IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: Sunday, December 22, 2019

cubexyz	seems like a major change	Dec 22 00:00
XRevan86	cubexyz: Fedora is a distro that adopts new stuff supported by Red Hat first, that's its thing.	Dec 22 00:00
MinceR	it's red hat's even less stable distro, it's to be expected to be the first to try and stuff cancerd down users' throats	Dec 22 00:00
cubexyz	but that doesn't answer why so many of the other distros also used systemd	Dec 22 00:01
DaemonFC[m]	Canonical briefly considered just using SMF from Solaris for init.	Dec 22 00:01
MinceR	because they're made by people who don't know what they're doing	Dec 22 00:02
MinceR	"ooh, shiny! let's throw it into "stable" immediately!"	Dec 22 00:02
cubexyz	but not AIX or HP-UX	Dec 22 00:03
XRevan86	cubexyz: systemd is a strictly Linux thing.	Dec 22 00:03
cubexyz	seems it's part of the linux world, yes	Dec 22 00:03
XRevan86	cubexyz: Not "seems", it's systemd's design.	Dec 22 00:04
MinceR	I'd like to interject. What you call Linux is actually just a kernel. Without systemd, it can't do anything at all, so I have recently started calling it systemd-kerneld. Yes, there really is a Linux, but we must give credit to the other software that makes up a complete system.	Dec 22 00:04
XRevan86	tightly dependent on Linux	Dec 22 00:04
MinceR	Looking at the package count on a modern systemd-kerneld distribution, you'll find that systemd is nearly half of all packages. If you go by source lines of code, Linux, or kerneld, is only 9%.	Dec 22 00:04
XRevan86	cubexyz: The farthest from Linux systemd is going to get is Microsoft WSL %). But not technically.	Dec 22 00:06
DaemonFC[m]	MinceR: systemd is mainly a way to get as much stuff out of the kernel and to where Red Hat directly controls it as possible.	Dec 22 00:06
cubexyz	there's something called UbuntuBSD :)	Dec 22 00:06
DaemonFC[m]	Then it doesn't matter if they control the kernel itself.	Dec 22 00:06
cubexyz	a schism :)	Dec 22 00:06
XRevan86	cubexyz: Sounds absolutely doomed.	Dec 22 00:06
DaemonFC[m]	Well, most distributions seem to be building x265 wrong.	Dec 22 00:07
XRevan86	expired domain, figured	Dec 22 00:07
DaemonFC[m]	Only Clear Linux and FreeBSD and DragonFly BSD did well according to Phoronix.	Dec 22 00:07
DaemonFC[m]	Most Linux distributions could encode 49 fps on his test system and the BSDs and Clear Linux managed like 75.	Dec 22 00:07
XRevan86	cubexyz: Telling by their Twitter account, they started the project in 2016, a year where it was already obvious that's doomed. Not very smart folks.	Dec 22 00:08
cubexyz	XRevan86, I just like to see what's out there	Dec 22 00:09
DaemonFC[m]	That suggests if you're helping your neighbors by dumping Blu Rays, you should build your own x265 or use a system that built it correctly.	Dec 22 00:09
MinceR	was building anything on ubuntu ever smart? :>	Dec 22 00:09
DaemonFC[m]	Blu Ray sources are h264 or (much less frequently) MPEG 2 or VC1, but always at such an insane bitrate that they survive being transcoded and crunched down to a manageable size with x265 pretty darned well.	Dec 22 00:10
XRevan86	cubexyz: Not a bad motive :). But this is misplaced attention.	Dec 22 00:10
DaemonFC[m]	Ultra HD Blu Ray makes a lot of existing televisions and stuff obsolete with its nastier DRM, but that's been broken too apparently.	Dec 22 00:10
cubexyz	I keep going back to slackware or vector	Dec 22 00:11
XRevan86	cubexyz: systemd is not going to run not on Linux, Ubuntu is systemd-only.	Dec 22 00:11
XRevan86	If Devuan is struggling for survival, imagine something based on Ubuntu.	Dec 22 00:11
XRevan86	ArchBSD is more believable as some people maintain multiple init systems in AUR. Which is still problematic, I'm not sure which ones still have a community, but at least that's something.	Dec 22 00:13
XRevan86	and it died in 2017	Dec 22 00:14
oiaohm	DaemonFC[m]: fun of being in Australia https://www.laserco.com.au/BLU-BD3000-blu-ray-player-multi-region-hdmi-digital-7-1-with-lan-for-bdlive	Dec 22 00:15
XRevan86	Arch Hurd is alive	Dec 22 00:15
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.laserco.com.au \| DVD and Blu Ray Players : Blu-Ray Player Multi Region HDMI Digital 7.1, with LAN for DLNA		Dec 22 00:15
XRevan86	which uses OpenRC, unsurprisingly	Dec 22 00:16
oiaohm	At least a init system with some chance by design of working properly.	Dec 22 00:18
MinceR	https://imgur.com/gallery/6c7nslc	Dec 22 00:21
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Queen Noomi for National Cat Day - Album on Imgur		Dec 22 00:21
MinceR	i.e. not systemd	Dec 22 00:21
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132007 #google #linux [https://pleroma.site/objects/9aca179a-7362-4ba9-a227-7cf5b5cdefd6]		Dec 22 00:41
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: RIP, Chuck Peddle http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132008 [https://pleroma.site/objects/96221d34-5afe-448f-816e-2d54628d78c9]		Dec 22 00:43
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: More #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132009 [https://pleroma.site/objects/6a002e94-8516-4889-a342-e8622d22db2f]		Dec 22 00:43
MinceR	https://hugelolcdn.com/i/642417.png	Dec 22 01:34
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132010 [https://pleroma.site/objects/c95fd7a3-7c45-4e55-b68c-8ea4d4f7a59b]		Dec 22 01:37
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: KTimeTracker 5.0.1 released http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132011 [https://pleroma.site/objects/b3142d6a-baac-4b64-a10a-5ceecc763605]		Dec 22 01:50
schestowitz	MinceR: so many 'words' in this language	Dec 22 01:53
schestowitz	is there more to this joke than meets the eye?	Dec 22 01:53
MinceR	¯\_(ツ)_/¯	Dec 22 01:54
MinceR	i trust you know which body part people usually refer to when using this emoji	Dec 22 01:54
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Pirate Chain Developers Unveil Privacy-Oriented OS for Crypto Usrs http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132012 [https://pleroma.site/objects/3aa1185b-5456-4f3c-aa64-9c3ae61c3252]		Dec 22 01:55
MinceR	https://hugelolcdn.com/i/642460.jpg	Dec 22 01:56
schestowitz	lol https://scallywagandvagabond.com/2019/12/apple-macs-worth-the-money/	Dec 22 01:58
schestowitz	who writes such tripe?	Dec 22 01:58
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-scallywagandvagabond.com \| Should you Buy an Apple Mac? Apple ecosystem tailored to user needs		Dec 22 01:58
schestowitz	MinceR: yes, I know, but...	Dec 22 01:58
schestowitz	why scooby doo?	Dec 22 01:58
MinceR	probably just to express the reaction	Dec 22 02:09
cubexyz	the computer of choice for posers :)	Dec 22 02:12
DaemonFC[m]	The Mac is a just an expensive trap that snares yoi and forces you to buy other junk or else it won't agree to interface with it.	Dec 22 02:13
DaemonFC[m]	Like everything else Apple makes.	Dec 22 02:13
cubexyz	probably no one remembers now, but in 1977 the Apple II was $1,298	Dec 22 02:14
cubexyz	now convert that to 2019 dollars...	Dec 22 02:14
DaemonFC[m]	Yeah, and for the first 4 years of that consider the US was in hyperinflation.	Dec 22 02:14
cubexyz	$1,298 in 1977 converts to $5,509.17 for 2019	Dec 22 02:15
DaemonFC[m]	So the money lost half it's value already by 1982. Communuty riffed on that where they find a guy that's been in a bunker since the 1970s and he says he has 3 million dollars but it probably wasn't worth anything because of Nixon.	Dec 22 02:16
danielp3344	looks like apple IIs are going for around 2-3k on ebay	Dec 22 02:17
danielp3344	so they've held value pretty well	Dec 22 02:17
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Hardware Retro and Legacy http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132013 [https://pleroma.site/objects/715a0aa6-eaec-4833-baae-8aad124f7404]		Dec 22 02:18
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Fedora 31 Release Party Novi Sad -- Event Report http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132014 [https://pleroma.site/objects/5eb56bb3-cae2-4765-b36c-adbfaf2d23c9]		Dec 22 02:21
schestowitz	danielp3344: what about inflation	Dec 22 02:21
schestowitz	their price back then plus inflation on the cost?	Dec 22 02:21
DaemonFC[m]	The US dollar has lost over half its value since I was born in 1984.	Dec 22 02:22
cubexyz	old computers don't really keep their value	Dec 22 02:22
DaemonFC[m]	And considering what inflationnwas running from 1977 until Paul Volcker caused a recession in 1981 to stop it....	Dec 22 02:22
cubexyz	people are always dumping them... then later on they buy them back due to nostalgia	Dec 22 02:23
DaemonFC[m]	Plus the three years in between.	Dec 22 02:23
schestowitz	DaemonFC[m]: he didn't keep his value	Dec 22 02:23
schestowitz	he died	Dec 22 02:23
danielp3344	lol	Dec 22 02:23
DaemonFC[m]	> $1,298 in 1977 converts to $5,509.17 for 2019	Dec 22 02:24
DaemonFC[m]	That's only if you accept the government's own math.	Dec 22 02:24
DaemonFC[m]	The reality is much worse.	Dec 22 02:24
schestowitz	no banks in heaven/hell/coffin/blanket	Dec 22 02:24
DaemonFC[m]	In 1996, $22,000 bought a Ford Crown Victoria LX.	Dec 22 02:24
schestowitz	DaemonFC[m]: yeah, annnnd...	Dec 22 02:24
schestowitz	there' s a gamble	Dec 22 02:24
DaemonFC[m]	In 2018 it barely bought a Kia Soul.	Dec 22 02:25
schestowitz	1) will people cherish the brand decades later?	Dec 22 02:25
schestowitz	2) will it still work after you drag it from one house to anoher	Dec 22 02:25
schestowitz	3) will you still be alive and can it sell?	Dec 22 02:25
DaemonFC[m]	Since 2003, the price of a new Chevy Impala has doubled.	Dec 22 02:25
schestowitz	cars are overpriced	Dec 22 02:25
danielp3344	^	Dec 22 02:25
schestowitz	not sure how much patents play into it	Dec 22 02:25
danielp3344	but not if you buy junk ones to play with	Dec 22 02:26
schestowitz	you work like... years of savings	Dec 22 02:26
schestowitz	(or installments)	Dec 22 02:26
DaemonFC[m]	The reliability is much worse.	Dec 22 02:26
schestowitz	for a piece of tin	Dec 22 02:26
danielp3344	schestowitz: I blame electronics	Dec 22 02:26
schestowitz	3mm thin	Dec 22 02:26
cubexyz	cars might get devalued even faster than computers	Dec 22 02:26
DaemonFC[m]	None of the cars they sell today will run in 20 years.	Dec 22 02:26
danielp3344	^	Dec 22 02:26
schestowitz	4 tires, some 'chairs' and a radio	Dec 22 02:26
schestowitz	"wow... look at me.. ma lifeeestyle"	Dec 22 02:26
cubexyz	I have lots of computers >20 years old	Dec 22 02:26
cubexyz	they all still work	Dec 22 02:26
danielp3344	I was once reading a book about neural networks	Dec 22 02:27
DaemonFC[m]	Yeah, but they put computer chips everywhere in a modern car.	Dec 22 02:27
schestowitz	DaemonFC[m]: yes, the other thing is how long they last	Dec 22 02:27
DaemonFC[m]	There isn't just one. There's dozens.	Dec 22 02:27
danielp3344	And found two 5-1/4 floppies tucked in the back	Dec 22 02:27
schestowitz	and their value diminished so fact compared to a hous	Dec 22 02:27
danielp3344	I never figured out what was on them	Dec 22 02:27
cubexyz	do you have any working 5.25" floppy drives? :)	Dec 22 02:27
schestowitz	for today's cheaply made shit they call "car" you shave off like 30% in the first year ALONE	Dec 22 02:28
DaemonFC[m]	Modern cars have so many expensive failure points that you would never put any money into one that's more than 10 yeara old unless you're insane.	Dec 22 02:28
schestowitz	they give warranty for about 3 years old... says what they think of their build quality	Dec 22 02:28
schestowitz	many houses are built equally poorly today... cheap materials	Dec 22 02:28
DaemonFC[m]	BMW charges $6500 to extend the 3 year warehouse to 5 years.	Dec 22 02:28
DaemonFC[m]	Warranty	Dec 22 02:28
DaemonFC[m]	Autocorrect fail.	Dec 22 02:28
schestowitz	you can buy another car	Dec 22 02:28
schestowitz	a cheaper one	Dec 22 02:29
cubexyz	it wouldn't be too hard to get a 5.25" drive though	Dec 22 02:29
schestowitz	for the same price	Dec 22 02:29
schestowitz	backup companion car	Dec 22 02:29
DaemonFC[m]	$6500 for two more years is sort of excessive, isn't it?	Dec 22 02:29
DaemonFC[m]	After all, that German quality should be reliable. 😂	Dec 22 02:29
schestowitz	[02:27] <DaemonFC[m]> Yeah, but they put computer chips everywhere in a modern car.	Dec 22 02:29
schestowitz	how long will spares last?	Dec 22 02:29
schestowitz	today's cars are hard/expensive to repair	Dec 22 02:29
schestowitz	it's only getting worse	Dec 22 02:30
schestowitz	like so-called 'smart locks'	Dec 22 02:30
schestowitz	and our 'electric shower'	Dec 22 02:30
schestowitz	Any issue? BUY A NEW ONE!!	Dec 22 02:30
schestowitz	Even the new rail	Dec 22 02:30
schestowitz	and showerhead... it's s set	Dec 22 02:30
schestowitz	they won't fix these, no parts manufactured either	Dec 22 02:30
cubexyz	schestowitz, it's a bit like that for laptops now, maybe not quite as bad	Dec 22 02:30
schestowitz	and thats for like... 2 - 3 years later	Dec 22 02:30
schestowitz	they have "NEW MODELS!"	Dec 22 02:31
schestowitz	cubexyz: depends on the OEM	Dec 22 02:31
schestowitz	you can get more modular ones	Dec 22 02:31
schestowitz	not that bendable, foldable, "thin" (Air) stuff	Dec 22 02:31
schestowitz	fashion in computing and 'novelty' in cars may mean shorter lives	Dec 22 02:31
schestowitz	they like it that way.... more sales	Dec 22 02:32
schestowitz	for showers the fix might be replacement valve	Dec 22 02:32
schestowitz	or something trivial like this	Dec 22 02:32
schestowitz	but no, they won't keep spares... not in their financial interests	Dec 22 02:33
schestowitz	and the "smarter" these things get (locks, phones), the harder they are to repair	Dec 22 02:33
schestowitz	on your own or with help	Dec 22 02:33
schestowitz	mechanical stuff you can figure out or find something who can figure out for a fee	Dec 22 02:33
schestowitz	https://www.managingip.com/Article/3909912/Managing-IPs-most-read-stories-of-the-decade.html	Dec 22 02:37
schestowitz	"The Unified Patent Court (UPC), Brexit and artificial intelligence (AI) all feature in our list more than once, either directly or indirectly, mirroring some of the biggest talking points of the last few years."	Dec 22 02:37
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.managingip.com \| Managing IP’s most-read stories of the decade \| Managing Intellectual Property		Dec 22 02:37
schestowitz	"A senior judge saying ‘bullshit’, a mental health and wellbeing focus, and tributes to inspirational figures who passed away are among Managing IP’s most-viewed articles in the last 10 years"	Dec 22 02:37
DaemonFC[m]	If your windows don't work you may not want to do anything about it.	Dec 22 02:38
DaemonFC[m]	The regulators and switches and motors are awfully expensive.	Dec 22 02:39
cubexyz	buy a car with old style crank windows?	Dec 22 02:39
cubexyz	surely it's still possible	Dec 22 02:39
MinceR	https://i.imgur.com/BHbeJ30.jpg	Dec 22 02:40
MinceR	or just buy a car with reliable electric windows	Dec 22 02:40
MinceR	my toyota carina never had any trouble with that	Dec 22 02:41
MinceR	working the hand cranks is a pain	Dec 22 02:41
schestowitz	at least they EXIST	Dec 22 02:41
schestowitz	the one cars lack these	Dec 22 02:41
cubexyz	just thinking they would be easier to repair for the do-it-yourselfers	Dec 22 02:42
schestowitz	now we have online shops for spares, videos to show you how to assemble...	Dec 22 02:43
schestowitz	like... keyboards on laptops	Dec 22 02:43
MinceR	and if you quickly want to replace the air in the car, you'll have to stop, go around and crank each of them twice	Dec 22 02:43
MinceR	instead of just pressing 4 buttons twice :>	Dec 22 02:43
cubexyz	keyboard replacement on laptops shouldn't be too hard	Dec 22 02:43
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danielp3344	cubexyz: I love manual windows	Dec 22 02:58
