EditorsAbout the SiteComes vs. MicrosoftUsing This Web SiteSite ArchivesCredibility IndexOOXMLOpenDocumentPatentsNovellNews DigestSite NewsRSS

12.14.09

Push-Polling Against the “G” in GNOME

Posted in Apple, GNOME, GNU/Linux, GPL, Microsoft at 9:43 pm by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

Steve Jobs

from JaBB

Summary: Richard Stallman and what seems like “Jobs’ mob”/Mono mob in a debate over GNOME’s views on Free(dom) software

THE unnecessary tension between GNU and a few people in GNOME was mentioned earlier today and the issue will hopefully be resolved now that provocateurs are being cornered. Here is a message from Dave Neary:

Re: Code of Conduct and Foundation membership


  • From: Dave Neary <dneary gnome org>
  • To: “Lefty (石鏡 )” <lefty shugendo org>
  • Cc: pvanhoof gnome org, rms gnu org, foundation-list gnome org
  • Subject: Re: Code of Conduct and Foundation membership
  • Date: Mon, 14 Dec 2009 11:35:02 +0100

Hi,

Lefty (石鏡 ) wrote:
> As a specific example, to the question, "Do you agree that viewing

> proprietary software as 'illegitimate', 'immoral', 'antisocial' and/or
> 'unethical' should be a pre-condition for syndication on Planet GNOME?", so
> far 151 respondents have answered "No", only 19 have answered "Yes". That's
> about an 8-to-1 ratio.

I'm no statistician (well, not any more at any rate), but I know that
you can construct surveys to say anything. If you ask someone "Do you
want to bring our boys home?" in the US, people are anti-war - if you
ask "Should we surrender in Iraq?" they're pro-war. Leading questions
prove nothing.

Your survey, in particular, is not particularly impartial. I would say
that it is somewhere between leading and "push polling". It's the type
of thing you rightly criticise when it is used by Boycott Novell.

Quite honestly, like others, I would just like to see this discussion
end. As I said before the weekend (50 emails ago), no opinions are being
changed, no new information of interest to GNOME Foundation members has
surfaced.

I'd like to ask both Lefty & Richard to refrain from mailing to this
thread again.

Thank you,
Dave.

-- 
Dave Neary
GNOME Foundation member
dneary gnome org

That’s what may happen when Apple fans enter the GNOME Foundation (people who don’t care about Freedom and expect others to feel the same way). The Inquirer likes to tease Apple fans for their attitude and in this latest article it even calls them “Jobs’ Mob”.

FRUITY PURVEYOR of cracked Imacs, Apple has decided not to ship any more of the machines for a couple of weeks.

On its webgroup, Jobs’ Mob said sorry to customers amid reports of shipping delays affecting its recently introduced Imac computers.

Well, it seems like “Jobs’ Mob” is also busy defaming Richard Stallman and the FSF (by distortion). Regarding those who are responsible for damaging hostility and friction, The Source wrote the following this morning:

Do you remember the last controversy around Richard Stallman and Mono? Well, surprise surprise: the players are same! Imagine that! Quite the coincidence.

It just so happens that the person calling for the vote is the same person that created the whole “I am not afraid of people writing code” slur-meme.

It just so happens that the person seconding the call for the vote is the same person that crafted “open letters”, published private correspondance and called for Stallman to be banned from speaking at future conferences.

(The irony of calling for someone to be banned from speaking while later pretending outrage at that same person for calling into question how appropriate some topics are is quite delicious.)

Again, read the posts to the mailing list and on the blogs. Stallman is calm and composed while being called a “fascistic extremist“, and subjected to push polling. His critics as usual are condescending, twist his words, and resort to childish rhetoric at every opportunity.

The beauty of the mailing list is that it is all laid out there for anyone to see.

Miguel de Icaza’s response goes like this:

Hello,

> GNOME is not connected with the anti-hunting movement; there’s no
> reason it should have any position on the question. But GNOME is part
> of the GNU Project, and it ought to support the free software
> movement. The most minimal support for the free software movement is
> to refrain from going directly against it; that is, to avoid
> presenting proprietary software as legitimate.

Gnome supports both the free software movement as well as proprietary developers, and that is why Gnome for years has encouraged the use of the LGPL license for all of its libraries.

Gnome is a general purpose desktop, but it also recognizes the need for proprietary applications to use these libraries and to build and integrate properly with it.

Miguel.

According to Sam Varghese, this whole issue actually arose because Miguel de Icaza had been promoting proprietary Microsoft software. There is no reason to do that (let alone promotion of Mono, which the FSF is against). Gnote is still moving forward and as Clair Ching points out:

If you’re looking for an alternative to Tomboy which is faster and uses less memory, then GNote is the way to go.

She leaves out the part about Mono being troublesome; for practical reasons too, Gnote cannot be ignored.

