Bonum Certa Men Certa

GNU/Linux Users Infuriated by Microsoft's Lennart Poettering Attacking Linux Freedom

Related: Microsoft is Trying to Hire (Read: Pay Salaries to) Matthew Garrett

Did you join Microsoft to attack Linux?



Summary: Microsoft's Lennart Poettering didn't take long to show his true colours... (and agenda)

AS just noted in Daily Links (or here), Lennart Poettering is being bossed by the NSA's foremost tentacle (Microsoft) and he acts accordingly. He says "I would go as far as saying that SecureBoot on Linux distributions is mostly security theater at this point, if you so will." (It is in general the case, not just in Linux)



But he wishes to go further with the security theater.

Although LWN lacks comments on this matter and Phoronix is, as usual, just Microsoft-friendly fluff these days, we need to examine comments in Phoronix. Here are some:

And of course, the UKI must include systemd, that will take over as a UEFI payload and control everything in the system!



Responding to the above:

Next year's new systemd plugin, same old story.



More:



Great. Some of the reasons I can't stand Windows.



How about no, especially if it makes it harder to build your own kernels or to make changes to the initrd



Responding to the above:

That's the fly in the ointment. The whole trusted boot and execution system requires end users to be able to load their own keys into the UEFI boot key store. Not all hardware allows that. For that matter not all PC hardware even allows for it. The only way this works is if there's some way to require OEMs to allow third party keys other than those signed by a megacorp. Apple and Microsoft will fight that with every dirty trick, lawsuit, and just plain underhandedness they can - and not enough users will even notice to bother to protest - so it's unlikely there would be any effective regulatory process to stop it. Think of the kids. Think of the corporate bottom lines. Think of national security. Think of...



To which the reply was:

That is not enough -- if there is a way to enroll user keys, evil maid can use it to inject her own. There are some solutions, but they are super complex in comparison to just fuse corpo-keys. Anyhow, all this requires user to fully trust the motherboard firmware, which is not verifiable.



More:

No, thanks. I'll opt to continue configuring and building my kernels (and initramfs) locally. Unsigned, very true. Trusted by .... me And yes, running an OpenRC system here.



Bureaucracy has arrived at Linux. Every bit needs a form and a signature before it can be flipped.


This is ridiculious. Securtity has nothing to do with signing if there is not trust in that chain. You must trust the parties involved in signing - and in case of Microsoft one would be crazy to trust it (we got lots of proofs). All those pseudo security features made the computers much less trust worthy - using minix to spy on users (Intel) - the stupid boot signatures which are more for making GNU/Linux more inconvenient or broken than making anything more secure. And the big binary monster of systemd may be nice to improve boot time and avoid race conditions, but the killing of processes and other things configuered in disguise does not make the situation better but much worse. Trust comes if you understand your system - and if other use reasonable defaults. Init scripts were easy - systemd is a monster in comparison. So while not against a trusted boot process in general, the authority must be trustworthy - and I am not aware of anything which would provide the necessary level of trust. And if big companies are involved it comes with a necessity of matching agendas - and not concerning security but more to the contrary. So this is just a Trojan Horse ... and a realy obvious one.



Bureaucracy came to Linux decades ago.
No, it was optional and so has not arrived, but was only lurking in the shadow. A bit like you.

The way I see it is this corporate FUD - the type of features corporations create when they have become too large to fail, and need to trick customers to get them to believe they need something they do not. And who is he working for now? Right, Microsoft ... I did not need a secure boot process in 25 years and I did not need Microsoft, and this is not going to change.


And? It's generated locally which makes it 1000 time more trusted than being generated remotely by who knows on what server run by who knows who! Why the fuck would I want it to be built and signed by someone who I don't know and trust? Lennart, get lost with your Microsoft infested ideas that can only think on how to infest more computers with its spyware! From all the employers you couldn't work for another one? I'm starting to feel more and more disgusted about this attitude and thinking that we are so stupid to want thing built by somebody else, especially by Microsoft!



Reply:

If it's reproducible, it kinda doesn't matter who signs it. If it also makes it 1000x harder for anyone to sign images that aren't reproducible, then most end-users have avoided plethora of attacks - quite unattainable for malware makers and most bad actors.

I'm starting to feel more and more annoyed how I can't give regular people an hardened Linux setup resistant to most ab- and misuse. All because of some pointless feet-dragging all while the actual threats to computing freedom fly past unnoticed.



More:

You are simply not save from mega corporations. They will try to cash in on every bit of fear, uncertainty and doubt you may have. They want you to need them and to buy from them. First they tell you it is 'locally generated', then it is 'generated', and then to best buy it from them for a price...



Uhu, so we all need to pay someone else to give us a f* rng nft: “hey daddy, can you please sign my initrd?, here are some bucks for your efforts”, to use whenever it actually matters because, yes, I bet everyone would be able to sign their own stuff, but of course, we would need certified signatures from some megacorp *cough, Microsoft, cough* to use our own things anywhere outside our home lab.