danielp3344	they almost never break	Dec 22 02:58
danielp3344	All my cars with power windows have taken like 5 minutes to roll up or down	Dec 22 02:58
danielp3344	because the motors and stuff wear out	Dec 22 02:58
MinceR	they never wore out on mine	Dec 22 03:00
danielp3344	how old was it?	Dec 22 03:00
danielp3344	I'm talking 20-30 years old and beat to hell cars TBH	Dec 22 03:01
MinceR	22 years when i sold it	Dec 22 03:01
danielp3344	that's about average I guess	Dec 22 03:01
danielp3344	most of them seem to start getting really bad around 25 years	Dec 22 03:01
danielp3344	my brothers 2001 mercury has terrible ones though	Dec 22 03:02
danielp3344	the passenger side you have to pull on to get it back up	Dec 22 03:02
danielp3344	argh so many cloudflare sites	Dec 22 03:03
schestowitz	aws and clownflare as the 'new webhost'	Dec 22 03:04
MinceR	:(	Dec 22 03:04
schestowitz	and for those without domains... FACEBOOK	Dec 22 03:04
schestowitz	yay, "the WEB"	Dec 22 03:04
danielp3344	lol	Dec 22 03:05
danielp3344	The worst part is the people who get hurt the most are the least technically adept	Dec 22 03:06
danielp3344	most of the cloudflare sites I find are car forums where it's hard to convince people to fix site stuff	Dec 22 03:06
danielp3344	but there's so much good information tere	Dec 22 03:07
danielp3344	there*	Dec 22 03:07
MinceR	https://hugelolcdn.com/i/642390.png	Dec 22 03:14
oiaohm	Trying to get a new car with manual windows these days is insanely hard	Dec 22 04:04
DaemonFC[m]	Well, the Yoga 900 at least was easy to replace the battery on.	Dec 22 04:16
DaemonFC[m]	Apple basically glues the batteries in, solders RAM so you can't upgrade it. Stuff like that.	Dec 22 04:17
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DaemonFC[m]	There's no real need to upgrade the RAM. It had 16 GB when I bought it and that's still a bottomless pit on Linux.	Dec 22 05:03
DaemonFC[m]	Macs are always like 4 GB of RAM or something ridiculous.	Dec 22 05:04
DaemonFC[m]	And then people say the Mac is so efficient it doesn't need more than that.	Dec 22 05:06
DaemonFC[m]	Like, pretty sure Chrome is a big pig on a Mac just like it is everywhere else.	Dec 22 05:06
DaemonFC[m]	Me when I see 4 GB of RAM and a slow processor....	Dec 22 05:07
DaemonFC[m]	Not sure if $4,000 Mac or $199 Chromebook.	Dec 22 05:07
DaemonFC[m]	Google pretty much does throw every trick in the book at Chrome OS to save RAM. It keeps device cost down.	Dec 22 05:11
DaemonFC[m]	> aws and clownflare as the 'new webhost'	Dec 22 05:39
DaemonFC[m]	schestowitz OpenBSD went as far as to patch out DNS over HTTPS from Firefox.	Dec 22 05:39
DaemonFC[m]	The reasoning was it sends your DNS lookups to Cloudflare.	Dec 22 05:39
DaemonFC[m]	The majority of DoH FUD seems to be coming from governments who want to censor though.	Dec 22 05:44
*DaemonFC[m] uploaded an image: Tusky_Share_Media_20191221_235506.png (33KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/ErcULGubInrqtusuMKBlBhDi >		Dec 22 05:55
DaemonFC[m]	This was definitely the plot of Doom....	Dec 22 05:55
*DaemonFC[m] uploaded an image: SmartSelect_20191222-013559_DroidEdit.jpg (379KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/tnngJAMxgJkXJkAnyQkzPMXx >		Dec 22 06:11
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Intel Graphics and Benchmarks http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132015 [https://pleroma.site/objects/878ebe5b-d237-43ab-859d-6bf3c6011ffa]		Dec 22 06:42
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Elementary OS \| Review From an openSUSE User http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132016 [https://pleroma.site/objects/afe7380c-3f5f-40d2-97b6-5915dd395960]		Dec 22 06:47
DaemonFC[m]	Someone commented that Brave removing ads and then inserting their own is a dick move.	Dec 22 07:22
DaemonFC[m]	Of course. Brendan Eich is an asshole.	Dec 22 07:22
schestowitz	> It appears that groups of {explitive_deleted} simply wander around the	Dec 22 07:24
schestowitz	> net looking for people to attack. Now they've turned against JK Rowling	Dec 22 07:24
schestowitz	> again, for stating facts, despite her having retrofitted one of the	Dec 22 07:24
schestowitz	> {explitive_deleted}'s own into a key role in her book series:	Dec 22 07:24
schestowitz	>	Dec 22 07:24
schestowitz	> https://mobile.twitter.com/jk_rowling/status/1207646162813100033?p=p	Dec 22 07:24
schestowitz	>	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> Twitter and MSM facilitate these wandering lynch mobs. Twitter is	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> partially Saudi-owned so somehow these attacks must match with their	Dec 22 07:25
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-mobile.twitter.com \| Twitter		Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> agenda, either directly or indirectly.	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	>	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> Just wait till those attack groups get a whiff of evolution and	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> selective fitness as applied to larger and larger groups: cultures.	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	Thanks for showing this to me. Yes, I am aware. Yesterday there was one bit in an article about Macron choosing someone for "gender balance"; that's considered a dangerous thing to say nowadays.	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	News is starting to dry up; media will manufacture scandals or support any (to get hits, sell ads).	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> It appears that groups of {explitive_deleted} simply wander around the	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> net looking for people to attack. Now they've turned against JK Rowling	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> again, for stating facts, despite her having retrofitted one of the	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> {explitive_deleted}'s own into a key role in her book series:	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	>	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> https://mobile.twitter.com/jk_rowling/status/1207646162813100033?p=p	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	>	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> Twitter and MSM facilitate these wandering lynch mobs. Twitter is	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> partially Saudi-owned so somehow these attacks must match with their	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> agenda, either directly or indirectly.	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	>	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> Just wait till those attack groups get a whiff of evolution and	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	> selective fitness as applied to larger and larger groups: cultures.	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	Thanks for showing this to me. Yes, I am aware. Yesterday there was one bit in an article about Macron choosing someone for "gender balance"; that's considered a dangerous thing to say nowadays.	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	News is starting to dry up; media will manufacture scandals or support any (to get hits, sell ads).	Dec 22 07:25
schestowitz	oops, double pasted. My bad...	Dec 22 07:25
DaemonFC[m]	Who is going after JK Rowling?	Dec 22 07:41
DaemonFC[m]	She's tge one who sued Canadians and got a court to order them not to read a book that a store sold them too early by mistake.	Dec 22 07:42
DaemonFC[m]	Fuck her.	Dec 22 07:42
DaemonFC[m]	It's the store's fault that the book got out before it was supposed to be sold. Sue them. Getting a court to order people not to read is fucking stupid. How are you going to enforce that? You're just showing what a cunt you are if you do that.	Dec 22 07:43
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DaemonFC[m]	Then in the UK, her publisher sued Asda for saying that they thought one of her books was overpriced.	Dec 22 07:45
DaemonFC[m]	Seriously? Can you win a lawsuit against someone for saying they think your product is overpriced in the UK?	Dec 22 07:46
DaemonFC[m]	Nobody should buy her books. Just BitTorrent them if you want to read them, or borrow a copy from the library before she sues to have libraries made illegal.	Dec 22 07:50
DaemonFC[m]	I don't like to spend money on copyrighted stuff because I don't agree with copyright as it stands.	Dec 22 07:51
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DaemonFC[m]	Disney waa nasty a long time before internet file sharing.	Dec 22 07:56
DaemonFC[m]	They had this "Disney vault" idea that they would stoo selling a movie for years at a time so that when they "opened the vault" again, people would panic and buy it before they weren't allowed to anymore.	Dec 22 07:57
DaemonFC[m]	Well, lots of people got together and ran off copies in their VCRs and traded them with other parents instead, ao the vault idea probably hurt sales, but Disney would never admit it.	Dec 22 07:58
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: This week in KDE: it’s gonna be amaaaaaaaaaaazing http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132017 [https://pleroma.site/objects/9d38bbd8-bb8e-4b1c-a64f-b93cf8f31f12]		Dec 22 09:17
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Create a unique Linux experience with the Unix Desktop Environment http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132018 [https://pleroma.site/objects/8b4ffe25-20ca-4ac7-99d4-bc788c90117d]		Dec 22 09:19
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: France to launch the Digital Labour Code open source platform http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132019 [https://pleroma.site/objects/103a97ad-ac0e-42e1-805c-cb49e2d40c5c]		Dec 22 10:01
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: My impressions using the System76 Oryx Pro http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132020 [https://pleroma.site/objects/c85ba591-a43f-4236-a651-c9da5352bfd4]		Dec 22 10:05
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linuxgirl	Hi guys :-)	Dec 22 11:03
linuxgirl	so arch shifts to zstd on the 27th, I just found out ... and the link about zstd goes to facebook.github link	Dec 22 11:04
schestowitz	hi	Dec 22 11:04
linuxgirl	hi :-)	Dec 22 11:04
schestowitz	less than a minute ago I posted https://joindiaspora.com/posts/16819133	Dec 22 11:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: #deletegithub #microsoft #github #proprietarysoftware		Dec 22 11:05
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- Photo by schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: https://joindiaspora.com/uploads/images/thumb_medium_4c8a082651ea8efc63fc.jpg		Dec 22 11:05
schestowitz	well,, yesterday I spoke to mr curl about github	Dec 22 11:05
schestowitz	maybe I made my point clear enough	Dec 22 11:05
linuxgirl	yes?	Dec 22 11:05
schestowitz	that for curl to leave github would be beneficial	Dec 22 11:05
linuxgirl	github needs throwing off a cliff	Dec 22 11:05
schestowitz	he listened	Dec 22 11:05
linuxgirl	everything leaving github would be so great	Dec 22 11:05
linuxgirl	good he listened	Dec 22 11:05
schestowitz	curl is used on like 3 billion machines	Dec 22 11:05
linuxgirl	really important it shuts shop and goes somewhere other than github	Dec 22 11:06
schestowitz	I can't do this on my own	Dec 22 11:06
linuxgirl	I'm stunned arch would go along with a facebook github thing	Dec 22 11:06
schestowitz	so we create a sort of movement	Dec 22 11:06
linuxgirl	Yes	Dec 22 11:06
schestowitz	more people need to confront devs over it	Dec 22 11:06
schestowitz	to create a perceptual dynamic	Dec 22 11:06
schestowitz	under "headlings" like "delete github"	Dec 22 11:06
linuxgirl	what could be useful is a set of links directly to devs, so ppl can come here and click thru and say their piece?	Dec 22 11:06
schestowitz	so by all means go around, spread the argyment for leaving github	Dec 22 11:07
schestowitz	explain to media that FOSS != github	Dec 22 11:07
linuxgirl	you're right	Dec 22 11:07
schestowitz	and things that are not on GitHub DO exist	Dec 22 11:07
linuxgirl	yes, lots of places went over to gitlab and a fair amount of links go there	Dec 22 11:07
schestowitz	see comment http://techrights.org/2019/11/11/delete-github/#comments	Dec 22 11:07
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Microsoft’s Abduction of the Voice of Its Opposition Highlights the Urgency of the Movement/Campaign to Delete GitHub \| Techrights		Dec 22 11:07
schestowitz	we still keep that wiki list up to date	Dec 22 11:07
schestowitz	it's like a todo list	Dec 22 11:07
schestowitz	some people go and speak to the devs	Dec 22 11:08
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/Delete_Github	Dec 22 11:08
linuxgirl	but then facebook.github arises, and I understand zstd is the main thing across the system, so facebook and github will be able to read everything?!	Dec 22 11:08
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Delete Github - Techrights		Dec 22 11:08
linuxgirl	great, thanks	Dec 22 11:08
schestowitz	help us out	Dec 22 11:08
schestowitz	it counts	Dec 22 11:08
schestowitz	it makes devs think	Dec 22 11:08
linuxgirl	yes :-)	Dec 22 11:08
schestowitz	if nobody says anything, nothing will change	Dec 22 11:08
schestowitz	NOT-A-FRIEND, MAN (Friedman) blocked me	Dec 22 11:09
linuxgirl	I've had a few barnies in my time, lol, about privacy	Dec 22 11:09
schestowitz	in twitter, where I never spoke to him	Dec 22 11:09
linuxgirl	if people are going to be like that, stuff 'em	Dec 22 11:09
schestowitz	use the wiki list	Dec 22 11:09
schestowitz	speak to the devs	Dec 22 11:09
linuxgirl	okay	Dec 22 11:09
schestowitz	explain why github is bad	Dec 22 11:09
schestowitz	also you can use this argument, of ethics/racism: http://techrights.org/2019/07/28/linux-foundation-microsoft-outsourcing/	Dec 22 11:09
linuxgirl	sorry, which link is the wiki?	Dec 22 11:09
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| People From Half a Dozen Countries May be Banned From Participating in the Linux Foundation Because It’s Outsourcing Many Projects to Microsoft/GitHub \| Techrights		Dec 22 11:09
schestowitz	this really gets to people ^	Dec 22 11:10
linuxgirl	the only solution is people voting with their feet, and loudly	Dec 22 11:10
schestowitz	reminds them they're not in control in who gets the s/w and gives back to uit	Dec 22 11:10
schestowitz	*it	Dec 22 11:10
schestowitz	Trump decides	Dec 22 11:10
schestowitz	and Microsoft implements	Dec 22 11:10
schestowitz	I heard github saw a decrease	Dec 22 11:10
schestowitz	not sure if deletions of number of people/projects joining	Dec 22 11:10
linuxgirl	it definitely did when ms bought it	Dec 22 11:10
schestowitz	but I heard they spotted a decrease and panicked a bit	Dec 22 11:11
schestowitz	ICE caused some brain drain also	Dec 22 11:11
schestowitz	let's keep that goin g	Dec 22 11:11
linuxgirl	I've seen very few actually go to it, and they get shocked comments at them	Dec 22 11:11
schestowitz	MS manufactured fake news	Dec 22 11:11
schestowitz	"arctic vault"	Dec 22 11:11
schestowitz	to distract the media from the ICE exodus	Dec 22 11:11
linuxgirl	they can't con people who are awake, thankfully, and here's hoping they bury themselves in their vault! that would do everyone a lot of good	Dec 22 11:11
schestowitz	I deleted my account at GH before the announcement	Dec 22 11:11
linuxgirl	well done!	Dec 22 11:11
schestowitz	hours before it, when it was still a rumour alone	Dec 22 11:12
linuxgirl	good!	Dec 22 11:12
