04.09.09

IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: April 8th, 2009 – Part 2

Posted in IRC Logs at 2:03 am by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

To use your own IRC client, join channel #boycottnovell in FreeNode.

iwmw	it found 4 trojans	Apr 08 14:20
iwmw	but they couldn’t work	Apr 08 14:20
schestowitz	http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bug…	Apr 08 14:20
oiaohm	You are more likely to have your system cracked through a service.	Apr 08 14:20
Eruaran	ClarkConnect has antivirus for email and other things that could hurt the fragile Windows systems under its care	Apr 08 14:21
oiaohm	selinux smack and tomoyo take up the role of keep problems out.	Apr 08 14:21
iwmw	1 downloader trojan was started but was blocked by firewall	Apr 08 14:21
oiaohm	Virus scanning companies are working on adding a real-time scanning framework to linux as well.	Apr 08 14:22
iwmw	Eruaran: there are always ways to bypass an antivirus	Apr 08 14:22
oiaohm	I am not sure how much usage that is going to get.	Apr 08 14:22
iwmw	like 1%?	Apr 08 14:22
Eruaran	indeed	Apr 08 14:22
Eruaran	we leave it off…	Apr 08 14:22
Eruaran	We have files on our server the antivirus will delete and we don’t want it to	Apr 08 14:23
iwmw	haha.. trojan spreaders	Apr 08 14:23
Eruaran	cracks and things	Apr 08 14:23
iwmw	yeah, cracks are good… especially those with mods inside	Apr 08 14:24
Eruaran	we have to crack Windows regularly	Apr 08 14:24
Eruaran	Someone installs Windows Media Player and it requires the user to validate Windows again	Apr 08 14:25
Eruaran	And then it throws up a false positive	Apr 08 14:25
Eruaran	And the user is locked out of their system	Apr 08 14:25
Eruaran	Not a good way of keeping your users	Apr 08 14:28
Eruaran	This is exactly why a customer wants me to install GNU/Linux on his system tomorrow	Apr 08 14:28
iwmw	why would anyone possibly want to install wmp?	Apr 08 14:28
Eruaran	just an example	Apr 08 14:28
trmanco	I don’t get it, why do people like evolution so much?	Apr 08 14:28
oiaohm	It can be anything.	Apr 08 14:28
oiaohm	I have had installing a printer driver set the wga off somehow.	Apr 08 14:29
Eruaran	It could be Microsoft Office for example	Apr 08 14:29
oiaohm	Even that it should not.	Apr 08 14:29
Eruaran	It checks	Apr 08 14:29
Eruaran	wga now checks if Office is valid also	Apr 08 14:30
oiaohm	You are running WSUS	Apr 08 14:30
Eruaran	We’ve noticed more wga false positives recently	Apr 08 14:30
oiaohm	I have found that reduces WGA set offs.	Apr 08 14:30
Eruaran	I don’t care really	Apr 08 14:31
oiaohm	Ok not 100 percent removes them.	Apr 08 14:31
Eruaran	Its a good wakeup call to users	Apr 08 14:31
Eruaran	Of the perils of giving control of your PC over to Microsoft	Apr 08 14:31
Eruaran	I should put up a big picture of Sweaty Ballmer with a sign under it saying, “Would you let this person use your computer ?”	Apr 08 14:32
oiaohm	And ms will take that and put some unknown guy as the example for Linux.	Apr 08 14:33
oiaohm	Even that its not true.	Apr 08 14:33
oiaohm	Most open source projects have really good tracking of who provides what.	Apr 08 14:34
Eruaran	Free Hugs… Linux	Apr 08 14:34
Eruaran	Hugs $10… Windows	Apr 08 14:34
schestowitz	heh. that video…	Apr 08 14:36
iwmw	Eruaran: make that picture and spread it XD	Apr 08 14:37
Eruaran	I love that vid	Apr 08 14:37
Eruaran	You could just take that snippet of the clip and it would make a great 10 second ad	Apr 08 14:38
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iwmw	which vid?	Apr 08 14:44
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Omar87	Hi	Apr 08 14:58
