| neighborlee | schestowitz, thx indeed | Aug 20 19:07 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: for Mono? | Aug 20 19:07 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: no | Aug 20 19:08 |
|---|
| neighborlee | self_liar, I wont use anything not 100% free, which gtk is ( except now its tarnished with .net crud) | Aug 20 19:08 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: kde without mono is great | Aug 20 19:08 |
|---|
| schestowitz | KDE had no Mono commits in the last report (hooks from Richard Dale). I keep an eye on it. | Aug 20 19:08 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: kde with mono is not good | Aug 20 19:08 |
|---|
| neighborlee | not that aI dont 'respet' what kde offers, but atm its encubmered IMHO, with qt | Aug 20 19:08 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: sorry for my bad english | Aug 20 19:08 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: it's all right. | Aug 20 19:09 |
|---|
| schestowitz | PJ is also concerned about Mono/OOXML/KDE | Aug 20 19:09 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Novell is likely to try to spread Mono. It's its 'added value' | Aug 20 19:09 |
|---|
| neighborlee | eek gad,,yes im sure of it | Aug 20 19:09 |
|---|
| self_liar | novell buy mattias family , im afraid of this | Aug 20 19:10 |
|---|
| neighborlee | and remember due to the M$/novel deal, they spread word about M$ stuff,,as does M$ for linux..supposedly.. | Aug 20 19:10 |
|---|
| schestowitz | As illustrated in my pictures, which is now on ZDnet (http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=2803 ) | Aug 20 19:10 |
|---|
| schestowitz | mattias family?? | Aug 20 19:10 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: mattias etrich ,the founder of kde and amarok | Aug 20 19:10 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Oh! | Aug 20 19:11 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: matthis ettrich | Aug 20 19:11 |
|---|
| benJIman | neighborlee: No more encumbered than linux. | Aug 20 19:11 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: *matthias ettrich | Aug 20 19:11 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Of course... is he still vocal? I saw him in an EFYTimes article, but his friends seem to have taken the stage. | Aug 20 19:11 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Novell is also promoting Microsoft technologies, which harms everyone like Sun and IBM (ODF, Java, etc,). | Aug 20 19:12 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: the go-oo site attacks open office in silence | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| neighborlee | benJIman, no I mean gtk vs qt | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| benJIman | neighborlee: What do you mean? | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| benJIman | Qt is GPLed, so is Linux. | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| neighborlee | no | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| neighborlee | its not gpl for windows | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| neighborlee | err | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| neighborlee | crap | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| neighborlee | I mean for commercial usage | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| benJIman | neighborlee: Wrong, it is GPL for windows too. | Aug 20 19:13 |
|---|
| neighborlee | yes | Aug 20 19:14 |
|---|
| neighborlee | I mean for commercial usage | Aug 20 19:14 |
|---|
| benJIman | You can write commercial GPL applications of course. | Aug 20 19:14 |
|---|
| neighborlee | its just that gtk gives you the power to do what you wish with it | Aug 20 19:14 |
|---|
| neighborlee | to me thats total freedom | Aug 20 19:14 |
|---|
| benJIman | Linux is GPLed too, so people are not allowed to distribute proprietary drivers for it. | Aug 20 19:14 |
|---|
| neighborlee | then the user decides from there | Aug 20 19:14 |
|---|
| benJIman | So why do you use linux? Shouldn't you be using bsd? | Aug 20 19:14 |
|---|
| neighborlee | most likely yes indeed, good point. | Aug 20 19:15 |
|---|
| neighborlee | but I can't | Aug 20 19:15 |
|---|
| neighborlee | I dont trust it | Aug 20 19:15 |
|---|
| neighborlee | I dont trust many things about bsd | Aug 20 19:15 |
|---|
| self_liar | I don t like to use linux as example of free software | Aug 20 19:15 |
|---|
| self_liar | linus et al. are corrupted | Aug 20 19:15 |
|---|
| neighborlee | woah nellie ;)))) | Aug 20 19:16 |
|---|
| neighborlee | but hey, if you have proof im willing to listen, as always ! | Aug 20 19:16 |
|---|
| self_liar | The linux "foundation" does not help free software comunnity | Aug 20 19:16 |
|---|
| Tallken | I like Linus | Aug 20 19:16 |
|---|
| self_liar | self_liar: canonical now helps linux foundation | Aug 20 19:16 |
|---|
| self_liar | oops ,a mistake | Aug 20 19:16 |
|---|
| neighborlee | we know they dont help kernel..or is that what you were getting at ?? | Aug 20 19:17 |
|---|
| self_liar | Linus is false,in revolution os ,he uses a reilly open source t-shirt | Aug 20 19:17 |
|---|
| neighborlee | lol | Aug 20 19:17 |
|---|
| self_liar | self_liar: linux "foundation" gains all credit about free software | Aug 20 19:18 |
|---|
| self_liar | oops a mistake again | Aug 20 19:18 |
|---|
| self_liar | the "foundation" does not consider problems like novell and microsoft | Aug 20 19:19 |
|---|
