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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: February 6th, 2009


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schestowitzSCO peddlers in Linux Today?? 06 00:29
schestowitzAnother company has just sold Linux out to Microsoft: (almost no-one covered this)Feb 06 00:34
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schestowitz:-( 06 00:59
schestowitz"Without quesiton, they are struggling.  The market has changed dramatically since they launched and we started tracking them. "Feb 06 00:59
schestowitz 06 01:01
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schestowitzWelcome to the last issue of Free Software Magazine < >Feb 06 01:07
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NotZedmorningFeb 06 02:12
schestowitzHey, morning(ish)Feb 06 02:13
schestowitzIt's 2 hereFeb 06 02:13
NotZedjust before 1pm here, so it's not so morning here.  its also 40 and headed for 43, nice and toastyFeb 06 02:14
schestowitzYes, I heardFeb 06 02:15
schestowitzA mate of of mine knew nothing about when I spoke to him about it in the afternoon. The realisation is that climate change is felt in places.Feb 06 02:15
schestowitzWe had snow (unusual amounts)Feb 06 02:15
NotZedi dunno if its climate change - we get heatwaves every year, even if this is a hot one.  the 90's was just unusually cool.  the dryness is extreme though - we had 1mm last month, average is 20mm.Feb 06 02:17
NotZedstill, always a laugh reading the northerners claiming things are getting cold not hot :)Feb 06 02:18
schestowitzI think turbulence is a sign, regardless of the direction of wingsFeb 06 02:18
schestowitzMelting of icebergs if factFeb 06 02:19
NotZedits scary reading comments on controversial news.  so many misinformed out there.Feb 06 02:19
NotZedsurely if novell have a lot of people to sack they'll announce it when ready - the market always loves layoffs.  although they have shrunk a lot, they were about 6K when i wentFeb 06 02:20
schestowitz...They might announce around financial result...Feb 06 02:27
schestowitzEnd of this month IIRC.. maybe 22ndFeb 06 02:27
schestowitzNotZed: you have experience with Novell?Feb 06 02:28
NotZedi worked on evolution for just shy of 6 yearsFeb 06 02:30
schestowitzNovell fired about 20% under Messman, IIRC.Feb 06 02:33
NotZediirc 10% when i went, late 2005Feb 06 02:33
schestowitzSun is a real avalancheFeb 06 02:35
schestowitzThey've just lost the core of MySQL, except MikosFeb 06 02:35
NotZedus companies buying non-us ones is a bit of a risk. the us work culture is a bit funny.Feb 06 02:40
schestowitzNovell has EU workforceFeb 06 02:41
schestowitzBut US-based companies are multinationals tooFeb 06 02:41
NotZedwell i was referring to sun.  but i bet novell's eu operations have a us culture - the australian one doesFeb 06 02:42
schestowitzYes, MySQL had a bad experience in the place Mikos (?) called a "candy store" in Dec 07Feb 06 02:43
NotZed`"It has been like walking around in a candy story," Mickos said, after looking over Sun's vast computing labs.'Feb 06 02:45
NotZedi dunno, for a techie that sounds like a reasonably innocuous commentFeb 06 02:46
schestowitzThe story become a kioskFeb 06 02:47
schestowitzPeople corrected "story" to "store"Feb 06 02:47
schestowitzAt least Kaj is still around... 06 02:49
NotZed  says he resigned when the company was bought, just hung around for technical help on a project he wasn't leading anymore.  that he lasted this long is surprising in that caseFeb 06 02:50
schestowitzZach Urlocker too.. 06 02:50
schestowitzDavid Arxmark (?) left tooFeb 06 02:51
NotZedbloody hell its hot and dry out there.  the other side of the country is having big floods.Feb 06 02:56
NotZedi wonder how much money they all made off the deal.  make it hard to stick around if they made a lotFeb 06 02:57
schestowitzWhich deal?Feb 06 03:01
NotZedbeing bought by sun?Feb 06 03:02
schestowitzI though you referred to the weather/Aussie govt.Feb 06 03:03
schestowitzNotZed: MySQL was bought for $100mFeb 06 03:03
schestowitzOopsFeb 06 03:03
schestowitz$1bilFeb 06 03:03
schestowitzTrolltech=$100miFeb 06 03:03
NotZedyeah so if those guys made a big chunk personally, there wouldn't be much incentive to hang around if things aren't really peachyFeb 06 03:04
schestowitzLike Woz maybe.Feb 06 03:05
schestowitzOr AllenFeb 06 03:06
NotZedlucky bastardsFeb 06 03:08
NotZedtime to brave the heat.  ttylFeb 06 03:38
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Guest40468helloFeb 06 04:23
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balzaclartFeb 06 04:27
amarsh04and HP still doesn't put penguin stickers on their printer packaging schetowitzFeb 06 05:28
amarsh04hi Guest40468Feb 06 05:49
amarsh04err balzacFeb 06 05:50
balzachi amarsh04Feb 06 05:52
balzaci'm just going to bed nowFeb 06 05:52
balzacttylFeb 06 05:52
amarsh04goodnightFeb 06 05:53
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MinceRr4wrFeb 06 09:31
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amarsh04this is amazing, the temperature was still 40.1 C at 8pm, and sunset is 8:19pmFeb 06 09:41
amarsh04max was 43.9 C = 111 FFeb 06 09:42
schestowitzHard to sleep without ACFeb 06 09:43
amarsh04yes, now listening to a piece inspired by a work famous for "Abandon all hope, ye who enter here" Tchaikovsky Francesca da Rimini, Symphonic Fantasia after Dante, Op 32Feb 06 09:46
schestowitzTake the computer to the fridge.... 06 09:47
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schestowitzIntel shuts Shanghai plant < >Feb 06 09:58
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*amarsh04 just submitted 06 10:06
amarsh04I like features to be well documented and use the same terminology throughoutFeb 06 10:07
schestowitz"Obey DRM" as an option is like "would you like salt in that icecream?"Feb 06 10:14
amarsh04exactlyFeb 06 10:35
amarsh04considering that the document was a public discussion paper I was a bit surprisedFeb 06 10:35
amarsh04in my dad's day one would churn together salt and ice to freeze icecream, not to eat with icecreamFeb 06 10:36
schestowitzIn both cases you can't consume the goods (document, food)Feb 06 10:37
amarsh04I wanted to copy from the document to query it with ACMA. I did get a reply, but might reply back, asking what they have done apart from publishing other parties' submissionsFeb 06 10:41
amarsh04handling of emergency calls is reasonably importantFeb 06 10:41
amarsh04I used to get the FCC's "The Billboard" - was quite informative about the US telephone systemFeb 06 10:43
amarsh04I was quite annoyed that the .au telecoms regulators also received the FCC Billboard but didn't publish something like that for AustraliaFeb 06 10:44
amarsh04it all struck me as information control rather than facilitating telecommunicationsFeb 06 10:45
schestowitzMaybe they are curiousFeb 06 10:58
schestowitzMaybe they need to be informed.Feb 06 10:58
schestowitzOh, here we go... more fraud exposed: (BlackBerry bosses settle share option row)Feb 06 10:59
