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#boycottnovell @ FreeNode: June 4th, 2008 (Part II)

Posted in IRC Logs at 3:51 am by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

schestowitz see you. Jun 04 11:41
ZiggyFish schestowitz: before he sent them to me he did ask if, openoffice could read them. Jun 04 11:41
ZiggyFish PetoKraus: see ya Jun 04 11:42
schestowitz This puts burden on OOo devs to do MOOX instead of adding new features. Jun 04 11:42
schestowitz That’s what IBM warned about too. Jun 04 11:42
schestowitz Microsoft: “let everyone run after us. We’ll just INNOV~1″ Jun 04 11:43
ZiggyFish lol Jun 04 11:43
ZiggyFish schestowitz: I must use that on the forums I go to. Jun 04 11:44
schestowitz OOXML? Jun 04 11:45
ZiggyFish schestowitz: I do a lot of hobby OS development ;) Jun 04 11:45
schestowitz Ah, OK. Jun 04 11:45
ZiggyFish no the ‘Microsoft: “let everyone run after us. We’ll just INNOV~1″‘ line Jun 04 11:45
schestowitz Well, it’s true that Microsoft just catches up in reality: hypervisors, word processors (before domination), browsers. They are also IPocrites. They used to whine about swpatents. Jun 04 11:46
ZiggyFish the current sig is: Rule one when dealing with Microsoft, they’re lying and while you’re listening to the their lies your attention is being diverted while they burn down your house and kidnap your children. Jun 04 11:47
ZiggyFish schestowitz: yeah. And they do in it such a way that people think that it’s their innverations Jun 04 11:48
schestowitz Well, XBox burned some houses down (one recently) and Gates had to attend a testimony Jun 04 11:49
schestowitz One incident claims that a baby was killed by this. Jun 04 11:49
ZiggyFish lol. Jun 04 11:49
schestowitz People have short memory spans. Young people know nothing. My brother things that the window UI thingie is all Windows and Microsoft and everything else is a ripoff. Jun 04 11:51
schestowitz Office suies? They are all “Microsoft Office clones”, apparently. Jun 04 11:51
schestowitz suites Jun 04 11:51
ZiggyFish lol, well he got one part right, Microsoft is a ripoff ;) Jun 04 11:51
schestowitz I’ll be off for a few moments. Just posting many links in BN.com Jun 04 11:52
ZiggyFish oh, k, it’s 9pm here, so I’ll be off soon Jun 04 11:52
schestowitz Australia? Jun 04 11:54
ZiggyFish yeah Jun 04 11:54
ZiggyFish Queensland to be exact Jun 04 11:54
schestowitz Cool. Jun 04 11:55
ZiggyFish anyway I’m off for the night. see ya Jun 04 11:56
*akf (i=akf@unaffiliated/akf) has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 11:59
schestowitz hey, akf. Jun 04 11:59
*akf is just listening… Jun 04 12:00
schestowitz I’m about to post a big bunch of links. Some big wins for us. Jun 04 12:00
akf heard about Vienna, as it seems they dump GNU/Linux for Vista, just because of one single program Jun 04 12:04
schestowitz 4 migrations in Germany though. Jun 04 12:12
schestowitz Vista’s successor was almost called Vienna, IIRC. Jun 04 12:12
PetoKraus akf: what is the one single program? Jun 04 12:13
schestowitz This news about Vienna goes back months ago _in a sense_. Someone up there might be cosy with Redmond. Jun 04 12:13
akf the articles don’t say which program, but only that it just runs with IE :-( Jun 04 12:14
schestowitz IE works in GNU/Linux ‘better’ than on Windows. Multiple versions at the same time even. Never tried it. Jun 04 12:15
schestowitz Speaking of which, it’s suspected that in the Czech Republic Microsoft gave the government discounts in exchange for the OOXML vote change. Jun 04 12:19
PetoKraus that’s old news, isn’t it Jun 04 12:20
schestowitz Sort of. I found this out in a press release (the smoking gun) a week ago and sent it also to PJ who wrote an article. Jun 04 12:23
PetoKraus it’s funny to see what two target groups use ubuntu Jun 04 12:40
PetoKraus beginners, and power-users, who don’t need something more configurable, but stable working running system without much hassle. Jun 04 12:41
ZiggyFish anyway see ya all tomorrow Jun 04 12:49
*ZiggyFish has quit (“Ex-Chat”) Jun 04 12:49
schestowitz I don’t know if power users prefer Ubuntu. If I had more CDs lying about, then my home PC would run something else. Before the Novell deal it has SuSE on it. Jun 04 12:58
PetoKraus i am talking about the users of ubuntu Jun 04 13:00
PetoKraus what i mean, if all power-users used ubuntu, there won’t be any gentoo, or slackware, right? Jun 04 13:00
PetoKraus why do you think ASUS picked Xandros? Jun 04 13:03
PetoKraus i mean, when they wanted patent covered distro, there’s still SuSE Jun 04 13:03
schestowitz Get a load of this: http://beranger.org/index.php?page=diary… Jun 04 13:13
schestowitz I don’t know why Xandros was chosen, but like Ubuntu it uses Debian. Jun 04 13:14
schestowitz Asus doesn’t pay Microsoft (yet), Xandros told me Jun 04 13:14
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PetoKraus nice! Jun 04 13:19
*jbh has quit (“leaving”) Jun 04 13:22
cyberorg schestowitz, you must consider putting opensuse 11.0 in it, we(community) work really hard on it ;) Jun 04 13:27
cyberorg boycott sled if you wish :P Jun 04 13:28
schestowitz I know. Jun 04 13:30
schestowitz That’s why I try to occasionally show the positives of OpenSUSE (on Saturdays), hoping that the developers will disengage from the Novell deal, even if it means forking the Novell project. The bright side of it is that OSUSE devs help other distros too. Jun 04 13:32
schestowitz As it stands, Microsoft has already sunk its teeth onto OpenSUSE. Watch the analysis of the pledge from last year (on Groklaw). They just want “brains for sale”. Jun 04 13:32
cyberorg schestowitz, our concentration is to create really great distro for users and the one that we enjoy using, and we are bunch of really nice people you know :) Jun 04 13:33
schestowitz Yes, but legal stuff won’t escape you. Jun 04 13:33
cyberorg so far i haven’t been approached by anything M$ Jun 04 13:33
cyberorg as long as there are stuff that is GPL and things are open source it wont bother us Jun 04 13:34
schestowitz Stallman once said: “Geeks like to think that they can ignore politics, you can leave politics alone, but politics won’t leave you alone.” Jun 04 13:34
schestowitz Same with lawyers, and I am not one. Jun 04 13:35
cyberorg no matter what anyone does politics has been around for a very long time and is going to be there, so we’ll just get on with what we do best Jun 04 13:37
PetoKraus schestowitz: i like the part on gentoo, in that report Jun 04 13:39
*pinkstormtrooper (i=pinkstor@gateway/tor/x-1ac3028c039eaf04) has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 13:44
schestowitz cyberorg, I agree, but keep an eye on Novell because they want to use Microsoft to take control. Let me find you a must-read. Jun 04 13:44
PetoKraus :D Jun 04 13:45
pinkstormtrooper fuck anyone who sides with microsoft Jun 04 13:45
schestowitz http://www.groklaw.net/articlebasic.ph… Internalise the bits further down. Jun 04 13:45
schestowitz Watch the language please. Jun 04 13:45
pinkstormtrooper ballmer is one example of the mind fuck corporations use to perpetuate their consolidation Jun 04 13:45
pinkstormtrooper they use humor and eccentricity to hide the truth Jun 04 13:45
