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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: March 7th, 2009 - Part 1


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schestowitzamarsh04: JIT: Free 3D Video Drivers needed to spread the Linux Desktop  < >Mar 07 00:00
amarsh04at last, someone posts such an article? thanks, schestowitzMar 07 00:01
amarsh04has linuxtoday linked to that article, schestowitz, if not, I'll submit itMar 07 00:04
schestowitzNo-one had.Mar 07 00:06
schestowitz*hasMar 07 00:06
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schestowitzAmber is a self-proclaimed average mom, which means that she juggles many tasks and has a limited amount of time and patience at the end of the day. Her husband works at Canonical (and used to work for Red Hat), but she wanted to move from her Mac and try out Linux without his help. 07 00:08
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MinceRshe fails at biology though :>Mar 07 00:11
MinceRmost of the arthropods she mentions as "bugs" aren'tMar 07 00:11
schestowitzCitrix ruined Xen. "Aside from the annoying requirement of a Windows management box, is there any other reason not to embrace this? I'd be worried about divergence and lock-in: will Citrix keep up with the Xen project or will they lag behind because of the need to keep their hooks in place? On the other hand, is it possible for Citrix Xen to leap ahead of the Xen project in features? "Mar 07 00:12
amarsh04"Free 3D Video Drivers needed to spread the Linux Desktop" submitted to schestowitzMar 07 00:16
amarsh04a centipede isn't an arthropod, it's a chilopodMar 07 00:17
schestowitzScroll down to "think correctly" 07 00:18
schestowitzamarsh04: thanks!Mar 07 00:19
MinceRchilopoda is a class inside the phylum of arthropodaMar 07 00:20
MinceRso centipedes are arthropods too :>Mar 07 00:20
MinceRpft... bsdMar 07 00:20
schestowitzJobs took BSD and thought "differently" from "correctly"Mar 07 00:22
schestowitzInhibit, not shareMar 07 00:22
amarsh04ok, I stand corrected MineRMar 07 00:23
amarsh04my mum was a zoologist, but mainly to do with marsupials and lepidopteraMar 07 00:24
Balrogreally 'inhibit'? They do share the kernel ......Mar 07 00:27
Balrogand driverMar 07 00:27
Balrogdrivers *Mar 07 00:28
amarsh04Wikipedia explains it well 07 00:29
Balrogand it's not all bsd...the majority it CMU Mach and NEXTSTEP code (well, brought up to date)Mar 07 00:29
schestowitzMicrosoft  is collapsing these days, thus it's suing. Mar 07 00:31
schestowitzI found several articles about migrations to FOSS and SaaS (pay by watching ads)Mar 07 00:31
schestowitzWatch Wall Street today. Google's value almost exceeds Microsoft's now. Vista 7 will not be enough because people don't buy new PCs.Mar 07 00:31
schestowitzMicrosoft waited with the FAT dog until now... it's hurting and it shows..Mar 07 00:31
Balrogbut now should be too lateMar 07 00:32
BalrogI thought that in the US if you don't enforce your 'IP' from the start, you lose the right to enforce your IPMar 07 00:32
schestowitzBilski is the real pain to themMar 07 00:32
schestowitzUnless they overrule this decision (I believe an appeal is in the making), then they rely on exhausting the sued party. They chose a victim near bankruptcy on puroposeMar 07 00:33
Balrogyeah.Mar 07 00:33
BalrogTom-Tom said they are prepared to fightMar 07 00:33
schestowitzGoogle is broken againMar 07 00:34
schestowitzGoogle Groups drops all sorts of symbols from results (for all messages)Mar 07 00:34
schestowitzBalrog: yes, they are (which is great news)Mar 07 00:34
Balrogurl?Mar 07 00:34
schestowitzThey receive loads of good publicityMar 07 00:34
Balrogyes, and publicity for MS is badMar 07 00:34
Balrogthe public opinion of MS will probably dropMar 07 00:35
schestowitzIt already does. I saw examplesMar 07 00:36
schestowitzPeople in servers arena run bothMar 07 00:36
schestowitzAnd they see the dog barking at their cat in the (servers) farmMar 07 00:36
BalroghehMar 07 00:43
trmancohahaMar 07 01:01
trmancoMozilla responds do the Secunia crappy report -> 07 01:01
schestowitzLots of good news for Linux today. I post to COLA now.Mar 07 01:02
Balrogrumor site, but there may be something to it:Mar 07 01:02
trmancoschestowitz, do you ever sleep? :-PMar 07 01:02
schestowitzYes, I'll sleep at around 5Mar 07 01:02
Balrog 07 01:02
trmancountil what? 9?Mar 07 01:02
schestowitztrmanco: 07 01:03
schestowitzProbably 11Mar 07 01:03
trmanco:DMar 07 01:03
trmancoAh, okMar 07 01:03
trmancoBalrog, Gayzelle is going to replace that junkMar 07 01:04