amarsh04I remember in the early to mid-90's some trade shows were decidely sexist/exploitative... far more effective was the vendor providing free decent coffeeFeb 06 11:05
amarsh04weren't Broadcom directors also a bit shadey?Feb 06 11:06
schestowitzSexist? How so?Feb 06 11:10
schestowitzBroadcom was caught for fraudFeb 06 11:10
schestowitz 06 11:11
amarsh04having teenage girls dressed provocatively to peddle the vendor's waresFeb 06 11:11
schestowitzThey still do thisFeb 06 11:11
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amarsh04yes, but the user-group organised events, there are enough females in charge to discourage that kind of practiceFeb 06 11:12
schestowitzHm. is BN down?Feb 06 11:13
schestowitzBTW, I saw your comment in LinuxTodayFeb 06 11:13
amarsh04resolves but doesn't loadFeb 06 11:13
amarsh04about darryl?Feb 06 11:13
schestowitzYesFeb 06 11:14
schestowitzOK, it's backFeb 06 11:14
schestowitzThe whole server may have been rebotted because I stepped outside the accountFeb 06 11:14
amarsh04I posted somewhere about trying out *recent* bootable/live media on new pc's and reporting back what worked and what didn't to the distros and kernel communityFeb 06 11:15
amarsh04ouchFeb 06 11:15
amarsh04wordpress: error establishing a database connectionFeb 06 11:15
schestowitzThat;s OKFeb 06 11:15
schestowitzGive it a moment.Feb 06 11:15
amarsh04reloaded nowFeb 06 11:16
*schestowitz diagnosesFeb 06 11:16
amarsh04emc reminds me of peoplesoft - something that a company ends up spending ever increasing amounts of money onFeb 06 11:16
schestowitzI don't understand why this wasn't promoted.. 06 11:17
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schestowitz"Server Load  10.19 (4 cpus)"Feb 06 11:19
schestowitzI don't know what's happening then.Feb 06 11:19
oiaohmBecause its not really a good benchmark.Feb 06 11:20
pranithhmmFeb 06 11:20
schestowitzø per second: 90.96Feb 06 11:20
oiaohmRunning a cache yet schestowitz?Feb 06 11:21
schestowitzNo, not yetFeb 06 11:21
schestowitzI need root to put Squid on it, I think.Feb 06 11:21 references the Ubuntu vs ms benchmark articleFeb 06 11:22
oiaohmMysql query cache is on?Feb 06 11:24
oiaohm  << good read about it schestowitz.  Some request times mysql cache helps a lot others it will kill you 12 ways from sunday.Feb 06 11:26
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oiaohmMajor problem windows vs Linux benchmarks is are not many test that would be classed as valid.Feb 06 11:29
oiaohmUbuntu installs can be speed up a lot.  The shocking one was the slow shutdown time of windows.Feb 06 11:29
*Received a CTCP PING 1233920508 from oiaohmFeb 06 11:36
schestowitzoiaohm: I think it's onFeb 06 11:41
oiaohmNeeds to be checked if Word press is compadible with it.Feb 06 11:41
oiaohmIf it not it will cause masive load spike outs when server is under load.  Really bad time to do it.Feb 06 11:42
oiaohmNow the annoying thing is if Word press is compadiblie with it the load is reduced masively by enabling it.Feb 06 11:43
schestowitzI think it's enabledFeb 06 11:43
schestowitz"Query cache"Feb 06 11:43
schestowitz"Qcache_free_blocks  1,093   The number of free memory blocks in query cache."Feb 06 11:44
schestowitz"Qcache_free_memory  23 M   The amount of free memory for query cache."Feb 06 11:44
schestowitz..Feb 06 11:44
oiaohmYep enabled.Feb 06 11:44
schestowitzWhether the CMS makes good use of it I don't know.Feb 06 11:44
schestowitzBut it's a DB level thingFeb 06 11:44
schestowitzUnless the query needs to invoke it specifically.Feb 06 11:44
oiaohmDifference here if php application is not compadible with it due to the sql commands it sends it costs you a extra 13 percent load.Feb 06 11:45
oiaohmIf it compadbile it can cut load by 1/3Feb 06 11:45
oiaohmSo yes it must be set right for the php application you are using.Feb 06 11:45
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schestowitz "The main reason for leaving was that I am not satisfied with the way the MySQL server has been developed, as can be seen on my previous blog post. In particular I would have like to see the server development to be moved to a true open development environment that would encourage outside participation and without any need of differentiation on the source code. Sun has beeFeb 06 13:12
schestowitzn considering opening up the server development, but the pace has been too slow."Feb 06 13:12
schestowitz"..others are laying off too - Microsoft are and it acts as a barometer for the whole industry. Novell are notoriously coy on the number of folks they lay off, but a number of European offices were closed at the back end of last summer. I suppose if they were next to useless, no-one will miss them (the offices, I mean)." 06 13:28
oiaohmFunny enough some companies are putting on more staff.Feb 06 13:30
oiaohmMost of them because of cost cutting.   Redhat fears if this downturn last long enough companies might not have free money for support contracts until then there life is great.Feb 06 13:31
schestowitzThey could hire in-house supportFeb 06 13:34
schestowitzBill Would Keep Bailout Recipients from Hiring H-1B Workers < >Feb 06 13:34
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schestowitz < Wall Street Beat: Downturn Continues to Slam IT Bellwethers >Feb 06 13:35
schestowitz"Cisco said Wednesday that revenue for the quarter ended Jan. 24 declined 7.5 percent from the year-earlier period to US$9.1 billion, as earnings plunged 27 percent to $1.5 billion."Feb 06 13:36
oiaohm_  << This reminds me of the bag of rice for 6 months.Feb 06 13:36
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oiaohm_Yep Cisco is going ouch.  People are not upgrading major network interlinks either.Feb 06 13:38
schestowitz 06 13:38
oiaohm_So hopefully the down turn is reducing numbers of people connected to internet.Feb 06 13:38
oiaohm_Or we could have a little bit of a data crunch.Feb 06 13:38
schestowitz"Hopefully"?Feb 06 13:39
schestowitzOh, ic.Feb 06 13:39
schestowitzOMG, watch his cap..Feb 06 13:39
schestowitzIt says "Razorfish"Feb 06 13:39
schestowitzThat happens to be the name of a Microsoft subsidiary where Microsoft laid off employees last year (just a coincidence of course)Feb 06 13:40
oiaohm_I have build a web site for food before.Feb 06 13:41
oiaohm_Ok 12 3 course meals at a top resurant.   So not really that cheep per line of code.Feb 06 13:42
schestowitz"Will build ballstic rockets for food"Feb 06 13:42
schestowitz*ballisticFeb 06 13:42
oiaohm_Hmm  wounder if anyone would.Feb 06 13:43
oiaohm_It would be fun building a ballstic rocketFeb 06 13:43
schestowitzColumbine..Feb 06 13:45
schestowitzMaybe something for redundant workforce to do. I still think the US is the greatest danger to world peace.Feb 06 13:45
schestowitzObama can hopefully change the control of the country by imperialist-fascists.Feb 06 13:46
oiaohm_I have done concret tank demolishions before using non convental explosives.   Boy does it save time if you have the charges to place.Feb 06 13:47
