Join us now at the IRC channel.
| msb_ | cubexyz: Can you get a more precise description of the files? "windows 10 wiped out files on his computer" | Dec 13 02:59 |
|---|---|---|
| msb_ | cubexyz: Could these have been copyrighted files that Microsoft, serving its partner corporations against the interests of its paying customer, decided that the customer didn't have proper "rights" to the files? | Dec 13 03:05 |
| msb_ | You will love Big Brother! | Dec 13 03:06 |
| msb_ | "One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad. "Ein Reich, Ein Volk, Ein Fuhrer" - Adolf Hitler | Dec 13 03:19 |
| cubexyz | it sounded like the entire operating system was munged | Dec 13 03:20 |
| cubexyz | I have to talk to him more | Dec 13 03:20 |
| cubexyz | it's like any closed source situation... | Dec 13 03:21 |
| cubexyz | you don't really have much info on what's happening | Dec 13 03:21 |
| cubexyz | it could be that windows 10 shunts your data into another directory | Dec 13 03:23 |
| cubexyz | I can imagine lots of scenarios where things get messed up | Dec 13 03:23 |
| cubexyz | what if you don't have enough drive space for the windows 10 upgrade? | Dec 13 03:24 |
| cubexyz | I showed him the NSA Ant Catalog and told him about OpenBSD and other FOSS operating systems | Dec 13 03:25 |
| msb_ | If it turns out that MS is deleting people's files, this could be extremely important news. Even windows users like their files! | Dec 13 03:35 |
| msb_ | At least the ones that know what files are. | Dec 13 03:41 |
| cubexyz | this guy is actually pretty smart | Dec 13 03:41 |
| cubexyz | just not so great in the software department | Dec 13 03:41 |
| cubexyz | to him software is something you order | Dec 13 03:42 |
| cubexyz | it's the automatic windows 10 upgrades that are causing problems | Dec 13 03:43 |
| cubexyz | you leave your computer on and come home.... bang you got windows 10 on it | Dec 13 03:43 |
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| Freeexaminer | First of all I want to commend you for the courage to keep this blog. Few people are brave enough to oppose authority and regardless of the outcome one should take a stand whenever private or collective rights are abused by the ones in power. | Dec 13 05:25 |
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| Freeexaminer | Batistelli has hijacked the office and turned the management into a mafia organization where the "capo" is surrounded by sycophants. | Dec 13 05:27 |
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| Freeexaminer | The atmosphere is unbearable and the main topic of discussion everywhere is the abuse of the system by the president. | Dec 13 05:27 |
| Freeexaminer | I would like to send you a letter signed by French director Yann Chabod, a member of the Batistelli inner circle, as a response to a demand by a lady suffering from breast cancer. The inhumanity of the response is unbelievable. | Dec 13 05:30 |
| Freeexaminer | How could I upload it? | Dec 13 05:31 |
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| r_schestowitz | some sites still spread this BS: http://www.pe.com/articles/view-788607-phone-washington.html | Dec 13 06:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pe.com | SAN BERNARDINO SHOOTING: Terror investigators can’t view NSA phone records - Press Enterprise | Dec 13 06:23 | |
| r_schestowitz | Oh, I missed Freeexaminer? | Dec 13 06:24 |
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| r_schestowitz | http://time.com/4142893/angela-merkel-kate-mckinnon-snl/ | Dec 13 06:56 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-time.com | Best of Kate McKinnon's Angela Merkel Impression: SNL Clips | Dec 13 06:56 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/scruffy_crunch/status/676012021779849216 | Dec 13 07:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@scruffy_crunch: @schestowitz @All4Privacy It didn't end. It just got outsourced. | Dec 13 07:16 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/scruffy_crunch/status/676012591437623296 | Dec 13 07:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@scruffy_crunch: @schestowitz @All4Privacy Yes, they are. | Dec 13 07:18 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Martinned81/status/676013449034473472 | Dec 13 07:21 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Martinned81: That must be one of those Zen koans. https://t.co/mZ50LnMJXT | Dec 13 07:21 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: There is no #internet #censorship in #China , says China’s top censor https://t.co/GU88sbfWGH a #clapper moment https://t.co/JS39v3HgwK | Dec 13 07:21 | |
| MinceR | http://motherboard.vice.com/read/congresswoman-asks-feds-why-they-pressured-a-library-to-disable-its-tor-node | Dec 13 07:38 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-motherboard.vice.com | Congresswoman Asks Feds Why They Pressured a Library to Disable Its Tor Node | Motherboard | Dec 13 07:38 | |
| cubexyz | what was the answer? | Dec 13 07:44 |
| cubexyz | ok, there wasn't one | Dec 13 07:47 |
| cubexyz | and they restored it | Dec 13 07:47 |
| MinceR | they did better | Dec 13 07:47 |
| MinceR | they turned their relay into an exit node | Dec 13 07:47 |
| cubexyz | ok, I don't know what that means | Dec 13 07:49 |
| MinceR | it means that now it can not only be used as a middle point in tor connections, but also as the point from the tcp connection is opened to the final (non-Tor) destination | Dec 13 07:52 |
| MinceR | exit nodes are riskier in a regulatory sense and more scarce | Dec 13 07:52 |
| cubexyz | New Hampshire... they like their freedom so not too surprising | Dec 13 07:57 |
| cubexyz | not a very big city, only 13K pop | Dec 13 07:57 |
| cubexyz | imagine the government bullying some small town library | Dec 13 07:58 |
| cubexyz | I wonder if any libraries run Linux | Dec 13 07:59 |
| r_schestowitz | some do | Dec 13 08:06 |
| r_schestowitz | in Europe at least | Dec 13 08:06 |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/scruffy_crunch/status/676026772912078848 | Dec 13 08:12 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@scruffy_crunch: @schestowitz @All4Privacy "[DHS] investigations warning that the network can be used by criminals" So can streets, telephones and deodorant | Dec 13 08:12 | |
| cubexyz | my local library has been microsoftized | Dec 13 08:16 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Now you can read BSOD's while reading books :). | Dec 13 08:17 |
| cubexyz | :-/ | Dec 13 08:17 |
| cubexyz | what if you have one of those multi screen displays | Dec 13 08:19 |
| cubexyz | does the BSOD appear on all the screens? | Dec 13 08:19 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/triple-bsod.jpg | Dec 13 08:20 |
| cubexyz | that looks like 3 different computers | Dec 13 08:21 |
| cubexyz | I bet a large part of those BSODs is the computer overheating | Dec 13 08:25 |
| cubexyz | one of my machines has been running X for over a year | Dec 13 08:27 |
| cubexyz | root 3849 3848 0 2014 ? 1-00:17:25 /usr/X11R6/bin/X :0 -audit 0 -auth /var/gdm/:0.Xauth vt | Dec 13 08:27 |
| cubexyz | on the other hand I hear "windows BSODs about once a week" from customers | Dec 13 08:28 |
| cubexyz | clearly the BSODs haven't stopped | Dec 13 08:29 |
| cubexyz | or "Visual Studio BSODs my computer" | Dec 13 08:29 |
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| r_schestowitz | https://phab.enlightenment.org/phame/live/3/post/e20_release/ | Dec 13 09:56 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://phab.enlightenment.org/phame/live/3/post/e20_release/ ) | Dec 13 09:57 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2010-August/019310.html | Dec 13 10:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2010-August/019310.html ) | Dec 13 10:01 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Metztli_IT/status/676056468521553920 | Dec 13 10:12 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Metztli_IT: .@schestowitz but was disappointed that(some?)#GNU maintainers place subjective evaluation criteria above tech merit https://t.co/JM9c40jM8z | Dec 13 10:12 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/mall_dweller/status/676057101177888768 | Dec 13 10:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mall_dweller: @schestowitz Facists; perfectly fitting description. | Dec 13 10:18 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/unorigmoniker/status/676057993813893120 | Dec 13 10:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@unorigmoniker: @schestowitz I've seen you post this before. Do you have any proof to back up your assertions DDG has privacy issues? Curious. @all4privacy | Dec 13 10:18 | |
| r_schestowitz | http://50.80.140.55/photo_album/chron/desktop/opinion/2013_06_21-avoid_duck_duck_go/ | Dec 13 10:19 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-50.80.140.55 | Duck Duck No No [ http://ur1.ca/jbxqn ] | Dec 13 10:19 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/3vxq61/so_i_was_watching_the_linux_movie_the_code_with/ | Dec 13 10:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Couldn't resolve host 'www.reddit.com' ( status 0 @ https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/3vxq61/so_i_was_watching_the_linux_movie_the_code_with/ ) | Dec 13 10:23 | |
| r_schestowitz | "And my dad says, "Oh I know that guy." Referring to Eric S. Raymond! He said Eric started talking to him at our train station and he thought he was kind of weird." | Dec 13 10:23 |
| r_schestowitz | LOL | Dec 13 10:23 |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/unorigmoniker/status/676059905246240769 | Dec 13 10:25 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@unorigmoniker: Hi @Yegg, I would be curious to hear your response to this: https://t.co/hWs67gSx12 @all4privacy | Dec 13 10:25 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @unorigmoniker @All4Privacy http://50.80.140.55/photo_album/chron/desktop/opinion/2013_06_21-avoid_duck_duck_go/ | Dec 13 10:25 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/unorigmoniker/status/676060253016993792 | Dec 13 10:27 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@unorigmoniker: @schestowitz Thank you. I do note that the post & info is over 2 years old. But interesting claims none-the-less. @all4privacy | Dec 13 10:27 | |
| r_schestowitz | I have written dozens of things about it since... | Dec 13 10:27 |
| r_schestowitz | Even senior from within DDG admitted there was no longer truth to the privacy vow (and left) | Dec 13 10:28 |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/paulhindes/status/676064493231845376 | Dec 13 10:44 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@paulhindes: @schestowitz Makes Skynet seem quaint. The surveillance state will zero in on those not talking to their things all the time. | Dec 13 10:44 | |
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| msb_ | cubexyz: Regarding Linux usage in libraries, I read years ago that in some US libraries, the computers provided for free use by the public ran Linux. Most users didn't realize that there was any difference from the previous winblows OS. Of course administration was much easier -- no crashing. | Dec 13 11:19 |
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| cubexyz | msb_, any references would be interesting to see | Dec 13 11:52 |
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| cubexyz | there was a program called "Linux in libraries" a few years ago | Dec 13 11:56 |
| msb_ | google-advanced for linux computers in libraries gets 30M hits. Lots of relevant ones. | Dec 13 11:58 |
| cubexyz | Groovix :) | Dec 13 12:00 |
| cubexyz | http://www.groovix.com | Dec 13 12:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.groovix.com | | Dec 13 12:01 | |
| cubexyz | of course if one of the librarians was a linux guru they could probably use any distro | Dec 13 12:03 |
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| r_schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6910224 | Dec 13 14:30 |
| r_schestowitz | "heh, “bottom up” development is an interesting way or putting things." | Dec 13 14:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Why #WilliamHill is betting on #freesw rather than traditional IT vendors for digital transformation http://www.computerworlduk.com/applications/why-william-hill-is-swapping-major-it-vendors-for-open-source-platforms-3631637/ | Dec 13 14:30 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.computerworlduk.com | William Hill betting on open source for digital transformation | Applications | Computerworld UK [ http://ur1.ca/occrz ] | Dec 13 14:30 | |
| r_schestowitz | That must be your "kind" of company | Dec 13 14:30 |
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| schestowitz | The patent boosters with a puff piece http://www.ipwatchdog.com/2015/12/13/patents-system-works-record-bruce-kisliuk/id=63803/ | Dec 13 15:14 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.ipwatchdog.com | Patents, a system that works - On the record with Bruce Kisliuk - IPWatchdog.com | Patents & Patent Law [ http://ur1.ca/occtz ] | Dec 13 15:14 | |
| schestowitz | "Maybe we haven't had that yet in the way that it could happen because sure, those of us in the industry I think know that things are not good, that a whole lot less is patent eligible and that we are really running the risk of saying that software and " | Dec 13 15:14 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FOSSpatents/status/676128265254395904 | Dec 13 17:51 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FOSSpatents: I'm quite sure this has nothing to do with GMail and everything to do with a lack of privacy of the EPO network. https://t.co/NsJzPtGB9u | Dec 13 17:51 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #epo claims to have evidence that someone in EPO contacted @fosspatents using GMail. Moral of the story? Never use #gmail @Control_Risks | Dec 13 17:51 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Sheikh_al_Touar/status/676143894531334144 | Dec 13 17:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Sheikh_al_Touar: @FOSSpatents @schestowitz well, I wouldn't be so sure because it is rumoured for months that they have a clandestine love affair ;) | Dec 13 17:52 | |
| schestowitz | http://www.epo.org/news-issues/news/2011/20110324.html | Dec 13 17:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.epo.org | EPO - EPO and Google break the language barrier for Europe’s innovators | Dec 13 17:53 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/colinsmartone/status/676154827785805833 | Dec 13 17:54 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@colinsmartone: @schestowitz the problem is they fear this might to true and underline their failure | Dec 13 17:54 | |
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| msb__ | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqLRd4neGGE | Dec 13 19:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com | Friend & Lover - Reach Out Of The Darkness - YouTube | Dec 13 19:03 | |
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| oiaohm | Got a fun few days ahead of me. Hard drive death. Thank you ddrescue resume feature. Controller on drive developed fault of randomally stopping. | Dec 13 20:12 |
| msb__ | oiaohm: Good luck with a complete recovery! | Dec 13 20:27 |
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| oiaohm | msb__: I already know its not complete about 2G of data off 500G drive was unable to be read. | Dec 13 20:41 |
| oiaohm | msb__: hopefully is 2G of nothing important. | Dec 13 20:41 |
| cubexyz | msb__, saw an interesting quote today | Dec 14 01:02 |
| msb__ | Yes? | Dec 14 01:02 |
| cubexyz | "The press in the developed world is in the hands of an ever smaller bunch of sociopaths who take pride in being unscientific." | Dec 14 01:02 |
| msb__ | I'm not sure they take pride in being unscientific. | Dec 14 01:03 |
| msb__ | They just say whatever will serve the ultra-wealthy. | Dec 14 01:03 |
| msb__ | The corporate media, Western govts, huge banks, weapons companies, etc, are all part of one huge conglomerate whose members lie and act for each other's benefit, and against ours. | Dec 14 01:06 |
| msb__ | For example, it's against IMF policy to give loans to countries that aren't paying back their current loans. But it's going to give hundreds of billions to Ukraine, because that will help the West to attack Russia. | Dec 14 01:08 |
| msb__ | ...even though Ukraine is now totally in arrears. | Dec 14 01:08 |
| msb__ | Carter, Reagan, Clinton, Obama armed and financed Islamic head-choppers/clit-cutters, and the US govt also did 9/11. Millions of people murdered, many nations destroyed, all for oil and weapons profits and the wishes of Israel. | Dec 14 01:13 |
| cubexyz | fossil fuels are going to end | Dec 14 01:14 |
| cubexyz | also fracking should end | Dec 14 01:15 |
| msb__ | Read _Shock Doctrine/Disaster Capitalism_ by Naomi Klein. | Dec 14 01:15 |
| msb__ | Yes, it's wrecking the planet. | Dec 14 01:15 |
| msb__ | There's enough fossil fuel left to cause a huge temperature jump and kill most species on the planet. | Dec 14 01:17 |
| msb__ | Corps, govts, banks, media, etc, ARE one huge conspiracy. | Dec 14 01:18 |
| cubexyz | on the moon in 1969 and look at us now in 2015... it's disappointing | Dec 14 01:21 |
| cubexyz | we got tablets | Dec 14 01:21 |
| cubexyz | the pirate bay guy had some interesting things to say about capitalism | Dec 14 01:22 |
| cubexyz | I'll see if I can locate the link | Dec 14 01:22 |
| msb__ | The Pirate Party? | Dec 14 01:22 |
| cubexyz | ok, I think the link was posted in here | Dec 14 01:25 |
| cubexyz | http://motherboard.vice.com/read/pirate-bay-founder-peter-sunde-i-have-given-up?trk_source=popular | Dec 14 01:25 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-motherboard.vice.com | Pirate Bay Founder: ‘I Have Given Up’ | Motherboard | Dec 14 01:25 | |
| cubexyz | Peter Sunde... I think he was in jail for a while | Dec 14 01:26 |
| cubexyz | although I think filesharing still continues | Dec 14 01:27 |
| cubexyz | I think you mentioned the The Shock Doctine before | Dec 14 01:29 |
| msb__ | Yes, it's a very important book. | Dec 14 01:30 |
| msb__ | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pirate_Party | Dec 14 01:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | Pirate Party - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/ocdms ] | Dec 14 01:30 | |
| msb__ | pirate bay is still working | Dec 14 01:30 |
| msb__ | YIFY has been killed, unfortunately | Dec 14 01:31 |
| cubexyz | Sunde got hammered | Dec 14 01:33 |
| msb__ | This is a very good video about how huge banks made trillions of dollars with criminal schemes, and then got nations to bail out the failing ones by robbing their citizens with austerity. http://whos-saving-whom.org/index.php/en/ | Dec 14 01:33 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-whos-saving-whom.org | Whos saving whom - Home [ http://ur1.ca/ocdn0 ] | Dec 14 01:33 | |
| msb__ | Most of it was shown on RT these last two days, or you can buy it for $22. Hopefully it will get on bt at some point. | Dec 14 01:34 |
| msb__ | So far, bt is still thriving, comprising something like 30% of Net traffic. | Dec 14 01:42 |
| msb__ | Every type of drm and censorship has been defeated by clever people. | Dec 14 01:42 |
| oiaohm | Really there is a pre human example of burning coal causing envornmental change. There was a coal field in one of the old russia states that before humans was set alight by metorite. | Dec 14 01:46 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, any references for that? | Dec 14 02:11 |
| cubexyz | the coal wouldn't be on the surface would it? | Dec 14 02:12 |
| cubexyz | when you think about it humans were using renewables before the industrial revolution: | Dec 14 02:14 |
| cubexyz | biomass (animals), sun, water and wind | Dec 14 02:14 |
| cubexyz | sailboats, horses, wind-mills, etc | Dec 14 02:15 |
| cubexyz | wood-burning stoves (wood -> renewable by planting more trees) | Dec 14 02:16 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I wish I could find the reference. I remember covering it in worse possible coal fire. | Dec 14 02:25 |
| cubexyz | I suppose the coal could have been right on the surface and the meteorite ignited it | Dec 14 02:26 |
| oiaohm | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal_seam_fire coal seam fire burn under ground. Australia's Burning Mountain from all maths has been burning for 6000 years. | Dec 14 02:35 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | Coal seam fire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/ocdpo ] | Dec 14 02:35 | |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: basically big rock hits under ground coal field with enough force it will light. | Dec 14 02:35 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: So the worse place for a meteorite to hit earth is right on top of a large oil/coal field. | Dec 14 02:36 |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6910191 | Dec 14 03:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Congresswoman Asks Feds Why They Pressured a Library to Disable Its Tor Node http://motherboard.vice.com/read/congresswoman-asks-feds-why-they-pressured-a-library-to-disable-its-tor-node go Zoe! She's great. #tor #anonymity | Dec 14 03:11 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> motherboard.vice.com | Congresswoman Asks Feds Why They Pressured a Library to Disable Its Tor Node | Motherboard [ http://ur1.ca/occse ] | Dec 14 03:11 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 14 03:11 |
| schestowitz | I was at LSU when this stuff rolled through and did not understand it at the time. LSU eliminated anonymous wifi and implemented WPA, which only worked with new versions of Microsoft at the time. I’m told they eventually eliminated anonymous wired connections as well. WPA annoyed me enough to chat with the head of IT who said the changes were driven by Federal laws and he was unable to talk about all of it. CIPA was not mentioned by name | Dec 14 03:11 |
| schestowitz | and as neither of us could do anything about Federal law, I failed to pursue the issue. I resigned myself to elimination of free software wifi use because I had good wired connectivity in the places I wanted it. I was unaware of the nature and pervasiveness of domestic spying at the time and did not connect the dots. I chalked it up to Microsoft and partners forcing expensive equipment sales that put free software at a disadvantage. I | Dec 14 03:11 |
| schestowitz | imagine we still don’t know about everything that was put in. | Dec 14 03:11 |
| schestowitz | In retrospect, it was outrageous - that the student fee built network was commandeered by some sort of secret federal laws. Given all the domestic spying abuse, I now think CIPA was mostly about spying on people. | Dec 14 03:11 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 14 03:11 |
| cubexyz | I assume Linux can use WPA now? | Dec 14 04:20 |
| cubexyz | and WPA isn't microsoft I don't think | Dec 14 04:21 |
| cubexyz | it's IEEE 802.11 (since 2003) | Dec 14 04:21 |
| cubexyz | one can philsophically debate whether or not free wi-fi is good | Dec 14 04:23 |
| cubexyz | really once people get a bit more knowledgeable microsoft is toast | Dec 14 04:25 |
| cubexyz | it's just worse... | Dec 14 04:25 |
| cubexyz | no sane person is going to defend twain, or asp or wma stuff | Dec 14 04:25 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/foss-matrix.txt | Dec 14 04:26 |
| cubexyz | who actually wants DRM on ebooks? | Dec 14 04:26 |
| cubexyz | not the reader, that's for sure | Dec 14 04:26 |
| cubexyz | the list of why it's worse gets longer and longer after each new release of windows | Dec 14 04:27 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wpa_supplicant WPA support has been on Linux since 2003. | Dec 14 04:50 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | wpa_supplicant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/ocdw0 ] | Dec 14 04:50 | |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: please note to use WPA under windows using particular wifi cards you need the same program. | Dec 14 04:51 |
| cubexyz | what program? | Dec 14 04:51 |
| oiaohm | "wpa supplicant" is the name of the program to make older wifi cards have WPA. | Dec 14 04:52 |
| cubexyz | ok... so that other person is wrong about WPA being a microsoft thing | Dec 14 04:54 |
| cubexyz | it's actually cross-platform | Dec 14 04:54 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: https://w1.fi/wpa_supplicant/ WPA standard comes approved from 2004. The program to support it was on Linux before routers shipped with WPA. | Dec 14 04:55 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-w1.fi | Linux WPA Supplicant (IEEE 802.1X, WPA, WPA2, RSN, IEEE 802.11i) | Dec 14 04:55 | |
| oiaohm | fun fact about wpa is that you can use it on a wired network. | Dec 14 04:55 |
| cubexyz | is there any reason to do that? | Dec 14 04:56 |
| oiaohm | It is kinda encrypted. | Dec 14 04:56 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FOSSpatents/status/676340117372542976 | Dec 14 04:59 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FOSSpatents: @schestowitz @Sheikh_al_Touar I would consider it a conspiracy theory to conclude from this that Google shares GMail messages with Benoit B. | Dec 14 04:59 | |
| schestowitz | Not Google, maybe GCHQ via @Control_Risks | Dec 14 04:59 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: when I say fun fact is the reality of it but most of the time it worthless. There is better network encryption options than using wpa. | Dec 14 05:01 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.infoworld.com/article/3012987/microsoft-windows/microsoft-edge-has-inherited-many-of-internet-explorers-security-holes.html | Dec 14 05:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.infoworld.com | Microsoft Edge has inherited many of Internet Explorer's security holes | InfoWorld [ http://ur1.ca/ocdwo ] | Dec 14 05:03 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 05:03 |
| schestowitz | > did I send that already? | Dec 14 05:03 |
| schestowitz | No, it's good coming from a MS booster | Dec 14 05:03 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FOSSpatents/status/676341540252459008 | Dec 14 05:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FOSSpatents: @schestowitz @Sheikh_al_Touar OK. I don't like Google's cooperation with the EPO either, but that doesn't diminish my trust in Google/GMail. | Dec 14 05:04 | |
| schestowitz | It's not so much about the EPO as much as about NSA/GCHQ PRISM and their privatised entities (which work with them) | Dec 14 05:05 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: knew t there was something about wifi encryption that was a laugh. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wired_Equivalent_Privacy Yes This is the full name of the WEP protocol that was used over Wifi that was full of holes. | Dec 14 05:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | Wired Equivalent Privacy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/ocdwr ] | Dec 14 05:05 | |
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| oiaohm | schestowitz: Please remember groups like the NSA has legal powers they can use to make privatieds entities obey them. | Dec 14 05:06 |
| schestowitz | > older: | Dec 14 05:07 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > "she pointed to posts about Goodfellas that he had "liked" on Facebook. | Dec 14 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > The judge denied Jelani bail,... The trial never came." | Dec 14 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.theverge.com/2014/12/10/7341077/nypd-harlem-crews-social-media-rikers-prison | Dec 14 05:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theverge.com | How the NYPD is using social media to put Harlem teens behind bars | The Verge [ http://ur1.ca/j351z ] | Dec 14 05:08 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > - | Dec 14 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/dec/13/facebook-offices-hamburg-germany-vandalised | Dec 14 05:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theguardian.com | Facebook offices in Hamburg vandalised | Technology | The Guardian [ http://ur1.ca/ocdx0 ] | Dec 14 05:08 | |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yeah | Dec 14 05:08 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FOSSpatents/status/676342911408164864 | Dec 14 05:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FOSSpatents: @schestowitz ok | Dec 14 05:11 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676343114815152128 https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676343376673918976 | Dec 14 05:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz @Sheikh_al_Touar @FOSSpatents So Google is participating to the patent inflation, including software patents. | Dec 14 05:11 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz @Sheikh_al_Touar @FOSSpatents Automated and non-legally binding translations still have to be tested in court. Stay tuned. | Dec 14 05:11 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Zeipt/status/676344140360261632 | Dec 14 05:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Zeipt: @schestowitz seems, it was hacked by russians - ukrainians not using mail.ru, because it is russian FSS freindly corp)) | Dec 14 05:16 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/676355600255721472 | Dec 14 06:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @ilgiornale @fattoquotidiano @corriere @reportrai3 @Serv_Pubblico @byoblu @LaGabbiaTw @POLITICOEurope https://t.co/Zld5ctQvSC | Dec 14 06:18 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #epo is political and interventionist. Here it is publicly batting for the #UPC https://t.co/d9pszSGgbp | Dec 14 06:18 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynco/status/676374506504634368 | Dec 14 07:14 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynco: @schestowitz A month prior CIA attorney Jon Fredman came to GTMO & said "If a detainee dies, you're doing it wrong." Guess they got it wrong | Dec 14 07:14 | |
| schestowitz | They'll just need to give them Hell, repeatedly, without giving them peace (death). #cia #torture #radicalisation | Dec 14 07:14 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-demonstrates-its-linux-based-azure-cloud-switch-operating-system/ | Dec 14 07:22 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.zdnet.com | Microsoft demonstrates its Linux-based Azure Cloud Switch operating system | ZDNet [ http://ur1.ca/oce6b ] | Dec 14 07:22 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 07:22 |
| schestowitz | > https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/blog/microsoft-showcases-the-azure-cloud-switch-acs/ | Dec 14 07:22 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-azure.microsoft.com | Microsoft showcases the Azure Cloud Switch (ACS) | Microsoft Azure Blog [ http://ur1.ca/oce6c ] | Dec 14 07:22 | |
| schestowitz | Getting desperate now... | Dec 14 07:22 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/676382213815017472 | Dec 14 07:59 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @fattoquotidiano @ilgiornale @diregiustizia @altalex @Corriereit @byoblu @reportrai3 @LaGabbiaTw @confindustria https://t.co/CnDgbBTqIz | Dec 14 07:59 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Terrible stuff. More lawsuits, more injunctions, more public tax. And for who? Non-European mega/superpowers... https://t.co/rW1sSWlkf6 | Dec 14 07:59 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/676382604971663360 | Dec 14 08:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @wallstreetita https://t.co/CnDgbBTqIz | Dec 14 08:00 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676385467860918273 | Dec 14 08:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz fail2ban on which port? SSH? | Dec 14 08:00 | |
| schestowitz | http/80 | Dec 14 08:00 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676387284418240512 | Dec 14 08:10 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz which useragent? maybe a transparent spying proxy hammering? | Dec 14 08:10 | |
| schestowitz | I thought about it, hard to check (need to scan logs, not a priority at the moment) | Dec 14 08:11 |
| oiaohm | msb__: thanks for wishing me luck before. I had a brain spark what if the reason why the missed sector count was so high was controller problem. Yep it was. From 2G back to 25meg of unaccessable. Real pain have to repeatily power on and off the drive. | Dec 14 08:22 |
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| sebsebseb | hi | Dec 14 09:23 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/JavaFact/status/676404034794688512 | Dec 14 12:20 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@JavaFact: IBM's open source #JVM project could also speed #Ruby , 3Python https://t.co/lZKaCfsdyK #freesw via @schestowitz | Dec 14 12:20 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.infoworld.com | IBM's open source JVM project could also speed Ruby, Python | InfoWorld | Dec 14 12:20 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynco/status/676416548572106753 | Dec 14 12:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynco: @fth_nix @schestowitz they were suppressed, marginalized, ignored and looked at as unPatriotic. | Dec 14 12:23 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Laura_F_ERCOLI/status/676426232297320448 | Dec 14 12:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Laura_F_ERCOLI: @zoobab @KrapulaPhD @schestowitz sorry everyone, tweet about 5 months old, content no longer on web site. | Dec 14 12:23 | |
| schestowitz | Maybe time to change their minds :-) | Dec 14 12:23 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676453591889133568 | Dec 14 12:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz let's really make sure those EPO IP addresses cannot really read techrights :-) | Dec 14 12:30 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/LFarrapos/status/676459918656987136 | Dec 14 12:56 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@LFarrapos: Olá schestowitz, curta nossa pagina no facebook! ♥ :) https://t.co/b6Gj4QhU0P https://t.co/FVBcDAx5Eg | Dec 14 12:56 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.facebook.com | Facebook | Dec 14 12:56 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Interestingly enough, same legal firm which lobbies alongside #microsoft on the #patent front is the same one threatening me for #epo now | Dec 14 12:56 | |
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| sebsebseb | Dec 14 15:33 | |
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| schestowitz | > Hi Ron, | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | Roy actually. ;-) | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | Dec 14 17:40 | |
| schestowitz | > Kyle here from The Linux Foundation PR team. | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > Tomorrow The Linux Foundation is announcing three new Silver members, | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > and on Thursday, we're launching a Collaborative Project in cloud native | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > computing. | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > I thought you might be interested in an early look for these | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > announcements. If you're ok to honor an embargo, I can send over details. | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > Thank you!! | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | > Kyle | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | If you send over the press releases, I'll post these in tuxmachines.org | Dec 14 17:40 |
| schestowitz | Embargo schmembargo... | Dec 14 18:25 |
| schestowitz | Here is some headsup regarding PR to come in 3 days from now: | Dec 14 18:25 |
| schestowitz | For tomorrow (supposed to be secret): | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | UNDER EMBARGO: Embargo lifts Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 8 am ET | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | Linux Foundation Drives Mass Innovation Through Open Source with New Members | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | Welcomes Autodesk, Concurrent Computer Corporation and DataKinetics to the organization | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | SAN FRANCISCO – December 15, 2015 – The Linux Foundation, the nonprofit organization enabling mass innovation through open source, today is announcing three new silver members are joining the organization: Autodesk, Concurrent Computer Corporation and DataKinetics. | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | Thousands of developers and more than 600 organizations work across Linux Foundation-hosted projects. From container technologies and application platforms to datacenter operating systems and networking, The Linux Foundation provides critical services to support every corner of technology infrastructure. By growing the member ecosystem to include software solutions and big data processing experts, The Linux Foundation further unites the | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | world’s leading technologists to drive open innovation on a global scale. | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | “Open source has become the de facto way to create software. The Linux Foundation provides a neutral home for organizations to develop technology at scale and at a rate that can’t be matched working on their own,” said Jim Zemlin, executive director, The Linux Foundation. “We’re excited to welcome these members to our organization as we enter another exciting year of collaboration.” | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | More information about the newest Linux Foundation members: | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | Autodesk (NASDAQ: ADSK) helps people imagine, design and create a better world. Over 170 million design professionals, including engineers, architects, digital artists, students and hobbyists, use Autodesk software to unlock their creativity and solve important challenges. | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | "Autodesk has been working to democratize access to design and fabrication software as part of our effort to support the newly emerging future of making things," said Guy Martin, Director, Open Source Strategy at Autodesk. "Open source is an important component of this effort, and we're excited to join the Linux Foundation to accelerate our participation in this critical ecosystem." | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | Concurrent (NASDAQ: CCUR) is a global software and solutions company that develops advanced applications on a core foundation of high performance Linux® and storage technologies. The company recently launched Aquari™, a Ceph-based scale-out storage solution powered by its advanced real-time Linux extensions that is designed to support the more demanding performance needs of enterprise and video customers. | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | “Concurrent’s technology strategy is increasingly shaped by our participation in open source development forums,” said Dale Gonzalez, Chief Technology Officer at Concurrent. “As open source software becomes an important part of our customer’s technology stack, we are finding new opportunities to deliver unique value by combining the advantages of our own solutions with the power of community-driven software. We are excited to join | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | The Linux Foundation and to collaborate with other thought-leaders from a wide range of industries.” | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | DataKinetics is a global leader in data performance and optimization solutions. The company optimizes data throughput and processing speeds for the world’s largest banks, credit card, brokerage, insurance, healthcare, retail and telecommunication organizations. | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | “The intersection of Big Data and mobile processing has caused unprecedented demand for mainframe capabilities. Only Linux’s rate of development can match that demand,” said Allan Zander, Chief Executive Officer, DataKinetics. “Working regularly with these Fortune 500 companies, we understand the unique challenges and critical need for scalable solutions. As a member of The Linux Foundation and the Open Mainframe Project, we’re | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | eager to contribute to the future technologies that will serve the needs of the industry and those of our customers.” | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | jgay: autodesk in Linux Foundation | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | but also VMWare | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | so less money for the Conservancy | Dec 14 18:26 |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6912656 | Dec 14 18:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@linux@joindiaspora.com: LetsEncrypt now available in Fedora https://fedoramagazine.org/letsencrypt-now-available-fedora/ | Dec 14 18:28 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://fedoramagazine.org/letsencrypt-now-available-fedora/ ) | Dec 14 18:28 | |
| schestowitz | "Hopefully that means a proper CentOS install isn’t far behind." | Dec 14 18:28 |
| <--jgay has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) | Dec 14 19:17 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/676578762394173441 | Dec 14 20:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @SMCADMAN @schestowitz Seems some gov. seeking ID of privacy & security advocates. Not surprising! Let's ask @ioerror ...? | Dec 14 20:48 | |
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| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 04:44 |
| schestowitz | Thank you very much. | Dec 15 04:44 |
| schestowitz | What I can't understand is why in the break-prism website DDG is still among the suggestions of web searchers (https://prism-break.org/en/all/#web-search) | Dec 15 04:44 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 04:44 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-prism-break.org | All Projects - PRISM Break [ http://ur1.ca/ocg42 ] | Dec 15 04:44 | |
| schestowitz | Clever marketing from DDG | Dec 15 04:44 |
| schestowitz | > "The publisher of the Las Vegas Review-Journal removed quotes from a | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > Thursday night article about the newspaper's sale that questioned its | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > new owner's decision to remain anonymous" | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20151214/11203533076/las-vegas-review-journal-now-owned.shtml | Dec 15 05:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.techdirt.com | Las Vegas Review-Journal Now Owned By... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ | Techdirt [ http://ur1.ca/ocg4q ] | Dec 15 05:08 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > Just in time for the upcoming major election. | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > == | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/digital-media/12050693/Yahoo-told-cut-9000-of-your-10.700-staff.html | Dec 15 05:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.telegraph.co.uk | Yahoo told: cut 9,000 of your 10.700 staff - Telegraph [ http://ur1.ca/ocg4r ] | Dec 15 05:08 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | > M$ effects roll on and on ... | Dec 15 05:08 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/fleming77/status/676703706813870080 | Dec 15 05:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@fleming77: this fuels climate change https://t.co/OtI7lIqAX1 | Dec 15 05:08 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Rampant #Indonesia fires causing havoc in Papua https://t.co/0OHGs7IPdV #imperialism through burning | Dec 15 05:08 | |
| cubexyz | cut 9,0000 of 10,700? | Dec 15 05:16 |
| cubexyz | sounds pretty drastic | Dec 15 05:16 |
| schestowitz | > "Having the best tech or the best marketing cannot help you win if the | Dec 15 05:16 |
| schestowitz | > product is crap" | Dec 15 05:16 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 05:16 |
| schestowitz | > http://communities-dominate.blogs.com/brands/2015/12/revisiting-best-big-data-case-study-we-have-new-details-about-narwhal-vs-orca-case-study-of-us-elect.html | Dec 15 05:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-communities-dominate.blogs.com | Communities Dominate Brands: Revisiting Best Big Data Case Study: We Have New Details about Narwhal vs Orca Case Study (of US Elections 2012 and world's largest Big Data project for which there is performance data) (Updated) [ http://ur1.ca/ocg58 ] | Dec 15 05:16 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 05:16 |
| schestowitz | > I expect that line refers to both the candidate and his programmers. | Dec 15 05:16 |
| schestowitz | cubexyz: yeah | Dec 15 05:16 |
| schestowitz | MSFT killed Yahoo | Dec 15 05:16 |
| schestowitz | http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/Microsoft_Hijack_of_Yahoo | Dec 15 05:17 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Microsoft Hijack of Yahoo - Techrights [ http://ur1.ca/518kt ] | Dec 15 05:17 | |
| schestowitz | What is this, an ad? http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2496295,00.asp | Dec 15 05:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pcmag.com | Microsoft Azure Review & Rating | PCMag.com [ http://ur1.ca/ocg6l ] | Dec 15 05:41 | |
| schestowitz | IDG "excellent".... on a bloody network | Dec 15 05:41 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/SleepyPenguin1/status/676721231253495808 | Dec 15 06:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@SleepyPenguin1: I've had some discussions with Sean Gourley about this @schestowitz https://t.co/BN4RKMn3GE | Dec 15 06:16 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> seangourley.com | Sean Gourley — thoughts from the intersection of science, technology and politics | Dec 15 06:16 | |
| msb__ | Russian rocket just took off from Baikonur Cosmodrome for the International Space Station with three crew aboard -- Russian, US, and UK. | Dec 15 06:16 |
| cubexyz | nice | Dec 15 06:17 |
| cubexyz | cooperation for a change :) | Dec 15 06:18 |
| msb__ | Superb new sci-fi series "The Expanse" from, of all places, the | Dec 15 06:26 |
| msb__ | "Syfy" channel (sometimes known as "Syphy"). Excellent major motion picture scale production values. | Dec 15 06:27 |
| msb__ | Second episode to be broadcast tonight. Get them both! | Dec 15 06:27 |
| oiaohm | msb__: I managed to recover all bar 25 meg of the 500Gb drive I had die. I had a brain spark the harddive own controller board was crashing every time it found a bad sector then playing dead. | Dec 15 07:22 |
| msb__ | oiaohm: Big congrats! | Dec 15 07:23 |
| oiaohm | msb__: even better 20megs was already declared dead by file system. | Dec 15 07:24 |
| cubexyz | doesn't anyone do backups? | Dec 15 07:24 |
| cubexyz | I see that a million times... | Dec 15 07:25 |
| cubexyz | backups should be at least weekly | Dec 15 07:25 |
| cubexyz | get cron to do an rsync nightly | Dec 15 07:26 |
| cubexyz | you wouldn't believe the horror stories I could tell | Dec 15 07:27 |
| cubexyz | software companies with all their svn stuff on one hard drive! | Dec 15 07:27 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: shocking part here is that I have specialised in data recovery. | Dec 15 07:27 |
| cubexyz | and not backed up | Dec 15 07:27 |
| oiaohm | I have horror stories with price tags. | Dec 15 07:27 |
| cubexyz | it's your own hard drive you're working on? | Dec 15 07:28 |
| cubexyz | tsk tsk! | Dec 15 07:28 |
| oiaohm | So far out of all the drives I have had personally on me I have never lost more than 1 percent of the data. I though this time I was going to break my own record. | Dec 15 07:28 |
| oiaohm | Just working out exactly what has gone wrong with the drive. | Dec 15 07:29 |
| oiaohm | This recovery cost me 36 hours. | Dec 15 07:29 |
| oiaohm | At 50 dollars an hour if this was billed it would be ouch. | Dec 15 07:29 |
| cubexyz | $1800 | Dec 15 07:30 |
| cubexyz | yeah rsync is cheaper | Dec 15 07:30 |
| oiaohm | No that is 1800 to me. | Dec 15 07:30 |
| oiaohm | Client it would be 120 per hour. | Dec 15 07:30 |
| cubexyz | you know the story of how Unix v1 was saved? | Dec 15 07:31 |
| cubexyz | it was printed out | Dec 15 07:31 |
| cubexyz | so any program I write I print it out... sometimes that's not enough | Dec 15 07:32 |
| cubexyz | the toolchain has to be reserved as well | Dec 15 07:32 |
| cubexyz | preserved | Dec 15 07:32 |
| oiaohm | Proper backups are cheaper cubexyz. But remembering when a drive is dead its not is critical. | Dec 15 07:32 |
| oiaohm | the 500g drive I just got this huge percentage from had a failed MBR cubexyz | Dec 15 07:33 |
| oiaohm | So insert into windows or linux without recovery tools it pretends to be completely dead. | Dec 15 07:33 |
| oiaohm | Harddrive is only not recoverable when it fragments. | Dec 15 07:34 |
| oiaohm | Preferably very small fragements. | Dec 15 07:34 |
| cubexyz | wasn't M-DISC supposed to solve these archival problems? | Dec 15 07:35 |
| cubexyz | can't really trust a hard drive much beyond 10 years | Dec 15 07:36 |
| cubexyz | or maybe even less than that | Dec 15 07:36 |
| cubexyz | some of my amiga floppies are close to 30 years | Dec 15 07:37 |
| oiaohm | I normally turn over my harddrives every 6 years. | Dec 15 07:37 |
| oiaohm | This 500GB drive got lost. | Dec 15 07:38 |
| cubexyz | how old is the 500GB? | Dec 15 07:38 |
| oiaohm | I was found 5 days before it death it was setup for replacement on the day it died. | Dec 15 07:38 |
| oiaohm | I was found/It was found | Dec 15 07:38 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the drive that died was made 2008-04-04 | Dec 15 07:42 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: so only a few years over my replacement time frame. | Dec 15 07:42 |
| cubexyz | I think lower density hard drives might last longer | Dec 15 07:42 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly. | Dec 15 07:43 |
| oiaohm | The main issue with the drive I had is the controller had gone nuts. | Dec 15 07:43 |
| oiaohm | Smart tech in harddrive is a double sided sword. | Dec 15 07:43 |
| cubexyz | ok, the computer that contained the defective 500gb drive... did it have a UPS? | Dec 15 07:43 |
| oiaohm | Yes I had a UPS | Dec 15 07:44 |
| oiaohm | Motherboard was also old and the power supply part on motherboard lost the wrong caps. | Dec 15 07:44 |
| cubexyz | ok, I keep track of my hard drives | Dec 15 07:44 |
| oiaohm | I normally do cubexyz | Dec 15 07:45 |
| cubexyz | I have mutiple ST340810A's | Dec 15 07:45 |
| cubexyz | 2001 era | Dec 15 07:45 |
| oiaohm | Please note this 500GB drive has been running 24/7 since it was installed. | Dec 15 07:45 |
| cubexyz | sure, mine too | Dec 15 07:45 |
| oiaohm | I would say that lucky. | Dec 15 07:45 |
| oiaohm | http://www.bugaco.com/calculators/seagate_date_code.php very useful with seagate harddrives. | Dec 15 07:46 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.bugaco.com | Seagate date code calculator and decoder - bugaco.com [ http://ur1.ca/0bhc1 ] | Dec 15 07:46 | |
| oiaohm | There is another problem with harddrives. If they are left sitting the bearings also start going. | Dec 15 07:47 |
| cubexyz | what I've seen is shorter lifespans on optical drives, e.g. cdrom, dvd, etc | Dec 15 07:47 |
| oiaohm | Really that with optical drives depends on conditions. | Dec 15 07:47 |
| oiaohm | and quality. | Dec 15 07:47 |
| oiaohm | In clean room you adverage about 14 years out a quality optical drive. | Dec 15 07:48 |
| cubexyz | ok... now for the Amiga 500... it has Quantum 49MB LP52S | Dec 15 07:48 |
| cubexyz | from 1990! | Dec 15 07:48 |
| cubexyz | but I only run it once or twice per month nowadays | Dec 15 07:48 |
| oiaohm | 49MB harddrives no smart in controller on harddrive. | Dec 15 07:48 |
| cubexyz | is that better? | Dec 15 07:48 |
| oiaohm | So you get it declare dead sectors and keep it kicking. | Dec 15 07:48 |
| oiaohm | Smart runs out of means to replace a dead sector with another the bastard starts locking up the harddrive. | Dec 15 07:49 |
| oiaohm | yes checking if harddrives are replacing sectors is critical. | Dec 15 07:50 |
| oiaohm | That is what drew my attention to it in the first place. It had replaced 4000+ sectors in 1 month. | Dec 15 07:50 |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6913320 | Dec 15 07:50 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Top 10 open source projects of 2015 https://opensource.com/business/15/12/top-10-open-source-projects-2015 #freesw | Dec 15 07:50 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> opensource.com | 10 amazing open source projects from 2015 | Opensource.com [ http://ur1.ca/ocgdx ] | Dec 15 07:50 | |
| schestowitz | "And what are our top ten p2p software projects?" | Dec 15 07:50 |
| schestowitz | I never p2p, too risky with ISPs... | Dec 15 07:51 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: https://twitter.com/MaryBethCarney3/status/676713840587902976?t=1&cn=bWVudGlvbg%3D%3D&sig=95907361cefbdf64982ae7779ba21557916f121b&al=1&refsrc=email&iid=152db36addc74bfaad3176dea8c89a47&autoactions=1450176127&uid=26603208&nid=4+1267 | Dec 15 07:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MaryBethCarney3: @fflandro @schestowitz https://t.co/Hm91yDL5KV | Dec 15 07:53 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MaryBethCarney3: @fflandro @schestowitz https://t.co/Hm91yDL5KV | Dec 15 07:53 | |
| cubexyz | ok, I've updated my longevity list to include hard drives that have lasted a long time: | Dec 15 07:56 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/computer-longevity.txt | Dec 15 07:56 |
| cubexyz | ok, now the quantum drives were made in japan, perhaps that's why they lasted longer | Dec 15 07:56 |
| cubexyz | so the Quantum LP52S is 25 years old at least | Dec 15 07:58 |
| cubexyz | pretty impressive | Dec 15 07:58 |
| cubexyz | guess I should fire it up to be sure :) | Dec 15 07:59 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: Its tech. | Dec 15 07:59 |
| oiaohm | The more complex the controller the more parts in it to screw up. | Dec 15 08:00 |
| cubexyz | note the oldest working CRT is 30 years | Dec 15 08:00 |
| oiaohm | I know of a 20 Meg 2 foot across harddrive 35 years old that is still working perfectly cubexyz | Dec 15 08:00 |
| oiaohm | Mind you lower denisty does help a bit. | Dec 15 08:01 |
| cubexyz | my point :) | Dec 15 08:01 |
| oiaohm | Biggest cause of modern harddrive data lost is not drive surface failures. | Dec 15 08:01 |
| oiaohm | But controller deciding not to work correctly. | Dec 15 08:02 |
| oiaohm | 35 old controller is insanely simple compared to modern day drives. | Dec 15 08:02 |
| cubexyz | 30 year old CRT is on and working... 1990 drive also working | Dec 15 08:03 |
| oiaohm | Again 1990 drive is prior to smart and sector remapping. | Dec 15 08:03 |
| oiaohm | The dirty tricks to make harddrives work with MBR has decreased their stablity. | Dec 15 08:04 |
| oiaohm | 1990 drive is most likely reporting a real sector map. | Dec 15 08:04 |
| oiaohm | Not a virtual one. | Dec 15 08:04 |
| cubexyz | one thing about the amiga, the power switch is on the external power supply which is on the floor | Dec 15 08:09 |
| cubexyz | not too convenient | Dec 15 08:09 |
| cubexyz | also my desk isn't really large enough for 4 computers | Dec 15 08:12 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I never found that a problem. Turned it on and off with tip of boot. | Dec 15 08:12 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: added different meaning to booting a computer. | Dec 15 08:12 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I did have a amiga a long long time ago. | Dec 15 08:13 |
| cubexyz | oh, which one? | Dec 15 08:13 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: to be correct two 500 and 1200 | Dec 15 08:16 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/amigados-1.0.gif | Dec 15 08:16 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: but sersouslly I turned that switch on the powersupply on and off with boot. | Dec 15 08:16 |
| oiaohm | It was just sticking it in a place that it could not be moved. | Dec 15 08:16 |
| cubexyz | I would have kept those | Dec 15 08:16 |
| cubexyz | I thought the amiga was so futuristic when I first saw it :) | Dec 15 08:17 |
| oiaohm | both of the amiga I had were destoryed by a fire. | Dec 15 08:17 |
| cubexyz | that's not good | Dec 15 08:19 |
| cubexyz | when the amiga was first launched it only had 256K of ram | Dec 15 08:19 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/christmas-1985-256k-amiga.png | Dec 15 08:19 |
| cubexyz | 30 years ago... | Dec 15 08:20 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: losing equipment is better than losing life. | Dec 15 08:21 |
| cubexyz | true | Dec 15 08:21 |
| oiaohm | It was a case of bush fire | Dec 15 08:21 |
| oiaohm | You leave behined items that you believe you will replace later. | Dec 15 08:22 |
| oiaohm | To be truthful I do miss the power on switch on flour where you can sit down a desk. | Dec 15 08:22 |
| oiaohm | and the computer starts. | Dec 15 08:23 |
| cubexyz | I thought the old desktops were the best, but then everything seemed to switch to towers | Dec 15 08:23 |
| cubexyz | keeping the old amiga 500 was an indulgence | Dec 15 08:25 |
| cubexyz | eventually I turned into a Unix person... | Dec 15 08:27 |
| cubexyz | the amiga had a short life... only 9 years long | Dec 15 08:31 |
| cubexyz | 1985 to 1994, then Commodore went bankrupt | Dec 15 08:31 |
| cubexyz | it wasn't long before all the distributors dropped all the amiga stuff | Dec 15 08:32 |
| oiaohm | Last commodore was a x86 computer. | Dec 15 08:32 |
| oiaohm | Also you have to remember a lot of the early stuff like amiga depended on Microsoft supplying stuff. | Dec 15 08:33 |
| cubexyz | Microsoft didn't supply anything for amiga | Dec 15 08:33 |
| cubexyz | well, maybe one thing... amigabasic... and it sucked | Dec 15 08:33 |
| oiaohm | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AmigaBASIC | Dec 15 08:34 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | AmigaBASIC - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia | Dec 15 08:34 | |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, no one used it | Dec 15 08:34 |
| oiaohm | Yep amigabasic was written by Microsoft. | Dec 15 08:34 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly. | Dec 15 08:34 |
| cubexyz | it was buggy | Dec 15 08:35 |
| oiaohm | basic was used a lot as the univeral source code based applications between all the systems. | Dec 15 08:35 |
| oiaohm | Yes amiga replaced basic with basic they sourced from other locations. | Dec 15 08:35 |
| cubexyz | True BASIC, Blitz Basic were both much better | Dec 15 08:35 |
| oiaohm | But when Microsoft stop providing basic and focused full time on Windows the basic based items become very limited. | Dec 15 08:36 |
| cubexyz | and what was this late x86 commodore computer? | Dec 15 08:36 |
| cubexyz | I'm drawing a blank on that | Dec 15 08:36 |
| cubexyz | I thought the last one was the Amiga 4000 | Dec 15 08:39 |
| oiaohm | http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/a2088t | Dec 15 08:42 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-amiga.resource.cx | Commodore A2088T - Amiga Hardware Database | Dec 15 08:42 | |
| oiaohm | Doing that fairly much put the end to getting Commodore only software. | Dec 15 08:43 |
| cubexyz | seems easier just to have a separate PC | Dec 15 08:44 |
| cubexyz | that's what I did | Dec 15 08:44 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I remember the http://amiga.resource.cx/mod/a4000.html without the expand card fitted. | Dec 15 08:50 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-amiga.resource.cx | Amiga Hardware Database - Amiga 4000 | Dec 15 08:50 | |
| oiaohm | Yes it also looks insanely like a PC. | Dec 15 08:50 |
| oiaohm | So all the Amiga nice design gone out the window by the end. | Dec 15 08:50 |
| oiaohm | What make the C64 so popular was the means to put it in a backpack and take it to a friends place and use it. | Dec 15 08:52 |
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| schestowitz | http://ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/merpel-pays-brief-visit-to-eponia.html?showComment=1450187818759 | Dec 15 09:31 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk | The IPKat: Merpel pays a brief visit to Eponia [ http://ur1.ca/ocgjv ] | Dec 15 09:31 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 09:31 |
| schestowitz | Can someone here answer the following questions? I am thinking about applying for an examiner post. Someone from inside told me I won't be able to work for 2 years after leaving the office. Is that true? How can the office impose that outside of Germany if I want to work as an attorney in Spain, for example? Can they force an attorney to fire me? | Dec 15 09:31 |
| schestowitz | The same person said that there are plans to lower pensions. What recourse do I have if the office refuses to pay pensions in the future or pays me less than originally agreed? | Dec 15 09:31 |
| schestowitz | A future examiner. | Dec 15 09:31 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 09:31 |
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| MinceR | schestowitz: (re tweet pic) nice | Dec 15 11:51 |
| schestowitz | I'll remember that one | Dec 15 12:25 |
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| schestowitz | http://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2015/12/merpel-pays-brief-visit-to-eponia.html?showComment=1450189384878#c7205125002494255825 | Dec 15 12:35 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ipkitten.blogspot.com | The IPKat: Merpel pays a brief visit to Eponia [ http://ur1.ca/ocgv2 ] | Dec 15 12:35 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 12:35 |
| schestowitz | MaxDrei, | Dec 15 12:35 |
| schestowitz | Perhaps inadvertently, you raise a critical question when dealing with Trans-national entities. | Dec 15 12:35 |
| schestowitz | To whom - if anyone at all - (and to what level) are "whatever" traditions and vows even amenable? | Dec 15 12:35 |
| schestowitz | As I often point out in your dabblings into the US patent environment, patent law is intrinsically law meant to be within a sovereign. Here in the US, we simply do not have the same EPOnia aspect that you all have. Your problem then with its leadership cannot have a solution that EITHER follows any US solution, NOR can look to the traditional within-sovereign "respect" factors (in truth, you just do not have any that apply, and even if you | Dec 15 12:35 |
| schestowitz | adopt them, to whom would you apply them to?) | Dec 15 12:35 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 12:35 |
| schestowitz | " US anon, if you are a lawyer registerd to practise then you have Bar Rules of Conduct. Not following them leaves you vulnerable to being struck off. That you do not understand my post gives me the feeling that you are not subject to any Rules of Professional Conduct. You can't escape them just by boarding a flight to Munich." | Dec 15 12:36 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 12:36 |
| schestowitz | User circles' interest in the fate of the Boards seem to gain momentum | Dec 15 12:36 |
| schestowitz | http://eplaw.org/epo-structural-reform-of-the-boards-of-appeal/ | Dec 15 12:36 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 12:36 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-eplaw.org | EPO – Structural Reform of the Boards of Appeal – EPLAW [ http://ur1.ca/ocgv5 ] | Dec 15 12:36 | |
| schestowitz | wow | Dec 15 12:39 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/676820276290654208 | Dec 15 12:45 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: Let's wish good luck to him, he's going to need it by the ton. And still it won't help him in the end. ;-) https://t.co/U2GjPNQPDG | Dec 15 12:45 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #EPO – Structural Reform of the Boards of Appeal https://t.co/sExqv8ey40 what a mess. #battistelli fights everyone. | Dec 15 12:45 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/MariusNestor/status/676820476358971393 https://twitter.com/MariusNestor/status/676821186647576576 | Dec 15 12:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MariusNestor: @schestowitz :) First one talks about upcoming things, 2nd one is about what was actually implemented in version 3.19.3 released yesterday. | Dec 15 12:49 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MariusNestor: @schestowitz Really? I see a lot people going "meah" when they hear about Enlightenment... Also, you're using KDE now :P | Dec 15 12:49 | |
| schestowitz | Not happily at all, 3 was great, 4 OK, 5? Don't get me started ;-) | Dec 15 12:49 |
| XRevan86 | > Enlightenment | Dec 15 12:49 |
| XRevan86 | meah | Dec 15 12:49 |
| schestowitz | why? | Dec 15 12:51 |
| schestowitz | with kde software | Dec 15 12:52 |
| XRevan86 | schestowitz: Enlightenment has a bad integration with Gtk and Qt. | Dec 15 12:53 |
| schestowitz | not all that bad | Dec 15 13:08 |
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| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6913525 | Dec 15 14:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: #battistelli "already burned his fingers badly with the TechRights affair... made it on to the pages of Private Eye" http://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2015/12/merpel-pays-brief-visit-to-eponia.html?showComment=1450175111498#c797513008796399089 | Dec 15 14:28 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> ipkitten.blogspot.com | The IPKat: Merpel pays a brief visit to Eponia | Dec 15 14:28 | |
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| schestowitz | hey | Dec 15 17:09 |
| schestowitz | the bots are down | Dec 15 17:09 |
| schestowitz | VPS has a disk issue | Dec 15 17:09 |
| schestowitz | tuxmachines bot will hopefully be back before xmas | Dec 15 17:09 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Twpalovi/status/676887255684882432 | Dec 15 17:15 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Twpalovi: @schestowitz @Control_Risks What is parallel construction? | Dec 15 17:15 | |
| schestowitz | Look it up. A probe with CRG involved alleges that Hardon spoke to @Fosspatents over #gmail - how would they know? CRG has ex-Stasi folks. | Dec 15 17:16 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/14/saudi-arabia-announces-military-alliance-terrorism | Dec 15 17:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theguardian.com | Saudi Arabia announces 34-state military alliance to fight terrorism | World news | The Guardian [ http://ur1.ca/ochge ] | Dec 15 17:49 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 17:49 |
| schestowitz | > older: | Dec 15 17:49 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 17:49 |
| schestowitz | > "defines terrorism as "calling for atheist thought in any form, or | Dec 15 17:49 |
