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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: January 28th, 2010

*amarsh04 has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Jan 28 00:00
MinceRi'm sure a little more bloat will make everything work better on low-powered mobile devices... oh, waitJan 28 00:00
schestowitzThere are 75 million Twitter users 28 00:00
schestowitz*LOL* Microsoft nearly confirms Zune phone 28 00:02
schestowitzYou don't make s/t good by mixing two s**tsJan 28 00:02
schestowitzZune and WInMobJan 28 00:02
MinceRto some, it doesn't matter that it isn't goodJan 28 00:03
cubezzzZune and WinBlob ftl!Jan 28 00:03
Chips_B_MalroyMS will not give up on WinMO as a cellphone platform, even though it knows its hopeless.  The PR will continue for that, but the real goal is CE on ARM, Mips, etcJan 28 00:04
schestowitz 28 00:04
phIRCe-BNcTitle: I, Cringely  » Blog Archive   » Apple Tablet Twit! - Cringely on technology  .::. Size~: 71.75 KBJan 28 00:04
schestowitz"Yes, it’s true… I’ve been beta testing the Apple tablet for the past two weeks and it’s amazing!"Jan 28 00:04
schestowitzThey gave schwag???Jan 28 00:04
MinceRor he's lyingJan 28 00:05
MinceRdoesn't really matter which, does it? :>Jan 28 00:05
schestowitzIf he got it for free ahead of time......Jan 28 00:05
schestowitzWell, he did obviouslyJan 28 00:05
Chips_B_MalroyAs such, WinMO/CE will continue to lose money.   It will be a drain on MS resources and profit.Jan 28 00:05
schestowitzIt was off the marketJan 28 00:05
MinceRstrange, WP says it's IPS, cringely says it's OLEDJan 28 00:05
MinceRlol @ "reads fingerprints for security"Jan 28 00:06
schestowitzChomium is based on UbuntuJan 28 00:07
schestowitzWill it use Bong? ;-)Jan 28 00:07
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schestowitzMinceR: so you need finger to use itJan 28 00:08
schestowitz"I'll take 10!"Jan 28 00:08
schestowitzUS PR: 28 00:08
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Flying radio station broadcasts help to Haiti - .::. Size~: 51.92 KBJan 28 00:08
schestowitzAfter all they had to /to/ Haiti.......Jan 28 00:09
MinceR010452 < schestowitz> Will it use Bong? ;-)Jan 28 00:09
MinceRlolJan 28 00:09
schestowitzNow it's PR time... doing 'for' HaitiJan 28 00:09
schestowitzMinceR: "I was like sooo high after using teh bong........"Jan 28 00:09
schestowitz"I nearly pissed in my own pants..."Jan 28 00:10
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] are Apple doing their own DRM'd eBook format which only works on their device? it wouldn't be like them eh?Jan 28 00:11
MinceRdon't they already have DRMed eBooks? DefectiveByDesign's chart seems to suggest that they doJan 28 00:12
schestowitzI've used plain PDF on my Palm for agesJan 28 00:15
schestowitzApple take people backwardsJan 28 00:16
schestowitzIt won't workJan 28 00:16
schestowitzJust as it failed for the recording cartelJan 28 00:16
Chips_B_MalroyAnother way to look at Ubuntu being paid by MS to switch to Bing (Yahoo) as default.  Ubuntu may need the cash, as Shuttleworth leaving may also mean he donates less cash.  MS is also if fact by paying Ubuntu to switch, is admitting in a way, that Ubuntu has lots of users, and it needs them to beat Google.  Sort of gives false to the 1%  claim when you think about it.Jan 28 00:16
*ThistleWeb has quit ("Lost terminal")Jan 28 00:16
Chips_B_MalroyM$ only uses its old playbook, pay for default switches, try to embed the default in Windows, and in updates, etc.  Problem is for MS, the old playbook is not working so well anymore.Jan 28 00:18
Chips_B_MalroyMS cannot innovate, never has, no matter how much they lie about it.Jan 28 00:18
Chips_B_MalroyPeople do not like Bing, no matter how much. how often you change the name.  Even if you call it "Yahoo" search, its still Bing.Jan 28 00:21
schestowitzMicrosoft did this with OEMJan 28 00:23
schestowitzIt was found guilty of breaking the lawJan 28 00:23
schestowitzMaybe settled to avoid convictionJan 28 00:23
schestowitzBut there are accurate description of how they made COmpq, for example, put Netscape awayJan 28 00:24
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: they need the Yahoo thing to spyJan 28 00:24
schestowitzThis is how they refine resultsJan 28 00:24
*jono has quit ("Ex-Chat")Jan 28 00:24
schestowitzSo users of Yahoo!'s become the garbils to BallmerJan 28 00:24
schestowitz*gerbilJan 28 00:24
schestowitzjono leftJan 28 00:24
schestowitzMaybe offendedJan 28 00:24
schestowitz*LMAO* 28 00:25
schestowitzGarbageOSJan 28 00:25
phIRCe-BNcTitle: News Leak Confirms Apple Tablet Will Run iPhone OS - Apple tablet, iPhone, OS - Techworld .::. Size~: 50.75 KBJan 28 00:25
schestowitzUseless for almost everythingJan 28 00:26
schestowitzNo control, no featuresJan 28 00:26
schestowitz 28 00:26
phIRCe-BNcTitle: As wired business shrinks, Verizon expects 13,000 job cuts - job cuts, verizon - Techworld .::. Size~: 47.85 KBJan 28 00:26
schestowitzMaybe this is why they sold out to Bong [sic]Jan 28 00:26
schestowitz$500,000,000 to move away from Google, reportedly (The Register)Jan 28 00:27
schestowitzIDG promotes the notion that we onyl had a recessionJan 28 00:27
schestowitzAnd there there is after "the recssion"Jan 28 00:27
schestowitzBy lulling people they play a dangerous gameJan 28 00:28
schestowitzThey ignore the fact that companies continue to implode and foreclosures accelerateJan 28 00:28
schestowitzThis is just irresponsible reportingJan 28 00:28
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dyfet 28 00:30
phIRCe-BNcTitle: EIM: We refused Microsoft's orgies and paid for it .::. Size~: 37.39 KBJan 28 00:30
dyfetI just loved the title ;)  But it is also a very serious storyJan 28 00:30
schestowitzHahahaJan 28 00:31
schestowitzExcellentJan 28 00:31
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schestowitzmaybe this is what Paul Allen made those cruises for, never disclosing why he visits the Israeli costJan 28 00:31
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schestowitz /sarcasmJan 28 00:32
schestowitzHe did deny the mediaJan 28 00:32
dyfetCapt. Allen of the Microsoft love boat? ;)Jan 28 00:39
dyfetBut it is a story consistent with the institutional corrupt business practices of Microsoft, which is why I noted itJan 28 00:41
schestowitzHeh.Jan 28 00:47
schestowitzWell..Jan 28 00:47
schestowitzI need to find the refJan 28 00:47
schestowitzI also recall an incident from 2 years agoJan 28 00:47
schestowitzSome sex calls form MS HQ or somewhere in same buildingJan 28 00:47
schestowitzBrother or somthingJan 28 00:47
schestowitzIt was on InfoWeekJan 28 00:47
schestowitz /Brother/Brothel/Jan 28 00:47
schestowitzdyfet: how did you come across it?Jan 28 00:48
schestowitzI usually collect MS news on Sunday afternoons... probably would have found it laterJan 28 00:48
dyfetIt was mentioned by someone on groklawJan 28 00:48
dyfetThe few places that carry the story seem to all refer back to the original article in globesJan 28 00:53
schestowitz 28 00:58
phIRCe-BNcTitle: [Phoronix] Adobe Rants Over Linux Video Acceleration APIs .::. Size~: 17.73 KBJan 28 00:58
schestowitzHere they go againJan 28 00:58
schestowitzdyfet: what else references it?Jan 28 00:59
schestowitzI suppose I could look that upJan 28 00:59
dyfetWell, a google search on "eim microsoft suit drugs" gives lots of hits, but all refer back to the original globes storyJan 28 00:59
*Spreadsheet_ (n=Spreadsh@unaffiliated/spreadsheet) has joined #boycottnovellJan 28 01:01
schestowitzDoes it still use a lot of mono like gnome-do: 28 01:01
schestowitzTHis one won't experiment with bongJan 28 01:01
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Spreadsheet_I'm going to need to take notes in class using my laptop. Should I use tomboy, or use something like Gnote that isn't mono?Jan 28 01:05
schestowitz 28 01:10
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Why Ubuntu GNU/Linux Should Not Make Microsoft Even Stronger | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 121.5 KBJan 28 01:10
schestowitz"Microsoft has eliminated Linspire/Xandros and I worry that we should try to help Ubuntu rather than bin it. Ubuntu’s deal — unlike Novell’s and Linspire’s and Xandros’ — does not in any direct way harm other distributors of GNU/Linux."Jan 28 01:10
schestowitzSpreadsheet_: we have a list, hold on...Jan 28 01:10
schestowitzHere is the list: 28 01:11
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Mono Applications - Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 21.59 KBJan 28 01:11
schestowitzIt shows you substitutesJan 28 01:11
Spreadsheet_I heard that ubuntu is actually considering using "solang" instead of fspotJan 28 01:11
schestowitzEnder2070: good news abut gnomeJan 28 01:11
Spreadsheet_They aren't replacing GIMP with FsportJan 28 01:11
Spreadsheet_*fspotJan 28 01:11
schestowitzEnder2070: 28 01:11
Spreadsheet_They are replacing GIMP with PitiviJan 28 01:11
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Checking in on the GNOME Foundation «  The .::. Size~: 34.34 KBJan 28 01:11
schestowitzSpreadsheet_: when they proposed removed (Rick from Microsoft//Ubuntu) fspot was namedJan 28 01:12
schestowitzIt's good that they add something different, but fspot probably staysJan 28 01:12
schestowitzThey also employed the gnome-do devJan 28 01:12
schestowitzCanonical pays himJan 28 01:12
schestowitzSO they could sooner or later preinstall itJan 28 01:12
Spreadsheet_They employed the Gnome-Do dev? Where?Jan 28 01:13
Spreadsheet_And how does using permissive licenses allow for patents?Jan 28 01:14
schestowitzSpreadsheet_: I could find you the blog postJan 28 01:15
schestowitzI can't find that now, but I wrote about it at one stage... 28 01:16
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Canonical Hires Noveller, Job Probably Wont Include Mono | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 106.15 KBJan 28 01:16
schestowitzAround July IIRCJan 28 01:16
schestowitz2009Jan 28 01:16
schestowitz 28 01:18
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Yahoo Calls On Grad Students To Improve Internet | WebProNews .::. Size~: 31.99 KBJan 28 01:18
schestowitz 28 01:19
phIRCe-BNcTitle: YouTube Movie Rental Experiment Fails (So Far) | WebProNews .::. Size~: 34.13 KBJan 28 01:19
schestowitzGoodJan 28 01:19
schestowitzdrmJan 28 01:19
schestowitztime expiryJan 28 01:19
schestowitz,antarctic-network-caretakers-in-demand.aspxJan 28 01:21
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Ender2070heheJan 28 02:13
schestowitz 28 02:20
*DaemonFC ( has joined #boycottnovellJan 28 03:00
DaemonFCrelax guys.....I'm from the government and I'm here to help. ;)Jan 28 03:01
*schestowitz ducks under tableJan 28 03:04
schestowitzMy sleeping cycles got b0rkedJan 28 03:04
schestowitzI get tired at 6amJan 28 03:04
DaemonFCgood thing it's 10 PMJan 28 03:05
DaemonFC;)Jan 28 03:05
DaemonFCschestowitz: I still want Indiana to ban daylight savings time againJan 28 03:06
DaemonFCwe didn't ever change the clocks until I was like 22 years oldJan 28 03:06
schestowitzNo self-correction?Jan 28 03:06
DaemonFCstill can't get used to itJan 28 03:06
schestowitz"@glynmoody she always writes there. IIRC used to write for some MSFT magazine"Jan 28 03:07
schestowitzPerezJan 28 03:07
DaemonFCschestowitz: Indiana is weird, we're in two different time zones, only like, 81 counties are in Eastern and 11 are in CentralJan 28 03:07
schestowitzMicrosoft infiltrationsJan 28 03:07
DaemonFCso the counties that are now in Eastern never observed DST til 2006Jan 28 03:07
schestowitzDST broke Windows in 2007 IIRCJan 28 03:08
schestowitzMaybe 2008.Jan 28 03:08
schestowitzNo, 2007...Jan 28 03:08
DaemonFCwhile some near the Illinois and Kentucky border didJan 28 03:08
DaemonFCmaybe it broke it in 2008 and it went back and thought it was 2007Jan 28 03:08
DaemonFCor maybe it happens again and it throws us back into 2008 and so many people use Windows that they just go along with itJan 28 03:09
DaemonFCand maybe we put Bush back into office cause of it and have to go through the election againJan 28 03:09
DaemonFCscary isn't it?Jan 28 03:09
DaemonFCschestowitz: my mom had to learn a kiosk system running Windows XP todayJan 28 03:12
schestowitzI go based on feel cause I wrote a lot about itJan 28 03:12
*tessier__ has quit ("leaving")Jan 28 03:12
schestowitzI have about 6 references on itJan 28 03:12
schestowitzServers went cuckoo if they ran WIndowsJan 28 03:13
DaemonFCit was freezing up and crashing so much that she ended up getting two hours overtime waiting on them to fix it so the class could proceedJan 28 03:13
DaemonFCturns out it was the same kiosk system I was using when I worked in that nursing homeJan 28 03:13
DaemonFCI told her to just hold in the power button until it shuts off and then press the power button to turn it back onJan 28 03:14
DaemonFCschestowitz: I can't believe anyone would be stupid enough to buy a brand new kiosk system for a massive nursing home like that and run it on fucking Windows XPJan 28 03:22
DaemonFCand you know it must have cost a fortuneJan 28 03:22
DaemonFCDilbertJan 28 03:23
DaemonFCthat's all I'm going to say is.....DilbertJan 28 03:23
Ender2070schestowitz - according to statistics canada, more people are dying than being born - and immigration alone has accounted for population growthJan 28 03:25
Ender2070in CanadaJan 28 03:25
DaemonFCcoolJan 28 03:26
DaemonFCeventually the US plot of slipping drugs into Canada that cause sterility will be completeJan 28 03:26
DaemonFCwe can wait for the population to die off and then take the land and resources for ourselvesJan 28 03:26
DaemonFCBush's idea I'm sureJan 28 03:27
Ender2070the birthrate has declined since 1991Jan 28 03:27
Ender2070the deathrate has gone upJan 28 03:27
DaemonFCBush Sr.Jan 28 03:27
DaemonFCmuahahahahahaJan 28 03:27
Ender2070"population control" in canada is pointlessJan 28 03:28
DaemonFCyeah, we're beaming bozo rays into your brainsJan 28 03:28
DaemonFCmaking you go crazy and eviscerate yourselvesJan 28 03:28
DaemonFCit's all going to planJan 28 03:28
*DaemonFC rubs his hands together like a mad scientistJan 28 03:29
Ender2070alright Rush LimbaughJan 28 03:29
DaemonFCnah, I'm not Rush LimbaughJan 28 03:29
DaemonFCI'm not 400 pounds and buying oxycontin in a Denny's parking lot in cigar boxesJan 28 03:29
DaemonFCI'm also not on AM radio, which most normal people don't know existsJan 28 03:30
Ender2070one weird/interesting statistic: immigration and emmigration numbers are identical - meaning they must have a cap on who can leave the countryJan 28 03:30
DaemonFCEnder2070: Mind teaching ICE how to do that?Jan 28 03:30
DaemonFCIf I was President, you'd see a crackdown like you've never seen beforeJan 28 03:31
DaemonFCI'd issue an executive order to have the US Marshals, ICE, and the FBI out doing raidsJan 28 03:31
DaemonFCall day every dayJan 28 03:31
DaemonFCsuspend the War on Drugs and retask the agents to immigrationJan 28 03:32
DaemonFCmarch them out by the thousandsJan 28 03:32
DaemonFCopens up jobs, gets rid of drug smugglers, gets rid of criminals who commit border skirmishesJan 28 03:33
DaemonFCyou know, like, the ones that come here and rape and murder US citizens and then we let the bastards go because it's not politically correct to charge them with crimes for the felonies they commitJan 28 03:34
DaemonFCthe ones that cross the border carrying drugs and get into shootouts with sheriffs and deputies on this side of the borderJan 28 03:35
DaemonFCyou never hear about that shit, not even Fox Noise will touch itJan 28 03:35
DaemonFCit's getting to where there are so many of them here establishing generations of anchor babies, that even the Republicans are too afraid to piss them offJan 28 03:36
DaemonFCEnder2070: You want to talk about immigration problems? The Mexicans are getting ready to overwhelm black people in the US after only the last 30 years of the ongoing immigration problem.Jan 28 03:38
DaemonFCtheir growth is nearly 100% due to unlawful immigrationJan 28 03:39
DaemonFC 28 03:40
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Dear Obama, Im moving to Mexico … «  Marylous America .::. Size~: 23.8 KBJan 28 03:40
DaemonFCnot original, but still funnyJan 28 03:41
DaemonFC"9. I do plan to get a car and drive in Mexico, but I don’t plan to  purchase car insurance, and I probably won’t make any special effort to  learn local traffic laws." <----- lolJan 28 03:42
Ender2070not saying its a problemJan 28 03:42
Ender2070how else is the government going to get extra tax money if the population is going downJan 28 03:42
Ender2070especially when they keep borrowing money from the world bankJan 28 03:43
DaemonFCEnder2070: We deport some Mexicans to Canada and they clean your toilets and pick your tomatos and spit in your fast food for less than your prevailing minimum wageJan 28 03:44
DaemonFCI'm sure we can spare a few......millionJan 28 03:44
DaemonFCEnder2070: World Bank loans are the national equivalent of going to a cash advance placeJan 28 03:45
Diablo-D3wheres the boJan 28 03:45
Diablo-D3tJan 28 03:45
DaemonFCEnder2070: From a Canadian perspective, maybe you can clue me in on something? And it might just be the way I'm perceiving this issue.Jan 28 03:47
Ender2070whatJan 28 03:48
DaemonFCDoes no other country even care about the national sovereignty they lose when doing business with the UN, WIPO, World Bank, International Criminal Court, World Health Organization, etc?Jan 28 03:48
DaemonFCcause that's the way a lot of people rub me that aren't in the USJan 28 03:49
Ender2070the US does the same thingJan 28 03:49
Ender2070every country does itJan 28 03:49
Ender2070its the planJan 28 03:49
DaemonFCunfortunatelyJan 28 03:49
Ender2070the UN is destined to run the worldJan 28 03:49
Ender2070it does right now behind the scenesJan 28 03:49
DaemonFCI'd like to see public beheading for all the people responsible for getting us involved in this and keeping us involvedJan 28 03:50
Ender2070all the building codes are drafted by them for instanceJan 28 03:50
Ender2070they keep updating the building codes so people in rural areas cant keep upJan 28 03:50
DaemonFCEnder2070: You know something messed up? Speaking of codes and permits.Jan 28 03:50
Ender2070?Jan 28 03:51
DaemonFCI had to get a building permit from the country to put up one of those prefabricated sheds in my back yardJan 28 03:51
DaemonFC*countyJan 28 03:51
Ender2070yeah?Jan 28 03:51
DaemonFCpay them $100 to give me a piece of paper authorizing a little toolshedJan 28 03:51
Ender2070did someone show up and tell you other stuff had to be updated?Jan 28 03:51
DaemonFCno, they didn'tJan 28 03:51
DaemonFCit does get better thoughJan 28 03:52
Ender2070i've heard the UN even hires people to go around inspecting rural places and rats you out to your local governmentJan 28 03:52
DaemonFCthey tried to include it in their assessment for my landlord's property taxesJan 28 03:52
Ender2070DaemonFC +1Jan 28 03:52
Ender2070its to push you out via feesJan 28 03:53
DaemonFCyeah, they're going through telling people that their $50,000 home + lot is worth $100,000 for tax purposesJan 28 03:53
DaemonFCtaxpayers in Indiana got some revenge thoughJan 28 03:53
DaemonFCballot initiatives to fire township tax assessors and cap the property tax at 1% were passed into lawJan 28 03:54
DaemonFCwithout the governor signing anything B-)Jan 28 03:54
DaemonFCI voted for both initiativesJan 28 03:54
Ender2070LOLJan 28 03:54
Ender2070they'll simply skip a generation and try againJan 28 03:55
DaemonFCit's what happens when you push people entirely too farJan 28 03:55
DaemonFCenough to where they go figure out what their rights areJan 28 03:55
DaemonFCI think they expected people to just lay back and take their property taxes doublingJan 28 03:55
DaemonFCnow the towns and cities all over the state are having to cut wasteful spending due to decreased tax revenuesJan 28 03:56
DaemonFCit's a beautiful thing to watchJan 28 03:56
DaemonFClooking for ways to get money without pissing off the taxpayersJan 28 03:56
Ender2070toronto just started cracking down on jaywalkers with $50 tickets for crossingJan 28 03:57
DaemonFCthere's an interesting thing that's coming to the town I live inJan 28 03:57
DaemonFCcalled Nature's FuelJan 28 03:57
Ender2070one person got a ticket for crossing when the flashing hand was upJan 28 03:57
DaemonFCthey take garbage and make some kind of natural gas out of itJan 28 03:57
Ender2070i didnt know that was illegalJan 28 03:57
DaemonFCEnder2070: That would be an infractionJan 28 03:57
Ender2070but yeah, they tried to say it was to save livesJan 28 03:57
DaemonFCit's to take your moneyJan 28 03:58
Ender2070they had a special day where they monitored one crossingJan 28 03:58
Ender2070they gave out 26 ticketsJan 28 03:58
DaemonFCseat belt law = $50 fine nowJan 28 03:58
Ender2070im like "bullshit, its for funding the police dept"Jan 28 03:58
DaemonFCdon't buckle it, you get a ticketJan 28 03:58
Ender2070if its for safety, they should donate the ticket money to a related charityJan 28 03:58
Ender2070if they really caredJan 28 03:58
DaemonFCMothers Against Street Crossing?Jan 28 03:59
Ender2070we had a seat belt law for a whileJan 28 03:59
Ender2070we just banned cell phone use while driving, i agree with that one :)Jan 28 03:59
Ender2070gotta have handsfreeJan 28 03:59
DaemonFCyeah, Indiana loves texting and it loves cigarettesJan 28 03:59
DaemonFCwe're like the only state left where it's fashionable to smoke in family restaurantsJan 28 04:00
Ender2070our government had plans to get rid of health coverage for smokersJan 28 04:00
DaemonFCthey shouldJan 28 04:00
Ender2070it has a very high anti smoking agendaJan 28 04:00
Ender2070which is goodJan 28 04:00
Ender2070its illegal to smoke within 50 feet of a buildingJan 28 04:00
Ender2070fully illegal to smoke insideJan 28 04:00
Ender2070anywhereJan 28 04:01
DaemonFCEnder2070: It's $100 fine for you and the owner of the bar/restaurant/whatever if you smoke inside the place in Fort WayneJan 28 04:01
Ender2070no such thing as smoking seating anymoreJan 28 04:01
DaemonFCyou have to be 20 feet away from any entranceJan 28 04:01
Ender2070yeah its 50 feet from an entrance hereJan 28 04:01
Ender2070no smoking at all on public/government propertyJan 28 04:01
Ender2070except sidewalks i thinkJan 28 04:01
DaemonFCthe owner of After Dark, the bar I go to sometimes lets you go out on the back patio and smokeJan 28 04:02
DaemonFChides you from the smoking inspector :PJan 28 04:02
Ender2070the one bar had spent a huge chunk of cash making a smoke friendly bar, it had an insane ventilation system and everythingJan 28 04:02
Ender2070a month later its illegal to smoke inside, whatsoeverJan 28 04:02
Ender2070lolJan 28 04:02
schestowitz[03:25] <Ender2070> schestowitz - according to statistics canada, more people are dying than being born - and immigration alone has accounted for population growthJan 28 04:03
schestowitzThat's not necessarily a bad thingJan 28 04:03
schestowitzMany nations struggle to /convince/ people to reduce birth ratesJan 28 04:03
Ender2070if overcrowding is a prob in canada, cut back on immigrationJan 28 04:03
schestowitzJapan and Europe naturally do OKJan 28 04:03
Ender2070birth rates have been going down for 20 yearsJan 28 04:03
Ender2070death rates have been going upJan 28 04:03
schestowitzChina apparently needs rules and enforcementJan 28 04:03
DaemonFCEnder2070: A lot of bars just ignore the law cause it's cheaper to pay the fines than lose the customersJan 28 04:04
DaemonFCit's a way for the city to milk people for finesJan 28 04:04
DaemonFCit's a taxJan 28 04:04
Ender2070families used to have like 5-6 children, back in the 50sJan 28 04:04
Ender2070now its averaging at 2Jan 28 04:05
DaemonFCsome still doJan 28 04:05
Ender2070and they are pushing 1Jan 28 04:05
DaemonFCCatholics and MormonsJan 28 04:05
DaemonFCMormons with their 14 underaged teenage realative wivesJan 28 04:05
schestowitzEnder2070: trmanco has just returned to CanadaJan 28 04:05
schestowitzHe's a good ladJan 28 04:06
DaemonFCand Catholics just as fast as their monogamous marriage can expel and reloadJan 28 04:06
Ender2070yeahJan 28 04:06
Ender2070my point wasJan 28 04:06
Ender2070there is no reason to push having less kids in canada, as immigration is the only reason the population is going upJan 28 04:06
schestowitzNeed it go up?Jan 28 04:06
Ender2070cut back on immigration would fix overcrowdingJan 28 04:06
schestowitzIt's not GDPJan 28 04:06
schestowitzAnd what's with growth of economy"?Jan 28 04:06
schestowitzWhat does it mean?Jan 28 04:06
schestowitzWhat is economy and money?Jan 28 04:06
schestowitzThey are not real assetsJan 28 04:07
schestowitzThe Earth absorbs energyJan 28 04:07
schestowitzWe use it in different warJan 28 04:07
schestowitzSome is radiated back to spaceJan 28 04:07
schestowitzMoney does not exist hereJan 28 04:07
schestowitzIt's man-madeJan 28 04:07
Ender2070Canada is the 2nd largest land mass in the world, with most of its land untapped, 32 million people focused on a few large citiesJan 28 04:07
schestowitzAnd humans increasing in number is like bacteria expanding in a Petri dishJan 28 04:07
Ender2070i dont doubt other countries might need to curb birth ratesJan 28 04:07
schestowitzEnder2070: cause it's coldJan 28 04:08
Ender2070leave Canada alone!Jan 28 04:08
Ender2070lolJan 28 04:08
schestowitzANd it takes energy to keep homo sapients in CanadaJan 28 04:08
Ender2070nahJan 28 04:08
Ender2070we have so much energy we have to sell some of it to the americansJan 28 04:08
schestowitzAlso food supplies in winter timeJan 28 04:08
*Eruaran has quit (Remote closed the connection)Jan 28 04:08
schestowitzEnergy has side-effectsJan 28 04:09
schestowitzLike global dimmingJan 28 04:09
schestowitzThen you can lose land, fauna and floraJan 28 04:09
Ender2070LOLJan 28 04:09
schestowitzThe Earth will always revolve around its axis and the SunJan 28 04:09
schestowitzAlmost alwaysJan 28 04:09
schestowitzWhat's on Earth may changeJan 28 04:09
schestowitzWe could mess up the atmosphere and become like VEnus over timeJan 28 04:10
Ender2070ever heard of the concept "continuity of government" ?Jan 28 04:10
schestowitzMost of the Earth is not even what we seeJan 28 04:10
schestowitzMost of it is magma and stuffJan 28 04:10
schestowitzWe're only seeing like maybe 5% of the planetJan 28 04:10
schestowitzground to stratosphereJan 28 04:10
Ender2070yeahJan 28 04:10
schestowitzThe most stuff is deep inside, matter includedJan 28 04:11
Ender2070some of the oceans haven't even had full explorationJan 28 04:11
schestowitzBig red giants would be fun to travelJan 28 04:11
schestowitzBut too much gasJan 28 04:11
schestowitzIt would probably take you some hundreds of years or travel in a 747 to just go around it onceJan 28 04:12
Ender2070maybe atlantis is at the bottom of one of the oceansJan 28 04:12
schestowitzWhat is Atlantis really?Jan 28 04:12
schestowitzPeople in deep sea?Jan 28 04:12