BalrogI hearMar 07 01:04
trmancohmm...Mar 07 01:04
MinceRgnMar 07 01:04
Balrogprobably it will be vaporware thoughMar 07 01:04
Balroglike IE 6 for MacMar 07 01:05
schestowitzThat's malware, no?Mar 07 01:06
Balrogno, it never came outMar 07 01:06
Balrog(IE 6 / Mac)Mar 07 01:06
Balrogthey cancelled it shortly after Apple started safariMar 07 01:06
schestowitzBut it was still mal-wareMar 07 01:07
Balrogyou mean IE 5?Mar 07 01:07
trmanco 07 01:07
Balrogsecunia is known to favor MS products in their reportsMar 07 01:08
trmancowho doesn't?Mar 07 01:09
Balrogwell, the antivirus companies do, as they want to sell more AV softwareMar 07 01:09
Balrog(and they want to sell it to people who run Linux / UNIX-based OS and don't really need it.)Mar 07 01:09
schestowitzBalrog: I think I had IE5 on the Mac at workMar 07 01:10
schestowitzAnd NetscapeMar 07 01:10
Balroglike our school forces mac users to install symantec (a piece of junk)Mar 07 01:10
schestowitzBalrog: yesMar 07 01:11
schestowitzSee secunia at BNMar 07 01:11
Balrogschestowitz: IE 5 for mac worked OK ... probably because it didn't use TridentMar 07 01:11
BalrogNetscape 4.x was slow and clunky, by the last days of OS 9Mar 07 01:11
trmancothey have "Scan your PC" on the frontpage, let me click irMar 07 01:11
trmancoit*Mar 07 01:11
BalrogIE at least worked reasonablyMar 07 01:11
BalrogActiveX contol, trmanco, probablyMar 07 01:12
trmancoit's a javaappletMar 07 01:12
Balrogew.Mar 07 01:12
Balrogthat's also a possibilityMar 07 01:12
schestowitzOld news: Secunia hates Linux: 07 01:12
schestowitzI already have them here: 07 01:13
Balrogi.e. there are no known Mac viruses in the wild (and a handful of malware/trojan apps), and no Linux viruses in the wild (yes there are like 100 that don't work anymore)Mar 07 01:14
Balrogso why put an antivirus on a Mac or Linux system?Mar 07 01:14
Balrog(unless you're running a mail or a file server...)Mar 07 01:14
schestowitzFear of the unknownMar 07 01:16
schestowitzBecause there /might/ be riskMar 07 01:16
schestowitzNot because there /is/Mar 07 01:16
Balrogan antivirus won't protect you from the unknownMar 07 01:16
schestowitzPlug in an unpatched XP box to broadband. See how far it getsMar 07 01:17
schestowitzBalrog: exactlyMar 07 01:17
Balrogand there are these people that insist that Linux / Mac is much less secure than Windows, because MS releases more patches.Mar 07 01:17
schestowitzBalrog: I want to hear about the risk NOWMar 07 01:17
schestowitzBalrog: tell me about the EVIL LUNIX exploit that threatens to swallow all our boxesMar 07 01:17
BalroghehMar 07 01:17
BalrogI don't see anyMar 07 01:18
Balrogwhat I do hear is that open services and incorrect permissions cause problemsMar 07 01:18
Balrogbut an AV won't help with that...Mar 07 01:18
trmancoWindows doesn't have proper filesystem permissionsMar 07 01:19
Balrogsure it doesn'tMar 07 01:19
BalrogNTFS tries thoughMar 07 01:19
Balrogit did pass C2 for a while (with NT4)Mar 07 01:19
trmancoits a pile a shit compared to *nix based systemsMar 07 01:19
BalrogWin2k had C2 withdrawnMar 07 01:19
trmancowhat is that?Mar 07 01:20
BalrogThe main difference is that NTFS implements ACL's directly.Mar 07 01:20
trmancosime kind of an american security control mesure?Mar 07 01:20
Balrogyes, a DoD classificationMar 07 01:20
Balrog 07 01:20
trmancomeasure *Mar 07 01:20
BalrogSELinux does all that and moreMar 07 01:21
trmancoahh, that, I've heard of that before... it's phonyMar 07 01:21
Balrognot totallyMar 07 01:22
trmancowhat do I and 98% of Linux users care about that?Mar 07 01:22
Balrogthe u+g+o permissions in Unix is rather weakMar 07 01:22
Balrogbut that's why we have ACL'sMar 07 01:22
trmancobut what about no permission capability at all?Mar 07 01:23
Balrognow that's horribleMar 07 01:23
BalrogFAT is like thatMar 07 01:23
BalrogWindows is configured like that by defaultMar 07 01:23
trmancosounds creepyMar 07 01:23
trmancoit's also configured with a series a clicks and EULA filesMar 07 01:24
BalrogI'm not supporting windows here ... just stating that their implementation of permissions at the FS level is a decent attempt.Mar 07 01:24
schestowitzPermissions are 'bolted on' in WindowsMar 07 01:24
Balrogbut one thing they missed was the execute bitMar 07 01:24
schestowitzTheir FS is very oldMar 07 01:24
Balrogaren't permissions part of NTFS?Mar 07 01:24
schestowitzThey haven't prioritised making it newMar 07 01:24
schestowitzWinFS collapsedMar 07 01:24
schestowitzSo since WinXP days they have stayed with a very old, flaky FSMar 07 01:25
