates like each other | Oct 16 03:59 |
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yuhong | Larry and Sergey did not like each other initially either. | Oct 16 04:00 |
yuhong | http://news.cnet.com/Intel-Microsoft-made-threats/2100-1001_3-217653.html | Oct 16 04:00 |
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JZA | people still here... interesting | Oct 16 05:07 |
JZA | hearing the twit show/interview. Pretty interesting. | Oct 16 05:07 |
JZA | I do notice Roy didnt got into the issues. | Oct 16 05:10 |
tessier | show/interview? | Oct 16 05:14 |
tessier | Some sort of podcast or what? | Oct 16 05:14 |
cubezzz | I don't particularly like the term podcast | Oct 16 05:15 |
tessier | Why? | Oct 16 05:15 |
JZA | tessier: because it ties to the ipod | Oct 16 05:15 |
cubezzz | it sounds exclusionist | Oct 16 05:15 |
JZA | cubezzz: but for the porpouse of communications it makes the point. | Oct 16 05:16 |
JZA | netcast, webcast, oggcast? | Oct 16 05:16 |
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stonebit | Has anyone seen boycott-boycottnovell.com? | Oct 16 05:19 |
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JZA | stonebit, yeah provided by the same guy who just flamed RMS as sexist. | Oct 16 05:19 |
JZA | Lefty | Oct 16 05:19 |
stonebit | It's hilarious! They run it on FrontPage, which is a MS abandonware. | Oct 16 05:20 |
JZA | I read the exchange between lefty and RMS, he seemed to be trying to make a storm in a glass of water. | Oct 16 05:20 |
JZA | stonebit -- I thought it was Joomla site. | Oct 16 05:20 |
JZA | jono: are you around? | Oct 16 05:21 |
jono | JZA, hey | Oct 16 05:21 |
JZA | jono: listening to your interview, what are you doing up this late? are you in the UK? | Oct 16 05:21 |
jono | JZA, no I am in California :-) | Oct 16 05:21 |
JZA | jono: oh that's why, just listening to your questions they jump around the site. | Oct 16 05:22 |
JZA | a bit too much | Oct 16 05:22 |
cubezzz | why flv sheesh | Oct 16 05:23 |
jono | I just tried to cover a decent amount of ground | Oct 16 05:23 |
JZA | I am getting dizzy from topic to topic | Oct 16 05:23 |
jono | heh | Oct 16 05:24 |
JZA | also I thought it was too novell focused, most of the posts here is more against Microsoft than novell really. | Oct 16 05:25 |
JZA | Microsoft lobying to get Free software out of the policy agendas. | Oct 16 05:25 |
jono | right | Oct 16 05:25 |
JZA | would have been a great topic to talk about and stick to | Oct 16 05:25 |
ThistleWeb | the site has grown beyond the idea behind the url though | Oct 16 05:26 |
JZA | ThistleWeb: my point | Oct 16 05:26 |
ThistleWeb | which is also covered in the interview | Oct 16 05:26 |
JZA | good point, still havent got to the end of it. | Oct 16 05:26 |
ThistleWeb | I agree, a more apt name would be better | Oct 16 05:27 |
ThistleWeb | he did wonder about that, ad you'll find out | Oct 16 05:27 |
cubezzz | is there an audio link for Roy's interview? | Oct 16 05:27 |
JZA | www.twit.tv | Oct 16 05:27 |
ThistleWeb | the podcast is released, that's how I get floss weekly | Oct 16 05:27 |
ThistleWeb | I was expecthing a Manchester accent | Oct 16 05:28 |
JZA | yeah but cubezzz dont like the word podcast. | Oct 16 05:28 |
tessier | jono: What part of Cali? | Oct 16 05:28 |
jono | tessier, Bay Area | Oct 16 05:28 |
ThistleWeb | I don't like the word dingleberry but it still exists | Oct 16 05:28 |
tessier | jono: Man, all the cool people and cool stuff are all the way up there. San Diego is a FOSS backwater. :( | Oct 16 05:28 |
ThistleWeb | "dingleberries you love, from sheep you trust" | Oct 16 05:29 |
jono | tessier, never been there, want to get there one day :) | Oct 16 05:29 |
cubezzz | North America is a FOSS backwater | Oct 16 05:29 |
jono | ThistleWeb, dingleberry? | Oct 16 05:29 |
ThistleWeb | look it up in urband dictionary | Oct 16 05:30 |
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ThistleWeb | lol | Oct 16 05:30 |
jono | ThistleWeb, I know what it means | Oct 16 05:30 |
tessier | jono: Let me know when you come down and I'll buy you a drink. | Oct 16 05:30 |
jono | tessier, cheers dude :) | Oct 16 05:30 |
cubezzz | podcast is too vague a term | Oct 16 05:30 |
jono | ThistleWeb, just checking you were drawing the link I was assuming | Oct 16 05:30 |
ThistleWeb | yeah I know, not exactly relevant but funny | Oct 16 05:30 |
stonebit | My wife tried to turn in a paper in odf. The prof didn't understand why she wouldn't want to pay for MS office. | Oct 16 05:31 |
ThistleWeb | jono: you need to take leo to task over the ogg thing | Oct 16 05:31 |
jono | ThistleWeb, we have an ogg feed now | Oct 16 05:31 |
jono | so all is good :) | Oct 16 05:31 |
ThistleWeb | on one hand he says "hardly anyone uses it" and on the other he says "I don't want to devote resources to it" | Oct 16 05:31 |
JZA | jono: it got accusatory on the spamy topic. I never have got spam from novell. | Oct 16 05:31 |
stonebit | ...oh-i'm in america, so yeah-it's blackwater | Oct 16 05:31 |
JZA | err.. boycotnovell | Oct 16 05:31 |
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JZA | and I do push many links on facebook | Oct 16 05:32 |
thegreatone | just saw the interview | Oct 16 05:32 |
ThistleWeb | if only a handful of peeps use it, how much does it eat into his $1.2m profits? | Oct 16 05:32 |
thegreatone | i thought it was good | Oct 16 05:32 |
thegreatone | *heard the interview with jono,leo and roy | Oct 16 05:33 |
jono | JZA, I thought I made it clear a number of times that I was not saying Roy was spamming, merely that a lot of spammers were speaking in the name of BN and Roy should set the record straight about them | Oct 16 05:33 |
jono | thegreatone, glad you enjoyed it :) | Oct 16 05:33 |
JZA | jono: yeah after you did but still. | Oct 16 05:33 |
ThistleWeb | leo was there? | Oct 16 05:34 |
jono | JZA, well I did through that discussion, I just heard it back :) | Oct 16 05:34 |
JZA | I do wonder how different would it have been if it was Eric Raymond interviewing on the halloween documents. | Oct 16 05:34 |
JZA | *about | Oct 16 05:35 |
ThistleWeb | it is good to hear a proper interview though, which is something mainstream US journos could do with going back to school to learn | Oct 16 05:36 |
ThistleWeb | now I come to think about it, I think Roy's episode was a world first for Leo.....something he didn't claim to love when the person responsible was being interviewed | Oct 16 05:37 |
JZA | yeah I dont see Leo installing Boycott Novell in his machine :) | Oct 16 05:38 |
JZA | I do wonder if kermitt the frong will do different. | Oct 16 05:38 |
ThistleWeb | leo loves everything his current guests are involved in | Oct 16 05:38 |
thegreatone | hahah | Oct 16 05:38 |
JZA | ThistleWeb: yeah he plays for the crowd, dont really play much hardball... unless ur mark erington | Oct 16 05:39 |
thegreatone | I appreciate Leo for giving the platform to educate people about something they would never know about all jokes aside | Oct 16 05:39 |
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ThistleWeb | lol, yeah, Leo was particularly abset in that episode | Oct 16 05:39 |
JZA | thegreatone: yeah but I was a bit dissapointed that the conversation was more focused on cleaning the name of the site, than what the sitee is actually about. | Oct 16 05:39 |
ThistleWeb | I also noticed the snide "I just turn up and others do the work" type of comment | Oct 16 05:39 |
thegreatone | JZA i concur, i have some digging to do to get to the truth | Oct 16 05:40 |
ThistleWeb | and the pleading for votes | Oct 16 05:40 |
thegreatone | thistleweb, I voted after the begging for votes | Oct 16 05:40 |
thegreatone | are there any other free/open source podcasts that you know about that are as good as FLOSS weekly | Oct 16 05:41 |
jono | thanks for the great feedback, folks :) | Oct 16 05:41 |
ThistleWeb | but for a real fodd podcast yes? | Oct 16 05:41 |
thegreatone | I am not being sarcastic I am really asking | Oct 16 05:41 |
jono | thegreatone, about to announce one ;-) | Oct 16 05:41 |
jono | I used to be on a show called LugRadio | Oct 16 05:41 |
ThistleWeb | foss* | Oct 16 05:41 |
jono | which was an irreverent take on Open Source | Oct 16 05:41 |
thegreatone | oh yea linux outlaws is also good | Oct 16 05:41 |
ThistleWeb | yeah I loved lugradio | Oct 16 05:41 |
thegreatone | thanks jono | Oct 16 05:41 |
ThistleWeb | you and aq are some double act | Oct 16 05:41 |
jono | and one of the other presenters (Aq) and I are about to announce our new show called Shot Of Jaq | Oct 16 05:41 |
jono | it will be the two of us discussing various topics | Oct 16 05:42 |
jono | I am just writing up the announcement right now | Oct 16 05:42 |
*ThistleWeb senses a new podcast subscription in da future | Oct 16 05:42 | |
jono | ThistleWeb, :) | Oct 16 05:42 |
JZA | jono: so what would u have done different on the interview if you neeeded to do it again? | Oct 16 05:42 |
ThistleWeb | not yours | Oct 16 05:42 |
ThistleWeb | rofl | Oct 16 05:43 |
jono | JZA, made it longer :) | Oct 16 05:43 |
ThistleWeb | nah I kid | Oct 16 05:43 |
jono | there was still so much for Roy and I to discuss | Oct 16 05:43 |
jono | ThistleWeb, lol | Oct 16 05:43 |
JZA | jono: thought podcasting was unlimited. | Oct 16 05:43 |
jono | JZA, well FLOSS tries to keep it the time slot | Oct 16 05:43 |
jono | and its really not my show | Oct 16 05:43 |
ThistleWeb | the boycot novell project is very varied, the time on the interview didn't even come close to covering it | Oct 16 05:43 |
jono | I was a guest once and they invited me to be a presenter | Oct 16 05:43 |
JZA | jono: yeah I give you that. | Oct 16 05:43 |
ThistleWeb | aka they know they're not all that respected in the FOSS community as FOSS people and need someone with previous FOSS podcasting credibility to help sell it | Oct 16 05:44 |
JZA | jono: well I would have listed some of the current topics that B.N. is currently focused. Myself I see many many attacks by Microsoft on the ODF OASIS board. | Oct 16 05:44 |
jono | JZA, right | Oct 16 05:45 |
jono | well maybe we can do a part 2 sometime | Oct 16 05:45 |
jono | :) | Oct 16 05:45 |
ThistleWeb | ooxml | Oct 16 05:45 |
mrsteveman1 | hi jono :) | Oct 16 05:45 |
jono | ThistleWeb, hah, not sure I have podcasting credibility :P | Oct 16 05:45 |
jono | hey mrsteveman1:) | Oct 16 05:45 |
ThistleWeb | well, you know how to push buttons on Cubase and talk into a mic | Oct 16 05:45 |
mrsteveman1 | jono: you were really well spoken in this weeks floss | Oct 16 05:46 |
JZA | mrsteveman1: yeah I miss the coursing from Lugradio | Oct 16 05:46 |
JZA | *cursing | Oct 16 05:46 |
ThistleWeb | considering how divisive BN is, it woulda been a tough interview to do | Oct 16 05:46 |
jono | ThistleWeb, heh, I guess so | Oct 16 05:46 |
jono | thanks mrsteveman1 :) | Oct 16 05:47 |
ThistleWeb | trying to play devils advocate | Oct 16 05:47 |
ThistleWeb | roy is certainly more personable than RMS | Oct 16 05:47 |
cubezzz | Cubase is proprietary? | Oct 16 05:47 |
JZA | by personable you mean reasonable? | Oct 16 05:48 |
ThistleWeb | oh yes | Oct 16 05:48 |
ThistleWeb | I mean able to accept others point of view | Oct 16 05:48 |
cubezzz | RMS is become more personable | Oct 16 05:48 |
cubezzz | if you listen to his older interviews he was a lot crankier | Oct 16 05:48 |
ThistleWeb | I remember the tllts interview with RMS | Oct 16 05:48 |
cubezzz | is becoming | Oct 16 05:48 |
ThistleWeb | he's continually correct the question | Oct 16 05:48 |
ThistleWeb | to his credit, he does walk the walk | Oct 16 05:49 |
ThistleWeb | even if it's a path than many couldn't follow to any practal degree just yet | Oct 16 05:49 |
cubezzz | he talked at the U of Calgary recently | Oct 16 05:50 |
cubezzz | talking about the evils of blu-ray | Oct 16 05:50 |
ThistleWeb | shoulda came on to the theme tune from Stingray played on a harp | Oct 16 05:50 |
ThistleWeb | blu-raaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyy bluray | Oct 16 05:50 |
cubezzz | ah, no :) | Oct 16 05:51 |
cubezzz | Stingray as in Gerry Anderson's show? | Oct 16 05:51 |
JZA | ThistleWeb: well more people should talk to Eben Moglen | Oct 16 05:51 |
JZA | and less to RMS | Oct 16 05:51 |
ThistleWeb | eban is great | Oct 16 05:51 |
JZA | and no.. not just to GPLv3 | Oct 16 05:51 |
ThistleWeb | he does know how to do talks | Oct 16 05:51 |
cubezzz | well, RMS is the extreme end of the scale | Oct 16 05:52 |
JZA | exactly, if you want to reason with someone from free software then talk to him and u will be enlightened the same way as if you talk to Larry lessig on Creative Commons. | Oct 16 05:52 |
ThistleWeb | ep 5 or 6 of the DFLC podcast was great, with the whole episode being one of his talks | Oct 16 05:52 |
JZA | cubezzz: yeah but RMS never ask to be on the show. | Oct 16 05:52 |
ThistleWeb | SFLC* | Oct 16 05:52 |
cubezzz | no RMS on broadcast televisio either :) | Oct 16 05:53 |
ThistleWeb | yes gerry anderson | Oct 16 05:53 |
cubezzz | unless I'm mistaken | Oct 16 05:53 |
JZA | well Leo said that RMS was on ScreenSavers | Oct 16 05:53 |
ThistleWeb | slight temp detour for a sec, anyone tried cmatrix? | Oct 16 05:54 |
ThistleWeb | it runs a matrix like animation in the terminal.....totally cool, but completely pointless | Oct 16 05:54 |
thegreatone | ??? | Oct 16 05:54 |
thegreatone | I've watcha movie in terminal | Oct 16 05:55 |
cubezzz | no RMS on Charlie Rose, but (dun dun DUNNN) Linus Torvals on Charlie Rose | Oct 16 05:55 |
thegreatone | my x session wouldnt start | Oct 16 05:55 |
thegreatone | vlc 'movie file' | Oct 16 05:55 |
ThistleWeb | there's a matix screensaver which does actually have a purpose, thats why I asked | Oct 16 05:55 |
thegreatone | surprising results | Oct 16 05:55 |
ThistleWeb | it's not a movie in a terminal | Oct 16 05:55 |
ThistleWeb | it's the matrix cascade of code in the terminal | Oct 16 05:55 |
thegreatone | yes i know, but until that poing i didnt know you could watch a movie with no x session open | Oct 16 05:55 |
ThistleWeb | it's funky but useless | Oct 16 05:56 |
ThistleWeb | anyhoo, back to the subject | Oct 16 05:56 |
cubezzz | doesn't xscreensaver do that? | Oct 16 05:58 |
ThistleWeb | actually I just thought of a geeky use for it. Have your terminal open and run cmatrix, so you have that until you press q to get the standard terminal prompt | Oct 16 05:58 |
JZA | ok finally is over | Oct 16 05:59 |
JZA | jono u totally slanted my man... | Oct 16 05:59 |
JZA | but oh well... I guess part II would be different | Oct 16 05:59 |
jono | JZA, heh, not slanted I would say, but have opinions on the project, yes, but my goal was to raise issues and provide Roy an opportunity to reply | Oct 16 06:00 |
jono | I felt the interview asked some tough questions but gave Roy an opportunity to reply and respond | Oct 16 06:00 |
thegreatone | Does anyone think Chrome Os will be positive for the FOSS community? | Oct 16 06:13 |
JZA | thegreatone: I dont think it has to do with anything floss | Oct 16 06:14 |
JZA | thegreatone: maybe it will inspire a new distro based on Mozilla. | Oct 16 06:15 |
JZA | Google's Native Client inspired WebGL | Oct 16 06:15 |
JZA | I think is sad that web is all focused on Javascript, I think FLOSS browsers could use a different thing like python on the client to process the calls. | Oct 16 06:16 |
thegreatone | If its linux underneath i think it has to do with floss, however seeing how their android project is going | Oct 16 06:16 |
thegreatone | I don't think it will win over developers | Oct 16 06:16 |
JZA | thegreatone: yup | Oct 16 06:16 |
JZA | FLOSS need to work more on integration than having more new projects. IMHO | Oct 16 06:17 |
JZA | not bundle, but just to talk to each other, something like asterisk talking to drupal (there is an extension about that) but most projects are too vertically minded. | Oct 16 06:17 |
thegreatone | javascript is okay and python is okay. As far as i know there are no browser that let you interact with client computers through python | Oct 16 06:17 |
thegreatone | that would be interesting however | Oct 16 06:17 |
mrsteveman1 | python in browser would be nice (Since i know python :) ) | Oct 16 06:18 |
JZA | well epiphany has python as a scripting language, but is just nowhere to go. | Oct 16 06:18 |
thegreatone | mrsteveman: yes i agree | Oct 16 06:18 |
thegreatone | epiphany sucks | Oct 16 06:18 |
JZA | thegreatone: it sucks like konqueror sucks | Oct 16 06:19 |
thegreatone | i will be brutally honest | Oct 16 06:19 |
thegreatone | konqueror also sucks | Oct 16 06:19 |
JZA | but that is just because the websites are not builted for them. | Oct 16 06:19 |
thegreatone | indeed,as long as I go to my banks website etc and it is not supported I will thing the browser stinks | Oct 16 06:19 |
thegreatone | also epiphany kept crashing on my jaunty 64bit machine | Oct 16 06:20 |
JZA | thegreatone: but thats why there is a lock-on. | Oct 16 06:20 |
thegreatone | ? | Oct 16 06:21 |
thegreatone | JZA:lock-on? | Oct 16 06:21 |
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JZA | thegreatone: it will be too hard to move away from anything but Javascript | Oct 16 06:29 |
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thegreatone | JZA: I agree with you the web moves very slowly sometimes , however all it takes is one browser to support it | Oct 16 06:31 |
thegreatone | and then the arm race will begin | Oct 16 06:31 |
mrsteveman1 | google could always write a python interpreter into a plugin :) | Oct 16 06:34 |
JZA | mrsteveman1: well the GWT does something like that. | Oct 16 06:45 |
JZA | Google Toolkit | Oct 16 06:45 |
JZA | http://jtauber.com/blog/2006/05/23/primitive_python_version_of_gwt_working/ | Oct 16 06:47 |
JZA | guess they are already working on it | Oct 16 06:48 |
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tessier | I would like to see a general purpose virtual machine in the browser like parrot/llvm | Oct 16 07:38 |
tessier | Then you could compile your java/python/lisp/haskell/javascript etc to that virtual machine | Oct 16 07:38 |
tessier | I wish that the JVM were a contender for this but I just see too many complications. | Oct 16 07:38 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] New Blog Post - The Matrix Has You http://tinyurl.com/yky67ra | Oct 16 07:50 | |
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e8h | Roy just listened to FOSS Weekly. The guy really was defending the Novel stance. | Oct 16 09:49 |
e8h | I personally haven't got invovled in the debate but at one point he calls you honuorable yet at the other end he's asking you to retract and step away. | Oct 16 09:50 |
e8h | The whole point that was important was that Novel attack other developers int he open source realm, so there's no of discussion needed then Novel is not to be promoted by the community. Obviously Novell has the right to do waht they want for Linux, but we the community should not be allowing them to dominate by the 'need' they create in the community. | Oct 16 09:52 |
e8h | ...so there's no other discussion needed... corrrection above... | Oct 16 09:53 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] #oggcamp mugs have just arrived :) They look great. Gonna break one in now with coffee http://bit.ly/8S9DJ | Oct 16 10:34 | |
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schestowitz | Turns out Silva likes my post... http://twitter.com/homembit/statuses/4853947019 http://twitter.com/homembit/statuses/4854065141 | Oct 16 10:52 |
oiaohm | http://shanzai.com/index.php/market-mayhem/8-op-ed/318-google-bets-on-arm-to-kill-both-intel-and-microsoft Interesting media starting to talk about it. | Oct 16 10:55 |
schestowitz | Compiz 0.8.4 Released With New Plug-Ins, Etc http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NzYxMg | Oct 16 10:59 |
schestowitz | oiaohm: google just relies on making good devices (or supplying an OS to some) | Oct 16 11:00 |
