EditorsAbout the SiteComes vs. MicrosoftUsing This Web SiteSite ArchivesCredibility IndexOOXMLOpenDocumentPatentsNovellNews DigestSite NewsRSS

06.23.08

Microsoft to ODF Technical Committee: Come Enter the Belly of the Beast

Posted in ISO, Microsoft, Office Suites, Open XML, OpenDocument, OpenOffice, SUN at 12:39 pm by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

Microsoft is trying to grab control of ODF

To some it was predictable [1, 2, 3] and to some it was not. Regardless: Microsoft Corporation, the company that actively fought ODF and force-forced an proprietary alternative like nothing less than a deranged criminal who knows no boundaries, is suddenly inviting all people behind ODF to 'pull a Patrick Durusau' and come to Microsoft’s turf.

The apprehensive reaction from Charles is very telling:

Thank you for this invitation. I have to say I have some trouble understanding why you would like to gather the OASIS TC in Redmond. It seems to me a bit cumbersome, and a bit bizarre to invite everyone here in Redmond as if nothing had ever happened before. Perhaps, as some would put it, “it’s a bit too early for that”. Besides, I’m sure we can have that event anywhere else . As you may know, the OASIS ODF TC (together with its subcommittees and the OASIS ODF Adoption TC) runs several panels and conferences worldwide. The next one, if I am not mistaken, will take place in Beijing during the ODF Track at the OpenOffice.org Conference. It is scheduled to take place around October-November 2008.

This ODF track is independent from the OpenOffice.org Conference as several different and competing vendors attend this conference track. We would really appreciate to have you and the Microsoft Office team
there.

Watch what Erwin says just before his departure.

Maybe this invitation has something to do with Microsoft’s public “ODF has clearly won” statement at a recent event. Thus, if Microsoft has to support ODF in their products due to market demand, what ISV can still ignore supporting ODF? I guess none! Anyway, OpenOffice.org is just one implementation of ODF and is facing more than 1.2M downloads per week (!!!) on average (since the beginning of 2008) with most recent download numbers having been close to 2M.

It’s figures like that which help Microsoft see what’s coming. It’s a matter of critical mass. Reasons for this new strategy are also related to new stories like this one.

Most Danish companies are actually trying to find an alternative to MS Office at the moment.

Microsoft can see that OOXML will not be adopted by everyone, so it’s trying to ensure it can butter its toast on both sides and control all committees. Will it stick?

If this sounds familiar, it ought to. Microsoft plays exactly the same card in order to gain control over "Open Source", having slammed and daemonised it for years. It seems as though it wants to seize as much control as possible over ODF (for self-beneficial purposes of course, even if that means derailing it).

“If this unethical behaviour by Microsoft was not sufficiently despicable, they did the unthinkable by involving politics in what should have been a technical evaluation of the standard by writing to the head of the Malaysian standards organization and getting its business partners to engage in a negative letter writing campaign to indicate lack of support of ODF in the Malaysian market. Every single negative letter on ODF received by the Malaysian standards organization was written either by Microsoft, or a Microsoft business partner or a Microsoft affiliated organization (Initiative for Software Choice and IASA).

A Memo to Patrick Durusau

Share this post: These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share and discover new web pages.
  • Reddit
  • email
  • Google Bookmarks

If you liked this post, consider subscribing to the RSS feed or join us now at the IRC channels.

Pages that cross-reference this one

12 Comments

  1. The NDA said,

    June 23, 2008 at 1:21 pm

    Gravatar

    And just what are the details of the NDA required to participate?

    Sounds like even more reason why we should
    keep the ODF proecess open.

  2. BoomBoom said,

    June 23, 2008 at 2:22 pm

    Gravatar

    If you can’t beat ‘em, then make ‘em drink your kool-aid then eat ‘em, eh, Microsoft?
    It’s no wonder anyone with half a brain don’t trust MS. Same old ‘embrace extend exterminate’ tactics, time and again. They’re doing it in desperation this time, because they’re dying and know it despite the noise they make in Redmond to the contrary. It’s only a matter of time before they’re so much bad history, but the amount of damage they can do on their way out is something to be wary of.

  3. Roy Schestowitz said,

    June 23, 2008 at 3:11 pm

    Gravatar

    I see that Bruce D’Arcus now weight in. He carries a similar message:

    http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office/200806/msg00078.html

    Also to keep in mind:

    http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2008/04/07/the-ugliness-of-it-all/

    Another way for Microsoft to attack ODF would be to oppose the standardization of ODF 1.2. They will use the same tactics they had with OOXML, but in the opposite direction. It will be funny to watch how the ISO and the national standards bodies will switch all of a sudden to a demanding stance on ODF 1.2, which will only be an iteration of an existing ISO standard. I am afraid we will witness such a shocking twist in the standardization bodies’ attitude.