| self_liar | for them all is "technical decisions" | Aug 20 19:19 |
|---|
| self_liar | business decisions | Aug 20 19:19 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I don't trust the LF, either., | Aug 20 19:19 |
|---|
| self_liar | for example reiser4 | Aug 20 19:19 |
|---|
| self_liar | I like the filesystem | Aug 20 19:19 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Come to consider the fact that IBM endorsed the Novell/Microsoft deal. They try to dilute and ruin Free software, then take just the code. Watch the recent Lotus move. | Aug 20 19:20 |
|---|
| neighborlee | self_liar, I never had trouble running reiserfs come to think o fit yes | Aug 20 19:20 |
|---|
| self_liar | but novell ,IBM and intel enforces do not use a software from prisioneer | Aug 20 19:20 |
|---|
| neighborlee | self_liar, faster as well.,I wonder about #4 | Aug 20 19:20 |
|---|
| schestowitz | On my SUSE 8.1, Resier lasted fine for 3+ years. | Aug 20 19:20 |
|---|
| self_liar | and then the linux "foundation" uses a technical argument | Aug 20 19:20 |
|---|
| schestowitz | *Reiser I mean. | Aug 20 19:20 |
|---|
| neighborlee | schestowitz, sweet | Aug 20 19:21 |
|---|
| self_liar | "reseifs is not good ,blabal" | Aug 20 19:21 |
|---|
| neighborlee | really ?? | Aug 20 19:21 |
|---|
| neighborlee | woah | Aug 20 19:21 |
|---|
| neighborlee | missed that | Aug 20 19:21 |
|---|
| self_liar | only 1 developer support reiser4 with patches | Aug 20 19:21 |
|---|
| self_liar | andrew morton | Aug 20 19:21 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Taser taitned by Microsoft now: http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/bus... | Aug 20 19:22 |
|---|
| schestowitz | "TASER International's products protect life. TASER provides advanced Electronic Control Devices (ECDs) for use in the law enforcement, medical, military, corrections, professional security, and personal protection markets. TASER devices use proprietary technology to incapacitate dangerous, combative, or high-risk subjects who pose a risk to law enforcement officers, innocent citizens, or themselves in a manner that is generally re | Aug 20 19:22 |
|---|
| schestowitz | cognized as a safer alternative to other uses of force." | Aug 20 19:22 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Watch this or make a mental note in case they procure from Ballmer and the Boys in the future. | Aug 20 19:23 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: If softwate community destroy m$ in 25 years , m$ can not do this | Aug 20 19:25 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The disease is spreading (XAML): http://www.marketwatch.com/news/stor... | Aug 20 19:25 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Microsoft is weakened by many things. The worst that can happen now is FOSS developers going into bed with Microsoft.You know, like Novell did. It colluded. | Aug 20 19:26 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: damn ,it's bad! | Aug 20 19:26 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: toyota is a very respected company in japan | Aug 20 19:26 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Not that bad. Microsoft is still losing. | Aug 20 19:27 |
|---|
| schestowitz | MSFT lost over $100 billion in value in less than one year. | Aug 20 19:27 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: i know | Aug 20 19:27 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Earlier I saw Pearly (Gates) and that other man who puts its stash in that tax-free haven (Fundation [sic]) taking a tour to Canada together. They still play politics. | Aug 20 19:27 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I was shocked but not surprised to hear that Gates also wants government control (and this time not by proxy). | Aug 20 19:28 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz:heh like the "terminator"? | Aug 20 19:29 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I haven't seen it since I was a kid, so I can't remember. | Aug 20 19:29 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Here's another boot-licking piece (too many of them today): http://directmag.com/opinions-columnists/l... | Aug 20 19:31 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Okay, so another Microsoft senior abandoned the ship. http://rcpmag.com/news/article... | Aug 20 19:33 |
|---|
| neighborlee | self_liar, hmm wow I had no idea andrew was supportin g that..thats very huge. | Aug 20 19:33 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: why this exodus happen? | Aug 20 19:34 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Someone still maintains reiserfs. kerneltrap reported on that last week. | Aug 20 19:34 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: lots of the seniors leave because Microsoft is past its days of glory. They go backwards now, not forward. So seniors move on to new challenges. | Aug 20 19:35 |
|---|
| neighborlee | so , is hans actually in jail for life, I lost track of all that mess | Aug 20 19:35 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The issue is the trail you have left of former-Softies. They 'poison' other companies by acting as insiders. Watch Xen and VMWare for example. Microsoft managers there... | Aug 20 19:35 |
|---|
| schestowitz | They should rename his FS or something. | Aug 20 19:36 |
|---|