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DaemonFC	http://img258.imageshack.us/img2…	Apr 08 15:25
DaemonFC	booted in 19.6 seconds	Apr 08 15:26
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iwmw	how did you build that bootchart?	Apr 08 15:34
iwmw	so sane chart…	Apr 08 15:34
MinceR	there’s a bootchart utility	Apr 08 15:34
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iwmw	so sane chart…	Apr 08 15:35
iwmw	how did you build that bootchart?	Apr 08 15:35
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iwmw	DaemonFC:	Apr 08 15:36
DaemonFC	pybootchartgui and bootchart	Apr 08 15:36
DaemonFC	it drops a PNG in /var/log/bootchart	Apr 08 15:36
iwmw	nice	Apr 08 15:37
schestowitz	zoobab01: I’ve just gotten my ACK from EBoA	Apr 08 15:37
schestowitz	20 seconds is what Phoronix said too	Apr 08 15:39
schestowitz	Fedora claims 11 seconds, IIRC.	Apr 08 15:39
schestowitz	Or maybe Fedora 11 is what has me misremembering.	Apr 08 15:39
DaemonFC	schestowitz: XFS and Ext4 essentially tie	Apr 08 15:40
DaemonFC	they’re within 2 seconds of each other	Apr 08 15:41
DaemonFC	you could rerun the bootchart and the other one might win	Apr 08 15:41
DaemonFC	but even Ext3 was only 3 seconds behind them	Apr 08 15:41
DaemonFC	so it doesn’t make all that much difference in boot up time	Apr 08 15:41
iwmw	what about ext2?	Apr 08 15:41
DaemonFC	some sites are saying it can take off 10 seconds, it won’t	Apr 08 15:42
DaemonFC	didn’t try Ext2	Apr 08 15:42
iwmw	what’s the need for ext3 over ext2?	Apr 08 15:42
iwmw	i know… journaling… but how much is that need?	Apr 08 15:43
DaemonFC	there’s a few minor differences other than journaling	Apr 08 15:44
DaemonFC	journaling alone is worth it though	Apr 08 15:44
DaemonFC	just so you don’t spend hours checking the disk after a crash	Apr 08 15:44
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DaemonFC	I may end up rebuilding the kernel	Apr 08 15:48
DaemonFC	just to snag one file from 2.6.30-rc1	Apr 08 15:48
iwmw	i may end up installing some distro that likes manually built kernels…	Apr 08 15:59
DaemonFC	you have to kill some stuff of in Ubuntu before it takes a custom kernel	Apr 08 16:00
DaemonFC	*off	Apr 08 16:00
iwmw	what about mandriva?	Apr 08 16:00
DaemonFC	should work	Apr 08 16:01
DaemonFC	haven’t tried it though	Apr 08 16:01
DaemonFC	Mandriva is garbage	Apr 08 16:01
iwmw	why?	Apr 08 16:01
DaemonFC	there’s always a lot of bugs that only happen on Mandriva	Apr 08 16:02
DaemonFC	that only show themselves if you piss it off in precisely the right way	Apr 08 16:02
DaemonFC	B-)	Apr 08 16:02
DaemonFC	sometimes the installer has a bug and you can’t even get it to install	Apr 08 16:03
DaemonFC	they don’t do good QA	Apr 08 16:03
iwmw	QA?	Apr 08 16:03
DaemonFC	at least Ubuntu will probably boot up	Apr 08 16:03
DaemonFC	quality assurance	Apr 08 16:03
schestowitz	Mandriva is great	Apr 08 16:03
schestowitz	The .1 releases are very solid	Apr 08 16:04
iwmw	.0 are usually not that good	Apr 08 16:04
schestowitz	I haven’t tried	Apr 08 16:04
schestowitz	I heard from Beranger when he told me the usual spiel/rant	Apr 08 16:04
schestowitz	he’s back with Linux it seems..	Apr 08 16:05
iwmw	gonna try debian5, does it like custom kernels?	Apr 08 16:05
schestowitz	He’s like DaemonFC — always ranting about something he cares about	Apr 08 16:05
DaemonFC	must be why the installer hangs	Apr 08 16:06
MinceR	is he as clueless as DaemonFC :>	Apr 08 16:06
MinceR	?	Apr 08 16:06
DaemonFC	Mandriva 2009.1 RC2, the installer hangs before it can install the bootloader	Apr 08 16:06
DaemonFC	and the kernel will panic	Apr 08 16:06
MinceR	well, it’s a release candidate	Apr 08 16:07
iwmw	rc1 was good	Apr 08 16:07