schestowitz	http://schestowitz.com/Weblog/archives/2018/06/04/delete-github/	Dec 22 11:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-schestowitz.com » Blog Archive » How to Delete Your GitHub Account to Tell GitHub What You Think About Their Decision to Sell Out		Dec 22 11:12
linuxgirl	good link!	Dec 22 11:12
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linuxgirl	what's your view of zstd?	Dec 22 11:13
schestowitz	fb	Dec 22 11:13
schestowitz	you know my views on fb	Dec 22 11:13
linuxgirl	I was worried as soon as I heard about it, and now it's all across the pc on the 27th	Dec 22 11:14
schestowitz	gh isn't the worst aspect of it	Dec 22 11:14
schestowitz	intel puts its compression crap on gh also	Dec 22 11:14
linuxgirl	yes, and I'm stunned any distro would choose something facebook-linked, especially arch	Dec 22 11:14
linuxgirl	I'd admired them for not being supportive of snaps, but seems it's gone a bit poo	Dec 22 11:16
linuxgirl	lol	Dec 22 11:16
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schestowitz	I mentioned one today	Dec 22 11:16
schestowitz	hang on	Dec 22 11:16
linuxgirl	okay	Dec 22 11:16
schestowitz	[09:32] <schestowitz> https://pleroma.site/notice/9qDN5t5UHzNLUmWXMe	Dec 22 11:16
schestowitz	[09:32] <schestowitz> "@schestowitz Hosted in github, this is a non-starter."	Dec 22 11:16
schestowitz	see context	Dec 22 11:16
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-pleroma.site \| Pleroma		Dec 22 11:16
schestowitz	based on opensuse	Dec 22 11:16
linuxgirl	that's the other site I couldn't remember then name of!	Dec 22 11:17
linuxgirl	if it's a gitlab alternative	Dec 22 11:17
schestowitz	at least people dare say things like these, namely: "Hosted in github, this is a non-starter."	Dec 22 11:17
schestowitz	We need a thousand of geeks to say that	Dec 22 11:17
linuxgirl	yes, well said	Dec 22 11:17
schestowitz	many a milion	Dec 22 11:17
schestowitz	then things will change	Dec 22 11:17
schestowitz	so please help	Dec 22 11:17
schestowitz	FOSS is at risk	Dec 22 11:17
linuxgirl	yes, if everyone who cares anything about privacy and linux's future said that straight out, things would be very different	Dec 22 11:17
schestowitz	they use GH for business intelligence	Dec 22 11:17
schestowitz	they use the "big data" BS	Dec 22 11:17
schestowitz	They look for who talks to who, how to control and undermine us	Dec 22 11:18
schestowitz	they have departments for this kind of thing	Dec 22 11:18
schestowitz	[20:34] <schestowitz> https://twitter.com/emilengler/status/1208464911703183362	Dec 22 11:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@emilengler: @bagder @schestowitz They have full write access. As long as you don’t sign all your git commits MS could easily fa… https://t.co/uScx1kNAxa		Dec 22 11:18
schestowitz	v	Dec 22 11:18
schestowitz	[20:34] <schestowitz> "They have full write access. As long as you don’t sign all your git commits MS could easily fake your commits. Bitcoin Core for example uses a strong crypto system to secure the commits. Everything would fail there if MS would try to edit the git repo."	Dec 22 11:18
schestowitz	[20:35] <schestowitz> I know what you mean, but the danger persists. See intro in http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/Delete_Github	Dec 22 11:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Delete Github - Techrights		Dec 22 11:18
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/emilengler/status/1208486889646370816	Dec 22 11:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@emilengler: @schestowitz @bagder Let's say all people who should have write access sign all commits and merge commits. Then you… https://t.co/UnAWk1tGzR		Dec 22 11:18
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schestowitz	see the reactions from Mr. Curl, a Swede	Dec 22 11:18
schestowitz	he's at least considering	Dec 22 11:19
schestowitz	Curl is MMMMAAASIVE	Dec 22 11:19
linuxgirl	that's some good news then, about Mr Curl	Dec 22 11:19
schestowitz	maybe distributes millions of copies PER DAY.	Dec 22 11:19
linuxgirl	if more like him get on board, there's hope	Dec 22 11:19
schestowitz	that's a lot of traffic (i.e. spying) by Microsoft	Dec 22 11:19
linuxgirl	yes	Dec 22 11:19
schestowitz	GH loses money	Dec 22 11:19
schestowitz	but the business model isn't that	Dec 22 11:19
schestowitz	it's about control	Dec 22 11:19
schestowitz	always was, even FSF had warned about it	Dec 22 11:20
linuxgirl	I'd hope the many who left for gitlab would 'wing' ms enough to stop anything worse	Dec 22 11:20
linuxgirl	absolutely needs ppl to leave GH entirely	Dec 22 11:20
schestowitz	yes, but	Dec 22 11:20
schestowitz	CREATE THE INERTIA :-)	Dec 22 11:20
schestowitz	let's do this	Dec 22 11:20
oiaohm	gitlab does not give access to the same CI testing platforms as github.	Dec 22 11:20
schestowitz	I can't do this alone	Dec 22 11:20
linuxgirl	yes :-)	Dec 22 11:20
schestowitz	I try, I use #deletegithub about 10 times per day	Dec 22 11:20
linuxgirl	well done!	Dec 22 11:20
schestowitz	but a thousand of us can floods social control media convos with the social call, the call for action	Dec 22 11:21
schestowitz	to the point where quitting is an act of collective solidarity	Dec 22 11:21
linuxgirl	the irony is I'm not on any social media, to avoid data/privacy issues, just a mastodon account I don't really use, but this needs social media! I can tweet it there lots	Dec 22 11:21
schestowitz	zoobab used to help with it	Dec 22 11:21
schestowitz	he slowed down a bit	Dec 22 11:21
oiaohm	The possiblity of the hosting messing with your git repo is possible no matter how you use.	Dec 22 11:21
linuxgirl	no reddit, twitter, google etc	Dec 22 11:21
schestowitz	oiaohm: stop with your MS apologism	Dec 22 11:21
oiaohm	So signing should be a general recommendation.	Dec 22 11:21
schestowitz	not the place	Dec 22 11:21
linuxgirl	oh my gawd, not the ms stuff again	Dec 22 11:22
linuxgirl	this is a linux IRC!	Dec 22 11:22
linuxgirl	not pro-ms	Dec 22 11:22
schestowitz	CI... give me a break... not many even use that	Dec 22 11:22
schestowitz	Maybe you can go on about Visual Studio 'Code' (openwash) integration	Dec 22 11:22
schestowitz	And AZUNE [sic]	Dec 22 11:22
linuxgirl	lol	Dec 22 11:22
linuxgirl	such a critical time to cut off ms tentacles, and LF/anything not supportive of Linux	Dec 22 11:23
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/2011/05/18/zune-theming/	Dec 22 11:23
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| At Microsoft, Linux/FOSS is Like Zune \| Techrights		Dec 22 11:23
schestowitz	LF is fried	Dec 22 11:23
linuxgirl	yes	Dec 22 11:23
schestowitz	it's an openwashing operation	Dec 22 11:23
oiaohm	schestowitz: https://about.gitlab.com/blog/2018/07/19/gcp-move-update/ welcome to great fun as well	Dec 22 11:23
schestowitz	They're to us what OSI was	Dec 22 11:23
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-about.gitlab.com \| Update on our planned move from Azure to Google Cloud Platform \| GitLab		Dec 22 11:23
schestowitz	irrelevant, a bypass used by corporate power	Dec 22 11:23
linuxgirl	I'm thinking it's surely getting so obvious that many more are awake to the dubious stuff they're doing, and won't support/donate	Dec 22 11:23
oiaohm	Notice the top list there of countries that cannot access gitlab because they are using google storage.	Dec 22 11:23
schestowitz	Torvalds doesn't care about freedom anyway, so I don't think I can ever convince him to do anything	Dec 22 11:24
oiaohm	schestowitz: this is not MS apologism	Dec 22 11:24
schestowitz	he's aging fast now	Dec 22 11:24
oiaohm	There is a set of pracital problems.	Dec 22 11:24
schestowitz	college in Portland is pricey	Dec 22 11:24
linuxgirl	yes, not impressed with Mr Torvalds over the last year	Dec 22 11:24
schestowitz	maybe the girls can do Ivy League, that's like a million bucks each	Dec 22 11:24
oiaohm	You might be using gitlab and github in combination so all your users can access it. + some others.	Dec 22 11:24
linuxgirl	and GregKH signing two MS ppl into the kernel ... well, that's me so done with him	Dec 22 11:24
schestowitz	[11:24] <oiaohm> There is a set of pracital problems.	Dec 22 11:24
schestowitz	You could stay with UNIX in 1989 for the same reasons	Dec 22 11:25
schestowitz	linuxgirl: he was trouble ages ago	Dec 22 11:25
schestowitz	he commented in techrights some times...	Dec 22 11:25
linuxgirl	users still accessing github are taking part in dismantling linux privacy/choice etc, so that'll be a short-lived thing if propping up ms is seen as the option ... never support what's anti-Linux	Dec 22 11:25
schestowitz	Greg was always a "pragmatist"	Dec 22 11:26
linuxgirl	yes, wasn't keen on GregKH on sight, lol	Dec 22 11:26
schestowitz	LF Swappie talked to him to reinforce this months ago	Dec 22 11:26
schestowitz	We're just "religion" and "hippies" to these people	Dec 22 11:26
linuxgirl	Greg seems to only care re tech/himself, not where or what is affected by that	Dec 22 11:26
schestowitz	that's what companies like	Dec 22 11:26
schestowitz	maybe that's why LF added him to the payroll	Dec 22 11:26
schestowitz	Microsoft apologism? Check. HIRED!	Dec 22 11:27
linuxgirl	wow, religion and hippies ... those championing what really matters!	Dec 22 11:27
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/2019/10/27/smearing-gnu-linux-as-religion/	Dec 22 11:27
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Somebody Needs to Explain to the Linux Foundation That GNU/Linux (or Software Freedom) is Not a Religion \| Techrights		Dec 22 11:27
linuxgirl	yes, guaranteed that's why LF cultivate GregKH	Dec 22 11:27
schestowitz	GregKH friend brings a friend	Dec 22 11:28
schestowitz	Levin	Dec 22 11:28
schestowitz	he said he "can vouch for him"	Dec 22 11:28
linuxgirl	omg	Dec 22 11:28
schestowitz	Thank you, Greg, we already know your Novell salaries came from Microsoft	Dec 22 11:28
linuxgirl	anyone GregKH vouches for isn't a friend of Linux I bet	Dec 22 11:28
schestowitz	his hyper-V work etc.	Dec 22 11:29
linuxgirl	hmmm	Dec 22 11:29
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/wiki/index.php/Hyper-V_Reality_Log	Dec 22 11:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Hyper-V Reality Log - Techrights		Dec 22 11:29
linuxgirl	wow, as we're chatting it keeps hitting me about facebook.github, lol	Dec 22 11:29
schestowitz	https://joindiaspora.com/posts/16819288	Dec 22 11:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz@joindiaspora.com: Remember that to #linuxfoundation we're just "religion" and "hippies"; we're NOTHING to these people; the management there is career-climbing sociopaths. http://techrights.org/2019/10/27/smearing-gnu-linux-as-religion/		Dec 22 11:29
linuxgirl	just unbelievable!	Dec 22 11:29
schestowitz	please help us	Dec 22 11:29
schestowitz	to spread the word	Dec 22 11:29
schestowitz	that's all we need	Dec 22 11:29
schestowitz	numbers	Dec 22 11:29
linuxgirl	where do you go after arch (baby arch, btw ... the Zen installer, after having done a lot of 'the arch way' installs)	Dec 22 11:30
schestowitz	we have the truth and narrative	Dec 22 11:30
schestowitz	not the budget	Dec 22 11:30
schestowitz	but we have time and passion	Dec 22 11:30
linuxgirl	yes, will do my best! :-)	Dec 22 11:30
schestowitz	some people send us articles	Dec 22 11:30
schestowitz	which helps also....	Dec 22 11:30
linuxgirl	will do my best! :-)	Dec 22 11:30
schestowitz	some send leaks and tips	Dec 22 11:30
linuxgirl	eek	Dec 22 11:30
schestowitz	like the Bill Gates stuff	Dec 22 11:30
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linuxgirl	grrr, text stopped working	Dec 22 11:31
schestowitz	months ago Bill paid my boss	Dec 22 11:31
schestowitz	under NDA	Dec 22 11:31
schestowitz	I did not sign the NSA	Dec 22 11:31
linuxgirl	eek	Dec 22 11:31
schestowitz	NDA	Dec 22 11:31
schestowitz	it does not apply to me	Dec 22 11:31
schestowitz	My boss competes against MS	Dec 22 11:31
oiaohm	schestowitz: you have a list of projects that are on github. Ok how many of those provide either Windows binaries or OS X binaries. Remember you move to gitlab hosted by gitlab there CI hardware does not provide OS X or Windows.	Dec 22 11:31
schestowitz	So no reason for Bill to pay him	Dec 22 11:31
oiaohm	Basically who is going to pay the bill to run those CI severs.	Dec 22 11:31
linuxgirl	yes, following things back, or the worse steps these people try, can be very surprising	Dec 22 11:32
schestowitz	we know what happened after Bill had paid MIT through his BBF Epstein	Dec 22 11:32
schestowitz	RMS homeless	Dec 22 11:32
schestowitz	oiaohm: enough with your CI nonsense	Dec 22 11:32
linuxgirl	yes, just awful ... hope RMS is doing well	Dec 22 11:32
schestowitz	irrelevant	Dec 22 11:32
schestowitz	you can use gitlab also	Dec 22 11:32
schestowitz	the startups that do CI also add gitlab support sooner or later	Dec 22 11:32
oiaohm	schestowitz: No you cannot gitlab provide CI is Linux.	Dec 22 11:32
schestowitz	as GL grows	Dec 22 11:32
oiaohm	schestowitz: the free one that is.	Dec 22 11:32
oiaohm	schestowitz: there is no windows CI or OS X CI free there.	Dec 22 11:33
schestowitz	[11:31] <oiaohm> Basically who is going to pay the bill to run those CI severs.	Dec 22 11:33
schestowitz	go on, fool	Dec 22 11:33
schestowitz	let's make MS our sugar daddy	Dec 22 11:33
schestowitz	what can go wrong	Dec 22 11:33
linuxgirl	lol, anything MS-linked is going to be doing damage	Dec 22 11:33
schestowitz	PLEASE Microsoft.... pay me for the server.... PLEASE!!! Freedom!! PLEASE!! NADELLA, I LOVE YOU!!	Dec 22 11:33
linuxgirl	lol :-)	Dec 22 11:33
oiaohm	Exactly point	Dec 22 11:33
oiaohm	If you don't use the CI provide at MS expenise you have to give them more money.	Dec 22 11:34
linuxgirl	linux has ALL the tech ability, so much so that ms wants that, so there are plenty who can develop a GH alternative, or improve gitlab	Dec 22 11:34
schestowitz	kaniini very generously donated a server to us	Dec 22 11:34
linuxgirl	cool! :-)	Dec 22 11:34
linuxgirl	very good of them	Dec 22 11:34
schestowitz	the Free software world can figure out how to keep momentum going, without MS money	Dec 22 11:34
linuxgirl	absolutely!	Dec 22 11:34
oiaohm	I am not against say that project should have copies of their git with more than provider.	Dec 22 11:35
schestowitz	to depend financially on one's competition is to kill oneself	Dec 22 11:35
linuxgirl	no support to those who back MS is critical, and no using MS stuff	Dec 22 11:35
oiaohm	Take as much advantage of what is given for free.	Dec 22 11:35
linuxgirl	yes, can never get rid of something like MS if still accessing and supporting it	Dec 22 11:35
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/eren_niazi/status/1125052469099151360	Dec 22 11:35
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@eren_niazi: @schestowitz #microsoft has a master plan for #opensource and it’s not good. OpenSource is about #Freedom not cont… https://t.co/xfmholiyEz		Dec 22 11:35
schestowitz	"	Dec 22 11:35
schestowitz	#microsoft has a master plan for #opensource and it’s not good.	Dec 22 11:35
schestowitz	OpenSource is about #Freedom not control.	Dec 22 11:35
schestowitz	Don’t you all think it’s a little suspicious what Microsoft paid for #github?	Dec 22 11:35
schestowitz	"	Dec 22 11:35
linuxgirl	yes, a world without privacy/space/choice/freedom is not manageable	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	oiaohm: github is NOT FREE	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	you are the PRODUCT	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	They spy on	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	devs	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	users	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	downloaders	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	It's B.I.	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	It's about control	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	They also censor devs	Dec 22 11:36
