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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: August 14th, 2008

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twitterM$ declares victory in Battle of UK http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer...Aug 14 00:00
twit...Aug 14 00:01
schestowitzYes, I saw that earlier. I also saw that anti-Linux article from the INQ, which came via some writer whom I never saw before.Aug 14 00:02
twitterThat article by Paul Venizia in Infoworld is interesting but I think he was way to easy on Vista.  He interesting sense of what "usable" is, especially when he ends up saying he's not going to use it.Aug 14 00:11
twitterHey, good for Felton!  I did not get a sense of the success they were having with Lindependence day from that one movie I saw.Aug 14 00:16
twitterThanks for all the other good GNU/Linux news today.  It would be nice to see all of that on Slashdot.Aug 14 00:24
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MinceRhayAug 14 00:31
schestowitzHi there.Aug 14 00:34
schestowitztwitter: see that previous article from Paul about Windows. I put it in Digg and it got like 60 votes. It was about putting it to rest. I think that followup article was about 'adding balance'.Aug 14 00:35
schestowitztwitter: Lindependence lives on as videos and stories. It creates buzz. Larry E-mailed me earlier. Very kind of him.Aug 14 00:36
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nathangrubb.............Aug 14 03:16
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schestowitzHmmm... this is not good http://www.daniweb.com/b... "The OS itself is based on SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop 10 and the software bundle includes a Firefox-derived browser plus a customised email, diary and contacts organiser, as well as drivers for the notebook’s wireless and 3G HSDPA radios. Viewers for Office documents and PDF are also included." Is it 'taxed'?Aug 14 09:14
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schestowitzAnother harassment account in Digg: http://digg.com/users/Amiga501Aug 14 14:26
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twitterGood morning.  I liked your last SLED article and submitted to Slashdot based on it.  http://slashdot.org/~twitter/...Aug 14 15:42
twitterThe SLED reference from daniweb was not there when I looked.Aug 14 15:46
twitterAmiga501 is a nasty little troll/sockpuppet.Aug 14 15:49
reya276schestowitz: hey dude, I'm spartan2276, I've posted some replies on your article. Pretty good stuff you guys got going.Aug 14 15:49
reya276schestowitz:  I need some clarification on this mono stuff, I'm a web developer and I keep getting alot of buzz from the MS .Net developers about this Silverlight garbage, I lean towards FOSS and Adobe products for development and at times I have to make critical decisions in my company when it comes to what web server software to use, right now we use mainly coldfusion, PHP and apache. So is Mono in it's current for bad for FOSS?Aug 14 15:52
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*schestowitz backAug 14 17:12
kentmaschestowitz: reya276 has a question for you.Aug 14 17:12
schestowitzHold on. I'll get a shower fistAug 14 17:12
schestowitzfirstAug 14 17:13
kentmadon't let gary see that typo, he'll have it all over the net ;-)Aug 14 17:13
schestowitzYes, I know. I typed while standing up. had to correct it quickly.Aug 14 17:22
kentmajust looking at your html file.Aug 14 17:23
schestowitztwitter:  thanks for the post to Slashdot. I'm looking at it now.Aug 14 17:23
kentmait seems that searching for href="http  as a start point will work, then finding "> then storing and finding </a> and trunkating the stored bit.  Unfortunately, the http doesn't start at the beginning of the line, which would be excellent, but at least there is only one per line, normally, anyway.Aug 14 17:24
kentmalooking at them, though, I can't see that truncating will leave anything meaningful, at least, not without doing some serious interpretation of the URL.Aug 14 17:27
kentmahmm, off for some tea.Aug 14 17:27
schestowitzYeah, it's a tought.Aug 14 17:27
schestowitz* Toughy.  I've just got this weird E-mail... hold onAug 14 17:28
schestowitztwitter: The editors at Slashdot put BN in the front page some times before, but after my warnings about their credibility, I wouldn't expect much.  Also the Roblimo thing and Bruce Byfield whom I criticised..Aug 14 17:30