schestowitz | x86 is utter relic for energy efficiency | Oct 16 11:00 |
schestowitz | Intel is very afraid of ARM | Oct 16 11:00 |
oiaohm | Arm is scarryly power effective | Oct 16 11:00 |
schestowitz | its recent moves with atom to phones and sub-nptebooks uis defensive | Oct 16 11:00 |
oiaohm | Most of the media don't talk about it | Oct 16 11:01 |
schestowitz | Wintel press they call it | Oct 16 11:01 |
schestowitz | Where computer=Windows on x86 | Oct 16 11:01 |
schestowitz | Not SPARC | Oct 16 11:01 |
oiaohm | ARM chips are the only ones that fully automatically power manage. | Oct 16 11:01 |
oiaohm | Without OS really having to bother about it. | Oct 16 11:01 |
schestowitz | But SPARC is mostly run on servers anyway | Oct 16 11:01 |
oiaohm | SPARC is behind ARM in power management tech. | Oct 16 11:02 |
oiaohm | But still way ahead of x86. | Oct 16 11:02 |
schestowitz | My Palm's battery is still in good shape after more than 5 years | Oct 16 11:02 |
schestowitz | It can power it for like 5 hours depending on task | Oct 16 11:02 |
schestowitz | ARM makes it easy to use no power when the device is idle | Oct 16 11:02 |
oiaohm | That chip would be power hungry compared to current day arms. | Oct 16 11:02 |
oiaohm | Current day arms only turn on as much as the cpu to do the instructions nothering more. | Oct 16 11:03 |
oiaohm | SPARC would be in the same class as your old Palm schestowitz | Oct 16 11:05 |
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schestowitz | bbl | Oct 16 11:11 |
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cubezzz | wintel is over :) | Oct 16 11:30 |
cubezzz | no windows on arm | Oct 16 11:36 |
oiaohm | Windows CE is on arm cubezzz | Oct 16 11:47 |
oiaohm | Ok no windows worth a bugger is on arm. | Oct 16 11:47 |
cubezzz | I thought WinCE was going the way of the Dodo | Oct 16 11:47 |
oiaohm | Its not dead yet its just working it way there cubezzz | Oct 16 11:48 |
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phIRCe | Hello World! | Oct 16 11:48 |
oiaohm | WinCE is basically applicaiton channalaged. | Oct 16 11:48 |
oiaohm | In the same class windows 7 would be on arm. | Oct 16 11:49 |
oiaohm | http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/10/these-42-people-are-shaping-us-internet-enforcement-policy.ars This suxs | Oct 16 11:50 |
phIRCe | Title: Secret ACTA treaty can't be shown to public, just 42 lawyers - Ars Technica .::. Size~: 46.54 KB | Oct 16 11:50 |
oiaohm | Why cannot they be open about it. | Oct 16 11:50 |
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koe | anybody here?? | Oct 16 13:51 |
P|scean | sort of | Oct 16 13:53 |
koe | schestowitz seems not to be here.. | Oct 16 13:53 |
P|scean | 03:10 <schestowitz> bbl | Oct 16 13:54 |
P|scean | its 05:53 now | Oct 16 13:55 |
koe | OK. I come later here. It is about 4 pm here. | Oct 16 13:55 |
koe | In Finlad, I mean. | Oct 16 13:56 |
koe | Bye. | Oct 16 13:56 |
P|scean | bye | Oct 16 13:56 |
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schestowitz | ACTA again.... | Oct 16 14:08 |
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Eruaran | hi | Oct 16 14:19 |
Eruaran | I'm trying out Kubuntu 9.10 here... its pretty sweet | Oct 16 14:20 |
MinceR | i don't find it so sweet | Oct 16 14:21 |
MinceR | audacious keeps making kwin go to 100% cpu usage | Oct 16 14:21 |
MinceR | also, krunner died at some point | Oct 16 14:22 |
schestowitz | MinceR: why would audacious do such a thing? Weird. | Oct 16 14:23 |
MinceR | i have no idea | Oct 16 14:23 |
schestowitz | For me kwin struggled only when I made windows giggantic in experiments | Oct 16 14:23 |
MinceR | inexplicable cpu hogging seems to be kde4's thing. | Oct 16 14:23 |
schestowitz | Ovr 4000px high | Oct 16 14:23 |
MinceR | in 4.2, it was plasma, now it's kwin | Oct 16 14:24 |
MinceR | (though i'll need time to see if plasma is fixed or not) | Oct 16 14:24 |
schestowitz | Plasma desktop takes up resources after a while | Oct 16 14:25 |
schestowitz | I reckon it leaks some RAM | Oct 16 14:25 |
schestowitz | But it's no big deal | Oct 16 14:25 |
Eruaran | I had to tell a customer with Ubuntu 9.04 not to upgrade the other day | Oct 16 14:26 |
schestowitz | Why upgade? It's not out yet. | Oct 16 14:26 |
Eruaran | He was considering upgrading when it comes out | Oct 16 14:27 |
schestowitz | I make regular backups, so I can afford an error | Oct 16 14:27 |
schestowitz | Eruaran: if KDE, then yes, it's probably worth upgrading | Oct 16 14:27 |
Eruaran | schestowitz: its not | Oct 16 14:27 |
schestowitz | But GNOME has little in terms of improvement | Oct 16 14:27 |
Eruaran | It breaks too much stuff | Oct 16 14:27 |
schestowitz | They do GNOME Shell now | Oct 16 14:27 |
schestowitz | Dell has just embraced 9.04 | Oct 16 14:27 |
Eruaran | Things that work without problems for him under 9.04 suddently become a nightmare under 9.10... so we told him not to | Oct 16 14:28 |
Eruaran | GNOME Shell doesn't do anything for me | Oct 16 14:28 |
schestowitz | Like what things? Drivers? | Oct 16 14:28 |
schestowitz | I could go back to GNOME... | Oct 16 14:29 |
Eruaran | His USB TV tuner, his 3G wirless internet | Oct 16 14:29 |
schestowitz | I've always just booted into many DEs | Oct 16 14:29 |
schestowitz | Had 7 different DEs/WMs at one stage | Oct 16 14:29 |
Eruaran | same | Oct 16 14:29 |
schestowitz | I used GNOME when I programmed in GTK | Oct 16 14:29 |
schestowitz | GTK 1.2 and GTK 2 | Oct 16 14:29 |
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schestowitz | GNOME/GTK have great themes | Oct 16 14:30 |
Eruaran | I'm going to put Kubuntu Karmic on demo display... with the Facebook widget prominently displayed... People buy because of that sort of thing ;) | Oct 16 14:30 |
schestowitz | http://schestowitz.com/Projects/kmdupdate-2.html | Oct 16 14:31 |
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MinceR | i've put kubuntu karmic beta on my new eee pc 1005ha | Oct 16 14:31 |
schestowitz | Eruaran: use Oxygen :-) | Oct 16 14:31 |
schestowitz | Not Air | Oct 16 14:31 |
MinceR | i'm going to add gnome-panel to my desktop though :) | Oct 16 14:31 |
Eruaran | Air looks alrigyht | Oct 16 14:31 |
trmanco | there are lots of themes | Oct 16 14:32 |
MinceR | there are lots of themes at kde-look :> | Oct 16 14:32 |
trmanco | kde has a built in (opendesktop) thing | Oct 16 14:32 |
trmanco | yeah | Oct 16 14:32 |
trmanco | the best thing is, it's built right into kde | Oct 16 14:32 |
trmanco | the best thing is, it's built right into kde "more themes" | Oct 16 14:32 |
Eruaran | I like the Ghost theme | Oct 16 14:32 |
trmanco | bbl | Oct 16 14:32 |
schestowitz | !google ghost theme kde | Oct 16 14:34 |
phIRCe | [1] - AMOR Themes | http://docs.kde.org/en/3.2/kdetoys/amor/amor-themes.html | Oct 16 14:34 |
phIRCe | [2] - The AMOR Handbook | http://docs.kde.org/stable/en/kdetoys/amor/amor.pdf | Oct 16 14:34 |
phIRCe | [3] - Ghost KDE-Look.org | http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php/Ghost%3Fcontent%3D107902 | Oct 16 14:34 |
phIRCe | [4] - KDE Community Forums • The Screenshot Thread | http://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D73%26t%3D17916%26start%3D90 | Oct 16 14:34 |
schestowitz | Naaaa.. http://www.kde-look.org/content/preview.php?preview=1&id=107902&file1=107902-1.jpeg&file2=&file3=&name=Ghost&PHPSESSID=603cff63436fa465a22fea9f9501dacb | Oct 16 14:34 |
Eruaran | That facebook widget is a winner... you have no idea how many teenage girls are going to come to our store and see that on the desktop and say, "OMG can we have that ?!" | Oct 16 14:34 |
phIRCe | Title: Preview Ghost .::. Size~: 1.45 KB | Oct 16 14:34 |
schestowitz | OpenSUSE has a great KDE theme | Oct 16 14:35 |
schestowitz | 11.2 also comes with kde4 as default selection | Oct 16 14:35 |
schestowitz | Facebook has like what now, 60k Linux servers? | Oct 16 14:35 |
schestowitz | trmanco would know... | Oct 16 14:36 |
schestowitz | Funny thing is BTW, my cousin from Florida mailed me today about Leo's show | Oct 16 14:36 |
schestowitz | Turns out he listens and watches all his stuff.... and he found out I was on despite the fact that I didn't say a thing. | Oct 16 14:37 |
schestowitz | It's available as video now | Oct 16 14:37 |
schestowitz | mp4 (no entry to FS) | Oct 16 14:37 |
schestowitz | http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/10/15/google-adds-google-docs-previews-to-gmail | Oct 16 14:38 |
phIRCe | Title: Google Adds Google Docs Previews to Gmail | WebProNews .::. Size~: 27.67 KB | Oct 16 14:38 |
schestowitz | I listened to the show | Oct 16 14:38 |
schestowitz | That's just not me | Oct 16 14:38 |
schestowitz | It was terrible for me... was more of an interrogation that had me sound funny and weird, very uncomfortable. | Oct 16 14:38 |
schestowitz | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKcPx2jD5to | Oct 16 14:39 |
phIRCe | Title: YouTube - Gates Deposition Greatest Hits .::. Size~: 129.41 KB | Oct 16 14:39 |
Eruaran | There's a vid on YouTube of a guy running Google Wave on his Nokia N900 | Oct 16 14:40 |
Eruaran | Was interesting | Oct 16 14:40 |
schestowitz | Anyway, it was nice of Leo to throw in a compliment at the end | Oct 16 14:40 |
schestowitz | Eruaran: which video? | Oct 16 14:40 |
schestowitz | there are many | Oct 16 14:40 |
schestowitz | The Nokia one with the two chaps? | Oct 16 14:40 |
schestowitz | http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/10/15/twitter-cofounder-speaks-out-again-against-sale | Oct 16 14:41 |
phIRCe | Title: Twitter Cofounder Speaks Out (Again) Against Sale | WebProNews .::. Size~: 29.87 KB | Oct 16 14:41 |
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Eruaran | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rqd2WCFc6mg | Oct 16 14:43 |
phIRCe | Title: YouTube - Episode 38: Nokia N900 running Google Wave .::. Size~: 136.64 KB | Oct 16 14:43 |
schestowitz | Great news: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8309583.stm | Oct 16 14:49 |
DaemonFC | my cell carrier was bought out by AT&T | Oct 16 14:49 |
phIRCe | Title: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 86.17 KB | Oct 16 14:49 |
DaemonFC | and my contract isn't up until July | Oct 16 14:49 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] All kids in Uruguay to use GNU/Linux. http://ping.fm/EQHl5 | Oct 16 14:50 | |
phIRCe | Title: BBC NEWS | Technology | Laptop for every pupil in Uruguay .::. Size~: 52.29 KB | Oct 16 14:51 |
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schestowitz | "GNU/Linux Laptop for every pupil in Uruguay - http://bit.ly/2o6K3Q 362,000 pupils and 18,000 teachers: not bad (via @schestowitz)" | Oct 16 14:58 |
schestowitz | http://identi.ca/notice/12188136 | Oct 16 14:58 |
schestowitz | Here is goes spreading | Oct 16 14:58 |
phIRCe | Title: BBC NEWS | Technology | Laptop for every pupil in Uruguay .::. Size~: 52.73 KB | Oct 16 14:58 |
phIRCe | Title: Glyn Moody (glynmoody) 's status on Friday, 16-Oct-09 13:51:50 UTC - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 7.36 KB | Oct 16 14:58 |
DaemonFC | hmmm, freedom by force? | Oct 16 14:59 |
schestowitz | Oracle is feuding with IBM < http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1558805/oracle-feuding-ibm > | Oct 16 14:59 |
DaemonFC | where have I heard that before? | Oct 16 14:59 |
DaemonFC | :) | Oct 16 14:59 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: no independence by resistence | Oct 16 14:59 |
schestowitz | Oops | Oct 16 14:59 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: no, independence by resistence | Oct 16 14:59 |
schestowitz | Important comma | Oct 16 14:59 |
DaemonFC | no, I think you were right the first time | Oct 16 15:00 |
DaemonFC | most resistance movements end up with worse government than they had before | Oct 16 15:00 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: GNU/Linux is bigger than Apple probably | Oct 16 15:00 |
schestowitz | In the client side sense | Oct 16 15:00 |
schestowitz | Not revenue | Oct 16 15:00 |
schestowitz | But use | Oct 16 15:00 |
schestowitz | Macs are a niche product in a way and statistics tend to focus on particular areas that are accessible for survey makers and also English-speaking | Oct 16 15:00 |
DaemonFC | that's hardly an accomplishment | Oct 16 15:00 |
schestowitz | Net Application is cited extensively as a source that's reliable when it comes to markey share, but it's really skewed in favour of a Web audience from the United States. To make matters even more dubious, Microsoft is a client of the firm (i.e. it pays it) and the management there has some roots with Microsoft intersection. | Oct 16 15:00 |
DaemonFC | Apple makes shitty niche products | Oct 16 15:00 |
schestowitz | The fact that they halved the "market share" of Apple overnight is very telling because it shows a lack or reliability. A high number of IP addresses alone is not sufficient when trying to determine how a morehomogenous global population behaves. | Oct 16 15:00 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: see last night's post | Oct 16 15:01 |
schestowitz | MinceR also | Oct 16 15:01 |
schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/10/15/apple-perfect-shiny-products/ | Oct 16 15:01 |
phIRCe | Title: Eye on Apple: Perfect Shiny Products | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 98.69 KB | Oct 16 15:01 |
schestowitz | MinceR: have a look. | Oct 16 15:01 |
DaemonFC | when did I ever say Apple was cost effective or reliable? Who COULD say that without a smile on their face? | Oct 16 15:01 |
MinceR | looking | Oct 16 15:02 |
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MinceR | DaemonFC: fanboys say that and more all the time | Oct 16 15:02 |
DaemonFC | well, fanboys of anything will worship it | Oct 16 15:02 |
DaemonFC | nothing new or unique about Apple fanboys | Oct 16 15:02 |
MinceR | they're some of the worst | Oct 16 15:03 |
schestowitz | MinceR: it's a lot for one day in Cupertino | Oct 16 15:03 |
MinceR | and there seems to be a lot of them | Oct 16 15:03 |
MinceR | schestowitz: indeed | Oct 16 15:03 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Time capsule doesn't eat data, it sends it back to 1969 | Oct 16 15:03 |
DaemonFC | a goode year wouldn't you say? B-) | Oct 16 15:03 |
DaemonFC | *good | Oct 16 15:03 |
schestowitz | Sends it to the moon | Oct 16 15:03 |
schestowitz | Never to return though | Oct 16 15:03 |
MinceR | sends it to a Time Bomb that's about to detonate! | Oct 16 15:04 |
schestowitz | "It's one small step for man *noise* *noise*.... END TRANSMISSION" | Oct 16 15:04 |
DaemonFC | One small step for man, one giant $10,000 bill on your Apple store card | Oct 16 15:04 |
DaemonFC | nyaaah | Oct 16 15:04 |
DaemonFC | the only system they have without laughable/puny specs is the Mac Pro | Oct 16 15:05 |
DaemonFC | loo at how much those are | Oct 16 15:05 |
DaemonFC | and you could still put together a PC with the same specs for a third the price, if that | Oct 16 15:05 |
schestowitz | A Million Mutinies Now http://www.tehelka.com/story_main43.asp?filename=Ne171009a_million.asp | Oct 16 15:06 |
phIRCe | Title: Tehelka - India's Independent Weekly News Magazine .::. Size~: 31.45 KB | Oct 16 15:06 |
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DaemonFC | my ~$900 PC (including GPU) is roughly 4 times as fast as their $3,000 iMac | Oct 16 15:06 |
DaemonFC | that's pretty telling of how stupid Apple customers are | Oct 16 15:06 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: they sell to small crowds, they must get high margins | Oct 16 15:06 |
schestowitz | Had Apple sold the OS as a commodity h/w s/w for $50, how much would they earn? | Oct 16 15:06 |
schestowitz | For hundreds of OS X engineers, maybe 30mx$50 income/year? | Oct 16 15:07 |
DaemonFC | they might have some success if they copycatted Windows pricing | Oct 16 15:07 |
DaemonFC | and competed on normal PCs | Oct 16 15:07 |
schestowitz | That's a budget of $1.5bn | Oct 16 15:07 |
Diablo-D3 | they're not a software business, however | Oct 16 15:07 |
schestowitz | Just to _break even_ | Oct 16 15:07 |
DaemonFC | they'd gain in volume but not on revenue cause the hardware they make you buy to get OS X is so overpriced | Oct 16 15:07 |
schestowitz | Diablo-D3: that's the point | Oct 16 15:08 |
DaemonFC | so they can do less volume for the same profit right now | Oct 16 15:08 |
schestowitz | Apple, IIRC, spends like a billion/annum on marketing | Oct 16 15:09 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: That's why they're terrified of OS X on a PC, even if you pay for the boxed set of OS X | Oct 16 15:09 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: no | Oct 16 15:09 |
DaemonFC | they don't really make the big bucks off OS X box sets | Oct 16 15:09 |
schestowitz | They are terrified of the same thing as msft | Oct 16 15:09 |
schestowitz | Cheap OSes and commodity h/w | Oct 16 15:09 |
schestowitz | Palm Pre scares them also | Oct 16 15:09 |
schestowitz | It threatens their jewels | Oct 16 15:09 |
DaemonFC | Microsoft thrives on commodity hardware | Oct 16 15:09 |
schestowitz | Phones and PMPs converge | Oct 16 15:09 |
DaemonFC | the cheaper the hardware gets, the less the customer notices the price of Windows | Oct 16 15:09 |
schestowitz | So a phone that plays music can harm ipod franchise | Oct 16 15:10 |
DaemonFC | plus it gives them a real point to go after Apple with in those commercials | Oct 16 15:10 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: no, they don't | Oct 16 15:10 |
schestowitz | [15:09] <DaemonFC> Microsoft thrives on commodity hardware | Oct 16 15:10 |
schestowitz | Microsoft doesn't sell h/w | Oct 16 15:10 |
schestowitz | It licences an OS | Oct 16 15:10 |
schestowitz | Sometimes for $5 | Oct 16 15:10 |
schestowitz | A piece | Oct 16 15:10 |
schestowitz | Apiece in netbooks | Oct 16 15:10 |
schestowitz | They try to sell PCs now | Oct 16 15:11 |
DaemonFC | right, so the cheaper a company like HP can slap the system together for, hardware wise, the less the customer should notice $50 for Windows | Oct 16 15:11 |
schestowitz | Microsoft 'Stores' | Oct 16 15:11 |
schestowitz | They're foolish | Oct 16 15:11 |
schestowitz | They alienate partners like H-P, which is already working on its Linux distro. Dell just tosses some Ubuntu on h/w | Oct 16 15:11 |
DaemonFC | well, there is no Microsoft PC | Oct 16 15:11 |
schestowitz | There won't be | Oct 16 15:12 |
schestowitz | There will be a store | Oct 16 15:12 |
DaemonFC | my thought was they were going to deal in HPs and Dells and such in the MS store | Oct 16 15:12 |
schestowitz | Microsoft takes h/w margins | Oct 16 15:12 |
schestowitz | At expense of previous partners | Oct 16 15:12 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: Microsoft is scared of HP now | Oct 16 15:12 |
schestowitz | In its latest SEC f' it said HP and Intel go it alone with the "L" word | Oct 16 15:13 |
Diablo-D3 | [10:10:29] <schestowitz> They alienate partners like H-P, which is already working on its Linux distro. Dell just tosses some Ubuntu on h/w | Oct 16 15:14 |
DaemonFC | Apple is funny with bugs | Oct 16 15:14 |
Diablo-D3 | stop saying H-P | Oct 16 15:14 |
DaemonFC | Microsoft is actually much more straightforward about admitting issues and fixing them than Apple | Oct 16 15:14 |
DaemonFC | I canceled the order for that HP Pavilion I had before I ordered this one | Oct 16 15:15 |
MinceR | which isn't sayinh much | Oct 16 15:15 |
MinceR | s/nh/ng/ | Oct 16 15:15 |
schestowitz | HP.... good open sauce | Oct 16 15:15 |
MinceR | see winxp vs sockstress | Oct 16 15:15 |
DaemonFC | I saw a picture of the inside of the Pavilion's case, and everything was just sandwiched in there | Oct 16 15:15 |
DaemonFC | can't upgrade it | Oct 16 15:15 |
DaemonFC | they installed the motherboard upside down even | Oct 16 15:16 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] "Iraq approves British troops' return" http://ping.fm/s7uMf Return?!?! | Oct 16 15:16 | |