| schestowitz | > calling into question the fundamentals of the Islamic religion" | Dec 15 17:49 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 17:49 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/saudi-arabia-declares-all-atheists-are-terrorists-in-new-law-to-crack-down-on-political-dissidents-9228389.html | Dec 15 17:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.independent.co.uk | Saudi Arabia declares all atheists are terrorists in new law to crack down on political dissidents | Middle East | News | The Independent [ http://ur1.ca/gyqai ] | Dec 15 17:49 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/caszwemer/status/676897486179606528 | Dec 15 17:54 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@caszwemer: @schestowitz indeed , my thoughs ! | Dec 15 17:54 | |
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| schestowitz | > "Note: For the purposes of this post, the term "use" refers to | Dec 16 04:00 |
| schestowitz | > including the project in your application." | Dec 16 04:00 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 16 04:00 |
| schestowitz | > x | Dec 16 04:00 |
| schestowitz | > https://www.nczonline.net/blog/2015/12/why-im-not-using-your-open-source-project/ | Dec 16 04:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://www.nczonline.net/blog/2015/12/why-im-not-using-your-open-source-project/ ) | Dec 16 04:00 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 16 04:00 |
| schestowitz | > Tries to smear GPL but otherwise has a few good points. | Dec 16 04:00 |
| <--pidgin_log has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Dec 16 04:09 | |
| schestowitz | http://ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/all-due-care-when-not-responsible-for.html?showComment=1450248031771 | Dec 16 04:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk | The IPKat: "All due care" when not responsible for renewals | Dec 16 04:41 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 16 04:41 |
| schestowitz | My point was that it was not a disciplinary case and therefore this question did not to have bee answered by this board. EPAs may use agencies, secretaried, Australian attorneys, Crocodile Dundee or other stuff, but they remain legally responsible for their supervision. The flx of money is of no importance of respective responsibltes. The applicant cannot relieve the rep. from a duty which is imposed on him by the EPC The applicant's order | Dec 16 04:41 |
| schestowitz | in this respect has no legal effect. | Dec 16 04:41 |
| schestowitz | What happened here, was that a mandatory legal consequence was not imposed because somebody not qualified and evidently unable to perform a quite simple duty with due care did a major mistake - after having received reminders to perform this duty | Dec 16 04:41 |
| schestowitz | If an EPA is told to do something - wrong - the one who told him is to face the consequences not the public having to face an illegal ressurection of an actually abondoned claim. Art. 22(5) EPC is only there to limit the negative effect in extremis, it is not to be misused for justifying the manifest abuse of procedure by the applicant and the board. | Dec 16 04:41 |
| schestowitz | Lets hope that this "decision" is not to set case law. | Dec 16 04:41 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 16 04:41 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/dravashishet/status/677056199330689024 | Dec 16 04:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@dravashishet: @schestowitz world bank know it tht Corrupt Indian politicians will grab this money and again send it to their banks for deposite as a black | Dec 16 04:41 | |
| schestowitz | http://ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/merpel-pays-brief-visit-to-eponia.html?showComment=1450229274645 | Dec 16 04:42 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk | The IPKat: Merpel pays a brief visit to Eponia [ http://ur1.ca/ociez ] | Dec 16 04:42 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | My point is that I don't need to prove anything. You quoted me: "If you want to make a serious accusation like corruption, it's your job to prove it's 20000 Euros, not mine to prove it's only a 50 Euro travel insurance policy." You've not answered that. | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | This is your accusation, not mine. If you and your fellow SUEPO supporters want to convince me and the rest of the world, where is your evidence? Why should we believe it otherwise? | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | I have examined the latest material you've now cited. Your argument seems to be "FOSS Patents says it, therefore it must be true." | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | OK, so I've read the FOSS Patents links given. Mr Mueller is quite clear. He is not offering any proof. He is merely repeating an allegation he heard in a speech by a SUEPO official at a demonstration in Munich. | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | So where is the evidence relied on by this SUEPO official? I've tried to search the SUEPO website, but I've not been able to find it. | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | Could it be that this SUEPO official merely read the ambiguous AC minutes, and ignored that travel insurance was a reasonable explanation? Surely there must be more than that, if he wanted to accuse corruption? So where is it? Otherwise that would be poor behaviour. | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | Right, Mr Mueller also notes that one of the disciplinary charges faced by Ms Hardon is that she allegedly contacted him personally and leaked the corruption allegation. He presents a believable case that she didn't. As described above, it was a public speech by a different SUEPO official. | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | Assuming that to be true, then I agree that making this particular charge against Ms Hardon is poor behaviour by the EPO management. (I cannot say anything about the other charges she faces. I can also imagine that the EPO management might have a better case against this other unidentified SUEPO official if not Ms Hardon.) | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | So where does all this lead? It merely brings me back to where I started. There seems to be poor behaviour on both sides. Both SUEPO and the EPO management are making accusations which, as far as I can tell, are not supported by evidence. | Dec 16 04:42 |
| schestowitz | ' | Dec 16 04:42 |
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| schestowitz | crawling techrights heavily at the moment: | Dec 16 06:25 |
| schestowitz | descr: Tages Anzeiger AG | Dec 16 06:25 |
| schestowitz | descr: Newpaper Publishing Company | Dec 16 06:25 |
| schestowitz | maybe researching for a story | Dec 16 06:25 |
| schestowitz | re EPO | Dec 16 06:25 |
| MinceR | http://asset-b.soupcdn.com/asset/14780/9376_bcc1.jpeg | Dec 16 06:54 |
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| schestowitz | lol, classy | Dec 16 07:11 |
| schestowitz | there's also the china ones | Dec 16 07:11 |
| schestowitz | showing sheer hypocrisy | Dec 16 07:11 |
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| schestowitz | lots of EPO articles today | Dec 16 17:58 |
| schestowitz | I keep trying to find the time to write the cancer story, but new docs keep being piled on me from different sources. Maybe it'll all be out and dealt with by year's end. | Dec 16 17:58 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Twpalovi/status/677275895376306177 | Dec 16 19:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Twpalovi: @schestowitz that is a strongly-worded reproach. Interesting. | Dec 16 19:01 | |
| schestowitz | another on the way | Dec 16 19:01 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/MariusNestor/status/677281673730465793 | Dec 16 19:20 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MariusNestor: @schestowitz Happy Birthday!!! :D | Dec 16 19:20 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/ppetrovdotnet/status/677453769886560256 | Dec 17 06:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@ppetrovdotnet: @schestowitz I learned about them yesterday :) as ridiculous as UEFI !!! | Dec 17 06:48 | |
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| cubexyz | what's ridiculous as UEFI? | Dec 17 08:17 |
| schestowitz | grub bug | Dec 17 08:24 |
| cubexyz | shows the importance of encryption | Dec 17 08:26 |
| schestowitz | if it works | Dec 17 08:27 |
| cubexyz | also if someone has physical access... :) | Dec 17 08:27 |
| cubexyz | sure, but one wouldn't just password grub | Dec 17 08:27 |
| cubexyz | there would be more layers of security if you were _really_ worried | Dec 17 08:27 |
| cubexyz | and your decrypted files would need to be shredded, not deleted | Dec 17 08:28 |
| cubexyz | password protected usb ports might be an idea as well | Dec 17 08:30 |
| schestowitz | y just usb? | Dec 17 08:49 |
| cubexyz | I was thinking along the lines of "if the computer reboots then don't boot from usb without a password" kind of thing | Dec 17 08:54 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, is there a bios that does that? | Dec 17 08:57 |
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| cubexyz | now that I think about it, I don't think chromebooks can boot from usb | Dec 17 08:58 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: You think about ARM or x86 Chromebooks? | Dec 17 09:01 |
| cubexyz | well mine is x86 | Dec 17 09:02 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: What's the drill on vanilla coreboot installation on Chromebooks? | Dec 17 09:02 |
| cubexyz | you have to use deveoper mode | Dec 17 09:03 |
| XRevan86 | This doesn't say much to me… | Dec 17 09:03 |
| cubexyz | I blogged a bit about it: | Dec 17 09:03 |
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| cubexyz | http://cubexyz.blogspot.ca/search?q=coreboot | Dec 17 09:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-cubexyz.blogspot.ca | Notes on Linux | Dec 17 09:04 | |
| cubexyz | also the folks in #coreboot are pretty helpful | Dec 17 09:04 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: So, you can use coreboot with tianocore (UEFI) or seabios (MBR) on Chromebooks if you have straight hands and enough time, right? | Dec 17 09:06 |
| XRevan86 | and thus to boot from USB | Dec 17 09:06 |
| cubexyz | pretty sure 2nd generation chromebook does not use UEFI | Dec 17 09:08 |
| cubexyz | it uses a combination of coreboot + U-Boot | Dec 17 09:09 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: coreboot piano | Dec 17 09:10 |
| cubexyz | I think ARM chromebook just uses U-boot on it's own | Dec 17 09:10 |
| XRevan86 | http://coreboot.org/Payloads#Tiano_Core | Dec 17 09:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.coreboot.org | Payloads - coreboot | Dec 17 09:11 | |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: The idea is to use TianoCore or SeaBIOS as a coreboot "payload". | Dec 17 09:11 |
| cubexyz | right, but was is the default off the shelf for chromebooks? | Dec 17 09:12 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: I'm pretty sure it's not. | Dec 17 09:12 |
| XRevan86 | But if third-party coreboot can be used on Chromebooks (whatever "Developer mode" is :)) then so is TianoCore/SeaBIOS. | Dec 17 09:13 |
| XRevan86 | although I suspect in reality it's probably harder than I think | Dec 17 09:13 |
| cubexyz | I think google should make chromebook-linux edition | Dec 17 09:14 |
| cubexyz | just grab the linux one, done | Dec 17 09:14 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Linux is pretty easy to load through U-Boot (naturally, as that's what U-Boot does) | Dec 17 09:15 |
| XRevan86 | but it would still be a one-OS laptop | Dec 17 09:15 |
| cubexyz | no AROS, FreeDOS, Plan 9 etc? | Dec 17 09:15 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Yes | Dec 17 09:15 |
| XRevan86 | chromebook-linux edition won't be a true solution then | Dec 17 09:16 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/mrjeremylcoope1/status/677490981239922688 | Dec 17 09:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mrjeremylcoope1: RT @schestowitz: How to make your Android awesome again https://t.co/QNjPwcGyIi #android #linux | Dec 17 09:16 | |
| cubexyz | we want chromebook-general purpose edition :) | Dec 17 09:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.androidpit.com | How to make your Android awesome again - AndroidPIT | Dec 17 09:16 | |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: I think better to say, general laptops with freakin' coreboot :). | Dec 17 09:16 |
| cubexyz | XRevan86, indeed | Dec 17 09:16 |
| cubexyz | that's what I want really | Dec 17 09:17 |
| cubexyz | also there's crouton, which I haven't tried yet | Dec 17 09:18 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: What I would do with a x86 Chromebooks is I'd kill ChromeOS completely and try to get coreboot with tianocore to work :) | Dec 17 09:20 |
| XRevan86 | and install $FAVOURITE_DISTRO | Dec 17 09:20 |
| XRevan86 | and probably replace drive with something bigger as chromebooks known to have as little space as possible | Dec 17 09:20 |
| cubexyz | I | Dec 17 09:21 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: some uefi systems cannot boot from USB until after they have access the EFI partition of the first harddrive for the same reason they cannot use usb keyboards and mice until them. No USB driver in flash firmware. | Dec 17 09:21 |
| cubexyz | I'm used to working in small spaces | Dec 17 09:21 |
| cubexyz | know how big a RK05 is? :) | Dec 17 09:21 |
| cubexyz | it's 2.5 megs | Dec 17 09:21 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: I have my pride :). | Dec 17 09:21 |
| cubexyz | you can have 8 drives though | Dec 17 09:22 |
| XRevan86 | "you dare to tell me how many Xonotic's I can install on my PC's!?" | Dec 17 09:22 |
| cubexyz | so 2.5 meg * 8 = 20 megs, that's pretty big for a 1974 OS :) | Dec 17 09:22 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Not a Chromebook case, right? :) | Dec 17 09:23 |
| XRevan86 | one can install emacs on it and be happy though | Dec 17 09:23 |
| cubexyz | vim :) | Dec 17 09:23 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: vim is just a text editor. | Dec 17 09:23 |
| XRevan86 | emacs is the universe | Dec 17 09:23 |
| cubexyz | I can't install emacs on Unix v5 | Dec 17 09:24 |
| cubexyz | em maybe | Dec 17 09:24 |
| XRevan86 | Just like Leechcraft | Dec 17 09:24 |
| cubexyz | actually I can't install vim or even vi either | Dec 17 09:24 |
| cubexyz | it's ed all the way | Dec 17 09:24 |
| cubexyz | in the old days we had multi-operating systems for PDP-11 | Dec 17 09:25 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: http://www.coreboot.org/GRUB2#Security GRUB2 in coreboot can be ass as it can be set only to load signed kernel adn will not load Windows. | Dec 17 09:25 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.coreboot.org | GRUB2 - coreboot | Dec 17 09:25 | |
| cubexyz | XRevan86, on PDP-11 I think there was _more_ choices for OS than now :) | Dec 17 09:26 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, we can roll our own | Dec 17 09:27 |
| cubexyz | I've had several years of working with Unix v5 now | Dec 17 09:29 |
| oiaohm | The issue these days is the stuplity written 256 bit signing keys into fluses in intel chipsets. | Dec 17 09:29 |
| oiaohm | That is small enough first quantuim chip it going to be able to reverse it. | Dec 17 09:29 |
| cubexyz | interesting thing about the transition to v6... ed was re-written in C language | Dec 17 09:30 |
| cubexyz | now the question is... would the v6 ed compile on v5 | Dec 17 09:32 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, you know, I don't even want signing keys | Dec 17 09:33 |
| cubexyz | I just want something I can experiment with | Dec 17 09:33 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: from the securtiy attacks that have been documented I do want signing keys but I want them like chromebooks devices in a flash chip with a physical write protect switch so I can set my own. Not set in fuses. | Dec 17 09:34 |
| cubexyz | I want to run AROS, Plan 9 and oddball stuff sometimes | Dec 17 09:34 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: If you can physically set your own your can still experment with the hardware. | Dec 17 09:35 |
| oiaohm | And lock anyone else out from doing the same behind your back. | Dec 17 09:35 |
| MinceR | 145823 < cubexyz> now that I think about it, I don't think chromebooks can boot from usb | Dec 17 09:38 |
| MinceR | i'm pretty sure at least one can | Dec 17 09:39 |
| MinceR | though probably only in developer mode | Dec 17 09:39 |
| cubexyz | wow, it compiled | Dec 17 09:40 |
| cubexyz | only 2k bigger than assembled ed :) | Dec 17 09:41 |
| MinceR | why bother with tianocore on a chromebook at all? | Dec 17 09:41 |
| MinceR | i'm pretty sure you can load anything sane without it | Dec 17 09:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: all chromebooks can be made boot from USB depend on model how many miles of hell you have to go through. http://www.pcworld.com/article/2873561/google-just-made-it-easier-to-run-linux-on-your-chromebook.html newer chromebooks it developer mode. | Dec 17 09:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pcworld.com | Google just made it easier to run Linux on your Chromebook | PCWorld [ http://ur1.ca/jix82 ] | Dec 17 09:41 | |
| cubexyz | MinceR, I was thinking the same thing | Dec 17 09:41 |
| MinceR | you don't want to put winblows on it, do you? :> | Dec 17 09:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: older chromebooks it is find the physicalal firmware protection switch and replace the firmware. | Dec 17 09:42 |
| MinceR | i think it was the asus flip i read instructions on how to boot from sd or usb on | Dec 17 09:42 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: It's just that booting from USB from plain GRUB for instance is… complicated. | Dec 17 09:43 |
| MinceR | http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv7/rockchip/asus-chromebook-flip-c100p | Dec 17 09:43 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-archlinuxarm.org | Asus Chromebook Flip C100P | Arch Linux ARM [ http://ur1.ca/ocl62 ] | Dec 17 09:43 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: those commands for the flip is chromebook standard for 2015 versions. crossystem dev_boot_usb=1 dev_boot_signed_only=0 Yep turn boot signing checking off. Leave internal bios signing checking on. | Dec 17 09:46 |
| MinceR | https://twitter.com/AdamBaldwin/status/677252678162878464/photo/1 | Dec 17 09:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AdamBaldwin: Anatomy of a Twitter lockout/reinstatement: https://t.co/NjWOtapiE8 | Dec 17 09:48 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AdamBaldwin: Anatomy of a Twitter lockout/reinstatement: https://t.co/NjWOtapiE8 | Dec 17 09:48 | |
| oiaohm | http://www.intelsecurity.com/advanced-threat-research/content/AttackingAndDefendingBIOS-RECon2015.pdf The on going list of EFI faults with security. Please note old BIOS had equally huge list of faults just no one talked about it. | Dec 17 09:49 |
| oiaohm | XRevan86: define plain GRUB instance. GRUB instance in Coreboot can ad extra issues to booting from a USB stick. | Dec 17 09:50 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: oh | Dec 17 09:50 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: Then it's only a problem of my coreboot ignorance :). | Dec 17 09:50 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: the difference is, the overwhelming majority of old BIOS did not use (nonexistent) security as an excuse for locking people out of sane and secure OS-es | Dec 17 09:51 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: also, back then people understood that you can't have IT security without physical security -- if someone has physical access to the computer, they can do anything | Dec 17 09:52 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: what you don't understand is even having physical access does not mean you can do anything. | Dec 17 09:52 |
| MinceR | but since propping up DRM and locking people into winblows requires something more evil and broken than BIOS, suddenly all this security theater arises to provide excuses for that | Dec 17 09:52 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: oh? what prevents me from taking components out, grinding chips down to access their internal state, etc.? | Dec 17 09:53 |
| oiaohm | If intel was to embed all the core in a SOC chip and use lot of rom and a little bit of thermite protection. | Dec 17 09:53 |
| oiaohm | You are screwed. | Dec 17 09:53 |
| oiaohm | Basically you can make silcon chips that you cannot grind into. | Dec 17 09:53 |
| MinceR | they'll never do that | Dec 17 09:53 |
| MinceR | they didn't even care to make TPMs tamper-resistant, only tamper-evident | Dec 17 09:54 |
| MinceR | which isn't worth dhit | Dec 17 09:54 |
| MinceR | s/dh/sh/ | Dec 17 09:54 |
| MinceR | and their _only_ excuse for the TPM was "security" | Dec 17 09:54 |
| oiaohm | For high security devices intel does make self destructing chips. | Dec 17 09:54 |
| MinceR | not on any commodity devices, though | Dec 17 09:54 |
| oiaohm | Just they currenty charge a massive extra for them. | Dec 17 09:54 |
| MinceR | and uefi is aimed at turning commodity computers into dumb, unusable, insecure appliances | Dec 17 09:54 |
| MinceR | if they won't protect your keys in the TPM, what makes you think they'll protect anything at all? | Dec 17 09:55 |
| oiaohm | You can by tamper-resistant TPM chips. | Dec 17 09:55 |
| oiaohm | But they are 200 dollars a pop. | Dec 17 09:55 |
| MinceR | and yet i'm forced to pay for useless TPM chips instead. | Dec 17 09:56 |
| MinceR | the reason is that security was never the goal | Dec 17 09:56 |
| MinceR | DRM and compromising users' computers was | Dec 17 09:56 |
| oiaohm | TPM chips first started as means to protect server intergerity. DRM over took it latter. | Dec 17 09:57 |
| MinceR | afaik TC started off as giving m$ root on every PC | Dec 17 09:58 |
| MinceR | then it got mellowed into this DRM bullshit with remote attestation | Dec 17 09:58 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, not _my_ PC :) | Dec 17 09:58 |
| MinceR | they haven't given up on root on every pc, though | Dec 17 09:58 |
| oiaohm | TPM first appears as a fpga reference design MinceR | Dec 17 09:58 |
| MinceR | as uefi and vista10 show | Dec 17 09:58 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: first software to operate TPM was Linux. | Dec 17 09:58 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: it was originally called Palladium and TCPA | Dec 17 09:58 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: wrong. | Dec 17 10:01 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: first name is the Fritz-Chip | Dec 17 10:02 |
| MinceR | is that like clipper? :> | Dec 17 10:02 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the first TPM is designed by IBM to secure signing keys in ways that a breached OS. | Dec 17 10:02 |
| oiaohm | So that a breach OS could not have stolen you access keys. | Dec 17 10:03 |
| oiaohm | IBM is the one that designed the first TPM in the from of the Fritz-Chip | Dec 17 10:03 |
| MinceR | when was that? | Dec 17 10:04 |
| oiaohm | Opps wrong first OS is AIX. | Dec 17 10:05 |
| MinceR | http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/tcpa-faq-0.2.html | Dec 17 10:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.cl.cam.ac.uk | TCPA / Palladium FAQ [ http://ur1.ca/ocl72 ] | Dec 17 10:05 | |
| MinceR | 9. Why call the monitor chip a `Fritz' chip? | Dec 17 10:05 |
| MinceR | In honour of Senator Fritz Hollings of South Carolina, who is working tirelessly in Congress to make TCPA a mandatory part of all consumer electronics. | Dec 17 10:05 |
| MinceR | not a shred of benevolence here | Dec 17 10:05 |
| cubexyz | how is he going to do that? | Dec 17 10:06 |
| cubexyz | one guy from the US can't do that | Dec 17 10:06 |
| MinceR | the corporate corruptors behind one guy can, though | Dec 17 10:07 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: 7. Where did the idea come from? in that page. | Dec 17 10:09 |
| MinceR | ic | Dec 17 10:09 |
| MinceR | well, at least that "reference monitor" was responsible to the owner/users, not to corrupt megacorporations | Dec 17 10:10 |
| oiaohm | TPM idea implemented how orginally planned is good for users security and privacy. What mega corporations have wanted todo with it really not good for end user. | Dec 17 10:11 |
| MinceR | except for how m$ originally planned it | Dec 17 10:11 |
| oiaohm | Microsoft did not know about it until after its presentation at the 1997 IEEE Symposium on Security and Privacy | Dec 17 10:12 |
| oiaohm | Microsoft is one of the mega corporations to see the tech and go hey lets abuse that. | Dec 17 10:12 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the road to disaster is paved with good intentions. | Dec 17 10:14 |
| cubexyz | mass exodus from Microsoft to something else... | Dec 17 10:14 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: especially if it's m$ at the helm | Dec 17 10:16 |
| oiaohm | TPM implemented as per the 1997 objective to allow users to protect their data from outside parties is fine. The reason why TPM is open to so many Physical attacks is it was not designed to resist physical attacks. | Dec 17 10:16 |
| MinceR | oh wait, they don't have any of those | Dec 17 10:16 |
| MinceR | they don't have a single intention that's not evil | Dec 17 10:16 |
| cubexyz | "good intentions"? :) | Dec 17 10:16 |
| MinceR | yeah, those | Dec 17 10:16 |
| abeNd-org | MinceR: oh come on now, MS has plenty of incompetent intentions that arent evil | Dec 17 10:17 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: so, basically, you're proposing to protect against physical attacks with something that was not designed to resist them | Dec 17 10:17 |
| MinceR | abeNd-org: i didn't think incompetence was a matter of intention :) | Dec 17 10:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: if a TPM was designed to resist physical attacks it would mandate selfdestruction. | Dec 17 10:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: if someone was attempting physical. | Dec 17 10:18 |
| MinceR | indeed | Dec 17 10:18 |
| oiaohm | Now a proper DRM chip you would expect self destruction. | Dec 17 10:18 |
| oiaohm | Problem here before TPM media companies had been proposing DRM chips and running into fact that no one wantted to make them. | Dec 17 10:19 |
| oiaohm | So media companies + Microsoft has attempt to high jack the TPM to get what they want. | Dec 17 10:19 |
| MinceR | another problem is that m$ and intel didn't want to admit that Treacherous Computing was primarily about DRM | Dec 17 10:20 |
| MinceR | and so we have people going around talking about how TC is so great for security | Dec 17 10:20 |
| oiaohm | To be truthful Intel had not intented TPM for DRM. When they found out the DRM usage idea they end the idea of the TPM chip ever been embeded in the CPU. | Dec 17 10:20 |
| oiaohm | 1997 Intel thought TPM in CPU would be a great idea. By 1998 after seeing Microsoft idea they scrapped that. | Dec 17 10:21 |
| MinceR | it seems to me that just as with uefi, intel was just a puppet of m$, nothing more | Dec 17 10:21 |
| MinceR | what m$ wants, intel does | Dec 17 10:22 |
| MinceR | tpm in cpu without tamper protection would have been just as worthless for security | Dec 17 10:22 |
| oiaohm | If Intel did what MS wants the TPM chip would be in the CPU not independant chips. | Dec 17 10:22 |
| MinceR | plus it would have cost more | Dec 17 10:22 |
| MinceR | which apparently always trumps doing what they otherwise wanted to do | Dec 17 10:22 |
| oiaohm | For protection from remote access attacks tpm without local tamper protection is fine. | Dec 17 10:22 |
| cubexyz | does microsoft really have that much clout? | Dec 17 10:22 |
| MinceR | apparently they do | Dec 17 10:23 |
| cubexyz | Intel is pretty big themselves | Dec 17 10:23 |
| oiaohm | and if you read the 1997 document that is what TPM chip wa meant to do. | Dec 17 10:23 |
| MinceR | they've managed to push uefi through | Dec 17 10:23 |
| MinceR | and pretty much all business-oriented PCs come tied with a TPM | Dec 17 10:23 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: you mean that's what their excuse for it was | Dec 17 10:23 |
| oiaohm | Not excuse. | Dec 17 10:23 |
| MinceR | you need to get used to m$ and their bootlickers lying all the time | Dec 17 10:23 |
| oiaohm | Intel has not been 100 percent playing along with Microsoft. | Dec 17 10:23 |
| oiaohm | Intel has its objectives and Microsoft has its objectives. Where they cross it gets horible. | Dec 17 10:24 |
| MinceR | they played along more than enough to destroy IT | Dec 17 10:25 |
| oiaohm | Like the Microsoft idea to store malware id information in the TPM chip. | Dec 17 10:25 |
| oiaohm | That is not what the TPM was intetend for. | Dec 17 10:25 |
| MinceR | i don't see what's that even useful for | Dec 17 10:25 |
| MinceR | unless the malware is a m$ product | Dec 17 10:25 |
| MinceR | like winblows | Dec 17 10:25 |
| MinceR | or whatever they got when they bought claria/gator | Dec 17 10:25 |
| oiaohm | TPM chip was intended to be a whitelist system not a blacklist one. | Dec 17 10:26 |
| oiaohm | Yet here is windows 10 using it as a blacklist system. | Dec 17 10:26 |
| MinceR | more like somebody claimed the TPM was intended to be a whitelist system | Dec 17 10:26 |
| MinceR | before they managed to cram it down on all our throats | Dec 17 10:27 |
| oiaohm | No the 1997 reference was whitelist. | Dec 17 10:27 |
| oiaohm | Whitelist is more of a prick to get past than blacklist. | Dec 17 10:27 |
| MinceR | remember, m$ and their allies always lie | Dec 17 10:27 |
| oiaohm | The 1997 TPM documents are not written by Microsoft allies but as a research project. | Dec 17 10:27 |
| MinceR | if the public had known where all this TC/UEFI/intel boot guard/vista10/crApp Store bullshit is designed to lead, they would have nipped it in the bud | Dec 17 10:28 |
| cubexyz | is the TPM chip still a factor now, or...? | Dec 17 10:28 |
| MinceR | you're still forced to pay infineon for it if you pay any business pc/laptop | Dec 17 10:28 |
| MinceR | to reward them for their scheming | Dec 17 10:28 |
| MinceR | and iirc uefi uses it more | Dec 17 10:28 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: Windows 10 will start mandating TPM chips. | Dec 17 10:28 |
| MinceR | there you go | Dec 17 10:28 |
| MinceR | meanwhile, the usa and the eu goes around pretending they have antitrust and anti-monopoly controls | Dec 17 10:28 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: and due to abusing the living crap out of the TPM chip they will most likely fail early. | Dec 17 10:28 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, I don't think any of my computers has a TPM chip | Dec 17 10:29 |
| MinceR | i know two of mine has one | Dec 17 10:29 |
| MinceR | i did what i could to stop them from being a problem | Dec 17 10:29 |
| MinceR | s/has/have/ | Dec 17 10:30 |
| oiaohm | http://events.linuxfoundation.org/sites/events/files/slides/Integrity_Protection_LinuxCon_Japan_2014_v2.pdf | Dec 17 10:31 |
| oiaohm | TPM chips in Linux integrity protection are implemented 1997 style as a whitelist method. | Dec 17 10:31 |
| MinceR | which is irrelevant | Dec 17 10:31 |
| oiaohm | TPM chip are useful to Linux | Dec 17 10:31 |
| oiaohm | Now of course that TPM chip under owner of machines control. | Dec 17 10:32 |
| MinceR | if the TPM had a benign purpose, it would be tamper-protected, it would be fully optional, and it would not include the Endorsement Key. | Dec 17 10:32 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: and most motherboards TPM is removable. | Dec 17 10:32 |
| MinceR | also, the TPM chip most people end up with is useless | Dec 17 10:33 |
| oiaohm | Yes TPM by design is optional MinceR | Dec 17 10:33 |
| MinceR | except it isn't | Dec 17 10:33 |
| MinceR | you don't get to pick your laptops without it | Dec 17 10:33 |
| MinceR | you don't get to run vista10 without it | Dec 17 10:33 |
| MinceR | 163220 < MinceR> if the TPM had a benign purpose, it would be tamper-protected, it would be fully optional, and it would not include the Endorsement Key. | Dec 17 10:33 |
| oiaohm | Microsoft Windows 10 can run without TPM. | Dec 17 10:33 |
| MinceR | and even then it would be problematic for security | Dec 17 10:34 |
| oiaohm | Windows 11 I suspect will not be able to. | Dec 17 10:34 |
| MinceR | since its implementation of cryptographic algorithms is effectively a black box | Dec 17 10:34 |
| MinceR | in hardware | Dec 17 10:34 |
| MinceR | it's foolish to trust such implementations | Dec 17 10:34 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: to be truthful the Endorsement Key in most TPM chips is changable. | Dec 17 10:36 |
| MinceR | so what purpose does it serve then? | Dec 17 10:36 |
| oiaohm | Ok you cannot read the Endorsement Key back out the TPM but you can send a new one in. | Dec 17 10:36 |
| MinceR | other than that you can break DRM that relies on it | Dec 17 10:37 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: TPM for DRM is a house of cards. | Dec 17 10:46 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: http://wiki.xenproject.org/wiki/Virtual_Trusted_Platform_Module_%28vTPM%29 | Dec 17 10:46 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-wiki.xenproject.org | Virtual Trusted Platform Module (vTPM) - Xen [ http://ur1.ca/ocl9o ] | Dec 17 10:46 | |
| MinceR | obviously | Dec 17 10:46 |
| oiaohm | qemu and xen and vmware all can run virtual TPM in software. | Dec 17 10:46 |
| MinceR | m$, intel and crApple are taking IT to a point where DRM might work, though | Dec 17 10:46 |
| oiaohm | So a TPM can be man in middle attacked if end users chooses to. | Dec 17 10:46 |
| MinceR | the death of the general purpose computer | Dec 17 10:46 |
| MinceR | and megacorporate/government controlled web clients for the user/slaves | Dec 17 10:47 |
| oiaohm | Intel was the first developer of a virtual software TPM. | Dec 17 10:47 |
| MinceR | intel was also the main company that gave its name for TC and UEFI. | Dec 17 10:47 |
| MinceR | (even despite the obvious m$ infestation in UEFI: PE, FAT, CAB) | Dec 17 10:47 |
| MinceR | and of course once you don't have root on your "PC" but only m$/us government does, you won't be able to run the VTPM | Dec 17 10:48 |
| oiaohm | Really Microsoft has dragged it feet on UEFI even that it contains all those parts you have listeed. | Dec 17 10:48 |
| MinceR | or QEMU, or Xen | Dec 17 10:48 |
| MinceR | oh, i'm sure they've kept up the charade | Dec 17 10:49 |
| oiaohm | Wrong point of view. | Dec 17 10:49 |
| MinceR | and yet they've been requiring it for some time | Dec 17 10:49 |
| MinceR | with Restricted Boot | Dec 17 10:49 |
| oiaohm | Intel objective is to move hardware. | Dec 17 10:49 |
| MinceR | which just happens to serve m$ interests | Dec 17 10:49 |
| MinceR | i'm sure this is all just a coincidence | Dec 17 10:49 |
| oiaohm | Not everything intel does like making TPM removable suites MS goals. | Dec 17 10:49 |
| MinceR | it seems to me that intel is not very competent when it comes to serving their own interests | Dec 17 10:50 |
| oiaohm | Intel and Microsoft being in alignment is nothing more than common interests. | Dec 17 10:50 |
| MinceR | they should have made themselves independent of m$ long ago | Dec 17 10:50 |
| MinceR | they should have diversified | Dec 17 10:50 |
| MinceR | yet here we are, with uefi, tc and intel boot guard | Dec 17 10:50 |
| MinceR | for some reason | Dec 17 10:50 |
| oiaohm | Intel is a lot more deverised. | Dec 17 10:50 |
| oiaohm | intel boot guard is about serving ODM interests not Microsoft ones. | Dec 17 10:51 |
| MinceR | yeah, pretending to obey the ODMs who do what m$ tells them to | Dec 17 10:51 |
| oiaohm | No | Dec 17 10:51 |
| MinceR | on pain of hiking winblows license prices | Dec 17 10:51 |
| oiaohm | ODM that make most motherboards don't buy Microsoft licenses. | Dec 17 10:51 |
| oiaohm | and boot guard was first made for the intel arm line of chips. | Dec 17 10:52 |
| MinceR | and how will their sales go if winblows refuses to run on their mainboards? | Dec 17 10:52 |
| oiaohm | That Microsoft never run on. | Dec 17 10:52 |
| MinceR | on arm chips, where m$ mandates restricted boot to be not disableable? | Dec 17 10:52 |
| MinceR | what a coincidence. | Dec 17 10:52 |
| oiaohm | Intel made arm chips for routers | Dec 17 10:52 |
| oiaohm | That is where boot guard comes form. | Dec 17 10:52 |
| MinceR | and look where it is now | Dec 17 10:53 |
| oiaohm | 256 bit signing key is old and out of date tech. | Dec 17 10:53 |
| MinceR | keeping coreboot out of the market by force | Dec 17 10:53 |
| oiaohm | Yep | Dec 17 10:53 |
| MinceR | intel/m$ never was good at security | Dec 17 10:53 |
| MinceR | despite all the marketing lies | Dec 17 10:53 |
| oiaohm | No you have something wrong. | Dec 17 10:53 |
| MinceR | they were good at corrupting and distorting markets though | Dec 17 10:53 |
| oiaohm | Keeping coreboot out is about ODM not Microsoft. | Dec 17 10:53 |
| oiaohm | And Intel. | Dec 17 10:53 |
| MinceR | i don't see how it would serve ODM interests to not be able to offer a more reliable, less bloated firmware | Dec 17 10:54 |
| MinceR | m$, on the other hand... | Dec 17 10:54 |
| oiaohm | Number 1 intel chips depend on microcode being loaded early to defined what features are usable. | Dec 17 10:54 |
| MinceR | uefi is the nail that keeps you from disinfecting the "PC" of winblows | Dec 17 10:54 |
| oiaohm | So loading the correct microcode into some I5 make them act like i7 | Dec 17 10:54 |
| oiaohm | Of course if people can buy i5 and use them as i7 that not good for intel bottom line right MinceR | Dec 17 10:55 |
| MinceR | yes, once again it's the customer that gets screwed | Dec 17 10:55 |
| oiaohm | You would call that intel Motovation alone right. | Dec 17 10:55 |
| MinceR | people at intel are so incompetent they can't fix this without intel boot guard? | Dec 17 10:56 |
| -->jgay (~jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 10:56 | |
| oiaohm | Now ODM making motherboards may make 2 indetical boards 1 for games with overclocking and one for business without and charge 2 different prices. Again difference is load firmware. Of course user being able to load own firmware means they can use what ever one is cheaper. | Dec 17 10:57 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: basically Microsoft is not the only problem here. ODM's and Intel have reasons to screw end users over. | Dec 17 10:58 |
| MinceR | and they're working together to this end | Dec 17 10:59 |
| oiaohm | I would not say working together either. | Dec 17 11:00 |
| oiaohm | You see ODM and Intel do stuff that goes against Microsoft objectives. | Dec 17 11:01 |
| oiaohm | Problem is ODMs, Intel and Microsoft objectives align to a point and most of that is not in the consumers best interest. | Dec 17 11:02 |
| oiaohm | The other one is microcode for intel cpus is why even if a INTEL cpu socket is the same you cannot use newer CPU in a lot of older motherboards. No microcode no cpu start. | Dec 17 11:03 |
| MinceR | they're working together sufficiently to foist uefi, ibg and tc on the users | Dec 17 11:03 |
| MinceR | and of course winblows | Dec 17 11:03 |
| MinceR | with its increasing malware-y/botnetty tendencies | Dec 17 11:03 |
| MinceR | and increasingly closed platform | Dec 17 11:03 |
| oiaohm | Even in UEFI like putting time limit on how long a PK can last. That was an intel idea. Of course for Microsoft objective PK with a never time out value would be ideal. | Dec 17 11:04 |
| <--jgay has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) | Dec 17 11:09 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: selling two identical products with minor modifications for two different Prices is not Just a intel thing. Most evil example energizer and eveready. Yes 2 alkaline batteries on shelf from same company different packaging 2 different prices. | Dec 17 11:21 |
| MinceR | that's just a branding difference | Dec 17 11:22 |
| MinceR | doesn't require making the product screw its user | Dec 17 11:22 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: its a little bit more than that. | Dec 17 11:25 |
| -->jgay (~jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 11:26 | |
| oiaohm | Energizer one that is the more expensive one has for use in smoke detectors on it even that there is techically no difference to the eveready one. | Dec 17 11:26 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: yes its purely to screw the buyer over. | Dec 17 11:26 |
| MinceR | yet both will provide power for any compatible device | Dec 17 11:27 |
| oiaohm | Yes both will function absolutely identical in any device they are put in. | Dec 17 11:28 |
| MinceR | unlike uefi, which increasingly tries to prevent you from booting any OS other than macos or winblows | Dec 17 11:28 |
| MinceR | and ibg, which prevents you from using coreboot or libreboot | Dec 17 11:29 |
| oiaohm | To be correct UEFI on most motherboard removing the PK and KEKs its really easy to end up unable to boot Windows. | Dec 17 11:29 |
| <--jgay has quit (Client Quit) | Dec 17 11:29 | |
| MinceR | or tc, which was intended to force you to prove you're running the exact binaries the other side wants | Dec 17 11:29 |
| MinceR | well, even without uefi, it's easy to end up being unable to boot winblows | Dec 17 11:29 |
| MinceR | as winblows is a fragile piece of shit | Dec 17 11:29 |
| oiaohm | UEFI PK/KEK reset and Microsoft making Windows depend on signed booting is making it even more fragile. | Dec 17 11:30 |
| oiaohm | Intel and ODM added the PK/KEK reset. | Dec 17 11:30 |
| cubexyz | ho ho ho... shrinking christmas treats: | Dec 17 11:30 |
| -->jgay (~jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 11:31 | |
| cubexyz | http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/nestl-hits-back-claims-quality-7025949 | Dec 17 11:31 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.mirror.co.uk | Nestlé hits back at claims Quality Street Christmas boxes have shrunk over the years - Mirror Online | Dec 17 11:31 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: Intel and ODM are not doing things the way Microsoft would have liked. | Dec 17 11:31 |
| MinceR | and intel, m$ and crApple are not doing things the way any independent IT professional would have liked | Dec 17 11:31 |
| oiaohm | I will give you I don't like everything intel is doing. | Dec 17 11:32 |
| oiaohm | ibg stuff is bad. | Dec 17 11:32 |
| oiaohm | Worse ibg is old obsolote design. Really who thinks in this day and age a 256 bit pgp setup is good enough. | Dec 17 11:33 |
| oiaohm | Like you would have wanted at least 4096 bit pgp with the fact that quatuim processes are not that far off. | Dec 17 11:33 |
| MinceR | they would have done that, if security was the objective | Dec 17 11:35 |
| MinceR | but it isn't | Dec 17 11:35 |
| MinceR | it's the excuse | Dec 17 11:35 |
| MinceR | the objective is to take all power away from the public | Dec 17 11:35 |
| oiaohm | Intel and ODM have cost saving as a factor. | Dec 17 11:40 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: larger PGP processing equals more silcon required for it. | Dec 17 11:40 |
| MinceR | will merging these megacorporations and the governments save costs? :> | Dec 17 11:40 |
| MinceR | or just disposing of governments and have megacorporations run the planet | Dec 17 11:40 |
| oiaohm | Its like HP argueing for only 1 PK and only 1 KEK slot. | Dec 17 11:41 |
| oiaohm | Because that would save flash space. | Dec 17 11:41 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: can you have security without enough silicon for what security needs? | Dec 17 11:41 |
| oiaohm | That is the insanity MinceR | Dec 17 11:41 |
| oiaohm | ODM and Intel cost cutting makes the implemtned security flawed. | Dec 17 11:42 |
| oiaohm | Its like firmware write protect jumpers that added an extra 0.4 cents per board. | Dec 17 11:43 |
| MinceR | so, if security is the objective, can you afford to use less silicon than you need? | Dec 17 11:45 |
| MinceR | it logically follows that security was not the objective. | Dec 17 11:47 |
| oiaohm | DRM was the objective security should also be in the objective. | Dec 17 11:48 |
| oiaohm | That is the problem this stuff starts not logically adding up very well. | Dec 17 11:49 |
| MinceR | DRM is unachievable as long as people have general purpose computers anyway | Dec 17 11:49 |
| oiaohm | Until you think maybe ODM and Intel want to do just enough to convice Microsoft and others they are making suitable products to move product. | Dec 17 11:50 |
| MinceR | so the aim to destroy general purpose computers follows naturally from DRM | Dec 17 11:50 |
| MinceR | hence, ibg, uefi, tc, vista10, app store-based platforms | Dec 17 11:50 |
| MinceR | "cloud" hype | Dec 17 11:50 |
| oiaohm | Problem here that is not matching what we are seeing in silcon. | Dec 17 11:50 |
| oiaohm | Like ibg being under quality. UEFI being key restable and tc being replacable modules. | Dec 17 11:51 |
| oiaohm | None of that adds up for a DRM game. | Dec 17 11:51 |
| oiaohm | Unless its deception to someone wanting a DRM game. | Dec 17 11:51 |
| MinceR | it has always been deception | Dec 17 11:52 |
| MinceR | DRM always screwed the typical consumer while not hindering the "pirate" | Dec 17 11:52 |
| oiaohm | Who is the deception against. | Dec 17 11:52 |
| MinceR | and of course it will still make it hell for most people to use a non-winblows, non-macos OS | Dec 17 11:52 |
| oiaohm | I suspect intel and ODM are doing deception to Microsoft. | Dec 17 11:52 |
| MinceR | that won't save us | Dec 17 11:52 |
| oiaohm | If intel and ODM are not working for Microsoft it just working out how to make it more profitable for Intel and ODM to work for us. | Dec 17 11:53 |
| oiaohm | So maybe it could save us MinceR | Dec 17 11:54 |
| MinceR | they're working more for m$ than for us | Dec 17 11:54 |
| oiaohm | No they are more working for themselves than Microsoft or us. | Dec 17 11:54 |
| oiaohm | If they were working for microsoft we would see items like PK and KEK not in nvram section of the firmware. | Dec 17 11:55 |
| oiaohm | Remember everything placed in the nvram section of a firmware image is intended to be replaceable by some means. | Dec 17 11:55 |
| MinceR | by the nsa | Dec 17 11:56 |
| MinceR | and by microsoft | Dec 17 11:56 |
| oiaohm | nvram is end user setting. | Dec 17 11:56 |
| MinceR | as long as the end-user is allowed to change it and the system won't refuse to implement the changes | Dec 17 11:57 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynmoody/status/677530972489965568 | Dec 17 12:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynmoody: @schestowitz great - I was looking for that... | Dec 17 12:00 | |
| schestowitz | context: https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/677527845879603200 | Dec 17 12:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @glynmoody Members of the EP Slam the EPO for Patent Maximalism That Led to Granting of Patents on Plants https://t.co/MLd8h1gqLr | Dec 17 12:00 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org | Members of the European Parliament Slam the EPO for Patent Maximalism That Led to Granting of Patents on Plants | Techrights | Dec 17 12:00 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: remember early UEFI the PK and KEK was not in the nvram. So this is a change you missed. Its very clear intel and ODM are not 100 percent working for Microsoft. Reason is greed ODM want to be able to sell boards to facebook, google and so on. | Dec 17 12:06 |
| MinceR | in the end they still do m$'s bidding | Dec 17 12:06 |
| MinceR | also note that i'm not facebook or google | Dec 17 12:06 |
| MinceR | i'm not even in the PRISM program | Dec 17 12:06 |
| oiaohm | Reality they are doing there own bidding | Dec 17 12:07 |
| MinceR | is that why with every successive version "PC"s make it harder to run any secure, reliable OS? | Dec 17 12:08 |
| MinceR | and require waiving ever more warranty? | Dec 17 12:09 |
| MinceR | and every time a new winblows version comes out, most users are even more exposed to malware and spying? | Dec 17 12:09 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: problem is PC has not be secure for a long time. BIOS breaching has been happening a lot. | Dec 17 12:28 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: problem is, all this crap does nothing to secure it any more than that | Dec 17 12:29 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: in fact, it does the opposite | Dec 17 12:29 |
| MinceR | but "security" is still a good excuse to get away with anything, apparently | Dec 17 12:29 |
| oiaohm | To be truthful at least with UEFI were are starting to see proper firmware state auditing tools made. | Dec 17 12:30 |
| MinceR | we're also starting to see alleged computers that take measures against obeying their owner | Dec 17 12:31 |
| oiaohm | Before UEFI there was no tools to run on a Machine to check that the BIOS had memory protection and other things set correctly. | Dec 17 12:31 |
| MinceR | and we're starting to see computers locked into winblows, which i hope you're not trying to claim is secure | Dec 17 12:31 |
| oiaohm | I don't see where you are getting locked into Windows. | Dec 17 12:31 |
| oiaohm | PK/KEK resetable. | Dec 17 12:31 |
| oiaohm | Reduced random power management crap. | Dec 17 12:32 |
| oiaohm | UEFI is in fact less boards locked to Windows only. | Dec 17 12:32 |
| MinceR | restricted boot was required to be included; the restricted boot option was already removed since | Dec 17 12:32 |
| MinceR | soon we'll see non-resetable PK/KEK | Dec 17 12:32 |
| MinceR | and once again the excuse will be "security" | Dec 17 12:33 |
| MinceR | and already it's a lot more difficult for the user to figure out how to install a real OS on a computer they've bought | Dec 17 12:33 |
| MinceR | on BIOS, you'd merely boot from a removable drive and it would work | Dec 17 12:33 |
| MinceR | now every UEFI setup has a different option in a different place on a different UI which must be changed | Dec 17 12:33 |
| MinceR | and the changes they must implement to get it to work are also getting more arcane | Dec 17 12:34 |
| oiaohm | Reality you skip over items. | Dec 17 12:34 |
| oiaohm | ACPI BIOS configured only for Windows do you forgot that MinceR | Dec 17 12:34 |
| oiaohm | Before signing motherboard that would not run Linux stable existed. | Dec 17 12:35 |
| oiaohm | Reality even with PK/KEK signing to get past you have more odds of a board being workable now than 2005 | Dec 17 12:35 |
| MinceR | i don't remember having issues due to ACPI | Dec 17 12:36 |
| MinceR | my distro installers booted regardless | Dec 17 12:36 |
| MinceR | and of course using the tried-and-true "boiling the frog" approach, by the time they'll lock the gates, there won't be any resistance left | Dec 17 12:37 |
| oiaohm | There is a huge stack of hack tables where the Linux kernel lies and pretends to be windows so ACPI does not cause it to fail. | Dec 17 12:37 |
| MinceR | you're already not resisting at all | Dec 17 12:37 |
| oiaohm | On older systems. | Dec 17 12:37 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly not resisting. | Dec 17 12:38 |
| oiaohm | I don't approve of not being able to replace firmware. | Dec 17 12:38 |
| oiaohm | I don't approve of bios protection signing keys being too weak. | Dec 17 12:39 |
| oiaohm | But I am realistic here. UEFI is cleaning up a lot of crap that has been let exist in BIOS for a long time. | Dec 17 12:39 |
| MinceR | and putting worse crap in its place | Dec 17 12:39 |
| oiaohm | So yes some of what UEFI is doing has to happen. | Dec 17 12:39 |
| MinceR | and mandating a lot more bloat | Dec 17 12:40 |
| MinceR | yes, humanity wants to abolish freedom, so that has to happen | Dec 17 12:40 |
| oiaohm | Your bloat arguement does not add up particular when you compare UEFI to coreboot. | Dec 17 12:40 |
| MinceR | humanity will not rest until it has built the perfect global fascist dystopia | Dec 17 12:40 |
| MinceR | oh really? | Dec 17 12:40 |
| oiaohm | coreboot secure uses larger signing and is bigger than UEFI. | Dec 17 12:41 |
| cubexyz | coreboot can fit into 256K :) | Dec 17 12:41 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: that is cut down. | Dec 17 12:41 |
| cubexyz | I've rolled it myself | Dec 17 12:41 |
| oiaohm | To what it can be. | Dec 17 12:41 |
| MinceR | afaik coreboot doesn't have to use this pointless security theater | Dec 17 12:41 |
| cubexyz | in fact there was still some room left over | Dec 17 12:42 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, my version doesn't | Dec 17 12:42 |
| cubexyz | you could cut it down to 128K without seabios | Dec 17 12:42 |
| cubexyz | but I need seabios for freedos | Dec 17 12:42 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: so basically "uefi is not bloated" because its "security" uses keys that are too small to be worth anything? :> | Dec 17 12:42 |
| MinceR | seabios is unneeded for gnu/linux, afaik | Dec 17 12:43 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, that's right | Dec 17 12:43 |
| MinceR | if you count seabios, you might as well use good old bios, before uefi | Dec 17 12:43 |
| oiaohm | udk2 the reference UEFI can be build without signing. Most compact version is 64kb. | Dec 17 12:43 |
| oiaohm | Yes coreboot is huge. | Dec 17 12:44 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, but if I use good old bios, most of the time I don't have source code | Dec 17 12:44 |
| oiaohm | UEFI full featured is also huge. | Dec 17 12:44 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/coreboot.rom | Dec 17 12:45 |
| cubexyz | check it out... 256K | Dec 17 12:45 |
| oiaohm | Exactly old bios we could not look at the source code so we had to trust it. | Dec 17 12:45 |
| oiaohm | We are now seeing more default firmware based on exposed source code so open to auditing. | Dec 17 12:45 |
| cubexyz | of course old bios was 128K in the past | Dec 17 12:45 |
| cubexyz | it got bigger over time | Dec 17 12:46 |
| MinceR | what use is looking at the source code if you have no assurance that the system you're using is actually built from those sources and if you can't rebuild and replace it? | Dec 17 12:46 |
| MinceR | what use is being able to fix holes in the source code if you can't share it with others? | Dec 17 12:46 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, I did build that one | Dec 17 12:46 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: not exact right. | Dec 17 12:46 |
| cubexyz | gcc was used | Dec 17 12:46 |
| MinceR | intel boot guard prevents exactly that | Dec 17 12:46 |
| cubexyz | now the leaked stuff is a different story | Dec 17 12:46 |
| cubexyz | I haven't been able to build that yet | Dec 17 12:47 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: https://wiki.debian.org/ReproducibleBuilds There is such thing as a Reproducible Build. | Dec 17 12:47 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://wiki.debian.org/ReproducibleBuilds ) | Dec 17 12:47 | |
| oiaohm | So if you can rebuild it you can confirm that it was built from X source code even if you cannot replace it. | Dec 17 12:47 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: What's that supposed to do with anything? | Dec 17 12:47 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: then you'll know that the hole you've found auditing the code is there, and you won't be able to fix it, ever | Dec 17 12:47 |
| MinceR | and you might not even be allowed to tell others about it | Dec 17 12:48 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: And magic signing? That unreproduce stuff. | Dec 17 12:48 |
| cubexyz | actually the coreboot folks encourage building from source | Dec 17 12:48 |
| cubexyz | they don't usually link to binary files | Dec 17 12:48 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: you just stated the real problem. | Dec 17 12:48 |
| oiaohm | The fact firmware is becoming more open source and more audited the means to replace it for security reasons is becoming more critical. | Dec 17 12:49 |
| MinceR | there are many real problems | Dec 17 12:49 |
| MinceR | and the powers that be work on making even more problems and solving none | Dec 17 12:49 |
| cubexyz | we got XT and AT BIOS source... then nothing for a long time after that | Dec 17 12:50 |
| oiaohm | XRevan86: Signing is conformable. Its design that way. Areas with signing can still be security checked. Confirming that something was built form X source code does not require checking signing that is not active code. | Dec 17 12:51 |
| oiaohm | Validating that something was built for X source code does not mandate requirement to replace it. | Dec 17 12:52 |
| oiaohm | Security is the reason why you need to be able to replace lots of stuff. | Dec 17 12:52 |
| cubexyz | we also like to know what are computers are doing | Dec 17 12:53 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: Xt and AT BIOS was only some rough reference. Each vendor of the XT and AT bios extended and modified the bugger. | Dec 17 12:53 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, I think there's a generic source listing that's easy to find | Dec 17 12:55 |
| cubexyz | what extensions did they make? | Dec 17 12:55 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: all kinds of strange things. Like some AT phoninix bios support putting up a pretend harddrive that was being served from a shared image in a custom network format. | Dec 17 12:57 |
| oiaohm | Yes I remember 286 running Windows 3.11 over network that way. | Dec 17 12:58 |
| oiaohm | Yes to be fun if you booted the machine from floppy drive the virtual network harddrive completley disappeared. | Dec 17 12:59 |
| cubexyz | I wonder how big the original BIOS was | Dec 17 13:00 |
| cubexyz | 8k? | Dec 17 13:00 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: smaller in fact. | Dec 17 13:01 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, if you want unbloated BIOS you want the original IBM PC :) | Dec 17 13:01 |
| oiaohm | 8k was the rom chip size. | Dec 17 13:01 |
| oiaohm | I think it was 7.5 | Dec 17 13:01 |
| MinceR | cubexyz: it's not the only option, afaik | Dec 17 13:02 |
| cubexyz | don't forget the BASIC rom | Dec 17 13:02 |
| oiaohm | If you download the ibm 8k image you will find it ends with a stack of zeros. | Dec 17 13:02 |
| cubexyz | probably another 8k | Dec 17 13:02 |
| cubexyz | I think there were some 8k BASICs | Dec 17 13:02 |
| oiaohm | Most clone bioses were larger than 8k | Dec 17 13:02 |
| cubexyz | yeah I remember 128k and 256k but I'm sure there were lots inbetween | Dec 17 13:04 |
| cubexyz | 64k, 32k probably | Dec 17 13:04 |
| oiaohm | Of cource the old IBM PC did not require microcode https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P6_%28microarchitecture%29 Basically since pent pro/pent II firmware images had to grow. | Dec 17 13:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | P6 (microarchitecture) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia | Dec 17 13:04 | |
| cubexyz | newer IBM AT BIOS had 101-keyboard support and 1.44 floppy support | Dec 17 13:05 |
| cubexyz | maybe two 32k ROM chips | Dec 17 13:06 |
| cubexyz | what is the standard keyboard now, 104 keys? | Dec 17 13:06 |
| MinceR | depends on the region | Dec 17 13:07 |
| MinceR | ISO layout tends to have an extra '<' (or whatever) key | Dec 17 13:08 |
| MinceR | japanese layouts tend to have some more extra keys | Dec 17 13:08 |
| oiaohm | https://books.google.com.au/books?id=hnvCf6WlcYcC&pg=PT433&lpg=PT433&dq=1992+AMI+ROM+size&source=bl&ots=CYQwdANqXt&sig=G5bl2IidqaUCBMZxy_KXOoLuEUg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj0vLKWvuPJAhXlIqYKHUa3AYgQ6AEISjAJ#v=onepage&q=1992%20AMI%20ROM%20size&f=false | Dec 17 13:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-books.google.com.au | PC Mag - Google Books | Dec 17 13:08 | |
| oiaohm | Good fun to see the 1992 price to replace a bios | Dec 17 13:09 |
| oiaohm | Yes to replace a bios back then was more than a cheep motherboard now. | Dec 17 13:09 |
| MinceR | and now you don't get to replace it | Dec 17 13:09 |
| MinceR | and soon you won't even get to replace the OS | Dec 17 13:10 |
| cubexyz | they did on the original Playstation :) | Dec 17 13:10 |
| cubexyz | upgraded for pirated game capability :) | Dec 17 13:10 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: even back in 1992 there were motherboard with signing checked embedded preventing bios replacement. | Dec 17 13:11 |
| oiaohm | So not being able to replace a bios is not exactly new. | Dec 17 13:11 |
| cubexyz | they only did a checksum though | Dec 17 13:11 |
| cubexyz | not too hard to figure out | Dec 17 13:11 |
| oiaohm | The first PGP signed bios is 1991 | Dec 17 13:11 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: was not popular the bugger took forever to boot. | Dec 17 13:12 |
| cubexyz | btw the Amiga 500 had a 512k rom | Dec 17 13:12 |
| cubexyz | and that was in 1987 | Dec 17 13:12 |
| cubexyz | bigger than I thought it would be | Dec 17 13:13 |
| oiaohm | x86 PC were really built on the cheap | Dec 17 13:13 |
| cubexyz | also the roms were really well documented on the amiga | Dec 17 13:14 |
| cubexyz | there was a huge book for it | Dec 17 13:14 |
| oiaohm | That is the thing we had huge ammount of time of underdocumented firmware. | Dec 17 13:15 |
| cubexyz | in fact it was 3 huge books | Dec 17 13:16 |
| oiaohm | exactly | Dec 17 13:17 |
| oiaohm | You might not have been able to change amiga 500 bios but you knew exactly what the beast was upto. | Dec 17 13:17 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, you could change it by replacing the chip | Dec 17 13:18 |
| cubexyz | 1.2 -> 1.3 -> 2.04 | Dec 17 13:18 |
| cubexyz | mine is still 1.3 rom | Dec 17 13:18 |
| oiaohm | I thought those were soldered on? | Dec 17 13:18 |
| cubexyz | nope | Dec 17 13:18 |
| cubexyz | socketed | Dec 17 13:18 |
| cubexyz | I upgraded mine from the original 1.2 | Dec 17 13:19 |
| oiaohm | Also those are roms not flash so secure from runtime alteration. | Dec 17 13:19 |
| cubexyz | yes :) | Dec 17 13:19 |
| oiaohm | level of means to replace alters security. | Dec 17 13:20 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/amiga-500-board.jpg | Dec 17 13:20 |
| cubexyz | see all the socketed chips? | Dec 17 13:21 |
| cubexyz | except for the ram at the bottom | Dec 17 13:21 |
| cubexyz | the rom chip is to the right of the 68000 cpu | Dec 17 13:22 |
| oiaohm | The problem with a flash firmware is it can be too simple to replace. | Dec 17 13:24 |
| MinceR | especially if switches or jumpers are too expensive to include | Dec 17 13:25 |
| cubexyz | doh | Dec 17 13:25 |
| MinceR | (because as we've seen before, no price is worth paying for security, even if we keep using "security" as the excuse for everything) | Dec 17 13:25 |
| cubexyz | yeah a jumper is so expensive :) | Dec 17 13:25 |
| cubexyz | there's lots of stupid stuff in the world | Dec 17 13:29 |
| cubexyz | I appreciate the old amiga more now | Dec 17 13:30 |
| <--liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) | Dec 17 13:30 | |
| MinceR | so do i | Dec 17 13:32 |
| MinceR | though i never had one :> | Dec 17 13:32 |
| oiaohm | Security is used as excuse. The effort you see hardware companies goto to save 0.4 cents is inane. | Dec 17 13:36 |
| MinceR | indeed | Dec 17 13:38 |
| oiaohm | Now of course some of the items they are attempting to fix should have been fixed years ago. | Dec 17 13:38 |
| oiaohm | Like means to overwrite bios at runtime causing all kinds of bad things to happen should have never been possible. | Dec 17 13:39 |
| oiaohm | asdasf hmm spell checker failed better restart program. | Dec 17 13:39 |
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| MinceR | lol | Dec 17 13:40 |
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| cubexyz | I think I understand Unix v5 better than I ever understood AmigaDOS | Dec 17 13:42 |
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| MinceR | is AMD doing anything like intel boot guard? | Dec 17 14:15 |
| cubexyz | AMD has DASH | Dec 17 14:23 |
| cubexyz | so there's a full TCP/IP stack in the BIOS or whatever they call it now | Dec 17 14:24 |
| cubexyz | there is some optional form of boot control but I don't know exactly how it works | Dec 17 14:25 |
| cubexyz | obviously it wouldn't be difficult for it to "ET phone home" | Dec 17 14:26 |
| MinceR | isn't DASH more of a parallel to IPMI? | Dec 17 14:30 |
| cubexyz | well intel boot guard is part of Intel VPro which is an example of IPMI | Dec 17 14:33 |
| cubexyz | so DASH probably has something like intel boot guard | Dec 17 14:33 |
| MinceR | ic | Dec 17 14:33 |
| MinceR | would be nice to know for certain | Dec 17 14:33 |
| cubexyz | I think actually most motherboards with AMD CPU support don't have DASH | Dec 17 14:35 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 17 14:35 |
| cubexyz | at least not the consumer ones | Dec 17 14:36 |
| MinceR | and also used to support coreboot, i wonder if that still stands | Dec 17 14:36 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Sheikh_al_Touar/status/677593378335432704 | Dec 17 15:58 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Sheikh_al_Touar: @schestowitz Happy B-Day! May all your wishes come true! Enjoy your time in the Pub 🍻🎈🎊🎉🎁🎈🎊🎉🎁 | Dec 17 15:58 | |
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| schestowitz | " | Dec 17 16:09 |
| schestowitz | Article 23 EPC | Dec 17 16:09 |
| schestowitz | Independence of the members of the Boards | Dec 17 16:09 |
| schestowitz | (1) | Dec 17 16:09 |
| schestowitz | The members of the Enlarged Board of Appeal and of the Boards of Appeal shall be appointed for a term of five years and may not be removed from office during this term | Dec 17 16:09 |
| schestowitz | I would read this provision as removal or measures having an effect equivalent to removal. | Dec 17 16:09 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 17 16:09 |
| schestowitz | https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=5574479&postID=5205293627419117961&isPopup=true | Dec 17 16:09 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.blogger.com | Blogger: The IPKat - Post a Comment | Dec 17 16:09 | |
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| MinceR | http://www.everyjoe.com/2015/12/17/news/yale-students-sign-petition-repeal-the-first-amendment/ | Dec 17 19:36 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.everyjoe.com | Yale Students Sign "Petition” to Repeal the First Amendment [ http://ur1.ca/ocm80 ] | Dec 17 19:36 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/AnarchistDalek/status/677783319082233856 | Dec 18 04:51 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AnarchistDalek: 😨😨😨😨😨 https://t.co/R1kqRefGK5 | Dec 18 04:51 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #UbuntuTouch OTA-9 for Ubuntu Phones Launches on January 20, 2016 https://t.co/W1wokqD1vm #linux #ubuntu | Dec 18 04:51 | |
| msb__ | cubexyz: Hello? | Dec 18 05:02 |
| cubexyz | msb__, hi | Dec 18 05:02 |
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| msb__ | Would you like to see a TV episode about a group of psychic investigators flying on a plane? Directed by Tobe Hooper. | Dec 18 05:03 |
