Join us now at the IRC channel.
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| MinceR | https://ircz.de/p/19090113 | Dec 28 00:45 |
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| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object | Dec 28 00:45 | |
| MinceR | https://i.imgur.com/oBXtRvR.jpg | Dec 28 01:01 |
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| schestowitz | kaniini: viera is now picking up posts | Dec 28 03:42 |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | More #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132209 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Android Leftovers | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132208 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Android Leftovers | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | Linux Kernel 5.3 Reached End of Life, Users Urged to Upgrade to Linux Kernel 5.4 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132207 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Linux Kernel 5.3 Reached End of Life, Users Urged to Upgrade to Linux Kernel 5.4 | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | How to Make the Switch From Windows to Linux http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132206 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | How to Make the Switch From Windows to Linux | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | Google Chrome on Linux reportedly freezing after version 79 update http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132205 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Google Chrome on Linux reportedly freezing after version 79 update | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | How Nitrux is Changing the Traditional Linux Scenario [Interview] http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132204 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | How Nitrux is Changing the Traditional Linux Scenario [Interview] | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | CopyQ â Advanced clipboard manager for Linux http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132203 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | CopyQ – Advanced clipboard manager for Linux | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | 5 best Google Chrome alternatives on Linux | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132202 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | 5 best Google Chrome alternatives on Linux | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | Meet Calculate Linux 20! | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132201 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Meet Calculate Linux 20! | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | Graphics: Mesa/LLVMpipe, DragonFlyBSD and NVIDIA | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132200 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Graphics: Mesa/LLVMpipe, DragonFlyBSD and NVIDIA | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | Games: Dead Cells, X-Plane and Dead Age | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132199 | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Games: Dead Cells, X-Plane and Dead Age | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | Games: Black Mesa, Minigalaxy, Date in the Park and More | Dec 28 03:52 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132198 #gnu #linux #gaming | Dec 28 03:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Games: Black Mesa, Minigalaxy, Date in the Park and More | Tux Machines | Dec 28 03:52 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:53 |
| schestowitz | Links 27/12/2019: WireGuard 1.0 Soon, NewPipe 0.18.0, EasyOS 2.2 http://techrights.org/2019/12/27/easyos-2-2/ | Dec 28 03:53 |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 03:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Links 27/12/2019: WireGuard 1.0 Soon, NewPipe 0.18.0, EasyOS 2.2 | Techrights | Dec 28 03:53 | |
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| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 04:23 |
| schestowitz | List of Differences Between Pop! OS and Ubuntu | Dec 28 04:23 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132216 | Dec 28 04:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | List of Differences Between Pop! OS and Ubuntu | Tux Machines | Dec 28 04:23 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | Can We Build Trustable Hardware? | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132215 | Dec 28 04:24 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Can We Build Trustable Hardware? | Tux Machines | Dec 28 04:24 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | Wine 5.0 RC3 | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132214 | Dec 28 04:24 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Wine 5.0 RC3 | Tux Machines | Dec 28 04:24 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | This is why smart displays run Ubuntu Core | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132213 | Dec 28 04:24 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | This is why smart displays run Ubuntu Core | Tux Machines | Dec 28 04:24 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | Latte Dock v0.10~ | Floating Docks And Panels | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132212 | Dec 28 04:24 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Latte Dock v0.10~ | Floating Docks And Panels | Tux Machines | Dec 28 04:24 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | today's howtos | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132211 | Dec 28 04:24 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | today's howtos | Tux Machines | Dec 28 04:24 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | Games: VietDoom, OpenTTD, GRAL, GOG Connect | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132210 | Dec 28 04:24 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Games: VietDoom, OpenTTD, GRAL, GOG Connect | Tux Machines | Dec 28 04:24 | |
| schestowitz | ➬ | Dec 28 04:24 |
| schestowitz | kaniini: I think pleroma.site might not getting pushed through the fediverase | Dec 28 04:41 |
| schestowitz | and that this is why it's not picked up by viera | Dec 28 04:41 |
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| oiaohm | https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/53968.html Hmm wonder what other flaws ring devices have. | Dec 28 05:36 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-mjg59.dreamwidth.org | mjg59 | Wifi deauthentication attacks and home security | Dec 28 05:36 | |
| schestowitz | thanks, I saw that yesterday | Dec 28 05:40 |
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| schestowitz | lwn has mentioned it since | Dec 28 05:40 |
| oiaohm | I have always believed if you are going for security camera to go hardwired. | Dec 28 06:12 |
| oiaohm | schestowitz: https://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-Wifi-Jammer-With-ESP8266-and-Mobile-App/ I guess you were not think of it in combination with this. | Dec 28 06:13 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.instructables.com | NO TITLE | Dec 28 06:13 | |
| oiaohm | 8 dollar device renders due to weak wifi usage renders those 200dollar plus ring devices worthless. | Dec 28 06:15 |
| oiaohm | Let alone the other issues. | Dec 28 06:15 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | It's creepy and unethical to even have one of tbose things. | Dec 28 06:44 |
| schestowitz | should be illegal | Dec 28 06:45 |
| schestowitz | I was giving out xmas cards days ago and one door had "Ring" | Dec 28 06:45 |
