Bonum Certa Men Certa

IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: October 4th, 2008 - Part 1


Enter the IRC channel now

schestowitzIt also preferred not to attack people's desire to write good code and share it.Oct 04 00:03
pombat42Of course. It's the calm before the storm. IBM=sophisticated vs Microsoft = Bull in a china shop.Oct 04 00:04
schestowitzIBM = Lotus blobs on top of patent-'protected' "Linux". I just keep a distance from IBM. Even Sun is easier to trust...Oct 04 00:05
pombat42Schestowitz: I agree with you concerning Sun. They are a very good company with little pretense. What you see is what you get, mostly.Oct 04 00:06
*pombat42 ( has left #boycottnovell ("Leaving")Oct 04 00:11
*PetoKraus ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 00:49
MinceRgnOct 04 00:55
*ld50 ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 01:00
*PetoKraus has quit ("The purpose of IRC is to...IDLE...")Oct 04 01:17
schestowitzI've leaked the remainder of OOXML. Over 4 gigs of traffic in today.Oct 04 01:27
*pombat42 ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 01:46
schestowitzbrbOct 04 02:10
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Oct 4 02:10:55 2008
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Oct 4 02:15:04 2008
*Now talking on #boycottnovellOct 04 02:15
*Topic for #boycottnovell is: "Exploring the reality behind exclusionary deals with Microsoft and their subtle (yet severe) implications"Oct 04 02:15
*Topic for #boycottnovell set by schestowitz at Mon Sep 22 17:17:52 2008Oct 04 02:15
-ChanServ-[#boycottnovell] Welcome to the #boycottnovell channelOct 04 02:15
*ChanServ gives channel operator status to schestowitzOct 04 02:15
*logger_bot has quit ( 04 02:23
*logger_bot ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 02:23
*ZiggyFish ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 02:44
*pinana ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 05:27
*pinana has quit ("Leaving")Oct 04 05:59
*kentma ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 06:15
*kentma1 ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 07:40
*kentma has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))Oct 04 07:40
schestowitz "So where does this leave us? GNOME has been encumbered with Microsoft patents. Microsoft clearly has no regard for anyone's intellectual property, albeit their own, and will stop at nothing to gain control or draw the life from new innovations in order to keep afloat their failing ideal. What can we do about it?"Oct 04 07:43
*PetoKraus ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 07:44
*PetoKraus has quit ("The purpose of IRC is to...IDLE...")Oct 04 07:50
schestowitzWhoa. BoycottNovell is passing about 10 MB/minute this morning.Oct 04 07:55
schestowitzBN now down because of the load. :-(Oct 04 08:00
*trmanco ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 08:36
schestowitzSudden outbreak of democracy baffles US pundits ... "The outrage isn't the spooky part. The really odd thing is that if you had to rely on the mainstream US newspapers and TV channels - and nothing else - you'd wouldn't know something remarkable was happening. Which is that the Treasury Secretary's Bailout Plan had united parts of America who spend most of their energy hitting each other over the head, in common opposition to the pOct 04 08:39
schestowitzroposal."Oct 04 08:39
schestowitz 04 08:40
schestowitzThen again: Apple shares plunge after Jobs 'heart attack' < >Oct 04 08:41
*kentma ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 08:44
*kentma1 has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Oct 04 08:46
kentmaschestowitz: why's BN become so popular, do you think?Oct 04 09:44
schestowitz"PJ: Just an off the wall suggestion: look into how Psystar folks are paying their lawyers to harass Apple? No? Too simple? I only raise it because Jobs has said that Apple is being shorted; and if that's true, any negative news would be useful to anyone wanting the stock to go down, I would assume, and any litigation is negative news."Oct 04 09:44
schestowitz : SEC Examining False Report on Apple Chief JobsOct 04 09:45
schestowitzkentma: it's because of the leaked OOXML specs.Oct 04 09:45
kentmaahh, what was in the specs?Oct 04 09:45
schestowitzBugs, of course.Oct 04 09:46
trmancololOct 04 09:48