We have seen this sh* with secure boot or web certificates to name two from the top of my mind; good intentions on paper, implementation faulted by design to maximize profit for a selected few.





I have not lost time or work to an attack which would be hindered by secure boot and don't know anyone else who has either. I have repaired and recovered data from computers for myself and others by booting external media of my own contrivance. I gain substantial benefit from external media Linux installations where my usb stick or SSD carries a useful environment to most any machine.

I see zero benefit, only pain as the boot process gets locked down like a cell phone, game console or Windows. It is about security, not user security, not my security, not your security. Who is Lennart working for now? Who is putting up the money? There is a good place to start looking.


"How on earth that now would work" you say... So you do not know and have got no idea. At least are you not hiding your ignorance. You must think all this encryption can be disabled or worked around easily. It is like you expect nightclubs to have two entrances, one with a bouncer and one without, where you can choose one or the other in case the bouncer does not let you in. You seem to be missing the basic principle here. It has to be mandatory at every link and layer, or it will be as weak as the weakest point. So it is either a useless feature or a guaranteed source of trouble for admins and anyone who wants their freedom.



Seems like this is the biggest problem: Asshole vendors that don't allow the user to sign their own shit. Funny how the whole "Trust" issue requires me to trust corporations who have done the wrong things in the past that hire people I've never met and vetted that run closed source code that isn't audited or vetted by a greater community at large.

Am I the weird one for thinking that I don't like being forced to trust them and that it's fucked up that I'm not allowed to trust myself or those that I deem trustworthy? I feel like the phrase "Protect and Serve" comes to mind.

Since you're at Microsoft, how about getting them to flex their muscles into strong-arming vendors and BIOS makers into making a method that allows the user to add their own keys so the initrd can be added to the secure chain and mitigate all the systmed madness...Or have you taken too many Soma Tabs, Linus.

Systemd is great, but it doesn't have to be the solution to every problem. It can be A solution, but it sucks when it's THE solution.



Ah yes, another dubious "security feature" that is just another thinly veiled excuse for big corpos to control the open source ecosystem.

Never forget "Embrace, extend, and extinguish"!



Is Lennart Poettering the Klaus Schwab of linux world? Honest question.



There will be more to come for sure. Maybe even a bunch of Microsoft AstroTurfers.

Recent Techrights' Posts

Slop Nihilism is Funded by Big Oil
Eventually human civilisation will destroy itself
Professor Eben Moglen Recovering From Open Heart Surgery
From his public pages (this is not secret)
 