schestowitzProbably ugly and pale and weirdJan 28 04:12
schestowitzI wouldn't want to see AtlantisJan 28 04:12
schestowitzPeople with gills and sperm like headsJan 28 04:13
Ender2070it was supposedly some old advanced human civilizationJan 28 04:14
Ender2070a cataclysm had taken them outJan 28 04:14
schestowitzAny remnants?Jan 28 04:14
schestowitzLike us..... we'd leave space debrisJan 28 04:14
Ender2070its one of those legends that hasn't been proven to be true yetJan 28 04:14
schestowitzStill circling us in piles of small rotten junkJan 28 04:15
schestowitzEnder2070: where does the legend originate?Jan 28 04:15
Ender2070PlatoJan 28 04:15
schestowitzI once heard this old legend about a dude who created usJan 28 04:15
schestowitz[04:14] <Ender2070> its one of those legends that hasn't been proven to be true yetJan 28 04:15
schestowitzThis one.. neitherJan 28 04:15
Ender2070lolJan 28 04:15
Ender2070some of the old civilizations refered to god as an alienJan 28 04:16
schestowitzWhat did Plato invent again? Or was he a philosopher? I can't recallJan 28 04:16
Ender2070who modified them, not createdJan 28 04:16
schestowitzI think Plato wrote some Greek stuffJan 28 04:16
schestowitzMaybe political too?Jan 28 04:16
schestowitzOr was it the atom guy? I think notJan 28 04:16
Ender2070Plato was a philosopherJan 28 04:16
schestowitzSo he was not a scientist or explorerJan 28 04:17
schestowitzHe wrote stuffJan 28 04:17
schestowitzIt's like that Watt guy taking questions about JesusJan 28 04:17
schestowitzABout how he must have existed cause some people wrote about itJan 28 04:18
schestowitzThat was ages agoJan 28 04:18
schestowitzEven the more recent Shakespeare we know was just plagiarising lotsJan 28 04:18
schestowitzNo wonder there are so many virgin moms and sons of the SunJan 28 04:18
Ender2070Shakesphere is alleged to be multiple authorsJan 28 04:19
schestowitzWhy need they be virgin anyway?Jan 28 04:19
schestowitzIs the human anatomy so repulsive?Jan 28 04:19
DaemonFCschestowitz: I have no strong preferenceJan 28 04:20
schestowitzI think the urethra or ovary or something around there is word for "panic" in GreekJan 28 04:20
DaemonFCthat's a religious hangupJan 28 04:20
schestowitzPenis means "Tail", IIRCJan 28 04:20
DaemonFCschestowitz: That episode of Futurama where Zoidberg reattaches Hermes' head backwardsJan 28 04:21
DaemonFC"I thought you'd be happy, look your tail is wagging"Jan 28 04:22
DaemonFC:)Jan 28 04:22
schestowitzI don't think I watched that episodeJan 28 04:23
schestowitzBut that was ages ago, I might just not remember itJan 28 04:23
Diablo-D3hrmJan 28 04:28
Diablo-D3the bot seems to be deadJan 28 04:28
Diablo-D3schestowitz: fix the botJan 28 04:29
schestowitzOh both of them evenJan 28 04:31
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-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] yummy pizza :DJan 28 04:32
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #TSA is a terrorist organization, yet again proven 28 04:32
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] I've seen this before, but heres the 18 minute video about the world's most important drum loop #awesomeJan 28 04:32
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] *warning highly annoying stuff* :P enjoy!!!Jan 28 04:32
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] FOSSEE site looks promising except the slides and videos are stored in non-free format. 28 04:32
phIRCe-BNcTitle: TSA plants baggie of white powder in traveller's bag Boing Boing .::. Size~: 130.55 KBJan 28 04:32
phIRCe-BNcTitle: HURR-DURR .::. Size~: 3.84 KBJan 28 04:33
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[serk01/@serk01] Make Youtube use open media codecs 28 04:33
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Downloads | FOSSEE .::. Size~: 13.2 KBJan 28 04:33
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] Who contributes to linux kernel, Little weird to see 7% of contribution comes from 'unknown' people (via @linuxjournal)Jan 28 04:33
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Make YouTube use open media codecs - Petition Spot .::. Size~: 52.57 KBJan 28 04:33
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] RT: @chadmccullough I see the lie dept at Microsoft is hard at work. 28 04:33
phIRCe-BNcTitle: .::. Size~: 4.06 KBJan 28 04:33
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] Will Idealism be Firefox's Downfall? - surprisingly clueless piece ignores Free s/w (via @glynmoody)Jan 28 04:33
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] idly+vada+poori+coconut water for breakfast and republic day school/college crowd on the streets + small walk+ cloudy chennai #ftwJan 28 04:37
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] RD: @schestowitz: #RedHat Launches New Site Based on #FreeSoftware ( #Drupal ) 28 04:37
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] The truth about Duke Nukem Forever #appleJan 28 04:37
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] RT: @linuxnetbook: For those who need a working version of Windows 28 04:37
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[serk01/@serk01] anyone else for 3D ? 28 04:37
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[serk01/@serk01] just became a member of the fsf!Jan 28 04:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Red Hat launches community site - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 30.11 KBJan 28 04:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle: launches on Drupal | Dries Buytaert .::. Size~: 13.18 KBJan 28 04:37
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] Tried to update emacs-goodies for !fedora; koji build failed for F13, some depsolving probs with glib2. Hope it will be fixed soon.Jan 28 04:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Steve Jobs drops the big bomb [COMIC] | Fredo and Pidjin. The Webcomic. .::. Size~: 94.09 KBJan 28 04:37
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] California school bans the English language #douchebagsJan 28 04:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting  type .::. Size~: 0 KBJan 28 04:37
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[freemjd/@freemjd] Any chance of using for @boycottnovell instead of putting it all in @schestowitz? Overwhelming.Jan 28 04:37
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #Mozilla #Weave doesn't work right on Linux PPC, apparently it has some binary blob crap in it; how lameJan 28 04:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle: SoCal school district bans the dictionary Boing Boing .::. Size~: 203.55 KBJan 28 04:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Tricklepost | StatusNet .::. Size~: 15.07 KBJan 28 04:38
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Needless to say, I've ditched #Weave and gone back to #Xmarks which doesn't require useless binary crapJan 28 04:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Judge puts anti-terrorist freedom fighter in jail, I wish more people would fight terrorism at home #scientologyJan 28 04:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #Ubuntu is a #Microsoft scam 28 04:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] updated emacs-goodies; Pushed it into fedora stable repository :-) #bugfix updateJan 28 04:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] #nowplaying kaho na Pyar hai... good song :DJan 28 04:42
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Man to plead guilty in Scientology cyber attacks  - .::. Size~: 53.53 KBJan 28 04:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] #nowplaying Peace Up! A town Down! #usher #ftw :DJan 28 04:42
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Slashdot Linux Story | Ubuntu Moves To Yahoo For Default Firefox Search .::. Size~: 158.34 KBJan 28 04:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] c-x c-c good night!Jan 28 04:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #Apple #iPad comes with wifi only unless you pay extra for 3G, Wimax is not an option, only runs iPhone OS and its an ARM. What a failure.Jan 28 04:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Seriously, what is #Apple smoking. No one wants a useless 10 inch iPhone that can't even make calls on most models. And 2 pounds? Seriously?Jan 28 04:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Oh, and the #iPad costs $500 for the 3G-less model. What a rip off.Jan 28 04:42
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Ender2070 28 05:08
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Britain: Dr. David Kelly death evidence suppressed for 70 years .::. Size~: 34.02 KBJan 28 05:08
schestowitzI hope to live to that dayJan 28 05:09
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schestowitzIf I live to be a hundred I might discover the truthJan 28 05:09
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schestowitzMy priorities will have changed by then, though :-)Jan 28 05:10
schestowitzOn my death bed they'll tell you about that incident that happend when you were a teenJan 28 05:10
schestowitzLike telling a veteran something about World War 1... today.Jan 28 05:10
schestowitzEven nuclear war (Cold War) secrets were not sealed for so longJan 28 05:11
schestowitzMaybe they'll store the investigation details in OOXML :0)Jan 28 05:11
schestowitzThat sure will make them rubbish within less than 10 yearsJan 28 05:12
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft and #GNU #Linux Don't Mix Well 28 05:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsoft and Linux Will Never Be "Best Buddies" - Linux Servers and Apache News Story .::. Size~: 54.24 KBJan 28 05:12
Omar87Greetings all.Jan 28 05:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux User Kicks #Netflix to the Curb 28 05:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Linux Basement Releases Nice New Episode one of my fav showsJan 28 05:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Desktop #GNU #Linux a Good Choice to Many Computer Users 28 05:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Ian's Thoughts: Dear Netflix .::. Size~: 94.41 KBJan 28 05:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: .::. Size~: 10.92 KBJan 28 05:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: .::. Size~: 10.92 KBJan 28 05:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux and Good Employment Increasingly More Synonymous 28 05:14
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #China Builds Giant #GNU #Linux Servers That Cannot Run #Windows 28 05:14
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Reviews and Raves About #GNU #Linux -Only Programs 28 05:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: .::. Size~: 10.92 KBJan 28 05:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: .::. Size~: 10.92 KBJan 28 05:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: open...: Enter the (Big) Dragon .::. Size~: 103.17 KBJan 28 05:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: .::. Size~: 10.92 KBJan 28 05:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: .::. Size~: 10.92 KBJan 28 05:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: .::. Size~: 10.92 KBJan 28 05:14
schestowitzHi, Omar87Jan 28 05:14
Omar87schestowitz: Hey.Jan 28 05:15
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-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Someone wake me when I can get Android or ChromeOS tablets the same size that can actually multitask and cost $250 and not weigh a tonJan 28 05:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] This sums up how I feel about the #Apple #iPad 28 05:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] US Customs are legally allowed to perform terrorism against American Citizens while they cross the border 28 05:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #Vimeo HTML5 player doesn't support the Vimeo HD channel (yet?), the most useful point of it (since Flash chokes on high res video)Jan 28 05:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle: No Warrant Necessary to Seize Your Laptop | Freedom to Tinker .::. Size~: 29.14 KBJan 28 05:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #Australia hates Asian women #douchebags #policestateJan 28 05:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] More on that #Australia sexist/racist bullshit 28 05:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] A Day In Paris by Benoit Millot !miotdJan 28 05:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle:   Australia bans small breasts - Somebody Think Of The Children .::. Size~: 46.88 KBJan 28 05:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle:   Now Australia Is Banning Small Boobs .::. Size~: 19.9 KBJan 28 05:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle: The Vimeo HD Channel on Vimeo .::. Size~: 51.45 KBJan 28 05:17
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Android / #Linux Gets New Browser, Rogers Canada Cripples It 28 05:19
phIRCe-BNcTitle: AndroidSPIN | You heard it here, first, on AndroidSPIN. Your No.1 source for Android news.  » Blog Archive   » First beta of Firefox for Android coming in February 2010 ? .::. Size~: 77.34 KBJan 28 05:19
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Rogers Canada forces Android update that takes away root access Boing Boing .::. Size~: 104.16 KBJan 28 05:19
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Another #Robot is #Linux Powered 28 05:20
phIRCe-BNcTitle: PLEN robot controlled by Android | AndroidGuys .::. Size~: 34.3 KBJan 28 05:20
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] The Anticipated #Tablet is Finally Here, Running #Linux 28 05:21
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Archos 7-Inch Tablet Leaked, Features Webcam | AndroidGuys .::. Size~: 31.58 KBJan 28 05:21
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #ARM Beats #x86 to the Punch and Sub-notebooks Run #GNU #Linux Distributions 28 05:23
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Thin clients and the cloud: how ARM beat x86 to the punch .::. Size~: 37.36 KBJan 28 05:23
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Netbook OS .::. Size~: 35.12 KBJan 28 05:24
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Bacula Passes 1,000,000 Downloads 28 05:24
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Bacula Surpasses 1 Million Downloads / Recent news / About us / Bacula Systems - Open Source Backup & Restore For The Enterprise .::. Size~: 25.14 KBJan 28 05:24
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Maddog Calls for Government to Stop Discrimination Harming FOSS 28 05:26
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] List of 65 Life-changing #FreeSoftware Projects,, 15 #Firefox #Wallpapers 28 05:36
phIRCe-BNcTitle: 65 Open Source Downloads That Could Change Your Life &mdash; .::. Size~: 74.92 KBJan 28 05:36
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Top 15 Never Seen Firefox Wallpaper Collection | Tech Drive .::. Size~: 88.57 KBJan 28 05:36
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Monty Widenius of #MySQL Comments on the #Database Acquisition 28 05:41
phIRCe-BNcTitle: The Fight to Save MySQL: Interview with Monty Widenius &mdash; .::. Size~: 72.58 KBJan 28 05:41
Omar87schestowitz: When I read that article about the complete story of Gary Kildall, a little feeling of disgust crawled slowly down my spine.. -_-Jan 28 05:44
Ender2070<phIRCe-BNc> Title: Rogers Canada forces Android update that takes away root access Boing Boing .::. Size~: 104.16 KBJan 28 05:45
Ender2070rogers always break stuff like douche bagsJan 28 05:45
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #NVidia Chooses #Drupal #CMS ; Drupal Gardens Launched 28 05:46
phIRCe-BNcTitle: NVidia using Drupal | Dries Buytaert .::. Size~: 13.22 KBJan 28 05:46
phIRCe-BNcTitle:   Drupal Goes Hosted With Private Beta Launch of Gardens (Invites)  .::. Size~: 77.45 KBJan 28 05:46
Omar87schestowitz: It sounded pretty much like if I take Paulo Coelho's book "The Alchemist", and copy it, then simply tweak the story a little in enough to make it "legally different", then simply publish it under my name.Jan 28 05:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #ASF Releases #SpamAssassin 3.3.0 28 05:48
phIRCe-BNcTitle: The Apache Software Foundation Announces Apache SpamAssassin Version 3.3.0 : The Apache Software Foundation Blog .::. Size~: 23.59 KBJan 28 05:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #IntellectualMonopolists Attack Innocent People, Companies 28 05:51
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC News - Piracy letter campaign 'nets innocents' .::. Size~: 56.78 KBJan 28 05:51
phIRCe-BNcTitle:    IFPI Loses Deep-Linking Case Against Baidu | TorrentFreak   .::. Size~: 80.95 KBJan 28 05:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #FreeSoftware + Hardware Replicate Objects 28 05:52
phIRCe-BNcTitle: In the Next Industrial Revolution, Atoms Are the New Bits | Magazine .::. Size~: 111.15 KBJan 28 05:52
phIRCe-BNcTitle: The Tyee — The Replicator, No Longer a Star Trek Dream .::. Size~: 71.89 KBJan 28 05:52
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Uncivil Rights Lead to #Censorship , #FreeSoftware Among Victims 28 05:55
phIRCe-BNcTitle: SourceForge no longer serving open source to US sanctioned countries - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 31.1 KBJan 28 05:55
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schestowitzEnder2070: maybe because they areJan 28 06:07
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Midgard Makes New #Free #Software Release 28 06:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Updates About the #ACTA Conspiracy 28 06:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Midgard: News: Midgard2 9.09.2 "Mjolnir" released .::. Size~: 12.85 KBJan 28 06:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: ACTA Attacks Internet! Let's Attack ACTA! | La Quadrature du Net .::. Size~: 23.63 KBJan 28 06:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: ACTA and three strikes «  Sköne Oke .::. Size~: 19.66 KBJan 28 06:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Early Day Motion Calling for ACTA Transparency - Community - ComputerworldUK .::. Size~: 73.36 KBJan 28 06:14
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #MAFIAA Goes Undercover, Upsets Barber Shops #racketeerign 28 06:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle:    BitTorrent Spammers Chosen to Spy On French Pirates | TorrentFreak   .::. Size~: 99.97 KBJan 28 06:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: p2pnet news  » Blog Archive   » Spanish hairdressers say No! to SGAE .::. Size~: 45.5 KBJan 28 06:14
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Updates on #Mandelson 's Anti-Magna Carta for Hollywood 28 06:16
phIRCe-BNcTitle: United Against the Digital Economy Bill - Community - ComputerworldUK .::. Size~: 81.86 KBJan 28 06:16
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Digital Economy Bill: will users have to divulge logs? - .::. Size~: 35.76 KBJan 28 06:18
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Virgin Media Collusion with Spying agents Leads to Backlash 28 06:18
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Mandelson in new move to protect music industry secrets - .::. Size~: 38.22 KBJan 28 06:19
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC News - EU to assess piracy detection software .::. Size~: 54.04 KBJan 28 06:19
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schestowitzEnder2070: Jan 28 06:29
schestowitz"@schestowitz #Rogers is the loosiest ISP. The should fly the Jolly Roger over their headquarters considering their pricing :]"Jan 28 06:29
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Wayne Borean (themadhatteron) 's status on Thursday, 28-Jan-10 05:56:21 UTC - .::. Size~: 8.4 KBJan 28 06:29
Ender2070lolJan 28 06:31
schestowitz6:30 bedtime.....Jan 28 06:31
Ender2070nobody likes themJan 28 06:31
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[qu1j0t3] >@zeepooter Just saw an #Ikea commercial. I wanna go so bad. // resist. in the name of all that is good and holyJan 28 06:44
DaemonFC 28 06:48
DaemonFCObama swipes at the Supreme Court with most of them sitting right in front of himJan 28 06:48
DaemonFCniceJan 28 06:48
Omar87schestowitz: Typo detected: "Mono developers are virtually going through the garbage can called “Microsoft” to use their ideas by *duplicate* [duplicating] them. The winning APIs are then Microsoft’s."Jan 28 07:01
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Needed: actual graphic designer to do business card. I have no money, can barter my skills/soul.Jan 28 07:56
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Anyone using Wordpress Firewall? Looks potentially just the thing. (HT @webcowgirl)Jan 28 07:59
phIRCe-BNcTitle: WordPress Firewall Plugin » SEO Egghead .::. Size~: 32.25 KBJan 28 07:59
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[omar_s_hafez] RT @jwildeboer Is Apple losing its magic? The iPay is disappointing AFAICS. Not enough bling and woohoo.Jan 28 08:01
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Eruaran_Is BN down ? I can't load it in any browser...Jan 28 09:02
Diablo-D3quickly, someone feed roy viagraJan 28 09:05
Eruaran_Dare I ask ?Jan 28 09:06
Diablo-D3you said bn was downJan 28 09:06
Diablo-D3dohohohohohohohoJan 28 09:06
Eruaran_*groan*Jan 28 09:06
Eruaran_:pJan 28 09:06
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oiaohmAnyone else having trouble getting to boycottnovel ?Jan 28 10:01
MarcusKozenope, it's ok hereJan 28 10:01
oiaohmAll I am getting is a white page.Jan 28 10:02
MarcusKozedrop ie :))Jan 28 10:07
oiaohmRunning Linux by the way MarcusKozeJan 28 10:08
oiaohmNo ieJan 28 10:08
MarcusKozeyeah, was kidding there :)Jan 28 10:09
MarcusKozelinux on my end here too ;Jan 28 10:09
MarcusKoze;)Jan 28 10:09
MarcusKozedon';t know why but when i see a windos box i feel as it's from a prehystoric ancient world, long gone Jan 28 10:11
MarcusKozefor me at least :)Jan 28 10:11
oiaohmNetwork admin MarcusKozeJan 28 10:12
oiaohmSo work I have to use windowsJan 28 10:12
oiaohmKinda against my will.Jan 28 10:12
MarcusKozedoes one have anything to do on a win box other than clicking settings forms ?Jan 28 10:13
oiaohmConfiguration and maintaining windows 2003 and 2008 servers.Jan 28 10:13
oiaohmAnd adding checking on software deployments to windows clients.Jan 28 10:14
oiaohmThat is my complete list of things I do on windows.Jan 28 10:14
oiaohm 28 10:15
phIRCe-BNcTitle: GCC to support Google's Go - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 30.01 KBJan 28 10:15
oiaohmAnother language defualt.Jan 28 10:15
EruaranI haven't been able to get anything but a white page from BN for hoursJan 28 10:18
oiaohmI wonder if the site is thinking I am attacker since I am stuck on a max of 8 kb a secound connetion.Jan 28 10:18
oiaohmDue to being way over quotaJan 28 10:18
oiaohmIe about 3 times over.Jan 28 10:19
Eruaransame hereJan 28 10:19
EruaranSwitching to a new ISP I amJan 28 10:20
EruaranI always go over quota and Telstra charge too much for too littleJan 28 10:20
EruaranChurning to InternodeJan 28 10:20
oiaohmIt was a 15 Gb quota EruaranJan 28 10:21
EruaranMine was 12GbJan 28 10:21
oiaohmI just got a little busy downloading a few distributions to try and lost where the quota was.Jan 28 10:21
oiaohmDoes not take long in dvd images to screw things.Jan 28 10:21
MarcusKozewhat do you pay for net there ?Jan 28 10:22
oiaohmGot to about 40 gb before being slowed down.Jan 28 10:22
EruaranWith Internode I will be able to download distributions from Internode's servers and have it now affect my quotaJan 28 10:22
oiaohmInternode servers don't hold all distributions.Jan 28 10:22
Eruaran*and have it NOT affect my quotaJan 28 10:22
oiaohmI was trying some of the odd ball ones.Jan 28 10:22
Eruaransure, but some is better than noneJan 28 10:22
Eruaranthey have mirrors tooJan 28 10:23
oiaohmI have also beat the heck out my local filemirror that does not count to quota for about 25 gb as well.Jan 28 10:23
EruaranyesJan 28 10:23
oiaohmMe new harddrive tones on space.Jan 28 10:23
oiaohmWent a little nuts.Jan 28 10:23
Eruaran:)Jan 28 10:23
oiaohmI am only half way threw my month to the reset point.Jan 28 10:24
oiaohmYes I did a good job of busting quotaJan 28 10:24
oiaohmSince I don't normally bust quota my ISP even rung me worried that I might have had a secuirty breach.Jan 28 10:25
oiaohmNice ISP.Jan 28 10:25
oiaohmDepends where you are in australia MarcusKoze.  Under 45 AUD would be basically normal for my quota.Jan 28 10:27
MarcusKozein romania, i pay about $US12 for 10 Mbps, unlimited trafficJan 28 10:28
MarcusKozefrom UPCJan 28 10:29
MarcusKozegot this provider south there ?Jan 28 10:29
oiaohmNopJan 28 10:29
MarcusKozeph well Jan 28 10:30
oiaohmBiggest problem we have is most of our telephone exchanges are owned by one company.Jan 28 10:30
oiaohmSo putting hardware in there has to have there approval.Jan 28 10:30
MarcusKozeused to be the same hereJan 28 10:30
MarcusKozenow there's competition Jan 28 10:30
oiaohmThere is sort of competition here.Jan 28 10:30
oiaohmIf you are in a big city you have good competition.Jan 28 10:31
oiaohmI am not in a big city so it suxs.Jan 28 10:31
MarcusKozebut most people here have mobile phones and ditched the fix phones mostlyJan 28 10:31
oiaohmLot of people here still keep land lines.Jan 28 10:31
MarcusKozeso you from australia , hows life there ?Jan 28 10:31
oiaohmEven if they have mobiles.Jan 28 10:31
oiaohmMain reason land lines here stay up in power outages and other things.Jan 28 10:32
oiaohmWhere mobiles can kinda fail big time.Jan 28 10:32
MarcusKozemeh, they used to literally rob people on the bills Jan 28 10:32
MarcusKozeso people ditched them all Jan 28 10:32
oiaohmAlso land line is need for items like DSL.Jan 28 10:33
oiaohmIn my area you can not get a DSL line without a normal phone line.Jan 28 10:33
MarcusKozenow they give you land lines with thousands of minutes in talks or even free talks Jan 28 10:33
MarcusKoze:)Jan 28 10:33
oiaohmLot of our ISP's give voip services.Jan 28 10:33
oiaohmNormal at the insane rate of 10 cents per call for unlimited time anywhere in australia.Jan 28 10:34
MarcusKozelook, wanted to try to imigrate to australia for quite some while, can you tell me whether there would be spme special issues for getting there ?Jan 28 10:35
MarcusKozei'm sick of this never-endind winter hereJan 28 10:35
MarcusKozei'm feeling like im in suberia darn itJan 28 10:35
MarcusKozesiberia*Jan 28 10:35
MarcusKozefreezing here Jan 28 10:36
oiaohmReally depends where in Australia you end up.Jan 28 10:36
oiaohmJust say Linux crosses many temp ranges.Jan 28 10:36
oiaohmOpps.Jan 28 10:37
oiaohmAustralia crosses many temp ranges.Jan 28 10:37
MarcusKozei was thinking more into south-east Jan 28 10:39