schestowitzOther possible proxy fights, against Google..Oct 04 09:48
schestowitz 04 09:49
schestowitz"Never in the future? What is the guy asking for, permanent government oversight of two private companies just in case someday the deal might not work out even though it isn't an antitrust problem currently? This is an extraordinary request. Is that how capitalism works normally? Anyone know who donates money to this individual? Man, Microsoft sure is a sore loser."Oct 04 09:49
schestowitz 04 09:49
*libervisco has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Oct 04 09:49
*moparx has quit ("leaving")Oct 04 09:50
schestowitzGoogle and Apple may have already been sued in the past via Microsoft proxies (I have example). Google for a fact. They also hired shills to poo-poo that deal (via LawMedia), so it seems like they might be doing to Apple and Google what they potentially do to GNU/Linux by injecting money for SCO to sue..Oct 04 09:51
trmanco 04 10:01
schestowitzThanks, seen it earlier.Oct 04 10:02
trmancoweird thoOct 04 10:02
trmancoor maybe notOct 04 10:03
schestowitzChanging operating systems requires a change in mindset : 04 10:03
schestowitzMSI was never serious about Linux. Same with H-POct 04 10:03
trmancothey forgot to say that Linux netbook have bigger sales than windows netbboksOct 04 10:03
schestowitzStats from Acer or Dell would be more interesting.Oct 04 10:03
trmancoasus tooOct 04 10:03
trmancoI king of like the EEEOct 04 10:03
trmancokind*Oct 04 10:03
zoobabdoes not matter, what matters is that the price of the OS is being displayedOct 04 10:04
*Tallken ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 10:05
Tallkenschestowitz: have you got some more details about Ballmer's visit to Portugal?Oct 04 10:07
Tallken(hi)Oct 04 10:07
schestowitzTallken: I wrote everything I know yesterday... well, and linked to some older information.Oct 04 10:10
trmanco 04 10:12
schestowitz "There, he said it. Microsoft is interested in making money. That's what CEO Steve Ballmer said in reference to Microsoft's motivation in the mobile space."Oct 04 10:13
schestowitzDespite the massive losses there, shipments of Windows Mobile are still bad.... Windows Mobile misses annual shipment target < >Oct 04 10:14
Tallkenya, was reading nowOct 04 10:16
TallkenI'd found an articleOct 04 10:16
Tallkenthought you'd like it, but I see you've got it covered :)Oct 04 10:16
schestowitzWhich one?Oct 04 10:17
schestowitzIn particular, I want to know more about the visit to Portugal. Ballmer and your president seem too close... a bit like Sarko who is having vacations at the homes of Micfrosofters.Oct 04 10:18
zoobabSarko is responsible for OOXML position in FRanceOct 04 10:19
schestowitzPoliticians love money and companies/execs just love corruptible politicians, whom they are they likely to fund in the form of campaign contributions. I still worry about Brown's and Blair's dirty dances in the Bilderberg Group, which may be partly responsible for them being elected (it's all about public perception, which boils down to adverti$$ing)Oct 04 10:20
Tallkenschestowitz: this article, it hasn't much more info than the others I guess (in PT) 04 10:21
schestowitz 04 10:21
schestowitzTallken: later on I'll read a Microsoft feed (I have about 1000 items unread because I was away). I'll try to find reports about other businesses Ballmer spoke to in Portuga. Someone who mailed thinks that FullSIX in Portugal is doing AstroTurfing for Microsoft there. There's circumstantial evidence.Oct 04 10:23
Tallkenok, give me a nudge when you post itOct 04 10:24
trmanco 04 10:24
TallkenI've been having troubles keeping up with the RSS as wellOct 04 10:24
zoobabis there a way to only activate javascript for certain websites on firefox?Oct 04 10:28
zoobabnoscript does the jobOct 04 10:29
schestowitzIs this a Q &A?Oct 04 10:31
zoobabI am just trying to save my batteryOct 04 10:32
zoobabI am looking to buy a netbookOct 04 10:32
schestowitzI just read pages, not 'execute them. :-)Oct 04 10:33
schestowitzNoScript lets you set up rules for JSOct 04 10:33
zoobabbut firefox just keeps eating CPU and memory while doing nothingOct 04 10:33
schestowitzFirefox is very fat.Oct 04 10:33
schestowitzFF3.0 should be better than 2.0.x though. I still use the latter.Oct 04 10:33