phIRCe | Title: Seven killed by Baghdad car bomb | IOL .::. Size~: 7.86 KB | Oct 16 15:16 |
DaemonFC | glad I saw that | Oct 16 15:17 |
DaemonFC | Iraq's new Navy? A few speedboats? Like Iran? lol | Oct 16 15:18 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] tribes massacred in the Amazonian forests - for corporate profits... http://ping.fm/lSai4 | Oct 16 15:18 | |
schestowitz | Unsafe abortions kill 70,000 a year http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/oct/14/unsafe-abortions-global-report | Oct 16 15:19 |
schestowitz | Wildlife expert claims gorilla dung is critical to containing climate change http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/oct/13/gorilla-forests-climate-change-redmond | Oct 16 15:20 |
DaemonFC | there's almost never an excuse for an abortion | Oct 16 15:21 |
DaemonFC | women just are irresponsible and whore themselves around without taking contraception | Oct 16 15:21 |
DaemonFC | if they die having their baby cut out, they deserve it | Oct 16 15:22 |
schestowitz | Might Google drop Chrome OS beta as a Windows 7 spoiler? http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=4256 | Oct 16 15:22 |
schestowitz | Vista 7 release is financial results spoiler already | Oct 16 15:22 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: some are raped | Oct 16 15:22 |
MinceR | poor vista7, it wouldn't be spoiled if it wasn't for chrome os :> | Oct 16 15:22 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: I said almost never an excuse | Oct 16 15:23 |
schestowitz | The numbers come from countries that are less developed too | Oct 16 15:23 |
DaemonFC | rape is a reason | Oct 16 15:23 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: oh. | Oct 16 15:23 |
schestowitz | Never mind, I misinterpreted what you said | Oct 16 15:23 |
DaemonFC | I don't think they should be performed left and right as a method of convenient disposal of an unborn baby | Oct 16 15:23 |
schestowitz | Being intoxicated is another issue | Oct 16 15:24 |
DaemonFC | I never said they were not psychologically or medically needed | Oct 16 15:24 |
schestowitz | They don't choose to be impregnated | Oct 16 15:24 |
schestowitz | We kill all the time, DaemonFC | Oct 16 15:24 |
schestowitz | The value of like is not a contigent issue | Oct 16 15:24 |
DaemonFC | there's how many methods of birth control? People don't use them and then they just have a viable unborn baby ripped out of them, cut up/murdered, and thrown in the trash | Oct 16 15:25 |
schestowitz | For instance, we nicely talk about the importance of life | Oct 16 15:25 |
DaemonFC | I think those people are sick | Oct 16 15:25 |
schestowitz | Yet everything we eat is life | Oct 16 15:25 |
schestowitz | And not only that | Oct 16 15:25 |
schestowitz | Values come into contradiction | Oct 16 15:25 |
schestowitz | We swap mosquitoes for instance | Oct 16 15:25 |
DaemonFC | so? | Oct 16 15:25 |
schestowitz | One value comes into interference with another and we know what they is | Oct 16 15:25 |
schestowitz | !google youtube obama kills fly | Oct 16 15:25 |
phIRCe | [1] - YouTube - Obama Kills Fly During Interview | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DgzgOS8dbF64 | Oct 16 15:25 |
phIRCe | [2] - YouTube - Obama Kills Fly: Ninja REMIX! | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3D6sV3_LUBGTU | Oct 16 15:25 |
phIRCe | [3] - YouTube - Obama Kills Fly Like a Ninja! - The Best of YouTube | http://www.bestofyoutube.com/story.php%3Ftitle%3Dyoutube---obama-kills-fly-like-a-ninja-1 | Oct 16 15:25 |
phIRCe | [4] - Obama Kills Fly Video Youtube | http://ngepress.com/news/obama-kills-fly-video-youtube/ | Oct 16 15:25 |
DaemonFC | human life is worth more than a mosquito that carries malaria I would hope | Oct 16 15:26 |
DaemonFC | :) | Oct 16 15:26 |
schestowitz | Why? | Oct 16 15:26 |
schestowitz | And why are elephant not as important? | Oct 16 15:26 |
schestowitz | Do we judge by mass? | Oct 16 15:26 |
schestowitz | Self awareness? | Oct 16 15:26 |
DaemonFC | so that mosquito should be allowedto let live? | Oct 16 15:26 |
schestowitz | Capability of introspection? | Oct 16 15:26 |
DaemonFC | Even if it bites you and you die? | Oct 16 15:26 |
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DaemonFC | mosquitos are not self aware | Oct 16 15:27 |
DaemonFC | they live like a few months? | Oct 16 15:27 |
DaemonFC | when they die there will still be hundreds of billions of the damned things? | Oct 16 15:27 |
*schestowitz easts | Oct 16 15:28 | |
*schestowitz eats | Oct 16 15:28 | |
schestowitz | [15:27] <DaemonFC> when they die there will still be hundreds of billions of the damned things? | Oct 16 15:28 |
schestowitz | Like humans | Oct 16 15:28 |
MinceR | feasts! | Oct 16 15:28 |
schestowitz | no, just toast | Oct 16 15:29 |
DaemonFC | you have to go on a stretch to say mosquitos are as important as humans | Oct 16 15:29 |
schestowitz | My diets' been s* | Oct 16 15:29 |
schestowitz | I need to benchpress 160kg this weekend | Oct 16 15:29 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Human activity also causes some things to thrive that may not have otherwise | Oct 16 15:29 |
DaemonFC | and most of the irresponsible population growth is caused in countries like India and China | Oct 16 15:30 |
schestowitz | [15:29] <DaemonFC> schestowitz: Human activity also causes some things to thrive that may not have otherwise | Oct 16 15:30 |
schestowitz | humans use biology like they use gold | Oct 16 15:30 |
schestowitz | !google youtube chicken production line | Oct 16 15:31 |
phIRCe | [1] - YouTube - Center Filled Wafer Production Line | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3D6NQEdNrFp5M | Oct 16 15:31 |
phIRCe | [2] - YouTube - chicken without a head | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DztwrnkLB7Q0 | Oct 16 15:31 |
phIRCe | [3] - Small-Scale Poultry Production Resources | http://nesfp.nutrition.tufts.edu/downloads/PeteJenPoultry_Resources.pdf | Oct 16 15:31 |
phIRCe | [4] - Agricultural Resources Dairy, Livestock, Poultry Production | http://extension.unh.edu/Counties/Carroll/docs/Calivestock08.pdf | Oct 16 15:31 |
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schestowitz | Michael Dell: Desktop PCs are getting 'cannibalized' by mobile http://www.techflash.com/seattle/2009/10/michael_dell_desktop_computers_are_getting_cannibalized_by_mobile.html?ana=from_rss | Oct 16 15:44 |
phIRCe | Title: Michael Dell: Desktop PCs are getting 'cannibalized' by mobile .::. Size~: 45.59 KB | Oct 16 15:44 |
schestowitz | Nokia N900 can eliminate the need for some to buy a computer | Oct 16 15:45 |
schestowitz | They can do E-mail and maybe banking online with that thing | Oct 16 15:45 |
schestowitz | http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-cpufreq-3/index.html | Oct 16 15:46 |
phIRCe | Title: Reduce Linux power consumption, Part 3: Tuning results .::. Size~: 69.86 KB | Oct 16 15:46 |
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schestowitz | Linux Users Still Left Out, Why Source Code Matters to End Users http://blog.linuxtoday.com/blog/2009/10/linux-users-sti.html | Oct 16 15:50 |
phIRCe | Title: Linux Today Blog .::. Size~: 74.41 KB | Oct 16 15:50 |
schestowitz | http://www.serverwatch.com/eur/article.php/3843511/Recent-Foibles-Expose-Dark-Side-of--Cloud-Computing.htm | Oct 16 15:51 |
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DaemonFC | speaking of freedom of the press, I'm glad I got to call out that hospital in the local paper | Oct 16 15:54 |
mcepl | I have comment about http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/Mono_Applications ... could you please add jbrout as an alternative to f-spot? After looking for the non-Mono equivalent of f-spot I found it the best photo-collection management app to the extent that I have maintained it for some time at Fedora. | Oct 16 15:55 |
phIRCe | Title: Mono Applications - Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 21.33 KB | Oct 16 15:56 |
DaemonFC | just going to the ER and getting an IV of Dilantin to bring you out of a seizure is nearly $3,000, and that's cause I didn't take an ambulance over there | Oct 16 15:56 |
DaemonFC | that would have pinned another $500 on | Oct 16 15:56 |
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schestowitz | mcepl: hi | Oct 16 16:06 |
schestowitz | Sure, you can edit the page too | Oct 16 16:07 |
schestowitz | If you can't, I'll add it myself | Oct 16 16:07 |
mcepl | well, i don't have an account ... oh well :( | Oct 16 16:09 |
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DaemonFC | this integrated sound chipset sounds fantastic | Oct 16 16:10 |
DaemonFC | they've really gotten better | Oct 16 16:10 |
Diablo-D3 | I dont know why they just dont put a via envy24 on it | Oct 16 16:11 |
DaemonFC | it's some RealTek HD Audio 7.1 thing | Oct 16 16:11 |
DaemonFC | it's nice | Oct 16 16:11 |
mcepl | schestowitz: ok, done | Oct 16 16:11 |
schestowitz | News Corp Lawyer: Aggregators Steal From Us! News Corp: Hey Check Out Our Aggregator! < http://techdirt.com/articles/20091014/1831246537.shtml > | Oct 16 16:12 |
phIRCe | Title: News Corp Lawyer: Aggregators Steal From Us! News Corp: Hey Check Out Our Aggregator! | Techdirt .::. Size~: 75.81 KB | Oct 16 16:12 |
schestowitz | mcepl: thanks | Oct 16 16:12 |
DaemonFC | Faux Noise | Oct 16 16:12 |
schestowitz | Nusance | Oct 16 16:12 |
schestowitz | News Cr*p | Oct 16 16:12 |
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schestowitz | amarsh04: http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,26210117-601,00.html | Oct 16 16:16 |
phIRCe | Title: The Australian, News from Australia's National Newspaper .::. Size~: 75.22 KB | Oct 16 16:16 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: | Oct 16 16:17 |
schestowitz | !google o'reilly owned | Oct 16 16:17 |
phIRCe | [1] - YouTube - Bill O'Reilly Gets Owned By Kid | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DbeJ9yJpR_DA | Oct 16 16:17 |
phIRCe | [2] - YouTube - Kirk Cameron gets Owned. Evolution is a myth! | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3Dr5J0cSnYnFg | Oct 16 16:17 |
phIRCe | [3] - Bill O'Reilly gets owned and freaks out | http://digg.com/people/Bill_O_Reilly_gets_owned_and_freaks_out | Oct 16 16:17 |
phIRCe | [4] - O'Reilly-Sucks.com | http://www.oreilly-sucks.com/ | Oct 16 16:17 |
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schestowitz | http://techdirt.com/articles/20091014/1838536538.shtml | Oct 16 16:19 |
phIRCe | Title: Michael Dell Recognizes Blocking What Customers Want To Protect Your Own Biz Model Is Dumb | Techdirt .::. Size~: 47.72 KB | Oct 16 16:19 |
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DaemonFC | schestowitz: HP lost a sale because of how they designed that Pavilion | Oct 16 16:22 |
DaemonFC | I wanted to put a GPU in it and they stuffed the case too full to let you put one in | Oct 16 16:23 |
DaemonFC | HP has done some of that for a while now though | Oct 16 16:23 |
DaemonFC | Microsoft emailed me to tell me my XBOX 360 is fixed and on the way back :P | Oct 16 16:26 |
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Balrog | DaemonFC: I wonder how long it will last this time | Oct 16 16:28 |
DaemonFC | well, supposedly they've fixed the defect that was causing the overheating issue | Oct 16 16:29 |
DaemonFC | I'll find out I guess | Oct 16 16:29 |
DaemonFC | at first they were fixing them and sending them back with the same defect, just to die again | Oct 16 16:29 |
DaemonFC | this will be my eighth console | Oct 16 16:29 |
DaemonFC | it launched in November 2005, so we'll say 35 months | Oct 16 16:30 |
trmanco | http://identi.ca/notice/12194489 | Oct 16 16:30 |
trmanco | lol | Oct 16 16:31 |
phIRCe | Title: Aaron Toponce (atoponce) 's status on Friday, 16-Oct-09 15:23:56 UTC - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 7.31 KB | Oct 16 16:31 |
DaemonFC | 4.3 months is how long my average XBOX 360 has lasted | Oct 16 16:31 |
schestowitz | http://odtv.me/2009/10/floss-91/ | Oct 16 16:32 |
schestowitz | It was terrible for me, but some people disagree. | Oct 16 16:32 |
phIRCe | Title: ODTV | On Demand TWiT Video | all-volunteer and non-commercial .::. Size~: 14.72 KB | Oct 16 16:32 |
schestowitz | I sound a lot better when not under pressure, but oh well.... :-( | Oct 16 16:33 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: do you not change xbox? | Oct 16 16:33 |
schestowitz | Have you given up | Oct 16 16:33 |
trmanco | no ogg? | Oct 16 16:33 |
schestowitz | BTW, my typo on Twitter ("secrecy") showed up on the screen | Oct 16 16:33 |
DaemonFC | meh | Oct 16 16:33 |
schestowitz | I know how to spell it correctly. That's just embarrassing. | Oct 16 16:33 |
schestowitz | trmanco: no ogg, not anymore | Oct 16 16:34 |
schestowitz | They stopped ogg a while ago, no volunteers for now | Oct 16 16:34 |
schestowitz | Unless you can find an ogg | Oct 16 16:34 |
schestowitz | trmanco: | Oct 16 16:35 |
schestowitz | http://www.techflash.com/seattle/2009/10/apple_says_its_looking_forward_to_windows_7_launch_too.html?ana=from_rss | Oct 16 16:35 |
phIRCe | Title: Apple's own Windows 7 pitch .::. Size~: 43.89 KB | Oct 16 16:35 |
schestowitz | "Despite positive reviews for Windows 7, the upgrade process for the millions of people still using the older Windows XP won't be simple. Unlike the shift from the newer Windows Vista, the move from Windows XP to Windows 7 requires a clean installation -- which means backing up data before installing Windows 7, then restoring data and reinstalling applications after the new OS is on the machine." | Oct 16 16:35 |
schestowitz | Hehe. | Oct 16 16:35 |
schestowitz | "Positive reviews" | Oct 16 16:35 |
schestowitz | Yes, MSDN subs and people whom Microsoft paid, amongst others | Oct 16 16:35 |
trmanco | what, technet? | Oct 16 16:35 |
trmanco | LOL | Oct 16 16:35 |
schestowitz | TechFlash too is PAID by Microsoft | Oct 16 16:35 |
schestowitz | To spout out such statements | Oct 16 16:35 |
trmanco | that's microsofts palace of windows devs | Oct 16 16:35 |
schestowitz | Naked emperor | Oct 16 16:35 |
trmanco | but you need to pay to get a free one year ticket | Oct 16 16:36 |
schestowitz | Editors would probably not publish 'outrageous' claims that say Vista 7 is not welcomed | Oct 16 16:36 |
schestowitz | Microsoft set the agenda/trend usign money | Oct 16 16:36 |
schestowitz | Just as it did with Vista | Oct 16 16:36 |
schestowitz | trmanco: DaemonFC is a sub iirc | Oct 16 16:38 |
schestowitz | But he dared to criticise Vista 7 | Oct 16 16:38 |
schestowitz | So the 'cops' started to curse him | Oct 16 16:38 |
schestowitz | Suggesting he had mental issues | Oct 16 16:38 |
schestowitz | So he took down the videos that criticise Vista 7 | Oct 16 16:38 |
DaemonFC | I have a Technet account and a DreamSpark account | Oct 16 16:38 |
schestowitz | Microsoft must have been happy | Oct 16 16:38 |
DaemonFC | they keep giving me crap I don't even have any use for | Oct 16 16:38 |
schestowitz | Another source of dissent bit the dust | Oct 16 16:38 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: I still haven't used my Windows Server 2008 R2 license | Oct 16 16:39 |
DaemonFC | wnat it? :P | Oct 16 16:39 |
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DaemonFC | *want | Oct 16 16:39 |
schestowitz | Why use it? | Oct 16 16:40 |
schestowitz | It's a licence | Oct 16 16:40 |
schestowitz | It's nothing physical to redeem | Oct 16 16:40 |
DaemonFC | I don't need Windows Server | Oct 16 16:40 |
schestowitz | Virtual goods | Oct 16 16:40 |
DaemonFC | too bloated with stuff I don't need | Oct 16 16:40 |
schestowitz | You could also use up your infinity licences to use Debian | Oct 16 16:40 |
schestowitz | On 1,0000000000000000000000000 machines | Oct 16 16:40 |
schestowitz | While Microsoft will say how it donated $1,0000000000000000000000000000000000000 worth of software to poor schools | Oct 16 16:41 |
schestowitz | The analogy would go like, giving African tires | Oct 16 16:41 |
DaemonFC | multi billion dollar tax deduction on products that have no physical value and cost nothing to make | Oct 16 16:41 |
schestowitz | Free Dumlop tires | Oct 16 16:41 |
schestowitz | *Dunlop | Oct 16 16:41 |
schestowitz | Leave it for them to find a car to put these on | Oct 16 16:41 |
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schestowitz | But it's a bad analogy | Oct 16 16:42 |
schestowitz | THe parable here assumed that tires is not scarce | Oct 16 16:42 |
schestowitz | *Are | Oct 16 16:42 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Those cheap Walmart tires are actually pretty good | Oct 16 16:43 |
DaemonFC | $40 each and I've had them on that car for like four years | Oct 16 16:43 |
DaemonFC | still have more than half their tread | Oct 16 16:43 |
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DaemonFC | damndest thing is that Firestone tires which are like $200+ per don't last that long | Oct 16 16:43 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Brand names are a salami slicing operation | Oct 16 16:44 |
DaemonFC | per item it may not seem like a fortune, but overall, it is | Oct 16 16:44 |
DaemonFC | there's also other ways to be sneaky/cheap bastard depending on how you look at it | Oct 16 16:45 |
schestowitz | My Nike pair of shoes hardly lasted | Oct 16 16:46 |
DaemonFC | I get a better haircut for $5 at the beauty school than I get at the other places for $15 | Oct 16 16:46 |
schestowitz | One pair that I had for like six (6!) years is still OK | Oct 16 16:46 |
DaemonFC | yeah, schestowitz, do they not have outlet stores there? | Oct 16 16:46 |
schestowitz | And the brand is lesser known | Oct 16 16:46 |
DaemonFC | just get a pair where the Vietnamese school kid messed up a stitch and was taken out back and shot | Oct 16 16:46 |
DaemonFC | same shoes for half price | Oct 16 16:46 |
DaemonFC | lol | Oct 16 16:46 |
schestowitz | Wage slavery.. | Oct 16 16:47 |
DaemonFC | you can't get a decent pair of shoes anymore, they all outsource to third world slave labor | Oct 16 16:47 |
DaemonFC | buy cheap and sell dear | Oct 16 16:47 |
schestowitz | !google youtube nike wage slavery | Oct 16 16:47 |
phIRCe | [1] - YouTube - Zoned for Slavery: The Child Behind the Label | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3D1XtYhfcEZ9A | Oct 16 16:47 |
phIRCe | [2] - YouTube - Diezel P - Modern Day Slaves | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DT94mrzc4B4s | Oct 16 16:47 |
phIRCe | [3] - AdScam/The Horror! : Wieden + Kennedy opens mouth, puts large Nike ... | http://adscam.typepad.com/my_weblog/2009/07/wieden-kennedy-opens-mouth-puts-large-nike-in-it.html | Oct 16 16:47 |
phIRCe | [4] - Tiger Woods should feel SOME guilt about his NIKE contract ... | http://www.fannation.com/throwdowns/show/287577-tiger-woods-should-feel-some-guilt-about-his-nike-contract%3Fcategory_id%3D17 | Oct 16 16:47 |
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schestowitz | http://www.tuxdeluxe.org/node/299 "mono serves and promotes a CONVICTED monopolist's interests and Judas Novell is helping them." | Oct 16 16:50 |
phIRCe | Title: Monomania | Tux Deluxe .::. Size~: 65.23 KB | Oct 16 16:50 |
schestowitz | http://www.insidesocal.com/click/2009/10/mono-a-mano---many-of-us-are-w.html | Oct 16 16:56 |
schestowitz | it's sad that Mono causes issue to GNOME | Oct 16 16:56 |
schestowitz | They can separate the two better | Oct 16 16:57 |
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schestowitz | http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Cornell-CUAUV-Nova/?kc=rss | Oct 16 16:59 |
phIRCe | Title: Linux-based robot sub wins top award - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 64.92 KB | Oct 16 16:59 |
schestowitz | Hey, wallc | Oct 16 16:59 |
wallc | hi! | Oct 16 16:59 |
