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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: August 20th, 2008 - Part III

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neighborleeschestowitz, thx  indeedAug 20 19:07
schestowitzself_liar: for Mono?Aug 20 19:07
self_liarschestowitz: noAug 20 19:08
neighborleeself_liar, I wont use anything not 100% free, which gtk is ( except now its tarnished with .net crud)Aug 20 19:08
self_liarschestowitz: kde without mono is greatAug 20 19:08
schestowitzKDE had no Mono commits in the last report (hooks from Richard Dale). I keep an eye on it.Aug 20 19:08
self_liarschestowitz: kde with mono is not goodAug 20 19:08
neighborleenot that aI dont 'respet' what kde offers, but atm its encubmered IMHO, with qtAug 20 19:08
self_liarschestowitz: sorry for  my bad englishAug 20 19:08
schestowitzself_liar: it's all right.Aug 20 19:09
schestowitzPJ is also concerned about Mono/OOXML/KDEAug 20 19:09
schestowitzNovell is likely to try to spread Mono. It's its 'added value'Aug 20 19:09
neighborleeeek gad,,yes im sure of itAug 20 19:09
self_liar novell buy mattias family , im afraid of thisAug 20 19:10
neighborleeand remember due to the M$/novel deal, they spread word about M$ stuff,,as does M$ for linux..supposedly..Aug 20 19:10
schestowitzAs illustrated in my pictures, which is now on ZDnet (http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=2803  )Aug 20 19:10
schestowitzmattias family??Aug 20 19:10
self_liarschestowitz: mattias etrich ,the founder of kde and amarokAug 20 19:10
schestowitzOh!Aug 20 19:11
self_liarschestowitz: matthis ettrichAug 20 19:11
benJImanneighborlee: No more encumbered than linux.Aug 20 19:11
self_liarschestowitz: *matthias ettrichAug 20 19:11
schestowitzOf course... is he still vocal? I saw him in an EFYTimes article, but his friends seem to have taken the stage.Aug 20 19:11
schestowitzNovell is also promoting Microsoft technologies, which harms everyone like Sun and IBM (ODF, Java, etc,).Aug 20 19:12
self_liarschestowitz: the go-oo site attacks open office in silenceAug 20 19:13
neighborleebenJIman, no I mean gtk vs qtAug 20 19:13
benJImanneighborlee: What do you mean?Aug 20 19:13
benJImanQt is GPLed, so is Linux.Aug 20 19:13
neighborleenoAug 20 19:13
neighborleeits not gpl for windowsAug 20 19:13
neighborleeerrAug 20 19:13
neighborleecrapAug 20 19:13
neighborleeI mean for commercial usageAug 20 19:13
benJImanneighborlee: Wrong, it is GPL for windows too.Aug 20 19:13
neighborleeyesAug 20 19:14
neighborleeI mean for commercial usageAug 20 19:14
benJImanYou can write commercial GPL applications of course.Aug 20 19:14
neighborleeits just that gtk gives you  the power to do what you wish with itAug 20 19:14
neighborleeto me thats total freedomAug 20 19:14
benJImanLinux is GPLed too, so people are not allowed to distribute proprietary drivers for it.Aug 20 19:14
neighborleethen the user decides from thereAug 20 19:14
benJImanSo why do you use linux? Shouldn't you be using bsd?Aug 20 19:14
neighborleemost likely yes indeed, good point.Aug 20 19:15
neighborleebut I can'tAug 20 19:15
neighborleeI dont trust itAug 20 19:15
neighborleeI dont trust many things about bsdAug 20 19:15
self_liarI don t like to use linux as example of free softwareAug 20 19:15
self_liarlinus et al. are corruptedAug 20 19:15
neighborleewoah nellie ;))))Aug 20 19:16
neighborleebut hey, if you have proof im willing to listen, as always !Aug 20 19:16
self_liarThe linux "foundation" does not help free software comunnityAug 20 19:16
TallkenI like LinusAug 20 19:16
self_liarself_liar: canonical now helps linux foundationAug 20 19:16
self_liaroops ,a mistakeAug 20 19:16
neighborleewe know they dont help kernel..or is that what you were getting at ??Aug 20 19:17
self_liarLinus is false,in revolution os ,he uses a reilly open source t-shirtAug 20 19:17
neighborleelolAug 20 19:17
self_liarself_liar: linux "foundation" gains  all credit about free softwareAug 20 19:18
self_liaroops a mistake againAug 20 19:18
self_liarthe "foundation"  does not consider problems like novell and microsoftAug 20 19:19
self_liarfor them all is "technical decisions"Aug 20 19:19
self_liarbusiness decisionsAug 20 19:19
schestowitzI don't trust the LF, either.,Aug 20 19:19
