Bonum Certa Men Certa

Manuel Estrada Sainz (ranty), Andres Garcia (ErConde) & Debian Deaths overworking

posted by Roy Schestowitz on Feb 21, 2024

People have noticed that Thiemo Seufer's death in a car accident occurred after working on Christmas Day. That was in 2008. It turns out there was a precedent for this.

Manuel Estrada Sainz (ranty) and Andres Garcia (ErConde) from Seville traveled to the city of Valencia, on the other side of Spain for the Congreso de Software Libre.

The conference ran from Thursday, 6 May to Saturday, 8 May 2004. It looks like they spent one extra day and night in the Valencia region at the home of Jesus Climent (mooch) who lives south of Valencia in Gandia.

They used Sunday night to try and drive all the way back to Seville. According to reports, they completed ninety-nine percent of the journey and then died in a car accident.

The deaths were discussed on the debian-private gossip network. Robert Millan commented that Sr Estrada had worked all night at a previous DebConf.

I found an archived copy of Sr Estrada's web site. It has a large banner on the front page, Wellcome to HELL. Coincidentally, the distance from Valencia to Seville is approximately 666km.

Manuel Estrada Sainz, ranty, Debian, Seville

Manuel Estrada Sainz, ranty, Debian, Seville

I can imagine that drive, it is a similar distance as the journey from Melbourne to Canberra.

A tribute page was created. It tells us that the site of the accident was Alcalá de Guadaira but there are no other details about how the accident came about or whether any third parties were injured. There are 347 comments on the tribute page. They tell us that Sr Estrada was a graduate of the University of Salamanca while Andres Garcia had previously been involved in activities in Malaga.

Police road safety campaigns tell us that driving without sleep makes us ten times more likely to be involved in a crash.

After the car accident, people immediately began to talk about making a tribute to Sr Estrada and Sr Garcia. Yet when Frans Pop committed suicide, people wanted to avoid a tribute. People who drive without sleep are not only a risk to themselves, they are also a risk to other drivers, cyclists, pedestrians and cats. Therefore, if they did take this risk, are they really more deserving than Frans Pop when it comes to a public tribute or dedication?

In the same year as the conference, the Valencia region committed to use free software. The desktop OS, Lliurex, is derived from Edubuntu, Ubuntu and Debian. A report claims they have saved €36 million with this strategy but the lives lost producing Debian, including those who died on the drive home, are not mentioned in the report at all.

Read more about the history and evolution of the Debian Harassment & Abuse culture

How we were informed about the casualties

Subject: A fellow DD passed away last night
Date: Mon, 10 May 2004 14:09:06 +0200 (CEST)
From: jesus.daniel@hispalinux.es
To: debian-private@lists.debian.org

Dear DDs.
Last night Manuel Estrada Sainz, along with another friend, Andres Garcia, passed away in a car accident. The details of the accident itself are still unknown. I was the last person to see them alive before they left from my home town, Gandia, and the news have struck me so badly that I will be taking few days off. My mind and my heart are with both of them.
Jesus Climent aka mooch@d.o

Discussion of dedications and comparison to Chris Rutter

Subject: Re: A fellow DD passed away last night
Date: Wed, 12 May 2004 15:13:54 +0200
From: Wouter Verhelst <wouter@grep.be>
To: debian-private@lists.debian.org
CC: debian-private@lists.debian.org

On Wed, May 12, 2004 at 02:47:45PM +0200, Andreas Tille wrote: > On Wed, 12 May 2004, Jesus Climent wrote: > > > teo@d.o, and other friends: dedicate sarge to his memory and put the next > > machine which enters the project with the name of Ranty. I will be putting a > ACK, even if I would love if we would run in trouble to find further names > for our machines according this naming scheme.
This was proposed on a previous occasion, too; when Chris Rutter died, on March 1, 2001, the same proposal was made by various other people. Back then, it was decided not to do this, because Joel Klecker was viewed upon as a special case -- one whom everybody knew as being very active and very dedicated regarding Debian.
The same wasn't true about Chris Rutter; for that reason, woody wasn't dedicated to his memory, nor did we name a machine after him. Instead, his name is still on the frontpage of the log viewing system he designed, which is now available at http://buildd.debian.org/
I'm not saying we should not, in any case, do what has been proposed here; but on the other hand, we should not go like "somebody died, we should dedicate a machine and a release to him or her" -- this should be something we can all agree on, rather than an automated response. If we don't do it that way, the end result will be that we have a number of people we're trying to remember, without remembering who they were.
What was done in the case of Chris Rutter was that he was given honour in a few areas, those where he had done the most work. That is why I can now say that Chris Rutter was an ARM porter who died in a car accident, rather than the far more vague "Chris Rutter was some random Debian Developer who died a few years ago".
Wouldn't it be better to do something similar here, too?
-- EARTH smog | bricks AIR -- mud -- FIRE soda water | tequila WATER -- with thanks to fortune

