EditorsAbout the SiteComes vs. MicrosoftUsing This Web SiteSite ArchivesCredibility IndexOOXMLOpenDocumentPatentsNovellNews DigestSite NewsRSS

09.30.09

Groklaw Groks Mono, Miguel de Icaza, Microsoft, and More

Posted in GNU/Linux, Microsoft, Mono, Novell at 1:51 pm by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

Perlow velociraptor in the park
Photo with permission from Jason

Summary: A counter article to Jason Perlow’s post from ZDNet is finally published

THE previous post spoke about the “Microsoft hater” label, which conveniently annuls or crosses out any regular critic of Microsoft’s practices, including Richard Stallman.

Recent attacks on Stallman [1, 2, 3] (some going back to July) were profoundly based on the assumption that for Stallman to be concerned about Microsoft is “irrational” and “sickly”.

Groklaw has published this long article which defends Stallman from critics like Jason Perlow, who is in our IRC channel at the moment having fun with some graphics and banter (the image above is hopefully treated amicably, as Jason chose his favourite dinosaur, the velociraptor). There are also some good comments at Reddit (the Novell/Mono employees who hang out at Reddit must not have responded yet).

Anyway, here are some fragments from the very good analysis at Groklaw:

In short, Perlow attacked the man for something he didn’t say. He never said not to use Mono. Nor is Mono even necessary for interoperability with Microsoft. I note Microsoft is letting Intel port Silverlight instead of Mono to Moblin. Surprise, Miguel. Ah, the joys and surprises of partnering with Microsoft. He will drink that cup to the full, no doubt, before this saga is done. Why would *you* want Silverlight on Moblin? I can’t imagine one good reason, personally, but the fact that Intel and Microsoft want it to happen may even be part of what’s behind the new push to tell us we must use both Windows and Linux and stop being so prissy about it. I note that in Perlow’s article on how he can’t live without Windows on the desktop, Why I Can Never Be Exclusive to Linux and Open Source on the Desktop,

[...]

I hate to burst people’s bubbles, but it was just last week that Microsoft sold, or tried to sell, to patent trolls some 22 patents that could be used against Linux. Caught with its pants down when OIN ended up with them instead and told the world all about it, Microsoft quickly announced the Codeplex Foundation, which Perlow calls an open source nonprofit but which actually could more accurately be called Microsoft’s Push-Mono-Down-Your-Throat foundation, now that Sam Ramji has announced that giving Mono more “credibility” is the goal. This is the star to guide you if you wish to be “pragmatic” and “compromise” also. I suggest you read Andy Updegrove’s understated but — to me, hilarious — analysis of the legal structure of the Codeplex Foundation.

[...]

And I have a question for those who tell us we have to compromise and use both proprietary Microsoft software and FOSS. If the purpose of Open Source was nothing more than making money as a Microsoft partner, you tell me — what was it all for? Why not just use Microsoft software, then, and call it good? No. Really. What was FOSS developed for, if that is the end result, a Microsoft-FOSS fusion? Why even bother? The idea was to provide something better, an alternative, one that was totally free of proprietary restrictions, so that it would be you who control your own computer. And that is exactly what Microsoft can’t ever offer you.

More obvious mistakes are being pointed out in the comments.

Addressing the real issue which is not the messenger but the promoter of Mono and Microsoft’s CodePlex Foundation, well… he is not alone. Miguel is joined by colleagues who bring about “fusion” between Microsoft and Linux, to borrow the term used by Groklaw. Novell helps organise the .NET/Mono Code Camp, which is supported by Microsoft and Novell (and probably Microsoft’s CodePlex Foundation). Also worth bearing in mind is Novell’s role at the Linux Foundation. The key panel at LinuxCon was moderated by a Novell employee, whose role there has been a little problematic [1, 2]. There is also this:

Generating lots of interest from press, enthusiasts and attendees, LinuxCon touched on everything from what music best represents Linux to “Is Linux bloated?” – which sparked lots of opinions, including one from Novell’s own Matt Richards.

Novell used that “bloated” debate which came from Novell’s James Bottomley to market its SUSE Studio product (appliances programme). We wrote about this last week.

Dog with a sign

Share this post: These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share and discover new web pages.
  • Digg
  • del.icio.us
  • Reddit
  • co.mments
  • DZone
  • email
  • Google Bookmarks
  • LinkedIn
  • NewsVine
  • Print
  • Technorati
  • TwitThis
  • Facebook

If you liked this post, consider subscribing to the RSS feed or join us now at the IRC channels.