| schestowitz | which means they took videos of me | Dec 28 06:45 |
| schestowitz | with face reco | Dec 28 06:45 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The in laws have one. | Dec 28 06:46 |
| schestowitz | and uploaded to 'cloud' in another country | Dec 28 06:46 |
| schestowitz | footage sent to police, army, companies.... all this for just giving a card | Dec 28 06:46 |
| schestowitz | > The Debian votes should be in by today. As mentioned it looks like the | Dec 28 06:48 |
| schestowitz | > death blow to general purpose GNU/Linux unless more developers somehow | Dec 28 06:48 |
| schestowitz | > move over to Devuan. | Dec 28 06:48 |
| schestowitz | The way I am reading it, systemd monopoly will be avoided at some level (if feasible): | Dec 28 06:48 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132218 | Dec 28 06:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org | Debian Votes to Stop SystemD 'Monopoly' | Tux Machines | Dec 28 06:48 | |
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| superkuh | Excellent. | Dec 28 07:42 |
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| oiaohm | schestowitz: please get out of the habit of SystemD that is not the spelling of it. | Dec 28 09:28 |
| oiaohm | schestowitz: its like people using QT for the toolkit Qt. | Dec 28 09:29 |
| oiaohm | The vote say Debian will still consider alternatives. | Dec 28 09:30 |
| oiaohm | But those making alternatives really do need to understand what systemd has done right. | Dec 28 09:30 |
| oiaohm | cgroups is one of those fun ones. People forgot about linux kernel implement autogroups to try to provide scheduler with more information to make more correct choices. | Dec 28 09:30 |
| oiaohm | Basically if you don't use cgroups around services. https://www.postgresql.org/message-id/50E4AAB1.9040902@optionshouse.com You have to turn on autogroups and pray it gets it right. | Dec 28 09:32 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.postgresql.org | PostgreSQL: Two Necessary Kernel Tweaks for Linux Systems | Dec 28 09:32 | |
| oiaohm | I am really looking forward to this to land https://lwn.net/ml/linux-kernel/20191218173516.7875-3-christian.brauner@ubuntu.com/ the means to start processes in cgroups in targeted way. | Dec 28 09:35 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-[PATCH 2/3] clone3: allow spawning processes into cgroups [LWN.net] | Dec 28 09:35 | |
| oiaohm | This would remove a lot of the crap systemd has to do to get services into cgroups. | Dec 28 09:35 |
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| schestowitz | kaniini: maybe some passive job isn't working and sending out or federating outwards from pleroma.site | Dec 28 11:10 |
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| MinceR | 28 103020 < oiaohm> But those making alternatives really do need to understand what systemd has done right. | Dec 28 14:10 |
| MinceR | nothing | Dec 28 14:10 |
| oiaohm | The usage of cgroups is in fact right because the scheduler is needing more information todo it job right as we are getting more cores to deal with. | Dec 28 14:12 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: so claiming systemd does nothing right is ingoring the problem space. | Dec 28 14:12 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: no, claiming systemd does that right is ignoring that cgroups doesn't work correctly | Dec 28 14:13 |
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| oiaohm | MinceR: For the scheduler correction its was working right before systemd existed with cgroups. | Dec 28 14:14 |
| oiaohm | For the miss behaving services cgroup was not working right. | Dec 28 14:15 |
| oiaohm | and for resource allocation cgroups was not working right. | Dec 28 14:15 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: so no cgroups did work for a particular problem. | Dec 28 14:15 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: https://lwn.net/Articles/433904/ the scheduler having major troubles without grouping information only started really being properly diagnosed around 2011. | Dec 28 14:19 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-A group scheduling demonstration [LWN.net] | Dec 28 14:19 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the resource allocations problem was fixed with cgroupv2. Work to fix up the containment for miss behaving services is still on going with cgroups but its getting there now. | Dec 28 14:21 |
| oiaohm | I guess you were presuming cgroups did not work at all right. When cgroupv1 could at least do one thing right. | Dec 28 14:22 |
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| MinceR | oiaohm: when they fix the parts that still don't work, they might break code depending on the parts that did | Dec 28 14:45 |
| MinceR | so, again, not something for "stable" code | Dec 28 14:45 |
| MinceR | and in any case, not something for people who didn't ask for it | Dec 28 14:45 |
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| oiaohm | People running bigger systems were asking for the scheduler problem fixed as early as 2007. | Dec 28 15:06 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: so this is not a case it was not asked for. Its also why cgroupv2 has a cgroupv1 compatibility mode not to break old code working around the scheduler problem using cgroupv1 commands. | Dec 28 15:06 |
| MinceR | i wasn't asking for it | Dec 28 15:31 |
| MinceR | yet they took over the distribution i used and tried to force systemd on me | Dec 28 15:31 |
| MinceR | people who want ibm's shit might as well run one of ibm's own distros | Dec 28 15:31 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: especially considering that people like you keep complaining about how badly deadian implements systemd | Dec 28 15:32 |
| oiaohm | Please note I did not say systemd was 100 percent good. It did get something right. That you may not have been asked for then but sooner or latter with systems expending in processing power the problem had to be taken on. | Dec 28 15:33 |
| MinceR | you're one of the people who want every "init system" to be turned into another systemd | Dec 28 15:34 |
| MinceR | with all the systemd design flaws | Dec 28 15:34 |
| kaniini | schestowitz: no. the container came up ipv6-only for whatever reason. | Dec 28 15:34 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: There are many systemd design flaws I would love to see totally avoided. As well as some of the other init systems design flaws totally avoided. | Dec 28 15:35 |
| MinceR | but do you recognize all of them? | Dec 28 15:37 |
| MinceR | like the superfluous new APIs that depend on dbugs, another broken piece of software? | Dec 28 15:38 |
| MinceR | or having the worlds worst logger daemon tied into it? | Dec 28 15:38 |
| MinceR | s/ds/d's/ | Dec 28 15:38 |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Today in Techrights http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132231 [https://pleroma.site/objects/5e721bc8-231d-4ee2-bab2-ba105ba9c5af] | Dec 28 15:38 | |
| oiaohm | journald turns out to be optional as people found out when they went looking in 2016 but you had to have something else pick up the socket files. | Dec 28 15:39 |
| oiaohm | So that journald would not socket activate. | Dec 28 15:39 |
| oiaohm | The dependency on dbus I would love not to exist. | Dec 28 15:42 |
