Bonum Certa Men Certa

Richard Stallman and Eben Moglen on the Microsoft-Red Hat Deal

Richard Stallman and Eben Moglen
Photo source: Professor Conrad Johnson



Summary: Founder of Free software and author of the GPL (respectively) comment on what Microsoft and Red Hat have done regarding patents

WE FINALLY GOT some feedback regarding the baffling patent agreement which seemingly affects every user of GNU/Linux. We got this feedback from Stallman and (indirectly) Moglen, two of the Free software world's most prominent individuals, especially when it comes to the GPL (GNU Public Licence/License).

Coverage of the Red Hat-Microsoft patent agreement can be found in [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13]. We sought feedback from Red Hat and spoke to low(er) level people for weeks, without ever hearing back from high-level management. After weeks of trying and waiting we ended up asking legal professionals to examine whatever legal contracts -- even if under NDA or some other secrecy clauses that legally-binding deals may have -- were involved. We first wrote to the FSF as follows:

Dear FSF licensing folks,

As discussed earlier in IRC (freenode), I have been pursuing answers from Red Hat regarding an urgent matter. I previously interviewed their CEO regarding patents and last week I spoke to a fairly senior person from Red Hat (unnamed for his own protection), for the third time this month. I wrote about 10 articles on this subject and it led to others writing about it as well, including some prominent bloggers.

"We need to understand what Red Hat agreed on with Microsoft on as Microsoft can use this behind closed doors against other companies, for pressure/leverage."To put it concisely, Red Hat signed a deal with Microsoft which not only involved technical work but also what they call patent "standstill". Who is this "standstill" for? Apparently Red Hat and its customers. I strongly doubt, especially in light of Alice v. CLS Bank, that a "standstill" should be needed. Red Hat does not threaten to sue Microsoft, whereas Microsoft did in the past threaten Red Hat (even publicly). This leaves those outside Red Hat in an awkward position and ever since this deal I have taken note of at least two companies being coerced by Microsoft using patents (over "Android" or "Linux" [sic]) or sued by one of its patent trolls, e.g. Intellectual Ventures. This isn't really a "standstill". It's more like the notorious "peace of mind" that Novell was after back in 2006.

Red Hat has also admitted to me that it is still pursuing some software patents in the USPTO -- a fact that does not surprising me, especially given the soaring market cap of RHT and the growing budget. This serves to contradict what people like Rob Tiller say to the courts; it shows double standards and no principled lead by example.

"The analysis and the voice of the FSF may be needed at this stage."I have asked the FSF's Joshua if it had looked into the patent agreement between Red Hat and Microsoft. Their lawyers in this case, Mr. Piana and Mr. Tiller (probably amongst others whom we don't know about yet), would probably claim and even insist that it's GPL-compatible, but the wording in the FAQ make it look exclusionary and there's no transparency, so one cannot verify these claims.

We need to understand what Red Hat agreed on with Microsoft on as Microsoft can use this behind closed doors against other companies, for pressure/leverage. I am genuinely worried and fellow journalists who focus on GNU/Linux (Sean Michael Kerner for instance) tell me that they are too.

The analysis and the voice of the FSF may be needed at this stage. I have politely urged Red Hat for a number of weeks to become more transparent, whereupon some in the company said they had escalated these requests, but evidently nothing is being done, hence I feel the need to turn to the FSF.

I would gladly provide additional information that I have upon request.

With kind regards,



"In concrete terms," Stallman responded, "what did they agree to do?"

"It is effectively a technical collaboration," I told him, "which also involves a ceasefire regarding patents."

"It is impossible to discuss whether it is good or bad," he said, "until we know what it is."

"We know too little about the patent aspects," I explained.

Referring to Red Hat's FAQ, Stallman said that I "seem[ed] to be talking about text I [Stallman] have not seen."

To quote the relevant part for readers:

4. Does the new partnership address patents?

Red Hat and Microsoft have agreed to a limited patent arrangement in connection with the commercial partnership for the benefit of mutual customers.