| neighborlee | heh | Aug 20 19:36 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: ok,but for me it's very strange | Aug 20 19:36 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: I was thinking..... | Aug 20 19:38 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: developed countries is a lot more easy to use GNU linux than in developing countries | Aug 20 19:38 |
|---|
| neighborlee | to them, free matters alot ;) | Aug 20 19:39 |
|---|
| neighborlee | open source I should say. | Aug 20 19:39 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: in Brazil for example, more than 70% linux computers is changed for windowz pirated edition | Aug 20 19:39 |
|---|
| neighborlee | you mean they use windows pirated instead ? | Aug 20 19:39 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: yes, true. The rich ones will upgrade to FOSS last. | Aug 20 19:39 |
|---|
| self_liar | neighborlee: no | Aug 20 19:40 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: just watch how the CH-based ISO gave the finger to developing countries. | Aug 20 19:40 |
|---|
| neighborlee | self_liar, ok sorry your grammar had me confused a bit | Aug 20 19:40 |
|---|
| self_liar | neighborlee: ok | Aug 20 19:40 |
|---|
| self_liar | neighborlee: a lot of people buy pcs with linux | Aug 20 19:40 |
|---|
| self_liar | self_liar: it's more cheap and more powerful pcs | Aug 20 19:41 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Hahaha. Watch the spin: | Aug 20 19:41 |
|---|
| schestowitz | http://www.adweek.com/aw/content_dis... | Aug 20 19:41 |
|---|
| self_liar | neighborlee: but a lot of people in one month changes for windowz | Aug 20 19:41 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The search business goes down every month and they say "it's only the beginning." Any plan? No. Yahoo? No. But it's still "Early". | Aug 20 19:41 |
|---|
| self_liar | neighborlee: you know ,addiction, the poor people does not know about free software | Aug 20 19:42 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: how many people do you estimate use Linux (at some capacity) where you are? | Aug 20 19:42 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Recently I found that in a college in the US, 15-25% are said to be GNU/Linux users. | Aug 20 19:42 |
|---|
| self_liar | neighborlee: 8 percent i guess, at long time | Aug 20 19:42 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Where is that, roughly? | Aug 20 19:43 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I saw some massive downloads of some distros I never heard about. Like 14 million in Brazil. | Aug 20 19:43 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: but the exodus rate is very high | Aug 20 19:43 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Hold on... | Aug 20 19:44 |
|---|
| schestowitz | It's out of date but good nonetheless: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/01/2... | Aug 20 19:44 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: a lot of people use linux because is better or give more knowledge | Aug 20 19:45 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: it's not because freedoom | Aug 20 19:45 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: they do not know nothing about GNU | Aug 20 19:46 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: for me this is very BAD, | Aug 20 19:46 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The press is _FILLED_ with this non-announcement < http://www.nytimes.com/idg/IDG_852573C400... >. W.E. must be busy pressuring journos to hype up HyperV. | Aug 20 19:46 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: only 8 percent (about 15 million) uses linux | Aug 20 19:46 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: had the press not been ignoring the adoption of FOSS in developing nations (rather than claim 90%+ for Microsoft, ignoring all but desktop), then RMS and his message would spread wider. | Aug 20 19:47 |
|---|
| neighborlee | well, its going to take time , with those not pooor for the option to catch on | Aug 20 19:47 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Which country is it, self_liar ? | Aug 20 19:47 |
|---|
| neighborlee | because windows for many, is adequate..people want a reason to switch | Aug 20 19:47 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz:for me windowz it'not adequate | Aug 20 19:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | neighborlee: if you're in AU (not sure), then expect people to switch last. Developing countries are key. Gates and other 'dug dealers' admit this when they talk about 'addicting' children. | Aug 20 19:48 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: and all windowz in desktop here is pirated | Aug 20 19:48 |
|---|
| neighborlee | schestowitz, yup | Aug 20 19:49 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: like the cigarretes campaing | Aug 20 19:49 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: Microsoft makes little money in developing counties. It relies on those countries for "de facto standard" status. | Aug 20 19:49 |
|---|
| neighborlee | yeah...very insideous | Aug 20 19:49 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I could show you memos Microsoft sends about treating 'piracy' in Brazil. It's ugly. | Aug 20 19:49 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: can you show the memos? | Aug 20 19:50 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Yes, I can try. I posted some in BN, but with 3700 posts it'll take time to find. | Aug 20 19:51 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: oh ,don t worry | Aug 20 19:51 |
