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09.22.08

IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: September 21st, 2008 – Part 1

Posted in IRC Logs at 3:18 am by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

GNOME Gedit

Enter the IRC channel now

twitter Yes, one of M$’s favorite tricks is to tell everyone that ALL software sucks like their software sucks.  See Benjie above for an example of that. Sep 21 00:08
schestowitz There are articles about that, but a friend of mine can’t find them. It’s probably “Murphy” Sep 21 00:10
schestowitz “All software is insecure. Deal with it.” Sep 21 00:10
benJIman cj: Quite a good article modulo some incorrect java trolling. Sep 21 00:10
cj benJIman: I told him as much Sep 21 00:19
twitter Here are a few articles about accounting fraud at CA.  http://www.stargeek.com/item/67091.html Sep 21 00:30
twitter Nothing related to M$ other than similar methods. Sep 21 00:30
schestowitz http://findarticles.com/p/articles… Sep 21 00:34
schestowitz Burgum resigned lasr year, IIRC. Sep 21 00:34
twitter CA, it seems, was important to M$’s entry to “enterprise” computing.  http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res… Sep 21 00:36
schestowitz Missing article from ECT: http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=mozclient… Sep 21 00:36
schestowitz Were you here the other day when we discusses CA corruptions going all the way to the top? Sep 21 00:36
twitter I saw some CA discussion yesterday. Sep 21 00:38
twitter You asked me to look into M$ connections.  I did not find much. Sep 21 00:39
schestowitz http://www.sec.gov/news/press/2002-71.htm Sep 21 00:39
schestowitz “The Securities and Exchange Commission today announced charges in separate cases against former executives at three northern California software companies for perpetrating financial accounting frauds at those companies. “ Sep 21 00:40
schestowitz “”Among those named were the former chief executive officer of Quintus Corp., the former chief executive and chief financial officers of Unify Corp., and former senior sales executives of Legato Systems, Inc. Also today, the U.S. Attorney’s Office for the Northern District of California announced criminal charges against former officers at Quintus and Unify for their roles in the frauds.” Sep 21 00:40
schestowitz http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-… (Liddell destroying Microsoft from within) Sep 21 00:40
twitter 2002 … is this related to 2004 about CA’s Kumar stepping down? Sep 21 00:41
twitter Atta-boy Liddell! Sep 21 00:41
schestowitz NZ First facing ‘serious and complex fraud’ inquiry [Clark knew of conflict of evidence in February]  http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/art… Sep 21 00:41
schestowitz Microsoft’s Liddell is from NZ, IIRC. Paper industry… the previous CFO left Microsoft Sep 21 00:42
schestowitz The article about mentioned a “SFO Grant Liddell”. I wonder if there could be a relation. Sep 21 00:42
schestowitz Int’l Paper CFO Chris Liddell to become Microsoft CFO By Heather Wilson Last update: 3:22 p.m. EDT April 25, 2005 http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/intl-paper-cfo-… Sep 21 00:45
schestowitz From Int’l Paper  to a software company then. I remembered correctly. Sep 21 00:45
schestowitz Maybe he knows how to cook those papers… or books. Sep 21 00:45
twitter Don’t know but Blankenhorn seems unaware of previous buying binges/destruction of rivals by M$.  Backup software in the 90′s, for  example.  They bought up everyone and provided their customers with crap that did not work. Sep 21 00:46
schestowitz http://query.nytimes.com/g… : Microsoft has hired Christopher Liddell, left, as its chief financial officer, replacing John Connors. Mr. Liddell was previously chief finance officer at International Paper. Sep 21 00:46
schestowitz Mind you, if Microsoft’s revenue increased, then Bill buddy Nathan wouldn’t be asked by him to find new revenue sources (patents), but he was Sep 21 00:47
twitter There are other examples.  Spyglass browser, the AV market and so on.  They pay out less as time goes on. Sep 21 00:47
twitter M$ has the best picture of anyone of how badly Vista and Office are selling (or not). Sep 21 00:48
schestowitz http://www.forbes.com/finance/mktguideapps/person… ” Mr. Connors, 49, a director since 2005, is a partner in Ignition Partners LLC, a Seattle-area venture capital firm. Mr. Connors served as Senior Vice President and Chief Financial Officer of Microsoft Corporation from December 1999 to May 2005.” Sep 21 00:49
twitter The rest of us can see things like hardware gluts and large retailer failures. Sep 21 00:49