linuxgirl	yes, to pay that much is odd ... part of the master plan no doubt, and they're mainly known as data stealers	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	they remove projects for "ethical" reasons	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	(business reasons)	Dec 22 11:36
oiaohm	schestowitz: gitlab sensors developers and removes projects for ethical reasons/business reasons as well.	Dec 22 11:36
linuxgirl	wow, they do that?!	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	remove project for Trump, to impose US racist sanctions	Dec 22 11:36
schestowitz	so stop calling GitHub "free"	Dec 22 11:37
linuxgirl	not a surprise really ... it is ms after all	Dec 22 11:37
schestowitz	"Free" bunny	Dec 22 11:37
schestowitz	Microsoft wants a list of who uses what	Dec 22 11:37
schestowitz	then they can target them	Dec 22 11:37
schestowitz	like cambridge analytics did brexit sceptics	Dec 22 11:37
linuxgirl	yes, power and control over open source	Dec 22 11:38
schestowitz	Now they display targeted ads inside native Vista 10 "apps"	Dec 22 11:38
schestowitz	Like file managers	Dec 22 11:38
linuxgirl	goodness	Dec 22 11:38
oiaohm	schestowitz: https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2017/02/microsoft-hosts-the-windows-source-in-a-monstrous-300gb-git-repository/ amount Microsoft paid for github makes sense for another reason.	Dec 22 11:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-arstechnica.com \| Microsoft hosts the Windows source in a monstrous 300GB Git repository \| Ars Technica		Dec 22 11:38
schestowitz	They can dissuade potential escapees they view as exploring gnu/linux	Dec 22 11:38
schestowitz	pushing them to MSVS, Azure etc.	Dec 22 11:38
linuxgirl	yes, trying to pull them over to develop 'linux' stuff for windows	Dec 22 11:38
schestowitz	And target CEOs to move companies to these, to ensure staff remains stranded in Windowsland	Dec 22 11:39
linuxgirl	IoT is bad enough without ms trying to pull linux devs over there for it	Dec 22 11:39
schestowitz	oiaohm: don't like to pedophile technica	Dec 22 11:39
schestowitz	they should really delete this MS propaganda	Dec 22 11:39
schestowitz	ghostwritten by Microsoft	Dec 22 11:39
oiaohm	I remember when windows source was stored in their own version control system.	Dec 22 11:39
schestowitz	sent to their child rapist to post under pressure	Dec 22 11:39
oiaohm	But they changed to git because it did not work.	Dec 22 11:39
linuxgirl	yes, ms very much about disgusting abuse	Dec 22 11:39
schestowitz	oiaohm: now you reinforce what people in phoronix say abouy uoi	Dec 22 11:40
schestowitz	a Microsoft pusher	Dec 22 11:40
-->mmu_man (~revol@vaf26-2-82-244-111-82.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #techrights		Dec 22 11:40
linuxgirl	I seriously think you're working for ms, oiaohm	Dec 22 11:40
schestowitz	We talk about GNU/Linux advocacy and all you can do is confront us by pushing pro-MSFT lies	Dec 22 11:40
linuxgirl	otherwise, what solutions do you have that are about supporting linux and privacy/freedom/choice?	Dec 22 11:40
schestowitz	GitHub also bribes OSI and LF	Dec 22 11:40
schestowitz	It's another bribery vehicle/coffer for the thugs	Dec 22 11:41
linuxgirl	yes, these places need nobody to donate a penny even	Dec 22 11:41
schestowitz	and they use that for entryism, e.g. Python Boards (PyCon etc.)	Dec 22 11:41
linuxgirl	yes	Dec 22 11:41
schestowitz	anyway, after today we must step up the calls for github to be abandoned	Dec 22 11:41
schestowitz	"why are you on github?"	Dec 22 11:41
linuxgirl	absolutely!	Dec 22 11:41
schestowitz	"what will it take for you to remove project/distro?"	Dec 22 11:42
schestowitz	"how can we help?"	Dec 22 11:42
linuxgirl	a list of the worst about ms, and 'this is the company trying to run linux'.	Dec 22 11:42
linuxgirl	good questions list	Dec 22 11:42
schestowitz	"what is the timeline for leaving?"	Dec 22 11:42
oiaohm	Its been fun watching Microsoft kind of given in with the idea of bend Linux source applications to windows nt with wsl2 going full Linux kernel.	Dec 22 11:42
schestowitz	"can we suggest a number of reasons for leaving...?"	Dec 22 11:42
schestowitz	oiaohm: WSL is an attack on us all	Dec 22 11:42
schestowitz	look who PROMOTES it	Dec 22 11:43
schestowitz	Microsoft sites	Dec 22 11:43
linuxgirl	I think most people also knowing things like the child abuse that goes on, too	Dec 22 11:43
schestowitz	Microsoft lovers	Dec 22 11:43
schestowitz	Microsoft staff	Dec 22 11:43
oiaohm	I am waiting for WSL2 to backfire.	Dec 22 11:43
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/2019/12/05/wsl-secrets/	Dec 22 11:43
oiaohm	Because WSL2 is not keeping up to date with kernel version.	Dec 22 11:43
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Microsoft Staff Repeatedly Refuses to Tell How Many People Use WSL, Defends Patent Extortion and Blackmail of Linux Instead \| Techrights		Dec 22 11:43
schestowitz	#microsoftloveslinux	Dec 22 11:43
oiaohm	This will result in not having all the require CVE as per government contracts.	Dec 22 11:43
oiaohm	WSL1 backfired.	Dec 22 11:44
schestowitz	[11:43] <linuxgirl> I think most people also knowing things like the child abuse that goes on, too	Dec 22 11:44
oiaohm	WSL2 will as well.	Dec 22 11:44
linuxgirl	#microsoftuseslinux	Dec 22 11:44
oiaohm	Just question of time.	Dec 22 11:44
schestowitz	we only cover this in relation to etch though	Dec 22 11:44
schestowitz	or we'd be spread too wide	Dec 22 11:44
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/2019/06/07/microsoft-peter-is-a-pedophile/	Dec 22 11:44
schestowitz	oiaohm uses him for referencing :-)	Dec 22 11:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Microsoft Peter is a Pedophile, Arrested Without Bail \| Techrights		Dec 22 11:44
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/2019/07/30/microsoft-peter-lives-on/	Dec 22 11:44
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Even After Microsoft Lost Its PR ‘Asset’ at Ars Technica (Arrested for Sexually Abusing Kids) Ars Technica Persists With Microsoft Advocacy (in ‘News’ Form) \| Techrights		Dec 22 11:45
linuxgirl	yes, the whole business is sordid, what with literal abuse, and what they're trying to do with linux ... nobody must support them who runs linux, if linux is to be protected ie privacy/freedom/choice	Dec 22 11:45
linuxgirl	Gates/Epstein too ... no normal person thinks paedophilia in an organisation, or anywhere, is okay	Dec 22 11:46
schestowitz	linux is easy for them to control	Dec 22 11:46
schestowitz	gnu... not as easy	Dec 22 11:46
schestowitz	linux is possible to control through LF	Dec 22 11:46
schestowitz	which is corrupt to the core now	Dec 22 11:46
oiaohm	schestowitz: I did not check who the reference was. https://devblogs.microsoft.com/bharry/the-largest-git-repo-on-the-planet/ Its over here as well. Microsoft uses a lot of Linux and for windows depends on git to be useable.	Dec 22 11:46
linuxgirl	we've got to all make sure that anything supporting ms is not supported	Dec 22 11:46
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-devblogs.microsoft.com \| The largest Git repo on the planet \| Brian Harry's Blog		Dec 22 11:46
schestowitz	[11:46] <linuxgirl> Gates/Epstein too ... no normal person thinks paedophilia in an organisation, or anywhere, is okay	Dec 22 11:46
schestowitz	wait for parts IV and V	Dec 22 11:47
schestowitz	Gates Sr. played a role also, perhaps	Dec 22 11:47
oiaohm	So it was only matter of time until Microsoft either bought github or gitlab.	Dec 22 11:47
linuxgirl	okay :-)	Dec 22 11:47
schestowitz	Bill's dad	Dec 22 11:47
oiaohm	Some ways it was good Microsoft bought github.	Dec 22 11:47
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/2019/12/21/police-report-bill-gates/	Dec 22 11:47
oiaohm	The non open source one.	Dec 22 11:47
linuxgirl	only the LF corruption etc enabled MS to buy GH ... it wasn't inevitable at all	Dec 22 11:47
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Mansion of Pedophilia – Part II: Dr. Stallman Defamed in the Media One Day After Request Made for King County Sheriff’s Office to Divulge Information About Pedophilia in Home of Bill Gates \| Techrights		Dec 22 11:47
schestowitz	The main t trafficking right now is of info... to Techrights	Dec 22 11:47
XRevan86	oiaohm: Why would they buy GitLab though? When buying a userbase GitHub is an obvious choice.	Dec 22 11:48
linuxgirl	users have never supported MS being near Linux	Dec 22 11:48
schestowitz	[11:47] <oiaohm> Some ways it was good Microsoft bought github.	Dec 22 11:48
schestowitz	some say "Hitler did nothing wrong"	Dec 22 11:48
linuxgirl	exactly	Dec 22 11:48
schestowitz	Microsoft Peter said it's OK to fuck kids	Dec 22 11:48
schestowitz	even openly	Dec 22 11:48
linuxgirl	just awful, and MS are fine with that	Dec 22 11:48
schestowitz	in Ars parties	Dec 22 11:48
XRevan86	oiaohm: If you mean that this made GitHub's problematic nature more evident, then so what?	Dec 22 11:48
schestowitz	and they didn't take that as a sign of something	Dec 22 11:48
schestowitz	[11:47] <linuxgirl> only the LF corruption etc enabled MS to buy GH ... it wasn't inevitable at all	Dec 22 11:49
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/2019/07/31/jim-zemlin-open-source-loves-microsoft/	Dec 22 11:49
XRevan86	oiaohm: It's flourishing, so the benefits to the commons are unclear.	Dec 22 11:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Jim Zemlin: Open Source Loves Microsoft \| Techrights		Dec 22 11:49
schestowitz	he said that while regulators looked at the GitHub acquisition	Dec 22 11:49
schestowitz	MS made him say that	Dec 22 11:49
schestowitz	they filmed it	Dec 22 11:49
linuxgirl	yes	Dec 22 11:49
schestowitz	even uploaded it to YOUTUBE!	Dec 22 11:50
linuxgirl	so arrogant, aren't they	Dec 22 11:50
oiaohm	XRevan86: exactly github was problemmatic before Microsoft bought it.	Dec 22 11:50
linuxgirl	... facebook.github ... :-(	Dec 22 11:50
oiaohm	Here a few horrible facts.	Dec 22 11:50
XRevan86	oiaohm: We know!	Dec 22 11:50
linuxgirl	https://facebook.github.io/zstd/	Dec 22 11:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-facebook.github.io \| Zstandard - Real-time data compression algorithm		Dec 22 11:51
oiaohm	Before github was bought by microsoft. Both gitlab and github hosting was on Azure so Microsoft could collect all the data back then anyhow.	Dec 22 11:51
oiaohm	Gitlab is now on google hosting.	Dec 22 11:51
schestowitz	not as legally	Dec 22 11:51
schestowitz	and also GitLab is not the solution	Dec 22 11:51
schestowitz	self hosting is	Dec 22 11:51
oiaohm	schestowitz: in fact legally.	Dec 22 11:51
linuxgirl	so you're saying linux developers were stupid before the GH purchase ... if that was the case, about data taken, they'd have known and left before	Dec 22 11:51
oiaohm	schestowitz: wording of azure contract allows monitoring for quality provide of service and internal usage.	Dec 22 11:52
oiaohm	Most people don't check the azure fine print.	Dec 22 11:52
linuxgirl	not interested in MS's inner workings, only in getting rid of them	Dec 22 11:52
schestowitz	oiaohm slows down the discussion	Dec 22 11:52
schestowitz	oiaohm: we're pro gnu/linux	Dec 22 11:52
schestowitz	are you?	Dec 22 11:52
oiaohm	So the change in fact changed nothing other than putting problem in face.	Dec 22 11:52
linuxgirl	why aren't you beavering away on Github or some MS office? why here?	Dec 22 11:52
linuxgirl	we are VERY pro-Linux, yes	Dec 22 11:53
kaniini	in fairness all the cloud services have this type of fine print	Dec 22 11:53
XRevan86	schestowitz: GitLab != GitLab.com :)	Dec 22 11:53
schestowitz	kaniini: yes, I know, but for this reason i don't recommend GitLab either, except self-hosted etc.	Dec 22 11:53
linuxgirl	deliberately taking up time with MS, when what matters is time/energy on Linux and it's future	Dec 22 11:53
kaniini	accordingly, AWS etc must be avoided too	Dec 22 11:53
schestowitz	like GNOME (AFAIK they're in better control)	Dec 22 11:53
linuxgirl	a lot of things to avoid nowadays	Dec 22 11:54
schestowitz	kaniini: yes, but less urgently than that which looks to undermine or hijack the FS movement	Dec 22 11:54
linuxgirl	wondering where to go after Arch (Zen, baby arch ... but have done the proper install quite a few times before)	Dec 22 11:54
oiaohm	Reality we have not been reading the fine print. Also we have the problem you want to move away from the cloud services you have to have the resources todo it as well.	Dec 22 11:54
schestowitz	you can die cheaply	Dec 22 11:55
schestowitz	or live expensively	Dec 22 11:55
schestowitz	as a business	Dec 22 11:55
kaniini	azure and aws are both trying to convince laboratories to throw their infrastructure in the trash and use the cloud for scientific computing	Dec 22 11:55
schestowitz	if you are at the mercy of Google API, watch out	Dec 22 11:55
linuxgirl	cloud/smart/5g are the end, if allowed to continue expanding	Dec 22 11:55
schestowitz	kaniini: later they jack up the price	Dec 22 11:55
schestowitz	and add "extensions" to raise exit barrier	Dec 22 11:55
schestowitz	a good CIO would foresee this	Dec 22 11:56
kaniini	yes	Dec 22 11:56
schestowitz	also unplanned downtimes	Dec 22 11:56
schestowitz	uncontrolled	Dec 22 11:56
schestowitz	"boss, server's down"	Dec 22 11:56
schestowitz	boss: do something	Dec 22 11:56
oiaohm	kaniini: its not just azure and aws either. Google and about 5 other cloud vendors are also pushing that into scientific computing and medicial......	Dec 22 11:56
schestowitz	"I do. I'm waiting for "the cloud"..."	Dec 22 11:56
linuxgirl	IoT = control the masses/switch off things 'randomly'	Dec 22 11:57
schestowitz	our energy provider tries to put one in our home	Dec 22 11:57
kaniini	they claim renting instances has lower TCO than buying a cluster outright	Dec 22 11:57
kaniini	quite funny really	Dec 22 11:57
schestowitz	yesterday in the post they gave notification of visit to install on e	Dec 22 11:57
schestowitz	of course we won't let them in, we even pay extra to NOT have one	Dec 22 11:57
schestowitz	I feel sooooo NOT "smart"	Dec 22 11:58
schestowitz	their marketing papers and letter put "smart" next to every word	Dec 22 11:58
linuxgirl	very actually smart, for sure, to not have this spying and controlling stuff	Dec 22 11:58
schestowitz	it's hilarious, I should take a photo and upload sometime...	Dec 22 11:58
oiaohm	schestowitz: I run Linux on all my systems. I don't see being anti-microsoft is a good move if all that end up happening is like everyone moves to google instead long term that will not improve things.	Dec 22 11:58
kaniini	smart meters they can click your power remotely	Dec 22 11:58
linuxgirl	yes, the number of time utter idiots use the word 'smart' is ridiculous, all the while intending to destroy privacy etc, including their own	Dec 22 11:58
kaniini	one time somebody typo the meter number on a disconnect order and I got clicked	Dec 22 11:58
schestowitz	later come Smart+++	Dec 22 11:59
schestowitz	microphones, cameras, thermostats	Dec 22 11:59
schestowitz	"for your improved service"	Dec 22 11:59
linuxgirl	energy company ALWAYS pushing smart ... an absolute NO from me!	Dec 22 11:59
schestowitz	and you can never switch back to analogue	Dec 22 11:59
schestowitz	I heard that in germany some energy providers now make this mandatory	Dec 22 11:59
linuxgirl	yes, must absolutely resist anything smart	Dec 22 11:59
schestowitz	we explain to the man who comes to take meter readings that we protect his job	Dec 22 12:00
schestowitz	he's not highly-skilled	Dec 22 12:00
linuxgirl	can guarantee google/facebook/ms/aws etc behind it, slurping up anything they can	Dec 22 12:00
schestowitz	sometimes we'd let him visit several times to just meet quotas	Dec 22 12:00
linuxgirl	yes, hopefully the meter reader 'gets it' and is an anti-smart as us	Dec 22 12:00
