Bonum Certa Men Certa

Microsoft Product Manager: “Screw Sun, cross-platform will never work. Let's move on and steal the Java language.”

Summary: Microsoft speaks about "killing Sun's Java."

WE ARE STARTING to cover Java territories from the Comes vs Microsoft case, which Microsoft paid to settle, apparently with the condition that all this evidence will disappear. Today we offer the text version of Exhibit px_2768 (1997) [PDF], which shows Microsoft's treatment of cross-platform, Java, and competition in general. The full exhibit can be seen at the bottom (or the original PDF), but to give some pointers and highlights, see the following message from Prashant Sridharan, Microsoft's Visual J++ Product Manager:



If we, as a company, are interested in promoting Windows, why bother with AFC? In my own opinion (apart from Ironwood, J/Direct, or any of the other politically-charged topics now), we are horribly inconsistent in this regard.

Screw Sun, cross-platform will never work. Let's move on and steal the Java language.

That said, have we ever taken a look at how long it would take Microsoft to build a cross-platform Java that did work? Naturally, we would never do it, but it would give us some idea of how much time we have to work with in killing Sun's Java.


For readers' convenience, the context too is displayed in the full exhibit. This fits our analysis that Microsoft et al (and now Novell [1, 2, 3]) are essentially fighting against Java with their .NET infatuation (or Visual J++ prior to that). This is done unethically in Microsoft's case. It it also important to remind people how Microsoft really feels about Java now that Microsoft is invading Java conferences, pretending nothing negative was ever intended by Microsoft.




Appendix: Comes vs. Microsoft - exhibit px_2768, as text








PLAINTIFF'S EXHIBIT 2768 Comes v. Microsoft

From: Russ Arun Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 1997 6:13 PM To: Prashant Sridharan Subject: RE: More Questions about ADO in java...

Cross platform is a red herring that is not worth spending time on. Based all the numbers we see it is interestingly more irrelevant now than it was 5 years ago when I joined MS.

However we need to coopt the best lessons from Java into Windows.

-------- From: Prashant Sridharan Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 1997 6:07 PM To: Russ Arun Subhect: RE: More Questions about ADO in java...

If we, as a company, are interested in promoting Windows, why bother with AFC? In my own opinion (apart from Ironwood, J/Direct, or any of the other politically-charged topics now), we are horribly inconsistent in this regard.

Screw Sun, cross-platform will never work. Let's move on and steal the Java language.

That said, have we ever taken a look at how long it would take Microsoft to build a cross-platform Java that did work? Naturally, we would never do it, but it would give us some idea of how much time we have to work with in killing Sun's Java.

Prashant Sridharan Visual J++ Product Manager preshant@microsoft.com (425) 703-4682 http://www.mediacity.com/-heath

-----Original Message-----

From: Russ Arun Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 1997 5:29 PM To: Preshant Sridharan Subhect: RE: More Questions about ADO in java...

It is in Sun's interest to be cross platform. NT is eating share fast. So they are scrambling to find something and Java is their best hope. But for Java they would be in trouble.

-------- From: Preshant Sridharan Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 1997 5:25 PM To: Russ Arun Subject: RE: More Questions about ADO in java...

Agreed on x-plat. Screw Sun.

Of course, you and I probably have some old Sun buddies that would think otherwise :-)

Prashant Sridharan Visual J++ Product Manager preshant@microsoft.com (425) 703-4682 http://www.mediacity.com/-heath

MSS 0097798 CONFIDENTIAL

ATTORNEYS ONLY




-----Original Message----- From: Russ Arun Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 1997 5:23 PM To: Prashant Sridharan Subhect: RE: More Questions about ADO in java...

Don't care about cross platform in future - pretense or otherwise. AFC is the closest to this at this point.

Yes - we are shipping the Microsoft JDBC-ODBC bridge that came from Intersolv and supports JDBC.

-------- From: Prashant Sridharan Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 1997 5:12 PM To: Russ Arun Subject: RE: More Questions about ADO in java...

Russ,

I am now joining in this thread, so forgive the silly question. Are we not shipping JDBC at all with the SDK 2.0?