schestowitz | So who's that rude person who put you off of IRC? | Oct 16 16:59 |
schestowitz | wallc: have you met phIRCe yet? | Oct 16 17:00 |
schestowitz | It kicks for obscene language | Oct 16 17:00 |
wallc | yes, phIRCe and I have met :) | Oct 16 17:00 |
wallc | no comment on the other question...i can see he's loggd in now. | Oct 16 17:02 |
wallc | *logged* | Oct 16 17:02 |
schestowitz | We'll make better effort to control manners | Oct 16 17:02 |
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wallc | well, people are people, can't really control them...i'm not fragile. i just didn't want to be part of the conversation at the time | Oct 16 17:03 |
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schestowitz | wallc: the issue is this | Oct 16 17:05 |
schestowitz | People judge the site based on collective behaviour | Oct 16 17:05 |
schestowitz | As in, link to comments and stuff | Oct 16 17:05 |
schestowitz | And although I don't bring up examples here, I do see it behind the scenes | Oct 16 17:05 |
schestowitz | Endless efforts to whip people who link here using all sorts of fraudulent claims like me blaming Microsoft for Nina Reiser's death (that's a lie) | Oct 16 17:06 |
schestowitz | Others show commenters with anti-Microsoft vitriol | Oct 16 17:07 |
wallc | that's just crazy...who'd believe a thing like that??? | Oct 16 17:07 |
schestowitz | wallc: people who distort stories | Oct 16 17:07 |
schestowitz | And rely on people not verifying the claims | Oct 16 17:07 |
schestowitz | There are worse ones | Oct 16 17:07 |
schestowitz | Like me saying I went on a night out | Oct 16 17:07 |
schestowitz | Trolls distort it as me "going to a gay bar" | Oct 16 17:08 |
schestowitz | Or me giving testimony to the police to help them | Oct 16 17:08 |
schestowitz | Trolls distort this as "me being arrested" | Oct 16 17:08 |
DaemonFC | hmmm | Oct 16 17:08 |
DaemonFC | did something naughty at the gay bar and got arrested? | Oct 16 17:09 |
DaemonFC | :D | Oct 16 17:09 |
schestowitz | So I now keep private life off the record. They distort things | Oct 16 17:09 |
schestowitz | Testimony based on witness account->crime | Oct 16 17:09 |
schestowitz | "Going out"->"being homosexual" | Oct 16 17:09 |
DaemonFC | the last time I went, we were all drunk | Oct 16 17:10 |
DaemonFC | backed into a Cadillac | Oct 16 17:10 |
DaemonFC | whooops | Oct 16 17:10 |
DaemonFC | :D | Oct 16 17:10 |
schestowitz | I can't think of anyone in my family ever having problems with the police | Oct 16 17:11 |
schestowitz | I have a small family anyway.. but still. My only uncle (I have no aunts) is a court judge | Oct 16 17:11 |
Diablo-D3 | [12:05:31] <schestowitz> Endless efforts to whip people who link here using all sorts of fraudulent claims like me blaming Microsoft for Nina Reiser's death (that's a lie) | Oct 16 17:11 |
wallc | well, i know you have to defend yourself from a lot of garbage. it seems like it's overwhelming sometimes. but people with any sense will know better than to believe the garbage, don't you think? | Oct 16 17:13 |
wallc | One thing I know for sure is that lies always come out...always. It's just miserable for those that have to deal with it in the meantime. | Oct 16 17:14 |
schestowitz | wallc: not that. | Oct 16 17:15 |
schestowitz | THe thing is, they needn't more ammo | Oct 16 17:15 |
schestowitz | SOme people at the highest place whose name I can't share do read the site but can't quite link to it | Oct 16 17:16 |
schestowitz | It's because of the 'bad' content | Oct 16 17:16 |
schestowitz | The type of stuff that repels and becomes personal attacks | Oct 16 17:16 |
schestowitz | It used to come from BN comments | Oct 16 17:16 |
schestowitz | Now people need to register to comment, so it's better | Oct 16 17:16 |
wallc | are they specific as to what is considered "bad" content? | Oct 16 17:16 |
schestowitz | People ending posts with a quick "F* you" comment are not helping | Oct 16 17:17 |
schestowitz | wallc: PJ modified comments to obfuscate bad words | Oct 16 17:17 |
schestowitz | Else it becomes like 4chan | Oct 16 17:17 |
wallc | PJ? Obfuscate? I don't think so, she's pretty up-front about deleting comments that don't abide by the forum rules. | Oct 16 17:18 |
schestowitz | wallc: BTW, I don't think I want to share that video of the show | Oct 16 17:18 |
schestowitz | It's just not me | Oct 16 17:18 |
schestowitz | trmanco makes an ogg from the video | Oct 16 17:19 |
trmanco | trying | Oct 16 17:19 |
schestowitz | wallc: my family found out about that show without me mentioning it. | Oct 16 17:19 |
schestowitz | http://odtv.me/2009/10/floss-91/ [video] | Oct 16 17:19 |
wallc | is that a problem? | Oct 16 17:19 |
phIRCe | Title: ODTV | On Demand TWiT Video | all-volunteer and non-commercial .::. Size~: 14.72 KB | Oct 16 17:19 |
schestowitz | My couson (at Davie) says: "No, I listened to the podcast at FLOSS Weekly on TWIT and at the beginning, before you came on they mentioned you would be voice only...Leo said had he known, he would have sent you one beforehand, but then joked (all in fun) that you might not have accepted it since it's not an open source product." | Oct 16 17:19 |
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schestowitz | *cousin | Oct 16 17:19 |
schestowitz | [17:19] <wallc> is that a problem? | Oct 16 17:20 |
wallc | Well, i think you did a great job under the circumstances | Oct 16 17:20 |
schestowitz | had I been myself, it would not be a problem | Oct 16 17:20 |
schestowitz | The thing is, I realise the site is seen as "Controversial" | Oct 16 17:21 |
schestowitz | So any time I go live on a show I'm outnumbered by opposers | Oct 16 17:21 |
kecskebak | I thought you were very good on FLOSS Weekly considering Jono Bacon was trying to aim each known logical fallacy at you in order; Poisoning the Well, Weasel Words, Ad hominem tu quoque - they were all there. | Oct 16 17:21 |
schestowitz | Channels like Fox do this to people | Oct 16 17:21 |
schestowitz | And I don't interrupt questions, even when they contain lots of false information | Oct 16 17:22 |
schestowitz | I lost my calm inside | Oct 16 17:22 |
schestowitz | But didn't quite show it | Oct 16 17:22 |
wallc | but you didn't lose it on the air, and that's what counts | Oct 16 17:22 |
schestowitz | I also brought up almost nothing negative about Microsoft and Novell because negativity does not help any cause | Oct 16 17:23 |
schestowitz | So I was left attacked and unwilling to strike back | Oct 16 17:23 |
wallc | i think you are being much too critical of yourself. | Oct 16 17:23 |
kecskebak | I thought it was very unfair the number of questions that were put to you which began "A lot of people say/think...". That's OK for chatting to friends but not an interview. | Oct 16 17:23 |
schestowitz | People love Leo and Jono; I can't impolitely tell jono off | Oct 16 17:23 |
wallc | i agree... | Oct 16 17:23 |
schestowitz | I spoke yto Jono for like an hour after the show | Oct 16 17:24 |
schestowitz | he's cool, but on the show he was pressured to put forth the classic lies | Oct 16 17:24 |
kecskebak | Who by? | Oct 16 17:24 |
wallc | I agree with kecskebak. | Oct 16 17:24 |
schestowitz | kecskebak: the anti-BN gang | Oct 16 17:24 |
schestowitz | They were all over IRC | Oct 16 17:24 |
schestowitz | Novell and Friends{TM} | Oct 16 17:24 |
schestowitz | People from here were in IRC and saw it | Oct 16 17:25 |
schestowitz | Sockpuppets | Oct 16 17:25 |
schestowitz | http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2009/10/15/microsofts-pinkdanger-backup-problem-blamed-on-roz-ho/ | Oct 16 17:25 |
kecskebak | I was shouting the logical fallacies at my monitor as I heard each one. | Oct 16 17:25 |
schestowitz | Heh! | Oct 16 17:25 |
phIRCe | Title: Microsofts Pink/Danger backup problem blamed on Roz Ho RoughlyDrafted Magazine .::. Size~: 55.52 KB | Oct 16 17:25 |
schestowitz | kecskebak: I ought to have prepared. I never do | Oct 16 17:26 |
schestowitz | Even when I give presentations here I don't prepare really | Oct 16 17:26 |
schestowitz | Just do the slides... or answer questions | Oct 16 17:26 |
schestowitz | The ending was silly cause he gave me this "make your statement" moment | Oct 16 17:27 |
schestowitz | As though I had something structually-coherent prepared | Oct 16 17:27 |
kecskebak | I think he did that to make up for the fact that he felt he went in too hard | Oct 16 17:27 |
schestowitz | And given concision contraints I can only ever recite conventions | Oct 16 17:27 |
schestowitz | Great claims requires great evidence/proof | Oct 16 17:27 |
schestowitz | I can't do it over the phone | Oct 16 17:27 |
wallc | i also got the feeling they knew they'd treated you badly. | Oct 16 17:27 |
kecskebak | Considering how friendly the podcast usually is, that episode sticks out like a sore thumb | Oct 16 17:28 |
schestowitz | Theyn typically host other folks... as programmers | Oct 16 17:28 |
schestowitz | They didn't point out that I too am a FOSS developer | Oct 16 17:28 |
schestowitz | All my projects -- including those I'm hired to write -- are GPLed | Oct 16 17:28 |
schestowitz | Although in one case I was forced to accept BSD for my code | Oct 16 17:29 |
schestowitz | My site is so badly out of date | Oct 16 17:29 |
schestowitz | 2003/2004/5 mostly | Oct 16 17:29 |
schestowitz | I have lots of new code I'll need to upload | Oct 16 17:30 |
schestowitz | http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2009/10/14/lance-ulanoff-and-robbie-bach-explain-why-library-size-doesnt-matter-for-wimo-apps-vs-the-iphone/ | Oct 16 17:30 |
phIRCe | Title: Lance Ulanoff and Robbie Bach explain why library size doesnt matter for WiMo apps vs the iPhone RoughlyDrafted Magazine .::. Size~: 55.79 KB | Oct 16 17:30 |
Balrog | meh idk about Dilger | Oct 16 17:30 |
schestowitz | Dilger published a book | Oct 16 17:31 |
Balrog | he used to be honest but lately he turned into an Apple supporter, even defending apple when it doesn't make sense | Oct 16 17:31 |
Balrog | yea I heard | Oct 16 17:31 |
schestowitz | SO that must have been why RD has been so quiet | Oct 16 17:31 |
schestowitz | jono thinks I should neglect BN to do a book | Oct 16 17:31 |
wallc | Yes! a book! :) | Oct 16 17:31 |
schestowitz | MATLAB managers contacted me in 2004 suggesting that I write a book | Oct 16 17:31 |
schestowitz | I declined | Oct 16 17:31 |
Balrog | he wrote a not-very-nice article about John Gruber, who is very well respected | Oct 16 17:32 |
schestowitz | SO that I can finished more important things at the time | Oct 16 17:32 |
schestowitz | Balrog: Gruber wrote some good stuff about Microsoft | Oct 16 17:32 |
trmanco | http://twitter.com/BrokenWindows_/status/4919571983 | Oct 16 17:32 |
phIRCe | Title: Twitter / Broken Windows: (1/2) Windows7,WindowsExpl ... .::. Size~: 9.28 KB | Oct 16 17:32 |
Balrog | yea. I like his commentary | Oct 16 17:32 |
Balrog | and he's not really one of those people that support Apple no matter what either | Oct 16 17:32 |
Balrog | like Dilger seems to be now | Oct 16 17:33 |
Balrog | his article on Apple dropping UTIs borders on incompetence really | Oct 16 17:33 |
schestowitz | trmanco: so it's like Vista then | Oct 16 17:33 |
trmanco | I guess | Oct 16 17:33 |
Balrog | here's the real story about that: http://arstechnica.com/staff/fatbits/2009/09/metadata-madness.ars | Oct 16 17:34 |
phIRCe | Title: Metadata madness - Ars Technica .::. Size~: 53.21 KB | Oct 16 17:34 |
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Balrog | Dilger said that creator codes aren't necessary anymore because the developer can assign uniform type identifiers hierarchially and give files a certain UTI | Oct 16 17:35 |
schestowitz | http://twitter.com/sudheera/statuses/4913775678 | Oct 16 17:35 |
schestowitz | "mo bacon's B.SHIT on FLOSS Weekly. This time with Boycott Novell. Next book "Art of being a condescending ass"? http://twit.tv/floss91 #TWiT" | Oct 16 17:35 |
phIRCe | Title: Twitter / sudheera: mo bacon's B.SHIT on FLOSS ... .::. Size~: 9.32 KB | Oct 16 17:35 |
phIRCe | Title: The TWiT Netcast Network with Leo Laporte .::. Size~: 22.71 KB | Oct 16 17:35 |
Balrog | but there's no API to select a UTI for a file; that's determined by *extension* | Oct 16 17:35 |
Balrog | that ugly part of the filename | Oct 16 17:35 |
schestowitz | Balrog: I discovered more about kde4 and metadata recently | Oct 16 17:35 |
Balrog | schestowitz: explain. | Oct 16 17:35 |
schestowitz | It's nice how it's kept as you move files around | Oct 16 17:36 |
schestowitz | There's also nepumok | Oct 16 17:36 |
Balrog | OS X supports metadata nicely in the filesystem. But the OS doesn't utilize it as much as it should :( | Oct 16 17:36 |
Balrog | nepomuk? | Oct 16 17:36 |
MinceR | many fs-es support extended attributes, but they're rarely used. | Oct 16 17:36 |
Balrog | I know :( | Oct 16 17:37 |
Balrog | Apple currently uses it to store stuff like where a file was downloaded from | Oct 16 17:37 |
Balrog | or the resource fork (a holdover from the old days) | Oct 16 17:37 |
Balrog | or compressed data with this new filesystem compression | Oct 16 17:37 |
schestowitz | Balrog: yes. | Oct 16 17:38 |
schestowitz | !google nepomuk | Oct 16 17:38 |
phIRCe | [1] - NEPOMUK - The Social Semantic Desktop | http://nepomuk.semanticdesktop.org/ | Oct 16 17:38 |
phIRCe | [2] - Semantic Desktop with KDE | Nepomuk | http://nepomuk.kde.org/ | Oct 16 17:38 |
phIRCe | [3] - NEPOMUK (framework) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEPOMUK_(framework) | Oct 16 17:38 |
phIRCe | [4] - John of Nepomuk - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_of_Nepomuk | Oct 16 17:38 |
Balrog | there's enough room to store a UTI (to replace the type code) and a bundle identifier (to replace the creator code) but they don't :( | Oct 16 17:38 |
Balrog | instead relying only on extensions and dropping creator code support completely in 10.6 | Oct 16 17:38 |
Balrog | many people are upset | Oct 16 17:38 |
Balrog | someone suggested this fix: http://www.openradar.appspot.com/5909813 | Oct 16 17:39 |
phIRCe | Title: rdar://5909813: Request for an updated document typing/ownership model .::. Size~: 15.88 KB | Oct 16 17:39 |
Balrog | read it; it's not mac specific | Oct 16 17:39 |
Balrog | (rdar: is not important here) | Oct 16 17:39 |
schestowitz | NASA IT security is vulnerable < http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1558884/nasa-it-security-vulnerable > | Oct 16 17:40 |
MinceR | expecting crApple to innovate is futile. maybe they'll consider doing it once a major FLOSS OS/DE does it. | Oct 16 17:40 |
schestowitz | Or just fork it | Oct 16 17:42 |
schestowitz | KDEkit | Oct 16 17:42 |
MinceR | lol | Oct 16 17:42 |
MinceR | indeed | Oct 16 17:42 |
Balrog | well apple is known to bend if there's enough pressure | Oct 16 17:42 |
schestowitz | Google to resume hiring, acquisitions http://infotech.indiatimes.com/news/internet/Google-to-resume-hiring-acquisitions/articleshow/5130154.cms | Oct 16 17:42 |
MinceR | though using the entirety of KDE instead of the proprietary mess they keep coming up with would be probably the greatest step forward for them | Oct 16 17:42 |
schestowitz | KDE4 impressed me a lot, still | Oct 16 17:43 |
Balrog | MinceR: unfortunately, KDE != ObjC/Cocoa | Oct 16 17:43 |
MinceR | they had an opportunity when they did osx, sadly they didn't. | Oct 16 17:43 |
schestowitz | kde is mostly c++ | Oct 16 17:43 |
Balrog | they'd be better off working with GNUStep but I don't know if that will happen | Oct 16 17:43 |
MinceR | Balrog: indeed, C++/Qt/KDE > ObjC/Cocoa | Oct 16 17:43 |
Balrog | MinceR: you think so | Oct 16 17:43 |
Balrog | others may not | Oct 16 17:43 |
schestowitz | c++ developers know what they do | Oct 16 17:43 |
MinceR | others may be wrong. | Oct 16 17:43 |
schestowitz | They also collaborate a lot with libs | Oct 16 17:43 |
Balrog | or you may be wrong. | Oct 16 17:43 |
Balrog | or it may be a subjective matter | Oct 16 17:44 |
schestowitz | Not sure how Apple does in that repsect | Oct 16 17:44 |
schestowitz | Many KDE classes are shared | Oct 16 17:44 |
Balrog | schestowitz: what do you mean? | Oct 16 17:44 |
schestowitz | my editor (kate) is just a component of kdevelop (kpart) | Oct 16 17:44 |
schestowitz | My editor in knode is also a reuse of some other kde code | Oct 16 17:44 |
MinceR | in any case, implementing macos look-and-feel on top of a GNU/Linux system is pretty trivial | Oct 16 17:44 |
schestowitz | ThunderBrowse uses Gecko | Oct 16 17:44 |
Balrog | well in Mac OS, Apple just has text editor classes | Oct 16 17:44 |
MinceR | and would result in a better system than any of the macos-es so far. | Oct 16 17:45 |
Balrog | in the Cocoa libraries | Oct 16 17:45 |
schestowitz | OK | Oct 16 17:45 |
Balrog | Textedit and Xcode use the same classes | Oct 16 17:45 |
schestowitz | That's why I said I don't know | Oct 16 17:45 |
MinceR | (especially if a change in look-and-feel on the scale of os9->osx is acceptable) | Oct 16 17:45 |
schestowitz | I reserved judgment | Oct 16 17:45 |
Balrog | well just so you know, the Cocoa API is extremely rich | Oct 16 17:45 |
schestowitz | " change in look-and-feel"? | Oct 16 17:45 |
schestowitz | Heh. | Oct 16 17:45 |
schestowitz | Not in Apple world | Oct 16 17:45 |
Balrog | it's so huge that many beginning programmers get lost with the weight | Oct 16 17:46 |
MinceR | they did change it | Oct 16 17:46 |
schestowitz | You can change a lot more _in WINDOWS_ | Oct 16 17:46 |
MinceR | see os9->osx | Oct 16 17:46 |
Balrog | this is on the Mac; the iPhone is a different story | Oct 16 17:46 |
Balrog | heh, I'm not talking about what you can change | Oct 16 17:46 |
Balrog | I'm talking about what they give the programmer to work with | Oct 16 17:46 |
schestowitz | MinceR: yes, they changed it, then left no room for hackability | Oct 16 17:46 |
MinceR | they never leave room for that | Oct 16 17:46 |
schestowitz | You must agree to how Mr. Jobs loves to work | Oct 16 17:46 |
MinceR | and it's costing them | Oct 16 17:46 |
MinceR | they take a lot more effort to develop it and end up with a lot less value | Oct 16 17:47 |
schestowitz | Not really | Oct 16 17:47 |
schestowitz | It's the whole "control the image" (or "get the Mac experience(TM)") | Oct 16 17:47 |
Balrog | fortunately, Mac OS X isn't locked down like the iPhone | Oct 16 17:47 |
schestowitz | You can't trim down OS X much | Oct 16 17:47 |
Balrog | and it's not difficult to inject code; not trivial, but not that hard | Oct 16 17:47 |
schestowitz | But then again, they control what h/w you have available | Oct 16 17:48 |
MinceR | only if you consider being locked-down part of the experience | Oct 16 17:48 |
schestowitz | You can use euphemisms and marketing to judtify this | Oct 16 17:48 |
schestowitz | Lockin=good | Oct 16 17:48 |
schestowitz | Taking orders=easy | Oct 16 17:48 |
Balrog | well I don't. I refuse to buy a device from any company that can't be jailbroken / accessed fully | Oct 16 17:48 |
schestowitz | Droping bombs =easy | Oct 16 17:48 |
schestowitz | [for you] | Oct 16 17:48 |
MinceR | bbl, going home | Oct 16 17:49 |
schestowitz | Not for those 30,000 feet beneath.. where you can't hear the screams and see the blood | Oct 16 17:49 |
Balrog | I wonder why apple didn't do anything significant about jailbreaking until now | Oct 16 17:49 |
schestowitz | It's the idea that you can sell preference | Oct 16 17:49 |
schestowitz | So Apple can tell people that choice is bad | Oct 16 17:49 |
schestowitz | Many distros=bad is like "War is peace" | Oct 16 17:49 |
schestowitz | They repeat it many times for it to be assumed a truism | Oct 16 17:49 |
Balrog | I think Jon Zdziarski got it right: http://twitter.com/jzdziarski/status/4903342975 http://twitter.com/jzdziarski/status/4903395302 | Oct 16 17:50 |
phIRCe | Title: Twitter / Jonathan Zdziarski: None of these anti-jailbre ... .::. Size~: 9.33 KB | Oct 16 17:50 |