schestowitzJust promises... now Vista becomes Vista7, which means just evolutionary change... new wallpaper and all.Mar 07 01:25
Balrogwell it's not as flaky as FAT.Mar 07 01:25
schestowitzFAT is fatMar 07 01:25
trmancoand a more anyinMar 07 01:25
Balrogby the way, NTFS wasn't even original from MSMar 07 01:26
schestowitzWelcome to INNOVA~1Mar 07 01:26
Balrogthey based much of it on HPFSMar 07 01:26
schestowitzwhere having long names is 'too' modernMar 07 01:26
trmancoand a more annoying UACMar 07 01:26
schestowitzThey need to kick itMar 07 01:26
BalroghehMar 07 01:26
schestowitzBut they won'tMar 07 01:26
schestowitzToo arrogantMar 07 01:26
Balrogwhat about all the others who did that?Mar 07 01:26
BalrogMS wasn't the first.Mar 07 01:27
schestowitzTook them like 15 years to kill bloody ClippyMar 07 01:27
schestowitzPeople have complained about it for centuries. Mar 07 01:27
schestowitzIt takes guts to admit a mistakeMar 07 01:27
trmancoclippy didn't dieMar 07 01:27
schestowitzClippy is ONE son of a BOBMar 07 01:28
Balrogclippy is patented, right.Mar 07 01:28
trmancoit still in bloat office 2007 somewhere, AFAIKMar 07 01:28
schestowitz 07 01:28
schestowitzThe remnants of a bad ideaMar 07 01:28
trmanco"Despite its ambitious nature, Bob was one of Microsoft's more visible product failures. "Mar 07 01:28
trmancoha, the person who gave bill this idea probably got fired and silently suedMar 07 01:29
trmancooh wait, there is moreMar 07 01:29
trmancolooks like the monkey named itMar 07 01:29
trmancointeresting, the person behind bob was his girlfriendMar 07 01:31
trmancowife at the momentMar 07 01:33
trmancoI don't remember using this on W3.1 or 95Mar 07 01:33
schestowitzSilently sued?Mar 07 01:34
schestowitzHow come?Mar 07 01:34
BalrogIt was around.Mar 07 01:34
BalrogI used to see itMar 07 01:35
Balrogbut it was a totally dismal failureMar 07 01:35
trmancothat was just me thinking (and typing) out loudMar 07 01:36
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schestowitz"I have been watching GOOG's market cap compared to MSFT's for some time now, and rejoiced when GOOG crossed the $100 b market cap barrier separating it from MSFT.  Today the spread between GOOG and MSFT is only $28 b.  However, not being a mathematician, I am not sure of the significance of 28 on a market cap of only $97 b for GOOG and $135 b for MSFT versus their earlier positions. "Mar 07 02:21
twitterSlam a bamma, they hit $13.31 today.  I don't think they've been there since 1997.Mar 07 02:37
twitterha haMar 07 02:37
twitterthat would give them a market cap of 118 B.  Notice that Google is still hanging in there at about 50% of it's 2008 max of $700 while M$ is around 25% of it's Y2K price of $58.Mar 07 02:41
schestowitz$13.31????/Mar 07 02:41
schestowitzI can't see that in the intra-day chart.Mar 07 02:42
schestowitzA friend wrote to me to say: "GOOG has lost half of its value from its high in 2005 and the same for Microsoft from its high in April 2008.  MSFT has actually lost more relative and absolute value than has GOOG in the last 12 mos or so, which is is contrary to common sense, because GOOG is a "growth" stock and MSFT is a "value" stock."Mar 07 02:42
twitterI don't see it on the chart either, but Google reports it as the today's low and their new 52 week low. 07 02:42
schestowitz"So it would appear that GOOG is weathering the downturn better than is MSFT.  It would also appear that even by relative standards, GOOG is closing in on MSFT, since GOOG has lost less value.  I think that is due to the fact that MSFT's investors are seeing that MSFT has not addressed the issue of cloud computing as well as has GOOG, which is all about the cloud. "Mar 07 02:42
schestowitz"The cloud is still relatively foreign territory for MSFT, which is not as good as monetizing the cloud as is GOOG.  GOOG is actually monetizing cloud apps in the form of Google Docs, and MSFT really is still trying to figure out Software plus services, as opposed to SaaS, which GOOG is really good at."Mar 07 02:42
schestowitz"MSFT is really good at dividing the FOSS community just by associating with them, as in the case of Novell, or by suing one of them, as it is doing with TomTom."Mar 07 02:43
schestowitz"Of course, the latter situation depends on how the court, the jury, and the parties behave throughout this trial.  If TomTom survives as a standalone company, it will be really tough sledding for MSFT and its bogus patents, especially in the wake of In re Bilski, which I think most people recognize weakens MSFT's patent portfolio."Mar 07 02:43