|---|
| *moparx (n=moparx@pdpc/supporter/base/moparx) has joined #boycottnovell | Aug 20 19:51 |
| self_liar | schestowitz: i will find ,it's not need to show | Aug 20 19:51 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Try finding one from Joachim. | Aug 20 19:51 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Joachim Kempin, that's the chief with the dirty mouth. He shot down animals to death and got arrested some years ago. | Aug 20 19:52 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: ok ,thanks ,i will find | Aug 20 19:52 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Big Brother Ballmer just found: http://www.alleyinsider.com/2008/8/microsoft... | Aug 20 19:53 |
|---|
| schestowitz | What makes this < http://blog.wired.com/business/... > laughable is the smears Microsoft uses against Google, claiming it is the devil for spying. Microsoft has off-site spyware as well: IE, Windows. | Aug 20 19:55 |
|---|
| MinceR | they're both the devil for spying | Aug 20 19:56 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Microsoft turns WMP to spyware because of RealNetworks, according to RMS. | Aug 20 19:56 |
|---|
| schestowitz | "But he started it!!!" Great logic right there. | Aug 20 19:56 |
|---|
| MinceR | :D | Aug 20 19:57 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Lot of Windows 7 vapouware announcements I see among the headlines right now (I bring them up as I go along very quickly :-) ). | Aug 20 19:57 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: look at the wine page about homogeneous population | Aug 20 19:58 |
|---|
| schestowitz | They must be feeling the heat if they make false promises. In their own words:In the face of strong competition, Evangelism's focus may shift immediately to the next version of the same technology, however. Indeed, Phase 1 (Evangelism Starts) for version x+1 may start as soon as this Final Release of version X." http://www.groklaw.net/pdf/Comes-3096.pdf | Aug 20 19:58 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Got URL? | Aug 20 19:58 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: wait a moment | Aug 20 19:59 |
|---|
| schestowitz | MS goes bio-spying: http://www.itnews.com.au/News/828... | Aug 20 19:59 |
|---|
| self_liar | http://www.winehq.org/site/why | Aug 20 19:59 |
|---|
| self_liar | Yet, The US Department of Justice has "found" that Microsoft Windows is run by more than 95% of personal computers. Even taking Apple's Mac OS into account, Microsoft Windows is still present on more than 80% of computers, and this is likely also true in most other countries, not just in the US. Thus governments, companies and home users all over the world ultimately depend on a single provider: Microsoft. | Aug 20 19:59 |
|---|
| *Tallken has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) | Aug 20 20:00 |
| *schestowitz looks | Aug 20 20:00 |
| self_liar | http://www.usdoj.gov/atr/cases/f... | Aug 20 20:00 |
|---|
| schestowitz | A Web page for USDoJ is nice. Action would be nicer. DoJ is corrupt. | Aug 20 20:01 |
|---|
| schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2007/10/23... | Aug 20 20:01 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz:M$ always spy users ,a lot of time | Aug 20 20:03 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz:windows, update, windows media player, IE, windows search | Aug 20 20:03 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Here'e ZeeDee defending Microsoft with gentle words: http://www.electronista.com/arti... http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=1533 Yeah, like Gates, who invites the Chinese leaders to his house, can't intercept justice. This is ridiculous. And they contact the FTC in Taiwan. The FTC too is corrupt. Majoras et al... | Aug 20 20:05 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: Yes, I know. Companies follow each others' bad standards and the sufferers are all of us. | Aug 20 20:06 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz:in my coutry a lot of people are stupid | Aug 20 20:07 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Some time ago I sent GL a headsup about Microsoft bloggers joining forces to spread marketing across the Web. I wonder if this news is related: http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource... | Aug 20 20:07 |
|---|
| schestowitz | 'professional'-grade astroturfing? | Aug 20 20:08 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: stupidity is everywhere. It's a matter of focus. I'm stupid when it comes to lots of things. | Aug 20 20:08 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: yes , but my people attacks the goverment instead of microsoft | Aug 20 20:09 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The key is for techies to engage in coversation with -- say --- football buffs and explain to them about what we know better. | Aug 20 20:09 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Same with pol;itics. Propaganda terms are used by the MAFIAA and software companies to pass new laws that politicians (lawyers) just can't understand. | Aug 20 20:10 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Is it Brazil? | Aug 20 20:10 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: yes | Aug 20 20:10 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Gilberto Gill is a hero. | Aug 20 20:10 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: for example | Aug 20 20:10 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Gil | Aug 20 20:10 |