| oiaohm | You can run systemd without dbus for embedded usage and it manages to use sockets and work. | Dec 28 15:42 |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: What If #RichardStallman Spoke Like #LinusTorvalds Does? http://techrights.org/2019/12/28/cool-insults-and-rude-criticisms/ #rms #gnu #freesw [https://pleroma.site/objects/ac571d68-ada5-4940-82e9-d82e9d78fd51] | Dec 28 15:44 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: dbus mostly exists because we have not really had good IPC in kernel. I would love to see posix signals have a signal added that can in fact send a message between applciations now that we have pidfd so it can be given to the right process. | Dec 28 15:48 |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: How to Rotate Display in Ubuntu, Linux http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132230 [https://pleroma.site/objects/33c0c7ff-238d-43fc-8745-4fb1e98ad69f] | Dec 28 15:48 | |
| oiaohm | I still find it kind of insane how long we were using PID value to send kill messages to possible the wrong thing. | Dec 28 15:49 |
| MinceR | that's because it's more reliable than you think | Dec 28 15:49 |
| MinceR | especially if you also check the command name for the PID first | Dec 28 15:49 |
| oiaohm | pidfd is 100 percent dependable to give single to the right process. | Dec 28 15:50 |
| oiaohm | Every single time without question. | Dec 28 15:50 |
| oiaohm | Check command name of pid before sending single does not make sure it still on that PID when you send signal. | Dec 28 15:50 |
| MinceR | pidfd is also very recent | Dec 28 15:51 |
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| oiaohm | Horrible part how not recent it is in other OS. Freebsd got something like pidfd back in 90s. Windows of course coming from VMS had it from start. Sun had for solaris mocked it up as userspace emulation in 2008 and due to sale to orcale never got it implemented in kernel as fully functional. | Dec 28 15:53 |
| oiaohm | pidfd in Linux is somewhere between a decade late to 3 decades late to the party. | Dec 28 15:54 |
| oiaohm | Of course OS X has not even worked out there is a party yet. | Dec 28 15:55 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: something else recent that is coming is the means to use clone3 to start a process directly in a cgroup instead of having to transfer something into a cgroup then run the target program that way. | Dec 28 15:56 |
| oiaohm | Of course solaris with zones only had that in 2005. | Dec 28 15:56 |
| oiaohm | Freebsd jails had the means todo that even earlier. | Dec 28 15:57 |
| oiaohm | systemd lot of ways was attempting to use stuff in the Linux kernel that really should have been in the Linux kernel and functional. | Dec 28 15:57 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: I would say most if not all of the foundation API/ABI stuff that you need to in the Linux kernel to make a really solid service management solution will be in place before the end 2020. We are very close now. | Dec 28 16:01 |
| oiaohm | I really wish we did not need to go though a decade of hell to get to that point. | Dec 28 16:02 |
| MinceR | compare that "end of 2020" to april 2015, when the red hat moles in deadian forced the incomplete "solution" onto users as "stable" | Dec 28 16:05 |
| MinceR | or june 2014, when red hat pushed it onto their "enterprise" customers as something that was supposed to be "really stable" | Dec 28 16:05 |
| oiaohm | Really need to stop that with debian. | Dec 28 16:06 |
| MinceR | should have, yes | Dec 28 16:06 |
| MinceR | but it's too late | Dec 28 16:06 |
| schestowitz | kaniini: it works now :) | Dec 28 16:07 |
| oiaohm | Debian did not take systemd in as a 100 percent stable solution. | Dec 28 16:07 |
| MinceR | deadian has broken every single thing in their title | Dec 28 16:07 |
| oiaohm | Took it in as the best option out of a bad choice list. | Dec 28 16:07 |
| MinceR | nope | Dec 28 16:07 |
| MinceR | they forced it on users using gnome's dependency on it as the excuse | Dec 28 16:07 |
| MinceR | and pretended they had to choose right then and pretended most options didn't even exist | Dec 28 16:08 |
| oiaohm | No the gnome dependancy came after the debian choice. | Dec 28 16:08 |
| MinceR | and pretended to choose an "init system" which, as you yourself said, did not actually work at the time | Dec 28 16:08 |
| oiaohm | Not before. | Dec 28 16:08 |
| oiaohm | If you look at the other options none of them worked properly at the time either. | Dec 28 16:08 |
| oiaohm | So nothing was in fact working right. | Dec 28 16:09 |
| MinceR | all of them worked much better and still do | Dec 28 16:09 |
| oiaohm | I would not say that. | Dec 28 16:09 |
| MinceR | systemd is the only "init system" that keeps failing to shutdown whenever i try to use it, and i used it in a small minority of cases | Dec 28 16:09 |
| MinceR | it is also the only one that failed to boot | Dec 28 16:09 |
| MinceR | it's the only one that boots into an emergency mode prompt hidden on an inactive virtual console | Dec 28 16:09 |
| MinceR | you keep saying sysvinit/rc keeps killing the wrong process, but i've never seen that happen, even though i use it a lot more than i use systemd | Dec 28 16:10 |
| oiaohm | Sorry there were debain bugs where everything you have listed so far has happened to users with sysvinit. | Dec 28 16:10 |
| MinceR | yeah, sometimes happened to other users | Dec 28 16:10 |
| oiaohm | So different level of luck. | Dec 28 16:10 |
| MinceR | a fresh install of ubuntu _always_ boots into emergency mode | Dec 28 16:10 |
| MinceR | and the systemd vm i used regularly went into "stop job is running" with no way to interrupt it when i told it to shut down | Dec 28 16:11 |
| danielp3344 | ubuntu is just some african dialect for 'I couldn't figure out how to install debian' | Dec 28 16:11 |
| MinceR | no, it's an ancient african word for "I can't configure Slackware" | Dec 28 16:11 |
| danielp3344 | I've heard that too | Dec 28 16:12 |
| oiaohm | stop job is running is a horrible trade off. | Dec 28 16:12 |
| oiaohm | sysvinit did not show it but also at times would lead to database screw up and equal because data was not written to disc. | Dec 28 16:13 |
| oiaohm | So pick devil MinceR | Dec 28 16:13 |
| MinceR | i'd like to pick one, but red hat didn't let me | Dec 28 16:15 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: reality is most init systems before systemd were not handling stop jobs properly. | Dec 28 16:15 |
| MinceR | they destroyed the distribution i used from the inside to deny me that choice | Dec 28 16:15 |
| MinceR | yet they all keep shutting down successfully, somehow | Dec 28 16:15 |
| oiaohm | systemd does allow you to set a stop job timeout to 0 | Dec 28 16:15 |
| MinceR | and this is not even counting waiting for the NFS server forever, which cancerd also does | Dec 28 16:16 |
| oiaohm | That will cause it to do the same data damage as sysvinit did. | Dec 28 16:16 |
| MinceR | ah, now you bring up data damage, that's an interesting topic | Dec 28 16:16 |
| oiaohm | You can set stop job 0 time out on a per service base. | Dec 28 16:16 |
| MinceR | https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=784720 | Dec 28 16:17 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-bugs.debian.org | #784720 - systemd: issues SIGKILL too early (risk of data loss) - Debian Bug report logs | Dec 28 16:17 | |
| MinceR | systemd is documented to have caused data loss regularly | Dec 28 16:17 |
| MinceR | what's more, this was (according to systemd developers) because cgroups was incapable of doing the job | Dec 28 16:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: that was still issuing SIGKILL latter than where sysvinit did. | Dec 28 16:18 |