twitterBryce Byfield earned his criticism and should have taken it well.  There's a bid difference between constructive criticism and calling people basement dwelling fanboys like he did.Aug 14 17:56
twitterSlashdot used to pick me up every other month.  That ended with Firehose.Aug 14 17:58
schestowitzThere's He did?Aug 14 17:58
schestowitzOops: I meant: "Did he?"Aug 14 17:59
twitterYes, a few months back, Byfield told everyone to "get over" M$ and to "grow up"Aug 14 17:59
twitterHe followed that up with his recent KDE bashing.Aug 14 17:59
schestowitzOh, *that*. Yes, I rebutted him many times back then. He was also on the podcast I did for SourceForge. he sidled with Waugh and the Mono/OOXXML people.Aug 14 18:00
twitterHe's advocated OOXML?  Got a link?Aug 14 18:01
schestowitzNot quite. He discouraged fighting it.Aug 14 18:02
schestowitzBTW, Victor posted this moments ago < http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/14/linu... >. He too noticed Slashdot's attack on  OpenGL.Aug 14 18:03
twitterDiscouraging the fight is about the same as accepting a wrong.  Here's his "grow up" article  http://itmanagement.earthweb.co...Aug 14 18:05
twitterIt has not aged well.  :)Aug 14 18:05
twitterHe's also listed some flames here, http://members.axion.net/...Aug 14 18:06
twitterThat should lead to whoppers.Aug 14 18:06
schestowitzThere was a whole bunch of them (articles). At least 5, some in his blog. Serach BN for Byfield and you'll see.Aug 14 18:06
MinceRtag the article "troll" ;)Aug 14 18:07
schestowitzHe accused many sites that criticise Microsoft of being "conspiracy theorists" and all... some called him a shill, I kid you not, but I was not among those who believed it. Later came this: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/0...Aug 14 18:07
schestowitzBTW, some site has just invited me to do an interview (on the telephone) with them. Because of Digg...Aug 14 18:10
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twitter:) Study up and have a good time.Aug 14 18:12
twitterIt might be better if you can get some of the questions in advance.Aug 14 18:13
schestowitzGood new example of abuse/misuse of the term "open source": http://www.xconomy.com/boston/2008/08/13/y-co...Aug 14 18:50
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schestowitzI've just been noticing some Slashdot comments where posters parrot the Big Lie (Linux @ 0.8%). is that common in Slashdot?Aug 14 20:36
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mib_0azlpqDon't know about slashdot but on one of the links to the about the Dell "Blacktop" (the APCMAG) kind've praises the pirated version of Win-XP in great detail; including screen shots.Aug 14 21:02
schestowitzYes, in China Microsoft just lets the boys be boys. But it occasionally cracks down on these 'boys;,.Aug 14 21:03
mib_0azlpqIt says to the effect of "maybe M$ should be doing something similar to it. - BTW, thanks for the link to KMFMS.Aug 14 21:05
schestowitzIn APC (MSN)?Aug 14 21:07
mib_0azlpqHere's the link: http://apcmag.com/pirated_window...Aug 14 21:07
schestowitzChina has much better versions of GNU/Linux. That's why Microsoft carries on giving Windows for free over there (while pretending it's a mistake... or theft).Aug 14 21:09
schestowitzhttp://ya.iyee.cn/2007/02/chine... Chinese attitude on buying VistaAug 14 21:09
schestowitzhttp://www.tuxmagazine.com/node/1000266 Why Piracy Hurts Open SourceAug 14 21:09
schestowitzhttp://observer.guardian.co.uk/bus... Microsoft seals its Windows and opens the door to LinuxAug 14 21:09
schestowitzhttp://www.arnnet.com.au/inde... Ballmer hints at tougher Vista antipiracy crackdownAug 14 21:10
schestowitzAs far as China goes, Microsoft loves Vista 'piracy' (it's made easy to crack). Let me find the link.Aug 14 21:10
schestowitzThat's the one: Microsoft Happy with the Evolution of Windows Vista Piracy : http://news.softpedia.com/news/Micros...Aug 14 21:11
mib_0azlpqThanks for these: the more I read the more I learn.Aug 14 21:11
twitterYes, the big lie is common on Slashdot.Aug 14 21:14
twitterThe trolls are also up on specifics of the "anti-piracy" sham.Aug 14 21:15
schestowitzOh! And the Foundation. Thanks for reminding me... dare to criticise the Fundation [sic]... Just dare!Aug 14 21:16
twitterI worked for a mom and pop shop owner that got busted by M$/BSA for "piracy".  He actually fought them off and won, which I think is rare.Aug 14 21:16
MinceRwhich Foundation?Aug 14 21:17
twitterThe last time I mentioned that, some troll posted as if he had worked there at the time.  Needless to say, my comment was buried, the troll was elevated.Aug 14 21:17