pinkstormtrooper they use humor and eccentricity to hide the truth! Jun 04 13:45
pinkstormtrooper they use humor and eccentricity to hide the truth!!!!! Jun 04 13:45
PetoKraus uhm Jun 04 13:45
pinkstormtrooper why? Jun 04 13:45
pinkstormtrooper is it past the ballmer bedtime? Jun 04 13:45
PetoKraus there is one twitter on facebook Jun 04 13:45
PetoKraus you remind me of him Jun 04 13:46
PetoKraus *slashdot Jun 04 13:46
pinkstormtrooper perhaps it’s time for some egg mcmuffins and cozy lizard night hats? Jun 04 13:46
pinkstormtrooper fuck facebook Jun 04 13:46
pinkstormtrooper bunch of people throwing away their privacy to cia Jun 04 13:46
pinkstormtrooper just like myspace Jun 04 13:46
pinkstormtrooper fucking sheep Jun 04 13:46
PetoKraus nice to meet you, i think Jun 04 13:46
cozub wtf? :) Jun 04 13:47
pinkstormtrooper they all have the IQs of anally raped llamas with chicken feet Jun 04 13:47
pinkstormtrooper I spit on microsoft Jun 04 13:47
pinkstormtrooper schestowitz is it true you’re joining microsoft? Jun 04 13:47
schestowitz No. Jun 04 13:47
pinkstormtrooper I heard you were baiting MS to show them your marketing skills Jun 04 13:47
cozub rotfl :)) Jun 04 13:47
pinkstormtrooper so you could be hired by them and reap the benefits of a ballmer french kiss and pelvis thrust Jun 04 13:47
PetoKraus was there a rumour saying that? Jun 04 13:47
cozub I think pinkstormtrooper just went bananas Jun 04 13:48
PetoKraus i’d love to read it Jun 04 13:48
schestowitz I wonder if it’s the same person who was here on Monday to poison the well. Jun 04 13:48
pinkstormtrooper I bet the drool pools at ballmer’s feet when his lizard head penis slides out, the size of a small, annoying canary, with the fragrance of kelp. I bet his eyes roll back and his tongue turns into an omlette textured slipper shaped widget while his voice turns metallic and his pelvis turns black while his penis shoots out a cloud of silverfish Jun 04 13:49
schestowitz They occasionally get them in /. and Groklaw too. Jun 04 13:49
pinkstormtrooper that’s what I bet Jun 04 13:49
schestowitz pinkstormtrooper, you’re just here to troll, methinks. Jun 04 13:49
cozub schestowitz: the style looks similar Jun 04 13:49
pinkstormtrooper schestowitz, no I am a keeper of the faith Jun 04 13:50
schestowitz I know. Jun 04 13:50
pinkstormtrooper but I had to joke about you once schestowitz Jun 04 13:50
cozub that being said, IRC is full of weirdos (just look at me :))… Jun 04 13:50
pinkstormtrooper to test the water Jun 04 13:50
schestowitz Please speak politely then. Jun 04 13:50
pinkstormtrooper cozub, you like my style? Jun 04 13:50
pinkstormtrooper cozub, kneel before me then Jun 04 13:50
pinkstormtrooper cozub, worship now at 1/2 the price Jun 04 13:50
cozub pinkstormtrooper: don’t exaggerate Jun 04 13:50
cozub or kick your butt for free… Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper ok schestowitz Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper sorry for being a nigger Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper I can’t help it Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper it’s my nigger nature Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper cozub, halos form around every body part of mine Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper cozub, they extend to the heights and the depths Jun 04 13:51
schestowitz We’ll have to ban you. Jun 04 13:51
cozub schestowitz: it might be time to terminate him Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper cozub, you humans are creatures of filth Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper every single human Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper filthy rotten greasy humans Jun 04 13:51
cozub lol :) Jun 04 13:51
*schestowitz sets ban on pinkstormtroope!*@* Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper see how they leak Jun 04 13:51
pinkstormtrooper aren’t they leaky? Jun 04 13:51
*schestowitz sets ban on *!i=pinkstor@*gateway/tor/x-1ac3028c039eaf04 Jun 04 13:52
*schestowitz has kicked pinkstormtrooper from #boycottnovell (schestowitz) Jun 04 13:52
*jbh (n=jonharpe@c-75-69-164-155.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 13:52
*akf dankt Jun 04 13:52
jbh ubuntu is shipping a lot of kernel updates lately Jun 04 13:52
jbh seems like every day I have to reboot Jun 04 13:52
*cyberorg (n=cyberorg@opensuse/member/Cyberorg) has left #boycottnovell (“Leaving”) Jun 04 13:52
PetoKraus on /. it’s not occasionally Jun 04 13:53
schestowitz The trolling? They cleaned up in 2006 Jun 04 13:53
schestowitz If people shove the homophobic stuff, the necrophilia, the  ugly pictures and insult people, then they dissipate it all. Jun 04 13:54
schestowitz They do plenty of that in COLA, which is unmoderated. Jun 04 13:54
jbh that’s why I don’t do newsgroups anymore Jun 04 13:55
jbh so few people continue these days anyway, they’ve moved on to other forms of communication Jun 04 13:55
schestowitz Recently they began exposing people’s addresses and phone numbers out in public, then attacked them with slander in the header (subject lines). It’s a form of intimidation. Jun 04 13:56
jbh typically ones that are or can be moderated :) Jun 04 13:56
schestowitz And BTW, some of them are associated with Microsoft. Some are former Microsoft employees or partners. It’s gross. Jun 04 13:57
jbh http://gburt.blogspot.com/20… Jun 04 13:58
jbh that makes me laugh Jun 04 13:58
jbh I should probably stop aggregating planetgnome Jun 04 13:58
schestowitz Some time ago I noticed they want to make it a video player as well. Jun 04 13:58
schestowitz The trouble would be DRM+Mono(Banshee )  on people’s PCs. Jun 04 13:59
jbh yea, I saw that too Jun 04 13:59
PetoKraus banshee? isn’t that the mono flagship useless app? Jun 04 13:59
schestowitz It’s a bit like the urgency list / priorities of the FSF. In this case it’s a question of what needs swapping with a Mono equiv. Jun 04 13:59
jbh what frustrates me most is that most of my friends use banshee Jun 04 14:00
schestowitz OpenSUSE installer: “Please select one from: 1) KDE; 2) KDE4; 3) GNOME; 4)MONOME” Jun 04 14:01
jbh hah Jun 04 14:01
PetoKraus why would you use banshee Jun 04 14:02
PetoKraus there are such good alternatives Jun 04 14:02
jbh yea, I use rythmbox Jun 04 14:02
PetoKraus Amarok. Rhythmbox. that E-something done in python Jun 04 14:03
PetoKraus and finally Quodlibet Jun 04 14:03
schestowitz I’m on XMMS and Amarok (work and home, respectively) Jun 04 14:03
jbh I used to use xmms, and still do on occassion Jun 04 14:03
jbh but I have problems with utf8 filenames Jun 04 14:04
jbh with xmms Jun 04 14:04
schestowitz Just in: “Novell joins Microsoft in Anti-Linux FUD” ( http://alexvalentine.org/?p=594 ) Jun 04 14:04
PetoKraus exaile Jun 04 14:04
jbh hah Jun 04 14:06
schestowitz “unpaid Linux” Jun 04 14:06
schestowitz “Blech! Those nasty cheap thingies” Jun 04 14:06
schestowitz Susan Hauser spouted out that FUD in OStatic last week. Jun 04 14:07
schestowitz They try to ‘tame’ the GNU. Pay up now (for patents, to Microsoft). Jun 04 14:07
PetoKraus duh i see a project Jun 04 14:08
PetoKraus let’s make paid phone support Jun 04 14:08
PetoKraus generic, for linux Jun 04 14:08
schestowitz That already exists. Jun 04 14:08
PetoKraus good Jun 04 14:09