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Wednesday, September 17, 2025
IRC logs for Wednesday, September 17, 2025
Slopwatch: Fake Articles, Fake Text, Fake Images, Negative Slant on "Linux"
Google News has lost its value; the signal-to-noise ratio has fallen off a cliff
Gemini Links 17/09/2025: Relax-and-Recover on Proxmox and New Smolweb File Transfer Service
Links for the day
Fact: EFF Got Corrupted by Corporate Money. Microsoft Lunduke (Political Noise): The Issue With EFF is, It Kills Babies.
Microsoft Lunduke - as usual - finds a way to make it about abortions
Pacing Publication Up a Bit
The news cycles have gotten rather light and slow
Links 17/09/2025: Power Outages, Digital Controls, and Attacks on the Mainstream Media (by Insecure and Corrupt Dictators)
Links for the day
Gemini Links 17/09/2025: Flashing LineageOS and ROOPHLOCH
Links for the day
Links 17/09/2025: Long COVID Study, "Exposing Pegasus", and Chatbots Exposing Sensitive Data
Links for the day
Links 17/09/2025: Secret Settlement for Internet Archive and Google’s LLM Slop Summaries Attracting Lawsuits
Links for the day
The True Cost of 'Generative Models'
Funded and promoted by the companies that profit from the waste
'Big Slop' Attacks Contemporary Information/Knowledge and Creative Works, 'Big Copyright' (Cartel) Attacks the Old
Someone at IA will hopefully "blow the whistle" on what they actually agreed
Why We Find It Difficult to Trust Rust
A comparison between C/C++ and Rust
Watching the OSI: Our Series Will Carry on Irrespective of the Chief's 'Resignation'
the OSI isn't even the real guardian of the term "Open Source"
Just What LibreOffice Needs? Another Language? (Rust)
what's all this concern about memory safety?
Many Microsoft Managers Are Leaving
"Hey hi" chaff or chaff about "hey hi" cannot eternally distract from the difficulties inside the company
There Are Red Hat (IBM) Layoffs, But Google News is Infested With Slopfarms
It contributes a lot to misinformation and it encourages plagiarism
Tomorrow, Microsoft's Tim Anderson's 'The Register MS' Offshoot Will Have Been Inactive for 2 Months (There's Also a Slop Problem)
We've already caught The Register MS using LLM slop for articles
Microsoft's Chief Legal Officer Leaves Microsoft After Nearly 30 Years
And not retiring
Even Windows Users Are Having Problems With "Secure Boot"
When it comes to security - Microsoft strives for the very opposite
Another Competition Crime of Microsoft, Long Facilitated and Advocated by a Bad Actor, Who is Funded by a Third Party to Commit Extortion Against People Who Have Correctly and Repeatedly Warned About It for Over 13 Year
We must always go back to the core issues
3 More Reasons to Replace Mozilla Firefox With LibreWolf
Thankfully there are de-enshittified versions of Firefox
USA Not a Place for Free Speech
In America, as in the US, the attacks seem more enhanced or advanced these days
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Tuesday, September 16, 2025
IRC logs for Tuesday, September 16, 2025
Links 17/09/2025: Google Layoffs in "Hey Hi" (AI), Perplexity Hit With More "Hey Hi" (Plagiarism) Lawsuits
Links for the day
Gemini Links 17/09/2025: Reclaiming Things in a Digital Age and Moon Phases in CGI
Links for the day
Slopwatch: Google News is Slop, Google News is Plagiarism, Google News is Dying
Google is off the rails
Links 16/09/2025: "The Censorship Alarm Is Ringing in the Wrong Direction" and ASRock Does Microsoft E.E.E. on GNU/Linux
Links for the day
Serious "Breach of Confidentiality of Personal Data" in Europe's Second-Largest Institution, the EPO
Yes, the same EPO that routinely uses "data protection" and "GDPR" as a pretext for hiding or covering up its corruption and white-collar crimes (it even uses that as an excuse for refusing to obey courts' orders)
Adrienne Rockenhaus Says Her Husband Was Arrested for Running Tor and Denied Basic Rights in the United States
the US seems to be getting "russified" in its approach towards Tor
This is What Happens When Microsoft Canonical Lets Decisions on Ubuntu be Made by a Youngster From the British Army (Where He Did Mass Surveillance)
"Is Ubuntu Compromised?"
Back Doored Windows Giving GNU/Linux a Hard Time (Under the Guise of 'Security')
Is this complication intentional? Most likely, yes
Links 16/09/2025: Science, Security, and Conflicts
Links for the day
Gemini Links 16/09/2025: Command-line Options in POSIX Shell and Introducing Acre 0.9
Links for the day
Microsoft 'Secure' Boot Versus Dual Boot With GNU/Linux
they're meant to assume everything is OK
Links 16/09/2025: While Oracle Pretends to be Rich It's Firing About 70 MySQL Workers, "Oracle's Revenge" (Faking Demand With "AI")
Links for the day
Microsoft Has Just Published a New Web Page About "Secure Boot Update Process" (Microsoft Also Admits Issues; PCs Can Stop Booting)
Why was this page issued and published only hours ago?
Microsoft Lunduke: I Spread Hate and Then I Receive Hate
Cry us a river, Microsoft Lunduke
"Use Wayland" Isn't a Bugfix for X (X11 is Still Necessary)
They tell us X is "dead" and we must all be herded into Wayland ASAP
"Disable Secure Boot and Fast Boot. Wipe and Start Over."
At least they didn't say, buy a new computer...
The Oracle Ponzi Scheme
Oracle isn't doing well, but it's nowadays fashionable to say "clown" and "hey hi" to prop up one's stock, even based on nothing at all
The New Head of OSI is an "Hey Hi" (AI) Obsessed Person
when Bryant says "AI" that doesn't mean AI
Taking Out the Battery, Opening Up Your Computer, Just Like a "Normie" Would
At this stage, any person who still says "enable Secure Boot" is misguided or persuaded by companies that sell rootkits
Slopwatch: Serial Sloppers and Slopfarms Still Infesting Google News (Fake 'Articles' About "Linux" Spreading FUD)
searching for "Linux" today yields a lot of FUD
"Governments, local authorities, schools and hospitals can lead by example by procuring only Free Software"
Crossposted from Tux Machines
Cindy Cohn Leaving the Electronic Frontier Foundation While Its Co-founder John Gilmore, Whom She Apparently Helped Oust, Will Celebrate 40 Years of the Free Software Foundation, Inc.
EFF has been busy hoarding GAFAM money, whereas the latter is where all the real activism is done
The Reach of Techrights Has Broadened
We nowadays cover a broader range of issues
"Google is Googlebombing KDE's Project Banana"
So is Google googlebombing KDE's Project Banana? You decide.
Complicating Things for No Actual Benefit, Just Added Risk and More Difficulties Adding GNU/Linux and BSDs
Watch what it's like for people who wish to use BSDs
Some Very Large IRC Networks Are Growing
IRC will turn 38 next year
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Monday, September 15, 2025
IRC logs for Monday, September 15, 2025
Links 16/09/2025: Autumn Party, RPG Planet, and Optical ROOPHLOCH
Links for the day