DaemonFC	yeah, so I installed from an RC 1 disc	Apr 08 16:07
DaemonFC	and upgraded	Apr 08 16:07
DaemonFC	and Compiz is still broken	Apr 08 16:07
iwmw	heh… they’ve got month until internal release	Apr 08 16:08
DaemonFC	2009 just fails to boot	Apr 08 16:08
DaemonFC	unless I accept the upgrades at the end of the install	Apr 08 16:08
iwmw	on my side it didn’t even find sata disks in ide emulation mode	Apr 08 16:09
DaemonFC	the stuff off the CD just kernel panics right after grub exits	Apr 08 16:09
iwmw	some distros found disks but failed to run x	Apr 08 16:09
iwmw	then i understood that i better use ahci	Apr 08 16:09
iwmw	and 2009.1rc1 installed like a charm	Apr 08 16:10
schestowitz	MinceR: corny headline: Hungary Hungry for Open Source < http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/h… >	Apr 08 16:11
balzac	nice one	Apr 08 16:11
MinceR	ow	Apr 08 16:11
balzac	Turkey Gobbles Free Software	Apr 08 16:11
iwmw	ooh, ti.com looks like linuxjournal.com	Apr 08 16:12
schestowitz	TI is downsizing	Apr 08 16:13
schestowitz	And increasingly supporting Linux	Apr 08 16:13
DaemonFC	besides schestowitz, if you love Mandriva, you must love Mono	Apr 08 16:13
DaemonFC	it ships with about enough of it	Apr 08 16:13
DaemonFC	including Beagle	Apr 08 16:13
*iwmw hates beagle		Apr 08 16:14
trmanco	kde with mono?	Apr 08 16:14
iwmw	schestowitz: but it takes some third-party linux (montavista)	Apr 08 16:14
DaemonFC	no, the GNOME version uses Beagle Desktop Search	Apr 08 16:14
iwmw	and they provide only demo version of it with their hardware	Apr 08 16:15
trmanco	…	Apr 08 16:15
schestowitz	Civil liberties are being trashed. It’s Mussolistalin all over again… Groups Warn New Cybersecurity Bill Oversteps < http://www.internetnews.com/inf… >	Apr 08 15:55
schestowitz	DaemonFC: no, KDE	Apr 08 15:55
DaemonFC	KDE is garbage	Apr 08 15:56
schestowitz	I also pressured them to drop it off OOo	Apr 08 15:56
MinceR	didn’t Mandriva start as “Red Hat, but with KDE”?	Apr 08 15:56
schestowitz	DaemonFC: KDE is great	Apr 08 15:56
MinceR	KDE rules	Apr 08 15:56
DaemonFC	KDE was great	Apr 08 15:56
schestowitz	MinceR: something like that	Apr 08 15:56
DaemonFC	now it’s bloated crap that wishes it was Vista	Apr 08 15:56
iwmw	beagle is kde app	Apr 08 15:57
DaemonFC	no	Apr 08 15:57
*MinceR replaces DaemonFC’s kde with twm		Apr 08 15:57
DaemonFC	that’s Kerry Beagle	Apr 08 15:57
schestowitz	I use 3.5 and will be using it until KDE 4.3/4 when it’s mature and very reliable	Apr 08 15:57
DaemonFC	Beagle is for GNOME	Apr 08 15:57
MinceR	i’m on 3.5.8 and i’m planning to switch to 4.2	Apr 08 15:57
iwmw	beagle is both gnome and kde friendly	Apr 08 15:57
DaemonFC	Ubuntu defaults to Tracker	Apr 08 15:57
trmanco	tracker sucks	Apr 08 15:58
DaemonFC	you can replace Beagle with Tracker on Mandriva easily enough though	Apr 08 15:58
schestowitz	I use recoil	Apr 08 15:58
iwmw	i switch beagle off right before or after installation	Apr 08 15:58
trmanco	I don’t use search tools…	Apr 08 15:58
MinceR	i use slocate ^_^	Apr 08 15:58
iwmw	i seriously don’t get what’s the reason to use tools like beagle	Apr 08 15:58
MinceR	i’m waiting for a dynamic indexer that lets me search in filenames	Apr 08 15:59
MinceR	(not just filenames and content)	Apr 08 15:59
DaemonFC	Problem: Search is too slow Solution: Lets thrash the disk exactly whenever and index and log everything from every program the user could possibly open	Apr 08 15:59
DaemonFC	B-)	Apr 08 15:59
iwmw	MinceR: you’re dreaming	Apr 08 15:59
MinceR	afaik tracker’s kioslave could do it	Apr 08 15:59
DaemonFC	Search indexing sucks on jsut about any OS	Apr 08 15:59
MinceR	but it was pre-1.0 when i last checked	Apr 08 15:59