The heart of the arrangement is a patent standstill that provides that neither company will pursue a patent lawsuit or claim against the other or its customers, while we are partnering. Neither company acknowledged the validity or enforceability of the other’s intellectual property; it is not a patent license or a covenant not to sue and no payment was made or will be made for intellectual property.

The partnership is between commercial companies related to their common customer offerings, spurred by customer demand. Both parties carefully designed for FOSS licensing compliance in building the arrangement and each party’s relationship to the FOSS community stands on its own.


"Covering only customers and not downstream users," Stallman said, "it is not a good thing, but it may not do a lot of harm."

“Covering only customers and not downstream users is not a good thing, but it may not do a lot of harm.”
      --Richard Stallman
I responded by saying "I hope that a thorough look into it will help remove uncertainty and get some hard answers. Right now it's too vague or me and some fellow developers to conclude anything from."

Days ago I asked whether "there been any progress on this case" because "I just want[ed] to be sure that licensing is looking for answers regarding the matter."

Stallman, by that stage, seemed to have already spoken to a colleague and friend. "Eben Moglen," he explained, "told me it doesn't violate GPLv3. Other than getting that information, I don't know what progress we could hope for."

Well, as GPLv3 co-authors, their take on this sure counts. We therefore got an answer without taking a look at the contract itself (they had made access to it highly privileged information).

Assuming the case won't go any further than this, we believe it helps set the record straight on the Microsoft-Red Hat situation.

Recent Techrights' Posts

Frans Pop suicide and Ubuntu grievances
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
Workers' Right to Disconnect Won't Matter If Such a Right Isn't Properly Enforced
I was always "on-call" and my main role or function was being "on-call" in case of incidents
A Discussion About Suicides in Science and Technology (Including Debian and the European Patent Office)
In Debian, there is a long history of deaths, suicides, and mysterious disappearances
Federal News Network is Corrupt, It Runs Propaganda Pieces for Microsoft
Federal News Network used to be OK some years ago
Hard Evidence Reinforces Suspicion That Mark Shuttleworth May Have Worked Volunteers to Death
Today we start re-publishing articles that contain unaltered E-mails
 