kentmaff3 is much better than 2.x, but it's still bigger than I'd likeOct 04 10:34
Tallkenzoobab: Opera or ChromeOct 04 10:40
*Sivvis (i=5c690c82@gateway/web/ajax/ has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 10:42
trmancoschestowitz, do you have any linux netbook sales stats vs windows?Oct 04 10:42
zoobabChrome is not yet available for linux, right?Oct 04 10:42
trmancozoobab, you need wineOct 04 10:43
schestowitzOnly with Wine, which leaves it buggier than it already isOct 04 10:43
zoobab:-)Oct 04 10:43
trmancothere are deb packages of chromeOct 04 10:43
schestowitztrmanco: no, not quite. Not for more than a single vendor anyway.Oct 04 10:43
*libervisco (n=daniel@tuxhacker/libervisco) has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 10:43
trmancowhich vendor?Oct 04 10:44
trmancoasus?Oct 04 10:44
schestowitzAsus said some months ago that Windows will outsell Linux 2:1. It got close to Microsoft ("we are currently closely tied up with Microsoft")Oct 04 10:44
schestowitzIt's just like OLPC. Microsoft plays whack-a-mole also by pressuring vendors, who then cease to /improve/ or maintain (properly) their Linux offerings.Oct 04 10:45
trmancoI can't beleive that people still but the windows xp junkOct 04 10:46
trmancothat OS is from 2001Oct 04 10:46
trmanco....Oct 04 10:46
schestowitzThey got 'addicted' to Windows.Oct 04 10:47
schestowitz 04 10:47
schestowitzBill Gates: “They’ll get sort of addicted, and then we’ll somehow figure out how to collect sometime in the next decade.”Oct 04 10:47
schestowitzbeos founder wrote (I think in "that who controls bootloader") that Gates realised he could establish lock-in through DEVELO~1 DEVELO~1 DEVELO~1. That was a long time ago in Paris, IIC.Oct 04 10:48
trmanco 04 10:49
zoobabyou have to change architechtureOct 04 10:49
schestowitzThey adapt,  just like a wookie.Oct 04 10:50
schestowitzWatch how they extended XP's lifeline just because of sub-notebooks. 2+ years...Oct 04 10:51
zoobabI hope ARM will come to the rescueOct 04 10:51
zoobabthe thing is that Firefox just consumes too much RAM, CPUOct 04 10:51
schestowitzThey have a light version coming. Milestone 8 reaches some days ago (Fennec.. maybe milestone 9)Oct 04 10:54
zoobabgoodOct 04 10:55
schestowitz*reachedOct 04 10:57
zoobabat some point I will go back to links framebufferOct 04 11:07
*ld50 has quit ("Lost terminal")Oct 04 11:08
schestowitzIt gets harder.Oct 04 11:08
schestowitzTry steering around without JS, Flash blobs, pop-ups etc. and see how far you can navigate.Oct 04 11:09
zoobabthe web is getting bloatedOct 04 11:27
zoobabit is a matter of facts with all of those javascript everywhereOct 04 11:28
schestowitzSome sites have JS coming from about 7 domains. I;ve seen /more/. Visit one site, be spied by 7.Oct 04 11:31
zoobabzoobab@warsaw /home/zoobab [43]$ xvidcapOct 04 11:34
zoobabSegmentation faultOct 04 11:34
MinceRhow are you gentlemen !!Oct 04 11:34
zoobabtrying to capture broken JS bug, found another one :-)Oct 04 11:34
schestowitzWhat distro?Oct 04 11:38
zoobabubuntuOct 04 11:38
schestowitzI'm going to do a quick post about Microsoft vs. Google|Apple.Oct 04 11:38
schestowitzDone before, being done again.Oct 04 11:39
schestowitz(by proxy, as always, with evidence)Oct 04 11:39
*cez0161 (i=5b6d526a@gateway/web/ajax/ has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 11:40
*cez0161 has quit (Client Quit)Oct 04 11:41
zoobabkdecore (KLibLoader): WARNING: KLibrary: /usr/lib/ undefined symbol: OpenSSL_add_all_algorithms_confOct 04 11:42
zoobabkio (KIOConnection): ERROR: Could not write dataOct 04 11:42
zoobabKonqueror nowOct 04 11:42
zoobabSegmentation faultOct 04 11:42
schestowitzWhich site?Oct 04 11:43
schestowitzApps are very stable in KDE on Mandriv 2008.1 (KDE 3.5.x).Oct 04 11:43
*Sivvis has quit (" ajax IRC Client")Oct 04 11:49
zoobabI will start it with straceOct 04 11:55
*AVRS2 (n=AVRS2@wikimedia/AVRS) has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 12:15
*ZiggyFish has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))Oct 04 12:46
*Adaptux (i=513e02d0@gateway/web/ajax/ has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 12:48
AVRS2Beeline advertises iPhone on TV :SOct 04 13:12
schestowitz ?Oct 04 13:13
AVRS2Beeline (telecommunications)Oct 04 13:14
schestowitzHmmm... I've just realised that FF2 has keystrike 'tracking' (spyware) in its search bar. A power they could abuse...Oct 04 13:14
