12.12.09

Microsoft as Communism, Revisited

Posted in Deception, Free/Libre Software, FSF, Microsoft at 6:06 pm by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

Soviet Microsoft

Summary: A very recent discussion of the “communist” smear against Free software

THIS is not yet another post reminding people that Microsoft — not Free software — resembles communism. We have done that several times before and so have others.

Ignorance and amnesia, combined with spin and deceit, can really make people believe just about anything, including the ridiculous claim that a scientific development model has something against capitalism. But that’s just McCarthyism incarnated. As TechCrunch phrased it two days ago, “Microsoft users [are] more gullible” and Vista 7 is a recent example.

When it cut the numbers by operating system, Chitika a similar trend. Windows users are about twice as likely as Linux or Mac users to click on ads. All of this data comes from one advertising network, so I’d say it is more suggestive than scientific (I’d love to know if other ad network are seeing the same trends). But it is a large sample.

Anyway, a couple of days ago we had an interesting discussion in the IRC channel. It starts around here and below is an excerpt. █

schestowitz	Wow. WHy is he insulting Allison? http://doctormo.wordpress.com/2009/12/10/fsf-is-asking-for-money-again/	Dec 11 12:21
phIRCe-local	Title: FSF is Asking for Money Again « DoctorMO’s Blog .::. Size~: 40.91 KB	Dec 11 12:21
*schestowitz removes channel operator status from schestowitz		Dec 11 12:21
kecskebak	He’s saying Allison is not a born broadcaster – he’s right about that. That video should have been done as an interview and it would have been much better.	Dec 11 12:23
kecskebak	I thought Allison looked very uncomfortable and self-conscious.	Dec 11 12:23
schestowitz	The criticism of Allison is very unfair. It’s understandable that critics will always — and I mean ALWAYS — be described as “bad” (just ask Dennis Kucinich), but Allison has actually done a good job explaining /slowly/ (to non-English speakers) what Free software means.	Dec 11 12:24
kecskebak	Yes, but compare it to the Stephen Fry one.	Dec 11 12:24
kecskebak	I think the content of the video was fine, it was the format that was wrong.	Dec 11 12:24
kecskebak	Speaking to the camera – “down the bottle” – is one of the hardest things to do. Even some actor’s can’t do it well.	Dec 11 12:26
schestowitz	I see insults directed at the appearance of RMS	Dec 11 12:26
schestowitz	They don’t seem to understand that the hair has become a symbol that helps identify Stallman in the crowd. Many people in music and sports do the same thing because with different looks they simply lose their identity (and following).	Dec 11 12:26
schestowitz	kecskebak: yes, but Fry is in broadcasting	Dec 11 12:27
schestowitz	I wouldn’t want Fry to become Samba patchmaster	Dec 11 12:27
kecskebak	Well, that’s as daft as asking Allison to talk down the bottle and not as an interview subject	Dec 11 12:27
kecskebak	FSF did something that silly and stuck it on their home page	Dec 11 12:27
schestowitz	Yes	Dec 11 12:27
schestowitz	Allison responded to it in BN	Dec 11 12:28
schestowitz	http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Dell-Optiplex-780-USFF-and-Vostro-V13/	Dec 11 12:28
phIRCe-local	Title: Ubuntu-ready Dell desktop looks like a nettop – News – Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 64.97 KB	Dec 11 12:28
kecskebak	I think Allison is an incredible bloke and very, very brave for speaking out against Mono	Dec 11 12:28
kecskebak	But I think that criticism of the video in the blog was fair comment	Dec 11 12:28
kecskebak	Microsoft is dying – and cornered wounded animals are the most dangerous.	Dec 11 12:29
kecskebak	That’s why they attack you so much.	Dec 11 12:29
cubezzz	no, I don’t think Stallman’s appearance was because he choose to look different	Dec 11 12:29
cubezzz	he just doesn’t think about his appearance	Dec 11 12:29
kecskebak	I think the “vicious front end” referred to in the blog was not Stallman’s appearance but his manner. I think that criticism is very unfair.	Dec 11 12:29
cubezzz	I’ve met other programmers with “Stallman hair”	Dec 11 12:30
*zer0c00l has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))		Dec 11 12:31
kecskebak	I’ve always been amazed in videos of Stallman how calm and reasonable he is. I was expecting more spit and vinegar.	Dec 11 12:31
cubezzz	well he’s been attacked since the 80′s	Dec 11 12:31
cubezzz	nothing new there	Dec 11 12:31
kecskebak	So to criticise Stallman’s manner in that blogpost was very unfair in my view.	Dec 11 12:32
cubezzz	he’s a “communist”	Dec 11 12:32
