11.14.12

Speculations That HTC Pays Apple Not Verified, Said to be Bogus, and May Only be Anti-Android FUD

Posted in FUD, GNU/Linux, Google, Microsoft, Patents at 8:28 pm by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

Trolled!

Steve BallmerSummary: HTC says there is no financial impact to the settlement, but Microsoft boosters say that HTC pays Apple for Android; Techrights investigates what people are saying and where the claims come from

As noted in the previous post, lawyers say that HTC pays Apple per phone sold following the secret settlement and they claim to know the cost. This speculation about Apple getting a patent tax (echoed by John Koetsier in this case) has Groklaw say: “Does that sound fair to you? Sound like the US patent system is working as it should?

“Folks who argue that the US patent system works beautifully for the US economy need to think about the future, then. How beautifully will the system work when other countries make it impossible for US companies to bring new products to market in the US? Think that could never happen? Look at the Apple-Microsoft-Nokia attack on Android. Now put non-US companies in attack mode and against a US product.”

Other sources seem to suggest Apple has retreated. TechDirt writes “HTC And Apple Settle Patent Dispute; Perhaps Tim Cook Realizes Patent Fights Are A Waste” and formal reports say nothing about a tax. Why? Because they do fact-checking. One Android site says:

While the specific details of the agreement are under wraps, press is being told by Jeff Grdon, representative for HTC, that HTC “does not expect this license agreement to have any adverse material impact on the financials of the company” – read as: HTC won’t break the bank in the settlement.

Right.

So no losses, correct?

Here is more speculation:

What is Google’s real incentive in seeding the Android mobile OS in the global market? Is it to make money from the sale of Android-based handsets and tablets? Certainly, that’s part of Google’s strategy. After all, through its Motorola Mobility acquisition, Google is a player in the smartphone and tablet markets.

Recently, there have been several reports about how Apple’s recent settlement with Taiwan’s HTC could mean that Apple and Microsoft make more from Android going forward than Google does. Apple and HTC have a cross-licensing deal that some are saying could mean Apple collects $6 to $8 per Android phone sold. The truth is, though, that Google’s real benefit from the spread of Android comes from bringing new users into its lucrative search/ad ecosystem.

Where do these numbers come from? These have not been verified. Given that Apple feels blowback (calls to boycott Apple and generally a great disdain or forced apologies that embarrass the company’s culture), we might as well suspect a non-victory for Apple. One expert says:

“This settlement and their statement on Friday don’t quite jive,” says David Martin, Founder and Chief Executive of M·CAM. “Apple is starting to look at the market consequence of their litigation strategy and realizing there may be some blow back from it.”

The Microsoft booster says that Apple gets paid (among other outrageous things), but maybe this is just propaganda. Groklaw writes in response: “Inventor of the touch screen, my foot. And by the way, isn’t Apple the company claiming that if it has to pay a more or less equivalent sum for FRAND patents owned by Android vendors, it will put them out of business? And next comes Nokia, the rumors continue, trying to get HTC to pay them too, and they already pay to Microsoft. They call this royalty stacking [Mark Lemley's paper explaining it, PDF], and it’s a fast way to kill off the competition, if you gang up on them this way. Meanwhile, both Apple and Microsoft are whining to regulators about royalty burdens they are threatened with if they can’t devalue FRAND patents. If there are 250,000 patents that read on just one smartphone, where in the world is the profit going to come from? You can’t make a phone in that environment. Instead of getting rid of software patents and/or devaluing all patents or even coming up with a reduced rate for victims of royalty stacking demands, Apple and Microsoft would like the devalue the ones they don’t own, but Android vendors own, while leaving their patents at full value. That way Android can’t compete in the marketplace and people will stop selling it. If by any chance you are thinking that *Apple* would never pull such a dirty trick, I direct you to their response to the UK court’s order to post a notice that Samsung didn’t copy Apple’s design patent, which the court characterized as showing a “lack of integrity”. Where are the antitrust regulators now?”

“It’s all secretive, but Microsoft and Apple try to deceive the press and the regulators.”But wait, does this booster (Eric Savitz) just spread his usual FUD? These are not verified claims, it could be just a scare tactic. Here is a more accurate report.