linuxgirl	cool	Dec 22 12:00
linuxgirl	*as anti-smart	Dec 22 12:00
schestowitz	haha.... gafam will sooner or later "partner" with these energy companies, not just undersea drillers	Dec 22 12:00
schestowitz	https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/cia-gus-hunt-big-data_n_2917842	Dec 22 12:01
kaniini	they do already	Dec 22 12:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-consent.yahoo.com \| HuffPost is now part of Verizon Media		Dec 22 12:01
schestowitz	:-o	Dec 22 12:01
kaniini	the smart meters analysis tools for AEP customers are google	Dec 22 12:01
linuxgirl	I'd think the more this happens the more people wake up to this and say a determined NO	Dec 22 12:01
oiaohm	On IOT https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2019/12/amazon-apple-google-and-the-zigbee-alliance-to-develop-connectivity-standard/ << this read like o crap no.	Dec 22 12:01
kaniini	and they connect to nest and stuff	Dec 22 12:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Amazon, Apple, Google, and the Zigbee Alliance to develop connectivity standard - Apple		Dec 22 12:02
schestowitz	hey, it's not like they'll sell this to the CIA through a shell that's Adelson security contractor in Las Vegas ;-)	Dec 22 12:02
linuxgirl	the more numbers who are awake, the less control these organisations have ... obviously they're banding together due to realising ppl are waking up, so they try to rush it through ...	Dec 22 12:02
schestowitz	(Assange case in Spain ATM)	Dec 22 12:02
schestowitz	linuxgirl: like UPC	Dec 22 12:02
schestowitz	Unitary Patent	Dec 22 12:02
kaniini	then you have the ring doorbells	Dec 22 12:02
schestowitz	They tried to rush it as soon as or before people caught on	Dec 22 12:02
schestowitz	but we managed to defeat it	Dec 22 12:02
kaniini	cops can view them any time	Dec 22 12:02
kaniini	no fourth amendment protection	Dec 22 12:03
linuxgirl	the more they try to rush bad things through, the more important it is to not 'jump', to insist on time and gain knowledge, to beat them	Dec 22 12:03
schestowitz	kaniini: CCTV in private hands	Dec 22 12:03
linuxgirl	those ring doorbells are a travesty ... abusing others' privacy who chose NOT to install them	Dec 22 12:03
schestowitz	and in private buildings, your neighbour as informant, unwittingly	Dec 22 12:03
linuxgirl	Yes, we're onto them trying to rush things, for sure	Dec 22 12:03
schestowitz	Ring is exposed a lot in the media this month	Dec 22 12:03
schestowitz	so people have some facts to chew on	Dec 22 12:04
schestowitz	whether it slows down adoption? Not sure...	Dec 22 12:04
oiaohm	I really do wonder how long until we have our first murder by smart home. That would add a horrible new card to the game of cluedo	Dec 22 12:04
linuxgirl	yes, ring does nothing to help neighbourhoods at all ... except maybe highlight who doesn't give a poo about others' rights, and whatever comes from that	Dec 22 12:04
schestowitz	SUPPORT CCTV or the "NAZIS"\|"TERRORISTS" will win	Dec 22 12:04
linuxgirl	yes, I doubt any sane person wants that ring rubbish anywhere near them, so the more publicity the better	Dec 22 12:04
schestowitz	[12:04] <oiaohm> I really do wonder how long until we have our first murder by smart home. That would add a horrible new card to the game of cluedo	Dec 22 12:04
schestowitz	see South Korea	Dec 22 12:04
schestowitz	girl, unnamed, committed suicide	Dec 22 12:04
schestowitz	when she found out she had been filmed undressing	Dec 22 12:05
linuxgirl	awful	Dec 22 12:05
schestowitz	I think she was underago, too... weeks ago	Dec 22 12:05
oiaohm	schestowitz: I am not talking like that I am talking like the house locks all the doors and sets the place on fire.	Dec 22 12:05
linuxgirl	ring has been repeatedly hacked already, instructing kids, screaming at ppl, etc	Dec 22 12:05
schestowitz	the media there won't even shed many details	Dec 22 12:05
schestowitz	hotels did the same thing	Dec 22 12:05
schestowitz	filming couples having sex	Dec 22 12:05
schestowitz	a friend who was there a year ago told me hotel r ooms were afleed with digial things	Dec 22 12:06
schestowitz	even the toilet seats...	Dec 22 12:06
schestowitz	They're technophiles... to the extreme	Dec 22 12:06
linuxgirl	it's got to the point that contemplating going anywhere, the first thought is privacy risks	Dec 22 12:06
schestowitz	they're put gadgets on their dicks if such a thing existed	Dec 22 12:06
linuxgirl	yep	Dec 22 12:06
linuxgirl	already robot sex being pushed as 'a great opportunity'	Dec 22 12:06
schestowitz	and wearing hats/masking the face is being criminalised	Dec 22 12:07
oiaohm	Some hotels do have horrible set of sensors.	Dec 22 12:07
linuxgirl	'build your own'	Dec 22 12:07
schestowitz	in several Western 'civilised' nations	Dec 22 12:07
schestowitz	I saw several reports this month alone	Dec 22 12:07
linuxgirl	yes	Dec 22 12:07
oiaohm	Yes some do have tollet seat sensors for the stupid reason to reduce on cleaning.	Dec 22 12:07
schestowitz	so EVEN LOOKING AWAY FROM A CAMERA gets you detained	Dec 22 12:07
schestowitz	happened in BritLand months ago	Dec 22 12:07
schestowitz	cameras in the streets that is	Dec 22 12:07
schestowitz	makes you "suspect"	Dec 22 12:07
linuxgirl	but ppl should be clean about the toilet .. it's just a lazy excuse saying 'we need sensors to make sure the loo is clean'	Dec 22 12:08
schestowitz	"Wants privacy" -> crime suspect	Dec 22 12:08
schestowitz	[12:07] <oiaohm> Yes some do have tollet seat sensors for the stupid reason to reduce on cleaning.	Dec 22 12:08
schestowitz	sign	Dec 22 12:08
oiaohm	linuxgirl: its so they don't have to clean it if you don't use it.	Dec 22 12:08
schestowitz	hey, get a smart watch	Dec 22 12:08
linuxgirl	exactly ... you're looked at as if you should be committed if mentioning privacy	Dec 22 12:08
schestowitz	apple has a new patent	Dec 22 12:08
schestowitz	for putting cameras on these	Dec 22 12:08
linuxgirl	still laxy	Dec 22 12:08
linuxgirl	*lazy	Dec 22 12:08
schestowitz	smike with your anus while you wipe, oiaohm	Dec 22 12:08
schestowitz	Hey, "] <oiaohm> linuxgirl: its so they don't have to clean it if you don't use it. "	Dec 22 12:08
oiaohm	Nothing as stupid as hotel/cruse ship safes.	Dec 22 12:09
schestowitz	It's good for your hiegiene to give them back end 'action'..."	Dec 22 12:09
oiaohm	That standard password basically open them always.	Dec 22 12:09
schestowitz	*hygiene	Dec 22 12:09
oiaohm	So if you have stuff to secure you should always travel with your own security solution.	Dec 22 12:09
linuxgirl	people sh*tting everywhere and not cleaning up is encouraged by 'sensors' ie potential data-miners	Dec 22 12:09
linuxgirl	that's lazy and not civilized	Dec 22 12:09
schestowitz	bs excuse	Dec 22 12:10
schestowitz	hire bloody maids and janitors	Dec 22 12:10
linuxgirl	a bum wash, where you pull a lever, fine, but sensors/smart stuff ... nope	Dec 22 12:10
schestowitz	give people bloody jobs	Dec 22 12:10
schestowitz	and they will respect your disgnity	Dec 22 12:10
linuxgirl	lol, yes, ppl's jobs, and normal ways of doing stuff	Dec 22 12:10
schestowitz	unless you're DSK from IMF	Dec 22 12:10
schestowitz	linuxgirl: f* jobs	Dec 22 12:10
schestowitz	give tax money to foxconn	Dec 22 12:11
linuxgirl	lol	Dec 22 12:11
schestowitz	they'll erect some empty building in WI	Dec 22 12:11
schestowitz	Jobs? There you go? Another 2 TRILLION in national debt. Am I doing OK? The Donald Tycoon had 6 bankruptcies... 7th and biggest one yet on the way	Dec 22 12:12
oiaohm	In future we could have way worse in a tollet than just monitoring if you used it or not. https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/11/191113114909.htm	Dec 22 12:12
linuxgirl	omg	Dec 22 12:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Can 'smart toilets' be the next health data wellspring? -- ScienceDaily		Dec 22 12:12
linuxgirl	plop in a bag, I say	Dec 22 12:12
linuxgirl	lol	Dec 22 12:12
schestowitz	or stay away from these "smart" places with "smart" se rvices	Dec 22 12:12
linuxgirl	yes, for sure	Dec 22 12:13
schestowitz	I never swipe a card at the gym... I'm the only one apparently, they came to accept that	Dec 22 12:13
linuxgirl	good	Dec 22 12:13
oiaohm	I guess you saw nytimes with the mobile phone tracking data that people had agreed to with apps on phones	Dec 22 12:13
schestowitz	'phones'	Dec 22 12:13
oiaohm	Including a good stack of people working in pentagon and whitehouse.	Dec 22 12:13
schestowitz	Jacob Appelbaum said it like I had	Dec 22 12:13
linuxgirl	my app days are long gone	Dec 22 12:13
schestowitz	it's a spying devices that can also make calls	Dec 22 12:13
schestowitz	before they 'vanished' him with fear of prosecution	Dec 22 12:14
schestowitz	he linked to techrights on occasions	Dec 22 12:14
oiaohm	https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/12/19/opinion/location-tracking-cell-phone.html << this one I am refering to.	Dec 22 12:14
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.nytimes.com \| Opinion \| Twelve Million Phones, One Dataset, Zero Privacy - The New York Times		Dec 22 12:14
schestowitz	I know	Dec 22 12:14
schestowitz	lots of articles about that one article	Dec 22 12:14
schestowitz	but people will likely not change habits	Dec 22 12:14
oiaohm	Of course this does not cover the fact your carrier can track you down to a roughtly square meter from the towers.	Dec 22 12:15
oiaohm	without an app.	Dec 22 12:15
schestowitz	when i met my consulate in Leeds (Germany) he was shocked when I explained to him google ignores the location toggle	Dec 22 12:15
schestowitz	they should not use these things	Dec 22 12:15
schestowitz	diplomats... Merkel has a special one	Dec 22 12:15
oiaohm	I am watching pinephone developments.	Dec 22 12:16
schestowitz	the others just buy one off the shelf... like ordinary citizens	Dec 22 12:16
oiaohm	Could be a decent phone from a security point of view.	Dec 22 12:16
schestowitz	the Pentagon analysts have them on their systems... can blackmail them using all sorts of things inc. corruption and infidelity	Dec 22 12:16
schestowitz	pinephone still uses the celltowers	Dec 22 12:16
linuxgirl	depends what's run on the phone maybe	Dec 22 12:16
schestowitz	and the calls are not e2e-encrypted	Dec 22 12:16
schestowitz	PGP works better	Dec 22 12:17
oiaohm	schestowitz: does have a cell moden offswitch so I can still access the data on it when it not trackable to towers	Dec 22 12:17
schestowitz	they know who talks to who unless you use tor	Dec 22 12:17
linuxgirl	pinephone are looking to develop a smart-watch. hopefully the phone and watch can make some real progress	Dec 22 12:17
schestowitz	but they don't know where from or contents	Dec 22 12:17
schestowitz	PGP now encrypts subject lines too (unlike in the past)	Dec 22 12:17
*schestowitz gets stuff about Gates in PGP crypto		Dec 22 12:18
linuxgirl	cool	Dec 22 12:18
oiaohm	Even using tor its still possible to solve out who is talking to who it just takes more time.	Dec 22 12:18
schestowitz	i.e. from 'criminals'	Dec 22 12:18
schestowitz	people who want privacy = criminals :-)	Dec 22 12:18
schestowitz	how dare they speak of crime	Dec 22 12:18
linuxgirl	gone from pushing ms to saying 'nothing is private' ... not true	Dec 22 12:18
schestowitz	oiaohm: so why does your country (AU) try to IMPOSE back doors?	Dec 22 12:19
schestowitz	It's the only one that openly passed a low about it	Dec 22 12:19
schestowitz	I suppose China, US and Russia did too	Dec 22 12:19
linuxgirl	asserting privacy, and working for that, does have positive outcomes, and will continue ... there'd not have been a linux otherwise, and now across all servers	Dec 22 12:19
schestowitz	Obviously they have a lapse of vision	Dec 22 12:19
schestowitz	https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pine_Gap	Dec 22 12:19
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org \| Pine Gap - Wikipedia		Dec 22 12:19
schestowitz	[12:19] <schestowitz> It's the only one that openly passed a low about it >>> LAW	Dec 22 12:20
schestowitz	UK did that more secretly, Aussie speaks to enough dingos... that they can just be all blatant about it and still pass it	Dec 22 12:20
linuxgirl	it's shameful how much the UK is mentioned as the worst for privacy ... and concerning	Dec 22 12:21
schestowitz	I'm waiting to see people who think WSL offers better privacy :-) LOL	Dec 22 12:21
linuxgirl	and AU used to not be negative about this stuff	Dec 22 12:21
linuxgirl	lol! :-)	Dec 22 12:21
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/wikileaks/status/1106025553042305025	Dec 22 12:21
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@wikileaks: Another example: The alleged "CIA Snowden", Joshua Schulte, who the US claims is the whistleblower behind the large… https://t.co/LVSg5yih4s		Dec 22 12:21
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@wikileaks: Another example: The alleged "CIA Snowden", Joshua Schulte, who the US claims is the whistleblower behind the large… https://t.co/LVSg5yih4s		Dec 22 12:21
schestowitz	https://twitter.com/schestowitz/status/1106026889200705538	Dec 22 12:21
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@schestowitz: @wikileaks https://t.co/nwyk77O285		Dec 22 12:21
linuxgirl	omg, 160 years ... they really want rid of him	Dec 22 12:22
schestowitz	they say he's a pedo	Dec 22 12:22
schestowitz	so nobody in the media will support him like they did Snowden	Dec 22 12:22
schestowitz	clever strategy	Dec 22 12:22
schestowitz	nobody would ever want to defend a pedo	Dec 22 12:22
linuxgirl	all fabricated to try to avoid another Snowden/any impact	Dec 22 12:22
schestowitz	same done to matt dehart	Dec 22 12:22
schestowitz	who was released months ago... his mother has been lovely to me	Dec 22 12:23
schestowitz	and I doubt he has interest in kids, sexuallu	Dec 22 12:23
linuxgirl	I'd hope people start realising not to take at face value these kind of slurs ... I think the system arrogantly does this too often	Dec 22 12:23
schestowitz	doesn't fit the 'profile'	Dec 22 12:23
oiaohm	schestowitz: You need to think more carefully. AU is part of the Five Eyes. That is Australia, Canada, New Zealand, the United Kingdom and the United States. Differnet things by law Australian government is required to declare publicly.	Dec 22 12:23
linuxgirl	system doesn't care if it destroys these men's lives	Dec 22 12:23
schestowitz	This is what a pedo might look like https://srx.sx/image_proxy?url=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.JCMus79i8VPqQ8XYiCcZawHaFf%26pid%3DApi&h=71ecfa56dcb943c2bec2269ad6c3904afa8ee0da0a5760f955c895dec4e2ea60	Dec 22 12:24
oiaohm	schestowitz: Don't think for one min that those backdoors the Australian government was talking about imposing was only Australia.	Dec 22 12:24
linuxgirl	as long as truth is kept quiet ... they hope ...	Dec 22 12:24
linuxgirl	definitely	Dec 22 12:24
linuxgirl	ie bill's one	Dec 22 12:24
schestowitz	Bill is ready	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	Bill is hungry	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	come to Bill	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	but...	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	I don't think he's a pedo	Dec 22 12:25
linuxgirl	bill is a .... [daren't type it]	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	wife thinks he might be "watching"	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	not "participating"	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	and I doubt it altogether	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	all of it, except some people around him are pedos	Dec 22 12:25
linuxgirl	paedo or supporting it ... both really bad	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	he's aware and he worries people will find out	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	familiar situation	Dec 22 12:25