Worked all night at DebConf

Subject: Re: A fellow DD passed away last night
Date: Mon, 10 May 2004 15:22:11 +0200
From: Robert Millan <zeratul2@wanadoo.es>
To: debian-private@lists.debian.org

I remember Manuel Estrada (ranty) as a very nice person. I spent the whole last night of debconf-es talking and hacking with him and other fellows. I believe I met Andres at debconf-es too, but didn't have the chance to know him further, I'm afraid.
I want to share the photos with you:
http://people.debian.org/~rmh/debconf-es/debconf-es-2%20009.jpg (with Guillem Jover and me)
http://people.debian.org/~rmh/debconf-es/debconf-es-2%20012.jpg (hacking on his laptop)
http://people.debian.org/~rmh/debconf-es/debconf-es-2%20015.jpg
So long, Manuel. I'll miss you.
-- Robert Millan
"[..] but the delight and pride of Aule is in the deed of making, and in the thing made, and neither in possession nor in his own mastery; wherefore he gives and hoards not, and is free from care, passing ever on to some new work."
-- J.R.R.T., Ainulindale (Silmarillion)

Read more about the history and evolution of the Debian Harassment & Abuse culture

Other Recent Techrights' Posts

When You're Evil and You're Publicly Attacking Something, That Something Will Become More Popular
when an oppressor becomes openly oppressive and does anything to squash/censor critics, the outcome will typically be detrimental to the oppressor
 