schestowitz That’s why it’s FUD Jun 04 14:09
Eruaran hello Jun 04 14:09
schestowitz It’s also why there’s money in Free software. Microsoft’s profits are nothing compared to that of its ecosystem as a whole, including all the malware ‘experts’. Jun 04 14:09
Eruaran Does the Suse that Novell distributes still default to KDE ? Jun 04 14:10
schestowitz Hi <Eruaran> Jun 04 14:10
Eruaran hi Jun 04 14:10
schestowitz No, it has a triange for choice. Jun 04 14:10
jbh did it ever default to kde? Jun 04 14:11
schestowitz I can find you a screenshot if you want. They try to make it an equal treatment for the DEs. Jun 04 14:11
Eruaran cause if its not already KDE 4 will soon be GPLv3 Jun 04 14:11
schestowitz jbh: yes. Jun 04 14:11
Eruaran And Microsoft participates in the distribution of Suse Jun 04 14:11
schestowitz SUSE was (almost) all KDE in the past Jun 04 14:11
jbh I meant after novell purchased suse Jun 04 14:11
jbh not before Jun 04 14:11
schestowitz Novell never talks to clients about GPLv3 Jun 04 14:11
schestowitz Pj jokes about it. Jun 04 14:12
PetoKraus lol, roy, did you read the last comment? Jun 04 14:12
schestowitz Novell will just try to hide the long-term issues associated with choosing Ballnux Jun 04 14:12
PetoKraus http://alexvalentine.org/?p=594#comment-61198 Jun 04 14:12
schestowitz I haven’t, yet. Jun 04 14:12
Eruaran If Microsoft remains involved in the distribution of Suse and Suse goes KDE 4.1, Microsoft won’t be able to rattle the patent sabre Jun 04 14:13
schestowitz GNOME came about to the installer and SLED around 2005 (late 2005, IIRC). Jun 04 14:13
Eruaran And a Suse without KDE isn’t Suse any more Jun 04 14:13
schestowitz The comment: ‘When your boss asks “what’s the status of situation-x” it’s always easier to say “I have placed a call to Novell support and they are looking into it” than say “I checked the online forums and I have no idea what’s going on”.’ Jun 04 14:14
schestowitz I think it’s more complicated with KDE/GNOME. Jun 04 14:15
schestowitz It’ll take a while for KDE to go GPLv3 wholly. There are many non-KDE packages as well. Jun 04 14:15
schestowitz IANAL. Jun 04 14:15
Eruaran While the guy who is waiting for Novell support is still waiting, ubottu will already have given me enough information for me to say to the boss, “the situation will soon be history”. Jun 04 14:16
*Eruaran looks at ficticious guy waiting for Novell support and says, “noob”. Jun 04 14:17
schestowitz “Ubuntu,” said the boss, “what on earth is that?!?!?” We need a brand name. Jun 04 14:17
*Eruaran turns back on ficticious boss and walks away… boss hears the word “noob” uttered. Jun 04 14:18
Eruaran :P Jun 04 14:18
schestowitz Coupons and brochures. The suits dig coupons and brochures. Jun 04 14:18
schestowitz Must have paper for intangible assets (read: imaginary property) Jun 04 14:19
Eruaran It may take a while for all of KDE to go GPLv3, but sooner or later Novell and Microsoft will be left out in the cold. Jun 04 14:20
jbh doesn’t the gpl3 have a clause that allows novell to ship gpl3 anyway? Jun 04 14:21
Eruaran Its the only protection from poison patent bombs. Jun 04 14:21
schestowitz Novell is getting weaker. Some readers in Linux Today say so too, so it will end up having less influence. The days of Linspire seem numbered (someone who knows the management there thinks so). Jun 04 14:21
schestowitz Yes, jbh, that’s what I thought too, but PJ insists otherwise. Jun 04 14:22
jbh ah Jun 04 14:22
schestowitz And the GLLv3 too is no cure for patent trolls, some of whom Microsoft has (Nathan Myrvold and others) Jun 04 14:22
jbh I’d be surprised if opensuse11 didn’t have gpl3 software Jun 04 14:23
Eruaran Novell is a pariah in the community… unless you’re Miguel de Icaza and friends… but they’re living in a land of fairies and a benevolent harmless fluffy cuddly Ballmerization Jun 04 14:23
schestowitz There’s no ‘IP condom’ as long as that disease called swpatents is out there. Jun 04 14:23
Eruaran At least it has a clause which can be argued in court Jun 04 14:23
schestowitz OpenOffice 3.0 (nightly and beta) is LGPLv3 Jun 04 14:23
Eruaran Which M$ knows about Jun 04 14:23
Eruaran M$ knows that legal action over patents whilst remaining involved in the distribution of GPLv3 code is a violation, and their huff and puff wont change that. Jun 04 14:25
schestowitz They don’t need legal action though. They have a stick to wave and some trolls, just in case they need them (and can hide the money trail). They failed with SCO. Jun 04 14:25
Eruaran If they claim the simply don’t recognize it, then we can all claim we simply don’t recognize Microsoft’s EULA’s. Jun 04 14:26
schestowitz Microsoft would laugh. Jun 04 14:26
Eruaran So would Eben Moglen Jun 04 14:26
schestowitz Watch how it snubbed the FSF around July last year, thinking that it’s above the law and GPLv3 does not apply to it. Jun 04 14:26
Eruaran Probably becuase they believe no one can last enough round with them in court. Jun 04 14:27
Eruaran *rounds Jun 04 14:28
Eruaran But Ballmer is a king who must pay his subjects to wave the flag. Jun 04 14:28
Eruaran That is why they will fail. Jun 04 14:28
schestowitz Microsoft is very hubris-infected. Asay spoke to them and sort of told me. Ballmer is a lost cause. The man is MAD. Jun 04 14:28
schestowitz Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Jun 04 14:29
Eruaran I noticed the deal with HP over Windows Live Search. Jun 04 14:29
Eruaran Same old same old… Jun 04 14:29
schestowitz Yes, yes. Jun 04 14:29
schestowitz Mikey needs to buy some market share. Jun 04 14:29
Eruaran Microsoft doesn’t know how to compete. Jun 04 14:29
schestowitz “What would you like for XMas, baby Ballmer?” Ballmer: market share; f* kill Google. Please. Jun 04 14:30
Eruaran It only knows to look for a way to monopolize, to leverage its market share on the desktop. Jun 04 14:30
schestowitz Bill Gates: “”Microsoft looks at new ideas, they don’t evaluate whether the idea will move the industry forward, they ask, ‘how will it help us sell more copies of Windows?’”” Jun 04 14:31
Eruaran Once upon a time it might mean something… but today this latest move looks rather Mikey Mouse… do they really think a deal with HP to make WLS default on HP’s PC’s will make headway against Google ? Jun 04 14:31
Eruaran Well they dropped the ball with Vista Jun 04 14:32
schestowitz H-P is part of the Trust. Jun 04 14:32
schestowitz O/ses become less relevant and Microsoft knows it. Jun 04 14:32
schestowitz It wants it both ways: 1) Get Silverlight out there (Web ceases to be commodity); 2) Promote Live as a portal. Jun 04 14:32
Eruaran New terms, old tricks. Jun 04 14:33
schestowitz This I don’t understand: http://www.linux.com/feature/136463   So Linux.com is now promoting blobs? And Mac SDKs? Jun 04 14:33
*Eruaran looks Jun 04 14:34
Eruaran more about getting around it Jun 04 14:39
schestowitz I haven’t really read it (just the bottom part on the FSF’s take) Jun 04 14:39
schestowitz The mention is advertising though, no matter what it contains, IMHO. Jun 04 14:39
schestowitz Remember this: Linux.com needs to give the spotlight to OHA and LiMO. Jun 04 14:40
schestowitz LiMo needs devs. Android needs apps. Jun 04 14:40