Share this post: These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share and discover new web pages.
  • Reddit
  • email
  • Google Bookmarks

If you liked this post, consider subscribing to the RSS feed or join us now at the IRC channels.

Pages that cross-reference this one

3 Comments

  1. your_friend said,

    December 14, 2009 at 11:55 pm

    Gravatar

    Push polling in Boycott Novell? Where? not here, maybe here, but that’s not BN. In fact, I don’t think there are any polls at BN, much less push polls. BN is passionate and partisan but honest. It is a shame that the mail list moderator slurred BN this way.

    Roy Schestowitz Reply:

    We had two polls back in 2006. I don’t think they were biased.

  2. NotZed said,

    December 15, 2009 at 3:07 am

    Gravatar

    IIRC `Jobs Mob’ is just Inquirer for `Apple Inc.’, not the rabid apple fanboys and girls.

    That `fascist extremist’ line is really telling (and shows a very poor command of the language and an embarrassingly overt bias). We’ll all be labeled `insurgents’ next for removing mono (or Microsoft Windows) from our own computers! One person’s `free software advocate’ another’s `cyber-terrorist’!

    I simply cannot fathom the logic behind that slur. The guy is one man against a world of proprietary interests who are trying to completely control what we can do with our own data and our own property, and yet he is picked on incessantly for holding those humanistic views so strongly. I really wonder about people’s state of mind who see increasingly powerful corporations as being worth more than individuals, to the point of defending them in such objectionable ways.

    GNOME is still a GNU project (even if they keep claiming the ‘acronym is now meaningless’), and RMS has every right to comment on it. And like any other branding exercise, being under the GNU brand does require certain obligations as well – even if some of these people are ignorant of them or wish they weren’t there.

    To be honest, it just looks like a simple query/request got blown out of all proportion just because some ning-nong who doesn’t like RMS personally wanted to blow it out of all proportion (like that virgin joke, which was clearly a piss-take on a fictional character known as The Virgin Mary, who last time I checked was a girl).

    Personally although I think there are a few nice apps in there, GNOME is irrelevant anyway. A bloated `file manager’ and too many disparate libraries slammed together. I used to think it was worth it but I’ve changed my mind – core GNOME mostly just gets in my way.

    I think Miguel would do better starting his own `desktop’ rather than undermining GNOME to force mono into it. He can drop all the baggage and political issues and take those who agree with him along for the ride. He would probably do quite well and enjoy himself a lot more, as would his followers. Of course Novell and Redhat might not be so happy with all their investment in GNOME, but that’s the risk they took.

What Else is New


  1. Microsoft is Going to Get Tired of Whining About “GAFA” and Accept That It's Just as Bad If Not a Lot Worse at Privacy

    Microsoft is being treated by the US government as if it's not abusing anything, let alone people's privacy; if anything, this demonstrates the degree to which Microsoft infiltrated or 'vendor-captured' regulatory branches



  2. Links 6/7/2020: LibreOffice 7.0 RC1, MX-19.2 KDE Beta 1, Linux 5.8 RC4

    Links for the day



  3. ZDNet's 'Linux' Section: Linux is Full of Problems and It Loves/Embraces Software Patents

    Software patents promotion and GNU/Linux FUD; your daily dosage of 'news' from the tabloid known as ZDNet...



  4. IRC Proceedings: Sunday, July 05, 2020

    IRC logs for Sunday, July 05, 2020



  5. Links 5/7/2020: Slackel 7.3 Mate Beta and GNOME Gingerblue

    Links for the day



  6. Technological Progress? Only If We Assume The Wrong Things...

    When we're told that we're all dumb we're being given increasingly dumb technology (and they tell us dumber is better)



  7. Linux Foundation Still Owned and Controlled Largely -- and More Over Time -- by Surveillance Companies (Openwashing Services for Bad Practices and Bad Actors)

    The Linux Foundation‘s growing role in spying or the focus on data-mining operations is an eternal reminder or warning that the Foundation follows power and money, not freedom or ethics (it began as a salary-paying venture, crowdfunding among large corporations which conduct mass surveillance)



  8. Sharing is Caring, as Those Who Share Usually Care

    Going back to our human roots, people who cooperate and collaborate are vastly more likely to survive and thrive; Free software is almost guaranteed to become the norm when/once everyone demands it (proprietary software is too divisive, supremacist and even racist)



  9. Systems Can Crash and People Can Die by Changing Language (Even in Parameter and Function Space) to Appease Activists

    It seems clear that Intel takes the lead in trying to change Linux not in technical means but purely social means; even when (and where) that can compromise the robustness of the kernel (Intel is nowadays known for profoundly defective chips with back doors)



  10. António Campinos Should Speak to Peasants, Not Litigation Lawyers

    Mr. Campinos does not work for campinos but against campinos; he represents the people who sue or threaten them using ludicrous patents that should never have been granted (e.g. in Ethiopia)