MarcusKozenot sure why, but my guts say so :)Jan 28 10:39
oiaohmBasically you would not want to come to australia to go work on macquarie island because were you are now is mostly warm in compareJan 28 10:39
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Macquarie Island - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 70.97 KBJan 28 10:39
MarcusKozealmost feel an inner attraction for that placeJan 28 10:40
MarcusKozehehe Jan 28 10:40
oiaohmYep Macquarie island is the most south-east point of australian tertoriry..Jan 28 10:40
MarcusKozenope, i dream of a bungalow in a hot savana, having coffe in the morning, watching some dingo packs hunting roos ... ah.. whatta life ...Jan 28 10:41
oiaohmdingo packs are rare to see.Jan 28 10:41
MarcusKozehehe, at least having my coffee in a hot savana Jan 28 10:42
oiaohmRoos hunting them these days is a permit.Jan 28 10:42
MarcusKozei;m a wilderness guy, i'd feel better there than in the city :)Jan 28 10:42
oiaohmAnnoying quoted by number of bullets allowed.Jan 28 10:42
MarcusKozeno, not me hunting the roos, but the dingos hunting them Jan 28 10:42
MarcusKozei dont like huntingJan 28 10:43
MarcusKozebut fishing, oh yeah, thats for meJan 28 10:43
oiaohmOut in some areas it either hunt roos or cut of water supply.Jan 28 10:43
MarcusKozewhy ?Jan 28 10:43
oiaohmMan made water supply causing them to breed more than the land can support.Jan 28 10:43
MarcusKozeawJan 28 10:43
MarcusKozehaha Jan 28 10:43
MarcusKozegeezJan 28 10:43
MarcusKozewell then, some Carmaggetron needed then :)Jan 28 10:44
oiaohmAlready happens.Jan 28 10:44
oiaohmSeime trailers just hit them if they are on road.Jan 28 10:44
oiaohmBut does not kill them fast enough.Jan 28 10:44
oiaohmthen you have scary big wedgetails who are eating the dead roos using your car as updraft to take off.Jan 28 10:45
oiaohmOut back roads in Australia can be kinda scary with wild lifeJan 28 10:46
oiaohm 28 10:46
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Wedge-tailed Eagle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 63.64 KBJan 28 10:46
oiaohmAlso don't underestermate how hard a roo is MarcusKoze.   Lot of small/medium size cars hit a roo car is damaged past driveable.Jan 28 10:47
oiaohmYes it a little hard for some overseas people to get that you can be a envormentalist here and still hunt MarcusKozeJan 28 10:49
MarcusKozehehe :)Jan 28 11:00
MarcusKozenot a trouble for me , as long as their population is kept in reasonable numbersJan 28 11:00
oiaohmWater cutt off culling is far worse for them than bullets.Jan 28 11:01
oiaohmAnd the bullet limit system means only people who are good shots even attempt it.Jan 28 11:01
MarcusKozeyeah well ... Jan 28 11:05
MarcusKozehey, does Rex Hunt still do his shows there ?Jan 28 11:05
MarcusKozeused to watch that nutcase on discovery :)Jan 28 11:05
MarcusKozefishing and stuffJan 28 11:05
oiaohmHave not seen a Rex Hunt show in ages most likely still is.Jan 28 11:07
oiaohmI don't follow fishing.Jan 28 11:08
MarcusKozehow bad did this psychosis of a financial crisis hit australia ? Jan 28 11:09
oiaohmWhen you have 15 free to air tv channels to choose from its fairly simple to avoid seeing anything about fishing.Jan 28 11:09
MarcusKozehaha :)Jan 28 11:09
oiaohmFinancial criss did cause some problems.Jan 28 11:10
oiaohmIe people not spending.Jan 28 11:10
oiaohmIt still going on.Jan 28 11:10
oiaohmAlso credit is now a lot harder to get here.Jan 28 11:10
oiaohmNone of our banks were majorally effected.Jan 28 11:11
oiaohmLot of people ended up with the credit cards made no more after the financial crisis.Jan 28 11:12
*Diablo-D3 has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))Jan 28 11:12
oiaohmBasically anyone never paying the credit card off fully lost there card.Jan 28 11:12
schestowitzIs the site working OK now?Jan 28 11:15
schestowitzI don't know what happened earlier (was asleep)Jan 28 11:15
MarcusKozei'm in such a situation too Jan 28 11:19
MarcusKozehavent paid the monthly fee for my credit for about 3 monthsJan 28 11:19
MarcusKozeunemployedJan 28 11:19
MarcusKozedesperately seeking a job around, too bad it's winter Jan 28 11:19
MarcusKozenot so much hiringJan 28 11:19
MarcusKozei might just lose my friggin appartment ... Jan 28 11:20
*schestowitz watches (Cell Biology)Jan 28 11:24
oiaohmNop still white screening on me but it might be how short on quota I am schestowitzJan 28 11:24
oiaohmMarcusKoze: I was a full time network admin I am now only on call.Jan 28 11:25
oiaohmMarcusKoze: when something breaks.Jan 28 11:25
oiaohmThat is a one hell of a wage drop MarcusKozeJan 28 11:25
MarcusKozeshifty times ... Jan 28 11:25
MarcusKozei'd hate to go back to my parents :)Jan 28 11:26
oiaohmI am looking forward to Linux supporting ADS servers and the like.Jan 28 11:26
MarcusKozei mean Jan 28 11:26
oiaohmThat will create me more work.Jan 28 11:26
MarcusKozewell not hate to be with them, but me losing the apptJan 28 11:26
oiaohmFreedom yes I know what you mean MarcusKozeJan 28 11:27
MarcusKozehow's linux adoption there ?Jan 28 11:27
oiaohmSmall MarcusKozeJan 28 11:27
MarcusKozewell, at least there is some :)Jan 28 11:27
oiaohmSome businesses have Linux core servers.Jan 28 11:27
oiaohmMost have windows core servers.Jan 28 11:27
oiaohmClient side Linux is still rare.Jan 28 11:28
oiaohmnetbooks of course more often than not Linux just for performance reasons.Jan 28 11:28
MarcusKozei cant stop laughing when i hear those preconceptions about linux being so hard to use, console/terminal/text-interface only and so on Jan 28 11:28
oiaohmYep.Jan 28 11:28
oiaohmI love crashing the windows 7 network stack then saying to them Ok fix that without using command line.Jan 28 11:29
oiaohmOr bat files.Jan 28 11:29
MarcusKozeand ofcourse, the eternal "will my x,y,z games work on it ?"Jan 28 11:29
oiaohmLinux network stack don't go splat like the windows one.Jan 28 11:29
MarcusKoze:))Jan 28 11:29
MarcusKozeyeah, show them Jan 28 11:29
oiaohmLinux can be a ass to set up.Jan 28 11:30
oiaohmBut once it setup it stays working basically for ever.Jan 28 11:30
MarcusKozeknow what you meah Jan 28 11:30
MarcusKozemean Jan 28 11:30
oiaohmWindows or the other hand can be simple to get to look that it setup right.Jan 28 11:30
oiaohmYet is just waiting to bite you nuts off.Jan 28 11:30
oiaohmThe question is when.  And that is not with viruses and other pests.Jan 28 11:31
MarcusKozesince ubuntu 5.10 , i;ve only re-installed linux on the 8.04 edition, from scratch Jan 28 11:31
MarcusKozeworked just oki doki Jan 28 11:31
oiaohmI have been running debian on this system since 2000Jan 28 11:31
MarcusKozenormally just upgradingJan 28 11:31
oiaohmNo re-install yet.Jan 28 11:31
MarcusKoze:)Jan 28 11:31
oiaohmAnd I am not even nice about it.  I run custom kernels and all.Jan 28 11:32
MarcusKozeso yep ... proven sturdinessJan 28 11:32
MarcusKozeor what's the word for that Jan 28 11:32
schestowitzJan 28 11:32
schestowitz[11:24] <oiaohm> Nop still white screening on me but it might be how short on quota I am schestowitzJan 28 11:32
schestowitzoiaohm: still???Jan 28 11:32
oiaohmschestowitz: yep still konquerer and firefoxJan 28 11:33
oiaohmBut I would be under 1 kb per second connetion to site at moment schestowitzJan 28 11:33
oiaohmI am downloading other things as well.  I might be landing on the wrong side of the anti spammer filter schestowitzJan 28 11:34
schestowitzHmmmmm....... does this usually happen?Jan 28 11:34
schestowitzCan other load the site?Jan 28 11:34
schestowitzLet's wait for tessier to see what happened?Jan 28 11:35
schestowitzI got mail about itJan 28 11:36
oiaohmFirst time for me.   Eruaran who also is on limited speed reported the same thing.  And MarcusKoze reported site working.Jan 28 11:36
schestowitzWell, at least it means people notice when something goes wrongJan 28 11:36
oiaohmIe MarcusKoze is not speed limited schestowitzJan 28 11:36
schestowitzoiaohm: why would speed limit do this?Jan 28 11:36
schestowitzANd someone from the UK reported getting a blank pageJan 28 11:36
oiaohmTiming out schestowitzJan 28 11:36
schestowitzAt 10:40Jan 28 11:37
schestowitzAbout an hour agoJan 28 11:37
MarcusKozei'm not bandwidth limited actually Jan 28 11:37
schestowitzoiaohm: maybe the front page is too large?Jan 28 11:37
oiaohmThey did not tell you want speed there connection is schestowitzJan 28 11:37
MarcusKozespeed at about 10 mbps here from what my isp saisJan 28 11:37
schestowitzCan you load for example?Jan 28 11:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Why Ubuntu GNU/Linux Should Not Make Microsoft Even Stronger | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 123.63 KBJan 28 11:37
schestowitzI can't see anything wrong from my endJan 28 11:38
MarcusKozeschestowitz, couldn't you set the frontpage to just present some excerpt from the article under the title and link to the full one ?Jan 28 11:38
MarcusKozemight be handier for those with limited bandwidth / speedJan 28 11:38
schestowitzMarcusKoze: people seem to prefer it this wayJan 28 11:38
MarcusKozeawJan 28 11:38
MarcusKozeok :)Jan 28 11:38
oiaohmOk that link you gave me works even that front page still does not schestowitzJan 28 11:38
schestowitzWeirdJan 28 11:39
schestowitzHow might that be?Jan 28 11:39
schestowitzFront page works for meJan 28 11:39
schestowitzOh waitJan 28 11:39
schestowitzIt doesn'tJan 28 11:39
schestowitzI think I know what might happen hereJan 28 11:39
MarcusKozeyeh, again everything up and speedy here Jan 28 11:39
schestowitzIt's a wiki problemnJan 28 11:41
EruaranThe ubuntu-and-msft link worked for me but not the main pageJan 28 11:41
schestowitzHmmmmmmm... if the wiki doesn't load I think the only think I can try is load it from DB backup?Jan 28 11:41
schestowitzI don't know how to even diagnose the DBJan 28 11:42
schestowitzOhJan 28 11:42
schestowitzIt's just WIki front page, it seemsJan 28 11:42
schestowitz 28 11:42
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsoft - Legal - Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 22.91 KBJan 28 11:42
schestowitzWorks OKJan 28 11:42
oiaohmYep same here.  So it the front page gone nuts ?Jan 28 11:43
MarcusKozeaww !!!Jan 28 11:43
MarcusKozebig correction hereJan 28 11:43
MarcusKozethe front page indeed doesnt work Jan 28 11:43
MarcusKozei was thinking at the /?stories frontpageJan 28 11:44
MarcusKozebut indeed Jan 28 11:44
MarcusKozethe root domain doesnt load anything thereJan 28 11:44
MarcusKozesorry :)Jan 28 11:44
schestowitzoiaohm: wiki front pageJan 28 11:44
MarcusKozechecked the source of the page, nothing served thereJan 28 11:44
oiaohm is still giving me nothing.Jan 28 11:45
MarcusKozehere neitherJan 28 11:46
oiaohmYep truly nothings.Jan 28 11:46
oiaohmthe source of the page is nothing in browser.Jan 28 11:46
MarcusKozesame here Jan 28 11:46
oiaohmOk so its not speed Jan 28 11:46
MarcusKozeyeah :)Jan 28 11:46
MarcusKozeall this time i was reloading the /?stories pageJan 28 11:47
MarcusKozethat's working oki doki Jan 28 11:47
schestowitzOK, try notJan 28 11:48
schestowitzI stripped it down just so that it loadsJan 28 11:48
MarcusKozeyup Jan 28 11:48
MarcusKozeloads now Jan 28 11:49
schestowitzThis seems to have gone on for several hours, I don't know what's causing it yetJan 28 11:49
MarcusKozealthough no articles / content Jan 28 11:49
MarcusKozewhat did you strip from it , the "article" variable / function / whatever renders the content ther e?Jan 28 11:50
Eruaranmain page is workingJan 28 11:50
schestowitznot the right content thoughJan 28 11:56
schestowitzI think magpie rss might be the causeJan 28 11:58
schestowitzIt's my mediawiki plugins messing aboutJan 28 12:03
schestowitzI still can't quite get it right......Jan 28 12:03
MarcusKozethat;s why i prefer my own cms :) for whateverJan 28 12:07
schestowitzSOmtimes.... yeah.Jan 28 12:08
oiaohm  Nice posterJan 28 12:19
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Protestors: iPad is nothing more than a golden calf of DRM .::. Size~: 28.67 KBJan 28 12:19
*oiaohm has quit (Remote closed the connection)Jan 28 12:22
MinceRhere's another term for the iGrenade: iEDJan 28 13:00
*amarsh04 has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Jan 28 13:04
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Apple Sent #iPad to ‘Important’ Writers Weeks Before Launch 28 13:07
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Apple Sent iPads to Important Writers Weeks Before Launch | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 103.95 KBJan 28 13:07
MinceRwho beside cringely said he got one or is otherwise known to have got one?Jan 28 13:14
*amarsh04 ( has joined #boycottnovellJan 28 13:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] Hopefully words of GNOME: 28 13:29
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Checking in on the GNOME Foundation «  The .::. Size~: 34.34 KBJan 28 13:29
*dyfet ( has left #boycottnovell ("Ex-Chat")Jan 28 13:47
schestowitz[13:14] <MinceR> who beside cringely said he got one or is otherwise known to have got one?Jan 28 13:48
schestowitzFind out...Jan 28 13:48
MinceR 28 13:49
phIRCe-BNcTitle:   Name Fail, Photoshop Win - FAIL Blog: Epic Fail Pictures and Videos of Owned, Pwnd and Fail Moments .::. Size~: 395.82 KBJan 28 13:49
*kecskebak ( has joined #boycottnovellJan 28 13:52
*kecskebak spend the morning installing ArchLinuxJan 28 13:53
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] What the #Yahoo Deal Means for #Ubuntu #GNU #Linux (and #Mono ) 28 13:58
phIRCe-BNcTitle: What the Yahoo! Deal Means for Ubuntu GNU/Linux (and Mono) | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 110.31 KBJan 28 13:58
schestowitzI can't figure out a workaround for the wiki....Jan 28 14:05
*kecskebak has quit ("Leaving")Jan 28 14:08
MarcusKozehave you tried to wipe out the app files and redeply on the existing database ?Jan 28 14:13
MarcusKozeassuming the problem is not from the databaseJan 28 14:14
schestowitzNo, it's a long-standing issueJan 28 14:17
schestowitzI usually had a workaroundJan 28 14:17
schestowitzI have temporary solutionJan 28 14:17
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft Makes Questionable Deals in #Kuwait , #Malta , and #Ireland 28 15:01
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsoft Makes Questionable Deals in Kuwait, Malta, and Ireland | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 108.25 KBJan 28 15:01
Omar87Greetings all.Jan 28 15:04
schestowitzHeyJan 28 15:22
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] "Free as in Free beer" it comes spontaneously from my mouth; i can't stop it;makes others(who don know abt free s/w) think i am a drunkardJan 28 15:42
*gargoyle-grin (n=randerso@gentoo/contributor/gargoyle-grin) has joined #boycottnovellJan 28 15:53
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] Posters on ipad #DRM #FSF #defectivebydesign.orgJan 28 16:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBJan 28 16:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBJan 28 16:17
MinceR171748 < hawk> &  for more ipad funJan 28 16:21
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBJan 28 16:21
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBJan 28 16:21
schestowitzMinceR: :-)Jan 28 17:02
schestowitzLet's just ignore the thing...Jan 28 17:02
schestowitzIt will fail in the market without interventionJan 28 17:03
MinceRi'll continue making and receiving jokes at their expense :>Jan 28 17:05
schestowitzOKJan 28 17:07
schestowitzSome people linked to the item on APple sending freebie stones.... errr. I mean padsJan 28 17:07
MarcusKoze:))Jan 28 17:08
MinceRstones are too useful to be a crApple productJan 28 17:08
schestowitzThey are also scarceJan 28 17:08
*kecskebak ( has joined #boycottnovellJan 28 17:15
*kecskebak has finally finished installing ArchLinux with nouveau drivers and GnashJan 28 17:15
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MarcusKozekecskebak, how's Gnash behaving ?Jan 28 17:21
MarcusKozehas it widened it's flash components support there ?Jan 28 17:21
schestowitzI think YouTube is the only need for Flash (and other sites that contain video files in blob enclosures)Jan 28 17:23
kecskebakI sometimes I can't play YouTube videos unless I look at them in a separate windowJan 28 17:23
kecskebakArchlinux is being a bit funny about mpeg audio in Flash - it worked fine with UbuntuJan 28 17:24
MinceRthere's also viddler, if you read icanhascheezburgerJan 28 17:24
kecskebakBut for most things Gnash is fineJan 28 17:24
MinceRand/or failblogJan 28 17:24
MinceRfor youtube, there's cliveJan 28 17:24
kecskebakIt stops at version 8, has some support for 9 and 10Jan 28 17:24
kecskebakI'm amazed at how fast my Archlinux desktop isJan 28 17:25
kecskebakI've always wanted a rolling distro with GNOME, and now I've got oneJan 28 17:25
kecskebakI could hardly stay with Ubuntu ;)Jan 28 17:25
MinceRi don't like rolling distros because there's always the risk of not being able to upgrade after not upgrading for a long timeJan 28 17:26
kecskebakWell, I've got a few live CDs in the drawer, and my home folder is on a separate partition if the worst comes to the worstJan 28 17:26
MinceRalso, the lesser risk of getting backwards-incompatible changes with any upgradeJan 28 17:27
kecskebakpacman keeps a cache, so you can roll backJan 28 17:28
MinceRi couldn't roll archlinux back when it broke, iircJan 28 17:28
kecskebakyou can also exclude whichever packages you like from being rollingJan 28 17:28
kecskebakBut I'm sure I'll soon find out from bitter experience if it works or notJan 28 17:29
MinceR:>Jan 28 17:29
kecskebakAnyway, I learnt more about GNU/Linux today than I have in monthsJan 28 17:29
kecskebakYou certainly get a good explanation of how it all fits together when you install itJan 28 17:29
kecskebakSo even if I have to bin it it's been very educationalJan 28 17:30
MinceRi got that with gentoo :>Jan 28 17:31
kecskebakIt also appreciates the Ubuntus and Fedoras of this world a lot moreJan 28 17:31
kecskebakIt also makes you appreciate I should have saidJan 28 17:31
kecskebakWhen you see all the work the installers have to do, and how easily it can all fall in a heapJan 28 17:32
kecskebakOne thing I did like was being able to choose which bits of Gnome I wanted to install one by oneJan 28 17:32
*kecskebak has quit (Remote closed the connection)Jan 28 17:35
schestowitzg2gJan 28 17:35
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Novell Gets More Software Patents, #Patent Watchtroll Gene Quinn is Sued 28 17:35
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Patents Roundup: Novell Gets More Software Patents, Patent Watchtroll Gene Quinn is Sued, Microsoft Writer Slams Firefox for Protesting Against Patents | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 112.34 KBJan 28 17:35
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MarcusKozehaha loads like a stubborn mule ... gues that freak ipad thing really made some craziness around the globe eh ?Jan 28 17:45
*MinceR sees no reason to load apple.comJan 28 17:46
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] sudo poweroffJan 28 17:47
MarcusKozeme neither really but i've just watched some news here talkinmg about jobs presenting it so i didnt know they've launched itJan 28 17:48
MarcusKozeso just checkingJan 28 17:48
MarcusKozei can;t believe how much people talked about this thing... wonder ... can it do magic or smth ?Jan 28 17:48
MarcusKoze:)Jan 28 17:48
*ThistleWeb has quit ("Lost terminal")Jan 28 18:19
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DaemonFCso my insurance company has been gouging me for a couple of years now, and the month I leave, they send me an offer for a "reduced rate" if I come back (which still isn't matching what I pay now)Jan 28 18:33
DaemonFCI repeat my question out loud "Why do big companies try to make it all better after you're fed up and want to leave?"Jan 28 18:33
DaemonFC"customer retention" says you have to threaten to cancel before you get the deal for what you should be paying regularlyJan 28 18:34
DaemonFCI kind of take it to say "We could have knocked your 6 month premiums down $50 an still made a killing, haha, here's a kick in the balls on your way out!"Jan 28 18:35
MinceRthey're greedy and they think their customers are stupidJan 28 18:36
MinceRand often there's no better or significantly better choiceJan 28 18:36
DaemonFCMinceR: Like Comcast or AT&TJan 28 18:37
MinceRindeedJan 28 18:37
cubezzzthe best ISP: freenetsJan 28 18:37
MinceRlike ISPs and telcos in generalJan 28 18:37
cubezzzbut we've been through this beforeJan 28 18:37
DaemonFCpeople have to pay $50 or more a month on broadband and they wonder why customers think they should bittorrent movies and music Jan 28 18:37
cubezzzI'm paying just under $40 CANJan 28 18:38
cubezzzplus I can run my host on it :)Jan 28 18:38
DaemonFCendless channels of propaganda and two star movies from the 1980s is what you get on Comcast unless you want to start using Pay Per View and getting the $20 "movie channels" which have the same two star 1980s movies with no commercialsJan 28 18:39
MinceRi pay approximately $18/month for broadbandJan 28 18:39
MinceRplus telephone, plus tvJan 28 18:39
cubezzzhrmmmJan 28 18:39
DaemonFCwith the plus being that HBO occasionally hosts racist far left comedians that aren't funnyJan 28 18:39
MinceRi mean that only covers the internet partJan 28 18:39
DaemonFC:DJan 28 18:39
cubezzzoh :)Jan 28 18:39
cubezzzI was wondering :)Jan 28 18:39
MinceRbut i'm probably required to have a tv and phone subscription beside itJan 28 18:39
cubezzzyeah get tv free thoughJan 28 18:40
MinceRbut someone else pays for those :>Jan 28 18:40
cubezzztv = antennaJan 28 18:40
cubezzzwhat speed MinceR?Jan 28 18:40
DaemonFCMinceR: Here's how they do it, you *can* get just TV or just internet, but your price for any package alone goes up $15 or soJan 28 18:40
DaemonFCthusly, it is only like $10 a month more to have cable TV than not to have itJan 28 18:40
MinceR30/20 Mbit/s (down/up)Jan 28 18:40
DaemonFCgeezJan 28 18:40
DaemonFCI think I get 12 down and 2 upJan 28 18:41
MinceRi got lucky though, this is one of the few places where they offer LAN-based serviceJan 28 18:41
DaemonFCthey have a plan for 50 down and 20 up, but that's like, over $100 a monthJan 28 18:41
DaemonFCthe cheapest you can do is 1 down and 256k up for $30Jan 28 18:42
DaemonFCit's not worth it obviouslyJan 28 18:42
DaemonFCAT&T has the same deal for $20 if you want something that slowJan 28 18:42
cubezzzMinceR, can you run a server on it?Jan 28 18:43
MinceRi can and doJan 28 18:43
cubezzzwell, that sounds pretty good actuallyJan 28 18:43
DaemonFCcubezzz: You can on Comcast if it's a "business" planJan 28 18:43
MinceRit has a dynamic IP address thoughJan 28 18:43
DaemonFCwhich the 50 down 20 up is where that startsJan 28 18:43
MinceRand getting a fixed address would cost almost once again that much as the monthly price i'm paying alreadyJan 28 18:43
DaemonFCthey're also nice enough to unblock port 25 for youJan 28 18:43
DaemonFCB-)Jan 28 18:43
cubezzzah, well I have fixed ip, but my speed is slowerJan 28 18:44
MinceRi suspect they wouldn't allow me to run public services thoughJan 28 18:44
DaemonFCthey say they block port 25 due to all the Windows zombie spam relays out thereJan 28 18:44
DaemonFClike night of the living deadJan 28 18:44
DaemonFCB-)Jan 28 18:44
MinceRbut if i wanted to do that, i'd prefer to have a server or VPS hosted at a data centerJan 28 18:44
MinceRas this isn't really reliableJan 28 18:44
cubezzzI'm running ftp, web server, mail serverJan 28 18:44
DaemonFCcubezzz: One Comcast commercial was bragging about all the Microsoft "services" you get with their Business plansJan 28 18:45
DaemonFCit was a hootJan 28 18:45
DaemonFC"I get MICROSOFT email!!!!" *grin*Jan 28 18:45
DaemonFCit's doubleplusgoodJan 28 18:45
MinceRlolJan 28 18:45
cubezzzhow much for this amazing plan?Jan 28 18:46
DaemonFCoh, only like $130 a month to start outJan 28 18:46
cubezzzblah Jan 28 18:46
DaemonFCthey have them going to 150 down for like $200 a monthJan 28 18:46
cubezzzwell if you can make money it's worth it I guessJan 28 18:46
DaemonFCprobably not a huge expense for small businesses that just want to use a router and connect a lot of terminals in the officeJan 28 18:47
DaemonFCmaybe run a small web serverJan 28 18:47
DaemonFCthey don't "support" Linux, but they don't do anything to stop you from using itJan 28 18:48
DaemonFCthey try to tell you that a negative side effect of Linux is their McAfee antivirus won't runJan 28 18:48
MinceRlolJan 28 18:48
MinceRi consider that a positive side effectJan 28 18:48
DaemonFCindeedJan 28 18:48
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DaemonFCI want to see those people at Free Software Magazine do a piece on how badly most antivirus software cripples WindowsJan 28 18:50
DaemonFCthey want to talk about a 1% slowdown in LinuxJan 28 18:50
DaemonFCtell me that's not funded from the outsideJan 28 18:50
DaemonFCMicrosoft has Forefront which is their server antivirus (licensed separately of course)Jan 28 18:52
DaemonFCI played around with that somewhatJan 28 18:52
DaemonFCbut it costs thousands of dollars to license, so now Microsoft is obviously making huge profit off of the malware problems on their own OSJan 28 18:53
DaemonFCwhy would they ever want to fix it?Jan 28 18:53
MinceRand it probably only goes after viruses m$ feels like going afterJan 28 18:54
MinceRso obviously it does nothing against claria malwareJan 28 18:54
*Chips_B_Malroy (i=4731c09d@gateway/web/freenode/x-ufdcjppfsfcydxxp) has joined #boycottnovellJan 28 18:54
MinceRtrusting m$ to produce anti-malware software is futileJan 28 18:54
DaemonFCMinceR: I highly suspect that Microsoft Security Essentials is just a front for a data mining operationJan 28 18:55
tessierSome problem with the site?Jan 28 18:55
DaemonFCit keeps asking you to send Microsoft files from your PC for "analysis"Jan 28 18:55
MinceRor just a PR attemptJan 28 18:55
tessierI haven't noticed anything.Jan 28 18:55
MinceR"see, we're dedicated to making your machine secure! really!"Jan 28 18:55
Chips_B_MalroyM$ only does just barely enough, if that, incrementally, as far as security and malware, to escape government oversite.Jan 28 18:56
DaemonFCMinceR: I'm using Avast! myself, I don't really need something else from Microsoft with another 1,000 page EULA asking to ssend files from my PC whenever it wants, whatever it wants, to MicrosoftJan 28 18:56
DaemonFCfor "threat analysis"Jan 28 18:56
MinceRi very rarely use antivirus at allJan 28 18:57
MinceRwhen i do, i use ClamAVJan 28 18:57
Chips_B_MalroyNot needed so far on Linux, antivirus, IMOJan 28 18:57
DaemonFCClamAV has a really lousy detection rateJan 28 18:57
MinceRonly if you want to run winblows software via wineJan 28 18:57
DaemonFCChips_B_Malroy: It is if you run a file or mail serverJan 28 18:57
MinceRDaemonFC: even then only if your clients are running winblowsJan 28 18:58