| cubexyz | ok :) | Dec 18 05:04 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677793116557082624 | Dec 18 05:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @Laura_F_ERCOLI @Serv_Pubblico @POLITICOEurope https://t.co/pHptGrpodv | Dec 18 05:18 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #EPO charges a lot of money from applicants for many examiners to examine together, but still rushes process https://t.co/QzixviJ3E1 | Dec 18 05:18 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677793521152167936 | Dec 18 05:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @wallstreetita @ilgiornale @fattoquotidiano @POLITICOEurope @Laura_F_ERCOLI @reportrai3 @LaGabbiaTw @Serv_Pubblico https://t.co/0R9PC2DzK2 | Dec 18 05:18 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @FOSSpatents Admin Council Does Not Crush the Boards But Does Crush the Unions (Suspension Duration Sextupled) https://t.co/4GgHJqS7qJ | Dec 18 05:18 | |
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| schestowitz | "I strongly recommend that the people who cannot live with libsystemd0 | Dec 18 07:03 |
| schestowitz | installed on their systems leave Debian, because their life is going to | Dec 18 07:03 |
| schestowitz | suck more and more as we will integrate it in every important daemon | Dec 18 07:03 |
| schestowitz | after jessie will have been released." | Dec 18 07:03 |
| schestowitz | https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2015/02/msg00644.html | Dec 18 07:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2015/02/msg00644.html ) | Dec 18 07:03 | |
| cubexyz | you'll see an exodus to the BSDs if things don't improve, mark my words | Dec 18 07:11 |
| cubexyz | we'll see what happens with slackware | Dec 18 07:13 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz and schestowitz the issue is a little more complex. Packages linked against libsystemd0 are going to want something libsystemd0 so you cannot straight up delete it. systemd-shim of the past solution could be used where the libsystemd0 is no-oped in most places. | Dec 18 07:17 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/robcolbert/status/677824818197196800 | Dec 18 07:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@robcolbert: @schestowitz I didn't mean to usurp your hashtag, but since we're fighting the same battles I would like to learn more & we should talk. | Dec 18 07:18 | |
| schestowitz | Always happy to hear of any updates, news... | Dec 18 07:18 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/robcolbert/status/677824951546679297 | Dec 18 07:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@robcolbert: If you'd rather not be tracked by what frameworks and other centralized assets you access every single day online: https://t.co/4iwrwkd9en | Dec 18 07:18 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #Decentraleyes for Firefox loads CDN resources locally https://t.co/8ILQ3naAKN #mozilla #firefox #freesw | Dec 18 07:18 | |
| cubexyz | on q4os I only have libsystemd-login0... all other systemd files are gone | Dec 18 07:18 |
| cubexyz | so I'm tolerating that one part only | Dec 18 07:18 |
| cubexyz | and only on q4os... | Dec 18 07:19 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I guess libsystem0 is still on the system. | Dec 18 07:19 |
| oiaohm | Because libsystmd-login0 uses it. | Dec 18 07:19 |
| cubexyz | nope | Dec 18 07:20 |
| cubexyz | it only uses libsystemd-login.so.0 | Dec 18 07:20 |
| cubexyz | I know because I just checked it :) | Dec 18 07:20 |
| oiaohm | I forgot that got split off. | Dec 18 07:21 |
| oiaohm | systemd is internally getting split up more. | Dec 18 07:21 |
| oiaohm | Purely being stuborn on my part my old 500GB harddrive is down to less than 10 megs of sectors questiaonable on readable status. | Dec 18 07:23 |
| cubexyz | I do wonder what the heck happened to ttylinux though | Dec 18 07:28 |
| cubexyz | seems to have disappeared | Dec 18 07:29 |
| cubexyz | people get tired or disillusioned and then pack it in | Dec 18 07:29 |
| <--WeS has quit (Quit: Gtg See ya Later) | Dec 18 08:21 | |
| schestowitz | >> I've not had the time to cover it and I worry that covering this will | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | >> > amplify the MS PR. | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | > Agreed. | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | >> > I'd rather just write more articles about the tax | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | >> > evasion. When new information becomes available. | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | > It's the tax evasion that they are worried about, and don't want | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | > coverage of. I think it itself may be covering something big. | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | > Hopefully time and material will turn up in the next few weeks. I have | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | > noticed that M$ rarely does a distraction unless they have reason to. | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | > Given that the distraction is big, noisy, and expensive they must have | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | > something big to hide. As mentioned my very speculative guess is that | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | > they may be reaching the limit to solvency. | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | I'm very deep into EPO (buried in material right now), so if you keep an eye on MS and send me links, that'll ensure I can still post about the important things... | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | Expect some major EPO scandal to come up very soon... | Dec 18 08:26 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/mall_dweller/status/677842102378766336 | Dec 18 08:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mall_dweller: @schestowitz Waitwhut? You're saing EPO is ddossing your website? | Dec 18 08:30 | |
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| schestowitz | > Just in time for a new attack on RMS. Brian Lunduke managed to talk RMS into | Dec 18 11:03 |
| schestowitz | > an interview and the panelists now seem to be busy smearing and | Dec 18 11:03 |
| schestowitz | > misrepresenting him to puff themselves up. See, | Dec 18 11:03 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 11:03 |
| schestowitz | > Lunduke | Dec 18 11:03 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/u/0/+BryanLunduke/posts/CEsDETRJxge | Dec 18 11:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Video: The Need for Compromise in Free Software - With Richard Stallman. Huge… | Dec 18 11:03 | |
| schestowitz | > http://lunduke.com/2015/12/16/need-for-compromise-in-free-software-with-richard-stallman/ | Dec 18 11:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lunduke.com | [Bryan] Lunduke.com » Need for Compromise in Free Software – With Richard Stallman [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhg ] | Dec 18 11:03 | |
| schestowitz | > https://archive.org/details/CompromiseInFreeSoftware | Dec 18 11:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-archive.org | Compromise In Free Software : Bryan Lunduke : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhh ] | Dec 18 11:03 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 11:03 |
| schestowitz | > Seigo, who calls RMS a "Zealot" who does not care enough about free software | Dec 18 11:03 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/u/0/+AaronSeigo/posts/j6DG5ERzLmb | Dec 18 11:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Video: The Need for Compromise in Free Software - With Richard Stallman. Huge… [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhi ] | Dec 18 11:04 | |
| schestowitz | > https://exote.ch/blogs/aseigo/2015/12/16/server-software-matters/ | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 11:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-exote.ch | Server Software Matters | Dec 18 11:04 | |
| schestowitz | > Bhartiya who promotes Pixel C | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/+SwapnilBhartiya/posts/U72P8mr7mTf | Dec 18 11:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Video: The Need for Compromise in Free Software - With Richard Stallman. Huge… [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhl ] | Dec 18 11:04 | |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/+SwapnilBhartiya/posts/RW8dZ5bHb2j | Dec 18 11:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | After using the Pixel C I realised how much I missed the iPad AIR. iPad Pro is… [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhn ] | Dec 18 11:04 | |
| schestowitz | > and has been promoting ... Microsoft Word, Apple, and Suse, | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.swapnil.io/2015/12/16/microsoft-word-bring-odf-support-to-ios-beats-google-docs/ | Dec 18 11:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.swapnil.io | Microsoft Word brings ODF support to iOS, beats Google Docs | swapnil [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhp ] | Dec 18 11:04 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > there, now I don't have to keep those tabs open ... maybe I can forget the | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > whole thing. | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > I have not actually watched the video yet, but I'm not really happy with these | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > people. They have all been doing odd things to promote fog computing and | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > other things to help Microsoft and software owners. Swampnil's trajectory | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > has been particularly disappointing. Seigo has always said awful things | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > about the wrong people. I'm not really sure I want to even start looking at | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > it, because it will be a waste of time talking to these folks. | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > At the same time, I expect the themes to resonate across Microsoft troll media | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | > and the fauxpen source community. | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | You can challenge them online over it, but I don't want to bicker with them on these issues because it's a distraction of efforts (the real enemy is proprietary software) and I really want to focus on the EPO right now. | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | Seigo isn't all that bad and Swapnil is usually OK. I personally challenged Brian many times and he tried building bridges with them... | Dec 18 11:04 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/wowbagger999/status/662396878923964416?cn=ZmF2b3JpdGVfbWVudGlvbmVkX3VzZXI%3D&refsrc=email | Dec 18 11:06 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@wowbagger999: @glynmoody @schestowitz #TTIP #TPP & Co seem infected with some kind of #ACTA bachdoor. We should delete them and reboot our systems! | Dec 18 11:06 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/677788818276270080 | Dec 18 11:58 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Big Brother is born. And we find out 15 years too late to stop him https://t.co/2VA0ehcui4 "four million intercepted phone calls a year" | Dec 18 11:58 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.theregister.co.uk | Big Brother is born. And we find out 15 years too late to stop him • The Register | Dec 18 11:58 | |
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| MinceR | http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-12-17/battle-over-women-pop-star-sinks-deutsche-telekom-unit-contract | Dec 18 13:29 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.bloomberg.com | Battle Over Women, Pop Star Sinks Magyar Telekom Contract - Bloomberg Business [ http://ur1.ca/ocnok ] | Dec 18 13:29 | |
| schestowitz | got this today | Dec 18 13:46 |
| schestowitz | "Regards, and keep up the good work." | Dec 18 13:46 |
| schestowitz | EPO is in a bad state atm | Dec 18 13:46 |
| <--abeNd-org has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Dec 18 13:49 | |
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| schestowitz | > I think it's everytime I mention your name or link to a Techrights article. | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > The only thing I have bothered to document was two years ago, where he said | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > you were "full on dipshit tinfoil hat crazy" about Novel and Microsoft. | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/+AaronS eigo/posts/6gT9djuXEV4 | Dec 18 14:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Aaron's - Google+ | Dec 18 14:53 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > If you'd like I can do a little more searching to confirm or disprove my | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > opinion. | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > Strangely enough, I get a similar reaction from Lauren Weinstein about Richard | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > Stallman. | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > It's interesting how effective the strategy is. When you suspect something | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > wrong, you are dismissed as paranoid and ignorant. If you do the research | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > and it verifies what you thought, you are dismissed as unbalanced for having | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > cared enough to do the work. | Dec 18 14:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 14:54 |
| schestowitz | > The holidays are on, as usual, and time is tight. This is when all sorts of | Dec 18 14:54 |
| schestowitz | > rude things are rolled out. | Dec 18 14:54 |
| schestowitz | I sounds as though Seigo's remark was a one-off, which I guess is good news. I don't need enemies there; besides, Seigo did support my views on Novell in the past, despite his issues of loyalty and commitments. Also remember Kolab's connections to SUSE (Germany-Switzerland). He works for Kolab now. | Dec 18 14:54 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynmoody/status/677944390065737728 | Dec 18 15:39 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynmoody: @schestowitz "fact-tracking" -> "fast-tracking"? | Dec 18 15:39 | |
| schestowitz | ta | Dec 18 15:39 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/David_Vaporium/status/677940535559069697 | Dec 18 15:40 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@David_Vaporium: @schestowitz @tvlicensingblog If are charged - claim you true status as `the accused` never accept the term `defendant` BoP is c/o Accuser | Dec 18 15:40 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677940192448266240 | Dec 18 15:40 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz @FOSSpatents As long as he's the only one in the building I would not mind at all. | Dec 18 15:40 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/InlineQuickSort/status/677977097479053313 | Dec 18 17:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@InlineQuickSort: @schestowitz no direct role, just a school for high public officials. 80% of french politicians come from "l’ENA". | Dec 18 17:28 | |
| schestowitz | including battistelli | Dec 18 17:28 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/terencecallacha/status/677980805755465729 | Dec 18 17:40 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@terencecallacha: He needs to look after his farms so having advance notice of govt policy allows his to avoid problems like tax https://t.co/d9kGaE9OTN | Dec 18 17:40 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Revealed: Prince Charles has received confidential cabinet papers for decades https://t.co/VFGBiqXWkN #monarchy #uk | Dec 18 17:40 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/morvjn/status/677984402660397056 | Dec 18 17:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@morvjn: @schestowitz But i might not get my tablet... | Dec 18 17:53 | |
| schestowitz | I want a KDE3 tablet :-) | Dec 18 17:53 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/morvjn/status/677985443405672448 | Dec 18 17:55 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@morvjn: @schestowitz That's vaporware, isnt it? The Jolla tablet is real - or at least the first batch was :( | Dec 18 17:55 | |
| schestowitz | Yes, but Vivaldi was KDE4 | Dec 18 17:55 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677993675213901825 | Dec 18 18:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @InlineQuickSort @schestowitz Sounds like becoming prince by heritage. Is there any issue on transparency in accessing ENA education ? | Dec 18 18:30 | |
| schestowitz | hhmmm. site down? | Dec 18 18:42 |
| schestowitz | test: http://techrights.org | Dec 18 18:42 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Techrights | People's rights in the digital age | Plutocracy threatened by freedom, democracy, privacy & civil rights | Dec 18 18:42 | |
| schestowitz | just me then... | Dec 18 18:42 |
| schestowitz | probably blacklisted by fail2ban | Dec 18 18:42 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/InlineQuickSort/status/678003160074559489 | Dec 18 19:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@InlineQuickSort: @KrapulaPhD @schestowitz not really, it’s a difficult entrance exam with bachelor degree required (usually litterature). | Dec 18 19:05 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/InlineQuickSort/status/678004446991917056 | Dec 18 19:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@InlineQuickSort: @KrapulaPhD @schestowitz but mostly upper classes go to ENA and ENArques do not go systematically into politics. | Dec 18 19:11 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677795117781147648 | Dec 18 19:13 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: While we're talking democracy and state of rights.... Help yourselves. https://t.co/ObTb0zX6nY | Dec 18 19:13 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Big Brother is born. And we find out 15 years too late to stop him https://t.co/2VA0ehcui4 "four million intercepted phone calls a year" | Dec 18 19:13 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/hewiak/status/678006833232015360 | Dec 18 19:20 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@hewiak: @SciencePorn @schestowitz this may constitute proof of how #boring #engineers can be, and how #bored #scientists can be | Dec 18 19:20 | |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6919375 | Dec 18 19:29 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com reshared: Birds Linux 6.0 Hummingbird has been released! http://birdslinux.altervista.org/en/ #linux #birdslinux #education #scuola #istruzione #math #algebra #mywork #opensource #matematica #xfce #sabayon | Dec 18 19:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- Photo by birdslinux@pod.geraspora.de: https://pod.geraspora.de/uploads/images/thumb_medium_dcfe8b510445eafadb71.jpg | Dec 18 19:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- Photo by birdslinux@pod.geraspora.de: https://pod.geraspora.de/uploads/images/thumb_medium_dcfe8b510445eafadb71.jpg | Dec 18 19:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> birdslinux.altervista.org | Birds Linux | Dec 18 19:29 | |
| schestowitz | "Chrome? Non-free for default browser?" | Dec 18 19:29 |
| schestowitz | Strange that, yes.. | Dec 18 19:29 |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6915676 | Dec 18 19:30 |
| schestowitz | "Yes, the patents were technically from Xerox but they are now owned by a Microsoft affiliated troll and Microsoft was all over it. At the time, I remember Microsoft used all of their retail and hardware might to muscle out Palm by excluding them and by dumping cheaper Windows based PDAs. I also ran into a Palm user who complained that Microsoft people had unfairly run him out of the local computer club. This was at a time before Internet | Dec 18 19:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: How #HTC went from smartphone trailblazer to barely breathing http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/the-decline-and-fall-of-htc/ great devices, marketing too weak | Dec 18 19:30 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.digitaltrends.com | The Sad History of HTC's Epic Rise and Fall | Digital Trends [ http://ur1.ca/oco6j ] | Dec 18 19:30 | |
| schestowitz | for me when I was just starting to realize how evil Microsoft, so I don’t have useful links and in depth knowledge of it." | Dec 18 19:30 |
| schestowitz | Which Microsoft troll 'owns' these patents now? | Dec 18 19:30 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678163612779741184 | Dec 19 06:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz Much like debt collectors, buying old (often expired) debt claims to extort money to the unaware. Vultures. Parasites. Leeches. | Dec 19 06:04 | |
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| schestowitz | The Christmas market in #manchester esp. this year is better and bigger than ever before (keeps expanding each year) http://schestowitz.com/royrianne/gallery/index.php/Birthday-at-the-German-Market | Dec 19 09:46 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-schestowitz.com | Birthday at the German Market [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4k ] | Dec 19 09:46 | |
| cubexyz | more emails complaining about windows 10 | Dec 19 09:46 |
| schestowitz | where? | Dec 19 09:46 |
| schestowitz | Need to see, can use in article | Dec 19 09:46 |
| cubexyz | it's frustrating... I tell people not to use windows 10 and what do they do? Install windows 7 | Dec 19 09:46 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: also, (haven't looked at TR in awhile) did you cover CyanogenOS's inclusion of Cortana | Dec 19 09:47 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: also, CM13 nightly recently added an NTFS driver | Dec 19 09:47 |
| XFaCE | http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/123061/ | Dec 19 09:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-review.cyanogenmod.org | Gerrit Code Review [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4n ] | Dec 19 09:49 | |
| XFaCE | "sepolicy: Set the context for fsck.exfat/ntfs to fsck_exec" | Dec 19 09:49 |
| schestowitz | didn't see it | Dec 19 09:50 |
| schestowitz | is it in C-Mode? | Dec 19 09:50 |
| XFaCE | http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/122995/ | Dec 19 09:50 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-review.cyanogenmod.org | Gerrit Code Review [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4p ] | Dec 19 09:50 | |
| schestowitz | Or just Cyanogen Inc? | Dec 19 09:50 |
| XFaCE | "Native NTFS kernel driver support" | Dec 19 09:50 |
| XFaCE | this is CM13 | Dec 19 09:50 |
| schestowitz | I mean, upstream | Dec 19 09:50 |
| schestowitz | is it included in the core of CM? | Dec 19 09:50 |
| XFaCE | yes | Dec 19 09:50 |
| schestowitz | wow | Dec 19 09:50 |
| cubexyz | schestowitz, I'm asking for permission to use it as it's a private email | Dec 19 09:50 |
| schestowitz | You said CyanogenOS | Dec 19 09:50 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: yeah, in realtion to cortana | Dec 19 09:50 |
| XFaCE | *relation | Dec 19 09:51 |
| schestowitz | what's the link? | Dec 19 09:51 |
| schestowitz | Because they claims CM is barebones and then vendors can do to it a bundle | Dec 19 09:51 |
| XFaCE | http://www.xda-developers.com/xda-external-link/cortana-now-available-where-and-when-you-need-her-no-matter-what-smartphone-you-choose/ | Dec 19 09:51 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.xda-developers.com | Cortana to Come Preloaded On Cyanogen OS 12.1.1 on OnePlus One [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4r ] | Dec 19 09:51 | |
| schestowitz | also, are there articles about it? | Dec 19 09:51 |
| XFaCE | so to summarize | Dec 19 09:51 |
| schestowitz | one PlusOne | Dec 19 09:51 |
| schestowitz | but is it also upstream? | Dec 19 09:51 |
| XFaCE | NTFS/exFat is added to CyanogenMod | Dec 19 09:51 |
| XFaCE | Cortana on CyanogenOS | Dec 19 09:51 |
| XFaCE | so CyanogenOS has become a transparent Microsoft marketing bed | Dec 19 09:52 |
| XFaCE | and CM13 is slowly becoming one :P | Dec 19 09:52 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: sorry you don't understand the problem. | Dec 19 09:53 |
| XFaCE | "At the official announcement post for Cortana’s availability on iOS and Android, Microsoft also announced that future versions of Cyanogen OS will feature deep integration of Cortana. " | Dec 19 09:53 |
| oiaohm | NTFS and exFat in fact becomes stupidly forced by storage device makers. | Dec 19 09:53 |
| XFaCE | I don't even run either on my sdcard | Dec 19 09:53 |
| XFaCE | I just use JFFS | Dec 19 09:53 |
| oiaohm | You still don't understand the problem. | Dec 19 09:53 |
| XFaCE | that was an aside comment | Dec 19 09:54 |
| oiaohm | Some sdcards if you put anything other than exfat or ntfs on them they will destory you data. | Dec 19 09:54 |
| oiaohm | and I am not kidding. | Dec 19 09:54 |
| XFaCE | well that's fucked up | Dec 19 09:54 |
| XFaCE | link? | Dec 19 09:54 |
| oiaohm | Why they storage card system for working out what sectors it can recycle for wear leveling is working from the information it extracting from the file system. | Dec 19 09:55 |
| oiaohm | It was covered in a 2010 australian Linux conference video. | Dec 19 09:55 |
| XFaCE | "Nevertheless, in order to be fully compliant with the SDXC card specification, many SDXC-capable host devices are firmware-programmed to expect exFAT on cards larger than 32 GB. Consequently, they may not accept SDXC cards reformatted as FAT32, even if the device supports FAT32 on smaller cards (for SDHC compatibility). Therefore, even if a file system is supported in general, it is not always possible to use alternative file systems on SDXC cards a | Dec 19 09:56 |
| XFaCE | t all depending on how strictly the SDXC card specification has been implemented in the device. This bears a risk of accidental loss of data, as a host device may treat a card with an unrecognized file system as blank or damaged and reformat the card." | Dec 19 09:56 |
| XFaCE | wow | Dec 19 09:56 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: Please note SDXC contains exfat as part of the standard. | Dec 19 09:56 |
| XFaCE | after how much $$$ from MS? | Dec 19 09:57 |
| oiaohm | So format SDXC with NTFS and its exfat only you data is screwed. | Dec 19 09:57 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: when you understand the problem what choice do OS vendors have when Hardware makers lock in the format. | Dec 19 09:58 |
| XFaCE | thanks for this info, I didn't know that | Dec 19 09:58 |
| schestowitz | thanks | Dec 19 09:58 |
| schestowitz | will do an article about i | Dec 19 09:59 |
| schestowitz | it | Dec 19 09:59 |
| XFaCE | two separate ones? | Dec 19 09:59 |
| oiaohm | Please note when buying ssd harddrives this problem can apply as well. | Dec 19 09:59 |
| oiaohm | Yes always look for Linux support on a ssd harddrive because that means generic file system support. | Dec 19 09:59 |
| oiaohm | Windows or OS X only ssds could be nasty. | Dec 19 09:59 |
| XFaCE | god damn | Dec 19 09:59 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: do you have an example of a Linux-ready SSD? | Dec 19 10:03 |
| XFaCE | for future reference | Dec 19 10:03 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: looks like what oiaohm has said - the cm13 ntfs thing is an android-wide developement | Dec 19 10:04 |
| XFaCE | cyanogenos however IS going microsoft | Dec 19 10:04 |
| oiaohm | https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/legal/intellectualproperty/mtl/technologylicensing.aspx?f0ebc726-7ebd-4545-a353-de9b1edbdbee=True Yes Microsoft does demard patents over exfat. | Dec 19 10:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.microsoft.com | Intellectual Property Technology Licensing Programs [ http://ur1.ca/ocp5c ] | Dec 19 10:05 | |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: this is the kind of shit that anti-trust agencies should be raving on | Dec 19 10:06 |
| XFaCE | this is clear monopolistic bullshit | Dec 19 10:07 |
| cubexyz | schestowitz, briefly it's like this... customer says win10 KOed his computer to the point he can't even install a new OS | Dec 19 10:07 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: ssd even Linux ready ones have major teeth at times. https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/18363/Intel-Solid-State-Drive-Firmware-Update-Tool | Dec 19 10:07 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-downloadcenter.intel.com | Download Intel® Solid-State Drive Firmware Update Tool [ http://ur1.ca/ocp5f ] | Dec 19 10:07 | |
| cubexyz | I've asked him for permision to quote him, as soon as he gives that I'll post the text online | Dec 19 10:08 |
| XFaCE | major teeth? | Dec 19 10:08 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: ssd drives have firmware updates read the notes about it. | Dec 19 10:08 |
| XFaCE | yikes | Dec 19 10:09 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: ---If the Intel SSD firmware update process is interrupted, your Intel SSD may not function properly.--- found this bit. | Dec 19 10:09 |
| oiaohm | In otherwords I can eat your data. | Dec 19 10:09 |
| oiaohm | Now Microsoft is wanting to make firmware updating on stuff automatic. | Dec 19 10:09 |
| cubexyz | the upside, if there is one... is the customer will be more receptive to non-microsoft operating systems | Dec 19 10:10 |
| oiaohm | My main usage of ssd harddrives is as bcache where the majority of the data is kept on old school spinning media. | Dec 19 10:11 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: how are kingston ssds for linux compatibility? | Dec 19 10:11 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: From what I have seen of kingston ssds they all had Linux firmware update tools. Now a problem you can run into with a kingston ssd they don't have os x tools and older drives don't have current version of Windows tools. | Dec 19 10:14 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: so kingston ssd is more Linux compadible than anything else. | Dec 19 10:14 |
| oiaohm | Ie not compadible with mostly everything else. | Dec 19 10:14 |
| XFaCE | lol | Dec 19 10:15 |
| XFaCE | well that's good to know | Dec 19 10:15 |
| XFaCE | Kingston SSDs it is | Dec 19 10:15 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: I guess you starting to see this SSD stuff has major holes. | Dec 19 10:15 |
| XFaCE | well I never even thought of it | Dec 19 10:15 |
| oiaohm | So a SSD good for Linux can be horible for Windows and OS X. | Dec 19 10:15 |
| XFaCE | thanks very much for bringing it to our attention | Dec 19 10:15 |
| XFaCE | the sdxc thing is just... wow | Dec 19 10:16 |
| oiaohm | And you can swap that around. | Dec 19 10:16 |
| oiaohm | So when you buy a SSD it better match the OS's you are wishing to use in spec. | Dec 19 10:16 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: in an ideal world SDXD would require JFFS or something open | Dec 19 10:16 |
| XFaCE | or YAFFS | Dec 19 10:17 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: F2FS is from samsung. | Dec 19 10:18 |
| XFaCE | ah right | Dec 19 10:18 |
| schestowitz | https://www.gnu.org/fun/jokes/helloworld.html | Dec 19 10:22 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gnu.org | Hello World! - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation (FSF) [ http://ur1.ca/ocp69 ] | Dec 19 10:22 | |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: JFFS and YAFFS don't have the required size to meet SDXC spec sizes let alown what a new spec could put up. But F2FS does. | Dec 19 10:22 |
| XFaCE | yeah I think I was thinking of F2FS oiaohm | Dec 19 10:23 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: yep, my bad | Dec 19 10:26 |
| XFaCE | the names can get confusing | Dec 19 10:26 |
| XFaCE | but yeah I'm using F2FS on my phone | Dec 19 10:26 |
| oiaohm | I know. Its only that I watch the australian Linux conference videos that I got it right. | Dec 19 10:26 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: http://windows.microsoft.com/en-au/windows/lifecycle Read down notice Oct 2016 preinstallation of Windows 7 and windows 8.1 is no longer meant to be performed by Microsoft Profesionals. | Dec 19 10:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-windows.microsoft.com | Windows lifecycle fact sheet - Windows Help [ http://ur1.ca/ocp6l ] | Dec 19 10:28 | |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: and "Retail software end of sales " is the full boxed set editions. | Dec 19 10:29 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: mostly the old OS stuff you find in stores is old stock. | Dec 19 10:30 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: writing on the wall | Dec 19 10:30 |
| XFaCE | gentoo for me | Dec 19 10:30 |
| oiaohm | Debian for me. | Dec 19 10:30 |
| XFaCE | all the time | Dec 19 10:30 |
| oiaohm | systemd does not bother me enough to move away from it. | Dec 19 10:30 |
| XFaCE | the only windows installation will be in an internet-free KVM | Dec 19 10:30 |
| XFaCE | like studying a virus or bacteria :) | Dec 19 10:31 |
| oiaohm | From what I am hearing is the windows 10 upgrade is being deployed by the Windows 7 and 8.1 update system. | Dec 19 10:32 |
| oiaohm | If that is the case Microsoft can declare it a critical update for Windows 7 and 8.1 so kill support to anything that is not 10. | Dec 19 10:32 |
| XFaCE | yeah | Dec 19 10:32 |
| XFaCE | I feel sorry for the Windows 7 users now - every windows update has to be examined | Dec 19 10:33 |
| XFaCE | I have an ignore list for what it's worth | Dec 19 10:33 |
| oiaohm | Windows 10 no ignore list | Dec 19 10:33 |
| oiaohm | For gernal users. | Dec 19 10:33 |
| XFaCE | yeah | Dec 19 10:33 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: Windows 10 is not for general users :) | Dec 19 10:34 |
| XFaCE | or any users | Dec 19 10:34 |
| XFaCE | as schestowitz would say, it's for the useds(sic) | Dec 19 10:34 |
| oiaohm | Only way I can see that I can run Windows 10 is run it inside virtual machine some how. | Dec 19 10:34 |
| XFaCE | KVM yeah | Dec 19 10:34 |
| XFaCE | isolated from the rest of the system | Dec 19 10:34 |
| oiaohm | So I can control its internet access so control its update system | Dec 19 10:34 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: there is WSUS | Dec 19 10:34 |
| oiaohm | WSUS is only for enterprise editions. | Dec 19 10:35 |
| XFaCE | that program enterprises use to control windows updates to machines | Dec 19 10:35 |
| oiaohm | That is another change with Windows 10. | Dec 19 10:35 |
| oiaohm | Windows 7 and 8.1 as long as it was pro you could connect it to WSUS. | Dec 19 10:35 |
| *schestowitz takes notes for later | Dec 19 10:35 | |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: well, there's always just downloading updates and installing them via cmd script | Dec 19 10:35 |
| XFaCE | aka the Windows 95 and below way :P | Dec 19 10:36 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: remember Windows 10 auto updates. | Dec 19 10:36 |
| oiaohm | So internet connection it getting it themselves. | Dec 19 10:36 |
| XFaCE | hence why the KVM (or equivalent) should have no or tightly regulated internet access | Dec 19 10:36 |
| cubexyz | it sounds like utter crap | Dec 19 10:37 |
| XFaCE | pretty much | Dec 19 10:37 |
| XFaCE | at this point running MS-DOS 10 sounds preferable | Dec 19 10:37 |
| oiaohm | http://www.wsusoffline.net/docs/ At least wsusoffline supports Windows 10 | Dec 19 10:38 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.wsusoffline.net | WSUS Offline Update - Update Microsoft Windows and Office without an Internet connection | Dec 19 10:38 | |
| oiaohm | So you don't need to give windows 10 internet access to get updates for it. | Dec 19 10:38 |
| XFaCE | good thought | Dec 19 10:38 |
| XFaCE | I forgot about WSUSoffline | Dec 19 10:38 |
| oiaohm | I have worked out that I can perfectly contain Windows 10. | Dec 19 10:39 |
| oiaohm | Problem is virtualisation stuff like sharing a video card between 2 OS's is still crap. | Dec 19 10:39 |
| XFaCE | true | Dec 19 10:39 |
| XFaCE | I guess Wine would be needed to run those applications | Dec 19 10:39 |
| XFaCE | graphics-intensive ones | Dec 19 10:40 |
| oiaohm | Businesses use a lot of applications that don't run in Wine. | Dec 19 10:40 |
| MinceR | businesses can afford to have those applications rewritten by people who have a clue | Dec 19 10:40 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: not exactly so. I wish it could say that. | Dec 19 10:40 |
| cubexyz | surely is this the total end of microsoft's dominance though | Dec 19 10:41 |
| cubexyz | it's so bad... | Dec 19 10:41 |
| MinceR | not unless uefi dies | Dec 19 10:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: some applications are forced on companies by stupid governement departments. | Dec 19 10:41 |
| XFaCE | cubexyz: end of *total* dominance perhaps | Dec 19 10:41 |
| XFaCE | but not the total end of dominance | Dec 19 10:41 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: governments can especially afford to have those applications rewritten by people who have a clue | Dec 19 10:41 |
| MinceR | skip buying hypePads for every MP for one year and it's funded | Dec 19 10:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: true lets take the Australian tax office for example of not having a clue. cisco system flawed VPN product is still in usage because they have not got any other solution ready. The product has been expired for 4 and a half years. | Dec 19 10:42 |
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| cubexyz | I renewed my driver's license online via linux this year | Dec 19 10:43 |
| cubexyz | first time | Dec 19 10:43 |
| cubexyz | so I'm 100% off the doze | Dec 19 10:44 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: first time it worked? | Dec 19 10:44 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, no I never tried it before | Dec 19 10:44 |
| MinceR | f5's vpn sucks about as much as fiasco's | Dec 19 10:44 |
| MinceR | (even if they try to deny at every opportunity that their vpn is a vpn) | Dec 19 10:44 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: you also know something horiblely wrong when If a computer with Windows 10 and I can legally go out and buy Windows 8.1 and 7 boxed set and write it off on the next Australian tax return on compadiblity grounds. | Dec 19 10:45 |
| cubexyz | I'm sorry to say things are getting worse in computer-land | Dec 19 10:46 |
| cubexyz | I was thinking things were improving but now... | Dec 19 10:46 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: see, they have plenty of money to waste | Dec 19 10:46 |
| cubexyz | I'm not so sure | Dec 19 10:46 |
| oiaohm | I can only spec about how stupid Australian governement departments are. | Dec 19 10:46 |
| oiaohm | spec/speek | Dec 19 10:46 |
| oiaohm | But I would suspect other countries in places could be as bad. | Dec 19 10:46 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, a safe assumption outside of Munich I think | Dec 19 10:47 |
| XFaCE | cisco system flawed VPN product is still in usage because they have not got any other solution ready | Dec 19 10:47 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: yeah | Dec 19 10:47 |
| XFaCE | Back on Windows the Cisco VPN driver caused nasty BSODs when copying over the network about a certain speed | Dec 19 10:48 |
| XFaCE | even on non-vpn connections | Dec 19 10:48 |
| XFaCE | *above | Dec 19 10:48 |
| oiaohm | https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Lodging-your-tax-return/In-detail/e-tax-help/#Computerrequirements Read this for a laugh. | Dec 19 10:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 400 @ https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Lodging-your-tax-return/In-detail/e-tax-help/#Computerrequirements ) | Dec 19 10:48 | |
| oiaohm | Yes latest version of OS X is support but the lastest version of Windows you are pot luck. | Dec 19 10:48 |
| XFaCE | lol | Dec 19 10:48 |
| MinceR | the other solution is called "OpenVPN" | Dec 19 10:49 |
| XFaCE | and works well :) | Dec 19 10:49 |
| cubexyz | no, not another BSOD.... | Dec 19 10:49 |
| cubexyz | as humourous as it is... enough is enough | Dec 19 10:49 |
| XFaCE | cubexyz: imagine having to cap your network transfer speeds | Dec 19 10:49 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: and XFaCE I have some horible facts. Cisco system vpn was choosen over openvpn because some stupid idiot pushed the fact that closed source was more secure than open source. | Dec 19 10:49 |
| XFaCE | ah, the ole fallacy | Dec 19 10:50 |
| MinceR | lol | Dec 19 10:50 |
| MinceR | especially funny in fiasco's case | Dec 19 10:50 |
| MinceR | whose idea of "security" is "sue the messenger" | Dec 19 10:50 |
| XFaCE | the Cisco VPN client uses QT, an open-source toolkit | Dec 19 10:50 |
| XFaCE | try asking that stupid idiot how they reconcile that | Dec 19 10:50 |
| MinceR | they also bought jabber, only to shit all over it | Dec 19 10:51 |
| XFaCE | *bought* jabber? | Dec 19 10:51 |
| XFaCE | how do you buy an open protocol? | Dec 19 10:51 |
| MinceR | yup | Dec 19 10:51 |
| MinceR | there was a jabber company | Dec 19 10:51 |
| XFaCE | ah | Dec 19 10:51 |
| MinceR | the protocol is pretty much called xmpp now | Dec 19 10:51 |
| XFaCE | another Fireware vs 1394 | Dec 19 10:51 |
| XFaCE | or JavaScript vs ECMAScript | Dec 19 10:51 |
| MinceR | well, it's not like fiasco is interested in staying compatible with xmpp anyway | Dec 19 10:52 |
| MinceR | they pretty much force you to use one of their broken, nearly unusable clients | Dec 19 10:52 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: the only good things off hand about Cisco are the Linksys routers | Dec 19 10:52 |
| XFaCE | AFTER putting 3rd party firmware on ofc | Dec 19 10:52 |
| MinceR | i avoid those | Dec 19 10:53 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: tomato linksys routers are still good | Dec 19 10:53 |
| MinceR | since fiasco decided the GPL does not apply to thm | Dec 19 10:53 |
| MinceR | s/hm/hem/ | Dec 19 10:53 |
| oiaohm | woo hoo. http://lets-talk.ato.gov.au/swdcommunity?category=ELS2SBR&tool=news_feed they plan to get off the cisco system broken vpn by june 2016 | Dec 19 10:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lets-talk.ato.gov.au | ATO Let's Talk | Software developers community [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7b ] | Dec 19 10:53 | |
| MinceR | and i'll probably have to build my own routers anyway, thanks to the FCC and the NSA | Dec 19 10:53 |
| XFaCE | heh | Dec 19 10:53 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: I've seen someting very scary - a lot of people's asus router config pages showing up on google O_o | Dec 19 10:54 |
| cubexyz | I'll help... | Dec 19 10:54 |
| MinceR | :> | Dec 19 10:54 |
| cubexyz | http://kicad-pcb.org | Dec 19 10:54 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: I mean, wow | Dec 19 10:54 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-kicad-pcb.org | KiCad EDA | Dec 19 10:54 | |
| XFaCE | MinceR: building your own router | Dec 19 10:55 |
| XFaCE | hmm | Dec 19 10:55 |
| XFaCE | pfSense | Dec 19 10:55 |
| XFaCE | + Beaglebone Black | Dec 19 10:55 |
| XFaCE | + Switch | Dec 19 10:55 |
| MinceR | yeah, i guess | Dec 19 10:55 |
| MinceR | i was thinking along the lines of a rpi2, but having a case is not important in this case | Dec 19 10:56 |
| MinceR | also, + usb wifi dongle | Dec 19 10:56 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: fuck the rpi2 | Dec 19 10:57 |
| MinceR | no thanks | Dec 19 10:57 |
| XFaCE | beaglebone black B-) | Dec 19 10:57 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: http://beagleboard.org/black | Dec 19 10:57 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-beagleboard.org | BeagleBoard.org - black | Dec 19 10:57 | |
| XRevan86 | > there was a jabber company | Dec 19 10:58 |
| XRevan86 | huh | Dec 19 10:58 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: bbb has a 1ghz processor, rpi2 has 900 mhz | Dec 19 10:58 |
| XFaCE | less ram, but meh | Dec 19 10:58 |
| MinceR | how many cores does the bbb have? | Dec 19 10:58 |
| XFaCE | 1 | Dec 19 10:59 |
| XFaCE | dammit | Dec 19 10:59 |
| XFaCE | you win again MinceR | Dec 19 10:59 |
| XFaCE | :P | Dec 19 10:59 |
| MinceR | pft | Dec 19 10:59 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 19 10:59 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: but | Dec 19 10:59 |
| oiaohm | I did not finsh that off. | Dec 19 10:59 |
| XFaCE | BUT | Dec 19 10:59 |
| MinceR | BUTT | Dec 19 10:59 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: the BBB doesn't have proprietary crap | Dec 19 10:59 |
| MinceR | that's good | Dec 19 10:59 |
| XFaCE | and it's painted black | Dec 19 10:59 |
| XFaCE | B-) | Dec 19 10:59 |
| MinceR | a big point for the BBB | Dec 19 10:59 |
| oiaohm | The repalcement to the broken Cisco vpn stuff is SBR. Horiblem part is all sample code for it is C# | Dec 19 10:59 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: What did Jabber company before being bought? | Dec 19 11:00 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: internal storage too | Dec 19 11:00 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: afaik they developed xmpp | Dec 19 11:00 |
| XRevan86 | * Jabber company did | Dec 19 11:00 |
| MinceR | though wikipedia only mentions one product | Dec 19 11:00 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: the BBB has a microSD built-in | Dec 19 11:00 |
| XFaCE | plus the slot | Dec 19 11:00 |
| XRevan86 | > The Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) formed an XMPP working group in 2002 to formalise the core protocols as an IETF instant messaging and presence technology | Dec 19 11:00 |
| XRevan86 | > 2002 | Dec 19 11:00 |
| XFaCE | and a serial connection port | Dec 19 11:00 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: bbb is not as great against the latest pi boards. | Dec 19 11:01 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20001203131700/http://www.jabber.com/ | Dec 19 11:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber.com, Inc. [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7k ] | Dec 19 11:01 | |
| XFaCE | true oiaohm , but it does still have the open hardware/internal storage advantages | Dec 19 11:01 |
| XFaCE | back in the rpi1 days, it easily bested it | Dec 19 11:02 |
| XFaCE | when the Beaglebone whatever comes out to replace the black, that'll be cool | Dec 19 11:02 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20081104100727/http://www.jabber.com/ | Dec 19 11:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Empty reply from server ( status 0 @ https://web.archive.org/web/20081104100727/http://www.jabber.com/ ) | Dec 19 11:03 | |
| XFaCE | meanwhile https://boards.openpandora.org/pyramain/main/ | Dec 19 11:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-boards.openpandora.org | DragonBox Pyra - the OpenSource Linux handheld - Pyra Handheld Boards [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7o ] | Dec 19 11:03 | |
| XFaCE | this looks damned awesome :D | Dec 19 11:04 |
| MinceR | can the BBB boot off the removable card? | Dec 19 11:04 |
| XFaCE | yes | Dec 19 11:04 |
| cubexyz | ok, can the BBB boot into a different OS? :) | Dec 19 11:05 |
| XFaCE | you can make so it boots off internal storage when no card is plugged in | Dec 19 11:05 |
| XFaCE | cubexyz: BSD? linux distros? :) | Dec 19 11:05 |
| XFaCE | not windows 10 tho XD | Dec 19 11:05 |
| cubexyz | XFaCE, sure | Dec 19 11:05 |
| cubexyz | yeah we'll skip that one | Dec 19 11:05 |
| XFaCE | yes | Dec 19 11:07 |
| XFaCE | is the answer to your question | Dec 19 11:07 |
| oiaohm | Only 1 thing wrong with the pandara https://boards.openpandora.org/pyramain/pyraspecs.html/ | Dec 19 11:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-boards.openpandora.org | DragonBox Pyra - Specifications - Pyra Handheld Boards [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7z ] | Dec 19 11:08 | |
| oiaohm | Boot media sdxc | Dec 19 11:08 |
| MinceR | does it mandate exfat? | Dec 19 11:09 |
| MinceR | as in, can it boot off saner fs-es | Dec 19 11:09 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: to be sdxc standard conforming yes. | Dec 19 11:09 |
| MinceR | that's why i clarified :> | Dec 19 11:09 |
| oiaohm | So sdxc cards don't have support any other format than exfat | Dec 19 11:09 |
| MinceR | question is, does the pyra support other fs-es | Dec 19 11:10 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: https://web.archive.org/web/20010124085700/http://www.jabber.com/about/index.shtml I see | Dec 19 11:13 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber.com, Inc. [ http://ur1.ca/ocp8c ] | Dec 19 11:13 | |
| XRevan86 | Jabber.com, Inc. != Jabber | Dec 19 11:13 |
| XRevan86 | not never | Dec 19 11:14 |
| MinceR | apparently they ran jabber.org too | Dec 19 11:14 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20060201231702/http://www.jabber.org/ | Dec 19 11:15 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber: Open Instant Messaging and a Whole Lot More, Powered by XMPP [ http://ur1.ca/ocp8f ] | Dec 19 11:15 | |
| MinceR | >Jabber® is a registered trademark of Jabber, Inc. | Dec 19 11:15 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: SD media gets horiblem. | Dec 19 11:15 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: first generation SD cards techically format genenic. | Dec 19 11:15 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20001109164300/http://www.jabber.org/ | Dec 19 11:15 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber.org [ http://ur1.ca/ocp8h ] | Dec 19 11:15 | |
| MinceR | >Jabber is a registered trademark of Jabber.com, Inc. Used by permission. | Dec 19 11:15 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: huh | Dec 19 11:16 |
| MinceR | so they probably didn't run it, but i'm not sure | Dec 19 11:16 |
| oiaohm | SDHC the second generation cards the standard formatting tool is FAT32 | Dec 19 11:16 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: well yeah, it's painful that sd promotes not only DRM, but also braindead m$ formats | Dec 19 11:16 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: That's ancient history that didn't really impact modern XMPP :). | Dec 19 11:16 |
| MinceR | and patents | Dec 19 11:16 |
| oiaohm | So SDHC to prevent screw up put small fat32 partition at start. | Dec 19 11:16 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: afaik that's where modern xmpp comes from :> | Dec 19 11:16 |
| oiaohm | Rasbery pi images use the small starting fat partition stunt. | Dec 19 11:17 |
| MinceR | to prevent screw up, stop using sd formatting tools, start using generic partitioning and filesystem creation tools | Dec 19 11:17 |
| MinceR | :> | Dec 19 11:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: no | Dec 19 11:17 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: But they hired Jabber original creater *later* :) | Dec 19 11:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the problem is wear leveling implmented in the SDHC cards. | Dec 19 11:17 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: works for me | Dec 19 11:18 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: sometimes the bugger is attempt to read fat to locate sectors it can recycle. | Dec 19 11:18 |
| MinceR | also, wear leveling should work on hw blocks, not filesystems | Dec 19 11:18 |
| MinceR | and TRIM | Dec 19 11:18 |
| oiaohm | SD cards they don't all work on hw blocks. | Dec 19 11:18 |
| MinceR | if they can't do it right, they should look for a career they're qualified for | Dec 19 11:18 |
| oiaohm | Some are reading file system data. | Dec 19 11:18 |
| oiaohm | By SD standard they are perfectly permitted to be rading the filesystem data. | Dec 19 11:19 |
| oiaohm | So bogus partition at start that gives it something to look at keeps the card firmware happy. | Dec 19 11:19 |
| MinceR | cards rarely if ever break for me | Dec 19 11:20 |
| MinceR | except for the shit sandisk peddles | Dec 19 11:20 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: people having strange failures with SD cards they have formated normally trace to this. | Dec 19 11:20 |
| MinceR | but i stay away from sandisk | Dec 19 11:20 |
| oiaohm | sandisk is one of the ones needing a small fat partition. | Dec 19 11:20 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: can you explaim the small fat partition again | Dec 19 11:20 |
| MinceR | sandisk can't even get physical dimensions right | Dec 19 11:21 |
| MinceR | their microsd card reader has a too thin slot, their microsd cards are too thick | Dec 19 11:21 |
| MinceR | even their usb flash drives are unreliable | Dec 19 11:21 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: the firmware wearleveling reads in some SD brands is reading the fat tables in the fat filesystem to find sectors that have been deleted so it can recycle them. | Dec 19 11:22 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: fat data area filled with random crap the wearleveling starts recycling random sectors so it a question to how long that is something important. | Dec 19 11:23 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: be wared some USB Flash is Fat and NTFS only as well. So requiring to level partitions in place to keep them happy. | Dec 19 11:24 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, do SSD's laster longer than hard drives? | Dec 19 11:24 |
| cubexyz | s/laster/last/ | Dec 19 11:24 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: hard question. | Dec 19 11:24 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: so on SDXC a small fat/exfat partition may fix some things? | Dec 19 11:26 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: yes its making sure the firmware wearleveling has the data it needs not be a stupid idiot. | Dec 19 11:26 |
| cubexyz | remember the quantum LP52S from 1990! | Dec 19 11:27 |
| cubexyz | and I think you mentioned even older ones | Dec 19 11:27 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: in theory http://betanews.com/2014/12/05/modern-ssds-can-last-a-lifetime/ Please note theory. Theory says a SSD drive should outlast a spinning media harddrive. | Dec 19 11:27 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-betanews.com | Modern SSDs can last a lifetime [ http://ur1.ca/ocp9j ] | Dec 19 11:27 | |
| oiaohm | Problem here its theory. | Dec 19 11:27 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: but the problem is that is hard to determine the size needed for this small partition? | Dec 19 11:28 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: So far we are fairly lucky resize down the default installed partition and its in the right place. | Dec 19 11:28 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: basically big mistake is completely clearing the media. | Dec 19 11:29 |
| MinceR | afaict SSDs are plagued by firmware bugs | Dec 19 11:29 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: resize it what size? | Dec 19 11:29 |
| XFaCE | *it to | Dec 19 11:29 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: what even is the min size without moving its fat tables. | Dec 19 11:30 |
| XFaCE | I have no idea :P | Dec 19 11:30 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: if you don't get it that answer is matched to the size of media. | Dec 19 11:30 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: correct SSD have issues with Firmware bugs. | Dec 19 11:31 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: what's the formula then? | Dec 19 11:31 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: I don't have the formula off the top of head. | Dec 19 11:31 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: Its 2 am in the morning here and I cannot sleep. | Dec 19 11:31 |
| cubexyz | ok, simple question... which SSD should I buy? | Dec 19 11:31 |
| XFaCE | sorry to hear that | Dec 19 11:31 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: No problems I have days where I skip sleep. Its just me. | Dec 19 11:32 |
| XFaCE | ok | Dec 19 11:32 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: so I am not at work where I have data on different things like formating drives. | Dec 19 11:32 |
| cubexyz | I can't go much over 24 hours | Dec 19 11:32 |
| XFaCE | ok | Dec 19 11:32 |
| cubexyz | even 16 hours is a lot :) | Dec 19 11:32 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: is there any risks going from exFat to fat32? | Dec 19 11:33 |
| XFaCE | or is the firmware coded to use exFAT specifically for the wear-leveling? | Dec 19 11:33 |
| MinceR | probably intel | Dec 19 11:33 |
| MinceR | maybe micron, if it's effectively the same as intel | Dec 19 11:33 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: if the sdxc drive only supports exfat and you put fat32 there you have confused the wearleveling. Same with the reverse on a SDHC putting exfat on it instead of fat32 you might send that nuts as well. | Dec 19 11:34 |
| cubexyz | ok, as a customer advocate I'll provide a special windows 10 warning: | Dec 19 11:35 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the longest I can stay awake is 6 days. I normally avoid that because then I sleep for 36 hours. | Dec 19 11:35 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/hey-kid-upgrade-to-windows-10.png | Dec 19 11:35 |
| oiaohm | To my body 48 hours just results in 12 hours of sleep. | Dec 19 11:36 |
| cubexyz | whoa, 6 days | Dec 19 11:36 |
| oiaohm | If I am not behind on sleep is nothing strange for me to only sleep 4 hours. | Dec 19 11:36 |
| oiaohm | So yes 48 hours awake does result in me sleeping longer. | Dec 19 11:37 |
| cubexyz | can I ask how old you are? | Dec 19 11:37 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: so even on fat32 you need a small exfat partition? | Dec 19 11:37 |
| cubexyz | some older folks seem to sleep less | Dec 19 11:37 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I was this way from 10 years old. | Dec 19 11:37 |
| oiaohm | I am in my thirtys now. | Dec 19 11:38 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: you need to use the partitiontype the drive supports. | Dec 19 11:38 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the problem with SSD is recovery. | Dec 19 11:38 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: spinning media moves very few sectors around. | Dec 19 11:39 |
| oiaohm | So a controller dies on spinning media there is a very good chance you can have the controller/motor replaced and get the data back. | Dec 19 11:39 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/sleep-chart.png | Dec 19 11:40 |
| oiaohm | SSD with wearleveling the data order on the media might be in the controller. | Dec 19 11:40 |
| cubexyz | I don't think I slept 11 hours when I was 12 | Dec 19 11:41 |
| cubexyz | maybe 8 hours? | Dec 19 11:41 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: basically SSD has way more complex controller so a controller failure is way more leathal. | Dec 19 11:41 |
| oiaohm | Remember no matter how good the drive they controller may be broken by electrical short circut in the computer. | Dec 19 11:42 |
| cubexyz | wouldn't any controller failure just result in a failure? | Dec 19 11:42 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: most spinning media it possible to have the controller replaced. Yes 500 to 1000 dollars but its replaceable,. | Dec 19 11:43 |
| cubexyz | why don't we have that... hard drives with replacement controllers? | Dec 19 11:43 |
| oiaohm | The reality is we do for spinning media. cubexyz | Dec 19 11:44 |
| oiaohm | The issue is wearleveling. | Dec 19 11:44 |
| cubexyz | it says here that most hard drive failures are caused by motor controller chip burn-out | Dec 19 11:45 |
| oiaohm | spinning media does not wearlevel that much. Has limited smart sector replacement and all smart sector replacement data is written to the drive. | Dec 19 11:45 |
| oiaohm | Yes burnt out moter controller on a harddrive is replacemable. | Dec 19 11:45 |
| oiaohm | Just expensive. | Dec 19 11:45 |
| oiaohm | 1 it costs just as much as a full drive for just the controller. | Dec 19 11:45 |
| oiaohm | 2 you have to pay someone to fit it. | Dec 19 11:46 |
| cubexyz | there's no interchangeability of parts it seems | Dec 19 11:48 |
| oiaohm | Old harddrives you could straight up swap the controller. As data has got more complex you need calibration data cubexyz | Dec 19 11:55 |
| cubexyz | how old? | Dec 19 11:56 |
| oiaohm | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yn2eL4o-6Eo up to 2013 breakdown. Of course stuff has changed since 2013. | Dec 19 11:57 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com | DIY: Repair Hard Drive PCB. How to swap circuit board ROM chip. - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/ocpaj ] | Dec 19 11:57 | |
| cubexyz | would seagate sell me just the controller? | Dec 19 11:58 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the answer is no. To buy controllers without drive is pay into data recovery program with harddrive. | Dec 19 12:01 |
| oiaohm | maker | Dec 19 12:02 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: also being in data recovery you can get calibration controllers. | Dec 19 12:03 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: calibration controllers for spinning media in lots of cases allows you to regenerate the rom data. | Dec 19 12:04 |
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| cubexyz | ok.. schestowitz | Dec 19 13:19 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/windows-10-botch-up.txt | Dec 19 13:19 |
| cubexyz | he gave me permission to relate his windows 10 experiences | Dec 19 13:19 |
| cubexyz | he won't budge off windows: | Dec 19 13:20 |
| cubexyz | he wants to run: Steam games, Corel Draw X7, Photoshop CS5 , Carrara 3D, Sonar 7, Sibelius 5 | Dec 19 13:20 |
| cubexyz | so that is that | Dec 19 13:21 |
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| XFaCE | <cubexyz> he wants to run: Steam games, Corel Draw X7, Photoshop CS5 , Carrara 3D, Sonar 7, Sibelius 5 | Dec 19 13:43 |
| XFaCE | 1/6 :P | Dec 19 13:43 |
| cubexyz | I'm sure there are open source equivalents to most if not all of those | Dec 19 13:44 |
| cubexyz | musescore for sibelius maybe | Dec 19 13:44 |
| cubexyz | I'm just amazed he isn't more willing to try alternatives to windows | Dec 19 13:44 |
| cubexyz | at least try the chromebook :-P | Dec 19 13:45 |
| schestowitz | cubexyz: thanks | Dec 19 13:46 |
| cubexyz | anytime :) | Dec 19 13:47 |
| cubexyz | those are his exact words | Dec 19 13:48 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678285239391776769 | Dec 19 13:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @FOSSpatents @schestowitz @Laura_F_ERCOLI @WorldIPReview https://t.co/KUERevktI3 | Dec 19 13:49 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@SciencePorn: Respect. https://t.co/tMqi4gcqid | Dec 19 13:49 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678284567594319872 | Dec 19 13:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz Maybe but no need: #epo messed up minds of employees for decades. Rotten chunks might boil up to surface in present turmoil. | Dec 19 13:49 | |
| cubexyz | ok, if I was to run windows I would do it under VMware | Dec 19 14:26 |
| cubexyz | now I'm not doing to do that... but if I _did_ that's the way I would do it | Dec 19 14:27 |
| cubexyz | no way would I trust windows as the main OS | Dec 19 14:27 |
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| schestowitz | French letter we translated into English | Dec 19 17:26 |
| schestowitz | http://techrights.org/2015/12/03/attacks-on-staff-representatives/ | Dec 19 17:26 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | French Member of Parliament Reacts to EPO Management Amidst Ongoing Attacks on Staff Representatives and Facts-free Information War | Techrights [ http://ur1.ca/ocpqa ] | Dec 19 17:26 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/theGuruWithin/status/678326341997977600 https://twitter.com/IntelTpNews/status/678328423257792512 | Dec 19 17:29 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@theGuruWithin: #coderhouse .@OpenELEC .@schestowitz How2make URL autoplay this isn't working .@OBSProject CLR Big ty fr .@nn99org https://t.co/qT5HBYqUnE | Dec 19 17:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> abcnews.go.com | ABC News Video | Dec 19 17:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@IntelTpNews: Answers to Frequently Asked Questions about libreboot https://t.co/MW6aLH7ByD via @schestowitz | Dec 19 17:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> gettopical.com | Answers to Frequently Asked Questions about libreboot | Dec 19 17:29 | |
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| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6920376 | Dec 19 17:59 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: The latest of #kde still sluggish for many https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=289&t=130131 stay with #kde4 for now (if possible) | Dec 19 17:59 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> forum.kde.org | Lag on first opening of plasma 5 elements like calendar, etc • KDE Community Forums [ http://ur1.ca/ocps1 ] | Dec 19 17:59 | |
| schestowitz | "wow never noticed that delay. But yeah one can reproduce it. Though it isn’t that nasty. I did not notice it until I read that." | Dec 19 17:59 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678284567594319872?cn=cmVwbHk%3D&refsrc=email | Dec 19 18:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz Maybe but no need: #epo messed up minds of employees for decades. Rotten chunks might boil up to surface in present turmoil. | Dec 19 18:03 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/BrideOfLinux/status/678358306826690560 | Dec 19 18:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@BrideOfLinux: Scratching the surface of what's wrong with Jolla... https://t.co/GnAnNFs7I6 | Dec 19 18:41 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: What is wrong with Jolla? https://t.co/ochSOsP6w1 the UI and the apps are all proprietary for one thing. #jolla #linux | Dec 19 18:41 | |
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| amarsh04 | thanks for the tuxmachines.org pointer to a KDE article that mentioned: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=356580 | Dec 19 19:10 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-bugs.kde.org | Bug 356580 – startplasmacompositor - kwin_wayland - "/usr/lib/startplasma" - hangs at "start_kdeinit_wrapper" [ http://ur1.ca/ocpv5 ] | Dec 19 19:10 | |
| amarsh04 | I think that was the root cause of a problem that I had with the other pc for several weeks | Dec 19 19:10 |
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| BACKUP | ||
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| cubexyz | more customers complaining about windows 10... | Dec 13 03:11 |