|---|
| schestowitz | He should be made PM, not minister of culture. A country needs culture, not lawyers and economists. | Aug 20 20:11 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: Ther a law here which enforce all ISP backup infos about users | Aug 20 20:11 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: for me it's not a great problem | Aug 20 20:11 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: microsoft always do this | Aug 20 20:12 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Videos @ | Aug 20 20:12 |
|---|
| schestowitz | http://www.archive.org/search.ph... | Aug 20 20:12 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: but my people hate de goverment instead of microsoft | Aug 20 20:12 |
|---|
| schestowitz | self_liar: I was going to write about it today. I posted 2 links about the situation in Brazil yesterday. | Aug 20 20:12 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Gates visited Brazil some time ago. I think he signed some 'special' deal. | Aug 20 20:13 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: do you know about this? | Aug 20 20:14 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Description of the original: Bill Gates and Brazilian President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva in Davos. Photo:ABr. Date:Jan/26/2003. http://commons.wikimedia... | Aug 20 20:14 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I don't know much about the relationships there, no. | Aug 20 20:15 |
|---|
| self_liar | schestowitz: i will find more info about this | Aug 20 20:15 |
|---|
| self_liar | i need to go | Aug 20 20:15 |
|---|
| self_liar | bye | Aug 20 20:15 |
|---|
| schestowitz | See you. | Aug 20 20:15 |
|---|
| *self_liar has quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") | Aug 20 20:16 |
| schestowitz | A Microsoft exec takes over VMWarer and h00pla! http://www.internetnews.com/bus-news/ar... "VMware, Microsoft Decide to Play Nice [...] Virtualization newbie Microsoft and market leader VMware play nice, up to a point, with validation program. " | Aug 20 20:18 |
|---|
| neighborlee | schestowitz, isn't a big part of defense of mono, that to legally abide with using it you must download from novel, which violates gpl ,,or am I missing something as im getting ready to post something on ubuntu | Aug 20 20:21 |
|---|
| neighborlee | its tricky following all of this and looking like you know what your talking about LOL | Aug 20 20:21 |
|---|
| schestowitz | No, that's Moonlight. | Aug 20 20:21 |
|---|
| neighborlee | sigh | Aug 20 20:21 |
|---|
| neighborlee | no i mean the novel/M$ deal | Aug 20 20:21 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Moonight you need to get from Novell and 'protection' is not there. Mono is another issue and the lead developer/manager of the Silverlight team admitted that Mono is only 'safe' for Novell customers. | Aug 20 20:23 |
|---|
| neighborlee | ok so it applies to both them | Aug 20 20:23 |
|---|
| neighborlee | ok so it applies to both then | Aug 20 20:23 |
|---|
| neighborlee | ok thx | Aug 20 20:23 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Blech! http://www.networkworld.com/news/2... http://news.zdnet.co.uk/softwar... | Aug 20 20:24 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Yes, in a way. Moonlight depends on Mono, too. | Aug 20 20:24 |
|---|
| neighborlee | do you have url for where silverlight manager admitted this mono thing | Aug 20 20:25 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Yes, hold on. | Aug 20 20:25 |
|---|
| neighborlee | kewl thx | Aug 20 20:25 |
|---|
| schestowitz | “Moonlight is usable for anyone on any distribution of Linux (redhat, ubuntu, etc.) — it is not limited just to Novell as Mono is.” | Aug 20 20:26 |
|---|
| schestowitz | -Brian Goldfarb [Microsoft] | Aug 20 20:26 |
|---|
| schestowitz | It's in ZDNet. | Aug 20 20:26 |
|---|
| *Ziggyfish has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) | Aug 20 20:26 |
| schestowitz | http://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-105... | Aug 20 20:26 |
|---|
| neighborlee | ok thx | Aug 20 20:27 |
|---|
| schestowitz | This links should work: http://talkback.zdnet.com/52... | Aug 20 20:28 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Grrrrr.... once again Microsoft uses Bollywood to play up its products. Yash Raj Films Partners with Microsoft Xbox 360 for Bachna Ae Haseeno - http://www.gameguru.in/microsoft-xbo... | Aug 20 20:30 |
|---|
| neighborlee | well | Aug 20 20:36 |
|---|
| neighborlee | they are doing what they can to ressurerect a dieing breed | Aug 20 20:36 |
|---|
| neighborlee | Wii is ruling them all atm, faict | Aug 20 20:36 |
|---|
| neighborlee | between wii, wiifit, wiisports etc.,etc, and the much lower price I think they are all sufffering quite alot. | Aug 20 20:37 |
|---|
| neighborlee | I know, having a wii, how incredibly immersive it is ;)) | Aug 20 20:37 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I would choose a Wii | Aug 20 20:37 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The controller makes it a new experience. | Aug 20 20:37 |
|---|
| neighborlee | thats what did it for me yes | Aug 20 20:38 |
|---|
| neighborlee | that and the accessible simple'ish gameplay for everyone | Aug 20 20:38 |
|---|