[Meme] Sometimes Torvalds and RMS Agree on Things
hype around chatbots
[Video] Linus Torvalds on 'Hilarious' AI Hype: "I Hate the Hype" and "I Don't Want to be Part of the Hype", "You Need to Be a Bit Cynical About This Whole Hype Cycle"
Linus Torvalds on LLMs
Colin Watson, Steve McIntyre & Debian, Ubuntu cover-up mission after Frans Pop suicide
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
Links 30/04/2024: Wireless Carriers Selling Customer Location Data, Facebook Posts Causing Trouble
Links for the day
Links 30/04/2024: More Google Layoffs (Wide-Ranging)
Links for the day
Fresh Rumours of Impending Mass Layoffs at IBM Red Hat
"IBM filed a W.A.R.N with the state of North Carolina. That only means one thing."
Mark Shuttleworth's (MS's) Canonical is Promoting Microsoft This Week (Surveillance Slanted as 'Confidential')
Who runs Canonical these days? Why does Canonical help sell Windows?
What Mark Shuttleworth and Canonical Can to Remedy the Damage Done to Frans Pop's Family
Mr. Shuttleworth and Canonical as a company can at the very least apologise for putting undue pressure
Amnesty International & Debian Day suicides comparison
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
[Meme] A Way to Get No Real Work Done
Walter White looking at phone: Your changes could not be saved to device
Modern Measures of 'Productivity' Boil Down to Time Wasting and Misguided Measurements/Yardsticks
People are forgetting the value of nature and other human beings
Countries That Beat the United States at RSF's World Press Freedom Index (After US Plunged Some More)
The United States (US) was 17 when these rankings started in 2002
Record Productivity and Preserving People's Past on the Net
We're very productive these days, partly owing to online news slowing down (less time spent on curating Daily Links)
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Monday, April 29, 2024
IRC logs for Monday, April 29, 2024
Links 30/04/2024: Malaysian and Russian Governments Crack Down on Journalists
Links for the day
Frans Pop Debian Day suicide, Ubuntu, Google and the DEP-5 machine-readable copyright file
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
Axel Beckert (ETH Zurich), the mentality of sexual violence on campus
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
[Meme] Russian Reversal
Mark Shuttleworth: In Soviet Russia's spacecraft... Man exploits peasants
Frans Pop & Debian suicide denial
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
The Real Threats to Society Include Software Patents and the Corporations That Promote Them
The OIN issue isn't a new one and many recognise this by now
Links 30/04/2024: OpenBSD and Enterprise Cloaking Device
Links for the day
Microsoft Still Owes Over 100 Billion Dollars and It Cannot be Paid Back Using 'Goodwill'
Meanwhile, Microsoft's cash at hand (in the bank) nearly halved in the past year.
[Teaser] Ubuntu Cover-up After Death
Attack the messenger
The Cyber Show Explains What CCTV is About
CCTV does not typically resolve crime
[Video] Ignore Buzzwords and Pay Attention to Attacks on Software Developers
AI in the Machine Learning sense is nothing new
Outline of Themes to Cover in the Coming Weeks
We're accelerating coverage and increasing focus on suppressed topics
[Video] Not Everyone Claiming to Protect the Vulnerable is Being Honest
"Diversity" bursaries aren't always what they seem to be
[Video] Enshittification of the Media, of the Web, and of Computing in General
It manifests itself in altered conditions and expectations
[Meme] Write Code 100% of the Time
IBM: Produce code for us till we buy the community... And never use "bad words" like "master" and "slave" (pioneered by IBM itself in the computing context)
[Video] How Much Will It Take for Most People to Realise "Open Source" Became Just Openwashing (Proprietary Giants Exploiting Cost-Free or Unpaid 'Human Resources')?
turning "Open Source" into proprietary software
Freedom of Speech... Let's Ban All Software Freedom Speeches?
There's a moral panic over people trying to actually control their computing
Richard Stallman's Talk in Spain Canceled (at Short Notice)
So it seems to have been canceled very fast
Links 29/04/2024: "AI" Hype Deflated, Economies Slow Down Further
Links for the day
Gemini Links 29/04/2024: Gopher Experiment and Profectus Alpha 0.9
Links for the day
[Video] Why Microsoft is by Far the Biggest Foe of Computer Security (Clue: It Profits From Security Failings)
Microsoft is infiltrating policy-making bodies, ensuring real security is never pursued
Debian 'Cabal' (via SPI) Tried to Silence or 'Cancel' Daniel Pocock at DNS Level. It Didn't Work. It Backfired as the Material Received Even More Visibility.
know the truth about modern slavery
Lucas Nussbaum & Debian attempted exploit of OVH Hosting insider
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
Software in the Public Interest (SPI) is Not a Friend of Freedom
We'll shortly reproduce two older articles from disguised.work
Harassment Against My Wife Continues
Drug addict versus family of Techrights authors
Syria, John Lennon & Debian WIPO panel appointed
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Sunday, April 28, 2024
IRC logs for Sunday, April 28, 2024
[Video] GNU and Linux Everywhere (Except by Name)
In a sense, Linux already has over 50% of the world's "OS" market
[Video] Canonical Isn't (No Longer) Serious About Making GNU/Linux Succeed in Desktops/Laptops
Some of the notorious (or "controversial") policies of Canonical have been covered here for years
[Video] What We've Learned About Debian From Emeritus Debian Developer Daniel Pocock
pressure had been put on us (by Debian people and their employer/s) and as a result we did not republish Debian material for a number of years
Bruce Perens & Debian public domain trademark promise
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
Links 28/04/2024: Shareholders Worry "AI" Hype Brings No Income, Money Down the Drain
Links for the day
Lawyer won't lie for Molly de Blanc & Chris Lamb (mollamby)
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Saturday, April 27, 2024
IRC logs for Saturday, April 27, 2024