Eruaran I really don’t agree with developers who waste time and effort on hacking closed platforms when there are open ones available. And I think it devalues the community, which is much bigger than Apple. Jun 04 14:41
PetoKraus but if you know it’s possible to have Xbox running linux, why not hack it? Jun 04 14:42
schestowitz Why buy it in the first place? Jun 04 14:43
PetoKraus well Jun 04 14:44
PetoKraus by the time, it was nice cost-performance-noise deal Jun 04 14:44
schestowitz I was told several times that even if Microsoft sells these at a loss, the sales help Microsoft because it uses it as a selling point to independent game makers (boasting high numbers) Jun 04 14:44
PetoKraus i don’t have one. Jun 04 14:44
PetoKraus moreover, if you get one now, it’s trough ebay mostly Jun 04 14:45
PetoKraus which helps only the other guy wanting to get rid of his crappy hardware Jun 04 14:45
schestowitz Yes, recycling hardware. Scares the hardware vendors, who conspired with Microsoft around Vista RTM time (Intel at the least). Jun 04 14:47
PetoKraus yeah. I hate myself for buying intel Jun 04 14:47
PetoKraus let’s say i was young and inexperienced :P Jun 04 14:48
cozub well, on the other hand, intell provides decent X drivers… Jun 04 14:48
schestowitz Intel is killing AMD at the moment. Jun 04 14:48
schestowitz Some others rise from the east though. Jun 04 14:48
schestowitz Intel is worse than Microsoft in certain ways. Jun 04 14:48
PetoKraus schestowitz: but is the few percent of performance really needed? Jun 04 14:48
schestowitz But people don’t see and /use/ their chips, so they can’t understand it. Jun 04 14:48
schestowitz Price-fixing has gone on for ages. Jun 04 14:49
schestowitz For servers maybe. Jun 04 14:49
PetoKraus opterons are GOOD Jun 04 14:49
schestowitz My PCs (all of them) are around 2GHz. Jun 04 14:49
schestowitz The CPU speed that is. Jun 04 14:49
*indianwarlord (i=war@gateway/tor/x-f145b8e364ba31ab) has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 14:50
PetoKraus yep Jun 04 14:50
Eruaran AMD are doing ok Jun 04 14:50
Eruaran I was talking to someone from AMD last weel Jun 04 14:50
Eruaran *week Jun 04 14:50
PetoKraus I hope Puma will be good… Jun 04 14:50
Eruaran They’re not sitting still Jun 04 14:51
schestowitz Yes, but the workforce shrinks. Jun 04 14:51
PetoKraus the main problem i see is Jun 04 14:51
PetoKraus there was nothing new from AMD for so long Jun 04 14:51
Eruaran People were predicting AMD’s doom back when Intel brought out the 486. Jun 04 14:52
PetoKraus Intel has released Dual Core’s, AMD Turion’s, and then Intel Core 2 Duos and the newer Penryn Core 2 duos Jun 04 14:52
PetoKraus slap me for using that ‘ Jun 04 14:52
Eruaran AMD/ATI has a raft of new products coming out this year Jun 04 14:52
PetoKraus yeah. That’s what i hope will be their saver Jun 04 14:52
schestowitz Sadly, Novell is a pal of AMD Jun 04 14:54
schestowitz They have all sorts of sponsorships and collabs’. Jun 04 14:54
PetoKraus the 780 chipset is marvelous… if i was buying a machine right now, desktop, i’d definitely go for X3 phenom and that 780g chipset… Jun 04 14:54
PetoKraus what can you do, roy…. Jun 04 14:54
PetoKraus but they are open-sourcing the ATI chipsets… Jun 04 14:56
Eruaran I think for AMD, Novell is more of a client Jun 04 14:56
PetoKraus there’s limited, but functional 3D already available Jun 04 14:56
PetoKraus open-sourced, i mean Jun 04 14:56
PetoKraus and is developed by novell…. Jun 04 14:56
Eruaran if its open it can be developed by anyone Jun 04 14:56
*indianwarlord has quit (“Leaving”) Jun 04 14:57
schestowitz Maybe the same troll? Jun 04 14:57
Eruaran And drunk ? Jun 04 14:58
PetoKraus there goes the tor traffic Jun 04 14:58
schestowitz Maybe paid. Jun 04 14:58
Eruaran Cause that wasn’t very coherent Jun 04 14:58
*akf has quit (“leaving”) Jun 04 14:58
schestowitz Poison piills. Jun 04 14:58
Eruaran something funny happened today at work Jun 04 14:59
Eruaran one of the guys skyped me saying ubuntu crashed after booting with new ati drivers Jun 04 15:00
Eruaran then a minute later Jun 04 15:00
Eruaran he skypes me again saying it wasnt the OS, his graphics card was actually a bit stuffed Jun 04 15:00
Eruaran worked perfectly with a new card Jun 04 15:01
schestowitz It’s easy to blame ‘foreign’ things. Jun 04 15:01
schestowitz Many Linux newbies blame Linux for not working seamlessly with iPods. Jun 04 15:01
schestowitz Just spotted in ZDNet Between the Lines (BTL) a short moment ago. Jun 04 15:02
schestowitz “Oh noes! The winmodem! Me [sic] iPod!!111″ Jun 04 15:02
Eruaran Had a customer at work who’s notbook hard drive got raped by Norton Jun 04 15:03
Eruaran Nothing would read it Jun 04 15:03
Eruaran But I was able to force it to mount with Kubuntu Jun 04 15:03
Eruaran And got data off it Jun 04 15:04
Eruaran Now he’s telling his mates that Linux saved his data Jun 04 15:04
schestowitz It does /more/. Tell him. Jun 04 15:04
Eruaran yes Jun 04 15:04
schestowitz :-) Jun 04 15:04
Eruaran I gave him the CD as well Jun 04 15:04
schestowitz “Linux… it’s for servers… it’s all command-line” Jun 04 15:05
schestowitz The myths that spread.. Jun 04 15:05
Eruaran We counter that Jun 04 15:05
Eruaran Had a guy in one day telling me some Linux myths Jun 04 15:05
Eruaran I just sat there saying, ‘uh huh… hmm… uh huh’ Jun 04 15:06
schestowitz There’s a danger that Novell will further change perceptions. Jun 04 15:06
Eruaran the boss’s wife walked over to our demo system which was behind the guy Jun 04 15:06
Eruaran And she asked me, ‘the demo has linux on it doesn’t it ?’ Jun 04 15:07
Eruaran I said, ‘yep’ Jun 04 15:07
schestowitz There’s “Free Linux” and then there’s “SUSE”, which you MUST have to work along with Windows. Jun 04 15:07
schestowitz They already do that routine against *buntu and RHT. Jun 04 15:07
Eruaran the guy turned around and saw her playing with a glorious looking desktop with compiz fusion Jun 04 15:08
Eruaran on a 24″ widescreen Jun 04 15:08
schestowitz That Zaharov guy from iTWire is a technical journalist and a months ago he though Linux was something you install on Windows. Jun 04 15:08
Eruaran The guy must have felt like an idiot Jun 04 15:08
Eruaran cause everything he said was wrong and I didnt need to say a thing Jun 04 15:08
schestowitz Well, one can always downgrade to Vista and do ‘slip mode’ for kicks. Jun 04 15:09
schestowitz flip mode Jun 04 15:09
Eruaran I wonder if Asus using Splashtop gets up Ballmers nose Jun 04 15:11
PetoKraus well i hope it’ll get GPL’ed Jun 04 15:13
schestowitz See this recent one: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/… Jun 04 15:15
schestowitz This has been brewing for a while. Jun 04 15:15
*Eruaran reads Jun 04 15:18
schestowitz Microsoft press: http://www.linux.com/feed/137230 “Mickos, who’s now senior VP in Sun’s new database group, pointed to Redmond’s work with MySQL in naming Microsoft one of three companies to receive its Partner of the Year awards.” Jun 04 15:18
schestowitz Mickos could fall for it. He’s not stubborn. Jun 04 15:19
Eruaran Steve Ballmer and Bill Gates even with Microsoft billions don’t have enough fingers to plug all the holes… there’s an increasing amount of water getting through that monopolistic dam… Jun 04 15:24