schestowitz "Warning over 'surveillance state' Lord Norton: "We are a world leader in surveillance" Electronic surveillance and collection of personal data are "pervasive" in British society and threaten to undermine democracy, peers have warned. "Feb 06 13:47
oiaohm_Those I did for free because they were threating to fall on where my car had to park.Feb 06 13:48
oiaohm_Do you know the problem with over surveillance.Feb 06 13:49
amarsh04schestowitz - report is at 06 13:50
oiaohm_Too much data you most likely cannot find the threats you are looking for.Feb 06 13:50
amarsh04analysis at 06 13:50
schestowitzThanks.Feb 06 13:53
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amarsh04courtesy of Electronic Frontiers Australia privacy mailing list 06 13:53
schestowitzIt's now confirmed that more Novell layoffs are coming.Feb 06 13:56
schestowitzamarsh04: they did Internet surveillance on me (they might still do this)Feb 06 13:56
amarsh04after what happened to sjvn and his father (HP pretexting) it doesn't surprise meFeb 06 13:57
schestowitzSJVN too?Feb 06 13:57
schestowitzI didn't know he was involved. I knew about CNET staff.Feb 06 13:58
schestowitzGot link?Feb 06 13:58
amarsh04or was it only his father?Feb 06 13:58
amarsh04was in groklaw... let me checkFeb 06 13:58
schestowitzThanks.Feb 06 14:02
schestowitzI know about Stephen Shankland (?) and Dawn something... maybe also the guy who died. They got a  settlement, IIRC, then gave to charity. Maybe Florina was ousted for it.....Feb 06 14:02
amarsh04sorry it was Stephen Shankland... list is at 06 14:03
amarsh04my memory did a short circuit and thought of the wrong namesFeb 06 14:04
schestowitzHehe. Feb 06 14:05
schestowitz 06 14:05
schestowitz"Brushes off"... hours later it turned out that Novell liedFeb 06 14:05
schestowitzamarsh04: I don't know if SJVN's dad is even aliveFeb 06 14:06
schestowitzTBH, I don't even know if it's true that MOG phones PJ's motherFeb 06 14:06
schestowitz"And here's number 9 -- Stephen Shankland is another victim of the KGB. Oops, I meant the HPB. That's the Hewlett Packard Board. Or maybe we should call them the HPG, the HP Gang. Joke. Joke. I know, I know. It's not HP or its board of directors or Ms. Dunn and her "internal group" -- it's the subcontractors. "Feb 06 14:08
schestowitzSounds like Microsoft and firms like W-E and Edelman. They bribe bloggers with laptops -- Edelman in 2006 and W-E in 2009 (Vista7)Feb 06 14:08
amarsh04from's main page I clicked on the archives link - it gives the titles of all public articlesFeb 06 14:10
schestowitz"Update: Marbux writes to me that Mr. Shankland might not need to wait. "Feb 06 14:13
schestowitzMarbux...... :-SFeb 06 14:13
schestowitzShe has him cited in many old articlesFeb 06 14:13
schestowitz"09/09/06, 2006"Feb 06 14:14
schestowitzU.S. job losses accelerate < > Watch the chartFeb 06 14:15
schestowitzThe criminals that Wikileaks exposed are calling it quits? Julius Baer confirms trading incident < >Feb 06 14:16
schestowitz"Swiss bank Julius Baer (BAER.VX), confirmed on Friday it had suffered a "minor trading incident" last year as its shares slid sharply on news of an anonymous letter to Swiss authorities claiming that employees hid losses."Feb 06 14:16
schestowitzHow many people will not see their money again? Not even in the balance sheet?Feb 06 14:17
schestowitz"Julius Baer's full-year net profit fell 25 percent to 852 million Swiss francs ($731 million) and weak equity markets led to a 32 percent fall in assets under management. A"Feb 06 14:17
schestowitz"The bank said that the fourth quarter was particularly hard for GAM as investors lost confidence in hedge funds in December with news of the alleged fraud involving U.S. businessman Bernard Madoff, even though GAM was not involved. "Feb 06 14:17
oiaohm_  << LOLFeb 06 14:23
oiaohm_I guess you have not seen that one schestowitz where they present KDE 4 to people and tell them it Windows 7 and they accept it.Feb 06 14:23
schestowitzBrilliant!Feb 06 14:26
schestowitzI'll put it in BN (embedment)Feb 06 14:27
oiaohm_Good bit is that Windows 7 will be versing KDE 4 on windows in time.Feb 06 14:28
oiaohm_Its australian prank nature.Feb 06 14:30
schestowitzI put it in BNFeb 06 14:34
oiaohm_zdnet australia is worth watching from time to time just for the prank's.Feb 06 14:37
schestowitzI prefer not to feed Zee Dee (it's too Microsoft-centric.. Apple too to an extent)Feb 06 14:41
amarsh04the person who wrote many of the linux columns for is an acquaintanceFeb 06 14:43
amarsh04Geoffrey Bennett, of windows refund cheque and segway clone fameFeb 06 14:43
schestowitzNot Ashton Mills?Feb 06 14:45
schestowitzHe's their main 'Linux guy'Feb 06 14:45
schestowitz 06 14:45
schestowitzIdentity fraud to rise once new Government databases are set up < >Feb 06 14:48
oiaohm_ReallyFeb 06 14:48
amarsh04Geoffrey Bennett was apcmag's first linux columnistFeb 06 14:50
oiaohm_Identity fraud should really reduce under a well setup systemFeb 06 14:51
oiaohm_Biggest advantage Identity fraud people are depending on is that they can swap a photo on a ID and no one can find out.Feb 06 14:52
oiaohm_Database forces frauders to attack a central point.Feb 06 14:52
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twitterI hate flash.Feb 06 15:05
schestowitzMe too, can you make ogg from it?Feb 06 15:05
schestowitzI can extract ogg from YouTube and others, but this is not what I'm used toFeb 06 15:06
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twitterNo, I can't get the video at all.Feb 06 15:12
twitterI might be able to watch it if I use my Wife's computer.Feb 06 15:14
schestowitzmaybe it's on YouTube tooFeb 06 15:14
schestowitzLenovo and NEC are leaving the market in the west.. 06 15:17
schestowitzAntarctic bulge could flood Washington DC < >Feb 06 15:21
schestowitzushimitsudoki1: Japan police to bring libel charges over blog posts < >Feb 06 15:23
ushimitsudoki1schestowitz: damn that's crazy, I'll have to get my wife to check it out and give me the detailsFeb 06 15:25
schestowitzI think that the issue is people who issue death thread, not those making accusationsFeb 06 15:26
schestowitz*threatsFeb 06 15:26
ushimitsudoki1could be - to be honest I'm not really up on Japanese libel laws (like I know there is a diff between US and UK, for example - but I don't know how Japan's are)Feb 06 15:26
schestowitzThe UK is badFeb 06 15:27
schestowitzYou need to prove it wasn't livelFeb 06 15:27
schestowitz*libel.Feb 06 15:27
ushimitsudoki1Yeah UK is pretty out of control with the surveillance and libel laws and so on. Scary stuff there, at least to my limited understanding.Feb 06 15:28
schestowitzSo the burden of proof is on the defendant, not the plaintiff, assuming it's taken to court. This is apparently how many small magazines got shut down here, only to be replaced by conglomerates and their conformist propganda.Feb 06 15:28
schestowitzWhat the Web knows about you < >Feb 06 15:41
schestowitz "Maybe this is old news, but I was checking Facebook’s terms of use to see if something had changed since the last time I saw them. But everytime I read this, I keep getting surprised and annoyed."Feb 06 15:43
