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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: August 29th, 2008

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MinceRthat too.Aug 29 00:00
twitterIt's like the fight against tobacco.  You would expect people who diss science to be smokers not tri-athletes.Aug 29 00:01
schestowitzI'm going through COLA at the moment. The Munchkins do some revisionist on Microsoft fraud. Grrrrrrrr.......Aug 29 00:02
schestowitz*revisionism Aug 29 00:02
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twitterYou could always tell Byfield that the only way he can get to zero credibility is to tell you he uses Windows as his home OS.  In one of his rants against you, he said he'd be proud to reach zero.Aug 29 00:28
schestowitzWhich rant?Aug 29 00:29
MinceRthe one about your credibility listAug 29 00:47
schestowitzHe should spend time writing good article rather than complain about it. :-) His technical articles are brilliant, but the ones about Microsoft stuff are another matter.Aug 29 00:52
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schestowitzRMS just told about Miguel that "Miguel has been no supporter of the free software movement since around 2002.  He often says things that support the Microsoft line." It's interesting that he lost trust in him completely (by association, perhaps he realise that Novell too "supports the Microsoft line").Aug 29 08:01
schestowitzNovell mob at ItWire? http://www.itwire.com/content... Aug 29 08:47
schestowitzHow come he gets slammed in the ratings? http://boycottnovell.com/2... Just in: Net loss at $15 million, claims Novell < http://www.networkworld.com/news/... >. They commit fraud, like Microsoft. Will post about it shortly.Aug 29 08:48
schestowitzhttp://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.p...Aug 29 09:16
zoobabpongAug 29 09:53
schestowitzIt's unlikely to make FP, but the campaign is promoted in Digg now: http://digg.com/linux_unix/Supp...Aug 29 09:55
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trmancohttp://4.bp.blogspot.com/_HNEge4YfF5g...Aug 29 11:19
schestowitzShouldn't 7 be in a jar?Aug 29 11:20
trmancowell yesAug 29 11:21
trmancobut we must wait until its "finally" releasedAug 29 11:21
trmancohttp://www.linuxworld.com.au/index...Aug 29 11:22
schestowitzOh, I get is. DoA.Aug 29 11:22
schestowitz*itAug 29 11:22
schestowitzYes, I was going to write about it in a moment.Aug 29 11:22
trmancoyes something like thatAug 29 11:24
trmancohttp://blogs.computerworld.com/r_i_p_exchangeAug 29 11:24
schestowitzIt's a long post, so I'll need to think about it.Aug 29 11:24
schestowitzYes, seen that too.Aug 29 11:25
schestowitzSJVN was an E-mail engineer for many years, so he knows that stuff.Aug 29 11:25
schestowitzPostPath is non-Free software, but it uses CentOS in some cases. It's more power to Linux.Aug 29 11:25
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mib_3h4ih0Hi. newb back. What is "COLA", what is "ROLF"?Aug 29 13:40
MinceRCOLA is comp.os.linux.advocacyAug 29 13:45
MinceRdunno about ROLFAug 29 13:45
schestowitzMe neither.Aug 29 13:47
mib_3h4ih0Thank you. My Dad is teaching me the other side of computing. He says go to #BN and read/listen to the guys in the know.Aug 29 13:49
MinceR:)Aug 29 13:51
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schestowitz:-)Aug 29 13:57
trmanconiceAug 29 13:58
schestowitzI've just taken a hit at NOVL (they showed their Achilles heel). Posted seconds ago: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08...Aug 29 13:59
mib_3h4ih0In the post picture, is that USS Novell or RMS Novell?  Is novell a US, British company?Aug 29 14:27
MinceRlol & RMS NovellAug 29 14:30