| cubexyz | also there's some talk of a google/microsoft "war" | Dec 13 03:11 |
| cubexyz | something about the Microsoft browser not playing nice with google search | Dec 13 03:11 |
| cubexyz | hopefully I'll get a few converts out of it | Dec 13 03:12 |
| cubexyz | there was also one customer who told me (in rather vague terms) that windows 10 wiped out files on his computer | Dec 13 03:13 |
| cubexyz | it's not that I want to deal with the win10 nonsense... it's just helping customers | Dec 13 03:20 |
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| msb_ | cubexyz: Can you get a more precise description of the files? "windows 10 wiped out files on his computer" | Dec 13 07:59 |
| msb_ | cubexyz: Could these have been copyrighted files that Microsoft, serving its partner corporations against the interests of its paying customer, decided that the customer didn't have proper "rights" to the files? | Dec 13 08:05 |
| msb_ | You will love Big Brother! | Dec 13 08:06 |
| msb_ | "One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad. "Ein Reich, Ein Volk, Ein Fuhrer" - Adolf Hitler | Dec 13 08:19 |
| cubexyz | it sounded like the entire operating system was munged | Dec 13 08:20 |
| cubexyz | I have to talk to him more | Dec 13 08:20 |
| cubexyz | it's like any closed source situation... | Dec 13 08:21 |
| cubexyz | you don't really have much info on what's happening | Dec 13 08:21 |
| cubexyz | it could be that windows 10 shunts your data into another directory | Dec 13 08:23 |
| cubexyz | I can imagine lots of scenarios where things get messed up | Dec 13 08:23 |
| cubexyz | what if you don't have enough drive space for the windows 10 upgrade? | Dec 13 08:24 |
| cubexyz | I showed him the NSA Ant Catalog and told him about OpenBSD and other FOSS operating systems | Dec 13 08:25 |
| msb_ | If it turns out that MS is deleting people's files, this could be extremely important news. Even windows users like their files! | Dec 13 08:35 |
| msb_ | At least the ones that know what files are. | Dec 13 08:41 |
| cubexyz | this guy is actually pretty smart | Dec 13 08:41 |
| cubexyz | just not so great in the software department | Dec 13 08:41 |
| cubexyz | to him software is something you order | Dec 13 08:42 |
| cubexyz | it's the automatic windows 10 upgrades that are causing problems | Dec 13 08:43 |
| cubexyz | you leave your computer on and come home.... bang you got windows 10 on it | Dec 13 08:43 |
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| Freeexaminer | First of all I want to commend you for the courage to keep this blog. Few people are brave enough to oppose authority and regardless of the outcome one should take a stand whenever private or collective rights are abused by the ones in power. | Dec 13 10:25 |
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| Freeexaminer | Batistelli has hijacked the office and turned the management into a mafia organization where the "capo" is surrounded by sycophants. | Dec 13 10:27 |
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| Freeexaminer | The atmosphere is unbearable and the main topic of discussion everywhere is the abuse of the system by the president. | Dec 13 10:27 |
| Freeexaminer | I would like to send you a letter signed by French director Yann Chabod, a member of the Batistelli inner circle, as a response to a demand by a lady suffering from breast cancer. The inhumanity of the response is unbelievable. | Dec 13 10:30 |
| Freeexaminer | How could I upload it? | Dec 13 10:31 |
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| r_schestowitz | some sites still spread this BS: http://www.pe.com/articles/view-788607-phone-washington.html | Dec 13 11:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pe.com | SAN BERNARDINO SHOOTING: Terror investigators can’t view NSA phone records - Press Enterprise | Dec 13 11:23 | |
| r_schestowitz | Oh, I missed Freeexaminer? | Dec 13 11:24 |
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| r_schestowitz | http://time.com/4142893/angela-merkel-kate-mckinnon-snl/ | Dec 13 11:56 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-time.com | Best of Kate McKinnon's Angela Merkel Impression: SNL Clips | Dec 13 11:56 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/scruffy_crunch/status/676012021779849216 | Dec 13 12:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@scruffy_crunch: @schestowitz @All4Privacy It didn't end. It just got outsourced. | Dec 13 12:16 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/scruffy_crunch/status/676012591437623296 | Dec 13 12:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@scruffy_crunch: @schestowitz @All4Privacy Yes, they are. | Dec 13 12:18 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Martinned81/status/676013449034473472 | Dec 13 12:21 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Martinned81: That must be one of those Zen koans. https://t.co/mZ50LnMJXT | Dec 13 12:21 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: There is no #internet #censorship in #China , says China’s top censor https://t.co/GU88sbfWGH a #clapper moment https://t.co/JS39v3HgwK | Dec 13 12:21 | |
| MinceR | http://motherboard.vice.com/read/congresswoman-asks-feds-why-they-pressured-a-library-to-disable-its-tor-node | Dec 13 12:38 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-motherboard.vice.com | Congresswoman Asks Feds Why They Pressured a Library to Disable Its Tor Node | Motherboard | Dec 13 12:38 | |
| cubexyz | what was the answer? | Dec 13 12:44 |
| cubexyz | ok, there wasn't one | Dec 13 12:47 |
| cubexyz | and they restored it | Dec 13 12:47 |
| MinceR | they did better | Dec 13 12:47 |
| MinceR | they turned their relay into an exit node | Dec 13 12:47 |
| cubexyz | ok, I don't know what that means | Dec 13 12:49 |
| MinceR | it means that now it can not only be used as a middle point in tor connections, but also as the point from the tcp connection is opened to the final (non-Tor) destination | Dec 13 12:52 |
| MinceR | exit nodes are riskier in a regulatory sense and more scarce | Dec 13 12:52 |
| cubexyz | New Hampshire... they like their freedom so not too surprising | Dec 13 12:57 |
| cubexyz | not a very big city, only 13K pop | Dec 13 12:57 |
| cubexyz | imagine the government bullying some small town library | Dec 13 12:58 |
| cubexyz | I wonder if any libraries run Linux | Dec 13 12:59 |
| r_schestowitz | some do | Dec 13 13:06 |
| r_schestowitz | in Europe at least | Dec 13 13:06 |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/scruffy_crunch/status/676026772912078848 | Dec 13 13:12 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@scruffy_crunch: @schestowitz @All4Privacy "[DHS] investigations warning that the network can be used by criminals" So can streets, telephones and deodorant | Dec 13 13:12 | |
| cubexyz | my local library has been microsoftized | Dec 13 13:16 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Now you can read BSOD's while reading books :). | Dec 13 13:17 |
| cubexyz | :-/ | Dec 13 13:17 |
| cubexyz | what if you have one of those multi screen displays | Dec 13 13:19 |
| cubexyz | does the BSOD appear on all the screens? | Dec 13 13:19 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/triple-bsod.jpg | Dec 13 13:20 |
| cubexyz | that looks like 3 different computers | Dec 13 13:21 |
| cubexyz | I bet a large part of those BSODs is the computer overheating | Dec 13 13:25 |
| cubexyz | one of my machines has been running X for over a year | Dec 13 13:27 |
| cubexyz | root 3849 3848 0 2014 ? 1-00:17:25 /usr/X11R6/bin/X :0 -audit 0 -auth /var/gdm/:0.Xauth vt | Dec 13 13:27 |
| cubexyz | on the other hand I hear "windows BSODs about once a week" from customers | Dec 13 13:28 |
| cubexyz | clearly the BSODs haven't stopped | Dec 13 13:29 |
| cubexyz | or "Visual Studio BSODs my computer" | Dec 13 13:29 |
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| sebsebseb | Dec 13 14:19 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://phab.enlightenment.org/phame/live/3/post/e20_release/ | Dec 13 14:57 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://phab.enlightenment.org/phame/live/3/post/e20_release/ ) | Dec 13 14:57 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2010-August/019310.html | Dec 13 15:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2010-August/019310.html ) | Dec 13 15:01 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Metztli_IT/status/676056468521553920 | Dec 13 15:12 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Metztli_IT: .@schestowitz but was disappointed that(some?)#GNU maintainers place subjective evaluation criteria above tech merit https://t.co/JM9c40jM8z | Dec 13 15:12 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/mall_dweller/status/676057101177888768 | Dec 13 15:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mall_dweller: @schestowitz Facists; perfectly fitting description. | Dec 13 15:18 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/unorigmoniker/status/676057993813893120 | Dec 13 15:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@unorigmoniker: @schestowitz I've seen you post this before. Do you have any proof to back up your assertions DDG has privacy issues? Curious. @all4privacy | Dec 13 15:18 | |
| r_schestowitz | http://50.80.140.55/photo_album/chron/desktop/opinion/2013_06_21-avoid_duck_duck_go/ | Dec 13 15:19 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-50.80.140.55 | Duck Duck No No [ http://ur1.ca/jbxqn ] | Dec 13 15:19 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/3vxq61/so_i_was_watching_the_linux_movie_the_code_with/ | Dec 13 15:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Couldn't resolve host 'www.reddit.com' ( status 0 @ https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/3vxq61/so_i_was_watching_the_linux_movie_the_code_with/ ) | Dec 13 15:23 | |
| r_schestowitz | "And my dad says, "Oh I know that guy." Referring to Eric S. Raymond! He said Eric started talking to him at our train station and he thought he was kind of weird." | Dec 13 15:23 |
| r_schestowitz | LOL | Dec 13 15:23 |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/unorigmoniker/status/676059905246240769 | Dec 13 15:25 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@unorigmoniker: Hi @Yegg, I would be curious to hear your response to this: https://t.co/hWs67gSx12 @all4privacy | Dec 13 15:25 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @unorigmoniker @All4Privacy http://50.80.140.55/photo_album/chron/desktop/opinion/2013_06_21-avoid_duck_duck_go/ | Dec 13 15:25 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/unorigmoniker/status/676060253016993792 | Dec 13 15:27 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@unorigmoniker: @schestowitz Thank you. I do note that the post & info is over 2 years old. But interesting claims none-the-less. @all4privacy | Dec 13 15:27 | |
| r_schestowitz | I have written dozens of things about it since... | Dec 13 15:27 |
| r_schestowitz | Even senior from within DDG admitted there was no longer truth to the privacy vow (and left) | Dec 13 15:28 |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/paulhindes/status/676064493231845376 | Dec 13 15:44 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@paulhindes: @schestowitz Makes Skynet seem quaint. The surveillance state will zero in on those not talking to their things all the time. | Dec 13 15:44 | |
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| msb_ | cubexyz: Regarding Linux usage in libraries, I read years ago that in some US libraries, the computers provided for free use by the public ran Linux. Most users didn't realize that there was any difference from the previous winblows OS. Of course administration was much easier -- no crashing. | Dec 13 16:19 |
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| cubexyz | msb_, any references would be interesting to see | Dec 13 16:52 |
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| cubexyz | there was a program called "Linux in libraries" a few years ago | Dec 13 16:56 |
| msb_ | google-advanced for linux computers in libraries gets 30M hits. Lots of relevant ones. | Dec 13 16:58 |
| cubexyz | Groovix :) | Dec 13 17:00 |
| cubexyz | http://www.groovix.com | Dec 13 17:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.groovix.com | | Dec 13 17:01 | |
| cubexyz | of course if one of the librarians was a linux guru they could probably use any distro | Dec 13 17:03 |
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| r_schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6910224 | Dec 13 19:30 |
| r_schestowitz | "heh, “bottom up” development is an interesting way or putting things." | Dec 13 19:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Why #WilliamHill is betting on #freesw rather than traditional IT vendors for digital transformation http://www.computerworlduk.com/applications/why-william-hill-is-swapping-major-it-vendors-for-open-source-platforms-3631637/ | Dec 13 19:30 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.computerworlduk.com | William Hill betting on open source for digital transformation | Applications | Computerworld UK [ http://ur1.ca/occrz ] | Dec 13 19:30 | |
| r_schestowitz | That must be your "kind" of company | Dec 13 19:30 |
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| schestowitz | The patent boosters with a puff piece http://www.ipwatchdog.com/2015/12/13/patents-system-works-record-bruce-kisliuk/id=63803/ | Dec 13 20:14 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.ipwatchdog.com | Patents, a system that works - On the record with Bruce Kisliuk - IPWatchdog.com | Patents & Patent Law [ http://ur1.ca/occtz ] | Dec 13 20:14 | |
| schestowitz | "Maybe we haven't had that yet in the way that it could happen because sure, those of us in the industry I think know that things are not good, that a whole lot less is patent eligible and that we are really running the risk of saying that software and " | Dec 13 20:14 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FOSSpatents/status/676128265254395904 | Dec 13 22:51 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FOSSpatents: I'm quite sure this has nothing to do with GMail and everything to do with a lack of privacy of the EPO network. https://t.co/NsJzPtGB9u | Dec 13 22:51 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #epo claims to have evidence that someone in EPO contacted @fosspatents using GMail. Moral of the story? Never use #gmail @Control_Risks | Dec 13 22:51 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Sheikh_al_Touar/status/676143894531334144 | Dec 13 22:52 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Sheikh_al_Touar: @FOSSpatents @schestowitz well, I wouldn't be so sure because it is rumoured for months that they have a clandestine love affair ;) | Dec 13 22:52 | |
| schestowitz | http://www.epo.org/news-issues/news/2011/20110324.html | Dec 13 22:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.epo.org | EPO - EPO and Google break the language barrier for Europe’s innovators | Dec 13 22:53 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/colinsmartone/status/676154827785805833 | Dec 13 22:54 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@colinsmartone: @schestowitz the problem is they fear this might to true and underline their failure | Dec 13 22:54 | |
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| msb__ | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqLRd4neGGE | Dec 14 00:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com | Friend & Lover - Reach Out Of The Darkness - YouTube | Dec 14 00:03 | |
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| oiaohm | Got a fun few days ahead of me. Hard drive death. Thank you ddrescue resume feature. Controller on drive developed fault of randomally stopping. | Dec 14 01:12 |
| msb__ | oiaohm: Good luck with a complete recovery! | Dec 14 01:27 |
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| oiaohm | msb__: I already know its not complete about 2G of data off 500G drive was unable to be read. | Dec 14 01:41 |
| oiaohm | msb__: hopefully is 2G of nothing important. | Dec 14 01:41 |
| cubexyz | msb__, saw an interesting quote today | Dec 14 06:02 |
| msb__ | Yes? | Dec 14 06:02 |
| cubexyz | "The press in the developed world is in the hands of an ever smaller bunch of sociopaths who take pride in being unscientific." | Dec 14 06:02 |
| msb__ | I'm not sure they take pride in being unscientific. | Dec 14 06:03 |
| msb__ | They just say whatever will serve the ultra-wealthy. | Dec 14 06:03 |
| msb__ | The corporate media, Western govts, huge banks, weapons companies, etc, are all part of one huge conglomerate whose members lie and act for each other's benefit, and against ours. | Dec 14 06:06 |
| msb__ | For example, it's against IMF policy to give loans to countries that aren't paying back their current loans. But it's going to give hundreds of billions to Ukraine, because that will help the West to attack Russia. | Dec 14 06:08 |
| msb__ | ...even though Ukraine is now totally in arrears. | Dec 14 06:08 |
| msb__ | Carter, Reagan, Clinton, Obama armed and financed Islamic head-choppers/clit-cutters, and the US govt also did 9/11. Millions of people murdered, many nations destroyed, all for oil and weapons profits and the wishes of Israel. | Dec 14 06:13 |
| cubexyz | fossil fuels are going to end | Dec 14 06:14 |
| cubexyz | also fracking should end | Dec 14 06:15 |
| msb__ | Read _Shock Doctrine/Disaster Capitalism_ by Naomi Klein. | Dec 14 06:15 |
| msb__ | Yes, it's wrecking the planet. | Dec 14 06:15 |
| msb__ | There's enough fossil fuel left to cause a huge temperature jump and kill most species on the planet. | Dec 14 06:17 |
| msb__ | Corps, govts, banks, media, etc, ARE one huge conspiracy. | Dec 14 06:18 |
| cubexyz | on the moon in 1969 and look at us now in 2015... it's disappointing | Dec 14 06:21 |
| cubexyz | we got tablets | Dec 14 06:21 |
| cubexyz | the pirate bay guy had some interesting things to say about capitalism | Dec 14 06:22 |
| cubexyz | I'll see if I can locate the link | Dec 14 06:22 |
| msb__ | The Pirate Party? | Dec 14 06:22 |
| cubexyz | ok, I think the link was posted in here | Dec 14 06:25 |
| cubexyz | http://motherboard.vice.com/read/pirate-bay-founder-peter-sunde-i-have-given-up?trk_source=popular | Dec 14 06:25 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-motherboard.vice.com | Pirate Bay Founder: ‘I Have Given Up’ | Motherboard | Dec 14 06:25 | |
| cubexyz | Peter Sunde... I think he was in jail for a while | Dec 14 06:26 |
| cubexyz | although I think filesharing still continues | Dec 14 06:27 |
| cubexyz | I think you mentioned the The Shock Doctine before | Dec 14 06:29 |
| msb__ | Yes, it's a very important book. | Dec 14 06:30 |
| msb__ | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pirate_Party | Dec 14 06:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | Pirate Party - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/ocdms ] | Dec 14 06:30 | |
| msb__ | pirate bay is still working | Dec 14 06:30 |
| msb__ | YIFY has been killed, unfortunately | Dec 14 06:31 |
| cubexyz | Sunde got hammered | Dec 14 06:33 |
| msb__ | This is a very good video about how huge banks made trillions of dollars with criminal schemes, and then got nations to bail out the failing ones by robbing their citizens with austerity. http://whos-saving-whom.org/index.php/en/ | Dec 14 06:33 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-whos-saving-whom.org | Whos saving whom - Home [ http://ur1.ca/ocdn0 ] | Dec 14 06:33 | |
| msb__ | Most of it was shown on RT these last two days, or you can buy it for $22. Hopefully it will get on bt at some point. | Dec 14 06:34 |
| msb__ | So far, bt is still thriving, comprising something like 30% of Net traffic. | Dec 14 06:42 |
| msb__ | Every type of drm and censorship has been defeated by clever people. | Dec 14 06:42 |
| oiaohm | Really there is a pre human example of burning coal causing envornmental change. There was a coal field in one of the old russia states that before humans was set alight by metorite. | Dec 14 06:46 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, any references for that? | Dec 14 07:11 |
| cubexyz | the coal wouldn't be on the surface would it? | Dec 14 07:12 |
| cubexyz | when you think about it humans were using renewables before the industrial revolution: | Dec 14 07:14 |
| cubexyz | biomass (animals), sun, water and wind | Dec 14 07:14 |
| cubexyz | sailboats, horses, wind-mills, etc | Dec 14 07:15 |
| cubexyz | wood-burning stoves (wood -> renewable by planting more trees) | Dec 14 07:16 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I wish I could find the reference. I remember covering it in worse possible coal fire. | Dec 14 07:25 |
| cubexyz | I suppose the coal could have been right on the surface and the meteorite ignited it | Dec 14 07:26 |
| oiaohm | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal_seam_fire coal seam fire burn under ground. Australia's Burning Mountain from all maths has been burning for 6000 years. | Dec 14 07:35 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | Coal seam fire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/ocdpo ] | Dec 14 07:35 | |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: basically big rock hits under ground coal field with enough force it will light. | Dec 14 07:35 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: So the worse place for a meteorite to hit earth is right on top of a large oil/coal field. | Dec 14 07:36 |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6910191 | Dec 14 08:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Congresswoman Asks Feds Why They Pressured a Library to Disable Its Tor Node http://motherboard.vice.com/read/congresswoman-asks-feds-why-they-pressured-a-library-to-disable-its-tor-node go Zoe! She's great. #tor #anonymity | Dec 14 08:11 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> motherboard.vice.com | Congresswoman Asks Feds Why They Pressured a Library to Disable Its Tor Node | Motherboard [ http://ur1.ca/occse ] | Dec 14 08:11 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 14 08:11 |
| schestowitz | I was at LSU when this stuff rolled through and did not understand it at the time. LSU eliminated anonymous wifi and implemented WPA, which only worked with new versions of Microsoft at the time. I’m told they eventually eliminated anonymous wired connections as well. WPA annoyed me enough to chat with the head of IT who said the changes were driven by Federal laws and he was unable to talk about all of it. CIPA was not mentioned by name | Dec 14 08:11 |
| schestowitz | and as neither of us could do anything about Federal law, I failed to pursue the issue. I resigned myself to elimination of free software wifi use because I had good wired connectivity in the places I wanted it. I was unaware of the nature and pervasiveness of domestic spying at the time and did not connect the dots. I chalked it up to Microsoft and partners forcing expensive equipment sales that put free software at a disadvantage. I | Dec 14 08:11 |
| schestowitz | imagine we still don’t know about everything that was put in. | Dec 14 08:11 |
| schestowitz | In retrospect, it was outrageous - that the student fee built network was commandeered by some sort of secret federal laws. Given all the domestic spying abuse, I now think CIPA was mostly about spying on people. | Dec 14 08:11 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 14 08:11 |
| cubexyz | I assume Linux can use WPA now? | Dec 14 09:20 |
| cubexyz | and WPA isn't microsoft I don't think | Dec 14 09:21 |
| cubexyz | it's IEEE 802.11 (since 2003) | Dec 14 09:21 |
| cubexyz | one can philsophically debate whether or not free wi-fi is good | Dec 14 09:23 |
| cubexyz | really once people get a bit more knowledgeable microsoft is toast | Dec 14 09:25 |
| cubexyz | it's just worse... | Dec 14 09:25 |
| cubexyz | no sane person is going to defend twain, or asp or wma stuff | Dec 14 09:25 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/foss-matrix.txt | Dec 14 09:26 |
| cubexyz | who actually wants DRM on ebooks? | Dec 14 09:26 |
| cubexyz | not the reader, that's for sure | Dec 14 09:26 |
| cubexyz | the list of why it's worse gets longer and longer after each new release of windows | Dec 14 09:27 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wpa_supplicant WPA support has been on Linux since 2003. | Dec 14 09:50 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | wpa_supplicant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/ocdw0 ] | Dec 14 09:50 | |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: please note to use WPA under windows using particular wifi cards you need the same program. | Dec 14 09:51 |
| cubexyz | what program? | Dec 14 09:51 |
| oiaohm | "wpa supplicant" is the name of the program to make older wifi cards have WPA. | Dec 14 09:52 |
| cubexyz | ok... so that other person is wrong about WPA being a microsoft thing | Dec 14 09:54 |
| cubexyz | it's actually cross-platform | Dec 14 09:54 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: https://w1.fi/wpa_supplicant/ WPA standard comes approved from 2004. The program to support it was on Linux before routers shipped with WPA. | Dec 14 09:55 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-w1.fi | Linux WPA Supplicant (IEEE 802.1X, WPA, WPA2, RSN, IEEE 802.11i) | Dec 14 09:55 | |
| oiaohm | fun fact about wpa is that you can use it on a wired network. | Dec 14 09:55 |
| cubexyz | is there any reason to do that? | Dec 14 09:56 |
| oiaohm | It is kinda encrypted. | Dec 14 09:56 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FOSSpatents/status/676340117372542976 | Dec 14 09:59 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FOSSpatents: @schestowitz @Sheikh_al_Touar I would consider it a conspiracy theory to conclude from this that Google shares GMail messages with Benoit B. | Dec 14 09:59 | |
| schestowitz | Not Google, maybe GCHQ via @Control_Risks | Dec 14 09:59 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: when I say fun fact is the reality of it but most of the time it worthless. There is better network encryption options than using wpa. | Dec 14 10:01 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.infoworld.com/article/3012987/microsoft-windows/microsoft-edge-has-inherited-many-of-internet-explorers-security-holes.html | Dec 14 10:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.infoworld.com | Microsoft Edge has inherited many of Internet Explorer's security holes | InfoWorld [ http://ur1.ca/ocdwo ] | Dec 14 10:03 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 10:03 |
| schestowitz | > did I send that already? | Dec 14 10:03 |
| schestowitz | No, it's good coming from a MS booster | Dec 14 10:03 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FOSSpatents/status/676341540252459008 | Dec 14 10:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FOSSpatents: @schestowitz @Sheikh_al_Touar OK. I don't like Google's cooperation with the EPO either, but that doesn't diminish my trust in Google/GMail. | Dec 14 10:04 | |
| schestowitz | It's not so much about the EPO as much as about NSA/GCHQ PRISM and their privatised entities (which work with them) | Dec 14 10:05 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: knew t there was something about wifi encryption that was a laugh. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wired_Equivalent_Privacy Yes This is the full name of the WEP protocol that was used over Wifi that was full of holes. | Dec 14 10:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | Wired Equivalent Privacy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia [ http://ur1.ca/ocdwr ] | Dec 14 10:05 | |
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| oiaohm | schestowitz: Please remember groups like the NSA has legal powers they can use to make privatieds entities obey them. | Dec 14 10:06 |
| schestowitz | > older: | Dec 14 10:07 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > "she pointed to posts about Goodfellas that he had "liked" on Facebook. | Dec 14 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > The judge denied Jelani bail,... The trial never came." | Dec 14 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.theverge.com/2014/12/10/7341077/nypd-harlem-crews-social-media-rikers-prison | Dec 14 10:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theverge.com | How the NYPD is using social media to put Harlem teens behind bars | The Verge [ http://ur1.ca/j351z ] | Dec 14 10:08 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > - | Dec 14 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/dec/13/facebook-offices-hamburg-germany-vandalised | Dec 14 10:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theguardian.com | Facebook offices in Hamburg vandalised | Technology | The Guardian [ http://ur1.ca/ocdx0 ] | Dec 14 10:08 | |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yeah | Dec 14 10:08 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FOSSpatents/status/676342911408164864 | Dec 14 10:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FOSSpatents: @schestowitz ok | Dec 14 10:11 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676343114815152128 https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676343376673918976 | Dec 14 10:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz @Sheikh_al_Touar @FOSSpatents So Google is participating to the patent inflation, including software patents. | Dec 14 10:11 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz @Sheikh_al_Touar @FOSSpatents Automated and non-legally binding translations still have to be tested in court. Stay tuned. | Dec 14 10:11 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Zeipt/status/676344140360261632 | Dec 14 10:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Zeipt: @schestowitz seems, it was hacked by russians - ukrainians not using mail.ru, because it is russian FSS freindly corp)) | Dec 14 10:16 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/676355600255721472 | Dec 14 11:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @ilgiornale @fattoquotidiano @corriere @reportrai3 @Serv_Pubblico @byoblu @LaGabbiaTw @POLITICOEurope https://t.co/Zld5ctQvSC | Dec 14 11:18 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #epo is political and interventionist. Here it is publicly batting for the #UPC https://t.co/d9pszSGgbp | Dec 14 11:18 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynco/status/676374506504634368 | Dec 14 12:14 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynco: @schestowitz A month prior CIA attorney Jon Fredman came to GTMO & said "If a detainee dies, you're doing it wrong." Guess they got it wrong | Dec 14 12:14 | |
| schestowitz | They'll just need to give them Hell, repeatedly, without giving them peace (death). #cia #torture #radicalisation | Dec 14 12:14 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-demonstrates-its-linux-based-azure-cloud-switch-operating-system/ | Dec 14 12:22 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.zdnet.com | Microsoft demonstrates its Linux-based Azure Cloud Switch operating system | ZDNet [ http://ur1.ca/oce6b ] | Dec 14 12:22 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 12:22 |
| schestowitz | > https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/blog/microsoft-showcases-the-azure-cloud-switch-acs/ | Dec 14 12:22 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-azure.microsoft.com | Microsoft showcases the Azure Cloud Switch (ACS) | Microsoft Azure Blog [ http://ur1.ca/oce6c ] | Dec 14 12:22 | |
| schestowitz | Getting desperate now... | Dec 14 12:22 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/676382213815017472 | Dec 14 12:59 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @fattoquotidiano @ilgiornale @diregiustizia @altalex @Corriereit @byoblu @reportrai3 @LaGabbiaTw @confindustria https://t.co/CnDgbBTqIz | Dec 14 12:59 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Terrible stuff. More lawsuits, more injunctions, more public tax. And for who? Non-European mega/superpowers... https://t.co/rW1sSWlkf6 | Dec 14 12:59 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/676382604971663360 | Dec 14 13:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @wallstreetita https://t.co/CnDgbBTqIz | Dec 14 13:00 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676385467860918273 | Dec 14 13:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz fail2ban on which port? SSH? | Dec 14 13:00 | |
| schestowitz | http/80 | Dec 14 13:00 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676387284418240512 | Dec 14 13:10 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz which useragent? maybe a transparent spying proxy hammering? | Dec 14 13:10 | |
| schestowitz | I thought about it, hard to check (need to scan logs, not a priority at the moment) | Dec 14 13:11 |
| oiaohm | msb__: thanks for wishing me luck before. I had a brain spark what if the reason why the missed sector count was so high was controller problem. Yep it was. From 2G back to 25meg of unaccessable. Real pain have to repeatily power on and off the drive. | Dec 14 13:22 |
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| sebsebseb | hi | Dec 14 14:23 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/JavaFact/status/676404034794688512 | Dec 14 17:20 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@JavaFact: IBM's open source #JVM project could also speed #Ruby , 3Python https://t.co/lZKaCfsdyK #freesw via @schestowitz | Dec 14 17:20 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.infoworld.com | IBM's open source JVM project could also speed Ruby, Python | InfoWorld | Dec 14 17:20 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynco/status/676416548572106753 | Dec 14 17:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynco: @fth_nix @schestowitz they were suppressed, marginalized, ignored and looked at as unPatriotic. | Dec 14 17:23 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Laura_F_ERCOLI/status/676426232297320448 | Dec 14 17:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Laura_F_ERCOLI: @zoobab @KrapulaPhD @schestowitz sorry everyone, tweet about 5 months old, content no longer on web site. | Dec 14 17:23 | |
| schestowitz | Maybe time to change their minds :-) | Dec 14 17:23 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/zoobab/status/676453591889133568 | Dec 14 17:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@zoobab: @schestowitz let's really make sure those EPO IP addresses cannot really read techrights :-) | Dec 14 17:30 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/LFarrapos/status/676459918656987136 | Dec 14 17:56 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@LFarrapos: Olá schestowitz, curta nossa pagina no facebook! ♥ :) https://t.co/b6Gj4QhU0P https://t.co/FVBcDAx5Eg | Dec 14 17:56 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.facebook.com | Facebook | Dec 14 17:56 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Interestingly enough, same legal firm which lobbies alongside #microsoft on the #patent front is the same one threatening me for #epo now | Dec 14 17:56 | |
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| *Disconnected (). | Dec 14 20:27 | |
| **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Dec 14 20:27:48 2015 | ||
| **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Dec 14 20:28:04 2015 | ||
| *Now talking on #techrights | Dec 14 20:28 | |
| *Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org | Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell | Dec 14 20:28 | |
| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 14 20:28 | |
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| sebsebseb | Dec 14 20:33 | |
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| schestowitz | > Hi Ron, | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | Roy actually. ;-) | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | Dec 14 22:40 | |
| schestowitz | > Kyle here from The Linux Foundation PR team. | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > Tomorrow The Linux Foundation is announcing three new Silver members, | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > and on Thursday, we're launching a Collaborative Project in cloud native | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > computing. | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > I thought you might be interested in an early look for these | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > announcements. If you're ok to honor an embargo, I can send over details. | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > Thank you!! | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | > Kyle | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | If you send over the press releases, I'll post these in tuxmachines.org | Dec 14 22:40 |
| schestowitz | Embargo schmembargo... | Dec 14 23:25 |
| schestowitz | Here is some headsup regarding PR to come in 3 days from now: | Dec 14 23:25 |
| schestowitz | For tomorrow (supposed to be secret): | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | UNDER EMBARGO: Embargo lifts Tuesday, December 15, 2015 at 8 am ET | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | Linux Foundation Drives Mass Innovation Through Open Source with New Members | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | Welcomes Autodesk, Concurrent Computer Corporation and DataKinetics to the organization | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | SAN FRANCISCO – December 15, 2015 – The Linux Foundation, the nonprofit organization enabling mass innovation through open source, today is announcing three new silver members are joining the organization: Autodesk, Concurrent Computer Corporation and DataKinetics. | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | Thousands of developers and more than 600 organizations work across Linux Foundation-hosted projects. From container technologies and application platforms to datacenter operating systems and networking, The Linux Foundation provides critical services to support every corner of technology infrastructure. By growing the member ecosystem to include software solutions and big data processing experts, The Linux Foundation further unites the | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | world’s leading technologists to drive open innovation on a global scale. | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | “Open source has become the de facto way to create software. The Linux Foundation provides a neutral home for organizations to develop technology at scale and at a rate that can’t be matched working on their own,” said Jim Zemlin, executive director, The Linux Foundation. “We’re excited to welcome these members to our organization as we enter another exciting year of collaboration.” | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | More information about the newest Linux Foundation members: | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | Autodesk (NASDAQ: ADSK) helps people imagine, design and create a better world. Over 170 million design professionals, including engineers, architects, digital artists, students and hobbyists, use Autodesk software to unlock their creativity and solve important challenges. | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | "Autodesk has been working to democratize access to design and fabrication software as part of our effort to support the newly emerging future of making things," said Guy Martin, Director, Open Source Strategy at Autodesk. "Open source is an important component of this effort, and we're excited to join the Linux Foundation to accelerate our participation in this critical ecosystem." | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | Concurrent (NASDAQ: CCUR) is a global software and solutions company that develops advanced applications on a core foundation of high performance Linux® and storage technologies. The company recently launched Aquari™, a Ceph-based scale-out storage solution powered by its advanced real-time Linux extensions that is designed to support the more demanding performance needs of enterprise and video customers. | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | “Concurrent’s technology strategy is increasingly shaped by our participation in open source development forums,” said Dale Gonzalez, Chief Technology Officer at Concurrent. “As open source software becomes an important part of our customer’s technology stack, we are finding new opportunities to deliver unique value by combining the advantages of our own solutions with the power of community-driven software. We are excited to join | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | The Linux Foundation and to collaborate with other thought-leaders from a wide range of industries.” | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | DataKinetics is a global leader in data performance and optimization solutions. The company optimizes data throughput and processing speeds for the world’s largest banks, credit card, brokerage, insurance, healthcare, retail and telecommunication organizations. | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | “The intersection of Big Data and mobile processing has caused unprecedented demand for mainframe capabilities. Only Linux’s rate of development can match that demand,” said Allan Zander, Chief Executive Officer, DataKinetics. “Working regularly with these Fortune 500 companies, we understand the unique challenges and critical need for scalable solutions. As a member of The Linux Foundation and the Open Mainframe Project, we’re | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | eager to contribute to the future technologies that will serve the needs of the industry and those of our customers.” | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | jgay: autodesk in Linux Foundation | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | but also VMWare | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | so less money for the Conservancy | Dec 14 23:26 |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6912656 | Dec 14 23:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@linux@joindiaspora.com: LetsEncrypt now available in Fedora https://fedoramagazine.org/letsencrypt-now-available-fedora/ | Dec 14 23:28 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://fedoramagazine.org/letsencrypt-now-available-fedora/ ) | Dec 14 23:28 | |
| schestowitz | "Hopefully that means a proper CentOS install isn’t far behind." | Dec 14 23:28 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/FrancisJeffrey7/status/676578762394173441 | Dec 15 01:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@FrancisJeffrey7: @SMCADMAN @schestowitz Seems some gov. seeking ID of privacy & security advocates. Not surprising! Let's ask @ioerror ...? | Dec 15 01:48 | |
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| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 09:44 |
| schestowitz | Thank you very much. | Dec 15 09:44 |
| schestowitz | What I can't understand is why in the break-prism website DDG is still among the suggestions of web searchers (https://prism-break.org/en/all/#web-search) | Dec 15 09:44 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 09:44 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-prism-break.org | All Projects - PRISM Break [ http://ur1.ca/ocg42 ] | Dec 15 09:44 | |
| schestowitz | Clever marketing from DDG | Dec 15 09:44 |
| schestowitz | > "The publisher of the Las Vegas Review-Journal removed quotes from a | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > Thursday night article about the newspaper's sale that questioned its | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > new owner's decision to remain anonymous" | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20151214/11203533076/las-vegas-review-journal-now-owned.shtml | Dec 15 10:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.techdirt.com | Las Vegas Review-Journal Now Owned By... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ | Techdirt [ http://ur1.ca/ocg4q ] | Dec 15 10:08 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > Just in time for the upcoming major election. | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > == | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/mediatechnologyandtelecoms/digital-media/12050693/Yahoo-told-cut-9000-of-your-10.700-staff.html | Dec 15 10:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.telegraph.co.uk | Yahoo told: cut 9,000 of your 10.700 staff - Telegraph [ http://ur1.ca/ocg4r ] | Dec 15 10:08 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | > M$ effects roll on and on ... | Dec 15 10:08 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/fleming77/status/676703706813870080 | Dec 15 10:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@fleming77: this fuels climate change https://t.co/OtI7lIqAX1 | Dec 15 10:08 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Rampant #Indonesia fires causing havoc in Papua https://t.co/0OHGs7IPdV #imperialism through burning | Dec 15 10:08 | |
| cubexyz | cut 9,0000 of 10,700? | Dec 15 10:16 |
| cubexyz | sounds pretty drastic | Dec 15 10:16 |
| schestowitz | > "Having the best tech or the best marketing cannot help you win if the | Dec 15 10:16 |
| schestowitz | > product is crap" | Dec 15 10:16 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 10:16 |
| schestowitz | > http://communities-dominate.blogs.com/brands/2015/12/revisiting-best-big-data-case-study-we-have-new-details-about-narwhal-vs-orca-case-study-of-us-elect.html | Dec 15 10:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-communities-dominate.blogs.com | Communities Dominate Brands: Revisiting Best Big Data Case Study: We Have New Details about Narwhal vs Orca Case Study (of US Elections 2012 and world's largest Big Data project for which there is performance data) (Updated) [ http://ur1.ca/ocg58 ] | Dec 15 10:16 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 10:16 |
| schestowitz | > I expect that line refers to both the candidate and his programmers. | Dec 15 10:16 |
| schestowitz | cubexyz: yeah | Dec 15 10:16 |
| schestowitz | MSFT killed Yahoo | Dec 15 10:16 |
| schestowitz | http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/Microsoft_Hijack_of_Yahoo | Dec 15 10:17 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Microsoft Hijack of Yahoo - Techrights [ http://ur1.ca/518kt ] | Dec 15 10:17 | |
| schestowitz | What is this, an ad? http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2496295,00.asp | Dec 15 10:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pcmag.com | Microsoft Azure Review & Rating | PCMag.com [ http://ur1.ca/ocg6l ] | Dec 15 10:41 | |
| schestowitz | IDG "excellent".... on a bloody network | Dec 15 10:41 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/SleepyPenguin1/status/676721231253495808 | Dec 15 11:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@SleepyPenguin1: I've had some discussions with Sean Gourley about this @schestowitz https://t.co/BN4RKMn3GE | Dec 15 11:16 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> seangourley.com | Sean Gourley — thoughts from the intersection of science, technology and politics | Dec 15 11:16 | |
| msb__ | Russian rocket just took off from Baikonur Cosmodrome for the International Space Station with three crew aboard -- Russian, US, and UK. | Dec 15 11:16 |
| cubexyz | nice | Dec 15 11:17 |
| cubexyz | cooperation for a change :) | Dec 15 11:18 |
| msb__ | Superb new sci-fi series "The Expanse" from, of all places, the | Dec 15 11:26 |
| msb__ | "Syfy" channel (sometimes known as "Syphy"). Excellent major motion picture scale production values. | Dec 15 11:27 |
| msb__ | Second episode to be broadcast tonight. Get them both! | Dec 15 11:27 |
| oiaohm | msb__: I managed to recover all bar 25 meg of the 500Gb drive I had die. I had a brain spark the harddive own controller board was crashing every time it found a bad sector then playing dead. | Dec 15 12:22 |
| msb__ | oiaohm: Big congrats! | Dec 15 12:23 |
| oiaohm | msb__: even better 20megs was already declared dead by file system. | Dec 15 12:24 |
| cubexyz | doesn't anyone do backups? | Dec 15 12:24 |
| cubexyz | I see that a million times... | Dec 15 12:25 |
| cubexyz | backups should be at least weekly | Dec 15 12:25 |
| cubexyz | get cron to do an rsync nightly | Dec 15 12:26 |
| cubexyz | you wouldn't believe the horror stories I could tell | Dec 15 12:27 |
| cubexyz | software companies with all their svn stuff on one hard drive! | Dec 15 12:27 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: shocking part here is that I have specialised in data recovery. | Dec 15 12:27 |
| cubexyz | and not backed up | Dec 15 12:27 |
| oiaohm | I have horror stories with price tags. | Dec 15 12:27 |
| cubexyz | it's your own hard drive you're working on? | Dec 15 12:28 |
| cubexyz | tsk tsk! | Dec 15 12:28 |
| oiaohm | So far out of all the drives I have had personally on me I have never lost more than 1 percent of the data. I though this time I was going to break my own record. | Dec 15 12:28 |
| oiaohm | Just working out exactly what has gone wrong with the drive. | Dec 15 12:29 |
| oiaohm | This recovery cost me 36 hours. | Dec 15 12:29 |
| oiaohm | At 50 dollars an hour if this was billed it would be ouch. | Dec 15 12:29 |
| cubexyz | $1800 | Dec 15 12:30 |
| cubexyz | yeah rsync is cheaper | Dec 15 12:30 |
| oiaohm | No that is 1800 to me. | Dec 15 12:30 |
| oiaohm | Client it would be 120 per hour. | Dec 15 12:30 |
| cubexyz | you know the story of how Unix v1 was saved? | Dec 15 12:31 |
| cubexyz | it was printed out | Dec 15 12:31 |
| cubexyz | so any program I write I print it out... sometimes that's not enough | Dec 15 12:32 |
| cubexyz | the toolchain has to be reserved as well | Dec 15 12:32 |
| cubexyz | preserved | Dec 15 12:32 |
| oiaohm | Proper backups are cheaper cubexyz. But remembering when a drive is dead its not is critical. | Dec 15 12:32 |
| oiaohm | the 500g drive I just got this huge percentage from had a failed MBR cubexyz | Dec 15 12:33 |
| oiaohm | So insert into windows or linux without recovery tools it pretends to be completely dead. | Dec 15 12:33 |
| oiaohm | Harddrive is only not recoverable when it fragments. | Dec 15 12:34 |
| oiaohm | Preferably very small fragements. | Dec 15 12:34 |
| cubexyz | wasn't M-DISC supposed to solve these archival problems? | Dec 15 12:35 |
| cubexyz | can't really trust a hard drive much beyond 10 years | Dec 15 12:36 |
| cubexyz | or maybe even less than that | Dec 15 12:36 |
| cubexyz | some of my amiga floppies are close to 30 years | Dec 15 12:37 |
| oiaohm | I normally turn over my harddrives every 6 years. | Dec 15 12:37 |
| oiaohm | This 500GB drive got lost. | Dec 15 12:38 |
| cubexyz | how old is the 500GB? | Dec 15 12:38 |
| oiaohm | I was found 5 days before it death it was setup for replacement on the day it died. | Dec 15 12:38 |
| oiaohm | I was found/It was found | Dec 15 12:38 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the drive that died was made 2008-04-04 | Dec 15 12:42 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: so only a few years over my replacement time frame. | Dec 15 12:42 |
| cubexyz | I think lower density hard drives might last longer | Dec 15 12:42 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly. | Dec 15 12:43 |
| oiaohm | The main issue with the drive I had is the controller had gone nuts. | Dec 15 12:43 |
| oiaohm | Smart tech in harddrive is a double sided sword. | Dec 15 12:43 |
| cubexyz | ok, the computer that contained the defective 500gb drive... did it have a UPS? | Dec 15 12:43 |
| oiaohm | Yes I had a UPS | Dec 15 12:44 |
| oiaohm | Motherboard was also old and the power supply part on motherboard lost the wrong caps. | Dec 15 12:44 |
| cubexyz | ok, I keep track of my hard drives | Dec 15 12:44 |
| oiaohm | I normally do cubexyz | Dec 15 12:45 |
| cubexyz | I have mutiple ST340810A's | Dec 15 12:45 |
| cubexyz | 2001 era | Dec 15 12:45 |
| oiaohm | Please note this 500GB drive has been running 24/7 since it was installed. | Dec 15 12:45 |
| cubexyz | sure, mine too | Dec 15 12:45 |
| oiaohm | I would say that lucky. | Dec 15 12:45 |
| oiaohm | http://www.bugaco.com/calculators/seagate_date_code.php very useful with seagate harddrives. | Dec 15 12:46 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.bugaco.com | Seagate date code calculator and decoder - bugaco.com [ http://ur1.ca/0bhc1 ] | Dec 15 12:46 | |
| oiaohm | There is another problem with harddrives. If they are left sitting the bearings also start going. | Dec 15 12:47 |
| cubexyz | what I've seen is shorter lifespans on optical drives, e.g. cdrom, dvd, etc | Dec 15 12:47 |
| oiaohm | Really that with optical drives depends on conditions. | Dec 15 12:47 |
| oiaohm | and quality. | Dec 15 12:47 |
| oiaohm | In clean room you adverage about 14 years out a quality optical drive. | Dec 15 12:48 |
| cubexyz | ok... now for the Amiga 500... it has Quantum 49MB LP52S | Dec 15 12:48 |
| cubexyz | from 1990! | Dec 15 12:48 |
| cubexyz | but I only run it once or twice per month nowadays | Dec 15 12:48 |
| oiaohm | 49MB harddrives no smart in controller on harddrive. | Dec 15 12:48 |
| cubexyz | is that better? | Dec 15 12:48 |
| oiaohm | So you get it declare dead sectors and keep it kicking. | Dec 15 12:48 |
| oiaohm | Smart runs out of means to replace a dead sector with another the bastard starts locking up the harddrive. | Dec 15 12:49 |
| oiaohm | yes checking if harddrives are replacing sectors is critical. | Dec 15 12:50 |
| oiaohm | That is what drew my attention to it in the first place. It had replaced 4000+ sectors in 1 month. | Dec 15 12:50 |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6913320 | Dec 15 12:50 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Top 10 open source projects of 2015 https://opensource.com/business/15/12/top-10-open-source-projects-2015 #freesw | Dec 15 12:50 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> opensource.com | 10 amazing open source projects from 2015 | Opensource.com [ http://ur1.ca/ocgdx ] | Dec 15 12:50 | |
| schestowitz | "And what are our top ten p2p software projects?" | Dec 15 12:50 |
| schestowitz | I never p2p, too risky with ISPs... | Dec 15 12:51 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: https://twitter.com/MaryBethCarney3/status/676713840587902976?t=1&cn=bWVudGlvbg%3D%3D&sig=95907361cefbdf64982ae7779ba21557916f121b&al=1&refsrc=email&iid=152db36addc74bfaad3176dea8c89a47&autoactions=1450176127&uid=26603208&nid=4+1267 | Dec 15 12:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MaryBethCarney3: @fflandro @schestowitz https://t.co/Hm91yDL5KV | Dec 15 12:53 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MaryBethCarney3: @fflandro @schestowitz https://t.co/Hm91yDL5KV | Dec 15 12:53 | |
| cubexyz | ok, I've updated my longevity list to include hard drives that have lasted a long time: | Dec 15 12:56 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/computer-longevity.txt | Dec 15 12:56 |
| cubexyz | ok, now the quantum drives were made in japan, perhaps that's why they lasted longer | Dec 15 12:56 |
| cubexyz | so the Quantum LP52S is 25 years old at least | Dec 15 12:58 |
| cubexyz | pretty impressive | Dec 15 12:58 |
| cubexyz | guess I should fire it up to be sure :) | Dec 15 12:59 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: Its tech. | Dec 15 12:59 |
| oiaohm | The more complex the controller the more parts in it to screw up. | Dec 15 13:00 |
| cubexyz | note the oldest working CRT is 30 years | Dec 15 13:00 |
| oiaohm | I know of a 20 Meg 2 foot across harddrive 35 years old that is still working perfectly cubexyz | Dec 15 13:00 |
| oiaohm | Mind you lower denisty does help a bit. | Dec 15 13:01 |
| cubexyz | my point :) | Dec 15 13:01 |
| oiaohm | Biggest cause of modern harddrive data lost is not drive surface failures. | Dec 15 13:01 |
| oiaohm | But controller deciding not to work correctly. | Dec 15 13:02 |
| oiaohm | 35 old controller is insanely simple compared to modern day drives. | Dec 15 13:02 |
| cubexyz | 30 year old CRT is on and working... 1990 drive also working | Dec 15 13:03 |
| oiaohm | Again 1990 drive is prior to smart and sector remapping. | Dec 15 13:03 |
| oiaohm | The dirty tricks to make harddrives work with MBR has decreased their stablity. | Dec 15 13:04 |
| oiaohm | 1990 drive is most likely reporting a real sector map. | Dec 15 13:04 |
| oiaohm | Not a virtual one. | Dec 15 13:04 |
| cubexyz | one thing about the amiga, the power switch is on the external power supply which is on the floor | Dec 15 13:09 |
| cubexyz | not too convenient | Dec 15 13:09 |
| cubexyz | also my desk isn't really large enough for 4 computers | Dec 15 13:12 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I never found that a problem. Turned it on and off with tip of boot. | Dec 15 13:12 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: added different meaning to booting a computer. | Dec 15 13:12 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I did have a amiga a long long time ago. | Dec 15 13:13 |
| cubexyz | oh, which one? | Dec 15 13:13 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: to be correct two 500 and 1200 | Dec 15 13:16 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/amigados-1.0.gif | Dec 15 13:16 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: but sersouslly I turned that switch on the powersupply on and off with boot. | Dec 15 13:16 |
| oiaohm | It was just sticking it in a place that it could not be moved. | Dec 15 13:16 |
| cubexyz | I would have kept those | Dec 15 13:16 |
| cubexyz | I thought the amiga was so futuristic when I first saw it :) | Dec 15 13:17 |
| oiaohm | both of the amiga I had were destoryed by a fire. | Dec 15 13:17 |
| cubexyz | that's not good | Dec 15 13:19 |
| cubexyz | when the amiga was first launched it only had 256K of ram | Dec 15 13:19 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/christmas-1985-256k-amiga.png | Dec 15 13:19 |
| cubexyz | 30 years ago... | Dec 15 13:20 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: losing equipment is better than losing life. | Dec 15 13:21 |
| cubexyz | true | Dec 15 13:21 |
| oiaohm | It was a case of bush fire | Dec 15 13:21 |
| oiaohm | You leave behined items that you believe you will replace later. | Dec 15 13:22 |
| oiaohm | To be truthful I do miss the power on switch on flour where you can sit down a desk. | Dec 15 13:22 |
| oiaohm | and the computer starts. | Dec 15 13:23 |
| cubexyz | I thought the old desktops were the best, but then everything seemed to switch to towers | Dec 15 13:23 |
| cubexyz | keeping the old amiga 500 was an indulgence | Dec 15 13:25 |
| cubexyz | eventually I turned into a Unix person... | Dec 15 13:27 |
| cubexyz | the amiga had a short life... only 9 years long | Dec 15 13:31 |
| cubexyz | 1985 to 1994, then Commodore went bankrupt | Dec 15 13:31 |
| cubexyz | it wasn't long before all the distributors dropped all the amiga stuff | Dec 15 13:32 |
| oiaohm | Last commodore was a x86 computer. | Dec 15 13:32 |
| oiaohm | Also you have to remember a lot of the early stuff like amiga depended on Microsoft supplying stuff. | Dec 15 13:33 |
| cubexyz | Microsoft didn't supply anything for amiga | Dec 15 13:33 |
| cubexyz | well, maybe one thing... amigabasic... and it sucked | Dec 15 13:33 |
| oiaohm | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AmigaBASIC | Dec 15 13:34 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | AmigaBASIC - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia | Dec 15 13:34 | |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, no one used it | Dec 15 13:34 |
| oiaohm | Yep amigabasic was written by Microsoft. | Dec 15 13:34 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly. | Dec 15 13:34 |
| cubexyz | it was buggy | Dec 15 13:35 |
| oiaohm | basic was used a lot as the univeral source code based applications between all the systems. | Dec 15 13:35 |
| oiaohm | Yes amiga replaced basic with basic they sourced from other locations. | Dec 15 13:35 |
| cubexyz | True BASIC, Blitz Basic were both much better | Dec 15 13:35 |
| oiaohm | But when Microsoft stop providing basic and focused full time on Windows the basic based items become very limited. | Dec 15 13:36 |
| cubexyz | and what was this late x86 commodore computer? | Dec 15 13:36 |
| cubexyz | I'm drawing a blank on that | Dec 15 13:36 |
| cubexyz | I thought the last one was the Amiga 4000 | Dec 15 13:39 |
| oiaohm | http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/a2088t | Dec 15 13:42 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-amiga.resource.cx | Commodore A2088T - Amiga Hardware Database | Dec 15 13:42 | |
| oiaohm | Doing that fairly much put the end to getting Commodore only software. | Dec 15 13:43 |
| cubexyz | seems easier just to have a separate PC | Dec 15 13:44 |
| cubexyz | that's what I did | Dec 15 13:44 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I remember the http://amiga.resource.cx/mod/a4000.html without the expand card fitted. | Dec 15 13:50 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-amiga.resource.cx | Amiga Hardware Database - Amiga 4000 | Dec 15 13:50 | |
| oiaohm | Yes it also looks insanely like a PC. | Dec 15 13:50 |
| oiaohm | So all the Amiga nice design gone out the window by the end. | Dec 15 13:50 |
| oiaohm | What make the C64 so popular was the means to put it in a backpack and take it to a friends place and use it. | Dec 15 13:52 |
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| schestowitz | http://ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/merpel-pays-brief-visit-to-eponia.html?showComment=1450187818759 | Dec 15 14:31 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk | The IPKat: Merpel pays a brief visit to Eponia [ http://ur1.ca/ocgjv ] | Dec 15 14:31 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 14:31 |
| schestowitz | Can someone here answer the following questions? I am thinking about applying for an examiner post. Someone from inside told me I won't be able to work for 2 years after leaving the office. Is that true? How can the office impose that outside of Germany if I want to work as an attorney in Spain, for example? Can they force an attorney to fire me? | Dec 15 14:31 |
| schestowitz | The same person said that there are plans to lower pensions. What recourse do I have if the office refuses to pay pensions in the future or pays me less than originally agreed? | Dec 15 14:31 |
| schestowitz | A future examiner. | Dec 15 14:31 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 14:31 |
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| MinceR | schestowitz: (re tweet pic) nice | Dec 15 16:51 |
| schestowitz | I'll remember that one | Dec 15 17:25 |
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| schestowitz | http://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2015/12/merpel-pays-brief-visit-to-eponia.html?showComment=1450189384878#c7205125002494255825 | Dec 15 17:35 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ipkitten.blogspot.com | The IPKat: Merpel pays a brief visit to Eponia [ http://ur1.ca/ocgv2 ] | Dec 15 17:35 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 17:35 |
| schestowitz | MaxDrei, | Dec 15 17:35 |
| schestowitz | Perhaps inadvertently, you raise a critical question when dealing with Trans-national entities. | Dec 15 17:35 |
| schestowitz | To whom - if anyone at all - (and to what level) are "whatever" traditions and vows even amenable? | Dec 15 17:35 |
| schestowitz | As I often point out in your dabblings into the US patent environment, patent law is intrinsically law meant to be within a sovereign. Here in the US, we simply do not have the same EPOnia aspect that you all have. Your problem then with its leadership cannot have a solution that EITHER follows any US solution, NOR can look to the traditional within-sovereign "respect" factors (in truth, you just do not have any that apply, and even if you | Dec 15 17:35 |
| schestowitz | adopt them, to whom would you apply them to?) | Dec 15 17:35 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 17:35 |
| schestowitz | " US anon, if you are a lawyer registerd to practise then you have Bar Rules of Conduct. Not following them leaves you vulnerable to being struck off. That you do not understand my post gives me the feeling that you are not subject to any Rules of Professional Conduct. You can't escape them just by boarding a flight to Munich." | Dec 15 17:36 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 17:36 |
| schestowitz | User circles' interest in the fate of the Boards seem to gain momentum | Dec 15 17:36 |
| schestowitz | http://eplaw.org/epo-structural-reform-of-the-boards-of-appeal/ | Dec 15 17:36 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 15 17:36 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-eplaw.org | EPO – Structural Reform of the Boards of Appeal – EPLAW [ http://ur1.ca/ocgv5 ] | Dec 15 17:36 | |
| schestowitz | wow | Dec 15 17:39 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/676820276290654208 | Dec 15 17:45 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: Let's wish good luck to him, he's going to need it by the ton. And still it won't help him in the end. ;-) https://t.co/U2GjPNQPDG | Dec 15 17:45 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #EPO – Structural Reform of the Boards of Appeal https://t.co/sExqv8ey40 what a mess. #battistelli fights everyone. | Dec 15 17:45 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/MariusNestor/status/676820476358971393 https://twitter.com/MariusNestor/status/676821186647576576 | Dec 15 17:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MariusNestor: @schestowitz :) First one talks about upcoming things, 2nd one is about what was actually implemented in version 3.19.3 released yesterday. | Dec 15 17:49 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MariusNestor: @schestowitz Really? I see a lot people going "meah" when they hear about Enlightenment... Also, you're using KDE now :P | Dec 15 17:49 | |
| schestowitz | Not happily at all, 3 was great, 4 OK, 5? Don't get me started ;-) | Dec 15 17:49 |
| XRevan86 | > Enlightenment | Dec 15 17:49 |
| XRevan86 | meah | Dec 15 17:49 |
| schestowitz | why? | Dec 15 17:51 |
| schestowitz | with kde software | Dec 15 17:52 |
| XRevan86 | schestowitz: Enlightenment has a bad integration with Gtk and Qt. | Dec 15 17:53 |
| schestowitz | not all that bad | Dec 15 18:08 |
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| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6913525 | Dec 15 19:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: #battistelli "already burned his fingers badly with the TechRights affair... made it on to the pages of Private Eye" http://ipkitten.blogspot.com/2015/12/merpel-pays-brief-visit-to-eponia.html?showComment=1450175111498#c797513008796399089 | Dec 15 19:28 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> ipkitten.blogspot.com | The IPKat: Merpel pays a brief visit to Eponia | Dec 15 19:28 | |
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| schestowitz | hey | Dec 15 22:09 |
| schestowitz | the bots are down | Dec 15 22:09 |
| schestowitz | VPS has a disk issue | Dec 15 22:09 |
| schestowitz | tuxmachines bot will hopefully be back before xmas | Dec 15 22:09 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Twpalovi/status/676887255684882432 | Dec 15 22:15 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Twpalovi: @schestowitz @Control_Risks What is parallel construction? | Dec 15 22:16 | |