| neighborlee | simple but quite effective. | Aug 20 20:38 |
|---|
| neighborlee | wiisports I mean | Aug 20 20:38 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The world needs a new paradigm... adults anyway. | Aug 20 20:40 |
|---|
| neighborlee | well I never understood really , why having fun had to mean gore and blood and violence | Aug 20 20:41 |
|---|
| neighborlee | its so not the case..ask any tennis player ;) | Aug 20 20:41 |
|---|
| *neighborlee of whom is one, since age 16 :)) | Aug 20 20:42 |
| neighborlee | thats how wii hooked me ;))hah | Aug 20 20:42 |
|---|
| neighborlee | line and sinker LOL | Aug 20 20:42 |
|---|
| neighborlee | ive had it for over a year now , and I still love playing wiitennis, its that much fun ;)) | Aug 20 20:42 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Violent games can be fun too. But the militgary fantasies are telly-imposed, I think. | Aug 20 20:42 |
|---|
| neighborlee | well society is used to violent games, even though really one must admit they have no redeeming social value ;) | Aug 20 20:43 |
|---|
| neighborlee | but yes clearly many are hooked on them for varoius reasons. | Aug 20 20:43 |
|---|
| neighborlee | I didn't grow up with a computer or such games..boring board games, so I was never hooked as the young of today are | Aug 20 20:44 |
|---|
| neighborlee | trends | Aug 20 20:45 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Mcirosoft is renowned for gore and violence... and sexual content. it gets in trouble for it. | Aug 20 20:45 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Though I could list some examples here... | Aug 20 20:45 |
|---|
| neighborlee | wasn't aware of that at all | Aug 20 20:45 |
|---|
| neighborlee | interesting | Aug 20 20:46 |
|---|
| neighborlee | be nice if games that had such things, at least let you toggle them off | Aug 20 20:46 |
|---|
| neighborlee | I can think of one game offhand that does..UT2004 | Aug 20 20:46 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I'll get your some readings... | Aug 20 20:46 |
|---|
| neighborlee | kewl | Aug 20 20:46 |
|---|
| schestowitz | British Government Fires Back at EA & Microsoft: http://www.thegamereviews.com/stor... | Aug 20 20:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Halo 3 Korea Promotion Part 2 ~ ver1~ : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ld... | Aug 20 20:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Microsoft XBox Banned Commercials: http://www.mall.hk/news/2007/08/2... | Aug 20 20:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | UK advertising authority nixes Xbox 360 spot: http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/mic... | Aug 20 20:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Viral Marketing Leads to Mock Gunfight: http://www.onthexbox.com/news981.html | Aug 20 20:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | WhatsWrongWithU: http://www.armchairempire.com/News/?p=187 | Aug 20 20:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Those Microsoft Vista ads are really bizarre: http://www.adjab.com/2007/01/15/t... | Aug 20 20:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Former Miss Austrlia to sex up IT industry: http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/4157506a28.html | Aug 20 20:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | So THIS is why people want Windows! : http://wolfgang.lonien.de/?p=388 | Aug 20 20:48 |
|---|
| neighborlee | this mono thing from M$ silverlight lead show totallly put an end to this whole 'mono is ecma standard' thing right ??? | Aug 20 20:49 |
|---|
| neighborlee | if im understanding all this | Aug 20 20:50 |
|---|
| neighborlee | its just alot to process ;) | Aug 20 20:50 |
|---|
| neighborlee | even so, it violates gpl by making you get source from one location , if I read correctly. | Aug 20 20:51 |
|---|
| schestowitz | neighborlee yes, Moonlight is analysed in Groklaw, too. The SFLC does not like it. | Aug 20 20:51 |
|---|
| schestowitz | neighborlee: Moonlight needs binary codecs for compatibility. That's downstream code (well, binary) from Mcirosoft. | Aug 20 20:52 |
|---|
| neighborlee | EEK | Aug 20 20:52 |
|---|
| neighborlee | talk about a mess LOL | Aug 20 20:52 |
|---|
| neighborlee | ohhh but its ok to use LOL | Aug 20 20:52 |
|---|
| neighborlee | it just keeps getting better ;) | Aug 20 20:52 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Are you discussing this in Ubuntu Forums? | Aug 20 20:53 |
|---|
| neighborlee | not yet | Aug 20 20:53 |
|---|
| neighborlee | I was preparing properly to avoid ambush :)-0 | Aug 20 20:53 |
|---|
| neighborlee | http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=... | Aug 20 20:54 |
|---|
| neighborlee | need to rsepoind toLaRoza ,,who claims mono follows ecma standard lol | Aug 20 20:54 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Watch this troll comment: http://digg.com/linux_unix/Gno... | Aug 20 20:55 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I spotted it after seeing this article: http://www.linux.com/feed/145352 | Aug 20 20:56 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I'm sick on Mono boosters on the Web. Some are paid "Evangelist" from Microsoft. I saw some signing that way when boosting Silverlight. | Aug 20 20:56 |
|---|
| trmanco | I've heard that there is a new version of moonlight | Aug 20 21:01 |
|---|
