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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: July 22nd, 2010

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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Apache Software Foundation Board Members, #Mozilla Bug Bounty, Governments Approach #FreeSoftware http://ur1.ca/0t6jhJul 22 00:12
TechrightsBotTitle: Links: Apache Software Foundation Board Members, Mozilla Bug Bounty, Governments Approach Free Software | Techrights .::. Size~: 95.05 KBJul 22 00:12
DaemonFChmmm, Mandriva has a 64-bit version of eduke32Jul 22 00:25
*DaemonFC goes off to find his old Duke Nukem mapsJul 22 00:25
schestowitzMandriva 2010 ForeverJul 22 00:29
DaemonFCschestowitz: My music sound different in KDEJul 22 00:33
DaemonFCoddJul 22 00:33
DaemonFCit's using GstreamerJul 22 00:34
schestowitzHow different?Jul 22 00:36
DaemonFCI like itJul 22 00:36
DaemonFCsounds clearerJul 22 00:37
DaemonFCI know it's not my imaginationJul 22 00:37
DaemonFCI wonder what's doing thatJul 22 00:37
schestowitzsame players?Jul 22 00:53
schestowitzMaybe it doesn't use gstreamerJul 22 00:53
schestowitzKDE has its ownJul 22 00:53
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DaemonFCI'm using GstreamerJul 22 00:58
DaemonFCit's the only backend installedJul 22 00:58
DaemonFCXine is a messJul 22 00:59
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft Booster Thinks #Vista Phone 7 is Dead on Arrival http://ur1.ca/0t6ya #mobile #hypephoneJul 22 01:00
TechrightsBotTitle: Microsoft Booster Thinks Vista Phone 7 is Dead on Arrival | Techrights .::. Size~: 89.52 KBJul 22 01:00
*DaemonFC smacks schestowitz with Alan ShimelJul 22 01:04
DaemonFCB-)Jul 22 01:04
DaemonFChmmmJul 22 01:04
DaemonFCschestowitz: Jul 22 01:04
DaemonFChttp://www.networkworld.com/community/blog/11778Jul 22 01:05
TechrightsBotTitle: Open Source Fact and Fiction .::. Size~: 84.77 KBJul 22 01:05
DaemonFCthe CISO groupJul 22 01:05
DaemonFCyou click on their link and their home page says they're a Microsoft affiliateJul 22 01:05
DaemonFCthey need to hide their shills betterJul 22 01:06
DaemonFCopen source fictionJul 22 01:09
DaemonFCbrought to you by Friends of MicrosoftJul 22 01:09
DaemonFChttp://www.vevo.com/watch/rihanna/disturbia/USUV70802187Jul 22 01:41
TechrightsBotTitle: Disturbia - Rihanna | Music Video | VEVO .::. Size~: 24.36 KBJul 22 01:41
*DaemonFC is dancing in his underwearJul 22 01:41
DaemonFCthere's benefits of living aloneJul 22 01:41
DaemonFCwhy do people put Mandriva Powerpack on torrent sites?Jul 22 01:45
DaemonFCit's not like it has anything importantJul 22 01:46
DaemonFCFluendo codecs actually make it worth less to meJul 22 01:46
DaemonFCI don't want to fund themJul 22 01:46
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DaemonFChttp://mso-chronicles.blogspot.com/2008/09/gstreamer-is-future.htmlJul 22 01:59
TechrightsBotTitle: Error processing the URL:  .::. Size~: 0 KBJul 22 01:59
DaemonFChehJul 22 01:59
DaemonFCMandriva has been using Gstreamer in KDE for some timeJul 22 02:01
DaemonFCthe rest seem to still be using XineJul 22 02:01
DaemonFCI guess Mandriva's main reason for Gstreamer is that it's the only way to get legally licensed codecs (Fluendo)Jul 22 02:02
DaemonFCbut it's still a better frameworkJul 22 02:02
ender2070fedora uses bothJul 22 02:07
DaemonFCender2070: Songbird on Windows is pretty lulzyJul 22 02:10
DaemonFCit has to package Gstreamer and all its plugins alongside the main applicationJul 22 02:11
DaemonFCwhich is essentially FirefoxJul 22 02:11
DaemonFCthe reason for this is probably because once upon a time they cared about being cross platform and now all the care about is WindowsJul 22 02:12
DaemonFCbut the damage is done :PJul 22 02:12
ender2070oh godJul 22 02:12
ender2070no wonder its so fucking bloatedJul 22 02:12
ender2070and slowJul 22 02:12
ender2070firefox AND gstreamerJul 22 02:12
ender2070firefox is bad enoughJul 22 02:12
DaemonFCyeahJul 22 02:12
DaemonFCthe good news, is it ports wellJul 22 02:12
DaemonFCthe bad news is that it's Firefox, VLC, Gstreamer, a bunch of Firefox extensions, and then some other crap all in oneJul 22 02:13
DaemonFCit's basically an entire operating system dedicated to being an overglorofied media library that spied on youJul 22 02:13
DaemonFCand it can't even do things like transcodingJul 22 02:13
ender2070it will when they include k3b to do it or somethingJul 22 02:14
DaemonFCender2070: They also bundle libmtpJul 22 02:14
DaemonFC:DJul 22 02:14
DaemonFCso it can crash when you plug your Zune in I guessJul 22 02:14
ender2070awesomeJul 22 02:14
ender2070sounds like a perfect windows applicationJul 22 02:14
DaemonFCit isJul 22 02:14
DaemonFCit was funny when they packed up and left Linux support behindJul 22 02:15
DaemonFCnobody cared by that pointJul 22 02:15
ender2070yeah it dropped out of my mind at that pointJul 22 02:15
ender2070why run two browsers though, anywaysJul 22 02:15
ender2070I usually have one open when im listening to musicJul 22 02:15
ender2070double bloatJul 22 02:16
DaemonFCyou can install Adblock Plus in SongbirdJul 22 02:16
DaemonFCand use it as a Firefox web browserJul 22 02:16
ender2070lolJul 22 02:16
DaemonFC:PJul 22 02:16
ender2070an outdated oneJul 22 02:16
DaemonFCtrueJul 22 02:16
DaemonFCFirefox 3.0-ish web browserJul 22 02:16
DaemonFC:DJul 22 02:16
DaemonFCXUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUL!!!!!!Jul 22 02:17
DaemonFCChoose the form of your PC's destroyer!Jul 22 02:18
DaemonFC:PJul 22 02:18
DaemonFCOh god, it's the Stay Puft Marshmallow media player browser!Jul 22 02:18
ender2070they probably could've just used webkitJul 22 02:18
ender2070and gstreamerJul 22 02:18
ender2070oh wait, thats chromiumJul 22 02:19
DaemonFCthey should have used Xine for what they're doingJul 22 02:19
DaemonFCXine was meant to be embedded in an applicationJul 22 02:19
DaemonFCnot to be a general purpose media frameworkJul 22 02:19
ender2070it connects to gstreamer to be honestJul 22 02:19
ender2070doesnt include its own, just uses it if its thereJul 22 02:20
ender2070if you have the latest ffmeg too you get webmJul 22 02:20
DaemonFCKDE developers curse and spit at Gstreamer even though it works much better in KDE than XineJul 22 02:20
DaemonFCthey were even trying to FUD it for a whileJul 22 02:20
ender2070???Jul 22 02:20
ender2070They're going to gstreamer nowJul 22 02:20
DaemonFChttp://amaroklive.com/blog/archives/91-Backends,-Phonon,-GStreamer.htmlJul 22 02:21
TechrightsBotTitle: Backends, Phonon, GStreamer  - Amarok Blog .::. Size~: 56.38 KBJul 22 02:21
ender2070thats 4 years agoJul 22 02:21
ender2070yes, gstreamer did suck back thenJul 22 02:21
ender2070and the amarok guys != KDEJul 22 02:21
DaemonFCan abstraction layer is necessary if you don't want to tie yourself down to a media framework that doesn't have the same objectives as your projectJul 22 02:22
DaemonFCbut the problem isn't a gstreamer exclusiveJul 22 02:22
DaemonFCor else they would have just hunkered down and made everyone use XineJul 22 02:22
DaemonFCif it was so greatJul 22 02:22
ender2070the distros started including it and gnome apps started using itJul 22 02:23
ender2070they kind of have to support itJul 22 02:23
ender2070its popular nowJul 22 02:23
ender2070especially with NoobuntuJul 22 02:23
DaemonFChttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARtsJul 22 02:23
TechrightsBotTitle: aRts - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 51.85 KBJul 22 02:23
DaemonFCnobody wanted a repeat of thatJul 22 02:24
DaemonFCso Phonon makes senseJul 22 02:24
ender2070yeahJul 22 02:24
ender2070arts wasn't bad when it came outJul 22 02:24
ender2070alsa kind of made it useless, but thats a new technologyJul 22 02:25
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ender2070arts predates alsaJul 22 02:25
DaemonFCyeah, other unix systems still have OSSJul 22 02:25
DaemonFCthey did go back to making a FOSS version I believeJul 22 02:25
DaemonFCtrying to go proprietary, gets replaced by ALSA and banished to the BSDs and Solaris where most users don't even care about multimediaJul 22 02:28
DaemonFCpanic and try to make it FOSS againJul 22 02:28
DaemonFCtoo lateJul 22 02:28
DaemonFC:PJul 22 02:28
DaemonFCFAILJul 22 02:28
DaemonFCOSS is inferior to ALSA at this pointJul 22 02:29
DaemonFCyou can patch it in and use it with Linux, but there's no pointJul 22 02:29
cubezzz3I'm sure BSD folks still want soundJul 22 02:30
DaemonFCyeah, it works Jul 22 02:30
DaemonFCit's total crapJul 22 02:31
DaemonFCbut it worksJul 22 02:31
DaemonFCkind ofJul 22 02:31
DaemonFCusuallyJul 22 02:31
ender2070I wonder why the BSD folks hate alsaJul 22 02:31
DaemonFCbecause they can't use itJul 22 02:31
ender2070I guess its cause they don't get free linux sound driversJul 22 02:31
DaemonFCwell, they could use itJul 22 02:31
DaemonFCbut it would require portingJul 22 02:32
cubezzz3I still have OSS, Arts and ESDJul 22 02:32
DaemonFCthen they'd have to distribute the entire kernel under the GPLJul 22 02:32
cubezzz3I don't have any problems with itJul 22 02:32
DaemonFCneither of which are happeningJul 22 02:32
DaemonFCALSA is much more closely tied to the Linux kernel than OSS ever wasJul 22 02:33
DaemonFCOSS is fairly genericJul 22 02:33
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cubezzz3you're assuming no one runs older systemsJul 22 02:33
cubezzz3I run a mix of old and newJul 22 02:33
DaemonFCwell, on an old pile of crap box or a headless server, you don't care if OSS supports timer schedulingJul 22 02:34
DaemonFCor proper surround soundJul 22 02:34
cubezzz3it's hardly crap if it worksJul 22 02:34
DaemonFCit works if you want to go back in time by about 5-6 yearsJul 22 02:34
cubezzz3old Loki games?Jul 22 02:35
cubezzz3some of those might not work with newer distrosJul 22 02:35
DaemonFCALSA's OSS emulation is good enough for ancient softwareJul 22 02:35
DaemonFCBSD people are disgusted by all things GPLJul 22 02:36
DaemonFCand fidn every excuse to FUD LinuxJul 22 02:36
cubezzz3like who?Jul 22 02:36
DaemonFChave you ever looked at the PC-BSD forumJul 22 02:37
cubezzz3nopeJul 22 02:37
DaemonFCone thread is "ZOMG, Linux sucks, rofl!!!"Jul 22 02:37
DaemonFC"We picked the best!"Jul 22 02:37
cubezzz3very informativeJul 22 02:37
DaemonFCthen the other forum was like "Why aren't there any Nvidia drivers for 64-bit BSD?"Jul 22 02:37
DaemonFCoh right, missing kernel featuresJul 22 02:37
DaemonFCthat was only VERY recently addressedJul 22 02:38
ender2070[21:27] <cubezzz3> you're assuming no one runs older systemsJul 22 02:38
cubezzz3there's more action on the Linux side Jul 22 02:38
ender2070no one doesJul 22 02:38
cubezzz3I'm not anti-BSD thoughJul 22 02:38
DaemonFCwhat was funny was when iXSystems licensed the entire PC-BSD distribution under GPLJul 22 02:38
DaemonFCcause they thought that using KDE and QT meant the whole thing had to be GPL'dJul 22 02:39
DaemonFC:DJul 22 02:39
DaemonFCit pissed a lot of people offJul 22 02:39
ender2070awesome!Jul 22 02:39
ender2070:DJul 22 02:39
ender2070when did they do thatJul 22 02:39
DaemonFCfirst versionJul 22 02:39
cubezzz3uh, can they really do that?Jul 22 02:39
DaemonFCfew years agoJul 22 02:39
ender2070yesJul 22 02:39
ender2070they canJul 22 02:40
DaemonFCyes, they canJul 22 02:40
cubezzz3sounds kind of wrongJul 22 02:40
DaemonFC:)Jul 22 02:40
cubezzz3huh, surprisingJul 22 02:40
ender2070you can wrap the GPL around BSD licensed codeJul 22 02:40
ender2070its compatible one wayJul 22 02:40
DaemonFCwhich is why the BSD people were pissedJul 22 02:40
DaemonFC:DJul 22 02:40
ender2070BSD just wants attribsJul 22 02:40
ender2070you got itJul 22 02:40
ender2070lolJul 22 02:40
DaemonFChttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PC-BSD#LicenseJul 22 02:41
TechrightsBotTitle: PC-BSD - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 57.67 KBJul 22 02:41
DaemonFC"PC-BSD was originally licensed under the GNU General Public License (GPL) because the developers were under the impression that applications using the Qt toolkit, which PC-BSD uses for its interface development, must be licensed under the GPL or the QPL. Upon discovering that there was no such restriction in fact, the PC-BSD developers later relicensed the code under a BSD-like license."Jul 22 02:41
DaemonFC:DJul 22 02:41
cubezzz3ok, so it reverted back to the BSD licenseJul 22 02:41
DaemonFCrightJul 22 02:41
DaemonFCthere are no binary drivers for ATIJul 22 02:42
DaemonFCwhich is why I won't touch itJul 22 02:43
DaemonFCwell, one reasonJul 22 02:43
DaemonFCit's limited to wherever "radeon" and mesa are Jul 22 02:43
ender2070I ran 8.1 RC on my machineJul 22 02:43
ender2070it was pretty niceJul 22 02:43
ender2070came with binary nvidia driversJul 22 02:43
DaemonFCthe 32-bit one didJul 22 02:43
ender207064-bitJul 22 02:43
DaemonFCthe 64-bit one couldn't use Nvidia drivers until recentlyJul 22 02:44
ender2070correctJul 22 02:44
ender20708.1 RC is the latestJul 22 02:44
ender2070well, now 8.1 finalJul 22 02:44
DaemonFCboth Nvidia and ATI have generic blobs, and then the kernel interface is in it's own packageJul 22 02:45
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DaemonFCbut like 85% of their driver cose is the same on all platformsJul 22 02:45
DaemonFC*codeJul 22 02:45
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DaemonFCATI's FGLRX drivers have a lot more changes between versions than what gets documentedJul 22 02:46
DaemonFCthey've already admitted that muchJul 22 02:46
DaemonFCso the release notes don't sound real exciting, but a lot has probably changedJul 22 02:46
Diablo-D3I think women should be banned from the Internet.Jul 22 02:47
Diablo-D3Their rights to "equality" need to be terminated.Jul 22 02:47
DaemonFCI think children shouldJul 22 02:47
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtHiut6hzTgJul 22 02:47
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- KEEP YOUR STUPID KIDS OFF THE INTERNET .::. Size~: 99.54 KBJul 22 02:47
Diablo-D3Until they can accept that the Internet is a genderless medium, and can stop dramawhoring about us not recognizing that they're women (ie, bowing down and worshipping them), they dont need to be here.Jul 22 02:47
DaemonFCDiablo-D3: They're like that offline tooJul 22 02:48
DaemonFC:)Jul 22 02:48
ender2070[21:41] <Diablo-D3> Until they can accept that the Internet is a genderless medium, and can stop dramawhoring about us not recognizing that they're women (ie, bowing down and worshipping them), they dont need to be here. +1Jul 22 02:48
DaemonFCthey want equal pay and benefitsJul 22 02:49
DaemonFCbut then they want easier workJul 22 02:49
Diablo-D3I got klined on an irc network because I refuse to accept people on irc as anything but people on irc.Jul 22 02:49
DaemonFCand time off whenever they decide to get pregnantJul 22 02:49
Diablo-D3The whole fucking Internet solved that "gender equality" shitJul 22 02:49
Diablo-D3there simply _isnt one_Jul 22 02:49
cubezzz3it's just a flame fest a lot of the timeJul 22 02:49
Diablo-D3you dont have a gender on IRC>Jul 22 02:49
Diablo-D3at all.Jul 22 02:49
DaemonFCI has a pee peeJul 22 02:49
DaemonFCthereJul 22 02:49
DaemonFC:PJul 22 02:50
ender2070theres people going around saying open source communities are worse than proprietary companies because they don't filter out menJul 22 02:50
DaemonFCnow you have genderJul 22 02:50
DaemonFCon the internetJul 22 02:50
DaemonFC:)Jul 22 02:50
DaemonFCender2070: obviously some of us need to have gender reassignmentJul 22 02:50
DaemonFCand take one for the teamJul 22 02:50
DaemonFCyou first!Jul 22 02:50
ender2070ROFLJul 22 02:50
DaemonFC:DJul 22 02:50
cubezzz3welcome to enunchNetJul 22 02:51
ender2070unfortunately it seems like someone already did, but is on their sideJul 22 02:51
ender2070"RMS IS SEXIST"Jul 22 02:51
DaemonFCthe be fair, I think in his species, the women are scarier than the menJul 22 02:52
DaemonFChe IS a Dwarf, right?Jul 22 02:52
cubezzz3eunuchJul 22 02:52
DaemonFCthe weight and beard are rightJul 22 02:52
cubezzz3more guys are murderers thoughJul 22 02:52
DaemonFCcubezzz3: sexistJul 22 02:52
cubezzz3lolJul 22 02:52
DaemonFCtelling us that women can't cut you up into little bits and dump you in the woodsJul 22 02:52
ender2070we're also better at suicide, women need to work on that a bit more - George CarlinJul 22 02:53
DaemonFCjust because they don't have penisesJul 22 02:53
DaemonFCyou chauvenist pig you!Jul 22 02:53
cubezzz3this time, I'm staying out of it :)Jul 22 02:53
ender2070http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJESXVWB7mAJul 22 02:53
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Female Equality .::. Size~: 75.43 KBJul 22 02:53
DaemonFCender2070: because men are for real about itJul 22 02:53
DaemonFCand women are just trying to be dramaticJul 22 02:53
DaemonFCand get attentionJul 22 02:53
DaemonFCif they had to deal with other women the way men have to deal with them, they'd hang and shoot themselves tooJul 22 02:54
DaemonFCtaking two vicodins is not a suicidal gestureJul 22 02:54
ender2070thats trueJul 22 02:54
ender2070women in lesbian marriages are more likely to commit suicideJul 22 02:55
DaemonFCyepJul 22 02:55
DaemonFCI don't trust anything that bleeds for 5 days and doesn't dieJul 22 02:55
DaemonFCB-)Jul 22 02:55
ender2070Ok Mr GarrisonJul 22 02:55
DaemonFCMrs. Garrison!Jul 22 02:55
DaemonFC:PJul 22 02:55
ender2070oh yeahJul 22 02:55
ender2070gender reassignmentJul 22 02:56
DaemonFCmmhmJul 22 02:56
DaemonFCand Mr. SlaveJul 22 02:56
DaemonFC:PJul 22 02:56
ender2070Jeeesus ChrisssstJul 22 02:56
DaemonFCand Paris HiltonJul 22 02:56
DaemonFCB-)Jul 22 02:56
ender2070http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nT0OqHr3wHQJul 22 02:57
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- If you don't like america, you can git out .::. Size~: 86.63 KBJul 22 02:57
DaemonFChttp://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/154656/?searchterm=Stupid+Spoiled+Whore+Video+PlaysetJul 22 02:58
TechrightsBotTitle: Stupid Spoiled Whore Video Playset - Clips - South Park Studios .::. Size~: 156.57 KBJul 22 02:58
ender2070damn americaJul 22 02:58
ender2070i cant watchJul 22 02:58
DaemonFC"and 16 hits of ecstasy!"Jul 22 02:59
DaemonFCroflJul 22 02:59
DaemonFC16 hits is more than 2 people could live throughJul 22 02:59
ender2070http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8Crnfa2gWAJul 22 03:00
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Stupid Spoiled Whore Video Playset (Commentary) .::. Size~: 87.54 KBJul 22 03:00
DaemonFCNo kitty, this is my pot pie!Jul 22 03:03
DaemonFC:)Jul 22 03:03
DaemonFChttp://www.linux.com/archive/feature/54180Jul 22 03:05
TechrightsBotTitle: Linux.com :: Phonon and the future of KDE multimedia .::. Size~: 42.5 KBJul 22 03:05
DaemonFClol @ aRtsJul 22 03:05
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ender2070http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzBUeq4g9N8Jul 22 03:37
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Kenny Hotz Introduces His Daughter .::. Size~: 114.63 KBJul 22 03:37
ender2070http://www.tomgreen.com/?video=387Jul 22 03:55
TechrightsBotTitle: TomGreen.com - The Channel .::. Size~: 15.43 KBJul 22 03:55
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @jimmy_wales: Hello from my new Android phoneJul 22 03:57
DaemonFCender2070: Decided to install the KDE 4.5 RC2 for MandrivaJul 22 03:59
DaemonFC:PJul 22 03:59
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[ender2070/@ender2070] ♻ @rrix: @wftl "Ubuntu User" always makes me think that it's a drug or something... "Is that what the kids are smoking these days?"Jul 22 04:00
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[nsisodiya] now at ganganagarJul 22 04:04
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] Getting ready to wrap up a good SF-LUG meeting @noisebridgeJul 22 04:05
ender2070yeah?Jul 22 04:13
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cubezzz3didn't realize RCA used to make computersJul 22 05:05
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DaemonFCwell, that was disgustingJul 22 06:20
DaemonFCI just dusted the PCJul 22 06:20
DaemonFC:PJul 22 06:20
DaemonFCnow I'm trying to figure out where I put stuffJul 22 06:22
DaemonFCthis apartment's only like 2 feet by 2 feetJul 22 06:22
DaemonFCwhere the hell is all my stuff going?Jul 22 06:23
DaemonFC:PJul 22 06:23
DaemonFCender2070: I managed to suppress the dust bunny insurrectionJul 22 06:29
DaemonFC:PJul 22 06:29
DaemonFCit's amazing how quickly that crap can build up in thereJul 22 06:29
DaemonFCI just dusted that thing out like 3-4 months agoJul 22 06:29
DaemonFCWhat's that thing that let you choose how GTK programs look?Jul 22 06:36
DaemonFCin KDEJul 22 06:36
DaemonFCheh, qt-gtk-engineJul 22 06:37
DaemonFCwell, that's unusually helpfulJul 22 06:37
DaemonFC:)Jul 22 06:37
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DaemonFCMandriva has all GTK apps set to use Ia-Ora and they look like crap once you change your KDE themeJul 22 06:43
DaemonFCunless you know to install qt-gtk-engineJul 22 06:44
DaemonFCand configure thatJul 22 06:44
MinceRwho's Ia-Ora?Jul 22 06:47
ender2070I tried one version of mandriva that came with kde 4.3Jul 22 06:48
ender2070I found it amusing that after replacing kde with 4.4, the theme hardcoded a graphic labeling which version it used to be (4.3)Jul 22 06:48
DaemonFCwell, their Mandriva Control Center is using GTK+Jul 22 06:48
ender2070mandriva's themeJul 22 06:48
DaemonFCand so is Firefox obviouslyJul 22 06:48
DaemonFCso you switch your KDE theme and Firefox, MCC, and anything else GTK+ is still Ia OraJul 22 06:49