| schestowitz | Look it up. A probe with CRG involved alleges that Hardon spoke to @Fosspatents over #gmail - how would they know? CRG has ex-Stasi folks. | Dec 15 22:16 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/14/saudi-arabia-announces-military-alliance-terrorism | Dec 15 22:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theguardian.com | Saudi Arabia announces 34-state military alliance to fight terrorism | World news | The Guardian [ http://ur1.ca/ochge ] | Dec 15 22:49 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 22:49 |
| schestowitz | > older: | Dec 15 22:49 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 22:49 |
| schestowitz | > "defines terrorism as "calling for atheist thought in any form, or | Dec 15 22:49 |
| schestowitz | > calling into question the fundamentals of the Islamic religion" | Dec 15 22:49 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 15 22:49 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/saudi-arabia-declares-all-atheists-are-terrorists-in-new-law-to-crack-down-on-political-dissidents-9228389.html | Dec 15 22:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.independent.co.uk | Saudi Arabia declares all atheists are terrorists in new law to crack down on political dissidents | Middle East | News | The Independent [ http://ur1.ca/gyqai ] | Dec 15 22:49 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/caszwemer/status/676897486179606528 | Dec 15 22:54 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@caszwemer: @schestowitz indeed , my thoughs ! | Dec 15 22:54 | |
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| schestowitz | > "Note: For the purposes of this post, the term "use" refers to | Dec 16 09:00 |
| schestowitz | > including the project in your application." | Dec 16 09:00 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 16 09:00 |
| schestowitz | > x | Dec 16 09:00 |
| schestowitz | > https://www.nczonline.net/blog/2015/12/why-im-not-using-your-open-source-project/ | Dec 16 09:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://www.nczonline.net/blog/2015/12/why-im-not-using-your-open-source-project/ ) | Dec 16 09:00 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 16 09:00 |
| schestowitz | > Tries to smear GPL but otherwise has a few good points. | Dec 16 09:00 |
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| schestowitz | http://ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/all-due-care-when-not-responsible-for.html?showComment=1450248031771 | Dec 16 09:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk | The IPKat: "All due care" when not responsible for renewals | Dec 16 09:41 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 16 09:41 |
| schestowitz | My point was that it was not a disciplinary case and therefore this question did not to have bee answered by this board. EPAs may use agencies, secretaried, Australian attorneys, Crocodile Dundee or other stuff, but they remain legally responsible for their supervision. The flx of money is of no importance of respective responsibltes. The applicant cannot relieve the rep. from a duty which is imposed on him by the EPC The applicant's order | Dec 16 09:41 |
| schestowitz | in this respect has no legal effect. | Dec 16 09:41 |
| schestowitz | What happened here, was that a mandatory legal consequence was not imposed because somebody not qualified and evidently unable to perform a quite simple duty with due care did a major mistake - after having received reminders to perform this duty | Dec 16 09:41 |
| schestowitz | If an EPA is told to do something - wrong - the one who told him is to face the consequences not the public having to face an illegal ressurection of an actually abondoned claim. Art. 22(5) EPC is only there to limit the negative effect in extremis, it is not to be misused for justifying the manifest abuse of procedure by the applicant and the board. | Dec 16 09:41 |
| schestowitz | Lets hope that this "decision" is not to set case law. | Dec 16 09:41 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 16 09:41 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/dravashishet/status/677056199330689024 | Dec 16 09:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@dravashishet: @schestowitz world bank know it tht Corrupt Indian politicians will grab this money and again send it to their banks for deposite as a black | Dec 16 09:41 | |
| schestowitz | http://ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/merpel-pays-brief-visit-to-eponia.html?showComment=1450229274645 | Dec 16 09:42 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ipkitten.blogspot.co.uk | The IPKat: Merpel pays a brief visit to Eponia [ http://ur1.ca/ociez ] | Dec 16 09:42 | |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | My point is that I don't need to prove anything. You quoted me: "If you want to make a serious accusation like corruption, it's your job to prove it's 20000 Euros, not mine to prove it's only a 50 Euro travel insurance policy." You've not answered that. | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | This is your accusation, not mine. If you and your fellow SUEPO supporters want to convince me and the rest of the world, where is your evidence? Why should we believe it otherwise? | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | I have examined the latest material you've now cited. Your argument seems to be "FOSS Patents says it, therefore it must be true." | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | OK, so I've read the FOSS Patents links given. Mr Mueller is quite clear. He is not offering any proof. He is merely repeating an allegation he heard in a speech by a SUEPO official at a demonstration in Munich. | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | So where is the evidence relied on by this SUEPO official? I've tried to search the SUEPO website, but I've not been able to find it. | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | Could it be that this SUEPO official merely read the ambiguous AC minutes, and ignored that travel insurance was a reasonable explanation? Surely there must be more than that, if he wanted to accuse corruption? So where is it? Otherwise that would be poor behaviour. | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | Right, Mr Mueller also notes that one of the disciplinary charges faced by Ms Hardon is that she allegedly contacted him personally and leaked the corruption allegation. He presents a believable case that she didn't. As described above, it was a public speech by a different SUEPO official. | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | Assuming that to be true, then I agree that making this particular charge against Ms Hardon is poor behaviour by the EPO management. (I cannot say anything about the other charges she faces. I can also imagine that the EPO management might have a better case against this other unidentified SUEPO official if not Ms Hardon.) | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | So where does all this lead? It merely brings me back to where I started. There seems to be poor behaviour on both sides. Both SUEPO and the EPO management are making accusations which, as far as I can tell, are not supported by evidence. | Dec 16 09:42 |
| schestowitz | ' | Dec 16 09:42 |
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| schestowitz | crawling techrights heavily at the moment: | Dec 16 11:25 |
| schestowitz | descr: Tages Anzeiger AG | Dec 16 11:25 |
| schestowitz | descr: Newpaper Publishing Company | Dec 16 11:25 |
| schestowitz | maybe researching for a story | Dec 16 11:25 |
| schestowitz | re EPO | Dec 16 11:25 |
| MinceR | http://asset-b.soupcdn.com/asset/14780/9376_bcc1.jpeg | Dec 16 11:54 |
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| schestowitz | lol, classy | Dec 16 12:11 |
| schestowitz | there's also the china ones | Dec 16 12:11 |
| schestowitz | showing sheer hypocrisy | Dec 16 12:11 |
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| schestowitz | lots of EPO articles today | Dec 16 22:58 |
| schestowitz | I keep trying to find the time to write the cancer story, but new docs keep being piled on me from different sources. Maybe it'll all be out and dealt with by year's end. | Dec 16 22:58 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Twpalovi/status/677275895376306177 | Dec 17 00:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Twpalovi: @schestowitz that is a strongly-worded reproach. Interesting. | Dec 17 00:01 | |
| schestowitz | another on the way | Dec 17 00:01 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/MariusNestor/status/677281673730465793 | Dec 17 00:20 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@MariusNestor: @schestowitz Happy Birthday!!! :D | Dec 17 00:20 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/ppetrovdotnet/status/677453769886560256 | Dec 17 11:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@ppetrovdotnet: @schestowitz I learned about them yesterday :) as ridiculous as UEFI !!! | Dec 17 11:48 | |
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| cubexyz | what's ridiculous as UEFI? | Dec 17 13:17 |
| schestowitz | grub bug | Dec 17 13:24 |
| cubexyz | shows the importance of encryption | Dec 17 13:26 |
| schestowitz | if it works | Dec 17 13:27 |
| cubexyz | also if someone has physical access... :) | Dec 17 13:27 |
| cubexyz | sure, but one wouldn't just password grub | Dec 17 13:27 |
| cubexyz | there would be more layers of security if you were _really_ worried | Dec 17 13:27 |
| cubexyz | and your decrypted files would need to be shredded, not deleted | Dec 17 13:28 |
| cubexyz | password protected usb ports might be an idea as well | Dec 17 13:30 |
| schestowitz | y just usb? | Dec 17 13:49 |
| cubexyz | I was thinking along the lines of "if the computer reboots then don't boot from usb without a password" kind of thing | Dec 17 13:54 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, is there a bios that does that? | Dec 17 13:57 |
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| cubexyz | now that I think about it, I don't think chromebooks can boot from usb | Dec 17 13:58 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: You think about ARM or x86 Chromebooks? | Dec 17 14:01 |
| cubexyz | well mine is x86 | Dec 17 14:02 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: What's the drill on vanilla coreboot installation on Chromebooks? | Dec 17 14:02 |
| cubexyz | you have to use deveoper mode | Dec 17 14:03 |
| XRevan86 | This doesn't say much to me… | Dec 17 14:03 |
| cubexyz | I blogged a bit about it: | Dec 17 14:03 |
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| cubexyz | http://cubexyz.blogspot.ca/search?q=coreboot | Dec 17 14:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-cubexyz.blogspot.ca | Notes on Linux | Dec 17 14:04 | |
| cubexyz | also the folks in #coreboot are pretty helpful | Dec 17 14:04 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: So, you can use coreboot with tianocore (UEFI) or seabios (MBR) on Chromebooks if you have straight hands and enough time, right? | Dec 17 14:06 |
| XRevan86 | and thus to boot from USB | Dec 17 14:06 |
| cubexyz | pretty sure 2nd generation chromebook does not use UEFI | Dec 17 14:08 |
| cubexyz | it uses a combination of coreboot + U-Boot | Dec 17 14:09 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: coreboot piano | Dec 17 14:10 |
| cubexyz | I think ARM chromebook just uses U-boot on it's own | Dec 17 14:10 |
| XRevan86 | http://coreboot.org/Payloads#Tiano_Core | Dec 17 14:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.coreboot.org | Payloads - coreboot | Dec 17 14:11 | |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: The idea is to use TianoCore or SeaBIOS as a coreboot "payload". | Dec 17 14:11 |
| cubexyz | right, but was is the default off the shelf for chromebooks? | Dec 17 14:12 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: I'm pretty sure it's not. | Dec 17 14:12 |
| XRevan86 | But if third-party coreboot can be used on Chromebooks (whatever "Developer mode" is :)) then so is TianoCore/SeaBIOS. | Dec 17 14:13 |
| XRevan86 | although I suspect in reality it's probably harder than I think | Dec 17 14:13 |
| cubexyz | I think google should make chromebook-linux edition | Dec 17 14:14 |
| cubexyz | just grab the linux one, done | Dec 17 14:14 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Linux is pretty easy to load through U-Boot (naturally, as that's what U-Boot does) | Dec 17 14:15 |
| XRevan86 | but it would still be a one-OS laptop | Dec 17 14:15 |
| cubexyz | no AROS, FreeDOS, Plan 9 etc? | Dec 17 14:15 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Yes | Dec 17 14:15 |
| XRevan86 | chromebook-linux edition won't be a true solution then | Dec 17 14:16 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/mrjeremylcoope1/status/677490981239922688 | Dec 17 14:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mrjeremylcoope1: RT @schestowitz: How to make your Android awesome again https://t.co/QNjPwcGyIi #android #linux | Dec 17 14:16 | |
| cubexyz | we want chromebook-general purpose edition :) | Dec 17 14:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.androidpit.com | How to make your Android awesome again - AndroidPIT | Dec 17 14:16 | |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: I think better to say, general laptops with freakin' coreboot :). | Dec 17 14:16 |
| cubexyz | XRevan86, indeed | Dec 17 14:16 |
| cubexyz | that's what I want really | Dec 17 14:17 |
| cubexyz | also there's crouton, which I haven't tried yet | Dec 17 14:18 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: What I would do with a x86 Chromebooks is I'd kill ChromeOS completely and try to get coreboot with tianocore to work :) | Dec 17 14:20 |
| XRevan86 | and install $FAVOURITE_DISTRO | Dec 17 14:20 |
| XRevan86 | and probably replace drive with something bigger as chromebooks known to have as little space as possible | Dec 17 14:20 |
| cubexyz | I | Dec 17 14:21 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: some uefi systems cannot boot from USB until after they have access the EFI partition of the first harddrive for the same reason they cannot use usb keyboards and mice until them. No USB driver in flash firmware. | Dec 17 14:21 |
| cubexyz | I'm used to working in small spaces | Dec 17 14:21 |
| cubexyz | know how big a RK05 is? :) | Dec 17 14:21 |
| cubexyz | it's 2.5 megs | Dec 17 14:21 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: I have my pride :). | Dec 17 14:21 |
| cubexyz | you can have 8 drives though | Dec 17 14:22 |
| XRevan86 | "you dare to tell me how many Xonotic's I can install on my PC's!?" | Dec 17 14:22 |
| cubexyz | so 2.5 meg * 8 = 20 megs, that's pretty big for a 1974 OS :) | Dec 17 14:22 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Not a Chromebook case, right? :) | Dec 17 14:23 |
| XRevan86 | one can install emacs on it and be happy though | Dec 17 14:23 |
| cubexyz | vim :) | Dec 17 14:23 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: vim is just a text editor. | Dec 17 14:23 |
| XRevan86 | emacs is the universe | Dec 17 14:23 |
| cubexyz | I can't install emacs on Unix v5 | Dec 17 14:24 |
| cubexyz | em maybe | Dec 17 14:24 |
| XRevan86 | Just like Leechcraft | Dec 17 14:24 |
| cubexyz | actually I can't install vim or even vi either | Dec 17 14:24 |
| cubexyz | it's ed all the way | Dec 17 14:24 |
| cubexyz | in the old days we had multi-operating systems for PDP-11 | Dec 17 14:25 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: http://www.coreboot.org/GRUB2#Security GRUB2 in coreboot can be ass as it can be set only to load signed kernel adn will not load Windows. | Dec 17 14:25 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.coreboot.org | GRUB2 - coreboot | Dec 17 14:25 | |
| cubexyz | XRevan86, on PDP-11 I think there was _more_ choices for OS than now :) | Dec 17 14:26 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, we can roll our own | Dec 17 14:27 |
| cubexyz | I've had several years of working with Unix v5 now | Dec 17 14:29 |
| oiaohm | The issue these days is the stuplity written 256 bit signing keys into fluses in intel chipsets. | Dec 17 14:29 |
| oiaohm | That is small enough first quantuim chip it going to be able to reverse it. | Dec 17 14:29 |
| cubexyz | interesting thing about the transition to v6... ed was re-written in C language | Dec 17 14:30 |
| cubexyz | now the question is... would the v6 ed compile on v5 | Dec 17 14:32 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, you know, I don't even want signing keys | Dec 17 14:33 |
| cubexyz | I just want something I can experiment with | Dec 17 14:33 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: from the securtiy attacks that have been documented I do want signing keys but I want them like chromebooks devices in a flash chip with a physical write protect switch so I can set my own. Not set in fuses. | Dec 17 14:34 |
| cubexyz | I want to run AROS, Plan 9 and oddball stuff sometimes | Dec 17 14:34 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: If you can physically set your own your can still experment with the hardware. | Dec 17 14:35 |
| oiaohm | And lock anyone else out from doing the same behind your back. | Dec 17 14:35 |
| MinceR | 145823 < cubexyz> now that I think about it, I don't think chromebooks can boot from usb | Dec 17 14:38 |
| MinceR | i'm pretty sure at least one can | Dec 17 14:39 |
| MinceR | though probably only in developer mode | Dec 17 14:39 |
| cubexyz | wow, it compiled | Dec 17 14:40 |
| cubexyz | only 2k bigger than assembled ed :) | Dec 17 14:41 |
| MinceR | why bother with tianocore on a chromebook at all? | Dec 17 14:41 |
| MinceR | i'm pretty sure you can load anything sane without it | Dec 17 14:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: all chromebooks can be made boot from USB depend on model how many miles of hell you have to go through. http://www.pcworld.com/article/2873561/google-just-made-it-easier-to-run-linux-on-your-chromebook.html newer chromebooks it developer mode. | Dec 17 14:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pcworld.com | Google just made it easier to run Linux on your Chromebook | PCWorld [ http://ur1.ca/jix82 ] | Dec 17 14:41 | |
| cubexyz | MinceR, I was thinking the same thing | Dec 17 14:41 |
| MinceR | you don't want to put winblows on it, do you? :> | Dec 17 14:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: older chromebooks it is find the physicalal firmware protection switch and replace the firmware. | Dec 17 14:42 |
| MinceR | i think it was the asus flip i read instructions on how to boot from sd or usb on | Dec 17 14:42 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: It's just that booting from USB from plain GRUB for instance is… complicated. | Dec 17 14:43 |
| MinceR | http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv7/rockchip/asus-chromebook-flip-c100p | Dec 17 14:43 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-archlinuxarm.org | Asus Chromebook Flip C100P | Arch Linux ARM [ http://ur1.ca/ocl62 ] | Dec 17 14:43 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: those commands for the flip is chromebook standard for 2015 versions. crossystem dev_boot_usb=1 dev_boot_signed_only=0 Yep turn boot signing checking off. Leave internal bios signing checking on. | Dec 17 14:46 |
| MinceR | https://twitter.com/AdamBaldwin/status/677252678162878464/photo/1 | Dec 17 14:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AdamBaldwin: Anatomy of a Twitter lockout/reinstatement: https://t.co/NjWOtapiE8 | Dec 17 14:48 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AdamBaldwin: Anatomy of a Twitter lockout/reinstatement: https://t.co/NjWOtapiE8 | Dec 17 14:48 | |
| oiaohm | http://www.intelsecurity.com/advanced-threat-research/content/AttackingAndDefendingBIOS-RECon2015.pdf The on going list of EFI faults with security. Please note old BIOS had equally huge list of faults just no one talked about it. | Dec 17 14:49 |
| oiaohm | XRevan86: define plain GRUB instance. GRUB instance in Coreboot can ad extra issues to booting from a USB stick. | Dec 17 14:50 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: oh | Dec 17 14:50 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: Then it's only a problem of my coreboot ignorance :). | Dec 17 14:50 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: the difference is, the overwhelming majority of old BIOS did not use (nonexistent) security as an excuse for locking people out of sane and secure OS-es | Dec 17 14:51 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: also, back then people understood that you can't have IT security without physical security -- if someone has physical access to the computer, they can do anything | Dec 17 14:52 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: what you don't understand is even having physical access does not mean you can do anything. | Dec 17 14:52 |
| MinceR | but since propping up DRM and locking people into winblows requires something more evil and broken than BIOS, suddenly all this security theater arises to provide excuses for that | Dec 17 14:52 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: oh? what prevents me from taking components out, grinding chips down to access their internal state, etc.? | Dec 17 14:53 |
| oiaohm | If intel was to embed all the core in a SOC chip and use lot of rom and a little bit of thermite protection. | Dec 17 14:53 |
| oiaohm | You are screwed. | Dec 17 14:53 |
| oiaohm | Basically you can make silcon chips that you cannot grind into. | Dec 17 14:53 |
| MinceR | they'll never do that | Dec 17 14:53 |
| MinceR | they didn't even care to make TPMs tamper-resistant, only tamper-evident | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | which isn't worth dhit | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | s/dh/sh/ | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | and their _only_ excuse for the TPM was "security" | Dec 17 14:54 |
| oiaohm | For high security devices intel does make self destructing chips. | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | not on any commodity devices, though | Dec 17 14:54 |
| oiaohm | Just they currenty charge a massive extra for them. | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | and uefi is aimed at turning commodity computers into dumb, unusable, insecure appliances | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | if they won't protect your keys in the TPM, what makes you think they'll protect anything at all? | Dec 17 14:55 |
| oiaohm | You can by tamper-resistant TPM chips. | Dec 17 14:55 |
| oiaohm | But they are 200 dollars a pop. | Dec 17 14:55 |
| MinceR | and yet i'm forced to pay for useless TPM chips instead. | Dec 17 14:56 |
| MinceR | the reason is that security was never the goal | Dec 17 14:56 |
| MinceR | DRM and compromising users' computers was | Dec 17 14:56 |
| oiaohm | TPM chips first started as means to protect server intergerity. DRM over took it latter. | Dec 17 14:57 |
| MinceR | afaik TC started off as giving m$ root on every PC | Dec 17 14:58 |
| MinceR | then it got mellowed into this DRM bullshit with remote attestation | Dec 17 14:58 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, not _my_ PC :) | Dec 17 14:58 |
| MinceR | they haven't given up on root on every pc, though | Dec 17 14:58 |
| oiaohm | TPM first appears as a fpga reference design MinceR | Dec 17 14:58 |
| MinceR | as uefi and vista10 show | Dec 17 14:58 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: first software to operate TPM was Linux. | Dec 17 14:58 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: it was originally called Palladium and TCPA | Dec 17 14:58 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: wrong. | Dec 17 15:01 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: first name is the Fritz-Chip | Dec 17 15:02 |
| MinceR | is that like clipper? :> | Dec 17 15:02 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the first TPM is designed by IBM to secure signing keys in ways that a breached OS. | Dec 17 15:02 |
| oiaohm | So that a breach OS could not have stolen you access keys. | Dec 17 15:03 |
| oiaohm | IBM is the one that designed the first TPM in the from of the Fritz-Chip | Dec 17 15:03 |
| MinceR | when was that? | Dec 17 15:04 |
| oiaohm | Opps wrong first OS is AIX. | Dec 17 15:05 |
| MinceR | http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/tcpa-faq-0.2.html | Dec 17 15:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.cl.cam.ac.uk | TCPA / Palladium FAQ [ http://ur1.ca/ocl72 ] | Dec 17 15:05 | |
| MinceR | 9. Why call the monitor chip a `Fritz' chip? | Dec 17 15:05 |
| MinceR | In honour of Senator Fritz Hollings of South Carolina, who is working tirelessly in Congress to make TCPA a mandatory part of all consumer electronics. | Dec 17 15:05 |
| MinceR | not a shred of benevolence here | Dec 17 15:05 |
| cubexyz | how is he going to do that? | Dec 17 15:06 |
| cubexyz | one guy from the US can't do that | Dec 17 15:06 |
| MinceR | the corporate corruptors behind one guy can, though | Dec 17 15:07 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: 7. Where did the idea come from? in that page. | Dec 17 15:09 |
| MinceR | ic | Dec 17 15:09 |
| MinceR | well, at least that "reference monitor" was responsible to the owner/users, not to corrupt megacorporations | Dec 17 15:10 |
| oiaohm | TPM idea implemented how orginally planned is good for users security and privacy. What mega corporations have wanted todo with it really not good for end user. | Dec 17 15:11 |
| MinceR | except for how m$ originally planned it | Dec 17 15:11 |
| oiaohm | Microsoft did not know about it until after its presentation at the 1997 IEEE Symposium on Security and Privacy | Dec 17 15:12 |
| oiaohm | Microsoft is one of the mega corporations to see the tech and go hey lets abuse that. | Dec 17 15:12 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the road to disaster is paved with good intentions. | Dec 17 15:14 |
| cubexyz | mass exodus from Microsoft to something else... | Dec 17 15:14 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: especially if it's m$ at the helm | Dec 17 15:16 |
| oiaohm | TPM implemented as per the 1997 objective to allow users to protect their data from outside parties is fine. The reason why TPM is open to so many Physical attacks is it was not designed to resist physical attacks. | Dec 17 15:16 |
| MinceR | oh wait, they don't have any of those | Dec 17 15:16 |
| MinceR | they don't have a single intention that's not evil | Dec 17 15:16 |
| cubexyz | "good intentions"? :) | Dec 17 15:16 |
| MinceR | yeah, those | Dec 17 15:16 |
| abeNd-org | MinceR: oh come on now, MS has plenty of incompetent intentions that arent evil | Dec 17 15:17 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: so, basically, you're proposing to protect against physical attacks with something that was not designed to resist them | Dec 17 15:17 |
| MinceR | abeNd-org: i didn't think incompetence was a matter of intention :) | Dec 17 15:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: if a TPM was designed to resist physical attacks it would mandate selfdestruction. | Dec 17 15:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: if someone was attempting physical. | Dec 17 15:18 |
| MinceR | indeed | Dec 17 15:18 |
| oiaohm | Now a proper DRM chip you would expect self destruction. | Dec 17 15:18 |
| oiaohm | Problem here before TPM media companies had been proposing DRM chips and running into fact that no one wantted to make them. | Dec 17 15:19 |
| oiaohm | So media companies + Microsoft has attempt to high jack the TPM to get what they want. | Dec 17 15:19 |
| MinceR | another problem is that m$ and intel didn't want to admit that Treacherous Computing was primarily about DRM | Dec 17 15:20 |
| MinceR | and so we have people going around talking about how TC is so great for security | Dec 17 15:20 |
| oiaohm | To be truthful Intel had not intented TPM for DRM. When they found out the DRM usage idea they end the idea of the TPM chip ever been embeded in the CPU. | Dec 17 15:20 |
| oiaohm | 1997 Intel thought TPM in CPU would be a great idea. By 1998 after seeing Microsoft idea they scrapped that. | Dec 17 15:21 |
| MinceR | it seems to me that just as with uefi, intel was just a puppet of m$, nothing more | Dec 17 15:21 |
| MinceR | what m$ wants, intel does | Dec 17 15:22 |
| MinceR | tpm in cpu without tamper protection would have been just as worthless for security | Dec 17 15:22 |
| oiaohm | If Intel did what MS wants the TPM chip would be in the CPU not independant chips. | Dec 17 15:22 |
| MinceR | plus it would have cost more | Dec 17 15:22 |
| MinceR | which apparently always trumps doing what they otherwise wanted to do | Dec 17 15:22 |
| oiaohm | For protection from remote access attacks tpm without local tamper protection is fine. | Dec 17 15:22 |
| cubexyz | does microsoft really have that much clout? | Dec 17 15:22 |
| MinceR | apparently they do | Dec 17 15:23 |
| cubexyz | Intel is pretty big themselves | Dec 17 15:23 |
| oiaohm | and if you read the 1997 document that is what TPM chip wa meant to do. | Dec 17 15:23 |
| MinceR | they've managed to push uefi through | Dec 17 15:23 |
| MinceR | and pretty much all business-oriented PCs come tied with a TPM | Dec 17 15:23 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: you mean that's what their excuse for it was | Dec 17 15:23 |
| oiaohm | Not excuse. | Dec 17 15:23 |
| MinceR | you need to get used to m$ and their bootlickers lying all the time | Dec 17 15:23 |
| oiaohm | Intel has not been 100 percent playing along with Microsoft. | Dec 17 15:23 |
| oiaohm | Intel has its objectives and Microsoft has its objectives. Where they cross it gets horible. | Dec 17 15:24 |
| MinceR | they played along more than enough to destroy IT | Dec 17 15:25 |
| oiaohm | Like the Microsoft idea to store malware id information in the TPM chip. | Dec 17 15:25 |
| oiaohm | That is not what the TPM was intetend for. | Dec 17 15:25 |
| MinceR | i don't see what's that even useful for | Dec 17 15:25 |
| MinceR | unless the malware is a m$ product | Dec 17 15:25 |
| MinceR | like winblows | Dec 17 15:25 |
| MinceR | or whatever they got when they bought claria/gator | Dec 17 15:25 |
| oiaohm | TPM chip was intended to be a whitelist system not a blacklist one. | Dec 17 15:26 |
| oiaohm | Yet here is windows 10 using it as a blacklist system. | Dec 17 15:26 |
| MinceR | more like somebody claimed the TPM was intended to be a whitelist system | Dec 17 15:26 |
| MinceR | before they managed to cram it down on all our throats | Dec 17 15:27 |
| oiaohm | No the 1997 reference was whitelist. | Dec 17 15:27 |
| oiaohm | Whitelist is more of a prick to get past than blacklist. | Dec 17 15:27 |
| MinceR | remember, m$ and their allies always lie | Dec 17 15:27 |
| oiaohm | The 1997 TPM documents are not written by Microsoft allies but as a research project. | Dec 17 15:27 |
| MinceR | if the public had known where all this TC/UEFI/intel boot guard/vista10/crApp Store bullshit is designed to lead, they would have nipped it in the bud | Dec 17 15:28 |
| cubexyz | is the TPM chip still a factor now, or...? | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | you're still forced to pay infineon for it if you pay any business pc/laptop | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | to reward them for their scheming | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | and iirc uefi uses it more | Dec 17 15:28 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: Windows 10 will start mandating TPM chips. | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | there you go | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | meanwhile, the usa and the eu goes around pretending they have antitrust and anti-monopoly controls | Dec 17 15:28 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: and due to abusing the living crap out of the TPM chip they will most likely fail early. | Dec 17 15:28 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, I don't think any of my computers has a TPM chip | Dec 17 15:29 |
| MinceR | i know two of mine has one | Dec 17 15:29 |
| MinceR | i did what i could to stop them from being a problem | Dec 17 15:29 |
| MinceR | s/has/have/ | Dec 17 15:30 |
| oiaohm | http://events.linuxfoundation.org/sites/events/files/slides/Integrity_Protection_LinuxCon_Japan_2014_v2.pdf | Dec 17 15:31 |
| oiaohm | TPM chips in Linux integrity protection are implemented 1997 style as a whitelist method. | Dec 17 15:31 |
| MinceR | which is irrelevant | Dec 17 15:31 |
| oiaohm | TPM chip are useful to Linux | Dec 17 15:31 |
| oiaohm | Now of course that TPM chip under owner of machines control. | Dec 17 15:32 |
| MinceR | if the TPM had a benign purpose, it would be tamper-protected, it would be fully optional, and it would not include the Endorsement Key. | Dec 17 15:32 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: and most motherboards TPM is removable. | Dec 17 15:32 |
| MinceR | also, the TPM chip most people end up with is useless | Dec 17 15:33 |
| oiaohm | Yes TPM by design is optional MinceR | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | except it isn't | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | you don't get to pick your laptops without it | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | you don't get to run vista10 without it | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | 163220 < MinceR> if the TPM had a benign purpose, it would be tamper-protected, it would be fully optional, and it would not include the Endorsement Key. | Dec 17 15:33 |
| oiaohm | Microsoft Windows 10 can run without TPM. | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | and even then it would be problematic for security | Dec 17 15:34 |
| oiaohm | Windows 11 I suspect will not be able to. | Dec 17 15:34 |
| MinceR | since its implementation of cryptographic algorithms is effectively a black box | Dec 17 15:34 |
| MinceR | in hardware | Dec 17 15:34 |
| MinceR | it's foolish to trust such implementations | Dec 17 15:34 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: to be truthful the Endorsement Key in most TPM chips is changable. | Dec 17 15:36 |
| MinceR | so what purpose does it serve then? | Dec 17 15:36 |
| oiaohm | Ok you cannot read the Endorsement Key back out the TPM but you can send a new one in. | Dec 17 15:36 |
| MinceR | other than that you can break DRM that relies on it | Dec 17 15:37 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: TPM for DRM is a house of cards. | Dec 17 15:46 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: http://wiki.xenproject.org/wiki/Virtual_Trusted_Platform_Module_%28vTPM%29 | Dec 17 15:46 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-wiki.xenproject.org | Virtual Trusted Platform Module (vTPM) - Xen [ http://ur1.ca/ocl9o ] | Dec 17 15:46 | |
| MinceR | obviously | Dec 17 15:46 |
| oiaohm | qemu and xen and vmware all can run virtual TPM in software. | Dec 17 15:46 |
| MinceR | m$, intel and crApple are taking IT to a point where DRM might work, though | Dec 17 15:46 |
| oiaohm | So a TPM can be man in middle attacked if end users chooses to. | Dec 17 15:46 |
| MinceR | the death of the general purpose computer | Dec 17 15:46 |
| MinceR | and megacorporate/government controlled web clients for the user/slaves | Dec 17 15:47 |
| oiaohm | Intel was the first developer of a virtual software TPM. | Dec 17 15:47 |
| MinceR | intel was also the main company that gave its name for TC and UEFI. | Dec 17 15:47 |
| MinceR | (even despite the obvious m$ infestation in UEFI: PE, FAT, CAB) | Dec 17 15:47 |
| MinceR | and of course once you don't have root on your "PC" but only m$/us government does, you won't be able to run the VTPM | Dec 17 15:48 |
| oiaohm | Really Microsoft has dragged it feet on UEFI even that it contains all those parts you have listeed. | Dec 17 15:48 |
| MinceR | or QEMU, or Xen | Dec 17 15:48 |
| MinceR | oh, i'm sure they've kept up the charade | Dec 17 15:49 |
| oiaohm | Wrong point of view. | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | and yet they've been requiring it for some time | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | with Restricted Boot | Dec 17 15:49 |
| oiaohm | Intel objective is to move hardware. | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | which just happens to serve m$ interests | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | i'm sure this is all just a coincidence | Dec 17 15:49 |
| oiaohm | Not everything intel does like making TPM removable suites MS goals. | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | it seems to me that intel is not very competent when it comes to serving their own interests | Dec 17 15:50 |
| oiaohm | Intel and Microsoft being in alignment is nothing more than common interests. | Dec 17 15:50 |
| MinceR | they should have made themselves independent of m$ long ago | Dec 17 15:50 |
| MinceR | they should have diversified | Dec 17 15:50 |
| MinceR | yet here we are, with uefi, tc and intel boot guard | Dec 17 15:50 |
| MinceR | for some reason | Dec 17 15:50 |
| oiaohm | Intel is a lot more deverised. | Dec 17 15:50 |
| oiaohm | intel boot guard is about serving ODM interests not Microsoft ones. | Dec 17 15:51 |
| MinceR | yeah, pretending to obey the ODMs who do what m$ tells them to | Dec 17 15:51 |
| oiaohm | No | Dec 17 15:51 |
| MinceR | on pain of hiking winblows license prices | Dec 17 15:51 |
| oiaohm | ODM that make most motherboards don't buy Microsoft licenses. | Dec 17 15:51 |
| oiaohm | and boot guard was first made for the intel arm line of chips. | Dec 17 15:52 |
| MinceR | and how will their sales go if winblows refuses to run on their mainboards? | Dec 17 15:52 |
| oiaohm | That Microsoft never run on. | Dec 17 15:52 |
| MinceR | on arm chips, where m$ mandates restricted boot to be not disableable? | Dec 17 15:52 |
| MinceR | what a coincidence. | Dec 17 15:52 |
| oiaohm | Intel made arm chips for routers | Dec 17 15:52 |
| oiaohm | That is where boot guard comes form. | Dec 17 15:52 |
| MinceR | and look where it is now | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | 256 bit signing key is old and out of date tech. | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | keeping coreboot out of the market by force | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | Yep | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | intel/m$ never was good at security | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | despite all the marketing lies | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | No you have something wrong. | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | they were good at corrupting and distorting markets though | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | Keeping coreboot out is about ODM not Microsoft. | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | And Intel. | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | i don't see how it would serve ODM interests to not be able to offer a more reliable, less bloated firmware | Dec 17 15:54 |
| MinceR | m$, on the other hand... | Dec 17 15:54 |
| oiaohm | Number 1 intel chips depend on microcode being loaded early to defined what features are usable. | Dec 17 15:54 |
| MinceR | uefi is the nail that keeps you from disinfecting the "PC" of winblows | Dec 17 15:54 |
| oiaohm | So loading the correct microcode into some I5 make them act like i7 | Dec 17 15:54 |
| oiaohm | Of course if people can buy i5 and use them as i7 that not good for intel bottom line right MinceR | Dec 17 15:55 |
| MinceR | yes, once again it's the customer that gets screwed | Dec 17 15:55 |
| oiaohm | You would call that intel Motovation alone right. | Dec 17 15:55 |
| MinceR | people at intel are so incompetent they can't fix this without intel boot guard? | Dec 17 15:56 |
| *jgay (~jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 15:56 | |
| oiaohm | Now ODM making motherboards may make 2 indetical boards 1 for games with overclocking and one for business without and charge 2 different prices. Again difference is load firmware. Of course user being able to load own firmware means they can use what ever one is cheaper. | Dec 17 15:57 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: basically Microsoft is not the only problem here. ODM's and Intel have reasons to screw end users over. | Dec 17 15:58 |
| MinceR | and they're working together to this end | Dec 17 15:59 |
| oiaohm | I would not say working together either. | Dec 17 16:00 |
| oiaohm | You see ODM and Intel do stuff that goes against Microsoft objectives. | Dec 17 16:01 |
| oiaohm | Problem is ODMs, Intel and Microsoft objectives align to a point and most of that is not in the consumers best interest. | Dec 17 16:02 |
| oiaohm | The other one is microcode for intel cpus is why even if a INTEL cpu socket is the same you cannot use newer CPU in a lot of older motherboards. No microcode no cpu start. | Dec 17 16:03 |
| MinceR | they're working together sufficiently to foist uefi, ibg and tc on the users | Dec 17 16:03 |
| MinceR | and of course winblows | Dec 17 16:03 |
| MinceR | with its increasing malware-y/botnetty tendencies | Dec 17 16:03 |
| MinceR | and increasingly closed platform | Dec 17 16:03 |
| oiaohm | Even in UEFI like putting time limit on how long a PK can last. That was an intel idea. Of course for Microsoft objective PK with a never time out value would be ideal. | Dec 17 16:04 |
| *jgay has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) | Dec 17 16:09 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: selling two identical products with minor modifications for two different Prices is not Just a intel thing. Most evil example energizer and eveready. Yes 2 alkaline batteries on shelf from same company different packaging 2 different prices. | Dec 17 16:21 |
| MinceR | that's just a branding difference | Dec 17 16:22 |
| MinceR | doesn't require making the product screw its user | Dec 17 16:22 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: its a little bit more than that. | Dec 17 16:25 |
| *jgay (~jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 16:26 | |
| oiaohm | Energizer one that is the more expensive one has for use in smoke detectors on it even that there is techically no difference to the eveready one. | Dec 17 16:26 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: yes its purely to screw the buyer over. | Dec 17 16:26 |
| MinceR | yet both will provide power for any compatible device | Dec 17 16:27 |
| oiaohm | Yes both will function absolutely identical in any device they are put in. | Dec 17 16:28 |
| MinceR | unlike uefi, which increasingly tries to prevent you from booting any OS other than macos or winblows | Dec 17 16:28 |
| MinceR | and ibg, which prevents you from using coreboot or libreboot | Dec 17 16:29 |
| oiaohm | To be correct UEFI on most motherboard removing the PK and KEKs its really easy to end up unable to boot Windows. | Dec 17 16:29 |
| *jgay has quit (Client Quit) | Dec 17 16:29 | |
| MinceR | or tc, which was intended to force you to prove you're running the exact binaries the other side wants | Dec 17 16:29 |
| MinceR | well, even without uefi, it's easy to end up being unable to boot winblows | Dec 17 16:29 |
| MinceR | as winblows is a fragile piece of shit | Dec 17 16:29 |
| oiaohm | UEFI PK/KEK reset and Microsoft making Windows depend on signed booting is making it even more fragile. | Dec 17 16:30 |
| oiaohm | Intel and ODM added the PK/KEK reset. | Dec 17 16:30 |
| cubexyz | ho ho ho... shrinking christmas treats: | Dec 17 16:30 |
| *jgay (~jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 16:31 | |
| cubexyz | http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/nestl-hits-back-claims-quality-7025949 | Dec 17 16:31 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.mirror.co.uk | Nestlé hits back at claims Quality Street Christmas boxes have shrunk over the years - Mirror Online | Dec 17 16:31 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: Intel and ODM are not doing things the way Microsoft would have liked. | Dec 17 16:31 |
| MinceR | and intel, m$ and crApple are not doing things the way any independent IT professional would have liked | Dec 17 16:31 |
| oiaohm | I will give you I don't like everything intel is doing. | Dec 17 16:32 |
| oiaohm | ibg stuff is bad. | Dec 17 16:32 |
| oiaohm | Worse ibg is old obsolote design. Really who thinks in this day and age a 256 bit pgp setup is good enough. | Dec 17 16:33 |
| oiaohm | Like you would have wanted at least 4096 bit pgp with the fact that quatuim processes are not that far off. | Dec 17 16:33 |
| MinceR | they would have done that, if security was the objective | Dec 17 16:35 |
| MinceR | but it isn't | Dec 17 16:35 |
| MinceR | it's the excuse | Dec 17 16:35 |
| MinceR | the objective is to take all power away from the public | Dec 17 16:35 |
| oiaohm | Intel and ODM have cost saving as a factor. | Dec 17 16:40 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: larger PGP processing equals more silcon required for it. | Dec 17 16:40 |
| MinceR | will merging these megacorporations and the governments save costs? :> | Dec 17 16:40 |
| MinceR | or just disposing of governments and have megacorporations run the planet | Dec 17 16:40 |
| oiaohm | Its like HP argueing for only 1 PK and only 1 KEK slot. | Dec 17 16:41 |
| oiaohm | Because that would save flash space. | Dec 17 16:41 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: can you have security without enough silicon for what security needs? | Dec 17 16:41 |
| oiaohm | That is the insanity MinceR | Dec 17 16:41 |
| oiaohm | ODM and Intel cost cutting makes the implemtned security flawed. | Dec 17 16:42 |
| oiaohm | Its like firmware write protect jumpers that added an extra 0.4 cents per board. | Dec 17 16:43 |
| MinceR | so, if security is the objective, can you afford to use less silicon than you need? | Dec 17 16:45 |
| MinceR | it logically follows that security was not the objective. | Dec 17 16:47 |
| oiaohm | DRM was the objective security should also be in the objective. | Dec 17 16:48 |
| oiaohm | That is the problem this stuff starts not logically adding up very well. | Dec 17 16:49 |
| MinceR | DRM is unachievable as long as people have general purpose computers anyway | Dec 17 16:49 |
| oiaohm | Until you think maybe ODM and Intel want to do just enough to convice Microsoft and others they are making suitable products to move product. | Dec 17 16:50 |
| MinceR | so the aim to destroy general purpose computers follows naturally from DRM | Dec 17 16:50 |
| MinceR | hence, ibg, uefi, tc, vista10, app store-based platforms | Dec 17 16:50 |
| MinceR | "cloud" hype | Dec 17 16:50 |
| oiaohm | Problem here that is not matching what we are seeing in silcon. | Dec 17 16:50 |
| oiaohm | Like ibg being under quality. UEFI being key restable and tc being replacable modules. | Dec 17 16:51 |
| oiaohm | None of that adds up for a DRM game. | Dec 17 16:51 |
| oiaohm | Unless its deception to someone wanting a DRM game. | Dec 17 16:51 |
| MinceR | it has always been deception | Dec 17 16:52 |
| MinceR | DRM always screwed the typical consumer while not hindering the "pirate" | Dec 17 16:52 |
| oiaohm | Who is the deception against. | Dec 17 16:52 |
| MinceR | and of course it will still make it hell for most people to use a non-winblows, non-macos OS | Dec 17 16:52 |
| oiaohm | I suspect intel and ODM are doing deception to Microsoft. | Dec 17 16:52 |
| MinceR | that won't save us | Dec 17 16:52 |
| oiaohm | If intel and ODM are not working for Microsoft it just working out how to make it more profitable for Intel and ODM to work for us. | Dec 17 16:53 |
| oiaohm | So maybe it could save us MinceR | Dec 17 16:54 |
| MinceR | they're working more for m$ than for us | Dec 17 16:54 |
| oiaohm | No they are more working for themselves than Microsoft or us. | Dec 17 16:54 |
| oiaohm | If they were working for microsoft we would see items like PK and KEK not in nvram section of the firmware. | Dec 17 16:55 |
| oiaohm | Remember everything placed in the nvram section of a firmware image is intended to be replaceable by some means. | Dec 17 16:55 |
| MinceR | by the nsa | Dec 17 16:56 |
| MinceR | and by microsoft | Dec 17 16:56 |
| oiaohm | nvram is end user setting. | Dec 17 16:56 |
| MinceR | as long as the end-user is allowed to change it and the system won't refuse to implement the changes | Dec 17 16:57 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynmoody/status/677530972489965568 | Dec 17 17:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynmoody: @schestowitz great - I was looking for that... | Dec 17 17:00 | |
| schestowitz | context: https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/677527845879603200 | Dec 17 17:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @glynmoody Members of the EP Slam the EPO for Patent Maximalism That Led to Granting of Patents on Plants https://t.co/MLd8h1gqLr | Dec 17 17:00 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org | Members of the European Parliament Slam the EPO for Patent Maximalism That Led to Granting of Patents on Plants | Techrights | Dec 17 17:00 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: remember early UEFI the PK and KEK was not in the nvram. So this is a change you missed. Its very clear intel and ODM are not 100 percent working for Microsoft. Reason is greed ODM want to be able to sell boards to facebook, google and so on. | Dec 17 17:06 |
| MinceR | in the end they still do m$'s bidding | Dec 17 17:06 |
| MinceR | also note that i'm not facebook or google | Dec 17 17:06 |
| MinceR | i'm not even in the PRISM program | Dec 17 17:06 |
| oiaohm | Reality they are doing there own bidding | Dec 17 17:07 |
| MinceR | is that why with every successive version "PC"s make it harder to run any secure, reliable OS? | Dec 17 17:08 |
| MinceR | and require waiving ever more warranty? | Dec 17 17:09 |
| MinceR | and every time a new winblows version comes out, most users are even more exposed to malware and spying? | Dec 17 17:09 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: problem is PC has not be secure for a long time. BIOS breaching has been happening a lot. | Dec 17 17:28 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: problem is, all this crap does nothing to secure it any more than that | Dec 17 17:29 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: in fact, it does the opposite | Dec 17 17:29 |
| MinceR | but "security" is still a good excuse to get away with anything, apparently | Dec 17 17:29 |
| oiaohm | To be truthful at least with UEFI were are starting to see proper firmware state auditing tools made. | Dec 17 17:30 |
| MinceR | we're also starting to see alleged computers that take measures against obeying their owner | Dec 17 17:31 |
| oiaohm | Before UEFI there was no tools to run on a Machine to check that the BIOS had memory protection and other things set correctly. | Dec 17 17:31 |
| MinceR | and we're starting to see computers locked into winblows, which i hope you're not trying to claim is secure | Dec 17 17:31 |
| oiaohm | I don't see where you are getting locked into Windows. | Dec 17 17:31 |
| oiaohm | PK/KEK resetable. | Dec 17 17:31 |
| oiaohm | Reduced random power management crap. | Dec 17 17:32 |
| oiaohm | UEFI is in fact less boards locked to Windows only. | Dec 17 17:32 |
| MinceR | restricted boot was required to be included; the restricted boot option was already removed since | Dec 17 17:32 |
| MinceR | soon we'll see non-resetable PK/KEK | Dec 17 17:32 |
| MinceR | and once again the excuse will be "security" | Dec 17 17:33 |
| MinceR | and already it's a lot more difficult for the user to figure out how to install a real OS on a computer they've bought | Dec 17 17:33 |
| MinceR | on BIOS, you'd merely boot from a removable drive and it would work | Dec 17 17:33 |
| MinceR | now every UEFI setup has a different option in a different place on a different UI which must be changed | Dec 17 17:33 |
| MinceR | and the changes they must implement to get it to work are also getting more arcane | Dec 17 17:34 |
| oiaohm | Reality you skip over items. | Dec 17 17:34 |
| oiaohm | ACPI BIOS configured only for Windows do you forgot that MinceR | Dec 17 17:34 |
| oiaohm | Before signing motherboard that would not run Linux stable existed. | Dec 17 17:35 |
| oiaohm | Reality even with PK/KEK signing to get past you have more odds of a board being workable now than 2005 | Dec 17 17:35 |
| MinceR | i don't remember having issues due to ACPI | Dec 17 17:36 |
| MinceR | my distro installers booted regardless | Dec 17 17:36 |
| MinceR | and of course using the tried-and-true "boiling the frog" approach, by the time they'll lock the gates, there won't be any resistance left | Dec 17 17:37 |
| oiaohm | There is a huge stack of hack tables where the Linux kernel lies and pretends to be windows so ACPI does not cause it to fail. | Dec 17 17:37 |
| MinceR | you're already not resisting at all | Dec 17 17:37 |
| oiaohm | On older systems. | Dec 17 17:37 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly not resisting. | Dec 17 17:38 |
| oiaohm | I don't approve of not being able to replace firmware. | Dec 17 17:38 |
| oiaohm | I don't approve of bios protection signing keys being too weak. | Dec 17 17:39 |
| oiaohm | But I am realistic here. UEFI is cleaning up a lot of crap that has been let exist in BIOS for a long time. | Dec 17 17:39 |
| MinceR | and putting worse crap in its place | Dec 17 17:39 |
| oiaohm | So yes some of what UEFI is doing has to happen. | Dec 17 17:39 |
| MinceR | and mandating a lot more bloat | Dec 17 17:40 |
| MinceR | yes, humanity wants to abolish freedom, so that has to happen | Dec 17 17:40 |
| oiaohm | Your bloat arguement does not add up particular when you compare UEFI to coreboot. | Dec 17 17:40 |
| MinceR | humanity will not rest until it has built the perfect global fascist dystopia | Dec 17 17:40 |
| MinceR | oh really? | Dec 17 17:40 |
| oiaohm | coreboot secure uses larger signing and is bigger than UEFI. | Dec 17 17:41 |
| cubexyz | coreboot can fit into 256K :) | Dec 17 17:41 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: that is cut down. | Dec 17 17:41 |
| cubexyz | I've rolled it myself | Dec 17 17:41 |
| oiaohm | To what it can be. | Dec 17 17:41 |
| MinceR | afaik coreboot doesn't have to use this pointless security theater | Dec 17 17:41 |
| cubexyz | in fact there was still some room left over | Dec 17 17:42 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, my version doesn't | Dec 17 17:42 |
| cubexyz | you could cut it down to 128K without seabios | Dec 17 17:42 |
| cubexyz | but I need seabios for freedos | Dec 17 17:42 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: so basically "uefi is not bloated" because its "security" uses keys that are too small to be worth anything? :> | Dec 17 17:42 |
| MinceR | seabios is unneeded for gnu/linux, afaik | Dec 17 17:43 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, that's right | Dec 17 17:43 |
| MinceR | if you count seabios, you might as well use good old bios, before uefi | Dec 17 17:43 |
| oiaohm | udk2 the reference UEFI can be build without signing. Most compact version is 64kb. | Dec 17 17:43 |
| oiaohm | Yes coreboot is huge. | Dec 17 17:44 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, but if I use good old bios, most of the time I don't have source code | Dec 17 17:44 |
| oiaohm | UEFI full featured is also huge. | Dec 17 17:44 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/coreboot.rom | Dec 17 17:45 |
| cubexyz | check it out... 256K | Dec 17 17:45 |
| oiaohm | Exactly old bios we could not look at the source code so we had to trust it. | Dec 17 17:45 |
| oiaohm | We are now seeing more default firmware based on exposed source code so open to auditing. | Dec 17 17:45 |
| cubexyz | of course old bios was 128K in the past | Dec 17 17:45 |
| cubexyz | it got bigger over time | Dec 17 17:46 |
| MinceR | what use is looking at the source code if you have no assurance that the system you're using is actually built from those sources and if you can't rebuild and replace it? | Dec 17 17:46 |
| MinceR | what use is being able to fix holes in the source code if you can't share it with others? | Dec 17 17:46 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, I did build that one | Dec 17 17:46 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: not exact right. | Dec 17 17:46 |
| cubexyz | gcc was used | Dec 17 17:46 |
| MinceR | intel boot guard prevents exactly that | Dec 17 17:46 |
| cubexyz | now the leaked stuff is a different story | Dec 17 17:46 |
| cubexyz | I haven't been able to build that yet | Dec 17 17:47 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: https://wiki.debian.org/ReproducibleBuilds There is such thing as a Reproducible Build. | Dec 17 17:47 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://wiki.debian.org/ReproducibleBuilds ) | Dec 17 17:47 | |
| oiaohm | So if you can rebuild it you can confirm that it was built from X source code even if you cannot replace it. | Dec 17 17:47 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: What's that supposed to do with anything? | Dec 17 17:47 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: then you'll know that the hole you've found auditing the code is there, and you won't be able to fix it, ever | Dec 17 17:47 |
| MinceR | and you might not even be allowed to tell others about it | Dec 17 17:48 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: And magic signing? That unreproduce stuff. | Dec 17 17:48 |
| cubexyz | actually the coreboot folks encourage building from source | Dec 17 17:48 |
| cubexyz | they don't usually link to binary files | Dec 17 17:48 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: you just stated the real problem. | Dec 17 17:48 |
| oiaohm | The fact firmware is becoming more open source and more audited the means to replace it for security reasons is becoming more critical. | Dec 17 17:49 |
| MinceR | there are many real problems | Dec 17 17:49 |
| MinceR | and the powers that be work on making even more problems and solving none | Dec 17 17:49 |
| cubexyz | we got XT and AT BIOS source... then nothing for a long time after that | Dec 17 17:50 |
| oiaohm | XRevan86: Signing is conformable. Its design that way. Areas with signing can still be security checked. Confirming that something was built form X source code does not require checking signing that is not active code. | Dec 17 17:51 |
| oiaohm | Validating that something was built for X source code does not mandate requirement to replace it. | Dec 17 17:52 |
| oiaohm | Security is the reason why you need to be able to replace lots of stuff. | Dec 17 17:52 |
| cubexyz | we also like to know what are computers are doing | Dec 17 17:53 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: Xt and AT BIOS was only some rough reference. Each vendor of the XT and AT bios extended and modified the bugger. | Dec 17 17:53 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, I think there's a generic source listing that's easy to find | Dec 17 17:55 |
| cubexyz | what extensions did they make? | Dec 17 17:55 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: all kinds of strange things. Like some AT phoninix bios support putting up a pretend harddrive that was being served from a shared image in a custom network format. | Dec 17 17:57 |
| oiaohm | Yes I remember 286 running Windows 3.11 over network that way. | Dec 17 17:58 |
| oiaohm | Yes to be fun if you booted the machine from floppy drive the virtual network harddrive completley disappeared. | Dec 17 17:59 |
| cubexyz | I wonder how big the original BIOS was | Dec 17 18:00 |
| cubexyz | 8k? | Dec 17 18:00 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: smaller in fact. | Dec 17 18:01 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, if you want unbloated BIOS you want the original IBM PC :) | Dec 17 18:01 |
| oiaohm | 8k was the rom chip size. | Dec 17 18:01 |
| oiaohm | I think it was 7.5 | Dec 17 18:01 |
| MinceR | cubexyz: it's not the only option, afaik | Dec 17 18:02 |
| cubexyz | don't forget the BASIC rom | Dec 17 18:02 |
| oiaohm | If you download the ibm 8k image you will find it ends with a stack of zeros. | Dec 17 18:02 |
| cubexyz | probably another 8k | Dec 17 18:02 |
| cubexyz | I think there were some 8k BASICs | Dec 17 18:02 |
| oiaohm | Most clone bioses were larger than 8k | Dec 17 18:02 |
| cubexyz | yeah I remember 128k and 256k but I'm sure there were lots inbetween | Dec 17 18:04 |
| cubexyz | 64k, 32k probably | Dec 17 18:04 |
| oiaohm | Of cource the old IBM PC did not require microcode https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P6_%28microarchitecture%29 Basically since pent pro/pent II firmware images had to grow. | Dec 17 18:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | P6 (microarchitecture) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia | Dec 17 18:04 | |
| cubexyz | newer IBM AT BIOS had 101-keyboard support and 1.44 floppy support | Dec 17 18:05 |
| cubexyz | maybe two 32k ROM chips | Dec 17 18:06 |
| cubexyz | what is the standard keyboard now, 104 keys? | Dec 17 18:06 |
| MinceR | depends on the region | Dec 17 18:07 |
| MinceR | ISO layout tends to have an extra '<' (or whatever) key | Dec 17 18:08 |
| MinceR | japanese layouts tend to have some more extra keys | Dec 17 18:08 |
| oiaohm | https://books.google.com.au/books?id=hnvCf6WlcYcC&pg=PT433&lpg=PT433&dq=1992+AMI+ROM+size&source=bl&ots=CYQwdANqXt&sig=G5bl2IidqaUCBMZxy_KXOoLuEUg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj0vLKWvuPJAhXlIqYKHUa3AYgQ6AEISjAJ#v=onepage&q=1992%20AMI%20ROM%20size&f=false | Dec 17 18:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-books.google.com.au | PC Mag - Google Books | Dec 17 18:08 | |
| oiaohm | Good fun to see the 1992 price to replace a bios | Dec 17 18:09 |
| oiaohm | Yes to replace a bios back then was more than a cheep motherboard now. | Dec 17 18:09 |
| MinceR | and now you don't get to replace it | Dec 17 18:09 |
| MinceR | and soon you won't even get to replace the OS | Dec 17 18:10 |
| cubexyz | they did on the original Playstation :) | Dec 17 18:10 |
| cubexyz | upgraded for pirated game capability :) | Dec 17 18:10 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: even back in 1992 there were motherboard with signing checked embedded preventing bios replacement. | Dec 17 18:11 |
| oiaohm | So not being able to replace a bios is not exactly new. | Dec 17 18:11 |
| cubexyz | they only did a checksum though | Dec 17 18:11 |
| cubexyz | not too hard to figure out | Dec 17 18:11 |
| oiaohm | The first PGP signed bios is 1991 | Dec 17 18:11 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: was not popular the bugger took forever to boot. | Dec 17 18:12 |
| cubexyz | btw the Amiga 500 had a 512k rom | Dec 17 18:12 |
| cubexyz | and that was in 1987 | Dec 17 18:12 |
| cubexyz | bigger than I thought it would be | Dec 17 18:13 |
| oiaohm | x86 PC were really built on the cheap | Dec 17 18:13 |
| cubexyz | also the roms were really well documented on the amiga | Dec 17 18:14 |
| cubexyz | there was a huge book for it | Dec 17 18:14 |
| oiaohm | That is the thing we had huge ammount of time of underdocumented firmware. | Dec 17 18:15 |
| cubexyz | in fact it was 3 huge books | Dec 17 18:16 |
| oiaohm | exactly | Dec 17 18:17 |
| oiaohm | You might not have been able to change amiga 500 bios but you knew exactly what the beast was upto. | Dec 17 18:17 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, you could change it by replacing the chip | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | 1.2 -> 1.3 -> 2.04 | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | mine is still 1.3 rom | Dec 17 18:18 |
| oiaohm | I thought those were soldered on? | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | nope | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | socketed | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | I upgraded mine from the original 1.2 | Dec 17 18:19 |
| oiaohm | Also those are roms not flash so secure from runtime alteration. | Dec 17 18:19 |
| cubexyz | yes :) | Dec 17 18:19 |
| oiaohm | level of means to replace alters security. | Dec 17 18:20 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/amiga-500-board.jpg | Dec 17 18:20 |
| cubexyz | see all the socketed chips? | Dec 17 18:21 |
| cubexyz | except for the ram at the bottom | Dec 17 18:21 |
| cubexyz | the rom chip is to the right of the 68000 cpu | Dec 17 18:22 |
| oiaohm | The problem with a flash firmware is it can be too simple to replace. | Dec 17 18:24 |
| MinceR | especially if switches or jumpers are too expensive to include | Dec 17 18:25 |
| cubexyz | doh | Dec 17 18:25 |
| MinceR | (because as we've seen before, no price is worth paying for security, even if we keep using "security" as the excuse for everything) | Dec 17 18:25 |
| cubexyz | yeah a jumper is so expensive :) | Dec 17 18:25 |
| cubexyz | there's lots of stupid stuff in the world | Dec 17 18:29 |
| cubexyz | I appreciate the old amiga more now | Dec 17 18:30 |
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| MinceR | so do i | Dec 17 18:32 |
| MinceR | though i never had one :> | Dec 17 18:32 |
| oiaohm | Security is used as excuse. The effort you see hardware companies goto to save 0.4 cents is inane. | Dec 17 18:36 |
| MinceR | indeed | Dec 17 18:38 |
| oiaohm | Now of course some of the items they are attempting to fix should have been fixed years ago. | Dec 17 18:38 |
| oiaohm | Like means to overwrite bios at runtime causing all kinds of bad things to happen should have never been possible. | Dec 17 18:39 |
| oiaohm | asdasf hmm spell checker failed better restart program. | Dec 17 18:39 |
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| MinceR | lol | Dec 17 18:40 |
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| cubexyz | I think I understand Unix v5 better than I ever understood AmigaDOS | Dec 17 18:42 |
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| MinceR | is AMD doing anything like intel boot guard? | Dec 17 19:15 |
| cubexyz | AMD has DASH | Dec 17 19:23 |
| cubexyz | so there's a full TCP/IP stack in the BIOS or whatever they call it now | Dec 17 19:24 |
| cubexyz | there is some optional form of boot control but I don't know exactly how it works | Dec 17 19:25 |
| cubexyz | obviously it wouldn't be difficult for it to "ET phone home" | Dec 17 19:26 |
| MinceR | isn't DASH more of a parallel to IPMI? | Dec 17 19:30 |
| cubexyz | well intel boot guard is part of Intel VPro which is an example of IPMI | Dec 17 19:33 |
| cubexyz | so DASH probably has something like intel boot guard | Dec 17 19:33 |
| MinceR | ic | Dec 17 19:33 |
| MinceR | would be nice to know for certain | Dec 17 19:33 |
| cubexyz | I think actually most motherboards with AMD CPU support don't have DASH | Dec 17 19:35 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 17 19:35 |
| cubexyz | at least not the consumer ones | Dec 17 19:36 |
| MinceR | and also used to support coreboot, i wonder if that still stands | Dec 17 19:36 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Sheikh_al_Touar/status/677593378335432704 | Dec 17 20:58 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Sheikh_al_Touar: @schestowitz Happy B-Day! May all your wishes come true! Enjoy your time in the Pub 🍻🎈🎊🎉🎁🎈🎊🎉🎁 | Dec 17 20:58 | |