| MinceR | so yeah, if they could have waited until their "init system" was actually stable and could actually do the job of an init system (including fixing cgroups so it can work), i would have considered switching to systemd | Dec 28 16:18 |
| MinceR | but with this history, i will never switch to systemd | Dec 28 16:18 |
| MinceR | i don't trust poettering, i don't trust red hat or ibm or you | Dec 28 16:19 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: the problem was not when they issued SIGKILL, the problem was that they never issued SIGTERM | Dec 28 16:19 |
| oiaohm | Problem is you don't compare what sysvinit does in the same case. | Dec 28 16:19 |
| MinceR | i know very well what sysvinit/rc does in the same case | Dec 28 16:19 |
| MinceR | it sends SIGTERM, waits a few seconds and then sends SIGKILL | Dec 28 16:19 |
| MinceR | which does the job correctly | Dec 28 16:19 |
| oiaohm | SIGTERM due to poor signal handling sysvinit also fails to send that to all processes all the time. | Dec 28 16:20 |
| MinceR | so you keep insisting | Dec 28 16:20 |
| MinceR | and yet | Dec 28 16:20 |
| oiaohm | The same race in fact happens in systemd and sysvinit. | Dec 28 16:20 |
| oiaohm | systemd did make it happen more dpendably. | Dec 28 16:20 |
| MinceR | i've used sysvinit/rc and never had the issues you allege | Dec 28 16:20 |
| MinceR | i've used it a lot | Dec 28 16:21 |
| MinceR | i've used systemd a little and i had lots of issues with it | Dec 28 16:21 |
| MinceR | including failure to boot and failure to shutdown | Dec 28 16:21 |
| oiaohm | Please note what I said about these races. | Dec 28 16:21 |
| oiaohm | Making a race happen more dependably is not exaclty a good thing. | Dec 28 16:21 |
| MinceR | somehow you shooting your mouth off about this for years didn't change how these systems behaved when i used them | Dec 28 16:21 |
| oiaohm | But if you are attempting to fix it they are. | Dec 28 16:21 |
| MinceR | maybe you should consider a different strategy | Dec 28 16:21 |
| oiaohm | Really you should think of a different strategy. | Dec 28 16:22 |
| MinceR | another thing you're ignoring that the alleged issues with sysvinit/rc can only occur when the daemons it manages misbehave | Dec 28 16:22 |
| oiaohm | You pull out bugs that are in fact issues that exist in sysvinit. | Dec 28 16:22 |
| MinceR | systemd regularly fucks up even if everything else works properly | Dec 28 16:22 |
| oiaohm | Also that a presume that eveyrthing else is working properly. | Dec 28 16:23 |
| MinceR | and (as its own developers admitted) it still can't deal with misbehaving daemons | Dec 28 16:23 |
| oiaohm | Systemd deals with misbehaving deamons better on adverage that sysvinit and upstart was. | Dec 28 16:23 |
| oiaohm | Of course for it to get right stuff in kernel had to be fixed. | Dec 28 16:23 |
| oiaohm | Boy has that taken some fixing. | Dec 28 16:24 |
| MinceR | yeah, that's what the brochure says | Dec 28 16:24 |
| MinceR | unfortunately, it has nothing to do with reality | Dec 28 16:25 |
| oiaohm | facebook and other parties started using systemd not because it was the force choice but because of the better monitoing and behavour handling. | Dec 28 16:26 |
| oiaohm | So yes you run into some trouble. | Dec 28 16:26 |
| oiaohm | but that does not mean it did not fix particular problems. | Dec 28 16:26 |
| scientes | XRevan86, brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46flumpZD8g | Dec 28 16:26 |
| MinceR | what does that have to do with me? | Dec 28 16:26 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Cientos de Papás Noel establecen un nuevo récord de Rusia en el desfile de Año Nuevo - YouTube | Dec 28 16:26 | |
| MinceR | how do my choices prevent dumbFuckBook and other incompetents from buying and using rHELL? | Dec 28 16:27 |
| MinceR | or even fedora? | Dec 28 16:27 |
| MinceR | they could have had their beloved broken "init system" labeled "stable" in 2011 if they used fedora | Dec 28 16:27 |
| MinceR | there was no reason to take over debian for this | Dec 28 16:27 |
| oiaohm | Facebook was interesting they went all out and got rid of all the old sysvinit scripts and went pure systemd service files. | Dec 28 16:27 |
| oiaohm | Items like debian tried to go halfway in the middle. | Dec 28 16:27 |
| MinceR | the interesting part about dumbFuckBook is how incredibly annoying their website is for visitors | Dec 28 16:28 |
| MinceR | first you get a massive fake popup telling you to register, and you tell it not now | Dec 28 16:28 |
| MinceR | then it turns into a massive bar occupying the bottom half of the screen | Dec 28 16:28 |
| MinceR | pushy like poettering's cult | Dec 28 16:28 |
| oiaohm | They were not the only big party todo that on massive numbers of systems and have them run with less issues than the old sysvinit. | Dec 28 16:28 |
| MinceR | and of course they push their "like button" malware on so many sites | Dec 28 16:28 |
| MinceR | i don't get how people didn't just turn and leave their shitty site and let dumbFuckBook go bankrupt | Dec 28 16:29 |
| MinceR | does dumbFuckBook even use deadian? | Dec 28 16:29 |
| danielp3344 | <MinceR "pushy like poettering's cult"> ._O | Dec 28 16:29 |
| danielp3344 | https://dayssincelastfacebookscandal.com/ | Dec 28 16:30 |
| <--pedro4 has quit () | Dec 28 16:30 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-dayssincelastfacebookscandal.com | Days since last facebook scandal | Dec 28 16:30 | |
| scientes | Bolivia violated the Mexican embassy in La Paz | Dec 28 16:30 |
| scientes | hope nothing bad happens to the very nice Russian ambaassador who approved my visa | Dec 28 16:30 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: What's that? | Dec 28 16:31 |
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| scientes | Moscow | Dec 28 16:31 |
| scientes | largest march of St Nick impersonators | Dec 28 16:32 |
| XRevan86 | Any value? | Dec 28 16:33 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: don't expect answer when you are not asking about the correct company names. | Dec 28 16:33 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: dumbFuckBook does not exist so how can I answer question | Dec 28 16:33 |
| scientes | oh holy shit, there was a solar eclipse XRevan86 | Dec 28 16:33 |
| scientes | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LryVm1kkY24 | Dec 28 16:33 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-El último eclipse solar del año visto desde Asia - YouTube | Dec 28 16:33 | |
| *scientes feels stupid in not knowing about it till after | Dec 28 16:33 | |
| MinceR | oiaohm: ah, now you demand respect for the abusers of humankind | Dec 28 16:34 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: you won't get it. fuck off. | Dec 28 16:34 |
| scientes | XRevan86, i was just feeling how cold it is in most of russia right now | Dec 28 16:34 |
| scientes | except St Petersberg | Dec 28 16:34 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: really there is nothing to gain from lowing yourself to their level of name calling. | Dec 28 16:34 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: and I will not play along with it. | Dec 28 16:35 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: Barely below zero according to Weather Underground. | Dec 28 16:36 |
| XRevan86 | in Moscow | Dec 28 16:36 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: there is also nothing to gain from respecting those authoritarian criminal enterprises | Dec 28 16:36 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: and so i won't | Dec 28 16:36 |