Eruaran Microsoft’s behavour will get worse before its over Jun 04 15:24
schestowitz Just found: Microsoft spreads the IP ‘love’: http://news.softpedia.com/news/The-Microsoft-… Jun 04 15:25
schestowitz Well, over in the EU they have just bought themselves a big lobbyist, so I can foresee this getting ugly.. There’s hope at the end. Eben Moglen: “Everybody is connected to everybody else, all data that can be shared will be shared will be shared: get used to it.” Jun 04 15:27
Eruaran you know what Jun 04 15:27
Eruaran that kind of thing reminds me of IBM’s attempts to change and proprietize PC hardware all those years ago Jun 04 15:28
Eruaran But its even more lame Jun 04 15:29
Eruaran Since when has Microsoft ever been, “As an industry leader in the design and development of computer peripherals and accessories”… ? Jun 04 15:29
Eruaran Are they talking about the MS mouse ? Jun 04 15:30
Eruaran Or those ergo keyboard that nobody buys ? Jun 04 15:30
schestowitz They have established this before, but not in an organised fashion. ACPI is an eye opener. Other examples are Microsoft’s attempt to keep things secret. Oh! Same with Intel BTW. Jun 04 15:31
schestowitz Microsoft bought them. They just rebrnad them. Jun 04 15:32
Eruaran hmm… though Intel was talking up MID’s running Linux again this week Jun 04 15:33
Eruaran And they’ve opened up their graphics chipset API Jun 04 15:33
PetoKraus ACPI? Jun 04 15:33
schestowitz Don’t confuse development with acquisitions. Google does this too. They rebranded KeyHole Google Earth and now struct around all the INNOVA~1.  MS Photosynth used to be more of a Linux project. Jun 04 15:33
schestowitz -struct- strut Jun 04 15:33
schestowitz Wait, I’ll find it for you. Jun 04 15:33
Eruaran It think ulitmately Microsoft’s screwed up hardware strategy will fail. Screwing up hardware as much as they’ve screwed up their software products in order to maintain monopolistic lock-in results in stuff that doesn’t work. Jun 04 15:34
Eruaran You end up with a black box that either doesn’t do anything people want it to do, or does things badly. Jun 04 15:35
Eruaran It creates complexity that puts people off. Jun 04 15:36
Eruaran Look at Vista with its DRM Jun 04 15:36
schestowitz I submitted this to Digg: http://digg.com/linux_unix/Newly_leake…. Jun 04 15:38
schestowitz Vista is for Hollywood, not for users or developers. Jun 04 15:38
Eruaran exactly Jun 04 15:38
Eruaran Gates today still sounds like a certain whiny teenager who once threatened the Homebrew Computer Club with legal action over hacking BASIC which that teen claimed was his own work… Jun 04 15:43
Eruaran same scenario, larger stage Jun 04 15:44
*anivar (n=anivar@ has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 15:44
schestowitz Welcome, anivar Jun 04 15:44
Eruaran That little dweeby piece of pond scum has always behaved like this, and he has always hated people who give away free software. Jun 04 15:45
anivar hi schestowitz Jun 04 15:45
schestowitz Gates comes from a litigious family. Dad’s a lawyer, grandpa’ a senator (think lobbying). Jun 04 15:45
Eruaran Hello anivar Jun 04 15:45
anivar Eruaran: hello Jun 04 15:46
anivar just came to know about this channel now Jun 04 15:46
Eruaran :) Jun 04 15:47
schestowitz It’s only a few days old. A reader insisted that we create one. Jun 04 15:47
*anivar waiting for a call from a Business Standard journalist on OOXML happenings Jun 04 15:49
schestowitz <anivar> , are you close to the incidents or testimony sources? Jun 04 15:50
schestowitz We try to make public record while people remember. Jun 04 15:50
anivar schestowitz:  i was part of BIS datamining committee on OOXML Jun 04 15:51
anivar But I dont like to make it public Jun 04 15:51
anivar I always hates works with Govt Jun 04 15:52
anivar It was an Old Commitee Jun 04 15:53
schestowitz Have you formally complained yet? Jun 04 15:54
anivar LITD 15 was the final commitee Jun 04 15:54
anivar schestowitz: About what Jun 04 15:54
anivar In India OOXML process is as follows Jun 04 15:55
schestowitz If the intervention by the government, which as the Bombay university professor claims was caused by Microsoft, affected you, then.. Jun 04 15:55
anivar No. Jun 04 15:55
anivar schestowitz: The initial review as by Wordprocessing-ML subcommittee Jun 04 15:55
schestowitz Microsoft filed a complaint with consumer <something>, IIRC. Jun 04 15:55
schestowitz Oh, I see. Jun 04 15:56
anivar The Datamining commitee reviewd it Jun 04 15:56
anivar The 200 issues listed by wordprocessing commitee was approved by datamining commitee Jun 04 15:57
schestowitz Yes, I remember. Jun 04 15:57
anivar LITD 15 commitee  approved it unanimously and Then India voted No in Fast Track Process Jun 04 15:57
schestowitz They were not addressed properly in the BRM, I gather? Jun 04 15:57
anivar After that Dataming commitees role was only on examining Microsoft response on issues Jun 04 15:58
schestowitz Were they all satisfactory? Jun 04 15:58
schestowitz Another key issue: was there sufficient time to name all issues in a very large specification? Jun 04 15:59
anivar schestowitz: Microsoft replied only to some of them Jun 04 15:59
anivar it was before BRM Jun 04 15:59
schestowitz I understand. Jun 04 15:59
anivar The reply was mainly intended for wasting our time Jun 04 15:59
schestowitz Only about 20% of the issues were discussed in the BRM. Jun 04 15:59
schestowitz This happened in Italy too, if I recall correctly. Jun 04 15:59
anivar for a single line critique they will send a 30 page reply contains nothing Jun 04 16:00
schestowitz (referring to futile responses) Jun 04 16:00
anivar And After BRM around 80 issues are remaining unresolved Jun 04 16:00
schestowitz What did your commitee decide? Approve? Jun 04 16:01
anivar LITD committee decided to Vote No again because of this Jun 04 16:01
schestowitz Okay, I understand. Jun 04 16:01
schestowitz Did anyone who was affiliated with Microsoft attend? Was the committee free of conflicting interests? Jun 04 16:02
anivar And I am mainly involved with Free Software community works Jun 04 16:02
schestowitz There is no conflict of interests there. Free software is tied to no company. Jun 04 16:03
schestowitz …Nor to a standard. Jun 04 16:03
schestowitz Have the complaints from Microsoft affected your committee? Jun 04 16:03
anivar Indian Process was fairly neat. But Microsoft appealed it with Government on last minute Jun 04 16:03
anivar You can see details on osindia.blogspot.com Jun 04 16:04
schestowitz I ask this because I read about the smearing of some people’s names, which happened not only in India. Jun 04 16:04
anivar Venkitesh Harikaran (Redhat)’s Blog Jun 04 16:04
schestowitz Yes, I know the blog well. Jun 04 16:04
schestowitz If only more countries adopted the same practises, but many committees were stuffed in practise. Jun 04 16:05
anivar schestowitz: I know that Smearing was started after the Second No vote. (even though they used NGOs to write  for OOXML to BIS before ) Jun 04 16:05
schestowitz India must try to embrace ODF and ODF only at government level and I’m worried that it hasn’t make such an announcement yet. Jun 04 16:06
schestowitz Yes, the letters are outrageous. Jun 04 16:06