MinceRwhich they shouldn'tJan 28 18:58
Chips_B_Malroysure, but the mail server antivirus is to scan for windows malware so you don't pass them on to windows computersJan 28 18:58
DaemonFCClamAV and ClamWin will get better when they have heuristics and real times scanning, which they've been saying will happen for at least 6 years nowJan 28 18:58
DaemonFCit's almost comical that they still say "when we implement that"Jan 28 18:59
DaemonFClike it's going to happen next monthJan 28 18:59
Chips_B_MalroyActually the detection rate for ClamAV was very hight Daemon.  Is what I noticed, at least the Windows version.Jan 28 18:59
DaemonFC54%Jan 28 18:59
Chips_B_MalroyThe cleanup rate, not so goodJan 28 18:59
DaemonFCI've never seen it do better than 57%Jan 28 18:59
Chips_B_Malroyand, it was the slowest of allJan 28 19:00
Chips_B_Malroyhad no guard eitherJan 28 19:00
Chips_B_Malroybut maybe it does now, I have not used it in awhileJan 28 19:00
Chips_B_Malroymy trick with antivirusJan 28 19:00
DaemonFCnopeJan 28 19:00
Chips_B_Malroywas to use about 4 or 5 antivirus free programs, and to have only one in resident memoryJan 28 19:01
Chips_B_Malroybut all updated and ready to scanJan 28 19:01
DaemonFCMicrosoft OneCare was doing horribly bad, even worse than NortonJan 28 19:01
Chips_B_Malroyit was one of the ways to clean infected machinesJan 28 19:01
MinceRi'm unwilling to have any residentJan 28 19:01
DaemonFCso they finally aborted it and made it freewareJan 28 19:01
Chips_B_MalroyMinceR that was xp machines I was referring to, the ones I used to cleanJan 28 19:02
MinceRand ClamAV has some great advantages on most others: it's free, gratis and runs on GNU/Linux (without jumping through stupid loops)Jan 28 19:02
Chips_B_Malroyagain, I found ClamAV to find a lot of virusesJan 28 19:03
Chips_B_MalroywormsJan 28 19:03
Chips_B_MalroyetcJan 28 19:03
Chips_B_Malroybut malware, like trojans, you needed stuff like Spybot, Lavasoft, A2SquiredJan 28 19:03
Chips_B_Malroy*SuaredJan 28 19:04
Chips_B_Malroystill could not spell itJan 28 19:04
DaemonFCand a lot of antivirus software is now detecting things that are not virusesJan 28 19:04
DaemonFCjust that companies don't want you to have themJan 28 19:05
DaemonFClike cracks, keygens, no-DVD exes for gamesJan 28 19:05
Chips_B_MalroyThere is a cd out I once seen someone have, not sure on its legallityJan 28 19:05
Chips_B_MalroyHiren'sJan 28 19:05
Chips_B_Malroyits very goodJan 28 19:05
DaemonFCNOD32 is the worst of them about thatJan 28 19:05
Omar87Hi all.Jan 28 19:05
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[omar_s_hafez] RT @ahmedmaher_twitعندما تظن أن كل شيء حولك يعاندك ويقاومك ، تذكر أنك لن تستطيع أن ترتفع إلا إذا سرت ضد الجاذبية الأرضيةJan 28 19:05
MinceRnod32 is horribleJan 28 19:06
MinceRhay Omar87 Jan 28 19:06
Chips_B_MalroyNot to change the subject, butJan 28 19:06
Chips_B_MalroyM$ and SilverlightJan 28 19:06
Chips_B_Malroyas it relates to M$ attempt, which is now Jan 28 19:07
Chips_B_MalroyachievedJan 28 19:07
Chips_B_Malroywith Blockbuster using MS DRM (most likely Silverlight)Jan 28 19:07
Chips_B_Malroyon their instant view as well as NetflixJan 28 19:07
Chips_B_MalroyM$ basically paid them both, I believeJan 28 19:08
Chips_B_Malroyto get this monopolyJan 28 19:08
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Chips_B_Malroy 28 19:08
phIRCe-BNcTitle:  BLOCKBUSTER On Demand for PC FAQ - Forums .::. Size~: 39.83 KBJan 28 19:08
Chips_B_Malroyrequirements, NET 3.51   IE  WMP 10 Jan 28 19:08
Chips_B_Malroydoesn't say Silverlight, but somehow I think it probably requires it?Jan 28 19:09
Chips_B_MalroyQuote from the link:  "6. Why doesn't BLOCKBUSTER support Apple, iPhone or iPod?  As is the case with all legal providers of downloaded movies, BLOCKBUSTER is required by the content owners to protect the movies from piracy. To satisfy those requirements, BLOCKBUSTER uses Microsoft's Windows Media Digital Rights Management which operates on Microsoft PCs and other devices which embed Microsoft's technology, and is Jan 28 19:10
Chips_B_MalroyHere is M$ once again using its monopoly leverage to exclude other systemsJan 28 19:12
Chips_B_Malroyand to limit what rights users haveJan 28 19:12
DaemonFCMinceR: It's just so obvious that the BSA is paying off antivirus makers to detect cracks for their products as virusesJan 28 19:12
DaemonFCthese signatures get slipped in with the usual pattern file updatesJan 28 19:13
Chips_B_MalroyThe fact that they have both Netflix and Blockbuster, the really only two games in town here (USA), or major playersJan 28 19:13
MinceRDaemonFC: they don't succeed with ClamAV though, do they? :>Jan 28 19:13
Chips_B_Malroyis monopoly all over againJan 28 19:13
DaemonFCwhen you can a crack with virus total or something and is uses 44 up to date scanners and onyl 4-5 of the big corporate ones detect the file as a virusJan 28 19:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NewsTechnica: Scotland to make cigarettes way cooler and sexier 28 19:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Scotland to make cigarettes way cooler and sexier | NewsTechnica .::. Size~: 38.4 KBJan 28 19:14
DaemonFC"Win32/Patcher" or "Win32/Banker" or whateverJan 28 19:14
DaemonFC*scan a crackJan 28 19:14
Chips_B_Malroyeach antivirus seems to detect some that others do not.  And many detect false postiives and remove them...Some even remove system files.Jan 28 19:14
DaemonFCit's usually Norton, McAfee, and ESET NOD32 on the list, and maybe a couple othersJan 28 19:14
DaemonFCNorton has removed system files before and left Windows unable to boot!Jan 28 19:15
DaemonFCWhy in the HELL are people paying them?Jan 28 19:15
Chips_B_MalroyEven AVG is better than Norton, McAfee, and OnecareJan 28 19:15
DaemonFCthey are slow, they have the worst detection for the price rangeJan 28 19:15
DaemonFCand they fuck up and destroy Windows themselves sometimesJan 28 19:15
DaemonFC:DJan 28 19:15
Chips_B_MalroyyesJan 28 19:15
DaemonFCthere's lots of freebies that not only scan faster and take up less resources, but hardly ever get a false positiveJan 28 19:16
DaemonFCso why do people pay Norton is the $100,000 questionJan 28 19:16
DaemonFCAvast is always in the 98-99% detection range in their freewareJan 28 19:17
DaemonFCI've never seen Norton do thatJan 28 19:17
DaemonFCMicrosoft is usually in the high 80'sJan 28 19:17
Chips_B_MalroyI used a program in Windows called Startup Control Panel, it was basically a freeware program that was a nice shell for msconfJan 28 19:18
DaemonFCthere's a lot of payware that gets worse than that, Sunbelt, Sophos, etc.Jan 28 19:18
Chips_B_Malroy 28 19:18
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Mike Lin's Home Page .::. Size~: 4.4 KBJan 28 19:18
DaemonFCsome payware does as poorly at 60-70% detectionJan 28 19:18
DaemonFCat that point, you'd be better off using ClamWinJan 28 19:18
DaemonFCbad detection, but it is freeJan 28 19:18
Chips_B_Malroyby using that program it was easy to install many antivirus programs in windows, and only have one memory resident (shield)Jan 28 19:19
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DaemonFCyou know, if Microsoft gets 90% detection, that might sound goodJan 28 19:19
sebsebseb Jan 28 19:19
DaemonFCbut 10% of millions of pieces of malware is still a LOT of malwareJan 28 19:19
sebsebsebhiJan 28 19:20
sebsebsebhiJan 28 19:20
sebsebsebHelloJan 28 19:20
sebsebsebHelloJan 28 19:20
DaemonFChell, even 1-2% is an uncomfortably large amount, but Microsoft Security Essentials is leaving this huge gaping holeJan 28 19:20
sebsebseb Jan 28 19:20
Chips_B_MalroyAlso, Mike Lin's "Startup Monitor" program did a lot of what UAC program (Vista) did in XP, but better and freeJan 28 19:20
sebsebsebsomething about malware hrm just joined, well  no virus scanner or anti spyware or whatever, will pick up on it allJan 28 19:21
stavrosLinuxDaemonFC so you say linux is the way to go :)Jan 28 19:21
DaemonFCstavrosLinux: Whenever possible or pragmaticJan 28 19:21
stavrosLinuxagreedJan 28 19:21
sebsebsebplus once infected by malware only true way to be 100% sure it's gone, would be to clean install the OS,  or put on another OS if were running Windows,  put a Linux distro on instead for example :DJan 28 19:22
Chips_B_Malroyantivirus and antimalware only reacts to know threats, it does not usually protect windows users running as admin from completely new forms of malwareJan 28 19:22
DaemonFCstavrosLinux: I'd say the next best thing is that if you must use Windows, limit the amount of payware/proprietary software you depend onJan 28 19:22
Chips_B_Malroyand run as a normal userJan 28 19:22
DaemonFCthere's a ton of FOSS and freeware on Windows evenJan 28 19:22
Chips_B_Malroyremove IE WMP Outlook and MessingerJan 28 19:22
DaemonFCChips_B_Malroy: Yes, and turn off all the spyware you canJan 28 19:23
DaemonFClike the Customer Experience Improvement ProgramJan 28 19:23
Chips_B_Malroyyes, in servicesJan 28 19:23
DaemonFCError ReportingJan 28 19:23
DaemonFCetcJan 28 19:23
sebsebsebsome malware can infect the BIOS for example, but that's pretty rareJan 28 19:23
Chips_B_Malroywindose update, and BITSJan 28 19:23
DaemonFCI leave Windows Updte on Notify but don't download or installJan 28 19:23
DaemonFCthat way I can refuse updates I don't agree withJan 28 19:23
DaemonFClike "this update patches the DRM in Windows Media Player"Jan 28 19:24
DaemonFC"Hide This Update"Jan 28 19:24
DaemonFC:)Jan 28 19:24
sebsebsebas for people who run Windows or  Mac OS X  by choice, without a proper reason :(    freesoftware/opensource OS's :)Jan 28 19:24
Chips_B_MalroyHave had so many windows users bring me their failing hard drives.  Now some are bad, but most have windows sleath viruses on them and can only be cleaned with programs like DBANJan 28 19:24
DaemonFCboot sector virusJan 28 19:25
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: sleath  viruses what does that mean?Jan 28 19:25
DaemonFCthe great great grandfather of malwareJan 28 19:25
Chips_B_Malroymostly yes, or worse sleath which is a boot sector usuallyJan 28 19:25
DaemonFCChips_B_Malroy: I have DEP and ASLR set to mandatoryJan 28 19:25
DaemonFCprograms don't get to opt outJan 28 19:25
Chips_B_MalroyDBAN is a linux boot cd or floppy which writes zero's to everywhere on a hard drive that can be written , several timesJan 28 19:26
DaemonFCand I have my account set up to be a normal user with UAC prompting for the administrator's passwordJan 28 19:26
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: sounds like something the family compurter might have got infected by not that long ago.   Since the Windows CD would blue screen for example, and WIndows woudn't boot up since an error message. Ubuntu on that same computer no problem.  Then I properly cleaned the hard disk out, and yep XP would install again.Jan 28 19:26
Chips_B_Malroyits purpose is for DOF cleaningJan 28 19:27
DaemonFCChips_B_Malroy: The idea is that I want as many roadblocks set up as possibleJan 28 19:27
MinceRthe winxp installer likes to BSoD-reboot if it sees a partition table it doesn't likeJan 28 19:27
MinceRbecause the idiots at m$ can't codeJan 28 19:27
DaemonFCa lot of Windows users just keep the default settings and don't even use antivirusJan 28 19:27
sebsebsebDOF cleaning you mean one of the security levels, and I know about Dban, and there are other programs as well that  do the same stuff.Jan 28 19:27
DaemonFCMinceR: A lot of the cracks for Windows use GRUBJan 28 19:28
DaemonFCI found that to be funny as all hellJan 28 19:28
MinceRhow do they use it? i've never come across suchJan 28 19:28
sebsebsebDaemonFC: a lot of  Windows users, don't really care about the security  of their computer, they just want it to work.Jan 28 19:29
Chips_B_MalroyDaemon, yes but, end the end, you figure out, no matter how good you are with windows, its never really secure compared to Linux.  Its also never really stable, and never as easy to backup from one computer to another, unless you use a VDIJan 28 19:29
DaemonFCMinceR: They use a modified GRUB to load a SLP key into the BIOS image in RAMJan 28 19:29
MinceRicJan 28 19:29
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: VDI?Jan 28 19:29
DaemonFCthat way, OEM serials and licensing certs can be installedJan 28 19:29
DaemonFCand Windows will accept themJan 28 19:29
MinceRisn't it a lot easier to just steal an "enterprise" image? :>Jan 28 19:29
DaemonFCMinceR: NoJan 28 19:29
DaemonFCyou can also modify your BIOSJan 28 19:29
Chips_B_Malroysebsebseb>  vdi is virtualboxJan 28 19:30
sebsebseball this malware for Windows,  I guess since their is money to be made, and also since a lot of the malware writers don't like WindowsJan 28 19:30
DaemonFCthe only difference between a Vista SLP authorization and a Windows 7 one is changing the BIOS SLP version reportedJan 28 19:30
MinceRat least i think i remember seeing winblows images that only needed a serial key and didn't do activation at allJan 28 19:30
DaemonFCfrom 2.0 to 2.1Jan 28 19:30
DaemonFCother than that, they are identicalJan 28 19:30
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: well yeah virtual machines,  just copy them a clean install. or whatever you want to doJan 28 19:30
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: esailly copy one for backupJan 28 19:30
DaemonFCand 2.1 will activate Vista tooJan 28 19:30
sebsebseball these computer problems, not just security,  thanks to Microsoft (sarcasm yes)Jan 28 19:31
DaemonFCSLIC 1.1 was XPJan 28 19:31
DaemonFCbut nobody bothered to activate XP that way because it's dangerous to modify the BIOS and there's easier ways to crack XPJan 28 19:31
sebsebsebMicrosoft stop computing from becoming much better, well a lot of aspects of it.Jan 28 19:31
Chips_B_Malroysebsebseb>  virtualbox vdi are the ultimate windows backup that Gates hates.  Its for people that have to run some program or game in dose.Jan 28 19:31
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: yes I know about virtual machinesJan 28 19:32
sebsebseband like VirtualboxJan 28 19:32
Chips_B_MalroyVirtualbox saves you the 3 day windows install with all the extra programs and antimalware to updateJan 28 19:32
DaemonFCMinceR: Basically, SLIC is an attack on individuals installing unlicensed Windows, it's very very very easy for a small systems builder to make one BIOS flash that works and thousands of systems to apply it toJan 28 19:32
DaemonFC:)Jan 28 19:32
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: it does not take 3 days to install and set up Windows, well not for most users anywayJan 28 19:32
MinceRDaemonFC: SLIC?Jan 28 19:33
DaemonFCyeahJan 28 19:33
MinceRstill, it's probably cleaner and easier to crack the code that checks all that crapJan 28 19:33
*sebsebseb wanted to work in IT, but then reolized how he would have to work loads with WindowsJan 28 19:33
DaemonFCMinceR: You could just deactivate or patch the Windows code that checks the licensing statusJan 28 19:34
MinceRi've worked in 2 jobs so far in IT and i didn't have to work much with winblowsJan 28 19:34
DaemonFCWindows Update can trojan something in that breaks that thoughJan 28 19:34
MinceRstill, it was too muchJan 28 19:34
DaemonFCWindows has no way of detecting or shutting down the BIOS modificationJan 28 19:34
sebsebsebMinceR: well depends on the job etc, but  I don't know enough to get a proper Linux job  at the moment,  and there aren't really any proper Linux courses around hereJan 28 19:35
sebsebsebso yep WindowsJan 28 19:35
DaemonFCso you can use the softmod, but then you shouldn't use updates or service packs after thatJan 28 19:35
MinceRDaemonFC: icJan 28 19:35
MinceRwell, winblows update made me disable it the last time anywayJan 28 19:35
Chips_B_Malroysebsebseb> 3 days for some people, if they had a lot of stuff installed, all their passwords etcJan 28 19:36
MinceRby popping up like an attention whore every 5 minutes while i was trying to run a full-screen appJan 28 19:36
DaemonFCMinceR: Early Vista cracks were based on everything from stopping the grace period timer to installing system files from the Vista Release Candidate that wouldaccept the RC serialsJan 28 19:36
MinceRand there was no other way to keep it from doing thatJan 28 19:36
sebsebsebComputing is great, with the correct software.  No not you Microsoft in the 90's you were ok, to about 2001, but not anymore.Jan 28 19:36
cubezzzlet's be clearJan 28 19:37
DaemonFCMinceR: Basically, the key to a successful crack is to make certain that Microsoft would inadvertently deactivate and shut down millions of legitimate copies at the same time it went after the exploitJan 28 19:37
cubezzzmicrosoft was _never_ very goodJan 28 19:37
DaemonFCthe BIOS mod is the only way that can happenJan 28 19:37
sebsebsebcubezzz: exactly, which is why I don't want to work with themJan 28 19:38
DaemonFCMicrosoft could shut down every HP machine, but yeah...Jan 28 19:38
DaemonFCor every Dell out there, but yeah.....Jan 28 19:38
MinceRif only they did soJan 28 19:38
Chips_B_MalroyWell, I basically came here to talk about Blockbuster, and the monopoly that MS is creating here, by using both Netflix and BlockbusterJan 28 19:38
MinceRdelicious backlash :>Jan 28 19:38
cubezzzwe should have all switched to unix systems in the late 80'sJan 28 19:38
MinceRindeedJan 28 19:38
MinceRibm should have never made a deal with m$Jan 28 19:39
sebsebsebcubezzz:  well I would want a better job, but well  I soudn't have a big deal with  doing some rubbish data entry job, where I am typing stuff up into Word for example, or putting data into a spread sheet, and being paid for it.Jan 28 19:39
DaemonFCMinceR: They're not going to shut down every HP or Dell even to stop thousands of people using HP or Dell SLIC keysJan 28 19:39
sebsebsebshoudn't hrm that was meant to be woudn't,  silly typeosJan 28 19:39
MinceRcp/m and vms should have died like the dinosaurs they areJan 28 19:39
MinceRcrApple should have dismissed like the joke it always wasJan 28 19:39
Chips_B_MalroyI see the Netflix/Blockbuster attempt by MS as a failure of Adobe to compete with them.Jan 28 19:39
sebsebsebcubezzz: computing didn't become main streame untill the PC, and so yep WindowsJan 28 19:39
sebsebsebcubezzz: everything before that, the average computer user doesn't know or care aboutJan 28 19:40
cubezzzPCs were all text based for a long time!Jan 28 19:40
sebsebsebthey just want to use a computer for whatever they are doing and that's thatJan 28 19:40
Chips_B_Malroyand we need Adobe to compete with MS, in order to prevent MS establishing another monopolyJan 28 19:40
sebsebsebcomputers are more than a tool reallyJan 28 19:40
sebsebsebor wellJan 28 19:40
MinceRwe need adobe to dieJan 28 19:40
MinceRpreferable after m$ diesJan 28 19:40
cubezzzbefore that we used word processors, also text basedJan 28 19:40
MinceRs/ble/bly/Jan 28 19:40
sebsebsebthey are a tool, but  one where you get chances of tools for a task, as in software for a taskJan 28 19:40
Chips_B_MalroytrueJan 28 19:40
sebsebseb,but people tend to just use the tool that  most other users use as wellJan 28 19:41
sebsebseband just, because something is popular and used by many people, does not mean that it is acstaully that goodJan 28 19:41
cubezzzit's not :)Jan 28 19:41
sebsebsebchances of tool above, uh  choices of toolsJan 28 19:41
cubezzzNews or X Windows was decent thoughJan 28 19:41
MinceRit was called X Window :>Jan 28 19:42
cubezzzsorry :)Jan 28 19:42
MinceRand it wasn't only decent, it was revolutionaryJan 28 19:42
sebsebsebgive the average computer user Ubuntu, and help them out a bit with it, and yep most will be rather happy indeed with itJan 28 19:42
Chips_B_Malroywindows users use windows, because they know windows, and it was hard for them to learn.  So they fear learning Linux, as windows was hard to learn, therefore they think Linux will tooJan 28 19:42
sebsebsebif all someone wants to do is basics, they really don't need Windows these daysJan 28 19:42
Chips_B_MalroyAnd most windows users had someone to help them learn, a relative, a friendJan 28 19:43
cubezzzI taught my parents Linux without difficultyJan 28 19:43
cubezzzand they are old :)Jan 28 19:43
MinceRwhat winblows users miss is that they'll have to learn vista or vista7 if they want to stay with winblowsJan 28 19:43
MinceRand then the next gui disaster after thoseJan 28 19:43
Chips_B_MalroyCubezzz> exactly my pointJan 28 19:43
sebsebsebcubezzz: sure, and some young children are lucky enough to use  Ubuntu alreadyJan 28 19:43
cubezzzUnix System V was _hard_Jan 28 19:44
sebsebsebDesktop Linux is for all computer using agesJan 28 19:44
cubezzzLinux is not hardJan 28 19:44
Chips_B_MalroyLinux will spread in the same manor as windows did, with a friend or relative to teach them the better wayJan 28 19:44
cubezzzat least I don't think modern Linux is hardJan 28 19:44
Chips_B_Malroysomeone to show them thats its not hardJan 28 19:44
sebsebsebcubezzz: it's not, well depending on the distro, and  Ubuntu, and Mandriva, and so on,  two releases a yearJan 28 19:44
sebsebsebcubezzz: keep on improvingJan 28 19:44
sebsebsebwhere as with Windows wellJan 28 19:45
sebsebseba new release every three years or soJan 28 19:45
sebsebsebWindows 7 really is Vista version 2Jan 28 19:45
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sebsebsebXP  is rather similar to 2000Jan 28 19:45
cubezzzwindows is slow, that's my 2nd criticism Jan 28 19:45
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sebsebseb2000 is quite similar to Windows 98 really?Jan 28 19:45
cubezzzmy 1st criticism is it's closed source of courseJan 28 19:45
sebsebsebWindows 98 is rather similar to WIndows 95?Jan 28 19:45
sebsebsebWindows 3.1 is really just a GUI for DOSJan 28 19:45
cubezzzand Windows 3.1, and Windows 3.0 and Windows 2.0 :)Jan 28 19:46
cubezzzhow far back do you want to go :)Jan 28 19:46
sebsebsebWindows hasn't really properly improved as an OS since Windows 95Jan 28 19:46
MinceRwindows stopped improving after xp :>Jan 28 19:46
MinceRmaybe earlierJan 28 19:46
sebsebseboh more software running on Windows and more hardware working on it, right, butJan 28 19:46
Chips_B_Malroy2010 will be an interesting year.  I predict WinMO loses the cellphone market almost entirely.  WinMO (CE) is really only be developed to keep Linux off ARMJan 28 19:46
sebsebsebthat wasn't Microsoft that did most of thatJan 28 19:46
sebsebsebthat was other developers, because Windows gained most of the desktop marketJan 28 19:47
Chips_B_MalroyBallmer has a good chance of being sacked in 2010Jan 28 19:47
cubezzzI didn't even like win2KJan 28 19:47
sebsebsebMinceR: that sounds about rightJan 28 19:47
sebsebsebMinceR: well there's Server 2003, which is meant to be quite a lot better than XP as a desktop OSJan 28 19:47
cubezzzwho can sack him?Jan 28 19:47
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: yes I know about that, Ballmer is on his way out it seemsJan 28 19:48
Chips_B_Malroyw2000 was really the last windows OS before they jumped completely on the DRM wagonJan 28 19:48
MinceRthey always seem to _mean_ to improve, but they rarely manage to do it :>Jan 28 19:48
sebsebsebMinceR: same with KDE and Gnome maybe :D heh hehJan 28 19:48
sebsebsebMinceR: well  I have used them since 2004, and a know a tiny bit about the historyJan 28 19:49
MinceRKDE improved all the time, except from 4.0 to 4.2Jan 28 19:49
Chips_B_MalroyMS is far more concerned about DRM and lockin than improvements, its why they need to hide everything with eye candy anymoreJan 28 19:49
sebsebsebthey make a new major version of Gnome or KDEJan 28 19:49
MinceRgnome improved until they decided to copy macos instead of kde, then it got into a downward spiralJan 28 19:49
sebsebseband all users of the previous version, don't just start using the next happileyJan 28 19:49
sebsebseb,because they remove features etcJan 28 19:49
sebsebsebquite a lot of people today still wanting to use KDE 3.5 for exampleJan 28 19:49
cubezzzlol, like meJan 28 19:50
cubezzzexcept I use 3.4.2 :)Jan 28 19:50
MinceRi'd like to have 3.5 installed beside 4.3Jan 28 19:50
Chips_B_MalroyI am one of those with KDE 3.5Jan 28 19:50
Chips_B_MalroyTo be truthful, I don't hate KDE 4Jan 28 19:50
DaemonFCsebsebseb: Yeah, but there's some incompatibilities between Server 2008 R2 and Windows 7Jan 28 19:50
MinceRi don't hate KDE4 either, i just don't consider its versions from 4.0 to 4.2 to be stable releases :>Jan 28 19:51
Chips_B_MalroyBut Mepis 8 with KDE3.5 is very comfy for me right nowJan 28 19:51
DaemonFCantivirus doesn't like to install unless you paid them $300 for the server versionJan 28 19:51
DaemonFCsome games freak out if they don't find the Games ExplorerJan 28 19:51
MinceRand iirc "windows server" (contradiction in terms) has some default settings that are very unsuitable for desktop useJan 28 19:52
MinceRof course you can fix them, but it's just more hassleJan 28 19:52
DaemonFCso you need to borrow some files from Windows 7 to drop into the System32 folder and make some programs happy on Server 2008 R2Jan 28 19:52
DaemonFCMinceR: Audio service is off, if you turn it on it's still low priority and likes to skipJan 28 19:52
sebsebsebDaemonFC: Server 2008, Vista, and Windows 7,  is there any proper reason to use them?    The only reason those got made is for Microsoft to make even more money,  XP  and 2003, are good enough.Jan 28 19:52
DaemonFChave to fix that in the registryJan 28 19:52
sebsebsebDaemonFC: so whilst XP and 2003 are st ill supported, no proper reason to use the others reallyJan 28 19:53
DaemonFCIE has "security" settings that keep it from rendering most websitesJan 28 19:53
sebsebsebDaemonFC: that's the other thing with propritary software, yes they stop supporting products, trying to get people to buy the  nextJan 28 19:53
DaemonFCthe "Desktop Experience" (AERO and Windows Media Player) isn't there by defaultJan 28 19:53
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DaemonFCit won't grab drivers from Windows Update for anything it doesn't already haveJan 28 19:53
sebsebsebDaemonFC: with opensource/freesoftware yes software loses support, but that's so developers can focus on the later versions,  improving thoseJan 28 19:53
DaemonFCyou get to go find themJan 28 19:53
MinceRafter seeing how ponderously slow luna is in virtualization, i tend to opt for "classic" anyway :>Jan 28 19:54
sebsebseband Microsoft sell the same thing,  quite a few times, with some changesJan 28 19:54
sebsebsebwell  I guess some of that Windows 7 code, goes back to uhmm Windows 95?Jan 28 19:54
DaemonFCnot reallyJan 28 19:54
MinceRsome of that vista7 code goes back to cp/m-86, bsd and vmsJan 28 19:54
DaemonFCWindows 95 got the transfusion from NTJan 28 19:55
MinceRit's a mishmash of stolen code, glued together with inhouse crapJan 28 19:55
DaemonFCnot so much the other way aroundJan 28 19:55
DaemonFCWindows NT eventually got DirectX if that's what you meanJan 28 19:55