schestowitz | You don't say "many cars"=bad | Oct 16 17:50 |
phIRCe | Title: Twitter / Jonathan Zdziarski: You'd think that running a ... .::. Size~: 9.32 KB | Oct 16 17:50 |
schestowitz | You like choice | Oct 16 17:50 |
schestowitz | Even if many cars use the same components | Oct 16 17:50 |
schestowitz | Often from the same suppliers, e.g. Goodyear | Oct 16 17:50 |
schestowitz | "What a waste!!!" | Oct 16 17:50 |
schestowitz | "There will never be the year of the automobile" | Oct 16 17:50 |
Balrog | did you look at those two tweets? | Oct 16 17:51 |
schestowitz | They spend too much time "reinventing the wheel" | Oct 16 17:51 |
schestowitz | Just buy Edsel | Oct 16 17:51 |
schestowitz | Balrog: good twits | Oct 16 17:51 |
schestowitz | Surgeries and plants are a form of reverse engineering to invent | Oct 16 17:52 |
Balrog | yea. I was lucky enough to get a jailbreakable and unlockable device. I may eventually sell it for $$$$$ | Oct 16 17:52 |
Balrog | yes exactly | Oct 16 17:52 |
Balrog | implants * | Oct 16 17:52 |
schestowitz | All scientists were like that | Oct 16 17:53 |
schestowitz | Tinkerers | Oct 16 17:53 |
schestowitz | Google too | Oct 16 17:53 |
schestowitz | Hacking with GNU | Oct 16 17:53 |
schestowitz | in a garage | Oct 16 17:53 |
Balrog | hopefully when the Apple // ATT contract runs out this may change. I'm not holding my breath though | Oct 16 17:53 |
schestowitz | Messing about with old commodity PCs | Oct 16 17:53 |
Balrog | yea exactly | Oct 16 17:53 |
schestowitz | http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/10/16/yahoo-shutting-down-paid-inclusion | Oct 16 17:54 |
phIRCe | Title: Yahoo Shutting Down Paid Inclusion | WebProNews .::. Size~: 28.96 KB | Oct 16 17:54 |
schestowitz | A shame to begin with | Oct 16 17:54 |
schestowitz | Web... by the rich for the rich? | Oct 16 17:54 |
Balrog | schestowitz: the yahoo article? | Oct 16 17:55 |
schestowitz | Hehe: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8310277.stm | Oct 16 17:57 |
phIRCe | Title: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 84.9 KB | Oct 16 17:57 |
Balrog | meh I wonder what kine | Oct 16 17:57 |
schestowitz | More cancer, more distractions, more surveillance, more cost | Oct 16 17:57 |
Balrog | kind * | Oct 16 17:57 |
schestowitz | Balrog: yes, that one | Oct 16 17:58 |
Balrog | I know that some of the leading forensics experts consider the BlackBerry to be very secure | Oct 16 17:58 |
schestowitz | Also, the shills fight the FTC right now | Oct 16 17:58 |
DaemonFC | Balrog, AT&T bought out Centennial and so I have to keep them til June | Oct 16 17:58 |
DaemonFC | ick | Oct 16 17:58 |
Balrog | arghh | Oct 16 17:58 |
schestowitz | http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/10/16/key-perspectives-on-the-ftc-blogger-guidelines | Oct 16 17:58 |
phIRCe | Title: Key Perspectives on the FTC Blogger Guidelines | WebProNews .::. Size~: 31.41 KB | Oct 16 17:58 |
Balrog | well I have no other choice | Oct 16 17:58 |
DaemonFC | they have to honor my existing rates though | Oct 16 17:58 |
schestowitz | "how dare they stop the shills?" | Oct 16 17:58 |
Balrog | verizon is $$$$$ and bad coverage | Oct 16 17:58 |
Balrog | err | Oct 16 17:58 |
Balrog | bad customer service | Oct 16 17:58 |
Balrog | t-mobile is HORRIBLE coverage | Oct 16 17:58 |
Balrog | as is sprint | Oct 16 17:59 |
schestowitz | "Executives from IBM and Intel were arrested today amid allegations they were involved in an insider trading scam." http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/10/16/ibm_intel_insider_trading/ | Oct 16 17:59 |
phIRCe | Title: IBM, Intel execs arrested over alleged insider trading • The Register .::. Size~: 21.06 KB | Oct 16 17:59 |
schestowitz | What about Microsoft? | Oct 16 17:59 |
schestowitz | They forgot people like Bach | Oct 16 18:00 |
schestowitz | They should consider arresting him too | Oct 16 18:00 |
schestowitz | He got caught | Oct 16 18:00 |
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schestowitz | Hi, kecskebak | Oct 16 18:04 |
schestowitz | *koe | Oct 16 18:04 |
kecskebak | schestowitz: Hi! | Oct 16 18:04 |
schestowitz | wb, koe, do you want feedback on that submission? | Oct 16 18:05 |
schestowitz | kecskebak: thanks for the support. I had an auto-complete oopsie there | Oct 16 18:05 |
kecskebak | No problem :) | Oct 16 18:05 |
schestowitz | koe works on a long paper for the EC Com. to read | Oct 16 18:06 |
*Adus has quit () | Oct 16 18:06 | |
schestowitz | ^^And Adus is a Microsoft UK employee | Oct 16 18:06 |
koe | HI all. | Oct 16 18:06 |
koe | http://www.jukkarannila.fi/lausunnot.html#nro_17 | Oct 16 18:07 |
phIRCe | Title: Jukka Rannilan kotisivut .::. Size~: 31.62 KB | Oct 16 18:07 |
koe | There it is. The FIRST document, not the LONG document | Oct 16 18:07 |
schestowitz | El Reg gave Pre a bad review: http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/10/16/review_phone_palm_pre/ | Oct 16 18:07 |
phIRCe | Title: Palm Pre smartphone • Register Hardware .::. Size~: 21.09 KB | Oct 16 18:07 |
schestowitz | I thought about buying a Pre when my Palm Tungsten dies | Oct 16 18:07 |
schestowitz | Today: http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/10/16/pre_launch_day/ | Oct 16 18:07 |
phIRCe | Title: Palm Pré arrives in Blighty • Register Hardware .::. Size~: 18.7 KB | Oct 16 18:08 |
koe | That first document is just my feedback for the first consultation of the Commission. | Oct 16 18:08 |
schestowitz | 6 pdfs | Oct 16 18:09 |
koe | http://www.jukkarannila.fi/docs/Web_Edition_39.530_Opinion_Jukka_Rannila.pdf | Oct 16 18:09 |
phIRCe | Title: Not a web page! Aborting application/pdf type .::. Size~: 0 KB | Oct 16 18:09 |
koe | That is the Opinion. | Oct 16 18:09 |
koe | One PDF. | Oct 16 18:09 |
schestowitz | Are you in the field of law? | Oct 16 18:10 |
koe | NO: | Oct 16 18:10 |
schestowitz | You format it paragraophically | Oct 16 18:10 |
koe | I am just a concerned citizen of Finland. | Oct 16 18:10 |
schestowitz | *paragraphically | Oct 16 18:10 |
koe | Well. I took two law courses in the university. | Oct 16 18:11 |
schestowitz | I see the screenshots now | Oct 16 18:12 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: I'm still loving this AMD/ATI rig | Oct 16 18:12 |
DaemonFC | It works so much better than that Intel/Nvidia setup | Oct 16 18:12 |
schestowitz | Heh. EU uses LateX :-) | Oct 16 18:13 |
schestowitz | I see the hyphenation | Oct 16 18:13 |
schestowitz | *LaTeX | Oct 16 18:14 |
koe | Well. I do not know anything of LateX. | Oct 16 18:14 |
koe | Anyway. | Oct 16 18:15 |
*schestowitz looks at http://www.jukkarannila.fi/ODF_OOXML.html | Oct 16 18:15 | |
phIRCe | Title: Jukka Rannilan kotisivut .::. Size~: 36.99 KB | Oct 16 18:15 |
schestowitz | It's mostly in Finnish | Oct 16 18:15 |
schestowitz | I'll mail this to a friend of mine from there; he's into it too | Oct 16 18:15 |
koe | If somebody wants to make a second opinion, I can help with writing. | Oct 16 18:16 |
schestowitz | koe: it's hard yto edit | Oct 16 18:16 |
schestowitz | And laborious to do with static and no diffs | Oct 16 18:17 |
schestowitz | I like history+diffs cause then no text is ever really lost, just passed aside to being optional | Oct 16 18:17 |
koe | Well. If there is interested persons, we can negotiate on editing measures. | Oct 16 18:18 |
schestowitz | " | Oct 16 18:18 |
schestowitz | Landmark ISP piracy case could kick thousands offline | Oct 16 18:18 |
schestowitz | A landmark Australian court case could see thousands of Australians losing their internet connection, and has major implications worldwide for the law on copyright. | Oct 16 18:18 |
schestowitz | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/10/16/australian_court_isp_piracy/ | Oct 16 18:18 |
phIRCe | Title: Landmark ISP piracy case could kick thousands offline • The Register .::. Size~: 24.14 KB | Oct 16 18:18 |
schestowitz | " | Oct 16 18:18 |
schestowitz | Confused message on UK broadband | Oct 16 18:18 |
schestowitz | Finland has made broadband a 'legal right', leading experts to question whether the UK government is similarly committed. | Oct 16 18:18 |
schestowitz | http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8311081.stm | Oct 16 18:18 |
phIRCe | Title: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 84.9 KB | Oct 16 18:18 |
schestowitz | koe: I mailed another who looks into the same thing in FI | Oct 16 18:19 |
koe | You should also look, what they did in Sweden.... | Oct 16 18:20 |
koe | Well. There is some time before 7 October, when to the Opinions should be in the Commission. | Oct 16 18:21 |
schestowitz | http://www.nuxified.org/blog/kde4-overtaking-gnome-terms-usability | Oct 16 18:22 |
phIRCe | Title: KDE4 overtaking GNOME in terms of usability? | Nuxified.org .::. Size~: 60.78 KB | Oct 16 18:22 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_juniper_scaling&num=1 | Oct 16 18:23 |
phIRCe | Title: [Phoronix] More AMD Radeon 5770 Linux Benchmarks .::. Size~: 19.08 KB | Oct 16 18:23 |
schestowitz | koe: what in Sweden? | Oct 16 18:24 |
schestowitz | OOXML fiasco? | Oct 16 18:24 |
schestowitz | Finland has its Microsoft fiascos too | Oct 16 18:24 |
koe | Well. According to my memory, the state was active in fibres, i.e. paying the cost of the major fibre installations. | Oct 16 18:25 |
Diablo-D3 | you know what Im wondering? | Oct 16 18:25 |
Diablo-D3 | why the 57xx are out already | Oct 16 18:25 |
koe | In Sweden, not in FIN. | Oct 16 18:25 |
Diablo-D3 | the 58xx just came out | Oct 16 18:25 |
schestowitz | koe: just for example: http://www.google.com/search?q=site:boycottnovell.com+finland&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&ie=UTF-8&hl=en-GB | Oct 16 18:25 |
phIRCe | Title: site:boycottnovell.com finland - Google Search .::. Size~: 24.28 KB | Oct 16 18:25 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: On the phone with a friend who was diagnosed Bipolar | Oct 16 18:26 |
DaemonFC | I told him to refuse the Symbyax the doc gave him | Oct 16 18:26 |
DaemonFC | go back and demand Lithium Carbonate or Depakote | Oct 16 18:26 |
koe | Dont shooot me sending a Microsoft page link next. | Oct 16 18:29 |
koe | http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2009/oct09/10-07statement.mspx | Oct 16 18:29 |
phIRCe | Title: Statement: Microsoft Welcomes European Commission Market Testing Announcement: A statement by Brad Smith, General Counsel, Microsoft Corporation, regarding the European Commission’s decision to market test a set of measures Microsoft has offered to address competition law issues relating to Windows, Office and other high volume products. .::. Size~: 58.22 KB | Oct 16 18:29 |
koe | I have been working on that Interoperability Commitment. | Oct 16 18:30 |
schestowitz | koe: he also spoke to the CNET puppet | Oct 16 18:30 |
schestowitz | Ina Fried | Oct 16 18:30 |
schestowitz | IIRC | Oct 16 18:30 |
schestowitz | It's all PR | Oct 16 18:30 |
schestowitz | Interoperability Commitment is more relevant to my work (and to FOSS) | Oct 16 18:31 |
koe | Well. Commission is gathering feedback about that Interoperability Commitment proposal. | Oct 16 18:31 |
schestowitz | Browser case was brought forth by opera software (non-Free) | Oct 16 18:31 |
schestowitz | Netscape was also non-Free when Microsoft committed the crimes it's now being punished for | Oct 16 18:31 |
schestowitz | They shouldn't call it Interoperability | Oct 16 18:32 |
schestowitz | They should call it standards | Oct 16 18:32 |
koe | Interoperability Commitment is different issue. | Oct 16 18:32 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Nothing wrong with Opera | Oct 16 18:32 |
DaemonFC | it conforms to web standards | Oct 16 18:32 |
koe | Than Opera case - I mean. | Oct 16 18:32 |
schestowitz | I wrote an article about this: http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/article.php/3714211 | Oct 16 18:32 |
phIRCe | Title: The Laws of Open Standards Broken by Interoperability — Datamation.com .::. Size~: 73.15 KB | Oct 16 18:32 |
DaemonFC | Firefox has invented a lot of its own crap over the years | Oct 16 18:32 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: yes, but not the point | Oct 16 18:33 |
schestowitz | Microsoft's fights against FOSS with patents, using the 'interop' BS | Oct 16 18:33 |
schestowitz | They should just implement standards | Oct 16 18:33 |
schestowitz | Then the whole patent nonsense no longer applies | Oct 16 18:33 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: moz- selectors don't hinder access | Oct 16 18:34 |
schestowitz | Nothing like ActiveX | Oct 16 18:34 |
DaemonFC | still, no reason to bag on Opera | Oct 16 18:34 |
cubezzz | a lot of the web is craptasic | Oct 16 18:35 |
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cubezzz | flash itself | Oct 16 18:36 |
cubezzz | although firefox is a standard of a sort | Oct 16 18:37 |
koe | I guess I made my point. Interested people can contact me by email. | Oct 16 18:38 |
cubezzz | Microsoft tried to take over the web, and failed, but they successfully crapped it up | Oct 16 18:38 |
cubezzz | I wouldn't be surprised if Microsoft tried to take over ISPs | Oct 16 18:39 |
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cubezzz | did Orcale take over SUN? | Oct 16 18:42 |
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schestowitz | koe: I senr the links around | Oct 16 18:43 |
schestowitz | *sent | Oct 16 18:43 |
schestowitz | Actually, I'll post it later as well | Oct 16 18:43 |
schestowitz | cubezzz: not yet | Oct 16 18:43 |
koe | Use link: http://www.jukkarannila.fi/lausunnot.html#nro_17 | Oct 16 18:43 |
phIRCe | Title: Jukka Rannilan kotisivut .::. Size~: 31.62 KB | Oct 16 18:43 |
mrsteveman1 | MS did spend a lot of time focusing on MSN rather than the internet back in the 90s | Oct 16 18:43 |
koe | There will definetely be more Opinions about different things. | Oct 16 18:44 |
mrsteveman1 | but so did AOL | Oct 16 18:44 |
koe | So. This was opinion no. 17. | Oct 16 18:44 |
cubezzz | MSN was actually an ISP? | Oct 16 18:44 |
cubezzz | or no? | Oct 16 18:45 |
mrsteveman1 | they had dial-up numbers yes | Oct 16 18:45 |
schestowitz | koe: "stronly" > "strognly" | Oct 16 18:45 |
koe | Typos happen. | Oct 16 18:45 |
mrsteveman1 | some of the MSN dial up numbers are still working too | Oct 16 18:45 |
mrsteveman1 | i know people who still use it | Oct 16 18:46 |
koe | I think I quit now, you got the links. | Oct 16 18:46 |
koe | Bye. | Oct 16 18:46 |
schestowitz | ta ra | Oct 16 18:46 |
cubezzz | so what do Mainframes use for browser? | Oct 16 18:48 |
DaemonFC | hmmm, this new modem Comcast gave me is IPv6 compliant | Oct 16 18:48 |
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cubezzz | I guess they could port lynx? :) | Oct 16 18:49 |
cubezzz | 64-bit mainframe for $40K used | Oct 16 18:54 |
schestowitz | mainframes with browsers? | Oct 16 18:58 |
schestowitz | That's like having Windows 'Server' with Solitaire | Oct 16 18:58 |
mrsteveman1 | windows server does ship with solitaire doesn't it? | Oct 16 19:00 |
cubezzz | :) | Oct 16 19:00 |
cubezzz | I should try running solitaire at Chapters, they use Windows Server 2003 | Oct 16 19:01 |
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schestowitz | mrsteveman1: I think it comes with WMP | Oct 16 19:07 |
schestowitz | For sysadmins to listen to music on their servers, maybe..... or for more buffer overflows :-D | Oct 16 19:08 |
mrsteveman1 | i remember when turning server 2003 into a workstation was all the rage | Oct 16 19:10 |
mrsteveman1 | there were packs available to reinstall all the stuff missing | Oct 16 19:10 |
mrsteveman1 | i don't remember what was missing though | Oct 16 19:11 |
cubezzz | it's OK | Oct 16 19:11 |
cubezzz | I don't use doze :-0 | Oct 16 19:11 |
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schestowitz | Windows server is the bicycle of sysadmins | Oct 16 19:13 |
schestowitz | The adults use UNIX or Linux | Oct 16 19:13 |
schestowitz | The motorcycle | Oct 16 19:13 |
schestowitz | Windows is OK to test some stuff on, as PHP devs do (on their desktop) | Oct 16 19:13 |
cubezzz | any portable FOSS OS will do :) | Oct 16 19:13 |
schestowitz | But 95% of them deploy on Linux | Oct 16 19:13 |
mrsteveman1 | i can't imagine trying to run a php app on windows | Oct 16 19:13 |
schestowitz | LSE was tested on Windows | Oct 16 19:13 |
schestowitz | Not it's time for prime time | Oct 16 19:14 |
mrsteveman1 | i use osx for local testing of php once in a while | Oct 16 19:14 |
mrsteveman1 | but otherwise its easier to just setup another apache vhost somewhere | Oct 16 19:14 |
schestowitz | So they bought a company to replace the TechDirect (prototype) | Oct 16 19:14 |
schestowitz | some people tried doing WordPress on Windows | Oct 16 19:14 |
schestowitz | An online mate of mine tried and it kept crashing | Oct 16 19:15 |
schestowitz | It was funny for me to watch | Oct 16 19:15 |
schestowitz | Made me feel proud of Linux in a selfish sort of way | Oct 16 19:15 |
mrsteveman1 | yea | Oct 16 19:16 |
mrsteveman1 | you guys may be interested in this http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2009/10/15/microsofts-pinkdanger-backup-problem-blamed-on-roz-ho/ | Oct 16 19:16 |
phIRCe | Title: Microsofts Pink/Danger backup problem blamed on Roz Ho RoughlyDrafted Magazine .::. Size~: 56.26 KB | Oct 16 19:16 |
cubezzz | I've been bitching about windos the longest, I deserve a prize or something | Oct 16 19:16 |
cubezzz | windows | Oct 16 19:16 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] "...looking to recruit Glaswegian interpreters to help business clients who are baffled by the local dialect." http://ping.fm/28OHQ | Oct 16 19:16 | |
phIRCe | Title: BBC NEWS | UK | Scotland | Glasgow, Lanarkshire and West | Firm seeks Glaswegian interpreter .::. Size~: 51.96 KB | Oct 16 19:16 |
schestowitz | mrsteveman1: I brought that same post up a couple of hours ago | Oct 16 19:20 |
mrsteveman1 | ah | Oct 16 19:20 |
schestowitz | News is slow toda, fortunately | Oct 16 19:20 |
schestowitz | I haven't much to catch up with this weekend | Oct 16 19:20 |
schestowitz | Just a contest | Oct 16 19:20 |
mutx | unless they get "grounds keeper willie" as the interpreter | Oct 16 19:21 |
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sebsebseb | hi | Oct 16 19:26 |
schestowitz | Another borrowed spokesperson for the RIAA: http://techdirt.com/articles/20091015/1836306554.shtml | Oct 16 19:30 |
phIRCe | Title: Garth Brooks Complains That The Gov't Ignores Musicians | Techdirt .::. Size~: 65.33 KB | Oct 16 19:30 |
schestowitz | First Lily, now Brooks? I'm running out of musicians to appreciate. | Oct 16 19:30 |
schestowitz | !google youtube lily cbs interview | Oct 16 19:30 |
phIRCe | [1] - YouTube - Lily Interview Part Two | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3D7rgaPi5jZqI | Oct 16 19:30 |
phIRCe | [2] - YouTube - Hispanic Lifestyle interview with Danny Pino of Cold ... | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DRsLEv-FEEhY | Oct 16 19:30 |
phIRCe | [3] - Lily Allen desperate to interview Britain's Queen Elizabeth. at ... | http://www.theinsider.com/news/675855_Lily_Allen_desperate_to_interview_Britain_s_Queen_Elizabeth. | Oct 16 19:30 |
phIRCe | [4] - Top Cobie Smulders Videos | http://www.metacafe.com/tags/cobie_smulders/page-4/ | Oct 16 19:30 |
schestowitz | She's not so smart, IMHO | Oct 16 19:31 |
schestowitz | But they are victims | Oct 16 19:31 |
schestowitz | They believe the fake numbers from the RIAA | Oct 16 19:32 |
cubezzz | 32GB compact flash cards, and it's sl-5500 compatible | Oct 16 19:32 |
cubezzz | my first hard drive was 20 megs :) | Oct 16 19:33 |
mrsteveman1 | ah kids, in my day we booted right to a 5.25" floppy and we were grateful for the privilege | Oct 16 19:34 |
cubezzz | mrsteveman1, I'm pre-5.25" | Oct 16 19:34 |
cubezzz | I have 8" | Oct 16 19:34 |