schestowitzThe photo is from Wiki Media, where it is filed (GPL  licensed of public domain) under the name: USS_Towers_DDG-9_sinking.jpgAug 29 14:33
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schestowitzhttp://www.channelregister.co.uk/...   "But this was turned into a loss of $15m for the period because of a debt write-off"    DEBT?Aug 29 15:09
MinceRs/\&/@/Aug 29 15:10
MinceRi knew something was off with what i saidAug 29 15:10
schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/0...Aug 29 15:22
schestowitz"This week, the promise was broken. It lasted less than six months. Now that Internet Explorer IE8 beta 2 is released, we know that many, if not most, pages viewed in IE8 will not be shown in standards mode by default." And people should trust Microsoft with ODF?Aug 29 15:22
MinceRpeople should trust microsoft with anything?Aug 29 15:23
schestowitzAsk Novell. It'll kiss Microsoft's and say "yes".Aug 29 15:24
MinceRpeople should trust novell with anything?Aug 29 15:25
schestowitzNovell = Microsoft's pseudo-alter-ego. When Microsoft needs a nod from its 'competitors' (e.g. Novell) it calls Novell in for some praise. Y'Know, keep those 'obnoxious' people like Neelie away...Aug 29 15:25
schestowitzGuess who's afraid of ODF? http://www.mmegi.bw/index.php?...Aug 29 15:34
schestowitzJohn Halamka, who claims to be a GNU/Linux supporter, is now giving Microsoft copies of potentially millions of health records of people. How clueless! People should be furious at him. http://www.masshightech.com/stories/200...Aug 29 15:49
schestowitzAnother patent strike from Microsoft (it's an offender/abuser, not a victim of the system): http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/busin...Aug 29 16:00
schestowitzhttp://www.cio.com/article/446372/Micr...   "Blitz" = "Slog" (The typical shills like Yankee Group are already at it) <  http://www.groklaw.net/pdf/Comes-3096.pdf >Aug 29 16:11
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_DougSchestowitz ?Aug 29 18:38
schestowitzHey, _Doug . What's up?Aug 29 18:39
_DougNothing much, I see you cannot uninstall IE 8 and it crashes other software ..Aug 29 18:39
_Doughttp://computerworld.com/action/article.d...Aug 29 18:40
_Doug. "If you install Internet Explorer 8 Beta 2, Windows Live Mail will crash when you create or reply to an e-mail message,"Aug 29 18:41
schestowitzYes, I saw some reports and I was going to write about it tonight.Aug 29 18:41
schestowitzThe standards issue is more serious, as well as SP3 lock-in and new incompatibilities.Aug 29 18:42
_DougIt must mean that IExplore is still welded to the OS ..Aug 29 18:42
schestowitzYes, was it required to stop?Aug 29 18:42
_DougCan't even have two versions running ..Aug 29 18:42
schestowitzUnless you use GNU/LinuxAug 29 18:43
_Dougrequired to stop? - no - but I thought it was 'sandboxed' ?Aug 29 18:43
schestowitzhttp://yro.slashdot.org/article... : Will W3C Accept DRM For Webfonts?Aug 29 18:43
_Dougtwo versions: yea, just how difficult is it, just copy to a seperate folder ..Aug 29 18:43
schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/08/2... : Microsoft breaks IE8 interoperability promiseAug 29 18:43
_DougWebfonts? what's this about ?Aug 29 18:44
schestowitz_Doug: Microsoft has a new site. Kind of Like 'OpenXML fan base'...Aug 29 18:44
schestowitz"Slimy campaign" indeed. Glorification of DRM and IE.Aug 29 18:44
_DougI mean does Ms own them ?Aug 29 18:44
_DougAnd if so what are they doing in an 'open' standard ?Aug 29 18:45
schestowitzDuh.Aug 29 18:45
schestowitzTo 'unopen' it.Aug 29 18:45
schestowitzIE-only feechure.Aug 29 18:45
_DougThey've stuck DRM in fonts ??? 101011010 1011010101010 1010101101010101 .. it is illegal to look at these bits .. :)Aug 29 18:47