| scientes | 9 in Batumi right now | Dec 28 16:37 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: using their right name then pointing out there defects means it turns up at times with google searchs and other things when people start going looking for information on them. | Dec 28 16:37 |
| scientes | and it was like 15 | Dec 28 16:38 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: You didn't show any signs of presence for some time, where've you been? :) | Dec 28 16:38 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: it is going to be difficult to find this chat log via web search anyway | Dec 28 16:38 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: and the keywords will still be there since you pay them homage | Dec 28 16:38 |
| scientes | XRevan86, I rented an apartment! | Dec 28 16:38 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: maybe you could also include the ® and ™ symbols to make sure. | Dec 28 16:38 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: I have had chat logs turn up inside the first 4 pages of google search before | Dec 28 16:38 |
| scientes | 5 rooms and balcony | Dec 28 16:39 |
| MinceR | i wonder if they've bought unicode code points for their logos yet | Dec 28 16:39 |
| MinceR | if so, you could use those too | Dec 28 16:39 |
| scientes | and windows facing west and north | Dec 28 16:39 |
| scientes | with a view of the black sea and the surf | Dec 28 16:39 |
| MinceR | oh, and corporate colors with mirc color codes! | Dec 28 16:40 |
| scientes | I also just got back from Temple, Hanukkah just ended | Dec 28 16:40 |
| oiaohm | Funny enough ® and ™ markers at times seam to have reverse effect on search results on google to what you would expect. Ie those present must be some third party don't list seams to happen. | Dec 28 16:41 |
| MinceR | sucks to be them, i guess | Dec 28 16:41 |
| MinceR | also sucks to be you | Dec 28 16:41 |
| MinceR | since you'll be torn between paying our corporate oppressors maximum respect and making the conversation searchable | Dec 28 16:41 |
| oiaohm | I did not say maximun respect. | Dec 28 16:42 |
| oiaohm | You can be totally disrespectful and use a person correct name., | Dec 28 16:42 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: Did you see what I wrote involving Zig? :) | Dec 28 16:42 |
| scientes | XRevan86, link? | Dec 28 16:42 |
| MinceR | i can, but i don't necessarily want to | Dec 28 16:43 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: do you use facebook? | Dec 28 16:44 |
| XRevan86 | I'll just give a tarball | Dec 28 16:44 |
| scientes | you certainly got me curious :) | Dec 28 16:44 |
| XRevan86 | https://xmppshare.meowr.ru/7018dab47d96f0125923921d7e7b834efc33c532/IXV051fvzX6K3vdfvml9qnpx4Qko3XHoWlyvJiuf/lev_dist.tar.xz | Dec 28 16:44 |
| scientes | you mean leviathian distance? | Dec 28 16:45 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: yes | Dec 28 16:45 |
| XRevan86 | wait | Dec 28 16:45 |
| XRevan86 | levenstein | Dec 28 16:45 |
| *XRevan86 should read more carefully. | Dec 28 16:46 | |
| scientes | oh damn, it doesn't have anything to do with the devil? | Dec 28 16:46 |
| scientes | hehehehe | Dec 28 16:46 |
| scientes | just some jewish dude | Dec 28 16:46 |
| MinceR | i like leviathan distance | Dec 28 16:47 |
| XRevan86 | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Levenshtein | Dec 28 16:47 |
| MinceR | also lament distance | Dec 28 16:47 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | Vladimir Levenshtein - Wikipedia | Dec 28 16:47 | |
| XRevan86 | scientes: Anyway, I've been trying out implementing this algorithm (the iterative version) on various programming languages, and looking how they fare. | Dec 28 16:48 |
| scientes | XRevan86, I like how you got the allocator custom right | Dec 28 16:48 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: Zig is interesting here as it claims "Speaking of performance, Zig is faster than C." | Dec 28 16:48 |
| scientes | I is (as long as gcc isn't way ahead of llvm at some specific thing) | Dec 28 16:48 |
| XRevan86 | and I don't see it happening | Dec 28 16:48 |
| scientes | well also mem.copy and mem.swap are not do right ATM XRevan86 | Dec 28 16:49 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: I've supplied a text file with numbers that I got | Dec 28 16:49 |
| scientes | I have a PR fixing it, and it was rejected because andrew...... | Dec 28 16:49 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: I saw the code and albeit it's freaky, I think it does the intended thing with arrays if I give it addresses | Dec 28 16:50 |
| scientes | his has this perfectionist attitude in which he tries to take all the problem unto himself, and do more than he can do | Dec 28 16:50 |
| scientes | and then he ends up getting things wrong and having to drop his own promises | Dec 28 16:50 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: If it did the wrong thing (copy the whole array), it'd be very apparent | Dec 28 16:50 |
| XRevan86 | because that would be done 225 000 000 times | Dec 28 16:51 |
| XRevan86 | oops, 15 000 | Dec 28 16:51 |
| scientes | anyways, it really does have the potential to be faster than C | Dec 28 16:51 |
| scientes | well, actually... | Dec 28 16:51 |
| scientes | its kinda bullshit right now because strict aliasing was abandoned | Dec 28 16:52 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: I indeed like how explicit it is | Dec 28 16:52 |
| scientes | anyways, I do care about Zig and if Andrew learns how to manage the project better it should have a great future | Dec 28 16:52 |
| XRevan86 | A lot harder to just forget something and get UB. | Dec 28 16:52 |
| XRevan86 | but boy are casts done freakishly verbose | Dec 28 16:53 |
| scientes | I actually like it | Dec 28 16:53 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: Compare to Rust, it also requires perfect type matching | Dec 28 16:53 |
| MinceR | https://pluspora.com/uploads/images/scaled_full_0d282c2da204b9701959.jpg | Dec 28 16:53 |
| scientes | at least you don't have brain-dead implicit cast to/from float | Dec 28 16:53 |
| XRevan86 | "@intToFloat(f64, 12309)" and "12309 as f64" | Dec 28 16:54 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: And also about LLVM, Rust also showed better results %) | Dec 28 16:54 |
| scientes | rust is a much more mature language | Dec 28 16:55 |
| MinceR | lol no multiple inheritance | Dec 28 16:55 |
| scientes | MinceR, no inheritance at all | Dec 28 16:56 |
| scientes | and no classes | Dec 28 16:56 |
| scientes | or methods (except as syntactic sugar) | Dec 28 16:56 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Go is also like that. | Dec 28 16:57 |
| MinceR | lol no generics | Dec 28 16:57 |
| scientes | MinceR, it has generics | Dec 28 16:57 |
| MinceR | rust does have inheritance, but only single | Dec 28 16:57 |
| scientes | and they are not even special | Dec 28 16:57 |
| MinceR | yet someone's pushing it as a replacement to c++ | Dec 28 16:57 |
| MinceR | which i find laughable | Dec 28 16:57 |
| MinceR | go doesn't have generics | Dec 28 16:57 |
| scientes | they are provided by a feature that just happens to provide generics | Dec 28 16:57 |
| scientes | same with templates | Dec 28 16:57 |
| scientes | this is a awesome thing about zig: generics and templates are provided without anyone having to even know what those things are | Dec 28 16:58 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: "it" == Rust, Go or Zig? | Dec 28 16:58 |
| MinceR | i prefer the python way | Dec 28 16:58 |
| scientes | zig | Dec 28 16:58 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: "lol no generics" was about Go | Dec 28 16:58 |
| scientes | zig has comptime | Dec 28 16:58 |