schestowitz	you know someone who stole or evades tax	Dec 22 12:26
linuxgirl	I don't know how anyone can stomach being anywhere near taking part in or supporting abuse	Dec 22 12:26
schestowitz	but that person trusts you, so you just blush and keep numb	Dec 22 12:26
linuxgirl	if Gates blew the whistle, yes, he'd be poor, but at least he'd have found a soul, and make a significant difference	Dec 22 12:26
schestowitz	AANND... remember what Gates' "Saint" status is built around	Dec 22 12:26
schestowitz	he loves and helps kids.... we're told	Dec 22 12:26
linuxgirl	exactly	Dec 22 12:26
schestowitz	so it would totally end his public career like it did PedoDrew ('Prince Andrew')	Dec 22 12:27
linuxgirl	yes	Dec 22 12:27
schestowitz	if he goes dark, it's good for FS	Dec 22 12:27
linuxgirl	a good thing ... these ppl have no right to be so corrupt and not pay for that	Dec 22 12:27
schestowitz	he's the lead in MS Board	Dec 22 12:27
schestowitz	nobody in the Board has more clout then him	Dec 22 12:27
linuxgirl	yes	Dec 22 12:27
schestowitz	he can sack nadella in 5 minutes if so he wishes	Dec 22 12:27
schestowitz	faster tan you can say "BILL, HEEEEL!"	Dec 22 12:28
linuxgirl	yes, if only he himself could be sacked	Dec 22 12:28
schestowitz	he can be put away	Dec 22 12:28
schestowitz	like RMS was	Dec 22 12:28
oiaohm	https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/oct/03/facebook-surveillance-us-uk-australia-backdoor-encryption << Please note here 3 countries sign this request to facebook. Only one in fact had taken it before the Parliament before doing that request and that is Australia.	Dec 22 12:28
schestowitz	for legit reasons, not libel	Dec 22 12:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.theguardian.com \| US, UK and Australia urge Facebook to create backdoor access to encrypted messages \| Technology \| The Guardian		Dec 22 12:28
schestowitz	RMS was pushed aside for what he had said for years	Dec 22 12:28
schestowitz	in his site, publicly	Dec 22 12:28
schestowitz	that sexual "assault" should at least be physical	Dec 22 12:29
linuxgirl	RMS has done so much good .... Gates definitely not	Dec 22 12:29
schestowitz	like cops assault protesters	Dec 22 12:29
linuxgirl	looking ahead, I'd choose an RMS-world, never a Gates one	Dec 22 12:29
schestowitz	then they spiced it up with something he said a decade ago about an article about some pedo political party... a Dutch one, IIRC	Dec 22 12:29
linuxgirl	as you'd now privacy/freedom/choice not only continue but become much more what real life is about	Dec 22 12:29
schestowitz	http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7487060.stm	Dec 22 12:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-news.bbc.co.uk \| BBC NEWS \| Technology \| It's not the Gates, it's the bars		Dec 22 12:30
schestowitz	by RMS	Dec 22 12:30
linuxgirl	the cancel culture went for him, just a week after he spoke at MS ... not suspicious (sarc)	Dec 22 12:30
schestowitz	Before Gates started bribing BBC repeatedly,	Dec 22 12:30
schestowitz	As he does the Guardian	Dec 22 12:30
schestowitz	RMS told me after that they had become less receptive to him columns, or something to that effect	Dec 22 12:31
linuxgirl	I don't bother with any of these horrible newspapers ... the British press have no credibility any more	Dec 22 12:31
linuxgirl	Yes, I imagine they would start unpleasantness like shoving RMS out of articles	Dec 22 12:31
schestowitz	linuxgirl: a day after a report request filed with the police	Dec 22 12:31
schestowitz	for pedo arrest at his home (Gates')	Dec 22 12:31
linuxgirl	yes	Dec 22 12:31
schestowitz	Sept. 13tth	Dec 22 12:31
schestowitz	September 13, 2019 - Written request made to King County Sheriff’s Office: “Request is made for the following public records regarding criminal case # 14-1-06789-1: 1. Full police report. 2. Search warrant application and affidavit. 3. CAD report. 4. All transcripts/audio recordings/statements from defendant and witnesses related to this case. 5. Property/Evidence Report.”	Dec 22 12:32
linuxgirl	shocking that there was so much RMS hate instead, wrongfully	Dec 22 12:32
schestowitz	September 13, 2019 - Received email from Sakilyne Kally \| Functional Analyst II \| Public Disclosure Unit - Subject: Public Disclosure Request Reference #P039465-091319. Message: “Using the information provided, the KCSO Disclosure Unit has determined that the incident you are referring to occurred outside the jurisdiction of the KCSO. We suggest you contact Seattle Police for records that may be responsive to your request. You may reach	Dec 22 12:32
schestowitz	them at (206) 684-5481. Your request is now closed.”	Dec 22 12:32
linuxgirl	hmmm	Dec 22 12:32
schestowitz	September 13, 2019 - Submitted same written request to City of Seattle Public Records Request Center. Included additional optional fields for reference: “Incident Number: 14-1-06789-1. Incident Date: March 20, 2014.”	Dec 22 12:32
schestowitz	September 13, 2019 - Request received by SPPD, reference number is P047691-091319. City of Seattle Public Records Request Center user account created and confirmed by email.	Dec 22 12:32
schestowitz	Sept. 14th THIS started: http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/128122	Dec 22 12:33
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.tuxmachines.org \| Stallman Under Fire for Views on Epstein \| Tux Machines		Dec 22 12:33
schestowitz	mind dates	Dec 22 12:33
linuxgirl	Like Andrew, I seriously wonder how involved we'll find Gates to be in the end.	Dec 22 12:33
linuxgirl	Yes, the very next day!	Dec 22 12:33
linuxgirl	To shift the heat	Dec 22 12:33
schestowitz	wait for later parts	Dec 22 12:34
schestowitz	it'll fascinate you	Dec 22 12:34
linuxgirl	With no regard for all of RMS's very important work	Dec 22 12:34
schestowitz	I will start next week with part III	Dec 22 12:34
linuxgirl	I look forward to reading that	Dec 22 12:34
linuxgirl	great :-)	Dec 22 12:34
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/2019/12/17/gates-secrets-gatekeeper/	Dec 22 12:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| Mansion of Pedophilia – Part I: Bill Gates Has Plenty to Hide. Money and Connections Have Helped. \| Techrights		Dec 22 12:34
oiaohm	The horrible part is laws effecting people in management positions like CEOs really don't care how much good you do for a business.	Dec 22 12:34
linuxgirl	RMS knows this, yes, that it was to shift the Gates heat away from the spotlight?	Dec 22 12:34
schestowitz	I wil drop clues in IRC	Dec 22 12:35
linuxgirl	Yes, the business psychopaths, who only care re money/control	Dec 22 12:35
schestowitz	October 22, 2019 - Received status update email from Sauncy Hurst: “The Seattle Police Department needs additional time to respond to your request due to the following: Records are currently being reviewed for redactions At this time, we anticipate having a response/installment to you on or about 11/13/2019.”	Dec 22 12:35
oiaohm	Gates moved himself out of management positions.	Dec 22 12:35
schestowitz	and latest	Dec 22 12:35
schestowitz	"At this time, we anticipate having a response/installment to you on or about 1/8/2020."	Dec 22 12:35
schestowitz	Hence my posting of this series slowly	Dec 22 12:35
oiaohm	as the it was coming clear that the laws would be enforced on these things.	Dec 22 12:35
linuxgirl	hmmm	Dec 22 12:35
schestowitz	We can hopefully publish a motherlode	Dec 22 12:35
schestowitz	with readactions	Dec 22 12:35
schestowitz	over 2000 pages!	Dec 22 12:35
schestowitz	But nothing happened	Dec 22 12:35
linuxgirl	yes, that would be good, and wake a lot of ppl up	Dec 22 12:35
schestowitz	just... 2000+ page police report ;-)	Dec 22 12:36
oiaohm	RMS should have changed his possition inside FSF a few year back.	Dec 22 12:36
linuxgirl	that's a heck of a lot of pages	Dec 22 12:36
schestowitz	yup	Dec 22 12:36
schestowitz	for cops	Dec 22 12:36
schestowitz	they're not novelists	Dec 22 12:36
schestowitz	they keep postposing and stonewalling	Dec 22 12:36
schestowitz	but we're persistent	Dec 22 12:36
linuxgirl	fsf should have kept their morals and values intact, including about who was allowed to join ... it was a new batch of members who were stirring it too, including YT channels (I dumped them instantly)	Dec 22 12:36
schestowitz	and at this stage walking away would itself become a scandal	Dec 22 12:37
schestowitz	so I hope they press on	Dec 22 12:37
linuxgirl	Yes, always keep them on their toes!	Dec 22 12:37
linuxgirl	Yes	Dec 22 12:37
schestowitz	it's good I dumped this in IRC	Dec 22 12:37
linuxgirl	good	Dec 22 12:37
schestowitz	in case something happens to me, even just some health reasons	Dec 22 12:37
schestowitz	if there's just one of us, it's easy to undermine progress	Dec 22 12:37
linuxgirl	don't worry about that ... that won't happen	Dec 22 12:37
schestowitz	SPPD, reference number is P047691-091319	Dec 22 12:38
schestowitz	City of Seattle Public Records Request Center	Dec 22 12:38
schestowitz	Don't let Gates and his dad off the hook	Dec 22 12:38
linuxgirl	it would be so ridiculously obvious, so I'd try not to worry	Dec 22 12:38
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oiaohm	https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Me_Too_movement It was basically 2017 when the writing on the wall appeared that presure would be put on that labour laws/work place health and saftey laws over sexual crimes stuff would start getting enforced.	Dec 22 12:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org \| Me Too movement - Wikipedia		Dec 22 12:38
schestowitz	make a copy, on paper if needed	Dec 22 12:38
schestowitz	https://patriotssoapbox.com/opinion/framed-spied-on-smeared-exposing-weinsteins-horrifying-secret-plan-to-bully-victims-into-silence/	Dec 22 12:38
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-patriotssoapbox.com \| Framed, Spied On, & Smeared: Exposing Weinstein's Horrifying Secret Plan to Bully Victims into Silence - Patriots' Soapbox 24/7 News Network		Dec 22 12:38
oiaohm	Lot of parties ignored the writing the Me too movement put on the wall and have been prosecuted since.	Dec 22 12:39
linuxgirl	give copies to everyone you know, and make sure they know that ... but I'd not worry; they'd want you to worry, and feel threatened, so don't let them bother you	Dec 22 12:39
schestowitz	http://www.latimes.com/business/hollywood/la-fi-ct-weinstein-company-bankruptcy-20180319-story.html	Dec 22 12:39
schestowitz	Like Cambridge Analystica	Dec 22 12:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.latimes.com \| Weinstein Co. has filed for bankruptcy and will pursue a sale - Los Angeles Times		Dec 22 12:39
schestowitz	you shut down	Dec 22 12:39
schestowitz	and then it's hard to subpoena	Dec 22 12:39
schestowitz	See also: Emerdata (their stuff shifted to that)	Dec 22 12:40
linuxgirl	weinstein is putting on the act of his life, with that 'ill health' thing	Dec 22 12:40
linuxgirl	abusers always play the sympathy card	Dec 22 12:40
schestowitz	linuxgirl: don't contact the police about it unless we go silent	Dec 22 12:40
schestowitz	as we don't want too many people to give them 'cold feet'	Dec 22 12:40
linuxgirl	women asserting about him; good, as long as they don't go sjw	Dec 22 12:40
schestowitz	one person is enough	Dec 22 12:40
linuxgirl	that's quite a serious message; noted :-)	Dec 22 12:40
schestowitz	this channel is logged and may be spied on by manual operators, either in real time or the site (can't keep track of all nicks in this channel, but we publish regardless, so no 'competitive advantage' to active watching in RT)	Dec 22 12:41
linuxgirl	okay	Dec 22 12:41
schestowitz	you know what I said about my boss	Dec 22 12:41
oiaohm	Yep all Cambridge Analystica collected data is now at Emerdata because they were allowed to go defunct without a order to destory what they had collected.	Dec 22 12:41
linuxgirl	didn't realise IRC could be seen, eek	Dec 22 12:41
schestowitz	that too should be kept in mind, though it might be just an awkward coincidence... the NDA adds to the suspicion	Dec 22 12:42
linuxgirl	yes, it does	Dec 22 12:42
schestowitz	I mean	Dec 22 12:42
schestowitz	say you're a charity	Dec 22 12:42
schestowitz	and someone help you	Dec 22 12:42
schestowitz	why NDA?	Dec 22 12:42
schestowitz	i mean, WTF?	Dec 22 12:42
schestowitz	Are you a spy agency?	Dec 22 12:42
linuxgirl	yes, does seem extreme	Dec 22 12:42
schestowitz	and we're not supposed to even NAME them?	Dec 22 12:43
linuxgirl	that's definitely dodgy	Dec 22 12:43
linuxgirl	if it was some above board thing, why'd they worry about being named?	Dec 22 12:43
schestowitz	As if, in case it comes to court (mind you, Gates Sr. is of highest legal clout in the US), they can say, "CAN'T TALK! NDA! Case dismissed!"	Dec 22 12:43
linuxgirl	hmmmm, not good	Dec 22 12:44
linuxgirl	I'd better pop off for now. If I'm not on before xmas, have a good one! :-)	Dec 22 12:45
schestowitz	cheers	Dec 22 12:46
schestowitz	keep the number handy	Dec 22 12:46
schestowitz	don't let go	Dec 22 12:46
schestowitz	we owe it to the piblic	Dec 22 12:46
linuxgirl	okay :-) no worries	Dec 22 12:46
schestowitz	it's worse than you think for reasons I will cover later	Dec 22 12:46
schestowitz	they gagged the media	Dec 22 12:46
schestowitz	but gagging police is risky	Dec 22 12:47
schestowitz	as that in itself can become a massive scandal	Dec 22 12:47
linuxgirl	always make sure to support what's genuinely ppl-respecting, so will always do what I can	Dec 22 12:47
schestowitz	we may oust another major culprit, but it won't be without toil	Dec 22 12:47
linuxgirl	yes, cops need to start speaking up more	Dec 22 12:47
schestowitz	they do	Dec 22 12:47
schestowitz	but not as cops ;-)	Dec 22 12:47
linuxgirl	yes, tends to be 'x-police officer'	Dec 22 12:48
schestowitz	my cohost in techbytes was a cop	Dec 22 12:48
linuxgirl	yes?	Dec 22 12:48
schestowitz	aye	Dec 22 12:48
linuxgirl	retired or left?	Dec 22 12:48
schestowitz	left	Dec 22 12:48
linuxgirl	hear that quite often	Dec 22 12:48
linuxgirl	good for them	Dec 22 12:48
linuxgirl	will have to bail for now, but will check in. all the best :-)	Dec 22 12:49
schestowitz	I gave a job recommendation	Dec 22 12:49
<--linuxgirl has quit (Remote host closed the connection)		Dec 22 12:49
schestowitz	he got the job	Dec 22 12:49
oiaohm	schestowitz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-incrimination really USA law don't need a NDA can just refuse to answer.	Dec 22 12:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org \| Self-incrimination - Wikipedia		Dec 22 12:49
schestowitz	we're uk-based	Dec 22 12:50
schestowitz	and ianal	Dec 22 12:50
schestowitz	bill's dad is	Dec 22 12:50
oiaohm	Australian law legally can force you to answer as long not you who will be prosecuted.	Dec 22 12:50
oiaohm	Uk law is about the same.	Dec 22 12:51
oiaohm	as USA law.	Dec 22 12:51
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Today in Techrights http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132021 [https://pleroma.site/objects/4f3775d3-4e90-4d96-8f72-90964315aa54]		Dec 22 13:05
schestowitz	based on similar constitutional 'templates', oiaohm	Dec 22 13:07
schestowitz	or shared 'heritage'	Dec 22 13:07
schestowitz	not just commitment, brotherhood, cross-pollination...	Dec 22 13:08
schestowitz	in 10 YEARS (almost, soon) in the company I NEVER heard of an NDA	Dec 22 13:10
schestowitz	until this...	Dec 22 13:10
schestowitz	the timing does raise some potential question/intrigue	Dec 22 13:10
oiaohm	schestowitz: https://www.ozy.com/true-and-stories/the-agreement-that-catapulted-microsoft-over-ibm/94437/ the first NDA I ever read about what the one between IBM and Microsoft over the dos operating system.	Dec 22 13:20
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-The Agreement That Catapulted Microsoft Over IBM \| OZY		Dec 22 13:21