kecskebak	Socialism is just for corporations, not the people. I notice Microsoft and the rest love state handouts	Dec 11 12:32
cubezzz	Stallman can get pretty irritable	Dec 11 12:33
cubezzz	personally, I like Stallman though	Dec 11 12:33
cubezzz	no fake politeness	Dec 11 12:33
schestowitz	cubezzz: RMS had a beard bad in the 30s	Dec 11 12:34
schestowitz	He was clean shaved before GNU	Dec 11 12:34
schestowitz	/bad/back/	Dec 11 12:35
cubezzz	in the 30s?	Dec 11 12:35
cubezzz	he’s not that old	Dec 11 12:35
schestowitz	His 30s	Dec 11 12:35
cubezzz	ah	Dec 11 12:35
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] I like the new Thundebird, now I have tabs and sub-tabs…. tabs within other tabs for organisation. Splendid!		Dec 11 12:35
cubezzz	yes, he once had a crew cut if you go back far enough	Dec 11 12:35
schestowitz	cubezzz: yes, “communist” if science if the new communism	Dec 11 12:36
schestowitz	The power of spin and perception	Dec 11 12:36
schestowitz	You could go about drawing analogies between Microsoft and communism	Dec 11 12:36
schestowitz	1) everyone is the sam…	Dec 11 12:36
schestowitz	2) One leader	Dec 11 12:36
kecskebak	3) One Microsoft way	Dec 11 12:36
schestowitz	3) No expression of code/thought (modification)	Dec 11 12:36
schestowitz	And so on…	Dec 11 12:36
cubezzz	I’m just repeating what people said on usenet in the 80′s, it’s all still there on google groups	Dec 11 12:37
schestowitz	I’m actually very surprised by how Linux advocates are daemonised	Dec 11 12:37
schestowitz	For things they do not do or get distorted for the most part	Dec 11 12:37
cubezzz	yeah. that’s disappointing	Dec 11 12:37
kecskebak	I think communism is a shock word like paedophile – it sort of closes the argument and puts the person beyond the pale	Dec 11 12:38
kecskebak	‘Religious’ is also used for Mono critics to do the same thing	Dec 11 12:38
cubezzz	no, I never thought of communism as a shock word	Dec 11 12:39
kecskebak	Many Americans do	Dec 11 12:39
cubezzz	for software at least	Dec 11 12:39
schestowitz	http://www.eweekeurope.co.uk/news/experts-question-hungary-s-role-as-european-open-source-leader-2720	Dec 11 12:39
phIRCe-local	Title: Experts Question Hungary’s Role As European Open Source Leader – News – eWeekEurope.co.uk .::. Size~: 27.04 KB	Dec 11 12:39
cubezzz	at most Stallman is a hybrid capitalist/communist with emphasis on the communist part	Dec 11 12:40
MinceR	lol	Dec 11 12:40
*MinceR gets some hybrid cold/hot water		Dec 11 12:40
cubezzz	and true communism doesn’t really exist	Dec 11 12:40
schestowitz	Sadly for Microsoft, it has communism in it	Dec 11 12:40
cubezzz	warm water?	Dec 11 12:40
schestowitz	Their EU head used to be a communist in the proper sense	Dec 11 12:41
MinceR	well, communism was an idea that was never implemented	Dec 11 12:41
MinceR	s/was/is/	Dec 11 12:41
schestowitz	And one of its advocate (Fiegel or something) written extensively to advocate communism in Europe in his younge days	Dec 11 12:41
schestowitz	So Microsoft has real communism baggage	Dec 11 12:41
schestowitz	They just hide it	Dec 11 12:41
MinceR	write an article on that	Dec 11 12:42
cubezzz	I think of Microsoft as fascist, not communist	Dec 11 12:42
schestowitz	MinceR: Microsoft communism?	Dec 11 12:42
MinceR	schestowitz: indeed	Dec 11 12:42
cubezzz	dare I say the H word?	Dec 11 12:42
MinceR	there is not a lot of difference between fascism and what was implemented as “communism” on earth	Dec 11 12:42
cubezzz	capitalism seems to fall apart if people get too greedy	Dec 11 12:43
kecskebak	MinceR: Spot on. That’s why the former communists are now running Hungary for the neo-Liberals	Dec 11 12:43
schestowitz	MinceR: OK	Dec 11 12:43
kecskebak	They didn’t need any training	Dec 11 12:44
cubezzz	but this doesn’t change the fact that we have FOSS, so in one small area we have real communism	Dec 11 12:45
cubezzz	it’s there if you want it	Dec 11 12:45
MinceR	actually it isn’t communism as long as it isn’t public domain	Dec 11 12:46
MinceR	sw still has an owner who could relicense it	Dec 11 12:46
MinceR	i’m not sure if the legal system would even allow it	Dec 11 12:46
MinceR	i wonder why are there ‘quasi-public domain’ licenses like the WTFPL, i remember hearing something like public domain not working the same way in all countries or something	Dec 11 12:47
cubezzz	well I suppose the gate keepers are really the maintainers	Dec 11 12:49
cubezzz	but anyone can be a maintainer	Dec 11 12:49
oiaohm	MinceR: WTFPL is just for fun form of License	Dec 11 12:52
oiaohm	Yes legally binding but not much better than Public domain.	Dec 11 12:52
MinceR	so public domain isn’t legally binding?	Dec 11 12:53
oiaohm	Public domain includes copyright expired works. The expired works don’t need a legally binding contract to make them such.	Dec 11 12:55