twitter interesting.  nice hunting. Sep 21 00:49
schestowitz Here is his company: Ignition Partners LLC Sep 21 00:49
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/ Sep 21 00:50
schestowitz Let’s see where he puts $$ Sep 21 00:50
schestowitz http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=mozclient… Sep 21 00:51
schestowitz This shows that quite a few Softies are there. Shades of IV and Acacia.. Sep 21 00:51
schestowitz WTF? Sep 21 00:51
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/people/… Sep 21 00:52
schestowitz That’s the vandal! The “tilt into the death spiral” guy. Sep 21 00:52
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/people/ven… “Prior to Ignition, Martin spent more than 15 years in operating roles in technology companies, including four years at Loudeye Technologies and six years with Microsoft.” Sep 21 00:52
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/people/partne… “Prior to joining Ignition, Richard spent 16 years at Microsoft Corporation in several leadership roles including serving in the executive staff as a division level vice president.” Sep 21 00:52
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/pe… “Prior to Ignition, Cameron spent thirteen years with Microsoft Corporation, most recently as Vice President of the Internet Customer Unit, where he was responsible for building business relationships with network operators and a broad range of telecommunications providers.” Sep 21 00:53
schestowitz Cameron Myhrvold, PARTNER —- is he related to Nathan?? Sep 21 00:53
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/peopl… “Prior to Ignition, John spent 11 years Microsoft where he most recently served at Vice President of Product Development. “ Sep 21 00:54
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/peopl… “Prior to Ignition, John spent over 8 years at Microsoft in various senior marketing and strategy positions. “ Sep 21 00:54
twitter Ick, what does Ignition do with all these frauds? Sep 21 00:54
schestowitz Mind the fact that this site is PHP-powered. :-) Sep 21 00:54
schestowitz twitter: it was created (I think) by the Microsoft CFO who left Sep 21 00:55
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/pe… “Prior to Ignition, Jon spent nine years at Microsoft Corporation in several strategic roles…” Sep 21 00:55
twitter Taking your idea to these guys is like taking your baby girl to a shark tank. Sep 21 00:55
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/people/… “Prior to Ignition, Rich spent 12 years at Microsoft where he most recently served as Vice President of Marketing for MS Office and BackOffice.” Sep 21 00:56
twitter Shark says, “We sure know a lot about eating, let us feed and grow your baby.” Sep 21 00:56
schestowitz twitter: there might be Nathan’s brother there. Sep 21 00:56
schestowitz I reckon this might be a Microsoft spinoff so to speak that can invest in Microsoft’s intrests. Sep 21 00:56
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/peo… “Prior to Ignition, Carolyn spent five years at Microsoft, most recently, as the Director of Worldwide Business Strategy,” Sep 21 00:57
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/people/part… “Prior to joining Ignition, John spent sixteen years at Microsoft Corporation in several strategic roles. “ Sep 21 00:57
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/people/pa… “Prior to Ignition Roberts spent 13 years at Microsoft, most recently as General Manager of the Windows CE Intelligent Appliance Division” Sep 21 00:58
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/people/pri… “Prior to joining Ignition Michelle worked as an independent consultant at Microsoft where she developed the initial business plans for products in the enterprise server space.” Sep 21 00:58
twitter Could be.  One Softie firm to steal ideas, another to snuff them out. Sep 21 00:58
schestowitz Almost the whole company is just Microsoft Sep 21 00:59
schestowitz Nothing in the Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?tit… Sep 21 00:59
twitter Do they have any testimonials? Sep 21 01:00
twitter Here’s an article on Intellectual Vultures http://techdirt.com/articles/2008… Sep 21 01:00
schestowitz http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/vent… “But the Bellevue venture capital firm, which raised more than $300 million last fall and recently hired former Microsoft Chief Financial Officer John Connors, is looking to move upstream with its investing tactics.” Sep 21 01:00
schestowitz On the side you can see Todd Bishop. He’s cover Microsoft for ages and jumped ship the other day. Sep 21 01:01