self_liarfor example reiser4Aug 20 19:19
self_liarI like the filesystemAug 20 19:19
schestowitzCome to consider the fact that IBM endorsed the Novell/Microsoft deal. They try to dilute and ruin Free software, then take just the code. Watch the recent Lotus move.Aug 20 19:20
neighborleeself_liar, I never had trouble running reiserfs come to think o fit yesAug 20 19:20
self_liarbut novell ,IBM and intel enforces do not use a software from prisioneerAug 20 19:20
neighborleeself_liar, faster as well.,I wonder about #4Aug 20 19:20
schestowitzOn my SUSE 8.1, Resier lasted fine for 3+ years.Aug 20 19:20
self_liarand then the linux "foundation" uses a technical  argumentAug 20 19:20
schestowitz*Reiser I mean.Aug 20 19:20
neighborleeschestowitz, sweetAug 20 19:21
self_liar"reseifs is not good ,blabal"Aug 20 19:21
neighborleereally ??Aug 20 19:21
neighborleewoahAug 20 19:21
neighborleemissed thatAug 20 19:21
self_liaronly 1 developer support reiser4 with patchesAug 20 19:21
self_liarandrew mortonAug 20 19:21
schestowitzTaser taitned by Microsoft now: http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/bus...Aug 20 19:22
schestowitz"TASER International's products protect life. TASER provides advanced Electronic Control Devices (ECDs) for use in the law enforcement, medical, military, corrections, professional security, and personal protection markets. TASER devices use proprietary technology to incapacitate dangerous, combative, or high-risk subjects who pose a risk to law enforcement officers, innocent citizens, or themselves in a manner that is generally reAug 20 19:22
schestowitzcognized as a safer alternative to other uses of force."Aug 20 19:22
schestowitzWatch this or make a mental note in case they procure from Ballmer and the Boys in the future.Aug 20 19:23
self_liarschestowitz: If softwate community destroy m$ in 25 years , m$ can not do thisAug 20 19:25
schestowitzThe disease is spreading (XAML): http://www.marketwatch.com/news/stor... Aug 20 19:25
schestowitzMicrosoft is weakened by many things. The worst that can happen now is FOSS developers going into bed with Microsoft.You know, like Novell did. It colluded.Aug 20 19:26
self_liarschestowitz: damn ,it's bad!Aug 20 19:26
self_liarschestowitz: toyota is a very respected company in japanAug 20 19:26
schestowitzNot that bad. Microsoft is still losing.Aug 20 19:27
schestowitzMSFT lost over $100 billion in value in less than one year.Aug 20 19:27
self_liarschestowitz: i knowAug 20 19:27
schestowitzEarlier I saw Pearly (Gates) and that other man who puts its stash in that tax-free haven (Fundation [sic]) taking a tour to Canada together. They still play politics.Aug 20 19:27
schestowitzI was shocked but not surprised to hear that Gates also wants government control (and this time not by proxy).Aug 20 19:28
self_liarschestowitz:heh like the "terminator"?Aug 20 19:29
schestowitzI haven't seen it since I was a kid, so I can't remember.Aug 20 19:29
schestowitzHere's another boot-licking piece (too many of them today): http://directmag.com/opinions-columnists/l...Aug 20 19:31
schestowitzOkay, so another Microsoft senior abandoned the ship. http://rcpmag.com/news/article...Aug 20 19:33
neighborleeself_liar, hmm wow I had no idea andrew was supportin g that..thats very huge.Aug 20 19:33
self_liarschestowitz: why this exodus happen?Aug 20 19:34
schestowitzSomeone still maintains reiserfs. kerneltrap reported on that last week.Aug 20 19:34
schestowitzself_liar: lots of the seniors leave because Microsoft is past its days of glory. They go backwards now, not forward. So seniors move on to new challenges.Aug 20 19:35
neighborleeso , is hans actually in jail for life, I lost track of all that messAug 20 19:35
schestowitzThe issue is the trail you have left of former-Softies. They 'poison' other companies by acting as insiders. Watch Xen and VMWare for example. Microsoft managers there...Aug 20 19:35
schestowitzThey should rename his FS or something.Aug 20 19:36
neighborleehehAug 20 19:36
self_liarschestowitz: ok,but for me it's very strangeAug 20 19:36
self_liarschestowitz: I was thinking.....Aug 20 19:38
self_liarschestowitz: developed countries is a lot more easy to use GNU linux than in developing countriesAug 20 19:38