twitterThat's a rather powerful libel against the shop owner but I don't expect justice.Aug 14 21:18
twitterMinceR:  MSFT, the Microsoft Foundation Trust, I assume.Aug 14 21:19
MinceRoh, i didn't know there was such a foundationAug 14 21:20
MinceRisn't MSFT just the stock symbol of the Evil Empire?Aug 14 21:20
twitterI believe the foundation is the legal entity which owns M$.  The odd name has to do with tax games they play.Aug 14 21:22
MinceRicAug 14 21:22
MinceRi thought they only started the tax games with the other foundationAug 14 21:23
mib_0azlpqIn a reply comment to VAR guy concerning INTEGRITY & COMPTIA, I partly criticized the foundation, but got back no reply.Aug 14 21:24
twitterNo, the tax games are all old.  The name turns up no results so, like everything else M$, it is surrounded with bullshit and I could be wrong.Aug 14 21:25
mib_0azlpqAre there 2 foundations?Aug 14 21:25
twitterIf you want to know about M$ tax games, see Erci Raymond and Bill Parish writings. The game has not changed, only the names used.Aug 14 21:25
schestowitzMinceR: the Gates Foundation.Aug 14 21:26
schestowitzmib_0azlpq: there are many pots of gold around (buckets of money to offer pet charities of politicians of whatever).Aug 14 21:27
schestowitzThere are several blogs that are more credible than Slashdort. I hope they help people make better judgment of things, which helps all of us at the end. I find the mainstream media lacking and biased. Gates literally owns some of it (it takes research to find this out). Shall time permit, I recommend you watch this good talk: http://lessig.org/blog/2008/07/n...Aug 14 21:29
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MinceRoh, i know about that oneAug 14 21:36
MinceRbut i doubt they own M$Aug 14 21:36
MinceR(re the foundation)Aug 14 21:37
schestowitzThe Foundation is a nice setup for a variety of things.Aug 14 21:37
schestowitzFirstly, it enables Mr. Gates not to pay tax. This was said many times by experts in this field. "The Shell Game" Warren possibly joined him for this reason. There are other uses though.Aug 14 21:38
schestowitzIt's like PATRIOT, ACTA, DRM and many other things. You market it using one story (decoy) whereas the purpose is very different and can be a combination of selfish factors. Regarding the Gates thing, it's a long story and I can find you elaborative explanations of what's involved.Aug 14 21:42
mib_0azlpqPersonally I think both parties are corrupt. NY a blue state, suppose to be democratic for the people but it's the worst state for a corporate employee and the ordinary taxpayer.  60% of the NY corporations do not pay state income tax.Aug 14 21:42
schestowitzBoth parties just happen to be controlled by the same people, so it makes hardly a difference who gets voted. The tycoons and even companies like Microsoft invest in both (through campaign funds). They butter the toast on both side.Aug 14 21:45
schestowitz*sides .There are many similar scenario to consider. The Foundation too can leak some money  that's not tracked in the legal way (disclosures have their limits, also wrt to lobbying). For Gates, it's a case of having the cake and eating it too. Being praised for philanthropic efforts while also amassing great fortunes.Aug 14 21:47
mib_0azlpqYeap, with the foundation investing in oil stocks no less.Aug 14 21:49
schestowitzWell, not that necessarily. Trust me, I've seen other things that are more disingenuous. What's repellent are the immediate attacks on those who 'dare' to question the intent. Smears and all...Aug 14 21:50
schestowitzA lot of charities are like this though. It isn't a targeted criticism of Gates. And yet, it isn't the exception, either, so it does not deserve special treatment. Charities are often shells not just for PR purposes but also for transportation of money (interests, favours). Lot of this happened through the OOXML fiasco, for instance. Example: threat to retract fundings conditionally (blackmail)... look at the Kenya story.Aug 14 21:54
mib_0azlpqThe straw for me was how MS & Intel sabotaged olpc.Aug 14 21:55
schestowitzYes, but that's older news. OOXML bothers me more because it's not finished (I'll post updates shortly). Blackmail is the 'inverse' of bribery. "You'll vote favourably on OOXML, or else..." [waves funds /] In the case of OLPC, Intel dumped PCs (sold at a loss in Nigeria, according to the BBC). That's like another form of bribery. And then there's AMD and those antitrust proceedings.Aug 14 21:56