ender2070they dont expect anyone to use it long enough to change the default KDE themeJul 22 06:49
DaemonFC?Jul 22 06:50
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] Thanking @jimstockford for following me. Jim is a grfeat spirit, a true leader, & has sacrificed much comfort so that others might benefit.Jul 22 06:50
ender2070people realize 'this sucks' within the first few minutes, before they can customize anythingJul 22 06:50
DaemonFCwell, the GTK+ apps in a KDE environment make some hilarious inconsistenciesJul 22 06:50
DaemonFCwithout the GTK-QT engineJul 22 06:50
MinceRwhat inconsistencies?Jul 22 06:51
ender2070i dont notice any on fedoraJul 22 06:51
ender2070even when changing themes aroundJul 22 06:51
DaemonFCWhat Mandriva did was set all GTK+ apps to use Ia-Ora GTK+Jul 22 06:52
DaemonFCand all KDE stuff uses Ia Ora for KDEJul 22 06:52
DaemonFCbut when you switch your KDE theme, the GTK+ stuff is still Ia OraJul 22 06:52
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] The world wd be a better place if more ppl were as giving as @grantbow, @daemonicpenguin & @jimstockfordJul 22 06:52
ender2070so change itJul 22 06:52
DaemonFCso you have to install GTK-QT Engine which as far as I know, most distros come withJul 22 06:52
MinceRor you could use QtCurveJul 22 06:52
DaemonFCender2070: There's two different menus, the KDE Kicker menu and the KDE Classic menuJul 22 06:54
DaemonFCbut they both have Mandriva customizationsJul 22 06:54
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @br3nda: Every day 160,000 Android-powered devices are activated —that’s 2 every second.Jul 22 06:54
DaemonFCyou can turn those off from the Mandriva Control CenterJul 22 06:54
ender2070http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVBDwAuCdPwJul 22 06:54
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Oh Canada Movie 1 - Intro .::. Size~: 102.27 KBJul 22 06:54
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] RT @smaffulli The issue with serving asparagus at a big convention lunch is that they leave a too clear mark in the restrooms #oscon | ROTFLJul 22 06:56
DaemonFCat least Firefox doesn't look like ass nowJul 22 07:00
DaemonFChttp://img713.imageshack.us/img713/8410/snapshot1v.pngJul 22 07:00
TechrightsBotTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/png type .::. Size~: 0 KBJul 22 07:00
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] I just ousted @stuartblue as the mayor of London Luton Airport on @foursquare! http://4sq.com/b85jOaJul 22 07:05
TechrightsBotTitle: foursquare    :: London Luton Airport    :: Luton, UK   .::. Size~: 14.68 KBJul 22 07:05
schestowitzOdd that........Jul 22 07:11
schestowitzFor the second day in a row, when my LCD wakes up from sleep (power saving mode) is makes some off noises and refuses to come back to life. Weird noises... after some persistence and power (mains) on and off for a bit it comes back to life. What might these symptoms mean?Jul 22 07:12
DaemonFCweird noises and working when it feels like?Jul 22 07:22
DaemonFCI'm no expert, but I'd say it's about to fail :PJul 22 07:22
DaemonFCall that's left is for the magic smoke to come otJul 22 07:23
DaemonFC*outJul 22 07:23
DaemonFC:DJul 22 07:23
schestowitzhttp://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/opensource/?p=1689Jul 22 07:26
TechrightsBotTitle: TechRepublic Blogs: For IT professionals, by IT professionals .::. Size~: 83.02 KBJul 22 07:26
schestowitzDaemonFC: I've just disabled power saving for screensJul 22 07:27
schestowitzI reckon if it stays on it'll not have the issue recur for a whileJul 22 07:27
DaemonFCpossibleJul 22 07:28
DaemonFCwatch your power bill go upJul 22 07:28
DaemonFChttp://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-ap-in-monkeyattack,0,703805.storyJul 22 07:29
TechrightsBotTitle: Monkey escapes from cage, terrorizes Ind. family - chicagotribune.com .::. Size~: 115.15 KBJul 22 07:29
DaemonFCshoot itJul 22 07:29
DaemonFCender2070: Firefox seems to do nothing quite right latelyJul 22 07:33
DaemonFCChromium is doing pretty much everything I need it toJul 22 07:33
DaemonFCwithout bugs and glitchesJul 22 07:33
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Linux police offer deviant Android return from exile - http://bit.ly/ae09JB that would be good #linux #androidJul 22 07:33
TechrightsBotTitle: Linux police offer deviant Android return from exile • The Register .::. Size~: 29.1 KBJul 22 07:33
schestowitzDaemonFC: how did you escape that cage?Jul 22 07:33
DaemonFChow the hell could a 3 foot tall monkey terrorize anyone?Jul 22 07:34
DaemonFCgrab something to hit it withJul 22 07:35
DaemonFC:PJul 22 07:35
DaemonFCschestowitz: Now Red Hat has splogs that spam Google NewsJul 22 07:41
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Escalating the war on piracy: domain names - http://bit.ly/bLwF4F deeply stupid idea: will just lead to a burgeoning darknet #piracyJul 22 07:46
TechrightsBotTitle: Escalating the war on piracy: domain names | TechnoLlama .::. Size~: 94.38 KBJul 22 07:46
schestowitzDaemonFC: opensource.com?Jul 22 07:47
DaemonFCnoJul 22 07:48
DaemonFChttp://whitepapers.techrepublic.com.com/abstract.aspx?docid=1858597&promo=100503Jul 22 07:49
TechrightsBotTitle: White Papers, Webcasts and Case Studies - TechRepublic .::. Size~: 62.97 KBJul 22 07:49
DaemonFCASPXJul 22 07:49
DaemonFClolJul 22 07:49
DaemonFCit's Red Hat spam on a Windows serverJul 22 07:49
DaemonFChttp://www.favbrowser.com/flock-ditches-firefox-in-favor-of-chromium/Jul 22 07:51
TechrightsBotTitle: Flock Ditches Firefox in Favor of Chromium .::. Size~: 32.68 KBJul 22 07:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Google Explains Why Making Special Copyright Laws For Newspapers Is A Mistake - http://bit.ly/bArtmv nice reference to "artificial scarcity"Jul 22 07:52
TechrightsBotTitle: Google Explains Why Making Special Copyright Laws For Newspapers Is A Mistake | Techdirt .::. Size~: 74.14 KBJul 22 07:52
schestowitzDaemonFC: techrepublic is the spamJul 22 07:56
MinceRwell, it's CNET's server, is it not?Jul 22 07:56
schestowitzNovell and Microsoft use them tooJul 22 07:56
schestowitzFor 'whitepapers' in Google 'News'Jul 22 07:56
DaemonFCI set Konqueror as the file managerJul 22 07:56
schestowitzMinceR: CNYET is CBS and runs LinuxJul 22 07:56
DaemonFCit's still more capable than DolphinJul 22 07:56
schestowitzYeahJul 22 07:57
schestowitzMake a shortcut to KonqJul 22 07:57
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Police To Receive Evidence Against ‘Large Scale’ File-Sharers - http://bit.ly/csoU8b because the police really have nothing better to doJul 22 07:57
TechrightsBotTitle:    Police To Receive Evidence Against Large Scale File-Sharers | TorrentFreak   .::. Size~: 47.91 KBJul 22 07:57
schestowitzDolphin still has no free-space mapperJul 22 07:57
DaemonFCDolphin seems to be more like Nautilus to meJul 22 07:57
MinceRstrange, i thought com.com was theirsJul 22 07:58
MinceRit certainly redirects to www.cnet.com :>Jul 22 07:58
schestowitzMinceR: tom.tom?Jul 22 07:58
MinceRor perhaps it's just a silly redirect service?Jul 22 07:58
MinceRno tom TLD, afaikJul 22 07:58
schestowitzicann-jacking :-)Jul 22 07:58
schestowitzMinceR: I know, was joking....Jul 22 07:59
MinceRohJul 22 07:59
DaemonFCschestowitz: I was talking to my dad at one point about KonquerorJul 22 08:00
DaemonFChe likes to use it to browse FTP sitesJul 22 08:00
DaemonFCesp ones full of MP3s :PJul 22 08:00
DaemonFCFirefox makes a lousy FTP clientJul 22 08:01
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Digital Act To Create Pirate ISPs In UK - http://bit.ly/bhGwZA that would be fun #DEAct #ispsJul 22 08:01
TechrightsBotTitle: Digital Act To Create Pirate ISPs In UK | eWEEK Europe UK .::. Size~: 35.73 KBJul 22 08:01
DaemonFCbut Konqueror handles them just like a local folderJul 22 08:01
schestowitzYes, kioJul 22 08:01
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] A Free Software week in the Basque Country - http://bit.ly/b0FREN what the world needs are more Basque distros #freesw #EuskalHerriaJul 22 08:03
TechrightsBotTitle: Karsten on Free Software  » A Free Software week in the Basque Country .::. Size~: 32.49 KBJul 22 08:03
DaemonFCI appreciate having drag and drop just like I'm going from one folder to anotherJul 22 08:04
DaemonFCFirefox is too basic for any heavy FTP useJul 22 08:05
schestowitzIt's not an ftp clientJul 22 08:05
schestowitzIt ain't advertised as one, eitherJul 22 08:05
DaemonFCit doesn't do a lot of things very wellJul 22 08:05
DaemonFCI'm surprised so many KDE distros have FirefoxJul 22 08:06
DaemonFCeven Konqueror makes a better browserJul 22 08:06
cubezzz3sftp or ncftpJul 22 08:06
schestowitzFirefox is not installed by default in some kde distrosJul 22 08:06
schestowitzcubezzz3: fish:// uses sftpJul 22 08:06
schestowitzor sshJul 22 08:07
schestowitzFTP is for people who want to share their server.... with a crackerJul 22 08:07
DaemonFCFirefox blowsJul 22 08:08
DaemonFCBloatzilla ExplorerJul 22 08:08
DaemonFC:)Jul 22 08:08
DaemonFCthar she blowsJul 22 08:08
DaemonFCthe amount of security patches they have to apply to it is ridiculousJul 22 08:09
DaemonFCand then even after all that, XSS attacking it is apparently trivialJul 22 08:09
schestowitzhttp://www.linuxinsider.com/story/Mandrivas-Rocky-Rebirth-70436.htmlJul 22 08:10
TechrightsBotTitle: Welcome to LinuxInsider .::. Size~: 2.69 KBJul 22 08:10
schestowitzWhat a messJul 22 08:10
schestowitzTHese aren't even articlesJul 22 08:10
schestowitzJust a bunch if copies and pastes of totally separate issues with quotes from anti-Linux trolls at SlashdotJul 22 08:10
schestowitzAnd they call it Blog SafariJul 22 08:10
cubezzz3ok DaemonFC, what browser do you think is good?Jul 22 08:11
MinceRfirefox does one thing relatively wellJul 22 08:11
MinceRthat thing is web browsingJul 22 08:11
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Texas company says it owns patent to spam filtering, sues Google, Apple, Yahoo, Dell, AOL, IBM, 30 others - http://bit.ly/8YYANo of courseJul 22 08:12
TechrightsBotTitle: Texas company says it owns patent to spam filtering, sues Google, Apple, Yahoo, Dell, AOL, IBM, 30 others .::. Size~: 87.31 KBJul 22 08:12
MinceRcounting patches is a typical m$ talking pointJul 22 08:12
cubezzz3MinceR :)Jul 22 08:12
MinceRbecause they keep many of theirs secretJul 22 08:12
MinceRwhile a FS project can't do the sameJul 22 08:12
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] How Google Plans To Crush The E-Book Market - http://bit.ly/di3gU1 and what about DRM? #google #ebooks #drmJul 22 08:14
TechrightsBotTitle: How Google Plans To Crush The E-Book Market .::. Size~: 79.15 KBJul 22 08:14
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schestowitzCreating a FLOSS Roadmap, brick by BRIC http://opensource.org/node/538Jul 22 08:18
TechrightsBotTitle: Creating a FLOSS Roadmap, brick by BRIC | Open Source Initiative .::. Size~: 13.99 KBJul 22 08:18
schestowitzGooglopolyJul 22 08:20
schestowitz"Haha! kdemicroblog vs gwibber! Euh... Non c'est du GNU/Linux aussi ;-) tweetez & identi.caez avec du Libre" http://is.gd/dBLBR http://identi.ca/conversation/42553484#notice-42922880Jul 22 08:25
TechrightsBotTitle: Logiciel libre - Wikipédia .::. Size~: 139.1 KBJul 22 08:25
TechrightsBotTitle: Conversation - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 9.72 KBJul 22 08:25
DaemonFChmmm, the Fanboy Element Hiding stylesheet for Opera fills in the crap that the Easylist adblock list misses in Konqueror :)Jul 22 08:25
DaemonFChoorayJul 22 08:25
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] International Experts See Backswing In Pendulum Of Biological Patenting - http://bit.ly/d9bmBA “We noted that IPR rights was no incentive”Jul 22 08:26
TechrightsBotTitle: Intellectual Property Watch  » Blog Archive   » International Experts See Backswing In Pendulum Of Biological Patenting .::. Size~: 50.19 KBJul 22 08:26
MinceRwhat sort of Trash blocking does opera have?Jul 22 08:28
DaemonFCan url filterJul 22 08:29
DaemonFCthe style sheet basically helps you get rid of the leftover white spaceJul 22 08:29
MinceRpftJul 22 08:30
*MinceR used a userjs but it was clunky as hellJul 22 08:30
MinceR(everything loaded before it could hide them)Jul 22 08:30
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[fosspatents] The controversial broccoli #patent case at the EPO http://bit.ly/cPETO4 Speaking from the #swpat experience, not surprised.Jul 22 08:30
MinceRthen again i could use gnash and a separate browser instance for real trashJul 22 08:30
MinceRs/gnash/swfdec/Jul 22 08:30
MinceRswfdec has that click-to-play thing built inJul 22 08:31
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Traditional Knowledge: ITKI and the Dilemmas of Sharing - http://bit.ly/d9KSzg "preserve, restore & promote re-use of traditional skills"Jul 22 08:31
TechrightsBotTitle: Worldchanging: Bright Green: Traditional Knowledge: The ITKI and the Dilemmas of Sharing .::. Size~: 48.71 KBJul 22 08:31
DaemonFCyeah, now if swfdec worked when you clicked to play something, I'd use it :PJul 22 08:34
MinceR:>Jul 22 08:34
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Google Hires Legal Gun For New Music Service - http://tcrn.ch/bdhfWe "converging on a $5/month streaming, $10/month for mobile access"Jul 22 08:37
TechrightsBotTitle:   Google Hires Legal Gun For New Music Service  .::. Size~: 48.42 KBJul 22 08:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] T-Mobile to Abandon Net Neutrality for Mobile Video - http://bit.ly/az3eMX bad, bad, bad idea #netneutralityJul 22 08:39
TechrightsBotTitle:   T-Mobile to Abandon Net Neutrality for Mobile Video .::. Size~: 93.97 KBJul 22 08:39
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] How Three Gorges Dam Headlines Have Changed Over 7 Years - http://bit.ly/bLQsgs this does not extrapolate well #chinaJul 22 08:42
TechrightsBotTitle: How Three Gorges Dam Headlines Have Changed Over 7 Years  chinaSMACK .::. Size~: 64.1 KBJul 22 08:42
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pp5eiHUdwb4&feature=digestJul 22 08:43
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Acupuncture .::. Size~: 117.36 KBJul 22 08:43
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] A Guide to the Digital Economy Act - Part 1 - http://bit.ly/cJtULG useful refresher of its idiocies #DEActJul 22 08:43
TechrightsBotTitle: A Guide to the Digital Economy Act - Part 1 - Pirate Party UK .::. Size~: 19.26 KBJul 22 08:43
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] #ICANN Should Avoid Expanding Scope of Mission to Include Enforcing “Morality” and Fighting “Terrorism” - http://bit.ly/8XhTXW too rightJul 22 08:46
TechrightsBotTitle: IP Justice &rsaquo; News Archive  » IP Justice Comments on ICANN Plans for New Top-Level Domains: Keep the Core Neutral - ICANN Should Avoid Expanding Scope of Mission to Include Enforcing Morality and Fighting Terrorism .::. Size~: 181.68 KBJul 22 08:46
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] I've favourited a YouTube video -- Climate Denial Crock of the Week - Climate Change a... http://youtu.be/vmv3NAO9sRc?aJul 22 08:50
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Climate Denial Crock of the Week -  Climate Change and National Security  - Part 2 .::. Size~: 116.49 KBJul 22 08:50
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] Indeed! I can't but fully agree. ♺ @pedromelo: @Biafra Read/listen to most (if not all) of Pratchett alreadyJul 22 08:57
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] ♺ @glynmoody: #ICANN Should Avoid Expanding Scope of Mission to Include Enforcing 'Morality' and Fighting 'Terrorism' http://bit.ly/8XhTXWJul 22 08:59
TechrightsBotTitle: IP Justice &rsaquo; News Archive  » IP Justice Comments on ICANN Plans for New Top-Level Domains: Keep the Core Neutral - ICANN Should Avoid Expanding Scope of Mission to Include Enforcing Morality and Fighting Terrorism .::. Size~: 181.68 KBJul 22 08:59
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Open Data in Agriculture and Why It Matters - http://bit.ly/9VZjEW interesting area #opendata #agricultureJul 22 09:00
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] Loves or loves to use? ♺ @pvilela: Facebook loves open source RT @iaincgray: The software behind Facebook: http://bit.ly/aLo7Hb"Jul 22 09:00
TechrightsBotTitle: Open Knowledge Foundation Blog  » Blog Archive   » Open Data in Agriculture and Why It Matters .::. Size~: 33.17 KBJul 22 09:00
TechrightsBotTitle: Exploring the software behind Facebook, the worlds largest site | Royal Pingdom .::. Size~: 80.17 KBJul 22 09:00
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ruiseabra] ♺ @glynmoody: International Experts See Backswing In Pendulum Of Biological Patenting http://bit.ly/d9bmBA “IPR rights was no incentive”Jul 22 09:02
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Lobbyists Promote Asbestos Use in the Developing World - http://bit.ly/9Vlvvh these people have no shame #asbestos #lobbyingJul 22 09:02
TechrightsBotTitle: Intellectual Property Watch  » Blog Archive   » International Experts See Backswing In Pendulum Of Biological Patenting .::. Size~: 50.19 KBJul 22 09:02
TechrightsBotTitle: Lobbyists Promote Asbestos Use in the Developing World - ProPublica .::. Size~: 32.2 KBJul 22 09:02
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Links: #GNU #Linux Desktop News, #Google Rejoins Linux Development http://ur1.ca/0tavu #androidJul 22 09:03
TechrightsBotTitle: Links: GNU/Linux Desktop News, Google Rejoins Linux Development | Techrights .::. Size~: 88.54 KBJul 22 09:03
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] The Stock Photo Industry’s Massive Copyright Campaign - http://bit.ly/dcZtlw fascinating comparison with recording industry's fight #piracyJul 22 09:05
TechrightsBotTitle: The Stock Photo Industry's Massive Copyright Campaign | PlagiarismToday .::. Size~: 50.62 KBJul 22 09:05
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] AppBrain Breaks Down the Current State of Android Apps - http://bit.ly/dAAMtn interesting analysis #androidJul 22 09:06
TechrightsBotTitle: AppBrain Breaks Down the Current State of Android Apps | AndroidGuys .::. Size~: 36.31 KBJul 22 09:06
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Links: Week With #KDE , Bangarang, and KDE Audiocast http://techrights.org/2010/07/22/kde-news-links/Jul 22 09:11
TechrightsBotTitle: Links: Week With KDE, Bangarang, and KDE Audiocast | Techrights .::. Size~: 88.23 KBJul 22 09:11
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Links: Programs and New Games for #GNU #Linux Desktops http://techrights.org/2010/07/22/games-for-gnu-linux/Jul 22 09:12
TechrightsBotTitle: Links: Programs and New Games for GNU/Linux Desktops | Techrights .::. Size~: 91.09 KBJul 22 09:12
schestowitzHaha. Brilliant new video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Rwioe1SGkQ&feature=digestJul 22 09:13
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Welcome To This World .::. Size~: 113.74 KBJul 22 09:13
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] RT @cdaffara Google: "Forty companies are official Android contributors with 1,000 contributions since launch" >>impressive or not?Jul 22 09:26
DaemonFChehJul 22 09:29
DaemonFCSoundKonverter can make WMAsJul 22 09:29
*DaemonFC gives schestowitz a fewJul 22 09:29
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Links: Distribution Reviews, #Sabayon #Linux 5.3 “Extra Spins”, #Fedora Community Web Site Design http://ur1.ca/0tb82Jul 22 09:30
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schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0JsdSDa_bM&feature=relatedJul 22 09:54
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Climate Denial Crock of the Week- "It's cold. So there's no Climate Change" .::. Size~: 103.98 KBJul 22 09:54
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[nsisodiya] india first need 'one wikipedia per school'Jul 22 09:54
Diablo-D3isnt one wikipedia per planet enough?Jul 22 09:59
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Links: Putting #GNU #Linux On One's Netbook, #FreeSoftware Week in the Basque Country, and Leftover News http://ur1.ca/0tbgmJul 22 10:00
TechrightsBotTitle: Links: Putting GNU/Linux On Ones Netbook, Free Software Week in the Basque Country, and Leftover News | Techrights .::. Size~: 103.85 KBJul 22 10:00
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tessierschestowitz: You back?Jul 22 10:03
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MinceRgeekingsJul 22 10:07
*DaemonFC is having fun with SoundKonverter krashesJul 22 10:07
DaemonFCit only crashes when I try to encode to VorbisJul 22 10:07
MinceRoggenc works fine for me :>Jul 22 10:07
DaemonFCwhich is alright I guess because SoundConverter produces the same resultsJul 22 10:08
MinceRthough i prefer flacJul 22 10:08
DaemonFCbut SoundConverter uses gstreamer-lame which is terrible for MP3sJul 22 10:08
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DaemonFCSoundKonverter uses lameJul 22 10:08
DaemonFC:PJul 22 10:08
DaemonFCsince SoundKonverter doesn't crash when making MP3s, I guess there's no problemJul 22 10:08
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*DaemonFC slaps MinceR around a bit with Transgaming CedegaJul 22 10:27
*DaemonFC then slaps jono with MinceRJul 22 10:27
*MinceR slaps DaemonFC around a bit with vistaJul 22 10:28
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*DaemonFC slaps MinceR with Linux: Vista Edition, AKA UbuntuJul 22 10:30
DaemonFCB-)Jul 22 10:30
MinceRno, that's OSX editionJul 22 10:30
DaemonFCno, it's cheap OS X EditionJul 22 10:32