AVRS2(Vympelcom)Oct 04 13:14
schestowitziPhone is advertised everywhere here in the UK.Oct 04 13:14
schestowitz 04 13:15
AVRS2iPhone hasn't been here officially till now.Oct 04 13:17
schestowitzGood for you. Fewer snobs in the streets.;-)Oct 04 13:23
AVRS2This year, Beeline acquired the company which previosly acquired my ISP.Oct 04 13:25
MinceRsnobs are still snobs, even if they can't get their much desired iBrick.Oct 04 13:25
*Tallken has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Oct 04 13:27
AVRS2schestowitz: someone has used Firefox search bar to search for porn, then forgot about that and filed a bug about porn appearing in suggestions for a safe word.Oct 04 13:29
MinceRlolOct 04 13:32
schestowitzAVRS2: did he offer a dump of text... you know, you 'debugging'?Oct 04 13:37
schestowitz*/s/you/for/Oct 04 13:37
AVRS2IIRC, there was a screenshot. Of course, the search engine itself didn't show that. Oh, IIRC, it was "callgirls" when entering "girls" (in Russian or Ukrainian, so not an exact example)Oct 04 13:39
schestowitzI guess Google could classify a lot of people that way, revealing intimate details. It's already done for regional populations in Google Trends. Oct 04 13:42
AVRS2There is safebrowsing with cookies for, too.Oct 04 13:43
*kentma has quit ("Leaving.")Oct 04 13:43
schestowitzDoes one opt /in/ or /out/. Same question goes for Phorm in the UK (it's government-approved spyware... nasty stuff!)Oct 04 13:44
schestowitzIn the UK, the 'default' option is getting rectal/Orwellian examination by Phorm. The naive ones will just let this happen and for BT/Govt to harvest lots of personal dataOct 04 13:45
schestowitztwitter will like this one:  Microsoft institutes hiring freeze  < Microsoft denies it, but its excuses are lame. It's about 'not being formal/final)Oct 04 13:47
*ZiggyFish ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 13:52
schestowitzWe need more people to obtain a copy of OOXML and report bugs, which would pressure ISO and Microsoft.Oct 04 13:57
schestowitzIt'll be like 7 GB of traffic in BN today...Oct 04 13:58
ZiggyFishniceOct 04 13:59
ZiggyFishschestowitz: has there been any found yetOct 04 13:59
schestowitzWell, the usual. The difference is that not only committee member will have a copy now. Groklaw will rip it apart, I'm sure.Oct 04 14:02
*twitter has quit ( 04 14:02
*benJIman has quit ( 04 14:02
*tessier_ has quit ( 04 14:02
*twitter (n=willhill@ has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 14:04
*tessier_ (n=treed@kernel-panic/sex-machines) has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 14:04
*benJIman ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 14:04
AVRS2GNU IceCat also has search suggestions enabled.Oct 04 14:07
schestowitzWell, it's FFOct 04 14:08
AVRS2Well, it must be a bug.Oct 04 14:08
schestowitzOf intent? Or a technical one?Oct 04 14:09
MinceRwhat's wrong with that? the search string would be sent anywayOct 04 14:09
schestowitzTrue, but some people don't like keyloggers. It's also means for grabbing people's letters, passwords, etcOct 04 14:09
AVRS2schestowitz: that is, not removed.Oct 04 14:09
schestowitzMalicious feature? I'm not sure it qualifies.Oct 04 14:10
AVRS2BTW, has Mono been at before the update?Oct 04 14:10
schestowitzMono?Oct 04 14:11
schestowitzI don't see it there.Oct 04 14:11
AVRS2There is no Mono there.Oct 04 14:11
schestowitzNot even dotgnuOct 04 14:11
AVRS2Maybe I am confusing it with Gnash, which still is there.Oct 04 14:11
schestowitzIf it was there, someone would have brought it up. Let's try Google cache.Oct 04 14:11
ZiggyFish (What is MSN Shadow)Oct 04 14:11
*[H]omer_ has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Oct 04 14:11
ZiggyFishMSN Shadow is a forensics tool developed to demonstrate several security proofs of concept in the MSN protocol.Oct 04 14:11
ZiggyFishlol lolOct 04 14:11
schestowitzNo, it's too recent... 04 14:11
MinceRif someone types a password into the search box, they deserve what they get :>Oct 04 14:12
schestowitz 04 14:13
schestowitz2007: "# DotGNU:Oct 04 14:13