“Microsoft and Google’s Motorola Mobility unit are set to square off on Tuesday at a trial with strategic implications for the smartphone patent wars and which could reveal financial information the two companies usually keep under wraps,” says the Indian press. It’s all secretive, but Microsoft and Apple try to deceive the press and the regulators.

We do not even know how much HTC pays Microsoft, if anything, The claims of five dollars are unverified. Here is a new example of spin in patent settlements:

In Planning Software Patent Settlement, Both Sides Claim Victory

In the wake of a settlement of a patent infringement lawsuit involving two major financial planning software products, both sides are proclaiming victory.

“We are extraordinarily happy,” said David Loeper, CEO of Wealthcare Capital Management, the plaintiff in the case. “We’re not just happy; we had a great celebration when the agreement was settled. I can understand why the other side would be too, given the liability if we had proceeded with litigation.”

This is what the Apple-HTC settlement might have been like. It is possible that HTC pays nobody for Android. It’s speculation. When Microsoft signed a patent deal with Novell, for example, Novell was actually bribed, not charged. It was all for FUD. They create fear, uncertainty, and doubt.

Update: hours after I had drafted this post I found this post titled: “Here is why HTC doesn’t pay a cent to Apple”

Remember those statements from yesterday that HTC has to pay Apple around $6-$8 for each and every Android smartphone they sell? Well it turns out that this was complete bogus.

As I suspected when I first researched this topic, this is all just FUD and the claim is most likely bunk. Sites like Groklaw got suckered by the FUD, which had simply spread all around the Web, sometimes by all the usual suspects.

Share in other sites/networks: These icons link to social bookmarking sites where readers can share and discover new web pages.
  • Reddit
  • email

If you liked this post, consider subscribing to the RSS feed or join us now at the IRC channels.

Pages that cross-reference this one

2 Comments

  1. Michael said,

    November 14, 2012 at 9:27 pm

    Gravatar

    This speculation about Apple getting a patent tax (echoed by John Koetsier in this case) has Grok law say: “Does that sound fair to you? Sound like the US patent system is working as it should?

    If HTC has been illegally using Apple’s property it makes a lot of sense for HTC to pay Apple for past and future use. Of course.

    formal reports say nothing about a tax

    Of course not. You are using the term "tax" completely incorrectly. Why would others use your incorrect term?

    Right.
    So no losses, correct?

    We do not know that. It could be he is comparing what *is* with would would be likely if this went to court. We do not know. Note, the fact we do not know means we do not know that HTC is paying Apple anything – I am not suggesting they are!

    Apple and HTC have a cross-licensing deal that some are saying could mean Apple collects $6 to $8 per Android phone sold. The truth is, though, that Google’s real benefit from the spread of Android comes from bringing new users into its lucrative search/ad ecosystem.

    Right. Google’s main business model is to collect data on users and monetize it. Scary, eh? Yet you try to prop them up as the good guys. Neither Apple nor Google nor Samsung nor Microsoft are blameless entities… they all have mixes of good and evil. Your bias, though, makes you focus on the evils of MS and Apple and pretend Samsung and Google are the good guys. Completely absurd and unsupportable. This is shown by your claiming Eric Savitz is a "Microsoft booster". More immature silliness from you. Your claim is shown to be false just looking at his articles on MS: http://seekingalpha.com/author/eric-savitz/articles/symbol/msft Notice how some are good and some are bad. No *objective* sign of "boosting". You see anyone who does not buy into your paranoid BS as boosting those you see as being evil.
     

  2. NotZed said,

    November 14, 2012 at 11:15 pm

    Gravatar

    It’s still all just speculation – just how litigators like it when they settle. Maybe the ability to keep settlements secret should be looked at since in general it doesn’t seem to serve much public interest.

    “no material impact” doesn’t (necessarily) mean zero, and even a zero-money-changed-hands cross-licensing deal isn’t a zero opportunity cost.