    He said this just before Microsoft announced that it would support (or ‘support’) ODF.

  4. Not Fluoridated said,

    June 23, 2008 at 5:36 pm

    Gravatar

    Yes, please come to Redmond. Are you thirsty? Drink THIS. There… feel better now? Now watch this shiny object swinging back and forth, back and forth, back and forth… and when you wake up, you’ll ask that ODF be taken out of the ISO standards and given to us.

    My former employer sure went for the Microsoft line, hook & sinker. Especially the sinker part. They’re now out of business, to a great extent because of MS. If OASIS isn’t careful, it could happen to them too.

    Microsoft had a great opportunity to participate when ODF was being developed. They refused. Then, all they wanted was to steal the good ideas to put into MS-XML (aka OOXML) without contributing back. Now, they want to act like they’re concerned about ODF being a universal format for everyone.

    I don’t believe them any more than I believe Dick Cheney. And that’s pretty far down the credibility scale.

  5. DOUGman said,

    June 23, 2008 at 7:17 pm

    Gravatar

    Well, if people are so stupid to believe MS with all the BS that they have done in the past, then it’s their own stupidity. MS, will never change, to the earlier post, ‘embrace extend exterminate’ is the name of the game….SO true.

    Remember the Sun Tzu… know your enemy.

    People should memorize this line, when MS comes a knocking….

    “Frak off…..”

    D.

  6. Roy Schestowitz said,

    June 24, 2008 at 12:01 am

    Gravatar

    “They are so predictable,” tells me someone who has watched this since day 1. Let’s see who falls for it.

    I bet Microsoft will promise a free trip and all sorts of ‘funs’… maybe even a trip down to Disneyland (sarcasm)

    Mind you, the guy who invites them, Doug Mahugh, on is also known as “Elephant in the Room” for the most disgusting of dirty tricks.

    http://www.openmalaysiablog.com/2008/03/the-elephant-in.html

    Doug Mahugh also said about OOXML that it’s a simple matter of Microsoft’s commercial interest. The guy one of the dirtiest among the bunch. It’s almost like being invited by Satan.

  7. Jose said,

    June 28, 2008 at 7:12 pm

    Gravatar

    That attitude makes the anti-microsoft camp lose credibility.

    For years Microsoft opponents complained Microsoft didn’t document their protocols and file formats. That was presented as unfair competition because of their monopoly. Still, the approval of OOXML as an ISO standard encountered tremendous opposition. Microsoft announced they were going to support ODF in Office and again people like you came up with the darkest reasons and plots behind that decision.

    Whatever reasons made Microsoft support ODF or document some of their protocols be happy and let consumers/users decide for themselves what they want.

    You come across as somebody who is afraid consumers are going to choose Microsoft which you consider a bad choice. Now that Microsoft took away one of your biggest argument (closed protocols and closed file formats) you vilify the company.

  8. Roy Schestowitz said,

    June 29, 2008 at 12:17 am

    Gravatar

    Did you think they would ever properly support ODF? Do you not believe that they only do this to avoid defections (pinning down contracts based on promises)? Why did they not support ODF at the start when they were first invited? What about precedence that serves as a lesson in such scenarios?

    By the way, there is no “anti-Microsoft camp”. There’s a pro-open standards camp; Microsoft just doesn’t want to be part of it; it never did. It wants to be ‘the’ standard (de facto).

    “We want to own these standards, so we should not participate in standards groups. Rather, we should call ‘to me’ to the industry and set a standard that works now and is for everyone’s benefit. We are large enough that this can work.”

    –Microsoft Corporation, internal memo (source [compressed PDF])

  9. Jose said,

    June 29, 2008 at 7:05 pm

    Gravatar

    Microsoft may very well have wanted to keep their standards closed (protocols or file formats). Had the legal context as well as the market context allowed it, I believe they would have done just that. I also believe, however, that any other company in their position would have done the exact same thing.

    Microsoft decided to support ODF now instead of when they were invited. So what? I’m convinced Microsoft, like any other corporation, makes decisions that they think will further their interests. Given the current legal context and market demands, they probably think that now is the time to support ODF.