schestowitz"By posting User Content to any part of the Site, you automatically grant, and you represent and warrant that you have the right to grant, to the Company an irrevocable, perpetual, non-exclusive, transferable, fully paid, worldwide license (with the right to sublicense) to use, copy, publicly perform, publicly display, reformat, translate, excerpt (in whole or in part) and distribute such User Content for any purpose, commercial, aFeb 06 15:44
schestowitzdvertising.."Feb 06 15:44
schestowitzIn mail: "MS is trying to repeat what it did do Borland and others, this time targeting NetBSD: Sidekick may or may not have been a great product, but it doesn't matter anymore since MS bought it and sidelined it.  Look at Foxpro for how long a good product can drag on in a pitiful existence."Feb 06 15:49
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schestowitzThe MSBBC is advertising Microsoft again (using taxpayers' money): 06 15:53
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schestowitzOh no.Feb 06 16:27
schestowitzMarten Mickos is leaving Sun amid reorg < >Feb 06 16:27
schestowitzFreudian slip..." My intention was to finnish Maria 2.0" 06 16:32
balzacMarten is from Mysql?Feb 06 16:59
balzacSun Microsystems needs to change their corporate culture.Feb 06 17:01
balzacI don't like how the ask me to register with Sun in order to download mysqlFeb 06 17:01
schestowitzReally?Feb 06 17:02
schestowitzI never triedFeb 06 17:02
balzacOpen Solaris is pretty lameFeb 06 17:02
balzacjust what the FOSS world needed, a new and not-special license - the CDDLFeb 06 17:03
*schestowitz on phoneFeb 06 17:03
balzacYeah, they just don't see how it takes the immediacy and the joy out of free software when you're asked to create an account for a friggin download.Feb 06 17:03
balzacWhat they've done is they've encumbered software users with this registration and sign-in process.Feb 06 17:06
schestowitzYes, I hate thatFeb 06 17:08
schestowitzWhat do they plan to do with it?Feb 06 17:08
schestowitzMS is pissing me off todayFeb 06 17:10
schestowitzDo me a favour and see if you can find typo in this thing I posted 20 secs ago: 06 17:10
balzacI don't see any typos popping out at meFeb 06 17:30
balzacThat's an interesting storyFeb 06 17:31
schestowitzThanks.Feb 06 17:31
schestowitzI try to keep these shortFeb 06 17:32
balzacMS might as well seize onto BSDFeb 06 17:32
balzachey, it's not GNU and it's not LinuxFeb 06 17:32
balzacwindows is trashFeb 06 17:32
balzacwhat's his name from BSD is always attacking RMSFeb 06 17:33
balzacseems like a natural fitFeb 06 17:33
balzacbut Microsoft is so damned big and expensive, how can they navigate between Scylla and Charybdis?Feb 06 17:34
balzacThe're headed for disaster in any case. They'll be having to restructure and accept the loss of supremecy.Feb 06 17:35
balzacbut who will fill the void of market share?Feb 06 17:35
schestowitzThey tried SingularityFeb 06 17:35
schestowitzBut nobody contributesFeb 06 17:35
schestowitzThey do it at their own expenseFeb 06 17:36
schestowitzNo-one to exploit because people learned not to help the criminal entitiesFeb 06 17:36
balzacRoy, seems like the real problem is finding a company smart enough to take the slack that M$ gives up.Feb 06 17:36
schestowitzNovell learned a similar lesson.. I think they lost a lot of the communityFeb 06 17:36
balzacIs there anyone who is ready to take the market share M$ is losing?Feb 06 17:36
schestowitzbalzac: no, MS will just have to drop losing productsFeb 06 17:36
schestowitzThey have many of thoseFeb 06 17:37
schestowitzThey'll be forced to refocus on key products that actually turn profitFeb 06 17:37
schestowitzOffice suite space, however, is becoming like a generic drugs spaceFeb 06 17:37
schestowitzOOXML is serving as decommoditisation tool.Feb 06 17:37
balzacright, but how and when are we going to see the catastrophic collapse of M$ that we've been waiting so many years for?Feb 06 17:37
schestowitzbalzac: "Read to take"? Microsoft already loses itFeb 06 17:38
balzacwho is getting the market share?Feb 06 17:38
schestowitzDon't tell me you go by Net Applications junk and other Fisher Price 'studies'Feb 06 17:38
schestowitzThe price of Windows and Windows revenues have been falling for quite some time now.Feb 06 17:38
schestowitzWhen they give Windows for $0 and Linux survives and still thrives, then it's "Oh boy!" to MicrosoftFeb 06 17:39
schestowitzbalzac: which market share?Feb 06 17:39
balzachome users operating systems - who is going to take what M$ loses, Apple and Ubuntu?Feb 06 17:39
schestowitzLook at MSFT share price. Down by HALFFeb 06 17:39
balzacApple and Canonical, I should say.Feb 06 17:39
schestowitzDow Jones is not down by Half... nor is NASDAQ, IIRCFeb 06 17:39
schestowitzCanonical where?Feb 06 17:40
schestowitzDesktop?Feb 06 17:40
schestowitzSubnotebooks?Feb 06 17:40
schestowitzMaemo gains alsoFeb 06 17:40
balzacsome company needs to emerge as the new power for personal computer operating systemsFeb 06 17:40
schestowitzIt runs Koffice now.Feb 06 17:40
schestowitzbalzac: that's like promoting mainframe domination in the 80sFeb 06 17:40
balzaceverywhere M$ is currently serving consumers and office staffFeb 06 17:40
schestowitzIt's a changed battleFeb 06 17:40
schestowitzMicrosoft is desparate for devicesFeb 06 17:40
schestowitzhance they bought DangerFeb 06 17:41
schestowitzThey also need to exist in cloudsFeb 06 17:41
schestowitzThat's where Red Hat is hugeFeb 06 17:41
balzacyeah, but the market wants and perhaps even demands some degree of shared experienceFeb 06 17:41
schestowitzSo they corrupt the virtualisation spaceFeb 06 17:41
balzacRoy, I think there has to be some really big successes for companies other than M$ to end the tyranny of M$.Feb 06 17:43
balzacwho is going to get all those billions of dollars and hundreds of millions of users?Feb 06 17:43
schestowitzDollars?Feb 06 17:44
balzacRedhat is not for home usersFeb 06 17:44
schestowitzNo, that's price fixing.Feb 06 17:44
balzacCanonical is well positionedFeb 06 17:44
schestowitzSame with IntelFeb 06 17:44
schestowitzOLPC f*ed them (AMD)Feb 06 17:44
schestowitzTheir profits fell 95% (!!) in the last reportFeb 06 17:44
balzacRoy, yeah people are going to pay substantially less, and for support and services, not the actual software.Feb 06 17:44
schestowitzOperating systems become a commodityFeb 06 17:44
schestowitzDon't expects SunMySQL to 'steal' Oracle's $$Feb 06 17:45
schestowitzThey can take share, not $Feb 06 17:45
schestowitzThis is not a zero-sum gameFeb 06 17:45
balzacrightFeb 06 17:45
schestowitzWe give platforms to BraziliansFeb 06 17:45
schestowitzMicrosoft says, "hey, you! Go grow coffee beans for 3 years, then get Vista Ultimate"Feb 06 17:45
schestowitzThat's insaneFeb 06 17:45
PetoKraushmm mmFeb 06 17:45
schestowitzIt doesn't cost money to replicate the SWFeb 06 17:46
balzacnew markets are crucial, but wiping M$ off of hundreds of millions of computers is also important.Feb 06 17:46
PetoKrausschestowitz: could you get me a flash video?Feb 06 17:46