oiaohmDaemonFC: Ok so where is androidJul 22 10:32
oiaohmIts going to be interesting to see how google reacts to the china fork long term as well with androidJul 22 10:34
oiaohmIs android wine all over again?Jul 22 10:34
DaemonFChttp://www.qdh.org.uk/wordpress/?p=156Jul 22 10:35
TechrightsBotTitle: Cedega + ubuntu + Battlefield 2 «  Quick and Dirty Hacks .::. Size~: 13.69 KBJul 22 10:35
DaemonFCThis was basically my experience with Cedega as wellJul 22 10:35
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] ♺ @jziemann: Exploring the software behind Facebook, world’s largest site: http://bit.ly/axxqWOJul 22 10:35
TechrightsBotTitle: Exploring the software behind Facebook, the worlds largest site | Royal Pingdom .::. Size~: 80.17 KBJul 22 10:35
DaemonFCalmost nothing worked and most of the time, it sucked less in WineJul 22 10:35
DaemonFCthe only thing I managed to get working in Cedega 6.0 was my Command & Conquer: The First Decade setJul 22 10:36
MinceRdid that work in plain wine?Jul 22 10:37
DaemonFCmost of it did at that pointJul 22 10:37
DaemonFCand all of it does now, glitch freeJul 22 10:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Morevna - An Open Source Anime Project Using Open Source Tools Only - http://bit.ly/bWtqn6 great to see these more specialised uses #animeJul 22 10:37
TechrightsBotTitle: Morevna - An Open Source Anime Project Using Open Source Tools Only | Tech Drive-in .::. Size~: 38.85 KBJul 22 10:37
DaemonFCCedega is like paying for old Wine with a cute games installerJul 22 10:38
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft Loves 'Open' Core http://ur1.ca/0tbrb #Microsoft employees may be trying to annihilate software freedom as a phenomenonJul 22 10:38
TechrightsBotTitle: Microsoft Loves Open Core | Techrights .::. Size~: 92.41 KBJul 22 10:38
DaemonFCCedega has people I'm sure they've paidJul 22 10:38
DaemonFCgoing around spamming Linux forumsJul 22 10:39
DaemonFCwith talking pointsJul 22 10:39
DaemonFC"ZOMG, they have the best Direct3d outside of Microsoft" (no they don't)Jul 22 10:39
DaemonFC"ZOMG, it's so easy to get the games installed" (no it's not)Jul 22 10:39
DaemonFC"ZOMG, they just work!" (maybe if they're 10 years oldJul 22 10:39
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ffii] Will ACTA outlaw the EU home copy and other liability rules? http://action.ffii.org/acta/injunctionsJul 22 10:41
TechrightsBotTitle: Will ACTA outlaw the EU home copy and other liability rules? - Action groups .::. Size~: 18.24 KBJul 22 10:41
DaemonFCat this point, the parts that work are the LGPL'd parts they brought in from WineJul 22 10:41
DaemonFCand their copy protection compatibility modulesJul 22 10:41
DaemonFCwhich Wine has mostly reverse engineered those copy protection schemes anywayJul 22 10:42
MinceRlulz >> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/930086Jul 22 10:43
TechrightsBotTitle: The option to use a serial cable connection or an infrared link is unavailable when you create an incoming connection in Windows Vista .::. Size~: 40.52 KBJul 22 10:43
MinceRwindows, now with even less featuresJul 22 10:44
DaemonFChttp://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9179504/Mozilla_patches_16_security_bugs_in_Firefox_3.6Jul 22 10:51
TechrightsBotTitle: Mozilla patches 16 security bugs in Firefox 3.6 - Computerworld .::. Size~: 81.37 KBJul 22 10:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Tech Genie Thinks It’s Time for #OpenSUSE to Say Goodbye to #Novell http://ur1.ca/0tbvp #ballnux #swpatsJul 22 11:00
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DaemonFChttp://www.computerhistory.org/highlights/macpaint/Jul 22 11:10
TechrightsBotTitle: Computer History Museum | MacPaint and QuickDraw source code .::. Size~: 18.71 KBJul 22 11:10
DaemonFCthere you go MinceRJul 22 11:10
MinceRlolJul 22 11:10
MinceRso much bullshit on one pageJul 22 11:11
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Anti-Piracy Group Accused Of Blackmailing Teen File-Sharers - http://bit.ly/dBKKVk sinking ever lower #piracy #blackmailJul 22 11:29
TechrightsBotTitle:    Anti-Piracy Group Accused Of Blackmailing Teen File-Sharers | TorrentFreak   .::. Size~: 37.01 KBJul 22 11:29
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Patent Trolls Have a Field Day; University of San Diego/UC Berkeley Study Questions Patenting http://ur1.ca/0tc33 #swpatsJul 22 11:33
TechrightsBotTitle: Patent Trolls Have a Field Day; University of San Diego/UC Berkeley Study Questions Patenting | Techrights .::. Size~: 93.34 KBJul 22 11:33
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] The meaning of #StupidScientology - http://bit.ly/9zk8oR brilliant post about a ridiculous and worrying situationJul 22 11:34
TechrightsBotTitle: Jack of Kent: The meaning of #StupidScientology .::. Size~: 107.64 KBJul 22 11:34
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Microsoft Will Give a Free Windows Phone 7 Device to Every Employee - http://bit.ly/9ax4sD next desperate move: free phone for everyoneJul 22 11:37
TechrightsBotTitle: Microsoft Will Give a Free Windows Phone 7 Device to Every Employee .::. Size~: 76.3 KBJul 22 11:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Character Amnesia - http://bit.ly/bnGTWU this is rather sad; don't tell Nicholas Carr... #chineseJul 22 11:42
TechrightsBotTitle: Language Log » Character Amnesia .::. Size~: 49.6 KBJul 22 11:42
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @glynmoody RT @cdaffara Google: "Forty companies are official Android contributors with 1,000 contributions since launch"Jul 22 11:44
schestowitztessier: yes, been back since MondayJul 22 11:44
schestowitz[10:44] <MinceR> windows, now with even less featuresJul 22 11:48
schestowitzLess is moreJul 22 11:48
schestowitz[more money that is]Jul 22 11:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] This week's meme is #StupidScientology so here's a nice video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwiYjQyu0Tw&feature=channelJul 22 11:52
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Scientology - Circus of the Stars .::. Size~: 113.5 KBJul 22 11:52
schestowitzbblJul 22 11:54
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[doctorow] How #Heinlein plotted http://tinyurl.com/2wzogsqJul 22 12:06
TechrightsBotTitle: How Heinlein plotted - Boing Boing .::. Size~: 17.23 KBJul 22 12:06
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] I Can Haz Virus http://tinyurl.com/yf9ql88Jul 22 12:27
TechrightsBotTitle: Error processing the URL:  .::. Size~: 0 KBJul 22 12:27
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Tomlinson's killer not charged - http://bit.ly/9GATBg the Police are above the law, it seems #tomlinson #policing #ukJul 22 13:00
TechrightsBotTitle: Tomlinson's killer not charged | openDemocracy .::. Size~: 41.04 KBJul 22 13:00
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] UK.gov sacks lead e-Borders contractor - http://bit.ly/aTGAio "'On schedule' programme actually 12 months late"; facts, who needs 'em?Jul 22 13:02
TechrightsBotTitle: UK.gov sacks lead e-Borders contractor • The Register .::. Size~: 28 KBJul 22 13:02
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Driving UK Research – Is copyright a help or a hindrance? - http://bit.ly/bAWlts great analysis of a growing problem #copyright #scienceJul 22 13:10
TechrightsBotTitle: Science in the Open  » Blog Archive   » Driving UK Research  Is copyright a help or a hindrance? .::. Size~: 39.44 KBJul 22 13:10
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Microsoft gives up on Windows security flaw - http://bit.ly/bSWX2F after all, with all the others, who will notice? #security #windowsJul 22 13:13
TechrightsBotTitle:                     Microsoft gives up on windows security flaw - The Inquirer          .::. Size~: 58.94 KBJul 22 13:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Open Source Schools Steering Group - http://bit.ly/cdjEyK "looking to the post-Becta future" #education (via @grumbledook @paulhaigh)Jul 22 13:16
TechrightsBotTitle: Open Source Schools Steering Group | Open Source Schools .::. Size~: 29.54 KBJul 22 13:16
*JustSuds (~justsuds@60-240-128-66.tpgi.com.au) has joined #boycottnovellJul 22 13:18
JustSudshmmm, so... What do you guys think of .NET ?Jul 22 13:19
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JustSudsWhy are we boycotting novell? I thought they were the greatest.Jul 22 13:22
MinceRthe greatest what?Jul 22 13:22
Diablo-D3And then JustSuds realizes its 8am and theres no one to troll.Jul 22 13:23
JustSudsawww. Its 8am is when i would expect all the fanatics to be online before work.Jul 22 13:23
Diablo-D3Meh, even hating Novell is overratedJul 22 13:24
Diablo-D3they're just not big enough to be importantJul 22 13:24
JoehIt's Microsoft you really hate right? :pJul 22 13:24
Diablo-D3Microsoft isn't big enough to be importantJul 22 13:24
Diablo-D3what have they actually contributed?]Jul 22 13:24
Diablo-D3will they even be remembered in 100 years?Jul 22 13:24
Diablo-D3hell, even 50?Jul 22 13:25
JoehI dunno, I'd say 80 thousand employees is pretty significant.Jul 22 13:25
Joeh:pJul 22 13:25
Diablo-D3They're a footnote in history in the making.Jul 22 13:25
Joeh:DJul 22 13:25
JoehI do love these little talks we have.Jul 22 13:25
JustSudsits apple that'll be remembered foreverJul 22 13:25
JustSudsor is it someone else?Jul 22 13:25
Diablo-D3Apple? Apple who?Jul 22 13:25
JoehPerhaps google? :pJul 22 13:26
JustSudsI like my googles.Jul 22 13:26
MinceRthe googles, they do nothing!Jul 22 13:26
JustSudsNovell saved my life's work (albeit a short life) about six months ago with a partition recovery app that hadnt been updated in something like ten years.Jul 22 13:27
ThistleWebgood for youJul 22 13:28
JoehSo MinceR, what is significant if Microsoft, Google and Apple are not?Jul 22 13:28
*Joeh waits for something about LinuxJul 22 13:28
MinceRwhy are you asking me about that?Jul 22 13:28
Diablo-D3All pales in comparison to the glory of God, duh.Jul 22 13:28
MinceRlolJul 22 13:28
Joehbecause my life has no meaning and I need cheering up.Jul 22 13:28
JoehAnd you guys always have the effect of making me smileJul 22 13:29
Joeh:DJul 22 13:29
MinceRDiablo-D3: maybe novell is God?Jul 22 13:29
ThistleWeblol @ the trolls clocking in for the dayJul 22 13:29
JoehOh, I come in every month or so usually. Jul 22 13:30
Diablo-D3There must be someway out of here, said the joker to the thief.Jul 22 13:30
JustSudsThistleWeb did you used to hang out at #linuxmint alot?Jul 22 13:30
ThistleWebnoJul 22 13:30
ThistleWebI still hang out thereJul 22 13:30
JoehWould our trolling go better in there?Jul 22 13:30
ThistleWebfeel freeJul 22 13:31
JustSudslol. I used to use linux mint and frequent that channel.Jul 22 13:31
Joehand now you use XNA? You traitor :pJul 22 13:31
MinceRthen you kids can go troll there togetherJul 22 13:31
JustSudsit was mint that destroyed my partition that novell savedJul 22 13:31
MinceRhow adorable (not)Jul 22 13:31
ThistleWeb* [Joeh] (~joehega@nat/microsoft/x-lvznnafzrgjjfbxv): Joe Hegarty  << hilariousJul 22 13:32
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Hollywood: Google TV would put us in same ship as pirates! - http://bit.ly/cdtQMO "causing consumer confusion" no, just choice #copyrightJul 22 13:32
TechrightsBotTitle: Hollywood: Google TV would put us in same ship as pirates! .::. Size~: 32.45 KBJul 22 13:32
JoehThistleWeb: I've been in here before.Jul 22 13:32
Joeh:)Jul 22 13:32
MinceRright, under a different nickJul 22 13:32
ThistleWebor have you come to tell us you're a Sabyon user or somethingJul 22 13:32
Joehyeh, Adus.Jul 22 13:32
MinceRyou've forgot to unlink this nick from that oneJul 22 13:33
JoehI don't want to unlink itJul 22 13:33
MinceRbefore coming here to trollJul 22 13:33
MinceRnot to mention the hostmaskJul 22 13:33
JoehI'm not trolling!Jul 22 13:33
JustSuds^^ its not real trollingJul 22 13:33
JustSudsjust making conversation. trying to see the world from your viewJul 22 13:33
JoehI have an Android phone... that's free software right?Jul 22 13:33
MinceRthey must be in real trouble if they can't afford better astroturfing than thisJul 22 13:33
JustSudsi have an android phone too. Where are we going with this?Jul 22 13:34
JoehJustSuds: Just trying to show we do at least have something in common :pJul 22 13:34
ThistleWebyep, you're both trollsJul 22 13:34
Diablo-D3Clearly Google works for the NSA, and are spying on us using Android. Clearly.Jul 22 13:34
JustSudsohhh.Jul 22 13:34
oiaohmMinceR:  back off Joeh is ok.Jul 22 13:34
JoehAww, I'm hurt ThistleWeb :(Jul 22 13:34
oiaohmYes he has a handle like one of the other bag guys.  MinceRJul 22 13:35
oiaohmSorry JoehJul 22 13:35
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[wikileaks] Feces, Urine, Blood, Smoke and something indescribable http://bit.ly/a6x2RJ http://bit.ly/bqzVzFJul 22 13:35
TechrightsBotTitle: Feces, Urine, Blood, Smoke, and Something Indescribable | MichaelMoore.com .::. Size~: 54.93 KBJul 22 13:35
TechrightsBotTitle: Collateral Murder .::. Size~: 6.07 KBJul 22 13:35
oiaohmThe problem of names around IRC sometimes Jul 22 13:35
MinceRi don't see the problemJul 22 13:35
oiaohmAndroid phone is free software.  Problem is there is such thing as too free.   JoehJul 22 13:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] A potential Net neutrality win-win-win - http://bit.ly/bBzFp0 buying bigger pipes was never a problem: neutrality refers to traffic *type*Jul 22 13:37
TechrightsBotTitle: A potential Net neutrality win-win-win | Politics and Law - CNET News .::. Size~: 90.19 KBJul 22 13:37
JustSudshow so?Jul 22 13:37
MinceRthat's not the problem with androidJul 22 13:37
Joehoiaohm: There is? Is this one of those "GPL is great because it screws over companies" arguments?Jul 22 13:38
JoehYou think stuff like BSD is too open? :pJul 22 13:38
JoehI quite like Android, beats my iPhone which I had before.Jul 22 13:38
oiaohmLesson of history from wine.Jul 22 13:38
MinceRandroid is not nearly open enoughJul 22 13:38
oiaohmWine was MIT licenceJul 22 13:39
oiaohmwhy did it end up LGPL.Jul 22 13:39
MinceRsee java-only apis, kill switch, cyanogen issue, etc.Jul 22 13:39
oiaohmSimple fact when you are too open its too tempting to fork.Jul 22 13:39
oiaohmThis is already happening to android in china.  JoehJul 22 13:39
*JustSuds hates javaJul 22 13:39
JoehYou mean like the linux guys made Google do with Android? lolJul 22 13:39
MinceRi think java got a lot better since 1.4 but it would be better not to lock programmers into itJul 22 13:40
oiaohmSame reason is why BSD failed to stay tech ahead of Linux.Jul 22 13:40
JoehJustSuds: I think everyone, no matter where they stand on software licensing can agree that Java is nothing short of a crime against programming.Jul 22 13:40
oiaohmHistory tells us a lot JoehJul 22 13:40
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JustSudsI for one, agree.Jul 22 13:40
Diablo-D3Wow, troll much Joeh?Jul 22 13:40
MinceRJoeh: can you elaborate/explain?Jul 22 13:40
oiaohmThere is such thing as a licence that is too open and leads to slower progress.Jul 22 13:40
Diablo-D3oiaohm: not at all.Jul 22 13:41
Diablo-D3BSD is a fine license.Jul 22 13:41
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JoehMinceR: My main problem is that it rams OO down you throat so hard there is no where to hide from it.Jul 22 13:41
JustSudsJava is full of sticky conventions that make .NET languages hard to get used to.Jul 22 13:41
MinceRoiaohm: when google doesn't let people redistribute some of their android apps then i doubt a case can be made for android being "too open"Jul 22 13:41
oiaohmFor OS's?  Diablo-D3Jul 22 13:41
Diablo-D3oiaohm: for anything.Jul 22 13:41
MinceRJoeh: you could just write static functions in a classJul 22 13:41
MinceRJoeh: or you could use procedural or hybrid languages on the JVMJul 22 13:42
MinceRthis is hardly a "crime against programming"Jul 22 13:42
JoehMinceR: I have no problem with the JVMJul 22 13:42
JustSuds^^ or you could use C#Jul 22 13:42
oiaohmChina has a fork that is android with no Google apps at all.  MinceRJul 22 13:42
JoehI don't like Java, the language.Jul 22 13:42
oiaohmReplacements instead.  MinceRJul 22 13:42
MinceRi thought C# was pretty strictly OOP tooJul 22 13:42
MinceRlike javaJul 22 13:42
Joehthe JVM is fine.Jul 22 13:42
JoehMinceR: To some extent. C# is less type strict in many ways.Jul 22 13:42
oiaohmProblem is the replacements are just as closed as googles.  MinceRJul 22 13:42
MinceRoiaohm: then maybe that fork is open, unlike android.Jul 22 13:42
MinceRthen it isn'tJul 22 13:42
oiaohmThere is nothing in the licence preventing this kind of forking happening.Jul 22 13:42
Diablo-D3oiaohm: AHH, BUT IN SOVIET CHINA, ANDROID FUCKS YOUJul 22 13:43
MinceRlolJul 22 13:43
oiaohmThis is exactly the same as what happened with BSD and Unix.Jul 22 13:43
MinceRoiaohm: except for the google branded appsJul 22 13:43
JoehTo be fair, isn't it just up the author to decide what license they want to use? if someone wants to use GPL for their software, let them. Jul 22 13:43
oiaohmThink back.Jul 22 13:43
JoehI can't stand it being pushed on people though.Jul 22 13:43
oiaohmHow many Unix's were based of BSDJul 22 13:43
JustSudsWait, BSD and Unix are different? I thought BSD was a type of Unix?Jul 22 13:43
MinceRhow can GPL being pushed on people?Jul 22 13:43
MinceRs/being/be/Jul 22 13:44
Diablo-D3BSD is an open source Unix.Jul 22 13:44
MinceRunless of course you believe that stealing the code of others is your god-given right :>Jul 22 13:44
Diablo-D3I started merely as a patchset for AT&T Unix, but grew into a whole OS, identical in function yet different (and superior) in code.Jul 22 13:44
oiaohmJustSuds: Unix is a trademark.Jul 22 13:44
oiaohmNot a platform.Jul 22 13:44
JoehMinceR: I know people who believe in free software so strongly they think all software should be GPL basically. Jul 22 13:44
Diablo-D3Unix, in this context, refers to any Unix compliant OS.Jul 22 13:44
MinceRJoeh: and what does that have to do with anything?Jul 22 13:44
Diablo-D3BSD is just one of many, and there are many different BSDs.Jul 22 13:44
Diablo-D3OSX is a Unix, for example.Jul 22 13:44
JustSudsI didnt know that. I thought unix was an accident, and everything evolved from it. like the first life on earth kinda theoryJul 22 13:44
MinceRosx is hardly a unixJul 22 13:45
JoehDarwin/OSX is a BSD variant isn't it?Jul 22 13:45
MinceRit violates most of its principlesJul 22 13:45
Diablo-D3Joeh: uses fbsd userland, but pairs it with a really bizzare kernelJul 22 13:45
MinceRit's a heap of garbage with some unix parts buried under itJul 22 13:45
Diablo-D3but it really is a Unix.Jul 22 13:45
*JustSuds bored. Going back to where i came fromJul 22 13:45
JoehI'm not Apple or OSX fan, you don't have to tell me it's not very good. Was just curious.Jul 22 13:45
MinceRJustSuds: good.Jul 22 13:45
JustSudslolJul 22 13:45
MinceRapparently Diablo-D3 is a crApple fan, thoughJul 22 13:45
Diablo-D3Im notJul 22 13:46
Diablo-D3I cant stand OSXJul 22 13:46
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Diablo-D3but I dont lie about what it isJul 22 13:46
MinceRthen you're ignorantJul 22 13:46
JoehYou run Linux I'm guessing?Jul 22 13:46
oiaohmReally by the book OS/X is not a Unix.Jul 22 13:46
oiaohmOpps OSXJul 22 13:46
oiaohmBecause is never been approved.Jul 22 13:46
oiaohmBy the opengroupJul 22 13:46
MinceRthe proprietary crap libraries they've heaped on top of their badly raped fork of freebsd and mach are anything but unixJul 22 13:46
Diablo-D3oiaohm: actually, they didJul 22 13:46
MinceRnobody cares about the open groupJul 22 13:47
Diablo-D3they're one of very few unixes that bothered to pay for the licensingJul 22 13:47
oiaohmI never saw the approval.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 13:47
MinceRtheir only criterion for using the unix trademark is moneyJul 22 13:47
oiaohmNot the only MinceRJul 22 13:47
MinceRof course crApple is all about marketing so they've paid for itJul 22 13:47
oiaohmYou have to pass the Posix standard tests.Jul 22 13:47
MinceRbut they couldn't be bothered to leave the unix systems unfuckedJul 22 13:47
Diablo-D3It passed POSIX back when it was still openstepJul 22 13:47
MinceRthey have that crap fisher price GUI on top of it, for exampleJul 22 13:48
MinceRinstead of XJul 22 13:48
oiaohmYes the thing that makes something Unix like is the Posix standard support.Jul 22 13:48
Diablo-D3MinceR: which has nothing to do with it being unix.Jul 22 13:48
MinceRDiablo-D3: it's part of it not being unixJul 22 13:48
Diablo-D3X is not part of Unix. At all.Jul 22 13:48
oiaohmCommon error is mixing Unix up with PosixJul 22 13:48
MinceRDiablo-D3: i know you hate X because you don't understand itJul 22 13:48
MinceR(like most people who hate it)Jul 22 13:48
Diablo-D3Actually, I quite like X.Jul 22 13:49
oiaohmThinking the opengroup maintaines the posix standard and is the approval body for Unix name usage.Jul 22 13:49
Diablo-D3opengroup only maintains the unix brandJul 22 13:49
Diablo-D3nothing moreJul 22 13:49
MinceRand it does so badlyJul 22 13:49
MinceRhanding it to osx but not to the open unixes makes it pretty clear that they're only in it for the moneyJul 22 13:49
Diablo-D3but osx DOES implement susv3 and posixJul 22 13:49
Diablo-D3MinceR: well yes, you have to PAY for thatJul 22 13:50
MinceRif m$ cared enough, they'd pay to make vista7 a "unix"Jul 22 13:50
Diablo-D3its just a logo you get to slap on your websiteJul 22 13:50
MinceRDiablo-D3: my point exactlyJul 22 13:50
Diablo-D3MinceR: erm, NT is a unix. Go install SFU.Jul 22 13:50