DaemonFC	but Beagle is like “God damn!”	Apr 08 15:59
MinceR	so i didn’t switch yet	Apr 08 16:00
trmanco	people can remove mono spyware now when Gnote goes stable	Apr 08 16:00
trmanco	from Ubuntu	Apr 08 16:00
DaemonFC	Mono is not spyware	Apr 08 16:01
trmanco	then it’s crapware	Apr 08 16:01
DaemonFC	show me your proof that Mono is spying on you	Apr 08 16:01
DaemonFC	and who it is reporting to	Apr 08 16:01
DaemonFC	and what it’s sending	Apr 08 16:01
DaemonFC	I assume you have logs?	Apr 08 16:01
DaemonFC		Apr 08 16:01
DaemonFC	cause you’ve uncovered a major scandal	Apr 08 16:02
*schestowitz has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))		Apr 08 16:02
DaemonFC	I’m sure everyone would like to hear about it	Apr 08 16:02
trmanco	I’m not going to bother to look at the source code	Apr 08 16:02
DaemonFC	oh right, so baseless accusation	Apr 08 16:02
trmanco	it’s just me saying	Apr 08 16:02
DaemonFC	oh right, so baseless accusation	Apr 08 16:02
DaemonFC		Apr 08 16:02
trmanco	DaemonFC, you’re a mono dev, right?	Apr 08 16:03
DaemonFC	oh right, so baseless accusation	Apr 08 16:03
MinceR	i think he’s stuck on that line	Apr 08 16:03
DaemonFC	why not?	Apr 08 16:03
trmanco	MinceR, mono crash	Apr 08 16:03
DaemonFC	he won’t answer	Apr 08 16:03
MinceR	trmanco: ic	Apr 08 16:03
DaemonFC	he’s just taking swipes at me	Apr 08 16:03
DaemonFC	what an idiot	Apr 08 16:03
trmanco	tomboy should have been written in c++ in the first place	Apr 08 16:04
DaemonFC	Don’t worry about proof, don’t think about the fact that the source is open and there’s lots of people that jsut hate mono and would love nothing more than for it to actually be spyware so they could expose it	Apr 08 16:04
DaemonFC	just baselessly accuse	Apr 08 16:04
DaemonFC	it’ll all work out	Apr 08 16:04
DaemonFC		Apr 08 16:05
DaemonFC	Don’t worry, Detective Dipshit is on the case	Apr 08 16:05
MinceR	i didn’t know that was your real name	Apr 08 16:05
trmanco	prepare for the Mono boom	Apr 08 16:05
DaemonFC	there’s nothing wrong with mono	Apr 08 16:05
trmanco	something isn’t right, something it going to explode	Apr 08 16:05
MinceR	except for the whole patent trap	Apr 08 16:06
trmanco	yes there is	Apr 08 16:06
DaemonFC	you can make bad software in C++ too	Apr 08 16:06
DaemonFC	look at Firefox	Apr 08 16:06
DaemonFC	there is no patent trap in mono	Apr 08 16:06
DaemonFC	unless you’re shipping the non-standard bits	Apr 08 16:06
trmanco	DaemonFC, I see, for you, almost everything is bad software, except for c# based software… hmmm	Apr 08 16:06
MinceR	don’t worry, they won’t sue you even if you aren’t a novell customer, exactly like they didn’t sue tomtom	Apr 08 16:06
trmanco	you even hate the kernel	Apr 08 16:07
DaemonFC	they can’t	Apr 08 16:07
DaemonFC	C# is a standard	Apr 08 16:07
MinceR	lol	Apr 08 16:07
MinceR	that makes it all right, doesn’t it?	Apr 08 16:07
trmanco	better right some crappy kernel written in c#	Apr 08 16:07
DaemonFC	well, C is the property of AT&T	Apr 08 16:07
trmanco	write*	Apr 08 16:07
DaemonFC	as much as C# is Microsoft’s	Apr 08 16:07
MinceR	C has nothing to do with C#	Apr 08 16:07
DaemonFC	C belonged to AT&T	Apr 08 16:07
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MinceR	AT&T isn’t trying to take over the world like m$ is	Apr 08 16:08
DaemonFC	GNU cloned it while AT&T still owned it	Apr 08 16:08
DaemonFC	so C is bad right?	Apr 08 16:08
DaemonFC	since it infringes	Apr 08 16:08
DaemonFC	they were	Apr 08 16:08
MinceR	does AT&T own patents on it?	Apr 08 16:08
DaemonFC	you don’t remember USL, do you?	Apr 08 16:08
*ChanServ gives channel operator status to schestowitz		Apr 08 16:08