    You can speculate all you want about whatever dark reasons made them support ODF, that’s irrelevant. You think Microsoft will not support ODF properly! What does that mean? If you mean they are going to support it with their best interests in mind, well of course, like any other company supporting a standard. If you think they are going to sabotage in some subtle way their support of ODF in Office I would say that’s wishful thinking. As much as you don’t like them admit at least that they are smarter than that.

    You claim to be pro-open standards. Yes I believe you are but I believe you are first anti-Microsoft and then pro-open standards. Any objective and reasonable person that is first pro-open standards would consider Microsoft support of ODF and Microsoft submission of OOXML as an ISO standard a victory (which I think it is as well as good for users). Instead you vilify Microsoft and one of its employees.

    So yes there is an “anti-Microsoft camp”. A “de facto” one.

  10. Roy Schestowitz said,

    June 30, 2008 at 1:11 am

    Gravatar

    Any objective and reasonable person that is first pro-open standards would consider Microsoft support of ODF and Microsoft submission of OOXML as an ISO standard a victory (which I think it is as well as good for users).

    Did you see what they do for OOXML? Do you consider bullying, bribery and extortion to be acceptable? Moreover, have you not seen that OOXML is Windows-specific and a case against the GPL? What about Microsoft’s history when it comes to standards?

  11. RiaD said,

    June 30, 2008 at 8:25 am

    Gravatar

    Pathetic little blog this is.

    For people needing full and correct information read:
    http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office/200806/msg00084.html

    Even IBM’s Rob Weir confirming that inviting ODF TC members to Redmond is actually a good thing and supporting it fully.

  12. Roy Bixler said,

    June 30, 2008 at 8:58 am

    Gravatar

    It’s a fair point to say that Microsoft is damned if they and damned if they don’t support ODF. Then again I would say that this is Microsoft’s own fault that they have such a bad reputation in the industry that they have earned such deep distrust among so many of us. It would be interesting if Microsoft does the right thing, supports ODF correctly, doesn’t try to undermine it and participates in its further development, but I won’t be holding my breath.

What Else is New


  1. [Humour] COVID-19 is Very, Very Afraid of Human Beings Making More Monopolies Instead of Fighting Together

    The European Patent Office (EPO) to the rescue! Fighting a dangerous pandemic one profitable monopoly at a time!



  2. The News is Never 'Slow', It's Just Journalism That's Slowing Down (and Investigative Journalism Coming Under Attack)

    A mix of censorship and subtle mind control contribute to misinformed societies that shape their perception or misunderstanding of the world based on false measures of authority (where money can determine what is true and what is untrue); many topics remain completely untouched, leading to apathy in a vacuum; it's very much applicable to international organisations, which are presumed benign by virtue of being multi-national or supranational



  3. Social Control Media is About Social Control and If It Doesn't Ban You It'll Shut Down Everyone's Account (One Day)

    It’s time to leave the ‘Internet rot’ which is social control media well behind us; blogging and RSS/XML may seem like a thing of the past, but they may as well become the future (again; if we make the correct and informed choices)



  4. Microsoft's Fingers in Every Pie: The Cult Mentality That Society Needs to Become Wary of

    Microsoft and its co-founder (pretending to do his for-profit 'charity' via the Gates Foundation) are trying to control the world; in the process they've moved to control even their most potent competitor, according to Gates himself, which is GNU/Linux



  5. Links 9/7/2020: Google’s Open Usage Commons, GNOME 3.36.4, Neptune 6.5

    Links for the day



  6. IRC Proceedings: Wednesday, July 08, 2020

    IRC logs for Wednesday, July 08, 2020



  7. Links 8/7/2020: SUSE to Acquire Rancher Labs, Btrfs as Default in Fedora, Qt Creator 4.12.4

    Links for the day



  8. Yes, Master

    When the Linux Foundation tells us to tone down our language we ought to remember what kind of hypocritical stance these people have (note: the above have nothing to do with slavery, either)



  9. Fraunhofer is Again Evergreening Software Patents to Maintain Its Codecs Cartel, Forcing Everyone to Pay to View/Stream Multimedia Files

    The roller-coaster of software patents on multimedia isn't stopping; we know the culprits who can be named for perpetuating this injustice



  10. [Humour/Meme] Focusing on the Bombings and Who's Included in the Bombings

    Supremacist agenda disguised as "tolerant and inclusive" is still objectionable supremacist agenda