neighborleeto them, free matters alot ;)Aug 20 19:39
neighborleeopen source I should say.Aug 20 19:39
self_liarschestowitz: in Brazil for example,  more than 70% linux computers is changed for windowz pirated editionAug 20 19:39
neighborleeyou mean they use windows pirated instead ?Aug 20 19:39
schestowitzself_liar: yes, true. The rich ones will upgrade to FOSS last.Aug 20 19:39
self_liarneighborlee: noAug 20 19:40
schestowitzself_liar: just watch how the CH-based ISO gave the finger to developing countries.Aug 20 19:40
neighborleeself_liar, ok sorry your grammar had me confused a bitAug 20 19:40
self_liarneighborlee: okAug 20 19:40
self_liarneighborlee: a lot of people buy pcs with linuxAug 20 19:40
self_liarself_liar: it's more cheap and more powerful pcsAug 20 19:41
schestowitzHahaha. Watch the spin:Aug 20 19:41
schestowitzhttp://www.adweek.com/aw/content_dis...Aug 20 19:41
self_liarneighborlee: but a lot of people in one month changes for windowzAug 20 19:41
schestowitzThe search business goes down every month and they say "it's only the beginning." Any plan? No. Yahoo? No. But it's still "Early".Aug 20 19:41
self_liarneighborlee: you know ,addiction, the poor people does not know about free softwareAug 20 19:42
schestowitzself_liar: how many people do you estimate use Linux (at some capacity) where you are?Aug 20 19:42
schestowitzRecently I found that in a college in the US, 15-25% are said to be GNU/Linux users.Aug 20 19:42
self_liarneighborlee: 8 percent i guess, at long timeAug 20 19:42
schestowitzWhere is that, roughly?Aug 20 19:43
schestowitzI saw some massive downloads of some distros I never heard about. Like 14 million in Brazil.Aug 20 19:43
self_liarschestowitz: but the exodus rate is very highAug 20 19:43
schestowitzHold on...Aug 20 19:44
schestowitzIt's out of date but good nonetheless: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/01/2...Aug 20 19:44
self_liarschestowitz: a lot of people use linux because is better or give more knowledgeAug 20 19:45
self_liarschestowitz: it's not because freedoomAug 20 19:45
self_liarschestowitz: they do not know nothing about GNUAug 20 19:46
self_liarschestowitz: for me this is very BAD,Aug 20 19:46
schestowitzThe press is _FILLED_ with this non-announcement < http://www.nytimes.com/idg/IDG_852573C400... >. W.E. must be busy pressuring journos to hype up HyperV. Aug 20 19:46
self_liarschestowitz: only 8 percent (about 15 million) uses linuxAug 20 19:46
schestowitzself_liar: had the press not been ignoring the adoption of FOSS in developing nations (rather than claim 90%+ for Microsoft, ignoring all but desktop), then RMS and his message would spread wider.Aug 20 19:47
neighborleewell, its going to take time , with those not pooor for the option to catch onAug 20 19:47
schestowitzWhich country is it, self_liar ?Aug 20 19:47
neighborleebecause windows for many, is adequate..people want a reason to switchAug 20 19:47
self_liarschestowitz:for me windowz it'not adequateAug 20 19:48
schestowitzneighborlee: if you're in AU (not sure), then expect people to switch last. Developing countries are key. Gates and other 'dug dealers' admit this when they talk about 'addicting' children.Aug 20 19:48
self_liarschestowitz: and all windowz in desktop here is piratedAug 20 19:48
neighborleeschestowitz, yupAug 20 19:49
self_liarschestowitz: like the cigarretes campaingAug 20 19:49
schestowitzself_liar: Microsoft makes little money in developing counties. It relies on those countries for "de facto standard" status.Aug 20 19:49
neighborleeyeah...very insideousAug 20 19:49
schestowitzI could show you memos Microsoft sends about treating 'piracy' in Brazil. It's ugly.Aug 20 19:49
self_liarschestowitz: can you show the memos?Aug 20 19:50
schestowitzYes, I can try. I posted some in BN, but with 3700 posts it'll take time to find.Aug 20 19:51
self_liarschestowitz: oh ,don t worryAug 20 19:51
*moparx (n=moparx@pdpc/supporter/base/moparx) has joined #boycottnovellAug 20 19:51
self_liarschestowitz: i will find ,it's not need to showAug 20 19:51
schestowitzTry finding one from Joachim.Aug 20 19:51
schestowitzJoachim Kempin, that's the chief with the dirty mouth. He shot down animals to death and got arrested some years ago.Aug 20 19:52