oiaohm	NDA between companies are used a hell of a lot.	Dec 22 13:23
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Games: Time Gate: Knight's Chase, Life is Strange 2, SuperTuxKart 1.1 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132022 [https://pleroma.site/objects/b48c2500-0e60-403f-9b1a-1d08f60aefc7]		Dec 22 13:23
schestowitz	oiaohm: I know	Dec 22 13:29
schestowitz	but this one I was notified about	Dec 22 13:29
schestowitz	only me	Dec 22 13:29
schestowitz	it was targeted at me only	Dec 22 13:29
schestowitz	not my colleagues	Dec 22 13:29
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Easy Buster 2.1.11 which is 2.2RC http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132023 [https://pleroma.site/objects/4b084f35-b9c8-4769-aef5-2da956cd5a0f]		Dec 22 13:31
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MinceR	https://hugelolcdn.com/i/642404.jpg	Dec 22 14:14
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MinceR	(audio:unimportant) https://vid.pr0gramm.com/2019/11/02/bf025dfb094d90a3.mp4	Dec 22 14:25
---norayr is now known as inky		Dec 22 14:34
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Linux App Summit(LAS’ 19) \| Barcelona http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132024 [https://pleroma.site/objects/0e542d05-b6cf-4a0e-a525-704b7d99a3b4]		Dec 22 14:59
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132025 [https://pleroma.site/objects/8d9096fd-7167-454b-a9f1-64549ddc1495]		Dec 22 14:59
MinceR	https://ircz.de/p/19090737	Dec 22 15:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de \| IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object		Dec 22 15:01
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Debian's Leftovers: Mike Gabriel's Report and Molly de Blanc on Consent and Dignity http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132026 [https://pleroma.site/objects/5a28c847-8721-4fdb-839c-f6fdb4de4343]		Dec 22 15:02
schestowitz	nice one	Dec 22 15:04
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Programming: Compilers, scikit-survival, Python and Web Accessibility http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132027 [https://pleroma.site/objects/e991b512-e34c-4751-a223-db77bc7656a9]		Dec 22 15:32
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132028 [https://pleroma.site/objects/caf14e1b-c62d-49d4-9840-df231cbd55c1]		Dec 22 15:35
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Links 22/12/2019: Linux Random Number Generation, KTimeTracker 5.0.1 http://techrights.org/2019/12/22/ktimetracker-5-0-1/ [https://pleroma.site/objects/5ffc6ccd-170a-42f8-aa89-d578d8f7fa5a]		Dec 22 15:49
MinceR	https://ircz.de/p/19090646	Dec 22 16:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de \| IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object		Dec 22 16:29
MinceR	https://imgur.com/gallery/p1aYgYi	Dec 22 16:39
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Dump of my princess Routa - Album on Imgur		Dec 22 16:39
MinceR	https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/1208469511051075585	Dec 22 16:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Snowden: The subtitles are very slightly more readable in this version of the video (via reddit). https://t.co/3YbR57DIiG		Dec 22 16:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-@Snowden: The subtitles are very slightly more readable in this version of the video (via reddit). https://t.co/3YbR57DIiG		Dec 22 16:45
schestowitz	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAKtpCo8fPE	Dec 22 16:51
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-1984 (8/11) Movie CLIP - Winston is Tested (1984) HD - YouTube		Dec 22 16:51
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: LinuxConsole 2019 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132029 [https://pleroma.site/objects/ec49e4e7-5920-4d72-8cd1-9fb6d5fc1289]		Dec 22 17:06
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: USB4 Support Being Introduced With Linux 5.6 Kernel http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132030 [https://pleroma.site/objects/7cf60ce4-6164-4b63-9ad2-0bcf9ed64140]		Dec 22 17:08
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: today's howtos http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132031 [https://pleroma.site/objects/9ddfa394-e79f-448b-b276-c3ac901587f0]		Dec 22 17:15
schestowitz	> i know shes pro-stallman, i assume you know whats going on with leah rowes financial situation.	Dec 22 17:45
schestowitz	>	Dec 22 17:45
schestowitz	> if not, update is here: https://minifree.org/	Dec 22 17:45
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights- ( status 500 @ https://minifree.org/ )		Dec 22 17:45
schestowitz	>	Dec 22 17:45
schestowitz	> seems newsworthy especially when shes looking for gestures of good will. cheers.	Dec 22 17:45
schestowitz	She's pro-RMS only in the context of the defamation campaign but had called for a boycott of GNU (later retracted and apologised).	Dec 22 17:45
schestowitz	I'm open to changes in opinions. But would be cautious given that flip-flopping. Unpredictable personality.	Dec 22 17:45
DaemonFC[m]	> as USA law.	Dec 22 18:24
DaemonFC[m]	Get it in writing that you won't be prosecuted for anything you discuss.	Dec 22 18:24
DaemonFC[m]	You could also pull the I don't recall trick.	Dec 22 18:26
DaemonFC[m]	Hillary Clinton them.	Dec 22 18:26
MinceR	cheat on the primaries to help the opposing party's candidate win?	Dec 22 18:30
schestowitz	we ought to contact the recycler... contact lundgren	Dec 22 18:45
schestowitz	I lost him email address	Dec 22 18:46
schestowitz	and his friend is no longer around	Dec 22 18:46
MinceR	https://ircz.de/p/19090534	Dec 22 19:18
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de \| IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object		Dec 22 19:18
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Best Distribution of 2019 Goes to Ubuntu MATE 19.10 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132032 [https://pleroma.site/objects/ba6c2c09-f16f-4040-9ddc-ac8a01d2b52e]		Dec 22 19:26
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Stable kernels 5.4.6, 4.19.91, 4.14.160, 4.9.207 and 4.4.207 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132033 [https://pleroma.site/objects/a01ff932-8ad5-433d-9aa7-fbf67016c1fc]		Dec 22 19:26
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: #Android Leftovers http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132034 [https://pleroma.site/objects/762f84ff-1f28-43cf-a5ec-adf23fc41929]		Dec 22 19:30
DaemonFC[m]	I might just revert to Linux 5.3.10 until RC6 is working again.	Dec 22 19:33
DaemonFC[m]	Fucking Intel....	Dec 22 19:33
-viera/#techrights-Tux Machines: Best Xfce distro of 2019 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/132035 [https://pleroma.site/objects/ac2975bc-4b0c-448b-96da-045e1ce0222b]		Dec 22 19:44
DaemonFC[m]	Linux is going downhill.	Dec 22 19:46
DaemonFC[m]	Without RC6, you will never get good battery life because the CPU package can't power down even into PC2 (and there are 8 package sstates on this thing).	Dec 22 19:46
schestowitz	linux the kerne;?	Dec 22 19:47
schestowitz	and if so, which branch?	Dec 22 19:47
schestowitz	it has gotten more solid over time	Dec 22 19:47
schestowitz	systemd and other stuff is another matter	Dec 22 19:47
schestowitz	and can be avoided with certain distros	Dec 22 19:47
schestowitz	same for gnome3	Dec 22 19:47
schestowitz	> Yes, please. Git seems to be the way to go. There is at least one	Dec 22 19:48
schestowitz	> additional program which can read Git archives.	Dec 22 19:48
schestowitz	On HV?	Dec 22 19:48
schestowitz	oops	Dec 22 19:48
schestowitz	wrong windows	Dec 22 19:48
schestowitz	kaniini: do you have experience setting up gitlab on apline?	Dec 22 19:49
schestowitz	I search for info, that just leads me to containers https://docs.gitlab.com/omnibus/docker/	Dec 22 19:50
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-docs.gitlab.com \| GitLab Docker images \| GitLab		Dec 22 19:50
schestowitz	we have some site-related code we wish to host locally	Dec 22 19:50
schestowitz	"Caution: We do not officially support running on Docker for Windows. There are known issues with volume permissions, and potentially other unknown issues. If you are trying to run on Docker for Windows, please see our getting help page for links to community resources (IRC, forum, etc) to seek help from other users."	Dec 22 19:50
schestowitz	Oh, DARN	Dec 22 19:50
<--_inky has quit (Remote host closed the connection)		Dec 22 19:51
schestowitz	kaniini: https://git.pleroma.social/kaniini looks great and very tidy	Dec 22 19:52
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-git.pleroma.social \| kaniini · GitLab		Dec 22 19:52
MinceR	https://i.imgur.com/iCJfUWP.mp4 ( https://imgur.com/gallery/ed7e8Rm )	Dec 22 20:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-gently...gently - Album on Imgur		Dec 22 20:01
DaemonFC[m]	Linux is getting very shitty indeed.	Dec 22 20:14
DaemonFC[m]	Here's what I said on Facebook.	Dec 22 20:14
*DaemonFC[m] sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/mQbFsCrSnqKNLttyFxboLWsH >		Dec 22 20:14
DaemonFC[m]	To put this into perspective, what's going on with Intel lately would be like a car company putting out a car that gets 50 miles a gallon and a top speed of 200 miles an hour, and then when you buy it, they issue a software update that makes it get 10 miles a gallon and top out at 50, and then say no take backsies.	Dec 22 20:16
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XRevan86	schestowitz: I suspect they use https://github.com/alpinelinux/alpine-docker-gitlab	Dec 22 20:28
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-GitHub - alpinelinux/alpine-docker-gitlab: Gitlab docker image based on Alpine Linux		Dec 22 20:28
XRevan86	As Alpine has https://gitlab.alpinelinux.org/ , but there's no package in the repository.	Dec 22 20:29
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-gitlab.alpinelinux.org \| alpine · GitLab		Dec 22 20:29
schestowitz	I am tweaking iRC logs CSS	Dec 22 20:29
schestowitz	feedback welcome	Dec 22 20:30
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/irc-archives/irc-log-techrights-211219.html#tDec%2021%2022:53:57	Dec 22 20:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: Saturday, December 21, 2019		Dec 22 20:30
schestowitz	force flush the CSS cache if needed	Dec 22 20:30
schestowitz	I am still able to edit	Dec 22 20:30
schestowitz	This impacts like thousands of files... IRC logs.. in one fell swoop	Dec 22 20:30
XRevan86	What is in the repository are gogs (as seen on https://notabug.org/ ) and gitea (as seen on https://codeberg.org/ ).	Dec 22 20:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-NotABug.org: Free code hosting		Dec 22 20:36
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Codeberg.org		Dec 22 20:36
XRevan86	schestowitz: Too many gradients	Dec 22 20:44
schestowitz	does it make things illegible?	Dec 22 20:44
schestowitz	are the fonts OK?	Dec 22 20:45
schestowitz	larger, different family, etc?	Dec 22 20:45
XRevan86	schestowitz: Gradients here just make the log unpleasant to look at.	Dec 22 20:46
XRevan86	The fonts seem fine.	Dec 22 20:46
XRevan86	Timestamps are hardish to read.	Dec 22 20:47
DaemonFC[m]	https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=GCC-LLVM-Clang-Icelake-Tests	Dec 22 20:49
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-LLVM Clang Achieves ~96% The Performance Of GCC On Intel Ice Lake - Phoronix		Dec 22 20:49
DaemonFC[m]	It's kind of interesting that where GCC wins, it tends to win big and on things people are likely to notice.	Dec 22 20:49
schestowitz	XRevan86: thanks, will tweak	Dec 22 20:50
DaemonFC[m]	Also interesting, the libvpx performance is in GCC's favor where Intel's SVT encoders favor Clang.	Dec 22 20:50
XRevan86	> There are some cases where GCC 9's performance is winning by big margins compared to Clang, but the more liberal compiler also had its share of sizable wins too.	Dec 22 20:51
XRevan86	The what compiler?	Dec 22 20:51
DaemonFC[m]	It's a compiler that wants high taxes and free abortion.	Dec 22 20:51
XRevan86	Doesn't sound like Apple	Dec 22 20:51
DaemonFC[m]	Not high taxes on themselves!	Dec 22 20:52
DaemonFC[m]	In true liberal fashion.	Dec 22 20:52
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: And free abortion only for themselves / their wives?	Dec 22 20:53
DaemonFC[m]	They locate in California, get themselves exempt from business taxation, and then force their engineers to live in $3,500 /month garages and use a compose bucket for a toilet. (Apple)	Dec 22 20:53
DaemonFC[m]	> DaemonFC: And free abortion only for themselves / their wives?	Dec 22 20:53
DaemonFC[m]	No, no, no. For the blacks, stupid!	Dec 22 20:53
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: Sounds like a nice deal.	Dec 22 20:53
XRevan86	If one is not ready to have a child	Dec 22 20:54
DaemonFC[m]	California is an easy state to do business in because taxes are for the little people.	Dec 22 20:54
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: Sounds almost libertarian	Dec 22 20:55
DaemonFC[m]	The Libertarian platform tends to include the FairTax, which would charge the same rate on all income no exemptions, so it would result in a substantial tax increase on the rich.	Dec 22 20:56
DaemonFC[m]	It would also not give people tax breaks for fucking and filling up the world, so it's environmentally friendly too.	Dec 22 20:57
*XRevan86 went to read on		Dec 22 20:57
XRevan86	> As defined in the proposed legislation, the tax rate is 23% for the first year.	Dec 22 20:58
XRevan86	23%!? That doesn't sound like something a real libertarian would dig	Dec 22 20:58
XRevan86	Unless now it's higher	Dec 22 20:58
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XRevan86	https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distribution_of_the_FairTax_burden#Progressive_/_regressive_debate huh	Dec 22 21:02
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-en.wikipedia.org \| Distribution of the FairTax burden - Wikipedia		Dec 22 21:02
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: This is way above my head.	Dec 22 21:03
DaemonFC[m]	Errr, I'm tired.	Dec 22 21:04
DaemonFC[m]	The flat tax is what I meant to say.	Dec 22 21:04
DaemonFC[m]	A flat tax of 10.5% is one figure I heard	Dec 22 21:04
XRevan86	> The FairTax proposal is regressive on income (using a cross-section time frame) and progressive on sales. Classical economic analysis indicates that the marginal propensity to consume (MPC) decreases as income increases. Households at the lower end of the income scale spend almost all their income, while households at the higher end are more likely to devote a portion of income to saving.	Dec 22 21:04
DaemonFC[m]	That's not really that much different than what a single person no kids working at Walmart pays now.	Dec 22 21:05
DaemonFC[m]	But some rich people deduct their way down to jsut a few percent under our current system by gaming it.	Dec 22 21:05
DaemonFC[m]	I think a flat tax would be much more fair. It's not fair that a guy with no kids working at McDonalds has to pay more taxes because someone who couldn't afford kids gets $1 million per child in tax cuts and welfare over 18 years.	Dec 22 21:06
DaemonFC[m]	Welfare is anything from free school lunches, to housing vouchers, to "free" high speed internet at home, food stamps, medicaid, public school, etc.	Dec 22 21:06
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: Well, that's easier. Flat taxation is bureaucratically simpler, but favours the rich as the richer one gets the less important a certain constant percentage gets.	Dec 22 21:07