_DougIs there a shortage of fonts out there ?Aug 29 18:47
_DougOh look .. they put the word 'open' in the name .. Embedded OpenTypeAug 29 18:48
_DougEmbedded DRMType . .shurly .. burp .. :0Aug 29 18:48
schestowitzHeh.Aug 29 18:48
schestowitzThey like misusing the work 'open'.Aug 29 18:48
_DougPM roy ?Aug 29 18:49
schestowitz"Independent" also.Aug 29 18:49
schestowitz?Aug 29 18:49
schestowitzOhAug 29 18:49
_Doug"How Can Nerds Make a Difference In November?" slashdot asks ..Aug 29 18:53
_Douganswer: none ..Aug 29 18:53
_DougGary McKinnon on the way to GitMo .. how sad .. :(Aug 29 18:55
schestowitzHehe. CHeck this out: http://getyourdrugon.com/Aug 29 18:57
_Dougblank here ..Aug 29 18:59
schestowitzEnable JS.Aug 29 19:00
_Dougf***ed system .. will take a look later ..Aug 29 19:00
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_DougWha' ...Aug 29 19:01
schestowitzJavascript and FlashAug 29 19:04
_DougCustoms raids tech trade showAug 29 19:04
schestowitzYes, seen it.Aug 29 19:04
_Doughttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/08/29/cus...Aug 29 19:04
_Dougpatent firm Sisvel ?Aug 29 19:05
schestowitzPatent firm... human and trolls?Aug 29 19:06
_Doug"Sisvel Spa, a multinational company with headquarters in Italy specializing in the protection and exploitation of intellectual property rights"Aug 29 19:06
_DougAnother patent extortion 'firm' ..Aug 29 19:07
_DougPAy us money, or soneone we don't know wil threaten people with guns at trade shows .. :)Aug 29 19:07
_DougMaaaaaaaaa .. shoosh :oAug 29 19:08
_Doughttp://www.ipbusinesscongress.com/Programme.pdfAug 29 19:09
_DougWhat's Sisvel and 'Intellectual Ventures' doing in the same doc ?Aug 29 19:10
_DougSnouts to the Trough ..Aug 29 19:12
_Doug"The role of IP monetisation"Aug 29 19:12
_DougHow to squeeze revenue out of real companies ..Aug 29 19:12
schestowitzYes, it's disgusting.Aug 29 19:14
schestowitzAlso new:Aug 29 19:14
schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/...Aug 29 19:14
_Doug"Ocean Tomo's second auction in Europe .. a world-record was set .. for a single patent .. for €£2,475,000"Aug 29 19:16
_DougI guess the 'commision' was meeting to carve up their terrority .. :]Aug 29 19:17
_DougWhy the armed response and seizures at trade shows .. like it would be calculated to maximize the damage to the companies reputation .. ?Aug 29 19:19
_Doughttp://www.redherring.com/Home/18346Aug 29 19:19
schestowitzAnyone killed yet?Aug 29 19:20
_DougHaaa ...Aug 29 19:21
_DougThis ain't funny for the companies involved ..Aug 29 19:21
schestowitzBankruptcy.Aug 29 19:21
schestowitzJoin the Military. Uncle Sam wants YOU................ to defend intellectual monopolies.Aug 29 19:24
_Doug"The DVB-T patent pool offers .. access to patents owned by France TA(C)lA(C)com, Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd., and Victor Company of Japan, Limited (JVC)"Aug 29 19:24
_Doug"Effective August 26th, 2008, licenses under those DVB-T essential patents will be available from SISVEL"Aug 29 19:25
_Doughttp://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/si...Aug 29 19:25
_Doughttp://tinyurl.com/56maelAug 29 19:25
zoobabSisvel is a Philips proxyAug 29 19:26
_DougI guess it's one way of gettig a choke hold on the Media .. ;)Aug 29 19:26
zoobabusing the same extorsion tactics as PhilipsAug 29 19:26
schestowitzWoot! IIS is falling: http://news.netcraft.com/archiv...Aug 29 19:26
zoobabAndre said that Sisvel has used the police to seize mp3 players today in a trade fair in GermanyAug 29 19:27
zoobabbut all articles are in germanAug 29 19:27
MinceRNetcraft confirms IIS is dyingAug 29 19:27
MinceR;)Aug 29 19:27
_Doughttp://www.ipeg.com/_UPLOAD%...Aug 29 19:28
_DougThis is a HUGE story .. why isn't the main stream press covering it ?Aug 29 19:29