MinceR	nope	Apr 08 16:08
DaemonFC	they were worse than Microsoft	Apr 08 16:08
MinceR	note past tense	Apr 08 16:08
DaemonFC	well, the government DID do something about them	Apr 08 16:09
schestowitz	The connection went wonky	Apr 08 16:09
DaemonFC	but my point is that C# now is no worse than C was then	Apr 08 16:09
schestowitz	Lost for a few minutes	Apr 08 16:09
DaemonFC	C was a patented language when GNU stole it	Apr 08 16:09
DaemonFC	and reimplemented it	Apr 08 16:09
DaemonFC	why weren’tthey sued?	Apr 08 16:09
MinceR	there’s a question you haven’t answered	Apr 08 16:09
MinceR	173743 < MinceR> does AT&T own patents on it?	Apr 08 16:09
DaemonFC	maybe cause C was an ISO/ANSI/IEC standard?	Apr 08 16:09
trmanco	how can we steal a language?	Apr 08 16:10
MinceR	iso isn’t what it used to be	Apr 08 16:10
DaemonFC	just like C# is	Apr 08 16:10
MinceR	since m$ bought it	Apr 08 16:10
DaemonFC	http://en.wikipedia.org/w…	Apr 08 16:11
DaemonFC	if you don’t ship that part of Mono, you should be fine	Apr 08 16:11
MinceR	i see, you don’t know if AT&T owns patents on C	Apr 08 16:11
DaemonFC	there’s nothing wrong with supporting programming languages	Apr 08 16:11
DaemonFC	even Richard Stallman said we should have C# support	Apr 08 16:11
MinceR	except that you can’t support C# completely without the VM?	Apr 08 16:11
DaemonFC	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DotGNU	Apr 08 16:11
MinceR	when did he say that?	Apr 08 16:11
MinceR	dotgnu is dead	Apr 08 16:12
MinceR	i wonder why	Apr 08 16:12
MinceR	also, we were discussing mono, not c#	Apr 08 16:12
MinceR	and not dotgnu	Apr 08 16:12
trmanco	“Microsoft has declared itself our enemy and we know that Microsoft is getting patents on some features of C#. So I think it’s dangerous to use C#, and it may be dangerous to use Mono.”	Apr 08 16:12
DaemonFC	probably cause Mono is better	Apr 08 16:12
DaemonFC	dotgnu was implementing C#	Apr 08 16:13
DaemonFC	jsut like Mono	Apr 08 16:13
MinceR	i see, you’re militantly unaware of your environment	Apr 08 16:13
DaemonFC	there’s nothing wrong with Mono	Apr 08 16:13
MinceR	keep telling yourself that	Apr 08 16:13
DaemonFC	you’	Apr 08 16:14
DaemonFC	you’re just a clueless jerk with an irrational hatred of Americans	Apr 08 16:14
DaemonFC	that’s your problem	Apr 08 16:14
MinceR	you’re just a brainless idiot	Apr 08 16:14
trmanco	…	Apr 08 16:14
MinceR	with blind faith in the worst megacorps around	Apr 08 16:14
DaemonFC	you don’t know how anything works	Apr 08 16:14
DaemonFC	you just point fingers	Apr 08 16:14
MinceR	you don’t know what you’re talking about	Apr 08 16:14
MinceR	you just keep spewing nonsense	Apr 08 16:14
DaemonFC	that is what you are doing	Apr 08 16:15
MinceR	when you’re proven wrong, you just change the subject	Apr 08 16:15
MinceR	and then you bring up the same stupid shit every day	Apr 08 16:15
DaemonFC	you are an irrational jerk	Apr 08 16:15
DaemonFC	period	Apr 08 16:15
DaemonFC	full stop	Apr 08 16:15
MinceR	i think that’s what we call “trolling”	Apr 08 16:35
DaemonFC	well, I’m sure that the FSF has better lawyers than you	Apr 08 16:36
DaemonFC	so whatever	Apr 08 16:36
MinceR	i’m not a lawyer	Apr 08 16:36
DaemonFC	my point	Apr 08 16:36
MinceR	you don’t have a point	Apr 08 16:36
MinceR	you’ve never proven a single word you’ve said	Apr 08 16:36
MinceR	you’ve never responded to any counterarguments	Apr 08 16:36
MinceR	you just keep saying the same things over and over again	Apr 08 16:36
MinceR	changing the subject	Apr 08 16:36
DaemonFC	they would never have reimplemented C# if their lawyers hadn’t OK’d it	Apr 08 16:36
MinceR	and trying to smear anyone who disagrees with you	Apr 08 16:37