schestowitzThere was a long discussion about it.. maybe another day..Mar 07 02:43
schestowitz"Well, at least the general media is now talking about open source.  Now if we could just get them to talk about Free Software.  Sure it might be negative coverage, and negative coverage is not as good as positive coverage, but Microsoft has really bet the farm on this case, due to the publicity it is getting.  Here is what that article says about FAT: 07 02:44
schestowitzl "Mar 07 02:44
schestowitz 07 02:44
twitterM$'s little rebound late in the day is just M$ buying stocks back.  If it ware not for that, they would have closed at less than $15.  They are close enough to 25% value for it not to matter.Mar 07 02:47
twitterBasically, M$ is through.Mar 07 02:47
twitterGoogle has kicked their ass on the web and broken M$'s silly non standards web initiative.  Google has also taken a bite out of M$'s Office revenue.  GNU/Linux has sapped M$'s Windows revenue, and Vista has cemented M$'s reputation as greedy, broken and not worth having.Mar 07 02:49
twitterWorse than that, anyone can do what Google and GNU/Linux vendors have.  M$ is now totally dependent on patent litigation for survival and that is a bad bet.Mar 07 02:50
twitter:) happy timesMar 07 02:56
schestowitzYes.Mar 07 02:57
schestowitzWait until daily linksMar 07 02:57
schestowitzLots of goodiesMar 07 02:57
twittercoolMar 07 03:33
schestowitzWatch Firefox and how they manage to make money. Some people explore business models in the wrong place....Mar 07 03:33
schestowitz (Leif Pagrotsky on the Swedish Economy)Mar 07 03:33
*schestowitz watches 07 03:42
schestowitzHehe. 07 03:59
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twitterbad audio quality on that boulevardMar 07 04:11
twitterrm BoulevardofBrokenDreams.mp4Mar 07 04:12
twitterbill buckly?  He's dead isn't he?Mar 07 04:13
schestowitzYesMar 07 04:14
schestowitzHe regrets the Vietnam warMar 07 04:14
schestowitzHe also admits the government fooled himMar 07 04:14
schestowitzThey fed journalists liesMar 07 04:14
schestowitzIraq is Vietnam 2.0Mar 07 04:15
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twitterWow!Mar 07 04:16
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twitterI reject the premise that civil rights protests were peaceful and anti-war protests were violent.  That's a silly and sweeping statement.Mar 07 04:18
twitter"masturbatory relief"  ha haMar 07 04:20
schestowitzViolent against violence of death?Mar 07 04:21
twitterThat's what they say up front.  Protests of all sorts can turn violent.  The generalization makes little sense to me.  We've all see pictures of dogs biting protesters and people being fire hosed, beaten and arrested.Mar 07 04:23
twitterI missed the part where Buckley says he changed his mind about the Vietnam war.Mar 07 04:24
twitterha ha, 07 04:26
twitter"Buckley's views changed on some issues, such as drug legalization, which he came to favor.[64] In his December 3, 2007 column, Buckley advocated banning tobacco use in America."Mar 07 04:27
twitterThink of that the next time someone bashes RMS for talking about legalizing drugs.Mar 07 04:27
twitter"Buckley believed the movement he made had destroyed itself by supporting the war in Iraq" duhMar 07 04:28
twitter" At the time of his death, he had been suffering from emphysema ..."  No wonder he ended up hating tobacco.Mar 07 04:30
schestowitzMany people I know died from smoking, family too.Mar 07 04:32
schestowitzSmoking makes life shorter, by design.Mar 07 04:33
twitterIt is an evil that is also going away but not fast enough.Mar 07 04:34
twittergood nightMar 07 04:35
schestowitzwilliam buckley threatens to punch chomsky in the face < >. He's so pretentious.Mar 07 04:38
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amarsh04I first heard of Noam Chomsky through Chomsky grammars in computer science classesMar 07 04:40
schestowitzSame here.Mar 07 04:40
schestowitzOff I go now (5am)Mar 07 04:40
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Omar871Hey guys.Mar 07 06:18
Omar871Did you see the video about MS's 2019 future vision. :)Mar 07 06:18
Omar871?Mar 07 06:18
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Omar871 07 06:20
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Omar871What more than halucination would you expect from Microsoft.Mar 07 06:21
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Omar871trmanco: Did you see this? 07 06:23
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Omar871schestowitz: Did you watch this? 07 06:24