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| schestowitz | " | Dec 17 21:09 |
| schestowitz | Article 23 EPC | Dec 17 21:09 |
| schestowitz | Independence of the members of the Boards | Dec 17 21:09 |
| schestowitz | (1) | Dec 17 21:09 |
| schestowitz | The members of the Enlarged Board of Appeal and of the Boards of Appeal shall be appointed for a term of five years and may not be removed from office during this term | Dec 17 21:09 |
| schestowitz | I would read this provision as removal or measures having an effect equivalent to removal. | Dec 17 21:09 |
| schestowitz | " | Dec 17 21:09 |
| schestowitz | https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=5574479&postID=5205293627419117961&isPopup=true | Dec 17 21:09 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.blogger.com | Blogger: The IPKat - Post a Comment | Dec 17 21:09 | |
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| *Disconnected (Connection timed out). | Dec 17 22:28 | |
| **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Dec 17 22:28:55 2015 | ||
| **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Dec 17 22:29:24 2015 | ||
| *Now talking on #techrights | Dec 17 22:29 | |
| *Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org | Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell | Dec 17 22:29 | |
| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 17 22:29 | |
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| *Now talking on #techrights | Dec 17 23:12 | |
| *Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org | Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell | Dec 17 23:12 | |
| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 17 23:12 | |
| *[freenode-info] help freenode weed out clonebots -- please register your IRC nick and auto-identify: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup | Dec 17 23:12 | |
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| MinceR | http://www.everyjoe.com/2015/12/17/news/yale-students-sign-petition-repeal-the-first-amendment/ | Dec 18 00:36 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.everyjoe.com | Yale Students Sign "Petition” to Repeal the First Amendment [ http://ur1.ca/ocm80 ] | Dec 18 00:36 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/AnarchistDalek/status/677783319082233856 | Dec 18 09:51 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AnarchistDalek: 😨😨😨😨😨 https://t.co/R1kqRefGK5 | Dec 18 09:51 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #UbuntuTouch OTA-9 for Ubuntu Phones Launches on January 20, 2016 https://t.co/W1wokqD1vm #linux #ubuntu | Dec 18 09:51 | |
| msb__ | cubexyz: Hello? | Dec 18 10:02 |
| cubexyz | msb__, hi | Dec 18 10:02 |
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| msb__ | Would you like to see a TV episode about a group of psychic investigators flying on a plane? Directed by Tobe Hooper. | Dec 18 10:03 |
| cubexyz | ok :) | Dec 18 10:04 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677793116557082624 | Dec 18 10:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @Laura_F_ERCOLI @Serv_Pubblico @POLITICOEurope https://t.co/pHptGrpodv | Dec 18 10:18 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #EPO charges a lot of money from applicants for many examiners to examine together, but still rushes process https://t.co/QzixviJ3E1 | Dec 18 10:18 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677793521152167936 | Dec 18 10:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @wallstreetita @ilgiornale @fattoquotidiano @POLITICOEurope @Laura_F_ERCOLI @reportrai3 @LaGabbiaTw @Serv_Pubblico https://t.co/0R9PC2DzK2 | Dec 18 10:18 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @FOSSpatents Admin Council Does Not Crush the Boards But Does Crush the Unions (Suspension Duration Sextupled) https://t.co/4GgHJqS7qJ | Dec 18 10:18 | |
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| schestowitz | "I strongly recommend that the people who cannot live with libsystemd0 | Dec 18 12:03 |
| schestowitz | installed on their systems leave Debian, because their life is going to | Dec 18 12:03 |
| schestowitz | suck more and more as we will integrate it in every important daemon | Dec 18 12:03 |
| schestowitz | after jessie will have been released." | Dec 18 12:03 |
| schestowitz | https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2015/02/msg00644.html | Dec 18 12:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2015/02/msg00644.html ) | Dec 18 12:03 | |
| cubexyz | you'll see an exodus to the BSDs if things don't improve, mark my words | Dec 18 12:11 |
| cubexyz | we'll see what happens with slackware | Dec 18 12:13 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz and schestowitz the issue is a little more complex. Packages linked against libsystemd0 are going to want something libsystemd0 so you cannot straight up delete it. systemd-shim of the past solution could be used where the libsystemd0 is no-oped in most places. | Dec 18 12:17 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/robcolbert/status/677824818197196800 | Dec 18 12:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@robcolbert: @schestowitz I didn't mean to usurp your hashtag, but since we're fighting the same battles I would like to learn more & we should talk. | Dec 18 12:18 | |
| schestowitz | Always happy to hear of any updates, news... | Dec 18 12:18 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/robcolbert/status/677824951546679297 | Dec 18 12:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@robcolbert: If you'd rather not be tracked by what frameworks and other centralized assets you access every single day online: https://t.co/4iwrwkd9en | Dec 18 12:18 | |
| cubexyz | on q4os I only have libsystemd-login0... all other systemd files are gone | Dec 18 12:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #Decentraleyes for Firefox loads CDN resources locally https://t.co/8ILQ3naAKN #mozilla #firefox #freesw | Dec 18 12:18 | |
| cubexyz | so I'm tolerating that one part only | Dec 18 12:18 |
| cubexyz | and only on q4os... | Dec 18 12:19 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I guess libsystem0 is still on the system. | Dec 18 12:19 |
| oiaohm | Because libsystmd-login0 uses it. | Dec 18 12:19 |
| cubexyz | nope | Dec 18 12:20 |
| cubexyz | it only uses libsystemd-login.so.0 | Dec 18 12:20 |
| cubexyz | I know because I just checked it :) | Dec 18 12:20 |
| oiaohm | I forgot that got split off. | Dec 18 12:21 |
| oiaohm | systemd is internally getting split up more. | Dec 18 12:21 |
| oiaohm | Purely being stuborn on my part my old 500GB harddrive is down to less than 10 megs of sectors questiaonable on readable status. | Dec 18 12:23 |
| cubexyz | I do wonder what the heck happened to ttylinux though | Dec 18 12:28 |
| cubexyz | seems to have disappeared | Dec 18 12:29 |
| cubexyz | people get tired or disillusioned and then pack it in | Dec 18 12:29 |
| *WeS has quit (Quit: Gtg See ya Later) | Dec 18 13:21 | |
| schestowitz | >> I've not had the time to cover it and I worry that covering this will | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | >> > amplify the MS PR. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > Agreed. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | >> > I'd rather just write more articles about the tax | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | >> > evasion. When new information becomes available. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > It's the tax evasion that they are worried about, and don't want | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > coverage of. I think it itself may be covering something big. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > Hopefully time and material will turn up in the next few weeks. I have | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > noticed that M$ rarely does a distraction unless they have reason to. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > Given that the distraction is big, noisy, and expensive they must have | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > something big to hide. As mentioned my very speculative guess is that | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > they may be reaching the limit to solvency. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | I'm very deep into EPO (buried in material right now), so if you keep an eye on MS and send me links, that'll ensure I can still post about the important things... | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | Expect some major EPO scandal to come up very soon... | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/mall_dweller/status/677842102378766336 | Dec 18 13:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mall_dweller: @schestowitz Waitwhut? You're saing EPO is ddossing your website? | Dec 18 13:30 | |
| *oiaohm has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Dec 18 14:45 | |
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| schestowitz | > Just in time for a new attack on RMS. Brian Lunduke managed to talk RMS into | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > an interview and the panelists now seem to be busy smearing and | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > misrepresenting him to puff themselves up. See, | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > Lunduke | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/u/0/+BryanLunduke/posts/CEsDETRJxge | Dec 18 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Video: The Need for Compromise in Free Software - With Richard Stallman. Huge… | Dec 18 16:03 | |
| schestowitz | > http://lunduke.com/2015/12/16/need-for-compromise-in-free-software-with-richard-stallman/ | Dec 18 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lunduke.com | [Bryan] Lunduke.com » Need for Compromise in Free Software – With Richard Stallman [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhg ] | Dec 18 16:03 | |
| schestowitz | > https://archive.org/details/CompromiseInFreeSoftware | Dec 18 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-archive.org | Compromise In Free Software : Bryan Lunduke : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhh ] | Dec 18 16:03 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > Seigo, who calls RMS a "Zealot" who does not care enough about free software | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/u/0/+AaronSeigo/posts/j6DG5ERzLmb | Dec 18 16:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Video: The Need for Compromise in Free Software - With Richard Stallman. Huge… [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhi ] | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > https://exote.ch/blogs/aseigo/2015/12/16/server-software-matters/ | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-exote.ch | Server Software Matters | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > Bhartiya who promotes Pixel C | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/+SwapnilBhartiya/posts/U72P8mr7mTf | Dec 18 16:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Video: The Need for Compromise in Free Software - With Richard Stallman. Huge… [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhl ] | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/+SwapnilBhartiya/posts/RW8dZ5bHb2j | Dec 18 16:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | After using the Pixel C I realised how much I missed the iPad AIR. iPad Pro is… [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhn ] | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > and has been promoting ... Microsoft Word, Apple, and Suse, | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.swapnil.io/2015/12/16/microsoft-word-bring-odf-support-to-ios-beats-google-docs/ | Dec 18 16:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.swapnil.io | Microsoft Word brings ODF support to iOS, beats Google Docs | swapnil [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhp ] | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > there, now I don't have to keep those tabs open ... maybe I can forget the | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > whole thing. | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > I have not actually watched the video yet, but I'm not really happy with these | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > people. They have all been doing odd things to promote fog computing and | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > other things to help Microsoft and software owners. Swampnil's trajectory | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > has been particularly disappointing. Seigo has always said awful things | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > about the wrong people. I'm not really sure I want to even start looking at | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > it, because it will be a waste of time talking to these folks. | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > At the same time, I expect the themes to resonate across Microsoft troll media | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > and the fauxpen source community. | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | You can challenge them online over it, but I don't want to bicker with them on these issues because it's a distraction of efforts (the real enemy is proprietary software) and I really want to focus on the EPO right now. | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | Seigo isn't all that bad and Swapnil is usually OK. I personally challenged Brian many times and he tried building bridges with them... | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/wowbagger999/status/662396878923964416?cn=ZmF2b3JpdGVfbWVudGlvbmVkX3VzZXI%3D&refsrc=email | Dec 18 16:06 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@wowbagger999: @glynmoody @schestowitz #TTIP #TPP & Co seem infected with some kind of #ACTA bachdoor. We should delete them and reboot our systems! | Dec 18 16:06 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/677788818276270080 | Dec 18 16:58 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Big Brother is born. And we find out 15 years too late to stop him https://t.co/2VA0ehcui4 "four million intercepted phone calls a year" | Dec 18 16:58 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.theregister.co.uk | Big Brother is born. And we find out 15 years too late to stop him • The Register | Dec 18 16:58 | |
| *schestowitz has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Dec 18 17:06 | |
| *schestowitz (~roy@host81-152-84-174.range81-152.btcentralplus.com) has joined #techrights | Dec 18 17:07 | |
| -NickServ-schestowitz!~roy@host81-152-84-174.range81-152.btcentralplus.com has just authenticated as you (schestowitz) | Dec 18 17:07 | |
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| MinceR | http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-12-17/battle-over-women-pop-star-sinks-deutsche-telekom-unit-contract | Dec 18 18:29 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.bloomberg.com | Battle Over Women, Pop Star Sinks Magyar Telekom Contract - Bloomberg Business [ http://ur1.ca/ocnok ] | Dec 18 18:29 | |
| schestowitz | got this today | Dec 18 18:46 |
| schestowitz | "Regards, and keep up the good work." | Dec 18 18:46 |
| schestowitz | EPO is in a bad state atm | Dec 18 18:46 |
| *abeNd-org has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Dec 18 18:49 | |
| *arossdotme has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat) | Dec 18 19:41 | |
| schestowitz | > I think it's everytime I mention your name or link to a Techrights article. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > The only thing I have bothered to document was two years ago, where he said | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > you were "full on dipshit tinfoil hat crazy" about Novel and Microsoft. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/+AaronS eigo/posts/6gT9djuXEV4 | Dec 18 19:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Aaron's - Google+ | Dec 18 19:53 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > If you'd like I can do a little more searching to confirm or disprove my | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > opinion. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > Strangely enough, I get a similar reaction from Lauren Weinstein about Richard | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > Stallman. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > It's interesting how effective the strategy is. When you suspect something | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > wrong, you are dismissed as paranoid and ignorant. If you do the research | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > and it verifies what you thought, you are dismissed as unbalanced for having | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > cared enough to do the work. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:54 |
| schestowitz | > The holidays are on, as usual, and time is tight. This is when all sorts of | Dec 18 19:54 |
| schestowitz | > rude things are rolled out. | Dec 18 19:54 |
| schestowitz | I sounds as though Seigo's remark was a one-off, which I guess is good news. I don't need enemies there; besides, Seigo did support my views on Novell in the past, despite his issues of loyalty and commitments. Also remember Kolab's connections to SUSE (Germany-Switzerland). He works for Kolab now. | Dec 18 19:54 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynmoody/status/677944390065737728 | Dec 18 20:39 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynmoody: @schestowitz "fact-tracking" -> "fast-tracking"? | Dec 18 20:39 | |
| schestowitz | ta | Dec 18 20:39 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/David_Vaporium/status/677940535559069697 | Dec 18 20:40 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@David_Vaporium: @schestowitz @tvlicensingblog If are charged - claim you true status as `the accused` never accept the term `defendant` BoP is c/o Accuser | Dec 18 20:40 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677940192448266240 | Dec 18 20:40 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz @FOSSpatents As long as he's the only one in the building I would not mind at all. | Dec 18 20:40 | |
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| -NickServ-schestowitz!~roy@host81-152-84-174.range81-152.btcentralplus.com has just authenticated as you (schestowitz) | Dec 18 21:03 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/InlineQuickSort/status/677977097479053313 | Dec 18 22:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@InlineQuickSort: @schestowitz no direct role, just a school for high public officials. 80% of french politicians come from "l’ENA". | Dec 18 22:28 | |
| schestowitz | including battistelli | Dec 18 22:28 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/terencecallacha/status/677980805755465729 | Dec 18 22:40 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@terencecallacha: He needs to look after his farms so having advance notice of govt policy allows his to avoid problems like tax https://t.co/d9kGaE9OTN | Dec 18 22:40 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Revealed: Prince Charles has received confidential cabinet papers for decades https://t.co/VFGBiqXWkN #monarchy #uk | Dec 18 22:40 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/morvjn/status/677984402660397056 | Dec 18 22:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@morvjn: @schestowitz But i might not get my tablet... | Dec 18 22:53 | |
| schestowitz | I want a KDE3 tablet :-) | Dec 18 22:53 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/morvjn/status/677985443405672448 | Dec 18 22:55 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@morvjn: @schestowitz That's vaporware, isnt it? The Jolla tablet is real - or at least the first batch was :( | Dec 18 22:55 | |
| schestowitz | Yes, but Vivaldi was KDE4 | Dec 18 22:55 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677993675213901825 | Dec 18 23:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @InlineQuickSort @schestowitz Sounds like becoming prince by heritage. Is there any issue on transparency in accessing ENA education ? | Dec 18 23:30 | |
| schestowitz | hhmmm. site down? | Dec 18 23:42 |
| schestowitz | test: http://techrights.org | Dec 18 23:42 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | Techrights | People's rights in the digital age | Plutocracy threatened by freedom, democracy, privacy & civil rights | Dec 18 23:42 | |
| schestowitz | just me then... | Dec 18 23:42 |
| schestowitz | probably blacklisted by fail2ban | Dec 18 23:42 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/InlineQuickSort/status/678003160074559489 | Dec 19 00:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@InlineQuickSort: @KrapulaPhD @schestowitz not really, it’s a difficult entrance exam with bachelor degree required (usually litterature). | Dec 19 00:05 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/InlineQuickSort/status/678004446991917056 | Dec 19 00:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@InlineQuickSort: @KrapulaPhD @schestowitz but mostly upper classes go to ENA and ENArques do not go systematically into politics. | Dec 19 00:11 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677795117781147648 | Dec 19 00:13 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: While we're talking democracy and state of rights.... Help yourselves. https://t.co/ObTb0zX6nY | Dec 19 00:13 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Big Brother is born. And we find out 15 years too late to stop him https://t.co/2VA0ehcui4 "four million intercepted phone calls a year" | Dec 19 00:13 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/hewiak/status/678006833232015360 | Dec 19 00:20 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@hewiak: @SciencePorn @schestowitz this may constitute proof of how #boring #engineers can be, and how #bored #scientists can be | Dec 19 00:20 | |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6919375 | Dec 19 00:29 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com reshared: Birds Linux 6.0 Hummingbird has been released! http://birdslinux.altervista.org/en/ #linux #birdslinux #education #scuola #istruzione #math #algebra #mywork #opensource #matematica #xfce #sabayon | Dec 19 00:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- Photo by birdslinux@pod.geraspora.de: https://pod.geraspora.de/uploads/images/thumb_medium_dcfe8b510445eafadb71.jpg | Dec 19 00:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- Photo by birdslinux@pod.geraspora.de: https://pod.geraspora.de/uploads/images/thumb_medium_dcfe8b510445eafadb71.jpg | Dec 19 00:29 | |
| schestowitz | "Chrome? Non-free for default browser?" | Dec 19 00:29 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> birdslinux.altervista.org | Birds Linux | Dec 19 00:29 | |
| schestowitz | Strange that, yes.. | Dec 19 00:29 |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6915676 | Dec 19 00:30 |
| schestowitz | "Yes, the patents were technically from Xerox but they are now owned by a Microsoft affiliated troll and Microsoft was all over it. At the time, I remember Microsoft used all of their retail and hardware might to muscle out Palm by excluding them and by dumping cheaper Windows based PDAs. I also ran into a Palm user who complained that Microsoft people had unfairly run him out of the local computer club. This was at a time before Internet | Dec 19 00:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: How #HTC went from smartphone trailblazer to barely breathing http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/the-decline-and-fall-of-htc/ great devices, marketing too weak | Dec 19 00:30 | |
| schestowitz | for me when I was just starting to realize how evil Microsoft, so I don’t have useful links and in depth knowledge of it." | Dec 19 00:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.digitaltrends.com | The Sad History of HTC's Epic Rise and Fall | Digital Trends [ http://ur1.ca/oco6j ] | Dec 19 00:30 | |
| schestowitz | Which Microsoft troll 'owns' these patents now? | Dec 19 00:30 |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678163612779741184 | Dec 19 11:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz Much like debt collectors, buying old (often expired) debt claims to extort money to the unaware. Vultures. Parasites. Leeches. | Dec 19 11:04 | |
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| schestowitz | The Christmas market in #manchester esp. this year is better and bigger than ever before (keeps expanding each year) http://schestowitz.com/royrianne/gallery/index.php/Birthday-at-the-German-Market | Dec 19 14:46 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-schestowitz.com | Birthday at the German Market [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4k ] | Dec 19 14:46 | |
| cubexyz | more emails complaining about windows 10 | Dec 19 14:46 |
| schestowitz | where? | Dec 19 14:46 |
| schestowitz | Need to see, can use in article | Dec 19 14:46 |
| cubexyz | it's frustrating... I tell people not to use windows 10 and what do they do? Install windows 7 | Dec 19 14:46 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: also, (haven't looked at TR in awhile) did you cover CyanogenOS's inclusion of Cortana | Dec 19 14:47 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: also, CM13 nightly recently added an NTFS driver | Dec 19 14:47 |
| XFaCE | http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/123061/ | Dec 19 14:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-review.cyanogenmod.org | Gerrit Code Review [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4n ] | Dec 19 14:49 | |
| XFaCE | "sepolicy: Set the context for fsck.exfat/ntfs to fsck_exec" | Dec 19 14:49 |
| schestowitz | didn't see it | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | is it in C-Mode? | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/122995/ | Dec 19 14:50 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-review.cyanogenmod.org | Gerrit Code Review [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4p ] | Dec 19 14:50 | |
| schestowitz | Or just Cyanogen Inc? | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | "Native NTFS kernel driver support" | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | this is CM13 | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | I mean, upstream | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | is it included in the core of CM? | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | yes | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | wow | Dec 19 14:50 |
| cubexyz | schestowitz, I'm asking for permission to use it as it's a private email | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | You said CyanogenOS | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: yeah, in realtion to cortana | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | *relation | Dec 19 14:51 |
| schestowitz | what's the link? | Dec 19 14:51 |
| schestowitz | Because they claims CM is barebones and then vendors can do to it a bundle | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | http://www.xda-developers.com/xda-external-link/cortana-now-available-where-and-when-you-need-her-no-matter-what-smartphone-you-choose/ | Dec 19 14:51 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.xda-developers.com | Cortana to Come Preloaded On Cyanogen OS 12.1.1 on OnePlus One [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4r ] | Dec 19 14:51 | |
| schestowitz | also, are there articles about it? | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | so to summarize | Dec 19 14:51 |
| schestowitz | one PlusOne | Dec 19 14:51 |
| schestowitz | but is it also upstream? | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | NTFS/exFat is added to CyanogenMod | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | Cortana on CyanogenOS | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | so CyanogenOS has become a transparent Microsoft marketing bed | Dec 19 14:52 |
| XFaCE | and CM13 is slowly becoming one :P | Dec 19 14:52 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: sorry you don't understand the problem. | Dec 19 14:53 |
| XFaCE | "At the official announcement post for Cortana’s availability on iOS and Android, Microsoft also announced that future versions of Cyanogen OS will feature deep integration of Cortana. " | Dec 19 14:53 |
| oiaohm | NTFS and exFat in fact becomes stupidly forced by storage device makers. | Dec 19 14:53 |
| XFaCE | I don't even run either on my sdcard | Dec 19 14:53 |
| XFaCE | I just use JFFS | Dec 19 14:53 |
| oiaohm | You still don't understand the problem. | Dec 19 14:53 |
| XFaCE | that was an aside comment | Dec 19 14:54 |
| oiaohm | Some sdcards if you put anything other than exfat or ntfs on them they will destory you data. | Dec 19 14:54 |
| oiaohm | and I am not kidding. | Dec 19 14:54 |
| XFaCE | well that's fucked up | Dec 19 14:54 |
| XFaCE | link? | Dec 19 14:54 |
| oiaohm | Why they storage card system for working out what sectors it can recycle for wear leveling is working from the information it extracting from the file system. | Dec 19 14:55 |
| oiaohm | It was covered in a 2010 australian Linux conference video. | Dec 19 14:55 |
| XFaCE | "Nevertheless, in order to be fully compliant with the SDXC card specification, many SDXC-capable host devices are firmware-programmed to expect exFAT on cards larger than 32 GB. Consequently, they may not accept SDXC cards reformatted as FAT32, even if the device supports FAT32 on smaller cards (for SDHC compatibility). Therefore, even if a file system is supported in general, it is not always possible to use alternative file systems on SDXC cards a | Dec 19 14:56 |
| XFaCE | t all depending on how strictly the SDXC card specification has been implemented in the device. This bears a risk of accidental loss of data, as a host device may treat a card with an unrecognized file system as blank or damaged and reformat the card." | Dec 19 14:56 |
| XFaCE | wow | Dec 19 14:56 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: Please note SDXC contains exfat as part of the standard. | Dec 19 14:56 |
| XFaCE | after how much $$$ from MS? | Dec 19 14:57 |
| oiaohm | So format SDXC with NTFS and its exfat only you data is screwed. | Dec 19 14:57 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: when you understand the problem what choice do OS vendors have when Hardware makers lock in the format. | Dec 19 14:58 |
| XFaCE | thanks for this info, I didn't know that | Dec 19 14:58 |
| schestowitz | thanks | Dec 19 14:58 |
| schestowitz | will do an article about i | Dec 19 14:59 |
| schestowitz | it | Dec 19 14:59 |
| XFaCE | two separate ones? | Dec 19 14:59 |
| oiaohm | Please note when buying ssd harddrives this problem can apply as well. | Dec 19 14:59 |
| oiaohm | Yes always look for Linux support on a ssd harddrive because that means generic file system support. | Dec 19 14:59 |
| oiaohm | Windows or OS X only ssds could be nasty. | Dec 19 14:59 |
| XFaCE | god damn | Dec 19 14:59 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: do you have an example of a Linux-ready SSD? | Dec 19 15:03 |
| XFaCE | for future reference | Dec 19 15:03 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: looks like what oiaohm has said - the cm13 ntfs thing is an android-wide developement | Dec 19 15:04 |
| XFaCE | cyanogenos however IS going microsoft | Dec 19 15:04 |
| oiaohm | https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/legal/intellectualproperty/mtl/technologylicensing.aspx?f0ebc726-7ebd-4545-a353-de9b1edbdbee=True Yes Microsoft does demard patents over exfat. | Dec 19 15:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.microsoft.com | Intellectual Property Technology Licensing Programs [ http://ur1.ca/ocp5c ] | Dec 19 15:05 | |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: this is the kind of shit that anti-trust agencies should be raving on | Dec 19 15:06 |
| XFaCE | this is clear monopolistic bullshit | Dec 19 15:07 |
| cubexyz | schestowitz, briefly it's like this... customer says win10 KOed his computer to the point he can't even install a new OS | Dec 19 15:07 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: ssd even Linux ready ones have major teeth at times. https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/18363/Intel-Solid-State-Drive-Firmware-Update-Tool | Dec 19 15:07 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-downloadcenter.intel.com | Download Intel® Solid-State Drive Firmware Update Tool [ http://ur1.ca/ocp5f ] | Dec 19 15:07 | |
| cubexyz | I've asked him for permision to quote him, as soon as he gives that I'll post the text online | Dec 19 15:08 |
| XFaCE | major teeth? | Dec 19 15:08 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: ssd drives have firmware updates read the notes about it. | Dec 19 15:08 |
| XFaCE | yikes | Dec 19 15:09 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: ---If the Intel SSD firmware update process is interrupted, your Intel SSD may not function properly.--- found this bit. | Dec 19 15:09 |
| oiaohm | In otherwords I can eat your data. | Dec 19 15:09 |
| oiaohm | Now Microsoft is wanting to make firmware updating on stuff automatic. | Dec 19 15:09 |
| cubexyz | the upside, if there is one... is the customer will be more receptive to non-microsoft operating systems | Dec 19 15:10 |
| oiaohm | My main usage of ssd harddrives is as bcache where the majority of the data is kept on old school spinning media. | Dec 19 15:11 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: how are kingston ssds for linux compatibility? | Dec 19 15:11 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: From what I have seen of kingston ssds they all had Linux firmware update tools. Now a problem you can run into with a kingston ssd they don't have os x tools and older drives don't have current version of Windows tools. | Dec 19 15:14 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: so kingston ssd is more Linux compadible than anything else. | Dec 19 15:14 |
| oiaohm | Ie not compadible with mostly everything else. | Dec 19 15:14 |
| XFaCE | lol | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | well that's good to know | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | Kingston SSDs it is | Dec 19 15:15 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: I guess you starting to see this SSD stuff has major holes. | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | well I never even thought of it | Dec 19 15:15 |
| oiaohm | So a SSD good for Linux can be horible for Windows and OS X. | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | thanks very much for bringing it to our attention | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | the sdxc thing is just... wow | Dec 19 15:16 |
| oiaohm | And you can swap that around. | Dec 19 15:16 |
| oiaohm | So when you buy a SSD it better match the OS's you are wishing to use in spec. | Dec 19 15:16 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: in an ideal world SDXD would require JFFS or something open | Dec 19 15:16 |
| XFaCE | or YAFFS | Dec 19 15:17 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: F2FS is from samsung. | Dec 19 15:18 |
| XFaCE | ah right | Dec 19 15:18 |
| schestowitz | https://www.gnu.org/fun/jokes/helloworld.html | Dec 19 15:22 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gnu.org | Hello World! - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation (FSF) [ http://ur1.ca/ocp69 ] | Dec 19 15:22 | |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: JFFS and YAFFS don't have the required size to meet SDXC spec sizes let alown what a new spec could put up. But F2FS does. | Dec 19 15:22 |
| XFaCE | yeah I think I was thinking of F2FS oiaohm | Dec 19 15:23 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: yep, my bad | Dec 19 15:26 |
| XFaCE | the names can get confusing | Dec 19 15:26 |
| XFaCE | but yeah I'm using F2FS on my phone | Dec 19 15:26 |
| oiaohm | I know. Its only that I watch the australian Linux conference videos that I got it right. | Dec 19 15:26 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: http://windows.microsoft.com/en-au/windows/lifecycle Read down notice Oct 2016 preinstallation of Windows 7 and windows 8.1 is no longer meant to be performed by Microsoft Profesionals. | Dec 19 15:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-windows.microsoft.com | Windows lifecycle fact sheet - Windows Help [ http://ur1.ca/ocp6l ] | Dec 19 15:28 | |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: and "Retail software end of sales " is the full boxed set editions. | Dec 19 15:29 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: mostly the old OS stuff you find in stores is old stock. | Dec 19 15:30 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: writing on the wall | Dec 19 15:30 |
| XFaCE | gentoo for me | Dec 19 15:30 |
| oiaohm | Debian for me. | Dec 19 15:30 |
| XFaCE | all the time | Dec 19 15:30 |
| oiaohm | systemd does not bother me enough to move away from it. | Dec 19 15:30 |
| XFaCE | the only windows installation will be in an internet-free KVM | Dec 19 15:30 |
| XFaCE | like studying a virus or bacteria :) | Dec 19 15:31 |
| oiaohm | From what I am hearing is the windows 10 upgrade is being deployed by the Windows 7 and 8.1 update system. | Dec 19 15:32 |
| oiaohm | If that is the case Microsoft can declare it a critical update for Windows 7 and 8.1 so kill support to anything that is not 10. | Dec 19 15:32 |
| XFaCE | yeah | Dec 19 15:32 |
| XFaCE | I feel sorry for the Windows 7 users now - every windows update has to be examined | Dec 19 15:33 |
| XFaCE | I have an ignore list for what it's worth | Dec 19 15:33 |
| oiaohm | Windows 10 no ignore list | Dec 19 15:33 |
| oiaohm | For gernal users. | Dec 19 15:33 |
| XFaCE | yeah | Dec 19 15:33 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: Windows 10 is not for general users :) | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | or any users | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | as schestowitz would say, it's for the useds(sic) | Dec 19 15:34 |
| oiaohm | Only way I can see that I can run Windows 10 is run it inside virtual machine some how. | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | KVM yeah | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | isolated from the rest of the system | Dec 19 15:34 |
| oiaohm | So I can control its internet access so control its update system | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: there is WSUS | Dec 19 15:34 |
| oiaohm | WSUS is only for enterprise editions. | Dec 19 15:35 |
| XFaCE | that program enterprises use to control windows updates to machines | Dec 19 15:35 |
| oiaohm | That is another change with Windows 10. | Dec 19 15:35 |
| oiaohm | Windows 7 and 8.1 as long as it was pro you could connect it to WSUS. | Dec 19 15:35 |
| *schestowitz takes notes for later | Dec 19 15:35 | |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: well, there's always just downloading updates and installing them via cmd script | Dec 19 15:35 |
| XFaCE | aka the Windows 95 and below way :P | Dec 19 15:36 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: remember Windows 10 auto updates. | Dec 19 15:36 |
| oiaohm | So internet connection it getting it themselves. | Dec 19 15:36 |
| XFaCE | hence why the KVM (or equivalent) should have no or tightly regulated internet access | Dec 19 15:36 |
| cubexyz | it sounds like utter crap | Dec 19 15:37 |
| XFaCE | pretty much | Dec 19 15:37 |
| XFaCE | at this point running MS-DOS 10 sounds preferable | Dec 19 15:37 |
| oiaohm | http://www.wsusoffline.net/docs/ At least wsusoffline supports Windows 10 | Dec 19 15:38 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.wsusoffline.net | WSUS Offline Update - Update Microsoft Windows and Office without an Internet connection | Dec 19 15:38 | |
| oiaohm | So you don't need to give windows 10 internet access to get updates for it. | Dec 19 15:38 |
| XFaCE | good thought | Dec 19 15:38 |
| XFaCE | I forgot about WSUSoffline | Dec 19 15:38 |
| oiaohm | I have worked out that I can perfectly contain Windows 10. | Dec 19 15:39 |
| oiaohm | Problem is virtualisation stuff like sharing a video card between 2 OS's is still crap. | Dec 19 15:39 |
| XFaCE | true | Dec 19 15:39 |
| XFaCE | I guess Wine would be needed to run those applications | Dec 19 15:39 |
| XFaCE | graphics-intensive ones | Dec 19 15:40 |
| oiaohm | Businesses use a lot of applications that don't run in Wine. | Dec 19 15:40 |
| MinceR | businesses can afford to have those applications rewritten by people who have a clue | Dec 19 15:40 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: not exactly so. I wish it could say that. | Dec 19 15:40 |
| cubexyz | surely is this the total end of microsoft's dominance though | Dec 19 15:41 |
| cubexyz | it's so bad... | Dec 19 15:41 |
| MinceR | not unless uefi dies | Dec 19 15:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: some applications are forced on companies by stupid governement departments. | Dec 19 15:41 |
| XFaCE | cubexyz: end of *total* dominance perhaps | Dec 19 15:41 |
| XFaCE | but not the total end of dominance | Dec 19 15:41 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: governments can especially afford to have those applications rewritten by people who have a clue | Dec 19 15:41 |
| MinceR | skip buying hypePads for every MP for one year and it's funded | Dec 19 15:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: true lets take the Australian tax office for example of not having a clue. cisco system flawed VPN product is still in usage because they have not got any other solution ready. The product has been expired for 4 and a half years. | Dec 19 15:42 |
| *XRevan86 (~XRevan86@meowr.ru) has joined #techrights | Dec 19 15:43 | |
| cubexyz | I renewed my driver's license online via linux this year | Dec 19 15:43 |
| cubexyz | first time | Dec 19 15:43 |
| cubexyz | so I'm 100% off the doze | Dec 19 15:44 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: first time it worked? | Dec 19 15:44 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, no I never tried it before | Dec 19 15:44 |
| MinceR | f5's vpn sucks about as much as fiasco's | Dec 19 15:44 |
| MinceR | (even if they try to deny at every opportunity that their vpn is a vpn) | Dec 19 15:44 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: you also know something horiblely wrong when If a computer with Windows 10 and I can legally go out and buy Windows 8.1 and 7 boxed set and write it off on the next Australian tax return on compadiblity grounds. | Dec 19 15:45 |
| cubexyz | I'm sorry to say things are getting worse in computer-land | Dec 19 15:46 |
| cubexyz | I was thinking things were improving but now... | Dec 19 15:46 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: see, they have plenty of money to waste | Dec 19 15:46 |
| cubexyz | I'm not so sure | Dec 19 15:46 |
| oiaohm | I can only spec about how stupid Australian governement departments are. | Dec 19 15:46 |
| oiaohm | spec/speek | Dec 19 15:46 |
| oiaohm | But I would suspect other countries in places could be as bad. | Dec 19 15:46 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, a safe assumption outside of Munich I think | Dec 19 15:47 |
| XFaCE | cisco system flawed VPN product is still in usage because they have not got any other solution ready | Dec 19 15:47 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: yeah | Dec 19 15:47 |
| XFaCE | Back on Windows the Cisco VPN driver caused nasty BSODs when copying over the network about a certain speed | Dec 19 15:48 |
| XFaCE | even on non-vpn connections | Dec 19 15:48 |
| XFaCE | *above | Dec 19 15:48 |
| oiaohm | https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Lodging-your-tax-return/In-detail/e-tax-help/#Computerrequirements Read this for a laugh. | Dec 19 15:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 400 @ https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Lodging-your-tax-return/In-detail/e-tax-help/#Computerrequirements ) | Dec 19 15:48 | |
| oiaohm | Yes latest version of OS X is support but the lastest version of Windows you are pot luck. | Dec 19 15:48 |
| XFaCE | lol | Dec 19 15:48 |
| MinceR | the other solution is called "OpenVPN" | Dec 19 15:49 |
| XFaCE | and works well :) | Dec 19 15:49 |
| cubexyz | no, not another BSOD.... | Dec 19 15:49 |
| cubexyz | as humourous as it is... enough is enough | Dec 19 15:49 |
| XFaCE | cubexyz: imagine having to cap your network transfer speeds | Dec 19 15:49 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: and XFaCE I have some horible facts. Cisco system vpn was choosen over openvpn because some stupid idiot pushed the fact that closed source was more secure than open source. | Dec 19 15:49 |
| XFaCE | ah, the ole fallacy | Dec 19 15:50 |
| MinceR | lol | Dec 19 15:50 |
| MinceR | especially funny in fiasco's case | Dec 19 15:50 |
| MinceR | whose idea of "security" is "sue the messenger" | Dec 19 15:50 |
| XFaCE | the Cisco VPN client uses QT, an open-source toolkit | Dec 19 15:50 |
| XFaCE | try asking that stupid idiot how they reconcile that | Dec 19 15:50 |
| MinceR | they also bought jabber, only to shit all over it | Dec 19 15:51 |
| XFaCE | *bought* jabber? | Dec 19 15:51 |
| XFaCE | how do you buy an open protocol? | Dec 19 15:51 |
| MinceR | yup | Dec 19 15:51 |
| MinceR | there was a jabber company | Dec 19 15:51 |
| XFaCE | ah | Dec 19 15:51 |
| MinceR | the protocol is pretty much called xmpp now | Dec 19 15:51 |
| XFaCE | another Fireware vs 1394 | Dec 19 15:51 |
| XFaCE | or JavaScript vs ECMAScript | Dec 19 15:51 |
| MinceR | well, it's not like fiasco is interested in staying compatible with xmpp anyway | Dec 19 15:52 |
| MinceR | they pretty much force you to use one of their broken, nearly unusable clients | Dec 19 15:52 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: the only good things off hand about Cisco are the Linksys routers | Dec 19 15:52 |
| XFaCE | AFTER putting 3rd party firmware on ofc | Dec 19 15:53 |
| MinceR | i avoid those | Dec 19 15:53 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: tomato linksys routers are still good | Dec 19 15:53 |
| MinceR | since fiasco decided the GPL does not apply to thm | Dec 19 15:53 |
| MinceR | s/hm/hem/ | Dec 19 15:53 |
| oiaohm | woo hoo. http://lets-talk.ato.gov.au/swdcommunity?category=ELS2SBR&tool=news_feed they plan to get off the cisco system broken vpn by june 2016 | Dec 19 15:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lets-talk.ato.gov.au | ATO Let's Talk | Software developers community [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7b ] | Dec 19 15:53 | |
| MinceR | and i'll probably have to build my own routers anyway, thanks to the FCC and the NSA | Dec 19 15:53 |
| XFaCE | heh | Dec 19 15:53 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: I've seen someting very scary - a lot of people's asus router config pages showing up on google O_o | Dec 19 15:54 |
| cubexyz | I'll help... | Dec 19 15:54 |
| MinceR | :> | Dec 19 15:54 |
| cubexyz | http://kicad-pcb.org | Dec 19 15:54 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: I mean, wow | Dec 19 15:54 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-kicad-pcb.org | KiCad EDA | Dec 19 15:54 | |
| XFaCE | MinceR: building your own router | Dec 19 15:55 |
| XFaCE | hmm | Dec 19 15:55 |
| XFaCE | pfSense | Dec 19 15:55 |
| XFaCE | + Beaglebone Black | Dec 19 15:55 |
| XFaCE | + Switch | Dec 19 15:55 |
| MinceR | yeah, i guess | Dec 19 15:55 |
| MinceR | i was thinking along the lines of a rpi2, but having a case is not important in this case | Dec 19 15:56 |
| MinceR | also, + usb wifi dongle | Dec 19 15:56 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: fuck the rpi2 | Dec 19 15:57 |
| MinceR | no thanks | Dec 19 15:57 |
| XFaCE | beaglebone black B-) | Dec 19 15:57 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: http://beagleboard.org/black | Dec 19 15:57 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-beagleboard.org | BeagleBoard.org - black | Dec 19 15:57 | |
| XRevan86 | > there was a jabber company | Dec 19 15:58 |
| XRevan86 | huh | Dec 19 15:58 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: bbb has a 1ghz processor, rpi2 has 900 mhz | Dec 19 15:58 |
| XFaCE | less ram, but meh | Dec 19 15:58 |
| MinceR | how many cores does the bbb have? | Dec 19 15:58 |
| XFaCE | 1 | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | dammit | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | you win again MinceR | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | :P | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | pft | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 19 15:59 |
| oiaohm | I did not finsh that off. | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: but | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | BUT | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | BUTT | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: the BBB doesn't have proprietary crap | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | that's good | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | and it's painted black | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | B-) | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | a big point for the BBB | Dec 19 15:59 |
| oiaohm | The repalcement to the broken Cisco vpn stuff is SBR. Horiblem part is all sample code for it is C# | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: What did Jabber company before being bought? | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: internal storage too | Dec 19 16:00 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: afaik they developed xmpp | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XRevan86 | * Jabber company did | Dec 19 16:00 |
| MinceR | though wikipedia only mentions one product | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: the BBB has a microSD built-in | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XFaCE | plus the slot | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XRevan86 | > The Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) formed an XMPP working group in 2002 to formalise the core protocols as an IETF instant messaging and presence technology | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XRevan86 | > 2002 | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XFaCE | and a serial connection port | Dec 19 16:00 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: bbb is not as great against the latest pi boards. | Dec 19 16:01 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20001203131700/http://www.jabber.com/ | Dec 19 16:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber.com, Inc. [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7k ] | Dec 19 16:01 | |
| XFaCE | true oiaohm , but it does still have the open hardware/internal storage advantages | Dec 19 16:01 |
| XFaCE | back in the rpi1 days, it easily bested it | Dec 19 16:02 |
| XFaCE | when the Beaglebone whatever comes out to replace the black, that'll be cool | Dec 19 16:02 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20081104100727/http://www.jabber.com/ | Dec 19 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Empty reply from server ( status 0 @ https://web.archive.org/web/20081104100727/http://www.jabber.com/ ) | Dec 19 16:03 | |
| XFaCE | meanwhile https://boards.openpandora.org/pyramain/main/ | Dec 19 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-boards.openpandora.org | DragonBox Pyra - the OpenSource Linux handheld - Pyra Handheld Boards [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7o ] | Dec 19 16:03 | |
| XFaCE | this looks damned awesome :D | Dec 19 16:04 |
| MinceR | can the BBB boot off the removable card? | Dec 19 16:04 |
| XFaCE | yes | Dec 19 16:04 |
| cubexyz | ok, can the BBB boot into a different OS? :) | Dec 19 16:05 |
| XFaCE | you can make so it boots off internal storage when no card is plugged in | Dec 19 16:05 |
| XFaCE | cubexyz: BSD? linux distros? :) | Dec 19 16:05 |
| XFaCE | not windows 10 tho XD | Dec 19 16:05 |
| cubexyz | XFaCE, sure | Dec 19 16:05 |
| cubexyz | yeah we'll skip that one | Dec 19 16:05 |
| XFaCE | yes | Dec 19 16:07 |
| XFaCE | is the answer to your question | Dec 19 16:07 |
| oiaohm | Only 1 thing wrong with the pandara https://boards.openpandora.org/pyramain/pyraspecs.html/ | Dec 19 16:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-boards.openpandora.org | DragonBox Pyra - Specifications - Pyra Handheld Boards [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7z ] | Dec 19 16:08 | |
| oiaohm | Boot media sdxc | Dec 19 16:08 |
| MinceR | does it mandate exfat? | Dec 19 16:09 |
| MinceR | as in, can it boot off saner fs-es | Dec 19 16:09 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: to be sdxc standard conforming yes. | Dec 19 16:09 |
| MinceR | that's why i clarified :> | Dec 19 16:09 |
| oiaohm | So sdxc cards don't have support any other format than exfat | Dec 19 16:09 |
| MinceR | question is, does the pyra support other fs-es | Dec 19 16:10 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: https://web.archive.org/web/20010124085700/http://www.jabber.com/about/index.shtml I see | Dec 19 16:13 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber.com, Inc. [ http://ur1.ca/ocp8c ] | Dec 19 16:13 | |
| XRevan86 | Jabber.com, Inc. != Jabber | Dec 19 16:13 |
| XRevan86 | not never | Dec 19 16:14 |
| MinceR | apparently they ran jabber.org too | Dec 19 16:14 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20060201231702/http://www.jabber.org/ | Dec 19 16:15 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber: Open Instant Messaging and a Whole Lot More, Powered by XMPP [ http://ur1.ca/ocp8f ] | Dec 19 16:15 | |
| MinceR | >Jabber® is a registered trademark of Jabber, Inc. | Dec 19 16:15 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: SD media gets horiblem. | Dec 19 16:15 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: first generation SD cards techically format genenic. | Dec 19 16:15 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20001109164300/http://www.jabber.org/ | Dec 19 16:15 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber.org [ http://ur1.ca/ocp8h ] | Dec 19 16:15 | |
| MinceR | >Jabber is a registered trademark of Jabber.com, Inc. Used by permission. | Dec 19 16:15 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: huh | Dec 19 16:16 |
| MinceR | so they probably didn't run it, but i'm not sure | Dec 19 16:16 |
| oiaohm | SDHC the second generation cards the standard formatting tool is FAT32 | Dec 19 16:16 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: well yeah, it's painful that sd promotes not only DRM, but also braindead m$ formats | Dec 19 16:16 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: That's ancient history that didn't really impact modern XMPP :). | Dec 19 16:16 |
| MinceR | and patents | Dec 19 16:16 |
| oiaohm | So SDHC to prevent screw up put small fat32 partition at start. | Dec 19 16:16 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: afaik that's where modern xmpp comes from :> | Dec 19 16:16 |
| oiaohm | Rasbery pi images use the small starting fat partition stunt. | Dec 19 16:17 |
| MinceR | to prevent screw up, stop using sd formatting tools, start using generic partitioning and filesystem creation tools | Dec 19 16:17 |
| MinceR | :> | Dec 19 16:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: no | Dec 19 16:17 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: But they hired Jabber original creater *later* :) | Dec 19 16:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the problem is wear leveling implmented in the SDHC cards. | Dec 19 16:17 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: works for me | Dec 19 16:18 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: sometimes the bugger is attempt to read fat to locate sectors it can recycle. | Dec 19 16:18 |
| MinceR | also, wear leveling should work on hw blocks, not filesystems | Dec 19 16:18 |
| MinceR | and TRIM | Dec 19 16:18 |
| oiaohm | SD cards they don't all work on hw blocks. | Dec 19 16:18 |
| MinceR | if they can't do it right, they should look for a career they're qualified for | Dec 19 16:18 |
| oiaohm | Some are reading file system data. | Dec 19 16:18 |
| oiaohm | By SD standard they are perfectly permitted to be rading the filesystem data. | Dec 19 16:19 |
| oiaohm | So bogus partition at start that gives it something to look at keeps the card firmware happy. | Dec 19 16:19 |
| MinceR | cards rarely if ever break for me | Dec 19 16:20 |
| MinceR | except for the shit sandisk peddles | Dec 19 16:20 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: people having strange failures with SD cards they have formated normally trace to this. | Dec 19 16:20 |
| MinceR | but i stay away from sandisk | Dec 19 16:20 |
| oiaohm | sandisk is one of the ones needing a small fat partition. | Dec 19 16:20 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: can you explaim the small fat partition again | Dec 19 16:20 |
| MinceR | sandisk can't even get physical dimensions right | Dec 19 16:21 |
| MinceR | their microsd card reader has a too thin slot, their microsd cards are too thick | Dec 19 16:21 |
| MinceR | even their usb flash drives are unreliable | Dec 19 16:21 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: the firmware wearleveling reads in some SD brands is reading the fat tables in the fat filesystem to find sectors that have been deleted so it can recycle them. | Dec 19 16:22 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: fat data area filled with random crap the wearleveling starts recycling random sectors so it a question to how long that is something important. | Dec 19 16:23 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: be wared some USB Flash is Fat and NTFS only as well. So requiring to level partitions in place to keep them happy. | Dec 19 16:24 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, do SSD's laster longer than hard drives? | Dec 19 16:24 |
| cubexyz | s/laster/last/ | Dec 19 16:24 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: hard question. | Dec 19 16:24 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: so on SDXC a small fat/exfat partition may fix some things? | Dec 19 16:26 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: yes its making sure the firmware wearleveling has the data it needs not be a stupid idiot. | Dec 19 16:26 |
| cubexyz | remember the quantum LP52S from 1990! | Dec 19 16:27 |
| cubexyz | and I think you mentioned even older ones | Dec 19 16:27 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: in theory http://betanews.com/2014/12/05/modern-ssds-can-last-a-lifetime/ Please note theory. Theory says a SSD drive should outlast a spinning media harddrive. | Dec 19 16:27 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-betanews.com | Modern SSDs can last a lifetime [ http://ur1.ca/ocp9j ] | Dec 19 16:27 | |
| oiaohm | Problem here its theory. | Dec 19 16:27 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: but the problem is that is hard to determine the size needed for this small partition? | Dec 19 16:28 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: So far we are fairly lucky resize down the default installed partition and its in the right place. | Dec 19 16:28 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: basically big mistake is completely clearing the media. | Dec 19 16:29 |
| MinceR | afaict SSDs are plagued by firmware bugs | Dec 19 16:29 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: resize it what size? | Dec 19 16:29 |
| XFaCE | *it to | Dec 19 16:29 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: what even is the min size without moving its fat tables. | Dec 19 16:30 |
| XFaCE | I have no idea :P | Dec 19 16:30 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: if you don't get it that answer is matched to the size of media. | Dec 19 16:30 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: correct SSD have issues with Firmware bugs. | Dec 19 16:31 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: what's the formula then? | Dec 19 16:31 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: I don't have the formula off the top of head. | Dec 19 16:31 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: Its 2 am in the morning here and I cannot sleep. | Dec 19 16:31 |
| cubexyz | ok, simple question... which SSD should I buy? | Dec 19 16:31 |
| XFaCE | sorry to hear that | Dec 19 16:31 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: No problems I have days where I skip sleep. Its just me. | Dec 19 16:32 |
| XFaCE | ok | Dec 19 16:32 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: so I am not at work where I have data on different things like formating drives. | Dec 19 16:32 |
| cubexyz | I can't go much over 24 hours | Dec 19 16:32 |
| XFaCE | ok | Dec 19 16:32 |
| cubexyz | even 16 hours is a lot :) | Dec 19 16:32 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: is there any risks going from exFat to fat32? | Dec 19 16:33 |
| XFaCE | or is the firmware coded to use exFAT specifically for the wear-leveling? | Dec 19 16:33 |
| MinceR | probably intel | Dec 19 16:33 |
| MinceR | maybe micron, if it's effectively the same as intel | Dec 19 16:33 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: if the sdxc drive only supports exfat and you put fat32 there you have confused the wearleveling. Same with the reverse on a SDHC putting exfat on it instead of fat32 you might send that nuts as well. | Dec 19 16:34 |
| cubexyz | ok, as a customer advocate I'll provide a special windows 10 warning: | Dec 19 16:35 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the longest I can stay awake is 6 days. I normally avoid that because then I sleep for 36 hours. | Dec 19 16:35 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/hey-kid-upgrade-to-windows-10.png | Dec 19 16:35 |
| oiaohm | To my body 48 hours just results in 12 hours of sleep. | Dec 19 16:36 |
| cubexyz | whoa, 6 days | Dec 19 16:36 |
| oiaohm | If I am not behind on sleep is nothing strange for me to only sleep 4 hours. | Dec 19 16:36 |
| oiaohm | So yes 48 hours awake does result in me sleeping longer. | Dec 19 16:37 |
| cubexyz | can I ask how old you are? | Dec 19 16:37 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: so even on fat32 you need a small exfat partition? | Dec 19 16:37 |
| cubexyz | some older folks seem to sleep less | Dec 19 16:37 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I was this way from 10 years old. | Dec 19 16:37 |
| oiaohm | I am in my thirtys now. | Dec 19 16:38 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: you need to use the partitiontype the drive supports. | Dec 19 16:38 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the problem with SSD is recovery. | Dec 19 16:38 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: spinning media moves very few sectors around. | Dec 19 16:39 |
| oiaohm | So a controller dies on spinning media there is a very good chance you can have the controller/motor replaced and get the data back. | Dec 19 16:39 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/sleep-chart.png | Dec 19 16:40 |
| oiaohm | SSD with wearleveling the data order on the media might be in the controller. | Dec 19 16:40 |
| cubexyz | I don't think I slept 11 hours when I was 12 | Dec 19 16:41 |
| cubexyz | maybe 8 hours? | Dec 19 16:41 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: basically SSD has way more complex controller so a controller failure is way more leathal. | Dec 19 16:41 |
| oiaohm | Remember no matter how good the drive they controller may be broken by electrical short circut in the computer. | Dec 19 16:42 |
| cubexyz | wouldn't any controller failure just result in a failure? | Dec 19 16:42 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: most spinning media it possible to have the controller replaced. Yes 500 to 1000 dollars but its replaceable,. | Dec 19 16:43 |
| cubexyz | why don't we have that... hard drives with replacement controllers? | Dec 19 16:43 |
| oiaohm | The reality is we do for spinning media. cubexyz | Dec 19 16:44 |
| oiaohm | The issue is wearleveling. | Dec 19 16:44 |
| cubexyz | it says here that most hard drive failures are caused by motor controller chip burn-out | Dec 19 16:45 |
| oiaohm | spinning media does not wearlevel that much. Has limited smart sector replacement and all smart sector replacement data is written to the drive. | Dec 19 16:45 |
| oiaohm | Yes burnt out moter controller on a harddrive is replacemable. | Dec 19 16:45 |
| oiaohm | Just expensive. | Dec 19 16:45 |
| oiaohm | 1 it costs just as much as a full drive for just the controller. | Dec 19 16:45 |
| oiaohm | 2 you have to pay someone to fit it. | Dec 19 16:46 |
| cubexyz | there's no interchangeability of parts it seems | Dec 19 16:48 |
| oiaohm | Old harddrives you could straight up swap the controller. As data has got more complex you need calibration data cubexyz | Dec 19 16:55 |
| cubexyz | how old? | Dec 19 16:56 |
| oiaohm | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yn2eL4o-6Eo up to 2013 breakdown. Of course stuff has changed since 2013. | Dec 19 16:57 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com | DIY: Repair Hard Drive PCB. How to swap circuit board ROM chip. - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/ocpaj ] | Dec 19 16:57 | |
| cubexyz | would seagate sell me just the controller? | Dec 19 16:58 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the answer is no. To buy controllers without drive is pay into data recovery program with harddrive. | Dec 19 17:01 |
| oiaohm | maker | Dec 19 17:02 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: also being in data recovery you can get calibration controllers. | Dec 19 17:03 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: calibration controllers for spinning media in lots of cases allows you to regenerate the rom data. | Dec 19 17:04 |
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| cubexyz | ok.. schestowitz | Dec 19 18:19 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/windows-10-botch-up.txt | Dec 19 18:19 |
| cubexyz | he gave me permission to relate his windows 10 experiences | Dec 19 18:19 |
| cubexyz | he won't budge off windows: | Dec 19 18:20 |
| cubexyz | he wants to run: Steam games, Corel Draw X7, Photoshop CS5 , Carrara 3D, Sonar 7, Sibelius 5 | Dec 19 18:20 |
| cubexyz | so that is that | Dec 19 18:21 |
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| XFaCE | <cubexyz> he wants to run: Steam games, Corel Draw X7, Photoshop CS5 , Carrara 3D, Sonar 7, Sibelius 5 | Dec 19 18:43 |
| XFaCE | 1/6 :P | Dec 19 18:43 |
| cubexyz | I'm sure there are open source equivalents to most if not all of those | Dec 19 18:44 |
| cubexyz | musescore for sibelius maybe | Dec 19 18:44 |
| cubexyz | I'm just amazed he isn't more willing to try alternatives to windows | Dec 19 18:44 |
| cubexyz | at least try the chromebook :-P | Dec 19 18:45 |
| schestowitz | cubexyz: thanks | Dec 19 18:46 |
| cubexyz | anytime :) | Dec 19 18:47 |