DaemonFCNT 4 had to use software rendered DirectX thoughJan 28 19:55
sebsebsebanyway Microsoft and Apple and so on are propritary, better to use opensource/freesoftware :)Jan 28 19:55
MinceRhm, did windows nt fix the palette entry 0 bug eventually?Jan 28 19:55
DaemonFCWindows 2000 got hardware accelerationJan 28 19:55
MinceRi can't really tell as practically nothing uses 256 color video modes nowadaysJan 28 19:56
sebsebsebor even software that is really propritary, but freewareJan 28 19:56
sebsebsebif people ony bought software that was properly good, computing would be much better.Jan 28 19:57
sebsebsebI mean if people only used propritary software that is properly good.Jan 28 19:57
DaemonFCsebsebseb: Windows 95 was the Iran-Contra for DOS usersJan 28 19:57
DaemonFC:DJan 28 19:57
sebsebsebDaemonFC: the what?Jan 28 19:58
MinceRthe antichrist?Jan 28 19:58
DaemonFCarms for hostagesJan 28 19:58
cubezzzthe anticomputer :)Jan 28 19:59
DaemonFCthey knew they wouldn't get people to use NT because they would bitch about losing their DOS appsJan 28 19:59
DaemonFCso that's where Windows 95 came fromJan 28 19:59
cubezzzreally it's time for people to get off the dozeJan 28 19:59
MinceRand because nt was even shittier than 9xJan 28 19:59
cubezzzway past time Jan 28 19:59
MinceRit was slow, incompatible and horribly buggyJan 28 19:59
MinceReven winblows games didn't work well with itJan 28 20:00
cubezzzNT could to multi cpu thoughJan 28 20:00
cubezzzto=doJan 28 20:00
MinceRno home user could afford multiple CPUs though :>Jan 28 20:00
DaemonFCNT was far better than 95Jan 28 20:00
Chips_B_MalroyNT was the best MS could do, but a lot of NT was what they learned also from IBM OS/2 which they jointly done for awhileJan 28 20:00
cubezzzwas there a NT 1.0?Jan 28 20:00
MinceR95 was better for gaming than NTJan 28 20:01
DaemonFCNT 3.1 is where it startedJan 28 20:01
MinceRcubezzz: no, they started at 3.xJan 28 20:01
cubezzzahJan 28 20:01
MinceRit's classic m$ version number inflationJan 28 20:01
Chips_B_MalroyNT 1.0 was OS/2 v1.0Jan 28 20:01
DaemonFCNT 3.1 can still run some Windows programsJan 28 20:01
cubezzzI only used 4.0 I thinkJan 28 20:01
DaemonFCincluding FirefoxJan 28 20:01
Chips_B_Malroyfirst version of real NT was 3.11, not to be confused with windows for workgroupsJan 28 20:02
MinceRi'm not sure what nt versions i've used, but i'm sure i've used nt 4, 2000, xp and vistaJan 28 20:02
DaemonFCat the time Windows 95 came otu it had all of its own problems and most of the limitations of NT 4 as wellJan 28 20:02
DaemonFCthere was no DirectX on either of themJan 28 20:02
DaemonFCthere was no Plug and PlayJan 28 20:02
MinceRi only used nt4 and win95 at school thoughJan 28 20:02
DaemonFCthey both used their own incompatible driver modelsJan 28 20:03
Chips_B_MalroyNT 3.51 still looked like windows for workgroupsJan 28 20:03
MinceRthe sole win95 machine was popular because it wasn't crippled that much for gaming by nt4Jan 28 20:03
DaemonFCMinceR: The only thing Windows 95 had on NT 4 was that it was easier to run DOS programsJan 28 20:03
MinceRand that it had less random incompatibilities, no palette index 0 bug, etcJan 28 20:03
MinceRoh, and it wasn't as slow as nt4Jan 28 20:04
DaemonFCgaming on Windows was really unheard of until way after either of themJan 28 20:04
DaemonFCat least hardware accelerated gamesJan 28 20:04
MinceRhardware acceleration was unheard of for a long timeJan 28 20:04
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DaemonFCeither 95 or NT 4 could run the same software accelerated onesJan 28 20:04
Chips_B_MalroyIBM OS/2 Warp version 3 actually had 6% of the desktop market share at one pointJan 28 20:05
DaemonFCby Windows 98 and NT 5 (2000), a number of things happened, they both had hardware accelerated DirectX, they both had Plug and Play, and they could both use the Windows Driver ModelJan 28 20:05
DaemonFC2000 was clearly superior to 98Jan 28 20:05
Chips_B_Malroyonly exceeded prehaps by Linux nowJan 28 20:05
DaemonFC95 and NT were a stalemateJan 28 20:05
MinceRat least 98 had dos modeJan 28 20:06
DaemonFCand of course by XP, everyone was using NT 5.1Jan 28 20:06
DaemonFCMinceR: You can use VDM SoundJan 28 20:06
MinceRwhatJan 28 20:06
DaemonFCand WDM display drivers allow for full screen DOS appsJan 28 20:06
MinceRyes, for full-screen DOS apps that are unusably slow up to the point when they crashJan 28 20:07
DaemonFCVDM Sound was an add-on to the NT command interpreter that allowed DOS games to emit soundJan 28 20:07
DaemonFCit emulated a Sound Blaster 16 for themJan 28 20:07
Chips_B_MalroyIf you look at what MS is always accused of stealing (idea's) from Apple, which they do, MS actually stole more from OS/2 than Apple.   OS/2 Warp 4 (1998) had a built in voice reconiztion, which only recently Vista hadJan 28 20:07
MinceRnot so great when you had an AWE32 and games that could actually use itJan 28 20:07
DaemonFCnot really, I played through lots of DOS games in the NTVDMJan 28 20:07
DaemonFCincluding DaggerfallJan 28 20:07
MinceRTyrian, for exampleJan 28 20:07
DaemonFCthe only thing that crashed it were its own bugsJan 28 20:08
DaemonFCB-)Jan 28 20:08
Chips_B_Malroywhich shows how far windows is behindJan 28 20:08
MinceRand of course games based on the Doom engine, but those were quickly portedJan 28 20:08
DaemonFCand there's DOSBOX now, so the lack of DOS compatibility in 64-bit Windows is not really an issueJan 28 20:08
MinceRindeedJan 28 20:08
Chips_B_MalroyMS has kept the computer world about 12 behind the timesJan 28 20:08
cubezzzyupJan 28 20:08
MinceRbut why run dosbox under winblows if you can run it under linux?Jan 28 20:08
cubezzzyeah I don't :)Jan 28 20:09
DaemonFCyou can run it on FreeBSDJan 28 20:09
DaemonFCor even your MacJan 28 20:09
Chips_B_Malroy*yearsJan 28 20:09
DaemonFC8-)Jan 28 20:09
MinceRthe only legitimate use case for winblows on the bare hw i can find now is games that weren't portedJan 28 20:09
DaemonFCfeel the 1979 goodness :)Jan 28 20:09
cubezzzdosbox is very usefulJan 28 20:09
MinceRi don't have a freebsd nor mac, you insensitive clod :>Jan 28 20:09
cubezzzbut porting stuff is even betterJan 28 20:09
MinceRcrappy windows-only desktop applications can run on wine or on virtualized winblowsJan 28 20:09
cubezzz1979 is pre MSDOSJan 28 20:10
cubezzzno MS DOS in 1979Jan 28 20:10
DaemonFCMinceR: I made a FreeDOS boot CD to patch my BIOS onceJan 28 20:10
DaemonFCI was proud of myself :PJan 28 20:10
cubezzzI know I was using computers in 1979 Jan 28 20:10
DaemonFCbooting a Core 2 Duo into DOSJan 28 20:10
DaemonFCwoot!Jan 28 20:10
MinceRi'm pretty sure i wasn't using computers in 1979Jan 28 20:10
MinceR:>Jan 28 20:10
cubezzzCommodore PET ftw :)Jan 28 20:11
MinceRDaemonFC: well, my core 2 duo craptop came with a freedos install cd :>Jan 28 20:11
MinceRand a printed copy of the GPLJan 28 20:11
DaemonFCyeah, and you bought it to run FreeDOSJan 28 20:11
DaemonFCthat's a badass FreeDOS rigJan 28 20:11
DaemonFChow many fps do you get on that blinking cursor?Jan 28 20:11
DaemonFC:DJan 28 20:11
MinceRlolJan 28 20:11
sebsebsebsome of us were born after 1979Jan 28 20:12
MinceRthat's done by the VGA card anywayJan 28 20:12
MinceRthe cursor can keep blinking even if your CPU has frozen :>Jan 28 20:12
cubezzzwe also had TRS-80 Model 1's :)Jan 28 20:12
DaemonFCI've had that happenJan 28 20:12
cubezzzwith black N white tv connected :)Jan 28 20:12
MinceRexcept perhaps with funky emulation like what Trident's software could do under DOSJan 28 20:13
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: yeah I guess most computer users would be using Unix or something Unix based, by now, if Microsoft hadn't come along and messed things up.  Or most would have been using something from IBM.Jan 28 20:13
MinceRi had (and still have) a sinclair zx spectrumJan 28 20:13
DaemonFCMinceR: My favorite is when you're playing a game and the system freezes and there's purple, green, and black bars dancing diagnolally across the screen while the soundcard keeps playing the last couple of notes sent to itJan 28 20:13
MinceRIBM would have come up with some unix as soon as PCs could handle itJan 28 20:13
MinceRprobablyJan 28 20:14
cubezzzit took have gone with BSD Jan 28 20:14
DaemonFC*diagonally Jan 28 20:14
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: exactly though, they keep things years behind, for example the web, since Internet Explorer gained most of the browser market, and it's lack of web standards supportJan 28 20:14
sebsebseboh IE 8s an improvement they say for web standards, right, but quite a lot of people are still using earlier versionsJan 28 20:14
DaemonFCMinceR: A fine tradition that Windows still carries forwardJan 28 20:14
MinceRoh, it would be an improvement if it actually used standards by defaultJan 28 20:14
MinceRinstead of relying on nonstandard hacks to enable its more standards-compliant behaviorJan 28 20:15
MinceRie8 is a jokeJan 28 20:15
sebsebsebMinceR: non snadard hacks to enable standards complaint browser mode hrm?   I hardly know anything about IE8Jan 28 20:15
DaemonFCMinceR: But it's fully CSS 2.1 compliant now, so you can have pretty borders on the page surrounding your Silverlight(R) contentJan 28 20:15
DaemonFChoe can you possibly ding them for this?Jan 28 20:16
DaemonFC:)Jan 28 20:16
DaemonFC*howJan 28 20:16
MinceRDaemonFC: pretty borders are 1 pixel off either on ie or on all other browsers? :>Jan 28 20:16
MinceRs/are/that are/Jan 28 20:16
DaemonFCafter all, web standards are only there to garnish our Flash and SilverlightJan 28 20:16
cubezzzanother thing I find interesting is that some ncurses programs still get updated, but I don't think ms dos programs get updatedJan 28 20:16
DaemonFCthe occasional Java crapplet left to roam the wastelandsJan 28 20:16
sebsebsebanyway it's basically screw Windows and Microsoft Office these days, because we got rather good alternatives, but right big problem, most computer users are to ignorant to know thatJan 28 20:16
MinceRi know some militantly ignorand computer usersJan 28 20:17
MinceRit's really sadJan 28 20:17
sebsebsebMinceR: you mean where they want try other stuff?Jan 28 20:17
sebsebsebwhere they won'tJan 28 20:17
DaemonFCMinceR: The standard should be changed then so everyone else is wrongJan 28 20:17
DaemonFCobviouslyJan 28 20:17
sebsebsebthat's something elseJan 28 20:17
sebsebsebquite a lot of people think Microsoft are standardJan 28 20:17
sebsebsebare they really a standard nahJan 28 20:18
cubezzzpeople know Linux existsJan 28 20:18
sebsebsebthey are just most usedJan 28 20:18
MinceRsebsebseb: where they either won't try other stuff or give up on the excuse that it isn't exactly winblowsJan 28 20:18
cubezzzok, some people may be 100% clueless, but most have some ideaJan 28 20:18
sebsebsebalso when it comes to computing,  the only ture real proper standards, are open standardsJan 28 20:18
sebsebsebMinceR: yeahJan 28 20:18
sebsebsebMinceR: well I thinkJan 28 20:18
MinceRsebsebseb: or where they're card-carrying m$ cultists and won't believe anything but official m$ lies, regardless of what their senses tell themJan 28 20:18
sebsebsebwell Desktop Linux  won't win over loads of Windows users in the next few yearsJan 28 20:19
Chips_B_MalroyReally when you look at patents and what is being patented, you see that codecs, which Bill Gates used to call "multimedia extenstions," were nothing but alogrythems used to encode sound and sight.   And then they were used to become dominant on the web, which should have been free.  That this type of patent was ever allowed was wrong.Jan 28 20:19
sebsebseb,but if ReactOS becomes ready enough that might just do itJan 28 20:19
MinceRsebsebseb: or where they confuse issues with hw vendors not supporting gnu/linux with inherent problemsJan 28 20:19
sebsebsebjust make  sure people know that it's very much like WindowsJan 28 20:19
sebsebsebI don't like the world clone when talking about computingJan 28 20:19
MinceRi'd rather give them ylmf osJan 28 20:19
sebsebsebMinceR: is that the chinese one?Jan 28 20:19
MinceRor some gnu/linux distro with xpdeJan 28 20:19
MinceRyesJan 28 20:19
sebsebsebanyway a clone means exactly the sameJan 28 20:20
sebsebsebso how can ReactOS be a clone of Windows,  exactly it can't beJan 28 20:20
sebsebsebso this clone word in computing is silly, just like Abiword is a clone of Micrsooft Word?Jan 28 20:20
sebsebsebno  it's not the sameJan 28 20:20
MinceRreactos is a reimplementation of an inherently flawed designJan 28 20:20
sebsebsebthey are both examples of programs that have been made  to be very similar to  what's from Microsoft,  however they aren't actsaul clones, tehy aren't exactly the same thingJan 28 20:20
MinceRbut maybe it will be useful on virtual machines eventuallyJan 28 20:20
sebsebsebMinceR: well it's going to be using a lot more Wine code soonJan 28 20:21
MinceRto run windows crApps that don't run in wineJan 28 20:21
Chips_B_MalroyReactOS is nice, but they do things wrong, they fall into the same trap in some ways as MS did.  Look at security, no limited user account by default?Jan 28 20:21
MinceRthen again, their use of wine code makes it unlikely that there will be anything that runs on reactos but not on wineJan 28 20:21
sebsebsebMinceR: exactlyJan 28 20:21
sebsebsebso both will improve even moreJan 28 20:21
MinceRChips_B_Malroy: they can't help it, they're reimplementing windows designJan 28 20:21
sebsebseband then  people can do Desktop Linux and WineJan 28 20:21
sebsebsebor if they really do want something like WIndows,  ReactOSJan 28 20:21
MinceRi think they're wasting their timeJan 28 20:22
sebsebsebMinceR: only time will tell us, if they are wasting time or notJan 28 20:22
MinceRi won't hold my breath to see a non-crap OS based on a crap design :>Jan 28 20:22
sebsebsebthings are starting to go rather mobile nowJan 28 20:22
sebsebsebso  in 10 years timeJan 28 20:22
sebsebsebmaybe  loads more mobile computer devices,  than desktop/laptopJan 28 20:23
sebsebsebdesktop/notebookJan 28 20:23
sebsebsebwell a notebook is really a mobile deviceJan 28 20:23
sebsebsebMinceR: bingo ReactOS will be a non crap OS, based on a crap OS :DJan 28 20:23
MinceRi doubt itJan 28 20:23
sebsebsebMinceR: to what?Jan 28 20:23
MinceRi think it will suck somewhat less than windowsJan 28 20:23
MinceRbut it will still be crippled by its design flawsJan 28 20:24
sebsebsebwell yeah maybe so, but  even so an interesting project to follow here and thereJan 28 20:24
sebsebsebWindows does have certain advantages over Desktop Linux really and the ReactOS people know thatJan 28 20:24
sebsebseband no I don't mean how loads of software just runs on WindowsJan 28 20:24
sebsebsebI mean actsaul OS advantagesJan 28 20:24
Chips_B_Malroy?Jan 28 20:25
MinceRwhat are those?Jan 28 20:25
Chips_B_Malroyyes, it will run malware, windows willJan 28 20:25
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: well I assume so anyway :D  I don't know that much about this stuffJan 28 20:25
stavrosLinuxI don;t see reactOS going anywhere, I would bet on Haiku rather than reactOSJan 28 20:25
sebsebsebI guess there is something that Windows has done rightJan 28 20:25
sebsebsebthat Desktop Linux should do as well reallyJan 28 20:25
MinceRwhat have they done right?Jan 28 20:25
MinceRnothing, as far as i knowJan 28 20:25
sebsebsebstavrosLinux: ah yes HaikuJan 28 20:25
sebsebsebthat's another oneJan 28 20:25
sebsebsebthere's a 3rd party program now, so it can run KDE 4 appsJan 28 20:25
stavrosLinuxyep, thats somethingJan 28 20:26
sebsebsebyes  Haiku could turn into something pretty useful for many people,  I still got to virtual machine itJan 28 20:26
MinceRis haiku multiuser already?Jan 28 20:26
sebsebsebstavrosLinux: it can do The GIMP and such as well, with the 3rd party programJan 28 20:26
stavrosLinuxno I dont think soJan 28 20:26
MinceRi hope for their sake that they won't wait until apps become reliant on haiku being single-userJan 28 20:27
sebsebsebwhen something isn't offical, why is it called 3rd party?  what about 1st and 2nd party?Jan 28 20:27
MinceRwindows did that and we can see the disaster that resulted inJan 28 20:27
sebsebseb`1st is the developer them selves? well then who is 2nd?Jan 28 20:27
stavrosLinuxI think it has a better chance to absorb KDE because of QTJan 28 20:27
sebsebsebKDE 4 for Windows exists as wellJan 28 20:27
MinceRi think 1st party and 2nd party are the user and the OS developer, but i don't know which is whichJan 28 20:27
sebsebsebso some apps will runJan 28 20:27
MinceRit seems like a stupid terminology anywayJan 28 20:28
sebsebsebseems they want to make KDE 4 cross platform.  also for Mac OS X yep so some apps will runJan 28 20:28
sebsebsebthat wasn't clear, you can run some KDE 4 apps natively on Mac OS X as well, not just WIndowsJan 28 20:28
MinceRi just don't know whyJan 28 20:29
MinceRi really don't see any point to running macosJan 28 20:30
MinceRit doesn't even have the apps to keep me hostage with, unlike windows :>Jan 28 20:30
sebsebsebMinceR: well seems certain geeks go for it since the consitencyJan 28 20:30
MinceRwhat consistency?Jan 28 20:30
sebsebsebalso it's what quite a lot of people are going to instead of Desktop Linux, from WindowsJan 28 20:30
MinceRwhere Tiger uses two visual styles at once? :>Jan 28 20:30
sebsebsebMinceR: how things look similarJan 28 20:30
stavrosLinuxto spread KDE as much as possible I thinkJan 28 20:31
MinceRor where non-macos apps use different looks and put their menubars in a different place? :>Jan 28 20:31
sebsebsebMinceR: don't know never used it properly,  I had a good look around someones Tiger Mac in 2007 thoughJan 28 20:31
sebsebsebit was offlineJan 28 20:31
MinceRor where you tell the damn thing that yes, you want to use the keyboard to navigate the dialog box and you still can't? :>Jan 28 20:31
sebsebsebcoudn't install stuff etcJan 28 20:31
sebsebseba lap top yeahJan 28 20:32
sebsebsebreally it's the OS I am missing, but screw it I guess, since propritaryJan 28 20:32
MinceRand then there are the stupid oddball terms they use, but i blissfully forgot them alreadyJan 28 20:32
sebsebsebhell even Windows is better than Mac OS X in certain ways really,  from my limited experienceJan 28 20:32
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MinceRindeed it isJan 28 20:32
MinceRwindows sucks less than osx in most waysJan 28 20:32
sebsebsebto be fiar, Windows isn't that bad as an OS, once it's been made to be secure enough, and heh heh, I don't mean  by just installing anti virus and anti spywareJan 28 20:33
sebsebseband using a more secure browser instead of IEJan 28 20:34
sebsebsebrun limited account yes, only admin when need to, but there are other things that can be done to make it more secure as wellJan 28 20:34
schestowitztessier: no problem with the siteJan 28 20:34
schestowitzIt was a CMS thing, I think I found a workaround. It was nothing major :-)Jan 28 20:35
sebsebsebMinceR: I think a lot of today's Mac users, use it, because they are ignorantJan 28 20:35
sebsebsebthey went to Mac to get away from the viruses and suchJan 28 20:35
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sebsebsebwhat they didn't reolize is that there's something called Ubuntu  for example, which they could have used insteadJan 28 20:35
MinceRbeing ignorant is what defines the cult of crAppleJan 28 20:35
sebsebsebin fact quite a few Mac users have then gone to Ubuntu, and they find Ubuntu betterJan 28 20:35
MinceRmaybe because gnome copies macosJan 28 20:36
MinceR:>Jan 28 20:36
sebsebsebyeah the adverts as well, I am a PC, I am a Mac, they want people to think  PC = Windows   Mac =  whatever Mac runsJan 28 20:36
sebsebsebMinceR: Gnome 2 is goodJan 28 20:36
sebsebsebwellJan 28 20:36
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Just recovering from a bug going around...feel much better today! New stuff planned for Friday!Jan 28 20:36
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @schestowitz yep, can do monday.Jan 28 20:36
sebsebsebthey are starting to mess it up a bit before Gnome 3, upstream GnomeJan 28 20:36
sebsebsebas for Gnome 3 I am not so sure about that, from  what I read about Gnome Shell and those screen shots I sawJan 28 20:37
sebsebsebGDM 2, and  the icons removed in system menu and some of places, I call that a mess up,  oh for now it can be turned  back on, but when I did the alpha 2 of Lucid in vm from the ISO, well the feature to turn back on, has been removed. I think I read Gnome wanted to do thatJan 28 20:38
sebsebsebso yep two mess up's just before Gnome 3Jan 28 20:38
sebsebsebGDM 2, well how it can't be themed like the old one, that kind of thingJan 28 20:38
MinceRoh, one more thing about "consistency" in macos i can remember: drag the drive icon on the trash icon to eject itJan 28 20:38
sebsebseboh?  that sounds like saying  the drive is  trashJan 28 20:39
Chips_B_MalroyI would not say that Mac users are mostly ignorant.  They are right that OS X is more secure out of the box than Vista/Seven, but what isn't?  Mac users vote with their wallets, its why in the USA that 90% of laptops costing $100 and up are Mac sales.Jan 28 20:39
schestowitz_Goblin: I'll be near hype park around 3pmJan 28 20:39
sebsebsebwhat's on the drive is trashJan 28 20:39
_Goblinah...Jan 28 20:39
schestowitzMondayJan 28 20:39
Chips_B_MalroySome people just think that an OS should be an applicanceJan 28 20:39
schestowitzThis way the travel is smootherJan 28 20:40
Chips_B_MalroyMac is an applicanceJan 28 20:40
MinceRif i wanted security, i would sure as hell not go for macosJan 28 20:40
sebsebsebChips_B_Malroy: what you mean appliance?Jan 28 20:40
MinceRthey're notoriously slow with their updatesJan 28 20:40
_Goblinit would be difficult for me to attend there, I'll be starting work at 2pmJan 28 20:40
schestowitzsebsebseb: appleianceJan 28 20:40
schestowitzLike s toasterJan 28 20:40
Chips_B_MalroyIn many way GNU/Linux distro's are applicances tooJan 28 20:40
schestowitzTablet without keyboardJan 28 20:40
sebsebsebschestowitz: oh a consumer device, that just works?Jan 28 20:40
sebsebseba TV for exampleJan 28 20:40
sebsebsebwell just works, untill the hardware messe's upJan 28 20:40
schestowitzYou press the screen, then clowns start dancing in iPhone OS or whatever they call itJan 28 20:40
MinceRnope, only chromium/chrome OS and the firewall distros are an applianceJan 28 20:40
MinceRand the router distrosJan 28 20:40
schestowitz"There's a [cr]app for that, too!"Jan 28 20:40
MinceRgeneral-purpose distros respect the idea of the general purpose computerJan 28 20:41
MinceRunlike crAppleJan 28 20:41
schestowitz[20:40] <sebsebseb> schestowitz: oh a consumer device, that just works?Jan 28 20:41
schestowitzNoJan 28 20:41
schestowitzMost products workJan 28 20:41
Chips_B_Malroyby applicance, I mean setup as a complete system, secure well out of the box, and basically nothing for a regular user to do to run on the internetJan 28 20:41
schestowitzExcept Windows :-)Jan 28 20:41
schestowitzOtherwise they won't be on the marketJan 28 20:41
MinceRmost products work, just not very well :>Jan 28 20:41
Chips_B_Malroy"internet applicance" is the term I should have usedJan 28 20:41
schestowitzAppliance is a buzzword like "consumer" and "unwashed masses" or :"innovation"Jan 28 20:41
schestowitzYou can call everything an applianceJan 28 20:42
schestowitzEven a solid Turing machine you build in a garageJan 28 20:42
MinceRif only i could build a Turing machine in a garage :>Jan 28 20:42
schestowitz"Appliance" Certified ProductJan 28 20:42
MinceRinfinite storage!Jan 28 20:42
schestowitzApproved by the Federal Appliances Commission (FAC!)Jan 28 20:42
schestowitzFSF got some publicity from this eventJan 28 20:43
schestowitzThat's goodJan 28 20:43
Chips_B_Malroyyes, Roy, applicance was not the right word, something else would have been a better selectionJan 28 20:45
MinceRi think it's the right wordJan 28 20:45
MinceRand i interpret it as "a machine that's aimed at only one task, can do nothing else and the user is prevented/discouraged from trying to deal with its internals"Jan 28 20:46
MinceRor a very limited set of tasks anywayJan 28 20:46
Chips_B_MalroyMinceR> Mac would be more of an "applicance" than Linux, as mostly its far less customizableJan 28 20:46
MinceRindeedJan 28 20:47
Chips_B_MalroyRoy, I hope u were able to read my rantings here on Blockbuster/M$ DRM Jan 28 20:48
Chips_B_MalroymonopolyJan 28 20:48
schestowitz 28 20:49
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Jeepers, creepers, where'd ya get them peepers - Big Brother Watch .::. Size~: 36.31 KBJan 28 20:49
*schestowitz looks up "appliance"....Jan 28 20:49
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: yes, I saw thatJan 28 20:49
DaemonFCthe car place pulled up my credit, there's nothing too bad thereJan 28 20:49
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: there was a lot to read here... fell asleep in the sauna... just 4 hour sleep/night  recently...Jan 28 20:49
MinceR 28 20:49
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Penny Arcade! - From Another Human Being .::. Size~: 7.99 KBJan 28 20:49
DaemonFCbut since I'm a "first time buyer" (in the loan system anyway), I either need to make double what I do now or cough up 20% as a down paymentJan 28 20:50
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phIRCe-BNcTitle: appliance - Definition of appliance noun from Cambridge Dictionary Online: Free English Dictionary and Thesaurus .::. Size~: 28.21 KBJan 28 20:50
*Diablo-D3 has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))Jan 28 20:51
schestowitzBased on this, we might not be able to call computers appliancesJan 28 20:51
schestowitzUnless they are tied to another processJan 28 20:51
MinceRnot computers, only what crApple is turning them intoJan 28 20:51
schestowitzLike a cooker that cooks stuff (microchip just secondary function)Jan 28 20:51
MinceR(and in the service of DRM, m$)Jan 28 20:51
schestowitzMinceR: did you try eating an iPod Shuttle?Jan 28 20:51
schestowitzIt tastes like sushiJan 28 20:52
stavrosLinuxwhat do you think about ubuntu-yahoo deal?Jan 28 20:52
MinceRnopeJan 28 20:52
schestowitzIt ends up smelling kind of cr*pJan 28 20:52
MinceRi prefer non-crap foodJan 28 20:52
MinceRstavrosLinux: it's vileJan 28 20:52
schestowitzcrepe??Jan 28 20:52
MinceRstavrosLinux: i think it's another step in canonical's betrayal of the community it sought to profit fromJan 28 20:52
schestowitziPaq.......Jan 28 20:52
schestowitzRemember those?Jan 28 20:53
schestowitzi.....Jan 28 20:53
MinceRfirst there was the push for mono, then the push for mono to the detriment of gimp, now this deal to push bingo to the usersJan 28 20:53
schestowitzstavrosLinux: they needed to make moneyJan 28 20:53
schestowitzI don't resent them for itJan 28 20:53
schestowitzBut I think they need to find another partnerJan 28 20:53
stavrosLinuxMinceR: I would think that Mozilla would money from this deal too, otherwise how could this be possibleJan 28 20:53