schestowitz The more paranoid side of me says it may have to do with the future he sees. http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/… Sep 21 01:02
schestowitz That’s a lot of money that needs to come from somewhere: http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/… Sep 21 01:02
schestowitz http://slated.org/microsoft_loses_90_bi… Sep 21 01:03
schestowitz (in market value anyway) Sep 21 01:03
twitter The ignition favico is a lot like a hurricane warning flag http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7e/Hu… Sep 21 01:03
schestowitz Let’s try to see what they put money in. They can serve as a Microsoft wing. Sep 21 01:03
twitter holy crap, check out all of the ignition companies http://www.ignitionpartners.com/portfolio/ Sep 21 01:04
twitter XenSource Sep 21 01:04
twitter avogadro Sep 21 01:04
schestowitz “Ignition was founded in early 2000 by a team of former senior McCaw Cellular, AT&T Wireless and Microsoft executives.” ( http://slated.org/microsoft_loses_90_billion_dollars ) Sep 21 01:05
schestowitz Oops: http://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/stories/2004/10… Sep 21 01:05
schestowitz XenSource??????/ Sep 21 01:06
schestowitz Aha! Sep 21 01:06
twitter Lots of “independent” people to stack panels with. Sep 21 01:06
schestowitz XenSource moves to Seattle just before Microsoft scooped them using Xen (to avoid GPL and FTC) Sep 21 01:06
twitter Citrix bought them, claims ignition. Sep 21 01:06
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/portfoli… “XenSource (acquired by Citrix)” Sep 21 01:07
schestowitz That’s like saying: “we gave them money, they came to Seattle, a Microsoft GM became a leader there (I can’t recall which position, and Microsoft’s bride then bought them” Sep 21 01:07
schestowitz But who is that Myhrvold, I wonder… Sep 21 01:08
schestowitz Aha! Sep 21 01:09
schestowitz “Myhrvold is the highest profile executive to take a break from Microsoft but he’s part of a growing trend. Several months ago, his brother, Cameron Myhrvold, who was vice president of Microsoft’s Internet customer unit, testified for Microsoft in the antitrust case, left Microsoft. “ Sep 21 01:10
schestowitz So Nathan (patent troll and Gates’ buddy) is the bother of Cameron from Ignition. Sep 21 01:10
schestowitz Both located in WA and serving Microsoft from outside (arguable at this stage) Sep 21 01:11
schestowitz Here is the source: http://www.forbes.com/1999/05/31/AS… Sep 21 01:11
twitter The case history will tell the story.  If they take M$ start up money and then piss all over free software projects, we know it’s another SCO like attack by proxy. Sep 21 01:12
schestowitz *LOL* That’s him, isn’t it? http://www.new.facebook.com/peopl… Drinking wine like a homeless guy… Sep 21 01:13
twitter If they don’t just take on M$ friendly lawsuits, they are just another patent troll.  M$ ethics either way. Sep 21 01:13
schestowitz *nod* Sep 21 01:14
schestowitz What’s RLX? Sep 21 01:15
schestowitz http://www.ignitionpartners.com/portfolio/por… Sep 21 01:15
twitter something to do with Linux. Sep 21 01:17
schestowitz Watch this headline: http://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/s… Sep 21 01:17
schestowitz “Ignition Partners-backed XenSource sells for $500M” Sep 21 01:17
schestowitz “XenSource Inc., a technology company backed by Ignition Partners of Bellevue, has agreed to be acquired by Citrix Systems Inc. for about $500 million in cash and stock.” Sep 21 01:17
twitter http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom… Sep 21 01:17
twitter some kind of server management company Sep 21 01:17
schestowitz Translation: a company that was all about GPL and Linux is now backed by top Microsoft seniors, who wed the company with Microsoft’s bride Citrix. Sep 21 01:18
schestowitz “Vendor capture,” as zoobab puts it. Sep 21 01:18
twitter Works with winblows, no surprise.  http://h18004.www1.hp.com/products/servers/… Sep 21 01:19
twitter It could have been grown by them all along.  What you see however, is a buy out of all sorts of Linux management software. Sep 21 01:20
schestowitz http://www.it-co.biz/c… Sep 21 01:20
schestowitz Ex-Microsoft’s exec Gordon Mangione joins XenSource… “Gordon Mangione, who headed up SQL Server and security duties at Microsoft before leaving last year, is now surfacing at Xensource as senior vice president of products and operations. “ Sep 21 01:20
schestowitz “Since leaving Microsoft last November, Mangione has worked with both VC Ignition Partners and Lockdown Networks, a maker of network access control technology.” Sep 21 01:20
schestowitz INER Sep 21 01:21