DaemonFC[m]	"Free public school" is a pot that anyone with kids can dip into so it's very popular welfare.	Dec 22 21:07
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: Flat taxation != tax cuts for certain groups	Dec 22 21:07
DaemonFC[m]	At 10.5%, a person who makes a million dollars pays $105,000 in taxes.	Dec 22 21:07
DaemonFC[m]	While a person who makes $25,000 pays $2625.	Dec 22 21:08
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: Free public schools is an extremely important part of social justice, to ensure that everyone has a chance at education.	Dec 22 21:08
DaemonFC[m]	If you want to add a bit of progressivity so that people don't scream, you could say "Everyone gets a $1,000 rebate each year that goes up with inflation.".	Dec 22 21:09
XRevan86	unless there's some other instrument that ensures that even the most marginalised groups have a way to get education	Dec 22 21:09
DaemonFC[m]	Now the million dollar guy pays $104,000, and the $25,000 guy pays $1,625.	Dec 22 21:09
XRevan86	(marginalised in a way of money)	Dec 22 21:09
DaemonFC[m]	The problem with public schools is they have to take everyone, so they end up dealing with violent fuck ups who are just taking up space and going to prison when they grow up.	Dec 22 21:10
DaemonFC[m]	It's not conducive to learning.	Dec 22 21:10
DaemonFC[m]	I think people who have had kids without planning on it should have to take birth control pills each month down at the welfare office.	Dec 22 21:11
DaemonFC[m]	Once is a mistake, twice is a habit.	Dec 22 21:11
schestowitz	XRevan86: better now?	Dec 22 21:12
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: Um, education isn't just math drilling.	Dec 22 21:12
schestowitz	http://techrights.org/irc-archives/irc-log-techrights-211219.html#tDec%2021%2022:53:57	Dec 22 21:12
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-techrights.org \| IRC: #techrights @ FreeNode: Saturday, December 21, 2019		Dec 22 21:12
XRevan86	schestowitz: I can't tell the difference.	Dec 22 21:12
schestowitz	force css to flush	Dec 22 21:13
schestowitz	if it works as it should "DEC" should be small caps	Dec 22 21:13
DaemonFC[m]	Look, it's not cold to say "Hey, get a job and don't expect me to pay for your kids.". What we need to do is grow the economy and pass moral wage laws.	Dec 22 21:14
DaemonFC[m]	So that way there are actually opportunities for people.	Dec 22 21:14
XRevan86	schestowitz: It is.	Dec 22 21:14
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: Without public schools the only opportunity some people are going to get is dish washing.	Dec 22 21:14
DaemonFC[m]	Health care is one thing where I think we need to look into nationalizing it.	Dec 22 21:14
DaemonFC[m]	That doesn't mean free ride for everyone. Single payer just means single payer.	Dec 22 21:15
DaemonFC[m]	The insurance companies add no value and skim money for themselves, and they need to go away.	Dec 22 21:15
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: Something definitely has to be done.	Dec 22 21:15
DaemonFC[m]	They keep saying hey look, give us some more time and we'll "contain costs".	Dec 22 21:16
*psydroid has no plans to move from Intel to AMD, but rather to ARM, RISC-V and POWER		Dec 22 21:17
DaemonFC[m]	Well, GCC is currently very broken on POWER and POWER is expensive.	Dec 22 21:18
DaemonFC[m]	RISC-V...Where do you even get it?	Dec 22 21:18
DaemonFC[m]	Most affordable ARM systems need custom kernels and binary blobs.	Dec 22 21:18
DaemonFC[m]	GCC can't build MAME and Firefox's JIT javascript is currrently not working on POWER when you build it with GCC.	Dec 22 21:18
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: To an outside observer it looks like the US has more expensive healthcare with insurance than almost anywhere else without insurance, rendering the whole US insurance system a big scam.	Dec 22 21:19
psydroid	I'm running mainline everything on my ARM SBC	Dec 22 21:19
DaemonFC[m]	I'm not even sure what other options are there for compiler on POWER.	Dec 22 21:19
psydroid	no blobs there	Dec 22 21:19
DaemonFC[m]	The Pinebook has blobs.	Dec 22 21:19
DaemonFC[m]	That's why it's running a "variant" of Debian 9.	Dec 22 21:19
DaemonFC[m]	By blob, I mean proprietary graphics drivers and stuff like that.	Dec 22 21:20
DaemonFC[m]	Not firmware, which most systems need.	Dec 22 21:20
psydroid	I'm running latest everything on my Orange Pi with Allwinner A64	Dec 22 21:20
psydroid	even the graphics driver is just lima	Dec 22 21:20
psydroid	so what you are saying was true before, but now all support is upstream	Dec 22 21:21
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: Can MAME be built anywhere except x86_64?	Dec 22 21:23
XRevan86	https://packages.debian.org/sid/mame so many options, including ppc64el %)	Dec 22 21:24
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-packages.debian.org \| Debian -- Details of package mame in sid		Dec 22 21:24
XRevan86	Do I understand it right that "el" here is trolling?	Dec 22 21:26
XRevan86	endian-little	Dec 22 21:26
psydroid	yes	Dec 22 21:27
psydroid	be - el	Dec 22 21:27
DaemonFC[m]	psydroid: So, I need a cheap reliable laptop for my husband that doesn't suck.	Dec 22 21:28
XRevan86	psydroid: At least it's not "en"	Dec 22 21:28
DaemonFC[m]	I don't care if it's x86 or not. Just needs to browse the web and run LibreOffice and stuff.	Dec 22 21:28
XRevan86	short for elttil-naidne	Dec 22 21:28
XRevan86	* "ne", short for naidne-elttil	Dec 22 21:28
psydroid	DaemonFC , that's fine and I agree that AMD is the obvious choice now for mainstream hardware and use cases	Dec 22 21:29
MinceR	elttil reminds me of this >> https://www.lfg.co/page/19/	Dec 22 21:30
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.lfg.co \| Page 19		Dec 22 21:30
XRevan86	MinceR: Not a phonetical reversal	Dec 22 21:31
MinceR	:)	Dec 22 21:31
XRevan86	chtib lttil	Dec 22 21:32
schestowitz	XRevan86: try now	Dec 22 21:33
DaemonFC[m]	AMD at least provides an x86 platform that's cheaper and more reliable than Intel.	Dec 22 21:35
DaemonFC[m]	So that's not nothing.	Dec 22 21:35
DaemonFC[m]	Intel is nastier than ever lately. They are obviously putting bugs in their products so they can "fix" them later to disastrous results, and the implication is that your laptop is old and you need to buy another one. Because there's no other way to sell new hardware every few years. It's very crooked.	Dec 22 21:36
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psydroid	I don't want to participate in advancing a duopoly, that's why I've been venturing out to other architectures over the years. It started when I first got my hands on a Chinese Loongson desktop and later on I got other hardware as well. I still have my Intel laptops and I'll see what I'll get in the future, probably not Intel and only if necessary AMD.	Dec 22 21:42
XRevan86	schestowitz: What changed?	Dec 22 21:44
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DaemonFC[m]	I may use my Fedora COPR and just build new kernels where the default is to turn off all of the Intel workarounds, and enable RC6 again.	Dec 22 21:51
MinceR	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ic3Yd0rDaoI	Dec 22 22:01
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-Have Yourself A Scary Little Solstice - YouTube		Dec 22 22:01
<--Condor has quit (Quit: fml, server went tits up)		Dec 22 22:06
oiaohm	DaemonFC[m]: https://pocketnow.com/pinebook-pro-review-a-200-laptop-thats-only-for-cool-people this does tick the reliable and cheap for light usage. But somethings do sux. There is for sure at least 1 design mistake like the inbuilt speaks suck and suck worse because the venting is pointing down instead of up.	Dec 22 22:23
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-pocketnow.com \| Pinebook Pro Review: A $200 laptop that's only for cool people.		Dec 22 22:23
MinceR	https://ircz.de/p/19090462	Dec 22 22:34
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-ircz.de \| IRCZ makes your life worth living Post object		Dec 22 22:34
DaemonFC[m]	> DaemonFC: https://pocketnow.com/pinebook-pro-review-a-200-laptop-thats-only-for-cool-people this does tick the reliable and cheap for light usage. But somethings do sux. There is for sure at least 1 design mistake like the inbuilt speaks suck and suck worse because the venting is pointing down instead of up.	Dec 22 22:35
DaemonFC[m]	Most name brand laptop do the speakers are underpowered and pointing down problem.	Dec 22 22:35
DaemonFC[m]	My Yoga 900 ISK2 does that.	Dec 22 22:36
DaemonFC[m]	And it was $1300.	Dec 22 22:36
XRevan86	kaniini: Hi, I've been remembering some stuff, and do I recall it right that Mastodon used to send private notices through OStatus and to everyone subscribed?	Dec 22 22:36
oiaohm	DaemonFC[m]: other problem is lack of a good heat spreader under the cpu. so straight on desk or lap not exactly fun.	Dec 22 22:40
oiaohm	Ie the case is the direct cpu heatsink/spreader.	Dec 22 22:40
oiaohm	So you can really find out where the cpu is without opening it.	Dec 22 22:41
kaniini	XRevan86: yes, via salmons	Dec 22 22:41
DaemonFC[m]	Well, Lenovo tried throttling the CPU while it was on your lap. Works in Windows.	Dec 22 22:42
oiaohm	Heat pipes fans other other spreading tech costs money,	Dec 22 22:42
DaemonFC[m]	When you put Linux on those systems, it just sticks it in low speed mode all the time.	Dec 22 22:42
MinceR	crApple just tells you not to use your laptop in your lap	Dec 22 22:42
MinceR	(while ads still show people using it in their lap)	Dec 22 22:42
oiaohm	MinceR: some models they go the step more into stupid by having a fake fan.	Dec 22 22:43
oiaohm	with apple.	Dec 22 22:43
oiaohm	DaemonFC[m]: some of those lenovo ones when you check the cpu temp and compare against recommend intel temps Linux mode that is crippled to hell is running at correct temp and Windows mode the driver has told it to exceeed intel recommend temp for the cpu.	Dec 22 22:45
oiaohm	That one of those cases why does the windows machine before better than Linux. Bugger me.	Dec 22 22:45
MinceR	what could possibly go wrong?	Dec 22 22:46
MinceR	sounds like consumer crap lenovos though	Dec 22 22:46
DaemonFC[m]	With Intel, who knows what this means?	Dec 22 22:46
DaemonFC[m]	Perhaps Intel recommended not to exceed a temp that they set too low on purpose.	Dec 22 22:46
DaemonFC[m]	That way when they don't exceed that temp on Linux, they Totally Aren't Sabotaging Linux.	Dec 22 22:47
DaemonFC[m]	Then again, from Lenovo's perspective, making their Windows laptop faster has two main results.	Dec 22 22:47
DaemonFC[m]	It gets it into your home....where it dies of heat just after the warranty ended and now you need a new laptop.	Dec 22 22:48
DaemonFC[m]	MinceR: So it really is who do you think is a bigger bucket of scum. Lenovo or Intel?	Dec 22 22:48
DaemonFC[m]	Hard to guess.	Dec 22 22:48
MinceR	yeah	Dec 22 22:48
MinceR	i'd say intel	Dec 22 22:48
MinceR	lenovo did that yoga with the ssd lying about what it was	Dec 22 22:49
MinceR	intel did uefi, boot guard, me...	Dec 22 22:49
MinceR	oh, and officially winblows-only cpus	Dec 22 22:49
MinceR	and those ultra-shitty atoms with 32bit uefi	Dec 22 22:49
DaemonFC[m]	They probably exceed the specified temperature on Windows because it's what it takes to overcome the fact that Windows is 20% slower than Linux, all things being equal.	Dec 22 22:49
MinceR	and the winblows user will just throw it out and buy a new one when the cpu turns into smoke?	Dec 22 22:50
oiaohm	With intel they don't set the temp too low they., If you get a silicon from tsmc made at equivalent nm you get the same recommend max temp.	Dec 22 22:50
DaemonFC[m]	Oh, Windows is 20% slower? Well, we just overclock the processor 20% and.....no problem.	Dec 22 22:50
DaemonFC[m]	> and the winblows user will just throw it out and buy a new one when the cpu turns into smoke?	Dec 22 22:51
DaemonFC[m]	That is pretty much what happens. Yeah.	Dec 22 22:51
oiaohm	Basically there are physical things about silicon chips that define what temp you should run at if you want decent life.	Dec 22 22:51
MinceR	yeah, but tsmc isn't the one struggling to downscale their process :>	Dec 22 22:51
DaemonFC[m]	No, AMD beat Intel to 14 nm iirc.	Dec 22 22:51
DaemonFC[m]	Like, by a lot.	Dec 22 22:51
oiaohm	DaemonFC[m]: amd is using tsmc for 7nm.	Dec 22 22:52
DaemonFC[m]	Now Intel keeps saying they wanted 7 nm, and cant make it work 3 years late, and so they'll go to 10.	Dec 22 22:52
oiaohm	Amd could not go down to 7nm with everything 7nm	Dec 22 22:52
oiaohm	That why you have a 14nm io dia in the new chips.	Dec 22 22:52
DaemonFC[m]	It's getting to the point where they are struggling to make better laptops so they just downgrade the one you have with "security patches" or kill it entirely so you have to buy a new one.	Dec 22 22:52
oiaohm	oPPS sorry its 12nm	Dec 22 22:53
MinceR	the new one will be just as slow with the patches, though	Dec 22 22:53
oiaohm	There is a problem here.	Dec 22 22:53
DaemonFC[m]	Those ultra high end 32 core desktops can be slowed down 30% and you won't notice, but a laptop with 2 cores...you'll notice.	Dec 22 22:53
oiaohm	There is still 120nm made for power circuits.	Dec 22 22:53
oiaohm	in silicon.	Dec 22 22:53
oiaohm	smaller nm you got to the less volatage you can push around simply.	Dec 22 22:54
oiaohm	Some how I think 7nm might not be able to handle enough volatage to dependably push across motherboard tracks.	Dec 22 22:54
oiaohm	voltage/amperage	Dec 22 22:55
oiaohm	Intel has been attempting to single chip there 10nm and 7nm chip efforts. They have talked about going multi chip like amd recently.	Dec 22 22:59
DaemonFC[m]	Apparently, there's a part in the movie Mrs. Doubtfire that wakes up my phone as if I said OK Google in my voice.	Dec 22 23:00
MinceR	:)	Dec 22 23:00
oiaohm	Its been documented that that ok Google wakes up on a lot of things that is not Ok Google.	Dec 22 23:01
XRevan86	DaemonFC[m]: You have too much Google in your life	Dec 22 23:03
oiaohm	https://www.reddit.com/r/googlehome/comments/7xeks9/do_you_guys_get_a_lot_of_false_activations/ << you hear of this for a while now.	Dec 22 23:04
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-www.reddit.com \| Do you guys get a lot of false activations? : googlehome		Dec 22 23:04
oiaohm	and you see instructions from google like reset device or replace device	Dec 22 23:04
oiaohm	Does make me wonder if some devices are shipped out in mode to spy every so often even if no ok google is said.	Dec 22 23:05
XRevan86	oiaohm: Isn't listening for "ok, google" enough for that already?	Dec 22 23:16
XRevan86	Responding to "ok, google" technically isn't a special case.	Dec 22 23:18
XRevan86	Listen → parse → if got "ok, google", then activate interactivity → listen → parse	Dec 22 23:19
DaemonFC[m]	AT&T is actually much worse than Sprint.	Dec 22 23:27
DaemonFC[m]	At least Sprint really is $45 a month and admits the iPhone is $46 a month instead of AT&T giving you a "free" one and a $150 bill that came from nowhere apparently.	Dec 22 23:28
MinceR	the first parse probably happens on the device though	Dec 22 23:34
MinceR	while the second happens on google's servers (and the nsa gets a copy)	Dec 22 23:34
MinceR	unless of course they just record a realtime feed all the time to the nsa servers...	Dec 22 23:34
DaemonFC[m]	Listening for ok google is on the device.	Dec 22 23:40
DaemonFC[m]	But Google stores everything that you say to it after that, forever.	Dec 22 23:40
DaemonFC[m]	I can get on there and play back things I said 7 years ago.	Dec 22 23:40
MinceR	which is why i don't use this "feature"	Dec 22 23:52
MinceR	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pcWlyUu8U4	Dec 22 23:53
-TechrightsBot-tr/#techrights-The NSA Is Coming to Town - YouTube		Dec 22 23:53
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