| MinceR | where i don't need generics because i can just accept values of any type and deal with them when convenient | Dec 28 16:58 |
| scientes | which provides generics and template | Dec 28 16:58 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: In that would be fn foo(comptime T: type) | Dec 28 17:00 |
| -->pidgin_log (~roy@host81-152-238-96.range81-152.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights | Dec 28 17:01 | |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Why not the Perl5 way? :D | Dec 28 17:03 |
| XRevan86 | Now that's The Way | Dec 28 17:03 |
| MinceR | because perl5 oop is incredibly messy | Dec 28 17:03 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: It is. | Dec 28 17:03 |
| MinceR | i kind of got started with python because i didn't really want to touch perl5 oop | Dec 28 17:03 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Functions there are also a joke. | Dec 28 17:04 |
| XRevan86 | hence the joks | Dec 28 17:04 |
| XRevan86 | * the joke | Dec 28 17:04 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Functions there don't actually have an argument list, instead everything's supplied to a function goes into an array @_ | Dec 28 17:05 |
| XRevan86 | Either that's inspired by bash functions or by @ARGV directly. | Dec 28 17:05 |
| XRevan86 | or rather, shell functions | Dec 28 17:05 |
| MinceR | iirc you can still specify how many arguments you want to take | Dec 28 17:06 |
| MinceR | and shift them into variables | Dec 28 17:06 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: You can, through a magical hack called a prototype. | Dec 28 17:06 |
| XRevan86 | or dynamically throw an error when you didn't get the right amount, yes | Dec 28 17:07 |
| XRevan86 | I have to mention https://perldoc.perl.org/perlsub.html#Signatures , Perl5 does have a proper argument list, but in an experimental feature, which will likely stay experimental indefinitely. | Dec 28 17:09 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-perlsub - perldoc.perl.org | Dec 28 17:09 | |
| XRevan86 | 1. it's already been brewing there for ~5 years 2. it partially conflicts with "prototypes" | Dec 28 17:10 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: About OOP, I'd imagine that Moops makes things much more palatable. | Dec 28 17:16 |
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| MinceR | https://ircz.de/p/19083167 | Dec 28 17:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object | Dec 28 17:28 | |
| XRevan86 | scientes: This not very complicated snippet uses undocumented features of Zig | Dec 28 17:29 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: Because there's barely any thing documented %) | Dec 28 17:29 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: Unclear from the photograph whether that case is the official one. | Dec 28 17:30 |
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| MinceR | that's a back cover, not a case | Dec 28 17:32 |
| XRevan86 | right | Dec 28 17:32 |
| XRevan86 | Still can be unofficial. | Dec 28 17:32 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | schestowitz There was an article the other day that said the Ryuk malware would stop encrypting Linux. | Dec 28 17:37 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Then it turned out it's Windows malware and what they meant was it blacklisted some WSL folders. | Dec 28 17:37 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | It did not exclude home for that matter. I'm not entirely sure how WSL works though. | Dec 28 17:40 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Probably home is a symlink back to the C:\Users\Whatever | Dec 28 17:41 |
| DaemonFC[m] | That's exactlt what it would want to encrypt. Ignoring Windows folders where there is no user data makes the malware work better, so of course they'll exclude some WSL stuff. Who cares? | Dec 28 17:42 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: "I have a PR fixing it, and it was rejected because andrew......" – I cannot find your MR. | Dec 28 17:45 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: "its kinda bullshit right now because strict aliasing was abandoned" – it's not like I can make something better directly in the code. | Dec 28 18:02 |
| XRevan86 | No matter, it looks like a pointer swap with a temporary variable, that's not that bad. | Dec 28 18:03 |
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| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux doesnt have Photoshop http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132232 [https://pleroma.site/objects/65adf7cd-e546-4618-a49c-3a36c3f90d83] | Dec 28 18:05 | |
| XRevan86 | scientes: And std.mem.copy looks very dumb %) | Dec 28 18:05 |
| MinceR | https://ircz.de/p/19091144 | Dec 28 18:06 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de | IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object | Dec 28 18:06 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Revealed: The BEST Ubuntu Release of the Past 10 Years http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132233 [https://pleroma.site/objects/6f94f69b-0d9b-4945-9d1d-619b2444dabf] | Dec 28 18:07 | |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC[m]: yes, I saw that | Dec 28 18:10 |
| schestowitz | I also responded to that crap in techrights and tuxmachines | Dec 28 18:10 |
| schestowitz | this is coming from a typical anti-Linux site | Dec 28 18:10 |
| XRevan86 | scientes: But the "documentation" states "The optimizer is intelligent enough to turn the above snippet into a memcpy.", so I assume this is fine. | Dec 28 18:10 |
| schestowitz | they called it "Windows Linux" | Dec 28 18:10 |
| schestowitz | which I found to be strage | Dec 28 18:10 |
| schestowitz | WSL | Dec 28 18:10 |
| schestowitz | I guess Linux is just "part" of Windows now | Dec 28 18:11 |
| schestowitz | they've been attempting to hijack the brands for a while, at least months | Dec 28 18:11 |
| schestowitz | that article also said "folders' | Dec 28 18:11 |
| schestowitz | Linux has no "folders" | Dec 28 18:11 |
| schestowitz | it has directories | Dec 28 18:11 |
| XRevan86 | "Windows' Linux" (with an apostrophe) makes slightly more sense. | Dec 28 18:11 |
| schestowitz | so you see they mess around with terminology as well | Dec 28 18:12 |
| schestowitz | <li><h5><a href="https://www.techradar.com/news/ryuk-ransomware-spares-windows-linux-installs">Ryuk ransomware spares Windows Linux installs</a></h5> | Dec 28 18:12 |
| schestowitz | <blockquote><p>A new variant of the Ryuk ransomware now blacklists Linux folders used on Windows 10, so as to avoid encrypting them. | Dec 28 18:12 |
| schestowitz | The change avoids affecting the folders for the Windows Subsystem for Linux (WSL), which allows Linux to be installed as a virtual machine on Windows 10. | Dec 28 18:12 |
| schestowitz | </p></blockquote></li> | Dec 28 18:12 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Ryuk ransomware spares Windows Linux installs | TechRadar | Dec 28 18:12 | |
| schestowitz | bleepingcomputer started it iirc | Dec 28 18:12 |
| schestowitz | and then the clickbait sites | Dec 28 18:12 |
| MinceR | Microsoft Linux | Dec 28 18:12 |
| MinceR | from the Microsoft-controlled Linux Foundation | Dec 28 18:13 |
| schestowitz | not yet :-) | Dec 28 18:13 |
| schestowitz | work in progress | Dec 28 18:13 |
| XRevan86 | http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_NXfYc7QPkKU/TRwgk7D6HxI/AAAAAAAAAnc/FBkCNWXXf2I/s1600/Screenshot-Nautilus-context-menu.png | Dec 28 18:13 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Technically, the WSL 2 Linux kernel does make that Linux kernel a Windows component. | Dec 28 18:13 |