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PetoKrauslemmezee...Mar 07 08:37
PetoKrausnowMar 07 08:41
PetoKrausthat's linux running on these PC\sMar 07 08:41
PetoKrausKDE4, ain't itMar 07 08:41
PetoKrausbrbMar 07 08:46
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trmancoOmar871, do you really think microsoft alone can do that?Mar 07 09:38
trmancoI've never seen the videoMar 07 09:38
trmancoairplanes with Windows, oh noesMar 07 09:39
schestowitzOmar871: it's like the Longhoen bullshit.Mar 07 10:45
schestowitzThew world heads into a crisis and Microsoft does films while it's entering debt. Hilarious.Mar 07 10:46
schestowitzFanbois will abandon iPhone for Palm, says Wikisugardaddy 07 11:09
schestowitzWTF?? "Sponsored Post: Event: Microsoft and Open Source…" 07 11:11
schestowitzIt says bull: "Over the past four years, Microsoft has had an entire team, led by open source guru Sam Ramji, diligently working on ways for open source developers to take advantages of the benefits that Microsoft"Mar 07 11:12
schestowitzA friend of mine who I think met the prick wrote yesterday: "The article linked above states that Microsoft has paid a huge price in bringing this case.  The cost?  a failed ability to send Sam Ramji around trying to kiss ass with everyone in the FOSS community. "Mar 07 11:13
schestowitz"Now people in the FOSS community will once again be reminded of Microsoft's true nature.  I must say that I dislike Sam Ramji, or at least the role that he plays.  He is such a traitor, a sneak thief, a provocateur, a spy, an infiltrator. "Mar 07 11:13
schestowitz"Also, I find myself becoming increasingly angry at Novell.  I am starting to wonder if I really misunderstood the nature of the Novell - Microsoft deal.  I have long thought of it as Microsoft purchasing ice in the winter from Novell."Mar 07 11:13
schestowitz"Novell denied Microsoft had patent claims, but said sure, I will accept money from you to enter into a deal for sharing sales contacts with customers who were pissed of at the pissing match between Microsoft and Linux."Mar 07 11:13
schestowitz"But I once ran into Jeremy Allison at Google after Jeremy had quit Novell and moved to Google.  Jeremy said that there were things about the Microsoft - Novell deal that he could not tell me or anyone.  He said that it would eventually become public."Mar 07 11:14
schestowitz"Now Jeremy is saying publicly that the TomTom deal is disclosing that Microsoft is using its secret patent licensing deals as a way to attack the GPL by getting Linux vendors to violate the GPL.  It appears that there are things in the NDAs signed by companies negotiating the patent deals with Microsoft that violate the GPL.  I haven't look into it, so I don't know the specifics."Mar 07 11:14
schestowitzMicrosoft = the lawyers company...Mar 07 11:15
schestowitz"If that is true, this TomTom suit could be very bad for Novell, because it could once again dredge up questions about Novell's good standing in the FOSS community.  I for one am going to be watching this case as closely as my limited time allows."Mar 07 11:15
schestowitz9/11 widows ask for investigation: 07 11:19
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oiaohmHaving a good day schestowitz last time I was in here I got a little off topic sorry for that.Mar 07 11:30
schestowitzNo, I enjoyed reading it.Mar 07 11:31
schestowitzjose tried finding you last nightMar 07 11:31
schestowitzHe wanted to thank you.Mar 07 11:31
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oiaohmLast night after work stuffed.Mar 07 11:33
oiaohmSo bad infact I don't remember going to bed.Mar 07 11:33
oiaohmI have already had 2 hours sleep after today.Mar 07 11:33
oiaohmI really hate it jobs at times.Mar 07 11:34
oiaohmAny idea what time zone jose is in.Mar 07 11:35
schestowitzFloridaMar 07 11:35
oiaohmI am in AustraliaMar 07 11:36
oiaohmso syncing up is going to be interesting.Mar 07 11:36
oiaohmLOL 6.44 AM there and its 9.44 pm hereMar 07 11:37
schestowitzNocturnals down underMar 07 11:38
oiaohmI guess you saw why some Microsoft fans muck me up at time for a Linux Hater.Mar 07 11:38
oiaohmI know the defects of Linux far too well.Mar 07 11:39
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oiaohmThey get upset because I know the defects of Windows equally well.Mar 07 11:39
schestowitzAnd Mac..?Mar 07 11:49
oiaohmMac don't have one to fully rip to bits.Mar 07 11:50
oiaohmCan do some decent hate on Mac just not complete cost kinda cuts me out from getting full data.Mar 07 11:51