DaemonFC	you don’t understand the legal mechanics	Apr 08 16:37
MinceR	“they” being?	Apr 08 16:37
DaemonFC	the FSF lawyers who gave the OK to do it	Apr 08 16:37
DaemonFC	you’re not a lawyer	Apr 08 16:38
MinceR	i’m pretty sure the FSF lawyers didn’t reimplement c#	Apr 08 16:38
DaemonFC	they wouldn’t have done it without getting legal advice first	Apr 08 16:38
MinceR	considering that lawyers rarely implement programming languages	Apr 08 16:38
MinceR	once again, who is “they”?	Apr 08 16:38
MinceR	novell, dotgnu developers, or the tooth fairy?	Apr 08 16:38
DaemonFC	ASP.NET, ADO.NET and Windows Forms are the only things Microsoft could sue over	Apr 08 16:39
DaemonFC	and Mono does not ship with those by default	Apr 08 16:40
MinceR	are you a lawyer?	Apr 08 16:40
trmanco	ASP.NET and Windows Forms are in mono	Apr 08 16:40
trmanco	don’t know about ADO.NET	Apr 08 16:41
DaemonFC	No they aren’t	Apr 08 16:41
DaemonFC	they are separate packages	Apr 08 16:41
DaemonFC	Mono by default uses only the ECMA standardized portions of .Net	Apr 08 16:41
MinceR	i’ll interpret that as a “no”	Apr 08 16:41
DaemonFC	ECMA-334 – C# Language Specification	Apr 08 16:41
DaemonFC	ECMA-335 – Common Language Infrastructure (CLI)	Apr 08 16:42
MinceR	next question: if you think that my arguments have no merit because i’m not a lawyer, what makes you think that yours do have merit even if you aren’t a lawyer?	Apr 08 16:42
MinceR	ecma standardizes anything they throw at them if money accompanies it	Apr 08 16:42
DaemonFC	C# is an ISO and ECMA standard	Apr 08 16:42
schestowitz	Yes, ECMA is corrupt	Apr 08 16:43
trmanco	again	Apr 08 16:43
DaemonFC	and they’ve already issued the covenant not to sue	Apr 08 16:43
MinceR	even RAND is bullshit (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reasonable_…)	Apr 08 16:43
schestowitz	I am always amused by the mentioning of ECMA	Apr 08 16:43
schestowitz	I think of Van der Fraudf	Apr 08 16:43
trmanco	I’ve read that today about 4 times today	Apr 08 16:43
MinceR	as i’ve mentioned already, iso was practically bought by m$	Apr 08 16:43
schestowitz	Now in CompTIA, a separate MS puppet	Apr 08 16:43
schestowitz	RAND is anti-FOSS	Apr 08 16:44
schestowitz	It’s not acceptable	Apr 08 16:44
schestowitz	See Groklaw’s article abotu RAND	Apr 08 16:44
DaemonFC	not my fault that other countries elect corrupt officials	Apr 08 16:44
MinceR	also, “covenant not to sue” is bullshit invented to screw everyone	Apr 08 16:44
DaemonFC	your politicians sold you out, yes?	Apr 08 16:44
DaemonFC	good for you	Apr 08 16:44
DaemonFC	keep voting for them	Apr 08 16:44
MinceR	serious standards are protected by _patent licenses_ that are _gratis_	Apr 08 16:44
MinceR	DaemonFC: who else can we vote for?	Apr 08 16:45
MinceR	once again you have no idea what you’re talking about	Apr 08 16:45
DaemonFC	if you wanted rid of your government officials that bad	Apr 08 16:45
schestowitz	MS blames non-Redmond apps for security woes < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/… >	Apr 08 16:45
DaemonFC	they’d be gone	Apr 08 16:45
schestowitz	Thrid party=malware devs?	Apr 08 16:45
DaemonFC	you have the government you deserve	Apr 08 16:45
MinceR	sure, because it only depends on me	Apr 08 16:45
MinceR	not on the millions of idiots that surround me	Apr 08 16:45
MinceR	who blindly believe any lie thrown their way	Apr 08 16:46
MinceR	just like you do	Apr 08 16:46
schestowitz	DaemonFC: “you have the government you deserve”? Look who’s talking	Apr 08 16:46
schestowitz	You hardly even have choice.	Apr 08 16:46
trmanco	xPUD, the ultra-fast booting Linux flavour: http://www.tuxradar.com/content/x…	Apr 08 16:46
DaemonFC	who cares?	Apr 08 16:46