self_liarschestowitz: ok ,thanks ,i will findAug 20 19:52
schestowitzBig Brother Ballmer just found: http://www.alleyinsider.com/2008/8/microsoft...Aug 20 19:53
schestowitzWhat makes this < http://blog.wired.com/business/... > laughable is the smears Microsoft uses against Google, claiming it is the devil for spying. Microsoft has off-site spyware as well: IE, Windows.Aug 20 19:55
MinceRthey're both the devil for spyingAug 20 19:56
schestowitzMicrosoft turns WMP to spyware because of RealNetworks, according to RMS.Aug 20 19:56
schestowitz"But he started it!!!" Great logic right there.Aug 20 19:56
MinceR:DAug 20 19:57
schestowitzLot of Windows 7 vapouware announcements I see among the headlines right now (I bring them up as I go along very quickly :-) ).Aug 20 19:57
self_liarschestowitz: look at the wine page about homogeneous populationAug 20 19:58
schestowitzThey must be feeling the heat if they make false promises. In their own words:In the face of strong competition, Evangelism's focus may shift immediately to the next version of the same technology, however. Indeed, Phase 1 (Evangelism Starts) for version x+1 may start as soon as this Final Release of version X." http://www.groklaw.net/pdf/Comes-3096.pdfAug 20 19:58
schestowitzGot URL?Aug 20 19:58
self_liarschestowitz: wait a momentAug 20 19:59
schestowitzMS goes bio-spying: http://www.itnews.com.au/News/828...Aug 20 19:59
self_liarhttp://www.winehq.org/site/whyAug 20 19:59
self_liarYet, The US Department of Justice has "found" that Microsoft Windows is run by more than 95% of personal computers. Even taking Apple's Mac OS into account, Microsoft Windows is still present on more than 80% of computers, and this is likely also true in most other countries, not just in the US. Thus governments, companies and home users all over the world ultimately depend on a single provider: Microsoft.Aug 20 19:59
*Tallken has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Aug 20 20:00
*schestowitz looksAug 20 20:00
self_liarhttp://www.usdoj.gov/atr/cases/f...Aug 20 20:00
schestowitzA Web page for USDoJ is nice. Action would be nicer. DoJ is corrupt.Aug 20 20:01
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2007/10/23...Aug 20 20:01
self_liarschestowitz:M$ always spy users ,a lot of timeAug 20 20:03
self_liarschestowitz:windows, update, windows media player, IE, windows searchAug 20 20:03
schestowitzHere'e ZeeDee defending Microsoft with gentle words: http://www.electronista.com/arti... http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=1533 Yeah, like Gates, who invites the Chinese leaders to his house, can't intercept justice. This is ridiculous. And they contact the FTC in Taiwan. The FTC too is corrupt. Majoras et al...Aug 20 20:05
schestowitzself_liar: Yes, I know. Companies follow each others' bad standards and the sufferers are all of us.Aug 20 20:06
self_liarschestowitz:in my coutry a lot of people are stupidAug 20 20:07
schestowitzSome time ago I sent GL a headsup about Microsoft bloggers joining forces to spread marketing across the Web. I wonder if this news is related: http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource...Aug 20 20:07
schestowitz'professional'-grade astroturfing?Aug 20 20:08
schestowitzself_liar: stupidity is everywhere. It's a matter of focus. I'm stupid when it comes to lots of things.Aug 20 20:08
self_liarschestowitz: yes , but my people attacks the goverment instead of microsoftAug 20 20:09
schestowitzThe key is for techies to engage in coversation with -- say --- football buffs and explain to them about what we know better.Aug 20 20:09
schestowitzSame with pol;itics. Propaganda terms are used by the MAFIAA and software companies to pass new laws that politicians (lawyers) just can't understand.Aug 20 20:10
schestowitzIs it Brazil?Aug 20 20:10
self_liarschestowitz: yesAug 20 20:10
schestowitzGilberto Gill is a hero.Aug 20 20:10
self_liarschestowitz: for exampleAug 20 20:10
schestowitzGilAug 20 20:10
schestowitzHe should be made PM, not minister of culture. A country needs culture, not lawyers and economists.Aug 20 20:11
self_liarschestowitz: Ther a law here which enforce all ISP backup infos about usersAug 20 20:11