schestowitz INTER~1 INTER~1 INTER~1 INTER~1 INTER~1 BILITY^H^H^H^H “The move makes sense for Xensource, an open-source virtualization specialist that is seeking to boost interop with Microsoft technologies.” Sep 21 01:21
schestowitz Do indeed they took the company, gave it some money, planted some Microsoft people inside and then gave it away to Citricsoft Sep 21 01:22
schestowitz Anyway, I’m off to bed. Tomorrow… Sep 21 01:24
twitter Night night, don’t think they will be able to buy http://www.nagios.org/about/ Sep 21 01:25
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twitter holy crap.  $700 Billion http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=2… Sep 21 02:41
twitter Overseen by a “dictator” Sep 21 02:45
twitter able to buy foreign and domestic Sep 21 02:46
ZiggyFish http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2008/09/… – They fucked this one up as well Sep 21 03:15
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dennis_ Hello all… I’m Dennis Sep 21 06:50
dennis_ Is it true that mono is bad because of microsoft? Sep 21 06:50
dennis_ Someone told me that you can use mono Sep 21 06:50
dennis_ ok, i guess its not a prlem than Sep 21 06:53
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dennis_ Hello? Sep 21 07:00
dennis_ I want to know the thruth Sep 21 07:00
dennis_ Wow… You all dicks Sep 21 07:02
dennis_ Fuck u all Sep 21 07:04
dennis_ ms rules Sep 21 07:04
dennis_ schestowiz you are stupid Sep 21 07:04
dennis_ haha Sep 21 07:04
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dennis_ wat? nothing? Hahaha/…. to afraid Sep 21 07:06
dennis_ microsoft is good for computes Sep 21 07:06
dennis_ novell to Sep 21 07:07
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dennis_ hello? Sep 21 07:32
dennis_ nobody? Sep 21 07:32
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schestowitz http://community.zdnet.co.uk/blog… “Microsoft has turned into the biggest patent troll in the world. The only thing that makes any sense is that some attorney in their employ is considering that a defensive move to prevent other bottom feeders from suing Microsoft. “ Sep 21 08:07
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schestowitz The world is recognising something obvious (which Ballmer and the SEC filing have admitted for years): http://vista.blorge.com/2008/09/19/is-l… “The various distributions of Linux most likely pose the greatest threat to Windows Vista overall- why you ask?” Sep 21 09:14
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AVRS2 Do patents get more publicity lately? Or are their holders worried about them? More and more ads mentions patents. Now there are patent-only ads on TV… Sep 21 12:17
AVRS2 (showing crashtest, then in reverse, with caption: 1755 inventions will protect you … 4xxx more will …) Sep 21 12:18
AVRS2 Guess I haven’t misheard or forgot it… searching for “nissan microsoft” shows lots of different things. Sep 21 12:24
AVRS2 s/ad/commercial/ Sep 21 12:24
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roybixler I’ve been travelling and have been kind of out of touch for a while.  But here is an interesting site: http://www.racketiciel.info/ Sep 21 15:01
roybixler It’s French and the name is a combination of “logiciel” (software) and “racket” (obvious) Sep 21 15:02
roybixler I heard about this site from a story in Le Monde, where they covered this French group against the Microsoft tax. Sep 21 15:03
roybixler My 2 centimes for now … Sep 21 15:03
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_Doug Don’t mind me, I’m just keeping an EYE on ROY .. :) Sep 21 16:05
_Doug http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?… Sep 21 16:05
_Doug IF you don’t like emacs then you ain’t a real techie Sep 21 16:06
_Doug I met a techie for old Yahoo and he designed his bit on four BASH screens running emacs .. Sep 21 16:06
schestowitz Hey, _Doug Sep 21 16:12
schestowitz Wrong question: boot duration. The question should be how often is it necessary to take it down/hibernate. Sep 21 16:13
benJIman http://ask.slashdot.org/article.p… Sep 21 16:13
benJIman 17:08:47 < _Doug> IF you don’t like emacs then you ain’t a real techie Sep 21 16:13
benJIman http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl… Sep 21 16:13
benJIman oops Sep 21 16:13
schestowitz AVRS2: there’s a patent fever, I think, but it overlaps with patent revolt (predictable, ain’t it?) Sep 21 16:14
twitter If you worry about boot time you need to find more dependable software with better power management. Sep 21 16:14
schestowitz Sub-notebooks and ASUS boards have Linux boot within seconds. Sep 21 16:15
twitter It’s painful to watch people booting their computers, especially laptops. Sep 21 16:16