| MinceR | its workers kept in line by the threats of the Linux Foundation and Microsoft's SJW troll army | Dec 28 18:13 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Not much different than CoLinux except Microsoft is distributing it. | Dec 28 18:13 |
| schestowitz | http://techrights.org/2019/11/26/microsoft-linux-entryism-2019/ | Dec 28 18:13 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Microsoft Employees Being Put in Charge of Linux | Techrights | Dec 28 18:14 | |
| schestowitz | Linus turned 50 today | Dec 28 18:14 |
| schestowitz | he's being thrown aside | Dec 28 18:14 |
| MinceR | he's been thrown aside | Dec 28 18:14 |
| *XRevan86 always uses "directory", but "folder" isn't new in GNU/Linux UI design at all. | Dec 28 18:14 | |
| DaemonFC[m] | I don't really care if there's some Microsoft code in Linux if it is under the GPL and either I don't have to use it or it was beaten into shape instead of being their usual garbage. | Dec 28 18:14 |
| schestowitz | XRevan86: yes, it's wrong | Dec 28 18:14 |
| schestowitz | I saw that before in gnome | Dec 28 18:14 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I remember with the hyperv driver, Greg KH kept on about how bad it was and Novell was paying him to fix it. | Dec 28 18:15 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC[m]: MS is not just distributing it | Dec 28 18:15 |
| schestowitz | it is controlling and spying on it | Dec 28 18:15 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Really at the time it was Microsoft money going through Novell thaf was paying him, so.... | Dec 28 18:15 |
| schestowitz | and it is used to push Windows | Dec 28 18:15 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC[m]: Microsoft paid to fix it | Dec 28 18:16 |
| schestowitz | through Novell | Dec 28 18:16 |
| DaemonFC[m] | > it is controlling and spying on it | Dec 28 18:16 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Only anyone who uses WSL. Dunno why you would. | Dec 28 18:16 |
| schestowitz | Novell was like a MSFT contractor also for OOXML | Dec 28 18:16 |
| schestowitz | in Go-OO | Dec 28 18:16 |
| schestowitz | when they added OOXMl support to it | Dec 28 18:16 |
| schestowitz | however poor | Dec 28 18:16 |
| schestowitz | that helped with ECMA and ISO | Dec 28 18:16 |
| schestowitz | They bribed for 'inertia' | Dec 28 18:16 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | "Hey, you know how Linux is 20% faster than Windows 10, hardly crashes, and doesn't get viruses? Now you can run it on Windows 10 and get all the disadvantages of Windows 10.". | Dec 28 18:17 |
| XRevan86 | DaemonFC[m]: It's a developer thing. | Dec 28 18:17 |
| XRevan86 | DaemonFC[m]: Microsoft is trying to make development for Linux-based servers as comfy as possible. | Dec 28 18:18 |
| XRevan86 | so that you don't need to actually use anything Linux anywhere else, but your servers | Dec 28 18:19 |
| XRevan86 | s/, but/but/ | Dec 28 18:19 |
| DaemonFC[m] | By putting it in the worst operating system ever? | Dec 28 18:19 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Developers developers developers developers...developers developers developers! | Dec 28 18:19 |
| XRevan86 | DaemonFC[m]: Like that matters here. | Dec 28 18:19 |
| XRevan86 | Microsoft has diven in to GNU/Linux on servers, and in that reality they want as much of themselves as possible. | Dec 28 18:22 |
| XRevan86 | Boot your Windows 10, launch Visual Studio (Code), code some crap on C#, test it in WSL, push to a GNU/Linux server on Azure, run it with .NET Core. | Dec 28 18:24 |
| XRevan86 | ^ this is why WSL exists | Dec 28 18:24 |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: MPV 0.31 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132236 [https://pleroma.site/objects/baa87a42-955f-4943-86f6-ca9c49f7644a] | Dec 28 18:28 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games: Barony, GB Studio and Teeworlds http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132237 [https://pleroma.site/objects/2415cb92-a827-45f9-8f0a-478452aa4e18] | Dec 28 18:31 | |
| MinceR | some steps are missing | Dec 28 18:45 |
| MinceR | like "wait until Backdoors10 reboots 9 times because 'updates'" | Dec 28 18:45 |
| MinceR | and "wonder why none of it works properly" | Dec 28 18:45 |
| MinceR | and "look for documentation on the botNET Framework in vain" | Dec 28 18:45 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: I outlined the idea which Microsoft is going for | Dec 28 18:46 |
| MinceR | also, it isn't a GNU/Linux server, it's a systemd/Linux server | Dec 28 18:46 |
| MinceR | ah, that idea can be expressed much more simply | Dec 28 18:46 |
| MinceR | "world domination, even if everything in it including us dies" | Dec 28 18:46 |
| MinceR | also, i thought they wanted to sell visual studio, not have people use vs code free of charge | Dec 28 18:47 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: I think they'll continue focusing on VS Code more. It caught on. | Dec 28 18:48 |
| MinceR | maybe it's easier to gobble tons of RAM if they have crashium running underneath | Dec 28 18:48 |
| XRevan86 | It promotes them, improves their chances of getting the "Microsoft stack" in more places | Dec 28 18:48 |
| MinceR | https://vid.pr0gramm.com/2019/12/13/58bfd90d25badb95.mp4 | Dec 28 18:51 |
| MinceR | since the "microsoft stack" sucks so hard, it's a lot easier to get the "microsoft stack" in more places by just taking over stuff that sucks less and turning it into part of the "microsoft stack" | Dec 28 18:51 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: VS Code wasn't made in Microsoft initially either %) | Dec 28 18:52 |
| XRevan86 | so yes | Dec 28 18:52 |
| MinceR | yeah, they used one of their older tricks for that | Dec 28 18:52 |
| MinceR | they bought github :> | Dec 28 18:52 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: VS Code caught on before that. | Dec 28 18:53 |
| MinceR | too bad microshit is like ShitMidas and everything they touch turns into shit | Dec 28 18:54 |
| XRevan86 | It's an absolute mystery for me whom Atom.io is still being developed for. | Dec 28 18:55 |
| MinceR | for microsloth | Dec 28 18:55 |
| XRevan86 | https://github.com/atom/atom/graphs/code-frequency https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode/graphs/code-frequency | Dec 28 18:55 |
| XRevan86 | "developed" | Dec 28 18:55 |
| MinceR | or maybe for web hipsters | Dec 28 18:55 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Code frequency · atom/atom · GitHub | Dec 28 18:55 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Code frequency · microsoft/vscode · GitHub | Dec 28 18:56 | |
| XRevan86 | "for microsloth" – not anymore it appears | Dec 28 18:56 |
| XRevan86 | I wonder if people who work on Atom.io are actually getting paid… | Dec 28 18:57 |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132238 [https://pleroma.site/objects/99a318fd-7d15-4877-b434-371f4335fd3a] | Dec 28 19:01 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Plasma hidden gems: removable media http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132235 [https://pleroma.site/objects/a0979523-2fcc-495a-9f01-30f6572bf17c] | Dec 28 19:02 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132234 [https://pleroma.site/objects/6ce035f9-11ba-4b90-a109-690edecd8f10] | Dec 28 19:03 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux 5.6 Plans, Linux 5.5 and 5.4 Benchmarks http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132239 [https://pleroma.site/objects/2b4eaa04-45b2-4c91-ac03-35c37ca6b9ef] | Dec 28 19:08 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: A Brief History of Open Source Software http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132240 [https://pleroma.site/objects/cd5eff13-502a-408f-a551-455398b0d5c4] | Dec 28 19:12 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: phpMyAdmin 5.0.0 is released http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132241 [https://pleroma.site/objects/4a8c7211-1b8c-4429-9cf1-04913564d2b4] | Dec 28 19:17 | |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Open Source Migrates With Emotional Distress http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132242 [https://pleroma.site/objects/11d474b9-bbfe-4eef-9d28-12fa79ad5155] | Dec 28 19:23 | |