MinceRLOLJul 22 13:50
Diablo-D3an entire actual unix environment that runs off the NT kernel (instead of inside the win32 userland)Jul 22 13:50
MinceRso everything is a unix, except GNU and the BSD-s?Jul 22 13:50
MinceRinteresting ideaJul 22 13:50
Diablo-D3BSD is a unixJul 22 13:50
Diablo-D3by definitionJul 22 13:50
Diablo-D3it was the second unixJul 22 13:50
MinceRask the open group about thatJul 22 13:50
Diablo-D3linux is _not_ a unix for very obscure reasons.Jul 22 13:51
MinceRask them about FreeBSDJul 22 13:51
Diablo-D3MinceR: they will reply fbsd didnt pay for the testing.Jul 22 13:51
MinceRexactlyJul 22 13:51
Diablo-D3but thats all they can sayJul 22 13:51
MinceRso you're basically telling me that winblows NT is a unix but FreeBSD isn'tJul 22 13:51
MinceRyou're full of shit, as usualJul 22 13:51
Diablo-D3[08:44:39] <Diablo-D3> BSD is a unixJul 22 13:51
Diablo-D3[08:44:41] <Diablo-D3> by definitionJul 22 13:51
Diablo-D3[08:44:44] <Diablo-D3> it was the second unixJul 22 13:51
ThistleWebgoal = whip up the channel to cause argument, ideally the argument continues after leaving......trolls 1 - channel 0Jul 22 13:51
Diablo-D3BSD, the unix, is older than you.Jul 22 13:51
oiaohmDiablo-D3:  Linux has been a approved Unix in some distributions.Jul 22 13:52
JoehThistleWeb: I thought I was a troll? I'm still here.Jul 22 13:52
oiaohmMost Distributions have not bothered.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 13:52
Diablo-D3oiaohm: nonsensical, its either a unix in all distributions, or in none.Jul 22 13:52
MinceR144354 < Diablo-D3> MinceR: well yes, you have to PAY for thatJul 22 13:52
MinceR144401 < Diablo-D3> its just a logo you get to slap on your websiteJul 22 13:52
MinceR144508 < Diablo-D3> MinceR: they will reply fbsd didnt pay for the testing.Jul 22 13:52
oiaohmNo Diablo-D3 incorrectJul 22 13:52
Diablo-D3MinceR: to put the logo on your website, you have to pay.Jul 22 13:52
Diablo-D3BSD didnt payJul 22 13:52
oiaohmTo use the Unix trademark you have to pass.Jul 22 13:52
Diablo-D3but it doesnt make them not a unix.Jul 22 13:52
oiaohmAnd some Linux's did.Jul 22 13:52
MinceRDiablo-D3: so they aren't unix, according to your argument.Jul 22 13:52
Diablo-D3the unix trademark should be dissolvedJul 22 13:52
MinceRwhich is pure, unmitigated bullshit.Jul 22 13:52
MinceRyes, it would be better off dissolvedJul 22 13:53
Diablo-D3MinceR: uh, how do you figure?Jul 22 13:53
MinceRthan being continually raped by a pack of suitsJul 22 13:53
oiaohmNot all Unix's come from the BSD blood line either.Jul 22 13:53
oiaohmNever have.Jul 22 13:53
Diablo-D3just because someone doesnt pay for having the logo doesnt mean they're notJul 22 13:53
Diablo-D3it just means they didnt pay for it.Jul 22 13:53
Diablo-D3nothing more.Jul 22 13:53
MinceRso who is to tell whether they're unix or not?Jul 22 13:53
oiaohmAnd did not pass the testing to be either.Jul 22 13:53
Diablo-D3quit trying to shove words in my mouthJul 22 13:53
Diablo-D3MinceR: if they comply with the specifications.Jul 22 13:53
MinceRDiablo-D3, the unofficial representative of the open group?Jul 22 13:53
Diablo-D3thats the ONLY thing that makes them a unix.Jul 22 13:54
oiaohmCatch is some Linux distibutions would passJul 22 13:54
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @EthanZ: Pushback on whether Indian models for sharing video (bluetooth) could work in Nigeria. Perception that literacy is higher in IndJul 22 13:54
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @EthanZ: Actually, Nigerian literacy was higher than Indian in 2001 UNDHR. Interesting to watch Nigerians showing low assessment of capabJul 22 13:54
oiaohmNot all do Diablo-D3Jul 22 13:54
Diablo-D3oiaohm: thats nonsensicalJul 22 13:54
oiaohmIe varation of Linux.Jul 22 13:54
Diablo-D3distros cannot control things at that levelJul 22 13:55
MinceRyeah, it's not like distros control what code they put into their reposJul 22 13:55
Diablo-D3anyhow, this originally started as osx not being a unix, when it isJul 22 13:55
MinceRoh, waitJul 22 13:55
MinceRthat's pretty much the thing they doJul 22 13:55
oiaohmYou are aware that Linux syscalls are part of the Unix standard.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 13:55
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @Info_Activism: RT @thesatyrswife: http://bit.ly/bmMFNs #10Tactics gets a great review by Nirupama Sarma in Infochange IndiaJul 22 13:55
Diablo-D3the kernel is a really mashed up mach kernelJul 22 13:55
oiaohmFrom kernel level Linux is fine.Jul 22 13:55
oiaohmTo pass Unix testsJul 22 13:55
Diablo-D3mach was designed as a replacement for the monolithic bsd kernelJul 22 13:56
oiaohmIts what the distrobutions put on top that cause it to fail to be a Unix.Jul 22 13:56
Diablo-D3it failed as one, but its a valid unix kernel.Jul 22 13:56
MinceRHURD happens to be built on MachJul 22 13:56
MinceRas much as it's uncool in your circlesJul 22 13:56
Diablo-D3the osx userland is parts of fbsd and openstep mashed togetherJul 22 13:57
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @glynmoody: Open Source Schools Steering Group - http://bit.ly/cdjEyK "looking to the post-Becta future" #education (via @grumbledookJul 22 13:57
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @glynmoody: Microsoft gives up on Windows security flaw - http://bit.ly/bSWX2F after all, with all the others, who will notice? #securityJul 22 13:57
TechrightsBotTitle: Open Source Schools Steering Group | Open Source Schools .::. Size~: 29.54 KBJul 22 13:57
Diablo-D3and together, this giant festering pile complies with all the relevant specs to call it a unix.Jul 22 13:57
TechrightsBotTitle:                     Microsoft gives up on windows security flaw - The Inquirer          .::. Size~: 59.01 KBJul 22 13:57
MinceRafaik the osx kernel also has some bits of freebsd randomly hammered into itJul 22 13:57
Diablo-D3yup it does.Jul 22 13:57
Diablo-D3they suplimented things their mach kernel couldnt do and they needed with fbsd's kernelJul 22 13:58
Diablo-D3osx is quite the franken osJul 22 13:58
Diablo-D3but yeah, any unix that can trace their path back to sysv really is a unix without questionJul 22 13:59
Diablo-D3no matter if they paid for the branding or notJul 22 13:59
oiaohmhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mach_%28kernel%29  Please correct you little incorrect cross reference.Jul 22 14:00
TechrightsBotTitle: Mach (kernel) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 87.06 KBJul 22 14:00
oiaohmDiablo-D3: Jul 22 14:00
MinceRthat's not what the open group saysJul 22 14:00
Diablo-D3and theres a shitload of very different unixesJul 22 14:00
Diablo-D3MinceR: nope, because they are interested in protecting their trademarkJul 22 14:00
oiaohmLinux and Mach are not really releated.Jul 22 14:00
MinceRwhich means that their claims of what is a unix and what isn't are invalidJul 22 14:00
oiaohmBoth Linux and BSD started life as monolithicJul 22 14:00
MinceRfrom which follows that just paying for the stamp doesn't make any os a unix, except for the ignorant marketroids.Jul 22 14:01
Diablo-D3linux and bsd are both still monolithicJul 22 14:01
oiaohmMach are you intro to microkernels.Jul 22 14:01
MinceRlinux is modular, actuallyJul 22 14:01
Diablo-D3however mach, although a microkernel design, is a valid unix kernelJul 22 14:01
Diablo-D3it was designed as a drop in replacement for the bsd osJul 22 14:01
Diablo-D3and it does do so for versions of mach that can do itJul 22 14:01
Diablo-D3MinceR: you have it slightly wrongJul 22 14:02
*MinceR prepares for lulzJul 22 14:02
Diablo-D3if they pay for the stamp, they're a unix. but it doesnt mean not paying for it doesnt make you not a unixJul 22 14:02
Diablo-D3you can't stamp, say, a ps3 game a unix.Jul 22 14:02
Diablo-D3nor the apollo flight computer.Jul 22 14:02
MinceRso you care for a bunch of greedy suits' opinion one way, but not the other? interestingJul 22 14:02
Diablo-D3no, the unix test really does involve a compliance suiteJul 22 14:03
Diablo-D3a shitty one, but its enough to ensure they comply with the relevant specifications Jul 22 14:03
MinceRwhich i'm sure is very strict, non-negotiable and meaningfulJul 22 14:03
oiaohmLinux Standard Base include the Unix compliance suiteJul 22 14:03
Diablo-D3SFU for NT probably could pass the test, and its _barely_ a unix.Jul 22 14:04
MinceRespecially if it brought out winblows NT (which only recently gained one of the types of links, iirc) as compliantJul 22 14:04
oiaohmIt passes the 1995 version of the Unix suite.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:04
oiaohmYes really old and out of date version.Jul 22 14:04
MinceRthey only hacked symlinks into vista or vista7 recently, didn't they?Jul 22 14:04
Diablo-D3I wonder why Microsoft never bothered persuing SFU moreJul 22 14:04
Diablo-D3its extremely fastJul 22 14:04
MinceRinteresting "unix", the one that has no symlink support. :>Jul 22 14:04
oiaohm1995 version had no requirement for symlinksJul 22 14:04
Diablo-D3NT as a kernel is actually well designedJul 22 14:04
Diablo-D3its a waste to use it on windowsJul 22 14:05
MinceRit was, until m$ came up with their requirementsJul 22 14:05
oiaohmIf the design was followed yes.Jul 22 14:05
Diablo-D3its the only thing keeping the whole OS togetherJul 22 14:05
Diablo-D3oiaohm: it wasJul 22 14:05
MinceRwhich was _long_ agoJul 22 14:05
oiaohmNo it was not.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:05
Diablo-D3no, it _was_ followedJul 22 14:05
oiaohmYou should not have subsystems calling win32Jul 22 14:05
Diablo-D3Microsoft just botched everything elseJul 22 14:05
MinceRthen there are the winblows subsystems that don't let their programs talk to each otherJul 22 14:05
oiaohmThe NT design never allowed doing that.Jul 22 14:05
Diablo-D3oiaohm: those subsystems arent quite part of the kernelJul 22 14:05
Diablo-D3they have shit in kernel space, but its not part of the kernel actualJul 22 14:06
Diablo-D3NT is half of a microkernelJul 22 14:06
MinceRwhat's part of the kernel, if not what's running in kernel space?Jul 22 14:06
Diablo-D3its not quite monolithic, its not quite microkernel either.Jul 22 14:06
MinceRNT is only microkernel in marketroid-speakJul 22 14:06
MinceRjust like OSXJul 22 14:06
Diablo-D3OSX is not microkernel in any senseJul 22 14:06
MinceRthey're actually both bullshitJul 22 14:06
Diablo-D3even if they used machJul 22 14:06
oiaohmTechincally NT is hybred.Jul 22 14:06
MinceRwell, crApple marketroids call OSX a microkernel-based OSJul 22 14:06
oiaohmPartway between micro and monoJul 22 14:06
MinceReven if it isn'tJul 22 14:06
oiaohmProblem is hybred is a huge list.Jul 22 14:06
MinceRand of course the cultists like to quote them on thatJul 22 14:07
oiaohmAnd Linux kernel is heading to hybred quite fast as well.Jul 22 14:07
Diablo-D3the DX HALs are kernel servers, and not part of the NT kernel, and the kernel servers run in kernel spaceJul 22 14:07
Diablo-D3arguably this gives great performanceJul 22 14:07
MinceRwell, they said it doesJul 22 14:07
MinceRbut it doesn'tJul 22 14:07
Diablo-D3and SFU, for example, is happy to ignore the rest of the shit Microsoft bolted onJul 22 14:07
MinceReven their windowing system is slow as fuckJul 22 14:07
oiaohmCurrently Linux has part microkernel part monolithic no hybred nature by default.Jul 22 14:07
MinceRdespite running in kernel modeJul 22 14:07
Diablo-D3oiaohm: not at allJul 22 14:07
Diablo-D3linux is quite monolithicJul 22 14:08
Diablo-D3without questionJul 22 14:08
MinceRinterestingJul 22 14:08
oiaohmLinux kernel can do almost all drivers in userspace these days Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:08
Diablo-D3MinceR: because win32 is a pile of fucking shitJul 22 14:08
oiaohmJust like microkernel.sJul 22 14:08
Diablo-D3SFU is _very fucking fast_Jul 22 14:08
Diablo-D3when I first used it, it scared the shit out of meJul 22 14:08
MinceRso there's NT, which Diablo-D3 lets get away run stuff in kernel space without being part of the kernel and being called "hybrid"Jul 22 14:08
Diablo-D3if word got out Microsoft had something fast, it'd be the end of the worldJul 22 14:08
MinceRbut Diablo-D3 hates Linux enough to not let it get away with being modular? :>Jul 22 14:08
MinceRwell, m$ could do something fastJul 22 14:08
oiaohmA true mircokernel does not run drivers in kernel space.Jul 22 14:08
Diablo-D3you can be modular and not a microkernelJul 22 14:09
Diablo-D3oiaohm: well noJul 22 14:09
MinceRfor example certain versions of winblows could get infected by malware pretty quicklyJul 22 14:09
Diablo-D3kernel space in a microkernel merely means fully privledgedJul 22 14:09
MinceR150308 < Diablo-D3> kernel space in a microkernel merely means fully privledgedJul 22 14:09
MinceRwhich is precisely what a microkernel doesn't allowJul 22 14:09
MinceRby definitionJul 22 14:09
MinceRprecisely because it compromises its reliabilityJul 22 14:09
Diablo-D3MinceR: not quiteJul 22 14:09
MinceRand makes the entire microkernel idea mootJul 22 14:09
Diablo-D3a kernel server could actually take the system down if you've coded it badly enoughJul 22 14:10
MinceRthe whole _point_ is that only a tiny bit of code runs in kernel mode and it's heavily auditedJul 22 14:10
Diablo-D3microkernels is not some holy grail of perfectivenessJul 22 14:10
MinceRand all the rest is properly separated from other parts and restarted if they crashJul 22 14:10
Diablo-D3nor is it all that great of an ideaJul 22 14:10
oiaohmNT breaks microkernel design purely by allowing non kernel stuff to share the same memory space.Jul 22 14:11
Diablo-D3oiaohm: I agreeJul 22 14:11
Diablo-D3and they ruined it.Jul 22 14:11
oiaohmAnd privilage level.Jul 22 14:11
MinceRstrangeJul 22 14:11
MinceRyou disagreed just a few minutes agoJul 22 14:11
Diablo-D3NT was designed by the guy who wrote VMS's kernel, and the original NT, and even now, its very damned goodJul 22 14:12
Diablo-D3the DX HAL shouldnt be in kernel spaceJul 22 14:12
Diablo-D3and theres no reason for itJul 22 14:12
MinceRgo use NT if it's so very goodJul 22 14:12
Diablo-D3MinceR: how?Jul 22 14:12
Diablo-D3you cant boot SFU nakedJul 22 14:12
MinceRit's still soldJul 22 14:12
MinceRas "vista7"Jul 22 14:12
MinceRoh, waitJul 22 14:12
Diablo-D3SFU isnt complete enough to allow thatJul 22 14:13
Diablo-D3which is a shameJul 22 14:13
oiaohmSFU depends on Win32 to operateJul 22 14:13
Diablo-D3oiaohm: noJul 22 14:13
MinceRas "Windows 7 (We Really Rewrote Everything Now, Not Just A New Skin. No, Really! Edition)"Jul 22 14:13
oiaohmIt does for many features.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:13
Diablo-D3microsoft just provides no method to boot sfu.Jul 22 14:13
oiaohmSaved MS from having to recode them.Jul 22 14:13
Diablo-D3oiaohm: it relies on it in no way.Jul 22 14:13
Diablo-D3the only "win32" part is the terminalJul 22 14:13
oiaohmReactos does have a version of posix for NT that does work.Jul 22 14:14
Diablo-D3reactos is bizzareJul 22 14:14
oiaohmWithout needing win32 at all.Jul 22 14:14
MinceRi have a version of posix for NT that does workJul 22 14:14
oiaohmYes with major hacking you can make windows boot that.Jul 22 14:14
MinceRit's called "debian in virtualbox"Jul 22 14:14
Diablo-D3oiaohm: I wouldnt want to.Jul 22 14:14
Diablo-D3without official microsoft support its pointlessJul 22 14:14
Diablo-D3I might as well run freevms instead.Jul 22 14:14
oiaohmIts not the only cross.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:14
MinceRtough shitJul 22 14:14
MinceRno other OS gets official m$ support :>Jul 22 14:14
oiaohmOther cross are some file operations as well Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:15
oiaohmIe SFU just forwards some of them to win32 functions.Jul 22 14:15
Diablo-D3oiaohm: all the file ops are handled by the kernelJul 22 14:15
oiaohmfprintf?  Kernel I think not.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:15
MinceRwhat are file operations doing in a supposed microkernel? :>Jul 22 14:15
Diablo-D3MinceR: it isnt oneJul 22 14:16
oiaohmThat thing takes a real trip.   Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:16
Diablo-D3we just went through that.Jul 22 14:16
Diablo-D3oiaohm: printf skirts win32 due to the terminalJul 22 14:16
Diablo-D3fprintf to a file doesnt.Jul 22 14:16
oiaohmThe only dll a subsystem should connect to is ntdll.dll if it by NT design.Jul 22 14:16
MinceRwhat do you call "the terminal"? that pile of bugs they call "MSVCRT" something?Jul 22 14:17
Diablo-D3MinceR: no, sfu comes with a terminalJul 22 14:17
MinceRoh.Jul 22 14:17
MinceRhow does that terminal display when win32 is in control of the screen?Jul 22 14:17
Diablo-D3we just went through thatJul 22 14:17
Diablo-D3its a win32 appJul 22 14:17
oiaohmNT design allowed for displaying.Jul 22 14:17
oiaohmWithout calling win32.Jul 22 14:18
Diablo-D3MinceR: due to what provides the display, only win32 apps can display thingsJul 22 14:18
oiaohmIe the NT design called for that kernel managed.Jul 22 14:18
oiaohmBut cost savings.Jul 22 14:18
Diablo-D3oiaohm: they never implemented it that wayJul 22 14:18
MinceRjust what i always wanted - a desktop "unix system" with no displayJul 22 14:18
MinceR:>Jul 22 14:18
Diablo-D3MinceR: yeah, its nutsJul 22 14:18
Diablo-D3and if you want XJul 22 14:18
Diablo-D3you can install the x dev libs in sfu, but you still have a win32 x serverJul 22 14:19
MinceRblechJul 22 14:19
oiaohmThat is the big problem.Jul 22 14:19
Diablo-D3this is why I hate microsoftJul 22 14:19
Diablo-D3I'd love to see SFU shipped as a full OSJul 22 14:19
oiaohmGraphic system if NT was never finished off correctly.Jul 22 14:19
Diablo-D3oiaohm: it doesnt have oneJul 22 14:19
oiaohmVista MS started to head back to where it should been.Jul 22 14:19
JoehDiablo-D3: Why the hate? Microsoft is a big organisation, can you please say you hate say, the WIndows TeamJul 22 14:19
Joehnot all of us? :pJul 22 14:19
MinceRoiaohm: obscurity?Jul 22 14:20
Diablo-D3Joeh: there are many different groups I hateJul 22 14:20
JoehXbox Live?Jul 22 14:20
Diablo-D3Vista did something weirdJul 22 14:20
MinceRJoeh: what's the official Hate Quota?Jul 22 14:20
Diablo-D3an actual display serverJul 22 14:20
MinceRhow many people?Jul 22 14:20
JoehMinceR: How do you mean?Jul 22 14:20
Diablo-D3but its still plugged into the DX HALJul 22 14:20
oiaohman actual display server was in the design to start off with.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:20
MinceRJoeh: you apparently take an issue with someone hating too many peopleJul 22 14:20
Diablo-D3(though the original win32 display system wasnt)Jul 22 14:20
JoehWe have 80 thousand full time employeesJul 22 14:21
Diablo-D3oiaohm: well yes, they were supposed to clone XJul 22 14:21
MinceRJoeh: i was hoping there was some sort of guideline behind thatJul 22 14:21
Joeh:pJul 22 14:21
Diablo-D3but its part of win32Jul 22 14:21
Diablo-D3not NTJul 22 14:21
MinceRJoeh: not just a vague guess that "hey, you're hating too many people and that's bad"Jul 22 14:21
oiaohmNow we can hate the company without hating the people JoehJul 22 14:21
MinceRwe can also hate bothJul 22 14:21
oiaohmAnd hate only particular people in the company.Jul 22 14:21
Diablo-D3at least if you crash the display driver, your whole system doesnt go down anymoreJul 22 14:22
MinceRit just goes dark until reboot :>Jul 22 14:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @glynmoody: Microsoft Will Give a Free Windows Phone 7 Device to Every Employee - http://bit.ly/9ax4sD desperate moveJul 22 14:22
TechrightsBotTitle: Microsoft Will Give a Free Windows Phone 7 Device to Every Employee .::. Size~: 83.42 KBJul 22 14:22
MinceRof course even that would be a huge step forward for m$Jul 22 14:22
JoehWoo, Free Phone :DJul 22 14:22
oiaohmNo it restarts the driver.  Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:22
oiaohmOpps MinceRJul 22 14:22
oiaohmsorry Diablo-D3Jul 22 14:22
MinceRwoo, free paperweightJul 22 14:22
MinceRone that combines the weaknesses of the hypePhone OS with the weaknesses of androidJul 22 14:23
oiaohmWonder if anyone will port android to it so its useful.Jul 22 14:23
Diablo-D3microsoft has improved some areasJul 22 14:23
MinceRthe best thing since sliced bread!Jul 22 14:23
Diablo-D3but its stupidJul 22 14:23
Diablo-D3windows is deadJul 22 14:23
JoehFunny. quite a lot of people are still using itJul 22 14:23
Joeh:pJul 22 14:23
Diablo-D3for every area they improve, another area failsJul 22 14:23
oiaohmDiablo-D3: dead is a over statementJul 22 14:23
MinceRquite a lot of people are cluelessJul 22 14:23
oiaohmDieing is more correct.Jul 22 14:23
oiaohmMore and more what people do are being done on phones JoehJul 22 14:24
oiaohmAnd phone OS's are starting to head in the desktop direction.Jul 22 14:24
oiaohmNot what you call good future for MS coming.Jul 22 14:24
MinceRexcept for windows ce/mobile/phoneJul 22 14:24
MinceRwhich is heading in the direction of the trash canJul 22 14:24
MinceRsince wm6, they've lost multitasking, copy/paste, native appsJul 22 14:24
MinceRwhat else?Jul 22 14:24
oiaohmThe future seams to be learn 1 OS for everything.Jul 22 14:25
MinceRa usable Today screenJul 22 14:25
JoehI don't know, from what I've seen of Windows Phone 7 it's pretty coolJul 22 14:25
oiaohmAnd that is all you will need to know.Jul 22 14:25
oiaohmJoeh: not cool most coders are not interested.Jul 22 14:25
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @glynmoody: Microsoft gives up on Windows security flaw - http://bit.ly/bSWX2F after all, with all the others, who will notice?Jul 22 14:25
TechrightsBotTitle:                     Microsoft gives up on windows security flaw - The Inquirer          .::. Size~: 62.12 KBJul 22 14:25