| trmanco | Looks like the team developing it is all fired up *shame* | Aug 20 21:02 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I've also heard there's a new pickle in the neighbour's jar. :-) | Aug 20 21:02 |
|---|
| trmanco | :P | Aug 20 21:02 |
|---|
| schestowitz | What do you mean by fired up? | Aug 20 21:03 |
|---|
| trmanco | they are really on to it | Aug 20 21:03 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Actually, based on Jason Perlow's coversation with Miguel, things stood in the way and Moonlight _LOST_ steam. | Aug 20 21:03 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I can find this if needed. | Aug 20 21:03 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Found it. "And sadly, there are very few people willing to contribute to make this happen on time.”" | Aug 20 21:05 |
|---|
| trmanco | sure, I would love to take a peak on that, if you don't mind finding it | Aug 20 21:05 |
|---|
| schestowitz | http://blogs.zdnet.com/perlow/?p=9214 | Aug 20 21:05 |
|---|
| trmanco | thanks | Aug 20 21:05 |
|---|
| schestowitz | But right now, Moonlight only supports Silverlight 1.0 apps, and NBCOlympics.com is implemented using 2.0. As Novell’s chief Mono/Moonlight developer, Miguel de Icaza told me several weeks ago before the NBCOlympics content launch, “Work on this has started, but it will take a lot of work. And sadly, there are very few people willing to contribute to make this happen on time.” | Aug 20 21:05 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I hope that some SUSE/Novell devs will sober up and realise what they do to F/LOSS | Aug 20 21:06 |
|---|
| trmanco | “Work on this has started, but it will take a lot of work. And sadly, there are very few people willing to contribute to make this happen on time.” oh really, no wonder :| | Aug 20 21:07 |
|---|
| trmanco | who is going to contribute to such a thing? | Aug 20 21:07 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Microsoft? | Aug 20 21:08 |
|---|
| trmanco | well, yes | Aug 20 21:08 |
|---|
| trmanco | but they are the creators, right? | Aug 20 21:09 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I don't know if they put money into it, but they sure give documentation. They need Novell to pretend that Silverlight is crossplatform**, for the regulators. | Aug 20 21:09 |
|---|
| trmanco | *pretend* :) | Aug 20 21:09 |
|---|
| schestowitz | [**] (small prints - just some trashy second-class catch-up work because GNU/Linux is Microsoft's #1 threat to sabotage). | Aug 20 21:09 |
|---|
| neighborlee | schestowitz, what LOL | Aug 20 21:10 |
|---|
| neighborlee | thougy I do like pickles lol | Aug 20 21:10 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Well, the neighbour's pickle you can't have. Ballmer would wrestle you for it. | Aug 20 21:13 |
|---|
| schestowitz | And that's Moonlight. It's a piece of cheese in an open................. bear trap. | Aug 20 21:14 |
|---|
| trmanco | Remember when Ballmer was received in Hungary with eggs thrown at his face? | Aug 20 21:16 |
|---|
| *MinceR remembers | Aug 20 21:17 |
| MinceR | (i'm hungarian) | Aug 20 21:17 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Hahaha, http://lxer.com/module/forums/t/27688/ | Aug 20 21:17 |
|---|
| trmanco | Well, I loved that | Aug 20 21:17 |
|---|
| schestowitz | MinceR: seen the latest action against MS i Hungary? Just days/weeks old... | Aug 20 21:18 |
|---|
| trmanco | I hope it happens more often, but with different *objects* | Aug 20 21:18 |
|---|
| trmanco | schestowitz: you are getting famous | Aug 20 21:18 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Na... in LXer there was some BN haters. | Aug 20 21:19 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The good news is that *EVEN* LXer is changing its view. | Aug 20 21:19 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The people in Linux Today, by contast, seem to love my posts most of the time. Digg also. It's just some people in LXer who defend(ed) Mono. | Aug 20 21:19 |
|---|
| trmanco | maybe devs? | Aug 20 21:20 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Maybe. I don't know them. | Aug 20 21:20 |
|---|
| trmanco | or some people contributing to the m*no project | Aug 20 21:20 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Some are German, so they are protective of S.u.S.E. | Aug 20 21:20 |
|---|
| MinceR | i'm not sure which action was latest | Aug 20 21:21 |
|---|
| schestowitz | In FSDaily it's a different story. There's no defence of Novell there. Same in Linux Today. I don't know why, but the crowds are different. Groklaw people are also OK with BN. | Aug 20 21:21 |
|---|
| trmanco | SuSe use te be a good distro a couple of years back | Aug 20 21:21 |
|---|
| schestowitz | It still is, technically speaking. | Aug 20 21:21 |
|---|
| trmanco | well yes | Aug 20 21:21 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Susan Linton reckons it's better than Mandriva ATM, having been the opposite a year ago. | Aug 20 21:22 |
|---|
| trmanco | to bad the company supporting it is going to the wrong side | Aug 20 21:22 |
|---|
| schestowitz | it's not surprising. | Aug 20 21:22 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Microsoft needed to grab a potetial leader | Aug 20 21:22 |
|---|
| schestowitz | *potential | Aug 20 21:22 |
|---|
| trmanco | I can still remember when a teacher of mine told me that Novell was an awesome to the GNU/Linux community | Aug 20 21:23 |
|---|