MinceRif they keep on moving in this directory, canonical will be nothing but another novellJan 28 20:53
*MarcusKoze has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))Jan 28 20:53
schestowitzMandriva's Adam was PISSED OFF when MarkS told publicly he can't make money from ClientJan 28 20:54
MinceRand even one novell is too muchJan 28 20:54
stavrosLinux*getJan 28 20:54
schestowitzIt was poo-pooing Mandriva's business case tooJan 28 20:54
MinceRstavrosLinux: i don't really care of mozilla is making money from thisJan 28 20:54
MinceRs/of/if/Jan 28 20:54
MinceRwell, except that it might make them accomplices in this crimeJan 28 20:54
schestowitzMozilla is an Apple fanboi clubJan 28 20:55
schestowitzThere are exceptionsJan 28 20:55
schestowitzChris Blizzard is oneJan 28 20:55
MinceRi suspected soJan 28 20:55
schestowitzBut I think many of the rest are iHeadsJan 28 20:55
MinceRi remember jwzJan 28 20:55
MinceRat least he worked for mozilla before he lost his mindJan 28 20:55
MinceRprobably still isJan 28 20:55
schestowitzChris is responsible for the ogg policy, AFACTJan 28 20:55
schestowitz*ICTJan 28 20:55
schestowitzEven nowJan 28 20:56
schestowitzBut he implemented itJan 28 20:56
Chips_B_MalroyA Television is an applicance.  What M$ attempts to do with DRM/Silverlight is in some ways trying to turn the computer into an applicance TV that they control.Jan 28 20:56
stavrosLinuxwell if mozilla is teaming with yahoo-ms we should knowJan 28 20:56
schestowitzOpera was a BIG pusher for OggJan 28 20:56
schestowitzThey also deserve creditJan 28 20:56
schestowitzLie did a lot of workJan 28 20:56
schestowitzTHeir CEO quit recentlyJan 28 20:56
schestowitzGoogle is adding Ogg soon, right?Jan 28 20:56
schestowitzI can't recall to what extentJan 28 20:56
schestowitzThey also biught codecJan 28 20:57
MinceRi haven't heard of google adding ogg support yetJan 28 20:57
schestowitzThey didn't say what they would do with itJan 28 20:57
schestowitzThey experiment with html5Jan 28 20:57
schestowitzI reckon they might later merge the whole shebang with their codecJan 28 20:57
schestowitzIt gives them more power, they could give it royalty freeJan 28 20:57
schestowitzAs long as they make the Web more FOSS-compatible I don't mindJan 28 20:57
stavrosLinuxmaybe its a sign that all companies will team up against google =-OJan 28 20:58
schestowitzI remember what it was like using the Web with Linux at the beginning of last decade... painfulJan 28 20:58
schestowitzstavrosLinux: not really, I don't thinkJan 28 20:58
schestowitzstavrosLinux: Here's the weird thingJan 28 20:58
schestowitzCanonical works WITH googleJan 28 20:58
schestowitzOn Chromium OS/Chrome OSJan 28 20:58
schestowitzIt's Ubuntu tiedJan 28 20:59
schestowitzSokme Debian tooJan 28 20:59
schestowitzBut they work togetherJan 28 20:59
MinceRat least they did until the yahoo dealJan 28 20:59
schestowitzSo here's Canonical taking a kit at Google... runs to BartzerJan 28 20:59
stavrosLinuxgoogle will use them until no longer needs themJan 28 20:59
schestowitzThe Black Widow is Ballmer, not BartzmerJan 28 20:59
Chips_B_Malroyand if M$ has their way, it could be painful again.  Silverlight is the key to them, as Adobe is the easier nut to crack than Google is.  The Netflix/Blockbuster buyoff by M$ for movies is a concern Jan 28 21:00
schestowitzBallmer will eat Bartzmer when the meal's appetisers (Yahoo! Search) are overJan 28 21:00
schestowitzMicrosoft always works like thisJan 28 21:00
schestowitzstavrosLinux: like MozillaJan 28 21:00
schestowitzMozilla was betrayed by ChromeJan 28 21:00
schestowitzGoogle could just use MozillaJan 28 21:00
schestowitzBut it did it itselfJan 28 21:00
schestowitzWith Webkit, not Gecko evenJan 28 21:00
schestowitzButJan 28 21:01
schestowitzJust before Chrome was announced Google gave Mozilla some millionsJan 28 21:01
schestowitzAnd Gogle still gets a lot of traffic from FF usersJan 28 21:01
schestowitzUnless they use Ubuntu ! :-)Jan 28 21:01
MinceRcan the netflix/blockbuster deal be attacked on antitrust grounds?Jan 28 21:01
Chips_B_MalroyGoogle probably feels it needs both Chrome and Firefox Jan 28 21:01
stavrosLinuxor a goobye giftJan 28 21:02
Chips_B_MalroyMaybe when Ballmer said " I am going F***ing kill Google," someone was listening over there.Jan 28 21:03
stavrosLinuxmore likely is to have windows lose market to chrome OS than google to bingJan 28 21:04
schestowitzAwwwwwwww. how cute: 28 21:05
phIRCe-BNcTitle: 24 hour race - Miguel de Icaza .::. Size~: 13.25 KBJan 28 21:05
schestowitzMigi and the boyz already shill for iPadJan 28 21:05
schestowitzThey bring Microsoft to itJan 28 21:05
stavrosLinuxthat gives google opportunity to turn HugeJan 28 21:05
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: browsers are easy to makeJan 28 21:06
schestowitzThere are small (even one-man teams) that make someJan 28 21:06
schestowitzThey built them from commodity Free software, off the shelfJan 28 21:06
stavrosLinuximagine a team of Apple, MS, Canonical, Mozilla vs GoogleJan 28 21:06
schestowitzChrome uses KDE with some Apple patchesJan 28 21:06
stavrosLinux:-DJan 28 21:07
schestowitzkhtmlJan 28 21:07
schestowitzHe works for Nokia now, I thinkJan 28 21:07
schestowitzHe joined them some years agoJan 28 21:07
Chips_B_MalroyI would like to see real free market competition in the online streaming video market.  Having a convicted criminal monopolist buying both Netflix and Blockbuster, the only real big players for this, (at least in the USA) is not in the interests of users.   Its leverage by a monopolist to create another monopoly, and to lock out competing operating systems.Jan 28 21:07
schestowitzThen Nokia bought QtJan 28 21:07
schestowitzHe's Norwegian IIRC, can't recall his nameJan 28 21:07
schestowitzNokia is NERVOUS abouut GoogleJan 28 21:08
schestowitzAndroid eats SymbianJan 28 21:08
Chips_B_Malroyby buying I mean the service, not he companiesJan 28 21:08
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: pls don't say "Free market'Jan 28 21:08
schestowitzIt means all sorts of thingsJan 28 21:08
schestowitzCompeitition - OKJan 28 21:08
MinceRalso, there's google maps vs ovi mapsJan 28 21:08
Chips_B_Malroyto most here, it means what capitalism in a better world wasJan 28 21:09
schestowitzMinceR: and Nokia tried musicJan 28 21:09
schestowitzMaybe Nokika will become extinct after many many years as pride of .fiJan 28 21:09
MinceRi hope notJan 28 21:09
MinceRthey own one of the few (or only?) mobile platforms that are actually worth consideringJan 28 21:09
MinceRfor the futureJan 28 21:09
MinceRMaemoJan 28 21:09
schestowitzThe Fins have always feared the RussianJan 28 21:09
schestowitzBrin is really giving it to them nowJan 28 21:10
schestowitzMaemo is niceJan 28 21:10
schestowitzBut people adore brands like Apple and GoogleJan 28 21:10
schestowitzSome actually choke on their coffee on "Microsoft"Jan 28 21:10
MinceRthe hypePhone OS is useless and so is androidJan 28 21:10
schestowitzCrime fetish maybe....Jan 28 21:10
schestowitzMinceR: it ISJan 28 21:10
schestowitzI am amazedJan 28 21:11
schestowitzI thought about it earlierJan 28 21:11
schestowitzThis dude in the sauna with a paper and Jobs on the front pageJan 28 21:11
MinceROpenMoko is dead or doomed because they don't support UMTSJan 28 21:11
schestowitzI thought about that picture with 4 iphones combined and chuckledJan 28 21:11
schestowitz4  times dumberJan 28 21:11
schestowitz4 dumb stations with *NEW* *NEW* copy & paste..Jan 28 21:11
MinceR4 times heavier and bulkierJan 28 21:11
schestowitzTo replace a computer with keyboard and real appsJan 28 21:12
Chips_B_MalroyI suspect that both Jobs and Ballmer will be gone soon as CEO'sJan 28 21:12
MinceRi doubt that the cult could do withough jobsJan 28 21:12
MinceRthey've built a cult of personality for himJan 28 21:12
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: when Apple slowsJan 28 21:12
schestowitzLike with BillGJan 28 21:12
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Verified By Visa and MasterCard SecureCode may actually be used to fund terrorism, do nothing to stop identity theft 28 21:12
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #FCC apparently is anti-Net Neutrality, wtf? 28 21:12
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #iPhone OS allows VoIP officially, but still can't multitask to actually let you use it #apple #douchebagsJan 28 21:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: 3D Secure online payment system not secure, researchers say - security - PC World .::. Size~: 116.58 KBJan 28 21:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: FCC's Net Neutrality Plan Would Permit Blocking of BitTorrent | Electronic Frontier Foundation .::. Size~: 19.49 KBJan 28 21:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Slashdot Apple Story | With New SDK, VoIP Over 3G Apps Now Working On iPhone .::. Size~: 139.23 KBJan 28 21:12
schestowitzPearly wanted to be SEEN as leaving on a high noteJan 28 21:12
schestowitzBut he realised that to get his orgasm he'll need new monopolies that go up, not downJan 28 21:13
Chips_B_MalroyJobs just has had too many health problemsJan 28 21:13
schestowitzHe's not a computer guyJan 28 21:13
schestowitzHe never wasJan 28 21:13
schestowitzSo he snak his teeth on Monsanto and stuffJan 28 21:13
Chips_B_MalroyI don't wish him badJan 28 21:13
MinceRi doJan 28 21:13
schestowitzNow they build an uber-mansion for the Gates Investfirm Firm(TM)Jan 28 21:13
schestowitzThey probably will decorate it with photos of hungry black kidsJan 28 21:14
MinceRnone of these criminals can possibly suffer as much as the damage they've caused to othersJan 28 21:14
schestowitzPerfect disguise for ehite-collar crimeJan 28 21:14
schestowitzSteal the world's food, make it seem like charityJan 28 21:14
schestowitzThere are some good storyline/move plots that go like thisJan 28 21:14
schestowitzConstant GardnerJan 28 21:14
schestowitzShocking filmJan 28 21:14
schestowitzMade me uneayf for daysJan 28 21:14
schestowitzPhramas... like the one Gates is investing in ans shilling on... experimenting with 'cheap' life in AfricaJan 28 21:15
schestowitzSlow news day today... relatievly speakingJan 28 21:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] JD Salinger, author of Catcher in the Rye, owner of giant brass balls, dies at 91 28 21:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #Google wants to fix DNS load balancing correctly, yay 28 21:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Challenger accident happened 24 years ago, 7 brave men and women died doing what they loved #scienceJan 28 21:17
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #Apple #iPad is not only shit, but DRM laden shit (more so than usual) 28 21:17
schestowitzWhys o serious...? 28 21:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC News - JD Salinger, author of Catcher in the Rye, dies at 91 .::. Size~: 49.76 KBJan 28 21:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Google Code Blog: A proposal to extend the DNS protocol .::. Size~: 112.99 KBJan 28 21:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle: 24th anniversary of the Challenger disaster Boing Boing .::. Size~: 112.26 KBJan 28 21:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Linux Today - The iPad is potentially one of the most important, culture-changing products in history! .::. Size~: 95.23 KBJan 28 21:17
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Linux Foundation to World: Get a Job! | ITworld .::. Size~: 87.53 KBJan 28 21:17
*amd-linux (i=54390eae@gateway/web/freenode/x-ovfmlxaarxfotvhv) has joined #boycottnovellJan 28 21:19
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phIRCe-BNcTitle: KDE - KDE Software Compilation 4.3.5 Release Announcement .::. Size~: 15.6 KBJan 28 21:20
amd-linuxhello roy, are the ms results for this quarter already out? Jan 28 21:21
schestowitz 28 21:22
phIRCe-BNcTitle:   9 Hilarious USB keys : .::. Size~: 63.78 KBJan 28 21:22
Chips_B_Malroy    "One thing we have got to change in our strategy - allowing Office documents to be rendered very well by other peoples browsers is one of the most destructive things we could do to the company. We have to stop putting any effort into this and make sure that Office documents very well depends on PROPRIETARY IE capabilities."Jan 28 21:22
schestowitzamd-linux: I don't knowJan 28 21:22
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Bill Gates - Wikiquote .::. Size~: 48.09 KBJan 28 21:22
schestowitzI don't think they will be interetsing, eitherJan 28 21:23
schestowitzThey'll be out no earlier than 5 or 4:30 SETJan 28 21:23
schestowitzThen comes the press releaseJan 28 21:23
*_Goblin has quit ("Lost terminal")Jan 28 21:23
schestowitzThen the sheepleJan 28 21:23
schestowitzThe first people to just copy the press releaseJan 28 21:23
schestowitzAnd say... "fmnkldsnfkldsnfkln," according to MicrosoftJan 28 21:23
schestowitzSpinner "yes men"Jan 28 21:24
schestowitz"Internet Explorer is the most secure," according to MicrosoftJan 28 21:24
schestowitz"Vista is loved by all," according to MicrosoftJan 28 21:25
amd-linux 28 21:25
schestowitz"Gates is a philanthropist," according to MicrosoftJan 28 21:25
amd-linuxpublished a few seconds agoJan 28 21:25
*_Goblin ( has joined #boycottnovellJan 28 21:26
schestowitzamd-linux: improper comparisonsJan 28 21:26
schestowitz“This is a record quarter for Windows units"Jan 28 21:26
schestowitzNotice that ignore the other divisionsJan 28 21:26
schestowitzCause they had a new releaseJan 28 21:27
schestowitzAs expectedJan 28 21:27
schestowitzTheir CFO quitJan 28 21:27
amd-linuxwell it is the typical corporate talkJan 28 21:27
Chips_B_MalroyRemember, if you go back two quarters, that MS withheld Windows Seven revenue, to add in this quarter I believeJan 28 21:27
amd-linuxlets see what analysts say. and why they are so quiet about the rest of their portfolioJan 28 21:27
schestowitzamd-linux: MSFT shares were down 2% todayJan 28 21:28
schestowitzAfter hours they barely moveJan 28 21:28
schestowitzThat's tellingJan 28 21:28
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: last quarter WIndows income was down 50%Jan 28 21:29
schestowitz40%Jan 28 21:29
schestowitzIt suits their lie this time aroundJan 28 21:29
schestowitzThe illusion of sales successJan 28 21:29
schestowitz"MSFT‎   -0.51‎ (-1.72%‎)  "Jan 28 21:29
schestowitz 28 21:30
schestowitzSome people don't like DKE4, I guesJan 28 21:30
phIRCe-BNcTitle: The Russell Family .::. Size~: 56.37 KBJan 28 21:30
Chips_B_MalroyGates you have to understand some, from a moral standpoint.  I don't believe he really had a moral upbringing, or religion played any role in it.   Gates quote:  " Just in terms of allocation of time resources, religion is not very efficient. There's a lot more I could be doing on a Sunday morning. "Jan 28 21:31
Chips_B_MalroyNow myself I don't go to chuch on sunday morning.  But one thing I have noticedJan 28 21:32
schestowitzHoly *. Bit fonts: 20 Ubuntu Karmic AnnoyancesJan 28 21:32
schestowitz 28 21:32
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: he doesn't sleep muchJan 28 21:33
schestowitzBut he's trying to unrich himself by all means possible by telling himself he helpsJan 28 21:33
schestowitzTyrants always think that wayJan 28 21:33
Chips_B_MalroyAs people become old.  and they know their time is limited, many become religious, because of the promise of the afterlife.  Gates I think, is not a believer at all.  Neither do  I think he got morals from early exposure to religion.Jan 28 21:33
schestowitzEven history's most vicious onesJan 28 21:33
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: making statements like that is not politically wise in the USJan 28 21:34
Chips_B_Malroytrue, be you know I don't careJan 28 21:34
Chips_B_MalroyI say it like I see itJan 28 21:34
schestowitzEven my own relatives in the US believes in an invisible manJan 28 21:34
schestowitz*believeJan 28 21:34
schestowitzBut I don't roll my eyesJan 28 21:35
Chips_B_MalroyIt was not really a statement about religion, but about what Gates thinks, and why he does the thinks he doesJan 28 21:35
schestowitzIt's not fun ending up in a disucssion where they feel insultedJan 28 21:35
schestowitzFor the same reason I won't bother becoming LInux support guy by migrating friends to itJan 28 21:36
schestowitzUnless they themselves choose to do itJan 28 21:36
Chips_B_MalroyReligion does in many ways provide the basic for many people's moral standard.  But in Gates case, I think religion failed.Jan 28 21:36
schestowitzHe has no moralsJan 28 21:36
schestowitzBut he preaches "Jihad"Jan 28 21:36
Chips_B_Malroywe agreeJan 28 21:36
schestowitzI guess "Jihad" to him means something elseJan 28 21:36
schestowitzLike destroying all those "Evil" companies like Netscape.... and LinuxJan 28 21:37
schestowitz"LUNIX" he called itJan 28 21:37
Chips_B_Malroyit means crushing all those who stand in his way of more powerJan 28 21:37
schestowitzThere's this picture where he bears a Nazi-like flagJan 28 21:37
schestowitzThat's kind of how he thinksJan 28 21:37
schestowitzThey too had this Utopian elitist view of the worldJan 28 21:37
schestowitzWe are angles, so we need everyone to be our mirrorJan 28 21:38
schestowitzMicrosoft is the sameJan 28 21:38
schestowitzWe must admire COM, C#, Silver Lie.......Jan 28 21:38
schestowitz"Follow Microsoft and life will be gold....."Jan 28 21:38
schestowitzGo to schoolJan 28 21:38
schestowitzLearn WIndowsJan 28 21:38
schestowitz"Microsoft Youth"Jan 28 21:38
Chips_B_MalroyMy guess is Bill is an aethist.  Not that all aethists are bad.   But in Bill's case, he did not get a moral value from his lack of religion.  He grew up where Lawyers were repected by winning and getting rich, those are his values.Jan 28 21:39
schestowitz"Some people will object to the deal automatically, because, last year, Microsoft emerged as one of Yahoo!'s major partners. As I write, I am sure that others are already reflexively ranting about how Ubuntu is inching closer to Microsoft, citing its use of Mono applications as further proof of this alleged trend. "Jan 28 21:39
MinceRmikro$oftjugend?Jan 28 21:39
schestowitz 28 21:39
schestowitzBruce trivialises it? I dunnnnno.......Jan 28 21:39
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: yesJan 28 21:40
schestowitzBut you're implying ethics shall come from religionJan 28 21:40
schestowitzI disagreeJan 28 21:40
schestowitzRMS has ethics and he's an atheistsJan 28 21:40
schestowitzOr realistJan 28 21:40
schestowitzIt depends on upbringingJan 28 21:40
MinceR(or is that mikro$chlapp?)Jan 28 21:40
schestowitzIMHO, Gates grew up in a greedy environment and to win endorsement from his Gates (who shares the same name) he needs to rob more peopleJan 28 21:41
schestowitzIt's a currency of powerJan 28 21:41
schestowitzWe need to eradicate greedJan 28 21:41
schestowitzIt's not a problem of theismJan 28 21:41
Chips_B_MalroyIt seem that I am implying that, but not really.  Humanists are another form of ethics, Philosphy, emphany.Jan 28 21:41
schestowitzJust a sick mentalityJan 28 21:41
amd-linuxMS earning in one sentence: everything down excpet win 7: 28 21:41
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsoft's bottom line gets a Windows 7 boost | Beyond Binary - CNET News .::. Size~: 72.3 KBJan 28 21:41
amd-linuxexceptJan 28 21:41
schestowitzThere's this documenatry about the Russian mafia I watched last weekJan 28 21:41
schestowitzOne of the guys there, "Tarzan", is mentally ill for his love for moneyJan 28 21:42
schestowitzHe says he must make a lot of money, even if it means crimeJan 28 21:42
schestowitzHe said he'd go anywhere to do itJan 28 21:42
schestowitzTo the cameaJan 28 21:42
Chips_B_Malroywhat I do imply, is the masses, do get mostly their only values from religion.  It is possilble to get from other sources as well.Jan 28 21:42
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] More truth about the #Apple #iPad 28 21:42
schestowitzHe went to Russian to buy a nuclearn submarine to smuggle drugs from ColobiaJan 28 21:42
schestowitzThe FBI busted himJan 28 21:42
schestowitz /Russian/Russia/Jan 28 21:42
schestowitzamd-linux: Ina Fried is Microsoft puppetJan 28 21:43
schestowitzI hate even linking to "it"Jan 28 21:43
amd-linux:-) I know, but it was the "best" summary I could find until now.... the rest of the current articles is just recycking of MS trash talkJan 28 21:44
schestowitz 28 21:44
Chips_B_MalroyThe puppets can be usefull idiots at times, when they say something wrong about M$ by accidentJan 28 21:44
phIRCe-BNcTitle: MonitoringForge: Network Management Software .::. Size~: 46.99 KBJan 28 21:44
amd-linuxrecyclingJan 28 21:44
schestowitzamd-linux: I'll write about it maybe in the weekendJan 28 21:44
schestowitzBut this one is simpleJan 28 21:44
schestowitzThere might be more layoffs comingJan 28 21:45
Chips_B_MalroyI loved quoting Andre when he stepped in itJan 28 21:45
Chips_B_MalroyRoy, I think soJan 28 21:45
schestowitzDid they fire him too?Jan 28 21:45
schestowitzHe's just in Twitter nowJan 28 21:45
*stavrosLinux (n=Stavros@ has left #boycottnovellJan 28 21:45
schestowitzThey fired their shill Don DodgeJan 28 21:45
schestowitzHe had to dodge themJan 28 21:45
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schestowitzHe didn't shill hard enough, so he got the bootJan 28 21:45
schestowitzThey didn't get their money's worth off him :-)Jan 28 21:46
MinceRso where do failed shills go? :)Jan 28 21:47
MinceRwill they learn honesty? :>Jan 28 21:48
Chips_B_MalroyMinceR> failed shills, like Andre just create more sock puppetsJan 28 21:48
MinceRicJan 28 21:49
MinceRwill the sockpuppets get funding?Jan 28 21:50
Chips_B_MalroyThe names were changed to protect M$.  Sorry I had to rip off Dagnet TV showJan 28 21:50
MinceRthe names were changed to protect the guilty :>Jan 28 21:50
Chips_B_Malroy*DragnetJan 28 21:50
Chips_B_MalroyMinceR> same thingJan 28 21:51
_GoblinAndre "Its a shame Michael Jackson didn't live to see Windows 7" Da Co$taJan 28 21:51
Chips_B_MalroyThis quarter is MS attempt to lie about its profits, by various schemes.  One is adding in the Windows Seven revenue that was withheld from 2 quarters.  Ballmer needs a good quarter or there will be a shareholder revolt.Jan 28 21:52
Chips_B_MalroyBallmer is pulling out all the stops this quarter to keep his jobJan 28 21:53
MinceRhow much control do shareholders outside the inner circle (gates, ballmer, allen and their pals) have over m$?Jan 28 21:54
schestowitz 28 21:54
phIRCe-BNcTitle: A Look at KDE 4.4 .::. Size~: 34.23 KBJan 28 21:54
schestowitzHere is the Real Vista 7Jan 28 21:54
schestowitzWithout the viruses and bloatJan 28 21:54
Chips_B_MalroyGoblin> hear much from Andre these days?  He was a good laugh sometimes.Jan 28 21:54
schestowitzWIndows Mobile-deadJan 28 21:54
schestowitzWInMob-deadJan 28 21:54
schestowitzThere's also a death of ZunePinkDanger comingJan 28 21:55
MinceRit's really insulting to call KDE that, you knowJan 28 21:55
schestowitzAnd the world goes mobile and SaaSJan 28 21:55
Chips_B_MalroyRoy, WinMo is dead on cellphones only.Jan 28 21:55
_GoblinHe's popped up on my blog a couple of times.Jan 28 21:55
MinceRKDE is easily flexible enough to make windows look like osxJan 28 21:55
schestowitzMinceR: it's insulting they copied kde4Jan 28 21:55
Chips_B_MalroyHoping WinMO (CE) will lose on ARM Smartbooks as wellJan 28 21:55
_GoblinAndre seems to be less active (under his known alias's)Jan 28 21:55
MinceRi think it's almost certain that wince will lose on smartbooks tooJan 28 21:56
schestowitzMaybe he's Mr. Eee nowJan 28 21:56
schestowitzNext up: Mr. Fee :-)Jan 28 21:56
schestowitzTime to pay up the shillJan 28 21:56
schestowitzDee is oustedJan 28 21:56
Chips_B_MalroyGoblin, he has to use sock puppets now, as he has been exposed and is an embarrasment to MSJan 28 21:56
Chips_B_Malroyadacosta is another one\Jan 28 21:57
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MinceRMr. EefJan 28 21:59
MinceRshould have started with Mr. AaaJan 28 21:59
Chips_B_MalroyMinceR>  winCE I am not convinced will lose here in the USA.  It could be another dumping scheme by MS to keep users from trying LinuxJan 28 21:59
Chips_B_Malroyon ARM smartbooks that isJan 28 22:00
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MinceRso they aren't trying to succeed, only to block the customers from getting smartbooks with gnu/linuxJan 28 22:01
MinceRthat's going to cost m$ a lot :>Jan 28 22:02
Chips_B_Malroyagreed, but M$ has to protect the home mature markets when most of its revenue comes fromJan 28 22:03
DaemonFCheh, why am I listening to Eminem?Jan 28 22:03
DaemonFCsinging along no lessJan 28 22:03
DaemonFCtaking joy in quality lyrics like "wouldn't piss on fire to put you out"Jan 28 22:04
DaemonFCand what is it doing on my radio channel, and where did I memorize this?Jan 28 22:05
Chips_B_MalroyLook now that WinMo version 7 is not due to come out until the same appoximate time as Google Chrome OS.Jan 28 22:05
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wispygalaxywhat's up?Jan 28 22:06
Chips_B_MalroyMy understanding is, tht Chrome OS is for smartbooks, and Android is for cellphones.Jan 28 22:06
DaemonFCMPEG-4 OSJan 28 22:06
DiabloD3thats not quite rightJan 28 22:06
wispygalaxyi think android might go on netbooks, tooJan 28 22:07
DiabloD3chromeos is converting to android as wellJan 28 22:07
Chips_B_MalroySo the timing of the WinMo 7 is to compete with Chrome OS and not Android OSJan 28 22:07
DiabloD3they only used "real" linux because they needed 3D accel, ie, X, because Wayland doesnt do it (yet, but its being worked on)Jan 28 22:07
wispygalaxyroy, are you here?Jan 28 22:07
DiabloD3so android and chromeos will only be UI methodologies instead of operating systems (they'll both be androidy underneath)Jan 28 22:07
Chips_B_MalroyDiabloDe> agreed, but there is still a bit of a separation currently in the destinatioin of each so farJan 28 22:08
Chips_B_Malroysorry, for typo, DiabloD3Jan 28 22:09
DiabloD3yes, the destination is differentJan 28 22:09
DiabloD3but the power of android is the OSJan 28 22:09
DiabloD3not just the UI.Jan 28 22:09
Chips_B_Malroythe destination is the device they were intended to go onJan 28 22:10
Chips_B_Malroysome apps and programs are for laptops (smarbooks) and some are for the small screen cellphones, that is one of the differencesJan 28 22:11
DiabloD3yes, but all devices are the same thingJan 28 22:11
Chips_B_Malroycan beJan 28 22:11
DiabloD3cell phones arent these shitty little embedded turds anymoreJan 28 22:11
Chips_B_Malroyin theoryJan 28 22:11
DiabloD3so its now more related to use case than anything elseJan 28 22:12
DiabloD3like, the difference between a cell phone and a 10 foot UI is very littleJan 28 22:12
DiabloD3even though they're used for radically different thingsJan 28 22:12
Chips_B_Malroysome things just work better on the bigger screen and keyboardJan 28 22:12