anivar In the Final Voting Industry Lobby (WIPRO INFOSYS NASSCO & TCS) voted yes Jun 04 16:06
anivar Along with microsoft Jun 04 16:06
schestowitz Back in August, just before the final vote, I alerted Sutor and others in their blogs that Microsoft gave away a lot of charity. Jun 04 16:06
schestowitz That was days before the vote. Jun 04 16:07
anivar i mean in LITD 15 Commitee Jun 04 16:07
schestowitz This may explain those letters. Jun 04 16:07
schestowitz Those companies votes for their partner, not for India. Jun 04 16:07
anivar yea , i remember you covered it Jun 04 16:07
schestowitz Al of them are associated with Microsoft, except one, I think. Jun 04 16:07
schestowitz Sam Varghese wrote about it later, as well. Jun 04 16:07
anivar I know. It is interesting to say, Some students  wrote an Open letter to these companies Jun 04 16:08
schestowitz Yes, I saw it. Jun 04 16:08
schestowitz Did anyone get it (among the companies)? Jun 04 16:08
schestowitz The vote was a very cultist one. Microsoft (+partners) versus the world as Open Malaysia put it. Jun 04 16:09
anivar Also on the candle light vigil There was placards saying “Get well soon” to these companies Jun 04 16:09
anivar Anyway I feel the rise of Developing world Vs Microsoft now Jun 04 16:10
anivar rise of a struggle Jun 04 16:10
schestowitz *smile* Jun 04 16:10
anivar By looking at appeal Jun 04 16:10
*anivar on phone Jun 04 16:10
schestowitz Yesterday I made and prepared sa set of photos from the protests in India. I will use them in the future to put a human face on resistance to expansionism with OOXML. Jun 04 16:11
anivar The set also have my  face too Jun 04 16:11
schestowitz I am not sure which one shows you, but I selected 7 photos that visibly show the message (against OOXML). Jun 04 16:13
schestowitz Just faces and congregations don’t convey the message. Jun 04 16:13
*maxstirner (n=user@ has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 16:23
schestowitz Howdy. Jun 04 16:26
Eruaran I’m off… its late here Jun 04 16:32
Eruaran bbl Jun 04 16:32
PetoKraus :) Jun 04 16:33
PetoKraus bye Jun 04 16:33
schestowitz See you Jun 04 16:34
schestowitz I struggle to see how to achieve something in KE. Jun 04 16:34
schestowitz KDE Jun 04 16:34
schestowitz Can one possibly make a windows visible in desktop X and Y, instead of in all desktops (workspaces)? Jun 04 16:35
PetoKraus no clue Jun 04 16:35
schestowitz I guess the only workaround is making it be below everything and visible in all workspaces, but it’s a mess. Jun 04 16:37
schestowitz I just struggle to read IRC while browsing even though it’s a dual-head, almost 4000 pixels wide Jun 04 16:38
*anivar just Finished the call. Jun 04 16:39
schestowitz Red Hat has just lost a VP… http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do… Jun 04 16:39
schestowitz No word from Red Hat about it. Jun 04 16:39
anivar schestowitz: Business standard plans to a cover story on OOXML Jun 04 16:40
schestowitz Who would ‘balance’ the article? Surely they’ll collect comments from Microsoft or its partners in India, no? Jun 04 16:41
anivar Yes offcourse Jun 04 16:42
anivar what I did is Linked a lot of people associated with Free Software circles Jun 04 16:43
schestowitz That’s valuable to communicate. Jun 04 16:43
schestowitz Better sometimes if done outside the closed circles of FOSS sites. Jun 04 16:44
schestowitz BoycottNovell, for example, attracts like 45% Linux users (based on nightly logs), so it’s a bit like preaching to the choir. Jun 04 16:44
anivar hmm Jun 04 16:45
schestowitz Hypothetical example: LinuxToday is a case of informing the converted and convinced (that OOXML is a hoax); Digg, on the other hand, esp. in the FP, reaches people who say “Aha! What it this thing called OOXML? I want to find out who’s exploiting me.” Jun 04 16:46
schestowitz The Business Standard is important for this reason, but it’ll try to give both sides some coverage I imagine… because the retiring guy in the sweater could not possibly mean just harm and greed. Jun 04 16:47
anivar I hope so lets see Jun 04 16:49
anivar Also I sent them some links so Jun 04 16:50
schestowitz Did they contact just yourself or others too? I also asked this because I made a mistake by doing the Linux.com./Slashtdot poscast without preparing for it (bad idea). Jun 04 16:51
anivar But the guy called me said that they are getting Opinions like “Multiple standards are good for customer’s choice. but OOXML is bad because of its errors” from most of the people Jun 04 16:52
schestowitz Haha. Jun 04 16:52
schestowitz Show them the rebuttal from Yook Kit. Jun 04 16:52
schestowitz That’s a classic Jun 04 16:52
anivar I attacked “Multiple standards are good ” point very well Jun 04 16:52
schestowitz There’s also one about lightbulbs from Rob Weir. They try to confuse people. Gymnastics in logic. Jun 04 16:53
anivar Sending some article links to this guy Jun 04 16:53
schestowitz “Multiple standard are ‘great’! Well, let’s have 10 to choose from and defeat the very purpose of having a standard in the first place…” Jun 04 16:53
schestowitz Choose products (e.g. Linus distros), not standards, e.g. LSB. Jun 04 16:54
anivar yea Jun 04 16:54
schestowitz CompTIA tried this spin in South Africa. Jun 04 16:55
anivar BTW Your attack on xen was wonderful Jun 04 16:57
schestowitz This one makes many headlines at the moment: http://www.reuters.com/article/… Jun 04 16:58
schestowitz There is usually a motive. ‘Addiction’ of children of favours. Based on experience, the motive comes to light later. Jun 04 16:58
schestowitz Really? A year ago people thought it was nasty (attack on a so-called Linux poster child). They paid like half a billion for 1000 customers and a messy hack that KVM renders obsolete. Jun 04 16:59
anivar They were investing in their project called Project Siksha Jun 04 17:01
anivar It a programme implimenting in schools Jun 04 17:01
anivar in partner with Intel Jun 04 17:01
anivar partnership Jun 04 17:01
anivar Kerala’s IT@school Project was Liberated to free software from this programme due to the civil society movement lead by Free software community & Teachers Jun 04 17:01
anivar schestowitz: I was not always happy with xen’s way Jun 04 17:03
schestowitz I reckon it won’t be long before Gates buys Facebook. I warned friends about it like 8 months ago when the founder of Facebook made visits to Redmond. http://arstechnica.com/journals… Jun 04 17:03
PetoKraus hmm Jun 04 17:03
PetoKraus the day this happens Jun 04 17:03
PetoKraus i stop using it Jun 04 17:03
anivar KVM’s hardware dependency was forcing people to adopt xen Jun 04 17:03
PetoKraus no kidding. Jun 04 17:03
schestowitz I keep getting these messages via Facebook instead of by E-mail. It’s all scattered with those ‘social’ sites. Jun 04 17:03
schestowitz And when people ‘write on my wall’(TM) it’s visible to all. *sigh* Jun 04 17:04
schestowitz Privacy time bomb Jun 04 17:04
schestowitz SJVN whines about it yesterday Jun 04 17:04
schestowitz There are some other options like Sun’s xVM, which now includes VirtualBox. Jun 04 17:05
schestowitz Sun is more ‘with’ Linux than with Microsoft. Jun 04 17:05
anivar http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/progra… An Old news on facebook Jun 04 17:05