schestowitzGNU/Linux already has a partial implementation of Microsofts .NET (AKA C#) language in the Mono Project. However, many people in free software are concerned that Mono could face patent attacks from Microsoft. Just as importantly, some view Mono with suspicion, especially since it is sponsored by Novell, Microsoft's chief partner in the community. DotGNU is an effort to provide a technical and political alternative."Oct 04 14:13
MinceRwould dotGNU be safe from patent-based attacks?Oct 04 14:13
schestowitzI can't find dotgnu in 04 14:13
schestowitzSo they tossed it out, I suppose.Oct 04 14:13
MinceR(considering that sw patents apply to ideas, not implementations?)Oct 04 14:13
AVRS2 - DotGNUOct 04 14:14
schestowitzMinceR: dotgnu doesn't appear to actually /implement/ apps, AFAIK. The thing about Mono is to do with Novell and MonoDevelop. They want not to 'backward engineer' (sort of)  like Mainsoft.; they want a Linux that's built on Mono. That's a stretch though.Oct 04 14:15
AVRS23D drivers removed, Google Earth replacement addedOct 04 14:15
AVRS2*Google Earth was there beforeOct 04 14:16
AVRS2Now Skype…Oct 04 14:16
schestowitzEkiga?Oct 04 14:17
schestowitzMarble?Oct 04 14:17
AVRS2Yes, they are linked there.Oct 04 14:17
AVRS2no Marble in the list thoughOct 04 14:17
schestowitzWho would acquire satellite images and who would run a high-b/w server?Oct 04 14:17
*[H]omer_ (n=[H] has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 14:18
schestowitzAVRS2: you're neighbour [H]omer_  is here.Oct 04 14:18
AVRS2There is "earth3d" in Debian, but I am not sure it really works…Oct 04 14:18
schestowitzzoobab is there too (his computer name)Oct 04 14:18
AVRS2Not Idaho? ;-)Oct 04 14:19
schestowitzI'm not sure. I go by memory.Oct 04 14:20
schestowitzAbout .NET getting slapped off the FSF's list, I'll do a post about it later.Oct 04 14:20
AVRS2Oh… 04 14:21
*ZiggyFish has quit ("Leaving.")Oct 04 14:21
AVRS2schestowitz: it could just have fallen down because it works well (don't know) already.Oct 04 14:23
AVRS2Like 3D drivers… which don'tOct 04 14:24
schestowitz "give me a linux native app... wine is fine as a quick fix... but that should not be the GOAL.... the GOAL should be to run it NATIVE!!!!! "Oct 04 14:31
schestowitzPretty much like the illusion that writing Linux apps in MS .NET is the route to 'winning'.Oct 04 14:31
*libervisco has quit (Remote closed the connection)Oct 04 15:45
AVRS2 (Wikipedia link) — Rospatent's magic patents.Oct 04 16:03
AVRS2Literally.Oct 04 16:04
schestowitzSome people sort of patent poetry.Oct 04 16:09
schestowitzWhich means that copyright is not enough. Expressions such as the use of analogies can consist infingements.Oct 04 16:10
schestowitzAliens must be L[T]AO watching the stupidity of human kind.Oct 04 16:11
*Tallken ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 16:28
*brunomiguel (n=brunomig) has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 16:35
*brunomiguel says hello :)Oct 04 16:35
schestowitzHowdy.Oct 04 16:36
TallkenhowdyOct 04 16:39
Tallkenschestowitz: watched Ballmer on TV a while agoOct 04 16:39
Tallkenbeing interviewedOct 04 16:39
Tallkenone of the interviewers had an iPhone lolOct 04 16:39
Tallkenpitty one couldn't call thereOct 04 16:39
Tallken:)Oct 04 16:39
Tallkenwouldn't be too much of a nuisance thoughOct 04 16:39
Tallkenjust ask him about linuxOct 04 16:39
Tallkenwould like to see what his answer would beOct 04 16:39
schestowitzThat Linux is at 60%Oct 04 16:40
schestowitzFor apps server.Oct 04 16:40
Tallkenand some philosophical questions :POct 04 16:40
brunomiguelgnu/linux is used in 60% of the webservers and windows in 40%??Oct 04 16:40
brunomiguelthose numbers feel like... well, not trueOct 04 16:41
brunomigueland the BSDs? don't they count?Oct 04 16:41
brunomigueleven mac os xOct 04 16:41
schestowitzBallmer thinks in terms of "Good" and "Evil"Oct 04 16:42
schestowitzThere are just Google and Microsoft on the Web (he worries not about Yahoo)Oct 04 16:42
schestowitzAnd there's a sick obsession with #1  threat, GNU/Linux.Oct 04 16:43
brunomiguelgnu/linux is not the only threat to them. any good software is a threat to themOct 04 16:45
schestowitzBut they can squash companies. GNU/Linux is not a company.Oct 04 16:46
brunomiguelwhen I say that any good software is a threat, I'm talking only from an user perspectiveOct 04 16:52
brunomigueli'm not a programmer or any thing like thatOct 04 16:52
brunomigueljust someone who got sick of constant infections, crashes, ugly bsods, ultra slow performance, etc...Oct 04 16:52