schestowitzIs it true that Mono employees (Novell) all work from the US or at least centred there?Mar 07 11:51
schestowitzSomeone said yesterday that SUSE employees need cleansing before going to Red HatMar 07 11:51
schestowitzBut I don't think they EVER likes the MS deal.Mar 07 11:52
schestowitzThey just worked for the man, for a paycheck.Mar 07 11:52
schestowitzOh, and for Geeko.Mar 07 11:52
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schestowitzoiaohm: if you do a Machater blog, yoi'll get lots of attention, guaranteedMar 07 11:52
schestowitzLook at how a certain loser pretended to be Steve Jobs. He had those fans running over.Mar 07 11:53
oiaohmAt least steve jobs was a true programmer at the head of the company.Mar 07 11:53
oiaohmThe guy who taken over really has huge shoes to fill.Mar 07 11:54
schestowitzDid he study something at higher education?Mar 07 11:56
*schestowitz can't recall his biographyMar 07 11:56
oiaohm 07 11:59
oiaohmWay better programmer history than Bill Gates kinda explains why Mac OS's at least work most of the time.Mar 07 11:59
schestowitz"'Unfortunately, Bill Gates is not a wizard. Even worse, he is a bad programmer. When Martin Eller, a Microsoft programmer, found an error in the flood fill routine of the MS-Basic interpreter, he exclaimed "Which moron wrote this brainless sh*t?" only to find out it was Gates himself who wrote the "brainless sh*t". I think it is safe to say that Bill Gates is hardly the technical wizard he would so much like to be.'"Mar 07 12:04
schestowitz 07 12:05
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oiaohmYepMar 07 12:06
schestowitzHe's a lawyerMar 07 12:07
schestowitzStill isMar 07 12:07
schestowitzAnd his dad is corrupting the system along with himMar 07 12:07
schestowitzNot they pretend to be philanthropists.Mar 07 12:07
schestowitzTo them, computers were just means for controlling the worldMar 07 12:08
schestowitzIn the 90s (or late 80s), Gates told a computer magazine that he intended to take over the world.Mar 07 12:08
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oiaohm"Nokia also believes that a party should not enjoy use of Nokia's patents and at the same time threaten the development of the Linux kernel by assertion of its own patents. Therefore, Nokia's commitment shall not apply with regard to any party asserting its patents against any Linux kernel," the company said in a statement.   Hmm now where is the raw statement 07 12:18
Omar871Guys, don't you find it hilarious that the company with the most two bloated products on earth, Zune and Surface (Or three, if you count Windows), is now making halucinational vidz about what's it gonna look like in 2019??Mar 07 12:19
oiaohmMS is a dieing company if they don't change there ways.Mar 07 12:20
oiaohmSurface I would not make too much fun of.   MPX that will allow Linuxs to do the same thing is slowly going into mainline of x.orgMar 07 12:22
schestowitzOmar871: where is the video from?Mar 07 12:26
schestowitzIs it part of the Innovation Day propaganda?Mar 07 12:26
Omar871Youtube.Mar 07 12:26
schestowitzThey try to influence (corrupt) politicians.Mar 07 12:26
Omar871I'm not sure.Mar 07 12:26
schestowitzWhen is it from?Mar 07 12:26
schestowitzThey are a dying companyMar 07 12:26
schestowitzThey try to sell the story that they invest everything (well, they mostly steal, even from Apple), so that they can have software patentsMar 07 12:27
schestowitzThey sell dreamsMar 07 12:27
schestowitzMaybe they should fix their broken software rtaher than make short filmsMar 07 12:27
schestowitzIt's like the Mac ad with fixing VistaMar 07 12:27
Omar871schestowitz: As stated on Youtube, it's fresh (March 03, 2009)Mar 07 12:27
schestowitz"some money for fixing Vista... lots for making more videos about it"Mar 07 12:27
schestowitzOmar871: bingo. That would be itMar 07 12:27
schestowitzThey must have made some propaganda for EU brainwash dayMar 07 12:28
schestowitzSee FP of BN... about Czech RepublicMar 07 12:28
schestowitzHave you seen the Longhorn video?Mar 07 12:28
schestowitzWait, I\ll get itMar 07 12:28
Omar871schestowitz: And yet, some pathetic morons here are so "Amazed" by how much of an "Angel" MS is..Mar 07 12:28
Omar871HAH... Just look at their products.. see of you could find anything original..Mar 07 12:29
schestowitzI can't find it nowMar 07 12:29
Omar871Absolutely nothing..Mar 07 12:29
schestowitzAnyway, all they offered was mockup demosMar 07 12:30
oiaohm  << At long last some of the MS camp are starting to get it.Mar 07 12:30