  11. Manners Are a Good Thing. The Yardstick or the Standard of Manners Changes Over Time.

    Entirely legitimate grievances of African-Americans are being exploited by people who aren’t even African-American (and usually don’t speak for African-Americans) to warp the debate from one about software ethics and technical issues, not to mention war crimes of companies that employ many programmers, to something which is unlikely to really help African-Americans (also, they don't employ any African-Americans)



  12. IRC Proceedings: Tuesday, July 07, 2020

    IRC logs for Tuesday, July 07, 2020



  13. Links 8/7/2020: Huawei’s GNU/Linux PC, Sparky 5.12, and Endless OS 3.8.4 Released

    Links for the day



  14. [Humour] Television Channels That Don't Speak of Real Looting But Participate in Looting

    People may need to look beyond (or outside) the television screen to grasp what's going on



  15. (Software) Freedom is Elusive Without the Ability to Concentrate

    Software is consuming people's minds; to make matters worse, people have become so attached to such software that they're unable to see it and get away from it (they associate that software with "social life")



  16. Monopolies Erode Freedom, Freedom Erodes Monopolies

    "There are so many reasons that GitHub makes projects less free."



  17. Links 7/7/2020: NomadBSD 1.3.2, Clonezilla Live 2.6.7 and DRM Comes to Cars

    Links for the day



  18. [Humour] IAM Ranked Top for Quality of EPO Propaganda

    Contrary to what the European Patent Office (EPO) keeps saying, patent quality is slipping very fast in Europe (based on the EPO's own analysis!) but patent trolls-funded publishers deny that



  19. When They're Done With Patents on Foods and Recipes They'll Have Patents on Fashion, Taste and Smell

    The mental dysfunction — an infectious condition — that says everything in the world must be patented should be resisted; it overlooks the fact that patents were introduced to protect/promote actual invention, not thoughts, feelings, nature and art



  20. [Humour/Meme] IBM's Money is Unhealthy to the Free Software Foundation (FSF)

    IBM will never be happy as long as RMS (Richard Stallman) has a say in the FSF — directly or indirectly — or even in the GNU Project, both of which he himself created back when IBM was the biggest monopolist



  21. IRC Proceedings: Monday, July 06, 2020

    IRC logs for Monday, July 06, 2020



  22. Never Let IBM/Red Hat Lecture Us on Morality

    Ethics and morality should not be taught by those who themselves need a lesson; in the meantime we're losing the courage to speak freely and those who commit atrocious acts like it a lot better that way



  23. [Humour/Meme] Wear the Red Hat as the Open Org Becomes Openwash

    IBM is changing Red Hat and not for the better; sooner or later IBM will become another Microsoft and changing from one to the other will be like swapping 'masters'



  24. IBM is Imposing Non-Free, Privacy-Infringing Tools and Patent Tolls on Red Hat Staff

    There are signs that Red Hat under IBM will be more like assimilation to IBM, not IBM assimilating to the 'Red Hat way' or the so-called 'open org'



  25. They Tell the Free Software Community That It is Racist While Saying Nothing at All About Trump's Racism (Because He Gives Them Government and Military Contracts)

    While their president compares 'foreign' people to a virus (using innuendo, dog whistles and racist rhetoric reminiscent of the Nazi era) the big US corporations (American surveillance giants) turn their attention to rather innocuous words inside people's code (which almost nobody sees anyway)



  26. LibreOffice 'Personal Edition' Seems Like a Marketing and Communication Fluke

    Had LibreOffice developers (and the Document Foundation) communicated these changes more openly, they would have averted/avoided some of the FUD



  27. It Almost Feels Like Microsoft Has Already 'Bought' Canonical

    Canonical's disturbing trajectory and betrayal of the community continue unabated; one can easily get the impression that Ubuntu exists to help Microsoft at some level



  28. Update to GNU Project Bleeding into Microsoft

    Update



  29. Microsoft is Going to Get Tired of Whining About “GAFA” and Accept That It's Just as Bad If Not a Lot Worse at Privacy

    Microsoft is being treated by the US government as if it's not abusing anything, let alone people's privacy; if anything, this demonstrates the degree to which Microsoft infiltrated or 'vendor-captured' regulatory branches



  30. Links 6/7/2020: LibreOffice 7.0 RC1, MX-19.2 KDE Beta 1, Linux 5.8 RC4

    Links for the day


RSS 64x64RSS Feed: subscribe to the RSS feed for regular updates

Home iconSite Wiki: You can improve this site by helping the extension of the site's content

Home iconSite Home: Background about the site and some key features in the front page

Chat iconIRC Channel: Come and chat with us in real time

Recent Posts