| cubexyz | those are his exact words | Dec 19 18:48 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678285239391776769 | Dec 19 18:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @FOSSpatents @schestowitz @Laura_F_ERCOLI @WorldIPReview https://t.co/KUERevktI3 | Dec 19 18:49 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@SciencePorn: Respect. https://t.co/tMqi4gcqid | Dec 19 18:49 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678284567594319872 | Dec 19 18:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz Maybe but no need: #epo messed up minds of employees for decades. Rotten chunks might boil up to surface in present turmoil. | Dec 19 18:49 | |
| cubexyz | ok, if I was to run windows I would do it under VMware | Dec 19 19:26 |
| cubexyz | now I'm not doing to do that... but if I _did_ that's the way I would do it | Dec 19 19:27 |
| cubexyz | no way would I trust windows as the main OS | Dec 19 19:27 |
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| schestowitz | French letter we translated into English | Dec 19 22:26 |
| schestowitz | http://techrights.org/2015/12/03/attacks-on-staff-representatives/ | Dec 19 22:26 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | French Member of Parliament Reacts to EPO Management Amidst Ongoing Attacks on Staff Representatives and Facts-free Information War | Techrights [ http://ur1.ca/ocpqa ] | Dec 19 22:26 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/theGuruWithin/status/678326341997977600 https://twitter.com/IntelTpNews/status/678328423257792512 | Dec 19 22:29 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@theGuruWithin: #coderhouse .@OpenELEC .@schestowitz How2make URL autoplay this isn't working .@OBSProject CLR Big ty fr .@nn99org https://t.co/qT5HBYqUnE | Dec 19 22:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> abcnews.go.com | ABC News Video | Dec 19 22:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@IntelTpNews: Answers to Frequently Asked Questions about libreboot https://t.co/MW6aLH7ByD via @schestowitz | Dec 19 22:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> gettopical.com | Answers to Frequently Asked Questions about libreboot | Dec 19 22:29 | |
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| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6920376 | Dec 19 22:59 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: The latest of #kde still sluggish for many https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=289&t=130131 stay with #kde4 for now (if possible) | Dec 19 22:59 | |
| schestowitz | "wow never noticed that delay. But yeah one can reproduce it. Though it isn’t that nasty. I did not notice it until I read that." | Dec 19 22:59 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> forum.kde.org | Lag on first opening of plasma 5 elements like calendar, etc • KDE Community Forums [ http://ur1.ca/ocps1 ] | Dec 19 22:59 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678284567594319872?cn=cmVwbHk%3D&refsrc=email | Dec 19 23:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz Maybe but no need: #epo messed up minds of employees for decades. Rotten chunks might boil up to surface in present turmoil. | Dec 19 23:03 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/BrideOfLinux/status/678358306826690560 | Dec 19 23:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@BrideOfLinux: Scratching the surface of what's wrong with Jolla... https://t.co/GnAnNFs7I6 | Dec 19 23:41 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: What is wrong with Jolla? https://t.co/ochSOsP6w1 the UI and the apps are all proprietary for one thing. #jolla #linux | Dec 19 23:41 | |
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| *Now talking on #techrights | Dec 13 09:03 | |
| *Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org | Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell | Dec 13 09:03 | |
| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 13 09:03 | |
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| Freeexaminer | First of all I want to commend you for the courage to keep this blog. Few people are brave enough to oppose authority and regardless of the outcome one should take a stand whenever private or collective rights are abused by the ones in power. | Dec 13 10:25 |
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| Freeexaminer | Batistelli has hijacked the office and turned the management into a mafia organization where the "capo" is surrounded by sycophants. | Dec 13 10:27 |
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| Freeexaminer | The atmosphere is unbearable and the main topic of discussion everywhere is the abuse of the system by the president. | Dec 13 10:27 |
| Freeexaminer | I would like to send you a letter signed by French director Yann Chabod, a member of the Batistelli inner circle, as a response to a demand by a lady suffering from breast cancer. The inhumanity of the response is unbelievable. | Dec 13 10:30 |
| Freeexaminer | How could I upload it? | Dec 13 10:31 |
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| r_schestowitz | some sites still spread this BS: http://www.pe.com/articles/view-788607-phone-washington.html | Dec 13 11:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pe.com | SAN BERNARDINO SHOOTING: Terror investigators can’t view NSA phone records - Press Enterprise | Dec 13 11:23 | |
| r_schestowitz | Oh, I missed Freeexaminer? | Dec 13 11:24 |
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| r_schestowitz | http://time.com/4142893/angela-merkel-kate-mckinnon-snl/ | Dec 13 11:56 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-time.com | Best of Kate McKinnon's Angela Merkel Impression: SNL Clips | Dec 13 11:56 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/scruffy_crunch/status/676012021779849216 | Dec 13 12:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@scruffy_crunch: @schestowitz @All4Privacy It didn't end. It just got outsourced. | Dec 13 12:16 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/scruffy_crunch/status/676012591437623296 | Dec 13 12:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@scruffy_crunch: @schestowitz @All4Privacy Yes, they are. | Dec 13 12:18 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Martinned81/status/676013449034473472 | Dec 13 12:21 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Martinned81: That must be one of those Zen koans. https://t.co/mZ50LnMJXT | Dec 13 12:21 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: There is no #internet #censorship in #China , says China’s top censor https://t.co/GU88sbfWGH a #clapper moment https://t.co/JS39v3HgwK | Dec 13 12:21 | |
| MinceR | http://motherboard.vice.com/read/congresswoman-asks-feds-why-they-pressured-a-library-to-disable-its-tor-node | Dec 13 12:38 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-motherboard.vice.com | Congresswoman Asks Feds Why They Pressured a Library to Disable Its Tor Node | Motherboard | Dec 13 12:38 | |
| cubexyz | what was the answer? | Dec 13 12:44 |
| cubexyz | ok, there wasn't one | Dec 13 12:47 |
| cubexyz | and they restored it | Dec 13 12:47 |
| MinceR | they did better | Dec 13 12:47 |
| MinceR | they turned their relay into an exit node | Dec 13 12:47 |
| cubexyz | ok, I don't know what that means | Dec 13 12:49 |
| MinceR | it means that now it can not only be used as a middle point in tor connections, but also as the point from the tcp connection is opened to the final (non-Tor) destination | Dec 13 12:52 |
| MinceR | exit nodes are riskier in a regulatory sense and more scarce | Dec 13 12:52 |
| cubexyz | New Hampshire... they like their freedom so not too surprising | Dec 13 12:56 |
| cubexyz | not a very big city, only 13K pop | Dec 13 12:57 |
| cubexyz | imagine the government bullying some small town library | Dec 13 12:58 |
| cubexyz | I wonder if any libraries run Linux | Dec 13 12:59 |
| r_schestowitz | some do | Dec 13 13:06 |
| r_schestowitz | in Europe at least | Dec 13 13:06 |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/scruffy_crunch/status/676026772912078848 | Dec 13 13:12 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@scruffy_crunch: @schestowitz @All4Privacy "[DHS] investigations warning that the network can be used by criminals" So can streets, telephones and deodorant | Dec 13 13:12 | |
| cubexyz | my local library has been microsoftized | Dec 13 13:16 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Now you can read BSOD's while reading books :). | Dec 13 13:17 |
| cubexyz | :-/ | Dec 13 13:17 |
| cubexyz | what if you have one of those multi screen displays | Dec 13 13:19 |
| cubexyz | does the BSOD appear on all the screens? | Dec 13 13:19 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/triple-bsod.jpg | Dec 13 13:20 |
| cubexyz | that looks like 3 different computers | Dec 13 13:21 |
| cubexyz | I bet a large part of those BSODs is the computer overheating | Dec 13 13:25 |
| cubexyz | one of my machines has been running X for over a year | Dec 13 13:27 |
| cubexyz | root 3849 3848 0 2014 ? 1-00:17:25 /usr/X11R6/bin/X :0 -audit 0 -auth /var/gdm/:0.Xauth vt | Dec 13 13:27 |
| cubexyz | on the other hand I hear "windows BSODs about once a week" from customers | Dec 13 13:28 |
| cubexyz | clearly the BSODs haven't stopped | Dec 13 13:29 |
| cubexyz | or "Visual Studio BSODs my computer" | Dec 13 13:29 |
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| r_schestowitz | https://phab.enlightenment.org/phame/live/3/post/e20_release/ | Dec 13 14:56 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://phab.enlightenment.org/phame/live/3/post/e20_release/ ) | Dec 13 14:56 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2010-August/019310.html | Dec 13 15:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-current/2010-August/019310.html ) | Dec 13 15:01 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/Metztli_IT/status/676056468521553920 | Dec 13 15:12 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Metztli_IT: .@schestowitz but was disappointed that(some?)#GNU maintainers place subjective evaluation criteria above tech merit https://t.co/JM9c40jM8z | Dec 13 15:12 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/mall_dweller/status/676057101177888768 | Dec 13 15:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mall_dweller: @schestowitz Facists; perfectly fitting description. | Dec 13 15:18 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/unorigmoniker/status/676057993813893120 | Dec 13 15:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@unorigmoniker: @schestowitz I've seen you post this before. Do you have any proof to back up your assertions DDG has privacy issues? Curious. @all4privacy | Dec 13 15:18 | |
| r_schestowitz | http://50.80.140.55/photo_album/chron/desktop/opinion/2013_06_21-avoid_duck_duck_go/ | Dec 13 15:19 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-50.80.140.55 | Duck Duck No No [ http://ur1.ca/jbxqn ] | Dec 13 15:19 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/3vxq61/so_i_was_watching_the_linux_movie_the_code_with/ | Dec 13 15:23 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Couldn't resolve host 'www.reddit.com' ( status 0 @ https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/3vxq61/so_i_was_watching_the_linux_movie_the_code_with/ ) | Dec 13 15:23 | |
| r_schestowitz | "And my dad says, "Oh I know that guy." Referring to Eric S. Raymond! He said Eric started talking to him at our train station and he thought he was kind of weird." | Dec 13 15:23 |
| r_schestowitz | LOL | Dec 13 15:23 |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/unorigmoniker/status/676059905246240769 | Dec 13 15:25 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@unorigmoniker: Hi @Yegg, I would be curious to hear your response to this: https://t.co/hWs67gSx12 @all4privacy | Dec 13 15:25 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @unorigmoniker @All4Privacy http://50.80.140.55/photo_album/chron/desktop/opinion/2013_06_21-avoid_duck_duck_go/ | Dec 13 15:25 | |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/unorigmoniker/status/676060253016993792 | Dec 13 15:27 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@unorigmoniker: @schestowitz Thank you. I do note that the post & info is over 2 years old. But interesting claims none-the-less. @all4privacy | Dec 13 15:27 | |
| r_schestowitz | I have written dozens of things about it since... | Dec 13 15:27 |
| r_schestowitz | Even senior from within DDG admitted there was no longer truth to the privacy vow (and left) | Dec 13 15:28 |
| r_schestowitz | https://twitter.com/paulhindes/status/676064493231845376 | Dec 13 15:44 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@paulhindes: @schestowitz Makes Skynet seem quaint. The surveillance state will zero in on those not talking to their things all the time. | Dec 13 15:44 | |
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| msb_ | cubexyz: Regarding Linux usage in libraries, I read years ago that in some US libraries, the computers provided for free use by the public ran Linux. Most users didn't realize that there was any difference from the previous winblows OS. Of course administration was much easier -- no crashing. | Dec 13 16:19 |
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| cubexyz | msb_, any references would be interesting to see | Dec 13 16:52 |
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| cubexyz | there was a program called "Linux in libraries" a few years ago | Dec 13 16:55 |
| msb_ | google-advanced for linux computers in libraries gets 30M hits. Lots of relevant ones. | Dec 13 16:58 |
| cubexyz | Groovix :) | Dec 13 17:00 |
| cubexyz | http://www.groovix.com | Dec 13 17:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.groovix.com | | Dec 13 17:01 | |
| cubexyz | of course if one of the librarians was a linux guru they could probably use any distro | Dec 13 17:03 |
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| *Now talking on #techrights | Dec 13 19:18 | |
| *Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org | Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell | Dec 13 19:18 | |
| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 13 19:18 | |
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| r_schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6910224 | Dec 13 19:30 |
| r_schestowitz | "heh, “bottom up” development is an interesting way or putting things." | Dec 13 19:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Why #WilliamHill is betting on #freesw rather than traditional IT vendors for digital transformation http://www.computerworlduk.com/applications/why-william-hill-is-swapping-major-it-vendors-for-open-source-platforms-3631637/ | Dec 13 19:30 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.computerworlduk.com | William Hill betting on open source for digital transformation | Applications | Computerworld UK [ http://ur1.ca/occrz ] | Dec 13 19:30 | |
| r_schestowitz | That must be your "kind" of company | Dec 13 19:30 |
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| schestowitz | The patent boosters with a puff piece http://www.ipwatchdog.com/2015/12/13/patents-system-works-record-bruce-kisliuk/id=63803/ | Dec 13 20:14 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.ipwatchdog.com | Patents, a system that works - On the record with Bruce Kisliuk - IPWatchdog.com | Patents & Patent Law [ http://ur1.ca/occtz ] | Dec 13 20:14 | |
| schestowitz | "Maybe we haven't had that yet in the way that it could happen because sure, those of us in the industry I think know that things are not good, that a whole lot less is patent eligible and that we are really running the risk of saying that software and " | Dec 13 20:14 |
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| **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Dec 16 12:13:32 2015 | ||
| *Now talking on #techrights | Dec 16 12:13 | |
| *Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org | Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell | Dec 16 12:13 | |
| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 16 12:13 | |
| schestowitz | lol, classy | Dec 16 12:13 |
| schestowitz | there's also the china ones | Dec 16 12:13 |
| schestowitz | showing sheer hypocrisy | Dec 16 12:13 |
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| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 16 18:18 | |
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| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 16 22:44 | |
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| schestowitz | lots of EPO articles today | Dec 16 22:58 |
| schestowitz | I keep trying to find the time to write the cancer story, but new docs keep being piled on me from different sources. Maybe it'll all be out and dealt with by year's end. | Dec 16 22:58 |
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| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 17 12:25 | |
| cubexyz | what's ridiculous as UEFI? | Dec 17 13:17 |
| schestowitz | grub bug | Dec 17 13:24 |
| cubexyz | shows the importance of encryption | Dec 17 13:26 |
| schestowitz | if it works | Dec 17 13:26 |
| cubexyz | also if someone has physical access... :) | Dec 17 13:27 |
| cubexyz | sure, but one wouldn't just password grub | Dec 17 13:27 |
| cubexyz | there would be more layers of security if you were _really_ worried | Dec 17 13:27 |
| cubexyz | and your decrypted files would need to be shredded, not deleted | Dec 17 13:28 |
| cubexyz | password protected usb ports might be an idea as well | Dec 17 13:30 |
| schestowitz | y just usb? | Dec 17 13:49 |
| cubexyz | I was thinking along the lines of "if the computer reboots then don't boot from usb without a password" kind of thing | Dec 17 13:54 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, is there a bios that does that? | Dec 17 13:57 |
| *XRevan86 (~XRevan86@meowr.ru) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 13:58 | |
| cubexyz | now that I think about it, I don't think chromebooks can boot from usb | Dec 17 13:58 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: You think about ARM or x86 Chromebooks? | Dec 17 14:01 |
| cubexyz | well mine is x86 | Dec 17 14:02 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: What's the drill on vanilla coreboot installation on Chromebooks? | Dec 17 14:02 |
| cubexyz | you have to use deveoper mode | Dec 17 14:03 |
| XRevan86 | This doesn't say much to me… | Dec 17 14:03 |
| cubexyz | I blogged a bit about it: | Dec 17 14:03 |
| *abeNd-org (~kklenke@38.104.35.66) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 14:03 | |
| cubexyz | http://cubexyz.blogspot.ca/search?q=coreboot | Dec 17 14:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-cubexyz.blogspot.ca | Notes on Linux | Dec 17 14:04 | |
| cubexyz | also the folks in #coreboot are pretty helpful | Dec 17 14:04 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: So, you can use coreboot with tianocore (UEFI) or seabios (MBR) on Chromebooks if you have straight hands and enough time, right? | Dec 17 14:06 |
| XRevan86 | and thus to boot from USB | Dec 17 14:06 |
| cubexyz | pretty sure 2nd generation chromebook does not use UEFI | Dec 17 14:08 |
| cubexyz | it uses a combination of coreboot + U-Boot | Dec 17 14:09 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: coreboot piano | Dec 17 14:10 |
| cubexyz | I think ARM chromebook just uses U-boot on it's own | Dec 17 14:10 |
| XRevan86 | http://coreboot.org/Payloads#Tiano_Core | Dec 17 14:11 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.coreboot.org | Payloads - coreboot | Dec 17 14:11 | |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: The idea is to use TianoCore or SeaBIOS as a coreboot "payload". | Dec 17 14:11 |
| cubexyz | right, but was is the default off the shelf for chromebooks? | Dec 17 14:12 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: I'm pretty sure it's not. | Dec 17 14:12 |
| XRevan86 | But if third-party coreboot can be used on Chromebooks (whatever "Developer mode" is :)) then so is TianoCore/SeaBIOS. | Dec 17 14:13 |
| XRevan86 | although I suspect in reality it's probably harder than I think | Dec 17 14:13 |
| cubexyz | I think google should make chromebook-linux edition | Dec 17 14:14 |
| cubexyz | just grab the linux one, done | Dec 17 14:14 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Linux is pretty easy to load through U-Boot (naturally, as that's what U-Boot does) | Dec 17 14:15 |
| XRevan86 | but it would still be a one-OS laptop | Dec 17 14:15 |
| cubexyz | no AROS, FreeDOS, Plan 9 etc? | Dec 17 14:15 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Yes | Dec 17 14:15 |
| XRevan86 | chromebook-linux edition won't be a true solution then | Dec 17 14:16 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/mrjeremylcoope1/status/677490981239922688 | Dec 17 14:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mrjeremylcoope1: RT @schestowitz: How to make your Android awesome again https://t.co/QNjPwcGyIi #android #linux | Dec 17 14:16 | |
| cubexyz | we want chromebook-general purpose edition :) | Dec 17 14:16 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.androidpit.com | How to make your Android awesome again - AndroidPIT | Dec 17 14:16 | |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: I think better to say, general laptops with freakin' coreboot :). | Dec 17 14:16 |
| cubexyz | XRevan86, indeed | Dec 17 14:16 |
| cubexyz | that's what I want really | Dec 17 14:17 |
| cubexyz | also there's crouton, which I haven't tried yet | Dec 17 14:18 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: What I would do with a x86 Chromebooks is I'd kill ChromeOS completely and try to get coreboot with tianocore to work :) | Dec 17 14:20 |
| XRevan86 | and install $FAVOURITE_DISTRO | Dec 17 14:20 |
| XRevan86 | and probably replace drive with something bigger as chromebooks known to have as little space as possible | Dec 17 14:20 |
| cubexyz | I | Dec 17 14:21 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: some uefi systems cannot boot from USB until after they have access the EFI partition of the first harddrive for the same reason they cannot use usb keyboards and mice until them. No USB driver in flash firmware. | Dec 17 14:21 |
| cubexyz | I'm used to working in small spaces | Dec 17 14:21 |
| cubexyz | know how big a RK05 is? :) | Dec 17 14:21 |
| cubexyz | it's 2.5 megs | Dec 17 14:21 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: I have my pride :). | Dec 17 14:21 |
| cubexyz | you can have 8 drives though | Dec 17 14:22 |
| XRevan86 | "you dare to tell me how many Xonotic's I can install on my PC's!?" | Dec 17 14:22 |
| cubexyz | so 2.5 meg * 8 = 20 megs, that's pretty big for a 1974 OS :) | Dec 17 14:22 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: Not a Chromebook case, right? :) | Dec 17 14:23 |
| XRevan86 | one can install emacs on it and be happy though | Dec 17 14:23 |
| cubexyz | vim :) | Dec 17 14:23 |
| XRevan86 | cubexyz: vim is just a text editor. | Dec 17 14:23 |
| XRevan86 | emacs is the universe | Dec 17 14:23 |
| cubexyz | I can't install emacs on Unix v5 | Dec 17 14:24 |
| cubexyz | em maybe | Dec 17 14:24 |
| XRevan86 | Just like Leechcraft | Dec 17 14:24 |
| cubexyz | actually I can't install vim or even vi either | Dec 17 14:24 |
| cubexyz | it's ed all the way | Dec 17 14:24 |
| cubexyz | in the old days we had multi-operating systems for PDP-11 | Dec 17 14:25 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: http://www.coreboot.org/GRUB2#Security GRUB2 in coreboot can be ass as it can be set only to load signed kernel adn will not load Windows. | Dec 17 14:25 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.coreboot.org | GRUB2 - coreboot | Dec 17 14:25 | |
| cubexyz | XRevan86, on PDP-11 I think there was _more_ choices for OS than now :) | Dec 17 14:26 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, we can roll our own | Dec 17 14:27 |
| cubexyz | I've had several years of working with Unix v5 now | Dec 17 14:29 |
| oiaohm | The issue these days is the stuplity written 256 bit signing keys into fluses in intel chipsets. | Dec 17 14:29 |
| oiaohm | That is small enough first quantuim chip it going to be able to reverse it. | Dec 17 14:29 |
| cubexyz | interesting thing about the transition to v6... ed was re-written in C language | Dec 17 14:30 |
| cubexyz | now the question is... would the v6 ed compile on v5 | Dec 17 14:32 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, you know, I don't even want signing keys | Dec 17 14:33 |
| cubexyz | I just want something I can experiment with | Dec 17 14:33 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: from the securtiy attacks that have been documented I do want signing keys but I want them like chromebooks devices in a flash chip with a physical write protect switch so I can set my own. Not set in fuses. | Dec 17 14:34 |
| cubexyz | I want to run AROS, Plan 9 and oddball stuff sometimes | Dec 17 14:34 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: If you can physically set your own your can still experment with the hardware. | Dec 17 14:35 |
| oiaohm | And lock anyone else out from doing the same behind your back. | Dec 17 14:35 |
| MinceR | 145823 < cubexyz> now that I think about it, I don't think chromebooks can boot from usb | Dec 17 14:38 |
| MinceR | i'm pretty sure at least one can | Dec 17 14:39 |
| MinceR | though probably only in developer mode | Dec 17 14:39 |
| cubexyz | wow, it compiled | Dec 17 14:40 |
| cubexyz | only 2k bigger than assembled ed :) | Dec 17 14:41 |
| MinceR | why bother with tianocore on a chromebook at all? | Dec 17 14:41 |
| MinceR | i'm pretty sure you can load anything sane without it | Dec 17 14:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: all chromebooks can be made boot from USB depend on model how many miles of hell you have to go through. http://www.pcworld.com/article/2873561/google-just-made-it-easier-to-run-linux-on-your-chromebook.html newer chromebooks it developer mode. | Dec 17 14:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.pcworld.com | Google just made it easier to run Linux on your Chromebook | PCWorld [ http://ur1.ca/jix82 ] | Dec 17 14:41 | |
| cubexyz | MinceR, I was thinking the same thing | Dec 17 14:41 |
| MinceR | you don't want to put winblows on it, do you? :> | Dec 17 14:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: older chromebooks it is find the physicalal firmware protection switch and replace the firmware. | Dec 17 14:42 |
| MinceR | i think it was the asus flip i read instructions on how to boot from sd or usb on | Dec 17 14:42 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: It's just that booting from USB from plain GRUB for instance is… complicated. | Dec 17 14:43 |
| MinceR | http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv7/rockchip/asus-chromebook-flip-c100p | Dec 17 14:43 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-archlinuxarm.org | Asus Chromebook Flip C100P | Arch Linux ARM [ http://ur1.ca/ocl62 ] | Dec 17 14:43 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: those commands for the flip is chromebook standard for 2015 versions. crossystem dev_boot_usb=1 dev_boot_signed_only=0 Yep turn boot signing checking off. Leave internal bios signing checking on. | Dec 17 14:46 |
| MinceR | https://twitter.com/AdamBaldwin/status/677252678162878464/photo/1 | Dec 17 14:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AdamBaldwin: Anatomy of a Twitter lockout/reinstatement: https://t.co/NjWOtapiE8 | Dec 17 14:48 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@AdamBaldwin: Anatomy of a Twitter lockout/reinstatement: https://t.co/NjWOtapiE8 | Dec 17 14:48 | |
| oiaohm | http://www.intelsecurity.com/advanced-threat-research/content/AttackingAndDefendingBIOS-RECon2015.pdf The on going list of EFI faults with security. Please note old BIOS had equally huge list of faults just no one talked about it. | Dec 17 14:49 |
| oiaohm | XRevan86: define plain GRUB instance. GRUB instance in Coreboot can ad extra issues to booting from a USB stick. | Dec 17 14:50 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: oh | Dec 17 14:50 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: Then it's only a problem of my coreboot ignorance :). | Dec 17 14:50 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: the difference is, the overwhelming majority of old BIOS did not use (nonexistent) security as an excuse for locking people out of sane and secure OS-es | Dec 17 14:51 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: also, back then people understood that you can't have IT security without physical security -- if someone has physical access to the computer, they can do anything | Dec 17 14:52 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: what you don't understand is even having physical access does not mean you can do anything. | Dec 17 14:52 |
| MinceR | but since propping up DRM and locking people into winblows requires something more evil and broken than BIOS, suddenly all this security theater arises to provide excuses for that | Dec 17 14:52 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: oh? what prevents me from taking components out, grinding chips down to access their internal state, etc.? | Dec 17 14:53 |
| oiaohm | If intel was to embed all the core in a SOC chip and use lot of rom and a little bit of thermite protection. | Dec 17 14:53 |
| oiaohm | You are screwed. | Dec 17 14:53 |
| oiaohm | Basically you can make silcon chips that you cannot grind into. | Dec 17 14:53 |
| MinceR | they'll never do that | Dec 17 14:53 |
| MinceR | they didn't even care to make TPMs tamper-resistant, only tamper-evident | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | which isn't worth dhit | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | s/dh/sh/ | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | and their _only_ excuse for the TPM was "security" | Dec 17 14:54 |
| oiaohm | For high security devices intel does make self destructing chips. | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | not on any commodity devices, though | Dec 17 14:54 |
| oiaohm | Just they currenty charge a massive extra for them. | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | and uefi is aimed at turning commodity computers into dumb, unusable, insecure appliances | Dec 17 14:54 |
| MinceR | if they won't protect your keys in the TPM, what makes you think they'll protect anything at all? | Dec 17 14:55 |
| oiaohm | You can by tamper-resistant TPM chips. | Dec 17 14:55 |
| oiaohm | But they are 200 dollars a pop. | Dec 17 14:55 |
| MinceR | and yet i'm forced to pay for useless TPM chips instead. | Dec 17 14:56 |
| MinceR | the reason is that security was never the goal | Dec 17 14:56 |
| MinceR | DRM and compromising users' computers was | Dec 17 14:56 |
| oiaohm | TPM chips first started as means to protect server intergerity. DRM over took it latter. | Dec 17 14:57 |
| MinceR | afaik TC started off as giving m$ root on every PC | Dec 17 14:58 |
| MinceR | then it got mellowed into this DRM bullshit with remote attestation | Dec 17 14:58 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, not _my_ PC :) | Dec 17 14:58 |
| MinceR | they haven't given up on root on every pc, though | Dec 17 14:58 |
| oiaohm | TPM first appears as a fpga reference design MinceR | Dec 17 14:58 |
| MinceR | as uefi and vista10 show | Dec 17 14:58 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: first software to operate TPM was Linux. | Dec 17 14:58 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: it was originally called Palladium and TCPA | Dec 17 14:58 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: wrong. | Dec 17 15:01 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: first name is the Fritz-Chip | Dec 17 15:02 |
| MinceR | is that like clipper? :> | Dec 17 15:02 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the first TPM is designed by IBM to secure signing keys in ways that a breached OS. | Dec 17 15:02 |
| oiaohm | So that a breach OS could not have stolen you access keys. | Dec 17 15:03 |
| oiaohm | IBM is the one that designed the first TPM in the from of the Fritz-Chip | Dec 17 15:03 |
| MinceR | when was that? | Dec 17 15:04 |
| oiaohm | Opps wrong first OS is AIX. | Dec 17 15:05 |
| MinceR | http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/tcpa-faq-0.2.html | Dec 17 15:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.cl.cam.ac.uk | TCPA / Palladium FAQ [ http://ur1.ca/ocl72 ] | Dec 17 15:05 | |
| MinceR | 9. Why call the monitor chip a `Fritz' chip? | Dec 17 15:05 |
| MinceR | In honour of Senator Fritz Hollings of South Carolina, who is working tirelessly in Congress to make TCPA a mandatory part of all consumer electronics. | Dec 17 15:05 |
| MinceR | not a shred of benevolence here | Dec 17 15:05 |
| cubexyz | how is he going to do that? | Dec 17 15:06 |
| cubexyz | one guy from the US can't do that | Dec 17 15:06 |
| MinceR | the corporate corruptors behind one guy can, though | Dec 17 15:06 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: 7. Where did the idea come from? in that page. | Dec 17 15:09 |
| MinceR | ic | Dec 17 15:09 |
| MinceR | well, at least that "reference monitor" was responsible to the owner/users, not to corrupt megacorporations | Dec 17 15:10 |
| oiaohm | TPM idea implemented how orginally planned is good for users security and privacy. What mega corporations have wanted todo with it really not good for end user. | Dec 17 15:11 |
| MinceR | except for how m$ originally planned it | Dec 17 15:11 |
| oiaohm | Microsoft did not know about it until after its presentation at the 1997 IEEE Symposium on Security and Privacy | Dec 17 15:12 |
| oiaohm | Microsoft is one of the mega corporations to see the tech and go hey lets abuse that. | Dec 17 15:12 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the road to disaster is paved with good intentions. | Dec 17 15:14 |
| cubexyz | mass exodus from Microsoft to something else... | Dec 17 15:14 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: especially if it's m$ at the helm | Dec 17 15:16 |
| oiaohm | TPM implemented as per the 1997 objective to allow users to protect their data from outside parties is fine. The reason why TPM is open to so many Physical attacks is it was not designed to resist physical attacks. | Dec 17 15:16 |
| MinceR | oh wait, they don't have any of those | Dec 17 15:16 |
| MinceR | they don't have a single intention that's not evil | Dec 17 15:16 |
| cubexyz | "good intentions"? :) | Dec 17 15:16 |
| MinceR | yeah, those | Dec 17 15:16 |
| abeNd-org | MinceR: oh come on now, MS has plenty of incompetent intentions that arent evil | Dec 17 15:17 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: so, basically, you're proposing to protect against physical attacks with something that was not designed to resist them | Dec 17 15:17 |
| MinceR | abeNd-org: i didn't think incompetence was a matter of intention :) | Dec 17 15:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: if a TPM was designed to resist physical attacks it would mandate selfdestruction. | Dec 17 15:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: if someone was attempting physical. | Dec 17 15:18 |
| MinceR | indeed | Dec 17 15:18 |
| oiaohm | Now a proper DRM chip you would expect self destruction. | Dec 17 15:18 |
| oiaohm | Problem here before TPM media companies had been proposing DRM chips and running into fact that no one wantted to make them. | Dec 17 15:19 |
| oiaohm | So media companies + Microsoft has attempt to high jack the TPM to get what they want. | Dec 17 15:19 |
| MinceR | another problem is that m$ and intel didn't want to admit that Treacherous Computing was primarily about DRM | Dec 17 15:20 |
| MinceR | and so we have people going around talking about how TC is so great for security | Dec 17 15:20 |
| oiaohm | To be truthful Intel had not intented TPM for DRM. When they found out the DRM usage idea they end the idea of the TPM chip ever been embeded in the CPU. | Dec 17 15:20 |
| oiaohm | 1997 Intel thought TPM in CPU would be a great idea. By 1998 after seeing Microsoft idea they scrapped that. | Dec 17 15:21 |
| MinceR | it seems to me that just as with uefi, intel was just a puppet of m$, nothing more | Dec 17 15:21 |
| MinceR | what m$ wants, intel does | Dec 17 15:22 |
| MinceR | tpm in cpu without tamper protection would have been just as worthless for security | Dec 17 15:22 |
| oiaohm | If Intel did what MS wants the TPM chip would be in the CPU not independant chips. | Dec 17 15:22 |
| MinceR | plus it would have cost more | Dec 17 15:22 |
| MinceR | which apparently always trumps doing what they otherwise wanted to do | Dec 17 15:22 |
| oiaohm | For protection from remote access attacks tpm without local tamper protection is fine. | Dec 17 15:22 |
| cubexyz | does microsoft really have that much clout? | Dec 17 15:22 |
| MinceR | apparently they do | Dec 17 15:23 |
| cubexyz | Intel is pretty big themselves | Dec 17 15:23 |
| oiaohm | and if you read the 1997 document that is what TPM chip wa meant to do. | Dec 17 15:23 |
| MinceR | they've managed to push uefi through | Dec 17 15:23 |
| MinceR | and pretty much all business-oriented PCs come tied with a TPM | Dec 17 15:23 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: you mean that's what their excuse for it was | Dec 17 15:23 |
| oiaohm | Not excuse. | Dec 17 15:23 |
| MinceR | you need to get used to m$ and their bootlickers lying all the time | Dec 17 15:23 |
| oiaohm | Intel has not been 100 percent playing along with Microsoft. | Dec 17 15:23 |
| oiaohm | Intel has its objectives and Microsoft has its objectives. Where they cross it gets horible. | Dec 17 15:24 |
| MinceR | they played along more than enough to destroy IT | Dec 17 15:25 |
| oiaohm | Like the Microsoft idea to store malware id information in the TPM chip. | Dec 17 15:25 |
| oiaohm | That is not what the TPM was intetend for. | Dec 17 15:25 |
| MinceR | i don't see what's that even useful for | Dec 17 15:25 |
| MinceR | unless the malware is a m$ product | Dec 17 15:25 |
| MinceR | like winblows | Dec 17 15:25 |
| MinceR | or whatever they got when they bought claria/gator | Dec 17 15:25 |
| oiaohm | TPM chip was intended to be a whitelist system not a blacklist one. | Dec 17 15:26 |
| oiaohm | Yet here is windows 10 using it as a blacklist system. | Dec 17 15:26 |
| MinceR | more like somebody claimed the TPM was intended to be a whitelist system | Dec 17 15:26 |
| MinceR | before they managed to cram it down on all our throats | Dec 17 15:27 |
| oiaohm | No the 1997 reference was whitelist. | Dec 17 15:27 |
| oiaohm | Whitelist is more of a prick to get past than blacklist. | Dec 17 15:27 |
| MinceR | remember, m$ and their allies always lie | Dec 17 15:27 |
| oiaohm | The 1997 TPM documents are not written by Microsoft allies but as a research project. | Dec 17 15:27 |
| MinceR | if the public had known where all this TC/UEFI/intel boot guard/vista10/crApp Store bullshit is designed to lead, they would have nipped it in the bud | Dec 17 15:28 |
| cubexyz | is the TPM chip still a factor now, or...? | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | you're still forced to pay infineon for it if you pay any business pc/laptop | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | to reward them for their scheming | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | and iirc uefi uses it more | Dec 17 15:28 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: Windows 10 will start mandating TPM chips. | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | there you go | Dec 17 15:28 |
| MinceR | meanwhile, the usa and the eu goes around pretending they have antitrust and anti-monopoly controls | Dec 17 15:28 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: and due to abusing the living crap out of the TPM chip they will most likely fail early. | Dec 17 15:28 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, I don't think any of my computers has a TPM chip | Dec 17 15:29 |
| MinceR | i know two of mine has one | Dec 17 15:29 |
| MinceR | i did what i could to stop them from being a problem | Dec 17 15:29 |
| MinceR | s/has/have/ | Dec 17 15:30 |
| oiaohm | http://events.linuxfoundation.org/sites/events/files/slides/Integrity_Protection_LinuxCon_Japan_2014_v2.pdf | Dec 17 15:31 |
| oiaohm | TPM chips in Linux integrity protection are implemented 1997 style as a whitelist method. | Dec 17 15:31 |
| MinceR | which is irrelevant | Dec 17 15:31 |
| oiaohm | TPM chip are useful to Linux | Dec 17 15:31 |
| oiaohm | Now of course that TPM chip under owner of machines control. | Dec 17 15:32 |
| MinceR | if the TPM had a benign purpose, it would be tamper-protected, it would be fully optional, and it would not include the Endorsement Key. | Dec 17 15:32 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: and most motherboards TPM is removable. | Dec 17 15:32 |
| MinceR | also, the TPM chip most people end up with is useless | Dec 17 15:33 |
| oiaohm | Yes TPM by design is optional MinceR | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | except it isn't | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | you don't get to pick your laptops without it | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | you don't get to run vista10 without it | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | 163220 < MinceR> if the TPM had a benign purpose, it would be tamper-protected, it would be fully optional, and it would not include the Endorsement Key. | Dec 17 15:33 |
| oiaohm | Microsoft Windows 10 can run without TPM. | Dec 17 15:33 |
| MinceR | and even then it would be problematic for security | Dec 17 15:34 |
| oiaohm | Windows 11 I suspect will not be able to. | Dec 17 15:34 |
| MinceR | since its implementation of cryptographic algorithms is effectively a black box | Dec 17 15:34 |
| MinceR | in hardware | Dec 17 15:34 |
| MinceR | it's foolish to trust such implementations | Dec 17 15:34 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: to be truthful the Endorsement Key in most TPM chips is changable. | Dec 17 15:36 |
| MinceR | so what purpose does it serve then? | Dec 17 15:36 |
| oiaohm | Ok you cannot read the Endorsement Key back out the TPM but you can send a new one in. | Dec 17 15:36 |
| MinceR | other than that you can break DRM that relies on it | Dec 17 15:37 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: TPM for DRM is a house of cards. | Dec 17 15:46 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: http://wiki.xenproject.org/wiki/Virtual_Trusted_Platform_Module_%28vTPM%29 | Dec 17 15:46 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-wiki.xenproject.org | Virtual Trusted Platform Module (vTPM) - Xen [ http://ur1.ca/ocl9o ] | Dec 17 15:46 | |
| MinceR | obviously | Dec 17 15:46 |
| oiaohm | qemu and xen and vmware all can run virtual TPM in software. | Dec 17 15:46 |
| MinceR | m$, intel and crApple are taking IT to a point where DRM might work, though | Dec 17 15:46 |
| oiaohm | So a TPM can be man in middle attacked if end users chooses to. | Dec 17 15:46 |
| MinceR | the death of the general purpose computer | Dec 17 15:46 |
| MinceR | and megacorporate/government controlled web clients for the user/slaves | Dec 17 15:47 |
| oiaohm | Intel was the first developer of a virtual software TPM. | Dec 17 15:47 |
| MinceR | intel was also the main company that gave its name for TC and UEFI. | Dec 17 15:47 |
| MinceR | (even despite the obvious m$ infestation in UEFI: PE, FAT, CAB) | Dec 17 15:47 |
| MinceR | and of course once you don't have root on your "PC" but only m$/us government does, you won't be able to run the VTPM | Dec 17 15:48 |
| oiaohm | Really Microsoft has dragged it feet on UEFI even that it contains all those parts you have listeed. | Dec 17 15:48 |
| MinceR | or QEMU, or Xen | Dec 17 15:48 |
| MinceR | oh, i'm sure they've kept up the charade | Dec 17 15:49 |
| oiaohm | Wrong point of view. | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | and yet they've been requiring it for some time | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | with Restricted Boot | Dec 17 15:49 |
| oiaohm | Intel objective is to move hardware. | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | which just happens to serve m$ interests | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | i'm sure this is all just a coincidence | Dec 17 15:49 |
| oiaohm | Not everything intel does like making TPM removable suites MS goals. | Dec 17 15:49 |
| MinceR | it seems to me that intel is not very competent when it comes to serving their own interests | Dec 17 15:50 |
| oiaohm | Intel and Microsoft being in alignment is nothing more than common interests. | Dec 17 15:50 |
| MinceR | they should have made themselves independent of m$ long ago | Dec 17 15:50 |
| MinceR | they should have diversified | Dec 17 15:50 |
| MinceR | yet here we are, with uefi, tc and intel boot guard | Dec 17 15:50 |
| MinceR | for some reason | Dec 17 15:50 |
| oiaohm | Intel is a lot more deverised. | Dec 17 15:50 |
| oiaohm | intel boot guard is about serving ODM interests not Microsoft ones. | Dec 17 15:51 |
| MinceR | yeah, pretending to obey the ODMs who do what m$ tells them to | Dec 17 15:51 |
| oiaohm | No | Dec 17 15:51 |
| MinceR | on pain of hiking winblows license prices | Dec 17 15:51 |
| oiaohm | ODM that make most motherboards don't buy Microsoft licenses. | Dec 17 15:51 |
| oiaohm | and boot guard was first made for the intel arm line of chips. | Dec 17 15:52 |
| MinceR | and how will their sales go if winblows refuses to run on their mainboards? | Dec 17 15:52 |
| oiaohm | That Microsoft never run on. | Dec 17 15:52 |
| MinceR | on arm chips, where m$ mandates restricted boot to be not disableable? | Dec 17 15:52 |
| MinceR | what a coincidence. | Dec 17 15:52 |
| oiaohm | Intel made arm chips for routers | Dec 17 15:52 |
| oiaohm | That is where boot guard comes form. | Dec 17 15:52 |
| MinceR | and look where it is now | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | 256 bit signing key is old and out of date tech. | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | keeping coreboot out of the market by force | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | Yep | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | intel/m$ never was good at security | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | despite all the marketing lies | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | No you have something wrong. | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | they were good at corrupting and distorting markets though | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | Keeping coreboot out is about ODM not Microsoft. | Dec 17 15:53 |
| oiaohm | And Intel. | Dec 17 15:53 |
| MinceR | i don't see how it would serve ODM interests to not be able to offer a more reliable, less bloated firmware | Dec 17 15:54 |
| MinceR | m$, on the other hand... | Dec 17 15:54 |
| oiaohm | Number 1 intel chips depend on microcode being loaded early to defined what features are usable. | Dec 17 15:54 |
| MinceR | uefi is the nail that keeps you from disinfecting the "PC" of winblows | Dec 17 15:54 |
| oiaohm | So loading the correct microcode into some I5 make them act like i7 | Dec 17 15:54 |
| oiaohm | Of course if people can buy i5 and use them as i7 that not good for intel bottom line right MinceR | Dec 17 15:55 |
| MinceR | yes, once again it's the customer that gets screwed | Dec 17 15:55 |
| oiaohm | You would call that intel Motovation alone right. | Dec 17 15:55 |
| MinceR | people at intel are so incompetent they can't fix this without intel boot guard? | Dec 17 15:56 |
| *jgay (~jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 15:56 | |
| oiaohm | Now ODM making motherboards may make 2 indetical boards 1 for games with overclocking and one for business without and charge 2 different prices. Again difference is load firmware. Of course user being able to load own firmware means they can use what ever one is cheaper. | Dec 17 15:57 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: basically Microsoft is not the only problem here. ODM's and Intel have reasons to screw end users over. | Dec 17 15:58 |
| MinceR | and they're working together to this end | Dec 17 15:59 |
| oiaohm | I would not say working together either. | Dec 17 16:00 |
| oiaohm | You see ODM and Intel do stuff that goes against Microsoft objectives. | Dec 17 16:01 |
| oiaohm | Problem is ODMs, Intel and Microsoft objectives align to a point and most of that is not in the consumers best interest. | Dec 17 16:02 |
| oiaohm | The other one is microcode for intel cpus is why even if a INTEL cpu socket is the same you cannot use newer CPU in a lot of older motherboards. No microcode no cpu start. | Dec 17 16:03 |
| MinceR | they're working together sufficiently to foist uefi, ibg and tc on the users | Dec 17 16:03 |
| MinceR | and of course winblows | Dec 17 16:03 |
| MinceR | with its increasing malware-y/botnetty tendencies | Dec 17 16:03 |
| MinceR | and increasingly closed platform | Dec 17 16:03 |
| oiaohm | Even in UEFI like putting time limit on how long a PK can last. That was an intel idea. Of course for Microsoft objective PK with a never time out value would be ideal. | Dec 17 16:04 |
| *jgay has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) | Dec 17 16:09 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: selling two identical products with minor modifications for two different Prices is not Just a intel thing. Most evil example energizer and eveready. Yes 2 alkaline batteries on shelf from same company different packaging 2 different prices. | Dec 17 16:21 |
| MinceR | that's just a branding difference | Dec 17 16:22 |
| MinceR | doesn't require making the product screw its user | Dec 17 16:22 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: its a little bit more than that. | Dec 17 16:25 |
| *jgay (~jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 16:26 | |
| oiaohm | Energizer one that is the more expensive one has for use in smoke detectors on it even that there is techically no difference to the eveready one. | Dec 17 16:26 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: yes its purely to screw the buyer over. | Dec 17 16:26 |
| MinceR | yet both will provide power for any compatible device | Dec 17 16:27 |
| oiaohm | Yes both will function absolutely identical in any device they are put in. | Dec 17 16:28 |
| MinceR | unlike uefi, which increasingly tries to prevent you from booting any OS other than macos or winblows | Dec 17 16:28 |
| MinceR | and ibg, which prevents you from using coreboot or libreboot | Dec 17 16:29 |
| oiaohm | To be correct UEFI on most motherboard removing the PK and KEKs its really easy to end up unable to boot Windows. | Dec 17 16:29 |
| *jgay has quit (Client Quit) | Dec 17 16:29 | |
| MinceR | or tc, which was intended to force you to prove you're running the exact binaries the other side wants | Dec 17 16:29 |
| MinceR | well, even without uefi, it's easy to end up being unable to boot winblows | Dec 17 16:29 |
| MinceR | as winblows is a fragile piece of shit | Dec 17 16:29 |
| oiaohm | UEFI PK/KEK reset and Microsoft making Windows depend on signed booting is making it even more fragile. | Dec 17 16:30 |
| oiaohm | Intel and ODM added the PK/KEK reset. | Dec 17 16:30 |
| cubexyz | ho ho ho... shrinking christmas treats: | Dec 17 16:30 |
| *jgay (~jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) has joined #techrights | Dec 17 16:31 | |
| cubexyz | http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/nestl-hits-back-claims-quality-7025949 | Dec 17 16:31 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.mirror.co.uk | Nestlé hits back at claims Quality Street Christmas boxes have shrunk over the years - Mirror Online | Dec 17 16:31 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: Intel and ODM are not doing things the way Microsoft would have liked. | Dec 17 16:31 |
| MinceR | and intel, m$ and crApple are not doing things the way any independent IT professional would have liked | Dec 17 16:31 |
| oiaohm | I will give you I don't like everything intel is doing. | Dec 17 16:32 |
| oiaohm | ibg stuff is bad. | Dec 17 16:32 |
| oiaohm | Worse ibg is old obsolote design. Really who thinks in this day and age a 256 bit pgp setup is good enough. | Dec 17 16:33 |
| oiaohm | Like you would have wanted at least 4096 bit pgp with the fact that quatuim processes are not that far off. | Dec 17 16:33 |
| MinceR | they would have done that, if security was the objective | Dec 17 16:35 |
| MinceR | but it isn't | Dec 17 16:35 |
| MinceR | it's the excuse | Dec 17 16:35 |
| MinceR | the objective is to take all power away from the public | Dec 17 16:35 |
| oiaohm | Intel and ODM have cost saving as a factor. | Dec 17 16:40 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: larger PGP processing equals more silcon required for it. | Dec 17 16:40 |
| MinceR | will merging these megacorporations and the governments save costs? :> | Dec 17 16:40 |
| MinceR | or just disposing of governments and have megacorporations run the planet | Dec 17 16:40 |
| oiaohm | Its like HP argueing for only 1 PK and only 1 KEK slot. | Dec 17 16:41 |
| oiaohm | Because that would save flash space. | Dec 17 16:41 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: can you have security without enough silicon for what security needs? | Dec 17 16:41 |
| oiaohm | That is the insanity MinceR | Dec 17 16:41 |
| oiaohm | ODM and Intel cost cutting makes the implemtned security flawed. | Dec 17 16:42 |
| oiaohm | Its like firmware write protect jumpers that added an extra 0.4 cents per board. | Dec 17 16:43 |
| MinceR | so, if security is the objective, can you afford to use less silicon than you need? | Dec 17 16:45 |
| MinceR | it logically follows that security was not the objective. | Dec 17 16:47 |
| oiaohm | DRM was the objective security should also be in the objective. | Dec 17 16:48 |
| oiaohm | That is the problem this stuff starts not logically adding up very well. | Dec 17 16:49 |
| MinceR | DRM is unachievable as long as people have general purpose computers anyway | Dec 17 16:49 |
| oiaohm | Until you think maybe ODM and Intel want to do just enough to convice Microsoft and others they are making suitable products to move product. | Dec 17 16:50 |
| MinceR | so the aim to destroy general purpose computers follows naturally from DRM | Dec 17 16:50 |
| MinceR | hence, ibg, uefi, tc, vista10, app store-based platforms | Dec 17 16:50 |
| MinceR | "cloud" hype | Dec 17 16:50 |
| oiaohm | Problem here that is not matching what we are seeing in silcon. | Dec 17 16:50 |
| oiaohm | Like ibg being under quality. UEFI being key restable and tc being replacable modules. | Dec 17 16:51 |
| oiaohm | None of that adds up for a DRM game. | Dec 17 16:51 |
| oiaohm | Unless its deception to someone wanting a DRM game. | Dec 17 16:51 |
| MinceR | it has always been deception | Dec 17 16:52 |
| MinceR | DRM always screwed the typical consumer while not hindering the "pirate" | Dec 17 16:52 |
| oiaohm | Who is the deception against. | Dec 17 16:52 |
| MinceR | and of course it will still make it hell for most people to use a non-winblows, non-macos OS | Dec 17 16:52 |
| oiaohm | I suspect intel and ODM are doing deception to Microsoft. | Dec 17 16:52 |
| MinceR | that won't save us | Dec 17 16:52 |
| oiaohm | If intel and ODM are not working for Microsoft it just working out how to make it more profitable for Intel and ODM to work for us. | Dec 17 16:53 |
| oiaohm | So maybe it could save us MinceR | Dec 17 16:54 |
| MinceR | they're working more for m$ than for us | Dec 17 16:54 |
| oiaohm | No they are more working for themselves than Microsoft or us. | Dec 17 16:54 |
| oiaohm | If they were working for microsoft we would see items like PK and KEK not in nvram section of the firmware. | Dec 17 16:55 |
| oiaohm | Remember everything placed in the nvram section of a firmware image is intended to be replaceable by some means. | Dec 17 16:55 |
| MinceR | by the nsa | Dec 17 16:56 |
| MinceR | and by microsoft | Dec 17 16:56 |
| oiaohm | nvram is end user setting. | Dec 17 16:56 |
| MinceR | as long as the end-user is allowed to change it and the system won't refuse to implement the changes | Dec 17 16:57 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynmoody/status/677530972489965568 | Dec 17 17:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynmoody: @schestowitz great - I was looking for that... | Dec 17 17:00 | |
| schestowitz | context: https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/677527845879603200 | Dec 17 17:00 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @glynmoody Members of the EP Slam the EPO for Patent Maximalism That Led to Granting of Patents on Plants https://t.co/MLd8h1gqLr | Dec 17 17:00 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> techrights.org | Members of the European Parliament Slam the EPO for Patent Maximalism That Led to Granting of Patents on Plants | Techrights | Dec 17 17:00 | |
| oiaohm | MinceR: remember early UEFI the PK and KEK was not in the nvram. So this is a change you missed. Its very clear intel and ODM are not 100 percent working for Microsoft. Reason is greed ODM want to be able to sell boards to facebook, google and so on. | Dec 17 17:06 |
| MinceR | in the end they still do m$'s bidding | Dec 17 17:06 |
| MinceR | also note that i'm not facebook or google | Dec 17 17:06 |
| MinceR | i'm not even in the PRISM program | Dec 17 17:06 |
| oiaohm | Reality they are doing there own bidding | Dec 17 17:07 |
| MinceR | is that why with every successive version "PC"s make it harder to run any secure, reliable OS? | Dec 17 17:08 |
| MinceR | and require waiving ever more warranty? | Dec 17 17:09 |
| MinceR | and every time a new winblows version comes out, most users are even more exposed to malware and spying? | Dec 17 17:09 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: problem is PC has not be secure for a long time. BIOS breaching has been happening a lot. | Dec 17 17:28 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: problem is, all this crap does nothing to secure it any more than that | Dec 17 17:29 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: in fact, it does the opposite | Dec 17 17:29 |
| MinceR | but "security" is still a good excuse to get away with anything, apparently | Dec 17 17:29 |
| oiaohm | To be truthful at least with UEFI were are starting to see proper firmware state auditing tools made. | Dec 17 17:30 |
| MinceR | we're also starting to see alleged computers that take measures against obeying their owner | Dec 17 17:31 |
| oiaohm | Before UEFI there was no tools to run on a Machine to check that the BIOS had memory protection and other things set correctly. | Dec 17 17:31 |
| MinceR | and we're starting to see computers locked into winblows, which i hope you're not trying to claim is secure | Dec 17 17:31 |
| oiaohm | I don't see where you are getting locked into Windows. | Dec 17 17:31 |
| oiaohm | PK/KEK resetable. | Dec 17 17:31 |
| oiaohm | Reduced random power management crap. | Dec 17 17:32 |
| oiaohm | UEFI is in fact less boards locked to Windows only. | Dec 17 17:32 |
| MinceR | restricted boot was required to be included; the restricted boot option was already removed since | Dec 17 17:32 |
| MinceR | soon we'll see non-resetable PK/KEK | Dec 17 17:32 |
| MinceR | and once again the excuse will be "security" | Dec 17 17:33 |
| MinceR | and already it's a lot more difficult for the user to figure out how to install a real OS on a computer they've bought | Dec 17 17:33 |
| MinceR | on BIOS, you'd merely boot from a removable drive and it would work | Dec 17 17:33 |
| MinceR | now every UEFI setup has a different option in a different place on a different UI which must be changed | Dec 17 17:33 |
| MinceR | and the changes they must implement to get it to work are also getting more arcane | Dec 17 17:34 |
| oiaohm | Reality you skip over items. | Dec 17 17:34 |
| oiaohm | ACPI BIOS configured only for Windows do you forgot that MinceR | Dec 17 17:34 |
| oiaohm | Before signing motherboard that would not run Linux stable existed. | Dec 17 17:35 |
| oiaohm | Reality even with PK/KEK signing to get past you have more odds of a board being workable now than 2005 | Dec 17 17:35 |
| MinceR | i don't remember having issues due to ACPI | Dec 17 17:36 |
| MinceR | my distro installers booted regardless | Dec 17 17:36 |
| MinceR | and of course using the tried-and-true "boiling the frog" approach, by the time they'll lock the gates, there won't be any resistance left | Dec 17 17:37 |
| oiaohm | There is a huge stack of hack tables where the Linux kernel lies and pretends to be windows so ACPI does not cause it to fail. | Dec 17 17:37 |
| MinceR | you're already not resisting at all | Dec 17 17:37 |
| oiaohm | On older systems. | Dec 17 17:37 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly not resisting. | Dec 17 17:38 |
| oiaohm | I don't approve of not being able to replace firmware. | Dec 17 17:38 |
| oiaohm | I don't approve of bios protection signing keys being too weak. | Dec 17 17:39 |
| oiaohm | But I am realistic here. UEFI is cleaning up a lot of crap that has been let exist in BIOS for a long time. | Dec 17 17:39 |
| MinceR | and putting worse crap in its place | Dec 17 17:39 |
| oiaohm | So yes some of what UEFI is doing has to happen. | Dec 17 17:39 |
| MinceR | and mandating a lot more bloat | Dec 17 17:39 |
| MinceR | yes, humanity wants to abolish freedom, so that has to happen | Dec 17 17:40 |
| oiaohm | Your bloat arguement does not add up particular when you compare UEFI to coreboot. | Dec 17 17:40 |
| MinceR | humanity will not rest until it has built the perfect global fascist dystopia | Dec 17 17:40 |
| MinceR | oh really? | Dec 17 17:40 |
| oiaohm | coreboot secure uses larger signing and is bigger than UEFI. | Dec 17 17:41 |
| cubexyz | coreboot can fit into 256K :) | Dec 17 17:41 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: that is cut down. | Dec 17 17:41 |
| cubexyz | I've rolled it myself | Dec 17 17:41 |
| oiaohm | To what it can be. | Dec 17 17:41 |
| MinceR | afaik coreboot doesn't have to use this pointless security theater | Dec 17 17:41 |
| cubexyz | in fact there was still some room left over | Dec 17 17:42 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, my version doesn't | Dec 17 17:42 |
| cubexyz | you could cut it down to 128K without seabios | Dec 17 17:42 |
| cubexyz | but I need seabios for freedos | Dec 17 17:42 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: so basically "uefi is not bloated" because its "security" uses keys that are too small to be worth anything? :> | Dec 17 17:42 |
| MinceR | seabios is unneeded for gnu/linux, afaik | Dec 17 17:43 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, that's right | Dec 17 17:43 |
| MinceR | if you count seabios, you might as well use good old bios, before uefi | Dec 17 17:43 |
| oiaohm | udk2 the reference UEFI can be build without signing. Most compact version is 64kb. | Dec 17 17:43 |
| oiaohm | Yes coreboot is huge. | Dec 17 17:44 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, but if I use good old bios, most of the time I don't have source code | Dec 17 17:44 |
| oiaohm | UEFI full featured is also huge. | Dec 17 17:44 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/coreboot.rom | Dec 17 17:45 |
| cubexyz | check it out... 256K | Dec 17 17:45 |
| oiaohm | Exactly old bios we could not look at the source code so we had to trust it. | Dec 17 17:45 |
| oiaohm | We are now seeing more default firmware based on exposed source code so open to auditing. | Dec 17 17:45 |
| cubexyz | of course old bios was 128K in the past | Dec 17 17:45 |
| cubexyz | it got bigger over time | Dec 17 17:45 |
| MinceR | what use is looking at the source code if you have no assurance that the system you're using is actually built from those sources and if you can't rebuild and replace it? | Dec 17 17:46 |
| MinceR | what use is being able to fix holes in the source code if you can't share it with others? | Dec 17 17:46 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, I did build that one | Dec 17 17:46 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: not exact right. | Dec 17 17:46 |
| cubexyz | gcc was used | Dec 17 17:46 |
| MinceR | intel boot guard prevents exactly that | Dec 17 17:46 |
| cubexyz | now the leaked stuff is a different story | Dec 17 17:46 |
| cubexyz | I haven't been able to build that yet | Dec 17 17:46 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: https://wiki.debian.org/ReproducibleBuilds There is such thing as a Reproducible Build. | Dec 17 17:47 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://wiki.debian.org/ReproducibleBuilds ) | Dec 17 17:47 | |
| oiaohm | So if you can rebuild it you can confirm that it was built from X source code even if you cannot replace it. | Dec 17 17:47 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: What's that supposed to do with anything? | Dec 17 17:47 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: then you'll know that the hole you've found auditing the code is there, and you won't be able to fix it, ever | Dec 17 17:47 |
| MinceR | and you might not even be allowed to tell others about it | Dec 17 17:48 |
| XRevan86 | oiaohm: And magic signing? That unreproduce stuff. | Dec 17 17:48 |
| cubexyz | actually the coreboot folks encourage building from source | Dec 17 17:48 |
| cubexyz | they don't usually link to binary files | Dec 17 17:48 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: you just stated the real problem. | Dec 17 17:48 |
| oiaohm | The fact firmware is becoming more open source and more audited the means to replace it for security reasons is becoming more critical. | Dec 17 17:49 |
| MinceR | there are many real problems | Dec 17 17:49 |
| MinceR | and the powers that be work on making even more problems and solving none | Dec 17 17:49 |
| cubexyz | we got XT and AT BIOS source... then nothing for a long time after that | Dec 17 17:50 |
| oiaohm | XRevan86: Signing is conformable. Its design that way. Areas with signing can still be security checked. Confirming that something was built form X source code does not require checking signing that is not active code. | Dec 17 17:51 |
| oiaohm | Validating that something was built for X source code does not mandate requirement to replace it. | Dec 17 17:52 |
| oiaohm | Security is the reason why you need to be able to replace lots of stuff. | Dec 17 17:52 |
| cubexyz | we also like to know what are computers are doing | Dec 17 17:53 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: Xt and AT BIOS was only some rough reference. Each vendor of the XT and AT bios extended and modified the bugger. | Dec 17 17:53 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, I think there's a generic source listing that's easy to find | Dec 17 17:55 |
| cubexyz | what extensions did they make? | Dec 17 17:55 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: all kinds of strange things. Like some AT phoninix bios support putting up a pretend harddrive that was being served from a shared image in a custom network format. | Dec 17 17:57 |
| oiaohm | Yes I remember 286 running Windows 3.11 over network that way. | Dec 17 17:58 |
| oiaohm | Yes to be fun if you booted the machine from floppy drive the virtual network harddrive completley disappeared. | Dec 17 17:59 |
| cubexyz | I wonder how big the original BIOS was | Dec 17 18:00 |