brunomigueladn that led me to the free software movementOct 04 16:53
brunomiguelonly good things happened after showing the finger to windows :DOct 04 16:53
zoobabat least you can correct bugs yourself, or pay someone to do it :-)Oct 04 16:53
*trmanco has quit ("I just hit the close button :)")Oct 04 16:54
brunomiguelyes, but it's not just that. i have freedom to do what the hell i want with the softwareOct 04 16:54
brunomigueli'm part of the process and i'm respectedOct 04 16:54
*PetoKraus ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 16:54
brunomigueli have *freedom*Oct 04 16:55
schestowitzMost people use it cause it's different and /or cheap.Oct 04 16:55
brunomiguelfreedom is much more important! i'm a strong believer in democracy (the theory, at least)Oct 04 16:56
MinceRanarchy would be betterOct 04 16:56
brunomiguelso, i believe that anyone should be free, although it has to respect the rulesOct 04 16:56
MinceR(but we need more clueful people for that to work)Oct 04 16:56
schestowitzDo any democratic countries exist really?Oct 04 16:56
brunomigueland the free software movement represents thatOct 04 16:56
brunomiguelschestowitz: well... you know...Oct 04 16:56
brunomiguelMinceR: i don't like anarchy because i don't trust people - at least that muchOct 04 16:57
brunomiguelschestowitz: the USA is a democracyOct 04 16:57
*brunomiguel laughs real loud!Oct 04 16:57
zoobab 04 16:58
zoobabCommission is a big client of Microsoft:Oct 04 16:58
zoobab"Regarding the cost of the products used on the desktops (the so calledOct 04 16:58
zoobaboffice automation software), which currently are mainly Microsoft ones"Oct 04 16:58
brunomiguelin an anarchy, people wioll do what the hell they want. and we all know where that would leed us.Oct 04 16:58
brunomiguel*leadOct 04 16:58
schestowitzMany countries present themselves as "democracy", but judging by the definition of the word, it doesn't work "as advertised". The USA is not a democracy; it's a corpocracy.Oct 04 16:58
*trmanco ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 16:59
schestowitzIt's the corporations, i.e. people like Ballmer, who 'run' the pollies, but you don't get to vote on (elect) people like Ballmer, Murdoch, etc.Oct 04 17:00
Already marked back.Oct 04 17:01
*schestowitz back in 2 hoursOct 04 17:01
MinceRbrunomiguel: if people can't be trusted, no system will work, not even democracyOct 04 17:03
MinceRbrunomiguel: if people can be trusted, there's no need to waste money on bureaucracyOct 04 17:04
brunomiguelthat's why i like democracy: rulesOct 04 17:04
brunomiguelrules that are fairOct 04 17:04
MinceRwhy are rules a good thing?Oct 04 17:04
MinceRwhen have you seen fair rules on earth?Oct 04 17:04
brunomiguelto protectOct 04 17:04
brunomiguelthe citizensOct 04 17:04
MinceRrules rarely protect the citizensOct 04 17:04
brunomiguelbut they should!Oct 04 17:05
MinceRthey tend to protect the powerful few who have managed to bend the system to their advantageOct 04 17:05
brunomiguelpeople are stupid, they need rules. i need rulesOct 04 17:05
MinceRif people are stupid, no amount of rules will help themOct 04 17:05
brunomiguelknow, things are strange, rottenOct 04 17:05
MinceRif people aren't stupid, they won't need rulesOct 04 17:05
brunomiguelthey helpOct 04 17:05
MinceRthey help the ones who are oppressing meOct 04 17:06
brunomiguelso, they are not well appliedOct 04 17:07
brunomiguelit's like a proprietary software licenseOct 04 17:07
brunomiguelwhen rules should be like the gplOct 04 17:07
brunomiguelall about respectOct 04 17:07
MinceRgpl is merely an attempt to subvert evil copyright lawOct 04 17:08
brunomigueland it sets rules so everyone, from the users to the developers, are in equal termsOct 04 17:08
brunomiguelthat's my interpretation of the gplOct 04 17:09
MinceRit does so to the extent law allows it toOct 04 17:09
brunomigueland the law is not that bad. it's subverted, it has some "dark spots", but it helpsOct 04 17:10
TallkenPower corruptsOct 04 17:12
Tallkenpeople with no dreams can't follow rulesOct 04 17:12
Tallkenunless forcedOct 04 17:12
Tallkenunless they are stopped by someone more powerfulOct 04 17:12
Tallkenbut those powerful people must be controlledOct 04 17:12
TallkensoOct 04 17:12
