The debian-private mailing list leak, part 1. Volunteers have complained about Blackmail. Lynchings. Character assassination. Defamation. Cyberbullying. Volunteers who gave many years of their lives are picked out at random for cruel social experiments. The former DPL's girlfriend Molly de Blanc is given volunteers to experiment on for her crazy talks. These volunteers never consented to be used like lab rats. We don't either. debian-private can no longer be a safe space for the cabal. Let these monsters have nowhere to hide. Volunteers are not disposable. We stand with the victims.
[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

Re: contrib/non-free policy

On 23 Jul 1997, Manoj Srivastava wrote:

> Hi,
> >>"Milan" == Milan Zamazal <pdm@fi.muni.cz> writes:
> 
> Milan> I think it would be nice to have popular (not necessarily the
> Milan> most or the third, but popular) non-commercial system.  Why?
> Milan> It's much more interesting to me to make things in the spirit
> Milan> of "users for users" than "developers for developers".
> 
> 	Please go ahead, with our blessings. We'll continue to package
>  things in non-free, and you can easily derive from Debian. Shaya is
>  putting together a group of people to do just that. My only objection
>  is if you try to take Debian in that direction.

I don't want it to appear that I am starting a distribution, that may be
what some people want--essentialy a Red Hat type debian.  I don't want
that.  I like Debian, I like where it's headed, I like the DFSG.  All I
want, is to make it easy for our users to get their hands on all the
freely distributable stuff in the archive.  I'd consider adding other
packages, but as I've said before, right now I'm wary of it.

> 
> Milan> I don't understand this: "Take a look, we just become better
> Milan> because we removed non-Debian `contrib' directory from our CD!"
> Milan> What does it help to free software?
> 
> 	Look, you don't have to agree with us, (you don't even have to
>  understand our viewpoint. But please respect the fact that it *is*
>  important to us that we are a "Free" distribution.

I agree w/ this.

> 
> Milan> Do you think many copyright owners of packages in contrib
> Milan> change their licenses because of it?  Do you think one will
> Milan> write GNU Prolog, because SWI Prolog can't be on Debian CD?  I
> Milan> don't.
> 
> 	It does not really matter. The authors of non-free software
>  are their own indoviduals (free spirits, we used to say ;-), they
>  make their own decisions, and they have their own philosophy. They
>  reap their own karma. But we are not them. We have our own take on
>  this, and though it would be really nice if they changed their
>  licence, I will in no way let them dictate my actions.

I agree, but we should have a method in distinguishing what the non-free
software is.  i.e. "freely distributable, but not freely ususable",
"freely usable, freely distributable, but not modifiable"....  Why? cause
just like we don't put certain software on the CD's, other people might
have laxer standards, but not totally lax.


> 
> Milan> And what does it help to users?  They will be asking
> Milan> why package XXX is not in Debian. Answer: It is supported, but
> Milan> we don't want include non-FSG SW on our CD.  If you want to
> Milan> learn Prolog and you haven't access to ftp, you shouldn't spent
> Milan> your $36 (in Czech Republic: $3 CD, $5 contribution to Debian,
> Milan> $20 shipping, $8 payment to bank, all together more than 10% of
> Milan> average month salary here).  You should buy commercial CD, you
> Milan> idiot!  Really nice advertisement for free SW...
> 
> 	Such is the problem with non-free software (don't you guys
>  have mirror in euorope?). Unfortunately, if you want Adobe Photoshop,
>  you do have to shell out $$$. Giving in to to the dark side because
>  victory prospects looks bleak will never put a photon torpedo in the
>  ventilation shaft, Luke.
> 
> 	If there is no free distribution os even a free OS, I think
>  that is a worse PR debacle for free software.
> 
> 	Unfortunately, one can't be all thngs to all people.

couldn't agree more.

> 
> Milan> Well, I think not distributing perfectly maintained and free
> Milan> redistributable (but not satisfying FSG) Debian packages on CDs
> Milan> could be considered being violation of point 5. of the Social
> Milan> Contract. There is nothing said about Official Debian CD there
> Milan> and if the decision is to distribute only Debian and not Debian
> Milan> very close stuff (read "contrib"), then I apologize and forget
> Milan> this article completely.
> 
> 	Hmmm, I disagree. How can they be free (as Boids) if they
>  depend on something in a cage? 

Why, because the authors view items like Qt, to be free enough.  They see
that Qt is the best thing available to them, so they use it, because their
target audience will be able to use it for free.  Their target isn't
Debian, but the Linux/unix community in general.

Shaya


--
TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word "unsubscribe" to
debian-private-request@lists.debian.org . 
Trouble?  e-mail to templin@bucknell.edu .