schestowitz	White of vanilla white	Apr 08 16:46
DaemonFC	I don’t pay taxes to them	Apr 08 16:46
MinceR	DaemonFC: do you live in the usa?	Apr 08 16:46
trmanco	comcast.net	Apr 08 16:46
MinceR	i’m guessing yes	Apr 08 16:47
schestowitz	Camcast are an MS puppet	Apr 08 16:47
DaemonFC	I don’t care what happens	Apr 08 16:47
schestowitz	Their favourite cable company	Apr 08 16:47
schestowitz	MS put billions in Comcast	Apr 08 16:47
MinceR	that puts you in no position to talk shit about what governments are elected in other countries	Apr 08 16:47
DaemonFC	cool	Apr 08 16:47
schestowitz	Practically billions, and got things in return	Apr 08 16:47
DaemonFC	like?	Apr 08 16:47
schestowitz	Do a search in BN	Apr 08 16:47
MinceR	even the hellhole i live in (hungary) is more free than the usa nowadays	Apr 08 16:47
DaemonFC	tell yourself that	Apr 08 16:48
schestowitz	trmanco: thanks for the link	Apr 08 16:48
MinceR	for example, we don’t officially have sw patents	Apr 08 16:48
trmanco	schestowitz, see the vid, blazing fast	Apr 08 16:48
MinceR	yet	Apr 08 16:48
DaemonFC	you will if your govt wants in on the WTO	Apr 08 16:48
MinceR	we don’t get our properties searched without warrants	Apr 08 16:48
DaemonFC	and it will	Apr 08 16:48
schestowitz	The Germans fined SCO and now MS: Microsoft hit with €9m fine over German pricing < http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2009/04… >	Apr 08 16:48
DaemonFC	MinceR: It’s against our constitution	Apr 08 16:48
MinceR	DaemonFC: yes, your government forces a lot of shit on us	Apr 08 16:49
DaemonFC	for warrantless searches	Apr 08 16:49
MinceR	DaemonFC: guess who cares about your constitution in your government	Apr 08 16:49
DaemonFC	so I believe you are mistaken	Apr 08 16:49
MinceR	DaemonFC: and i believe you don’t read enough news	Apr 08 16:49
DaemonFC	the news with who’s views?	Apr 08 16:49
DaemonFC	anything to sell copies	Apr 08 16:49
DaemonFC	and conflict sells copies	Apr 08 16:49
MinceR	well, not fox news, i guess	Apr 08 16:49
DaemonFC	I don’t pay attention to those assholes	Apr 08 16:50
MinceR	“that’s crazy! the government doesn’t lie to people!”	Apr 08 16:50
DaemonFC	well, you’ll believe your delusions no matter what I say	Apr 08 16:51
DaemonFC	you’re dead set on hating people	Apr 08 16:51
DaemonFC	your loss	Apr 08 16:51
MinceR	you should be telling yourself that	Apr 08 16:52
schestowitz	http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009… “LuckySploit, which was hidden behind an invisible iFrame on the website, was detected by web security services firm ScanSafe on Saturday 5 April at around 12:3opm GMT. The malware toolkit uses browser exploits in an attempt to load banking Trojans onto visiting surfers’ Windows PCs.”	Apr 08 16:52
schestowitz	<DaemonFC> “you’re dead set on hating people”	Apr 08 16:53
schestowitz	hehe. hypocrite.	Apr 08 16:53
DaemonFC	not really	Apr 08 16:54
DaemonFC	I don’t hate MinceR, he just needs to eat some prunes, maybe some ex-lax	Apr 08 16:54
DaemonFC	he’ll be fine	Apr 08 16:54
MinceR	and you just need to get a brain	Apr 08 16:55
MinceR	and you’ll be fine	Apr 08 16:55
schestowitz	Google pours Java on code cloud < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/… >	Apr 08 16:56
schestowitz	IDC forms partnership, says NZ telecoms industry ‘at a crossroads’ < http://www.itwire.com/con… > IDC gets payola	Apr 08 16:59
schestowitz	When analysis is SOLD, where is the trust?	Apr 08 17:00
MinceR	in the mind of fools like DaemonFC :>	Apr 08 17:00
DaemonFC	so Microsoft actually doesn’t own any of Comcast	Apr 08 17:00
DaemonFC	they never owned any significant part of them anyway	Apr 08 17:01
DaemonFC	yay	Apr 08 17:01