oiaohmAlso lot of hardware makers are not interested MS is asking too much.Jul 22 14:25
MinceRJoeh: duh. it has a m$ logo so of course it's cool to youJul 22 14:25
MinceRor winblows logo, or bothJul 22 14:25
oiaohmAndroid have them spolied.Jul 22 14:25
oiaohmThey are making more profit with android then anything else they have sold before.  JoehJul 22 14:26
JoehI like Android.Jul 22 14:26
oiaohmBasically the phone market is going to be hostile to ms.Jul 22 14:26
MinceRm$ is responding to the threat by copying hypePhone OS and androidJul 22 14:26
MinceR...the worst parts of both :>Jul 22 14:26
oiaohmQuestion how long before android is going to be part of motherboards.Jul 22 14:26
MinceRbut if people love dumb phones, they'll love itJul 22 14:27
MinceRjust like they loved the KINJul 22 14:27
MinceRoh, waitJul 22 14:27
MinceRonly 500 of those were ever sold :>Jul 22 14:27
JoehI wish there wasn't so much rivalry between Microsoft and Google. They could be very succesful partners imho.Jul 22 14:27
MinceRyes, they both want to be Big BrotherJul 22 14:27
oiaohmMicrosoft threated to Kill Google.  Jul 22 14:27
MinceRbut m$ wants to get there by killing everyoneJul 22 14:27
JoehTheir expertise also lies in seperate areas.Jul 22 14:27
oiaohmGoogle is just making sure to Kill MS before MS can kill them.Jul 22 14:27
MinceRgoogle wants to get there by making people want to use their services for everythingJul 22 14:28
JoehWell, I'm not claiming either side is innocent oiaohm, or that there aren't good reasons.Jul 22 14:28
JoehI just think it's a shame.Jul 22 14:28
MinceRi wonder how we'll kill the survivor.Jul 22 14:28
oiaohmGoogle and MS will always be other sides.Jul 22 14:28
MinceRno, eventually one or both will be deadJul 22 14:29
MinceRthe dead take no sidesJul 22 14:29
oiaohmGoogle heavly uses open source internally.Jul 22 14:29
oiaohmMS has always had the idea of secrets.Jul 22 14:29
Joehoiaohm: I know. I could see Apple and Microsoft jumping into bed together to rival google before either would ever co-operate on anything more than minor things :pJul 22 14:29
MinceRthat would be funny tooJul 22 14:30
MinceRmaybe we'd see a chair fight between the two Steves to decide who gets to be the supreme ruler of everythingJul 22 14:30
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] Thanks to #froyo my car now has a hotspot :-)Jul 22 14:42
*Ziomatrix (~who@ool-44c468e3.dyn.optonline.net) has joined #boycottnovellJul 22 14:43
oiaohmJoeh: Really is funny now.  Apple is worth more than MSJul 22 14:48
oiaohmLot more.Jul 22 14:48
oiaohmSo apple as no reason to merge with MSJul 22 14:48
Ziomatrixoiaohm: MS Board of Directors may give Balmer the boot: http://news.yahoo.com/s/dailybeast/9107_willmicrosoftceosteveballmerbefiredforlowstockprice;_ylt=ArrNLf_hO8u4GPkSQ3.b4EH9xg8F;_ylu=X3oDMTRsNmpuODgwBGFzc2V0A2RhaWx5YmVhc3QvMjAxMDA3MjIvOTEwN193aWxsbWljcm9zb2Z0Y2Vvc3RldmViYWxsbWVyYmVmaXJlZGZvcmxvd3N0b2NrcHJpY2UEY2NvZGUDbW9zdHBvcHVsYXIEY3BvcwM0BHBvcwM0BHNlYwN5bl90b3Bfc3RvcmllcwRzbGsDYnJld2luZ2NvdXBhJul 22 14:49
TechrightsBotTitle: Brewing Coup Against Microsoft CEO - Yahoo! News .::. Size~: 118.24 KBJul 22 14:49
Ziomatrixoiaohm: sorry link is too big for tinyurl to handle :-PJul 22 14:49
MinceRcrApple is overratedJul 22 14:57
MinceRit's a hype bubbleJul 22 14:57
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] We are not amused? Jokes, twitter and copyright - http://bit.ly/aLpc82 fascinating post about important #copyright issues #twitter #jokesJul 22 15:03
TechrightsBotTitle: panGloss: We are not amused? Jokes, twitter and copyright .::. Size~: 74.52 KBJul 22 15:03
MinceR152242 < oiaohm> Google and MS will always be other sides.Jul 22 15:06
MinceR152253 < MinceR> no, eventually one or both will be deadJul 22 15:06
MinceR152256 < MinceR> the dead take no sidesJul 22 15:06
ZiomatrixMinceR: A hype bubble thats going to collapse over peoples' inflated expectations.Jul 22 15:06
MinceRalso, the winner might do a hostile takeover of the other right before it could dieJul 22 15:06
MinceR=> same side :>Jul 22 15:06
ZiomatrixMinceR: or at least Apple will be severly marginalized once Steve Jobs is no longer CEOJul 22 15:07
MinceRZiomatrix: indeedJul 22 15:07
ZiomatrixMinceR: Apple's stock is already experience violent fluctuations over the iPhone 4's damage control: http://tinyurl.com/3xa9cjtJul 22 15:09
TechrightsBotTitle: Apple Inc. Share Price Chart | AAPL - Yahoo! Finance .::. Size~: 62.22 KBJul 22 15:09
MinceRicJul 22 15:11
ZiomatrixMinceR: I think the stock is a bit better though now that Jobs finally relented and is having Apple stores give out free "bumpers," until September.Jul 22 15:12
MinceRi don't see that on the graph :>Jul 22 15:12
MinceRperhaps stock holders realize that those bumpers are going to cost _them_Jul 22 15:12
MinceR:>Jul 22 15:12
MinceRit's also an official admission of failureJul 22 15:12
ZiomatrixMinceR: lol, its an overglorified rubberbandJul 22 15:12
MinceRi wonder how much help the RDF is against thatJul 22 15:12
MinceRwell, everything from crApple is overglorifiedJul 22 15:13
ZiomatrixMinceR: can't disagree there, its how people make of it which up until recently has been a lotJul 22 15:13
ZiomatrixMinceR: perhaps since the Droid X is getting coverage and is giving Android more then ample face time the whole aura behind Apple's iTunes app store will fade.Jul 22 15:14
MinceRthe droid x is crap, tooJul 22 15:14
MinceRwith the self-destruct "feature"Jul 22 15:14
ZiomatrixMinceR: It maybe a large PMP embedded with DRM and cellphone second but it still gives Android a ton of coverage it didn't have before, at least statesideJul 22 15:15
MinceRicJul 22 15:16
ZiomatrixMinceR: btw, it has been cracked: http://tinyurl.com/28sygp2Jul 22 15:16
TechrightsBotTitle: Droid X can now be counted among the rooted -- Engadget .::. Size~: 174.46 KBJul 22 15:16
MinceRit might be bad coverage thoughJul 22 15:16
MinceRdue to the aforementioned "feature"Jul 22 15:16
ZiomatrixMinceR: not from the non-stop radio supported and TV ads I have been hearingJul 22 15:16
MinceRpeople might go "oh, the hypePhone isn't so bad if others are locking stuff down so hard..."Jul 22 15:16
MinceRor that "android is almost the same crap"Jul 22 15:16
MinceR:)Jul 22 15:16
ZiomatrixMinceR: not to defend such conduct, but the Droid X is only locked from installing custom ROMs. It doesn't even brick itself, it just goes into a forever kind of sleep state.Jul 22 15:17
MinceR"he isn't dead, he's forever asleep"Jul 22 15:18
ZiomatrixMinceR: Android is almost the same in my opinion with a few major ommissions regarding application policyJul 22 15:18
ZiomatrixMinceR: once the stock ROM is re-installed it wakes up againJul 22 15:18
ZiomatrixMinceR: its not in Motorola's best interests to fry their own phonesJul 22 15:18
MinceRi seeJul 22 15:18
MinceRit could be worseJul 22 15:19
MinceRstill, fuck motorola and the horse they rode in onJul 22 15:19
ZiomatrixMinceR: at least they don't pay the MS patent taxJul 22 15:19
MinceRthat makes them better than samsung, but not many othersJul 22 15:19
ZiomatrixMinceR: Many others whose handsets don't make it statesideJul 22 15:21
MinceRicJul 22 15:21
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] EPA slams State Department tar sands pipeline study - http://bit.ly/boXZPL "Oil from Canadian tar sands is among the world’s dirtiest" #oilJul 22 15:22
TechrightsBotTitle: EPA slams State Department tar sands pipeline study «  Climate Progress .::. Size~: 43.42 KBJul 22 15:22
schestowitzJoeh: is JustSuds a Microsoft employee or just you?Jul 22 15:31
ThistleWebhe dun goofedJul 22 15:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] Jedes Volk bekommt die Politiker die es verdient? http://is.gd/dCb2d - die Bayern müssen vieles falsch gemacht haben. #dumpfbacke #daemlichJul 22 15:46
TechrightsBotTitle: Sexuelle Gewalt in der Ferienfreizeit: CSU-Ministerin macht Spiele und FDP für Missbrauch verantwortlich - SPIEGEL ONLINE - Nachrichten - Netzwelt .::. Size~: 57.7 KBJul 22 15:46
schestowitzMaybe a wannabe employeeJul 22 15:47
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Openness: Just What the Doctoral Student Ordered - http://bit.ly/8XFVV5 too bad that the British Library doesn't agree #openaccess #blJul 22 15:51
TechrightsBotTitle: open...: Openness: Just What the Doctoral Student Ordered .::. Size~: 67.28 KBJul 22 15:51
schestowitzhttp://www.techradar.com/news/software/operating-systems/asus-eee-pad-abandons-windows-7-ce-for-android-704385Jul 22 15:51
TechrightsBotTitle: Asus Eee Pad abandons Windows 7 CE for Android | News | TechRadar UK .::. Size~: 65.44 KBJul 22 15:51
schestowitzWow. Everyone loves WIndows.........Jul 22 15:52
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Public-Software.in - http://bit.ly/b3tCRM "only software that is freely shareable can allow universal access" #freesw #indiaJul 22 15:54
TechrightsBotTitle: About Public-Software.in | www.public-software.in .::. Size~: 18.97 KBJul 22 15:54
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[omar_s_hafez] [bɔɹd æz hɪl]!!! ><Jul 22 15:58
ZiomatrixI wonder if MS will include these in their initial Windows 7 phone sales PR? http://twitter.com/maryjofoley/status/19105560802Jul 22 15:58
TechrightsBotTitle: Twitter / Mary Jo Foley: 90K down... just under 30  ... .::. Size~: 11.24 KBJul 22 15:58
schestowitzhttp://mandrivachronicles.blogspot.com/2010/07/bye-linux-im-into-windows-7-now.htmlJul 22 15:59
TechrightsBotTitle: Mandriva Linux Chronicles: Bye, Linux, I'm into Windows 7 Now! .::. Size~: 93.23 KBJul 22 15:59
schestowitzBait headlineJul 22 15:59
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @glynmoody Public-Software.in - http://bit.ly/b3tCRM "only software that is freely shareable can allow universal access" #freesw #indiaJul 22 16:02
TechrightsBotTitle: About Public-Software.in | www.public-software.in .::. Size~: 18.97 KBJul 22 16:02
*oiaohm has quit (Remote host closed the connection)Jul 22 16:03
schestowitzhttp://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Asus-EP101TC-for-Android-and-HP-tradmarks-Palmpad/Jul 22 16:03
TechrightsBotTitle: Is Asus prepping an Android tablet? - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 54.13 KBJul 22 16:04
schestowitzOur resident Microsoft UK employee insisted that Vista 7 is alive and wellJul 22 16:04
schestowitzASUS: "it's better with...... Android?"Jul 22 16:04
MinceR"it's better with whatever we're being paid to advertise at the moment"Jul 22 16:05
MinceRs/paid/paid or threatened/Jul 22 16:05
schestowitzI knowJul 22 16:05
schestowitzThat's what I just wrote in my post draftJul 22 16:05
MinceR:)Jul 22 16:06
schestowitzI'll have fun with this one, given ASUS' historyJul 22 16:06
Ziomatrixschestowitz: it will be interesting to see if HPalm follows Apple exactly akin to the hypePad or offers something closer to Dell's Streak.Jul 22 16:07
schestowitzh/w-s/w bundle?Jul 22 16:08
Ziomatrixschestowitz: HP has already stated contrary to popular belief their HP Slate Windows 7 tablet is still on trackJul 22 16:08
Ziomatrixschestowitz: you mean hardware/software bundle?Jul 22 16:08
schestowitzyeahJul 22 16:08
Ziomatrixschestowitz: who knows, it would be quite awesome if HP actually made drivers and an application so WebOS can print to HP printers.Jul 22 16:09
MinceRit would be nice of HP removed spy-on-the-user functionality from WebOSJul 22 16:10
MinceRs/of/if/Jul 22 16:10
Ziomatrixschestowitz: they can base it off CUPS :-)Jul 22 16:10
Ziomatrixschestowitz: even though then there maybe some heat with Apple, is CUPS totally GNU/GPL?Jul 22 16:11
MinceRseems soJul 22 16:12
MinceRthat's why crApple bought the company :>Jul 22 16:12
ZiomatrixMinceR: what does s/of/if mean btw?Jul 22 16:12
MinceRhm, actually they bought CUPS, not the whole companyJul 22 16:13
MinceRZiomatrix: sed/vim/ex/perl substitute commandJul 22 16:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Draft filesharing code flawed, says Open Rights Group - http://bit.ly/cAs6Fj "How is anyone meant to trust this code?" #DEActJul 22 16:13
ZiomatrixMinceR: I'm actually surprised Apple has not utilized CUPS to get their iPhone to print.Jul 22 16:13
TechrightsBotTitle:  Draft filesharing code flawed, says Open Rights Group | Technology | guardian.co.uk  .::. Size~: 77.55 KBJul 22 16:13
MinceRZiomatrix: replace the first match of the "of" regex with "if"Jul 22 16:13
MinceRwell, the printer would be a peripheral, and they can't have thatJul 22 16:13
ZiomatrixMinceR: icJul 22 16:13
schestowitz[16:10] <MinceR> it would be nice of HP removed spy-on-the-user functionality from WebOSJul 22 16:14
schestowitzThe same HP which ships PCs with Windows+craplets?Jul 22 16:15
MinceRi guess soJul 22 16:15
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Indian Government Builds $35 Computing Device - http://bit.ly/bomFtp presumably running Linux at that price (anyone know?) #indiaJul 22 16:15
TechrightsBotTitle: Woot! Indian Government Builds $35 Laptop .::. Size~: 42.19 KBJul 22 16:15
schestowitzAnd the same HP which has print jobs phone home for advertisers?Jul 22 16:15
MinceRok, so no chance then :>Jul 22 16:15
schestowitz[16:09] <Ziomatrix> schestowitz: who knows, it would be quite awesome if HP actually made drivers and an application so WebOS can print to HP printers.Jul 22 16:15
schestowitzThey'll use the WebOS GUI for printer panelsJul 22 16:15
Ziomatrixschestowitz: lol that seems very yet likely, but I think if thats the case its only logical they get other devices to interact with their flagship and main cashcowsJul 22 16:17
schestowitzThey said so thoughJul 22 16:17
schestowitzMaybe you missed itJul 22 16:17
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Microsoft Rebranding Itself To Be What’s Next - http://bit.ly/bLO36s as in "has-been"? #microsoftJul 22 16:18
TechrightsBotTitle: Microsoft Rebranding Itself To Be Whats Next .::. Size~: 79.62 KBJul 22 16:18
Ziomatrixschestowitz: no I didn't, only every tech blog across the web ran with that headline and straight into a PR disasterJul 22 16:18
schestowitzTheir statements re phones confuse people cause theys hift form factorsJul 22 16:18
schestowitzGoogle got all the lInux appsJul 22 16:18
schestowitzWebOS has a 3rd-party dev issueJul 22 16:18
schestowitzDespite the one-million/100,000-dollar prizeJul 22 16:18
Ziomatrixschestowitz: MS hired kindergardeners for their logo design team: http://tinyurl.com/2czydjhJul 22 16:19
TechrightsBotTitle: New Microsoft brand logos, company tagline revealed at MGX event? (update: no new logos, tagline is a go) -- Engadget .::. Size~: 216.36 KBJul 22 16:19
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Will The House Of Lords Block The Digital Economy Act? - http://bit.ly/ccmfPQ that would be fun #DEAct #houseoflordsJul 22 16:20
TechrightsBotTitle: Will The House Of Lords Block The Digital Economy Act?| paidContent:UK .::. Size~: 29.61 KBJul 22 16:20
Ziomatrixschestowitz: devs are slowly trickling back: http://tinyurl.com/34yuuvfJul 22 16:20
TechrightsBotTitle: Angry Birds on webOS: You can make it happen | PreCentral.net .::. Size~: 131.98 KBJul 22 16:20
schestowitzZiomatrix: hehe. Yes, crap logosJul 22 16:22
Ziomatrixschestowitz: well those "crap apps" are some of the best selling on iTunes apparentlyJul 22 16:22
Ziomatrixschestowitz: I found plenty of good exclusives on my own and don't feel the need to be 100s of diplicates of those that do roughly the same to constitute a healthy dev community.Jul 22 16:23
Ziomatrixschestowitz: I find WebOS's dev community a cooperative while iTunes is a jungle, and Android is fluctuating between the two with only Google apps such as Google Voicemail and Goggles leading the way in killer apps.Jul 22 16:24
schestowitzZiomatrix: I'll quote you on that laterJul 22 16:25
schestowitzbrbJul 22 16:25
Ziomatrixschestowitz: I have to get going anyway, glad I can contributeJul 22 16:26
ZiomatrixMinceR: laterzJul 22 16:26
*Ziomatrix has quit ()Jul 22 16:27
schestowitzThis reminds me...Jul 22 16:31
*schestowitz removes channel operator status from schestowitz_logJul 22 16:31
*schestowitz gives channel operator status to MinceRJul 22 16:31
schestowitzTrolls around here lately...Jul 22 16:31
MinceR:)Jul 22 16:31
JoehThose nasty trolls.Jul 22 16:31
schestowitzUbertroll: http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2010/Jul-21-1.htmlJul 22 16:32
TechrightsBotTitle: Mono 2.8 Trick: tracing exceptions - Miguel de Icaza .::. Size~: 14.96 KBJul 22 16:33
schestowitz[13:33] <Joeh> I have an Android phone... that's free software right?Jul 22 16:33
schestowitz[14:26] <Joeh> I like Android.Jul 22 16:33
schestowitz"Butt........."Jul 22 16:33
schestowitzYou need to get behind something in order to stab it in the backJul 22 16:34
JoehThat's not trolling. I could do way better than that. :pJul 22 16:34
schestowitzJava for exampleJul 22 16:34
schestowitzJoeh: I haven't been rude to youJul 22 16:34
JoehNot a big fan of Java I have to say :pJul 22 16:34
schestowitzBut I came back here and read the logsJul 22 16:35
schestowitzIt's basically not too supportive of us, to say the leastJul 22 16:35
schestowitzSome is intended to aggravateJul 22 16:35
schestowitz[13:20] --> Joeh has joined this channel (~joehega@nat/microsoft/x-lvznnafzrgjjfbxv).Jul 22 16:35
schestowitz[13:22] <JustSuds> Why are we boycotting novell? I thought they were the greatest.Jul 22 16:35
schestowitzFirst line is a "hit"Jul 22 16:36
JoehThat's not me...Jul 22 16:36
Joeh:pJul 22 16:36
JoehRead the username...Jul 22 16:36
schestowitzYour sidekickJul 22 16:36
JoehHe's not my sidekick.Jul 22 16:36
schestowitzYou know, like the one which Rosie had lose t-mobile customers' data..Jul 22 16:36
MinceR:>Jul 22 16:36
MinceRi'm afraid that's over our Hate Quota too :>Jul 22 16:36
JoehYou could always ban me from the channel if you don't want me here.Jul 22 16:37
schestowitzJustSuds = the Krusty of Techrights :-)Jul 22 16:37
schestowitzJoeh: I have no problem with you hereJul 22 16:37
schestowitzYour employer mightJul 22 16:37
schestowitzYou use their machinesJul 22 16:37
MinceRwhy? they do support astroturfing :>Jul 22 16:37
JoehI don't agree with you guys, I didn't mean to cause offense though :)Jul 22 16:38
schestowitzI know....Jul 22 16:38
ThistleWebyes you didJul 22 16:38
schestowitzJoe BarktoJul 22 16:38
JoehWho is Joe Barkto?Jul 22 16:39
schestowitzhttp://identi.ca/notice/42995112 "Nice, you picked up a post of mine on Ghabuntu, thanks http://ur1.ca/0tdq1"Jul 22 16:39
TechrightsBotTitle: agentsmith's status on Thursday, 22-Jul-10 14:22:36 UTC - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 8.72 KBJul 22 16:39
TechrightsBotTitle: How to make you own Linux distro | GHABUNTU .::. Size~: 90.44 KBJul 22 16:39
schestowitzGhabuntu is greatJul 22 16:39
schestowitzhttp://twitter.com/mahesharandara/statuses/19259181932 "Nice Pic about #foss http://bit.ly/d5ugd4 | Mono deserves its place! | Lol"Jul 22 16:40
TechrightsBotTitle: Twitter / Mahesh Arandara: RT: @Aerobender: Nice Pic  ... .::. Size~: 11.36 KBJul 22 16:40
MinceRi'm not sure what's mono doing thereJul 22 16:40
MinceRinfections generally aren't depicted that way :>Jul 22 16:40
schestowitzJoeh: http://lists.essential.org/1998/am-info/msg01529.htmlJul 22 16:40
Joehschestowitz: I have never tried to conceal my association. Jul 22 16:41
JoehYou are free to believe what you want :) - I'm not going to try and convince you Microsoft are fluffy bunnies out the save the worldJul 22 16:42
Joehthat would be a waste of all of our time :pJul 22 16:42
schestowitzYou did not disclose it, eitherJul 22 16:42
schestowitzI find it curious that you chose to speak to us of all peopleJul 22 16:42
schestowitzI mean, I distrust Microsoft, but I don't go to their HQ to chatJul 22 16:42
Joehschestowitz: To be fair, my hostmask does say Microsoft, and I have been in this channel before under the name Adus, I just forgot to make my new join script use that username.Jul 22 16:42
schestowitzJoeh: you're a personJul 22 16:42
schestowitzMicrosoft is a companyJul 22 16:43
schestowitzA group of peopleJul 22 16:43
schestowitzNobody forced you to work thereJul 22 16:43
MinceRit didn't say so before, thoughJul 22 16:43
schestowitzYet you chose that company (in two senses of the word)Jul 22 16:43
JoehWhat didn't?Jul 22 16:43
MinceRand i wonder what "join scripts" have to do with nicks, considering that nicks are assigned to connections, not channelsJul 22 16:43
ThistleWebsomeone vouched for you as "allright "too, can't remember whoJul 22 16:43
MinceR(this being IRC, not Jabber)Jul 22 16:43
MinceRJoeh: your hostnameJul 22 16:43
JoehMy hostname was this when I joined the channelJul 22 16:44
Joehand MinceR, Joeh is the default nickname I have on mIRCJul 22 16:44
schestowitzJoeh: you are a slave to a criminal groupJul 22 16:44
schestowitzYou don't need to beJul 22 16:44
schestowitzYour job is writing code they ownJul 22 16:44
schestowitzYou give them your life, they compensate youJul 22 16:44
schestowitzThat's the nature of the job you doJul 22 16:44
JoehIsn't that the nature of working for any company?Jul 22 16:44
JoehYou do something, they pay you, they own it?Jul 22 16:44
schestowitzI never needed to make proprietary code or be the servant of people who harm others with my workJul 22 16:45
MinceRnot all companies are criminal groupsJul 22 16:45
schestowitzBut hey, that's your choiceJul 22 16:45
schestowitzSchools openly say they prepare kids for work, not teach them ethicsJul 22 16:45
JoehI'm thinking any big company has significant litigation tied to it over the years.Jul 22 16:45