schestowitzMinceR: I'll write about Apache later... and IE8.Aug 29 19:29
_Dougtfab, time for a break ..Aug 29 19:29
schestowitz_Doug: which story?Aug 29 19:29
_DougThe whole IP patents thing ..Aug 29 19:31
_Doug.. sleep(5)Aug 29 19:34
schestowitzByfield disinformation (one-sided piece) was also put in InternetNews *sigh*: http://www.internetnews.com/commenta...   At least Carla picked my rebuttal for Linux Today.Aug 29 19:34
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MinceRhmm... Stardock says "Gamers shall have the right to not be treated as potential criminals by developers or publishers." while pushing DRM.Aug 29 19:37
schestowitzThey 'protect' the user.Aug 29 19:38
MinceRlike the microsoft patent deals?Aug 29 19:38
schestowitzzoobab: this one might make the FP < http://digg.com/linux_unix/Suppo... >, but it slowed down after about 40 Diggs in 7 hours.Aug 29 19:42
_Dougprotect from who .. Intellectual Vultures .. :)Aug 29 19:42
schestowitzMinceR: they protect nobody.Aug 29 19:42
schestowitzSee this response to my post at LT:  http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story...   (he's not a lawyer, but still..)Aug 29 19:42
schestowitz_Doug: I'll take the piss out of Nathan Myhrvold later. I have some good images.Aug 29 19:43
MinceRwasn't Sun the main supporter of OOo?Aug 29 19:43
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/uplo...Aug 29 19:43
schestowitzMinceR: yes, Novell is only Microstitizing it with OOXML and Mono.Aug 29 19:44
schestowitzzoobab: I'm catching  with DM. I see you link to < http://localtechwire.com/busines... >, which I sent PJ. It has FUD at the end and she emphasised: "There is an article about GPLv3 and patents written by a lawyer at Ward and Smith. I thought I should point out that this is not the same firm whose partner, Johnny Ward, is suing PatentTrollTracker, Ward & Smith, the Texas firm (scroll down to keyAug 29 19:49
schestowitzword Cisco)."Aug 29 19:49
twitterDRM Gamer Protection that's rich.  DRM is all about the criminalization of sharing.  Those who advocate DRM think sharing is wrong in the first place.Aug 29 20:13
twitterOnce they get DRM in place, they charge you with circumventing their poison.Aug 29 20:13
twitterI like seeing IIS losing share to Google, Apache and others.Aug 29 20:14
schestowitzI'll do a post about it later.Aug 29 20:14
MinceR(Stardock is saying things they don't mean in their press release: http://pc.ign.com/articles/90... )Aug 29 20:14
twitterHere's my thought http://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/210379Aug 29 20:23
schestowitzCool.Aug 29 20:24
twitter:)Aug 29 20:24
trmancohttp://www.itworld.com/internet/545...Aug 29 20:26
twitterThink it's worth a Sladhdot front page?Aug 29 20:26
twitter^^The IIS story?Aug 29 20:27
schestowitzToo short.Aug 29 20:27
twitterIt's clear that IIS has stumbled over the last three months and Slashdot loves controversy.Aug 29 20:27
twitterThe trolls don't like my long stories either.Aug 29 20:27
_Dougttg .. that's Time To Go ...Aug 29 20:29
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twitterLike this one.  http://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/210145Aug 29 20:29
schestowitzThe dollar signs don't helpAug 29 20:30
twitterA friendly M$ press release about piracy made it to the front page two days later.Aug 29 20:30
schestowitzBut encyclopedia of failurelog is effectiveAug 29 20:30
twitterI've got better things to do with my time that type icrosoftAug 29 20:30
twitterthanksAug 29 20:30
MinceRthe front page would deserve a story about the piracy leak in IE8Aug 29 20:31
MinceRimoAug 29 20:31
twitterMissed that story.Aug 29 20:31