Pages that cross-reference this one

5 Comments

  1. David Gerard said,

    September 30, 2009 at 3:45 pm

    Gravatar

    Jason Perlow is being a quintessential ad banner troll.

    twitter Reply:

    Jason’s reasons for using M$ junk boil down to the fact that his customers use crap software and he’s attached to a few particular pieces of junk himself. His number one irrational attachment is a flow chart program. I once used kvivio and thought it was nicer than Visio. I prefer GIMP to Photoshop, and so on and so forth. None of this will really help Jason because his customers will continue to use garbage as long as Jason is irrational enough to tell them that the garbage they know is better than the freedom or performance they could have with free software. Sad.

  2. NotZed said,

    September 30, 2009 at 7:43 pm

    Gravatar

    “Is Linux bloated?”

    Yes, yes it is. But at least with the kernel it’s bloated only once Then again, look at sound drivers – two interfaces and they both suck. Or video drivers.

    And the `desktop’ is a total mess. Each iteration of almost every application gets fatter and slower for minimal or no real improvement in functionality or stability.

    finalzone Reply:

    Define bloat.

    Concerning sound and video drivers, it is really vendors issues. At least open source iterations are working despite the lack of important source. On sound part, pulseaudio does a good job to simplify configuration while providing advanced setting. For videos, both AMD and Intel made effort to provide 3D support and release documentations.

    About desktops, lightweight iteration from enlightenment to ICEWin via Fluxbox are filling the void left by both Gnome and KDE. Be glad GNU/Linux or BSD based distributions provide the ability to switch to different desktop environment.

    Roy Schestowitz Reply:

    At the kernel level, Linus says there are many integrity checks and logging wasting CPU cycles (companies like Oracle need those), but recent benchmarks show that Linux is still faster than FreeBSD, for example. Also see this.

What Else is New


  1. Links 8/12/2019: Debian Init Systems GR, NomadBSD 1.3

    Links for the day



  2. Can We Quit Celebrating DRM in GNU/Linux?

    Over the past couple of days various news sites and "Linux" sites expressed great satisfaction [1-5] over the passive embrace of Disney's DRM ploy (Disney+), even when Disney itself rejects DRM, seeing the harms practically caused by it [6,7]



  3. You Know WSL is Bad for GNU/Linux Because Anti-Linux People, Microsoft and Its Propagandists, Want People to Use That

    Microsoft and its boosters (and media partners) haven’t grown tired of spreading falsehoods to stigmatise and take control of GNU/Linux by creating their own versions and traps for it



  4. IRC Proceedings: Saturday, December 07, 2019

    IRC logs for Saturday, December 07, 2019



  5. 5 Years Ago the Linux Foundation Turned Linux.com Into a Non-Linux Site

    One can leverage the Internet Archive’s Wayback Machine to better understand how, over time, the Foundation called “Linux” deviated or diverged away from its mission statement for the sole purpose of raising corporate funds and selling influence to corporations (passing the community’s hard work to them — a form of tacit privatisation)



  6. Microsoft Redefining Ownership and Identity of GNU/Linux

    The idea that “Microsoft loves Linux” is as insane as it gets; but the lie which is “Microsoft loves Linux” is a powerful enabler of Microsoft entryism, e.g. if Greg steps down, does a Microsoft employee become the deputy of Linus Torvalds?



  7. Things That Cannot Be Said

    The limits on what we can say are mostly defined by what sources permit us to say publicly (for the sake of source protection)



  8. Fake European Patents (on Algorithms) Leading to Fake Embargoes

    Law firms have gotten their way in Germany; instead of supporting the productive workers the patent system is nowadays promoting the litigation 'industry' and it ought to be corrected



  9. From Moderate Advice to FUD and Misinformation: The Case of a VPN Vulnerability (CVE-2019-14899)

    What should have been a trivial bugfix in a variety of operating systems and bits of software — both proprietary and Free software — somehow became anti-Linux FUD, clickbait and worse



  10. Dangerous Thinker

    Society oughtn't be alarmed by people who say unusual things; it should be wary and sceptical of those corporations ever so eager to silence such people