self_liarschestowitz: for me it's not a great problemAug 20 20:11
self_liarschestowitz: microsoft always do thisAug 20 20:12
schestowitzVideos @ Aug 20 20:12
schestowitzhttp://www.archive.org/search.ph...Aug 20 20:12
self_liarschestowitz: but my people hate  de goverment instead of microsoftAug 20 20:12
schestowitzself_liar: I was going to write about it today. I posted 2 links about the situation in Brazil yesterday.Aug 20 20:12
schestowitzGates visited Brazil some time ago. I think he signed some 'special' deal.Aug 20 20:13
self_liarschestowitz: do you know about this?Aug 20 20:14
schestowitzDescription of the original: Bill Gates and Brazilian President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva in Davos. Photo:ABr. Date:Jan/26/2003. http://commons.wikimedia...Aug 20 20:14
schestowitzI don't know much about the relationships there, no.Aug 20 20:15
self_liarschestowitz: i will find more info about thisAug 20 20:15
self_liari need to goAug 20 20:15
self_liarbyeAug 20 20:15
schestowitzSee you.Aug 20 20:15
*self_liar has quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")Aug 20 20:16
schestowitzA Microsoft exec takes over VMWarer and h00pla! http://www.internetnews.com/bus-news/ar... "VMware, Microsoft Decide to Play Nice [...] Virtualization newbie Microsoft and market leader VMware play nice, up to a point, with validation program. "Aug 20 20:18
neighborleeschestowitz, isn't a big part of defense of mono, that to legally abide with using it you must download from novel, which violates gpl ,,or am I missing something as im getting ready to post something on ubuntuAug 20 20:21
neighborleeits   tricky following all of this and looking like you know what your talking about LOLAug 20 20:21
schestowitzNo, that's Moonlight.Aug 20 20:21
neighborleesighAug 20 20:21
neighborleeno i mean the novel/M$ dealAug 20 20:21
schestowitzMoonight you need to get from Novell and 'protection' is not there. Mono is another issue and the lead developer/manager of the Silverlight team admitted that Mono is only 'safe' for Novell customers.Aug 20 20:23
neighborleeok so it applies to both themAug 20 20:23
neighborleeok so it applies to both thenAug 20 20:23
neighborleeok thxAug 20 20:23
schestowitzBlech! http://www.networkworld.com/news/2... http://news.zdnet.co.uk/softwar...Aug 20 20:24
schestowitzYes, in a way. Moonlight depends on Mono, too.Aug 20 20:24
neighborleedo you have url for where silverlight manager admitted this mono thingAug 20 20:25
schestowitzYes, hold on.Aug 20 20:25
neighborleekewl thxAug 20 20:25
schestowitz“Moonlight is usable for anyone on any distribution of Linux (redhat, ubuntu, etc.) — it is not limited just to Novell as Mono is.”Aug 20 20:26
schestowitz-Brian Goldfarb [Microsoft]Aug 20 20:26
schestowitzIt's in ZDNet.Aug 20 20:26
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schestowitzhttp://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-105...Aug 20 20:26
neighborleeok thxAug 20 20:27
schestowitzThis links should work: http://talkback.zdnet.com/52...Aug 20 20:28
schestowitzGrrrrr.... once again Microsoft uses Bollywood to play up its products. Yash Raj Films Partners with Microsoft Xbox 360 for Bachna Ae Haseeno - http://www.gameguru.in/microsoft-xbo...Aug 20 20:30
neighborleewellAug 20 20:36
neighborleethey are doing what they can to ressurerect a dieing breedAug 20 20:36
neighborleeWii is ruling them all atm, faictAug 20 20:36
neighborleebetween wii, wiifit, wiisports etc.,etc, and the much lower price I think they are all sufffering quite alot.Aug 20 20:37
neighborleeI know, having a wii, how incredibly immersive it is ;))Aug 20 20:37
schestowitzI would choose a WiiAug 20 20:37
schestowitzThe controller makes it a new experience.Aug 20 20:37
neighborleethats what did it for me yesAug 20 20:38
neighborleethat and the accessible simple'ish gameplay for everyoneAug 20 20:38
neighborleesimple but quite effective.Aug 20 20:38
neighborleewiisports I meanAug 20 20:38
schestowitzThe world needs a new paradigm... adults anyway.Aug 20 20:40
neighborleewell I never understood really , why having fun had to mean gore and blood and violenceAug 20 20:41
neighborleeits so not the case..ask any tennis player ;)Aug 20 20:41