schestowitzhttp://techrights.org/2010/02/17/choice-versus-condition/Jul 22 16:45
schestowitzStep back sometimes and think about your impact on societyJul 22 16:45
MinceRnot all companies try to do business solely by trying to keep competitors with superior products and services out of the marketJul 22 16:46
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[doctorow] 1st WITH A LITTLE HELP prototype! http://twitpic.com/27linc http://twitpic.com/27lixuJul 22 16:46
schestowitzI too am critical even of my family when someone does harm to society for moneyJul 22 16:46
TechrightsBotTitle: Nobody is Born a Microsoft Employee | Techrights .::. Size~: 111.58 KBJul 22 16:46
TechrightsBotTitle:  Twitpic - Share photos on Twitter  .::. Size~: 9.35 KBJul 22 16:46
TechrightsBotTitle:  Twitpic - Share photos on Twitter  .::. Size~: 9.28 KBJul 22 16:46
schestowitzSo at least I'm not a hypocriteJul 22 16:46
JoehI work on the Xbox. We're not exactly evil I'd argue :pJul 22 16:46
MinceRnot all companies gained their position in their respective markets by scamming a clientJul 22 16:46
schestowitzHeheJul 22 16:46
JoehIs this revenge for earlier? :pJul 22 16:47
schestowitzAFAIK, your company discriminates against gaysJul 22 16:47
MinceRyeah, a gaming console that has an over 50% failure rate and an inherently abusive business model and loads of DRM is not evil at allJul 22 16:47
schestowitzAnd you too IIRC are gayJul 22 16:47
MinceRno sirJul 22 16:47
Joehschestowitz: Since when? Jul 22 16:47
schestowitzANd it gets worse: http://techrights.org/2008/09/15/microsoft-gags-own-employees/Jul 22 16:47
TechrightsBotTitle: Microsoft Gags Own Employees to Put Customers Life at Risk | Techrights .::. Size~: 103.13 KBJul 22 16:47
schestowitzAlso xbox related: http://techrights.org/2009/04/12/microsoft-sneaks-out/Jul 22 16:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Iran stoning case woman ordered to name campaigners | World news | The Guardian http://tinyurl.com/33cfwc5Jul 22 16:48
TechrightsBotTitle: Microsoft Sneaks Out of Treason and Homophobia Charges | Techrights .::. Size~: 103.95 KBJul 22 16:48
TechrightsBotTitle:  Iran stoning case woman ordered to name campaigners | World news | The Guardian  .::. Size~: 68.38 KBJul 22 16:48
MinceRnot to mention restricting business to certain countries, then taking the money from prospective customers in other countries only to ban them from the service right after taking the moneyJul 22 16:48
schestowitzIt's worseJul 22 16:49
schestowitzAs I explained to someone last week (in person), importers do a disservice to their countryJul 22 16:49
schestowitzThey pretend to help the populationJul 22 16:49
schestowitzBut they compete against the local producersJul 22 16:49
JoehSo, what. You're saying I shouldn't work for Microsoft because they are evil?Jul 22 16:49
schestowitzTheir imports helps 'outsiders' competeJul 22 16:49
schestowitzMicrosoft does a lot of thatJul 22 16:49
schestowitzImport = import of powerJul 22 16:49
JoehIsn't that the reality of a global economy?Jul 22 16:50
schestowitzJoeh: you could check which companies provide a service to society, not force OEMs to force customers to force peers to buy OfficeJul 22 16:50
MinceRi'm saying that you shouldn't say that you're not evil despite aiding one of the biggest criminal organizations in the worldJul 22 16:50
MinceRknowinglyJul 22 16:50
JoehWhat are you opinions on google?Jul 22 16:50
MinceRnot very flatteringJul 22 16:50
schestowitzJoeh: that goes into the globalisation angleJul 22 16:51
MinceRbut google is still a lot less evil than m$Jul 22 16:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] Handy-Hersteller fühlen sich ver-applet ;-) http://is.gd/dCeZz #antennagateJul 22 16:51
TechrightsBotTitle: Netzwelt-Ticker: Handy-Hersteller wehren sich gegen Apple-Vereinnahmung - SPIEGEL ONLINE - Nachrichten - Netzwelt .::. Size~: 55.34 KBJul 22 16:51
MinceRhttp://games.slashdot.org/story/10/01/27/064236/Microsoft-Facing-Class-Action-Suit-Over-Xbox-Live-Points?from=rss&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Slashdot%2Fslashdot+%28Slashdot%29Jul 22 16:51
TechrightsBotTitle: Slashdot Games Story | Microsoft Facing Class-Action Suit Over Xbox Live Points .::. Size~: 143.77 KBJul 22 16:51
MinceRthis is interesting tooJul 22 16:51
schestowitzglobalisation not as in harmony, but increasingly-cheaper (poorer) labour to super-commerceJul 22 16:51
schestowitzhttp://www.tuxmachines.org is up and down todayJul 22 16:52
schestowitzRare downtimes...Jul 22 16:52
JoehI'd make a joke about flakey Linux servers, but I actually like Linux as a server.Jul 22 16:53
schestowitzThis is really annoying, I'll just write some posts Jul 22 16:53
JoehThat would be trolling :pJul 22 16:53
schestowitzJoeh: "just a server"?Jul 22 16:53
TechrightsBotTitle: Error processing the URL:  .::. Size~: 0 KBJul 22 16:53
MinceRJoeh: even you can't stand winblows as a server? :>Jul 22 16:53
Joehschestowitz: I think it has other uses. Embedded. Android seems to make good use of it as a mobile.Jul 22 16:53
JoehI'm not a fan for desktops thoughJul 22 16:53
Joehthough that's not really the fault of LinuxJul 22 16:53
Joehjust the crap that sits on top of it :pJul 22 16:54
MinceRi seem to make good use of gnu/linux on the desktopJul 22 16:54
MinceRincluding the most powerful windowing system :>Jul 22 16:54
MinceRand a command line that is actually usableJul 22 16:54
schestowitzYour smartphone runs Linux too, JoehJul 22 16:54
Joehschestowitz: I know it does. I just said that.Jul 22 16:54
MinceRand a system that's actually modularJul 22 16:54
schestowitzSo Chimp-in-chief wants to give you free Vista Phone 7Jul 22 16:54
JoehSo I hear schestowitzJul 22 16:55
MinceRwell, maybe he'll be ordered to love it tooJul 22 16:55
MinceRor elseJul 22 16:55
JoehAssuming I'm still at Microsoft of course.Jul 22 16:55
JoehWhen it comes out.Jul 22 16:55
MinceRwhy?Jul 22 16:55
Joeh?Jul 22 16:55
MinceRwhy are you uncertain about being still there then?Jul 22 16:56
schestowitzDownsizing, unless you're in IndiaJul 22 16:56
schestowitzIn India they still hireJul 22 16:56
MinceRoh.Jul 22 16:56
JoehBecause the project I'm working on is coming to an end, and I've been considering what I want to do in future. Staying here is a distinct possibilityJul 22 16:56
Joehbut I've been interviewing elsewhere in the last couple of weeksJul 22 16:56
schestowitzMicrosoft should hire a female of ethnic minority for CEOJul 22 16:57
schestowitzThis way nobody will mock Microsoft's CEO anymoreJul 22 16:57
Diablo-D3soJul 22 16:57
MinceRlolJul 22 16:57
schestowitzThey did this with CodePlexJul 22 16:57
Diablo-D3uhJul 22 16:57
Diablo-D3pull aJul 22 16:57
MinceRactually we still willJul 22 16:57
Diablo-D3GOPJul 22 16:57
Diablo-D3with micheal "IM BLACK" steeleJul 22 16:57
ThistleWeb"I'm black, and I'm proud"Jul 22 16:57
MinceRDiablo-D3: that sentence would have easily fit on one line :>Jul 22 16:57
Diablo-D3<obama> dear gop, I have the color black patented and trademarked, pay up faggotsJul 22 16:58
MinceRthat would be geniusJul 22 16:58
MinceRsuing all people of a certain race like thatJul 22 16:58
MinceR:>Jul 22 16:58
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] RHT at 32 US$ is a nice thing :-) market cap now 6.08B, almost 3x that of NOVL ...Jul 22 16:59
JoehSurely you can just come up with an equation, give the variables names and get your own patent. Get rich quick? Rather than making jokes about other people abusing patentsJul 22 16:59
Joehget it on the action :pJul 22 16:59
Diablo-D3seriously thoughJul 22 16:59
Diablo-D3obama gets electedJul 22 16:59
Diablo-D3shortly afterJul 22 16:59
Diablo-D3steele becomes the head of gopJul 22 16:59
Diablo-D3just so they can goJul 22 16:59
Diablo-D3HEY OUR HEAD GUY IS BLACK TOOJul 22 16:59
Diablo-D3ignoring the fact that if you're not a catholic white male you're hated.Jul 22 17:00
Diablo-D3sorry, catholic white STRAIGHT maleJul 22 17:00
Diablo-D3if you're jew, black, gay, or a woman, you're fucked.Jul 22 17:00
schestowitzWith one wifeJul 22 17:00
schestowitzUnless you're ThatcherJul 22 17:01
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @jwildeboer RHT at 32 US$ is a nice thing :-) market cap now 6.08B, almost 3x that of NOVL ...Jul 22 17:01
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Joehschestowitz: Thatcher was hated before long :pJul 22 17:01
Diablo-D3schestowitz: Thatcher had a set of thatchersJul 22 17:01
JoehANy of you guys canadian (odd question I know) ?Jul 22 17:02
Diablo-D3so like, shes fineJul 22 17:02
Joehor live in canada?Jul 22 17:02
ZiodotmatrixJeoh: pfff I live in the real AmericaJul 22 17:02
schestowitzcubezzz3 is canadian iircJul 22 17:03
schestowitzender2070 tooJul 22 17:03
JoehI am wondering what montreal is like. Thinking about moving thereJul 22 17:04
ZiodotmatrixJoeh: not in the little parlaimentary socialist Commonwealth remaining enclave of the northJul 22 17:04
Joehjust trying to get lots of opinions.Jul 22 17:04
schestowitztrmanco lives around thereJul 22 17:04
schestowitzhe wrote TechrightsBotJul 22 17:04
ZiodotmatrixJoeh: It looks like a nice city, good beer and interesting bagelsJul 22 17:04
schestowitzHow do you know he's only into food?Jul 22 17:04
JoehZiodotmatrix: Heard it has a good gay scene as well.Jul 22 17:05
schestowitzLondon seems to tread towards having more CCTVs than peopleJul 22 17:05
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: I am stating what I know about the place, I actually want to visit sometimeJul 22 17:05
schestowitzIn London, CCTV is the new sheepJul 22 17:05
schestowitzTo NZJul 22 17:05
MinceRno, citizens are the sheepJul 22 17:05
MinceRCCTV is the eye of the shepherdJul 22 17:05
Joehschestowitz: UK is ridiculous at the momentJul 22 17:05
JoehI want out asap.Jul 22 17:06
schestowitzEscaping national debt?Jul 22 17:06
schestowitz'Defence' budget down 30%Jul 22 17:06
JoehYes, and Higher Taxes/VATJul 22 17:06
JoehStill don't see why we need Trident personally.Jul 22 17:06
JoehCan't we just borrow some off the americans or something?Jul 22 17:06
Joehif we really need them at all?Jul 22 17:06
schestowitzTirdent was the sub, right?Jul 22 17:07
ZiodotmatrixJoeh: Canadian dollar  value to the US couldn't be better. Be aware there are a lot of Asians living there.Jul 22 17:07
schestowitzNuclear one... controversial still.Jul 22 17:07
Joehschestowitz: Yeh, the Nuclear DeterrantJul 22 17:07
Joeh3 subs, one is always out, with ICBMsJul 22 17:07
Joehso they can hit back at anyone after an attackJul 22 17:07
Joehvery cold warJul 22 17:07
Joeh:pJul 22 17:07
schestowitzToronto G20Jul 22 17:07
schestowitzPolice with zealJul 22 17:07
ZiodotmatrixJoeh: some say that Chinese may become the majority or at least a major minority over FrancophonesJul 22 17:07
schestowitztuxmachines.org finally back. YippieJul 22 17:08
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: no Trident is the name of an underwater launched ICBM. Polaris is the system that launches it.Jul 22 17:08
schestowitzA few hours ago I met a cynical friend who serves in KuwaitJul 22 17:09
schestowitzBoxing class..Jul 22 17:09
schestowitzJust reminds me how out of touch I am with militariesJul 22 17:09
schestowitz*served (not serves anymore)Jul 22 17:10
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: military is right behind celebrities and money when it comes to most talked about in the US mediaJul 22 17:10
schestowitzUK has other oil pipes now... :-)Jul 22 17:10
schestowitzIn fact, who needs pipes?Jul 22 17:10
schestowitzIt just flows out of the seasbed :-)Jul 22 17:10
schestowitz*seabedJul 22 17:10
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: I read though the UK has reached peak oil thoughJul 22 17:11
schestowitzBP has new staffJul 22 17:11
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: and Scottland wants independence to take the remainderJul 22 17:11
schestowitzThey give some buckets to poverty-stricken Lousianans and say, "let's go to the beach. Whoever grabs most oil wins."Jul 22 17:12
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: or at least the major political party in Scottish Parliament doesJul 22 17:12
MinceRor "you get to sell the oil you gather"Jul 22 17:12
schestowitzWith sand?Jul 22 17:12
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: oil is really of not much use or profit unless refined.Jul 22 17:13
schestowitzThat's worse than Canadian sandy tar pitsJul 22 17:13
schestowitzIt would spoil your engineJul 22 17:13
schestowitzWe need oil for food tooJul 22 17:13
schestowitzAnd we need more of itJul 22 17:13
schestowitz9 billion to feed in 20 yearsJul 22 17:13
schestowitzGotta make them fertilisers/pesticides/tractors/trucks...Jul 22 17:14
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: Iran exports plenty but is still not a first class power because it has nothing to refine it so they actually have to import gas. Israel actually saves more by importing raw oil and having their domestic refining company owned by an Ausie Paz refine it.Jul 22 17:14
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: and now I go OT :-PJul 22 17:15
*schestowitz considers going to S.America to advocate Freedom software where it's accomplishableJul 22 17:16
schestowitzWhy is Greenpeace so anti-nuclear power?Jul 22 17:17
schestowitzI mean, the alternatives are waves/wind/sunJul 22 17:17
MinceRprobably because nuclear power is not 100% cleanJul 22 17:18
schestowitzToo low-intensityJul 22 17:18
Ziodotmatriximho the Islamic Republic should focus more on building their own state of the art refineries rather then The Bomb. It would definitely benefit their international standing (except against the Anglophiles) and among the Iranian peopleJul 22 17:18
schestowitzMinceR: it's almost waste-free now in g3 aand g4Jul 22 17:18
MinceRcan't handle the waste, only store it and even then it remains very dangerous for a long timeJul 22 17:18
MinceRwtf g3, g4?Jul 22 17:18
schestowitzChernobyl had a crappy old methodJul 22 17:18
schestowitzAnd sloppy staffJul 22 17:19
schestowitzEven with sloppy design nothing bad should have ever happenedJul 22 17:19
schestowitzBut now it's self-suspending and not much waste generatedJul 22 17:19
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: I bet Open Source software would be a huge hit in S.America considering MS's assosciation with US corporate and political establishment there.Jul 22 17:19
schestowitzJust don't ask me about the technical details because these are closely-guarded secrets for obvious reasonsJul 22 17:19
JoehI'm quite supportive of Nuclear Power. Not so much with Nuclear weaponsJul 22 17:19
Joehproblem is, everyone would have to get rid of them, and they won't.Jul 22 17:19
MinceRafaik it is successfulJul 22 17:19
MinceRin brazil, for exampleJul 22 17:20
schestowitzEven Linus Pauling was harassed by the US secret services for dropping some detailsJul 22 17:20
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] AOL Mobile Goes HTML5, Picks Android Over iPhone for New App - http://bit.ly/cZOPhD straws in the wind #html5 #android #aolJul 22 17:20
TechrightsBotTitle:   AOL Mobile Goes HTML5, Picks Android Over iPhone for New App .::. Size~: 62.47 KBJul 22 17:20
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: Chilean government has written an amendment into their constitution for Net NeutralityJul 22 17:20
MinceRnuclear power is still most likely better than most of the power generation we're doing nowJul 22 17:20
JoehI agree MinceRJul 22 17:20
schestowitzZiodotmatrix: opposite?Jul 22 17:20
schestowitz[17:19] <Ziodotmatrix> schestowitz: I bet Open Source software would be a huge hit in S.America considering MS's assosciation with US corporate and political establishment there.Jul 22 17:20
draoanin finland our new olkiluoto-3 reactor: "Olkiluoto has become an example of all that can go wrong in economic terms with new reactors".Jul 22 17:21
schestowitz[17:19] <Joeh> I'm quite supportive of Nuclear Power. Not so much with Nuclear weaponsJul 22 17:21
schestowitzAlmost the same thingJul 22 17:21
schestowitzYou just refine it moreJul 22 17:21
draoanwelding errors and failure of supervision constant news :DJul 22 17:21
schestowitzThe former sometimes used as disguise for the latterJul 22 17:21
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: just stating how many S.Americans have lingering hatred for US establishments.Jul 22 17:22
schestowitzdraoan: so temporary shutdownJul 22 17:22
schestowitzZiodotmatrix: yes, coupsJul 22 17:22
Joehschestowitz: Oh. I'm not talking technology wise, just ideologically.Jul 22 17:23
schestowitzBut that doesn't mean all leaders in SA are proxies set up/installed by CIA et alJul 22 17:23
JoehI accept that nuclear weapons are a neccesary part of our world.Jul 22 17:23
draoanno they haven't finished the reactor yet Jul 22 17:23
JoehUnless everyone agreed not to build them, and actually didn't, we can't get rid of them.Jul 22 17:23
draoanhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olkiluoto_Nuclear_Power_PlantJul 22 17:23
schestowitzChavez has just put in prison someone who criticized their banking industyr/economyJul 22 17:23
ZiodotmatrixMinceR: Canadian CANDU reactors are the most ideal for efficiency, price and relative environmental friendliness compared to others. The PRC contracted them to build a bunch throughout China.Jul 22 17:23
schestowitzHere we put in prison people who joke about airportsJul 22 17:24
MinceRthe PRC is not a good recommendation :>Jul 22 17:24
TechrightsBotTitle: Olkiluoto Nuclear Power Plant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 56.03 KBJul 22 17:24
schestowitzBut the West will use this to demonise the Hugo Igor Hunchback something...Jul 22 17:24
ZiodotmatrixJoeh: Canada is actually a leader in civil nuclear technology. Their only real competition is France.Jul 22 17:24
draoanhttp://www.world-nuclear-news.org/NN-Olkiluoto_pipe_welding_deficient_says_regulator-1610095.htmlJul 22 17:24
TechrightsBotTitle: Olkiluoto pipe welding 'deficient', says regulator .::. Size~: 24.03 KBJul 22 17:24
draoanyeah, gotta go->Jul 22 17:24
schestowitzok, l8ersJul 22 17:25
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz_log: patent trolls are killing our (US) economyJul 22 17:37
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz_log: the Obama Administration need not go further then fraudulent patents, lopsided licensing agreements and banks not doing what their main intended purpose for businesses being lend as the primary problem creating an incredibly devisive environment for entrepreneurs.Jul 22 17:39
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz_log: some argue Obama's regime is actually complicit or even involved in creating such a messJul 22 17:39
schestowitz"Regime"?Jul 22 17:40
schestowitzAlso, what do you want from Obama? He's just the spokesperson/front.Jul 22 17:40
schestowitzFor example, regarding "IPR", Biden does most of the shoulder-pattingJul 22 17:40
Diablo-D3and hillary does most of the shoulder paddingJul 22 17:41
Diablo-D3dohohohohohoJul 22 17:41
schestowitzMonica does most of the.... never mindJul 22 17:41
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: well technically that is how one can define each suceding government that gets elected into office of a healthy republic, an administration or regime with unique political interests the voting majority endorsed.Jul 22 17:41
schestowitzhttp://tirania.org/blog/archive/2010/Jul-20.htmlJul 22 17:42
TechrightsBotTitle: Fresh Mono Baked - Miguel de Icaza .::. Size~: 13.99 KBJul 22 17:42
schestowitzOh, goodie. Into the wastebasket it goesJul 22 17:42
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz_log: I know Obama doesn't run the show, but he's their face none the less. US politics no matter how large are far more open to the media then PRC leadership.Jul 22 17:42
schestowitzThis Microsoft blog (written in an Office in Boston) pretends to be FOSSJul 22 17:43
schestowitzMexica has some good developers though: http://www.twit.tv/floss127Jul 22 17:43
TechrightsBotTitle: The TWiT Netcast Network with Leo Laporte .::. Size~: 28.12 KBJul 22 17:43
schestowitzhttp://www.streetinsider.com/New+Coverage/CapStone+Slaps+a+Sell+on+Red+Hat+(RHT),+Also+Sets+$24+Price+Target/5818403.htmlJul 22 17:45
TechrightsBotTitle: StreetInsider.com .::. Size~: 42.95 KBJul 22 17:45
schestowitzWho's thatJul 22 17:45
schestowitz?Jul 22 17:45
schestowitz"CapStone"Jul 22 17:45
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz: viva para la resistance en nationalJul 22 17:46
schestowitzhttp://www.google.com/search?hl=&q=CapStone+sucks&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&ie=UTF-8Jul 22 17:46
TechrightsBotTitle: CapStone sucks - Google Search .::. Size~: 39.35 KBJul 22 17:46
schestowitzAhh...Jul 22 17:46
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz_log: classic pump and dump maneuverJul 22 17:47
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz_log: or if they didn't endorse it before it's short sellingJul 22 17:47
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz_log: are you familiar with shorting?Jul 22 17:52
Ziodotmatrixschestowitz_log: anyway I have to get going because the battery is approaching est. half capacity and it's not safe to constantly text while walking, ecspecially in a big city.Jul 22 17:54
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MinceR:)Jul 22 17:55
schestowitzThey tell the stoc^H^H^Hvestor what to doJul 22 17:58
ender2070I'm in the Toronto area thoughJul 22 18:02
ender2070I didn't really like Montreal too muchJul 22 18:02
*Wulf-is-not-here is now known as WireWulfJul 22 18:07
schestowitzInstall Gloobus Preview In UbuntuJul 22 18:11