schestowitzLike in Minority Report or somehtingMar 07 12:30
schestowitzoiaohm: yes, he doesMar 07 12:30
schestowitzHe's leaning towards some Macs nowMar 07 12:30
schestowitzHe got burned badly by Vista (Joe Wilcox that is)Mar 07 12:30
oiaohmThat is the other problem MS is facing there marketing systems are basically splitering.Mar 07 12:31
oiaohmWhat use to be pro in some places is turn antiMar 07 12:31
Omar871What pisses me off even more are the ".NET clubs" run by a bunch of stupid IT and CPE students here in most (if not all) Jordanian colleges and Univ.'sMar 07 12:33
Omar871It makes me kinda disgusted by how brainwashed they are..Mar 07 12:34
oiaohmI am personally waiting on kdevelop 4 to complete before taking them on head on.Mar 07 12:36
MinceRr4wrMar 07 12:58
schestowitzOmar871: don't worry, Microsoft is dyingMar 07 13:00
schestowitzThey'll need to move on at some stage, just like Atari fansMar 07 13:00
schestowitzSamsung stuffs 1.5TB onto three-platter hard drive < >Mar 07 13:01
oiaohmThere is 1 problem with what they are doing.Mar 07 13:02
oiaohmMore dence they get it the more impossiable data recovery becomes.Mar 07 13:02
schestowitzSo use redundancy.Mar 07 13:04
oiaohmReduncancy does fail.Mar 07 13:04
oiaohmOf site storage is kinda critical.Mar 07 13:05
oiaohmNice fun is datarecoverying drives that have been in a fire.Mar 07 13:05
schestowitzHot stuff.Mar 07 13:09
oiaohmOk interesting one company is working on something the size of a credit card that holds 30 GB.Mar 07 13:11
oiaohmThat does not need to spin.Mar 07 13:11
schestowitzStorage capacity is leapfrogging needMar 07 13:19
schestowitzWith the exception of datacentres maybe.Mar 07 13:19
schestowitzUnless we go back in time, all of this is futileMar 07 13:19
schestowitzIn the past, most storage MAY have been consumed by average consumers by VIDEOS.Mar 07 13:19
schestowitzBut people these days are streaming videos (e.g. YouTube) because networks are fasterMar 07 13:20
schestowitzSo what to do -- as an average consumer -- with all that space? Progressive backups?Mar 07 13:20
schestowitzHeh. A friend of mine who's a lawyer admitted: "As a lawyer, I can tell you that lawyers don't sit around talking about justice, they talk about whether you can win a motion for summary judgment (a quick way to end cases)."Mar 07 13:23
schestowitz"Law is very narrow.  It is not about justice.  It is about whether the law can be used to bludgeon your opponent.  This is why I am increasing becoming disillusioned with the practice of law.  It is increasingly becoming true that the party with the greater resources wins.  That is why it is so important for TomTom to win this case. "Mar 07 13:23
oiaohmIt comes down to the skill of your laywer too.Mar 07 13:23
oiaohmThere are a lot of cases where a good laywer can making the other side with more resources do a lot more.Mar 07 13:24
oiaohmParticularly when you are smart about who has to prove what.Mar 07 13:25
oiaohmPatent case Attacked person has to prove if or if not they used patent.   Attacker has to prove if there patent is valid.Mar 07 13:25
schestowitzOj Simpson...Mar 07 13:26
oiaohmOj Simpson dumb goverment laywersMar 07 13:26
schestowitzHeh. Well, he's detained nowMar 07 13:26
schestowitzAnother violent assault. Is Tyson out? How about Unabomber? Out before death?Mar 07 13:27
oiaohmThe bload stained glove should have been blocked from being touched.Mar 07 13:27
oiaohmOn the grounds that future examination would be tainted so by allow it touched was damaging any possiable apeal attempt by either side.Mar 07 13:27
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oiaohmWhen judge refused gone straight for miss trial.Mar 07 13:28
oiaohmBasically goverment laywers lack balls.Mar 07 13:29
oiaohmI always love common law court cases.  Only cases we you can put all lawyers judge and court reporter in the case under oath to tell and write the truth.  I have got a miss trial once because other lawyer did not mirror and put me under oath.Mar 07 13:33
oiaohmAlso got that lawyer disbared in the process.Mar 07 13:33
oiaohmBigger firm.  Play hardball on there lawyer registrations is supprising how friendly the become.Mar 07 13:34
oiaohmMost lawyers don't want to enter a court room with another lawyer who pure goal is to disbar them so the case has to start over if they lose.Mar 07 13:36
schestowitzoiaohm: BTW...Mar 07 13:36
schestowitzThe host didn't explain what had gone wrong with the wiki DBMar 07 13:36
schestowitzit just got corruptedMar 07 13:36