ml2mstwispygalaxy: nice to see you again, miss you in COLAJan 28 22:13
wispygalaxyhi marti!Jan 28 22:13
DiabloD3Chips_B_Malroy: yesJan 28 22:13
DaemonFCand this is, by far, the most *BANG*Jan 28 22:14
wispygalaxyi'll be back in COLA, i just need to find a way to sign my postsJan 28 22:14
DiabloD3its largely the difference between a "computer" interface and a "human" interfaceJan 28 22:14
DaemonFCincredible thing I've ever heard.....Jan 28 22:14
wispygalaxyi hope that im still not being forged in COLAJan 28 22:14
ml2mstwispygalaxy: unfortunately yes you are. On of the trolls is already forging youJan 28 22:15
MinceR230116 < DaemonFC> taking joy in quality lyrics like "wouldn't piss on fire to put you out"Jan 28 22:15
MinceRwhat's wrong with that?Jan 28 22:15
wispygalaxyi wonder who it is??Jan 28 22:15
wispygalaxywho would forge meJan 28 22:15
DaemonFCMinceR: Nothing I guessJan 28 22:15
wispygalaxyroy did say that if im beingf forged, i must be doing something good for linux advocacyJan 28 22:15
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DaemonFCthe fact that I haven't shot anyone yet probably affirms my fitness for gun ownership , MinceRJan 28 22:16
MinceRDiabloD3: so you figure they'll dumb down chrome os even further?Jan 28 22:16
DaemonFCthat's my theoryJan 28 22:16
MinceRDaemonFC: do you have a gun?Jan 28 22:16
ml2mstwispygalaxy: it's probably the "clogwog" he does that to everyone who has the audacity to write positive about GNU/LinuxJan 28 22:16
DaemonFCMinceR: severalJan 28 22:16
wispygalaxyi thought so, marti :PJan 28 22:16
MinceRDaemonFC: still not too convincing :>Jan 28 22:16
wispygalaxyany new trolls in COLA?Jan 28 22:17
DaemonFCwere I to risk going to prison over my ex, I'd use the 20 gaugeJan 28 22:17
DaemonFCand that's theoreticalJan 28 22:17
ml2mstwispygalaxy: don't worry ;-)Jan 28 22:17
wispygalaxyhahaJan 28 22:17
DaemonFCI just got a letter that our restraining orders on each other have expiredJan 28 22:17
MinceR:)Jan 28 22:17
DaemonFC:)Jan 28 22:17
ml2mstwispygalaxy: No, the same old crowd, only nymshifting and nymstealing as usual.Jan 28 22:18
DaemonFChe made up some shit to get a restraining order on me so I made up some shit to get one on himJan 28 22:18
DaemonFCthat way he wouldn't be tempted to come near me and say I was the one that violated the orderJan 28 22:18
DaemonFCwe'd both be sitting in jailJan 28 22:18
wispygalaxyand the trolls say that i nymshift!Jan 28 22:18
wispygalaxyi have been posting under the same nameJan 28 22:19
ml2mstwispygalaxy: I understand, I was pissed when Clogwog started forging me, but over time you'll get used to it (well sort of)Jan 28 22:19
DaemonFCMinceR: So like "If you come near me and make me violate your order, we're both fucked, so don't do it"Jan 28 22:19
wispygalaxyi can spot the forgers pretty easily, so i check headersJan 28 22:19
DaemonFCI'm just cautious like thatJan 28 22:19
wispygalaxyi dont like it when they forge roy, tooJan 28 22:19
DaemonFCso then he used the police to harass me, tried to anywayJan 28 22:20
wispygalaxyit's libel.  they can't debate his points, so they resort to attacking him personallyJan 28 22:20
DaemonFCtried to come here accusing me of stealing a check of his out of the mailJan 28 22:20
MinceRdo you use PGP or GPG against forgery?Jan 28 22:20
wispygalaxyno i havent yetJan 28 22:20
wispygalaxybut i will soonJan 28 22:20
DaemonFCwhich I countered by pressing charges on him of filing a false police report against meJan 28 22:20
ml2mstwispygalaxy: of course they do. They parrot everything one saids. Now the GNU/Linux users are "sheeple" for example.Jan 28 22:20
wispygalaxythe trolls keep "mee tooing" each otherJan 28 22:21
DaemonFCwhich in Indiana is a Class C Misdemeanor, and he ended up getting 30 days and a $500 fine over lying about me to the policeJan 28 22:21
wispygalaxyat least we can see past their idiocyJan 28 22:21
ml2mstGood tip by MinceR, both Roy and me already use GPG.Jan 28 22:22
wispygalaxyit's very secureJan 28 22:22
wispygalaxyim trying to figure out how to do it in knodeJan 28 22:22
wispygalaxyhow did roy do itJan 28 22:22
schestowitzHeyJan 28 22:22
schestowitzLet me catch upJan 28 22:22
wispygalaxyhi roy!Jan 28 22:22
schestowitzHold on...Jan 28 22:23
wispygalaxyok :)Jan 28 22:23
Chips_B_MalroyBill Gates:  "You see, antiquated ideas of kindness and generosity are simply bugs that must be programmed out of our world. And these cold, unfeeling machines will show us the way. "Jan 28 22:23
*schestowitz sees that DaemonFOX has a crush on Marshall MathersJan 28 22:23
wispygalaxydid he really sat that?  it goes against what his foundation stands forJan 28 22:23
wispygalaxysay*Jan 28 22:24
DaemonFC:DJan 28 22:24
wispygalaxyeminem?Jan 28 22:24
Chips_B_Malroy 28 22:24
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Bill Gates Quotes .::. Size~: 11.74 KBJan 28 22:24
wispygalaxythanks, chipsJan 28 22:24
wispygalaxymy sister has 2 eminem CDs :PJan 28 22:24
schestowitzwispygalaxy: no, you'e not being forged anymoreJan 28 22:25
wispygalaxygoodyJan 28 22:25
schestowitzNot since the incidents you caughtJan 28 22:25
wispygalaxyactually, i saw that i was forged again a few times this monthJan 28 22:25
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ml2mstwispygalaxy: Roy is back, I think he uses Knode as well. I think he can help you setting up GPG in Knode.Jan 28 22:25
wispygalaxythat sounds goodJan 28 22:25
wispygalaxyroy, do you know how to do PGPJan 28 22:26
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Chips_B_Malroy<wispygalaxy>  Goblin and I were impersonated many times before on MS WatchJan 28 22:26
DaemonFCschestowitz: I just got a few Apocalyptica albumsJan 28 22:26
schestowitzMinceR: yes, I use PGPJan 28 22:26
DaemonFCthey're pretty good (at least Worlds Collide was, haven't listened to the rest)Jan 28 22:26
wispygalaxythe trolls want to make us look bad, chipsJan 28 22:26
schestowitzIt takes longer to post, but I had to do it when forging became too commonplace around 2007Jan 28 22:26
wispygalaxyi havent been over to MS watch, yetJan 28 22:26
wispygalaxyok, ill take that into account, royJan 28 22:27
wispygalaxydo you need to go to a special website for a key?Jan 28 22:27
wispygalaxylemme open knode...Jan 28 22:27
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: weird quote from PearlyG that one.....Jan 28 22:27
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schestowitz"..antiquated ideas of kindness and generosity are simply bugs that must be programmed out of our world."--PearlyJan 28 22:27
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wispygalaxywas that quote on the record?Jan 28 22:28
schestowitzwispygalaxy: you need to create a key in KDEJan 28 22:28
Chips_B_Malroy<wispygalaxy> MS Watch is dead mostly.  Its an astroid, barren of life, and thought.  The shills/trolls impersonate when they have nothing else left, and use profanity too.Jan 28 22:28
schestowitzThen it's available for you to use in knodeJan 28 22:28
schestowitzIt should not be hardJan 28 22:28
MinceR*gasp* profanity!Jan 28 22:28
MinceR:>Jan 28 22:28
wispygalaxyok, thanks for the info, chips.  ill still look around out of curiosityJan 28 22:28
schestowitzSearch for the KDE documentation on creating keys... I haven't done that for 6 yearsJan 28 22:29
wispygalaxyyou're telling me to RTFM?!Jan 28 22:29
wispygalaxyjkJan 28 22:29
Chips_B_MalroyIf they cannot debate and win, they try to distractJan 28 22:29
schestowitzwispygalaxy: I don't knowJan 28 22:29
schestowitzThere are some fake quotes from PEarlyJan 28 22:29
Chips_B_Malroyor bury a thought of fact with spamJan 28 22:29
Chips_B_Malroyyes, there are some fakes quotesJan 28 22:30
wispygalaxyso they're forging bill, too?Jan 28 22:30
schestowitzA better one would be: "..antiquated ideas of wunderkind and genocide are simply bugs that must be programmed inyo of our world."Jan 28 22:30
schestowitzKill African kids while pretending to be a heroJan 28 22:30
wispygalaxy:(Jan 28 22:30
schestowitzI suppose most people don't know how his money is used to murder kids for oilJan 28 22:30
wispygalaxyit's all PR stuffJan 28 22:31
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: MS Watch is obsoleteJan 28 22:31
schestowitzNothing links to itJan 28 22:31
wispygalaxynow, they link to you. roy :)Jan 28 22:31
schestowitzIt's just a notepad.exe 4 NickJan 28 22:31
wispygalaxyyou are the cornerstone for linux and MS newsJan 28 22:31
schestowitzWilcox was at least intresting sometimesJan 28 22:31
schestowitzwispygalaxy: no ftfm, I just don't know how without checkingJan 28 22:32
schestowitzkpgp is what I usedJan 28 22:32
wispygalaxyim kidding roy :)Jan 28 22:32
schestowitzBut I think it's phased out by nowJan 28 22:32
wispygalaxywhat should i do now??Jan 28 22:32
wispygalaxyshould i still use your methodJan 28 22:32
Chips_B_MalroyThis quote of Gates is my favorate, if it is his:  "I have 100 billion dollars... You realize I could spend 3 million dollars a day, every day, for the next 100 years? And that's if I don't make another dime. Tell you what-I'll buy your right arm for a million dollars. I give you a million bucks, and I get to sever your arm right here." 28 22:32
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Bill Gates Quotes .::. Size~: 11.74 KBJan 28 22:32
DaemonFCschestowitz: True evil never dies, it changes name and mailing address from time to timeJan 28 22:32
schestowitzwispygalaxy: it prompts you to create a key if you have noneJan 28 22:33
schestowitzkde 4.3?Jan 28 22:33
wispygalaxynot yetJan 28 22:33
wispygalaxyim switching soon thoughJan 28 22:33
wispygalaxyim too lazy to upgradeJan 28 22:33
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: are you sure these are real quotes?Jan 28 22:33
MinceRand then people say gates should be allowed to liveJan 28 22:34
schestowitzI got 'poisoned' by satirical onesJan 28 22:34
DaemonFClmaoJan 28 22:34
DaemonFCschestowitz: I'll give you 47 cents from the top of my desk if I can sever your armJan 28 22:34
DaemonFCright hereJan 28 22:34
DaemonFCcome on!Jan 28 22:34
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: find out which publication or somethingJan 28 22:34
schestowitzMisatributions are annoyingJan 28 22:34
schestowitzLike people who faked me insulting peopleJan 28 22:34
schestowitzANd then those people showing I was rude and radical, for something forgers said under my nameJan 28 22:35
schestowitzVery annoyingJan 28 22:35
wispygalaxyawwwJan 28 22:35
wispygalaxybut we know you, royJan 28 22:35
wispygalaxyyou arent vulgar or rudeJan 28 22:35
wispygalaxyi can tell if someone's forging youJan 28 22:35
Chips_B_MalroyRoy, it like everything on the internet.  But wikiquotes is maybe your best source of the fake ones.  I you quote, don't quote bill directly, but the site that quoted him.  look at misatributedJan 28 22:35
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Bill Gates - Wikiquote .::. Size~: 48.09 KBJan 28 22:35
schestowitz 28 22:36
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Bruce Byfield Misattributes Quotes (Updatedx4) | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 106.1 KBJan 28 22:36
schestowitzThere were like 5 accoutns impersoning me in trying to sell people the impression that I was gay, rude, etc.Jan 28 22:36
wispygalaxyi remember bruce byfieldJan 28 22:36
MinceRi remember when byfield wasn't so blatantly anti-FLOSSJan 28 22:36
DaemonFCthe ones from Linus Torvalds are always so sarcastic, offensive, and condescending, it's probably easy to make some fakes for himJan 28 22:36
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: wikiquotes got poisoned tooJan 28 22:37
DaemonFCand go totally unnoticed Jan 28 22:37
schestowitzLike when this dude died last yearJan 28 22:37
schestowitzAnd some school kid put a fake quote in itJan 28 22:37
schestowitzThen many papers quoted thatJan 28 22:37
Chips_B_MalroyI used that one quote about Bill and severing an ARM on MS Watch a couple of times, and the shills had no reply.   So maybe it is his.Jan 28 22:37
schestowitzMisattributedJan 28 22:37
wispygalaxydidnt byfield do an interview with you, roy?Jan 28 22:37
wispygalaxyon linux.comJan 28 22:37
schestowitzIt became a big anti-WIKIPEDIA storyJan 28 22:37
DaemonFCschestowitz: Did they at least do a retraction on page 43, 10 days later?Jan 28 22:37
DaemonFC;)Jan 28 22:37
schestowitzwispygalaxy: ages agoJan 28 22:37
schestowitzI was there with 4 people all of whom diagreeJan 28 22:38
wispygalaxyi still remember that Jan 28 22:38
schestowitzMicrosoft apoligosim echo chamber IMHOJan 28 22:38
wispygalaxygnome dudes?>Jan 28 22:38
schestowitzIncluding Novell's de ICaza, Microsoft MVPJan 28 22:38
schestowitza "caller"Jan 28 22:38
schestowitzHehe.Jan 28 22:38
wispygalaxyoh yeahJan 28 22:38
DaemonFCschestowitz: That's the problem with newspapers, when they lie or fuck up and get called on it, they wait a couple weeks and print the retraction in the back of the paperJan 28 22:38
DaemonFCthere's almost no accountability at allJan 28 22:39
wispygalaxythat's why letting comments on news articles speeds up the porcessJan 28 22:39
wispygalaxyonlineJan 28 22:39
DaemonFCafter all the people that read that paper have all absorbed the original article as pure truth and moved onJan 28 22:39
DaemonFCand will never see the retractionJan 28 22:39
schestowitz 28 22:39
schestowitzWatch the middleJan 28 22:39
schestowitzWhere he calls them on the setupJan 28 22:40
wispygalaxythat's too bad that we cant trust newspapers 100%Jan 28 22:40
schestowitzSurrounding him with "no men"Jan 28 22:40
DaemonFCwispygalaxy: No, accepting comments on news articles is the worst thing that can happenJan 28 22:40
wispygalaxythanks for the YT link, royJan 28 22:40
wispygalaxywhy, daemonFC?Jan 28 22:40
DaemonFCIt's like telling the crazies "come out, come out, wherever you are!"Jan 28 22:40
wispygalaxythe trolls ruin the commentsJan 28 22:40
wispygalaxyso there cant be a good discussionJan 28 22:40
DaemonFCexactly, so there is no way anyone wil lread through the 147 posts comparing Obama to Hitler to get to the comment telling them they messed part of the article upJan 28 22:41
DaemonFC:)Jan 28 22:41
wispygalaxyhahaJan 28 22:41
wispygalaxyid try to do ctrl+f for "messed up"Jan 28 22:42
wispygalaxymaybe that will help?Jan 28 22:42
wispygalaxyor "error in article"Jan 28 22:42
DaemonFC"Obama totally messed up, he's like StalinHitler, RAAAARRRRGH!!!!!!"Jan 28 22:42
DaemonFC-Anncoulter67Jan 28 22:42
wispygalaxylolJan 28 22:42
wispygalaxyor glenbeck45Jan 28 22:42
DaemonFCStalinHitlerChavezAhmadinejad evenJan 28 22:43
DaemonFCRush LimbaughJan 28 22:43
DaemonFCB-)Jan 28 22:43
wispygalaxyhehJan 28 22:43
schestowitzwispygalaxy: no problemJan 28 22:44
wispygalaxynow im figuring out how to do gpg on kdeJan 28 22:44
wispygalaxyroy:  :)Jan 28 22:45
wispygalaxydo i need to download anything for pgp?Jan 28 22:45
schestowitzMaybe. KDE 3.5?Jan 28 22:45
wispygalaxyyepJan 28 22:45
schestowitzThere's a wizardJan 28 22:45
ml2mst jono: how are you?Jan 28 22:45
wispygalaxysoon it'll be kde 4Jan 28 22:45
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wispygalaxyi just need to backup my stuffJan 28 22:45
schestowitzI can't check now cause I'm on wonderful kde4Jan 28 22:45
wispygalaxyim jealousJan 28 22:46
MinceR:DJan 28 22:46
DaemonFCwispygalaxy: "You know Obama messed up when he started bargaining with the devil, true story. Right there in the Oval Office. Obama said 'I just want to get healthcare through' and Satan said 'Yeah, sure, youbetcha!' and clicked his ruby red slippers three times and went back down into hell with the homosexuals and women's movement leaders."Jan 28 22:46
DaemonFC-Pat RobertsonJan 28 22:46
schestowitzwispygalaxy: it coms with ponies and everythingJan 28 22:46
oiaohm;col1 Hmm when is the 2q sharemarket report.Jan 28 22:46
oiaohmFor MSJan 28 22:46
wispygalaxylol daemonJan 28 22:47
jonoml2mst, hey!Jan 28 22:47
jonoon a call atmJan 28 22:47
wispygalaxyroy, pink ponies?!Jan 28 22:47
wispygalaxymy iceweasel is still pinkJan 28 22:47
ml2mstjono: ok ;-)Jan 28 22:47
schestowitzoiaohm: so ZDNet advertise Microsoft presentationsJan 28 22:47
schestowitzNo surprise therJan 28 22:47
schestowitzwispygalaxy: I can't do pinkJan 28 22:48
schestowitzTHen people would wrongly think I'm a homosexualJan 28 22:48
oiaohmNow the problem is it not true until is on the stock exchange schestowitzJan 28 22:48
schestowitzThere is nothing wrong with pink, BTWJan 28 22:48
schestowitzNot with homosexualsJan 28 22:48
schestowitzBut I don't wear dresses or tubans either, because there's something about what people wear and carry that sends messagesJan 28 22:49
oiaohmI remember the big E report before they had to report to stock exchange.Jan 28 22:49
schestowitz /Not/Nor/Jan 28 22:49
wispygalaxypink used to be a color for boys, and blue was for girls... then around 1950, it swtiched.  learned that in sociology classJan 28 22:49
schestowitz*turbansJan 28 22:49
schestowitzDamn, my spellchecker keeps going offJan 28 22:49
DaemonFCwispygalaxy: Was the strap-on invented in 1950?Jan 28 22:49
wispygalaxyidk lolJan 28 22:49
DaemonFCcould explain the chain of eventsJan 28 22:49
wispygalaxyi forget why, but it was after WWIIJan 28 22:49
DaemonFCwhoever has the penis is the dominant members of society Jan 28 22:50
schestowitzChemical weapons from the war made fertilisersJan 28 22:50
DaemonFCthe strap-on was the great equalizerJan 28 22:50
schestowitzInnovation through deathsJan 28 22:50
wispygalaxyis that so? :PJan 28 22:50
wispygalaxyhahaJan 28 22:50
wispygalaxythat's sad, roy :Jan 28 22:50
schestowitzVietnam was a bit of a testing ground tooJan 28 22:50
DaemonFCyep, just like that scene in Cabin FeverJan 28 22:51
wispygalaxyagent orangeJan 28 22:51
schestowitzThe West loves testing weapons on real targetsJan 28 22:51
schestowitzSame with drugsJan 28 22:51
DaemonFChe let his girlfriend bend him over and a few minutes later, wrath of GodJan 28 22:51
schestowitzThey just find some place where life is "cheap" or people are "Evil"Jan 28 22:51
DaemonFCthe flesh eating fungus ate both of themJan 28 22:51
wispygalaxywould you be a lab rat for a drug in its alpha stage?Jan 28 22:51
DaemonFCthey should play that scene in those abstinence only classesJan 28 22:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_the_mad_hatter] Two hours worth of audio editing today. ARGH!Jan 28 22:51
schestowitzDaemonFC: c'mon, stop thatJan 28 22:52
wispygalaxythat's scary, daemonJan 28 22:52
schestowitzThis is a family crowdJan 28 22:52
DaemonFCI knowJan 28 22:52
DaemonFCit could totalyl save that whole programJan 28 22:52
wispygalaxyroy's a family guyJan 28 22:52
DaemonFCpurity ring sales would save the economyJan 28 22:52
wispygalaxythe jonas bros wear themJan 28 22:52
DaemonFCmmhm, that episode of South Park lampooning that was awesomeJan 28 22:53
oiaohmYou normally do expect a after chrismas restocking.Jan 28 22:53
DaemonFCMickey Mouse as the destroyer of manJan 28 22:53
schestowitzoiaohm: it's no major newsJan 28 22:53
schestowitzJust a Vista 7 advertJan 28 22:53
wispygalaxyroy, i have the wizard upJan 28 22:54
wispygalaxyfinally! :PJan 28 22:54
schestowitzThey had WIndows revenue fall 30%Jan 28 22:54
Chips_B_MalroyWhy is it that the pictures of the Prediator drones, remind me of Skynet?  This technology is somewhat predated by the bomb that the Nazi's used to sink ships that had a television camera in the noseJan 28 22:54
schestowitzTo make an illusion of Vista 7 successJan 28 22:54
schestowitzAs I said 3 times this week in BN, look NOT at Vista 7Jan 28 22:54
DaemonFCschestowitz: Vista 7....because you can buy it now or buy it later. We don't care. -MicrosoftJan 28 22:54
schestowitzThey HIDE the restJan 28 22:54
wispygalaxymy school is still using XPJan 28 22:54
schestowitzDaemonFC: no, buying PCJan 28 22:54
wispygalaxythere is no word about upgradingJan 28 22:55
schestowitzMicrosoft just needs to corrupt the OEM channelJan 28 22:55
schestowitzThat's who they sell like 80% of the units toJan 28 22:55
oiaohmProblem is all new licences your school gets would count as Windows 7 wispygalaxyJan 28 22:55
wispygalaxyand IT says to stick with IE 7 because they think IE 8 is unsafeJan 28 22:55
Chips_B_MalroyDaemonFC> wrong, I will never buy SEVEN or Vista, not everJan 28 22:55
wispygalaxyit's not supportedJan 28 22:55
oiaohmEven if they install XP wispygalaxyJan 28 22:55
wispygalaxyreally?Jan 28 22:55
DaemonFC7 is like their revenge against everyone who thought they would wait out Vista, just to find another 5 years of it is the "upgrade"Jan 28 22:55
schestowitzwispygalaxy: they should move to Opera or FirefoxJan 28 22:55
schestowitzAnd stop being MicroturfersJan 28 22:55
wispygalaxythere's friefox on campus computersJan 28 22:55
wispygalaxy:)Jan 28 22:55
cubezzzdon't use doze at allJan 28 22:55
oiaohmYes really wispygalaxy.   I work in volume licences you cannot buy XP volume any more.Jan 28 22:55
cubezzzthat's my adviceJan 28 22:55
oiaohmInstead you down grade Vista or Windows 7 volume liences wispygalaxyJan 28 22:56
wispygalaxyXP is soft of supported until 2014, right?Jan 28 22:56
oiaohmTo get XP licencesJan 28 22:56
schestowitzoiaohm: you can't buy ANY WIndowsJan 28 22:56
schestowitzYou rent a licenceJan 28 22:56
MinceRthat's actually an upgrade :>Jan 28 22:56
DaemonFCpeople avoiding Vista now kind of remind me of when Bush said "We'll smoke 'em out"Jan 28 22:56
schestowitzIt's all just pieces of paper with a waiverJan 28 22:56
DaemonFCwispygalaxy: TechnicallyJan 28 22:56
schestowitzFunny money, funny software, derivatives trade...Jan 28 22:56
oiaohmXP volumne licence ie you buy the licence not the software schestowitzJan 28 22:56
DaemonFCit's not sold anymore and there won't be any new stuff added to itJan 28 22:56
schestowitzMicrosoft's assets are mostly paperJan 28 22:57
DaemonFCit's effectively deadJan 28 22:57
schestowitzIt's a taxJan 28 22:57
schestowitzThere's a good talk on itJan 28 22:57
wispygalaxyyou're on your own if you use it past 2014Jan 28 22:57
schestowitzThey just created a toll systemJan 28 22:57
oiaohmBasically by MS numbers they are not counting XP wispygalaxyJan 28 22:57
wispygalaxyokJan 28 22:57
schestowitzPeople pay for Windows over and over again without choosing tooJan 28 22:57
schestowitz*toJan 28 22:57
cubezzzyou have to have the nerve or the guts to say no windowsJan 28 22:57
oiaohmI have many times over cubezzzJan 28 22:57
wispygalaxypeople have to learn about linux... too bad there's no educationJan 28 22:57
schestowitzMinister of education is Gates :-))Jan 28 22:58
Chips_B_MalroyI have to ask, how can MS only give extended support only to XP until 2014, when MS is still actively selling XP Home on some Netbooks?  Somehow it looks like a basis for another lawsuit.Jan 28 22:58
schestowitzHe hijacked the system by bribing or being cocky to US politiciansJan 28 22:58
schestowitzHe's also hijacking it in India and the UKJan 28 22:58
wispygalaxyhe's everywhereJan 28 22:58
schestowitzLess so in central EuropeJan 28 22:58
oiaohmXP home on netbooks counts in MS embeded sales.  Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 22:58
wispygalaxyyeah, they're still selling XPJan 28 22:58
wispygalaxyso they werent confident about vistaJan 28 22:58
oiaohmSo making there Mobile phone OS failure look better Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 22:59
schestowitzThey still defend their kids more effectively from the white-collar criminals the EU is putting in courtJan 28 22:59
schestowitzAlso Wal-MartJan 28 22:59
schestowitzMonsanto....Jan 28 22:59
cubezzzthis is what I say to retailes and manufacturers: sell me blank or linux or I dont' buyJan 28 22:59
schestowitzThey tried to push their poison into CanadaJan 28 22:59
oiaohmI built my own cubezzzJan 28 22:59
schestowitzWhistleblower showed the corruption of Monsanto (based by that evil guy Gates)Jan 28 22:59
schestowitzANd then Europe flipped outJan 28 22:59
cubezzzoiaohm, of course, but I mean more for PDA or laptop Jan 28 22:59
schestowitzAnd banned it outrightJan 28 22:59
wispygalaxyso european food is safer>Jan 28 23:00
schestowitzWell, it's still foodJan 28 23:00
wispygalaxydo you have to label genetically engineered foodJan 28 23:00
cubezzzif enough people say "I won't buy" then manfacturers will adjust Jan 28 23:00
schestowitzIt's not non-foodJan 28 23:00
Chips_B_MalroyI build my own desktop computers, and buy used laptopsJan 28 23:00
oiaohmNext 12 months is going to get funny.Jan 28 23:00
wispygalaxyGE food can be dangerous, we dont know its effectsJan 28 23:00
schestowitzWe'll find out :-)Jan 28 23:00
oiaohmWith a few companies now to doing XP embeded what is basically XP home in phones.Jan 28 23:00
schestowitzLike we did smokingJan 28 23:00
wispygalaxylolJan 28 23:00
schestowitzSame with ceelphonesJan 28 23:01
wispygalaxyi bet we are goind to be mutant veggiesJan 28 23:01
schestowitz2 US states intend to put cancer warning message on phonesJan 28 23:01
wispygalaxylike in veggie tales, that movieJan 28 23:01
wispygalaxylike that will stipo teens, roy!Jan 28 23:01
wispygalaxystop*Jan 28 23:01
schestowitzwispygalaxy: they have warehouses and stuff where they keep some real genesJan 28 23:01
schestowitzSo they can run back to the real thingJan 28 23:01
schestowitzNot the experiments with arbitrary changes to DNA which they don't even understand or testJan 28 23:02
wispygalaxywhat if the fake genes decide to rebel?  what if the real stuff is contaminatedJan 28 23:02
schestowitz"Look!! The tomato is bigger.... it must be good... for profit.."Jan 28 23:02
Chips_B_Malroy <oiaohm>by XP embeded, you mean XP, or CE?  Has XP been ported to ARM now?  Jan 28 23:02
schestowitzThey look at just one parameterJan 28 23:02
schestowitzOr fewJan 28 23:02
wispygalaxyill move to the moon if nature gets out of whackJan 28 23:02
schestowitzNot millionsJan 28 23:02
schestowitzIf "big", then good;Jan 28 23:02
oiaohmThere are a few phones coming out with x86 chips Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:02
oiaohmYes insanity Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:02
wispygalaxyorganic fruit is smaller and more lopsided than GE fruitJan 28 23:03
schestowitzwispygalaxy: BGH is cancerousJan 28 23:03
schestowitzMonsanto hides itJan 28 23:03
schestowitzANd they spikes the story at FAUX newsJan 28 23:03
schestowitz*spikedJan 28 23:03
wispygalaxyi dont watch TV news at allJan 28 23:03
schestowitzMonsanto threatened to sueJan 28 23:03
schestowitzIt's a gagging techniqueJan 28 23:03
DaemonFCthe thing that bugs me about Kindle is that you can buy40-50 books for what the reader alone costs, and the books don't have DRMJan 28 23:03
wispygalaxybut what if its true?Jan 28 23:03
schestowitz"Obligation to the shareholders," I guessJan 28 23:04
DaemonFCthen you get to pay the same price for book downloads as the books with no DRM costJan 28 23:04
Chips_B_Malroy <oiaohm> I believe that MS might have had a NT4 port to ARM at one time?Jan 28 23:04