twitter I use APM on an old Thinkpad.  It works great. Sep 21 16:16
twitter I close the lid, it sleeps.  I open the lid and my work is where I left it. Sep 21 16:16
twitter Closing the lid takes no time.  Wake up takes a few seconds. Sep 21 16:17
twitter I have not used my daughter’s EEEPC enough to know if it is as dependable as the Thinkpads are but it seems to work. Sep 21 16:18
schestowitz My Windows 98 laptop (last Windows machine) could hibernate or stand by. Not too sure if progress has been made since. I hear that Vista takes ages to boot. Sep 21 16:20
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_Doug Embedded hardware , noharddrive, no backlight .. Sep 21 16:26
_Doug at least one that don’t need a backlight in daylight .. Sep 21 16:26
_Doug And a low power mode . .eg the clock slows down .. almost to 100 htz ? Sep 21 16:26
_Doug oh .. what agile innovation .. :) Sep 21 16:27
_Doug eliminate the bios and boot sequence .. now that’s what I call INNOV~1 Sep 21 16:27
schestowitz It can be done. Hold on… there’s already something on the way… Sep 21 16:28
_Doug yea, design it so as you can halt the clock .. Sep 21 16:28
schestowitz http://www.osnews.com/story/19661/A_… Sep 21 16:30
_Doug An LCD display when not being updated consums zero power, yea ? Sep 21 16:30
twitter Windows never got power management right.  Applications like Word would bomb on wake up.  Then APCI was a huge step backwards.  http://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/183403 Sep 21 16:30
_Doug So when the keyboard isn’t beign pressed switch off the clock .. and it’s suspend mode with instant on .. Sep 21 16:30
schestowitz Intel also has some alternation for the current BIOS… can’t recall what they call it. Sep 21 16:30
twitter We can not trust Intel with power management. Sep 21 16:31
_Doug suspend-hybernate-sleep .. are all a hack .. Sep 21 16:31
schestowitz Check this one out: http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS4716172415.html Sep 21 16:32
_Doug All this discussion is so 1998 .. :) Sep 21 16:32
schestowitz “The PIC has been demonstrated running Linux, although versions of the device that were sold along with Internet service packages in developing nations reportedly blocked Linux at the BIOS level. “ Sep 21 16:32
schestowitz AMD PIC snubs Linux : http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS… Sep 21 16:32
twitter Stopping the clock on RAM will only work when memory is both fast and non volatile Sep 21 16:32
schestowitz WARNING!! There is windows in my.. BIOS!!!! :  http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/showthread.php?p… Sep 21 16:33
_Doug AMD’s (PIC) why did it fail ? Sep 21 16:33
_Doug Because it didn’t have a major OEM behind it .. like DELL ? Sep 21 16:33
schestowitz Intel Expected to Open Next-gen BIOS Code in China : http://www.cabi.net.cn/view_article.php?id=469 Sep 21 16:34
*libervisco (n=daniel@tuxhacker/libervisco) has joined #boycottnovell Sep 21 16:34
schestowitz Intel to make major UEFI announcement : http://apcmag.com/5845/intel_to_make_ma… Sep 21 16:34
schestowitz No, Dell was bribed by Intel Sep 21 16:35
schestowitz They did illegal and secret kickbacks. Welcome to Wall Street! Where investors sue Dell for $1 billion in compensation for massive under-the-table kickbacks. Sep 21 16:35
_Doug Dell was bribed by Intel: any citations Schestowitz ? Sep 21 16:36
schestowitz Yes Sep 21 16:36
schestowitz They don’t call it “bribe” though. They embellish. Sep 21 16:36
_Doug ot: 2GBs to type a letter .. GOOD GRIEF !!!! Sep 21 16:37
schestowitz Like Microsoft when it bribed a Nigerian official and called it “marketing help” Sep 21 16:37
schestowitz http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/… Sep 21 16:37
_Doug well a big DOH !! tell me something know .. Sep 21 16:37
_Doug knew Sep 21 16:37
_Doug This is about par for the cource, A does deal with B to squeeze C, later on B does deal with B to do it to A, welcome to market capitolism 101 … Sep 21 16:39
_Doug A->B screws C, B->C screws A … Sep 21 16:40
schestowitz IBM collaborates/competes with Sun  collaborates/competes with Microsoft collaborates/competes with Novell… companies don’t have partners… they have interests. Sep 21 16:42
_Doug Well yea, I knew that already .. Sep 21 16:44
schestowitz It harms consumers. The illusion that capitalism is competition, not collusion. Sep 21 16:45
_Doug Speaking of bribery, I once worked for a company where I became of irregularities as in they didn’t know the fuck what they were on about. Sep 21 16:45
schestowitz Just watch how ATI and NVidia (IIRC) actually worked together on price-fixing. Sep 21 16:45
_Doug When I brought it to managements attention Sep 21 16:45