| schestowitz | "hIt's just business for Microsoft, and business is better when Linux is limping. So Microsoft is trying to kill off the Linux market leader by giving Novell a compelling differentiator. The day that Novell becomes a threat to Microsoft's business, however, is the day that the deal is shut down." ttp://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10020866-16.html | Aug 20 21:23 |
|---|
| MinceR | afaik suse has always been reputed to be a bad distro | Aug 20 21:23 |
|---|
| schestowitz | http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10... | Aug 20 21:23 |
|---|
| trmanco | MinceR: not here | Aug 20 21:23 |
|---|
| schestowitz | No, not as far as I know. It's advanced. Was always KDE-based, admins-oriented. | Aug 20 21:23 |
|---|
| schestowitz | That's why I like Juna's blog: http://www.junauza.com/2008/08/... | Aug 20 21:25 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Wow! This is big: http://www.groklaw.net/artic... | Aug 20 21:29 |
|---|
| schestowitz | "SCO was enjoined from making certain claims in Germany, and it signed an agreement in 2003 not to say them there, because its alternate choice was to have to prove them immediately, so it chose silence. As a result, SCO can't say in Germany that Linux violates SCO's IP or that end users could be liable for violations of SCO's intellectual property or that Linux is an unauthorized derivative of UNIX. Unless it can prove it." | Aug 20 21:29 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I knew about these German laws. If true and generally applicable, Microsoft can be sued for slander (against Linux) in Germany. | Aug 20 21:30 |
|---|
| trmanco | I hope so | Aug 20 21:30 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I have a PDF somewhere which talks about this German law (should be expanded elsewhere). | Aug 20 21:30 |
|---|
| neighborlee | welll, yes suse is a lovely installer,,but too bad their political ties or backwards indeed | Aug 20 21:31 |
|---|
| schestowitz | If SCO was working at the behest of Microsoft, that's another potential fine and public embarrassment that exceeds SCO's balance sheet (pink slip). | Aug 20 21:31 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I had SUSE on all my machines before the deal was signed. | Aug 20 21:31 |
|---|
| schestowitz | The most impactful writeup (for me at least) was the post from Bruce Perens. Later came his petition. | Aug 20 21:31 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Weird and inaccurate pick for Susan's standards... strange: v | Aug 20 21:37 |
|---|
| schestowitz | http://blackravenplace.net76.net/blog6... | Aug 20 21:37 |
|---|
| schestowitz | This guy mentions BoycottNovell, but it's not the first time that he criticises the site. Whatever. Let him defend Mono. http://blog.ibeentoubuntu.com/2008/08/fanb... | Aug 20 21:38 |
|---|
| twitter | yes, shame on Intel. | Aug 20 22:17 |
|---|
| *schestowitz runs AMD. Twice. Dual. AMD is no saint, but the lesser of the two evils. | Aug 20 22:18 |
| *Ziggyfish (n=brendan@123-243-163-103.static.tpgi.com.au) has joined #boycottnovell | Aug 20 22:18 |
| neighborlee | well at least they now own ati, which is trying to work with oss...im curious if it will cause nvida to consider similar options | Aug 20 22:33 |
|---|
| trmanco | a have an intel cpu and an ati graphics card :| | Aug 20 22:34 |
|---|
| schestowitz | AMD has just added overclocking support. | Aug 20 22:34 |
|---|
| trmanco | when I bought mu computer I never heard of FOSS | Aug 20 22:35 |
|---|
| trmanco | :| | Aug 20 22:35 |
|---|
| trmanco | my* | Aug 20 22:35 |
|---|
| MinceR | i have an intel cpu and an nvidia gpu | Aug 20 22:36 |
|---|
| twitter | Here's more money down the corruption hole: http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=... | Aug 20 22:38 |
|---|
| schestowitz | \At least boycottnovell is mentioned, so they don't get away without criticism. | Aug 20 22:40 |
|---|
| twitter | where? | Aug 20 22:45 |
|---|
| schestowitz | I saw one hypelinks and som e text. I didn't unfold any comments though. We always appear somewhere in /. when there's a story about Novell. Sometimes Shane jumps in too. | Aug 20 22:46 |
|---|
| twitter | comments look like a crap flood to me. One AC, way down, linked to BN. You had to go through some really nasty stuff to get there. | Aug 20 22:48 |
|---|
| schestowitz | What nasty stuff? I didn't read. I just did a "find as you type". | Aug 20 22:49 |
|---|
| twitter | The second post, http://slashdot.org/comments.pl... | Aug 20 22:49 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Slashdot should ban and delete again. Didn't they 'clean up'? | Aug 20 22:51 |
|---|
| twitter | :) here's a nice top post: http://slashdot.org/comments.pl... | Aug 20 22:57 |
|---|
| twitter | ha ha. | Aug 20 22:57 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Is that you?!? | Aug 20 22:58 |
|---|
| twitter | Sure | Aug 20 22:59 |
|---|
| twitter | I can't believe the crap flood left open that slot. | Aug 20 22:59 |
|---|
| twitter | Got some specific links to coupon stories? A follow up will be nice and cost them more mod points when they bury it. | Aug 20 23:00 |
|---|
| schestowitz | Coupon stories? Sure. | Aug 20 23:02 |
|---|
| schestowitz | How's this one? http://boycottnovell.com/2007/03/... | Aug 20 23:03 |
|---|
| *dsmith_ (n=dsmith@c-76-114-142-224.hsd1.md.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Aug 20 23:13 |
| schestowitz | Hey, DOUGMan | Aug 20 23:14 |
|---|
| twitter | thanks. | Aug 20 23:30 |
|---|