Do we have any pretense of cross-platform left? ;-)

Prashant Sridharan Visual J++ Product Manager preshant@microsoft.com (425) 703-4682 http://www.mediacity.com/-heath

-----Original Message----- From: Russ Arun Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 1997 5:09 PM To: Java Discussion Alias: Craig Longman (Excell Data Corporation) Subject: RE: More Questions about ADO in java...

In theory having both JDBC (the deprecated one) and MSJDBC (the Microsoft JDBC-ODBC bridge) is OK, but you will have spurious classes that I would worry about you relying on.

JDBC can be rid off by deleting JDBC.zip and any other muck should clear itself as part of the VM install.

-------- From: Craig Longman (Excell Data Corporation) Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 1997 4:59 PM To: Java Discussion Alias Subject: RE: More Questions about ADO in java...

>in the words of 'Russ Arun' >* JDBC.zip is not being shipped - so you relying on it is not good

Ahh. I just looked over the docs again, and I must admit I failed to notice the 'ms' in front of the jdbc.exe file to run. After running that, I get the Intersolv stuff installed just great, and everything is running fine.

Now if I can just figure out why multiple result sets in a single statement are not working correctly...

Does anyone know where I can report bugs on the jdbc-odbc bridge?

> - You might want to uninstall your VM and install the latest VM or IE

ATTORNEYS ONLY


of us to look forward to, no doubt.

>* There are examples in the SDK that might help you

Aside from the SimpleSelect.java that was changed to use MSs new naming conventions before they had the Intersolv which has the same naming conventions and can now use the standard sample, I couldn't find anything in the samples that helped in any way what-so-ever.

Cheers, and thanks for the help.

CraigL->Thx():

MSS 0097800 CONFIDENTIAL

ATTORNEYS ONLY



Credit: wallclimber

Recent Techrights' Posts

Microsoft XBox Having a "Dog Ate My Homework" Moment: No New Console Until 3 Years From Now... Because "RAM Prices"
Who will ever remember this in 2028? Nobody.
Gemini End of Year Capsules Tally (Based on Lupa) Shows About 10% Growth
What a difference a year makes
Dr. Andy Farnell Explains Why Chatbots Became Dishonesty on Top of Dishonesty (Hiding Usage of Dishonest Salads of Words)
new article from CyberShow
Jean-Slop Van Damme and the Art of Bull--- Code
it's saving neither time nor money
 