schestowitzAnd Brazil can afford to employ devs for localisation and bus fixing in the 'Universal' platform *UNIversnal)Feb 06 17:46
schestowitzPetoKraus: surewFeb 06 17:46
PetoKraus 06 17:46
schestowitzI can'tFeb 06 17:46
schestowitzI triedFeb 06 17:46
PetoKraus;)Feb 06 17:46
PetoKrausokFeb 06 17:46
schestowitzWe talked about it earlierFeb 06 17:46
PetoKrausis it worth watching?Feb 06 17:47
schestowitztwitter can't watch itFeb 06 17:47
schestowitzPetoKraus: not that much.Feb 06 17:47
PetoKrausrightFeb 06 17:47
schestowitzIt's humour, not newsFeb 06 17:47
PetoKrauslemme see how it worksFeb 06 17:47
PetoKrausoh nice xmlFeb 06 17:49
schestowitzOh wait!Feb 06 17:49
schestowitz 06 17:49
schestowitzJust posted in USENETFeb 06 17:49
schestowitzSame videoFeb 06 17:49
schestowitzI'll grab an ogg and uploadFeb 06 17:49
schestowitzGive me a minuteFeb 06 17:49
PetoKrausnahFeb 06 17:49
PetoKrausi've got itFeb 06 17:49
PetoKraus 06 17:49
PetoKraus:)Feb 06 17:50
schestowitz6mbFeb 06 17:50
PetoKrausit has 2:27Feb 06 17:50
schestowitzYesFeb 06 17:52
schestowitz      0:01:36.90 audio: 33kbps video: 654kbps, time remaining: 00:00:42Feb 06 17:52
PetoKraushmmFeb 06 17:53
PetoKrausit wasn't worth itFeb 06 17:53
PetoKraus:)Feb 06 17:53
balzacok, I'm afk for a few...Feb 06 17:53
PetoKrausbut they've got their whole playlist up there in the openFeb 06 17:53
PetoKrauswhich is niceFeb 06 17:53
PetoKraus 06 17:53
schestowitzDone. 06 17:58
trmanco"Banshee 1.4.2 is epicly broken in Jaunty. Slow to start up and wont play music (GStreamer errors)"Feb 06 18:04
schestowitzOh oh.Feb 06 18:05
schestowitzDon't tell me that Novell is pushing that junk into Ubuntu now.Feb 06 18:06
trmancoyes, for while nowFeb 06 18:07
trmanco 06 18:10
PetoKrausoh godFeb 06 18:17
PetoKrauswho's that?Feb 06 18:17
schestowitzAny proof of it being shoved int Ubuntu?Feb 06 18:17
PetoKrausWho?: I’m a 16 year old Ubuntu Linux developer from Edinburgh, Scotland.Feb 06 18:18
PetoKrausDavid Futcher (bobbo) is an Ubuntu Linux developer and general free software hacker, living in Edinburgh, Scotland.Feb 06 18:18
PetoKraus"general free software hacker" at the age of 16?Feb 06 18:18
PetoKrausalright.Feb 06 18:18
schestowitzWhy not?Feb 06 18:19
schestowitztrmanco is also coding/hacking at a young age.Feb 06 18:19
PetoKrauscoding and hacking is something differentFeb 06 18:20
PetoKrausyou know, "real programmer"â„¢ stuffFeb 06 18:20
trmancoPetoKraus, he might beFeb 06 18:21
trmanco 06 18:21
trmancohe is o MOTUFeb 06 18:21
trmancoso I assume that he knows what he is talking aboutFeb 06 18:22
PetoKrausmark of the unicorn?Feb 06 18:22
trmanco 06 18:23
trmancowhere did you see that?Feb 06 18:23
PetoKrausgoogle ;)Feb 06 18:24
trmancohmm okFeb 06 18:25
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trmanco 06 19:06
trmanco 06 19:23
schestowitzWatch a fool:  < > "After all, it's not Linux. How many hundreds of Linux distributions are there? That's why Linux will never be mainstream. Nobody knows which distribution to use."Feb 06 19:27
schestowitzThe comments probably address this already, but Linux doesn't have pricing difference and it's not about FEATURES being DISABLED. I don't think the author even knows what Linux is. Microsoft has price scale for CRIPPLED (not different) versions.Feb 06 19:28
schestowitz"Smell the Coffee, distributions are not operating systems. They are extremely helpful advances in how software is packaged and deployed. In the Microsoft world, picture being able to easily put your favorite operating system (maybe you like XP, service pack 3) on a cd (sorry DVD since windows is bloated),..Feb 06 19:29
schestowitz" add your favorite office applications (Visio, Word, Excel), change the background to your favorite screen saver, bundle some cool content (you're home recorded .mp3s), package all of this to auto install, and give the cd to all of your friends and co-workers."" There are some Microshills there, too.Feb 06 19:29
schestowitz"Stanford has released Open Molecular Mechanics version 1.0. The software... library is release under the GPL and thus Free Software: "Feb 06 19:40
schestowitzLenovo CEO quits < >Feb 06 19:41
schestowitzI don't think I get it........... 06 19:44
schestowitz 06 20:07
schestowitz For shame, Forbes magazine < >Feb 06 20:08
schestowitzHm... "They forgot the leader of the U.S.S.A. (United Socialist States of America): Barrack Obama" 06 20:10
schestowitzCitrix is bastardising Xen.... Only Windows through to Linux but no Linux hosts, just slaves?Feb 06 20:33
*balzac has quit ("Lost terminal")Feb 06 20:53
schestowitzGovernment Already Overpaid By $78 Billion In Bailout Money  < >Feb 06 21:02
schestowitz (EU Court Says Simply Taking Someone's Photo Can Violate Their Civil Rights)Feb 06 21:02
schestowitz"I mentioned the guardian blog and how it tracks hits. Well someone else noticed it connecting to Omniture. There is also a mention of Omniture in relation to the BBC on a reg article < > . Curiously enough all mention of the issue has disappeared from the Guardian tech blog < >"Feb 06 21:04
schestowitzWTF? "The readers' editor is adjudicating a complaint about this post. It will be restored when the complaint is resolved" 06 21:04
schestowitzNot So Much Truth in Advertising < >Feb 06 21:07
schestowitzPhoto: Brits 'a bunch of yellow bastards', says irate Yank < >Feb 06 21:21
schestowitz (US sheds 598,000 jobs in January)... it's probably a lot worse. They could too easily underplay this.Feb 06 21:22
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trmancowhat does atm mean?Feb 06 21:26
schestowitzat the momentFeb 06 21:26
schestowitzor automatic tellerFeb 06 21:26
schestowitz 06 21:26
trmancoat the moment in my context :D thanks schestowitzFeb 06 21:26
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schestowitz 06 21:32
schestowitz"According to the bureau's sampling and calculations done on that sampled data, America shed 598,000 non-farm jobs in January, worse than expected and boosting the unemployment rate to 7.6 per cent."Feb 06 21:32
schestowitzThat's BS. They don't measure it using the same yardstick that they used to. A friend tells me they 'expire' once a period of 6 of months is lapsed, so unemployment levels may be almost equivalent (but not comparable) to great depression levels.Feb 06 21:34
schestowitzping balzacFeb 06 21:37
balzac64 bytes from balzac ( icmp_seq=1 ttl=47 time=61.5 msFeb 06 21:42
trmancololFeb 06 21:42
GoblinRFDsorry about that...I log on and the wife starts giving me jobs....hi all!Feb 06 21:42
balzac64 bytes from balzac ( icmp_seq=1 ttl=47 time=63.1 msFeb 06 21:42
schestowitzHoly SPIN batman!  The Micropress spins Microsoft admitting screwing up as "Microsoft responds to bloggers".. Feb 06 21:42
schestowitzbalzac: I was going to askFeb 06 21:43
schestowitzYou suggested changes. How about putting the Web UI for IRC in each page?Feb 06 21:43
balzacthat's a good ideaFeb 06 21:43
schestowitzThis improves real-time interacxtion and feedback. One click away from channel.Feb 06 21:43
balzacget more of your http traffic in hereFeb 06 21:43