Tallkenwe're in a dangerous dependency pathOct 04 17:13
Tallkendemocracy is the best system we know so farOct 04 17:13
MinceRyes, the law is that badOct 04 17:13
MinceRit allows a group of people to rob me, oppress me and tell me how to live my lifeOct 04 17:13
MinceRwhile not protecting my interests or my rightsOct 04 17:14
TallkenMinceR: you're being sarcastic, I hope?Oct 04 17:14
MinceRi'm getting constantly harrassed by authorities and companies who are put into the position of an authorityOct 04 17:14
MinceRand i'm really tired of itOct 04 17:14
MinceRTallken: no, i'm being realisticOct 04 17:14
TallkenMinceR: the problem isn't authorityOct 04 17:14
TallkenMinceR: is who is in those positionsOct 04 17:14
TallkenMinceR: you can only ensure whois there is fairOct 04 17:15
MinceRfor an ontopic example, see what SweatyB did here in hungary not too long agoOct 04 17:15
TallkenMinceR: you can't eliminate authorityOct 04 17:15
MinceRTallken: only worthless assholes will want those positionsOct 04 17:15
Tallkenwhat?Oct 04 17:15
MinceRreasonable people don't try to make a career out of meddling with affairs they know nothing aboutOct 04 17:15
TallkenMinceR: what are we talking about exactly?Oct 04 17:16
MinceRTallken: they've paid at least 35 million forints to microsoft in various ways for their productsOct 04 17:16
MinceReven though we need none of itOct 04 17:16
MinceRoh, part of it went to marketing m$ products under the umbrella of "education"Oct 04 17:16
MinceRand some of that money came from the EUOct 04 17:17
MinceRbut still, it all comes from taxpayersOct 04 17:17
Tallkensame here, in PortugalOct 04 17:17
MinceRthe city i'm living in is falling apartOct 04 17:17
MinceRtransportation is close to nonexistentOct 04 17:17
MinceRthe freedom of people all over the world is severely constrainedOct 04 17:18
MinceR(see what they're doing in the name of "protecting intellectual property")Oct 04 17:18
MinceRmost of the population here is torn between choosing which of the two great assholes to give control over the countryOct 04 17:20
MinceRboth of them do the same thingOct 04 17:20
twitterOh, I do like that hiring freeze.  Nice spot.Oct 04 17:23
MinceRguess who are the only people in this country who have their expenses paid by the state without having to show invoicesOct 04 17:25
MinceRmembers of parliamentOct 04 17:25
MinceRwhile tax authorities keep having everyone else do ridiculous amounts of administrating exactly how much we owe the stateOct 04 17:26
*_Doug ( has joined #boycottnovellOct 04 17:28
_Doughi there .. "Firefox can't find the server at"Oct 04 17:29
brunomiguel_Doug: it works with me, using IcecatOct 04 17:30
_DougIs back again ..Oct 04 17:39
_Dougtemperory local bork ?Oct 04 17:39
MinceREmperor-y!Oct 04 17:39
_Dougtemporary ..Oct 04 17:39
_DougEnglish is not my native tongue ..Oct 04 17:40
_Dougare we all just going to sit here and stare at our keyboards ..Oct 04 17:42
trmancoI guess soOct 04 17:42
_Dougin that case I'm off to watch the wierdos on Youtube ..Oct 04 17:43
*_Doug has quit ()Oct 04 17:43
MinceRoh, the online weirdo sharing service ;)Oct 04 17:44
trmancololOct 04 17:44
trmanco#1Oct 04 17:44
*[H]omer_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))Oct 04 17:45
*trmanco is is off for a whileOct 04 17:46
twitterha ha, 04 17:47
twitterI could use a few mod points here to undo the result of M$ cleaning action, 04 17:48
twitterI know, no one but trolls have mod points on Slashdot these days.Oct 04 17:49
MinceRnot really, i sometimes get someOct 04 17:49
MinceRbut there are way too many clueless mods nowadays, i'll grant thatOct 04 17:49
MinceR(or astroturfing mods)Oct 04 17:49
twitterThey target me for sure.Oct 04 17:49
twitterI've seen them dump as many as 15 points at a time onto my comments.Oct 04 17:50
twitterThey do the same for any account they think is mine.Oct 04 17:51
twitterI got the first post and watched a big mod point fight over it.  I hope it cost them plenty.Oct 04 17:53
twitterYou might go vote up my M$ hiring freeze journal submission.  It would be nice to see that front paged.Oct 04 17:53
MinceRi've spent my mod points alreadyOct 04 18:03
MinceRoh, you mean firehose?Oct 04 18:03
twitterYes, firehose.  Anyone can nod there.Oct 04 18:06
MinceRmeanwhile, 04 18:07

Recent Techrights' Posts