schestowitz Maybe it was just an allegation, but GPUs are overpriced anyway Sep 21 16:45
_Doug They hied me on for a special ‘project’ until my contract was up .. Sep 21 16:45
_Doug Wh oam I to refuse an extra £2,000 :) Sep 21 16:45
schestowitz _Doug: Sep 21 16:45
_Doug hired Sep 21 16:45
schestowitz Seen the Charlie story yet/ Sep 21 16:46
schestowitz ? Sep 21 16:46
_Doug No, what Charlie story ? Sep 21 16:46
schestowitz It’s common. That’s how Microsoft silenced a whistleblower. Sep 21 16:46
schestowitz The judge was convinced. Sep 21 16:46
schestowitz Let me find it. You don’t follow COLA, so you must have missed it. Sep 21 16:46
_Doug Ahh .yea .. I ma familiar with the technigue . .:) Sep 21 16:46
schestowitz http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/26… http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/… Sep 21 16:47
schestowitz I guess you could still snitch on that company you worked for. Charlie, on the other hand, received a good sum to STFU and have the evidence destoryed. Sep 21 16:48
schestowitz But wait, there’s more. Sep 21 16:48
schestowitz The whistleblowing story came back to MS 2 weeks ago, but in a different form. Sep 21 16:48
schestowitz Here is the story http://boycottnovell.com/2008/09/15/mi… . I read in some places that he plans to sue  them for firing him after he had said the truth. It would surprise me if Microsoft will be sued and then ‘pull a Charlie’, i.e. pay his $millions to drop the suit and settle out of court. Sep 21 16:50
*trmanco (n=trmanco@bl8-226-224.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #boycottnovell Sep 21 16:50
twitter Doug, the AMD PIC was sold in Radio Shacks.  It could have done well if it were hackable, but it was locked down.  Would you buy a device that would only run WinCE? Sep 21 16:50
_Doug Nope, locked down to what exactly ? Sep 21 16:51
schestowitz Welcome to 21st century justice. A justice where you can commit crime, sack people who snitch about it, bribe them to shut up having been fired (if necessary) and then corrupt the government to settle with the SEC too (see the Charlie saga again). Sep 21 16:51
_Doug Roy: you sound shocked, welcome to the real world .. businesses massage the books, as long as it isn’t outright fraud, then it’s borderline acceptable. Sep 21 16:52
twitter That is outright fraud.  Jail is part of the real world too. Sep 21 16:52
schestowitz _Doug: I’m not shocked, but I think the Net gives an opportunity to truth Sep 21 16:53
_Doug In contrast to politicians walking through airport gates with suitcases full on money, then these are pure as the driven snow . .:) Sep 21 16:53
schestowitz I’m a big wikileaks fan. Sep 21 16:53
schestowitz twitter: in the ‘real’ world, rich people like Jobs can rarely end up in a cell Sep 21 16:54
_Doug That’s why the truth must be covered with a heap of lies and distortions, or at least the messenger discredited .. Sep 21 16:54
schestowitz Martha Stewart was a watch-and-learn exception. Sep 21 16:54
twitter It’s getting harder to discredit the messenger. Sep 21 16:54
schestowitz Robbie Bach did pretty much the same thing and he should be sent to prison (he’s a Microsoft vice president BTW) Sep 21 16:55
_Doug Martha Stewart: she was prosecuted for tax evasion, how is that shoot the messenger ? Sep 21 16:55
twitter Tax evasion and inside trading. Sep 21 16:55
schestowitz Yesw Sep 21 16:55
_Doug If she was smart she wouldn’t ever be caught .. should have kept her money in Switzerland .. Sep 21 16:55
schestowitz Microsoft does both Sep 21 16:56
twitter she was an exception and one that proves the rule Sep 21 16:56
schestowitz The tax breaks, however, it might as well be legalising by greasing up the right pollies. Sep 21 16:56
_Doug I mean if anyone on the inside whistleblows, they are either bribed or discredited .. Sep 21 16:56
twitter the freer flow of information will start nailing bigger targets sooner or later. Sep 21 16:56
_Doug The ship of bribes carries right on crusing Sep 21 16:57
_Doug Standby to be tared with ‘subversive’ or offered a job with a ‘consuntancy’ ;) Sep 21 16:57
_Doug time for a break, keep an eye on Roy for me won’t you benJIman :) Sep 21 16:58
schestowitz _Doug: the risk is increased though Sep 21 16:59
trmanco schestowitz, you used a Portuguese based article, to prove a Astroturf thing on usenet :P Sep 21 16:59
schestowitz The hope is not the lock up society, but to keep people honest and prident. Sep 21 16:59
schestowitz *prudent Sep 21 16:59
schestowitz Yes. :-0 Sep 21 16:59
schestowitz I know Rui Sep 21 16:59
trmanco :D Sep 21 16:59
schestowitz He had lots of Astofluffers in his blog. Sep 21 17:00