schestowitzLet's try it.Feb 06 21:43
schestowitzEven if just for a short whileFeb 06 21:44
balzacbut what kind of client? hopefully something which doesn't rely on a java applet.Feb 06 21:44
balzacirc implemented with phpFeb 06 21:44
balzacthe recipe is maximum concurrent users and maximum interactivityFeb 06 21:45
balzachave I told you my plan for a gaming website with live cam-girls?Feb 06 21:45
balzacI bounced the idea off of RMS and he thought it could be goodFeb 06 21:46
balzacall based on free software of course...Feb 06 21:47
schestowitzThe good thing is thisFeb 06 21:48
schestowitzWe used to get spam in old postsFeb 06 21:48
schestowitzOver 5000 of them (posts, not comments)Feb 06 21:48
schestowitzSo people who read old posts cannot comment, but they can click to enter the chatroom to discussFeb 06 21:49
schestowitzCheck any individual post now. It's up.Feb 06 21:49
schestowitz “Software is like sex: it's better when it's free.” -Linus TorvaldsFeb 06 21:50
schestowitz"Would a dating service on the net be ‘frowned upon’ . . . ? I hope not. But even if it is, don’t let that stop you from notifying me via net mail if you start one." --Richard StallmanFeb 06 21:51
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balzac_httpcoolFeb 06 21:51
mib_qt6uytheyFeb 06 21:51
balzac_httpthis irc client works niceFeb 06 21:51
schestowitzit's valid HTML (ish)Feb 06 21:52
schestowitzAnd it doesn't put load on the server (mashup)Feb 06 21:52
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balzac_httpI'm going to put this on my site: http://www.disruptech.comFeb 06 21:52
balzac_httpThere's a drupal module for mibbit as wellFeb 06 21:53
schestowitzSounds good, let me checkFeb 06 21:53
balzac_http 06 21:53
schestowitzNice designFeb 06 21:53
balzac_httpwell, it's just the default acquia marina themeFeb 06 21:53
balzac_httpI had my own theme but it has some issues I didn't want to deal withFeb 06 21:54
balzac_httpso I'm going to customize this themeFeb 06 21:54
schestowitzReminds me of lifehckerFeb 06 21:54
schestowitz (It is that time of the Quarter! Traveling to Microsoft.)Feb 06 21:55
schestowitzWhat a toolFeb 06 21:55
schestowitzWho is Joseph?Feb 06 21:56
schestowitzShields???Feb 06 21:56
schestowitzMoonlight.....Feb 06 21:56
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schestowitzMaybe this chap: 06 21:57
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Goblin[RFD]so it works then!Feb 06 22:19
schestowitzWhat does? MIB?Feb 06 22:19
Goblin[RFD]the embedded chat client.Feb 06 22:19
Goblin[RFD]I saw the conversation just before I had to log offFeb 06 22:19
schestowitzMaybe we can get reader to join the conversation and not be just passive readers. That's what balzac rightly suggested and I thank him for thatFeb 06 22:20
Goblin[RFD]good ideaFeb 06 22:20
Goblin[RFD]things been a little slow for me today.....mind you the MS posters are becoming desperateFeb 06 22:21
schestowitzThere is a lot of good Linux news today. Microsoft is getting nervousFeb 06 22:21
schestowitzLet me find something I spotted earlierFeb 06 22:21
Goblin[RFD]over on mswatch theyve posted a nasty homophobic tirade aimed at us.Feb 06 22:22
schestowitzHere, have a look: 06 22:22
Goblin[RFD]going nowFeb 06 22:22
schestowitzWait, I heard of that tacticFeb 06 22:22
schestowitzSomeone mailed me earlier suggesting that there's some new squad killing communities with such messagesFeb 06 22:22
schestowitzHe suggested this ruined TechnocratFeb 06 22:22
Goblin[RFD]its all so desperate....I just hope nobody was offended by their remarksFeb 06 22:24
schestowitzLet me check my box again..Feb 06 22:24
schestowitzCause I don't think I can quote itFeb 06 22:25
schestowitzHe said BN was also affected by themFeb 06 22:25
schestowitzBut I promised not to quote thisFeb 06 22:26
schestowitzNew site: 06 22:30
schestowitzSimilar to trmanco 'sFeb 06 22:31
trmancolooks niceFeb 06 22:34
schestowitzThe name makes it sound like another LinuxHater(C) or anti-Linux, but it ain'tFeb 06 22:34
Goblin[RFD]ahhhhhhhFeb 06 22:35
Goblin[RFD]Quote "A new release of Wine, everyones favourite Windows emulator is out. "Feb 06 22:35
Goblin[RFD]noooooFeb 06 22:35
Goblin[RFD]that needs to be changed and fast on that site.Feb 06 22:35
Goblin[RFD]looks quite nice though appart from that.Feb 06 22:36
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Goblin[RFD]and just seen a new onlinerpg there....although all the rest Ive already covered on mine.....Feb 06 22:38
schestowitz"Critic"=make it more like Win32Feb 06 22:39
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balzacI know they methodicaly subvert free and open source software communities as well.Feb 06 22:41
balzacNovell employees themselves have dogged Roy on sites other than BNFeb 06 22:41
schestowitzLet's see who picks the job of "Microsoft's anti Desktop/sub-notebooks/laptop Linux",10...Feb 06 22:42
schestowitzbalzac: they do it to other people who write about BNFeb 06 22:42
balzacTheir strategy is to try to provoke activists into appearing overzealous and unreasonable by a pattern of harrassment.Feb 06 22:42
schestowitzI have it documented tooFeb 06 22:42
schestowitzYes, that too.Feb 06 22:42
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balzacI wouldn't know the extent to which Microsoft is guilty of these kinds of activities if it weren't for BNFeb 06 22:46
balzacWhat a bunch of weasels.Feb 06 22:47
schestowitzmichaellarabel is spread disinfo: 06 22:48
schestowitzI told him on IRC to clam it downFeb 06 22:48
schestowitzHe's putting down a good projectFeb 06 22:48
schestowitz"The Phoronix headline was probably a little confusing, Compiz Fusion as a project is not being dropped, we’re here to stay, however considering that the same two leaders are in charge of both Compiz and Compiz Fusion, we have decided to merge the two projects. "Feb 06 22:48
schestowitzbalzac: yes, I need to be careful what I saidFeb 06 22:49
schestowitzOne person told me to shut down IRC because the trolls cherry-pick stuff from here to wrongly claims (they lie) that I attributed reiser's murder to Microsoft.Feb 06 22:49
schestowitzSome of them have a quick copy-n-paster to smear me whenever BN makes the front page of a site like Slashdot in order to deflect attention and stir people up against BNFeb 06 22:50
schestowitztwitter gets the same treatment in places because he says the truthFeb 06 22:50
balzacyeah, that's crapFeb 06 22:51
schestowitzThey have labelsFeb 06 22:51
schestowitzPick on:Feb 06 22:51
balzacpeople who position themselves as intermediaries to resolve conflict - it doesn't make sense ethically if one side of the conflict is obviously wrong.Feb 06 22:52
schestowitz*one. [Microsoft hater|zealot|loon|fanboi|basement dweller|others]Feb 06 22:52
schestowitzThey apply this also to PJ and people who are super-polite like Andy Updegrove, who mailed me to suggest that I tone myself down (I had no idea I ever toned myself 'up')Feb 06 22:53
balzacI write carefully, even in heated debates. I re-read my stuff more than some editors for the NY Times.Feb 06 22:53