mrsteveman1 | i've never seen one of those | Oct 16 19:34 |
mutx | cassette interface, and "cload". | Oct 16 19:35 |
cubezzz | Plato system used those at CDC, back when there was a CDC | Oct 16 19:35 |
mrsteveman1 | i did have a sinclair | Oct 16 19:35 |
cubezzz | I don't remember cload, I remember load"blah",1 | Oct 16 19:36 |
mrsteveman1 | but not when they were released, probably 10 years later | Oct 16 19:36 |
cubezzz | 32GB on a computer than fits in your pocket, that's SF level | Oct 16 19:38 |
schestowitz | http://www.kdenews.org/2009/10/15/linux-journal-reviews-kdenlive | Oct 16 19:38 |
phIRCe | Title: Linux Journal Reviews Kdenlive | KDE.news .::. Size~: 9.98 KB | Oct 16 19:39 |
*schestowitz unable to grasp Kdenlive UI within minutes of trying | Oct 16 19:39 | |
schestowitz | Couldn't clip a subsection of a video for example | Oct 16 19:39 |
cubezzz | schestowitz, I never got to see your interview | Oct 16 19:44 |
mutx | u can download it | Oct 16 19:45 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[omar_s_hafez] A MUST watch: http://bit.ly/3OSDV8 | Oct 16 19:47 | |
phIRCe | Title: YouTube - A Catholic TV asked Yusuf Estes Why he Converted to Islam .::. Size~: 115.25 KB | Oct 16 19:47 |
Balrog | heh, that data loss bug in Mac OS X will be fixed in the next point release. Still it shouldn't happen, but I don't know anyone who uses guest accounts | Oct 16 19:51 |
Balrog | you know, I should install kde on this ubuntu system | Oct 16 19:51 |
Omar87 | It seems ThePirateBay is dead. | Oct 16 19:54 |
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Omar87 | I just don't understand, of all the torrent websites on Earth, why did they punish ThePirateBay in particular?? | Oct 16 19:56 |
sebsebseb | Omar87: ,because it is/was the most used? | Oct 16 19:57 |
trmanco | I wonder if skype for ubuntu puts on any trash into the system | Oct 16 19:58 |
trmanco | like update processes or something like that, anybody have a clue? | Oct 16 19:58 |
schestowitz | Matt Aslett defends "open core" *Sigh* http://openbookonbi.blogspot.com/2009/03/building-on-success-of-open-core-guest.html | Oct 16 20:01 |
phIRCe | Title: The Open Book on BI: Building on the Success of Open Core, guest post by Matt Aslett .::. Size~: 123.21 KB | Oct 16 20:01 |
schestowitz | He posts this in a blog that looks to justify the model | Oct 16 20:02 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[omar_s_hafez] Man! #LiveLeak is pretty good! Too bad it doesn't offer #OGG as a conversion format option though. | Oct 16 20:04 | |
schestowitz | http://www.downloadsquad.com/2009/10/15/couchdb-dev-unwittingly-gives-ubuntu-users-cloud-based-nightmare/ | Oct 16 20:07 |
phIRCe | Title: CouchDB dev unwittingly gives Ubuntu users cloud-based nightmares .::. Size~: 73.4 KB | Oct 16 20:07 |
schestowitz | Ah... that picture again: http://www.examiner.com/x-9438-SF-Business-Tech-Examiner~y2009m10d15-Snow-Leopard-and-Windows-7-battle | Oct 16 20:10 |
phIRCe | Title: SF Business Tech Examiner .::. Size~: 70.01 KB | Oct 16 20:10 |
schestowitz | "Incidentally, I'm neither Mac nor PC. I'm Ubuntu." http://www.dailygamecock.com/viewpoints/tete-a-tete-pcs-superior-1.778954 | Oct 16 20:11 |
phIRCe | Title: The Daily Gamecock - Tete a tete: PCs superior .::. Size~: 55.97 KB | Oct 16 20:12 |
schestowitz | Makes me wonder | Oct 16 20:12 |
schestowitz | I could make up for this poor one by making more audio that's proper | Oct 16 20:13 |
schestowitz | One thought I had was shortly audio to go with daily links and summarise key points | Oct 16 20:13 |
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schestowitz | *Short | Oct 16 20:13 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Alguem consegue advinhar o país em que o preço da Gasolina por litro está a ¢92 ?? | Oct 16 20:15 | |
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MinceR | Balrog: i think that article overcomplicates things in an attempt to defend the existence of creator codes | Oct 16 20:25 |
MinceR | i'm not even sure if the preferred app really belongs there | Oct 16 20:25 |
schestowitz | BTW, I paste a lot in #boycottnovell-sociakl | Oct 16 20:26 |
MinceR | a preference-ordered MIME type list should be sufficient | Oct 16 20:26 |
schestowitz | Thus the above | Oct 16 20:26 |
schestowitz | Freenode doesn't like many lines | Oct 16 20:26 |
MinceR | schestowitz: you could try using a pastebin or rate-limiting yourself | Oct 16 20:26 |
schestowitz | #boycottnovell-social I mean | Oct 16 20:26 |
schestowitz | MinceR: I suppose I could. | Oct 16 20:26 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Pravastatin on Tuesday is what they may put me on | Oct 16 20:38 |
DaemonFC | my friend is the lab tech there and told me my cholesterol was too high | Oct 16 20:38 |
DaemonFC | :P | Oct 16 20:38 |
schestowitz | I just spoke about you somewhere | Oct 16 20:38 |
schestowitz | Regarding health care | Oct 16 20:38 |
DaemonFC | I tried giving the rabbit food a try a while back and it didn't lower it enough | Oct 16 20:39 |
schestowitz | Rabbit food is bad quality | Oct 16 20:39 |
schestowitz | Why would you touch the thing? | Oct 16 20:39 |
schestowitz | Don't tell me you share a bowl of food with your kitty | Oct 16 20:39 |
DaemonFC | no, I meant vegetarian diet | Oct 16 20:40 |
DaemonFC | tried to get my cholesterol under control with that | Oct 16 20:40 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Lockheed Snags $31 Million To Reinvent the Internet, Microsoft To Help - Some never learn http://tinyurl.com/ykq6fzz | Oct 16 20:40 | |
phIRCe | Title: Slashdot Technology Story | Lockheed Snags $31 Million To Reinvent the Internet, Microsoft To Help .::. Size~: 142.22 KB | Oct 16 20:40 |
DaemonFC | lost some weight but the cholesterol barely went down at all | Oct 16 20:40 |
schestowitz | Ah./ | Oct 16 20:43 |
schestowitz | I don't know vegan terminology so well | Oct 16 20:43 |
schestowitz | "Rabbit food" | Oct 16 20:43 |
DaemonFC | they basically don't know where the seizures came from, so they're trying to help me eliminate as many possible contributing factors as they can | Oct 16 20:43 |
DaemonFC | the blood pressure was way out of control | Oct 16 20:43 |
DaemonFC | I call it rabbit food | Oct 16 20:43 |
DaemonFC | pejorative term | Oct 16 20:43 |
schestowitz | Most animals are vegans I think | Oct 16 20:43 |
DaemonFC | can't live on that shit | Oct 16 20:44 |
schestowitz | But we all digest small organism at some level, so...... | Oct 16 20:44 |
DaemonFC | almost every vegan I've seen gets discolored and rail thin | Oct 16 20:44 |
schestowitz | I guess all mastication of lethal to /some/ "life" | Oct 16 20:44 |
DaemonFC | looks like a stiff breeze could knock them over | Oct 16 20:44 |
schestowitz | That's derogatory | Oct 16 20:44 |
schestowitz | No need for that remark | Oct 16 20:44 |
DaemonFC | it's also true | Oct 16 20:45 |
DaemonFC | I don't feel like being 50 pounds underweight and pale | Oct 16 20:45 |
schestowitz | Better than dead | Oct 16 20:45 |
DaemonFC | I don't know if it's just because they're lacking a proper diet | Oct 16 20:45 |
DaemonFC | or because it's so disgusting that they have to force themselves to eat | Oct 16 20:45 |
schestowitz | http://www.downloadsquad.com/2009/10/15/couchdb-dev-unwittingly-gives-ubuntu-users-cloud-based-nightmare/ | Oct 16 20:46 |
phIRCe | Title: CouchDB dev unwittingly gives Ubuntu users cloud-based nightmares .::. Size~: 73.54 KB | Oct 16 20:46 |
DaemonFC | they're just on another end of an extreme | Oct 16 20:46 |
schestowitz | I could be over 100kg had there not been this competition that's endurance-based | Oct 16 20:46 |
DaemonFC | various nutrient deficiencies | Oct 16 20:46 |
DaemonFC | like B12 especially | Oct 16 20:46 |
schestowitz | I can't afford to not be slim(ish) | Oct 16 20:47 |
schestowitz | The US is getting heavier | Oct 16 20:47 |
DaemonFC | meh, I have a fast metabolism anyway | Oct 16 20:47 |
schestowitz | Maybe the depression will have an effect on this (less eating) | Oct 16 20:47 |
DaemonFC | I lose about 5 pounds a week at 2000 Calories a day | Oct 16 20:47 |
schestowitz | The fat cats will carry on getting fatter, that's for sure | Oct 16 20:47 |
schestowitz | Anyway, let's not talk diets. It's OT | Oct 16 20:48 |
DaemonFC | actually, people get fatter in a recession | Oct 16 20:48 |
DaemonFC | you notice how many poor fat people are in Walmart all the time? | Oct 16 20:48 |
DaemonFC | cause the government funds the empty calorie food they pig out on | Oct 16 20:49 |
DaemonFC | this in turn frees up a few hundred dollars a month that they can buy cigarettes with | Oct 16 20:50 |
DaemonFC | :D | Oct 16 20:50 |
DaemonFC | once they have enough health problems brought on by awful diet and chain smoking, they get on medicaid and medicare and leech some more | Oct 16 20:51 |
schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/40388 | Oct 16 20:52 |
phIRCe | Title: Top 10 Things I HATE about KDE 4 | tuxmachines.org .::. Size~: 36.77 KB | Oct 16 20:52 |
DaemonFC | welfare works out to be a government funded vicious cycle that most directly benefits junk food makers, cigarette companies, and pharmaceutical industry | Oct 16 20:52 |
schestowitz | She's right about this: | Oct 16 20:52 |
schestowitz | "9. Dual monitor separation - What I mean by that is on dual display systems, one has to configure each monitor/display/half of the desktop separately. And it also means that the panel can't stretch out over the two displays, move from one to the other, and you can't move icons from one to the other." | Oct 16 20:52 |
schestowitz | I have this bit of an 'issue' too | Oct 16 20:52 |
schestowitz | But I like it | Oct 16 20:52 |
schestowitz | I can run each desktop independently with slideshow | Oct 16 20:52 |
schestowitz | It's a bit of a pro, not a con | Oct 16 20:52 |
schestowitz | Once you get used to the fact of having TWO independent wallpapers | Oct 16 20:53 |
DaemonFC | why do you think we have food stamps, SSI income, and Medicare/Medicaid? | Oct 16 20:53 |
DaemonFC | corporate lobbyists always want more of that | Oct 16 20:53 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: let's get off health | Oct 16 20:53 |
DaemonFC | as long as the government buys their stuff at full retail price, they love government welfare | Oct 16 20:53 |
schestowitz | It's adding off-topic signal/noise to the channel | Oct 16 20:53 |
DaemonFC | one more fun fact then I'll knock it off, food stamps DON'T buy anything organically grown | Oct 16 20:54 |
DaemonFC | they do buy candy bars, sugary soft drinks, TV dinners with no nutritional value, bubble gum.... | Oct 16 20:58 |
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MikeyC | Hey Roy I just did 165! | Oct 16 20:59 |
schestowitz | http://www.itnewstoday.com/?p=1032 | Oct 16 20:59 |
schestowitz | Why the hostility towards KDE? | Oct 16 21:00 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: damn you | Oct 16 21:00 |
phIRCe | Title: Is Kubuntu Caught in a Downward Spiral? : IT News Today .::. Size~: 90.09 KB | Oct 16 21:00 |
schestowitz | You're now tying my all-time best :-p | Oct 16 21:00 |
MikeyC | Not really:) only joking | Oct 16 21:00 |
schestowitz | Phew | Oct 16 21:00 |
schestowitz | I could benchpress 160kg on Sunday\ | Oct 16 21:00 |
MikeyC | If you're all time best is 165 i wanna go for it | Oct 16 21:00 |
schestowitz | I was close to it today, but was still sore from yesterday's workout | Oct 16 21:00 |
MikeyC | its a good target | Oct 16 21:00 |
MikeyC | me too i need to recover and come sunday | Oct 16 21:01 |
MikeyC | it will be good | Oct 16 21:01 |
schestowitz | Joe was supervising it at the time | Oct 16 21:01 |
schestowitz | What time? | Oct 16 21:01 |
MikeyC | i will be in around 10 | Oct 16 21:01 |
MikeyC | you fancy meeting up | Oct 16 21:01 |
schestowitz | Too early | Oct 16 21:01 |
schestowitz | I only wake up around 10 in recent days | Oct 16 21:02 |
schestowitz | Lag | Oct 16 21:02 |
MikeyC | you need a nextra afternoon of protein! | Oct 16 21:02 |
MikeyC | i reckon we could both go 170! | Oct 16 21:02 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: have a look at http://odtv.me/2009/10/floss-91/ . You'll see it ain't me... | Oct 16 21:02 |
phIRCe | Title: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found .::. Size~: 0 KB | Oct 16 21:02 |
schestowitz | They turned it to awful grilling | Oct 16 21:02 |
MikeyC | link doesnt work | Oct 16 21:03 |
schestowitz | Ah. | Oct 16 21:03 |
*Diablo-D3 has quit ("do coders dream of sheep()?") | Oct 16 21:03 | |
schestowitz | http://odtv.me/2009/10/macbreak-weekly-162/ | Oct 16 21:03 |
phIRCe | Title: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found .::. Size~: 0 KB | Oct 16 21:03 |
schestowitz | They have blog issue | Oct 16 21:04 |
schestowitz | It's temporarily broken | Oct 16 21:04 |
schestowitz | Never mind that | Oct 16 21:04 |
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schestowitz | There's an audio-only version | Oct 16 21:04 |
MikeyC | ok, but i will be eating sunday so try get to the gym early doors | Oct 16 21:04 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: http://www.twit.tv/floss91 | Oct 16 21:04 |
phIRCe | Title: The TWiT Netcast Network with Leo Laporte .::. Size~: 22.72 KB | Oct 16 21:04 |
schestowitz | You'll see it sounds awful. You know I'm a lot more coherent in person. | Oct 16 21:05 |
schestowitz | A friend of mine made an analogy | Oct 16 21:05 |
schestowitz | "What is this site, who are the two interviewers. Notice they paint you with the 'controversy' label. It's like the atheist v true-believers" | Oct 16 21:06 |
MikeyC | i am downloading it now, you better be good royston! | Oct 16 21:06 |
MikeyC | here goes you are live on stage at fortress Mr Fitness! | Oct 16 21:06 |
schestowitz | "Rather than address the issue they abuse the non-believers and use the response as evidence as to their extremism. Notice they spend a lot of time addressing personalities. That's what you get for making personal remarks." | Oct 16 21:07 |
trmanco | http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1076770 | Oct 16 21:07 |
phIRCe | Title: [ubuntu] Logitech QuickCam - Ubuntu Forums .::. Size~: 66.84 KB | Oct 16 21:07 |
trmanco | I'm not the only one | Oct 16 21:07 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: no, not this year | Oct 16 21:07 |
schestowitz | I'm not in good share or even motivated to train | Oct 16 21:07 |
schestowitz | /s/share/shape/ | Oct 16 21:07 |
trmanco | http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=7087422&postcount=4 | Oct 16 21:07 |
phIRCe | Title: Ubuntu Forums - View Single Post - [ubuntu] Logitech QuickCam .::. Size~: 8.37 KB | Oct 16 21:07 |
trmanco | very helpful | Oct 16 21:08 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: I couldn't even win the situps with 108 in 2 minutes | Oct 16 21:08 |
MikeyC | i cant hear you yet, when do you come on? | Oct 16 21:08 |
schestowitz | ANd I lost the rowing too | Oct 16 21:08 |
schestowitz | I don't care enough to want to win anymore | Oct 16 21:08 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: it's terrible, you'll see. They made me extremely uncomfortable. | Oct 16 21:09 |
trmanco | it's a problem with vl4l | Oct 16 21:09 |
trmanco | v4l2* | Oct 16 21:09 |
schestowitz | http://gnuski.blogspot.com/2009/10/open-request-to-rename-ubuntu-package.html | Oct 16 21:10 |
phIRCe | Title: lefty.crupps' GNUski bacon: An open request to rename Ubuntu package formats .::. Size~: 25.56 KB | Oct 16 21:10 |
MikeyC | dont be so soft, you are well thought of, you have at least 15 years of elite in front of you, you are just a little demotivated from your first taste of loss | Oct 16 21:10 |
schestowitz | http://desktoplinux.wordpress.com/2009/10/15/ubuntu-wins/ | Oct 16 21:11 |
phIRCe | Title: Ubuntu Wins! « On Becoming a Penguin .::. Size~: 29.91 KB | Oct 16 21:11 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: nope | Oct 16 21:11 |
schestowitz | I've done enough | Oct 16 21:11 |
schestowitz | As I get older I won't be able to keep up physically, so I'll move on to other things | Oct 16 21:11 |
MikeyC | you could try painting | Oct 16 21:12 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: look at DaemonFC here | Oct 16 21:12 |
schestowitz | He had two seizures a while ago | Oct 16 21:12 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: I did as a kid | Oct 16 21:12 |
MikeyC | no link | Oct 16 21:12 |
schestowitz | None? | Oct 16 21:12 |
MikeyC | Your voice isn't picked up fully by the mic | Oct 16 21:13 |
DaemonFC | I'm really thinking my blood pressure triggered them | Oct 16 21:13 |
DaemonFC | they can't give me any better reason than that, so it's what I'll go with I guess | Oct 16 21:13 |
DaemonFC | speaking of which, time for a zestril tablet :P | Oct 16 21:14 |
MikeyC | apparently having you on the show was "very controversial" and they described the site as a "hate site", these are very cheap shots, they came off worse, to me at least. | Oct 16 21:15 |
schestowitz | Exactly | Oct 16 21:17 |
schestowitz | But I knew this coming in. He brought me in to play this angle | Oct 16 21:17 |
schestowitz |  | Oct 16 21:17 |
schestowitz | [21:13] <MikeyC> Your voice isn't picked up fully by the mic | Oct 16 21:17 |
schestowitz | What do you mean? | Oct 16 21:17 |
MikeyC | during the interview | Oct 16 21:18 |
schestowitz | http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2009/10/gnome-do-docky-no-longer-part-of-gnome.html | Oct 16 21:19 |
phIRCe | Title: OMG! UBUNTU!: Gnome-Do Docky To Become Separate Application .::. Size~: 162.73 KB | Oct 16 21:19 |
MikeyC | to me you sound better informed than the interviewers, they just keep resorting to cheap smear quotes periodically. | Oct 16 21:19 |
schestowitz | But that's not my point though | Oct 16 21:19 |
schestowitz | By making the guest uncomfortable they make it harder for him/her to speak clearly and make coherent arguments | Oct 16 21:20 |
MikeyC | just overviewing the vibe, we can do the message soon enough | Oct 16 21:20 |
schestowitz | And it was a mess | Oct 16 21:20 |
schestowitz | MikeyC: shows I get invited to are always like that | Oct 16 21:20 |
MikeyC | that's what i guess being tough is about, being able to talk over all the cheap shots and not get flustered | Oct 16 21:21 |
schestowitz | Naturally | Oct 16 21:21 |
schestowitz | Let me show you something... hold on. | Oct 16 21:21 |
schestowitz | Found it | Oct 16 21:22 |
schestowitz | Watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E01VPsdozSo&feature=PlayList&p=63E1BAAA260A3183&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=38 | Oct 16 21:22 |
phIRCe | Title: YouTube - todd friel interviews christopher hitchens on "wretched radio" (full interview) - part 2 .::. Size~: 162.21 KB | Oct 16 21:22 |
schestowitz | They put a bad picture of him and take the s* out of him on the air | Oct 16 21:22 |
schestowitz | Yet he doesn't hang up | Oct 16 21:22 |
schestowitz | But it's a good example of daemonisation Fox-style | Oct 16 21:23 |
schestowitz | And this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrfPMa3lONU | Oct 16 21:23 |
phIRCe | Title: YouTube - Classic Bill O'Reilly - Loses it on Barney Frank .::. Size~: 184.68 KB | Oct 16 21:23 |
DaemonFC | I just got off the phone with the doctor, she said she'd prescribe Lovastatin instead of Pravastatin if I'd pay for the prescription (they don't have it on hand) | Oct 16 21:24 |
DaemonFC | that's good to know | Oct 16 21:24 |
schestowitz | http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2009/10/random-gnome-games-news-tips-and-tweaks.html | Oct 16 21:24 |
phIRCe | Title: OMG! UBUNTU!: Random Gnome-Games News, Tips and Tweaks. .::. Size~: 160.2 KB | Oct 16 21:24 |
schestowitz | DaemonFC: is it on your insurance? | Oct 16 21:24 |
DaemonFC | Pravastatin has potential kidney and liver related side effects, Lovastatin has almsot no side effects | Oct 16 21:25 |