schestowitzThey would probably also have an "obligation to shareholder" to 'suicide' some  troublemakersJan 28 23:04
schestowitzCause it's good for business to eliminate critics...Jan 28 23:04
wispygalaxywe should consider stakeholders: the community, workers, etcJan 28 23:04
schestowitzDaemonFC: I prefer PDAJan 28 23:04
wispygalaxyif a corp is in the community, they should play by the rulesJan 28 23:05
schestowitzI can copy and paste and edit text on itJan 28 23:05
oiaohmChips_B_Malroy: Reactos runs on ARM kind of.  Its the only port of the windows NT line on ARM.Jan 28 23:05
wispygalaxyid like an e-readerJan 28 23:05
wispygalaxymakes it easier to carry my schoolbooks aroundJan 28 23:05
schestowitz 28 23:05
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Wait, Who Wants A Proprietary, Locked Down Device That Limits What You Can Do? | Techdirt .::. Size~: 224.77 KBJan 28 23:05
wispygalaxyi have all my classes in one day, so i need to have all my text w/ meJan 28 23:05
schestowitzWatch the fanbois of Jobs' cultJan 28 23:05
schestowitzIn the commentsJan 28 23:06
schestowitz"Attack! He attacks out Cult"Jan 28 23:06
schestowitz*ourJan 28 23:06
wispygalaxybeing loyal to a corporation is weirdJan 28 23:06
schestowitzYesJan 28 23:06
Chips_B_Malroy <oiaohm>interesting, thanksJan 28 23:06
schestowitzThey have PR techqnieus for itJan 28 23:06
schestowitzI saw a programme on how they do itJan 28 23:06
schestowitzMake people fans of some logoJan 28 23:06
schestowitzAssociating it with lifestyle and prideJan 28 23:06
wispygalaxyi learned that in marketing classJan 28 23:06
schestowitzit's like football teamsJan 28 23:06
schestowitzTribalJan 28 23:06
schestowitzTribe+PR+sheeple=profitJan 28 23:07
wispygalaxyits cheaper to cater to longtime customers than to get new onesJan 28 23:07
wispygalaxythats why they do itJan 28 23:07
schestowitzI see Apple fan sitesJan 28 23:07
schestowitzMakes me think they are insaneJan 28 23:07
schestowitzThey voluntarily make someone else richJan 28 23:07
schestowitzSome billlionaireJan 28 23:07
schestowitzSites like ROughly DraftedJan 28 23:07
wispygalaxylinux fan sites are legit, they advocate freedomJan 28 23:07
schestowitzCultofMac...Jan 28 23:08
schestowitzMacNightOwlJan 28 23:08
schestowitzAnd many othersJan 28 23:08
schestowitzThere are even Mac trolls in the Linux newsgroupJan 28 23:08
wispygalaxyare they too blind to see FOSS?Jan 28 23:08
Chips_B_MalroyMac is the ultimate form of lockinJan 28 23:08
schestowitzIt must be upsetting to them that their poor, poor hero Jobs might lose some bucksJan 28 23:08
wispygalaxyhe lost his liver :PJan 28 23:08
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: yes, the books get an i tooJan 28 23:09
oiaohm!.aspx  How marketing spin come apart.Jan 28 23:09
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found .::. Size~: 0 KBJan 28 23:09
schestowitziBookJan 28 23:09
schestowitziPadJan 28 23:09
Chips_B_Malroyyou have to buy a Mac to legally use OS X.  It the only computer you are really allowed to run all three major OS on.Jan 28 23:09
schestowitziTampon?Jan 28 23:09
oiaohmA4 chip is just a run of the mill ARM chip.Jan 28 23:09
DaemonFC 28 23:09
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Campaign For Liberty &mdash; Home .::. Size~: 62.6 KBJan 28 23:09
wispygalaxyron paul?Jan 28 23:09
MinceRcrApple doesn't support running other os-es on its hardware though, do they?Jan 28 23:09
oiaohmThey do MinceRJan 28 23:10
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: reminds me...........Jan 28 23:10
*gargoyle-grin has quit ("Leaving.")Jan 28 23:10
schestowitzGroklaw wastes timeJan 28 23:10
Chips_B_Malroysure u can Jan 28 23:10
schestowitzWriting to defend Cult of Jobs againJan 28 23:10
schestowitzWaste of time for GroklawJan 28 23:10
oiaohmItems like ipod and ipads are locked but.Jan 28 23:10
MinceRiirc when an update to osx bricked all macs that used boot camp, they just spread their arms and said it's unsupportedJan 28 23:10
schestowitzIt's almost embarrassingJan 28 23:10
oiaohmboot camp is a MS product MinceRJan 28 23:10
oiaohmOppsJan 28 23:10
MinceRor maybe not all of themJan 28 23:10
oiaohmApple productJan 28 23:10
schestowitzAPple can afford lawyersJan 28 23:10
oiaohmSo they break it they are repsonable for it.  MinceRJan 28 23:11
MinceRoiaohm: i'm aware of thatJan 28 23:11
schestowitzIt doesn't need community sits clamouringJan 28 23:11
schestowitz*sitesJan 28 23:11
ml2mstSchestowitz: indeed there are Mac fans in COLA. I responded to a post of 7 about the iTamponJan 28 23:11
MinceRoiaohm: but they probably have to be sued to do thatJan 28 23:11
MinceRoiaohm: crApple always denies responsibility and supportJan 28 23:11
wispygalaxy7 has an imaginationJan 28 23:11
wispygalaxy"7" the poster i meanJan 28 23:11
Chips_B_MalroyI was rooting for Pystar, but only because Apple made everyone else PC defective by design because they could not run Mac OS X because of their EFI chip and patents/eula/legaltiesJan 28 23:11
schestowitz 28 23:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsoft Sues BitTorrent Tracker | Techdirt .::. Size~: 41.11 KBJan 28 23:12
wispygalaxyMS is suing everyoneJan 28 23:12
schestowitzwispygalaxy: his heart is in the right placeJan 28 23:12
wispygalaxy:DJan 28 23:12
wispygalaxyi like enthusiasmJan 28 23:12
schestowitzHe doesn't usually communicate wellJan 28 23:12
wispygalaxythat's okJan 28 23:12
schestowitzHe can, thoughJan 28 23:12
ml2mstI Know, 7 writes BS but very funny at times IMO :-)Jan 28 23:12
schestowitzSometimes he does, and it's like it's a different personJan 28 23:12
Chips_B_MalroyToo tell you the truth though, even though OS X is more secure than Windows, I liked the old XP interface better than the dock in MacJan 28 23:12
wispygalaxyat least 7 tells it like it is!Jan 28 23:13
oiaohmDefine more secure Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:13
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: that's not the OSJan 28 23:13
schestowitzDock is just an appJan 28 23:13
schestowitzUnderneath OS X is rubbishJan 28 23:13
oiaohmOS X secuirty frameworks are quite weak  Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:13
schestowitzWindows tooJan 28 23:13
schestowitzWIndows just has many apps written for itJan 28 23:13
schestowitzplasma-desktop is very niceJan 28 23:13
oiaohmOS X gets attacked more than Linux does.Jan 28 23:13
schestowitzANd very usefulJan 28 23:14
MinceRcomparing osx and windows on grounds of security is like poking two turds with a twig and debating which one is harderJan 28 23:14
wispygalaxyplasma theme is coolJan 28 23:14
oiaohmAnd Linux has huge server markets that make it a target.Jan 28 23:14
schestowitzMinceR: did you try?Jan 28 23:14
MinceRosx is missing many modern OS security features, afaikJan 28 23:14
wispygalaxyi need a new iceweasel themeJan 28 23:14
wispygalaxyhavent changed this one in monthsJan 28 23:14
MinceRthey also lag a lot with security updatesJan 28 23:14
MinceRfar behind everyone elseJan 28 23:14
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm> by more secure, I mean more than Windows, Not Linux, which is usually better done, depending also on distroJan 28 23:14
wispygalaxyroy, i have to go now!  see you soonJan 28 23:15
schestowitzMinceR: their priest thinks it's OKJan 28 23:15
oiaohmCompared to windows in tech is weaker Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:15
wispygalaxybye martiJan 28 23:15
MinceRschestowitz: i'm sureJan 28 23:15
schestowitzwispygalaxy: laterJan 28 23:15
wispygalaxy:) see ya!Jan 28 23:15
oiaohmAnd that is quite supprising to most people Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:15
wispygalaxybye everyone!Jan 28 23:15
schestowitzwispygalaxy: marti misses you, girl..Jan 28 23:15
schestowitz:-pJan 28 23:15
wispygalaxyhaha ;)Jan 28 23:15
wispygalaxyi promise to head back to COLAJan 28 23:15
schestowitzcoolJan 28 23:15
wispygalaxyyay!Jan 28 23:15
schestowitzWe need more girls thereJan 28 23:15
wispygalaxyof courseJan 28 23:16
Chips_B_MalroyMinceR> I am not promoting OS X, in fact I was saying the opposite.  I was blasting the lockin that they used to stop other intel based PC's using it.Jan 28 23:16
wispygalaxygirls shouldnt be scared of computersJan 28 23:16
oiaohmOf course Apple does a few minor things right.  Chips_B_Malroy Like email clients and browsers that cannot install stuff without asking.Jan 28 23:16
wispygalaxytell tony and goblin i said hiJan 28 23:16
schestowitzwispygalaxy: computers don't address gendersJan 28 23:16
wispygalaxyonly 0's and 1'sJan 28 23:16
schestowitzwispygalaxy: tony is in Canada nowJan 28 23:16
oiaohmSupprising now a few minor differences make a huge difference to numbers of viruses Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:16
wispygalaxyi hope he's having funJan 28 23:16
schestowitzHe isJan 28 23:16
schestowitzcold though]Jan 28 23:16
wispygalaxybrrrJan 28 23:17
wispygalaxyi wore my boots todayJan 28 23:17
schestowitzgrrrrJan 28 23:17
oiaohmBasically MS dump IE run Firefox over night the infection rates of windows would drop.Jan 28 23:17
Chips_B_Malroyas long as Jobs runs Apple, they will remain a niche computer company that milks the more affluantJan 28 23:17
wispygalaxyyou're mad at me?? :(  Jan 28 23:17
wispygalaxy:PJan 28 23:17
schestowitzNancy Sinatra - These Boots Are Made For Walking (1966) 28 23:17
wispygalaxywell, ill be back soon!Jan 28 23:18
wispygalaxybye roy and marti and everyone elseJan 28 23:18
*wispygalaxy has quit ("Page closed")Jan 28 23:18
MinceRand when jobs stops running crApple, it will collapse like a house of cardsJan 28 23:18
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm> dropping IE and replacing with Firefox also gets rid of activeXJan 28 23:18
Chips_B_Malroywell, if you get rid of Outlook as wellJan 28 23:18
MinceRand i will laugh at the fanboysJan 28 23:18
schestowitz 28 23:19
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 97.05 KBJan 28 23:19
MinceRlusers have probably already left outlook for webmailJan 28 23:19
schestowitzMAFIAAsosJan 28 23:19
schestowitzMinceR: many haveJan 28 23:19
oiaohmYep windows biggest problems is there net facing applications  Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:19
schestowitzNow they can use their keyboardless big iPhone to type stuff into gmailJan 28 23:19
schestowitzWith the big wheelJan 28 23:19
MinceRat least the letters they know :>Jan 28 23:19
schestowitz0s and 1sJan 28 23:19
oiaohmUntil MS has the balls to deal with that mess will keep on happening to windows Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:20
schestowitzMorse codeJan 28 23:20
MinceRreading/writing it must be high science for cultistsJan 28 23:20
MinceRs/it //Jan 28 23:20
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm> I windows biggest problem on the internet as the default account being AdminJan 28 23:20
oiaohmLike the recent IE flaw MS only had 18 months warning of.Jan 28 23:20
schestowitzMaybe Apple will do a proper touch-typing keyboard for their bit IPhone thingieJan 28 23:20
schestowitz*bigJan 28 23:20
schestowitzLike the one I have had with my Palm for 7 yearsJan 28 23:20
DaemonFC 28 23:20
phIRCe-BNcTitle: FACT CHECK: Obama and a toothless commission - Yahoo! News .::. Size~: 114.99 KBJan 28 23:20
MinceRthey can't, as long as they insist on touchscreens and there's no technology that can make bumps in a touchscreenJan 28 23:20
Chips_B_Malroyand at some point, I think we will see a newer version of Windows come out with a default limited user accountJan 28 23:21
oiaohmEven Linux if you can breach the User account you can search for evilvation flaws.   IE OS X has many Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:21
MinceR(there were only demos of it, no ready-to-use touchscreens)Jan 28 23:21
oiaohmBasically if they don't get in first they cannot go any where Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:21
MinceReven if there will be, chances are the first generations will feel more like silicone chiclet keyboardsJan 28 23:21
MinceRand thus a pain to useJan 28 23:21
oiaohmAccounts is the second line of defence Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:21
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[qu1j0t3] #Dovecot: Your error messages are no help at all. #failJan 28 23:21
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm> no OS so far is 100%.  Its like putting a lock on a house door,  breakins tend to occur on the house with the door that does not have the deadboltJan 28 23:22
DaemonFC"THE FACTS: The anticipated savings from this proposal would amount to  less than 1 percent of the deficit — and that's if the president can  persuade Congress to go along."Jan 28 23:22
DaemonFCon the "spending freeze" proposalJan 28 23:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[qu1j0t3] >@WeAllLoveBlund We all want Ikea Blund coming back to Ikea // au contraire, i'd like to see the dirty business #IKEA shut down. #greedJan 28 23:22
Chips_B_MalroyWindows is like the House without lock and broken windows pane.  (sorry for the pun)Jan 28 23:23
oiaohmIe first line needs major work with windows.   Second sux's ie accounts .   Mandory Access controls sux it don't have any.   Anti-virus scanning on windwos is exculsive that don't help either.Jan 28 23:23
oiaohmNow lets go Mac.   First line ie browers is solid.    Second sux's you can easly run a code as root.    Mandoray access controls sux it dont' have any.   Anti-virus scanning is also exclusive so that dont' help either.Jan 28 23:24
oiaohmSupprising how much fixing up the front line changes about infection rates.Jan 28 23:25
oiaohmNo OS will be 100 percent.Jan 28 23:25
DaemonFCApple has put in a system to detect some Mac malwareJan 28 23:26
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm>antivirus and antimalware will always be required on any new legacy Windows version, even if it would come with default limited user account and no IE.  As you have stated, there are always exploits to raise the privledges to full Administrator.  And which OS (hint windows) has so many that are not just exploits, but the actual malware already all over the internet to exploit this?Jan 28 23:26
DaemonFCfanbois don't like to talk about itJan 28 23:26
*_Goblin has quit ("Lost terminal")Jan 28 23:26
oiaohmYes real worm viruses already exploit windows and Linux evelvation flaws  Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:27
oiaohmSame with OS X eveleation flaws.Jan 28 23:27
oiaohmBasically accounts alone are not enough.Jan 28 23:28
Chips_B_MalroyWindows is becoming very unstable or unusable for many now.  Not the ones that know more.  But the malware for windows is becoming more of a problem.  That is why I say, MS will soon be forced to actually do something about it.Jan 28 23:28
MinceRwindows security is like this >> 28 23:28
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBJan 28 23:28
oiaohmWhat is the best way to detect malware  Chips_B_Malroy its not a anti-virus.Jan 28 23:28
oiaohmThe best way is being able to audit your systems.Jan 28 23:29
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm> an once of preventionJan 28 23:29
oiaohmI said detectJan 28 23:29
oiaohmMac and Windows packaging don't help you audit your system.Jan 28 23:29
Chips_B_MalroyI know, but I think like someone who has cleaned too many windows computersJan 28 23:29
oiaohmLinux on the other hand does not need many virus scanners but people do need to be trained how to to a alterations audit.Jan 28 23:30
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm> sometimes to detect you have to run a system that is not infectedJan 28 23:30
oiaohmAudit scanning beats virus scanners.Jan 28 23:30
Chips_B_Malroyit can be a self booting cd for exampleJan 28 23:30
oiaohmWhy.Jan 28 23:30
oiaohmYou don't need signatures to find infections.Jan 28 23:30
oiaohmAlso is faster because you are comparing known to known.Jan 28 23:31
oiaohmSo you don't have to run like 100 000 compares to work out that something might be clean.Jan 28 23:31
oiaohmAudit says its clean or it not clean.Jan 28 23:31
Chips_B_Malroysignatures are one way, looking at processes in windows another, certain registary settings and key anotherJan 28 23:32
schestowitzWindows is FesterJan 28 23:32
MinceRUncle Fester?Jan 28 23:32
schestowitzNoJan 28 23:32
MinceR(Addams)Jan 28 23:32
schestowitzFaster FesterJan 28 23:32
schestowitzGo go SJVN.. 28 23:32
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Anything the iPad can do, Linux can do better. - Computerworld Blogs .::. Size~: 140.89 KBJan 28 23:32
oiaohmregistray is a mess Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:32
oiaohmIt makes finding virus infections harder.Jan 28 23:32
schestowitz"Anything you can do, I can do better. "Jan 28 23:32
schestowitzPaint the Wagon IIRCJan 28 23:32
MinceR:)Jan 28 23:32
schestowitzoiaohm: UAC makes them hard to removeJan 28 23:33
schestowitzEruran said soJan 28 23:33
schestowitzHe couldn't clean up a machineJan 28 23:33
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm>agreed, but many times I end fixing some malware there for usersJan 28 23:33
schestowitzUAC stood in the wayJan 28 23:33
oiaohmLinux systems made the right selection a long time ago.  .d directories inprove it even more.Jan 28 23:33
schestowitzIt'sa  security feature... for the invaderJan 28 23:33
schestowitzIt defends the malwareJan 28 23:33
schestowitzFrom thw userJan 28 23:33
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm>system restore is another malware trapJan 28 23:33
oiaohmIe applications don't edit other applications settings under Linux.Jan 28 23:33
schestowitzOr the ngineer/repair personJan 28 23:33
oiaohmInstead they put a file in a .d directory that get append to the other applications config.Jan 28 23:34
oiaohmThat way you know what application altered what.Jan 28 23:34
Chips_B_MalroyWindows was made wide open, so anyone, any corp could change it without the users permissionJan 28 23:34
oiaohmIe .d in the Linux config system improved means to auditJan 28 23:34
oiaohmIt all comes down to how auditable the system is for how long a unknown virus can spreed before being detected.Jan 28 23:35
oiaohmTruthfully If I gave you a raw /etc directory from a Linux system and a windows registry what one would you prefer to audit.   Chips_B_MalroyJan 28 23:36
Chips_B_Malroy<schestowitz>  I am just a lowly former Windows Malware cleaner mostly.  Yes I used to fix em.   So its why I dislike MS so much, the pain they have inficted on their users, for no real reasonJan 28 23:36
schestowitz [Warning: Scientology]Jan 28 23:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle:   Daniel Eran Dilgers iPad Apple Event Photos  RoughlyDrafted Magazine .::. Size~: 27.21 KBJan 28 23:37
Chips_B_MalroyMy point, was that at least 85% of the computers that were bought to me to fix, ended up being some sort of Windows Malware or Windows stability problemJan 28 23:38
schestowitzChips_B_Malroy: Microsoft didn't spend much time of my life, luckilyJan 28 23:38
schestowitzI used Win98 the mostJan 28 23:38
schestowitzIt ran OK on an old laptop, run winampJan 28 23:38
Chips_B_Malroythe other 10 to 15% were hardwareJan 28 23:38
oiaohmIts getting worse.Jan 28 23:38
Chips_B_MalroyyesJan 28 23:38
schestowitzWIndows was saddled onto my old PCsJan 28 23:38
oiaohmOne shop I work with 95 percent of work is windows failures.Jan 28 23:39
oiaohmNo hardware problems.Jan 28 23:39
schestowitzLinux was not ready for desktop back thenJan 28 23:39
schestowitzLiterallyJan 28 23:39
Chips_B_MalroyIf I only had all the time back in my life that I spent for Windows to rebootJan 28 23:39
schestowitzNo GUI quite.......Jan 28 23:39
oiaohmI used Linux as a desktop in 1995Jan 28 23:39
oiaohmBut I came from dosJan 28 23:39
MinceRwho said the desktop needed a GUI? :>Jan 28 23:39
oiaohmSo commard line was nothing to worry about.Jan 28 23:39
MinceRi used me$$y-dos even when there was win95Jan 28 23:40
schestowitzA friend of mine from school had Linux on the desktop in 98, but that's not so earlyJan 28 23:40
oiaohmTurn out I could cd burn on my crappy machine back then under Linux.Jan 28 23:40
schestowitzMinceR: image viewers and stuffJan 28 23:40
Chips_B_Malroy<oiaohm> yes, I said 85 to 90% but 95% does not surprize meJan 28 23:40
schestowitzAlthoug DOS could do these fineJan 28 23:40
oiaohmyet loading windows 95 would have suxed the live out of it and gave  me bad burns.Jan 28 23:40
MinceRoiaohm: btw, i had an idea -- building mesh networks in cities via wifi and perhaps inter-home ethernet links could help their privacy considerablyJan 28 23:40
schestowitzI also had some DOS-based programs for drawingJan 28 23:40
schestowitzDOS 6Jan 28 23:41
MinceRoiaohm: if they also used Tor, that isJan 28 23:41
schestowitzMS-DOS... but others tooJan 28 23:41
schestowitzBullfrog's Theme Park was goodJan 28 23:41
MinceRmy image viewer was a program called DisplayJan 28 23:41
MinceR(not ImageMagick)Jan 28 23:41
schestowitz 28 23:42
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.0 403 Forbidden .::. Size~: 0 KBJan 28 23:42
oiaohmI am waiting for wimax stuff to come down in price MinceRJan 28 23:42
MinceRschestowitz: i preferred the Doom series :)Jan 28 23:42
oiaohmRange of wimax stuff makes building mesh networks over cities simpler MinceRJan 28 23:42
MinceRoiaohm: that tooJan 28 23:42
MinceRoiaohm: though wimax is also easier to eavesdrop on and to triangulateJan 28 23:43
oiaohmNot really.Jan 28 23:43
oiaohmI can triangulate wifiJan 28 23:43
Chips_B_MalroyI held on to dos 6.2 with win3.11 with qemm for a long time.  I hated W95A with a passion.  Forced to use it with my first cd burner.  It would hang about every 3 out of 10 burns even with easycd v3 back then.  Hang so bad, it crashed 95 so bad it needed complete reinstallJan 28 23:43
MinceRyes, but from how far?Jan 28 23:43
oiaohmFrom about 30 km  MinceRJan 28 23:43
MinceRthen again, if an entire city is doing a mesh network over wimax, it simply takes way too much effort to keep track of everybodyJan 28 23:43
oiaohmLets just say I have some hell of big airials.Jan 28 23:44
schestowitzTurbolinux is DeadJan 28 23:44
MinceR:>Jan 28 23:44
schestowitz 28 23:44
phIRCe-BNcTitle: China Business News: China’s iSoft buys Japan’s TurboSystems .::. Size~: 78.69 KBJan 28 23:44
schestowitzGood riddanceJan 28 23:44
oiaohmI also have access a few remote control aircraft setup for wifi locating.Jan 28 23:44
MinceRoiaohm: you must be really into this stuff :>Jan 28 23:44
Chips_B_MalroyBy the time of W98A, corp internet malware and tracking were big business, and would slow your dialup connections to a crawlJan 28 23:45
oiaohmNo I need some long range links at one point.Jan 28 23:45
oiaohmYou try lining those buggers up MinceRJan 28 23:45
schestowitz 28 23:46
schestowitzThere's heaps of coverage in ChineseJan 28 23:46
schestowitzNovell is like the only sellout left nowJan 28 23:46
schestowitzDown from 4Jan 28 23:46
oiaohmThe remote control location aircraft for wifi is good to work out if you are little left or a little right when doing a very pin point for range.Jan 28 23:47
schestowitzMakes it easier for BN to track the problem of distribution whose use is harmful for GNU/Linux and Free softwareJan 28 23:47
oiaohmThinking a little left or a little right can be a few kms over range.Jan 28 23:47
oiaohmOf course when you have that gear in you spare time you mess with ti MinceRJan 28 23:48
MinceR:>Jan 28 23:48
oiaohmIe the just for fun factorJan 28 23:48
schestowitz 28 23:49
phIRCe-BNcTitle: For me, Gentoo is about *convenient* choice | Zwillingssterns Weltenwald .::. Size~: 21.75 KBJan 28 23:49
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @teddks @robbychen You grossly misunderstand what the Free Software movement means by "free". #GNU #Linux #fsfJan 28 23:49
oiaohmReally I am looking forward to being able to place arm chips in the wifi locating units the PPC chips in there eat a little more power than I like.Jan 28 23:50
Chips_B_Malroy 28 23:51
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 96.98 KBJan 28 23:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @greve RT @jra Another view of all the excitement :-). 28 23:51
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Slashdot Comments | Apple's "iPad" Out In the Open .::. Size~: 37.49 KBJan 28 23:51
schestowitzJra++Jan 28 23:52
schestowitz"Apple Announces new iShackle (tm) !"Jan 28 23:52
Chips_B_MalroyI wonder how much they actually made after the two quarters were subtracted in withheld vista/7 salesJan 28 23:52
Chips_B_MalroyBBC is M$ lapdogJan 28 23:53
oiaohmChrismas restocking.Jan 28 23:53
oiaohmAfter chrismas restockign I personally suspect.Jan 28 23:53
oiaohmThe store where I was let our stock run to basically nothing.Jan 28 23:53
oiaohmAt some point you have to refill stock.Jan 28 23:53
Chips_B_MalroyyesJan 28 23:53
schestowitzWhoa. 28 23:54
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Slashdot Politics Story | US Grants Home Schooling German Family Political Asylum .::. Size~: 204.83 KBJan 28 23:54
oiaohmMost businesses follow the same pattern restock after chrismasJan 28 23:54
schestowitz Chips_B_Malroy their tech section is Rory and MaggieJan 28 23:54
schestowitzBoth Microsoft boot lickers, having meals with the company (at least one)Jan 28 23:54
schestowitzAnd the BBC (their bosses) are former Microsoft executivesJan 28 23:55
schestowitzBBC and Microsoft UK are intersecting beyond beliefJan 28 23:55
Chips_B_MalroyXbox360 downJan 28 23:55
schestowitzDuh :-) :-)Jan 28 23:55
oiaohmThey are saying live sales are up.Jan 28 23:55
schestowitzMicrosoft only talks about "natal"Jan 28 23:55
schestowitzVapourwareJan 28 23:56
schestowitzNot "xbox360"Jan 28 23:56
schestowitzIt used to be "Halo"Jan 28 23:56
schestowitzCHange the brand, change targetJan 28 23:56
schestowitzResults=Vista 7Jan 28 23:56
schestowitz"Ignore the rest"Jan 28 23:56
Chips_B_MalroyI wonder why?  Oh well, maybe DaemonXP can tell us why?Jan 28 23:56
oiaohmI am waiting on the stock exchange report.Jan 28 23:56
oiaohmThat will tell us how well they really did.Jan 28 23:56
Chips_B_MalroyDaemonFC, why is Xbox360 sales down?Jan 28 23:57
schestowitz 28 23:57
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Slashdot Your Rights Online Story | Man in Court Over Simpsons Porn .::. Size~: 193.26 KBJan 28 23:57
oiaohmXbox360 sales are down quite simpley not as many are breaking.Jan 28 23:57
oiaohmLot of gamers are so hooked they cannot wait for turn around.Jan 28 23:57
Chips_B_MalroyMS pulled out all the stops here folks.  They had the Xmas season.  They had a new release of a slightly improved Vista, called Seven, it should have had a small bump.  They withheld a massive amount of Seven revenue from other quarters.  And they laid off many workers and cut projects (costs) that did not produce profits.Jan 28 23:59
Chips_B_MalroyBallmer had to have a good quarter, even if it was mostly an engineered oneJan 28 23:59

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