schestowitzSee how RMS gets slammed by MS pressure groups (i.e. by proxy) like COmpTIA if he dares to say something true people are not used to hearing.Feb 06 22:53
balzacI've had to become extra careful because when you're up against intellectually dishonest character assassins, they're going to be as un-charitable as possible every time vague language is left open to interpretation.Feb 06 22:54
balzacThey'll misinterpret even when I write clearly, so I find myself saying "please don't ever paraphrase me and attribute it to me".Feb 06 22:55
balzacThat's probably why RMS doesn't encourage people to make up their own rhetoric regarding touchy topics such as referring to GNU/Linux as "Linux". He just recommends you refer them to the relevant pages on fsf.orgFeb 06 22:57
schestowitzCool: 06 22:57
schestowitzYes, RMS reuses properly constructed argument to save time and ambiguity.Feb 06 22:59
schestowitzI still have many references spread in over 50,000 USENET posts and I ought to have them more cohesively organised over time. Feb 06 22:59
balzacthat's a lotFeb 06 22:59
balzacone month I posted 2300 comments in favor of impeaching BushFeb 06 23:00
balzacI did that with varying degrees of intensity over the course of yearsFeb 06 23:00
balzacluckily for me, i'm focused on work now.Feb 06 23:01
balzacI had hoped that as a blogger I'd get enough traffic to have substantial ad revenueFeb 06 23:02
balzacI underestimated the determination of the political hacks to protect their positions within the online democratic fundraising communities.Feb 06 23:03
balzacIt sucks when you're not getting paid as an activist and your opponents are getting paid to trash you.Feb 06 23:03
balzacthere's this guy who is the chief of staff for a democratic governor or senator - this guy is such an utter and complete asshole.Feb 06 23:04
balzacOne of these days, I'm going to make contact with this politicians office and say, I think you're a real piece of shit an the reason is your chief of staff.Feb 06 23:04
balzache's been verbally abusing hundreds of sincere, volunteer activists over the course of years.Feb 06 23:05
balzacto think that someone with that nice of a job can be that nasty to regular shmoes who volunteer their time..Feb 06 23:05
balzacI'd love to get that bastard fired.Feb 06 23:06
schestowitzThe comments... just in Daily Kos?Feb 06 23:06
balzacyeahFeb 06 23:06
schestowitzDo you know the Berman lad?Feb 06 23:06
schestowitzAbusing many activists.Feb 06 23:06
balzacnoFeb 06 23:06
schestowitzThere are hired guns doing this thing.Feb 06 23:06
balzacis that a real name or a pseudonym?Feb 06 23:07
schestowitzGetting paid to trash poor volunteersFeb 06 23:07
balzacohFeb 06 23:07
balzacoh yeah, I know itFeb 06 23:07
schestowitz 06 23:07
balzacthey're paid by our tax dollars to brow beat us in our online communitiesFeb 06 23:07
schestowitzYesFeb 06 23:07
schestowitzTo keep responsible adults in chargeFeb 06 23:07
balzacAlright, time for me to get off my computer for a while...Feb 06 23:09
balzacRoy, I have to say I see only one way to beat these fuckers - in businesFeb 06 23:09
schestowitz "I was even told by someone else in the forum that they were given short shrift on the phone to Dell UK when trying to order one of the XPS laptops with Ubuntu. Apparently the sales representative told them they no longer sold any XPS laptops with Ubuntu in the UK."Feb 06 23:09
schestowitzbalzac: no, build 'an army' as they sayFeb 06 23:10
schestowitzThey use cash.Feb 06 23:10
balzacthat's my focus now. If you don't have a business plan behind your activism, you'll never be able to "drain the swamp" of capital that funds your ideological oppositionFeb 06 23:10
schestowitzYou can use people's voicesFeb 06 23:10
schestowitzTap people's effortsFeb 06 23:10
balzacwell, even an army has to eat and be sheltered. You have to have a scalable plan to finance your efforts.Feb 06 23:10
schestowitzLike I follow the words of other whose blogs or campigns are worth supportingFeb 06 23:10
balzacmoney is the best for "dynamic resource allocation" among large groups of people. People need to get paid, ultimately.Feb 06 23:11
schestowitzbalzac: not quiteFeb 06 23:11
schestowitzI disagree with you.Feb 06 23:11
schestowitzI know you must go, but wait.Feb 06 23:11
balzacokFeb 06 23:11
schestowitzThe thing is, keeping people divided is something that's done by designFeb 06 23:11
schestowitzFor many years in many so-called "democracies" unions were broken apart in smart waysFeb 06 23:12
schestowitzNot the press is deterioratingFeb 06 23:12
schestowitzUnless they receive bailout (aka "public looting"), they will lose control of people's thoughts and feelings.Feb 06 23:12
PetoKrausDinner time :)Feb 06 23:12
schestowitzMoreover, here in BN I get help from people in places like Brazil in India, i.e. those vasssalised by the westFeb 06 23:12
schestowitzThey are willing to donate time, and it's all enabled by the _OPEN_ Internet (must fight tiered Web too)Feb 06 23:13
schestowitzSo with connected minds, the elites have sh* in their .. well,.. hanmd.Feb 06 23:13
schestowitzIf they are 1% of the population..Feb 06 23:13
schestowitzThink about not just wealth.Feb 06 23:13
balzacwell, there'll be a newer, slightly more benevolent elite to replace them.Feb 06 23:14
schestowitzThink about media controllers, diplomats, Bilderbergers and all that sort of crowdFeb 06 23:14
schestowitzThey are shaking scared of the other 99%Feb 06 23:14
balzacI'm not going to find myself a hungry old activist years down the road.Feb 06 23:14
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schestowitzEspecially now when people are unhappy (economy just in part, transparency being another), they are at huge risk and they know itFeb 06 23:14
schestowitzThus they create "Police State"Feb 06 23:14
schestowitzForm of neo-fascismFeb 06 23:15
schestowitzThey daemonise protestors and unions (same old, same old)Feb 06 23:15
balzacthey're not as afraid of us as you think. if they were afraid, they wouldn't be pissing all over everyone.Feb 06 23:15
schestowitzI think they are worried, maybe not "Scared"Feb 06 23:15
schestowitzWatch the politicians in the UKFeb 06 23:16
schestowitzI do follow this (local news)Feb 06 23:16
schestowitzThey get blasted in blogsFeb 06 23:16
schestowitzThey get phonecallsFeb 06 23:16
schestowitzPeople see their corruptionFeb 06 23:16
schestowitzAnd they're hopping mad when wikileaks get their latest corruptionFeb 06 23:16
schestowitzIn BN I focus on one area... COmes is a favourite ATMFeb 06 23:16
schestowitzIf many people do this, then the Web gets flooded by the stuff that has UK MPs want to 'close it down'Feb 06 23:17
balzacgood luck with controlling the internet...Feb 06 23:18
balzacwell, ultimately, I want to be able to afford a nice lifestyle.Feb 06 23:18
schestowitzWhat is "nice"?Feb 06 23:18
balzacI'm going to stay focused on business, but in accordance with my ethics.Feb 06 23:18
schestowitzWhat the Tube says?Feb 06 23:19
schestowitzI'm not sure RMS is bothered by flying coach.Feb 06 23:19