schestowitzSlashdot is not a MS-bashing site anymore.Aug 29 20:31
schestowitzThey visited Redmond.Aug 29 20:31
MinceRto what extent?Aug 29 20:31
twitterIt's not about M$ bashing, it's about telling the truth and not being brainwashed.Aug 29 20:32
MinceRtelling the truth about m$ and m$ bashing is pretty much the same thing :>Aug 29 20:32
twitterI'm not sure about the effectiveness of the Vista failure log.  Hardware will catch up and M$ will fix enough bugs for people to tolerate it like they did XP.Aug 29 20:33
twitterThe brainwash about "not as bad as people say" struck the BRLUG today.Aug 29 20:34
schestowitzMinceR: That's not what the cronies would have them believe though.Aug 29 20:35
twitterIt's not true either.  "Bash" is a label invented to discredit people who point out how bad M$ business practices and software are.Aug 29 20:38
twitterIt's usually followed by name calling like "conspiracy theorist" "shrill" "obsessive" "ignorant" and so on and so forth.Aug 29 20:39
twitterIf you don't do your homework, you are ignorant and stupid.  If you do, you are obsessive and crazy.Aug 29 20:40
schestowitzIt goes both ways.Aug 29 20:40
schestowitzMany confrontations are like this, but I don't endorse it when it comes from people on the defender's payroll.Aug 29 20:40
schestowitzI wrote some stuff about it this morning. Can't remember what exactly, but I wrote a little more about AstroTurfing and other forms of deception. Microsoft does it as often as a bodily functyion.Aug 29 20:41
twitterWell of course it goes both ways.  The perception management and marketing from M$ are obviously over the top, obsessive and dishonest.Aug 29 20:41
twitterThat does not keep them from doing it.Aug 29 20:42
schestowitzDo you have some bookmakred links or indexed to known incidents?Aug 29 20:43
schestowitzI'm collecting these.Aug 29 20:43
twitterNo links, other than the M$ quarterly reports.  This is a big picture thought.  If you had billions of dollars a year to spend, would you put it towards perception management?  Could you ever be as aggressive and asinine as the trolls are?Aug 29 20:44
schestowitzThe reports are 'cooked'.Aug 29 20:47
twitterYes, but they tell you how much money is spent on marketing.  It's something like a billion dollars a month.Aug 29 20:48
schestowitzPerception examples: "Linux is a cancer, it violated patent law, it's all command-line and less than 1% market share while Vista was sold 200 million times and people just mock it for no reason."Aug 29 20:49
twitterAll to make something third rate.Aug 29 20:49
schestowitzThe Bush government uses similar tactics.Aug 29 20:49
twitterWhile free software runs circles around it.Aug 29 20:49
schestowitzWell, that's the safe analogy... not to step on Godwin's law.Aug 29 20:50
twitterThe CIA is scary like that.Aug 29 20:50
schestowitzI bet to differ. Nothing is more scary than this: http://bp0.blogger.com/_UqUwVPikChs/...Aug 29 20:51
schestowitzSo many Novell spinner today. *sigh* Novell’s losses widened, the company admits cooking the books and I spot many spinner that parrot Novell’s twist on debt write-off.Aug 29 20:55
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MinceR:(Aug 29 21:55
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tessier__Hello allAug 29 22:01
tessier__Anything interesting happening?Aug 29 22:01
schestowitzHey, tessier_. Not much, but trolling has declined.Aug 29 22:04
tessier__Trolling has declined eh? How about on the newsgroup?Aug 29 22:05
schestowitzHmmm... that too. But it was really mad back in July.Aug 29 22:09
zoobabPatent sharks are on the riseAug 29 22:22
schestowitzSharks?!! Where, where?Aug 29 22:22