schestowitz I wrote about it here: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/12… Sep 21 17:00
trmanco :) Sep 21 17:03
trmanco htt p://www.bomahy.nl/hylke/blog/gnome-30-art-roadmap-first-draft/ Sep 21 17:05
schestowitz http://www.bomahy.nl/hylke/blog/gnome-… Sep 21 17:06
schestowitz No i can click it (it’s faster) Sep 21 17:06
trmanco :P Sep 21 17:06
schestowitz No picture of monkeys?!?! Sep 21 17:07
trmanco nop Sep 21 17:07
schestowitz “I’d like to see Gnome applications written in .NET in version 4.0 – no, version 3.0. But Gnome 4.0 should be based on .NET,” he told us. “A lot of people just see .NET as a fantastic upgrade for the development platform from Microsoft. ( http://www.theregister.co.uk/2002/02/… ) Sep 21 17:07
trmanco I just wanted to point out the banshee reference at the end of the pdf Sep 21 17:08
trmanco who said that? Sep 21 17:08
trmanco Mr.Icaza? Sep 21 17:08
schestowitz Doctor ActiveX. Sep 21 17:08
schestowitz ls Sep 21 17:09
schestowitz .gdm.DLL startx.EXE ……. Sep 21 17:09
trmanco lol Sep 21 17:09
trmanco gdm.dll has encountered an error Sep 21 17:10
schestowitz Look at the bright side. It’ll be easier for AV vendors to adapt Sep 21 17:10
schestowitz BSOM… no, not what you think… Blue Screen of Mono: http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/uplo… Sep 21 17:11
trmanco lol Sep 21 17:11
trmanco BsODM0N Sep 21 17:12
schestowitz Demon? http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/up… Sep 21 17:13
_Doug Microsoft + Yahoo = Good, Google + Yahoo = bad, explain the logic ? Sep 21 17:22
schestowitz Who do you think is behind it? Sep 21 17:23
schestowitz http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&am… Sep 21 17:24
schestowitz I’m trying to find many articles that I saw last week. Sep 21 17:24
schestowitz Schmidt accused Microsoft of being pretty much the sole reason there was scrutiny. I have just one reference about it (there were many articles though). Hold on. Sep 21 17:25
schestowitz Microsoft bought astroturfers against it, according to reports: http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2… : Corn Farmers Against Google? Sep 21 17:26
schestowitz http://www.computerweekly.com/Articles/2008/08/2…  ( Google/Yahoo web ad deal on track despite anti-trust scrutiny ) Sep 21 17:26
schestowitz http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/20… ( Icahn and Microsoft to oust Yahoo board ) Sep 21 17:26
schestowitz http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/… ( Microsoft cops to talking with Icahn on Yahoo ) Sep 21 17:27
schestowitz http://blogs.barrons.com/techtraderdaily/20… ( Yahoo: Icahn “Manipulates The Facts” ) Sep 21 17:27
schestowitz But this one is the latest I was talking about : http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2008/09/18/goog… ( Google Blames Microsoft for Yahoo! Deal Controversy ) Sep 21 17:28
schestowitz It’s a dejva vu ’cause Microsoft tried it before when it tried to buy DoubleClick (like Yahoo), but saw it going to Google at the end. Sep 21 17:29
schestowitz *deja . Let me get URLs Sep 21 17:29
schestowitz http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070816-microsoft-s… ( Microsoft trying to derail Google/DoubleClick deal by lobbying congress ) Sep 21 17:29
schestowitz They had the buyout postponed and gave Google a bad reputation: http://investing.reuters.co.uk/news/art… ( Google-Doubleclick deal likely to win OK – experts ) Sep 21 17:30
schestowitz Here  you can see that Microsoft wanted to buy DoubleClick and was willing to pay more than Google: http://battellemedia.com/archives/003561.php ( News Analysis: Microsoft General Counsel on DoubleClick and Antitrust ) Sep 21 17:31
schestowitz To sum up: http://www.forbes.com/2007/03/06/microsoft-goo… ( Microsoft Befriends Google’s Foes ) Sep 21 17:32
twitter in the Wintel press, M$=good M$_competitor=bad.  M$ never was good at math, so they add or multiply both sides of either equation anyway they like Sep 21 17:45
_Doug Lenovo launches Linux netbook ? Sep 21 17:48
_Doug http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS4400501053.html Sep 21 17:48
schestowitz Not in the US… Sep 21 17:48
schestowitz Lenovo is bizarre. Sep 21 17:48
_Doug “for “certain overseas markets,” a version of Linux (Linpus, in this case” Sep 21 17:48
schestowitz They also neglected Red Hat (initially) from server, using SLES instead. Sep 21 17:48
schestowitz I’m waiting for a comment of mine to show up here (left it this morning): Microsoft’s “I’m a PC” Millions Actually Promoting the Mac Sep 21 17:49
schestowitz Oops: http://www.sutor.com/newsite/blog-open/ Sep 21 17:49
_Doug http://www.desktoplinux.com/news… Sep 21 17:50