schestowitzhttp://www.simplehelp.net/2010/07/21/how-to-dual-boot-jolicloud-and-windows-on-your-netbook/Jul 22 18:11
TechrightsBotTitle: How to dual-boot Jolicloud and Windows on your Netbook  Simple Help .::. Size~: 46.35 KBJul 22 18:11
schestowitzThree Apps For Monitoring Performance In Linux - http://techthrob.com/2010/07/21/three-apps-for-monitoring-performance-in-linux/Jul 22 18:12
TechrightsBotTitle: Three Apps For Monitoring Performance In Linux  |  Techthrob.com .::. Size~: 42.79 KBJul 22 18:13
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sebsebsebHiJul 22 18:21
ender2070hey sebsebsebJul 22 18:22
sebsebsebender2070: HeyJul 22 18:25
schestowitzhttp://identi.ca/conversation/42659019#notice-43019007 "@schestowitz interesting. I agree openSUSE probably needs a bit more distance, find other supporters too. Final goodbye is a bit much"Jul 22 18:27
TechrightsBotTitle: Conversation - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 9.37 KBJul 22 18:27
schestowitzif the OpenSUSE guys forked it, I'd probably install it for the KDE implementation againJul 22 18:27
schestowitzComments disabled http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/07/22/corbis_fraud/Jul 22 18:29
TechrightsBotTitle: Bill Gates' other company dinged for fraud • The Register .::. Size~: 26.3 KBJul 22 18:29
schestowitzAndrew Orlowski hates comments. He flames and then says, "Shut it!"Jul 22 18:29
MinceRdisengaging from novell could save opensuseJul 22 18:30
ender2070it is a nice distroJul 22 18:31
ender2070it just has the taint of novell's nameJul 22 18:31
MinceRi don't think it's nice at allJul 22 18:32
schestowitzIt looks niceJul 22 18:32
schestowitzIt still has good developers working on itJul 22 18:32
ender2070they finally caught up with fedoraJul 22 18:32
ender2070its pretty goodJul 22 18:32
schestowitzI liked yast2Jul 22 18:32
ender2070they past fedora in gcc thoughJul 22 18:32
schestowitzNot sure if it kept up with new kcenter/othersJul 22 18:33
ender2070I have to wait for Fedora 14 if I want GCC 4.5Jul 22 18:33
schestowitz /kkontrolJul 22 18:33
sebsebsebI still haven't virtual machined the latest OpenSuse to try, however its apparently pretty good.Jul 22 18:33
schestowitz*conJul 22 18:33
ender2070even then, i'll have to compile my own software if I want LTO enabledJul 22 18:33
ender2070the redhat gcc maintainer tells people not to use LTO because its brokenJul 22 18:33
sebsebsebschestowitz: by the way its been there for a while now, but theres also this site now.Jul 22 18:34
sebsebsebhttp://www.omgsuse.comJul 22 18:34
TechrightsBotTitle: OMG! SUSE! | openSUSE news, app reviews, eye candy and opinion .::. Size~: 22.27 KBJul 22 18:34
sebsebsebwhich I still haven't visitedJul 22 18:34
ender2070other than opensuse, arch also has gcc 4.5Jul 22 18:34
sebsebsebmaybe its timeJul 22 18:34
ender2070gentoo has it but its maskedJul 22 18:34
sebsebsebok its time I just clicked the link, and my browser opensJul 22 18:34
ender2070none of the buntu's or debian derivatives have it from what i can tellJul 22 18:35
schestowitz"omg crap"Jul 22 18:35
sebsebsebso when is Novell dieing?Jul 22 18:37
sebsebsebWhen is OpenSuse dieing? :DJul 22 18:37
schestowitz I am going to try a different format in the site; you'll see in a momentJul 22 18:37
sebsebsebschestowitz: your site you mean?Jul 22 18:38
sebsebsebI don't tend to visit it, to be honestJul 22 18:38
ender2070I usually just catch the interesting headlines that pop up in channelJul 22 18:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Sony now facing single class-action for PS3 other-OS removal http://tinyurl.com/382pax2Jul 22 18:48
TechrightsBotTitle: Sony now facing single class-action for PS3 other-OS removal .::. Size~: 29.38 KBJul 22 18:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Slashdot Apple Story | Forced iAds Coming To OS X? - I soooooo hope Apple do this http://tinyurl.com/34zvss2Jul 22 18:54
TechrightsBotTitle: Slashdot Apple Story | Forced iAds Coming To OS X? .::. Size~: 149.8 KBJul 22 18:54
WireWulfi miss read that i thinked i read forced Aids coming to OS XJul 22 18:55
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Slashdot Apple Story | Apple Doesn't Appreciate Toilet Humor - iPood, brilliant http://tinyurl.com/2uudzpsJul 22 18:56
TechrightsBotTitle: Slashdot Apple Story | Apple Doesn't Appreciate Toilet Humor .::. Size~: 124.8 KBJul 22 18:56
ender2070seems opensuse is even beating fedora on benchmarksJul 22 18:57
ender2070its probably due to gcc 4.5Jul 22 18:57
ender2070newer kernelJul 22 18:57
ender2070we'll see what happens with F14 thoughJul 22 18:57
WireWulfi am still useing gcc 4.4.2 Jul 22 18:57
WireWulf*4.4.3 i mean Jul 22 18:57
ender2070I feel sorry for you :(Jul 22 18:58
ender2070i feel sorry for myself tooJul 22 18:59
ender2070gcc (GCC) 4.4.4 20100630 (Red Hat 4.4.4-10)Jul 22 18:59
schestowitzHmmm.. The Rickroll  goes back to 4chan?? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KT--CsBh5TM&NR=1Jul 22 19:04
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Know Your Meme: The Rickroll .::. Size~: 119.48 KBJul 22 19:04
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1wZbIdlSTI&NR=1Jul 22 19:06
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Know Your Meme: Yo Dawg .::. Size~: 119.88 KBJul 22 19:06
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[nsisodiya] CM (Rajasthan ) Ashok Gehlot visit GangaNagar District. We will be showing our OLPC efforts. #olpc #india #rajasthanJul 22 19:19
*DaemonFC (~ryan@adsl-99-20-199-32.dsl.sbndin.sbcglobal.net) has joined #boycottnovellJul 22 19:26
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] German court overturns injunction against RapidShare - http://bit.ly/9ShkrA swings and roundabouts #copyright #deJul 22 19:29
TechrightsBotTitle: German court overturns injunction against RapidShare .::. Size~: 29.45 KBJul 22 19:29
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Links: #GNU #Linux Spreads in India, Netbooks http://techrights.org/2010/07/22/spreading-in-india/Jul 22 19:39
TechrightsBotTitle: Links: GNU/Linux Spreads in India, Netbooks | Techrights .::. Size~: 117.25 KBJul 22 19:39
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Designer Leading The Charge For Fashion Copyright... Caught Copying Someone Else's Design - http://bit.ly/d4Aj8Z rich #hypocrisy #copyrightJul 22 19:45
TechrightsBotTitle: Designer Leading The Charge For Fashion Copyright... Caught Copying Someone Else's Design | Techdirt .::. Size~: 21.71 KBJul 22 19:45
*WireWulf is now known as Wulf-is-not-hereJul 22 19:47
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Michael Tilson Thomas' Mahler Cycle Is Now On Spotify - http://bit.ly/adDceh more Mahler #spotify #mahlerJul 22 19:48
TechrightsBotTitle: Spotify Classical Playlists: Michael Tilson Thomas' Mahler Cycle Is Now On Spotify .::. Size~: 74.55 KBJul 22 19:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Ex-Palm VP Says It's A Two-Horse Race Between Android And iPhone - http://bit.ly/dBupoE everyone's saying it... #android #iphone #palmJul 22 19:50
TechrightsBotTitle: Ex-Palm VP Says Its A Two-Horse Race Between Android And iPhone| paidContent .::. Size~: 25.91 KBJul 22 19:50
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Russia to Create Linux-Based National Operating System - http://bit.ly/9uKRpO mixed signals from Moscow: MS also going into schools #ruJul 22 19:51
TechrightsBotTitle: Quintura blog  » Blog Archive   » Russia to Create Linux-Based National Operating System .::. Size~: 20.74 KBJul 22 19:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] I've favourited a YouTube video -- Know Your Meme: One Take http://youtu.be/fApXQ0efyo0?aJul 22 19:52
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Know Your Meme: One Take .::. Size~: 116.87 KBJul 22 19:52
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] publisher hits schoolgirl with £1,300 bill for using Chaplin song in charity video - http://bit.ly/bQxz5k dying children don't need moneyJul 22 19:57
TechrightsBotTitle: U.S. publisher hits schoolgirl, 10, with £1,300 bill for using Chaplin song in her charity video  | Mail Online .::. Size~: 65.86 KBJul 22 19:57
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @mkapor: If the FTC is proposing a "hot news doctrine" to protect dead tree media, it's a stupid idea http://nyti.ms/bKNyluJul 22 19:58
TechrightsBotTitle: Google Tells FTC Enforcing “Hot News” Would Create a Hot Mess - NYTimes.com .::. Size~: 63.58 KBJul 22 19:58
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @sjvn: Android may have the phones, but MeeGo may get the cars http://bit.ly/cEfh8k MeeGo has a big embedded Linux 'smart' car deal.Jul 22 19:59
TechrightsBotTitle: Android may have the phones, but MeeGo may get the cars - Computerworld Blogs .::. Size~: 9.13 KBJul 22 19:59
squarepegunbelievable that a schoolgirl got a such a huge fine for the song in her charity videoJul 22 19:59
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Links: PC-BSD 8.1 and #Lightspark 0.4.2 Released, Other Free Software/Open Source News http://ur1.ca/0tflp #bsdJul 22 20:06
TechrightsBotTitle: Links: PC-BSD 8.1 and Lightspark 0.4.2 Released, Other Free Software/Open Source News | Techrights .::. Size~: 98.79 KBJul 22 20:06
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[nsisodiya] Posterous Tip - Image as Inline http://blog.posterous.com/posterous-tip-post-multiple-images-inline-witJul 22 20:07
TechrightsBotTitle: Posterous tip: Post multiple images inline, without a gallery, by putting ((nogallery)) in the subject line of your email - The Official Posterous Posterous .::. Size~: 135.42 KBJul 22 20:07
MinceRand the previous tip is the preposterous tip?Jul 22 20:08
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Wikimedia blog: Nazi Goatse, part 94. http://davidgerard.co.uk/notes/2010/07/22/nazi-goatse-part-94/Jul 22 20:09
TechrightsBotTitle: Nazi Goatse, part 94. «  David Gerard .::. Size~: 16.76 KBJul 22 20:09
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Software Defects in Cardiac Medical Devices are a Life-or-Death Issue, says SFLC report - http://bit.ly/9I1tB6 *real* Blue Screens of DeathJul 22 20:13
TechrightsBotTitle: Software Defects in Cardiac Medical Devices are a Life-or-Death Issue, says SFLC's new report.  - Software Freedom Law Center .::. Size~: 7.18 KBJul 22 20:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Links: #NetNeutrality and Digital Economy Act Under Fire http://techrights.org/2010/07/22/deact-under-fire/ #deactJul 22 20:14
TechrightsBotTitle: Links: Net Neutrality and Digital Economy Act Under Fire | Techrights .::. Size~: 100.19 KBJul 22 20:14
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kcWRu2XC_A&feature=channelJul 22 20:18
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- O RLY? Know Your Meme .::. Size~: 122.96 KBJul 22 20:19
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Turkish Citizens Take To The Streets Over Internet Freedoms - http://bit.ly/dgGZK8 perhaps we should do the same in the UK #DEAct #trJul 22 20:19
TechrightsBotTitle: Turkish Citizens Take To The Streets Over Internet Freedoms | OpenNet Initiative .::. Size~: 18.24 KBJul 22 20:19
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MinceRWhy the Mythbusters won't do RFID (last hope Adam Savage) >> (flash) (video) (audio) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X034R3yzDhw&feature=relatedJul 22 20:25
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Why the Mythbusters won't do RFID (last hope Adam Savage) .::. Size~: 102.83 KBJul 22 20:25
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[nsisodiya] Training of Kids in OLPC Classroom at Kikarwali http://post.ly/oKrWJul 22 20:26
TechrightsBotTitle:   Posterous - 404 - The page you requested could not be found .::. Size~: 5.32 KBJul 22 20:26
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Digitisation and its discontents - http://bit.ly/9wqioH holding books back from e-readers “is not the best strategy for combating piracy”Jul 22 20:36
TechrightsBotTitle: Media's analogue holdouts: Digitisation and its discontents | The Economist .::. Size~: 44.89 KBJul 22 20:36
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Help build a history of #OCW - http://bit.ly/d761M1 "we’d like to build is a comprehensive timeline of OCW-related events" via wiki or emailJul 22 20:44
TechrightsBotTitle: Help build a history of OCW «  OpenFiction [Blog] .::. Size~: 17.96 KBJul 22 20:44
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] #Peppermint has risen up the distrowatch charts again! Its now at 51! #linux #foss #linuxJul 22 20:57
MinceRhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-10723274?a=1Jul 22 20:58
TechrightsBotTitle: BBC News - G20: No charges over Ian Tomlinson demo death .::. Size~: 61.46 KBJul 22 20:58
MinceRpolice stateJul 22 21:00
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[jwildeboer] RT @glynmoody publisher hits schoolgirl with £1,300 bill for using Chaplin song in charity video - http://bit.ly/bQxz5k |#IPterrorismJul 22 21:07
TechrightsBotTitle: U.S. publisher hits schoolgirl, 10, with £1,300 bill for using Chaplin song in her charity video  | Mail Online .::. Size~: 65.61 KBJul 22 21:07
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #ASUS Dumps #Vista7 , Goes With #Linux Instead (and Windows Has Other New Problems) http://ur1.ca/0tg6tJul 22 21:14
TechrightsBotTitle: ASUS Dumps Vista 7, Goes With Linux Instead (and Windows Has Other New Problems) | Techrights .::. Size~: 96.64 KBJul 22 21:14
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Amanda Palmer Sells $15,000 Worth Of Music & Merch In Three Minutes - http://bit.ly/aCY8aw more data points #scarcityJul 22 21:42
TechrightsBotTitle: Amanda Palmer Sells $15,000 Worth Of Music & Merch In Three Minutes | Techdirt .::. Size~: 26.95 KBJul 22 21:42
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Could the EU Walk Away From ACTA? - http://bit.ly/9ILVG8 probably too much to hope for #acta #euJul 22 21:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Blackboard and TSC Block #GNU #Linux in Education http://ur1.ca/0tgd9 #nigeria #lockin #firefoxJul 22 21:49
TechrightsBotTitle: Blackboard and TSC Block GNU/Linux in Education | Techrights .::. Size~: 90.82 KBJul 22 21:49
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Steve Ballmer at Risk of Being Thrown Out, Bill Gates Still Makes the News Due to Fraud http://ur1.ca/0tgfu #microsoftJul 22 21:58
TechrightsBotTitle: Steve Ballmer at Risk of Being Thrown Out, Bill Gates Still Makes the News Due to Fraud | Techrights .::. Size~: 91.82 KBJul 22 21:58
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @glynmoody: Turkish Citizens Take To The Streets Over Internet Freedoms - http://bit.ly/dgGZK8 maybe we shd do same in UKJul 22 22:03
TechrightsBotTitle: Turkish Citizens Take To The Streets Over Internet Freedoms | OpenNet Initiative .::. Size~: 18.24 KBJul 22 22:03
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] RT @glynmoody: Ex-Palm VP Says It's A Two-Horse Race Between Android And iPhone - http://bit.ly/dBupoE everyone's saying it.Jul 22 22:08
TechrightsBotTitle: Ex-Palm VP Says Its A Two-Horse Race Between Android And iPhone| paidContent .::. Size~: 25.79 KBJul 22 22:08
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[einfeldt] Microsoft not really a contender in race for market share for smartphones according to former Palm VP http://bit.ly/dBupoEJul 22 22:11
TechrightsBotTitle: Ex-Palm VP Says Its A Two-Horse Race Between Android And iPhone| paidContent .::. Size~: 25.79 KBJul 22 22:11
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Windows 7 and Office 2010 Drive Microsoft to Record Revenues - http://bit.ly/bSNDuK it's clearly doomed... #microsoftJul 22 22:13
TechrightsBotTitle: Windows 7 and Office 2010 Drive Microsoft to Record Revenues .::. Size~: 76.41 KBJul 22 22:13
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[glynmoody] Release Early, Release Often - http://bit.ly/a9XmSh wonder where the Chrome team got that from? #chrome #browsersJul 22 22:17
TechrightsBotTitle: Chromium Blog: Release Early, Release Often .::. Size~: 24.37 KBJul 22 22:17
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #OpenSUSE 11.3 Users Sensitive to #Microsoft Lawsuit Due to #Banshee Bundling http://ur1.ca/0tgl4 #novell #suseJul 22 22:19
TechrightsBotTitle: OpenSUSE 11.3 Users Sensitive to Microsoft Lawsuit Due to Banshee Bundling | Techrights .::. Size~: 91.4 KBJul 22 22:19
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @mkapor: If the FTC is proposing a "hot news doctrine" to protect dead tree media, it's a stupid idea http://nyti.ms/bKNyluJul 22 22:25
TechrightsBotTitle: Google Tells FTC Enforcing “Hot News” Would Create a Hot Mess - NYTimes.com .::. Size~: 63.65 KBJul 22 22:25
schestowitz[21:00] <MinceR> police stateJul 22 22:30
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] I've favourited a YouTube video -- Why the Mythbusters won't do RFID (last hope Adam Sa... http://youtu.be/X034R3yzDhw?aJul 22 22:30
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Why the Mythbusters won't do RFID (last hope Adam Savage) .::. Size~: 102.41 KBJul 22 22:30
schestowitzActually, the cops I saw in London were quite niceJul 22 22:30
schestowitzOne of them gave me instructions evenJul 22 22:30
MinceRthey weren't quite nice to that man, thoughJul 22 22:30
schestowitzHe looked 'funny'Jul 22 22:30
MinceRthey killed him and then the state covered up for itJul 22 22:30
schestowitzSo they helped him walk fasterJul 22 22:30
schestowitz"oops!"Jul 22 22:30
MinceRperhaps they should be helped to walk faster tooJul 22 22:31
MinceR"boom!"Jul 22 22:31
schestowitzHe could be another 7/7Jul 22 22:31
MinceRsome people seem to believe that a uniform gives them the right to do anything they feel likeJul 22 22:31
schestowitzRemember when they shot a Brazilian tourist?Jul 22 22:31
schestowitzThey thought he was a tourristJul 22 22:31
MinceRi don't remember itJul 22 22:31
MinceRthere's so much of news like that going aroundJul 22 22:32
MinceRlike in canada recentlyJul 22 22:32
MinceRof course there was police brutality here in absurdistanJul 22 22:32
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z3AG-V83TFUJul 22 22:32
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- UK #03 - News : top Police chief forced to quit - 03.10.2008 .::. Size~: 87.11 KBJul 22 22:32
MinceRwhen the shit our two biggest parties did resulted in riotsJul 22 22:33
schestowitzWith context: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xG9GqL1aeFYJul 22 22:33
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Police shooting unlawful .::. Size~: 102.58 KBJul 22 22:33
MinceRand the police suddenly decided that this means that anyone who dares exist on public space is now a criminal and must be beaten up and taken inJul 22 22:33
MinceRregardless of what they're doingJul 22 22:33
MinceRetc.Jul 22 22:33
MinceRwell, i guess it's going to get worseJul 22 22:33
MinceRif there's one thing those two big gangs agree on it's that we don't deserve libertyJul 22 22:34
ender2070http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/37227/20100721/utargeting-china-in-new-anti-piracy-drive.htmJul 22 22:35
TechrightsBotTitle: U.S. targeting China in new anti-piracy drive - International Business Times .::. Size~: 53.28 KBJul 22 22:35
ender2070i wonder if this is why China downgraded USA to AA instead of AAAJul 22 22:35
schestowitzUS law >> China lawJul 22 22:38
schestowitzUntil China throws a nuke somewhere on some tropical islandJul 22 22:39
schestowitzTsar bombaJul 22 22:39
MinceRthe Tsar bomba wasn't a nuke, was it?Jul 22 22:39
*DaemonFC (~ryan@ppp-69-215-51-100.dsl.sbndin.ameritech.net) has joined #boycottnovellJul 22 22:49
DaemonFChttp://www.angrywhiteboy.org/index.php/2010/07/19/food-bank-mistakenly-gives-out-dog-food-to-seniors-leaving-them-outraged-but-alert-and-frisky/Jul 22 22:49
TechrightsBotTitle: ~ Angry White Boy ~ » Food bank mistakenly gives out dog food to seniors, leaving them outraged but alert and frisky .::. Size~: 51.49 KBJul 22 22:49
DaemonFChttp://www.upi.com/Odd_News/2010/07/18/Food-bank-mistakenly-gives-out-dog-food/UPI-68411279478355/Jul 22 22:50
TechrightsBotTitle: Food bank mistakenly gives out dog food - UPI.com .::. Size~: 60.05 KBJul 22 22:50
DaemonFCschestowitz: Senior Superfood!Jul 22 22:51
schestowitzDaemonFC: it wasn't?Jul 22 22:54
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] I've finally sorted out my photos from London (last week) http://schestowitz.com/Weblog/archives/2010/07/22/london-photos/Jul 22 22:54
TechrightsBotTitle: schestowitz.com  » Blog Archive   » Some London Photos (July 2010) .::. Size~: 30.78 KBJul 22 22:54
schestowitzI think it was the biggest ever unleashesJul 22 22:54
schestowitzSo big that the plane that dropped it almost fell down after the explosionJul 22 22:54
DaemonFChttp://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2010/07/22/Obama-to-sign-bill-to-trim-federal-waste/UPI-42081279798011/Jul 22 23:01
TechrightsBotTitle: Obama signs bill to trim federal waste - UPI.com .::. Size~: 63.94 KBJul 22 23:01
DaemonFC"The federal government wasted $110 billion in fiscal 2009 by sending out fraudulent Medicare and Medicaid payments, overpaying contractors and sending benefit checks to dead people, The Washington Post reported."Jul 22 23:01
DaemonFCThey probably wasted 10 times that much on overpayments to the drug companiesJul 22 23:02
schestowitzMinceR: http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/10/07/17/037259/Motorola-Says-eFuse-Doesnt-Permanently-Brick-PhonesJul 22 23:03