mib_0azlpqYes many going on are disturbing. But OLPC was the alarm clock waking me up and saying WTF is going on here? Primarily, BN is the first site I go to in the morning, then branch out from there.Aug 14 22:04
MinceRBN?Aug 14 22:05
mib_0azlpqBoycottNovellAug 14 22:05
MinceRoh.Aug 14 22:05
MinceR:)Aug 14 22:05
schestowitzI would have never called it BoycottNovell. It was Shane's choice.Aug 14 22:07
schestowitzHe started ranting as soon as Novell had announced the deal and the blog category (in EDUNix) was "Boycott Novell". He later made it a separate domain. Impulsive, quick, but we're stuck with the name, I guess. Shane is OK with it... that's just the 'brand' of the site now and how people recognise it, so it was never changed.Aug 14 22:08
mib_0azlpqWhen I first saw the name, I thought, oh well here's another sight with a bone to pick; then I saw it's very informative, not transparent as the MS humor sightsAug 14 22:11
mib_0azlpqI'm learning a lot. Grandpa said, "The day you stop learning, is the day you die".Aug 14 22:12
schestowitzHmmm :-( the initial reaction ("hate site") is what harms it so much. To be fair, it also harms Novell as it should.  All in all, however, some are put aback by the name.Aug 14 22:12
trmancohttp://weblog.infoworld.com/openreso...Aug 14 22:18
mib_0azlpqGrandpa also said, "If you straddle a fence, and you slip, it's going to hurt you big time". You can't coddle the M$ viper and be true to FOSS. Something has to give.Aug 14 22:20
schestowitzI can't stand the blogger, whom I corresponded with cordially seevral times before. He's a nice guy, but he doesn't belong in this sponosred-by-MS 'open source' blog.Aug 14 22:20
schestowitzHe calls FOSS people 'freetards' and always tried to 'monetise'. Since IBM and Sun took over this blog (from Asay and Rosenberg of MuleSource and Alfresco), it has not been the same. They are in CNET now.Aug 14 22:21
schestowitzmib_0azlpq: PJ wrote this earlier: http://www.groklaw.net/articl... http://www.groklaw.net/article... "It means that while OSI's handling of a list of approved licenses worked very well for a community made up of FOSS programmers, who are decent folks all on the same page overall, now that enemies of FOSS are attacking.."Aug 14 22:23
schestowitzFUD resurfaces (alert): He's feeding a flamer/troll. Why bother? It's the same dead horse being kicked again by some guest that showed up in the Inquirer. http://www.geekzone.co.nz/b...Aug 14 22:27
trmancoI don't blame him, blame the trollAug 14 22:38
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schestowitzSometimes bringing attention to the FUD Chorus Does more harm than good. IMHO.Aug 14 22:41
trmancotrueAug 14 22:42
trmancohttp://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/...Aug 14 22:44
schestowitzWow. I spotted that just a minuted ago and pasted it in my text editor just seconds ago. Coincidence?Aug 14 22:45
trmancomaybe :PAug 14 22:45
schestowitzEither way, Huggers is a Microsoft cr00k. He was there in Europe for the antitrust over Real and together with Ashley Highfield he excluded Mcirosoft's #1 rival.Aug 14 22:45
trmancowe just can't trust no one these daysAug 14 22:46
schestowitzOh, it's probably not clear from the way I put it. Huggers is a Microsoft executive... former... that's why the BBC is now crooked and biased.Aug 14 22:46
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/06/2...Aug 14 22:47
trmancololAug 14 22:50
trmancothey are getting pownedAug 14 22:50
trmancoaha ha ah ahahAug 14 22:52
trmancolol just loledAug 14 22:52
schestowitzOther broadcasters are the same, but BBC came under proper scrutiny.Aug 14 22:52
trmanconice videoAug 14 22:56
schestowitzAnd now the MSBBC is run by the same people (and probably the same guy) behind the demise of Real. If you look at antitrust exchibits (E-mails), you'll find those executives (which Judge Jackson called "Criminals") explicitly scheming to kill Real Networks /before/ it becomes as strong as Netscape. It's like a suppressive regime at work and it was appalling when I last saw it. Aug 14 22:59
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twitterfunny movieAug 14 23:59

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We hope that Guardian Digital and linuxsecurity.com will rectify the matter and persist with real articles
Links 20/06/2024: Somali Piracy Surges, Juneteenth Discussed
Links for the day
Gemini Links 20/06/2024: Gemini is 5 Today (Still No Gemlog Entry From its Founder)
Links for the day
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Wednesday, June 19, 2024
IRC logs for Wednesday, June 19, 2024