  11. Unitary Patent (UPC) Died Along With the Credibility of Managing IP and the Rest of the UPC Lobby

    It is pretty astounding that Team UPC (collective term for people who crafted and lobby for this illegal construct) is still telling us lies, even in the absence of underlying supportive facts, and pressure groups disguised as "news sites" latch onto anything to perpetuate an illusion of progress (even in the face of a growing number of major barriers)



  12. IRC Proceedings: Friday, December 06, 2019

    IRC logs for Friday, December 06, 2019



  13. Links 7/12/2019: Fedora 31 Elections Results, Lots of Media Drama Over VPN Bug

    Links for the day



  14. Links 6/12/2019: DRM in GNU/Linux and Sparky Bonsai

    Links for the day



  15. The EPO Rejects Innovation

    The EPO ceased caring about the needs of scientists whose work involves invention; instead, EPO management crafts increasingly lenient guidelines that yield illegal European Patents (not compatible with the EPC) that heavily-besieged EPO judges are unable to stop



  16. Startpage CEO Robert Beens in 'Damage Control' Mode, Trying to Get Startpage Relisted After Selling to a Massive Surveillance Company

    PrivacytoolsIO is being lobbied by the CEO of Startpage to relist Startpage, based on no actual refutations at all



  17. IRC Proceedings: Thursday, December 05, 2019

    IRC logs for Thursday, December 05, 2019



  18. Links 5/12/2019: qBittorrent 4.2.0, Expensive Librem 5 and OpenBSD Bugs

    Links for the day



  19. Microsoft Staff Repeatedly Refuses to Tell How Many People Use WSL, Defends Patent Extortion and Blackmail of Linux Instead

    The people who develop WSL (mostly Microsoft employees) get easily irritated when asked how many people actually use this thing; but more interestingly, however, they reveal their disdain for GNU/Linux and support for Microsoft blackmail (for 'Linux patent tax')



  20. IRC Proceedings: Wednesday, December 04, 2019

    IRC logs for Wednesday, December 04, 2019



  21. Links 4/12/2019: Tails 4.1, UCS 4.4-3 and Proxmox VE 6.1

    Links for the day



  22. Google Tightens Its Noose

    Now it’s official! Google is just a bunch of shareholders looking to appease the Pentagon at all costs



  23. Europeans Still Need to Save the European Patent Office From Those Who Attack Its Patent Quality

    Patent quality is of utmost interest; without it, as we're seeing at the EPO and have already seen at the USPTO for a number of years, legal disputes will arise where neither side wins (only the lawyers win) and small, impoverished inventors or businesses will be forced to settle outside the courts over baseless allegations, often made by parasitic patent trolls (possessing low-quality patents they don't want scrutinised by courts)



  24. We Never Accepted and Will Never Accept Corporate Money

    Corporate money is a unique problem because of its magnitude and the fact that it's impersonal; shareholders can only ever accept its supposed justifications if they're receiving something in return (of proportional worth to the payment/transaction)



  25. IRC Proceedings: Tuesday, December 03, 2019

    IRC logs for Tuesday, December 03, 2019



  26. Links 3/12/2019: elementary OS 5.1 Hera, Plasma 5.17.4, Firefox 71

    Links for the day



  27. Laundering the Reputation of Criminals: That's an Actual Job

    An important reminder that the manufactured, paid-for (media is being bribed) image of Bill Gates is the product of the PR industry he enlisted to distract from his endless crimes



  28. 'Priceless' Tickets to the EPO's Back End and Team UPC

    CIPA's and the EPO's event (later this week) is more of the same; the EPO exists not to serve European businesses but a bunch of law firms and their biggest clients (which usually aren't even European)



  29. IRC Proceedings: Monday, December 02, 2019

    IRC logs for Monday, December 02, 2019



  30. New EPO Leak Shows That the Rumours and Jokes Are Partly True and We Know Who 'Runs the Show'

    Europe’s second-largest institution is so profoundly dysfunctional, a reprehensible kakistocracy of tribalism, money-grabbing career-climbing autocrats and possibly major fraud; today’s leak looks at what motivated and enabled the formation and latest incarnation of “Team Campinos”


RSS 64x64RSS Feed: subscribe to the RSS feed for regular updates

Home iconSite Wiki: You can improve this site by helping the extension of the site's content

Home iconSite Home: Background about the site and some key features in the front page

Chat iconIRC Channel: Come and chat with us in real time

Recent Posts