*neighborlee of whom is one, since age 16 :))Aug 20 20:42
neighborleethats how wii hooked me ;))hahAug 20 20:42
neighborleeline and sinker LOLAug 20 20:42
neighborleeive had it for over a year now , and I still love playing wiitennis, its that much fun ;))Aug 20 20:42
schestowitzViolent games can be fun too. But the militgary fantasies are telly-imposed, I think.Aug 20 20:42
neighborleewell society is used to violent games, even though really one must admit they have no redeeming social value ;)Aug 20 20:43
neighborleebut yes clearly many are hooked on them for varoius reasons.Aug 20 20:43
neighborleeI didn't grow up with a computer or such games..boring board games, so I was never hooked as the young of today areAug 20 20:44
neighborleetrendsAug 20 20:45
schestowitzMcirosoft is renowned for gore and violence... and sexual content. it gets in trouble for it.Aug 20 20:45
schestowitzThough I could list some examples here...Aug 20 20:45
neighborleewasn't aware of that at allAug 20 20:45
neighborleeinterestingAug 20 20:46
neighborleebe nice if games that had such things, at least let you toggle them offAug 20 20:46
neighborleeI can think of one game offhand that does..UT2004Aug 20 20:46
schestowitzI'll get your some readings...Aug 20 20:46
neighborleekewlAug 20 20:46
schestowitzBritish Government Fires Back at EA & Microsoft: http://www.thegamereviews.com/stor...Aug 20 20:48
schestowitzHalo 3 Korea Promotion Part 2 ~ ver1~ : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ld...Aug 20 20:48
schestowitzMicrosoft XBox Banned Commercials: http://www.mall.hk/news/2007/08/2...Aug 20 20:48
schestowitzUK advertising authority nixes Xbox 360 spot: http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/mic...Aug 20 20:48
schestowitzViral Marketing Leads to Mock Gunfight: http://www.onthexbox.com/news981.htmlAug 20 20:48
schestowitzWhatsWrongWithU: http://www.armchairempire.com/News/?p=187Aug 20 20:48
schestowitzThose Microsoft Vista ads are really bizarre: http://www.adjab.com/2007/01/15/t...Aug 20 20:48
schestowitzFormer Miss Austrlia to sex up IT industry: http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff/4157506a28.htmlAug 20 20:48
schestowitzSo THIS is why people want Windows! : http://wolfgang.lonien.de/?p=388Aug 20 20:48
neighborleethis mono thing from M$ silverlight lead show totallly put an end to this whole  'mono is ecma standard' thing right ???Aug 20 20:49
neighborleeif im understanding all thisAug 20 20:50
neighborleeits just alot to process ;)Aug 20 20:50
neighborleeeven so, it violates gpl by making you get source from one location , if I read correctly.Aug 20 20:51
schestowitz neighborlee yes, Moonlight is analysed in Groklaw, too. The SFLC does not like it.Aug 20 20:51
schestowitzneighborlee: Moonlight needs binary codecs for compatibility. That's downstream code (well, binary) from Mcirosoft.Aug 20 20:52
neighborleeEEKAug 20 20:52
neighborleetalk about a mess LOLAug 20 20:52
neighborleeohhh but its ok to use LOLAug 20 20:52
neighborleeit just keeps getting better ;)Aug 20 20:52
schestowitzAre you discussing this in Ubuntu Forums?Aug 20 20:53
neighborleenot yetAug 20 20:53
neighborleeI was preparing properly  to avoid ambush :)-0Aug 20 20:53
neighborleehttp://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=...Aug 20 20:54
neighborleeneed to  rsepoind toLaRoza ,,who claims mono follows ecma standard lolAug 20 20:54
schestowitzWatch this troll comment: http://digg.com/linux_unix/Gno...Aug 20 20:55
schestowitzI spotted it after seeing this article: http://www.linux.com/feed/145352Aug 20 20:56
schestowitzI'm sick on Mono boosters on the Web. Some are paid "Evangelist" from Microsoft. I saw some signing that way when boosting Silverlight.Aug 20 20:56
trmancoI've heard that there is a new version of moonlightAug 20 21:01
trmancoLooks like the team developing it is all fired up *shame*Aug 20 21:02
schestowitzI've also heard there's a new pickle in the neighbour's jar. :-)Aug 20 21:02
trmanco:PAug 20 21:02
schestowitzWhat do you mean by fired up?Aug 20 21:03
trmancothey are really on to itAug 20 21:03
schestowitzActually, based on Jason Perlow's coversation with Miguel, things stood in the way and Moonlight _LOST_ steam.Aug 20 21:03