balzacRoy, I have my own ideas of lifestyle.Feb 06 23:19
schestowitzHad he flown first class, then what preacher would he be?Feb 06 23:19
balzachonestly, the lifestyle I'm focused on isn't for everyone.Feb 06 23:19
schestowitzIn some parts of the world, lifestyle means other things.Feb 06 23:20
balzacI'm not averse to the idea of having money, employees, and all the trappings of wealth. That's just me...Feb 06 23:20
schestowitzHopefully not consumerism and fashionable following, balzac Feb 06 23:20
balzacBut that's a separate issue from software freedomFeb 06 23:20
schestowitzWealth is OKFeb 06 23:20
schestowitzNo-one I know is against itFeb 06 23:21
schestowitzThe question is how you achieve itFeb 06 23:21
balzacby kicking the asses of less deserving competitors on the battlefield of businessFeb 06 23:21
schestowitzTreading on others is one way, like in ColmbiaFeb 06 23:21
schestowitz*ombiaFeb 06 23:21
schestowitzbalzac: that's how many companiesview themselvesFeb 06 23:22
schestowitzMS: "We're the good guys!" (see Comes memos)Feb 06 23:22
balzacIf you've got to climb over anyone else's back, make sure they deserve to lose.Feb 06 23:22
balzacthere is no shortage of scumbags to compete againstFeb 06 23:22
schestowitzDon't fall into mental traps of self justification. It's too easyFeb 06 23:22
schestowitzSuccess can be intoxication when measured in the wrong sorts of material gain.Feb 06 23:23
balzacdon't worry about me, my friendFeb 06 23:23
schestowitzWhat you say was also said by the dumpster divers who wanted to beat "Evil" IBMFeb 06 23:23
balzacI've got some finely-tuned ethical calculus to guide meFeb 06 23:23
schestowitzIBM too is trying to defeat MS based on "ethical" or "moral" basisFeb 06 23:23
schestowitzBut IBM is misbehaved tooFeb 06 23:23
schestowitzGoogle as wellFeb 06 23:24
balzacsure.Feb 06 23:24
schestowitzPeople's abacus for ethics gets changedFeb 06 23:24
balzacAny company which has to answer to share-holders is going to partake in a bogus systemFeb 06 23:24
PetoKrausschestowitz: it doesntFeb 06 23:24
schestowitzSome people turned from peddlers into extreme predatorsFeb 06 23:24
PetoKraussince most people judge in terms of relative valuesFeb 06 23:24
PetoKrausthe "abacus" doesn't changeFeb 06 23:25
PetoKrausthe people doFeb 06 23:25
balzacok, ttyl guysFeb 06 23:25
schestowitzTrue.Feb 06 23:25
balzachave a good weekendFeb 06 23:25
schestowitzYou tooFeb 06 23:25
*balzac is now known as balzac_afkFeb 06 23:25
PetoKrausalrightyFeb 06 23:29
PetoKrausschestowitz: 06 23:29
schestowitzI see.... the last time you posted a photo here it had a nippleFeb 06 23:31
schestowitzI saw this cartoon about a year ago.Feb 06 23:31
*mib_be8hx8 (i=8258be83@gateway/web/ajax/ has joined #boycottnovellFeb 06 23:32
PetoKrausyeah it's niceFeb 06 23:32
PetoKraus:)Feb 06 23:32
PetoKrausdo you know all of them,?Feb 06 23:32
schestowitzNo.Feb 06 23:33
PetoKraus:)Feb 06 23:33
*mib_be8hx8 has quit (Client Quit)Feb 06 23:33
schestowitzViolent unrest rocks China as crisis hits < >Feb 06 23:34
schestowitz"Bankruptcies, unemployment and social unrest are spreading more widely in China than officially reported, according to independent research that paints an ominous picture for the world economy." They censor the truthFeb 06 23:35
schestowitzSame in the UK and US. Any number you read about and estimate projection you are told about is bogus. It's always optimistic -- low-balling the reality or severity of the situation.Feb 06 23:36
schestowitzIBM and Google are still 'dressing up' open standards as "openness" or open source. 06 23:39
schestowitzWhat a load of *. "The nonprofit has open-sourced the API, and will make available the following data in hopes that developers" < >. How can an API be 'open-sourced'?Feb 06 23:40
PetoKrausuhmFeb 06 23:42
PetoKrauswhateverFeb 06 23:42
PetoKrausclassical journo ignorance/spinFeb 06 23:42
PetoKrausthat HP design for UMPC's looks coolFeb 06 23:42
schestowitzYes, I liked it tooFeb 06 23:45
schestowitzBetter than Ubuntu colours and all....Feb 06 23:45
PetoKrausYeahFeb 06 23:45
schestowitzH-P has big budget and staffFeb 06 23:45
PetoKrausi'm "professionally deformed" thoughFeb 06 23:45
schestowitzBut the Linux people in there will be pressure by MS lackeys, as usual.Feb 06 23:45
PetoKrauseven if i like some UIFeb 06 23:45
PetoKrausi can't force myself to use it... i'm just too used to my layoutFeb 06 23:46
PetoKrausyou wouldn't even know I changed the OS, if you didn't see the background image logoFeb 06 23:46
schestowitzThe Fortify shills are attacking FOSS all over the press again. They are Microsoft attack dogs.Feb 06 23:46
PetoKrausdid you read about HP not selling Linux version of their machines in UK?Feb 06 23:46
PetoKrausI mean, what the?Feb 06 23:46
schestowitzYesFeb 06 23:46
schestowitzUK is well behindFeb 06 23:46
PetoKrausyesFeb 06 23:46
schestowitzAlso see Firefox share hereFeb 06 23:47
PetoKrausi wonder whyFeb 06 23:47
PetoKrausyeahFeb 06 23:47
schestowitzLike the US... patiotismFeb 06 23:47
schestowitzObedience to English-named brandFeb 06 23:47
PetoKrausi am trying to do my best at work... you know, i usually even preinstall firefox for the usersFeb 06 23:47
schestowitzMicrosoft is a top brand here, never mind the crimes.Feb 06 23:47
PetoKrausor openoffice or soFeb 06 23:47
schestowitzYes, they then pressure their peers/family too. That's how Firefox grewFeb 06 23:48
PetoKrausi'm thinking about bringing my laptop over to work tomorrowFeb 06 23:48
PetoKrausi could use some cleaning :DFeb 06 23:48
PetoKrauson the other side, suit, bike and laptop case are quite incompatibleFeb 06 23:49
schestowitzUse a backpackFeb 06 23:52
schestowitzOh, wait.. suit?Feb 06 23:53
twitterUse a locker and shower and get there earlier.Feb 06 23:53
twitterA case for the bike helps get things back and forth with less wrinkles.Feb 06 23:54
PetoKrauswellFeb 06 23:54
PetoKraus1) it's downhill, i don't need a showerFeb 06 23:54
twitterlucky youFeb 06 23:54
schestowitzThe MOG gang gives an award to the Tucci|Maritz brothel: 06 23:54
PetoKraus2) i use backpack. It just doesn't match the suit wellFeb 06 23:55
twittermight leave you rumply ...Feb 06 23:55
PetoKrausyeahFeb 06 23:55
PetoKrausit was the best buy i made thoughFeb 06 23:56
PetoKrausit's nice sturdy samsonite backpackFeb 06 23:56
PetoKrausi can manage to fit swimsuit+towel, jogging pants, t shirt, squash boots, lab coats, lab manuals and my notes (a4 folder) in it pretty easilyFeb 06 23:57
twitterThe biggest battle is being close enough to ride and having streets that don't kill you.  The rest are trivial details.Feb 06 23:57
PetoKrausthe streets of glasgowFeb 06 23:58
PetoKrauswellFeb 06 23:58
PetoKrausit takes a while to get used to itFeb 06 23:58
PetoKrausmainly for someone from the continentFeb 06 23:58
PetoKrausbut now i find riding in glasgow much safer than back home...Feb 06 23:58
PetoKrausthe drivers are used to it, the most arrogant being cabs... and driving on the left has it's advantages.Feb 06 23:59
PetoKraus*itsFeb 06 23:59

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