DaemonFC	Comcast ditched Microsoft’s cable box software in 2007, and Microsoft sold all of its shares of Comcast by January of this year	Apr 08 17:02
DaemonFC	hardly sounds like a glowing friendship to me	Apr 08 17:02
DaemonFC	but hey, if you’re paranoid	Apr 08 17:02
schestowitz	DaemonFC: since you asked, hold on.	Apr 08 17:03
DaemonFC	http://www.seattlepi.com/business…	Apr 08 17:04
DaemonFC	http://news.cnet.com/8301-138…	Apr 08 17:04
schestowitz	http://boycottnovell.com/2008/09…	Apr 08 17:04
schestowitz	More on Camcast: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/01/…	Apr 08 17:04
PeterKraus	haha, i’m reading about the Google – AP thing	Apr 08 17:05
PeterKraus	gosh.	Apr 08 17:05
PeterKraus	one has to facepalm	Apr 08 17:05
schestowitz	The zombie is at it again: Murdoch Says Newspapers Must Charge For Online Content < http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/0… >	Apr 08 17:06
schestowitz	They want to backtrack to good ol’ days	Apr 08 17:06
schestowitz	Let’s also run back to punch cards and pay for CPU cycles.	Apr 08 17:06
PeterKraus		Apr 08 17:07
PeterKraus	it’s this old backwards thinking	Apr 08 17:07
schestowitz	That was fast: OOo 3.1 already in release candidate stage: New: OpenOffice.org 3.1.0 Release Candidate 1 (build OOO310_m9) available < http://blogs.sun.com/GullFOSS/en… >	Apr 08 17:08
schestowitz	PeterKraus: they try t shore up dying biz model	Apr 08 17:09
schestowitz	MS too	Apr 08 17:09
schestowitz	They sell Windows for pretty much 0$ on ‘small laptops’	Apr 08 17:09
schestowitz	So now, who would buy a laptop for 5 times the cost AND also PAY for Windows, when it’s actually free on the other cheaper laptops?	Apr 08 17:09
schestowitz	Microsoft was just too desperate to injore linux	Apr 08 17:09
schestowitz	*injure	Apr 08 17:09
PeterKraus	it worked, partially	Apr 08 17:10
PeterKraus	well	Apr 08 17:10
PeterKraus	not that it injured linux	Apr 08 17:10
schestowitz	under no circumstances lose to linux: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/01/14/…	Apr 08 17:10
PeterKraus	it just pointed at it’s weaknessess	Apr 08 17:10
*DaemonFC sets up schestowitz’s system to dual boot OpenSuse with Windows 7 Beta		Apr 08 17:10
DaemonFC		Apr 08 17:10
PeterKraus	DaemonFC: that’s not a dual boot	Apr 08 17:10
PeterKraus		Apr 08 17:10
schestowitz	I have some opensuse CDs	Apr 08 17:10
schestowitz	PeterKraus: it’s Windows morhping	Apr 08 17:10
schestowitz	Mono/.NET	Apr 08 17:11
DaemonFC	no, Suse is a joke	Apr 08 17:11
DaemonFC	if you want Windows compatibility, you’ll buy Windows	Apr 08 17:11
DaemonFC	not some cheap knock off that’s half-compatible	Apr 08 17:11
schestowitz	Boot into Mono-based or…	Apr 08 17:11
PeterKraus	i don’t buy windows	Apr 08 17:11
PeterKraus	i download it off torrents	Apr 08 17:11
schestowitz	Well, even Microsoft DOESN’T use .NET	Apr 08 17:11
schestowitz	In Vista, they didn’t use .NET	Apr 08 17:11
schestowitz	Talk about rejecting one’s own meal.	Apr 08 17:12
DaemonFC	why would you torrent it?	Apr 08 17:12
PeterKraus	it’s faster than going to the shop and buying it	Apr 08 17:12
DaemonFC	all it takes is one update to torpedo your crack	Apr 08 17:12
schestowitz	For play./	Apr 08 17:12
MinceR	better disable updates then	Apr 08 17:12
PeterKraus	yeah	Apr 08 17:12
MinceR	m$ doesn’t deserve the money anyway	Apr 08 17:12
schestowitz	Won’t work	Apr 08 17:12
PeterKraus	it does	Apr 08 17:12
schestowitz	MinceR: Windows ignored those settings	Apr 08 17:12
MinceR	block them on the firewall	Apr 08 17:12
*_Hicham_ (n=hicham@wana-99-245-12-196.wanamaroc.com) has joined #boycottnovell		Apr 08 17:12
PeterKraus	i’m running skype that way	Apr 08 17:12