schestowitz | !google if you are not health die quickly | Oct 16 21:25 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: Lovastatin is a $4 /month generic | Oct 16 21:25 |
schestowitz | phIRCe: test http://test.com | Oct 16 21:25 |
phIRCe | Title: Test.com Web Based Testing and Certification Software v2.0 .::. Size~: 28.25 KB | Oct 16 21:25 |
schestowitz | !google if you are not healthy die quickly | Oct 16 21:25 |
phIRCe | [1] - Alan Grayson "Die Quickly" Comment Prompts Uproar - Political ... | http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/09/30/politics/politicalhotsheet/entry5353632.shtml | Oct 16 21:25 |
phIRCe | [2] - Alan Grayson: Republicans Want Sick People To Die Quickly (VIDEO) | http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/30/alan-grayson-republicans_n_303996.html | Oct 16 21:25 |
phIRCe | [3] - Don't get sick and die quickly! | Trusted.MD Network | http://trusted.md/blog/marc/2009/10/01/dont_get_sick_and_die_quickly | Oct 16 21:25 |
phIRCe | [4] - Grayson: GOP health care plan is 'Die Quickly' | http://blogs.tampabay.com/buzz/2009/09/grayson-says-gop-health-care-plan-is-dont-get-sick-or-die-quickly.html | Oct 16 21:25 |
DaemonFC | that's at Walmart, but Owens and Walgreens are matching that list | Oct 16 21:25 |
schestowitz | http://bytesandsuch.com/2009/10/ubuntu-bittorrent-issues/ | Oct 16 21:27 |
phIRCe | Title: Ubuntu Bittorrent Issues | bytesandsuch.com .::. Size~: 27.69 KB | Oct 16 21:27 |
schestowitz | http://beginlinux.com/blog/2009/10/ubuntu-9-10-ufw-firewall/ | Oct 16 21:29 |
phIRCe | Title: Ubuntu 9.10 UFW Firewall | BeginLinux .::. Size~: 31.83 KB | Oct 16 21:29 |
schestowitz | Interesting stuff in Buntuland | Oct 16 21:29 |
DaemonFC | schestowitz: The one good thing I can say about Walmart is that $4 list | Oct 16 21:30 |
trmanco | damn | Oct 16 21:30 |
trmanco | camstream now works | Oct 16 21:30 |
DaemonFC | before that happened everythin on that list was $10-60 for a 30 day supply | Oct 16 21:31 |
trmanco | ugly hack, but I think I got my webcam working with everthing now | Oct 16 21:31 |
DaemonFC | adds up fast, I'd rather pay $12 a month for my three prescriptions than $100 | Oct 16 21:31 |
DaemonFC | :) | Oct 16 21:31 |
trmanco | it works :D | Oct 16 21:33 |
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schestowitz | Castro leaves Mandriva: http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/4082 | Oct 16 21:35 |
phIRCe | Title: So far, so long, thanks for all the fish... | kdedevelopers.org .::. Size~: 14.67 KB | Oct 16 21:35 |
schestowitz | trmanco: maybe I should sort out a Web cam too. My mic is also a crappy (Cheapo) one that makes me sound odd | Oct 16 21:36 |
trmanco | haha | Oct 16 21:37 |
trmanco | man I love linux | Oct 16 21:37 |
trmanco | piece of cake | Oct 16 21:37 |
schestowitz | LINA is back!! http://www.reuters.com/article/pressRelease/idUS93947+15-Oct-2009+PRN20091015 | Oct 16 21:37 |
trmanco | my webcam no works | Oct 16 21:37 |
trmanco | everywhere | Oct 16 21:37 |
schestowitz | no works? | Oct 16 21:37 |
schestowitz | No? | Oct 16 21:37 |
trmanco | now* | Oct 16 21:37 |
schestowitz | :-) | Oct 16 21:38 |
trmanco | sorry | Oct 16 21:38 |
trmanco | I love this os | Oct 16 21:38 |
trmanco | :D | Oct 16 21:38 |
schestowitz | No works. Is nice! | Oct 16 21:38 |
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trmanco | the problem was that most of the apps still use v4l1 | Oct 16 21:38 |
trmanco | and ubuntu only had v4l2 installed so everything was trying to use that | Oct 16 21:39 |
trmanco | I installed the v4l1 lib and made a preload -> bash -c 'LD_PRELOAD=/usr/lib/libv4l/v4l1compat.so firefox' | Oct 16 21:39 |
trmanco | it now works :D | Oct 16 21:39 |
schestowitz | http://www.itwire.com/content/view/28574/1141/ | Oct 16 21:55 |
trmanco | http://www.itwire.com/content/view/28574/1141/ | Oct 16 22:03 |
trmanco | :| | Oct 16 22:03 |
schestowitz | Yeah, odd one | Oct 16 22:08 |
schestowitz | happened earlier too with !google uses | Oct 16 22:08 |
trmanco | http://itwire.com | Oct 16 22:10 |
trmanco | they are blocking me | Oct 16 22:10 |
trmanco | !google itwire | Oct 16 22:10 |
phIRCe | [1] - iTWire | http://www.itwire.com/ | Oct 16 22:10 |
phIRCe | [2] - iTWire - Microsoft urges Nokia to offer Windows Mobile devices | http://www.itwire.com/content/view/16510/127/ | Oct 16 22:10 |
phIRCe | [3] - www.Itwire.com - Itwire | http://www.ip-adress.com/whois/www.itwire.com | Oct 16 22:10 |
phIRCe | [4] - iTWire - Tech News (iTWire) on Twitter | http://twitter.com/ITwire | Oct 16 22:10 |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Watching re-runs of Doctor Who downloaded off iPlayer on the revo.. timing how long before it locks up | Oct 16 22:17 | |
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schestowitz | Let's see some news | Oct 16 22:26 |
sebsebseb | schestowitz: Apparantly Channel 4 shows are going to be free on Youtube, because they made a deal | Oct 16 22:27 |
sebsebseb | Google and Channel Four or something | Oct 16 22:27 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Boycott Novell on TWiT TV (as Ogg) http://ping.fm/ug9Xh | Oct 16 22:28 | |
phIRCe | Title: Boycott Novell on TWiT TV (as Ogg) | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 96.46 KB | Oct 16 22:28 |
voltronw | you guys have flash installed? | Oct 16 22:31 |
MinceR | i do | Oct 16 22:31 |
MinceR | i hate it, but sadly a lot of the web is infected with it | Oct 16 22:31 |
MinceR | also carefully engineered so that it won't work with swfdec or gnash | Oct 16 22:32 |
voltronw | content authors are specifically engineering their code to not work with gnash? citation? | Oct 16 22:33 |
MinceR | just kidding -- where there's flash, there's no engineering. :> | Oct 16 22:33 |
MinceR | it's a disease. | Oct 16 22:33 |
voltronw | i'm sure there's plenty of well engineered flash code out there | Oct 16 22:35 |
voltronw | and plenty of poorly engineered flash code out there | Oct 16 22:35 |
voltronw | just like everything else | Oct 16 22:35 |
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_goblin | bonjour | Oct 16 22:35 |
schestowitz | sebsebseb: yes | Oct 16 22:36 |
schestowitz | It's good news though | Oct 16 22:36 |
schestowitz | You knows why? :-) | Oct 16 22:36 |
sebsebseb | schestowitz: no? | Oct 16 22:36 |
schestowitz | Cause they used to be with Silver Lie | Oct 16 22:36 |
_goblin | who's this? | Oct 16 22:36 |
sebsebseb | what's that? | Oct 16 22:36 |
schestowitz | Very Windows-only | Oct 16 22:36 |
schestowitz | Ch4 | Oct 16 22:36 |
_goblin | ah | Oct 16 22:36 |
schestowitz | Silverblight/Silverfish | Oct 16 22:36 |
_goblin | makes sense since ITV have dumped it. | Oct 16 22:36 |
schestowitz | Yes | Oct 16 22:36 |
_goblin | silversh*te | Oct 16 22:36 |
sebsebseb | _goblin: what's that? | Oct 16 22:36 |
schestowitz | They join the 'freetards' :-) | Oct 16 22:37 |
MinceR | there's no good reason to infect a website with flash | Oct 16 22:37 |
schestowitz | YouTube | Oct 16 22:37 |
schestowitz | trmanco: thanks for transcoding | Oct 16 22:37 |
sebsebseb | yeah Google should embrace HTML 5's video tag with OGG :) | Oct 16 22:37 |
trmanco | you're welcome | Oct 16 22:37 |
voltronw | MinceR: how would you deliver a website that needs interactive content or video? | Oct 16 22:37 |
schestowitz | back in a moment. Lookin' at news.. | Oct 16 22:37 |
sebsebseb | and make it clear to users they need a browser such as Firefox to support it | Oct 16 22:37 |
MinceR | voltronw: for interactive content (which is usually overrated), there's html forms and javascript; for video, my preferred method is linking to a video file | Oct 16 22:38 |
MinceR | but you could use embed, object or the new video element. | Oct 16 22:38 |
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MinceR | video plugins tend to be a lot more flexible than flash | Oct 16 22:38 |
MinceR | and perform better | Oct 16 22:38 |
MinceR | and they get new codecs before flash does | Oct 16 22:39 |
voltronw | so i have to download a plugin to see your website? | Oct 16 22:39 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] Patent lawyers hates the subject matter criteria, push for business method patents and software patents: http://i5.be/OT | Oct 16 22:39 | |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] Join us -> http://tinychat.com/lady | Oct 16 22:39 | |
phIRCe | Title: Intellectual Property Watch » Blog Archive » How The Machine-or-Transformation Test In Bilski Is Failing .::. Size~: 59.82 KB | Oct 16 22:39 |
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MinceR | voltronw: do you know what flash is? | Oct 16 22:40 |
voltronw | yes, a plugin that almost everyone with a web browser already has installed | Oct 16 22:40 |
MinceR | so, you have to download a plugin anyway. | Oct 16 22:41 |
voltronw | no you don't | Oct 16 22:41 |
voltronw | because everyone already has | Oct 16 22:42 |
MinceR | no, not everyone | Oct 16 22:42 |
MinceR | for example, my netbook doesn't have flash installed yet. :> | Oct 16 22:42 |
oiaohm | Really I want to see flash die. | Oct 16 22:42 |
voltronw | MinceR: http://www.adrianblog.com/web-development/flash-player-installed-on-987-percent-of-online-computers.html | Oct 16 22:42 |
phIRCe | Title: Flash Player installed on 98.7 percent of online computers .::. Size~: 23.81 KB | Oct 16 22:42 |
MinceR | voltronw: something being widespread doesn't make it right. | Oct 16 22:43 |
oiaohm | voltronw: that does not count phones. | Oct 16 22:43 |
MinceR | voltronw: also, we get it, you love flash. not everyone does, though. | Oct 16 22:43 |
oiaohm | There are a lot of items not licenced to contain flash. | Oct 16 22:43 |
voltronw | i don't love flash, i hate flash. i don't even have it installed | Oct 16 22:43 |
MinceR | then we do you keep telling us it's so great? | Oct 16 22:44 |
oiaohm | webgl and the video tags cover most of what flash does without needing to leave a html standard. | Oct 16 22:44 |
oiaohm | Just both are not largely deployed yet. | Oct 16 22:44 |
MinceR | (btw, even in the (in my opinion, pointless) embedded video case, you can include a direct link anyway) | Oct 16 22:44 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Mainstream Indian Press: #Linux Rising http://www.expresscomputeronline.com/20091019/market01.shtml | Oct 16 22:44 | |
phIRCe | Title: Linux rising - Express Computer .::. Size~: 30.43 KB | Oct 16 22:44 |
MinceR | most of what flash does does not belong on the web. | Oct 16 22:44 |
voltronw | where did i say it's great? the point i'm trying to make is that people who deliver content have to consider installed user base. until there are alternatives, flash will be the obvious choice. | Oct 16 22:45 |
oiaohm | There is alterentive voltronw | Oct 16 22:45 |
MinceR | it should be a useful hypertext resource, not a shiny toy intended to induce drooling -- while it takes massive amounts of CPU and memory. | Oct 16 22:45 |
oiaohm | Just means picking on IE users. | Oct 16 22:45 |
oiaohm | And tell them to install the chrome extention to IE. | Oct 16 22:45 |
oiaohm | So html5 video tags work. | Oct 16 22:45 |
MinceR | voltronw: it's the obvious wrong choice, yes. it still isn't suited to streaming video and it never will be. | Oct 16 22:45 |
voltronw | MinceR: great, when you're crowned king of the internet you can dictate what web pages should be, until then, the real world will continue to function. | Oct 16 22:46 |
oiaohm | All other upto date web browsers support html 5 voltronw | Oct 16 22:46 |
oiaohm | Including phones. | Oct 16 22:46 |
MinceR | no, what the real world does is hardly "functioning" | Oct 16 22:46 |
oiaohm | So if you want 100 percent market coverage its html5 not flash. | Oct 16 22:46 |
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voltronw | oiaohm: i'd love to see html5 displace flash | Oct 16 22:46 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux Has an Unusual Big User: Microsoft http://ur1.ca/drpa | Oct 16 22:46 | |
phIRCe | Title: Is it ethical for Microsoft to offer online services? A Review | Tech Blog .::. Size~: 40.76 KB | Oct 16 22:46 |
oiaohm | webgl displaces flash out games. | Oct 16 22:47 |
oiaohm | Without games and videos what does flash have. | Oct 16 22:47 |
MinceR | voltronw: and no matter how obnoxious you are, flash still plays videos slowly, has a limited selection of codecs, is difficult to resize or make fullscreen and it makes videos difficult to download. | Oct 16 22:47 |
MinceR | also, i suspect that the formats and codecs it prefers includes patent-encumbered ones. | Oct 16 22:48 |
voltronw | MinceR: dude how am i being obnoxious? i'm advocating for open standards and presenting data. you're running proprietary code and making up0 conspiracies about people designing things not to work in gnash. | Oct 16 22:48 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Home Automation and Why It's Better off Done with #Linux http://bit.ly/uCKZX | Oct 16 22:48 | |
voltronw | MinceR: and dictating what the web should or shouldn't be | Oct 16 22:49 |
MinceR | voltronw: where are you advocating open standards, exactly? | Oct 16 22:49 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux Already Wins in Many Fields: Evidence http://bit.ly/4thLKG | Oct 16 22:49 | |
MinceR | voltronw: are you trying to imply that flash is an open standard, perhaps? | Oct 16 22:49 |
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voltronw | MinceR: voltronw: oiaohm: i'd love to see html5 displace flash | Oct 16 22:50 |
oiaohm | It already is voltronw | Oct 16 22:50 |
oiaohm | Lot of the major video provide sites like youtube have html5 interfaces. | Oct 16 22:50 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #LINA 1.0 is Here! (as Beta) http://bit.ly/4tPBGN | Oct 16 22:50 | |
MinceR | what makes LINA so important? | Oct 16 22:51 |
schestowitz | See details | Oct 16 22:52 |
schestowitz | http://dailyapps.net/2008/03/hack-attack-run-linux-apps-natively-on-windows-osx/ | Oct 16 22:53 |
schestowitz | http://www.downloadsquad.com/2008/03/23/lina-run-linux-aps-on-windows-or-os-x-or-at-least-one-linux-ap/ | Oct 16 22:53 |
phIRCe | Title: Hack Attack : Run Linux Apps Natively On Windows, OSX | dailyApps .::. Size~: 26.77 KB | Oct 16 22:53 |
phIRCe | Title: Lina: Run Linux aps on Windows or OS X, or at least one Linux app .::. Size~: 75.04 KB | Oct 16 22:53 |
schestowitz | http://openlina.org/news.html | Oct 16 22:53 |
phIRCe | Title: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found .::. Size~: 0 KB | Oct 16 22:53 |
schestowitz | http://www.libervis.com/article/lina_like_java_but_different | Oct 16 22:53 |
phIRCe | Title: LINA: like Java, but different | Libervis.com .::. Size~: 18.41 KB | Oct 16 22:53 |
schestowitz | Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGiIkceewRA | Oct 16 22:53 |
phIRCe | Title: YouTube - The LINA Home Movie .::. Size~: 138.09 KB | Oct 16 22:53 |
schestowitz | http://www.downloadsquad.com/2007/05/27/run-linux-apps-on-windows-or-os-x-with-lina/ | Oct 16 22:53 |
phIRCe | Title: Run Linux apps on Windows or OS X with Lina .::. Size~: 101 KB | Oct 16 22:53 |
MinceR | linux apps should be ran on linux | Oct 16 22:53 |
schestowitz | Homepage: http://www.openlina.com/ | Oct 16 22:53 |
MinceR | just like everything else. | Oct 16 22:53 |
oiaohm | MinceR: is more users numbers. | Oct 16 22:53 |
schestowitz | MinceR: build once, run everywhere | Oct 16 22:53 |
oiaohm | Lina is also about stoping people bothing coding for windows. | Oct 16 22:53 |
MinceR | it cuts both ways. | Oct 16 22:54 |
schestowitz | So devs won't get distracted by bobinaries | Oct 16 22:54 |
schestowitz | oiaohm: exactly | Oct 16 22:54 |
schestowitz | It's like wine for Windows!! | Oct 16 22:54 |
schestowitz | Just build for Linux | Oct 16 22:54 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Is it ethical for Microsoft to offer online services? A Review | Tech Blog - Brilliant! http://tinyurl.com/yloufzr | Oct 16 22:54 | |
schestowitz | The Windows folks can just use LINA to dream as though they have Linux ;-) | Oct 16 22:54 |
phIRCe | Title: Is it ethical for Microsoft to offer online services? A Review | Tech Blog .::. Size~: 40.76 KB | Oct 16 22:54 |
oiaohm | KDE is also running on windows more and more. It the user count issue. More users better feed back on features. | Oct 16 22:55 |
oiaohm | Basically to take out MS we have to displace the apps that keep people using it. | Oct 16 22:55 |
oiaohm | kontact is a good replacement to outlook. kolab server is a good replacement to exchange and so on. | Oct 16 22:56 |
trmanco | kontact is great | Oct 16 22:56 |
oiaohm | kontact just need to run on windows so outlook can be displaced. | Oct 16 22:56 |
oiaohm | Once outlook is displaced there is one less problem to migration. | Oct 16 22:57 |
voltronw | trmanco: can kontact connect to exchange servers? | Oct 16 22:57 |
oiaohm | Not perfectly voltronw | Oct 16 22:57 |
trmanco | exchage is a closed "app" | Oct 16 22:57 |
oiaohm | MS keeps on changing sections of the exchange server interfaces. | Oct 16 22:57 |
voltronw | then how the hell is it going to replace outlook? | Oct 16 22:57 |
oiaohm | Replace exchanage as well voltronw | Oct 16 22:58 |
trmanco | why would I want exchange if I have imap and ldap | Oct 16 22:58 |
oiaohm | kolab | Oct 16 22:58 |
voltronw | because you already have exchange if you're the average company | Oct 16 22:58 |
oiaohm | Kolab will import all the data out exchange. | Oct 16 22:58 |
oiaohm | kolab has plugins for outlook that cost. | Oct 16 22:58 |
oiaohm | kontact basically makes conversion cheep. | Oct 16 22:59 |
voltronw | oiaohm: do you have experience migrating email systems for businesses? | Oct 16 22:59 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Linux 2.6.32 Reaches Fifth RC http://lkml.org/lkml/2009/10/15/408 | Oct 16 22:59 | |
phIRCe | Title: LKML: Linus Torvalds: Linux 2.6.32-rc5 .::. Size~: 25.4 KB | Oct 16 22:59 |
MinceR | you could replace exchange with kolab server, add the evaluation versino of toltec connector to outlook and have 30 days to replace outlook with kontact :> | Oct 16 23:00 |
oiaohm | Yes I have voltronw | Oct 16 23:00 |
oiaohm | Exactly MinceR | Oct 16 23:01 |
voltronw | MinceR: that sounds like a good idea, migrating the server and the clients simultaneously would probably be a non starter for most businesses | Oct 16 23:01 |
MinceR | i'm not sure how the data is moved between the servers, but i suspect they have a way | Oct 16 23:01 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Google Uses #GNU #Linux to Obliterate #Microsoft http://ur1.ca/drqb http://ur1.ca/drqc http://ur1.ca/drqd | Oct 16 23:01 | |
oiaohm | kolab vampire connects to exchange as well. | Oct 16 23:02 |
phIRCe | Title: First Look: Google's Chrome Browser Within The Chrome OS - LinuxWorld .::. Size~: 38.02 KB | Oct 16 23:02 |
oiaohm | So you can run kolab side by side with exchange while you are doing the migration. | Oct 16 23:02 |
oiaohm | Only reason for not doing it is lack of windows side client. | Oct 16 23:02 |
oiaohm | Basically voltronw exchange is a sitting duck. | Oct 16 23:03 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Computer Lab Running #GNU #Linux ( #Gentoo ), South America Moves in Same Direction http://ur1.ca/drql http://ur1.ca/drqm | Oct 16 23:03 | |
phIRCe | Title: Online Games Press » Blog Archive » GHCAs Computer Lab Running Gentoo Linux .::. Size~: 13.12 KB | Oct 16 23:03 |
phIRCe | Title: open...: Open Sourcing America's Operating System .::. Size~: 94.47 KB | Oct 16 23:03 |
voltronw | oiaohm: i hate exchange, i hope you're right | Oct 16 23:04 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux #Desktop : the Question of #Choice Defended http://bit.ly/IjcGe | Oct 16 23:04 | |
phIRCe | Title: Welcome to LinuxInsider .::. Size~: 3.33 KB | Oct 16 23:04 |
oiaohm | I personally prefer this over kolab but its harder to migrate exchange to http://www.citadel.org | Oct 16 23:05 |