| cubexyz | 8k? | Dec 17 18:00 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: smaller in fact. | Dec 17 18:01 |
| cubexyz | MinceR, if you want unbloated BIOS you want the original IBM PC :) | Dec 17 18:01 |
| oiaohm | 8k was the rom chip size. | Dec 17 18:01 |
| oiaohm | I think it was 7.5 | Dec 17 18:01 |
| MinceR | cubexyz: it's not the only option, afaik | Dec 17 18:02 |
| cubexyz | don't forget the BASIC rom | Dec 17 18:02 |
| oiaohm | If you download the ibm 8k image you will find it ends with a stack of zeros. | Dec 17 18:02 |
| cubexyz | probably another 8k | Dec 17 18:02 |
| cubexyz | I think there were some 8k BASICs | Dec 17 18:02 |
| oiaohm | Most clone bioses were larger than 8k | Dec 17 18:02 |
| cubexyz | yeah I remember 128k and 256k but I'm sure there were lots inbetween | Dec 17 18:04 |
| cubexyz | 64k, 32k probably | Dec 17 18:04 |
| oiaohm | Of cource the old IBM PC did not require microcode https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P6_%28microarchitecture%29 Basically since pent pro/pent II firmware images had to grow. | Dec 17 18:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org | P6 (microarchitecture) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia | Dec 17 18:04 | |
| cubexyz | newer IBM AT BIOS had 101-keyboard support and 1.44 floppy support | Dec 17 18:05 |
| cubexyz | maybe two 32k ROM chips | Dec 17 18:05 |
| cubexyz | what is the standard keyboard now, 104 keys? | Dec 17 18:06 |
| MinceR | depends on the region | Dec 17 18:07 |
| MinceR | ISO layout tends to have an extra '<' (or whatever) key | Dec 17 18:08 |
| MinceR | japanese layouts tend to have some more extra keys | Dec 17 18:08 |
| oiaohm | https://books.google.com.au/books?id=hnvCf6WlcYcC&pg=PT433&lpg=PT433&dq=1992+AMI+ROM+size&source=bl&ots=CYQwdANqXt&sig=G5bl2IidqaUCBMZxy_KXOoLuEUg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj0vLKWvuPJAhXlIqYKHUa3AYgQ6AEISjAJ#v=onepage&q=1992%20AMI%20ROM%20size&f=false | Dec 17 18:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-books.google.com.au | PC Mag - Google Books | Dec 17 18:08 | |
| oiaohm | Good fun to see the 1992 price to replace a bios | Dec 17 18:09 |
| oiaohm | Yes to replace a bios back then was more than a cheep motherboard now. | Dec 17 18:09 |
| MinceR | and now you don't get to replace it | Dec 17 18:09 |
| MinceR | and soon you won't even get to replace the OS | Dec 17 18:10 |
| cubexyz | they did on the original Playstation :) | Dec 17 18:10 |
| cubexyz | upgraded for pirated game capability :) | Dec 17 18:10 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: even back in 1992 there were motherboard with signing checked embedded preventing bios replacement. | Dec 17 18:10 |
| oiaohm | So not being able to replace a bios is not exactly new. | Dec 17 18:11 |
| cubexyz | they only did a checksum though | Dec 17 18:11 |
| cubexyz | not too hard to figure out | Dec 17 18:11 |
| oiaohm | The first PGP signed bios is 1991 | Dec 17 18:11 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: was not popular the bugger took forever to boot. | Dec 17 18:12 |
| cubexyz | btw the Amiga 500 had a 512k rom | Dec 17 18:12 |
| cubexyz | and that was in 1987 | Dec 17 18:12 |
| cubexyz | bigger than I thought it would be | Dec 17 18:13 |
| oiaohm | x86 PC were really built on the cheap | Dec 17 18:13 |
| cubexyz | also the roms were really well documented on the amiga | Dec 17 18:14 |
| cubexyz | there was a huge book for it | Dec 17 18:14 |
| oiaohm | That is the thing we had huge ammount of time of underdocumented firmware. | Dec 17 18:14 |
| cubexyz | in fact it was 3 huge books | Dec 17 18:16 |
| oiaohm | exactly | Dec 17 18:17 |
| oiaohm | You might not have been able to change amiga 500 bios but you knew exactly what the beast was upto. | Dec 17 18:17 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, you could change it by replacing the chip | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | 1.2 -> 1.3 -> 2.04 | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | mine is still 1.3 rom | Dec 17 18:18 |
| oiaohm | I thought those were soldered on? | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | nope | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | socketed | Dec 17 18:18 |
| cubexyz | I upgraded mine from the original 1.2 | Dec 17 18:19 |
| oiaohm | Also those are roms not flash so secure from runtime alteration. | Dec 17 18:19 |
| cubexyz | yes :) | Dec 17 18:19 |
| oiaohm | level of means to replace alters security. | Dec 17 18:20 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/amiga-500-board.jpg | Dec 17 18:20 |
| cubexyz | see all the socketed chips? | Dec 17 18:21 |
| cubexyz | except for the ram at the bottom | Dec 17 18:21 |
| cubexyz | the rom chip is to the right of the 68000 cpu | Dec 17 18:22 |
| oiaohm | The problem with a flash firmware is it can be too simple to replace. | Dec 17 18:24 |
| MinceR | especially if switches or jumpers are too expensive to include | Dec 17 18:25 |
| cubexyz | doh | Dec 17 18:25 |
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| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 18 11:00 | |
| schestowitz | "I strongly recommend that the people who cannot live with libsystemd0 | Dec 18 12:03 |
| schestowitz | installed on their systems leave Debian, because their life is going to | Dec 18 12:03 |
| schestowitz | suck more and more as we will integrate it in every important daemon | Dec 18 12:03 |
| schestowitz | after jessie will have been released." | Dec 18 12:03 |
| schestowitz | https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2015/02/msg00644.html | Dec 18 12:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-SSL connect error ( status 0 @ https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2015/02/msg00644.html ) | Dec 18 12:03 | |
| cubexyz | you'll see an exodus to the BSDs if things don't improve, mark my words | Dec 18 12:11 |
| cubexyz | we'll see what happens with slackware | Dec 18 12:13 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz and schestowitz the issue is a little more complex. Packages linked against libsystemd0 are going to want something libsystemd0 so you cannot straight up delete it. systemd-shim of the past solution could be used where the libsystemd0 is no-oped in most places. | Dec 18 12:17 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/robcolbert/status/677824818197196800 | Dec 18 12:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@robcolbert: @schestowitz I didn't mean to usurp your hashtag, but since we're fighting the same battles I would like to learn more & we should talk. | Dec 18 12:18 | |
| schestowitz | Always happy to hear of any updates, news... | Dec 18 12:18 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/robcolbert/status/677824951546679297 | Dec 18 12:18 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@robcolbert: If you'd rather not be tracked by what frameworks and other centralized assets you access every single day online: https://t.co/4iwrwkd9en | Dec 18 12:18 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: #Decentraleyes for Firefox loads CDN resources locally https://t.co/8ILQ3naAKN #mozilla #firefox #freesw | Dec 18 12:18 | |
| cubexyz | on q4os I only have libsystemd-login0... all other systemd files are gone | Dec 18 12:18 |
| cubexyz | so I'm tolerating that one part only | Dec 18 12:18 |
| cubexyz | and only on q4os... | Dec 18 12:19 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I guess libsystem0 is still on the system. | Dec 18 12:19 |
| oiaohm | Because libsystmd-login0 uses it. | Dec 18 12:19 |
| cubexyz | nope | Dec 18 12:20 |
| cubexyz | it only uses libsystemd-login.so.0 | Dec 18 12:20 |
| cubexyz | I know because I just checked it :) | Dec 18 12:20 |
| oiaohm | I forgot that got split off. | Dec 18 12:21 |
| oiaohm | systemd is internally getting split up more. | Dec 18 12:21 |
| oiaohm | Purely being stuborn on my part my old 500GB harddrive is down to less than 10 megs of sectors questiaonable on readable status. | Dec 18 12:23 |
| cubexyz | I do wonder what the heck happened to ttylinux though | Dec 18 12:28 |
| cubexyz | seems to have disappeared | Dec 18 12:29 |
| cubexyz | people get tired or disillusioned and then pack it in | Dec 18 12:29 |
| *WeS has quit (Quit: Gtg See ya Later) | Dec 18 13:21 | |
| schestowitz | >> I've not had the time to cover it and I worry that covering this will | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | >> > amplify the MS PR. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > Agreed. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | >> > I'd rather just write more articles about the tax | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | >> > evasion. When new information becomes available. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > It's the tax evasion that they are worried about, and don't want | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > coverage of. I think it itself may be covering something big. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > Hopefully time and material will turn up in the next few weeks. I have | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > noticed that M$ rarely does a distraction unless they have reason to. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > Given that the distraction is big, noisy, and expensive they must have | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > something big to hide. As mentioned my very speculative guess is that | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | > they may be reaching the limit to solvency. | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | I'm very deep into EPO (buried in material right now), so if you keep an eye on MS and send me links, that'll ensure I can still post about the important things... | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | Expect some major EPO scandal to come up very soon... | Dec 18 13:26 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/mall_dweller/status/677842102378766336 | Dec 18 13:30 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@mall_dweller: @schestowitz Waitwhut? You're saing EPO is ddossing your website? | Dec 18 13:30 | |
| *oiaohm has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Dec 18 14:45 | |
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| schestowitz | > Just in time for a new attack on RMS. Brian Lunduke managed to talk RMS into | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > an interview and the panelists now seem to be busy smearing and | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > misrepresenting him to puff themselves up. See, | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > Lunduke | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/u/0/+BryanLunduke/posts/CEsDETRJxge | Dec 18 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Video: The Need for Compromise in Free Software - With Richard Stallman. Huge… | Dec 18 16:03 | |
| schestowitz | > http://lunduke.com/2015/12/16/need-for-compromise-in-free-software-with-richard-stallman/ | Dec 18 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lunduke.com | [Bryan] Lunduke.com » Need for Compromise in Free Software – With Richard Stallman [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhg ] | Dec 18 16:03 | |
| schestowitz | > https://archive.org/details/CompromiseInFreeSoftware | Dec 18 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-archive.org | Compromise In Free Software : Bryan Lunduke : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhh ] | Dec 18 16:03 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > Seigo, who calls RMS a "Zealot" who does not care enough about free software | Dec 18 16:03 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/u/0/+AaronSeigo/posts/j6DG5ERzLmb | Dec 18 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Video: The Need for Compromise in Free Software - With Richard Stallman. Huge… [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhi ] | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > https://exote.ch/blogs/aseigo/2015/12/16/server-software-matters/ | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-exote.ch | Server Software Matters | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > Bhartiya who promotes Pixel C | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/+SwapnilBhartiya/posts/U72P8mr7mTf | Dec 18 16:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Video: The Need for Compromise in Free Software - With Richard Stallman. Huge… [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhl ] | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/+SwapnilBhartiya/posts/RW8dZ5bHb2j | Dec 18 16:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | After using the Pixel C I realised how much I missed the iPad AIR. iPad Pro is… [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhn ] | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > and has been promoting ... Microsoft Word, Apple, and Suse, | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.swapnil.io/2015/12/16/microsoft-word-bring-odf-support-to-ios-beats-google-docs/ | Dec 18 16:04 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.swapnil.io | Microsoft Word brings ODF support to iOS, beats Google Docs | swapnil [ http://ur1.ca/ocnhp ] | Dec 18 16:04 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > there, now I don't have to keep those tabs open ... maybe I can forget the | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > whole thing. | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > I have not actually watched the video yet, but I'm not really happy with these | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > people. They have all been doing odd things to promote fog computing and | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > other things to help Microsoft and software owners. Swampnil's trajectory | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > has been particularly disappointing. Seigo has always said awful things | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > about the wrong people. I'm not really sure I want to even start looking at | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > it, because it will be a waste of time talking to these folks. | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > At the same time, I expect the themes to resonate across Microsoft troll media | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | > and the fauxpen source community. | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | You can challenge them online over it, but I don't want to bicker with them on these issues because it's a distraction of efforts (the real enemy is proprietary software) and I really want to focus on the EPO right now. | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | Seigo isn't all that bad and Swapnil is usually OK. I personally challenged Brian many times and he tried building bridges with them... | Dec 18 16:04 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/wowbagger999/status/662396878923964416?cn=ZmF2b3JpdGVfbWVudGlvbmVkX3VzZXI%3D&refsrc=email | Dec 18 16:06 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@wowbagger999: @glynmoody @schestowitz #TTIP #TPP & Co seem infected with some kind of #ACTA bachdoor. We should delete them and reboot our systems! | Dec 18 16:06 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/677788818276270080 | Dec 18 16:58 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: Big Brother is born. And we find out 15 years too late to stop him https://t.co/2VA0ehcui4 "four million intercepted phone calls a year" | Dec 18 16:58 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> www.theregister.co.uk | Big Brother is born. And we find out 15 years too late to stop him • The Register | Dec 18 16:58 | |
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| MinceR | http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-12-17/battle-over-women-pop-star-sinks-deutsche-telekom-unit-contract | Dec 18 18:29 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.bloomberg.com | Battle Over Women, Pop Star Sinks Magyar Telekom Contract - Bloomberg Business [ http://ur1.ca/ocnok ] | Dec 18 18:29 | |
| schestowitz | got this today | Dec 18 18:46 |
| schestowitz | "Regards, and keep up the good work." | Dec 18 18:46 |
| schestowitz | EPO is in a bad state atm | Dec 18 18:46 |
| *abeNd-org has quit (Quit: Leaving.) | Dec 18 18:49 | |
| *arossdotme has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat) | Dec 18 19:41 | |
| schestowitz | > I think it's everytime I mention your name or link to a Techrights article. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > The only thing I have bothered to document was two years ago, where he said | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > you were "full on dipshit tinfoil hat crazy" about Novel and Microsoft. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > https://plus.google.com/+AaronS eigo/posts/6gT9djuXEV4 | Dec 18 19:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-plus.google.com | Aaron's - Google+ | Dec 18 19:53 | |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > If you'd like I can do a little more searching to confirm or disprove my | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > opinion. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > Strangely enough, I get a similar reaction from Lauren Weinstein about Richard | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > Stallman. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > It's interesting how effective the strategy is. When you suspect something | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > wrong, you are dismissed as paranoid and ignorant. If you do the research | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > and it verifies what you thought, you are dismissed as unbalanced for having | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > cared enough to do the work. | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 18 19:53 |
| schestowitz | > The holidays are on, as usual, and time is tight. This is when all sorts of | Dec 18 19:54 |
| schestowitz | > rude things are rolled out. | Dec 18 19:54 |
| schestowitz | I sounds as though Seigo's remark was a one-off, which I guess is good news. I don't need enemies there; besides, Seigo did support my views on Novell in the past, despite his issues of loyalty and commitments. Also remember Kolab's connections to SUSE (Germany-Switzerland). He works for Kolab now. | Dec 18 19:54 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/glynmoody/status/677944390065737728 | Dec 18 20:39 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@glynmoody: @schestowitz "fact-tracking" -> "fast-tracking"? | Dec 18 20:39 | |
| schestowitz | ta | Dec 18 20:39 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/David_Vaporium/status/677940535559069697 | Dec 18 20:40 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@David_Vaporium: @schestowitz @tvlicensingblog If are charged - claim you true status as `the accused` never accept the term `defendant` BoP is c/o Accuser | Dec 18 20:40 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/677940192448266240 | Dec 18 20:40 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz @FOSSpatents As long as he's the only one in the building I would not mind at all. | Dec 18 20:40 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/InlineQuickSort/status/677977097479053313 | Dec 18 22:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@InlineQuickSort: @schestowitz no direct role, just a school for high public officials. 80% of french politicians come from "l’ENA". | Dec 18 22:28 | |
| schestowitz | including battistelli | Dec 18 22:28 |
| *Disconnected (Invalid argument). | Dec 19 08:45 | |
| **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Dec 19 08:45:16 2015 | ||
| **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Dec 19 08:45:42 2015 | ||
| *Now talking on #techrights | Dec 19 08:45 | |
| *Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org | Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell | Dec 19 08:45 | |
| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 19 08:45 | |
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| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678163612779741184 | Dec 19 11:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz Much like debt collectors, buying old (often expired) debt claims to extort money to the unaware. Vultures. Parasites. Leeches. | Dec 19 11:03 | |
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| schestowitz | The Christmas market in #manchester esp. this year is better and bigger than ever before (keeps expanding each year) http://schestowitz.com/royrianne/gallery/index.php/Birthday-at-the-German-Market | Dec 19 14:45 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-schestowitz.com | Birthday at the German Market [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4k ] | Dec 19 14:46 | |
| cubexyz | more emails complaining about windows 10 | Dec 19 14:46 |
| schestowitz | where? | Dec 19 14:46 |
| schestowitz | Need to see, can use in article | Dec 19 14:46 |
| cubexyz | it's frustrating... I tell people not to use windows 10 and what do they do? Install windows 7 | Dec 19 14:46 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: also, (haven't looked at TR in awhile) did you cover CyanogenOS's inclusion of Cortana | Dec 19 14:47 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: also, CM13 nightly recently added an NTFS driver | Dec 19 14:47 |
| XFaCE | http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/123061/ | Dec 19 14:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-review.cyanogenmod.org | Gerrit Code Review [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4n ] | Dec 19 14:49 | |
| XFaCE | "sepolicy: Set the context for fsck.exfat/ntfs to fsck_exec" | Dec 19 14:49 |
| schestowitz | didn't see it | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | is it in C-Mode? | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | http://review.cyanogenmod.org/#/c/122995/ | Dec 19 14:50 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-review.cyanogenmod.org | Gerrit Code Review [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4p ] | Dec 19 14:50 | |
| schestowitz | Or just Cyanogen Inc? | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | "Native NTFS kernel driver support" | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | this is CM13 | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | I mean, upstream | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | is it included in the core of CM? | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | yes | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | wow | Dec 19 14:50 |
| cubexyz | schestowitz, I'm asking for permission to use it as it's a private email | Dec 19 14:50 |
| schestowitz | You said CyanogenOS | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: yeah, in realtion to cortana | Dec 19 14:50 |
| XFaCE | *relation | Dec 19 14:51 |
| schestowitz | what's the link? | Dec 19 14:51 |
| schestowitz | Because they claims CM is barebones and then vendors can do to it a bundle | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | http://www.xda-developers.com/xda-external-link/cortana-now-available-where-and-when-you-need-her-no-matter-what-smartphone-you-choose/ | Dec 19 14:51 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.xda-developers.com | Cortana to Come Preloaded On Cyanogen OS 12.1.1 on OnePlus One [ http://ur1.ca/ocp4r ] | Dec 19 14:51 | |
| schestowitz | also, are there articles about it? | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | so to summarize | Dec 19 14:51 |
| schestowitz | one PlusOne | Dec 19 14:51 |
| schestowitz | but is it also upstream? | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | NTFS/exFat is added to CyanogenMod | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | Cortana on CyanogenOS | Dec 19 14:51 |
| XFaCE | so CyanogenOS has become a transparent Microsoft marketing bed | Dec 19 14:52 |
| XFaCE | and CM13 is slowly becoming one :P | Dec 19 14:52 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: sorry you don't understand the problem. | Dec 19 14:53 |
| XFaCE | "At the official announcement post for Cortana’s availability on iOS and Android, Microsoft also announced that future versions of Cyanogen OS will feature deep integration of Cortana. " | Dec 19 14:53 |
| oiaohm | NTFS and exFat in fact becomes stupidly forced by storage device makers. | Dec 19 14:53 |
| XFaCE | I don't even run either on my sdcard | Dec 19 14:53 |
| XFaCE | I just use JFFS | Dec 19 14:53 |
| oiaohm | You still don't understand the problem. | Dec 19 14:53 |
| XFaCE | that was an aside comment | Dec 19 14:54 |
| oiaohm | Some sdcards if you put anything other than exfat or ntfs on them they will destory you data. | Dec 19 14:54 |
| oiaohm | and I am not kidding. | Dec 19 14:54 |
| XFaCE | well that's fucked up | Dec 19 14:54 |
| XFaCE | link? | Dec 19 14:54 |
| oiaohm | Why they storage card system for working out what sectors it can recycle for wear leveling is working from the information it extracting from the file system. | Dec 19 14:55 |
| oiaohm | It was covered in a 2010 australian Linux conference video. | Dec 19 14:55 |
| XFaCE | "Nevertheless, in order to be fully compliant with the SDXC card specification, many SDXC-capable host devices are firmware-programmed to expect exFAT on cards larger than 32 GB. Consequently, they may not accept SDXC cards reformatted as FAT32, even if the device supports FAT32 on smaller cards (for SDHC compatibility). Therefore, even if a file system is supported in general, it is not always possible to use alternative file systems on SDXC cards a | Dec 19 14:56 |
| XFaCE | t all depending on how strictly the SDXC card specification has been implemented in the device. This bears a risk of accidental loss of data, as a host device may treat a card with an unrecognized file system as blank or damaged and reformat the card." | Dec 19 14:56 |
| XFaCE | wow | Dec 19 14:56 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: Please note SDXC contains exfat as part of the standard. | Dec 19 14:56 |
| XFaCE | after how much $$$ from MS? | Dec 19 14:57 |
| oiaohm | So format SDXC with NTFS and its exfat only you data is screwed. | Dec 19 14:57 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: when you understand the problem what choice do OS vendors have when Hardware makers lock in the format. | Dec 19 14:58 |
| XFaCE | thanks for this info, I didn't know that | Dec 19 14:58 |
| schestowitz | thanks | Dec 19 14:58 |
| schestowitz | will do an article about i | Dec 19 14:59 |
| schestowitz | it | Dec 19 14:59 |
| XFaCE | two separate ones? | Dec 19 14:59 |
| oiaohm | Please note when buying ssd harddrives this problem can apply as well. | Dec 19 14:59 |
| oiaohm | Yes always look for Linux support on a ssd harddrive because that means generic file system support. | Dec 19 14:59 |
| oiaohm | Windows or OS X only ssds could be nasty. | Dec 19 14:59 |
| XFaCE | god damn | Dec 19 14:59 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: do you have an example of a Linux-ready SSD? | Dec 19 15:03 |
| XFaCE | for future reference | Dec 19 15:03 |
| XFaCE | schestowitz: looks like what oiaohm has said - the cm13 ntfs thing is an android-wide developement | Dec 19 15:04 |
| XFaCE | cyanogenos however IS going microsoft | Dec 19 15:04 |
| oiaohm | https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/legal/intellectualproperty/mtl/technologylicensing.aspx?f0ebc726-7ebd-4545-a353-de9b1edbdbee=True Yes Microsoft does demard patents over exfat. | Dec 19 15:05 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.microsoft.com | Intellectual Property Technology Licensing Programs [ http://ur1.ca/ocp5c ] | Dec 19 15:05 | |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: this is the kind of shit that anti-trust agencies should be raving on | Dec 19 15:06 |
| XFaCE | this is clear monopolistic bullshit | Dec 19 15:07 |
| cubexyz | schestowitz, briefly it's like this... customer says win10 KOed his computer to the point he can't even install a new OS | Dec 19 15:07 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: ssd even Linux ready ones have major teeth at times. https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/18363/Intel-Solid-State-Drive-Firmware-Update-Tool | Dec 19 15:07 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-downloadcenter.intel.com | Download Intel® Solid-State Drive Firmware Update Tool [ http://ur1.ca/ocp5f ] | Dec 19 15:07 | |
| cubexyz | I've asked him for permision to quote him, as soon as he gives that I'll post the text online | Dec 19 15:08 |
| XFaCE | major teeth? | Dec 19 15:08 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: ssd drives have firmware updates read the notes about it. | Dec 19 15:08 |
| XFaCE | yikes | Dec 19 15:09 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: ---If the Intel SSD firmware update process is interrupted, your Intel SSD may not function properly.--- found this bit. | Dec 19 15:09 |
| oiaohm | In otherwords I can eat your data. | Dec 19 15:09 |
| oiaohm | Now Microsoft is wanting to make firmware updating on stuff automatic. | Dec 19 15:09 |
| cubexyz | the upside, if there is one... is the customer will be more receptive to non-microsoft operating systems | Dec 19 15:10 |
| oiaohm | My main usage of ssd harddrives is as bcache where the majority of the data is kept on old school spinning media. | Dec 19 15:11 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: how are kingston ssds for linux compatibility? | Dec 19 15:11 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: From what I have seen of kingston ssds they all had Linux firmware update tools. Now a problem you can run into with a kingston ssd they don't have os x tools and older drives don't have current version of Windows tools. | Dec 19 15:14 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: so kingston ssd is more Linux compadible than anything else. | Dec 19 15:14 |
| oiaohm | Ie not compadible with mostly everything else. | Dec 19 15:14 |
| XFaCE | lol | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | well that's good to know | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | Kingston SSDs it is | Dec 19 15:15 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: I guess you starting to see this SSD stuff has major holes. | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | well I never even thought of it | Dec 19 15:15 |
| oiaohm | So a SSD good for Linux can be horible for Windows and OS X. | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | thanks very much for bringing it to our attention | Dec 19 15:15 |
| XFaCE | the sdxc thing is just... wow | Dec 19 15:16 |
| oiaohm | And you can swap that around. | Dec 19 15:16 |
| oiaohm | So when you buy a SSD it better match the OS's you are wishing to use in spec. | Dec 19 15:16 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: in an ideal world SDXD would require JFFS or something open | Dec 19 15:16 |
| XFaCE | or YAFFS | Dec 19 15:17 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: F2FS is from samsung. | Dec 19 15:18 |
| XFaCE | ah right | Dec 19 15:18 |
| schestowitz | https://www.gnu.org/fun/jokes/helloworld.html | Dec 19 15:22 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.gnu.org | Hello World! - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation (FSF) [ http://ur1.ca/ocp69 ] | Dec 19 15:22 | |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: JFFS and YAFFS don't have the required size to meet SDXC spec sizes let alown what a new spec could put up. But F2FS does. | Dec 19 15:22 |
| XFaCE | yeah I think I was thinking of F2FS oiaohm | Dec 19 15:23 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: yep, my bad | Dec 19 15:26 |
| XFaCE | the names can get confusing | Dec 19 15:26 |
| XFaCE | but yeah I'm using F2FS on my phone | Dec 19 15:26 |
| oiaohm | I know. Its only that I watch the australian Linux conference videos that I got it right. | Dec 19 15:26 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: http://windows.microsoft.com/en-au/windows/lifecycle Read down notice Oct 2016 preinstallation of Windows 7 and windows 8.1 is no longer meant to be performed by Microsoft Profesionals. | Dec 19 15:28 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-windows.microsoft.com | Windows lifecycle fact sheet - Windows Help [ http://ur1.ca/ocp6l ] | Dec 19 15:28 | |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: and "Retail software end of sales " is the full boxed set editions. | Dec 19 15:29 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: mostly the old OS stuff you find in stores is old stock. | Dec 19 15:29 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: writing on the wall | Dec 19 15:30 |
| XFaCE | gentoo for me | Dec 19 15:30 |
| oiaohm | Debian for me. | Dec 19 15:30 |
| XFaCE | all the time | Dec 19 15:30 |
| oiaohm | systemd does not bother me enough to move away from it. | Dec 19 15:30 |
| XFaCE | the only windows installation will be in an internet-free KVM | Dec 19 15:30 |
| XFaCE | like studying a virus or bacteria :) | Dec 19 15:31 |
| oiaohm | From what I am hearing is the windows 10 upgrade is being deployed by the Windows 7 and 8.1 update system. | Dec 19 15:31 |
| oiaohm | If that is the case Microsoft can declare it a critical update for Windows 7 and 8.1 so kill support to anything that is not 10. | Dec 19 15:32 |
| XFaCE | yeah | Dec 19 15:32 |
| XFaCE | I feel sorry for the Windows 7 users now - every windows update has to be examined | Dec 19 15:33 |
| XFaCE | I have an ignore list for what it's worth | Dec 19 15:33 |
| oiaohm | Windows 10 no ignore list | Dec 19 15:33 |
| oiaohm | For gernal users. | Dec 19 15:33 |
| XFaCE | yeah | Dec 19 15:33 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: Windows 10 is not for general users :) | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | or any users | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | as schestowitz would say, it's for the useds(sic) | Dec 19 15:34 |
| oiaohm | Only way I can see that I can run Windows 10 is run it inside virtual machine some how. | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | KVM yeah | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | isolated from the rest of the system | Dec 19 15:34 |
| oiaohm | So I can control its internet access so control its update system | Dec 19 15:34 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: there is WSUS | Dec 19 15:34 |
| oiaohm | WSUS is only for enterprise editions. | Dec 19 15:35 |
| XFaCE | that program enterprises use to control windows updates to machines | Dec 19 15:35 |
| oiaohm | That is another change with Windows 10. | Dec 19 15:35 |
| oiaohm | Windows 7 and 8.1 as long as it was pro you could connect it to WSUS. | Dec 19 15:35 |
| *schestowitz takes notes for later | Dec 19 15:35 | |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: well, there's always just downloading updates and installing them via cmd script | Dec 19 15:35 |
| XFaCE | aka the Windows 95 and below way :P | Dec 19 15:36 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: remember Windows 10 auto updates. | Dec 19 15:36 |
| oiaohm | So internet connection it getting it themselves. | Dec 19 15:36 |
| XFaCE | hence why the KVM (or equivalent) should have no or tightly regulated internet access | Dec 19 15:36 |
| cubexyz | it sounds like utter crap | Dec 19 15:37 |
| XFaCE | pretty much | Dec 19 15:37 |
| XFaCE | at this point running MS-DOS 10 sounds preferable | Dec 19 15:37 |
| oiaohm | http://www.wsusoffline.net/docs/ At least wsusoffline supports Windows 10 | Dec 19 15:38 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.wsusoffline.net | WSUS Offline Update - Update Microsoft Windows and Office without an Internet connection | Dec 19 15:38 | |
| oiaohm | So you don't need to give windows 10 internet access to get updates for it. | Dec 19 15:38 |
| XFaCE | good thought | Dec 19 15:38 |
| XFaCE | I forgot about WSUSoffline | Dec 19 15:38 |
| oiaohm | I have worked out that I can perfectly contain Windows 10. | Dec 19 15:39 |
| oiaohm | Problem is virtualisation stuff like sharing a video card between 2 OS's is still crap. | Dec 19 15:39 |
| XFaCE | true | Dec 19 15:39 |
| XFaCE | I guess Wine would be needed to run those applications | Dec 19 15:39 |
| XFaCE | graphics-intensive ones | Dec 19 15:40 |
| oiaohm | Businesses use a lot of applications that don't run in Wine. | Dec 19 15:40 |
| MinceR | businesses can afford to have those applications rewritten by people who have a clue | Dec 19 15:40 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: not exactly so. I wish it could say that. | Dec 19 15:40 |
| cubexyz | surely is this the total end of microsoft's dominance though | Dec 19 15:40 |
| cubexyz | it's so bad... | Dec 19 15:41 |
| MinceR | not unless uefi dies | Dec 19 15:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: some applications are forced on companies by stupid governement departments. | Dec 19 15:41 |
| XFaCE | cubexyz: end of *total* dominance perhaps | Dec 19 15:41 |
| XFaCE | but not the total end of dominance | Dec 19 15:41 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: governments can especially afford to have those applications rewritten by people who have a clue | Dec 19 15:41 |
| MinceR | skip buying hypePads for every MP for one year and it's funded | Dec 19 15:41 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: true lets take the Australian tax office for example of not having a clue. cisco system flawed VPN product is still in usage because they have not got any other solution ready. The product has been expired for 4 and a half years. | Dec 19 15:42 |
| *XRevan86 (~XRevan86@meowr.ru) has joined #techrights | Dec 19 15:43 | |
| cubexyz | I renewed my driver's license online via linux this year | Dec 19 15:43 |
| cubexyz | first time | Dec 19 15:43 |
| cubexyz | so I'm 100% off the doze | Dec 19 15:44 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: first time it worked? | Dec 19 15:44 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, no I never tried it before | Dec 19 15:44 |
| MinceR | f5's vpn sucks about as much as fiasco's | Dec 19 15:44 |
| MinceR | (even if they try to deny at every opportunity that their vpn is a vpn) | Dec 19 15:44 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: you also know something horiblely wrong when If a computer with Windows 10 and I can legally go out and buy Windows 8.1 and 7 boxed set and write it off on the next Australian tax return on compadiblity grounds. | Dec 19 15:45 |
| cubexyz | I'm sorry to say things are getting worse in computer-land | Dec 19 15:46 |
| cubexyz | I was thinking things were improving but now... | Dec 19 15:46 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: see, they have plenty of money to waste | Dec 19 15:46 |
| cubexyz | I'm not so sure | Dec 19 15:46 |
| oiaohm | I can only spec about how stupid Australian governement departments are. | Dec 19 15:46 |
| oiaohm | spec/speek | Dec 19 15:46 |
| oiaohm | But I would suspect other countries in places could be as bad. | Dec 19 15:46 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, a safe assumption outside of Munich I think | Dec 19 15:47 |
| XFaCE | cisco system flawed VPN product is still in usage because they have not got any other solution ready | Dec 19 15:47 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: yeah | Dec 19 15:47 |
| XFaCE | Back on Windows the Cisco VPN driver caused nasty BSODs when copying over the network about a certain speed | Dec 19 15:48 |
| XFaCE | even on non-vpn connections | Dec 19 15:48 |
| XFaCE | *above | Dec 19 15:48 |
| oiaohm | https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Lodging-your-tax-return/In-detail/e-tax-help/#Computerrequirements Read this for a laugh. | Dec 19 15:48 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 400 @ https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Lodging-your-tax-return/In-detail/e-tax-help/#Computerrequirements ) | Dec 19 15:48 | |
| oiaohm | Yes latest version of OS X is support but the lastest version of Windows you are pot luck. | Dec 19 15:48 |
| XFaCE | lol | Dec 19 15:48 |
| MinceR | the other solution is called "OpenVPN" | Dec 19 15:49 |
| XFaCE | and works well :) | Dec 19 15:49 |
| cubexyz | no, not another BSOD.... | Dec 19 15:49 |
| cubexyz | as humourous as it is... enough is enough | Dec 19 15:49 |
| XFaCE | cubexyz: imagine having to cap your network transfer speeds | Dec 19 15:49 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: and XFaCE I have some horible facts. Cisco system vpn was choosen over openvpn because some stupid idiot pushed the fact that closed source was more secure than open source. | Dec 19 15:49 |
| XFaCE | ah, the ole fallacy | Dec 19 15:50 |
| MinceR | lol | Dec 19 15:50 |
| MinceR | especially funny in fiasco's case | Dec 19 15:50 |
| MinceR | whose idea of "security" is "sue the messenger" | Dec 19 15:50 |
| XFaCE | the Cisco VPN client uses QT, an open-source toolkit | Dec 19 15:50 |
| XFaCE | try asking that stupid idiot how they reconcile that | Dec 19 15:50 |
| MinceR | they also bought jabber, only to shit all over it | Dec 19 15:50 |
| XFaCE | *bought* jabber? | Dec 19 15:51 |
| XFaCE | how do you buy an open protocol? | Dec 19 15:51 |
| MinceR | yup | Dec 19 15:51 |
| MinceR | there was a jabber company | Dec 19 15:51 |
| XFaCE | ah | Dec 19 15:51 |
| MinceR | the protocol is pretty much called xmpp now | Dec 19 15:51 |
| XFaCE | another Fireware vs 1394 | Dec 19 15:51 |
| XFaCE | or JavaScript vs ECMAScript | Dec 19 15:51 |
| MinceR | well, it's not like fiasco is interested in staying compatible with xmpp anyway | Dec 19 15:52 |
| MinceR | they pretty much force you to use one of their broken, nearly unusable clients | Dec 19 15:52 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: the only good things off hand about Cisco are the Linksys routers | Dec 19 15:52 |
| XFaCE | AFTER putting 3rd party firmware on ofc | Dec 19 15:52 |
| MinceR | i avoid those | Dec 19 15:53 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: tomato linksys routers are still good | Dec 19 15:53 |
| MinceR | since fiasco decided the GPL does not apply to thm | Dec 19 15:53 |
| MinceR | s/hm/hem/ | Dec 19 15:53 |
| oiaohm | woo hoo. http://lets-talk.ato.gov.au/swdcommunity?category=ELS2SBR&tool=news_feed they plan to get off the cisco system broken vpn by june 2016 | Dec 19 15:53 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-lets-talk.ato.gov.au | ATO Let's Talk | Software developers community [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7b ] | Dec 19 15:53 | |
| MinceR | and i'll probably have to build my own routers anyway, thanks to the FCC and the NSA | Dec 19 15:53 |
| XFaCE | heh | Dec 19 15:53 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: I've seen someting very scary - a lot of people's asus router config pages showing up on google O_o | Dec 19 15:54 |
| cubexyz | I'll help... | Dec 19 15:54 |
| MinceR | :> | Dec 19 15:54 |
| cubexyz | http://kicad-pcb.org | Dec 19 15:54 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: I mean, wow | Dec 19 15:54 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-kicad-pcb.org | KiCad EDA | Dec 19 15:54 | |
| XFaCE | MinceR: building your own router | Dec 19 15:54 |
| XFaCE | hmm | Dec 19 15:55 |
| XFaCE | pfSense | Dec 19 15:55 |
| XFaCE | + Beaglebone Black | Dec 19 15:55 |
| XFaCE | + Switch | Dec 19 15:55 |
| MinceR | yeah, i guess | Dec 19 15:55 |
| MinceR | i was thinking along the lines of a rpi2, but having a case is not important in this case | Dec 19 15:56 |
| MinceR | also, + usb wifi dongle | Dec 19 15:56 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: fuck the rpi2 | Dec 19 15:56 |
| MinceR | no thanks | Dec 19 15:57 |
| XFaCE | beaglebone black B-) | Dec 19 15:57 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: http://beagleboard.org/black | Dec 19 15:57 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-beagleboard.org | BeagleBoard.org - black | Dec 19 15:57 | |
| XRevan86 | > there was a jabber company | Dec 19 15:58 |
| XRevan86 | huh | Dec 19 15:58 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: bbb has a 1ghz processor, rpi2 has 900 mhz | Dec 19 15:58 |
| XFaCE | less ram, but meh | Dec 19 15:58 |
| MinceR | how many cores does the bbb have? | Dec 19 15:58 |
| XFaCE | 1 | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | dammit | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | you win again MinceR | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | :P | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | pft | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 19 15:59 |
| oiaohm | I did not finsh that off. | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: but | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | BUT | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | BUTT | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: the BBB doesn't have proprietary crap | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | that's good | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | and it's painted black | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XFaCE | B-) | Dec 19 15:59 |
| MinceR | a big point for the BBB | Dec 19 15:59 |
| oiaohm | The repalcement to the broken Cisco vpn stuff is SBR. Horiblem part is all sample code for it is C# | Dec 19 15:59 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: What did Jabber company before being bought? | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: internal storage too | Dec 19 16:00 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: afaik they developed xmpp | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XRevan86 | * Jabber company did | Dec 19 16:00 |
| MinceR | though wikipedia only mentions one product | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XFaCE | MinceR: the BBB has a microSD built-in | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XFaCE | plus the slot | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XRevan86 | > The Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) formed an XMPP working group in 2002 to formalise the core protocols as an IETF instant messaging and presence technology | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XRevan86 | > 2002 | Dec 19 16:00 |
| XFaCE | and a serial connection port | Dec 19 16:00 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: bbb is not as great against the latest pi boards. | Dec 19 16:01 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20001203131700/http://www.jabber.com/ | Dec 19 16:01 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber.com, Inc. [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7k ] | Dec 19 16:01 | |
| XFaCE | true oiaohm , but it does still have the open hardware/internal storage advantages | Dec 19 16:01 |
| XFaCE | back in the rpi1 days, it easily bested it | Dec 19 16:02 |
| XFaCE | when the Beaglebone whatever comes out to replace the black, that'll be cool | Dec 19 16:02 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20081104100727/http://www.jabber.com/ | Dec 19 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Empty reply from server ( status 0 @ https://web.archive.org/web/20081104100727/http://www.jabber.com/ ) | Dec 19 16:03 | |
| XFaCE | meanwhile https://boards.openpandora.org/pyramain/main/ | Dec 19 16:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-boards.openpandora.org | DragonBox Pyra - the OpenSource Linux handheld - Pyra Handheld Boards [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7o ] | Dec 19 16:03 | |
| XFaCE | this looks damned awesome :D | Dec 19 16:04 |
| MinceR | can the BBB boot off the removable card? | Dec 19 16:04 |
| XFaCE | yes | Dec 19 16:04 |
| cubexyz | ok, can the BBB boot into a different OS? :) | Dec 19 16:05 |
| XFaCE | you can make so it boots off internal storage when no card is plugged in | Dec 19 16:05 |
| XFaCE | cubexyz: BSD? linux distros? :) | Dec 19 16:05 |
| XFaCE | not windows 10 tho XD | Dec 19 16:05 |
| cubexyz | XFaCE, sure | Dec 19 16:05 |
| cubexyz | yeah we'll skip that one | Dec 19 16:05 |
| XFaCE | yes | Dec 19 16:07 |
| XFaCE | is the answer to your question | Dec 19 16:07 |
| oiaohm | Only 1 thing wrong with the pandara https://boards.openpandora.org/pyramain/pyraspecs.html/ | Dec 19 16:08 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-boards.openpandora.org | DragonBox Pyra - Specifications - Pyra Handheld Boards [ http://ur1.ca/ocp7z ] | Dec 19 16:08 | |
| oiaohm | Boot media sdxc | Dec 19 16:08 |
| MinceR | does it mandate exfat? | Dec 19 16:09 |
| MinceR | as in, can it boot off saner fs-es | Dec 19 16:09 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: to be sdxc standard conforming yes. | Dec 19 16:09 |
| MinceR | that's why i clarified :> | Dec 19 16:09 |
| oiaohm | So sdxc cards don't have support any other format than exfat | Dec 19 16:09 |
| MinceR | question is, does the pyra support other fs-es | Dec 19 16:10 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: https://web.archive.org/web/20010124085700/http://www.jabber.com/about/index.shtml I see | Dec 19 16:13 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber.com, Inc. [ http://ur1.ca/ocp8c ] | Dec 19 16:13 | |
| XRevan86 | Jabber.com, Inc. != Jabber | Dec 19 16:13 |
| XRevan86 | not never | Dec 19 16:14 |
| MinceR | apparently they ran jabber.org too | Dec 19 16:14 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20060201231702/http://www.jabber.org/ | Dec 19 16:15 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber: Open Instant Messaging and a Whole Lot More, Powered by XMPP [ http://ur1.ca/ocp8f ] | Dec 19 16:15 | |
| MinceR | >Jabber® is a registered trademark of Jabber, Inc. | Dec 19 16:15 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: SD media gets horiblem. | Dec 19 16:15 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: first generation SD cards techically format genenic. | Dec 19 16:15 |
| MinceR | https://web.archive.org/web/20001109164300/http://www.jabber.org/ | Dec 19 16:15 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-web.archive.org | Jabber.org [ http://ur1.ca/ocp8h ] | Dec 19 16:15 | |
| MinceR | >Jabber is a registered trademark of Jabber.com, Inc. Used by permission. | Dec 19 16:15 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: huh | Dec 19 16:16 |
| MinceR | so they probably didn't run it, but i'm not sure | Dec 19 16:16 |
| oiaohm | SDHC the second generation cards the standard formatting tool is FAT32 | Dec 19 16:16 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: well yeah, it's painful that sd promotes not only DRM, but also braindead m$ formats | Dec 19 16:16 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: That's ancient history that didn't really impact modern XMPP :). | Dec 19 16:16 |
| MinceR | and patents | Dec 19 16:16 |
| oiaohm | So SDHC to prevent screw up put small fat32 partition at start. | Dec 19 16:16 |
| MinceR | XRevan86: afaik that's where modern xmpp comes from :> | Dec 19 16:16 |
| oiaohm | Rasbery pi images use the small starting fat partition stunt. | Dec 19 16:17 |
| MinceR | to prevent screw up, stop using sd formatting tools, start using generic partitioning and filesystem creation tools | Dec 19 16:17 |
| MinceR | :> | Dec 19 16:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: no | Dec 19 16:17 |
| XRevan86 | MinceR: But they hired Jabber original creater *later* :) | Dec 19 16:17 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: the problem is wear leveling implmented in the SDHC cards. | Dec 19 16:17 |
| MinceR | oiaohm: works for me | Dec 19 16:18 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: sometimes the bugger is attempt to read fat to locate sectors it can recycle. | Dec 19 16:18 |
| MinceR | also, wear leveling should work on hw blocks, not filesystems | Dec 19 16:18 |
| MinceR | and TRIM | Dec 19 16:18 |
| oiaohm | SD cards they don't all work on hw blocks. | Dec 19 16:18 |
| MinceR | if they can't do it right, they should look for a career they're qualified for | Dec 19 16:18 |
| oiaohm | Some are reading file system data. | Dec 19 16:18 |
| oiaohm | By SD standard they are perfectly permitted to be rading the filesystem data. | Dec 19 16:19 |
| oiaohm | So bogus partition at start that gives it something to look at keeps the card firmware happy. | Dec 19 16:19 |
| MinceR | cards rarely if ever break for me | Dec 19 16:20 |
| MinceR | except for the shit sandisk peddles | Dec 19 16:20 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: people having strange failures with SD cards they have formated normally trace to this. | Dec 19 16:20 |
| MinceR | but i stay away from sandisk | Dec 19 16:20 |
| oiaohm | sandisk is one of the ones needing a small fat partition. | Dec 19 16:20 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: can you explaim the small fat partition again | Dec 19 16:20 |
| MinceR | sandisk can't even get physical dimensions right | Dec 19 16:21 |
| MinceR | their microsd card reader has a too thin slot, their microsd cards are too thick | Dec 19 16:21 |
| MinceR | even their usb flash drives are unreliable | Dec 19 16:21 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: the firmware wearleveling reads in some SD brands is reading the fat tables in the fat filesystem to find sectors that have been deleted so it can recycle them. | Dec 19 16:22 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: fat data area filled with random crap the wearleveling starts recycling random sectors so it a question to how long that is something important. | Dec 19 16:23 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: be wared some USB Flash is Fat and NTFS only as well. So requiring to level partitions in place to keep them happy. | Dec 19 16:24 |
| cubexyz | oiaohm, do SSD's laster longer than hard drives? | Dec 19 16:24 |
| cubexyz | s/laster/last/ | Dec 19 16:24 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: hard question. | Dec 19 16:24 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: so on SDXC a small fat/exfat partition may fix some things? | Dec 19 16:26 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: yes its making sure the firmware wearleveling has the data it needs not be a stupid idiot. | Dec 19 16:26 |
| cubexyz | remember the quantum LP52S from 1990! | Dec 19 16:27 |
| cubexyz | and I think you mentioned even older ones | Dec 19 16:27 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: in theory http://betanews.com/2014/12/05/modern-ssds-can-last-a-lifetime/ Please note theory. Theory says a SSD drive should outlast a spinning media harddrive. | Dec 19 16:27 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-betanews.com | Modern SSDs can last a lifetime [ http://ur1.ca/ocp9j ] | Dec 19 16:27 | |
| oiaohm | Problem here its theory. | Dec 19 16:27 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: but the problem is that is hard to determine the size needed for this small partition? | Dec 19 16:28 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: So far we are fairly lucky resize down the default installed partition and its in the right place. | Dec 19 16:28 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: basically big mistake is completely clearing the media. | Dec 19 16:29 |
| MinceR | afaict SSDs are plagued by firmware bugs | Dec 19 16:29 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: resize it what size? | Dec 19 16:29 |
| XFaCE | *it to | Dec 19 16:29 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: what even is the min size without moving its fat tables. | Dec 19 16:29 |
| XFaCE | I have no idea :P | Dec 19 16:30 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: if you don't get it that answer is matched to the size of media. | Dec 19 16:30 |
| oiaohm | MinceR: correct SSD have issues with Firmware bugs. | Dec 19 16:31 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: what's the formula then? | Dec 19 16:31 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: I don't have the formula off the top of head. | Dec 19 16:31 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: Its 2 am in the morning here and I cannot sleep. | Dec 19 16:31 |
| cubexyz | ok, simple question... which SSD should I buy? | Dec 19 16:31 |
| XFaCE | sorry to hear that | Dec 19 16:31 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: No problems I have days where I skip sleep. Its just me. | Dec 19 16:32 |
| XFaCE | ok | Dec 19 16:32 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: so I am not at work where I have data on different things like formating drives. | Dec 19 16:32 |
| cubexyz | I can't go much over 24 hours | Dec 19 16:32 |
| XFaCE | ok | Dec 19 16:32 |
| cubexyz | even 16 hours is a lot :) | Dec 19 16:32 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: is there any risks going from exFat to fat32? | Dec 19 16:33 |
| XFaCE | or is the firmware coded to use exFAT specifically for the wear-leveling? | Dec 19 16:33 |
| MinceR | probably intel | Dec 19 16:33 |
| MinceR | maybe micron, if it's effectively the same as intel | Dec 19 16:33 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: if the sdxc drive only supports exfat and you put fat32 there you have confused the wearleveling. Same with the reverse on a SDHC putting exfat on it instead of fat32 you might send that nuts as well. | Dec 19 16:34 |
| cubexyz | ok, as a customer advocate I'll provide a special windows 10 warning: | Dec 19 16:35 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the longest I can stay awake is 6 days. I normally avoid that because then I sleep for 36 hours. | Dec 19 16:35 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/hey-kid-upgrade-to-windows-10.png | Dec 19 16:35 |
| oiaohm | To my body 48 hours just results in 12 hours of sleep. | Dec 19 16:36 |
| cubexyz | whoa, 6 days | Dec 19 16:36 |
| oiaohm | If I am not behind on sleep is nothing strange for me to only sleep 4 hours. | Dec 19 16:36 |
| oiaohm | So yes 48 hours awake does result in me sleeping longer. | Dec 19 16:37 |
| cubexyz | can I ask how old you are? | Dec 19 16:37 |
| XFaCE | oiaohm: so even on fat32 you need a small exfat partition? | Dec 19 16:37 |
| cubexyz | some older folks seem to sleep less | Dec 19 16:37 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: I was this way from 10 years old. | Dec 19 16:37 |
| oiaohm | I am in my thirtys now. | Dec 19 16:38 |
| oiaohm | XFaCE: you need to use the partitiontype the drive supports. | Dec 19 16:38 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the problem with SSD is recovery. | Dec 19 16:38 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: spinning media moves very few sectors around. | Dec 19 16:39 |
| oiaohm | So a controller dies on spinning media there is a very good chance you can have the controller/motor replaced and get the data back. | Dec 19 16:39 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/sleep-chart.png | Dec 19 16:40 |
| oiaohm | SSD with wearleveling the data order on the media might be in the controller. | Dec 19 16:40 |
| cubexyz | I don't think I slept 11 hours when I was 12 | Dec 19 16:41 |
| cubexyz | maybe 8 hours? | Dec 19 16:41 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: basically SSD has way more complex controller so a controller failure is way more leathal. | Dec 19 16:41 |
| oiaohm | Remember no matter how good the drive they controller may be broken by electrical short circut in the computer. | Dec 19 16:42 |
| cubexyz | wouldn't any controller failure just result in a failure? | Dec 19 16:42 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: most spinning media it possible to have the controller replaced. Yes 500 to 1000 dollars but its replaceable,. | Dec 19 16:43 |
| cubexyz | why don't we have that... hard drives with replacement controllers? | Dec 19 16:43 |
| oiaohm | The reality is we do for spinning media. cubexyz | Dec 19 16:44 |
| oiaohm | The issue is wearleveling. | Dec 19 16:44 |
| cubexyz | it says here that most hard drive failures are caused by motor controller chip burn-out | Dec 19 16:44 |
| oiaohm | spinning media does not wearlevel that much. Has limited smart sector replacement and all smart sector replacement data is written to the drive. | Dec 19 16:45 |
| oiaohm | Yes burnt out moter controller on a harddrive is replacemable. | Dec 19 16:45 |
| oiaohm | Just expensive. | Dec 19 16:45 |
| oiaohm | 1 it costs just as much as a full drive for just the controller. | Dec 19 16:45 |
| oiaohm | 2 you have to pay someone to fit it. | Dec 19 16:46 |
| cubexyz | there's no interchangeability of parts it seems | Dec 19 16:48 |
| oiaohm | Old harddrives you could straight up swap the controller. As data has got more complex you need calibration data cubexyz | Dec 19 16:55 |
| cubexyz | how old? | Dec 19 16:56 |
| oiaohm | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yn2eL4o-6Eo up to 2013 breakdown. Of course stuff has changed since 2013. | Dec 19 16:57 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.youtube.com | DIY: Repair Hard Drive PCB. How to swap circuit board ROM chip. - YouTube [ http://ur1.ca/ocpaj ] | Dec 19 16:57 | |
| cubexyz | would seagate sell me just the controller? | Dec 19 16:58 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: the answer is no. To buy controllers without drive is pay into data recovery program with harddrive. | Dec 19 17:01 |
| oiaohm | maker | Dec 19 17:02 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: also being in data recovery you can get calibration controllers. | Dec 19 17:03 |
| oiaohm | cubexyz: calibration controllers for spinning media in lots of cases allows you to regenerate the rom data. | Dec 19 17:04 |
| *oiaohm has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Dec 19 17:27 | |
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| cubexyz | ok.. schestowitz | Dec 19 18:19 |
| cubexyz | http://www.maxhost.org/other/windows-10-botch-up.txt | Dec 19 18:19 |
| cubexyz | he gave me permission to relate his windows 10 experiences | Dec 19 18:19 |
| cubexyz | he won't budge off windows: | Dec 19 18:20 |
| cubexyz | he wants to run: Steam games, Corel Draw X7, Photoshop CS5 , Carrara 3D, Sonar 7, Sibelius 5 | Dec 19 18:20 |
| cubexyz | so that is that | Dec 19 18:21 |
| **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Dec 19 18:30:53 2015 | ||
| *Now talking on #techrights | Dec 19 18:30 | |
| *Topic for #techrights is: TechRights.org | Channel #techrights for http://TechRights.org :: please also join channels #boycottnovell-social #techbytes and #boycottnovell | Dec 19 18:30 | |
| *Topic for #techrights set by schestowitz!~schestowi@unaffiliated/schestowitz at Sat Jun 9 18:16:19 2012 | Dec 19 18:30 | |
| *liberty_box has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) | Dec 19 18:30 | |
| XFaCE | <cubexyz> he wants to run: Steam games, Corel Draw X7, Photoshop CS5 , Carrara 3D, Sonar 7, Sibelius 5 | Dec 19 18:43 |
| XFaCE | 1/6 :P | Dec 19 18:43 |
| cubexyz | I'm sure there are open source equivalents to most if not all of those | Dec 19 18:43 |
| cubexyz | musescore for sibelius maybe | Dec 19 18:44 |
| cubexyz | I'm just amazed he isn't more willing to try alternatives to windows | Dec 19 18:44 |
| cubexyz | at least try the chromebook :-P | Dec 19 18:45 |
| schestowitz | cubexyz: thanks | Dec 19 18:46 |
| cubexyz | anytime :) | Dec 19 18:47 |
| cubexyz | those are his exact words | Dec 19 18:48 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678285239391776769 | Dec 19 18:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @FOSSpatents @schestowitz @Laura_F_ERCOLI @WorldIPReview https://t.co/KUERevktI3 | Dec 19 18:49 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@SciencePorn: Respect. https://t.co/tMqi4gcqid | Dec 19 18:49 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678284567594319872 | Dec 19 18:49 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz Maybe but no need: #epo messed up minds of employees for decades. Rotten chunks might boil up to surface in present turmoil. | Dec 19 18:49 | |
| cubexyz | ok, if I was to run windows I would do it under VMware | Dec 19 19:26 |
| cubexyz | now I'm not doing to do that... but if I _did_ that's the way I would do it | Dec 19 19:27 |
| cubexyz | no way would I trust windows as the main OS | Dec 19 19:27 |
| *sabalmyrak (~lars@cm-84.208.229.82.getinternet.no) has joined #techrights | Dec 19 21:37 | |
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| schestowitz | French letter we translated into English | Dec 19 22:26 |
| schestowitz | http://techrights.org/2015/12/03/attacks-on-staff-representatives/ | Dec 19 22:26 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org | French Member of Parliament Reacts to EPO Management Amidst Ongoing Attacks on Staff Representatives and Facts-free Information War | Techrights [ http://ur1.ca/ocpqa ] | Dec 19 22:26 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/theGuruWithin/status/678326341997977600 https://twitter.com/IntelTpNews/status/678328423257792512 | Dec 19 22:29 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@theGuruWithin: #coderhouse .@OpenELEC .@schestowitz How2make URL autoplay this isn't working .@OBSProject CLR Big ty fr .@nn99org https://t.co/qT5HBYqUnE | Dec 19 22:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> abcnews.go.com | ABC News Video | Dec 19 22:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@IntelTpNews: Answers to Frequently Asked Questions about libreboot https://t.co/MW6aLH7ByD via @schestowitz | Dec 19 22:29 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> gettopical.com | Answers to Frequently Asked Questions about libreboot | Dec 19 22:29 | |
| *sabalmyrak has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!) | Dec 19 22:40 | |
| *XRevan86 (~XRevan86@meowr.ru) has left #techrights | Dec 19 22:42 | |
| schestowitz | https://joindiaspora.com/posts/6920376 | Dec 19 22:59 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: The latest of #kde still sluggish for many https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=289&t=130131 stay with #kde4 for now (if possible) | Dec 19 22:59 | |
| schestowitz | "wow never noticed that delay. But yeah one can reproduce it. Though it isn’t that nasty. I did not notice it until I read that." | Dec 19 22:59 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights--> forum.kde.org | Lag on first opening of plasma 5 elements like calendar, etc • KDE Community Forums [ http://ur1.ca/ocps1 ] | Dec 19 22:59 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/KrapulaPhD/status/678284567594319872?cn=cmVwbHk%3D&refsrc=email | Dec 19 23:03 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@KrapulaPhD: @schestowitz Maybe but no need: #epo messed up minds of employees for decades. Rotten chunks might boil up to surface in present turmoil. | Dec 19 23:03 | |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/BrideOfLinux/status/678358306826690560 | Dec 19 23:41 |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@BrideOfLinux: Scratching the surface of what's wrong with Jolla... https://t.co/GnAnNFs7I6 | Dec 19 23:41 | |
| -TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: What is wrong with Jolla? https://t.co/ochSOsP6w1 the UI and the apps are all proprietary for one thing. #jolla #linux | Dec 19 23:41 | |
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