anivar schestowitz: A national policy for ICT for education is on Drafting in India. I afraid this is a step to influence the process Jun 04 17:06
schestowitz @ <PetoKraus >: Microsoft and Facebook are like a couple scre**ing around without marriage. I don’t trust them and never will. They just picked CPAL (anti-GPL in a way). Jun 04 17:06
schestowitz Aha! Jun 04 17:07
schestowitz Yes, I remember. “Look. Freebie. Give your children’s freedom away for some cash now. Softie will cash in later.” Jun 04 17:07
anivar and a M$ Friendly NGO is in charge of the drafting process Jun 04 17:08
PetoKraus COINCIDENCE??!? Jun 04 17:08
anivar We are trying our best to change the process Jun 04 17:09
anivar See the paper by Dr. Nagarjuna http://gnowgi.org/2008/04/27/… Jun 04 17:09
*maxstirner has quit (“Leaving”) Jun 04 17:09
anivar he is the President of FSF India Jun 04 17:09
*maxstirne1 (n=maxstirn@ has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 17:09
schestowitz Which NGO? Jun 04 17:10
anivar Also we are now in a syllabus change drive to remove proprietary  mentions from syllabus Jun 04 17:10
*akf (i=akf@unaffiliated/akf) has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 17:11
schestowitz I’ve read about this since 2006. They kill Linux with ‘kindness’ Jun 04 17:11
anivar see http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Syllabus_Review Jun 04 17:12
schestowitz (unrelated: http://www.vnunet.com/vnunet/… (Microsoft seeks new revenue sources, so the rumours were true ) Jun 04 17:13
anivar CSDMS Jun 04 17:13
anivar CSDMS is the NGO. The last MS denotes M$ Jun 04 17:13
anivar http://www.csdms.in/gesci/call-for-papers.asp Jun 04 17:13
anivar :-) Jun 04 17:14
anivar http://www.csdms.in/gesci/r-detail.asp have more details of Process Jun 04 17:15
schestowitz Look under “Primary Education” Jun 04 17:15
schestowitz It’s like a Microsoft recruitment camp Jun 04 17:15
PetoKraus ehm compiling openssl…. ^^ Jun 04 17:15
schestowitz <anivar>, I think you should blog this. Jun 04 17:17
anivar I will Try. problem is with time. Jun 04 17:18
anivar The Syllabus Review process is going on now with the help of volunteers Jun 04 17:20
schestowitz I can’t remember is the Gates Fundation [sic] invested in Mercury (San Jose), but here’s a new show-polish article: http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci… Jun 04 17:21
schestowitz They do a lot of Gates praise in the struggling press that Gates ‘saved’ by investing millions (in return for ‘fair’ editorship). Jun 04 17:22
schestowitz Geez! The Microsoft puppet O’Kelly is writing for Forbes too? http://www.forbes.com/technology/2008/06/… Jun 04 17:23
PetoKraus do you have a mysql database for all these people? Jun 04 17:23
schestowitz That’s the man who got a fortune for slamming ODF (and then doing ‘consulting’, preaching to journalists Microsoft flew over to Redmond) Jun 04 17:23
PetoKraus cause i couldn’t remember all those names :D Jun 04 17:23
schestowitz Which ones? Jun 04 17:23
schestowitz I put some of them in  http://boycottnovell.com/credi… . I think  Peter O’Kelly is there too. I only add when I see a pattern recurring. Jun 04 17:25
schestowitz Microsoft has all those PR people running around. Jun 04 17:25
schestowitz Analysts too are marketers in suits. A manager from China told me the other day that those Gartner folks just charge $7000 for ‘reports’. Pay for what you need to convince clients of. Want Gartner rubber stamp of approval for  YaST? Pay up. Jun 04 17:26
*maxstirne1 (n=maxstirn@ has left #boycottnovell Jun 04 17:27
schestowitz http://www.newsline365.com/20081245/indi… ( India Is Not Yet Ready To Accept Microsoft’s OOXML File Format ) Jun 04 17:30
schestowitz Watch the photo. Jun 04 17:30
anivar schestowitz: cool .. nice photo Jun 04 17:33
schestowitz He’s in third grade now. He is almost 4 and a half foot tall. Jun 04 17:34
schestowitz Watch this headline: Microsoft India Plans New Educational Prospects ( http://www.channeltimes.com/In… ). It’s getting clearer now. Jun 04 17:36
schestowitz Better headline would be: Microsoft India blocks new education prospects with FOSS Jun 04 17:36
anivar we are Pretty clear on their tactics Jun 04 17:42
anivar A lot of M$ supporters are there in commitee Jun 04 17:43
anivar They are included as “Educational Experts” Jun 04 17:43
anivar arguing for M$ Jun 04 17:44
anivar Thanks dor the link Jun 04 17:45
schestowitz If you blog it, let me know so I can link to a good summary.. They play a similar game in the UK (BECTA), so citing this to prove universality of the tactic would be handy. Jun 04 17:52
schestowitz Oh, and same in Spain. Jun 04 17:52
anivar I can do it tommorrow Jun 04 17:54
schestowitz Look up OnMyWay. I think it’s the program they run in Europe. Jun 04 17:55
schestowitz “…Eligible to receive money…. as long as you stick with Microsoft.” Jun 04 17:55
anivar Related to Dr.Deepak Patak ‘s Open letter M$ tries to frame him before starting smear campaign against him see this document http://download.microsoft.com/downloa… Jun 04 17:58
anivar He was a jury member in M$ Egov award and his book was released on same function Jun 04 17:58
schestowitz Remember what he said about Microsoft wanting everyone to be not only a friend but also to accept Microsoft’s convictions and dispositions. He quotes some famous things from the cinemas, IIRC. Jun 04 18:04
anivar Yea. Modified Starwars Quote Jun 04 18:05
schestowitz Yes, that’s the one. Jun 04 18:06
anivar schestowitz:  I will let u know after bloging it. need to leave now Jun 04 18:07
*anivar is sleepy Jun 04 18:07
*anivar has quit (Remote closed the connection) Jun 04 18:08
*anivar (n=anivar@ has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 18:09
*anivar has quit (Remote closed the connection) Jun 04 18:09
*anivar (n=anivar@ has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 18:10
*hassanibraheem (n=hassan@ has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 18:21
*PetoKraus has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) Jun 04 18:32
*moparx returns Jun 04 19:05
schestowitz I’m about to post a bunch. I do this in a bursty fashion. Jun 04 19:24
moparx :) Jun 04 19:24
hassanibraheem schestowitz: you should stop blogging, that SuSE’s EULA post explains everything that needs to be said :D Jun 04 19:41
*akf has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) Jun 04 19:41
schestowitz Heh. I hope so, but people forget quickly. There’s new evidence coming all the time. Jun 04 19:56
*hassanibraheem has quit (“Ex-Chat”) Jun 04 20:22
schestowitz Okay, I’m off to bed soon. Hopefully no crazed trolls will invade. :-S Jun 04 20:25
moparx haha Jun 04 20:25
tessier_ schestowitz: I think you should advertise this IRC channel more. It could easily replace c.o.l.a since this place is or can be moderated. Jun 04 20:31
moparx *nod* you should add a permanent  link on the site (possibly at the top with the other links) Jun 04 20:33
tessier_ And maybe also mention it in your signature or something to each of the c.o.l.a postings Jun 04 21:38
*ZiggyFish (n=brendan@123-243-163-103.static.tpgi.com.au) has joined #boycottnovell Jun 04 23:36
ZiggyFish good morning every one Jun 04 23:36
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    Links for the day