  11. Christine Lambrecht (German Minister of Justice and Consumer Protection) Ignores the Fact That Even Patent Experts Reject the Unitary Patent (UPC)

    The debacle single-handedly caused by and attributable to Christine Lambrecht, who is eager to appease litigation lawyers, is made yet worse by the fact that people in this domain/profession reject what she's trying to ram down people's throats



  12. [Humour] The Linux Foundation is Not Even Using Linux

    The Linux Foundation does not support Linux except in name; it is important to remember that



  13. Microsoft Loves Power

    An explanation of why Microsoft says it loves this and that; Microsoft lacks the capacity to love or to express empathy as it's always about self gratification or coercion, nothing else



  14. IRC Proceedings: Saturday, July 04, 2020

    IRC logs for Saturday, July 04, 2020



  15. Indoors Society, Shut the Windows

    Times are changing in all sorts of ways; it seems like GNU/Linux and other Free/libre operating systems may emerge as winners when the 'dust settles'



  16. Allegation That Microsoft Adopted the Mentality of Suicide Bombers Against Linux, Leaks Reveal

    Looking at leaked E-mails from around the time Microsoft used Cyanogen as a 'proxy', we're finding some stunning admissions or speculation about the real motivations



  17. [Humour] A Union in Whose Interests?

    The union-busting 'yellow union' (the one that helped Benoît Battistelli marginalise SUEPO) is unable to represent staff any longer



  18. FFPE EPO Has Rendered Itself Obsolete by Liaising With Benoît Battistelli

    FFPE EPO has been left out of staff representation, demonstrating that liaising with the oppressor is a self-deprecating move which must be avoided (the only remaining potent union is SUEPO)



  19. Links 4/7/2020: LibreOffice 7.0 'Personal Edition', Atari VCS Coming Soon

    Links for the day



  20. [Humour/Meme] The 'New' Edge (Chrome Copycat) is Already Dead, So Microsoft is Trying to Just Kill the Competition

    Edge market share is so minuscule that it doesn’t even make it into this chart (it’s in “other”); no wonder Microsoft now bullies Windows users into using it, for users reject it even after months of endless advertising/AstroTurfing and aggressive exploitation/appropriation



  21. Fourth of July in the United Kingdom and the United States

    In these bizarre times Independence Day is still being celebrated, even as so many people are out of work, running out of hope and being fed xenophobia in social control media with a racist 'celebrity' president (the "user in chief")



  22. [Humour] Bigger is Always Better When You're a Deluded Maximalist

    The EPO totally lost sight of its mission; it's just speeding everything up, very carelessly, not minding quality and accuracy/certainty/legal validity



  23. 'Managing Intellectual Property' Managing to Become Uncritical Parrot of EPO Management

    Managing to amplify the EPO's lies isn't hard; one just needs to copy, paste, edit a little; then they call it 'journalism', irrespective of the proven track record of EPO management lying to staff and to the media



  24. IRC Proceedings: Friday, July 03, 2020

    IRC logs for Friday, July 03, 2020



  25. Monopoly Abuse, Still: Microsoft Pays Projects to Embrace/Move to C#, GitHub and Visual Studio

    Microsoft's greatest of efforts to lull regulators into inaction and fool us all into thinking that things have changed are undone by actual behaviour, which is abusive, anti-competitive and just... typical Microsoft



  26. Links 4/7/2020: Grml 2020.06 and diffoscope 150 Released

    Links for the day



  27. [Humour/Meme] Don't Let a COVID Crisis Go to Waste When You're Eager to Find Excuses for Many Layoffs and Shutdowns

    Microsoft business units that were defunct (long-failing, well before COVID-19) are being thrown out and Microsoft exploits a virus to rationalise these decisions while spicing up media coverage with "Hey Hi" (AI) and "virtual" experience or Facebook (to give the false impression that nothing really goes away)



  28. Free Software Tackles Political Issues. Political Tactics Are Also Being Weaponised Against Free Software.

    Divide-and-rule tactics seem to have been exploited to weaken collaborative work on Free/libre software; the response to these tactics needs to start with realisation that this is going on (even if it's done in a somewhat clandestine nature)



  29. Offence and Racism

    o those in positions of power and privilege (financial) you are controllable by guilt; dividing us and causing us to feel guilt and fear (over potential offence) is a powerful social control mechanism and pretext for dismissal, censorship, humiliation



  30. Links 3/7/2020: TrueNAS 12 Beta 1, Librem 13 Product Line

    Links for the day


RSS 64x64RSS Feed: subscribe to the RSS feed for regular updates

Home iconSite Wiki: You can improve this site by helping the extension of the site's content

Home iconSite Home: Background about the site and some key features in the front page

Chat iconIRC Channel: Come and chat with us in real time

Recent Posts