Ahead of 2026 Mass Layoffs at Microsoft the Tree Gets Shaken to See Who 'Falls' (Resigns/Retires)
"We had a quiet meeting last week about budget realignment. No one said layoffs, but it’s clear where the focus is shifting."
Almost 6,5000 Pages in 2025, Aiming Higher in 2026
if we can keep focused, then quantity will increase
Gemini Links 31/12/2025: New Resolution, Reverse Hexdump, and Programming Languages
Links for the day
Links 31/12/2025: Nvidia Faces Bubble-Bursting Moment, Saudi Oil Money Pumped Into Chatbots to Keep the Energy Waste Going (Circular Financing Again)
Links for the day
Richard Stallman's First Talk in a U.S. College Since 2018
Greetings from Georgia Tech!
EPO People Power - Part XX - Why António Campinos Chose to Put His Cokehead Friend on 'Sick Leave'
EPO Cocainegate will be covered for months to come
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Tuesday, December 30, 2025
IRC logs for Tuesday, December 30, 2025
Gemini Links 30/12/2025: FreeBSD, Gemlogs, and Xobaque
Links for the day
Get Ready for Gigantic XBox Layoffs at Microsoft (Much Bigger Than in 2025)
he unionisation drive is a sign workers already expect this
Concern Trolls: Stop Criticising Poor Gerstner Because Now He's Dead. Reality Check: Gerstner Has Found a Trick for Dodging Tax on His Hundreds of Millions in Wealth.
Maybe even billions in wealth
Samoa: GNU/Linux and ChromeOS Rose to Around 11%
based on Web access data from Samoa
DnD: Debian and Drugs
There will soon be some interesting new information about Debian
A Conundrum of Privacy/Surveillance: Will You Give Them a Stool Sample to "Feel Humane"?
What if skinnerboxes in South Korea also required that people provide urine and stool samples?
Nope, There's No Twitter "Successor"
There's a lot of horrible abuse going on in social control media
A Calm Year in IRC is a Good Year for IRC
Next year IRC will turn 38 (in August) and in 2028 it'll turn 40, just like the FSF did a couple of months ago
Slopfarms Covering Up for "Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella" After a Terrible Performance and a Terrible Year at Microsoft
How to cause many to resign/retire, hence not be counted as "layoffs"
IBM Was Never Saved, It Has Been a Downhill Journey for Decades Already
Gerstner wasn't a tech person but a fiscal butcher
Some GNU Joiners in Geminispace
Jose E. Marchesi (known for GNU poke and a bunch of other things) adopted Gemini Protocol
IBM Seems to be Doing to HashiCorp What It Did to Red Hat (Many Key People Leaving)
"Today marks my last day at HashiCorp, wrapping up an incredibly rewarding 5-year journey"
State of the Slop, Day 364
How does Phoronix feel about Google promoting slopfarms that 'rewrite' its stories and slap slop images on top?
Links 30/12/2025: "Durian Tsunami" and "Unneeded Surgeries"
Links for the day
Links 30/12/2025: Social Control Media Detox, Rage Against Slop Wasting People's Productive Capacities
Links for the day
Reality Check About IBM's Louis Grestner, Slopfarms Say He Was IBM CEO for 30 Years!
It is "hallucinating" (lying)
Debt as the New Currency?
Rich people get richer because they take money from the rest of us, if not directly then by compelling us (collectively) to borrow money at a national level, then "invest" in them
EPO People Power - Part XIX - "Berenguer Has Known of Campinos' Substance Abuse First Hand For a Long Time"
"You rightfully claimed that Berenguer is Campinos' protegee"
Gemini Links 30/12/2025: Quitting Coffee, Apartment by the Beach, and Strange Retail Ethics
Links for the day
Nintendo and Sony Outsold Microsoft XBox by 15:1!
The mass layoffs indicate Microsoft is aware of this
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Monday, December 29, 2025
IRC logs for Monday, December 29, 2025
Slopfarm: Firing 35,000 Employee is "Saving the Company"
"Big Blue" is getting smaller all the time
Slopfarms About the "Linux CEO" Linus Torvaldos [sic]
nowadays NVIDIA builds and helps build a giant Ponzi scheme
Vista 11 is "10" (Ten Percent)
Some months ago Microsoft openly admitted that it had lost (shed off) hundreds of millions of Windows users
Dealing With Online Pogroms
lawfare funded by third parties
The Year Apple Would Rather Forget
We await further stumbles and falls from Apple (in 2026)
"EU's reform agenda threatens to erase a decade of digital rights"
This is really sad for those of us who spent decades promoting and boosting/advocating the EU
IBM Layoffs in India, More Coming Soon, Say Apparent Insiders
Threads regarding IBM layoffs
Gemini Links 29/12/2025: Earlier "Happy New Year 2026" and "Dead Archivist Society"
Links for the day
Links 29/12/2025: Putin Critic Sergei Udaltsov Imprisoned, Cloudflare’s Outages Discussed
Links for the day
LLMs Are Inherently Parasitic, We Need to Treat Them Accordingly
a maintenance burden for those who possess actual intelligence
Links 29/12/2025: Bottled Water Considered Harmful, Cheetos Promoting Nazis in Europe
Links for the day
EPO People Power - Part XVIII - European Patent Office "Paints Itself as Progressive While Literally Being Represented by Cokeheads"
To what length/s will German authorities and media (not just in Germany) go to protect the EPO's "precious image"?
What IBM Will Do to Red Hat in the Coming Year or Years
This won't end up well for GNU/Linux as a whole
Not Turning in His Grave: When People Die, Their Corporate Destruction Becomes a "Turnaround"
All he did was mass layoffs - a tradition that has not ended since then
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Sunday, December 28, 2025
IRC logs for Sunday, December 28, 2025
Louis Gerstner Has Died, His Legacy of Mass Layoffs at IBM Hasn't
Hagiographies will follow. They will say he "saved" IBM.
Links 29/12/2025: The Sunday Routine, Limits of Memory, and Gemini Vocabulary
Links for the day