Rumours of Impending Mass Layoffs in IBM's Yorktown Office, Impacting the LLM (Slop) Staff
Bubbles never last forever, hence their name
Links 10/08/2026: "Long COVID Linked to Lasting Damage in The Brain's Dopamine System", Microsoft’s Weather App Uses Over 1,000 Megabytes of RAM
Links for the day
Software Freedom Conservancy (SFC) Does Not Support Women, It Imitates Authentic Organisations, Embraces Misogynists, Then Projects
They try to monetise for personal gain at the expense of unpaid volunteers
Links 10/08/2026: "Against Oligarch" and "The Invisible Women"
Links for the day
Social Control Media Deathwatch: After Nearly a Million Posts Sent EchoFeed Shuts Down
EchoFeed is hardly unique
When the LLM Chatbots Industry (Trillions in the Red) Quits Paying the Media for FOMO
fear of missing out, or FOMO for short
Microsoft Killing Morale
branding the process “inhumane” and “demoralizing”
Google's "AI Overview" as Proprietary Censorship Engine and Gatekeeper
People do not choose to use this, Google is just shoving that in people's faces, encouraging laziness and misinformation
SLAPP Censorship - Part 145 Out of 200: They Tried Hard to Hide the Fact Their Client Had Been Sued, Twice Even
A month ago Brett Wilson LLP tried to take my wife "to the side" (in effect isolated) to make her an offer
statCounter: GNU/Linux Up to 8.95% Globally
So the estimates are being "corrected" upwards, not downwards
Explaining How Someone Attempted to Cancel RMS This Year (and Failed)
The process itself involved debunking some falsehoods
Microsoft's "XBOX Ranks Last", IBM is Headed for Extinction
If Microsoft cannot dominate its own "home turf", what prospects are there elsewhere?
DebConf6 fight denied by Google artificial intelligence
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Sunday, August 09, 2026
IRC logs for Sunday, August 09, 2026
Gemini Links 10/08/2026: A Mild Monday, Sleepy Saturday, OUYA, and Moving to GNU/Linux
Links for the day
Links 09/08/2026: US Blackouts (Energy Wasted), Slop to Evade Accountability, and Software Patents Framed as "Hey Hi"
Links for the day
Gemini Links 09/08/2026: Parakeets in Britain and Rant About 'Modern' Washing Machines
Links for the day
Links 09/08/2026: Social Control Media Weaponises Immigration, Europe Suffers Severe Drought, and "Internet of Stuff" Explained
Links for the day
SLAPP Censorship - Part 144 Out of 200: The "Hired Guns" ("Media" at BW) Shrank Almost Three-Fold Since They Sued Us in 2024
No wonder they're so visibly outnumbered
10 Days Ago Red Hat Formally Terminated Employment of About 500 Technical Workers (the Media Didn't Mention This)
IBM has nothing left to do except fire people (in secret) whilst attacking sites that give these people a voice
Freenode Continues to Shed Off Servers and Users, Good Thing We Abandoned It
you cannot sell communities. It leads to chaos
Daniel Pocock in the Sunday Times (Today)
Expect the attacks (from Pocock's haters, motivated by envy) to intensify
Controlling One's Platform
We need to strive for or actively pursue a Web where everyone has their own platform/s and where censors ("moderators") have no direct control over these platforms
Improving the Static Site Generator (SSG), Fixing Bugs
Next month the site's SSG turns 3
Gemini Links 09/08/2026: Meatballs (1979), Gopher, RSS Experiment
Links for the day
2026: The Year Richard Stallman Came Back to American Campuses
There's more on the way
IBM's "Next Step" Program
Apparently close to 1,000 people being laid off by IBM wasn't worth reporting
XBox is Rotting Away, Technical Issues for Second Time in Two Weeks
XBox is dying
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Saturday, August 08, 2026
IRC logs for Saturday, August 08, 2026
Red Hat is in Need of a 'Jolla', as an IBM-Controlled Red Hat is Becoming Like the Microsoft-Infiltrated Nokia
Dying fast, partly by design
Gemini Links 08/08/2026: Gigs, Poems, SREs, and Shared Passion
Links for the day
If GNU/Linux Rising is Just "Bots" (It's Not, Many Surveys Show the Same), Why Does Microsoft Rush to Lie About System Requirements of Vista 11?
The real reason is, GNU/Linux is rising
Kompromat Tactics in GNU and Linux
Kompromat as a concept was covered here in the past in relation to Microsoft
SLAPP Censorship - Part 143 Out of 200: After Nearly 10 Attempts to Settle With Us and Over a Million Pounds Spent on Lawyers and Barristers
We are in no particular hurry
20 Years and 43 Years
GNU/Linux is not just code, it's a philosophy, licence (copyleft), and community
GNU/Linux Turns 43 Next Month, Many Distros Actively Maintained
A lot of Debian-based distros are still actively maintained (we talk about this in IRC this evening), so the stability of the Debian Project is important
Links 08/08/2026: GAFAM Colonialism "Paved Over Protected Wetlands", Slop Companies Hoard Software Patents as Debt Soars to Trillions
Links for the day
Links 08/08/2026: "Palantir Paid No Federal Income Tax" and "Who's Responsible for This Mess?"
Links for the day
Retained: The Time IBM's Red Hat Tried to Hijack or Take Offline Site of Critics, Failed on All Grounds (Meritless Action Intended to Harass Critics)
Replicated from adrforum.com
IBM's 'Final Solution': Censor Sites Not Controlled by IBM, Sites Where Dissent is Expressed
IBM has no culture of free speech
More Mass Layoffs Coming IBM's Way (Ones IBM Cannot Hide, Cannot Convince Enough People to Leave or Unjustifiably PIP Them When They Say No)
The company that was like a "father of modern computing" is now stingy when it comes to travel. Not a good sign.
What Will it Take for Mainstream Media to Report Silent or Secret Layoffs at IBM?
"Silent" or "secret" sometimes because the media won't cover them
Is the Future of IBM Red Hat Temporary Staff, Contractors?
They want cheap, obedient lemmings
Gemini Links 08/08/2026: Tribute to Lloyd Center, Radio Amateurism, Homeworlds
Links for the day
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Friday, August 07, 2026
IRC logs for Friday, August 07, 2026