  10. IRC Proceedings: Tuesday, January 25, 2022

    IRC logs for Tuesday, January 25, 2022

  11. Links 26/1/2022: No ARM for Nvidia, End of EasyArch, and WordPress 5.9 is Out

    Links for the day

  12. Why the Unified Patent Court (UPC) is Still Just a Fantasy and the UPC's Fake News Mill Merely Discredits the Whole Patent 'Profession'

    Patents and science used to be connected; but now that the patent litigation 'sector' is hijacking patent offices (and even courts in places like Texas) it's trying to shove a Unified Patent Court (UPC) down the EU's throat under the disingenuous cover of "community" or "unity"

  13. Links 25/1/2022: Vulkan 1.3 Released, Kiwi TCMS 11.0, and antiX 19.5

    Links for the day

  14. Gemini Milestones and Growth (Almost 2,000 Known Gemini Servers Now, 39,000 Pages in Ours)

    The diaspora to Gemini Protocol or the transition to alternative 'webs' is underway; a linearly growing curve suggests that inertia/momentum is still there and we reap the benefits of early adoption of Gemini

  15. [Meme] Get Ready for Unified Patent Court (UPC) to be Taken to Court

    The Unified Patent Court (UPC) and Unitary Patent system that’s crafted to empower EPO thugs isn’t legal and isn’t constitutional either; even a thousand fake news 'articles' (deliberate misinformation or disinformation) cannot change the simple facts because CJEU isn’t “trial by media”

  16. The EPO Needs High-Calibre Examiners, Not Politicians Who Pretend to Understand Patents and Science

    Examiners are meant to obstruct fake patents or reject meritless patent applications; why is it that working conditions deteriorate for those who are intellectually equipped to do the job?

  17. Free Software is Greener

    Software Freedom is the only way to properly tackle environmental perils through reuse and recycling; the mainstream media never talks about it because it wants people to "consume" more and more products

  18. Links 25/1/2022: Git 2.35 and New openSUSE Hardware

    Links for the day

  19. IRC Proceedings: Monday, January 24, 2022

    IRC logs for Monday, January 24, 2022

  20. Links 25/1/2022: GPL Settlement With Patrick McHardy, Godot 4.0 Alpha 1, and DXVK 1.9.4 Released

    Links for the day

  21. Proprietary Software is Pollution

    "My daughter asked me about why are we throwing away some bits of technology," Dr. Andy Farnell says. "This is my attempt to put into words for "ordinary" people what I tried to explain to a 6 year old."

  22. Microsoft GitHub Exposé — Part XV — Cover-Up and Defamation

    Defamation of one’s victims might be another offence to add to the long list of offences committed by Microsoft’s Chief Architect of GitHub Copilot, Balabhadra (Alex) Graveley; attempting to discredit the police report is a new low and can get Mr. Graveley even deeper in trouble (Microsoft protecting him only makes matters worse)

  23. [Meme] Alexander Ramsay and Team UPC Inciting Politicians to Break the Law and Violate Constitutions, Based on Misinformation, Fake News, and Deliberate Lies Wrapped up as 'Studies'

    The EPO‘s law-breaking leadership (Benoît Battistelli, António Campinos and their corrupt cronies), helped by liars who don't enjoy diplomatic immunity, are cooperating to undermine courts across the EU, in effect replacing them with EPO puppets who are patent maximalists (Europe’s equivalents of James Rodney Gilstrap and Alan D Albright, a Donald Trump appointee, in the Eastern and Western Districts of Texas, respectively)

  24. Has the Administrative Council Belatedly Realised What Its Job in the European Patent Organisation Really Is?

    The "Mafia" which took over the EPO (the EPO's own workers call it "Mafia") isn't getting its way with a proposal, so it's preventing the states from even voting on it!

  25. [Meme] Team UPC is Celebrating a Pyrrhic Victory

    Pyrrhic victory best describes what's happening at the moment (it’s a lobbying tactic, faking/staging things to help false prophecies be fulfilled, based on hopes and wishes alone), for faking something without bothering to explain the legal basis is going to lead to further escalations and complaints (already impending)

  26. Links 24/1/2022: Scribus 1.5.8 and LXLE Reviewed

    Links for the day

  27. IRC Proceedings: Sunday, January 23, 2022

    IRC logs for Sunday, January 23, 2022

  28. [Meme] Team UPC Congratulating Itself

    The barrage of fake news and misinformation about the UPC deliberately leaves out all the obvious and very important facts; even the EPO‘s António Campinos and Breton (Benoît Battistelli‘s buddy) participated in the lying

  29. Links 24/1/2022: pgBadger 11.7 Released, Catch-up With Patents

    Links for the day

  30. The Demonisation and Stereotyping of Coders Not Working for Big Corporations (or 'The System')

    The war on encrypted communication (or secure communications) carries on despite a lack of evidence that encryption stands in the way of crime investigations (most criminals use none of it)

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