schestowitz I left a question: “As VP of standards, do you believe there is a chance that IBM will challenge the patent system? The goodwill gain would be tremendous. Just watch SGI.” Sep 21 17:50
schestowitz IBM is still partly responsible for that Novell/Microsoft deal for all I can tell Sep 21 17:50
_Doug ? how ? Sep 21 17:52
_Doug By letting them sabatage OS/2 ? Sep 21 17:55
_Doug IBM, the Personal Computer company that lost control of it’s business, twice ! Sep 21 17:56
schestowitz No, wait Sep 21 17:57
schestowitz I got information from someone who met Hovsepian some years back (he’s from IBM BTW, much like Jaffe, the CTO) Sep 21 17:57
schestowitz My thoughts about it are here: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/0… Sep 21 17:58
_Doug Well, IBM ‘supported’ Linux from wayback .. but made sure not to actuallt own a distro, thet was very prescient of the Nazgûls .. Sep 21 18:01
_Doug Didn’t they recently release a Linux only desktop ? Sep 21 18:03
schestowitz Lip service so far. Sep 21 18:03
schestowitz Either way, they didn’t like Red Hat con trolling the server market, so they gave Novell a push. That’s how the theory (which I think is very substantiated) goes. Sep 21 18:04
schestowitz They handed out a large endowment for S.u.S.E. to marry the Ximian/Novell duo. Sep 21 18:05
_Doug To be fair, a bit more than lipservice .. I think … Sep 21 18:07
_Doug They contribute to the kernel .. Sep 21 18:07
_Doug GCC, GLIB, Apache .. Sep 21 18:08
_Doug SAMBA Sep 21 18:08
schestowitz Yes, they use a lot of that. Sep 21 18:09
_Doug My question is, what is their thinking behind not actually owning a distro ? Sep 21 18:09
schestowitz _Doug: public perception. Sep 21 18:09
schestowitz Remember that Washington company they hired many years ago? Sep 21 18:09
_Doug “public perception” of what ? not even this. Sep 21 18:10
schestowitz Too much control. I read that somewhere anyway. Sep 21 18:10
_Doug The reason is, it prevents them getting IBMed again .. yea ? Sep 21 18:10
schestowitz Red Hat? Sep 21 18:14
_Doug http://www.tectonic.co.za/?p=3025 Sep 21 18:14
_Doug What about RedHat ? Sep 21 18:14
schestowitz Well, one could argue that Red Hat alone could get a “GNU/Linux monopoly” and use that to outgrow IBM as it develops. [theory /] Sep 21 18:14
schestowitz Yes, I saw that when he published it. Sep 21 18:15
_Doug monopoly: to get that they need to tie up the OEMs .. :) Sep 21 18:16
_Doug We’re past where such a desktop monopoly could be achieved again. Sep 21 18:16
_Doug Unless they go for a total stack, an OEM + an OS maker + a media provider + a telecom company (like comcast) Sep 21 18:18
_Doug He who has his foot on the hose, controls the InterPIPES .. :) Sep 21 18:18
_Doug In terms as to who has the most influence, it’s the owner of the desktop OS, an historical distortion. Sep 21 18:19
schestowitz Well, I don’t advocate Lotus for this reason. Sep 21 18:19
_Doug imho: it’s the owner of the pipes and the hardware makers, as they have the power as to what OS goes onto the machine .. Sep 21 18:19
schestowitz IBM, like Novell, is still about cotnrol. Sun… a little less. Sep 21 18:19
_Doug Imagine what would happen if all the hardware manufacturers united and formed United OEMs ! Sep 21 18:20
_Doug That would that leave the OS venders, the ISPs and the media owners .. Sep 21 18:21
schestowitz Media has owners?? Sep 21 18:22
schestowitz Depends on what you obtain. There’s lots of CC stuff out there. Sep 21 18:23
_Doug Well, yea, which is why it is a dumb idea to give away control of all your media .. Sep 21 18:23
schestowitz As for ISPs, that’s why we need wireless meshes… cut the middleman… which won’t happen because they want central control for censorship and such. Sep 21 18:23
_Doug I’m looking at the big picture .. here … Sep 21 18:23
schestowitz As for software, Free software is virtually /ownerless/. Share your code with mates.. Sep 21 18:24
_Doug Right now there is a desktop multimedia OS available, that is the equivilent to Windows. Why hasn’t anyone snapped it up ? Sep 21 18:24
_Doug Media + Pipes + desktop + hardware, a license to print money !!! Sep 21 18:25
schestowitz From the moguls’ point of view, your hard-drive, which is taxed by them (because you are ‘criminal’ by default) contains binaries that you rent (Mac OS or Windows) and a bunch of files that you license temporarily because of copyrights and DRM. IOW, you own nothing on your PC Sep 21 18:25
_Doug Remember comcast and the rest are going to wind down the pipes unless the get paid, same for BBC iPlayer, no-one is goitgn to carry it unless you pay them. Sep 21 18:26
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