schestowitzI can find this if needed.Aug 20 21:03
schestowitzFound it. "And sadly, there are very few people willing to contribute to make this happen on time.”"Aug 20 21:05
trmancosure, I would love to take a peak on that, if you don't mind finding itAug 20 21:05
schestowitzhttp://blogs.zdnet.com/perlow/?p=9214Aug 20 21:05
trmancothanksAug 20 21:05
schestowitzBut right now, Moonlight only supports Silverlight 1.0 apps, and NBCOlympics.com is implemented using 2.0. As Novell’s chief Mono/Moonlight developer, Miguel de Icaza told me several weeks ago before the NBCOlympics content launch, “Work on this has started, but it will take a lot of work. And sadly, there are very few people willing to contribute to make this happen on time.”Aug 20 21:05
schestowitzI hope that some SUSE/Novell devs will sober up and realise what they do to F/LOSSAug 20 21:06
trmanco“Work on this has started, but it will take a lot of work. And sadly, there are very few people willing to contribute to make this happen on time.” oh really, no wonder :|Aug 20 21:07
trmancowho is going to contribute to such a thing?Aug 20 21:07
schestowitzMicrosoft?Aug 20 21:08
trmancowell, yesAug 20 21:08
trmancobut they are the creators, right?Aug 20 21:09
schestowitzI don't know if they put money into it, but they sure give documentation. They need Novell to pretend that Silverlight is crossplatform**, for the regulators.Aug 20 21:09
trmanco*pretend* :)Aug 20 21:09
schestowitz[**] (small prints -  just some trashy second-class catch-up work because GNU/Linux is Microsoft's #1 threat to sabotage).Aug 20 21:09
neighborleeschestowitz, what LOLAug 20 21:10
neighborleethougy I do like pickles lolAug 20 21:10
schestowitzWell, the neighbour's pickle you can't have. Ballmer would wrestle you for it.Aug 20 21:13
schestowitzAnd that's Moonlight. It's a piece of cheese in an open................. bear trap.Aug 20 21:14
trmancoRemember when Ballmer was received in Hungary with eggs thrown at his face?Aug 20 21:16
*MinceR remembersAug 20 21:17
MinceR(i'm hungarian)Aug 20 21:17
schestowitzHahaha, http://lxer.com/module/forums/t/27688/Aug 20 21:17
trmancoWell, I loved thatAug 20 21:17
schestowitzMinceR: seen the latest action against MS i Hungary? Just days/weeks old...Aug 20 21:18
trmancoI hope it happens more often, but with different *objects*Aug 20 21:18
trmancoschestowitz: you are getting famousAug 20 21:18
schestowitzNa... in LXer there was some BN haters.Aug 20 21:19
schestowitzThe good news is that *EVEN* LXer is changing its view.Aug 20 21:19
schestowitzThe people in Linux Today, by contast, seem to love my posts most of the time. Digg also. It's just some people in LXer who defend(ed) Mono.Aug 20 21:19
trmancomaybe devs?Aug 20 21:20
schestowitzMaybe. I don't know them.Aug 20 21:20
trmancoor some people contributing to the m*no projectAug 20 21:20
schestowitzSome are German, so they are protective of S.u.S.E.Aug 20 21:20
MinceRi'm not sure which action was latestAug 20 21:21
schestowitzIn FSDaily it's a different story. There's no defence of Novell there. Same in Linux Today. I don't know why, but the crowds are different. Groklaw people are also OK with BN.Aug 20 21:21
trmancoSuSe use te be a good distro a couple of years backAug 20 21:21
schestowitzIt still is, technically speaking.Aug 20 21:21
trmancowell yesAug 20 21:21
schestowitzSusan Linton reckons it's better than Mandriva ATM, having been the opposite a year ago.Aug 20 21:22
trmancoto bad the company supporting it is going to the wrong sideAug 20 21:22
schestowitzit's not surprising.Aug 20 21:22
schestowitzMicrosoft needed to grab a potetial leaderAug 20 21:22
schestowitz*potentialAug 20 21:22
trmancoI can still remember when a teacher of mine told me that Novell was an awesome to the GNU/Linux communityAug 20 21:23
schestowitz"hIt's just business for Microsoft, and business is better when Linux is limping. So Microsoft is trying to kill off the Linux market leader by giving Novell a compelling differentiator. The day that Novell becomes a threat to Microsoft's business, however, is the day that the deal is shut down." ttp://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10020866-16.htmlAug 20 21:23
MinceRafaik suse has always been reputed to be a bad distroAug 20 21:23