What Else is New


  1. Links 30/11/2020: GhostBSD 20.11.28, Nitrux 1.3.5, Linux 5.10 RC6, GNOME Circle, Microsoft Collapses Again in Web Server Share

    Links for the day



  2. Alternatives to the World Wide Web, to HTML, to HTTP/S, and to the Internet

    Looking around the Web (yes, the Web) for alternatives to the Web (and the stack underneath the Web), we're finding that IPFS is mature and robust enough for our needs



  3. Management of the EPO Dragged to the International Labour Organisation Over Its Assault on the Right to Strike

    Opinion on strikes challenged by the Central Staff Committee of Europe's second-largest organisation; if strike rights are almost abolished there, what hope is there for the rest of Europe?



  4. [Meme] Management of the EPO Cannot Let the Staff Breathe or Smell Freedom

    Working for the EPO means giving up on one’s human rights; that’s the sort of conclusion many workers have reached



  5. “ViCo” is Nothing New (Not Even the Acronym), Done on 9/11 Last Year, Been Possible as Long as the EPO Has Existed

    Contrary to what many people are led to believe, the EPO isn't embracing innovation, it's just embracing COVID-19 and leveraging lock-downs (de facto house arrest to some) to impose an illegal practice on EPO staff and EPO stakeholders



  6. Release: Early Letters and Documents About Financial Hoax Disguised as EPO 'Study'

    It was over a year ago that staff representation at the EPO expressed concerns about what would later enrage workers — seeing that based on unscientific fabrications the EPO would take away what had been promised to them



  7. IRC Proceedings: Sunday, November 29, 2020

    IRC logs for Sunday, November 29, 2020



  8. Managing IP: Puff Pieces Galore for the EPO's Dictatorship (Complete With Buzzwords and PR Stunts)

    By giving a platform to notorious patent trolls and ‘engaging’ with the EPO‘s dictator (whom only 3% of EPO staff trusts) Managing IP is sort of giving away its real agenda, which isn’t journalism but conducting or assisting misinformation campaigns



  9. Links 29/11/2020: Genode OS Framework 20.11, Linux 5.11 Kernel Changes, and Latest in KDE Itinerary

    Links for the day



  10. Sincere Thoughts About Outreachy

    Outreachy's role in the Free software community and inclusion in the FSF's High Priority Projects, as seen from the eyes of a female coder from a minority group; she used to work for the Free Software Foundation (FSF) and she expresses concerns about what Outreachy has become



  11. Free Software Under Tyranny of Codes of Conduct as the Western Equivalent of Blasphemy Law (Corporations as the New Religion/Sponsors as Deities)

    The free speech crisis in Free software communities has enabled expulsion of opinionated people whose opinions truly matter; in their place we now have companies that bomb people, sometimes even kidnapping children and sterilising women because nothing says “Ethics” like naked fascism and corporate domination everywhere



  12. Release: 4 More Documents and Letters About the Financial Siege at Europe's Second-Largest Institution

    Documents disputing the accuracy of the "hoax" from António Campinos and the Mercers



  13. One Year Ago: The Last EPO Demonstration Before COVID-19

    About a year ago staff of the EPO apparently had its last protest (in front of the Isar building) before staff got ‘herded’ into homes, where workers became more isolated and even illegally spied on



  14. [Meme] Unified Patent Court Agreement (UPCA) is an Attack on Europe and the European Businesses That Don't Do Litigation

    Litigation lawyers and patent zealots want to set Europe ablaze with legislation that they themselves crafted; thankfully, however, they face constitutional obstacles, no matter how many politicians they bamboozle and buy



  15. Reasons EPO Staff Decided to Go on Strike This Year (Before or Until Coronavirus Prevented It)

    An year-old letter from the Staff Union of the European Patent Office (SUEPO) to the President of the EPO; 7 reasons for going on strike are enumerated



  16. EPO Can Save Money by “Dropping Events Like the Inventor of the Year, Reducing the Number of Managers, Throwing Less Money at Consultants or Bringing the Boards of Appeal Back into Office Buildings.”