phIRCe | Title: Email and Groupware - easy to install, easy to use. - Citadel.org .::. Size~: 13.26 KB | Oct 16 23:05 |
oiaohm | citadel is based off the old BBS systems great for decentralised very tollerent to server disruption. | Oct 16 23:06 |
oiaohm | voltronw: I am plaining something far worse than migrating just exchange. | Oct 16 23:07 |
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oiaohm | I am plaining a ADS migration to samba 3.5.0 and off exchange at the same time. | Oct 16 23:07 |
voltronw | oiaohm: aren't you worried about samba patents? | Oct 16 23:08 |
oiaohm | Exchange has some nasty flaws. ADS is the most common reason spreed out small business with MS small business server don't deploy enough servers. | Oct 16 23:08 |
trmanco | still discussing exchange? :-P | Oct 16 23:08 |
oiaohm | voltronw: MS go for it. Remember MS did not design anything new really in ADS is stuffed up LDAP with a few other open source things stuffed up. | Oct 16 23:09 |
oiaohm | voltronw: and the file and printer protocals of windows are not MS's either. | Oct 16 23:09 |
oiaohm | Please be aware Samba is offically the standard body for those protocals. | Oct 16 23:10 |
voltronw | oiaohm: so samba is good, mono is bad? | Oct 16 23:10 |
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oiaohm | Not exaclty. | Oct 16 23:10 |
oiaohm | Samba is the standard body. | Oct 16 23:10 |
oiaohm | It would be interesting to have a court case to find out how much that means. | Oct 16 23:10 |
oiaohm | That is right we have already had one in the EU and MS lost. | Oct 16 23:11 |
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oiaohm | Samba will defend its users. | Oct 16 23:11 |
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oiaohm | Novell behind mono has failed to defend there users so we have problems with mono. | Oct 16 23:11 |
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voltronw | who should they have defended? | Oct 16 23:12 |
voltronw | also, isn't mono licensed as Free Software? if novell disappeared tomorrow mono would still be around | Oct 16 23:12 |
oiaohm | Samba defends any user using mono. | Oct 16 23:12 |
oiaohm | Samba project. | Oct 16 23:12 |
oiaohm | Opps. | Oct 16 23:12 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] K Desktop Environment ( #KDE ) Surpasses Others in Usability -- Claim http://bit.ly/oTSYe | Oct 16 23:12 | |
phIRCe | Title: KDE4 overtaking GNOME in terms of usability? | Nuxified.org .::. Size~: 75.21 KB | Oct 16 23:12 |
oiaohm | Samba project defends any user using Samba | Oct 16 23:13 |
oiaohm | Mono project leads don't defend any user with Mono. | Oct 16 23:13 |
oiaohm | Instead there line is you are fine if you aquire it form Novell. | Oct 16 23:13 |
oiaohm | Actions voltronw | Oct 16 23:13 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Compiz 0.8.4 is Out, Hulu is Proprietary and Slow http://ur1.ca/drr2 http://ur1.ca/drr3 | Oct 16 23:13 | |
phIRCe | Title: [Phoronix] Compiz 0.8.4 Released With New Plug-Ins, Etc .::. Size~: 15.71 KB | Oct 16 23:13 |
phIRCe | Title: Hands-on: Hulu Desktop for Linux beta a big resource hog - Ars Technica .::. Size~: 43.5 KB | Oct 16 23:13 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Midori 0.2.0 it Out http://bit.ly/8ZLYr | Oct 16 23:14 | |
phIRCe | Title: OMG! UBUNTU!: Midori 0.2.0 Released .::. Size~: 152.12 KB | Oct 16 23:14 |
oiaohm | voltronw: Samba lead developers have even stood up in court to protect the project. | Oct 16 23:15 |
voltronw | oiaohm: when has mono been challenged in court? | Oct 16 23:16 |
oiaohm | Tomtom case. | Oct 16 23:16 |
oiaohm | Some of the patents being pushed agaisnt Tomtom were covering .net | Oct 16 23:16 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #JackWallen Continues Series on How to Dump #MacOSX for #GNU #Linux Applications http://ur1.ca/drra | Oct 16 23:16 | |
phIRCe | Title: Linux equivalents to popular Mac apps .::. Size~: 38.59 KB | Oct 16 23:16 |
voltronw | oiaohm: wasn't the tomtom thing about FAT32? | Oct 16 23:17 |
oiaohm | That was only 1 small part of it. | Oct 16 23:17 |
oiaohm | 2 out of 8 patents. | Oct 16 23:17 |
Omar87 | Hi all. | Oct 16 23:17 |
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voltronw | oiaohm: list? | Oct 16 23:18 |
oiaohm | Not open to public voltronw | Oct 16 23:18 |
voltronw | oiaohm: everything i can find on it mentions FAT32 specifically, nothing about .net | Oct 16 23:19 |
oiaohm | Because the FAT patents could be fort. | Oct 16 23:19 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Great New #Games for #GNU #Linux (and Instructions) http://ur1.ca/drrd http://ur1.ca/drre http://ur1.ca/drrf http://ur1.ca/drrg | Oct 16 23:19 | |
phIRCe | Title: 3 Tools to Discover & Install Awesome Linux Games .::. Size~: 41.53 KB | Oct 16 23:19 |
phIRCe | Title: LinuxGames - Embrace your inner penguin .::. Size~: 15.44 KB | Oct 16 23:19 |
oiaohm | Due to prior art and other things voltronw | Oct 16 23:20 |
phIRCe | Title: LinuxGames - Embrace your inner penguin .::. Size~: 15.23 KB | Oct 16 23:20 |
phIRCe | Title: Get Your Five-Minute Multiplayer Game Fix with OMGPOP .::. Size~: 29.17 KB | Oct 16 23:20 |
voltronw | oiaohm: so i'm still not sure what the tomtom case has to do with .net and/or mono | Oct 16 23:20 |
oiaohm | Novell could not assist Tomtom over the .net patent claims due to there deal with MS. | Oct 16 23:20 |
voltronw | o'd like to understand this better | Oct 16 23:20 |
oiaohm | TomTom was using mono internally. | Oct 16 23:20 |
oiaohm | All future versions will be pure C++ | Oct 16 23:21 |
voltronw | oiaohm: citation? | Oct 16 23:21 |
oiaohm | It was only mentioned a few times. | Oct 16 23:21 |
voltronw | oiaohm: where? | Oct 16 23:22 |
oiaohm | Hmm I will have to dig back into wayback machine sites with the information about that are gone. | Oct 16 23:24 |
voltronw | oiaohm: ... | Oct 16 23:25 |
oiaohm | The entry on tomtom covering what there devices were using internally are gone. | Oct 16 23:25 |
voltronw | oiaohm: extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. you seem to have no evidence | Oct 16 23:25 |
oiaohm | The issue here is I did have the evidence but the links are no more. | Oct 16 23:26 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Qt 4.6 Brings Improves Cross-platform Support (Good for #KDE ?) http://ur1.ca/drs5 http://ur1.ca/drs6 | Oct 16 23:26 | |
*voltronw shrugs | Oct 16 23:26 | |
phIRCe | Title: Nokia Releases Qt 4.6 Framework -- Mobile Apps -- InformationWeek .::. Size~: 91.32 KB | Oct 16 23:26 |
phIRCe | Title: Qt 4.6 promises to deliver Windows 7, Maemo, and S60 support - Ars Technica .::. Size~: 46.04 KB | Oct 16 23:27 |
oiaohm | It happens voltronw | Oct 16 23:27 |
oiaohm | O well another case will happen and the same will happen again. | Oct 16 23:27 |
oiaohm | Novell agreement with MS only covers users who aquire there binarys of there .net from Novell. | Oct 16 23:27 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #KDE Applications in Review - All Positive http://ur1.ca/drs8 http://ur1.ca/drs9 http://ur1.ca/drsa http://ur1.ca/drsb | Oct 16 23:27 | |
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oiaohm | And does not allow Novell to use its patents to protect anyone else. | Oct 16 23:28 |
voltronw | oiaohm: so you're argument is "some stuff happened in the past that i have no evidence of, and some stuff might happen in the future"? | Oct 16 23:28 |
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voltronw | your | Oct 16 23:28 |
oiaohm | Will happen again voltronw | Oct 16 23:28 |
oiaohm | Unless something changes. | Oct 16 23:28 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Fedora 12 Looks Great and #Gentoo is FAR from Dead http://ur1.ca/dq8m http://ur1.ca/drse | Oct 16 23:28 | |
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oiaohm | Like MS giving a proper patent coverage for .net | Oct 16 23:29 |
oiaohm | Including mono. | Oct 16 23:29 |
voltronw | something in addition to ecma standardization and the community promise? | Oct 16 23:29 |
oiaohm | That kind of issue is why Intel insisted that MS provide silverlight directly to them instead of using Moonlight. | Oct 16 23:29 |
MinceR | proper patent coverage would be by definition in addition or instead of those. | Oct 16 23:30 |
oiaohm | The community promise only covers upto .net 2.0 | Oct 16 23:30 |
MinceR | considering that neither ecma "standardization" nor the community promise is proper patent coverage. | Oct 16 23:30 |
oiaohm | Not current day .Net 3.5 | Oct 16 23:30 |
oiaohm | ie the ecma standard does not contain .net 3.5 MS never updated it. | Oct 16 23:30 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] "Ubuntu Wins!" and Other Great Things Coming Its Way http://ur1.ca/drsl http://ur1.ca/drsm http://ur1.ca/drsn http://ur1.ca/drso | Oct 16 23:30 | |
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #WindowsTax Refunded and Passed to #GNU #Linux Developers http://www.linuxmint.com/blog/?p=1073 Fantastic! | Oct 16 23:31 | |
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oiaohm | Basically a simple if you are implenting a compadible .net implenetation we will not sue over usage of patents would cover it voltronw | Oct 16 23:32 |
oiaohm | Its that MS limited the scope causes the problem voltronw | Oct 16 23:32 |
oiaohm | And before that stating nothing about patents. | Oct 16 23:32 |
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oiaohm | Note we are worse off now than before MS declare what was covered. | Oct 16 23:33 |
oiaohm | since in caught MS could argue now that it was a known breach since the ecma document clearly documented what was covered. | Oct 16 23:33 |
oiaohm | Basically legally screwed voltronw. | Oct 16 23:35 |
oiaohm | You never asked me how I am sure it will happen again voltronw. | Oct 16 23:36 |
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voltronw | oiaohm: it may or may not. by definition, what you're saying is purely speculative | Oct 16 23:37 |
oiaohm | Not really voltronw | Oct 16 23:38 |
oiaohm | When ever a company gets short of cash. Like 3com recently there patents come to bare to make money. | Oct 16 23:38 |
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oiaohm | Basically legal department trying to save company to save there own skin. | Oct 16 23:39 |
oiaohm | This is not specultaive it is what happens voltronw | Oct 16 23:39 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Linux Becomes a Big Winner in Consumer Electronics/Appliances http://ur1.ca/druy | Oct 16 23:39 | |
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oiaohm | Reason why it key that all patent agreements you depend on are written right. Or that none exist. | Oct 16 23:40 |
oiaohm | None exist you can still bring any patents you have to bare to sort out problem. | Oct 16 23:41 |
voltronw | let | Oct 16 23:41 |
voltronw | let's assume for a minute that you're hyper cautious reading of the legal and technical situation is correct | Oct 16 23:42 |
voltronw | and consider this thought experiement. MS sues "mono" today and wins. what happens to software that depends on mono? | Oct 16 23:42 |
oiaohm | MS will not sue mono. | Oct 16 23:42 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] As #Android Grows, "Android Foundation" Seen as an Option http://ur1.ca/drvz What about OHA? | Oct 16 23:42 | |
voltronw | does a microsoft swat team burst into your house and shoot your computer that's running tomboy? | Oct 16 23:42 |
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oiaohm | They will sue end users. | Oct 16 23:42 |
oiaohm | That will be like device makers voltronw | Oct 16 23:43 |
oiaohm | Anyone who does not aquire mono directly from Novell voltronw | Oct 16 23:43 |
oiaohm | In binary form. | Oct 16 23:43 |
voltronw | oiaohm: if i buy a dell computer, and install ubuntu, i got mono from ubuntu | Oct 16 23:43 |
MinceR | and there's no m$ swat team, they'll use police forces provided by your government, paid by your tax money. | Oct 16 23:43 |
schestowitz | Mono is Novell's drug samples | Oct 16 23:43 |
oiaohm | Then you can be sued voltronw | Oct 16 23:43 |
schestowitz | They put some mono in your drink | Oct 16 23:44 |
oiaohm | You have no patent coverage voltronw | Oct 16 23:44 |
schestowitz | Like Tomboy inside GNOME | Oct 16 23:44 |
voltronw | oiaohm: so microsoft is going to take individual tomboy users to court? | Oct 16 23:44 |
schestowitz | And you're then hooked on the drink | Oct 16 23:44 |
oiaohm | Tomboy uses .net 3.5 features. | Oct 16 23:44 |
oiaohm | They can voltronw | Oct 16 23:44 |
schestowitz | But only as long as it has the stuff slipped into it | Oct 16 23:44 |
oiaohm | The lead developers of mono are safe. | Oct 16 23:44 |
schestowitz | And it's not always free, either | Oct 16 23:44 |
voltronw | oiaohm: but do you think they will? | Oct 16 23:44 |
oiaohm | They are protected by Novell agreement. | Oct 16 23:44 |
schestowitz | Right now, Microsoft/Novell slip many 'mickies' into Linux users' drink | Oct 16 23:45 |
oiaohm | If MS gets short enough for money they will be forced to voltronw | Oct 16 23:45 |
voltronw | there are hundreds of thousands of people running ubuntu. microsoft is going to serve every single one of them with a lawsuit? | Oct 16 23:45 |
schestowitz | "It's free software," they exclaim | Oct 16 23:45 |
schestowitz | But wait.. | Oct 16 23:45 |
schestowitz | It's gratis for now. | Oct 16 23:45 |
oiaohm | At 2000 dollars Min per head it would be quite profitable voltronw | Oct 16 23:45 |
schestowitz | And developers are meanwhile creating mills to manufacture mickies | Oct 16 23:45 |
MinceR | m$ is getting more desperate every month | Oct 16 23:45 |
MinceR | some day they might indeed sue large companies using mono. | Oct 16 23:46 |
MinceR | (that is, as end-users) | Oct 16 23:46 |
trmanco | an example of why I love wolfram alpha -> http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=ln | Oct 16 23:46 |
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trmanco | a simple one too | Oct 16 23:46 |
voltronw | oiaohm: so microsoft is going to sue an individual user and pursue a civil lawsuit for 2000 dollars each? | Oct 16 23:46 |
schestowitz | Don't exaggerate | Oct 16 23:46 |
schestowitz | That does not serve your case | Oct 16 23:46 |
oiaohm | That is what they can legally sue for and 2000 would be nice. | Oct 16 23:46 |
schestowitz | It's like saying, "why eat chocolate? It can give you a heart attack" | Oct 16 23:47 |
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oiaohm | Of course sueing companies would be a higher and simpler voltronw | Oct 16 23:47 |
oiaohm | Less paper work. | Oct 16 23:48 |
voltronw | oiaohm: then in the case of my dell computer/ubuntu linux case, who gets sued? ubuntu? | Oct 16 23:48 |
schestowitz | No suing | Oct 16 23:48 |
schestowitz | Dell signed a deal | Oct 16 23:48 |
oiaohm | That case ubuntu is not in a location to be used. | Oct 16 23:48 |
schestowitz | And they can add mono tax | Oct 16 23:48 |
oiaohm | sued. | Oct 16 23:48 |
schestowitz | Of course they'd call it s/t else | Oct 16 23:48 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Linux Phones from #Palm Arrive at the #UK , Reviewed http://ur1.ca/drwd http://ur1.ca/drwe | Oct 16 23:48 | |
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oiaohm | And dell paid for you already voltronw | Oct 16 23:49 |
schestowitz | Dell joined the Novell/Microsoft deal in May 2007 | Oct 16 23:49 |
voltronw | but dell isn't providing me with mono | Oct 16 23:49 |
schestowitz | Dell also pays PowerDVD people | Oct 16 23:49 |
schestowitz | Or LinDVD rather | Oct 16 23:49 |
schestowitz | So MPEG and stuff also | Oct 16 23:49 |
MinceR | dell also has the additional disadvantage of being crap. | Oct 16 23:49 |
schestowitz | voltronw: it does | Oct 16 23:49 |
schestowitz | It uses vanilla *buntu | Oct 16 23:49 |
oiaohm | If you installed it and its not the dell version you are the builder responsable. | Oct 16 23:49 |
schestowitz | D[E]LL HELL | Oct 16 23:50 |
MinceR | indeed | Oct 16 23:50 |
oiaohm | The is the problem lot of Linux users are no longer just computer users. | Oct 16 23:50 |
voltronw | schestowitz: but as soon as i run apt-get upgrade then i'm not running dell supplied mono. | Oct 16 23:50 |
oiaohm | They are system installers and software aquires. | Oct 16 23:50 |
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oiaohm | voltronw: you are still using dell supplied OS with dell approved updates. | Oct 16 23:51 |
oiaohm | So still covered by the argreement. | Oct 16 23:51 |
voltronw | oiaohm: am i downloading code form a ubuntu mirror hosted on dell servers? no. | Oct 16 23:51 |
oiaohm | Yes its where the OS is from covers if you have patent coverage. | Oct 16 23:51 |
oiaohm | The wording is evil voltronw | Oct 16 23:51 |
oiaohm | Using the same file mirror is not the issue. | Oct 16 23:52 |
oiaohm | If you download the install iso of ubuntu from dell for a dell machine you are covered by the patent agreemtn. | Oct 16 23:52 |
voltronw | oiaohm: where can i download an ubuntu iso from dell? link? | Oct 16 23:52 |
oiaohm | Yet if you download that same iso from the ubuntu home site due to the wording of the agreement you are not covered. | Oct 16 23:53 |
oiaohm | You can get it out the dell support site but its a lot of digging voltronw | Oct 16 23:53 |
voltronw | oh i found ubuntu 7.4 on linux.dell.com | Oct 16 23:53 |
oiaohm | Basically MS patent agreement is a trap for end users. | Oct 16 23:54 |
voltronw | so great, if i want to be "covered" i have to download 7.04 from dell and run a 2.5 year old distro? | Oct 16 23:54 |
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oiaohm | There is a 8.04 up there too voltronw | Oct 16 23:54 |
oiaohm | But it is berried away. | Oct 16 23:54 |
voltronw | which is 1.5 years old | Oct 16 23:54 |
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Linux: it's good enough for Microsoft! http://is.gd/4n0Fk | Oct 16 23:54 | |
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oiaohm | Yep it suxs voltronw | Oct 16 23:54 |
EDavidBurg | what patent agreements are you talking about? | Oct 16 23:55 |
oiaohm | Install 8.04 then have to do distribution upgrade to be covered. | Oct 16 23:55 |
oiaohm | MS/Novell agreement that Dell also has agreed to the same format. EDavidBurg | Oct 16 23:55 |
voltronw | i'm not a lawyer. if any of you are, please speak up, because the things i'm being told here don't make any sense whatsoever | Oct 16 23:55 |
oiaohm | The law is a ass voltronw | Oct 16 23:56 |
oiaohm | Particularly when things are written badly voltronw | Oct 16 23:56 |
voltronw | EDavidBurg: don't ask him for any evidence of this, the links probably "don't exist anymore" | Oct 16 23:56 |
oiaohm | I though those links still existed when gave that point voltronw | Oct 16 23:56 |
oiaohm | The Novell and dell patent agreements with MS are listed in the stock exchange voltronw | Oct 16 23:57 |
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EDavidBurg | oiaohm: but what are these patent agreements about? what's the danger in not being covered by them? | Oct 16 23:58 |
schestowitz | http://linuxlandit.blogspot.com/2009/10/antomic-is-project-to-build-free.html | Oct 16 23:58 |
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oiaohm | If MS gets desprate enough they could bring there patents to bare like 3com is doing now on quite a few places EDavidBurg | Oct 16 23:58 |
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schestowitz | voltronw: besides the point | Oct 16 23:58 |
EDavidBurg | oiaohm: ...but what are the patent agreements about? | Oct 16 23:59 |
voltronw | schestowitz: i really wish i knew what the point was, no one seems to be making any strong ones | Oct 16 23:59 |
schestowitz | EDavidBurg: which one/s?\ | Oct 16 23:59 |
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