OpenBSD Says That Even on Linux, Wayland Still Has a Number of Rough Edges (But IBM Wants to Make X Extinct)
IBM tries to impose unready software on users
Professor Eben Moglen on How Social Control Media Metabolises Humans and Constraints Freedom of Thought
Nothing of value would be lost if all these data-harvesting giants (profiling people) vanished overnight
Media Cannot Tell the Difference Between Microsoft and Iran
a platform with back doors
Links 28/11/2023: New Zealand's Big Tobacco Pivot and Google Mass-Deleting Accounts
Links for the day
Justice is Still the Main Goal
The skulduggery seems to implicate not only Microsoft
[Teaser] Next Week's Part in the Series About Anti-Free Software Militants
an effort to 'cancel' us and spy on us
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news
This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 International License
IRC Proceedings: Monday, November 27, 2023
IRC logs for Monday, November 27, 2023
When Microsoft Blocks Your Access to Free Software
"Linux is a cancer that attaches itself in an intellectual property sense to everything it touches." [Chicago Sun-Times]
Techrights Statement on 'Cancel Culture' Going Out of Control
relates to a discussion we had in IRC last night
Stuff People Write About Linux
revisionist pieces
Links 28/11/2023: Rosy Crow 1.4.3 and Google Drive Data Loss
Links for the day
Links 27/11/2023: Australian Wants Tech Companies Under Grip
Links for the day
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news
Links 27/11/2023: Underwater Data Centres and Gemini, BSD Style!
Links for the day
[Meme] Leaning Towards the Big Corporate CoC
Or leaning to "the green" (money)
Software Freedom Conservancy Inc in 2022: Almost Half a Million Bucks for Three People Who Attack Richard Stallman and Defame Linus Torvalds
Follow the money
[Meme] Identity Theft and Forgery
Coming soon...
Microsoft Has Less Than 1,000 Mail (MX) Servers Left, It's Virtually Dead in That Area (0.19% of the Market)
Exim at 254,000 servers, Postfix at 150,774, Microsoft down to 824
The Web is Dying, Sites Must Evolve or Die Too
Nowadays when things become "Web-based" it sometimes means more hostile and less open than before
Still Growing, Still Getting Faster
Articles got considerably longer too (on average)
In India, the One Percent is Microsoft and Mozilla
India is where a lot of software innovations and development happen, so this kind of matters a lot
Feeding False Information Using Sockpuppet Accounts and Imposters
online militants try every trick in the book, even illegal stuff
What News Industry???
Marketing, spam, and chatbots
IRC Proceedings: Sunday, November 26, 2023
IRC logs for Sunday, November 26, 2023
The Software Freedom Law Center's Eben Moglen Explains That We Already Had Free Software Almost Everywhere Before (Half a Century Ago)
how code was shared in the 1970s and 80s
When the So-called 'Cancel Culture' Sees Everything in Free Software Through the Scopes of 'Sex' (Because It Cannot Argue on Technical or Legal Grounds)
Losing the plot
Links 26/11/2023: Debunking So-called G.A.I. and Sierra Leone's National Curfew
Links for the day
In the 'Phoronix Universe', Single Job Openings at AMD Are News, But Not ~400 Layoffs
like a classifieds section
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news
Microsoft Shamelessly Attacks Both Git and Projects in GitHub, Using Plagiarism in "AI" Clothing (Exit GitHub Now!)
A mountain of plagiarism
Microsoft Loses Market Share, Market Price of Windows Plunges to Almost Nothing (28 Dollars for Vista 10)
GNU/Linux has grown so potent that Microsoft now charges only dozens of bucks for Vista 10
Professor Eben Moglen Stands with Snowden While Moglen's 'Critics' (Microsofters) Keep Defaming Prominent Whistleblowers
Don't listen to Microsoft liars and weasels, who merely try to "replace" Moglen and override his message
"Check Point" + Microsoft Partnerships Extend to Anti-GNU/Linux FUD
a close partner/pusher of Microsoft tries to alter the narrative (change reality itself)
IRC Proceedings: Saturday, November 25, 2023
IRC logs for Saturday, November 25, 2023
Links 26/11/2023: Fresh Concerns Over North Korea Satellite Ambitions and South China Sea Patrols
Links for the day
Eben Moglen Explains the Connection Between FSF and SFLC (Both of Which Under Attack by Microsofters)
Old clip