    Constructive suggestions from EPO staff, made just over a year ago and assembled into a letter to their EPO colleagues



  17. The Real Fate of the UPC 'Stunt' in Germany Will be Known Next Month (or Next Year) and There Are Substantial Constitutional Barriers in the Way

    Contrary to what Team UPC wants people to think, UPC(A) isn’t a “done deal” in Germany; they never actually addressed the substance of complaints and with help from Benoît Battistelli‘s friends in the Commission they’re just attempting a blatant coup



  18. Microsoft Removes Free Software From GitHub Again, This Time for Motion Picture Association (MPA)

    GitHub is proving to be more of a censorship site than a code-sharing site; with the GitHub takeover Microsoft became a 'censorship police' or force of occupation against its ideological competition; just weeks after the YouTube-DL debacle and further take-downs seeking to 'protect' broken DRM schemes (by banning code) we can see that Microsoft isn't defending developers at all; it's just protecting the interests of MPA, RIAA and other Biden circles from the interests of the general population, which sometimes circumvents perfectly circumventable 'DRM' schemes



  19. IRC Proceedings: Saturday, November 28, 2020

    IRC logs for Saturday, November 28, 2020



  20. Help Make Techrights (and Other Technology-Centric Sites) More Robust to Censorship by Setting Up More IPFS Nodes

    We’re trying to improve the site’s availability (ensuring it can never be offline) and make it more censorship-resistant; people who adopt IPFS can make that happen while tackling the “bloated Web” and “centralised Internet” issues — all at the same time



  21. Microsoft Loves Linux and Android Apps Running on Windows Instead of GNU/Linux and Android Devices

    Microsoft loves Linux, they say; but as Microsoft's former VP James Allchin put it: "If you're going to kill someone there isn't much reason to get all worked up about it and angry -- you just pull the trigger [...] We need to smile at Novell while we pull the trigger."



  22. Links 28/11/2020: RenderDoc 1.11, GNOME 40 Scrolling Horizontally

    Links for the day



  23. Nine Documents About the Financial Siege Against EPO Staff (Past, Present, and Future)

    Today we release dozens of pages of letters and documents (internal to Europe's second-largest institution); they all focus on the betrayal and skulduggery, crushing staff in spite of what was originally promised (and what workers actually signed up for)



  24. EPO Senior Management (Cabal) “Essentially Deaf to the Proposals From Staff Representatives.”

    Representatives of EPO staff feel like the management of the EPO is "deaf" and uncaring; there's hardly any meaningful progress (or none whatsoever) when it comes to truly honest dialogue with real participation



  25. EPO Management, Led by António Campinos, Attempted to Stifle or Prevent Staff From Being Surveyed

    Battistelli's cabal, which covers up a lot of fraud and corruption, is attempting to prevent the staff from expressing an opinion (for insiders and perhaps outsiders to assess) because things are really bad and autocratic measures are seen as necessary to keep the lid on issues/abuses



  26. The European Patent Office's Central Staff Committee: Office Cannot Recruit Fit-for-Purpose Patent Examiners Anymore

    One third of EPO recruits are 'locals' (Germans), 0.2% are Swiss, 1% Scandinavian; the EPO as an employer became unattractive and it's unable to attract the staff it needs (as was projected and planned when the EPC was agreed upon)



  27. IRC Proceedings: Friday, November 27, 2020

    IRC logs for Friday, November 27, 2020



  28. Links 27/11/2020: Jolla is 7, Diffoscope 162, MNT Reform Production

    Links for the day



  29. The Time Coronavirus Helped EPO Management Prevent Staff From Protesting and Going on Strike (March 26th)

    "In view of the spreading of the New Corona Virus, the planned General Assemblies have to be cancelled," the Staff Union of the European Patent Office (SUEPO) wrote in the wake of the crisis across Europe back in March (weeks ahead of a planned strike)



  30. Guarding Your Privacy With E2EE: Primer

    "As with all security, there is assumed risk no matter how careful you are. There are no security guarantees but that doesn't mean you shouldn't try."


RSS 64x64RSS Feed: subscribe to the RSS feed for regular updates

Home iconSite Wiki: You can improve this site by helping the extension of the site's content

Home iconSite Home: Background about the site and some key features in the front page

Chat iconIRC Channel: Come and chat with us in real time

Recent Posts