zoobabWith 232 patent cases filed in Marshall in the past year, trial dates for filing there are now running to 2012. Judge T. John Ward's patent litigation mill is slowing, but faring.Aug 29 22:23
tessier__I hear patent sharks were suspected to have fed off those four bodies found floating off the coast of FloridaAug 29 22:23
zoobabhttp://www.digitalmajority.org/for...Aug 29 22:23
zoobabpatent sharks is another word for patent trollAug 29 22:23
zoobabit is olderAug 29 22:24
tessier__What's in it for that judge to be nice to patents?Aug 29 22:24
zoobabfrom the 1896Aug 29 22:24
zoobabhe just says that Marshallll is full until 2012Aug 29 22:24
zoobabhttp://www.digitalmajority.org/forum/t...Aug 29 22:24
zoobabProf. Magliocca compares 19th century problems with "patent sharks" to today's problems with "patent trolls" and suggests the only politically acceptable path out of today's problems may be the path taken out of the 19th century problems, i.e. elimination of the class of patents that triggered the problems.Aug 29 22:25
tessier__What class of patents did they eliminate in the 19th century?Aug 29 22:26
schestowitzPoetry patents.... that's a funny one.Aug 29 22:26
zoobabdon't know still have to read the articleAug 29 22:28
zoobab:-)Aug 29 22:28
zoobabI need to outsource more to the communityAug 29 22:28
zoobabtoo few people are working in documenting the swpat issueAug 29 22:28
zoobabthis paper is a must readAug 29 22:34
zoobabhttp://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/paper...Aug 29 22:34
zoobab10Aug 29 22:35
zoobab       See Arguments Before the Committee on Patents, 45th Cong., 2d Sess., Sen.Aug 29 22:35
zoobabMisc. Doc. No. 50, at 123 (1878) (testimony of J.H. Raymond) (criticizing “thoseAug 29 22:35
zoobabwho are justly called patent sharks” and the “large number of patents that areAug 29 22:35
zoobabgood for nothing except as the bases for infringement suits”); see generally Earl W.Aug 29 22:35
zoobabHayter, The Patent System and Agrarian Discontent, 34 MISS. VALLEY HIST. REV. 59Aug 29 22:35
zoobab(1947) (describing this controversy in detail).Aug 29 22:35
zoobab1878!Aug 29 22:35
schestowitzzoobab: how is FFII funded?Aug 29 22:39
trmancohttp://itstudent.org/blog/?p=715Aug 29 22:46
schestowitzThey squeeze the goose. One day the golden egg won't come out.Aug 29 22:49
zoobabwhois patentshark.orgAug 29 22:52
zoobabwhois patentshark.netAug 29 22:53
schestowitzRay Niro?Aug 29 22:55
schestowitzhttp://www.whois.net/whois_new.cgi?d=... (I get nothing for .net and .org)Aug 29 22:57
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IRC Proceedings: Sunday, October 06, 2024
IRC logs for Sunday, October 06, 2024
EPO: We Give Recognition to Frauds
Good to see some frank recognition right there in the EPO's own Web site
Even Though We Don't Focus on statCounter for Now (Not Our Top Priority) GNU/Linux Reaches New Highs This Month:
We caught GNU/Linux at 4.86% before, but only temporarily
Links 06/10/2024: Ham Radio for Recovery, Health Problems Worldwide
Links for the day
Gemini Links 06/10/2024: Special Interest Galore and Religion
Links for the day
Keeping Control Out of Dictators' Hands
When people are just "numbers"...
Links 06/10/2024: Misinformation Growing on the Web, "Hey Hi" Hype Waning for Lack of RoI
Links for the day
[Meme] Years Have Passed and EPO Management Still Isn't Obeying a Ruling From a Court Regarding Communications Between Staff
Representatives talking to their staff is "privacy violation"?
Presentations of the Staff Union of the European Patent Office in Its Headquarters Tomorrow After Work
Annual General Meeting and reports
Gemini Links 06/10/2024: SSH Keys and Hobby Game Development
Links for the day
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Saturday, October 05, 2024
IRC logs for Saturday, October 05, 2024