TechrightsBotTitle: Slashdot Hardware Story | Motorola Says eFuse Doesn't Permanently Brick Phones .::. Size~: 163.15 KBJul 22 23:03
MinceRit still does a lot more than it should (which is nothing)Jul 22 23:03
schestowitzDaemonFC paints hard to pay medicare mogulsJul 22 23:04
MinceRif i buy a device, it's mine, therefore i should decide what code runs on itJul 22 23:04
MinceRso fuck motorola and the horse they rode in onJul 22 23:04
schestowitzHeheJul 22 23:04
schestowitzWhat's left for Android?Jul 22 23:04
schestowitzSony Ericcson?Jul 22 23:04
schestowitzWith DRM madness?Jul 22 23:04
DaemonFCschestowitz: You mean the doctors who are treating Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck for thyroid cancerJul 22 23:05
schestowitzMaybe Acer phonesJul 22 23:05
DaemonFCand buying Ferraris with their Medicare payments?Jul 22 23:05
DaemonFC:PJul 22 23:05
MinceRi don't care about android until they turn it into a truly open platformJul 22 23:05
schestowitzIt's mostly shareholdersJul 22 23:05
MinceRright now it's even scarier than symbianJul 22 23:05
schestowitzI don't think 'health' execs become billionairesJul 22 23:05
MinceRand that's really fucked upJul 22 23:05
schestowitzAnd it uses GoogleJul 22 23:05
schestowitzAndroid.HarvestData(*);Jul 22 23:06
MinceRyes, even for PIMJul 22 23:06
MinceRso you don't get to have good PIM appsJul 22 23:06
MinceRonly "cloud" google crapJul 22 23:06
schestowitzReally?Jul 22 23:06
schestowitzDidn't know it was *that* sadJul 22 23:06
MinceRwell, they can only sync with googleJul 22 23:06
MinceRfor one thingJul 22 23:06
schestowitzI thought so-called 'apps' would do itJul 22 23:06
MinceRand as far as i could tell, their calendar is rather poor in featuresJul 22 23:06
schestowitzWebOS does this too, I thinkJul 22 23:06
MinceRwell, the 'apps' are thereJul 22 23:06
schestowitzmethinks it's like SidekickJul 22 23:07
MinceRbut how much you get to own your data is questionableJul 22 23:07
DaemonFCschestowitz: yeah, the law says for example, that if you're in jail, your Social Security payments stop until you are releasedJul 22 23:07
schestowitzwhen I saw 'apps' I cringleJul 22 23:07
MinceRof course navigation is totally "cloud"edJul 22 23:07
MinceRyou can't do it offline, afaikJul 22 23:07
schestowitzIf Apple applications are s**t I tend to think of 'apps' as crapletsJul 22 23:07
DaemonFCbut the government tends to keep sending checks to that person and other people in the house cash and spend themJul 22 23:07
MinceRKringle?Jul 22 23:07
schestowitzNoJul 22 23:07
MinceRobviously if you do navigation online they get a pretty clear realtime feed of where you are and where you're goingJul 22 23:08
schestowitzGringle if anythingJul 22 23:08
schestowitzGoogleIngeJul 22 23:08
MinceRthe GTK+ version?Jul 22 23:08
MinceR:>Jul 22 23:08
DaemonFCI've started writing checks to pay my rentJul 22 23:08
DaemonFCthe landlord had some problems with one of the women in the officeJul 22 23:08
DaemonFCembezzlingJul 22 23:08
DaemonFCso now I'm writing him checks and stamping them "Deposit Only"Jul 22 23:09
schestowitzchecks are like a permission from your mom?Jul 22 23:09
schestowitzHad problems passing money?Jul 22 23:09
DaemonFCwell, cash can end up anywhereJul 22 23:09
DaemonFCbut if anyone tries to cash a check that's not made out to them, it's a felonyJul 22 23:09
schestowitzI see...Jul 22 23:09
schestowitzFelony -> welfare jailJul 22 23:10
schestowitzNo queue to soup kitchenJul 22 23:10
schestowitzYou get served...Jul 22 23:10
DaemonFCcheck deception and fraud is a Class D Felony in IndianaJul 22 23:10
schestowitzIn your 'room'.... when you're done playing console games (they get them here in the UK)Jul 22 23:10
DaemonFCwith not less than 1 year in state prisonJul 22 23:10
DaemonFC:PJul 22 23:10
schestowitzSounds better than your lifeJul 22 23:11
schestowitzNo loonies banging on your doorsJul 22 23:11
schestowitzI reckon Microsoft hires some Turfers who are in jail :-pJul 22 23:11
DaemonFCyeah maybeJul 22 23:11
schestowitzRude people, already in jail, nothing to loseJul 22 23:11
cubezzz3really? That low?Jul 22 23:12
schestowitzhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/10646540Jul 22 23:12
TechrightsBotTitle: BBC - Newsbeat - US army heat-ray gun in Afghanistan .::. Size~: 33.76 KBJul 22 23:12
schestowitzDaemonFC's dad made it/!!Jul 22 23:12
DaemonFCRaytheon?Jul 22 23:12
DaemonFC"They often scream but the US military says the chance of injury from the system is 0.1%"Jul 22 23:13
DaemonFCit usually works, but there's a 0.1% chance your head will explodeJul 22 23:13
DaemonFCacceptable risksJul 22 23:13
MinceRyayJul 22 23:13
MinceRwhat's the chance that your eye boils away?Jul 22 23:13
cubezzz3scanners part two!Jul 22 23:13
MinceRwhat's the chance that your junk boils away?Jul 22 23:13
cubezzz3or whatever :)Jul 22 23:14
DaemonFCMinceR: I'm sure that only hurts the first timeJul 22 23:14
DaemonFC:DJul 22 23:14
MinceRtypical Yankeestani bullshitJul 22 23:14
MinceRthey make up novel ways to injure and torture peopleJul 22 23:14
MinceRand go all innocent about itJul 22 23:14
DaemonFChmmmJul 22 23:15
DaemonFCI wonder how much those things costJul 22 23:15
DaemonFCthey have a 1600 foot rangeJul 22 23:15
DaemonFCmaybe I can surround my house with themJul 22 23:15
MinceRi need an islandJul 22 23:15
MinceRand to surround it with coilgunsJul 22 23:15
DaemonFCrailguns?Jul 22 23:16
schestowitzhttp://thehill.com/blogs/hillicon-valley/technology/109453-wsjs-mossberg-wants-a-broadband-plan-with-teethJul 22 23:16
TechrightsBotTitle: WSJ's Mossberg wants a broadband plan with teeth - The Hill's Hillicon Valley .::. Size~: 74.26 KBJul 22 23:16
MinceRi prefer coilgunsJul 22 23:16
MinceRno need for galvanic contact :)Jul 22 23:16
schestowitzWho gives a goat about this goat?Jul 22 23:16
MinceRalso, afaik there's no real restriction about the shape of bulletsJul 22 23:16
MinceRany chunk of metal of the right size goes :>Jul 22 23:16
MinceRwell, at least metal of the right EM propertiesJul 22 23:16
schestowitzwhere would you weld metal?Jul 22 23:17
MinceRapparently it needs to be ferromagneticJul 22 23:17
schestowitzYou need a volcanic islandJul 22 23:17
MinceR:)Jul 22 23:17
MinceRor recycle scraps from attackersJul 22 23:17
DaemonFCMinceR has iron balls apparentlyJul 22 23:17
MinceRlike in TA ;)Jul 22 23:17
schestowitzhttp://schestowitz.com/Weblog/archives/2010/07/12/retrovision-theater/Jul 22 23:17
DaemonFCwho knew?Jul 22 23:17
TechrightsBotTitle: schestowitz.com  » Blog Archive   » Internet Archive .::. Size~: 31.22 KBJul 22 23:17
DaemonFChow many?Jul 22 23:17
MinceR"I've got balls of steel."Jul 22 23:17
schestowitzNice idea, eh?Jul 22 23:18
schestowitzShooting your own package at enemies?Jul 22 23:18
schestowitzIn MINCERLAND, balls shoot YOUJul 22 23:18
cubezzz3lolJul 22 23:18
schestowitzIt's like those crazy real stories where guys throw their penis at police/wifeJul 22 23:19
schestowitzIt's a hard readJul 22 23:19
DaemonFCI might save that for lastJul 22 23:19
DaemonFC:PJul 22 23:19
MinceRhttp://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_weapons_that_shoot_other_weapons_that_don%27t_exist%2C_but_shouldJul 22 23:19
TechrightsBotTitle: List of weapons that shoot other weapons that don't exist, but should - Uncyclopedia, the content-free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 79.96 KBJul 22 23:19
schestowitzIIRC, the latter happened in Ethiopia, the former in the USJul 22 23:20
schestowitzSome guy throwing it at cops out the windowsJul 22 23:20
schestowitzMaybe he thought it was Windows VistaJul 22 23:20
schestowitzWrong package (Starter)Jul 22 23:20
DaemonFChttp://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_weapons_that_shoot_other_weapons_that_don't_exist,_but_should#Gun_That_Shoots_Exploding_Swiss_Army_KnivesJul 22 23:20
TechrightsBotTitle: List of weapons that shoot other weapons that don't exist, but should - Uncyclopedia, the content-free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 79.96 KBJul 22 23:20
DaemonFCdeath by corkscrew?Jul 22 23:21
MinceR:)Jul 22 23:21
MinceRrailguns do have the advantage of the bullet only needing to be conductiveJul 22 23:21
MinceRnot ferromagneticJul 22 23:22
DaemonFChmmmJul 22 23:22
DaemonFClots of things are conductiveJul 22 23:22
MinceRindeedJul 22 23:22
*DaemonFC loads MinceR into a railgunJul 22 23:22
DaemonFC:DJul 22 23:23
MinceRbut less of them can reliably connect to the rails all the way through firingJul 22 23:23
DaemonFChmmmJul 22 23:23
DaemonFCshould I wrap you in aluminum foil first?Jul 22 23:23
DaemonFCuggghJul 22 23:23
DaemonFCheat wave!Jul 22 23:24
DaemonFCit's going to get to 100 tomorrowJul 22 23:24
DaemonFCI better get out there early and mow the lawn while it's "only" hot as hellJul 22 23:24
schestowitzWhoa! http://www.informationweek.com/news/infrastructure/management/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=225900165Jul 22 23:24
TechrightsBotTitle: Nokia Siemens To Buy Motorola Unit For $1.2B -- Motorola -- InformationWeek .::. Size~: 78.58 KBJul 22 23:24
schestowitzI missed this oneJul 22 23:24
DaemonFCit actually hasn't grown that muchJul 22 23:25
*MinceR fires a burst of steel scraps at DaemonFC from a coilgunJul 22 23:25
DaemonFCI could probably jsut tell the landlord I mowed itJul 22 23:25
schestowitz/me checks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CoilgunJul 22 23:25
TechrightsBotTitle: Coilgun - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 40.48 KBJul 22 23:25
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] BBC News - BP accused of 'buying academic silence' http://tinyurl.com/2etyx7tJul 22 23:26
TechrightsBotTitle: BBC News - BP accused of 'buying academic silence' .::. Size~: 51.89 KBJul 22 23:26
schestowitzMinceR is mostly metalJul 22 23:26
schestowitzJust toss some MinceR at the coilgunJul 22 23:26
schestowitzhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MincerJul 22 23:26
TechrightsBotTitle: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.0 403 Forbidden .::. Size~: 0 KBJul 22 23:26
MinceR\m/Jul 22 23:26
schestowitztwo heads?Jul 22 23:27
*MinceR is metalJul 22 23:27
schestowitzMaybe husband and wife in wedding ->  \m/Jul 22 23:27
schestowitzThey wave to the crowdJul 22 23:27
*Judas_PhD (~kevin@misterfluffy.dsl.xmission.com) has joined #boycottnovellJul 22 23:27
MinceRhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%5Cm/Jul 22 23:27
TechrightsBotTitle: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.0 403 Forbidden .::. Size~: 0 KBJul 22 23:27
schestowitzIt can also be interpreted as a sexual positionJul 22 23:28
MinceRhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%5Cm/#Heavy_metal_subcultureJul 22 23:28
TechrightsBotTitle: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.0 403 Forbidden .::. Size~: 0 KBJul 22 23:28
schestowitz[View from above]Jul 22 23:28
schestowitzOhJul 22 23:28
schestowitzI thought  \0/Jul 22 23:28
schestowitz\0/Jul 22 23:29
schestowitz88Jul 22 23:29
schestowitz /\Jul 22 23:29
schestowitz[Man in coilgun]Jul 22 23:29
MinceRpeople don't seem to make decent bullets for EM-based gunsJul 22 23:29
schestowitzOr woman withbn 'guns'Jul 22 23:29
MinceRthey're better fit for firearmsJul 22 23:30
schestowitzWhat is?Jul 22 23:30
MinceRpeopleJul 22 23:30
schestowitzYesJul 22 23:30
MinceRthey aren't rigid enough for railguns (unless you put them in a sabot)Jul 22 23:30
MinceRand they aren't ferromagneticJul 22 23:30
schestowitzToday I asked an ex-soldier about his gunJul 22 23:30
schestowitzThe one they gave himJul 22 23:30
schestowitzAnd how it was used to 'defend'Jul 22 23:30
MinceRyou know what the best defense isJul 22 23:30
schestowitzThey use British guns hereJul 22 23:31
schestowitzEven though they are crapJul 22 23:31
schestowitz /. advertises MSFT again. http://games.slashdot.org/story/10/07/20/0640244/Anatomy-of-an-AchievementJul 22 23:32
TechrightsBotTitle: Slashdot Games Story | Anatomy of an Achievement .::. Size~: 147.25 KBJul 22 23:32
schestowitzCha-chingJul 22 23:32
schestowitzhttp://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=laser-downs-uavsJul 22 23:33
TechrightsBotTitle: U.S. Navy Laser Weapon Shoots Down Drones in Test [Video]: Scientific American .::. Size~: 98.89 KBJul 22 23:33
schestowitzDaemonFC: was your pops in Raytheon or Lockheed?Jul 22 23:33
schestowitzLoose canon that manJul 22 23:34
schestowitzcannonJul 22 23:34
DaemonFChe's worked for a lot of placesJul 22 23:36
DaemonFCmainly Thomson, Raytheon, and CaterpillerJul 22 23:36
schestowitzlar?Jul 22 23:37
DaemonFChe's taken short term contracts in betweenJul 22 23:37
schestowitzGoogle wants to call meJul 22 23:37
schestowitzI won't go for it though, they pay for it thoughJul 22 23:37
schestowitzI can at least speak to nice people :-)Jul 22 23:38
DaemonFCschestowitz: The problem is that he makes great money while he's working on one of those types of contractsJul 22 23:38
schestowitzSome years ago they phoned me when I was asleepJul 22 23:38
DaemonFCbut then they lay him off and he has to take what is for him kind of a crappy job for a whileJul 22 23:38
schestowitzI answered them and asked them to leave me alone for a whileJul 22 23:38
DaemonFCjustso there's no lapse in his health insuranceJul 22 23:38
cubezzz3schestowitz, what do they want you to do?Jul 22 23:38
DaemonFCcause then the next insurer could turn him and my step mom downJul 22 23:38
schestowitzcubezzz3: not evilJul 22 23:39
schestowitz:-pJul 22 23:39
schestowitzQ: What does GOogle not do? not evil.Jul 22 23:39
DaemonFCschestowitz: Health insurance companies use lapses as an excuse to crank up your premiumsJul 22 23:39
schestowitzQ: What does GOogle do? Well...Jul 22 23:39
schestowitzThey link to other people's content/sitesJul 22 23:39
DaemonFCand deny everything you try to claim as pre-existingJul 22 23:39
schestowitzDaemonFC: he should work in ChinaJul 22 23:40
DaemonFCit's a pain in the ass to get new insurance if you've had any lapsesJul 22 23:40
schestowitzThe Land of Opportunity 2.0Jul 22 23:40
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] Nice article: http://ur1.ca/0tg6t Yet I wonder how long it will take ASUS to drink Microsoft deadly cool aid again :-(Jul 22 23:40
TechrightsBotTitle: ASUS Dumps Vista 7, Goes With Linux Instead (and Windows Has Other New Problems) | Techrights .::. Size~: 96.64 KBJul 22 23:40
DaemonFCyeah, China isn't going anywhereJul 22 23:41
DaemonFCit'll burn itself out when there's no longer cheap infinitely exploitable laborJul 22 23:41
DaemonFCthings will pack up and go somewhere elseJul 22 23:41
MinceRwhat google does is not evil; and oceania has always been at war with eastasia.Jul 22 23:41
DaemonFCthey're always winning tooJul 22 23:41
DaemonFCor so I hearJul 22 23:41
schestowitzIngSucksJul 22 23:42
schestowitzI can't think of a word that combined Apple with ScientologyJul 22 23:42
DaemonFCApple and Scientology share a marketing departmentJul 22 23:43
DaemonFCI believeJul 22 23:43
schestowitzhttp://it.slashdot.org/story/10/07/21/1221209/Is-Open-Source-SNORT-DeadJul 22 23:43
TechrightsBotTitle: Slashdot IT Story | Is Open Source SNORT Dead? .::. Size~: 149.22 KBJul 22 23:43
schestowitzDaemonFC: don't insult ScientologyJul 22 23:43
DaemonFCthe Xenuism Cult?Jul 22 23:43
schestowitzAFAIK, Scientology doesn't send a private army to raid people's homes if they are opposed to their ruleJul 22 23:43
schestowitzAlso, today I read this comment...Jul 22 23:44
DaemonFCno, they hire hitmenJul 22 23:44
DaemonFCit looks like you slipped in the showerJul 22 23:44
DaemonFCor fell down some stairsJul 22 23:44
schestowitzSomething about Scientology making more sense than most religionsJul 22 23:44
schestowitzWhichI agree withJul 22 23:44
schestowitzit's more modernised (and corrupt)Jul 22 23:44
MinceRno, Xenu is their enemyJul 22 23:44
MinceRHail Xenu!Jul 22 23:44
schestowitzTell me when Scientologists behead people they don't likeJul 22 23:44
schestowitzOr nailing them to woodJul 22 23:45
schestowitzOr cutting off part of their babies' penisJul 22 23:45
schestowitzImagine the public reaction if Scientology folks did thatJul 22 23:45
schestowitzThere would be public FURYJul 22 23:45
schestowitzBut you can't do it against Big CultsJul 22 23:46
schestowitzThe biggest have like a billion people eachJul 22 23:46
schestowitzThe smaller ones control the media and label anyone who opposes a "Nazi" or somethingJul 22 23:46
cubezzz3Microsoft is the worst of the cultsJul 22 23:47
schestowitzScientology is a pesky itchJul 22 23:47
schestowitzIt's a small problem, it's peanutsJul 22 23:47
schestowitzBut it's easy to target the small onesJul 22 23:47
MinceRit will get bigger if it's not curedJul 22 23:47
schestowitzFor example:Jul 22 23:47
schestowitzTHe label "Novell hater" hardly existedJul 22 23:47
schestowitzIt existed only after "Boycott Novell" AFAIKJul 22 23:47
MinceRgnJul 22 23:47
cubezzz3later :)Jul 22 23:48
schestowitzhttp://it.slashdot.org/story/10/07/21/1354206/Dell-Ships-Infected-Motherboards lol failJul 22 23:48
TechrightsBotTitle: Slashdot IT Story | Dell Ships Infected Motherboards .::. Size~: 154.71 KBJul 22 23:48
schestowitzWin-onlyJul 22 23:49
cubezzz3if you want to talk mind control...Jul 22 23:49
schestowitzhttp://www.newscientist.com/blogs/shortsharpscience/2010/07/pc-giant-warns-of-hardware-tro.htmlJul 22 23:49
TechrightsBotTitle: Short Sharp Science: PC giant warns of hardware trojan .::. Size~: 77.61 KBJul 22 23:49
schestowitzwin32.somethingJul 22 23:49
cubezzz3look at the goverment and schoolsJul 22 23:49
schestowitzYeahJul 22 23:49
cubezzz3Microsoft is in there like flintJul 22 23:49
schestowitzSchools are strategic to themJul 22 23:49
schestowitzIt's supposed to indoctrinateJul 22 23:49
sebsebsebyep get people vender locked in when youngJul 22 23:49
sebsebsebmake them rely on their rubbish softwareJul 22 23:49
sebsebseband continue to make money for loads and loads of years, and a lot of itJul 22 23:49
schestowitz"Prepare" for college or 'real world' (=commerce)Jul 22 23:50
schestowitzThey instill prideJul 22 23:50
schestowitzAnd self-cnfidenceJul 22 23:50
schestowitzRevisionist historyJul 22 23:50
schestowitzNot in Asia thoughJul 22 23:50
cubezzz3right, in fact the thought is one can't even get a job without learning Microsoft productsJul 22 23:50
cubezzz3I'm sure you heard that one many timesJul 22 23:50
schestowitzThat's where many youngsters commit suicide due to low self esteemJul 22 23:50
sebsebsebcubezzz3: depends on the job, but yeahJul 22 23:50
sebsebsebmost jobs will be using silly WindowsJul 22 23:50
schestowitzAmericans are taught to think they are the rulers of EarthJul 22 23:50
sebsebsebbusiness I meanJul 22 23:50
sebsebsebschestowitz: hehJul 22 23:50
sebsebsebschestowitz: I guessJul 22 23:50
schestowitzSo they don't work hard at school to improveJul 22 23:50
schestowitzAnd the science skills there suffer. Asians work to excel (straight As), others work just to passJul 22 23:51
cubezzz3what is gd.h part of?Jul 22 23:51
cubezzz3is that gnome?Jul 22 23:51
schestowitzContext?Jul 22 23:51
schestowitzI don't know gnome source by filenamesJul 22 23:52
cubezzz3the marks don't matterJul 22 23:52
cubezzz3it's actually learning that matters :)Jul 22 23:52
cubezzz3otherwise you have no insight, no understanding Jul 22 23:52
cubezzz3just memorizingJul 22 23:53
schestowitzhttp://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/eso-massive-stars-discovered-100721.htmlJul 22 23:53
TechrightsBotTitle: SPACE.com -- Heftiest Star Discovery Shatters Cosmic Record .::. Size~: 63.11 KBJul 22 23:53
schestowitzWeirdJul 22 23:53
schestowitzI thought we had far bigger onesJul 22 23:54
cubezzz3not bigger, heavier Jul 22 23:54
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsgKp_Vf6wIJul 22 23:54
TechrightsBotTitle: YouTube- Largest known planet - biggest star ever seen .::. Size~: 94.12 KBJul 22 23:54
cubezzz3Canis Majoris is still the biggest by volumeJul 22 23:54
schestowitzcubezzz3: I see...Jul 22 23:54
cubezzz3forget this, I'll rewrite itJul 22 23:55
cubezzz3there's nothing good for 640x480 on X hardlyJul 22 23:55
cubezzz3no one even wants to talk about XlibJul 22 23:55
schestowitzhttp://yro.slashdot.org/story/10/07/21/1831226/Obama-Wont-Intervene-Over-British-Hacker-McKinnonJul 22 23:55
TechrightsBotTitle: Slashdot Your Rights Online Story | Obama Won't Intervene Over British Hacker McKinnon .::. Size~: 170.3 KBJul 22 23:56
cubezzz3the new star just discovered is a monster blue starJul 22 23:56
schestowitzBama gets involves when MAFIAA needs help (ACTA for example)Jul 22 23:56
cubezzz3burning hydrogen like crazyJul 22 23:56
schestowitzcubezzz3: naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaJul 22 23:56
schestowitzWe're the biggest planetJul 22 23:57
schestowitzCentre of the universe :-)Jul 22 23:57
cubezzz3with the biggest OS? :)Jul 22 23:57
schestowitzAnd the stars were created to help us walk in the darkJul 22 23:57
schestowitzLittle lamps from heavens :-)Jul 22 23:57
schestowitzcubezzz3: most bloated OSJul 22 23:57
schestowitzNot biggestJul 22 23:58
schestowitzJust heaviest :-)Jul 22 23:58
cubezzz3very good :)Jul 22 23:58
schestowitzYou don't wanna see its kernel :-)Jul 22 23:58
schestowitzIt has criminal elements in it... and then it turns into a dwarfJul 22 23:59
cubezzz3we hopeJul 22 23:59
schestowitzOtherwise it turns into a black holeJul 22 23:59
schestowitzAnd it sucks in all its competitorsJul 22 23:59
*ThistleWeb (~gordon@unaffiliated/thistleweb) has joined #boycottnovellJul 22 23:59
schestowitzIf it can't survice, it'll sink everyone else with itJul 22 23:59
schestowitz*viveJul 22 23:59

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