schestowitzhttp://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10...Aug 20 21:23
trmancoMinceR: not hereAug 20 21:23
schestowitzNo, not as far as I know. It's advanced. Was always KDE-based, admins-oriented.Aug 20 21:23
schestowitzThat's why I like Juna's blog: http://www.junauza.com/2008/08/...Aug 20 21:25
schestowitzWow! This is big: http://www.groklaw.net/artic...Aug 20 21:29
schestowitz"SCO was enjoined from making certain claims in Germany, and it signed an agreement in 2003 not to say them there, because its alternate choice was to have to prove them immediately, so it chose silence. As a result, SCO can't say in Germany that Linux violates SCO's IP or that end users could be liable for violations of SCO's intellectual property or that Linux is an unauthorized derivative of UNIX. Unless it can prove it."Aug 20 21:29
schestowitzI knew about these German laws. If true and generally applicable, Microsoft can be sued for slander (against Linux) in Germany.Aug 20 21:30
trmancoI hope soAug 20 21:30
schestowitzI have a PDF somewhere which talks about this German law (should be expanded elsewhere).Aug 20 21:30
neighborleewelll, yes suse is a lovely installer,,but too bad their political ties or backwards indeedAug 20 21:31
schestowitzIf SCO was working at the behest of Microsoft, that's another potential fine and public embarrassment that exceeds SCO's balance sheet (pink slip).Aug 20 21:31
schestowitzI had SUSE on all my machines before the deal was signed.Aug 20 21:31
schestowitzThe most impactful writeup (for me at least) was the post from Bruce Perens. Later came his petition.Aug 20 21:31
schestowitzWeird and inaccurate pick for Susan's standards... strange: vAug 20 21:37
schestowitzhttp://blackravenplace.net76.net/blog6...Aug 20 21:37
schestowitzThis guy mentions BoycottNovell, but it's not the first time that he criticises the site. Whatever. Let him defend Mono. http://blog.ibeentoubuntu.com/2008/08/fanb...Aug 20 21:38
twitteryes, shame on Intel.Aug 20 22:17
*schestowitz runs AMD. Twice. Dual. AMD is no saint, but the lesser of the two evils.Aug 20 22:18
*Ziggyfish (n=brendan@123-243-163-103.static.tpgi.com.au) has joined #boycottnovellAug 20 22:18
neighborleewell at least they now own ati, which is trying to work with oss...im curious if it will cause nvida to consider similar optionsAug 20 22:33
trmancoa have an intel cpu and an ati graphics card :|Aug 20 22:34
schestowitzAMD has just added overclocking support.Aug 20 22:34
trmancowhen I bought mu computer I never heard of FOSSAug 20 22:35
trmanco:|Aug 20 22:35
trmancomy*Aug 20 22:35
MinceRi have an intel cpu and an nvidia gpuAug 20 22:36
twitterHere's more money down the corruption hole:  http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=...Aug 20 22:38
schestowitz\At least boycottnovell is mentioned, so they don't get away without criticism.Aug 20 22:40
twitterwhere?Aug 20 22:45
schestowitzI saw one hypelinks and som e text. I didn't unfold any comments though. We always appear somewhere in /. when there's a story about Novell. Sometimes Shane jumps in too.Aug 20 22:46
twittercomments look like a crap flood to me.  One AC, way down, linked to BN.  You had to go through some really nasty stuff to get there.Aug 20 22:48
schestowitzWhat nasty stuff? I didn't read. I just did a "find as you type".Aug 20 22:49
twitterThe second post, http://slashdot.org/comments.pl...Aug 20 22:49
schestowitzSlashdot should ban and delete again. Didn't they 'clean up'?Aug 20 22:51
twitter:) here's a nice top post:  http://slashdot.org/comments.pl...Aug 20 22:57
twitterha ha.Aug 20 22:57
schestowitzIs that you?!?Aug 20 22:58
twitterSureAug 20 22:59
twitterI can't believe the crap flood left open that slot.Aug 20 22:59
twitterGot some specific links to coupon stories?  A follow up will be nice and cost them more mod points when they bury it.Aug 20 23:00
schestowitzCoupon stories? Sure.Aug 20 23:02
schestowitzHow's this one? http://boycottnovell.com/2007/03/...Aug 20 23:03
*dsmith_ (n=dsmith@c-76-114-142-224.hsd1.md.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovellAug 20 23:13
schestowitzHey, DOUGManAug 20 23:14
twitterthanks.Aug 20 23:30

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