| XRevan86 | scientes: If you mentioned that, because it's inefficient compared to C, then don't worry, this kind of overhead won't even register on the radar %). | Dec 28 19:23 |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: openSUSE Board election 2019-2020 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132243 [https://pleroma.site/objects/99e87565-1c2c-4745-9206-e1ee4c6e1c56] | Dec 28 19:34 | |
| XRevan86 | What matters the most is looping performance, array semi-random access performance, variables and comparisons. Of course variable swapping, but not as much (outer loop). | Dec 28 19:34 |
| XRevan86 | Surprisingly a lot can be said about a language from this. | Dec 28 19:35 |
| XRevan86 | https://sourceforge.net/p/octave/strings/ci/default/tree/inst/editdistance.m#l58 like that a math language Octave doesn't have it of any decent performance in any way. | Dec 28 19:35 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-sourceforge.net | Octave Forge / strings / [db1ee7] /inst/editdistance.m | Dec 28 19:35 | |
| XRevan86 | Because loops are slow, and the implementation they do provide is written in Octave %). | Dec 28 19:36 |
| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games and Retro http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132244 [https://pleroma.site/objects/c996a674-85aa-4b4f-afe0-501b47872e0f] | Dec 28 19:37 | |
| XRevan86 | And for some reason that's more sad for me than Raku (Rakudo/MoarVM) having the same issue. | Dec 28 19:38 |
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| -viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Programming: C, Perl and Python http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132245 [https://pleroma.site/objects/519bb2c0-9a86-4da5-9d0e-67482fab9c22] | Dec 28 20:16 | |
| MinceR | https://full.pr0gramm.com/2019/12/13/0cdead6dabdf7c91.jpg | Dec 28 20:29 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | I figured out the wumping sounds the car waa making, MinceR | Dec 28 21:03 |
| MinceR | lol | Dec 28 21:03 |
| DaemonFC[m] | It wasn't the suspension, the tire, or anything terribly important. | Dec 28 21:03 |
| DaemonFC[m] | One of the ebrake cables snapped and was hitting the rim as I drove the car. | Dec 28 21:04 |
| MinceR | sounds like something important | Dec 28 21:04 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Instead of having it fixed, it's zip tied to something else. | Dec 28 21:04 |
| MinceR | at least if you like the car to stay where you leave it even if it's not a perfectly flat piece of road | Dec 28 21:04 |
| DaemonFC[m] | The ebrake still works on 3 out of 4 wheels. | Dec 28 21:05 |
| DaemonFC[m] | And that ain't bad. | Dec 28 21:05 |
| MinceR | lol | Dec 28 21:05 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I don't feel like spending money to fix something I've never used on any car in 20 years of driving. | Dec 28 21:05 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Which 75% still works anyway | Dec 28 21:06 |
| DaemonFC[m] | MinceR With all the broken shit that I had to replace after mom gave it to me.... | Dec 28 21:09 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I'm losing my appetite for expensive repairs. | Dec 28 21:09 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 28 21:09 |
| DaemonFC[m] | It needs one more. A fuel line and the filter. | Dec 28 21:09 |
| DaemonFC[m] | She left the original one on there so long that it's permanent as removing it would break the shitty rusted line that will eventually be leaking anyway. | Dec 28 21:10 |
| DaemonFC[m] | It's causing an intermittent drop in fuel pressure that isn't terribly severe. | Dec 28 21:11 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I thought eh just replace the filter, but it's fused to the line itself now. | Dec 28 21:11 |
| DaemonFC[m] | It'll run until Monday when I can just have them replace the filter and the line. | Dec 28 21:12 |
| DaemonFC[m] | MinceR I doubt it's done any serious damage. Those things can be surprisingly old and not be badly plugged up, which is why people don't pay any attention. | Dec 28 21:20 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | Especially since gasoline is a lot cleaner tha it used to be. Unless you're using filthy ran down gas stations all the time. | Dec 28 21:21 |
| DaemonFC[m] | I always eyeball the station and assume if it looks bad on the outside their storage tanks probably aren't any good. | Dec 28 21:22 |
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| MinceR | https://ircz.de/p/19091124 | Dec 28 21:54 |
| danielp3344 | MinceR: You should get a cat | Dec 28 21:59 |
| danielp3344 | They're rather nice to have around | Dec 28 21:59 |
| schestowitz | mess to have around, too | Dec 28 21:59 |
| danielp3344 | schestowitz: not as bad as some pets | Dec 28 21:59 |
| schestowitz | and hard to go on holiday | Dec 28 21:59 |
| danielp3344 | This is true | Dec 28 22:00 |
| schestowitz | danielp3344: true, you need not walk them out | Dec 28 22:00 |
| danielp3344 | Having both cats and a dog the cats are far less work | Dec 28 22:00 |
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| MinceR | danielp3344: i don't have a good place to host cats | Dec 28 22:04 |
| MinceR | this apartment isn't even fit for human habitation | Dec 28 22:04 |
| schestowitz | try /usr/bin | Dec 28 22:04 |
| MinceR | cats do visit the holiday house but i can't take care of them there | Dec 28 22:04 |
| schestowitz | fedora is merging the bins for cat | Dec 28 22:05 |
| danielp3344 | :'( | Dec 28 22:05 |
| schestowitz | which cat | Dec 28 22:05 |
| schestowitz | /bin/cat | Dec 28 22:05 |
| schestowitz | I see that Ubuntu does too | Dec 28 22:05 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | https://www.purina.co.uk/cats/cat-breeds/breed-selector | Dec 28 22:42 |
| DaemonFC[m] | Which cat? /opt/cat | Dec 28 22:47 |
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| DaemonFC[m] | Whose cat? Our cat! | Dec 28 23:10 |
| DaemonFC[m] | What do we want? Meow! When do we want it? MEOW! | Dec 28 23:10 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 28 23:23 |
| MinceR | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rlSjdnAKY4 | Dec 28 23:24 |
| MinceR | https://img.pr0gramm.com/2019/12/13/edd81c3f9335c122.png | Dec 28 23:28 |
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| XRevan86 | https://docs.julialang.org/en/v1/base/math/index.html#Base.abs2 | Dec 28 23:38 |
| XRevan86 | https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/blob/v1.3.0/base/number.jl#L157 | Dec 28 23:38 |
| XRevan86 | Whaaaaaaah | Dec 28 23:38 |
| XRevan86 | Is this to avoid lambdas when doing x^2 in a map or something? | Dec 28 23:41 |
| XRevan86 | I.e. map(abs2, [1, 2, 3, 4]) instead of map(x -> x^2, [1, 2, 3, 4]) | Dec 28 23:43 |
| XRevan86 | But even then the name is peculiar. | Dec 28 23:45 |
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