MinceRwell, Atari still exists :>Mar 07 13:36
schestowitzAfter those odd downtimes that caused troubleMar 07 13:36
schestowitzMinceR: not in the same 'form'Mar 07 13:36
MinceRindeedMar 07 13:37
schestowitzAnyway, I restored the DB from backup, which was up to dateMar 07 13:37
schestowitzBut I didn't get diagnostics of any kind.Mar 07 13:37
oiaohmTake Apple case in point.Mar 07 13:37
schestowitzIt scales badlyMar 07 13:37
oiaohmRemember at OS 9 Apple almost went under.Mar 07 13:37
schestowitzLike 300 DB queries per second the other dayMar 07 13:37
MinceRit should haveMar 07 13:37
schestowitzoiaohm: it did.Mar 07 13:37
schestowitzOS 9 anywayMar 07 13:37
MinceRsadly, apple didn'tMar 07 13:38
schestowitzI used to think Apple would help LinuxMar 07 13:38
schestowitzI was wrongMar 07 13:38
schestowitzThey continue to attack Freeom and LinuxMar 07 13:38
oiaohmApple lived threw but restructured to a system cheaper to maintain.Mar 07 13:38
schestowitzThey are being either: 1) foolishMar 07 13:38
schestowitzOr: 2 ) afraidMar 07 13:38
schestowitzI believe the latterMar 07 13:38
oiaohmThey are scared.Mar 07 13:38
schestowitzAlso, Apple is still buddies with MSMar 07 13:38
schestowitzApple knows that Linux has parity wrt to OS X pretty muchMar 07 13:39
schestowitzOnly cheaper (no h/w lock-in) and more versatlie, libe, etc.Mar 07 13:39
oiaohmApple is trying to stay alive.Mar 07 13:39
schestowitz*libreMar 07 13:39
schestowitzE.g. filesystems in Linux are miles aheadMar 07 13:39
schestowitzSame with fast boot..Mar 07 13:39
oiaohmApple having to compete in a open hardware market how long will they last.Mar 07 13:39
schestowitzFirefox...Mar 07 13:39
oiaohmNot long.Mar 07 13:39
schestowitzWine...Mar 07 13:39
schestowitzAnd so on and so forthMar 07 13:40
schestowitzApple=marketingMar 07 13:40
oiaohmApple shares resources were it suits them with Linux.Mar 07 13:40
schestowitzApple=simple, compact, not so powerfulMar 07 13:40
oiaohmLike cups.Mar 07 13:40
schestowitzApple to linux is what BSD is to Linux, plus better artwork and marketingMar 07 13:40
oiaohmApple has not be a full loss for Linux.Mar 07 13:40
oiaohmBefore Apple restructed there was no sharing with Linux.Mar 07 13:41
oiaohmImprovement is Improvement.Mar 07 13:41
oiaohmMS is going to have to go through th same kinda conversion as Apple long term.Mar 07 13:41
schestowitzImagine how much it cost Apple to build a platform for iPhoneMar 07 13:41
schestowitzPalm did the same without all the effortMar 07 13:41
schestowitzBut unlike Apple, it needs to give patches backMar 07 13:42
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oiaohmApple ipod, iphone.  What is common about way MS is trying to do to liveMar 07 13:42
oiaohmApple focus is building hardware that people will use + DRM they make a good profit.Mar 07 13:43
oiaohmEven doing patent deals under the table is the same as what Apple did when it hit the wall.Mar 07 13:44
oiaohmMS is coping Apple a lot at moment.Mar 07 13:44
MinceRi think they're both foolish and scared.Mar 07 13:46
MinceRoiaohm: buying small FLOSS companies isn't "sharing resources"Mar 07 13:47
MinceRit's plain old fashioned microsoft-style acquisition.Mar 07 13:47
schestowitzApple did rightMar 07 13:48
schestowitzSoftware is a commodityMar 07 13:48
MinceRand of course apple doesn't have to be a loss for linux, but they do want to beMar 07 13:48
schestowitzThey make hardware uniqueMar 07 13:48
schestowitzBranding power and allMar 07 13:48
schestowitzAnd the software is just a complementMar 07 13:48
schestowitzLike Linux to H-P, Intel and IBMMar 07 13:48
MinceRthey're unwilling to work with anyone outside the companyMar 07 13:48
schestowitzSell hardware, make the platform added valueMar 07 13:48
schestowitzMicrosoft sells nothingMar 07 13:48
MinceRand they want to exploit FLOSS and then kill itMar 07 13:48
schestowitzIit LICENCESMar 07 13:48
schestowitzIf phone makers and OEMs no longer LICENSE from MS, it's friedMar 07 13:49
schestowitzOOo licensing is lax and SaaS is just plug-and-play (address bar)Mar 07 13:49
MinceRapple is profiting from BSDL-ed code and at the same time they're patent trollingMar 07 13:49
schestowitzFor most people who just write letters and maybe put taxes in spreadsheet this is fineMar 07 13:49
schestowitzIt's the MOOX files sent to them (sometimes by stupid govts) that acts as monopoly imposerMar 07 13:50
MinceRso they believe they have the right to profit from the work of others but they don't need to give anything backMar 07 13:50

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